Hello Internet

◼   ► jokes and the fact that they joke about

◼   ► a thing means that it's not serious and

◼   ► so that they're contributing in this way

◼   ► like I think that's a path down towards

◼   ► crazy town and the only result then is

◼   ► like Oh everybody has to just say things

◼   ► that are perfectly acceptable online

◼   ► like the other thing is I also just feel

◼   ► bad for this guy because his whole life

◼   ► has been on hold while this trial has

◼   ► been waiting to happen

◼   ► and it's been like a year and a half or

◼   ► something before it has actually gone to

◼   ► trial and this is a thing where I have

◼   ► these bad feelings about the Internet

◼   ► where it's like these little storms

◼   ► happen and it's like a person becomes an

◼   ► unperson even before anything official

◼   ► has occurred so even though this guy

◼   ► hasn't gone to trial it's like Oh his

◼   ► whole life has been destroyed for the

◼   ► past year and a half while this is

◼   ► occurring because nobody wants to hire

◼   ► the guy who is waiting for his trial

◼   ► about inciting hate on the Internet to

◼   ► go through and it's like Oh even if he

◼   ► wasn't ever punished like he has still

◼   ► been totally punished in the meantime

◼   ► it's like a terrifying thing in society

◼   ► that that can happen it's like you get

◼   ► swept up in something and so much of

◼   ► your life is destroyed and even if in

◼   ► the end it's like oh we're gonna

◼   ► overturn that case and we're not gonna

◼   ► put you in prison and don't mind about

◼   ► it it's like well the internet never

◼   ► forgets and now no one will ever want to

◼   ► associate with you because you are this

◼   ► person even though like many people

◼   ► don't think you did anything wrong

◼   ► like it just it's terrible for UK law

◼   ► and for people who make anything on the

◼   ► Internet

◼   ► in the UK I'm not condoning it but I do

◼   ► wonder in the back of my mind if it

◼   ► could be the making of him because he's

◼   ► a pretty funny guy he could become like

◼   ► a really funny successful youtuber now

◼   ► again I'm not saying he wanted the

◼   ► attention but now that has happened I

◼   ► hope it becomes the making of him for

◼   ► his sake even if like everything turns

◼   ► up roses for him in the future somehow

◼   ► it doesn't change the fact that it's

◼   ► like okay well who are we gonna bring up

◼   ► next on this obscenity law just start

◼   ► picking youtubers in the UK very early

◼   ► you said like so many people who are

◼   ► leaving comments on reddit hmm I don't

◼   ► know it's like such an incredible

◼   ► overreaction do you have this fear

◼   ► because you're worried that it'll affect

◼   ► you one day because quite often I

◼   ► thought your fears boil down to that

◼   ► somehow lucky you skate one day someone

◼   ► will take something you've done in the

◼   ► wrong context and you'll end up in hot

◼   ► water or you really just being quite you

◼   ► know Noble here and just worried about

◼   ► the world in general I don't know how to

◼   ► say this very well in the context of

◼   ► this conversation because we've just

◼   ► been talking about Nazis right but the

◼   ► ability to express thoughts is extremely

◼   ► important and the power to suppress what

◼   ► thoughts people are allowed to express

◼   ► is terrifyingly powerful it worries me

◼   ► on a society level right like when you

◼   ► ask Oh am I personally concerned not

◼   ► really I produce the most g-rated

◼   ► content in the world and the podcast has

◼   ► a million hours of context around it and

◼   ► I don't think aside from our opening up

◼   ► the wound of the necessary lies of

◼   ► society like I don't think we say

◼   ► anything that's terrible on the show so

◼   ► I'm not personally concerned but I I

◼   ► really do feel that there's something

◼   ► like dangerously corrosive here I always

◼   ► try to stay away from specific political

◼   ► examples because I don't think that that

◼   ► is very instructive but I will mention

◼   ► one that came up like in a conversation

◼   ► with someone so this is like in an

◼   ► American context but the conversation

◼   ► was around the idea of this person

◼   ► basically wanted to make it illegal to

◼   ► deny the fact that climate change was

◼   ► occurring all right they're like you

◼   ► shouldn't be able to express this idea

◼   ► online it should be against the law hmm

◼   ► the reasoning was it's so potentially

◼   ► harmful spreading misinformation around

◼   ► this may be the end of the species right

◼   ► maybe the end of all life on Earth

◼   ► they're like this idea that there's no

◼   ► climate change is so terrible we should

◼   ► put it into law that people are not

◼   ► allowed to express it

◼   ► it's like Oh

◼   ► okay that's absolutely terrifying even

◼   ► if you agree with that that opens the

◼   ► door to the idea that like you're

◼   ► seeding power to a government to tell

◼   ► you what you're allowed to think hey

◼   ► news flash your team isn't in charge

◼   ► right now so how would you feel if a law

◼   ► was passed that said oh you're not

◼   ► allowed to express the idea that the

◼   ► climate is changing then suddenly is

◼   ► like oh I don't like that idea at all

◼   ► like yeah of course this is why like you

◼   ► have to defend the ability to express

◼   ► ideas and thoughts in the broadest

◼   ► possible form and so I feel like any

◼   ► incursion into this territory is just

◼   ► like a big danger yeah so that's why

◼   ► like I feel these stories very strongly

◼   ► and it's like yes I will agree with you

◼   ► like there are tiny areas that we can

◼   ► carve out direct incitement to violence

◼   ► like attacks on a particular person but

◼   ► even then I feel like we need to define

◼   ► that very tightly what do we mean by

◼   ► that it's like there's a cleanliness

◼   ► monster that is going through the world

◼   ► making everything have to be clean and

◼   ► safe we can't even make jokes about the

◼   ► Nazis because the Nazis are not clean

◼   ► and safe right so let's just put some

◼   ► antiseptic over this and just make it go

◼   ► away all right and I think it's bad like

◼   ► I think it's really bad for society and

◼   ► there's something about it that just

◼   ► seems like it's getting worse and the

◼   ► producers is a perfect example psycho

◼   ► fifteen years after World War two we can

◼   ► make an entire movie that makes fun of

◼   ► the Nazis but 60 years after World War

◼   ► two jokes about the Nazis are forbidden

◼   ► they're so dangerous we can't possibly

◼   ► even speak them aloud I don't think

◼   ► that's good for society yeah here's a

◼   ► topic rady where I feel like I need

◼   ► pushback where am I wrong here or do you

◼   ► agree I do fundamentally agree so I

◼   ► don't want to be the good person who now

◼   ► gets up here and talks against free

◼   ► speech the only thing that I don't like

◼   ► about the way you argue this point it

◼   ► doesn't mean I disagree with the point

◼   ► it's just I don't like your stylistic

◼   ► argument and that is I always feel like

◼   ► the people who are like the scumbags of

◼   ► the world who would putting all the scum

◼   ► out there that I hate and the dirty

◼   ► stuff I acknowledge there

◼   ► right to do it right so I'm on your side

◼   ► but I sometimes feel you kind of clothed

◼   ► them in righteous garments when you talk

◼   ► about defending like their right to

◼   ► express thoughts and ideas like this is

◼   ► just people taking a dump everywhere and

◼   ► I feel like you're kind of using this

◼   ► argument of let's have a free debate and

◼   ► you make a lot of these people sound

◼   ► better than they are I don't deny their

◼   ► right to exist and do these things but I

◼   ► wish you didn't make them sound so noble

◼   ► yeah I mean the reason I talk about

◼   ► thoughts and ideas is because I feel

◼   ► like I'm trying to keep it

◼   ► generic yeah but I think by doing that

◼   ► you're bringing a lot of scumbags into

◼   ► the fold of nice people yeah but that's

◼   ► the problem of letting people express

◼   ► all of their thoughts and ideas here it

◼   ► is guess what some people have terrible

◼   ► thoughts and ideas I don't think these

◼   ► people were taking a dump all over the

◼   ► place are expressing thoughts or ideas

◼   ► they dislike taking a dump but they are

◼   ► thoughts and ideas they are concepts

◼   ► expressed with language I don't think

◼   ► that there is a way to draw a circle

◼   ► where we can say we all agree these

◼   ► patterns of words are good and these

◼   ► patterns of words are terrible no no I

◼   ► think we can do that I just don't think

◼   ► we can ban them I think it's fair to sit

◼   ► around and start weighing things and

◼   ► saying that's a good idea that's an

◼   ► interesting thought and idea that's a

◼   ► smart thing you said you there who just

◼   ► wrote you're gay that's not a good

◼   ► thought or idea that's not constructive

◼   ► you're an idiot but you're allowed to do

◼   ► it like that's a perfect example right

◼   ► like the canonical youtube comment

◼   ► you're you are gay yeah perhaps there

◼   ► has been no YouTube comment more

◼   ► frequently said than that one right

◼   ► right and it's like yeah I'll sit here

◼   ► and agree with you like 100 percent like

◼   ► it adds nothing it's no good it's not

◼   ► Plato

◼   ► but I think it's too easy in a

◼   ► conversation to pick a particular thing

◼   ► that we can say like oh we all agree

◼   ► that this is no good

◼   ► but if you're trying to craft laws I

◼   ► think it's really hard to craft a law

