0:00:00My favorite story of the last few weeks was from your colleagues at the Wall Street Journal
0:00:03Shalini Rama Shondran and I think I got it now dice K. Wakabayashi
0:00:11Or did I don't know I don't know how to pronounce I just call him die
0:00:16They had a story that ran yesterday, I'm sure you saw it that apples quote hard charging negotiations with the TV networks
0:00:28scrambled any sort of attempt that Apple had to get.
0:00:32What Apple more or less wanted was to charge people
0:00:3430 bucks a month.
0:00:35I guess they would just, just like to have Apple Music,
0:00:38they'd have Apple TV.
0:00:39You pay them $30 a month and you get a package
0:00:41of a bunch of channels and you can watch them
0:00:43whenever you want.
0:00:44And there's a couple of things in this story
0:00:47that really amused me.
0:00:48I quoted both of them on "Daring Fireball,"
0:00:50but the one was that Apple wouldn't show
0:00:52the CEO of Comcast the user interface.
0:00:56and he said, "How about you just get shit
0:00:58"on the back of a napkin?"
0:00:59And Apple officials replied that the software
0:01:04would be quote, "Better than anything you've ever had."
0:01:06Which A, wouldn't take much,
0:01:10and B, sounds a little, it worries me,
0:01:12it's a little, it's typical Apple,
0:01:14but it sounds like Donald Trump.
0:01:16- The back of the napkin?
0:01:17- No, it's gonna be better than anything you've ever had.
0:01:20- Oh, it's gonna be better, yeah, believe me,
0:01:22it's going to be.
0:01:23You have to preface that with believe me.
0:01:25- Believe me.
0:01:26And then the other tidbit that was great
0:01:29was that when he met with Mr. Britt, the Time Warner CEO,
0:01:34or no, Time Warner CEO, Jeff Bux,
0:01:37and some other guy named Britt, I don't know who he is,
0:01:40but big, big meeting with Time Warner.
0:01:43Eddie Q shows up, quote, "10 minutes late,"
0:01:45and was wearing jeans, tennis shoes with no socks,
0:01:50and a Hawaiian shirt, says a person familiar with the bill.
0:01:54- Yeah.
0:01:55- What I love about stories like this is like,
0:01:58obviously there's so much reporting
0:02:00that goes into a piece like this.
0:02:01And it has to be, you know,
0:02:03everything has to be written straight faced.
0:02:05I mean, everything is like,
0:02:06every line is combed over in a piece like this.
0:02:09But it's like, you want to laugh
0:02:11and you can only imagine like, what they were laughing,
0:02:14like what the like sentiment was
0:02:16when they were writing something like this.
0:02:18But it's like that whole sentence
0:02:20and then somebody familiar with the matter.
0:02:22It's just like, who was the tips?
0:02:23Who was the source or the tip on that?
0:02:25- And I've always, I've long said
0:02:29that ever since I wanted to be a writer,
0:02:31I've always wanted to be a columnist.
0:02:32That's all that I've ever aspired to be.
0:02:34I feel like you're probably in the same boat.
0:02:36And it's, I have, I don't want to write straight news
0:02:40like that, never did, but I have so much respect
0:02:43for the people who do, for exactly what you just said is.
0:02:46- Right, right.
0:02:47- How do you?
0:02:48- The other executives were wearing suits, period.
0:02:52- Yes, I forgot to add that, which is essential to the story.
0:02:55- Yeah, no, I mean, and it's funny that Dai
0:02:58is a really funny guy and he's a great reporter,
0:03:01but yeah, it's, we also do these front page stories
0:03:06called A-heads and many of those also,
0:03:10like the reporting is just like straight face,
0:03:12but like it's the funniest thing, you know,
0:03:14Dai's story, he did one on the Apple Watch in the nose,
0:03:17the nose interaction, forget what it was,
0:03:20that people use their nose to navigate their Apple Watch.
0:03:24And the whole story's like not,
0:03:25it's written in just like a great tone
0:03:28that's just like, what are, you know,
0:03:30this ridiculous thing that's happening.
0:03:32- There is a lot to unpack here though.
0:03:36It's like, you know, like it's sort of like,
0:03:40there's like a nightmare you have
0:03:42where you show up for a thing
0:03:43and you're terribly underdressed
0:03:45or you didn't put pants on, you know.
0:03:47That's, it's a trope, you know.
0:03:49everybody has that sort of recurring dream.
0:03:51Eddie Q showing up for this meeting
0:03:54with jeans and a wine shirt and tennis shoes with no socks.
0:03:58Eddie Q was not embarrassed at all.
0:04:00- Right, right, that's the thing.
0:04:01I mean, many readers probably don't know that,
0:04:03but people, Apple followers,
0:04:05or people who have watched interviews with him
0:04:07or have gotten to meet with him, like both of us,
0:04:10we know that he really didn't give a shit.
0:04:12Like, he just got there and he was like, all right.
0:04:15- Right.
0:04:16And part of it is Apple's own culture.
0:04:18Part of it is California culture,
0:04:20because I think that when Apple deals outside,
0:04:25it's not just the Valley,
0:04:26but when Apple deals with Hollywood,
0:04:28which is Valley versus Southern California,
0:04:32showing up for a meeting with jeans and sneakers
0:04:35is not a big deal.
0:04:37- Right.
0:04:38- Whereas New York media world is still very,
0:04:42you wear a suit to a meeting
0:04:43with the CEO of Comcast or Time Warner.
0:04:47- Yeah, I mean, not me.
0:04:49- Right. (laughs)
0:04:50- I wear sandals, I have a Hawaiian shirt.
0:04:52- It also brings to mind, I remember,
0:04:55and I must have been like 12 years old, I don't know.
0:04:57- I mean, why was he not wearing socks though?
0:04:59- That is a good question.
0:05:00- That's like gross, you know?
0:05:02I mean, like I hate wearing shoes without socks.
0:05:05Sometimes I have to do it
0:05:06because I forget my socks someplace
0:05:08and like I have to get my shoes on.
0:05:09I don't know really when I have to do it.
0:05:11I just think it's gross.
0:05:12- That is my only objection as well.
0:05:14- Right, I mean.
0:05:15- Well, and he was photographed,
0:05:16Eddie was photographed at the courtside at the basketball game at the Golden State game
0:05:21and he was on the front page. He was wearing sandals. Sandals are good. Yeah, you know
0:05:26what, I don't like sandals. My thing about him wearing sandals to that basketball game
0:05:29though is that a lot of times soda gets spilled and and you know, I mean like I feel like
0:05:33but maybe because when you're courtside, there's like maybe like no soda rule because no soda.
0:05:39So maybe it's okay. I don't know. I think I'm pretty sure next time I meet with him,
0:05:45I'll be asking about his feet and how he feels about
0:05:48the sweat that happens when you wear sneakers without socks.
0:05:52It's just, there's sweat, your feet sweat.
0:05:55- Maybe he doesn't have sweaty feet.
0:05:56- Shoes start to smell.
0:05:57- Maybe he doesn't. - Everyone does.
0:05:58It happens.
0:05:59I wear Toms, I have these Toms shoes.
0:06:01I don't know if they, I think they make male Toms,
0:06:04but Toms are the same thing.
0:06:05You're not supposed to wear them with socks,
0:06:07but even in there, your feet sweat.
0:06:09I'm happy we had this conversation about those feet.
0:06:13- My feet are extremely, I think half of my sweat glands
0:06:18are in my feet, I have very, very sweaty feet.
0:06:20- Right, sometimes before I go to bed,
0:06:22my feet are so sweaty, I put my feet in the shower.
0:06:25- I've always a recurring theme, (laughs)
0:06:28it's a recurring theme on the show that in the winter,
0:06:31I work at home, my feet get cold, I like to wear slippers.
0:06:34I have a hard time finding slippers that I like,
0:06:36'cause I don't like open back slippers.
0:06:38They just go flying off your feet, I like to have the back.
0:06:42And so a couple years ago, Amy got me for Christmas,
0:06:45she got me a pair of Uggs slippers, I think they're Uggs.
0:06:48And they're real, there's like all this,
0:06:50I don't know what it is, like wool or fake wool,
0:06:54but all this like fuzzy stuff on the inside.
0:06:57And you're supposed to wear them with no socks.
0:06:58And within 24 hours--
0:07:00- That's a dead animal.
0:07:01- Within 24 hours, it was all coming out.
0:07:04I had completely sweated through and destroyed them
0:07:08in about a day and a half.
0:07:12My feet are not meant for something like that.
0:07:14- But those are, they're really comfortable.
0:07:16- That's what she said, and that's why she got them for me.
0:07:18And I had to agree that for the few hours
0:07:21before my sweat started destroying them, I agreed.
0:07:24But anyway, the whole gist of this story--
0:07:28- Maybe this is what Apple, on the earnings call,
0:07:31Tim Cook said how excited he is about products
0:07:34that are out of the box for them that they're working on.
0:07:36Maybe sandals. - Footwear.
0:07:39- Yeah, footwear.
0:07:41The whole point of this story, though.
0:07:42- It would be funny, you know,
0:07:43like there's that huge cult following around sneakers,
0:07:46right, sort of feels like the same kind of people
0:07:48that follow Apple in a way.
0:07:50- Yeah, I could see that.
0:07:51- You know, they line up for shoes, they line up for phones.
0:07:54I don't know, just a thought here,
0:07:56but you would like to move on from the sneakers, I feel.
0:07:59- Well, but I've noticed, you know,
0:08:01but people who keep, and they keep their sneakers
0:08:02like in pristine condition.
0:08:04- Yeah. - They may not.
0:08:05- Yeah.
0:08:06- I saw--
0:08:07- Sneaker heads, right?
0:08:08- Yeah, I saw last night I watched Seth Meyers,
0:08:12Late Night, because it was like live
0:08:15after the Democratic Convention,
0:08:17and Colin Jost and Michael Che from Saturday Night Live
0:08:21were on to talk about it, 'cause they were there.
0:08:23And Che had on a pair of vintage Michael Jordan,
0:08:28Carolina blue Air Jordans that were,
0:08:30I was like, whoa, those are totally,
0:08:33probably like super expensive.
0:08:34And of course they were mint condition.
0:08:37- Yeah, see, I'm not a, I don't,
0:08:40it sounds very impressive, but I'm not a sneaker.
0:08:42I'm not a sneaker person.
0:08:43- Yeah, I know enough about basketball shoes,
0:08:46just because I used to follow basketball,
0:08:47but otherwise, no.
0:08:48Anyway, the whole gist of the story
0:08:51was not about Eddy Cue's sartorial choices.
0:08:54It was about Apple's hard-charging negotiations,
0:08:56and that their stance on this has blocked them
0:08:59from putting together the package,
0:09:01being able to offer the package they want to offer.
0:09:03And I think it's so transparent
0:09:05that the cable companies are talking to the press
0:09:09and talking to the Wall Street Journal
0:09:12to try to press the matter,
0:09:13and they're making it sound like Apple is being,
0:09:15I don't know what the word is, arrogant?
0:09:20Arrogant, maybe?
0:09:21- Yeah, yeah, yeah.
