The Incomparable

102: Princess Indiana Jones


00:00:00   where's the Meryl Streep action movie I [TS]

00:00:01   demand it [TS]

00:00:04   the Contras below podcast 102 artists [TS]

00:00:10   went where [TS]

00:00:13   welcome back everybody to be [TS]

00:00:14   uncomfortable podcast I'm your host [TS]

00:00:16   Jason snail and on this episode of the [TS]

00:00:19   uncomfortable we're going to be talking [TS]

00:00:20   about the latest Pixar movie brave which [TS]

00:00:25   came out a few weeks ago maybe more than [TS]

00:00:28   a month ago and we're gonna follow that [TS]

00:00:31   path and probably talk about female [TS]

00:00:33   protagonist in other animated movies and [TS]

00:00:35   maybe even beyond joining me to talk [TS]

00:00:38   about this subject tonight are for [TS]

00:00:41   esteemed panelists first up serenity [TS]

00:00:44   Caldwell hi thanks for being here [TS]

00:00:46   hello thanks for inviting me Jason [TS]

00:00:49   yeah I more than happy and also i was [TS]

00:00:51   happy that you could provide some female [TS]

00:00:53   representation on this episode since [TS]

00:00:55   Lisa couldn't make it and all the rest [TS]

00:00:57   of them are dudes so that yeah yeah so [TS]

00:01:00   here's a guy who I haven't checked with [TS]

00:01:02   the Olympic officials who are in charge [TS]

00:01:03   of gender testing but i'm pretty sure is [TS]

00:01:05   male and Cal hi welcome alteration we [TS]

00:01:09   haven't discussed it before but we don't [TS]

00:01:12   know how to pull out children names of [TS]

00:01:14   these characters last we talked about it [TS]

00:01:15   in distraction sir actually least until [TS]

00:01:18   like a tired of it I'm going to be [TS]

00:01:19   talking electronic collar Atlantis [TS]

00:01:21   entire podcast [TS]

00:01:22   alright I don't I this [TS]

00:01:26   ok i'm sick of it I'm really sorry David [TS]

00:01:28   Morgan isn't here since he does by far [TS]

00:01:30   the best terrible Sean Connery [TS]

00:01:32   impression that I've heard [TS]

00:01:34   also joining us today his accent [TS]

00:01:38   indeterminate is Dan Frakes hi Dan [TS]

00:01:40   hey Jason it's good to have you back [TS]

00:01:42   thank you also a male by the way if [TS]

00:01:45   you're wondering [TS]

00:01:46   otherwise you'd be Danielle will be [TS]

00:01:50   different and John siracusa is here [TS]

00:01:52   because this is about pixar and where [TS]

00:01:55   when we cover pixar John siracusa is [TS]

00:01:57   always here [TS]

00:01:58   hi John Jason I come by my accent [TS]

00:02:01   honestly it's it's straight from Long [TS]

00:02:04   Island [TS]

00:02:05   you got it yeah so we have talked about [TS]

00:02:08   pixar before i should say that up at the [TS]

00:02:09   beginning and if you would like to hear [TS]

00:02:11   us talk about all the many other pixar [TS]

00:02:15   movies that were made before brave and [TS]

00:02:18   cars to you know I still haven't seen [TS]

00:02:20   courage to me neither [TS]

00:02:22   no I which I have finally seen it i've [TS]

00:02:24   not seen cars number one I just did by [TS]

00:02:26   the [TS]

00:02:26   promise i seen car 54 where are you know [TS]

00:02:29   i have seen that here in the sons of [TS]

00:02:31   talking cars and it's see it's i don't [TS]

00:02:36   i'm an amount insisting i'm right here [TS]

00:02:37   it's just that I see the trailers it [TS]

00:02:39   wasn't that funny it's like wait a [TS]

00:02:40   minute if why are there seats if there's [TS]

00:02:42   a play this is a planet in which humans [TS]

00:02:44   have never existed [TS]

00:02:45   one of the cars have seats don't [TS]

00:02:47   overthink it and II exactly see this [TS]

00:02:50   again but this time it's just I'm not [TS]

00:02:51   assisting them right in saying that it [TS]

00:02:53   was not a strong enough concept to get [TS]

00:02:55   me to cauterize that neuron that was [TS]

00:02:57   asking these questions understand why [TS]

00:02:59   their seat [TS]

00:03:00   it's not their cars makes a whole lot [TS]

00:03:01   more sense if you think about it [TS]

00:03:03   entirely as a story within the Toy Story [TS]

00:03:06   universe wherein someone is playing out [TS]

00:03:08   the cars story on a place at somewhere i [TS]

00:03:12   like that that's brilliant that's very [TS]

00:03:13   good i'm going to use that alright [TS]

00:03:15   that's good now you can watch it with [TS]

00:03:16   that framework in mind anyway if you [TS]

00:03:18   would like to hear us talk about pixar [TS]

00:03:20   incomparable episode 49 it's like [TS]

00:03:23   working roll with monsters and fifty we [TS]

00:03:26   apologize for the extinction of the [TS]

00:03:28   clownfish that will give you an hour and [TS]

00:03:30   15 minutes of me john siracusa and Steve [TS]

00:03:33   let's walking through our favorite [TS]

00:03:35   moments in the pixar cannon so check [TS]

00:03:38   that out if you haven't already but uh [TS]

00:03:40   but here we're going to be talking about [TS]

00:03:41   brave which is new and i speaking of [TS]

00:03:44   course to I went into brave with [TS]

00:03:46   diminished expectations i have to say as [TS]

00:03:49   somebody who has loved pixar movies [TS]

00:03:52   since toy story and owns all up two cars [TS]

00:03:55   and not including cars 2 on DVD and love [TS]

00:03:59   Pixar movies before I had kids and of [TS]

00:04:01   course now my kids have loved watching [TS]

00:04:02   those movies too [TS]

00:04:04   i I don't know maybe it was that I had [TS]

00:04:06   skipped cars 2 and and was just kind of [TS]

00:04:08   down on on the direction of where [TS]

00:04:10   picture was going or what but I i had [TS]

00:04:12   very low expectations going in to brave [TS]

00:04:16   low to no expectations I i really didn't [TS]

00:04:19   I wasn't as enthusiastic about it i want [TS]

00:04:21   with the whole family which was great [TS]

00:04:22   but I I was not sort of dragging them [TS]

00:04:25   they're like I might to some other movie [TS]

00:04:27   that i really want to see and you know [TS]

00:04:30   so i don't know i don't want to give up [TS]

00:04:34   we should say the spoiler for the movie [TS]

00:04:36   we're going to talk about moving spoil [TS]

00:04:37   it so if you don't want to know what [TS]

00:04:39   happens in the movie [TS]

00:04:40   don't listen but I liked it [TS]

00:04:44   i'll give you that spoiler I I came out [TS]

00:04:46   of it saying I liked it way more than I [TS]

00:04:49   had ever expected to and I I can't [TS]

00:04:52   decide how much of that is just my [TS]

00:04:54   diminished expectations versus how much [TS]

00:04:57   how much I i liked it and we've talked [TS]

00:04:59   about in previous podcast and I do [TS]

00:05:01   believe sometimes it's all about your [TS]

00:05:03   expectations and whether they were met [TS]

00:05:05   or exceeded or not that influences your [TS]

00:05:09   emotions when you're watching a movie [TS]

00:05:11   and when it's over [TS]

00:05:12   so how did everybody else feel about [TS]

00:05:15   about brave let's talk about the the [TS]

00:05:18   film as a whole [TS]

00:05:19   first off John you want to start yeah i [TS]

00:05:21   actually went home with very high [TS]

00:05:23   expectations I i finally did get around [TS]

00:05:25   to see them cars 2 and it wasn't the [TS]

00:05:26   disaster everyone said it was but it [TS]

00:05:28   certainly yeah like I can understand why [TS]

00:05:30   people were doing it my expectations for [TS]

00:05:32   cars to archive of expectations for [TS]

00:05:33   brave very high and a lot of it gets [TS]

00:05:36   back to the previous podcast we're [TS]

00:05:38   talking about a female protagonist pics [TS]

00:05:40   are on my other broadcast talked about [TS]

00:05:42   how that's that pic that picture was [TS]

00:05:46   challenging itself right one example [TS]

00:05:48   that might be though you know why I'm [TS]

00:05:49   they had a female protagonist maybe it's [TS]

00:05:51   hard to do those kinds of stories so [TS]

00:05:52   when I saw they were making a movie with [TS]

00:05:54   a female protagonist that got that got [TS]

00:05:57   my hopes up that they were gonna go in a [TS]

00:05:58   different direction than the other [TS]

00:06:01   movies they've done so because the other [TS]

00:06:02   movies like don't fit into that there [TS]

00:06:05   was a certain formula for our kind of [TS]

00:06:08   male centered male-oriented movie that [TS]

00:06:10   they've made so far they've done [TS]

00:06:11   excellent and that great great movies [TS]

00:06:13   but this is this necessarily had to be [TS]

00:06:14   something different and it could have [TS]

00:06:16   been different in a terrible way [TS]

00:06:17   different a good way black citations [TS]

00:06:18   were very very high mostly because i [TS]

00:06:20   stayed almost entirely spoiler freeze [TS]

00:06:22   all I knew about it like any more notch [TS]

00:06:23   trail is all I knew is female [TS]

00:06:25   protagonist Scotland medieval thing go [TS]

00:06:29   and i don't think it exceeded my [TS]

00:06:33   expectations but I think met them I was [TS]

00:06:35   pretty happy with that something would [TS]

00:06:36   be twice in the theater actually at the [TS]

00:06:38   insistence of my two young children who [TS]

00:06:40   wanted to go back to movie theaters see [TS]

00:06:42   it again so success on that measure and [TS]

00:06:44   both times I saw it in the theater I i [TS]

00:06:47   liked it i I think it did interesting [TS]

00:06:49   things and it really made me think about [TS]

00:06:51   what they actually did there [TS]

00:06:53   it didn't it didn't seem like obvious or [TS]

00:06:56   pat or try to me about the same token i [TS]

00:07:00   also have this nagging feeling that they [TS]

00:07:02   still don't quite know what to do with [TS]

00:07:04   female protagonist so it'sit's maybe [TS]

00:07:05   turn over my mind a lot but I overall [TS]

00:07:07   give it a thumbs up [TS]

00:07:09   I should as a footnote that I think you [TS]

00:07:11   discuss pics are on hypercritical number [TS]

00:07:14   12 and number 13 [TS]

00:07:16   if you need to look it up if the [TS]

00:07:17   internet i have an encyclopedic [TS]

00:07:20   knowledge of the hyper of high do not so [TS]

00:07:22   you kidding i know every I i I've made a [TS]

00:07:25   supercut of only you talking about pixar [TS]

00:07:28   and yeah anyway still eight hours like [TS]

00:07:31   it is it's very long [TS]

00:07:33   brand what did you think of brave i [TS]

00:07:36   quite liked it i went in with anti [TS]

00:07:39   medium high expectations [TS]

00:07:41   I mean my history with pics are [TS]

00:07:44   basically is that I've gone to every [TS]

00:07:47   single pixar film either in a midnight [TS]

00:07:49   release or on the day that the movie [TS]

00:07:51   came out so I'm you know I'm a big fan [TS]

00:07:54   of their work in general and I was [TS]

00:07:57   really curious to like many people I [TS]

00:07:59   imagine to see what they were going to [TS]

00:08:01   do with a pseudo traditional fairy tale [TS]

00:08:04   and I'm all for free male protagonist [TS]

00:08:07   especially when they're written well and [TS]

00:08:09   I think Mara is a shit they're they're [TS]

00:08:11   definitely spots throughout the film [TS]

00:08:14   where maybe it's not quite [TS]

00:08:16   hammering home the message that I think [TS]

00:08:18   they want but i think on the whole the [TS]

00:08:20   film is really solid it's really fun to [TS]

00:08:24   watch and i had the pleasure of watching [TS]

00:08:26   it with two young children who were [TS]

00:08:27   horribly scared at the scary parts and [TS]

00:08:30   horribly excited during the exciting you [TS]

00:08:34   know adventure ii parts and what I [TS]

00:08:37   really like about this film and what [TS]

00:08:39   stuck with me a few days after I watched [TS]

00:08:41   it i only watch this one once in [TS]

00:08:42   theaters which is unusual for me but i [TS]

00:08:44   have not been getting to a lot of movies [TS]

00:08:46   lately I'm i really find the [TS]

00:08:50   mother-daughter relationship in this [TS]

00:08:52   film which is clearly what it's built [TS]

00:08:55   around but really go out of their way to [TS]

00:08:57   really solidify it in very specific ways [TS]

00:09:01   which we'll talk about later I assume [TS]

00:09:03   that i really appreciate the way that [TS]

00:09:06   they [TS]

00:09:06   you know honed in on specific things [TS]

00:09:10   like yes we want to we want to basically [TS]

00:09:12   use a small but mostly inconsequential [TS]

00:09:16   detail to highlight a feature of their [TS]

00:09:19   relationship and that's that's something [TS]

00:09:21   you don't see a lot of movies doing a [TS]

00:09:22   lot of movies will kind of brush over it [TS]

00:09:24   in broad strokes and be like yes teenage [TS]

00:09:27   girl rebelling from her mother and you [TS]

00:09:30   know that they do the the archetype the [TS]

00:09:33   stereotype I but this movie I think [TS]

00:09:35   starts with stereotype and then opens it [TS]

00:09:39   up further which I which I really enjoy [TS]

00:09:41   it and I'm actually kind of sad that I [TS]

00:09:43   didn't see this with my mother i feel [TS]

00:09:45   like i've seen all previous pixar films [TS]

00:09:48   with her and I feel like that was this [TS]

00:09:50   would have been a good one to co-author [TS]

00:09:51   i will now enter into the official [TS]

00:09:54   record if your honor will let me remind [TS]

00:09:57   you might be the judge here i order that [TS]

00:09:59   this be put in the official record a [TS]

00:10:01   piece called just another princess movie [TS]

00:10:03   on the new inquiry will put it in the [TS]

00:10:05   show notes and it is bio woman whose [TS]

00:10:10   name is very difficult to pronounce its [TS]

00:10:11   Lily looper oh I believe a great long [TS]

00:10:16   essay about how about exactly what [TS]

00:10:19   you're saying about how it on one level [TS]

00:10:21   this is the the movie we sort of expect [TS]

00:10:23   in terms of princesses and her mother [TS]

00:10:26   says you'll be you know you one of these [TS]

00:10:29   Prince's will become your husband and [TS]

00:10:30   she repels and you think you know where [TS]

00:10:32   the where the arc of the story is going [TS]

00:10:34   and you you actually don't which was one [TS]

00:10:38   of the things that delighted me about it [TS]

00:10:40   but will so we'll get back to that let's [TS]

00:10:42   continue my pole damn freaks [TS]

00:10:45   what did you feel generally about movie [TS]

00:10:47   I i went into it with pretty high [TS]

00:10:50   expectations like John I saw you know [TS]

00:10:53   that the premises Scottish historical [TS]

00:10:55   background female protagonists pixar I [TS]

00:10:58   thought the previous are gorgeous so i [TS]

00:11:00   was pretty excited i came out i think i [TS]

00:11:03   was pleased with that I think it was a [TS]

00:11:04   little bit less than my expectations for [TS]

00:11:07   reasons we'll probably get into it [TS]

00:11:10   mainly because it just felt a little [TS]

00:11:12   less pics are a little more Disney and I [TS]

00:11:14   know Glenn fleshman heard me say that [TS]

00:11:16   once and who disagreed vehemently but [TS]

00:11:19   he's not here [TS]

00:11:20   I i really liked the characters i [TS]

00:11:22   thought i'm like Ren said the mother and [TS]

00:11:24   the daughter which is clearly the focus [TS]

00:11:25   they did the characters really well they [TS]

00:11:28   made them they're they're animated [TS]

