The Incomparable

50: We Apologize for the Extinction of the Clownfish

 

  the incomparable podcast number 50 [TS]

  artists 2011 back for part two of the [TS]

  copper bowls you into the films of pixar [TS]

  animation studios [TS]

  so we're going to get back into our [TS]

  likes or dislikes seems that really [TS]

  creeped us out stuff like that [TS]

  i'm joined again I'm Jason Snelling [TS]

  hosted the incomparable i'm joined by [TS]

  Steve let's your back for more [TS]

  punishment welcome aged one week since [TS]

  the last time we supposed to fix her [TS]

  it's funny how that works and again John [TS]

  siracusa John thanks for coming back for [TS]

  part two [TS]

  I don't know if I can remember what we [TS]

  were talking about what we talked about [TS]

  in part 10 i don't know i think it was [TS]

  something [TS]

  yeah it's all a blur now I think it's [TS]

  all about steve jobs and EDD Catmull [TS]

  that's what it was involuntary [TS]

  Katzenberg but yes [TS]

  Pixar pixar right yeah all right let's [TS]

  get back to it [TS]

  let's go around one more time more [TS]

  quickly to to do this is our lightning [TS]

  round another movie that you'd like to [TS]

  say something kind of in favor of the to [TS]

  Pixar movie Steve do you have another [TS]

  one you'd like to call out just for a [TS]

  few words of encouragement [TS]

  yeah it's a actually in the run-up to [TS]

  this podcast as i said i just watched up [TS]

  for the first time a couple nights ago [TS]

  and i actually just watch wall-e about [TS]

  two weeks ago and i really liked it [TS]

  I get where you're coming from John [TS]

  reset the messages heavy-handed it [TS]

  definitely goes off the rails in the [TS]

  second act I think it was a bit jarring [TS]

  to have real-life people as much as I [TS]

  like Fred Willard regular have him be in [TS]

  the video screens and then have the [TS]

  people be animated is just kind of this [TS]

  weird cognitive dissonance there that I [TS]

  did throws me for a bit of a loop but [TS]

  that opening sequence with with wall-e [TS]

  and Eve and then the subsequent sequence [TS]

  in space where they're doing their [TS]

  little dance through space is just so [TS]

  beautiful that it it it's a near [TS]

  masterpiece I think to me that is it's [TS]

  only really ruined by a slightly [TS]

  disappointing ending that this cleaned [TS]

  up maybe a little too too too rapidly [TS]

  and quickly and you don't really have [TS]

  enough time to get fit [TS]

  for the villains in the the other human [TS]

  characters but but that Wally and they [TS]

  and and Eve sequences and and just the [TS]

  way that they they brought Wally life [TS]

  and made him so relatable is just so [TS]

  impressive to me that that I i really [TS]

  enjoyed the film and and I definitely [TS]

  think it deserves [TS]

  if not masterpiece status than very [TS]

  close to it i agree about i mean the [TS]

  opening is I you know I could argue that [TS]

  yeah the first 10 or 15 minutes of Wally [TS]

  is the best 10 or 15 minutes the Pixar [TS]

  is done and it's hard it's kind of hard [TS]

  to top and the plot is harmless and it's [TS]

  the message was a little over the [TS]

  overbearing I i think i might argue that [TS]

  that's the best-looking Pixar movie i [TS]

  love how it looks [TS]

  the whole thing from the i love the [TS]

  design of the spaceship i love the [TS]

  design of the the the you know wrecked [TS]

  dirty earth that's being picked up and [TS]

  Wally's little shed and the robots and [TS]

  it sounds great i mean it's such as they [TS]

  made a roach likable [TS]

  yeah yeah yeah it's such a great [TS]

  technical achievement and end of the [TS]

  silent opening it you know the dialogue [TS]

  this opening is so brilliant that you [TS]

  know I'm willing to forgive it [TS]

  it's missteps you know plot-wise and [TS]

  it's sort of a little you know a little [TS]

  too much heavy-handedness with the [TS]

  message just because it is so you know [TS]

  it's Wally is so likeable you know your [TS]

  main character that can't speak and and [TS]

  there's so much good in it even though [TS]

  it's much more like that kind of movie [TS]

  right where it's where it's kind of like [TS]

  got some good and some bad rather than [TS]

  it just being solid all the way through [TS]

  and i also want to mention just a quick [TS]

  shout-out to something that's that's [TS]

  usually kind of ignored but the little [TS]

  sequence over the end credits at the end [TS]

  of Wally i think is really really strong [TS]

  beautiful where they go through the the [TS]

  cave paintings and sort of the [TS]

  resurgence of man is he is he becomes a [TS]

  goes through his various stages of [TS]

  growth again over the peter gabriel's [TS]

  are you know right which yeah [TS]

  which-which is a little distracting [TS]

  because it's one of those things where [TS]

  you know it's clearly Peter Gabriel but [TS]

  then again [TS]

  it's not Randy Newman so I guess that's [TS]

  it was gonna get that but I mean the [TS]

  Italian that song really kind of match [TS]

  I mean that that's a case where they did [TS]

  some work with the lyrics really match [TS]

  what you're seeing in the right in the [TS]

  in the credits and yeah that it works [TS]

  really well can I say bad things about [TS]

  Wally before saying really something [TS]

  else so I'm a little i have a little bit [TS]

  more trouble forgiving Wally mostly [TS]

  because like you mentioned that the [TS]

  designs and everything is good movie i [TS]

  agree except humans and I don't want the [TS]

  humans in a movie right because i was [TS]

  interested in the robot and this future [TS]

  dystopia and his problems and I I don't [TS]

  I didn't see a place I don't think you [TS]

  needed humans in there i would just been [TS]

  happy a big fat human blobs right [TS]

  it almost would have been better if they [TS]

  have been brought to the spaceship in [TS]

  the intake could have come up with some [TS]

  clever way to avoid ever seeing the [TS]

  humans while still knowing they were [TS]

  there or just have them being like cryo [TS]

  freeze all the humans are gone and [TS]

  robots are there and it's the robots [TS]

  were sent down because the robots are [TS]

  trying to recolonize and he would be [TS]

  rejoined by robot like his dilemma our [TS]

  main character they're with is I'm alone [TS]

  I'm in a bad time in this bad place and [TS]

  I'm trying to do all this [TS]

  do what I think i'm supposed to do but [TS]

  it's just a an impossible task and now a [TS]

  visitor comes and finally i'm not alone [TS]

  but it's intriguing and she's different [TS]

  than like that's the story I don't want [TS]

  to hear about fat people who don't float [TS]

  around on chairs I don't want to hear [TS]

  about pollution you know where you fit [TS]

