The Talk Show

53: If They Had Asked Us

 

  so we got a very special episode of the talk show this week I'm here and Denver [TS]

  Colorado at Chateau whiskers with with my Q branch colleagues Brent Simmons and [TS]

  a viscous hi David first time on the show rain ya been spent online on times [TS]

  once it was a great show thanks I was a live person I thought you were on one [TS]

  remote well possibly should have been on the show so we're recording on Thursday [TS]

  the week of the iPhone event and I think the show program out tomorrow it's about [TS]

  time people listen to this day still won't be able to get a new iPhone but [TS]

  and I was 71 isn't quite as gonna come out next week right so might as well [TS]

  just wait to listen to this [TS]

  yeah yeah and make it but i dont bosnia but we can talk about I was seven [TS]

  because I think you know that it's going GMI think that means the NDA's I burned [TS]

  up or something I think I tell it works well the very least almost everything [TS]

  that we would want to talk about his stuff that people know now right [TS]

  it it's not a stretch to say that we want to talk about the status bar right [TS]

  we've all seen as we all know I can't imagine that would even if that were [TS]

  under NDA it's been shown up correct among some first the news so actually [TS]

  you know for a big week of the Big Apple week I think the news relatively simple [TS]

  to new phones five see is really just the iPhone 5 with a new case cases [TS]

  confusing it with the other cases I would say colorful candy show and the [TS]

  five a switch is the new top of the line iPhone and of course you know as soon as [TS]

  Apple announced to stuff the stock dropped $26 five plus 5% today and the [TS]

  thing that gets me about that and I would love to get your guys opinion this [TS]

  is the thing that gets me about that is that by almost all [TS]

  want everything that was announced all of those things 25 °c colorful candy [TS]

  shells the 5s fingerprint sensor that was all the rumors were spot on [TS]

  shouldn't the stock market have had like no reaction because it was exactly what [TS]

  everybody expected this isn't based on logic or reason there are eight people [TS]

  learn that the market isn't responding based on what Apple has actually done [TS]

  they're responding to the magical things that Apple was supposed to have done [TS]

  somehow yeah there was supposed to be something beyond the rumors if it turns [TS]

  out that while we expect is true then right at the start but it's the market [TS]

  punishing Apple for not surprising and delighting them right there is no [TS]

  there's nothing else to it I'm trying to stick to a you know an end I go back and [TS]

  forth on this but I'm trying to stick to a don't feed the trolls strategy this [TS]

  week in terms of the Jackass jury that people have opposed to end and I'm not [TS]

  even saying that you can't be there isn't a sensible logical defendable hey [TS]

  this is kind of a disappointing week for a poor you know argument you can make [TS]

  but did the things i'm talking bout of the art articles that are saying that [TS]

  you know the dance noting that this is a disaster that the five siege be $200 you [TS]

  know off contract and that they are doomed because I don't know somethin [TS]

  somethin China so I'm trying not to link to those because I think a lot of them [TS]

  are really are just purposefully written to get that sort of pageview traffic [TS]

  that I'm going to say Apple is doomed and I know that people are gonna like to [TS]

  me only to disagree but there's still some training Fisher out here on my [TS]

  phone there are still some forms and forbes is kind of turning into a click [TS]

  big factory but there was a guy forms to today's posted an article that seriously [TS]

  argued that that Tim Cook it's already too late that is [TS]

  ruined apple and then it's probably too late friend even save his job [TS]

  ruined Apple uses that's not that's not just a dumb thing to say that so [TS]

  hyperbolic yeah I'd even take that seriously I really do think that is like [TS]

  time goes on you know exactly well maybe not quite exactly it may be months or [TS]

  somebody's about two years in Steve Jobs died and the the Apple can't function [TS]

  without Steve Jobs mindset it's like there's no dissuading them from that it [TS]

  doesn't matter what happens and it's just it's getting worse and I think part [TS]

  of it too is that people seem to like in their minds they think that when steve [TS]

  Jobs was alive every new iPhone you know just as amazing as the ignoring the fact [TS]

  that we had these exact same conversations year after year except [TS]

  that they didn't have the Apple Steve Jobs part that read it was just Apple is [TS]

  sometimes it was Apple's doomed because of Steve Jobs has Steve lost his touch I [TS]

  did a few Google right now as he lost his touch in a final example of articles [TS]

  from before Steve died about and talk about the cube or yeah with the iPhone [TS]

  for me i i would bet I'd bet that at least one of those was written within [TS]

  months of him dying remember how much disappointment was when the iPad was [TS]

  released products the blow back in the game [TS]

  yeah but also that absolutely no look what it did yeah well my favorite I've [TS]

  said this before about it was sure it was even said this public pleas were [TS]

  aware that that's like one of the best examples of it because there was all [TS]

  these critics who say you know media people who streamed out of the iPad [TS]

  introduction said Matt just a big iPod Touch and all round the world there are [TS]

  millions of people who can't wait to buy one because oh cool its a big hunt [TS]

  and especially because it's a big iPhone like and I know how to use my iPhone so [TS]

  I i cures a new piece of technology that I know that I will be able to use and [TS]

  enjoy I don't already know how to use it right and I think that's that's a great [TS]

  example so much of Apple's success with fostering that kind of love is because [TS]

  of the way they approach their products and so much of it is people are afraid [TS]

  of technology but with Apple products they feel simple they feel easier to use [TS]

  they feel familiar and the has Apple lost its touch is this team should be [TS]

  fired all of these things they expect these big iPhone moments when you wanna [TS]

  staging here's the thing is gonna change your life when that's not really what [TS]

  Apple does sometimes they do that but it's not because that's their goals [TS]

  because that's just kind of a natural byproduct of of cycling and I don't [TS]

  think there's any way they can get out of there really is nothing they can do [TS]

  there's died in the game I wanna play and we we talked about this before we [TS]

  started recording but what could Apple have announced this week regarding the [TS]

  iPhone that would have satisfied these people I really can't think of anything [TS]

  then one thing that obviously pops up they could have done a bigger screen [TS]

  iPhone and I think all of these same people would have just said well now [TS]

  they've just caught up to where the competition last two years I don't think [TS]

  if they had announced big surprise hey the 5s comes in two sizes for engine [TS]

  five-inch which obviously would satisfy some people I don't think it would have [TS]

  eliminated any of this this was a bad week for Apple and I can't think of [TS]

  anything else that they could have done that is actually like realistic [TS]

  the anti-family argument is always been why does Apple act like they invented [TS]

  the mp3 player they didn't invent what's the big deal along those same lines what [TS]

  can you do to too surprised or or to do what what steps did you take that would [TS]

  be inventing something is inventing something the only logical argument [TS]

  right and and yet they then they could have come out with the most amazing [TS]

  thing ever and you know a whole brand new unexpected product a whole new [TS]

  category and people would have been down [TS]

  if they had come out with a watch more than there are people saying well yeah [TS]

  like Apple invented the watch the watch thing is one of those things where I [TS]

  think everybody just I want Apple to do something new in a new category and [TS]

  somebody said they're gonna do watch watch their it is and in the day they [TS]

  are truly something that's probably not a watch but maybe it's something that [TS]

  you strap on your wrist at that moment all of the people who have been saying [TS]

  that they're already late to the game should have released their gonna sit [TS]

  down and quick do the math and figure out whether watch only cost 200 bucks [TS]

  and so if like half of all the people who bought an iPhone by one of these [TS]

  watches in the next two years that's only like two billion dollars that's [TS]

  nothing you know and it's just an accessory why they do this and it's like [TS]

  hey did you know the opportunity to sell $800 devices to you know 300 million [TS]

  people around the world just doesn't doesn't happen all the time in the watch [TS]

  cannot caused $100 clearly the only thing I could think of the day would [TS]

  have done that would have modified the people who are adamant that Apple is is [TS]

  not just like a little bit off but like like I said like ruined companies shell [TS]

  of its former self is it is said to have announced that the five Si was truly [TS]

  cheap that the sea stood for cheap and you could buy one you don't like the [TS]

  cost of an iPod Touch $229.00 or something like that off contract which [TS]

  in hindsight would have been i think really stupid move for Apple that's not [TS]

  that's not what I pulled out right now they're not the cheap company right [TS]

  opposite in every single way quality she is never gonna step right and and all [TS]

  they do I think that what they're done is they've slowly in this annual cycle [TS]

  bike expanded the pricing by like one not so now for $100 last year you could [TS]

  buy the year old for us $400 less than the brand new now at that same price [TS]

  $100 less you can get a brand new phone [TS]

  and you could if you want spend another $100 and get a 32 gigabyte version of it [TS]

  so it's nicer like the mid tier of iPhone lineup is now a nice yeah I [TS]

  wouldn't say the expanded by not more that they acknowledged that not as its [TS]

  own product category interment began treating it that way instead of into the [TS]

  hand-me-down last year's it's it's the last year's hardware but wrapped up in a [TS]

  different packaging is being treated the same way that the iPod touch has been [TS]

  true that's it's the fun quirky exciting version for kids I think there's also [TS]

  has to be Apple like really understanding how they aren't there an [TS]

  international company and selling to a lot of places besides just Canada right [TS]

  you know and the way they the way they look at overseas markets has to be [TS]

  certain very in-depth very interesting I would love to be inside the company to [TS]

  know more about that that all had to go into the fight see ya I you know and [TS]

  they still have you know even with two new models they have far fewer phone as [TS]

