The Accidental Tech Podcast

248: Chili Cookoff


00:00:00   check it off it's like one of those [TS]

00:00:01   confusing titles where people will [TS]

00:00:03   listen to the whole episode and then [TS]

00:00:05   glance back at the title before I like [TS]

00:00:06   it it's always I'm like what was that [TS]

00:00:08   about anything right it's a great time I [TS]

00:00:12   didn't love this title when you first [TS]

00:00:13   said it but you're the two of you are [TS]

00:00:15   convincing me that there's this thing's [TS]

00:00:17   got legs just like my icon there's death [TS]

00:00:20   to that title Depp the flavor and spice [TS]

00:00:22   it's just a good practice that's not but [TS]

00:00:25   not a lot of levels of depth mapping [TS]

00:00:32   yourself so as always we start with [TS]

00:00:36   follow up and listen to Richard Buxton [TS]

00:00:38   wrote in to say that traits people [TS]

00:00:40   generally like face ID and this was [TS]

00:00:43   something I hadn't considered and I and [TS]

00:00:45   I really liked this email Richard wrote [TS]

00:00:47   I wanted to provide some feedback on the [TS]

00:00:48   face ID concept and perhaps shed light [TS]

00:00:50   on an entirely different group of phone [TS]

00:00:51   users I'm a trades person or more [TS]

00:00:53   specifically an electrician and touch ID [TS]

00:00:55   sucks as a consequence of manual work [TS]

00:00:58   with rough materials all day long my [TS]

00:01:00   fingertips constantly gets scratched and [TS]

00:01:02   worn the result is that touch ID on [TS]

00:01:04   either a six or seven plus constantly [TS]

00:01:07   fails I have perhaps a ten percent [TS]

00:01:08   success rate and I am therefore forced [TS]

00:01:10   to type my password in a lot and thus [TS]

00:01:12   Richard rate you know had written that [TS]

00:01:14   he was he is really really really [TS]

00:01:16   excited about face ID and that makes [TS]

00:01:18   perfect sense but it was something I [TS]

00:01:19   hadn't really considered you know the [TS]

00:01:21   obvious thought of like oh people who [TS]

00:01:22   don't have I don't know hands or perhaps [TS]

00:01:25   you know don't have fingers that are [TS]

00:01:27   dexterous enough to be placed on a [TS]

00:01:29   little fingerprint sensor that all you [TS]

00:01:31   know is semi obvious but I didn't even [TS]

00:01:33   think of somebody that has potentially [TS]

00:01:34   ten working digits but but they're [TS]

00:01:37   packed to smithereens because of the [TS]

00:01:39   line of work that they're in so I [TS]

00:01:40   thought that was a release we'll follow [TS]

00:01:41   up yeah also to think about people who [TS]

00:01:43   have weather which is the first thing [TS]

00:01:45   that comes to my mind when thinking [TS]

00:01:46   about face ID is the large portion of [TS]

00:01:49   the year that many people don't want to [TS]

00:01:50   take their hands out of their gloves or [TS]

00:01:53   mittens or whatever to use their phone [TS]

00:01:55   that's why they have all the special [TS]

00:01:56   gloves with the touch sensors on them [TS]

00:01:58   but then sometimes they only work for a [TS]

00:02:00   short period of time or sometimes it can [TS]

00:02:01   be too cold for them to even work and to [TS]

00:02:04   not have to deal with that to be able to [TS]

00:02:05   basically say if I got gloves that are [TS]

00:02:07   dexterous enough to handle my phone I [TS]

00:02:09   don't have to worry that [TS]

00:02:11   the phone can't touch my fingerprints in [TS]

00:02:14   any way even if my fingerprints are [TS]

00:02:15   pristine I think it was pointed in my [TS]

00:02:17   face and they will unlock and then of [TS]

00:02:19   course you still have the problem of how [TS]

00:02:20   do you touch the screen but I think [TS]

00:02:22   that's you know again that's where those [TS]

00:02:24   gloves come in where at least you can do [TS]

00:02:27   touch and scroll things but as far as [TS]

00:02:29   I'm aware there are no gloves that [TS]

00:02:30   transfer your fingerprint through the [TS]

00:02:32   through their warmth to the touch ID [TS]

00:02:33   sensor these biological systems you kind [TS]

00:02:38   of have to think like you know how many [TS]

00:02:40   people does this exclude and you know [TS]

00:02:43   and for the most part like we you know [TS]

00:02:45   that our mainstream tech commentators [TS]

00:02:47   and and media reviewers and everything [TS]

00:02:49   we usually are not very aware of the [TS]

00:02:52   kinds of people or groups or situations [TS]

00:02:54   that this that anything you know could [TS]

00:02:57   rule out in a lot of edge cases and like [TS]

00:03:00   it's it's nightly touch ID provides a [TS]

00:03:02   fairly simple interaction but if you for [TS]

00:03:06   some reason can't do that very often [TS]

00:03:09   that's gonna be a major problem there's [TS]

00:03:10   no real out for you face idea I think is [TS]

00:03:13   a little bit more flexible like they [TS]

00:03:15   they had the thing you know first of all [TS]

00:03:16   I think more people can probably show [TS]

00:03:18   their face and then but not everybody of [TS]

00:03:20   course but you know but more people can [TS]

00:03:22   I think then can take out their finger [TS]

00:03:24   all the time and there's the wonderful [TS]

00:03:26   because accessibility option where you [TS]

00:03:28   can turn off the looking at it attention [TS]

00:03:30   detection so in case people you know [TS]

00:03:33   can't use their eyes that way then you [TS]

00:03:37   know they don't have to be directly [TS]

00:03:38   looking at the screen for it to unlock [TS]

00:03:40   you know so like there's there's that [TS]

00:03:41   kind of accommodation and you're never [TS]

00:03:43   going to find a system with this that [TS]

00:03:44   accommodates everybody but it does seem [TS]

00:03:47   like face ID probably accommodates more [TS]

00:03:49   situations than touch ID did one of you [TS]

00:03:53   like to tell me about why the [TS]

00:03:54   multitasking gesture feels different on [TS]

00:03:57   springboard this is me that I'm the one [TS]

00:03:59   who last week described how I I couldn't [TS]

00:04:02   bring up the multitasking switcher [TS]

00:04:03   reliably from springboard versus doing [TS]

00:04:06   it from an in applications so much so [TS]

00:04:08   that I initially thought it wasn't even [TS]

00:04:09   possible to bring up the Moses and [TS]

00:04:11   Twitter from springboard and I pretty [TS]

00:04:13   quickly figured out why after the show [TS]

00:04:14   and back and looked at it more closely [TS]

00:04:16   and it has to do with something that we [TS]

00:04:18   talked about which is animations on when [TS]

00:04:22   you do the multitasking gesture on us [TS]

00:04:25   that contains an application as you [TS]

00:04:28   start to do the swipe up thing whether [TS]

00:04:31   you're gonna like take a hard ride and [TS]

00:04:33   go multitasking or go up in an angle and [TS]

00:04:35   go to multitasking or go straighter up [TS]

00:04:38   and go to the homescreen no matter what [TS]

00:04:40   one of those things you're doing as [TS]

00:04:41   you're doing the gesture the application [TS]

00:04:44   that was in the foreground starts to [TS]

00:04:46   like shrink and move upward like it [TS]

00:04:48   doesn't follow your finger exactly but [TS]

00:04:50   it reacts to what your finger is doing [TS]

00:04:52   in a reasonably linear way I'm swiping [TS]

00:04:55   up at the far farther up I go the more [TS]

00:04:57   shrinky the front thing gets and you [TS]

00:05:00   know if I flick to the right I see the [TS]

00:05:01   little mostly fasten thing or whatever [TS]

00:05:02   um if you do it on springboard the [TS]

00:05:08   screen reacts to you're scrolling upward [TS]

00:05:12   from the bottom like it doesn't just sit [TS]

00:05:13   there and not move at all it does sort [TS]

00:05:15   of start to shrink and move a little bit [TS]

00:05:17   but then it stops shrinking and moving [TS]

00:05:20   and it's kind of inert for a period of [TS]

00:05:23   time if you successfully complete the [TS]

00:05:25   gesture the multitasking switcher [TS]

00:05:27   appears if you don't successfully [TS]

00:05:29   complete it it snaps back to where it [TS]

00:05:31   was and that discontinuity like the fact [TS]

00:05:35   that there was a different relationship [TS]

00:05:38   between what my finger was doing what [TS]

00:05:40   was on the screen was apparently enough [TS]

00:05:42   to make me think it wasn't possible [TS]

00:05:45   initially and then fail at it away [TS]

00:05:47   higher percentage of the time then on [TS]

00:05:49   other screens so what I've been trying [TS]

00:05:52   to do is break that connection which is [TS]

00:05:55   hard for me because I'm a visual person [TS]

00:05:56   and I you know like that when things are [TS]

00:06:00   connected in that way it makes sense to [TS]

00:06:01   me when they're not connected it feels [TS]

00:06:02   like things are broken but to say look [TS]

00:06:04   the screen is not gonna react the same [TS]

00:06:05   way in springboard just do the gesture [TS]

00:06:07   right just do your little J turn do your [TS]

00:06:09   little angle swipe do whatever it is you [TS]

00:06:10   have to do to make N and have faith that [TS]

00:06:13   even though the screen stops reaction to [TS]

00:06:15   your sliding finger just keep sliding it [TS]

00:06:17   just just keep sliding swipe me just [TS]

00:06:19   keep swiping and have some confidence [TS]

00:06:21   now I still am less successful and it [TS]

00:06:24   could be that I need some kind of [TS]

00:06:26   feedback to match up with my like yeah [TS]

00:06:29   you know yeah your thumbs making a right [TS]

00:06:31   turn yeah it's gonna happen for you see [TS]

00:06:33   how the little thing is moving to the [TS]

00:06:34   right a little bit like I don't know you [TS]

00:06:35   know what the disconnect is there but I [TS]

00:06:38   did [TS]

00:06:38   that I'm not the only one a lot of [TS]

00:06:40   people did tweet at me and tell me they [TS]

00:06:42   some people also thought it wasn't [TS]

00:06:44   possible from springboard until they [TS]

00:06:45   heard the program some people knew it [TS]

00:06:47   was possible but have much more [TS]

00:06:48   difficulty doing it and then of course [TS]

00:06:49   there are all the people who are the [TS]

00:06:51   equivalent of taptic like wizards like I [TS]

00:06:52   had no problem at a single time I just [TS]

00:06:55   exact 45-degree line with my thumb it [TS]

00:06:57   happens every single time so whatever [TS]

00:07:00   everyone has difficult in ass [TS]

00:07:02   accessibility issue everyone has [TS]

00:07:03   different difficult different abilities [TS]

00:07:06   to swipe but I think the difficulty on [TS]

00:07:10   spring work actually is explicable by [TS]

00:07:11   the by the difference in animation [TS]

00:07:14   because that is the only difference as [TS]

00:07:16   far as I can tell like it's still like [TS]

00:07:17   the same gesture works in both places [TS]

00:07:19   the only difference is what happens on [TS]

00:07:20   your screen and if you have an [TS]

00:07:22   expectation of something that's going to [TS]

00:07:24   happen on your screen that it doesn't it [TS]

00:07:26   can cause you to to pause to rethink to [TS]

00:07:29   move your finger differently to stop [TS]

00:07:31   moving and all those things will mess up [TS]

00:07:32   your gesture so I'll keep practicing on [TS]

00:07:36   my wife's thumb in the meantime Apple [TS]

00:07:40   should consider doing something about [TS]

00:07:42   that J because I don't see any reason [TS]

00:07:43   why springboard can't have the same [TS]

00:07:46   animation my goal in the multitasking [TS]

00:07:48   obviously you're never going to go from [TS]

00:07:49   springboard to springboard so the only [TS]

00:07:51   animation that has to initiate is the [TS]

00:07:53   one that brings to the multitasking [TS]

00:07:54   switcher and if you bail on the gesture [TS]

00:07:56   yeah it'll snap back to where it's plus [TS]

00:07:57   but I don't see why it doesn't do [TS]

00:07:59   doesn't follow your thumb the full way [TS]

00:08:01   through the gesture to give you the [TS]

00:08:03   confidence to know that it's gonna [TS]

00:08:04   happen for you the multitasking screen [TS]

00:08:06   is gonna come up yeah it is weird I've [TS]

00:08:10   noticed that as well that it's super [TS]

00:08:12   peculiar speaking of things that I think [TS]

00:08:15   you said John last episode I got this [TS]

00:08:18   phone for $50 and it's fine tell me more [TS]

00:08:20   about that's still funny that was just [TS]

00:08:22   me describing my sister getting her [TS]

00:08:25   phone and how I wasn't able to answer [TS]

00:08:26   get an iPhone and you know it occurred [TS]

00:08:28   to me that would be good slogan for [TS]

00:08:30   Android and some people took that and [TS]

00:08:31   ran with it [TS]

00:08:32   but I did want to offer some [TS]

00:08:34   clarification because some people [TS]

00:08:35   thought it was like they were putting [TS]

00:08:38   down Android that is you know the [TS]

00:08:39   pejorative like oh this $50 phone bought [TS]

00:08:43   a piece of crap right my main point was [TS]

00:08:45   the opposite that the Android phone you [TS]

00:08:48   can can you can get for $50 is fine [TS]

00:08:52   right and if you're not as I said a [TS]

00:08:53   phone enthusiast or like an Apple [TS]

00:08:57   enthusiast or a gadget head or someone [TS]

00:09:01   who appreciates the ways in which iOS [TS]

00:09:04   differs from Android the supposed [TS]

00:09:07   superiority of iOS or Apple hardware [TS]

00:09:10   anything like that does not even come [TS]

00:09:12   close to overcoming the price difference [TS]

00:09:15   right so I got this one $40 and it's [TS]

00:09:18   fine sounds like you know like Apple [TS]

00:09:22   people you end up but really if Apple's [TS]

00:09:24   problem in that if the $50 phone is fine [TS]

00:09:26   Apple has a problem there and the second [TS]

00:09:28   aspect is people say well I don't I do [TS]

00:09:30   appreciate those differences I just you [TS]

00:09:32   know I do like high-tech gadgets I just [TS]

00:09:34   don't like iOS or I like Android phones [TS]

00:09:36   better or you know whatever those are [TS]

00:09:37   the people who are shopping for the [TS]

00:09:38   high-end fancy Android phones and those [TS]

00:09:41   people are insulted that we thought they [TS]

00:09:42   said if you're a gadget nerd obviously [TS]

00:09:44   you're gonna like iOS and if you're nan [TS]

00:09:46   gadget nerd then Android is fine for you [TS]

00:09:47   and that wasn't my intention I can [TS]

00:09:50   understand where you got that impression [TS]

00:09:51   but yeah of course if you don't like iOS [TS]

00:09:55   at all but also like high-tech fancy [TS]

00:09:57   phones yeah you're also gonna shop for [TS]

00:09:59   an Android but you're not gonna pay $50 [TS]

00:10:01   for it is what I'm getting out there [TS]

00:10:02   like you're gonna actually pay the big [TS]

00:10:04   money for the fanciest highest and [TS]

00:10:05   Android phone and that phone is not [TS]

00:10:07   going to cost you $50 so you are [TS]

00:10:09   excluded from this guy I got this one [TS]

00:10:10   for the LSM it's fine the only thing I [TS]

00:10:12   can say for those people is you do have [TS]

00:10:14   to make do with a slower CPU sorry about [TS]

00:10:17   that [TS]

00:10:17   but that if you like Android and the [TS]

00:10:21   control it offers and all the various [TS]

00:10:23   features that Andros has that that iOS [TS]

00:10:25   doesn't like a configurable set of [TS]

00:10:27   widgets on your lockscreen and all that [TS]

00:10:29   good stuff [TS]

00:10:29   then yeah go for it but yeah my main [TS]

00:10:32   point is I got this one $50 and it's [TS]

00:10:34   fine sounds insulting if you're an Apple [TS]

00:10:37   snob but really it constitutes a semi [TS]

00:10:40   real problem for Apple because the fifty [TS]

00:10:42   dollar phone is fine why the hell are we [TS]

00:10:44   all paying $1200 for an iPhone 10 yep [TS]

00:10:47   Duncan Stevenson price writes in [TS]

00:10:49   regarding Apple Care Plus did you guys [TS]

00:10:51   know that you can get a pro-rata refund [TS]

00:10:53   on the plan if you change your iPhone [TS]

00:10:55   after one year this changes the math [TS]

00:10:57   this individual wrote maths that's [TS]

00:10:59   incorrect [TS]

00:11:00   this changes the math a little though [TS]

00:11:02   admittedly not the overall thrust of [TS]

00:11:03   your argument against buying it [TS]

00:11:05   I had no idea that that was possible and [TS]

00:11:07   and I don't recall how they said that [TS]

00:11:10   you go about doing that because I think [TS]

00:11:11   they did include it in their email but [TS]

00:11:13   apparently there's a way to get a bit of [TS]

00:11:15   a refund on your Apple Care Plus I don't [TS]

00:11:17   get a phone every year so I didn't know [TS]

00:11:19   about this at all but - you - who do get [TS]

00:11:21   a phone every you should try that if you [TS]

00:11:23   know Casey you bought the Apple care [TS]

00:11:24   this time next time you go to get a [TS]

00:11:26   phone say Duncan told you you're [TS]

00:11:28   supposed to get some of the money back [TS]

00:11:30   for Apple care and see what they do well [TS]

00:11:31   I did not get AppleCare this time but I [TS]

00:11:33   know you did no no no I got a while I [TS]

00:11:36   did get AppleCare it's a $50 leather [TS]

00:11:38   case remind me of this when I still [TS]

00:11:40   shadow my phone that's right Stephen [TS]

00:11:43   Harrison writes you mentioned that it is [TS]

00:11:44   not possible to remove individual keys [TS]

00:11:46   on the new keyboards well I just had a [TS]

00:11:48   faulty B key on my macbook pro and the [TS]

00:11:52   first thing they did the Genius Bar was [TS]

00:11:53   take it out back that sounds awkward and [TS]

00:11:55   removed the offending geek app to check [TS]

00:11:57   for dust etc underneath from what I [TS]

00:12:00   could gather they have a special device [TS]

00:12:01   or machine for removing keys so it's not [TS]

00:12:03   something one could do at home but it's [TS]

00:12:04   possible in the end I still had a new [TS]

00:12:07   top case with the accompanying touch pad [TS]

00:12:09   our trackpad touch bar and battery etc [TS]

00:12:11   there's been a lot of talk about whether [TS]

00:12:15   or not you can remove individual keys in [TS]

00:12:17   a non-destructive way and Stephen [TS]

00:12:19   certainly thinks that it's possible [TS]

00:12:21   although he ended up going the destroy [TS]

00:12:22   they ended up going the destructive [TS]

00:12:24   route in his behalf anyway so what we [TS]

00:12:27   heard from geniuses in a past feedback [TS]

00:12:29   is yeah of course you can get the key [TS]

00:12:31   caps off right but that the process of [TS]

00:12:34   removing them has such a high chance of [TS]

00:12:36   bending or breaking one of the very very [TS]

00:12:39   tiny very delicate plastic pins that [TS]

00:12:41   holds these things together that the [TS]

00:12:45   geniuses you wrote to us that basically [TS]

00:12:46   I've never seen anyone pull it off [TS]

00:12:47   successfully or the success rate is so [TS]

00:12:49   low that it's not even worth trying so I [TS]

00:12:51   don't doubt that they still try to do it [TS]

00:12:53   but I wonder like why did this person [TS]

00:12:55   get a new keyboard possibly because they [TS]

00:12:57   got the key cap off and they thought [TS]

00:13:00   they had done it successfully and they [TS]

00:13:01   tried to put it back on and realize [TS]

00:13:02   they'd accidentally bent one of the [TS]

00:13:03   little tiny pins and it's like well [TS]

00:13:04   that's it game over because there's no [TS]

00:13:06   repairing a bent pin there's no [TS]

00:13:07   repairing a broken pen if you don't get [TS]

00:13:10   it off cleanly and get it back on [TS]

00:13:12   cleanly then its whole new top case with [TS]

00:13:15   just one of the many reasons that this [TS]

00:13:16   keyboard is not friendly to repair [TS]

00:13:18   yeah it seems like the the rate at which [TS]

00:13:22   they're able to properly rescue it with [TS]

