Under the Radar

◼   ► welcome to under the radar a show about

◼   ► independent iOS app development I'm

◼   ► Marco Arment and I'm David Smith under

◼   ► the radar was never longer than 30

◼   ► minutes so let's get started so an

◼   ► exciting thing happened over the last I

◼   ► guess it's about a week or so at least

◼   ► since I first noticed this and started

◼   ► to hear about it so as you would imagine

◼   ► as someone who has quite a few apps I

◼   ► submit to the App Store on a

◼   ► semi-regular basis you know usually I'll

◼   ► have at least a Napper to in review at

◼   ► any given time and you notice something

◼   ► a bit funny the my apps started to get

◼   ► through review really quickly and in

◼   ► fact this is now sort of gone from being

◼   ► this sort of a freak occurrence which

◼   ► I've had before you know in the past

◼   ► I've had like a freak app review that

◼   ► just went through in a day or two or I

◼   ► think I've even had a couple that went

◼   ► through in a few hours and you know who

◼   ► knows what that is but this has happened

◼   ► now three times in a row where my last

◼   ► app reviews have taken 27 25 and 17

◼   ► hours respectively and I've started to

◼   ► hear more generally from app developers

◼   ► that this is a thing now that whatever

◼   ► is causing this to happen is a

◼   ► consistent thing it isn't just my

◼   ► account and if you go to app review

◼   ► times which is this lovely little

◼   ► community source yeah I don't know site

◼   ► that Dave or who's the guy who also does

◼   ► the iOS dev weekly newsletter runs where

◼   ► you can you know you can submit your app

◼   ► review times it seems like this is a

◼   ► thing that the vast majority of apps

◼   ► that are you know people who have

◼   ► submitted their app review times

◼   ► recently are saying that it's taking you

◼   ► know a day or two you know somewhere

◼   ► between you know one or two days which

◼   ► is a massive departure from what we had

◼   ► before and you know certainly it's fair

◼   ► to have a side note obvious yes I know

◼   ► Android has no review time and it's

◼   ► amazing and it's wonderful but this is

◼   ► the world in which the iOS App Store

◼   ► lives and has lived for a very long time

◼   ► where there as long as I can remember

◼   ► the after view has taken about a week

◼   ► sometimes it takes a bit less than a

◼   ► week typically around big updates you

◼   ► know so like in September sometimes

◼   ► things will speed up a little bit

◼   ► because you know there's new update lots

◼   ► of updates coming out the Apple wants to

◼   ► get those read

◼   ► for the new phones great sometimes you

◼   ► can get it slower sometimes it can be

◼   ► you know 10 days 2 weeks but I would say

◼   ► about a week has been what it's been for

◼   ► seven or eight years now and how all of

◼   ► a sudden it seems like you know fingers

◼   ► crossed

◼   ► dabble has changed something in their

◼   ► process in their staffing in their

◼   ► automation in who knows what but they're

◼   ► doing something that's meaning that app

◼   ► review is taking a day and that seemed

◼   ► like a pretty big deal and something

◼   ► that we should talk about because I feel

◼   ► like a lot of the ways in which I

◼   ► approach development are in many ways

◼   ► sort of there were they're working

◼   ► backwards from it's whatever whenever I

◼   ► submit it's going to be a week until

◼   ► that shows up in the store and so if you

◼   ► change that calculus to essentially be a

◼   ► day then a lot of things about the way

◼   ► that you know updates that I think are

◼   ► big enough or good enough to go and

◼   ► actually submit or things might change

◼   ► and just in general like it's it's good

◼   ► for a lot of reasons there's also some

◼   ► tricky things that I think will also be

◼   ► worth updating so does that make sense

◼   ► yeah I mean I I'm as surprised as

◼   ► anybody because as you said like it has

◼   ► been about a week you know whether it

◼   ► was six days or eight days like it's

◼   ► been about a week for almost the entire

◼   ► history of the App Store

◼   ► and we should clear for the iOS App

◼   ► Store the Mac App Store has gone all

◼   ► over the map because it seems to have to

◼   ► have gotten a lower priority most of its

◼   ► life and and so the Mac App Store times

◼   ► have often been as high as like 30 days

◼   ► which was horrible and that's pretty

◼   ► crippling to to any actual efforts to

◼   ► get quality software in the market but

