Roderick on the Line

Ep. 156: "The Dumbest Guy I Ever Met"


00:00:00   this episode of rock on the line is [TS]

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00:00:19   hello hi John hi Merlin how's it going [TS]

00:00:24   good how ru who I'm facing the fan [TS]

00:00:27   myself a little southern lady [TS]

00:00:29   uh-huh is it hot down there in [TS]

00:00:31   California a Oh John Rother you are [TS]

00:00:33   caution [TS]

00:00:34   yeah it's a no-no it's you know it's [TS]

00:00:38   like every day I should you know you [TS]

00:00:40   could just take a sharpie and write 51 [TS]

00:00:41   uh I phone screen that's pretty much 51 [TS]

00:00:44   51 degrees 51 degrees with the with the [TS]

00:00:47   breeze off the ocean [TS]

00:00:48   yep yep yep yeah it's beautiful here in [TS]

00:00:51   Seattle because as you know global [TS]

00:00:53   warming which is really climate change [TS]

00:00:58   let's see on its climate change we got [TS]

00:01:00   it we got it we gotta work on that it is [TS]

00:01:02   turning Seattle into la jolla which is [TS]

00:01:06   which is wonderful i love that name [TS]

00:01:09   uh yeah la jolla home of dr. Seuss I [TS]

00:01:14   we're going to have a beautiful day here [TS]

00:01:17   that's going to have sea lions in it and [TS]

00:01:19   they're going to be a lot of surfers who [TS]

00:01:20   are very protective of their Beach [TS]

00:01:23   locals only so so that's what's [TS]

00:01:26   happening here and we're having a you [TS]

00:01:28   know we're having a great time property [TS]

00:01:29   values are skyrocketing and we couldn't [TS]

00:01:31   be more excited about it oh my god what [TS]

00:01:33   a great time to be a Seattle ition mm oh [TS]

00:01:36   my goodness you we are we you know just [TS]

00:01:39   administrivia we we were worried what we [TS]

00:01:41   could work in recording this week with [TS]

00:01:42   the with the with the holidays and what [TS]

00:01:44   nuneaton you know what you know what you [TS]

00:01:45   you hit me hit me on my burner em I said [TS]

00:01:48   what time i went to wear that was like [TS]

00:01:49   that was ten minutes ago [TS]

00:01:50   boom I was like I was pulling into a [TS]

00:01:52   parking lot and I was like you know [TS]

00:01:54   what's missing in my life you know what [TS]

00:01:56   is missing right now is Merlin man oh [TS]

00:01:58   man i need the show and i pinged you [TS]

00:02:01   being you know the thing is I've started [TS]

00:02:03   to say like helping you what why don't [TS]

00:02:05   you pick me [TS]

00:02:06   ping ping ping ping and it's surprising [TS]

00:02:09   how many people get upset about the use [TS]

00:02:12   of the word ping it like being in [TS]

00:02:14   transitively paint they don't want to [TS]

00:02:15   bed do not want to ping they do not want [TS]

00:02:18   to deepen how do you on ping is nice in [TS]

00:02:22   one way arm thing is nice because it [TS]

00:02:25   exists without respect to how one pings [TS]

00:02:29   so that could you call could be an email [TS]

00:02:31   could be a text and then it has the [TS]

00:02:33   and problems of not having that [TS]

00:02:34   specificity but I'm not uh oh geez [TS]

00:02:37   Louise of all the stupid stuff that [TS]

00:02:41   people say I ping is far from my biggest [TS]

00:02:43   right now [TS]

00:02:44   well I did the reason I use ping who not [TS]

00:02:49   just because of its association with him [TS]

00:02:51   with a very famous panda bear but also [TS]

00:02:55   because of time let's see one ping [TS]

00:02:59   Mowgli actually i finally saw that one [TS]

00:03:02   laughing like yes one ping only oh let [TS]

00:03:07   me leave may ask question [TS]

00:03:09   thank you um first-time caller the in [TS]

00:03:13   the process of going to probably should [TS]

00:03:15   get straight to the campaign [TS]

00:03:16   oh geez Wow why don't we wait and we can [TS]

00:03:18   save it for later I have a lot to have a [TS]

00:03:19   lot to talk about i have never looked up [TS]

00:03:22   to do you need to be many new chip [TS]

00:03:24   beetle beetle but by the way your [TS]

00:03:26   identity kandice impersonation was [TS]

00:03:27   impeccable shaman amo that's not like a [TS]

00:03:30   WoW building building the bundu gonna be [TS]

00:03:35   a little bit bow i think it is with his [TS]

00:03:38   arms that's just disturbing [TS]

00:03:40   well I think about when you think about [TS]

00:03:41   the I mean I sometimes try to put myself [TS]

00:03:43   in to anthony kiedis and see the world [TS]

00:03:47   through those eyes and imagine the life [TS]

00:03:51   that he led and I just feel so warm [TS]

00:03:55   oh ok i'll write something down here um [TS]

00:03:58   ok anyway so you want to jump you want [TS]

00:03:59   to jump right in oh I also went out [TS]

00:04:01   myself a little bit because for what our [TS]

00:04:04   mama call the autumn of 1988 i really [TS]

00:04:11   liked the red hot chili peppers mother's [TS]

00:04:14   milk [TS]

00:04:15   yeah if you see me getting mighty see me [TS]

00:04:17   getting high right knock me down let me [TS]

00:04:19   down there was none bigger than life [TS]

00:04:21   I'm not big on life that was good shit [TS]

00:04:23   it was really good and it had the truck [TS]

00:04:26   driver key change toward the end I don't [TS]

00:04:28   mind that I think they earned it [TS]

00:04:29   yeah they did and you know that was [TS]

00:04:31   that's one of the things about rock and [TS]

00:04:33   roll right you a band comes up you're [TS]

00:04:35   like this is interesting this is novel [TS]

00:04:37   who who knows which direction y trap is [TS]

00:04:41   going to go [TS]

00:04:41   who it could go a lot of ways and it [TS]

00:04:45   seemed like this [TS]

00:04:47   this might be the way I mean you know [TS]

00:04:48   punk and a punk [TS]

00:04:53   they've sound a lot alike they are the [TS]

00:04:55   very similar in the two great size [TS]

00:04:57   mhm and there was a there was a quite a [TS]

00:04:59   while there where like like punky punky [TS]

00:05:02   punky funk seemed like it might be the [TS]

00:05:05   might be the way to go i mean i remember [TS]

00:05:07   very distinctly in early nineteen [TS]

00:05:09   ninety-one telling everybody I knew that [TS]

00:05:13   this like sludgy dumb heavy rock thing [TS]

00:05:20   was really yesterday's news and what was [TS]

00:05:25   what the music of the future was going [TS]

00:05:27   to be was upbeat jangly pop and I was [TS]

00:05:33   correct but it took ten years of sludgy [TS]

00:05:38   grunge to get to upbeat generally pop [TS]

00:05:40   anywhere [TS]

00:05:42   yeah i mean with Rachel Paris it was [TS]

00:05:43   such a weird thing is they were they [TS]

00:05:46   were kind of their own thing for a while [TS]

00:05:47   they they had the reputation for being [TS]

00:05:48   naked in wearing socks on their [TS]

00:05:50   Johnson's and stuff like that and that [TS]

00:05:53   record store the well died [TS]

00:05:55   oh yeah right that's why he wants to be [TS]

00:05:57   knocked down yeah i think it was a shame [TS]

00:05:59   that was a shame but I'm and we traveled [TS]

00:06:02   out of town for the weekend and in [TS]

00:06:05   Sacramento man they got a radio station [TS]

00:06:07   there that I I didn't realize how much i [TS]

00:06:10   wish we had here which was like 10 1.1 i [TS]

00:06:14   think it was and it was a you know a lot [TS]

00:06:16   of the like where the urban in urban [TS]

00:06:20   stations will have the throwbacks you [TS]

00:06:22   have like a disco weekend they had like [TS]

00:06:23   it was all like nineties mostly nineties [TS]

00:06:27   hip-hop and it was amazing [TS]

00:06:31   good stuff it was a lot of stuff that I [TS]

00:06:32   was kind of tangentially aware because [TS]

00:06:34   my eye I had peak hip hop in probably [TS]

00:06:36   1989-90 where I was just it was like [TS]

00:06:38   almost all listen to it like that and [TS]

00:06:39   Pixies like dinosaurs like all I [TS]

00:06:41   listened to and but I you know I I [TS]

00:06:44   wasn't like buying it and i think i [TS]

00:06:46   bought the house of payne to set was [TS]

00:06:48   like the last rap thing that i bought [TS]

00:06:50   but it was it was so crazy because like [TS]

00:06:52   song after song after song a lot of [TS]

00:06:54   these songs [TS]

00:06:55   had only heard sampled yes but Ben stuff [TS]

00:06:58   i had heard in years like the changing [TS]

00:06:59   chink chink dr dre and snoop dogg song [TS]

00:07:02   that's a pretty good song it is more [TS]

00:07:04   like what far side i forgot about far [TS]

00:07:07   side they were really good [TS]

00:07:09   uh-huh and what was what was the worst [TS]

00:07:11   side was killer then there was a while [TS]

00:07:13   we're far side felt like that was the [TS]

00:07:14   future far side was going to be a major [TS]

00:07:17   almost like picking up the mantle of De [TS]

00:07:19   La Soul in like you know what so you [TS]

00:07:21   don't have to play in the the kanye west [TS]

00:07:24   kind of us that gold digger song it's a [TS]

00:07:26   great tune for the first Laura Neil solo [TS]

00:07:30   record that's that's a bonafide classic [TS]

00:07:32   classic funny part is that here's the [TS]

00:07:34   funny part so the signal starts fading [TS]

00:07:36   away [TS]

00:07:36   hmm you know we put more rounds drive [TS]

00:07:38   there and you know we heard everything [TS]

00:07:44   everything all the words about this [TS]

00:07:46   particular band make me laugh Marcy [TS]

00:07:48   Playground oh bummer and I I guess I [TS]

00:07:51   didn't realize when danger [TS]

00:07:53   contemporaries yes in the year that [TS]

00:07:56   didn't exist 1997 right they had a [TS]

00:07:58   member there yet [TS]

00:07:59   my one candy rats male sex and candy be [TS]

00:08:04   really you do em especially like cells [TS]

00:08:06   me like he have a like you have a CD of [TS]

00:08:09   nirvana unplugged is what you smell [TS]

00:08:11   yeah I had shared a a shuttle bus ride [TS]

00:08:14   with those guys one time from the hotel [TS]

00:08:17   to the to the festival and I find that I [TS]

00:08:22   found them to be very smirky no no I'm [TS]

00:08:25   sorry like that [TS]

00:08:26   yeah they were smirky my only point [TS]

00:08:27   being it's it's funny how like Madeline [TS]

00:08:29   and I heard that song and were like you [TS]

00:08:31   know it's it really sounds kind of a lot [TS]

00:08:36   like life on a broad unplugged nirvana [TS]

00:08:38   unplugged specifically and really kind [TS]

00:08:41   of win-win was this like was this was [TS]

00:08:43   like 93 94 97 97 years and Xavier did [TS]

00:08:47   insist they were step was still [TS]

00:08:49   happening [TS]

00:08:50   yeah yeah what was not nearly as fresh [TS]

00:08:52   as like you know dr. dre computing that [TS]

00:08:55   you know not forget about him well and I [TS]

00:08:58   mean I i I'm [TS]

00:09:03   actually like literally having a music [TS]

00:09:05   stroke right now like I just said impian [TS]

00:09:11   went important it's not working i'm not [TS]

00:09:14   sure i'm much better I feel like I think [TS]

00:09:17   I pop the stand with us are so well [TS]

00:09:19   because said ever since you mention it [TS]

00:09:20   I've been just sitting here with the [TS]

00:09:22   with the with the constant repeat of [TS]

00:09:23   those who break the law [TS]

00:09:25   go straight to the house of payne it's [TS]

00:09:27   just been shouting in my head and I [TS]

00:09:29   don't remember I don't remember having [TS]

00:09:33   having earmarked such a loud little [TS]

00:09:35   place in my brain for that will just be [TS]

00:09:37   stored the track star like each you and [TS]

00:09:41   then like digest you like / like a [TS]

00:09:43   thousand years 5,000 years like there [TS]