  KU's than any of their competition but it's actually the those two phones cover [TS]

  I think a pretty wide gamut of the high end of the market [TS]

  you know there's the 5s which still has that premium metal finish and then 25 C [TS]

  which is way more like a fun design [TS]

  fund that's an interesting word it seems almost like they've acknowledged that [TS]

  that that category that price category is for gets this is this is the younger [TS]

  people teenagers and younger who buy phones are one they're going to have [TS]

  less money to spend on them probably and so why not appeal to them why not make [TS]

  them ensuring well and I think it gets to a promising to is I would bet and [TS]

  it's the sort of thing they don't really break down even though they give a lot [TS]

  of numbers in their quarterly things too but they pretty much just say here's how [TS]

  many iPhones we sold and here is the average selling price and then you can [TS]

  kind of you know the average selling price and amount of phones sold in kind [TS]

  of figure out you know how many of them Ryan [TS]

  lol but you don't get a lot of color in between countries but I'll bet in [TS]

  different countries they're gonna sell and extremely different proportions and [TS]

  not based on like economics but just on culture show you know that like you know [TS]

  like I think everybody everybody seems to think with the gold one is going to [TS]

  sell really well in asia because it's sort of a status I'm and I think that in [TS]

  other late maybe more practical countries that five she is gonna sell [TS]

  better and you know I've also read though that in America and Europe you [TS]

  know neutrals blacks grays Browns tend to be quite popular in China India [TS]

  developing nations brighter colors are often are often loved so it's not a [TS]

  surprise that would be a product perhaps geared toward developing nations that [TS]

  colors and costs that's an interesting take I wouldn't have even really thought [TS]

  along those lines I see it as a demographics [TS]

  it's certainly good news for Apple of both of these things are true that [TS]

  changes in the USA and to everyone in Asia right well our day or haven't they [TS]

  just got on to China's biggest carrier no they haven't got on that was that's [TS]

  one of the things that is that's a real thing that if they had announced it [TS]

  would have been there's a lot of people who would have seen that is better news [TS]

  and news China Mobile and there were a lot of it [TS]

  rumors that they were going to and I guess they're still rumors that they're [TS]

  still in talks but didn't happen yet and i know i think you know this is a little [TS]

  boring but there's issues with china mobile with the specific bands that are [TS]

  required to operate its you know because it is china mobile they they can have [TS]

  their own weird you know sort of like rising used to be in Aus have to have a [TS]

  special phone for China Mobile but I guess the both phones would work on [TS]

  china mobile so that Scott everybody thinking that maybe you know that [TS]

  they're closin at these phones will be on china mobile within the year because [TS]

  they would work on it [TS]

  well if so then that's awfully good news [TS]

  and that is one of the technical things that is different and better with the [TS]

  five see versus the old 55 from a year ago is that the works on way more [TS]

  cellular networks around the world one SKU so along the same point so I thought [TS]

  one of the most interesting marketing things today announced with these two [TS]

  funds is that there's two of them at the exact same price point of $199 it used [TS]

  to be that the midrange and lower range when they saw the year old phone in the [TS]

  midrange and two-year-old at lower range did you don't have any storage options [TS]

  for those who got eight gigs in the low end and 16 gigs in the middle rounds and [TS]

  didn't like it [TS]

  get the five whereas now they have to have a 16 and a 32 gigabyte five see so [TS]

  the 32 gigabyte five see is under 99 and the 16 Gigabyte 5s is 199 and they've [TS]

  you know they've never had that sort of overlap with the previous strategy I'm [TS]

  really torn at trying to guess which 199 iPhone is gonna sell better I really [TS]

  don't know what to guess what do you guys think you know I can I think it [TS]

  might be to see an end just because it seems really fun I'm kind of tempted to [TS]

  get one just cuz I'd like to pick color you know there's something refreshing [TS]

  about them I would also guess the sea again because of the appeal to teenagers [TS]

  it's not just the colors though I think it'd be the building materials the dance [TS]

  there is interesting having plastic versus the middle and I haven't seen [TS]

  when I don't know is that Decker it is a little bit surprised or so it can almost [TS]

  feel like I mean they make those cases but you don't looks like you would need [TS]

  two cases it has the case built-in difference from the 50 S and 25 in the [TS]

  four before it it feels more like it's it's own self-contained [TS]

  I think so I mean I but I don't use a case with my iPhone 5 either and I've [TS]

  never used the case with any my iPhones but I realize now more and more that I'm [TS]

  clearly in the minority regard that that the sell-through on cases is just off [TS]

  the charts yes I'll be Lady Dior 90% [TS]

  look at the phones for people who don't have to give up their mind something [TS]

  done [TS]

  Gabbert you and I have a handle these things will be different [TS]

  i think is a case my phone is pristine but withdrew definitely in the minority [TS]

  on that here's what I think I'm with you where I think that the five CD and I got [TS]

  to play with him in the hands on here and help them totally agree that it [TS]

  feels like even I wouldn't get a case for the five of the five ass but with [TS]

  the five CIB even less likely to get a case it feels like it is a case exactly [TS]

  and I'll bet eighty or ninety percent of people biamby case for it only seems [TS]

  like that's why Apple made that stupid looking case for it with the holes in [TS]

  the back I definitely think so i think that they've had you know I don't know [TS]

  why they didn't come out with a bumper last year like so two years ago when [TS]

  they came out when I guess it was three years ago when they did the box because [TS]

  it was when I read you know they gave the bumpers out for the antenna seems [TS]

  like forever ago does seem like forever ago and I guess they haven't done cases [TS]

  since although they kept the bumpers around for the four US I had a bumper on [TS]

  my for us I loved it and then came out in November I didn't ever get a case for [TS]

  it I was happier I was cathartic I let go I but I don't you know just [TS]

  observation only just looking like it people in airports and coffee shops and [TS]

  stuff like that doesn't seem like those bumpers never really took off I mean [TS]

  it's something I never saw them but they were not as popular like people really [TS]

  want to protect the phone or at least they think they do when they buy case [TS]

  they want you know their argument was hey we made the back row beautiful so we [TS]

  made a case that's just a bumper to show it off and I feel like the mass market [TS]

  was I want to protect them back [TS]

  well they certainly had a bunch of them in the stores and seemed like more [TS]

  colors were always so that knows about to argue that [TS]

  that everyone I knew had a 44 has had a bumper on it but that might be nerds and [TS]

  I think you know I think they got into the bumper business because they know [TS]

  the how many people buy them and it's just like you know like a free extra [TS]

  $29.00 price funds sold for something makes 45 cents to me probably and they [TS]

  wanted in on that money rather than just the you know whatever however much money [TS]

  they make some third-party cases in the Apple Store an apple online and if you [TS]

  like this year is the year that they finally like ok this case thing is not [TS]

  going to go away we kind of guy I really think that johnnie I've kinda hates [TS]

  everybody wraps his phone cases where they feel like they're they're like okay [TS]

  you're gonna wrap it in the case we want you to buy our case will look at it you [TS]

  did you see one with the case honored if you look at the pictures the way it [TS]

  covers up the logo looks like it is non yeah I Matthew panzeri know now it [TS]

  TechCrunch has was the first one to kinda called out and I have to agree it [TS]

  doesn't seem likely that's but that's the case for the five see right and that [TS]

  again it seems like that phone is designed to not have a case they only [TS]

  made this thing so the biggest thing because they felt like people to ask for [TS]

  it it doesn't seem like it was made thoughtfully the cases the leather cases [TS]

  for the 5s seem more serious I don't think people are gonna like those holes [TS]

  in the back on yeah I don't expect they will it can have that bumper feel we're [TS]

  supposed to show you more of the phone like if you go and you buy the gold one [TS]

  in utero one of the leather cases are you never gonna see the gold glad you [TS]

  see it on the air that's but I think people are gonna do it I really do [TS]

  sure I guess what people like to do I see a lot of third-party cases where [TS]

  they a lot of them where they have a hole cut out just for the Apple logo [TS]

  just a you know datos yeah you're using an iPhone that's what I think the people [TS]

  who buy the gold one buys they're gonna buy one that has it holds you can see [TS]

  the Golden Apple logo [TS]

  back but they just want one hole just for the Apple logo it does seem to think [TS]

  about him or it does seem make the those those holes that don't align at all with [TS]

  anything on the back of the phone on at 5 °c case seemed more inexplicable [TS]

  because it seems like it's pretty obvious that people want the brand stuff [TS]

  to show through I can't imagine that they could tactile feel of your hands on [TS]

  those those holes is gonna be a pleasant sensation and imagining it would be [TS]

  weird holding my hand yeah I don't know it feels ugly so I think we're all in [TS]

  agreement that the that the that the 5 C's going to be very popular right now [TS]

  like I C stands for cute yeah I pointed out wandering fireball that day one [TS]

  right up that it's seems telling to me that it's when you go to apple.com [TS]

  that's the first one it's listed as I can tell the new stuff but the first one [TS]

  is the five see and it's the only when it's available for pre-orders gonna be [TS]

  available I guess pre-order tomorrow so I be the day that the show comes out but [TS]