◼   ► on iOS it's been pretty much yeah pretty

◼   ► much a week forever and you know I don't

◼   ► think there was I don't think this is a

◼   ► coincidence I think Apple is pretty

◼   ► clearly setting internal metrics of

◼   ► whatever guideline they they consider to

◼   ► be good enough they hit that guideline

◼   ► and it's pretty obvious that for most of

◼   ► the history of the App Store that's been

◼   ► a week and there's lots of reasons why

◼   ► Apple might want to not get faster and

◼   ► one of the biggest ones obviously is the

◼   ► faster they review apps the more

◼   ► frequently people will submit updates so

◼   ► just

◼   ► it'll increase the total volume of

◼   ► updates they're going to have to deal

◼   ► with which will increase their cost

◼   ► increase the size of that team but that

◼   ► the team has to be et cetera and you

◼   ► know as you get more and more people in

◼   ► this in the app review team you're

◼   ► probably gonna have more mistakes made

◼   ► and that increases the risk of angering

◼   ► developers getting negative press you

◼   ► know possibly letting letting bad things

◼   ► through instead of you know being a too

◼   ► aggressive on the good things so it's

◼   ► certain there's certainly reasons for

◼   ► Apple to want to keep the review times

◼   ► high for all these kind of accessory

◼   ► benefits they get from it and and I

◼   ► really it really does seem like for the

◼   ► last eight years they have just thought

◼   ► that one week was good enough and that

◼   ► was a good balance of all these factors

◼   ► according to them and developers have

◼   ► kind of gotten used to it and have just

◼   ► I was resigned to accepting that it

◼   ► would just always be about a week

◼   ► because they obviously were targeting

◼   ► that and so that was just the way it was

◼   ► it was always going to be forever and

◼   ► the idea now that that that over the

◼   ► past few months like if you look at the

◼   ► graph on on the Trant development thing

◼   ► I look at the graph like it it hasn't

◼   ► been like a dramatic drop just yesterday

◼   ► it's been like a pretty straight

◼   ► downward slope for the last few months

◼   ► basically since Phil took over and it's

◼   ► it's probably related although Phil

◼   ► already ran that department before so

◼   ► like Phil already was the head of the

◼   ► department that contains a preview so he

◼   ► was already the top of that before so

◼   ► presumably he could have you know he

◼   ► probably could have just heard this

◼   ► before and just and didn't because I he

◼   ► probably thought he was he was however

◼   ► the one who made the decision that seven

◼   ► days was was a good target so there are

◼   ► changes afoot like this is it there's

◼   ► because it has not just been like all of

◼   ► a sudden in like a day it's been like

◼   ► this because it's been this this kind of

◼   ► steady progression downwards over the

◼   ► last few months I think it's more likely

◼   ► that this is intentional and that this

◼   ► is possibly the new goal possibly here

◼   ► to stay and that will just have

◼   ► tremendous effects on our development

◼   ► because like like I remember back when I

◼   ► purview you know back when the apps were

◼   ► started

◼   ► you settled pretty quickly into this

◼   ► one-week delay I I said a number of

◼   ► times back then like yeah cuz back that

◼   ► iOS developers had not quite resigned

◼   ► ourselves this is like the inevitable

◼   ► forever state and we were like oh I

◼   ► preview is terrible there should be no a

◼   ► preview we should have direct access and

◼   ► and be able to update as much as we want

◼   ► just like people could always do on the

◼   ► Mac etc and and at the time I remember

◼   ► saying like there's a huge difference

◼   ► between having a short a preview and

◼   ► having a long a preview and the longer

◼   ► it takes generally like the more of a

◼   ► burden it places on developers and the

◼   ► more of like a slowing effect it has on

◼   ► on technological progress on development

◼   ► and on your ability to ship quality

◼   ► software I remember even saying back

◼   ► then seven days is you know we can

◼   ► tolerate this but it would be it would

◼   ► be totally different if it was 24 hours

◼   ► and now it appears that after eight

◼   ► years they are actually changing it so

◼   ► that it is 24 hours and I never thought

◼   ► this would happen I am very happy about

◼   ► it it will change the way we do things

