Under the Radar 27: Fast App Review
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welcome to under the radar a show about
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independent iOS app development I'm
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Marco Arment and I'm David Smith under
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the radar was never longer than 30
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minutes so let's get started so an
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exciting thing happened over the last I
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guess it's about a week or so at least
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since I first noticed this and started
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to hear about it so as you would imagine
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as someone who has quite a few apps I
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submit to the App Store on a
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semi-regular basis you know usually I'll
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have at least a Napper to in review at
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any given time and you notice something
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a bit funny the my apps started to get
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through review really quickly and in
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fact this is now sort of gone from being
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this sort of a freak occurrence which
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I've had before you know in the past
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I've had like a freak app review that
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just went through in a day or two or I
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think I've even had a couple that went
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through in a few hours and you know who
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knows what that is but this has happened
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now three times in a row where my last
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app reviews have taken 27 25 and 17
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hours respectively and I've started to
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hear more generally from app developers
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that this is a thing now that whatever
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is causing this to happen is a
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consistent thing it isn't just my
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account and if you go to app review
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times which is this lovely little
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community source yeah I don't know site
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that Dave or who's the guy who also does
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the iOS dev weekly newsletter runs where
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you can you know you can submit your app
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review times it seems like this is a
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thing that the vast majority of apps
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that are you know people who have
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submitted their app review times
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recently are saying that it's taking you
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know a day or two you know somewhere
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between you know one or two days which
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is a massive departure from what we had
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before and you know certainly it's fair
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to have a side note obvious yes I know
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Android has no review time and it's
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amazing and it's wonderful but this is
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the world in which the iOS App Store
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lives and has lived for a very long time
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where there as long as I can remember
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the after view has taken about a week
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sometimes it takes a bit less than a
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week typically around big updates you
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know so like in September sometimes
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things will speed up a little bit
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because you know there's new update lots
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of updates coming out the Apple wants to
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for the new phones great sometimes you
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can get it slower sometimes it can be
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you know 10 days 2 weeks but I would say
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about a week has been what it's been for
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seven or eight years now and how all of
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a sudden it seems like you know fingers
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dabble has changed something in their
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process in their staffing in their
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automation in who knows what but they're
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doing something that's meaning that app
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review is taking a day and that seemed
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like a pretty big deal and something
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that we should talk about because I feel
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like a lot of the ways in which I
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approach development are in many ways
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sort of there were they're working
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backwards from it's whatever whenever I
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submit it's going to be a week until
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that shows up in the store and so if you
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change that calculus to essentially be a
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day then a lot of things about the way
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that you know updates that I think are
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big enough or good enough to go and