00:09:45   are these little people that the Sarlacc [TS]

00:09:46   of my mind ate that I've completely [TS]

00:09:47   forgotten we're being digested and then [TS]

00:09:49   suddenly it comes popping up and go oh [TS]

00:09:51   my god it's just it's like you're there [TS]

00:09:53   again I had one of those this morning on [TS]

00:09:55   the was coming into town I saw under a [TS]

00:09:59   bridge there was a homeless person had [TS]

00:10:01   built a little sort of enclosure for [TS]

00:10:04   themselves out of Thompson's and bags [TS]

00:10:06   and shopping carts and so forth and they [TS]

00:10:08   had a bicycle change to what to the to [TS]

00:10:14   the handle of one of the carts that was [TS]

00:10:16   supporting their they're pretty [TS]

00:10:18   elaborate housing construction and the [TS]

00:10:22   bicycle was a very old specialized that [TS]

00:10:28   was a bike i had once owned and as I [TS]

00:10:32   drove past it just caught a glimpse of [TS]

00:10:33   this bike and I suddenly had this flash [TS]

00:10:36   back to nineteen eighty-seven it was [TS]

00:10:40   early days of mountain bikes and I [TS]

00:10:45   wanted to buy a mountain bike and I had [TS]

00:10:48   a friend but I didn't have any money so [TS]

00:10:49   i had a friend who had a friend who had [TS]

00:10:53   a cabin up at Big Lake in Alaska which [TS]

00:10:56   is quite a ways from Anchorage up to big [TS]

00:10:58   lake big lake was where all the like all [TS]

00:11:01   the rich kids their dads all had cabins [TS]

00:11:04   on big lake and you could fly up there [TS]

00:11:05   in a floatplane or you could drive up [TS]

00:11:07   there and it was one of the few lakes [TS]

00:11:10   you could drive to right at most lakes [TS]

00:11:12   you couldn't but big lake was accessible [TS]

00:11:15   it was where the jet skiing happened in [TS]

00:11:17   the water skiing so forth so I Drive up [TS]

00:11:19   to big lake with my friend sheffer [TS]

00:11:21   Shepherd knows a guy who's got a [TS]

00:11:24   mountain bike for sale and I get up [TS]

00:11:27   there and it's this specialized which [TS]

00:11:30   was not properly a mountain bike but it [TS]

00:11:32   was one of those early early bikes [TS]

00:11:37   wasn't i remember being a pretty not [TS]

00:11:40   cheap and pretty Hardy road bike [TS]

00:11:43   well it was so this was this had [TS]

00:11:45   stand-up handlebars it was built to look [TS]

00:11:48   like a mountain bike but it was very [TS]

00:11:52   very upright riding position and i think [TS]

00:11:55   it was it was before I don't know if you [TS]

00:11:58   remember this but early days of mountain [TS]

00:11:59   biking there was a lot of question about [TS]

00:12:01   what the frame geometry was gonna [TS]

00:12:04   eventually look like for mountain bikes [TS]

00:12:06   there were there was some argument that [TS]

00:12:08   a that when you spend more time riding [TS]

00:12:12   uphill than down so the frame geometry [TS]

00:12:14   should reflect a riding position that [TS]

00:12:16   was like level if you were climbing and [TS]

00:12:20   there was a lot of different radical [TS]

00:12:22   design ideas in early mountain bikes [TS]

00:12:24   before it all kind of settled down to [TS]

00:12:26   the overall general frame and this was [TS]

00:12:30   like this was actually probably best [TS]

00:12:33   described as a dad bike for but to my [TS]

00:12:37   net mid-eighties eyes it looked like a [TS]

00:12:40   mountain bike because it had these q's [TS]

00:12:43   these visual cues the the straight [TS]

00:12:45   handlebars the knobby tires the few [TS]

00:12:49   other things you know shimano components [TS]

00:12:50   all these things that I was excited [TS]

00:12:52   about and so the guy only wanted a [TS]

00:12:55   hundred bucks for it because he had [TS]

00:12:57   bought himself a proper mountain bike [TS]

00:12:59   and this was just a bike for riding [TS]

00:13:01   around town but I didn't know the [TS]

00:13:02   difference and I remember I remember [TS]

00:13:04   buying the so but anyway the first thing [TS]

00:13:07   we did before any of the the negotiation [TS]

00:13:10   before any transaction happened the [TS]

00:13:12   first thing we did was we all smoked a [TS]

00:13:14   ton of pot and then we were all really [TS]

00:13:17   baked and this was at an age I mean I [TS]

00:13:22   was always very strongly affected by pot [TS]

00:13:25   and.and I would get so stoned that I [TS]

00:13:30   could not function in anyone in any [TS]

00:13:34   right way I would just I would I would [TS]

00:13:37   become incapacitated by being too high [TS]

00:13:41   and we got stoned and then we're [TS]

00:13:45   negotiating a transaction which I could [TS]

00:13:49   not I could not handle my half of it and [TS]

00:13:54   then I he said you know like here's the [TS]

00:13:57   bike it's a hundred bucks and I was like [TS]

00:13:58   does the door and he said do you want to [TS]

00:14:01   take it for a test run and I was like [TS]

00:14:02   you know [TS]

00:14:03   yes and I got on the bike and not [TS]

00:14:05   understanding how mountain bikes worked [TS]

00:14:07   not ever having been on one [TS]

00:14:09   I assumed that you could just drive [TS]

00:14:11   anywhere on it and so I i wrote 15 feet [TS]

00:14:15   up the road off the road into the ditch [TS]

00:14:17   into what was four feet of standing [TS]

00:14:21   tractor mud and in my mind's eye I saw [TS]

00:14:27   myself [TS]

00:14:27   loading across the top of this tractor [TS]

00:14:29   be settling a mean I wasn't as bad as it [TS]

00:14:33   sounds it's worse on top of my new super [TS]

00:14:36   mountain bike I was just gonna like go [TS]

00:14:38   through this stuff a just just floating [TS]

00:14:42   on top of it like a like a superstar and [TS]

00:14:43   I went right into this tractor mud end [TS]

00:14:47   owed over the handlebars just into the [TS]

00:14:50   bike into the mud so that you could only [TS]

00:14:52   see the tips of my shoes and the end of [TS]

00:14:55   my nose and you have to know that these [TS]

00:14:58   guys up a big lake they were like true [TS]

00:15:01   Alaskan mountain bike bro [TS]

00:15:04   spike water-ski dudes and sheffer was to [TS]

00:15:10   you know they all had Birkenstocks they [TS]

00:15:13   all knew knew about all this stuff right [TS]

00:15:17   and so I'm already i'm already reppin [TS]

00:15:21   that I can't hold my weed because i'm [TS]

00:15:25   too baked and everybody can tell them to [TS]

00:15:27   baked and I don't know anything about [TS]

00:15:29   mountain bikes and then i go over the [TS]

00:15:31   handlebars into the by just i rode down [TS]

00:15:33   the hill into a thing where any normal [TS]

00:15:36   sensible person would have looked and [TS]

00:15:37   said what are you doing [TS]

00:15:38   we don't go down what do you think and [TS]

00:15:40   then just splat right and there it's not [TS]

00:15:45   that they're trying not to laugh it it's [TS]

00:15:48   so stupid is even funny like think [TS]

00:15:51   they're not it's not that they're [TS]

00:15:52   laughing they are they are seriously [TS]

00:15:54   like what is wrong with this person and [TS]

00:15:57   then I think they get me out of the mud [TS]

00:15:59   they clean me off I'll take it and then [TS]

00:16:02   they said somehow we're all standing [TS]

00:16:05   around right and we're gonna go well i [TS]

00:16:09   think i think still too although now i'm [TS]

00:16:13   wet and cold [TS]

00:16:14   we're gonna go out on their boat for a [TS]

00:16:18   minute and somehow I screw up their boat [TS]

00:16:21   like I got in the boat wrong I i sat in [TS]

00:16:24   the driver's seat and turn on the engine [TS]

00:16:27   Milton there wasn't any gas in it or [TS]

00:16:29   decided I burnt suddenly the like the [TS]

00:16:31   boat is the boat motors smoking and [TS]

00:16:34   everybody's yelling at me and i don't [TS]

00:16:36   i'm not proud of my performance that day [TS]

00:16:40   and i remember that i remember these [TS]

00:16:43   guys looking at me and like one of them [TS]

00:16:45   saying like you know you like the [TS]

00:16:47   dumbest guy I've ever met and and what's [TS]

00:16:52   amazing about it is that those guys are [TS]

00:16:55   still alive probably they're no older [TS]

00:16:57   than I am there in the world somewhere [TS]

00:17:00   these two guys in their mid forties [TS]

00:17:03   probably living in Alaska and if my name [TS]

00:17:06   comes up in conversation [TS]

00:17:08   those two guys have a have one really [TS]

00:17:11   fantastic story about what an idiot I am [TS]

00:17:15   and they're not wrong I i am in in that [TS]

00:17:21   respect the dumbest guy either of those [TS]

00:17:23   two guys ever met [TS]

00:17:25   wow so that was what I was that that was [TS]

00:17:28   my little like I'm glad to know that I [TS]

00:17:30   stored that whole very hazy story [TS]

00:17:34   somewhere in my head to come out at the [TS]

00:17:37   suggestion of this specialized bike that [TS]

00:17:40   I caught out of the corner of my eye on [TS]

00:17:42   that so that and that Augustine flashing [TS]

00:17:44   back it all just the entire thing and [TS]

00:17:46   you know and I'm i think I'm i think i'm [TS]

00:17:48   confusing it with another time that [TS]

00:17:49   Peter no second i went up to big lake [TS]

00:17:52   and and also got into trouble and pretty [TS]

00:17:58   much every time I went to Big Lake I got [TS]

00:17:59   in trouble with somebody and i realized [TS]

00:18:02   i needed to just stop going to big like [TS]

00:18:03   it wasn't that was not ever going to be [TS]

00:18:05   my scene [TS]

00:18:06   uh-huh i went to a party at a cabin one [TS]

00:18:08   time a big lake and I showed up and they [TS]

00:18:10   were all the people that had gone to my [TS]

00:18:11   high school but they were all the [TS]

00:18:12   beautiful ones and for whatever reason [TS]

00:18:15   that day for some other reason I'm not [TS]

00:18:19   sure why but I chose to wear a tuxedo [TS]

00:18:21   and I showed up at this lake cabin where [TS]

00:18:24   everyone else is in bikinis and James [TS]

00:18:28   remember jams of course I did yeah [TS]

00:18:30   everybody's in jams and bikinis and [TS]

00:18:32   they're all jumping off the dock and [TS]

00:18:34   they're all like jet skiing and [TS]

00:18:35   everything very very Alaskan version of [TS]

00:18:38   like beach blanket bingo and jen you're [TS]

00:18:41   in there in the rat pack and I'm there [TS]

00:18:42   and I'm you know I'm just like I'm [TS]

00:18:45   probably 25 pounds over my my normal [TS]

00:18:48   weight and i'm wearing a brown tuxedo [TS]

00:18:50   and you know and I had long hair and it [TS]

00:18:55   was just like that people were walking [TS]

00:18:57   something front and we'll acted and [TS]

00:19:00   looked like Brian Wilson but I didn't [TS]

00:19:02   have the good sense to either stay in [TS]

00:19:03   the car or drive back to the town where [TS]

00:19:05   ever I walked right down on the dock and [TS]

00:19:07   so I'm standing on the dot i'm standing [TS]

00:19:09   on the dock [TS]

00:19:11   it's an Abercrombie & Fitch ad all [TS]

00:19:13   around me and it was one of those things [TS]

00:19:16   i used to get this used to be true all [TS]

00:19:17   the time my mere presence in the scene [TS]

00:19:21   bummed everyone else and like about come [TS]

00:19:25   on really [TS]

00:19:26   my mere presence there made sure that no [TS]

00:19:29   one was going to have sex that afternoon [TS]

00:19:30   because everybody suddenly lost the mood [TS]

00:19:34   and so that you know like all the [TS]

00:19:37   dudebros we're looking at me like to [TS]

00:19:39   just like get out of here or something [TS]

00:19:42   like just go [TS]

00:19:43   I don't know go for a walk down the dirt [TS]

00:19:45   road or something I'm like what do you [TS]

