146: Bashing Two Action Figures Together
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the incomparable number 146 to plan to
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welcome back to being comfortable
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podcast I'm your host Jason snow and in
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this episode we're going to talk about a
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recent movie release so many of the
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things we do on this podcast it's
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classic stuff stuff that's been out for
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a while but in the last few months we've
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been trying to do a few of the summer
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movies and and get them out there sooner
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and so this is something that came out
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not too long ago as we record this week
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it's a man of steel the zack snyder
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directed Superman movie and we're going
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to talk about it for the next hour ish
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probably unless we all get very
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frustrated and say this podcast is over
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and then i'll be the shortest episode
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joining me to talk about the new
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Superman movie are my three
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distinguished panelists Dan Morgan hi
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dan thanks for coming thanks for being
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I Jason it's great to be back after such
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a long time away from the incomparable
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yeah you say that but the other episodes
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i've recorded with you recently aren't
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going to air for weeks now but I'm just
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screwing with our audience just between
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you and me we've done a lot of these
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this week John siracusa is also here
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John thanks for being here does this
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title have missing colon 2 or is that
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not a thing but me and you will not see
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yes man of colon steel XO man of steel
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no that's I would watch that movie
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totally different character Action Man
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O'War and because of the yeah that was a
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reference the comic reference brought
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him out it's more sense to you on high
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moisture is I Jason I'd like to think of
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myself as the the crypto in this lineup
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yes Oh Krypto the Superdog he will be
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making an appearance on a on a on a
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future in comfortable life is one of us
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Supergirl is one of us like Beppo boppo
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buca di beppo know but both a superchip
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about the super cheap yeah alright sorry
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i was reading an interview with David
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Goyer this morning in which he talks to
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tell the story about sitting on set with
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russell crowe and says to him
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yeah the senior going to be acting
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opposite beppo the super to cross your
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arm I'll just looks at him and it's like
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are you will leave in kidding me and it
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was like yeah yeah I'm just kidding
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so this is a I like to talk about when
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the movie was made this is a movie from
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2013 how was released last week so it's
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it's not it's not a classic but we're
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going to dive in just
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we did with iron man and star trek and
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I'm gonna blow the spoiler horn here
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because really even though I ok let's
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defense out he's an alien
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oh yeah jor-el dies kryptonics blows up
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a Superman color can do the same guy
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that would have been a really bold move
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if they decided like maybe let's not
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just blow up Krypton the Sun like it's
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still there when he can shoot lasers
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from his eyes narrow drops red matter
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into Klingon planet Krypton and it blows
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up it's very sad to see that would be
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really shaking things up bringing the
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arms and in sit and Romulans from the
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future man is from the homeworld of the
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Klingons so Warner Brothers buys
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paramount merges star trekkin see all
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spoilers real and imagined we're going
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to talk about what's in this movie which
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means if you have not seen this movie
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you should not listen to this episode
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unless you are crazy person and if
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you're a crazy person I don't want to
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get near you because you might stab me
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so do whatever you like
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there is porn spoken so I man of steel
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this is a movie that was written by what
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David lawyer and christopher nolan Jonah
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Nolan no no one no one bucknell no
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Christopher Nolan Ryan and so
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Christopher Nolan who brought us the
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dark knight trilogy that the Batman
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Begins trilogy and so that there but
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it's zack snyder the director of 300 and
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watch men an interesting combination
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I've seen a lot of articles that sort of
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like in this Superman reboot 22 dark
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night movies I'm not sure I necessarily
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buy that but it's definitely I think
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Superman shooting for
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unlike Superman Returns which was
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honoring the those classic Christopher
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Reeve movies this is a return to the
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beginning and people who listen being
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comfortable know that I complain a lot
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about retelling of origin stories you
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know I sometimes I guess superheroes
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most interesting story is their origin
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other times I wonder though if we've
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seen all these origins before and
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they're not that interesting so it we
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get it here i think so here's the thing
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i have lots of problems with this movie
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but I one of the reasons i have problems
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with this movie is that I think that
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there are a lot of things this movie
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does right with a problematic character
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and Superman who has his 75 years old
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his origins are a little bit strange
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they did do some rewriting and
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refiguring of his origins and I think
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they I think for a lot of that they do a
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pretty good job so in this movie we see
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when Krypton there's sort of like
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political imaginations there's a corrupt
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Society russell crowe is jor-el he's
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he's trying to convince the corrupt
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government to do something because the
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planet's gonna implode on itself because
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they've been mining the core or
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something it's an ecological catastrophe
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basically but meanwhile General Zod has
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he would like to just shoot everybody
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essentially and that's it and that's
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sort of how the movie get started we
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discover that this is what motivates URL
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to send his son who
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turns out is the first child born of of
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woman instead of out of a test tube in
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Krypton in thousands of years and send
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his Son and the genetic material that
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makes up the entire Kryptonian race to
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earth and meanwhile General Zod is
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blowing things up and and it was a
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little like avatar because girl rides on
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a little like one of those hostages
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dragon chalice is like a dragonfly
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yeah something like that which I
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actually thought was kind of cool
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this means a great it's a great-looking
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sequence this whole section of Krypton I
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think it's actually some of the better
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green screen work I've seen yeah there's
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my ride avatar a little bit with a funny
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flying creatures in the weird shape
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buildings and stuff well in the design i
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looked like some of the design i like
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the little robot you know his little
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probe guys that you got going around
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with them that's got scored the what do
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you call that thing nothing that's like
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made an impression
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yeah that's right in the president yeah
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it's got that thing direction as the is
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the definition of all technology on
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yeah that's as far as they advanced they
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got to like the nineteen eighties and
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we're like my head and organ x-men to
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oh yeah oh yeah sharper image was very
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big on Krypton so I i think it's
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good-looking there's a lot of good it's
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good looking effects it's a you know
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spectacular sequence in terms of just
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you know literally spectacle but it's
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also way too long
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yeah that's what that's what you want to
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have an opening sequences you want to
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knock people not people socks off right
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from the get-go and starting with
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Krypton wherever is watching this movie
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knows what's gonna happen like we know
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we're not going to be spending much of
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this movie on Krypton Scott blow up
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pretty soon and yeah it does go a little
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bit long they could have compressed it a
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little bit but like I when the movie
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opens I was impressed by the visuals and
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but because i figured like okay they got
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to go chop chop chop I gotta have
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Darrell he complains sends the Sun off
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final blows up figured that would happen
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in pretty rapid sequence and the fact
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that they let it run a little bit too
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long maybe a few too many sequences
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should have been a warning for the right
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how they were going to handle the rest
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of the movie but at that point I was
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willing to give them the benefit of the
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doubt inside this look really cool yeah
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i like the fact that i like how
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everything played out i like that i like
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to all the designs and the effects were
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very impressive and I didn't you know I
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didn't fall in for anything except
