0:00:00maybe you can switch to maybe maybe you
0:00:02have sufficient girth to do a one-legged
0:00:04thing where like instead of putting a
0:00:05lot of talk on both legs can it can it
0:00:07can it sit on one leg you could have one
0:00:09laptop on each leg you would do a
0:00:11wielding cool I think we're all set so I
0:00:16have notes on everything that happened
0:00:18but I didn't check the notes in the
0:00:19doctor okay yes your own personal notes
0:00:23well guess what I have notes shared
0:00:25notes follow up you of course you do we
0:00:29can breathe we can breeze through it
0:00:31these are all quick oh why don't you
0:00:33again Marco into a long tangent about
0:00:36your deep 20-minute feelings in each one
0:00:38of these items we can get through it
0:00:40shots fired its gonna be like that I
0:00:41would like you to listen to recent
0:00:43episodes and see what percentage of
0:00:46follow-up items IE MIT a single word
0:00:48about yeah but it just takes one it only
0:00:51takes one it gets you going and that
0:00:53becomes half the show anyway we can get
0:00:57through this quickly because marco is
0:00:58not interested oh my god every time you
0:01:00say that all that means is everyone is
0:01:02looking at the chapter mark to see where
0:01:04the first stop it begins look at the
0:01:06chapter markers just just listen to the
0:01:07show just be just experienced the show
0:01:09be in the mom be the show be in the
0:01:12moment alright so Stephen Empson rights
0:01:13in case nobody mentioned turns out turns
0:01:15out the Wii U gamepad had less display
0:01:18lag than most TVs and we'll put a couple
0:01:20links in the show notes John you're the
0:01:22only one of us with wii u i believe so
0:01:24you want to tell us about this I think
0:01:25John's the only one with a wii u yeah
0:01:27very well maybe yeah it was last week
0:01:30where I was saying that I like to use
0:01:32the gamepad for Mario Kart because it
0:01:34felt like there was actually less live
0:01:35than a TV which seems crazy because it
0:01:37is wirelessly sending video to the thing
0:01:39so i actually i had read this article
0:01:40back when I came out I just forgot about
0:01:42because I'm old apparently it's measured
0:01:46to be about 33 milliseconds of lag for
0:01:48the video on the Wii U gamepad which
0:01:50sounds like a lot until you realize that
0:01:52TVs especially TVs that are either not
0:01:54in game mode or can't get into a decent
0:01:57game mode that where they turn off all
0:01:59the image processing the input lag for
0:02:01TVs especially if you went through a
0:02:02receiver and then through a TV can be up
0:02:05to like 100 milliseconds so I wasn't
0:02:07imagining it
0:02:09it is very likely that my complete TV
0:02:11set up as configured at the time i was
0:02:13doing this is actually slower than using
0:02:15the wii u gamepad itself so good job
0:02:17Nintendo I minimizing that lag bad job
0:02:19whole rest of the AV industry on having
0:02:21horrendous leg input lag for television
0:02:24set ups what's the mechanism that the
0:02:27video is being broadcasted gamepad is
0:02:28that like a private Wi-Fi or something
0:02:30yeah I think it's like an h.264 stream
0:02:33over wireless thing I think the prior
0:02:36Terry I don't think it is just like
0:02:38liberal Wi-Fi but I don't know actually
0:02:39so it could be like a is an airdrop like
0:02:42a peer-to-peer thing that's kind of
0:02:43stood up just in the moment and then
0:02:45destroyed after you transfer the file or
0:02:47files or something like that maybe it's
0:02:49maybe it's one of those sort of
0:02:50scenarios who knows mm-hmm fair enough
0:02:52right in this in the interest of speedy
0:02:54follow-up for the first time ever tell
0:02:56us what happened with your Zelda HUD
0:02:57playing zelda as everybody knows and
0:03:01Zelda does have a HUD so is every pass
0:03:04Zelda game they always have something on
0:03:05the screen that's showing like a little
0:03:07mini map or like Skyward Sword had this
0:03:09giant honking picture of the wiimote
0:03:11which you could turn off and I did turn
0:03:13off a little status indicators a breath
0:03:16of the wild has the traditional line of
0:03:18hearts in the upper left hand corner and
0:03:20the lower right it's got a little
0:03:21circular map thing and some other little
0:03:22icons underneath the hearts it has a
0:03:24couple of other items that appear as you
0:03:27progress through the game don't want to
0:03:29spoil anything for people problem with
0:03:31those items is that they are white much
0:03:33of the time one hundred percent
0:03:34completely opaque white and my TV hates
0:03:37that and so after playing breath of the
0:03:39wild friday now 20 or 30 hours i noticed
0:03:42i'm getting into retention in the upper
0:03:43left corner for the white items luckily
0:03:46breath of the wild has a HUD option
0:03:47which i saw when i first start playing
0:03:49the game because of course being a nerd
0:03:51i always go into all the options first
0:03:52before starting anything and they called
0:03:55they call it the pro HUD which turns off
0:03:58basically everything except for your
0:03:59hearts and i said well i don't want to
0:04:01turn everything off it's a pretty
0:04:03minimal HUD to begin with it's very
0:04:04minimal very pushed off to the side so
0:04:06it's nice but and i like seeing the
0:04:07thing someone were useful like
0:04:08interesting the compass direction and
0:04:09stuff like that so i left and on that
0:04:11turned out to have been mistakes now i'm
0:04:13using the pro HUD which only shows
0:04:14hearts the hearts are one hundred
0:04:16percent britt red and opaque so they are
0:04:18causing some heart-shaped image
0:04:19retention in the upper left but they do
0:04:21vary a little bit as you
0:04:22take damage at the very least and one
0:04:24hundred percent red is much better than
0:04:26hundred percent white so I'm not kicking
0:04:28Zelda off my TV yet and moving it to the
0:04:30to the the gaming monitor or anything I
0:04:33think I'm just going to accept the
0:04:35amount of image pension because I know
0:04:36from our destiny experiment that yes you
0:04:39will get image retention but it is not
0:04:41permanent if you're merely wait a year
0:04:42it will go away and someone is
0:04:44suggesting that I get OLED oh let also
0:04:46has image retention guess what you know
0:04:49if you had brought a TV with a proper
0:04:52technology that doesn't have image
0:04:54retention this would have been a lot
0:04:55easier but no you had to have you had to
0:04:57have the blackest black sand the dark
0:04:59you stop saying even LCDs have image
0:05:01retention mine has it mine has it worse
0:05:03yeah well and and vibrant colors like
0:05:06seriously on my gaming monitor it is
0:05:08such an incredible difference in what
0:05:10the game looks like compared to what it
0:05:11looks like on tv and breadth of the
0:05:12while it's the type of game they want to
0:05:13experience and if there's not a lot of
0:05:15HUD in breadth of the wild it is
0:05:16actually pretty darn minimal so I want
0:05:18to see the full rich experience and to
0:05:20get the 5.1 surround sound with just
0:05:22they don't take that much advantage of
0:05:23what the speakers are better anyway I'm
0:05:24not kicking it off yet we'll check back
0:05:26in next week fair enough Carsten Weiss
0:05:29maybe vice rights in to talk about
0:05:32high-end desktop processors which I
0:05:34really don't care that much about so
0:05:36money you can take this this is in
0:05:38reference to be asking Oh a shelf if
0:05:40Intel makes any processors that are not
0:05:43Zeon's that have more than four cores
0:05:44that in theory could be used in an iMac
0:05:46and Marco said no and a lot of people
0:05:49tweeted that actually they make these a
0:05:51bunch of processors within decipherable
0:05:52numeric alphanumeric names that have 10
0:05:55cores and eight cores and six scores and
0:05:57other people trying done on Twitter to
0:05:58say actually those are basically two
0:06:00Zeon's rebranded and rename but without
0:06:02ECC ram and different chipsets that
0:06:04require them either way it seems like
0:06:06however you want to slice it there are
0:06:09other options that are not the same as
0:06:12the processors in the mac pro that Apple
0:06:13could put in the imac if we wanted to so
0:06:16maybe if they make an imac pro instead
0:06:18of having a xeon in there they could
0:06:20have one of these in between easy on
0:06:22things which would be kind of cruddy
0:06:24because i really want ECC ram so I from
0:06:26you know if I'm going to pay for an imac
0:06:28pro but anyway I'll buy whatever they
0:06:29put out because what the hell choice do
0:06:31I have yea sorry I'm going to talk to
0:06:34Sean during follow-up
0:06:36this is the x 99 series that people keep
0:06:39talking about I honestly don't know much
0:06:40about it I had it in the back of my mind
0:06:42and just forgotten about it but it seems
0:06:44like if if you're going to go to the
0:06:47trouble of having a very expensive
0:06:50processor that puts out a lot of heat
0:06:52and needs a big socket and everything
0:06:53else like why not just use eons at that
0:06:56point like I bet the engineering
0:06:58constraints and cost constraints and
0:07:00everything else around using these is
0:07:03probably not that different from just
0:07:04using Zeon's in the first place which is
0:07:06probably why apple doesn't just put one
0:07:08of these in an imac Jason Breckenridge
0:07:10rights in to say more about the mac pro
0:07:13a macro delay is likely due to wait for
0:07:17AMD to produce something that they can
0:07:18leverage to get intel xeon prices down
0:07:21that seems bold to me but anyway he
0:07:24continues margins are everything in Tim
0:07:26Cook's Apple not sure how you can know
0:07:28that but I'll continue especially for
0:07:29low-volume products maybe I don't know
0:07:31what do you guys I put this in here for
0:07:34not to address it directly but just for
0:07:36the larger issue because it's
0:07:41interesting to me that the three of us
0:07:43on this show seemed to all come to a
0:07:46sort of no I'm going to say unspoken
0:07:48agreement but chances are we spoke about
0:07:50it because we talked about the knife bro
0:07:51a lot agreement that there is no new Mac
0:07:54Pro coming and yet when I see people
0:07:57like when listeners right in or tweet or
0:08:00whatever there is still a contingent out
0:08:02there that is on a different page than
0:08:04we are that they believe that there is a
0:08:07delay like the Mac but there is a mac
0:08:09pro delay the new Mac Pro is coming and
0:08:12maybe i'm wrong but do we all basically
0:08:13do the three of us like obviously we
0:08:15don't know we're just guessing right but
0:08:16do we all kind of agree there is no new
0:08:20mac pro coming in in the terms that we
0:08:22understand it to be basically like a
0:08:23thing that you buy from apple that is
0:08:26their their fastest computer that
0:08:27doesn't have a screen attached to it I
0:08:29don't know your your the yearly what
0:08:33you're the one holdout I mean I think
0:08:34Marco agrees right yeah pretty much I've
0:08:38been on the page for a while that just
0:08:40like there is no new Mac Pro coming and
0:08:42all I'm thinking of is low you know in
0:08:44the way that we understand it I'm I'm a
0:08:45hundred percent pinning my hopes on and
0:08:48I'm
0:08:48mac pro at this point but the mac pro
0:08:50like so many people right into talked
0:08:51about what do we think the next Mac Pro
0:08:53is going to be and what might be
0:08:54delaying the next Mac Pro and I feel
0:08:55like writing back saying I I've lost my
0:08:58faith like I what what new Mac Pro what
0:09:01are you even talking about it's there is
0:09:03no new Mac Pro the rebel never will be a
0:09:05new mac pro except for something
0:09:08different than in terms of yet again and
0:09:10when I say it I'm talking about a box
0:09:12that you buy that doesn't have a monitor
0:09:13built into it from apple that is their
0:09:15fastest computer I think that's that's
0:09:17gone yeah i mean like all right like
0:09:19i've been using this imac since 2014
0:09:21because it it just fit my overall
0:09:25desires better like I really wanted
0:09:27retina like I desperately want a desktop
0:09:30retina and I thought for years that it
0:09:33was it was further away and so and then
0:09:35when they released the 5k imac it like
0:09:38it blew my mind and it was so good and
0:09:40it still is so good you know I decided
0:09:43then like okay I will trade some
0:09:45processing power and I will trade the
0:09:47freedom of this external cylinder or
0:09:49tower and having it separate my monitor
0:09:51I'll trade that for this awesome screen
0:09:53experience and the time there really was
0:09:55no great way to get 5k externally now
0:09:58well maybe you could argue that the LG
0:10:02still sucks so badly that make me maybe
0:10:05there still isn't agree we can fuck
0:10:07external in that is what broke me if you
0:10:09recall that was the end I was like I now
0:10:12I accept I accept it up you're telling
0:10:14me and no uncertain terms give up yeah
0:10:18maybe I don't anyway so I the the
0:10:21problem is like I hear from various
0:10:24tipsters and rumors and birdies and
0:10:27everything else I hear a different thing
0:10:29like every month every month I here oh
0:10:30the mac pro is really dead this time or
0:10:32oh no it's not dead yet it's coming you
0:10:34know they're they're starting up a new
0:10:36thing yeah but every time I hear that
0:10:37like I think does what I'm hearing fit
0:10:39into the idea of an imac pro and every
0:10:41time i go that totally could be an imac
0:10:43bro all i want is for them to address
0:10:45high-end needs and for the current imac
0:10:50series as we know it to not be the
0:10:53highest they ever go because it is very
0:10:55limited in you know limiting itself to
0:10:57the primarily for core desktop line and
0:10:59not having desktop class
0:11:02high-powered GPU support and desktop
0:11:04class high-powered CPU support and
0:11:07workstation class i should say cpu
0:11:09support you know there's there's a huge
0:11:11ceiling above the current imac series
0:11:14and it isn't just about getting a higher
0:11:17clock speed on single core it's about
0:11:18like like if you want if you need
0:11:21multi-core performance which lots of
0:11:23things use these days it isn't it isn't
0:11:26a matter of just wait till next year's
0:11:28imac and the four core line will be will
0:11:31be good enough that a mac pro won't be
0:11:33necessary it's literally like the imac
0:11:35grows like five or ten percent
0:11:37performance a year and a mac pro with
0:11:40more cores could have like it could have
0:11:42like six times the performance like
0:11:44that's that's the difference we're
0:11:45talking about here it's not it isn't
0:11:48something that we can just wait a couple
0:11:49years and the need goes away because a
0:11:52couple years down the road the
0:11:53multi-core high-power workstation chips
0:11:55have gotten better too so this having
0:11:59having a gap like there's a big gap
0:12:01between what the imac can do and what a
0:12:04computer that has a much higher power
0:12:08and heat budget and and money budget can
0:12:10do and that use for the Mac Pro and now
0:12:13it's it's kind of gone and that huge gap
0:12:16is just being unserved and the people
0:12:19who need that huge gap are going to
0:12:20windows and hackintosh is another crap
0:12:23like that that's what I hope Apple
0:12:25addresses whether it has a screen built
0:12:28into it or not I would prefer if it
0:12:31didn't just for additional flexibility
0:12:33but I don't really I'm not going to be
0:12:36massively disappointed if they give me a
0:12:38new high-end 16 core xeon workstation
0:12:42that happens to have a 5k screen in
0:12:43front of it which is by the way the best
0:12:45screen i've ever seen yeah I'm actually
0:12:47like now that I know there's no
0:12:48third-party monitor that's what makes
0:12:50the imac pro so much more palatable to
0:12:52me because i will still have an apple
0:12:53monitor that's what i want and so I'm
0:12:57just paying my hopes on the insides of
0:12:59that I Mac Pro being all that they can
0:13:01be right here to you to you have had
0:13:03your talking privileges revoked for the
0:13:05remainder of follow-up I was trying to
0:13:07get things quickly and then I said those
0:13:09two curse it goddamn words Mac Pro and
0:13:12then everything took a turn as it always
0:13:14does
0:13:15uh anyway I mean in our defense I'm
0:13:19pretty sure you started it well I died I
0:13:23didn't put this in the show notes but I
0:13:25did I reading this I was dutifully
0:13:27reading John's show notes and here's
0:13:29where we ended up so anyway we'll move
0:13:32on to talk about how Americans are cheap
0:13:33so Jake rights in to say I wanted to
0:13:36tell you all what I've seen with a
0:13:38family member that has been in education
0:13:40for almost 30 years and this person's
0:13:43family member works for a 12,000 student
0:13:46school district in America in this
0:13:48district there several schools need
0:13:50repairs or renovation keep students safe
0:13:51over the last two years the district has
0:13:54presented referendum which goes to a
0:13:56public vote to the public which gets
0:13:58voted down a secondary referendum for a
0:14:01lesser amount of money which is also
0:14:02voted down and now there's a third
0:14:04referendum on the table the current
0:14:05referendum has a lot of opposition this
0:14:07time at this time and according to Jake
0:14:10they don't play nice so Jake summarizes
0:14:13people aren't really not fond of taxes