◼   ► that can define what do we mean by this

◼   ► and that then as an additional layer can

◼   ► be in

◼   ► forced in a reasonable way and count

◼   ► Acula is a good example of this we're

◼   ► okay if this is the law of the land in

◼   ► the United Kingdom how is it that like

◼   ► just this one guy got swept up by this

◼   ► law and meanwhile like there are actual

◼   ► Nazis like expressing actual Nazi

◼   ► thoughts and that's cool like okay well

◼   ► then you have some kind of bizarre

◼   ► selective enforcement of this I'd love

◼   ► to know the story behind this there must

◼   ► be a bigger story it is amazing isn't it

◼   ► this guy got done with all the other

◼   ► stuff that's out there it's weird I

◼   ► think it's because it was a viral video

◼   ► right so we're just like it becomes a

◼   ► bunch of attention and then someone

◼   ► files a complaint and like now it starts

◼   ► getting run up the chain I feel like for

◼   ► my old days as a teacher I understand

◼   ► very well the concept of like a small

◼   ► thing the instant someone makes an

◼   ► official complaint about it it like oh

◼   ► god like now it's going to be run up the

◼   ► chain and like no one can stop the

◼   ► machine that keeps making this a bigger

◼   ► deal than it actually is right even if

◼   ► no one involved in the chain wants to

◼   ► keep escalating it there's an incentive

◼   ► at every level to keep escalating it so

◼   ► I feel like this can just be like the

◼   ► random weather of the Internet yeah but

◼   ► so that's why I do want to be clear like

◼   ► I'm not saying like everybody has an

◼   ► equal contribution to the conversation

◼   ► because obviously they don't some people

◼   ► are really smart and they can contribute

◼   ► more to conversations some people are

◼   ► really stupid and they don't have very

◼   ► much to add at all anyway you just as I

◼   ► said I agree with you you just asked for

◼   ► some pushback and my pushback is the way

◼   ► you frame your argument I think cloaks

◼   ► these people in garments of

◼   ► righteousness that they're entitled to

◼   ► the garments but I just feel a bit like

◼   ► let me just say the reason that I do say

◼   ► it is thoughts and ideas is it just like

◼   ► when I made those videos about the

◼   ► voting systems a long time ago that

◼   ► there's a reason I don't talk about

◼   ► specific political parties because as

◼   ► soon as you talk about specific

◼   ► political parties the only thing people

◼   ► want is whatever voting system gets

◼   ► their guys into office right that's the

◼   ► one that seems the most fair and you

◼   ► need to have a system where everyone can

◼   ► agree that the election is fair before

◼   ► the election takes place when I'm

◼   ► talking about thoughts and ideas in the

◼   ► public realm we need to talk about them

◼   ► in the most abstract way because if we

◼   ► start talking about like what do we do

◼   ► with good ideas and what do we do with

◼   ► bad ideas like the conversation about

◼   ► how do you manage conversation is

◼   ► already poisoned because everybody has

◼   ► in their own head like the idea of what

◼   ► a bad idea is and then so we should do

◼   ► bad things to bad ideas

◼   ► like the idea of like Oh which side of a

◼   ► debate do you want to not allow to speak

◼   ► so that's why I try to talk about it in

◼   ► general terms because I think that is

◼   ► the only sensible way to try to think

◼   ► through the topic and yeah of course

◼   ► whenever you're discussing freedom of

◼   ► speech and you are defending it you are

◼   ► by definition having to defend the most

◼   ► fringe of fringe people that's just the

◼   ► nature of this conversation and I think

◼   ► it's why free speech defenders are often

◼   ► at a bit of a disadvantage because like

◼   ► by necessity you you're like the guy who

◼   ► has to defend the Nazi joke when it

◼   ► would be much easier to just join in

◼   ► with a sanctimonious crowd and be like

◼   ► he should have phrased it differently

◼   ► like I don't appreciate that joke at all

◼   ► and I don't think it's good for the

◼   ► world I do think he should have phrased

◼   ► it but he's very good how many more

◼   ► people do you have to see step on the

◼   ► landmine before you think hmm

◼   ► maybe I won't walk into that minefield

◼   ► how many people do you have to see get

◼   ► blown up to take it in a slightly

◼   ► adjacent way I'm reading a book which is

◼   ► about the court case that happened with

◼   ► Gawker a few years ago with the Hulk

◼   ► Hogan sex tape and Peter Thiel was

◼   ► funding this lawsuit against Gawker it's

◼   ► an interesting book so far but part of

◼   ► what they're talking about as well is

◼   ► this effect that like gossip columns

◼   ► have on people's ability to think in

◼   ► public and it's like oh people start

◼   ► worrying when there's a gossip column

◼   ► that's going after the technology sector

◼   ► that it it naturally has people close

◼   ► ranks much further than they otherwise

◼   ► would like they're much more reluctant

◼   ► to express any ideas in public because

◼   ► they're worried about it being twisted

◼   ► because like that's what the gossip

◼   ► column does and that's what I mean when

◼   ► I say like I think there's something

◼   ► dangerous in this kind of

◼   ► that is like even if you're a million

◼   ► miles from making Nazi jokes like you

◼   ► said it's you feel like ah the boundary

◼   ► of acceptable conversation has been

◼   ► moved and so if I want to stay far from

◼   ► that boundary I need to move even

◼   ► farther in to only acceptable things you

◼   ► know so it's like I want to stay a

◼   ► hundred metres away from that boundary

◼   ► and we keep pulling that boundary and

◼   ► further and further it has more of an

◼   ► effect than just the people at the very

◼   ► edge and I just don't think that that's

◼   ► good for public conversation fair enough

◼   ► sorry about that I didn't mean to rant

◼   ► for so long you've passed my guy this

◼   ► whole time I've been ranting Brady to

◼   ► the dead fish on the H I love me for my

◼   ► computer screen I never close that image

◼   ► it's still there hello internets this

◼   ► audio sounds terrible because I have

◼   ► just gotten into a hotel room I'm on the

◼   ► last leg of a multi leg trip and without

◼   ► my regular audio equipment and you know

◼   ► when you're traveling it's very easy to

◼   ► find yourself without the stuff that you

◼   ► really need including for example your

◼   ► computer files you grab your laptop and

◼   ► you go but you know what you forgot that

◼   ► thing that's sitting back at home on

◼   ► your desktop what are you gonna do in

◼   ► that scenario well under most

◼   ► circumstances you're just screwed

◼   ► there's nothing that you can do but if

◼   ► you have taken our advice on hello

◼   ► internet and installed Backblaze then

◼   ► everything is fine because Backblaze in

◼   ► addition to being the backup service

◼   ► that you should obviously have on your

◼   ► computer will also allow you anywhere in

◼   ► the world to access any of your files

◼   ► and speaking from experience not only

◼   ► has back lays on multiple times totally

◼   ► saved my bacon with lost files back lays

◼   ► has been super helpful for grabbing a

◼   ► file that I just saved in a random spot

◼   ► on my hard drive it didn't really think

◼   ► about and then later needed when I was

◼   ► away from the computer

◼   ► once again

◼   ► I'm going to tell you that's if you're

◼   ► sitting in front of your computer and

◼   ► you do not have Backblaze installed on

◼   ► that computer right now you need to open

◼   ► up your web browser open it up and go to

◼   ► Backblaze comm slash hello Internet and

◼   ► get started there really isn't any

◼   ► better service for your Mac or PC to

◼   ► just take care of your backups and allow

◼   ► you remote access and it's just five

◼   ► dollars a month five dollars a month for

◼   ► peace of mind so please go to Backblaze

◼   ► comm slash hello Internet

◼   ► do it for your sake so you can sleep

◼   ► better at night do it for my sake so

◼   ► I'll sleep better at night knowing that

◼   ► your files are protected so once again

◼   ► go to Backblaze comm slash hello

◼   ► internet that lets Backblaze know that

◼   ► you came from us and it will get you a

◼   ► fully featured 15-day free trial for

◼   ► your computer that's Backblaze comm

◼   ► slash hello Internet alright enjoy the

◼   ► rest of the show I I gotta get going so

◼   ► there was a full-page ad in my copy of

◼   ► The Times Sunday Times this morning

◼   ► Mark Zuckerberg kind of apologizing to

◼   ► the world but in that kind of in a

◼   ► weaselly way where he's not really

◼   ► apologizing is also blaming other people

◼   ► right like the way a spider who's

◼   ► pretending to be a person would

◼   ► apologize he's got a terrible signature

◼   ► by the way Matt psycho does he mmm well

◼   ► that's because spiders riding inside of

◼   ► human suits have a really hard time with

◼   ► that finger dexterity that's an

◼   ► interesting theory because it is kind of

◼   ► spider like in fact I took a photo of it

◼   ► to send you so I'll show you maybe this

◼   ► is wrong maybe this is me bullying a

◼   ► public person but I always just get the

◼   ► feeling that Mark Zuckerberg is like

◼   ► there's a spider riding around in a

◼   ► robot that's shaped like Mark Zuckerberg

◼   ► this is the feeling like whenever he

◼   ► talks whenever he moves it's like

◼   ► there's not a person in there there's a

◼   ► spider in there here's my question all