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dragging out a bit much although in some
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of those things like
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it's showing the story about his parents
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and whatever actress played his mother
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and everything like i like to the the
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actress who played his mother I'd like
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Russell Crowe for the most part when he
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yeah i guess they wanted to make them
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into some kind of characters before they
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killed them off but i don't know if
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that's essential for superman movie and
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it made me it kind of makes sense of why
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he sent to Earth in a retelling the you
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know again I i don't really is a little
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I I like well I like I'm trying to make
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it something that feels a little more
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modern and relevant and and they didn't
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want the sort of sci-fi plot route here
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but you know it was it was kind of
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interesting it's me it's makto we really
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need a reason later why Zod is looking
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at this time like that that's what did I
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don't think that's terrible you do
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because I was trying to think back to
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Superman to him like why was odd there
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he was just annoyed that he was trapped
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in a mirror for a long time and you want
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to feel like this is at least a better
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motivation because in this in this
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genetic world where the people are
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designed for certain roles his role in
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the role he was designed for dictates
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that he would go after the guy who's got
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this genetic code or whatever like it's
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silly but it you need something to give
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a character motivation and as far as
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motivations go it makes sense in context
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and what's it's a way to explain the
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kind of black-and-white cold war-era
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villain that Zod was in the Superman
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mythos where he is he's he's about as
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nuanced is Cobra Commander in the comics
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he's just and in this movie and another
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movie I think I ya is more sympathetic
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in the movie because it's like that's
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what is it you know when he goes to
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everything I've done I've done to save
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Krypton ago well you know if he was if
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he was genetically bred to be that
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particular role as the leader of the
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Armed Forces whose goal is to protect
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crypt honest it's like a howl 9000
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scenario where he was programmed to
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protect the mission at all costs and
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ends up doing bad things really is just
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trying to protect the mission right well
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that is just trying to save Krypton yes
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blew up but carrying out his program so
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this is the logical consequence and it
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would also make sense that you would
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have no qualms about doing terrible
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things because he is also supposed to be
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the leader of the Armed Forces exactly
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well yeah and despite the fact these
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the Armed Forces i also was was thrown
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off a little bit by the fact that you
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know Russell Crowe in a world where
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apparently everybody is genetically bred
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for a specific purpose and yet
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russell crowe manages to pretty well
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hold his own against like the top of the
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warrior caste presumably which is it
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loses in like five minutes it's not like
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you know but I mean heels that we keep
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knocking down a couple times like that
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Johnson the the scientists versus the
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warrior fights should be over in about
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three seconds and I and this is an issue
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i have later on to with the you know
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which will get to with the the superman
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vs odd fights to their there is the
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russell crowe suspension of disbelief
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clause in his contract is science armor
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yeah you know and yet science armor
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right science armor and just it's it's
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something that they're contractually
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obligated to give Russell Crowe one
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fight in every movie that he's in where
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he is the fist of justice fighting
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against evil and he at least starts to
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get the upper hand on somebody had
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happened lame as Rob and they they they
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made Javert you know more of a more of a
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a strapping badass the same as gladiator
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realize i just think this is the least
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least believable superhero scientists
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since Arnold Schwarzenegger plate Victor
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fries couch so I don't want us to stay
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on Krypton too long like the movie does
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but uh it is interesting and it and what
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we end up getting next which I i found a
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lot of relief about is we don't end up
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with you know comet kind of thing in the
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sky people in Kansas wonder what it is
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thing comes down Jonathan Kent finds it
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you know be naked baby picks up a car
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you know all that kind of stuff instead
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we get a we get an adult more or less
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Clark and we see him he's kind of a kind
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of a drifter a traveler going from place
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to place but he's also renal yeah
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exactly he's with the beard laws but
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he's yeah he's scruffy and he's nice
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though he's not Wolverine Wolverines not
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nice but he's scruffy and and then in
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flashback we see sort of the story of
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him growing up I i like to the attempted
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to go i was really dreading the yet
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another retelling of the origin story
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quite why you dreading that why here a
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lot of people complain all I can see is
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origin stories in our what is it about
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the origin story Superman's origin story
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in particular that is off-putting to you
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I you know as its not Superman in
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particular I didn't really want to see
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spider-man's origin story a second time
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in ten years either end and it's just
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it's it's the this ground this
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particular grounds been tread on with
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the Superman movies with smallville I
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mean hanging out years of small i I just
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I don't know I I worried that it was
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going to be a story tell me a story that
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I've heard in exactly the same way I
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heard it before what I like is they
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tried to tell it differently and I think
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it was effective in large part I liked
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the fact that he is sort of disaffected
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and I mean alienated from people he
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wants to do good and he wants to to take
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care of people when they're in harm's
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way but he's not part of our world and
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quite you know quite literally but also
[TS]
◼
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just socially he's not part of our world
[TS]
◼
►
he's he's removed from everybody and
[TS]
◼
►
then in flashback we see that what his
[TS]
◼
►
father tells him which is you don't
[TS]
◼
►
I even if you save people maybe you
[TS]
◼
►
shouldn't save them be if it's gonna
[TS]
◼
►
reveal yourself and I'll I just I I
[TS]
◼
►
guess what i was really dreading was the
[TS]
◼
►
retelling of that same old story in that
[TS]
◼
►
same old way and i like that they told
[TS]
◼
►
it in a different way and got to the
[TS]
◼
►
point of like why he is what you know
[TS]
◼
►
for for the first 33 years of his life
[TS]
◼
►
this sort of secretive figure who who
[TS]
◼
►
doesn't make any connections other than
[TS]
◼
►
with his family because he's always
[TS]
◼
►
drifting on like Bill Bixby and the
[TS]
◼
►
incredible hulk well see i like to the
[TS]
◼
►
the substance of that i agree i like
[TS]
◼
►
that the drift apart in that the stuff
[TS]
◼
►
they sort of read it I actually wanted
[TS]
◼
►
more of that and less of the flashback I
[TS]
◼
►
thought I think for me the flashback
[TS]
◼
►
lost some of its effectiveness by going
[TS]
◼
►
so nonlinear where it really bounces
[TS]
◼
►
around between him as like you know as a
[TS]
◼
►
kid as a teenager as an adult I felt
[TS]
◼
►
like it got disjointed to me and I
[TS]
◼
►
didn't get a clear i never got a clear
[TS]
◼
►
view of clark as a character you know I
[TS]
◼
►
I feel being a lot of it because I know
[TS]
◼
►
who Superman and Clark Kent are but I i
[TS]
◼
►
did not feel like they did they needed
[TS]
◼
►
to build up a lot of stuff in order
[TS]
◼
►
in certain things later on and i don't
[TS]
◼
►
think that they built up enough of it to
[TS]
◼
►
actually make those payoffs work i liked
[TS]
◼
►
the substance of it but I just didn't
[TS]
◼
►
like the structure bugged me you're not
[TS]
◼
►
helping the people who confuse us than
[TS]
◼
►
because you said everything you said I
[TS]
◼
►
agree with as I want that I want that in
[TS]
◼
►
I I agree I agree so much with with
[TS]
◼
►
everything that Dan said as well and on
[TS]
◼
►
the note i think the show's over guys
[TS]
◼
►
ceiling yeah I think we're done
[TS]
◼
►
I think we're done now our work here is
[TS]
◼
►
done Jason I in in something that's kind
[TS]
◼
►
of a sideways plug I'm glad that I
[TS]
◼
►
didn't have you on this week's episode
[TS]
◼
►
of giant size because all we talked
[TS]
◼
►
about Superman origin story telling and
[TS]
◼
►
it just would have been in our review
[TS]
◼
►
yelling and screaming and crying no no I
[TS]
◼
►
mean I i guess i guess it's the same
[TS]
◼
►
reason that I'm I'm kind of okay with
[TS]
◼
►
the retelling of of stories that are
[TS]
◼
►
that are considered sacred I actually
[TS]
◼
►
end up being more interested in them
[TS]
◼
►
being told differently than in them
[TS]
◼
►
being told the same way and and I just I
[TS]
◼
►
don't know why they are obligatory but
[TS]
◼
►
it is fine and in like i said in this
[TS]
◼
►
innocent i didn't mind how they were
[TS]
◼
►
they were telling him i agree with all
[TS]
◼
►
of you that the flashbacks
[TS]
◼
►
I mean that the flashbacks were long but
[TS]
◼
►
hit-boy they could have been so much
[TS]
◼
►
like it's not so much of their
[TS]
◼
►
flashbacks like well first on origin
[TS]
◼
►
stories I like origin stories
[TS]
◼
►
particularly superheroes because what I
[TS]
◼
►
dread in superhero movies is the ones
[TS]
◼
►
where they settled in where it's like
[TS]
◼
►
we've set up the world we set up the
[TS]
◼
►
character we set up the powers this
[TS]
◼
►
movie is created and tagging it's like
[TS]
◼
►
James Bond movie create antagonist here
[TS]
◼
►
goes against antagonist here defeats
[TS]
◼
►
that world is in the balance here
[TS]
◼
►
defeats antagonist that's what I find
[TS]
◼
►
tiresome about the h and when they they
[TS]
◼
►
change it when they've changed the lead
[TS]
◼
►
actor more than twice and that I don't
[TS]
◼
►
want them changing things around it's
[TS]
◼
►
just like it's like it becomes episodic
[TS]
◼
►
where I feel like I'm watching scooby
[TS]
◼
►
doo where it's like up here we go again
[TS]
◼
►
here at a spot like that and the orange
[TS]
◼
►
customer you and that even though that
[TS]
◼
►
story's been told a million times i I'd
[TS]
◼
►
is my feel more of a human connection it
[TS]
◼
►
feels less like a person going to work
[TS]
◼
►
and doing their job feels more like
[TS]
◼
►
someone growing up and like it's like a
[TS]
◼
►
coming-of-age story how did they come to
[TS]
◼
►
terms with the powers and how did they
[TS]
◼
►
take that the mantle of this thing they
[TS]
◼
►
want to become and it's in that
[TS]
◼
►
development from oh I have these gifts
[TS]
◼
►
what am I going to do with them that
[TS]
◼
►
causes you to create whatever kind of
[TS]
◼
►
character you are so what kind of
[TS]
◼
►
Superman is this what kind of Batman is
[TS]
◼
►
the tortured soul dark knight batman is
[TS]
◼
►
it the world's greatest detective Batman
[TS]
◼
►
is this the dude goody-two-shoes
[TS]
◼
►
Superman is the the you know the Darkin
[TS]
◼
►
and more ambiguous Superman is that the
[TS]
◼
►
alienated Superman and it's through the
[TS]
◼
►
origin story that you develop that
[TS]
◼
►
character once the character rods it's
[TS]
◼
►
kind of like I'm not as excited to see
[TS]
◼
►
that character have various adventures
[TS]
◼
►
in battle excellent there in the next
[TS]
◼
►
movie unless he still has some sort of
[TS]
◼
►
