40: When The Hobby Light Goes Off


  this is hypercritical [TS]

  a weekly talkshow ruminating on exactly [TS]

  what is wrong in the world of Apple [TS]

  related technologies and businesses [TS]

  nothing is so perfect that it can't be [TS]

  complained about show is hosted by John [TS]

  siracusa and by me I'm Dan benjamin [TS]

  today is october 28th 2011 this is [TS]

  episode number 40 we would like to say [TS]

  thanks to our two sponsors today tiny [TS]

  letter dot-com and squarespace.com will [TS]

  tell you more about those as the show [TS]

  goes on hey John how you doing this week [TS]

  pretty good I'm bummed that our guest [TS]

  isn't here yeah we you had do we even [TS]

  want to talk do we want to talk about it [TS]

  or no II just I we were supposed to have [TS]

  a guest we're gonna have a spent very [TS]

  special very special guest very special [TS]

  he's not here we waited we waited a [TS]

  little while and he didn't he didn't [TS]

  show up yeah maybe he got timezones [TS]

  confused to me [TS]

  who knows how hopefully you know now I'm [TS]

  so now I'm starting to worry now I'm [TS]

  just now I just hope he's all right [TS]

  that's all sleep well if that's all it [TS]

  is then that's uh that's merely rude and [TS]

  then being injured or something would [TS]

  not be good we'll see anyway I had [TS]

  prepared to do a show with guest today [TS]

  so all my notes that I'm looking at are [TS]

  all about things that we would have [TS]

  discussed with the guests but I've got [TS]

  enough be sure in the back of my mind [TS]

  yeah guy added I added links all week [TS]

  long gonna add links to the to the note [TS]

  I know I moved a bunch of them out [TS]

  before the show because I thought they [TS]

  were the ones that weren't relevant to [TS]

  the guests but as your hero c-3po says [TS]

  how rude I saved them I non-tech delete [TS]

  move them out on my own little file and [TS]

  move them out you know I don't know what [TS]

  that means well you know I don't I don't [TS]

  want to lose the the urls right so I [TS]

  just copy and paste them into another [TS]

  document so I can add them back next [TS]

  week okay but no you know what I was [TS]

  listening to the other shows this week I [TS]

  was thinking more there's a lot of stuff [TS]

  I want to talk about but we've got the [TS]

  guest I was like I'll just save it for [TS]

  next week but now I guess we have a [TS]

  chance to talk about it yeah [TS]

  so the ones I wanted to talk about were [TS]

  and you can pick we can talk about Apple [TS]

  and TV stuff for the umpteenth time or [TS]

  we can talk about the Steve Jobs bio I I [TS]

  have not completed reading the Bible and [TS]

  neither of I so I and John Gruber on his [TS]

  show on the talk show has essentially [TS]

  said that he would like to you know not [TS]

  he doesn't want to talk about until he's [TS]

  completed it I kind of feel the same way [TS]

  I feel like unless and until we've read [TS]

  it and maybe given the audience a chance [TS]

  to read it also because the book is for [TS]

  most people especially if you ordered [TS]

  the hardcover book which of course I did [TS]

  and I haven't I haven't I know some [TS]

  people like our mutual friend Jason [TS]

  Snell you know he got the Kindle edition [TS]

  so he could start reading it [TS]

  instantaneously that the moment it was [TS]

  released on the 24th which was Wednesday [TS]

  and and and then of course ordered the [TS]

  hardcover so he could switch to that I [TS]

  did not do that is that what you did or [TS]

  do you have the hardcover just the [TS]

  digital I haven't been reading paper [TS]

  books since like 2002 sorry I'm the [TS]

  digital version so you want to wait [TS]

  until everybody has finished it [TS]

  that's all I feel like I feel like we [TS]

  have to I feel like we need to get least [TS]

  give him a chance you know and then and [TS]

  then even after they're done even if [TS]

  their people are like I don't need a [TS]

  chance I'm ready right now well it's [TS]

  fine let it gel in your mind then [TS]

  consider this to be an incubation period [TS]

  for you to form your opinions of course [TS]

  by then like all the other shows may [TS]

  have talked about the book and everyone [TS]

  is bored of it by the time we get the [TS]

  next Friday but I will have my say-so [TS]

  well perhaps what I could do is I could [TS]

  have I and I I've you know I have to run [TS]

  this by the other guys but maybe I could [TS]

  do a show where we all talk about it [TS]

  where it's just a a special show we can [TS]

  all come together talk about it be [TS]

  scheduling logistics of that are easy we [TS]

  just do it on Friday when you're sitting [TS]

  sitting at home [TS]

  well if they all want to do that [TS]

  although there could be a lot of people [TS]

  talking about it anyway so that that [TS]

  means you want to talk about Apple TV [TS]

  today instead I think we have two all [TS]

  right well actually I should go back to [TS]

  only pull up my my larger notes file and [TS]

  look to see if we have any follow-up [TS]

  because I had excised all the follow-up [TS]

  to because we're gonna [TS]

  that I wanna you know waste time doing [TS]

  yeah follow up mm-hmm we have and follow [TS]

  up not much stuff actually I had [TS]

  something that I didn't investigate much [TS]

  but someone sent along I'll put in the [TS]

  show notes was a remember we talked [TS]

  about iCloud a couple weeks ago when I [TS]

  was talking about the philosophy that I [TS]

  was surmising that I kept my cloud [TS]

  philosophy that I was sort of inferring [TS]

  from the things I knew about it a things [TS]

  said at WWDC it's not like a stated goal [TS]

  of Apple as far as I know but just [TS]

  looking at how the API works and how [TS]

  differs from MobileMe I was saying how [TS]

  they don't want it to be like the [TS]

  MobileMe syncing where you have like [TS]

  resolving conflicts and that whole [TS]

  infrastructure they just want to not [TS]

  bother you with as many questions as [TS]

  possible and just keep multiple versions [TS]

  and if they make the wrong choice on [TS]

  your behalf at least you can rewind and [TS]

  go back to the previous version so [TS]

  someone sent me a screenshot of pages [TS]

  running on the iPad and unfortunately [TS]

  it's French so I don't know exactly what [TS]

  the dialogues say but it shows the I [TS]

  guess it's the Pages document screen I [TS]

  haven't tried pages on the iPads I don't [TS]

  know what screen this is and it's the [TS]

  the screen behind it shows a bunch of [TS]

  pages documents and a bunch of pages [TS]

  folders where it shows like a bunch of [TS]

  little squares inside of a bigger square [TS]

  kind of like the folders on the [TS]

  springboard screen in front of it is a [TS]

  modal dialog box that's asking you to [TS]

  resolve a conflict and it shows two [TS]

  choices with like dates under them and [TS]

  it says something about the [TS]

  modifications are not synchronized [TS]

  choose the document that you want to [TS]

  save this is me translating from my high [TS]

  school French right you know share [TS]

  someone else going to look at the [TS]

  screenshot now I'll paste into the chat [TS]

  room so people can take a look for [TS]

  themselves so here is an actual dialogue [TS]

  box prompting you to you know which one [TS]

  of these documents do you want to save [TS]

  now I don't know how this thing occurred [TS]

  and it seems like it's a dialogue [TS]

  produced by the pages application unlike [TS]

  say MobileMe where there was a [TS]

  system-wide conflict resolution thing [TS]

  that would be launched by the the sync [TS]

  services process so presumably this is [TS]

  something [TS]

  it individual applications can provide [TS]

  like if they call the cloud api's and [TS]

  they find their about the pull document [TS]

  that's newer than the one you have but [TS]

  the one that you have has been modified [TS]

  since it was last synchronized maybe [TS]

  it'll pop up this document so I can't [TS]

  tell if that's like you know the an [TS]

  expected part of an iCloud application [TS]

  or just an individual choice that the [TS]

  pages developers made regarding iCloud [TS]

  but anyway it's the first time I have [TS]

  seen in practice or in screenshot a [TS]

  conflict resolution dialog for iCloud so [TS]

  apparently they are not totally gone see [TS]

  what else we have for follow up I do [TS]

  actually have follow up on Apple TV but [TS]

  that's going to be our topic tonight so [TS]

  we won't need to talk about that mmm [TS]

  yeah I don't want to talk more about flu [TS]

  stuff and then we did that we continue [TS]

  to get a lot of commentary out through [TS]

  stuff right out of flu it is the problem [TS]

  with it with the flu stuff that be met a [TS]

  problem I think there there are so many [TS]

  what I and many other people would [TS]

  consider crazy opinions about vaccines [TS]

  in particular and medicine out there on [TS]

  the net right I mean we've all read all [TS]

  sorts of things but I even just you know [TS]

  for people follow us politics with the [TS]

  Michelle Bachman and the HPV vaccine all [TS]

  that business and then there's the the [TS]

  vaccine I don't know what you call them [TS]

  other people like Jenny McCarthy and [TS]

  stuff I think the vaccines are harmful [TS]

  to our children and the government [TS]

  shouldn't be forcing us to have let that [TS]

  that whole thing right and everything [TS]

  you know in between and in the extremes [TS]

  of that on the internet so now I think [TS]

  whenever anyone discusses anything that [TS]

  touches on one of those issues it's easy [TS]

  for the people listening to imagine that [TS]

  what they're hearing is one of those [TS]

  crazy opinions because those crazy pains [TS]

  do you know they get people worked up [TS]

  right yeah and so if you talk about [TS]

  something else like you're just talking [TS]

  about shoes people and say you say [TS]

  something that could conceivably be [TS]

  misinterpreted to mean that you think [TS]

  shoes are magic and help you levitate if [TS]

  they're brown but only if you wear them [TS]

  on Wednesdays no one is going to make [TS]

  that jump to that conclusion because [TS]

  it's ridiculous right huh but if [TS]

  it was a big meme on the internet about [TS]

  brown shoes letting you levitate on [TS]

  Wednesdays and it was just everywhere [TS]

  and you kept telling people look brown [TS]

  shoes don't let you levitate on [TS]

  Wednesdays people your your hunk you [TS]

  know this makes no sense they don't make [TS]

  you levitate like oh it's a government [TS]

  conspiracy they do let you levitate [TS]

  that's why they won't let you wear brown [TS]

  shoes you know if that was a big thing [TS]

  on the internet it would be very [TS]

  difficult to discuss shoes without [TS]

  somebody saying wait are you saying the [TS]

  brown shoes help you levitate on [TS]

  Wednesdays because it's a thing they've [TS]

  heard elsewhere right so I think the [TS]

  problem with talking about the flu stuff [TS]

  is that no matter what we say on the [TS]

  topic someone will assume that what [TS]

  they're hearing is one of those crazy [TS]

  things that they've heard uh and now the [TS]

  reverse is also true if I was actually [TS]

  talk about vaccines which I won't uh [TS]

  other than the flu shot apparently uh [TS]

  people who are like you know in the [TS]

  Jenny McCarthy anti vaccine camp would [TS]

  probably jump on me and tell me I'm [TS]

  crazy in blah blah blah because I don't [TS]

  agree with them right and if that [TS]

  happened if we got a bunch of reader [TS]

  mail from people who are like anti [TS]

  vaccine I'll be ok with that I'd be like [TS]

  you know I feel like yeah that's what I [TS]

  expect to get because I actually do [TS]

  disagree with their position and you [TS]

  know so I would just accept that but [TS]

  instead what we getting in the flu shot [TS]

  stuff are angry emails from people who I [TS]

  agree with who think what I'm saying is [TS]

  something they don't agree with I don't [TS]

  think it's a possible for me to resolve [TS]

  that so I'm gonna say to all you people [TS]

  out there who believe in science and [TS]

  medicine I agree with you so you can [TS]

  stop in telling me and and and thinking [TS]

  that I might if I accidentally implied [TS]

  we said something that made you think I [TS]

  don't that was a mistake I'm sorry that [TS]

  I implied that I'm if I'm if I misspoke [TS]

  if I said something I do think that I [TS]

  don't I agree with you for the people [TS]

  who are on the opposite side I really do [TS]

  disagree with you and you continue to [TS]

  send me angry email if you want but we [TS]

  really have been getting that so that's [TS]

  that's what that's the I'm not gonna [TS]

  discuss the substance I don't think with [TS]

  two shows words enough would be the meta [TS]

  issue here is once some topic gets [TS]

  enough extreme opinions on both sides of [TS]

  it [TS]

  even the people you agree with will be [TS]

  inclined to jump on you if they if it [TS]

  seems like you are not very accurately [TS]

  and adamantly and completely denying the [TS]

  extreme points of view so I think that's [TS]

  what's been happening with the flu issue [TS]

  flu shot thing which I don't want to [TS]

  discuss further but I just wanted to [TS]

  discuss this larger issue I'm just glad [TS]

  you got your flu shot I have still [TS]

  haven't got mine I bet usually I get [TS]

  mine through work and they send out a [TS]

  little thing as hey we're going to have [TS]

  flu shots sign up Bob and they haven't [TS]

  sent out their thing yet this year I [TS]

  looked through the past years like what [TS]

  have they done this they've done it [TS]

  pretty late and past year so maybe they [TS]

  just haven't gotten to it yet but the [TS]

  family's gotten them I'm just glad you [TS]

  haven't got your flu shots relieved [TS]

  that's a bummer sent now you should get [TS]

  the angry email all right Apple TV Apple [TS]

  TV so recently in the news as a result [TS]

  of this book coming out you have a Steve [TS]

  Jobs quote that I read we read this on [TS]

  one of the other shows the interview was [TS]

  talking to Steve Jobs about television [TS]

  DTV and the quote was something like I [TS]

  finally cracked it in reference to how [TS]

  to create the ultimate Apple TV [TS]

  experience that yeah Steve Jobs has done [TS]

  it he has cracked it and of course this [TS]