0:09:22- Whereas I think-- - Pompous.
0:09:23- Yeah, and I think the truth is,
0:09:25Apple is the one that can afford to wait.
0:09:27They can wait forever.
0:09:28They can never offer a TV package, and they'll be okay.
0:09:32- Right, well, it seems like also there's things
0:09:34that Apple's asking for, like they won't be upping
0:09:37the rates of the shows, I guess that's a typical thing
0:09:40that happens, yeah.
0:09:43Yeah, they're certainly hardlining to get this
0:09:46in their favor, as Apple does.
0:09:48- It's totally different worlds, like the cable world
0:09:50is a world where it's like, maybe when you sign up
0:09:53for cable, there's like a promotion where it's like,
0:09:56hey, for $89, exactly $89 a month, you get this internet
0:10:01and this TV package.
0:10:04But then once that promotion's over,
0:10:07your cable bill just starts going from like 89 to 93
0:10:11to 96, 72 to $101.32.
0:10:16You know, like you get these weird bills that are like that.
0:10:18Apple's world is, if they say it's 29.99, it's 29.99.
0:10:22And it's not gonna go silently change to $31.23
0:10:27just so the ESPN can get 5% more.
0:10:30- Right, actually in Apple's world it's usually no 99,
0:10:33so it's probably just 29.
0:10:34- Yeah, exactly, you're right.
0:10:35Actually I don't-- - Zero zero, right.
0:10:36I mean, yeah, I just actually went through this
0:10:41with my cable company.
0:10:42I'm desperately trying to get my bill down.
0:10:45I returned my router, I returned the other box,
0:10:47or the modem, and another box that we had
0:10:49that we just don't use enough.
0:10:51And you go in the store and they're sort of like,
0:10:52"Well, if you sign up for this special deal,
0:10:54"we can actually knock $20 off your bill a month
0:10:58"for the next six months."
0:10:59And it's like, okay, so I'm gonna go through all of that,
0:11:01but then in six months you're gonna raise it again
0:11:04probably more to then what I'm paying now.
0:11:06You know, they do all of these behind the scenes,
0:11:10frankly they're scams really.
0:11:11- Yeah, it's a low grade scam,
0:11:14but it's definitely a, it's a bait and switch.
0:11:17- Right, I mean mostly just like when I read that article,
0:11:20I was like, oh, Apple hates the cable companies
0:11:22as much as we do.
0:11:23- Yeah. - They wanna work with them,
0:11:26obviously, but.
0:11:27And they specifically mentioned that they don't want,
0:11:30like somebody, you know, unnamed,
0:11:32but said that we're not like those music guys
0:11:35who Apple took advantage of.
0:11:37I just think that they're just not quite
0:11:40where the music guys were.
0:11:42Like when, and it is very different
0:11:44because when Apple started with iTunes
0:11:47way back last decade, it was Mac only,
0:11:50and the Mac was very small, and it was no,
0:11:52we were years away from the iPhone
0:11:57and any sort of large market share.
0:11:59And there was, seemingly overlooked in their negotiations
0:12:04was even the possibility
0:12:05that Apple might offer iTunes for Windows.
0:12:08- Right, but also what we didn't have was,
0:12:11it was like a pre-app world, right?
0:12:14We listened to music through one service
0:12:17and that was a local service most of the time.
0:12:20And so now we live in a world where we're,
0:12:23and this is kind of, obviously Apple's created it,
0:12:26but even on the TV, they've really pushed it
0:12:28that the future's apps, right?
0:12:30And so for many of these companies,
0:12:32they already have a solution that works for them, right?
0:12:34CBS or NBC or, I don't know, FX,
0:12:38they make you sign in with your cable information
0:12:40and they've still got this presence there.
0:12:43Now that makes it really hard for cable cutters, of course,
0:12:46but they have a presence on these digital platforms.
0:12:49There seems like less incentive
0:12:51than when we were in this pre-app world
0:12:54for them to wanna join it.
0:12:55- Yeah, and I think that,
0:12:58and the trend is obvious that it may take a while,
0:13:04it's just, it applies to so many things.
0:13:07There's that great Hemingway quote about a character like,
0:13:09"How did you go bankrupt?"
0:13:10And it's slowly then quickly.
0:13:13And that's how all of these things take,
0:13:16all these disruptions is slowly then quickly.
0:13:18And it's right now we're at the point where slowly
0:13:21more and more people are not paying for cable TV
0:13:24in their house.
0:13:25I mean, I now bet-- - I need to be one of them.
0:13:27- Listeners of this show are way off the charts
0:13:29in that direction.
0:13:30- Oh, absolutely.
0:13:32- People who read your column are surely way off the charts
0:13:34in that.
0:13:35And they know--
0:13:38- I need to get behind it.
0:13:39I just, there's some things can't live without.
0:13:41- That's how we are.
0:13:42I mean, for me, it's a couple of sports things.
0:13:45And for Amy, it's a couple of shows that she likes
0:13:47that don't have, you know, that they're not,
0:13:51there's no way to get them otherwise.
0:13:52- Right.
0:13:53- But we're close, and I'll tell you,
0:13:56Jonas, you know, he's 12 years old,
0:13:58he doesn't watch anything on TV,
0:14:00except stuff that we make him watch.
0:14:01Like, get down here and watch Hillary Clinton
0:14:03give this speech, you know, he doesn't watch anything on TV.
0:14:05- Wait, you watch YouTube?
0:14:06- Yep, YouTube and--
0:14:08- Facebook or whatever.
0:14:09- No, and Netflix. - Snapchat.
0:14:10- Netflix. - Netflix, Netflix, right.
0:14:11- If we-- - Netflix is just,
0:14:13I mean, this is the summer of Netflix, in my opinion.
0:14:16I mean, yes, also them raising rates and issues
0:14:19with their, I don't know, financial situations,
0:14:21but just the stuff they're putting out right now is great.
0:14:25- If our Netflix, like if our credit card
0:14:27that we have on file with them needed to be renewed
0:14:30'cause the expiration date was up,
0:14:32Jonas would know within an hour.
0:14:33- He would get his seven or whatever you pay,
0:14:389.99 and dollars in cash and just say, deal with this debt.
0:14:42- Netflix and YouTube.
0:14:45And it's a reckoning that is coming for them,
0:14:49where eventually the gravy train of everybody pays for cable
0:14:54and everybody frankly pays too much for cable
0:14:58is going to come to an end.
0:15:00- Right, right.
0:15:01Well, we're gonna see some of this play out
0:15:03with the Olympics in a couple of weeks.
0:15:05I mean, they are NBC subscribers.
0:15:10You need your cable information to log in
0:15:12to a number of different apps.
0:15:14That's the way they still want to play.
0:15:16- Yeah.
0:15:16I'm really, I hope, I have not been following along,
0:15:20like trying all these betas over the summer,
0:15:22but I'm really looking forward to,
0:15:24hopefully everybody getting on board with the Apple TV,
0:15:27with that thing that they announced at WWDC,
0:15:29where you can sign-- - Oh yeah.
0:15:30That's gonna be huge.
0:15:31- Sign in here, cable thing once,
0:15:33and then we will vouch for all of these apps
0:15:35that you are a cable subscriber.
0:15:37- I know, there's like times where I like,
0:15:39it happened with the FX app, like,
0:15:41I was like, put it off, 'cause I was like,
0:15:42I really want to watch something in here,
0:15:44and I just don't remember my cable login.
0:15:47You set up the rest of your other apps on there
0:15:50and then I'm like, ah, you know, and I spend,
0:15:52I don't know, I really probably did spend 30 minutes
0:15:54trying to recover that information and then punching it in.
0:15:56- There was one a couple of weeks ago,
0:15:57I think it was HBO, but I might be wrong,
0:15:59but one of them, I was on the Apple TV
0:16:01and it forgot, I had already done it
0:16:04and it made me do it again.
0:16:05And it wouldn't work on my phone for some reason.
0:16:08And so I had to actually go upstairs,
0:16:10which is, I mean, that's cruel,
0:16:11Going up a flight of stairs at 11 o'clock at night,
0:16:14it's cruel and unusual.
0:16:16- In your slippers?
0:16:17- Yes, in my slippers.
0:16:18- In your sweaty slippers.
0:16:19- Right, in my sweaty slippers,
0:16:20to do it at the desktop, which seemed ridiculous.
0:16:23So anyway, I think something's going on there, but.
0:16:26- Well, yeah, it is certainly an interesting report
0:16:31and humorous report.
0:16:33- Let me take a break and thank our first sponsor.
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0:19:15You love Backblaze.
0:19:16I need to figure out my whole backup situation actually.
0:19:20- You know what I need to do and I haven't done it
0:19:21and it's criminal because I tell people to do it.
0:19:23I need to sign my parents up for Backblaze.
0:19:25I'm not even gonna make it a gift.
0:19:28It's not like I'm gonna say,
0:19:30here, happy Father's Day, you got backup.
0:19:32I'm just gonna do it next time I'm at their house
0:19:34and just pay for it and just not even tell them.
0:19:37- Or you're gonna be like the cable companies
0:19:38and then raise their rates in like two years.
0:19:40- Exactly, and start sending my parents a bill.
0:19:43- Yeah.
0:19:43- I want to talk to you,
0:19:46'cause I love your opinions on laptops and tablets.
0:19:50What do you think is going on with Apple's lineup of Macs
0:19:54that have not been-- - I hope something.
0:19:56- Have not been updated in like--
0:19:58- I'm, I mean, like, I'm eager, obviously,
0:20:02I love gadgets and I love reviewing things
0:20:04and I love helping people get better stuff,
0:20:08but I really care about myself right now
0:20:10and I have a MacBook Air that, as you know,
0:20:13I clung to for many years and I love the MacBook Air,
0:20:17but it's time, it is really time
0:20:19for me to get another computer
0:20:21and this thing is really on its last legs
0:20:24and I need something now.
0:20:26Like I need something in September or October.
0:20:29So the timing really works for me, Apple,
0:20:32to release this new rumored MacBook Pro.
0:20:34Please, please just do it.
0:20:38- I feel like-- - And also don't be bad.
0:20:40Like I need it to be good.
0:20:41- I feel like there should be like a crew of volunteers
0:20:44who stands outside Apple stores right now
0:20:46and when people go in, they say, "What do you wanna buy?"
0:20:48And if they say they wanna buy like a MacBook Air
0:20:50or MacBook Pro, they say, "No, no, no, don't do it."
0:20:53- I mean, I'm happy to take that on.
0:20:54I just did that in a very public way for the iPhone.
0:20:57- Yeah, I saw that.
0:20:58It's, you know, do not buy an iPhone right now.
0:21:01- I mean, it's just, you know, and for us,
0:21:04like, and listeners of this podcast and many readers,
0:21:07you know, it is obvious, but it really is not obvious
0:21:10to many, many people who ask me every year,
0:21:14when should I buy an iPhone, should I buy the next iPhone,
0:21:16should I buy an iPhone right now?
