The Incomparable

50: We Apologize for the Extinction of the Clownfish


00:00:00   the incomparable podcast number 50 [TS]

00:00:08   artists 2011 back for part two of the [TS]

00:00:13   copper bowls you into the films of pixar [TS]

00:00:16   animation studios [TS]

00:00:18   so we're going to get back into our [TS]

00:00:20   likes or dislikes seems that really [TS]

00:00:22   creeped us out stuff like that [TS]

00:00:24   i'm joined again I'm Jason Snelling [TS]

00:00:26   hosted the incomparable i'm joined by [TS]

00:00:27   Steve let's your back for more [TS]

00:00:29   punishment welcome aged one week since [TS]

00:00:31   the last time we supposed to fix her [TS]

00:00:33   it's funny how that works and again John [TS]

00:00:36   siracusa John thanks for coming back for [TS]

00:00:39   part two [TS]

00:00:39   I don't know if I can remember what we [TS]

00:00:41   were talking about what we talked about [TS]

00:00:42   in part 10 i don't know i think it was [TS]

00:00:45   something [TS]

00:00:47   yeah it's all a blur now I think it's [TS]

00:00:50   all about steve jobs and EDD Catmull [TS]

00:00:51   that's what it was involuntary [TS]

00:00:53   Katzenberg but yes [TS]

00:00:55   Pixar pixar right yeah all right let's [TS]

00:00:59   get back to it [TS]

00:01:00   let's go around one more time more [TS]

00:01:01   quickly to to do this is our lightning [TS]

00:01:04   round another movie that you'd like to [TS]

00:01:06   say something kind of in favor of the to [TS]

00:01:08   Pixar movie Steve do you have another [TS]

00:01:09   one you'd like to call out just for a [TS]

00:01:11   few words of encouragement [TS]

00:01:13   yeah it's a actually in the run-up to [TS]

00:01:17   this podcast as i said i just watched up [TS]

00:01:19   for the first time a couple nights ago [TS]

00:01:20   and i actually just watch wall-e about [TS]

00:01:24   two weeks ago and i really liked it [TS]

00:01:28   I get where you're coming from John [TS]

00:01:30   reset the messages heavy-handed it [TS]

00:01:31   definitely goes off the rails in the [TS]

00:01:33   second act I think it was a bit jarring [TS]

00:01:35   to have real-life people as much as I [TS]

00:01:38   like Fred Willard regular have him be in [TS]

00:01:41   the video screens and then have the [TS]

00:01:43   people be animated is just kind of this [TS]

00:01:45   weird cognitive dissonance there that I [TS]

00:01:46   did throws me for a bit of a loop but [TS]

00:01:49   that opening sequence with with wall-e [TS]

00:01:52   and Eve and then the subsequent sequence [TS]

00:01:54   in space where they're doing their [TS]

00:01:55   little dance through space is just so [TS]

00:01:57   beautiful that it it it's a near [TS]

00:02:00   masterpiece I think to me that is it's [TS]

00:02:02   only really ruined by a slightly [TS]

00:02:06   disappointing ending that this cleaned [TS]

00:02:08   up maybe a little too too too rapidly [TS]

00:02:11   and quickly and you don't really have [TS]

00:02:12   enough time to get fit [TS]

00:02:13   for the villains in the the other human [TS]

00:02:16   characters but but that Wally and they [TS]

00:02:19   and and Eve sequences and and just the [TS]

00:02:21   way that they they brought Wally life [TS]

00:02:23   and made him so relatable is just so [TS]

00:02:26   impressive to me that that I i really [TS]

00:02:30   enjoyed the film and and I definitely [TS]

00:02:32   think it deserves [TS]

00:02:34   if not masterpiece status than very [TS]

00:02:37   close to it i agree about i mean the [TS]

00:02:39   opening is I you know I could argue that [TS]

00:02:43   yeah the first 10 or 15 minutes of Wally [TS]

00:02:44   is the best 10 or 15 minutes the Pixar [TS]

00:02:46   is done and it's hard it's kind of hard [TS]

00:02:48   to top and the plot is harmless and it's [TS]

00:02:52   the message was a little over the [TS]

00:02:53   overbearing I i think i might argue that [TS]

00:02:57   that's the best-looking Pixar movie i [TS]

00:02:59   love how it looks [TS]

00:03:01   the whole thing from the i love the [TS]

00:03:04   design of the spaceship i love the [TS]

00:03:06   design of the the the you know wrecked [TS]

00:03:09   dirty earth that's being picked up and [TS]

00:03:11   Wally's little shed and the robots and [TS]

00:03:15   it sounds great i mean it's such as they [TS]

00:03:17   made a roach likable [TS]

00:03:19   yeah yeah yeah it's such a great [TS]

00:03:20   technical achievement and end of the [TS]

00:03:23   silent opening it you know the dialogue [TS]

00:03:26   this opening is so brilliant that you [TS]

00:03:28   know I'm willing to forgive it [TS]

00:03:30   it's missteps you know plot-wise and [TS]

00:03:35   it's sort of a little you know a little [TS]

00:03:37   too much heavy-handedness with the [TS]

00:03:39   message just because it is so you know [TS]

00:03:43   it's Wally is so likeable you know your [TS]

00:03:46   main character that can't speak and and [TS]

00:03:50   there's so much good in it even though [TS]

00:03:52   it's much more like that kind of movie [TS]

00:03:54   right where it's where it's kind of like [TS]

00:03:56   got some good and some bad rather than [TS]

00:03:57   it just being solid all the way through [TS]

00:03:59   and i also want to mention just a quick [TS]

00:04:01   shout-out to something that's that's [TS]

00:04:03   usually kind of ignored but the little [TS]

00:04:05   sequence over the end credits at the end [TS]

00:04:07   of Wally i think is really really strong [TS]

00:04:09   beautiful where they go through the the [TS]

00:04:11   cave paintings and sort of the [TS]

00:04:12   resurgence of man is he is he becomes a [TS]

00:04:15   goes through his various stages of [TS]

00:04:17   growth again over the peter gabriel's [TS]

00:04:19   are you know right which yeah [TS]

00:04:21   which-which is a little distracting [TS]

00:04:23   because it's one of those things where [TS]

00:04:24   you know it's clearly Peter Gabriel but [TS]

00:04:26   then again [TS]

00:04:27   it's not Randy Newman so I guess that's [TS]

00:04:28   it was gonna get that but I mean the [TS]

00:04:31   Italian that song really kind of match [TS]

00:04:33   I mean that that's a case where they did [TS]

00:04:35   some work with the lyrics really match [TS]

00:04:36   what you're seeing in the right in the [TS]

00:04:38   in the credits and yeah that it works [TS]

00:04:42   really well can I say bad things about [TS]

00:04:43   Wally before saying really something [TS]

00:04:45   else so I'm a little i have a little bit [TS]

00:04:47   more trouble forgiving Wally mostly [TS]

00:04:50   because like you mentioned that the [TS]

00:04:51   designs and everything is good movie i [TS]

00:04:53   agree except humans and I don't want the [TS]

00:04:56   humans in a movie right because i was [TS]

00:04:58   interested in the robot and this future [TS]

00:05:00   dystopia and his problems and I I don't [TS]

00:05:04   I didn't see a place I don't think you [TS]

00:05:05   needed humans in there i would just been [TS]

00:05:07   happy a big fat human blobs right [TS]

00:05:10   it almost would have been better if they [TS]

00:05:11   have been brought to the spaceship in [TS]

00:05:12   the intake could have come up with some [TS]

00:05:13   clever way to avoid ever seeing the [TS]

00:05:15   humans while still knowing they were [TS]

00:05:17   there or just have them being like cryo [TS]

00:05:19   freeze all the humans are gone and [TS]

00:05:21   robots are there and it's the robots [TS]

00:05:23   were sent down because the robots are [TS]

00:05:24   trying to recolonize and he would be [TS]

00:05:25   rejoined by robot like his dilemma our [TS]

00:05:27   main character they're with is I'm alone [TS]

00:05:30   I'm in a bad time in this bad place and [TS]

00:05:32   I'm trying to do all this [TS]

00:05:34   do what I think i'm supposed to do but [TS]

00:05:36   it's just a an impossible task and now a [TS]

00:05:38   visitor comes and finally i'm not alone [TS]

00:05:40   but it's intriguing and she's different [TS]

00:05:41   than like that's the story I don't want [TS]

00:05:43   to hear about fat people who don't float [TS]

00:05:45   around on chairs I don't want to hear [TS]

00:05:46   about pollution you know where you fit [TS]

00:05:48   Ratzenberger and then if you do that uh [TS]

00:05:50   yeah there's always a place you can take [TS]

00:05:52   the fred willard I so I don't know you [TS]

00:05:54   got back on Wally too much because that [TS]

00:05:56   first half really is great i know you're [TS]

00:05:58   right they could just have them be in [TS]

00:06:00   cryo suspension and have it be like well [TS]

00:06:02   you know people they were good people [TS]

00:06:04   got fat and tired and we just what they [TS]

00:06:06   decided to wait it out [TS]

00:06:07   you don't even need to do the fat thing [TS]

00:06:09   that the people could all be dead and [TS]

00:06:10   you could have a an emergence of a hot [TS]

00:06:12   but the whole thing is about you know [TS]

00:06:14   because we do we need people we have [TS]

00:06:16   these characters who we relate to who [TS]

