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H.I. #86: Banana Republic

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0:00:00okay is not cutesy yeah you have not

0:00:02understood what Icarus no uncle wouldn't

0:00:05be cute

0:00:05oka would be like there are the cash

0:00:08bastard have you lose the cash bastard

0:00:10yeah yeah I paid I paid for my toes with

0:00:13the cash bastard hmm I'm thinking like

0:00:15akka is is like the ha for getting the

0:00:18word but like the Japanese word for

0:00:20cuteness that a thousand people will put

0:00:21it in the comments no awkwardness is

0:00:23very masculine and it's very unrefined

0:00:27not always obscene but someone who's

0:00:30aqua is very likely to use a lot of

0:00:31swear words haka in my head it feels

0:00:33like a koala with big eyes that's what

0:00:35aqua feels like really oh no you have

0:00:38not understood okay I'm gonna improve

0:00:40your education on that with some

0:00:42materials I think I like this definition

0:00:44of ARCA much better oka is like

0:00:46Australian cuteness we have talked a

0:00:49little bit about Disney we were talking

0:00:52about the fastpasses

0:00:53which yes I don't even want to get into

0:00:54it but boy did I discover that fast

0:00:58passes work different everywhere they

0:01:00were different in different Disney parks

0:01:02we got explained in the reddit all of

0:01:04the various algorithms that exist with

0:01:07fast passes everywhere in the world and

0:01:09I left feeling ten times more confused

0:01:11than it had started but I am

0:01:13appreciative to everybody who wrote in

0:01:14all that stuff but it's like holy hell

0:01:16fast passes are complicated that must be

0:01:19a in the top 10 or top 20 of most fed

0:01:21back things we've ever got and I

0:01:24understand maybe we made some mistakes

0:01:25and if you want to understand it just go

0:01:27to the subreddit from that previous

0:01:29episode and knock yourself out

0:01:31fill your books but one thing I did

0:01:34notice is obviously a lot of people who

0:01:36work for Disney listen to hello internet

0:01:38because a lot of them got in touch and

0:01:39one thing which I was obviously aware of

0:01:42before and was emphasized by these

0:01:44messages and I just wonder what you

0:01:45think about it is the fact that Disney

0:01:47call their staff cast members this is

0:01:51like obviously a very Disney thing in

0:01:52there I think they're known for it and

0:01:54the staff seem to like it too because

0:01:55they always like referring to themselves

0:01:56as cast members what do you think of

0:02:00that

0:02:00alright are you giggling already baby

0:02:05because I know what I'm talking

0:02:07we will never discuss this but I know

0:02:08you well enough to think you must have

0:02:10used on this and I think that will

0:02:11entertain me

0:02:12I don't have use okay sort of do it cozy

0:02:17day because this kind of crap I hate

0:02:20when businesses do when it's like oh

0:02:23we're a family and you're a guest in our

0:02:26company here coming to visit us and the

0:02:30like false familiarity and the false

0:02:34chumminess it really rubs me the wrong

0:02:36way yeah except somehow somehow the

0:02:40magic Disney Tinkerbell pixie dust has

0:02:44gotten into my brain and I feel like I'm

0:02:47perfectly okay with the Disney staff

0:02:48being called cast members I'm perfectly

0:02:50happy with probably in Disney corporate

0:02:52lingo than referring to the guests like

0:02:56as guests right as opposed to customers

0:02:59right so I feel like I'm perfectly fine

0:03:01with this with Disney I'm not sure there

0:03:03are very many other companies in the

0:03:05whole world I would be okay with this

0:03:07but I'm gonna give it a thumbs up I'm

0:03:09perfectly fine with it all right

0:03:10disappointed Brady do you think I'd be

0:03:12angrier I did actually I'm a bit

0:03:14disappointed I didn't think you'd give

0:03:15Disney such a pass I didn't think he'd

0:03:17be so suckered by the corporate behemoth

0:03:20that is Disney into thinking it's like

0:03:21Tinkerbell and stuff

0:03:23isn't that what Disney is aren't they

0:03:25small and vulnerable and charming like

0:03:28Tinkerbell and you just have to believe

0:03:30in them otherwise they'll go away and

0:03:32not one of the world's largest companies

0:03:34yeah that's why I think it's funny like

0:03:36it totally shouldn't work on me but for

0:03:38some reason it just does tell me why

0:03:40that term though why cast members why

0:03:43would that have been chosen as the way

0:03:45to describe staff of the theme park I

0:03:48just realized is this supposed to refer

0:03:49to staff in addition to the people in

0:03:53the costumes like does cast members

0:03:55refer to everybody no I think Pete like

0:03:58the person assuring you onto the roller

0:04:00coaster is a cast member okay but what

0:04:03what about the guy doing paperwork in an

0:04:06office on the park now I don't know now

0:04:09you've got me wondering is that guy a

0:04:10cast member but see the thing is I feel

0:04:13like I could actually make an argument

0:04:14for him being a cast member because if

0:04:16you're putting on a big show and it

0:04:18feels like a Disney park is kind of like

0:04:20a big show even though it's really a

0:04:22machine lets you feed the mouse it's

0:04:24kind of like a big show

0:04:26so like on a Broadway show are members

0:04:29of the crew are they called cast members

0:04:31- I don't know if they are not I don't

0:04:33know I imagined all the public facing

0:04:35people were cast members not just the

0:04:37person that dressed as Mickey I will

0:04:39give Disney a pass for every person that

0:04:41a guest would see in the park I think

0:04:45that's okay to call them cast members

0:04:46even if you're the person like saying

0:04:49okay you go and sit in that seat on the

0:04:50roller coaster yes I think I'm gonna

0:04:52give Disney a pass on that one but only

0:04:53Disney okay don't even think about it

0:04:55Six Flags you're not getting a pass on

0:04:57this one for me all right I'm only gonna

0:04:59give it to Disney I think that's the way

0:05:00this works

0:05:01Amaya hello Internet cast member yes I

0:05:04think you are Brady I am however I think

0:05:06our corporate policy should not be to

0:05:08use these terms like I think you are we

0:05:11were better described as a co-host of

0:05:14the show don't you think that's a more

0:05:15accurate way to describe it do you think

0:05:17describing me as a co-host rightly or

0:05:20wrongly is belittling like because if

0:05:23someone said they were the co-pilot that

0:05:26doesn't sound as awesome as saying like

0:05:27you're the captain or you're the pilot

0:05:29the other copilot makes it sound like

0:05:30you're the junior guy in the right seat

0:05:32who occasionally gets to land if there's

0:05:34no wind and stuff now I know you don't

0:05:36describe yourself differently you also

0:05:37call yourself a co-host but do you think

0:05:39is the term co-host sounds like you're

0:05:42the vice president because I say

0:05:44sometimes I'm the co-host of a podcast

0:05:47called hello Internet does that make me

0:05:48sound less than if I said I was a host I

0:05:51think what you've done here is that

0:05:52you've done like an anchoring effect

0:05:53that by mentioning pilots which is one

0:05:57of the cases where the copilot does mean

0:06:00something else

0:06:00mm I can't wait to hear from all the

0:06:02pilots co-pilots they should be called

0:06:04sub pilots it's not the co-pilot

0:06:06because the captain is right that's the

0:06:10way that works well I don't want to be

0:06:11called the sub host of hello intimate I

0:06:13wouldn't mind being called the vice host

0:06:15no but that's worse I know it's worse

0:06:17but I just think it sounds funny no

0:06:19that's way worse you can't be the vice

0:06:20host of the show that makes no sense at

0:06:22all that's what makes if you ever

0:06:23incapacitated I would be the host no 3d

0:06:27it's not how this works these titles

0:06:29work so I think you have anchored it in

0:06:32bringing up maybe the one or very few

0:06:35places where Co actually means sub

0:06:38that's fair enough I said I see you

0:06:40you're saying and I agree with what

0:06:41you're saying but I still think Co does

0:06:44have a slight belittling effect because

0:06:47it says you don't do it on your own like

0:06:50if you were the co first person to step

0:06:52on top of Mount Everest as opposed to

0:06:54being the first person it's not as

0:06:55awesome you've kind of lost a bit of

0:06:57your glory because it's not all yours I

0:06:59will totally grant that if Hillary and

0:07:02Eva wrists held hands and stepped tents

0:07:04on the mountain or Tenzing at the same

0:07:06time

0:07:07Tenzing siffredi right it would be

0:07:10amazing if the first person on top of

0:07:12Mount Everest also happened to be caught

0:07:13Everest yeah like George Everest or

0:07:16whatever that's right that's how it's

0:07:18named after but he never climbed it well

0:07:20I'm spinning a tale of magic here that

0:07:23if Hillary and Eva is a held hands and

0:07:26stepped on top at the same time yeah or

0:07:28if Armstrong and come on Zizi

0:07:34I'm strong and Buzz Aldrin Aldrin oh

0:07:40thank you thank you like okay I should

0:07:43have got that one I should have gotten

0:07:44that if they held hands and jumped onto

0:07:47the moon at the same time yeah like I

0:07:49would be going back through the footage

0:07:50and going frame by frame like whose foot

0:07:52landed first right like I'm gonna

0:07:54disallow this notion that your co first

0:07:58men on the moon you're the co first

0:07:59climbers of the mountain that's not how

0:08:02this works this is a debate that centers

0:08:04around the climbing of men Everest it

0:08:06was always an often discussed topic as

0:08:09to who actually led the way and stepped

0:08:12on the summit of Mount Everest first out

0:08:14of Hillary and Tenzing it was like a

0:08:15huge debate and they never wanted to

0:08:18answer the question and talk about it

0:08:19because for all the sort of people of

0:08:22Nepal they like to think it was Tenzing

0:08:24and for people through the Commonwealth

0:08:25I think they liked to think it was

0:08:27Hillary and it wasn't until one of

0:08:28Hillary's late autobiographies came out

0:08:30that he actually put in writing that he

0:08:33was actually in front and got to the top

0:08:35first according to him

0:08:37tensing's dead so he couldn't argue with

0:08:38it but Hillary's dead too now by the way

0:08:40but okay yeah time to wait right yeah

0:08:44yeah we all know was a Sherpa right

0:08:46that's the first person on the top of

0:08:47the mountain let's the era clearly gonna

0:08:49be the case that's not what Hillary said

0:08:51in his book but anyway

0:08:52I don't even know how we got onto this

0:08:54topic we were talking about Disney cast

0:08:55members the way we got onto this topic

0:08:57is as always the Brady wandering through

0:09:00the valley of misplaced metaphors and

0:09:02analogies yeah and I think yes you are

0:09:05correct that being the co person to

0:09:08discover a thing or get to a place is a

0:09:10ridiculous notion yeah I don't think Co

0:09:13in the in the world of podcasts has any

0:09:17kind of sub meaning yeah because I think

0:09:19the most directly comparable thing is

0:09:22like companies where people Co found a

0:09:26company because you're not getting to a

0:09:29place you're making a thing together but

0:09:31even then and as I said it's still

0:09:33awesome to found a company but isn't it

0:09:35more awesome to be the only founder

0:09:37rather than a co-founder like saying I'm

0:09:39the co-founder of something means mmm I

0:09:42wonder who like had more of the ideas

0:09:45and who was cleverer and who's richer

0:09:47and like it just shows those seeds there

0:09:50CONUS it's like hmm you say you're the

0:09:53co-discoverer of that comic but does

0:09:54that mean the other guy actually saw it

0:09:56first and this is just a technical

0:09:58reason we have to call you the