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actually submit or things might change
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and just in general like it's it's good
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for a lot of reasons there's also some
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tricky things that I think will also be
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worth updating so does that make sense
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yeah I mean I I'm as surprised as
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anybody because as you said like it has
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been about a week you know whether it
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was six days or eight days like it's
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been about a week for almost the entire
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history of the App Store
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and we should clear for the iOS App
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Store the Mac App Store has gone all
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over the map because it seems to have to
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have gotten a lower priority most of its
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life and and so the Mac App Store times
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have often been as high as like 30 days
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which was horrible and that's pretty
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crippling to to any actual efforts to
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get quality software in the market but
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on iOS it's been pretty much yeah pretty
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much a week forever and you know I don't
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think there was I don't think this is a
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coincidence I think Apple is pretty
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clearly setting internal metrics of
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whatever guideline they they consider to
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be good enough they hit that guideline
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and it's pretty obvious that for most of
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the history of the App Store that's been
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a week and there's lots of reasons why
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Apple might want to not get faster and
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one of the biggest ones obviously is the
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faster they review apps the more
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frequently people will submit updates so
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it'll increase the total volume of
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updates they're going to have to deal
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with which will increase their cost
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increase the size of that team but that
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the team has to be et cetera and you
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know as you get more and more people in
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this in the app review team you're
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probably gonna have more mistakes made
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and that increases the risk of angering
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developers getting negative press you
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know possibly letting letting bad things
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through instead of you know being a too
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aggressive on the good things so it's
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certain there's certainly reasons for
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Apple to want to keep the review times
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high for all these kind of accessory
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benefits they get from it and and I
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really it really does seem like for the
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last eight years they have just thought
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that one week was good enough and that
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was a good balance of all these factors
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according to them and developers have
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kind of gotten used to it and have just
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I was resigned to accepting that it
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would just always be about a week
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because they obviously were targeting
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that and so that was just the way it was
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it was always going to be forever and
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the idea now that that that over the
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past few months like if you look at the
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graph on on the Trant development thing
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I look at the graph like it it hasn't
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been like a dramatic drop just yesterday
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it's been like a pretty straight
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downward slope for the last few months
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basically since Phil took over and it's
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it's probably related although Phil
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already ran that department before so
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like Phil already was the head of the
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department that contains a preview so he
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was already the top of that before so
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presumably he could have you know he
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probably could have just heard this
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before and just and didn't because I he
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probably thought he was he was however
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the one who made the decision that seven
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days was was a good target so there are
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changes afoot like this is it there's
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because it has not just been like all of