  Ratzenberger and then if you do that uh [TS]

  yeah there's always a place you can take [TS]

  the fred willard I so I don't know you [TS]

  got back on Wally too much because that [TS]

  first half really is great i know you're [TS]

  right they could just have them be in [TS]

  cryo suspension and have it be like well [TS]

  you know people they were good people [TS]

  got fat and tired and we just what they [TS]

  decided to wait it out [TS]

  you don't even need to do the fat thing [TS]

  that the people could all be dead and [TS]

  you could have a an emergence of a hot [TS]

  but the whole thing is about you know [TS]

  because we do we need people we have [TS]

  these characters who we relate to who [TS]

  have everything that people have there's [TS]

  no reason that people [TS]

  well this is something that you [TS]

  mentioned in your in your hypercritical [TS]

  podcast is is the question [TS]

  they've got this whole story process [TS]

  that picture they do seem to take risks [TS]

  they make these amazing movies and [TS]

  sometimes you wonder if they didn't [TS]

  quite take enough of a risk and i think [TS]

  this is one of those cases where [TS]

  there as they did they felt like they [TS]

  took a risk [TS]

  it's almost like mitigated their lack of [TS]

  risk-taking in the whole movie by doing [TS]

  the big risk with the dialogue list [TS]

  first 15 minutes but the real risk would [TS]

  have been to say you know what [TS]

  there are no people there is no dialogue [TS]

  it is all robots and they didn't do that [TS]

  they kind of stuck the fat people in [TS]

  there with a fairly easy kind of a [TS]

  satirical message and you know i'm not [TS]

  sure it was really necessary [TS]

  you know I don't think having no [TS]

  dialogue without much of a risk because [TS]

  kids of all people get me tom and jerry [TS]

  has no dialogue and one of my son's [TS]

  favorite cartoon kids of all people get [TS]

  ya pantomime and like they don't need [TS]

  dialogue dialogue distraction for them [TS]

  and their the risk wasn't so much that [TS]

  they weren't going to have people [TS]

  because you know cars has no people toy [TS]

  story has limited people like that toy [TS]

  the thing is that pixar tends to make [TS]

  inanimate objects or other things that [TS]

  aren't people people like but these [TS]

  robots and Wally were not people like [TS]

  and you're like they were I mean [TS]

  obviously they were content with being [TS]

  an actress but but they were they were [TS]

  different they were alien some somewhat [TS]

  they didn't act exactly like people they [TS]

  didn't talk they didn't express things [TS]

  the same way you know what he didn't say [TS]

  anything at all eve spoke very [TS]

  differently and had very different [TS]

  attitude you know they had personalities [TS]

  but the head machine personalities and [TS]

  that would have been the risk to say [TS]

  we're not going to take a robot and make [TS]

  it just like your neighbor gym is not [TS]

  going to be neighbor Jim robot robots [TS]

  robots and they are intelligent beings [TS]

  in this universe and infinitely emotions [TS]

  they have feelings and emotions but [TS]

  they're a little bit different than you [TS]

  a little bit alien that would have been [TS]

  you know the suspending someone an [TS]

  entire movie where everything is [TS]

  slightly alien that probably would have [TS]

  been a risk and interested just doing [TS]

  since we talked about the things that [TS]

  hyper-girl give it a quick summary of it [TS]

  here and then the cars two things with [TS]

  my argument was that pixar before cars 2 [TS]

  by making a series by never making a bad [TS]

  movie they had figured out how to [TS]

  engineer the process to avoid making a [TS]

  bad movie but it was preventing them [TS]

  from make a trend making a [TS]

  transcendently good movie and my my [TS]

  comparison was that have you asked John [TS]

  Lasseter have you ever made a movie [TS]

  that's better than the best miyazaki [TS]

  movie I think he would say no and it's [TS]

  because miyazaki is not afraid to make a [TS]

  stinky movie [TS]

  his great movies are really great [TS]

  because he's willing to try and do [TS]

  things that are way outside the norm [TS]

  whereas I feel like Pixar keeps itself [TS]

  within semi well-defined boundaries [TS]

  making a series of great movies in some [TS]

  really great ones but the best of pixar [TS]

  in my opinion and I think in the opinion [TS]

  of the people who work at Pixar is not [TS]

  better than the best miyazaki movie they [TS]

  just have a massively higher average is [TS]

  probably some sports analogy the Jason [TS]

  can make at this point [TS]

  yeah its value over replacement player [TS]

  with a park neutral now I got to know [TS]

  the odds you're gonna make some Yankee [TS]

  slow the only argument I'd make is that [TS]

  is the is the incredibles is a great i [TS]

  think a great movie [TS]

  oh yeah now i'm not saying i just i'm [TS]

  such a but it's not in such a huge [TS]

  miyazaki fan and you know it John [TS]

  Lasseter that's why I'm making that [TS]

  particular comparison and the [TS]

  incredibles i think one of the reasons [TS]

  its greatest that it's got its got Brad [TS]

  Bird right i mean but it is a it is the [TS]

  one example if you look at the wikipedia [TS]

  page for pics are listed pixar films you [TS]

  know it's the only movie that they have [TS]

  made where the writer and director and [TS]

  story is one guy and it's brad bird [TS]

  that's his movie he made that movie he [TS]

  owns it [TS]

  it's his and I think that maybe the [TS]

  reason one of the reasons why it's so [TS]

  great it's not that it wasn't a team [TS]

  effort but there was actually some [TS]

  singular vision in it right in a movie [TS]

  by committee and he and brad bird had [TS]

  come to Pixar right so he hadn't been [TS]

  there before he wasn't part of that [TS]

  glass eyes so it that in itself is maybe [TS]

  telling that their greatest work is an [TS]

  outlier and a and it's not up a result [TS]

  of the process in the same way that all [TS]

  the other movies are all i would say [TS]

  like it you said I was not a movie by [TS]

  committee if you look at that same [TS]

  wikipedia page and lists like that's a [TS]

  hell of a committee I mean we can bring [TS]

  about you know Canada yet John Lasseter [TS]

  and Peter doctor and you know it's like [TS]

  and read and understand me if you want [TS]

  to have a committee of three or four [TS]

  people it's not bad having them in your [TS]

  government and that's why they make all [TS]

  good want to make that's my good movies [TS]

  and most of the time in a great movie so [TS]

  but they you know to punch through you [TS]

  you need to be able to do you need to be [TS]

  willing to risk make a duck because [TS]

  Miyazaki's made some movies that are [TS]

  just like you didn't quite make it [TS]

  quite connector is just a little bit too [TS]

  weird or it fails in one obvious way or [TS]

  another that any of these story [TS]

  committees of these three or four [TS]

  amazingly talented pixar guys would have [TS]

  would have told me sake [TS]

  here's where your movies falling apart [TS]

  and would have tried to fix it but that [TS]

  doesn't happen it's doing here generally [TS]

  apparently and you just got to make [TS]

  whatever you want it let him make those [TS]

  transcended ones and the whole thing was [TS]

  like all you're just asking for failure [TS]

  with cars to it isn't that your failure [TS]

  that you wanted [TS]