0:09:59co-discoverer you know what's really

0:10:00funny about this Brady I think there is

0:10:02something I have recently really gotten

0:10:04an understanding of with you that I

0:10:05haven't had over these lo these many

0:10:07years hmm which is your competitiveness

0:10:11you've mentioned to me about your

0:10:13competitiveness and you we've talked

0:10:15about it on the show sometimes like at

0:10:17you're competitive person but I feel

0:10:18like I have only recently actually

0:10:20understood this on a more deep level and

0:10:22somehow this conversation about the

0:10:24nature of co versus solo yeah I feel

0:10:28like I get this deep down this is a

0:10:30question of competitiveness and Brady

0:10:33there cannot be ties right someone must

0:10:36win and isn't it better to win than to

0:10:39tie I think that's what's going on here

0:10:41Brady I think that's my interpretation

0:10:42of what's going on in your Brady mind I

0:10:44don't think that's true like in the case

0:10:46of hello Internet I mean hello internet

0:10:47was your idea you came up with a you did

0:10:50all the work at start so like I would

0:10:52consider if we had to say who is the

0:10:54junior person of course it would be me

0:10:57like I wouldn't doubt it for a second so

0:10:58it's not like I'm thinking ah why am i

0:11:00Co it's not fair like I have no problem

0:11:03with that it just gets me thinking about

0:11:04the word Co I think we are we are

0:11:07because Brady no we're doing here yeah

0:11:10we're building a beautiful thing

0:11:11together in the last episode you

0:11:16mentioned that you had a new wedding

0:11:18ring that your wife got for you because

0:11:19your previously chubby fingers have been

0:11:22replaced with new alive 55,000 that's

0:11:27exactly the way I phrased it yeah yes my

0:11:29chubby chubby hands so as someone who

0:11:32doesn't like to hoard objects I didn't

0:11:35get the chance to ask because the topic

0:11:37sort of moved on what have you done with

0:11:39your old wedding ring the original uh I

0:11:42don't know where it is all I know is

0:11:46that it is somewhere under the aegis of

0:11:49my wife's protection I can she has it

0:11:51somewhere it still exists it's in the

0:11:54house someplace it hasn't been thrown

0:11:57into Mount Doom or anything like that no

0:12:00it hasn't been thrown into Mount Doom I

0:12:02don't think I could throw it into Mount

0:12:04Doom I would I would stand upon the

0:12:05precipice and resist wear that the case

0:12:07speaking of dropping things into Mount

0:12:09Doom you know I left my Segway so I'm

0:12:12just gonna go with that you know how I

0:12:15talk about how I'm invincible when it

0:12:17comes to dropping phones and I can drop

0:12:18I literally have dropped my phone off a

0:12:20cliff and it didn't break mm-hmm I was

0:12:23listening to the last podcast of ours

0:12:25because I like to check to see what made

0:12:27it into the final episode about me

0:12:30saying how invincible I was dropping my

0:12:32phone when I bumped into a lady I knew

0:12:35at the park walking dogs so I stopped

0:12:37the podcast and was started talking to

0:12:39her and while I was fiddling with my

0:12:40headphones and trying to put my phone

0:12:42away I dropped my phone onto the

0:12:44Ashville path we were standing on and it

0:12:47landed facedown and went bang and the

0:12:50woman oh my goodness oh no and I said to

0:12:52her before I even pick up my phone I

0:12:54said don't worry there's no chance it's

0:12:55broken I leaned over turned around the

0:12:58face pristine absolutely pristine she

0:13:01was like oh my goodness how did you know

0:13:03it wasn't broken

0:13:04i lo my phone never breaks no case or

0:13:08anything bang I think with that story

0:13:10all of the credit goes to your

0:13:13superpowers hmm and none of it goes to

0:13:16the hundreds of materials engineers

0:13:18who've been working on the magic

0:13:21quote glass that isn't glass at all

0:13:23that's on the front of those screens but

0:13:24my wife sneezes on her iPhone and it

0:13:27shatters into a thousand pieces that

0:13:28sounds a little bit overblown that's a

0:13:30description what skirt sounded good they

0:13:34did it it does sound good

0:13:36it would make a fantastic Android

0:13:38commercial like they hire here wife she

0:13:39sneezes on the phone into a thousand

0:13:43pieces

0:13:43hey what they've since then and since I

0:13:46last saw you which wasn't long ago I've

0:13:47changed my iphone Oh help me Brady you

0:13:51were using the iPhone se mm-hm and you

0:13:55have you've changed now I'm trying at

0:13:58the moment the the newest one plus

0:14:01you're trying the plus I am I'm trying

0:14:04it I can't remember now cuz I feel like

0:14:06we've switched phones a bunch of times

0:14:08and though in the course of the podcast

0:14:10have you ever used a plus phone before

0:14:11no it's my first plus okay what do you

0:14:14think of the plus pros and cons okay

0:14:16pros and cons it's a hell of a thing to

0:14:18go to after the SE it is an occasionally

0:14:21I go back to my se for certain things

0:14:22still and it does feel very small now

0:14:24mm-hmm

0:14:24of course but I'm undecided I'm gonna

0:14:27stick with it for a while because it's

0:14:29really expensive and I paid a lot of

0:14:31money for us I'm gonna use it for a

0:14:32while yeah this is that cheap no say I'm

0:14:35kind of stuck with it now but it's good

0:14:38for some things the main reason I got it

0:14:41was because I found myself watching so

0:14:42much a video on my phone that I wanted a

0:14:45bigger screen for video watching like

0:14:47whether it's just watching sports

0:14:48highlights or graphs of videos that

0:14:51people are editing with me

0:14:52professionally and stuff and for that

0:14:53I'm liking it it's nice to quickly you

0:14:55know watch the goals that have been

0:14:56scored in the football that day on on

0:14:58the biggest ground but the reaching

0:15:00around and navigating the screen with my

0:15:02mortal human fingers which I don't think

0:15:05I have overly small hands but there

0:15:07certainly no match for the plus screen

0:15:10nobody has hands that are a match

0:15:11smartphone it's awesome no man can do it

0:15:14only Giants I like using my phone while

0:15:17I'm walking like you know walking down

0:15:19the street and you don't want to use two

0:15:20hands when you're doing that so I'm a

0:15:22big one-handed phone user I find it very

0:15:25hard to switch to two hand phone use I

0:15:27just don't think it's a fit for me and I

0:15:29don't think the plus is suited to

0:15:32one-handed phone users so unless I get

0:15:34down with the kids and start becoming a

0:15:36two-handed phone user I'm gonna continue

0:15:39to be frustrated by is that what the

0:15:41kids do Brady the kids are the

0:15:42two-handed phone users a parent that's

0:15:44what someone told me apparently that's a

0:15:46young person's game it's two-handed

0:15:48phone use well I do have a little bit of

0:15:50good news for you because I am running

0:15:53the beta version of the next operating

0:15:55system on my phone currently on my plus

0:15:58size phone hmm and I've sent you a

0:16:00picture that they have finally conceded

0:16:02and acknowledged that this phone is too

0:16:05big for people's hands and there is a

0:16:08scrunched over to the left keyboard in

0:16:10the iPhone plus that makes one-handed

0:16:13texting easier to do see the one thing I

0:16:16do want is a big keyboard because I was

0:16:18having problems I'm a small phone of

0:16:20miss typing all the time I felt like I

0:16:22was making more typos so one of my

0:16:23keyboard buttons further apart that's

0:16:25the one thing I don't want okay then I

0:16:29have no good news for you Brady I'm

0:16:30sorry I thought you were going to be

0:16:31happy the top of the phone is just like

0:16:34a wasteland mm-hmm that I can't get to

0:16:36right I'm using the plus you know I

0:16:39haven't been happy with any of the

0:16:40phones really for like what four years

0:16:42now with this rounded design that I've

0:16:46just been very sad and frustrated with

0:16:48it is also frustrating that app

0:16:50designers and everybody keeps putting

0:16:52stuff at the top of the phone it's like

0:16:53hey yeah that might as well be a hundred

0:16:56miles away yeah I can't reach that why

0:16:58don't you put all the controls at the

0:16:59bottom of the phone the bottom of the

0:17:00phone is where the action is yeah I need

0:17:03to do a big icon rearrange I know

0:17:04there's all these little trick things

0:17:05but I need to start putting my go-to

0:17:07apps like my Twitter and stuff like that

0:17:09down low where my thumb can get to yeah

0:17:12if you switch to the big phone you have

0:17:14to reverse everything everything that's

0:17:15a frequent use that's got to go at the

0:17:17bottom yeah like my iMessages maps like

0:17:20calendar all of that stuff have got to

0:17:22be at the bottom of the phone I need to

0:17:23do that and then I'll relearn it in a

0:17:25day or two so it is very hard to get rid

0:17:27of that muscle memory though yeah I

0:17:28almost hate to bring this up Brady but

0:17:30you do know the time that we're

0:17:32recording this is this is like right

0:17:34before new iPhone season are you aware

0:17:36of this

0:17:37I do but whatever he just couldn't wait

0:17:40anymore I don't think I'm gonna like the

0:17:42new ones as much like I'm liking them

0:17:44less as they go

0:17:46so I'm figuring they're gonna do

0:17:47something else I don't like on the next

0:17:49one you know they'll remove whatever

0:17:51ports are left I would say no we don't

0:17:54think screens are the way of the future

0:17:56everything's just gonna be smelled now

0:17:59like I don't know you never know what

0:18:01they're gonna do so get in before they

0:18:02ruin it more ill if the rumors are did

0:18:04we believe they're taking away the home

0:18:05button on the next phone yeah

0:18:07we'll see but uh I wish you were happier

0:18:10with your phone I wish I was happier

0:18:11with my phone but it is a hell of a

0:18:13transition going from the little one to

0:18:14the big one

0:18:15you've got to reverse absolutely

0:18:16everything I'm sorry that the smouched

0:18:18over keyboard is of no assistance to you

0:18:20hmm

0:18:21iPhones they've been frustrating for the

0:18:23last four years yeah hopefully less

0:18:26frustrating soon but I'm not necessarily

0:18:29holding my breath on that one

0:18:30you remind me of like those football

0:18:32fans whose team loses every season and

0:18:34at the start of every season they're

0:18:36like this is the one this is the year

0:18:37we're gonna get it together and go all

0:18:39the way and then yet again disappointed

0:18:42I am simply saying I am hopeful about

0:18:45the next phone I'm not expecting to be

0:18:48happy okay we'll see in a in a couple

0:18:50short months but big phones too big

0:18:53little phones too outdated middle phone

0:18:56both too big and too small that's the

0:18:59situation oh and they're all made of

0:19:01soap I've actually put a case on this

0:19:03one believe it or not why have you put a

0:19:04case on these phones Brady you don't

0:19:06have to worry about dropping them at all

0:19:07you have some kind of superpower you can

0:19:09confidently tell ladies in the street

0:19:10don't worry my phone it's unbroken yeah

0:19:13but the problem is the longer that goes

0:19:15the more disappointed I'll be when I

0:19:18finally break one so now I'm taking

0:19:20steps to minimize breakage so I can keep

0:19:23your streak yeah and like not only is

0:19:25this one soapy but because I can't hold

0:19:27it the way I like with my safe one hand

0:19:30one finger underneath back up mm-hmm I

0:19:32just know that more drops are imminent

0:19:34so need a bit of friction

0:19:36I'm not worried Brady I have confidence

0:19:38in you from now until the end of time no

0:19:42broken phones

0:19:42that's the Brady promise this episode of

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0:21:55so Brady last time you mentioned that

