0:00:02you're listening to hypercritical
0:00:04a weekly talkshow ruminating on exactly
0:00:06what is wrong in the world of Apple and
0:00:08related technologies and businesses
0:00:09nothing is so perfect that it can't be
0:00:11complained about by the host of this
0:00:14show john siracusa I'm the co-host dan
0:00:16Benjamin this is episode number 37
0:00:20today is October 7th 2011 and we would
0:00:24like to briefly mention our sponsors
0:00:26before we tell you more about them later
0:00:27the first sponsor is MailChimp comm the
0:00:31second sponsor is a new one
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0:00:35more about them later hi John how are
0:00:37you okay
0:00:41sad week it is sad very sad week yeah I
0:00:45think that's what we're going to talk
0:00:47about yeah because even before follow up
0:00:51breaking the format probably was a good
0:00:54occasion to break with the format yeah
0:00:56because the cuz the follow-up is tends
0:00:58to be kind of flip and this is not flip
0:00:59so right so this first everybody who is
0:01:03everybody who's listening to this live
0:01:06or with in recent days knows that this
0:01:08is the week that earlier this week
0:01:10Wednesday Steve Jobs passed away ah
0:01:13but in case somebody's listening to this
0:01:15down the road they may not know you know
0:01:19with the time frame so is worth
0:01:22mentioning that and we actually got did
0:01:26a little 5x5 special we're different
0:01:27people some of them hosts some of them
0:01:29just friends the network we did a little
0:01:33a little I guess you call to thank you a
0:01:35tribute and John you didn't you didn't
0:01:38participate in that and you said you
0:01:41wanted to talk about it here today so I
0:01:42knew this was going to be a heavy heavy
0:01:44show I tried to participate I recorded a
0:01:47whole bunch of stuff first I tried just
0:01:49reading stuff that I had written ahead
0:01:50of time and then I tried uh just talking
0:01:54extemporaneously and it and then I
0:01:56listened to it I actually edited some
0:01:58food see if although I can edit this
0:01:59into shape but just never I'm just not
0:02:01good at talking to nobody I guess it's a
0:02:03it's a skill I don't have but Natalia so
0:02:09we did a show about stay like it wasn't
0:02:12a whole show about Steve Jobs I think
0:02:13when he retired
0:02:14I was just trying to look up the episode
0:02:15number but I remember what it was but do
0:02:18you remember that one yeah I do I'm
0:02:20trying to think about when that when
0:02:22that actually was well we'll find it and
0:02:25put it in the show notes but that was
0:02:27when he retired and I think I did a
0:02:29whole show on it just because as I said
0:02:31in that show I didn't know Steve Jobs
0:02:34the man I just knew Steve Jobs the CEO
0:02:37of Apple was that was that the next big
0:02:38move could that have been it the future
0:02:40of Apple without Steve Jobs which is
0:02:42that sounds that's a choice to era I'll
0:02:44put them to show not all right uh and
0:02:47since I did I only knew the CEO when he
0:02:50retired as CEO
0:02:51that's like him disappearing from my
0:02:54life because the personal Steve Jobs is
0:02:56not part of my life just be the
0:02:57corporate Steve Jobs was so we talked a
0:02:59lot about the corporate Steve Jobs in
0:03:01that show and the future of Apple and
0:03:03what he did at Apple and all that stuff
0:03:06and I said at the time that I thought it
0:03:07was really sad and I remember I also
0:03:09said that I wanted to write something
0:03:11because when he retired everyone was
0:03:12writing stuff like you know the same
0:03:15similar things that you're seeing now
0:03:16people want to write like what he meant
0:03:18to the company and his legacy and how
0:03:20Apple would be without him then
0:03:22everything I could think of to write
0:03:23sounded like a eulogy but he wasn't dead
0:03:25so it was kind of inappropriate right
0:03:27I'd be writing something like oh you
0:03:28know as if he's gone but he's not gone
0:03:30and we didn't know how long he would be
0:03:32around right like so I couldn't write
0:03:35something that sounded like a eulogy
0:03:36then having lived for another five years
0:03:38and so I figured well I'll do that thing
0:03:41that the quote unquote real journalists
0:03:44do is you write a eulogy or the obituary
0:03:46ahead of time and so that's that's
0:03:49actually when you're saying you wrote
0:03:50you wrote your pieces just put out on
0:03:53arstechnica no because I that's what I
0:03:55said I maybe I should do that but we
0:03:57didn't I didn't bring myself to do it I
0:03:59couldn't I a couple times I sat down I'm
0:04:01like I'm gonna write that Steve Jobs
0:04:02thing that I wanted to write that
0:04:03sounded like you will Jose have it in
0:04:05reserve I'll have it ready but I just I
0:04:07just couldn't do it I don't know it just
0:04:09wasn't
0:04:09I just wasn't motivated to do it and the
0:04:11retirement thing had come and gone I
0:04:13read a whole bunch of stuff that other
0:04:14people did and that always demotivates
0:04:15me reading what other people do I'm like
0:04:17yeah they said everything I was going to
0:04:18say anyway I really have nothing to add
0:04:19so when the you know on the news that he
0:04:24had died came along I think I saw it on
0:04:26Twitter first but it was pretty instant
0:04:27blanketing all possible media that I
0:04:30have access to right as you can imagine
0:04:32all my news feeds email Twitter feeds I
0:04:34am everything then I had to kind of
0:04:38scramble to write something but at least
0:04:40at that point I felt like it was easier
0:04:42and as had been in the this should the
0:04:45next big move show I thought that I had
0:04:47resigned myself to him being gone when I
0:04:50wrote this thing for Macworld ages ago
0:04:52there was like maybe even years ago and
0:04:53then again when he retired like I guess
0:04:56there was more there just emotional and
0:04:57sad and I was like all right I'll I'll
0:04:59talk we did a whole show on his
0:05:00retirement I'm like right that's it it's
0:05:02all it's out of my system I've I've come
0:05:05to terms with it but then nobody died
0:05:06apparently I had not come to terms with
0:05:08it because it was just like it was it
0:05:10was like even worse is every time that
0:05:11some event has happened it's been even
0:05:14worse thankfully this is the last one
0:05:15but it was just it was really bad I
0:05:17don't know how you felt about it but I
0:05:19was surprised by how much it affected me
0:05:21especially since like well somewhat if
0:05:23he's still alive but he's not at the
0:05:24company but I guess I guess the did the
0:05:26thing about it was that even if he's not
0:05:28the CEO of Apple if he's still around
0:05:30then you could always be like when Apple
0:05:33does something like boy I wonder what
0:05:34Steve thinks of this and maybe someone
0:05:35will call him and get and get a line
0:05:37from him or he would be it like
0:05:39anniversary ceremonies like you wouldn't
0:05:41you always want to know what does Steve
0:05:42Jobs think of this even if he's not the
0:05:43CEO or the company's still a person in
0:05:45the world and is still famous and and
0:05:47maybe he'd be doing more press now that
0:05:49he was retired you know maybe he would
0:05:50not feel as constrained about it yeah so
0:05:54anyway I wrote something for ours it was
0:05:58fairly short by my standards and when I
0:06:02was trying to figure out both times when
0:06:05I was trying to figure what to write you
0:06:06don't good thing I know one thing I
0:06:07could think of was that it's hard to
0:06:09write anything about Steve Jobs the
0:06:12phenomenon or that like his his
0:06:16corporate legacy his accomplishments
0:06:18that's just too big
0:06:19um you need to be you know like Walter
0:06:21Isaacson who's writing the authorized
0:06:23biography that's going to be a thick
0:06:24book I imagine or the big articles in
0:06:26The New York Times or Time magazine
0:06:28special issue or whatever that's too big
0:06:31I'm not it's too big for me to address
0:06:33so I figured the only way I could talk
0:06:35about the topic was to make it to go the
0:06:36other way and make it as small as
0:06:37possible that's what I did I wrote about
0:06:39my personal yeah Steve Jobs effect in my
0:06:44personal life which which is what a lot
0:06:46of people did online they didn't a few
0:06:48people try to reward generalities about
0:06:50what Steve Jobs meant to the industry or
0:06:53they ended on that point or whatever
0:06:54most people said here's what Steve Jobs
0:06:55meant to me personally and that's what I
0:06:57think has been touching to read on the
0:07:00web at all these little personal stories
0:07:01of how Steve Jobs and his company
0:07:04affected the lives of so many other
0:07:05people friend the biggest obviously the
0:07:07ones who were like I'm a developer I
0:07:09write Apple software everything I do in
0:07:11my professional life and my livelihood
0:07:12wouldn't exist if Steve Jobs hadn't
0:07:14started Apple so those people have the
0:07:16the most of it even even the people like
0:07:17me who are kind of tangentially touched
0:07:20like it's not it's not our livelihood so
0:07:22much but they affect this in more
0:07:24personal way so that that's what I wrote
0:07:25in my in the thing at ours I'll put the
0:07:28link in the show notes and people can
0:07:29read it these are gone it's really great
0:07:31piece I got a lot of compliments on it
0:07:34and I I considered trying to put links
0:07:38to all the other great things that I've
0:07:40read but as I started collecting the
0:07:41links is just too many of like it
0:07:43there's not a single person whose blog I
0:07:46read or whose site I go on frequently
0:07:48who doesn't have something up about
0:07:49Steve Jobs probably multiple ones so I
0:07:52don't think you're hurting for things to
0:07:55read on the web about the this topic and
0:07:57there's a lot of good ones out there
0:08:01know what I tried to do when I was
0:08:04recording stuff last night it was like
0:08:05maybe I'll try just summarizing what I
0:08:08wrote about that didn't work that well
0:08:12but I'm actually gonna take another run
0:08:13out of here did you read my thing
0:08:14I did so one of the problems I have with
0:08:20that thing was I was trying to come up
0:08:20with a title and I did in my little
0:08:23scratch file I just called it Steve Jobs
0:08:25and it was great in the days when I had
0:08:27my little staff blog on our stack nigger
0:08:30and then the fat bit section that was
0:08:33the name of my little corner of the site
0:08:35and I could use those super obscure
0:08:37titles you know we're just Steve Jobs
0:08:39right but it was like last year maybe
0:08:42the year before that ours changes site
