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428: A Series of Rectangles

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0:00:00(laughs) I'm not feeling great right now. (laughs)

0:00:02- Save it for the show. - Okay, okay.

0:00:04- Save it for the show, save it for the show.

0:00:06Yeah, so we have a lot of things to,

0:00:09this is not really the show, but I'm trying to ease into it

0:00:11since I have to cut Marco off.

0:00:13We have a lot of stuff to cover.

0:00:15It's going to be John Siracusa's favorite kind of episode,

0:00:17an episode where it's probably nothing but follow up.

0:00:20So brace yourselves, everybody.

0:00:22(electronic music)

0:00:23It is everyone's favorite time of year.

0:00:27It is approaching WWDC time.

0:00:30So what does that mean?

0:00:32It means the ATP store is back and no snark.

0:00:37I really mean this.

0:00:40I've been really excited for this one.

0:00:41I feel like we have a really good lineup this year.

0:00:43Not that they've been bad in other years,

0:00:44but I feel like this year, really good lineup.

0:00:47And so here's what we've got.

0:00:49If you are listening to this now, recorded or live,

0:00:52you can go to ATP.fm/store.

0:00:56And we have several different offerings.

0:00:59Let me briefly try to go through them all

0:01:02without John or Marco, probably John, interrupting me.

0:01:04And then we will spend a little more time on each of them.

0:01:07We've got--

0:01:07- Hey, I'm good at interrupting you too.

0:01:09- Well, yes, but I thought John

0:01:10would have more thoughts on this one.

0:01:12So anyway, so we've got, actually you succeeded

0:01:14in making the point, well done.

0:01:15(laughing)

0:01:18All right, so we've got several different shirts.

0:01:20We've got the M1 shirt.

0:01:22The front is our favorite six colors, slash, slash, slash,

0:01:27with M1 on the front.

0:01:28The back, a certain John Siracusa spent an inordinate

0:01:33amount of time recreating the ChIP diagram of the M1.

0:01:35It looks excellent.

0:01:36We have that in color on the front,

0:01:39and then it's monochrome on the back.

0:01:40We also have that in monochrome on the front.

0:01:43So it's just white ink on the front,

0:01:44but several different kind of colors of shirts.

0:01:47We've got an ATP Performance shirt.

0:01:48So this is kind of in the spirit of Under Armour,

0:01:51although it is not exactly Under Armour.

0:01:52So if you were wearing this while you are sweating,

0:01:55it doesn't stick to you,

0:01:56and you don't have to like scissor it off.

0:01:58It actually slides right off.

0:02:00Then we also have the classic logo shirt,

0:02:03the one that we've known and loved for several years now.

0:02:05We've got the pins that have been around forever,

0:02:06and we'll eventually run out of them,

0:02:07but that day is not today.

0:02:09And then my personal favorite,

0:02:11because this was my contribution,

0:02:12we have an ATP pint glass, an etched ATP pint glass,

0:02:17which I'm very excited about.

0:02:19So that's the quick overview.

0:02:21This will all be available.

0:02:22The sale will end Friday, May 14.

0:02:25This is where I do the same thing I do every year.

0:02:27For those of you who are good about this,

0:02:29I'm sorry for wasting a moment of your time.

0:02:31I'm sorry, but I gotta do it.

0:02:33Every year, every time, without fail,

0:02:36within hours of the sale ending, I get tweets.

0:02:40(gasps)

0:02:41Is it over?

0:02:42Oh, I forgot, is it over?

0:02:43Is it over?

0:02:44Oh no, I forgot, is it over?

0:02:45Yes, it's over.

0:02:46So please, if you're listening to this,

0:02:49and you are at all interested in any of these fantastic

0:02:51shirts or glasses or pins, now's the time.

0:02:54Pull your car over if you're in the car.

0:02:56Pull over to the side of the walkway that you're on

0:02:58if you're walking.

0:02:59Or, in all likelihood, you're at home,

0:03:01which is where you probably should be.

0:03:02So stop what you're doing at home.

0:03:04ATP.fm/store, now's the time.

0:03:07All right, let's go through this with a little more detail.

0:03:08Jon, the M1 shirt was, I think, 100% your work.

0:03:12So would you like to dive in a little more

0:03:14and tell us a little more about it?

0:03:15- Yeah, for the people who don't listen to the car segments,

0:03:17who don't care about them,

0:03:18who don't understand what it is with our logo,

0:03:19like the joke of our ATP logo is that since this,

0:03:23you know, since Accidental Tech podcast

0:03:25came out of us doing a car podcast,

0:03:27it looks a lot like the M logo, the BMW M logo,

0:03:31which has some colored stripes leaning to the right,

0:03:33and then an M, and so our show was a bunch of,

0:03:36you know, colored stripes, but it was the apple colors,

0:03:38and then a leaning A for ATP, right?

0:03:42This year, of course, we know the M1 is in all the max,

0:03:44and the M1 is awesome, so it gave us a chance

0:03:46to make a shirt that actually has a bunch of colored stripes

0:03:49and a slanty M.

0:03:51Looks just like the BMW M logo.

0:03:52Please, BMW, don't sue us, it's a parody.

0:03:55(laughing)

0:03:56And so now, finally, we have an actual M shirt.

0:04:00Now, BMW, the M1 was a supercar,

0:04:02and it was not, it didn't have a logo or anything like this.

0:04:05Actually, BMW makes their 1s a little bit different,

0:04:07but we took some artistic license,

0:04:09so that's the idea behind the M1 shirt.

0:04:12So we've got the colored one,

0:04:16which I think is the most expensive

0:04:17to manufacture shirt we've ever made,

0:04:20because every single one of those colors in the front,

0:04:22I think, is a separate printing pass,

0:04:24plus we printed on the back,

0:04:26so I think for the first time, we had to do calculations

0:04:28to make sure we literally wouldn't lose money

0:04:30in each shirt that we sold.

0:04:32So we apologize for the price,

0:04:35and speaking of the price of these shirts,

0:04:37and forget about shipping and VAT,

0:04:38I know they're insanely expensive,

0:04:40just wanna remind everybody,

0:04:41if you don't care about shirts,

0:04:42you don't care about pint glasses,

0:04:43you don't want any of this junk in your life,

0:04:45but you just wanna give us money,

0:04:46we have a way for you to do that.

0:04:49You can become an ATP member at ATP.fm/join,

0:04:53and believe me, if you want a shirt, get a shirt,

0:04:56but if you just wanna give us money,

0:04:58we get way, way, way more money if you join as a member

0:05:01than if you buy a shirt.

0:05:02I know it seems ridiculous,

0:05:03like how can you not be making a ton of money

0:05:05off these shirts?

0:05:05The shirts are here for people who want shirts.

0:05:08I want shirts, my kids want shirts,

0:05:10people want shirts, people want pint glasses.

0:05:12Get them if you want them, they're awesome,

0:05:14they're really cool, but if you don't care

0:05:15about any of this merch and you just wanna give us money,

0:05:17ATP.fm/join, and the synergy here is,

0:05:20if you do want a shirt,

0:05:21but you don't wanna pay full price for that shirt,

0:05:23if you're an ATP member,

0:05:25you get 15% off every single thing in the store.

0:05:28So you can become a member today, become a member,

0:05:31pay for one month of membership, get the 50% discount,

0:05:34save more money than you spent on the membership,

0:05:36buy a bunch of stuff, cancel next month.

0:05:38It's really easy to do.

0:05:39- Yep.

0:05:40- Oh, and I guess the colored M1 shirt.

0:05:42So the monochrome one is our attempt to let people

0:05:44have this shirt for less money,

0:05:45'cause the monochrome is just one color of ink,

0:05:47so you don't have to do umpteen printing passes on it.

0:05:50But the cool thing about the M1 monochrome shirt

0:05:52is it comes in a ton of colors.

0:05:54Let me look at how many different colors

0:05:55we have with this thing.

0:05:56We have blue, red, purple, teal, green, pink,

0:06:01like a lighter purple, like tri-blend versions of all those.

0:06:05So just because we show a blue shirt

0:06:07and you're like, ah, I don't want a blue shirt,

0:06:08look at all the colors.

0:06:09A lot of them are really cool looking.

0:06:11Lots of different styles, different materials.

0:06:13When possible, we give every color

0:06:15and every possible material.

0:06:16It's not always possible.

0:06:17Some colors are only available in cotton,

0:06:18some only available in tri-blend,

0:06:20but just check out all the colors.

0:06:21Same thing with the performance shirt.

0:06:23It comes in a bunch of different colors and styles,

0:06:25so check it out.

0:06:26And as for the pint glass, it is not printed, it is etched.

0:06:30We already had someone ask whether that's dishwasher safe.

0:06:32I assume so.

0:06:33We will follow up next week to confirm one or the other,

0:06:35but that's part of the reason we didn't choose printing.

0:06:38Etching is actually scratching of the glass,

0:06:40so I think that'll hold up well.

0:06:42- Yep, yep, I am super excited about this.

0:06:44All of this, and I can't stress enough.

0:06:46John, can you tell the story of recreating the M1

0:06:51for the back of the M1 shirt?

0:06:52Because you went through a preposterous amount of work

0:06:56to get this to look right.

0:06:57- Eh, it's not that much work.

0:06:58I mean, so if you look at it, you'll say,

0:07:00hey, I recognize that kind of from Apple's presentations

0:07:03where they show this stylized, not really realistic version

0:07:05of the M1 that shows the four high-performance cores

0:07:09and the four efficiency cores and the GPU cores,

0:07:11and it's not a reflection of the physical chip,

0:07:13but it is kind of an abstract diagram that Apple uses.

0:07:16But of course, we can't use Apple's graphics

0:07:18because they belong to Apple's.

0:07:19But I can, in fact, sit there for hours and hours

0:07:22in a vector design program and make a series of rectangles

0:07:27that more or less approximates exactly what Apple had.

0:07:29So thank you, Apple, for the inspiration

0:07:32for this chip design, even though it doesn't reflect reality

0:07:35and yes, I did draw every single line of that chip myself.

0:07:38- And I think a series of rectangles might be

0:07:40underestimating how many lines there are in this drawing.

0:07:43- I mean, they really are all rectangles.

0:07:45Like, it's just, it's a lot of rectangles.

0:07:47And the other thing that I discovered when drawing it

0:07:49is that Apple's drawings are not symmetrical.

0:07:52Like, when you see a bunch of lines

0:07:54that you think are evenly spaced,

0:07:55they're not actually evenly spaced.

0:07:57Because I was trying to do it on a grid with, like,

0:07:59grid snap, and I realized when I did the same number

0:08:01of lines as Apple, it would be like,

0:08:03they wouldn't line up correctly.

0:08:04Anyway, it's artisanally hand-created.

0:08:07It's very interesting.

0:08:08(both laughing)

0:08:09- Yeah, I'm really, really excited for this.

0:08:12Way back when, it was one of our earlier shirt sales,

0:08:14when we had done the, how would you describe this?

0:08:17I think this was Marco's idea,

0:08:19but it was a rounded rect outline

0:08:22that was approximately the proportions

0:08:24of the then-new Apple Watch,

0:08:26and it said Accidental Tech Podcast on it,

0:08:27and we did this years and years and years ago.

0:08:29And I think this was the same shirt

0:08:31that we did the edition, the very first edition,

0:08:33if I'm not mistaken.

0:08:34- Yes.

0:08:35- And if you weren't around for that,

0:08:36we basically printed one, or had one printed in

0:08:39with gold foil or something like that,

0:08:40which I don't think it was actual literal gold,

0:08:42but nevertheless.

0:08:43- No, we actually tried to make it literal gold,

0:08:45but they, and there are people who print in gold leaf,

0:08:48but it wasn't gonna work out.

0:08:50There was some practical reason why

0:08:53you kinda can't really do it.

0:08:55It's technically possible, but it's a bad idea.

0:08:57- Right, so we attempted to do that,

0:08:59and it didn't work out, but one of the shirts we did

0:09:01was the sport shirt, and we did that in this,

0:09:04again, it's not literally Under Armour,

0:09:05but Under Armour style, I don't know how to describe it

0:09:08that doesn't, in a flattering way,

0:09:10'cause I would say almost like a plasticky,

0:09:12but that sounds terrible, it's not plasticky,

0:09:14but nevertheless, we did that,

0:09:15and that is my designated workout shirt,

0:09:17and I only bought one of them, so I use it a lot,

0:09:20and it needs brothers and sisters.