00:13:24   some kind of replacement in store or [TS]

00:13:26   some kind of like you know not replacing [TS]

00:13:28   the entire top case the the the number [TS]

00:13:30   of problems that are solved that way [TS]

00:13:32   seems significantly smaller than the [TS]

00:13:34   number that require a whole top case [TS]

00:13:36   replacement anyway so what however the [TS]

00:13:38   multiple parts inside the keys work out [TS]

00:13:39   however the serviceability works out the [TS]

00:13:42   reality is this is a incredibly service [TS]

00:13:46   unfriendly problem I also you know on [TS]

00:13:49   this topic there's been some number of [TS]

00:13:51   good discussions about this on connected [TS]

00:13:53   with Stephen Hackett and because he was [TS]

00:13:55   a genius back in the day and he you know [TS]

00:13:58   he he mentioned that like the idea of [TS]

00:14:01   one bad key requiring the replacement of [TS]

00:14:04   the entire top case of the computer and [TS]

00:14:06   the entire top case being a very [TS]

00:14:09   expensive repair because the entire [TS]

00:14:11   computer is basically built under it so [TS]

00:14:12   you have to like basically take the [TS]

00:14:14   entire computer apart in order to [TS]

00:14:16   replace that and put it back together he [TS]

00:14:18   mentioned that this is actually not new [TS]

00:14:20   to this current generation of MacBook [TS]

00:14:22   Pros this started with the unibody back [TS]

00:14:24   what was at 2011 that the unibody [TS]

00:14:27   started 2010 something like that and [TS]

00:14:29   ever since the unibody MacBook Pros [TS]

00:14:31   you've had to replace the entire top [TS]

00:14:34   case and it's been a lot of work if the [TS]

00:14:36   keyboard breaks in certain ways the main [TS]

00:14:38   difference with the new ones is that not [TS]

00:14:41   only are the keys more likely to break [TS]

00:14:43   in a way that requires top case [TS]

00:14:45   replacement into the older keys you had [TS]

00:14:47   a better chance of servicing individual [TS]

00:14:48   key caps but also as we know the new [TS]

00:14:52   ones have such an incredibly high key [TS]

00:14:55   failure rate with whatever-it-is specks [TS]

00:14:57   of dust things bending whatever the [TS]

00:14:58   problem ends up being with these we know [TS]

00:15:00   that they are failing way more often [TS]

00:15:02   than they used to so the the whole top [TS]

00:15:05   case being required thing is not new but [TS]

00:15:07   the rate of failure and how severe the [TS]

00:15:11   failures are now does seem very new and [TS]

00:15:14   even the old keyboards with the scissor [TS]

00:15:15   switches I've manually tried to repair [TS]

00:15:18   many of those and they have a lesser [TS]

00:15:19   version of the same problem removing the [TS]

00:15:22   key caps from an older or scissor switch [TS]

00:15:23   keyboard is possible but there is some [TS]

00:15:27   fairly high chance that you will bend or [TS]

00:15:30   break one of the little pin [TS]

00:15:31   I think I think mostly I bent them I [TS]

00:15:33   don't think know if I ever really broke [TS]

00:15:34   one off but I definitely bent them in my [TS]

00:15:37   attempts to repair things both on the [TS]

00:15:38   the laptop keyboards and on these same [TS]

00:15:40   scissors which is that are in the like [TS]

00:15:42   extended aluminum keyboard and stuff [TS]

00:15:44   it's pretty easy to mangle the tiny semi [TS]

00:15:49   clear pieces of plastic in there because [TS]

00:15:50   it's basically like a bunch of little [TS]

00:15:52   plastic Hindi mechanisms with these [TS]

00:15:54   little little feet little legs little [TS]

00:15:56   cylindrical sticks that snap into these [TS]

00:16:00   little C shaped clamps on the key cap or [TS]

00:16:02   at least with a scissors it was I [TS]

00:16:03   imagine it's similar with the with the [TS]

00:16:05   new butterfly ones and that's just [TS]

00:16:08   that's just a really difficult thing to [TS]

00:16:10   to work with you kind of have to do a [TS]

00:16:12   lot of them blind where you just have to [TS]

00:16:13   get the pieces of line correctly put the [TS]

00:16:15   cap on and then just press down and hope [TS]

00:16:16   everything snaps in all at once it's not [TS]

00:16:19   not particularly friendly to repair it [TS]

00:16:22   never hasn't been it just seems like [TS]

00:16:23   these new ones are even smaller and the [TS]

00:16:25   little leggy things are even finer you [TS]

00:16:27   can find some good like sort of macro [TS]

00:16:29   photography of it online if you search [TS]

00:16:30   but it's not something that I would want [TS]

00:16:32   to repair and I'm sure there are lots of [TS]

00:16:34   sort of gung-ho geniuses who are like [TS]

00:16:35   I'm gonna do it this is gonna be the [TS]

00:16:37   time I'm gonna get the key cap off and I [TS]

00:16:38   never get it back on and everything's [TS]

00:16:40   gonna work until the next speck of dust [TS]

00:16:41   but you know they know that if they if [TS]

00:16:44   they blow it [TS]

00:16:44   475 dollars or whatever it is yeah [TS]

00:16:47   that's rough I see the notes here about [TS]

00:16:51   the OLED display but I have a feeling [TS]

00:16:52   that somebody's trying to tell a story [TS]

00:16:54   with them so rather than flub my way [TS]

00:16:56   through it and whoever I'm assuming this [TS]

00:16:57   is John do you want to talk about this I [TS]

00:16:59   think we touched on this in many past [TS]

00:17:01   shows in terms of burn in on the old [TS]

00:17:02   LEDs and everything and things Apple [TS]

00:17:04   might be doing that acknowledge the fact [TS]

00:17:06   that has burned them whether it be the [TS]

00:17:07   the 30-second timeout on the thing which [TS]

00:17:09   by the way some people say is not new [TS]

00:17:11   and just a bug or happened with non [TS]

00:17:13   iPhone 10 so who knows that's still [TS]

00:17:14   mysterious but this the the burnin of [TS]

00:17:18   the OLED is communicated in various [TS]

00:17:19   Apple tech notes it's also communicated [TS]

00:17:21   in iOS itself if you look at the auto [TS]

00:17:24   brightness setting on a non iPhone 10 it [TS]

00:17:28   says auto brightness on and often [TS]

00:17:29   there's a little descriptive text [TS]

00:17:30   underneath it says turning off auto [TS]

00:17:31   brightness way affect the battery life [TS]

00:17:33   right so that was the old message like [TS]

00:17:34   hey if you don't let the phone sense how [TS]

00:17:36   much life there is in the room and doom [TS]

00:17:38   itself if you just set it keep a [TS]

00:17:39   brightness and set it that way all the [TS]

00:17:40   time even in the pitch dark room it may [TS]

00:17:43   affect battery life we're just [TS]

00:17:44   may lessen your battery life right the [TS]

00:17:46   new thing if you have an iPhone 10 on [TS]

00:17:49   that very same switch says turning off [TS]

00:17:52   auto brightness may affect battery life [TS]

00:17:53   and long-term display performance so [TS]

00:17:56   they added some words to that and what [TS]

00:17:57   they mean by long-term display [TS]

00:17:59   performance is that if you turn off auto [TS]

00:18:02   brightness crank it to max brightness [TS]

00:18:04   and don't let it dim itself even in a [TS]

00:18:06   dark room you're probably gonna get [TS]

00:18:08   burnin sooner than if you didn't do that [TS]

00:18:10   because one of the tools like you know [TS]

00:18:12   if you read the Apple Doc's they in [TS]

00:18:14   typical sort of marketing PR speak they [TS]

00:18:16   say the Apple display and iPhone 10 and [TS]

00:18:19   whatever blah blah blah have been [TS]

00:18:20   engineered to reduce burnin and there [TS]

00:18:22   are many aspects to being engineered to [TS]

00:18:24   reduce burnin one of those aspects is [TS]

00:18:26   our software will try to prevent burnin [TS]

00:18:29   by trying to be nice to your screen will [TS]

00:18:31   adjust the brightness down so it's not a [TS]

00:18:32   max brightness in a dark room well dim [TS]

00:18:35   as soon as we possibly can [TS]

00:18:36   we'll try to pay attention to whether [TS]

00:18:37   you're looking at the screen so we know [TS]

00:18:39   when we can dim and also the way the [TS]

00:18:41   screen is built to be resistant to burn [TS]

00:18:43   and whatever that involves so it's it's [TS]

00:18:44   the whole package it's not just [TS]

00:18:45   hardware's not just software it's [TS]

00:18:46   everything and part of that is you [TS]

00:18:49   taking you know some responsibility in [TS]

00:18:51   your own hands if you tweak the settings [TS]

00:18:53   if you if you put the brightness to max [TS]

00:18:55   turn off auto brightness and probably [TS]

00:18:57   also turn off true tone and put your [TS]

00:18:59   sleep your display sleep time around 5 [TS]

00:19:01   minutes you are probably gonna get burn [TS]

00:19:04   in sooner and more severely than someone [TS]

00:19:06   who leaves it in the default setting so [TS]

00:19:08   welcome to my world of plasma television [TS]

00:19:10   ownership yeah this is probably my only [TS]

00:19:14   long-term concern about the iPhone 10 [TS]

00:19:16   and using all that screens in general on [TS]

00:19:18   the iPhone which you know this is not [TS]

00:19:20   gonna be the first phone to do this I [TS]

00:19:21   mean sorry the only phone to do this [TS]

00:19:23   because we really don't know what they [TS]

00:19:27   mean by critical word here long term if [TS]

00:19:31   you actually use your phone with the [TS]

00:19:33   screen on a lot because if you're using [TS]

00:19:36   it the screen is going to be on a lot [TS]

00:19:37   and many parts of iOS are always in the [TS]

00:19:40   same place like status bar items and the [TS]

00:19:41   home indicator and stuff when they say [TS]

00:19:43   long term sure to refer to OLED problems [TS]

00:19:48   well how long what are we talking here [TS]

00:19:50   are we talking a few months are we [TS]

00:19:53   talking a year a few years you know cuz [TS]

00:19:55   that like I feel like whatever the [TS]

00:19:58   number actually is there makes a great [TS]

00:20:00   deal of difference on to what we should [TS]

00:20:02   do and how big those problems are you [TS]

00:20:04   know if it if it turns out that OLED [TS]

00:20:07   screened iPhones are going to have like [TS]

00:20:10   really annoying screen flaws eight [TS]

00:20:13   months into ownership that's gonna be a [TS]

00:20:15   really big problem even if they're gonna [TS]

00:20:17   have really annoying flaws after two [TS]

00:20:19   years of ownership that's gonna really [TS]

00:20:20   impact the used market so either way [TS]

00:20:23   like if this is at all like likely to [TS]

00:20:26   have serious display flaws during the [TS]

00:20:29   useful lifetime of the product that's [TS]

00:20:32   gonna be a big problem down the road and [TS]

00:20:34   I really hope it's not that bad I think [TS]

00:20:37   it will probably be okay just because [TS]

00:20:39   Apple seemed so aware of this issue and [TS]

00:20:41   Apple held off on OS for such a long [TS]

00:20:43   time and also the whole rest of the [TS]

00:20:45   industry meaning Android is that all it [TS]

00:20:47   screens for so long that I feel like [TS]

00:20:49   it's it's not a it shouldn't be a [TS]

00:20:51   mystery Apple is not the first you know [TS]

00:20:53   companies putting all it in its phone so [TS]

00:20:56   we should have data from all the many [TS]

00:20:57   many years of OLED Android phones of [TS]

00:21:00   what their performance characteristics [TS]

00:21:02   are like and how bad burnin is and then [TS]

00:21:04   Apple of course waiting until it gets [TS]

00:21:06   just the right display hopefully has one [TS]

00:21:08   that is better in all ways that they can [TS]

00:21:10   make it better including burnin so my [TS]

00:21:13   advice to people is to not be as [TS]

00:21:15   obsessed about this as I am with my [TS]

00:21:16   closet Intellivision and just you know [TS]

00:21:20   use sensible settings maybe just take [TS]

00:21:22   the defaults if you don't know what [TS]

00:21:23   sensible settings are leave [TS]

00:21:25   auto-brightness on don't crank your [TS]

00:21:27   brightness to max if you can help it [TS]

00:21:30   let your display go to sleep but in [TS]

00:21:33   general just use your phone because I my [TS]

00:21:35   prediction is that image retention will [TS]

00:21:39   not be a problem on the average lights [TS]

00:21:41   lifetime of a newly bought iPhone 10 [TS]

00:21:44   because I would imagine the average [TS]

00:21:45   lifetime a newly bought iPhone 10 is [TS]

00:21:46   probably like two points something years [TS]

00:21:49   right because if you buy the fancy [TS]

00:21:51   iPhone 10 probably you're gonna want to [TS]

00:21:53   buy a new one or within at least two [TS]

00:21:54   years and maybe there's some long-tailed [TS]

00:21:56   people who try to keep them for much [TS]

00:21:57   longer right because it's an expensive [TS]

00:21:59   phone it may be more of a problem when [TS]

00:22:01   OLED travels down the line to the [TS]

00:22:03   cheaper phones that tend to be kept [TS]

00:22:04   longer and Marco's right about the used [TS]

00:22:05   market but you know I don't know how [TS]

00:22:08   much people buy their phones [TS]

00:22:11   contingent on the idea of being able to [TS]

00:22:13   sell them for you haven't have them [TS]

00:22:14   having high resale value I'm not sure [TS]

00:22:16   how common that is versus trade-ins [TS]

00:22:17   which that's the good thing about trade [TS]

00:22:19   ins is you're not getting a big great [TS]

00:22:20   deal on trade ins anyway but I don't [TS]

00:22:22   think Apple's gonna give you guff about [TS]

00:22:23   trading in your phone for their like [TS]

00:22:24   update program if you've got image [TS]

00:22:26   retention because like look it's your [TS]

00:22:27   damn phone Apple that's not my fault it [TS]

00:22:28   is every time you take my phone and give [TS]

00:22:30   me a pittance for it so I'm I'm not that [TS]

00:22:34   concerned also when I look at my plasma [TS]

00:22:37   television that is how I don't know how [TS]

00:22:39   old it is but it's longer there's older [TS]

00:22:40   than two years old and plasmas are just [TS]

00:22:42   notorious for image retention I don't [TS]

00:22:46   know what the oled characteristics of [TS]

00:22:47   remnant retention are but i'm pretty [TS]

00:22:49   convinced that the characteristics are [TS]

00:22:50   plasma or the are that if you are [TS]

00:22:52   patient enough you could your destiny [TS]

00:22:54   HUD will go away in a year right I don't [TS]

00:22:56   know if that helps the resale market or [TS]

00:22:58   makes people feel better but you know [TS]

00:23:01   I'm actually kind of optimistic about [TS]

00:23:02   this having been in the burnin wars for [TS]

00:23:05   many many years and finally having seen [TS]

00:23:10   so many people in real life you use [TS]

00:23:13   absolutely shattered cell phones like [TS]

00:23:16   smartphones just completely destroyed [TS]

00:23:19   like not just little spiderweb or a [TS]

00:23:21   crack here or there but like whole giant [TS]

00:23:23   glass chips missing circuit boards [TS]

00:23:25   exposed like one step short of sparks [TS]

00:23:29   flying from the phone as they use it I [TS]

00:23:31   have a hard time believing that the [TS]

00:23:33   average person will be thwarted from [TS]

00:23:34   using their phone because it has image [TS]

00:23:35   retention honey because that's not even [TS]

00:23:38   a physical defect like tactile disa and [TS]

00:23:41   defect like they can feel that's just [TS]

00:23:43   like the home indicator always looking [TS]

00:23:45   like it's on the screen but whatever so [TS]

00:23:46   I think it'll be okay but if you're a [TS]

00:23:49   super paranoid nerd about it you know [TS]

00:23:52   take a look at your phone in a year or [TS]

00:23:53   two and I don't know Marco will put a [TS]

00:23:56   free app on the App Store that puts a [TS]

00:23:57   checkerboard pattern on your screen that [TS]

00:23:59   turns it into grey yeah I really hope [TS]

00:24:04   that this is a non-issue but like it my [TS]

00:24:06   concern is you know so they set it at [TS]

00:24:09   the 30 second by default screens sleep [TS]

00:24:12   which I hate and thank God I turned it [TS]

00:24:13   off my concern is if I since I raised [TS]

00:24:18   that to five minutes if my if I get bad [TS]

00:24:21   image retention on my screen in six [TS]

00:24:22   months are they [TS]

00:24:25   you slash all the crazy Apple defenders [TS]

00:24:27   on Twitter going to say well I was doing [TS]

00:24:29   it wrong I was using this option that I [TS]

00:24:31   shouldn't have been using like is that [TS]

00:24:32   gonna be my fault [TS]

00:24:33   because I changed this annoying setting [TS]

00:24:35   back to where it was on all LCD phones [TS]

00:24:36   before that it said may affect battery [TS]

00:24:38   life and long-term display performance [TS]

00:24:40   Marco can't you read you know it does [TS]

00:24:45   say that and yeah that will contribute [TS]

00:24:46   to it but like that I don't think [TS]

00:24:48   there's any consequences like they're [TS]

00:24:50   not going to say you know you like if [TS]

00:24:52   you bring it in with image retention I'm [TS]

00:24:54   not sure what their their deal with it [TS]

00:24:55   but same thing with the iMac like if you [TS]

00:24:57   just let your iMac screen dim more often [TS]

00:24:59   or move your windows around more often [TS]

00:25:00   maybe you'd have less image retention [TS]

00:25:01   but it still just replaces green for you [TS]

00:25:03   right I wonder if there is it's kind of [TS]

00:25:06   like if you use launch control on us on [TS]

00:25:08   a sports car there's there's there's [TS]

00:25:10   always like it's always like [TS]

00:25:11   conventional wisdom that like there's a [TS]

00:25:12   counter for that right and like if you [TS]

00:25:14   burn out the engine like they'll check [TS]

00:25:16   that counter or you do any launch [TS]

00:25:18   controls like they won't serve as your [TS]

00:25:19   car like is it like a counter on the [TS]

00:25:20   iPhone of like how many times a day that [TS]

00:25:22   I've let it reach that's like five max [TS]

00:25:27   brightness for five minutes [TS]

00:25:30   sorry sir we can't replace this panel [TS]

00:25:32   you change this one setting too much [TS]

00:25:34   it's been in the bathroom red flag John [TS]

00:25:39   red flag it was actually a tag that [TS]

00:25:41   wasn't it wasn't the proper tag we are [TS]

00:25:45   sponsored this week by fracture who [TS]

00:25:47   prints photos directly onto glass visit [TS]

00:25:50   fracture dot me and get 50% off your [TS]

00:25:53   first order with code 80 P 17 fracture [TS]

00:25:56   prints photos on glass this is an [TS]

00:25:58   amazing looking print you can hang it on [TS]

00:26:01   the wall you can prop it up on a desk [TS]

00:26:02   you can give them as gifts you can keep [TS]

00:26:04   them in your own house or office they [TS]

00:26:06   look great they get tons of compliments [TS]

00:26:08   I have them all over my house all over [TS]

00:26:11   my office I have photos I've gotten my [TS]

00:26:13   app icons printed and little square ones [TS]

00:26:15   and hanging like a little trophy app [TS]

00:26:17   icon wall up above in my office here [TS]

00:26:19   we've given lots of them as gifts to [TS]

00:26:21   family members and friends things like [TS]

00:26:23   if you have you know a cute picture of [TS]

00:26:25   your kid or pet you can give them to [TS]

00:26:27   other people who might appreciate that [TS]

00:26:29   and your family and friends they make [TS]

00:26:31   wonderful wonderful decorations for your [TS]

00:26:33   home or gifts and the photos really look [TS]

00:26:35   great the colors really pop the contrast [TS]

00:26:37   is really perfect [TS]

00:26:38   and it really just goes edge to edge [TS]

00:26:40   with the coupe with the photo print it [TS]

00:26:42   looks clean and sleek and modern without [TS]

00:26:45   really needing any other ornamentation [TS]

00:26:47   you don't need like a big frame around [TS]

00:26:48   it or anything else like that so it's [TS]

00:26:50   incredibly practical it's also [TS]

00:26:52   incredibly economical you don't have to [TS]

00:26:54   buy a frame or get it framed fractures [TS]