0:08:43design so that everything shows up on
0:08:45the front page you know right at which
0:08:47section it originates from it's just
0:08:48like a big linear stream of articles
0:08:49which is great as a reader of the site I
0:08:51like that much better
0:08:52but as a writer on the site who often
0:08:53wants to write obscure weird things
0:08:56there's pressure to have something show
0:08:59up on the homepage of our second to go
0:09:00with a headline that makes sense because
0:09:02the last thing you want is millions of
0:09:04people clicking through on it and saying
0:09:06this is not what I thought it was going
0:09:07to be or whatever so I had to obviously
0:09:11dumb down but clarify it make less nice
0:09:15the title and I called it Steve Jobs a
0:09:18personal remembrance or something like
0:09:19that just because as if you don't want
0:09:21to read someone's personal account of
0:09:23what Steve Jobs meant to then don't
0:09:24click through we just called Steve Jobs
0:09:25is like what what is this everyone's
0:09:26unique like that it could be a 17 page
0:09:28biography it could could be anything if
0:09:31you have like an individual blog like
0:09:33Gruber can get away with the title that
0:09:34just says Steve Jobs because people
0:09:35would understand in context what it is
0:09:37but the front page of our stack they
0:09:38have stories about gaming about law or
0:09:41science and lots of other stuff so you
0:09:43have to sort of point out what you want
0:09:45to be but another title I was thinking
0:09:48of like when I was trying to think of
0:09:49titles I got to make this more clear is
0:09:50like something like my two lessons from
0:09:53Steve Jobs which I definitely didn't
0:09:54want to do because I did not want anyone
0:09:55to think this was going to be one of
0:09:57those top five best ways to supercharge
0:09:59your X Y you know those things with the
0:10:01lists yeah those are bad and you know
0:10:04but really I had two things that I
0:10:06wanted to talk about and the first one
0:10:08was my childhood remembrance of what
0:10:11Steve Jobs it how Steve Jobs influenced
0:10:15my coming-of-age sort of and and I
0:10:17mentioned that had this picture on the
0:10:19wall that had cut out a Mac World
0:10:20magazine that had the Macintosh team on
0:10:22it and it was basically the realization
0:10:24that a small group of really smart
0:10:27dedicated people can do some amazing
0:10:28thing and change the world and even
0:10:31before that bit the idea that the world
0:10:32was a changeable place that when you're
0:10:34a little kid you think like well this is
0:10:36the world and this is what it is and
0:10:36it's always been this way and even if
0:10:38they tell you about history and about
0:10:39sailing ships and you're like yeah but
0:10:41this is you know this is the world and
0:10:42then the Mac came out and was like you
0:10:45remember before the Mac what computers
0:10:47were like and how you now you see what
0:10:48the Mac is like and it's clear this is
0:10:50going to change the world and it some
0:10:52people actually made this thing they
0:10:55there wasn't a Mac they came up with the
0:10:57idea and they created it and all those
0:10:58people could fit in this little picture
0:11:00that I had on my wall so I'd cut it out
0:11:01I taped that up there and stayed there I
0:11:03think until I left for college
0:11:05and so that was my childhood realization
0:11:07that uh you know particularly engineers
0:11:09nerds my kind of people the people who
0:11:11are as relating to could change the
0:11:13world and I would just stare at that
0:11:16picture of our ages now I hadn't looked
0:11:17at that picture probably maybe probably
0:11:19since like my my room got cleaned out
0:11:22when I left for college and my parents
0:11:24converted into a spare bedroom and
0:11:27removed all the millions of posters and
0:11:29comics and other things I had taped to
0:11:31my wall with scotch tape which they
0:11:34cursed me for us they had to scrape all
0:11:35the scotch tape off and repaint
0:11:36everything but when I look at the I'm
0:11:39going to try to pull up the web page
0:11:40when I look at this web page now I put
0:11:42the picture at the very top of the web
0:11:43page I actually scanned it out of a mag
0:11:45out of the magazine that it came in this
0:11:48is from a Macworld issue number one the
0:11:50premiere of Macworld which was actually
0:11:51released with the original back and I
0:11:54have multiple copies of it and one of
0:11:56the copies I sacrificed to cut out the
0:11:57picture and that sort of died as it
0:11:59faded on my wall and hang wrinkled into
0:12:00nothingness but the other one is still
0:12:01in the magazine so I put my magazine on
0:12:03the scanner and scanned it and that's
0:12:04the picture up there and I look at this
0:12:05picture it's just amazing the feelings
0:12:09that it triggers inside me just because
0:12:11that image is burned on my brain that I
0:12:14had realized it until I looked at it
0:12:15again like if you were trying to program
0:12:16me to like kill the president or
0:12:18something you could use one of these
0:12:19pictures I did I didn't realize that it
0:12:22had such deep hooks and I stared I'm
0:12:23like what is it about that picture I
0:12:25keep looking back in it and it's because
0:12:27it was on my wall for my entire time
0:12:28growing up and you just it's just
0:12:30imprinted on me uh but anyway that was
0:12:34my my lesson number one you know from
0:12:37growing up and it's not particularly
0:12:39profound or interesting everybody when
0:12:41you're kid you learn all sorts of things
0:12:43about life and about the way it works in
0:12:44its only it's only important to you
0:12:46because this was the thing that taught
0:12:48you that lesson when you were growing up
0:12:49and the grand scheme of things adults
0:12:51will it say it intellectually they
0:12:53understand that yes people can invent
0:12:54things and change the world but then the
0:12:57larger point ahead and the one thing
0:12:58this is what I was trying to get it with
0:12:59the big with the big point I want to
0:13:01make up in my story small but my my big
0:13:03thing was like what is it about Steve
0:13:06Jobs that's special
0:13:08what is his most the most important
0:13:11thing that he's done and I in true to
0:13:14form I always want to think of the thing
0:13:15that other people aren't thinking else
0:13:16I'm not going to say oh you know he made
0:13:18the eye
0:13:18i phone or you made technology
0:13:20accessible to people or someone and so
0:13:22forth I think maybe this is not the most
0:13:24important thing that he did but it's the
0:13:27it's the most profound I think the most
0:13:29the most unique because lots of people
0:13:31have made amazing products in different
0:13:34genres not in technology but you know in
0:13:36other in other areas or in medicine or
0:13:38any other field
0:13:39so certainly jobs is the top of the
0:13:42technology field and doing that but
0:13:43other people have done great things like
0:13:44that in other fields but the unique
0:13:45thing that I think Jobs did across all
0:13:48fields was he proved that the grim
0:13:53Dilbert future that we all know about
0:13:56yeah doesn't have to be a reality and
0:13:59doesn't have to be that way and in my
0:14:01adult life this is the first time I can
0:14:04think of that this happened because I
0:14:06think of all other large organizations
0:14:09or large groups of people that I've
0:14:11dealt with from the government to big
0:14:13universities to working in corporate
0:14:16America or even something like science
0:14:19you know they say for scientists that
0:14:21you should do that best work before
0:14:22they're like 30 years old I forget how
0:14:24old is Tyne was when he did all of his
0:14:27work on relatively in everything but he
0:14:29was shockingly young and certainly for
0:14:31athletes just simply because they age
0:14:32they you know they're their best years
0:14:34or when they're younger and same thing
0:14:36with organizations like yeah
0:14:37the company does some amazing thing to
0:14:39guys in a garage or whatever and and it
0:14:42grows like gangbusters then it gets to
0:14:44be a big company and it's like you don't
0:14:45expect that from any them anymore and in
0:14:48the worst case they become just a
0:14:49horrible horrible place to work and a
0:14:52horrible company to deal with and they
0:14:54get filled with middle middle managers
0:14:56and employees whose motivation no longer
0:15:00aligns in any way with the supposed
0:15:02mission of the corporation I don't know
0:15:04how much you've worked in corporate
0:15:05America as you did contracting but nice
0:15:07but it wasn't every company has seen
0:15:09this right for a decade or more like in
0:15:12in the cube yeah although I don't see
0:15:15Merlin didn't I don't think Merlin ever
0:15:16worked in big corporations but he had it
0:15:18he has a keen sense of this and even in
0:15:20this little company that he worked out
0:15:21with Dave and I know is that he makes me
0:15:23for he says the word Dave that I can't
0:15:24do some people have a keener sense of
0:15:28this and others and nerds tend to have a
0:15:30pretty keen sense of it but
0:15:32just think of any endeavor involving
0:15:33large numbers of people we just assumed
0:15:35that
0:15:36oh yeah once you get a lot of people in
0:15:37there its bozo time all right
0:15:39an apple is the first example I can
0:15:41think of where a humungous corporation
0:15:45didn't it didn't act like one acted it
0:15:49was better than the startups acted
0:15:50better than the smoker people and the
0:15:52most amazing thing about this is that
0:15:54the original Apple was like two guys in
0:15:56a garage they make the Apple one and
0:15:57they make the Apple two in the company
0:15:58he goes IPO everybody's rich everybody
0:16:01you know it's an amazing success story
0:16:03Steve Jobs on the cover of Time magazine
0:16:04in 1982 Premack right but look at these
0:16:07whiz kids they are the kings of the
0:16:09world right and then the company gets
0:16:12big it's just too big that's like 83
0:16:14it's like well you know Apple was great
0:16:15when it was little did that Apple too
0:16:17but now it's a big company right and
0:16:18people like a big company the magazine's
0:16:19say now it's a serious company it's a
0:16:21competitor to IBM which is also a very
0:16:23serious company very important very big
0:16:24and to do the Mac project Jobs had to
0:16:30well steal a project from Jef Raskin
0:16:32internal politics but he was cultivating
0:16:36the idea that the Mac team were rebels
0:16:38so he's got the pirate flag on top of
0:16:40the band lieth rebuilding right this is
0:16:42within the big behemoth corporate
0:16:44monster that is 1982-83 Apple right so