  I 5s is not available for pre-order yeah and my guess sort of semi in foreign by [TS]

  people [TS]

  Cupertino areas that it's about availability that the 5 C's there's more [TS]

  of them on boats on route from China right now do you think that any of that [TS]

  has to do with the colors of the 50 US I don't know I I bet it's more just that [TS]

  all the components are you that the a seven is know that that's fingerprint [TS]

  sensors and cameras and whereas all of those components in the fight see our [TS]

  year old components it's the exact same camera from the five its exact same a [TS]

  six it's the exact same [TS]

  even home but was it had less to do to ramp up production made of components [TS]

  that they're already good at making I was about to suggest that maybe it had [TS]

  something to do with like trying to mitigate demand for specific color of [TS]

  the five but that doesn't make sense as in you would want pre-order so you would [TS]

  know how many to ship over and boats how many things put together and I wonder [TS]

  you know I don't wonder what will see like when when the order comes out like [TS]

  will we see that like pink and blue are six weeks delayed you know if you don't [TS]

  get in the day that the moment that the store open now there's six weeks delayed [TS]

  but you can get a yellow one in a week [TS]

  yeah who's gonna buy white seems to me that I don't know why it seems sort of [TS]

  boring and it looks even in person to me a lot like an old white 3G s exactly it [TS]

  did actually do it looks less new then the other ones because I've seen a white [TS]

  plastic iPhone before ya and years ago when they first came out like that was [TS]

  kind to the mental image the protocol mental image of what an Apple phone [TS]

  would look like that white candy shop with a QWERTY keyboard and a free iPhone [TS]

  all the artists renditions of a year right that they look that way to dial [TS]

  the phone you had to use the controls what they did Tony Fadell is admitted [TS]

  that they actually made prototypes that work like that actually you know that [TS]

  was it always seemed like a joke and I think a lot of the people who made those [TS]

  mockups were joking but they actually tried that and and his and then he just [TS]

  said you know there's a reason people don't use rotary phones anymore they [TS]

  tried it and then quickly abandoned that surprises me doesn't surprise me that [TS]

  they would want a prototype things and try things out when exploring a new [TS]

  product category but they would never made it past the conceptual phase [TS]

  because it seems it seems like something maybe you don't even have to try it yet [TS]

  so it's so dumb that you don't even need to bother going down that path so that [TS]

  when you have billions of dollars in your pocket you can you can make the [TS]

  product of billions of dollars but not doings of Engineers yeah [TS]

  designers are right before I think the first quarter break what what are you [TS]

  guys gonna buy I think about gold digger by 5s 5s God surprising I I would not [TS]

  have guessed that when I saw them mark-ups and even as I get my phone I [TS]

  get it reenergized its blue and one of the available colors was a gold and even [TS]

  that's a good idea would never do that but something about the way up and put [TS]

  it together and the ring on the front end up looking elegant and probably [TS]

  gonna buy the 5s black but I might just go crazy by i've seen the colors you [TS]

  wouldn't want the 64 bit faster I like around before that stuff you know the [TS]

  phones are pretty darn fast already that's true I'm gonna go 64 gig by black [TS]

  was not black / grey [TS]

  Dave you have an interesting theory on this I think they had to call there's [TS]

  always people on Twitter her complaining about spaces and grey or making fun of [TS]

  its gunmetal grey that's the real name of that color color gunmetal grey [TS]

  because gun the word gun is to politicize the gunman opened their [TS]

  drawing attention away that they don't want yeah I totally agree and and having [TS]

  seen it [TS]

  gunmetal gray is exactly what I would call it it in I think it's better [TS]

  because it's better than last year's Black because it looks like just like a [TS]

  darker metal [TS]

  whereas it or not trying to make you like the last year's one looks more like [TS]

  the the 2001 you know model and black slab where this one looks like it's a [TS]

  black face with a metal side and I think that as it wears over the year and you [TS]

  get a little nicks along the edges I think it's gonna they're they're not [TS]

  going to stand out and they made you can refine the anodization process I had [TS]

  mine re-energize now I can think of the scratches Daily Show I think it's like [TS]

  sort of like just good advice to just take the materials should be honest to [TS]

  themselves I'm sure Jony ive said then video about 10 times but I feel like the [TS]

  black one last year [TS]

  went too far when a field from that because it's it was mad about it they [TS]

  tried to make it look like not metal right now it looks like metal yeah and [TS]

  going back to the color thing the space grade gunmetal grey that's a name that [TS]

  refers to where you would see that color of metal I think space great I think it [TS]

  feels sci-fi like that's the color of the spaceship you would imagine [TS]

  take a break here thank our first sponsor it's our old friends at [TS]

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  big square spaces and customers they have and how totally serious they are [TS]

  about like at any point you need help there someone in New York who's ready to [TS]

  help you [TS]

  which just blows my mind everything about this guy's makes it seem like [TS]

  they're they're like preparing to take over the world they really want to get [TS]

  it right and they're always coming out with new templates they have a whole [TS]

  bunch of stuff to choose from all their templates are mobile ready you load the [TS]

  same site on your iPhone it looks perfect on the iPhone load on your iPad [TS]

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  know how if you see the same the same being used over [TS]

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  repetitive stuff away to set yourself apart from from a lot of other places [TS]

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  yeah and use the exact same template that every every other person uses you [TS]

  get a little design hand-holding so let's jump in talk with you mentioned [TS]

  the 64 bit when Brown was saying maybe he'd get a five see so it seems like [TS]

  this controversy but it seems like especially as I looked around the web [TS]

  today there's an awful lot of people were traded over arguing that going 64 [TS]

  bit is sort of show off do nothing meaningless move at this point because [TS]

  one of the things about 64 bit computing is it lets software dress more than four [TS]

  gigabytes of memory and so it's a big deal it was a big deal in pakistan won [TS]

  64 bit because Big Data hungry apps could use a lot more RAM like the [TS]

  effectively unlimited however much RAM you could put the machine now your [TS]

  software could use it while the five phone only has 512 I think megabytes of [TS]

  RAM or maybe a gig I don't know but it certainly doesn't think it's a good now [TS]

  definitely not for sure yet [TS]

  yeah so the question is is there any other advantage to going 64 bit other [TS]

  than just being able to say when 64 bit well of course you know even 64 bit apps [TS]

  on the Mac are probably not using that much memory that's even the issue the [TS]

  issue is that you know there are newer processor is faster processors have more [TS]

  registers [TS]

  whatever different instruction sets wherever just designed to be really fast [TS]

  they're better I think there's a sec not just the memory memory I think I think [TS]

  even even if the memory thing doesn't make any sense and even if they aren't [TS]

  any faster even if the the benchmarks are the same for the architecture [TS]

  between 32 bit and 64 bit on the same processor it still seems like Apple [TS]

  setting themselves up to make some kind of change if I'm apple and I've got the [TS]

  64 bit CPU that can make that's really fast and I'm putting on my mobile [TS]

  devices I'm gonna be thinking about what other mobile devices I have that I could [TS]

  put this in not just obviously the iPad but the MacBook Air they've already made [TS]

  the the the architectures which ones I would be shocked if they didn't have Mac [TS]

  OS 10 running on ARM processors right now I do it and they emphasized that one [TS]

  of the phrases that they used couple times in the event about the performance [TS]

  was that there was quote unquote desktop class performance yes and they had the [TS]

  Infinity Blade guys come out that was that was actually I think the only [TS]

  software that was actually demoed live on stage they didn't demo all the iOS 7 [TS]

  stuff was you know in the keynote slides like the only person who actually like [TS]

  used an iPhone on stage was the the Infinity Blade guy I'm almost certain [TS]

  which I thought was interesting but you know I know guys emphasize that this was [TS]

  like console quality gaming graphics [TS]

  if if that chip doesn't show up in the next iteration of the MacBook Air I'll [TS]

  be surprised and I would bet money that within a year it's a MacBook Air [TS]

  that's a bold timeline I i dont have a year but I would bet they're looking at [TS]

  it serious I believe that but I don't get a lot of money for a big but I do [TS]

  think it fits in the in the general idea though that the MacBook Air is not about [TS]

  maximizing performance it's about minimizing weight minimizing thickness [TS]

  minimizing heat and maximizing battery life given those constraints that there [TS]

  do you know we're going to make this thing really small so we can't put [TS]

  physically huge battery in there but we really do want these days [TS]

  amazing battery life and the ones that came out this year they jump in battery [TS]

  life year over year on the the current areas that you can buy his amazing [TS]

  absolutely amazing green but let's not discount the importance of controlling [TS]

  your supply chain yeah and then they'd have their own their own CPUs their own [TS]

  made CPUs but I can't help but think that it hypothetical MacBook Air based [TS]

  on 64 bit ARM processor the battery life would would you know you could [TS]

  conceivably get twenty hours about it yeah i pod style battery life it just [TS]

  feels like there's every reason to start thinking about making the switch and it [TS]

  really shouldn't be a surprise it's telling that they would say specifically [TS]

  desktop class performance but ever since they started making their own chips for [TS]

  anything this is kind of been in the back of people's minds chair what's [TS]

  going to happen until I mean they'll probably be ok [TS]

  medium-term long-term they're gonna everything's going mobile these days and [TS]

  how much they really do not say they just really well and a weird thing about [TS]