  I haven't seen cars to yet if cars to [TS]

  fail because it was too ambitious than [TS]

  yes but i have a feeling it did not fail [TS]

  because it was ambitious i found a [TS]

  feeling its I don't think it's probably [TS]

  gonna be a failure at all when i watched [TS]

  i think i'm going to say that was an ok [TS]

  movie i think it was just probably to [TS]

  conventional right too timid to i don't [TS]

  know i haven't seen it it's hard for me [TS]

  to say but my and I haven't seen it [TS]

  either i was disappointed when the [TS]

  trailer came out because i wasn't aware [TS]

  that they were actually making cards too [TS]

  and I was disappointed because I felt [TS]

  that was a failure of ambition not [TS]

  because the movie wouldn't necessarily [TS]

  be creative and it sounds like they made [TS]

  a very different movie from cars that [TS]

  it's more of a sort of spy inflected and [TS]

  international kind of movie and and [TS]

  maybe it's a lot of fun but it and I i [TS]

  know some people with Pixar but I I [TS]

  don't know any behind-the-scenes and I [TS]

  feel you know I it's difficult for me to [TS]

  put to make a guess about what the [TS]

  internal struggle is about this but it's [TS]

  very hard for me to look at cars tues [TS]

  existence and not think well cars was [TS]

  the pet project the guy who runs the [TS]

  studio John Lasseter it's he's a car nut [TS]

  it's his favorite subject and now [TS]

  they're making a sequel hard for me to [TS]

  not look at that and say maybe they're [TS]

  not making this for the right reasons [TS]

  maybe they're making this because he's [TS]

  the boss and he loves this and they're [TS]

  going to do it again at part of its cars [TS]

  is my least favorite Pixar movie by far [TS]

  not that it's bad but it's my least [TS]

  favorite and of all the movies for them [TS]

  to make a sequel to next for it to be [TS]

  cars like really when you've got [TS]

  monsters incorporated when you've got [TS]

  the incredibles you know it you've got [TS]

  so many other choices and its cars to it [TS]

  just seems so easy and it's got you know [TS]

  marketing potential because kids can [TS]

  make you know you can make cars that [TS]

  kids can play with and [TS]

  and and you know again it just seemed [TS]

  like such a safe choice for them when [TS]

  they ought to be doing more original [TS]

  things while the money angle is that the [TS]

  one convincing part of that not so much [TS]

  the bosses wins it's just that car [TS]

  merchandise has been selling just like [TS]

  its opening weekend for the original [TS]

  cars for years it's not like you know [TS]

  the movie comes out every by the dolls [TS]

  and you forget about your car's [TS]

  merchandise is still selling strongly [TS]

  we've got and we've got two majors in [TS]

  our house but i'd rather me when my [TS]

  girls I have so the fact that this [TS]

  merchandise has been selling so well [TS]

  years after the movie has been out you [TS]

  know without even the sequel hyping it [TS]

  up or anything you consider this like [TS]

  this is their funding the rest of their [TS]

  more ambitious projects and the thing [TS]

  about cars 2 is when I saw their wedding [TS]

  card too I felt the same way but then I [TS]

  thought well they made toy story 2 and I [TS]

  thought that was going to be a disaster [TS]

  yeah sure as heck wasn't you know like [TS]

  why don't make sequel itís don't make [TS]

  sequels it also i said we'll find I i'm [TS]

  going to give this movie the benefit of [TS]

  the doubt because I you know I thought [TS]

  toy story 2 is going to be stupid and [TS]

  why make a sequel or toy story three for [TS]

  that matter they're making a third moist [TS]

  or not they have enough for stories but [TS]

  against and maybe we should wait for [TS]

  purportedly on the way [TS]

  yeah yeah so I mean you know until they [TS]

  make a bad one you know but it's just [TS]

  because this is a sequel it I don't I [TS]

  don't fault them for because you can [TS]

  make sequels good and again I haven't [TS]

  seen the movie but even if it just turns [TS]

  out to be a so-so kids movie if it makes [TS]

  a lot of money and it funds the more [TS]

  ambitious projects i'm all for it [TS]

  it didn't start talking about this [TS]

  without seeing it I don't think it did [TS]

  make my eye I think it's an outlet for [TS]

  your toys not the movie [TS]

  oh yeah that's true don't know where the [TS]

  real money from the movie is made [TS]

  come on merchandising now John do you [TS]

  have a another picture that you'd like [TS]

  to touch on [TS]

  yeah that the 1i want to talk about is a [TS]

  finding nemo and I its i love Finding [TS]

  Nemo I think it's a great movie i think [TS]

  it's one of the one of the funniest pics [TS]

  are i find myself laughing at Ellen [TS]

  DeGeneres nothing more than an where I [TS]

  should you [TS]

  the I don't know if it's been riding her [TS]

  delivery I just find it very funny and I [TS]

  think her performance was great but [TS]

  that's not what i want to highlight this [TS]

  movie I want to highlight it because it [TS]

  marks the first time that I really [TS]

  noticed pics are really coming into its [TS]

  own deciding that they were going to so [TS]

  previously had been using animation for [TS]

  things and animation is good at and then [TS]

  finding nemo they said you know what we [TS]

  can do the things that people who make [TS]

  like historical pictures or like [TS]

  romances or travel movies can do [TS]

  having beautiful things having the [TS]

  scenery be beautiful and having that add [TS]

  to the movie like when you're watching a [TS]

  particular movie show a sunset or people [TS]

  are driving through Africa or whatever [TS]

  that adds to the movie and they said we [TS]

  don't have to be timid making rigidbody [TS]

  things inside a building with lighting [TS]

  from a light bulb in the middle of the [TS]

  room we can make beautiful natural [TS]

  things we can have and that can add to [TS]

  the movie not just you know don't just [TS]

  do enough to get it done make shots [TS]

  where you dwell on look at this [TS]

  beautiful places where these things live [TS]

  and even though it's not like that [TS]

  wasn't the focus finding nemo and it [TS]

  wasn't about the beauty of the ocean [TS]

  that's the first time that I think [TS]

  they're their technology and their [TS]

  ambition combined to let them realize [TS]

  that they can do that with movies that [TS]

  you know that everybody doesn't have to [TS]

  be about that but that but that you can [TS]

  do that so if it's appropriate for the [TS]

  story it had the equivalent of the magic [TS]

  hour in your movies because it adds to [TS]

  the experience and everyone I think of [TS]

  finding less what I think about i think [TS]

  about those various water seems [TS]

  inefficient even during the credits they [TS]

  had that little scenes with the things [TS]

  waving in the water and everything I i [TS]

  think that makes it stand out from and i [TS]

  hope i hope they're going to do [TS]

  something similar with brave because [TS]

  they have a similar type of environment [TS]

  there but we'll say a beautiful movie [TS]

  and the the fact that you never really [TS]

  forget that you're in the water but II [TS]

  and the quality of the water the quality [TS]

  of the fish tank with the junk in it and [TS]

  I mean that's just yeah they're in nemo [TS]

  it i believe was it was a number one for [TS]

  a while was the highest-grossing Pixar [TS]

  movie until story story story three came [TS]

  out and and it you know rightfully a hit [TS]

  because yeah it's a it's it's just a [TS]

  great movie i think it's easy to [TS]

  overlook at [TS]

  because you know well it's nemo but it's [TS]

  it's it's great and my kids to this day [TS]

  can't see a clown fish in a fish tank [TS]

  without app proclaiming it Nemo there's [TS]

  a problem we apologize for the [TS]

  extinction of the clownfish but uh yeah [TS]

  and funny and again you get the picture [TS]

  has this tendency to time kind of I [TS]

  think say well we were going to [TS]

  alternate between the kind of main [TS]

  storyline and be kind of wackier zanier [TS]

  story which might not work as a whole [TS]

  story but we were gonna have it and so [TS]

  Nemo himself in the fish tank with his [TS]

  cast of wacky characters like Allison [TS]