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a sudden in like a day it's been like
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this because it's been this this kind of
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steady progression downwards over the
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last few months I think it's more likely
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that this is intentional and that this
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is possibly the new goal possibly here
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to stay and that will just have
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tremendous effects on our development
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because like like I remember back when I
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purview you know back when the apps were
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you settled pretty quickly into this
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one-week delay I I said a number of
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times back then like yeah cuz back that
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iOS developers had not quite resigned
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ourselves this is like the inevitable
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forever state and we were like oh I
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preview is terrible there should be no a
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preview we should have direct access and
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and be able to update as much as we want
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just like people could always do on the
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Mac etc and and at the time I remember
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saying like there's a huge difference
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between having a short a preview and
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having a long a preview and the longer
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it takes generally like the more of a
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burden it places on developers and the
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more of like a slowing effect it has on
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on technological progress on development
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and on your ability to ship quality
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software I remember even saying back
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then seven days is you know we can
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tolerate this but it would be it would
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be totally different if it was 24 hours
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and now it appears that after eight
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years they are actually changing it so
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that it is 24 hours and I never thought
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this would happen I am very happy about
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it it will change the way we do things
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and not all those things will be for the
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better but I think most of them will I
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don't know I mean what do you what do
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you think how will this change I mean
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your special case also because you do so
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many apps how do you think this will
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change the way you work so I was trying
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to think through how this changes things
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and the biggest like I think that it
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makes different has different impacts on
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different kinds of updates that I'm
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trying to do and it sounds probably
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worth one thing I looked up ahead of
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time was I was curious what the current
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adoption rate for updates is recently
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you know since iOS 7 there's been
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automatic app updates so you know
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customers don't have to go to the App
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Store and hit update anymore like and
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for most people that just happens
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although I believe that's off by default
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if it is then a lot of people are
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turning it on or going to the App Store
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a lot because what I saw is that for me
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I'm seeing about three days to get 80%
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of people updated to the latest version
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because that's also an important thing
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to keep in mind because like even if the
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app update cycle is a day
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it's still a while until that update
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will be running on everybody all of your
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customers apps but it's still a pretty
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substantial change if say we're going to
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a world where 80% of your customers get
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the update four days one day for app
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review three days for actually updating
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it on their phone you know versus eleven
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twelve thirteen days like that's a
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pretty substantial change but that's you
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know so good to keep in mind that so
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within about you know three or four days
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I can get people doing things for small
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changes like bug fixes you know I see
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pan update and I you know I get a crash
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report back something like that some