0:14:14being raised sport education I've seen
0:14:16this every day for the last uh decade or
0:14:19two of my life even when kids safety is
0:14:22on the line there is still opposition
0:14:25it's really sad and this is an exact
0:14:28retelling of my childhood in in n what
0:14:32now how do I say this because however
0:14:33it's i pronounced it apparently everyone
0:14:35was very very upset just putting the you
0:14:38just putting the emphasis on the wrong
0:14:39syllable that's all right what what what
0:14:42flight attendant movie was that I never
0:14:43actually saw but that preview that was
0:14:45on the initials is very popular I parted
0:14:49back in middle schools i don't know the
0:14:50original origin asst and anyway i have
0:14:52fluent is what you're trying to say
0:14:53thank you so you said about yes
0:14:56apparently and very there were a lot of
0:14:58people it's probably an alternate
0:14:59pronunciations because everything is
0:15:01yeah i always have that defense you can
0:15:03look it up I'm sure I'm sure that's true
0:15:05but whatever so affluent is that correct
0:15:08yep anyway it doesn't matter whatever we
0:15:11lived into an area that had a lot of
0:15:12rich people in it so there we go so the
0:15:15point is this was the exact same
0:15:17behavior that I saw at my school
0:15:19district which we went over last episode
0:15:21we had several other people right in to
0:15:23say very very similar things that were
0:15:25equally depressing and this was just a
0:15:27really great summary
0:15:29how Americans are cheap and and I hate
0:15:31all of us so i just thought i'd share
0:15:33that little anecdote speaking of things
0:15:35that we won't talk long about at all i'm
0:15:37quite sure twitter twitter if it for mac
0:15:40the kickstarter made it and the stretch
0:15:43goal of 100 thousand dollars to get
0:15:44basic things like direct messaging
0:15:47support also made it which is super
0:15:49exciting so congratulations John
0:15:51Syracuse the this moment is yours yes
0:15:53this is a right victory lap for the
0:15:54project and for all of the listeners to
0:15:57this show who I'm sure heard my plea and
0:15:59pledged support and it amazes me like I
0:16:01was just at the goal I set for everybody
0:16:04says ignore the fact that the goal is 75
0:16:05grand the stretch goals 100 grand and we
0:16:08need to get that because that's where
0:16:09like direct messages come in as much as
0:16:11I love terrific I really don't want to
0:16:12use a mac Twitter client doesn't support
0:16:14direct messages so we did it 108,000 is
0:16:16the total we passed 100 k as a marker
0:16:20was pointing out now I have to pay the
0:16:22money that I pledged towards it and
0:16:23there are a lot of people i know on
0:16:25twitter told me that not only did they
0:16:27pledge because they heard my
0:16:29encouragement to do so but they also up
0:16:32their pledges when they saw that it
0:16:33wasn't close to its goal or whatever so
0:16:35thank you to everybody who did that I'm
0:16:38sure this will turn out great the one
0:16:40the one bad thing for me is that of
0:16:42course I can't alright may not be able
0:16:44to run this project if it's Sarah only
0:16:46until and unless I get a new mac that
0:16:48runs I mean it's not supposed to be done
0:16:51until much later nice is really is gonna
0:16:54be not as expensive Twitter client ever
0:16:55free huh yeah well I want to get the new
0:16:57mac anyway but gonna be a few bucks for
0:16:59Twitter and average for tweet button key
0:17:01thousand bucks for a new mac i'm also
0:17:03lobbying them through certain channels
0:17:05to perhaps try to support back dale cap
0:17:07but i don't know if that will happen but
0:17:09either way I want a new mac the run
0:17:10Sierra and I want to be able to run this
0:17:11thing and it's not done yet so fingers
0:17:13crossed everybody but thanks to
0:17:14everybody who helped this is awesome
0:17:15congratulations John siracusa I'm very
0:17:18very very excited for you I know this
0:17:21was uh this was a big deal for you could
0:17:23just use tweetbot but that's cool Cirie
0:17:25has multi-language support several
0:17:28people wrote in with regard to our
0:17:29ladies in the cylinder conversation last
0:17:32episode to remind us that in it is we
0:17:35needed a reminder that that what is the
0:17:39the the the Amazon
0:17:42which I'm stumbling so hard to say our
0:17:44name yes the echoes lady I didn't want
0:17:47to say the AL exa word um the echoes
0:17:50lady does not have a lot of
0:17:52multi-language support whereas the Apple
0:17:56lady does have considerable by
0:17:58comparison multi-language support and
0:18:00that's a big deal for anyone who doesn't
0:18:02speak English and obviously we tend to
0:18:05be more myopic than we intend when it
0:18:07comes to these sorts of things but for
0:18:09people outside of the United States
0:18:11Britain etc Australia to before we get
0:18:14people emailing us about that um people
0:18:18outside those areas you know the only
0:18:20choice I really have a Serie and that's
0:18:22kind of a big bummer so anyway it's
0:18:25worth considering we didn't really give
0:18:27any thought to that last episode what is
0:18:28it wasn't uh somebody wrote in to get
0:18:32onto the they will actually for the some
0:18:34someone run in there in a foreign
0:18:36country and they said that they had to
0:18:39speak to whatever thing they were
0:18:41speaking to in their native language but
0:18:44they had to pronounce things the way an
0:18:46English feature English speaker would
0:18:48try to say the words in their language
0:18:49in order to be understood which I
0:18:51thought was interesting that like even
0:18:53though it purports to understand your
0:18:54language if you speak sort of
0:18:55colloquially and just like casually as
0:18:59you would it doesn't work as well if you
0:19:01think like how would an American trying
0:19:03to speak my language say this and say it
0:19:04that way then then the cylinder picks
0:19:06out which I thought was funny I mean
0:19:07it's working on works the same way here
0:19:09you kind of think like how would
0:19:10somebody in California say this like the
0:19:13way I say it never works right you just
0:19:15gotta add in a groovy and you know and
0:19:17whatever the other lingos reckon can you
0:19:19get me a Jaguar with an automatic
0:19:21transmission Wow that'll work perfectly
0:19:24don't forget the passive aggression no I
0:19:26mean so I think what about what bugs me
0:19:28about a lot of the times i see this
0:19:30pointed out is when it's used as a
0:19:33defense for areas in which siri is not
0:19:36doing so well or as stupider than it
0:19:38should be so to me these should be
0:19:40carefully considered as separate factors
0:19:43yes sirree is better at international
0:19:47and multi-language support amazon sucks
0:19:50internationally they have terrible
0:19:52coverage outside the US for all of their
0:19:54services
0:19:56and the echoes voice service is no
0:19:58exception to that but what Amazon's even
0:20:01better at is in the like one language in
0:20:05that they support well it simply works
0:20:08more reliably and I know there are there
0:20:11areas in which Siri is better and and
0:20:14that's fine there's areas in which
0:20:15amazon is better but these are separate
0:20:18discussions and I don't think it's a
0:20:20valid excuse for apple or four for Apple
0:20:25fans and commentators to use just
0:20:27whenever anybody points out that Siri
0:20:29does something less well than it should
0:20:31or that Amazon does something really
0:20:33well it is not a valid excuse to say
0:20:35well series report supports you know 75
0:20:38different languages it's like well okay
0:20:40it does the sky is also blue these are
0:20:42separate facts these are separate
0:20:44discussions right like so that's I see
0:20:47this a lot in a way that bothers me but
0:20:48that is an attribute that should be
0:20:52commended you know it is great this here
0:20:55supports all the different languages and
0:20:56if you speak one of those languages
0:20:57that's a huge factor for you in the same
0:20:59way that other factors of these products
0:21:01might influence other people's decisions
0:21:02I would just be careful how we throw
0:21:05that around because so often it's used
0:21:07in this kind of invalid defense fair
0:21:10enough all right so I've a very quick
0:21:14question about the Apple watch which is
0:21:16kind of a call to listeners to tweet at
0:21:19me and me alone and then I'd like to go
0:21:22to your lawfully i am going to regret
0:21:25this but i'm curious and then marco has
0:21:27a tale of waffling ideas a lot less
0:21:29delicious than it said you have a brief
0:21:31tale of waffling right Marco yeah very
0:21:33bright well I do I wasn't I wasn't aware
0:21:35you guys knew about it somebody put in
0:21:36the show notes we know everything we're
0:21:38watching always watching cool all right
0:21:40well anyway I I wanted to want to ask
0:21:45the audience and you can tweet at me and
0:21:47me alone you don't need to bother mark
0:21:48when John do you I've been doing this by
0:21:51the way I know if you have a Syria what
0:21:55we calling this a series 0 an original
0:21:57Apple watch do you find that the battery
0:22:00is starting to get a little long in the
0:22:01tooth and starting to wear out a little
0:22:03more quickly than you use than it used
0:22:05to be cuz i got i took delivery of my
0:22:08apple watch in early May
0:22:09and the last couple days it has been
0:22:11nice enough out that I can go for my
0:22:13afternoon or really evening walk with
0:22:15Declan and i'll do a walking exercise on
0:22:18my Apple watch and as soon as I've
0:22:21started doing that last few days at
0:22:23unreasonably early hours my Apple watch
0:22:26is going from oh I'm fine everything I'm
0:22:28asleep and power reserve mode is on and
0:22:31I basically don't have a watch at all
0:22:34anymore and this only started when I
0:22:36when I started doing these exercises and
0:22:38eat well for loose definitions of
0:22:39exercise but anyway exercises in the
0:22:41evening and tracking these like 15 to 30
0:22:44minute walks and I'm curious those who
0:22:46listen if you had only if you have a
0:22:49series 0 original Apple watch do you
0:22:51also find your heaven having battery
0:22:53woes let at kc list no i'm curious to
0:22:56hear that's all for now you can you
0:22:58restore your phone I have a series 0
0:23:00watch and my battery is awesome as it
0:23:02sits there on it's charging thing on top
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0:23:54we're taking more photos than ever but
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0:24:45you have a gift for a relative or you
0:24:47know some of the holidays coming up like
0:24:49Mother's Day and stuff it is totally
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0:24:53yourself and you'll be a convert trust
0:24:55me they can't pay me to say that they
0:24:56can't pay me to see how much I love them
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0:25:00it out today fracture me calm and when
0:25:03they ask you where you heard about them
0:25:05make sure to enter accidental tech
0:25:07podcast or ATP whatever they have their
0:25:09it's wonderful check it out once again
0:25:11don't forget to tell them where they
0:25:12where you heard about them fracture me
0:25:14calm thanks a lot to fracture for
0:25:16sponsoring our show so tell me about
0:25:21your waffling but I'm gonna say this is
0:25:25by my count your third mac laptop order
0:25:28since the new mac laptops are released
0:25:30again oh my god Marco here's here's what
0:25:34happened oh here we go yeah you had to
0:25:37do it why did you have to do it here's
0:25:38here's what happened all right I'll try
0:25:40to be brief as we have all of us talking
0:25:41about on my I recently came back from a
0:25:44trip on the way home I was I was
0:25:47supposed to have downloaded a TV show
0:25:50for TIFF and I to watch on the plane and
0:25:52last minute at the airport I realized
0:25:55like at the departure airport I realized
0:25:58I had not done it over the hotel Wi-Fi
0:26:00overnight like I had planned and i had
0:26:02to very quickly download episodes of a
0:26:04TV show and of course nothing was
0:26:07available in any legal fashion so I was
0:26:09going to ship them to myself on a truck
0:26:12and there are numerous ways to do this
0:26:16on airport Wi-Fi none of which are very
0:26:19good and the only way I found for this
0:26:23show that I was supposed to downloaded
0:26:25but didn't download the only way that I
0:26:27could find it is a certain kind of truck
0:26:30that let's say it forms a torrential
0:26:34downpour
0:26:36data pieces into a TV show I knew like
0:26:40you know if I could just use a group of
0:26:43newspaper delivery trucks that would be
0:26:46better but the the torrential downpour
0:26:49of trucks was the only thing I get to
0:26:51work in a reliable fashion from the
0:26:54airport Wi-Fi that I was on and the
0:26:56plane was taking off in like a half hour
0:26:58and I just had to get something quickly
0:27:00so I installed a type of torrential
0:27:05downpour truck that I had trusted in the
0:27:07past even though I knew that you know
0:27:09that they I heard they kind of got shady
0:27:11with bundling smaller satellite trucks
0:27:14with it install yahoo search toolbar in
0:27:17your browser installed java it did set
0:27:20my homepage to yahoo and all of my
0:27:22browsers that's the stuff and on my home
0:27:26mac i have an older version of this
0:27:28truck that has note i downloaded years
0:27:31ago that has no problems but on on the
0:27:34the new version that i could get off the
0:27:36website quickly it did a bunch of weird
0:27:38stuff that I don't trust and so because
0:27:40of this I now consider my 15 inch touch
0:27:44bar macbook pro compromised and I need
0:27:47to format it and reinstall basically for
0:27:51my own sanity do you guys remember what
0:27:54made my curly quit his job oh god it was
0:27:59him having to buy a new pair of
0:28:01shoelaces and yet how does that justify
0:28:03you getting a new damn computer I was
0:28:05gonna say to remind everybody this story
0:28:07about him forgetting to download a TV
0:28:09show and trying to do to the airport is
0:28:10going to lead to him buying a new
0:28:12computer just whoever's on the same page
0:28:13all right so basically the gist of it if
0:28:17I can summarize my curly story about how
0:28:18he of what made him finally quit a job
0:28:20become a professional podcasters is that
0:28:22he he was going to his his office job
0:28:25where he had to dress up and he broke
0:28:27the shoelace on his shoe and he was
0:28:29thinking acquitting for a while and that
0:28:31finally pushed him over the edge because
0:28:33he's like you know I I don't want to buy
0:28:35a new pair of shoelaces for these shoes
0:28:38because it was kind of like reinforcing
0:28:41and reinvesting in the world he was he
0:28:44was not happy with and trying to leave
0:28:46so you decided to just stop at that
0:28:48point I'm sorry if you butch
0:28:50I bunch of that in case you remember
0:28:51offhand what episode of analog people
0:28:53should listen to no i don't but i'll
0:28:55have it in the show notes okay i don't
0:28:56remember which episode it is but we go
0:28:58into detail about this and it is it is
0:29:00one of the better episodes of analog if
0:29:01i do say so myself so it's worth
0:29:02listening to ok so when faced with the
0:29:06need to reformat my 15 inch touch bar
0:29:09macbook pro at the end of this trip
0:29:12probably the third or fourth trip I've
0:29:14taken it on I was already not loving
0:29:18this computer on this trip in so many
0:29:21things about it that I that I when I
0:29:23bought it I was like you know I don't
0:29:25love this but I'll get used to it maybe
0:29:27and some of those things I've gotten
0:29:29used to decently enough some of those
0:29:31things I haven't I I just have no
0:29:33motivation to fix this computer even
0:29:36though it's a software you have to
0:29:37reinstall the OS which I have to do even
0:29:40if I get a new one I will then start on
0:29:41a fresh one and then I'll have to you
0:29:42know put everything back on that one I
0:29:44don't want to this this is my shoelace
0:29:47and I don't want to fix this laptop
0:29:50because I just don't like it and I'm
0:29:52finally admitting to myself you know
0:29:53what the 15 inch touch bar macbook pro
0:29:56it's not a bad computer it's just really
0:29:59designed with different priorities and
0:30:00different needs than what my needs and
0:30:02priorities actually are and i thought i
0:30:04would get past it i thought i'd get used
0:30:06to it and I thought certain things would
0:30:07would stick better than they have like
0:30:09for me honestly the touch bar doesn't
0:30:12work for me it may be down the road it
0:30:13will but right now it doesn't and there
0:30:16it causes a lot of problems like
0:30:17accidentally brushing against it and and
0:30:19other issues bugs incident so anyway so
0:30:22I thought you know what I can't do this
0:30:24anymore i'm going to switch to a
0:30:26computer that i actually like and my
0:30:29original plan was i'm going to wait for
0:30:33the next update to the macbook one and
0:30:34give that a solid try again because with
0:30:37that when i first got the first one and
0:30:39really hated it part of the reason i
0:30:41hated it was the keyboard but well now
0:30:43they all have that keyboard and it's
0:30:45like well I i I'm forcibly getting used
0:30:47to that keyboard it's like all right
0:30:49well that's that that is kind of now an
0:30:51equal between them almost I mean though