◼   ► and not all those things will be for the

◼   ► better but I think most of them will I

◼   ► don't know I mean what do you what do

◼   ► you think how will this change I mean

◼   ► your special case also because you do so

◼   ► many apps how do you think this will

◼   ► change the way you work so I was trying

◼   ► to think through how this changes things

◼   ► and the biggest like I think that it

◼   ► makes different has different impacts on

◼   ► different kinds of updates that I'm

◼   ► trying to do and it sounds probably

◼   ► worth one thing I looked up ahead of

◼   ► time was I was curious what the current

◼   ► adoption rate for updates is recently

◼   ► you know since iOS 7 there's been

◼   ► automatic app updates so you know

◼   ► customers don't have to go to the App

◼   ► Store and hit update anymore like and

◼   ► for most people that just happens

◼   ► although I believe that's off by default

◼   ► isn't it

◼   ► if it is then a lot of people are

◼   ► turning it on or going to the App Store

◼   ► a lot because what I saw is that for me

◼   ► I'm seeing about three days to get 80%

◼   ► of people updated to the latest version

◼   ► because that's also an important thing

◼   ► to keep in mind because like even if the

◼   ► app update cycle is a day

◼   ► it's still a while until that update

◼   ► will be running on everybody all of your

◼   ► customers apps but it's still a pretty

◼   ► substantial change if say we're going to

◼   ► a world where 80% of your customers get

◼   ► the update four days one day for app

◼   ► review three days for actually updating

◼   ► it on their phone you know versus eleven

◼   ► twelve thirteen days like that's a

◼   ► pretty substantial change but that's you

◼   ► know so good to keep in mind that so

◼   ► within about you know three or four days

◼   ► I can get people doing things for small

◼   ► changes like bug fixes you know I see

◼   ► pan update and I you know I get a crash

◼   ► report back something like that some

◼   ► situation where there's this little

◼   ► change that is obviously wrong with

◼   ► what's currently out there this changes

◼   ► the dynamic for me a lot for looking at

◼   ► it and saying well maybe I'll just do

◼   ► like a point oh one release 0.02 release

◼   ► point O three release like doing the

◼   ► more iterative model in terms of these

◼   ► little little fixes when I used to look

◼   ► at those kind of updates and I'd bundle

◼   ► them together because you know a lot of

◼   ► those fixes really are short and simple

◼   ► and kind of verifiably correct you know

◼   ► you look if you look at you'll find the

◼   ► line of code where oh then you know what

◼   ► am I thinking you know I have an off by

◼   ► one error I have an out of bounds there

◼   ► like something that is just obvious and

◼   ► fixable and I want to get that out to my

◼   ► customers as quick as I could but you

◼   ► know doing a going through at one-week

◼   ► process when I can't submit and any any

◼   ► other changes it usually didn't make

◼   ► sense and so I tend to bundle these

◼   ► things up and then you know do a big

◼   ► sort of a bigger submission and you know

◼   ► when that one came out maybe I'll do

◼   ► another one

◼   ► but you that the cadence of that was

◼   ► very much you know I'd be doing maybe an

◼   ► update or two a month but you could

◼   ► imagine a world where you would do

◼   ► updates much more regularly I mean in

◼   ► many ways it's much sort of like you

◼   ► imagine with web development where you

◼   ► can do releases on a fairly regular

◼   ► basis and your as a result you're sort

◼   ► of your average lifespan of a bug of a

◼   ► known bug will drop dramatically

◼   ► you know you discover a bug you fix a

◼   ► bug you ship that out to your customers

◼   ► so for small changes it seems like

◼   ► that's a

◼   ► new something that I'll have to think

◼   ► through on bigger releases it sort of

◼   ► changes things I think the biggest thing

◼   ► that it changes is if it can become

◼   ► consistent ly around a day or two then

◼   ► when I'm doing a big update something

◼   ► that I'm trying to mark it around

◼   ► something that I'm trying to get

◼   ► attention for it'll be great to have

◼   ► some a better sense of if I put it in

◼   ► review

◼   ► it'll be approved or rejected within 24

◼   ► hours say that was like what the this

◼   ► becomes and I really hope Apple doesn't

◼   ► change their mind on this and this is

◼   ► just some kind of cruel experiment but