00:06:18   have everything that people have there's [TS]

00:06:20   no reason that people [TS]

00:06:21   well this is something that you [TS]

00:06:22   mentioned in your in your hypercritical [TS]

00:06:24   podcast is is the question [TS]

00:06:28   they've got this whole story process [TS]

00:06:30   that picture they do seem to take risks [TS]

00:06:32   they make these amazing movies and [TS]

00:06:33   sometimes you wonder if they didn't [TS]

00:06:35   quite take enough of a risk and i think [TS]

00:06:36   this is one of those cases where [TS]

00:06:38   there as they did they felt like they [TS]

00:06:40   took a risk [TS]

00:06:41   it's almost like mitigated their lack of [TS]

00:06:43   risk-taking in the whole movie by doing [TS]

00:06:45   the big risk with the dialogue list [TS]

00:06:47   first 15 minutes but the real risk would [TS]

00:06:50   have been to say you know what [TS]

00:06:52   there are no people there is no dialogue [TS]

00:06:55   it is all robots and they didn't do that [TS]

00:06:58   they kind of stuck the fat people in [TS]

00:07:01   there with a fairly easy kind of a [TS]

00:07:04   satirical message and you know i'm not [TS]

00:07:07   sure it was really necessary [TS]

00:07:09   you know I don't think having no [TS]

00:07:10   dialogue without much of a risk because [TS]

00:07:12   kids of all people get me tom and jerry [TS]

00:07:14   has no dialogue and one of my son's [TS]

00:07:16   favorite cartoon kids of all people get [TS]

00:07:18   ya pantomime and like they don't need [TS]

00:07:20   dialogue dialogue distraction for them [TS]

00:07:22   and their the risk wasn't so much that [TS]

00:07:24   they weren't going to have people [TS]

00:07:24   because you know cars has no people toy [TS]

00:07:27   story has limited people like that toy [TS]

00:07:29   the thing is that pixar tends to make [TS]

00:07:31   inanimate objects or other things that [TS]

00:07:33   aren't people people like but these [TS]

00:07:34   robots and Wally were not people like [TS]

00:07:36   and you're like they were I mean [TS]

00:07:38   obviously they were content with being [TS]

00:07:40   an actress but but they were they were [TS]

00:07:43   different they were alien some somewhat [TS]

00:07:45   they didn't act exactly like people they [TS]

00:07:47   didn't talk they didn't express things [TS]

00:07:49   the same way you know what he didn't say [TS]

00:07:50   anything at all eve spoke very [TS]

00:07:52   differently and had very different [TS]

00:07:53   attitude you know they had personalities [TS]

00:07:55   but the head machine personalities and [TS]

00:07:57   that would have been the risk to say [TS]

00:07:58   we're not going to take a robot and make [TS]

00:08:00   it just like your neighbor gym is not [TS]

00:08:02   going to be neighbor Jim robot robots [TS]

00:08:03   robots and they are intelligent beings [TS]

00:08:06   in this universe and infinitely emotions [TS]

00:08:08   they have feelings and emotions but [TS]

00:08:10   they're a little bit different than you [TS]

00:08:11   a little bit alien that would have been [TS]

00:08:13   you know the suspending someone an [TS]

00:08:14   entire movie where everything is [TS]

00:08:16   slightly alien that probably would have [TS]

00:08:17   been a risk and interested just doing [TS]

00:08:20   since we talked about the things that [TS]

00:08:21   hyper-girl give it a quick summary of it [TS]

00:08:23   here and then the cars two things with [TS]

00:08:25   my argument was that pixar before cars 2 [TS]

00:08:30   by making a series by never making a bad [TS]

00:08:32   movie they had figured out how to [TS]

00:08:34   engineer the process to avoid making a [TS]

00:08:36   bad movie but it was preventing them [TS]

00:08:38   from make a trend making a [TS]

00:08:39   transcendently good movie and my my [TS]

00:08:41   comparison was that have you asked John [TS]

00:08:43   Lasseter have you ever made a movie [TS]

00:08:44   that's better than the best miyazaki [TS]

00:08:46   movie I think he would say no and it's [TS]

00:08:48   because miyazaki is not afraid to make a [TS]

00:08:50   stinky movie [TS]

00:08:51   his great movies are really great [TS]

00:08:53   because he's willing to try and do [TS]

00:08:55   things that are way outside the norm [TS]

00:08:57   whereas I feel like Pixar keeps itself [TS]

00:09:00   within semi well-defined boundaries [TS]

00:09:02   making a series of great movies in some [TS]

00:09:04   really great ones but the best of pixar [TS]

00:09:07   in my opinion and I think in the opinion [TS]

00:09:09   of the people who work at Pixar is not [TS]

00:09:11   better than the best miyazaki movie they [TS]

00:09:13   just have a massively higher average is [TS]

00:09:15   probably some sports analogy the Jason [TS]

00:09:17   can make at this point [TS]

00:09:18   yeah its value over replacement player [TS]

00:09:20   with a park neutral now I got to know [TS]

00:09:24   the odds you're gonna make some Yankee [TS]

00:09:25   slow the only argument I'd make is that [TS]

00:09:27   is the is the incredibles is a great i [TS]

00:09:32   think a great movie [TS]

00:09:33   oh yeah now i'm not saying i just i'm [TS]

00:09:35   such a but it's not in such a huge [TS]

00:09:36   miyazaki fan and you know it John [TS]

00:09:38   Lasseter that's why I'm making that [TS]

00:09:40   particular comparison and the [TS]

00:09:41   incredibles i think one of the reasons [TS]

00:09:42   its greatest that it's got its got Brad [TS]

00:09:45   Bird right i mean but it is a it is the [TS]

00:09:48   one example if you look at the wikipedia [TS]

00:09:50   page for pics are listed pixar films you [TS]

00:09:53   know it's the only movie that they have [TS]

00:09:54   made where the writer and director and [TS]

00:09:57   story is one guy and it's brad bird [TS]

00:10:01   that's his movie he made that movie he [TS]

00:10:03   owns it [TS]

00:10:04   it's his and I think that maybe the [TS]

00:10:07   reason one of the reasons why it's so [TS]

00:10:09   great it's not that it wasn't a team [TS]

00:10:11   effort but there was actually some [TS]

00:10:13   singular vision in it right in a movie [TS]

00:10:16   by committee and he and brad bird had [TS]

00:10:18   come to Pixar right so he hadn't been [TS]

00:10:20   there before he wasn't part of that [TS]

00:10:21   glass eyes so it that in itself is maybe [TS]

00:10:24   telling that their greatest work is an [TS]

00:10:27   outlier and a and it's not up a result [TS]

00:10:30   of the process in the same way that all [TS]

00:10:32   the other movies are all i would say [TS]

00:10:34   like it you said I was not a movie by [TS]

00:10:36   committee if you look at that same [TS]

00:10:37   wikipedia page and lists like that's a [TS]

00:10:39   hell of a committee I mean we can bring [TS]

00:10:40   about you know Canada yet John Lasseter [TS]

00:10:43   and Peter doctor and you know it's like [TS]

00:10:45   and read and understand me if you want [TS]

00:10:47   to have a committee of three or four [TS]

00:10:48   people it's not bad having them in your [TS]

00:10:49   government and that's why they make all [TS]

00:10:51   good want to make that's my good movies [TS]

00:10:53   and most of the time in a great movie so [TS]

00:10:55   but they you know to punch through you [TS]

00:10:58   you need to be able to do you need to be [TS]

00:10:59   willing to risk make a duck because [TS]

00:11:01   Miyazaki's made some movies that are [TS]

00:11:03   just like you didn't quite make it [TS]

00:11:05   quite connector is just a little bit too [TS]

00:11:06   weird or it fails in one obvious way or [TS]

00:11:09   another that any of these story [TS]

00:11:10   committees of these three or four [TS]

00:11:12   amazingly talented pixar guys would have [TS]

00:11:13   would have told me sake [TS]

00:11:15   here's where your movies falling apart [TS]

00:11:16   and would have tried to fix it but that [TS]

00:11:18   doesn't happen it's doing here generally [TS]

00:11:20   apparently and you just got to make [TS]

00:11:22   whatever you want it let him make those [TS]

00:11:23   transcended ones and the whole thing was [TS]

00:11:25   like all you're just asking for failure [TS]

00:11:26   with cars to it isn't that your failure [TS]

00:11:28   that you wanted [TS]

00:11:29   I haven't seen cars to yet if cars to [TS]

00:11:31   fail because it was too ambitious than [TS]

00:11:33   yes but i have a feeling it did not fail [TS]

00:11:35   because it was ambitious i found a [TS]

00:11:37   feeling its I don't think it's probably [TS]

00:11:39   gonna be a failure at all when i watched [TS]

00:11:41   i think i'm going to say that was an ok [TS]

00:11:42   movie i think it was just probably to [TS]

00:11:45   conventional right too timid to i don't [TS]

00:11:48   know i haven't seen it it's hard for me [TS]

00:11:50   to say but my and I haven't seen it [TS]

00:11:51   either i was disappointed when the [TS]

00:11:53   trailer came out because i wasn't aware [TS]

00:11:54   that they were actually making cards too [TS]

00:11:56   and I was disappointed because I felt [TS]

00:11:58   that was a failure of ambition not [TS]

00:12:00   because the movie wouldn't necessarily [TS]

00:12:01   be creative and it sounds like they made [TS]