0:30:53the one on the map book one currently
0:30:54has less feedback it is still the same
0:30:57low travel but it has less feedback then
0:30:59the ones that are on the new 2016
0:31:01macbook pros I'm used to that one now on
0:31:04MacBook Pros I still don't like it but
0:31:05I'm used to it so I can tolerate that
0:31:08and I was assuming that the next update
0:31:09to the macbook one would get that
0:31:12keyboard also the original map book one
0:31:14I mean all the map ones are very slow
0:31:16but in in the 2016 update was it they
0:31:21dramatically increased the speed of the
0:31:23SSD which it which dramatically
0:31:26increases the performance of lots of
0:31:27things in the system and so the gist of
0:31:29what owners have reported basically is
0:31:31that the the second version of the
0:31:34macbook one which is the one that's been
0:31:35on for about a year now is significantly
0:31:38faster than the first version was also
0:31:39thanks tipster the GPU is also a lot a
0:31:42lot faster which also helps so so I
0:31:45thought you know let me just wait for
0:31:46that and then I'll make a decision well
0:31:49I'm about to go on a trip in like a
0:31:51couple of weeks to Ireland to the
0:31:54all-conference and like like Arthur
0:31:56friends I will pimp the OL conference
0:31:57not because they've asked me to not
0:31:59because I feel obligated to but because
0:32:01if you are anywhere near Ireland or can
0:32:03get to Ireland in a couple of weeks you
0:32:05should go to the all-conference it's
0:32:06amazing so go to the old conference
0:32:08everybody ull dot IE is cool anyway I'm
0:32:12going to Ireland this is the perfect
0:32:13kind of trip where I want to have a
0:32:15laptop with me but I don't really get a
0:32:17lot of work done I'm trips anymore I try
0:32:19I always try and I just I don't you know
0:32:22it's very rare that actually get a lot
0:32:23of work done since the 15-inch was not
0:32:25for me i speaking you know this would be
0:32:26a great time to have a new smaller
0:32:30laptop to try to use to enjoy and since
0:32:34the 15-inch is not working for me for
0:32:35lots of reasons and one of the main
0:32:37reasons is the touch bar that really is
0:32:39not working for me I think my choices
0:32:40were basically the macbook law under the
0:32:42macbook escape or an old macbook pro you
0:32:45know like I can get the old 13 of the I
0:32:46already have my old 15 so I took out the
0:32:49old 15 figured I'd boot that up for a
0:32:50little bit use that for a couple days
0:32:51see how that goes and it's fine but I'm
0:32:55ruin now for the weight difference on
0:32:58the new one even though going from the
0:33:01old to the new 15 is only a half pound
0:33:03savings went from like four point five
0:33:05to four point oh that's enough that to
0:33:07ruin me so now I pick up the old one in
0:33:09it and it feels really old the then the
0:33:12the event or the announcements rather
0:33:14the other day yesterday the other day
0:33:17came out and I thought apple is sure to
0:33:20update the macbook one so let me wait
0:33:22for this announcement and then I will
0:33:24probably just order a macbook one which
0:33:26with the new hopefully with the new
0:33:27keyboard and with the new you know maybe
0:33:30maybe faster Thunder maybe Thunderbolt
0:33:32until just us bc or whatever else okay i
0:33:34was going to do the same thing for the
0:33:36record i had every intention of buying
0:33:38myself a macbook adorable / macbook 1 /
0:33:42officially called macbook the 12 inch
0:33:44macbook but right i was planning to buy
0:33:46one yesterday i was locked and loaded
0:33:47ready to go and then not so much so what
0:33:51did you do see I I know how I know how
0:33:53to not spend money but if there's
0:33:55anything you know how to do it not
0:33:58spending money is not on that list you
0:33:59you do not know how to not spend money
0:34:01all I can do is rationalize spending a
0:34:04little bit less money than I was going
0:34:05to spend anyway but anyway the the the
0:34:08day came and went they had their big
0:34:09browser press releases which people get
0:34:10to don't worry everyone will get to that
0:34:12and they didn't release basically
0:34:14anything I wanted but but yeah they
0:34:17didn't they didn't release the macbook
0:34:18one so I decided you know what let me go
0:34:20to the apple store now that everything's
0:34:22in stock I'll spend some real time with
0:34:24the macbook escape and the macbook one
0:34:27side by side and to just see like should
0:34:30I just wait for an escape or I'm
0:34:32strikers by an escape now or should I
0:34:34wait for the map of one update that
0:34:36might happen in a couple of weeks or it
0:34:39might happen in six months or it might
0:34:42never happen we have not liked it this
0:34:45is modern Apple who knows when things
0:34:46will come out there's no relation
0:34:48anymore to like Intel schedules so it
0:34:51could come out anytime or never so
0:34:53anyway so I went to the store side by
0:34:56side macbook escape to MacBook one the
0:34:59weight difference between them is
0:35:01noticeable it's two pounds versus three
0:35:02pounds so it's a noticeable weight
0:35:03difference it's a noticeable size
0:35:05difference but the macbook Escape is the
0:35:08same approximate size and weight as the
0:35:1013-inch macbook air has always been it
0:35:12feels great it's small you know and and
0:35:16critically it is basically a retina
0:35:18macbook air in its internals and so it
0:35:21has amazing battery life the best
0:35:23battery life in the whole lineup and one
0:35:25of my problems with the 15 inches that
0:35:26the battery life is just not that great
0:35:28it's it's not horrible
0:35:30all but it's not great and it varies
0:35:32tremendously with what you're doing
0:35:33because it has that high-powered GPU and
0:35:36the nice big four core cpu and
0:35:38everything else so 15 inch varies a lot
0:35:39and isn't even great to begin with the
0:35:42macbook escape has and by the way I
0:35:44should clarify my stupid name for that
0:35:45that's the 13-inch MacBook Pro 2016 with
0:35:49two Thunderbolt ports and also known as
0:35:52the non-touch bar 13 inch MacBook Pro
0:35:54all these want to see at my name is
0:35:57better than apples right okay so anyway
0:35:58the macbook escape it is not as small
0:36:00and light as I would love it to be but
0:36:02it's pretty small in light the macbook
0:36:04one now again this is this is the now
0:36:06year old version so maybe this will
0:36:08change in the new one but the keyboard
0:36:12different side by side is not a big
0:36:14difference but it is noticeable and the
0:36:17macbook one keyboard is worse by you
0:36:20know a noticeable amount the ergonomic
0:36:22difference is more noticeable than I
0:36:26would have guessed you know the macbook
0:36:27one feels great when you're holding it
0:36:28when you pick it up when you when you're
0:36:29carrying it around feels great I don't
0:36:32care for how you have to open the lid
0:36:35basically with two hands because it's so
0:36:38thin and so small that you kind of you
0:36:40can't really like wed your thumb under
0:36:43like the little lip area and push down
0:36:44on what's below it like you can with the
0:36:46bigger ones you don't have to that's the
0:36:48babbles all big thing you can do with
0:36:49one hand and the bass stays down yeah it
0:36:52does it really does i tried all the time
0:36:54the apple store on them amazing how
0:36:55often how it works actually try it
0:36:57you're right that it's hard to get your
0:36:58finger under it but it's if you'd let go
0:37:00of the notion you actually need to hold
0:37:02the base down and you can manage to get
0:37:04through a little finger under the lip I
0:37:05swear to you that the base will stay on
0:37:07the table oh I don't realize that okay
0:37:09anyway so it didn't feel as good it felt
0:37:13like a little bit like flimsy to do that
0:37:14like just like it's not a huge deal but
0:37:17when you compare them side-by-side it's
0:37:18an obvious difference also when i had
0:37:21the macbook escape for like a day and a
0:37:23half when it first came inside of epic
0:37:2514 day and a half and a first came out
0:37:26one problem i had with it was it
0:37:28actually on my lap it was too narrow and
0:37:31it would likes it too low on my legs as
0:37:34a result like it wouldn't quite span
0:37:35across my leg gap quite well enough and
0:37:38i actually found it not that pleasant to
0:37:40use on my lap it would be great on like
0:37:43an airplane tray table
0:37:44and it'd be totally you know suitable on
0:37:46a desk and anything else but on my lap I
0:37:48actually found it was actually not quite
0:37:50wide enough to really be comfortable
0:37:53there and and the biggest difference to
0:37:55me is that the macbook ones trackpad is
0:37:59truly awful it is horrendous how how
0:38:03differently when you when you feel them
0:38:04side by side even on the same settings
0:38:06on the same like force touch firmness
0:38:08level or whatever the difference in the
0:38:10cliq feel and the responsiveness between
0:38:13the macbook one and the macbook escape
0:38:15is massive on the on the trackpad it's a
0:38:17huge difference I basically decided then
0:38:20that you know I actually don't think I
0:38:22want a macbook one again even if it gets
0:38:26updated so i played with the escape a
0:38:29little bit longer play with the one a
0:38:31little bit longer firm but my decision
0:38:32went home and ordered a maxed-out
0:38:34macbook escape except for that I didn't
0:38:36get the terabyte I got the 512 it's
0:38:38still time for you to cancel that order
0:38:39again I already canceled the same order
0:38:4216 months ago I know I'm saying I'm
0:38:44gonna make it this time is it gonna make
0:38:45it I I'll see how it goes and ask me
0:38:48again you know in a couple of weeks what
0:38:52are you doing with your with your old
0:38:53one um once once i'm sure that i'm going
0:38:56to keep the escape i'll sell the 15
0:38:58unless casey wants it i can sell to you
0:39:00so you were like the the proverbial
0:39:03little lady only drove to church on
0:39:05sunday if you want a lightly used yeah
0:39:08laptop for a reasonable price just wait
0:39:10for Marco to get bored of it exactly oh
0:39:12goodness I don't even know what to do
0:39:15with you though I'm most disappointed
0:39:17that you didn't get a macbook one
0:39:19because I would have bought that off of
0:39:20you in two weeks or two weeks a day when
0:39:23you decide that you don't want this one
0:39:25but as it turns out that's not you
0:39:26bought but I have the complete opposite
0:39:28of 15 inch no I don't want a 15-inch
0:39:30like that either interest me but I don't
0:39:32want that like I I'm not saying that
0:39:34it's bad I'm not sad just at today with
0:39:37my needs today I don't want it because
0:39:39it what I really want is a new 15 inch
0:39:41touch bar for work but I'm not gonna get
0:39:44another computer for work for like two
0:39:46or three years so alas anyway like what
0:39:48the reason I got the 15 to begin with
0:39:51was that I had originally ordered this
0:39:53exact same macbook escape configuration
0:39:56that I guess reordered on day one I
0:39:57ordered
0:39:58and because it was day one there was
0:39:59like a two-week delay or something
0:40:01because I they were all backed up and in
0:40:03the meantime I convinced myself you know
0:40:05whatever I think it's like 2200 hours
0:40:07like 2200 dollars for effectively a
0:40:10souped-up MacBook Air is kind of a lot
0:40:12and I didn't feel good about the value
0:40:14of that and the 15 inch it for bang for
0:40:17the buck the 15 inch is a way better buy
0:40:20than any of the other laptops and so I
0:40:23kind of rash on myself into into a
0:40:2415-inch and I also thought the touch bar
0:40:26would be a bigger deal and I and I
0:40:28should have some experience with it and
0:40:29and it turns out that I in an effort to
0:40:33get the best value for my money I got a
0:40:36computer that was actually not the right
0:40:38computer for me so there's a lesson
0:40:40there somewhere I don't know and the
0:40:42touch bar ended up not really sticking
0:40:44for me so there we go alright 45 minutes
0:40:47into our recording we can finally be
0:40:49done with follow-up told you John it was
0:40:50gonna be a quick one that was a topic
0:40:52come on somebody spent some while on a
0:40:55particular topic but not gonna say Oh
0:40:57Casey oh yeah totally me we are
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0:43:04next move I wanted to cover something
0:43:09before we go to big into the last 48
0:43:13hours worth of announcements there was a
0:43:15little bit of talk but not a lot about
0:43:17the apple shareholder diversity proposal
0:43:21and this always struck me is a little
0:43:24weird and how Apple's handling it is a
0:43:28little weird but if you recall for the
0:43:30last couple of shareholder meetings
0:43:33maybe in several now there's been some
0:43:35sort of um and I don't know the
0:43:37appropriate terminology but there's been
0:43:39a thing that they had to vote on that
0:43:41that shareholders had petitioned Apple
0:43:44for where the the general premise of
0:43:47this particular thing they're voting on
0:43:48is to adopt an accelerated recruitment
0:43:52policy to increase the diversity of
0:43:53senior management and its board of
0:43:54directors that's actually coming off a
0:43:56verge article put the show notes and
0:43:57this has been voted down yet again and I
0:44:01have mixed feelings about this which I
0:44:05probably shouldn't because on the one
0:44:08side I feel like well they have an
0:44:09executive team that everyone but Marco
0:44:11thinks is working okay it seems a little
0:44:15silly to just throw one or more of them
0:44:18out for the sake of diversity but but on
0:44:21the other side of the coin diversity is
0:44:24a good thing I
0:44:25think that having a more diverse
0:44:26executive team might help get rid of
0:44:29some of these issues that we've seen I
0:44:31don't know which one specifically but
0:44:33just a different thing I was gonna say
0:44:35outside the box thinking butts not even
0:44:36outside the box thinking just different
0:44:38thinking could be helpful which to
0:44:40Marco's credit is I think a lot of the
0:44:41point that you were trying to make last
0:44:42week I'm disappointed by this like I'm
0:44:46not entirely surprised that this is the
0:44:48way the the the vote came and I know
0:44:50that Apple was was pushing pretty hard
0:44:53for for shareholders to say no to this
0:44:56but and so I am disappointed I'm not
0:44:59surprised but I'm disappointed and and I
0:45:01kind of wish that apple would say
0:45:02something more directly about their lack
0:45:08of diversity really across the company
0:45:10but particularly amongst executives and
0:45:14yes I'm aware that they've been making
0:45:15this big push for diversity or so they
0:45:17say but I feel like it's not really
0:45:21hitting the upper echelon of Apple and
0:45:24that's that's not a good thing and I
0:45:26guess maybe my conflicting feelings are
0:45:28just about I think it would be good to
0:45:30do what this what this shareholder but
0:45:33whatever is trying to do this just seems
0:45:35like a peculiar way to go about doing it
0:45:38but I guess this is the only way a
0:45:40shareholder can force apples hand I
0:45:41don't know it's I know that's very muddy
0:45:43in gray but do you guys have any
0:45:44thoughts on this oh they're not this
0:45:46thing doesn't ask them to throw out
0:45:47executives like that's not the choice
0:45:49they're making your oh I doubt this
0:45:50proposal and you have to can one of your
0:45:52top executives know they totally don't I
0:45:54think we talked about this the maybe one
0:45:56of the earlier times that it came up and
0:45:58I think the situation is still the same
0:45:59and it boils down to companies don't
0:46:03like being told what to do right so the
0:46:06fact that this is a shareholder proposal
0:46:07and that is coming from the outside and
0:46:09that the shareholders trying to say
0:46:10Apple you should do this specific thing
0:46:12I think just institutionally all
0:46:15corporations are like you're you're not
0:46:17the boss of me you can't like an apples
0:46:20answer is always this weird sort of
0:46:21vaguely hostile mumbo-jumbo to say look
0:46:26we already have we already have our own
0:46:28initiatives about diversity that are
0:46:29actually broader than this very narrow
0:46:31proposal therefore we reject it but
0:46:33every time I look at this thing go I
0:46:34have to think like it's this this is not
0:46:36even actually about of river
0:46:38diversity it is totally about the idea
0:46:41that big companies and especially Apple
0:46:44their default position on every single
0:46:46share over the proposal is no no no no
0:46:49we have board of directors we are the
0:46:51bosses of ourselves even though you
0:46:53technically owned the company are some
0:46:54large portion of the company through
0:46:55your shares or whatever there are not
0:46:57enough of you there is not enough of a
0:46:59coalition to make it worth our while
0:47:01listen to you you cannot tell us what to
0:47:03do and doesn't matter what it's about
0:47:05whether it's about you know a renewable
0:47:08energy or executive compensation or
0:47:11diversity over the years and looking at
0:47:16these type of proposals and seeing all
0:47:17the stories about like just Apple read
0:47:19it apple always advises to reject all of
0:47:22them and it's kind of ashamed of this
0:47:23one is specifically about diversity I'm
0:47:25not sheriff I'm not sure if the proposal