◼   ► if this is actually the new reality then

◼   ► that changes that a lot because I can

◼   ► submit my update I can get it approved

◼   ► and I can coordinate my marketing versus

◼   ► the thing that I ended up having to kind

◼   ► of do now where I submit it and I say

◼   ► like tell you I'm tell people in the

◼   ► press and talk to people and say hey

◼   ► sometime in the next 7 to 10 days

◼   ► I hope it'll be approved and you know

◼   ► maybe if you can write an article about

◼   ► it that would be great but like the

◼   ► worst thing on those updates is if it

◼   ► gets rejected and if you get a rejection

◼   ► and then getting the rejection reira

◼   ► viewed takes a week like suddenly you

◼   ► can end up the you know of some that you

◼   ► hoped was going to be one week can

◼   ► become three weeks or more and so

◼   ► turning that around to you get rejected

◼   ► you resubmit you get approved and that's

◼   ► two days rather than two weeks is just

◼   ► massive for release planning for big you

◼   ► know marketing pushes and things like

◼   ► that and yeah I mean like the rejection

◼   ► thing I think is one of the biggest

◼   ► savings here because you know I said

◼   ► like if you're especially if you're

◼   ► submitting a brand new app Apple's gonna

◼   ► nitpick a lot of things you might have

◼   ► thought of or they're gonna disagree

◼   ► with you on something that's kind of

◼   ► near the edge of a rule or something

◼   ► rejection is a multiplier of this app

◼   ► review time where like you know if it is

◼   ► not uncommon for for up for the a 1.0 of

◼   ► an app to get rejected one to three

◼   ► times before one finally gets approved

◼   ► you know with little changes here and

◼   ► there the more you you go near third

◼   ► rails like in-app purchase or pay

◼   ► services like the more likely that is to

◼   ► happen but either way like you always

◼   ► had to plan like you know well this

◼   ► might get this app I'm planning to

◼   ► launch my

◼   ► get rejected one to three times before I

◼   ► can launch it so now your buffer which

◼   ► used to be like well this is probably

◼   ► gonna be in the store sometime in the

◼   ► next month can now shrink down to this

◼   ► can probably be in the store sometime in

◼   ► the next week and that that is

◼   ► substantially better it just it

◼   ► dramatically decreases the cost of

◼   ► rejection and and it also decreases how

◼   ► bad it is if Apple wrongly rejects you

◼   ► this is true

◼   ► yeah and I'm delighted to vent it's just

◼   ► it's I'm honestly still trying to wrap

◼   ► my head around some of the changes

◼   ► because I think about this and I

◼   ► combined it with thinking of recently

◼   ► about the business models and the things

◼   ► that are all on both sides in the App

◼   ► Store where you know things like paid

◼   ► updates which we don't have would have

◼   ► would meek would make bundling up the

◼   ► changes in two large things making make

◼   ► a lot of sense you know sort of the the

◼   ► the model of software where your version

◼   ► number you know it's like you have a 1.0

◼   ► and then a year later you have a 2.0 and

◼   ► that kind of a a model which in this I

◼   ► would say feels fairly outdated at this

◼   ► point the changes too dramatically if

◼   ► there's no incentive on the business

◼   ► side to bundle up your changes and if

◼   ► releasing updates it becomes really

◼   ► lightweight and straightforward it's

◼   ► kind of like this is a situation you end

◼   ► up with I believe I think this is what

◼   ► chrome does the browser we're like

◼   ► there's just a new version all the time

◼   ► or even a scenario where I think I don't

◼   ► actually use the Facebook app but I

◼   ► believe it's just sort of every week

◼   ► gets an update and the number goes

◼   ► bigger or something along those lines

◼   ► I've heard of a lot of software

◼   ► companies moving to that kind of a model

◼   ► where you're you just ship on a very

◼   ► regular basis and the app the product

◼   ► you're sort of always gets better rather

◼   ► than there being these discontinuities

◼   ► in updates you know that rather than

◼   ► having these big moments where the

◼   ► customers have to be like whoa what's

◼   ► going on and you know sometimes you'll

◼   ► still have those if you're doing a big

◼   ► UI refresh or something like that but in

◼   ► general if the app is just sort of

◼   ► always getting better if it's getting

◼   ► updated in the background behind the