00:12:04   a very different movie from cars that [TS]

00:12:06   it's more of a sort of spy inflected and [TS]

00:12:08   international kind of movie and and [TS]

00:12:10   maybe it's a lot of fun but it and I i [TS]

00:12:13   know some people with Pixar but I I [TS]

00:12:15   don't know any behind-the-scenes and I [TS]

00:12:17   feel you know I it's difficult for me to [TS]

00:12:19   put to make a guess about what the [TS]

00:12:22   internal struggle is about this but it's [TS]

00:12:24   very hard for me to look at cars tues [TS]

00:12:26   existence and not think well cars was [TS]

00:12:29   the pet project the guy who runs the [TS]

00:12:30   studio John Lasseter it's he's a car nut [TS]

00:12:34   it's his favorite subject and now [TS]

00:12:36   they're making a sequel hard for me to [TS]

00:12:39   not look at that and say maybe they're [TS]

00:12:41   not making this for the right reasons [TS]

00:12:42   maybe they're making this because he's [TS]

00:12:44   the boss and he loves this and they're [TS]

00:12:48   going to do it again at part of its cars [TS]

00:12:50   is my least favorite Pixar movie by far [TS]

00:12:52   not that it's bad but it's my least [TS]

00:12:55   favorite and of all the movies for them [TS]

00:12:57   to make a sequel to next for it to be [TS]

00:13:00   cars like really when you've got [TS]

00:13:02   monsters incorporated when you've got [TS]

00:13:04   the incredibles you know it you've got [TS]

00:13:08   so many other choices and its cars to it [TS]

00:13:11   just seems so easy and it's got you know [TS]

00:13:13   marketing potential because kids can [TS]

00:13:15   make you know you can make cars that [TS]

00:13:17   kids can play with and [TS]

00:13:18   and and you know again it just seemed [TS]

00:13:21   like such a safe choice for them when [TS]

00:13:23   they ought to be doing more original [TS]

00:13:26   things while the money angle is that the [TS]

00:13:28   one convincing part of that not so much [TS]

00:13:30   the bosses wins it's just that car [TS]

00:13:32   merchandise has been selling just like [TS]

00:13:35   its opening weekend for the original [TS]

00:13:37   cars for years it's not like you know [TS]

00:13:39   the movie comes out every by the dolls [TS]

00:13:41   and you forget about your car's [TS]

00:13:42   merchandise is still selling strongly [TS]

00:13:44   we've got and we've got two majors in [TS]

00:13:46   our house but i'd rather me when my [TS]

00:13:48   girls I have so the fact that this [TS]

00:13:50   merchandise has been selling so well [TS]

00:13:52   years after the movie has been out you [TS]

00:13:55   know without even the sequel hyping it [TS]

00:13:57   up or anything you consider this like [TS]

00:13:59   this is their funding the rest of their [TS]

00:14:01   more ambitious projects and the thing [TS]

00:14:03   about cars 2 is when I saw their wedding [TS]

00:14:04   card too I felt the same way but then I [TS]

00:14:06   thought well they made toy story 2 and I [TS]

00:14:08   thought that was going to be a disaster [TS]

00:14:09   yeah sure as heck wasn't you know like [TS]

00:14:11   why don't make sequel itís don't make [TS]

00:14:12   sequels it also i said we'll find I i'm [TS]

00:14:15   going to give this movie the benefit of [TS]

00:14:16   the doubt because I you know I thought [TS]

00:14:19   toy story 2 is going to be stupid and [TS]

00:14:20   why make a sequel or toy story three for [TS]

00:14:22   that matter they're making a third moist [TS]

00:14:24   or not they have enough for stories but [TS]

00:14:26   against and maybe we should wait for [TS]

00:14:27   purportedly on the way [TS]

00:14:28   yeah yeah so I mean you know until they [TS]

00:14:31   make a bad one you know but it's just [TS]

00:14:32   because this is a sequel it I don't I [TS]

00:14:35   don't fault them for because you can [TS]

00:14:36   make sequels good and again I haven't [TS]

00:14:38   seen the movie but even if it just turns [TS]

00:14:40   out to be a so-so kids movie if it makes [TS]

00:14:44   a lot of money and it funds the more [TS]

00:14:45   ambitious projects i'm all for it [TS]

00:14:47   it didn't start talking about this [TS]

00:14:48   without seeing it I don't think it did [TS]

00:14:50   make my eye I think it's an outlet for [TS]

00:14:52   your toys not the movie [TS]

00:14:54   oh yeah that's true don't know where the [TS]

00:14:55   real money from the movie is made [TS]

00:14:57   come on merchandising now John do you [TS]

00:15:00   have a another picture that you'd like [TS]

00:15:02   to touch on [TS]

00:15:03   yeah that the 1i want to talk about is a [TS]

00:15:05   finding nemo and I its i love Finding [TS]

00:15:10   Nemo I think it's a great movie i think [TS]

00:15:11   it's one of the one of the funniest pics [TS]

00:15:13   are i find myself laughing at Ellen [TS]

00:15:16   DeGeneres nothing more than an where I [TS]

00:15:19   should you [TS]

00:15:21   the I don't know if it's been riding her [TS]

00:15:24   delivery I just find it very funny and I [TS]

00:15:26   think her performance was great but [TS]

00:15:28   that's not what i want to highlight this [TS]

00:15:29   movie I want to highlight it because it [TS]

00:15:31   marks the first time that I really [TS]

00:15:32   noticed pics are really coming into its [TS]

00:15:35   own deciding that they were going to so [TS]

00:15:38   previously had been using animation for [TS]

00:15:40   things and animation is good at and then [TS]

00:15:42   finding nemo they said you know what we [TS]

00:15:45   can do the things that people who make [TS]

00:15:47   like historical pictures or like [TS]

00:15:50   romances or travel movies can do [TS]

00:15:54   having beautiful things having the [TS]

00:15:56   scenery be beautiful and having that add [TS]

00:15:58   to the movie like when you're watching a [TS]

00:15:59   particular movie show a sunset or people [TS]

00:16:00   are driving through Africa or whatever [TS]

00:16:02   that adds to the movie and they said we [TS]

00:16:04   don't have to be timid making rigidbody [TS]

00:16:05   things inside a building with lighting [TS]

00:16:08   from a light bulb in the middle of the [TS]

00:16:09   room we can make beautiful natural [TS]

00:16:11   things we can have and that can add to [TS]

00:16:13   the movie not just you know don't just [TS]

00:16:16   do enough to get it done make shots [TS]

00:16:18   where you dwell on look at this [TS]

00:16:20   beautiful places where these things live [TS]

00:16:21   and even though it's not like that [TS]

00:16:23   wasn't the focus finding nemo and it [TS]

00:16:24   wasn't about the beauty of the ocean [TS]

00:16:25   that's the first time that I think [TS]

00:16:28   they're their technology and their [TS]

00:16:29   ambition combined to let them realize [TS]

00:16:31   that they can do that with movies that [TS]

00:16:33   you know that everybody doesn't have to [TS]

00:16:35   be about that but that but that you can [TS]

00:16:36   do that so if it's appropriate for the [TS]

00:16:38   story it had the equivalent of the magic [TS]

00:16:41   hour in your movies because it adds to [TS]

00:16:43   the experience and everyone I think of [TS]

00:16:45   finding less what I think about i think [TS]

00:16:46   about those various water seems [TS]

00:16:48   inefficient even during the credits they [TS]

00:16:50   had that little scenes with the things [TS]

00:16:52   waving in the water and everything I i [TS]

00:16:54   think that makes it stand out from and i [TS]

00:16:56   hope i hope they're going to do [TS]

00:16:57   something similar with brave because [TS]

00:16:59   they have a similar type of environment [TS]

00:17:00   there but we'll say a beautiful movie [TS]

00:17:03   and the the fact that you never really [TS]

00:17:05   forget that you're in the water but II [TS]

00:17:09   and the quality of the water the quality [TS]

00:17:11   of the fish tank with the junk in it and [TS]

00:17:14   I mean that's just yeah they're in nemo [TS]

00:17:16   it i believe was it was a number one for [TS]

00:17:21   a while was the highest-grossing Pixar [TS]

00:17:24   movie until story story story three came [TS]

00:17:26   out and and it you know rightfully a hit [TS]

00:17:30   because yeah it's a it's it's just a [TS]

00:17:33   great movie i think it's easy to [TS]

00:17:34   overlook at [TS]

00:17:34   because you know well it's nemo but it's [TS]

00:17:37   it's it's great and my kids to this day [TS]

00:17:40   can't see a clown fish in a fish tank [TS]

00:17:43   without app proclaiming it Nemo there's [TS]

00:17:49   a problem we apologize for the [TS]

00:17:51   extinction of the clownfish but uh yeah [TS]

00:17:57   and funny and again you get the picture [TS]

00:17:59   has this tendency to time kind of I [TS]

00:18:02   think say well we were going to [TS]

00:18:03   alternate between the kind of main [TS]

00:18:05   storyline and be kind of wackier zanier [TS]

00:18:08   story which might not work as a whole [TS]

00:18:10   story but we were gonna have it and so [TS]

00:18:12   Nemo himself in the fish tank with his [TS]

00:18:15   cast of wacky characters like Allison [TS]

00:18:18   Janney is in there and brad garrett is [TS]

00:18:20   in there and but Jesus willem dafoe yeah [TS]