internal conflict or unless like
[TS]
◼
►
something happened to him in the first
[TS]
◼
►
movie that he hasn't quite results kind
[TS]
◼
►
of like casino royale where that james
[TS]
◼
►
bond character like he was different
[TS]
◼
►
character beginning the movie and had
[TS]
◼
►
bad things happen to him you know he's
[TS]
◼
►
going to be damaged in the second movie
[TS]
◼
►
and there was a writer struggle that was
[TS]
◼
►
kind of but that was kind of his origin
[TS]
◼
►
story though that was kind of monstrous
[TS]
◼
►
tries what I'm saying like that that
[TS]
◼
►
developed that gives you the James Bond
[TS]
◼
►
it in the land reason which you've um
[TS]
◼
►
you know I just wanted to say something
[TS]
◼
►
about origins that which is which is
[TS]
◼
►
origins are a good story to tell and I
[TS]
◼
►
don't want to get too far off here but
[TS]
◼
►
origins are good story to tell but there
[TS]
◼
►
are other ways to tell stories other
[TS]
◼
►
than how did I come to be if you it may
[TS]
◼
►
be harder to tell those stories but it
[TS]
◼
►
doesn't have to be just sort of
[TS]
◼
►
completely episodic i mean i can give
[TS]
◼
►
you an example of you know star star
[TS]
◼
►
trek it's starting to or started first
[TS]
◼
►
contact they don't they don't just say
[TS]
◼
►
how the enterprise came to be it's like
[TS]
◼
►
there's the characters that are dynamic
[TS]
◼
►
they have things going on with them you
[TS]
◼
►
can tell a good story without it being
[TS]
◼
►
the coming-of-age story i guess maybe
[TS]
◼
►
that's part of my my feeling too is like
[TS]
◼
►
it's not the only superhero story i
[TS]
◼
►
agree and disagree there where to die
[TS]
◼
►
hard star trek nerds like us start to
[TS]
◼
►
the wrath of khan and star trek whatever
[TS]
◼
►
number 9 10 is first contact is seem
[TS]
◼
►
like they could be great jumping on
[TS]
◼
►
points but there have been a number of
[TS]
◼
►
instances where I've tried showing both
[TS]
◼
►
of those movies to people that just
[TS]
◼
►
don't know star trek from pete and
[TS]
◼
►
they're lost out of their minds
[TS]
◼
►
that's not to say that you know maybe
[TS]
◼
►
they're their head wasn't in the right
[TS]
◼
►
space for it but those movies are better
[TS]
◼
►
at being able to jump into them than
[TS]
◼
►
some of the other Star Trek movies
[TS]
◼
►
but I in that specific case I don't feel
[TS]
◼
►
like they're as easy to get into as the
[TS]
◼
►
09 track for people that aren't familiar
[TS]
◼
►
with it all but honestly I think any
[TS]
◼
►
version of superman origin story they've
[TS]
◼
►
done in the movies is equally easy to
[TS]
◼
►
get into and the function of this one
[TS]
◼
►
should have been and was apparently to
[TS]
◼
►
reset the Superman world in modern times
[TS]
◼
►
and around story elements that will make
[TS]
◼
►
sense and not be entirely outdated and
[TS]
◼
►
sort of bigger action landscape but the
[TS]
◼
►
thing that drives me crazy about it
[TS]
◼
►
about this this that you know trying
[TS]
◼
►
trying too long with Krypton and too
[TS]
◼
►
many flashbacks is that they're trying
[TS]
◼
►
to do do they try to do too many
[TS]
◼
►
different mechanics at once and that's
[TS]
◼
►
why it feels long and that's why feels
[TS]
◼
►
like like they they could have trimmed
[TS]
◼
►
it down a bit while they're all
[TS]
◼
►
templated because we're talking about
[TS]
◼
►
you know we're talking to hero's journey
[TS]
◼
►
to answer yesterday right right so and
[TS]
◼
►
this is this is to me where this falls a
[TS]
◼
►
little bit flat is that it does try to
[TS]
◼
►
mix up the hero's journey a little bit
[TS]
◼
►
but you know there's a I don't say
[TS]
◼
►
there's just a comfort to a template
[TS]
◼
►
like that but there is a familiar part
[TS]
◼
►
about it and I think that people really
[TS]
◼
►
respond to that shape of a story and i'm
[TS]
◼
►
not saying that you need to use that
[TS]
◼
►
story for everything but you can work
[TS]
◼
►
against it in some ways that provide a
[TS]
◼
►
really nice conflict i don't think this
[TS]
◼
►
did a good enough job of creating that
[TS]
◼
►
tension to me it felt like a very much a
[TS]
◼
►
set up as a diametrically like oh we
[TS]
◼
►
don't want to do that so we're gonna try
[TS]
◼
►
to do just like different different
[TS]
◼
►
different at all these points and it
[TS]
◼
►
doesn't come together cohesively it's
[TS]
◼
►
very Superman is a problematic character
[TS]
◼
►
and maybe we'll get there but in so many
[TS]
◼
►
ways because he is so perfect
[TS]
◼
►
historically they're trying to make
[TS]
◼
►
trying to make it different to make the
[TS]
◼
►
shape of his story a little bit
[TS]
◼
►
different and and I like a lot of that
[TS]
◼
►
right and to John's point I think the
[TS]
◼
►
problem with Superman in particular when
[TS]
◼
►
you talk about you know he's talking
[TS]
◼
►
about getting at the comfort inn the
[TS]
◼
►
formula the problem Superman is he's
[TS]
◼
►
he's God right like he he's invulnerable
[TS]
◼
►
he's indestructible he can beat
[TS]
◼
►
everybody's got super strength you can
[TS]
◼
►
fight like he's got everything so don't
[TS]
◼
►
think his biggest problem is biggest
[TS]
◼
►
problem is not as powers biggest problem
[TS]
◼
►
is his personality because you need you
[TS]
◼
►
want you want to have internal conflict
[TS]
◼
►
you would think someone with those
[TS]
◼
►
powers would have inter like the actual
[TS]
◼
►
Jesus Christ had more internal conflict
[TS]
◼
►
Superman movies you know to make sure i
[TS]
◼
►
know and i think you're right i mean i
[TS]
◼
►
just think in with Batman or you know
[TS]
◼
►
iron man where it's like all right this
[TS]
◼
►
is a person who can get hurt and killed
[TS]
◼
►
I think you know you do want to see
[TS]
◼
►
internal conflict but there's also an
[TS]
◼
►
external part of it where Superman's
[TS]
◼
►
like Superman beats everything right
[TS]
◼
►
like Superman is just the trump card
[TS]
◼
►
well in in those in those previous
[TS]
◼
►
adaptations so often the Superman
[TS]
◼
►
paragon of virtue who always gets there
[TS]
◼
►
in the nick of time is different than
[TS]
◼
►
and I think this is this is a big point
[TS]
◼
►
that is the reason that a lot of super
[TS]
◼
►
diehard fans have railed against the
[TS]
◼
►
movie is the scale of destruction that
[TS]
◼
►
that the movie gets into we'll get to
[TS]
◼
►
that but we'll get to that but I want to
[TS]
◼
►
get a few more things on the origin
[TS]
◼
►
before we get off it for good one about
[TS]
◼
►
the the tooth the the JJ Abrams Star
[TS]
◼
►
Trek's the first to that be the first to
[TS]
◼
►
and only Jason Star Trek's are both
[TS]
◼
►
origin stories because the first one is
[TS]
◼
►
yeah here's how these characters come to
[TS]
◼
►
be and the second one is you know by the
[TS]
◼
►
end of the movie they're on their
[TS]
◼
►
five-year mission right it's just not a
[TS]
◼
►
retelling greatly never told it and the
[TS]
◼
►
difference is the differences that i
[TS]
◼
►
look forward to seeing the adventures of
[TS]
◼
►
the Star Trek Enterprise crew on their
[TS]
◼
►
five-year mission because I maybe that's
[TS]
◼
►
what I expect out of Star Trek or
[TS]
◼
►
there's enough moving parts but I feel
[TS]
◼
►
like they have there's so many
[TS]
◼
►
possibilities that can go to all sorts
[TS]
◼
►
of different worlds you can have
[TS]
◼
►
different characters be the focus you
[TS]
◼
►
can have different things happen you can
[TS]
◼
►
kill off characters who had some
[TS]
◼
►
ensemble cast whereas with a single
[TS]
◼
►
superhero movie you're not going to kill
[TS]
◼
►
them off because unless you would like
[TS]
◼
►
you're going to immediately bring them
[TS]
◼
►
back or something like that and he's
[TS]
◼
►
going to have some sort of villain and
[TS]
◼
►
it's going to be the world in crisis and
[TS]
◼
►
he's going to you know it's like I don't
[TS]
◼
►
want to see you Superman going to work
[TS]
◼
►
and doing this job and I would rather
[TS]
◼
►
see you around each bank robbers right
[TS]
◼
►
now that I was gonna say the same thing
[TS]
◼
►
John it which is maybe the reason that
[TS]
◼
►
they keep telling superhero origin
[TS]
◼
►
stories is that there aren't any other
[TS]
◼
►
good i mean i would like to believe
[TS]
◼
►
there are other good superhero stories
[TS]
◼
►
but maybe it's much more difficult i
[TS]
◼
►
mean that like spider-man 2 is an
[TS]
◼
►
example where there's more but I mean
[TS]
◼
►
there there are but it can't be it can't
[TS]
◼
►
be about the plot though it's like world
[TS]
◼
►
war two movies are not about world war
[TS]
◼
►
two there about the people who are in
[TS]
◼
►
world war two so it's super hero movies
[TS]
◼
►
have to be about the superhero person
[TS]
◼
►
dealing channel and personal issues with
[TS]
◼
►
you know this thing this thing this that
[TS]
◼
►
spider-man 2 is such a great movie will
[TS]
◼
►
end in spider-man 2 and in intern is
[TS]
◼
►
like Superman to which he does the same
[TS]
◼
►
thing right there both cases they sort
[TS]
◼
►
of like I'm not going to be a hero
[TS]
◼
►
anymore right and I'm gonna spider-man
[TS]
◼
►
you know more hours right like Superman
[TS]
◼
►
does then Superman to as well as it
[TS]
◼
►
that's that that's the internal struggle
[TS]
◼
►
I mean it's also again it's becomes kind
[TS]
◼
►
of not exactly cliche but it is a trope
[TS]
◼
►
right of the superhero like no I'm
[TS]
◼
►
putting too many people in danger or
[TS]
◼
►
whatever I just going to be a normal
[TS]
◼
►
person as superintendent have that
[TS]
◼
►
problem this movie I want to stop for a
[TS]
◼
►
moment to talk about our sponsor yes
[TS]
◼
►
once again this is becoming a wonderful
[TS]
◼
►
trendy and uncomfortable as a sponsor
[TS]
◼
►
and this sponsor is a glue glue is an
[TS]
◼
►
intranet for your for your work your for
[TS]
◼
►
your place of employment that you'll
[TS]
◼
►
actually like I know you've heard about
[TS]
◼
►
they're a bunch of different services
[TS]
◼
►
that do things like you know corporate
[TS]
◼
►
blogs or internal calendars or like a
[TS]
◼
►
chat room or a twitter-like thing all
[TS]
◼
►
the wiki all these different kind of
[TS]
◼
►
things that you can get and set up for
[TS]
◼
►
your for your work equals all of those
[TS]
◼
►
things it is blogs and calendars and
[TS]
◼
►
file sharing and forums and micro blogs
[TS]
◼
►
and wiki's and all that stuff its social
[TS]
◼
►
you can comment on any kind of content
[TS]
◼
►
you can add mention your coworkers
[TS]
◼
►
you can follow content for updates so
[TS]
◼
►
it's like a whole social internet for
[TS]
◼
►
your work you can add on rooms little
[TS]
◼
►
mini glue is you create an entire like
[TS]
◼
►
igloo complex and have your own personal
[TS]
◼
►
igloo fortress of solitude
[TS]
◼
►
ah Superman tie-in fortress of solitude
[TS]
◼
►
anyone come on Dan you have to like that
[TS]
◼
►
i may have left slightly i will just ask
[TS]
◼
►
you know I like us having sponsors can
[TS]
◼
►
it be one of those things like when
[TS]
◼
►
you're in Little League and they put
[TS]
◼
►
their name on the gallows shirts and the
[TS]
◼
►
other sponsors name and software on the
[TS]
◼
►
back and then we all get this week
[TS]
◼
►
afterwards can yes we can sold already a
[TS]
◼
►
guy's a clue a clue software will will
[TS]
◼
►
be buying t-shirts for our softball team
[TS]
◼
►
and and so fortress of solitude many
[TS]
◼
►
you don't have to be in Canada to use a
[TS]
◼
►
clue software is available everywhere
[TS]
◼
►
even where it's warm
[TS]
◼
►
these igloos won't melt super easy to
[TS]
◼
►
the whole thing's drag-and-drop this
[TS]
◼
►
responsive design Typekit fonts so it
[TS]
◼
►
looks really great
[TS]
◼
►
it's secure if you've got somebody in
[TS]
◼
►
I've got a few in mind you say oh no we
[TS]
◼
►
can't use third-party apps insecure and
[TS]
◼
►
people read all our important stuff
[TS]
◼
►
enterprise-grade security so your stuff
[TS]
◼
►
we stay safe you can start using it
[TS]
◼
►
right away and here is a great thing
[TS]
◼
►
about a clue software it is absolutely
[TS]
◼
►
free to use for up to 10 people so
[TS]
◼
►
you've got a small workgroup you can
[TS]
◼
►
just use it go ahead and use it now and
[TS]
◼
►
then when you've got the like oversized
[TS]
◼
►
igloo you gotta bring in some more
[TS]
◼
►
blocks of ice you gotta clicks clear the
[TS]
◼
►
Moose out and get some more ice out and
[TS]
◼
►
build up even like a giant igloo or one
[TS]
◼
►
of those ice hotels like in Sweden
[TS]
◼
►
twelve dollars per person per for each
[TS]
◼
►
month for every extra person that you
[TS]
◼
►
get but it's all of your internet stuff
[TS]
◼
►
for your for your work and here's how
[TS]
◼
►
you get it you go to a very special URL
[TS]
◼
►
generated just for us i think with John
[TS]
◼
►
siracusa in mind go to igloo
[TS]
◼
►
software.com / Vader that's right if you
[TS]
◼
►
don't know how to spell Vader you are
[TS]
◼
►
listening to the wrong podcast igloo
[TS]
◼
►
software.com / Vader and you can start
[TS]
◼
►
building your a glue and Darth Vader's
[TS]
◼
►
igloo has a little top part and a little
[TS]
◼
►
bottom part of ice and then they come
[TS]
◼
►
together and he lives inside that is
[TS]
◼
►
no it's white ice and he's the
[TS]
◼
►
black-clad guy sign outside white icing
[TS]
◼
►
means I'll ok very good
[TS]
◼
►
that's right that's that's it igloo
[TS]
◼
►
software.com / Vader to build Darth
[TS]
◼
►
Vader's igloo and your own personal
[TS]
◼
►
business a clip it's an interesting by
[TS]
◼
►
the way that this summer we got two
[TS]
◼
►
movies where a classic villain played
[TS]
◼
►
played by a very interesting actor from
[TS]
◼
►
about 30 years ago in the second movie
[TS]
◼
►
in a film series got replayed in a it in
[TS]
◼
►
a summer movie because Terran stamps
[TS]
◼
►
General Zod and Superman to is such a
[TS]
◼
►
great a great character i think it was
[TS]
◼
►
smart of them to put all the Krypton
[TS]
◼
►
stuff in one movie here
[TS]
◼
►
although it is kind of overstuffed and
[TS]
◼
►
it gives you a direct line between why
[TS]
◼
►
Superman was sent to earth and why
[TS]
◼
►
General Zod is angry and I think that's
[TS]
◼
►
what they tried to do in the original
[TS]
◼
►
superman and they ended up splitting it
[TS]
◼
►
into two movies but i like that that
[TS]
◼
►
they sort of like put it all in here and
[TS]
◼
►
and try to get out of the way I thought
[TS]
◼
►
that was interesting i do wonder if
[TS]
◼
►
people who are diehard Superman fans are
[TS]
◼
►
upset by some of the canonical changes
[TS]
◼
►
that are in here like lowest lame
[TS]
◼
►
figures out you know cause identity it's
[TS]
◼
►
the other direction she figures out from
[TS]
◼
►
his mysterious appearances and ends up
[TS]
◼
►
at his childhood home in Kansas I
[TS]
◼
►
thought that was interesting and made
[TS]
◼
►
Lois Lane a little more interesting
[TS]
◼
►
it's certainly not the canon of Superman
[TS]
◼
►
but one man or that were freaking out
[TS]
◼
►
but I thought it was good that might
[TS]
◼
►
have been my favorite part of the movie
[TS]
◼
►
because for ages i've been i've been
[TS]
◼
►
waiting for somebody to not just iterate
[TS]
◼
►
on Lois Lane being the same dumb broad
[TS]
◼
►
in the newsroom who she's appealing
[TS]
◼
►
surprise winner here eight amy adams did
[TS]
◼
►
not come across as a dummy and everyone
[TS]
◼
►
else can recognize faces though
[TS]
◼
►
enforceable that's true the entire what
[TS]
◼
►
yeah that is I kept thinking when
[TS]
◼
►
watching this movie is so we have that
[TS]
◼
►
scene where where she goes up to the
[TS]
◼
►
Arctic and then we have guests cameos
[TS]
◼
►
from two different battlestar galactica
[TS]
◼
►
actors yeah yeahs America data and he'll
[TS]
◼
►
oh yeah and so I end so then you know we
[TS]
◼
►
haven't go on the ship and Amy Adam Lois
[TS]
◼
►
Lane follows them onto the ship and then
[TS]
◼
►
she gets shot by the like security
[TS]
◼
►
system and he has to save her and so I'm
[TS]
◼
►
sitting there the whole time thinking
[TS]
◼
►
like as we're doing the lead-up like
[TS]
◼
►
she's gonna find him in the ship and
[TS]
◼
►
what's he gonna say like I was like
[TS]
◼
►
maybe he'll tell her he's a reporter
[TS]
◼
►
from her and that's how we'll get the
[TS]
◼
►
Clark Kent ID and then when I you know
[TS]
◼
►
when when he's trying to heal her right
[TS]
◼
►
like he cauterizes the wound I think it
[TS]
◼
►
up so they're going well there's no way
[TS]
◼
►
she's not going to recognize him if he
[TS]
◼
►
ever shows up as Clark Kent right
[TS]
◼
►
because you're like two feet away from
[TS]
◼
►
this guy if he doesn't look that does
[TS]
◼
►
not wearing glasses or anything so he's
[TS]
◼
►
not going to fool you with that that's
[TS]
◼
►
part of the conceit of the hero of
[TS]
◼
►
mission of this entire show was that for
[TS]
◼
►
some reason we can't recognize that
[TS]
◼
►
money has it may be glamorous than like
[TS]
◼
►
this part vampire
[TS]
◼
►
this is the it's the there's the tick
[TS]
◼
►
character was a Clark Oppenheimer or
[TS]
◼
►
something worse the hypno glasses
[TS]
◼
►
yeah yeah so but the thing that i agree
[TS]
◼
►
i liked the lois lane tracking him down
[TS]
◼
►
part the the difficulty sort of feeds
[TS]
◼
►
back into that same comment I made
[TS]
◼
►
earlier where I think it robs us of a
[TS]
◼
►
little bit of the Clark Kent setup also
[TS]
◼
►
i will say this now because you know and
[TS]
◼
►
I realize this reaches the head towards
[TS]
◼
►
the end of the movie but is anyone else
[TS]
◼
►
really concerned that maybe like he
[TS]
◼
►
didn't actually go to college or have a
[TS]
◼
►
degree in journalism anything to get
[TS]
◼
►
he's a fraud he's don't nobody checks
[TS]
◼
►
resume and he's very persuasive and very
[TS]
◼
►
soon as that stopped any blog i assumed
[TS]
◼
►
the lowest vouches for him and said well
[TS]
◼
►
that's that's why would people kept
[TS]
◼
►
saying but I'm like I don't know like
[TS]
◼
►
you feel like there's probably a lot of
[TS]
◼
►
reporters going hungry now because they
[TS]
◼
►
didn't even a way downhill there i'm
[TS]
◼
►
just saying they're given jobs away to
[TS]
◼
►
illegal aliens left and right now he
[TS]
◼
►
works you i want one more thing in the
[TS]
◼
►
origins before we leave it for good oh
[TS]
◼
►
yeah you already had one more time this
[TS]
◼
►
is my final think it's alright alright
[TS]
◼
►
so the the trailers really leaned on the
[TS]
◼
►
the origin story and like the seams with
[TS]
◼
►
kevin costner and the voice-over and all
[TS]
◼
►
that other stuff like that and as Dan
[TS]
◼
►
said the way they cut it together like
[TS]
◼
►
if you follow the traditional arc that's
[TS]
◼
►
fine and if you do it well it works
[TS]
◼
►
really well if you want to go against
[TS]
◼
►