0:21:18I mean, it's still the most common question I get,
0:21:20being in this industry, and many people, you know,
0:21:23will head out to the store in August and go buy a new phone
0:21:28And I just don't think, you know,
0:21:29and I especially don't think that the rumors
0:21:32that this next phone won't be a big update
0:21:34is even reason to say, okay, fine,
0:21:36I can go buy an iPhone right now.
0:21:37It just isn't.
0:21:39But yeah, I don't really, I mean,
0:21:41there's very few Apple products
0:21:42I would let anyone go by right now.
0:21:45I mean-- - The only one
0:21:46I would recommend would be the one port MacBook,
0:21:49you know, which was updated and refreshed
0:21:51a couple months ago, which is right in line.
0:21:53But other than that-- - But even then,
0:21:54even then, I think there's a decision
0:21:56for many people to make.
0:21:57Like I'm in this situation where I actually think
0:22:00that MacBook, it could do, it could be my computer.
0:22:03I wrote this in the HP and MacBook review
0:22:06I did a couple weeks ago.
0:22:08It could be, but I think there could be something else
0:22:11that's actually gonna meet my needs a little bit better.
0:22:14And that's a little bit more power and some more ports.
0:22:19I can make, I could probably make do
0:22:22with the port situation now.
0:22:23I got one of these hyperdrive attachments to the MacBook
0:22:25and I love it.
0:22:26- Wait, what's that?
0:22:28- It's, you know, it plugs into the USB-C port
0:22:32and it's got a SD card reader, it's got two USB ports,
0:22:36it's got, it's also got a display port,
0:22:39but it doesn't really work.
0:22:41- Oh, I think I saw that in a, I think,
0:22:43I think Dieter Bohn was using that at the keynote,
0:22:48earlier, earlier, or maybe a competing one.
0:22:49What's it called, the hyperdrive?
0:22:51- It's called hyperdrive, I think it's, let's see.
0:22:55And a lot of people actually emailed me about it after--
0:22:58It's a pain.
0:23:01I used a MacBook Air 11 inch, which I loved.
0:23:05I really did love the size for years, years and years.
0:23:09It was one of my favorite MacBooks I've ever had.
0:23:12But I remember the one time I was at WWDC
0:23:15and I wanted to download all the iOS betas and stuff
0:23:18that they had released and the Wi-Fi.
0:23:20There was no way you could possibly-- it was like,
0:23:22this will take 17 days over Wi-Fi.
0:23:24And so they had all these ethernet things,
0:23:28and you could download, and it was like super fast ethernet,
0:23:30you could download it in like five seconds.
0:23:32And of course, I forgot to pack my ethernet dongle.
0:23:36- Yeah. - Eventually,
0:23:37I found a friend that's lucky that I have,
0:23:40know lots of people there, and I found somebody who I knew,
0:23:42and I was like, hey, can I borrow that, and did.
0:23:45But I just saw somebody, a friend, not a friend,
0:23:49but somebody who I follow on Twitter,
0:23:50who was at the Democratic National Convention
0:23:52here in Philly, and was like,
0:23:53I need a service like Uber that will deliver
0:23:57USB ethernet adapters to the convention hall.
0:24:01- Right, 'cause no one has them anymore.
0:24:03Yeah, I mean, yeah, this thing's called
0:24:05the HyperDrive USB Type-C five-in-one hub,
0:24:09if anyone's interested.
0:24:11- I will put it in the show notes.
0:24:12- Yeah, I mean, I don't know.
0:24:14I think that this next MacBook Pro
0:24:17is probably the answer for me.
0:24:22But I don't know, I don't know where it is.
0:24:24- Mike-- - I mean, it's there.
0:24:24It's gotta be coming.
0:24:25I mean, it's been so long, it's gotta be coming.
0:24:28To me, what's odd is that it didn't come before
0:24:31back to school, but it wouldn't really work
0:24:33with Apple's timing on the Macs.
0:24:35Yeah, I mean, it's a tough situation
0:24:39to tell students what to buy right now,
0:24:42because this is a computer that should last them
0:24:45for the next four years, and I don't think
0:24:47the MacBook Air is good enough.
0:24:50Sure, it's definitely the lower end option,
0:24:53but I don't know, you just want it to be a better product.
0:24:57- I've said a few times that my really biggest regret
0:25:00with my interview with Phil Schiller and Craig Federighi
0:25:03at WWDC was that I didn't bring this up.
0:25:05I really wanted to, I almost did, and then I lost it.
0:25:08It just got lost in the flow of the conversation
0:25:11and it didn't seem right to go back to it.
0:25:12And I really regret it,
0:25:13'cause I think it's an important topic
0:25:15and I really would have been interested
0:25:16to hear Schiller's take on it.
0:25:18And the other thing about it is at the time of the interview,
0:25:21so there's like second week of June, the day after WWDC,
0:25:24when I was sort of kind of hoping that they'd have a surprise announcement with
0:25:28a new Mac book pro,
0:25:29that it was only like a one day old wound in my psyche that they didn't have a
0:25:34new Mac book pro. I didn't really,
0:25:37I didn't feel at that moment just how weird it was going to feel this summer
0:25:42that the whole summer is going to go by. It was like,
0:25:45It just felt like at that moment in June,
0:25:47the MacBook Pro was a little old, ready for an upgrade,
0:25:50and the addition of this summer, and in particular,
0:25:55especially with, I think, with notebooks,
0:25:57the thing about summer is, like you said, back to school,
0:25:59which is a big time to buy notebooks.
0:26:03Just how weird that would, it feels so much older now.
0:26:09Like, I know it's only like six weeks after WWDC
0:26:12right now as we speak, but it feels like it crossed a border
0:26:17from being a little old to being ridiculously old.
0:26:21- Yeah, yeah, I mean, and when you look at what Apple's done
0:26:26like with the rest of the line, it's not there yet.
0:26:30There's stuff that needs to be flushed out, so I don't know.
0:26:35I mean, look, I wanna think it's gonna be
0:26:38during the September event,
0:26:41but I think there's a lot to cover in the September event.
0:26:44I don't know.
0:26:45Well, when do we expect?
0:26:48- I think the September event, but only because,
0:26:53or mainly because it's just, when else would it be?
0:26:57They're not gonna have two events.
0:26:58And in theory, they could have like a boring update
0:27:03to the MacBook Pro that just adds an updated CPU and GPU
0:27:08or something like that.
0:27:09But if they do that, then it just seems ridiculous
0:27:12that it took them so long.
0:27:13- No, I don't think that's happened.
0:27:15I think there's something else.
0:27:16- I do too.
0:27:17- I mean, also, it's there with Sierra, right?
0:27:20There's some hints in Sierra about things
0:27:23that should be improved in the hardware.
0:27:25So maybe then that's the timing.
0:27:30I don't know in Sierra, did they fall, right?
0:27:32They just say fall.
0:27:33Yeah, maybe, I don't know.
0:27:36I don't have any sources or any insight
0:27:38to the Mac line right now.
0:27:41- Yeah, the last two years, I think the schedule
0:27:43has roughly been a early September event
0:27:46with the iPhone, new iPhone coming out the next week
0:27:50and the new iOS coming out at the same time
0:27:52or a day or two before the phones.
0:27:55And then the new version of macOS comes out,
0:27:59and they'll tell you in September that it'll be out
0:28:02at the end of October or something like that.
0:28:05- All right, so maybe there's something in October.
0:28:07Because the question is do they do iPads
0:28:09at this first event, the iPhone event?
0:28:12And there's been some rumors of new pro.
0:28:16A new pro?
0:28:17I mean, I don't understand how that's really
0:28:19gonna be updated in a big way,
0:28:20but I think there's been some leaks of that.
0:28:24- Well, one thing, when I've speculated about this
0:28:27on Twitter and other places, people have said,
0:28:29"No, there's no way they're going to,
0:28:30"they don't wanna share the stage with the iPhone."
0:28:33But the truth is the last few years,
0:28:35they've actually always shared the stage with the iPhone.
0:28:38They use the fact that the world's attention is on them
0:28:41for this announcement.
0:28:42Everybody's iPhone, iPhone, iPhone, iPhone, new iPhone.
0:28:44And they use it, but spend most of the event on other things
0:28:47like two years ago, it was--
0:28:49- Last year was like everything.
0:28:50- Yeah, last year was Apple TV and the iPad Pro, right?
0:28:54And the pencil and all the third party apps that already,
0:28:58you know, they'd given pre-release access to the pencil for.
0:29:01- Right, yeah, they had the three, you know,
0:29:03at the end of the event, they had the three big demo rooms,
0:29:05which was like, honestly, the iPhone was the smallest part
0:29:08of the thing to see.
0:29:10I remember being like, oh crap, I gotta go see the iPhone.
0:29:13And yeah, there was that whole big room for the Apple TV,
0:29:16the whole big room for the Pro, and then, yeah, iPhone.
0:29:20- Yeah, and I always take notes on the time,
0:29:22like how much, when new products come out on stage.
0:29:26And I remember, I don't think the iPhone
0:29:28took more than 20 or 25 minutes.
0:29:30It was like, hey, hello, here's Phil Schiller,
0:29:33and 20 minutes of here's the new iPhone 6S and 6S Plus,
0:29:37and then the rest of the show was Apple TV and iPad Pro.
0:29:42- Yeah, I mean, I think if you look at the hard,
0:29:44I think there's hardware to come in three places in the fall.
0:29:49I think it's iPhone, it's Mac, and I think it's Watch.
0:29:54And I think iPad, the reason I say that
0:29:59is because of the software, like what we saw at WWDC,
0:30:02there were clear hints about hardware improvements
0:30:05that would optimize for the software or vice versa.
0:30:10I don't feel that way about iPad, but I don't know.
0:30:15Like with iPad, there's so many software things
0:30:20that I feel like need to be fixed
0:30:21or as it moves to the pro,
0:30:25and I feel like we didn't give a sense of that in iOS 10.
0:30:28- Yeah, and there've been rumors.
0:30:30Federico Viticci, who's the, by far and away, go-to guy,
0:30:35the guy at MacStories, the go-to guy for iPad productivity.
0:30:39I mean, this guy's been living his life
0:30:41with all these crazy workflows and stuff like that
0:30:44on the iPad.
0:30:45He does all of his work on the iPad.
0:30:47What he heard was that it's--
0:30:50I don't know what they're going to number it,
0:30:52but that it's more or less that the major improvements to iOS
0:30:55with a focus on the iPad Pro and Pro users
0:30:59is sort of like an iOS 10.1 type thing
0:31:01that might be like January or February.
0:31:04- That's a great report or rumor.
0:31:07Does that mean that would make more sense?
0:31:10- I don't know how much of that though is wishful thinking,
0:31:12like because we all want them to like--
0:31:15- So true.
0:31:16Whose podcast was I on where I was like,
0:31:20I feel like many times Apple rumors
0:31:23are just what people want.
0:31:25like the iMessage for Android rumor.
0:31:29We should talk about that 'cause I think both of us
0:31:32sort of were hoping for something like that at WWDC.
0:31:35And it was pretty unreliable sourcing on that.
0:31:40But it's like everyone wanted it.
0:31:42So everyone said, yeah, this is a rumor that people wrote it.
0:31:46And I mean, I'm not saying it's unreliable.