00:18:22   i thought was willing to follow as the [TS]

00:18:23   leader of the fish tank [TS]

00:18:26   you know that's wacky with with [TS]

00:18:28   interesting characters that's that's [TS]

00:18:29   like really kind of wacky stuff and and [TS]

00:18:33   then there's the main kind of quest [TS]

00:18:35   story which is also got Ellen DeGeneres [TS]

00:18:38   he's really funny and Albert Brooks [TS]

00:18:39   again well-known person comedian funny [TS]

00:18:42   but not you know just they're being [TS]

00:18:46   Albert Brooks and no kid no kid knows [TS]

00:18:48   who Howard process know now he has [TS]

00:18:50   invented what we'll we'll make a fortune [TS]

00:18:52   but have Albert Brooks headline on [TS]

00:18:54   animated kids movie [TS]

00:18:56   brilliant alright well for my second [TS]

00:18:58   round pick [TS]

00:18:59   I am gonna go with I'm gonna go with toy [TS]

00:19:02   story 2 to our point about sequels and [TS]

00:19:07   being disappointed sequels this was [TS]

00:19:09   going to be a direct-to-video sequel I [TS]

00:19:11   think and at some point somebody saw it [TS]

00:19:14   and said no this is good this should be [TS]

00:19:15   an actual might even bid Steve John as [TS]

00:19:18   it was it was the reverse that a disney [TS]

00:19:20   was going to make toy story 2 and it was [TS]

00:19:22   a piece of crap and they said let's make [TS]

00:19:25   an actual toy story to tell a story [TS]

00:19:27   through is even worse we're through the [TS]

00:19:29   entire movie yes I story to was sort of [TS]

00:19:31   the plan was to make it crappy and pixar [TS]

00:19:34   second and we're not we're not we don't [TS]

00:19:36   make a crappy we're going to go into [TS]

00:19:37   story three they started to make you [TS]

00:19:39   happy movie actually had a garden and [TS]

00:19:41   throughout the crappy movie version of [TS]

00:19:43   our toy story toy story 2 [TS]

00:19:48   interesting you know they went back and [TS]

00:19:50   they made bikes like my like we're going [TS]

00:19:51   back we're making a sequel to toy story [TS]

00:19:53   but it it tells a new story it expands [TS]

00:19:59   the world it is the first punch in the [TS]

00:20:05   gut of many to come [TS]

00:20:07   yes with that and one of the best I [TS]

00:20:09   think maybe the bit when she loved me [TS]

00:20:11   the song by Randy Newman is performed by [TS]

00:20:13   sarah mclachlan / / Jessie the cowgirl [TS]

00:20:16   story of you know basically toy story 3 [TS]

00:20:20   is that song in an entire movie with and [TS]

00:20:26   and if it's you know in minutes that's [TS]

00:20:29   sad that points to but it that this is [TS]

00:20:32   the first time we've got that kind of [TS]

00:20:34   unexpected punch in the gut emotionally [TS]

00:20:36   and you know it's got Kelsey Grammer is [TS]

00:20:40   it lives in a box and it's got way night [TS]

00:20:44   as the crazy collector which says [TS]

00:20:46   something about like how not to view a [TS]

00:20:48   toy have a have a toy on my shelf in my [TS]

00:20:51   in my house that's a it's it's a micro [TS]

00:20:54   not actually but it's a replica and it's [TS]

00:20:57   still in the box and every time my kids [TS]

00:20:59   say we need to get that out of the box i [TS]

00:21:01   think god i i i i am like the old [TS]

00:21:05   prospector and toys to return to the [TS]

00:21:07   bodies kids never been opened its a toy [TS]

00:21:09   that hasn't been played with it's a [TS]

00:21:11   horrible perversion and I ought to just [TS]

00:21:13   rip it out of the box you are stinky [TS]

00:21:15   Pete the podcaster I am I am stinky Pete [TS]

00:21:19   that's right the stinky Pete the plot [TS]

00:21:21   against hot caster so a toy story 2 [TS]

00:21:25   didn't didn't have to be it didn't have [TS]

00:21:27   to be good at all i believe it's a [TS]

00:21:28   hundred percent rotten tomatoes right [TS]

00:21:29   it's not just good it's great it's it's [TS]

00:21:32   got emotional depth at the first movie [TS]

00:21:34   didn't didn't even have it still I think [TS]

00:21:38   one of Pixar's very best which is saying [TS]

00:21:42   a lot because it was early and I think [TS]

00:21:43   it's to be preferred over toy story 3 as [TS]

00:21:45   well yeah I like toy story 3 a lot and [TS]

00:21:48   there's a scene you know the one of the [TS]

00:21:51   most recent punches in the gut is that [TS]

00:21:53   seen toy story three at the end where [TS]

00:21:56   basically something else my wife and I [TS]

00:21:59   were talking about it that's the scene [TS]

00:22:00   that basic [TS]

00:22:01   he is we're all gonna die there's [TS]

00:22:03   nothing you can do about it you might as [TS]

00:22:05   well make friends with the people that [TS]

00:22:06   you've gotten life because in the end [TS]

00:22:07   we're all gonna die and there's nothing [TS]

00:22:09   you can do and it's inevitable and oh [TS]

00:22:10   god oh god were doomed and they actually [TS]

00:22:12   have that whole moment and then it's [TS]

00:22:14   like oh and then there and then kids [TS]

00:22:16   they're saved [TS]

00:22:17   that's right everything will be fine and [TS]

00:22:19   they will live happily ever after [TS]

00:22:20   meanwhile the parents the movie like oh [TS]

00:22:22   god do is ruined [TS]

00:22:26   yeah see the thing was three for me [TS]

00:22:28   though is the same thing that the same [TS]

00:22:29   issue that I sort of have with up which [TS]

00:22:32   is that were bookended by these really [TS]

00:22:33   great emotional moments and then the [TS]

00:22:35   middle is this kind of pedestrian [TS]

00:22:37   jailbreak movie and and so much of it is [TS]

00:22:41   just a rehash of the character [TS]

00:22:43   interactions that we've seen the first [TS]

00:22:44   David baby is like a statistically [TS]

00:22:46   manipulative teddy bear I mean right no [TS]

00:22:50   no that's great very good that that's a [TS]

00:22:52   it's a very good jailbreak film but in [TS]

00:22:55   contrast a toy story 2 which i think is [TS]

00:22:57   strong and end and carries that [TS]

00:23:00   emotional depth is kind of an [TS]

00:23:01   undercurrent you're obviously peaking at [TS]

00:23:03   the when she loved me moment but I mean [TS]

00:23:06   that the the whole film is kind of a [TS]

00:23:08   mean as soon as as we we have a woody [TS]

00:23:13   meeting the rest of the roundup gang you [TS]

00:23:14   know you've got this this sense of loss [TS]

00:23:16   and loneliness and and and the [TS]

00:23:19   abandonment that the other characters [TS]

00:23:22   felt you know when when everybody loved [TS]

00:23:24   woody and nobody cared about bullseye [TS]

00:23:26   and stinky Pete and Jesse Jesse Jesse [TS]

00:23:28   Jesse yes and in it i think it's it's [TS]

00:23:32   just so much stronger film because it it [TS]

00:23:34   holds onto that the whole way whereas [TS]

00:23:36   toy story 3 you know again i think is is [TS]

00:23:38   in parts that good and then kind of [TS]

00:23:43   loses it for me in the middle so yeah [TS]

00:23:45   it's easily the strongest I think of the [TS]

00:23:46   toy stories and that's the problem with [TS]

00:23:49   the Toy Story franchise is that they are [TS]

00:23:50   they're running out of things for the [TS]

00:23:53   characters to do first movie was about [TS]

00:23:54   was about woody you know and the invader [TS]

00:23:57   buzz second movie had wooden bus [TS]

00:23:59   together facing a challenge but the [TS]

00:24:00   secondary characters have always kind of [TS]

00:24:03   been there for gags and we're kind of [TS]

00:24:04   running out of we're running out of [TS]

00:24:06   character development for forwarded how [TS]

00:24:09   many more slinkies are long jokes can [TS]

00:24:11   you make ya for Woody and Buzz were [TS]

00:24:13   running out of things to their character [TS]

00:24:14   to do they both have relationships that [TS]

00:24:16   have sort of been established with these [TS]

00:24:17   other you know people in a way and [TS]

00:24:19   everything but at and but decide [TS]

00:24:21   characters had never been truly solid [TS]

00:24:23   characters and they needed to give them [TS]

00:24:24   something to do in toy story 3 but I [TS]

00:24:26   story three was more about Andy's [TS]

00:24:27   relationship with the toys you know as [TS]

00:24:31   pantomimed through the toys actions you [TS]

00:24:34   know it was kind of a mirror image where [TS]

00:24:36   at the end of the movie the boy has to [TS]

00:24:38   go through the same type of thing that [TS]

00:24:39   slice themselves have to go to being [TS]

00:24:40   abandoned so on and so forth but if in a [TS]

00:24:42   for what do you do with these characters [TS]

00:24:44   like the ones that we cared about were [TS]

00:24:46   woody buzz his relationship with Andi [TS]

00:24:49   and Andy's fan like that whole [TS]

00:24:51   everything seems to be all tied up and [TS]

00:24:53   now you have to like come up with some [TS]

00:24:54   sort of news that seems like a mistake [TS]