0:16:48even then a knight a2 a3 job is like the
0:16:50apples too big we need to get the small
0:16:52team here this going to get back to our
0:16:54roots and really do this great project
0:16:56uh
0:16:58and the Mac came out of that a little
0:17:00did he know how big Apple would actually
0:17:01grow of course the year after the Mac
0:17:02comes out he gets kicked out of the
0:17:04company which what I would say is proof
0:17:05of the you know the the culmination of
0:17:07the grim Dilbert future is that a
0:17:09company gets big enough and dumb enough
0:17:11to eject Steve Jobs so admittedly was a
0:17:13bit of a nut job back in those days but
0:17:17I don't know how someone could produce
0:17:19the Macintosh and say we gotta get that
0:17:21guy out of this company because we don't
0:17:22like those types of things uh so then he
0:17:25comes back and Apple now is just
0:17:27humongous it's almost a bit it's the
0:17:30second biggest the second biggest
0:17:32company in the u.s. next to Exxon Mobil
0:17:33I think I think they trade places
0:17:34actually but yeah idly right now today I
0:17:37think it is a second and and this next
0:17:40gen oils company an oil company you know
0:17:43yeah exactly
0:17:45look at you look at what role oil plays
0:17:47and has played in a global economy and
0:17:50that's that that's the number one
0:17:51company and number two is Apple and this
0:17:55this giant behemoth which is just so
0:17:57comically larger than the Apple of 1982
0:18:00that Steve Jobs thought was just too big
0:18:02and too corporate and COO full of bozos
0:18:04this is the company that is producing
0:18:07even more amazing things than the Apple
0:18:08- you know things as amazing as the Mac
0:18:11and not just one of them but multiple
0:18:13ones I saw Scott Adams the guy actually
0:18:16writes Dilbert speaking of Dilbert on
0:18:17his blog it's gotta hands a little bit
0:18:20of a nut job - but he's funny and he had
0:18:22a little post about Steve Jobs or he
0:18:25said that he originally thought the
0:18:27Steve Jobs was just like in the right
0:18:29place at the right time er it was luck
0:18:30at when he you know had these many
0:18:32successes but then he did it again and
0:18:33again and again once you do like the
0:18:35fifth great thing okay this is not luck
0:18:37right and so this is I think is the most
0:18:40profound thing Steve Jobs did it's
0:18:43proving that Hume of humans can still do
0:18:47amazing things now also part of the
0:18:50lesson is that to make that happen there
0:18:54are going to be some things that aren't
0:18:55so nice some people don't like apples
0:18:58corporate policies some people who work
0:19:00there say for for all the admiration
0:19:02that company gets on the outside on the
0:19:03inside it's a little bit more like
0:19:05corporate America than they thought it
0:19:06would be but the things that Apple does
0:19:10as an organization are amazing things
0:19:13and are unlike the things that the
0:19:15government's do that companies like IBM
0:19:17and Microsoft do we see it all around us
0:19:19we will eventually do the showing what's
0:19:21wrong with Microsoft but that's just
0:19:22typical giant corporate maladies you get
0:19:24too big
0:19:25everything gets ossified you get twelve
0:19:27layers of management in between
0:19:28everything you can't make big dramatic
0:19:30moves even with a strong leader like
0:19:32Bill Gates and we got turned the whole
0:19:33ship we've got to be the Internet
0:19:34company the internet tidal wave is
0:19:36coming that's just like barely enough to
0:19:37keep you alive it's not enough to make
0:19:39that's not your iPod that's not your
0:19:41iPad or your iPhone so that's what I
0:19:45think if not the most important thing
0:19:47that Steve Jobs did at least the thing
0:19:48that the least the most important thing
0:19:50that people aren't talking about and it
0:19:52gives me hope for things like government
0:19:54visit especially with a government
0:19:55wanted make us into a government show
0:19:56where Nate's politics another one
0:19:58but either but the idea that government
0:20:00is fundamentally broken a large number
0:20:02of large groups of people just can't do
0:20:05anything smart they're just inherently
0:20:06dumb they they they sink to the level
0:20:08the dumbest person involved I think
0:20:10Apple shows that large groups of people
0:20:13really can do things and and you have to
0:20:15ascribe that to Steve Jobs because when
0:20:16he wasn't there
0:20:17Apple was big and was just screwing up
0:20:19left and right and when he got there
0:20:20Apple got even bigger ended things even
0:20:22better so that's that's what knows
0:20:26that's much longer than reading the nine
0:20:28hundred words I read about Steve Jobs
0:20:29but those are my two points one was the
0:20:31personal story about the picture on my
0:20:33wall and what Steve Jobs meant to me the
0:20:35other one was that the Oh Steve Jobs
0:20:36being to humanity I think that that
0:20:38sounds highfalutin and everything and
0:20:39maybe you overwrought but if you think
0:20:42about it maybe someone can give me a
0:20:44better example of another large
0:20:49organization that's acted as well as
0:20:52Apple has but it's the first thing that
0:20:53I've ever seen in my adult life in my
0:20:55jaded cynical adult life where I'm not
0:20:57the naive kid who was just realizing the
0:20:59world can be changed first thing I've
0:21:00seen where a large group of people
0:21:02really do something amazing over and
0:21:05over and over again it and and the thing
0:21:07about it is the streak is so long at
0:21:08that point you're like if he lived if
0:21:11you live forever he was immortal I think
0:21:14Apple continued to execute like that
0:21:16forever and ever like it was it was a
0:21:18sustainable thing it wasn't a fluke it
0:21:20wasn't a surprise one-time thing you got
0:21:23lucky right place right time and then
0:21:25you're coasting on your your previous
0:21:27victory it's just amazing it someone
0:21:31someone points out Pixar but I think
0:21:32we've already done some in the chat room
0:21:33but I think we've already done Pixar I
0:21:35would say that they have a system for
0:21:37making great movies or rather they have
0:21:41a system for not making bad movies again
0:21:43I've still never seen cars had not seen
0:21:44cars too yet and I apologize for that
0:21:46but it's close but then everything at
0:21:50Pixar is also related to save jobs so
0:21:51you know I would describe that to him as
0:21:54well if you want to do smart see what
0:21:58kind of thing I maybe one more thing to
0:22:00do about Steve Jobs but this is all I
0:22:02have to say about my thing that I wrote
0:22:03most a good piece I really do recommend
0:22:05everybody everybody read it it's a it's
0:22:08always it's always very interesting to
0:22:10me
0:22:11to see what people like you will will
0:22:15say or write about it and it's always
0:22:17almost always very different from what
0:22:22I'm expecting does that make any sense
0:22:24like this that wasn't exactly what I
0:22:26thought you would you would write but I
0:22:30was like when do you think I would write
0:22:31you know I'm not really sure I'm not
0:22:33sure I can put my finger on it exactly
0:22:35um it was it was more personal maybe
0:22:39maybe then I was expecting not like I
0:22:41didn't expect it to reflect on your life
0:22:43in some way but it you know you're
0:22:47talking about your childhood and things
0:22:49like that I thought that was great
0:22:50different I have to rein myself in and
0:22:52not make it even more personal realize
0:22:55that's why but I thought I was the anglo
0:22:59I didn't want to do you know I don't
0:23:01want to write what I've seen other
0:23:02people write I knew everyone was going
0:23:03to write here is the list of Steve Jobs
0:23:05greatest accomplishment and those are
0:23:07I'm not saying it's bad to write those
0:23:08things someone needs to write them but I
0:23:09just feel like other people are writing
0:23:10that are going to write that better than
0:23:12I do
0:23:13and the obvious things a Steve Jobs is
0:23:15about about you know technology serving
0:23:18people and not the other way around and
0:23:19it just and you know that the
0:23:21perfectionism the elegance and bringing
0:23:23design to I knew everyone was going to
0:23:25talk about that and I didn't want to be
0:23:27the person doing that same thing but
0:23:29worse which I know it would be so I had
0:23:30to come at a different angle and my
0:23:32different angle is the personal story
0:23:33which you can't fault people for doing
0:23:35that I see lots of personal stories
0:23:36that's their personal story they're
0:23:37going to say what they have to say what
0:23:39it meant to them and I find that
0:23:40touching to read and I think people
0:23:42relate to that and then I also wanted to
0:23:45find the the one larger thing that I
0:23:48didn't think was going to be talked
0:23:50about as much in the other articles
0:23:51because you'll be spending too much time
0:23:52on the more obvious thing so what I was
0:23:55resisting when I was recording stuff
0:23:57last night I I found myself like I lose
0:24:03this in the buzz recording like what are
0:24:04you telling your life story like don't
0:24:06turn it into biography yeah I am
0:24:09I hear that right and I did you know and
0:24:11then I was this age and then I got this
0:24:12thing and then are you talking about
0:24:14Steve Jobs anymore you just talking
0:24:15about yourself so I really wanted to
0:24:16rein it in a little bit and I think
0:24:20other people feel the same inclination
0:24:21like a Gruber
0:24:23a mental doppelganger over there look
0:24:26what he wrote about jobs it was not
0:24:27about how all a job it was not a list of
0:24:30accomplishments because I don't think he
0:24:31wanted to write that either it was it
0:24:34was kind of a personal story but was
0:24:36kind of a personal story about Steve
0:24:37Jobs but it was not perhaps what people
0:24:39were expecting if they expected just the
0:24:40run of the mill you know I am the the
0:24:43obituary writer for New York Times I got
0:24:44to write about Steve Jobs because the
0:24:46people who are doing that are going to
0:24:48do a great job at it and it's important
0:24:50to have that I read and enjoyed those
0:24:51articles but that's not how individuals
0:24:55relate to Steve Jobs so Gruber writes
0:24:57during fire ball a lot more like an
0:24:59individual author a lot more like a
0:25:01diary really or a journal then like he's
0:25:04a reporter on assignment for a magazine
0:25:07all right anyway you're gonna do a
0:25:09sponsor so yeah okay sure first sponsor
0:25:11this week is Squarespace Squarespace is
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0:27:07you in the Star Trek so by the ever