0:31:48Maybe somebody really did have good sourcing on that.
0:31:51But that felt like one which was like,
0:31:53oh yes, that's what I want.
0:31:55- It was Mac Daily News, which is a weird website
0:31:59that has been around forever.
0:32:02I'm almost certain it predates during Fireball.
0:32:04I think it's been around since the late '90s.
0:32:07And it's, I don't know if he's secret,
0:32:11and I don't even know if it's really a he, I don't know.
0:32:13It's like, but whoever it is who writes it
0:32:15never puts a byline on it.
0:32:17So when I link to that rumor,
0:32:19and he doesn't usually have news,
0:32:22it's usually more like he points to things elsewhere.
0:32:24Yeah, he writes, he'll usually link to my stuff. I didn't realize that's where it started.
0:32:28Yeah, he, he, he said, you know, it was his original thing that he heard from a reliable source that Apple's working on iMessage for Android, and that it's going to come out at WWDC. And so when I linked to it, I was like, because I always like to put the name of whoever wrote it, like the reporter, you know, I don't like to just say the Wall Street Journal says I like to say, you know, here's the reporter writing for the Wall Street Journal. Right? Because I think that's
0:32:54important. And so for his I wrote, whoever the hell it is
0:32:57who writes Mac, Mac Daily News. I have heard I can say, I haven't
0:33:05seen it personally. But I have spoken to people at Apple who
0:33:08have seen the mock ups of iMessage for Android. So I don't
0:33:12know that it exists like that they have like an app that's
0:33:15been made, but there is absolutely been consideration
0:33:19of it. Yeah.
0:33:19But the guy, I think it makes sense. And Cook has said, and I
0:33:24I forget, there was two interviews where he said,
0:33:27we are making it a priority to bring our services
0:33:31to other platforms.
0:33:33I think it was around the music launch
0:33:36or something around then.
0:33:38- What I heard, and this makes total sense
0:33:42and sounds very happily,
0:33:43was that it was a series of 10 mock-ups
0:33:46of what I messaged, complete mock-ups
0:33:48of what iMessage for Android would look like,
0:33:50ranging from like on one would be,
0:33:54just looks exactly like the iOS version.
0:33:58And 10 looks as much like pure,
0:34:02what's the Google UI theme called?
0:34:07- Material design. - Material design.
0:34:09As pure material design as possible
0:34:12with like two through nine being a continuum
0:34:15of how much it looks like that.
0:34:17Which is also to me an interesting thing
0:34:20in terms of the difference between Google and Apple,
0:34:22where Google stuff on iOS is very popular,
0:34:25but yet really looks a lot like material design.
0:34:28And Apple Music on Android, I think,
0:34:31is actually pretty, you know,
0:34:33on that scale of one to 10,
0:34:34I think is sort of like a seven or an eight.
0:34:36It's much more Android-like than iOS-like, to my eyes.
0:34:41- Yeah, I actually can't say I've ever used it, so.
0:34:44- Well, I've installed it on my little--
0:34:46- I've seen the screenshots.
0:34:48I just called it and poked around just to see
0:34:50what the sharing sheet looks like and stuff like that.
0:34:52But anyway, and here's my argument for it.
0:34:55My argument for putting some credibility on it is,
0:34:58like when that rumor leaked, a lot of people wrote to me
0:35:00and said, "No way would Apple do this
0:35:02"because they sell hardware.
0:35:04"It behooves them to keep iMessage proprietary."
0:35:08But my answer to them is nobody buys an iPhone
0:35:09to get iMessage.
0:35:11It's a nice thing to have once you have an iPhone
0:35:13and you're in the Apple ecosystem, but nobody buys it.
0:35:16That's not a selling point.
0:35:17It's just a nice thing you get afterwards.
0:35:20I think where Apple could make some money on this
0:35:22is if they add payments to iMessage.
0:35:25If I can send you money by Apple Pay over iMessage,
0:35:28then I think it makes all the sense in the world
0:35:30for there to be an Android version.
0:35:31- Right.
0:35:32I do question nobody buys an iPhone 'cause of iMessage.
0:35:36I think it is one of the lock-in apps
0:35:40that sort of, like, I wouldn't consider going
0:35:43to an Android phone mostly because of iMessage.
0:35:47Like I have a family conversation,
0:35:49I have a friend conversation,
0:35:51all of these groups in my life,
0:35:53and they're on iMessage.
0:35:54- Well, that's a good point.
0:35:55- And I don't think I can get them all to pick up
0:35:58and go to WhatsApp or Facebook Messenger.
0:36:02But look, I don't think,
0:36:04I don't know enough about the market
0:36:06of how big that market is
0:36:08for people who feel like iMessage is the reason.
0:36:11There's plenty of other great things about an iPhone
0:36:15that is probably why they have it.
0:36:17- Good point, I actually, I'm gonna say
0:36:19that you changed my mind.
0:36:21- I changed your mind?
0:36:21- Yeah. - That happens.
0:36:23- Because you know what, I was too focused
0:36:25on the upfront idea of buying an iPhone.
0:36:28Whereas once you have an iPhone and you're used to iMessage,
0:36:31it absolutely is a reason that you'd be
0:36:33a little reluctant to switch, right?
0:36:35So it's the lock-in angle more than the upfront angle.
0:36:39Like once you have it, you don't wanna lose it.
0:36:41- Right, like I just couldn't.
0:36:42Like even when I'm reviewing an Android phone,
0:36:46I try, you know, I'll put my SIM in,
0:36:48but I'll still keep my iPhone on Wi-Fi or whatever
0:36:52because I gotta get my iMessages
0:36:55and talk about my syncing with my Mac, but you know.
0:36:58- I think that like many times, I think Apple,
0:37:02it's not like Apple doesn't enjoy lock-in features,
0:37:05but I don't think that they prioritize them
0:37:07over other things.
0:37:08And I don't think that,
0:37:10I think whatever lock-in advantages they see
0:37:12with iMessage being iOS only for mobile
0:37:16could easily be overruled by the money they could make
0:37:21by having Apple Pay as a device-to-device payment method.
0:37:25But there is a trade-off there.
0:37:29There's definitely a trade-off.
0:37:30- I mean, I'm going through right now.
0:37:31It's just like, I wish that, I mean,
0:37:33and maybe it will be with the new iMessage and iOS 10,
0:37:36like Venmo will be easily integrated into the,
0:37:39what are they called, message apps.
0:37:41But I don't see why Apple doesn't do it itself.
0:37:45You know what I mean?
0:37:46Like, why doesn't it just power through Apple Pay?
0:37:50I say I want to send $15 to Gruber,
0:37:53and inside an iMessage window,
0:37:57I hit touch ID and it goes through.
0:38:00- Yeah, I think it definitely should.
0:38:02- Right, it should just happen.
0:38:04I don't know, I'm writing, my column for next week
0:38:06is all about the chip card disaster,
0:38:09and so I'm very, very into payments right now.
0:38:14- I love payments.
0:38:15I love, I have Apple paying everywhere.
0:38:18Yeah, it's just great.
0:38:20- I was just talking about this last week on my show
0:38:24with Glenn Fleischman that it somehow,
0:38:27I don't know if it just is coincidence,
0:38:30but a whole bunch of places here in Philadelphia
0:38:32have just upgraded their terminals
0:38:36and put in the chip readers.
0:38:38And they all have handwritten stickers.
0:38:41- Yeah, yeah, no chip, chip not working.
0:38:44Chip doesn't work yet, no chip yet.
0:38:46- Don't chip here.
0:38:47Yeah, I'm like, I've spent a lot of time
0:38:50reporting this story.
0:38:52I'm excited about it 'cause it's been such a disaster
0:38:55in New York too.
0:38:56It's been a national disaster.
0:38:57It's a headache.
0:38:58But I actually think,
0:39:01I'm not gonna spoil my column here,
0:39:03but maybe I will. - Yeah, you could give us a--
0:39:05- Basically, I think that this will push us all
0:39:07to use our phones.
0:39:09It's actually the best thing that could have ever happened
0:39:11to Apple Pay and to Android Pay
0:39:13because all of the terminals that are being installed
0:39:16have NFC in them.
0:39:17And so it's basically a software upgrade
0:39:20on the point of sale people, companies have spoken to,
0:39:25to enable that for the retailers.
0:39:28- Yeah, and the thing that's interesting to me
0:39:30is that you don't need to see the Apple Pay logo
0:39:32for Apple Pay to work.
0:39:33It's just like the one that just looks like a little,
0:39:36almost looks like a WiFi symbol.
0:39:38And it always works.
0:39:40There was one time-- - It should work, yeah.
0:39:41- There was one time last week
0:39:42where it didn't work for me at Starbucks.
0:39:44It gave me, I don't know, I got in some kind of circle.
0:39:46But then the next day I went back and it worked again.
0:39:50With no Apple Pay logo on the Starbucks one.
0:39:52- Right, yeah, it's weird because Starbucks
0:39:55does support Apple Pay and they never have signs
0:39:57that say we have this there.
0:39:58And that's one of the things I'm writing in this piece
0:40:00is that set up your phone for Apple Pay
0:40:02and just try it first.
0:40:04I mean, you're already gonna lose a lot of time
0:40:06with the chip, I get it, but it's kind of like
0:40:10the same amount of time to just try it.
0:40:12If it doesn't work, you have your credit card.
0:40:14- And it's so funny because Apple Pay,
0:40:18what was it, two years ago where it first came out?
0:40:20- Yeah, and it's set.
0:40:22- And Whole Foods had it and I'd use it there
0:40:24and I'd get the, wow, what was that?
0:40:26You know, like, holy heck, what are you doing there?
0:40:28And now all of a sudden that it's working
0:40:30at all these other places, I'm getting it all over again.
0:40:32Like people who've never seen Apple Pay,
0:40:33and they're like, what did you just do?
0:40:34And I'm like, oh, it's called Apple Pay.
0:40:36You'd like just take a picture of your credit card,
0:40:39Go to the Wallet app, take a picture of your credit card,
0:40:42and then you can just go up to places
0:40:43and just put your finger on the thing.
0:40:44And they're like, that is the coolest thing I've ever seen.
0:40:47- Yeah, I think a lot of people don't even know
0:40:48that it's there.
0:40:49And especially also now that it's gonna probably work
0:40:54more on more and more phones.
0:40:55I think the chip thing has been a disaster,
0:40:59but I think there's a silver lining in it.
0:41:01- I noticed, it was very interesting to me
0:41:04as a user experience critic.
0:41:08I bought some shorts at J.Crew and they had the chip thing.
0:41:12- Your shorts did?
0:41:15- No, the terminal.
0:41:16And I put my credit card in for the chip
0:41:22and then went through the chip process.
0:41:24And when it was done, it was like authorizing,
0:41:27you wait a second, and then when it was done,
0:41:29it made this terrible noise like,
0:41:31(imitates buzzer)
0:41:35And on the little terminal, it says,
0:41:36"Remove card now, remove card now."
0:41:39It's in all capital letters.
0:41:40And so somebody decided that to make sure
0:41:43nobody forgets their credit card in the thing,
0:41:45we better make a scary sound.