00:19:46   mean I that when i was also smoking and [TS]

00:19:51   a you know and probably like drinking [TS]

00:19:53   whiskey out of a milk bottle [TS]

00:19:56   everything about it was meant for any [TS]

00:20:01   for from another place and and probably [TS]

00:20:04   a place that did not exist maybe a place [TS]

00:20:07   that would never exist [TS]

00:20:09   oh god it's so brutal all i have to do [TS]

00:20:13   is just see this this bicycle on the [TS]

00:20:14   street today and it's all they're all [TS]

00:20:17   waiting for me [TS]

00:20:18   there's nobody there who kind of pull [TS]

00:20:19   you aside and go you know you needed a [TS]

00:20:21   couple of these interesting expectations [TS]

00:20:23   and things even met one just maybe leave [TS]

00:20:25   those on the counter next nobody could [TS]

00:20:26   nobody could because because there [TS]

00:20:28   wasn't a single other person at the [TS]

00:20:29   party I mean my friend Peter loved to [TS]

00:20:32   take me places where he could turn me [TS]

00:20:35   loose like the elephant man he he he [TS]

00:20:38   loved he loved you know Peter was always [TS]

00:20:40   Peter was was he had a good sense of [TS]

00:20:43   what to do how to handle himself he was [TS]

00:20:46   not like ever the chicest person but he [TS]

00:20:49   knew how to be at any party and seemed [TS]

00:20:53   like he belonged there [TS]

00:20:54   alright um and what Peter loved to roll [TS]

00:20:59   me into places and turn me loose and it [TS]

00:21:03   was and and and people at the party [TS]

00:21:04   would be like who in five who invited [TS]

00:21:08   this gorilla and it and you know and [TS]

00:21:11   Peter was happy to claim responsibility [TS]

00:21:12   but but never but somehow was able also [TS]

00:21:17   to disavow all my crimes right so he [TS]

00:21:21   could he could take credit for having [TS]

00:21:23   brought this monster to the party but it [TS]

00:21:26   was not his prayer was but I mean he got [TS]

00:21:28   chased out of a lot of parties to that [TS]

00:21:31   but anyway as my chaperone but it's also [TS]

00:21:34   it's different to i don't know i may be [TS]

00:21:39   different kind of thing but I feel like [TS]

00:21:40   there's this certain kind of feeling [TS]

00:21:41   were and I am I had when I especially [TS]

00:21:43   like junior high and so high school I [TS]

00:21:45   was so freaking weird because I kind of [TS]

00:21:47   wanted to be weird but I didn't realize [TS]

00:21:49   that the look I was coming up with [TS]

00:21:51   wasn't really pulled together too well [TS]

00:21:53   and it combined too many disparate [TS]

00:21:55   elements and you know this it's it's a [TS]

00:21:57   sort of always feel like I never quite [TS]

00:21:58   knew how to comb my hair to make it look [TS]

00:22:00   like other people's hair even when I [TS]

00:22:02   wore what you know theoretically the [TS]

00:22:04   same kinds of clothes other people that [TS]

00:22:06   didn't look right i still look like me [TS]

00:22:07   it just [TS]

00:22:09   and in like it's what I would just I [TS]

00:22:10   would kill for that ability to just be [TS]

00:22:13   an average person at an event and not [TS]

00:22:15   feel like a like a bizarre social [TS]

00:22:17   experiment [TS]

00:22:18   me too and particularly when when young [TS]

00:22:22   people started to make out with each [TS]

00:22:24   other and want to go make out with each [TS]

00:22:25   other and want to go have sex with each [TS]

00:22:27   other like I had a perverse pride in [TS]

00:22:30   being the the last man standing right [TS]

00:22:34   here in ER you're in a room and [TS]

00:22:36   everybody goes off into the into the [TS]

00:22:37   dark back corners [TS]

00:22:39   it's what you want the saddest game of [TS]

00:22:41   musical chairs yeah and I'm sitting out [TS]

00:22:43   there you know i'm sitting out there [TS]

00:22:44   going through the their parents jazz LP [TS]

00:22:46   is going wow this is a very rare record [TS]

00:22:49   this this is an extremely rare album we [TS]

00:22:53   heard you just below her chick low [TS]

00:22:56   anyway if never felt that never felt a [TS]

00:23:01   net because because then you know when i [TS]

00:23:05   started to hang out with weirdos [TS]

00:23:07   I hoped that the weirdos would that I'd [TS]

00:23:11   find my found my people but of course [TS]

00:23:14   that's not true either [TS]

00:23:16   you know I just still can't eat those in [TS]

00:23:18   a methodology even to being a weirdo [TS]

00:23:20   like being a weirdo in there in the [TS]

00:23:22   right way [TS]

00:23:23   yeah yeah and the weirdos want to go [TS]

00:23:25   make out with each other and I [TS]

00:23:27   desperately wanted to go make out with [TS]

00:23:29   somebody i just did not know how to [TS]

00:23:32   affect that I never felt like I had any [TS]

00:23:35   access to that I mean people who would [TS]

00:23:38   just meet at a party and make out and [TS]

00:23:41   then go their separate ways [TS]

00:23:42   I mean I might as well like wanted to [TS]

00:23:45   sprout wings that seems so foreign to me [TS]

00:23:47   yeah yeah particularly when you could be [TS]

00:23:50   arguing about LBJ in the well and a lot [TS]

00:23:55   of times arguing about LBJ in the mirror [TS]

00:23:58   because you couldn't find anybody else [TS]

00:24:00   to argue about LBJ with you and the [TS]

00:24:03   field you know the few times where I [TS]

00:24:04   would be at a party there would be an [TS]

00:24:06   attractive woman there we would start [TS]

00:24:08   talking we would start talking about LBJ [TS]

00:24:10   she would be really smart on the topic [TS]

00:24:14   of LBJ that it made it somehow even [TS]

00:24:17   worse i would i would have to throw [TS]

00:24:19   myself off the balcony to get away from [TS]

00:24:22   this [TS]

00:24:22   fascinating charming woman who wanted to [TS]

00:24:24   talk about LBJ with me so case you might [TS]

00:24:27   have just been like a temporary safe [TS]

00:24:29   harbor at the party like somebody to [TS]

00:24:31   talk to and not feel hassles or not feel [TS]

00:24:33   you know well no she was chief had [TS]

00:24:35   finally found someone to talk to about [TS]

00:24:36   LBJ to only on anything more tragic and [TS]

00:24:39   all the more tragic that then i had to [TS]

00:24:41   run out and as I was running out the [TS]

00:24:45   last decision i made as I was running [TS]

00:24:46   out of the house was to steal [TS]

00:24:48   everybody's shoes right so that was [TS]

00:24:51   never I never given just ran out i also [TS]

00:24:54   took everybody shoes and then was [TS]

00:24:56   remembered for the rest of its subtle [TS]

00:24:59   weaker arrested up the year right as the [TS]

00:25:01   that fucking guy who was told everybody [TS]

00:25:04   shoes that are fat guy in a brown tuxedo [TS]

00:25:07   is stuck in the film everybody shoes he [TS]

00:25:10   was you know he was talking to that [TS]

00:25:11   other weird girl for a long time and [TS]

00:25:13   then he stole everybody shoes including [TS]

00:25:15   hers like didn't even and didn't do [TS]

00:25:18   anything with him just put him in the [TS]

00:25:19   trunk of his car and drove around career [TS]

00:25:20   like there's just no and I have to I [TS]

00:25:24   have to say that it because i went to [TS]

00:25:25   kindergarten when I was four [TS]

00:25:27   yeah and if I had waited a year maybe my [TS]

00:25:31   whole life would be different maybe I [TS]

00:25:33   would have been so much better if I had [TS]

00:25:36   just spent that extra year being a kid [TS]

00:25:40   you you are me maybe kidding but I think [TS]

00:25:43   about that a lot [TS]

00:25:44   mhm and it was instrumental in our [TS]

00:25:46   decision to have our kid a holdback we [TS]

00:25:51   redshirted her every year I am [TS]

00:25:53   powerfully not kidding i feel like if i [TS]

00:25:55   had been if I'd gone if I because there [TS]

00:25:58   were kids I mean I had a good friend in [TS]

00:26:00   high school who was in 11th grade when i [TS]

00:26:02   was in 12th grade and he and I had the [TS]

00:26:04   exact same birthday and yeah he was [TS]

00:26:08   Rico suave in his own grade and I was [TS]

00:26:14   mean but by senior year I had figured [TS]

00:26:16   out a way to be a part of the part of [TS]

00:26:20   the culture and part of the class and to [TS]

00:26:22   be somebody who mattered but uh but I [TS]

00:26:26   was not ever [TS]

00:26:28   mature enough to to play the reindeer [TS]

00:26:32   gayness you know what I mean I kill him [TS]

00:26:34   but you think about like even just [TS]

00:26:36   looking normal I think about I've told [TS]

00:26:38   you before I think I really see this in [TS]

00:26:40   5th graders at my kids school because [TS]

00:26:43   it's kindergarten to fifth grade and the [TS]

00:26:45   thing is the the standard deviation on [TS]

00:26:48   maturity and fifth-graders is nothing [TS]

00:26:50   short of mind-boggling [TS]

00:26:51   there are a couple couple guys but [TS]

00:26:55   especially they're like these three [TS]

00:26:56   girls who are obviously like in charge [TS]

00:26:58   of the school and to these girls were [TS]

00:27:00   taller than I am and they look about 16 [TS]

00:27:03   and they're in fifth grade and then of [TS]

00:27:05   course there are there a lot of kids are [TS]

00:27:07   just random kids with boogers and then [TS]

00:27:09   there are some fifth graders my daughter [TS]

00:27:11   my daughter is taller than and she's in [TS]

00:27:13   first grade [TS]

00:27:14   it'sit's so you think about that just [TS]

00:27:15   even if even taking that into account [TS]

00:27:17   but then imagine adding or subtracting a [TS]

00:27:19   year from that and you can see how [TS]

00:27:20   completely bananas that can get you know [TS]

00:27:23   if it you know ways against you the [TS]

00:27:25   wrong [TS]

00:27:26   the funny thing is like my kid this is [TS]

00:27:27   her last week of school she's in for [TS]

00:27:29   ending first grade this week and this is [TS]

00:27:31   her fifth year of being in school which [TS]

00:27:34   I sometimes think about and I think how [TS]

00:27:35   how strange and different that is then [TS]

00:27:39   when I was a kid where she had three [TS]

00:27:41   years of preschool we had heard you a [TS]

00:27:43   graduate year in preschool and that was [TS]

00:27:46   the year we gonna say hey you know still [TS]

00:27:47   we love this place we really like this [TS]

00:27:48   place [TS]

00:27:49   she was kind of shy you know and we [TS]

00:27:51   thought I you know my daughter my uh my [TS]

00:27:53   wife started school on the early side i [TS]

00:27:55   started going the late side and we both [TS]

00:27:57   agree that i had the better deal [TS]

00:27:58   everybody i know he started later I you [TS]

00:28:01   know I think there's a thing today of [TS]

00:28:02   like we should put your kid harder put [TS]

00:28:03   your tiny little four-year-old and [TS]

00:28:04   kindergarten whatever that's everybody's [TS]

00:28:06   personal choice like if your kid can [TS]

00:28:07   read really well and therefore it seems [TS]

00:28:09   like a no-brainer don't hold him back [TS]

00:28:10   but I think about that now and like it's [TS]

00:28:13   like when I was a kid [TS]

00:28:15   this I must be honest you stayed at home [TS]

00:28:18   with your mom mostly or with a family [TS]

00:28:19   member i did not know that many kids who [TS]

00:28:22   weren't Catholic that went to school [TS]

00:28:24   before kindergarten almost all the [TS]

00:28:26   Catholic kids went to preschool or [TS]

00:28:28   nursery school as they called them you [TS]

00:28:30   know what i mean so much I mean now I [TS]

00:28:32   think about oh my god it's no wonder it [TS]

00:28:34   was such a weirdo [TS]

00:28:35   I was at home with my mom all day and [TS]

00:28:38   and play my parenting my own little [TS]

00:28:39   personal reindeer games and talking into [TS]

00:28:41   the mirror about LBJ and then the hey [TS]

00:28:43   Here I am and I was a good reader and [TS]

00:28:45   stuff like I was a smart kid but I show [TS]