0:09:24So, hence the ATP Performance shirt,

0:09:26which I'm really excited about,

0:09:27and again, that comes, like John said,

0:09:28in several different colors,

0:09:30and I cannot tell you enough how excited I am

0:09:32for the ATP Pint Glass.

0:09:33Years ago, Plex sent me a bunch of swag,

0:09:36just to be nice, because Plex is awesome,

0:09:38and one of them was a pint glass

0:09:39with a printed Plex logo on it,

0:09:41and it is my favorite pint glass,

0:09:43and even though I'm not a beer drinker,

0:09:44a pint is a perfect size for all sorts of beverages,

0:09:47for water, for soda, for any number of things,

0:09:51for mixed drinks if you're aggressive.

0:09:53So, I am really excited to get this pint glass in the house

0:09:57and have some friends for my Plex pint glass as well.

0:10:00I am super stoked.

0:10:01This is all, again, until Friday, May 14th.

0:10:04I won't belabor the point,

0:10:05but please, if you're even thinking about it,

0:10:06now's the time.

0:10:07Pull over, stop what you're doing,

0:10:09atp.fm/store, atp.fm/join,

0:10:11and again, please go to your membership page

0:10:14or your member page and see what your discount code is,

0:10:17and find your discount code,

0:10:18and use that when you check out, save yourself 15%.

0:10:21So, thank you for entertaining us.

0:10:24I appreciate it, and we'll move right along,

0:10:27and continue celebrating.

0:10:29- Before we continue, I wanted to thank Casey

0:10:31and reiterate that, 'cause I totally forgot.

0:10:33If you're an ATP member, you get 15% off.

0:10:36If you go to your member page and get your discount code,

0:10:38you actually have to go,

0:10:40we have a link to the member page on atp.fm/store.

0:10:42So, you log in as your member, you go to your member page,

0:10:44there you see your private feeds and all the other stuff,

0:10:46and you will also see your discount code.

0:10:48Copy and paste that discount code into the promo code field

0:10:51when you check out from the Cotton Bureau page,

0:10:53and that's how you get your discount.

0:10:55- Yep.

0:10:56Moving right along, we have other things

0:10:57that we need to celebrate.

0:10:59Two-thirds of ATP have completed asterisk, asterisk,

0:11:03their journey on the vaccination train,

0:11:04which we'll talk about that in a second.

0:11:05But Marco, how you feeling, buddy?

0:11:07- Not great, Bob.

0:11:10(both laughing)

0:11:11- What is that from?

0:11:12I know the line, but what is that from?

0:11:14- Mad Men. - Okay.

0:11:16So, you got yours yesterday, your second shot yesterday?

0:11:18- Yeah, yeah.

0:11:19I've had friends who have had worse days after,

0:11:24but I'm not having the nothing reaction

0:11:26that I think many people have, for sure.

0:11:28- I had a mostly nothing reaction.

0:11:31Erin also got her second yesterday,

0:11:32and she, I think, is on the same path that you are.

0:11:35She's not bad, but she's not feeling good.

0:11:38- On my desk in front of me are two Benadryl pills

0:11:42that I will be taking near the end of the show,

0:11:45(both laughing)

0:11:46which will start a timeline after this, so I won't.

0:11:49But yeah, I, look, let me start by saying

0:11:53I might have committed a crime.

0:11:57- Oh, wonderful.

0:11:58- I gave false statements.

0:12:00They asked if I had had any of the symptoms recently,

0:12:05and I said no, but that wasn't entirely true.

0:12:09You see, my kid had a cold about a week ago.

0:12:14Basically, it was going around like the whole school,

0:12:15the whole town, everybody has this cold,

0:12:17and it's not COVID, people have been tested, it's fine.

0:12:19We know it's not that.

0:12:20So, this cold has hit me.

0:12:25One of the weird symptoms of this cold is that every night,

0:12:29or most nights for the last three or four nights,

0:12:33I've gotten hives on my arms and legs

0:12:36that just itch for a while. - What?

0:12:37- I've never gotten hives in my life.

0:12:39I have mild allergies here and there.

0:12:40Never had hives for anything.

0:12:42So, that's interesting.

0:12:43And it seems to completely unrelated,

0:12:48believe me, I've done the debugging of like,

0:12:50all right, what are the factors that have changed?

0:12:52What could this possibly be?

0:12:53Could it be food?

0:12:54Could it be laundry detergent?

0:12:55Like all that, everything.

0:12:57It's not, it's none of those things.

0:12:58Like nothing correlates in a direct way to this.

0:13:02Except, I did some research, and apparently,

0:13:06hives are often apparently the result of certain viruses.

0:13:10Like sometimes you just get a cold,

0:13:11and one of the things it does to you

0:13:13is give you hives for the duration of the cold.

0:13:15I had never heard of this, but when you research hives,

0:13:18that's what turns up from the more reputable sources.

0:13:21Which by the way, are hard to find.

0:13:23But anyway, so, I decided, you know,

0:13:27we had this appointment that was set

0:13:29from when we got the first shot.

0:13:30They automatically set you the second appointment

0:13:32three weeks later.

0:13:33And I thought, you know, I can not get my second shot.

0:13:38But there's a risk in that, that like,

0:13:42all the testing that's been done on the vaccines,

0:13:44and the massive amount of data that we have

0:13:47that this thing is ridiculously overwhelmingly safe.

0:13:50Like, I'm pretty sure you're more likely

0:13:52to die on the way to the vaccine site

0:13:54in a car accident than you are to die from the vaccine.

0:13:57I know that we've tested this very widely,

0:13:59but we've tested it with people getting a shot,

0:14:02you know, once, and then getting a second one

0:14:04three weeks later.

0:14:06If I get my second one six weeks later,

0:14:09then that's gonna be a lot less tested of a situation.

0:14:13- You'll be fine, like the three weeks

0:14:15is the soonest you can possibly give it

0:14:17because they're rushing to get the vaccine.

0:14:18Most vaccines, they wait six months to a year.

0:14:20So just FYI, I know it's too late now,

0:14:22but you could've waited a year and it would be fine.

0:14:24- Well, and I know, logically, I know, like,

0:14:27and I mean, again, like the way mRNA vaccines work

0:14:30is so remarkably amazing and remarkably safe

0:14:33compared to most of the things.

0:14:35Like, I wasn't too concerned, I'm like,

0:14:38okay, that would be like an unknown.

0:14:40Or I could just go get it now,

0:14:42even though I kinda have a weird cold,

0:14:44and roll the dice on that risk.

0:14:47And I decided to do that instead

0:14:51because I wanted to get this done.

0:14:52- Your reasoning about health decisions

0:14:54is suspect on many levels.

0:14:55I mean, you're talking about the thing that's tested.

0:14:57They're asking those questions for a reason,

0:14:59presumably because they don't want you to take it

0:15:01when you have a cold, but you're okay doing that.

0:15:04Anyway, I'm sure everything is fine, I'm sure it's fine.

0:15:06I'm just saying, I feel like your reasoning,

0:15:09your reasoning is not sound for any of this.

0:15:12- Well, regardless, maybe people don't always

0:15:14make the right decisions, but regardless, that's what I did.

0:15:17So I still have the weird nighttime hives

0:15:22on my arms and legs, but otherwise, like from the vaccine,

0:15:26I seem to only have worsened my cold

0:15:28by making myself extremely tired all day today.

0:15:32Just like really, just like knocked out tired.

0:15:35But I don't have like the fever

0:15:37that everyone says they get and everything,

0:15:38so I think I'm doing okay.

0:15:40And ultimately, I mean, geez,

0:15:42I did two episodes of the show with COVID.

0:15:44- I was gonna say, like you're really on the COVID tour

0:15:47this year, you get the actual COVID, you get the vaccine,

0:15:49now you're getting the second shot

0:15:51while you have some other cold.

0:15:52Like you just, you're rounding all the bases here.

0:15:54So I think you're, you know, maybe you'll get a fourth

0:15:57or a third COVID shot in six months, who knows?

0:16:00- Oh my word. - Thanks, yeah.

0:16:02Maybe I see this, I got the Pfizer,

0:16:03maybe I get the Moderna one also, just for--

0:16:05- Yeah, why not, just double up.

0:16:07All right, so we should start with some follow-up

0:16:09and this relates actually to what we were just talking about

0:16:11So I, this is one of those moments where I swear

0:16:14at some point I said something,

0:16:16but either it got cut or-- - You totally said it,

0:16:19it got cut in the edit.

0:16:20- Okay, so I was gonna say either it got cut in the edit

0:16:22or there was enough like distance between the thing

0:16:25that I said wrong in my in-show correction,

0:16:28which does happen sometimes, you know,

0:16:29I'll say something five minutes into the show

0:16:31and then I'll correct it 10 minutes into the show.

0:16:32And we've already gotten inundated with emails

0:16:34after the five minute mark about how wrong I am,

0:16:36which, you know, at that moment I was wrong, so that's fine.

0:16:39- And that's why it got edited out

0:16:40because your correction was distant from it

0:16:42and Marco was trimming the fat, so anyway, go on.

0:16:44- Yeah, so last week I was making reference

0:16:48to being quote unquote fully vaccinated,

0:16:51which I don't know if that necessarily

0:16:54is the wrong nomenclature,

0:16:55but it certainly presented the wrong implication.

0:16:57And I would just like to state clearly that yes,

0:16:59even last week I knew that it's not until two weeks

0:17:02after your second shot, if you're on the two shot system,

0:17:06that you are considered completely and utterly vaccinated.

0:17:09All I was trying to say at the time, which again,

0:17:11I probably should have chosen better words,

0:17:13is I have received the mandatory two shots that I need.

0:17:17And this was, at some point or another,

0:17:19this related to the Gruber term, vaccinated,

0:17:22which I think is quite funny and I have embraced.

0:17:25And Gruber defined vaccinated as two weeks

0:17:27after your final shot.

0:17:28And so I am not yet vaccinated, I am halfway to vaccinated

0:17:31in the sense that I got my first, excuse me,

0:17:34I got my second shot about a week ago.

0:17:36So yes, you are not fully vaccinated

0:17:38until two weeks after your second shot.

0:17:40I am well aware of that, I am sorry that that got cut

0:17:43in the last episode.

0:17:44- As am I, because it was probably my fault.

0:17:46- Well, you know, like I said, I think I clarified,

0:17:48we went off on like a tangent if I recall correctly,

0:17:50and then by the time I got the clarification.

0:17:52- Us? - Yeah, if you listen

0:17:53to the tangent, you see why it was cut,

0:17:54but that's where you put your correction.

0:17:56- Yeah, exactly. - Got it.

0:17:58- Yeah, us and a tangent, no.

0:17:59- Yeah, right, that never happens.

0:18:01- So moving right along, sometime, what was it,

0:18:04just a day or two ago, who is this, Joanna Stern

0:18:07had an interview with Hair Force One,

0:18:09otherwise known as Craig Federighi,

0:18:11and it was a pretty good interview,

0:18:12it was only eight minutes long, you can find it on YouTube,

0:18:14and interestingly, at seven and a quarter minutes,

0:18:18Joanna asks him, "Hey, Tim has said

0:18:21"that he's gonna be out in 10 years,

0:18:23"are you gonna be the next CEO?"

0:18:25And John, what did he say?

0:18:26- Also, here's the thing, yeah,

0:18:28I would encourage everyone to watch his interview

0:18:29'cause it's really short, and also 'cause his hair

0:18:31seems to be at half mast. (laughing)

0:18:34This is like the first bad CFED hair day I've ever seen.

0:18:37- Maybe it was like really humid there?

0:18:39- Yeah, it looked kinda like that.

0:18:40Or maybe you just got out of bed, I don't know.

0:18:42But that was the question, it's like,

0:18:43"Oh, your name's been floated as the next CEO,"

0:18:45which is a topic that we discussed in the show

0:18:47a couple episodes ago, who are the possible people

0:18:50who could be in line for next CEO?

0:18:51And when we discussed it, my attitude towards Federighi

0:18:56being the next CEO was like, "Ah, it doesn't seem

0:18:57"like something he's interested in,"

0:19:00'cause he just seems like he's more interested in tech stuff,

0:19:02and I'm sure he knows how hard Tim's job is,

0:19:04I'm not sure he has any, it was all about like,

0:19:06whoever was gonna be CEO was gonna really have

0:19:08to want that job, and it's a difficult job,

0:19:10and it's in many ways not as much fun

0:19:12as being the more technical level.