0:41:46It's the complete opposite of Apple Pay,
0:41:50where when Apple Pay is confirmed, you get this beautiful,
0:41:53I sometimes-- - It's so funny,
0:41:55I'm going through the video right now
0:41:56and I'm trying to collect these sounds.
0:41:59So we're gonna like, we actually have to hold the mic up
0:42:02at the register to get the sounds,
0:42:05but you're totally right,
0:42:06I know exactly what you're talking about.
0:42:07- So with Apple Pay, you get this beautiful ding
0:42:10and it just feels like, hey, you just did something cool.
0:42:13You're living in the future.
0:42:14And with the chip, you get like this,
0:42:16it sounds like the Star Trek, you know,
0:42:18red alert when the Klingons are attacking,
0:42:20like you're about to die.
0:42:21- Right, no, the whole situation is just like,
0:42:25who, I mean, it does feel like taking 15 steps back
0:42:29with the whole payment system.
0:42:30It's like, I get it secure, but like,
0:42:33I'm having this hugely awkward 10 seconds
0:42:35where I don't really know what to do.
0:42:37Yeah, I've also, I mean, New York City store clerks
0:42:43are sort of fed up with me,
0:42:44'cause I've been going into stores
0:42:46and doing six methods of payment.
0:42:49So I collect all this stuff and I'm like,
0:42:51I'm gonna actually need to put this on six separate cards.
0:42:54(laughing)
0:42:56I did it at Trader Joe's,
0:42:57which is typically the longest lines in New York City.
0:43:00And the woman was just dying.
0:43:02She's like, this is so cool, who's gonna win next?
0:43:05(laughing)
0:43:07But yeah, so I'm payment obsessed, but--
0:43:10- I look forward to it.
0:43:11I think that it's just so interesting to me
0:43:14that it seems like Apple Pay was ahead of its time
0:43:19because it's already here and ready to capitalize
0:43:22on this seemingly mass turnover in point of sale terminals
0:43:27that's happening right now.
0:43:28- Yeah, and it's actually, I've been thinking back on this
0:43:31because now being in the industry for almost a decade,
0:43:35you sort of get to really see those moments
0:43:38when a company does, as it usually typically is,
0:43:41Apple, takes what has been going on
0:43:44and makes it really, really seamless.
0:43:47And I was thinking back to Google Wallet.
0:43:50I was one of the people who wrote about
0:43:52the first impressions of Google Wallet.
0:43:54And it was like this hugely clunky thing
0:43:57where you had to hold the phone up to the right thing,
0:43:59you had to launch the app, it only worked on the Nexus.
0:44:03What was it, the Nexus?
0:44:05Might've been just the Nexus, it was the Samsung Nexus.
0:44:08And it only worked at like one retailer in the country
0:44:11and it just didn't work, right?
0:44:12And then, so you had a couple of iterations of that
0:44:15and then Apple Pay comes out of whatever,
0:44:18it's actually probably like four years later,
0:44:20Apple Pay requires the fingerprint, it works really well,
0:44:24it launches the thing and then we have Samsung Pay
0:44:26that basically does the same thing even better
0:44:29because it works at more places.
0:44:31And we have Android Pay that also does the same thing.
0:44:33So, you know, there's,
0:44:36took a little bit of time for us to get here
0:44:38and there's certainly a uphill battle
0:44:40as a lot more retailers have to try and support this,
0:44:44but it really does feel like there was this turning point
0:44:46with Apple Pay.
0:44:47- Yeah, I really wanna see this NFC stuff go elsewhere too.
0:44:52Like I really wanna see the airports switch
0:44:56from those infrared scanners to NFC.
0:45:00I hate, I just hate putting my phone down,
0:45:03like when they want you to like let go of your phone
0:45:05and put it on the glass.
0:45:06I don't like to let go of my phone.
0:45:07You know what I mean?
0:45:08- Right. - Don't let go.
0:45:10Just let me put it near.
0:45:11- And I so badly wanted the subways and metro cards.
0:45:15It's just, I'm constantly not sure
0:45:18a bunch of money's on my card and you lose the card.
0:45:21Yes, absolutely. Yeah, there's so much more potential. And I mean, I really do think at
0:45:27some point, you know, the phone is obviously the wallet, but there's just, you know, in
0:45:33terms of identification as well.
0:45:34All right, let me take another break here and thank our next sponsor. It is our good
0:45:39friends at igloo igloo software.com slash TTS, the talk show TTS. Anybody who's worked
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0:47:28My thanks to iglo.
0:47:30A couple other things, and you've been writing about them.
0:47:33wrote, I thought, a really interesting column on the $50, I forget what it's called, the
0:47:40Blue R1 HD, which is kind of a mouthful. This is the phone that is made by a company called
0:47:46Blue and Amazon is selling it for 50 bucks. And how much is the one with more storage?
0:47:5160 bucks with ads.
0:47:53It's just so funny. Like with Apple, it goes up $100 to get
0:47:58more. Right? Yeah. It goes up $10.
0:48:01I know it's Yeah, not 100
0:48:05$60 pretty decent Android phone. And the biggest catch is that
0:48:11when you're the lock screen is full of Amazon's special offers.
0:48:15Yeah, it is the catch a big one.
0:48:18(muffled speaking)
0:48:21- I think that Amazon could have
0:48:23some serious success with this.
0:48:25I don't know, I don't wanna bet on it,
0:48:27because I feel like Amazon's never really been able
0:48:29to sell phones, but I feel like if anything's gonna work,
0:48:32it's this.
0:48:34- Yeah, yeah, well, I mean,
0:48:35I think if they had some higher end phones with this model,
0:48:41it could be really interesting.
0:48:42I think in these lower end cases, I think,
0:48:45Certainly there's good substitution or burner phones
0:48:49in a way, like if you've broken,
0:48:52this is actually the CEO of Blue told me this,
0:48:54that one of their biggest markets is people who break
0:48:56iPhones or Galaxy phones and don't have the money
0:49:00right away to go buy a new one,
0:49:02especially now that people are buying phones outright
0:49:04and might not have insurance, et cetera.
0:49:06So they buy these phones and sort of hold onto it
0:49:08for a couple months, or it's used for travel
0:49:12or it's used for kids.
0:49:13So there's sort of like lower end phones in that sense.
0:49:17But yeah, I think for Amazon,
0:49:20this is sort of makes the most sense.
0:49:23And even I think even without the ads,
0:49:26I spoke to an analyst, even without the ads,
0:49:29they could probably stand to bring down the price
0:49:31and take a hit if they're really loading up
0:49:33with some of their services.
0:49:36'Cause when you get the phone, you log into Amazon
0:49:39and it sort of logs you into all the Amazon apps.
0:49:42So, you know, music and Alexa and--
0:49:45- Kindle. - Shopping and Kindle,
0:49:47yeah, exactly.
0:49:48And it's a pretty good experience
0:49:51for if you're really all in on Amazon.
0:49:53- And it seems so much better than the Fire Phone
0:49:59that they tried like two years ago,
0:50:02which really was, I mean, hats off to them
0:50:04for trying something new,
0:50:05but it just seems like that whole project
0:50:07went way off in the rails once they started going
0:50:10in the direction of having the user interface
0:50:13that tilts in 3D as you move the phone.
0:50:15It's like, you know, cool demo,
0:50:18but like terrible idea for actual usability.
0:50:21And they were too close to it to recognize that
0:50:24and actually brought it to market, you know?
0:50:26- Yeah, and they also were cutting off Google services,
0:50:28which was just like, what are you, you know,
0:50:32in many ways, Amazon's a perfect complement
0:50:34to Google on the phone, but it's not a replacement.
0:50:38- Right, because Amazon doesn't offer email, right?
0:50:41- Yeah, yeah, or what maps would Amazon offer?
0:50:46- Calendar, right, it's like with the Alexa,
0:50:52what's my device called when I talk to my Alexa?
0:50:55- Echo?
0:50:56- Yeah, my Echo. - Your Echo, yeah.
0:50:57- I just wanna call it my Alexa.
0:50:59- My Alexa, yeah.
0:51:00- If you wanna get your calendar on there,
0:51:02the best, really the only integrated calendar
0:51:05is Google Calendar, 'cause Amazon
0:51:06doesn't have a calendar product.
0:51:08- Right, and in terms of Amazon's bottom line
0:51:11in trying to get you to buy things,
0:51:13Google doesn't try us to really get us to buy things
0:51:17other than it's sort of the ads it wants us to get to.
0:51:20I mean, with Amazon, that is sort of integrated experience
0:51:24of books and movies and music.
0:51:27I mean, yes, obviously Google also has their solution there,
0:51:30but it's not the first thing that comes to mind
0:51:31when I think about Google.
0:51:33Yeah, so I mean, it's a pretty good experience
0:51:36for an Amazon user, you know,
0:51:39I wasn't crazy about the ads on the lock screen.
0:51:41I just think it's a pretty personal thing.
0:51:44And it's, I mean, it's funny.
0:51:45You kind of like, you know,
0:51:46you wanna keep looking to see what the next one's gonna be.
0:51:49But I feel like that would get a little old.
0:51:51- You've got your dog on your lock screen, right?
0:51:54- I have my dog on my lock screen, of course.
0:51:56- And so when you're trying the Blue Phone
0:51:59and instead of seeing your dog,
0:52:01you see an ad for detergent.
0:52:04I was seeing photos of other dogs that are not as cute
0:52:08because I was getting ads for dog food.
0:52:11- Oh, so that's a little too on the nose.
0:52:16- I know, and they were not cute dogs.
0:52:20So, you know, it's yeah, I mean,
0:52:22but there are other ones too, which I was like,
0:52:24I got one for like a dietary supplement
0:52:26and it's like, what are you trying to tell me Amazon?
0:52:28And then one of them was for a typing tutor
0:52:31And it was like, why would I-- I'm a great typer.
0:52:34I'm the best typer I know.
0:52:37Just like Donald Trump.
0:52:39Yeah.
0:52:40You actually are.
0:52:40I have seen you type.
0:52:41You are.
0:52:41Believe me, I'm a great typer.
0:52:44Love typing.
0:52:47It is true, though.
0:52:48You do take those things personally.
0:52:50Yeah, like, fuck you.
0:52:51What are you talking about, Amazon?
0:52:52I don't need to go on a diet.
0:52:54I mean, I probably do, but whatever.
0:52:56I don't need Mavis Bacon telling me--
0:52:59But it's definitely interesting.
0:53:01And I mean, what's really interesting
0:53:03is how cheap that hardware is and how impressive
0:53:07it is for the price.
0:53:08- I'm impressed that their CEO was so honest with you,
0:53:12that this is a phone people buy when they can't afford to,
0:53:17they just broke their two year old $700 iPhone or Galaxy.
0:53:21- Yeah, I mean, at a $50 price point,
0:53:22but they have phones at $130 with probably not great cameras
0:53:27but certainly good enough for many people.
0:53:30And they're selling a lot of those too.
0:53:33And there's this whole phenomenon
0:53:34happening in Android phones.
0:53:35The best Android phones right now are $400.
0:53:39They're great.