0:47:27it would be better or worse at advancing
0:47:32the cause of diversity with an apple
0:47:33than what Apple is already doing it's
0:47:34difficult to tell because again these
0:47:36are you tend to be very focused and kind
0:47:38of not vindictive but like like come on
0:47:41Apple you gotta whatever you're doing
0:47:43it's taking too long and it is being
0:47:45ineffective so here is a more aggressive
0:47:47thing that may or may not have as much
0:47:51regard for the success of the company
0:47:53overall just saying look at we gotta go
0:47:55off your butt so it could be the most
0:47:57important function of these is to let
0:47:59Apple no and no in certain terms that
0:48:01they're not doing a good enough job
0:48:02right that and that's why enough
0:48:05shareholders got together to make this
0:48:07proposal to vote on Apple's still going
0:48:08to recommend against that Apple still
0:48:09going to think their plan is good but
0:48:11hopefully the message is getting through
0:48:12that whatever it is that you're doing
0:48:14you're not doing it fast enough or well
0:48:16enough but I continue to think that
0:48:18Apple will reject every single one of
0:48:19these proposals are Apple Apple will
0:48:21encourage the rest of the shareholders
0:48:23to reject their mother because these go
0:48:24up for a vote for all the shelves and
0:48:25Apple has a recommendation we think
0:48:27shareholders should vote this down and
0:48:28in the end they tend to because the
0:48:31shareholders of Apple there are you know
0:48:33at a certain point it's a small number
0:48:35of very rich shareholders who are
0:48:37inclined to do with the corporation says
0:48:38versus a much larger number of not quite
0:48:41as with shareholders who are backing
0:48:43this type of proposal so it is kind of a
0:48:46difficult in a comfortable situation but
0:48:49I think Apple Apple should be getting
0:48:51the message
0:48:52Apple needs to change what it's doing
0:48:53even if it continues to reject all its
0:48:56continues to encourage its shareholders
0:48:59of all these down and those challenges
0:49:00continue to do so that's it's just a
0:49:03tough situation and I wish that there
0:49:04was a easy turnkey answer but I just
0:49:07wanted to call attention to that so
0:49:09breaking news just before we recorded in
0:49:13a rare stroke of good luck for ATP it
0:49:16seems that Apple clearly the executives
0:49:18listen to this program because we're
0:49:19getting a new Mac Pro wait nevermind I
0:49:21guess they don't listen but anyway uh
0:49:23yeah they seem to all the Apple
0:49:26executive seem to always want to do
0:49:28apple news on Thursdays which is the day
0:49:31after we record but in a rare stroke of
0:49:33good luck on this evening like an hour
0:49:35or two before we started recording it
0:49:37was announced and I first saw it on
0:49:39TechCrunch my friend of the show Matt
0:49:41Panzer II know that Apple has bought the
0:49:44app and the company that makes it called
0:49:47workflow which if you listen to any of
0:49:50the shows of some of our friends you'll
0:49:53know that people like my curly and
0:49:55Federico vtg for example are huge into
0:49:57workflow I've used it a bunch i really
0:49:59like it i'm nowhere near their level but
0:50:01i do like it and use it and this is a
0:50:05trick just whether or not workflow has a
0:50:08place in your life it is a phenomenally
0:50:13impressive app and basically it's sort
0:50:15of kind of like Automator is on OS 10 or
0:50:19excuse me mac OS that that's not a truly
0:50:22fair analogy but sort of that's kind of
0:50:24thing where you can you have a series of
0:50:26different actions that you can string
0:50:28together also vaguely similar to if this
0:50:30than that and you can string these
0:50:31actions together to do to create
0:50:33workflows and and to do these just
0:50:35unbelievably complex things so Apple has
0:50:38bought workflow and the I guess the
0:50:41three founders of the company are going
0:50:45to be working for apple and that's
0:50:46really really exciting now I'm also
0:50:49hearing breaking news that I haven't yet
0:50:50confirmed that apparently they're
0:50:52already they've already made the app
0:50:54free good but they're already removing
0:50:58chrome support and Street View actions
0:51:01because Apple yeah well actually there
0:51:04might be something else to that okay so
0:51:07so a couple of weeks ago or recently
0:51:09like a week ago so like that I got an
0:51:13email from workflow I don't want to go
0:51:14into too many details because I don't
0:51:17know if they wanted this to be public or
0:51:18not so I'll try to be tasteful here but
0:51:21basically workflow has supported
0:51:23overcast URL scheme for quite some time
0:51:26and I got an email basically with from
0:51:29asking me to sign a legal document that
0:51:34basically says it's okay for them to
0:51:36call my app via its URL schemes
0:51:38something on the lines of like if you
0:51:41want us to continue supporting this in
0:51:43the future please sign this document in
0:51:46my best guess at the time which turn out
0:51:48to be true is that somebody is about to
0:51:51invest a lot of money in them or acquire
0:51:53them and is doing due diligence and
0:51:55somebody's lawyer told the somebody with
0:51:57all the money bind them or investing in
0:51:59them you know they should really sure
0:52:01this up in some kind of legal fashion to
0:52:03make sure that none of the apps that
0:52:04workflow calls via URL schemes would
0:52:08later threaten them in any legal way for
0:52:10using like an undocumented API or using
0:52:13an API without permission or something
0:52:14like that my best guess with the
0:52:18immediate removal of the Google related
0:52:20features is not that Apple is being a
0:52:23jerk to Google but the Google probably
0:52:26just didn't respond and didn't even
0:52:27consider signing this document because
0:52:28like it's a it's it's it was basically a
0:52:31very very simple but still legal
0:52:34contract like document I i I'm not a
0:52:37lawyer I can't tell you exactly what it
0:52:38was but it looks like a very simple
0:52:40contract so you would imagine like
0:52:42emailing Google to say hey sign this
0:52:44contract please we can keep calling you
0:52:45from art from our iOS app like I don't
0:52:48think that's going to be a high priority
0:52:49for Google's legal department to review
0:52:51but they're usually so responsive to
0:52:53people it's so out of character for them
0:52:57exactly so basically I'm guessing that
0:53:01it again this is not some kind of like
0:53:03you know Apple immediately being a jerk
0:53:05to Google because their Google it's
0:53:07probably google didn't feel like it was
0:53:09worth responding to that or hasn't
0:53:11gotten to it yet or legal decided it
0:53:12wasn't worth the the legal implications
0:53:14of it
0:53:15and so you know after the acquisition
0:53:18Apple probably just says all right well
0:53:19this is this is your deadline that
0:53:20anybody just for legal protection
0:53:22reasons for themselves anybody who
0:53:24hasn't signed this document saying you
0:53:25can call their secret api's or URL
0:53:27schemes or whatever you can't do it
0:53:29anymore that's interesting take yeah so
0:53:31the the bigger issue on workflow though
0:53:33is like after saw this acquisition what
0:53:37I immediately felt was I felt bad for
0:53:40fatigue E and Mike and all the other
0:53:43workflow enthusiasts because when apple
0:53:46buys a company that does something like
0:53:48this it can go a couple different ways
0:53:51they can be what they call an aqua hire
0:53:52where the whole point is they're just
0:53:53buying it to get these employees who are
0:53:55proven that they're really really good
0:53:56iOS developers and so we tap or Apple we
0:53:59would love really good iOS developers
0:54:01let's buy the company and now we've got
0:54:03those developers and then the product
0:54:04just gets sunsetted becomes free it
0:54:07hangs out for a while is it's sunset sun
0:54:09sat yeah and then it just goes away
0:54:12other possibilities like what they did
0:54:14with test flight where they buy it and
0:54:16it continues to exist but now as an
0:54:18apple internal thing but here's the deal
0:54:21even in that scenario Apple's priorities
0:54:23are different than the priorities of an
0:54:25independent workflow company even for
0:54:27strategy tax things like even though we
0:54:28this chrome thing is probably not that
0:54:30right but Apple has different priorities
0:54:31different things are important to Apple
0:54:33as the platform owner then they are
0:54:34someone writing an application on the
0:54:36platform so even in the best case
0:54:40workflow is going to change in ways that
0:54:42are better for Apple and probably not
0:54:44better for existing workflow customers
0:54:47it it could change in ways that are
0:54:49better for both because they now work
0:54:51all has access to private api's and
0:54:52notice about the roadmap or whatever
0:54:54workflow itself could be integrated into
0:54:56the next major version of iOS as a core
0:54:58feature of the OS to stop being an
0:55:00independent application or become a
0:55:01bundled application like there are good
0:55:03scenarios but either way it is a
0:55:06disruption to the workflow of all the
0:55:08people who use this application as part
0:55:10of their daily work even if you just
0:55:12have to rejigger all your scripts and
0:55:14change things around so I there there
0:55:17baby it may be a really bad situation
0:55:19for people who love workflow but as
0:55:22someone who has workflow and uses a
0:55:24little bit but don't have my work is not
0:55:27intimately tied into
0:55:28but I think I'm hoping that it is a yet
0:55:33another sign that Apple is trying to do
0:55:36things to make iOS a more powerful
0:55:39platform for people with more demanding
0:55:41needs because I like I don't want to
0:55:45believe that it was purely these guys
0:55:46are good IRS developers get them and
0:55:48have them do something I want to believe
0:55:49it's because they recognize that the
0:55:53people who are using iOS devices in the
0:55:55in the most sophisticated way love
0:55:58workflow and that's something those
0:56:00capabilities should be part of the
0:56:01operating system to make iOS on the iPad
0:56:04or even on the phone for that matter a
0:56:06more capable system so I think overall
0:56:09it's encouraging but for anybody who
0:56:12really really love workflow I think the
0:56:15very near future is either slightly
0:56:17painful or very grim but the longer term
0:56:20future for the platform I think it's
0:56:21better yeah I think that's right i mean
0:56:23the way workflow you know where flow has
0:56:26a lot of different features these days
0:56:28but kind of the core of it and the first
0:56:31part of it before had all these all
0:56:33these new like API related features well
0:56:36is it was just calling URL schemes for
0:56:37apps and using X callback URL and
0:56:41everything else and you know X callback
0:56:43URL i I don't I don't say this to brag I
0:56:47say this as historical context Greg
0:56:51Pearce that I actually invented that
0:56:52that's Greg Pearce is the developer of
0:56:55drafts and and also a couple other apps
0:56:58and one of them is terminology and which
0:57:00is like it's like a fancy dictionary app
0:57:01basically and back in 2010 he contacted
0:57:06me asking like is there a way that we
0:57:08can make Instapaper basically shell out
0:57:11to terminology for its dictionary
0:57:13lookups and we we basically went back
0:57:16and forth over a couple days via email
0:57:18and worked out this URL scheme called x
0:57:21call back and that and you could just it
0:57:24had these parameters and it was
0:57:25basically the first thing i knew of on
0:57:27iOS where there was a defined protocol
0:57:30that you could launch you could sell it
0:57:32to another app VAR URL scheme and give
0:57:33that app a way to call you back when
0:57:35it's done at the time i think both of us
0:57:38look at this as
0:57:40a tremendous hack and and and you know
0:57:44an event and it became big anyway like
0:57:47you know and Greg Greg went and and
0:57:49really kind of took the ball and like
0:57:52and ran with it and made a whole site
0:57:54and directory about X callback URL
0:57:57formally documented this little you know
0:58:00fairly simple URL scheme spec that we
0:58:02had come up with and then made this big
0:58:04directory of all the different apps that
0:58:05used it and document all the URL schemes
0:58:07and naturally what made the the world of
0:58:10x callback URL take off was that big
0:58:13site that he ran and publicizing it and
0:58:14everything else but even back then this
0:58:17is 2010 remember even back then I think
0:58:19both Greg and I looked at it as this is
0:58:22really a temporary need that surely in
0:58:25the future iOS is going to add some
0:58:27better ways of interacting and scripting
0:58:31and things like that like wait other
0:58:33other ways to solve this problem that
0:58:35isn't calling URL schemes in the
0:58:38background and launching apps and then
0:58:39kicking you between different apps and
0:58:41having them all come to the program for
0:58:42a second and kick you back like that is
0:58:44kind of a terrible hack and now you know
0:58:48almost seven years later iOS has added
0:58:52extensions which helped tremendously but
0:58:54only in certain ways like only in the in
0:58:56the extension points and only in the
0:58:57very strict ways those are defined and
0:58:59in the very limited areas that they
0:59:00exist in so extensions help a little but
0:59:04what they need is something bigger and
0:59:07on the Mac they have the entire
0:59:08applescript interface not to mention
0:59:10everything from the UNIX you know system
0:59:13below it all the different scripting and
0:59:14IPC mechanisms that are all over the mac
0:59:17OS like the Mac has it's very well
0:59:18covered but iOS still really doesn't so
0:59:22there is very much a need if if Apple
0:59:26wants to keep pushing iOS into
0:59:27productivity which is especially
0:59:29important for the ipad business i'd say
0:59:31and it sure wouldn't help the icer
0:59:33wouldn't hurt the iphone business either
0:59:35but to keep it happy wants to push
0:59:38people into more productivity use on iOS
0:59:40they need automation systems like this
0:59:43they need mechanisms in in the in the OS
0:59:46itself for apps to communicate with each
0:59:49other automate each other and for users
0:59:52to help
0:59:53you know define write and edit and chain
0:59:56together those automations and and you
0:59:59know again on the mac that have
0:59:59know again on the mac that have
1:00:00while this already have had it for years
1:00:00decades even if I was a user of workflow
1:00:05I would not feel great about the future
1:00:07of that app right now because in any
1:00:09acquisition the future of the app that
1:00:12and this is I think clearly mostly an
1:00:16aqua higher and in like the official you
1:00:19know story to the press I think they
1:00:20said it wasn't but I think it pretty
1:00:22clearly is everyone always says it isn't
1:00:24everyone always says their product going
1:00:26to keep going indefinitely and it's
1:00:27going to be wonderfully a great plan to
1:00:28the future and then it gets you know
1:00:30sunset so I would not depend on this app
1:00:34being there in say a year or two but I
1:00:38do think that there's a good chance that
1:00:40the reason they bought this app and and
1:00:42you know the reason they hired this
1:00:45talented team who's really good at iOS
1:00:47automation probably has something to do
1:00:50with an effort to improve iOS automation
1:00:52at the system level and again I think
1:00:54pretty much everything John side I agree
1:00:57with that I would not expect this app to
1:01:01continue to exist in you know two years
1:01:03say i would bet that you know it's too
1:01:07late probably for iOS 11 but i would bet
1:01:09by iOS 12 or 13 there is something there
1:01:14is some kind of system or new technology
1:01:17in the OS that is better in in some way
1:01:22at automation than URL schemes and
1:01:24things like that which would make say
1:01:26you know seventy percent of workflow
1:01:28unnecessary and Apple would consider
1:01:31that good enough and then they would
1:01:32kill the app I don't know I my first
1:01:36reaction is oh this app is going away
1:01:38immediately and then as I thought more
1:01:41about it I thought you know the most
1:01:44obvious answer to me is what you said
1:01:46marco which is it'll get sucked into iOS
1:01:49maybe in 12 if not 11 but or whatever on
1:01:54now god I'm losing and keep on losing
1:01:55track but anyways it was knocked into
1:01:57some version of a hot yeah thank you
1:01:59it'll get sucked into some version of
1:02:01iOS and then it'll go away and that will
1:02:03be that but then I got thinking about it
1:02:06more and the reason I felt like you
1:02:09would get sucked into iOS is because it
1:02:11feels like this is wrong for Apple to
1:02:12make an appt
1:02:13is so feature-rich and offers so much
1:02:16functionality that isn't part of the OS
1:02:17itself and that very well still could be
1:02:19but then I got to thinking about like
1:02:21iMovie or garage band or you know some
1:02:26of these other apps like that and it
1:02:28occurred to me that you know those are
1:02:30pretty full featured apps and yeah it's
1:02:32less of a system-level thing like the
1:02:34the problem domain i think is a little
1:02:35more bounded but they're really really
1:02:39big complex kind of intense apps that
1:02:43are apple-branded but are downloaded
1:02:47optionally from the App Store and so