  I don't know when the date of that [TS]

  particular interview where he said that [TS]

  was because this book is a collection of [TS]

  something like 30 40 interviews over [TS]

  years so we don't I personally I don't [TS]

  know do you know when that quote [TS]

  actually was like dated whether that was [TS]

  it a month before he passed or or a year [TS]

  do we know [TS]

  no and that's another complaint I would [TS]

  have about the book if we were [TS]

  discussing the book which or not but no [TS]

  there was not not good footnotes and not [TS]

  good citations to be able to he [TS]

  obviously didn't back so I did not use [TS]

  markdown either as I probably know my [TS]

  footnotes very easy yeah so the quote I [TS]

  actually pulled out I just pulled this [TS]

  from our webpage not from the book [TS]

  itself but I assume it is accurate I [TS]

  don't know why P [TS]

  miscalled the book this is a steve job [TS]

  speaking it says i'd like to create an [TS]

  integrated television set that is [TS]

  completely easy to use it would be [TS]

  seamlessly synced with all of your [TS]

  devices and with iCloud so presumably [TS]

  that quote comes from after the point [TS]

  when iCloud was public I guess because [TS]

  why would he tell his biographer maybe [TS]

  he would tell his biographer if iCloud [TS]

  was uh still in the work you know I [TS]

  hadn't been announced yet [TS]

  what he told his biographer guy what he [TS]

  mentioned I got but so that Steve Jobs [TS]

  saying that they won't approaches so [TS]

  Marco talked about it a lot and then [TS]

  Gruber sort of replied to what market [TS]

  was saying and a lot of the issue this [TS]

  two parts the issue one it's been [TS]

  discussing is Apple going to make a [TS]

  television set which is what the current [TS]

  hot rumor stuff for the past month or [TS]

  two has been like an actual TV set or [TS]

  are they going to continue to make a [TS]

  thing that you attach to the television [TS]

  and the second issue is regardless of [TS]

  which one of those things they do what's [TS]

  the point like what does this thing do [TS]

  for you ah how they going to deal with [TS]

  content like why how is it going to be [TS]

  different than right presumably Apple's [TS]

  not going to make a television that's [TS]

  exactly like you know Samsung or [TS]

  Panasonic television so they're going to [TS]

  do something with it right and also [TS]

  presumably something different in some [TS]

  way than the current Apple TV they're [TS]

  going to be applications is just going [TS]

  to be like the current Apple TV but [TS]

  faster with more content deals and all [TS]

  you know all sorts of speculation like [TS]

  that and I don't know if I ever discuss [TS]

  this but Marco went over most of the [TS]

  points about why Apple would probably [TS]

  not be interested in making a television [TS]

  set let's summarize what he said is like [TS]

  you know people don't buy Dell vision [TS]

  sets that often because they're big [TS]

  expensive purchases a lot of people had [TS]

  just bought a television set because you [TS]

  know that converting from non HD HD [TS]

  television sets and the Apple TV didn't [TS]

  have a lot of penetration when it was [TS]

  like 400 bucks probably dropped it to 99 [TS]

  it really started to take off so like [TS]

  Apple seems to be on the hey you know we [TS]

  can get some traction if we make this [TS]

  thing cheap all those are reasons why [TS]

  they wouldn't wanna make an actual [TS]

  television set though and to that I [TS]

  would add that Apple [TS]

  really doesn't have much to add to the [TS]

  set television set part anyway they [TS]

  would be like well you know they're not [TS]

  they don't make this stuff anyway they [TS]

  license all this all the screens are [TS]

  licensed or some other manufacturer [TS]

  presumably they'd have to license their [TS]

  television innards from you know who are [TS]

  like they buy the iPad screens from I [TS]

  think LG or you know I don't know who I [TS]

  don't know makes their screens for all [TS]

  their stuff but someone else make Apple [TS]

  doesn't make these the Apple design you [TS]

  design them they design the cases and [TS]

  often oftentimes they design the circuit [TS]

  boards and even perhaps the analog [TS]

  circuitry that goes inside them but the [TS]

  actual LCD panels are plasma or whatever [TS]

  they were use for a TV come from another [TS]

  company and most of those companies make [TS]

  television set so LG makes television [TS]

  sets I don't know if LG makes pcs maybe [TS]

  they do but it's kind of all those [TS]

  relationships where if you're buying [TS]

  from Sam so they have the same image [TS]

  situation with Samsung they buy you know [TS]

  the systems on chips from Samsung that [TS]

  used to buy memory from Samsung you know [TS]

  flash memory and RAM chips and all sorts [TS]

  and stuff like that but Samsung will [TS]

  also makes phones that compete with [TS]

  Apple's phones but it's the same [TS]

  situation with television you'd be like [TS]

  well you know you weren't you got to buy [TS]

  your panels from somebody and then you [TS]

  package them up and you sell them as [TS]

  televisions but really Samsung is going [TS]

  to be making more money by selling the [TS]

  television set itself than Apple [TS]

  presumably if they were just competing [TS]

  on like just like making actual plain [TS]

  old television set with a tuner and you [TS]

  know special sauce or anything like that [TS]

  because Samsung is going to give Apple a [TS]

  higher price than it gives itself when [TS]

  it makes its own television sets so it [TS]

  seems like that would be something that [TS]

  Apple but only add if they thought you [TS]

  couldn't do the product without like [TS]

  there was some compelling reason for [TS]

  them to do it because it's not like [TS]

  they're without by making the television [TS]

  set will make so much more money rather [TS]

  than just making the box because you can [TS]

  you can get more margins on the box [TS]

  putting that big expensive item in there [TS]

  the big expensive item that you were [TS]

  going to have lower margins on then the [TS]

  Samsung talked about the panel itself [TS]

  Samsung will have lower margins on its [TS]

  panels higher margins in its panels then [TS]

  you will because Samsung is going to [TS]

  charge you more and then it charges its [TS]

  own TV makers so there have to be some [TS]

  reason to put it in there and finally [TS]

  what's this person's name I could say [TS]

  its splat F com splat is Z glad F the [TS]

  the slang [TS]

  this person's slang name for the command [TS]

  key symbol I was used to call it [TS]

  squiggly when I was [TS]

  but splat squiggly except Thomas we're [TS]

  all different were amenable to [TS]

  everything yes so this is Dan Romer from [TS]

  ER who has recently gone off on his own [TS]

  and made his own site and this is SPLA [TS]

  TF comm he did an article that I was I [TS]

  had been thinking about for a long time [TS]

  like you know well people keep talking [TS]

  about a television set but no one has [TS]

  done no one has done an article that [TS]

  says why would they make a TV instead of [TS]

  a little box we did an entire article [TS]

  it's just about oh the reasons that [TS]

  Apple might make a actual television set [TS]

  instead of just a box I don't think he's [TS]

  trying to say this is what they're going [TS]

  to do or these reasons are so compelling [TS]

  that they're they're certain to do it [TS]

  but the rumors the rumors are like hey [TS]

  we have a rumors of an Apple television [TS]

  and you know kind of like we got all [TS]

  those rumors about the the wedge-shaped [TS]

  larger iPhone there's just so many of [TS]

  those at a certain point I was like [TS]

  what's going to happen because [TS]

  everybody's saying it they're making [TS]

  case it's going to be a wedge-shaped [TS]

  iPhone and you know not so much right [TS]

  well the Apple television set rumors [TS]

  have been around got in a couple years [TS]

  cycles I think last year year before [TS]

  that it these these Apple television set [TS]

  things come around some you'll see one [TS]

  pundit will put something up and say [TS]

  I've got inside info and I'm absolutely [TS]

  certain that Apple's making the TV and [TS]

  then maybe it'll get a little momentum [TS]

  and then the event will come and go and [TS]

  there's no TV and people forget about it [TS]

  and that recycles every couple years so [TS]

  we're in another one of those upswing [TS]

  cycles where people are reporting that [TS]

  they have inside information that Apple [TS]

  is going to make a television this is [TS]

  compounded by the quotes we just talked [TS]

  about from the the biography where he's [TS]

  like I finally cracked it I figured out [TS]

  this TV thing you know and the quote [TS]

  that I just read which was like an [TS]

  integrated television set this is Steve [TS]

  Jobs words when he says television said [TS]

  he was an older person he means an [TS]

  actual TV he doesn't if you meant a [TS]

  little box like Apple TV you would have [TS]

  said that he's using language that says [TS]

  an actual television so Dan farmers set [TS]

  of reasons why they might actually make [TS]

  a whole TV and and they're more or less [TS]

  the reasons I was thinking I was just [TS]

  nice to have someone lay them out I like [TS]

  the fact that he laid them out not as a [TS]

  not trying to convince anybody he's just [TS]

  like you know let's put two columns here [TS]

  reasons they would make a TV reasons [TS]

  they wouldn't and he's filling in the [TS]

  column of reasons they would and all of [TS]

  his reasons I think are good so the [TS]

  first one is that I'll just read the [TS]

  headings and summarizes that Apple sells [TS]

  complete experiences not [TS]

  Isis right now this is kind of a weak [TS]

  reason because everything he's got in [TS]

  there you can say well that build and [TS]

  why did they ever sell the Apple to [TS]

  you've it you know you want to just have [TS]

  one one thing one widget not a bunch of [TS]

  things that you plug together and [TS]

  something that attaches to something [TS]

  else that's not made by them a parolee [TS]

  wants to have the entire experience of [TS]

  watching television you know be seamless [TS]

  and having to attach something to your [TS]

  existing thing through some cable make [TS]

  sure you have the adapter and find a [TS]

  place to plug it in now you got a second [TS]

  remote and stuff that's not the Apple [TS]

  but you know on the foot on the other [TS]

  column of that you know they've got the [TS]

  Apple TV which is exactly like that so [TS]

  clearly they're not going to not to do [TS]

  that they've shown that they'll do the [TS]

  other way the next one is that Apple [TS]

  wants to be the primary interface so [TS]

  he's going through you know the current [TS]

  Apple TV is like input to on your [TS]

  television you know to to make it work [TS]

  you've got to hit the input button on [TS]

  your television remote and your [TS]

  television remote did not come to you [TS]

  from Apple it's from whatever company [TS]

  makes your television or maybe the [TS]

  universe or remote that you bought [TS]

  yourself and you switch the input to [TS]

  tell your big monitor TV screen things I [TS]

  switch to this input and this input is [TS]

  the Apple TV an Apple TV with apples [TS]

  eyes they want that to be input too [TS]

  because right now most people for input [TS]

  one it's your cable box or satellite box [TS]

  or whatever your quote-unquote normal [TS]

  television is assuming you still have a [TS]

  cable or satellite subscription which [TS]

  most people do the vast majority of [TS]

  people when they turn on their [TS]

  television the default the input number [TS]

  one is their satellite box and if it's [TS]

  on some other input that's like you know [TS]

  it says I left it on the blu-ray player [TS]

  input so switch it back to normal TV and [TS]

  that's what they mean by that well Apple [TS]

  wants you to turn on the thing and have [TS]

  it be the Apple interface right away [TS]

  right so that's you know one remote is [TS]

  just the Apple remote and you can say [TS]

  well what if I just took my Apple TV on [TS]

  input one isn't that the same thing well [TS]

  no they want they want to change what [TS]

  the default is where when you watch TV [TS]

  quote-unquote you're watching at you're [TS]

  in an Apple experience and only the [TS]

  other things like oh now I wanna watch a [TS]

  blueberry I'll switch it to that and [TS]

  they would hope that you would I guess [TS]

  it get rid of your cable or subscription [TS]

  or have it as an alternate thing or [TS]

  whatever and you can only really do that [TS]

  like B or eat what he calls input 0 if [TS]

  you make the television set because then [TS]

  all that stuff is built in it's not [TS]

  something else plugged in right so you [TS]

  can just sort of [TS]

  are coded as you know input zero and [TS]

  your thing because I guess Ethernet will [TS]

  go into the back or whatever but that's [TS]

  not an input like HDMI so you know other [TS]

  you could have another HDMI input maybe [TS]

  for your cable box and stuff but the [TS]

  Apple TV would be in the TV and when you [TS]

  turn on that's what you get [TS]

  Apple cells tightly integrated hardware [TS]

  software and services so this goes into [TS]

  talks a little bit about Siri thing [TS]

  which has been another rumor and we [TS]

  talked about many many shows ago but [TS]

  that's been picking up speed [TS]

  where people are talking and thinking [TS]

  about how Syria might work with the [TS]

  television and getting to some of the [TS]

  same issues we discussed about alright [TS]

  well how do i how do i make myself heard [TS]

  well i'm sitting on the couch to the tvs [TS]

  way across they are talking to a [TS]

  microphone and what about like FaceTime [TS]

  is there going to be a camera am i going [TS]

  to take a little eyesight type camera [TS]

  and plug it into the back of a TV and [TS]

  put it on top and then have a little [TS]

  microphone or another wire that's all [TS]

  very on Apple like what's Apple like is [TS]

  you know like an iMac or Apple Cinema [TS]

  Display with mics built-in the cameras [TS]

  built-in it's an HD camera you know you [TS]

  that's what you would expect from an [TS]

  Apple television experience all that [TS]

  stuff would be built in you'd be able to [TS]

  sit on your couch with your Apple remote [TS]

  and do whatever it is you need to do and [TS]

  be able to like FaceTime chat with [TS]

  people however they have to have that [TS]

  work is it a Bluetooth mic that you [TS]

  stick somewhere in the room is it a [TS]

  directional mic that points that you and [TS]

  follows you wherever you are does the [TS]

  camera move is camera build it you know [TS]

  but it's integrated experience like [TS]

  their monitors and like the IMAX are not [TS]

  a bunch of dongles because you do start [TS]

  to have to have a bunch of dongles like [TS]

  kind of like the Wii with the sensor bar [TS]

  on top and or the connect with another [TS]

  box that you put a lot of wires and [TS]

  boxes and sensors to try to make what we [TS]

  imagine to be the potential Siri Apple's [TS]

  evey experience to get out to work and [TS]

  that the next bit is that despite what I [TS]

  said about Apple not getting having the [TS]

  big panel added to your television set [TS]

  having that not add to your your margins [TS]

  in itself because once you add the panel [TS]

  you have to pay for the panel from a [TS]

  vendor and you can only put you know a [TS]

  certain amount of margin on top of that [TS]

  panel to make up the money that you lost [TS]

  by giving Samsung or LG or whatever the [TS]

  profit they got right but the other side [TS]

  of that coin is that by making the [TS]

  device much more expensive obviously an [TS]

  apple [TS]

  television set is not going to cost $99 [TS]

  it's going to be a thousand two thousand [TS]

  you know it's going to cost what a big [TS]

  television set costs but what then once [TS]

  you get up into the higher price range [TS]

  sort of a magical thing happens you can [TS]

  see this when you go to buy a car like [TS]

  when you go into the car dealership [TS]

  you're haggling over price and you will [TS]

  find yourself dismissing a difference in [TS]

  price that an absolute values you would [TS]

  care very much about the item itself was [TS]

  a lower price just because it's a lower [TS]

  percentage so you'll be like you know [TS]

  five hundred here five hundred there not [TS]

  a big deal right when you're buying a [TS]

  car but if you're buying a computer they [TS]

  say do you mind if we add five hundred [TS]

  dollars of this price assume computers [TS]

  or something you could haggle with like [TS]

  cars you'd like what not you can add [TS]

  five hunting about becomes a larger and [TS]

  larger percentage of the whole purchase [TS]

  it starts to make you object to it more [TS]

  so by increasing the price massively [TS]

  from $99 Apple can get away with [TS]

  increasing its margin somebody by [TS]

  charging more so you know say they're [TS]