0:53:40This new OnePlus is amazing for the price.
0:53:45Great camera, fingerprint sensors work, good builds,
0:53:48good screens.
0:53:49When you want to go up and you want to get the iPhone
0:53:54equivalent in Android or Samsung,
0:53:56that's what you're paying $650 for.
0:53:58But look, if you want a good phone
0:54:00and you want to pay $400, you're getting an Android phone.
0:54:04- It's funny-- - I guess you're getting
0:54:05an SE, right?
0:54:07I mean, SE is, what is an, iPhone SE costs $450?
0:54:12- Yeah, $499, I forget.
0:54:16Maybe $399, I think it might start,
0:54:17but that is 16 gigabytes.
0:54:19So I always, I just pretend like it doesn't exist.
0:54:23- Right, right. - I think it's like $499
0:54:24to get a reasonable amount of memory.
0:54:26- Well, that was my scoop of the summer.
0:54:27That was my, you know, the next iPhone
0:54:30will start at 32 gigabytes, my sources say.
0:54:33- Oh, that's great news.
0:54:34- Yeah.
0:54:35- That is, I hope you're, I really hope you're true.
0:54:39- I mean, I reported it in that piece on, you know,
0:54:42don't upgrade your iPhone right now
0:54:43or don't buy an iPhone right now.
0:54:44It was sort of hidden in there,
0:54:45but that was the best I could dig up on the new iPhone.
0:54:49- I missed that, but that is actually wonderful.
0:54:51I would have bet on that.
0:54:52I have no inside information on that whatsoever,
0:54:54but it's just my gut feeling that it's just preposterous,
0:54:58if not. - Yeah, and I think
0:55:00Apple heard that, but I think also the cost of storage
0:55:03is so down that it doesn't affect their bottom line anymore
0:55:05to just give us 32.
0:55:07The question, and what I couldn't get sources on
0:55:09was sort of the tiers that would be happening after that.
0:55:13Obviously there's these rumors
0:55:14that it will go all the way up to 256,
0:55:16and I believe that.
0:55:17So, you know, maybe-- - I do too
0:55:20because of the camera, in my opinion.
0:55:23- It's the single biggest reason is that these cameras,
0:55:26the still images are like, if you have live picture on,
0:55:30they're like 13 megabytes, I think.
0:55:33- Yeah, this was my argument in my success review last year,
0:55:37which was that two things absolutely need to be improved,
0:55:41and number one was storage, or number one was battery life,
0:55:44and number two was storage,
0:55:45and it was because the camera had gotten better,
0:55:48then they had added 4K video,
0:55:51and we were still stuck with a base of 16.
0:55:54- 4K video at a 16 gigabyte storage card,
0:55:59it just does not, it doesn't jibe.
0:56:02- And look, it's not enabled out of the box,
0:56:04but Apple was marketing that this was a 4K capable phone,
0:56:09and they were certainly, I mean,
0:56:11the biggest marketing point was the live photos,
0:56:13which were three times the size of your regular photos.
0:56:15So, you know, give us the storage,
0:56:17and it sounds like we're gonna get the storage,
0:56:19so I'll stop complaining.
0:56:20- Yeah.
0:56:21- I don't know if I'll stop complaining about battery life,
0:56:23but we'll see about that.
0:56:24- Yeah, so it's 499 for the 64 gigabyte SE,
0:56:28and it is 399 for the 16 gigabyte SE.
0:56:32- All right, so, yeah.
0:56:35All right, so there's decent,
0:56:38a decent value in comparison to the $400 Android phones
0:56:44on the Apple side.
0:56:45- Yeah.
0:56:47I think that's so unbelievable that Blue just admits that,
0:56:50you know, hey, that's what these, you know,
0:56:51some of the market for this is people
0:56:52who just need a stopover phone.
0:56:55Just pop your SIM in there and get by for a while.
0:56:58- Yeah, you know, I actually, I might end up buying one,
0:57:01'cause what I usually do is I have this new process,
0:57:04which I wrote about last year,
0:57:05which is that I will sell my iPhone about a month ahead
0:57:09of the new launch to make back a good amount of money on it,
0:57:14and then I'll put that money towards the next iPhone
0:57:17instead of doing these upgrade plans.
0:57:18this has just worked for me and I'm lucky enough
0:57:21to have enough phones lying around that I have a phone,
0:57:24a loaner phone for the month of August or September.
0:57:28But the blue is actually a great option for people
0:57:31who are just like, I know I'm gonna get the next iPhone,
0:57:34I wanna make 500, 550 depending on what size phone you have
0:57:39and sell it at the end of August or beginning of August
0:57:43and use the blue phone.
0:57:45- Yeah.
0:57:47I also think, and you were saying about how a lot of the Android phones all have good
0:57:52screens, all have good cameras.
0:57:54I've noticed that too, and it's not surprising because I think that this is the single most
0:58:00competitive market in all of consumer electronics.
0:58:04Everybody has a...
0:58:07I just call them phones now, but everybody has a smartphone.
0:58:11It's funny how the technology, the water finds its own level fairly quickly, where just a
0:58:16few years ago, I mean, I remember that even the top of the line Android phones had the
0:58:21worst color on those OLED screens like it. And for someone picky like me, it was just
0:58:27unbearable, like the way that like pinks would, I remember the flicker logo, it would like
0:58:33sear your retina because of that pink on the flicker logo because it like hit the sweet
0:58:38spot of OLED where it just like went off the charts in terms of being like super saturated.
0:58:43- Yeah, that used to be Samsung's huge problem,
0:58:45those screens.
0:58:46- And it really made, you know,
0:58:49like you could design around it in the user interface
0:58:53by picking colors that look good on OLED,
0:58:55but like for photography, it was just dreadful
0:58:58because it looked like you applied
0:58:59like a weird Instagram filter in your photo.
0:59:02It was just like, oh, that's just your picture.
0:59:04- Right, yeah.
0:59:06- And that's over.
0:59:07That is, it's like I haven't seen
0:59:10an even medium to high level Android phone
0:59:12that has weird color issues.
0:59:13I'm sure that you can, you know, that the experts,
0:59:16you know, you can look at them and see fine differences,
0:59:18but like just like to the, just the basic eyeball test
0:59:22of looking at it, they all look good.
0:59:24- Yeah, I mean, and then the Samsung phone is just,
0:59:27it's beautiful now, the screen is beautiful.
0:59:31- Yeah, and I think that the cameras are all decent.
0:59:33I think, I still think that the iPhone has a pretty,
0:59:36you know, a noticeable advantage.
0:59:38Maybe not over the highest end, get the new Galaxy,
0:59:42which is really-- - Yeah, definitely not.
0:59:42- Seems to have a good camera,
0:59:43but that's a brand new phone,
0:59:45but over the mid-market Android phones.
0:59:48But even there, the cameras are really good
0:59:52compared to even standalone point-and-shoots
0:59:55from a few years ago.
0:59:56- Oh yeah, yeah.
0:59:57I mean, the camera on that blue,
0:59:59that $50 blue was horrendous.
1:00:02I mean, horrendous.
1:00:04When you go up even to a $200 Android phone,
1:00:07Huawei makes a really good $200 phone
1:00:09with I think it's like a 13 megapixel camera,
1:00:12who knows what kind of sensor,
1:00:13but that's like certainly passable for many people.
1:00:18But yeah, the $400 phones certainly don't take
1:00:23as good a shots as the S7 or the iPhone,
1:00:27but yeah, they're good.
1:00:28- Let me take one break before we wrap up the show
1:00:33and thank our third and final sponsor of the show
1:00:35and another one of our longtime good friends,
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1:01:34to have a frame behind it. You get this edge to edge effect that looks it almost looks
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1:02:39and get all your vacation photos from this summer
1:02:41and print it out.
1:02:42All right, last thing I wanted to talk to you about,
1:02:43and then you can bring up anything else you want
1:02:45with our remaining time,
1:02:46is I wanna talk to you about this whole
1:02:48Windows 10 upgrade thing.
1:02:49Because this is like, I'm vaguely aware of it,
1:02:52but my weird, like, I don't use any Windows stuff
1:02:56means that I'm not really aware of it.
1:02:58Can you explain this to me?
1:02:59- Sure.
1:03:00Okay, you ready for the deep explanation?
1:03:05- Yes.
1:03:06- Okay, so it's actually pretty complicated,
1:03:08and I said in that piece that it's,
1:03:11I don't understand why Microsoft didn't just do
1:03:13these updates in one fell swoop.
1:03:15So last year, a year ago today, yep, right?
1:03:21A year ago today, Microsoft released Windows 10
1:03:24is a free update for Windows 8 and Windows 7 users.
1:03:28Windows 7, Windows 8, and Windows 8.1 users.
1:03:31So you've been able--
1:03:32- And I'll just point out for those who don't remember,
1:03:34they skipped Windows 9.
1:03:35- They did skip Windows 9, that's right.
1:03:37- Right.
1:03:38- And so for the last year,
1:03:40you've been able to upgrade for free.
1:03:43But today, tonight, at 11 p.m. Hawaii time,
1:03:48which is the most random time zone ever,
1:03:53you will no longer be able to upgrade for free.
1:03:57So that is what today is.
1:04:01Is everyone with me?
1:04:04- All right.
1:04:05- Then on August 2nd, which is next--
1:04:10- Monday?
1:04:10- Monday?
1:04:11- Or am I wrong? - Next Tuesday.
1:04:12- Tuesday?
1:04:13- The anniversary update goes out.
1:04:17So people who have had Windows 10 for the last year,
1:04:23or the last couple months,
1:04:24we'll get this push about download Windows 10
1:04:29anniversary update.
1:04:30And that update adds very few new features,
1:04:35some good stability fixes in Microsoft Edge browser,
1:04:39which is kind of a big deal
1:04:40'cause it's like what most people use on their computers.
1:04:44It has extensions now.
1:04:46There's a lot of new stylus tricks that they have,
1:04:49which are actually pretty cool.
1:04:52Cortana does some more things.
1:04:54It's small, it's sort of like the equivalent
1:05:00of a El Capitan release for Grapple, right, a year in.
1:05:05But yeah, it's kind of confusing, right?
1:05:09One day was the end of the free updates for all users
1:05:14and then next week is this,
1:05:15and then if you were one of the people
1:05:17who just updated right now, like today to Windows 10,
1:05:21you won't actually get that anniversary update
1:05:23for a month or so.
1:05:24So yeah, it's pretty staggered.
1:05:27- Why would they do this?
1:05:29- I think, well, the answer I got was basically
1:05:31it was two separate teams,
1:05:33it was timing of two separate teams.
1:05:35Yeah, yeah.
1:05:39- Why, is there like an accounting angle
1:05:42like where for accounting purposes,
1:05:44they can't just continue to give Windows 10
1:05:46to other people for free?
1:05:49- No, I mean, I think that was just like a,
1:05:51I think that was an offer and that was a marketing push.
1:05:54You know, it was a marketing push, I think.
1:05:56- They're still in the business of selling windows.
1:05:59- I frankly have no idea, right.
1:06:00They're still in the business of selling windows,
1:06:02but they are, you know, there's definitely hints
1:06:04that windows as a service or a subscription
1:06:08could be something that happens.