◼   ► right Facebook is in a new controversy

◼   ► to do with data and stuff like that we

◼   ► can talk about it in a minute if you

◼   ► want

◼   ► but my overall question is because this

◼   ► this is gonna keep happening to Facebook

◼   ► because they're a company that seems to

◼   ► cause a lot of controversy is Facebook

◼   ► too big to fail now is facebook gonna be

◼   ► with us forever

◼   ► it's interesting if you'd asked me a

◼   ► month ago I would have said no that I

◼   ► think Facebook is too big to fail but

◼   ► Facebook has done an amazing job of

◼   ► collecting some of the worst PR in the

◼   ► world in a short period of time just at

◼   ► the wrong time zeitgeist why's that

◼   ► people are super receptive to it like I

◼   ► think the idea that hey maybe all of the

◼   ► social media is bad for us was really

◼   ► coming to fruition earlier in the year

◼   ► and then it's like right around that

◼   ► time Facebook had some of the worst PR

◼   ► in the world and then they have this

◼   ► most recent scandal it just might be a

◼   ► perfect storm of things to drive a stake

◼   ► through the heart of Facebook but that

◼   ► being said I think even if it were to

◼   ► happen we are at a technological point

◼   ► in time where there is always going to

◼   ► be a natural monopoly for a social

◼   ► network if you strike Facebook down

◼   ► something else will just grow up and be

◼   ► stronger in its place and will be

◼   ► functionally equivalent to Facebook I

◼   ► mean there has to be one doesn't there

◼   ► for a social network to actually work

◼   ► the way it should they sort of has to be

◼   ► one doesn't there otherwise we're not

◼   ► networked yeah 100%

◼   ► I am really convinced that it's not just

◼   ► Facebook I think that the big tech

◼   ► companies exist in no small part because

◼   ► we're at a technological point where

◼   ► there are these natural monopolies I

◼   ► think that search and video are a kind

◼   ► of natural monopolies that Google has

◼   ► that there will be a super big video

◼   ► site I think it's almost inevitable I

◼   ► almost think that like Amazon is kind of

◼   ► at a logistics and server running kind

◼   ► of natural monopolies that makes it

◼   ► almost impossible for any other company

◼   ► to compete with them I think we really

◼   ► are in a weird phase of the world where

◼   ► that is a truth

◼   ► so these big companies exist and even if

◼   ► we were to somehow break them up it

◼   ► would just take a couple of years before

◼   ► the thing that replaces them is is just

◼   ► as big because everything is pointing in

◼   ► that direction but yeah you're 100%

◼   ► right

◼   ► the social network is the most strong

◼   ► version of that like definitionally

◼   ► there almost has to be one do you use

◼   ► Facebook anymore

◼   ► I haven't used Facebook in any

◼   ► meaningful way in years in any

◼   ► meaningful way but do you use it non

◼   ► meaningful ways yes I do use it in a non

◼   ► meaningful way which is that I have a

◼   ► CGP grey like business page right

◼   ► because if you're a public person

◼   ► Facebook doesn't let you have a personal

◼   ► webpage you have to have this business

◼   ► page I don't even know if it still works

◼   ► but I did have set up like an if this

◼   ► than that trigger that would just

◼   ► automatically post stuff from the

◼   ► website onto that page yeah and so when

◼   ► I can when I say like I haven't used it

◼   ► in a meaningful way that's what I mean

◼   ► like I haven't logged into Facebook and

◼   ► like six months at a bare minimum yeah

◼   ► and even then it would be just to like

◼   ► check on a thing I pretty much checked

◼   ► out of Facebook the instant they started

◼   ► that you need to pay us to send out your

◼   ► posts to the people who follow you on

◼   ► Facebook thing hmm

◼   ► that was for me the day Facebook died I

◼   ► was like okay well I don't use Facebook

◼   ► on a personal level anyway and so if the

◼   ► only thing that I use it for is on a

◼   ► business level and now you're playing

◼   ► the Mafia game of like oh it's a nice

◼   ► business page you have there sure would

◼   ► be a shame if something happened to it

◼   ► then it's like okay I'm out I'm out I'm

◼   ► not really gonna play this game I'm not

◼   ► gonna participate in this so now I

◼   ► haven't used it personally in ever to

◼   ► you yeah I mean I have pages for all my

◼   ► different projects that I maintain yeah

◼   ► I go in there every day and have a look

◼   ► just to check what my friends are up to

◼   ► and I don't post a lot of stuff myself

◼   ► on there unless I'm doing like something

◼   ► amazing like yeah amazing my life is I

◼   ► don't post a pending three weeks in a

◼   ► row sitting at a desk editing videos but

◼   ► and that's the social media effect where

◼   ► everybody's life seems a million times

◼   ► more amazing than yours only the most

◼   ► amazing things they do and of course

◼   ► he's contributing to making the world a

◼   ► worse place by doing that brady you have

◼   ► to post your mundane days as well I

◼   ► think it's a problematic

◼   ► company but I almost feel like it's too

◼   ► big to fail because I look at you know

◼   ► although I don't reach all my followers

◼   ► because of the Mafia thing you mentioned

◼   ► do you have you know followings of all

◼   ► these Facebook pages and it seems like I

◼   ► can't just throw that away again I like

◼   ► ignore us so I mean I can but you

◼   ► totally can right I mean I'm willing to

◼   ► bet that if you dig into your analytic

◼   ► data on YouTube that Facebook is a much

◼   ► smaller portion of the views than you

◼   ► might expect that it is yeah I think

◼   ► you'd be right if that is the case I

◼   ► would certainly encourage you to not

◼   ► waste your time on it because if you're

◼   ► tracking like how much time do you spend

◼   ► on Facebook and how many views does that

◼   ► actually translate into I bet that

◼   ► equation would show very fast that

◼   ► Facebook is not worth actually spending

◼   ► any time on I would definitely say I

◼   ► don't waste time on it I do probably

◼   ► waste time on you know looking at my

◼   ► friends puppy but I don't waste time

◼   ► business on it like if there's a new

◼   ► numberphile video I'll just go in say

◼   ► hey everyone there's a new numberphile

◼   ► video I hope you like it mm-hmm

◼   ► here's the link and then leave and I

◼   ► won't hang around reading comments and

◼   ► you know it's it's perfunctory Facebook

◼   ► terrible I like this much cuz I could

◼   ► have expired a thing you've got me

◼   ► thinking now

◼   ► we have much to complain about we do

◼   ► have much to complain about Braden we

◼   ► may need another 100 episodes gray Oh Oh

◼   ► Brady you can't do that to the people I

◼   ► can't do that to the people

◼   ► can't do that to the people

◼   ► hi this is Dirk from Veritas okay here

◼   ► we go here we go hmm this is Dirk from

◼   ► Vera stab Liam and you're listening to

◼   ► the hundredth episode of hello Internet

◼   ► maybe it's time to stop making fun of my

◼   ► name green vs. yellow tennis balls yep

◼   ► this has become quite the thing yeah

◼   ► I've seen a little bit of this on my

◼   ► Twitter timeline so for people who don't

◼   ► know I'll do the quick background gray

◼   ► and his wife had a little marital

◼   ► discussion about where the tennis balls

◼   ► were green or yellow which caused gray

◼   ► to do a little tweaked poll about it do

◼   ► you think tennis balls are green or

◼   ► yellow lots of people got into it got

◼   ► lots of votes it even got a little bit

◼   ► of like media coverage which was quite

◼   ► funny yeah and we discussed it on hello

◼   ► Internet

◼   ► and it was really interesting what

◼   ► happened as a result of the hello

◼   ► internet discussion there was lots of

◼   ► tim foolery

◼   ► there are several scientific studies

◼   ► done I don't know if you've seen the one

◼   ► that I've popped in the show notes where

◼   ► someone actually took my advice and

◼   ► measured the light spectrum from lime

◼   ► from lemon and from a tennis ball which

◼   ► it was closer to and so you know they

◼   ► wrote up a little scientific report and

◼   ► many a laugh was had and that could have

◼   ► been the end of it except that one

◼   ► listener I think he must have found out

◼   ► that his girlfriend and his girlfriend's

◼   ► father were going to the tennis so he

◼   ► decided to tell them I listen to this

◼   ► podcast they were talking about where

◼   ► the tennis balls a green or yellow and

◼   ► the father who is not a Tim who was just

◼   ► the father of a girl whose boyfriend

◼   ► listens to Holly winter net right was

◼   ► quite taken by this and the next day he

◼   ► found himself in a little gaggle of

◼   ► people who were waiting to meet and get

◼   ► autographs from quite possibly the

◼   ► greatest tennis player ever current

◼   ► world number one tennis player although

◼   ► he's about to just go back down to

◼   ► number two but I think he's the greatest

◼   ► tennis player ever Roger Federer they

◼   ► were all waiting for Roger Federer to

◼   ► walk past between whatever matches he

◼   ► was playing sign a couple of autographs

◼   ► and whisk away and while he was signing

◼   ► these autographs this dad calls out

◼   ► Roger had tennis balls green or yellow

◼   ► and amongst all like the confusion Roger

◼   ► Federer at the question two suddenly

◼   ► took him and he looked up and he went

◼   ► I think he said something long was of

◼   ► the yellow aren't they mm-hmm and then a

◼   ► few other people in the quadrant yeah