that traditional story and riff on it
[TS]
◼
►
you need to be really good and they did
[TS]
◼
►
not successfully respond and I think it
[TS]
◼
►
undercut all the things i wanted to see
[TS]
◼
►
in the movie by chopping up the way they
[TS]
◼
►
did and I think they chopped it up the
[TS]
◼
►
way they did because they wanted to get
[TS]
◼
►
Amy Adams on screen as soon as possible
[TS]
◼
►
you can't have the whole first half of
[TS]
◼
►
the movie not feature Amy Adams pcs not
[TS]
◼
►
grown up yet and he doesn't meet her
[TS]
◼
►
because she's presently not the same
[TS]
◼
►
Tennyson some I think that Rob that
[TS]
◼
►
whole section of the movie of momentum
[TS]
◼
►
of force I did not like jumping forward
[TS]
◼
►
adult then remember when you were a kid
[TS]
◼
►
then remember your adult remember your
[TS]
◼
►
kid I wanted to because that you didn't
[TS]
◼
►
didn't work for me i would rather have
[TS]
◼
►
seen them go traditional chronological
[TS]
◼
►
he lands on the planet you don't give us
[TS]
◼
►
a like you don't do the baby holding a
[TS]
◼
►
car but just go through his is growing
[TS]
◼
►
up period as it as a gentle ramp into
[TS]
◼
►
because all those things were mostly
[TS]
◼
►
good with the kids felt alien he didn't
[TS]
◼
►
hand but the fact that we kept jumping
[TS]
◼
►
back and forth it was like I was
[TS]
◼
►
two stories and they did not cut
[TS]
◼
►
together and it's actually not if I
[TS]
◼
►
could not agree more i cannot possibly
[TS]
◼
►
reward they were trying to do too many
[TS]
◼
►
things to do things as unconventionally
[TS]
◼
►
as they could and they were just doing
[TS]
◼
►
it to do it and not doing it because it
[TS]
◼
►
actually serve the story in the best way
[TS]
◼
►
to say something about the flashback
[TS]
◼
►
yeah i think the problem with some of it
[TS]
◼
►
is the flashback is supposed to lend you
[TS]
◼
►
like I remember this time you're a kid
[TS]
◼
►
need this thing happened to that really
[TS]
◼
►
impacted you later my last it's like
[TS]
◼
►
lost they want to enter cut it like lost
[TS]
◼
►
but that doesn't yes right doesn't work
[TS]
◼
►
because the problem is that you already
[TS]
◼
►
know all like there's nothing surprising
[TS]
◼
►
and you have to do you have to say with
[TS]
◼
►
him in the journey like that right
[TS]
◼
►
talent chronological then you start to
[TS]
◼
►
identify with him and you feel like
[TS]
◼
►
you're the the alien kid and you
[TS]
◼
►
sympathize with him and like that's what
[TS]
◼
►
you need to do you don't need to go
[TS]
◼
►
oh but like lost oh by the way here is
[TS]
◼
►
this scene from the past that informs
[TS]
◼
►
the current behavior because i lost you
[TS]
◼
►
you in lost you care about the current
[TS]
◼
►
situation and in this story you need
[TS]
◼
►
people to care about your childhood and
[TS]
◼
►
what it was like you you know and it was
[TS]
◼
►
just like we didn't care that much about
[TS]
◼
►
him as an adult and we didn't need to be
[TS]
◼
►
informed of these things and we weren't
[TS]
◼
►
tied to the childhood story they were
[TS]
◼
►
always like flashbacks and we could have
[TS]
◼
►
gotten vignettes of the childhood stuff
[TS]
◼
►
and do it in order and and again i know
[TS]
◼
►
i find myself using a method of
[TS]
◼
►
argumentation that that seems like stuff
[TS]
◼
►
that I always complained about and tell
[TS]
◼
►
people they're idiots for for doing but
[TS]
◼
►
if they had just done it in order it
[TS]
◼
►
worked it worked so much better and and
[TS]
◼
►
trusting the build to work and yes okay
[TS]
◼
►
the story's been told seven different
[TS]
◼
►
times but there are different bits of
[TS]
◼
►
that story that you can tell in
[TS]
◼
►
different ways that achieves what they
[TS]
◼
►
were selling in the trailer a lot better
[TS]
◼
►
than we actually got executed the movie
[TS]
◼
►
yeah i heard that I like I mean I was
[TS]
◼
►
super psyched about seeing the trailer I
[TS]
◼
►
thought it was really well zone so I
[TS]
◼
►
came back from the movie and I I said
[TS]
◼
►
something on Twitter we're basically
[TS]
◼
►
said I was disappointed the movie and a
[TS]
◼
►
bunch of people who haven't seen it yet
[TS]
◼
►
because i saw this on the saturday i
[TS]
◼
►
think that came out said they were
[TS]
◼
►
really disappointed cuz i like the
[TS]
◼
►
trailer and I like the trailer 2 and my
[TS]
◼
►
take on it when i look back at that
[TS]
◼
►
trailer is they put the best things in
[TS]
◼
►
the movie in the trailer they did I mean
[TS]
◼
►
really good friend
[TS]
◼
►
I'm all kevin costner scenes were in the
[TS]
◼
►
trail yeah single right and they cut it
[TS]
◼
►
together really well and they have music
[TS]
◼
►
and that seemed where he says can I just
[TS]
◼
►
pretend to be your son and he says you
[TS]
◼
►
I mean that's a scene that there any
[TS]
◼
►
parents gonna look at and be like oh my
[TS]
◼
►
god it's like such a trailer that i
[TS]
◼
►
didn't her letter because there's like
[TS]
◼
►
you have been like a first time on
[TS]
◼
►
camera and you know they need to build
[TS]
◼
►
up they need to build up to that with
[TS]
◼
►
him and yeah I agree completely
[TS]
◼
►
it robbed it of the emotion because in
[TS]
◼
►
the trailer it does
[TS]
◼
►
he's got that little crack in his voice
[TS]
◼
►
and that sells you right there like it's
[TS]
◼
►
beautiful but they spent all of that
[TS]
◼
►
sympathetic currency all in the trailer
[TS]
◼
►
and you've got to have stuff that more
[TS]
◼
►
women making want to see the movie but
[TS]
◼
►
then you gotta have more
[TS]
◼
►
yeah you gotta go somewhere beyond that
[TS]
◼
►
in the movie itself or people go oh I
[TS]
◼
►
was in and by the way this is this is my
[TS]
◼
►
favorite that was my favorite travels
[TS]
◼
►
past year and my favorite part of the
[TS]
◼
►
trails were listing them was the one
[TS]
◼
►
where his mother says they'll kill him
[TS]
◼
►
and the father says how which is a great
[TS]
◼
►
line that's followed by the trailer if
[TS]
◼
►
the movie had seven more of those lines
[TS]
◼
►
surrounding that it would have been
[TS]
◼
►
better but just had the one line that I
[TS]
◼
►
heard before yeah that no they did this
[TS]
◼
►
so so we're talking about things that
[TS]
◼
►
would that work and they put the things
[TS]
◼
►
that worked in the trailer and and I
[TS]
◼
►
know that we people who really love this
[TS]
◼
►
movie and maybe love it on uncritically
[TS]
◼
►
and and just think it's the best will be
[TS]
◼
►
quite upset by the fact that we've
[TS]
◼
►
picked apart and complained about a lot
[TS]
◼
►
of things that are in the first part of
[TS]
◼
►
make no mistake i enjoyed watching the
[TS]
◼
►
first part of the movie and it got my
[TS]
◼
►
hopes up that this was going to be a
[TS]
◼
►
very good movie that solved a lot of the
[TS]
◼
►
Superman problems and then came the
[TS]
◼
►
second half of the movie which I gotta
[TS]
◼
►
say completely lost any goodwill I had
[TS]
◼
►
toward it and in the end made me I think
[TS]
◼
►
dislike it even more than i would have
[TS]
◼
►
if it had just been kind of pour from
[TS]
◼
►
the start and hadn't gotten my hopes up
[TS]
◼
►
i would just wave my hand like a this is
[TS]
◼
►
just crappy instantly got my hopes up
[TS]
◼
►
like yeah you know who they're mainly
[TS]
◼
►
just wanted right decisions they're
[TS]
◼
►
trying to work around a lot of problems
[TS]
◼
►
of Superman is a character trying to
[TS]
◼
►
tell the story in a different way you
[TS]
◼
►
know that they had those cool things
[TS]
◼
►
that were in the trailer that we're in
[TS]
◼
►
this in this movie you know it's not all
[TS]
◼
►
great but I'm encouraged by it and then
[TS]
◼
►
we get to the second half we get to
[TS]
◼
►
coming to Earth and for me it for me it
[TS]
◼
►
goes off the rails and I want to talk
[TS]
◼
►
about General Zod for a little bit i
[TS]
◼
►
want to talk about michael shannon
[TS]
◼
►
Michael Shannon an interesting actor in
[TS]
◼
►
the scenes in on Krypton where he's
[TS]
◼
►
trying to talk and reason with people I
[TS]
◼
►
felt like he was having trouble getting
[TS]
◼
►
the words out I think he actually was I
[TS]
◼
►
think it's a terrible performance in
[TS]
◼
►
those scenes I think he's a bad he's
[TS]
◼
►
being a bad actor and I wondered why did
[TS]
◼
►
the world did they cast him for this job
[TS]
◼
►
is not being a bad actor have you seen
[TS]
◼
►
him on boardwalk empire
[TS]
◼
►
well I haven't if you if you've seen him
[TS]
◼
►
on Boardwalk Empire you would recognize
[TS]
◼
►
the performance because it's like a case
[TS]
◼
►
where their trade their traits of the
[TS]
◼
►
actor that come through in their
[TS]
◼
►
it's sort of the opposite of meryl
[TS]
◼
►
streep i saw me that means sorority girl
[TS]
◼
►
in that in that viral video up might
[TS]
◼
►
what I was going to say though is that
[TS]
◼
►
at the end of the movie when he's kind
[TS]
◼
►
of a maniac and shouting a lot i like ah
[TS]
◼
►
that's why they cast him because he's
[TS]
◼
►
really good at being a menacing maniac
[TS]
◼
►
and shouting a lot but in the beach but
[TS]
◼
►
i think i think it's uh I would you put
[TS]
◼
►
this guy in charge of your military how
[TS]
◼
►
many things have you seen him in I'm
[TS]
◼
►
dying I'm dying right now iÃve seen him
[TS]
◼
►
in this movie and in the thing where
[TS]
◼
►
he's the sorority girl and I like that a
[TS]
◼
►
lot better than this there was much
[TS]
◼
►
better performance if you had seen him
[TS]
◼
►
or you would know you've got to see him
[TS]
◼
►
take shelter you've got to see him in
[TS]
◼
►
mud that the thing the thing about
[TS]
◼
►
Michael Shannon is the reason they cast
[TS]
◼
►
him in what he was able to do in the
[TS]
◼
►
movie are totally different things
[TS]
◼
►
fair enough all i can say is somebody
[TS]
◼
►
who I'm not gonna I'm not gonna look at
[TS]
◼
►
the an actor's backstory and in order to
[TS]
◼
►
judge his performance in the movie and
[TS]
◼
►
this movie he was a disaster and I would
[TS]
◼
►
actually say when I was walking on the
[TS]
◼
►
movie it when my wife and I were talking
[TS]
◼
►
about it and and I said remember when we
[TS]
◼
►
were talking about how lucky the star
[TS]
◼
►
trek people were that they got Benedict
[TS]
◼
►
Cumberbatch because he did a really good
[TS]
◼
►
well this is what happens when you get
[TS]
◼
►
an actor who doesn't do a very good job
[TS]
◼
►
better which character the ad or the
[TS]
◼
►
dialogue because it's bad dialogue to I
[TS]
◼
►
think right i mean it's not always the
[TS]
◼
►
actors fault if they got miscast but
[TS]
◼
►
this performance doesn't work for me i
[TS]
◼
►
think it's i think it's awful i mean i
[TS]
◼
►
just i think the characters awful the
[TS]
◼
►
dialogue is awful and the performances
[TS]
◼
►
awful what what I'll say is i'm not i'm
[TS]
◼
►
not disagreeing with you that
[TS]
◼
►
that as a whole piece it doesn't work
[TS]
◼
►
what I'm getting at is that iÃve I put
[TS]
◼
►
a whole lot more of it on the miscasting
[TS]
◼
►
miss framing side of things because
[TS]
◼
►
Michael Shannon is an actor who is the
[TS]
◼
►
king of loci and and the reason that I
[TS]
◼
►
site that other stuff that he's been in
[TS]
◼
►
is that them transporting him into this
[TS]
◼
►
movie in this role in theory under the
[TS]
◼
►
most i yield ideal circumstances
[TS]
◼
►
possible in theory he could absolutely
[TS]
◼
►
kill that role in theory but in
[TS]
◼
►
execution this is a guy who friend of
[TS]
◼
►
mine interviewed once and asked him if
[TS]
◼
►
he had gotten into blu-ray yet he was
[TS]
◼
►
like what's what's that sounds like some
[TS]
◼
►
kind of like Godzilla monster laser yeah
[TS]
◼
►
sort of laser a know he like he had lead
[TS]
◼
►
they had no idea what the guy was
[TS]
◼
►
talking about when you surround a guy
[TS]
◼
►
who is you know like a a hardcore
[TS]
◼
►
theater actor Loki dude is all about
[TS]
◼
►
character working process and all that
[TS]
◼
►
kind of stuff and not all of the green
[TS]
◼
►
screen motion-captured dot BS he allayed
[TS]
◼
►
they say it's more it's more not that
[TS]
◼
►
they put him out of his depth but that
[TS]
◼
►
they transplanted them into a world that
[TS]
◼
►
just didn't make sense to mesh him with
[TS]
◼
►
I mean if the the big the big thing is
[TS]
◼
►
this is the first time that he's done
[TS]
◼
►
something of this scale of the scope of
[TS]
◼
►
this filmmaking style and it would be it
[TS]
◼
►
would be like putting John Diehl good in
[TS]
◼
►
300 i would watch that movie i think it
[TS]
◼
►
makes a difference that is what what
[TS]
◼
►
other things you've seen even though
[TS]
◼
►
because jason has seen but Benedict
[TS]
◼
►
Cumberbatch in Sherlock right of things
[TS]
◼
►
and if you like i said if you see this
[TS]
◼
►
actor in his other roles he is like one
[TS]
◼
►
of those actors who has personality
[TS]
◼
►
characteristic can't help but show
[TS]
◼
►
through in the roles that like I said
[TS]
◼
►
it's the opposite of Meryl Streep who
[TS]
◼
►
appears to have no personality of her
[TS]
◼
►
own when she's in a role she totally
[TS]
◼
►
inhabits it right he and his thing and
[TS]
◼
►
the roles that he plays is simmering
[TS]
◼
►
repressed feelings that he tries to keep
[TS]
◼
►
down but that inevitably come out in a
[TS]
◼
►
burst of rage right that is that is
[TS]
◼
►
maybe it's his real personality but he
[TS]
◼
►
plays lots of roles like that and he
[TS]
◼
►
plays them very well like that's where
[TS]
◼
►
you started this the sorority girl was
[TS]
◼
►
it is a great example right where you
[TS]
◼
►
the beginning of the movie he's trying
[TS]
◼
►
to keep that stuff tamp down which may
[TS]
◼
►
not be appropriate for General Zod right
[TS]
◼
►
I but his weird personality during that
[TS]
◼
►
point that looks like bad acting is just
[TS]
◼
►
him doing that thing he does when it's
[TS]
◼
►
someone trying to keep it together when
[TS]
◼
►
they have just incredible raging at the
[TS]
◼
►
end of the movies when the rage comes
[TS]
◼
►
out I don't think that's the appropriate
[TS]
◼
►
character for General Zod but that's
[TS]
◼
►
what he was doing and in the movie and
[TS]
◼
►
if you would see in other roles i was
[TS]
◼
►
completely comfortable with him doing
[TS]
◼
►
that but I kept thinking is he the right
[TS]
◼
►
guy for this he's not maybe I'll take
[TS]
◼
►
enough he's not maybe menacing enough i
[TS]
◼
►
don't feel like he would be repressing I
[TS]
◼
►
feel like he would be more confident
[TS]
◼
►
because he's always like in his other
[TS]
◼
►
roles less confident and that's why he's
[TS]
◼
►
repressing this and that's not doesn't
[TS]
◼
►
fit with General Zod and everything so I
[TS]
◼
►
don't fault is acting I fought the
[TS]
◼
►
casting and yes of course the scripture
[TS]
◼
►
in the dialogue were not we're not
[TS]
◼
►
helping him I felt the haircut and the
[TS]
◼
►
goatee both of those i thought were not
[TS]
◼
►
the girl the girl was really good though
[TS]
◼
►
I liked her oh yeah she was good evenin
[TS]
◼
►
yeah i should say I mean when we talk
[TS]
◼
►
about acting I mean you can never tell
[TS]
◼
►
what the movie so complicated thing that
[TS]
◼
►
I can say I don't like Michael Shannon
[TS]
◼
►
in this movie it may it may or may not
[TS]
◼
►
be his fault because it's a whole
[TS]
◼
►
confluence of things including the
[TS]
◼
►
casting an actor you know can only do so
[TS]
◼
►
much with apart if he was miscast he can
[TS]
◼
►
try his best and he it's still not
[TS]
◼
►
welcome across you know but but it
[TS]
◼
►
doesn't i can say this i think this is
[TS]
◼
►
one of the big not the biggest but one
[TS]
◼
►
of the big liabilities in this movie is
[TS]
◼
►
I don't think he's the right guy for
[TS]
◼
►
this part i'm not sure who is but I just
[TS]
◼
►
don't think he's the right guy I want to
[TS]
◼
►
flip this for one second and say that I
[TS]
◼
►
I thought I really thought Henry Cavill
[TS]
◼
►
was actually pretty good
[TS]
◼
►
I just didn't think they gave me
[TS]
◼
►
anything get do I know he was he was
[TS]
◼
►
good and if if he fit the role well it's
[TS]
◼
►
just again i don't think they give him
[TS]
◼
►
enough to do there's only three or four
[TS]
◼
►
points where he's got like so he's got
[TS]
◼
►
the scene it's interesting earlier than
[TS]
◼
►
later right here always got the scene in
[TS]
◼
►
the restaurant where you like defends
[TS]
◼
►
the waitress right then he walks away
[TS]
◼
►
and you've got the one seen I like to
[TS]
◼
►
sing with him at the very end where he's
[TS]
◼
►
talking to the general and you know he
[TS]
◼
►
has a little bit of personality there
[TS]
◼
►
and the scene where he's in the
[TS]
◼
►
interrogation room with a met with Lois
[TS]
◼
►
Lane also they're like little spots with
[TS]
◼
►
him because again we talked about this
[TS]
◼
►
earlier with the problem Superman being
[TS]
◼
►
like well he's you know if he's very
[TS]
◼
►
good e2 shoes is really boring but like
[TS]
◼
►
all was well cast he looks like looks
[TS]
◼
►
like the piano lesson one to squeeze in
[TS]
◼
►
the fence railing like that and yeah
[TS]
◼
►
looks like the adult actor and
[TS]
◼
►
everything just just a shortage of stuff
[TS]
◼
►
yeah the problem with him and the
[TS]
◼
►
problem with a lot of this movie is this
[TS]
◼
►
sounds weird but like this one of the
[TS]
◼
►
first thing I seen in a long time I felt
[TS]
◼
►
like there was not enough script like
[TS]
◼
►
the gentlemen we have worked on the
[TS]
◼
►
graters because the words that were you
[TS]
◼
►
weren't always terrible some scenes were
[TS]
◼
►
hit something for mrs. Bigelow just
[TS]
◼
►
should be more script there i was
[TS]
◼
►
thinking of you while I was watching
[TS]
◼
►
this movie because there is a scene that
[TS]
◼
►
is very much like you described episode
[TS]
◼
►
one where characters are actually just
[TS]
◼
►
saying their motivations out loud for it
[TS]
◼
►
I i will do I i am i'm here to destroy
[TS]
◼
►
this world because then Krypton will
[TS]
◼
►
come back and that is what i want to do
[TS]
◼
►
so that is all I'm going to do that and
[TS]
◼
►
and know the results there's you're a
[TS]
◼
►
monster Zod and I will stop you
[TS]
◼
►
oh I am the unmovable force i am the
[TS]
◼
►
unmovable force that will move you do is
[TS]
◼
►
I did somebody leds x like zack snyder
[TS]
◼
►
rewrite parts of the script or what
[TS]
◼
►
happened here you let it burn half the
[TS]
◼
►
pages apparently let's talk about let's
[TS]
◼
►
talk about the fights they're too big
[TS]
◼
►
fights there's a fight that in a small
[TS]
◼
►
it was it only do I didn't say it was
[TS]
◼
►
either one giant fight or thousands of
[TS]
◼
►
smith that's oh ok now now they set
[TS]
◼
►
apart what are you talking about you
[TS]
◼
►
talking about the movable objects we