1:06:11I certainly think they're setting up for that.
1:06:14But I don't know.
1:06:19and I don't know, yeah, I just don't know
1:06:23what they're really sort of thinking in terms of.
1:06:25- And it does seem to me, as somebody who casually looks
1:06:30at all these big companies, quarterly reports
1:06:33when they come out, just to keep an eye on
1:06:35who's doing well and whatever, it really does seem to me
1:06:37that under Saadia Nadella, Microsoft is very successfully
1:06:41weaning itself, or maybe has already weaned itself away
1:06:44from being the company that sells Windows in Office,
1:06:46that they have serious, significant, same scale,
1:06:51the company is as big as it was and has revenue
1:06:54that on these services that make up for it,
1:06:57that they could definitely, it doesn't seem foolish.
1:07:0210 years ago it would have been ridiculous
1:07:03to say that they should just make windows free.
1:07:06But it seems now, it seems like well,
1:07:08as a front end to these services that they're selling,
1:07:11and to do it on a subscription model,
1:07:12it doesn't seem silly at all.
1:07:14- Right, well, they want to obviously be a services company
1:07:19and I think as they move into more of these sort of AI
1:07:25or the Cortana's of the world
1:07:28and the other types of services they're trying to build
1:07:30into the operating system,
1:07:32the more we come to lean on those types of things
1:07:36and the more we sort of want to pay,
1:07:38or we may use Microsoft services across our devices,
1:07:43especially on the iPhone, Microsoft's done a really good
1:07:47job with some of those iPhone apps.
1:07:48Maybe there's a chance they think you buy a,
1:07:53you sort of lumped in with your Office 365 subscription
1:07:57and you get all of this other stuff.
1:07:59I don't know, I don't know.
1:08:01- What about this whole thing where too many people
1:08:04are obviously getting like, surprise,
1:08:07your computer's been updated to Windows 10?
1:08:09- Yeah, it's a huge problem.
1:08:12- So my understanding is that they have configured
1:08:14default settings or made it so that if you just
1:08:18click through setup, maybe like two years ago
1:08:20or whenever when you got your Windows 8 computer,
1:08:23that it's all set up so that at some point overnight,
1:08:26it's going to update itself to Windows 10,
1:08:28which is a major update.
1:08:30- Yeah.
1:08:30- And people are very upset about this.
1:08:32- People are really upset about ones.
1:08:35And one, I think what happened was, and I've gotten,
1:08:39In general, I've never gotten so many angry reader emails
1:08:43as I have gotten this week.
1:08:44It's not about what I'm about to talk about,
1:08:46but it is about huge customer service problems
1:08:50that Microsoft seems to have on this.
1:08:52And you really wanna talk about Microsoft needing
1:08:55to control the hardware and software experience is,
1:08:59I mean, I see it in every single one of these emails,
1:09:02which I wish I could respond to.
1:09:03So I'm sure none of these listeners are actually
1:09:06the people that emailed me.
1:09:07They're quite old, I can tell from the fonts
1:09:10and the signatures that I get in these emails.
1:09:13But they're just infuriated that they updated
1:09:18and their printer doesn't work.
1:09:19They updated and the graphics driver doesn't work.
1:09:23And I have not had these problems.
1:09:27I upgraded three old laptops in the last two weeks
1:09:30when I was writing that piece.
1:09:31I actually think Windows 10 is really stable
1:09:34and I really like using it.
1:09:35There's a lot of similarities to the Mac
1:09:38when it comes to handling your apps and stuff like that.
1:09:42So yeah, I think it's a huge customer service problem.
1:09:44But the issue on the upgrade,
1:09:46what happened was there was a pop-up,
1:09:47like I turned on these old computers
1:09:49and I had tons of Windows 10 upgrade pop-ups.
1:09:52And my whole video is basically
1:09:54the pop-up interrupting my sentence
1:09:55because I could, like I would launch these
1:09:58and it was like every five minutes, you know, it would say,
1:10:01oh, did you know Windows 10, your upgrade's expiring?
1:10:04and it's like, I freaking told you to go away.
1:10:07But what happened was, was one of those pop-ups,
1:10:09I guess, you don't read it very closely.
1:10:12And so one of them said,
1:10:14your computer will upgrade to Windows 10 tonight
1:10:17at the scheduled time,
1:10:18and if you have a problem with that,
1:10:21kick cancel or whatever.
1:10:22And people didn't hit those, they hit the red X.
1:10:24And it ended up just,
1:10:27it didn't end up overriding the pop-up
1:10:30or whatever the command was to start upgrading.
1:10:33and that's what happened.
1:10:35- Right, and it's sort of-- - So lots of people
1:10:36just were like, my computer upgraded overnight
1:10:38and I told them no.
1:10:40- Right, and it's one of those things
1:10:41that's always bugged me about Windows
1:10:43as a UI nerd and critic is the way
1:10:46that they often have those windows
1:10:47where there's both like, okay, cancel, and a red X.
1:10:52And it's like, I think it is, if you're,
1:10:54A, that's a bad design, it's a really bad design,
1:10:56but if you're gonna do that, it is very natural to think
1:11:00as just a normal person who doesn't think about the UI,
1:11:04just reacts to it, that the red X means do nothing,
1:11:08that it's like cancel.
1:11:09That that should not, hitting the red X to close the window
1:11:13should not mean, okay, go ahead and do this super
1:11:16significant, almost risky thing.
1:11:19- Right, and actually, the pop-up that I put in the article
1:11:22I wrote this week, it says, sorry to interrupt,
1:11:24but this is important, Windows 10 free upgrade offer
1:11:27will end July 29th, right?
1:11:29It's this big text, right?
1:11:30And then underneath it says, upgrade now within a box
1:11:33or remind me later in a box.
1:11:37And those are the main options, right?
1:11:40But then in the bottom left hand corner,
1:11:42and I'll send you this link, it says,
1:11:44do not notify me again in a similar purple
1:11:48to the purple pop-up.
1:11:50So it's almost like so hard to see that it's like,
1:11:54you wouldn't notice it, right?
1:11:56Like if you get this pop-up, you just want it to go away,
1:11:58You either hit the X or you hit remind me later, right?
1:12:01Because you don't have any other option.
1:12:03- Is this in your survival guide to perpetual windows?
1:12:06- Yeah, yeah.
1:12:07- I've already got that link.
1:12:08I've got the link in the show. - You see that purple,
1:12:08you know, and it's crazy.
1:12:11It's just like, that's not fair to people.
1:12:13But, and then, you know, what I couldn't get,
1:12:15and I think this is something that happens,
1:12:17it's happening, and I think this is actually
1:12:19a separate piece, it's happening to every,
1:12:21all of our operating systems.
1:12:23I talk about it in this piece, but, you know,
1:12:25Android, iOS, it doesn't matter, Mac, Windows,
1:12:28these companies want to get you
1:12:30on their newest operating system.
1:12:32They want to do it for a couple of reasons.
1:12:34In Microsoft's case, it's actually a little bit unclear.
1:12:38Obviously, they would love everyone to be on it.
1:12:40I think there is some data mining going on
1:12:43that I think really does benefit Microsoft.
1:12:47In the cases of Apple, it always seems like it's security
1:12:50and it seems like a bragging right that they get to say,
1:12:52everyone is on this latest operating system,
1:12:55but certainly security and features play pretty high
1:12:58on the top of the list of why they want people
1:13:00on the new software.
1:13:02Unless there's something else I'm missing.
1:13:05I mean, what is the other main reason
1:13:07these companies want us on their latest software?
1:13:09- No, I think you hit them.
1:13:11I think security is one, I think new features
1:13:14that they want people to have access to are another.
1:13:16I know with iOS, macOS to a lesser degree, I think,
1:13:21But with iOS, I know that there are,
1:13:25and I've written about it many times,
1:13:26there's often complaints from people
1:13:28with like three-year-old iPhones
1:13:30who find that their experience degrades
1:13:32after they go ahead and do what is obviously
1:13:36what Apple wants you to do.
1:13:38And I think that they've changed it.
1:13:41I don't think that it automatically updates,
1:13:43but they've made it even more aggressive,
1:13:44I think, starting last year in terms of pushing it.
1:13:47- Yeah, it won't automatically, but it will say,
1:13:49I think there's the same options,
1:13:50upgrade now remind me later and you know, there's
1:13:54no I think what they've changed I know it. I know what they've done is that they've changed
1:13:58it where it's like upgrade now. And like the next schedule it. Yeah, the next button which
1:14:03makes you think like it's maybe like now don't do it really means I'm going to do it when
1:14:07you plug me in. Right. I'm going to schedule it. Yeah. Yeah, that's what it is. And it's
1:14:13a little you know, it's nowhere near as sneaky as I think what Microsoft is doing. But you
1:14:17could argue that it's not bad UI design, it's sort of sneaky UI design.
1:14:23Mm-hmm, right.
1:14:25It's definitely the case that the security issues are real though, like...
1:14:28Oh yeah, for sure.
1:14:29I was talking on this show last week with Glenn Fleishun about these bugs
1:14:33that were fixed in this, these image format things where, you know, all these
1:14:39bugs were discovered where the way that you could send somebody an iMessage with
1:14:43with a maliciously designed image,
1:14:47and just by looking at the iMessage,
1:14:48you could be exploited.
1:14:50And they fixed it, but they've only fixed it
1:14:52in the very latest versions of iOS and Mac OS X,
1:14:55and at least to my knowledge, they haven't done like,
1:14:58so if you're on Yosemite still,
1:15:02you don't have a fix for this yet.
1:15:04So the only way to get these fixes
1:15:06is to stay totally up to date.
1:15:08- Right, right.
1:15:11Which, yeah, I mean, that's certainly the right incentive
1:15:15to also tell users because that's scary.
1:15:19You don't want to be put at blame for that.
1:15:22Yeah.
1:15:25- Anything else that you wanted to talk about
1:15:27this week, Joanna?
1:15:27- So many things to talk about, I don't know.
1:15:31- If there's only one more thing I'd pick your brain about
1:15:35is looking at everybody's results,
1:15:39Some strong quarters from lots of people Facebook and and Google both did really well online advertising Twitter not so good
1:15:46And I I don't know. I'm not a business expert. I could be totally wrong
1:15:50I have a gut feeling like Twitter is not long for this world as an independent company
1:15:55I think somebody is gonna acquire them and I my question is who?
1:15:59Like a question if Verizon bought Yahoo, why not Verizon I
1:16:04Think Verizon's got all this money and they want content, right?
1:16:08I'm not saying it'd be a good idea.
1:16:10I'm not saying that Verizon would be good or bad
1:16:12as a parent, but I could see them being interested in it.
1:16:15- I could see that too also just for the sort of
1:16:19TV integration too.
1:16:20- Yeah. - Comcast and--
1:16:21- Comcast would be another one that I would think might,
1:16:24'cause they have more money than they know what to do with
1:16:26and are sort of looking to own content.
1:16:30- Right.
1:16:30Right. - Just a gut feeling.