00:28:46   up in fifth grade and I was like you [TS]

00:28:48   know [TS]

00:28:48   well I remember just feeling like [TS]

00:28:50   everybody here I've said this before [TS]

00:28:52   also but I really feel like everybody [TS]

00:28:53   here got a manual that I didn't get have [TS]

00:28:55   no idea how to conduct myself with these [TS]

00:28:57   other kids i have no idea how to how to [TS]

00:28:59   scrap for status even in kindergarten [TS]

00:29:02   and now I mean it's weird because I mean [TS]

00:29:04   that the truth is that those three years [TS]

00:29:06   of school really good thing for my kids [TS]

00:29:07   she showed up in kindergarten and she [TS]

00:29:09   kind of already knew like how a day goes [TS]

00:29:10   it seems like it seems I mean like [TS]

00:29:13   criticizing but like that's I mean I [TS]

00:29:16   don't know I feel like I could use that [TS]

00:29:17   I really could have used a remedial [TS]

00:29:18   course on how to be a little kid and [TS]

00:29:21   that would have that would help for the [TS]

00:29:22   beginning my god it [TS]

00:29:25   yeah I a remedial course in how to be a [TS]

00:29:27   little kid I think I still would have [TS]

00:29:29   benefited from it [TS]

00:29:31   my second year in college oh well you [TS]

00:29:34   know the thing is you're kind of by the [TS]

00:29:36   time on I'm this broad numbers here but [TS]

00:29:38   i think by the time if you've got a [TS]

00:29:40   relatively stable home life and like a [TS]

00:29:43   relatively you know stable normal public [TS]

00:29:45   school i think by 3rd or 4th grade most [TS]

00:29:49   kids know how stuff should work like you [TS]

00:29:52   pick up an awful lot when you're a [TS]

00:29:53   little kid and if you choose to do [TS]

00:29:56   something different from what's expected [TS]

00:29:57   of you you do so with full knowledge of [TS]

00:29:59   what the consequences or you know ups or [TS]

00:30:02   downs of that are but I think there's a [TS]

00:30:04   latent period where you get you just get [TS]

00:30:06   so goofy for a while and then maybe you [TS]

00:30:08   come back and maybe like oh you know [TS]

00:30:10   sophomore year of high school I kind of [TS]

00:30:12   got it together or whatever like every [TS]

00:30:13   kid is different but you're totally [TS]

00:30:14   right [TS]

00:30:15   second-year college is a bloodbath I [TS]

00:30:18   feel like I feel like my sophomore year [TS]

00:30:20   in high school was the first one where I [TS]

00:30:22   started to kind of get it together but i [TS]

00:30:23   remember in grade school through to two [TS]

00:30:28   kids one when I was in grade school in [TS]

00:30:30   Seattle like fourth grade and he was he [TS]

00:30:35   was small but the girls loved him and he [TS]

00:30:41   was you know quiet and smooth and cool [TS]

00:30:43   right he he was like the kid in Bad News [TS]

00:30:49   Bears that drop the motorcycle who he [TS]

00:30:52   wasn't he wasn't bad it wasn't good [TS]

00:30:55   he was cool man in fourth grade I can't [TS]

00:31:01   and I was big even then and loud even [TS]

00:31:05   then and I i remember going over to his [TS]

00:31:10   house a couple of times he was nice to [TS]

00:31:13   me but there was there was cool in him [TS]

00:31:17   that was never gonna rub off on me and [TS]

00:31:22   he was comfortable in it he was [TS]

00:31:24   comfortable with 4th grade girls but he [TS]

00:31:28   wasn't you know he wasn't playing with [TS]

00:31:32   them he wasn't playing house with them [TS]

00:31:35   he was already cool enough that they had [TS]

00:31:40   crushes on him a whole different a whole [TS]

00:31:44   different concept like it better like [TS]

00:31:47   he's got a certain kind of like a [TS]

00:31:49   surprising amount of agency [TS]

00:31:50   yep yep he was you know he liked talk to [TS]

00:31:55   his parents i don't i'm not sure if he [TS]

00:31:56   called his parents by their first names [TS]

00:31:58   but it felt like that in his home and [TS]

00:32:01   there was just like he was just [TS]

00:32:03   self-possessed in a way that I wouldn't [TS]

00:32:05   be four decades and then when i moved to [TS]

00:32:08   Alaska there was a another little boy he [TS]

00:32:11   was very small compared to me and you [TS]

00:32:15   know like his name was Brian nominee and [TS]

00:32:19   a lorry basler loved Brian nominee and I [TS]

00:32:25   love Lori basler and there was this to [TS]

00:32:29   the this is terrible [TS]

00:32:31   it caused me to not like Brian nominee [TS]

00:32:35   even though brian amy was perfectly good [TS]

00:32:38   to me and made no he made no overture to [TS]

00:32:43   Lori basler he just was himself cool and [TS]

00:32:48   small and blond and had long straight [TS]

00:32:51   hair parted in the middle that he comes [TS]

00:32:53   with a goodie comb and he was good at [TS]

00:32:55   roller skating but he was just he didn't [TS]

00:32:59   he wasn't pushy [TS]

00:33:01   he was just cool and I couldn't [TS]

00:33:04   understand i mean i could very much [TS]

00:33:06   understand what Larry Bosler saw him I [TS]

00:33:09   couldn't understand how to make myself [TS]

00:33:12   b.p different and just just and you know [TS]

00:33:18   and and the girl who liked me was Chris [TS]

00:33:22   Fayette and crisp yet had headgear and [TS]

00:33:26   big freckles and what I think about it [TS]

00:33:32   now I should have just loved crispy add [TS]

00:33:34   that would have made everything so much [TS]

00:33:36   better for me in my life but I couldn't [TS]

00:33:40   love crispy and I had the lovely basler [TS]

00:33:42   very badly as a very credible name this [TS]

00:33:47   episode of rock on the line is brought [TS]

00:33:48   to you by Squarespace you can start [TS]

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00:34:35   recommend John and I have u square space [TS]

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00:34:58   purchase our thanks to squarespace for [TS]

00:35:00   making the web so beautiful and for [TS]

00:35:02   supporting rider on the line [TS]

00:35:04   Squarespace build it beautiful Lori [TS]

00:35:06   burns like me in cary colomer is not a [TS]

00:35:08   criminal named Carrie colomer yeah she [TS]

00:35:11   had a twin sister sharing sharing [TS]

00:35:12   kerikeri and sherry colomer dar I oh my [TS]

00:35:17   god you don't even know how many times i [TS]

00:35:19   wrote the name Carrie colomer over and [TS]

00:35:21   over i can i can only imagine i feel [TS]

00:35:24   like that [TS]

00:35:24   close like this close but i just i don't [TS]

00:35:26   i wasn't i wasn't in her League and you [TS]

00:35:29   know and the thing is what we're [TS]

00:35:30   describing partly as you you have this [TS]

00:35:32   get this certain stink on you maybe not [TS]

00:35:35   in the literal sense but there's a [TS]

00:35:36   certain kind of like we talked about [TS]

00:35:37   cool like we know who's a Paragon cool [TS]

00:35:39   maybe Miles Davis like what is cool cool [TS]

00:35:42   is like you say agency being [TS]

00:35:44   self-possessed and it is not it's not [TS]

00:35:47   that the thing is acting like a hipster [TS]

00:35:49   doofus is really negative about [TS]

00:35:51   everything is is a kind of a reflection [TS]

00:35:53   or shadow of cool but the real cool is [TS]

00:35:56   someone who's their own person that's to [TS]

00:35:58   me that's what cool is I mean to captain [TS]

00:36:00   beefheart is cool in in his way [TS]

00:36:02   there's a lot of people were really cool [TS]

00:36:03   like but I mean like the things in that [TS]

00:36:04   sense you and I are very cool but that's [TS]

00:36:08   right the mascara snake it's just it's [TS]

00:36:11   just that kind of cool in fifth grade [TS]

00:36:14   anyway I still refuse to put on [TS]

00:36:17   headphones when i record i just listened [TS]

00:36:19   to vibrations but you know buddy and [TS]

00:36:21   here's the thing i'm trying to get at is [TS]

00:36:23   that like I do in my parlance like I [TS]

00:36:25   spent so many years trying to solve the [TS]

00:36:27   wrong problem but the problem that i [TS]

00:36:29   wanted to solve was why can't i make [TS]

00:36:31   girls like me or like you know it starts [TS]

00:36:34   out as simple as like why don't why [TS]

00:36:36   aren't all girls into me like I you know [TS]

00:36:38   I i have lots of trading cards and I'm [TS]

00:36:41   really cool but then that becomes this [TS]

00:36:43   more like functional like how do i get [TS]

00:36:45   girls to like me which is like a hold of [TS]

00:36:48   in so many ways that horrible it's an [TS]

00:36:50   understandable question but it's not the [TS]

00:36:51   right question like the the right [TS]

00:36:53   question which would never occur to me [TS]

00:36:55   for many years was like how do I become [TS]

00:36:57   a more interesting version of myself [TS]

00:36:58   like how I actually increase my nice [TS]

00:37:01   element selection community [TS]

00:37:03   how do i increase increase my value i [TS]

00:37:05   guess like but you don't say like what [TS]

00:37:06   you really look at and make people you [TS]

00:37:08   got you've got you've got them even if [TS]

00:37:10   you're even if you're working with a six [TS]

00:37:11   you don't have a wingman you gonna get [TS]

00:37:13   in there and neg you're learning your [TS]

00:37:15   learning John megam you know I think in [TS]

00:37:18   my case the thing that I needed to learn [TS]

00:37:20   and the thing that I still have that I [TS]

00:37:22   that my whole life I needed to learn was [TS]

00:37:24   just Shh [TS]

00:37:25   leave it leave it and I just needed to [TS]

00:37:33   learn that when I was four when i was 14 [TS]

00:37:35   when I was 40 benefit but maybe in that [TS]

00:37:42   relationship and yeah okay cupcake with [TS]

00:37:44   a designer but what is the others [TS]

00:37:46   institutions change if I could have just [TS]

00:37:50   ever ever ever managed just shoot [TS]

00:37:55   everything would have been fine i just [TS]

00:37:58   couldn't believe i didn't have any [TS]

00:38:01   shushing Anna I'm very wise wise a [TS]

00:38:04   partner at one point and she said [TS]

00:38:07   something about about makeup and she [TS]

00:38:10   said here's the thing take out take out [TS]

00:38:12   all the makeup you want to use put it on [TS]

00:38:14   the counter and then put half of it away [TS]

00:38:16   and that's how much makeup you should [TS]

00:38:17   use right and that goes for so many [TS]

00:38:20   things in the physical world that goes [TS]

00:38:21   for hair gel that goes for alcohol [TS]

00:38:23   because for so many things take out all [TS]

00:38:25   you think you want then put away half [TS]

00:38:27   and just use that half and stick with it [TS]

00:38:28   and like it that is so true [TS]

00:38:32   like in life you know like because part [TS]

00:38:35   of it is like when you go when you have [TS]

00:38:36   a good party lucky if you get the brown [TS]

00:38:38   tuxedo or you can have the milk bottle [TS]

00:38:40   full of whiskey or you can steal the [TS]

00:38:42   shoes but but you don't want to be a [TS]

00:38:45   carny right right so it is like you're [TS]

00:38:48   right though it's a simmer down you know [TS]

00:38:50   just slow your roll little bit and like [TS]

00:38:52   you don't like I'm talking to me now [TS]

00:38:54   like you don't have to tell them [TS]

00:38:56   everything you know about the making of [TS]

00:38:58   Tommy let's keep some of that for later [TS]

00:39:01   you don't have to talk about everything [TS]

00:39:03   you know about tom seaver like let it [TS]

00:39:06   you know this let's sit on that you have [TS]

00:39:07   more to talk about next time [TS]

00:39:08   yeah yeah for me I think it was well [TS]

00:39:11   obviously I do not I do not look like an [TS]

00:39:15   abercrombie & fitch model and so I'd [TS]

00:39:18   better wear this brown tuxedo because [TS]

00:39:21   that is very very good armor it's a [TS]

00:39:26   super armor against anybody ever wanting [TS]

00:39:30   me to take off my clothes and jump in [TS]

00:39:32   the water and i also hate being in a [TS]