00:26:56   are just great [TS]

00:26:57   ordering is simple and fracture prints [TS]

00:26:59   come ready to display right out of the [TS]

00:27:01   box they even include the wall hanger if [TS]

00:27:03   you need it and they are a green company [TS]

00:27:05   operating a carbon-neutral factory right [TS]

00:27:08   here in Gainesville Florida from us [TS]

00:27:10   source materials so you can feel good [TS]

00:27:11   about it but fracture wants you to know [TS]

00:27:13   that around the holiday season [TS]

00:27:14   they really get booked up quickly and in [TS]

00:27:17   the holiday season they get tons and [TS]

00:27:18   tons of orders because they make such [TS]

00:27:19   great gifts so if you're gonna point if [TS]

00:27:21   you're gonna order fracture prints for [TS]

00:27:23   out the holiday season get your orders [TS]

00:27:25   in now today not next week get them in [TS]

00:27:28   today just so you can make sure you get [TS]

00:27:30   it on time so check it out today at [TS]

00:27:32   fracks your dot me and get 15% off your [TS]

00:27:35   first order with code ATP 17 thank you [TS]

00:27:38   so much to fracture for sponsoring our [TS]

00:27:40   show anyway at least a couple people [TS]

00:27:46   wrote in and were confused / perturbed [TS]

00:27:50   that we didn't really talk about the [TS]

00:27:52   iPhone 10 camera last week when we were [TS]

00:27:54   going over our impressions that's a fair [TS]

00:27:57   criticism and I don't have all that much [TS]

00:28:00   to say surprisingly I do really really [TS]

00:28:04   like portrait mode until Joe Steele [TS]

00:28:07   corrects me and shows me all the ways in [TS]

00:28:09   which portrait mode is terrible but my [TS]

00:28:13   eyes are not discerning enough to be [TS]

00:28:15   able to see in a lot of cases all the [TS]

00:28:18   places that portrait mode is just [TS]

00:28:20   falling on its face and and portrait [TS]

00:28:21   mode is where they get the fake boat [TS]

00:28:23   bouquet whatever however you pronounce [TS]

00:28:25   it the background blur and the depth of [TS]

00:28:27   field tricks is one of those words like [TS]

00:28:29   niche or niche where no matter how you [TS]

00:28:31   pronounce it everyone's gonna tell you [TS]

00:28:32   what you're wrong yeah so if I remember [TS]

00:28:35   I'll see if I can dig up some links for [TS]

00:28:37   the for the show notes but it followed [TS]

00:28:39   Joe Steele on Twitter he's funny and [TS]

00:28:41   he's he's good but anyways he has gone [TS]

00:28:43   through some of the pictures I've taken [TS]

00:28:45   and noted all the places that portrait [TS]

00:28:48   mode has been not as good [TS]

00:28:50   and it's funny because some of the [TS]

00:28:52   things that he's noted are extremely [TS]

00:28:55   obvious in retrospect but in the heat of [TS]

00:28:58   the moment I just don't notice them like [TS]

00:28:59   I think I had tweeted a picture of a cup [TS]

00:29:03   of Diet Coke at McDonald's to friend of [TS]

00:29:05   the show Alex Cox and half of the straw [TS]

00:29:08   was missing and I didn't even notice it [TS]

00:29:10   pointed it out like again it's super [TS]

00:29:12   obvious that I should have noticed I [TS]

00:29:14   just didn't and maybe it's because I'm [TS]

00:29:15   just predisposed to like this cuz this [TS]

00:29:17   is the first time I've had this in a [TS]

00:29:18   human-sized phone but uh but I really do [TS]

00:29:22   like portrait mode and I think it's [TS]

00:29:23   pretty cool it just has a lot of room to [TS]

00:29:25   improve but I don't know Marco what do [TS]

00:29:27   you think about the camera so I I had a [TS]

00:29:29   hard time evaluating the camera in any [TS]

00:29:31   kind of useful way to anybody else [TS]

00:29:32   because I didn't have the duels through [TS]

00:29:34   the dual lens camera from the 7 plus [TS]

00:29:35   bill I didn't I didn't do plus phones [TS]

00:29:38   before but my impressions of it with [TS]

00:29:40   that giant disclaimer you know aside [TS]

00:29:41   I love the regular cameras on this the [TS]

00:29:46   regular wide and the regular you know [TS]

00:29:49   quote telephoto which is not a telephoto [TS]

00:29:50   but I'll take it because it's it's like [TS]

00:29:52   a 45 millimeter ish equivalent something [TS]

00:29:54   like that so I very much enjoy that [TS]

00:29:57   focal length and and so I've really [TS]

00:30:00   enjoyed the camera using its regular [TS]

00:30:02   modes I have played a little bit with [TS]

00:30:04   portrait mode and portrait lighting and [TS]

00:30:07   have managed so far to take zero [TS]

00:30:09   acceptable pictures with it in addition [TS]

00:30:11   when I've seen other people's pictures [TS]

00:30:12   using these modes I have seen I'm pretty [TS]

00:30:16   sure 0 of them that I considered you [TS]

00:30:18   know good without without obvious [TS]

00:30:20   weirdness or flaws maybe it's because I [TS]

00:30:25   have a lot of experience shooting [TS]

00:30:27   pictures with big cameras and big glass [TS]

00:30:29   with proper background blur with shout [TS]

00:30:32   at the field but these the pictures from [TS]

00:30:35   portrait mode and not even getting into [TS]

00:30:37   portrait lighting which I think portrait [TS]

00:30:38   lighting is basically the same thing but [TS]

00:30:40   with some weird effects apply to the [TS]

00:30:41   same data that sometimes work but [TS]

00:30:44   usually don't portrait mode itself it [TS]

00:30:48   just always looks really bizarre to me [TS]

00:30:50   it never fools me into thinking that [TS]

00:30:53   this was taken with a shallow depth of [TS]

00:30:54   field and a lot of glass ideally it [TS]

00:30:58   shouldn't be perfect every time but it [TS]

00:31:00   should be able to provide that illusion [TS]

00:31:01   much of the time and to me it just [TS]

00:31:03   doesn't and they [TS]

00:31:04   maybe I'm just being too picky or too [TS]

00:31:06   observant or you know nitpicking on the [TS]

00:31:08   details but the problem with me you know [TS]

00:31:09   III basically have to two critical [TS]

00:31:11   problems with it [TS]

00:31:12   number one is obviously the depth map [TS]

00:31:15   that it captures just simply is not [TS]

00:31:17   granular enough it is not [TS]

00:31:19   high-resolution enough and you can see [TS]

00:31:21   they've actually been a couple of apps [TS]

00:31:22   one of them is called focus FOCS [TS]

00:31:26   this is really cool like 3d you can kind [TS]

00:31:30   of like it kind of like shows you the [TS]

00:31:31   picture in the 3d rendering as the depth [TS]

00:31:35   map and you can kind of turn it and you [TS]

00:31:37   can see like the different layers that [TS]

00:31:39   are captured in the depth map it's [TS]

00:31:40   really cool to see but you you can see [TS]

00:31:44   from these deaf math viewing apps that [TS]

00:31:47   the resolution of the depth data is not [TS]

00:31:51   very high it's not very granular it's [TS]

00:31:53   it's pretty coarse there's not that many [TS]

00:31:55   levels and there's and it's not doing [TS]

00:31:58   per pixel depth mapping so that's why [TS]

00:32:00   you can have like if somebody has like a [TS]

00:32:02   hair sticking out of their head that [TS]

00:32:05   hair will be blurred away in this effect [TS]

00:32:07   whereas on a real camera that hair if [TS]

00:32:09   the rest of her hair was InFocus that [TS]

00:32:10   hair being focused to and also in [TS]

00:32:13   Infinity starts like at the back of the [TS]

00:32:14   people's head like that only does it not [TS]

00:32:16   have a lot of levels but it uses up all [TS]

00:32:18   the levels on the stuff that's close to [TS]

00:32:19   you so it's like nose cheek ear back of [TS]

00:32:23   the head and that everything else is one [TS]

00:32:25   depth which is behind like the farthest [TS]

00:32:28   depth so when you do the 3d 3d thing and [TS]

00:32:30   you rotate it it looks like everyone's [TS]

00:32:31   head is embedded in a wall and that wall [TS]

00:32:33   is like here are the levels close closer [TS]

00:32:36   close nose and then everything else is [TS]

00:32:38   basically either infinity or whatever [TS]

00:32:40   that and so when they blur the [TS]

00:32:41   background they're blurring everything [TS]

00:32:43   that's beyond their last level of depth [TS]

00:32:45   resolution as if it's equidistant and [TS]

00:32:48   and it's not like the tree that's ten [TS]

00:32:50   feet from you is too different than the [TS]

00:32:51   tree that's forty feet from you but as [TS]

00:32:53   far as the blurring is concerned it has [TS]

00:32:55   no more depth information so it treats [TS]

00:32:56   them all the same which contributes to [TS]

00:32:58   the what Mark was talking about if you [TS]

00:33:00   know what it's supposed to look like and [TS]

00:33:02   you see these pictures it's so obvious [TS]

00:33:03   to you this something is off right so [TS]

00:33:06   like so you know problem number one is [TS]

00:33:08   that the depth information is not high [TS]

00:33:10   resolution enough to even do the effect [TS]

00:33:13   consistently around things like object [TS]

00:33:16   edges and that's that's where you [TS]

00:33:18   the obvious problems up here is you know [TS]

00:33:21   around edges you know edges of people's [TS]

00:33:22   heads edges of objects you know because [TS]

00:33:25   they're Justin's very course map and [TS]

00:33:27   they're trying to be smart about it and [TS]

00:33:28   they succeed sometimes but like even [TS]

00:33:31   apples example photos I remember like [TS]

00:33:34   when when the iPhone 8 and 10 we went [TS]

00:33:36   when their event happened and they put [TS]

00:33:38   up their big press pages on the site [TS]

00:33:39   even some of their example photos I [TS]

00:33:41   thought had obvious flaws from the [TS]

00:33:43   algorithm so again maybe I'm just seen [TS]

00:33:46   this too much but they're not capturing [TS]

00:33:48   enough resolution of depth data to be [TS]

00:33:51   able to do the edges correctly that's [TS]

00:33:54   why edges always look weird and fuzzy [TS]

00:33:55   and they blur things that shouldn't be [TS]

00:33:57   blurred and vice versa sometimes and the [TS]

00:34:01   other problem is which on set the blur [TS]

00:34:04   doesn't look right like if if you have [TS]

00:34:06   seen actual you know blur photos from [TS]

00:34:09   real optics more than a few times you [TS]

00:34:13   will probably recognize that the type [TS]

00:34:16   and look of the blur in these portrait [TS]

00:34:18   mode photos isn't right like and and [TS]

00:34:21   it's hard to put into words why but it's [TS]

00:34:24   just not the right kind of blur it [TS]

00:34:26   doesn't look the way it would look for a [TS]

00:34:28   lens even if the def map was perfect and [TS]

00:34:31   they were able to do it pixel by pixel [TS]

00:34:32   the blur is still wrong and so the end [TS]

00:34:35   and it looks it just looks like a filter [TS]

00:34:38   it looks like a like a cheap image [TS]

00:34:40   editing filter that's trying to cover up [TS]

00:34:43   bad optics which it is so so well you [TS]

00:34:47   know not not bad small optics that are [TS]

00:34:49   not designed for this now so all that [TS]

00:34:52   being said I am very very happy with the [TS]

00:34:55   camera without any of these tricks it's [TS]

00:34:58   a fantastic camera and you don't need [TS]

00:35:02   the portrait crazy effects that all look [TS]

00:35:05   weird and blur the edges of your dog off [TS]

00:35:06   you don't need those to make this camera [TS]

00:35:09   look amazing they're a fun trick they're [TS]

00:35:11   a fun demo I'm sure and I'm sure people [TS]

00:35:13   have fun with them and I'm sure [TS]

00:35:14   everyone's going to write in to me [TS]

00:35:15   saying how much fun they have with them [TS]

00:35:16   if you like them great but I really [TS]

00:35:19   really don't and the cameras are so good [TS]

00:35:21   without them that I almost find them [TS]

00:35:23   like an odd detraction from this [TS]

00:35:25   otherwise awesome camera but fortunately [TS]

00:35:27   it doesn't get in my way I just don't [TS]

00:35:29   use those modes and I get to take [TS]

00:35:31   awesome [TS]

00:35:32   pictures well you know technically [TS]

00:35:34   awesome my competition is terrible but [TS]

00:35:35   but I hate to take technically awesome [TS]

00:35:38   pictures with this camera and with both [TS]

00:35:40   of these cameras and finally had the [TS]

00:35:42   flexibility of having that zoomed in [TS]

00:35:44   lens and I loved all that I just have no [TS]

00:35:48   use for the for the trickery modes [TS]

00:35:49   having a telephoto lens is really really [TS]

00:35:52   nice [TS]

00:35:53   and I forget that it's a thing at first [TS]

00:35:56   because I'm so used to just never ever [TS]

00:35:58   ever zooming my camera ever you know and [TS]

00:36:02   early as my iPhone I should say in the [TS]

00:36:05   same way that I never really use the [TS]

00:36:08   flash ever because I've just trained [TS]

00:36:10   myself to never use the flash which [TS]

00:36:11   actually from everything I've gathered [TS]

00:36:13   and seen the flash on the iPhone both [TS]

00:36:15   front facing and rear is actually not [TS]

00:36:17   bad I mean it doesn't mean that it's [TS]

00:36:19   perfect but it as a flash goes [TS]

00:36:21   particularly on a phone it's pretty [TS]

00:36:23   decent and so because I've trained [TS]

00:36:25   myself to never zoom I forget that the [TS]

00:36:26   telephoto lens is a thing but as it [TS]

00:36:29   turns out it's awesome just like you [TS]

00:36:31   were saying Marco just to have the [TS]

00:36:32   option to zoom at all is really really [TS]

00:36:35   nice [TS]

00:36:36   and as a quick aside at work today we [TS]

00:36:39   had a chili cook-off and in I'm going [TS]

00:36:42   somewhere with this the way it worked [TS]

00:36:43   was we had something like we had [TS]

00:36:45   something like twelve different [TS]

00:36:46   employees cooked Chili's and then they [TS]

00:36:50   gave us like a little shooter like a [TS]

00:36:52   shot cup or it would be a glass if you [TS]

00:36:54   will but like a little play a paper cup [TS]

00:36:56   it was like the size of a shot that you [TS]

00:36:59   could take a little sample of each of [TS]

00:37:01   the chilies and you know vote on [TS]

00:37:03   whichever one was your favorite right so [TS]

00:37:04   I take it a picture to send to Aaron [TS]

00:37:07   earlier today and I used portrait mode [TS]

00:37:09   now in the defense of Apple portrait [TS]

00:37:10   mode was only really officially marketed [TS]

00:37:12   as being for people but what I did was I [TS]

00:37:15   took a shot of my stack of you know shot [TS]

00:37:18   cups if you will and and I sent it to [TS]

00:37:22   her and I just looked back at it a few [TS]

00:37:23   minutes ago and realized that if you [TS]

00:37:26   look at it at a glance it looks really [TS]

00:37:29   really good or at least it does to me [TS]

00:37:31   but if you look at it for even a second [TS]

00:37:33   more than a glance and I've put a link [TS]

00:37:36   in the show notes now put a link in the [TS]

00:37:37   chat room look at the right side all the [TS]

00:37:40   way at the top like part of the cup it's [TS]

00:37:43   just gone which [TS]

00:37:46   yes proposed algorithm kind of hopefully [TS]

00:37:48   found the edge of that design on the cup [TS]

00:37:50   and expected that that was an edge of a [TS]

00:37:52   person and just blurt it out for you [TS]

00:37:54   which I mean again to be fair to Apple [TS]

00:37:57   like this is a really crummy situation [TS]

00:38:00   to put this software through right to [TS]

00:38:01   put this edge detection through like [TS]

00:38:02   this is this is this is ripe for failure [TS]

00:38:06   but at the same time like it is it is [TS]

00:38:09   clear that I'm not going to be giving up [TS]

00:38:11   on my Micro Four Thirds camera anytime [TS]

00:38:12   soon you know what I mean so I think the [TS]

00:38:15   blur effect that Marco thought look bad [TS]

00:38:18   I think that blur effect would be fine [TS]

00:38:20   if there was depth information back [TS]

00:38:22   there because the reason I think it [TS]

00:38:24   looks terrible is because it is [TS]

00:38:26   basically blurring a flat photo whereas [TS]

00:38:28   if you have an actual absolute optically [TS]

00:38:31   you know blurred stuff depending on the [TS]

00:38:33   distance the closer things are blurred [TS]

00:38:35   less than things are farther away like [TS]

00:38:36   depending it from with how close they [TS]

00:38:37   are to like that you know the focal [TS]

00:38:39   point right but if you only have depth [TS]

00:38:42   information for the first like two feet [TS]

00:38:43   in front of you everything behind that [TS]

00:38:45   is like a blurred poster and it looks [TS]

00:38:47   like a blurred poster but all that said [TS]

00:38:50   I agree with Marco like you don't need [TS]

00:38:51   this the cameras are great without it [TS]

00:38:52   there that you know that's probably why [TS]

00:38:54   we didn't talk about it's like these are [TS]

00:38:55   the best iPhone cameras ever everything [TS]

00:38:57   Apple says it's true they are better [TS]

00:38:59   than the previous cameras and the [TS]

00:39:00   previous cameras are already pretty good [TS]

00:39:01   and they're great and you'll take good [TS]

00:39:03   pictures with them two things to say [TS]

00:39:05   about this the portrait lighting modes [TS]

00:39:08   I think the fill their purpose better [TS]

00:39:10   than the whatever the portrait blurring [TS]

00:39:13   mode because they're so focused on like [TS]

00:39:17   selfies and you know dramatic pictures [TS]

00:39:20   of people they're more like Instagram [TS]

00:39:21   filters were like yeah we're gonna [TS]

00:39:22   mangle your picture for an artistic [TS]

00:39:24   effect no one is going to think like [TS]

00:39:26   this is an untouched photo and that's [TS]

00:39:28   the point the crazy studio lighting [TS]

00:39:30   where blacks out the background for [TS]

00:39:31   extra drama and stuff you can get some [TS]

00:39:33   hilarious weird effects out of that but [TS]

00:39:35   it's kind of you know that's it the [TS]

00:39:38   people who want to use it and try it are [TS]

00:39:39   getting exactly what they want out of it [TS]

00:39:41   ridiculous over long dramatic effects [TS]

00:39:43   that they're gonna screw up a lot of [TS]

00:39:44   time but hey you think 900 selfies [TS]

00:39:46   before you pick the one you like anyway [TS]

00:39:47   right so no problem there as for the [TS]

00:39:51   portrait mode blurring thing which has [TS]

00:39:54   been around for a while now and I see [TS]

00:39:56   all over the place in real life on on [TS]

00:39:58   Instagram [TS]

00:39:59   I think the main feature of that is if [TS]

00:40:04   you don't have a big expensive camera [TS]

00:40:06   and most people don't and I just look at [TS]

00:40:08   the numbers like this they don't sell a [TS]

00:40:09   lot of big expensive cameras as compared [TS]

00:40:11   to the number of cell phones this is the [TS]

00:40:14   first time many people have ever been [TS]

00:40:15   able to take a picture that has this [TS]

00:40:20   look that you know oh the thing I wanted [TS]

00:40:23   to take a picture of now look sharper [TS]

00:40:25   because the rest of the thing is blurred [TS]

00:40:27   and so I'm not distracted by the [TS]

00:40:28   background and it looks like a better [TS]

00:40:32   picture it looks more professional it [TS]

00:40:34   doesn't matter whether they can tell [TS]

00:40:36   whether it looks right or not all that [TS]

00:40:38   matters is that they had never [TS]

00:40:39   previously had the ability to take [TS]

00:40:41   pictures there were anything like this [TS]

00:40:43   that had any kind of depth of field [TS]

00:40:44   right it was always like everything was [TS]

00:40:46   you know there's some tiny pinhole [TS]

00:40:48   camera and everything was in focus cuz [TS]

00:40:50   all the light beams were getting phone [TS]

00:40:51   through this tiny tiny aperture on there [TS]

00:40:53   you know cheap camera on their phone [TS]

00:40:54   right and so for them it's a huge [TS]

00:40:58   upgrade of never having this effect and [TS]