00:11:31   cartoons characters right but they made [TS]

00:11:33   them feel real and that relationship to [TS]

00:11:35   the mom and the daughter felt like the [TS]

00:11:37   kind of relationship on actual teenager [TS]

00:11:39   might have with just larger consequences [TS]

00:11:42   people being turned into bears and [TS]

00:11:44   getting into battles and stuff but um I [TS]

00:11:46   felt like a real relationship and I [TS]

00:11:47   really like that um I thought that the [TS]

00:11:50   sum of the supporting characters like [TS]

00:11:51   the dad and stuff we're kind of you know [TS]

00:11:54   goof balls which is sort of the Disney's [TS]

00:11:56   side that broad but but you know it's a [TS]

00:11:59   it's a movie about about the though the [TS]

00:12:02   female relationships so you know you [TS]

00:12:03   can't really feel bad about that fact [TS]

00:12:05   somebody on Twitter set a couple weeks [TS]

00:12:07   ago they said wait you're you're being [TS]

00:12:11   reduced to caricatures i would not know [TS]

00:12:13   how that feels [TS]

00:12:15   it was a woman of course I uh I thought [TS]

00:12:17   that was funny yeah but I'm overall I [TS]

00:12:18   thought it was really it was really it [TS]

00:12:20   was well done and it was it was I want [TS]

00:12:25   to see I'm i like that it exists [TS]

00:12:27   perhaps as much if not more than I liked [TS]

00:12:29   itself that there's a Pixar movie with a [TS]

00:12:32   with the female protagonist that's about [TS]

00:12:35   a women relationships and that's good [TS]

00:12:37   that's good and it's not just a dumb [TS]

00:12:39   teenage love story thing right right [TS]

00:12:42   Andy what about you what do you think my [TS]

00:12:46   expectations were high those [TS]

00:12:47   expectations were met [TS]

00:12:48   I I would have a good friend who [TS]

00:12:50   actually bout not this time i was [TS]

00:12:52   thinkin bout not to see this movie but [TS]

00:12:54   he was certainly didn't plan to see the [TS]

00:12:55   movie only because he liked a lot of [TS]

00:12:57   people he saw the trailers oh dear it's [TS]

00:13:00   a princess being forced to marry and she [TS]

00:13:02   repels and now she has to go through [TS]

00:13:04   this whole little journey you know that [TS]

00:13:06   but she's gonna have a singing talking [TS]

00:13:08   hedgehog companion perilous journey of [TS]

00:13:10   hers and that's then we've seen that [TS]

00:13:13   from from disney God knows how many [TS]

00:13:15   times his name is haggis by the way the [TS]

00:13:18   singing talking Scottish Hedgehog is [TS]

00:13:20   haggis spoiler alert i thank you g but [TS]

00:13:26   that what it is is that that's how [TS]

00:13:28   Disney would do that story and that's [TS]

00:13:31   playing the game and easy level [TS]

00:13:33   sorry is playing the game at expert [TS]

00:13:35   level where you're hitting a controller [TS]

00:13:39   but push the joystick up because okay [TS]

00:13:40   well obviously the way for this [TS]

00:13:41   character the situation await that [TS]

00:13:43   control doesn't work because that's not [TS]

00:13:45   easy level this is expert level we [TS]

00:13:47   actually have to think we have to [TS]

00:13:49   actually get through get through the [TS]

00:13:52   actual conflict between these two [TS]

00:13:53   characters the basis of how these two [TS]

00:13:56   characters way to each other and what [TS]

00:13:58   really struck me at the end the reason [TS]

00:14:00   why i thought was so satisfying the [TS]

00:14:02   reason why I really do categorize it as [TS]

00:14:04   up among the best of what pixar offers [TS]

00:14:07   is that there's a it made me it made me [TS]

00:14:10   think about the early days of [TS]

00:14:11   computer-generated imagery where the the [TS]

00:14:15   odd thing about it is that the stuff [TS]

00:14:18   that will be impossible to animate [TS]

00:14:20   traditionally is easy easy as hell to [TS]

00:14:23   animate in in computer graphics you want [TS]

00:14:26   to do a glass fear if you want to do a [TS]

00:14:28   character that that's covered in chrome [TS]

00:14:29   those are dirt simple for computer to [TS]

00:14:32   animate what's really difficult is [TS]

00:14:34   something that simple animate like shit [TS]

00:14:36   like a sheet of paper something like [TS]

00:14:37   that and this is what that it [TS]

00:14:40   this is sort of translates into the [TS]

00:14:41   story of a brave we're at Pixar started [TS]

00:14:46   off making huge huge huge impressions by [TS]

00:14:49   doing things that are sort of impossible [TS]

00:14:51   to do otherwise we're here is a story in [TS]

00:14:53   which all the tall the child's toys come [TS]

00:14:56   to life and their personalities and [TS]

00:14:58   there's hold this whole backstory going [TS]

00:14:59   on when you're not looking at your toys [TS]

00:15:01   or another one where here is an entire [TS]

00:15:03   world of bugs and here is a world that's [TS]

00:15:05   the planet is covered with trash and has [TS]

00:15:07   all these robots that have to do the [TS]

00:15:09   work of human beings [TS]

00:15:10   this is the first one in which these [TS]

00:15:12   pics are was have what seems like it [TS]

00:15:14   seems to be an unsurmountable challenge [TS]

00:15:16   they have to do a very human story where [TS]

00:15:19   it is [TS]

00:15:19   they could have shot this live-action [TS]

00:15:21   without much difficulty whatsoever they [TS]

00:15:24   could have there's only really one [TS]

00:15:26   fantasy element in this entire story and [TS]

00:15:29   you do and it is that ok spoiler [TS]

00:15:32   it's when a character gets to transform [TS]

00:15:33   into a bear there and and I could I [TS]

00:15:36   could just tell that yo this is the this [TS]

00:15:38   whole thing got greenlit when like that [TS]

00:15:42   if they put the top of the pitch [TS]

00:15:44   we're here the characters ABC DNA [TS]

00:15:47   and the Queen gets turned into a bear [TS]

00:15:48   and suddenly like the pitch stops [TS]

00:15:50   because all the animators the ring oh my [TS]

00:15:52   god I'll be so funny [TS]

00:15:54   okay first of all do a shot which like [TS]

00:15:55   she has to eat okay then we'll do a shot [TS]

00:15:57   like okay where you're going for with [TS]

00:15:58   this movie just because you're thinking [TS]

00:16:00   about how cool will be to animate that [TS]

00:16:01   character at that point but you could be [TS]

00:16:03   you could do that if you you can [TS]

00:16:05   actually do away with that element [TS]

00:16:06   completely and just create create a [TS]

00:16:08   reason for which the Queen let's say the [TS]

00:16:10   quit the the America gives her the cake [TS]

00:16:13   that's the magic cake that's not a magic [TS]

00:16:14   cake she just like used spoiled eggs [TS]

00:16:17   when she baked it and so the Queen has [TS]

00:16:19   absolutely horrible stomach cramps [TS]

00:16:21   she is and she's completely indisposed [TS]

00:16:23   for like this with us how this this [TS]

00:16:25   negotiation has to happen you could [TS]

00:16:27   really do the entire story almost [TS]

00:16:29   exactly the same way from that point on [TS]

00:16:31   we're because it's not about the magic [TS]

00:16:33   and it's not about the animation that [TS]

00:16:36   has to happen when you have a magical [TS]

00:16:37   spell going on [TS]

00:16:38   it really is about these characters [TS]

00:16:40   interacting with each other and bouncing [TS]

00:16:42   off of each other and there is no point [TS]

00:16:44   at which Meredith sings a song about how [TS]

00:16:46   horrible it is to be a princess you know [TS]

00:16:48   there is no talking hedgehog they're the [TS]

00:16:51   only thing that came up a little bit [TS]

00:16:52   close to that is the is the the magic [TS]

00:16:54   woman in the forest which was very [TS]

00:16:56   Disney ask although they put their own [TS]

00:16:59   little twist on it but when it comes [TS]

00:17:01   down to is that this is probably the [TS]

00:17:03   most human level story that has ever [TS]

00:17:06   been done in computer animation they did [TS]

00:17:08   something incredibly difficult by doing [TS]

00:17:10   a story that could have been filmed live [TS]

00:17:12   action with really really good actors [TS]

00:17:14   but they had to do it all by hand [TS]

00:17:16   through animation that's why i think [TS]

00:17:17   it's above it's a real landmark thing [TS]

00:17:20   for Pixar to have done [TS]

00:17:21   yeah it looks every time they seem to [TS]

00:17:24   want to challenge themselves technically [TS]

00:17:25   and not only have lots and lots and lots [TS]

00:17:27   of human characters which is always a [TS]

00:17:29   challenge because you have you have to [TS]

00:17:31   choose a caricature style essentially [TS]

00:17:33   because you don't want to get caught me [TS]

00:17:34   in the uncanny valley but I her hair her [TS]

00:17:40   unruly red hair is that I feel like that [TS]

00:17:44   i was thinkin on my bus ride home today [TS]

00:17:46   about the how they always like [TS]

00:17:48   technically challenged themselves [TS]

00:17:50   good grief i was wondering how many guys [TS]

00:17:53   like spent weeks coding new processes in [TS]

00:17:58   the Pixar Animation computer system [TS]

00:18:00   to do that hair and because he wrote [TS]

00:18:04   their animation system ya hair without [TS]

00:18:06   hair right i mean so that that's the [TS]

00:18:08   thousands of hours of programming time [TS]

00:18:10   for it for hair but it's a fantastic [TS]

00:18:13   hair this is why the bonus DVD is the is [TS]

00:18:16   the best investment in terms of [TS]

00:18:18   enjoyment per dollar because you almost [TS]

00:18:20   don't wanna watch the movie you want to [TS]

00:18:22   just go right to the commentary track [TS]

00:18:23   and that'sthat's we find out in toy [TS]

00:18:25   story 3 that the biggest technical [TS]

00:18:27   challenge the entire movie was finding [TS]

00:18:29   out how to animate a trash bag [TS]

00:18:31   ok that is literally true where you that [TS]

00:18:35   this writer's throws up this lines okay [TS]

00:18:37   the toys are put inside a trash bag and [TS]

00:18:39   that was fast forward how difficult it's [TS]

00:18:41   going to be too like animate the trash [TS]

00:18:42   compactor i was going to be to animate [TS]

00:18:44   this fire and meanwhile now like now [TS]

00:18:46   that you have to put the production that [TS]

00:18:47   nobody could figure out how to do the [TS]

00:18:49   plastic of a trash bags would actually [TS]

00:18:51   move the way that plastic moves and [TS]

00:18:53   everybody's tearing their hair out [TS]

00:18:55   psycho use stupid idiot [TS]

00:18:57   you could've written anything else they [TS]

00:18:59   could say because we are her bag [TS]

00:19:01   ok how about putting in a chromebox [TS]

00:19:03   we're really good at doing things are [TS]

00:19:04   made out of chrome but this is what [TS]

00:19:07   pixar does right i mean this is part of [TS]

00:19:09   what separates it from other animation [TS]

00:19:10   companies [TS]

00:19:11   um I i read an article where they were [TS]

00:19:13   talking about the interviewed archery [TS]

00:19:17   and physics and researchers talking [TS]

00:19:20   about how that the one scene where [TS]

00:19:22   Meredith takes that archery shot in [TS]

00:19:24   slow-motion how they got all the details [TS]

00:19:26   exactly right on how the arrow bend and [TS]

00:19:30   shakes during that during flight really [TS]

00:19:32   does band around the boat like that [TS]

00:19:35   yeah it's a lot of attention to detail [TS]

00:19:38   you also get the sense that the pixar [TS]

00:19:39   guys left I was like alright we're going [TS]

00:19:41   to move out archery and it and bears and [TS]

00:19:43   in Scotland we're gonna go to Scotland [TS]

00:19:45   for a while and see some bears and learn [TS]

00:19:48   how to shoot arrows and lots of things [TS]

00:19:51   and then they apply it to do this i [TS]

00:19:53   wanted to talk about for a moment [TS]

00:19:55   somebody actually in the chatroom [TS]

00:19:56   mentioned this and I i have the exact [TS]

00:19:58   same plot which is one of the reasons [TS]

00:20:00   that i think i was so delighted by the [TS]

00:20:03   movie when i saw it was that that I [TS]

00:20:04   hadn't read a lot about it and the [TS]

00:20:07   trailer to me seemed to be a real act of [TS]

00:20:11   misdirection [TS]

00:20:12   the one seen that they kept showing over [TS]

00:20:14   and over again which was Meredy shooting [TS]

00:20:16   the her bow and arrow with you know to [TS]

00:20:19   take better shots than that her three [TS]

00:20:21   suitors and I feel like that was really [TS]

00:20:25   picks are playing us that they were they [TS]

00:20:28   were they were actually in the marketing [TS]

00:20:29   even setting up an expectation for what [TS]

00:20:33   this movie would be that you know that [TS]

00:20:37   they didn't deliver that they didn't [TS]

00:20:39   want to deliver that they delivered in [TS]

00:20:41   the first 10 minutes and then swerved [TS]

00:20:43   and when in a whole other direction and [TS]

00:20:45   I loved that I loved going into that [TS]

00:20:47   movie and really not knowing that uh you [TS]

00:20:51   know that it was gonna be a story about [TS]

00:20:53   a girl and her mother who had been [TS]

00:20:56   transformed into a kind of wacky clumsy [TS]

00:20:58   talking bear and I i love the fact that [TS]

00:21:01   that it it legitimately took me by [TS]

00:21:04   surprise and wasn't a movie that I was [TS]

00:21:06   led to believe by the commercials in the [TS]

00:21:07   trailer the whole movie kinda does that [TS]

00:21:10   where it at every turn this story and [TS]

00:21:13   not just the movies of it is the story [TS]

00:21:15   is there's an event that's going to take [TS]

00:21:16   place that you think will either [TS]

00:21:18   heighten the tension or resolve some [TS]

00:21:21   kind of conflict and it just doesn't [TS]

00:21:22   like it with the ads you expected that [TS]

00:21:25   archery contest to be something and she [TS]

00:21:27   wins it and something dramatic happens [TS]

00:21:28   and it's just like that's like the [TS]

00:21:30   starting of the dialogue like it's [TS]

00:21:32   barely even you know all the events that [TS]

00:21:34   would be a big turning point a dramatic [TS]

00:21:36   scene that has a dramatic changes just [TS]

00:21:38   don't in the movie and it's like oh that [TS]

00:21:40   the problem is still that didn't just [TS]

00:21:42   win the archery thing but i still have [TS]

00:21:44   the problem still exists we haven't [TS]

00:21:45   solved the problem in it at every point [TS]

00:21:47   everything that's supposed to be [TS]

00:21:49   triumphant are transformative in a [TS]

00:21:50   typical movie of this type is not [TS]

00:21:53   transformer transformer it because all [TS]

00:21:55   your same problems that were set up at [TS]

00:21:57   the b-movie continue to exist they don't [TS]

00:21:59   go away because the music swells and [TS]

00:22:01   something interesting happens on screen [TS]

00:22:03   and that's that's very I don't say [TS]

00:22:05   unsettling but like it keeps you [TS]

00:22:07   off-balance as a viewer up because you [TS]

00:22:09   do expect certain terms of events to act [TS]

00:22:12   a certain way in the movie they just [TS]

00:22:13   don't let that's why I think different [TS]

00:22:16   studios different writers have almost a [TS]

00:22:17   credit score when it comes to well [TS]

00:22:20   creating screenplays Pixar is really [TS]

00:22:22   really good that way where you'll see [TS]

00:22:24   the trailer and you think you can start [TS]

00:22:25   it [TS]

00:22:26   you can't help but be reminded of films [TS]

00:22:28   that are sort of someone to this trailer [TS]

00:22:29   but you know that well this is pics are [TS]