  Mart or you know even if it's the same [TS]

  amount say it's margin is is 25-30 [TS]

  percent thirty percent of two thousand [TS]

  it's way more than thirty percent of a [TS]

  $99 box and I think they can get away [TS]

  even more than that I think they can [TS]

  actually boost their margin simply by [TS]

  increasing the margins on the more [TS]

  expensive product like they do with the [TS]

  Mac Pros because people's minds work [TS]

  that way they'll say well it's already a [TS]

  two thousand dollar TV set and it was a [TS]

  hundred dollars here there where if you [TS]

  what's a hundred dollars here they're a [TS]

  $99 Apple TV it's doubling the price and [TS]

  people flip out even though it's the [TS]

  same exact $100 it's just not how [TS]

  pricing psychology works with people so [TS]

  not only can they get bigger margins [TS]

  just simply because 30% of mm is more [TS]

  than 30% of 99 I think they can get 31 [TS]

  32 % because people don't notice that [TS]

  difference on a you know on a larger [TS]

  purchase and as I've pointed on the show [TS]

  many times the whole notion of is Apple [TS]

  a hardware company or is Apple software [TS]

  company its meaning a statement but what [TS]

  we can do is look at their their balance [TS]

  sheet and say how does Apple make its [TS]

  money it makes its money by selling [TS]

  hardware the software business the media [TS]

  business selling apps selling songs [TS]

  selling movies renting things all of [TS]

  that makes a little tiny bit of money [TS]

  some of it is kind of like break even a [TS]

  little bit of profit but their meat and [TS]

  potatoes is the margins they make by [TS]

  selling your hardware [TS]

  so if they can find a way to sell people [TS]

  another set of $2,000 products with [TS]

  their usual margins or possibly higher [TS]

  that's that's great for them I think [TS]

  that Apple even though it likes the fact [TS]

  that it's selling more Apple TVs for 99 [TS]

  bucks it doesn't want to sell you know [TS]

  much rather sell you thousands and [TS]

  thousands of 500 iPads than an equal [TS]

  number of $99 Apple TVs it wants to sell [TS]

  you expensive items of a Canon and [TS]

  recently it's this has been a problem [TS]

  with all vendors like the PC makers have [TS]

  been really screwed because I used to [TS]

  sell you computers for $1000 and then [TS]

  just the race to the bottom is now like [TS]

  the average selling price for a PC [TS]

  laptop is well below a thousand dollars [TS]

  whereas Apple's average selling price [TS]

  for its laptops is usually above $1000 [TS]

  so they've been holding the line there [TS]

  but everyone has been dropping alright [TS]

  but people are still going to Best Buy [TS]

  and spending eight hundred nine hundred [TS]

  thousand dollars for a TV right so [TS]

  here's here's a product that has not [TS]

  come people aren't going at the Best Buy [TS]

  and buying 50 inch televisions for three [TS]

  hundred dollars it's just not happening [TS]

  televisions are simply a more expensive [TS]

  product and people are buying them [TS]

  because they're upgrading their old TVs [TS]

  to HD TVs and they want a big TV set [TS]

  right so no matter how cheap you know if [TS]

  you go to the Vizio you know bottom of [TS]

  the lines cheap is you could possibly [TS]

  get it really horrible looking LCD [TS]

  television set [TS]

  people still want 50 inches and that's [TS]

  going to cost you close to a thousand [TS]

  dollars six hundred seven hundred [TS]

  dollars like the cheapest one you could [TS]

  possibly get and once you go up to like [TS]

  60 inch or 70 inch or the people want to [TS]

  see the football in the big screen you [TS]

  just you're over a thousand there's no [TS]

  way to avoid it this you can't sell them [TS]

  for less than that right now so [TS]

  televisions are potentially a way for [TS]

  app for Apple to increase the average [TS]

  selling price of the products that it [TS]

  sells and if it maintains margins or [TS]

  increases them which I think it can they [TS]

  that will be a big boon to their [TS]

  business now so that's the these are all [TS]

  the cases for why you might might want a [TS]

  television set the case is against our [TS]

  our you know Marco covered them pretty [TS]

  well and I think they're pretty strong [TS]

  it's like people people don't turn over [TS]

  the TVs like they turn over their cell [TS]

  phones or you know or like to turn over [TS]

  their Mac's or anything like that people [TS]

  just it's like it was like a piece of [TS]

  furniture and people still treat it that [TS]

  way you know they buy [TS]

  it it's it's in their house you don't [TS]

  get a new one unless you're unhappy with [TS]

  the one you have because it's too small [TS]

  because it's not HD because it breaks [TS]

  but these things tend to last a long [TS]

  time now [TS]

  cell phones used to be cell phones were [TS]

  never that bad cell phones used to be [TS]

  you buy it you wait for your contract to [TS]

  be up and you get a new phone in the [TS]

  contracts for like two years but that's [TS]

  still way more frequent than people were [TS]

  placed at helpin it's like how many [TS]

  televisions have you owned in your life [TS]

  trying to think I mean half dozen really [TS]

  that's why I than mine you see you're [TS]

  going six televisions in my whole life [TS]

  including the ones my mind not when [TS]

  you're a kid like you yourself like when [TS]

  you move out of your parents house and [TS]

  your first TV is yeah I would say maybe [TS]

  three or four and so and how many Macs [TS]

  have you owned during our camera time I [TS]

  got twelve in here now I thirteen I have [TS]

  no idea [TS]

  Hyundai not hundreds but dozens and how [TS]

  many cell phones see now you're making [TS]

  me try and remember things I can't try [TS]

  to block out like well did you did you [TS]

  did you change your cell phone every [TS]

  time your oh you didn't you're a [TS]

  non-contract person so I don't know [TS]

  maybe you're different but I used to [TS]

  back in the days when I used to do [TS]

  contracts at the minute that contract is [TS]

  up I was out of that old phone been [TS]

  during that time the phones have gotten [TS]

  that's so much better [TS]

  yeah but so I know lots and lots and [TS]

  lots of cell phones and of course Apple [TS]

  has changed that habit among super nerds [TS]

  by you know every tenth they come up [TS]

  with the new iPhone super nerds want one [TS]

  and even if even if you're being [TS]

  responsible and you say okay well I'll [TS]

  hold off and I'll just wait till my [TS]

  contract it up as soon as your contract [TS]

  is up you're changing from you know your [TS]

  3GS to a 4s because that's a huge [TS]

  upgrade so eyeballs actually accelerated [TS]

  that right the televisions for me [TS]

  I bought one television when I was you [TS]

  know I graduated college got married and [TS]

  got a television set for myself and [TS]

  they're like $600 back in the late 90s [TS]

  right [TS]

  I used that television I'm until maybe [TS]

  four years ago when I bought a friend's [TS]

  television yeah from a used television [TS]

  for a hundred bucks so I was my second [TS]

  television both those were standard def [TS]

  Posehn the more Sony Trinitron and then [TS]

  I had been planning HD upgrade for a [TS]

  long time and then I finally pulled the [TS]

  trigger [TS]

  by HD television so I've owned three [TS]

  televisions in my independent adult life [TS]

  and the number of Mac's during that time [TS]

  again destino seven eight nine I don't [TS]

  know if I even wanna count like my [TS]

  wife's max then I'm not even counting [TS]

  used Mac's that I bought at the MIT swap [TS]

  and stuff even funded with that how [TS]

  about the MIT swap I am a big MIT swap [TS]

  fan I I've gone there for years I used [TS]

  to go there and I used to see him there [TS]

  before I actually knew him because he'd [TS]

  have the hat on and stuff or whatever I [TS]

  never actually said hi to him but now [TS]

  that we know each other we have not [TS]

  actually seen each other this well I had [TS]

  to stop going because I had I mean kind [TS]

  of the same reason he found a way to did [TS]

  D he found a coping mechanism but there [TS]

  was people just take photographs of the [TS]

  items but a certain point I had to stop [TS]

  because every time I went I would come [TS]

  home with car loads of stuff and my [TS]

  attic just started to fill up and so I [TS]

  had to cut myself off so I only went [TS]

  like once or twice this season I usually [TS]

  I go and my friend is selling something [TS]

  doesn't even get in early with the [TS]

  sellers that's a secret that he may that [TS]

  he didn't mention but you really want to [TS]

  get something they either pay to sell [TS]

  something it becomes friends with [TS]

  someone who's selling but the sellers [TS]

  get in really early and then just go in [TS]

  with the seller as their helper person [TS]

  then you can browse well everybody's [TS]

  setting up but anyway yeah I've got a [TS]

  lot of hardware from that so the the [TS]

  television turnover rate is not the [TS]

  habits people have for buying new [TS]

  televisions is not great for Apple [TS]

  because when Apple comes out with a new [TS]

  cell phone there's certain number people [TS]

  turning over every two years just by [TS]

  even before they start to try to induce [TS]

  this 18-month one-year cycle there are a [TS]

  lot of people whose contract is up so [TS]

  when they introduce the first iPhone [TS]

  maybe people didn't break their [TS]

  contracts to get it they took a [TS]

  wait-and-see but the people whose [TS]

  contracts were up there like oh maybe [TS]

  I'll try this iPhone thing right but [TS]

  there's no contract for your television [TS]

  so they introduced a television set [TS]

  there's not people there's not a [TS]

  two-year interval of people coming into [TS]

  the market for a new television right [TS]

  there is a mark of people buying a new [TS]

  television switching from HD from non HD [TS]

  to HD but I don't know where we are in [TS]

  that transition certainly among Apple's [TS]

  best consumers like the the early [TS]

  adopters and the people who want the [TS]

  best Apple stuff and you know people own [TS]

  Apple stuff I would imagine they either [TS]

  don't watch television at all or they [TS]

  already have HD [TS]

  television so I don't think they can [TS]

  introduce a television set and and [TS]

  expect that there will be a big market [TS]

  of people who are like well I was [TS]

  looking for a TV anyway so I'll check [TS]

  out this Apple thing because among their [TS]

  customers we've already got HD TVs and [TS]

  among regular people there's just not [TS]

  that kind of turnover right so for a [TS]

  television set but - for Apple to [TS]

  release one and for it to get any [TS]

  traction at all in the market it has to [TS]

  be something different than a plain [TS]

  television set and I think it also has [TS]

  to be something different than the [TS]

  equivalent of taking the current Apple [TS]

  TV and jamming up inside the television [TS]

  set [TS]

  there's no matter how cool you make the [TS]

  television set and this is the thing [TS]

  that burns maybe like we've did all the [TS]

  shows about television I'm such a [TS]

  stickler for these little details of [TS]

  image quality and I don't want any fans [TS]

  with Oh Steve was with me on the Oh fan [TS]

  thing so I have high hopes for an Apple [TS]

  TV there but it's very specific about [TS]

  all the the image and input options and [TS]

  all that stuff right but Apple [TS]

  historically has or at least in the past [TS]

  decade has not been like the old Apple [TS]

  the old Apple would say what is the best [TS]

  color display technology current of [TS]

  currently available in the entire world [TS]

  that's what we're going to use to build [TS]

  our Apple monitors or even the first [TS]

  laptop we're going to make a laptop with [TS]

  a flat screen where is the best flat [TS]

  screen available prices no objects [TS]

  that's how you get the Mac portable [TS]

  which is the the first quote-unquote [TS]

  portable Macintosh was like 16 pounds [TS]

  with lead-acid battery in it I actually [TS]

  have one of those in my attic by the way [TS]

  they are monsters and they put an [TS]

  active-matrix display in it which no one [TS]

  even heard of what active nature but [TS]

  basically meant that the cursor and [TS]

  everything on it what didn't have [TS]

  humongous ghost trails behind it and it [TS]

  cost an arm and a leg and the Mac [TS]

  portable I forget what the price rotor [TS]

  core was but it's just astronomically [TS]

  more expensive because that's the way [TS]

  they used to do things Apple hardware [TS]

  used to be what's the best we can buy [TS]

  and still be able to sell it for less [TS]

  than the price of a house I guess and [TS]

  we'll put that in but the later Apple [TS]

  has been but we want good displays right [TS]

  but if there's a slightly better panel [TS]

  out right now that maybe Dell is selling [TS]

  or HP is selling or you know NEC or [TS]

  whoever those like high-end graphic [TS]

  artists color calibrated really [TS]

  expensive displays like well we're not [TS]

  going to buy one of those because we [TS]

  think that's overkill and if we did that [TS]

  we have to sell our monitors for like [TS]

  four grand kind of like a or who's [TS]

  company does the really expensive ones [TS]

  is it is it NEC NEC I used to I don't [TS]

  know how they compare price-wise anymore [TS]

  if they're still making them yeah oh [TS]

  they sell consumer stuff but they also [TS]

  sell like you are graphics RS here's a [TS]

  super expensive one oh yeah like that [TS]

  like photographers who must have perfect [TS]

  color matching and yeah they I think the [TS]

  NEC we could ask Duncan but I think the [TS]