00:39:37   brown tuxedo and a swimming party [TS]

00:39:38   so I had better be drinking whiskey in [TS]

00:39:42   copious amounts but I'm not just gonna [TS]

00:39:44   stand around drinking whiskey [TS]

00:39:46   I'm gonna drink whiskey out of a milk [TS]

00:39:48   bottle because fuck the world and then [TS]

00:39:53   I'm gonna steal everybody she was [TS]

00:39:54   because i'm really in pain and put a lot [TS]

00:39:58   of game and I and all i could think of [TS]

00:40:01   to do is steal their shoes because I [TS]

00:40:03   can't you know I can't fight them all [TS]

00:40:04   there's a distinction that last people [TS]

00:40:08   making different ways and I know I [TS]

00:40:10   really differ from a lot of my my good [TS]

00:40:13   smart friends in this one way but I've [TS]

00:40:15   always I've come to feel that one [TS]

00:40:17   distinction between being a geek and [TS]

00:40:19   being a nerd [TS]

00:40:20   it may have to do a topic but i think it [TS]

00:40:22   has to do with degree and self-awareness [TS]

00:40:24   in some ways like an eighth another [TS]

00:40:26   that's an important distinction but in [TS]

00:40:28   my head it's one thing to be a geek [TS]

00:40:30   about something like your kind of a geek [TS]

00:40:31   about LBJ right you can be a geek about [TS]

00:40:34   Tom Seaver like you're somebody who has [TS]

00:40:36   maybe like even like a surpassingly high [TS]

00:40:39   level of interest expertise and [TS]

00:40:42   knowledge especially interest about that [TS]

00:40:44   thing but you know you really want to [TS]

00:40:46   talk about it but that by itself doesn't [TS]

00:40:49   make you a nerd i think what makes you a [TS]

00:40:50   nerd in you know the negative [TS]

00:40:52   connotation is that having an [TS]

00:40:55   insensitivity to how much other people [TS]

00:40:57   care about your geeky topic and like [TS]

00:41:00   that that's the part where you go from [TS]

00:41:01   being you know you come up with any kind [TS]

00:41:03   of disparaging name you want but it's [TS]

00:41:04   one thing to be really into stamp [TS]

00:41:06   collecting and nobody ever finds out and [TS]

00:41:08   it's another thing to like buttonhole [TS]

00:41:11   somebody at a party and tell them about [TS]

00:41:12   you know every kind of stamp that you've [TS]

00:41:14   ever seen and what it's called and [TS]

00:41:16   correct them when they get something [TS]

00:41:17   wrong and all that kind of stuff and its [TS]

00:41:19   really i think it can be very difficult [TS]

00:41:20   don't you see being yourself in that but [TS]

00:41:23   that's definitely true for me and and as [TS]

00:41:27   a fellow digger in John Roderick I you [TS]

00:41:29   might appreciate I think part of it is [TS]

00:41:30   like when you get pushback from somebody [TS]

00:41:32   your inclination is not to go that's a [TS]

00:41:34   good note i should i should i should [TS]

00:41:36   leave it it's more like you dig in even [TS]

00:41:38   further like you haven't made your case [TS]

00:41:40   yet [TS]

00:41:40   like that's what i do is so no okay well [TS]

00:41:43   I'm sorry probably explain this well let [TS]

00:41:44   me really explain the Tom Seaver [TS]

00:41:46   situation to you and that's when let [TS]

00:41:49   that's when you become that's when you [TS]

00:41:50   become a nuisance [TS]

00:41:51   because you're insensitive to what else [TS]

00:41:55   is happening in the room and now you're [TS]

00:41:56   no longer self-possessed now you're just [TS]

00:41:58   a weirdo [TS]

00:42:00   you know years later or maybe it was [TS]

00:42:06   years earlier i don't remember i'm i'm [TS]

00:42:09   i'm getting confused now but no it was [TS]

00:42:15   about the same time [TS]

00:42:17   wait a minute what we talked about here [TS]

00:42:19   we're talking like ladies ladies [TS]

00:42:21   ok I was downtown in Anchorage on a [TS]

00:42:26   beautiful summer day and when [TS]

00:42:28   Anchorage's in full flower in the spring [TS]

00:42:30   and summer there's really no more [TS]

00:42:32   beautiful place because they're hanging [TS]

00:42:34   baskets of flowers everywhere it's part [TS]

00:42:37   of Anchorage's it's part of Anchorage's [TS]

00:42:41   identity that when spring comes everyone [TS]

00:42:44   hangs baskets of flowers everywhere and [TS]

00:42:47   so you have just this proliferation of [TS]

00:42:49   flowers and because the Sun is up all [TS]

00:42:51   day like flowers just go crazy and so I [TS]

00:42:54   was downtown was walking on Fourth [TS]

00:42:57   Avenue right by the fourth avenue [TS]

00:42:59   theatre right by you know right in the [TS]

00:43:01   center of town and I bumped into some [TS]

00:43:03   friends and i'm standing and talking to [TS]

00:43:05   them and a little group of people [TS]

00:43:06   gathered there and we're all out of high [TS]

00:43:08   school now we're in college and we feel [TS]

00:43:11   like the young people who are the next [TS]

00:43:14   generation of young folks and this girl [TS]

00:43:21   that went to a different school but whom [TS]

00:43:25   I'd met at debate competitions she went [TS]

00:43:32   to diamond high school her name was [TS]

00:43:34   Debbie and she was the star of the [TS]

00:43:37   Diamonds debate team [TS]

00:43:40   and she comes along and and we were all [TS]

00:43:44   standing there and and chatting with one [TS]

00:43:47   another ended and she was with a friend [TS]

00:43:49   of a friend and so that's it you know [TS]

00:43:52   where a group of people in our I mean [TS]

00:43:55   we're probably 20 and debbie smith and i [TS]

00:43:59   started talking and we break off from [TS]

00:44:02   the rest of the group and debbie smith [TS]

00:44:05   is half she'sshe was she is a half [TS]

00:44:08   Japanese and very very very very smart [TS]

00:44:14   person that I will had always been [TS]

00:44:16   impressed with her at debate meets she [TS]

00:44:20   was like very together and i was very [TS]

00:44:23   unimpressive at debate meets because I [TS]

00:44:26   debated kind of like I talk to you now [TS]

00:44:29   which is to say with no preparation but [TS]

00:44:33   I understood Robert's Rules of Order but [TS]

00:44:36   beyond that i believe that i could [TS]

00:44:37   debate any topic just on the you know [TS]

00:44:39   like flip a coin and go style and Debbie [TS]

00:44:44   was very prepared and she and I like [TS]

00:44:48   wandered off from this group and pretty [TS]

00:44:51   soon we had arranged to go on a date and [TS]

00:44:57   we went on a date to see the movie born [TS]

00:45:01   on the fourth of July so whenever that [TS]

00:45:03   movie came out that is when this is [TS]

00:45:04   happening after feels like making [TS]

00:45:07   mediator some somewhere around [TS]

00:45:09   yeah and then she and then we had a good [TS]

00:45:11   time on the date and we went on a second [TS]

00:45:13   date in the entire time I'm thinking [TS]

00:45:14   what is going on here [TS]

00:45:16   debbie smith is one of the very very [TS]

00:45:20   popular together people and then I [TS]

00:45:24   realized that she went to diamonds so [TS]

00:45:27   she didn't know anything about me and [TS]

00:45:28   somehow to her i seemed like one of the [TS]

00:45:34   one of the good people i seemed like one [TS]

00:45:37   of the abercrombie & fitch people maybe [TS]

00:45:40   or it was very confusing but i really [TS]

00:45:44   enjoyed her i was just overthinking it [TS]

00:45:47   you know that this is one of those [TS]

00:45:49   moments where somebody should have just [TS]

00:45:50   said she [TS]

00:45:51   just like just be just be with debbie [TS]

00:45:53   smith because as much as you're aware [TS]

00:45:55   that it's a fresh start your also still [TS]

00:45:57   kind of mentally recalibrating like [TS]

00:45:59   don't screw this up like you screw this [TS]

00:46:01   don't screw this up [TS]

00:46:02   do not screw that you're gonna screw [TS]

00:46:03   this up and then she and I like liked [TS]

00:46:07   each other and we made out and we made [TS]

00:46:11   out again and then it was wonderful and [TS]

00:46:15   there was this and this was happening in [TS]

00:46:16   the summer so what could be better [TS]

00:46:18   and then she invited me to a party at [TS]

00:46:20   her house and I was like I can't wait [TS]

00:46:23   you know of course I'll come to the [TS]

00:46:25   party and I came to the party and I [TS]

00:46:28   believe that I probably wore a bow tie [TS]

00:46:30   because it was a party and I was a [TS]

00:46:35   person i was a person who understood [TS]

00:46:36   that if you're invited to a party where [TS]

00:46:38   about I at this time and I showed up and [TS]

00:46:42   all of the fashionable people were there [TS]

00:46:45   and when I arrived it was clear that [TS]

00:46:49   none of them realized that I knew Debbie [TS]

00:46:52   Smith there was no reason I would have [TS]

00:46:55   known her and they and so honestly I got [TS]

00:46:59   out of my car and I bumped into a guy [TS]

00:47:01   I'd known for years and he had a look on [TS]

00:47:03   his face and then said just get bully [TS]

00:47:08   blurted out like what are you doing here [TS]

00:47:12   like how did you get in here and I was [TS]

00:47:17   like uh and and I'm thinking to myself [TS]

00:47:20   I'm Debbie's I'm Debbie's boyfriend or [TS]

00:47:24   like close to it and so I had this [TS]

00:47:29   strange this strange feeling of like I [TS]

00:47:32   belong here more than all of these other [TS]

00:47:34   people but I but at the same time I [TS]

00:47:36   don't and she was really glad to see me [TS]

00:47:38   and came over and I'm standing there and [TS]

00:47:42   everyone is staring at me like why is he [TS]

00:47:43   here why is she being affectionate to [TS]

00:47:45   him all of this is wrong and so I [TS]

00:47:49   started drinking now now because it was [TS]

00:47:54   all I could it was all I understood to [TS]

00:47:56   do even though she was being cool with [TS]

00:47:58   you you're really uncomfy [TS]

00:47:59   she was great i was really uncomfortable [TS]

00:48:02   standing there because I knew all of her [TS]

00:48:05   friends and I knew them to be people who [TS]

00:48:07   understood that i did not belong there [TS]

00:48:10   and they were like trying to communicate [TS]

00:48:14   to her like what does he do what he why [TS]

00:48:16   are you with him stop and I mean I'm [TS]

00:48:18   seeing all this I'm not imagining it and [TS]

00:48:20   she's like what are you talking about [TS]

00:48:21   he's great like we you know we went to [TS]

00:48:23   the you know he knows all about LBJ and [TS]

00:48:27   I I knew that she was good and that that [TS]

00:48:33   the connection that we had could have [TS]

00:48:34   survived this because we she was growing [TS]

00:48:36   out of that crowd anyway she was headed [TS]

00:48:39   on off on her own path we were all [TS]

00:48:41   headed on our own path this was all old [TS]

00:48:44   stuff that we were capable of shedding [TS]

00:48:48   but I started to get drunk because I was [TS]

00:48:51   terrified and was already at a point [TS]

00:48:54   when you're we see said from the [TS]

00:48:56   beginning you're cognizant that there [TS]

00:48:57   wasn't never going to be a one beer [TS]

00:48:59   night for you [TS]

00:49:00   oh no and in a situation like this where [TS]

00:49:02   it was just like uh you know i'm going [TS]

00:49:04   to show everybody and I got drunk and at [TS]

00:49:09   a certain point you know drunk I was [TS]

00:49:11   like I confronted Debbie and said did [TS]

00:49:15   you just invite me here to to to [TS]

00:49:20   embarrass me she was like what are you [TS]

00:49:22   talking about she had no idea my history [TS]

00:49:26   with all these people and because she [TS]

00:49:28   sort of moved in that circle [TS]

00:49:30   effortlessly she didn't understand she [TS]

00:49:34   didn't see them as as exclusive she [TS]

00:49:40   didn't see them as people who would shun [TS]

00:49:42   somebody for being fat or for being a [TS]

00:49:49   nerd or for stealing their shoes you're [TS]

00:49:50   wearing about time for wearing about [TS]