  Intel and I'm weird but the the the problem they're facing a sort of like [TS]

  the problem Microsoft is facing and then they've always been the sibling [TS]

  companies Microsoft did the PC software and Intel did the PC hardware and in a [TS]

  way that Microsoft is getting pinched by the rise of free software like the way [TS]

  that Android Google just gives it for free and Microsoft wants to charge $10 [TS]

  so you can use Windows Phone that's a huge resort Windows Phone is less [TS]

  popular than Android is no doubt in my mind you know anybody $10 per phone that [TS]

  they use and Microsoft is not set up for that world they're not set up for a [TS]

  world where they make money on your word processing activity by selling $0.05 ads [TS]

  and just make up fifty million people use it in a day and then it's real money [TS]

  they are set up so that they get $100 at the time when you upgrade to work [TS]

  entails the same way where there used to making you know 23 $400 for it [TS]

  in CPU and he's armed CPUs there in these devices are you know I don't know [TS]

  what exactly they cost but they don't cost anywhere near what Intel charges [TS]

  first CPA and they're just not set up for me I think in theory they you know [TS]

  they used to be part of our day sold like their partner army they could [TS]

  obviously get back into it and make them but they can't get back into armed and [TS]

  sell chips for the prices that they want to I'm so maybe if your Intel you're [TS]

  thinking about getting acquired by somebody who makes these things and tell [TS]

  me I'm just talking long-term how do they they can't they can produce them [TS]

  and sell them with a mark-up cheaply enough the best bet is to if if the [TS]

  world is turning in the direction of everybody's building on CPUs sooner or [TS]

  later you coming by I think that they've gotta get into it they've got to get in [TS]

  mobile somehow and it they've got accepted are gonna be cheap and and [TS]

  somehow do it in a way that accept that people are going to buy a lot more [TS]

  mobile devices you know they're going to buy watches they're gonna buy glasses [TS]

  that have a CPU you know your eyeglasses and now have a CPU and everybody wants [TS]

  to prepare for that world and instead of selling $100 pentium to somebody who's [TS]

  going to keep the computer for three years [TS]

  you know try to sell them seven or eight little CPUs that you know you upgrade [TS]

  every year I get you know it's a joke but actually maybe they could make it up [TS]

  and they actually charge something which in those other side processors like [TS]

  Apple's using the 5s the motion tracking might be called them and said yeah [TS]

  that's so there's this let's talk about the m7 so David I know you [TS]

  yeah I dunno I had time to fit I i got it was an IndieGoGo campaign for [TS]

  Fitbit type device called the misfit shine and your name as an indie rock [TS]

  band little bit it was like a little about the size of a quarter kind of [TS]

  really cool to touch her owners build quality and came a little rubber thing [TS]

  you could stretch around it and and magnetized to put on your builder [TS]

  products lasted six days before a loss of course and I have no idea where it is [TS]

  I hear people talk about losing their fifth but I haven't lost mine but even [TS]

  just in those six days I thought the thing was a pain in the ass and I don't [TS]

  think my amy has it and she said a couple of them she's lost a few but put [TS]

  into the washer put into the washer other one time it was terrible she had a [TS]

  brand new skirt and and she put it in the pocket and it ends up there wasn't a [TS]

  pocket it was like a slip and so it's just like when straight if that's [TS]

  terrible design like something that looks like a pocket has to be upon you [TS]

  cannot have it looks like a pocket just drop straight through to the ground [TS]

  notice like that you're not here to the floor and you know it probably had like [TS]

  enough likes diction that it you know who knows where she lost it but I think [TS]

  that the sinking is the sinking against me I don't want to have another device [TS]

  that right in the only reason I have [TS]

  traveling I'm not use bluetooth on my phone for my car my card assembly to [TS]

  control center cities due to have one more thing that I have to have bluetooth [TS]

  on for to keep these things work is to not have to think about that would be a [TS]

  win the only time that I wouldn't have it with me would be when I am actually [TS]

  exercising like if I could go for a jog I don't take my phone you don't hear [TS]

  from you could you could imagine that external things that maybe I would maybe [TS]

  I would with the m7 I don't know if I mean if you knew that your phone was [TS]

  your fit and I'm gonna say Fitbit because my guess is that with this stuff [TS]

  they're gonna make a dedicated app that replaces the hardware thing in this [TS]

  study twenty people by the hardware [TS]

  the phone that does that I just don't see jogging and I'm going on break it [TS]

  somehow or just like just a day after day like to take a key cog in [TS]

  sharpeville shuffle yeah I mean I could buy one at Dance right now just yet I do [TS]

  bring my house keys otherwise yeah well let's come back to that because they're [TS]

  doing after sponsor break we'll come back to that idea of taking the shuttle [TS]

  and putting that M seven in other devices I but I do think I i think that [TS]

  they almost if there's anything that's new in the five yesterday underplayed I [TS]

  think it's that motion because they spend a lot of time on the camera and [TS]

  spent a lot of time on the performance improvements you know they had the [TS]

  Infinity Blade guys come out the m7 the motion thing they kind of I think it [TS]

  doesn't but they didn't really get telling a story about how you could use [TS]

  it well they had nothing to demo right with the camera you can demo camera you [TS]

  can demo Infinity Blade you condemn allow faster phone is but it's harder to [TS]

  demo for some is just a piece of technology doesn't do anything yet right [TS]

  and it seems and cuz its new so there's no apps for yet although clearly behind [TS]

  the scenes they've been working with Nike cuz they talked about it [TS]

  an upcoming Nike app that will integrate with it and they specifically said for [TS]

  this kind of a poor to see a whole new class of fitness at home right now it [TS]

  seems like the the big difference between like the camera and the motion [TS]

  trackers the camera I mean not the door on camera apps in the App Store but [TS]

  Apple has a very serious camera app that's built into the phone right where [TS]

  is there apparently not going to have a built-in fitness app that's part of [TS]

  islands oh yeah yeah because this this only works on one device good point so [TS]

  maybe that changes three years from now on every iPhone raise maybe or maybe [TS]

  they just let it be a third-party opportunity maybe it did kinda feel the [TS]

  way they said it the whole new class of business health insurance application [TS]

  however the phrasing was it seemed like they were announced a daring but [TS]

  encouraging developers like most guys don't think about this stuff [TS]

  they probably already reached out to you not just like you but other partners yes [TS]

  well but I wonder though because some of them I mean hardware to sign on now and [TS]

  I would have reached out of it but behind the scenes I don't know that [TS]

  seems like the obvious choice to me because my user but there's that but has [TS]

  been kind of a talent acquisition spree they've been hiring really really top [TS]

  level designers and I haven't seen anything new come out of that so but it [TS]

  seems like part of it is you know it's like it's supposed to be like a [TS]

  so-called circle virtuous circle yeah that it is a big part of using a Fitbit [TS]

  or any of these devices seems to be the social networking angle of it so you've [TS]

  got a fifth and you know I know via did you and Amy and lacks in jackass with [TS]

  the beard Montara made you say Jackson the beard I got I can't say anything is [TS]

  actually I'm gonna say their own man Mike Monteiro [TS]

  you guys are all like I got social circle on the Fitbit citing you guys are [TS]

  all comparing your steps every day [TS]

  yeah I know the one time there was like two days r you had like 10 steps and he [TS]

  was like hey are you sure she said that she's I don't think it ever wake up in [TS]

  the morning saying how can I get through the day [TS]

  only taking ten steps no I think think that would be easier to pull off then [TS]

  like my daily goal is set at $10,000 ten steps a lot easier than 10,000 still up [TS]

  there would be just one child she's she's she's hundred and thirty 4477 [TS]

  steps right now is that all time no that's the last seven days wow thats [TS]

  issues killing it [TS]

  38,000 and you get out my ass but I thought that maybe just maybe I wasn't [TS]

  paying enough attention during that part of the presentation but I i feel i left [TS]

  the presentation confused about just how independent [TS]

  m70 is from the rest of the CPU like I think it matters profoundly for battery [TS]

  life so let's say I get this Nike app today have already promoted and I'm [TS]

  gonna used used that happened to track my steps with my with my phone does that [TS]

  mean my battery life is going to go down because the Nike ad is running in some [TS]

  way in the background all day but is it [TS]

  know the answer is no and I don't think they made that clear like the m7 is the [TS]

  kind of independent and it's like a Fitbit or like that misfit shine that I [TS]

  lost like it just takes a watch batteries so not that there's a separate [TS]

  watch battery for it but that that sort of tracking clearly doesn't take a lot [TS]

  of power if it can run off a watch battery for a couple of months then it's [TS]

  obviously something that is almost a negligible effect can read all the other [TS]

  stuff going on a phone that just works all the time and it does nothing on the [TS]

  CPU and no software running on the CPU it's just this little independent chip [TS]

  that tracking and logging steps and then when you launch the Nike app or the [TS]