00:22:31   so if they're going to give us something [TS]

00:22:33   that looks like what we've seen before [TS]

00:22:35   that's probably going to be misdirection [TS]

00:22:37   to begin with although i will i will be [TS]

00:22:39   contrary a little bit there [TS]

00:22:41   uh I thought the second trailer for this [TS]

00:22:43   movie gave away way too much because I [TS]

00:22:46   knew exactly what the twist was going to [TS]

00:22:49   be because they they have the in the end [TS]

00:22:51   of the the three mute little brothers [TS]

00:22:55   oh yeah and then you see a shot of three [TS]

00:22:57   little bears like okay I bet [TS]

00:23:00   oh and that's that's why the the shot of [TS]

00:23:02   the Bears trying was trying to trying [TS]

00:23:04   and failing to catch a salmon [TS]

00:23:05   ok now I know what happens now the only [TS]

00:23:07   question is does the entire family turn [TS]

00:23:09   into bears or just a couple didn't read [TS]

00:23:12   it didn't ruin for me but I i thought [TS]

00:23:14   that was okay i think they want to be [TS]

00:23:16   able to further it's difficult you have [TS]

00:23:18   to show three little bears like a [TS]

00:23:19   certain point the marketing people take [TS]

00:23:21   over and listen we're showing throwing [TS]

00:23:22   three little bears could be any kid [TS]

00:23:24   that's gonna put into identify the three [TS]

00:23:26   little bears yes Saul you kept telling [TS]

00:23:28   me here at that bears a tested through [TS]

00:23:30   the roof through thought roof week we [TS]

00:23:32   wish we could sign all the details are [TS]

00:23:34   being offered frozen licensing gotta put [TS]

00:23:36   the bed without it the trailer is in the [TS]

00:23:38   trailer noble argument next Pixar movie [TS]

00:23:40   there's two it's there was no beers one [TS]

00:23:43   well the country bears honey talk to [TS]

00:23:45   their instruments rudimentary into [TS]

00:23:46   spring the servants so another way that [TS]

00:23:48   this movie took me by surprise which I [TS]

00:23:50   liked was the the mother turns into a [TS]

00:23:55   bear and I so as I'm watching that I'm [TS]

00:23:58   thinking okay I know again I know where [TS]

00:24:01   this is going which is that she's going [TS]

00:24:02   to be turned into a bear and they're [TS]

00:24:04   gonna chase after and that's going to be [TS]

00:24:06   the the plotline and what I did not [TS]

00:24:08   expect for whatever reason maybe I [TS]

00:24:10   should have maybe this is my fault I [TS]

00:24:12   didn't expect that she would be entirely [TS]

00:24:16   herself and not transformed into an [TS]

00:24:19   animal and that that we would end up [TS]

00:24:21   with these really wacky and I thought [TS]

00:24:25   really enjoyable scenes where where the [TS]

00:24:28   mother is not realizing she's a bear and [TS]

00:24:33   discovering she's a bear and being [TS]

00:24:34   horrified that she's a bear and then [TS]

00:24:37   married has to has to smuggle her out of [TS]

00:24:39   the [TS]

00:24:39   Castle and I thought that was all that [TS]

00:24:41   was all charming and again not what I [TS]

00:24:42   expected I expected it to be she's [TS]

00:24:44   turned into a bear and she becomes an [TS]

00:24:46   animal and runs off into the forest and [TS]

00:24:48   then they have to find her and save her [TS]

00:24:49   from being hunted [TS]

00:24:50   I figured that would be the arc here but [TS]

00:24:52   I didn't expect so much great interplay [TS]

00:24:55   and really mother-daughter interplay [TS]

00:24:57   between America and her mother turned [TS]

00:25:00   into a giant bear with the Briton that [TS]

00:25:02   was that was so bro it's how i love that [TS]

00:25:04   so much that [TS]

00:25:05   yes of course is gonna be the wacky [TS]

00:25:07   seems I what I'm a bear all know I can't [TS]

00:25:09   be all my beer holy cats I'm a bear that [TS]

00:25:11   the end you get through that and [TS]

00:25:12   instantly because it goes right just [TS]

00:25:14   write down to as if like Mara [TS]

00:25:16   accidentally like you know left her [TS]

00:25:18   mom's hair and the curlers too long and [TS]

00:25:20   her hair is like albarn scores and she [TS]

00:25:22   has no hair left now to like look at [TS]

00:25:24   what you did [TS]

00:25:25   104 watches if you bought anything [TS]

00:25:28   through Meredy these now look what now [TS]

00:25:30   we're going to fix this now what is not [TS]

00:25:32   my fault it's not my fault that said the [TS]

00:25:34   knob on the dial should be set a little [TS]

00:25:35   bit but it's not my fault well I don't [TS]

00:25:36   care about your fault and we're going to [TS]

00:25:38   do it the minute you have this argument [TS]

00:25:40   between like a very like Angry [TS]

00:25:42   twelve-year-old girl and the eight-foot [TS]

00:25:44   bear who's wearing a tiara [TS]

00:25:47   ya know it's a great image it's been hot [TS]

00:25:51   I really like actually that it gets it [TS]

00:25:55   gets married his mother to shut up even [TS]

00:25:57   though she's interacting you know she's [TS]

00:26:00   not necessarily for the first time and [TS]

00:26:02   you notice she doesn't do a lot of [TS]

00:26:04   physical interaction you see it a little [TS]

00:26:06   bit when marriages young but as she gets [TS]

00:26:09   older you don't you see the Queen become [TS]

00:26:11   more and more reserved and she's very [TS]

00:26:13   polite and she's you know she doesn't [TS]

00:26:14   use her hands very much it's very you [TS]

00:26:16   know talking and measured tones and as [TS]

00:26:18   soon as she gets turned into a bear [TS]

00:26:21   she has the same kind of boisterous [TS]

00:26:23   energy that Mara does when there is [TS]

00:26:25   moving around and marriages talking and [TS]

00:26:27   things like that so it's in a weird way [TS]

00:26:30   it's like they're put on the same level [TS]

00:26:31   and she's I mean yeah you get her bring [TS]

00:26:34   being brought into the forest and you [TS]

00:26:36   get married and interacting with her in [TS]

00:26:38   that way and like well look at where I [TS]

00:26:40   hang out with them and spend my days mom [TS]

00:26:41   but you I feel like for the first for [TS]

00:26:45   the first time since Merida's little [TS]

00:26:47   tiny kid the two of them connect in and [TS]

00:26:51   did all the only thing they had to [TS]

00:26:53   do was you know take her out of a gallon [TS]

00:26:55   and turn into a nature of their into a [TS]

00:26:56   bear [TS]

00:26:57   although her mother's immediate response [TS]

00:26:59   is that she's horrified that she's not [TS]

00:27:01   ladylike enough as a bear which is hence [TS]

00:27:04   the tiara and and other things that [TS]

00:27:06   happened very early on in her mannerisms [TS]

00:27:07   where she's trying to be dainty and [TS]

00:27:09   realizing that it's completely [TS]

00:27:10   impossible and that's great because [TS]

00:27:12   isn't that kind of a parallel with with [TS]

00:27:14   marisa who finds this idea that she's [TS]

00:27:17   going to be this lady that her mother [TS]

00:27:19   wants her to be completely impossible [TS]

00:27:21   she just can't she can't even conceive [TS]

00:27:24   of it there's no way she can do it so I [TS]

00:27:26   I am I i do love that and then of course [TS]

00:27:28   then threw her misfiring magic the the [TS]

00:27:33   mother and the daughter actually get to [TS]

00:27:34   spend time together out of this context [TS]

00:27:37   that they're in which is the context of [TS]

00:27:38   all of these other princess movies right [TS]

00:27:40   of you know you have to you have to do [TS]

00:27:42   this no I'm going to repel against that [TS]

00:27:44   and they and they take it and they take [TS]

00:27:46   it all the way out which is great they [TS]

00:27:47   they they put him in the forest with you [TS]

00:27:50   gotta eat it eat some fish and follow [TS]

00:27:53   the will of the wisp of the one hard and [TS]

00:27:55   fast thing that like other princess [TS]

00:27:58   movies tend to do is the the the adults [TS]

00:28:00   whoever they may be the adults in power [TS]

00:28:02   who are telling the kids to do the [TS]

00:28:03   things they don't want to do they have [TS]

00:28:04   like two modes they have like Stern but [TS]

00:28:08   being started out of love and concern [TS]

00:28:10   mode and then at the end of the movie [TS]

00:28:11   they have the slight softening with its [TS]

00:28:13   alright you taught me kid i guess i was [TS]

00:28:15   wrong after all some kind of softening [TS]

00:28:17   in this that those modes don't exist in [TS]

00:28:19   this movie because in the beginning we [TS]

00:28:21   established the characters like this is [TS]

00:28:22   a mother who loves her little daughter [TS]

00:28:23   and then with that contrasted with now [TS]

00:28:26   look how their relationship is has [TS]

00:28:28   changed and cooled and strained a little [TS]

00:28:29   bit as she enters adolescence and then [TS]

00:28:32   they go off into when she's on she's a [TS]

00:28:33   bear the it slips everything around and [TS]

00:28:36   now you know now the mother needs help [TS]

00:28:39   from the daughter and the daughter is [TS]

00:28:41   forced to look at the mother not as the [TS]

00:28:43   authority figures telling me to do [TS]

00:28:44   something I don't want to do but as [TS]

00:28:45   another vulnerable human being with her [TS]

00:28:47   own problems and she's this slide thru [TS]

00:28:49   the cause of like that that leveling the [TS]

00:28:51   playing field of like oh now both the [TS]

00:28:53   movie and the protagonist now recognize [TS]

00:28:55   the adult authority figure as also a [TS]

00:28:57   human being with problems and needs and [TS]

00:28:59   motivations that never happens it's [TS]

00:29:01   always like the wall because it's like [TS]

00:29:02   that that the the dumb adults and the [TS]

00:29:04   end [TS]

00:29:05   the crazy kids in typical kids movie [TS]

00:29:07   this completely levels that what i like [TS]

00:29:09   about that's how it gets revealed to [TS]

00:29:12   America but what I like about this movie [TS]

00:29:14   too is that the the magic and the [TS]

00:29:17   turning the mother into a bear that [TS]

00:29:21   doesn't that makes me laugh every time [TS]

00:29:23   she's a bear doesn't transform her [TS]

00:29:26   attitude toward her daughter that [TS]

00:29:28   there's a very very nice scene where you [TS]

00:29:33   know Meredith cuts the tapestry right [TS]

00:29:35   and and and her mother throws marriages [TS]

00:29:38   bow and the fire and um what's wonderful [TS]

00:29:42   is that her mother and you're thinking [TS]

00:29:44   oh this is this awful woman she she [TS]

00:29:47   doesn't understand her daughter and she [TS]

00:29:48   says oh what if I done and she realizes [TS]

00:29:50   just how terrible this action has been [TS]

00:29:54   and that they've come this far and their [TS]

00:29:57   relationship is so broken and I really [TS]

00:29:59   appreciated that because it lets you see [TS]

00:30:02   that she realizes what these issues are [TS]

00:30:04   before she turns into the bear instead [TS]

00:30:06   of it being well i got turned into a [TS]

00:30:07   bear and it made me rethink a few things [TS]

00:30:09   instead it's like she's already [TS]

00:30:11   rethinking and realizing this is a [TS]

00:30:14   problem with her relationship with her [TS]

00:30:15   daughter and it just so happens because [TS]

00:30:17   she gets turned into a bear and has to [TS]

00:30:19   go to the forest that she can you know [TS]

00:30:22   they learn to communicate even though [TS]

00:30:24   she can't talk and it all works itself [TS]

00:30:26   out but I think it's important that the [TS]

00:30:28   mother realizes before there's any magic [TS]

00:30:31   involved that they've got this is gone [TS]

00:30:33   you know way too far and that she needs [TS]

00:30:35   to do something [TS]

00:30:36   yeah that not only value but again it's [TS]

00:30:39   it's it's playing the game at expert [TS]

00:30:41   level not only it instantly sort of [TS]

00:30:43   movies there's also that the the final [TS]

00:30:45   scenes which well you're you're right [TS]

00:30:47   little girl like you think he was a [TS]

00:30:49   little girl that can make her own [TS]

00:30:50   decisions but you should forge your own [TS]

00:30:52   path [TS]

00:30:53   part of it is that America has to [TS]

00:30:55   realize that oh actually mom had mom [TS]

00:30:57   with mom but my mother was making really [TS]

00:30:59   really good points here they would leave [TS]

00:31:01   this she wasn't just sort of making me [TS]

00:31:03   to something that I don't want to be [TS]

00:31:04   it's actually really really essential [TS]

00:31:07   for like the continued health of [TS]

00:31:08   everybody who lives in this article in [TS]

00:31:10   time right that we maintain the pace I [TS]

00:31:13   didn't I was too frustrated to really [TS]

00:31:15   listen to what she was saying was trying [TS]

00:31:17   to teach with something really [TS]

00:31:18   the important and ok let's let's find a [TS]

00:31:20   way to solve that problem they get it [TS]

00:31:22   gives the mother of the grown-ups credit [TS]

00:31:25   for being intelligent human beings yeah [TS]

00:31:27   and it's it's that sense compromise to [TS]

00:31:29   where she's she's about she realizes [TS]

00:31:31   what her mother's been trying to teach [TS]

00:31:32   her in that scene with the the the the [TS]

00:31:35   four tribes and in that meeting where [TS]

00:31:37   things are about to come fall apart and [TS]

00:31:40   at the same time she offers basically [TS]

00:31:42   she's gonna go and do everything and [TS]

00:31:44   offer her hand in marriage and her [TS]

00:31:46   mother as a bear says no right that says [TS]

00:31:51   says no no you don't need to do that so [TS]

00:31:53   there's that compromise that happens in [TS]

00:31:54   that moment while they're mining she's [TS]

00:31:56   mine to her cause she's out there that [TS]

00:31:58   was brilliant with Billy I i really [TS]

00:32:00   wanted to like send twenty dollars to [TS]

00:32:01   Pixar saying five of you get copies for [TS]

00:32:04   dollar copies on me because you deserve [TS]

00:32:06   it with it the the whole the whole point [TS]

00:32:08   of her like giving that speech at least [TS]

00:32:09   seventy-five percent of it is simply to [TS]

00:32:11   distract everybody so that her mother [TS]

00:32:13   bear could sneak upstairs with attack [TS]

00:32:15   tapestry is so they can pick together [TS]

00:32:17   but she was the queen squander this [TS]

00:32:19   opportunity because she's so proud of [TS]

00:32:22   her daughter and she's just transfixed [TS]

00:32:25   and she's like almost welling up in [TS]

00:32:27   tears at how wonderful and strong and [TS]

00:32:29   intelligent a girl itchy that she's [TS]

00:32:31   raised here and she's squander this [TS]

00:32:33   opportunity because she just doesn't [TS]

00:32:34   want to miss it and all goodness bestest [TS]

00:32:36   it's not it's not as tear-jerking as you [TS]

00:32:39   know this as a as a as Jesse being [TS]

00:32:42   abandoned toy story 2 but it's up there [TS]

00:32:44   you will get some way you're going what [TS]

00:32:46   is handy [TS]

00:32:46   that's about as tear-jerking as it gets [TS]

00:32:48   that is that song that damn song the [TS]

00:32:51   Sarah McLachlan song and toy story 2 [TS]

00:32:52   love [TS]

00:32:54   oh no we just call out the begin to cry [TS]

00:32:56   now song just start crying [TS]

00:32:58   go ahead all of you have kind of touched [TS]

00:33:00   on something that struck me about the [TS]

00:33:01   movie which is that there really are no [TS]

00:33:03   bad characters in the movie in terms of [TS]

00:33:05   you know evil there's course there's the [TS]

00:33:07   Fallen prints and you know who is kind [TS]