◼   ► user

◼   ► you can kind of get into a very

◼   ► interesting pattern there that kind of

◼   ► completely gets away from the concept of

◼   ► like oh I'm working on my next big

◼   ► three-o

◼   ► it's like no I'm just the app is just

◼   ► always getting better and I don't need

◼   ► to break them up into small into these

◼   ► big updates because updates are

◼   ► lightweight they're like this sort of

◼   ► this very simple thing that you know

◼   ► it's even if there was no app review it

◼   ► taking you'd like the difference between

◼   ► a day and zero days is a fairly minor

◼   ► because the majority of the time is

◼   ► going to be spent in getting people to

◼   ► actually go and download it from the App

◼   ► Store's like to get the new software

◼   ► anyway so as long as that number is on

◼   ► that very low end it's warped by the

◼   ► update rate and so it's essentially for

◼   ► like free to do which hopefully Apple

◼   ► you know can adapt to because I would

◼   ► imagine the rate will necessarily go up

◼   ► but I mean the Android store has had

◼   ► essentially no app review well they have

◼   ► a purview but it doesn't take time like

◼   ► I'm not entirely sure in the details of

◼   ► that but I remember they famously

◼   ► announced that they had added app review

◼   ► to the Google Play Store but nobody

◼   ► noticed yeah I think it takes like a few

◼   ► hours to a day something like that but

◼   ► it's it's short and that works and

◼   ► that's great and if we give that's our

◼   ► world to now like that's kind of wild

◼   ► like I would love the amad you know the

◼   ► the who worst thing and I think you ran

◼   ► into this recently with an overcast

◼   ► update where is where you ship an update

◼   ► that you know like you're all your

◼   ► testing all these things you somehow you

◼   ► missed a pretty substantial bug you know

◼   ► a date of lost bug something that's

◼   ► crushing your server is something like

◼   ► some some kind of really heinous bug and

◼   ► previously for those things we would

◼   ► have to go and do the like the bet you

◼   ► know like again our knees and beg Apple

◼   ► hey please give me an expedited review

◼   ► an Apple was usually pretty good about

◼   ► that you know in my in my years I've

◼   ► requested probably a handful of those

◼   ► they've always granted them I mean they

◼   ► the email you get back was almost always

◼   ► a bit comical because it has this kind

◼   ► of like well we'll make a special

◼   ► one-time exception for you and really

◼   ► shouldn't rely on this you know it's

◼   ► like poor you know it's like sort of

◼   ► this kind of very condescending email

◼   ► you get back but whatever I don't mind

◼   ► being condescended to if that meant that

◼   ► my app got really you know good approved

◼   ► in a few hours and

◼   ► this kind of terrible bug you know I've

◼   ► had I've shipped updates where you know

◼   ► it's like if you launch the if you

◼   ► launch that particular version it would

◼   ► like start corrupting your database or

◼   ► things like these things happen and

◼   ► they're terrible but I almost wonder if

◼   ► Apple would still have the expedited

◼   ► system you know in a world of you know

◼   ► if it's a one-day review cycle like if

◼   ► you can be you know a request a one-hour

◼   ► review like I don't even know if that

◼   ► would even make sense but it's lovely to

◼   ► think that at worst it would be a day

◼   ► before I could get something out I mean

◼   ► it takes them about a day to respond to

◼   ► those requests so it's like I think that

◼   ► actually might be a sign like if they

◼   ► end up eliminating the extra had to

◼   ► review system I think that would be a

◼   ► sign that they intend to keep through a

◼   ► few times this low because with the

◼   ► review times being approximately a day

◼   ► that system doesn't make sense anymore

◼   ► it's it's there's no gain there because

◼   ► it takes about a day to get the FFI

◼   ► reviews so yeah it's I mean that would

◼   ► man that would be great it this really

◼   ► would like many of the problems of app

◼   ► review are proportional to the time it

◼   ► takes every few to happen and so you

◼   ► know you don't get rid of all the issues

◼   ► of that review by having short review

◼   ► times but you do make a lot of them a

◼   ► lot smaller of a problem and so I man

◼   ► this is great

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◼   ► much to Braintree for supporting under