00:24:56   to me Toy Story the next generation a [TS]

00:24:59   whole new group until is now the girl [TS]

00:25:02   that they're left within in the box at [TS]

00:25:04   the end of toy story 3 now she'll be [TS]

00:25:06   going off to school and will be sad [TS]

00:25:09   again [TS]

00:25:09   yeah I like it but now they're old hat [TS]

00:25:11   like now they've been through it before [TS]

00:25:12   now they're more of the grizzled veteran [TS]

00:25:14   toys where they understand that you know [TS]

00:25:16   this was their first owner you get the [TS]

00:25:18   impression and he was their first owner [TS]

00:25:20   addresses the sort of the Ark of the [TS]

00:25:21   toys life and encountering these other [TS]

00:25:23   toys who have been through that arc once [TS]

00:25:25   before and come out worse for it shows [TS]

00:25:28   like now here's are our heroes coming [TS]

00:25:29   out of it and understanding that they [TS]

00:25:31   don't have to be bitter like the Baron [TS]

00:25:33   you know it just seems like there's not [TS]

00:25:34   much for them to go i don't know how [TS]

00:25:37   much of a new place them to go with a 4 [TS]

00:25:38   right well my really think you can [TS]

00:25:40   really do is introduce a whole batch of [TS]

00:25:41   new characters and and that's gonna be a [TS]

00:25:43   disaster before it even starts [TS]

00:25:45   yeah well i mean if you make a new cable [TS]

00:25:47   cast of characters you if you decide to [TS]

00:25:49   make an entirely new movie that's fine [TS]

00:25:51   just kind of making a new movie happened [TS]

00:25:53   to using toys as actors you could do [TS]

00:25:55   that successfully and just capitalized [TS]

00:25:57   in Toy Story brand but i don't know i [TS]

00:26:00   think the other thing i want to say [TS]

00:26:00   speaking of the montage with jesse is in [TS]

00:26:04   my challenge to Pixar is the things they [TS]

00:26:06   do in those montages I with is just [TS]

00:26:10   music and and scenes and stuff like that [TS]

00:26:12   where you're you're experiencing [TS]

00:26:14   something that they're trying to show [TS]

00:26:16   you the loss of you know loss of [TS]

00:26:17   innocent people getting all that type of [TS]

00:26:18   thing [TS]

00:26:19   look viewed from the perspective of us [TS]

00:26:22   have a situation that will never will [TS]

00:26:23   never be in so it's like kind of an [TS]

00:26:25   allegory like a toy the person growing [TS]

00:26:27   up not want [TS]

00:26:28   play with the toy people can relate that [TS]

00:26:30   to real situations in their life and [TS]

00:26:31   their own relationships but it's but [TS]

00:26:33   it's it it's by way of an analogy and [TS]

00:26:36   it's under montage my challenge that [TS]

00:26:37   would to be to do a scene like that that [TS]

00:26:41   has a similar message but not as a [TS]

00:26:44   montage and head on and that's really [TS]

00:26:47   hard to do like the greatest of the [TS]

00:26:48   greatest movies have emotional scenes [TS]

00:26:50   between peoples we're really talking [TS]

00:26:51   about what they're talking about it and [TS]

00:26:52   it's not reminding you of something [TS]

00:26:55   because it's an allegory or fable or [TS]

00:26:59   fantastical situation it's like a real [TS]

00:27:00   one or whatever I think they they're not [TS]

00:27:03   there shying away from but i think they [TS]

00:27:05   can do it like you can make you can make [TS]

00:27:07   that the text and not have it be the [TS]

00:27:09   subtext I and still pull it off I i [TS]

00:27:12   totally believe that they have the [TS]

00:27:13   strength to that's thus far [TS]

00:27:15   maybe it's because they make kid movies [TS]

00:27:16   or whatever they mostly shied away for [TS]

00:27:18   the most of come at an angle sometimes [TS]

00:27:19   when you come in an angle that's how it [TS]

00:27:21   catches you because like we don't care [TS]

00:27:23   that this toy is missing its owner like [TS]

00:27:25   Arizona is growing up and not being [TS]

00:27:27   interested in playing with it again [TS]

00:27:28   because we know where that's not the the [TS]

00:27:32   text of the story is not what we're [TS]

00:27:33   getting upset about its the [TS]

00:27:34   you-know-whats relating to if you gave [TS]

00:27:37   us a real scene where someone was in the [TS]

00:27:40   relationship that was drifting apart or [TS]

00:27:42   whatever a home movie about that will [TS]

00:27:45   will accept that too is just so much [TS]

00:27:47   harder to do so I not that they're [TS]

00:27:49   cheating so much but that the music [TS]

00:27:51   backed montage triggering childhood [TS]

00:27:55   feelings is even though they do it so [TS]

00:27:58   well it's there's a degree of difficulty [TS]

00:28:01   that's not there that you know they want [TS]

00:28:03   to go to the next level deck do it for [TS]

00:28:04   real do it head-on make that the story [TS]

00:28:06   right and probably the closest they've [TS]

00:28:08   come to that with it would be with the [TS]

00:28:10   incredibles with the whole dynamic that [TS]

00:28:12   that the that mr. incredible inelastic [TS]

00:28:15   will have it at home and I think that's [TS]

00:28:17   probably why that is so strong right or [TS]

00:28:21   again they're elastic are wrapping [TS]

00:28:23   around the people like that's that was [TS]

00:28:25   that's head-on that's not reminding you [TS]

00:28:27   of what it's like to protect your [TS]

00:28:28   children its that's the story she's [TS]

00:28:30   doing that in the story so one of my [TS]

00:28:33   questions I that I was gonna get to it [TS]

00:28:35   very and i thought i'd ask now because [TS]

00:28:37   of what John just said which is what i [TS]

00:28:41   want to know [TS]

00:28:41   you think pixar should do next not [TS]

00:28:44   necessarily they're very next movie [TS]

00:28:46   because we know that's going to be brave [TS]

00:28:47   which is set in Scotland as a female [TS]

00:28:49   protagonist and I it looks like going to [TS]

00:28:53   the wikipedia and wikipedia doesn't lie [TS]

00:28:55   there is a monster's inc sequel in the [TS]

00:28:57   offing I'm just looking more generally [TS]

00:28:59   where should pixar go next what would [TS]

00:29:02   you like to see pics are do maybe [TS]

00:29:04   outside their comfort zone a little bit [TS]

00:29:06   what you know what would you like to see [TS]

00:29:08   from them that you know as a as the next [TS]

00:29:13   big thing that makes you sit up and say [TS]

00:29:14   all I you know this is something new [TS]

00:29:17   from pixar one of things i think john [TS]

00:29:19   mentioned in his podcast that I I [TS]

00:29:21   thought about is doing something that's [TS]

00:29:23   really a through-and-through a PG movie [TS]

00:29:26   or p or even our but let's just say PG [TS]

00:29:29   because I think you'll ever do in our [TS]

00:29:30   but a PG movie something that is in a [TS]

00:29:33   genre that they're not comfortable with [TS]

00:29:35   I mean John mentioned you know that they [TS]

00:29:37   took a shot at a romantic comedy and [TS]

00:29:39   ended up kind of killing it [TS]

00:29:41   aurorae a kind of a kind of Moorish [TS]

00:29:44   detective kind of thing I just I wonder [TS]

00:29:46   if they there is something outside of [TS]

00:29:49   their comfort zone that they that they [TS]

00:29:52   could do that would be you know [TS]

00:29:55   interesting to see i'm also interested [TS]

00:29:57   in the fact that andrew stanton is [TS]

00:29:58   directing John Carter of Mars I guess [TS]

00:30:01   has directed which is coming out next [TS]

00:30:02   year that's for disney so it's not [TS]

00:30:06   really pixar but there are not a lot of [TS]

00:30:08   pics our names in the credits and that's [TS]

00:30:10   a live action sci-fi movie and it did [TS]

00:30:13   you see the trailers and I did I did Tim [TS]

00:30:15   Riggins has come a long way from Dillon [TS]

00:30:17   Texas tunis that's pulling me out of it [TS]

00:30:20   a little bit to Mars but but on one [TS]

00:30:23   level I I'm fascinated by that because I [TS]

00:30:25   wonder is this in some ways the first [TS]

00:30:28   live-action Pixar movie a little bit [TS]

00:30:30   maybe you maybe just a little [TS]

00:30:32   and I think doesn't Brad Bird have a [TS]

00:30:35   live-action movie to that he's working [TS]

00:30:36   on so I'm kind of fascinated by that [TS]

00:30:38   these animations Edwards doing a mission [TS]

00:30:40   impossibles any you're right he is he's [TS]

00:30:43   doing mission impossible 4 which which I [TS]

00:30:46   wouldn't be excited about but when I [TS]

00:30:47   think mission impossible from the [TS]

00:30:49   director of the incredibles interesting [TS]

00:30:51   Redbird Redbird can do anything i watch [TS]

00:30:53   this play [TS]

00:30:54   ya on that level but some suggestions I [TS]

00:30:56   made in my podcast kind of still [TS]

00:30:58   standing I was what i was trying to do [TS]

00:30:59   online was come up with the most [TS]

00:31:01   ridiculous things I can think of like I [TS]

00:31:04   was immediately say you know go radar i [TS]

00:31:07   go photorealistic which no one dares do [TS]

00:31:11   because it's so hard to do but like at a [TS]