  Fitbit app or whatever app it goes inquiries that and gets a log of all the [TS]

  activity since the last time the appt it just gets data and then it process in [TS]

  Apple they did in the event I thought they said that it does that thing and [TS]

  then the main processor will will but it doesn't do any of that until you launch [TS]

  an app to do it and I think like it compared to some of the absurd are [TS]

  already in the store that let you track you know you'd like to GPS and stuff [TS]

  they're all battery killers [TS]

  stuff that's in the iPhone store now to use your iPhone to track like where you [TS]

  been like right and I have known who works on apps like that and the trouble [TS]

  with it is morning gotta carry your phone with you when you go running which [TS]

  everybody wants to do but the app has to be open it it won't just like track that [TS]

  stuff in the background of the actors in the front most right and I mean over the [TS]

  years all the stuff that happens in the background Apple has tried to beat you [TS]

  know [TS]

  engineer the API is very carefully you know so that if you're going to do audio [TS]

  in the background it's minimally you know and CPU intensive but still it is [TS]

  sleepy it's still something some kind of code is running on the CPU and that [TS]

  takes battery and m7 is not super clever seems very good examples and I think it [TS]

  was in his wrap-up at the event Tim Cook mentioned any sort of emphasizing like [TS]

  maybe like verbally underlined that the new stuff they've added to the fine ass [TS]

  is all intended to be genuinely useful and I took that as a sort of we're not [TS]

  going to name names but look at the goofy stuff Samsung came out with this [TS]

  year that nobody uses the six months later nobody uses the thing where if [TS]

  you're watching a video and you move your eyes away the video pauses right [TS]

  there was I think they had a thing where they could could scroll tax based on [TS]

  where your eyes are and they had a silly thing where you can not touch the screen [TS]

  and just point your finger at it all and none of them are actually useful well [TS]

  maybe useful but not used for yet another tech demo skis are prototypes [TS]

  for something that we might want five years from now maybe but it seems like [TS]

  they're emphasizing with the 5s is that looked the better camera to take better [TS]

  pictures and better video it's real improvement but also an explanation of [TS]

  the people who think that they're supposed to come out and change the [TS]

  world like we're doing the things that are going to make this phone genuinely [TS]

  better actually improve the way you do things make your life more whatever I [TS]

  let me take a break here [TS]

  sponsors an Event Apart an Event Apart is the design conference for people who [TS]

  make websites the one web design and front-end development conference that [TS]

  you don't wanna mess and it's great because there's a couple of events all [TS]

  around the country so it's not just one place and you've got to travel there [TS]

  they've probably gotten event near you [TS]

  their stage the event apart stage is where you can Marcotte introduced [TS]

  responsive web design I mean that's really invented the guy invented in a [TS]

  presentation [TS]

  part I mean this is a huge deal its work mister how a person sounded the cry for [TS]

  content strategy is where Luke Wroblewski premiered the idea of [TS]

  designing for mobile first and then go expanding to desktop browsers second if [TS]

  you care about code as well as content usability as well as design an Event [TS]

  Apart is the conference for you see the city's the schedules and the tickets and [TS]

  more go to their website here is the address an Event Apart dot com slash [TS]

  talk show and that'll let them know you came here from the show an Event Apart [TS]

  dot com slash talk show talked about so this was the first year they called the [TS]

  event this year the music event and this is the first time they've ever had quote [TS]

  unquote music event which is always the way they called their September events [TS]

  where they didn't have any new iPods not just no new iPod Touches no new iPods [TS]

  period music other than the that London Festival the iTunes Festival and I guess [TS]

  that's why they announced the drug industry for the US right the iLife [TS]

  stuff where was not a thing I miss remembers alright for sure new [TS]

  purchasers right by work that includes I work my life is lost over which is very [TS]

  nice which would be sure if I'm even remembering that correctly but we could [TS]

  come back to that that's but i wanna say I wanna talk about the iPod's arms I'm [TS]

  really wondering whether there's going to be no new iPods at all this year or [TS]

  they just didn't want to steal the spotlight from the iPhone and maybe the [TS]

  iPods are gonna come next month when they do [TS]

  iPads because I leave my hat if they don't have new iPads do you think [TS]

  they're gonna do iPods to what do you think maybe they're gonna go two years [TS]

  without even touching the iPod line I kinda hope they don't have those don't [TS]

  touch that I hope they don't get it i hope they don't touch it because it [TS]

  simpler but at what point [TS]

  does the iPod bleed into the five see well I definitely think obviously in [TS]

  terms of total costs it's way more expensive and you know in the USU no [TS]

  $199 or even if you get the $99 1 $99 five see combined with the mandatory [TS]

  two-year contract is you know you're probably talking like $2000 although I [TS]

  guess some of the carriers now have some cheaper plans likes like t-mobile and [TS]

  Sprint Verizon and AT&T words really expensive but realistically practically [TS]

  don't most families have like a family shared plan already like how what is the [TS]

  percentage of let's say kids who would want an iPod Touch they couldn't get a [TS]

  five see ya I don't know if it's also definitely the case where if you're just [TS]

  emotionally view just go in the store they're competing with each other [TS]

  because they're both bright and colorful right you know you know the ones of [TS]

  metal and plastic but the colors of the same the same sort of color scheme and [TS]

  it's you know I think very both beautiful and you know they're obviously [TS]

  they're the exact same size and they do the same thing other than whether they [TS]

  have so you're not working yet I have always seen the iPod Touch is being for [TS]

  kids [TS]

  the funniest iPad iPod ever like these things kind of all point to that same [TS]

  this is the this is a demographically nobody's these things and we're just [TS]

  gonna wait for them to my wife is isn't isn't a quilting guild so she knows a [TS]

  lot of a lot of women in their forties fifties sixties seventies a lot of them [TS]

  have really really cheap phones and iPod Touch interesting I would say all of [TS]

  them but do you know why they're like they just they get the whatever the [TS]

  cheapest stupidest well free phone plan and and for ten years so there but they [TS]

  like the iPod Touch pretty cool that you can get you can get a phone this is as [TS]

  good as the touch the cheapest phone is as good as attachment that comes free by [TS]

  the plan so what you're saying though is that John Syracuse's an old lady [TS]

  yes it is I think older people and at least in America I think they're [TS]

  particularly resistant to smartly I think it's because they're wise and [TS]

  their their sensible and they're not like me they're very sensitive to [TS]

  anything that's a recurring charge and so they're a less likely even do [TS]

  anything with recurring charge and winner is like a monthly cell phone bill [TS]

  they want it low and they you know and and they want to know exactly what it's [TS]

  going to cost and that you know if it's $29 a month is it really $29 month or [TS]

  are you gonna talk on $15.09 fees CI I think that has more to do with fear of [TS]

  change of technology if you've always had this phone also have a touch me like [TS]

  they're not releasing the photos it's just that they don't want to change the [TS]

  thing the thing that they don't understand is how their phone with the [TS]

  contract on the stuff works became something is going to be more money is [TS]

  not my money to buy different something or other [TS]

  they made the leap to cell phones and whatever where they landed they got that [TS]

  to work and they don't know exactly what they know they can get a call and let my [TS]

  grandkids their numbers are so so so the iPod Touches WiFi only well you know I [TS]

  don't have to whatever at the grocery store you know what i mean about Twitter [TS]

  notifications exist if you look at Apple's quarterly numbers yeah it's [TS]

  definitely you know I iPod sales overall are definitely trending down [TS]

  and you know looking at the history of the iPod it's it's clearly being propped [TS]

  up by the iPod Touch which is you know how hard it's not really an iPod it's an [TS]

  iPhone without the phone but I'd still sells in decent numbers it's just way [TS]

  down from its heyday you know 2005 2006 2007 but I wonder you know one of the [TS]

  nice things when I'm sure that the actual data that Apple has fascinating [TS]

  you know and who knows it could be that maybe you know if if they don't come out [TS]

  with any new iPods this year which would be the first time they've ever done [TS]

  maybe it's because it's the whole wine is sort of a legacy line and they're [TS]

  selling it you know while it's still a couple million reporter [TS]

  shades of secularism here where it used to be that the iPod was gonna buy [TS]

  security around and then it became a nap on the phone and then the iPod app on [TS]

  your phone was quietly changed the same music as I even called iPod anymore so [TS]

  now I'm getting rid of the actual physical devices to kind of make sense [TS]

  and it's only in the end it's all its gonna be one thing right [TS]

  the iPod line well but I wonder why I think maybe scenario is that based on [TS]

  what we know like an iPod is like you know two things you put music on and [TS]

  play it they've sort of perfected it like there's no white white week it this [TS]

  year if if it's not going to be any better [TS]

  like the shuttle is great the current shuttle is great iPod back or or if [TS]

  excluding need the touch the iPod is something that you care and you play [TS]

  music on that's smaller in tune to a specific set of tasks playing music and [TS]

  what not what what if they are planning to release something like that but it [TS]

  doesn't go in your pocket anymore it gets trapped your wrist exactly thats [TS]

  sort of you seem exactly where I'm going I guess I've always thought that maybe [TS]

  the if there's an iWatch that its think about it more as a next generation iPod [TS]

  right and you know maybe that's something to I don't think we would see [TS]