0:21:59you'd seen the Tim's come up with a

0:22:01bunch of words to describe their actions

0:22:03yep there was Tim foolery yes there was

0:22:07Tim work there was Tim work that's right

0:22:10a bunch of these different words going

0:22:12around that the Tim's like I've seen

0:22:13really run with this with many different

0:22:15variations like a thousand let a

0:22:17thousand Tim prefixes bloom as far as

0:22:19words or concerns seems to be what the

0:22:21audience is done yeah and they've really

0:22:23build with that there was like an

0:22:25explosion of hello internet creativity

0:22:28on the subreddit recently and I just

0:22:31wanted to point out that related to all

0:22:32of this one of my favorite things that a

0:22:36user put together Monken tarus is a

0:22:40hello Internet

0:22:42pirate flag that I absolutely adore

0:22:45because I think it strikes an excellent

0:22:48balance of being adorable and

0:22:52intimidating I just thought yay what do

0:22:56you think of this pirate flag that the

0:22:59Tim's have made I do like it's sort of

0:23:01like a slightly comic Jolly Roger but

0:23:05with a few little hello Internet

0:23:06flourishes like the famous gray glasses

0:23:09my kind of side pattered hair and like a

0:23:13robotic arm and a nail instead of the

0:23:15two crossed bones it's worth a look I'm

0:23:17sure gray link to it in the show notes

0:23:18and I think you're right you sum it up

0:23:20right it's like it's the perfect mixture

0:23:22of cute yeah it has got a slight menace

0:23:25to it like any Jolly Roger does I've got

0:23:27to say I really like it it seems like a

0:23:29great little logo for Tim mischief that

0:23:32occurs it's really greatly put together

0:23:33this is one of the reasons why I do love

0:23:35having the hello Internet subreddit

0:23:38where people just post whatever they're

0:23:39working on and I really wanted to draw

0:23:41attention to this one because I think

0:23:42this is one of my favorite things to

0:23:44come out of the show artwork in quite a

0:23:47while I really like this flag it's

0:23:48adorable and thank you for making it and

0:23:51I hope you guys have fun with it it's

0:23:52hilarious it was made in the context of

0:23:54the recent voting hijinks which we might

0:23:56come to later in the show and for that

0:23:58reason I like it because I I think it

0:24:00was sort of made in the context of when

0:24:02you see this flying like when you see

0:24:03this coming over the horizon you know

0:24:05something is gonna happen that's not

0:24:08necessarily good if you don't like

0:24:10mischief so I do I do like it as a kind

0:24:14of a warning sign like I can just see

0:24:16it's striking fear into the heart of

0:24:18Wikipedia editors everywhere yeah

0:24:20there's an armada of Tim's approaching

0:24:22that's what it is

0:24:22[Laughter]