  Janney is in there and brad garrett is [TS]

  in there and but Jesus willem dafoe yeah [TS]

  i thought was willing to follow as the [TS]

  leader of the fish tank [TS]

  you know that's wacky with with [TS]

  interesting characters that's that's [TS]

  like really kind of wacky stuff and and [TS]

  then there's the main kind of quest [TS]

  story which is also got Ellen DeGeneres [TS]

  he's really funny and Albert Brooks [TS]

  again well-known person comedian funny [TS]

  but not you know just they're being [TS]

  Albert Brooks and no kid no kid knows [TS]

  who Howard process know now he has [TS]

  invented what we'll we'll make a fortune [TS]

  but have Albert Brooks headline on [TS]

  animated kids movie [TS]

  brilliant alright well for my second [TS]

  round pick [TS]

  I am gonna go with I'm gonna go with toy [TS]

  story 2 to our point about sequels and [TS]

  being disappointed sequels this was [TS]

  going to be a direct-to-video sequel I [TS]

  think and at some point somebody saw it [TS]

  and said no this is good this should be [TS]

  an actual might even bid Steve John as [TS]

  it was it was the reverse that a disney [TS]

  was going to make toy story 2 and it was [TS]

  a piece of crap and they said let's make [TS]

  an actual toy story to tell a story [TS]

  through is even worse we're through the [TS]

  entire movie yes I story to was sort of [TS]

  the plan was to make it crappy and pixar [TS]

  second and we're not we're not we don't [TS]

  make a crappy we're going to go into [TS]

  story three they started to make you [TS]

  happy movie actually had a garden and [TS]

  throughout the crappy movie version of [TS]

  our toy story toy story 2 [TS]

  interesting you know they went back and [TS]

  they made bikes like my like we're going [TS]

  back we're making a sequel to toy story [TS]

  but it it tells a new story it expands [TS]

  the world it is the first punch in the [TS]

  gut of many to come [TS]

  yes with that and one of the best I [TS]

  think maybe the bit when she loved me [TS]

  the song by Randy Newman is performed by [TS]

  sarah mclachlan / / Jessie the cowgirl [TS]

  story of you know basically toy story 3 [TS]

  is that song in an entire movie with and [TS]

  and if it's you know in minutes that's [TS]

  sad that points to but it that this is [TS]

  the first time we've got that kind of [TS]

  unexpected punch in the gut emotionally [TS]

  and you know it's got Kelsey Grammer is [TS]

  it lives in a box and it's got way night [TS]

  as the crazy collector which says [TS]

  something about like how not to view a [TS]

  toy have a have a toy on my shelf in my [TS]

  in my house that's a it's it's a micro [TS]

  not actually but it's a replica and it's [TS]

  still in the box and every time my kids [TS]

  say we need to get that out of the box i [TS]

  think god i i i i am like the old [TS]

  prospector and toys to return to the [TS]

  bodies kids never been opened its a toy [TS]

  that hasn't been played with it's a [TS]

  horrible perversion and I ought to just [TS]

  rip it out of the box you are stinky [TS]

  Pete the podcaster I am I am stinky Pete [TS]

  that's right the stinky Pete the plot [TS]

  against hot caster so a toy story 2 [TS]

  didn't didn't have to be it didn't have [TS]

  to be good at all i believe it's a [TS]

  hundred percent rotten tomatoes right [TS]

  it's not just good it's great it's it's [TS]

  got emotional depth at the first movie [TS]

  didn't didn't even have it still I think [TS]

  one of Pixar's very best which is saying [TS]

  a lot because it was early and I think [TS]

  it's to be preferred over toy story 3 as [TS]

  well yeah I like toy story 3 a lot and [TS]

  there's a scene you know the one of the [TS]

  most recent punches in the gut is that [TS]

  seen toy story three at the end where [TS]

  basically something else my wife and I [TS]

  were talking about it that's the scene [TS]

  that basic [TS]

  he is we're all gonna die there's [TS]

  nothing you can do about it you might as [TS]

  well make friends with the people that [TS]

  you've gotten life because in the end [TS]

  we're all gonna die and there's nothing [TS]

  you can do and it's inevitable and oh [TS]

  god oh god were doomed and they actually [TS]

  have that whole moment and then it's [TS]

  like oh and then there and then kids [TS]

  they're saved [TS]

  that's right everything will be fine and [TS]

  they will live happily ever after [TS]

  meanwhile the parents the movie like oh [TS]

  god do is ruined [TS]

  yeah see the thing was three for me [TS]

  though is the same thing that the same [TS]

  issue that I sort of have with up which [TS]

  is that were bookended by these really [TS]

  great emotional moments and then the [TS]

  middle is this kind of pedestrian [TS]

  jailbreak movie and and so much of it is [TS]

  just a rehash of the character [TS]

  interactions that we've seen the first [TS]

  David baby is like a statistically [TS]

  manipulative teddy bear I mean right no [TS]

  no that's great very good that that's a [TS]

  it's a very good jailbreak film but in [TS]

  contrast a toy story 2 which i think is [TS]

  strong and end and carries that [TS]

  emotional depth is kind of an [TS]

  undercurrent you're obviously peaking at [TS]

  the when she loved me moment but I mean [TS]

  that the the whole film is kind of a [TS]

  mean as soon as as we we have a woody [TS]

  meeting the rest of the roundup gang you [TS]

  know you've got this this sense of loss [TS]

  and loneliness and and and the [TS]

  abandonment that the other characters [TS]

  felt you know when when everybody loved [TS]

  woody and nobody cared about bullseye [TS]

  and stinky Pete and Jesse Jesse Jesse [TS]

  Jesse yes and in it i think it's it's [TS]

  just so much stronger film because it it [TS]

  holds onto that the whole way whereas [TS]

  toy story 3 you know again i think is is [TS]

  in parts that good and then kind of [TS]

  loses it for me in the middle so yeah [TS]

  it's easily the strongest I think of the [TS]

  toy stories and that's the problem with [TS]

  the Toy Story franchise is that they are [TS]

  they're running out of things for the [TS]

  characters to do first movie was about [TS]

  was about woody you know and the invader [TS]

  buzz second movie had wooden bus [TS]

  together facing a challenge but the [TS]

  secondary characters have always kind of [TS]

  been there for gags and we're kind of [TS]

  running out of we're running out of [TS]

  character development for forwarded how [TS]

  many more slinkies are long jokes can [TS]

  you make ya for Woody and Buzz were [TS]

  running out of things to their character [TS]

  to do they both have relationships that [TS]

  have sort of been established with these [TS]

  other you know people in a way and [TS]

  everything but at and but decide [TS]

  characters had never been truly solid [TS]

  characters and they needed to give them [TS]

  something to do in toy story 3 but I [TS]

  story three was more about Andy's [TS]

  relationship with the toys you know as [TS]

  pantomimed through the toys actions you [TS]

  know it was kind of a mirror image where [TS]

  at the end of the movie the boy has to [TS]

  go through the same type of thing that [TS]

  slice themselves have to go to being [TS]

  abandoned so on and so forth but if in a [TS]

  for what do you do with these characters [TS]

  like the ones that we cared about were [TS]

  woody buzz his relationship with Andi [TS]

  and Andy's fan like that whole [TS]

  everything seems to be all tied up and [TS]

  now you have to like come up with some [TS]