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situation where there's this little
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change that is obviously wrong with
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what's currently out there this changes
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the dynamic for me a lot for looking at
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it and saying well maybe I'll just do
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like a point oh one release 0.02 release
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point O three release like doing the
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more iterative model in terms of these
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little little fixes when I used to look
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at those kind of updates and I'd bundle
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them together because you know a lot of
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those fixes really are short and simple
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and kind of verifiably correct you know
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you look if you look at you'll find the
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line of code where oh then you know what
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am I thinking you know I have an off by
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one error I have an out of bounds there
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like something that is just obvious and
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fixable and I want to get that out to my
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customers as quick as I could but you
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know doing a going through at one-week
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process when I can't submit and any any
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other changes it usually didn't make
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sense and so I tend to bundle these
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things up and then you know do a big
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sort of a bigger submission and you know
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when that one came out maybe I'll do
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but you that the cadence of that was
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very much you know I'd be doing maybe an
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update or two a month but you could
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imagine a world where you would do
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updates much more regularly I mean in
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many ways it's much sort of like you
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imagine with web development where you
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can do releases on a fairly regular
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basis and your as a result you're sort
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of your average lifespan of a bug of a
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known bug will drop dramatically
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you know you discover a bug you fix a
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bug you ship that out to your customers
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so for small changes it seems like
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new something that I'll have to think
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through on bigger releases it sort of
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changes things I think the biggest thing
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that it changes is if it can become
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consistent ly around a day or two then
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when I'm doing a big update something
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that I'm trying to mark it around
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something that I'm trying to get
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attention for it'll be great to have
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some a better sense of if I put it in
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it'll be approved or rejected within 24
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hours say that was like what the this
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becomes and I really hope Apple doesn't
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change their mind on this and this is
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just some kind of cruel experiment but
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if this is actually the new reality then
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that changes that a lot because I can
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submit my update I can get it approved
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and I can coordinate my marketing versus
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the thing that I ended up having to kind
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of do now where I submit it and I say
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like tell you I'm tell people in the
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press and talk to people and say hey
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sometime in the next 7 to 10 days
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I hope it'll be approved and you know
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maybe if you can write an article about
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it that would be great but like the
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worst thing on those updates is if it
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gets rejected and if you get a rejection
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and then getting the rejection reira
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viewed takes a week like suddenly you
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can end up the you know of some that you
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hoped was going to be one week can
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become three weeks or more and so
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turning that around to you get rejected
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you resubmit you get approved and that's
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two days rather than two weeks is just
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massive for release planning for big you
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know marketing pushes and things like
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that and yeah I mean like the rejection
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thing I think is one of the biggest
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savings here because you know I said