0:24:25quick serious one because I know that

0:24:28you have been giving me a hard time

0:24:30about basically how I'd neglected to CGP

0:24:34grey the penguin

0:24:35oh yes forgot about her basically until

0:24:38we found out about her demise so I was

0:24:42trying to make this tragic I was trying

0:24:43to make amends for this and I contacted

0:24:45the zoo and I said I want to know how

0:24:48she died

0:24:48like I want details obviously we know

0:24:52she died on this trip there this foreign

0:24:54trip she was going on to go to another

0:24:55zoo mm-hmm yeah we were awaiting that

0:24:57penguin autopsy whirring yeah so I was

0:24:59kind of I was tenacious I was you know I

0:25:02was reminding them I wasn't gonna let

0:25:04this one slip through the cracks I said

0:25:07I insisted on you know and I said okay

0:25:08we'll have someone from like the penguin

0:25:10office call you when we know all the

0:25:11details so I finally got the coal but

0:25:16the coal came like while I was on

0:25:17holiday and having a nice time and I was

0:25:19just about to go down to the pool and

0:25:21like my phone rings and I'm like this is

0:25:23I think this was when I was in Greece

0:25:24and my phone rings and I'm like duh

0:25:25what's this it's a Bristol number I was

0:25:27like ah you interrupting my holiday and

0:25:29then it was the lady sang out so-and-so

0:25:31from Bristol Zoo I'm calling with the

0:25:33details of the penguin death it wasn't

0:25:36the right time for it so I ended up

0:25:38being one of those phone calls I was

0:25:39like yep yep yep fine appreciate that

0:25:41thank you and now I feel like I can't

0:25:44contact them again asking for loads more

0:25:45detail because they code me like the

0:25:47person called me to give me all the

0:25:48details so I feel like I failed again

0:25:52basically I like this because it feels

0:25:53like what you're basically saying is I

0:25:55didn't want this penguin death for which

0:25:57I am responsible to be a downer on my

0:25:59vacation that's the story that you're

0:26:01telling me well it sounds like you're

0:26:04the one putting words in people's mouths

0:26:06- I would never do such a thing that's

0:26:07that's what I did glean because there

0:26:09was talk that maybe

0:26:10CGP grey the lady penguin had died from

0:26:13maybe like some kind of disease or virus

0:26:15that exacerbated when the plane travel

0:26:18happened but I was told that's not the

0:26:20case the penguin just died from like the

0:26:24stress of the plane travel there were

0:26:26lots of penguins that did it two or

0:26:28three died from memory oh he's bad but

0:26:31it sounds like it was just like CGP Grey

0:26:34Lady ping which wasn't made of a stern

0:26:36stuff as some

0:26:37the other ones the zoo lady also did

0:26:39tell me like you know they're taking

0:26:41lessons from this and other measures are

0:26:43going to be implemented to make sure

0:26:45nothing like this can happen again

0:26:48so CTP gray the lady penguin did not die

0:26:50in vain it sounds a little bit like

0:26:51you're saying that she wasn't hard as

0:26:53nails like if she was made of sterner

0:26:55stuff she would have survived the

0:26:56journey is that what you're saying there

0:26:57Brady I'm not gonna sit here on a

0:26:59podcast and start bad-mouthing a dead

0:27:01penguin I would never try to get you to

0:27:09do that that would be ridiculous I'm not

0:27:11gonna do that

0:27:11penguin and I still feel a bit sad when

0:27:14I think about it but I always had a

0:27:18feeling that it was like a softer

0:27:20penguin compared to the other ones which

0:27:21it's you but maybe that's because I felt

0:27:23protective of it but like if you were

0:27:25gonna ship 20 penguins to another

0:27:28country I felt like

0:27:30CGP Grey Lady penguin might be the one

0:27:32that would have struggled and it turns

0:27:34out that was true well I mean this is

0:27:36the thing with most animals pets in

0:27:40particular we love them but they're all

0:27:43just tragedies waiting to happen a

0:27:45moment of silence for cgp grey the lady

0:27:47penguin alright let's talk a bit about

0:27:58shops been going to the shops lately so

0:28:03I go to Tesco - supermarket quite a lot

0:28:04these days like I go almost every day

0:28:07now is like a quick shop rather than

0:28:09doing like a one big shop I like just

0:28:10going every day and buying two or three

0:28:11things and we have talked about self

0:28:15checkout before you like it and I don't

0:28:17right I have now decided self checkout

0:28:21at the shops I go - he's a mug's game I

0:28:25see them queuing to use it looking for

0:28:29the barcodes on their things and not

0:28:31being able to find that they all look

0:28:33miserable

0:28:33it takes them ages and meanwhile where I

0:28:37go there are like 20 checkouts that are

0:28:40staffed usually there's no queue at all

0:28:42you'll walk right up to it you don't

0:28:44have to have a conversation if you're a

0:28:45bit introverted you can just say hello

0:28:47they scan your stuff they're so good at

0:28:49it because they know

0:28:50all the barcodes are because they've

0:28:51seen everything before they do it for a

0:28:53job they're way better at putting things

0:28:54in bags than I am everything so fast and

0:28:58now with like contactless payment like

0:29:00the interactions even less most of the

0:29:03time I think self checkout is bit of a

0:29:05mug's game I keep having the feeling

0:29:08that this is like a suburban versus

0:29:10urban divide because you're a

0:29:13description of this I find baffling and

0:29:16doesn't match my experience now personal

0:29:18preferences about which till to go aside

0:29:21like when I think of all the

0:29:22supermarket's I go to even the big

0:29:24supermarkets around me that I think

0:29:26might be more on the scale of what you

0:29:28would find in a suburban environment

0:29:30yeah they're always the case that it

0:29:32looks like the lines with the actual

0:29:33checkout people have long lines and

0:29:37people with shopping carts filled with

0:29:39three four five hundred items in them

0:29:42that to me looks like boy I feel sorry

0:29:45for you if you have to use the human

0:29:47line because this this is the line for I

0:29:49have a thousand things that need to be

0:29:51checked out yeah whereas the self

0:29:52checkout lines they're fast they're

0:29:55faster they're smaller like they're

0:29:57there's a bazillion machines in the same

0:29:59amount of space that you could put like

0:30:01a few checkout people so I feel like I

0:30:03almost want to go with you on one of

0:30:05your holiday excursions to pick up two

0:30:07items at the supermarket okay and see

0:30:10like what's the situation that Brady's

0:30:11working with you see how the other half

0:30:12lives

0:30:13will arrange that I know that we must be

0:30:15having different experiences how does

0:30:17this country mouse go shopping that's

0:30:19what I'm trying to find out here it

0:30:21doesn't make any sense to me your

0:30:22description of what's occurring but I

0:30:23have to say while I am traditionally the

0:30:25advocate of the old-fashioned way of

0:30:27doing things and you are more the modern

0:30:29man my goodness

0:30:31contactless payment with cards what a

0:30:34life-changing thing that is how quickly

0:30:36I've become used to her how much I

0:30:39resent having to even put my pin number

0:30:41in when I'm buying things it is such a

0:30:43wonderful innovation it's a much bigger

0:30:46step up from going from money to pin

0:30:48cards which is I don't think much of as

0:30:50a step but there's a step up from

0:30:53putting your PIN into contactless is

0:30:55fabulous and places that don't take

0:30:57contactless I think a barbaric and they

0:31:01have to lift the limits on these things

0:31:02like you know if

0:31:04I spend 40 or 50 pounds on something

0:31:06that's like I know you can't use

0:31:07contactless I'm like what what are you

0:31:09doing

0:31:10since sane I need to use my contactless

0:31:12I don't want to touch things I don't

0:31:14want to press buttons I just want to do

0:31:17the thing I think it's fabulous

0:31:19literally just before this show was

0:31:21starting I was running an errand to pick

0:31:22up a few things from the local

0:31:24supermarket for the house and the total

0:31:27bill went over 30 pounds which at this

0:31:30store is the limit for using contact

0:31:32lists yeah and it was something like 33

0:31:36pounds or like just barely over and I

0:31:39caught myself

0:31:40unfortunately there's no self checkout

0:31:42at this thing I have to actually use a

0:31:44person but I caught myself looking at

0:31:46the guy and almost saying just wring it

0:31:49as two separate things so I can tap

0:31:52twice like because it's also about like

0:31:55I don't want to touch your buttons that

0:31:58have been touched by a thousand people

0:32:00and the contact list is so pleasing like

0:32:03you just Boop Bucky it just goes like I

0:32:05use it on my phone or my watch all the

0:32:06time it's the greatest thing in the

0:32:08whole world I'm with you 100%

0:32:10I absolutely love the contactless but

0:32:12this is a case where I feel like I have

0:32:14become so spoiled by it as well and I

0:32:18did not realize until I had spent all of

0:32:22this time in America this past summer

0:32:23because in my world in all of the places

0:32:27that I go I'm essentially 99.9% of the

0:32:30time using contactless payment because

0:32:33everything is under 30 or 40 pounds and

0:32:35every single store that I go to takes it

0:32:38and I can just use my watch or my phone

0:32:41everywhere like I'm so ridiculously

0:32:43spoiled and then going to America it

0:32:46feels like stepping back in time a

0:32:48hundred years when they ask you for your

0:32:50signature on the card to do payments it

0:32:52feels like why don't you bring out that

0:32:54machine from my childhood where you like

0:32:56put the credit card in the thing and

0:32:58then you go over it and then I get like

0:33:02a piece of yellow paper and you take two

0:33:04pieces I don't even know what the hell

0:33:05that machine is like what is this thing

0:33:07even doing I don't understand how any

0:33:10payment is getting processed by this

0:33:12analogue thing yeah I never understood

0:33:14that and you need that there rosetta

0:33:16stone to read what's on the

0:33:18bit of paper because it's so hard to

0:33:19decipher I mean I guess thinking it

0:33:21through that machine must be a

0:33:23mechanical version of an IOU like is

0:33:26that what those things were obviously

0:33:27being sent off to like some head office

0:33:29somewhere

0:33:29how could anyone read those curb and

0:33:31helping paper things they were awful

0:33:33it's ridiculous but that but that's what

0:33:34it felt like in America where I'm using

0:33:36my card and they're like oh you have to

0:33:38sign for this thing and I'm like

0:33:39surprised and angry every single time

0:33:42that I have I have to sign and the

0:33:44signing is is also like it's just such a

0:33:46ridiculous farce like you're not

0:33:48checking my signature yeah right I had a

0:33:50credit card that like four years went

0:33:53unsigned before anybody ever commented

0:33:56on it right like some picky rules

0:33:58following person's like well you have to

0:34:00sign the card but no the stuff just

0:34:01feels it feels so arcane and so

0:34:02ridiculous and I felt so happy coming

0:34:06back to London and like we had

0:34:09contactless payments everywhere

0:34:10beep-beep-beep like it just works and

0:34:13there's a thing in America that I don't

0:34:15I had heard people describe but I sort

0:34:19of didn't believe it because obviously I

0:34:21know Americans I listen to podcasts that

0:34:24have Americans on them and people

0:34:25complain about these credit card

0:34:28machines that are being rolled out in

0:34:29America and I heard people complain

0:34:32about them and I just like what is the

0:34:33problem with this but there are these

0:34:35like weird clunky gigantic credit card

0:34:39machines that I guess are supposed to be

0:34:41the American version of the little

0:34:43wireless terminals that everybody in

0:34:45Europe uses except there they're like

0:34:48twice as big and huge and confusing and

0:34:51what is baffling to me is that when you

0:34:54make a successful payment they make a

0:34:56noise like and they have like an angry

0:34:59beeping noise which is confirmation that

0:35:03everything went okay right it's like

0:35:05everything's great alarm like it

0:35:06confused me every single time I used it

0:35:08and I was in a bunch of different places

0:35:10in America and I came across them

0:35:12and a whole bunch of different states I

0:35:14was like oh ma why are you so behind the

0:35:17times with payments like why are you so

0:35:19bad at this there's a solution for

0:35:22contactless new payments these little

0:35:25machines that we use over here like why

0:35:26don't we use these in America I don't

0:35:27understand I don't understand it all it

0:35:29was infuriating

0:35:31okay people here we go I'm gonna ask you

0:35:33some questions and just answer yes or no

0:35:35in your head no out loud because you

0:35:38might get some funny looks

0:35:39do you ever travel in planes trains or

0:35:42automobiles do you ever walk places do

0:35:46you ever just lay in bed at night do you

0:35:49listen to podcasts now if you answered

0:35:52yes to any one of those questions that I

0:35:55think you might like audiobooks and if

0:35:57you're like audiobooks today's sponsor

0:36:00audible.com is where it's at now audible

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0:36:31trial at audible.com slash hallo