1:02:49this may not be any different I'm
1:02:51disappointed by but like you said Marco
1:02:54maybe it's for good reason that that
1:02:55some of the third party stuff is already
1:02:58getting neutered but nevertheless I'm
1:03:01pretty optimistic about this probably in
1:03:03part because I don't rely on it to get
1:03:05my job done but I'm pretty optimistic
1:03:07about this because it's kind of a
1:03:09win-win right either a lot of this
1:03:10functionality gets built into iOS makes
1:03:12iOS more powerful or if it's if it's
1:03:14kept in some vague form like it is today
1:03:18well it's a great darn app and so that's
1:03:21a win too so I'm I'm very tentatively
1:03:24optimistic about this well the other
1:03:26thing that that people that workflow
1:03:28users I think should find somewhat
1:03:29comforting is that most of the app you
1:03:33know it's not doing things that only
1:03:34these developers and only this app could
1:03:37do it's doing things that are possible
1:03:40for anyone else to step in and recreate
1:03:43with a new app I don't say this to
1:03:44insult the app or or to say that it was
1:03:46easy to make but that it is bit is a
1:03:49combination of things that each one of
1:03:51which is fairly easy and so I wish like
1:03:54most apps honestly but but the point is
1:03:58like if workflow disappears if it shuts
1:04:01down or it it is made to suck in a way
1:04:04that people find intolerable there will
1:04:07be a new one someone else will make a
1:04:09new one it might take a few months but
1:04:11someone else will make a new one because
1:04:12there's clearly a market demand for it
1:04:14there and and these are high-end you
1:04:16know technical and and very devoted
1:04:19users if workflow disappears there's
1:04:22going to immediately be a not massive
1:04:26but very passionate
1:04:27very desperate market who would probably
1:04:30pay like 10 15 20 bucks for an iOS app
1:04:33to replace it so I wouldn't worry too
1:04:36much about that unless Apple actually
1:04:37starts prohibiting apps that are like
1:04:39this which would be possible that is
1:04:42certainly a risk I wouldn't say it's
1:04:44incredibly likely but it's it's
1:04:45certainly a risk but anyway basically
1:04:48workflow people there might be some
1:04:51disruption I don't mean that in the tech
1:04:54guy sense I mean that in the literal
1:04:56meaning of the word there might be some
1:04:58disruption to your workflows I'm sorry
1:05:01but god this is terrible phrase in this
1:05:05market but I think in the long run
1:05:07you'll be okay so we brought up test
1:05:09flight already which is I think one of
1:05:11the most best example of an application
1:05:16that was bought and contented and change
1:05:18the icon today the test flight continues
1:05:20to be called test flight yeah as a
1:05:24separate application and Apple uses it
1:05:26for the purpose the test flight was
1:05:27created so it's like it survived the
1:05:29acquisition right and then of course
1:05:31your applications that totally go away
1:05:33or become free and disappear serenity
1:05:35call will just point on Twitter that
1:05:36Siri Siri was an independent company
1:05:38about the people you know like same
1:05:40thing if they had an application on the
1:05:42store and it went free when it got
1:05:43bought back in 2010 but eventually it
1:05:44got rolled into the OS so that's another
1:05:47possibility for this is that you know we
1:05:48hope that this what this means is that
1:05:51Apple wants to make automation better on
1:05:53iOS like it's that seems clear like why
1:05:55you know in some fashion whether you're
1:05:57just gonna have these people do a new
1:05:58thing or you're going to incorporate
1:05:59that but you could have workflow
1:06:01appearing as an apple application with a
1:06:03different icon perhaps bundled with the
1:06:05OS perhaps free downloadable you know as
1:06:08an apple-branded thing until the big new
1:06:13we have big improvements automation come
1:06:15in iOS 12 or something so it could be
1:06:18the application like becomes part of the
1:06:21OS in terms of it's still called work
1:06:25floats still more or less works the same
1:06:26maybe gets a new coat of paint and while
1:06:28that sits there doing its thing those
1:06:31people who made that application are
1:06:32working on the next big thing in terms
1:06:35of automating workflows maybe
1:06:37incorporate maybe you know working in
1:06:40conjunction with whatever
1:06:41possible multitasking improvements they
1:06:43may be coming anti OS that will see the
1:06:45summer or whatever so there are a lot of
1:06:47possibilities and I see all of them
1:06:48point towards to me anyway automation
1:06:51becoming better on the mac but it's
1:06:54really especially with the portability
1:06:55like will my workflow sport over to the
1:06:57new Apple one will the my workflows
1:06:59carry over to the new world of
1:07:01automation that's going to happen in iOS
1:07:0312 who knows but I think I think these
1:07:04are going in the right direction even
1:07:05though it might be a little painful
1:07:06short term I did you mean iOS there you
1:07:08said the Mac yeah yeah I know I got Mac
1:07:10on the brain yep you know just replace
1:07:12what I said but the words you know that
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1:09:11alright so there was yesterday and we've
1:09:17made several references to this already
1:09:20in this episode yesterday there was an
1:09:23announcement or series of announcements
1:09:24of new apple products and so I'm going
1:09:27to try to run through just a very high
1:09:29level each of them and then we'll step
1:09:31in and do a deeper dive through each of
1:09:32them after that so there's now a red
1:09:34iphone 7 it is a product red which means
1:09:38some subset of this money is donated
1:09:40towards some aids research etc etc
1:09:43except in China except in China which
1:09:46we'll get to in a minute well I think
1:09:47they actually got clarification on that
1:09:49I think cook gave some statement to
1:09:51somebody somewhere saying that actually
1:09:53yes a portion of the proceeds are also
1:09:54being donated from china sales I think
1:09:56it just doesn't brand it as such Oh
1:09:58interesting that makes you feel a little
1:09:59better there's a new there there a
1:10:02couple of new iphone SE storage sizes as
1:10:04far as anyone can tell the internals are
1:10:06otherwise identical but the SE no longer
1:10:10has the 16 gig option which means that
1:10:12there are no more 16 gig iOS devices
1:10:15John siracusa how happy are you right
1:10:16now I should have looked up the timeline
1:10:19so this like how long do we have to wait
1:10:21from the first introduction of 16 gig to
1:10:23it disappearing it's taken long enough
1:10:25but I'm glad it's happened although and
1:10:27Apple always manages to frustrate me
1:10:30with the sizes because they changed it
1:10:32now what is the SE comes in 32 and 128
1:10:34sounds like boy 664 seems like the
1:10:37perfect size but nope nope you got a pic
1:10:3932 which at this point it doesn't feel
1:10:41small 16 obviously 32 is great right
1:10:43it's been pretty huge you know kudos to
1:10:45getting rid of the 16 gigabyte finally
1:10:47but for me personally like I'm really
1:10:50well 64 if I was recommending it for
1:10:53somebody i would say well 32 will be
1:10:54fine right and 128 is probably too much
1:10:5664 would be great but now they just
1:10:58skipped that size so I mean that's this
1:11:01part of this ready like they want you to
1:11:02step up they want you to pay the premium
1:11:04that you pay for the larger size but I'm
1:11:06glad 32 is no longer ridiculously
1:11:09painfully way too small so thank
1:11:12goodness right there is a new 9.7 inch
1:11:15iPad everything that's old is new again
1:11:18we've gone from ipad ipad 2 or something
1:11:21like that i forget the timeline but it's
1:11:23ridiculous right to display to ipad air
1:11:26and blah blah blah blah blah but a fret
1:11:28ipad 4th generation and ipad air 2 so
1:11:32this the like 7th ipad is called the
1:11:34ipad 5th generation yeah remember the
1:11:37new idea yes that was originally for the
1:11:40ipad 3 yep they're just called the new
1:11:42ipad yeah anyway this this new ipad is
1:11:45is the basic spec bump and price drop
1:11:48which would be boring i think if it
1:11:50wasn't seemingly so rare these days
1:11:52because you either get a spec bump with
1:11:55a price increase or it just something
1:11:58just lingers on but this is like the old
1:12:00style it's like we make it faster
1:12:01because new stuff is available and it's
1:12:04not it's like the middle of the road
1:12:05product so we can actually make it a
1:12:06little bit cheaper because there's just
1:12:08not much in there and it's not getting
1:12:10the top of the top-of-the-line
1:12:11system-on-a-chip it's getting a better
1:12:14one so I think this this 9 17 inch iPad
1:12:17has become more attractive to people who
1:12:20would otherwise by you know who are
1:12:24shopping for a full-size iPad but don't
1:12:26need an ipad pro especially the
1:12:27education because they've they've
1:12:28brought it down below the magic three
1:12:30hundred dollar mark so it's it's 299 for
1:12:32education buyers and it's it's thicker
1:12:36than the one that it replaces presume
1:12:39he's got a little bit more battery the
1:12:40system on a chip is faster but not as
1:12:42fast as it could be so it looks like a
1:12:45good middle aerobic iPad yeah it's act
1:12:47so when when this was first announced I
1:12:49was kind of puzzled on like you know
1:12:50it's kind of weak but if for some reason
1:12:53I had miss parsed the price in my head
1:12:56as for 29 and actually 329 and and I and
1:13:00that's actually that's a bigger deal on
1:13:02the price point than I originally
1:13:03thought and and it's you know as we get
1:13:06more you know detail on it it's it seems
1:13:08like you know it's kind of arguable
1:13:10whether it's a whether it's like a speck
1:13:12bumped air to or whether it's more of a
1:13:15cut-down 9.7 pro it's kind of in the
1:13:17middle really with with some cut with
1:13:20some new ways to cut the price
1:13:22down like you know it only has the the
1:13:25two speakers I like the like the older
1:13:28iPads it does not have the laminated
1:13:31screen like it like the when the pros
1:13:34came out they came with this really nice
1:13:36beautiful laminated screen where there's
1:13:38no there's like a smaller or basically
1:13:40zero screen gap like between the glass
1:13:42and the screen and all the all the you
1:13:45know at the iphone did this a couple
1:13:46couple versions back to and the ipad
1:13:48finally did it i think with the nine
1:13:50point seven pro if not the heir to and
1:13:52anyway so this one has the old-style
1:13:54screamer there's like that gap there
1:13:55like it's kind of a visible gap between
1:13:58the glass and the screen so there's
1:13:59there's things like that where it's cut
1:14:01down and it lacks all the all the pro
1:14:03you know the quote ipad pro feature so
1:14:06does not have pencil support it doesn't
1:14:07have doesn't have a smart connector but
1:14:09for a lot of ipad buyers that's pretty
1:14:13great I you know for 329 it's an amazing
1:14:18value it compared to the rest of the
1:14:19lineup whether you think it's an amazing
1:14:21value compared to other tablets like
1:14:23from amazon or other android weirdos
1:14:25that's up to you it probably isn't but
1:14:28oh well I don't think Apple cares but
1:14:30compared to other iPads it's a fantastic
1:14:33value for the money and you know as long
1:14:36as you don't need any of those Pro
1:14:37features but I think if you're willing
1:14:39to like drop 160 bucks on a keyboard you
1:14:42probably aren't that price sensitive
1:14:43about the purchase price of the initial
1:14:45iPad it's obviously being targeted
1:14:48strongly at educational buyers but I
1:14:51think it'll also just be a really good
1:14:52entry-level iPad I think that's going to
1:14:55be you know they're probably going to
1:14:57sell a lot of these things just like and
1:14:59and the fact they that it has fairly
1:15:01modern internals is really nice sermon
1:15:04from a user perspective from a developer
1:15:06perspective it's really really nice I
1:15:08mean to me the oh and also I wanted to
1:15:10point out Stephen Hackett wrote a
1:15:12wonderful article on 512 pixels citing
1:15:16the interesting marketing copy
1:15:18differences between the way Apple brands
1:15:21this new cheaper iPad versus the way
1:15:23they brand that I'm point 7 pro and this
1:15:25new cheap one is all about fun it's like
1:15:27you know casual fun and games and the
1:15:29pros like this is your new supercomputer
1:15:31it's like totally different marketing
1:15:33guidelines but I think that makes sense
1:15:35for how
1:15:36they're targeting it the only major
1:15:37question I have about it is it kind of
1:15:41leaves the ipad mini in a weird spot
1:15:43because the they also discontinued the
1:15:45old mini so now there's only one iPad
1:15:48Mini available it's more expensive than
1:15:50this it's it's the it's the four hundred
1:15:52dollar mini for 128 gig and so this to
1:15:58me kind of looks like this is their
1:16:00gradual way of maybe killing the mini I
1:16:03don't know but short like this this new
1:16:069.7 is now I think better than better
1:16:11than that mini in most ways and this is
1:16:14clearly their new entry-level ipad so i
1:16:17don't i don't think the mini has a lot
1:16:19of places to go anymore but i don't know
1:16:21I've never been a big fan of the mini
1:16:24and if it's not going to be cheaper than
1:16:25this than I don't know why anyone would
1:16:28be into it unless they really love that
1:16:29size but I mean in all fairness they do
1:16:31still sell the ipod touch I'm gonna side
1:16:34by the way there is actually one 16
1:16:36gigabyte model out the ipod touch which
1:16:38everyone forgets exists is thing though
1:16:39even at all markets it exists it almost
1:16:42doesn't count but hey you know what you
1:16:44can get the ipod touch and you can get
1:16:45it in 16 32 64 and 128 no gaps no 256
1:16:49model but whatever so but for this for
1:16:53this ipad this I think is what one of
1:16:55the things that we would be on the show
1:16:58at least would probably love it if Apple
1:17:00did with this a laptop or desktop line
1:17:02which is take a middle-of-the-road model
1:17:04and make it cheaper and thicker like
1:17:08trade like I bring the price down you
1:17:11know make something that is you know
1:17:13make it more powerful bring the price
1:17:15down by sacrificing like the nice to
1:17:19haves the laminated screen the couple of
1:17:21millimetres of thickness there's a
1:17:24little bit of extra weight in exchange
1:17:25for like in this class like do you need
1:17:28the fanciest most laminated screen do
1:17:30you need true tone wouldn't you just
1:17:32rather have a machine that is like a
1:17:34hundred bucks cheaper but also pretty
1:17:36darn fast and sacrifice like a
1:17:38millimeter of thickness yes like that's
1:17:40what a middle the road mouth should be
1:17:41it makes the expensive one look like
1:17:44what am I getting for money you're
1:17:45getting fancier crap right it is
1:17:47actually faster it's nicer it's it's
1:17:49got the laminated screen on it it's got
1:17:51the smarts connector or whatever you see
1:17:52what you're paying for their but it is a
1:17:55thing that gets bumped and doesn't just
1:17:56you know it's not like the iPad to that
1:17:58stays the same and it's just like super
1:17:59crappy and you feel like you're getting
1:18:00a terrible model um and the fact that
1:18:02they made this thicker like I think
1:18:03that's great that's exactly what we're
1:18:04looking for please make those trade-offs
1:18:06in the middle models to make a machine
1:18:09that has better it gives people better
1:18:10value for the money and so I'm
1:18:12encouraged with us and I think someone
1:18:14pointed out that the the ipad line is
1:18:15now much simplified over its previous
1:18:18thing now we have to ipad pros one of
1:18:20which is a little creaky we'll talk
1:18:21about later to iPad pro is that they
1:18:23going in the small one and then you have
1:18:24two other iPads which are not pro is the
1:18:26big one in the small and and it's weird
1:18:27that the mini is called like the ipad
1:18:29mini 4 and i agree that it's a weird
1:18:32product in it with a rear price and
1:18:33maybe it will go away or maybe it itself
1:18:35will get bumped in the same way
1:18:36inevitable there will be a faster mini
1:18:38for that is cheaper and that sacrifices
1:18:41i don't know what you could sacrifice
1:18:42what's left sacrificing on the mini i
1:18:44don't know but overall i think this was
1:18:47a good announcement and especially
1:18:48especially for education i think they
1:18:50need to drive it down farther for that
1:18:52purpose is like kind of like the ipad 2
1:18:53was in the end of its life when it was
1:18:55just so incredibly behind the times that
1:18:57they could probably sell to education
1:18:59for much less money but anyway thumbs up
1:19:01so continuing with the summary and then
1:19:04we'll come back and talk about each one
1:19:05individually like i said there are not
1:19:08that's not happening i was on board with
1:19:11that plan but i did see i did like the
1:19:13fact that we still be cruise through the
1:19:15the red iphone on the SE in appropriate
1:19:18with appropriate speed we don't need to
1:19:19circle back to them it's red it looks
1:19:21cool it's nice yeah so i guess since
1:19:24we're talking about this now sorry Casey