  it this year I think this m7 because its new is is meant only to be in the 50 S [TS]

  but think about like next year what if they put in m7 in something like the [TS]

  shuffle and maybe some of the shuttle's come with a watch strap and now you've [TS]

  got a thing that you know and combine that with a little bit of the little [TS]

  blue tooth like the airdrop style Bluetooth communication where you don't [TS]

  have to like to liking connected with a cable sync process the sink just happens [TS]

  over the year when it get when your iPod shuffle gets near your iPhone or iPad [TS]

  and there's a good thing that happens every time interval right yeah and that [TS]

  way [TS]

  brand can put his i watch on and go for his run and then it just talks to his [TS]

  phone everything works right and it's all coordinated and that you know and if [TS]

  your time you spend with both your iPhone and you watch or whatever it is [TS]

  you know little clip on thing there's no duplication of it because they they know [TS]

  they're near each other and in fact maybe they could almost like double [TS]

  check like I had him at a thousand steps the other device said 1100 will call at [TS]

  ten fifty right but it wouldn't go down is 2100 you know what it reminds me of [TS]

  is the play count and iTunes not sure how do you take your phone you listen to [TS]

  music in your car and you come back in your bones things to your computer in [TS]

  the lake at night he gets updated yeah I know exactly how many times I've [TS]

  listened to any song so that sort of thinking combined with no actual manual [TS]

  intervention to make this thing happen you know they make you set them up you [TS]

  pair them at one point in the beginning and in the future [TS]

  all their handshaking just happens well let's let's also think maybe that if [TS]

  these if the iWatch or whatever [TS]

  they're gonna call it maybe it does have not just life I but some kind of [TS]

  cellular data thing you can get on it mean that would make it much more useful [TS]

  out in the wild [TS]

  yeah I think especially of notifications right that's what I'm expecting their [TS]

  the way these things work now is that the talks to your phone via bluetooth [TS]

  and just picked up their applications via phone but if it's another one of [TS]

  these ties to your buck 50 my watch on the ties my a polite the [TS]

  then wherever I am it could be in trouble sending all of my my step count [TS]

  data up to this thing could be third and final sponsor these guys are great I [TS]

  love i mean they're actually there's like 10 percent of my body weight is [TS]

  their product at Starbucks Coffee back on the show and a week like this and [TS]

  I've been away from home this is a fourth day away from home I play on the [TS]

  morrow III we've had some good coffee here I had some good coffee in San [TS]

  Francisco Bay what I miss my talks really do I'm starting to get the shakes [TS]

  plus we don't know the talks is a small online Coffee Company days source beings [TS]

  from all over the world [TS]

  themselves they roasted themselves and then they ship it to the people who are [TS]

  their customers you subsided per subscription totally reasonable rate for [TS]

  what I would argue is as good a coffee as you can get anywhere in the world and [TS]

  you sign up for how frequently wanted I get every two weeks ago a big bag and [TS]

  it's just magic just every two weeks [TS]

  a bag of fantastic amazing coffee just shows up at my door [TS]

  one of the little things as time goes on I just love about talks number one I [TS]

  still never gotten a bad that I didn't think was great but I get badges a [TS]

  coffee that I would not ordinarily by usually when it before talks what I [TS]

  would do is i would find one kind of coffee that I like and I would just buy [TS]

  it that exact coffee week after week after week [TS]

  scares me like a variety and sort of opens my palate [TS]

  coffees that I wouldn't ordinarily try you just put your faith in talks and [TS]

  they give you great coffee pretty good I am the guy who thinks the same exact [TS]

  thing every day so you should think about it the more you go to talk start [TS]

  org CTO and acts and you'll find out more but I cannot recommend them highly [TS]

  enough i'm looking up right now what we gonna do with him I can I can I get a [TS]

  real good with you are you could also just google docs to you and access to go [TS]

  and I googled it but anyway go there if you like coffee talks unites looks like [TS]

  they have decaf so if you're like me and I mean don't ever admit that vintage on [TS]

  know so last week I don't notice the same case enough Lee there's there's a [TS]

  small point which is occasionally at night a little coffee sounds good and [TS]

  you really just a you know not every day not a good week not even every month but [TS]

  on occasion and you know I guess the thing I love the way good coffee tastes [TS]

  show there is something when you talk about decaf vs Capcom you are you [TS]

  treating like the drug is it matters do not like the flavor if you don't like [TS]

  the flavor do you care about the process of D drug defying it changes a little [TS]

  bit but not so much that I mean I haven't had caffeine caffeine so long [TS]

  that I don't remember what the differences if there's one right now I [TS]

  feel like you wouldn't even if it was really good [TS]

  well there are people who do want tastings wine people wow that's a really [TS]

  great to get into a wine tasting like a really serious one and don't like [TS]

  everybody else is everybody else is all we need to talk about the [TS]

  and all this stuff and branded in the bottle empty bucket as his whiskey is [TS]

  suing congress wine is so snobby nabi booze right and i think is becoming the [TS]

  snobby alcohol yeah but it never will be on the way wineries and I'm not saying [TS]

  that I'm not a wine drinker but I'm not but I i understand you know that it [TS]

  really is so hard to make good wine that it's worth the money because it is you [TS]

  know it's supply and demand and it might actually be worth to buy the line but I [TS]

  just get so dressed up its serious wine is very dressy thing and then they're [TS]

  spinning in the bucket yeah it's money paid them up right it's like you know [TS]

  some wine tastings are is as fine and experience as elegant experiences you're [TS]

  gonna find these fancy people spitting being grouped into my guess is better [TS]

  than 50 people being smashed their minds and I really I think people are probably [TS]

  improved by being special I think drinking some of the problem [TS]

  alright speaking against a target I S wrap the show up and talk about over [TS]

  seven and maybe tired and a little bit with what we've been doing with that and [TS]

  some of the design challenges that we face we were just talking about it today [TS]

  and Eve you said something to the effect of their unveiled it back in [TS]

  June and then I was seven came out a week later an awful lot of people said [TS]

  wow you guys you know sort of saw where the puck was going you guys kind of have [TS]

  an iOS 7 looking out before I was seven and then followed that up with you guys [TS]

  probably won't have much to do to update the design for more than a weekend but [TS]

  like any good thing was designed basically I scribbled some stuff in [TS]

  crayon militant brand mailed it the actual postal me the truth is we I think [TS]

  we ran into more design problems getting this thing to where we wanted to be Fri [TS]

  07 then we did with the original version yes I think a lot of us because we we [TS]

  were speculating we were trying pretty hard to get a sense of what the future [TS]

  is going to look like and I'm not going to say it's an accident that we got what [TS]

  we did a lot of work into it but I am surprised by how close we got better or [TS]

  worse I'm surprised that we got as close as we did and when when you look at what [TS]

  I was seven actually is the way that all turned out were close but there's [TS]

  differences that are not just a cosmetic fix their differences that required [TS]

  rethinking the way we did some things well and there's definitely some [TS]

  differences that really i mean ourselves but honestly they come down to if if [TS]

  Apple had a star pinion before I was seven came out we would have recommended [TS]

  they do something different [TS]

  there's no not picky wait to see what you've written about it on your blog [TS]

  Dave but the status bar the thing at the top of the screen where there's the time [TS]

  the carrier signal strength that's when we just disagree with what Apple's done [TS]

  in Dallas seven energy was really really hard to figure out what to do with [TS]

  aspirin that shaking my head in frustration I i look at that thing and [TS]

  it doesn't make any sense to me the reason I get why they wanted it to look [TS]

  like the entire screen was the at extracting [TS]

  abstracting the hardware and software but the trouble is that the status bar [TS]

  has always been hardware that's always been its all Harbor indicators or [TS]

  something I have control over yeah it's a throwback to like dumb phones were [TS]

  there'd be an LED line that would strip you signal strength [TS]

  raise the time but now they've taken what was an OS level problem showing me [TS]

  that hardware information and made it an apple of a problem for now I as a [TS]

  designer have to account for what they've done in a way that I want have [TS]

  no control over that's the big issue we have so little control we can say be [TS]

  darker be like yeah so that means our Design has to be so that it's readable [TS]

  we can't do anything right you can't you can't do anything where the left at your [TS]

  screen is dark generate happens like a lesson to draw a pic status bar [TS]

  background that idea we thought seriously about do we just all black [TS]

  rectangle there say screw Apple they're wrong and I believe me I'm still kind of [TS]

  tempted it would be easiest to program gotta get used to it I still hate it but [TS]

  I've gotten used to it [TS]

  enough to where it doesn't enrage me I can look at the work we've done I'm [TS]

  happy with where we are just way more effort to get here that it frustrates me [TS]

  about it is that they started with the status bar problem and I'm this is the [TS]

  original iPhone in 2007 there were a couple of different styles there was the [TS]

  great style black style there is a third style but it was always kind of up in [TS]

  the air if you went anywhere non-standard you I wise in your app [TS]

  which status bar you're supposed to use and I think that the head went back and [TS]

  forth on it [TS]