◼   ► yeah they're yellow and this guy the

◼   ► dead who was filming this with his

◼   ► mobile phone said I think they're green

◼   ► but lots of other people think they're

◼   ► yellow and then Roger Federer said Nana

◼   ► they're yellow mm-hmm and then walked

◼   ► off you know that in itself I think was

◼   ► a great hello internet moment and I

◼   ► declared then and there that this Tim's

◼   ► girlfriend's dead is gonna get a Hello

◼   ► Internet Medal of Honor is that legal he

◼   ► doesn't even listen to the show but yeah

◼   ► I think he's getting around he's getting

◼   ► one and he's what within enough degrees

◼   ► of separation from the initiating

◼   ► incident that he's gonna get a medal

◼   ► it's never been written anywhere that

◼   ► you have to be a listener to get a Medal

◼   ► of Honor imagine it helps I mean to be

◼   ► fair I don't think we have anything

◼   ► written anywhere about how anything

◼   ► works but yes that's true we haven't

◼   ► written down rules about how the medals

◼   ► work now a lot of people said that I

◼   ► shouldn't be just giving them

◼   ► willy-nilly and I needed your approval

◼   ► but even if you said no to this I would

◼   ► say too bad he's getting one this is

◼   ► what happens people maybe could I

◼   ► stopped him no often I could not I could

◼   ► not would you stop me is the question

◼   ► you wouldn't veto this one surely this

◼   ► is a great moment having the greatest

◼   ► tennis player in history weigh in on

◼   ► this - squabble about the color of

◼   ► tennis books I certainly could disagree

◼   ► with you one you send me a video and

◼   ► from my perspective it's some guy in a

◼   ► crowd is commenting on the tennis ball

◼   ► thing right it's like oh okay

◼   ► great I feel like the medals should be

◼   ► going to actual listeners of the show so

◼   ► I do feel like I can disagree with you

◼   ► but I just you seem so tickled by this

◼   ► that I know there's nothing I can do to

◼   ► stop you from simply mailing out one of

◼   ► these medals to a guy who's going to be

◼   ► very surprised to just get a box that's

◼   ► an award it would be the second one

◼   ► awarded look right I see what you mean

◼   ► about you have to be a listener right

◼   ► like you have to be a citizen of a

◼   ► certain country to win certain honors

◼   ► but I think medals of Honor generally

◼   ► are just for the furtherance of the

◼   ► greatness of hello Internet and this

◼   ► definitely has furthered the cause in a

◼   ► very special way to me so I thought it

◼   ► was fantastic right I thought was

◼   ► absolutely fantastic I had a right laugh

◼   ► at it and that could have been it just

◼   ► so you

◼   ► understand I know you don't really

◼   ► appreciate Who Roger Federer is this is

◼   ► the equivalent of say instead of tennis

◼   ► balls you and your wife had been

◼   ► discussing something about mr. chompers

◼   ► ears you couldn't decide something about

◼   ► his ears or not mm-hmm and then someone

◼   ► went and got an official comment from

◼   ► Charles Darwin about it this is what it

◼   ► is to me this is a level of greatness in

◼   ► the field this is the Charles Darwin or

◼   ► Isaac Newton of tennis hmm he just

◼   ► happens to be alive this means that I'm

◼   ► officially right in your eyes is that

◼   ► how this works well that's another issue

◼   ► I tell you another thing though about

◼   ► Roger Federer that you may not

◼   ► appreciate but you know how there are

◼   ► certain things on the internet that you

◼   ► don't mess with because everyone will

◼   ► jump on you like you know electric

◼   ► fences because they have really jealous

◼   ► followers Roger Federer is one of those

◼   ► things that was about to say can you

◼   ► give me an example of things that you

◼   ► don't mess with on the Internet Brady

◼   ► like what are beehives you are not

◼   ► supposed to poke the sticks you're

◼   ► normally the one who tells me so you

◼   ► don't worry about them than me you're

◼   ► the one who says no we're not talking

◼   ► about that I have never said such a

◼   ► thing braving criticizing Roger Federer

◼   ► is such a beehive never criticize Roger

◼   ► Federer because his fans known as the

◼   ► fed heads Oh God are very zealous

◼   ► this is like tennis Logan Pollard's is

◼   ► that what this is like I'll make jokes

◼   ► about Elon Musk who the cows come home

◼   ► but I'm not saying anything bad about

◼   ► Roger Federer or his fans so annoying

◼   ► that you don't want to like him Brady is

◼   ► that one of these situations no comment

◼   ► no comment from Brady at all so anyway

◼   ► after Roger Federer weighed in on the

◼   ► debate mm-hmm

◼   ► this story for lack of a better word

◼   ► completely blew up and went absolutely

◼   ► everywhere like The Today Show in

◼   ► America it was in all the newspapers it

◼   ► was on all the web sites it was all over

◼   ► the BBC tennis balls yellow or green for

◼   ► like a day and a half or two days became

◼   ► an absolute obsession a media obsession

◼   ► any mention of gray and his wife where

◼   ► it all started or hello Internet had

◼   ► completely vanished from existence lots

◼   ► of teams were upset about this they're

◼   ► like oh they're not mentioning gray and

◼   ► then I'm mentioning hello Internet like

◼   ► that's just what happens with these

◼   ► things yeah but it became absolutely

◼   ► massive you couldn't look anywhere

◼   ► without it coming up do you care or you

◼   ► relieved that you kind of got pushed out

◼   ► of the story or I mean you kept sending

◼   ► me more and more things from stories

◼   ► about where it was being posted and the

◼   ► number one thing no I don't feel like I

◼   ► need to be credited that I worded a

◼   ► tweet that was a discussion about my

◼   ► wife and I and tennis ball like that is

◼   ► the kind of thing on the internet that

◼   ► trying to have any kind of ownership of

◼   ► that is just like an insanity right so I

◼   ► want to be really clear I would have no

◼   ► expectations that by the time this thing

◼   ► gets pattern matched up to Good Morning

◼   ► America The Good Morning America is like

◼   ► Greg and his wife we're having a

◼   ► discussion about tennis balls right like

◼   ► I would not expect that but I did have

◼   ► this different feeling where I kind of

◼   ► did not like you keeping sending me

◼   ► these articles were you like oh look

◼   ► it's over here now three or four I think

◼   ► it was three or four hundred it felt

◼   ► like I would likely continue but you are

◼   ► doing me a disservice here it was not

◼   ► that man it was three or four it wasn't

◼   ► that many but it was also on Twitter

◼   ► like people just kept sending me like

◼   ► hey look the thing is over here okay so

◼   ► there is awesome away where I feel like

◼   ► how can I say this thing without

◼   ► sounding like the world's most jaded

◼   ► asshole I think there's a thing where

◼   ► people want you to be like happy that

◼   ► this thing that you started has spread

◼   ► far and wide throughout the news media

◼   ► and my response to this is not a kind of

◼   ► happiness it's just like enough of these

◼   ► things have happened over the years I've

◼   ► seen this happen with other people

◼   ► enough over the years that this is just

◼   ► like a pattern and I feel like this is

◼   ► what the media machine does like they're

◼   ► looking for things that they know are

◼   ► going to get them views and attention

◼   ► and they will just repeat and pattern

◼   ► amplify that and copy the others what

◼   ► the others are doing

◼   ► yeah and copy the others but they copy

◼   ► the others in this like battle of the

◼   ► memes for attention of who's watching TV

◼   ► and any kind of thing like this where

◼   ► you can divide people in teams like it's

◼   ► going to spread but my feeling people

◼   ► are like oh aren't you excited like it

◼   ► made the New York Times is like not

◼   ► exciting

◼   ► this is like literally the job of these

◼   ► companies is to find things that will

◼   ► get people's attention and to pattern

◼   ► amplify them across time so I almost

◼   ► felt like oh this like thing that was

◼   ► fun for the podcast like now it is

◼   ► everywhere in the world like and it's

◼   ► just been pattern amplified all over the

◼   ► place it was a strange thing to see this

◼   ► spread across the internet but that's

◼   ► what happens like catchy ideas spread it

◼   ► would be like definitionally impossible

◼   ► for them not to spread but that's how

◼   ► these things go they spread across the

◼   ► internet very fast and very far just to

◼   ► be clear I wasn't sending you those

◼   ► things because I wanted you to be like

◼   ► excited or happy or proud I was winding

◼   ► you up basically because I don't know

◼   ► how much you hate the media so the fact

◼   ► that like you and your wife just you

◼   ► know chatting about tennis balls for ten

◼   ► minutes in your house can make it as a

◼   ► news story in The Times of London yeah

◼   ► like I expect you to see that oh my god

◼   ► what where do I live in I'm sending that

◼   ► to you to like poke the grumpy old man

◼   ► and get him more upset about news not

◼   ► like well done you should be proud

◼   ► you've made it yeah I know that's 100%

◼   ► what you're doing which is also why

◼   ► Brady you may have noticed you've got

◼   ► very few responses from me Brady sends

◼   ► the articles through and is like I say

◼   ► nothing back right reply because I know

◼   ► you're trying to wind me up right and

◼   ► that's why I CC your wife into the

◼   ► messages as well because she's polite