1:16:33I wanna be able to say I was right when Twitter
1:16:36ends up being acquired sometime in the near future.
1:16:39- No, I think that's a, yeah.
1:16:44I don't know where makes sense, I don't know.
1:16:47- I don't know that makes sense is the right way
1:16:48to think about it because I don't think it makes any sense
1:16:50for Verizon to buy Yahoo's web project, but they did it.
1:16:54I think that's maybe, that's what I've,
1:16:56it's the Yahoo thing that put it in my head too,
1:16:59where Verizon buying Yahoo doesn't make much sense to me,
1:17:03but then I realized like, so stop thinking
1:17:04of who would make sense to buy Twitter
1:17:06and just think who would do it.
1:17:08And that's what made me think like Comcast or Verizon
1:17:12or somebody like that.
1:17:14- Right.
1:17:15- Well, and-- - Yeah, I mean,
1:17:17I think that when you think of Twitter as like,
1:17:20I said a couple of months ago in a piece I wrote,
1:17:23Twitter really isn't a social network, it's a media site.
1:17:27- Yep, and they don't know it themselves.
1:17:30- They don't know it, no.
1:17:31But they're starting to get into it a little bit more,
1:17:34I think also the focus on Periscope.
1:17:36There's been a lot of updates to Periscope,
1:17:38which is, it's a sad thing.
1:17:40Now everyone's not using Facebook Live
1:17:42and it's gotten tons of buzz this summer
1:17:44and this was an opportunity.
1:17:47Twitter really could have been a head out on that
1:17:49and they weren't.
1:17:50- Yeah, and it seemed like just in the last two weeks,
1:17:52as a political junkie watching the two conventions,
1:17:55it seemed like whenever they were talking about people
1:17:57streaming stuff from their phones,
1:17:58it was just Facebook Live.
1:18:01It was almost like, in Chelsea Clinton's speech last night
1:18:05when she was talking about her grandkids
1:18:06talking to Hillary Clinton, she just said FaceTime.
1:18:09FaceTime is the thing when you talk.
1:18:12That's just what people say.
1:18:13And for this broadcasting, I'm here
1:18:16and I'm gonna broadcast to people on social network,
1:18:18it's Facebook Live. - Definitely.
1:18:19- And I like Periscope, and I hope Periscope
1:18:22continues to thrive, but it seems like Facebook Live
1:18:24just swooped in and ate their lunch.
1:18:26- Right, right.
1:18:27I mean, 'cause people are there, and also Periscope,
1:18:29really not 'til a couple of months ago,
1:18:31was really sort of integrated in the Twitter experience.
1:18:35It sort of was like, we own this thing
1:18:37and you can get your Twitter followers integrated here,
1:18:39but watching one of those through the Twitter apps
1:18:42and stuff was not a thing,
1:18:45and now they've worked on that integration more.
1:18:47Yeah.
1:18:50- That was my last thing.
1:18:53Joanna Stern, thank you so much for your time.
1:18:54I always love having you on the show.
1:18:55- I wanna ask you one question.
1:18:56I've been thinking about the Apple Watch a lot lately
1:18:58'cause I finally,
1:19:00I took mine off for a couple of months.
1:19:02I just did not find it useful for things that,
1:19:07mostly I used Apple Watch to tell the time
1:19:11and when I was working out.
1:19:12And it's sort of like, I just got tired
1:19:14of working out with it on.
1:19:16It lost its relevance to me.
1:19:18What do you think, you think there's gonna be a new one
1:19:22in the fall?
1:19:23- You know what, that's an excellent,
1:19:26it's like everybody's saying iPhone, iPhone, iPhone.
1:19:28It's gonna look like the old iPhone,
1:19:29it's gonna have a new camera, it's gonna be thinner,
1:19:31it's gonna be lighter, it's gonna be way faster,
1:19:34blah, blah, blah.
1:19:34- No headphone? - iPhone, iPhone, iPhone.
1:19:36Yeah, no headphone, all this, pages and pages.
1:19:39And nobody's talking about Apple Watch.
1:19:41I think that they're definitely gonna do
1:19:42a new Apple Watch in September.
1:19:44I have no-- - I really only think that--
1:19:45- No inside information about this at all.
1:19:47- Right, and we've heard no leaks, which is interesting.
1:19:49But I only think that 'cause of watchOS 3.
1:19:51And so as I'm wearing this watch again,
1:19:54I kinda keep thinking in the back of my head,
1:19:56I don't have OS 3 on here, but I keep thinking,
1:19:58this thing's gonna be so much better
1:20:00when I have watchOS 3 on here.
1:20:02And then I sort of keep thinking,
1:20:03well, what would the hardware improvements be
1:20:05that would make that even better?
1:20:07And I happen to think they all,
1:20:09a lot of them are fitness related,
1:20:11'cause that was the real focus at WWDC.
1:20:13- Yeah, I think fitness related,
1:20:15I think that they've realized,
1:20:17once it's out in the real world,
1:20:18that the fitness stuff is off the charts popular.
1:20:21So, and it seems like there could be design considerations
1:20:24to emphasize that more.
1:20:25And I think now that they've rethought
1:20:26the way that the two buttons work, the crown and the button.
1:20:29- That's right, that's right.
1:20:31- They've rethought the way they work in the OS,
1:20:33I think for the better, even on the old watch,
1:20:35the existing watch that we know,
1:20:37but if they rethought them like that in the software,
1:20:39why not, I don't know what they would do.
1:20:41I don't know, but it's something to make them
1:20:43even more apt to the new purpose in the OS.
1:20:46- Totally, totally.
1:20:48- And I think the thing could be thinner.
1:20:50- Yeah, for sure, yeah.
1:20:52And the battery life possibly a little bit better,
1:20:54but you know, I don't know.
1:20:55- I find it crazy that there's no speculation about it.
1:20:57I don't know if it's something to do with the fact
1:20:59that like somehow in the supply chain,
1:21:01they've got a new, you know,
1:21:02they're doing it in a way that actually can hold the secret
1:21:05in a way that the iPhone supply chain obviously can't.
1:21:08And because of that,
1:21:10if it doesn't leak through the supply chain,
1:21:11it just doesn't percolate out to our speculation.
1:21:14But it seems crazy to me
1:21:15that there's not more speculation right now
1:21:17at the beginning of August, end of July,
1:21:21about a device that I think we're gonna hear about
1:21:23in like six weeks.
1:21:24- Right, maybe it doesn't ship then.
1:21:26- No, just like they did.
1:21:28But this year they would have to ship before Christmas.
1:21:31- Right, which is October.
1:21:33Yeah, November.
1:21:34- Yeah, they could ship as late as early November, I think.
1:21:37But that's, and I would expect that.
1:21:40I would expect that the iPhone ships in September,
1:21:42but that if they do announce a new watch,
1:21:44it'll be like an October thing.
1:21:46- Yeah, I agree.
1:21:47- Yeah, I feel like that's one of the big,
1:21:51hopefully we'll be surprised
1:21:52when we go out there in September to hear about this stuff.
1:21:55But I'm with you, I think that they're gonna do it.
1:21:57And the fact that there's no rumors about it,
1:21:59I think it's just sort of, I don't know what it is.
1:22:02I guess, I mean, maybe I'm wrong.
1:22:04Maybe there is, you know, they're just heading
1:22:06to Christmas selling the same watch
1:22:07they've been selling for two years.
1:22:08But it seems crazy to me that--
1:22:10- And it costs like $100.
1:22:12- Right, yeah.
1:22:12- I mean, it costs 200 bucks last year, right?
1:22:14Like the one offered at Target,
1:22:17I mean, and that's the one I see.
1:22:20I see that one a lot.
1:22:21I see women wearing the rose gold one
1:22:23that was offered on cheaper at Target and Walmart
1:22:27than most of them.
1:22:29I see a lot of women wearing them.
1:22:32- I see more and more.
1:22:33I see an awful lot of them.
1:22:35- Yeah, I mean that's, you know,
1:22:37New York workout scene is Apple watches.
1:22:40And there's Fitbits, there's Fitbits.
1:22:41But yeah, that's like one of the things
1:22:44I'm also really excited about,
1:22:45which is the competition stuff that's,
1:22:47you know, you can compare to others.
1:22:49I'm excited about that in watchOS 3.
1:22:51- Yeah, so I definitely think that that is,
1:22:53I think it's just overwhelmed by the speculation
1:22:56about the new iPhone, whatever they're gonna call it.
1:22:58- Right. - And I definitely think
1:22:59it's coming and I think it'll be really, really interesting
1:23:02'cause I feel like the iPhone is at a point
1:23:05where it's almost 10 years old and it's not surprising to me
1:23:08that the new iPhone is supposedly so similar to the 6S
1:23:13because they've had so many times to iterate it
1:23:15that they've sort of achieved the platonic ideal
1:23:19of the form factor, at least in their mind.
1:23:21Whereas the watch, they've only done one.
1:23:23And it's like, think back to the early years of the iPhone
1:23:26and how quickly they went from the original
1:23:30to those plastic 3Gs to the 4S, or the 4 and 4S.
1:23:34They made significant improvements and changes
1:23:36to the form factor in just a few years.
1:23:38And I feel like they could do the same with the watch.
1:23:40- Right, right.
1:23:41- And last but not least, if we're gonna talk about that,
1:23:44I do believe, 'cause I know people will ask,
1:23:45I believe that if they do have a new watch
1:23:47that it will remain strap compatible
1:23:49with the existing watch straps.
1:23:52- Yeah, I think that makes sense.
1:23:53That's why I put this new watch on.
1:23:55I actually found this band.
1:23:57It's like the, it was the new felt band,
1:24:00what is it, what do they call these?
1:24:03- I forget what that's called.
1:24:04- And I really like it.
1:24:05You know, it kind of like, and I, you know,
1:24:09the whole band thing, it's really, it's so smart.
1:24:11I mean, it really-- - Wait, do you mean
1:24:12the nylon one?
1:24:13- Yeah, it's not felt, it's like a--
1:24:16- Braided nylon. - Fabric, yeah, yeah, yeah.
1:24:18I mean, it feels like a new watch to me.
1:24:21- Yeah, that's my favorite too,
1:24:22especially for wearing it to exercise.
1:24:25- You don't like to wear it when you exercise, or you do?
1:24:27- No, I do, and I like, but I have the one
1:24:30with the metal link band, which is more
1:24:35like a serious dress band, and it just feels
1:24:38really weird to me to go out running
1:24:39with that watch. - Yeah, you can't work
1:24:40that with that, yeah, right.
1:24:41- You can't, it just feels too heavy,
1:24:42it just feels weird when you sweat on it. Whereas this nylon fabric feels like it's
1:24:47almost like an athletic material.
1:24:48Yeah. Yeah. My problem with it is that unlike the sport band, I can't get it that tight
1:24:53around my wrist, so the heart rate monitor doesn't work as well if it's not snug, like
1:24:57really snug. But yeah, it looks really nice.
1:25:01That's it for me. Joanna Stern of the Wall Street Journal, I thank you for your time.
1:25:07I want to thank our three sponsors. Fraktor, where you go get your pictures taken, go to
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1:25:26Thank you, Joanna.