  I've got an opinion on this and then the iPad came out and they did something [TS]

  interesting when the iPad came out the status bar was black and that was it [TS]

  and your options were show the status bar and if you do get a black one or [TS]

  don't show it like if you're a gamer showing the full screen video and that's [TS]

  it and it means that was so clearly what they should have done with the iPhone [TS]

  and I honestly thought this is back 2010 when the iPad came out and when I [TS]

  noticed that this there was no great status bar they're always black and I [TS]

  thought always look great great on both white ones and black ones hardware that [TS]

  was a great next year when the iPhone comes out that go with the black status [TS]

  bar and then instead they went with the goofy color thing the weird extracting [TS]

  from the navbar 10th color right and it made it and my pain worse but it was [TS]

  still I think better than this because you at least had the option is an app [TS]

  developer to go black you can see just give me a black status and if you look [TS]

  in the App Store almost all apps I would say are nice they all have the black [TS]

  status bar on Iowa sex because that's the sensible solution is almost like [TS]

  third-party developers are screaming at Apple you solve this with the iPad just [TS]

  have a black status yeah I mean you look at iOS 6 I can't think of a single app [TS]

  that I admire that uses the great status bar know and I think that the way you [TS]

  know the semantics of it are that you know 98% of the screen is yours being [TS]

  that you know and we'll just take this loss trip up here for the system right [TS]

  to go somewhere right look at the user needs to see this we gotta show it we [TS]

  gotta put it somewhere to stick it up here and in this part of the screen and [TS]

  get everything below that we're sorry but I will take care of this and now [TS]

  they're saying is you have to show this stuff you have to deal with it and a few [TS]

  you figured out it's really hard if you customize your right your eyes you I at [TS]

  all [TS]

  yeah to deal with and we've talked about how the UI is always going to be home [TS]

  the UI pieces are always going to be about it system WI and so it's as much [TS]

  as would be nice to have any kind of typography control over things like what [TS]

  do you i alert looks like when the activity sheets the status bar taxed as [TS]

  long as it's all consistent that's that's fine but it's still it's another [TS]

  it's another example of they've got full control over this thing but it's your [TS]

  problem I never found it jarring typographical II when you know we use a [TS]

  custom other a lot of apps use custom never found it jarring in iOS 6 when the [TS]

  status bar was black and white Helvetica tax and any app underneath was a [TS]

  different things it seemed like here's to different regions little tiny bit of [TS]

  the system at the top down below that is integrated with the navbar it does I [TS]

  think I think anytime I think any app that uses custom fonts it's jarring in [TS]

  the way that you know it's it's just dishonest the status bar is not part of [TS]

  our appt right I think this is the best reviews they're alright it's almost like [TS]

  in you I turn so much like a parasite yeah yeah you could tell I really like [TS]

  what else what other problems did we have live luring you know and you know [TS]

  the wonderful demos Apple did everything look like live blurring would be an easy [TS]

  thing to do would be all over I don't know no way too many surprises but we're [TS]

  trying to do live learn with something in it just was a nightmare is the only [TS]

  way you can do this if you if you use the tool bar now bar yeah and so we [TS]

  wanted something larger than we just do a giant will borrow the things we wanted [TS]

  to blur seriously developers here's your tip AQI toolbar make whatever size you [TS]

  want you just like any other do I view then you've got like ever performance [TS]

  sucks so and I guess that's probably why they didn't expose it you know they've [TS]

  kept the library to themselves is that you know there are some serious [TS]

  performance problems [TS]

  and so they're they're doing it in small doses and knowing they know exactly how [TS]

  much live blurring performance problems are going on the phone because the only [TS]

  people who get it is the system itself well the live during the reason we wind [TS]

  up going slightly different direction is not because of the performance I mean [TS]

  that was definitely worth considering but it was more that we have to account [TS]

  for what happens on devices that are capable of doing the blur and now [TS]

  designing for different things and we wind up doing something else be like the [TS]

  way they look better [TS]

  the other thing that we ran into and I guess I don't know if we want to spoil [TS]

  it or not but we can talk about week maybe we won't say what we came up with [TS]

  but the question of all of Apple's out Fri 17 have a white navbar the top are [TS]

  colored now of bars and no flat whatever just is a colored navbar passe Apple is [TS]

  really setting a tempo here and I don't know if they mean to or not it almost [TS]

  seems like it's unintentional but they're really setting a temple of [TS]

  everything is gonna have to wait in a bar and i'm i'm fearful of this [TS]

  historically the stock apps that come with the phone Apple stock apps have [TS]

  always had suggestions for what [TS]

  third-party developers should do with their apps like everything from the [TS]

  compass after the stocks after two maps have all had like one or two things that [TS]

  were a little bit custom or suggested what you should do in this kind of [TS]

  situation in with every app now having that right now part I'm fearful that [TS]

  developers in be turning out apostolic the same I just don't don't thinks I [TS]

  don't think I'll turn out that way I think developers of you like a you know [TS]

  you know we have a color scheme we have some branding whenever you're ready to a [TS]

  number I had i dont in in happen even complain to them but I don't think it's [TS]

  going to change i think that based just on a few screenshots they showed at the [TS]

  event this week of of third-party iOS apps that are in development you know a [TS]

  couple of them [TS]

  but I saw a couple of them and just in the screenshots that flash by road [TS]

  quickly that had colored now bars and they were you know flattered or or [TS]

  totally flat but they you know they seems to me like even just the ones that [TS]

  Apple already has been in communication with behind the scenes color is not [TS]

  going away [TS]

  yeah I guess my bigger concern is that developers going to do everything to do [TS]

  with no guidance there's nothing I was given us nothing to show us how we're [TS]

  supposed to do this and so the family in the dark so the guy INS will be here to [TS]

  pee right we'll see what other developers to do and I think kind of [TS]

  form based on that we don't really understand I was seven from Apple's [TS]

  absolutely understand it because I come factory near yeah and it's always kind [TS]

  of been there were others are things we learned from a ponders the things we [TS]

  learned from third parties this just seems like Apple had an opportunity and [TS]

  they threw it away and it's not clear to me why they had an opportunity to show [TS]

  what we're doing it might just be that they don't know they don't know how to [TS]

  handle color and what have you guys figured out we did this stupid thing [TS]

  with the status bar now we have no idea what to do and yeah and and we talked [TS]

  about this before the show but I think that possible it's possible I could see [TS]

  how maybe like when they were doing and they wanted to let's start with a clean [TS]

  slate let's have no preconceptions from the look and feel that maybe they tried [TS]

  to get away with now bars from completely and if there was going to be [TS]

  a back button just dry with no background and you know just if there is [TS]

  a button just draw the buttons over the content and some of the apps you know [TS]

  like the weather app that fit on a screen there like that you know not that [TS]

  weather had a nap now far before but you could see it you know I think the stocks [TS]

  app is another example the more rigid es rate but the problem you run into if [TS]

  you're just gonna draw the button with nothing no bar behind it that stretches [TS]

  across what do you do with scrolling content all of a sudden you're your [TS]

  words are being covered by a button [TS]

  that doesn't look great and I almost wonder if that's what they tried [TS]

  realized scrolling content was a problem and then they went white with the [TS]

  background but in their minds they don't even see it as a white navbar they see [TS]

  that is known as far but just that it white said that it obscures the content [TS]

  as it swirls underneath and maybe the party race you still kind of see you get [TS]

  the context of this that's interesting you can still do that with a colored now [TS]

  bar doesn't work quite the same way but there's also how do you handle different [TS]

  types of content especially images versus text this thing show up [TS]

  differently behind a blurred now borrows things differently behind a text but [TS]

  they are different so I've been running I was seven bidders I think since been [TS]

  at 32 weeks after four weeks after switching to debate on the same day and [TS]

  I can definitely say I like and again we just grabbed about something so there's [TS]

  definitely something that I don't like about I was but overall I really do like [TS]

  it and the thing that really jumps out is when I use apps that aren't updated [TS]

  for iOS app which is a lot of apps at this point because you know none of us [TS]

  really only ones that I'm beta testing that could be updated for seven or [TS]

  Apple's own lines but it every single time it it's like punching a guy right [TS]

  yeah I think she just looks so chunky yeah it looks it looks like it looks [TS]

  slow it adds five pounds of the feeling I know you know I could be this is one [TS]

  of those places right maybe just two blinded by my own preferences but I [TS]

  really do think that normal people are a lot of normal people when they upgrade [TS]

  the phone to Iowa 7 which you know the statistics show they do very quickly I [TS]

  think that they are going to be grossed out by apps that haven't been updated [TS]

  for seven yeah you know my my initial just noise about this and he made the [TS]

  point that when Windows the switch gets flipped and everybody sees that there is [TS]

  an update available [TS]

  normal people had the buttoned up to 80 s their phone restarts or that had they [TS]

  based their gonna wake up a look at the phone and they're going to be shocked [TS]

  but I don't i maybe it's that I've had enough time to look at it and think [TS]

  about and get used to it I just don't think there's any couple support calls [TS]

  but for the most part been pretty well informed that there is a change coming [TS]

  and despite looking different it's still it's not even that it doesn't feel [TS]

  different feels very different but in a very good women so feels familiar I [TS]

  don't think it's gonna be a jarring to normal people underestimate people's [TS]

  hatred of any change at all [TS]

  yeah and I think it's you know there's no doubt in my mind I think Apple's done [TS]

  a good job but I think it's a better design is by far I think it's built to [TS]

  last [TS]

  i like it alot better I think it's going to be fun and I think I was pretty [TS]

  confident of all those things that I just said that I think even Apple has no [TS]

  idea what that first month reaction is going to be like I guess maybe the [TS]

  better point to make would be that even if the reaction is bad apples willing to [TS]

  take that hit well they did it with maps and mean in the new maps was going to be [TS]

  bad but I think they were surprised by how bad people considered it right it [TS]

  whereas with iOS I think they're confident rightfully so that people may [TS]

  be surprised at first but will end up being very happy for the change these [TS]

  are things that need to happen when I get upset when people who talk about how [TS]