00:31:13   certain point it's going to be there for [TS]

00:31:15   the taking [TS]

00:31:16   you know and not cartoonish things real [TS]

00:31:19   anatomy real physics hundred percent [TS]

00:31:21   photorealistic wally was really close [TS]

00:31:23   it's easier to do machines but the [TS]

00:31:25   opening sequences of Wally most nothing [TS]

00:31:27   on the screen really reads as a cartoon [TS]

00:31:29   even the cockroaches pretty realistic [TS]

00:31:31   looking but eventually it's going to be [TS]

00:31:34   sitting there right in front of you and [TS]

00:31:35   somebody like so do we know we can do it [TS]

00:31:37   now we've got subsurface scattering we [TS]

00:31:40   can do skin that doesn't look like [TS]

00:31:41   plastic do we wanna go full photo but [TS]

00:31:45   but but i thought now we're thinking [TS]

00:31:46   more about this is that it's probably [TS]

00:31:49   best for them to sneak up on it and the [TS]

00:31:51   the easiest way for them to transition [TS]

00:31:53   into things that are outside their [TS]

00:31:55   comfort zone I feel like is sci-fi and [TS]

00:31:58   it's not hard sci-fi but serious syfy [TS]

00:32:02   where there is yeah at least the serious [TS]

00:32:06   i is say like the wrath of connor empire [TS]

00:32:09   strikes back where you have to fund [TS]

00:32:10   relatively light hearted movie but it's [TS]

00:32:13   not really a kids movie it's a little [TS]

00:32:15   bit too intense for kids and give it [TS]

00:32:18   sort of a dark sci-fi premise that would [TS]

00:32:22   be a way I think pixar can find its way [TS]

00:32:24   out of the child movie ghetto by having [TS]

00:32:27   a pg-13 or PG but have it be sort of a [TS]

00:32:32   gritty dark sci-fi action adventure [TS]

00:32:35   movie that reads like the you that you'd [TS]

00:32:38   watch the same way you would watch you [TS]

00:32:39   know empire strikes back or something [TS]

00:32:41   like that I can't think of a better [TS]

00:32:42   darker so maybe later mate runner but [TS]

00:32:44   not that dark like not only piece like [TS]

00:32:47   Blade Runner like you know justjust a [TS]

00:32:49   good a sci-fi movie for teenagers and [TS]

00:32:54   adults that's not not for kids and [TS]

00:32:57   sci-fi is not that far from their [TS]

00:32:58   comfort zone I feel and they haven't [TS]

00:33:00   really done with the exception of Wally [TS]

00:33:01   they haven't really really done that [TS]

00:33:03   like a new IP you know or don't or make [TS]

00:33:07   it up make it [TS]

00:33:07   a making an adaptation of something [TS]

00:33:10   that's not well-known don't pick another [TS]

00:33:12   philip k dick story and just come out [TS]

00:33:15   with something like that to to say that [TS]

00:33:17   boy this is really great sci-fi movie [TS]

00:33:19   that's it's not like transformers that's [TS]

00:33:21   an actual great movie and also happens [TS]

00:33:23   to be science fiction that [TS]

00:33:24   science-fiction fans like sort of like a [TS]

00:33:26   game of thrones is done for fantasy you [TS]

00:33:28   know what I mean we're Game of Thrones [TS]

00:33:29   is a fantasy thing but it's it raises [TS]

00:33:33   the level of the best of television [TS]

00:33:35   dramas well they can make a sci-fi movie [TS]

00:33:37   that raised the level of the best of you [TS]

00:33:40   know action adventure science-fiction [TS]

00:33:42   human drama was it just happens to be [TS]

00:33:44   sci-fi that I think is their way in [TS]

00:33:46   verses going all the way for the I you [TS]

00:33:49   know for the realistic murder mystery to [TS]

00:33:51   our thing which I think might be because [TS]

00:33:54   the people would say like all we can't [TS]

00:33:56   take it seriously like you can't you [TS]

00:33:57   know is it you know make schindler's [TS]

00:33:59   list but with CJ you gotta go get there [TS]

00:34:02   in a world that is not even close to [TS]

00:34:04   being our world so people are a little [TS]

00:34:06   more accepting of the deviations from [TS]

00:34:07   reality right suspension of disbelief is [TS]

00:34:10   already there right but still have it be [TS]

00:34:12   you know a real real live movie for [TS]

00:34:16   adults not kids movies and very you know [TS]

00:34:18   do with trying to do with no comedy [TS]

00:34:20   relief like that would be the challenge [TS]

00:34:21   pixar expects are everything they do [TS]

00:34:23   there's something like funny awry about [TS]

00:34:25   it can you make a good quality movie [TS]

00:34:27   without lots of humor it's possible [TS]

00:34:29   especially in sci-fi you can make a good [TS]

00:34:30   exciting action adventure sci-fi movie [TS]

00:34:33   that's not funny joke time right you can [TS]

00:34:36   have some jokes in it but it needs to be [TS]

00:34:38   more than that like serenity is actually [TS]

00:34:40   a pretty good movie but it's got its got [TS]

00:34:42   jokes in it but miles up with the [TS]

00:34:44   wheeling the whedon is deep down and now [TS]

00:34:47   he's had everything we needed service [TS]

00:34:49   uncensor I could remember I wouldn't [TS]

00:34:51   advocate serenity being the model for a [TS]

00:34:53   picture sci-fi movie but it's to it [TS]

00:34:55   springs to mind is a fun sci-fi movie [TS]

00:34:57   that still got some jokes in it but it's [TS]

00:35:00   not the not the point it i get on back [TS]

00:35:02   to Empire which will eventually podcast [TS]

00:35:04   about which has jokes in it and is funny [TS]

00:35:06   but takes itself a hundred percent [TS]

00:35:07   seriously like it its it takes itself [TS]

00:35:09   seriously as a movie and all possible [TS]

00:35:12   levels and I think they can make a [TS]

00:35:13   science-fiction movie that's not [TS]

00:35:16   derivative anything that if they again [TS]

00:35:18   if they get an equivalent of brad bird [TS]

00:35:19   who has this great idea for an awesome [TS]

00:35:21   sci-fi movie that takes itself seriously [TS]

00:35:22   and he's super talented like brad bird [TS]

00:35:25   there you go alright well i doubt i'll [TS]

00:35:29   pick up where you left off Jason and say [TS]

00:35:30   I'd like to see what would happen if [TS]

00:35:31   they tried their hand at a live-action [TS]

00:35:32   film I mean obviously the animation is [TS]

00:35:35   is what they became known for and it was [TS]

00:35:37   really their calling card and now [TS]

00:35:39   they've excelled at it to such an extent [TS]

00:35:41   that you almost watch the film and [TS]

00:35:44   forget that it's animated at times it [TS]

00:35:46   and that's really what's so impressive [TS]

00:35:47   about it he'll step back once in awhile [TS]

00:35:50   you look at the of the same like the [TS]

00:35:52   Paradise Falls vista and up or again [TS]

00:35:55   although the great underwater stuff and [TS]

00:35:57   finding nemo and you go wow that's [TS]

00:35:58   that's really impressive stuff but the [TS]

00:36:01   reason pixar films are so great is not [TS]

00:36:03   because of the animation it's not [TS]

00:36:04   because the animation is so fantastic [TS]

00:36:06   and well done [TS]

00:36:07   it's because the story and the process [TS]

00:36:09   that they they put together to come up [TS]

00:36:10   with a story and the scripting and the [TS]

00:36:12   characters is is so fantastically [TS]

00:36:15   conceived and I'd be really curious to [TS]

00:36:18   see what would happen if they took that [TS]

00:36:19   same process and and applied it to live [TS]

00:36:23   action and we've seen you know how close [TS]

00:36:26   to two storyboards films can look these [TS]

00:36:30   days with CGI and whatnot you know with [TS]

00:36:32   a with watch man [TS]

00:36:33   watchmen and other comic book films that [TS]

00:36:34   are almost no for no copies from comic [TS]

00:36:38   panels for instance you know so i think [TS]

00:36:40   i think they could really almost go down [TS]

00:36:43   to that level that they do with the [TS]

00:36:44   animation where they a storyboard every [TS]

00:36:46   single singing every single you know [TS]

00:36:47   facial tic and and I don't know maybe to [TS]

00:36:52   some extent the actors would repeal the [TS]

00:36:53   fact that they were being told you know [TS]

00:36:55   follow such a strict formula but i think [TS]

00:36:59   they could end up with something very [TS]

00:37:01   interesting if they went down that path [TS]

00:37:02   I what you said actually makes me think [TS]

00:37:05   the other the other thing they could do [TS]

00:37:06   and I'm not sure whether there's a good [TS]

00:37:07   creative reason to do this or not but [TS]

00:37:09   you know history is littered with [TS]

00:37:10   attempts to combine live action with [TS]

00:37:12   animation and roger roger rabbit is an [TS]

00:37:15   example and you don't do and Ike dancing [TS]

00:37:18   with ya know that I think they pretty [TS]

00:37:21   much peaked with that with that the [TS]

00:37:22   incredible mr. limpet and it's all been [TS]

00:37:24   downhill since then well I anything [TS]

00:37:25   something like what if she's going to [TS]

00:37:27   have to count a good world you know it [TS]

00:37:29   was sky captain interesting what if they [TS]

00:37:31   found a a good way to kind of mix [TS]