[TS]
◼
►
talk about zack snyder i did get the
[TS]
◼
►
sense that this was the equivalent of
[TS]
◼
►
somebody with to action figures just
[TS]
◼
►
kind of go and you know when i get each
[TS]
◼
►
oh that's great ungu save you lose me
[TS]
◼
►
you got to have the coconut you're
[TS]
◼
►
banging them together we get you I'm
[TS]
◼
►
gonna get you and then what happens when
[TS]
◼
►
you whack to action figures against each
[TS]
◼
►
nothing because they're just plastic and
[TS]
◼
►
nothing happens when you have a giant
[TS]
◼
►
special-effects budget so so everything
[TS]
◼
►
but so the fact that nothing happened
[TS]
◼
►
isn't the problem it's the property
[TS]
◼
►
well it's it's there's two problems
[TS]
◼
►
first there's a a dramatic problem with
[TS]
◼
►
these fights which is you have to
[TS]
◼
►
invincible or or in the case of a
[TS]
◼
►
smallville battle 3i guess invincible
[TS]
◼
►
people and they they beat the crap out
[TS]
◼
►
of each other and buildings were damaged
[TS]
◼
►
whole cities are destroyed and we'll get
[TS]
◼
►
to that but but the boring part people
[TS]
◼
►
have some people when i said that this
[TS]
◼
►
movie was boring say what do you mean
[TS]
◼
►
action like you know people beating on
[TS]
◼
►
each other when literally you can't see
[TS]
◼
►
any effect where it's like Zod and
[TS]
◼
►
Superman go at it and they they go at it
[TS]
◼
►
so hard and they aren't bloodied they
[TS]
◼
►
are mean occasionally there they like
[TS]
◼
►
fall down and then they get up and kind
[TS]
◼
►
of shake their head but there's there's
[TS]
◼
►
no sense that that uh you know like a
[TS]
◼
►
video game there's like a little power
[TS]
◼
►
bar and the power bars going down there
[TS]
◼
►
is absolutely no sense that we're
[TS]
◼
►
progressing and so instead it's just
[TS]
◼
►
like I don't even know what i'm watching
[TS]
◼
►
this vid the to what end is this fight
[TS]
◼
►
happening able nobody asking for it
[TS]
◼
►
doesn't make sense because it's like all
[TS]
◼
►
right I punched him it didn't seem to do
[TS]
◼
►
anything but if I punch him harder maybe
[TS]
◼
►
that what not didn't do anything
[TS]
◼
►
let me try again what if i throw my like
[TS]
◼
►
it and there's a point where you feel
[TS]
◼
►
like they were just get really tired and
[TS]
◼
►
just be like alright let's just like
[TS]
◼
►
five minute break i guess they don't get
[TS]
◼
►
tired there's get bored but they have
[TS]
◼
►
like a tool that using this movie is you
[TS]
◼
►
just put the people Superman cares about
[TS]
◼
►
in peril like that's the usual move is
[TS]
◼
►
you know you get Lois Lane you get his
[TS]
◼
►
mother whatever and then something is
[TS]
◼
►
finally expected yeah Superman can't get
[TS]
◼
►
hurt right hand he saved you know
[TS]
◼
►
whoever ready I'm not see I mean that's
[TS]
◼
►
cheap ploy but at least that's something
[TS]
◼
►
but yet they're just hitting each other
[TS]
◼
►
and everything especially since suit
[TS]
◼
►
both of them seem motivated by anger as
[TS]
◼
►
if like if I just get angry or when I do
[TS]
◼
►
this it will have a different effect but
[TS]
◼
►
I don't see how you get away from the
[TS]
◼
►
property damage because that I think
[TS]
◼
►
undercuts to trans character yeah
[TS]
◼
►
in general and for the end for the
[TS]
◼
►
earlier part of this movie so so much
[TS]
◼
►
that it just right
[TS]
◼
►
hey there's a great a great review i
[TS]
◼
►
read this morning by a Scott Lynch the
[TS]
◼
►
fantasy author where he wrote a very
[TS]
◼
►
long review of man of steel and I think
[TS]
◼
►
he nailed this perfectly like you know
[TS]
◼
►
this is Superman right you're not going
[TS]
◼
►
to he would move the fight he would go
[TS]
◼
►
somewhere else where people would not
[TS]
◼
►
into a basket over the ocean or movement
[TS]
◼
►
he would not engage you know this is the
[TS]
◼
►
big point of contention that that I
[TS]
◼
►
think has more than any other element of
[TS]
◼
►
movie people tied up in knots one way or
[TS]
◼
►
another and the the reason that I i
[TS]
◼
►
mentioned to you Jason that I think I
[TS]
◼
►
think I came I came I ended up coming
[TS]
◼
►
down on the naco side of things which
[TS]
◼
►
are making a lot of assumptions about
[TS]
◼
►
Andy's opinion he said that it had
[TS]
◼
►
problems but that it was what a super
[TS]
◼
►
hero movie was supposed to be which it
[TS]
◼
►
as I said to my wife in the car driving
[TS]
◼
►
back from dinner tonight
[TS]
◼
►
this movie is so vastly inferior to the
[TS]
◼
►
Avengers but he's not here to defend it
[TS]
◼
►
so so go ahead myself so for me for me
[TS]
◼
►
the the thing that happens with these
[TS]
◼
►
fights that is so counter to what our
[TS]
◼
►
expectations should be Superman is that
[TS]
◼
►
no he does not move the fight to site B
[TS]
◼
►
that doesn't have a bunch of helpless
[TS]
◼
►
people in the way and so on and so forth
[TS]
◼
►
but the framing the movie sets it up
[TS]
◼
►
such that well Superman hasn't really
[TS]
◼
►
had a fight of this scale to deal with
[TS]
◼
►
and as unsatisfying as it is to a lot of
[TS]
◼
►
people some much more than others
[TS]
◼
►
I'm unsatisfying me that there there's
[TS]
◼
►
all this destruction all this death all
[TS]
◼
►
of these innocence that are dying not
[TS]
◼
►
near him or because of stuff that's
[TS]
◼
►
happening with him but because of him
[TS]
◼
►
because he's somehow not able to save
[TS]
◼
►
them to some extent but he's killing me
[TS]
◼
►
he's not saving them yet really killing
[TS]
◼
►
them life crashing by punching is odd
[TS]
◼
►
through a building filled with people
[TS]
◼
►
all those people in the building by this
[TS]
◼
►
this is the massive the massive
[TS]
◼
►
consequence moment that we haven't
[TS]
◼
►
gotten Superman origin stories
[TS]
◼
►
previously where he is he is not he's
[TS]
◼
►
witty he's willfully not paying
[TS]
◼
►
attention to the amount of destruction
[TS]
◼
►
to consolidate our movie that's the
[TS]
◼
►
movie you wanted to see but that's not
[TS]
◼
►
the movie they put on the screen because
[TS]
◼
►
I'm the screen they had him occasionally
[TS]
◼
►
saving some token person to remind you
[TS]
◼
►
that Superman and on the screen they
[TS]
◼
►
didn't have him looking at any point
[TS]
◼
►
saying oh my God look what I've done
[TS]
◼
►
I've killed half the city they like they
[TS]
◼
►
didn't do that they didn't they didn't
[TS]
◼
►
put it in the movie it's not that he
[TS]
◼
►
didn't take it to site B we never saw
[TS]
◼
►
him try to take it suicide or rear-end
[TS]
◼
►
Miller is rare consequently could never
[TS]
◼
►
write read it he never acted like that
[TS]
◼
►
but they like i said in the middle of
[TS]
◼
►
the fight they have him try to like save
[TS]
◼
►
some random person and they had like
[TS]
◼
►
that the Daily Planet people be in in
[TS]
◼
►
stupid peril briefly because the
[TS]
◼
►
smashing machine is coming and it was
[TS]
◼
►
like like what's the point of that some
[TS]
◼
►
and Superman going off to the side and
[TS]
◼
►
saving somebody depending on your bench
[TS]
◼
►
you're like okay
[TS]
◼
►
oh I wish she did more of that I wish he
[TS]
◼
►
had I wish she was saving people like
[TS]
◼
►
the ultimate so that's one way to go the
[TS]
◼
►
other way to go is that's not what I
[TS]
◼
►
think they should be doing here instead
[TS]
◼
►
they should have him losing control of
[TS]
◼
►
his power and destroying everybody
[TS]
◼
►
regretting it if he's gonna be
[TS]
◼
►
regretting it why is he taking time out
[TS]
◼
►
to save some talking character in the
[TS]
◼
►
middle of a fight because like they were
[TS]
◼
►
there working at odds I don't feel like
[TS]
◼
►
that the movie you want to see my sensei
[TS]
◼
►
was it wasn't on the screen it was in
[TS]
◼
►
your head and that's the thing is is
[TS]
◼
►
where i wanted that moment of regret to
[TS]
◼
►
come by the end of this movie as
[TS]
◼
►
supremely counterintuitive as it sounds
[TS]
◼
►
I feel like they're setting that up as
[TS]
◼
►
the inciting incident of the next movie
[TS]
◼
►
which i think is ridiculous and terrible
[TS]
◼
►
and the most corporate way to make
[TS]
◼
►
movies that makes this movie a failure
[TS]
◼
►
but they had their setup for the second
[TS]
◼
►
movie to be a residential insulation
[TS]
◼
►
start the dark knight where it's like oh
[TS]
◼
►
now they hate me but I had to do it to
[TS]
◼
►
save the same exact traditionally went
[TS]
◼
►
again there's no indication as an
[TS]
◼
►
international its rounded them it's not
[TS]
◼
►
in the movie no I I had a bunch of
[TS]
◼
►
people who mentioned this to me on
[TS]
◼
►
Twitter and I and I have to have to keep
[TS]
◼
►
saying it's not as long as it's not
[TS]
◼
►
there you can you can you imagine that
[TS]
◼
►
your was really shy and moving platen
[TS]
◼
►
tour he was trying to save people
[TS]
◼
►
whatever the fact is the to action
[TS]
◼
►
fingers bang up against each other and i
[TS]
◼
►
gotta say it I movie with this scale of
[TS]
◼
►
destruction the Avengers just like this
[TS]
◼
►
to any time you have building
[TS]
◼
►
destruction on this level in an urban
[TS]
◼
►
it's gonna be 911 in people's minds
[TS]
◼
►
people know how many people died in
[TS]
◼
►
scenarios like this and although the
[TS]
◼
►
Avengers did a lot of property damage
[TS]
◼
►
this one goes I mean they essentially
[TS]
◼
►
nuke blocks of Metropolis in this movie
[TS]
◼
►
and what's worse is in the Avengers
[TS]
◼
►
they're trying to stop it in Superman he
[TS]
◼
►
is everything it and they're causing
[TS]
◼
►
whole buildings to collapse around them
[TS]
◼
►
and and I kept waiting for the it
[TS]
◼
►
wow this is really dark is there going
[TS]
◼
►
to be a payoff and in the end no it's
[TS]
◼
►
sort of like Superman will get your
[TS]
◼
►
feelings if he sees odd burn this little
[TS]
◼
►
family and so then he breaks his neck
[TS]
◼
►
which is a whole other story about
[TS]
◼
►
Superman killing somebody which is not a
[TS]
◼
►
Superman kind of thing to do i yeah that
[TS]
◼
►
doesn't bother me I oh I popularly as
[TS]
◼
►
much I mean it doesn't bother me nearly
[TS]
◼
►
as much as the as the thousands tens of
[TS]
◼
►
thousands of people who died in this
[TS]
◼
►
fight because these two guys couldn't
[TS]
◼
►
take it elsewhere i take it out ride
[TS]
◼
►
no fighting here because they just
[TS]
◼
►
decided to beat on each other and it
[TS]
◼
►
didn't matter that the humans were all
[TS]
◼
►
them which completely undercut Superman
[TS]
◼
►
scary and that family that family up
[TS]
◼
►
against the wall by the way is the
[TS]
◼
►
second incident in recent memory in
[TS]
◼
►
which people in peril in a movie could
[TS]
◼
►
have been saved by casually walking in a
[TS]
◼
►
different direction
[TS]
◼
►
yeah other one being prometheus yes yeah
[TS]
◼
►
well this movie had a Prometheus moment
[TS]
◼
►
to work like that building is coming to
[TS]
◼
►
the Daily Planet building is coming down
[TS]
◼
►
Barry White go to the side and he does
[TS]
◼
►
finally go to the side but it was having
[TS]
◼
►
our exponent laser Ray's walk casually
[TS]
◼
►
to your left there was a little trouble
[TS]
◼
►
there it's like jump over the rubble you
[TS]
◼
►
could walk forward five steps then take
[TS]
◼
►
a left your fine said we could just
[TS]
◼
►
cowered together and hope the Superman
[TS]
◼
►
personalized here here's the thing i
[TS]
◼
►
gotta-i gotta talk about the death thing
[TS]
◼
►
for a minute maybe I'm jumping head but
[TS]
◼
►
i gotta bring this up because this
[TS]
◼
►
bothered me and not just from the
[TS]
◼
►
perspective of ok you know Superman he
[TS]
◼
►
doesn't kill people and that's kind of a
[TS]
◼
►
central tenet it bothers me for two
[TS]
◼
►
well the main reason being it's unearned
[TS]
◼
►
there's nothing but all of the advice he
[TS]
◼
►
gets is don't tell anybody because like
[TS]
◼
►
the like try to hurt you write like his
[TS]
◼
►
dad keeps telling like maybe you should
[TS]
◼
►
reveal yourself and his dad told him
[TS]
◼
►
don't engage right he's already engaged
[TS]
◼
►
by this point he is literally through
[TS]
◼
►
and harder every single building he can
[TS]
◼
►
find a metropolis by that point he has
[TS]
◼
►
already overcome what should have been
[TS]
◼
►
the difficult decision which is do I
[TS]
◼
►
fight back right the the issue is not
[TS]
◼
►
his dad's not like don't kill people
[TS]
◼
►
because like you know we kind of get
[TS]
◼
►
that one it's ingrained is that is no
[TS]
◼
►
you don't need to you know you don't
[TS]
◼
►
need to get involved in a conflict right
[TS]
◼
►
you're better than that and that's the
[TS]
◼
►
Superman thing event you know like more
[TS]
◼
►
than anything is like you know you can
[TS]
◼
►
wipe the floor with you guys you know
[TS]
◼
►
don't you you are better than that and
[TS]
◼
►
so the killing felt it off handed and
[TS]
◼
►
dumb and like you know it to me
[TS]
◼
►
especially having and I mentioned this
[TS]
◼
►
in our superhero drafters that we
[TS]
◼
►
recorded some point you listen to me
[TS]
◼
►
listen to your future for our house that
[TS]
◼
►
I've been watching a lot of the justice
[TS]
◼
►
league cartoon and they deal with this
[TS]
◼
►
same issue in that and they deal with it
[TS]
◼
►
way better which is that Superman
[TS]
◼
►
eventually like in a in a parallel
[TS]
◼
►
Superman kills Lex Luthor because he
[TS]
◼
►
gets to the point where is like I just
[TS]
◼
►
keep putting him away like it you know
[TS]
◼
►
in jail or whatever and it just keeps
[TS]
◼
►
getting out and beating the system and
[TS]
◼
►
sooner or later the riders made him do
[TS]
◼
►
can I question the logic to which is up
[TS]
◼
►
until now these guys I i find it done
[TS]
◼
►
clear what really kills a Kryptonian
[TS]
◼
►
when they're on earth
[TS]
◼
►
I mean there's the gallon and who is
[TS]
◼
►
killed because she loses her mask and it
[TS]
◼
►
makes her all weird I thought that
[TS]
◼
►
didn't kill them or is it because she
[TS]
◼
►
got like hit when her mask was off and
[TS]
◼
►
then sod again these guys do so much
[TS]
◼
►
damage to each other except they do no
[TS]
◼
►
damage right well broken login and
[TS]
◼
►
MacGuffins but that's what does it but
[TS]
◼
►
then you could break his neck in the end
[TS]
◼
►
so that's the one thing that you can do
[TS]
◼
►
so when that happened I was like oh I
[TS]
◼
►
guess he can die by a broken neck in his
[TS]
◼
►
bones aren't invulnerable like the rest
[TS]
◼
►
of it and hated and solar charge up to
[TS]
◼
►
full capacity to use the battery analogy
[TS]
◼
►
yeah or the Ultraman Alice she is
[TS]
◼
►
outside the outside was involved but it
[TS]
◼
►
hadn't already gone through too well and
[TS]
◼
►
then we get back to my same problem that
[TS]
◼
►
i mentioned with russell crowe at the
[TS]
◼
►
top which is like this guy is like the
[TS]
◼
►
cream of the crop of the Warriors and
[TS]
◼
►
some kid who you know didn't even grow
[TS]
◼
►
up on Krypton in theory can be done but
[TS]
◼
►
he's got he was the natural birth and
[TS]
◼
►
he's not inferior like the machine
[TS]
◼
►
that's the whole you know it's what I
[TS]
◼
►
certainly not reach anything made by
[TS]
◼
►
machine is inferior to the natural one
[TS]
◼
►
so it's going to be the kid was born the
[TS]
◼
►
right way he's jesus and let's let's be
[TS]
◼
►
clear we haven't even talked to me even
[TS]
◼
►
barely know about that is your 23 years
[TS]
◼
►
old and that when he falls out of the
[TS]
◼
►
spaceship he doesn't have the ross and
[TS]
◼
►
sits in the church in front of the
[TS]
◼
►
stained-glass window of Jesus at
[TS]
◼
►
Gethsemane no less yeah oh yeah you know
[TS]
◼
►
hero with a thousand faces and
[TS]
◼
►
everything now Jason and I like like a
[TS]
◼
►
i-i-i interjected I think broken logic
[TS]
◼
►
and MacGuffins is is the way that all of
[TS]
◼
►
that stuff works they contradicted so
[TS]
◼
►
much of the stuff that they set up
[TS]
◼
►
themselves and stuff that they didn't
[TS]
◼
►
even set up terrific Lee clearly and it
[TS]
◼
►
just seemed like it was serving serving
[TS]
◼
►
a function of the plot that you know
[TS]
◼
►
well at this point so-and-so has to die
[TS]
◼
►
somehow so we're just gonna use a
[TS]
◼
►
science thing and harbor
[TS]
◼
►
yeah we're going to use the science
[TS]
◼
►
thing and the science thing is going to
[TS]
◼
►
make alien person go buy it and some
[TS]
◼
►
people were there was a great debate
[TS]
◼
►
when we talk about star trek into
[TS]
◼
►
darkness and a lot of people were
[TS]
◼
►
complaining about the plot holes and and
[TS]
◼
►
you know i'm sure there are plot holes
[TS]
◼
►
in this movie to a plenty but again if
[TS]
◼
►
enjoying it kind of doesn't matter and
[TS]
◼
►
my problem with this movie is that is
[TS]
◼
►
that I I didn't take that ride because i
[TS]
◼
►
kept getting jarred out of it by these
[TS]
◼
►
things that that frustrated me and they
[TS]
◼
►
weren't just about the plot imagination
[TS]
◼
►
is not working but it's like this isn't
[TS]
◼
►
explained i don't know what i'm watching
[TS]
◼
►
I don't know why what I mean it's like
[TS]
◼
►
there's I'm gonna watch them fight until
[TS]
◼
►
the movie decides they shouldn't fight
[TS]
◼
►
anymore and that's not i like some
[TS]
◼
►
internally consistent explanation for
[TS]
◼
►
why they're fighting and why the fight
[TS]
◼
►
ends and I you know I never really got
[TS]
◼
►
one that was satisfying to me that
[TS]
◼
►
incumbent combined with this this movie
[TS]
◼
►
wins an award for me for most number of
[TS]
◼
►
good actors squandered in crappy light
[TS]
◼
►
side roles get through north and
[TS]
◼
►
laurence fishburne's why is Lawrence but
[TS]
◼
►
I mean he's in there baby for another
[TS]
◼
►
movie it's so you see how much weight
[TS]
◼
►
he's put on and well yeah it doesn't
[TS]
◼
►
matter he still great actor but they
[TS]
◼
►
give him nothing to do richard schiff
[TS]
◼
►
gets like three scenes of light science
[TS]
◼
►
jargon look Lois Lane has like five
[TS]
◼
►
lines I mean it seems like nobody had a
[TS]
◼
►
lot of scenery chewing lines in fact it
[TS]
◼
►
seemed like the people the beginning of
[TS]
◼
►
the movie on Krypton had more lines with
[TS]
◼
►
their you know and that was not that was
[TS]
◼
►
in consequence well and then there's the
[TS]
◼
►
issue of I mean maybe it's because I'm a
[TS]
◼
►
writer and I'm a fan of good writing you
[TS]
◼
►
but like there's not if you if you like
[TS]
◼
►
what's your favorite quote from this
[TS]
◼
►
movie like the Batman movies i think
[TS]
◼
►
even have you know they have like good
[TS]
◼
►
lines right you know there's something
[TS]
◼
►
there's some humor there's you know some
[TS]
◼
►
jobs here in the area of humor was a
[TS]
◼
►
problem this yeah there's very little