0:27:11thoughtful Kieran Haley in the chatroom
0:27:13posted a link to Wikipedia that's a it's
0:27:17like a formal description of the Dilbert
0:27:19ization of the world that I was talking
0:27:21about noncom try to pronounce its
0:27:23routine izing charisma that's got to be
0:27:26how it's pronounced I'll read from the
0:27:28page a routine eyes incredible is the
0:27:29process by which charismatic Authority
0:27:31is succeeded by bureaucratic bureaucracy
0:27:33controlled by a rationally established
0:27:35Authority or by a combination of
0:27:37traditional and bureaucratic authority
0:27:38so is the idea that you have a
0:27:41charismatic leader and his spirit goes
0:27:44into the organization and then it's
0:27:46eventually replaced by what seemed like
0:27:51good solid business practices like when
0:27:54you were a small company it's great to
0:27:55go on this one dudes whims but now the
0:27:57adults have to come in that's what they
0:27:59called it when they brought in the
0:28:01people to run Apple because Jobs wasn't
0:28:02CEO back then it was like president or
0:28:04whatever you know you need adult
0:28:06supervision so the real business people
0:28:07need to come in and this I show you how
0:28:09you run a real company and that's what
0:28:11kills big companies so I put that link
0:28:14in the show notes people can read the
0:28:15entire Wikipedia page on routine izing
0:28:16charisma oh I have one more tangent on
0:28:22Steve Jobs or we can go on to follow up
0:28:24and now let's hear it so tangent that I
0:28:28couldn't work into the article I was a
0:28:32lot of the things I saw that people
0:28:34linked up stuff you know here's a great
0:28:35Steve Jobs Greatest Hits though here's
0:28:37him introducing the iPhone stuff like
0:28:39that and one of them is all linked
0:28:42around a lot was one that I think I put
0:28:44in the show notes a while back was Steve
0:28:46Jobs at WWDC and it was someone he'd
0:28:49come back to app
0:28:50after a politico yeah maybe he was icy
0:28:55remember that like interim CEO yeah but
0:28:57this might have been even before that I
0:28:58think this before he was even ICO he had
0:29:00not yet kicked out what's his name who's
0:29:05the guy he kicked that is uh Emilio yeah
0:29:07add to be Emilio and so he had a session
0:29:11WWC which like Steve Jobs I'll just go
0:29:13up in the stays and you know you'll ask
0:29:15some questions some will just chat and
0:29:16that's what happened for like 45 minutes
0:29:18people from the stage as and this was
0:29:19Apple in 1997 which wasn't doing so hot
0:29:22so you can imagine some of the questions
0:29:23were kind of contentious and there I
0:29:25have clone the clone stuff going on
0:29:26stuff like that but if you listen to
0:29:28that and I would highly recommend that I
0:29:29should find that input in the show notes
0:29:30it's actually a YouTube video I had a
0:29:34long youtube video but I would recommend
0:29:36watching it and the sound quality is not
0:29:37great but what he does is he lays out
0:29:40his vision of the future of computing
0:29:44and with the exception of some of the
0:29:45weird stuff around the clones that
0:29:46didn't quite come out the way he
0:29:47described a lot of it it sounds crazy
0:29:52like that Apple could branch out into a
0:29:56network connected electronics and and
0:29:58how what computing would be like in the
0:30:00future and you know if you're back at
0:30:02Apple this time with Apple compare lis
0:30:03stay in business and it's in the PC
0:30:05business oh and there's the Newton thing
0:30:08which I think had just been canned and
0:30:09he's laying up as this grand vision of
0:30:12what the future would be like it sounds
0:30:13ridiculous like yeah whatever Joker get
0:30:14off the stage what have you done for me
0:30:16lately but people look at it now and
0:30:18Richards back hoe my god you know I
0:30:20would a visionary he predicted the
0:30:23future he would what a visionary you
0:30:24know he could see farther than we could
0:30:26uh and this like I like listening to
0:30:31that and I like watching the older
0:30:34videos like that but I don't like is the
0:30:35idea that Steve Jobs has some sort of
0:30:39supernatural power that people who say
0:30:41like he he could see the future we
0:30:44couldn't he he's special and magical
0:30:45it's almost like it's an excuse for why
0:30:48you are not Steve Jobs because well
0:30:50Steve Jobs is special and magical and
0:30:51obviously I can't be that uh that's I
0:30:55don't like that I don't like ascribing
0:30:57but once you invoke the supernatural you
0:30:59are checking out of reality so as far as
0:31:01I'm concerned so they it's like like I
0:31:04said it's an excuse
0:31:04for Yui you can't do that you stop
0:31:06thinking about it quickly you stop
0:31:08thinking about how he actually did it uh
0:31:10in reality I think this is the old alan
0:31:13kay saying the the best way to predict
0:31:14the future is to invent it and that's
0:31:16what he did he didn't predict what the
0:31:18future would be like because he's a
0:31:19Nostradamus he said what he would like
0:31:22the future to be like and then he made
0:31:24it that way that's why it matches what
0:31:25he said because he made it that way he
0:31:28was the one he was the one who did it he
0:31:30didn't predict a future like a visionary
0:31:32I will predict the future and then you
0:31:34just sit back and cross your arms and
0:31:35you wait and it turns out way different
0:31:36than your predicted well it won't turn
0:31:38out different if you are the guy who
0:31:39makes all that stuff you know and
0:31:41obviously not with his own little hands
0:31:42but like he kicked out the other CEO
0:31:44took over the company and just set to
0:31:46work doing all the things that he
0:31:48thought should be done and so it's no
0:31:49coincidence that he said that the future
0:31:51matched what he said because it was his
0:31:53plan and the that's I think what people
0:31:58who are close to Apple ever know about
0:32:00Apple admire the most about Steve Jobs
0:32:01people who don't know anything about him
0:32:03like you know just random people who saw
0:32:05that he died in the moon news or like
0:32:06that's that guy he must have been so
0:32:07smart he made those iPods and those
0:32:09iPads boy what a smart guy he's magical
0:32:11it's like Einstein or Edison you just
0:32:13they become a character in history and
0:32:16not a real person but the people who
0:32:19follow Apple and who have been with him
0:32:21and have known him for his entire career
0:32:24well I think we admire about him is the
0:32:28same thing we admire about like like the
0:32:32only other place I can imagine is
0:32:33happening or this happens frequently is
0:32:35athletics where people admire Michael
0:32:39Jordan for example because he sent it a
0:32:43clearly setting audacious goal he was
0:32:45going to be the best basketball player
0:32:46rather he was going to bin every single
0:32:48championship he was going to spoil the
0:32:50most points in every single game and
0:32:51then he then he actually did that it's
0:32:54setting in a bit ambitious goal and
0:32:56executing and accomplishing it and
0:32:58that's what Steve Jobs did do and that's
0:32:59what we admire about him stick the idea
0:33:01that he he dreamed these dreams that
0:33:03many people had like I imagine computing
0:33:05could be this way and then he actually
0:33:06made it happen and it's that the
0:33:09goal-setting and then the execution and
0:33:12the accomplishment of the goals that
0:33:13triumph that his personal triumph of
0:33:15accomplishing what he wanted to do is an
0:33:18inspiration
0:33:19was not because we think he's magical
0:33:20because it's like no matter what you're
0:33:21thinking of if your goal is to or
0:33:24whatever your goal happens to be to run
0:33:26a marathon and then you and then you
0:33:27accomplish that that feels great and we
0:33:29like seeing movies about people who do
0:33:31that they set some really ambitious goal
0:33:34and then they achieve it that's what we
0:33:35want to see and Steve Jobs had perhaps
0:33:38grander dreams than any of us and
0:33:40actually accomplished them and like that
0:33:42you see that in sports a Michael Jordan
0:33:43Lance Armstrong Michael Phelps the
0:33:45people who had big dreams and then and
0:33:47then actually did them right that is a
0:33:52that's a better lesson to take away from
0:33:55Steve Jobs then he's special and an
0:33:58outlier and and we no one else can do
0:34:01what he did everybody can do what he did
0:34:03on a different scale or in a different
0:34:05context you shouldn't check out from
0:34:09thinking that that's a different reality
0:34:11and that he's magical or supernatural
0:34:13he's just a person like we are he just
0:34:15it's hard work and you have to make
0:34:18sacrifices and it's not always pretty
0:34:21and there's going to be stumbles along
0:34:23the way but but he had that crazy goal
0:34:25that he's you know his whole life he's
0:34:26had these crazy goals that Mac was a
0:34:28crazy goal that the iPod everything I
0:34:31but he actually did it that that I
0:34:35couldn't find a way to work into what I
0:34:36wanted to write about but I just wanted
0:34:38to buy that I don't like I don't like
0:34:40the deification of Steve Jobs I like it
0:34:44better too I liked it better when when
0:34:46you recognized him as a person and what
0:34:50he has and take the lesson away that
0:34:54it's a it's a story of triumph just like
0:34:57any other possibly smaller story of
0:34:59triumph it's just the things he did are
0:35:01different still a great guy yeah that
0:35:09that's the the celebrity angle something
0:35:12I could have talked about but didn't for
0:35:15people who are celebrities and he was
0:35:17kind of a celebrity this happens more
0:35:20with actors and singers and stuff but
0:35:21you see all the interviews with them you
0:35:24listen to all their music you watch all
0:35:25their movies you buy all their products
0:35:27whatever it is and you start to think
0:35:29that you know the person right and
0:35:31that's that's
0:35:32a celebrity thing when you see the
0:35:34millet use if you see your favorite
0:35:35celebrity like God I know everything
0:35:37about this person I know the biography I
0:35:39read their life story I've seen a
0:35:40million injuries with them it feels like
0:35:42they're your friend but they don't know
0:35:43you because they've never seen you or
0:35:44met you and so you have this you have
0:35:48this weird desire to be like I know you
0:35:50so much I bet we could be great friends
0:35:52if you only knew me which is almost
0:35:53certainly not the case well in many
0:35:54cases they they feel like you are
0:35:57already their friend I bet that there
0:35:59are people who are listening to you who