0:19:14So he got asked the question, and his answer was,

0:19:17"Get outta here, no," I think he said--

0:19:19- Irresponsible.

0:19:20- Yeah, that would be irresponsible, that's insanity,

0:19:22forget it, right?

0:19:23But watch the video, that's why we have a timestamp link

0:19:26in the show notes that brings you directly to that question,

0:19:29you can see his answer.

0:19:31What he says, the words, the transcript is,

0:19:33"Oh, that's silly," you know, whatever.

0:19:36But the way he says it, said, "Oh, CFED wants to be CEO."

0:19:40(laughing)

0:19:41That was my read on it anyway, my read on it was,

0:19:44"Yes, it was a silly," oh, forget it,

0:19:45that's so ridiculous, right?

0:19:47But the way he said it makes me think,

0:19:49he's open to the idea, so I'm starting

0:19:52to come around on that.

0:19:53- I still don't think that A, he would want it,

0:19:56or B, he should be the CEO, because we know him

0:20:00to some degree, the three of us have all met him

0:20:02at some point, right?

0:20:04Like, I've had a couple of conversations with him,

0:20:06like WBCs and stuff, you can tell through and through,

0:20:10he's a nerd like us, and a nerd like us should not be

0:20:15in the CEO of Apple in 2021 position.

0:20:19Because as I was saying, at this point,

0:20:21it's more of like a, it's almost like a political

0:20:25and diplomatic kind of job on a lot of levels,

0:20:27and that's not a job for a nerd, that's a job

0:20:30for basically a tech-savvy politician.

0:20:34- Well, I was saying that because he's a nerd,

0:20:35he wouldn't want it, because that's not what he's into,

0:20:38but in terms of could a nerd do that job well,

0:20:41here's the thing, yes, he's the nerd,

0:20:42but he's so high up on the org chart

0:20:44that surely his last two or three jobs have been

0:20:47like 98% political, managerial, you know, BS,

0:20:51it just so happens that he's also still super tactical

0:20:53and super into that, but I think as Steve Jobs

0:20:57at least has shown, whatever it is that you're super into,

0:21:00you can still dig down on even when you're CEO,

0:21:03like you can just kind of choose which things you delegate,

0:21:05you know what I mean?

0:21:06So that, I mean, I'm basing it off like the way he said

0:21:09like a three-word answer, so this is obviously silly, right?

0:21:12But I no longer think it's ridiculous

0:21:16that he might be interested in it,

0:21:17and I don't think it's ridiculous

0:21:19that he might do an okay job at it.

0:21:21Just because his strengths are completely different

0:21:23than Tim Cook's, and Tim Cook's were completely different

0:21:26than Steve's, I think they're all inhabiting

0:21:29such a high level in the org chart

0:21:31that they all could do a reasonable job as CEO,

0:21:35they would just be very different kinds of CEOs.

0:21:38- I think that's true, and the rumblings I've heard

0:21:40from friends at Apple is that, you know,

0:21:43I think some of them like C-Fed and some of them don't,

0:21:45but I've never heard anyone even think about breathing

0:21:49that he's not an incredibly smart man.

0:21:53Like, you know, everyone universally,

0:21:55the friends of mine who like him,

0:21:56the friends of mine that don't,

0:21:57all say that he's extremely bright.

0:21:59And if you look at this interview,

0:22:00now granted I'm sure it was heavily edited,

0:22:02but it seems like not only is he smart,

0:22:04but he's a very cool customer in a very Tim Cook sort of way.

0:22:08And I don't know that he would get the nod,

0:22:10and I'm not 100% convinced he would want it,

0:22:13but I do think, if I were a betting man,

0:22:15I'd say he would definitely take a stab at it.

0:22:18And the other interesting thing is, you know,

0:22:19he is extremely technical.

0:22:21I think it was Marco a second ago that said

0:22:22he's, you know, a nerd's nerd.

0:22:23- He really, really is.

0:22:25- Right, he's still at least looking at code

0:22:28from time to time, and I think there have been times

0:22:30that rank and file engineers have had to be like,

0:22:33Craig, stop, please don't make commits.

0:22:36No, no, no, no, no, please stop.

0:22:38You have much more important things.

0:22:39That may be BS, I might be making that up,

0:22:41but I'm pretty sure that I have heard stories about that,

0:22:44you know, not too many years ago,

0:22:46that this is still a thing that happens from time to time.

0:22:48And he seems to really get it.

0:22:51So I only met him once, it was when Marco,

0:22:54if I recall correctly, you had spotted him

0:22:56across the field at the bash

0:22:58when it was still in San Francisco,

0:23:00and all of a sudden you basically grabbed my arm

0:23:02and said, follow me, let's go.

0:23:04What is going on?

0:23:04And next thing I know, I'm posing with Federighi

0:23:07and shaking his hand, and he was an extremely kind fellow.

0:23:09And so anyways, yeah, I would be surprised

0:23:13if he was the one to get the nod,

0:23:14but I wouldn't be surprised if he was interested in it.

0:23:18- I did pick up, there was a little bit of oddity

0:23:20to his tone of reaction, but I attributed that

0:23:23to discomfort with the question,

0:23:25as opposed to actually wanting the job.

0:23:28'Cause again, I've heard similar things, Casey,

0:23:31of how he really is very involved with the tech.

0:23:35I can't imagine that he has any interest

0:23:38in doing all the other crap that the CEO has to do.

0:23:41He's really into the software and the tech.

0:23:44And he doesn't even seem to be that into

0:23:46a lot of the product design and product decisions,

0:23:49let alone the massive amount of operational

0:23:53and political stuff that CEOs have to deal with.

0:23:55Financial stuff, I mean, there's so much stuff

0:23:57that CEOs have to do these days,

0:23:58especially the CEO of Apple in 2021,

0:24:01or 2031, or whatever it is.

0:24:03It's not a job that somebody who is very, very technical

0:24:08would probably really want to do.

0:24:10Because honestly, he's probably really happy where he is,

0:24:14'cause where he is is about as high up as you can go

0:24:17without having a lot more of that other stuff

0:24:20come into your job description

0:24:21that he probably doesn't want.

0:24:23- Yeah, I think people always have aspirations,

0:24:27people are always enthusiastic

0:24:29and trying to get to the next big thing.

0:24:31But I totally hear what you're saying.

0:24:33I could go on with this conversation for another hour.

0:24:35We got a lot to go through, so let's just move right along.

0:24:37Apple TV, so calibration.

0:24:39I thought we had said this or implied this last episode,

0:24:42but I guess not.

0:24:44The whole thing where you calibrate the TV,

0:24:47which is I guess how we phrased it,

0:24:48you're not actually calibrating the TV itself.

0:24:50You're calibrating the Apple TV's output

0:24:53for your specific TV.

0:24:55The idea being that when your TV is tuned to the Apple TV,

0:24:59when you're using the Apple TV as your input,

0:25:01then it will look incredible

0:25:02because you've used your iPhone and the Apple TV in concert

0:25:05in order to tune the output for your specific TV.

0:25:08Is that a better way of describing it?

0:25:10- I mean, we did say that it adjusts the TV's outputs,

0:25:13but I didn't delve into what the implications of that are.

0:25:16I mean, the obvious first implication is that means

0:25:19that if you calibrate the Apple TV's output

0:25:22to look better on your TV, that only affects the Apple TV

0:25:25because when you're not looking at the Apple TV,

0:25:28that was the only thing whose output you calibrated.

0:25:30Like you're not calibrating the display device,

0:25:33you're calibrating the signal that comes over the HDMI cable

0:25:36into your display device and adjusting that signal

0:25:38to account for whatever weirdness there is

0:25:40in your display device.

0:25:41But when you use another display device

0:25:43like your game console or your cable box

0:25:45or whatever it is that you have,

0:25:46anything you did with the Apple TV is totally irrelevant

0:25:49because you were only basically telling the Apple TV

0:25:52to output different signals.

0:25:53Second thing is, perhaps less obvious,

0:25:56television sets, especially modern ones,

0:25:57have tons of adjustments that the Apple TV has no access to.

0:26:02There are tons of image processing things

0:26:05that happen on the TV itself,

0:26:07and there's nothing you can do to the output

0:26:09from the Apple TV to enable, disable,

0:26:11or adjust those features at all.

0:26:13And if your TV is super duper off,

0:26:15there's nothing the output of your HDMI signal can do

0:26:17to account for that.

0:26:18Or if it could account for it,

0:26:19it could just make it much worse

0:26:20because if you're red and you're green, you're super low,

0:26:23the only way it can get it in balance

0:26:24is bringing your blue super low

0:26:25and now your whole image level is down.

0:26:27It's very, very complicated.

0:26:28All this is to say that you should actually calibrate

0:26:31your television and not calibrate the output

0:26:35of one of your HDMI devices to account

0:26:38for the idiosyncrasies of your television sets.

0:26:40So please calibrate your TV if you want to do this.

0:26:43Now, all that said,

0:26:45this Apple thing is probably better than nothing.

0:26:47And if you watch most of your TV through the Apple TV,

0:26:50it might help some, but yeah.

0:26:53Quinn Nelson, Snazzy Labs, Snazzy YouTube channel,

0:27:00has an upcoming video about the Apple calibration

0:27:02versus a real calibration.

0:27:04I'm really curious to see what he finds,

0:27:05but my assessment of this Apple calibration thing right now

0:27:10is pretty low.

0:27:10So unless it's, this is some very surprising results,

0:27:13I would say, please calibrate your television

0:27:14and not just your Apple TV.

0:27:17- Sounds good.

0:27:17All right, the remote has a slightly rounded back,

0:27:20which I think I had seen before we recorded,

0:27:23but I don't believe we brought up last time.

0:27:25So that should be nice to at least be able to pick up

0:27:28the correct side facing upwards,

0:27:30which is definitely an improvement.

0:27:32How do you feel about that, Jon?

0:27:34- Yeah, and even last time I said

0:27:35it had no acknowledgement of human hands,

0:27:37here's a minor acknowledgement.

0:27:38Now, the Siri remote also had slightly curved sides,

0:27:42so you could pick it up with your fingernails off the table.

0:27:44This one is a more of a uniform sort of U shape

0:27:48along the entire bottom.

0:27:50It's not sloped enough,

0:27:51and it's not like it's still not gonna be,

0:27:52you're gonna pick it up

0:27:53or you're gonna feel like you're a giant

0:27:54and this is something for a toddler,

0:27:56because that's how small the remote is,

0:27:57but credit where credit is due,

0:27:58they slightly curved the bottom.

0:28:01- Indeed, and then Eric Weber writes

0:28:03that the original Siri remote was $80,

0:28:05but it was dropped to 60 with the refreshed white ring

0:28:09when the original Apple TV 4K was introduced in 2017.

0:28:13- So this remote is not cheaper than the Siri remote.

0:28:16It's only cheaper than the original Siri remote,

0:28:18so that's a shame.

0:28:19- There was a big brouhaha over the last several days

0:28:22that the new Siri remote does not have an accelerometer

0:28:26or gyroscope for gaming on the Apple TV, which is a bummer.

0:28:30- Yeah, especially since it costs the same amount

0:28:32and it doesn't have a U1 in it as we discussed last week,

0:28:34so I'm not sure where the extra money went.

0:28:38It's got a smaller touchpad, a similar number of buttons.

0:28:42It's made of aluminum instead of being aluminum,

0:28:45glass, and metal or whatever the other one was.

0:28:48I don't know, anyway, I don't quite understand

0:28:50why this lacks those features,

0:28:52other than the touchpad's not big enough

0:28:53to play games with anyway, so why should they bother?

0:28:56But really, if you're gonna play games on the Apple TV,

0:28:58you should buy a controller.

0:28:59You shouldn't use the Siri remote,

0:29:01and apparently you can't use this remote

0:29:02if the games require an accelerometer or gyroscope.

0:29:05- Is anybody playing games on Apple TV?

0:29:08- I hope they're not playing them with the remote

0:29:10if they are.

0:29:11- I guess you can play Crossy Road with the remote.

0:29:13Any game that has one button?

0:29:14- We did.

0:29:15When it first came out, we played a lot of Crossy Road,

0:29:17we played Badland, but ultimately,

0:29:20we just fell out of favor with the Apple TV

0:29:22as a gaming platform because we tried a bunch of games.