[TS]
◼
►
humor there's very little in the way of
[TS]
◼
►
dialogue that you're like what
[TS]
◼
►
when there's more humor in a Nolan
[TS]
◼
►
Batman movies you know you're the most
[TS]
◼
►
damning thing I can say about this that
[TS]
◼
►
it just occurred to me but I was
[TS]
◼
►
thinking about the action scenes is that
[TS]
◼
►
the action scene in superman returns the
[TS]
◼
►
pretty much universally reviled earlier
[TS]
◼
►
Superman reboot where heat where he
[TS]
◼
►
saves that with the jetliner is going
[TS]
◼
►
oh yeah example that action scene was
[TS]
◼
►
better than any of the action scenes in
[TS]
◼
►
this movie green obviously not just
[TS]
◼
►
because it was interesting dynamically
[TS]
◼
►
and you know like a well-executed action
[TS]
◼
►
scene but because it showed Superman
[TS]
◼
►
like what they were trying to this movie
[TS]
◼
►
it showed Superman not quite sure how to
[TS]
◼
►
be Superman and show the difficulty of
[TS]
◼
►
so what you're Superman is still
[TS]
◼
►
actually not that easy to save people
[TS]
◼
►
within its physics is hard
[TS]
◼
►
which is supposed to be Superman
[TS]
◼
►
character so here is the i mean i know
[TS]
◼
►
there was it was supposed to be the post
[TS]
◼
►
Christopher Reeve Superman but it read
[TS]
◼
►
more like inexperienced Superman not
[TS]
◼
►
quite either knowing you're remembering
[TS]
◼
►
how to do the Superman thing and it's
[TS]
◼
►
actually pretty hard to do so you had
[TS]
◼
►
you had the same thing where like oh
[TS]
◼
►
this is Superman for the first time
[TS]
◼
►
deciding to be Superman fighting and not
[TS]
◼
►
knowing you're not supposed to knock
[TS]
◼
►
over buildings well here he was trying
[TS]
◼
►
to save people in a plane the plane is
[TS]
◼
►
coming apart he's gonna try to save
[TS]
◼
►
people he's not endanger his main
[TS]
◼
►
dangerous i'm gonna screw up this rescue
[TS]
◼
►
i'm not going to save these people and
[TS]
◼
►
when it seemed in superman returns is
[TS]
◼
►
better than your action scenes in this
[TS]
◼
►
movie there's real problems here credit
[TS]
◼
►
that's the death 10 first 10 minutes of
[TS]
◼
►
that movie is you know it goes downhill
[TS]
◼
►
pretty rapidly after that man i don't
[TS]
◼
►
get all the superman returns hate like I
[TS]
◼
►
don't like it that much when i saw it
[TS]
◼
►
the first time and it seems like I've
[TS]
◼
►
been trained to dislike it more it's a
[TS]
◼
►
little boring but I haven't I haven't
[TS]
◼
►
you know I haven't seen it again since i
[TS]
◼
►
saw the maybe it's uneven but like I
[TS]
◼
►
look at it more family now having seen
[TS]
◼
►
this one burn well plus it was a it was
[TS]
◼
►
an homage to those movies that I
[TS]
◼
►
remember from family from when I was a
[TS]
◼
►
kid and this is a reboot and and you
[TS]
◼
►
know an exact you know we're running out
[TS]
◼
►
of time but zack snyder is a problem
[TS]
◼
►
and I'll wewe didn't want to start a lot
[TS]
◼
►
for director you know he's pretty as a
[TS]
◼
►
must be stopped he's he died i hate to
[TS]
◼
►
say he's kinda like the superhero genre
[TS]
◼
►
is michael bay but he come on that's ok
[TS]
◼
►
mental I know it's that's harsh even for
[TS]
◼
►
me 300 was good right
[TS]
◼
►
I apologize to Michael Shannon's mom and
[TS]
◼
►
zack snyder's terrible things I've said
[TS]
◼
►
about them i would i would take the good
[TS]
◼
►
and the bad what you just said about
[TS]
◼
►
comparing michael bay because when he
[TS]
◼
►
excels at is the iconic look of stuff
[TS]
◼
►
but like what what Dan and John were
[TS]
◼
►
saying there's there's there's barely
[TS]
◼
►
any dialogue involved it's this is
[TS]
◼
►
iconic shot of lois lane and hear ya man
[TS]
◼
►
saving her and here's iconic shot of
[TS]
◼
►
this and all the framing of it he has
[TS]
◼
►
bad tendencies I mean he takes some some
[TS]
◼
►
he's working with some fairly
[TS]
◼
►
intelligent people like David Boyer and
[TS]
◼
►
John and christopher nolan and yet I get
[TS]
◼
►
this feeling that like when zack snyder
[TS]
◼
►
walks into the room everybody's IQ drops
[TS]
◼
►
she's got that weird thing where he's
[TS]
◼
►
got that weird instinct to say you know
[TS]
◼
►
what I'm going to try and put a
[TS]
◼
►
different spin on this but it's really
[TS]
◼
►
clumsy and ham fisted he's got because
[TS]
◼
►
like what watchman needed a little more
[TS]
◼
►
darkness at the end and Superman would
[TS]
◼
►
you know needed a little more and
[TS]
◼
►
lightness and subtext little less text I
[TS]
◼
►
mean and it was one of those things
[TS]
◼
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where it's like every time he takes the
[TS]
◼
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properties like not i don't think it's
[TS]
◼
►
quite good i gotta put my stamp on it or
[TS]
◼
►
whatever or he just thinks he's being
[TS]
◼
►
clever and he's not being clever like he
[TS]
◼
►
doesn't really really broadly and
[TS]
◼
►
obviously when he tries to throw a twist
[TS]
◼
►
in and it's just sort of like yeah you
[TS]
◼
►
didn't commit to that though you just
[TS]
◼
►
you changed like you you you held true
[TS]
◼
►
to the ideals for like ninety percent of
[TS]
◼
►
the thing I mean change ten percent but
[TS]
◼
►
you just like you flipped it like a
[TS]
◼
►
hundred eighty degrees thinking that
[TS]
◼
►
would make you clever and what it just
[TS]
◼
►
makes is disjoint it and it to your
[TS]
◼
►
point and the thing the thing that I
[TS]
◼
►
kept thinking was he decides to do less
[TS]
◼
►
is more in exactly the wrong places in a
[TS]
◼
►
person without them precisely the wrong
[TS]
◼
►
places where up it in the design
[TS]
◼
►
Superman exchange you know the euro
[TS]
◼
►
monster not going to stop you because
[TS]
◼
►
I'm Superman you know the the so corny
[TS]
◼
►
it wouldn't have been in the nineteen
[TS]
◼
►
fifties adventures of superman shirt
[TS]
◼
►
I'll chair they could have done less is
[TS]
◼
►
more with you know it with with with
[TS]
◼
►
giving Zod forwards to say and having
[TS]
◼
►
Superman's response just be no and then
[TS]
◼
►
they start hitting each other like
[TS]
◼
►
action figures again and that would have
[TS]
◼
►
played a whole lot better than now i am
[TS]
◼
►
going to declare my intent and act on my
[TS]
◼
►
intention ah but you need to have you
[TS]
◼
►
need to front-load the talking you need
[TS]
◼
►
to have talky talky talky so that when
[TS]
◼
►
the fighting comes everyone's motivation
[TS]
◼
►
and hang-ups and what's at stake is
[TS]
◼
►
clear because you did all the talking
[TS]
◼
►
before like the lowest relationship with
[TS]
◼
►
him like they didn't they said likes
[TS]
◼
►
five words to each other as in by the
[TS]
◼
►
end of the movie doesn't make any sense
[TS]
◼
►
you rolling my eyes at that point is
[TS]
◼
►
it's like uh I mean you're going over
[TS]
◼
►
the fact that shorthand that it's
[TS]
◼
►
superman and lois lane but like you
[TS]
◼
►
cannot earn that either
[TS]
◼
►
ya know she kisses everybody who
[TS]
◼
►
cauterizes her with her with us
[TS]
◼
►
here's your stuff for me is that their
[TS]
◼
►
version of giving us enough Clark was
[TS]
◼
►
not the version of giving us enough
[TS]
◼
►
Clark that I think makes it work
[TS]
◼
►
cohesively all around in the best way
[TS]
◼
►
where the and it's setting aside the
[TS]
◼
►
whole journalist thing and how that's
[TS]
◼
►
just kind of a grace note at the end the
[TS]
◼
►
duality of the character is just it's
[TS]
◼
►
it's explored in a different way then i
[TS]
◼
►
think is the reason that it's worked
[TS]
◼
►
archetypal e in seventeen thousand
[TS]
◼
►
different retellings of this origin
[TS]
◼
►
story or the last 75 years but i do like
[TS]
◼
►
that they tried something different and
[TS]
◼
►
I I don't that doesn't it doesn't bother
[TS]
◼
►
me i kinda give it I kind of get a kick
[TS]
◼
►
it's the it's the it's the noble failure
[TS]
◼
►
thing i think which is like yeah he
[TS]
◼
►
really tried he just did you know like
[TS]
◼
►
great a for effort but you didn't
[TS]
◼
►
execute well and and and again you know
[TS]
◼
►
I i don't think that my opinion is
[TS]
◼
►
exactly what Andy's was but in Nevada
[TS]
◼
►
not what we're well here's the thing is
[TS]
◼
►
where I agree with him where I very much
[TS]
◼
►
agree with him I wanted to sum up
[TS]
◼
►
everybody's taken the movie so why don't
[TS]
◼
►
we you you get the first crack
[TS]
◼
►
ok alright good and then everybody can
[TS]
◼
►
contradict me and talking on to go first
[TS]
◼
►
Tresckow first in in the this is this is
[TS]
◼
►
how a superhero movie is made
[TS]
◼
►
ok littered with issues that we have
[TS]
◼
►
with the cannon alterations that were
[TS]
◼
►
issues with characterization issues with
[TS]
◼
►
massive opportunities just not taken to
[TS]
◼
►
flesh out different characters and all
[TS]
◼
►
this stuff but we will have a thousand
[TS]
◼
►
of these different microscopic arguments
[TS]
◼
►
about different elements of the film
[TS]
◼
►
then there are the bigger issues where
[TS]
◼
►
in my heart of hearts the way that
[TS]
◼
►
they've been setting this stuff up in
[TS]
◼
►
the way they talk about it in the press
[TS]
◼
►
yes i have imagined a beginning to the
[TS]
◼
►
second movie that probably should have
[TS]
◼
►
ended up at the end of this movie to
[TS]
◼
►
make it less like Superman is totally ok
[TS]
◼
►
that he murdered all of these thousands
[TS]
◼
►
of people and actually your comes out
[TS]
◼
►
and says what we're all saying here
[TS]
◼
►
that's not that exact that's exactly the
[TS]
◼
►
setup and that's exactly what they kind
[TS]
◼
►
of talked their way toward in addition
[TS]
◼
►
to you know green-lighting the next man
[TS]
◼
►
of steel movie and moving toward it very
[TS]
◼
►
quickly they're not doing separate
[TS]
◼
►
movies for other major DC heroes they're
[TS]
◼
►
going to do the Justice League movie and
[TS]
◼
►
let them split off of that for me the
[TS]
◼
►
reason that it works in terms of what
[TS]
◼
►
they're trying to setup and the stories
[TS]
◼
►
that they are trying to tell is setting
[TS]
◼
►
aside how personally invested i am with
[TS]
◼
►
all the stuff that I think they ripped
[TS]
◼
►
off or didn't do as well as a kid or
[TS]
◼
►
opportunities where well if I were
[TS]
◼
►
writing the movie premiere
[TS]
◼
►
I think they are setting themselves up
[TS]
◼
►
for placing these characters in the
[TS]
◼
►
modern day with consequences that for
[TS]
◼
►
the love of God if they do not do
[TS]
◼
►
something with the consequences of of of
[TS]
◼
►
kal-el doing what he does in the climax
[TS]
◼
►
of the movie you know they don't do that
[TS]
◼
►
well then then everything that I'm
[TS]
◼
►
saying all the support that I'm trying
[TS]
◼
►
to give them is totally lost
[TS]
◼
►
that's what you're saying is that you
[TS]
◼
►
you liked this movie as a strategy by
[TS]
◼
►
the movie studio but not actually I mean
[TS]
◼
►
you're I don't hear you saying you like
[TS]
◼
►
the movie you're saying you like how
[TS]
◼
►
they have strategically placed their
[TS]
◼
►
franchise it i like how they
[TS]
◼
►
strategically played the chess pieces so
[TS]
◼
►
that the overlong Krypton thing that
[TS]
◼
►
sets up the kind of space weird stuff
[TS]
◼
►
that Marvel's having to tack on at the
[TS]
◼
►
end and explain it yeah there's a bunch
[TS]
◼
►
of mystical wacky crap ok I i don't
[TS]
◼
►
disagree with all of that but I come
[TS]
◼
►
back to is this movie a good actually a
[TS]
◼
►
good movie or is it just a franchise
[TS]
◼
►
player then your mind is this a good
[TS]
◼
►
b or is it just an interesting strategic
[TS]
◼
►
I think it's a good movie with major
[TS]
◼
►
character flaws that i like despite
[TS]
◼
►
all right you went first
[TS]
◼
►
now I'm conflicted I'm conflicted but i
[TS]
◼
►
all right Dan I don't have the same kind
[TS]
◼
►
of faith and maybe just cuz I i mean i-i
[TS]
◼
►
so much of it to me comes back to this
[TS]
◼
►
idea of in the word in ethnic the words
[TS]
◼
►
that I hear John you so many times it's
[TS]
◼
►
just not earned right like there's so
[TS]
◼
►
much stuff in here that's like you want
[TS]
◼
►
to do a paint-by-numbers Superman movie
[TS]
◼
►
and so you gotta check the boxes and you
[TS]
◼
►
got to have this in that he's gotta fly
[TS]
◼
►
he's gotta have Lois Lane he's gotta you
[TS]
◼
►
know be all good and everything you have
[TS]
◼
►
Krypton all that and it just it felt
[TS]
◼
►
like I wanted there to be a more
[TS]
◼
►
cohesive it wasn't just that I wanted to
[TS]
◼
►
eat the characters in the modern age I
[TS]
◼
►
wanted the storytelling to come into the
[TS]
◼
►
modern age because there is a way that
[TS]
◼
►
movies are made now and it's different
[TS]
◼
►
from the way that movies were made in
[TS]
◼
►
the seventies when they made their for
[TS]
◼
►
the christopher reeve Superman movies
[TS]
◼
►
and so you want to see the sort of
[TS]
◼
►
modern sensibilities in the same way
[TS]
◼
►
that I think we thought we'd like to see
[TS]
◼
►
casino royale as we mentioned earlier
[TS]
◼
►
was very much a james bond for the two
[TS]
◼
►
thousands rather than a James Bond from
[TS]
◼
►
the sixties or seventies there's a
[TS]
◼
►
different flavor there's a different
[TS]
◼
►
tone it's got to be grittier to a
[TS]
◼
►
certain extent because we you know
[TS]
◼
►
you've got such savvy movie watchers now
[TS]
◼
►
as opposed to 30 or 40 years ago and I
[TS]
◼
►
felt that it just didn't it executed
[TS]
◼
►
poorly on a lot of these and as much as
[TS]
◼
►
I really wanted to like a lot of the
[TS]
◼
►
ingredients it came together in a way
[TS]
◼
►
that just ended up being kind of
[TS]
◼
►
unsatisfactory I mean that my favorite
[TS]
◼
►
scenes from the movie are probably the
[TS]
◼
►
last two scenes in the movie which is
[TS]
◼
►
the the scene where he confronts the
[TS]
◼
►
journey blows up the drone right and
[TS]
◼
►
confronts the general because there's a
[TS]
◼
►
little humor there's little interplay I
[TS]
◼
►
liked the bit about like how do we know
[TS]
◼
►
you won't turn against us when I grew up
[TS]
◼
►
in Kansas you know like like there's
[TS]
◼
►
something funny about that and and I
[TS]
◼
►
appreciate it and even the fact that you
[TS]
◼
►
know it's weird to talk about the idea
[TS]
◼
►
of there being consequences down the
[TS]
◼
►
road when the last seen you see them in
[TS]
◼
►
the movie is like looking all gee shucks
[TS]
◼
►
you know like that
[TS]
◼
►
an eager to start at the daily planets
[TS]
◼
►
like no we just did not like i got a new
[TS]
◼
►
building interested yeah where was the
[TS]
◼
►
building and also where there's just a
[TS]
◼
►
lot of reporters who were killed and
[TS]
◼
►
maybe a little things they all were
[TS]
◼
►
crushed under rubble by the species is
[TS]
◼
►
there anything left to cover rebuilding
[TS]
◼
►
of the center of Metropolis yes and just
[TS]
◼
►
saying once you've discovered alien life
[TS]
◼
►
I think that pretty much takes over your
[TS]
◼
►
new cycle for a while so I don't know I
[TS]
◼
►
there's a lot of good ingredients here I
[TS]
◼
►
liked Henry Cavill i wanted i wanted
[TS]
◼
►
more i wanted there to be in I think
[TS]
◼
►
John nailed it like there's no there's
[TS]
◼
►
no writing like I think you condense it
[TS]
◼
►
down it's like what a
[TS]
◼
►
two-and-a-half-hour movie there's
[TS]
◼
►
probably less than an hour dialogue is
[TS]
◼
►
my guess yeah i think this movie could
[TS]
◼
►
be much better if it was a half an hour
[TS]
◼
►
shorter and I know people say that a lot
[TS]
◼
►
but I feel like this is a movie where I
[TS]
◼
►
could take I could literally take the
[TS]
◼
►
footage that's on the screen and just
[TS]
◼
►
cut it clip hearts out and make it a
[TS]
◼
►
better movie or rearrange it 4-2 all its
[TS]
◼
►
there's too much things go on we didn't
[TS]
◼
►
say I mean things go on way too long
[TS]
◼
►
even even if you do like the destruction
[TS]
◼
►
fights they don't need to be as long as
[TS]
◼
►
they are it's that scene where after
[TS]
◼
►
they you know throw fly the plane into
[TS]
◼
►
the thing and they're like we want it's
[TS]
◼
►
over and then general zod gets up and
[TS]
◼
►
you're like really we're going to do
[TS]
◼
►
more then there's like another 20
[TS]
◼
►
minutes of them bashing each other and
[TS]
◼
►
it's like already seen this guy's like
[TS]
◼
►
cut like a few times now Dan you said
[TS]
◼
►
something about a gradient I that's one
[TS]
◼
►
way to go i don't think these movies
[TS]
◼
►
must be gritty I think that this is
[TS]
◼
►
trying to remake the magic of the Nolan
[TS]
◼
►
Batman series because I mean I think one
[TS]
◼
►
of the best superhero movies in the last
[TS]
◼
►
five or ten years is Iron Man which is
[TS]
◼
►
very sunny and funny and doesn't take
[TS]
◼
►
itself too seriously and in many ways I
[TS]
◼
►
mean I've 75 and I like a good example I
[TS]
◼
►
like Iron Man better than the dark night
[TS]
◼
►
they came out the same summer I thought
[TS]
◼
►
iron man was better and it was light I
[TS]
◼
►
don't think you have to go dark and you
[TS]
◼
►
know it's a different kind of Superman
[TS]
◼
►
story to tell and maybe it was wise of
[TS]
◼
►
them to mix it up i did like that they
[TS]
◼
►
took it in a different direction i'm not
[TS]
◼
►
sure i mean those Christopher Reeve
[TS]
◼
►
movies were so light and sunny and funny
[TS]
◼
►
that maybe they needed to do something
[TS]
◼
►
fear of not being accused of just
[TS]
◼
►
ripping those off well and I think
[TS]
◼
►
you're right there with no one on board
[TS]
◼
►
they they want to capitalize especially
[TS]
◼
►
are going to do a justice league thing
[TS]
◼
►
that there is a certain continuity of
[TS]
◼
►
tone they are for DC vs marvel right
[TS]
◼
►
like Marvel's got it stone like Marvel's
[TS]
◼
►
done an awesome job of establishing what
[TS]
◼
►
is a marvel superhero movie write
[TS]
◼
►
anything the biggest problem is that
[TS]
◼
►
Superman's groundwork was already late
[TS]
◼
►
for it by what they did in the batman
[TS]
◼
►
trilogy and they had to somehow put them
[TS]
◼
►
in the same world not to mention what
[TS]
◼
►
they didn't green lantern which really
[TS]
◼
►
if you just think about pass through
[TS]
◼
►
that really tie together
[TS]
◼
►
apparently they're pretending Green
[TS]
◼
►
Lantern didn't even why don't forget
[TS]
◼
►
that taping it so the the you're right
[TS]
◼
►
and there's that differentiation of
[TS]
◼
►
product to get to what my sense was
[TS]
◼
►
saying about product strategy is if
[TS]
◼
►
Marvel is gone with this doesn't make me
[TS]
◼
►
sound like more of a marketing service
[TS]
◼
►
to well no I'm just mean that that is an
[TS]
◼
►
aspect this is big business to it's not
[TS]
◼
►
just art is commerce but and if Marvel