00:33:09   of touched on but he's really just the [TS]

00:33:11   backstory he's not really a character in [TS]

00:33:13   this in the movie every other character [TS]

00:33:15   in the movie is pretty much a good [TS]

00:33:17   person and that the movie is really [TS]

00:33:20   about the relationships between good [TS]

00:33:22   people that sometimes don't go well and [TS]

00:33:26   and how you know how you can sometimes [TS]

00:33:27   fix those but i just like the fact that [TS]

00:33:29   you know I could take my kids the movie [TS]

00:33:31   and [TS]

00:33:32   there's a lot of violence in it which [TS]

00:33:33   kind of freaked him out but everybody in [TS]

00:33:35   the movie was actually a good you know [TS]

00:33:37   at heart a good person [TS]

00:33:39   yeah yeah i'm also by the way it for [TS]

00:33:43   fans of baseball young McIntosh is Tim [TS]

00:33:45   Lincecum not the voice the guy is [TS]

00:33:49   totally San Francisco Giants long hair [TS]

00:33:51   big chin [TS]

00:33:52   totally yeah check it out I mean they [TS]

00:33:54   had to put in their twenties to read [TS]

00:33:55   when it's beautiful it's a thing of [TS]

00:33:57   beauty [TS]

00:33:57   surrender you've seen a lot of pixar [TS]

00:33:59   movies did were you struck by the fact [TS]

00:34:01   that this was either their attempt to [TS]

00:34:05   finally tell a story with a with a [TS]

00:34:07   female character as the protagonist [TS]

00:34:08   after you know many many movies having [TS]

00:34:11   not you know having not gone there or [TS]

00:34:14   did it did it really not matter i are at [TS]

00:34:19   least my opinion is always first and [TS]

00:34:21   foremost to tell a good story turns sure [TS]

00:34:23   I feel like it does not matter who the [TS]

00:34:26   protagonist is as long as everyone in [TS]

00:34:28   the film is flushed out and interesting [TS]

00:34:30   i like seeing female protagonists [TS]

00:34:33   because as a kid I know like it was very [TS]

00:34:37   hard to grow up and have only role [TS]

00:34:39   models like pink power ranger to be here [TS]

00:34:42   you know oh yeah no I want to play [TS]

00:34:44   Wolverine no you can't play Wolverine [TS]

00:34:46   because you're a girl like that kind of [TS]

00:34:48   thing is very disappointing for for a [TS]

00:34:52   kid and so I appreciate it from that [TS]

00:34:55   from that level i appreciate that little [TS]

00:34:57   girls you know can go and be like yeah I [TS]

00:35:00   want to learn archery I want to be you [TS]

00:35:02   know an awesome princess who saves her [TS]

00:35:04   mother and you know and and focuses in [TS]

00:35:07   and is awesome [TS]

00:35:09   I i really like that aspect of it I but [TS]

00:35:13   i think on the whole I mean pixar pixar [TS]

00:35:17   does well by its characters you know [TS]

00:35:20   when it chooses to make archetypal [TS]

00:35:22   characters it usually does it for a [TS]

00:35:24   reason and they like to play off that [TS]

00:35:28   like the triplets and brave [TS]

00:35:30   I you get a good balance there between [TS]

00:35:33   the archetypal roles that you might see [TS]

00:35:36   in any other animation series and then [TS]

00:35:38   the little twist the the pic sorry and [TS]

00:35:41   flavor that they that they put to make [TS]

00:35:43   the archetypes a little more interesting [TS]

00:35:45   and [TS]

00:35:45   memorable and funny in your eyes I so [TS]

00:35:49   i'm very glad that pixar did a movie [TS]

00:35:52   with female protagonist and i'm all for [TS]

00:35:54   seeing more female protagonists in the [TS]

00:35:56   future because I would love it if we [TS]

00:35:58   could stop talking about [TS]

00:35:59   oh isn't it novel that isn't that [TS]

00:36:02   adorable that girl thinks he's a hero [TS]

00:36:03   i'm glad they did that it's half the [TS]

00:36:06   population and and one of 15 2015 12 [TS]

00:36:09   pixar movies or 10 pixar movies or [TS]

00:36:11   whatever it is so you know that that's [TS]

00:36:13   sad that's really the the issue and of [TS]

00:36:16   course the attitude in Hollywood against [TS]

00:36:18   lots of evidence to the contrary that [TS]

00:36:20   that a movies with female characters [TS]

00:36:24   don't do as well and then there's the [TS]

00:36:26   question of you know we'll kids with [TS]

00:36:28   boys want to see a movie with a girl at [TS]

00:36:30   the center of it and i can tell you that [TS]

00:36:31   mean oh my son and I have a son and a [TS]

00:36:34   daughter and my and they both really [TS]

00:36:35   liked it and it didn't really matter [TS]

00:36:37   that that.oh well it's a girl I don't [TS]

00:36:39   care about her [TS]

00:36:40   I mean they cared about her and she's [TS]

00:36:42   the main character she's she's awesome [TS]

00:36:44   and she's got this you know and her mom [TS]

00:36:45   turns into a bear and how cool is that [TS]

00:36:46   and it wasn't an issue with them i think [TS]

00:36:49   it's more of an issue with the people [TS]

00:36:51   who are worried about and are [TS]

00:36:52   overthinking how it's going to play in [TS]

00:36:55   the box office [TS]

00:36:56   it's the marketers that are worried not [TS]

00:36:58   the little kids the little kids just [TS]

00:37:00   want a good story and fun characters [TS]

00:37:02   exactly so so one of the things that [TS]

00:37:06   we've touched on briefly is that there [TS]

00:37:08   are there are many many other animated [TS]

00:37:10   movies that are famous for having a [TS]

00:37:13   female protagonist but that there are [TS]

00:37:15   lots of issues with those and you know [TS]

00:37:18   the obviously the Disney Princesses come [TS]

00:37:20   to mind there are you know Disney [TS]

00:37:22   animated movies mostly mostly are female [TS]

00:37:26   characters at the center but they are [TS]

00:37:28   generally even called and marketed as [TS]

00:37:31   the disney princesses and they have lots [TS]

00:37:33   of things in common involving no mother [TS]

00:37:35   or dead mother or dead parents and and [TS]

00:37:39   they usually have a well let's see i [TS]

00:37:42   mean that they're all the different [TS]

00:37:43   things that they need that they are in a [TS]

00:37:44   situation they want to repel against [TS]

00:37:46   there being a being a princess and and [TS]

00:37:48   day my prince will come it right there [TS]

00:37:50   either put into a into a relationship [TS]

00:37:52   that they don't want with with somebody [TS]

00:37:54   and they rebelled against it only to [TS]

00:37:56   discover that the in this case the [TS]

00:37:57   prince is nice or they from [TS]

00:37:59   another boy who is also nice instead and [TS]

00:38:03   you know you can trace the story arc of [TS]

00:38:05   the disney princess and you know even in [TS]

00:38:08   recent times when Disney has tried to [TS]

00:38:11   make movies with non-white princesses [TS]

00:38:13   that's their big step is that the that [TS]

00:38:16   the race of the animated character that [TS]

00:38:18   doesn't actually I guess have erased [TS]

00:38:20   because it's animated is the big [TS]

00:38:23   variation which is great on one level [TS]

00:38:25   but it doesn't really change the story [TS]

00:38:27   arcs which you know in Pocahontas or [TS]

00:38:29   Milan or the princess and the frog you [TS]

00:38:32   know the story arcs are still not that [TS]

00:38:34   different even if the characters look a [TS]

00:38:35   little bit different you know what I'd [TS]

00:38:37   actually argue that Milan and specific [TS]

00:38:39   reminded me of brave a lot and that [TS]

00:38:42   movie sort of isolation area from the [TS]

00:38:45   rest of the disney princess lot i takes [TS]

00:38:48   on more of a i'm doing this you know [TS]

00:38:52   because I want to help somebody or I [TS]

00:38:55   want to you know go forward and make my [TS]

00:38:56   own path and and it holds together [TS]

00:38:59   towards the end of it like yes Mulan [TS]

00:39:02   ends up meeting in you know eventually [TS]

00:39:04   falling in love with one of the people [TS]

00:39:07   that you know she's working together [TS]

00:39:09   within her in her unit but you know she [TS]

00:39:12   goes through the whole movie basically [TS]

00:39:15   to to defend honor and yes she's [TS]

00:39:19   defending her father's on RC could argue [TS]

00:39:21   oh no that makes her a weak character [TS]

00:39:23   but i think so does mother in Milan [TS]

00:39:25   yeah exactly her reported mother know [TS]

00:39:27   her mother's alive in that no okay [TS]

00:39:29   her mother is alive I don't know how to [TS]

00:39:31   actually send her father is we i think [TS]

00:39:34   we see her [TS]

00:39:34   we see her because she's come from panda [TS]

00:39:37   just have a know there are many there [TS]

00:39:40   are many don't but that's all the way [TS]

00:39:42   but still you mentioned already when [TS]

00:39:44   shang with the guys name sharing when he [TS]

00:39:46   shows up at the end though it's like you [TS]

00:39:47   think the movies over and she's [TS]

00:39:49   triumphant and she succeeded and she has [TS]

00:39:51   all these friends and she showed that [TS]

00:39:52   she's resourceful and smart and then he [TS]

00:39:54   shows up comes walking at the end is at [TS]

00:39:55   that little girl you forgot your role in [TS]

00:39:58   life is to is to get in a relationship [TS]

00:39:59   with a man and here is so off you go [TS]

00:40:02   that it's a kind of undercuts it where [TS]

00:40:05   the whole movie was not about that and [TS]

00:40:08   they had this little like not real [TS]

00:40:10   relation [TS]

00:40:11   what kind of like they flirting sexual [TS]

00:40:14   tension thing which is fine but then at [TS]

00:40:15   the end of the movie actor she's [TS]

00:40:16   trapping he shows up going all shocks [TS]

00:40:18   lady you know you're dropped your role [TS]

00:40:19   in life is to come and be with me and [TS]

00:40:21   she's like oh yes now but that's just [TS]

00:40:22   her father is so proud that she's found [TS]

00:40:25   a man to to find her desirable and they [TS]

00:40:27   get paired off and I'm not it's not at [TS]

00:40:28   this terrible the disney movies with the [TS]

00:40:30   princess just gets in peril and the [TS]

00:40:32   princess to come and save her with a [TS]

00:40:33   kiss and bs like that but that it's [TS]

00:40:36   that's the word that the worst thing [TS]

00:40:38   about the disney princess movies is that [TS]

00:40:40   all them revolve around the idea that [TS]

00:40:44   finding a man is your purpose in life [TS]

00:40:47   and they never explicitly say like and [TS]

00:40:49   to have children or whatever it's like [TS]

00:40:51   marriage that is the culmination of your [TS]

00:40:53   existence and then I how the stories and [TS]

00:40:55   there's going to be you and it's going [TS]

00:40:56   to be a guy is gonna be handsome guy and [TS]

00:40:57   it's gonna be nice and brave or whatever [TS]

00:40:59   but your role as a princess is to pair [TS]

00:41:01   up with that guy and that works is not [TS]

00:41:03   evil or networks because little girls [TS]

00:41:06   like to think about their prints coming [TS]

00:41:07   and stuff like that and making you know [TS]

00:41:08   the debate all the different reasons why [TS]

00:41:10   that is so in nature versus nurture or [TS]

00:41:11   whatever but that sameness and that sort [TS]

00:41:14   of just over decades and decades of [TS]

00:41:15   doing the princess movies it's it just [TS]

00:41:17   gets tiring and it just it really [TS]

00:41:19   reinforces the notion in females [TS]

00:41:21   watching it like the path of your life [TS]

00:41:24   no matter who you are what decade you [TS]

00:41:25   live in what your race is what your [TS]

00:41:27   classes what your status is what your [TS]

00:41:28   skills are it's going to culminate in [TS]

00:41:30   marriage and that's the end that's the [TS]

00:41:32   end of the movie they never had the [TS]

00:41:33   second movie we've been married for 20 [TS]

00:41:35   years and you have the screaming kids or [TS]

00:41:36   whatever that's a less popular animated [TS]

00:41:39   form the screaming kids parents while [TS]

00:41:41   incredible is this is an incredible [TS]

00:41:43   right now and the incredibles does a [TS]

00:41:45   good job of that [TS]

00:41:47   yeah no yeah it does it does the [TS]

00:41:49   incredibles well we could talk about the [TS]

00:41:50   incredibles remember and maybe we're [TS]

00:41:52   very long time yeah yeah maybe we should [TS]

00:41:54   do a whole show about that I wanted to [TS]

00:41:56   bring up something about going back to [TS]

00:41:58   brave as I yes go again and again I I [TS]

00:42:02   appreciate that they leave it out [TS]

00:42:05   I leave out the the possibility for Mara [TS]

00:42:08   to fall in love with one of the people [TS]

00:42:11   that she eventually has to be betrothed [TS]

00:42:13   to is still on the line but they're not [TS]

00:42:18   resolving in this film you know she [TS]

00:42:20   doesn't even have to think about it it's [TS]

00:42:21   just know that is something to decide [TS]

00:42:24   when I am [TS]

00:42:24   older and it will be my own choice right [TS]

00:42:26   I appreciate that the romance wasn't you [TS]

00:42:29   know they didn't try and shoehorn a [TS]

00:42:30   romance story into it [TS]

00:42:32   yeah like that was the great things they [TS]

00:42:34   they have three suitors and you're [TS]

00:42:36   watching it if you're watching with the [TS]

00:42:37   idea that stereotypes around like pi [TS]

00:42:39   wonder which one of those three is going [TS]

00:42:40   to turn out to actually be the cool one [TS]

00:42:42   she finds none of them nope none of them [TS]

00:42:43   out all you know a Qatari the shy open [TS]

00:42:47   whether i was so put off by earlier [TS]

00:42:49   I'm starting to realize that perhaps [TS]

00:42:50   there's something in this person after [TS]

00:42:52   all [TS]

00:42:53   well yeah if it was a dreamworks movie [TS]

00:42:54   the two of them would be going off with [TS]

00:42:57   her mother the bear and finding [TS]

00:42:58   something out about each other while [TS]

00:43:00   they're babysitting her so john is a big [TS]

00:43:03   fan as we've covered on a previous [TS]

00:43:04   podcast of a of a miyazaki who is and [TS]

00:43:08   people pics are huge fans I mean really [TS]

00:43:09   if you look at the the big influences on [TS]

00:43:13   the people pics are obviously disney and [TS]

00:43:15   miyazaki I think would be two of the [TS]

00:43:17   biggest if not the biggest and meanest [TS]

00:43:19   Rockies movies are interesting because [TS]

00:43:21   they quite frequently not always have [TS]

00:43:23   female protagonist so John you know [TS]

00:43:26   what's your take on on how brave handles [TS]

00:43:30   handles merida and universes disney [TS]

00:43:33   princesses and Miyazaki's characters us [TS]

00:43:36   that thinking about ways to do a [TS]

00:43:40   non-sexist I guess non stereotypical [TS]

00:43:43   female characters because we all know [TS]

00:43:45   what the stereotype is the outlines that [TS]

00:43:47   very well how do you do a story with [TS]

00:43:49   with with females female characters or [TS]

00:43:52   female lead that doesn't fall into those [TS]

00:43:55   traps and one way to do it is to do a [TS]

00:43:57   story where gender doesn't matter [TS]

00:44:01   and sometimes that the cheap way to do [TS]

00:44:04   that is to write a story with a male [TS]

00:44:06   lead that you think is going to be [TS]

00:44:07   exciting and interesting that's not [TS]

00:44:09   doesn't hammering on the mail stuff like [TS]

00:44:11   it's not about I don't know tips [TS]

00:44:13   specifically male things but just write [TS]

00:44:15   a regular story with the male lead and [TS]

00:44:16   just swap the gender and that's it so it [TS]