1:19:25oh my god the you deserve this for all
1:19:29your follow-up complaints yeah yeah the
1:19:31red iphone it's nice that it's product
1:19:34red this is you know the in you know as
1:19:36you mentioned about the charitable
1:19:38donation part of this it is nice they
1:19:40finally for the very first time brought
1:19:42that to their most profitable product
1:19:45the iphone like I guess maybe back in
1:19:46the ipod days it might have been but but
1:19:48anyway it's been a while you know you'll
1:19:50be able to get red stuff from Apple you
1:19:53know the right ipod touch has been there
1:19:55for a while which by the way looks a lot
1:19:56like the new read the you know that you
1:20:00had like the product red watchbands
1:20:02stuff like that
1:20:03it's really nice to be able to finally
1:20:05get on the iphone I hope you know for
1:20:07when basically before the before we saw
1:20:10the seven and there were some rumors of
1:20:12new colors I believe I made some comment
1:20:14back then about how like I would love
1:20:16for them to replace all of the like old
1:20:18metal colors like the silver space grey
1:20:21gold rose gold I would like you know
1:20:23those all I think look stale to me now
1:20:25like all four of those I would say look
1:20:27fairly overdone and dated these days I
1:20:31and most of the products especially the
1:20:32iphone so to have new colors is very
1:20:35very welcome I was you know this and I
1:20:38think this phone looks great I do think
1:20:40it looks a little bit like the old ipod
1:20:41touch and a little too uncomfortable
1:20:43degree and and i agree with with mike's
1:20:46complained that it should definitely
1:20:48have a red circle around the touch ID
1:20:50button because all the other phones have
1:20:52metal color matching circles so there's
1:20:55also have a black front i do not like
1:20:57white-fronted phones I don't like white
1:21:00fronts of the things but a lot of people
1:21:02do so like it if they're not going to
1:21:04make it in two colors like hey here's a
1:21:06red back in a black front and I read a
1:21:07black and a white front like they have
1:21:09to pick one of them and it's just a
1:21:10personal taste thing honestly I think
1:21:11the white front looks really good i
1:21:13would never want to own it for the
1:21:15reasons I've talked to him before by
1:21:16putting some reflective white surface
1:21:17Nexus screen just makes you screen look
1:21:19the engineer because it can never
1:21:20compare to the sun shining off a white
1:21:22thing like I think it's a I don't want
1:21:23it and but it's totally personal
1:21:25preference i think it looks I think it
1:21:27looks really it looks like a Christmas
1:21:28phone looks like a piece of candy people
1:21:31say it in like a bad way like oh this
1:21:32looks like the ipod touches the ipod
1:21:34touches look cool I and you know and
1:21:36because this is entirely a fashion thing
1:21:38and a taste thing I I have no complaints
1:21:41about the white front despite the fact
1:21:43that I would never ever ever buy one
1:21:44because you know they make phones that
1:21:47some people are gonna like it looks
1:21:48that's why they make them in different
1:21:49colors all point of different calls you
1:21:50know like this color pick a different
1:21:51color and I love the fact that now there
1:21:54was a color that is not silver black or
1:21:57some tint thereof like it is a bold
1:21:58color for a phone and last time you saw
1:22:00that was like the 5c I guess which I
1:22:02thought were also really fun well I i
1:22:04would say jet black was and it was a
1:22:06bold color of that scale like it wasn't
1:22:08it wasn't expected you can get any bold
1:22:10color as long it's black ya know like
1:22:12like it wasn't it wasn't like something
1:22:14I would have predicted or expected
1:22:16good and ended up being but i would say
1:22:18jet-black is is one of those like game
1:22:21changer colors that really did really
1:22:22did feel new and awesome that being said
1:22:25I do wish this was like you know jet red
1:22:28like I wish it had the finish of the jet
1:22:30black like the tacky because it would
1:22:32increase grip and everything and and I
1:22:34think it might look a little bit more
1:22:35modern because again i don't think i
1:22:37would like more like the 5c which was
1:22:38also very glossy and colored yeah but
1:22:40look you know more saturated and newer
1:22:42and you know thinner and everything else
1:22:44I think that would help but not look
1:22:46like an old ipod touch but I do think
1:22:48this is overall very nice looking phone
1:22:50the the timing is interesting of it
1:22:53being mid-cycle this is about this is
1:22:56about when they launched the the SE last
1:22:58year right this is you know the cynical
1:23:01take on this is this is a nice way for
1:23:03them to boost sales in a very slow
1:23:05traditionally quarter you know that it's
1:23:07a nice way for them to boost sales on
1:23:08their most profitable product line i
1:23:10wish i did this more often like who
1:23:12would complain if they if they treated
1:23:13the phone back like watchband it's like
1:23:15go out the year every couple months came
1:23:17out with different colors of phones
1:23:18because it i mean it's you know it gives
1:23:21them the freedom to have lots of
1:23:22different ideas and honestly does get
1:23:24people more excited because phones are
1:23:25very much faster and accessories and if
1:23:28you can come up with different colors
1:23:29and different parts of the year people
1:23:30like it does renew your interesting
1:23:32getting the phones especially if you see
1:23:34the phones and you're like I don't know
1:23:36if I need a new phone I'm not sure I
1:23:37like all these new colors especially if
1:23:38it the same as last year where it's like
1:23:40gold rose gold and maybe you don't like
1:23:42the jet black or whatever if you knew
1:23:44you could wait three months and they
1:23:45would be like you know a teal one or a
1:23:47purple one or a yellow one I mean I
1:23:49still see five Cs that are white now
1:23:50like that's a cool looking phone right
1:23:52it you know if it's fashion and the
1:23:56watch is certainly are and the phone is
1:23:57at this point too by all means do this
1:23:59as many times as you want Apple I think
1:24:01it's think it's great yeah also by the
1:24:03way I think a jet white phone like with
1:24:04the same finish but in white that would
1:24:06look amazing oh yeah but yeah how are
1:24:08you allowed to say that and I'm sitting
1:24:10here quiet you're thinking it's a jet
1:24:13white phone with a black front on it tho
1:24:14i guess but that's true well i think
1:24:17that would look better yeah i agree with
1:24:18you i think the red with the white front
1:24:20i think that does look better even
1:24:21though i agree also that i wouldn't want
1:24:23the white front but i think a black back
1:24:25or I mean a white bag I think would only
1:24:27look good with a black front
1:24:29anyway there's a storm trooper phone
1:24:31yeah exactly anyway uh Michael Harmon
1:24:34and I want to wait found that god you're
1:24:37killing me as big as it's a pleasing
1:24:39shape so it does look good in white oh
1:24:40oh my god what do I do to deserve this I
1:24:44just try to keep you two in lines that
1:24:45deserve that's just that this is a
1:24:47foundational theory of white car is if
1:24:49we not gone over this no we have we had
1:24:51think we started with this I think we
1:24:54did yeah so anyway I hope I hope you
1:24:57know I would just love to see more color
1:25:00and apples line in general so angry so I
1:25:03hope they keep this up you know this is
1:25:05great I don't really I'm not going to
1:25:07you know go trade in my you know still
1:25:09perfectly fine working iphone 7 that's
1:25:12halfway through its cycle for this but
1:25:15if I were buying new today I'd seriously
1:25:17consider it although I Sultanate Lee I
1:25:19still want the grip of the jet black
1:25:20finish so i would probably slow side
1:25:22against it but give me jet red and jet
1:25:25white and we'll talk but anyway i hope
1:25:28this fall when presumably new iphones
1:25:31come out again all those it's hard to
1:25:33say with that but when things will come
1:25:34out but presumably this fall i hope they
1:25:38continue with even with the new products
1:25:40to offer cool new colors yeah I would
1:25:43agree with that I really liked the look
1:25:45at this I really do wish it was a black
1:25:47front there's something to be said for
1:25:49white perhaps being a better match but
1:25:52the back of this does look awesome and
1:25:55they've also released a couple of new
1:25:58colors for iphone cases and i believe
1:26:01was sapphire on screen anyway looked
1:26:03really nice haven't seen it in person
1:26:05and they've also released a bunch of
1:26:06watch bands which largely matched the
1:26:10case colors they've also started selling
1:26:13nike+ bands separately which if you want
1:26:16something that is for the most part
1:26:19visually extremely loud power to you i
1:26:22guess and now you can buy the band as a
1:26:24sport band having all those holes in it
1:26:26is really nice for ventilation because
1:26:27the regular support band is pretty
1:26:28sweaty because it just you know that's
1:26:30solid surface that does not breathe it
1:26:32all so the nike bands actually are nicer
1:26:35for sport use for any kind of you know
1:26:37if you're going to be hot and sweaty if
1:26:39they are way nicer because they have
1:26:41those holes my wife picked that when she
1:26:42bought her watch
1:26:43she bought the nike plus one and i think
1:26:45in part because of the way she didn't
1:26:46get like the neon one but the holes and
1:26:48she's she likes it yeah like you know it
1:26:50does look like some kind of crazy alien
1:26:52creature but it is highly functional but
1:26:56anyway one more thing before we get off
1:26:57the phone the red phone one at one angle
1:27:00I think might be interesting to consider
1:27:01or I guess we'll see is like so there's
1:27:05two there's two cynical takes and this
1:27:06one I mentioned you know to boost sales
1:27:08in a slow quarter the second is will
1:27:12they release a product red phone with
1:27:14the charitable donation portion of its
1:27:16profits during the peak season in the
1:27:18holidays like will will the will they
1:27:21release it on day one basically for the
1:27:23next phone because that could cost them
1:27:25more money in donations that's the kind
1:27:28of thing that I hope they would say you
1:27:29know it's worth it and knowing Tim Cook
1:27:31I think they probably would he you know
1:27:33Jim cook he cares a lot about like
1:27:36charitable causes and things that are
1:27:38good for the world and for people's
1:27:39health and everything else so I can see
1:27:41him saying you know what screw it we'll
1:27:43take the hit but it's so much money at
1:27:46that scale at during the peak order that
1:27:48it's it might be a tricky balance it did
1:27:52back in the day they they did introduce
1:27:54several iPods at the time when the ipod
1:27:56was still very important product that
1:27:58when a new line came out he would come
1:28:00with the product red one like there was
1:28:01no delay like what you're talking about
1:28:02here are the new ipod nanos and you can
1:28:04get by these five colors plus product
1:28:06red that happened routinely i know is my
1:28:07fought plot of the red ones because they
1:28:09were cool neighbor red so i totally
1:28:11think they'll do it i think it's just a
1:28:14question of like manufacturing ramps and
1:28:16how many different colors they can
1:28:18handle and being able to deal with
1:28:20multiple skews and the color variant
1:28:22like we always have problems with that
1:28:23like an era how well they try to predict
1:28:26what the color mix will be there always
1:28:27off by a little bit and it scales they
1:28:28do it makes you frustrated they got like
1:28:30look for a jet black one or remember
1:28:32when people couldn't find the gold
1:28:33phones for the very first gold one it's
1:28:35difficult so I feel like if they don't
1:28:36do it it will mostly be for inventory
1:28:39control reasons clips for iOS a
1:28:42forthcoming app that will how are they
1:28:46pitching this it will basically let you
1:28:49make little videos and I think it's
1:28:53apple.com / clips what a link in the
1:28:56show notes it's like snapchat for olds
1:28:57it's not but it's not like snapshot know
1:28:59this too many people who have who have
1:29:03heard from Apple about this topic this
1:29:05appears to be surprisingly to you know
1:29:08we were all looking at the announcement
1:29:09yesterday surprisingly perhaps the most
1:29:11important announcement from Apple's
1:29:13perspective of all the things we just
1:29:14listed even though it is software not
1:29:16hardware and even though it seems like
1:29:18great you made an app that we can make
1:29:21videos with unlike snapchat and
1:29:23Instagram and all these other
1:29:25applications that people use to take
1:29:26videos of themselves and put words over
1:29:28those videos and six stickers on their
1:29:30faces and do all the other stuff that
1:29:31they do this is not a ping version 2
1:29:35point 0 this is not an apple social
1:29:36network this is not a way for you to
1:29:38share videos for people this is a video
1:29:40production tool this is a way for you to
1:29:42make impressive looking videos that you
1:29:45then shove on to all those social
1:29:47networks run by companies that are not
1:29:49Apple and it's leveraging Apple
1:29:51strengths we know how to make nice
1:29:53looking video transition effects we know
1:29:55how to take video and incorporate other
1:29:57elements in the video we know how to let
1:29:59you somehow edit video with your fingers
1:30:01on this tiny little phone screen we can
1:30:03help you in the same way that I movie
1:30:05helped you make like family movies that
1:30:07looked a hundred times better than the
1:30:09family movies they were cut together and
1:30:11edited on someone's mini DV camcorder
1:30:14like literally on the camcorder like you
1:30:16can you use your mac to do it you got
1:30:17these amazing transitions and effects
1:30:19and things that are previously only
1:30:20available and professional software you
1:30:21know like you made that yourself even if
1:30:23you just use one of the stinkin
1:30:24templates or keynote made you let people
1:30:26make tasteful presentations it didn't
1:30:28look like they were made in PowerPoint
1:30:29because they weren't like just by
1:30:30providing good tools and templates
1:30:32that's what this seems to be a very well
1:30:34done application for video production
1:30:37whose output is targeting all those
1:30:41services that people use to share video
1:30:42of themselves yeah I think it looks
1:30:45really good like I this is this is
1:30:48trying to tie together like three or
1:30:50four different worlds none of which I
1:30:53really understand or participate in very
1:30:55much so it's hard for me to have a smart
1:30:57take on how it will do but how it looks
1:30:59on this page it looks good and I'm going
1:31:01to play with it you do participate in it
1:31:04because i watch videos of you on these
1:31:05services often
1:31:06taken by your wife I mean you do you do
1:31:09periscope a lot that is one of these
1:31:10services I know it's not like a
1:31:11pre-produced thing where you put stuff
1:31:13on but it is like hey I want to take
1:31:15some spur-of-the-moment video that
1:31:18immediately gets shared with people onto
1:31:19a social network type of thing and it is
1:31:22is perhaps the least invasive where
1:31:24they're not putting little stickers over
1:31:26your head or writing words on the screen
1:31:27but you know for Instagram I follow
1:31:29people who post daily Instagram stories
1:31:32or whatever they're called where it's
1:31:33just a series of small clips with some
1:31:35text occasionally over it or some audio
1:31:38and I got to tell you of all those
1:31:40things that look at they look pretty
1:31:41rough and if someone could use in it you
1:31:43know it's a question of like do people
1:31:44care enough about the quality to go into
1:31:46an external app and like you know hit
1:31:48the share button and share the Instagram
1:31:49versus doing it from within the
1:31:50instagram app but this this should be
1:31:53Apple strength in the same way that I
1:31:55movie was a you know demonstrated Apple
1:31:57strengthened back in the day I photo
1:31:59used to less now they make good software
1:32:03for dealing with media and they're able
1:32:05to do it even on the phone to leverage
1:32:08all the hardware they have there that
1:32:10makes it like a you know a little
1:32:11magical video production studio to make
1:32:13clever wit and was one of the things
1:32:15they were saying there was clever says
1:32:16it is facial recognition to know who's
1:32:17in the video matches up with your
1:32:19contact photos to say oh it looks like
1:32:21in this video of these three people if
1:32:23you want to share with them here are
1:32:24their faces it does dictation for the
1:32:26text so you don't have to type it in and
1:32:27supposedly like when you dictate the
1:32:29text if you dictate the test the text
1:32:31with a certain cadence it will appear on
1:32:33the screen with that cadence so you can
1:32:36you know basically by speaking in a
1:32:37certain manner make text appear in a way
1:32:41that emphasizes the point of your video
1:32:43as opposed to trying to time that with
1:32:44like a bunch of curves you know and I
1:32:46could be like lots and lots of clever
1:32:48touches so what regular people do things