◼   ► the radar and all of real AFN so I

◼   ► wanted to also mention the the impact

◼   ► this has both ways on quality so like

◼   ► for me I mentioned before like I stress

◼   ► out like crazy when doing it release and

◼   ► and part of the reason I stress out is

◼   ► what you mentioned earlier of like I

◼   ► know that if I screwed up something

◼   ► big-time it's gonna take me a week to

◼   ► get to get a fix out there and that's

◼   ► just horrible and like worst case

◼   ► scenario if the app it's something's

◼   ► really bad like a data loss bug I'm out

◼   ► to pull the app from the store until I

◼   ► can get a fix out there and lose like a

◼   ► week of sales I've never had to do that

◼   ► but it always been like kind of like the

◼   ► like the the failsafe in the back of my

◼   ► mind like well I might someday have to

◼   ► do that if it's really bad I've had to

◼   ► do that yeah it's it's bad pull the net

◼   ► from from the store for a week and it's

◼   ► just like well that's that yeah I like

◼   ► it that's a that's a huge dent in your

◼   ► income and in the app's growth and usage

◼   ► and sucks for the customers so yeah so

◼   ► like I've always had in the back of my

◼   ► mind like man if I screw this up this is

◼   ► gonna take me a week to fix and if it

◼   ► only takes me a day to fix that's a

◼   ► pretty big difference and so this the

◼   ► faster you can get updates out the more

◼   ► you know the lower stress it is but also

◼   ► I think the more likely I might be to

◼   ► let my standards slip of of like testing

◼   ► and quality assurance to be like because

◼   ► before like if you've ever rejected a

◼   ► binary more than 24 hours after you

◼   ► submitted it then if you think about in

◼   ► this new system that would have shipped

◼   ► to customers and I've done that a few

◼   ► times I did that look two weeks ago so

◼   ► you know I feel like this will this this

◼   ► is a double-edged sword it will increase

◼   ► the ability for us to to to get fixes

◼   ► out there and to improve quality and to

◼   ► be faster but I think it will also

◼   ► increase the likelihood that we ship bad

◼   ► bugs

◼   ► and it's gonna take a certain degree of

◼   ► self-control of quality assurance of

◼   ► good rigorous practices to prevent that

◼   ► one of the weird side effects of this is

◼   ► that right now getting your app approved

◼   ► through the App Store takes roughly the

◼   ► same amount of time or even less then

◼   ► getting test flight beta approval for

◼   ► the first version of the baby ship in

◼   ► test flight so hopefully that's a

◼   ► temporary hiccup and hopefully that will

◼   ► change maybe to the point of getting rid

◼   ► of test flight review entirely because

◼   ► it doesn't make a lot of sense and

◼   ► especially in this world because like

◼   ► we're basically right now I am more

◼   ► incentivized to just update the app for

◼   ► everybody than I am to run a beta

◼   ► because running a beta will take way

◼   ► longer now then then just getting the

◼   ► update out there which is very strange

◼   ► and I think it also I was thinking too

◼   ► like it and one of the things I remember

◼   ► I when I was talking about this online

◼   ► people were the comment I got back was

◼   ► this like well this is just gonna make

◼   ► people use the public as their QA

◼   ► Department which i think is sort of what

◼   ► you're saying it's like well I may as

◼   ► well just ship it out into the world and

◼   ► if people if there are bugs people will

◼   ► tell me and I'll submit an update and

◼   ► we'll go back round and round and I mean

◼   ► I guess that the reality is that may be

◼   ► true and for some people that may happen

◼   ► but I think overall like the average

◼   ► quality will still go up because it's

◼   ► you know it's like our ability to sort

◼   ► of ask them like in a lot of ways I

◼   ► think of software quality you know it's

◼   ► like you're trying to get to say like

◼   ► for some arbitrary measure say it's like

◼   ► crash free users which is I think the

◼   ► way fabric and crashlytics measure it

◼   ► it's like I want that line to approach

◼   ► 100% and the faster I can iterate on it

◼   ► the faster I'm going to get it there and

◼   ► so while some like some reality because

◼   ► I think think of you viewing like public

◼   ► QA as a bad thing like it can be but the

◼   ► reality is a lot of bugs can only be

◼   ► found in the wild you know if beta

◼   ► testing and internal QA were perfect you

◼   ► know then we wouldn't need a crash

◼   ► reporter we I wouldn't mix in my apps I

◼   ► would have just caught all the bugs

◼   ► before I shipped it but like that's not

◼   ► the reality like I had respect and

◼   ► especially any app that involves user

◼   ► data in any way

◼   ► a guy Avena of a recipe book app and

◼   ► sometimes I find some very strange and

◼   ► interesting bugs that are caused by

◼   ► issues that I just wouldn't have I never

◼   ► even dreamed of or imagined would be

◼   ► issues but it's like that's just the way