  I was seven assists visual change it's all it's all just a new coat of paint [TS]

  kind of thing to me it feels so much better than our sex and if you if you [TS]

  only see our seven individual change I have to assume you haven't used it is it [TS]

  feels so much better and again familiar so I can see where there might be some [TS]

  confusion but there's just so many details are better thought out well and [TS]

  I think like multitasking is one example where I think you know the original have [TS]

  fun didn't have it I mean I'm talking about the computer science level I'm [TS]

  saying can you switch double tap home in switching don't not not getting into the [TS]

  and then it didn't have it and I am sure they've had some basic idea of how they [TS]

  were going to do it maybe even already knew [TS]

  double tap the home screen but whenever you designed something when you actually [TS]

  have to do it for real its like that's when the shit hits the fan and you [TS]

  always run an unexpected problems and the multitasking interface on iOS 6 and [TS]

  543 whenever they introduced it was always felt a little tacked on [TS]

  yeah yeah and whereas the multitasking on I was 7 feels natural because there [TS]

  is this the animations play into this where your icon flashes from the launch [TS]

  it zooms in and that becomes your app and when you double tap for multitasking [TS]

  the app gets sucked back a little bit you know three dimensionality of the [TS]

  animations conveys to you how the multitasking work it's funny it going [TS]

  back to the things that we got right ahead of time its its users easy access [TS]

  as we don't push over investor to get to the details you have no balls in it [TS]

  seems an odd solves the axis navigation and that's that's the world we live in [TS]

  now I think it's great i like that every out deals that way I like the way that [TS]

  folders are set up now to learn you tap on it just comes forward in the outcomes [TS]

  that everything is all in the z axis you're either moving into or out of the [TS]

  thing you want your not and that's what he said the things that you want are [TS]

  appearing and disappearing a logical way there's there's not as much spatial [TS]

  movement as there was when I was 6 for the API 7 totally corrupt all that which [TS]

  is interesting he still is still easier to move left and right using a standard [TS]

  navigation and you can write you know but it's nowhere near as easy to a lot [TS]

  of work to do [TS]

  early days of break ya overtime overtime it's getting there but to me that is a [TS]

  huge fundamental change in seven [TS]

  one that I quite like if if if there's anything that excites me the most about [TS]

  our seven it's what it means for Iowa see ya there were on a trajectory now [TS]

  that is genuinely excited it does it does feel I'm grateful that it still had [TS]

  to hasn't shipped to consumers but we've already heard we're building up the [TS]

  whole show has been about is building up to fix the status bar fixed assets if [TS]

  there's if there's anyone think of anybody that thinks that satisfied [TS]

  having used it and guidance [TS]

  you know it's now when I see your advisers see my wife's phone something [TS]

  running iOS 6 and they never really jumps out at me and it's is not a unique [TS]

  observation everybody a lot of people do know right after it to be the seeds kind [TS]

  of picked up on this but it in practice it to me it's very tangible is everybody [TS]

  says I was seven is flat and Iowa 6 was not flat but conceptually iOS 6 was very [TS]

  flat in terms of you to open an app in the App was just there and you go left [TS]

  or right side ways you navigated through the app right if she's a piece of paper [TS]

  being moved around wright's kid 23 dienes of like I said like the [TS]

  multitasking that there's these levels like there's this bottom level which is [TS]

  the AP's that's your home screen and then there's like a mid-level which is [TS]

  your multitasking you're switching between running apps right and it's the [TS]

  actual card and I know Palm webOS had a very similar multitasking interface with [TS]

  the cards but that's the way that that card zooms up to fill the screen it's [TS]

  like a third level of Zoom Mic now you're really zoomed in and you're in [TS]

  the app it it really gives you more of a sense of place where you are and drive [TS]

  which apps you're switching between right and flat when people talk about or [TS]

  complain about flattened I was seven they're just talking about the visual [TS]

  and again all this focus on the visual there's so much more that people are [TS]

  missing it's so much easier to talk about the visual though to talk about [TS]

  things it's visually flat but conceptually very much not flagged as I [TS]

  was 6 was [TS]

  just animation and and and navigation was very flat but visually very lumpy I [TS]

  think in terms of like is gonna be controversial when it rolls out and [TS]

  you're one ok yes update me when I'm plugged-in away from perhaps getting a [TS]

  very major surprise I sighed I think with Dave fry clearly you can't have a [TS]

  hundred million customers in not have some of them scream bloody mary no [TS]

  matter what you do but I think it's going to go over pretty well and I think [TS]

  that there's enough awareness that that this is happening that that will be [TS]

  allowed fewer people surprised than some people think talking to a friend of mine [TS]

  and she'd she'd called me right after the 2007 announcement she was super [TS]

  excited that she's not a technical person should work in this industry but [TS]

  she said she watched the event she loves her phone she loves using Apple stuff [TS]

  and she sees the stuff in seven she's genuinely excited and this is just like [TS]

  like a scandalously worldwide you know which last two weeks like it but I mean [TS]

  it could be an interesting [TS]

  could be really really noisy and don't underestimate the news media's desire [TS]

  for anti Apple stories or made another mistake stories and blown out of [TS]

  proportion of the the end of that story is that she's got seven running on the [TS]

  phone now so that she can [TS]

  loves it [TS]

  a genuine visiting genuinely excited about all the new things it does and the [TS]

  way it works and it just so much better and that that's my template for the rest [TS]

  of the world to do people resisted for a second spend a day or two it and they're [TS]

  gonna love it [TS]

  should wrap up soon but here's one last topic would be with a lot of it it gets [TS]

  to the stuff that's not just cosmetic but even the cosmetic stuff is hard to [TS]

  straddle Iowa six and seven so how many apps do you think you're gonna go Iowa [TS]

  seven on volume lot of people I talk to you really wanna do I was seven only but [TS]

  they have constraints sure bosses clients whatever as people often tend to [TS]

  be very conservative they think that brought back to for about three years [TS]

  later I III there are reasons 16 now is it ninety years more than 96 I think [TS]

  it's more than 95 something ridiculous and red hair I think no matter what I [TS]

  think it's you know I think I was 7 reach similar levels similar time I was [TS]

  a pastor right so how do I wonder I mean I can see not going I was only on day [TS]

  one because there is a ramp up its not like 95% of people are going to britain [TS]

  first week I was 5 didn't have to update it didn't have the over the air update [TS]

  right and six so I'm expecting I would expect then that even more it's even [TS]

  faster than we get the same percentage yeah but I you know I think it's very [TS]

  reasonable to do it with it within a couple of months time frame I really do [TS]

  and I don't think you're gonna leave many customers behind and I think the [TS]

  people you do or probably not you know it's just not a big enough number to [TS]

  really worry about right yeah you're leaving behind a people who don't buy [TS]

  software the people who don't upgrade custom I am reminded of like the people [TS]

  who are coming onto classic Mac OS for five years after Mac OS 10 came out like [TS]

  first 23 years I was actually totally reasonable I spent a lot of time on Mac [TS]

  OS nine first to three years after Mac OS 10 came out I want to some that was [TS]

  fast but there there came a point you know we're taking Monday that they have [TS]

  computers that run classic in years and you're still running it because of you [TS]

  know [TS]

  know [TS]

  NZ you know but hurt feelings about Mac OS 10 you know there's gonna be some of [TS]

  those people with iOS 6 who are going to you know klingon iOS 6 for the next [TS]

  three years and not upgrade their phone and complain but there are you said [TS]

  they're not good customers they're they're not they're they're not the [TS]

  people that you can reach with your software god I hope there's not like a [TS]

  huge contingent of talk show listeners who are all I can already get so much [TS]

  hate men who are already planning their strategies for keeping their it's [TS]

  getting harder and harder not to update I think not just cause your social [TS]

  pressure whatever but it seems like the UI is more and more like you know we [TS]

  have over the air update so you know you just kinda can't miss it [TS]

  yeah you know here's where you go I was seven only known on right now [TS]

  assets on the iPhone because because it doesn't support I was seven doesn't [TS]

  support any devices that are threatening about the iPad Mini the iPad Mini runs [TS]

  iPhone apps into expert so users to access [TS]

  well there you go yeah nine runners gross too X thank you guys its rapid up [TS]

  Brandon Simmons and and Dave whiskas thank you very much I love doing shows [TS]

  like this where I'm in the room with you if you like these are the best yet [TS]

  dining room yeah I thank our sponsors we had Squarespace talks and an Event Apart [TS]

  so thanks thanks thank you [TS]