  NEC is still the kid the king in that [TS]

  space and they come with they would come [TS]

  with the optical calibrator that you [TS]

  clamp on to the thing like the highest [TS]

  end display you can get but apples like [TS]

  that's not appropriate for our business [TS]

  we want to sell to consumers so they [TS]

  will Apple want to get the IPS displays [TS]

  and I should put a Wikipedia page with [TS]

  their IPs and PVA and all these other [TS]

  different technologies used to make LCDs [TS]

  and they'll use the LED backlighting [TS]

  right so but try to they'll try to be [TS]

  like the 80 or 90% solution because I [TS]

  don't want to be the highest of the high [TS]

  end is that just that prices them out of [TS]

  the market they want to have their [TS]

  monitors be in range so the Apple [TS]

  27-inch displays a thousand bucks it [TS]

  looks really nice but it is definitely [TS]

  not the best display panel you can buy [TS]

  you want to say I want the best 27-inch [TS]

  or round abouts display panel I can buy [TS]

  Apple doesn't sell it to you so if that [TS]

  makes television set [TS]

  you're not gonna whatever they make [TS]

  first of all I would imagine they would [TS]

  make it LCD just because that's what [TS]

  they're familiar with they wouldn't go [TS]

  with plasma or something but as [TS]

  discussed in previous shows if you want [TS]

  the absolute best image quality in a non [TS]

  projector television set I get an actual [TS]

  direct view television set plasma is [TS]

  still the way to go and I don't think [TS]

  Apple would go with the plasma because [TS]

  the power concerns because of all you [TS]

  know the the fact that it might need [TS]

  fans the fact that their entire business [TS]

  and all their contracts have to do with [TS]

  LCDs I would imagine they would go with [TS]

  an LCD television set and maybe LED [TS]

  backlighting but I imagine it would be [TS]

  edge lit because they like the thinness [TS]

  there wouldn't be that the backlight [TS]

  wouldn't be directly behind it would be [TS]

  on the edges and reflected with mirrors [TS]

  and that does make this hats thinner [TS]

  which Apple likes but it's not as good [TS]

  as direct backlighting and there's the [TS]

  whole local dimming thing we discussed [TS]

  so go back to listen to whatever episode [TS]

  that was when we discussed television [TS]

  technology [TS]

  what I'm getting at is that if Apple [TS]

  came out with television set I ignore [TS]

  everything else that has to do with this [TS]

  television set I would say I would look [TS]

  at it and say that the picture quality [TS]

  of that television is not as good as [TS]

  other televisions I can buy for less [TS]

  money or even possibly my current [TS]

  television set uh and that's probably [TS]

  not a problem for most people I just [TS]

  bring it up because it's an issue for [TS]

  people who are real sticklers about [TS]

  their television is that you think all [TS]

  Apple TV is going to come on it's going [TS]

  it's going to be awesome it's going to [TS]

  Apple television set it's not going to [TS]

  be the best television set in terms of [TS]

  just picture quality that you can buy in [TS]

  the market either at the same price or [TS]

  even a lesser price you can get a better [TS]

  looking television set alright so there [TS]

  has to be something his television set [TS]

  that's going to make people who aren't [TS]

  in the market for television to buy it [TS]

  it's not going to be because the image [TS]

  quality is so much better something [TS]

  we've made a breakthrough in this [TS]

  television looks better than every [TS]

  television ever sold that's not going to [TS]

  be the case 100% guaranteed it will not [TS]

  right it may look good it'll be fine [TS]

  we'll be better than most people's [TS]

  televisions [TS]

  it'll also be more expensive most [TS]

  people's televisions for the high-end TV [TS]

  people aren't going to be on it so what [TS]

  is it that's gonna make me go out and [TS]

  buy this television set why why do I [TS]

  need this thing in my life do you feel [TS]

  like do you feel like you know the [TS]

  answer well well because any deals if [TS]

  you do we ought to do the sponsor first [TS]

  all right governor [TS]

  you've been on a roll for 38 minutes now [TS]

  squarespace.com [TS]

  they've been on a roll for for about 7 [TS]

  years 7 years of creating content [TS]

  management systems they just came out [TS]

  with a new version of Squarespace that's [TS]

  not available to everybody they're [TS]

  releasing releasing I guess the invites [TS]

  daily though but they've been working on [TS]

  this update for like a year and a half [TS]

  what is Squarespace it's a fully hosted [TS]

  completely managed environment for [TS]

  quickly creating a beautiful website [TS]

  managed from an interface it's like [TS]

  nothing else you've ever seen they've [TS]

  opened up this beta are you going to [TS]

  check this out even if you don't care [TS]

  about the beta don't worry about it [TS]

  because what they've already been [TS]

  building is pretty amazing this is for [TS]

  anybody who wants to make an amazing [TS]

  website bloggers businesses [TS]

  photographers it doesn't matter their [TS]

  platform powers every site it doesn't [TS]

  matter who links to you [TS]

  whether it's John Gruber or anybody else [TS]

  they scale there's nothing that you have [TS]

  to worry about it's it is just it's kind [TS]

  of amazing [TS]

  they have social integration so you can [TS]

  connect to Twitter or Facebook if you [TS]

  must they have built-in customizable [TS]

  photo galleries they have an iPhone iPad [TS]

  app they're going to Android app now if [TS]

  you go that way and you can do every [TS]

  anything you can check your site you can [TS]

  post to your blog you can manage the [TS]

  comments you can see the details stats [TS]

  all while you're on the go it really is [TS]

  amazing [TS]

  so you can try this you can try it for [TS]

  14 days two weeks [TS]

  takes you 30 seconds they'll import your [TS]

  old blog don't even have to pay them for [TS]

  anything but we have a special coupon [TS]

  code for you you use it you get 20% off [TS]

  for six months go to Squarespace comm / [TS]

  5x5 that's step one step two and it asks [TS]

  you for the coupon code it's emotion [TS]

  chip all one word emotion chip 20% six [TS]

  months Squarespace calm / 5x5 just go [TS]

  there you'll be supporting the show sign [TS]

  up you'll be doing yourself a favor [TS]

  that's my little slogan for them my LD [TS]

  go for that course as well or is that [TS]

  someone who is actually on the show you [TS]

  know like it and not that I'm an [TS]

  employee but employees of the company [TS]

  can't participant it you're not an [TS]

  employee alright uh you know go checking [TS]

  I'm still looking for something that [TS]

  replace my iWeb look no further this [TS]

  this is the thing to do and and and if [TS]

  anybody needs an emotion chip it's you [TS]

  all right no absolutely [TS]

  they might even be able to do something [TS]

  more for you but at the very least [TS]

  you'll get that that isn't and it is a [TS]

  good discount all right so where was [TS]

  that you were about to tell us Oh [TS]

  during the know during the when you're [TS]

  doing the sponsor I get to look at the [TS]

  chat room a little bit and a couple of [TS]

  people bring up 4k which is a resolution [TS]

  for I think it's just for filming now [TS]

  but anyway you can you can film it you [TS]

  know he's got HD so 1080p HD right [TS]

  that's the highest level the television [TS]

  sets go now and finally pretty much any [TS]

  televisions that you can buy unless it's [TS]

  very small hmm it can do native 1080p [TS]

  but for [TS]

  is the next resolution step up it's like [TS]

  four times a times as many pixels four [TS]

  times as wide four times as high [TS]

  I hope forget what 1080 is 1080 the the [TS]

  height or the width resolution cat room [TS]

  we'll know this in a second [TS]

  so anyway 4k is I think the height goes [TS]

  to 4k someone posted a link to the [TS]

  Wikipedia page it says several different [TS]

  resolutions actually qualifies [TS]

  quote-unquote 4k so it's one of those [TS]

  terms that's not entirely you know [TS]

  nailed down but it's like for 4000 [TS]

  actually what 4k seems to be the width [TS]

  it's 4096 by 3112 and or by 4096 by 1714 [TS]

  there's all sorts of different aspect [TS]

  ratios and resolutions for 4k but the [TS]

  point is it's many many more pixels than [TS]

  1080p and people doing digital [TS]

  filmmaking like making movies have been [TS]

  moving to 4k just because 1080p is kind [TS]

  of a low resolution if you're going to [TS]

  blow it up onto a 60-foot screen you [TS]

  know or like a even just a regular large [TS]

  not imax or anything but just a large [TS]

  rectangular regular movie screen 1080p [TS]

  is kind of Dadi if you think about it [TS]

  because we're all looking at monitors if [TS]

  you have a 24-inch monitor or larger you [TS]

  know you're looking at more than 1080p [TS]

  or at least exactly 1080p now imagine [TS]

  taking that monitor and putting it up in [TS]

  a giant movie screen it starts to get a [TS]

  little bit you know so they want [TS]

  something that has high resident so 4k [TS]

  is the next standard that varies camera [TS]

  shooting and there have been television [TS]

  sets demoed that's how we can display 4k [TS]

  natively and something was saying that [TS]

  if Apple wants to do some sort of [TS]

  display technology that is that's enough [TS]

  to make people say all I'm going to buy [TS]

  this maybe they would be the first one [TS]

  with a mass-market consumer 4k [TS]

  television that I think it's something [TS]

  the old Apple would do the old Apple [TS]

  would say you know we're not just coming [TS]

  out with a laptop or a kind of laptop [TS]

  whose screen is amazing a look at you [TS]

  know you're sick of all that ghosting on [TS]

  your PC laptop look at this no ghosting [TS]

  it's called active matrix people be [TS]

  blown away and willing to pay huge sums [TS]

  of money for it I don't think at Apple [TS]

  today wants to sell millions and [TS]

  millions of items there's no way they [TS]

  can sell millions and millions of 4k [TS]

  television sets and an Apple doesn't [TS]

  even seem willing to offer that as a [TS]

  product I wrote you know the there's no [TS]

  reason that they couldn't have [TS]

  fielded more models of iPod for example [TS]

  like by this point they could say well [TS]

  you know we'll introduce a new ipod that [TS]

  has a Retina display or iPod iPad that [TS]

  has a Retina display but it's going to [TS]

  be hugely expensive and just the [TS]

  high-end product Apple this doesn't seem [TS]

  into that market these days there's [TS]

  gonna be this one iPad everyone can buy [TS]

  it and yes we could make a more [TS]

  expensive version they'd much rather [TS]

  push down they must rather make a [TS]

  cheaper version and much about us say [TS]

  how cheap can we make the 16 gig model [TS]

  how cheap you know without compromising [TS]

  quality without making it crappy without [TS]

  putting on a worse screen or stuff like [TS]

  that but they want to drive the price [TS]

  down they don't want to say oh and for [TS]

  the people who have disposable income [TS]

  for your tiny percentage here is a [TS]

  super-duper iPad the most they'll do is [TS]

  you know here's a 64 gig model but even [TS]

  that they could have fielded a 64 gig [TS]

  model you know or 120 they could put a [TS]

  128 gig most plenty of room in that iPad [TS]

  to put in more memory chips but they're [TS]

  just not interested in that so I don't [TS]

  think they will come up with a 4k [TS]

  television set so I don't think that [TS]

  will be their selling proposition now [TS]

  the selling proposition is getting to [TS]

  before the break what what is it it's [TS]

  going to make anyone buy this thing it [TS]

  has to be about content it just has to [TS]

  be and whether that content is [TS]

  applications which is a valid [TS]

  differentiator or just viewing content [TS]

  it has to be a different or better deal [TS]

  that you get with any of the existing [TS]

  solutions including the current Apple TV [TS]

  so first let start with applications [TS]

  applications were were a big [TS]

  differentiator for phones like people [TS]

  bought why would you buy an iPhone even [TS]

  obviously the first time I wasn't even [TS]

  have apps for it right but once that app [TS]

  thing came around I only started to get [TS]

  rolling you know that there's an app for [TS]

  that thing you'd see you know people who [TS]

  don't know anything about Apple didn't [TS]

  even know the first iPhone came out by [TS]

  the time the App Store came out for the [TS]

  iPhone their friends would be shown and [TS]

  check out as appliques fart app look at [TS]

  this thing looks like I'm drinking a cup [TS]

  of beer when I tilt my iPhone isn't that [TS]

  awesome like that as stupid as it is [TS]

  that really got the ball rolling on the [TS]

  iPhone it wasn't like oh it's a [TS]

  touchscreen interface and it's magical [TS]

  involved like if that's harder sell than [TS]

  your friends seeing some cool app that [TS]

  you have or a dumb app that you have [TS]

  just a fart app anything right that gets [TS]

  the ball rolling right so if Apple could [TS]

  find some way to put applications on a [TS]

  television set [TS]

  you went over your friend's house and [TS]

  instead of just watching TV you had the [TS]

  ability to do app like stuff on there [TS]

  that could be a differentiator the big [TS]

  problem I think is that nobody knows and [TS]

  I think including Apple how how do you [TS]

  make apps work on a television senton [TS]

  you keep your not going to be putting [TS]

  your fingers on it I can tell you that [TS]

  anybody stand in front of it swiping at [TS]

  your televisions that not getting over [TS]

  behind the entertainment center getting [TS]

  fingerprints all over right so how does [TS]

  that even work [TS]

  and and Apple has not been so far a fan [TS]

  of older input methods like there's no [TS]

  reason the Apple couldn't have released [TS]

  a official Bluetooth type device or [TS]

  something that plugged into the iPod did [TS]

  you know something probably plug into [TS]

  the dock connector that gave you an [TS]

  analog stick and buttons for gaming like [TS]

  basically turns it into like a DS or PSP [TS]

  right because that would make a lot of [TS]

  games much easier oh you don't touch the [TS]

  screen for this game this is a [TS]

  traditional game here's a little d-pad [TS]

  who's a little analog stick here's some [TS]

  buttons and now suddenly we've opened up [TS]

  the world of game is had No [TS]

  it's touch screen we touch screen games [TS]

  if a third party wants to try to sell [TS]

  that stuff finally we'll open up the you [TS]

  know you can you can third parties can [TS]

  now make this product I think several of [TS]

  them do actually exist but Apple is not [TS]

  endorsing it and since it's such a small [TS]

  percentage of people with iOS devices [TS]

  who will ever buy that little d-pad [TS]

  think people aren't designing games or [TS]

  the games are designed for touch so I [TS]

  don't think Apple would say well we [TS]

  can't figure out how to way do apps on [TS]

  this thing so we'll just have a [TS]

  peripheral and it's like a directional [TS]

  pad or it's like the Wii mode and we'll [TS]

  build on the IR sensors or it's like the [TS]