◼   ► and replies and she was also getting a

◼   ► bit wound up and I happened to be away

◼   ► while this was going on and you were

◼   ► messaging my wife and I and I was busy

◼   ► but I came very very close to sending my

◼   ► wife a message which would have been

◼   ► something along the lines of like don't

◼   ► keep replying to Brady or just

◼   ► encouraging her because she was all like

◼   ► this is tweeting right this is

◼   ► outrageous she got the joke but yeah no

◼   ► of course of course I know you're trying

◼   ► to wind me up and it fits exactly in

◼   ► like the gray checklist of not media

◼   ► hatred but media sadness disappointment

◼   ► a little bit of despise 'el I'm not

◼   ► angry at the media I'm disappointed yeah

◼   ► I'm disappointed and next time you want

◼   ► to tell me about the brave Fourth Estate

◼   ► protect

◼   ► our democracy from all sorts of ills

◼   ► I'll remind you that they spent lots of

◼   ► time on whether or not tennis balls are

◼   ► green or yellow can I give you that I

◼   ► know we talked about how I will

◼   ► sometimes cut things that you say from

◼   ► the show segments that I find boring

◼   ► sports ball corners sometimes but I have

◼   ► to say that last episode I did have a

◼   ► real crisis of confidence of if I should

◼   ► even put up that section about necessary

◼   ► lies of society there is something about

◼   ► it that just felt like I don't know if I

◼   ► really want to open this door publicly I

◼   ► really did think about it like should we

◼   ► put up this little section we're not

◼   ► really saying anything that's terrible

◼   ► in here this is not like a brand new

◼   ► idea that has never been released into

◼   ► the world but there was something about

◼   ► it that I felt a little bit

◼   ► uncomfortable about but once the show

◼   ► was up then I immediately asked on

◼   ► Twitter like hey everybody tell me your

◼   ► necessary lies to keep civilization

◼   ► together because I'm like well when it's

◼   ► out here let's just double down and it's

◼   ► interesting because I think I got back

◼   ► many terrible answers and that people

◼   ► would just say things that like our

◼   ► phrases that you hear that simply aren't

◼   ► true so I'm trying to think about how to

◼   ► define more clearly this idea like a

◼   ► necessary lie of civilization and I

◼   ► think you're one just then as the

◼   ► transition is totally true like cheaters

◼   ► never win is a kind of civilization

◼   ► propaganda that we have to try to get

◼   ► people on board with even though it's

◼   ► not true anyway so there were a bunch of

◼   ► answers that I thought were not really

◼   ► good or just like aphorisms but I think

◼   ► the best answer that I got was from

◼   ► greed grow on reddit and the necessary

◼   ► lie is that violence is not the answer

◼   ► or violence is not the solution man

◼   ► that is a really great necessary lie of

◼   ► civilization

◼   ► it's almost definitionally there to keep

◼   ► civilization together that like

◼   ► civilization is the resolution of

◼   ► problems without having to resort to

◼   ► violence and that feels like a real

◼   ► ground level kind of agreement that

◼   ► there are plenty of things that you

◼   ► could probably try to solve with

◼   ► violence but we all have to agree

◼   ► together that like we're not going to

◼   ► resort to this tool and we have to agree

◼   ► like this

◼   ► things together like we're not going to

◼   ► resort to violence as a solution but

◼   ► it's like there are plenty of situations

◼   ► where we use violence as the solution we

◼   ► have Wars right or it's like we pay

◼   ► police like to essentially force things

◼   ► to occur so I really like that as an

◼   ► answer for a necessary lie of

◼   ► civilization is like we teach kids like

◼   ► violence is not the answer violence is

◼   ► not the solution and and often can be we

◼   ► just we can't resort to it otherwise

◼   ► we'll be a bunch of chimps tearing each

◼   ► other apart

◼   ► so violence isn't a solution then

◼   ► because ultimately we tear each other

◼   ► apart violence is not the solution if

◼   ► everyone uses violence the violence can

◼   ► be a solution if a select few people use

◼   ► it yeah that's really getting to the

◼   ► core of like we were talking last unlike

◼   ► the psychopathy school of like oh we

◼   ► pull some people apart and we say like

◼   ► hey here's some things you might want to

◼   ► they're actually true or like you're

◼   ► gonna be very successful or very

◼   ► terrible people and being willing to

◼   ► resort to violence is one of those

◼   ► things it's like if everybody does this

◼   ► civilization falls apart which is why

◼   ► it's a necessary lie but like on an

◼   ► individual basis it can kind of work the

◼   ► thing it made me think about which it

◼   ► can it's like how can I don't even want

◼   ► to say it out loud when I was in middle

◼   ► school and like on the edge of being a

◼   ► kid who was about to be bullied a little

◼   ► bit and you know the adults tell you

◼   ► it's like oh I'll ignore the situation

◼   ► you know don't do anything bullies just

◼   ► feel bad about themselves which is also

◼   ► like a weird lie

◼   ► like you hear all of this advice and my

◼   ► experience as a kid was nothing stopped

◼   ► the beginning of bullying faster than

◼   ► adding a little bit of violence into the

◼   ► solution what did you do grey because my

◼   ► question I was gonna ask you was have

◼   ► you ever used violence as a solution and

◼   ► I thought there's no way he'd answer

◼   ► that

◼   ► and you've just offered it up well your

◼   ► criminal past is not criminal it's

◼   ► self-defense

◼   ► what did you do did you punch someone a

◼   ► bully did you punch your bully look I

◼   ► don't even really want to get into the

◼   ► details but it sounds cooler if you

◼   ► don't tell anyway because a lot we can

◼   ► imagine something more awesome I don't

◼   ► know look here's the thing the reason

◼   ► why I would be like a potential bullying

◼   ► target is because I wasn't like a big

◼   ► buff kid or anything like shocked

◼   ► surprised younger gray was kind of a

◼   ► nerd right like total surprise I'm sure

◼   ► - absolutely every

◼   ► oh you mean he wasn't quarterback at the

◼   ► school football team yeah that's not the

◼   ► image of how it was so you just had to

◼   ► lay down a marker once you lay down a

◼   ► marker and the trick is you have to be

◼   ► able to convince the other person that

◼   ► retaliation will be unreasonably large

◼   ► again I don't want to say these things

◼   ► out loud Brady why do I say them into

◼   ► the microphone but it's just you it may

◼   ► here when I was a teacher I would just

◼   ► see it like I had the interesting

◼   ► experience of teaching at mixed schools

◼   ► with both boys and girls teaching at

◼   ► girl only schools and teaching at boy

◼   ► only schools like it was really

◼   ► interesting as an adult

◼   ► to see this like from a different

◼   ► perspective and it's like oh there's a

◼   ► couple of lessons that I learned there

◼   ► like lesson number one is high school is

◼   ► even more awful like viewing it from the

◼   ► perspective as an adult than it was as a

◼   ► kid but it's like oh okay I can see that

◼   ► none of the boys make it through school

◼   ► without being subjected to some kind of

◼   ► physical violence and none of the girls

◼   ► make it through school without being

◼   ► subjected to some kind of psychological

◼   ► violence from each other it's like it's

◼   ► just so obvious

◼   ► I like that violence is not the answer

◼   ► or the solution one I feel like that was

◼   ► just a like a really really great answer

◼   ► to this question and I'll be sure to cut

◼   ► or dramatically cut down this section

◼   ► don't let me leave it up Brady don't let

◼   ► me leave it up we're gonna tear the

◼   ► world apart I don't mean to hello hello

◼   ► internet listeners is there something

◼   ► that you want to learn is there a skill

◼   ► that you want to require something you

◼   ► wish you could do that you can't do now

◼   ► then you should check out skills share

◼   ► skill share is an online learning

◼   ► community with thousands of classes in

◼   ► design business technology and more with

◼   ► skills share Premium Membership you get

◼   ► unlimited access to high-quality classes

◼   ► on must know topics so you can improve

◼   ► your skills unlock new opportunities and

◼   ► do the work you love right now you're

◼   ► listening to a podcast and I'm willing

◼   ► to bet that many of you probably want to

◼   ► start a podcast of your own but you

◼   ► don't know where to begin and it can be

◼   ► pretty overwhelming even after having

◼   ► done this for years I'm constantly

◼   ► surprised at how fiddly and fussy doing

◼   ► a podcast can be well

◼   ► Skillshare has podcasting classes and

◼   ► not just one thing on podcasting they

◼   ► cover all of the various ranges from the

◼   ► technical side about how to get started

◼   ► to the editing side how to work with

◼   ► tools like logic or Adobe to actually

◼   ► edit the podcast and they have classes

◼   ► on how to improve your extemporaneous

◼   ► way of speaking so across the whole

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◼   ► hello and the first 1,000 people will

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◼   ► internet listeners so if you are hearing

◼   ► the sound of my voice right now you

◼   ► probably want to go and check that out

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◼   ► Skillshare know that you came from our