  sort of news that seems like a mistake [TS]

  to me Toy Story the next generation a [TS]

  whole new group until is now the girl [TS]

  that they're left within in the box at [TS]

  the end of toy story 3 now she'll be [TS]

  going off to school and will be sad [TS]

  again [TS]

  yeah I like it but now they're old hat [TS]

  like now they've been through it before [TS]

  now they're more of the grizzled veteran [TS]

  toys where they understand that you know [TS]

  this was their first owner you get the [TS]

  impression and he was their first owner [TS]

  addresses the sort of the Ark of the [TS]

  toys life and encountering these other [TS]

  toys who have been through that arc once [TS]

  before and come out worse for it shows [TS]

  like now here's are our heroes coming [TS]

  out of it and understanding that they [TS]

  don't have to be bitter like the Baron [TS]

  you know it just seems like there's not [TS]

  much for them to go i don't know how [TS]

  much of a new place them to go with a 4 [TS]

  right well my really think you can [TS]

  really do is introduce a whole batch of [TS]

  new characters and and that's gonna be a [TS]

  disaster before it even starts [TS]

  yeah well i mean if you make a new cable [TS]

  cast of characters you if you decide to [TS]

  make an entirely new movie that's fine [TS]

  just kind of making a new movie happened [TS]

  to using toys as actors you could do [TS]

  that successfully and just capitalized [TS]

  in Toy Story brand but i don't know i [TS]

  think the other thing i want to say [TS]

  speaking of the montage with jesse is in [TS]

  my challenge to Pixar is the things they [TS]

  do in those montages I with is just [TS]

  music and and scenes and stuff like that [TS]

  where you're you're experiencing [TS]

  something that they're trying to show [TS]

  you the loss of you know loss of [TS]

  innocent people getting all that type of [TS]

  thing [TS]

  look viewed from the perspective of us [TS]

  have a situation that will never will [TS]

  never be in so it's like kind of an [TS]

  allegory like a toy the person growing [TS]

  up not want [TS]

  play with the toy people can relate that [TS]

  to real situations in their life and [TS]

  their own relationships but it's but [TS]

  it's it it's by way of an analogy and [TS]

  it's under montage my challenge that [TS]

  would to be to do a scene like that that [TS]

  has a similar message but not as a [TS]

  montage and head on and that's really [TS]

  hard to do like the greatest of the [TS]

  greatest movies have emotional scenes [TS]

  between peoples we're really talking [TS]

  about what they're talking about it and [TS]

  it's not reminding you of something [TS]

  because it's an allegory or fable or [TS]

  fantastical situation it's like a real [TS]

  one or whatever I think they they're not [TS]

  there shying away from but i think they [TS]

  can do it like you can make you can make [TS]

  that the text and not have it be the [TS]

  subtext I and still pull it off I i [TS]

  totally believe that they have the [TS]

  strength to that's thus far [TS]

  maybe it's because they make kid movies [TS]

  or whatever they mostly shied away for [TS]

  the most of come at an angle sometimes [TS]

  when you come in an angle that's how it [TS]

  catches you because like we don't care [TS]

  that this toy is missing its owner like [TS]

  Arizona is growing up and not being [TS]

  interested in playing with it again [TS]

  because we know where that's not the the [TS]

  text of the story is not what we're [TS]

  getting upset about its the [TS]

  you-know-whats relating to if you gave [TS]

  us a real scene where someone was in the [TS]

  relationship that was drifting apart or [TS]

  whatever a home movie about that will [TS]

  will accept that too is just so much [TS]

  harder to do so I not that they're [TS]

  cheating so much but that the music [TS]

  backed montage triggering childhood [TS]

  feelings is even though they do it so [TS]

  well it's there's a degree of difficulty [TS]

  that's not there that you know they want [TS]

  to go to the next level deck do it for [TS]

  real do it head-on make that the story [TS]

  right and probably the closest they've [TS]

  come to that with it would be with the [TS]

  incredibles with the whole dynamic that [TS]

  that the that mr. incredible inelastic [TS]

  will have it at home and I think that's [TS]

  probably why that is so strong right or [TS]

  again they're elastic are wrapping [TS]

  around the people like that's that was [TS]

  that's head-on that's not reminding you [TS]

  of what it's like to protect your [TS]

  children its that's the story she's [TS]

  doing that in the story so one of my [TS]

  questions I that I was gonna get to it [TS]

  very and i thought i'd ask now because [TS]

  of what John just said which is what i [TS]

  want to know [TS]

  you think pixar should do next not [TS]

  necessarily they're very next movie [TS]

  because we know that's going to be brave [TS]

  which is set in Scotland as a female [TS]

  protagonist and I it looks like going to [TS]

  the wikipedia and wikipedia doesn't lie [TS]

  there is a monster's inc sequel in the [TS]

  offing I'm just looking more generally [TS]

  where should pixar go next what would [TS]

  you like to see pics are do maybe [TS]

  outside their comfort zone a little bit [TS]

  what you know what would you like to see [TS]

  from them that you know as a as the next [TS]

  big thing that makes you sit up and say [TS]

  all I you know this is something new [TS]

  from pixar one of things i think john [TS]

  mentioned in his podcast that I I [TS]

  thought about is doing something that's [TS]

  really a through-and-through a PG movie [TS]

  or p or even our but let's just say PG [TS]

  because I think you'll ever do in our [TS]

  but a PG movie something that is in a [TS]

  genre that they're not comfortable with [TS]

  I mean John mentioned you know that they [TS]

  took a shot at a romantic comedy and [TS]

  ended up kind of killing it [TS]

  aurorae a kind of a kind of Moorish [TS]

  detective kind of thing I just I wonder [TS]

  if they there is something outside of [TS]

  their comfort zone that they that they [TS]

  could do that would be you know [TS]

  interesting to see i'm also interested [TS]

  in the fact that andrew stanton is [TS]

  directing John Carter of Mars I guess [TS]

  has directed which is coming out next [TS]

  year that's for disney so it's not [TS]

  really pixar but there are not a lot of [TS]

  pics our names in the credits and that's [TS]

  a live action sci-fi movie and it did [TS]

  you see the trailers and I did I did Tim [TS]

  Riggins has come a long way from Dillon [TS]

  Texas tunis that's pulling me out of it [TS]

  a little bit to Mars but but on one [TS]

  level I I'm fascinated by that because I [TS]

  wonder is this in some ways the first [TS]

  live-action Pixar movie a little bit [TS]

  maybe you maybe just a little [TS]

  and I think doesn't Brad Bird have a [TS]

  live-action movie to that he's working [TS]

  on so I'm kind of fascinated by that [TS]

  these animations Edwards doing a mission [TS]

  impossibles any you're right he is he's [TS]

  doing mission impossible 4 which which I [TS]

  wouldn't be excited about but when I [TS]

  think mission impossible from the [TS]

  director of the incredibles interesting [TS]