00:44:18   was a prince you make a princess but [TS]

00:44:20   just the stories exactly the same or if [TS]

00:44:21   it's just it's just a person you just [TS]

00:44:22   switch the gender right much harder is [TS]

00:44:25   to write a story of a character living [TS]

00:44:30   with all the usual impressions of [TS]

00:44:32   females that we all know from the [TS]

00:44:33   various cultures on earth there were you [TS]

00:44:35   know in our societies [TS]

00:44:37   have it be a female character had that [TS]

00:44:39   character living in a world where all [TS]

00:44:40   that stuff exists but don't have the [TS]

00:44:43   movie about those forms of oppression [TS]

00:44:45   everything just simply have the [TS]

00:44:46   character not be limited by them and [TS]

00:44:48   that's what miyazaki i think does so [TS]

00:44:50   well with the female protagonist because [TS]

00:44:53   they're in there in a world where their [TS]

00:44:56   expectations of my outcome of kikis [TS]

00:44:58   delivery services one of my favorite [TS]

00:45:00   movies of all time I am meeting [TS]

00:45:02   she's she's in a world where there are [TS]

00:45:04   gender roles and expectations for [TS]

00:45:06   females i love the fact that her friend [TS]

00:45:08   in the town is a pregnant woman which is [TS]

00:45:11   something that you know they wouldn't [TS]

00:45:12   even show in live-action television for [TS]

00:45:13   decades i probably can't show pregnancy [TS]

00:45:15   right is an acknowledgement that like [TS]

00:45:17   pregnancy is uniquely female your her [TS]

00:45:20   role model when you know when she's away [TS]

00:45:21   from her parents is this woman who is [TS]

00:45:23   pregnant and they don't talk about it [TS]

00:45:24   it's not a thing but it's their right [TS]

00:45:26   and there is the expectations of romance [TS]

00:45:28   and the boy who likes her and everything [TS]

00:45:30   all the things that you are i set by and [TS]

00:45:32   the the younger sort of teenage friend [TS]

00:45:34   in the woods who sort of more [TS]

00:45:35   self-actualized woman showing her all [TS]

00:45:38   and she has the older woman which makes [TS]

00:45:39   the pie for she's womanhood and all its [TS]

00:45:42   different phases yeah and and all those [TS]

00:45:45   people are you know you could say their [TS]

00:45:48   stereotypes that they're in there in the [TS]

00:45:49   typical stages of life we see a woman [TS]

00:45:52   young kid teenager and older woman a [TS]

00:45:54   pregnant woman and her childbearing [TS]

00:45:55   years up but that's not the story is [TS]

00:45:58   about and she is not limited by those [TS]

00:46:00   things and it doesn't culminate in her [TS]

00:46:01   getting married and the the relationship [TS]

00:46:03   is the same way it is when you have a [TS]

00:46:05   twelve-year-old like your life doesn't [TS]

00:46:06   culminating you finally holding hands [TS]

00:46:08   with that boy is just one of the things [TS]

00:46:10   out here but that it's just I like the [TS]

00:46:13   fact that acknowledges all that instead [TS]

00:46:15   of simply saying uh it's an amazing [TS]

00:46:19   prints hero but i doubt it she's got [TS]

00:46:21   long hair and so she's a girl and so [TS]

00:46:23   look at this is that we don't we don't [TS]

00:46:25   fall into those gender stereotypes at [TS]

00:46:26   all and that is very difficult to do I [TS]

00:46:29   think I like that I like that in key the [TS]

00:46:31   the boy is there like you said whoo-whoo [TS]

00:46:34   he he kinda likes her and you know she's [TS]

00:46:36   sort of too busy but he's a friend but [TS]

00:46:39   it's just not the point right i mean [TS]

00:46:41   it's there it's just not it's just [TS]

00:46:44   another pointless and she is like [TS]

00:46:45   slightly she's she likes the boy wants [TS]

00:46:48   to have a relationship with a little bit [TS]

00:46:49   feel self-doubt like [TS]

00:46:50   the boy is used as a part as I think it [TS]

00:46:52   is in real life where the kids that age [TS]

00:46:54   are so self-absorbed that these [TS]

00:46:57   relationships type things are really [TS]

00:46:59   just ways for you to grow as a person [TS]

00:47:01   and to figure out how all this stuff [TS]

00:47:02   works and it's not so much about the [TS]

00:47:04   other person so she she feels self-doubt [TS]

00:47:06   and and the rich friends that he has and [TS]

00:47:08   she's not comfortable that situation and [TS]

00:47:09   she you know is depressed about it and [TS]

00:47:11   just dump doesn't have anything to do [TS]

00:47:12   with him and gets into self-loathing [TS]

00:47:14   right but she doesn't want him to die by [TS]

00:47:16   being dropped from a blimp yeah and like [TS]

00:47:18   all of it is about how she grows and you [TS]

00:47:20   kind of feel bad for Tom but because you [TS]

00:47:22   know he's times he's you know he's in [TS]

00:47:24   the picture and she has deep feelings [TS]

00:47:25   surrounding him but she really feeling [TS]

00:47:28   or tambo doesn't you know at that age [TS]

00:47:30   it's really all about you yourself [TS]

00:47:31   growing not so much about the other [TS]

00:47:33   person I I think miyazaki does a it talk [TS]

00:47:37   about expert levels like that the [TS]

00:47:38   masterclass how to do on how to do [TS]

00:47:41   female protagonists indeed in the most [TS]

00:47:44   interesting way possible and I think [TS]

00:47:47   miyazaki also to be fair for his entire [TS]

00:47:48   work does all the other levels till he's [TS]

00:47:51   got the stereotypical females who are [TS]

00:47:52   like the princess you do nothing like an [TS]

00:47:54   and castle in the sky you know [TS]

00:47:56   oh yeah and he's got the like nas ago [TS]

00:47:59   who is much more in the vein of what [TS]

00:48:01   there's a little bit of gender roles [TS]

00:48:02   there and how she's treated by the [TS]

00:48:03   village but she's very much a similar to [TS]

00:48:06   a prince here or you could swap her out [TS]

00:48:07   with the with a male and half the movie [TS]

00:48:10   works and the only one-half you need to [TS]

00:48:12   change all of the key who I think is the [TS]

00:48:15   complete you know that the best move you [TS]

00:48:17   look for little girls ever seen in my [TS]

00:48:19   entire life because it shows everything [TS]

00:48:21   that you're going to be beset by and [TS]

00:48:23   shows how you how that doesn't have to [TS]

00:48:25   define your limit you in any way and how [TS]

00:48:27   you can deal with it and overcome it and [TS]

00:48:30   a movie like like totoro I mean the main [TS]

00:48:34   characters are our little girls and [TS]

00:48:36   there's a boy around two and you know it [TS]

00:48:40   doesn't matter that they're just they [TS]

00:48:41   happen to be girls and it's just not a [TS]

00:48:42   big deal and they're not they're not [TS]

00:48:44   princesses but they do have their [TS]

00:48:45   magical you know adventure and it just [TS]

00:48:47   doesn't matter and the act like little [TS]

00:48:49   they actually leaving them on the Attic [TS]

00:48:51   stereotypical little girls that's what [TS]

00:48:52   about what's great about is you don't [TS]

00:48:53   want to make the girls who like girly [TS]

00:48:55   things feel like that is if I like girly [TS]

00:49:00   things I'm somehow failure as a woman [TS]

00:49:01   because I should be more manly and like [TS]

00:49:03   manly [TS]

00:49:03   things and be like the prince in this [TS]

00:49:05   story like it's ok to do all the things [TS]

00:49:08   that the girl stereotypically like but [TS]

00:49:10   you don't you also don't have to accept [TS]

00:49:12   the other oppressions that seem to come [TS]

00:49:13   with gender roles in society so that the [TS]

00:49:16   girls in miyazaki movies are girly much [TS]

00:49:18   of the time but like that's okay they [TS]

00:49:21   still are resourceful and heroic and [TS]

00:49:24   have have feelings and you know [TS]

00:49:27   relationships and stuff in ways that's [TS]

00:49:29   interesting and not limiting and never [TS]

00:49:32   never need to be saved by a man or need [TS]

00:49:35   to get married at the end of the movie [TS]

00:49:36   or anything like that [TS]

00:49:37   can you tell we have daughters and Dan [TS]

00:49:38   4x has his daughters to sew and i am [TS]

00:49:42   currently writing down a list of [TS]

00:49:43   miyazaki films that to put on my haha [TS]

00:49:46   lucky if you haven't shown tricky and [TS]

00:49:49   totoro to your your kids they're totally [TS]

00:49:51   safe for little kids to and are our [TS]

00:49:53   amazing amazing castle is pretty good [TS]

00:49:56   too although it has some scary points [TS]

00:49:58   yeah I didn't really like that one but [TS]

00:50:00   but yeah I mean yeah start with Kiki [TS]

00:50:03   totoro and go from there [TS]

00:50:05   bonito is really weird to really weird [TS]

00:50:08   but we did a whole podcast miyazaki i [TS]

00:50:11   like most of the really really good [TS]

00:50:14   storytellers out there [TS]

00:50:15   his point is to tell a good fictional [TS]

00:50:19   tale and you know pull people in and he [TS]

00:50:23   just happens to use female protagonist [TS]

00:50:24   to do that and do it well but it's not [TS]

00:50:28   you know he doesn't go into it or at [TS]

00:50:30   least it doesn't feel like to me he goes [TS]

00:50:32   into it saying i need two female [TS]

00:50:35   characters and one male character and i [TS]

00:50:38   will balance this out you know his [TS]

00:50:42   ratios are pretty even like in the [TS]

00:50:43   movies even if it is a female lead this [TS]

00:50:45   the expected number of males and females [TS]

00:50:48   and also doing things that you would [TS]

00:50:50   expect males and females to do it's not [TS]

00:50:52   like one half of a lot of the movies [TS]

00:50:53   they just cut out one half of the gender [TS]

00:50:55   oh this is a girl's movie so we're going [TS]

00:50:56   to show us the moms and the daughters [TS]

00:50:57   and my dad will come in for two scenes [TS]

00:50:59   they don't even exist in the reverse if [TS]

00:51:01   it's an action movie you know the [TS]

00:51:02   females are just there to be love [TS]

00:51:04   interest in distress and everything else [TS]

00:51:05   is about the guys fighting right it's [TS]

00:51:07   like half of the world is invisible to [TS]

00:51:08   you and they just decided to focus on [TS]

00:51:10   better movies show males and females in [TS]

00:51:13   the expected ratios doing the expected [TS]

00:51:15   things and then [TS]

00:51:17   no whoever your main character is fine [TS]

00:51:18   but they inhabit a world that is [TS]

00:51:20   balanced in that way and and fits with [TS]

00:51:23   whatever time it's done if it's if it's [TS]

00:51:24   a Victorian thing and women are like [TS]

00:51:26   even more massively depressed than now [TS]

00:51:28   that's what they show you know you don't [TS]

00:51:30   don't make it look like that's not the [TS]

00:51:31   case and say well I want I want to have [TS]

00:51:33   a strong female character so i'm going [TS]

00:51:34   to pretend that you know the female [TS]

00:51:36   there's a female president and you know [TS]

00:51:38   1886 or something is well but you can [TS]

00:51:42   still write a female a strong female [TS]

00:51:43   character and 1886 you just have to take [TS]

00:51:46   a different tack from it [TS]

00:51:47   yeah because the world she's in is very [TS]

00:51:49   is different like you can't you you can [TS]

00:51:50   have the characters change but you can't [TS]

00:51:53   change the environment like when you're [TS]

00:51:54   making completely fictional environment [TS]

00:51:56   you can choose what it's like obviously [TS]

00:51:57   whatever century and Scotland that you [TS]

00:51:59   have you have certain expectations that [TS]

00:52:01   you have to deal with but if you're [TS]

00:52:02   completely making a fictional more like [TS]

00:52:03   a nozzle you can make that b2b however [TS]

00:52:06   you want and that can be an interesting [TS]

00:52:07   way to defy expectations or say that you [TS]

00:52:09   know even thousands of years in the [TS]

00:52:11   future [TS]

00:52:12   we've reverted to monarchy and typical [TS]

00:52:14   gender roles but that still doesn't [TS]

00:52:16   limit this one princess for you know [TS]

00:52:18   she's very very unlike princess you [TS]

00:52:20   would expect [TS]

00:52:21   absolutely so I can't go past through [TS]

00:52:26   this podcast without bringing up legend [TS]

00:52:29   of korra which aired recently and is a [TS]

00:52:32   animated show on Nickelodeon that is the [TS]

00:52:36   sequel to a it's an anime show but it's [TS]

00:52:40   an American anime show or American [TS]

00:52:43   written and designed anime show that's [TS]

00:52:45   produced in south korea but shown on an [TS]

00:52:47   American work it's very it's a little [TS]

00:52:51   roundabout but um avatar the original [TS]

00:52:54   series ran for I think 40 episodes was [TS]

00:52:57   fantastic and had some great female [TS]

00:52:59   characters and why didn't my yeah [TS]

00:53:01   there's there's a great female character [TS]

00:53:04   a couple of great female characters in [TS]

00:53:06   the original avatar and now the sequel [TS]

00:53:08   which started airing this year legend of [TS]

00:53:10   korra has a female protagonist who [TS]

00:53:13   besides being an excellently written [TS]

00:53:16   character I one of the things that [TS]

00:53:19   people keep calling out and really that [TS]

00:53:21   comes to mind when i watch it is you [TS]

00:53:23   never hear supporting characters in that [TS]

00:53:26   show describing Korra as oh you're so [TS]

00:53:29   pretty i want to [TS]

00:53:30   no hang out with you it's always wow [TS]

00:53:32   you're an amazing bender [TS]

00:53:35   wow you do all these cool things wow [TS]

00:53:38   you're so strong and she's not drawn [TS]

00:53:41   like if you traditional feel what you [TS]

00:53:43   would think of a traditional female [TS]

00:53:45   protagonist where she's basically a [TS]

00:53:47   powerful character in this world and can [TS]

00:53:50   do magic type things that they call [TS]

00:53:53   bending in the universe and she's drawn [TS]

00:53:57   buff she's drawn like she's been lifting [TS]

00:53:59   weights since she was four and they [TS]

00:54:02   comment on that always in a positive [TS]

00:54:04   aspect which I find really really [TS]

00:54:07   fantastic my son was angry for halloween [TS]

00:54:10   Lester yes I that's that's a great a [TS]

00:54:15   really really great show i watched it on [TS]

00:54:18   the original avatar when I was sick a [TS]

00:54:20   couple years ago when absolutely fell in [TS]

00:54:22   love with it like it is a kids show and [TS]

00:54:24   it is kids friendly but it is written [TS]

00:54:26   with such care to the universe and [TS]

00:54:30   towards the characters that it's [TS]

00:54:33   absolutely like I i put it up there is [TS]

00:54:36   like a really fantastic television show [TS]

00:54:38   de to go and watch it introduced my kids [TS]

00:54:40   to the idea of serialize storytelling to [TS]

00:54:42   that it's the story isn't over that what [TS]

00:54:46   there is in the next episode the story [TS]

00:54:48   continues what would it would it would a [TS]

00:54:49   second i wanna know what happened that's [TS]

00:54:51   a cliffhanger son that's called a [TS]

00:54:52   cliffhanger get used to integrating [TS]

00:54:54   early it's got to be done [TS]

00:54:56   it's got to be done so at but I I random [TS]

00:54:58   with you with you about something you [TS]

00:55:00   said earlier which is it would be nice [TS]

00:55:02   if we couldn't you we just didn't have [TS]

00:55:03   to talk about this but you know the fact [TS]

00:55:05   remains that it this is an ongoing issue [TS]

00:55:08   that it you know in popular [TS]

00:55:11   entertainment and as somebody who is a [TS]

00:55:15   up a parent of a of a daughter i I've [TS]