0:36:35internet a free audiobook shall I

0:36:38recommend one I think I shall today it's

0:36:40going to be Conclave by Robert Harris

0:36:43this is a fictional account of the vote

0:36:46for a new pope and for anyone fascinated

0:36:48by what happens in the Sistine Chapel

0:36:50when the Vatican when a new Pope's being

0:36:52elected this is a great book for you

0:36:54plenty of politics intrigue mystery but

0:36:57also a really easy listen it really rips

0:37:00along I got through this one pretty

0:37:01quickly desperate to know what had

0:37:03happened next so that's my

0:37:04recommendation Conclave but there are

0:37:07countless others you may prefer as your

0:37:09free audiobook with that 30-day trial I

0:37:12know that Tim's on reddit even keep a

0:37:13list of previous recommendations from

0:37:15the show both from gray and myself so

0:37:17maybe check that out that address for

0:37:19the free book audible.com slash hallo

0:37:24internet and hallo internet is all one

0:37:26word they'll also be a link in the show

0:37:28description they help us make Hello

0:37:30Internet as sponsors but we're also just

0:37:32everyday customers and we really like

0:37:34them you know that bench

0:37:36I sit on sometimes where I have lunch

0:37:38where I was sitting a few months ago

0:37:39when I saw like someone crash into

0:37:42another car and try to sneak away and I

0:37:44like

0:37:44we've had this quandary about what do i

0:37:46do do i dub them in do i leave a note

0:37:48that sort of stuff you're wondering how

0:37:50much of a Samaritan do you have to be

0:37:52mmm is there a Good Samaritan law that

0:37:54you need to worry about in this area

0:37:56what is the right thing I was sitting on

0:37:58that same bench yesterday just minding

0:38:01my own business swinging your feet back

0:38:03and forth eating a sandwich that's how I

0:38:05imagined it in fact that is what I was

0:38:07doing

0:38:08and something caught my eye on the

0:38:12ground a little flash of red and silver

0:38:14glint ooh and it was a dropped these

0:38:18occurred like a Visa debit card with

0:38:20contactless payment and everything like

0:38:22that and I had the person's name on it

0:38:23it was brand-new in pristine condition

0:38:25like it looked brand-new and the expiry

0:38:28date was like matched the month we're in

0:38:30so it made me think maybe it was a brand

0:38:32new card so I picked it up and I sort of

0:38:35looked around and there was no one

0:38:37around so I went bought another sandwich

0:38:40with that najin I looked around there

0:38:42was no one around and I was like what do

0:38:44I do like what are my responsibilities

0:38:46here what is the right thing to do with

0:38:49this card what would you have done

0:38:51hmm it's one of those things that you're

0:38:54not entirely educated about best

0:38:57practices I'm just pausing here because

0:38:59I feel like there is there's some

0:39:03version of an old school teacher in my

0:39:06head who is like well if you find a

0:39:08thing you should take it to a police

0:39:09station yeah I guess here's here's a

0:39:11complication which you didn't find is

0:39:14somebody's wallet no right just the card

0:39:17yeah if you find somebody's wallet it

0:39:19feels like okay I guess I'll take this

0:39:22to the authorities yeah and the police

0:39:25have a Lost & Found box in the station

0:39:28yeah or they get the new guy to try to

0:39:32track down the owner of a wallet in

0:39:34between solving homicides like I don't

0:39:37know what's gonna I mean to be honest if

0:39:38I found someone's wallet I feel like I

0:39:40would have enough information to

0:39:41probably find that person in 10-15

0:39:44minutes and get it back to them you know

0:39:46I could google them or if the address

0:39:48was nearby I could just walk to their

0:39:50house like that seems easier in many

0:39:53ways but yes if not I thought they would

0:39:54take him to a police station but all I

0:39:56had was a

0:39:57name my you know mr. Jones and a card if

0:40:01you have address information in the

0:40:03wallet and that also makes it much

0:40:04easier right that's that's a much

0:40:05clearer thing to do

0:40:06I don't think there's anything in my

0:40:07wallet that actually I list my address

0:40:09on it like if my wallet was lost someone

0:40:11we need to take it to a police station

0:40:12yeah you'd have a driver's license or

0:40:13anything yeah I don't have a driver's

0:40:14license so there's nothing in there with

0:40:16with my address on it as far as I know

0:40:17yeah but an individual card what we have

0:40:22here is something that's on the spectrum

0:40:23from how much burden do you feel versus

0:40:27personal inconvenience yeah right and a

0:40:30wallet feels like it's very far along

0:40:31that spectrum of it's horrific ly

0:40:35inconvenient for another person to lose

0:40:36the wallet so you feel like oh I'm doing

0:40:38a great thing by bringing the person the

0:40:40wall I'm saving them an enormous amount

0:40:42of here like if I happen to me I'd be

0:40:43begging for someone to find that rather

0:40:45than may have to deal with all of that

0:40:46bureaucracy right but a single car yeah

0:40:50a single card feels like it's sitting on

0:40:53that knife's edge of is the personal

0:40:56hassle to me worth this thing yeah or

0:40:58like will the police officer laugh me

0:41:00out of the station if I bring them a

0:41:02single crap like I think they would I

0:41:04think if I go in there officer McNulty

0:41:07is gonna be like get the hell out of

0:41:08here with this yeah with this credit

0:41:09cards like why are you wasting my time I

0:41:11just take it out of your hand and cut it

0:41:13in half with a pair of scissors and say

0:41:14thanks for coming that is exactly what I

0:41:15expect would happen talking this through

0:41:17I think that is what I would think is my

0:41:19level of responsibility I would cut it

0:41:21in half and leave it at that no further

0:41:24Good Samaritan action to be required

0:41:26than that okay the question is break

0:41:30what did I do

0:41:30what did you do I'm a bit reluctant to

0:41:32say in case I broke some law or someone

0:41:34says I shouldn't have done it well I

0:41:36mean we cannot we can just say that this

0:41:37is of course a fanciful story

0:41:39it was just being told on a podcast yes

0:41:41so there were one or two people in my

0:41:44vicinity so I did say to them did you

0:41:46just drop a card and if they'd said yes

0:41:48I would have then said what's your name

0:41:49and if they got the name right I would

0:41:51have handed to the car what are the last

0:41:53four did yeah but no one no one had I

0:41:56walked into like the sandwich shop where

0:41:58I had gotten my sandwich and I said has

0:42:00anyone come in here saying they'd lost a

0:42:03cut I don't know what I would have done

0:42:05if they said yes cuz I guess I would

0:42:08have said - have you got their details I

0:42:09wouldn't have given it to st. people at

0:42:10the shop

0:42:11but they said no and the girl behind the

0:42:13checkout said you should probably just

0:42:14cut it in half because they probably

0:42:15already canceled it there were two

0:42:18restaurants right near where it had

0:42:20dropped like a Italian restaurant and a

0:42:22Chinese restaurant and I did think about

0:42:23going in and asking if I should make

0:42:26some kind of public announcement because

0:42:28there's you know 50 or 60 people so it

0:42:30was a good chance that the person who

0:42:31dropped up was in the restaurant and

0:42:33needed it to like pay for their meal or

0:42:35something but I did feel like that was a

0:42:37high level of disruption for maybe not

0:42:42even success so I decided not to do that

0:42:44what I did was I then went back to the

0:42:46bench near where I found her

0:42:48and I sat there for another 15 20

0:42:49minutes just finishing my food and

0:42:51faffing around on my phone to see if I

0:42:54could see anyone walking around looking

0:42:55for a card and no one no one emerged who

0:42:58fit that description so then I went home

0:43:00and I cut it into lots of small pieces

0:43:02with scissors and threw it in the bin

0:43:04you didn't shred it Brede you have a

0:43:05shredder that can handle a credit card

0:43:07know that a shredder I famously bought

0:43:10right at the start of hello Internet

0:43:12hasn't worked for about two years and I

0:43:13haven't replaced it or fixed it it just

0:43:15sits under my desk dormant that's very

0:43:17sad a number of levels annoys me but I

0:43:19yeah anyway let's not go there anyway

0:43:23I'm much more interested in the shredder

0:43:24underneath your desk taking up your

0:43:26precious foot space that you haven't

0:43:28fixed after two years it is still there

0:43:32I do need to throw it away because I did

0:43:35like it when I was running I just got

0:43:36greedy and tried to put too many pieces

0:43:38of paper in it one day

0:43:39it jammed and like no matter what I

0:43:42tried to do I couldn't fix it no of

0:43:44course that's the call of the paper

0:43:45shredder yeah I want to push it to its

0:43:47breaking limit right you're never

0:43:48satisfied until you get too many pieces

0:43:51of paper five six six is for weaklings

0:43:56what about seven seven yeah that's for

0:43:58co-hosts why not oh yeah that's what

0:44:03existence is for shredders it's like

0:44:06some kind of hellish torment where no

0:44:08matter how much they can eat like you're

0:44:09constantly upping the spectrum of like

0:44:10oh but you're gonna eat more until it

0:44:12breaks I'm sorry that you broke your

0:44:14shredder Brady I'm sorry that you had to

0:44:16manually cut up this credit card by hand

0:44:19it's quite pleasant cutting credit cards

0:44:20with scissors because it's like a

0:44:21naughty thing like it's quite fun I like

0:44:24it I'm glad you got a naughty thrill out

0:44:27of cutting up that credit card into

0:44:28multiple pieces it must've been very

0:44:30exciting for you it's quite a

0:44:31pleasurable amount of resistance on the

0:44:34scissors when you cut credit card to

0:44:35like you don't normally get that level

0:44:37of resistance on a cut it's nice

0:44:40cutting a credit card is a nice with

0:44:41scissors is a pleasant feeling no people

0:44:43drop your credit cards around Brady so

0:44:47he can get the naughty satisfaction of

0:44:49cutting up other people's credit cards I

0:44:50will have cut it in half before it even

0:44:51hits the ground you'd be like wait wait

0:44:52that's mine

0:44:53I was bang you past the event horizon

0:44:55you're gonna be carrying scissors to

0:44:57that Park just just hoping just waiting

0:44:59who knows what moral conundrum will

0:45:02strike next on Brady's bench and you

0:45:05know how you get those park benches

0:45:06where it says you know Gladys and Ron

0:45:08used to sit here and watch the Sun set

0:45:10for 50 years maybe one day they'll put

0:45:12like a little metal plaque on the back

0:45:13of the bench saying this is where Brady

0:45:15saw two cars hit and where he found a

0:45:18credit card and like it could become

0:45:20famous I don't know if this is a

0:45:21national thing or if it's if it's just

0:45:23in London but do you have those blue

0:45:24badges that are the historical markers

0:45:27it's more of a London thing but other

0:45:29cities and parts of the UK do keep

0:45:31trying to co-opt it so you do see blue

0:45:33plaques around the place yeah there's

0:45:35historic markers yeah that is a thing

0:45:36that exists then where in your town

0:45:39you're walking around there's a blue

0:45:40plaque and it says Bobby Thorpe inton

0:45:44the third yep writer of something you've

0:45:47never heard of was born here yeah but

0:45:50they're not usually as official outside

0:45:51this is a how we could do a whole

0:45:53podcast about blue plaques but yeah

0:45:54there are a couple Whitney where I live

0:45:56but they're not like officially

0:45:58sanctioned ones well I guess where I was

0:46:00going with this is these blue historical

0:46:03plaques that I see all over the place in

0:46:06London you can hardly move in London for

0:46:08blue plaques

0:46:08it's like wading through treacle I do

0:46:10feel like hey guys maybe we should tone

0:46:12it down a little bit especially there's

0:46:14a couple that I love that aren't even

0:46:16like oh this famous person was born here

0:46:19there's a few that kind of make me laugh

0:46:20every time because it's like oh this

0:46:22person you never heard of lived in a

0:46:26house on this site yeah from 1832 to

0:46:311835 yeah what is this plaque it's like

0:46:35a Jane Austen stayed in a room in the

0:46:38house for three hours while she was

0:46:39smoking the second draft of Pride and

0:46:41Prejudice yeah that's what it feels like

0:46:43like the bar is just too low for some of

0:46:46these things like there's too many of

0:46:47them all over the place and I feel like

0:46:49the number of times I have any idea who

0:46:51the person they're referring to is is

0:46:53very small compared to the number of

0:46:54total plaques but I was just wondering

0:46:56cuz we touched on the idea of Fame last

0:46:59time now that you're talking about this

0:47:01bench then you clearly want to be made a

0:47:05historical object you think Brady that

0:47:10after you're dead this is seriously yeah

0:47:14you are

0:47:15famous enough to get a blue plaque on

0:47:18that bench that says this is Brady's

0:47:21bench

0:47:21Brady sat here eating lunch and thinking

0:47:24about moral conundrum sometimes great I

0:47:27can say without a shadow of a doubt that

0:47:29I'm not famous enough to get a blue

0:47:31plaque anywhere anything any time to do

0:47:34with anything I've ever done I totally

0:47:36disagree with that I think you should

0:47:38have a blue plaque you're way more

0:47:40famous than most of the blue plaques I

0:47:42see where it's like oh some nobody 200

0:47:45years ago no one's ever heard of gets a

0:47:47blue plaque gray I can promise you in

0:47:49two hundred years I'll be an even bigger

0:47:50nobody I don't know man people might be

0:47:53listening to the show in two hundred

0:47:54years

0:47:54well let's say let's say it's not over

0:47:57yet I could still make that late move

0:48:00into Test cricket and become the oldest

0:48:03player ever to score 100 for Australia

0:48:04yeah that's the thing that's gonna make

0:48:05you the famous person yeah that's what's

0:48:07gonna be it that's what I want to make

0:48:09me a famous person no I understand that

0:48:11Brady I understand that very clearly

0:48:13yeah apparently you don't want to be

0:48:15known as the mirror co-host a popular

0:48:18podcast you want to be a man who strikes

0:48:22out and does his own thing that's what

0:48:24you want to be remembered for not a

0:48:26co-host gray I want us to introduce the

0:48:29term vice host from my position no I am

0:48:31vetoing this is ridiculous title it

0:48:34makes no sense for podcast co-hosts this

0:48:37is gray the host of hello Internet and

0:48:38I'm his vice host it's ridiculous and I

0:48:44think it's self demeaning Brady I don't

0:48:46agree with this I'd be quite happy to be

0:48:48a vice host I think that's a really cool

0:48:50name

0:48:51like if it would be really a good

0:48:53talking point like how many podcasts do

0:48:55you know that have a vice host we might

0:48:57be the first and that would make us

0:49:00special it's like have you heard that

0:49:01podcast they've got a host and a vice

0:49:03host all right I'm gonna listen to that

0:49:05just to check that out and then they'll

0:49:06listen to me oh I thought this would be

0:49:08boring but actually it turns out they

0:49:09talk about blue Plex

0:49:10penguin deaths it's really cool yeah

0:49:14contactless payment cards that have

0:49:16existed for two years it's brilliant

0:49:20yeah I thought they were just a couple

0:49:22of clowns but cutting-edge okay

0:49:24so that'll be your blue plaque then

0:49:27world's oldest cricketer and vice host

0:49:31of hello internet podcasts and I sat on

0:49:33this bench I've take that not whales I

0:49:36was cricket at world's oldest cricketer

0:49:37to score a hundred I have to score a

0:49:38test century just being old is not good

0:49:41enough I hope to score a ton it probably

0:49:44is too late for me

0:49:45sports-wise but you can always be the

0:49:47world's first vice vice I host of a

0:49:49podcast I don't like it I still don't

0:49:51like you crazy that's out of the photo

0:49:54now my friend I feel like I know you

0:49:55will enough but sometimes get an idea in

0:49:58your Brady head and there's just no

0:50:00dislodging it this moment I'm ordering

0:50:02the embroidered t-shirt across my back

0:50:07in big red letters of Isis until the

0:50:13buzz started I didn't realize how many B

0:50:16stories were in the media every week

0:50:18it's massive it is I feel the same way

0:50:21like I was on Twitter earlier and I saw

0:50:23someone had made a little logo for the

0:50:26buzz with CGP grey like a like a cute

0:50:29little turning a microphone into B wings

0:50:30a little bit of a logo and I was making

0:50:33a joke about how like everybody seems

0:50:36really interested in all the B news but

0:50:38like there really isn't like haha the

0:50:40joke is over there really isn't enough B

0:50:42news all of the time to have any kind of

0:50:45regular segment that's the buzz and then

0:50:47immediately people are like oh did you

0:50:50know this week there was a million

0:50:51dollars worth of bees stolen it a bee

0:50:53heist like what all right and then it's

0:50:58like oh not only was this a bee heist

0:51:00but it's be heists our thing at least

0:51:03stolen bees the

0:51:05this is like a whole underground yeah

0:51:07industry there are bay rustlers yeah I

0:51:09know I think I can't believe like this

0:51:13is really a thing that people go around

0:51:16stealing bees so someone sent me this

0:51:19article about like Fresno police

0:51:20officers find 1 million dollars worth of

0:51:22stolen bees in the great be heist it's

0:51:26just it's it's crazy like the guy who

0:51:28stole all these bees is facing 10 years

0:51:30in prison if he's convicted yours

0:51:33weren't even better one you've got the

0:51:34American Bay hush there was a British

0:51:35Bay heist as well just recently there

0:51:37are multiple be heists going on I mean

0:51:40of course America's be heists are bigger

0:51:42and better than it be heist in England

0:51:44yeah they're more small-scale here yeah

0:51:46go big or go home with American be

0:51:49heists yeah I guess is the way that

0:51:51works today in The Times there was a

0:51:53story about a new nature paper that's

0:51:55just been published about some pesticide

0:51:57that we all use that's devastating

0:51:59bumblebees they found that bumble bee

0:52:02Queens that are exposed to this New Yawk

0:52:04denied thing a 26 percent less likely to

0:52:08lay eggs and start a colony like how

0:52:10detailed is that research they're like

0:52:12exposing queen bees to this chemical and

0:52:15then like that's detailed research they

0:52:17go on hardcore they are going hardcore

0:52:19and it was in The Times you know baby

0:52:21news is big it's obviously like demand

0:52:23for the sub editors of the newspaper

0:52:25obviously thinking what are we going to

0:52:26put in are we gonna put in this yet

0:52:28another story about YouTube terrorism or

0:52:33should we just have a break from that

0:52:34and like put in this story about bees

0:52:36and I put the base Torian this kind of

0:52:38stuff is increasing like reading through

0:52:40the bee heist news my favorite quote so

0:52:43far is from Steve Godwin from the

0:52:46California State Beekeepers Association

0:52:48he says quote there used to be a code of

0:52:52honor that you didn't mess with another

0:52:54man's bees but the perpetrators of this

0:52:58giant hive heist broke that code some

0:53:03things are just wrong it's like the Wild

0:53:06West out there with bees what's the

0:53:07security measures one can put in place

0:53:09to prevent ones Bay's being taken I mean

0:53:11foolishly I would have assumed that the

0:53:13bees themselves would be the security

0:53:14measure you know I guess is like cattle

0:53:17rustling

0:53:18the bees are happy to go along with

0:53:19somebody who's you know giving them some

0:53:22smoke and then here they would get all

0:53:24sleepy and you can just take them I

0:53:25don't have any idea but I quote this guy

0:53:27apparently the police got him in an

0:53:28elaborate sting Jihad Brady that was

0:53:32absolutely awful

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0:55:46Squarespace calm /hello