0:36:00listen to every single episode of the
0:36:02show and they've listened to have over
0:36:0430 40 of these and if they were to meet
0:36:07you in an elevator
0:36:09they'd be like God you know remember
0:36:11that time we were talking about and
0:36:12you're like well I was I wasn't talking
0:36:14to you about that and I was talking to
0:36:16to Dan about that but you know they
0:36:19they're part of this conversation
0:36:20because they're listening to it they're
0:36:22in an intimate way and for somebody like
0:36:23Steve Jobs you've been using things that
0:36:27that person has inspired or created and
0:36:29you've been paying attention to things
0:36:31that they've said for for decades so you
0:36:34feel like you have a connection to that
0:36:36person even though in from that person
0:36:38standpoint they haven't like you're
0:36:40saying they have no clue who you are I
0:36:42had the same experience when I was on
0:36:44guesting on the Stack Exchange podcast
0:36:48recently uh Joel Spolsky
0:36:49are we gonna end the show that was great
0:36:52yeah so those guys I've listened I've
0:36:55ever been reading with Joel and writing
0:36:56on the web since you know for a decade
0:36:58and I've listened to all their podcasts
0:37:00and I felt like I and you even this like
0:37:02you communicate with them on Twitter
0:37:03occasionally or whatever I felt like I
0:37:04knew them it felt like hey we're buddy
0:37:05pals but they didn't know me from a
0:37:07whole wall it's just it's the easy trap
0:37:08to to fall into I'm gonna hook this in
0:37:11the this is a day Stack Exchange podcast
0:37:14number 20 I'll put this in the show
0:37:15notes great listen yeah and so I find
0:37:20myself with this inclination to because
0:37:21when somebody dies the people who are
0:37:23most affected by are the people who
0:37:24personally knew him and to a first
0:37:27approximation
0:37:27nobody personally knew him you know only
0:37:30it's a very small compared to the number
0:37:32of people who think they know Steve Jobs
0:37:33because they buy all these Apple
0:37:34products and have read all about him and
0:37:36stuff like that so you find yourself
0:37:37wanting wishing wishing you had been
0:37:41personal friends with Steve Jobs he's
0:37:42like and now he's gone and now we can
0:37:44never be friends which is pretty
0:37:46the irrational no busy we're never gonna
0:37:48be friends with him anyway right he
0:37:49can't be friends with the whole world I
0:37:50even you know I saw some stories they
0:37:52even the people who did know him we're
0:37:54all trying to see him before he died and
0:37:56he was very particular right even the
0:37:57set of people he was you know going to
0:37:59talk to and write I made it to he made
0:38:01choices that you would say well why
0:38:02would you make that like one of the
0:38:03piece of people who he talked to was I
0:38:04don't know how to pronounce his last
0:38:06name but John Doerr do eerr was a
0:38:09venture capitalist for the early Apple
0:38:11and I don't know what their relationship
0:38:12was but I can imagine like the reason he
0:38:14might have talked with him was that your
0:38:15back when I was starting capital a
0:38:17starting Apple I needed somebody who
0:38:18believed in me and who would give me
0:38:20money to do my thing and this was the
0:38:21guy who this was the venture capitalist
0:38:23who believed in me
0:38:23right that's the guy who steve job wants
0:38:26to talk to he doesn't want to talk to
0:38:27his adoring fans who bought like and not
0:38:29that he doesn't like you or anything but
0:38:31that that feeling that that sense of
0:38:34loss that now I can never be friends
0:38:36with Steve Jobs makes no sense on a
0:38:37rational basis but I think a lot of us
0:38:39feel it simply because we felt like he
0:38:40either already was our friend or could
0:38:42have been our friend or we would have a
0:38:43lot to talk about or you know I mean
0:38:45that that that's a weird that's a weird
0:38:48feeling and I think I think we're all
0:38:50feeling it yeah that's all I think I
0:38:56have to say about jobs unless you have
0:38:57any anything you want to add or any
0:38:59questions or any other things gonna
0:39:00bring up what do you what do you think I
0:39:04mean without getting too much into
0:39:06speculating on the future what do you
0:39:08think that immediate challenges are
0:39:11going to be not for Apple as a business
0:39:13but for the people at Apple I mean I've
0:39:15got a few friends who work at Apple you
0:39:17probably do too I talked to a couple of
0:39:19them and and and for them they were you
0:39:22know like there were people who are
0:39:23telling me oh you know that you might
0:39:26you know you might imagine well people
0:39:28would just be down or they would just be
0:39:29depressed and obviously people are sad
0:39:31but if anything the people that I know
0:39:33what they've told me being at Apple is
0:39:36it is that they're actually inspired
0:39:38they're trying you know they're trying
0:39:39to write better code they're working
0:39:40later you know they're they're staying
0:39:42longer they're they're you know they're
0:39:45they're doing more yeah this this is
0:39:48when the the danger starts for Apple as
0:39:50a company where it's obviously there's
0:39:53obviously are going to have the speed of
0:39:54just eve jobs will sort of imbue
0:39:57everything that they do
0:39:59and that's good but you it is the danger
0:40:03when the guy is not there when he's not
0:40:05alive anymore but that he becomes like
0:40:08like a martyr and like yeah it you can't
0:40:12I was saying is you don't want to DF I
0:40:14Steve Jobs like everyone there wants to
0:40:17respect him and say what would Steve
0:40:18think of this and we should do something
0:40:19like Steve proud but when Steve is not
0:40:21actually there to tell you what the heck
0:40:22he actually likes and what actually does
0:40:23make him proud other people can coop
0:40:25that intentionally or unintentionally
0:40:27and you know people start doing things
0:40:31in his name or saying well this is what
0:40:33Steve would have wanted and when the
0:40:35actual person is there and when he's so
0:40:37like down-to-earth and always cutting
0:40:39straight to the bone and just like from
0:40:40everything I read of all his
0:40:41interactions he was the first one to
0:40:44like would be the first one to cut the
0:40:46wind out of the sails of this legend of
0:40:47Steve Jobs he comes in he tells you what
0:40:49he wants tells you what's good tells you
0:40:50what's not uh and it's not always what
0:40:53you want to hear and doesn't always make
0:40:54you happy and sometimes he's you know a
0:40:57hard-ass and when he's not there and
0:41:00he's just like Lee we should do
0:41:01something to make Steve Jobs proud you
0:41:02have to be very careful that it doesn't
0:41:04drift that you don't start to have a
0:41:05little bit of you know it doesn't take
0:41:08on a new meaning slowly over time or
0:41:11other people don't
0:41:12everyone's gonna try to claim him like
0:41:14I'm doing what Steve Jobs won no
0:41:15actually Steve Jobs want this and he's
0:41:16not there anymore he can't tell you so
0:41:18so that's that's the long-term danger in
0:41:21short term I think that phenomenon I was
0:41:23talking about where like we all think
0:41:24we're Steve Jobs friend and we want to
0:41:26hang out with him stuff like that that's
0:41:27magnified eight billion fold when you
0:41:29routinely see him in the hallway and
0:41:30occasionally he does come over to your
0:41:31desk and looks at something and it's
0:41:32like the highlight of your year right uh
0:41:34now imagine what lost their feeling
0:41:37because they weren't his friends either
0:41:38right they were just his co-workers but
0:41:39that's so much closer relationship than
0:41:41guy who buys ipods a lot so I bet
0:41:44they're feeling that even more acutely
0:41:46because then that really is a real loss
0:41:48he was you know he was there either
0:41:51directly or indirectly shaping them as
0:41:53individuals and commenting on their work
0:41:55and judging it and if they if that's
0:41:57something they wanted which I imagine
0:41:59they what if they work at Apple that
0:42:00they respect his opinion that that
0:42:03feedback is gone now so that's got to be
0:42:05a really big loss for them what you got
0:42:10I think we can go to follow up now okay
0:42:14follow the heavy stuff with the lightest
0:42:17possible stuff I'm not which I should
0:42:23start with you rob before well this is
0:42:24kind of all but the last bit of Steve
0:42:26Jobs thing is that I wanted to mention
0:42:27my mother called me at work when Steve
0:42:30Jobs said the day after Steve don't want
0:42:32to on top of the news cycle to to offer
0:42:34her condolences and were they the funny
0:42:39thing that she said maybe we'll get to
0:42:40if we have time for stuff later is that
0:42:42uh she was mentioning it's just so soon
0:42:44after you left she doesn't have a
0:42:46timeline exactly now but yeah it was
0:42:47like how many months was at one month
0:42:48two months yeah it was not all it was
0:42:50not long yeah and she mentioned it was
0:42:53just after that that new announcement
0:42:55thing because that was covered in the
0:42:57mainstream you know the iPhone 4s
0:42:58announcement and one of the things you
0:43:00mentioned is but but people were kind of
0:43:02disappointed in that announcement
0:43:03weren't they
0:43:03so there there you go that is outside
0:43:07the echo chamber in the mainstream world
0:43:09of news coverage the impression from mom
0:43:12is that the iPhone 4s announcement was
0:43:14this point yeah
0:43:15we'll discuss that what if we start
0:43:17discussing the iPhone snap we should and
0:43:19and I actually had you know it's funny
0:43:22you mentioned getting that call my
0:43:23brother-in-law who is probably as far
0:43:25outside of the geek range as your mom uh
0:43:28he is a you know a regular guy he texted
0:43:33me to you know offer his condolences so
0:43:35I mean it's it's clear that that people
0:43:38are aware of that but he didn't see you
0:43:40know this was before the um this was
0:43:45before I think he was you know it was
0:43:47really really really in news and it was
0:43:51just it's interesting how it reads it
0:43:52it's so widely known who Steve Jobs is
0:43:56as some people have said to me recently
0:43:58they said you know what I didn't know
0:44:00until I was reading his obituary that
0:44:02that he was involved with Pixar you know
0:44:04people have said that to me and I think
0:44:06all everybody makes the association with
0:44:08Apple but maybe not necessarily with the
0:44:10Pixar he actually owned more of his
0:44:15fortune came from Pixar than from Apple
0:44:17maybe twice double well Disney but yeah
0:44:20Disney sure