  PlayStation Move and it's you know [TS]

  they'll track some sort of ball with the [TS]

  camera that we build in or some way to [TS]

  do stuff on that screen without touching [TS]

  it or or just a regular controller like [TS]

  an Xbox controller like a Pippin or [TS]

  whatever because games are a big [TS]

  application but if you can't touch a [TS]

  screen and you don't have a mouse and [TS]

  you don't have a keyboard [TS]

  your choices are basically you know what [TS]

  does everyone else done before in terms [TS]

  of how do you interact with a television [TS]

  without using one of those methods and [TS]

  there's a whole menagerie of choices and [TS]

  they've been getting better but I don't [TS]

  think any of them are up to Apple [TS]

  standards I don't think any of them [TS]

  would be so compelling that they would [TS]

  make applications great that you know [TS]

  that you'd want to use absent because a [TS]

  lot of people have apps on TVs mine [TS]

  comes with some set of credi app [TS]

  since Samsung televisions have their own [TS]

  apps yeah some people have app stores [TS]

  but it's like what do I do with this [TS]

  what can I just play games like is it [TS]

  just like an Xbox or a Wii or PS you [TS]

  know a PlayStation no that's kind of [TS]

  been done it's not revolutionary it's [TS]

  Apple want to enter that market do they [TS]

  want to make a game console that's a [TS]

  whole other ball of wax and if you did [TS]

  want to make one are you going to build [TS]

  into the TV you know apps on the phone [TS]

  work because because of the range of [TS]

  things you can do with them it Maps [TS]

  application is the fart app that silly [TS]

  games new kinds of games Angry Birds [TS]

  flicking little birds over right you can [TS]

  do Angry Birds with the remote control [TS]

  up up down pull back let you know that's [TS]

  not as fun though it's not if the Angry [TS]

  Birds doesn't take off because that you [TS]

  don't want to sit down in front of TV [TS]

  and do it if you can sit down in front [TS]

  of TV and play a game you want it to be [TS]

  either fun for the whole family like the [TS]

  Wii wherever I can get a kick out of it [TS]

  and it you know it's it's something new [TS]

  and novel but we've kind of already done [TS]

  that with the Wii and all the other [TS]

  stuff or you want it to be like a game [TS]

  game for like the hardcore gamers and [TS]

  apples [TS]

  I don't think interested in entering [TS]

  that market because that market seems to [TS]

  be on it on the decline mostly because [TS]

  of Apple's touch games so I don't quite [TS]

  see how apps are going to be the big [TS]

  selling point of the television unless [TS]

  they figure out the input issue and we [TS]

  talked about Siri with Apple TV and [TS]

  stuff that was an interface for watching [TS]

  television shows and though that is a [TS]

  much more limited world of things you [TS]

  not it's not like a game or an [TS]

  application or anything that you would [TS]

  use on an iOS device where you need like [TS]

  the full range of input and being able [TS]

  to tap on things and drag them and swipe [TS]

  them and enter texts and stuff like that [TS]

  Siri for apple TV would only work [TS]

  because mostly what you want to do is [TS]

  tell it to put a show on and you sit [TS]

  there and watch it [TS]

  tell it to pause tell it to resume [TS]

  whatever the world of things you want to [TS]

  do they'd be emptied the numbers of [TS]

  interactions are much smaller not like [TS]

  using an app where you're constantly [TS]

  using it right and any kind of apps [TS]

  where you're not constantly use it like [TS]

  book readers you're not going to read a [TS]

  book on your television right so I think [TS]

  apps are a good idea but not the kind of [TS]

  apps that we talk about when we talk [TS]

  about what made the the iPhone so great [TS]

  not not games not you know there would [TS]

  be games not fard apps because this is [TS]

  not interesting not word processors GPS [TS]

  map things I don't know what you know [TS]

  all the kinds of apps that people use [TS]

  every day on their iPhone so it has to [TS]

  be a different kind of [TS]

  so the content side the content mostly [TS]

  what we're talking about is so you want [TS]

  me to buy this thing and presumably [TS]

  apples proposition would be buy this [TS]

  thing and stop paying for one of those [TS]

  things you're currently paying for stop [TS]

  paying for cable stop paying for [TS]

  satellite because we're going to offer [TS]

  you the same stuff but in a more [TS]

  attractive package and this gets the [TS]

  stuff that John was talking about Gruber [TS]

  was begging up the whole model of [TS]

  there's a big stream of content coming [TS]

  to your house and you have to sit down [TS]

  in front of it and we decide when it's [TS]

  on and if you want to subvert that you [TS]

  can add another layer this that next [TS]

  layer is a Google TV or a TiVo or DVR [TS]

  where game comes into the house and you [TS]

  buy this other device in this other [TS]

  service that watches that stream [TS]

  constantly and picks out the things that [TS]

  you want so that you can come up to it [TS]

  at a later point and watch stuff that [TS]

  has aired when you weren't there time [TS]

  shifting right changing it from a big [TS]

  stream that you have to sit in front of [TS]

  a certain times to be an experience more [TS]

  like you picking and choosing what you [TS]

  want to watch but it's it's another [TS]

  layer on top of the existing service and [TS]

  this is we recall episode number one [TS]

  hypercritical this is what I so [TS]

  desperately wanted Apple to build I [TS]

  still want them to go I still want [TS]

  someone to build is a really awesome [TS]

  device that sits on top of all the [TS]

  content that I'm already paying for and [TS]

  changes it in a way that it will make me [TS]

  like it better I can watch it whenever I [TS]

  want I can record two things at once I [TS]

  can't watch two shows at the same time [TS]

  record four things at once with the TiVo [TS]

  Oly premiere or whatever I want to have [TS]

  a nice interface I want it to be smart I [TS]

  wanted to say hey the US Open is on I [TS]

  want to see every match of that record [TS]

  the US Open I don't care what channel [TS]

  it's on I don't care it's on espn2 at [TS]

  night but then it switches CBS and then [TS]

  the highlight show just record the US [TS]

  Open you know all the Super Bowls coming [TS]

  up record the Super Bowl I want to tell [TS]

  that to Siri and have a record Super [TS]

  Bowl as opposed to what I do now which [TS]

  is go to TiVo and search for n:f no it's [TS]

  not NFL su-yong is you never know what [TS]

  the hell they're gonna tell the show and [TS]

  the listings it's like it's the Super [TS]

  Bowl is one show in the United States [TS]

  that you'd have a big shiny red button [TS]

  in the menu it should be record the [TS]

  Super Bowl I don't know I want to get [TS]

  into a Tebow rant again but like there [TS]

  was a huge potential for people to do [TS]

  like that better but then there was the [TS]

  d8 conference that I talked about an [TS]

  episode more of the show in the 2008 or [TS]

  something like that when when Steve Jobs [TS]

  onstage he basically said no we're not [TS]

  gonna make a box like that just came [TS]

  right out and said it so I don't things [TS]

  I need to speculate about I don't think [TS]

  Apple would make one of those devices he [TS]

  just came out and said it no we don't [TS]

  want to make one of those no again that [TS]

  was years ago and he's not with the [TS]

  company anymore so they could change [TS]

  their mind I desperately want someone to [TS]

  make one of those because I'm unhappy [TS]

  with the progress t-bo's were making or [TS]

  lack of progress all right but Apple [TS]

  does not seem interested they don't want [TS]

  to be a thing on top of the other stuff [TS]

  it's kind of like if instead of the [TS]

  iTunes Music Store they made something [TS]

  like Radio shift where it was like a PVR [TS]

  for radio where you attach it to analog [TS]

  or your hybrid digital radio or even [TS]

  like internet streaming radio and it [TS]

  would watch the stream and record the [TS]

  song as you wanted and then you can you [TS]

  know that's not what they made they made [TS]

  the iTunes Music Store it said don't go [TS]

  to the music store anymore we're not [TS]

  going to record the stream of music [TS]

  coming out of the radio we are going to [TS]

  replace those things with something we [TS]

  think is better whenever you want come [TS]

  you can sample the songs you know by an [TS]

  individual songs that are buying an [TS]

  album and it comes right from us and [TS]

  we're not we're not a front end for Sam [TS]

  Goody we're not a front end for Tower [TS]

  Records we are not we're not buying from [TS]

  Tower Records and selling it through to [TS]

  you right and that's what you know [TS]

  that's what Tebow is doing that's what [TS]

  Google TV is trying to do all the things [TS]

  it's a layer on top and I just really [TS]

  want one of those for the reason we [TS]

  discussed before is that I want to see [TS]

  all those shows that are coming out of [TS]

  the stream that I baibe subscribe to [TS]

  files that's television over you know [TS]

  Comcast or whatever I subscribe to [TS]

  that's where all the content is and if [TS]

  that's the only way I can get that [TS]

  content then I have I would like a box [TS]

  and sit in front of it and provide me [TS]

  you know to make that better for me [TS]

  right Apple has been trying to [TS]

  circumvent that by saying well forget [TS]

  about that stream like we will will sell [TS]

  you a box and through that box you can [TS]

  buy episodes or whole seasons of [TS]

  television shows ok all right so maybe [TS]

  you know some of them might not be on [TS]

  like you can't watch them the night [TS]

  they're on you go over to the next day [TS]

  sorry about that [TS]

  and some things may not be on there at [TS]

  all and some things may come and go but [TS]

  we'll provide access to Netflix and the [TS]

  Netflix is fighting with the content [TS]

  providers to say okay can we please [TS]

  provide this a movie on streaming oh you [TS]

  can't provide it on streaming until [TS]

  we've had the blu-ray out for a year [TS]

  sorry and you know it's just all these [TS]

  horrible content deals but Apple has [TS]

  been trying to [TS]

  to get out from under them to try to [TS]

  give you a compelling reason not to have [TS]

  your regular television service anymore [TS]

  but basically no one and I'm sorry the [TS]

  Marco gets included and it gets it gets [TS]

  a rounded out due to statistical [TS]

  anomalies but in the grand scheme of [TS]

  things in the United States anybody [TS]

  nobody gets her if their cable just to [TS]

  use Netflix and stuff now [TS]

  listeners of the show is probably a huge [TS]

  proportion of people said I finally cut [TS]

  the cord I finally I love when people's [TS]

  that I caught the cord I don't I cut the [TS]

  cord I don't have cable TV anymore I [TS]

  just watch everything on Netflix well I [TS]

  have bad news for you about where the [TS]

  Netflix come from it comes from a cord [TS]

  right [TS]

  often from the same company that you [TS]

  were previously playing television but [TS]

  anyway the point is stop paying for your [TS]

  television subscription from satellite [TS]

  from from comcast from whoever and just [TS]

  do the ala carte thing whether that's [TS]

  Netflix streaming where you pay a [TS]

  monthly fee you say I'm happy to watch [TS]

  just whatever is on Netflix streaming or [TS]

  you do when I'm interested in movie I'll [TS]

  buy it from iTunes and watch it people [TS]

  who can get by like that that's great [TS]

  for them and they find it much [TS]

  preferable to paying 60 $80 a month when [TS]

  said they can pay you know 20 or 30 [TS]

  dollars just to watch the things they [TS]

  want when they want them but for the [TS]

  vast majority of people the content [TS]

  simply isn't there yet and it isn't [TS]

  there for a good reason it's not it's [TS]

  not there because the content owners [TS]

  don't want it to be there because the [TS]

  whole value chain involved in delivering [TS]

  that to you through cable companies [TS]

  those deals are you know it's too much [TS]

  power in too few companies and it also [TS]

  has to do with the fact that this as few [TS]

  cable companies there are there's lots [TS]

  of regional differences so it's not like [TS]

  one big hammer that you can bring down [TS]

  even cellphone networks are better where [TS]

  you basically just only got four big [TS]

  players in the US but the number of [TS]

  cable companies in the u.s. is much [TS]

  larger than four and in the whole world [TS]

  it's even worse so Apple is kind of [TS]

  dealt with that with with cell phones by [TS]

  partnering with a bazillion different [TS]

  cell phone providers in every country [TS]

  you know the people in the u.s. just [TS]

  don't know are four but there's millions [TS]

  of cell phone providers they've dealt [TS]

  with that business elsewhere well it's [TS]

  even worse for television and we just [TS]

  can't you know Apple and everybody [TS]

  Netflix everybody just cannot wrench [TS]

  control of that content from the people [TS]

  who currently make money karma because I [TS]

  don't want to give it up why would [TS]

  Comcast what you know who they're not [TS]

  going to say oh you you know whoever's [TS]

  got the contracts for airing NFL games [TS]

  are airing local Yankees games or [TS]

  whatever they don't [TS]

  give that contract up they want it to be [TS]

  exclusive that we have exclusive right [TS]

  to air Yankees games in New York metro [TS]

  area there's no way in hell they're [TS]

  gonna they're gonna say okay [TS]

  well next time we renegotiate we'd [TS]

  really like to sell Yankees games to all [TS]

  this is differently the MLB app kind of [TS]

  has rights of everything baby Yankees [TS]

  are a bad example I don't know about [TS]

  sports to say this but anything any [TS]

  television show or any type of thing [TS]

  like that the people who are currently [TS]

  making money for it don't want other [TS]

  people to be able to make money for it [TS]

  especially if the goal of other people [TS]

  is to make customers stop subscribing to [TS]

  television right and so the the great [TS]

  white hope of the Apple television set [TS]

  has almost nothing to do with the [TS]

  television set almost no new technology [TS]

  and everything to do with will they [TS]

  magically come on stage and say we have [TS]

  reached a critical mass of content we've [TS]

  got local news we've got your local [TS]

  sports team we've got the NFL we've got [TS]