0:55:49I caught up with gray and mrs. gray a

0:55:54week ago or so was it yeah I saw you in

0:55:56person

0:55:57we had a lovely day together and the day

0:55:59got off to a brilliant start because the

0:56:03moment your wife walked in the room she

0:56:05was carrying this incredibly huge

0:56:07wrapped present for me wrapped in gold

0:56:10paper with a big red bow mm-hmm I felt a

0:56:13bit bad because like I hadn't turned up

0:56:16with anything and you guys were

0:56:17bestowing on me this enormous gift which

0:56:20I have to say as one of the best wrapped

0:56:22and ribbond gifts I've ever seen I will

0:56:26put a picture of it wrapped in the

0:56:28shownotes and I couldn't wait to open it

0:56:30mm-hmm and then you guys told me I

0:56:32couldn't open it until this episode so

0:56:35it remains wrapped and it's sitting next

0:56:37to me right this moment fantastic ready

0:56:39yes we got a little gift for you huh and

0:56:43I wanted to wait it's not little it's

0:56:47massive you have a picture I'll put in

0:56:49the show notes of the gifts with Audrey

0:56:52for scale so people can immediately

0:56:54understand how big the packages yeah but

0:56:57yes there's a presence that we got for

0:57:00you yeah that we wanted to have you open

0:57:03on the show we thought would be the best

0:57:06way to do it so we've made you wait a

0:57:09week a suspense has been killing me has

0:57:11it brainy hasn't actually been killing

0:57:12you actually kind of has I've grown kind

0:57:15of attached to it now that it's been

0:57:16sitting in my office and cause it's so

0:57:17such a beautiful object mm-hmm you know

0:57:19it's big and gold with a big red sash

0:57:21I've come to quite like it it's the

0:57:24point where unwrapping it is gonna be

0:57:25disappointed because the beauty of it

0:57:27will be destroyed I'm not a very like

0:57:29Nate and rapper either I wouldn't expect

0:57:31you a very neat unwrapped er either I

0:57:33figured this he'd go one of two ways

0:57:34which is that one you would obsess over

0:57:36what's in the box

0:57:37hmm or two you might just totally forget

0:57:40about it

0:57:41did you put it in a room and it would

0:57:42out of sight out of mind it didn't occur

0:57:44to me that you would you would place

0:57:45in a spot where you could see it and

0:57:47gaze upon it all the time and then just

0:57:49just like it as an actual object in your

0:57:51office the only slight problem with

0:57:54having a beautiful gold gift wrapped in

0:57:57your office at a time that like it's not

0:57:58Christmas and stuff like that is over

0:58:01the past few days I've had a few people

0:58:03visit my house like some of them have

0:58:05been here for like extended stays as

0:58:07well because they're like numberphile

0:58:08guests who sometimes come here and we

0:58:10make videos together for a day or two

0:58:11and then they go off so all of these

0:58:14people like when they come into my

0:58:16office they see this wrapped gift and

0:58:18I'm a bit worried in the back of their

0:58:20head they've all been thinking oh I

0:58:21wonder if that's for me is little thank

0:58:22you for doing numberphile they never get

0:58:24it and then I feel really guilty that

0:58:26all these people have been coming and

0:58:27thinking that the presents for them and

0:58:28they they it's not it's for me if people

0:58:31don't say anything I think you can kind

0:58:33of assume that in the back of their mind

0:58:35they were hoping what the gift is for

0:58:36them cuz I don't go oh what's the gift

0:58:39because you wouldn't say that yeah

0:58:40exactly right like they're standing by

0:58:42it like you know rubbing their toe into

0:58:44the ground looking at you and going like

0:58:46so is it time to go now that the day is

0:58:49over

0:58:49Oh big s I'll be here to go if there's

0:58:51nothing else nothing else that I think

0:58:55that's the implicit social thing that's

0:58:58occurring there yeah feeling like it

0:58:59gives her for them so I'm sorry about

0:59:00that Brady maybe they just didn't notice

0:59:02it although he's hard to miss because

0:59:03it's gold and red it's crazy

0:59:06so should I open up okay yes you can

0:59:09open the gift now okay just preface yes

0:59:13that there is some assembly required

0:59:17just so that you know that you know that

0:59:19going into it but yes you can open the

0:59:21gift you can open the gift now Brady

0:59:22okay here we go

0:59:24oh I'm putting it on my lap and I'm

0:59:31undoing this secure doesn't contain

0:59:35basil yeah surprise it's a bag full of

0:59:39live view that would make quite the

0:59:43podcast Sigma all right I've done the

0:59:45sides

0:59:52Wow this is a new microphone

0:59:57it's called Shore legend

0:59:57it's called Shore legend

1:00:00Darry performance 75th anniversary model

1:00:03limited edition it's amazing looking

1:00:07like it funnily enough it's the sort of

1:00:09thing that I would quite like the look

1:00:11of it's almost like the people who

1:00:12bought it and you might taste it's

1:00:13almost like we've been in your house and

1:00:15know how things look again

1:00:18top-of-the-line early 1900s

1:00:22look for everything that's in your house

1:00:23Brady this is gorgeous I'm actually

1:00:25opening the box to look at the device

1:00:27itself now this is what I was going to

1:00:28say is what you have to understand is

1:00:31that it is it's not just a microphone

1:00:34that we got your Brady yeah this is a a

1:00:37symbol of something so what I want you

1:00:40to take a look at is the base because

1:00:43what we got you is not just a microphone

1:00:45but it is it is a trophy is what it is

1:00:49Brady Wow

1:00:50so oh wow so it's got like a numbered

1:00:54certificate of authenticity mm-hmm so

1:00:56like that that already it really excites

1:00:58me and it's like wow this is amazing

1:01:03it's in like a its own little steel

1:01:06suitcase mm-hmm like you would see

1:01:11someone carrying if it was like like you

1:01:13play your head like like it should be

1:01:15handcuffed to my wrist yeah that's

1:01:17exactly what like that that case totally

1:01:19looks like the case that's handcuffed to

1:01:22a security guard kind of case so I'm

1:01:24gonna I'm gonna undo the case now Wow

1:01:30there's the microphone like in all

1:01:32spongy sponginess mm-hmm

1:01:34that's a good-looking microphone now it

1:01:38doesn't appear the basis that looks like

1:01:40the base is separate so I'm gonna open

1:01:41the other box with the base in it

1:01:42because you know it's all about the base

1:01:44on hello Internet

1:01:47well here's the base oh hang on no the

1:01:51base isn't engraved there we know oh

1:01:55well what is the base a Brady the base

1:02:01says dr. Brady Haran radio and podcast

1:02:05champion 2017 you're being naughty

1:02:14we're not being Yeti because as the

1:02:18audience already knows at this point the

1:02:21people who follow hello internet

1:02:22intensely now you won the internet radio

1:02:28competition podcast voting extravaganza

1:02:32that the Radio Times put on we were

1:02:34discussing in the last episode yes you

1:02:37won that you won that by an enormous

1:02:40amount and what was there from the Radio

1:02:44Times not but silence and my wife and I

1:02:50thought that's not the kind of respect

1:02:52and acknowledgement that dr. Brady Haran

1:02:54deserves we need to give him a trophy to

1:02:59embody this accomplishment and this

1:03:02award that Brady has won so my wife went

1:03:05out on the Internet's and we decided to

1:03:09find a trophy for Brady and there was

1:03:13nothing that was up to what we thought

1:03:15would be the magnificent standard that

1:03:18you deserve so we found this

1:03:20limited-edition microphone and we got it

1:03:23engraved in London and the base so this

1:03:26is the trophy to represent your triumph

1:03:29in podcasting Brady well I feel like I

1:03:33should make a short speech I would just

1:03:37like to say this is not just a victory

1:03:39for me mm-hmm

1:03:40this is a victory for my co-host

1:03:46although he fell in the battle and was

1:03:49not able to make it all the way to the

1:03:50final stages I felt like he was with me

1:03:53in spirit and he was certainly with me

1:03:56on Twitter

1:03:56[Laughter]