0:29:24I even bought two of the controllers,

0:29:26like two different branded Apple TV MFI controllers,

0:29:31and the gaming scene is just so,

0:29:33it feels like back in the '90s

0:29:35when you bought the wrong system.

0:29:37It feels like you had the 3DO,

0:29:39and you're waiting for good games to come out,

0:29:40and you're like, well, there's not a lot here.

0:29:43- Well, you're used to that being a Genesis person.

0:29:45- Oh, no way, come on.

0:29:46(laughing)

0:29:49- It was too easy, I couldn't resist.

0:29:50- No, it's more like a 32X.

0:29:51It's like you bought 32X thinking,

0:29:53oh, there's gonna be a lot of games for this,

0:29:54and then just nothing happens.

0:29:57- Well, if you subscribe to Apple One,

0:29:58you should at least check out Apple Arcade

0:30:00'cause they just added a whole infusion of games,

0:30:02including a bunch of known good games

0:30:05from the pre-Apple Arcade days,

0:30:06only without ads in an app purchase.

0:30:08So, you know, if you're getting it for free anyway,

0:30:10you might as well check it out.

0:30:12- Yeah, so anyway, to come back

0:30:13to this lack of gyroscope and accelerometer,

0:30:15apparently if you try to play a game that requires it

0:30:18and you don't have a proper game controller hooked up,

0:30:22the app will say, to play this game on your Apple TV,

0:30:25you need to connect the Apple TV remote,

0:30:26parenthesis, first generation, parenthesis,

0:30:28or a compatible PlayStation, Xbox, or MFI controller.

0:30:31If I were to read that as a regular person,

0:30:34I wouldn't have a clue what MFI meant.

0:30:36- I wouldn't have a clue what Apple TV remote,

0:30:38parenthesis, first generation means.

0:30:39- That's true too, yeah, absolutely.

0:30:40- And there's a note about this,

0:30:41that Apple TV remote is what it's called in countries

0:30:45where Siri is not available on the Apple TV,

0:30:47but otherwise it's called the Siri remote.

0:30:49- Fair enough.

0:30:50- But no one knows what Siri remote first generation is,

0:30:53and no one knows what Apple remote first generation is,

0:30:55but people do know what PlayStation, Xbox controllers are,

0:30:57so at least they have a fighting chance.

0:30:59- Somebody, Odin, wrote in with an interesting point

0:31:03about Apple TV pricing.

0:31:04So as everyone else has been,

0:31:06we've been lamenting the fact that it is a very expensive

0:31:09box to do the sorts of things that it does.

0:31:11And Odin writes, with regard to the pricing,

0:31:14neither comes, neither, the Apple TV doesn't come

0:31:17with an HDMI cable, so you can't even connect it

0:31:20to your TV right out of the box.

0:31:22Meanwhile, Google and Amazon's $30 streaming device

0:31:25is plugged directly into an HDMI port.

0:31:27- Neither meaning like the 4K or the HD.

0:31:29Like it makes sense if you think about it for a second

0:31:31and you know how big the box is.

0:31:32Of course there's not an HDMI cable in there,

0:31:34it's this tiny little box.

0:31:35It's just got enough room for the little puck

0:31:36and the remote, but it's another, you'll get it,

0:31:40you'll say like, yay, here's this new Apple TV,

0:31:41let me hook it up, and you realize,

0:31:42unless you already have a spare HDMI cable,

0:31:44unless you disconnect another input

0:31:46and put this one in its place,

0:31:48there's something else you have to buy.

0:31:49Because it's just not expensive enough

0:31:51to support the price of that cable.

0:31:53- It's pretty crummy.

0:31:55Did the Apple TV ever come with an HDMI cable?

0:31:58I don't remember.

0:31:58- No. - I don't think so.

0:31:59I think it's always, maybe the one that was

0:32:01basically a Mac Mini, do you remember that one?

0:32:03- I don't think that had HDMI output,

0:32:05I think that was component.

0:32:06- Maybe.

0:32:07I never had one, I don't remember.

0:32:07- But no, they never came with HDMI,

0:32:09I had one of those, they never came with HDMI cables.

0:32:11- And yes, the chatter of mass,

0:32:12the PS5 does come with an HDMI cable.

0:32:14And it's good that it does because PS5 supports HDMI 2.1

0:32:18and most people don't have an HDMI 2.1 compatible cable

0:32:21just laying around if they haven't bought

0:32:23AV equipment in a while.

0:32:24- Correction, it did have HDMI out.

0:32:26(laughing)

0:32:28- We regret the--

0:32:29- It also had component, in my defense.

0:32:31- Yeah, it was the one that ran Mac OS 10.4 or something.

0:32:35- Yeah, it was basically,

0:32:36it was like a little Celeron in there.

0:32:38It was a whole little low powered,

0:32:40like 400 megahertz Celeron computer or something like that.

0:32:43- And a hard drive, right?

0:32:44- Yeah, I believe so.

0:32:45- It was a little Mac, it ran Mac OS.

0:32:47- I do not remember this at all.

0:32:49- It was the one that, it basically acted like an iPod.

0:32:51You had to sync things to it from your Mac.

0:32:54And it was a whole thing.

0:32:56- I think it was introduced at the iPhone event in 2007,

0:32:58wasn't it?

0:32:59- Yes, yes it was.

0:33:00- It was like ITV, right?

0:33:02- Yeah, originally it was,

0:33:03well I think it was announced as ITV earlier that year,

0:33:05but I think they introduced it then as Apple TV.

0:33:07It was introduced at one event,

0:33:09or it was like previewed at one event,

0:33:10and then it was, I think it was shown off

0:33:12at the iPhone event.

0:33:13- As bad as the current crop of Apple TVs are,

0:33:16this one was worse, so just be glad things have improved.

0:33:18- For the time, it was really interesting.

0:33:21- For the time, TiVo embarrassed it, so I'm not sure.

0:33:24- Oh, here we go.

0:33:25We need a different sound effect

0:33:27other than a ding for the TiVo.

0:33:29Like a whomp.

0:33:30- I don't know about TiVo much, I'm just saying.

0:33:31Back when the first Apple TV came out,

0:33:34TiVo was just a thousand times better.

0:33:36- Moving right along.

0:33:37John, tell me, what is the deal with high frame rate HDR,

0:33:41anyway, like what is the story there?

0:33:44- We talked about that as a possible reason

0:33:45that Marco should get the fancy new Apple TV,

0:33:47oh don't you wanna see high frame rate HDR video,

0:33:50meaning higher than like 30 frames per second or whatever.

0:33:53And Chris Jennings tells us that apparently,

0:33:59according to his conversations with Apple support,

0:34:01which isn't always exactly correct,

0:34:03but according to these conversations

0:34:04from a theoretically knowledgeable Apple source

0:34:07in Apple support, you can get the high frame rate HDR

0:34:12features on the older Apple TV 4K too,

0:34:15that it's basically a software feature,

0:34:16not a hardware feature.

0:34:17Now initially I thought, well, that can't be the case,

0:34:19because only the new Apple TV 4K supports HDMI 2.1,

0:34:22and I know you need HDMI 2.1 to support

0:34:25120 frames per second and stuff like that,

0:34:27but it turns out that even though the new Apple TV

0:34:29has HDMI 2.1, it only supports up to 4K

0:34:33at 60 frames per second.

0:34:35Even though HDMI 2.1, the standard,

0:34:37can do 4K at 120 frames per second,

0:34:40the fancy new Apple TV doesn't go higher than 60.

0:34:44And the old Apple TV 4K supported HDMI 2.0A,

0:34:47which stops at 4K 60, but I don't know

0:34:51if the old Apple TV 4K before the software

0:34:53did do 4K 60, so anyway, it's still an open question,

0:34:56but it seems clear that if you're looking for 4K

0:34:58at 120 frames per second from your new Apple TV,

0:35:01it can't currently do that, even though technically

0:35:03the wire coming out of it can support that.

0:35:06I guess we'll just wait to have to get these things

0:35:08in our houses and see if we can play back

0:35:114K 60 frame per second HDR video on an old Apple TV 4K

0:35:16with the new tvOS update, but according to Apple support,

0:35:19that is a thing that can happen.

0:35:21The other theory I have is that maybe high frame rate HDR

0:35:23via AirPlay requires the new Apple TV,

0:35:25and it only works wired or downloaded to the thing

0:35:29with the old one, I don't know, it's very confusing.

0:35:33- Better get that 64 gig model

0:35:35in case it's only downloaded.

0:35:36(laughing)

0:35:37- Yeah, right?

0:35:39- Aye yai yai, all right, and AppleCare+ is available

0:35:41for the first time for Apple TV, providing three years

0:35:44of technical support and additional hardware coverage,

0:35:46including up to two incidents of accidental damage

0:35:49protection every 12 months.

0:35:51It's $30 for all of that.

0:35:54And I first thought, why would one want this?

0:35:57But then it occurred to me when I was still

0:36:00with a true jobby job, there were Apple TVs

0:36:02in like every conference room, and I would assume

0:36:04that this is a corporate thing.

0:36:05- No, no, you forget, or maybe you've been lucky enough

0:36:08not to know this.

0:36:09It's a stupid remote, the Siri remote was covered in glass.

0:36:12People were shattering them all the time.

0:36:13It's not like your Apple TV puck is gonna get damaged,

0:36:18I hope, like it's usually just sitting with the TV

0:36:19or whatever, it's this stupid remote.

0:36:21Now, I think the new remote looks much, much sturdier

0:36:23'cause it's just aluminum and plastic buttons

0:36:25and there's no big glass thing, but I've seen so many

0:36:27pictures of completely shattered, like the glass diving

0:36:31board on the Siri remotes.

0:36:33So I just wanted to bring those up just because

0:36:35if you're afraid of that happening or if for some reason

0:36:38you're buying the one that still has the glass remote,

0:36:41you can actually get AppleCare for it.

0:36:42And I think the only reason this exists is because of all

0:36:45of the people breaking their Siri remote and then being

0:36:47super angry that it costs 60 bucks or in the past 80 bucks

0:36:50to replace the stupid remote that they just broke.

0:36:52That's a good point, I hadn't considered that.

0:36:54- The chatroom says that the Apple TV remote is not covered

0:36:56by AppleCare or was not covered by AppleCare.

0:36:58I'm assuming this new AppleCare for the Apple TV

0:37:01covers everything.

0:37:02And when they say accidental damage, I'm assuming

0:37:04they include accidental damage to the remote.

0:37:07But if you have any questions, ask Apple to make sure

0:37:09before you buy it, but it is only 30 bucks.

0:37:11- Is it very likely that you would accidentally

0:37:14damage the box?

0:37:16- I mean, I guess if it's in a conference room or being

0:37:19wheeled around on a card and you drop it and it cracks,

0:37:21I don't know, maybe yank out the cable and it breaks

0:37:24the connector.

0:37:25- I don't know, man.

0:37:26But all I know is it's this coming Friday, which as we

0:37:29record is like a day and a half away that I can finally

0:37:32order a new one and I am super excited.

0:37:34- It is pretty funny though, like there was, I think

0:37:37somebody wrote in to point this out, but like the new one

0:37:40isn't that much better than the outgoing one.

0:37:44Like it's actually most of the newness of it is the new

0:37:48remote, which you can now get for all of them, or you will

0:37:51be able to get for all of them once the orders go up.

0:37:54And it's an A12 versus an A10X, but like the A10X and A12

0:37:58are actually not as far apart as you would think.

0:38:01- And I did read that the A10X has a better GPU than the

0:38:04A12, which I'm not sure that I buy, but I mean the A12

0:38:08certainly will be lower power for doing the same amount

0:38:12of work, I suppose.

0:38:13- Yeah, it seems like this was an update mostly to the

0:38:16remote, and Apple basically speed bumped barely the box.

0:38:21And I'm okay with that, because the remote was the biggest

0:38:24problem, I'm still amused at how bad the pricing is,

0:38:29and that they still offer two capacities.

0:38:32(laughs)

0:38:34But you know, I'm hoping that the remote will be good,

0:38:36and we will find out.

0:38:37Honestly though, I don't think I'm even gonna buy the new

0:38:41box, I think I'm only gonna buy the remotes.

0:38:43Because I look at the box and I'm like, well what am I

0:38:46spending the extra $120 for the box for?

0:38:49I'm not really getting a lot for that, I don't think.