00:49:52   time like she thought that the boat I [TS]

00:49:54   was charming she didn't understand that [TS]

00:49:57   they saw it as a further example of how [TS]

00:50:00   i did not understand how to fit in and [TS]

00:50:02   was never going to and and that the [TS]

00:50:06   whole thing just the whole thing just [TS]

00:50:08   turned into his disaster [TS]

00:50:10   and you know and Debbie wanted she [TS]

00:50:12   wanted us to go to get it get away from [TS]

00:50:14   those people let's go upstairs and let's [TS]

00:50:15   just and I was and I had I had so much [TS]

00:50:19   baggage that I was the you know I was [TS]

00:50:23   the one that that turned it into a a [TS]

00:50:26   turned it into a scene between us about [TS]

00:50:31   how I was never gonna you know I was [TS]

00:50:35   never gonna be somebody that she would [TS]

00:50:38   like and she was like I'm not asking you [TS]

00:50:40   to be anything and it was it was just [TS]

00:50:42   terrible [TS]

00:50:44   all this because i saw that stupid [TS]

00:50:45   bicycle under an overpass today I I'm [TS]

00:50:49   now I'm reliving 1988 at the last year I [TS]

00:50:52   possible after I would ever want to [TS]

00:50:54   relive I just so much stupid shit nation [TS]

00:50:56   8800 if I could [TS]

00:50:59   let's see if i get erased three years if [TS]

00:51:02   they did they'd be continued [TS]

00:51:04   no I think you can raise three years out [TS]

00:51:06   of your life ok any three years ago man [TS]

00:51:09   that's going on um what's yeah well I'm [TS]

00:51:12   not always a word this I mean a lot of [TS]

00:51:15   terrible decisions in 1988 I've I tried [TS]

00:51:19   to level up as a grownup in a lot of [TS]

00:51:21   ways that year and failed colossally in [TS]

00:51:23   ways that i didn't actually learn much [TS]

00:51:25   from people who want to learn from your [TS]

00:51:26   mistakes i think that's a lot of [TS]

00:51:27   geography I was just down just really [TS]

00:51:30   don't [TS]

00:51:30   okay you pick one up another one uh [TS]

00:51:33   let's see 87 write a seven any paid [TS]

00:51:40   either then so I can't think of a better [TS]

00:51:44   year to erase the 1988 if I could have a [TS]

00:51:47   do-over [TS]

00:51:48   uh-huh 1988 would be a really yeah [TS]

00:51:52   really good year to do over and you know [TS]

00:51:57   for for my second choice [TS]

00:52:01   I kind of feel like you know maybe 2008 [TS]

00:52:07   oh is that by ear for you [TS]

00:52:10   yeah it was just like a year that I i [TS]

00:52:14   feel like i could have done I could have [TS]

00:52:17   done so much more in 2008 yeah I'm gonna [TS]

00:52:22   take I was gonna say 79 [TS]

00:52:23   and I think I'm gonna go with 1980 and [TS]

00:52:26   maybe 2009 where I don't erase it but i [TS]

00:52:29   wish i could get into over on this [TS]

00:52:31   yeah maybe 2,000 maybe what I'm thinking [TS]

00:52:33   2008 it's actually 2009 is what I'm [TS]

00:52:35   talking about [TS]

00:52:36   but you know I feel like it i feel like [TS]

00:52:38   we should I feel like we should agree on [TS]

00:52:40   three years later strength in numbers so [TS]

00:52:43   88 2009 and then we have to pick one [TS]

00:52:47   more year [TS]

00:52:48   why 1980 1982 was more uh I was more [TS]

00:52:52   victim of circumstance in 1980 but [TS]

00:52:55   that's the 79 is when my mom remarried [TS]

00:52:57   nothing gets me my mom is making the [TS]

00:52:59   best decision she could she marry marry [TS]

00:53:01   this guy who turned out to be awful and [TS]

00:53:03   we moved to Florida from Ohio so you [TS]

00:53:05   know I went to military school a lot of [TS]

00:53:08   pop music was cocaine e a lot of very [TS]

00:53:11   memorable get your home notes and stuff [TS]

00:53:13   but 1984 me was was a very tough I mean [TS]

00:53:17   it was it was the year without a clutch [TS]

00:53:20   I mean it just felt like all the gears [TS]

00:53:22   are grinding so hard work if every if [TS]

00:53:24   everything in my life had been perfect [TS]

00:53:26   you know I and like I was if everything [TS]

00:53:30   had supported the kind of person i [TS]

00:53:31   needed to be it still would've been a [TS]

00:53:33   hard year because i was 13 but given [TS]

00:53:35   what I was up against it's the year I [TS]

00:53:37   kind of gave up on life in a lot of ways [TS]

00:53:39   in a way that would dog me definitely [TS]

00:53:41   through high school that I really feel [TS]

00:53:43   like I didn't I never completely came [TS]

00:53:45   out of it but I didn't really come out [TS]

00:53:47   of it really until like I went to [TS]

00:53:48   college was kind of forced to like [TS]

00:53:50   reboot and I did have that fresh [TS]

00:53:52   opportunity to to be like you know it [TS]

00:53:55   helps to get help so I went to a school [TS]

00:53:56   was okay to be a weirdo [TS]

00:53:58   we're actually I was not a weirdo I was [TS]

00:54:00   a pretty you straight normal kid but [TS]

00:54:03   that was anyway that's my 1980 [TS]

00:54:06   I you know I know if we said if you said [TS]

00:54:08   the 80 81 school year nineteen eighty [TS]

00:54:12   starting in September and i have no [TS]

00:54:14   affection or attachment to that at all [TS]

00:54:16   well I i could join 481 let's do 81 [TS]

00:54:19   let's do September in September 8081 [TS]

00:54:23   over and I'm done with you a hundred [TS]

00:54:25   percent that was seventh grade [TS]

00:54:28   yeah and seventh grade was no oh good [TS]

00:54:31   now I i I'm pleased to see some [TS]

00:54:35   interesting uptake in our [TS]

00:54:37   I thought technology around a [TS]

00:54:38   junior-high concierge services [TS]

00:54:40   uh-huh uh-huh well there's an [TS]

00:54:42   opportunity there [TS]

00:54:44   I you know and all this it feels like [TS]

00:54:46   when I when I talk about a do-over mi [TS]

00:54:50   I'm very curious to know like whether [TS]

00:54:52   that do over would be if if we're going [TS]

00:54:55   to allow if we're going to appeal to the [TS]

00:54:57   to the parole board and say do-over on [TS]

00:55:00   81 school year [TS]

00:55:02   are they going to say ok all its just [TS]

00:55:05   alternate universe John and Merlin your [TS]

00:55:08   view there it's still it's still your [TS]

00:55:10   your dumb seventh-grade brain Ryan just [TS]

00:55:13   you just get it you know we're just [TS]

00:55:14   going to set you in motion like 30 [TS]

00:55:16   seconds later so it's a completely [TS]

00:55:19   different version reason but yeah give [TS]

00:55:22   me a crack about this on Twitter the [TS]

00:55:23   other day about wishing you could go [TS]

00:55:25   back and like you know with all the [TS]

00:55:27   stuff you know now after yeah right i [TS]

00:55:29   mean that's the thing like if I could go [TS]

00:55:31   back and be my own concierge and you [TS]

00:55:35   know and every week have a sit-down with [TS]

00:55:37   myself and say listen here and I think [TS]

00:55:39   we're gonna I don't think we can allow [TS]

00:55:40   that I think it's a reset of the [TS]

00:55:41   timeline i think maybe result of the [TS]

00:55:44   time later can you actually go back [TS]

00:55:45   inhabit your earlier self i don't think [TS]

00:55:47   so i well I think well here's the thing [TS]

00:55:49   i think you have to go back with the [TS]

00:55:51   same knowledge and stuff that you had at [TS]

00:55:52   the time I think maybe you get to [TS]

00:55:55   inhabit like an african-american janitor [TS]

00:55:58   who gets to give you wisdom sometimes [TS]

00:56:00   well [TS]

00:56:01   oh you're saying that you're saying that [TS]

00:56:02   that there's a morgan freeman character [TS]

00:56:05   yes but only putting this message on [TS]

00:56:06   what if what if in the timeline that [TS]

00:56:09   actually that we know of that already [TS]

00:56:11   existed [TS]

00:56:11   what if you already had gone back there [TS]

00:56:13   and you just didn't listen to morgan [TS]

00:56:14   freeman because you thought you had it [TS]

00:56:16   all wired [TS]

00:56:17   well here's the problem i have known you [TS]

00:56:18   would you know if your morgan freeman i [TS]

00:56:19   know for a fact that no Morgan Freeman [TS]

00:56:22   ever deigned to give me advice I was [TS]

00:56:26   starved for adult advice and and every [TS]

00:56:29   single like that God maybe maybe should [TS]

00:56:32   leave the boat home every single God [TS]

00:56:34   character in my story was busy talking [TS]

00:56:37   to another kid because I I'm you know [TS]

00:56:41   I'm walking by in a brown tuxedo and [TS]

00:56:43   they are you know and they're telling [TS]

00:56:44   somebody to improve their golf swing in [TS]

00:56:47   a completely different episode [TS]

00:56:50   no one ever stop me you know the ND and [TS]

00:56:53   the teachers that I had that we're good [TS]

00:56:55   they didn't understand I mean a lot of [TS]

00:56:58   them were younger teachers who who felt [TS]

00:57:04   like the way they needed to approach me [TS]

00:57:07   and and deal with me was to how do I put [TS]

00:57:13   this [TS]

00:57:14   like I was so precocious that that that [TS]

00:57:18   the adult response was often like you [TS]

00:57:21   think you're pretty cool don't you [TS]

00:57:22   oh you like you're like they're like a [TS]

00:57:24   little dog and you're like a rat you [TS]

00:57:26   like threatening to them [TS]

00:57:27   yeah yeah and-and-and their best you [TS]

00:57:30   know they had the best intentions which [TS]

00:57:32   was to say things aren't what you think [TS]

00:57:34   they are I think you know the world [TS]

00:57:37   isn't like you think it is but the way [TS]

00:57:39   that they approached me was always that [TS]

00:57:41   always in that tone of like hey mr. cool [TS]

00:57:46   why don't you sit down and listen once [TS]

00:57:48   in awhile and stop being you know like [TS]

00:57:50   it was very they were trying to be teams [TS]

00:57:55   you know they were trying to communicate [TS]

00:57:58   with me i remember i remember at this is [TS]

00:58:01   gonna sound terrible but I had a high [TS]

00:58:04   school teacher who pulled me aside I may [TS]

00:58:08   have told you about this high school [TS]

00:58:09   teacher who pulled me aside and said i [TS]

00:58:12   was in the teachers lounge the other day [TS]

00:58:13   we were talking about you and I was like [TS]

00:58:16   really what would say what and he said [TS]

00:58:21   well you know I was talking to the shop [TS]

00:58:24   teacher about you and we both agreed [TS]

00:58:25   that you that you probably get a lot of [TS]

00:58:28   tail [TS]

00:58:29   am i right whoa whoa and I was a virgin [TS]

00:58:34   and yet my response was hook [TS]

00:58:42   well I mean you know i'm not one to talk [TS]

00:58:46   out of school and he said that's what I [TS]

00:58:50   thought that's what I thought [TS]

00:58:52   am i right am i right that's so weird [TS]

00:58:53   and I was like to totally I mean you [TS]

00:58:57   know [TS]

00:58:57   yes and also haha and also who and he [TS]

00:59:02   was trying to make [TS]

00:59:04   a connection with me but he had read my [TS]

00:59:09   blog stir and this at this was true of i [TS]

00:59:13   think a lot of people at my school had [TS]

00:59:14   read my blaster and my confidence in the [TS]

00:59:16   fact that that uh you know that i did [TS]

00:59:19   have a lot of friends that you know that [TS]

00:59:23   I was a kid that teachers were talking [TS]

00:59:25   about in the teachers lounge [TS]

00:59:27   he had read all that incorrectly which [TS]

00:59:29   is to say he read it as I was projecting [TS]

00:59:32   it rather than seeing through it and so [TS]

00:59:35   he will you know he wanted to be my pal [TS]

00:59:40   and yet in that moment like i couldn't [TS]

00:59:46   have felt more estranged from him [TS]