  Major League Baseball we've got all your [TS]

  shows [TS]

  we've got first-run movies this the [TS]

  second they come out in the theater you [TS]

  can watch them on on your television [TS]

  like all sorts of fantasy scenarios [TS]

  where it would suddenly make a whole [TS]

  bunch of people say I'm not paying 80 [TS]

  bucks for Comcast a month anymore I'm [TS]

  going to buy this Apple television set [TS]

  and just buy Internet access from [TS]

  Comcast [TS]

  which is kind of a shame that you do the [TS]

  same company still gets to sell your [TS]

  internet access because apples not on [TS]

  that business right and I'll watch [TS]

  everything on my Apple television set [TS]

  because it's cheaper it's all a cart I [TS]

  can watch it whenever I want I don't [TS]

  have to wait like if the current new [TS]

  episode of Fringe is on I can watch it [TS]

  when everyone else is watching it uh but [TS]

  my TV doesn't have to record it if I [TS]

  come in an hour later and I want to [TS]

  watch Fringe now or later it's ready for [TS]

  me because Apple's got them day and date [TS]

  you know when they air on the television [TS]

  set uh and slowly that model you know [TS]

  Apple want that model to fade away and [TS]

  it's just like well we do a lot of [TS]

  Fringe every week and it comes out of [TS]

  like midnight you know Eastern Time so [TS]

  if you were crazy you know that no [TS]

  longer a scheduled stream of shows and [TS]

  no longer constant the primetime but [TS]

  merely a big ala carte menu of things [TS]

  you can choose to watch uh that I think [TS]

  would get people to buy an Apple [TS]

  television set but I also think that's [TS]

  that's not going to happen there's just [TS]

  no way that Apple can get a critical [TS]

  mass of television shows though now they [TS]

  could do the foot-in-the-door thing [TS]

  where they say okay currently there's X [TS]

  percentage of people in the US who only [TS]

  subscribe to Netflix or only watch [TS]

  iTunes stuff on Apple TV [TS]

  we double that percentage make it from [TS]

  point O 1% to 0.02 percent you know a [TS]

  little bit at a time we'll get a few [TS]

  more shows weed a little more that's the [TS]

  thing that the Gruber was talking about [TS]

  where he was saying the future of [TS]

  television not channels but apps right [TS]

  so you've got the MLB app [TS]

  so you've got the MLB app [TS]

  all right and if you've got the [TS]

  Bloomberg TV app or to get the NFL app [TS]

  instead of having channels have apps [TS]

  that that's it's a strange way to to [TS]

  reimagine television as a series of [TS]

  applications I think that's not really [TS]

  an appropriate model kind of like when [TS]

  you set books in the App Store and each [TS]

  book was an individual application [TS]

  that's not the way to do that right the [TS]

  iBook store Kindle Store [TS]

  you know iBook store is the best example [TS]

  because at least you can buy the thing [TS]

  from within the app that's a better way [TS]

  to do it ensuring intern app isn't great [TS]

  but the concept is the same that the [TS]

  people who own these contents would [TS]

  decide we're going to invest in making [TS]

  an application or whatever you have to [TS]

  make so that our content is available to [TS]

  IRS users or two people two users of [TS]

  this new Apple TV set and they're [TS]

  already doing you know the MLB app and [TS]

  stuff in the end the Bloomberg app [TS]

  they're already doing that for iOS [TS]

  devices a couple people have said well [TS]

  what if they just build in like a little [TS]

  Apple TV box and you airplay them from [TS]

  the devices you can already get them at [TS]

  so that I think that's not the seamless [TS]

  integrated experience that Steve Jobs [TS]

  was describing in that thing especially [TS]

  with the syncing with iCloud everything [TS]

  I think he wants you to sit down I don't [TS]

  think he wants you to pull up your iPad [TS]

  or your iPod touch and airplay stuff [TS]

  over that by launching the NFL app I [TS]

  think he wants you to sit down in front [TS]

  of the thing and be able to see [TS]

  everything that's available including [TS]

  things that are currently happening now [TS]

  assuming they have live TV and choose [TS]

  from that I don't think he wants you to [TS]

  bring a menagerie of other devices close [TS]

  to your dumb relatively dumb television [TS]

  set and airplay them onto it just like [TS]

  you would onto a television with a Apple [TS]

  TV right now [TS]

  so so I'm kind of on the other thing is [TS]

  where he's got the I cracked it quote a [TS]

  nice eikaiwa finally figured out where [TS]

  yeah I'm sure he thinks that I'm sure he [TS]

  thought the same thing when he made the [TS]

  iPod hi-fi right the number of things [TS]

  that he's been excited about and it [TS]

  thinks he's probably cracked the problem [TS]

  it's not a guarantee that he has right [TS]

  or that Apple has or that you know they [TS]

  tried out and didn't actually work he [TS]

  may be excused excited about a lot of [TS]

  things but a lot but you know only some [TS]

  of those things are successful in the [TS]

  market and I think the things that he's [TS]

  excited about have always been filtered [TS]

  through the lens of the rest of the [TS]

  company being [TS]

  or against it I haven't gotten I'm still [TS]

  about like a quarter of the way through [TS]

  the book so I haven't gotten to the [TS]

  later chapters but all the elite things [TS]

  I've seen on the web made me think that [TS]

  later you'll see instances where Steve [TS]

  Jobs is either not for or adamantly [TS]

  against a move that we all think was [TS]

  brilliant it turned out to be really [TS]

  important for the company because Steve [TS]

  Jobs is not the company is not just one [TS]

  person so we see the successes of Apple [TS]

  and occasionally you know things that [TS]

  sneak through there aren't successes but [TS]

  who knows how many things that he's been [TS]

  excited about internally that were [TS]

  really dumb and would not have worked or [TS]

  things that he opposed it turned out to [TS]

  be awesome right I don't want to cite [TS]

  specific examples then again I've gotten [TS]

  at that point in the book but when he [TS]

  says that he thinks there's an interface [TS]

  that's really awesome I'm sure he does [TS]

  think it's awesome but he's not the [TS]

  average consumer and as the things that [TS]

  he finds awesome diverge from the things [TS]

  that regular people find awesome that [TS]

  the success rate of the products go down [TS]

  like I'm sure he did replace his stereo [TS]

  with an iPod hi-fi but the rest of the [TS]

  world didn't right or the g4 cube for [TS]

  another example he thought it was so [TS]

  awesome would definitely be worth that [TS]

  amount of money the rest of the world [TS]

  disagreed but the iPhone really was [TS]

  awesome enough that people you know [TS]

  hooked onto it so I'm not so convinced [TS]

  that just because Steve Jobs is excited [TS]

  about this and they finally solve the [TS]

  problem for Apple television that it's [TS]

  going to be a big big deal and the way [TS]

  to check for this is to see when the [TS]

  hobby light goes off right you know [TS]

  Apple TV is just hobby they're [TS]

  constantly lowering expectations you [TS]

  know we're not going to sell as many of [TS]

  these as we sell iOS devices we haven't [TS]

  figured out a way to make money we're [TS]

  not expecting people to immediately [TS]

  cancel their cable television and just [TS]

  buy Apple TVs because they didn't a lot [TS]

  of people bought them more people than [TS]

  when it was 300 bucks but they didn't [TS]

  they didn't replace their television [TS]

  sets with them so if Apple comes out [TS]

  with television set in Steve Jobs saying [TS]

  I cracked it I think he thinks that when [TS]

  they feel the product that incorporates [TS]

  these things that he thinks are so [TS]

  awesome it's going to do much much [TS]

  better than the existing Apple TV like [TS]

  it's going to it's going to sell in more [TS]

  numbers it's going to make the more [TS]

  money it's going to be the start of [TS]

  something big and the ways to do that as [TS]

  you can you can start a platform you can [TS]

  sell applications for it or you can make [TS]

  it you can finally start stealing [TS]

  customers from cable [TS]

  and the final part about stealing [TS]

  costumes from cable and make as I [TS]

  mentioned before is that most people get [TS]

  their internet access through the cable [TS]

  companies now and the same people who [TS]

  sell in television those people want to [TS]

  sell you telephone television and [TS]

  Internet access [TS]

  and if it turns out that people suddenly [TS]

  start buying Apple TV the Apple stole it [TS]

  the mercy of those people because those [TS]

  people can say oh so you don't want to [TS]

  do our triple play which they all call [TS]

  it you know phone television or whatever [TS]

  you just want to have internet access or [TS]

  Internet access and phone all right so [TS]

  the price for that will actually be more [TS]

  expensive than what you're doing now you [TS]

  know or the price from that will be five [TS]

  dollars less than what you're doing now [TS]

  but oh you know once you get out of our [TS]

  triple everything you know they can do [TS]

  so many things with the pricing not even [TS]

  getting into the whole conspiracy theory [TS]

  of like they're going to slow down [TS]

  traffic to the Apple special Apple [TS]

  television set if they can tell it's a [TS]

  Netflix they're gonna you know throttle [TS]

  it or that the whole dough shenanigans [TS]

  which they get into trouble for with for [TS]

  the sec and all that you know lobbyist [TS]

  business even ignoring it they can just [TS]

  say fine we're just gonna we're just you [TS]

  know if you don't buy a triple play it's [TS]

  actually more expensive you so you might [TS]

  as well just get this thing and now [TS]

  don't you feel dumb connecting a [TS]

  television that's can't even read the [TS]

  Cape the cable television shows that [TS]

  you're getting especially if Apple [TS]

  doesn't come out of the gate with 100 [TS]

  percent solution like well I can watch [TS]

  most things on my new Apple TV set but [TS]

  when I want to watch this particular [TS]

  show I have to watch on HBO I [TS]

  that's bad example because I have an app [TS]

  but you know are whatever the show is I [TS]

  have to watch a Doctor Who on BBC [TS]

  America unless I want to wait a day [TS]

  after it aired and I don't like waiting [TS]

  a day so I really don't want to buy TV [TS]

  that can't even show the stuff in that [TS]

  cable box is putting out well why don't [TS]

  you just cancel the cable box and you [TS]

  will be tempted well they'll charge me [TS]

  more so this is a tough tough nut to [TS]

  crack to crack there and that's why I [TS]

  think everyone keeps going towards [TS]

  applications because that's that's [TS]

  something that the cable companies don't [TS]

  have an answer for or it's like all the [TS]

  reason I want the Apple TV is because it [TS]

  runs apps and they're awesome for some [TS]

  reason that none of us can can think of [TS]

  but it's something that's not answerable [TS]

  the cable companies are not going to [TS]

  field an app store the cable companies [TS]

  cannot make a platform like iOS they [TS]

  cannot recruit develop as they simply [TS]

  cannot like technically it's possible [TS]

  but realistically that's so far from [TS]

  their competency whatever their company [TS]

  sees maybe it just forget it's not gonna [TS]

  happen so I've got I've got a question [TS]

  for you about this and hang on let's do [TS]

  our second sponsor its tiny letter com [TS]

  this is a great this is a simple [TS]

  newsletter app for people with something [TS]

  to say there are no to HTML templates [TS]

  there's no sign up embed code there's no [TS]

  API each account it's just one mailing [TS]

  list you just write and send it's simple [TS]

  it's personal and best of all it's [TS]

  totally free how do you how do you get [TS]

  this you go to tiny letter com you sign [TS]

  up you start writing that's it [TS]

  tiny letter dot-com simple could it be [TS]

  easier that I don't think it could be I [TS]

  like the name it reminds me a tiny wing [TS]

  tiny wings tiny wing I never know if [TS]

  it's plural or singular I think it's [TS]

  singular so much like him tiny letter [TS]

  com not tiny wing they did not sponsor [TS]

  shame on them but tiny letter did it's [TS]

  also a cute name so what if Apple really [TS]

  doesn't care how often people buy these [TS]

  things because again this is the biggest [TS]

  argument the biggest strike against this [TS]

  which is your your getting to this or [TS]

  you actually address this to some degree [TS]

  look at your cinema display sitting on [TS]

  your desk I'm assuming you don't you [TS]

  don't use anything but a cinema display [TS]

  at home you are correct so how old is [TS]

  this I'm looking at the 23 inch aluminum [TS]

  with the white sides right and previous [TS]

  to that I had the 22 inch with the [TS]

  moment to clear legs now this one that I [TS]

  have here I believe is the 24 inch LED [TS]

  they didn't do a smaller than the 24 LED [TS]

  did they ah I think that was the first [TS]

  LED when is also the first glass front [TS]

  yeah I think that was the first LED back [TS]

  was own yeah I still consider this Monta [TS]

  screen to be new to me this is the new [TS]

  display and I bought this the instant [TS]

  that those things came out uh you know [TS]

  it this is still my new one yeah and [TS]

  think like does it look worse than it [TS]

  did when your first look the same [TS]

  because it's an LED in theory it should [TS]

  never fade it should never you know get [TS]

  dim or anything looks great [TS]

  it looks beautiful I love it and I can [TS]

  come up with no reason why I would want [TS]

  to replace this right now I can't think [TS]

  of a reason why the new ones are simply [TS]

  too large they're ridiculous they're [TS]

  embarrassing [TS]