00:55:19   noticed it even more now than I did [TS]

00:55:21   before that I you know there's a lot of [TS]

00:55:24   popular entertainment out there that it [TS]

00:55:25   really seems to be that that it's got to [TS]

00:55:30   be about it's gonna be about male [TS]

00:55:31   characters because women will go see [TS]

00:55:33   movies about with male characters in the [TS]

00:55:35   lead but then we'll go see movies with [TS]

00:55:37   women in the lead which i think you know [TS]

00:55:39   keeps being proven isn't true but it [TS]

00:55:41   still happens and in [TS]

00:55:43   the kind of stuff that we like to talk [TS]

00:55:44   about on this podcast that's often the [TS]

00:55:48   case to right i mean there are there are [TS]

00:55:51   lots of great example to the contrary [TS]

00:55:52   which i think would you would think [TS]

00:55:54   would prove that that it shouldn't be [TS]

00:55:56   the case and yet nobody seems to pick up [TS]

00:55:58   on and he mentioned before we started [TS]

00:56:00   the fact that a alien and aliens that [TS]

00:56:03   are carried by i'm incredibly strong [TS]

00:56:06   woman character and that's an action [TS]

00:56:07   franchise and yet everybody seems [TS]

00:56:09   reluctant to and are supposedly making [TS]

00:56:13   huge risks taking these risks by having [TS]

00:56:16   women characters leading movies which [TS]

00:56:18   seems insane to me [TS]

00:56:20   the problem here is that when you write [TS]

00:56:23   a really good female protagonist and you [TS]

00:56:25   tell a story that happens to have a [TS]

00:56:26   really good female protagonist then it's [TS]

00:56:29   looked at by the general public as a [TS]

00:56:30   good story and the only people who are [TS]

00:56:32   highlighting it as hey look it's it's [TS]

00:56:34   such a cool female protagonist you [TS]

00:56:36   should go look at that are generally [TS]

00:56:38   women because it's like oh hey look [TS]

00:56:43   finally a character that looks like us [TS]

00:56:45   and you know acts that that's that's [TS]

00:56:47   fantastic [TS]

00:56:48   I nice to finally see that but the rest [TS]

00:56:51   of the world doesn't really see oh this [TS]

00:56:54   is a movie about a woman there just oh [TS]

00:56:56   this is a really good story and this [TS]

00:56:59   badass you know woman happens to be [TS]

00:57:02   fighting off aliens you know you don't [TS]

00:57:05   you don't rest [TS]

00:57:06   you don't necessarily say just like you [TS]

00:57:08   don't necessarily say this is a film [TS]

00:57:10   with a male protagonist unless you are [TS]

00:57:12   in the you know film discussion you're [TS]

00:57:15   looking for good stories and bad stories [TS]

00:57:17   but yes female protagonists are so few [TS]

00:57:20   and far between because marketing [TS]

00:57:22   executives and you know the people [TS]

00:57:25   green-lighting these stories and people [TS]

00:57:27   writing these stories to put money you [TS]

00:57:29   know food on their table and money in [TS]

00:57:31   their bank accounts you know they write [TS]

00:57:33   what sells and unfortunately even [TS]

00:57:36   recently what sells either strong male [TS]

00:57:40   protagonists because that's the way it's [TS]

00:57:41   been since time immemorial or female [TS]

00:57:44   protagonists but the way we know that [TS]

00:57:47   they're you know good-hearted and [TS]

00:57:49   important is that all the other male [TS]

00:57:51   protagonist are all the other male [TS]

00:57:53   characters are like oh you're so pretty [TS]

00:57:55   oh your prince [TS]

00:57:56   yes oh that's why I care about you of [TS]

00:57:59   course yeah you know that you talked [TS]

00:58:01   about like how it would be nice if we [TS]

00:58:02   didn't have to [TS]

00:58:04   I if it wasn't such a big deal that was [TS]

00:58:06   female protagonist but it's the cause [TS]

00:58:09   and effect i think it is as always been [TS]

00:58:11   the other way is that there is [TS]

00:58:13   inequality in society and the art [TS]

00:58:16   reflects that that's just simply the way [TS]

00:58:17   it is and the reason it's an issue is [TS]

00:58:19   not because of the imbalance in movies [TS]

00:58:21   the imbalance and movies exists because [TS]

00:58:23   of the imbalances in society until and [TS]

00:58:25   those imbalances have been getting [TS]

00:58:26   better over time on the long graph but [TS]

00:58:29   they're still there and who knows how [TS]

00:58:30   long it'll be until they're entirely gun [TS]

00:58:32   I the art and the people who consume the [TS]

00:58:35   art reflect that because those those [TS]

00:58:37   inequalities existing society because [TS]

00:58:39   that's prevailing opinion in society and [TS]

00:58:41   if most people think that way for good [TS]

00:58:44   or for ill they seek out entertainment [TS]

00:58:46   that you know matches their [TS]

00:58:48   preconceptions and so then it is a story [TS]

00:58:51   when something goes against the the [TS]

00:58:54   expectations and the fact is that the [TS]

00:58:56   expectations are still skewed like [TS]

00:58:58   intellectually we can all say we we know [TS]

00:59:00   that things should not be this way but [TS]

00:59:02   the reality is you know I even in the [TS]

00:59:05   most modern society's gender roles and [TS]

00:59:08   oppression of women still exists for the [TS]

00:59:10   same crazy reasons they've existed for [TS]

00:59:11   you know for millennia and I i think you [TS]

00:59:16   know like changing the movies is not [TS]

00:59:18   going to change that part is going to [TS]

00:59:19   come in the other direction like as it [TS]

00:59:21   becomes as certain things become beyond [TS]

00:59:22   the pale and real society then those [TS]

00:59:24   things aren't shown in movies anymore [TS]

00:59:26   and that that's the way movies will [TS]

00:59:28   change if you want it to ever be the [TS]

00:59:29   point where is not a big deal to have a [TS]

00:59:31   female protagonist artist can make that [TS]

00:59:33   happen they can help they can help by [TS]

00:59:34   having great movies but what they're [TS]

00:59:36   helping by as influencing society then [TS]

00:59:38   we'll feed back into the art so it's [TS]

00:59:39   kind of I sometimes I feel like the the [TS]

00:59:42   artist get a bad rap for for that or it [TS]

00:59:46   seems like things are the way they are [TS]

00:59:48   because the artist being made that way [TS]

00:59:49   when I think it's definitely very [TS]

00:59:51   heavily the other direction society [TS]

00:59:53   produces the art I don't believe the [TS]

00:59:55   article in the studio i believe the [TS]

00:59:56   money people for being you're being [TS]

00:59:58   cowards and so yeah [TS]

00:59:58   cowards and so yeah [TS]

01:00:00   and for m4 you know being well I mean [TS]

01:00:03   cowards but superstitious to the the [TS]

01:00:06   idea that I'd say that there's lots of [TS]

01:00:08   evidence that it's not true and yet they [TS]

01:00:10   keep doing it which makes me wonder if [TS]

01:00:12   our the being truly superstitious [TS]

01:00:13   cowards or they just saying you know [TS]

01:00:16   it's easier to be to to be sexist if [TS]

01:00:20   it's not worry about it [TS]

01:00:21   the idvr I don't think it's the artist [TS]

01:00:23   if they do make a movie that I mean you [TS]

01:00:25   can go against the expectations and [TS]

01:00:27   stereotypes that exist in society with [TS]

01:00:29   certain degree but once you cross a [TS]

01:00:30   certain line then the story becomes 0 an [TS]

01:00:33   action movie with a female John McClane [TS]

01:00:35   are we right like that's the stupid [TS]

01:00:37   evening news story like once you cross [TS]

01:00:38   that line that becomes the story and [TS]

01:00:40   that's what these executives are on fear [TS]

01:00:41   of that their movie crosses over in a [TS]

01:00:43   bad way into people aren't talking about [TS]

01:00:45   my movie anymore they're talking about [TS]

01:00:47   the fact that my movie is it really goes [TS]

01:00:50   against what they expect from whatever [TS]

01:00:51   you know [TS]

01:00:52   yeah right you have the expected gender [TS]

01:00:53   roles and it's it's kind of amazing to [TS]

01:00:55   me that you know and dimension aliens [TS]

01:00:56   earlier that that totally has not [TS]

01:00:58   happened with alien or aliens aliens [TS]

01:01:01   didn't have but i think because people [TS]

01:01:03   were accustomed to horror movies having [TS]

01:01:04   female leads because they're supposed to [TS]

01:01:06   be in peril and they just stuck with a [TS]

01:01:07   sneaky one by their own she's not really [TS]

01:01:09   quite in parallel and she kind of is but [TS]

01:01:11   she's the one alive at the end right and [TS]

01:01:13   then aliens if you ask a guy about that [TS]

01:01:15   movie like oh yeah a Space Ranger [TS]

01:01:17   shooting areas like you do realize that [TS]

01:01:19   the main character member with a female [TS]

01:01:20   and she was the one who fights the big [TS]

01:01:22   giant alien in the end in the you know [TS]

01:01:24   with say it saves the girl and has the [TS]

01:01:26   big gun and you know it just kind of [TS]

01:01:28   like I don't care man it was awesome [TS]

01:01:29   like nobody cares and like that movie [TS]

01:01:31   didn't get be the blowback but if you [TS]

01:01:33   tried to do basically like a movie that [TS]

01:01:35   was like die hard but you had a female [TS]

01:01:36   lead that would become the story and [TS]

01:01:39   that can be good for the studio but can [TS]

01:01:41   also be bad and that's why they freaked [TS]

01:01:43   out about somebody the chairman [TS]

01:01:44   mentioned salt earlier I mean that's [TS]

01:01:45   actually a movie that's a little bit [TS]

01:01:46   like diehard cross with no way out and [TS]

01:01:48   that's a angelina jolie and you're gonna [TS]

01:01:51   pick your battery type define woman [TS]

01:01:54   maybe don't take Anjali Anjali that's [TS]

01:01:56   almost exactly the right but the case to [TS]

01:01:58   make though that the way that movies get [TS]

01:01:59   made it's not about some screenwriter [TS]

01:02:02   who has an idea for one would be great [TS]

01:02:04   if we had a great have an action movie [TS]

01:02:06   without great female female hero the [TS]

01:02:08   center center of it [TS]

01:02:09   it all comes down to the same 20 a list [TS]

01:02:13   Drew's mattresses who can open a movie [TS]

01:02:15   meaning that if their names associated [TS]

01:02:17   with the project the money is gonna get [TS]

01:02:19   going to materialize they only like to [TS]

01:02:21   work with and a short list of a-list [TS]

01:02:23   directors so really comes down to [TS]

01:02:25   someone like Angelina Jolie saying i [TS]

01:02:27   want to make an action movie I want to [TS]

01:02:29   make a really great possibly franchise [TS]

01:02:31   launchings action series with a female [TS]

01:02:34   character it happens almost immediately [TS]

01:02:36   when again the a-list actress hooks up [TS]

01:02:38   with the a-list director and make it [TS]

01:02:40   happen unfortunately we get when you [TS]

01:02:42   don't need when you have a lack of [TS]

01:02:45   either one of those things you're trying [TS]

01:02:47   to raise a hundred million dollars on a [TS]

01:02:49   movie that doesn't have a guaranteed [TS]

01:02:51   return of investment at the end of the [TS]

01:02:54   end of that guarantees of that are [TS]

01:02:55   non-existent in the movie industry but [TS]

01:02:58   in terms of what will attract investment [TS]

01:03:00   it's really do need those to a list [TS]

01:03:03   names to make it happen so it's I think [TS]

01:03:05   it's less ok so is the audience ready [TS]

01:03:07   for it as much as it is a case of how [TS]

01:03:09   rare is it that you get a lot of an [TS]

01:03:13   actress actually reaches that level in [TS]

01:03:16   which they can actually command that [TS]

01:03:17   movie be made it happens so rarely and [TS]

01:03:20   when that happens i don't i'm not sure [TS]

01:03:21   that most of these actresses are [TS]

01:03:24   interested in making those kind of [TS]

01:03:25   movies will start to turn are really [TS]

01:03:27   quickly once we have more angelina [TS]

01:03:28   jolie's out there is the Meryl Streep [TS]

01:03:30   action movie [TS]

01:03:31   I demand it okay well first of all she [TS]

01:03:34   really kicked butt on that white water [TS]

01:03:36   rafting movie i met that is that is an [TS]

01:03:39   indication towards her versatility [TS]

01:03:40   mortal to the market or anything like [TS]

01:03:42   that anything like that but it's still a [TS]

01:03:44   data point that like rendered into the [TS]

01:03:45   Russians could really wield a knife in [TS]

01:03:48   julie and julia so you go if you're in [TS]

01:03:51   an onion stay the hell away from Meryl [TS]

01:03:53   Streep because you're i'm here to chop [TS]

01:03:56   onions and chaos upon you that there's [TS]

01:04:00   that scene in The Iron Lady where she [TS]

01:04:01   threatens to stab ronald reagan so that [TS]

01:04:05   i don't know the old the lead point that [TS]

01:04:09   I wanted the that I want to make on top [TS]

01:04:11   of we're also has been said is that [TS]

01:04:13   there's also a responsibility to if [TS]

01:04:16   you're going to do with female action [TS]

01:04:18   hero at a female action character like [TS]

01:04:21   this you really have to give that [TS]

01:04:23   character the same level of respect that [TS]

01:04:26   you would get [TS]

01:04:27   move to a male action action hero and [TS]

01:04:29   this is one that came up were talking [TS]

01:04:30   about the avengers movie where the [TS]

01:04:33   reasons why Ellen Ripley is such a great [TS]

01:04:35   characters because she is imperfect [TS]

01:04:38   she's not a super woman she you know if [TS]

01:04:40   you hit her she bleeds and she stumbles [TS]

01:04:42   and she gets scared and she there's no [TS]

01:04:44   way in hell that she's gonna go back to [TS]

01:04:46   that planet and festive aliens cause she [TS]

01:04:48   barely got a lot out why the first time [TS]

01:04:50   Indiana Jones has exactly the same [TS]

01:04:53   reason the same kind of character the [TS]

01:04:55   qualities she did he doesn't go into a [TS]

01:04:57   situation being the absolute Lord master [TS]

01:04:59   of all time space knowledge in reality [TS]

01:05:01   he goes and he makes up the plan as he [TS]

01:05:04   goes along he gets punched a lot he [TS]

01:05:06   bleeds a lot [TS]

01:05:07   he get comes he comes through in the end [TS]

01:05:08   but not after having proven that he [TS]

01:05:11   really does have a lot of sangria and [TS]

01:05:12   metal about him [TS]

01:05:13   the problem that I've seen with a lot of [TS]

01:05:15   times especially when there's like a [TS]

01:05:17   large cast characters is that I think [TS]

01:05:19   the producers the writers are terrified [TS]

01:05:21   of having a fear of being accused of [TS]

01:05:24   saying all course of course sick and [TS]

01:05:26   have this kind of female character who [TS]

01:05:28   did it wasn't picking up taking hostages [TS]

01:05:30   some Pointer has this has to be helped [TS]

01:05:32   by somebody well let's have that so [TS]

01:05:33   that's what proves that a hero is a hero [TS]

01:05:35   the fact that they are knocked down but [TS]

01:05:37   then they get back up again and this is [TS]

01:05:39   the reason why i didn't like black widow [TS]

01:05:40   the avengers because it was exactly that [TS]

01:05:42   problem where she's never asked there's [TS]

01:05:45   never a situation which it is not in [TS]

01:05:47   complete command of the situation she [TS]

01:05:48   never gets heard she never knows Jesus [TS]

01:05:51   do that right a loss for exactly what to [TS]

01:05:53   do that makes her boring character we [TS]

01:05:55   need more Ellen Ripley zup she feels [TS]

01:05:56   like a token to me that's my problem [TS]

01:05:58   with that too it's like well we need a [TS]