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like if you're especially if you're
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submitting a brand new app Apple's gonna
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nitpick a lot of things you might have
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thought of or they're gonna disagree
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with you on something that's kind of
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near the edge of a rule or something
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rejection is a multiplier of this app
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review time where like you know if it is
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not uncommon for for up for the a 1.0 of
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an app to get rejected one to three
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times before one finally gets approved
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you know with little changes here and
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there the more you you go near third
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rails like in-app purchase or pay
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services like the more likely that is to
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happen but either way like you always
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had to plan like you know well this
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might get this app I'm planning to
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get rejected one to three times before I
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can launch it so now your buffer which
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used to be like well this is probably
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gonna be in the store sometime in the
◼
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next month can now shrink down to this
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can probably be in the store sometime in
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the next week and that that is
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substantially better it just it
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dramatically decreases the cost of
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rejection and and it also decreases how
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bad it is if Apple wrongly rejects you
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yeah and I'm delighted to vent it's just
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it's I'm honestly still trying to wrap
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my head around some of the changes
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because I think about this and I
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combined it with thinking of recently
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about the business models and the things
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that are all on both sides in the App
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Store where you know things like paid
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updates which we don't have would have
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would meek would make bundling up the
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changes in two large things making make
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a lot of sense you know sort of the the
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the model of software where your version
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number you know it's like you have a 1.0
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and then a year later you have a 2.0 and
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that kind of a a model which in this I
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would say feels fairly outdated at this
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point the changes too dramatically if
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there's no incentive on the business
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side to bundle up your changes and if
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releasing updates it becomes really
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lightweight and straightforward it's
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kind of like this is a situation you end
◼
►
up with I believe I think this is what
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chrome does the browser we're like
◼
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there's just a new version all the time
◼
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or even a scenario where I think I don't
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actually use the Facebook app but I
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believe it's just sort of every week
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gets an update and the number goes
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bigger or something along those lines
◼
►
I've heard of a lot of software
◼
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companies moving to that kind of a model
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where you're you just ship on a very
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regular basis and the app the product
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►
you're sort of always gets better rather
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than there being these discontinuities
◼
►
in updates you know that rather than
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having these big moments where the
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customers have to be like whoa what's
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going on and you know sometimes you'll
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still have those if you're doing a big
◼
►
UI refresh or something like that but in
◼
►
general if the app is just sort of
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always getting better if it's getting
◼
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updated in the background behind the
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►
you can kind of get into a very
◼
►
interesting pattern there that kind of
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completely gets away from the concept of
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like oh I'm working on my next big
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it's like no I'm just the app is just
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always getting better and I don't need
◼
►
to break them up into small into these
◼
►
big updates because updates are
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lightweight they're like this sort of
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this very simple thing that you know
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►
it's even if there was no app review it
◼
►
taking you'd like the difference between