  Redbird Redbird can do anything i watch [TS]

  this play [TS]

  ya on that level but some suggestions I [TS]

  made in my podcast kind of still [TS]

  standing I was what i was trying to do [TS]

  online was come up with the most [TS]

  ridiculous things I can think of like I [TS]

  was immediately say you know go radar i [TS]

  go photorealistic which no one dares do [TS]

  because it's so hard to do but like at a [TS]

  certain point it's going to be there for [TS]

  the taking [TS]

  you know and not cartoonish things real [TS]

  anatomy real physics hundred percent [TS]

  photorealistic wally was really close [TS]

  it's easier to do machines but the [TS]

  opening sequences of Wally most nothing [TS]

  on the screen really reads as a cartoon [TS]

  even the cockroaches pretty realistic [TS]

  looking but eventually it's going to be [TS]

  sitting there right in front of you and [TS]

  somebody like so do we know we can do it [TS]

  now we've got subsurface scattering we [TS]

  can do skin that doesn't look like [TS]

  plastic do we wanna go full photo but [TS]

  but but i thought now we're thinking [TS]

  more about this is that it's probably [TS]

  best for them to sneak up on it and the [TS]

  the easiest way for them to transition [TS]

  into things that are outside their [TS]

  comfort zone I feel like is sci-fi and [TS]

  it's not hard sci-fi but serious syfy [TS]

  where there is yeah at least the serious [TS]

  i is say like the wrath of connor empire [TS]

  strikes back where you have to fund [TS]

  relatively light hearted movie but it's [TS]

  not really a kids movie it's a little [TS]

  bit too intense for kids and give it [TS]

  sort of a dark sci-fi premise that would [TS]

  be a way I think pixar can find its way [TS]

  out of the child movie ghetto by having [TS]

  a pg-13 or PG but have it be sort of a [TS]

  gritty dark sci-fi action adventure [TS]

  movie that reads like the you that you'd [TS]

  watch the same way you would watch you [TS]

  know empire strikes back or something [TS]

  like that I can't think of a better [TS]

  darker so maybe later mate runner but [TS]

  not that dark like not only piece like [TS]

  Blade Runner like you know justjust a [TS]

  good a sci-fi movie for teenagers and [TS]

  adults that's not not for kids and [TS]

  sci-fi is not that far from their [TS]

  comfort zone I feel and they haven't [TS]

  really done with the exception of Wally [TS]

  they haven't really really done that [TS]

  like a new IP you know or don't or make [TS]

  it up make it [TS]

  a making an adaptation of something [TS]

  that's not well-known don't pick another [TS]

  philip k dick story and just come out [TS]

  with something like that to to say that [TS]

  boy this is really great sci-fi movie [TS]

  that's it's not like transformers that's [TS]

  an actual great movie and also happens [TS]

  to be science fiction that [TS]

  science-fiction fans like sort of like a [TS]

  game of thrones is done for fantasy you [TS]

  know what I mean we're Game of Thrones [TS]

  is a fantasy thing but it's it raises [TS]

  the level of the best of television [TS]

  dramas well they can make a sci-fi movie [TS]

  that raised the level of the best of you [TS]

  know action adventure science-fiction [TS]

  human drama was it just happens to be [TS]

  sci-fi that I think is their way in [TS]

  verses going all the way for the I you [TS]

  know for the realistic murder mystery to [TS]

  our thing which I think might be because [TS]

  the people would say like all we can't [TS]

  take it seriously like you can't you [TS]

  know is it you know make schindler's [TS]

  list but with CJ you gotta go get there [TS]

  in a world that is not even close to [TS]

  being our world so people are a little [TS]

  more accepting of the deviations from [TS]

  reality right suspension of disbelief is [TS]

  already there right but still have it be [TS]

  you know a real real live movie for [TS]

  adults not kids movies and very you know [TS]

  do with trying to do with no comedy [TS]

  relief like that would be the challenge [TS]

  pixar expects are everything they do [TS]

  there's something like funny awry about [TS]

  it can you make a good quality movie [TS]

  without lots of humor it's possible [TS]

  especially in sci-fi you can make a good [TS]

  exciting action adventure sci-fi movie [TS]

  that's not funny joke time right you can [TS]

  have some jokes in it but it needs to be [TS]

  more than that like serenity is actually [TS]

  a pretty good movie but it's got its got [TS]

  jokes in it but miles up with the [TS]

  wheeling the whedon is deep down and now [TS]

  he's had everything we needed service [TS]

  uncensor I could remember I wouldn't [TS]

  advocate serenity being the model for a [TS]

  picture sci-fi movie but it's to it [TS]

  springs to mind is a fun sci-fi movie [TS]

  that still got some jokes in it but it's [TS]

  not the not the point it i get on back [TS]

  to Empire which will eventually podcast [TS]

  about which has jokes in it and is funny [TS]

  but takes itself a hundred percent [TS]

  seriously like it its it takes itself [TS]

  seriously as a movie and all possible [TS]

  levels and I think they can make a [TS]

  science-fiction movie that's not [TS]

  derivative anything that if they again [TS]

  if they get an equivalent of brad bird [TS]

  who has this great idea for an awesome [TS]

  sci-fi movie that takes itself seriously [TS]

  and he's super talented like brad bird [TS]

  there you go alright well i doubt i'll [TS]

  pick up where you left off Jason and say [TS]

  I'd like to see what would happen if [TS]

  they tried their hand at a live-action [TS]

  film I mean obviously the animation is [TS]

  is what they became known for and it was [TS]

  really their calling card and now [TS]

  they've excelled at it to such an extent [TS]

  that you almost watch the film and [TS]

  forget that it's animated at times it [TS]

  and that's really what's so impressive [TS]

  about it he'll step back once in awhile [TS]

  you look at the of the same like the [TS]

  Paradise Falls vista and up or again [TS]

  although the great underwater stuff and [TS]

  finding nemo and you go wow that's [TS]

  that's really impressive stuff but the [TS]

  reason pixar films are so great is not [TS]

  because of the animation it's not [TS]

  because the animation is so fantastic [TS]

  and well done [TS]

  it's because the story and the process [TS]

  that they they put together to come up [TS]

  with a story and the scripting and the [TS]

  characters is is so fantastically [TS]

  conceived and I'd be really curious to [TS]

  see what would happen if they took that [TS]

  same process and and applied it to live [TS]

  action and we've seen you know how close [TS]

  to two storyboards films can look these [TS]

  days with CGI and whatnot you know with [TS]

  a with watch man [TS]

  watchmen and other comic book films that [TS]

  are almost no for no copies from comic [TS]

  panels for instance you know so i think [TS]

  i think they could really almost go down [TS]

  to that level that they do with the [TS]

  animation where they a storyboard every [TS]

  single singing every single you know [TS]

  facial tic and and I don't know maybe to [TS]

  some extent the actors would repeal the [TS]

  fact that they were being told you know [TS]

  follow such a strict formula but i think [TS]

  they could end up with something very [TS]

  interesting if they went down that path [TS]