0:38:53- I can understand that.

0:38:54- Real time follow up, they were looking at the

0:38:56apple.com/support/products/appletv, and it says the

0:39:00AppleCare+ does cover your Apple TV, included Siri remote

0:39:04and power cord, it's not called Siri remote anymore,

0:39:06Apple, update your page.

0:39:07And up to two incidents of accidental damage.

0:39:09It looks like the remote is covered under the new AppleCare.

0:39:12And one more AppleCare thing here that I snuck in,

0:39:15this is not Apple TV related, but apparently now AppleCare+

0:39:18coverage for the Mac can be extended beyond three years,

0:39:21you just keep paying for it.

0:39:22So they always have the thing where you can pay like

0:39:24per month, but then you could also pay one lump sum

0:39:27and get the three years, now at the end of the three years

0:39:29you can just keep paying, I presume on a yearly or monthly

0:39:32or whatever plan.

0:39:33We'll put a link in the show notes for more details on this.

0:39:35So if you have a Mac and you're always annoyed that even

0:39:37with the fancy AppleCare+, you know, three year bulk

0:39:41purchase thing, it just ends after three years, now you

0:39:43can keep paying and keep getting that AppleCare

0:39:45if you want to.

0:39:46That's actually really nice, you know, like I would have

0:39:49definitely used that on my iMac Pro, I think people who buy

0:39:53like really expensive Macs and use them for more than

0:39:56three years, that's a really nice feature.

0:39:58I wonder like how long will it go though?

0:40:00Like there has to be some limit, right?

0:40:02Because otherwise they would be, like Apple would therefore

0:40:04be on the hook to replace your like seven year old Mac

0:40:07or something, like there's probably some limit.

0:40:10- They have that time horizon where like the products

0:40:11become like obsolete or something and Apple parlance

0:40:15and they're like, I'm sure there is a limit on it,

0:40:17but just going past three years is useful and you know,

0:40:20the longer you go, the more likely it is you're gonna need

0:40:23that coverage, so if, and if the price doesn't increase,

0:40:25which I don't think it does, I don't think it increases

0:40:27with time, other than just like the normal sort of

0:40:30inflationary increases of AppleCare and all their products,

0:40:34yeah, it might be a good deal for people if they keep

0:40:35you the Macs for a long time.

0:40:37- Hey, going back to the Apple TV for a second,

0:40:39I am going to be placing an order Friday morning.

0:40:41Do I, why would I spend the extra $20 for the 64 gig

0:40:44one, I'm never gonna play games on it, I almost never,

0:40:47I can't remember a time I've ever downloaded anything

0:40:49to this.

0:40:50- You gotta hold all those screensaver video.

0:40:51- You know, you joke, but that actually is a reasonable

0:40:54answer 'cause those screensavers are so good, but like,

0:40:56I don't think it's worth 20 bucks to do that, is it?

0:40:58Like why would I get the big one?

0:40:59- I think $20 is so little for doubling the storage,

0:41:03I just might get it anyway, just for the hell of it,

0:41:05but yeah, I have the aerial screensaver on my Mac

0:41:07and I looked at how big the folder of downloads is

0:41:09and it's 54 gigs.

0:41:11- Yeah, it's big, it is not small, especially for a computer

0:41:14with the monitor you have.

0:41:16- So, you know, if you get the 32 gig Apple TV,

0:41:18you certainly won't have all of the screensaver video cache

0:41:21locally and I know that's gonna really pain you.

0:41:23- That's interesting actually.

0:41:24- With your gigabit internet connection,

0:41:25you never notice this. - Exactly, exactly.

0:41:27Yep, all right, well, we'll see how I feel,

0:41:29but sitting here now, I think I'm just gonna get the 32.

0:41:32All right, moving on to the iMac.

0:41:34The power brick slash cable, this was brought up,

0:41:38I think I first saw this with Jason Snell,

0:41:40he apparently cut a, I think it was a two meter string

0:41:44and hung it off the back of a standing desk

0:41:45while it was in standing mode and he said

0:41:47that the power brick would probably be dangling in the air

0:41:50because the two meters isn't quite enough

0:41:52for his particular standing desk, which is kind of a bummer.

0:41:54- What is this meters business?

0:41:55Analog is affecting you.

0:41:56We're talking about feet here, okay?

0:41:58- Sorry, John.

0:41:59- Two meters is not the same thing as six feet.

0:42:02Yeah, so Jason did bring this up

0:42:04when he was trying to see, you know, in my standing desk,

0:42:07if I had a six foot cord coming out of the back of my iMac,

0:42:10would the brick reach the ground

0:42:12or would the brick be dangling in midair

0:42:14and his measurements indicated that the power brick

0:42:16would kind of be dangling in midair, which is not ideal.

0:42:19He did an interview on upgrade with the Apple folks

0:42:23and brought this exact issue up and said,

0:42:24"Hey, six foot cord, I just measured

0:42:27"that won't be quite long enough for my setup.

0:42:29"How did you come up with six feet?"

0:42:30And the Apple people said, "Well, we looked

0:42:32"at all different setups and we came up

0:42:33"and we thought this was the blah, blah, blah."

0:42:35But like, Jason had just got done telling them,

0:42:37it's like, well, this may fit, like the AirPods,

0:42:40fit the average ear but not fitting Marco's ear.

0:42:42This may be sort of the sweet spot

0:42:44for satisfying the most people,

0:42:46but it doesn't work in Jason's setup

0:42:48and I don't think Jason's, you know,

0:42:50because Apple acknowledged standing desks,

0:42:52it's not like they didn't think about standing desks,

0:42:53they did, but Jason's not that tall

0:42:55and his desk is not that high,

0:42:57so I feel like they made, you know,

0:42:59put an extra six inches to a foot on this cord

0:43:02would probably be beneficial

0:43:03for people who use standing desks.

0:43:05- You know what would be a lot more beneficial

0:43:07for people who use standing desks?

0:43:09Why are you running more than one cable off the desk?

0:43:12- Oh, you'll have to Velcro things

0:43:14at the bottom of your desk, here we go.

0:43:16- Yes, somehow zip tie or otherwise attach a surge strip

0:43:20under your desk to the underside of your desk,

0:43:23plug everything on your desk into that,

0:43:25tie up all the loose, you know, cable excess

0:43:27so it's nice and tidy somewhere,

0:43:28and then run one cable or maybe two if you include ethernet

0:43:32from that area of your desk down one of the lifting legs

0:43:36or whatever you can have it run down cleanly to the outlet.

0:43:39And then you can have a huge amount of slack

0:43:42in that second, you know, cable grouping of, you know,

0:43:44just the ethernet and power coming out of the desk

0:43:46and all the stupid little short cables

0:43:47you can plug into the underside of your desk

0:43:49and have everything nice and tidy.

0:43:51- So this is a setup for people who have more than just

0:43:53the iMac on their desk, but part of the beauty

0:43:55of having the single cable coming out of your iMac,

0:43:57like you don't even need ethernet back there and everything,

0:44:00like that's, I think if you just have an iMac

0:44:02in a lone scenario like that,

0:44:05you don't need the whole power strip underneath the desk,

0:44:07maybe you just have the one cord.

0:44:08And maybe those people don't use standing desks,

0:44:10I don't know, I'm just saying like it's,

0:44:11the fact that it's so close to working with a standing desk,

0:44:13but just needs a few more inches seems like they could

0:44:16fix that in a subsequent revision.

0:44:18The second thing to know about the power brick is

0:44:20we were speculating about, hey, they could have used USB-C

0:44:22because USB-C can, USB-C power delivery can do 100 watts.

0:44:27Apparently the power brick is rated for 143 watts.

0:44:30Now that doesn't mean the iMac or any of the iMacs

0:44:32they introduced, you know, in the Apple event

0:44:35will actually ever consume 143 watts,

0:44:38but that's what the brick is rated for.

0:44:40So maybe Apple knows something we don't,

0:44:42maybe they're just trying to have one brick and reuse it.

0:44:45You know, maybe they're thinking ahead,

0:44:47is the next version might use more power than this one did.

0:44:49I don't know, but either way,

0:44:51the bricks makes me think that Apple thinks that 100 watts

0:44:54is not sufficient for the system,

0:44:56either in the present or the future.

0:44:58- That's interesting.

0:44:59Tell me about Visa mounts,

0:45:01'cause apparently you can flip flop sort of, kind of.

0:45:04- Yeah, we didn't, I don't know if you mentioned

0:45:05Visa mounts at all, but just FYI, like the old style iMacs,

0:45:09these new colored ones,

0:45:11you can also get them with a Visa mount.

0:45:13If you don't like the non-adjustable little foot,

0:45:15you can get a Visa mount on the back

0:45:16and then put it on whatever arm or stand

0:45:18or anything else you have that supports Visa.

0:45:20And apparently, according to Jason Snell,

0:45:22you can call AppleCare and if you buy a Visa mount iMac

0:45:26and say, I don't want the Visa mount anymore,

0:45:28can you swap it for the foot version?

0:45:31Now, no idea how much that would cost.

0:45:33Obviously it would cost you some money.

0:45:35I assume they just replaced the entire back of the computer,

0:45:38but the good thing is the computer

0:45:39is basically a giant iPad anyway,

0:45:41and so the back is just like the entire big back shell

0:45:43and maybe it's an easy repair, I don't know.

0:45:46But it's nice to know that you're not stuck

0:45:48with the Visa mount permanently if you buy one

0:45:51and then change your mind later.

0:45:53- Indeed.

0:45:54And then someone wrote in to ask,

0:45:56hey, does anyone else wish that they would add

0:45:59the ethernet port to all Mac-powered adapters?

0:46:02For example, the notebooks would be nicer than a dongle.

0:46:04Don't we all want that?

0:46:05Or is it just me?

0:46:07I guess not literally just me, but.

0:46:08- I mean, it depends on your setup.

0:46:09I can see the appeal because we don't like dongles, right?

0:46:12And you have to have the power brick with you anyway,

0:46:13and there's plenty of room on the power brick

0:46:15for the ethernet connector.

0:46:16But on the other hand,

0:46:18people tend not to like to crawl around under their desk

0:46:20and plug things in, and with an iMac, it's not a big deal.

0:46:22You do it once, it's a desktop,

0:46:23you set it up and you're done.

0:46:24But with a notebook, you're bringing it from place to place.

0:46:27Maybe if you had multiple power adapters in the house

0:46:29and you could set up the ethernet at once

0:46:30and just have the power cord

0:46:31kind of stick it up on your desk, it would be cool.

0:46:33I can see the appeal and maybe that is Apple's plan.

0:46:36Again, they made 143 watt adapter.

0:46:38Maybe this adapter will also come

0:46:41with some other future computer.

0:46:42But the tricky bit is you need to route ethernet

0:46:46to the power brick and all of Apple's current power bricks

0:46:50don't do that in terms,

0:46:51I don't think they even have the right number of conductors.

0:46:53I think they're just power from the power brick.

0:46:55I'm not entirely sure,

0:46:56but my impression is that from the power brick.

0:46:58- That's not entirely true.

0:47:00They support only USB two transfer speeds though.

0:47:03So like whatever Apple labels as a charge cable for USB-C,

0:47:06it can be used as data, but not for USB three speeds.

0:47:10- Yeah, and of course,

0:47:12they could put out an adapter that would support this.

0:47:14The other wrinkle in this

0:47:15and we're not gonna talk about this week,

0:47:17but there's a bunch of leaks from some ransomware attack

0:47:20on a manufacturer that shows,

0:47:22supposedly show the rumored MacBook Pros

0:47:25with all the things that we talked about in past shows,

0:47:27SD card slot and MagSafe.

0:47:29- And HDMI.

0:47:30- Yeah, and HDMI, right?

0:47:31If those things end up having MagSafe,

0:47:35of course Apple can do whatever it wants

0:47:36with this, whatever this new MagSafe is,

0:47:38but that would mean that they would need to route ethernet

0:47:41through the MagSafe adapter,

0:47:42along with power down the power cable to the power brick

0:47:45where the supposed ethernet port is.

0:47:47So I think there's some merit to this idea,

0:47:50but it seems complicated enough

0:47:52that unless Apple is really married to it,

0:47:54that they're, especially if they're going to MagSafe,

0:47:57it's just seems simpler for them to just bring back MagSafe

0:47:59as just a power thing.

0:48:00And then continue to rely on dongles for everything else.