  [Music] [TS]

  and now here come the emails from people [TS]

  well I need them because it will find [TS]

  then if you need to get it for me this [TS]

  is perfect I have no I have no plans to [TS]

  ever replace this thing until it dies [TS]

  and the TV that we have in the other [TS]

  room we've got to believe it's a 46-inch [TS]

  samsung TV we've talked about this a [TS]

  little bit same situation there until [TS]

  that thing until that thing dies and [TS]

  stops working completely I have no plans [TS]

  to replace that I'm almost embarrassed [TS]

  that we have such a large TV in our [TS]

  house and and it's it's fine it's plenty [TS]

  big it's a good TV I I have no need to [TS]

  replace it now I'll say this if Apple [TS]

  came out with with an Apple television [TS]

  set I would buy it because we anticipate [TS]

  that it would do all the things that you [TS]

  mentioned it would have to do well [TS]

  no but which of those things would be [TS]

  enough for you to buy it because I [TS]

  already said that like I don't think [TS]

  they can ever get enough content to make [TS]

  people switch it you still have a cable [TS]

  subscription right unfortunately I do [TS]

  right and so are you like kind of on [TS]

  just on the edge of being able to ditch [TS]

  that cable do you think not oh well [TS]

  no way not even close yeah so it would [TS]

  take us in your more closer to the [TS]

  mainstream that it would take a [TS]

  substantial amount of content for you to [TS]

  flip over like there's some things you [TS]

  need like you need NFL I guess and [TS]

  certain other shows that you wouldn't [TS]

  want to wait until the day after to [TS]

  watch Fringe or whatever right well and [TS]

  here here's the thing I have ditched [TS]

  cable and we did it I've done that twice [TS]

  now where we went a period of time [TS]

  whether it was a month or a few months [TS]

  without it and you know maybe maybe if [TS]

  you don't have kids [TS]

  ah it's it's easier to do that maybe if [TS]

  you don't have kids and you don't kit [TS]

  you don't care about sports and you [TS]

  don't [TS]

  there aren't television shows that you [TS]

  enjoy watching when their new mom Marco [TS]

  had to had three out of three of those [TS]

  but something's gonna have two out of [TS]

  three now see if that changes there are [TS]

  a lot of people who will say that we [TS]

  don't like for our kids to watch regular [TS]

  TV anyway we like to I won't use the [TS]

  word control [TS]

  but we like to strongly influence what [TS]

  our kids watch and we provide them with [TS]

  the programming of our choice or then [TS]

  you have the the the real the people who [TS]

  really look down your their nose again [TS]

  say well our kids don't watch TV well [TS]

  see the thing is on that particular [TS]

  topic having cable which I've always had [TS]

  and never even thought of ditching [TS]

  somebody from my own needs I have too [TS]

  many shows that I want to watch that and [TS]

  I want to watch them day out because I'm [TS]

  stickler right so but my children have [TS]

  never ever just watched television [TS]

  quote-unquote as and sitting down in [TS]

  front of it and they don't know channels [TS]

  exist the only things they watch are [TS]

  things that I record on the DVR for them [TS]

  that's all they have to choose from [TS]

  that's it [TS]

  movies that I buy and television shows [TS]

  that I record so for example my son it's [TS]

  easier for the first child to think for [TS]

  his first several years of life he only [TS]

  ever watched educational programming [TS]

  from PBS like that's the only shows he [TS]

  knew existed and as he gets older it's [TS]

  hard to like hold the line enough [TS]

  because kids want to watch he wants to [TS]

  watch Star Wars the Clone Wars which was [TS]

  not educational and so you know when [TS]

  he's like five I let him watch his first [TS]

  non educational program but the second [TS]

  kid she sees him watching Clone Wars and [TS]

  you know something she wants to watch [TS]

  itself like it but still it shows that I [TS]

  select it's not which is why for example [TS]

  they've never seen spongebob neither [TS]

  live because I'm I don't think that's a [TS]

  good show alright so you can have a [TS]

  cable subscription and still 100% [TS]

  control every piece of media to your [TS]

  children see how long they see it what [TS]

  they see everything about it you just [TS]

  have a larger menu of things to choose [TS]

  from as we got like 70 PBS stations so I [TS]

  can just a thing up to like save save at [TS]

  the most 8 episodes of you know Super [TS]

  Why and just always had that queue [TS]

  rotating a new episode so any television [TS]

  the house that can go to they can go up [TS]

  there and pick one of the shows that [TS]

  we've said is acceptable for them and [TS]

  just watch them right so you what you're [TS]

  saying is you can still control that's [TS]

  not you don't just because you have the [TS]

  big fire hose doesn't mean you ever need [TS]

  to have anyone sit in front of it [TS]

  children or adults right so even even [TS]

  the people at anyway those are the three [TS]

  criteria that I would say have brought [TS]

  us back one of the big ones is you know [TS]

  when a new episode of Boardwalk Empire [TS]

  comes out you know what I'd like to [TS]

  watch that I don't I don't necessarily [TS]

  want to weigh [TS]

  until the entire season is available to [TS]

  be downloaded on iTunes I don't download [TS]

  them illegally through the torrents or [TS]

  whatever I did you know that's that's [TS]

  extra trouble I don't need [TS]

  I'll pay money so that they're there and [TS]

  available when I want them to be for [TS]

  example and that that's just one of a [TS]

  handful of shows I we actually don't [TS]

  watch the adults in the house don't [TS]

  watch a whole lot of TV and a lot of [TS]

  what we do watch comes from Netflix via [TS]

  the Apple TV a lot of what we do watch [TS]

  our programs that we've DVR'd the only [TS]

  live TV that I personally watch really [TS]

  ever our sporting events you know I [TS]

  watched I watched Major League Baseball [TS]

  I watch NFL I'm aware that there are [TS]

  some other sports out there and I don't [TS]

  really watch them I do watch golf [TS]

  sometimes so you know for somebody like [TS]

  me I don't I don't even want I don't [TS]

  really even want to watch a sporting [TS]

  event DVR'd [TS]

  I would rather miss the first half and [TS]

  watch alive it's just the way I am or [TS]

  catch up really fast if I have to uh so [TS]

  for somebody like me you know ditching [TS]

  cable yes there yes I could get like an [TS]

  antenna or I could you get the very most [TS]

  basic cable or I could keep the coax [TS]

  plugged into the television and use it [TS]

  as an antenna and okay you know like I [TS]

  get all that and in fact yes I've done [TS]

  that I've tried that I've done that and [TS]

  the experience was not what we wanted [TS]

  and it created more hassle and other [TS]

  people looking for a slub a better [TS]

  situation because yeah we all you know [TS]

  if you could just snap your finger say [TS]

  what would I want I would obviously [TS]

  people have to produce content so we [TS]

  understand that there will be delay in [TS]

  producing content we don't want to say [TS]

  like I want to see the whole Doctor Who [TS]

  season right on day one will they have [TS]

  to make the shows so there will always [TS]

  be some sort of time stream release of [TS]

  content right but beyond what is [TS]

  necessary for the creation of the [TS]

  content and maybe what is necessary for [TS]

  the idea of doling it out slowly so that [TS]

  it's not you know so they're all your [TS]

  friends haven't watched the entire [TS]

  season of Doctor Who on the first day of [TS]

  is they stayed up all night and once [TS]

  there's hours of TV right right but [TS]

  beyond simply doling stuff out as a [TS]

  periodical everything else we just said [TS]

  I just want to want to watch it when I [TS]

  want to watch it I don't want any [TS]

  commercials like we all know what our [TS]

  demands are it's just how well are the [TS]

  products serving our needs so for us to [TS]

  buy a different product or do a [TS]

  different thing we want it to be [TS]

  better for us not worse and so you've [TS]

  tried the cable thing and for the [TS]

  content that you wanted it was more of a [TS]

  hassle so you go back right and and to [TS]

  the degree that Apple can get critical [TS]

  mass of content that changes people [TS]

  minds about that that's that's how many [TS]

  consumers they can get and now it's the [TS]

  convincing factor too but once you see [TS]

  your friends like I ditched it and I'm [TS]

  you know I would never ditch real cable [TS]

  but I actually ditched cable for this [TS]

  Apple thing because they have enough [TS]

  content that it's finally crossed my [TS]

  threshold and we all have our own [TS]

  thresholds of what things we want to see [TS]

  right I so but I think that there's no [TS]

  way they can have enough content to come [TS]

  out of the gate and and sell a lot of [TS]

  Apple TVs based on the content deals now [TS]

  when you were saying before I think is [TS]

  that also what so what what if they want [TS]

  to come out and do the slow burn like [TS]

  you look at the iPod growth there was a [TS]

  slow burn it was Mac only it was this [TS]

  weird thing even Mac users didn't know [TS]

  what to think of it for the first year [TS]

  or two or three of the iPod it wasn't [TS]

  you know it was like it didn't do a [TS]

  hockey stick in me it didn't do like the [TS]

  iPad where it comes out of the gate and [TS]

  just they sell them like crazy it's like [TS]

  hotcakes right that so if they don't if [TS]

  they come out with this thing and it's [TS]

  only and content is their angle they're [TS]

  not going with like apps because they [TS]

  haven't figured out some awesome way to [TS]

  deal with like traditional applications [TS]

  or games in a way that's nice [TS]

  and only a few people buy it because [TS]

  like it you there they crossed over like [TS]

  why don't you other people's threshold [TS]

  for acceptability of content and then [TS]

  the next year they get a few more deals [TS]

  and the next year they get a few more [TS]

  deals like they could do that slow burn [TS]

  type thing but unless they keep labeling [TS]

  it as a hobby [TS]

  they're gonna get slammed by everybody [TS]

  if they do that in terms of like you [TS]

  know Apple no one's comes out and says [TS]

  well Apple TV's a failure you know [TS]

  because they were so it's a hobby you [TS]

  know it's not a big deal we make money [TS]

  on it's not you know but look people [TS]

  it's a distraction people are like yeah [TS]

  yeah you saw Apple TV tell us more about [TS]

  your iPhones and iPads and the things [TS]

  that really make you the money right but [TS]

  if they say this is it this is going to [TS]

  be the I don't know what the fourth leg [TS]

  in our stool the fifth I don't how many [TS]

  legs I think they have next door now but [TS]

  like this is gonna be a pillar of our [TS]

  company we think you know and they come [TS]

  out of the gate and it does that slow [TS]

  burn thing like oh then analysts are [TS]

  gonna be like Oh apples television set [TS]

  flounders in the market it's only got [TS]

  0.02 percent market share and most [TS]

  people still have cable and blah blah so [TS]

  that's that's tough way to go if they [TS]

  keep calling it hobby they can say we've [TS]

  changed our hobby to selling little $99 [TS]

  boxes to selling $2,000 [TS]

  television sets are $1500 television [TS]

  sets or whatever and I keep saying at [TS]

  the hobby people could watch it like in [TS]

  the earnings calls with Tim Cook for [TS]

  four years now anytime the ballasts have [TS]

  talked about whoa what is that will to [TS]

  be not going to be hobby or they ask the [TS]

  obligatory Apple TV question hope you [TS]

  like oh it's still hobby blah blah but [TS]

  his big phrases we think there's [TS]

  something there saying we as an Apple [TS]

  this was before our jobs was gone he was [TS]

  speaking of jobs didn't do the earning [TS]

  calls that much in his later years [TS]

  unless it was a special reason for him [TS]

  to be there we think there is something [TS]

  there in the television market I think [TS]

  we all think there's something there the [TS]

  analysts think there's something that [TS]

  the consumers Apple we know that it's a [TS]

  situation that sucks for reasons that [TS]

  knowing the technology sucks because of [TS]

  the incumbents with too much power and [TS]

  content owners and stupid FCC and [TS]

  government and that whole big melange of [TS]

  corruption and influence and anti [TS]

  consumer sentiment adjust everything [TS]

  about it is horrible that's why Apple [TS]

  sees it as like it you know it's a [TS]

  problem or it's an opportunity it's an [TS]

  opportunity to is a big upside there if [TS]

  we can figure out how to do what we did [TS]

  to the phone market which was suck the [TS]

  value away from the people who [TS]

  previously got all the things selling [TS]

  their stupid ringtones for 10 bucks and [TS]

  only letting a few credit applications [TS]

  we can we can make them into a dumb pipe [TS]

  and give us all the profit right they [TS]

  want to do that same thing with [TS]

  television and it's going to be much [TS]

  harder and I have trouble envisioning [TS]

  anything they can feel that will it will [TS]

  come out of the gate like an iPad or [TS]

  even like an iPhone and be as successful [TS]

  at stealing the profits of the [TS]

  television watching industry as the [TS]

  other thing so as excited jobs when Jobs [TS]

  is excited I don't think he's excited [TS]

  about a business model he's probably [TS]

  excited about a hardware piece of [TS]

  software or interface method and that [TS]

  may all be great or maybe so so like I [TS]

  bet he was excited about Siri - I think [TS]

  Siri is a big deal and everyone I've [TS]

  seen with iPhone 4s is excited about [TS]

  Siri and excitement whereas often it [TS]

  still is a useful feature so but that's [TS]

  it's incremental if you just say it's [TS]

  like a regular television set with an [TS]

  Apple TV attached but it's got Siri [TS]

  that's not gonna do it either so I am [TS]

  pretty pessimistic about the prospects [TS]

  of an Apple television set I see exactly [TS]

  how it could be done I just don't think [TS]

  the things that will make it happen are [TS]

  not under Apple's control Apple can't [TS]

  like they don't have an army they can't [TS]

  force content owners to give them [TS]

  they can't you know they can't kick out [TS]

  the incumbents and say we're going to [TS]

  use your wires but not pay you anything [TS]

  other than for being dumb you know pipes [TS]

  to the household not this I don't know [TS]

  I'm I'm not that excited about an Apple [TS]

  TV and I don't have great helpers for it [TS]

  but I will be very very happy to be [TS]

  proven wrong I I would love to see this [TS]

  but like I said I would I would I will [TS]

  buy this if they come out with it if for [TS]

  no other reason then I anticipate that [TS]

  the the integration will be will be nice [TS]

  it will be an attractive TV you need a [TS]

  new TV anyway like I need it I mean I'm [TS]

  like season 23 inch Mont 23 inch model I [TS]

  would like a 27 inch like my wife has I [TS]

  don't need to put it but not so much [TS]

  that I bought a new one right so I just [TS]

  like yeah you know 46 inch TV I could [TS]

  get a 55 inch one right now it wouldn't [TS]

  be that much and it would look nicer but [TS]

  do you need it that much it's like [TS]

  there's TVs fine right Sam I'm a [TS]

  computer monitor next time I get a new [TS]

  computer I'll probably buy a new monitor [TS]

  with it but it's like well you got a [TS]

  much better computer but just keeping [TS]

  using my old monitor so I've used this [TS]

  monitor with a couple of computers so [TS]

  the television thing I think you're [TS]

  already on the edge because you've got [TS]

  an older TV aids it's not massively big [TS]

  these days it's hard to find anything [TS]

  under 50 inches so you might be like [TS]

  yeah I'll get a new one I mean I could [TS]

  it would be an extravagance but would [TS]

  you buy the new Apple TV if they said oh [TS]

  and by the way uh there's there's no [TS]

  other inputs there's no way to connect [TS]

  anything to it you can even watch [TS]

  blu-rays on it there's no inputs to [TS]

  switch between if you pay for cable [TS]

  tough luck there's no place where it [TS]

  plugs in you connect an Ethernet cable [TS]

  or Wi-Fi and that's it now would you buy [TS]

  the Apple TV yep you still get it would [TS]

  it replace your regular television [TS]

  because now you know what do you do for [TS]

  kids shows you could say well we can [TS]

  only get what's on the iTunes Store well [TS]