0:44:22it's all finally what leave it's good
0:44:24actually well let's go to fall so I
0:44:27talked about many shows ago the the
0:44:32Netflix queue management thing the
0:44:34Gruber had mentioned when you get the
0:44:35movie stuck at the top of the queue and
0:44:37I had said that it would be best for you
0:44:42to just return that movie because it's
0:44:44just blocking up your queue and you're
0:44:45never going to watch it but it feels bad
0:44:47to return without watching it and I was
0:44:48I said it was something like the sunk
0:44:50cost fallacy where you've already you've
0:44:52already incurred that loss best to just
0:44:53you know move on someone sent me I got a
0:44:57mangas name again Jonathan Llodra folder
0:45:01sorry P oo udre sent a link to a better
0:45:05mapping of that it's a cognitive bias
0:45:08called hyperbolic discounting this
0:45:11rating curve is male here this is where
0:45:13we all think that our future selves are
0:45:15more trustworthy than than we currently
0:45:16are so it's sort of like saying some day
0:45:19I'll watch this movie but tonight I'm
0:45:21going to watch something
0:45:22it's like sloppier right so I think some
0:45:26day I'll watch Saving Private Ryan but
0:45:27tonight I'm going to watch Iron Man
0:45:28right you just always assume that you of
0:45:31the future will live up to the ideals
0:45:32that you set for yourself not like the
0:45:34you of the present who just wants to eat
0:45:36pizza and watch some cruddy B movie so I
0:45:38put the show link in the show notes to
0:45:40hyperbolic discounting which is much
0:45:42better I think so we have some
0:45:44complaints about things we say in the
0:45:45show this is Jonathan Jonathan not John
0:45:48top Lee so could you please stop saying
0:45:50that you could care less I did this
0:45:52myself in a recent show and I heard
0:45:53myself saying it and I wondered if
0:45:55someone's saying but he says that you
0:45:56say it more than I do I hadn't noticed
0:45:57you saying but this is one of those
0:45:59things well first of all miss speaking
0:46:03on podcasts I do it all the time and I'm
0:46:05amazed that people don't call me like
0:46:06I'm on a show three shows ago I said
0:46:08Microsoft PSP not a single person called
0:46:10me on that probably because I've never
0:46:11been shown on PSP
0:46:13yeah I immediately followed it up by
0:46:15talking extensively about how Sony did
0:46:17XY and Z with the PSP so it was clear
0:46:19from context of the rest of the show
0:46:22that I understood that the PSP came from
0:46:23stony you know I'll tell you in your
0:46:25case what it is is that you're clearly
0:46:28intelligent and in fact you're you speak
0:46:30with such authority that you could say
0:46:34something for example like
0:46:36Apple's new version of Windows is
0:46:39horrible and people would actually
0:46:42before they would correct you they would
0:46:43question their own concept of reality
0:46:46and I get I guess Apple is the one
0:46:48behind Windows they would or maybe I
0:46:50just talk really fast I think it's the
0:46:53former but you do put it at any rate
0:46:55yeah so that's miss speaking but the
0:46:58could care less thing that's one of the
0:47:00situations where the the nonsensical
0:47:03version of that I don't know what you
0:47:05would call that colloquialism I'm not
0:47:07sure they correct word for that would be
0:47:09but we all say that so much we all know
0:47:13what you mean they're the one that I
0:47:14find most annoying every all have our
0:47:17pet peeves is a lowest common
0:47:19denominator which makes no sense
0:47:20mathematically mmm-hmm it's not it's not
0:47:22even the mathematical reality of that
0:47:24phrase is not what's meant by the by the
0:47:26you know but when someone says lowest
0:47:28common denominator we all know what
0:47:29they're talking about I'm going to get
0:47:31back to what I talked about in that
0:47:32writing show is that all this stuff we
0:47:35all have our peeves and it's better to
0:47:37be correct and it's better to say
0:47:39couldn't care less instead of could care
0:47:40less but let's not forget that the
0:47:43purpose of speech and writing is to
0:47:45communicate uh
0:47:46and if we're successfully communicating
0:47:49like even even this guy complaining
0:47:51about it he knows what we meant he
0:47:52doesn't like the fact the phrase doesn't
0:47:54actually mean that because it it's you
0:47:56know the same way I don't like lowest
0:47:57common denominator but we have
0:47:59successfully communicated right I mean
0:48:02people understand what we mean yeah and
0:48:04and sometimes saying it the wrong way
0:48:06has better success at communicating and
0:48:09saying it the right way like it's
0:48:10something if I didn't say lowest common
0:48:12denominator but I said greatest common
0:48:14denominator people will think for like
0:48:16does he mean the opposite of what I know
0:48:18to be the traditional meaning of lowest
0:48:21common denominator and they get confused
0:48:22and it's yeah English the English
0:48:25language is weird grammars weird usage
0:48:27is weird and even in phrases that make
0:48:29no logical sense eventually just take on
0:48:32these weird meanings so uh I think we
0:48:35should say couldn't care less but when
0:48:36we say could care less I don't think
0:48:38that they're I think it's still
0:48:40successful communication so that's why I
0:48:42want to save John Copley who was very
0:48:43nice who gave pronunciation of his name
0:48:44t.o.p - le e top Li but I think about it
0:48:47got them one without his help but I
0:48:49ensured other
0:48:49like Jonathan Blow drew - please pride
0:48:52pronunciation love your neighbor unless
0:48:54you want me to mangle it yeah loader
0:48:57yeah he's written in before was I think
0:48:59you've made that same noise memories
0:49:00that's how I pronounce his name and
0:49:02people know what I mean yeah to further
0:49:05your point
0:49:06so another one you know you do the nosy
0:49:09and siracusa and you always you always
0:49:11say that voice it's something solid and
0:49:13what you say nosy and nos why yeah like
0:49:16like butting in or having a big nose
0:49:19which I do but that's exactly the main
0:49:22reason you say nosey is because back
0:49:25when we first chatted on podcast you
0:49:26have trouble pronouncing my name and you
0:49:27would always put the Z in it and you
0:49:28still do you backslide a lot you will
0:49:30you people hear it because it sounds
0:49:32better it's an upgrade yeah I know but
0:49:34you you slide back in a little bit but
0:49:36the one I've seen more recently is in
0:49:39the reviews which thank you for everyone
0:49:41has written a review but recently
0:49:42there's been a rash of reviews with why
0:49:44like the sy RAC USA because the the city
0:49:48in New York Syracuse is sy ha ha and
0:49:50that's sort of the the Americanization
0:49:52of the Italian city which is actually
0:49:54spelled by like my last name my name
0:49:56does not have a Y in it and I think it's
0:49:58cargo cult thing because people were
0:49:59seeing the most recent review oh and
0:50:01then they around you it they dodge this
0:50:03ah they just copy and paste the name
0:50:05they're like oh that the previous
0:50:07reviewer must have done had a spout
0:50:08there is no y in my name so if you want
0:50:10to mix it up then you can do Syracuse in
0:50:12to Y but I think you should keep doing
0:50:14nosey because that will help you
0:50:15remember it's not circ use' si RAC you
0:50:22si yeah we've done the mnemonic before
0:50:26right people want to remember how to
0:50:27spell it it's sir si R because we've got
0:50:28three letters there then you've got AC
0:50:30in the middle which is the only part you
0:50:31have to remember and then USA which easy
0:50:33for Americans to remember oh no no Z
0:50:40yeah Star Wars blu-rays we talked about
0:50:45Star Wars and the blu-rays and all that
0:50:47business a couple of shows ago and I
0:50:51mentioned how I thought I might end up
0:50:54buying the original trilogy thing simply
0:50:57because the Empire Strikes Back is one
0:50:58of my favorite movies of all time and
0:51:00the Empire Strikes Back is the least
0:51:01adulterated by special edition
0:51:03stuff there are no character destroying
0:51:06moments like griot shooting first there
0:51:09are no copy-and-paste in people from the
0:51:12prequels like the ghosts and Return of
0:51:13the Jedi there's certainly no additional
0:51:15Darth Vader no business when he's
0:51:18chucking the emperor down yeah yeah
0:51:20that's Empire Empire is the least
0:51:22touched and it is my favorites I figured
0:51:24well I would really like a
0:51:26high-definition version of that movie so
0:51:28I was going to buy it but before I did I
0:51:30said let me just do a little more
0:51:31research and I asked around on Twitter
0:51:32and I said for people who have bought it
0:51:34or people who know there's a bunch of
0:51:37special features that come with the Star
0:51:38Wars blu-rays like making of movies and
0:51:40never-before-seen interviews and next
0:51:42one you know all that business and I
0:51:45wanted those and I said do those special
0:51:47features only come with the big set that
0:51:49includes all the movies are they also
0:51:51included with the with the original
0:51:54trilogy box set which just includes
0:51:56those three movies and the answer I got
0:51:58was that the special features are only
0:52:00on the big set and then I asked if I get
0:52:03the big set are the special features are
0:52:06the original trilogy special features
0:52:08mixed in with the prequel special
0:52:10features like you know are they touching
0:52:11each other and the answer is no there
0:52:13are separate discs one disc for special
0:52:15features for the prequels and one disc
0:52:17for special features for the real Star
0:52:18Wars movies and so I actually did end up
0:52:22buying the full Star Wars blu-ray boxset
0:52:27which includes the prequels and I would
0:52:29just simply never open those boxes just
0:52:31so I could get a high definition of
0:52:33empire with minimal delt eration
0:52:35even though the lightsabers are pink and
0:52:36there are some changes that make no
0:52:38sense like the additional seamless Vader
0:52:42going back to his starters drawer but I
0:52:45get to see the special features a bit
0:52:48Lucas always finds a way to get me so I
0:52:50put in the special features discs and
0:52:51I'm like I'm going to see these special
0:52:52features about these movies that I love
0:52:53and some of them are really neat but
0:52:55they all seem to play in this weird
0:52:57player window it's like like a computer
0:53:00desktop where there's a background and a
0:53:01little viewer screen and then the
0:53:03picture appears in the viewer screen so
0:53:04a I'm concerned about burning on my