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a day and zero days is a fairly minor
◼
►
because the majority of the time is
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going to be spent in getting people to
◼
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actually go and download it from the App
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►
Store's like to get the new software
◼
►
anyway so as long as that number is on
◼
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that very low end it's warped by the
◼
►
update rate and so it's essentially for
◼
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like free to do which hopefully Apple
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you know can adapt to because I would
◼
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imagine the rate will necessarily go up
◼
►
but I mean the Android store has had
◼
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essentially no app review well they have
◼
►
a purview but it doesn't take time like
◼
►
I'm not entirely sure in the details of
◼
►
that but I remember they famously
◼
►
announced that they had added app review
◼
►
to the Google Play Store but nobody
◼
►
noticed yeah I think it takes like a few
◼
►
hours to a day something like that but
◼
►
it's it's short and that works and
◼
►
that's great and if we give that's our
◼
►
world to now like that's kind of wild
◼
►
like I would love the amad you know the
◼
►
the who worst thing and I think you ran
◼
►
into this recently with an overcast
◼
►
update where is where you ship an update
◼
►
that you know like you're all your
◼
►
testing all these things you somehow you
◼
►
missed a pretty substantial bug you know
◼
►
a date of lost bug something that's
◼
►
crushing your server is something like
◼
►
some some kind of really heinous bug and
◼
►
previously for those things we would
◼
►
have to go and do the like the bet you
◼
►
know like again our knees and beg Apple
◼
►
hey please give me an expedited review
◼
►
an Apple was usually pretty good about
◼
►
that you know in my in my years I've
◼
►
requested probably a handful of those
◼
►
they've always granted them I mean they
◼
►
the email you get back was almost always
◼
►
a bit comical because it has this kind
◼
►
of like well we'll make a special
◼
►
one-time exception for you and really
◼
►
shouldn't rely on this you know it's
◼
►
like poor you know it's like sort of
◼
►
this kind of very condescending email
◼
►
you get back but whatever I don't mind
◼
►
being condescended to if that meant that
◼
►
my app got really you know good approved
◼
►
this kind of terrible bug you know I've
◼
►
had I've shipped updates where you know
◼
►
it's like if you launch the if you
◼
►
launch that particular version it would
◼
►
like start corrupting your database or
◼
►
things like these things happen and
◼
►
they're terrible but I almost wonder if
◼
►
Apple would still have the expedited
◼
►
system you know in a world of you know
◼
►
if it's a one-day review cycle like if
◼
►
you can be you know a request a one-hour
◼
►
review like I don't even know if that
◼
►
would even make sense but it's lovely to
◼
►
think that at worst it would be a day
◼
►
before I could get something out I mean
◼
►
it takes them about a day to respond to
◼
►
those requests so it's like I think that
◼
►
actually might be a sign like if they
◼
►
end up eliminating the extra had to
◼
►
review system I think that would be a
◼
►
sign that they intend to keep through a
◼
►
few times this low because with the
◼
►
review times being approximately a day
◼
►
that system doesn't make sense anymore
◼
►
it's it's there's no gain there because
◼
►
it takes about a day to get the FFI
◼
►
reviews so yeah it's I mean that would
◼
►
man that would be great it this really
◼
►
would like many of the problems of app
◼
►
review are proportional to the time it
◼
►
takes every few to happen and so you
◼
►
know you don't get rid of all the issues
◼
►
of that review by having short review
◼
►
times but you do make a lot of them a
◼
►
lot smaller of a problem and so I man
◼
►
anyway we are sponsored this week by
◼
►
Braintree go to Braintree payments comm
◼
►
slash radar why make payment integration
◼
►
more difficult than it has to be
◼
►
Braintree powerful full stack payment
◼
►
platform allows you to accept nearly any
◼
►
type of payment from any device with
◼
►
just one integration it's flexible to
◼
►
your systems needs and supports most
◼
►
languages where they're using Java Ruby
◼
►
or Python you'll always have a range of
◼
►
server-side and client-side SDK is
◼
►
available this code supports Android iOS
◼
►
and JavaScript clients and this takes
◼
►
just ten lines of code to implement
◼
►
Braintree now by next year maybe even
◼
►
next week there could be a whole new way
◼
►
to pay maybe it'll be the next Bitcoin
◼
►
the next app will pay maybe both
◼
►
fortunately brain trees full stack
◼
►
payment platform is easily adaptable to
◼
►
whatever the future holds so you can
◼
►
adapt easily to accept everything from
◼
►
pounds to PayPal to the next big
◼
►
innovation from any device with just
◼
►
this one integration and when that next
◼
►
payment method comes out all you have to
◼
►
do is update a few lines of code no late
◼
►
no complicated recoding no stress about
◼
►
staying ahead of the curve Braintree is
◼
►
Braintree makes payments and your job a
◼
►
whole lot easier learn more at Braintree
◼
►
payments comm slash radar thank you very
◼
►
much to Braintree for supporting under
◼
►
the radar and all of real AFN so I
◼
►
wanted to also mention the the impact
◼
►
this has both ways on quality so like
◼
►
for me I mentioned before like I stress
◼
►
out like crazy when doing it release and
◼
►
and part of the reason I stress out is
◼
►
what you mentioned earlier of like I
◼
►
know that if I screwed up something
◼
►
big-time it's gonna take me a week to
◼
►
get to get a fix out there and that's
◼
►
just horrible and like worst case
◼
►
scenario if the app it's something's
◼
►
really bad like a data loss bug I'm out
◼
►
to pull the app from the store until I
◼
►
can get a fix out there and lose like a
◼
►
week of sales I've never had to do that
◼
►
but it always been like kind of like the
◼
►
like the the failsafe in the back of my
◼
►
mind like well I might someday have to
◼
►
do that if it's really bad I've had to
◼
►
do that yeah it's it's bad pull the net
◼
►
from from the store for a week and it's
◼
►
just like well that's that yeah I like
◼
►
it that's a that's a huge dent in your
◼
►
income and in the app's growth and usage
◼
►
and sucks for the customers so yeah so
◼
►
like I've always had in the back of my
◼
►
mind like man if I screw this up this is
◼
►
gonna take me a week to fix and if it
◼
►
only takes me a day to fix that's a
◼
►
pretty big difference and so this the
◼
►
faster you can get updates out the more
◼
►
you know the lower stress it is but also
◼
►
I think the more likely I might be to
◼
►
let my standards slip of of like testing
◼
►
and quality assurance to be like because
◼
►
before like if you've ever rejected a
◼
►
binary more than 24 hours after you
◼
►
submitted it then if you think about in
◼
►
this new system that would have shipped
◼
►
to customers and I've done that a few
◼
►
times I did that look two weeks ago so
◼
►
you know I feel like this will this this
◼
►
is a double-edged sword it will increase
◼
►
the ability for us to to to get fixes
◼
►
out there and to improve quality and to
◼
►
be faster but I think it will also
◼
►