0:48:04- Yeah, and if you actually want a single cable solution,

0:48:07I would assume and hope that if this new MagSafe

0:48:11based MacBook Pro thing is real,

0:48:13or even if it isn't,

0:48:14assuming future MacBook Pros might have MagSafe,

0:48:17I would hope that they would also still be able to charge

0:48:20via USB-C PD.

0:48:21And if that's the case,

0:48:22then people who want a single cable solution,

0:48:25but some kind of port expansion

0:48:28can continue to use like Thunderbolt docs and stuff.

0:48:30And still have just one cable running to the computer

0:48:32that also charges it.

0:48:33- Yeah, I will be,

0:48:35even though I think MagSafe would be great

0:48:37to bring back for notebooks,

0:48:39it will bum me out ever so slightly

0:48:41if USB-C power delivery goes away.

0:48:43You know, if it's one or the other, not both.

0:48:46And especially since we're all approaching this

0:48:50like USB-C lifestyle where everything is USB-C.

0:48:54I mean, there's so much of my life other than my iPhone

0:48:57that is USB-C.

0:48:58And just having a USB-C dongle sitting around

0:49:02can power my iPad, my computer, my drone, et cetera,

0:49:07my Switch.

0:49:08And man, it would really stink

0:49:11if MagSafe got reintroduced, which would be excellent.

0:49:14And then they said,

0:49:15"Well, that's the only way you can charge now."

0:49:17Tough nuggies.

0:49:18That would really bum me out.

0:49:19- Yeah, agreed.

0:49:20And I hope and I bet they would probably keep both.

0:49:24- One would hope and one would think.

0:49:26All right, and then finally, Eric Berlin writes,

0:49:28"What's the benefit of having four high efficiency cores

0:49:30"in a system without a battery like the iMac or Mac mini?

0:49:33"Aside from economies of scale,

0:49:34"do you expect there to be a split

0:49:35"between desktop and laptop versions

0:49:36"and of future Apple M series systems on a chip?"

0:49:40I mean, one silly answer is it's just more efficient.

0:49:43Like as silly as that sounds,

0:49:44but why run a higher wattage core

0:49:48and why expend all that energy if you don't have to?

0:49:51I mean, I know that's kind of silly,

0:49:53but it does add up over time, doesn't it?

0:49:56- I mean, it makes sense for more

0:49:57than just an electric bill perspective.

0:49:59It's, you know me, it's all about fan noise, right?

0:50:02If you can use, most of the time, your Mac is not doing much

0:50:06if you're not running some big, you know,

0:50:08hard task in the background that's using lots of cores.

0:50:10So from moment to moment,

0:50:12those efficiency cores are getting a ton of use

0:50:14because especially when you're just sitting there

0:50:16reading text on a webpage, there's probably,

0:50:18hopefully, unless you're running Chrome

0:50:19with a bunch of terrible tabs in the background,

0:50:21no need for the high efficiency cores to be enabled at all.

0:50:24And if you can just use the efficiency cores

0:50:26or one or two of the efficiency cores,

0:50:28it uses less power, yes, and that means less heat

0:50:30and that means less fan noise.

0:50:32Now, Eric is right that like the reason they're using this

0:50:35'cause like this is the architecture they have

0:50:37and you know, they're not gonna, you know,

0:50:40it's not, apparently, we now know the answer.

0:50:42Is it worth it for them to make for the low-end iMac

0:50:45an entirely different chip,

0:50:46even though the current M1 fits fine?

0:50:48No, not worth it to them.

0:50:49They could have made a chip without efficiency cores

0:50:52and with like six, you know,

0:50:54high performance cores or something, right?

0:50:56And that would be extra expense

0:50:57and maybe they'd get a little bit of benefit,

0:50:59but for the low-end iMac, it was not worth it.

0:51:01So yes, economies of scale,

0:51:03there are many different computers you can wrap around the M1

0:51:05and the iMac is one of them

0:51:06and it's perfectly fine for that.

0:51:07And as a bonus, less fan noise, less heat, less electricity.

0:51:11Probably less electricity is non-measurable,

0:51:14but I imagine the less heat and less fan noise

0:51:16is something that they could actually measure.

0:51:17So I'm glad that efficiency cores exist

0:51:20and I think there's a place for efficiency cores

0:51:22on every single one of their desktop computers,

0:51:24even the big giant Mac Pro that they eventually make

0:51:27with umpteen cores or whatever,

0:51:29it's okay to have some efficiency cores in there

0:51:30'cause sometimes the Mac Pro

0:51:31is not doing anything that big either.

0:51:33- And that brings us to another computer that has an M1

0:51:37and it's, as its core, and that is the iPad.

0:51:41And so there's some follow-up we need to talk about

0:51:43with regard to the iPad,

0:51:44starting with the front-facing camera.

0:51:45Tell me about that.

0:51:47- I think we missed this entirely in the event show.

0:51:49There was so much stuff,

0:51:50but Apple talked about center stage,

0:51:52which is their way to use the new 12 megapixel

0:51:55front-facing wide camera on the new iPads

0:51:59to take a very wide view of what's in front of them,

0:52:03but then crop it to show the area of interest

0:52:06when doing like video conference type things.

0:52:08And they showed it with like,

0:52:09with one person in the picture, it will center on them.

0:52:12And then when more people come, it will expand the image.

0:52:14Now the camera doesn't move.

0:52:16It's not like it's actually zooming optically.

0:52:18It's not pivoting from side to side.

0:52:20It is merely taking different crops

0:52:21and doing image processing, you know,

0:52:22using the software to do some smarts.

0:52:25And obviously the crops are gonna be lower resolution

0:52:26than the full 12 megapixels,

0:52:28but apparently there's enough pixels to go around

0:52:29to make this work, especially for like a FaceTime thing.

0:52:31So it looks like a very cool feature.

0:52:34And the other thing to know about it is that

0:52:36this feature is actually available

0:52:38to other people through an API.

0:52:40So if you have any kind of third-party app

0:52:42and you want to start taking video

0:52:43from the front-facing camera,

0:52:45apparently there's an API that you can just tell it,

0:52:47please do that center stage thing

0:52:48where you look for people's faces

0:52:49and try to include them,

0:52:50which is very nice of them to include.

0:52:52Although, honestly, I'm not sure what other apps

0:52:54people use for doing video conferencing on the iPad

0:52:57besides FaceTime and I guess Zoom maybe,

0:53:00but do people use Zoom on the iPad?

0:53:02I guess so.

0:53:02- Yeah.

0:53:03- Well, Declan spends several hours a day

0:53:05in Teams on the iPad.

0:53:07- In Teams, seriously?

0:53:08- Yep.

0:53:09- Oh my God, I didn't even think about that.

0:53:10Children shouldn't be subjected to Teams.

0:53:12- No, it is bad.

0:53:14It is real bad on the iPad.

0:53:16- I hope those apps do use those features though,

0:53:18because that is a problem,

0:53:19especially with an iPad where you're trying to like

0:53:21prop it up at the right angle

0:53:22and make sure you get everyone in the picture,

0:53:24like doing, well, mostly for me

0:53:26is doing family FaceTime calls,

0:53:27but I suppose for other things that are not family

0:53:29and maybe you're using Teams or what do you call it?

0:53:33WebEx or Zoom or whatever.

0:53:36So that's cool and worth mentioning.

0:53:39- Indeed.

0:53:39Hey John, how much RAM do you have in your iPad?

0:53:42- We noted this on the event show,

0:53:44but we didn't really emphasize, right?

0:53:46So yes, the iPad comes with two different amounts

0:53:49of RAM, but the most important thing is

0:53:51Apple lists those two different amounts of RAM

0:53:54on their web pages and in their promotional material

0:53:56for the first time, the amount of RAM in an iPad

0:53:59is not a secret that Apple won't tell you,

0:54:01even though everybody knows what it is.

0:54:03They actually use it in their advertising material.

0:54:05It's on their slides, up to 16 gigabytes of memory.

0:54:09We should all, if we were there live,

0:54:10we all should have gasped and said,

0:54:12the iPad has memory?

0:54:14I thought it just had storage all these years.

0:54:16If you've just been buying iPads based on storage,

0:54:17now you're gonna tell me there's memory?

0:54:20It's like when they change from iOS firmware,

0:54:22from iPhone firmware to iOS.

0:54:25It's like, the iPhone has an operating system?

0:54:27I thought it just had firmware.

0:54:29You know, a secret.

0:54:31So I like this.

0:54:32Obviously this is just in the pro models

0:54:33that I think they still don't talk about RAM

0:54:35on the lesser iPad models, but see Apple,

0:54:38nothing bad happens if you talk about RAM.

0:54:39We all know it's in there and we have to figure out

0:54:42what it is anyway eventually.

0:54:43It's just annoying that it's not on your product pages

0:54:45and now it finally is, at least for the pros.

0:54:48- So speaking of iPad pros,

0:54:50apparently the new 12.9 inch iPad pro,

0:54:54specifically the 12.9, won't work

0:54:56with the original $350 Magic Keyboard.

0:55:00So it's just a bit thicker than the last one was

0:55:03and because of that, officially speaking,

0:55:05it is not compatible with the Magic Keyboard

0:55:08that came out before this new one existed.

0:55:10However, if you were to buy a Magic Keyboard today,

0:55:13it is compatible with every iPad

0:55:15that has ever been compatible with the Magic Keyboard.

0:55:18- Yeah, that's a shame,

0:55:20but I still think they made the right move.

0:55:22Some people were saying, oh, didn't you know how thick

0:55:24the new 12.9 inch iPad would be

0:55:26when you made the original Magic Keyboard?

0:55:28I think it's conceivable that no, they didn't.

0:55:30Maybe they were shooting for, oh, it'll be the same width.

0:55:32But you know, we talked about the screen tech

0:55:34in this new 12.9 inch iPad with the, you know,

0:55:372,500 different zones and 10,000 LEDs.

0:55:41That screen is amazing and it's worth

0:55:42putting on the highest of the high-end iPad.

0:55:44And if they had to make it 0.5 millimeters thicker

0:55:48to pull that off at the cost of breaking compatibility

0:55:51with their very expensive Magic Keyboard,

0:55:52I still think that's the right move

0:55:54because this is the most expensive iPad

0:55:57with the highest end, you know,

0:55:59you can get it 16 gigs of RAM and two terabytes of storage

0:56:01and all that stuff.

0:56:03Obviously not ideal.

0:56:04I don't think Apple planned this.

0:56:05I think they probably tried to make it

0:56:07exactly the same size and they just couldn't quite get it.

0:56:10And if the choice was between this screen

0:56:12and being compatible with the Magic Keyboard,

0:56:15they'd take the screen any day.

0:56:16So it's a bummer, but I think the right move.

0:56:19- Yeah, I mean, honestly, I'm surprised and happy

0:56:23that they haven't changed the keyboard size

0:56:26for the 11 inch.

0:56:27I mean, this is like, this is the longest they've ever gone.

0:56:30If you're an 11 inch customer,

0:56:31this is the longest you've ever been able

0:56:32to carry any peripherals forward.

0:56:35You know, like normally, if you were buying a new iPad Pro,

0:56:39or you would have to buy a new keyboard,

0:56:42possibly even a new pencil depending on when you bought it,

0:56:44if you use the pencil or not.

0:56:46And those things are so expensive.

0:56:48They add up pretty quickly.

0:56:50So this is actually a nice, you know, constant period here

0:56:55where like, if I bought a new iPad,

0:56:57which honestly I'm not going to,

0:56:58but if I bought a new iPad,

0:56:59I would still be able to use my same keyboard

0:57:01from two years ago.

0:57:03- Yeah, and people who are second guessing this,

0:57:05like it was helpful to think about the other scenarios

0:57:07that could have happened,

0:57:08just let's say they're targeting

0:57:09to make it exactly the same width.

0:57:10And they build one and they say,

0:57:12here it is with the new screen and the, you know,

0:57:15the new guts and it's exactly the same dimensions

0:57:17as the old one.

0:57:18And they have some kind of problem.

0:57:19Oh, it's like overheating in this area,

0:57:22or this thing is very close to shorting out,

0:57:24or there's some other problem.

0:57:25And they say, well, you know,

0:57:26the only way we can solve this is to make the thing

0:57:29half a millimeter thicker

0:57:30to give a little bit more breathing room.

0:57:31And everyone's like, oh,

0:57:32that's going to break compatibility with the thing.