◼   ► show so thanks to Skillshare for

◼   ► supporting hello Internet and thanks to

◼   ► Skillshare for teaching people the

◼   ► skills they can use to make their lives

◼   ► better a thing has happened which we all

◼   ► know we have been waiting for it to

◼   ► happen a bad thing that was inevitable

◼   ► which is we have had now the first death

◼   ► as a result of a self-driving car as in

◼   ► hitting a pedestrian because people have

◼   ► died in their own cars already there

◼   ► have been a bunch of these like leading

◼   ► up incidences I think some of which

◼   ► we've even talked about on the show in

◼   ► the past where like someone is in a car

◼   ► and they're not paying attention or like

◼   ► there's accidents but this is one where

◼   ► it was

◼   ► uber testing a like fully autonomous

◼   ► self-driving car and there was someone

◼   ► behind the wheel who was just like

◼   ► keeping an eye on the equipment and a

◼   ► pedestrian walking a bicycle across the

◼   ► street got hit by the uber and died

◼   ► this to me is like the first like

◼   ► clearest example of someone has died

◼   ► from a self-driving car that was being

◼   ► autonomous and it's a car that is

◼   ► designed to be autonomous in the way

◼   ► that we're all thinking about as opposed

◼   ► to the malfunction of a system which is

◼   ► much more like an assistive driving

◼   ► system or like a lane maintaining system

◼   ► yeah what do you think about this as a

◼   ► moment in time or as a news story that

◼   ► has occurred it's a significant sort of

◼   ► moment like in terms of being a

◼   ► milestone I've seen footage of the

◼   ► accident mm-hm and I've seen what a lot

◼   ► of people wrote about the accident

◼   ► and like to look at it without knowing

◼   ► all the facts like it does seem like

◼   ► this person was crossing the road in a

◼   ► way that wasn't like being super super

◼   ► cautious like they did seem to be

◼   ► crossing the road in a way that looked

◼   ► dangerous but we're also told these

◼   ► self-driving cars can see everything off

◼   ► to the sides and know what's going on

◼   ► and predict these things and so all the

◼   ► people who are saying well of course no

◼   ► one could have avoided that no human

◼   ► could have avoided it how do we expect a

◼   ► self-driving car to avoid it well I will

◼   ► hold self-driving cars to a higher

◼   ► standard but you can only hold them to

◼   ► so high standard if someone wants to die

◼   ► by jumping in love this person did but

◼   ► if someone wants to die by jumping in

◼   ► front of a car they they can still do it

◼   ► with a self-driving car so I think we

◼   ► have to realize people are still gonna

◼   ► die at the hands of self-driving cars I

◼   ► think this was just a a milestone that

◼   ► was always gonna happen

◼   ► it'll slow things down it does make me

◼   ► wonder if when the first person died

◼   ► from an actual car like you know back in

◼   ► the olden days whether or not cars being

◼   ► on the road was stopped for like six

◼   ► months while people rethought the

◼   ► situation like was it the same back then

◼   ► when the first pedestrian got hit by

◼   ► some five miles an hour

◼   ► automobile did everyone go no we can't

◼   ► have these things on the road and go up

◼   ► in arms well there was no social media

◼   ► on which to share these stories

◼   ► who knows how information was spread

◼   ► back in those days of yore nobody nobody

◼   ► knows I think it's interesting because

◼   ► this happened a little while ago and I

◼   ► remem

◼   ► when the first thing that could be even

◼   ► classified as a kind of accident with

◼   ► any self-driving occurred which i think

◼   ► was something like a tesla system a

◼   ► couple years ago on the highway had an

◼   ► accident that became like the first

◼   ► story about this I thought it was

◼   ► interesting to see that that blew over

◼   ► relatively quickly and I feel like this

◼   ► story as well at least from the little

◼   ► bit I've been keeping an eye on it seems

◼   ► like it's blowing its way through the

◼   ► news cycle pretty quickly yeah I don't

◼   ► know if this is actually going to have

◼   ► any significant effect on the

◼   ► development of self-driving cars you can

◼   ► find the video online that shows the

◼   ► camera in front of the car and I agree

◼   ► that it's a case where no human driver

◼   ► could have possibly avoided that

◼   ► accident it's at nighttime the woman

◼   ► walking the bicycle is walking across a

◼   ► highway where there's not a pedestrian

◼   ► intersection and by the time she appears

◼   ► in the headlights

◼   ► the accident is inevitable like there's

◼   ► no way even if the car slammed on the

◼   ► brakes immediately there's no way that

◼   ► you could possibly do it but I feel like

◼   ► I don't need self-driving cars to be

◼   ► better than humans to be on the road I

◼   ► feel like they just need to be

◼   ► equivalent to humans that is my my point

◼   ► of like where can we start putting

◼   ► self-driving cars on the road no I need

◼   ► to be better ok why do they need to be

◼   ► better and how much better because when

◼   ► they need to better cuz we're so bad at

◼   ► driving like L live was unacceptable

◼   ► basically but they don't need to be

◼   ► infallible they need to be more

◼   ► impressive than humans and how could

◼   ► they not be because we're such bad

◼   ► drivers they are already better so I

◼   ► think this debates already over yeah I

◼   ► did see someone on Twitter make a joke

◼   ► or something like a self-driving car has

◼   ► killed one person today and people

◼   ► driving cars will kill 3,000 people

◼   ► today right which is like Oh God it's an

◼   ► unfair comparison in many ways but I

◼   ► think it really does make a point of

◼   ► humans are terrible drivers my feeling

◼   ► there was like I'm happy with

◼   ► equivalency because I think the benefits

◼   ► that you get from the self-driving car

◼   ► then make that mental calculus of is

◼   ► this better it makes it clearly better

◼   ► even if the self-driving cars are only

◼   ► at human level and I feel like it's

◼   ► inevitable that they'll obviously keep

◼   ► improve

◼   ► over time but you're right that it is a

◼   ► case where the story about the

◼   ► self-driving cars is like oh they have

◼   ► lidar which looks in all directions and

◼   ► can see everything it does raise the

◼   ► human expectation that like oh this car

◼   ► should always be able to see all

◼   ► pedestrians in all situations I also

◼   ► wanted to mention the story because

◼   ► there's a thing that has been on my mind

◼   ► for a while with self-driving cars which

◼   ► I find myself wondering or maybe I

◼   ► should say reevaluating my position on

◼   ► how fast this is actually going to occur

◼   ► because when I put out that humans need

◼   ► not apply video a few years ago it felt

◼   ► like things were moving very quickly in

◼   ► the world of self-driving technology and

◼   ► most people were not aware of it and now

◼   ► that people know self-driving cars are a

◼   ► thing and that they exist and people are

◼   ► sort of waiting for self-driving cars it

◼   ► feels like there has been just very very

◼   ► slow progress in this field and I wonder

◼   ► like is this a technology that is going

◼   ► through some kind of s-curve where there

◼   ► was no progress made for a long time and

◼   ► then like the year 2000 s things start

◼   ► to speed up and accelerates and then we

◼   ► hit like 2015 and it looks like oh man

◼   ► it's gonna be here any day and then all

◼   ► of a sudden it starts to really level

◼   ► off like the rate at which we're making

◼   ► progress in this area and I do wonder if

◼   ► it is the case where it's a

◼   ► technological problem where the last 10

◼   ► or 15 percent of the problem turns out

◼   ► to be you know 85% of the actual work

◼   ► that getting a car - not quite human

◼   ► level is much much simpler than getting

◼   ► it to human level like getting it to

◼   ► that last 10% but I am aware that I feel

◼   ► like past me expected there to be more

◼   ► progress in self-driving cars by now

◼   ► then there actually are and I feel like

◼   ► we've only seen the smallest scale tests

◼   ► of these things so you think this last

◼   ► 15 10 % that we might be going through

◼   ► at the moment is purely going to be a

◼   ► technological hurdle we haven't started

◼   ► running into the social and political

◼   ► side of things you think it's so

◼   ► technology now it's funny I didn't

◼   ► mention it because that is just not a

◼   ► thing that's even on my radar I really

◼   ► just don't think that that is going to

◼   ► be any kind of significant barrier right

◼   ► I still think it is such a technological

◼   ► advantage if we can get it there that

◼   ► there's no way that the places that say

◼   ► oh we're gonna wait on self-driving cars

◼   ► I feel like that is such a self slowdown

◼   ► that very few places will do that like

◼   ► it would be like banning cellphones

◼   ► because we're not quite sure how

◼   ► addictive they are yet it's like well

◼   ► okay good luck with that

◼   ► but the rest of the world is gonna

◼   ► totally leave you behind

◼   ► and I think that yeah when we do get the

◼   ► self-driving cars it'll be the same

◼   ► thing that if some states or some

◼   ► country say mmm we're gonna hold off on

◼   ► this for a little while it's going to be

◼   ► just such a tremendous economic

◼   ► advantage that they won't be able to do

◼   ► so oh yeah

◼   ► I don't know I wonder if it's just gonna

◼   ► take a lot longer than I expected I hope

◼   ► it doesn't but I'm a little worried that

◼   ► it might well I'm finding every time I

◼   ► think it's gonna take forever at speeds

◼   ► up and every time I think it's gonna be

◼   ► tomorrow it slows down so I've given up

◼   ► all together I have this feeling almost

◼   ► like as soon as we publish this episode

◼   ► again it's going to be like oh and

◼   ► self-driving cars are here in three

◼   ► weeks they're on sale right you can

◼   ► pre-order them now I read an article in

◼   ► the paper this morning that really

◼   ► disappointed me about self-driving cars

◼   ► they hmm they're talking about building

◼   ► into the interface for self-driving cars

◼   ► things to keep people's attention

◼   ► whether it's like you know games of

◼   ► tetris or things like that so that

◼   ► people will stay alert so they can take

◼   ► over the car in an emergency that's not

◼   ► what I want my self-driving car to be I

◼   ► want to be in the back reading the paper

◼   ► or working on my laptop I don't want to

◼   ► have to be ready to take over in an

◼   ► emergency that's an excellent point and

◼   ► I think there is a way where we are

◼   ► actually in a little bit of a dangerous

◼   ► like local minimum right now with

◼   ► self-driving technology because like my

◼   ► parents bought a new car that has a lot

◼   ► of Drive assistance stuff in it so we

◼   ► can do things similar there too like

◼   ► what Tesla's will do where you can tell

◼   ► it to stay in a lane and it will

◼   ► maintain its position within that Lane

◼   ► on a highway even if it goes around the

◼   ► corner or it will be able to like you

◼   ► should if you're trying to minimize the

◼   ► amount of traffic like it'll keep an

◼   ► equal distance between the

◼   ► in front of it and behind it on the

◼   ► highway and it will do some limited

◼   ► accident avoidance stuff and it's very

◼   ► interesting to drive that and play

◼   ► around with that but I really do think

◼   ► it does put humans in the worst

◼   ► situation where the car is good enough

◼   ► on the highway that you feel like you

◼   ► don't need to pay any attention at all

◼   ► which must dramatically raise the

◼   ► possibility of an accident like I would

◼   ► love to see what the numbers are for

◼   ► what is the accident rate per 100,000

◼   ► miles when Lane maintenance is engaged

◼   ► on a highway and I wouldn't be the least

◼   ► bit surprised if like minor traffic

◼   ► accidents go up because the person feels

◼   ► like I don't have to really pay

◼   ► attention I can be doing something else

◼   ► like and I noticed that behavior in

◼   ► myself when I was driving that car it's

◼   ► like oh I'm on the highway I feel much

◼   ► safer looking at my phone in a way that