1:03:58I was with you on Twitter every step of

1:04:00the way buddy but also this is not about

1:04:03me mm-hmm no and this is not a victory

1:04:05for me this is a victory for the Tim's

1:04:07and I mean that quite literally because

1:04:11as we were discussed early they pretty

1:04:13much did it and I was a slightly

1:04:16confused and bemused passenger for their

1:04:21mischief-making but before we talk about

1:04:24this vote and how it came to be that I

1:04:26am the Radio Times rarely on podcast

1:04:29champion and we will talk about it

1:04:30because it was fascinating and also I

1:04:33need some of it explain to me there is a

1:04:35group of people I want to thank and

1:04:38these are not the people who are

1:04:39responsible for the victory really but

1:04:43they actually are a really sizable group

1:04:44and that is the group of people that sat

1:04:48at their computer and just clicked on a

1:04:51button and refresh the page and waited

1:04:54and click the button again and then

1:04:56wouldn't had a coffee and click the

1:04:57button again and I had like some friends

1:04:59that dinner and like some friends wives

1:05:02and people like that who were oblivious

1:05:04to the technological firestorm that was

1:05:09taking place behind the scenes on both

1:05:10sides even people who were aware we're

1:05:13still participating there were many a

1:05:14manual vote cast in the gray household

1:05:16for Brady I'll tell you them yes and

1:05:18there are lots of people who used the

1:05:21conventional way of mallets died think

1:05:23of just voting over and over again on

1:05:26their computer I seriously want to thank

1:05:27them because some people like spent a

1:05:29lot of time doing and it was really

1:05:31sweet like Alan who famously composed

1:05:33the hello internet jingle mm-hmm it'll

1:05:36sound at the side of a show called me up

1:05:37and said oh my wife and I so happy that

1:05:39you weren't my wife like stayed up

1:05:41really late and was sitting in bed

1:05:42voting for you lots and lots of times

1:05:44and then I sort of said to him like you

1:05:46realized like that was quite a lot of

1:05:48other stuff going on and he was like I

1:05:49didn't I had no idea like so there are

1:05:52lots of people who were just like really

1:05:54sweet voting the old-fashioned way and

1:05:56like that means a lot like you know the

1:06:00whole thing doesn't mean anything cause

1:06:01they silly vote but I want to thank

1:06:04those people because they're like you

1:06:06know they're old school I guess we'd

1:06:07better talk about what happened in this

1:06:09vote and discuss a few things about it

1:06:11because

1:06:11it had quite the conclusion let's talk

1:06:13about that vote just to finish my speech

1:06:16thank you to gray and mrs. gray because

1:06:18this is actually a really lovely thing

1:06:20you've given me as well like actually

1:06:21does mean a lot to me so thank you very

1:06:23much and I will thank her in person

1:06:25that's well again we know physical

1:06:28objects mean a lot to you Brady

1:06:30we wanted you to have an embodiment of

1:06:32this tremendous thing that we have all

1:06:35gone through together as a big hello

1:06:39internet group I mean should I use this

1:06:40microphone now as my podcasting

1:06:42microphone or should I put it on my

1:06:43little shelf where I have like my

1:06:44favorite because I do have three or four

1:06:46trophies that means so much to me I do

1:06:48have them on display so I could put that

1:06:50up there on my little my mantle of Fame

1:06:52this is 100% up to you it serves either

1:06:56as a trophy or it can be a hell of an

1:06:58Internet microphone it is a working

1:07:00microphone it is a limited edition

1:07:01working microphone so it looks like the

1:07:03bangs nice to be honest

1:07:04however it's your trophy now it is in

1:07:06your hands

1:07:07however it best serves you baby I just

1:07:09don't want to sully it it's so lovely

1:07:10like I don't want to scratch it and

1:07:12knock it but maybe that will add you

1:07:14know charm to it if it's like you used

1:07:16in battle like it will increase its

1:07:18value if hello Internet episodes were

1:07:20actually recorded on it it's up to you

1:07:23man it's up to you all right all right

1:07:25so let me very quickly recap what

1:07:28happened for people who are smart enough

1:07:30to have taken absolutely no interest in

1:07:32this debacle that happened a few weeks

1:07:34ago now just before you even begin with

1:07:36this like I just have to say I love kind

1:07:39of sometimes getting involved in these

1:07:41sort of silly internet things it really

1:07:43is fun to let yourself get like swept

1:07:46away in an event like this something

1:07:48like that just really heightens the

1:07:50feeling of even like you were saying

1:07:52with with Alan and his wife who were

1:07:53voting for you in the election that

1:07:56people are just unaware of like to us

1:07:59what seemed like this incredible

1:08:01all-consuming Malstrom for a weekend

1:08:03yeah there's Twitter and this

1:08:05coordination on reddit and there's

1:08:06messages going back and forth where I am

1:08:08in and it's like this is this flurry of

1:08:10activity that seems so all-consuming

1:08:13which you realize is like just one of

1:08:15like an infinite number of internet

1:08:17maelstroms that are occurring and every

1:08:19corner of the globe right it's like

1:08:21outside of this world totally

1:08:24meaningless

1:08:25inside of this world to a sub community

1:08:28all consuming like 40 points in 72 hours

1:08:32I have followed no election in my life

1:08:36more closely than this way so I'll give

1:08:39like a brief summary of what I think

1:08:41happened you can you can explain some of

1:08:43it to me and tell me the parts of it

1:08:45that tickled your fancy so last time

1:08:47people listened if they listened to the

1:08:49last episode they'll know the radio

1:08:50times around this pole for their radio

1:08:53and podcast champion they ran all

1:08:55different polls for different categories

1:08:57like TV stars and comedians and there

1:08:59was a radio and podcast section there

1:09:01was a huge big thing very elaborate with

1:09:03all different groups and a knockout

1:09:05section and it got to a point where I

1:09:07was in this quarter-final up against

1:09:10this guy called Steve Allen who gray and

1:09:13I thought was a bit dismissive of us

1:09:14within wait so we we sort of caused a

1:09:17call to arms to try and win the vote let

1:09:19me win the vote against this guy and

1:09:21that's how the last podcast ended and we

1:09:26deliberately released that podcast after

1:09:28all the voting was over because we

1:09:29didn't we didn't want to be seen to be

1:09:30like you know getting involved

1:09:32well at least via the back up that

1:09:36phrasing we thought it would be better

1:09:38to drop the episode after results were

1:09:41closed yeah I mean releasing the podcast

1:09:43to like you know 900 thousand downloads

1:09:45whatever felt a bit like we'd be

1:09:46bringing a gun to a knife fight

1:09:48so it was like let's just do it they do

1:09:50this the old-fashioned way

1:09:51mmm-hmm so I won this vote against the

1:09:54Steve Allen and I had said on the

1:09:56podcast that was it this is a

1:09:58meaningless silly vote to just drive

1:09:59clicks to their website and increase

1:10:01their advertising and I said I'm gonna

1:10:04have anything more to do with it I want

1:10:05to just jump in here as well that I to

1:10:08at this point felt satiated in this

1:10:12internet's kerfuffle I think my exact

1:10:15words were that I wanted I wanted your

1:10:17opponent crushed into the ground yeah I

1:10:19feel like that was in internet terms

1:10:21accomplished it was victory and I felt

1:10:24like ah okay catharsis

1:10:26it's all over oh good oh good so in the

1:10:30semi-final I was paired up with someone

1:10:32called lilah Parsons who is a DJ and a

1:10:35TV presenter and a model and obvious

1:10:39very talented and successful but it

1:10:41turns out I won that vote as well I

1:10:43didn't even follow that vote really but

1:10:45it turns out I won that vote and that

1:10:47put me into the final and the final was

1:10:50against funnily enough a colleague a

1:10:52radio colleague of Steve Allen like a

1:10:54co-presenter on the same station threw

1:10:57like mates and I was in the final

1:10:59against him and he had taken an interest

1:11:01in this whole vote and had been tweeting

1:11:04about it and encouraging people to vote

1:11:05now out of kind of respect I kind of

1:11:09looked him up and who he was and found

1:11:11out a bit about him and I listened to

1:11:12his show and I just want to say from the

1:11:13outset I quite like this guy like I

1:11:16listened to his show a couple of times

1:11:17I've read some of the stuff he writes he

1:11:20seems reasonably like-minded to me on

1:11:22some issues a lot of people who follow

1:11:24it hello internet like him I found out

1:11:26there was a lot of crossover seems of

1:11:28sound guy and also before the vote

1:11:31started he even tweeted me and like said

1:11:33you know good luck mate haha and I sort

1:11:35of tweeted back so no issues with this

1:11:37guy at all sound guy everything's good

1:11:40yeah so the vote started and there was a

1:11:44bit of to and fro early and I think he

1:11:46had a lead but what happened then was

1:11:48the Tim's took over at this point and

1:11:52they got really really into it and I

1:11:55want to say Radio Times was really

1:11:57whipping this up into a frenzy there

1:11:59article and their website said in the

1:12:01blue corner and in the red corner and

1:12:03they all the way through the whole thing

1:12:04they were tweeting about it all the time

1:12:06they were inciting people to vote they

1:12:08were using language that like made it

1:12:10sound like a real war they were using

1:12:12language like rally the troops oh yeah

1:12:14they specifically said on their website

1:12:16and in multiple places vote as many

1:12:18times as you want vote often because I

1:12:20think they wanted people to continually

1:12:22refresh the pages and up their ad

1:12:24impression exactly yeah that that's 100%

1:12:26what it was I realized they were they

1:12:28were retweeting everything that they

1:12:30possibly could that was related to these

1:12:33internet fights they were whipping it up

1:12:35they were really whipping it up

1:12:37so the Tim's took the gauntlet now I

1:12:39decided to stay out of it that was my

1:12:41decision I wasn't going to tweet about

1:12:42it I wasn't going to get involved in the

1:12:45end my only policy was to retweet

1:12:47whenever this James O'Brien tweeted so

1:12:49if he ever said come on everyone that's

1:12:51vote lots of times

1:12:52just retweet his thing and let people

1:12:54decide what to do but the Tim's the

1:12:57Tim's got really into it they created

1:12:59this like battle command station on

1:13:01River on a reddit thread where they

1:13:04coordinated in ways that I still don't

1:13:06understand

1:13:07they were clearly using automated voting

1:13:09and BOTS and things like that they were

1:13:12creating pages where the voting could be

1:13:14done automatically by your computer and

1:13:16clearly a kind of arms war started

1:13:19because James O'Brien fans who I want to

1:13:22point out were doing the same thing and

1:13:23I have lots of evidence they were doing

1:13:25the same thing and the vote wouldn't

1:13:26have been as close as it was if they

1:13:27weren't doing the same thing but the

1:13:29James some of the more old-fashioned

1:13:31James O'Brien fans started crying foul

1:13:34and because this was the teams were

1:13:36doing this so openly they were doing on

1:13:38reddit they were explaining their

1:13:39tactics so that other people could do it

1:13:41it was a real public communal effort

1:13:43there wasn't it wasn't clandestine yeah

1:13:44that's why the James O'Brien fans was

1:13:46stealing all the technology and codes

1:13:48that they were finding and using it to

1:13:50vote for their guy so it was very open

1:13:52but like the more old-fashioned fans of

1:13:55James O'Brien probably a more typical

1:13:56Radio Times readers I think when they

1:13:59found this thread thought they'd found

1:14:01something from like the dark web or

1:14:02something some great secret yeah and

1:14:04they were then tweeting it and sending

1:14:06it to Radio Times going look what's

1:14:07going on this cheating and they started

1:14:09crying foul and they started saying some

1:14:11like inflammatory things like I'm gonna

1:14:12you know cancel my subscription and this

1:14:15whole thing's corrupt and they got

1:14:16really upset because their beloved radio

1:14:18presenter looked like he might lose the

1:14:20vote and at that point Radio Times were

1:14:23like oh my god what have we done we've

1:14:26created a monster yeah there was

1:14:28definitely a tonal shift from Radio

1:14:30Times they went deadly silent on the

1:14:33whole thing they never said or tweeted

1:14:34another word they still haven't to this

1:14:36day even though they're happy tweeting

1:14:38about other winners they went completely

1:14:39silent but they obviously started trying

1:14:43to implement technological solutions

1:14:45like at one point they introduced

1:14:47captures to stop people from using the

1:14:50automated process but when they did that

1:14:52yeah the lead I had actually started

1:14:53increasing which makes me think maybe I

1:14:55had more manual voters then than the

1:14:57other guy I want to just point out a

1:15:00couple things as we're going along this

1:15:01along this road here right because yes

1:15:03automated voting started

1:15:05happening and and escalating at a rate

1:15:08that almost felt like there's like

1:15:09there's a self-learning artificial

1:15:11intelligence here that is pulling apart

1:15:12everything everything that has anything

1:15:15to do with how the entire system works

1:15:17and cranking out every advantage that

1:15:20there could possibly be it's like yeah

1:15:21it was very interesting to see in the

1:15:23reddit threads slightly terrifying to

1:15:25see what the audience can do if it could

1:15:28it's like yeah Jesus Christ like I'd

1:15:31like these guys might be rigging real

1:15:32elections right it was it was amazing it

1:15:35was very impressive what I really liked

1:15:37is someone put together a data

1:15:39visualization of the percentage win over

1:15:42time which made it much easier to follow

1:15:44the election this is like you know if I

1:15:46was if I was the kind of person who

1:15:47follow a real election you'd be checking

1:15:49updates in the like the polls of the of

1:15:52the predicted wins of candidates you

1:15:54know once a day when the news publishes

1:15:56it but like there's a graph that's

1:15:57updating every 5 seconds with what the

1:15:59current exact tenth of a percentage edge

1:16:01is technology the technology was amazing

1:16:04there's a few things about I want to

1:16:05come to yeah it was really interesting

1:16:06to follow like I kept refreshing the

1:16:08graphs and seeing how things were going

1:16:09and once the graph existed you could see

1:16:13more clearly that at some point as the

1:16:17bots were introduced it became entirely

1:16:20about war because the graph just ended

1:16:23up being just too smooth right like when

1:16:25humans are voting it was much more spiky

1:16:28but then at a point when you have BOTS

1:16:30that are voting whatever it was like

1:16:31hundreds and hundreds of times a second

1:16:33yeah and you have BOTS on both sides

1:16:35voting it ends up becoming like a smooth

1:16:38curve because you're just looking at the

1:16:40difference between the bots on either

1:16:42side and this is where I would have paid

1:16:46so much money to know what was going on

1:16:48inside Radio Times headquarters because

1:16:51they obviously built a clique machine

1:16:55like they wanted this to be a bring your

1:16:59audience

1:17:00bring advertising revenue to us click

1:17:02machine for Radio Times own benefit and

1:17:06much like a shredder in which you keep

1:17:08shoving in more paper until it breaks

1:17:11this felt like the same thing like Radio

1:17:13Times you want votes you're gonna get

1:17:16votes you're gonna get millions and

1:17:19millions of votes you're going to get

1:17:21more votes than there ever will be

1:17:24people in the universe like I wouldn't

1:17:26be the least bit surprised if in the end

1:17:29the results on that final vote were in

1:17:33the billions like on either side I made

1:17:36the percentages public but they didn't

1:17:37make the number of votes public they

1:17:39didn't make the number of votes public

1:17:40you could only you can only see the

1:17:41percentages so for me again it's like

1:17:44just like in the the first round where

1:17:47it's like Oh la-dee-da isn't this fun

1:17:49and then I got angry when Steve Allen

1:17:52tweeted the kind of dismissive of you

1:17:54tweet like please vote for me over this

1:17:56like I have never heard of thing then I

1:17:58got riled up I was having the same

1:18:00feeling with the later rounds at the