00:59:49   because now I'm are now I am conscious [TS]

00:59:52   of I I'm conscious of adults seeing me [TS]

00:59:57   as a as a player [TS]

00:59:57   as a as a player [TS]

01:00:00   mhm and I was desperate at that time for [TS]

01:00:03   somebody to put their arm around my [TS]

01:00:04   shoulder and say your virgin right cool [TS]

01:00:08   so she just Shh like just cool it just [TS]

01:00:13   it's fine it's good to be a version [TS]

01:00:17   still and you can do that and just be [TS]

01:00:20   fine and not and it's not that I walked [TS]

01:00:22   around school haha claiming that i [TS]

01:00:25   wasn't right it was joint that I had you [TS]

01:00:28   know I was my dad introduced me to this [TS]

01:00:31   concept when I was really young big man [TS]

01:00:33   on campus and my dad was like are you [TS]

01:00:34   big man on campus bmoc moc and I was [TS]

01:00:38   like I don't know what does that even [TS]

01:00:39   mean and he was like big man on campus [TS]

01:00:40   you know big man you're the big guy [TS]

01:00:42   you're the guy on campus the big guy the [TS]

01:00:44   one but there you know BMOC and i was [TS]

01:00:47   like i guess i'll be i guess is that the [TS]

01:00:51   expectation I can you know like the [TS]

01:00:53   expectation was that ipf I guess that I [TS]

01:00:57   be the BMOC and so I was but anyway so [TS]

01:01:01   that relationship and I had that kind of [TS]

01:01:04   relationship with several teachers who [TS]

01:01:06   were like who recognized that I was [TS]

01:01:08   flailing but what they saw was what I [TS]

01:01:14   was projecting and not what I was and no [TS]

01:01:17   there was never that there was never [TS]

01:01:19   that character that that came into the [TS]

01:01:24   script that was like hey i see what you [TS]

01:01:26   really are and it and and it's fine [TS]

01:01:29   because you know that that was one of [TS]

01:01:32   the ways of which one of the primary [TS]

01:01:35   reasons I didn't trust adults they [TS]

01:01:38   didn't seem to be any smarter than kids [TS]

01:01:41   I you're making me feel like I'm [TS]

01:01:44   realizing something here something [TS]

01:01:46   something i'm really really really [TS]

01:01:47   starting to get with my kid that I [TS]

01:01:49   suspect goes to what you're talking [TS]

01:01:51   about i think it was stuff I've thought [TS]

01:01:53   about in the past kids of all kinds you [TS]

01:01:57   know young younger than adult age people [TS]

01:01:59   if there's one thing most all of them [TS]

01:02:01   have in common [TS]

01:02:02   from a very very fairly early age it's [TS]

01:02:04   that they're very resistant to a frontal [TS]

01:02:06   attack on you know what i mean so going [TS]

01:02:09   going at somebody had to have the trying [TS]

01:02:11   to confront kit at one extreme end [TS]

01:02:13   confronting a can on why they're mostly [TS]

01:02:15   going to say no i didn't i didn't do [TS]

01:02:16   that right or in this case you know in [TS]

01:02:19   for me like stuff like I actually will [TS]

01:02:21   sometimes like I'm trying to turbo to [TS]

01:02:24   the solution way too early so I'll i was [TS]

01:02:28   drinking try to encourage my child to [TS]

01:02:30   talk about how she feels about things [TS]

01:02:32   that's the last thing in the world that [TS]

01:02:34   she wants to do and in your case what [TS]

01:02:36   you're describing here is like you know [TS]

01:02:38   they they have this like first question [TS]

01:02:41   that they're gonna ask you like whether [TS]

01:02:42   that's what you're getting any pussy but [TS]

01:02:45   so bizarre or whatever but they [TS]

01:02:48   commanded it the it's too on-the-nose [TS]

01:02:50   it's to it really is the the reaction [TS]

01:02:53   gift for this would be some guy walking [TS]

01:02:55   and taking off his jacket with the [TS]

01:02:57   patches on the elbows and turn in the [TS]

01:02:59   seat around backwards so you can have a [TS]

01:03:00   rap session you see that coming a mile [TS]

01:03:02   off when you're a kid and I think your [TS]

01:03:04   defenses really pop up when that happens [TS]

01:03:06   when there is a question that you really [TS]

01:03:08   want to be asked but it's it's not the [TS]

01:03:10   question and that they're asking did you [TS]

01:03:12   know what I mean yeah the the thing that [TS]

01:03:17   I heard the most from the from the two [TS]

01:03:23   teachers that I respected the most was [TS]

01:03:27   and they both said it to me over and [TS]

01:03:32   over and they were friends with each [TS]

01:03:33   other and they were you know guys in [TS]

01:03:37   their thirties who were well read they [TS]

01:03:41   were the English teachers and so forth [TS]

01:03:44   the thing i heard the most from them was [TS]

01:03:45   Roderick you're such an asshole and I [TS]

01:03:52   felt a lot of pride in the fact that [TS]

01:03:58   these two teachers basically would talk [TS]

01:04:03   to me that way like a like sort of [TS]

01:04:04   appear you're such an asshole and they [TS]

01:04:09   meant it to be kind of encouraging in [TS]

01:04:16   the sense [TS]

01:04:16   of like you're you're growing up now [TS]

01:04:19   you're not a brat you're an asshole but [TS]

01:04:24   what it ultimately was was you know it [TS]

01:04:28   confirmed in me all these things that I [TS]

01:04:35   was the most afraid of [TS]

01:04:36   I didn't want to be an asshole I wasn't [TS]

01:04:40   even trying to be an asshole i was [TS]

01:04:41   trying to I was trying to be funny or I [TS]

01:04:44   was trying to be smart or I was trying [TS]

01:04:46   to be you know is trying to be cool and [TS]

01:04:51   asshole was I don't think that's on [TS]

01:04:55   anybody's list of of ambitions and what [TS]

01:05:00   in what I what I what I wish that either [TS]

01:05:03   one of those guys had done was to say [TS]

01:05:07   you know the back to say hey look this [TS]

01:05:12   game we're playing this thing that [TS]

01:05:14   you're in this school this these people [TS]

01:05:19   like this is small beer life is actually [TS]

01:05:25   not anything like this [TS]

01:05:27   right right right there is a place for [TS]

01:05:29   you in the world and if if anybody has [TS]

01:05:34   ever said that like there's no place for [TS]

01:05:38   you here clearly but there is a place [TS]

01:05:40   for you in the world I would have you [TS]

01:05:45   know i would have borne everything with [TS]

01:05:47   so much more calm over and the panic was [TS]

01:05:53   just this feeling of like there's no [TS]

01:05:55   there's no place for me here and I don't [TS]

01:05:59   see any place for me in my parents world [TS]

01:06:02   I don't see any place for me in the [TS]

01:06:04   world of the newspaper except you know [TS]

01:06:12   except such Carlson everyone so i'll [TS]

01:06:15   write a column for a the Anchorage Daily [TS]

01:06:17   News and a and I feel like I can I could [TS]

01:06:22   I could see myself in in his column [TS]

01:06:24   every once in a while it's like there's [TS]

01:06:28   I mean there is light out there [TS]

01:06:29   somewhere [TS]

01:06:30   yeah thats i'm probably put that was [TS]

01:06:33   what i was trying to get that was like [TS]

01:06:35   when you go out somebody and you're [TS]

01:06:37   gonna be helpful right you go in you're [TS]

01:06:38   gonna be helpful you're gonna come in [TS]

01:06:40   and you're gonna like you know same [TS]

01:06:41   thing that needs to be said and shake [TS]

01:06:43   somebody up and like the problem is that [TS]

01:06:45   like what what they don't take fully [TS]

01:06:48   into account is that you are much more [TS]

01:06:50   maybe i'm being dismissive but I i think [TS]

01:06:53   you you kids are so much more vulnerable [TS]

01:06:56   and uh and then they're so vulnerable [TS]

01:06:59   and they know that they're vulnerable [TS]

01:07:01   and the very last thing in there were [TS]

01:07:02   the world that they're gonna do is gonna [TS]

01:07:04   be breakdown whatever shoddy defenses [TS]

01:07:06   they have on that vulnerability [TS]

01:07:08   ok and so you kind of you I mean I and [TS]

01:07:11   now that sounds like an after school [TS]

01:07:12   special but you kind of need to not it's [TS]

01:07:15   like almost like treat the kids like a [TS]

01:07:16   cat [TS]

01:07:17   I just don't go up and flip it over and [TS]

01:07:18   start rubbing his tummy you gotta go [TS]

01:07:20   real slow and you've got to just spend [TS]

01:07:22   some time with that person until that [TS]

01:07:24   you have credibility with them where you [TS]

01:07:26   know maybe you should learn a little bit [TS]

01:07:28   more about who they are as a person [TS]

01:07:29   before you come dive bombing in with a [TS]

01:07:31   solution because that's just going to be [TS]

01:07:32   more off-putting you know and then on [TS]

01:07:35   top of all kinds of an asshole and [TS]

01:07:36   that's what you call somebody that you [TS]

01:07:37   want to reform its what you want to call [TS]

01:07:39   somebody who's a lost cause [TS]

01:07:41   well I'm that exact that you hit the [TS]

01:07:43   nail on that is what they that is what [TS]

01:07:45   they were communicating to me like we [TS]

01:07:47   can't reach you [TS]

01:07:49   you're gonna you're gonna be and when it [TS]

01:07:51   and and it was like any efforts will be [TS]

01:07:53   wasted but it was admiring you know this [TS]

01:07:56   was the crazy thing it was admiring like [TS]

01:07:58   you are going to you know like what they [TS]

01:07:59   were saying was you are already on a [TS]

01:08:03   trajectory far away from here but and [TS]

01:08:08   and so all they could say was asshole as [TS]

01:08:10   they were kicking me out the door for um [TS]

01:08:13   and there was a 50-50 there was a fifty [TS]

01:08:16   percent chance that that trajectory was [TS]

01:08:18   going to go right through juvenile hall [TS]

01:08:19   right into jail and there and you know [TS]

01:08:25   and I don't think they wanted to be [TS]

01:08:26   wrong and say you've got a bright future [TS]

01:08:29   and then I end up in jail [TS]

01:08:31   well it's kinda almost like their way of [TS]

01:08:32   saying kudos like you wanted to screw it [TS]

01:08:34   up and you screwed it up real good [TS]

01:08:35   yeah but without but it like what you [TS]

01:08:39   are saying I mean I'm in a very i'm [TS]

01:08:42   going to vary [TS]

01:08:43   interesting place with my daughter right [TS]

01:08:45   now which is that she when when I push [TS]

01:08:48   her a little bit too much just just to [TS]

01:08:53   sound out a word or two try to climb [TS]

01:08:57   over the wall herself or to you know [TS]

01:09:01   what whatever I say you know try again [TS]

01:09:04   if i say try again three times she [TS]

01:09:11   surrenders and and we get caught in a [TS]

01:09:18   dynamic where I say well I mean you [TS]

01:09:20   can't just quit [TS]

01:09:22   we have to try we have to try again [TS]

01:09:25   there's nothing wrong with trying again [TS]

01:09:26   there's nothing wrong with trying and [TS]

01:09:27   not succeeding but it's important to try [TS]

01:09:30   multiple times and she says no I can't I [TS]

01:09:35   can't do it and gets very emotional and [TS]

01:09:41   I and I'm thinking back to my own [TS]

01:09:43   relationship with my dad who in those [TS]

01:09:45   situations was would get mad and would [TS]

01:09:49   say god damn it get up and do it again [TS]

01:09:51   and I don't and I don't want to be there [TS]

01:09:54   and I do do this thing that you're [TS]

01:09:56   saying where I'm like let's talk about [TS]

01:09:58   your feelings here and she's just like [TS]

01:10:01   fuck you talking like a i think a [TS]

01:10:04   process server that the reaction is so [TS]

01:10:06   negative talk about my feelings [TS]

01:10:08   go to hell and eventually what we end up [TS]

01:10:11   doing is sometimes we're just we just [TS]

01:10:13   sit on the sidewalk for 30 minutes not [TS]

01:10:17   trying not you know and crying and not [TS]

01:10:24   succeeding and my and my parenting is [TS]

01:10:27   not succeeding and I see all kinds of [TS]