  I what you said actually makes me think [TS]

  the other the other thing they could do [TS]

  and I'm not sure whether there's a good [TS]

  creative reason to do this or not but [TS]

  you know history is littered with [TS]

  attempts to combine live action with [TS]

  animation and roger roger rabbit is an [TS]

  example and you don't do and Ike dancing [TS]

  with ya know that I think they pretty [TS]

  much peaked with that with that the [TS]

  incredible mr. limpet and it's all been [TS]

  downhill since then well I anything [TS]

  something like what if she's going to [TS]

  have to count a good world you know it [TS]

  was sky captain interesting what if they [TS]

  found a a good way to kind of mix [TS]

  together beyond Fred Willard showing up [TS]

  on a on a screen some way to 300 [TS]

  yeah well I mean yeah there are lots of [TS]

  think of example there are lots of [TS]

  theoretically live-action movies that [TS]

  are out of a CG practically a mean the [TS]

  star wars sorry the Star Wars prequels i [TS]

  have to mention it here with their whole [TS]

  sections of that I look at my just think [TS]

  you know the bladder is this is an [TS]

  animated feature at this point yeah the [TS]

  race [TS]

  yeah some of the stories that i think is [TS]

  the most successful because like the [TS]

  close-up scenes of that stupid kid look [TS]

  horrible and the whole rest of the thing [TS]

  which only exists in a computer looks [TS]

  great [TS]

  yeah yeah so you know it wouldn't be [TS]

  that much for them to cross over into [TS]

  something that is indescribable about [TS]

  whether it's an animated film or live [TS]

  action but you're still saying human [TS]

  human actors you're still saying like [TS]

  that's that's the where the line is [TS]

  drawn it's like what your main character [TS]

  is a human being and maybe you filmed in [TS]

  front of a green screen and it's all [TS]

  stylized like 300 or our sin city or [TS]

  something like that or maybe that's your [TS]

  lifetime movie where it's where it's [TS]

  their human characters who are humans [TS]

  but there are alien characters who are [TS]

  going to be CGI anyway except that [TS]

  they're there [TS]

  pixar animated characters i saw that [TS]

  though the waters of mars i saw John [TS]

  Carter of Mars or John Carter whatever [TS]

  they're playing cards so that trailer [TS]

  and that was much that didn't look too [TS]

  great to me like no i don't i would [TS]

  rather see them do the final fantasy [TS]

  experience within thing the right way [TS]

  two decades three decades later like the [TS]

  holy spirit of it [TS]

  yeah that eventually it's gonna be there [TS]

  for the taking it don't make it with [TS]

  humans if you're afraid make the entire [TS]

  thing make like you know a deepness in [TS]

  the sky but with no humans you know like [TS]

  if you're afraid of making human right [TS]

  pick something else first but or make [TS]

  your humans slightly stylized or [TS]

  something but but look like reliving [TS]

  things like Bobby or something you know [TS]

  like they're strange-looking if we have [TS]

  I believe the highest grossing film of [TS]

  all time is essentially a sci-fi movie [TS]

  with live-action and maybe people put [TS]

  together which is avatar so maybe that's [TS]

  been done [TS]

  yeah well I'm it i just think it's [TS]

  harder to do I think pixar strength is [TS]

  because that's the whole thing all their [TS]

  worlds other piece and consistent friend [TS]

  will decide you know that there are also [TS]

  automatic brother will eventually for [TS]

  guy [TS]

  eventually why is that red Willard [TS]

  should be John Ratzenberger damn it it [TS]

  should be anybody you know speaking of [TS]

  that the first time I saw it yeah I'm [TS]

  like what the hell right but the second [TS]

  time I thought didn't even register [TS]

  didn't register that it was live action [TS]

  I guess I had already gotten over the [TS]

  shock and somehow actually fit into the [TS]

  movie the second and third and fourth [TS]

  time like I don't know why it fits in [TS]

  and I the fact that they picked him as [TS]

  the actor that fits to like he does a [TS]

  little stick I'm like yeah you know he's [TS]

  my favorite human in the movies i [TS]

  actually thought it was pretty cool [TS]

  until I say until I realized we were [TS]

  going to see animated people later and [TS]

  that's what killed it for now [TS]

  last thing I wanted to to do is go [TS]

  around and talk about i want to turn [TS]

  negative i want to go i wanna go- [TS]

  full-on negative I I want you to select [TS]

  a movie or part of a movie some put [TS]

  something in pixar that we haven't [TS]

  covered yet [TS]

  ideally that is your least favorite [TS]

  thing that Pixar has done [TS]

  who would like to be negative alright [TS]

  I'll go first I've gotta this is [TS]

  probably isn't fair because i've only [TS]

  seen his movie I think twice maybe three [TS]

  times but it's not one that we own so I [TS]

  haven't seen it a thousand times but I [TS]

  can see this movie sticks with me the [TS]

  least I and i don't i don't think it's a [TS]

  bad movie like it's not it's not [TS]

  actively bad and nothing in it i can [TS]

  point to it that the just it just it [TS]

  just doesn't work for me I guess my [TS]

  movies ratatouille [TS]

  that's the only movie we haven't yet [TS]

  mentioned all this time talking at it [TS]

  hasn't come up [TS]

  yeah now that it has its moments it [TS]

  certainly looks beautiful [TS]

  I I appreciate what it's trying to do [TS]

  but it just does not hold together as a [TS]

  cohesive movie for me that I'm [TS]

  interested in or that i find myself [TS]

  thinking about are coming back to or [TS]

  wanted my children to watch or anything [TS]

  like that so that's like the worst thing [TS]

  you can say about it's just it's just [TS]

  blonde again I haven't seen cars to [TS]

  maybe cars 2 will have the same effect [TS]

  on me i don't know but i hate cars which [TS]

  I've seen billions of times it it has a [TS]

  certain charm to it that you know and I [TS]

  I'm a car guy so maybe that helps a [TS]

  little bit too it's certainly not their [TS]

  best work but ratatouille is flat from a [TS]

  flatter than cars even so that is my [TS]

  that is my bottom [TS]

  I'm it again and maybe it's not fair [TS]

  maybe we need to watch it a few more [TS]

  times [TS]

  and refresh myself on it but just just [TS]

  given my personal impression of its and [TS]

  stay with me all right Steve I I find [TS]

  hard to come up with the the worst thing [TS]

  i can say which probably my least [TS]

  favorite film is it might not be a [TS]

  popular choice I i think one it doesn't [TS]

  do it for me the most is probably toy [TS]

  story huh [TS]

  and that's it's it's very cool was [TS]

  innovative for the time I think the [TS]

  problem for me was I didn't actually see [TS]

  toy story until i had already seen a [TS]

  bug's life I i think it was after [TS]

  finding nemo that i finally got around [TS]

  to watching the first toy story and so [TS]

  much of it is just pics are finding [TS]

  their feet and so much it there's so [TS]

  much reliance on the toy ponds which are [TS]

  good they're funny and the timeless puns [TS]

  as timeless as pleasant as can be i was [TS]

  a joss whedon jokes and that one too [TS]

  right but at the same time there's the [TS]

  narrative isn't that strong the people [TS]

  look funky you know I i don't think the [TS]

  characters really come into their own [TS]

  until the second film and a lot of ways [TS]

  it is it is they're figuring things out [TS]

  right and it's not sure I can forgive it [TS]

  for that [TS]

  yeah but but it's just it doesn't it [TS]

  doesn't do the same thing for me as the [TS]

  other ones too and it's it's largely [TS]

  because the narrative just isn't strong [TS]

  and they haven't really gotten that [TS]

  whole they're starting to you know with [TS]

  the scene with the with the buzz trying [TS]

  to take flight and not being able to do [TS]

  it and then the irritating randy newman [TS]

  tinkling along the background there [TS]

  they're starting to get that sort of [TS]

  emotional resonance thing going but it's [TS]