◼   ► if I was driving a car without it I feel

◼   ► like the phone doesn't exist for me if

◼   ► I'm driving a car without any assistance

◼   ► stuff and I found myself like oh maybe I

◼   ► can just look at that text message and

◼   ► see what it was about or I want to

◼   ► change what podcast I'm listening to I

◼   ► can flip over and do like a fiddly app

◼   ► switch on my phone right now because I

◼   ► the car's got it on the highway so I

◼   ► wouldn't be surprised if cars with that

◼   ► stuff are a little bit worse than cars

◼   ► without it that's like we need to push

◼   ► past here to get to exactly what you're

◼   ► talking about like I can sit in the back

◼   ► with a laptop and not have to care at

◼   ► all but if if you need to have Tetris on

◼   ► the dashboard to keep a person mentally

◼   ► engaged I think that's almost worse than

◼   ► not having that technology at all there

◼   ► was a plane crash caused by a pilot

◼   ► basically saying these things can land

◼   ► themselves I'll prove it and didn't look

◼   ► while landing and then crash the plane

◼   ► and killed a bunch of people pilot snow

◼   ► dares in the cockpit okay no we don't

◼   ► want that that's no good okay I've been

◼   ► going through the listener emails you

◼   ► know what people are doing what people

◼   ► have to say I know you want to have the

◼   ► people feel like you're listening to

◼   ► them you're looking through their

◼   ► feedback always listening that's a

◼   ► little much oh no no I knew when they

◼   ► want to be listened to and sometimes not

◼   ► been

◼   ► but go message for Brady at gmail the

◼   ► number four is where these things should

◼   ► go and I will have a look from time to

◼   ► time including an email from Ryan which

◼   ► was so interesting I sent him an email

◼   ► back asking for some more details and

◼   ► boy did he provide them he wrote a very

◼   ► lengthy reply thank you very much Ryan

◼   ► but the main reason he caught my

◼   ► attention was he has gotten himself a

◼   ► tattoo that I thought I should share

◼   ► with you ah he already had tattoos and

◼   ► this is like he's kind of added this as

◼   ► you'll see I think these tattoos are

◼   ► sort of to reflect his interests sorry I

◼   ► accidentally just sent them to my wife

◼   ► replied with oh my god then we send them

◼   ► to you I thought why is grey replying

◼   ► with oh my god and not just saying it

◼   ► out loud I've decided that we should do

◼   ► this podcast via texting Brady there we

◼   ► go now hopefully you've got them too oh

◼   ► my god we have a nail and gear tattoo

◼   ► that is connected to Oh God

◼   ► okay USB symbol at the other end and

◼   ► that's a representation of a certain

◼   ► kind of chemical connection right the

◼   ► hexagon with the three lines yeah I mean

◼   ► that card if I paint like a benzene ring

◼   ► but it can't be that cuz it's got a

◼   ► whole bunch of other stuff I don't know

◼   ► what that is but yes so three symbols

◼   ► connected to each other the nail and

◼   ► gear the benzene ring and the USB symbol

◼   ► it's like a chemical compound that we

◼   ► don't know what it is a USB symbol

◼   ► coming off and most recently he's added

◼   ► quite a bold nail and gear to his inner

◼   ► arm it looks very fresh that nail and

◼   ► cure yeah that picture you're looking at

◼   ► was very soon after it was done he says

◼   ► I really love the podcast I'm a huge fan

◼   ► of you and gray the H o podcast got me

◼   ► through some tough times and I want my

◼   ► tattoos to be a sort of time capsule of

◼   ► what was important to me at each stage

◼   ► in my life

◼   ► it took about half an hour to have done

◼   ► my friends like the tattoo although some

◼   ► of them got a bit confused when they

◼   ► asked me what the nailing gear was and I

◼   ► went on a five-minute tangent on the

◼   ► podcast about plane crashes and flags

◼   ► so this is a thing Brady you send me

◼   ► these I get nervous with the tattoos

◼   ► there is definitely a way in which I

◼   ► obviously think about tattoos in a

◼   ► different way than people who get

◼   ► tattoos think about tattoos I think that

◼   ► way too

◼   ► yeah yeah and even that comment from

◼   ► Ryan sums up what I've heard from a lot

◼   ► of people with tattoos where they want

◼   ► them as markers of a point in life and I

◼   ► can't think about tattoos that way I am

◼   ► tattoo las' as I'm sure will be a

◼   ► surprise to no one in the world it'll be

◼   ► a surprise to Ryan cuz he says in his

◼   ► longer version of the email that he

◼   ► feels like he's on the same wavelength

◼   ► as you not about tattoos they may be

◼   ► just about other things I feel like

◼   ► there's a lot of pressure all of a

◼   ► sudden right because when someone puts a

◼   ► tattoo on their body and they say oh I

◼   ► love the show right now what happens if

◼   ► you decide in the future that you're not

◼   ► such fans of us but nothing's ever gonna

◼   ► change the fact he was a fan for I know

◼   ► I know this is exactly it like this is

◼   ► what I try to understand is this idea of

◼   ► it is a marker of a time and so the

◼   ► future is not affecting the thing like

◼   ► tattoos I feel like are the opposite of

◼   ► my mental framework because people who

◼   ► get tattoos it does seem to be much more

◼   ► passed focus like it's a marker of a

◼   ► thing that happened and of course I feel

◼   ► like I want nothing to do with the past

◼   ► it doesn't exist anymore I have no

◼   ► interest in it it is gone

◼   ► and it is only about the future so when

◼   ► I look at tattoos I can't not always

◼   ► mentally frame them from the perspective

◼   ► of what will future me think about this

◼   ► tattoo which then always leads me to the

◼   ► conclusion of well I don't have any idea

◼   ► what that guy's going to think about

◼   ► this and then like well I can't make

◼   ► decisions for that guy in this way so

◼   ► I'm like I'm not going to get a tattoo

◼   ► but when I've spoken to people who have

◼   ► tattoos and I try to explain my thinking

◼   ► about them they look at me like I'm

◼   ► crazy

◼   ► and I clearly don't understand

◼   ► so yeah I mean it can go wrong I just

◼   ► sent you a tattoo that was doing the

◼   ► rounds quite recently that someone got a

◼   ► few days before all the news stories

◼   ► broke about Kevin Spacey and he got a

◼   ► tattoo of Kevin Spacey on his arm and

◼   ► then like you know all that stuff hit

◼   ► the fan it's a bit like what does that

◼   ► mean now that's the problem there's a

◼   ► reason that most countries also decide

◼   ► that they are only going to put dead

◼   ► people on their money is to avoid this

◼   ► sort of problem if you don't want to put

◼   ► a living person on your money and then

◼   ► that living person does something that

◼   ► you as a country don't like they start

◼   ► spilling the necessary lies of

◼   ► civilization and you're like oh no we

◼   ► just put them on the $2 bill I don't

◼   ► think Frank Underwood is a president

◼   ► he'd want to put on your American money

◼   ► anyway so I think we were gonna always

◼   ► gonna be safe on that one well Ryan's

◼   ► happy with her he thinks and looks good

◼   ► and I think it looks good it does look

◼   ► good it does look good and we appreciate

◼   ► it and we will try to keep the support

◼   ► cast that is worthy of your tattoo no

◼   ► sorry I shouldn't say that that's what

◼   ► you don't mean to say yes because all

◼   ► right because look we're not gonna be

◼   ► beholden to Ryan that's not what's going

◼   ► to happen right and we make no promises

◼   ► about the future quality of this show

◼   ► right

◼   ► Brady feels happy about it I feel

◼   ► slightly uncomfortable about it but I am

◼   ► glad that you are glad that's what

◼   ► matters you got to make decisions for

◼   ► you you don't make decisions for me oh

◼   ► so I had another photo from a viewer a

◼   ► kind of what you do while listening to

◼   ► hello internet moment that really

◼   ► tickled me before I Audrey that's just

◼   ► that's terrible she's getting worse

◼   ► great she wants to be on the podcast but

◼   ► he is on the podcast so here's one from

◼   ► Eden I am a student studying ecology I'm

◼   ► currently working on research about

◼   ► differences in animal community

◼   ► structure that result from external

◼   ► factors around streams one of the things

◼   ► this involves is collecting fish and

◼   ► measuring 24 different parts of the

◼   ► fish's body which is amazing to me

◼   ► because I didn't know fish had 24 parts

◼   ► of their body I tend to listen to

◼   ► podcasts while doing this as it is

◼   ► tedious work hello internet is of course

◼   ► the world's greatest podcast trademark

◼   ► because I like to listen to you and gray

◼   ► discuss those pesky flag flag ripples

◼   ► while I work I've attached

◼   ► lightly morbid proof of my claim keep up

◼   ► the work so here's the picture the fish

◼   ► studier

◼   ► eden has sent grouse I feel like I can

◼   ► smell all of those fish on that

◼   ► measuring tray through this photograph

◼   ► that has a very fishy photograph nicely

◼   ► arranged in a pattern we have some dead

◼   ► fish spelling out a chai and some tiny

◼   ► little fish around a border making the H

◼   ► I love go all on a medical examining

◼   ► tray I love that I love that there is a

◼   ► little tiny little baby sad anyone's

◼   ► make up the little dots of the border

◼   ► and the big fish make the lettuce I was

◼   ► originally going to say I don't believe

◼   ► this photograph because I don't see the

◼   ► mandatory podcast logo in the image and

◼   ► then it took me a second to resolve what

◼   ► I was actually looking at it like oh

◼   ► right the fish are the logo I don't know

◼   ► what kind of fish they are but they're

◼   ► freaky looking their eyes are scary I

◼   ► think that's how things look when

◼   ► they're dead Brady you know they passed

◼   ► on to the next realm and their eyes are

◼   ► all cloudy I've seen dead fish in the

◼   ► fish market and their eyes were as cold

◼   ► and dead as those ones I'm very happy

◼   ► that people listen to the show I'm happy

◼   ► that it gets them through tedious things

◼   ► in their life and I'm happy that

◼   ► somewhere in the world someone arranged

◼   ► a bunch of fish in a laboratory to spill

◼   ► out the HR logo sentences you'd never

◼   ► thought you'd say Brady when you bring

◼   ► stuff to me especially when you bring

◼   ► stuff from listeners I never know what's

◼   ► going to happen and I always feel

◼   ► slightly apprehensive no sigh well yeah

◼   ► I'm something big because there is a

◼   ► plague that is spreading through the

◼   ► world Brady and that plagues name is

◼   ► bitmoji yeah bit mochi yep and I know

◼   ► you know what bitmoji are huh

◼   ► because you created one as well recently

◼   ► hey I've had mine for a while I just

◼   ► never send it to you yeah as you know

◼   ► better yeah I think that's why bitmoji

◼   ► it's a company that's obviously decided

◼   ► the regular emoji not enough and so what

◼   ► they allow you to do is you can create

◼   ► little avatar of yourself and then this

◼   ► app will allow you to place that avatar

◼   ► in a bazillion situations so it was like

◼   ► you're creating a custom mochi for

◼   ► everything that's possible Under the Sun

◼   ► would you say that's a fair description

◼   ► of what the bitmoji are it's kind of

◼   ► fair the only thing that's not fair

◼   ► about it and I think this is a problem

◼   ► with the name maybe is it's not like a

◼   ► replacement for emojis to me it's just a

◼   ► different toy it's just a different fun

◼   ► things yeah they're using the the Apple

◼   ► sticker method they're not really emoji

◼   ► like bitmoji is a good name but it there

◼   ► are custom stickers but I think that

◼   ► when people use bitmoji they often start

◼   ► to displace the regular emoji so what

◼   ► you could do so people can better

◼   ► understand if grey said let's meet at 4

◼   ► o'clock and maybe I would send him an

◼   ► emoji of just a thumbs up instead I

◼   ► could send him this customized a little

◼   ► Brady that looks just like me riding a

◼   ► horse saying yes let's do it or

◼   ► something like that right these things

◼   ► are awful they're terrible I would love

◼   ► to say one of you I'm gonna design one