1:18:01election like oh isn't this a kind of

1:18:04fun thing to follow over the weekend

1:18:05like let's see if Brady wins oh it's

1:18:07it's now become a bot war like it

1:18:09obviously would like lol it's hilarious

1:18:11but then the thing that you just

1:18:13mentioned is where once again I felt

1:18:16myself turned from like happy fun gray

1:18:20into like furious gray and it was when

1:18:24very obviously someone at the Radio

1:18:28Times was looking at the numbers looking

1:18:30at the monster that they themselves have

1:18:34summoned from the internet and they

1:18:36wanted to turn it off right they wanted

1:18:38to stop it and so they introduced the

1:18:41CAPTCHA so the CAPTCHAs are those those

1:18:44words you have to type in to prove that

1:18:46you are not a robot right or that the

1:18:49pictures that you have to click but they

1:18:50were they were using like a

1:18:51bargain-basement word CAPTCHA as the

1:18:54thing that they were using to try to

1:18:56determine that they were actually humans

1:18:57voting this to me was when it's like oh

1:19:01okay I see what's going on here you now

1:19:05you've set up your dopey election which

1:19:07has dumb rules in the first place where

1:19:09you can vote as many times as you want

1:19:11because it's not really an election it's

1:19:13an impressions generating machine for

1:19:15you now this has gotten out of control

1:19:17because you radio times probably have

1:19:19like actual people on the radio being

1:19:22quite annoyed with you and your position

1:19:24as you're trying to be like this thing

1:19:27that radio people might care about so

1:19:29like they suddenly found themselves in

1:19:30awkward position

1:19:31yeah

1:19:32I do people didn't seem to take it as

1:19:33quite the joke we did no and I think

1:19:36obviously you know core business for

1:19:38Radio Times is probably radio these

1:19:39people probably buy ads in their

1:19:41magazine they pay to have their listings

1:19:43on there so the people they were pissing

1:19:45off and the people who were losing

1:19:46suddenly right would like the people who

1:19:48actually put bread on the table and the

1:19:50podcasters who they don't really care

1:19:52about and they just put in there to try

1:19:53and up their clicks by getting people

1:19:55with like Twitter followers we're

1:19:56suddenly winning and they're like oh no

1:19:58this is the structural problem they have

1:20:00is like this is why like it started to

1:20:02get into my brain like it makes me mad

1:20:04about the whole system because like you

1:20:05obviously included podcasters in some of

1:20:08these polls because you wanted to bring

1:20:09in like those juicy juicy Internet

1:20:11clicks but it's like none of these

1:20:13people are your business you don't

1:20:15actually want any of the podcasters to

1:20:17win and we know that's the case because

1:20:21like you said when they introduced the

1:20:22CAPTCHA it actually made things worse

1:20:25because like you said so many people

1:20:28were manually voting for you from hello

1:20:31internet versus the number of people

1:20:32voting for the radio people that when

1:20:34they introduced the CAPTCHA for a couple

1:20:36of hours you could see on the graph that

1:20:37is like your lead just kept increasing

1:20:40even faster than without and so after a

1:20:43couple of hours they pulled the CAPTCHA

1:20:44and that was when is like my blood is

1:20:47now boiling it's like oh okay

1:20:48you're just being really open about this

1:20:50banana republic that you're running over

1:20:52here right like okay if you're gonna put

1:20:55the CAPTCHA on and then you're gonna

1:20:56take it away because you're obviously

1:20:58trying to monkey with the results to get

1:21:00the thing that is financially in your

1:21:03own best interest like why don't you

1:21:04just make up the results at this point

1:21:06like this whole thing was a ridiculous

1:21:07Sharad like before it even began now you

1:21:10have made it into like an even more

1:21:12ridiculous thing that the person who

1:21:15clearly has more people manually voting

1:21:19for him like you kind of wanted to have

1:21:21happen in the first place but you don't

1:21:23want him to win so you're switching it

1:21:25back hoping that the radio personalities

1:21:28bots will somehow win or that it won't

1:21:31be such an incredibly crushing defeat if

1:21:33you have the bots fighting it out versus

1:21:35having the actual people fighting it out

1:21:36so it made me furious to see this

1:21:39election where they wanted to change the

1:21:40rules to get the result they want and

1:21:42when it wasn't working and it was

1:21:43actually worse for them to like whoop I

1:21:45guess we'll go back to

1:21:45the other way and like change it back so

1:21:47the whole thing was just ridiculous but

1:21:50my like my blood was boiling after the

1:21:52CAPTCHA incidents in this election it's

1:21:54like my it's still like it still riles

1:21:56me up that's when you started

1:21:57marshalling a few troops and started

1:21:59encouraging people on Twitter because I

1:22:01was trying to be like president you know

1:22:03and like stay out of it and I never

1:22:05linked to anything that encouraged

1:22:08multiple voting either manually or

1:22:10automatically I was trying to rise above

1:22:13it but then you energized and already

1:22:15very energetic group my feeling of it

1:22:18was like Radio Times you made me do this

1:22:20like I didn't want to do this but you

1:22:22made me do it because after the the

1:22:25quarterfinals with Steve Allen when you

1:22:27won I felt like oh we're done and this

1:22:29is just a fun thing to follow and see

1:22:31what happens over the weekend but after

1:22:32the capture thing it was like no Brady

1:22:34has to win this like I'm like I'm gonna

1:22:36come in on Twitter and try to make sure

1:22:38that like push as much as I can like I

1:22:40want this thing to go a particular way

1:22:42because Radio Times is like shown their

1:22:44hand with this vote manipulation that

1:22:48they wanted to have happen but didn't

1:22:49happen you want to blow past the capture

1:22:51thing like but if it's like to me this

1:22:53was like that one of the major events in

1:22:54the great election of 2017 well there's

1:22:57a few other things I want to ask you

1:22:58about and talk about but just to kind of

1:23:00finish the the emotional story first I

1:23:02didn't want to care but as you have

1:23:04pointed out I have like this naturally

1:23:05competitive you know streak like most

1:23:08Australians I didn't want to win because

1:23:10it would be a little bit embarrassing

1:23:12but I also really didn't want to lose so

1:23:15it got to a point where I was really

1:23:16like consumed by it but trying not to be

1:23:19and I kept I would look at the numbers

1:23:21and like I would see myself like going

1:23:24up and holding a lead but as the O'Brien

1:23:26fans got more savvy with the automated

1:23:27voting sometimes he would claw back some

1:23:29ground

1:23:30and I'd be thinking that's it I'm gonna

1:23:31lose now this is the start of the

1:23:33precipice and it's all gonna end and I

1:23:35would you know and it got to a point

1:23:36where I was so like worked up about it

1:23:38over days because they made the final

1:23:41last more days this is a prelim the

1:23:43cruelty and their revenue of course it

1:23:44got to a point where I was like just

1:23:46going for walks like I would just go for

1:23:48a walk out flight to the sea so that I

1:23:50didn't have to think about it and like

1:23:53then I would get my phone out just

1:23:55quickly check the score

1:23:56gone down another point one of a percent

1:23:58and when whenever a trend started it

1:24:00would continue you know you would drop a

1:24:02you know a point one of a percent every

1:24:04minute and then someone else would do

1:24:05something technological and it would it

1:24:07would change so anyway I decided I

1:24:10thought the best thing for me would be

1:24:11to win but to win narrowly so that

1:24:13everyone saved face but that's not what

1:24:16happened no and I ended up winning about

1:24:1880% but never a word was spoken about it

1:24:22by Radio Times they like they completely

1:24:24disowned the whole thing which is again

1:24:26exactly exactly shows you that this is

1:24:28not what they wanted on all of the other

1:24:30things they're very happy to promote the

1:24:32winners and then suddenly this is like

1:24:33silence I'm kind of a little bit glad

1:24:36because like if they'd made a big deal

1:24:38about it and stirred it up again then

1:24:41all the O'Brien fans would have come

1:24:42back online and said that it was a farce

1:24:44and that would have all and that would

1:24:45have riled me up again and it would have

1:24:46riled you up and I just wouldn't I'm

1:24:48quite happy for it to sort of just fade

1:24:51a little bit out of existence but still

1:24:53happy to of won and like to have my

1:24:55trophy from you and mrs. gray but there

1:24:57are a few things that I observed and

1:25:00liked about it and a few questions I've

1:25:01come out with mm-hmm

1:25:03first is I said thank you to the people

1:25:06who like voted manually but also thank

1:25:09you to the people who did all this

1:25:10technological stuff because like it was

1:25:14awesome like they were awesome and it

1:25:15was really interesting to watch as like

1:25:18an outsider all the discussions they

1:25:20were having and all the tactics they

1:25:21were coming up with and all the things

1:25:23they were doing and like the camaraderie

1:25:25they were having and like the two camps

1:25:27of like nailing gear and flag a flag got

1:25:30together to work together for others

1:25:31laughs so there was a it had a real fun

1:25:34spirit to it and I've got a few friends

1:25:35who are like just casual hello internet

1:25:38observers and they went and had a look

1:25:40at like that subreddit what was going on

1:25:42and they said to me afterwards I didn't

1:25:44realize like hello Internet had so much

1:25:46like law about it like so many in jokes

1:25:50and so many things and like all of that

1:25:52stuff really bubbled to the surface in a

1:25:53really fun way on that subreddit I did

1:25:56enjoy that but an important question is

1:25:58I'm not going to say is this cheating

1:26:00because I think that's not even a valid

1:26:02question it's not cheating because it's

1:26:04not prohibited in the rolls but the

1:26:07thing is is that morally right

1:26:09and if you think it's morally shady to

1:26:12be winning the election this way isn't

1:26:15any more morally shady than auntie Doris

1:26:18who likes listening to the radio sitting

1:26:20there with a cup of coffee and the lamp

1:26:21clicking over and over again because

1:26:24they were told to you know with a sore

1:26:26finger clicking a thousand times like is

1:26:28that more legitimate than the people who

1:26:30say well I'm not gonna get a sore finger

1:26:32when I can just automate this mm-hmm

1:26:34like are there moral shades here is it

1:26:36the wrong thing is it the right thing

1:26:38what do you think about that

1:26:39I have zero moral qualms about this

1:26:41whatsoever right Radio Times asked for

1:26:44as many votes as humans could give them

1:26:47and just panicked when when more votes

1:26:51were being shoved down their throats

1:26:52than they expected right but I don't

1:26:54think there's a moral problem with this

1:26:56that's why again like there's something

1:26:58about this in my mind that it's just

1:26:59like like a perfect little storm of

1:27:01antagonism is a vote that is so

1:27:05obviously intentionally set up to be an

1:27:09illegitimate vote by an organization

1:27:12that is sort of pretending like it's a

1:27:14real thing you're taking a bit of shine

1:27:16off this trophy right now by the way

1:27:17great this is why I wanted to get you

1:27:21this trophy is I think like the trophy

1:27:24is a manifestation of like the thing

1:27:27that the hello Internet audience did

1:27:29that's my question is what did this vote

1:27:32measure because it hasn't voted who's a

1:27:34better radio presenter or podcaster or

1:27:36champion of anything in terms of us as

1:27:38individuals like me or James O'Brien or

1:27:40Steve Allen or anyone what has this vote

1:27:43established has established that hello

1:27:45Internet listeners are the most

1:27:46technologically savvy and determined or

1:27:49has established that there's a size of

1:27:52them what do you think this vote has has

1:27:55established what has been won I think

1:27:57what has been won is a kind of audience

1:28:00intensity I think that's what has been

1:28:03established here this is why I have such

1:28:05a fun feeling about this meeting 'less

1:28:08vote because of precisely what you were

1:28:10saying before that it was enjoyable and

1:28:13engaging to see everybody on the

1:28:18subreddit like working toward a thing

1:28:21yeah and working toward a thing in

1:28:23complicated intricate manner one of the

1:28:27things that that was happening just

1:28:28before the Radio Times turned off the

1:28:31CAPTCHA so like it was a couple of hours

1:28:33in but there was like 30 minutes before

1:28:35they actually ended up shining a thing

1:28:36off was people who didn't have technical

1:28:39skills were asking like oh what can I do

1:28:40to help in addition to just manually

1:28:43voting someone was was essentially

1:28:45running the CAPTCHA through like a

1:28:46Mechanical Turk system so that people

1:28:48could decode what the words were and

1:28:50then have a bot do the other parts of

1:28:53doing the voting automatically it's like

1:28:55they just got that system set up like

1:28:57right before the CAPTCHA got shut down

1:28:58that was the equivalent of Internet

1:29:00users saying like and you have my axe

1:29:03right like I don't I don't have

1:29:04programming skills but like what else

1:29:06can I bring to this table the hell yeah

1:29:07and people building a system so that

1:29:09there was something that was that was

1:29:11there to help so I think it's a real

1:29:14indicator of audience intensity and

1:29:17interest that's why like when the Radio

1:29:20Times doubled down on their silence it

1:29:22felt even more intense to me like there

1:29:25needs to be some acknowledgment of this

1:29:27that's why this trophy exists right is

1:29:30like hey Radio Times you thought you

1:29:32were doing something you were not

1:29:34remotely doing what you thought you were

1:29:36doing something far more interesting

1:29:39happened around this that's what this

1:29:42trophy is about there Brady it was just

1:29:45a very very fun and interesting weekend

1:29:48and terrifyingly impressive to see what

1:29:52an internet community can do so I guess

1:29:55the next big question is when they do it

1:29:58again next year and I think they will

1:30:00because it seems to be something they're

1:30:01quite proud of will you and I be put in

1:30:04I mean I'm the defending champion you

1:30:07know ad you are the defending champion

1:30:09it wouldn't outrageous not included next

1:30:13year it would be interesting to see how

1:30:15they conduct the vote next year I

1:30:17imagine it would be different it would

1:30:18also be really interesting if next year

1:30:20we were both put in because this kind of

1:30:22slipped under the radar before the teams

1:30:24were really onto it and you got knocked

1:30:26out by the very zealous Steve Allen fans

1:30:28before you know without us rallying the

1:30:31troops so if you if this time we were

1:30:33ready and troops were bradleyt before

1:30:35the vote

1:30:36you know we could get our long-awaited

1:30:37showdown no no is I don't want there to

1:30:40be a showdown I can click I will promote

1:30:43no poles until after I have been

1:30:46eliminated that is my policy so that's

1:30:50the way that's gonna work I want to win

1:30:52these things but when I won it was so

1:30:54sweet I was like I saw some of the light

1:30:57like teams and that was saying this is

1:30:58so great that we're really pleased I

1:31:00wonder if they're gonna do like a

1:31:01magazine spread with Braley and an

1:31:03interview and like I think they

1:31:05genuinely thought like I was you know so

1:31:07I have seen someone mock up a cover of

1:31:09Radio Times with me on the cover

1:31:11I think they genuinely thought like you

1:31:12know there would be some celebration of

1:31:14the wind as opposed to the Stoney Stoney

1:31:17cold silence that it's been met by yeah

1:31:19well again if it was how could we phrase

1:31:21this a more legitimately intended poll

1:31:25like yeah of course they would have some

1:31:27some kind of photo shoot with Brady

1:31:29you know you and Audrey they'd have

1:31:32pictures the trophy my new trophy like

1:31:34just lounging with the trophy yeah a

1:31:36trophy they do all this kind of stuff

1:31:37but of course no absolute silence on

1:31:39their end but again that that's why

1:31:40that's why you needed you needed a

1:31:42physical tangible symbol of this thing

1:31:45Brady this thing we will never forget

1:31:47you my friend are a radio and podcast

1:31:50champion you deserve that trophy