1:32:50that are much more interesting I think
1:32:51it will probably create a middle-tier
1:32:54class of produced videos in the same way
1:32:57that they were like professional people
1:32:59producing vines presumably using like I
1:33:01don't know if I even let you do this but
1:33:02some it you know for other other types
1:33:04of services where it's clear that there
1:33:06is a group of people using tools way
1:33:08more sophisticated than our available on
1:33:10the social services native app to
1:33:12nevertheless share that video on that
1:33:14app so like they would make a video like
1:33:15an final cut basically with a bunch of
1:33:17cool effects and everything and trim it
1:33:18down and share it on a social network
1:33:20the same way that I take pictures with
1:33:21my fancy camera and put them Instagram
1:33:23and some people get cranky because like
1:33:24it's only supposed to be pictures you
1:33:25take with your phone like that's not how
1:33:26I'm using Instagram I would imagine
1:33:28there are people who are sharing things
1:33:30through social services that are made
1:33:32with very complicated tools but not
1:33:34everyone can do that so this is like an
1:33:35in-between thing you have you could use
1:33:38the built-in tools for the sharing
1:33:39services and make an okay video you go
1:33:41one step back which is just a separate
1:33:43application that's also on your phone
1:33:44and still pretty darn easy to use but
1:33:46you get a nicer result and then the
1:33:48final one is you know use Final Cut the
1:33:49pro to spend a week making this amazing
1:33:51video that you hope will go viral and
1:33:52you know dude do it anyway there's a
1:33:56there's a video on the apple.com / clips
1:34:00and the the section is called say it see
1:34:03it and there's a little video of a
1:34:04gentleman who is saying how to tie a bow
1:34:06tie and you see the words pop on screen
1:34:08just like you were describing John it
1:34:09looks really clever I don't I have a
1:34:12snapchat account I only ever use it to
1:34:15send or receive pictures with Aaron and
1:34:18Declan so often times when he wakes up
1:34:19from nap she'll go in there and like
1:34:21take a goofy picture with one of the
1:34:22goofy filters and I gotta say it is
1:34:24actually quite delightful I don't have
1:34:26the faintest idea how to use the actual
1:34:28features of snapchat that you're
1:34:29supposed to be using because I'm old I
1:34:32do like Instagram stories I don't find
1:34:34myself doing it very often because my
1:34:36day is usually pretty boring but I think
1:34:39they're super cool and I like that the
1:34:41features they've added and so this to me
1:34:43I think Marco I know you were being
1:34:45snarky but I think you're right to some
1:34:47degree to a small degree I do think this
1:34:49is snapchat for old people but I'm
1:34:51really amped about this I think this is
1:34:52going to be super neat to play with and
1:34:54it may be that i play with it twice
1:34:55never use it again but i really think
1:34:58this is apple firing on all cylinders in
1:35:01theory anyway we'll see what it when
1:35:02it's released but it's embracing all the
1:35:05stuff they're good at just like you guys
1:35:06said in and ignoring the stuff they're
1:35:08not so rather than making another paying
1:35:09they're just using this to create
1:35:11content and then pushing it to the
1:35:13places where you want that content to be
1:35:15which is awesome and a lot of really
1:35:17nice little touches on here like the oh
1:35:19you have Aaron in this video do you want
1:35:21to send it to early this all sounds
1:35:23really really cool and I'm really
1:35:24looking forward to playing with it i'm
1:35:26not entirely sure why it was announced
1:35:28today like i'm not sure what that really
1:35:30buys them because it's almost done I
1:35:33guess but Lexi
1:35:34that's the thing though like like what
1:35:35they did all these announcements via
1:35:38this barrage of press releases but after
1:35:41these announcements were over and
1:35:43throughout the entire day yesterday when
1:35:44they're getting all this press you still
1:35:46can't pre-order the red iphone you still
1:35:48can't pre-order the new cheap ipad you
1:35:51can't download the clips app or even
1:35:54they didn't even do like the App Store
1:35:56notify me thing like they did from Mario
1:35:58run like there's nothing we can do about
1:36:00this like we're interested now give us a
1:36:02way to turn that into something for you
1:36:04later Apple but no instead we just have
1:36:07to try to remember about these things
1:36:09and then when they are available in you
1:36:12know a week or three then go get them
1:36:14then but like why why couldn't they do
1:36:18anything what like why do they have to
1:36:20announce this yesterday when none of
1:36:22this stuff is even ready to pre-order
1:36:24exactly no they're trying to be trying
1:36:26to space it out you know like they have
1:36:28other announcements they don't want to
1:36:29push it up against them like I don't
1:36:32really because I think the Apple line
1:36:34and this is that they're not the type of
1:36:38products that there's going to be a mad
1:36:40rush for people to get like it doesn't
1:36:42really matter when I tell you about
1:36:43clips being a thing because it's going
1:36:45to be like a slow burn even though it's
1:36:47not even available it requires I was
1:36:4810.3 actually so no one's gotten it
1:36:51until iOS emily three comes out and 10.3
1:36:52is not coming out until you next month
1:36:54sometime probably but it's not this may
1:36:57be the iphone you could argue like there
1:36:59could be a potential rush for that but
1:37:00you know i don't know why they all came
1:37:02together i don't know why they're all
1:37:03not available but i don't think it
1:37:05matters that much because for all these
1:37:07type of products it's not the type of
1:37:09thing where you have to strike while the
1:37:10iron is hot and build up a frenzy of
1:37:12activity is just going to be cool new
1:37:13stuff that Apple's coming out with just
1:37:15so you know here it is it'll be here
1:37:17it'll be here before you know it but
1:37:18it's not a big deal like I don't think
1:37:20anybody is it has money burning a hole
1:37:23in their pocket for that new iPad even
1:37:25though it is better than the old one
1:37:26just lets you know if you were thinking
1:37:27ab item on maybe wait a little bit and
1:37:29for the application it'll be coming out
1:37:32soon but it requires the new OS and you
1:37:34know I I you can question why didn't
1:37:37they wait until like one of the items is
1:37:39available and like it was announced
1:37:41because that one's all that one's
1:37:42available the other ones aren't because
1:37:43you can't really make try to make them
1:37:45all simultaneously
1:37:46particularly mind that they they talk
1:37:49about it ahead of time especially since
1:37:50like there is something to be said for
1:37:51having all the sights talk about it you
1:37:54can't get this net but here's our
1:37:55exclusive look like you know here here
1:37:57is it was the red iphone that you can't
1:37:59get your hands on and here is the clips
1:38:00app that if anybody has a Clips app that
1:38:03won't be out until 10.3 that is another
1:38:05way to build hype so who knows I don't
1:38:08think anyone even has it i mean like the
1:38:09reviewers we at least know like
1:38:11reviewers seem to have read iphones but
1:38:14i don't think i haven't heard anybody
1:38:15mentioned that they have eclipse anyway
1:38:17it doesn't matter although the clips out
1:38:18by the way getting back to that string
1:38:19of playing to their strengths oh the
1:38:21more negative tech I'm playing To Your
1:38:23Strengths is it is a further emphasis of
1:38:26your weakness because like it if you had
1:38:28to pick who do you want to be the
1:38:30company that is really good in making it
1:38:32like a high-quality clever nice
1:38:34interface powerful application it takes
1:38:36advantage of your phone's hardware to
1:38:37make cool videos or the company that
1:38:39owns the social network where all those
1:38:41videos will be posted whether it be
1:38:42Instagram or snapchat or whatever I
1:38:44think Apple would trade in a second to
1:38:46be the the company that controls the
1:38:49social networks where that because
1:38:51that's there's more value in being the
1:38:53place where people post all their stuff
1:38:54than there is in making the application
1:38:56that lets people post their stuff and i
1:38:59like when i gave the hierarchy before
1:39:01was that most people are going to use
1:39:02the app a second tier is much fewer
1:39:05people who care more about quality will
1:39:07use this thing and then a third tier is
1:39:09even fewer people use professional tools
1:39:10so they're not even getting the fat part
1:39:12of that market right i think if they
1:39:14could choose they would say boy we
1:39:16really wish we were instagram or boy we
1:39:17really wish we were snapchat or whatever
1:39:19but they aren't and they can't be and
1:39:21they're bad at that stuff so at the very
1:39:23least this is always talking about like
1:39:24people who sell apples good at software
1:39:27and they make good interfaces the
1:39:28dimensions like are they what
1:39:30application have been made recently that
1:39:31shows that Apple actually knows how to
1:39:32make good applications get workflows an
1:39:34example and a phenomenal application
1:39:35like we get to the point where I feel
1:39:37like the ABA winners I think workflow
1:39:38one and a da da da winners are like all
1:39:41those applications are better than
1:39:43what's Apple is doing whereas this feels
1:39:44like a return to form or Apple saying
1:39:46the ABA sr4 a cup for people making
1:39:49software that we feel like exemplifies
1:39:51the ideals and the api's that we're
1:39:53promoting or whatever then we at Apple
1:39:55are interested in and we at apple also
1:40:00want to make applications of that level
1:40:01and for a long time it seemed like Apple
1:40:03was no longer able to make really great
1:40:05applications consistently and clips
1:40:09looks like a modern version of really
1:40:11great application and rather than being
1:40:13a Mac application or like a pro
1:40:14application it's like this is this is an
1:40:17application to do a simple thing so I
1:40:18was like one of the thing then was the
1:40:19use of WC so you want to make an
1:40:21application that does video those people
1:40:23make videos for social services what
1:40:25kind of features could you add to it if
1:40:26you took advantage of all our api's and
1:40:28could you make a really clever interface
1:40:30and use all our you know new systems for
1:40:32laying out the UI and use everything you
1:40:35learn from like it looks like a really
1:40:38good third-party application which at
1:40:40this point is a high compliment for
1:40:42something that Apple puts out yeah i'm
1:40:47looking forward to trying this and who
1:40:48knows that like i said if i'll ever use
1:40:49it but i'm really excited about yeah and
1:40:51the application itself like I'm less
1:40:53concerned about like you know whatever
1:40:54maybe no one will ever use it but I'm
1:40:56excited to see Apple making really good
1:40:59iOS applications again I always
1:41:00applications that even third-party
1:41:02developers say that's a good I osf in
1:41:04the same way we all say that about you
1:41:05know workflow or whatever that's that's
1:41:07what's encouraging to me about there's
1:41:08not the specifics of like always he made
1:41:10an appt to chair video or whatever so I
1:41:12did briefly want to address the other
1:41:15thing that happened when all these
1:41:17announcements dropped which is a bunch
1:41:19of people got really mad at things that
1:41:21weren't announced and I was one of them
1:41:24you know as I mentioned earlier I was
1:41:26hoping for a inch macbook update that
1:41:29didn't happen yep many people have been
1:41:32waiting for imac updates that were
1:41:34supposed to happen last fall didn't
1:41:36happen lots of people expected the nine
1:41:40point seven and twelve point nine inch
1:41:41iPad pros to be updated because the nine
1:41:45point seven is due now the 12.9 assuming
1:41:48it has the same cycle as the other ones
1:41:50is now past due by about half a year and
1:41:52so a lot of people are mad you know like
1:41:54and there was the rumored 10.5 inch iPad
1:41:57and I think John Gruber's take on this
1:41:58on daring fireball is probably right
1:42:00which is like it probably never made
1:42:02sense to launch that in the spring that
1:42:04probably see that sounds more like a you
1:42:07know let the iphone debut the new design
1:42:09language and then release the iPad
1:42:10afterwards kind of thing or do them both
1:42:12it wants to be a big bang
1:42:14you know or so but I get it also things
1:42:16make more sense than what what was
1:42:18predicted which was like you're gonna
1:42:20get 20 new iPhones in mar 22 iPads in
1:42:22March and they're gonna be weird sizes
1:42:24that aren't consistent with each other
1:42:25and one of them is going to be amazing
1:42:26it's like really it's not know exactly
1:42:28never sounded right and we keep hearing
1:42:30rumblings to about major iPad
1:42:33enhancements in iPad productivity
1:42:35multitasking things like that major
1:42:37enhancements that were originally
1:42:39supposed to be coming out about now with
1:42:41iOS 10.3 and that we've heard recently
1:42:44that those have been delayed until iOS
1:42:4711 presumably in the fall so if that's
1:42:50the case it also might make sense to
1:42:52hold back this new 10 and a half inch
1:42:54crazy awesome iPad pro and maybe an
1:42:57update to the 12.9 as well that's going
1:42:59to happen to hold those back until like
1:43:02whatever september-october event is the
1:43:05public launch of iOS 11 that's usually
1:43:07what they do like you know though that
1:43:09they will show us all at WTC in the
1:43:12summertime like the core features and
1:43:13then when it when it comes time for
1:43:15launch day for that OS in the
1:43:17september-october event there will be
1:43:19new hardware that makes it even better
1:43:21usually as an iphone event but you know
1:43:22as John just said it could be both so
1:43:25that makes sense but I think the reason
1:43:27why people were so mad and still are so
1:43:29mad is that you know traditionally at
1:43:33most Apple products have been on a
1:43:35predictable schedule you know like the
1:43:37ipad and iphone is about one year max
1:43:40were about one year to maybe 18 months
1:43:43for most families we complain about the
1:43:45Mac Pro and people complain about the
1:43:47mac mini those have honestly always been
1:43:49on ridiculous schedules usually not this
1:43:51ridiculous but but like you know that's
1:43:53not new for those families but like most
1:43:54most mammals products you could pretty
1:43:56much extrapolate based on their previous
1:43:58release schedules okay this one will be
1:44:00out in about a year this will be updated
1:44:01in about a year and a half etc and so
1:44:03even even if Apple has said nothing
1:44:06about future products which is usually
1:44:08the case you you as like if you're
1:44:10waiting for an updated like if you're if
1:44:12you want to buy an imac today and if you
1:44:15do any research at all which many people
1:44:17do you know people people in the geek
1:44:20sphere often think that like you know
1:44:21quote normal people just walk into an
1:44:23apple store just buy whatever's there
1:44:24and they don't do any research but
1:44:26that's wrong
1:44:27a lot of people do research and a lot
1:44:28more people than we give credit for do
1:44:31the kind of research that can tell them
1:44:33like you know I should probably wait and
1:44:34not by this yet because the new ones are
1:44:36becoming soon anyway so when the product
1:44:38that you're waiting for is past due for
1:44:42an expected update every announcement
1:44:45that Apple makes every event they have
1:44:47every new product release that passes by
1:44:49that you don't get the thing you're
1:44:51waiting for that feels like a delay even
1:44:54though they never said they were gonna
1:44:55release it because it isn't officially a
1:44:58delay because they never announced it
1:44:59but it feels like you were told this and
1:45:03you might even been told that by Apple
1:45:05experts by the apple press by Apple
1:45:07commentators who you know the rest of
1:45:10the year they tell you oh you're being
1:45:12impatient just wait until wdc or the
1:45:16fall event or the spring event like it's
1:45:18always I'll just wait till the next X it
1:45:20just keep waiting keep waiting that's
1:45:22what you're told when you look into this
1:45:23kind of stuff and so when that event
1:45:25comes and goes and you still don't have
1:45:27your update that you thought was do that
1:45:30feels like something was taken away from
1:45:31you it feels like it was delayed even
1:45:32though Apple never never officially
1:45:34promised it and when there's only a
1:45:37couple of products that are on these
1:45:38delays like the mac pro in the mac mini
1:45:40well those are always on these delays I
1:45:42think that's no surprise but but you
1:45:45know as we mentioned in past shows it
1:45:47does seem like there's more of those
1:45:48product lines than usual right now 2016
1:45:51was an especially bad year we're still
1:45:54you know at least the laptops recovered
1:45:56from that now that was a big one but you
1:45:58know there's still some of these
1:45:59products like the 12 point on a tripod
1:46:00that was kind of sitting around waiting