0:57:34You would much rather have them make the thing thicker

0:57:37than to say, well, let's just shove it in there

0:57:39and just hope for the best

0:57:40because whatever the problem may be with overheating

0:57:42or shorting or compressing or bulging

0:57:45or causing discoloration on the screen because of stress,

0:57:47you don't want any of those problems.

0:57:49And if that was the reality and they said,

0:57:51well, they did that because if they didn't do that,

0:57:52the keyboard wouldn't work,

0:57:53you'd be saying what a ridiculous notion,

0:57:55who cares that the keyboard works?

0:57:56I don't, I just want my iPad to work.

0:57:58I don't even have that keyboard.

0:57:59This is absolutely the right move.

0:58:01It's a bummer, but sometimes that happens

0:58:02when you're pushing the envelope,

0:58:04which I feel like Apple is with this,

0:58:06with this don't call it a tablet iPad

0:58:09that is just tremendously fast

0:58:11and has an amazing screen on it.

0:58:12- Indeed.

0:58:13Last week, we were talking about potential uses for AirTags,

0:58:17which actually speaking of, before we get to this followup,

0:58:20Marco, did you order any AirTags?

0:58:22- You can order them?

0:58:23- Yeah.

0:58:24- Oh, yes, that's right.

0:58:25I did.

0:58:26- Wow. - Sorry.

0:58:27- Are you feeling well, bud?

0:58:28- Beaver's setting in.

0:58:29- Little warm.

0:58:30No, I forgot.

0:58:34Yes, I did order a four-pack.

0:58:37It's coming on whatever day one is,

0:58:38which I think is, is it this Friday?

0:58:40- It's either this or next, I think.

0:58:41I don't recall, to be honest with you.

0:58:43So the reason--

0:58:43- Yeah, so I'll have it next Monday.

0:58:45(laughing)

0:58:46- The reason I don't recall is because I ordered a one-pack,

0:58:48which at the time was delivering in like mid-May,

0:58:51and I thought about getting a four-pack,

0:58:52but I don't even know what I'm using one for,

0:58:54so it seems silly to buy four just on a lark,

0:58:58but I did order one, and it'll be here

0:59:01several weeks after your four-pack is.

0:59:03John, what about you?

0:59:04What did you order, if any?

0:59:05- Didn't order any, 'cause I still can't think of

0:59:07what I'm gonna use it for, you know.

0:59:10So I'll listen to your reports

0:59:12and what it's like to have a little plastic puck.

0:59:14- It is kind of, you know, I would've been very surprised

0:59:17if you would've told me before the Apple event

0:59:20that the only things I would buy as a result

0:59:22of this Apple event were AirTags and a new Apple TV remote.

0:59:25But that's honestly, like, that's what I'm in.

0:59:29I'm in this for those things.

0:59:30- Yeah, yeah, that's a fair point.

0:59:32So anyway, so we were asking, you know,

0:59:34what would we use these for?

0:59:35And something that I had thought of,

0:59:37but I didn't say on the show,

0:59:38this was not Marco's fault this time,

0:59:40I definitely did not say it out loud.

0:59:42And this was also provided to us by Jameson on Twitter.

0:59:45A use case for AirTags, watching your luggage

0:59:48work its way back to you at the carousel at the airport.

0:59:51Now, I vaguely remember where airports are,

0:59:53and I vaguely remember what luggage is, but nevertheless,

0:59:56that is a very good use case for it.

0:59:57Another thing that a few people have suggested,

0:59:58including just now in the chat,

1:00:00is placing it in or around a favorite stuffed animal

1:00:04from a child, because if you're a parent,

1:00:06you know, especially when they're young,

1:00:08they have that special stuffed animal

1:00:10that if they lose that stuffed animal,

1:00:13oh, your next week, two months is going to be terrible.

1:00:17So a lot of people are saying they're thinking

1:00:20about sewing one in the animal or putting it

1:00:22around the animal or whatever the case may be.

1:00:24And again, I'm talking about a stuffed animal.

1:00:25- If you put it inside the animal, though,

1:00:26your kids will just tear it open and pull out the stuffing

1:00:29and get that thing out and then just destroy it.

1:00:30- Probably, probably, but nevertheless,

1:00:32that's another idea.

1:00:33- If your kids are dogs.

1:00:34- I would say also, like, on the following your luggage

1:00:37through the airport thing, I'm not, we don't know yet

1:00:41how frequently the location is updated

1:00:43and what kind of range they have in practice yet.

1:00:46I would wait, if that's the kind of use case

1:00:48you have in mind, I would maybe wait and see

1:00:52how these things actually perform in reality.

1:00:54- I mean, I'm assuming people are expecting that

1:00:55to be in U1 range by that point, like,

1:00:57you're not looking to say, like,

1:01:00which baggage carousel is it?

1:01:01You just wanted to know, like,

1:01:03is it coming off the thing now or whatever?

1:01:05Again, yeah, you're right, someone would have to test it,

1:01:07but I'm guessing that this use case is only useful

1:01:10when you're within U1 range, and I don't know

1:01:12what U1 range is, but certainly it's less than

1:01:15the passerby had Bluetooth on range.

1:01:18- Yeah, I would expect it to be something like 30 feet,

1:01:20you know, because it's Bluetooth-based and, yeah, so,

1:01:23I'm guessing it's something like that,

1:01:24but I wouldn't expect it to be, like--

1:01:26- And you don't need this for Boston's Logan Airport,

1:01:30you don't need this AirTek thing at all,

1:01:31because I can just tell you, just get a chair,

1:01:33your luggage is not coming out for an hour.

1:01:35(laughing)

1:01:38- Well, that's what you get for living in Boston.

1:01:39Hey-o, all right, moving right along.

1:01:41Something that I think all of us knew, but again,

1:01:43did not say actually on the show is one of the problems

1:01:47with Apple's premium podcast offering is

1:01:50what if you don't have an iPhone?

1:01:51Tough nuggies?

1:01:52- Yeah, we were talking about who are you excluding

1:01:54by using this Apple premium podcast,

1:01:57and we talked mostly about, hey, if any of your listeners

1:02:00don't use the Apple podcast app,

1:02:01they have to start using it,

1:02:02because that's the only way to listen to your show

1:02:04if it's an Apple premium podcast.

1:02:07But many people were going to say, and yeah,

1:02:09what about all the people who don't even have iPhones?

1:02:12Of course they can't use Apple podcasts,

1:02:14and they can't listen to your show at all,

1:02:15and there's tons of those people.

1:02:17One of the reasons I didn't mention this,

1:02:18it was something that I should have mentioned

1:02:20when we talked about the premium podcast is,

1:02:22I'm basing this on nothing, but my impression and hunch is

1:02:27that Apple is at least considering the notion

1:02:32of making Apple premium podcasts available on Android.

1:02:36I know this seems weird to you, but I mean,

1:02:39I just assumed that they would eventually make it available

1:02:41on Android, and then I saw everyone else thinking

1:02:43that they never would.

1:02:45It just seems like Apple music,

1:02:46like an audio service type thing.

1:02:51I know Apple doesn't do a lot of things on other platforms.

1:02:53They made Safari for Windows and then gave up on it

1:02:55or whatever, but Apple premium podcast for Android

1:02:59does not seem like a ridiculous thing to me.

1:03:00Now obviously they don't have that now,

1:03:02so don't assume it is going to exist,

1:03:05but I don't know if you two feel the same way.

1:03:06It just seems to me that it's not such a ridiculous notion.

1:03:10- No, I don't think it's a ridiculous notion.

1:03:12It would take a lot of motivation though.

1:03:15The reason why Apple brought Apple Music to Android,

1:03:18they did, right?

1:03:19That's something they actually did?

1:03:20- Yep, I believe so.

1:03:22- We've never talked about it after they did it,

1:03:24so I kind of forgot.

1:03:25- I mean, it's like Safari on Windows.

1:03:27When it went away, it probably took a while for me

1:03:28to realize it went away because we use Safari on Windows.

1:03:31- Right, so I don't know how well Apple Music on Android

1:03:34would be doing, but the reason they did that

1:03:37is because Apple Music is a massive service

1:03:40that brings in significant revenue

1:03:42into their services division and everything.

1:03:44Premium podcasts, I don't think, I mean, I could be wrong,

1:03:49but the way they've launched at least,

1:03:50their version of premium podcasts,

1:03:52I don't see that becoming anywhere near the size

1:03:55of Apple Music as a business.

1:03:57And therefore, I think there would be a lot less

1:04:00financial motivation for them to invest

1:04:02into the engineering of that.

1:04:04The Apple Music, or the Apple Podcasts app

1:04:07is not just a big web view.

1:04:09It's a whole bunch of native code in there.

1:04:11And so it would be substantial work for them

1:04:14to bring over that app as its own thing.

1:04:17So I just, I don't see it happening, honestly.

1:04:21- I mean, it really, it kind of depends

1:04:23a little bit on the competitive landscape.

1:04:24Not that, we're probably not gonna have time

1:04:25to talk about it this episode,

1:04:26but Spotify's new premium podcast move

1:04:30is an interesting counter to what Apple has done

1:04:32and is different in all sorts of ways.

1:04:33And you're right, it's mostly small potatoes,

1:04:35and the safe bet is that they're not gonna do it,

1:04:37but they might eventually see it as a strategic thing

1:04:40that they have to do just to keep Spotify at bay.

1:04:42It also depends on how all of the antitrust stuff

1:04:44related to Spotify and other stuff turns out.

1:04:47So all I'm saying is that this is right,

1:04:50that you are excluding people who have Android,

1:04:52but that I don't think it's completely ridiculous

1:04:56that Apple might someday put their premium podcast

1:04:59on Android.

1:05:00- Yeah, I mean, I think it depends a lot on like,

1:05:02how well is Apple Music doing on Android?

1:05:05(laughs)

1:05:06I've never heard of anybody using it.

1:05:08I'm sure there are some people who do,

1:05:10but I would bet it's not a substantial market for them.

1:05:13- I mean, and I think one of the big reasons

1:05:15that Apple Music exists on Android is, interestingly,

1:05:18as a counter to Spotify, not in the podcast space,

1:05:20obviously, just in the plain old music space.

1:05:22And I think you're probably right

1:05:23that it's maybe not doing that well on Android.

1:05:26But like, why does it exist at all?

1:05:27You said it's because Apple Music is a big business.

1:05:29I think a big part of it is also

1:05:31because Spotify is there,

1:05:33and if we're gonna compete with Spotify,

1:05:34kind of like the Apple TV thing,

1:05:35if we're gonna compete at all,

1:05:37we can't be stingy and say,

1:05:39"Oh, it's only on Apple platforms."

1:05:40It's like, if you're gonna be some kind of service

1:05:43type thing, you've gotta be everywhere.

1:05:44- Yeah, maybe, and part of it also,

1:05:45it might just be as simple as,

1:05:47like Apple Music was born out of Beats Music,

1:05:49and Beats Music was available on Android,

1:05:51so maybe they had an easier path to get there.

1:05:54Maybe they didn't have to build as much

1:05:55as we think they had to build from scratch for that.

1:05:57- They should give Android the old podcast app

1:05:59with the reel-to-reel tape.

1:06:00- Yeah, that'd be great!

1:06:02Yeah, from iOS 5.

1:06:03- Oh man, that would be funny.

1:06:06All right, John, do you wanna tell me

1:06:08about your Eero and smart outlet situation, please?

1:06:11- This is so long ago, I don't know

1:06:12if people still remember.

1:06:13I did a whole big RecDefs episode about it,

1:06:15so I'm not gonna go into too much detail,

1:06:16but to catch everyone up, I had filled around

1:06:20with my network and made my Eero my router

1:06:22and got rid of an airport extreme,

1:06:24and everything worked except for my smart outlet,

1:06:26which was completely invisible,

1:06:27and I was trying to debug it,

1:06:28I couldn't figure what the deal was.

1:06:30Here's what eventually worked.

1:06:32Why did it work?

1:06:34Unknown, but here's what eventually worked.

1:06:36It was a suggestion I got from two different places.