[TS]
◼
►
is going with the jon favreau joss
[TS]
◼
►
whedon shane black kind of kind of tone
[TS]
◼
►
of these movies on one level you know
[TS]
◼
►
you might say a DC and Warner Brothers
[TS]
◼
►
you might say well we need to we
[TS]
◼
►
organize stick around let's go with that
[TS]
◼
►
let's let's provide an alternative
[TS]
◼
►
I'm just saying that when dad says you
[TS]
◼
►
sort of have to get have to be AI and
[TS]
◼
►
reserved for stronger nothing too but
[TS]
◼
►
they chose to well it's got a its the
[TS]
◼
►
gritty part is less than 10 min less
[TS]
◼
►
important than the the contemporary part
[TS]
◼
►
right it's got a family your modern
[TS]
◼
►
sensibilities can be the jokey funny
[TS]
◼
►
stuff that they do in the Marvel side
[TS]
◼
►
because it's very much you know you're
[TS]
◼
►
just weed no you know style but you know
[TS]
◼
►
there's a difference between you
[TS]
◼
►
couldn't do the movie the way you did ya
[TS]
◼
►
years ago modernity of this movie is one
[TS]
◼
►
of the things I like about it i like a
[TS]
◼
►
great ride to try to make it it's coming
[TS]
◼
►
in over the RSS feeds Jason I know I
[TS]
◼
►
you're a monster dan that's uh John
[TS]
◼
►
siracusa you know if we've sort of
[TS]
◼
►
gotten your vibe but i wonder if you
[TS]
◼
►
want to give us just a little overview
[TS]
◼
►
and final thoughts i think people get
[TS]
◼
►
thrown off by my vibe is if you remember
[TS]
◼
►
the avengers movie I was I
[TS]
◼
►
at various times defending the movie but
[TS]
◼
►
the night when we asked graded at the
[TS]
◼
►
end I gave it a see which I still stand
[TS]
◼
►
by and this looking at this movie
[TS]
◼
►
comparing it to the Avengers and star
[TS]
◼
►
trek I think it makes a nice continuum
[TS]
◼
►
so the Avengers i could not really take
[TS]
◼
►
seriously a lot of the Marvel movies i
[TS]
◼
►
have trouble taking seriously and not
[TS]
◼
►
taking them seriously allows me to enjoy
[TS]
◼
►
the stupid fun and the joss whedon lines
[TS]
◼
►
in the ridiculousness without being
[TS]
◼
►
bothered about the other parts of it so
[TS]
◼
►
that's like don't take seriously but
[TS]
◼
►
Star Trek I is fun and have fun watching
[TS]
◼
►
it and it also lets me take it seriously
[TS]
◼
►
a little bit like I get wrapped up in a
[TS]
◼
►
little bit i start to feel for the
[TS]
◼
►
characters or whatever and that's that's
[TS]
◼
►
you know that's the idea you want to you
[TS]
◼
►
want the movies I want the movie to make
[TS]
◼
►
me take it seriously but also be fun if
[TS]
◼
►
it's appropriate for the movie or
[TS]
◼
►
whatever but I really needs to pull me
[TS]
◼
►
and i can't i can't keep me at a
[TS]
◼
►
distance with ridiculous Marvel things
[TS]
◼
►
that I'm just not really that into and
[TS]
◼
►
you know whatever right
[TS]
◼
►
this movie from especially for the
[TS]
◼
►
trailers the trail just movie we're
[TS]
◼
►
making this was going to be my most
[TS]
◼
►
anticipated movie of the contrast it to
[TS]
◼
►
the star trek where the trailers the
[TS]
◼
►
gate did nothing for me I was like all
[TS]
◼
►
this is not going to be that great so
[TS]
◼
►
that was a pleasant surprise this one I
[TS]
◼
►
was going in with expectations because
[TS]
◼
►
those trailers really connected with me
[TS]
◼
►
and I didn't take this movie
[TS]
◼
►
seriously more seriously than Avengers
[TS]
◼
►
but then it wasn't fun and me taking it
[TS]
◼
►
seriously just brought like it
[TS]
◼
►
disappointed me like you're trying to
[TS]
◼
►
bring me in but you're failing to do
[TS]
◼
►
with this not enough script you're not
[TS]
◼
►
pulling off the traditional story arc
[TS]
◼
►
you're not pulling off the much more
[TS]
◼
►
advanced moves of chopping it up it's
[TS]
◼
►
just not working for me and you're
[TS]
◼
►
making me take it seriously and is
[TS]
◼
►
actually not that much in the movies for
[TS]
◼
►
me to be light and enjoyable like if I
[TS]
◼
►
had disengaged from it and so that put a
[TS]
◼
►
bad taste in my mouth but I give it I'm
[TS]
◼
►
almost like giving it a better grade
[TS]
◼
►
than Avengers like a b-minus or
[TS]
◼
►
something because like Avengers has kept
[TS]
◼
►
me at a distance and and it was like fun
[TS]
◼
►
i watch it again with my son it's like
[TS]
◼
►
it's there it's whatever you know where
[TS]
◼
►
is it okay like is it because adventures
[TS]
◼
►
was kind of a series of meetings
[TS]
◼
►
well I mean like it's just I'd it's not
[TS]
◼
►
it's so clearly like the characters are
[TS]
◼
►
so ridiculous there's no real rules in
[TS]
◼
►
the universe the individual movies for
[TS]
◼
►
the I I felt like at this point I feel
[TS]
◼
►
like I enjoyed watching for more than
[TS]
◼
►
move just like sacrilegious war was just
[TS]
◼
►
for indoor was just ridiculous it was
[TS]
◼
►
like it was like one of those terrible
[TS]
◼
►
shows that Dan watches and undersea WRA
[TS]
◼
►
that's my doorway like like John i will
[TS]
◼
►
say i think fundamentally the more
[TS]
◼
►
superheroes you add to a movie
[TS]
◼
►
the more level of ridiculousness you're
[TS]
◼
►
going to get because you know this movie
[TS]
◼
►
and has a 1 don't match up you know you
[TS]
◼
►
can't you can only see birds in the same
[TS]
◼
►
then movie what's up but so this one
[TS]
◼
►
like it i could have done something and
[TS]
◼
►
i saw it was going for and the fact that
[TS]
◼
►
it didn't attain it left me more
[TS]
◼
►
disappointed but I think if i had to
[TS]
◼
►
grade the movie and take myself out of
[TS]
◼
►
it i'm going to say that because this
[TS]
◼
►
movie actually made me want to take it
[TS]
◼
►
seriously i have to have to give it a
[TS]
◼
►
higher grade than i would like it's real
[TS]
◼
►
it's like the trailer did that job
[TS]
◼
►
well no the movie itself like the
[TS]
◼
►
Krypton thing I was at first it was just
[TS]
◼
►
it just didn't it just didn't pull it
[TS]
◼
►
off and like and speaking of likely what
[TS]
◼
►
they're going to do with the character
[TS]
◼
►
in the movie that we imagine that was
[TS]
◼
►
there is kind of like imagining the quad
[TS]
◼
►
movie the hell yeah I'm existing that's
[TS]
◼
►
what imagining this movie where he's
[TS]
◼
►
conflicted like they did so many things
[TS]
◼
►
to undercut by thinking of the scene
[TS]
◼
►
where like he's he's conflicted as a
[TS]
◼
►
child and doesn't know how to act and
[TS]
◼
►
doesn't know what he's going to do any
[TS]
◼
►
harm and even as an adult he still
[TS]
◼
►
hiding does want to reveal his powers is
[TS]
◼
►
conflicted about the death of his father
[TS]
◼
►
and everything that but then he allows
[TS]
◼
►
himself to be captured and constantly
[TS]
◼
►
strolls up to the thing and says the
[TS]
◼
►
military guy you don't control me you
[TS]
◼
►
never will where does this wherewithal
[TS]
◼
►
come from how do you switch on the dime
[TS]
◼
►
to say I'm conflicted i don't know what
[TS]
◼
►
a real life LOL i've got a totally a
[TS]
◼
►
plan i'm going to be Christopher he's 43
[TS]
◼
►
seconds up i'm conflicted the end of
[TS]
◼
►
found Christopher Reeves again it's it
[TS]
◼
►
they didn't commit to the story that
[TS]
◼
►
could have done and the execution was
[TS]
◼
►
poor but the there are good parts of
[TS]
◼
►
yes it ended up that don't have to do
[TS]
◼
►
with the script and not like that have
[TS]
◼
►
to do with just vegetables i really love
[TS]
◼
►
the actor the guy who played Superman I
[TS]
◼
►
really loved him I thought he was great
[TS]
◼
►
he just was given nothing to do and he
[TS]
◼
►
was trapped in this movie that made him
[TS]
◼
►
do weird things that were contradictory
[TS]
◼
►
didn't come to anything
[TS]
◼
►
there you go so what we've learned is
[TS]
◼
►
that parts of this movie parts of this
[TS]
◼
►
movie not involving the script for good
[TS]
◼
►
and that it was a good business
[TS]
◼
►
calculation by the movie studio you know
[TS]
◼
►
what I said earlier i'll stick by which
[TS]
◼
►
is I think that the Avengers is a much
[TS]
◼
►
better movie than this in a sense that I
[TS]
◼
►
think the Avengers succeeds as a movie
[TS]
◼
►
and even though we can argue about how
[TS]
◼
►
why it succeeds and at what level it
[TS]
◼
►
succeeds I can watch that and i have
[TS]
◼
►
watched it several times since and I
[TS]
◼
►
enjoy what I'm watching and have a good
[TS]
◼
►
where's this movie doesn't that just
[TS]
◼
►
made me mad because this movie had those
[TS]
◼
►
good things that made a promising and
[TS]
◼
►
then in the end I felt like it
[TS]
◼
►
squandered it and it went back to be
[TS]
◼
►
bashing the bashing the action figures
[TS]
◼
►
against each other and honestly I was
[TS]
◼
►
wavering on the movie before all the
[TS]
◼
►
fight scenes and the fight scenes
[TS]
◼
►
murdered it for me because the fight
[TS]
◼
►
scenes were let in
[TS]
◼
►
they were boring they showed none of the
[TS]
◼
►
nuance and promise and interest that we
[TS]
◼
►
got in those better scenes and better
[TS]
◼
►
visuals that happened earlier and were
[TS]
◼
►
left with you know Zack Snyder and his
[TS]
◼
►
action figures and people in these
[TS]
◼
►
collapsing buildings dying all over the
[TS]
◼
►
city and I'm sorry you can't ignore that
[TS]
◼
►
like it didn't happen and and for
[TS]
◼
►
whatever reason i don't blame the
[TS]
◼
►
Avengers for all of the collapsed
[TS]
◼
►
buildings in the Avengers ago I can't
[TS]
◼
►
seriously either like now whatever it's
[TS]
◼
►
silly it's the Avengers there's a god
[TS]
◼
►
there with a hammer come on they're
[TS]
◼
►
desperately trying to stop the dollar
[TS]
◼
►
and they have felt that Superman was
[TS]
◼
►
trying to stop the destruction he was
[TS]
◼
►
just fighting a guy so for me it this
[TS]
◼
►
movie is is interesting because it tried
[TS]
◼
►
more stuff than the Avengers maybe in
[TS]
◼
►
some ways and did some really
[TS]
◼
►
interesting things but in the end it
[TS]
◼
►
lost me and it made me dislike the movie
[TS]
◼
►
even though there are things and I I'm i
[TS]
◼
►
feel like i'm coming along stronger
[TS]
◼
►
coming on stronger than I I maybe feel
[TS]
◼
►
about this I don't hate this movie but I
[TS]
◼
►
I'm my feelings are extremely mixed
[TS]
◼
►
about it because there are things that I
[TS]
◼
►
liked that sort of set me up to think
[TS]
◼
►
favorably for the movie and then I felt
[TS]
◼
►
so let down by the swing of what
[TS]
◼
►
happened at the end that it made me more
[TS]
◼
►
infuriated about it then if I had just
[TS]
◼
►
thought it was middling all the way
[TS]
◼
►
through his middling I could be like at
[TS]
◼
►
it was fine it was in substantial which
[TS]
◼
►
is sort of what you're saying about the
[TS]
◼
►
Avengers and you just go yeah it's fine
[TS]
◼
►
whereas this one was like got my hopes
[TS]
◼
►
up and dash them and I i hate when that
[TS]
◼
►
happens so that's that's that's my take
[TS]
◼
►
on it is I i think that Moises is
[TS]
◼
►
absolutely right about I think maybe
[TS]
◼
►
is weaker than it should be because of
[TS]
◼
►
the imaginations of how they wanted to
[TS]
◼
►
set up a franchise and I think that's
[TS]
◼
►
shameful because yeah you got to judge
[TS]
◼
►
the movie as a movie first and the fact
[TS]
◼
►
that Superman is therefore all this
[TS]
◼
►
destruction and then it's essentially
[TS]
◼
►
never dealt with again is problematic to
[TS]
◼
►
say the least so but but I don't want to
[TS]
◼
►
completely castigate the movie because I
[TS]
◼
►
think we've all said here there's some
[TS]
◼
►
really interesting good things about
[TS]
◼
►
this movie if somebody asks I've been
[TS]
◼
►
struggling with the old the whole hour
[TS]
◼
►
Siskel and Ebert thumbs-up thumbs-down
[TS]
◼
►
thing my friend jeff anderson who is a
[TS]
◼
►
movie critic gave it two and a half
[TS]
◼
►
stars which is essentially the Oh almost
[TS]
◼
►
a recommendation but not and I'm sort of
[TS]
◼
►
in that ballpark which is I'm sort of
[TS]
◼
►
like if you like superhero movies you
[TS]
◼
►
should see man of steel
[TS]
◼
►
I think there's interesting stuff in it
[TS]
◼
►
and it will certainly make you think
[TS]
◼
►
about what you just saw and you may not
[TS]
◼
►
like it but you might you might but if
[TS]
◼
►
you don't like it you still have a lot
[TS]
◼
►
to chew on and I think that's where I
[TS]
◼
►
end up on this movie is like I kinda
[TS]
◼
►
recommend that people who like this kind
[TS]
◼
►
of movie see it it's because I think
[TS]
◼
►
there's interesting stuff in it even if
[TS]
◼
►
I came out of it thinking sort of like i
[TS]
◼
►
did with inception actually thinking on
[TS]
◼
►
balance I thought about it for a week
[TS]
◼
►
and then I decided yeah i actually
[TS]
◼
►
didn't like it but I don't know need to
[TS]
◼
►
see inception come on ya know i don't
[TS]
◼
►
recommend people see inception but i do
[TS]
◼
►
recommend that that superhero movie fans
[TS]
◼
►
and and sci-fi movie fans go see Man of
[TS]
◼
►
Steel if you if you think you might like
[TS]
◼
►
this kind of movie because you'll
[TS]
◼
►
certainly have a lot to think about and
[TS]
◼
►
you may like about and talked about but
[TS]
◼
►
in the end that doesn't make me feel any
[TS]
◼
►
less sort of disappointed and let down
[TS]
◼
►
why if if i can say touching on on kind
[TS]
◼
►
of the way that that john looked at it
[TS]
◼
►
as kind of as a movie and as you know as
[TS]
◼
►
compared to Avengers that the way that I
[TS]
◼
►
kind of think about it is as a movie i
[TS]
◼
►
think it I I think it actually who works
[TS]
◼
►
as a movie itself but separating out the
[TS]
◼
►
notion of it as a Superman origin story
[TS]
◼
►
movie that like that's where a lot of my
[TS]
◼
►
confliction comes from because i love a
[TS]
◼
►
lot of things they changed some of the
[TS]
◼
►
other stuff that they changed really
[TS]
◼
►
struck me is weird and because I'm so
[TS]
◼
►
the consequences being self contained in
[TS]
◼
►
the same movie itself and not coming
[TS]
◼
►
after where end and i know you keep you
[TS]
◼
►
keep you keep hammering me on this but
[TS]
◼
►
but to the point of well you know why
[TS]
◼
►
wasn't that in this movie where the
[TS]
◼
►
consequences of all of those poor
[TS]
◼
►
independent contractors being murdered
[TS]
◼
►
in a new hope working on the Death Star
[TS]
◼
►
oh yeah well that's true what happened
[TS]
◼
►
to all of those people that the rebels
[TS]
◼
►
there's no character that movie who is
[TS]
◼
►
known for saving the population those
[TS]
◼
►
people chose to work harder with me and
[TS]
◼
►
wonder the bad guy
[TS]
◼
►
yeah exactly just a couple bad life
[TS]
◼
►
decisions that the point the point is
[TS]
◼
►
more than consequences it's more to well
[TS]
◼
►
your expectation is that that has to be
[TS]
◼
►
self-contained story for me I says if
[TS]
◼
►
they were if there were scenes about the
[TS]
◼
►
regular Joe's working on the desktop is
[TS]
◼
►
actually something the robot chicken
[TS]
◼
►
episodes do really really well then you
[TS]
◼
►
then you're like oh yeah those people
[TS]
◼
►
thats really sad but the point is in
[TS]
◼
►
this movie I mean I'm sorry after nine
[TS]
◼
►
eleven you cannot show urban destruction
[TS]
◼
►
like this without having every single
[TS]
◼
►
person there know that there are
[TS]
◼
►
thousands of innocent people dying
[TS]
◼
►
you can't you can't do it but this is
[TS]
◼
►
actually one of the reasons i like I get
[TS]
◼
►
it will go off on a tangent here so we
[TS]
◼
►
shouldn't but other reasons i like the
[TS]
◼
►
movie cloverfield which is found footage
[TS]
◼
►
and it's problematic and I like that one
[TS]
◼
►
what I like Cloverfield for is that
[TS]
◼
►
clover field is the superposition of
[TS]
◼
►
Godzilla and 911 and it makes you
[TS]
◼
►
suddenly find it far more horrific but
[TS]
◼
►
you can't just have it happen never
[TS]
◼
►
comment on it have the scale of the
[TS]
◼
►
family in the Grand Central Station be
[TS]
◼
►
the only scale that you see that seems
[TS]
◼
►
to matter and then never address it
[TS]
◼
►
again it's just that you can't do it
[TS]
◼
►
well that's what I'm talking about when
[TS]
◼
►
you're tired when you have a movie
[TS]
◼
►
that's modern right like there is a
[TS]
◼
►
there is a contemporary sensibility in
[TS]
◼
►
terms of the context that we're watching
[TS]
◼
►
it in like them and when I say movies
[TS]
◼
►
were made in the seventies like they're
[TS]
◼
►
made in the 2007 true because we have a
[TS]
◼
►
different perspective I mean at that
[TS]
◼
►
point we were dealing with the aftermath
[TS]
◼
►
of Vietnam you know Watergate all those
[TS]
◼
►
things you take a different impression
[TS]
◼
►
of a movie It's Made in a different area
[TS]
◼
►
absorbs different things from those
[TS]
◼
►
what's going on around it and I think
[TS]
◼
►
you're right you can't you know maybe 50
[TS]
◼
►
years from now somebody goes back and
[TS]
◼
►
watches man of steel they might not have
[TS]
◼
►
that same contextual you know
[TS]
◼
►
feeling to bring to it because they
[TS]
◼
►
didn't live through the arrow but it you
[TS]
◼
►
know on that stretching its or is like a
[TS]
◼
►
teen violence you have people crawling
[TS]
◼
►
out of right we'll be right there okay
[TS]
◼
►
whereas post-911 you get like in
[TS]
◼
►
Cloverfield with the building kind of
[TS]
◼
►
leans on the side of another building
[TS]
◼
►
and you actually have to show all the
[TS]
◼
►
people trying to escape from the Leaning
[TS]
◼
►
building because we know there are
[TS]
◼
►
people in there you can avoid it
[TS]
◼
►
well and and 2 to some extent and you
[TS]
◼
►
know I I'm sure this will be classified
[TS]
◼
►
as over-reaching i'm i'm i'm i'm
[TS]
◼
►
predicting my own downfall i really i
[TS]
◼
►
really feel like the brutality of it and
[TS]
◼
►
this is something that that that loads
[TS]
◼
►
of directors from like the seventies and
[TS]
◼
►
so on to have said about modern cinema
[TS]
◼
►
about how we are brutalizing the
[TS]
◼
►
audience with these movies I feel like
[TS]
◼
►
you can't you can't do a Superman movie
[TS]
◼
►
without some sort of big action-packed
[TS]
◼
►
fight and i'm not talking about the
[TS]
◼
►
exact context of the way that the fight
[TS]
◼
►
was was carried out i'm not saying you
[TS]
◼
►
have to do it with that kind of loss of
[TS]
◼
►
life and that kind of carelessness on
[TS]
◼
►
the part of a hero that is so well known
[TS]
◼
►
for always being there and always
[TS]
◼
►
pulling somebody out of the rubble and
[TS]
◼
►
oh he saved thousands of people i really
[TS]
◼
►
in my heart of hearts I felt like those
[TS]
◼
►
steaks were there purposely and yeah
[TS]
◼
►
it's awful and it's terrible and I i
[TS]
◼
►
wanted to use an explicit tag word to
[TS]
◼
►
describe it that that Superman doesn't
[TS]
◼
►
seem like he cares it lands with him
[TS]
◼
►
that it just happened and he's basically