1:46:01for an update and you know as I said
1:46:04earlier I think the new reality is that
1:46:07there is no apple product line except
1:46:11probably the iphone that is on a regular
1:46:14schedule anymore every other one they
1:46:18could they could have updated at every
1:46:19year for the last five years and then
1:46:20well now it's on a two-year cycle now
1:46:22it's on an 18-month cycle what like we
1:46:25can't depend on that that way of
1:46:27predicting long schedules anymore like
1:46:29whatever interval they've been on in the
1:46:31past is now totally irrelevant for
1:46:34possibly every product but if not
1:46:36probably not the iphone but but probably
1:46:39everything else
1:46:40so there are some speculation there
1:46:42might still be like an April event there
1:46:45was like on the WTC wall of text that
1:46:49was on the big walls downstairs there
1:46:51was like Hello April is at April
1:46:52eighteenth what was the event was the
1:46:54date on that deal I don't remember I
1:46:56know what you're talking about but I
1:46:57don't remember somewhere on the teens i
1:46:59think in april that was like printed on
1:47:01there as a possible easter egg so there
1:47:03might still be in april event maybe
1:47:05they're going to be at the new Steve
1:47:06Jobs theater on on the new apple campus
1:47:09who knows but if I had to bet money on
1:47:12it i would guess they probably aren't
1:47:14done announcing things for the spring
1:47:16yet because the other thing is like WTC
1:47:19in recent years has really been a
1:47:21software-only event for the most part
1:47:23there's usually there's so much to talk
1:47:26about during that keynote because there
1:47:28is usually so many changes to iOS watch
1:47:32OS TVO as like there's so much to cram
1:47:35in there that they have they have in
1:47:37recent years been minimizing or
1:47:39eliminating any kind of hardware release
1:47:41talk from that keynote and they also
1:47:43don't tend to do any other events in the
1:47:44summertime besides that one because you
1:47:46know everyone's on vacation in july and
1:47:47august and everything so so i'm guessing
1:47:49if they have anything more to announce
1:47:52before September we're probably like
1:47:55hardware and product wise not software
1:47:57wise we're probably going to still hear
1:47:59about it maybe you know maybe in April
1:48:00we'll see if I had to bet whether or not
1:48:03they would be an event in April right
1:48:04now I'd say probably yes but I wouldn't
1:48:07bet Casey five bucks on it you know it's
1:48:10funny you bring all this up I was um I
1:48:12was thinking about this earlier today
1:48:14and we've also gotten a couple emails
1:48:16and I don't have them in front of me but
1:48:18somebody wrote in saying you know
1:48:21listing this scenario i don't know maybe
1:48:23five years ago and like snow leopard was
1:48:25about to come out or something like that
1:48:27and you know hey here's the scenario
1:48:28everyone was upset about a b c d e f and
1:48:31g we all thought the world was ending
1:48:32all the pundits all the all the
1:48:34podcasters everyone thought the world
1:48:36was ending turns out it really wasn't
1:48:37that bad and yet i left yesterday I
1:48:41didn't go anywhere but you know at the
1:48:43end of yesterday I felt like me and I
1:48:45don't know if I was too excited about
1:48:48all this like I knew I that Clips looked
1:48:50kind of cool but the rest of it I just
1:48:51didn't really care
1:48:53and the first constructive thought I had
1:48:56was well it's just that these weren't
1:48:58for me these announcements weren't for
1:49:00me does make them bad and in fact
1:49:01reflecting on them now today with you
1:49:03guys they're pretty good truth be told
1:49:06but they weren't for me and most
1:49:08specifically I don't have my damn
1:49:09adorable refresh but that's okay but I
1:49:15started thinking you know why is it that
1:49:17I feel disappointed about this in a way
1:49:22that I don't think i would have a few
1:49:23years back and I think a lot of it marco
1:49:27was what you said was that there was a a
1:49:29pretty reliable cadence to how Apple
1:49:31release stuff up until fairly recently
1:49:33and that's not quite so reliable anymore
1:49:37which on the surface I should be excited
1:49:39about because it means things are less
1:49:42predictable and more exciting but I'm
1:49:45not that excited about it because I'm
1:49:47not always excited about levels
1:49:50releasing any more I am always excited
1:49:53about new iPhones because every single
1:49:54time I think there's been an improvement
1:49:56but everything else that's hit or miss
1:49:58right like I've not used to touch bar
1:50:00for more than a couple of minutes to
1:50:02this day but I'm not overwhelmingly
1:50:04amped to go get myself one and stuff
1:50:08just but I've been trying and I haven't
1:50:09come to any great conclusions but I'm
1:50:11trying to figure out you know why am i
1:50:12less excited about late announcements of
1:50:15late than I have been in the past and
1:50:17the only other thing I can come to is
1:50:19that I feel like there was always
1:50:22something in every single product that I
1:50:25could be like holy hell that looks
1:50:27awesome and so maybe a product that I
1:50:29didn't really care about so as an
1:50:30example the twelve point nine inch iPad
1:50:33pro I don't have any desire for that in
1:50:36my life but I can see cool things about
1:50:38it and similarly like the smart keyboard
1:50:40for both sizes that's cool and that was
1:50:43fairly recent in fairness but I don't
1:50:47know I just I feel like in years past
1:50:48everything had something really cool
1:50:51about it maybe I'm just becoming a
1:50:53cynical old man maybe that's the problem
1:50:55but I'm just less excited about it and I
1:50:57think a lot of that is the cadence some
1:50:59of that is that these products just may
1:51:02not be for me anymore
1:51:04or and and maybe I just gotta get okay
1:51:07with that you know what still is
1:51:10possibly for you what the macbook escape
1:51:13man it's a really good computer I think
1:51:16asked me a few weeks yeah I'll ask you
1:51:19in 15 days after the lag if it's not a
1:51:22real computer I might have a macbook
1:51:24escape to sell you yeah funny about four
1:51:28people being angry about this like I
1:51:30mean I think it's what we talked about a
1:51:33lot a lot of the other announcements for
1:51:34it's like it is not so much about what's
1:51:36announced is just like sort of simmering
1:51:38desire / resentment for things out that
1:51:41aren't getting updated and so every time
1:51:43something happens it does include the
1:51:44thing you want just makes you angry but
1:51:46everyone knew this was going to be like
1:51:48there was no event where people were
1:51:49going out to sit in a room to listen to
1:51:51someone talk this was a press release
1:51:52only thing right it wasn't it wasn't
1:51:54like they they had everyone come out to
1:51:56a location you know so everyone knows
1:51:58when when it's a press release only
1:51:59thing its lesser stuff the idea that
1:52:02they were to release a new 10.5 inch
1:52:04iPad you know with an entirely new
1:52:06physical design without calling a bunch
1:52:08of press to come to a room and sit there
1:52:11and get a presentation like that's not
1:52:14you know the the amount of ceremony
1:52:18surrounding the announcements matches
1:52:21the the magnitude of the announcements
1:52:23so this is going to be hey it's just
1:52:25going to be a bunch of press releases
1:52:26and some journalists will get briefed in
1:52:28various locations but we're not
1:52:30gathering everybody into a room we're
1:52:31not doing a live Sheeran you know what's
1:52:33the caliber of the stuff that's going to
1:52:34be there so being disappointed that you
1:52:37didn't even get like a macbook refresh I
1:52:38mean it's conceivable that you could
1:52:40have got a macbook refresh with with
1:52:41this caliber of announcement but what I
1:52:44don't think is that it doesn't actually
1:52:45reset like are now now it's almost like
1:52:48a delay because they're not going to
1:52:49have a vent right after this I think
1:52:51it's entirely conceivable that they
1:52:52could have here's the press release only
1:52:54stuff and then here is an event where
1:52:56ever we actually invite people out in
1:52:58the near future that it doesn't push any
1:53:00future announcements out at all because
1:53:02very often they have the thing where
1:53:04they dump a bunch of pre-announcements
1:53:06and press releases sometimes they do
1:53:08like the day before like the real event
1:53:10where actual you know people sit in a
1:53:11room and get it get a little song and
1:53:13dance from Apple right so I totally
1:53:16understand
1:53:17the idea that like every time apple says
1:53:19anything and it doesn't include the
1:53:20thing that you think should be coming
1:53:22that it's painful but the actual things
1:53:27that were announced here all seemed fine
1:53:28and I actually don't think it pushes
1:53:30anything back it doesn't mean that
1:53:32there's an imminent announcement or
1:53:33anything you could still be cranky about
1:53:34the fact that the ipad pro does need an
1:53:37update and hasn't got one and when is it
1:53:39going to come and if it doesn't come in
1:53:40April does that mean I have to wait to
1:53:41the beauty like you can continue to be
1:53:42sad about that but honestly like I guess
1:53:46it's just people getting over the idea
1:53:47that the ipad pro might not be updated
1:53:50every time there are obvious technology
1:53:52upgrades to it like you would think oh
1:53:53well surely the big iPad pro will get
1:53:55the truth on screen out of the small and
1:53:56has it and you wait and wait and wait
1:53:58but you know talk to my pro people about
1:54:01waiting like you're cranky because
1:54:02you're like it's one year come on chop
1:54:04chopping like one year haha so young so
1:54:06young lease your product will still be
1:54:09released thanks to our three sponsors
1:54:11this week hello fresh Squarespace and
1:54:14fracture and we will see you next week
1:54:16now the show is over they didn't even
1:54:22mean to begin as it was accidental oh it
1:54:27was accidental John didn't
1:54:31money research Marco and Casey wouldn't
1:54:34let
1:54:35cuz it was accidental it was accidental
1:54:39and you can find the show notes at ATP
1:54:43FM I live for into twitter you can
1:54:49follow them at cas eyl ISS so that's
1:54:55Casey list and a osseo a RM Angie Marco
1:55:00are men and I are a c-usa Syracuse we
1:55:20have important after show facts about a
1:55:22PFS I know you guys are dying for an
1:55:24exciting after-show on that my god I'm
1:55:26so ready what mailing list is on this is
1:55:29on one of apples one of apple's mailing
1:55:33lists people complaining about bugs
1:55:35being closed about a PFS on iOS
1:55:37obviously because it's you know it's not
1:55:38officially for the mac actually it's
1:55:41still beta for iOS to anyway the bug was
1:55:44closed with this explanation iosh best
1:55:47normalization and unicode names i have i
1:55:50oh Sh of us normalized unicode names
1:55:52which was we know like they folded it
1:55:54all into a particular normalization of
1:55:55their thing and so that's why you would
1:55:56you no matter how you enter the file
1:55:58name it would all fold it into a
1:55:59particular form so you can only have one
1:56:00file name cafe with an e an accent on
1:56:03the end no matter how you encode it up
1:56:05as you can you can write that in 20
1:56:06different ways in your code with
1:56:07combining characters and stuff a PFS now
1:56:10treats all files as a bag of bytes on
1:56:12iOS and so they closed it as closing the
1:56:15bug report so if you use apple's api's
1:56:18you don't care about this because it
1:56:19does all that sort of normalization for
1:56:21you but if you use the direct file
1:56:22system API you like the bsd you know the
1:56:24unix layer it is a PFS behaves like like
1:56:28a plain old UNIX file system which is
1:56:30basically give him a buffer full of
1:56:33bytes and I will write that to the part
1:56:35of the file system that says it's
1:56:36supposed to hold the file name and and
1:56:38that's it so if you want to write one
1:56:41file name in utf-32 and one file name
1:56:45and a ski and one file name in utf-8 and
1:56:48normalization I'm just a filesystem man
1:56:51you just gave me a sequence of bytes
1:56:52when you ask me later what the name of
1:56:54this file is i'm going to give you that
1:56:55sequence of bytes back i hope you know
1:56:56what encoding it's in good luck which is
1:56:59exactly how i believe linus torvalds of
1:57:02linux fame really wished hfs+ behaved
1:57:05because he hated the fact that it did
1:57:06normalization he said just just take the
1:57:08bytes that I give you and stick them in
1:57:09your file system and that is apparently
1:57:12how a PFS works and I felt the bog on
1:57:14this as well to say look I don't know
1:57:15this is a bug or feature but hfs+ dude
1:57:19hit this way and your new replacement
1:57:21behaves that way and it seems to me that
1:57:22could possibly cause something
1:57:24compatibilities down the line so is this
1:57:27something you intended to do or what and
1:57:29I don't remember what the status of that
1:57:30bug is but this this bug report of if it
1:57:32is to be believed that this radar that
1:57:34was close is like on iOS anyway that's
1:57:37totally what we meant it's now just the
1:57:39Bagel Bites user api's you'll be fine
1:57:42but it certainly simplifies the file
1:57:44system because thousands of no longer
1:57:47needs to be concerned about what the
1:57:48heck is in the the file names it's just
1:57:51it's just a big data buffer and
1:57:53everything else is handled it at a
1:57:54higher level and arguably that is a
1:57:56cleaner layering but it is definitely a
1:57:58definite break with how it was done
1:57:59before so be careful out there so are
1:58:06you excited for a PFS like i know we've
1:58:08talked about this in the past but
1:58:09sitting here now have you been it seems
1:58:11like you're keeping up with it keeping
1:58:12up with it at least a little bit I am
1:58:15I'm excited for it I'm a little bit
1:58:17worried about compatibility things
1:58:18because of this encoding issue and I'm a
1:58:20little bit worried about bugs and stuff
1:58:22but I bought a new fastest then and I'm
1:58:23getting one and you know I'm still I
1:58:26still think about it and get sad about
1:58:27the the lack of data integrity features
1:58:29and stuff like that but there there are
1:58:31enough new interesting features that I'm
1:58:33that I'm still excited for it i just do
1:58:34worry about you know maybe i'll just
1:58:37like I should really upgrade my synology
1:58:39to btrfs which it now actually supports
1:58:42with the new thing but I don't know a
1:58:44way to do it in place and they don't
1:58:45have any place to copy all this data off
1:58:46to and put it back on except for the
1:58:48network and so anyway I would like it if
1:58:51my backups at least were someplace where
1:58:54I knew that they were not bit rotting
1:58:55I'll just continue to have to sort of
1:58:58bury my head in the sand about the state
1:58:59of the data I'm actual max because if
1:59:01that's not self
1:59:02is not helping me there hi titles uh
1:59:05what is it that you and I suggested
1:59:07simultaneously Oh Christmas phone yeah
1:59:09that was that yeah that's it what was
1:59:11the shoelace thing I've already lost the
1:59:12thread on the what was the amount of
1:59:15thread hey what was the analogy for the
1:59:17show I was the macbook pro like once you
1:59:18had to reformat it right okay yeah yeah
1:59:20if you listen to analog John you would
1:59:23know the story of I know the shul a
1:59:24story I've heard that episode stop it
1:59:26I've heard that episode you can jump in
1:59:29anytime John you don't have to go to the
1:59:31back catalog everyone knows the shoelace
1:59:32story and and if you had and if you
1:59:35didn't hear in an analog in here Mike
1:59:36talk about it on eight thousand other
1:59:37episodes of other shows so it's not like
1:59:39you can avoid the shoelace but he told
1:59:40the best with me dammit I know I didn't
1:59:42I heard it first there I still like
1:59:44Christmas phone although span across my
1:59:46leg gap actually starting to edge that I
1:59:47don't like them either like gap what was
1:59:50the true light shoelace is rising this
1:59:52is my shoelaces rising and oh boo just
1:59:55going to hear Mike talk about how
1:59:57awesome e is for inspiring the title
1:59:57awesome e is for inspiring the title
2:00:00and I don't want to deal with that but
2:00:01he is he is that awesome because that
2:00:03was an amazing story we don't need but
2:00:04we don't need to tell him that we don't
2:00:06need to give him that moment what is he
2:00:08doing with the shoelaces that they're
2:00:09breaking that's my real question I can't
2:00:12remember the last time I had a shoelace
2:00:13break like is he being very rough with
2:00:15them is he rubbing his shoe against
2:00:16something there fraying like who
2:00:18shoelaces break maybe the style in Great
2:00:20Britain is to have really tightly laced
2:00:22shoes like to really tighten them up you
2:00:24know this is very thin I don't know it's
2:00:25it's it's a suspicious story my shoelace
2:00:29just broke as I pulled really partner
2:00:31snap oh I can't I have to put my job now
2:00:33hey should check to check his lightning
2:00:39cable how are they doing like that's it
2:00:43like if I if I replace this lightning
2:00:45cable I'm I'll just use this iPad pro
2:00:48for another year