00:37:34   together beyond Fred Willard showing up [TS]

00:37:36   on a on a screen some way to 300 [TS]

00:37:39   yeah well I mean yeah there are lots of [TS]

00:37:42   think of example there are lots of [TS]

00:37:43   theoretically live-action movies that [TS]

00:37:46   are out of a CG practically a mean the [TS]

00:37:48   star wars sorry the Star Wars prequels i [TS]

00:37:50   have to mention it here with their whole [TS]

00:37:52   sections of that I look at my just think [TS]

00:37:55   you know the bladder is this is an [TS]

00:37:57   animated feature at this point yeah the [TS]

00:37:59   race [TS]

00:37:59   yeah some of the stories that i think is [TS]

00:38:01   the most successful because like the [TS]

00:38:03   close-up scenes of that stupid kid look [TS]

00:38:05   horrible and the whole rest of the thing [TS]

00:38:07   which only exists in a computer looks [TS]

00:38:09   great [TS]

00:38:09   yeah yeah so you know it wouldn't be [TS]

00:38:13   that much for them to cross over into [TS]

00:38:14   something that is indescribable about [TS]

00:38:16   whether it's an animated film or live [TS]

00:38:18   action but you're still saying human [TS]

00:38:20   human actors you're still saying like [TS]

00:38:21   that's that's the where the line is [TS]

00:38:23   drawn it's like what your main character [TS]

00:38:24   is a human being and maybe you filmed in [TS]

00:38:26   front of a green screen and it's all [TS]

00:38:27   stylized like 300 or our sin city or [TS]

00:38:30   something like that or maybe that's your [TS]

00:38:31   lifetime movie where it's where it's [TS]

00:38:33   their human characters who are humans [TS]

00:38:35   but there are alien characters who are [TS]

00:38:38   going to be CGI anyway except that [TS]

00:38:39   they're there [TS]

00:38:40   pixar animated characters i saw that [TS]

00:38:44   though the waters of mars i saw John [TS]

00:38:46   Carter of Mars or John Carter whatever [TS]

00:38:48   they're playing cards so that trailer [TS]

00:38:49   and that was much that didn't look too [TS]

00:38:51   great to me like no i don't i would [TS]

00:38:53   rather see them do the final fantasy [TS]

00:38:56   experience within thing the right way [TS]

00:38:58   two decades three decades later like the [TS]

00:39:00   holy spirit of it [TS]

00:39:02   yeah that eventually it's gonna be there [TS]

00:39:03   for the taking it don't make it with [TS]

00:39:05   humans if you're afraid make the entire [TS]

00:39:07   thing make like you know a deepness in [TS]

00:39:09   the sky but with no humans you know like [TS]

00:39:11   if you're afraid of making human right [TS]

00:39:12   pick something else first but or make [TS]

00:39:14   your humans slightly stylized or [TS]

00:39:17   something but but look like reliving [TS]

00:39:19   things like Bobby or something you know [TS]

00:39:20   like they're strange-looking if we have [TS]

00:39:22   I believe the highest grossing film of [TS]

00:39:24   all time is essentially a sci-fi movie [TS]

00:39:25   with live-action and maybe people put [TS]

00:39:28   together which is avatar so maybe that's [TS]

00:39:30   been done [TS]

00:39:31   yeah well I'm it i just think it's [TS]

00:39:33   harder to do I think pixar strength is [TS]

00:39:35   because that's the whole thing all their [TS]

00:39:37   worlds other piece and consistent friend [TS]

00:39:39   will decide you know that there are also [TS]

00:39:42   automatic brother will eventually for [TS]

00:39:46   guy [TS]

00:39:47   eventually why is that red Willard [TS]

00:39:49   should be John Ratzenberger damn it it [TS]

00:39:52   should be anybody you know speaking of [TS]

00:39:54   that the first time I saw it yeah I'm [TS]

00:39:55   like what the hell right but the second [TS]

00:39:57   time I thought didn't even register [TS]

00:39:59   didn't register that it was live action [TS]

00:40:01   I guess I had already gotten over the [TS]

00:40:02   shock and somehow actually fit into the [TS]

00:40:04   movie the second and third and fourth [TS]

00:40:06   time like I don't know why it fits in [TS]

00:40:07   and I the fact that they picked him as [TS]

00:40:09   the actor that fits to like he does a [TS]

00:40:11   little stick I'm like yeah you know he's [TS]

00:40:13   my favorite human in the movies i [TS]

00:40:15   actually thought it was pretty cool [TS]

00:40:16   until I say until I realized we were [TS]

00:40:17   going to see animated people later and [TS]

00:40:19   that's what killed it for now [TS]

00:40:21   last thing I wanted to to do is go [TS]

00:40:23   around and talk about i want to turn [TS]

00:40:25   negative i want to go i wanna go- [TS]

00:40:27   full-on negative I I want you to select [TS]

00:40:29   a movie or part of a movie some put [TS]

00:40:32   something in pixar that we haven't [TS]

00:40:34   covered yet [TS]

00:40:35   ideally that is your least favorite [TS]

00:40:39   thing that Pixar has done [TS]

00:40:41   who would like to be negative alright [TS]

00:40:42   I'll go first I've gotta this is [TS]

00:40:46   probably isn't fair because i've only [TS]

00:40:47   seen his movie I think twice maybe three [TS]

00:40:51   times but it's not one that we own so I [TS]

00:40:53   haven't seen it a thousand times but I [TS]

00:40:54   can see this movie sticks with me the [TS]

00:40:58   least I and i don't i don't think it's a [TS]

00:41:01   bad movie like it's not it's not [TS]

00:41:03   actively bad and nothing in it i can [TS]

00:41:06   point to it that the just it just it [TS]

00:41:08   just doesn't work for me I guess my [TS]

00:41:09   movies ratatouille [TS]

00:41:10   that's the only movie we haven't yet [TS]

00:41:12   mentioned all this time talking at it [TS]

00:41:13   hasn't come up [TS]

00:41:15   yeah now that it has its moments it [TS]

00:41:17   certainly looks beautiful [TS]

00:41:19   I I appreciate what it's trying to do [TS]

00:41:21   but it just does not hold together as a [TS]

00:41:23   cohesive movie for me that I'm [TS]

00:41:25   interested in or that i find myself [TS]

00:41:26   thinking about are coming back to or [TS]

00:41:28   wanted my children to watch or anything [TS]

00:41:30   like that so that's like the worst thing [TS]

00:41:32   you can say about it's just it's just [TS]

00:41:33   blonde again I haven't seen cars to [TS]

00:41:35   maybe cars 2 will have the same effect [TS]

00:41:37   on me i don't know but i hate cars which [TS]

00:41:40   I've seen billions of times it it has a [TS]

00:41:43   certain charm to it that you know and I [TS]

00:41:46   I'm a car guy so maybe that helps a [TS]

00:41:48   little bit too it's certainly not their [TS]

00:41:49   best work but ratatouille is flat from a [TS]

00:41:53   flatter than cars even so that is my [TS]

00:41:55   that is my bottom [TS]

00:41:56   I'm it again and maybe it's not fair [TS]

00:41:57   maybe we need to watch it a few more [TS]

00:41:58   times [TS]

00:41:59   and refresh myself on it but just just [TS]

00:42:01   given my personal impression of its and [TS]

00:42:05   stay with me all right Steve I I find [TS]

00:42:08   hard to come up with the the worst thing [TS]

00:42:10   i can say which probably my least [TS]

00:42:13   favorite film is it might not be a [TS]

00:42:14   popular choice I i think one it doesn't [TS]

00:42:17   do it for me the most is probably toy [TS]

00:42:20   story huh [TS]

00:42:22   and that's it's it's very cool was [TS]

00:42:25   innovative for the time I think the [TS]

00:42:27   problem for me was I didn't actually see [TS]

00:42:29   toy story until i had already seen a [TS]

00:42:31   bug's life I i think it was after [TS]

00:42:34   finding nemo that i finally got around [TS]

00:42:35   to watching the first toy story and so [TS]

00:42:39   much of it is just pics are finding [TS]

00:42:41   their feet and so much it there's so [TS]

00:42:44   much reliance on the toy ponds which are [TS]

00:42:46   good they're funny and the timeless puns [TS]

00:42:48   as timeless as pleasant as can be i was [TS]

00:42:52   a joss whedon jokes and that one too [TS]

00:42:53   right but at the same time there's the [TS]

00:42:56   narrative isn't that strong the people [TS]

00:42:58   look funky you know I i don't think the [TS]

00:43:02   characters really come into their own [TS]

00:43:03   until the second film and a lot of ways [TS]

00:43:06   it is it is they're figuring things out [TS]

00:43:08   right and it's not sure I can forgive it [TS]

00:43:10   for that [TS]

00:43:11   yeah but but it's just it doesn't it [TS]

00:43:13   doesn't do the same thing for me as the [TS]

00:43:15   other ones too and it's it's largely [TS]

00:43:16   because the narrative just isn't strong [TS]

00:43:18   and they haven't really gotten that [TS]

00:43:19   whole they're starting to you know with [TS]

00:43:22   the scene with the with the buzz trying [TS]

00:43:25   to take flight and not being able to do [TS]

00:43:27   it and then the irritating randy newman [TS]

00:43:29   tinkling along the background there [TS]

00:43:31   they're starting to get that sort of [TS]

00:43:32   emotional resonance thing going but it's [TS]