00:41:01   subjectively looking at a picture of [TS]

00:41:03   your kid with the background and [TS]

00:41:04   pleasantly blurred out makes your kid [TS]

00:41:06   look better right it's not that they're [TS]

00:41:08   comparing that to how it would look with [TS]

00:41:09   you know an actual wide aperture big [TS]

00:41:12   glass expensive camera because they [TS]

00:41:13   don't have one of those and they [TS]

00:41:14   probably never will they're comparing it [TS]

00:41:16   to how it would look if that with that [TS]

00:41:17   effect turned off and as far as they're [TS]

00:41:18   concerned this looks better because it [TS]

00:41:21   just looks closer to like a [TS]

00:41:22   quote-unquote professional picture or a [TS]

00:41:24   magazine type picture and I can see that [TS]

00:41:26   I can see but when I see if we use it [TS]

00:41:28   like they just say I just like it better [TS]

00:41:29   it looks better so in the end that the [TS]

00:41:32   blurring portrait picture is giving [TS]

00:41:34   people a better experience with this [TS]

00:41:37   phone at least in the moment where [TS]

00:41:39   they're like this phone takes pictures [TS]

00:41:41   that I'm just blown away they maybe [TS]

00:41:43   don't even know what it is about them [TS]

00:41:44   like they just look better right and [TS]

00:41:47   even if you point out how you just [TS]

00:41:48   erased your kids ear they're like oh but [TS]

00:41:51   I still like it the only only concern [TS]

00:41:53   with the blurring which so many people [TS]

00:41:55   love is that I worry that years down the [TS]

00:41:57   line they will feel bad that all their [TS]

00:42:01   pictures of lily and Apple also saves [TS]

00:42:03   the unmodified picture so that shouldn't [TS]

00:42:05   be a problem but I still worry that [TS]

00:42:08   somehow that information will get lost [TS]

00:42:10   or the blurred [TS]

00:42:12   we burned out to a flat JPEG and moved [TS]

00:42:14   around to different service and just you [TS]

00:42:16   know I don't know like I've already [TS]

00:42:17   heard from some people who kind of [TS]

00:42:18   regret they took a lot of pictures of [TS]

00:42:19   their kids with that maybe they maybe [TS]

00:42:21   they don't know they can recover the [TS]

00:42:23   original or maybe they can't anymore [TS]

00:42:25   because they've exported it in some way [TS]

00:42:26   but in general I think despite what [TS]

00:42:30   Marco and I a many other big camera [TS]

00:42:33   owning people think about it a lot of [TS]

00:42:35   people like this feature I think it [TS]

00:42:37   helps sell iPhones and I think it makes [TS]

00:42:38   people happier with their phone and [TS]

00:42:40   happier with the pictures they take with [TS]

00:42:42   it yeah I agree [TS]

00:42:43   and again if you don't take a critical [TS]

00:42:45   eye to it which for the three of us is [TS]

00:42:48   or certainly the two of you probably the [TS]

00:42:50   three of us is hilarious but you know if [TS]

00:42:53   I don't if I don't really and truly look [TS]

00:42:55   at these pictures even those cups which [TS]

00:42:57   as soon as you take a true look at it [TS]

00:43:00   it's so obvious how broken it is but at [TS]

00:43:02   a glance I didn't even notice so yeah if [TS]

00:43:04   you're not discerning then this is more [TS]

00:43:07   than enough and it saves you the [TS]

00:43:08   thousand plus dollars of getting another [TS]

00:43:11   camera that has big glass etc yeah you [TS]

00:43:14   would want to spend a thousand dollars [TS]

00:43:15   on a camera right yeah why would you [TS]

00:43:16   guys spend $1,200 on a phone it's fine [TS]

00:43:18   though we are brought to you this week [TS]

00:43:21   by jammed now which helps you manage [TS]

00:43:23   your Apple devices from anywhere create [TS]

00:43:25   your free account today at Jam comm [TS]

00:43:27   slash ATP that's JAMF comm slash ATP [TS]

00:43:30   when you first start a business it is [TS]

00:43:33   pretty easy to keep track of your own [TS]

00:43:34   computer and your own phone and your own [TS]

00:43:36   iPad but as you grow you start to apply [TS]

00:43:39   more technology for your employees and [TS]

00:43:41   it gets harder to keep track of [TS]

00:43:42   everyone's Macs iPhones and iPads and [TS]

00:43:44   how to manage them figuring out how to [TS]

00:43:47   secure for example the iPad that your [TS]

00:43:49   sales rep just lost this can be tough [TS]

00:43:51   and this can require lots of complex [TS]

00:43:53   technology and setup especially if you [TS]

00:43:55   want to do it all remotely for any [TS]

00:43:57   locations jammed now makes that and a [TS]

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00:44:04   information or even remotely lock or [TS]

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00:44:08   jammed now secures your stuff so you can [TS]

00:44:11   focus on your business instead with no [TS]

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00:44:19   setting up your first three devices for [TS]

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00:44:27   yourself at jam com / ATP that's JAMF [TS]

00:44:31   dot-com / ATP manage your Apple devices [TS]

00:44:35   from anywhere alright moving on to ask [TS]

00:44:40   ATP Kim Albrecht writes in with John [TS]

00:44:43   consider gaming on the GeForce now [TS]

00:44:45   service instead of getting a tricked-out [TS]

00:44:46   new Mac Pro and and Kim included a [TS]

00:44:49   youtube link which we will put in the [TS]

00:44:51   show notes so what is g-force now and [TS]

00:44:53   what is this about what is this all [TS]

00:44:56   about [TS]

00:44:56   so the short answer is no I wouldn't [TS]

00:44:58   consider that but the longer answer is [TS]

00:45:00   what do you for us now is g-force now is [TS]

00:45:02   another sad / I don't know it's it's sad [TS]

00:45:07   to me attempt to get gaming to bring [TS]

00:45:11   gaming to Mac users right you got a Mac [TS]

00:45:14   you want to play games [TS]

00:45:15   boot camp is there for you if you want [TS]

00:45:17   it but even if you go in boot camp you [TS]

00:45:21   probably don't have the best GPU because [TS]

00:45:23   Apple isn't cellmaxx with it and so [TS]

00:45:25   you're like what if you want to play the [TS]

00:45:27   most demanding modern PC games but you [TS]

00:45:29   don't want to and a PC you just have a [TS]

00:45:31   Mac you're kind of stuck these days and [TS]

00:45:33   you for us now is the service a lot like [TS]

00:45:36   some services in the past including the [TS]

00:45:39   one I'm most familiar with on live for [TS]

00:45:41   many years ago where it will run the [TS]

00:45:45   game for you in a data center far away [TS]

00:45:47   on a tricked-out PC with all the fancy [TS]

00:45:49   hardware presumably using nvidia gpus [TS]

00:45:51   right and then it will let you remotely [TS]

00:45:54   control that PC sending the picture of [TS]

00:45:56   it to your screen and letting your [TS]

00:45:57   keyboard and mouse act as input for it [TS]

00:46:00   so that's what the g-force now services [TS]

00:46:02   and it lets you run unlike your dinky [TS]

00:46:05   like Matt you know MacBook escape with a [TS]

00:46:08   Wimpy GPU you can run the most modern [TS]

00:46:12   game at a really high frame rate at a [TS]

00:46:14   really high resolution because you're [TS]

00:46:16   not running it it's running on a fancy [TS]

00:46:18   computer far away from you you're just [TS]

00:46:20   displaying the results is kind of a dumb [TS]

00:46:21   terminal but of course there's no you [TS]

00:46:25   know no free lunch you've got latency [TS]

00:46:28   because you're communicating over the [TS]

00:46:29   Internet the image quality that you're [TS]

00:46:31   getting is not going to be the same as [TS]

00:46:33   if it was running locally because they [TS]

00:46:34   have to compress that video and send it [TS]

00:46:36   to you you need to have a fast internet [TS]

00:46:38   connection [TS]

00:46:39   to have not many hitches and your [TS]

00:46:40   internet connection you need to have a [TS]

00:46:42   surprising amount of bandwidth because [TS]

00:46:43   there are a lot of frames in that video [TS]

00:46:45   and that's generally why I wouldn't want [TS]

00:46:47   instead of a local computer because the [TS]

00:46:49   compromises are not great and they are [TS]

00:46:52   especially bad for some of the types of [TS]

00:46:55   games that I like like you know a game [TS]

00:46:56   like destiny if I want to try I would [TS]

00:46:58   love to play destiny too on on the PC [TS]

00:46:59   because I get a higher framerate and [TS]

00:47:01   it's higher res but destiny does have a [TS]

00:47:03   game that is very sensitive to lag it [TS]

00:47:06   would really affect gameplay if you want [TS]

00:47:08   to play something like civilization or [TS]

00:47:09   some other game that is also very [TS]

00:47:10   demanding but maybe not as sensitive to [TS]

00:47:12   like I don't know someone who play [TS]

00:47:13   civilization could tell me if it's if [TS]

00:47:15   it's a game where you need to have [TS]

00:47:16   twitch reflexes but surely there are [TS]

00:47:17   games out there that you don't care [TS]

00:47:20   about the extra latency and it's more [TS]

00:47:22   about you know the rest of the gameplay [TS]

00:47:24   experience this would be something you [TS]

00:47:26   might be interested in it's going to be [TS]

00:47:29   a pay service and then you have to pay [TS]

00:47:30   for the games on top of that so it's you [TS]

00:47:33   know it's cheaper than buying a gaming [TS]

00:47:34   PC but it's an additional cost so I wish [TS]

00:47:37   them luck with the service and it seems [TS]

00:47:38   like a good idea I just wish that gaming [TS]

00:47:41   would actually get better on Macs but if [TS]

00:47:43   that's never ever gonna happen I'm kind [TS]

00:47:45   of glad that someone still feels like [TS]

00:47:47   there's money to be squeezed from Mac [TS]

00:47:48   users should want to play games as long [TS]

00:47:50   as they make that amount of money [TS]

00:47:51   smaller than the price and hasslein and [TS]

00:47:53   desk space of buying a gaming PC I guess [TS]

00:47:55   maybe there's a market for it alright so [TS]

00:47:58   mark MV writes in do you use a VPN if so [TS]

00:48:01   which one would you recommend so the [TS]

00:48:04   motivation here I think is that there [TS]

00:48:06   are many VPN services that that allow [TS]

00:48:09   for different things one example is if [TS]

00:48:12   you live outside the United States but [TS]

00:48:13   want to have an internet connection that [TS]

00:48:15   appears to be within the United States [TS]

00:48:17   so you can use well I guess Netflix used [TS]

00:48:19   to be a good example now I don't think [TS]

00:48:21   it's quite as important or any number of [TS]

00:48:24   other services that are that are forced [TS]

00:48:26   to be us-only but another option is if [TS]

00:48:29   you're just in a public Wi-Fi hotspot [TS]

00:48:31   and you want your your communications to [TS]

00:48:33   be encrypted then you could use a VPN [TS]

00:48:36   for that I do use a VPN when I am out of [TS]

00:48:40   the house on a Wi-Fi networks that I do [TS]

00:48:43   not trust or if for some reason I want [TS]

00:48:46   to get on my in-home network and the [TS]

00:48:48   answer that I have for what VPN do I [TS]

00:48:50   recommend well I recommend the [TS]

00:48:52   VPN that you run on your Synology that's [TS]

00:48:55   sitting in your house it's not a [TS]

00:48:57   terribly useful recommendation I'll be [TS]

00:48:59   the first to admit but you could install [TS]

00:49:02   mac OS server if you have a computer at [TS]

00:49:04   home a Mac at home that's on all the [TS]

00:49:06   time if you have any sort of like cheap [TS]

00:49:08   computer that can run Linux you can run [TS]

00:49:10   you know various different servers that [TS]

00:49:11   do it that way or if you have a Synology [TS]

00:49:14   that I strongly recommend setting up a [TS]

00:49:17   VPN server on there if like me you [TS]

00:49:19   connect your Synology to the Internet [TS]

00:49:21   which I know John's is not but that's [TS]

00:49:23   what I do I can't speak for either of [TS]

00:49:25   you guys so Marco what do you do for [TS]

00:49:27   this if anything I mostly don't use them [TS]

00:49:30   because first of all I'm hardly ever out [TS]

00:49:32   of my house and when I am usually on the [TS]

00:49:34   cell network and I know the Sun network [TS]

00:49:36   is not perfectly secure but I'm hardly [TS]

00:49:40   ever connecting to somebody else's Wi-Fi [TS]

00:49:42   it is what I'm saying [TS]

00:49:43   so it where I think is probably the most [TS]

00:49:46   common need for a VPN is to you know [TS]

00:49:50   protect yourself in that kind of [TS]

00:49:51   situation there are lots of other [TS]

00:49:54   reasons to use one as you said you know [TS]

00:49:56   I I'm not that up on what's the best [TS]

00:49:59   solution if security and privacy are the [TS]

00:50:02   main reasons you're using them there [TS]

00:50:05   like you can use a big service like like [TS]

00:50:07   so the one I use occasionally when I [TS]

00:50:09   need it is encrypt me which is formally [TS]

00:50:11   known as cloak I signed up for that a [TS]

00:50:14   little while back but it's mostly for [TS]

00:50:17   practicality not like sheer amount of [TS]

00:50:21   security so for instance at my in-laws [TS]

00:50:24   place their crappy rural ISP blocks [TS]

00:50:28   outbound SSH connections so I can't into [TS]

00:50:31   any of yes so I can't log into any of my [TS]

00:50:34   servers when I'm there it's probably [TS]

00:50:39   like I'm sure it's like you know some [TS]

00:50:41   like Windows worm probably started [TS]

00:50:42   attacking SSH servers they just figure [TS]

00:50:44   they block I don't know I'm sure there [TS]

00:50:45   was a reason like that it's not whatever [TS]

00:50:48   it is not a good reason but the fact is [TS]

00:50:50   I have to occasionally log in the [TS]

00:50:51   servers when I'm away so [TS]

00:50:53   so I basically bought it just to do that [TS]

00:50:56   but I use it also when traveling you [TS]

00:50:59   know when I have to be like on a hotel [TS]

00:51:01   Wi-Fi for a reasonable connectivity I'll [TS]

00:51:03   use it that but I usually don't use one [TS]

00:51:07   because again I'm usually I'm almost [TS]

00:51:08   never connected to anybody else's Wi-Fi [TS]

00:51:10   networks I think the whole idea of [TS]

00:51:12   connecting to a random Wi-Fi network in [TS]

00:51:15   public and letting all your traffic flow [TS]

00:51:18   over that without always being encrypted [TS]

00:51:21   like without everything running over [TS]

00:51:22   HTTP which you know let's face it you're [TS]

00:51:24   gonna have something that probably [TS]

00:51:25   doesn't the idea of that sounds crazy to [TS]

00:51:27   me and I think we're gonna look back on [TS]

00:51:29   this era of using public Wi-Fi networks [TS]

00:51:32   unencrypted like I think we're gonna [TS]

00:51:35   look back on this and think that was [TS]

00:51:36   crazy [TS]

00:51:36   in in not even that long maybe in five [TS]

00:51:38   or ten years this was the whole idea of [TS]

00:51:41   can I think of random public Wi-Fi and [TS]

00:51:43   everyone not having every device have a [TS]

00:51:45   Sylar connection that is theirs in [TS]

00:51:47   private that's gonna seem barbaric but [TS]

00:51:51   anyway yeah I use I use cloak which is [TS]

00:51:54   now known as encrypt me but hardly I [TS]

00:51:56   hope that I hardly ever actually need to [TS]

00:51:57   use it if you are doing it more for [TS]

00:51:59   privacy I don't know a lot about this [TS]

00:52:02   but I do know there is always discussion [TS]

00:52:04   about like which of the various VPN [TS]

00:52:06   services keep logs or will be beholden [TS]

00:52:09   to government requests or things like [TS]

00:52:11   that there's all sorts of like levels of [TS]

00:52:14   paranoia slash security depending on [TS]

00:52:16   your point of view that that you can go [TS]

00:52:18   into with this and I not familiar with [TS]

00:52:20   that so I will say if you lead in that [TS]

00:52:21   direction or if you have more advanced [TS]

00:52:23   needs like that you're probably better [TS]

00:52:24   off doing something more like KC's just [TS]

00:52:26   suggested which is like kind of running [TS]

00:52:27   your own on some kind of server that you [TS]

00:52:29   can trust somewhere rather than doing [TS]

00:52:32   somebody's big service but that's I [TS]

00:52:34   don't worry about that I'm always [TS]

00:52:37   worried about you know kind of like this [TS]

00:52:39   story's about antivirus software being a [TS]

00:52:41   vector for malware right VPNs the VPNs [TS]

00:52:44   that are secretly run by like some [TS]

00:52:46   hostile foreign government unbeknownst [TS]

00:52:48   to you they're just man in the middle [TS]

00:52:50   and all of your traffic even is secure [TS]

00:52:52   stuff and feeding you fake certificates [TS]

00:52:54   for SSL and all sorts of other stuff and [TS]

00:52:55   like I'm using on my Synology its local [TS]

00:52:58   it's fine it's like a you don't know [TS]

00:52:59   that you don't know like Synology could [TS]

00:53:00   be unknowing shipping some you know [TS]

00:53:02   thing that is infected with some malware [TS]

00:53:04   that is sending all your traffic to [TS]

00:53:06   who-knows-where by in general I use VPN [TS]

00:53:10   at work for work because I have to I [TS]

00:53:12   have no idea if the VPN I'm using for [TS]

00:53:15   work is actually making things more [TS]

00:53:16   secure or not but I have to use it so I [TS]

00:53:18   do [TS]

00:53:19   when I am out and about I'm never [TS]

00:53:22   connecting back to anything in my home [TS]

00:53:24   because I have no way to do so just [TS]

00:53:25   because that just makes me feel more [TS]

00:53:27   comfortable and I tend not to you know I [TS]

00:53:32   think I have cloak and a couple other [TS]

00:53:34   VPN software that I think I've used on [TS]

00:53:36   occasion when I've been feeling [TS]

00:53:37   particularly paranoid and have no choice [TS]

00:53:39   but to connect to some potentially [TS]

00:53:40   sketchy Wi-Fi network but in general I I [TS]

00:53:43   will connect to Wi-Fi at the hotel I'm [TS]

00:53:46   staying at and I'll just use it and just [TS]

00:53:47   try not to worry about it I'm basically [TS]

00:53:49   going for the Big Sky theory which is a [TS]

00:53:51   lot of people out in the world didn't [TS]

00:53:52   unless someone is specifically targeting [TS]

00:53:54   me I'm probably gonna be fine [TS]

00:53:56   and on-cell most of the time that I'm [TS]

00:53:58   away anyway but I have to think back a [TS]

00:54:00   few times over so I use the hotel Wi-Fi [TS]

00:54:03   I rely on the fact that the things I [TS]

00:54:05   care about should all be over a cell and [TS]

00:54:07   I just hope that I'm not being [TS]

00:54:08   man-in-the-middle with some fake [TS]

00:54:10   certificate authority crap and I just [TS]

00:54:13   keep my fingers crossed because what [TS]

00:54:14   else can you do and there's also other [TS]

00:54:16   practical reasons you might want to use [TS]

00:54:18   one like there's a lot of VPN services [TS]

00:54:19   that provide built-in ad blocking for [TS]

00:54:21   like just all of your stuff through the [TS]

00:54:23   VPN there's some that that enable you [TS]

00:54:27   know as he said to enable you to change [TS]

00:54:28   your regions for video services which [TS]

00:54:30   can be nice there's also such and that [TS]

00:54:33   could be not only just internationally [TS]

00:54:34   but even that could be for things like [TS]

00:54:35   sports black out things which I'll I [TS]

00:54:38   don't want even pretend to know anything [TS]

00:54:39   more than just that's a term that exists [TS]

00:54:41   I'm sorry there's also things like like [TS]

00:54:45   on airplanes where a lot of times the [TS]

00:54:47   airplane Wi-Fi providers will throttle [TS]

00:54:50   or block certain things or they'll do [TS]

00:54:52   they'll do creepy things like recompress [TS]

00:54:54   images down to lower lower sizes and if [TS]

00:54:57   your friend or do something that [TS]

00:54:58   requires you to not have your images [TS]

00:55:00   recompress like if you're doing web [TS]

00:55:01   development or something that might get [TS]