[TS]
◼
►
ignored it but I almost wonder if that
[TS]
◼
►
wasn't part of the point of why they
[TS]
◼
►
handled the way that they did in in in
[TS]
◼
►
the way that they're changing things and
[TS]
◼
►
you can like that are not like it but
[TS]
◼
►
the way in which I appreciated it is
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that that's something that is so rarely
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addressed in these and certainly isn't
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really in Avengers Avengers is basically
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some of the super-powered people are
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basically super military and their kind
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of doing what they can and they're never
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shown as causing something that might
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have killed somebody but that doesn't
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run that they didn't necessarily kill
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someone and this is actually putting
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more real-world steaks on what happens
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when a man with the powers of a god is
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flying around fighting a dude with the
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same kind of destructive power extends
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never it's never paid off again
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I i would I think it could have whatever
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squandered potential if if if we had
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seen that at any point but I feel like
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what's really happening here is not mean
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we can rationalize it and and I feel
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like that's sort of what you're doing i
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look at this and think you know Zack
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Snyder wasn't interested in any of the
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consequences he just wanted stuff to
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blow up he showed they showed Superman
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after when he took out the drone he
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seemed fine you see if not broken up
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about killing all those people at all
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just like dough taking out your drones
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don't try to find me haha i seemed fine
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you know like they showed him after you
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know and then he goes and works in a
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newspaper is good this is a character
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that we're not used to having those
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kinds of character flaws and that's why
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it bothers us so it's not a flat stuff
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on the character flaw in the movie it's
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yeah he we don't see him not caring we
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we see the movie not caring and that's
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the difference for me I think we're
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putting your you're putting your putting
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it on all of the filmmakers that they
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don't care where I me honestly like it's
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an immensely crappy thing for Superman
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to do and we read it is something that
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Superman would never do
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no it's not just that we read that is
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like it movies either going to make you
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are you supposed to sympathize and
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identify with him or are you supposed to
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condemn him for his callous destruction
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and the movie does not frame movie
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frames that is if we're supposed to be
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always super and we we sympathize with
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like it's up to the movie too
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it's not just like a documentary right
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it's up to the movie to arrange itself
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to deliver whatever kind of thing is
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trying to deliver here and it was
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delivering was Superman is your guy he's
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cool he's coming to his own now this is
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Superman you remember that was the drone
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seen its like oh yeah there is that
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stupid i remember it's not
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hey it's not like zero dark thirty we're
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just like look at the stuff guys what do
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you think of it it's not just laying it
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out in front of me I don't know about
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you guys but the crowds of your co now
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the movie theater not like oh my god I
[TS]
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can't believe superhero murdered over
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serious writing like this is that
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happening are like super nice double
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►
yeah so for me for me it's not that the
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movie is is is commenting on whether
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it's right or wrong for Superman to have
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had this fight in this area with all
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these people dying my point is the movie
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isn't commenting on at all i think it's
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just not there i think i think this
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movie is taking is essentially a moral
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at that point it's not like zero dark
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thirty years amore more are not
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commenting this movie is actually coming
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at you and saying you should be okay
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with this cause look at Superman he's
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actually kind of cool
[TS]
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any guy and high took out that drone is
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actually kind of hot isn't that great
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guys that the movies coming out instinct
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this is our view on what just happened
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Superman we as moviemakers feel that
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this was perfectly fine that there are
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no consequences and here's the scene to
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prove it right there not saying they're
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not staying out of it like zero dark
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thirty saying terrible things happened
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it what do you guys think about you walk
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out of the other movie theater like with
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►
your eyes straight ahead like zombies
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►
like oh my god and you don't know what
[TS]
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►
to think of it like they did this movie
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►
does not stay out of it has a stance in
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►
the stances it's fine no big deal
[TS]
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►
I i disagree i think the stance is judge
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►
him judging for don't judge them for it
[TS]
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►
and that's that ties exactly to what
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►
you're talking about people walking it
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going hey that's great and you know
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►
Superman be the bad guy and everything
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►
and people say the same things about the
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military doing different things as well
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great at whatever cost fantastic they
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I didn't care about it none of those
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►
10,000 people were my sister or cousin
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alright I I think you're giving it too
[TS]
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►
much credit and I don't think the movie
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►
is actually thinking anybody's going to
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think that i think the movie is
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expecting that people are going to be
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►
like wow a lot of crap blew up and that
[TS]
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was kind of cool and then the guy died
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►
and that was awesome and not thinking
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about and I just don't think you can I
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►
offer you can or should show skit
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►
destruction on that scale while
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►
pretending that it has no relevance to
[TS]
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►
what happens in the story plus I think
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►
you're missing a lot of dramatic options
[TS]
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►
by not addressing it but it is what it
[TS]
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►
is i think we've we've beat we've we've
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►
taken our own little city and destroyed
[TS]
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►
it into the weather hasn't prevented the
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►
reins with our machine that makes the
[TS]
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►
gravity go up and down again which
[TS]
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►
actually that was kinda cool and weird
[TS]
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►
in a way this motion machine Jason
[TS]
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►
although I'm not quite sure how how you
[TS]
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►
use the smashing machine for
[TS]
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►
terraforming but whatever whatever this
[TS]
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►
is these are people this is technology
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►
invented by people who destroyed the
[TS]
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►
core of the planet made their plan to
[TS]
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►
blow up so they're not their technology
[TS]
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►
is not solid its advanced but not
[TS]
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►
technologies fine as user are totally it
[TS]
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►
is it has kak anyway
[TS]
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►
again this is one of the things that I
[TS]
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►
credit a movie like this even when I say
[TS]
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►
that I don't like it is that if you can
[TS]
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►
talk about it in this level of detail
[TS]
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►
there's something to to be you gotta get
[TS]
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►
a credit for that because there are a
[TS]
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►
lot of movies out there that you just be
[TS]
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►
like I don't know what to say about this
[TS]
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►
movie good or bad especially bad so I
[TS]
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►
think that's to this movie's credit that
[TS]
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►
we can talk about it
[TS]
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►
well if I can almost get Jason all the
[TS]
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►
ban me from the incomparable permanently
[TS]
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►
don't know because i can so angry no I
[TS]
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►
invited nobody's definitely Anthony know
[TS]
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►
nobody expected that no I mean nobody's
[TS]
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►
been feeling uncomfortable i
[TS]
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►
specifically invited you want because
[TS]
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►
you you said that you had a you had a
[TS]
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►
more positive opinion on this and I
[TS]
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►
thought that would be kind of fun to
[TS]
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►
happen have it on there now your band
[TS]
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►
know so I want to thank my my guests for
[TS]
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►
discussing man of steel with me Dan
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►
Morgan thank you again for being on
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►
every podcast ever
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►
it's a pleasure and i'll see you on the
[TS]
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►
next podcast yes of course John syracuse
[TS]
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►
oh you're a monster and I will stop you
[TS]
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►
think we can all agree that the real
[TS]
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►
after watching this movie and as JJ
[TS]
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►
Abrams who made to star trek movies that
[TS]
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►
were not terrible and he's all just
[TS]
◼
►
setting us up for the crushing crushing
[TS]
◼
►
blow there will be the terrible about
[TS]
◼
►
getting your whole step is right exactly
[TS]
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►
now is just setting us up to knock us
[TS]
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►
yeah yeah and y su are you are welcome
[TS]
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►
back sometime of all the time of my
[TS]
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►
choosing when I choose it carefully but
[TS]
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►
yes you are welcome back and I'm glad
[TS]
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►
that you brought your your perspective
[TS]
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►
I appreciate it well thank you Jason
[TS]
◼
►
you're welcome on on the all-new all
[TS]
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►
different giant-sized that that we
[TS]
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►
rebooted just this week and in which in
[TS]
◼
►
which we talk about Superman stuff as
[TS]
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►
well but not nearly to the heat at which
[TS]
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►
wich we discussed it tonight so thank
[TS]
◼
►
by all means check out my successes
[TS]
◼
►
podcast giant-sized on five by five so
[TS]
◼
►
until next time thanks for listening to
[TS]
◼
►
be uncomfortable thanks again to the
[TS]
◼
►
panel i'm jason still signing off
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►
everybody out there we'll see you next
[TS]