0:53:06plasma not going to be watching this
0:53:07movie that's filling up 80% of the
0:53:09screen but there's this border around it
0:53:11and be make the thing fill the screen we
0:53:13want to see the video I don't care about
0:53:14the frame or the surroundings
0:53:16or want to see Tatooine in the
0:53:18background while I'm watching the video
0:53:19fill the screen with the video it's
0:53:21supposed to be it's not hi-def just
0:53:22stretch it that yeah Lucas not a friend
0:53:32not a friend
0:53:34yeah it gets all the fault we have to do
0:53:38I want to talk briefly about Syrian a
0:53:41little bit of the time we have left we
0:53:42don't have time to go through the whole
0:53:44announcement well maybe we just wanna
0:53:46clear up you have not bought an iPhone
0:53:484s you know and you and you will not be
0:53:52buying one I think it's a great phone no
0:53:54no I won't be long and apparently
0:53:57there's some people who've been emailing
0:53:58me there's a guy who started up he
0:54:02started a web site and he started taking
0:54:05donations uh for people who would like
0:54:10for you to have an iPhone of any kind
0:54:13and iPhone 4s or otherwise and he
0:54:17started taking up donations he hasn't
0:54:19raised a lot of money yet and he's asked
0:54:21me if I would get behind this
0:54:23fundraising process to help you get an
0:54:26iPhone 4s and as you've said on other
0:54:29shows including a special we did on the
0:54:31day of the event you said something like
0:54:35you will you didn't want it because
0:54:37there's a data plan associated with it
0:54:39and this guy is actually trying to raise
0:54:41enough money that would cover both the
0:54:43cost of the phone and the full cost of
0:54:47the data plan for the two-year contract
0:54:48uh and I did not get back to him I've
0:54:53not yet said yes I'll get behind this or
0:54:55not because I pinged you about this and
0:54:57I said that what are you doing and you
0:55:00were still you still said no you still
0:55:02said no now I'm sure if you know Merlin
0:55:04and Marko had asked if you wanted a
0:55:06toaster you would have said no and by
0:55:09the way we have received emails about
0:55:11toasters saying in insert country name
0:55:14here a toaster is the slot toaster and
0:55:17what you have is a toaster oven well
0:55:18that's the same here
0:55:20but we just call it a toaster but that's
0:55:22beside the point the point is it seems
0:55:25like you really just don't want one of
0:55:26these so I would like a phone what I
0:55:29don't want is people collecting money
0:55:30to buy me a phone that's just messed up
0:55:32I especially messed up because as far as
0:55:34I can tell the people who like PayPal
0:55:35donated the person who's organizing us
0:55:37now has your money he should give it
0:55:38back to you
0:55:39I can afford to buy myself an iPhone if
0:55:41I buy an iPhone I won't
0:55:43I won't default online mortgage and my
0:55:45kids won't starve I can I can buy myself
0:55:46an iPhone it's just what I choose to
0:55:49spend my money on and right now I don't
0:55:50use a cellular phone
0:55:52I'm not away from Wi-Fi enough to
0:55:55justify $70 a month bill it doesn't mean
0:55:58I can't afford a $70 month bill I can't
0:56:00afford one I could buy my whole family
0:56:02iPhones if I wanted to I thought that
0:56:04would be an effective use of my money
0:56:06but I would rather spend that money on
0:56:08other things other fun things or
0:56:10whatever just put it in the kids bank
0:56:11accounts for college whatever so please
0:56:13do not collect money to buy me and I buy
0:56:15gift is one thing like Marco and Merlin
0:56:17you know well Marco Elise had met me at
0:56:20that point and knew me and they both
0:56:22know me from the podcast and like when
0:56:24your friends buy you a gift it's rude
0:56:27not to accept it but when strangers try
0:56:28to give you a gift like don't don't
0:56:30collect money for me please give those
0:56:31money back to those people I appreciate
0:56:33the idea that they would like for me to
0:56:34have an iPhone someday I'm sure I will
0:56:37when the prices come down or when we can
0:56:39eventually justify it I mean like
0:56:41obviously when my kids get older they're
0:56:42gonna want cellphones because all the
0:56:43kids are gonna have them and stuff and
0:56:44at that point I'll be getting them my
0:56:46phones like iPhones will enter my life
0:56:48don't worry and I get access to iOS
0:56:50devices I'm not deprived but don't
0:56:52collect money for me please give it back
0:56:53to the people I won't accept an iPhone
0:56:55that you give me I won't you know just
0:56:58the people should get their money back I
0:56:59appreciate this is like that friend
0:57:01thing like you think you're friends with
0:57:02somebody I appreciate the idea that they
0:57:04want to do this and it's like they will
0:57:07feel bad that they couldn't do this
0:57:08thing because like they're giving it
0:57:09willingly they want me to have one it
0:57:11would make them happy for me to have one
0:57:12but I just think it's inappropriate so
0:57:17you don't want one from this yeah and
0:57:20the the problem comes in because I keep
0:57:22saying well I would like one if it was
0:57:23given to me for free but that's not what
0:57:25I mean I don't mean people go out and
0:57:26buy me a phone but I'm saying that I'm
0:57:27not rejecting it because I don't like
0:57:29the product it's just a matter of what
0:57:30you spend your money on I don't have an
0:57:32Apple TV either
0:57:33but that doesn't mean that I don't like
0:57:35an Apple TV I will I'm going to get an
0:57:37Apple TV 3 but I figure let me wait it
0:57:39out wait a few more versions let the
0:57:40features come up and stuff like that
0:57:43you know it's I hope people can grasp
0:57:45that concept the idea that I think the
0:57:47iPhone is a great product and if I had
0:57:48one I would use one but when it comes
0:57:50time to budget my money for what I want
0:57:52to spend it on I can't justify the
0:57:54expense of an iPhone simply because I'm
0:57:56just not away from Wi-Fi and in need of
0:57:59data services almost ever
0:58:00I just commute from my car from work to
0:58:03home both of which have Wi-Fi that's it
0:58:07so can I get in a little bit on Siri
0:58:10before we go please
0:58:11yeah so except we don't have time to go
0:58:14through the whole iPhone announcement
0:58:15maybe next week but the Siri thing no
0:58:16let's do the sponsor thing okay all
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0:59:32supporting us for so long and going
0:59:34forward MailChimp calm apparently we
0:59:38can't get off this buying and I have one
0:59:40thing out a few more comments that I saw
0:59:41come up within chat room one is everyone
0:59:42saying why not get an unlock phone why
0:59:44not get when I get one unlock it and use
0:59:46your SIM card from your current prepaid
0:59:49phone so on and so forth I said to me in
0:59:51the episode six or whatever we talk
0:59:52about iPhones I don't want to deal with
0:59:54the whole I don't want to pay for an
0:59:56unlock phone
0:59:57I don't want to deal with the whole
0:59:57unlocked and and you know
0:59:57unlocked and and you know
1:00:00a jailbroken stuff so for the things
1:00:02that are gray market slash illegal I
1:00:04don't want to deal with that hassle for
1:00:05things that aren't like buying an
1:00:06official unlock phone from Apple I cost
1:00:09a lot of money and it doesn't you know
1:00:11it doesn't help me to get an unlock
1:00:13phone like that
1:00:14because you start to pay for a data plan
1:00:16if you want to use it right and the
1:00:19thing uses signe we're going to add data
1:00:21so if I buy 200 megabyte data plan it's
1:00:23just I don't want the monthly bill it's
1:00:24buying an unlock one is a suggestion
1:00:26that people keep saying I don't I just
1:00:28don't want the bill unlocked phone
1:00:30doesn't get free data doesn't get free
1:00:32voice even the voice built people think
1:00:33I was the data plan it's the problem
1:00:34voices well I pay like eight dollars a
1:00:37month for my voice and I use almost none
1:00:39of it it's like for emergencies that my
1:00:41car breaks down that's what I use my
1:00:42cell phone for or if I'm on the road
1:00:43needs a call about picking up a kid from
1:00:45daycare or school or something that's
1:00:47what I use my phone for almost nothing
1:00:48for nothing else and someone was
1:00:53suggesting that the people who are
1:00:54collecting money that they should just
1:00:55give it to charity I don't think that's
1:00:56fair either because the people who gave
1:00:57that money thought they were giving it
1:00:59to buy a phone for somebody and
1:01:00something that would make them feel good
1:01:01they didn't give it for the person
1:01:02collect my money to pick a charity they
1:01:04also didn't give it for me to pick a
1:01:05charity the person who collected that
1:01:06money should give the money back to the
1:01:07individual people because the thing they
1:01:09wanted to give the money for it's not
1:01:11going to happen
1:01:12and so they should be allowed to decide
1:01:14what happens that my addition say odd
1:01:16you know that person gave their money to
1:01:17some sort of research organization for
1:01:19cancer or something
1:01:20that's not what they get the money for
1:01:21it's not fair so I think the people
1:01:23should get the money back alright Siri
1:01:27so did you see the Apple ad with the
1:01:31dude jogging yes he's like make this
1:01:36appointment I've got another appointment
1:01:37at that time or I move it to send a text
1:01:40message to my wife blah blah blah
1:01:43these things the Siri thing is kind of
1:01:47cruel because people who watch this ad
1:01:50and the ad is made to do this people
1:01:56know that AI doesn't exist artificial
1:01:57intelligence but people washes ad even
1:02:01people who should know better and they
1:02:03think it's AI right and it's not and
1:02:08that's I think going to be a problem of
1:02:10expectations in reality
1:02:12in reality I think this thing will work
1:02:14great when you have a limited vocabulary
1:02:15and we have enough processing power to
1:02:18get recognition to work right but it's
1:02:21going to work like a text adventure game
1:02:23where you have to learn the vocabulary
1:02:25like when you're a kid you get it you
1:02:27learn like what do you know
1:02:28move couch or you know push lever pull
1:02:30lever use X on Y you learn when you're a
1:02:34computer nerd you start learning the
1:02:35grammar that this game engine
1:02:37understands and that's after eight
1:02:39thousand times of the game engine coming
1:02:40back to you saying I don't understand X
1:02:42Y I don't know how to yank I don't know
1:02:45how to leap I don't know how to jump