  I have Netflix for that well I'm I go [TS]

  you watch Netflix is what I'm saying [TS]

  you're getting you're saying that it's [TS]

  not going to preserve the same [TS]

  functionality of the existing Apple TV [TS]

  and provide me with Netflix the Netflix [TS]

  is a weird thing if you think about it [TS]

  because we're we just taught let me just [TS]

  tell you there's only two things plugged [TS]

  into this TV right now one of them is [TS]

  the Apple TV and the other one is the [TS]

  stupid DVR that they force us to use [TS]

  yeah if you could if you could may if [TS]

  the Apple TV was the Apple TV then [TS]

  that's one gone [TS]

  and if if the Apple TV itself let us [TS]

  watch the things that we want to watch [TS]

  whether it was with a cable card whether [TS]

  it was with some other magical thing [TS]

  that Apple figures out how to do then [TS]

  that's that's the DVR box gone so what [TS]

  else is left out we don't have a blu-ray [TS]

  player [TS]

  we don't have explain think about that [TS]

  though we just talked about how Apple [TS]

  does not want to be another layer on top [TS]

  of the thing it Apple put Netflix in the [TS]

  Apple TV but I don't think they liked [TS]

  the idea of okay [TS]

  Netflix goes out there and negotiates to [TS]

  get the content and then we negotiate [TS]

  with Netflix to be put inside the [TS]

  devices in them you know it's like [TS]

  layers upon layers sucking up profit and [TS]

  then it's very easy for the profit [TS]

  suddenly to shift in Netflix and away [TS]

  from Apple for that obviously Apple [TS]

  again Apple makes its money on the [TS]

  hardware so like look this is what we [TS]

  have to do to put the kite on anything [TS]

  I'll tell you what if anything I think I [TS]

  think Apple TV has the potential to prop [TS]

  up Netflix right now more than the other [TS]

  way around that's just my thought on it [TS]

  but I'll tell you what else the fewer [TS]

  boxes of fewer things have to plug in [TS]

  again I'll sit I have no blu-ray player [TS]

  I've never owned one I don't own one [TS]

  I have no gaming consoles that will [TS]

  change when my kids are older but I have [TS]

  none plugged in and unless the Apple TV [TS]

  handles something there but what I'm [TS]

  saying is this if Apple can solve a [TS]

  handful of these problems and create a [TS]

  better television viewing environment [TS]

  even if it's just the user interface [TS]

  that gets better I'm all about that I'm [TS]

  probably weird and that I don't have any [TS]

  game consoles and I don't have any uh [TS]

  you know blu-ray or DVD players or [TS]

  anything but it's just it who needs that [TS]

  well you know what I'm I dreaded just [TS]

  sit down with my family watch something [TS]

  and have fun watching a show I don't [TS]

  know II you know I'm not gonna slow [TS]

  there was an artifact and the [TS]

  such-and-such HD signal on the sci-fi HD [TS]

  channel was made you're making fun of me [TS]

  complaining about it yeah who cares if [TS]

  the signals really so what if it's [TS]

  compressed he'll killers could do could [TS]

  you see the people's faces when they [TS]

  were talking could you see the laser [TS]

  beam barely could you see Thor you know [TS]

  smashing his hammer over the guy's head [TS]

  or whatever you were watching I'm you [TS]

  know I'm sure you could it was fine and [TS]

  a regular human being would have [TS]

  probably looked at it and said hey this [TS]

  looks looks it looks great know what a [TS]

  nice TV you have John so you're talking [TS]

  about the simplicity fact that's another [TS]

  reason I think people people are annoyed [TS]

  with the current apathy because of this [TS]

  you're like look I just want to see the [TS]

  show I don't care if it's on Netflix I [TS]

  don't care if it's not Amazon yeah where [TS]

  it's available I just want to find the [TS]

  show is it available in iTunes look I [TS]

  now gotta go to Netflix before I pay for [TS]

  his iTunes things let me check in [TS]

  Netflix to make sure I can't get it for [TS]

  free there all that business that's a [TS]

  lack of simplicity which is again why I [TS]

  think about the idea of you know an [TS]

  Apple TV in you suitable for use like [TS]

  well soon Netflix will be there but what [TS]

  if that's the whole thing an integrated [TS]

  simplified experience without like this [TS]

  other place to check don't all you know [TS]

  as iTunes [TS]

  there's Netflix and then there's the NFL [TS]

  app and there's the MLB app and there's [TS]

  the Bloomberg happens the CNN app and [TS]

  you know I think they want something [TS]

  unified I I think you want something [TS]

  unified I don't think you want to be [TS]

  hunting around you know the PBS app to [TS]

  get hang on a second [TS]

  hang on a second what's the difference [TS]

  between the NFL app and saying oh wait a [TS]

  minute which channel has the NFL game is [TS]

  it yeah okay this one is on ESPN that's [TS]

  what DVR so solve you're from supposed a [TS]

  good number call you from doing it you [TS]

  know I don't have them the Cowboys games [TS]

  I don't care where the air find them and [TS]

  record them for me I would I would [TS]

  actually say please never show me a [TS]

  Cowboys games unless one of the two can [TS]

  keep track with who eagles-cowboys game [TS]

  which are usually Monday night games one [TS]

  home and one away that would be the [TS]

  exception to the time I would want to [TS]

  see a cowboy sports are one instance [TS]

  where I think the app model can work [TS]

  though this is like look it's the NFL [TS]

  app it's for all the footballers and the [TS]

  MLB app is where the baseball yeah I [TS]

  like that I like that to me to me that's [TS]

  nice that's like the MLB chuckles the [TS]

  Fox app you gotta remember the fringe is [TS]

  on Fox do I care that fringes on Fox [TS]

  unlike ruber I have no memory of what [TS]

  shows around what stations I'm with it [TS]

  on there what stations are on I don't [TS]

  care what days they air I don't care [TS]

  anything about them if I like a show I [TS]

  want to see the show and that's why the [TS]

  iTunes Store is like you just search for [TS]

  Fringe you iTunes doesn't say I mean I'm [TS]

  sure somewhere in the iTunes beta does [TS]

  this fringe now airing on Fox or [TS]

  whatever it's like you go to the Fox [TS]

  section of the iTunes video store you [TS]

  know so here's the Fox section you saw [TS]

  the Fox host and I'd do a separate [TS]

  search for the ABC section right a [TS]

  unified experience that stops this idea [TS]

  of you know channels and air times or [TS]

  even venues Netflix is like a venue for [TS]

  getting something like a different [TS]

  middleman and [TS]

  as different middlemen the netbooks is a [TS]

  middleman and Apple itself is the [TS]

  middleman a unified experiences I think [TS]

  what Apple wants and what everybody [TS]

  wants and continuing to have a Netflix [TS]

  app and an Amazon map and an iTunes app [TS]

  is not good I think you would have [TS]

  unified experience you if it's all apps [TS]

  like just you know the only way you can [TS]

  get there's no Netflix app because [TS]

  Netflix is like it's like nesting dolls [TS]

  like so you've got Apple TV and then [TS]

  inside it there's another Apple TV [TS]

  called Netflix where you have you know [TS]

  Damien I dunno list of things in there [TS]

  right at least they don't go more than [TS]

  two levels deep but because the NFL app [TS]

  is more like well that's just you know [TS]

  imagine if you just had Apple TV and all [TS]

  it was was individual applications for [TS]

  free two shows or four for sports [TS]

  leagues right that's pretty much the [TS]

  most level people would tell her because [TS]

  they wouldn't you know so I don't like [TS]

  the fact is NFL app I want equals AB the [TS]

  NFL app is fun you can find the Eagles [TS]

  games that you want you know what I mean [TS]

  but people don't want a fox app that is [TS]

  that's too far that's like well didn't [TS]

  we just come from this with the channel [TS]

  thing it seems dumb like I don't care [TS]

  what channel it's on because then and [TS]

  especially the people search like how do [TS]

  I search you'd want if this give me an [TS]

  ax flop and then I'll be app you'd still [TS]

  want some sort of overall interface [TS]

  where you just do a search Apple would [TS]

  call it a spotlight search for no reason [TS]

  do a search and search for cowboys and [TS]

  you'd expect the Cowboys games to come [TS]

  up sorry with the Cowboys example again [TS]

  and you'd also expect TV shows about [TS]

  Cowboys to come up right a you know [TS]

  Universal Search you don't have these [TS]

  little islands of things but that [TS]

  scenario is even more difficult to pull [TS]

  off because then you've got to get [TS]

  individual applications for all the [TS]

  content that's going to reach you to [TS]

  some sort of critical mass it's going to [TS]

  make somebody new buy this thing someone [TS]

  who previously didn't ditch their cable [TS]

  subscription and make them ditch it and [TS]

  get this thing and get the cooperation [TS]

  from all that you know like it you say [TS]

  ok you want to make an application for [TS]

  Apple TV said it can't be like your [TS]

  existing apps you have to provide you [TS]

  have to hook into some Universal thing [TS]

  where we can keep track of what you're [TS]

  what you're providing what shows are [TS]

  available in the NFL app what shows are [TS]

  available this new feed in to us and [TS]

  then we make it all available through [TS]

  Universal Search tour iCloud [TS]

  infrastructure and you know that's [TS]

  different than what they're doing now [TS]

  which is like you know MLB can make an [TS]

  app and you can't search inside that MLB [TS]

  app there's they're not talking to Apple [TS]

  and telling some master server what [TS]

  baseball games are airing when right so [TS]

  that I think that's the model that that [TS]

  people want and that's that's like the [TS]

  minimum they need to make this app model [TS]

  work is some sort of centralized thing [TS]

  that eliminates this nesting doll island [TS]

  problem nesting doll island maybe [TS]

  nesting doll is a bad example I just saw [TS]

  I just like I think it's a good one my [TS]

  graphic of a nesting doll thing or some [TS]

  cartoon in the net it was like a nesting [TS]

  doll laying down on a table to get a [TS]

  little ultrasound like you do see the [TS]

  big picture the baby and the doctor is [TS]

  holding the ultrasound thing on me on [TS]

  the stomach of the nesting doll and on [TS]

  the screen you see a picture of a doctor [TS]

  holding the ultrasound thing on the [TS]

  stomach of nesting doll in front of a [TS]

  screen that has a picture of a doctor [TS]

  holding the stomach when I'm asking [TS]

  though that's right I just described a [TS]

  visual joke is a new frontier in [TS]

  podcasting I'll put that in the show [TS]

  notes right [TS]

  Marlin could've pulled that off I can't [TS]

  I think you did fine yeah so that's [TS]

  about it though we're about 90 minutes [TS]

  how much I suffer so for a show more [TS]

  thing before you wrap up well I was just [TS]

  gonna say so first show where you were [TS]

  you were not prepared for it you had no [TS]

  notes you had no links you're expecting [TS]

  a guest think he did okay well I told [TS]

  him stuff as an unlimited font of a [TS]

  hangar for me and I bring something is [TS]

  yes yesterday during I think it was [TS]

  during rubriz podcast yesterday was that [TS]

  yesterday yes so there was someone in [TS]

  the chat room was actually an employee [TS]

  of TiVo that's true we were talking [TS]

  about TiVo stuff as soon as you saw [TS]

  myself [TS]

  Otis it's not you're coming apart all [TS]

  the company he's not the CEO right you [TS]

  don't want to yell at individual [TS]

  employee like and he basically agreed [TS]

  with anything all the complaints I had [TS]

  to say but he can't you know I know what [TS]

  it's like the worker you can't just go [TS]

  in there I know because you work with [TS]

  you're gonna yell at you because I don't [TS]

  like it anything about TiVo right and he [TS]

  was very helpful in wanted to say hey [TS]

  you know you could contact me privately [TS]

  and what we can talk about but it's like [TS]

  it's not he's not his fault he's not the [TS]

  CEO he's not running the company but [TS]

  it's all I could do from just being like [TS]

  look finally a you know contact was it's [TS]

  kind of like Apple where it's like a [TS]

  black hole where I fell out all these [TS]

  Tebow surveys and I could plan on the [TS]

  podcast but it's like nothing happens [TS]

  like there's no engagement with TiVo [TS]

  about what problems are and so I had to [TS]

  you know keep myself from just like [TS]

  harangue this poor person was very nice [TS]

  in the chat room too [TS]

  tolerate my annoying typing about stuff [TS]

  so that's why I think I had no problem [TS]

  talking about things here now if you [TS]

  think I was angry about the television [TS]

  stuff and Apple TV I am just as upset [TS]

  about the Steve Jobs bio so if we do get [TS]

  to do a show on that even if Margo and [TS]

  John have both talked about it ad [TS]

  infinitum and said exactly what I'm [TS]

  going to say I'm going to say it too and [TS]

  then we have the guest wild-card [TS]

  situation yes this contacted me during [TS]

  the show and so I don't know what we're [TS]

  going to do maybe we'll try to [TS]

  reschedule figure it out yeah siracusa [TS]

  on twitter i'm dan benjamin on twitter [TS]

  we have two sponsors tiny letter comm [TS]

  squarespace.com slash 5x5 emotion chip [TS]

  is the discount there you can check out [TS]

  all the other shows that we do and [TS]

  previous episodes of this show by going [TS]

  to 5x5 dot TV if you haven't been there [TS]

  in a while there's a bunch to see John [TS]

  sir Cuse is on like eight eight or nine [TS]

  shows now quickly catching up to me what [TS]

  else you got that's it all right we'll [TS]

  have a good week everybody thanks for [TS]

  tuning in right [TS]

  you [TS]