00:55:05   in your way so you can you know [TS]

00:55:07   oftentimes they will allow you to get [TS]

00:55:08   around those restrictions even when [TS]

00:55:09   you're like at a hotel or something or [TS]

00:55:11   on some kind of like large public Wi-Fi [TS]

00:55:13   network like an airport or something [TS]

00:55:15   like that [TS]

00:55:15   a lot of times they will use different [TS]

00:55:18   traffic prioritization schemes to D [TS]

00:55:21   prioritize or limit certain types of [TS]

00:55:23   traffic that might get in your way so [TS]

00:55:24   what you know if you're like you know [TS]

00:55:26   trying to download something off of a [TS]

00:55:28   CDN or if you're trying to watch a [TS]

00:55:29   youtube video or something that might [TS]

00:55:31   get throttled or blocked [TS]

00:55:33   Hotel or Airport if you download it [TS]

00:55:35   directly but if you go through a VPN it [TS]

00:55:37   might not be so like there it kind of [TS]

00:55:39   gives you more flexibility and more [TS]

00:55:40   options to have this tool at your [TS]

00:55:42   disposal if you're out and about a lot [TS]

00:55:44   yeah some people use it just to get a [TS]

00:55:46   different route like if you're having [TS]

00:55:47   trouble reaching a server and connect [TS]

00:55:50   your VPN because then your traffic will [TS]

00:55:51   go through the VPN which may be [TS]

00:55:52   geographically located in a way that [TS]

00:55:54   totally changes your route to that host [TS]

00:55:55   and suddenly you can get through to it [TS]

00:55:57   some people have tried this like getting [TS]

00:55:58   through to the store when ordering [TS]

00:56:00   putting their thing on Wi-Fi through a [TS]

00:56:02   VPN to have a different route on one [TS]

00:56:04   device to see if maybe their CDN comes [TS]

00:56:06   up sooner lots of interesting things you [TS]

00:56:08   can do to sort of using VPN not for its [TS]

00:56:11   primary purpose but merely to just take [TS]

00:56:12   a different path to the same destination [TS]

00:56:14   all right Eliot George would like to [TS]

00:56:17   know do you think Apple will eventually [TS]

00:56:18   bring air power to its magic mouse and [TS]

00:56:20   keyboard so to recap the new iPhones all [TS]

00:56:25   support G a key g-g-gee wireless [TS]

00:56:30   charging Thank You that's neat [TS]

00:56:32   exactly and pizzelle they pronounce they [TS]

00:56:36   support that wireless charging and so [TS]

00:56:39   the Apple is announced but not released [TS]

00:56:41   a special mat that will allow you to [TS]

00:56:44   charge your phone your watch and your [TS]

00:56:48   ear pods given you spend money on a [TS]

00:56:50   special case or get a brand-new set of [TS]

00:56:52   air pods all on the same mat because [TS]

00:56:55   currently you can only from most of [TS]

00:56:58   these pads you can only charge one [TS]

00:57:00   device at a time and so air power will [TS]

00:57:02   allow you to do if you're super nerd [TS]

00:57:04   like me that has a watch in air pods and [TS]

00:57:06   a phone it will let you do all three on [TS]

00:57:08   one pad so it's asking do we think that [TS]

00:57:11   Apple will eventually bring air power to [TS]

00:57:12   match your mouse and keyboard I don't [TS]

00:57:14   think so but I can't figure out why it [TS]

00:57:17   just doesn't feel to me like something [TS]

00:57:19   Apple would do I think they're perfectly [TS]

00:57:20   satisfied with having you periodically [TS]

00:57:22   charge via the via the lightning cable [TS]

00:57:26   even the harpooned turtle that is the [TS]

00:57:29   Magic Mouse and I don't think they feel [TS]

00:57:31   like there's really any need to change [TS]

00:57:33   or improve that but I don't know that's [TS]

00:57:35   my thoughts Jon they changed her Apple [TS]

00:57:39   input devices so infrequently the [TS]

00:57:42   keyboards changing precluding the mice [TS]

00:57:44   change even more [TS]

00:57:45   frequently but all that said I think the [TS]

00:57:48   mouse is they should do it and I think [TS]

00:57:52   there's a reasonable chance that they [TS]

00:57:54   will just because the Harper turtle is [TS]

00:57:55   ridiculous and the reason I did the [TS]

00:57:57   Arbutin turtle is no other good place to [TS]

00:57:59   plug the thing in and the mouse is small [TS]

00:58:01   and easy to pick up and put on a mat so [TS]

00:58:04   once a month when you have to recharge [TS]

00:58:07   it it's easier to just see like the [TS]

00:58:09   thing pops up to just plop it down on [TS]

00:58:11   the thing keyboard would be too awkward [TS]

00:58:13   like how do you pick up your keyboard [TS]

00:58:16   and like balance it's bigger than the [TS]

00:58:17   air power mat you're not gonna have a [TS]

00:58:18   mat that's the size of your keyboard and [TS]

00:58:20   the keyboard would take up the whole [TS]

00:58:21   thing and which part of the keyboard [TS]

00:58:22   needs to be over the thing it just seems [TS]

00:58:24   like not a good fit the mouse is more or [TS]

00:58:27   less the size of a phone I think it [TS]

00:58:29   would fit perfectly well and I think it [TS]

00:58:31   will solve that harpooned turtle [TS]

00:58:33   problems solve they're like where do we [TS]

00:58:34   put the charging port problem and if you [TS]

00:58:37   do have one of those mats there's a [TS]

00:58:39   reasonable chance that it will be on the [TS]

00:58:41   desk where your computer is because [TS]

00:58:42   that's where you plop your phone when [TS]

00:58:43   you're using the computer so you plop [TS]

00:58:45   your mouse there so I'm I'm semi [TS]

00:58:47   optimistic that five years from now when [TS]

00:58:49   they finally revise their Mouse again [TS]

00:58:51   that it will have whatever the current [TS]

00:58:54   standard of wireless charging is because [TS]

00:58:56   it makes sense to me as a product to be [TS]

00:58:58   a thing that you put on a mat to charge [TS]

00:59:00   every once in a while yeah that sounds [TS]

00:59:02   about right [TS]

00:59:03   the only thing is that the the lightning [TS]

00:59:06   method of charging them also provides a [TS]

00:59:08   secondary function which is it pairs [TS]

00:59:10   them to the computer like you never have [TS]

00:59:12   to go through bluetooth pairing and [TS]

00:59:13   everything all you have to do is plug [TS]

00:59:15   them into the lightning cable that's [TS]

00:59:17   mention to the computer and it just [TS]

00:59:18   automatically pairs through the computer [TS]

00:59:19   which is really nice it's also [TS]

00:59:21   frequently used for me when my trackpad [TS]

00:59:24   disconnects itself for no reason [TS]

00:59:27   thanks Sierra and then I have to plug it [TS]

00:59:29   back in about every two days so that it [TS]

00:59:31   reconnects itself so there's there's [TS]

00:59:33   reasons why you need what the cable is [TS]

00:59:36   nice to have besides just charging I [TS]

00:59:38   agree with John that you know the it [TS]

00:59:40   doesn't make as much sense on the [TS]

00:59:41   trackpad and keyboard where it's not [TS]

00:59:43   only do they need to be plugged in [TS]

00:59:44   general s often but also you can still [TS]

00:59:47   use them when they're plugged in so if [TS]

00:59:48   you forget to charge a keyboard or [TS]

00:59:49   trackpad not that big of a deal just [TS]

00:59:51   plug the cable in and keep working [TS]

00:59:52   whereas you forget to charge the mouse [TS]

00:59:54   you have to literally just stop using it [TS]

00:59:56   for a while as it sits there sideways [TS]

00:59:58   then you go back to your trackpad that [TS]

00:59:59   has [TS]

00:59:59   has [TS]

01:00:00   for no reason so not that I'm bitter [TS]

01:00:07   this to me it's it's an interesting [TS]

01:00:10   problem to solve on the mouse but if [TS]

01:00:13   they just move the port to the front of [TS]

01:00:16   the mouse and gave us a little like [TS]

01:00:17   indentation there that would also solve [TS]

01:00:19   the problem with lightning port I think [TS]

01:00:21   it's the Qi charging makes is less [TS]

01:00:24   necessary and is less compelling for a [TS]

01:00:26   device that you only have to charge once [TS]

01:00:28   a month for a little while you know it's [TS]

01:00:30   it makes a lot more sense on devices [TS]

01:00:32   like phones where you are using them [TS]

01:00:35   constantly and they're draining their [TS]

01:00:36   batteries constantly and then every [TS]

01:00:38   night or even throughout the day they [TS]

01:00:41   need to be topped off they need to be [TS]

01:00:42   recharged that's not really the case of [TS]

01:00:43   these with these peripherals so I can't [TS]

01:00:45   I can't really see them doing that [TS]

01:00:48   necessarily they really need a dizzily [TS]

01:00:51   to solve you're just connecting problems [TS]

01:00:53   like you know the equivalent or maybe [TS]

01:00:55   the identical you think the w1 chip like [TS]

01:00:57   this the fact that you can plug it into [TS]

01:00:58   parity is great because it gets you out [TS]

01:00:59   of the whole Bluetooth device pairing [TS]

01:01:01   game like this I'd circumvented it with [TS]

01:01:03   a hardwired connection but also on air [TS]

01:01:05   pods there you know they have their own [TS]

01:01:08   pairing mechanism yes they are positive [TS]

01:01:10   bluetooth but the whole w1 thing and the [TS]

01:01:12   experience of opening a little container [TS]

01:01:13   and switching easily from device to [TS]

01:01:15   device and all that stuff that [TS]

01:01:16   experience would help you presumably [TS]

01:01:20   work around OS bugs when your trackpad [TS]

01:01:22   disconnects without having to actually [TS]

01:01:24   plug in a cable and so you know wireless [TS]

01:01:28   everything for devices that are small [TS]

01:01:29   and handheld I think is a reasonable [TS]

01:01:32   future and like they revised their mice [TS]

01:01:34   so infrequently that by the time they do [TS]

01:01:36   all the stuff should be more reliable [TS]

01:01:38   lower power cheaper and just sort of be [TS]

01:01:41   table stakes for any portable thing that [TS]

01:01:43   has batteries it presumably will become [TS]

01:01:46   less common to have to keep plugging [TS]

01:01:48   these things in and have to have ports [TS]

01:01:50   on them and have to deal with connectors [TS]

01:01:51   it'll just be like put it down on the [TS]

01:01:53   pad and let it go so why don't you like [TS]

01:01:57   the next task ATP which I know we've [TS]

01:01:59   already hit three but I'm bothered by [TS]

01:02:01   you not liking this question and I am [TS]

01:02:03   willing to give Marco the editing work [TS]

01:02:05   to clean this up because you're so in [TS]

01:02:09   the show notes [TS]

01:02:10   it reads how would you define quote [TS]

01:02:12   close [TS]

01:02:13   - the metal quote - non nerds and do you [TS]

01:02:15   have a favorite non-computer analogical [TS]

01:02:17   use for the saying and and all I feel is [TS]

01:02:21   that a word I don't think so [TS]

01:02:23   looks terror in and and it's prefixed in [TS]

01:02:26   italics I don't like this question so I [TS]

01:02:29   asked in slack earlier John why don't [TS]

01:02:32   you like this question the response I [TS]

01:02:34   got was as follows many reasons I was [TS]

01:02:38   busy and we have time to type a big [TS]

01:02:39   thing I pad I got type a big answer to [TS]

01:02:41   you on my iPad so what the hell's wrong [TS]

01:02:43   with this is a perfectly reasonable [TS]

01:02:45   quality you don't have a smart Keyboard [TS]

01:02:46   on an iPad no that's it I know I don't [TS]

01:02:48   know you're missing out the only way to [TS]

01:02:50   use an iPad pro is with a key with smart [TS]

01:02:52   Keyboard it's so good I don't type I'm [TS]

01:02:54   just reading the web and browsing [TS]

01:02:56   Twitter and watching YouTube I'm not [TS]

01:02:57   typing things yeah because it's sucks to [TS]

01:02:59   type on the screen but if you have a [TS]

01:03:00   keyboard start typing on it I wouldn't a [TS]

01:03:05   laptop we get a laptop but I don't like [TS]

01:03:07   laptops oh I don't have a laptop except [TS]

01:03:09   your work laptop no choice right I don't [TS]

01:03:13   like that one either anyway what the [TS]

01:03:14   hell's wrong with this question my my [TS]

01:03:17   assumption is that they're asking this [TS]

01:03:19   because of the Merlin many years old [TS]

01:03:24   troll gag of trying to say you know is [TS]

01:03:28   that close to the metal he was like [TS]

01:03:29   riffing on something that we said in an [TS]

01:03:31   early tech podcast that he reframed and [TS]

01:03:34   and you know I don't know if close the [TS]

01:03:38   metal was something we said or was close [TS]

01:03:40   to something we said but he catched he [TS]

01:03:42   latched on to it is like a catchphrase [TS]

01:03:44   and sort of a nonsense thing that like [TS]

01:03:49   it's a it's a multi-layered multi-year [TS]

01:03:52   old gag that has lost all meaning and [TS]

01:03:55   never really did have a meaning it's [TS]

01:03:57   like his returning null thing right [TS]

01:03:58   that's it's it's not it doesn't seem [TS]

01:04:01   like an honest question because what how [TS]

01:04:03   would you define why would you find [TS]

01:04:05   yourself needing to define close to the [TS]

01:04:07   metal unless they also listened to a [TS]

01:04:09   bunch of podcasts with me and Marilyn [TS]

01:04:10   for years and years to understand what [TS]

01:04:12   this gag is about in which case you [TS]

01:04:13   would never need to define it like [TS]

01:04:14   there's context that's missing here what [TS]

01:04:16   is the why does this come up why are you [TS]

01:04:21   saying close to the metal to anyone why [TS]

01:04:23   do you feel like you have to explain it [TS]

01:04:24   why is it an important thing for them to [TS]

01:04:25   understand [TS]

01:04:26   you understand it are you asking me to [TS]

01:04:27   explain it to you or do you just want [TS]

01:04:29   you think you understand it but you want [TS]

01:04:30   me to tell you how to explain it to [TS]

01:04:31   someone else who doesn't care about it [TS]

01:04:32   it's a bad question that's why we're not [TS]

01:04:35   answering it are you serious same thing [TS]

01:04:38   I've ever heard maybe you guys don't [TS]

01:04:41   have that same context and maybe this [TS]

01:04:42   I'm wrong and this person also has no [TS]

01:04:44   idea what I'm talking about and they [TS]

01:04:45   just like I've just heard close to the [TS]

01:04:46   middle line I wanted to know what it [TS]

01:04:48   mean do I know what I mean but I need to [TS]

01:04:49   explain to other people maybe it's [TS]

01:04:50   perfectly honest but I didn't interpret [TS]

01:04:52   it that way how would you define quote [TS]

01:04:54   close to the metal quote to non nerds [TS]

01:04:57   okay that was literally verbatim the [TS]

01:04:59   question how in the name of Zeus's [TS]

01:05:02   butthole did you get that much context [TS]

01:05:04   from that little tank maybe you don't [TS]

01:05:07   have that context but if you had [TS]

01:05:08   listened to tons of podcasts with me and [TS]

01:05:10   Marlon and knew and remembered the [TS]

01:05:11   origins of this whole gag you would have [TS]

01:05:14   the same context as I do that's why I [TS]

01:05:16   don't like the question I'm I'm [TS]

01:05:18   stupefied right now I I understand the [TS]

01:05:21   words coming out of your mouth but how [TS]

01:05:24   you concluded from how would you define [TS]

01:05:27   close to the metal to non nerds how how [TS]

01:05:30   did you come to that conclusion because [TS]

01:05:32   the only reason they're staying close to [TS]

01:05:34   the metal is because like I mean again [TS]

01:05:36   I'm assuming you're right but but like [TS]

01:05:38   it's too much a coincidence Marco who [TS]

01:05:40   actually listens to podcasts that [TS]

01:05:42   Marilyn is on and I am on and probably [TS]

01:05:44   remembers this more better than most of [TS]

01:05:45   us you know what I'm talking about right [TS]

01:05:46   I don't think so well forget it forget [TS]

01:05:49   aside whether you like the question you [TS]

01:05:51   know that you know the origin supposed [TS]

01:05:52   to the metal thing right in computer [TS]

01:05:54   terms I know what it means I'm not sure [TS]

01:05:57   you don't you don't know that John [TS]

01:05:58   Murrell and podcast access of this maybe [TS]

01:06:00   I've forgotten it I mean well maybe it's [TS]

01:06:03   just me but anyway that was that was my [TS]

01:06:04   interpretation and my guess is that the [TS]

01:06:06   person asking this question also knows [TS]

01:06:08   what I'm talking about [TS]

01:06:08   even if nobody else does I bet you that [TS]

01:06:12   you are 100% wrong on this anyway yeah [TS]

01:06:16   you can see why I didn't want to try to [TS]

01:06:17   type that so can we answer this without [TS]

01:06:20   all of that completely bananas you're [TS]

01:06:26   abstaining from this no no listen listen [TS]

01:06:28   if you why what is the non John Merlin [TS]

01:06:35   related context for asking this question [TS]

01:06:37   do you think close to the metal is a [TS]

01:06:39   phrase that needs to be explained [TS]

01:06:40   to other people does it come up in [TS]

01:06:41   conversation why would anyone why would [TS]

01:06:44   anyone say this and be disappointed that [TS]

01:06:47   someone didn't understand it to them and [TS]

01:06:48   yet not know how to explain it to them [TS]

01:06:49   like what why is this a legit question [TS]

01:06:51   in any way independent of any other [TS]

01:06:54   stuff who knows why are you judging [TS]

01:06:56   whether or not Jonathan bowling has used [TS]

01:06:59   the phrase close to the metal in [TS]

01:07:00   conversation that's not up to you you're [TS]

01:07:02   not the boss of him it's not a like you [TS]

01:07:05   could say how would you define you know [TS]

01:07:09   like a slippery is a banana peel to non [TS]

01:07:12   nerds do you have a favorite analogy [TS]

01:07:14   used to explain it's like that's not [TS]

01:07:15   gonna calm a phrase you know yes but I [TS]

01:07:17   peels are slippery but as slippery as a [TS]

01:07:19   banana peel is not a thing that people [TS]

01:07:20   say so why would I have to explain to [TS]

01:07:21   you how I explain to other people it [TS]

01:07:23   just doesn't come up like it's arbitrary [TS]

01:07:26   to arbitrary have you ever like had to [TS]

01:07:28   explain to anyone said that anyone win [TS]

01:07:31   I'm sure I have oh my god I'm sure I [TS]

01:07:34   have at some point because there's a big [TS]

01:07:36   difference to answer the question see [TS]

01:07:38   I'm gonna sneak the answer in here [TS]

01:07:39   there's no way this is the show this is [TS]

01:07:43   the chat room this is what the quality [TS]

01:07:46   you get for there is no way this makes [TS]

01:07:49   the Edit you get fish and you get this [TS]

01:07:52   the answer to the question which [TS]

01:07:54   Jonathan will never hear is that [TS]

01:07:56   something he already knows no he does [TS]

01:08:00   maybe he does but you just know how to [TS]

01:08:02   describe it in a simple way all right [TS]

01:08:04   oh my god I'm so angry you right now [TS]

01:08:08   because you are putting this poor man in [TS]

01:08:10   a context that I don't think you're [TS]

01:08:11   putting him in a box John you're putting [TS]

01:08:13   them in a box anyway the answer the [TS]

01:08:16   question is there there my answer the [TS]

01:08:19   question which John will then refute and [TS]

01:08:21   be angry with is that there are many [TS]

01:08:23   different kinds of computer languages [TS]

01:08:24   programming languages and some of them [TS]

01:08:26   are literal direct translations to ones [TS]

01:08:30   and zeros that are run on the CPU in [TS]

01:08:32   question and most of them are not and as [TS]

01:08:35   you get more and more current most of [TS]

01:08:37   these languages have many more [TS]

01:08:39   abstractions that they're built upon [TS]

01:08:41   that get you further and further and [TS]

01:08:43   further away from from ones and zeros [TS]

01:08:45   that are run on the CPU and so when [TS]

01:08:48   you're close to the metal you're doing [TS]

01:08:50   something that is either directly [TS]

01:08:51   translatable to ones and zeros or as [TS]