1:02:47question not understood command line it
1:02:49you go through a ton of that before you
1:02:51figure out the vocabulary of the game so
1:02:53that when you're in the final dungeon or
1:02:54whatever you can just rattle off the
1:02:55commands that you know will fit into the
1:02:56grammar of the thing Siri has a grammar
1:02:59too it has a set of things that it can
1:03:01do it's more flexible than those old
1:03:03texts eventer game so you can phrase
1:03:04things in different ways and use
1:03:05synonyms and so on and so forth that's
1:03:06that's why it's in advance in technology
1:03:08it's a better recognition engine and by
1:03:11the way it's not the speech component as
1:03:12far as I understand Siri came up with
1:03:14the part that figures out what the heck
1:03:17you're saying textually but the speech
1:03:20recognition part that turns what you
1:03:22said into text commands is separate so
1:03:26so series is the thing that's trying to
1:03:29parse your English sentence I know how
1:03:33can I keep messing up people gonna hear
1:03:34that I think it's a speech recognition
1:03:35but any right it's the it's the
1:03:37understanding engine but it is not AI it
1:03:39will not understand you like a secretary
1:03:41would it's not going to work like it
1:03:43does in that video is special for
1:03:45regular people who don't know the
1:03:46vocabulary now you're going to have one
1:03:47or two magical experiences where you say
1:03:49something and it happens to actually
1:03:50work but you're gonna spend a lot of
1:03:51time I think figuring out what you have
1:03:53to say now this doesn't this doesn't
1:03:56mean it's Siri is bad Siri is great
1:03:58because for the people who do learn the
1:03:59vocabulary even if you just learn one
1:04:01piece of vocabulary even if you just
1:04:03learn the reply to text message thing
1:04:05that will let you reply to someone's
1:04:07text message without taking your hands
1:04:09off the wheel or without taking your
1:04:10phone out of your pocket or you know or
1:04:12look something up quickly if you're if
1:04:14you just wanna look up a restaurant you
1:04:15don't want to type it out with your
1:04:16little thumbs
1:04:16once you learn those one or two little
1:04:18commands that you will actually use it
1:04:19will be a great addition and I think
1:04:21this is great technology it's going to
1:04:22make the iPhone 4s well worth buying
1:04:24over the iPhone 4 but
1:04:26you will have to learn those those
1:04:28commands essentially it's not going to
1:04:31be a magical helpful person that you
1:04:34talk to and it's not it's not going to
1:04:35be your secretary and I fear that
1:04:37everybody watching that Edie thinks it's
1:04:39going to be their secretary and they're
1:04:41going to bring the thing home they're
1:04:41going to start talking to it and it's
1:04:43just going to bounce right off of it
1:04:44because they have no idea what the what
1:04:46things that understands and it doesn't
1:04:47and that's seen before you get into the
1:04:50possible problems with the actual speech
1:04:52recognition part the translation of your
1:04:54speech and detect someone saying the
1:04:55natural language processing is the
1:04:57process of understanding the text and
1:04:59the meaning behind it and then before
1:05:00that is the barrier translating what you
1:05:03said into a text command so I fear for
1:05:07the Siri backlash kind of Doonesbury
1:05:10eggs freckles moment for Siri but I but
1:05:14I do think it's it's going to be a great
1:05:15addition simply because typing stuff in
1:05:17that little keyboard is sometimes
1:05:20fumbling in a pane and if there's
1:05:23something that you do frequently as part
1:05:25of your daily routine like replying to
1:05:27tech messages or making a quick
1:05:29appointment without having to open up
1:05:30the the calendar app and tap around and
1:05:32stuff if you can figure out because you
1:05:35do that a hundred times a day and you
1:05:37get a hang of like how this works in
1:05:39Siri and what's command Siri knows this
1:05:41will be a huge boost to your efficiency
1:05:43not to have to go pecking in there with
1:05:44your fingers but it is not going to be a
1:05:51magic robot it's not going to be hell
1:05:53it's not going to be a secretary so if
1:05:59you say so I mean it don't you get that
1:06:02fear that layperson fear when you see
1:06:04that ad know like it's not going to work
1:06:08like that
1:06:09you're not maybe I think I think it will
1:06:11work like that and I'm looking forward
1:06:13to it you can't blow not alright that's
1:06:15the thing about the Nerds though because
1:06:16like we'll figure it out the same way we
1:06:18figure out those texts adventury we'll
1:06:20figure it out in a day or two and we'll
1:06:21know exactly what you can send you can't
1:06:22say and we'll want to show it off to
1:06:23people and you say hey mom check it out
1:06:25look here take this phone out tell it to
1:06:26do whatever and should be like tell it
1:06:28what and she'll say something and you're
1:06:30like no you have to say it like this and
1:06:31like why do I have to know it's
1:06:33understand yeah
1:06:33it's gonna be it's not gonna be like it
1:06:37is in the ad and because we don't have
1:06:39AI
1:06:40and that's that's the worst part of the
1:06:42relay people who don't know that we
1:06:43don't have I I don't don't understand
1:06:45the current state of Technology and
1:06:47artificial intelligence and how far we
1:06:48are from anything that comes even
1:06:49remotely close to what they would
1:06:51consider AI and when it does what they
1:06:53want like one or two things in a row
1:06:55when does what they want the like see it
1:06:56knows it's thinking it's smart like it's
1:06:59yeah when we actually get AI boy that'll
1:07:02be great right up until it didn't slaves
1:07:03awesome kills us all but but it but we
1:07:06don't have it yet in series not it so I
1:07:08think it's a great feature they'll be
1:07:10really useful that will also have a
1:07:11humongous backlash I hope I'm wrong
1:07:13about the backlash part but we'll see
1:07:19then it that sense yeah I have many more
1:07:22things now iPhone announcement I'm sorry
1:07:24that if we still have the talent of the
1:07:26Windows eight stuff I don't know if
1:07:28we'll even do that at this point I will
1:07:30want to talk about what's wrong with
1:07:31Microsoft eventually so yeah the next
1:07:35time we get the next time we talk I'll
1:07:36have an iPhone for us and I'd be using
1:07:38Siri Siri on the air yeah
1:07:40Siri please call Jon siracusa nose II
1:07:47need a nickname for me in the address
1:07:49book nosy I was going to say can you can
1:07:52you assign you know how like uh in the
1:07:55least in in your favorite science
1:07:58fiction world in Star Trek uh you know
1:08:00they are they to activate the computer
1:08:02to start talking the computer that
1:08:04computer and then it lated listens it
1:08:06starts and it starts talking to you you
1:08:08don't have to do that with Siri you have
1:08:09to hold down the the button or something
1:08:12but I'd like to name Iowa if I could I
1:08:14wouldn't I would given a name to Siri
1:08:17and then it would always be listening
1:08:18see then you know you got really high
1:08:20when it's always listening well Apple
1:08:22did that with speech recognition and
1:08:24classic Mac OS where you could assign a
1:08:25name to your computer and it would wait
1:08:26for the name you'd there was different
1:08:28modes you can still hold down a key and
1:08:29make a deal but the one mole I didn't
1:08:30know you it was all it could always
1:08:31listen
1:08:32yeah it could listen for your net for
1:08:34its name and then do what you said it a
1:08:35default name was computer my friend whom
1:08:37I was telling you remembered back in the
1:08:38day when he was that they first got the
1:08:40first set of 660 a V's remember those
1:08:43you know remember the AV series of
1:08:45Macintosh's are great so anyway he would
1:08:47yell across the office through the guy's
1:08:49computer computer shut down and they
1:08:51would
1:08:51shut down that's great but nope no
1:08:54confirmation coming right yeah so they'd
1:08:57be naming the thing and pushing the
1:08:59button is much better that will help a
1:09:00lot because people kind of understand
1:09:02that from walkie-talkies yeah yeah so
1:09:07I'm looking forward to you getting your
1:09:08phone assuming it ships on time and
1:09:09assuming you don't break it any interval
1:09:11between that time you get it answers
1:09:12okay use the case you're getting the
1:09:14Apple Care Plus mmm you should reply
1:09:18hazy you should get it is too late now
1:09:20you have to get it when you buy the
1:09:21phone if you didn't order it now I think
1:09:23you can't I think you can no I think
1:09:25that was the yeah Theo today so you can
1:09:27get AppleCare you can get the Apple Care
1:09:29Plus at plus thing is like I drop it in
1:09:31the toilet they'll give you a numeric
1:09:32test I don't need that I'll see how how
1:09:34well faith does with her naked iPhone me
1:09:37I know well beyond her to replace it if
1:09:42she busted as an as an employee of this
1:09:45company you get it you get an iPhone
1:09:47it's part of your standard you know but
1:09:51you don't get a second iPhone
1:09:52no definitely not so that's it but we
1:09:57will be back we will be back next week
1:09:59and people can follow you on twitter at
1:10:05as just at siracusa know why i'm dan
1:10:11benjamin on twitter we appreciate all of
1:10:13you who have gone in and reviewed and
1:10:15rated the show please keep doing that
1:10:16please keep doing it and you can hear
1:10:19previous episodes of this show and all
1:10:21of the other shows that we do on 5x5
1:10:23just by going to 5x5 TV I always get
1:10:26email from people where they say you
1:10:29don't cross promote the other shows
1:10:30enough I didn't know that there were any
1:10:32other shows besides hypercritical on 5x5
1:10:35there are and and then I I promoted a
1:10:39few then I actually felt bad and I said
1:10:41maybe I don't promote enough so I
1:10:43promoted a few of the shows and then I
1:10:45got more email saying and this was
1:10:47inaccurate by the way but you only
1:10:49promoted the shows you were on and I
1:10:50said that's not true I promoted the web
1:10:52ahead I promoted back power users and
1:10:54and I also did promote like Andy knockos
1:10:58new show which I am on
1:10:59but gets good so don't just how about
1:11:01this just go to 5x5 TV there's a lot of
1:11:04cool shows that we'd love for you to
1:11:05listen to them you just go there right
1:11:09and that seems seems reasonable right
1:11:12John and write a review it's a good
1:11:14chance to write a little essay yeah
1:11:18thank you John see you next week
1:11:20yep