01:05:59   female character so we'll insert one and [TS]

01:06:01   she's not that important but will insert [TS]

01:06:02   it but we're not here to talk about the [TS]

01:06:03   avengers 2 good that you're right you're [TS]

01:06:07   right i could like I conclusively proved [TS]

01:06:10   the point about that movie when I spoke [TS]

01:06:11   better with its Abbi this is your fourth [TS]

01:06:13   podcast about the event i'll just make [TS]

01:06:15   people sad by talking about it again [TS]

01:06:16   because they don't have to admit how [TS]

01:06:18   right I am I was bad girl in the dark [TS]

01:06:21   knight series by the way John in your [TS]

01:06:25   hypercritical podcast about pixar more [TS]

01:06:27   than are uncomfortable podcast about it [TS]

01:06:30   you talked about pixar taking risks and [TS]

01:06:34   where could how could pixar push [TS]

01:06:36   themselves more and the very nice BDSM [TS]

01:06:39   in the [TS]

01:06:40   room has asked me to ask you does brave [TS]

01:06:44   fulfill your wish of pics are pushing [TS]

01:06:46   itself and taking a big risk with a [TS]

01:06:49   movie and getting out of its comfort [TS]

01:06:50   zone I lesson that episode that the [TS]

01:06:52   kinds of risks that I was suggesting [TS]

01:06:55   because I didn't want to give some kind [TS]

01:06:56   of examples were much more ambitious and [TS]

01:06:59   mainly I focus on things like what is [TS]

01:07:02   pixar at that point pics are done you [TS]

01:07:03   know hit movie after movie I don't think [TS]

01:07:05   our students even out yet at least I [TS]

01:07:06   haven't seen it and they had the string [TS]

01:07:08   of successes and it was clear what they [TS]

01:07:09   could do they could make a great [TS]

01:07:11   family-friendly heartwarming engaging [TS]

01:07:15   movie that's appropriate for children [TS]

01:07:18   but they're also was entertaining to [TS]

01:07:20   adults and they just did that so well [TS]

01:07:21   right and not i'm not saying that's [TS]

01:07:23   easier anything but but what I wanted to [TS]

01:07:25   see them challenge themselves on is ken [TS]

01:07:27   pixar move out of that comfort zone [TS]

01:07:29   because I felt like there was a risk of [TS]

01:07:31   them sort of going into a rut and kind [TS]

01:07:33   of making the same over and over again [TS]

01:07:34   but my suggestion for like make a rated [TS]

01:07:36   r movie make a movie with intentionally [TS]

01:07:39   photorealistic humans doing things you [TS]

01:07:41   see someone doing an HBO show or make a [TS]

01:07:44   movie with no living things and just [TS]

01:07:45   entirely robots early you know like [TS]

01:07:47   really like adult entertainment adults [TS]

01:07:50   only entertainment really pushing the [TS]

01:07:52   boundaries of what's possible with [TS]

01:07:54   animation so I was expecting you know I [TS]

01:07:55   I was suggesting do something super [TS]

01:07:58   ambitious and that was kind of in the [TS]

01:07:59   service of that sort of hyperbole was in [TS]

01:08:01   the service of the idea that I was [TS]

01:08:03   challenging pixar to say that you're all [TS]

01:08:05   big miyazaki fans and Miyazaki's had [TS]

01:08:07   some stinkers and some weird movies but [TS]

01:08:09   I think Miyazaki's highs are greater [TS]

01:08:11   than pixar size because pixar was kind [TS]

01:08:13   of falling into a comfort zone and not [TS]

01:08:16   didn't seem well it was a picture would [TS]

01:08:18   make great movies but was never going to [TS]

01:08:20   make a transcendent movie unless it was [TS]

01:08:22   willing to make stickers and so I wanted [TS]

01:08:23   to see it take risks and fail and and [TS]

01:08:26   when they make cars 2 and people didn't [TS]

01:08:27   like people so is that what you wanted [TS]

01:08:29   not really because cars to didn't fail [TS]

01:08:31   because it was such a radical risk cars [TS]

01:08:32   to was right down the middle and it [TS]

01:08:34   wasn't a bad movie just wasn't as [TS]

01:08:36   amazing as the other ones but it didn't [TS]

01:08:37   fail because they took a crazy risk cars [TS]

01:08:39   2 is not any movie with the two and the [TS]

01:08:41   title is not a crazy risk right so brave [TS]

01:08:45   is moving in the right direction because [TS]

01:08:47   if they're gonna get them out of their [TS]

01:08:48   comfort zone clearly the comfort zone is [TS]

01:08:50   because his movies with male [TS]

01:08:51   protagonists right [TS]

01:08:52   I guess Wally's a male and as far as [TS]

01:08:56   robots can be anyway and so this is [TS]

01:08:59   moving in the right direction but it's [TS]

01:09:01   still very far from let's take a crazy [TS]

01:09:04   risk let's make movies for it maybe it [TS]

01:09:05   maybe something I never want to do maybe [TS]

01:09:06   that's not the company they are i'm not [TS]

01:09:08   saying you have to make rated R movies [TS]

01:09:10   are your failure or something like that [TS]

01:09:11   it's just like I want biggest miyazaki [TS]

01:09:14   doesn't make you know where many movies [TS]

01:09:16   for Delta grave of the fireflies which [TS]

01:09:17   is now involved in is arguably only in [TS]

01:09:21   tulsa movie really but you know baby [TS]

01:09:25   steps you're brave [TS]

01:09:26   let's take them out of the comfort zone [TS]

01:09:27   a little bit challenged them to do [TS]

01:09:29   something they haven't done before and [TS]

01:09:31   make a different kind of movie and I [TS]

01:09:33   think in my thinking back on pixar [TS]

01:09:35   movies brave stands apart and not not [TS]

01:09:38   because of the female protagonist which [TS]

01:09:39   is it just feels different to me then [TS]

01:09:42   there are other movies is it feel that [TS]

01:09:43   way to you it feels not like less of a [TS]

01:09:45   kids movie but it feels different [TS]

01:09:47   like in my mind the shape of it and had [TS]

01:09:49   nothing to do with the lead just the [TS]

01:09:51   shape of the story [TS]

01:09:52   well it is a fairy tale in the true [TS]

01:09:54   sense of the word [TS]

01:09:55   yeah we're not gonna rely on fantastic [TS]

01:09:58   scenes and incredible special effects it [TS]

01:10:00   really is going to be about these very [TS]

01:10:03   very real human characters even when the [TS]

01:10:05   humans are not looking very human during [TS]

01:10:07   the third movie and there's those those [TS]

01:10:09   magical elements are there but it's like [TS]

01:10:10   the weird that they're there so tamped [TS]

01:10:12   down like they felt the need to have [TS]

01:10:14   animal transformation which some nights [TS]

01:10:17   and castles and stuff it is an animated [TS]

01:10:20   movie and I I really do believe that [TS]

01:10:22   every hand in that picture went up and [TS]

01:10:24   say can we do what would she like to get [TS]

01:10:27   she gets her head stuck in a jar and [TS]

01:10:29   then she has to pull the jar off and [TS]

01:10:31   then she gets the jar off her head [TS]

01:10:32   there's like lemons all over her face at [TS]

01:10:35   the time i'm sure that the as much as [TS]

01:10:38   much as I said that maybe just maybe [TS]

01:10:39   they could have done a different version [TS]

01:10:41   of this in which the between just like [TS]

01:10:42   eat some bad dates or something you know [TS]

01:10:44   it's much funnier to have returned much [TS]

01:10:46   more funny much more visual to have [TS]

01:10:48   turned into a giant pair i also wonder [TS]

01:10:50   if the I mean some of this is pics are [TS]

01:10:53   pushing itself and some of this is the [TS]

01:10:55   state of of the animation and computer [TS]

01:10:58   animation being what it is now that you [TS]

01:11:02   know then it used to be the pixar was [TS]

01:11:03   way out ahead of everybody and [TS]

01:11:06   not saying that you know the disney [TS]

01:11:08   internal animation studio or DreamWorks [TS]

01:11:10   or anybody else out there has surpassed [TS]

01:11:12   them not even close but I feel like it's [TS]

01:11:16   more of a it's more of a they've [TS]

01:11:19   established this field and it is [TS]

01:11:20   established and there are lots of [TS]

01:11:21   competitors out there working at a much [TS]

01:11:24   higher levels than they used to and I [TS]

01:11:27   wonder if that pushes picture to [TS]

01:11:29   differentiate themselves a little bit [TS]

01:11:32   more because they've kind of written a [TS]

01:11:34   playbook already and everybody else is [TS]

01:11:35   using it and they need to do some [TS]

01:11:37   different things to be different i also [TS]

01:11:39   wonder if it changed my expectations of [TS]

01:11:41   their movies because they're no longer [TS]

01:11:43   the only ones out there operating on [TS]

01:11:45   this level and it's them or nothing that [TS]

01:11:47   there's other the competition is greater [TS]

01:11:49   i guess and i wonder what that does to [TS]

01:11:51   their to their creative process I've [TS]

01:11:54   actually developed a pretty good respect [TS]

01:11:56   for some dreamworks movies at the shrek [TS]

01:11:59   movies are pretty much okay given [TS]

01:12:00   community that's that's exactly [TS]

01:12:02   everybody well said but it's my legacy [TS]

01:12:05   yeah but you know I i have HBO and then [TS]

01:12:09   so that's how i got that's how IC just [TS]

01:12:11   saw despicable me for the first time [TS]

01:12:12   could actually very that's a very good [TS]

01:12:14   news is good [TS]

01:12:15   how to train your dragon also very good [TS]

01:12:17   moving mine and I'm gonna rant about [TS]

01:12:19   megamind it's great [TS]

01:12:20   yep i love these little movies I like [TS]

01:12:23   and I think one of the reasons why movie [TS]

01:12:25   especially like this pickle may work so [TS]

01:12:27   well is that it's distinguished from a [TS]

01:12:29   Pixar movie you through you feel it [TS]

01:12:32   Pixar movies are great because they do [TS]

01:12:34   think about every single element and how [TS]

01:12:37   it locks into everything else and they [TS]

01:12:39   just hammer at that script in that story [TS]

01:12:42   until beat for beat for beat there is [TS]

01:12:44   with rare exceptions not a single wasted [TS]

01:12:47   moment not a single wasted page in that [TS]

01:12:49   screenplay but you do see like how badly [TS]

01:12:53   did you do see how much work went into [TS]

01:12:55   it with a movie like despicable me feel [TS]

01:12:57   as though they get it they give they [TS]

01:12:59   found the studio in in France they said [TS]

01:13:01   here's the DreamWorks logo [TS]

01:13:03   here's a hundred thirty million dollars [TS]

01:13:04   come back with a movie into here's the [TS]

01:13:06   property come back to the movie and six [TS]

01:13:07   months because the minions are equal [TS]

01:13:10   just as funny as the funniest thing [TS]

01:13:11   that's ever been in a Pixar movie [TS]

01:13:13   yeah no other there the equivalent of [TS]

01:13:15   the little aliens and toy story the [TS]

01:13:17   upcoming movie wreck-it Ralph I think [TS]

01:13:19   that's [TS]

01:13:19   from disney proper not be as our that [TS]

01:13:22   that looks like something my tactic my [TS]

01:13:24   expect pics started it does [TS]

01:13:26   behind-the-scenes video games feels like [TS]

01:13:28   a movie that escaped from Pixar and went [TS]

01:13:30   to decide I I don't know because I see I [TS]

01:13:33   I worry from the trip was just from the [TS]

01:13:35   trailer that so much of this is just [TS]

01:13:39   people and they're likely twenties early [TS]

01:13:42   thirties and forties like whoa Qbert we [TS]

01:13:45   can have Cuban ok there's a great scene [TS]

01:13:46   zaxxon I will fight to the death to put [TS]

01:13:49   Zacks on this team and it I I just what [TS]

01:13:53   I i really want to see it like opening [TS]

01:13:54   week just to hear like the noisiest [TS]

01:13:56   theater ever of like all these like 30 [TS]

01:13:59   and four-year-olds that cooks other kids [TS]

01:14:01   ok the first of all the reason why he's [TS]

01:14:02   holding that cherry use game called [TS]

01:14:05   pacman my I guess I'm not pacman but [TS]

01:14:08   they don't get the q / thing and all and [TS]

01:14:10   that makes me wonder I with you I do [TS]

01:14:12   wonder if it's gonna be like ready [TS]

01:14:13   player one and be yeah I just horribly [TS]

01:14:16   pandering to people like me but again I [TS]

01:14:18   I don't mind being pandered to every now [TS]

01:14:21   and then [TS]

01:14:22   well the question is whether or not they [TS]

01:14:23   can still tell the story while working [TS]

01:14:25   in all these references like if you come [TS]

01:14:27   to it as a seven or eight year old kid [TS]

01:14:29   which they are presumably expecting kids [TS]

01:14:31   to do will you be able to understand it [TS]

01:14:34   right I'll let my kids thought the [TS]

01:14:36   trailer was cool [TS]

01:14:37   they thought it looked cool they thought [TS]

01:14:39   it was funny that they know that there [TS]

01:14:40   are different kinds of video games even [TS]

01:14:42   if they don't know a lot of the details [TS]

01:14:43   that truth in the fact that you've got [TS]

01:14:45   your that mean they have a wii and they [TS]

01:14:47   have and they have a an iphone and [TS]

01:14:49   you're an ipod touch and ipad and and if [TS]

01:14:52   they've seen these different games in [TS]

01:14:53   these different levels you know of [TS]

01:14:55   quality and so they kind of get like oh [TS]

01:14:57   that's like a fighting game and now you [TS]

01:14:59   know this is this is like a mario game [TS]

01:15:01   and no there's a pacman thing and [TS]

01:15:03   they've actually you know so it may work [TS]

01:15:05   on on that level 2 but it does it did [TS]

01:15:08   say that vibe but the kind of pics are [TS]

01:15:10   but we're going to take all this stuff [TS]

01:15:11   and I'm looking forward to that movie a [TS]

01:15:14   lot i'm very excited about that but [TS]

01:15:16   let's think of it this way in terms of [TS]

01:15:17   pandering and like that the fear because [TS]

01:15:19   we've always seen the trailer right so [TS]

01:15:21   we don't know it's gonna be like toy [TS]

01:15:23   story was a hundred percent [TS]

01:15:25   hey kids of baby boomers or similar age [TS]

01:15:28   or baby will result remember the toys [TS]

01:15:30   that you play with the kids remember [TS]

01:15:32   army men remember like never like [TS]

01:15:34   they're always exactly it was and you [TS]

01:15:36   could say all that toy story movies just [TS]

01:15:38   going to be at first of all blatant a [TS]

01:15:40   play to try to sell toys in the actual [TS]

01:15:43   store which it did tons of and second of [TS]

01:15:45   all it's just gonna be a bunch of people [TS]

01:15:47   going i had the barrel of monkeys oh and [TS]

01:15:49   just get show you know I but on top of [TS]

01:15:52   that toy store was also a good movie so [TS]

01:15:54   I run record Ralph like we have a [TS]

01:15:56   prototype for a movie that just totally [TS]

01:15:58   appears to be pandering and pop-culture [TS]

01:16:00   references and it can also be a good [TS]

01:16:01   movie so I think that's what we're all [TS]

01:16:02   hoping for wreck-it Ralph but from the [TS]

01:16:04   trailer is just too hard to tell and i [TS]

01:16:06   don't i don't have any I don't know [TS]

01:16:08   who's on that project and all I know [TS]

01:16:09   it's like it's disney animation i could [TS]

01:16:11   tangled was tangled dreams works for [TS]

01:16:13   disney animation was that list is nice [TS]

01:16:16   to have this yes i love this some [TS]

01:16:18   predatory 44 like what what does disney [TS]

01:16:21   do outside of pixar with computer [TS]

01:16:23   animation i think how to train your [TS]