◼   ► people are using you know using the data

◼   ► or it's their particular language or

◼   ► character set has a weird quirk that

◼   ► causes a strange issue see also our

◼   ► episode number 16 designing for misuse

◼   ► yes exactly like some of these things

◼   ► you're only gonna find and but for me

◼   ► like maybe there is definitely I have to

◼   ► keep I think it's in it's like it's a

◼   ► good cautionary word to keep in the back

◼   ► of our minds that just because our

◼   ► review is quick and fixing a potential

◼   ► bug is more lightweight we still have to

◼   ► have the discipline of keeping of

◼   ► keeping ourselves to high standards that

◼   ► we're not just gonna like oh we'll just

◼   ► ship it and fix it and you know sort of

◼   ► fix it in post kind of mindset but if we

◼   ► embrace the ability of what that means

◼   ► if we keep our standards high they can

◼   ► now the overall quality can get to that

◼   ► much higher and having a much more

◼   ► higher quality level so much faster you

◼   ► know sort of in way that I think of in

◼   ► some ways like iOS updates like iOS you

◼   ► know big major updates where Apple

◼   ► doesn't update once a year with you know

◼   ► a few point releases on the way that's a

◼   ► much slower process necessarily to

◼   ► getting towards really high quality

◼   ► overall because you just it just takes

◼   ► longer and so there's a much higher

◼   ► period where things aren't going to be

◼   ► as good yeah and I think you know and we

◼   ► can see like it's not like this is going

◼   ► to be the first platform ever that has

◼   ► fast app updates available like we can

◼   ► see from existing platforms the Mac the

◼   ► web maybe Andrew it I don't know but you

◼   ► know you can see from other platforms

◼   ► what happens when developers come update

◼   ► their software whenever they want and

◼   ► the answer is some some products become

◼   ► like crashing unstable and changing

◼   ► every day but most don't

◼   ► most just have releases that are

◼   ► carefully issued when they need to be

◼   ► and like most of my Mac apps don't

◼   ► update themselves every day

◼   ► it's fine like they they wait until they

◼   ► they have a solid release and then they

◼   ► update them web apps tend to be the same

◼   ► way we know we're like you're generally

◼   ► not noticing changes every single day to

◼   ► web apps that you use

◼   ► they're generally not like crashing

◼   ► constantly because everyone's running

◼   ► untested code like people just have

◼   ► disciplined and good practices and they

◼   ► figure out how to make it work and I

◼   ► think iOS is gonna be the same way you

◼   ► know as this time stays down if it stays

◼   ► down as we hope it does then we're just

◼   ► gonna see just in the long run better

◼   ► software and there might be some hiccups

◼   ► along the way as some developers get a

◼   ► little bit too careless with it but I

◼   ► think that will iron itself out fairly

◼   ► soon and it'll just be great and I'm

◼   ► just assuming this stays here I could

◼   ► not be happier that they're making

◼   ► changes like this because this means

◼   ► that they care and that they recognize

◼   ► that the previous system was not as good

◼   ► as it can be exactly and I like honest

◼   ► genuine thanks to if anybody who happens

◼   ► to listen to the show happens to work in

◼   ► app review or know someone who works in

◼   ► app review you know highest of fives

◼   ► like this is awesome this is exactly the

◼   ► kind of thing that is an encouragement

◼   ► to me as a developer especially as a

◼   ► smaller developer that you know there

◼   ► are changes afoot that things you know

◼   ► we've been talking about for a while

◼   ► that the App Store is a trickier and

◼   ► trickier place to to make a business and

◼   ► to make a run at and these changes in

◼   ► some ways are small but they are

◼   ► impactful in terms of they allow me to

◼   ► ship better product more easily and

◼   ► that's awesome and so thank you all so

◼   ► big big congrats the app review team for

◼   ► the amazing degree of like secrecy that

◼   ► they have like i i've through my web

◼   ► presence and everything else i have met

◼   ► a lot of apple contacts or heard from a

◼   ► lot of apple people from every

◼   ► department you can think of in the

◼   ► company except a preview I have never

◼   ► heard from or met or heard about anybody

◼   ► who either worked in a preview or who

◼   ► even knew anybody who worked in a

◼   ► preview that's pretty crazy that's

◼   ► saying a lot anyway so a good job on

◼   ► them they're more secret in the car yeah

◼   ► so congrats i purview thank you for

◼   ► doing this please keep it up we are

◼   ► looking forward to this being our new

◼   ► reality I believe it's all the time we

◼   ► have for this week

◼   ► so thank you very much for listening

◼   ► everybody thank you Phil Schiller you're

◼   ► amazing and

◼   ► please keep this and we'll talk to you

◼   ► guys next week bye