01:08:53   very very very close to directly [TS]

01:08:55   translatable as opposed to something [TS]

01:08:57   like say Swift or PHP or certainly Perl [TS]

01:09:01   which is built on so many abstractions [TS]

01:09:04   it's almost hilarious that any of this [TS]

01:09:06   actually works and so you know the stuff [TS]

01:09:10   that the three of us work in day to day [TS]

01:09:11   is nowhere close to the metal there are [TS]

01:09:14   abstractions upon abstractions upon [TS]

01:09:15   abstraction upon abstraction xand and so [TS]

01:09:18   many it's a it's a layer cake just just [TS]

01:09:20   layers all the way down and thus that's [TS]

01:09:22   what when somebody says close to the [TS]

01:09:24   metal it means you're working in a snit [TS]

01:09:26   in a situation where you are probably [TS]

01:09:29   using a tool chain that is very [TS]

01:09:31   difficult to work in because you're [TS]

01:09:32   talking you it's more about talking the [TS]

01:09:35   computers language than it is talking [TS]

01:09:36   about human language you know and you [TS]

01:09:38   said when you said I bet John's gonna [TS]

01:09:40   have complaints about my description I'm [TS]

01:09:42   thinking to myself oh sure it'll be fine [TS]

01:09:45   but then as you got further into [TS]

01:09:46   isolation I was like you know what I [TS]

01:09:47   would explain that differently so here [TS]

01:09:50   we go you're right of course [TS]

01:09:54   why would you even think that wouldn't [TS]

01:09:56   have it you know I'm not gonna have any [TS]

01:09:58   objections your explanation but then [TS]

01:10:00   it's like no no I wouldn't say it that [TS]

01:10:01   way no no anyway do you know you exactly [TS]

01:10:08   so how would you explain it then King [TS]

01:10:14   already knows what it means no it [TS]

01:10:17   doesn't need to explain it to non nerds [TS]

01:10:21   that's it I'm tweeting right now I'm [TS]

01:10:22   tweeting it Jonathan bowling and we're [TS]

01:10:24   gonna fly this right this says sleep it [TS]

01:10:27   probably is but how do you what if [TS]

01:10:30   Jonathan balling legit needs an [TS]

01:10:31   explanation he mail me and I will email [TS]

01:10:33   him if you can give me a a so handsome [TS]

01:10:35   you're gonna complain about my [TS]

01:10:37   explanation and you're not even going to [TS]

01:10:38   actually give your own explanation [TS]

01:10:40   it's hot it's hard to explain but I [TS]

01:10:42   don't think it's pronounced siracusa I [TS]

01:10:44   don't think Marco you're like one of the [TS]

01:10:47   only few people in the world to actually [TS]

01:10:49   pronounce my last name correctly and I [TS]

01:10:50   enjoy that hard so really you're not [TS]

01:10:57   gonna answer the question no it's fine [TS]

01:10:59   like it was its nitpicking like I'm what [TS]

01:11:02   you said is perfectly adequate and I [TS]

01:11:04   would have to know why does [TS]

01:11:06   don't I would never say close to the [TS]

01:11:08   metal to non nerds and expect them to [TS]

01:11:09   understand what I was saying like well I [TS]

01:11:11   use jargon techno jargon was someone who [TS]

01:11:13   you know is not going to understand it [TS]

01:11:14   like you think I'm throwing a destiny [TS]

01:11:16   jargon and regular conversations people [TS]

01:11:18   expect them to follow along no would we [TS]

01:11:20   even know oh my gosh I cannot believe [TS]

01:11:28   here you're gonna complain and moan [TS]

01:11:29   about my about my description and then [TS]

01:11:32   not actually I said you were right I [TS]

01:11:33   said you were right and that I thought I [TS]

01:11:36   would wouldn't have any objections to it [TS]

01:11:38   but in the end I did this is [TS]

01:11:42   preposterous I'm so angry at you right [TS]

01:11:44   now anyway the main reason why this [TS]

01:11:46   shouldn't go in the show is stealing of [TS]

01:11:48   three questions who define that as the [TS]

01:11:50   rule go find that recording of like how [TS]

01:11:58   many think we should have one two or [TS]

01:11:59   three we're like oh three questions [TS]

01:12:00   sounds good and that's what we've been [TS]

01:12:01   doing ever since we'll make it a topic [TS]

01:12:03   well yeah that's the first time close to [TS]

01:12:07   the metal topic technically it's [TS]

01:12:09   follow-up because it was discussing [TS]

01:12:10   another podcast before right I mean it [TS]

01:12:19   couldn't possibly be the same people who [TS]

01:12:20   invented ask podcast right I don't [TS]

01:12:24   it was track of all the micro is how do [TS]

01:12:27   you so many of them and they change name [TS]

01:12:29   so much not upgrade which has never [TS]

01:12:31   changed names yeah it's only ever been [TS]

01:12:33   up the Dugga Dugga was from like three [TS]

01:12:36   mike early shows ago right yes they do [TS]

01:12:45   it and do by Friday don't why are you [TS]

01:12:46   doing it and do by Friday because an [TS]

01:12:48   earlier show they're imitating an [TS]

01:12:49   earlier show which one feel like I'm [TS]

01:12:51   what this is the verbal version of like [TS]

01:12:54   looking in your brain and seeing the [TS]

01:12:57   world's most intricate conspiracy theory [TS]

01:12:59   with the verbal version of like that [TS]

01:13:05   t-shirt that says Helvetica printed in [TS]

01:13:07   Comic Sans someone says the prompt does [TS]

01:13:12   that bring it about to you guys the [TS]

01:13:13   prompt remember the Duggar dog on the [TS]

01:13:14   prompt I don't know a dog on that they [TS]

01:13:17   have the recording of the word follow up [TS]

01:13:19   with the weird [TS]

01:13:20   yeah and it had a little musical like [TS]

01:13:22   trill in front of it follow no it's like [TS]

01:13:25   I said it's like a space laser sound [TS]

01:13:26   effect it sounds awful actually I think [TS]

01:13:28   that's what they're imitating undo by [TS]

01:13:30   Friday we know like like TV news like [TS]

01:13:36   yes like brick breaking news it's the [TS]

01:13:39   thing I thought I thought what they were [TS]

01:13:41   doing was imitating the prompt certainly [TS]

01:13:43   the job where you are really voiced word [TS]

01:13:46   follow-up is from the prop right yes [TS]

01:13:48   that is from the prompt and so I was [TS]

01:13:51   tying those two together hold on my bad [TS]

01:13:54   I I recalled that build musically is a [TS]

01:13:56   trail and I thought that's what they [TS]

01:13:57   were imitating this slowly warp until [TS]

01:13:58   abyss Dig Dug [TS]

01:13:59   wow I I don't even know where to go from [TS]

01:14:03   here this this is we have just created a [TS]

01:14:08   verbal in in oral trainwreck references [TS]

01:14:14   all the way down and anything that gets [TS]

01:14:15   filtered through Merlin slowly mutates [TS]

01:14:17   until it's unrecognizable [TS]

01:14:19   so what can you do we are sponsored this [TS]

01:14:23   week by betterment rethink what your [TS]

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01:16:05   rethink what your money can do I don't [TS]

01:16:10   have a chi charger but I hear rumors [TS]

01:16:13   that one or two of us do so can one of [TS]

01:16:15   you with a Cheeto charger tell me if [TS]

01:16:17   they're any good worth buying so I got [TS]

01:16:19   my first Chi Chargers this past week and [TS]

01:16:21   so I have the Mophie one that the Apple [TS]

01:16:25   Store sells because one of the only ones [TS]

01:16:27   that Apple has ever officially [TS]

01:16:28   acknowledged its existence of and I have [TS]

01:16:30   the what is this let me see the ravpower [TS]

01:16:34   stand up one that's it looks like it [TS]

01:16:37   props it up so it can like stand up on [TS]

01:16:38   your desk it's like this black thing [TS]

01:16:40   this has fast charge in the middle of it [TS]

01:16:42   for some reason ref power seems to be a [TS]

01:16:46   reasonable brand they seem like they're [TS]

01:16:48   like pretty much on the level of anchor [TS]

01:16:50   in terms of like power and charging and [TS]

01:16:52   battery gear that is inexpensive and [TS]

01:16:55   seems to be reasonably made so anyway [TS]

01:16:58   and Mophie is very well regarded to [TS]

01:17:00   their stuff I usually find their stuff a [TS]

01:17:02   little bit pricey for what it is but [TS]

01:17:04   it's good its well-made stuff so it's [TS]

01:17:06   you know I can't complain too much [TS]

01:17:07   anyway so the this is my first [TS]

01:17:11   experience with any kind of wireless [TS]

01:17:12   charging for phones I know and with with [TS]

01:17:14   previous phones you could get cases that [TS]

01:17:16   were basically Chi receivers and yeah [TS]

01:17:18   and you know and and both even sells [TS]

01:17:20   those actually a few other people do too [TS]

01:17:22   but I have no experience with those all [TS]

01:17:26   the reviews that said while I was [TS]

01:17:28   charging is and not very good I think [TS]

01:17:31   the only reason they were saying that is [TS]

01:17:33   because it seems like Apple gave the [TS]

01:17:35   Belkin charger to reviewers not the [TS]

01:17:39   Mophie charger and the Belkin charger [TS]

01:17:40   seems like it has I haven't tried it [TS]

01:17:43   because everyone said it sucked but it [TS]

01:17:44   seems like it has pretty significant [TS]

01:17:46   problems with the phone [TS]

01:17:47   vibrating off of it and also the the [TS]

01:17:50   like correct target spot of where you [TS]

01:17:53   have to put the phone being pretty small [TS]

01:17:54   and it being very easy to put it on [TS]

01:17:58   there thinking that you're charging it [TS]

01:17:59   but it's actually slightly misaligned [TS]

01:18:00   and so it doesn't charge I have not [TS]

01:18:03   found this to be the case at all with [TS]

01:18:05   either my ravpower stand up one or the [TS]

01:18:08   Mophie circle pad thing and so let's I [TS]

01:18:13   don't know these are called the Mophie [TS]

01:18:15   discs so you know let's get that right [TS]

01:18:20   of the way the and I don't know if the [TS]

01:18:22   mochi one has multiple coils I know like [TS]

01:18:24   one of the ways that the stand-up ones [TS]

01:18:26   try to fix this problem is they'll have [TS]

01:18:29   multiple coils in there and so if the [TS]

01:18:31   phone is aligned with any of like three [TS]

01:18:33   different coils it'll charge properly so [TS]

01:18:35   you that way you could maybe have it a [TS]

01:18:36   different orientation like some of the [TS]

01:18:38   desk ones they support the phone being [TS]

01:18:40   in landscape if you're like standing up [TS]

01:18:42   to watch a movie or something look use a [TS]

01:18:43   nice little touch these you have to have [TS]

01:18:45   like a coil kind of down low for that [TS]

01:18:46   and they also have one kind of up high [TS]

01:18:48   in the middle so the phone can be [TS]

01:18:49   standing up in different heights anyway [TS]

01:18:51   so the the experience of using these [TS]

01:18:54   things I gotta say these are these are [TS]

01:18:56   amazing these are awesome [TS]

01:18:58   like and for a number of reasons now [TS]

01:19:00   they're not perfect they there are a [TS]

01:19:02   couple of downsides as mentioned you do [TS]

01:19:05   have to actually land it somewhere near [TS]

01:19:06   the charging spot in practice I have [TS]

01:19:09   found this to not be a problem at all [TS]

01:19:10   with these two chargers maybe there's [TS]

01:19:13   other ones that are terrible sounds like [TS]

01:19:14   there are but with these two charges the [TS]

01:19:16   only experience with so far they seem [TS]

01:19:19   great the other there's other slight [TS]

01:19:22   problems like the flat ones obviously [TS]

01:19:26   it's like having the phone flat on the [TS]

01:19:27   desk for face ID purposes so you're [TS]

01:19:30   probably not gonna have face ID work [TS]

01:19:31   with it lying on the desk flat the stand [TS]

01:19:34   of Brad power one that I have in my desk [TS]

01:19:35   though does actually work and it will [TS]

01:19:37   unlock the city with it in the stand so [TS]

01:19:39   this probably has to do with angle and [TS]

01:19:42   distance and everything else but just so [TS]

01:19:44   you know that's a thing that can work so [TS]

01:19:45   I'm very happy with that [TS]

01:19:46   and the other main downside to be aware [TS]

01:19:49   of these things is that they charge [TS]

01:19:51   fairly slowly compared to high wattage [TS]

01:19:55   power bricks it seems like most of them [TS]

01:19:57   charge at five watts some of them will [TS]

01:19:59   charge at 7.5 watts on [TS]

01:20:01   11.2 beta I don't know how many of them [TS]

01:20:03   will do that but at least the Mophie one [TS]

01:20:05   will and that's roughly that that's like [TS]

01:20:09   that's like roughly two-thirds of the [TS]

01:20:11   speed that you'd get out of and I out of [TS]

01:20:13   if you use an iPad power brick or any [TS]

01:20:14   kind of 2.4 amp charger so it's not [TS]

01:20:17   quite as fast it's closer to the speed [TS]

01:20:20   of the little crappy power brick that [TS]

01:20:22   come to the iPhone which for many [TS]

01:20:25   purposes is totally fine so if you're [TS]

01:20:27   charging overnight like next on a [TS]

01:20:29   bedside table it's totally fine and let [TS]

01:20:31   me tell you being able like every night [TS]

01:20:34   for the last I don't know decade I have [TS]

01:20:37   upon going to bed placed my phone in [TS]

01:20:40   some kind of dock or charger on my [TS]

01:20:42   nightstand to charge overnight I have a [TS]

01:20:45   feeling this is a pretty common use case [TS]

01:20:47   pretty much everyone does something like [TS]

01:20:49   this and I've gone through so many [TS]

01:20:51   different docks and you know good and [TS]

01:20:54   bad and lots of different ones there [TS]

01:20:57   there used to be zero good docks now [TS]

01:20:59   there's lots of good docks are our [TS]

01:21:01   friends estudio neat make one the [TS]

01:21:02   material dock that's wonderful even has [TS]

01:21:04   an Apple watch option I have one of [TS]

01:21:06   those on my desk it's it's great that's [TS]

01:21:07   how I keep my watch charged yet sides [TS]

01:21:09   table is one of their material docks [TS]

01:21:12   with my phone and my watch and and we're [TS]

01:21:13   it not for this cheese stuff I would [TS]

01:21:16   probably use that freakin forever but [TS]

01:21:17   now that she is a thing it's got me it's [TS]

01:21:19   got my eye wandering yeah and there's [TS]

01:21:21   there's been all sorts of efforts over [TS]

01:21:22   the years to to make docks that were [TS]

01:21:25   easy to lift the phone out of one handed [TS]

01:21:27   I believe elevation dock kind of made [TS]

01:21:29   this famous then right after elevation [TS]

01:21:32   dock launched the 30-pin connector was [TS]

01:21:35   replaced by lightning and it really [TS]

01:21:36   screwed them over for a while and they [TS]

01:21:38   had various attempts to fix that for a [TS]

01:21:39   while their current the way most dock [TS]

01:21:43   seem to fix this is to just have one of [TS]

01:21:46   those micro suction pads on the bottom [TS]

01:21:49   that just sticks it really hard to with [TS]

01:21:51   the surface it's on so that way you can [TS]

01:21:52   just pull the phone out and and have the [TS]

01:21:54   dock stay where it is so you know then [TS]

01:21:56   there's lots you know the and I have the [TS]

01:21:58   new elevation talked to it's also really [TS]

01:21:59   nice what's especially nice about it is [TS]

01:22:01   that you can adjust the alignment and [TS]

01:22:04   the thickness of its charging things [TS]

01:22:06   really quickly and easily with little [TS]

01:22:08   knobs on it so if you if you frequently [TS]

01:22:11   change whether your phone has a case or [TS]

01:22:12   not or you change between two different [TS]

01:22:13   thicknesses of [TS]

01:22:14   cases or something like that the [TS]

01:22:16   elevation doc is great for that but once [TS]

01:22:19   you get to cheat charging once you try a [TS]

01:22:21   wireless charging pad I have a feeling [TS]

01:22:24   you're gonna not want to ever use a doc [TS]

01:22:25   again because it is so different it is [TS]

01:22:27   so much better rather than having to [TS]

01:22:30   align your phone into a doc no matter [TS]

01:22:32   how good that doc is the matter how nice [TS]

01:22:34   it's designed and then having to pull [TS]

01:22:36   your phone out of that dock in the [TS]

01:22:37   morning rather than doing that to just [TS]

01:22:39   lay it on a pad and have and it lights [TS]

01:22:43   up to confirm that it's charging like [TS]

01:22:45   that's awesome and then when you want [TS]

01:22:48   paper phone in and you just reach over [TS]

01:22:49   and pick it up it's incredibly it's it's [TS]

01:22:52   so much lower friction it's so much both [TS]

01:22:55   physically and and you know [TS]

01:22:57   metaphorically it's so much nicer that [TS]

01:23:01   it really is like a behavior changer [TS]

01:23:04   similarly the one on my desk this is [TS]

01:23:07   nice I was reminded by it by somebody on [TS]

01:23:09   Twitter the other day I'm sorry I forget [TS]

01:23:10   who right now I don't I can't find it [TS]

01:23:12   quickly but I didn't realize that Wi-Fi [TS]

01:23:15   iOS app debugging had shipped and is a [TS]

01:23:18   thing we can now do in Xcode now I still [TS]

01:23:21   haven't tried it I knew I did know it [TS]

01:23:23   was the thing but I still have not tried [TS]

01:23:24   it myself so the great thing is so all [TS]

01:23:26   you do is you go is so so basically the [TS]

01:23:29   reason why I was I've always have [TS]

01:23:31   lightning cables on my desk is that as [TS]

01:23:33   an iOS developer you frequently need to [TS]

01:23:34   from Xcode do a build and run where you [TS]

01:23:37   are building your code that you just [TS]

01:23:38   wrote and your deploy it onto your [TS]

01:23:40   iPhone or iPad and you need to test it [TS]

01:23:42   right of the device to do this before [TS]

01:23:44   this fall you had to use a cable you had [TS]

01:23:46   to be plugged in via USB and a lightning [TS]

01:23:48   cable and it helpfully also charged the [TS]

01:23:50   phone which was nice during listen [TS]

01:23:51   during this time but you had to do that [TS]

01:23:53   with Xcode 9 that came out this fall you [TS]

01:23:56   can now do Wi-Fi built and run and Wi-Fi [TS]

01:23:59   debugging and all you do is you go into [TS]

01:24:01   the organizer pane and going to go to a [TS]

01:24:02   device and there's a little checkbox at [TS]

01:24:04   the top that says something like access [TS]

01:24:06   via network and then it's just always [TS]

01:24:09   available it doesn't have to be [TS]

01:24:10   connected via USB anymore and so this is [TS]

01:24:14   a perfect combination with a Qi charging [TS]

01:24:16   device because you can have your phone [TS]

01:24:18   sitting there charging when you're not [TS]

01:24:20   running and then when you build and run [TS]

01:24:22   you can just pick it up and hold it in [TS]

01:24:24   your hand and you're running and [TS]

01:24:25   debugging your code it's glorious it is [TS]

01:24:27   so [TS]

01:24:28   nice and it works as far as I can tell [TS]

01:24:31   it there doesn't seem to be any [TS]

01:24:33   difference in performance everything [TS]

01:24:35   seems to work just fine it isn't like [TS]

01:24:37   horribly slow or anything in my initial [TS]

01:24:38   testing and use so far it's great so [TS]

01:24:41   anyway so now on my desk I I lose a big [TS]

01:24:45   reason to plug my phone in or a big [TS]

01:24:48   reason why I would need to plug my phone [TS]

01:24:50   and so that's why this ramp our thing is [TS]

01:24:52   great to have in my desk because here's [TS]

01:24:54   the phone standing up it's charging much [TS]

01:24:56   of the time and when I want when I want [TS]

01:24:58   to build and run I can just pick it up [TS]

01:24:59   and it's glorious and I don't think we [TS]

01:25:03   think about these chargers is that there [TS]

01:25:04   are tons of them in all different shapes [TS]

01:25:07   and sizes and looks and while many of [TS]

01:25:10   them most of them I would say are these [TS]

01:25:13   hideous plastic things with fast charge [TS]