  just not really that strong yet and I [TS]

  think even ratatouille i think is it is [TS]

  better for me while i agree with you [TS]

  that it'sit's kind of blah overall as a [TS]

  film it does have kind of a weird [TS]

  emotional resonance in places and and [TS]

  somehow for some reason even though i'm [TS]

  not that invested in the character that [TS]

  the scene where the food critic each the [TS]

  ratatouille and he's immediately brought [TS]

  back to his childhood that that one [TS]

  nails me for some reason it almost makes [TS]

  the rest of the film uh you know much [TS]

  more tolerable for me and there's [TS]

  nothing like that in Toy Story I mean [TS]

  it'sit's just not it's not there yet [TS]

  it's still great [TS]

  but it's just not on a par with the rest [TS]

  of the film's I was going to mention [TS]

  ratatouille as well there's a scene i'm [TS]

  thinking of a particular although you [TS]

  mentioned the critic is interesting that [TS]

  is a really careful line they walk [TS]

  because there are movies where there are [TS]

  characters of critics and they are [TS]

  savage as being talentless people who do [TS]

  nothing but tear down other people's [TS]

  work and every time I see that in a [TS]

  movie I want to throw something at the [TS]

  screen because you know again criticism [TS]

  uh because because I I am I in my mind [TS]

  there is nothing more classless then a [TS]

  maker of movies getting revenge at movie [TS]

  critics by by insulting them in their [TS]

  next movie and you see this hat it it [TS]

  happens right at tooheys depiction of [TS]

  that critic is right on the edges peter [TS]

  o'toole i think is the voice of the [TS]

  critic um because on one level he is [TS]

  portrayed as being this just miserable [TS]

  son of a gun who hates everything and [TS]

  he's mean and you know and you can't [TS]

  please him and and yet when you finally [TS]

  see him there is that scene where he's [TS]

  taken back to the reasons that he always [TS]

  loved food in the first place and then [TS]

  he raves about it and it humanizes him [TS]

  on one level where i kinda want to [TS]

  forgive it on another level though I [TS]

  feel like what it's really saying is if [TS]

  only critics would remember that they [TS]

  love watching movies they would stop [TS]

  criticizing it and being so mean [TS]

  which is just a biggest load of horsemen [TS]

  that you could possibly imagine and and [TS]

  and I you know honestly it as much [TS]

  education as i have heaped upon brad [TS]

  bird for the incredibles um if he if [TS]

  he's the guy who hatched that concept [TS]

  he should be embarrassed for himself [TS]

  because it's it's it's it's ridiculous [TS]

  people you know you know what your movie [TS]

  maker people get to criticize your work [TS]

  suck it up [TS]

  so anyway that that's an offense me and [TS]

  that's not the scene that bothers me the [TS]

  most about to we've seen that bothers me [TS]

  the most in ratatouille [TS]

  the scene that I think undercuts the [TS]

  entire premise of the movie i believe [TS]

  that they're in this fantasy world where [TS]

  a rat to grab onto a kid's head and make [TS]

  him make food by a real filled with hair [TS]

  it connects to his limbs [TS]

  it's amazing of the hair pulls on his [TS]

  brain and his anyway [TS]

  that alone should be public health and [TS]

  undercuts p hair stuff to cook so public [TS]

  health hazard [TS]

  it's the scene where they bring all the [TS]

  rats from the sewers of Paris into the [TS]

  kitchen because the kitchen staff is [TS]

  quit and you and there's a moment where [TS]

  I'm sitting here thinking well this is [TS]

  odd because these are the vermin is now [TS]

  in the kitchen but the rats are friends [TS]

  so it's okay that part doesn't bother me [TS]

  what bothers me is in an attempt to I [TS]

  think to smooth out people's concern [TS]

  about rats in the kitchen they show a [TS]

  scene where the rats are sterilized by [TS]

  being run through the dishwasher and [TS]

  then the rats come out of the dishwasher [TS]

  and I think we're meant to think is oh [TS]

  what a relief the rats are clean now and [TS]

  instead all I think is wow that ran [TS]

  smelly wet wraps in the kitchen and and [TS]

  at that moment the entire movie just [TS]

  completely careens off the rails because [TS]

  I've it took me like 10 minutes to get [TS]

  back to accepting what this movie was [TS]

  because it completely blew me out of the [TS]

  premise ipad that way you apparently [TS]

  didn't wear underwear that lemon fresh [TS]

  joy is actually a cure for the black [TS]

  Pike wet rats in the kitchen it's just [TS]

  the wet rats it was even the rats [TS]

  it was the wet rats in the kitchen just [TS]

  push me over the edge a wet rat will [TS]

  make you dinner now sir mr. but Mr film [TS]

  critic or mister mister critic who is a [TS]

  miserable sob because he doesn't like [TS]

  anything because all he does is [TS]

  criticize it good news the white rats [TS]

  are making your dinner tonight will be [TS]

  excellent and the idiot kid who is [TS]

  controlled by his hair anyway so what [TS]

  I'm saying is the cars is my least [TS]

  favorite of all but you hate everything [TS]

  is your critic [TS]

  no I I you know cars just lays there for [TS]

  me Brett relatives got highs and lows [TS]

  there's some good stuff in it i like i [TS]

  like some of the stuff with Remy the rat [TS]

  and his family and there are a lot of [TS]

  kind of rat jokes and you know the [TS]

  romantic element with the kid and the [TS]

  girl in the it doesn't really work that [TS]

  well but you know some stuff with patton [TS]

  oswalt you know he's likeable and the [TS]

  characters is interesting cars is the [TS]

  one that feels just kind of artificial [TS]

  and and blame to me and but you know and [TS]

  I still it's fine i have the DVD of it's [TS]

  not like I hate it but I would rank cars [TS]

  beretta to a just hate the wet rats and [TS]

  ratatouille hate it when i mentioned [TS]

  that tonight anyway I want to thank you [TS]

  guys for being a part of this marathon [TS]

  yet another marathon two-part and [TS]

  comfortable podcast [TS]

  wow I can't shut up it just can't it [TS]

  can't end now let's talk about future [TS]

  now but let's talk about the shorts will [TS]

  mention all the pixar shorts and I [TS]

  wanted to get to the shore to dammit i [TS]

  forgot about that will have to be [TS]

  importantly really been a pause in the [TS]

  action i would've brought that up the [TS]

  third half of the show we rock style [TS]

  ah yes exactly uh anyway so pixar makes [TS]

  great movies and if you're jaded [TS]

  childless person who has never seen them [TS]

  what is wrong with you why did you [TS]

  listen to this podcast but you should go [TS]

  see them now because it generally pretty [TS]

  good except for the ones that we said 10 [TS]

  k alright so thanks to everyone for [TS]

  listening i would also like to thank my [TS]

  guest Steve let's thanks very much thank [TS]

  you sir and John syracuse oh thanks for [TS]

  being here thank you and until next time [TS]

  I'm chasing snow for the uncomfortable [TS]

  thanks for listening [TS]

  [Music] [TS]

  well it's it's the new hope of pixar a [TS]

  new hope [TS]

  toy story co co this is flipped around [TS]

  now don't know this is exactly what I [TS]

  say about your help [TS]

  yeah I I didn't listen that pocket haha [TS]

  ah [TS]