◼   ► to look like you just to see if I can do

◼   ► it

◼   ► do not Brady I am it no you know I won't

◼   ► put it out there because it'll look so

◼   ► much like II that that would be unfair

◼   ► for spoilers but I'm gonna make one just

◼   ► as my own little project great have you

◼   ► tried to make one look like you no of

◼   ► course I haven't tried to make one look

◼   ► like me I mean look here's this thing

◼   ► these bitmoji they're just like a

◼   ► nightmare from an episode of Black

◼   ► Mirror these are so close to the little

◼   ► avatars in 15 million merits which is

◼   ► still my favorite black mirror episode I

◼   ► swear to God when people send them to me

◼   ► they make me sad they really do like I

◼   ► was on a thread recently with a bunch of

◼   ► people and it's like oh this is supposed

◼   ► to be like a happy event and everybody

◼   ► is expressing their emotions through the

◼   ► bitmoji maybe there's something wrong

◼   ► with me but I feel like it sucks all of

◼   ► the genuine emotion out of the world

◼   ► like even emojis regular emojis do this

◼   ► to some acquitted out like there's a way

◼   ► that they kind of suck out emotion in

◼   ► your expression

◼   ► the bitmoji is like more and more people

◼   ► are using them and because they're

◼   ► customizable for every situation you see

◼   ► them all the time and I'd like they make

◼   ► me sad and seeing people use them to

◼   ► express thoughts a lot it's like I hate

◼   ► them I hate them so much

◼   ► and they're creepy they're so creepy and

◼   ► I had to endure this longest hour of my

◼   ► life when my wife finally got sucked up

◼   ► in the bitmoji thing and she was

◼   ► creating her own bitmoji avatar she's

◼   ► good at though she's good at it

◼   ► she kept asking me does this one look

◼   ► more like me whenever she would show me

◼   ► one it's like that doesn't look like you

◼   ► that looks like an uncanny valley

◼   ► nightmare version of you the thing I

◼   ► don't get as well is that like almost

◼   ► all the women I know they're bitmoji

◼   ► look exactly the same whereas the men I

◼   ► know like that kind of looks like them

◼   ► and I don't know why that is

◼   ► I can't figure out why it is but like I

◼   ► know three or four women who use bitmoji

◼   ► all look the same it could be any of

◼   ► them my wasn't happy with hers and I

◼   ► said what do you think of mine she's

◼   ► like yes yours looks just like you like

◼   ► angrily she said has more options or

◼   ► something but I don't know why this has

◼   ► happened but it feels like it has

◼   ► happened I'll tell you that bitmoji app

◼   ► is not short on options though my wife

◼   ► was doing this on the iPad so she could

◼   ► have like the full palette of everything

◼   ► that was possible

◼   ► I couldn't believe like the enormous

◼   ► number of options to be able to maintain

◼   ► different noises and oh 19 we would be

◼   ► blessed with but 19 noses to go through

◼   ► right there were hundreds of noses she's

◼   ► like is this one more like me or is this

◼   ► one more than me like I don't like any

◼   ► of them they all make me uncomfortable

◼   ► it's all securely in the uncanny valley

◼   ► please never send this to me ever it

◼   ► will make me sad I don't like it but

◼   ► they just keep spreading and people keep

◼   ► using them I want them to go away but

◼   ► they won't it's too much like it's too

◼   ► far I feel like the constraint of but

◼   ► like 200 regular emojis is almost good

◼   ► for people it's like it's too adaptable

◼   ► and then people use it for everything

◼   ► and it it makes me die a little inside

◼   ► every time I see one

◼   ► says the man who portrays himself

◼   ► publicly and videos with an animated

◼   ► stick figure and face and doing key

◼   ► things yeah in my youtube videos which

◼   ► are produced like I'm not when we text

◼   ► Brady I don't quickly in Inkscape whip

◼   ► together and exactly correct CGP grey to

◼   ► be a response to everything that you do

◼   ► know it's is totally different don't

◼   ► even try to compare it like those things

◼   ► are the same and also I don't think the

◼   ► stick figure has like the creepy creepy

◼   ► Dead Eye uncanny valley nests of these

◼   ► bitmoji 's don't you agree with me

◼   ► aren't they unsettling in the way that

◼   ► they look no I don't agree with you they

◼   ► don't unsettle me go to bitmoji comm and

◼   ► look upon the nightmare that stares back

◼   ► at you from the top of that page I'm

◼   ► gonna make a CGP grey one I tell you why

◼   ► I could see it to be a green one you

◼   ► actually physically cannot stop me it's

◼   ► impossible I can't believe your wife

◼   ► didn't make one of you and said looks

◼   ► like you because she respected my

◼   ► desires and she knows never to send me

◼   ► the bit mode I don't even like seeing

◼   ► her using the bitmoji talking with other

◼   ► people I just like I don't want to see

◼   ► them they're creepy and they're weird

◼   ► and my wife respects my desires unlike

◼   ► my podcast co-host he was probably right

◼   ► now giggling on his phone making a

◼   ► bitmoji of me I'm looking at the front

◼   ► page of the bitmoji website and there's

◼   ► a one that looks a bit like me maybe

◼   ► these are random I have no idea which

◼   ► one you think looks like you that really

◼   ► had someone the winking guy is that the

◼   ► one who you think looks like you to the

◼   ► right the far right

◼   ► no it doesn't look a bit like you and if

◼   ► it did look like you it would only look

◼   ► like you in a nightmare world where

◼   ► we're all trapped and emotionally

◼   ► separated from each other riding on

◼   ► bicycles all day long for pretend points

◼   ► that's the way it would look like you

◼   ► and that one on the left is the one that

◼   ► looks like all the people I know who use

◼   ► it generic brown hair go bitmoji thumbs

◼   ► down they're terrifying hello Internet

◼   ► if you are someone who bills by the hour

◼   ► here's a quick mental calculation that

◼   ► might leave you unsettled

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◼   ► losing to having to complete annoying

◼   ► paperwork and admin tasks how about in a

◼   ► month or in a year

◼   ► our friends at fresh book calculate that

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◼   ► a hundred and ninety two hours in a year

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◼   ► simply by using fresh books so if you

◼   ► bill by the hour in any way and you

◼   ► listen to hello internet which

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◼   ► try out fresh books for a free

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◼   ► just go to fresh books calm /hello and

◼   ► enter hello in the how did you hear

◼   ► about a section this lets fresh books

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◼   ► go to fresh books calm /hello

◼   ► and enter hello in the how did you hear

◼   ► about a section and get back many

◼   ► billable hours for your business let's

◼   ► go to a less controversial subject that

◼   ► won't upset you as much as bitmoji grade

◼   ► let's talk about not cease Brady this is

◼   ► an interesting new story that's been

◼   ► doing the rounds this caught your eye

◼   ► did no it did catch my eye I feel like

◼   ► bitmoji not see pugs things going on

◼   ► with Facebook things going on with

◼   ► YouTube I'm at a low point with my

◼   ► thoughts about people and the internet

◼   ► and what the internet does to people and

◼   ► vice versa it's all a terrible mess

◼   ► there has been a sort of conclusion to a

◼   ► story which to me is a terrifying story

◼   ► let me try to summarize it is a story

◼   ► about a Nazi pug as in a little dog hmm

◼   ► this guy up in Scotland count Deng Cola

◼   ► is his online name I don't know what his

◼   ► actual name is because count Acula is

◼   ► way easier to remember he made a video

◼   ► for youtube where he trained his

◼   ► girlfriend's pug to be excited and do a

◼   ► little Nazi salutes upon hearing

◼   ► particular phrases particular phrases

◼   ► you would expect Nazis to say so he put

◼   ► together this video and he sets it up as

◼   ► a joke like it's yeah there is this

◼   ► little bit of a story that people always

◼   ► say when they upload videos to YouTube

◼   ► with like oh I only expected a few of my

◼   ► friends to see a thing and then like it

◼   ► went viral and I had no idea that it

◼   ► would I'm not entirely sure that I

◼   ► believed that because that's like a

◼   ► standard story that everybody says like

◼   ► I kind of think that the guy did expect

◼   ► it was gonna be a bit of a viral video

◼   ► but he sets it up in the beginning that

◼   ► like he is playing a joke on his

◼   ► girlfriend who the pug belongs to yeah

◼   ► that the pug is super cute and his

◼   ► girlfriend is always talking about the

◼   ► pug and loves the pug so much that like

◼   ► she's on vacation or something and while

◼   ► she's gone he's gonna train the dog

◼   ► right on like zig Heil that's going to

◼   ► put up its little paw in a Nazi salute

◼   ► which you can almost say the dark humor

◼   ► of car he like that is this dog's the

◼   ► apple of her eye and he turns into this

◼   ► leg yeah it's pretty twisted but you sit

◼   ► there is that twisted brand of humor

◼   ► that exists yes there is a choice of

◼   ► brand of humor that exists and there's

◼   ► this weird thing where everybody feels

◼   ► like they need to like distance

◼   ► themselves a little bit from it like

◼   ► when I saw this video like it's funny

◼   ► like it's a funny joke and people have

◼   ► to pretend like it's not funny but guess

◼   ► what like part of humor is surprise and

◼   ► unexpected juxtapositions of things

◼   ► right and so like he films a shot where

◼   ► it's like pretending like the dog is

◼   ► watching a Nazi rally on TV and like

◼   ► that's a funny shot because of course

◼   ► like the pug doesn't know anything about

◼   ► what's going on like he's just setting

◼   ► up a frame yeah these are jokes and he

◼   ► sets it up as a joke but what has

◼   ► happened in the UK is that

◼   ► the UK has less freedom of speech laws

◼   ► than the United States does and there

◼   ► are more caveats and this guy counting

◼   ► Kela has been convicted guilty of I

◼   ► forget exactly what it is but it's like

◼   ► spreading obscene messages over the

◼   ► Internet he's been found guilty as of

◼   ► the time of recording the sentencing

◼   ► hasn't occurred the sentencing is going

◼   ► to happen in a couple of weeks but he is

◼   ► facing prison time over a viral video

◼   ► where he trains a dog to raise its paw

◼   ► on particular commands and I think this

◼   ► is just terrifying I agree it's

◼   ► terrifying and I wonder him what'd he

◼   ► say about it just to be clear though

◼   ► it's not the fact that dog raises poor

◼   ► that's got him in trouble it's like the

◼   ► phrase he's repeating isn't it yeah okay

◼   ► but so can I say the phrase are you

◼   ► afraid to say the phrase Brady I think

◼   ► he should not have said use that phrase

◼   ► so one of the phrases that he uses in

◼   ► the video is he says hi future gray here

◼   ► stepping in for a moment I wouldn't

◼   ► normally do this but it is a special

◼   ► occasion since we recorded this episode

◼   ► I looked into more of the specifics

◼   ► around this law and this ruling and haha

◼   ► turns out that the judge did know it was

◼   ► a joke but the way the obscenity law is

◼   ► written in the UK allows judges to

◼   ► ignore that factor it seems to allow

◼   ► judges to ignore all context around the

◼   ► literal words that are spoken in

◼   ► isolation from everything else which

◼   ► seems to make it impossible to talk

◼   ► about the bad ruling of an obscenity

◼   ► case without also exposing yourself to

◼   ► the very same obscenity law that you're

◼   ► talking about which makes this just a

◼   ► rather breathtaking catch-22 / Brazil

◼   ► level law so anyway here we are

◼   ► future gray is going back and cutting

◼   ► off past gray and thus this very

◼   ► conversation becomes an example of what

◼   ► we end up talking about later in the

◼   ► conversation in the video as he says

◼   ► and the Pug sits up and looks interested

◼   ► like he's obviously been giving the dog

◼   ► treats for that phrase right clearly

◼   ► this to me is the thing where there's