01:10:30   parents who you know whose whose [TS]

01:10:35   philosophy is well she doesn't want to [TS]

01:10:37   do it then then move on get an ice cream [TS]

01:10:39   cone and you know and I don't and I [TS]

01:10:43   don't often admire the results of that [TS]

01:10:45   style of parenting and so not i'm [TS]

01:10:50   absolutely at a at a an impasse and I'm [TS]

01:10:54   very moved by your [TS]

01:10:56   by your insight into the fact that she [TS]

01:10:59   knows that she's she knows what her [TS]

01:11:01   vulnerabilities are and she knows that [TS]

01:11:04   those are the last things that she wants [TS]

01:11:06   to reveal like that feels very native to [TS]

01:11:13   me to that your vulnerabilities are not [TS]

01:11:17   what you want to probe not the things [TS]

01:11:20   you had an end to surrender in those [TS]

01:11:22   moments as she does is very defensive [TS]

01:11:27   against failure obviously but also [TS]

01:11:31   defensive against against my involvement [TS]

01:11:38   and right you know she's such a small [TS]

01:11:44   baby still that it that all of this is I [TS]

01:11:48   mean that she's not she's not [TS]

01:11:52   strategizing it it's just coming out [TS]

01:11:56   this way but I feel like I'm I feel like [TS]

01:12:00   I really want them to try and not carved [TS]

01:12:05   big ruts in the ground right and yes and [TS]

01:12:10   I mean this is a huge process for me [TS]

01:12:13   that I struggle with all the time but if [TS]

01:12:15   you think about how often with us with [TS]

01:12:17   anybody but especially with a little kid [TS]

01:12:20   what so you get your crying what is [TS]

01:12:22   crying crying is surrender [TS]

01:12:24   crying is when you kind of have [TS]

01:12:26   something that's so emotional that you [TS]

01:12:28   have a good buffer overrun or whatever [TS]

01:12:31   like there's just too much stuff here [TS]

01:12:32   and you kind of want to give up but you [TS]

01:12:35   know what i mean it's like you kind of [TS]

01:12:36   emotionally reached the end of your rope [TS]

01:12:37   and that's how it comes out but what is [TS]

01:12:39   the emotion that's so frequently [TS]

01:12:41   precedes crying its anger like think [TS]

01:12:45   about how at least my in our case at our [TS]

01:12:46   house like crying is almost always [TS]

01:12:48   preceded with anger and I think a lot of [TS]

01:12:50   times that anger is unconsciously like [TS]

01:12:54   unknowingly worrying about that [TS]

01:12:56   vulnerability that you have like for you [TS]

01:12:58   and me will try again to do this thing [TS]

01:13:00   you know they're not gonna die even if [TS]

01:13:02   they fall but they don't but they're [TS]

01:13:04   also you as you know as well as I think [TS]

01:13:06   agreeing that the vulnerability part is [TS]

01:13:08   there [TS]

01:13:09   the improbable upside down approach that [TS]

01:13:12   I'm trying to really think about and i [TS]

01:13:13   had to not have a handle on this yet [TS]

01:13:15   whether it's for my daughter for anybody [TS]

01:13:17   to junior hire anybody else is that I do [TS]

01:13:19   really feel like very few things are [TS]

01:13:23   successful in the wrong run when they're [TS]

01:13:25   based on fear and depleting security [TS]

01:13:28   like that can be when you're a grown-up [TS]

01:13:30   like their stuff you gotta do and you [TS]

01:13:32   want to take care of this like you have [TS]

01:13:34   the equipment to deal with that but [TS]

01:13:36   especially when you're younger and you [TS]

01:13:37   have all those vulnerabilities that [TS]

01:13:38   you're acutely aware of like I just try [TS]

01:13:41   to avoid anything that even [TS]

01:13:42   unintentionally becomes less secure [TS]

01:13:45   rather than more secure because I feel [TS]

01:13:47   like I'm being supportive when I say hey [TS]

01:13:49   you know you can do this or I you know I [TS]

01:13:51   know but what I'm really doing is kind [TS]

01:13:53   of making it about me and I'm kind of [TS]

01:13:54   making you know when like here's my [TS]

01:13:56   expectations for what you can do when [TS]

01:13:58   like what you described like sitting on [TS]

01:13:59   the sidewalk [TS]

01:14:00   that's the thing to do is the hardest [TS]

01:14:02   thing in the world again Shh right [TS]

01:14:04   there's this time we've got to go like [TS]

01:14:06   you know what I all of my words are not [TS]

01:14:08   going to do anything to add to this and [TS]

01:14:10   in a way i'm probably not i'm not aware [TS]

01:14:13   of i am making this more perilous [TS]

01:14:15   because now she sees me being nervous [TS]

01:14:17   and trying to make her feel better [TS]

01:14:18   why is he doing that well I must have [TS]

01:14:19   done something wrong or something bad [TS]

01:14:21   you know what I mean it's like you are [TS]

01:14:23   reactions to how people do stuff in the [TS]

01:14:24   world ends up having a much user impact [TS]

01:14:27   than what we think or what we believe or [TS]

01:14:28   even what we say you know what I mean [TS]

01:14:30   it's how we act is what the the [TS]

01:14:33   supportiveness sometimes it just let [TS]

01:14:35   them you know you don't want you to turn [TS]

01:14:37   into it you know an idiot or an asshole [TS]

01:14:39   but I think about things I said to her [TS]

01:14:41   that I thought were very inspiring and i [TS]

01:14:43   really regret [TS]

01:14:44   I've said things in the past like I know [TS]

01:14:46   you can be a better person than this and [TS]

01:14:48   think oh my gosh what a horrible for [TS]

01:14:50   what a horrible thing to say I'm trying [TS]

01:14:52   to say I really do believe in you and I [TS]

01:14:53   know you're a good person but like [TS]

01:14:55   because to me that's a question I ask [TS]

01:14:57   myself is this the person that I want to [TS]

01:14:58   be all grown man that's a good question [TS]

01:15:00   for me to ask myself [TS]

01:15:02   you're not a great question feel [TS]

01:15:03   supported but it's not yeah yeah and and [TS]

01:15:06   I I don't know how much my parents [TS]

01:15:12   recognize themselves in me it didn't [TS]

01:15:16   seem to me like they did recognize [TS]

01:15:18   themselves very much in me until maybe [TS]

01:15:21   later [TS]

01:15:22   um and and watching Marlo I'm trying not [TS]

01:15:28   to recognize myself in her because I [TS]

01:15:33   don't want to put my own struggles on [TS]

01:15:36   her and I don't want to see her [TS]

01:15:38   struggles as extensions of mine or or [TS]

01:15:42   recapitulation of some family line so [TS]

01:15:46   hard not to do [TS]

01:15:47   it's hard not to do and and and so I'm [TS]

01:15:52   just watching her and saying like what [TS]

01:15:53   are you gonna do what are you going to [TS]

01:15:57   struggle with and you know and I also [TS]

01:16:05   wanted to stop yelling in restaurants [TS]

01:16:08   about stuff about her poop you know so [TS]

01:16:13   there are things there are certain [TS]

01:16:15   things well that's the great goals i [TS]

01:16:17   just say no you do not yell about poop [TS]

01:16:20   in a Mexican restaurant but but beyond [TS]

01:16:26   that like do I care if she's a soccer [TS]

01:16:29   player or not know do i do I want her to [TS]

01:16:34   learn that if she tries something and it [TS]

01:16:37   doesn't work that someone else will step [TS]

01:16:39   in and do it for no do I want her to [TS]

01:16:43   learn that if she tried something and it [TS]

01:16:45   doesn't work [TS]

01:16:46   everything comes to a screeching halt [TS]

01:16:47   and everybody stares at her until she [TS]

01:16:48   figures that I don't know [TS]

01:16:50   so you know but but I've never I've [TS]

01:16:54   never helped somebody learn how to do [TS]

01:16:56   things like this before you know [TS]

01:16:58   somebody wasn't I mean to do not appear [TS]

01:17:01   and she's like she's like from another [TS]

01:17:02   planet right I don't hurt her skill set [TS]

01:17:05   is real different than ours [TS]

01:17:07   I'm not teaching her to drive i'm [TS]

01:17:09   teaching her not to eat glass and you [TS]

01:17:14   know and I don't want to I don't want to [TS]

01:17:16   fill her little heart with fear and I [TS]

01:17:18   don't want to I don't want to make her [TS]

01:17:22   embarrassed about herself and you know [TS]

01:17:25   and so far so far we're doing a great [TS]

01:17:29   job her mother and I are [TS]

01:17:31   I feel like weird we're doing good but [TS]

01:17:34   this is a new this is a new world where [TS]

01:17:36   she is asserting herself and the only [TS]

01:17:39   way she the only power she has is the [TS]

01:17:42   power to um you know it's not the only [TS]

01:17:47   power but it's very interesting to watch [TS]

01:17:49   heard learned that she has the power to [TS]

01:17:52   not do something for the power to not [TS]

01:17:56   like the power to not try [TS]

01:17:59   uh-huh especially if she knows it drives [TS]

01:18:01   you crazy it's a huge power [TS]

01:18:03   uh-huh and i used the power to not try [TS]

01:18:07   that was one of my major powers in my [TS]

01:18:12   family the power to not try a superpower [TS]

01:18:15   it was my super power and the power to [TS]

01:18:18   not try is incredibly frustrating for [TS]

01:18:21   people for other people because it isn't [TS]

01:18:24   you know it isn't that you're trying and [TS]

01:18:26   fucking up it is that you just aren't [TS]

01:18:28   even willing to try and that drove my my [TS]

01:18:33   own people to distraction and it caused [TS]

01:18:36   me so much additional pain and suffering [TS]

01:18:39   in my own life over and above this the [TS]

01:18:43   pain and suffering of just failing at [TS]

01:18:44   something and I don't want I don't want [TS]

01:18:48   her to have to to endure that the same [TS]

01:18:52   way i did but i have to you know I have [TS]

01:18:57   to step back and say she's not reliving [TS]

01:19:01   your life she's not you know should her [TS]

01:19:04   her challenges are different so I i said [TS]

01:19:12   and talk to her but I'm going to start [TS]

01:19:16   doing that now with this this other [TS]

01:19:19   understanding that she's not that that [TS]

01:19:24   no no one in their right mind and [TS]

01:19:26   particularly not a four-year-old is [TS]

01:19:28   going to be unguarded about the things [TS]

01:19:33   that she knows our her her greatest [TS]

01:19:36   vulnerabilities and that's just seems [TS]

01:19:38   that makes so much sense when you say it [TS]

01:19:42   of course you don't that's not your [TS]

01:19:44   expectation right i mean i would think [TS]

01:19:46   so much parenting advice is it is [TS]

01:19:50   predicated on the idea that your child [TS]

01:19:52   is an open book and that they're gonna [TS]

01:19:54   just tell me they're gonna talk about [TS]

01:19:56   their fucking feelings [TS]

01:19:58   the worst thing in the world I feel like [TS]

01:20:00   such activities is such a fit such a [TS]

01:20:02   total failure that I thought maybe I'd [TS]

01:20:06   just watched any TV shows i really [TS]

01:20:07   thought it could be something where I [TS]

01:20:08   wrap lightly on the door and stick my [TS]

01:20:10   hand I got hey do you want to talk [TS]

01:20:13   what hey hey sweetie you know the way [TS]

01:20:18   for us to establish really good [TS]

01:20:19   communications between father and [TS]

01:20:21   daughter just to start talking about [TS]

01:20:22   your feelings when you're for yeah you [TS]

01:20:24   know i was thinkin maybe I to come into [TS]

01:20:26   your room which is the only place where [TS]

01:20:28   you feel really safe from the rest of [TS]

01:20:30   the world and I committed confront [TS]

01:20:32   structure of vulnerabilities and that's [TS]

01:20:33   2-2 pitch in [TS]

01:20:35   just sit on the edge of your bed and [TS]

01:20:36   wrapped you know you know what I'll just [TS]

01:20:38   be a I'll just be a friendly ear while [TS]

01:20:41   you talk about all of that and you know [TS]

01:20:44   what and maybe even i'll make some [TS]

01:20:45   suggestions maybe I'll tale about how [TS]

01:20:47   I'm broken inside and talk any good luck [TS]

01:20:51   [Music] [TS]