01:16:24   dragon is the best my understanding is [TS]

01:16:26   the disney animation now is essentially [TS]

01:16:28   pixar 2 which is not to say that they [TS]

01:16:31   duplicated the culture but that it's [TS]

01:16:32   like they that Lassiter and cattle have [TS]

01:16:36   kind of put in place the same structures [TS]

01:16:38   of like creative structures and [TS]

01:16:40   processes that they did at Pixar accept [TS]

01:16:42   this is in la at Disney and they're not [TS]

01:16:44   and the rule i saw some interview with [TS]

01:16:46   them where they said the one rule is [TS]

01:16:47   that the people on the in one place [TS]

01:16:50   don't get to go help the people in the [TS]

01:16:51   other and rescue them that they have to [TS]

01:16:53   fix it themselves and but otherwise I [TS]

01:16:55   get the sense that they really kind of [TS]

01:16:56   said Pixar is a bottle that makes movies [TS]

01:16:58   up here and we made a new you know [TS]

01:17:00   bottle in LA [TS]

01:17:02   that makes movies and you know so that's [TS]

01:17:04   the test right is kinda pixar process [TS]

01:17:06   just be replicated in another place and [TS]

01:17:09   work and you know maybe so [TS]

01:17:11   yea trained how to train your dragon [TS]

01:17:13   dreamworks right yeah is that that has [TS]

01:17:17   impressed me the most out of a group of [TS]

01:17:18   trying someone trying to do pics are [TS]

01:17:20   because like it hydrating dragon-like it [TS]

01:17:22   pixar did it it would the animation will [TS]

01:17:25   be a little bit better the art would be [TS]

01:17:26   a little bit better but the story was [TS]

01:17:29   pretty darn solid and the movie over all [TS]

01:17:31   worked very well I thought so that that [TS]

01:17:33   impressed me and I think it was creative [TS]

01:17:35   creative in terms of the story and the [TS]

01:17:38   design of the characters in the dragons [TS]

01:17:41   and everything so that the the chris [TS]

01:17:44   sanders [TS]

01:17:45   Sandler's Sanders what the designers and [TS]

01:17:48   directors in that movie was a director [TS]

01:17:50   lilo and stitch which i think is one of [TS]

01:17:52   the best disney animated movies in the [TS]

01:17:54   past 40 years i right [TS]

01:17:56   traditionally animated last exactly that [TS]

01:18:01   I was just a point that we didn't see [TS]

01:18:03   follow-ups like that because I thought [TS]

01:18:05   that lilo and Stitch came out like after [TS]

01:18:07   the pixar revolution and I thought this [TS]

01:18:09   was a good indication that yeah I can't [TS]

01:18:11   imagine that I can't imagine that story [TS]

01:18:14   being told better in computer-generated [TS]

01:18:17   imagery than in hand drawn animation [TS]

01:18:18   enforces so well [TS]

01:18:20   lilo and Stitch followed by think home [TS]

01:18:23   on the range was the last of the old [TS]

01:18:26   guard disney animation and after that [TS]

01:18:28   they threw out all of the traditional [TS]

01:18:30   animation desks and they shut down that [TS]

01:18:32   division for two or three years until [TS]

01:18:35   last year possible merger and last [TS]

01:18:38   michael wiseman against us before oh [TS]

01:18:40   yeah we don't talk about my class but [TS]

01:18:44   yeah I mean last has been trying to do a [TS]

01:18:47   lot of good there and I mean tangled was [TS]

01:18:51   supposed to be 2d animation i forget why [TS]

01:18:53   they ended up changing it to 3d [TS]

01:18:56   animation but there are definitely still [TS]

01:18:58   2d projects being down there [TS]

01:19:00   yeah with what one more topic i really [TS]

01:19:04   want to throw out for four panel [TS]

01:19:06   discussion because though one disconnect [TS]

01:19:08   I've had with brave at all and this is [TS]

01:19:11   really going to the going to the corners [TS]

01:19:13   of the barrel look for something that I [TS]

01:19:14   don't that I have a problem with is that [TS]

01:19:16   now of course being a Disney property [TS]

01:19:18   they have 21 / in with like the disney [TS]

01:19:21   princesses ice show and the Disney [TS]

01:19:23   Princesses you know collection of soaps [TS]

01:19:25   and and Ben Ben makeup mirrors and [TS]

01:19:27   whatever they weren't they say so and I [TS]

01:19:29   can't think of any situation which [TS]

01:19:32   Meredith would hang out with any of [TS]

01:19:34   these ladies i do i just see her legs [TS]

01:19:37   just one empty the the tea party with [TS]

01:19:40   one empty chair always like where's Mara [TS]

01:19:42   oh she's out of the woods again [TS]

01:19:44   well well no the entrances Harriet so [TS]

01:19:46   why would they have that one there one [TS]

01:19:48   single friend of Mary we gotta find [TS]

01:19:50   somebody for your world was 14 [TS]

01:19:52   that's part of it but yeah little bit [TS]

01:19:55   young no I'm I again [TS]

01:19:58   disagree with the all the disney [TS]

01:20:01   princesses are you know airheads who [TS]

01:20:04   only want to get married but no but no [TS]

01:20:07   but that's the culmination of their [TS]

01:20:09   story arcs this time sometimes not at it [TS]

01:20:12   that way but as as somebody who grew up [TS]

01:20:14   in the disney princess Sarah very much [TS]

01:20:16   so and who like played the you know [TS]

01:20:20   played out the disney princess thing I [TS]

01:20:22   know I mean my sister and I worked very [TS]

01:20:26   hard to be like yeah like Jasmine from [TS]

01:20:29   Aladdin well she decides to go [TS]

01:20:31   undercover and she did you know goes and [TS]

01:20:33   runs around Agrabah I you know like she [TS]

01:20:35   puts on GI Joe's outfit but that's not [TS]

01:20:38   the second wave of Disney Princesses [TS]

01:20:40   though that that's no doubt that's the [TS]

01:20:42   modern conveniences wearing these waves [TS]

01:20:44   where they were where they did try to [TS]

01:20:46   give them all i remember when Beauty and [TS]

01:20:48   the Beast came out and it was like she [TS]

01:20:50   likes to read that was sit that was the [TS]

01:20:52   thing so radically likes to read your 3d [TS]

01:20:55   she looked out her nose at all that good [TS]

01:20:58   are good hard-working farm people who do [TS]

01:21:00   nothing but greater cheerily throughout [TS]

01:21:02   the day isn't that Jeremy well no but [TS]

01:21:04   that but they didn't in there's the the [TS]

01:21:06   guy was Gaston right he's he's this [TS]

01:21:09   strapping young prince type figure and [TS]

01:21:12   never all the girls love him and all but [TS]

01:21:14   not bail [TS]

01:21:15   she knows that he's shallow jerk right i [TS]

01:21:18   mean this was this was building the [TS]

01:21:20   pieces of the story I mean like when he [TS]

01:21:22   was playing as a kid she was playing the [TS]

01:21:23   aspects of the characters that appealed [TS]

01:21:25   to her but it doesn't feel like I'm not [TS]

01:21:26   saying you can't enjoy the characters [TS]

01:21:28   but doesn't change that in the actual [TS]

01:21:29   movies these characters appeared in [TS]

01:21:31   their story arcs culminated in the you [TS]

01:21:33   know marriage at the end of a romance [TS]

01:21:35   that the love stories a big part of the [TS]

01:21:37   movie and just like the sameness of like [TS]

01:21:39   every movie did they have to be [TS]

01:21:41   princesses they have to get rid of it [TS]

01:21:43   you have a Jonas well yeah they shove in [TS]

01:21:47   love stories in a lot of places where [TS]

01:21:49   there shouldn't be love stories but I [TS]

01:21:51   mean Beauty and the Beast is a great [TS]

01:21:52   film and i would argue you know it [TS]

01:21:55   doesn't diminish bells character that [TS]

01:21:57   she gets married to the beast at the end [TS]

01:21:58   of the film she's still a very strong [TS]

01:22:00   world character I'm not I'm not hooking [TS]

01:22:02   on that it's just that internet and this [TS]

01:22:05   is gonna sound like I'm being sarcastic [TS]

01:22:07   but i really do mean this like sincerely [TS]

01:22:09   I'm not casting aspersions against like [TS]

01:22:12   and spells character personally it's [TS]

01:22:14   just that I at that era I don't think it [TS]

01:22:17   occurred to the screenwriters to write [TS]

01:22:19   her as a fully fleshed-out character the [TS]

01:22:21   way that in 2010 it would have occurred [TS]

01:22:23   to fix our writers to let's make sure [TS]

01:22:25   that Meredy really has depth and feeling [TS]

01:22:28   and meaning behind her and so that's the [TS]

01:22:31   reason why it's hard for me to it's hard [TS]

01:22:33   for me to see her as being cut from the [TS]

01:22:36   same cloth as previous Disney Princesses [TS]

01:22:38   not that not that there's anything wrong [TS]

01:22:40   with the with with Belle marrying the [TS]

01:22:42   the prince at the end just that you [TS]

01:22:45   never seen you know anything about her [TS]

01:22:47   except where she likes she likes to read [TS]

01:22:48   and she's fond of her dad and then to [TS]

01:22:50   save my dad's life she agrees to be a [TS]

01:22:52   prisoner and then she sort of is pulled [TS]

01:22:55   along for the rest of the story is not a [TS]

01:22:57   very active character I entirely [TS]

01:22:59   disagree about that i mean it's it's her [TS]

01:23:03   it's it's not about like the ACT again [TS]

01:23:06   it's not about the little tiny you know [TS]

01:23:08   she likes to read it's the fact that she [TS]

01:23:10   is a she presents sort of strong [TS]

01:23:13   opinions and she she forces the Beast to [TS]

01:23:16   become a better person you know she I [TS]

01:23:19   mean she is the driving force she's not [TS]

01:23:21   getting dragged along at all shes she is [TS]

01:23:23   the person acting change throughout the [TS]

01:23:25   entire the entirety of the movie and [TS]

01:23:27   she's the one who you know inadvertently [TS]

01:23:30   starts arrayed but then tries to stop it [TS]

01:23:33   at the end like she's not a damsel in [TS]

01:23:36   distress and oh I'm being locked up in [TS]

01:23:38   this this tower guess I'll you know it's [TS]

01:23:41   not just be our guest right i think it's [TS]

01:23:43   also important to point out that I don't [TS]

01:23:46   think anyone's arguing that there [TS]

01:23:48   shouldn't be any romance or you know [TS]

01:23:50   love interest in disney movies because [TS]

01:23:52   for some it's the story right i mean [TS]

01:23:54   beauty and the beast without a love [TS]

01:23:56   interest in a story of romance there is [TS]

01:23:58   no story at all right I i think the [TS]

01:24:00   argument would be that they've done [TS]

01:24:01   everything they can to make bail more [TS]

01:24:03   interesting character within the [TS]

01:24:04   framework of a traditional fairy tale [TS]

01:24:06   where she falls in love right the prince [TS]

01:24:08   at the end right it but not break the [TS]

01:24:11   form just make her as as kind of like [TS]

01:24:14   contrary to type within the form i think [TS]

01:24:17   the criticism that John is making that I [TS]

01:24:20   can agree with is that too often in [TS]

01:24:22   other movies where that isn't the key [TS]

01:24:25   storyline where the the traditional [TS]

01:24:28   fairy tale or or romance story is not [TS]

01:24:32   what the movies about that they kind of [TS]

01:24:34   stick it on at the end and we're even [TS]

01:24:37   when you know you've got a strong female [TS]

01:24:40   character at the very end the very last [TS]

01:24:42   scene is oh I found a man and i think [TS]

01:24:47   that's that's an issue i've always had [TS]

01:24:48   words with a lot of disney movies [TS]

01:24:50   oh yeah that that part definitely rubs [TS]

01:24:53   me the wrong way and they're plenty of [TS]

01:24:56   movies do it that way but rent a trip to [TS]

01:24:59   your point of the the era of Disney [TS]

01:25:00   Princesses that you're defending that [TS]

01:25:02   was when that was the change when that [TS]

01:25:05   was the second wave of movies that were [TS]

01:25:06   successful after the classic Walt Disney [TS]

01:25:09   movies and there was a rethinking of how [TS]

01:25:10   the princess's behave to make them more [TS]

01:25:13   their own characters in a way and more [TS]

01:25:14   active than perhaps some of the classic [TS]

01:25:17   ones were and so you know but with while [TS]

01:25:19   not changing the kind of classic story [TS]

01:25:21   arc of these characters so it was a step [TS]

01:25:24   right and then what we're seeing now [TS]

01:25:26   with a movie like brave is that it's [TS]

01:25:28   sort of the next step which is to break [TS]

01:25:29   the breaker story arc to not just make [TS]

01:25:32   her a fully more fully realized [TS]

01:25:34   character but but changed her to her [TS]

01:25:37   destiny OC now we're getting to the [TS]

01:25:38   voice-over at the end of the movie is [TS]

01:25:40   all about changing your destiny and [TS]

01:25:42   that's what you i think the word listen [TS]

01:25:44   change your fate you can change your [TS]

01:25:46   teammate Amanda change your fate [TS]

01:25:48   Meredith alright so we have spent a lot [TS]

01:25:51   of time talking about this and it's been [TS]

01:25:52   great but uh that the clock on the wall [TS]

01:25:55   I have no clock on the wall the pretend [TS]

01:25:58   clock on the wall says it's time to go [TS]

01:25:59   so this has been great i want to thank [TS]

01:26:02   my guests for for coming tonight a great [TS]

01:26:04   panel dan Frakes thanks for being here [TS]

01:26:07   thanks for having me and I coat thank [TS]

01:26:10   you very much for attending [TS]

01:26:12   it's been a slice John siracusa thank [TS]

01:26:16   you very much any chance to discuss me [TS]

01:26:19   as i am there and picks are really [TS]

01:26:21   yep yeah yeah we got to do more of this [TS]

01:26:23   I I started to realize that that we made [TS]

01:26:26   a terrible mistake and covering trying [TS]

01:26:28   to cover all of miyazaki in two episodes [TS]

01:26:30   instead of just taking the film's one by [TS]

01:26:32   one we go back right wing go back and [TS]

01:26:35   make a lead us to go back we have to go [TS]

01:26:37   back [TS]

01:26:38   labor day weekend miyazaki marathon [TS]

01:26:40   serenity called well thank you for being [TS]

01:26:43   here in and giving us a perspective that [TS]

01:26:45   the men in the room with black about [TS]

01:26:48   this [TS]

01:26:49   you're welcome Jason I am happy to tell [TS]

01:26:52   stories about my nine-year-old playtime [TS]

01:26:54   any day in the princess Indiana Jones [TS]

01:26:56   it's gonna be a thing only that but it's [TS]

01:26:59   a sleep Skywalker you just blew my mind [TS]

01:27:01   or in a far-out alright until next time [TS]

01:27:07   on the uncomfortable thanks everybody [TS]

01:27:09   for listening this is jason still [TS]

01:27:10   signing off thanks again goodnight [TS]

01:27:16   [Music] [TS]

01:27:25   so it's pronounced Meredy as far as we [TS]

01:27:27   can tell the protagonist in brave but [TS]

01:27:30   then again you pronounce Mario Mario [TS]

01:27:32   right so something like that keep trying [TS]

01:27:35   you get it Mary oh mary oh yeah but it's [TS]

01:27:40   like my um yeah my uh my mother-in-law [TS]

01:27:44   and father-in-law both from New York and [TS]

01:27:46   and they pronounce what what why what is [TS]

01:27:50   your problem when they talk to you it [TS]

01:27:52   what we go to Florida what they [TS]

01:27:54   pronounced Jason dough head for some [TS]

01:27:56   reason you see is the Adirondack bird [TS]

01:27:59   that goes on with that makes it somewhat [TS]

01:28:00   go ahead its peculiar really [TS]