increase the likelihood that we ship bad
◼
►
and it's gonna take a certain degree of
◼
►
self-control of quality assurance of
◼
►
good rigorous practices to prevent that
◼
►
one of the weird side effects of this is
◼
►
that right now getting your app approved
◼
►
through the App Store takes roughly the
◼
►
same amount of time or even less then
◼
►
getting test flight beta approval for
◼
►
the first version of the baby ship in
◼
►
test flight so hopefully that's a
◼
►
temporary hiccup and hopefully that will
◼
►
change maybe to the point of getting rid
◼
►
of test flight review entirely because
◼
►
it doesn't make a lot of sense and
◼
►
especially in this world because like
◼
►
we're basically right now I am more
◼
►
incentivized to just update the app for
◼
►
everybody than I am to run a beta
◼
►
because running a beta will take way
◼
►
longer now then then just getting the
◼
►
update out there which is very strange
◼
►
and I think it also I was thinking too
◼
►
like it and one of the things I remember
◼
►
I when I was talking about this online
◼
►
people were the comment I got back was
◼
►
this like well this is just gonna make
◼
►
people use the public as their QA
◼
►
Department which i think is sort of what
◼
►
you're saying it's like well I may as
◼
►
well just ship it out into the world and
◼
►
if people if there are bugs people will
◼
►
tell me and I'll submit an update and
◼
►
we'll go back round and round and I mean
◼
►
I guess that the reality is that may be
◼
►
true and for some people that may happen
◼
►
but I think overall like the average
◼
►
quality will still go up because it's
◼
►
you know it's like our ability to sort
◼
►
of ask them like in a lot of ways I
◼
►
think of software quality you know it's
◼
►
like you're trying to get to say like
◼
►
for some arbitrary measure say it's like
◼
►
crash free users which is I think the
◼
►
way fabric and crashlytics measure it
◼
►
it's like I want that line to approach
◼
►
100% and the faster I can iterate on it
◼
►
the faster I'm going to get it there and
◼
►
so while some like some reality because
◼
►
I think think of you viewing like public
◼
►
QA as a bad thing like it can be but the
◼
►
reality is a lot of bugs can only be
◼
►
found in the wild you know if beta
◼
►
testing and internal QA were perfect you
◼
►
know then we wouldn't need a crash
◼
►
reporter we I wouldn't mix in my apps I
◼
►
would have just caught all the bugs
◼
►
before I shipped it but like that's not
◼
►
the reality like I had respect and
◼
►
especially any app that involves user
◼
►
a guy Avena of a recipe book app and
◼
►
sometimes I find some very strange and
◼
►
interesting bugs that are caused by
◼
►
issues that I just wouldn't have I never
◼
►
even dreamed of or imagined would be
◼
►
issues but it's like that's just the way
◼
►
people are using you know using the data
◼
►
or it's their particular language or
◼
►
character set has a weird quirk that
◼
►
causes a strange issue see also our
◼
►
episode number 16 designing for misuse
◼
►
yes exactly like some of these things
◼
►
you're only gonna find and but for me
◼
►
like maybe there is definitely I have to
◼
►
keep I think it's in it's like it's a
◼
►
good cautionary word to keep in the back
◼
►
of our minds that just because our
◼
►
review is quick and fixing a potential
◼
►
bug is more lightweight we still have to
◼
►
have the discipline of keeping of
◼
►
keeping ourselves to high standards that
◼
►
we're not just gonna like oh we'll just
◼
►
ship it and fix it and you know sort of
◼
►
fix it in post kind of mindset but if we
◼
►
embrace the ability of what that means
◼
►
if we keep our standards high they can
◼
►
now the overall quality can get to that
◼
►
much higher and having a much more
◼
►
higher quality level so much faster you
◼
►
know sort of in way that I think of in
◼
►
some ways like iOS updates like iOS you
◼
►
know big major updates where Apple
◼
►
doesn't update once a year with you know
◼
►
a few point releases on the way that's a
◼
►
much slower process necessarily to
◼
►
getting towards really high quality
◼
►
overall because you just it just takes
◼
►
longer and so there's a much higher
◼
►
period where things aren't going to be
◼
►
as good yeah and I think you know and we
◼
►
can see like it's not like this is going
◼
►
to be the first platform ever that has
◼
►
fast app updates available like we can
◼
►
see from existing platforms the Mac the
◼
►
web maybe Andrew it I don't know but you
◼
►
know you can see from other platforms
◼
►
what happens when developers come update
◼
►
their software whenever they want and
◼
►
the answer is some some products become
◼
►
like crashing unstable and changing
◼
►
every day but most don't
◼
►
most just have releases that are
◼
►
carefully issued when they need to be
◼
►
and like most of my Mac apps don't
◼
►
update themselves every day
◼
►
it's fine like they they wait until they
◼
►
they have a solid release and then they
◼
►
update them web apps tend to be the same
◼
►
way we know we're like you're generally
◼
►
not noticing changes every single day to
◼
►
web apps that you use
◼
►
they're generally not like crashing
◼
►
constantly because everyone's running
◼
►
untested code like people just have
◼
►
disciplined and good practices and they
◼
►
figure out how to make it work and I
◼
►
think iOS is gonna be the same way you
◼
►
know as this time stays down if it stays
◼
►
down as we hope it does then we're just
◼
►
gonna see just in the long run better
◼
►
software and there might be some hiccups
◼
►
along the way as some developers get a
◼
►
little bit too careless with it but I
◼
►
think that will iron itself out fairly
◼
►
soon and it'll just be great and I'm
◼
►
just assuming this stays here I could
◼
►
not be happier that they're making
◼
►
changes like this because this means
◼
►
that they care and that they recognize
◼
►
that the previous system was not as good
◼
►
as it can be exactly and I like honest
◼
►
genuine thanks to if anybody who happens
◼
►
to listen to the show happens to work in
◼
►
app review or know someone who works in
◼
►
app review you know highest of fives
◼
►
like this is awesome this is exactly the
◼
►
kind of thing that is an encouragement
◼
►
to me as a developer especially as a
◼
►
smaller developer that you know there
◼
►
are changes afoot that things you know
◼
►
we've been talking about for a while
◼
►
that the App Store is a trickier and
◼
►
trickier place to to make a business and
◼
►
to make a run at and these changes in
◼
►
some ways are small but they are
◼
►
impactful in terms of they allow me to
◼
►
ship better product more easily and
◼
►
that's awesome and so thank you all so
◼
►
big big congrats the app review team for
◼
►
the amazing degree of like secrecy that
◼
►
they have like i i've through my web
◼
►
presence and everything else i have met
◼
►
a lot of apple contacts or heard from a
◼
►
lot of apple people from every
◼
►
department you can think of in the
◼
►
company except a preview I have never
◼
►
heard from or met or heard about anybody
◼
►
who either worked in a preview or who
◼
►
even knew anybody who worked in a
◼
►
preview that's pretty crazy that's
◼
►
saying a lot anyway so a good job on
◼
►
them they're more secret in the car yeah
◼
►
so congrats i purview thank you for
◼
►
doing this please keep it up we are
◼
►
looking forward to this being our new
◼
►
reality I believe it's all the time we
◼
►
so thank you very much for listening
◼
►
everybody thank you Phil Schiller you're
◼
►
please keep this and we'll talk to you