01:25:16   written in capital letters on them [TS]

01:25:17   somewhere for no reason [TS]

01:25:19   some of them are decent looking and [TS]

01:25:21   they're all really inexpensive like you [TS]

01:25:24   can get tons of them because Apple [TS]

01:25:26   didn't invent Qi charging it's been [TS]

01:25:27   around for some time and Android phones [TS]

01:25:30   have supported it for some time and so [TS]

01:25:31   there's a whole ecosystem out there of [TS]

01:25:32   existing Qi products that are all pretty [TS]

01:25:35   functional you know they're pretty ugly [TS]

01:25:38   most of them but they're pretty [TS]

01:25:39   functional and they're so cheap and I [TS]

01:25:42   even IKEA makes a lot of pretty decent [TS]

01:25:44   looking ones and and because they're so [TS]

01:25:47   plentiful and inexpensive you can afford [TS]

01:25:49   to put these pretty much all over the [TS]

01:25:51   place like I already have the one next [TS]

01:25:53   to my bed which is amazing I have the [TS]

01:25:55   one on my desk which is incredibly [TS]

01:25:56   useful and amazing I've ordered a few [TS]

01:25:59   more to have like on the kitchen counter [TS]

01:26:01   on the end table next to the couch [TS]

01:26:03   because like when we watch TV I often [TS]

01:26:05   will put my phone on that table well [TS]

01:26:07   might as well have a pad there right [TS]

01:26:09   like you know I mean I might confuse it [TS]

01:26:11   for a co store sometimes but it's only [TS]

01:26:13   if it's only 18 bucks that's not that [TS]

01:26:15   bad so like it's really it is a pretty [TS]

01:26:20   big game-changer it also brings another [TS]

01:26:24   big advantage that you can charge the [TS]

01:26:27   phone while you have something plugged [TS]

01:26:29   into the Lightning port like maybe [TS]

01:26:31   headphones because a very very common [TS]

01:26:34   need now that I see how cheat charging [TS]

01:26:37   actually works and and this is I'm sorry [TS]

01:26:39   Android people is this is like the Opera [TS]

01:26:41   did at first people [TS]

01:26:42   like the edger people just screaming [TS]

01:26:43   right now like we know we've had this [TS]

01:26:46   forever like you we you know you guys [TS]

01:26:49   are living in the past forever like I [TS]

01:26:50   know how frustrating this must be for [TS]

01:26:53   you Android people I'm sorry but this is [TS]

01:26:55   new to us it's so whatever you were [TS]

01:26:58   talking about six years ago when you and [TS]

01:27:00   opera did it together we are now [TS]

01:27:02   enjoying this now so let us have this [TS]

01:27:04   moment but it's so clear to me now that [TS]

01:27:08   the iPhone 7 should never have been the [TS]

01:27:12   phone to remove the headphone jack the [TS]

01:27:14   10 and the eights [TS]

01:27:15   should have been because that's [TS]

01:27:17   interesting once you have wireless [TS]

01:27:19   charging abilities one of the biggest [TS]

01:27:22   annoyances about the removal of the [TS]

01:27:25   headphone jack is you can't charge the [TS]

01:27:27   phone at the same time you have [TS]

01:27:28   headphones plugged in you know there are [TS]

01:27:30   other annoyances like having that dongle [TS]

01:27:32   for other headphones but the fact is [TS]

01:27:33   most people use the earbuds that come [TS]

01:27:35   with it and so or they use bluetooth [TS]

01:27:37   headphones honestly so you know it's [TS]

01:27:39   it's less intrusive as long as you can [TS]

01:27:42   use that lightning port but you can't [TS]

01:27:45   but so many people listen their phone [TS]

01:27:46   like all day at work because there were [TS]

01:27:48   computer doesn't have any you know they [TS]

01:27:49   can't install apps on it or something so [TS]

01:27:50   they use their phone to play Spotify or [TS]

01:27:52   whatever it's so common for people to [TS]

01:27:55   want to listen and charge all day long [TS]

01:27:56   and with the iPhone 7 they couldn't do [TS]

01:28:00   that without buying some kind of [TS]

01:28:01   expensive dongle or adapter or series of [TS]

01:28:04   adapters and dongles and it was horrible [TS]

01:28:06   whereas it's I think it's a much more [TS]

01:28:09   defensible position to have remove the [TS]

01:28:11   headphone jack when introducing Qi [TS]

01:28:14   charging because you can just get a $15 [TS]

01:28:16   disc and put it on your desk and that [TS]

01:28:18   problem goes away so a little side note [TS]

01:28:21   there but overall this is really great [TS]

01:28:24   and the charging speed thing that is [TS]

01:28:27   indeed a problem you know it is [TS]

01:28:29   noticeably slower than then like an iPad [TS]

01:28:32   brick through a wire or you know or like [TS]

01:28:35   a USB C power brick through a wire but [TS]

01:28:38   when you when you can afford and when [TS]

01:28:41   you can practically and when it's low [TS]

01:28:42   friction enough to put these little [TS]

01:28:44   charging pads all over the place the [TS]

01:28:47   charging speed becomes less important [TS]

01:28:48   because the battery is probably more [TS]

01:28:50   charged most of the time like you don't [TS]

01:28:52   have to go from 15 percent to [TS]

01:28:55   80% in a half hour because you're [TS]

01:28:57   probably not dropping the battery down [TS]

01:28:58   that load most of the time and for the [TS]

01:29:00   very few occasions that you actually [TS]

01:29:02   need very fast charging you can plug it [TS]

01:29:04   in somewhere for that you know you can [TS]

01:29:06   cable it for that the other benefits of [TS]

01:29:08   this is that all these all these times [TS]

01:29:11   every single night and throughout the [TS]

01:29:13   day that I'm not plugging in a lightning [TS]

01:29:16   cable over and over again plugging it in [TS]

01:29:18   unplugging it putting in an amount of [TS]

01:29:19   dock I'm saving tons of wear and tear on [TS]

01:29:22   the Lightning connector and on the bed [TS]

01:29:24   on the outside edge of the bottom of the [TS]

01:29:25   phone like my iPhone 7 I had to I had to [TS]

01:29:29   get my iphone 7 replaced after about six [TS]

01:29:32   months because the Lightning connector [TS]

01:29:34   broke like it just through regular use [TS]

01:29:36   it just like started frying cables and [TS]

01:29:38   then eventually just wouldn't charge [TS]

01:29:39   because I had probably some kind of [TS]

01:29:41   damage to pins or something in there who [TS]

01:29:42   knows and and that from what I learn at [TS]

01:29:45   the time that was not that uncommon of a [TS]

01:29:47   problem to have and so with this I am [TS]

01:29:50   I'm turning the Lightning port from [TS]

01:29:53   something that I plug something into you [TS]

01:29:56   know two to eight times a day probably [TS]

01:29:58   on average into something that on some [TS]

01:30:01   days I'll never use at all and so that's [TS]

01:30:03   probably gonna be great for long term [TS]

01:30:05   reliability of the port and of the phone [TS]

01:30:08   so to me this is pretty much all wins [TS]

01:30:11   I don't what do you guys think so what [TS]

01:30:14   room do you think there is for apples [TS]

01:30:16   air power Matt to come into this market [TS]

01:30:18   and give you something that you feel [TS]

01:30:20   like you're not getting like what like [TS]

01:30:22   is there place for Apple innovation here [TS]

01:30:24   or is like no matter what Apple comes [TS]

01:30:26   out with you're just gonna keep [TS]

01:30:28   surveying the field of cheap Android [TS]

01:30:31   focused chargers and just buy like 50 of [TS]

01:30:33   em and spread them around your house I [TS]

01:30:34   feel like if you have like the full [TS]

01:30:36   Apple combo of air pods [TS]

01:30:38   Apple watch and phone that becomes more [TS]

01:30:41   compelling for the air Powermat because [TS]

01:30:43   right now the air pods and the watch are [TS]

01:30:46   not Qi compatible you can't just put [TS]

01:30:48   them on a cheap desk and have them [TS]

01:30:49   charge they are they seem to be their [TS]

01:30:51   own little thing that only the air [TS]

01:30:52   Powermat will support so if you have all [TS]

01:30:57   the all the current Apple stuff you get [TS]

01:30:59   the the new air pods or the new case for [TS]

01:31:00   your old air pods you get the Apple [TS]

01:31:02   watch series 3 so it has whatever this [TS]

01:31:04   thing is in it and you have the iPhone 8 [TS]

01:31:06   or 10 [TS]

01:31:07   then you can go by the air power mat [TS]

01:31:10   whenever it comes out I honestly I'm [TS]

01:31:12   kind of wondering where it is like I [TS]

01:31:13   kind of it seems kind of weird for them [TS]

01:31:15   not to release it when they release [TS]

01:31:17   their sheet charging phones but oh well [TS]

01:31:20   that I can see being popular for the [TS]

01:31:24   people who are all in on new Apple gear [TS]

01:31:27   and want to charge it all at once if it [TS]

01:31:29   isn't too big or heavy that could also [TS]

01:31:31   be really nice to bring when you're [TS]

01:31:33   traveling if you if you travel with all [TS]

01:31:35   those Apple products that could be nice [TS]

01:31:37   to then not have to travel with it many [TS]

01:31:38   chargers or cables but ultimately I have [TS]

01:31:43   a feeling it's going to be very [TS]

01:31:44   expensive who knows it where it is it [TS]

01:31:47   isn't out yet and you know III think I [TS]

01:31:51   think it's gonna be a totally good [TS]

01:31:52   product probably that it's very likely [TS]

01:31:54   to be a good product but I think it's [TS]

01:31:56   going to be unlikely to be very [TS]

01:31:58   compelling unless you are one of those [TS]

01:32:01   Apple super power users with all the new [TS]

01:32:02   hardware you know see also home pod by [TS]

01:32:05   the way like I think Bloods gonna have [TS]

01:32:06   the exact same problem and where is that [TS]

01:32:09   another good question [TS]

01:32:11   but so you've got all that hardware but [TS]

01:32:13   I'm thinking that you're not gonna get [TS]

01:32:15   it because you want your phone to charge [TS]

01:32:18   while you're wirelessly debugging it [TS]

01:32:21   well FaceTime can see you and the air [TS]

01:32:23   Powermat makes everything lay flat on [TS]

01:32:25   the table so even though you have you [TS]

01:32:28   know you could get that you have air [TS]

01:32:29   pods and you could get the new case for [TS]

01:32:31   it for 60 whatever bucks if you wanted [TS]

01:32:32   and you have an Apple watch even though [TS]

01:32:34   you hardly ever wear it and you have a [TS]

01:32:36   phone but I don't think you want all [TS]

01:32:39   three of those things on the same mat [TS]

01:32:40   even on your nightstand I would imagine [TS]

01:32:42   that you don't have your ear pods your [TS]

01:32:46   watch and your phone all charging on [TS]

01:32:47   your nightstand because that's getting [TS]

01:32:48   pretty crowded right yeah - and isn't [TS]

01:32:51   big enough for all those things and you [TS]

01:32:52   know for me like my personal use here is [TS]

01:32:55   weird I don't use the air pods to fuse [TS]

01:32:57   the air pods I had to give her mine [TS]

01:32:58   because they don't they make my ears [TS]

01:32:59   hurt I know I really I wish I could wear [TS]

01:33:03   them because they're so good but I can't [TS]

01:33:06   so I don't have air pods that's one [TS]

01:33:08   thing out and in the Apple watch I do [TS]

01:33:10   wear it frequently just not for long [TS]

01:33:12   durations I wear it almost every day for [TS]

01:33:15   dog walks and foremost for much of the [TS]

01:33:17   morning but then I take it off when I [TS]

01:33:19   when I like you know showering a dress [TS]

01:33:20   for the day after [TS]

01:33:21   dog walking school drop-off and [TS]

01:33:23   everything else in any way so the Apple [TS]

01:33:26   watch those on my desk not upstairs but [TS]

01:33:28   this is this is like this is I get this [TS]

01:33:30   is a very unusual setup that I have here [TS]

01:33:32   I think most people who own the Apple [TS]

01:33:33   watch probably wear it every day where [TS]

01:33:35   most days so they might have different [TS]

01:33:37   needs than me but I'm guessing the air [TS]

01:33:41   power mats probably at a cost like one [TS]

01:33:44   to two hundred dollars I think it was [TS]

01:33:48   cortex Mike and gray brought up the the [TS]

01:33:52   problem of if you have like one of those [TS]

01:33:54   bands that doesn't let your watch lay [TS]

01:33:56   flat right like a link that like [TS]

01:33:57   bracelet or something then I guess you [TS]

01:33:59   also can't use the air power Mac because [TS]

01:34:01   you can't get your watch the charging [TS]

01:34:04   part of your watch on the bottom to [TS]

01:34:06   contact with the pad yep and that you [TS]

01:34:09   know what mostly what I'm getting at [TS]

01:34:11   with the air power mat which seems like [TS]

01:34:13   a good solution for like you know the [TS]

01:34:14   fat part of the curve of like hey you're [TS]

01:34:16   all and like you said you buy you got a [TS]

01:34:17   lot of Apple stuff and this will charged [TS]

01:34:19   all at once and isn't that convenient [TS]

01:34:20   but I don't envision Apple selling 17 [TS]

01:34:24   different charging minutes like they've [TS]

01:34:26   just got the one that they announced and [TS]

01:34:28   maybe there'll be a little bit of [TS]

01:34:29   variety on the line but nothing will [TS]

01:34:32   ever compare to the ecosystem of Qi [TS]

01:34:36   charging stuff that's out there and this [TS]

01:34:38   is the type of thing charging devices [TS]

01:34:41   even though there is a fat part of the [TS]

01:34:43   curve well most people charge things [TS]

01:34:44   like this there are long tails on both [TS]

01:34:47   sides all sorts of different scenarios [TS]

01:34:49   developers who want the thing upright [TS]

01:34:51   well the one I'm thinking of is like for [TS]

01:34:53   me families with lots of devices we [TS]

01:34:55   recently we've had lots of problems for [TS]

01:34:57   you know where to charge all our devices [TS]

01:34:58   and as our kids got older and have more [TS]

01:35:00   and more devices that they actually care [TS]

01:35:01   about you we have a problem of where you [TS]

01:35:04   charge all these things and the current [TS]

01:35:06   solution we're using it is really the [TS]

01:35:08   only one that physically fits in the [TS]

01:35:11   space we have allotted for wave like a [TS]

01:35:12   sideboard table and we have let's see we [TS]

01:35:15   all have iPads and we all have something [TS]

01:35:18   that's phone shaped and some of us have [TS]

01:35:21   watches right there is no room for all [TS]

01:35:27   those things to be laying on pads the [TS]

01:35:29   pad would have to be like 3 feet by 5 [TS]

01:35:31   feet to fit all those iOS devices in the [TS]

01:35:34   crazy jigsaw puzzle [TS]

01:35:35   right so even if Apple made like a [TS]

01:35:38   family pad where you can put all your [TS]

01:35:40   stuff good luck finding a place to put [TS]

01:35:43   four iPads for iPhones and two watches [TS]

01:35:46   down on a pad like are you gonna [TS]

01:35:47   dedicate an entire piece of furniture to [TS]

01:35:49   this it's just not efficient so we have [TS]

01:35:50   one of those things that like lets you [TS]

01:35:53   put them like books in a shelf like [TS]

01:35:55   vertically you know so they're all sort [TS]

01:35:56   of like lined up with each other and you [TS]

01:35:59   know you plug in lightning cables in the [TS]

01:36:00   back of them so it's like this big this [TS]

01:36:02   big it's not even that big it's like [TS]

01:36:03   nine inch by nine inch square with slots [TS]

01:36:06   and you just put the iPads or the phones [TS]

01:36:09   in the slots and you connect the [TS]

01:36:10   lightning cables from the side and we [TS]

01:36:13   can actually fit like three iPads and [TS]

01:36:16   four phones and no watches unfortunately [TS]

01:36:19   cousin do watches into a fairly small [TS]

01:36:21   amount of space these extremes like I [TS]

01:36:24   always want to have my phone upright and [TS]

01:36:26   facing me so I can tell you I don't [TS]

01:36:27   often I'm doing an iOS development or I [TS]

01:36:28   have a family of you know many people [TS]

01:36:31   with many devices and I need a place [TS]

01:36:32   where they can charge all of them every [TS]

01:36:34   day and not you know cover the surface [TS]

01:36:36   of some desk with either a giant pad or [TS]

01:36:38   a rat's nest of wires or both apples [TS]

01:36:41   never gonna address those needs they're [TS]

01:36:43   gonna make one or two pads just like [TS]

01:36:45   they make one or two docks and that'll [TS]

01:36:48   be that so despite whatever advantages [TS]

01:36:51   Apple may have all you know the Apple [TS]

01:36:52   pad charges faster the Apple pad can [TS]

01:36:54   charge your watch you have a pad is less [TS]

01:36:55   finicky about finding all your devices [TS]

01:36:58   it's never going to be the go-to [TS]

01:37:01   recommendation I think because the first [TS]

01:37:04   question will be how many devices do you [TS]

01:37:06   want to charge and where do you want [TS]

01:37:07   them to charge and what orientation do [TS]

01:37:08   you want them to charge and pads in [TS]

01:37:10   general will never be the solution to [TS]

01:37:12   lots of devices if they require any [TS]

01:37:14   device that charges on to lay flat I [TS]

01:37:17   mean imagine if you had a family of four [TS]

01:37:18   people all with 12 49 inch iPad it's [TS]

01:37:20   like now you're getting into like a [TS]

01:37:21   coffee table just you want the Apple [TS]

01:37:26   surface yeah you but you want them to be [TS]

01:37:29   vertical in for vertical stuff you need [TS]

01:37:31   you know something like the I was for [TS]

01:37:34   the other company started by the guy who [TS]

01:37:36   did on live Steve Perlman or whatever [TS]

01:37:38   the wireless power delivery but why for [TS]

01:37:41   me no are you so yeah artemus piece oh [TS]

01:37:45   yeah something like that where you could [TS]

01:37:47   actually have them [TS]

01:37:48   like books in the shelf and have them [TS]

01:37:50   all wirelessly charge but we're not [TS]

01:37:52   there yet [TS]

01:37:52   so anyway I'm I'm intrigued by what you [TS]

01:37:55   described marker like the you know the [TS]

01:37:56   the sort of described as crossing a [TS]

01:37:59   threshold where like yeah it's only [TS]

01:38:01   slightly less annoying to plug in but [TS]

01:38:02   you crossed over some threshold and it's [TS]

01:38:04   like you're freed up like from it just [TS]

01:38:07   feels so different you never want to [TS]

01:38:08   like line up a little thing with the [TS]

01:38:10   hole and again [TS]

01:38:11   and so I'm actually kind of interested [TS]

01:38:13   in I'm suing my next one we'll have [TS]

01:38:15   wireless charging and I'll think about [TS]

01:38:16   you know what do I want a pad for my [TS]

01:38:18   nightstand do I want a little up right [TS]

01:38:19   thing for my desk go on both because [TS]

01:38:22   they're only 20 bucks each maybe I'll [TS]

01:38:23   both that's I feel like that's the power [TS]

01:38:26   of this ecosystem is that because there [TS]

01:38:28   are so many options and most of them [TS]

01:38:29   cost pretty little you can just get a [TS]

01:38:32   lot of them and they're probably gonna [TS]

01:38:34   last a while because you're not having [TS]

01:38:36   some connector that's getting plugged in [TS]

01:38:37   unplug all the time like so like the the [TS]

01:38:39   wear and tear on these is probably gonna [TS]

01:38:41   be fairly minimal I'm guessing this is [TS]

01:38:44   gonna last multiple phones and maybe [TS]

01:38:46   down the road it won't be the fastest [TS]

01:38:48   charging method I mean it isn't today [TS]

01:38:50   even so I can you know maybe down the [TS]

01:38:52   road that they'll develop higher wattage [TS]

01:38:53   ones and you'll maybe you'll want those [TS]

01:38:55   in certain places but I bet having these [TS]

01:38:57   around everywhere are still gonna be [TS]

01:38:58   useful so I have a question for you [TS]

01:39:01   Marco [TS]

01:39:02   I know you've only tried a couple of [TS]

01:39:05   these so far but I'm looking at IKEA and [TS]

01:39:07   they have something that's spelled are a [TS]

01:39:09   lot llen [TS]