00:43:34   just not really that strong yet and I [TS]

00:43:38   think even ratatouille i think is it is [TS]

00:43:40   better for me while i agree with you [TS]

00:43:42   that it'sit's kind of blah overall as a [TS]

00:43:44   film it does have kind of a weird [TS]

00:43:46   emotional resonance in places and and [TS]

00:43:48   somehow for some reason even though i'm [TS]

00:43:52   not that invested in the character that [TS]

00:43:53   the scene where the food critic each the [TS]

00:43:56   ratatouille and he's immediately brought [TS]

00:43:58   back to his childhood that that one [TS]

00:44:00   nails me for some reason it almost makes [TS]

00:44:02   the rest of the film uh you know much [TS]

00:44:05   more tolerable for me and there's [TS]

00:44:07   nothing like that in Toy Story I mean [TS]

00:44:09   it'sit's just not it's not there yet [TS]

00:44:11   it's still great [TS]

00:44:13   but it's just not on a par with the rest [TS]

00:44:15   of the film's I was going to mention [TS]

00:44:18   ratatouille as well there's a scene i'm [TS]

00:44:23   thinking of a particular although you [TS]

00:44:24   mentioned the critic is interesting that [TS]

00:44:26   is a really careful line they walk [TS]

00:44:28   because there are movies where there are [TS]

00:44:31   characters of critics and they are [TS]

00:44:34   savage as being talentless people who do [TS]

00:44:37   nothing but tear down other people's [TS]

00:44:38   work and every time I see that in a [TS]

00:44:40   movie I want to throw something at the [TS]

00:44:42   screen because you know again criticism [TS]

00:44:44   uh because because I I am I in my mind [TS]

00:44:49   there is nothing more classless then a [TS]

00:44:54   maker of movies getting revenge at movie [TS]

00:44:58   critics by by insulting them in their [TS]

00:45:02   next movie and you see this hat it it [TS]

00:45:05   happens right at tooheys depiction of [TS]

00:45:07   that critic is right on the edges peter [TS]

00:45:09   o'toole i think is the voice of the [TS]

00:45:10   critic um because on one level he is [TS]

00:45:13   portrayed as being this just miserable [TS]

00:45:15   son of a gun who hates everything and [TS]

00:45:19   he's mean and you know and you can't [TS]

00:45:21   please him and and yet when you finally [TS]

00:45:25   see him there is that scene where he's [TS]

00:45:28   taken back to the reasons that he always [TS]

00:45:30   loved food in the first place and then [TS]

00:45:33   he raves about it and it humanizes him [TS]

00:45:35   on one level where i kinda want to [TS]

00:45:36   forgive it on another level though I [TS]

00:45:38   feel like what it's really saying is if [TS]

00:45:41   only critics would remember that they [TS]

00:45:43   love watching movies they would stop [TS]

00:45:46   criticizing it and being so mean [TS]

00:45:48   which is just a biggest load of horsemen [TS]

00:45:51   that you could possibly imagine and and [TS]

00:45:54   and I you know honestly it as much [TS]

00:45:57   education as i have heaped upon brad [TS]

00:46:00   bird for the incredibles um if he if [TS]

00:46:04   he's the guy who hatched that concept [TS]

00:46:07   he should be embarrassed for himself [TS]

00:46:08   because it's it's it's it's ridiculous [TS]

00:46:12   people you know you know what your movie [TS]

00:46:16   maker people get to criticize your work [TS]

00:46:17   suck it up [TS]

00:46:19   so anyway that that's an offense me and [TS]

00:46:22   that's not the scene that bothers me the [TS]

00:46:23   most about to we've seen that bothers me [TS]

00:46:25   the most in ratatouille [TS]

00:46:26   the scene that I think undercuts the [TS]

00:46:28   entire premise of the movie i believe [TS]

00:46:30   that they're in this fantasy world where [TS]

00:46:31   a rat to grab onto a kid's head and make [TS]

00:46:35   him make food by a real filled with hair [TS]

00:46:39   it connects to his limbs [TS]

00:46:40   it's amazing of the hair pulls on his [TS]

00:46:44   brain and his anyway [TS]

00:46:46   that alone should be public health and [TS]

00:46:48   undercuts p hair stuff to cook so public [TS]

00:46:51   health hazard [TS]

00:46:52   it's the scene where they bring all the [TS]

00:46:54   rats from the sewers of Paris into the [TS]

00:46:56   kitchen because the kitchen staff is [TS]

00:46:58   quit and you and there's a moment where [TS]

00:47:01   I'm sitting here thinking well this is [TS]

00:47:02   odd because these are the vermin is now [TS]

00:47:04   in the kitchen but the rats are friends [TS]

00:47:06   so it's okay that part doesn't bother me [TS]

00:47:08   what bothers me is in an attempt to I [TS]

00:47:10   think to smooth out people's concern [TS]

00:47:12   about rats in the kitchen they show a [TS]

00:47:14   scene where the rats are sterilized by [TS]

00:47:16   being run through the dishwasher and [TS]

00:47:18   then the rats come out of the dishwasher [TS]

00:47:20   and I think we're meant to think is oh [TS]

00:47:22   what a relief the rats are clean now and [TS]

00:47:24   instead all I think is wow that ran [TS]

00:47:27   smelly wet wraps in the kitchen and and [TS]

00:47:30   at that moment the entire movie just [TS]

00:47:32   completely careens off the rails because [TS]

00:47:34   I've it took me like 10 minutes to get [TS]

00:47:36   back to accepting what this movie was [TS]

00:47:38   because it completely blew me out of the [TS]

00:47:40   premise ipad that way you apparently [TS]

00:47:42   didn't wear underwear that lemon fresh [TS]

00:47:43   joy is actually a cure for the black [TS]

00:47:45   Pike wet rats in the kitchen it's just [TS]

00:47:48   the wet rats it was even the rats [TS]

00:47:50   it was the wet rats in the kitchen just [TS]

00:47:52   push me over the edge a wet rat will [TS]

00:47:54   make you dinner now sir mr. but Mr film [TS]

00:47:56   critic or mister mister critic who is a [TS]

00:47:59   miserable sob because he doesn't like [TS]

00:48:01   anything because all he does is [TS]

00:48:02   criticize it good news the white rats [TS]

00:48:05   are making your dinner tonight will be [TS]

00:48:06   excellent and the idiot kid who is [TS]

00:48:10   controlled by his hair anyway so what [TS]

00:48:12   I'm saying is the cars is my least [TS]

00:48:14   favorite of all but you hate everything [TS]

00:48:18   is your critic [TS]

00:48:19   no I I you know cars just lays there for [TS]

00:48:22   me Brett relatives got highs and lows [TS]

00:48:24   there's some good stuff in it i like i [TS]

00:48:26   like some of the stuff with Remy the rat [TS]

00:48:27   and his family and there are a lot of [TS]

00:48:28   kind of rat jokes and you know the [TS]

00:48:31   romantic element with the kid and the [TS]

00:48:32   girl in the it doesn't really work that [TS]

00:48:35   well but you know some stuff with patton [TS]

00:48:37   oswalt you know he's likeable and the [TS]

00:48:41   characters is interesting cars is the [TS]

00:48:44   one that feels just kind of artificial [TS]

00:48:46   and and blame to me and but you know and [TS]

00:48:50   I still it's fine i have the DVD of it's [TS]

00:48:52   not like I hate it but I would rank cars [TS]

00:48:54   beretta to a just hate the wet rats and [TS]

00:48:57   ratatouille hate it when i mentioned [TS]

00:49:00   that tonight anyway I want to thank you [TS]

00:49:04   guys for being a part of this marathon [TS]

00:49:05   yet another marathon two-part and [TS]

00:49:07   comfortable podcast [TS]

00:49:08   wow I can't shut up it just can't it [TS]

00:49:11   can't end now let's talk about future [TS]

00:49:13   now but let's talk about the shorts will [TS]

00:49:15   mention all the pixar shorts and I [TS]

00:49:17   wanted to get to the shore to dammit i [TS]

00:49:19   forgot about that will have to be [TS]

00:49:20   importantly really been a pause in the [TS]

00:49:21   action i would've brought that up the [TS]

00:49:23   third half of the show we rock style [TS]

00:49:25   ah yes exactly uh anyway so pixar makes [TS]

00:49:31   great movies and if you're jaded [TS]

00:49:33   childless person who has never seen them [TS]

00:49:35   what is wrong with you why did you [TS]

00:49:37   listen to this podcast but you should go [TS]

00:49:38   see them now because it generally pretty [TS]

00:49:40   good except for the ones that we said 10 [TS]

00:49:43   k alright so thanks to everyone for [TS]

00:49:45   listening i would also like to thank my [TS]

00:49:47   guest Steve let's thanks very much thank [TS]

00:49:50   you sir and John syracuse oh thanks for [TS]

00:49:52   being here thank you and until next time [TS]

00:49:55   I'm chasing snow for the uncomfortable [TS]

00:49:57   thanks for listening [TS]

00:50:09   [Music] [TS]

00:50:19   well it's it's the new hope of pixar a [TS]

00:50:22   new hope [TS]

00:50:23   toy story co co this is flipped around [TS]

00:50:27   now don't know this is exactly what I [TS]

00:50:29   say about your help [TS]

00:50:30   yeah I I didn't listen that pocket haha [TS]

00:50:35   ah [TS]