01:39:11   and it's an integrated wireless charger [TS]

01:39:13   comma black it that's 12 dollars and it [TS]

01:39:16   looks pretty cheap yeah exactly [TS]

01:39:18   it looks to me to be quite a bit taller [TS]

01:39:21   than the what was the good one that you [TS]

01:39:23   said the movie one okay thank you [TS]

01:39:26   it looks to be to me to be quite a bit [TS]

01:39:28   taller than the Mophie but the Mophie is [TS]

01:39:30   listed on Apple's website as $60 and [TS]

01:39:32   this is 12 [TS]

01:39:33   yeah like is what having never held the [TS]

01:39:37   IKEA one from the best that you can do [TS]

01:39:41   you feel like the Mophie one is you know [TS]

01:39:43   like five times better than this is [TS]

01:39:45   probably not I mean that you know you're [TS]

01:39:48   paying the Mophie tax you're also paying [TS]

01:39:50   the Apple certification tax you know [TS]

01:39:52   like that like that's you're paying a [TS]

01:39:54   lot of taxes on that they you know for [TS]

01:39:55   for what it is but this this Ram power [TS]

01:39:58   one I think was like 20 bucks something [TS]

01:40:00   like that somewhere around 20 bucks [TS]

01:40:02   and it's totally fine - it seems to [TS]

01:40:04   charge the same speed for now I mean I [TS]

01:40:07   don't think it's gonna get the 7.5 watt [TS]

01:40:08   upgrade but I don't honestly really care [TS]

01:40:11   that much because I don't need that much [TS]

01:40:14   charging speed on my desk right at this [TS]

01:40:15   moment but you know I feel like this is [TS]

01:40:19   the kind of thing where like first of [TS]

01:40:21   all because everything is so inexpensive [TS]

01:40:22   you can afford to try a few of them and [TS]

01:40:24   see what works best for you yeah but you [TS]

01:40:28   know ultimately if you buy one and it's [TS]

01:40:31   just kind of okay and you want to later [TS]

01:40:34   down the road get a nicer one you're [TS]

01:40:37   totally fine that's totally reasonable [TS]

01:40:39   just move the one that you're not using [TS]

01:40:40   anymore in one place move it somewhere [TS]

01:40:42   else in the house and you'll figure out [TS]

01:40:44   a way to use it like you'll it'll these [TS]

01:40:46   things I haven't filled were gonna are [TS]

01:40:47   gonna be as useful and long-lasting as [TS]

01:40:50   like cables are you know like no one [TS]

01:40:53   says like you know you shouldn't buy [TS]

01:40:54   another lightning cable you'll never use [TS]

01:40:56   it like you depending on maybe if you [TS]

01:40:58   buy so many charges you might not use it [TS]

01:41:00   but yeah but now it's like it's it's so [TS]

01:41:04   useful that now I'm thinking like you [TS]

01:41:07   know do I want to replace my little [TS]

01:41:08   power bank battery with one that [TS]

01:41:11   includes a cheap hat some of them do it [TS]

01:41:13   like some of them can some of the [TS]

01:41:14   batteries have Qi charging pads on them [TS]

01:41:16   so you could place your phone on the [TS]

01:41:18   battery and not even use a cable to [TS]

01:41:20   charge it like this stuff like that like [TS]

01:41:22   I'm now looking at looking at other [TS]

01:41:23   things that like I just want like can I [TS]

01:41:26   put one in my car can I get my car dock [TS]

01:41:28   look at current I have some kind of like [TS]

01:41:30   you know a little suction cup mount in [TS]

01:41:31   the car so I can use Waze which is some [TS]

01:41:33   point we're gonna talk about I had one [TS]

01:41:36   of those and said can I get one of those [TS]

01:41:37   that uses cheese so I don't have to plug [TS]

01:41:39   the cable into that over and over again [TS]

01:41:40   like it's the kind of thing once you get [TS]

01:41:43   one of these things you see how awesome [TS]

01:41:46   it is like all right where else can I [TS]

01:41:49   take advantage of this like can I put [TS]

01:41:50   one on the couch end table can I put one [TS]

01:41:52   on my nightstand can I put one on my [TS]

01:41:54   spouse's ID with a nice tang can I put [TS]

01:41:55   one in the kitchen like you you kind of [TS]

01:41:57   want them all over the place because [TS]

01:41:58   it's so nice and then you're walking [TS]

01:42:00   around with a pretty much always fully [TS]

01:42:02   charged phone so that when you do need [TS]

01:42:04   to leave the house or go somewhere do [TS]

01:42:05   something crazy you can do that and your [TS]

01:42:07   phone's not going to totally burn [TS]

01:42:09   through like the last 20% of battery it [TS]

01:42:10   has because you have been charging all [TS]

01:42:11   day [TS]

01:42:12   yeah so a couple of notes about this [TS]

01:42:14   IKEA one first of all this apparently [TS]

01:42:16   tops out at five watts second of all it [TS]

01:42:19   may or may not include the wall brick [TS]

01:42:21   and associated paraphernalia that you [TS]

01:42:23   need to plug into the charger itself [TS]

01:42:25   whereas the Mophie one apparently does [TS]

01:42:27   come with all that also the both v1 as [TS]

01:42:29   far as I can tell Marco does not have [TS]

01:42:31   any illuminated lights or LEDs or [TS]

01:42:33   anything when it's charging is that [TS]

01:42:34   correct no it has a very small white LED [TS]

01:42:37   in the base it doesn't it isn't like a [TS]

01:42:39   ring shape on the the RAM power has like [TS]

01:42:41   a small ring around it that glows softly [TS]

01:42:44   white when you first put the phone on it [TS]

01:42:46   does not stay lit it just like goes on [TS]

01:42:48   for like a minute when you first put it [TS]

01:42:49   on the the Mophie pad it has a single [TS]

01:42:54   white LED shining from one dot on one [TS]

01:42:57   side I think there's one side and I [TS]

01:43:00   don't think that stays lit either [TS]

01:43:01   either way if you're charging an iPhone [TS]

01:43:03   you don't need any kind of lighting and [TS]

01:43:04   I'm very hungry to just cover these up [TS]

01:43:06   or tape or paint over them or something [TS]

01:43:08   because sure the iPhone when you put it [TS]

01:43:10   on the charger it you know the screen [TS]

01:43:13   turns on for a minute and it goes blink [TS]

01:43:14   you know it makes the the it plugged in [TS]

01:43:16   sound and so like it's very obvious [TS]

01:43:18   without any kind of indication from the [TS]

01:43:20   charger itself the iPhone makes it [TS]

01:43:22   obvious [TS]

01:43:22   whether you are on it or not so and [TS]

01:43:24   because one of the reasons why I like [TS]

01:43:25   I'm I have not yet had any issues with [TS]

01:43:29   like misalignment or misplacing it [TS]

01:43:30   because it makes it very clear yeah and [TS]

01:43:33   I brought this up because a friend of [TS]

01:43:35   the show jelly in the chat room had had [TS]

01:43:37   said that he has the IKEA one and it [TS]

01:43:39   works fine but it has a pretty bright [TS]

01:43:41   white light while while charging and I [TS]

01:43:43   think it was the Belkin one had a very [TS]

01:43:44   bright blue light while charging if I'm [TS]

01:43:46   not mistaken there was a anchor makes [TS]

01:43:48   one or that it has like this is ring of [TS]

01:43:50   blue LEDs yeah it's a kind of thing like [TS]

01:43:56   unfortunately like with muck with a lot [TS]

01:43:59   of like you know cheap commodity [TS]

01:44:00   hardware taste does not come frequently [TS]

01:44:03   to these products it's it's very hard to [TS]

01:44:07   find nice ones but we I'm sure like now [TS]

01:44:12   that the iPhone supports this and now [TS]

01:44:13   that a lot more high-end buyers are [TS]

01:44:15   looking for these things there's gonna [TS]

01:44:16   be a lot more coming out there's one [TS]

01:44:18   this portly company called Grove made [TS]

01:44:19   has has one that's coming soon that I've [TS]

01:44:22   pre-ordered that is like a fancy like [TS]

01:44:24   metal and cork [TS]

01:44:25   one for like 80 bucks your days of $20 [TS]

01:44:29   chief Chargers are coming to an end as [TS]

01:44:32   the artisanal handcrafted ones start [TS]

01:44:34   appearing [TS]

01:44:34   well yeah but as we start buying them [TS]

01:44:36   like the one on my desk that can be the [TS]

01:44:38   you know the the one that says fast [TS]

01:44:40   charge and big letters Minh has an LED [TS]

01:44:41   in it but the one I put in the living [TS]

01:44:43   room on the couch end table that's [TS]

01:44:45   probably gonna have to be something [TS]

01:44:46   nicer your whole end table should be the [TS]

01:44:48   T charger just like every car like a [TS]

01:44:49   little like center center console things [TS]

01:44:52   they all have tea charters yeah yeah [TS]

01:44:53   where you just check the phone into this [TS]

01:44:55   little bin and they all charge yeah no [TS]

01:44:56   that's that I want that no it's funny [TS]

01:44:58   it's so IKEA actually sells one of the [TS]

01:45:00   Ikea things is just like a charger [TS]

01:45:03   that's almost shaped like a cup holder [TS]

01:45:04   insert and and they and the idea is you [TS]

01:45:07   take a hole saw and of like exactly that [TS]

01:45:09   size and you can drill a hole into a [TS]

01:45:11   desk or table or any desk or table you [TS]

01:45:13   already have and just drop this in there [TS]

01:45:16   and then that becomes a teacher which is [TS]

01:45:18   kind of clever yeah and actually I'm [TS]

01:45:21   glad you brought that up John because a [TS]

01:45:23   friend of mine who has recently acquired [TS]

01:45:25   an m2 has pointed out to me that between [TS]

01:45:30   Wireless carplay and the fact that the [TS]

01:45:32   m2 actually does have Qi charging in it [TS]

01:45:35   he has like the perfect setup for for [TS]

01:45:39   his car and I was curious Marco if [TS]

01:45:41   you've looked at Tiff's car to see if [TS]

01:45:43   she also has a charging pad within her [TS]

01:45:46   car I'm pretty sure that was available [TS]

01:45:49   as an option and we didn't select it [TS]

01:45:51   because Lal iPhones don't support [TS]

01:45:53   wireless charging we'll never need this [TS]

01:45:55   just sing a video review of a car maybe [TS]

01:45:58   you saw it to Casey of someone [TS]

01:45:59   complaining that the little cubby where [TS]

01:46:01   you chuck your phone it's like hard to [TS]

01:46:03   get your phone in and out of there like [TS]

01:46:05   they'd seem to do everything right hey [TS]

01:46:06   you got Wireless carplay you got a t [TS]

01:46:07   charging that when you get a new car [TS]

01:46:09   wasn't that the Verge's iPhone 10 review [TS]

01:46:12   with Neely anyway anyway the point is [TS]

01:46:14   that like leave it to car makers to find [TS]

01:46:16   a way to screw it up right like finally [TS]

01:46:18   the dream you just get into your car and [TS]

01:46:20   check your phone into like that's what [TS]

01:46:21   people do with their phones now anyway [TS]

01:46:23   for the most part is either they clip [TS]

01:46:24   them in a little Clippy thing so they [TS]

01:46:25   can see the navigation or they check it [TS]

01:46:27   somewhere so they can be dangerous and [TS]

01:46:29   see their text messages when they appear [TS]

01:46:30   or stuff like that right or plug it into [TS]

01:46:33   a charger like my wife has a like a wire [TS]

01:46:35   coming out of the little center console [TS]

01:46:37   you know aligning some things [TS]

01:46:39   you can plug it in and you know charge [TS]

01:46:41   while you drive your phone wouldn't it [TS]

01:46:42   be great if you didn't have to plug that [TS]

01:46:43   in but then car makers make the cubby in [TS]

01:46:46   a weird place or awkward to get to or [TS]

01:46:48   fiddly to get your phone in and out of [TS]

01:46:50   or to place in it so that it actually [TS]

01:46:51   stays on the pad and isn't like up on an [TS]

01:46:53   angle and not actually contacting the [TS]

01:46:55   pad but you know give them a few decades [TS]

01:46:57   they'll figure it out oh well and one [TS]

01:46:59   more thing to be careful of when you're [TS]

01:47:01   looking at you chargers some of them [TS]

01:47:03   have fans and this depending on your [TS]

01:47:06   point of view one fans one of so and I'm [TS]

01:47:10   not entirely clear yet from like Amazon [TS]

01:47:11   reviews so there's you know these things [TS]

01:47:14   support like the regular five watt [TS]

01:47:16   charging rate and then the reason why [TS]

01:47:18   some of them yell fast charger on them [TS]

01:47:20   is because they support like a higher [TS]

01:47:21   wattage thing for certain Android phones [TS]

01:47:23   that have these varying fast charge [TS]

01:47:26   standards as far as I know the iPhone [TS]

01:47:28   does not support those fast charge [TS]

01:47:30   standards but maybe in the future who [TS]

01:47:31   knows anyway so I I'm not clear whether [TS]

01:47:34   the fans usually only kick on during [TS]

01:47:36   fast charging or whether they are on all [TS]

01:47:38   the time or what like I don't know like [TS]

01:47:40   he put an iPhone on there will it engage [TS]

01:47:42   the fan I don't know some people like [TS]

01:47:45   the fans because it keeps their phone [TS]

01:47:46   cooler because when you fast charge with [TS]

01:47:48   you ion batteries they get hotter so [TS]

01:47:50   that's actually a thing that could be [TS]

01:47:51   necessary I don't think an iPhone is [TS]

01:47:54   going to draw enough power for you to [TS]

01:47:55   need that especially if you're doing you [TS]

01:47:57   know all-day trickle charging at 5 watts [TS]

01:47:59   so I have elected to buy 0 models with [TS]

01:48:03   fans and I intend to never buy one with [TS]

01:48:05   a fan because that sounds like a [TS]

01:48:06   terrible idea to have this already very [TS]

01:48:09   inexpensive and tastelessly designed [TS]

01:48:11   object let's throw a cheap fan in there [TS]

01:48:14   and see how well that works out no [TS]

01:48:16   thanks yeah real-time follow-up it was [TS]

01:48:19   an m5 50 I in the Verge's iPhone 10 [TS]

01:48:22   review additional real-time follow-up [TS]

01:48:25   from our conversation before Jonathan [TS]

01:48:27   bowling has clarified it was an honest [TS]

01:48:29   question but I was betting something [TS]

01:48:31   pretty funny might happen in the answers [TS]

01:48:37   something funny would happen oh come on [TS]

01:48:41   like that he knew that he knew the [TS]

01:48:44   background it wasn't just like Oh try to [TS]

01:48:48   defend yourself it would be a don't [TS]

01:48:50   think about it [TS]

01:48:51   this question can you tell me how you [TS]

01:48:53   might explain to someone how to [TS]

01:48:54   pronounce bezel this is an honest [TS]

01:48:56   question now no connection to anything I [TS]

01:48:58   just want to know like a toy I will not [TS]

01:49:00   I will not I have a feeling the answer [TS]

01:49:01   might be kind of funny no I will not [TS]

01:49:04   allow this you are reading way too much [TS]

01:49:06   into this and it isn't an idea the [TS]

01:49:10   answer might be funny he just said it [TS]

01:49:12   was known this question because we have [TS]

01:49:13   no way to verify always telling a truth [TS]

01:49:15   he went too far oh come now you are [TS]

01:49:19   being absolutely preposterous I cannot [TS]

01:49:21   believe I cannot believe you're hanging [TS]

01:49:23   your hat on this I'm back to the back to [TS]

01:49:26   the car on the verge review by the way [TS]

01:49:28   the reason I remembered it is not your [TS]

01:49:30   right now next five it was because it [TS]

01:49:31   was I remember when they showed the [TS]

01:49:32   badge and I said no case he's gonna be [TS]

01:49:33   angry about this because it's the m5 50 [TS]

01:49:36   I like what the hell is the m5 50 I is [TS]

01:49:38   it an m5 50 I oh it's just the M Sport [TS]

01:49:42   package and they named the thing and [TS]

01:49:44   that's why I had to remembered it [TS]

01:49:46   because that's BS at least we can all [TS]

01:49:49   agree on that I cannot believe you're [TS]

01:49:51   hanging your hat on this John you can't [TS]

01:49:53   have anything I'm just explaining thanks [TS]

01:49:55   to our sponsors this week betterment [TS]

01:49:57   fracture and jams now and we will talk [TS]

01:50:00   to you next week now the show is over [TS]

01:50:05   they didn't even mean to begin as it was [TS]

01:50:09   accidental accidental [TS]

01:50:15   research Marco and Casey wouldn't let [TS]

01:50:18   him cuz it was accidentally was [TS]

01:50:22   accidental and you can find the show [TS]

01:50:26   notes at ADP yl is s so that's Casey [TS]

01:50:39   less and a RC own a RM ante Marco Arment [TS]

01:50:45   as I are a Syracuse [TS]

01:50:54   [Music] [TS]

01:51:02   are we still friends a little bit I [TS]

01:51:10   don't want I don't like a question it's [TS]

01:51:12   not it's not an invitation to discuss it [TS]

01:51:13   on the show it's an invitation to not [TS]

01:51:15   discuss it on the show I tried to not [TS]

01:51:17   discuss it on the show explained and you [TS]

01:51:27   just didn't like the explanation yeah [TS]

01:51:29   many reasons it's not a fucking [TS]

01:51:31   explanation oh you mean I explained it I [TS]

01:51:33   told you I was on my iPad in one type I [TS]

01:51:35   know that now I know that catching up on [TS]

01:51:39   Twitter watching destiny videos it's [TS]

01:51:41   important pre-show well yeah that's more [TS]

01:51:42   important to your good friend please I [TS]

01:51:45   was gonna talk to you on skype like 15 [TS]

01:51:48   minutes that's all right if it makes you [TS]

01:51:51   feel I was busy talking to Merlin okay [TS]

01:51:54   mister close to the metal about if he [TS]

01:51:57   makes me feel better I was fully [TS]

01:51:59   prepared in I was Manning my battle [TS]

01:52:01   stations to take marco to task about his [TS]

01:52:03   his laptop article earlier today I know [TS]

01:52:08   we just never got around to it so yeah [TS]

01:52:10   really that was that was frustration [TS]

01:52:12   with Marco that somehow ended up on your [TS]

01:52:14   plate [TS]

01:52:14   on your lap so my bad you're welcome no [TS]

01:52:24   I I do still love both of you even [TS]

01:52:26   though John you're killing me today [TS]

01:52:35   like you just let it be I don't like the [TS]

01:52:38   question but like I said I don't I the [TS]

01:52:42   reason they didn't delete the question [TS]

01:52:43   is because like I just pushed it down [TS]

01:52:45   because I felt like I had three more [TS]

01:52:46   better one you know the three though [TS]

01:52:48   that is alright that's fair that's so [TS]

01:52:52   and like I'm you know if we didn't if we [TS]

01:52:53   need this question for next week or you [TS]

01:52:55   want answer to you had an angle because [TS]

01:52:56   it's very difficult to know what you [TS]

01:52:57   know angle you might have an answer like [TS]

01:52:59   often I put things in there because I [TS]

01:53:00   have a specific kind of answer about it [TS]

01:53:02   even though the question looks you know [TS]

01:53:04   particularly simple anyway mhm no that's [TS]

01:53:06   fair you did that's fair that's fair [TS]

01:53:09   alright what else we can even delete it [TS]

01:53:12   out [TS]

01:53:14   well it's gonna make it in the show so [TS]

01:53:16   of course I can delete it no I don't [TS]

01:53:18   know I know sing oh it's gotta stand [TS]

01:53:26   gotta stick the problem is you guys made [TS]

01:53:28   it too good I was gonna cut it out and [TS]

01:53:30   then you made it good you're welcome but [TS]

01:53:32   it's gonna be like nonsense there's a [TS]

01:53:33   lot of nonsense a lot of inside baseball [TS]

01:53:34   that people don't care about isn't that [TS]

01:53:37   our whole show no not the whole show [TS]

01:53:39   it's it's the it's the podcast [TS]

01:53:41   equivalent of talking about Skype like [TS]

01:53:42   you know but he's gonna cut out the [TS]

01:53:46   skywards oh yeah there's no way Scott's [TS]

01:53:47   being in that cycle I know that is [TS]

01:53:50   illegal [TS]