1:06:38Merlin suggested that I do this,

1:06:39and I didn't follow his suggestion,

1:06:42and then I got the same suggestion

1:06:44from a person at the smart outlet company,

1:06:47and the reason I did it when the person

1:06:48in the smart outlet company said it was not because,

1:06:51like, oh, I trust that person more than Merlin,

1:06:52but it was simply because I needed

1:06:53to respond to their email,

1:06:55and when I respond to any kind of email

1:06:57where people give debugging suggestions,

1:06:58I have to tell them, I tried your suggestions

1:07:00and here were the results, like truthfully,

1:07:03and one of their suggestions was hardware reset the outlet,

1:07:07which I had done many, many times before,

1:07:09but I had not, you know, this is two different ways

1:07:12to reset, it's like a soft reset and a factory reset,

1:07:14depending on how long you hold down

1:07:15the little buttons or whatever,

1:07:17I had not factory reset the new outlet,

1:07:20the new one that I bought that just came out of the box,

1:07:23and you may be thinking, why would you need

1:07:25to factory reset an outlet that you just brand new

1:07:28took out of a box that's never been on your network,

1:07:31like that's never even been seen by anything

1:07:33on your network that is invisible,

1:07:34like, you know, I haven't even been able

1:07:36to attempt to connect it, because every time I do it,

1:07:38it says, looking for devices, can't find anything, right?

1:07:41But that's what I did, I factory reset the new outlet,

1:07:45and it just joined right up and worked perfectly.

1:07:47(laughing)

1:07:48- Oh my goodness.

1:07:49- Now, here are the theories we've got behind this.

1:07:51One theory is that there is, apparently for this brand

1:07:55of smart outlet, there is a server-side component

1:07:58associated with your account, 'cause I think you have

1:08:01to sign into your account to use their iOS app,

1:08:04and the person at the smart outlet company says

1:08:06that we deleted all your data on our server side.

1:08:08- Oh.

1:08:09- Yeah, we've all, like, maybe that was a factor, right?

1:08:12The second thing is, and this is something I didn't know,

1:08:14and I just don't know the details of it,

1:08:15that apparently home kit devices can only be

1:08:19in provisioning mode, like where they're ready

1:08:22to be added to your network or whatever,

1:08:24for a limited amount of time, and I think it's like

1:08:27a security thing, like you don't want to allow them

1:08:29to be in provisioning mode indefinitely,

1:08:30'cause you could like put something in provisioning mode

1:08:33and like your neighbors accidentally pick it up

1:08:35a week after you tried to connect it,

1:08:36and they connect it to their thing, right?

1:08:38So there's some kind of time limit as part

1:08:39of the home kit spec, if you want to be

1:08:41a home kit compliant device, you can only be

1:08:43in provisioning mode for a limited amount of time,

1:08:46after which you need to do some kind of reset

1:08:48to get them out of that, and maybe this particular

1:08:50smart outlet needs a factory reset after it has reached

1:08:53its provisioning mode time limit, and I can tell you

1:08:54that if there is a time limit, I'm surely past it,

1:08:56because I've been trying to add these things to my network

1:08:59for, you know, days and days, just constantly having them

1:09:02and like ready to be added to your network,

1:09:03make sure this light is blinking, right?

1:09:05So those are the theories.

1:09:06Server side, or it was stuck in provisioning mode

1:09:09too long and timed out, but whatever it is,

1:09:11a factory reset of the brand new thing made it work,

1:09:13and now I have the old one, which I have no use for,

1:09:16it's just sitting here, I'm not sure what I'm gonna do

1:09:18with it, I haven't even tried to connect it,

1:09:19but now I'm just not touching anything,

1:09:20because my network, everything's on my network,

1:09:23just like I want it to be, I haven't had any

1:09:25of that Teams problem in all my Teams meeting at work,

1:09:28I have yet to, you know, have the problem recur,

1:09:30although it hasn't been a month yet, but so far so good,

1:09:33my networking house is in order.

1:09:35(laughing)

1:09:37- That's good, I'm very glad for you.

1:09:38- Don't touch it.

1:09:39- Yeah, definitely don't touch it.

1:09:41I'd actually like to make a brief request for help.

1:09:45I, in the process of doing this screened in porch,

1:09:48selected, I don't remember talking about this on the show,

1:09:50but I selected two not cheap ceiling fans

1:09:53in order to put in the screened in porch,

1:09:55and there was a little bit of a disagreement

1:09:59as to whether or not these not cheap ceiling fans

1:10:01were worth the money that we spent,

1:10:02and one of the things I wanted to do

1:10:04with these ceiling fans was use them

1:10:06with Lutron Caseta switches,

1:10:08and I thought I was buying the appropriate kind of fan

1:10:11in order to use them with Lutron Caseta switches,

1:10:13and it turns out I did not,

1:10:14and many, many hours of investigation

1:10:17and fiddling about later,

1:10:19what I've realized is these particular fans

1:10:21use some sort of proprietary radio frequency controller,

1:10:24so there is something in the wall,

1:10:26and it is connected to the fan,

1:10:29but the actual commands to go on or off

1:10:31for different speeds or whatever are radio frequency,

1:10:33and what I'd like to do is figure out a way

1:10:34to get that on HomeKit.

1:10:35These fans are Kickler fans, K-I-C-H-L-E-R.

1:10:39Kickler doesn't seem to believe that HomeKit exists

1:10:42or even Alexa or anything like it,

1:10:44so if you have a way that you are aware of

1:10:48that you can make a RF device talk HomeKit,

1:10:52please let me know, Casey lists on Twitter,

1:10:53or you can find my contact information on my website.

1:10:56I'd love to know, 'cause I've been looking

1:10:57at this broad link RM4 IR and RF universal remote,

1:11:02which I guess is basically it's supposed to just emit IR

1:11:06or RF in order to control things

1:11:09that really you're not supposed to be able to control,

1:11:11and I'm looking at this, but I don't know

1:11:13if it's gonna work with the appropriate frequencies,

1:11:14blah, blah, blah, so I will stop here,

1:11:16but just if you've experienced anything like this,

1:11:18please let me know.

1:11:19I would love to know about it.

1:11:20Our, I think, final bit of follow-up?

1:11:22No, yeah, our final section of follow-up

1:11:24is with regard to Marco's refusal to believe

1:11:27that there's anything other than Tesla Superchargers

1:11:29in the world, and friend of the show,

1:11:32Sam, well-submitted of the Wheel Bearings podcast,

1:11:34wrote in to say that Tesla accounted

1:11:36for about two-thirds of EV sales in the US in the last year,

1:11:40but according to Sam, whose job is to know

1:11:42these sorts of things, that share is likely

1:11:44to shrink significantly in 2021 and beyond.

1:11:46There's lots of new competitors arriving this year next

1:11:49from all the legacy brands.

1:11:50And then moving on, Sam writes,

1:11:54for distribution, there are currently 3,440 CCS,

1:11:58which I believe is the connector type,

1:11:59DC fast charger locations with 6,534 actual outlets,

1:12:04so about 3,500 locations with about 6,500 outlets

1:12:09across the United States.

1:12:10There are 1,000 Supercharger locations,

1:12:13so about a third as many locations,

1:12:15however, they have about 10,000 outlets,

1:12:18so about twice as many outlets.

1:12:20So Tesla has fewer locations,

1:12:22but more chargers per station.

1:12:24Something I don't think we've mentioned on the show

1:12:26is that Electrify America was done in part

1:12:30because Volkswagen was compelled to fund it

1:12:32as a result of Dieselgate.

1:12:35And Electrify America was the first network

1:12:37to implement the plug-in charge standard,

1:12:39which allows drivers to set up one account

1:12:40for their compatible vehicles.

1:12:42So Ford, Volkswagen, Mercedes, Lewis, and Rivian

1:12:45have all announced support and more coming,

1:12:46and then they let you just plug it in,

1:12:48and then it authenticates and starts charging,

1:12:49just like a Supercharger.

1:12:50And we'll put a link in the show notes

1:12:51to a list of all the chargers and networks

1:12:54and whatnot at the Department of Energy website

1:12:58for the United States.

1:13:00Do you wanna jump in here, Marco,

1:13:01'cause I know you have some feedback

1:13:02or you wanna plow forward?

1:13:03- Yeah, just a quick little thing on this point.

1:13:05So my car is still in the body shop, still,

1:13:10and they haven't even been able to start to work on it

1:13:13because insurance companies are apparently terrible.

1:13:17But-- - Neat.

1:13:18- So it's been almost a month,

1:13:19and they haven't actually started working on it yet

1:13:21because of my insurance company, so that's okay.

1:13:23I mean, I guess it was my fault for going with the

1:13:26totally fly-by-night insurance company Allstate.

1:13:29- Ah, I also use Allstate, and they are--

1:13:30- But you don't get to be a big insurance company

1:13:32by just giving out money for free.

1:13:35Insurance company does not wanna pay a lot for the Smuffler.

1:13:38- Yeah, nice.

1:13:39- Anyway, so we're still driving around the i3,

1:13:44and we had an opportunity to stop and supercharge,

1:13:48and I specifically sought out an Electrify America location

1:13:53'cause there was one kinda near where we were going.

1:13:55And so we were down to about 30-something percent on the i3.

1:14:00We stopped off.

1:14:02It looked almost like a supercharger.

1:14:04They had these big, glowing white bays across the back

1:14:08of this mall parking lot.

1:14:09There were eight plugs in this location,

1:14:12so it looked pretty nice,

1:14:14and it was a pretty good experience.

1:14:17It was significantly nicer than the ChargePoint one

1:14:21that I'd used before.

1:14:22And it was super easy.

1:14:25I walked up to the thing, and I plugged it into the car,

1:14:28and they had a little credit card contactless/chip reader

1:14:32on the front, so I just did Apple Pay on the front of it.

1:14:34I didn't have to make an account.

1:14:35I didn't have to do anything.

1:14:36All I had to do was Apple Pay with my credit card,

1:14:39Apple Pay with my phone, rather,

1:14:41wave it in front of their little reader,

1:14:43beep, it started up, and then I was able to watch

1:14:47both in my car and also on their screen.

1:14:49They had a giant, glowing screen

1:14:50to show my car's charge level.

1:14:52I guess the car communicates its charge level

1:14:54back through the CCS connector to the charger.

1:14:57So it was able to give me a time estimate.

1:15:00It was able to give me a percentage readout and everything.

1:15:03It allowed you to type in a phone number,

1:15:05and it would text you updates.

1:15:06That way, like, if you wanted to leave

1:15:08and go inside the mall or whatever,

1:15:10you could do that and see when it's done.

1:15:12And overall, it cost me about 10 bucks to charge

1:15:15from something like 30% to about 90%.

1:15:21I mean, this is not a large-range car.

1:15:22That's something like 100 miles of range.

1:15:26But it was about a half hour.

1:15:29Really not bad at all.

1:15:31It was a surprisingly nice

1:15:33supercharger competitive experience.

1:15:38And if every DC fast charger was as nice

1:15:42as the Electrify America ones,

1:15:44then I think that would be a really nice world to get to.

1:15:47I don't think we're there yet,

1:15:48and I think it's gonna be a while before we get there.

1:15:50But when and if that kind of world arrives

1:15:54for the non-Tesla charging needs,

1:15:57that will be very nice and very compelling.

1:15:59So I really enjoyed it.

1:16:00It was very nice to use,

1:16:02and I would gladly use it again.

1:16:04However, again, when I look for things like this

1:16:07in the areas I travel,

1:16:09the Tesla superchargers are still,

1:16:11they're still better coverage of the areas I go,

1:16:15and they're in more convenient locations.

1:16:19Kind of an underappreciated part

1:16:21of charger location selection is,

1:16:24well, what can you do during the half hour

1:16:26that you're waiting there?

1:16:27If it's in a travel plaza or something,

1:16:29like off the highway, that's great.

1:16:30Because then you can park your car,

1:16:33and the thing is, you're only gonna be charging there

1:16:35for maybe a half hour to 40 minutes.

1:16:38You can't do something that's gonna take you two hours.

1:16:40You can't watch a movie or anything in a movie theater.

1:16:43But you also don't want it to just be

1:16:45in the back of an empty parking lot

1:16:48where there's nowhere even within walking distance

1:16:50that you could really meaningfully go.

1:16:53So you want something to do,

1:16:55and I like the travel plaza kind of situation

1:16:57because then you can go in, use the bathroom,

1:17:00order food, have a quick snack,

1:17:03get a crappy coffee at Starbucks,

1:17:05go out to your car, and it's pretty much time.

1:17:07Tesla seems to be significantly better,

1:17:10at least with the more recent round of superchargers,

1:17:13significantly better at choosing good locations

1:17:16that actually give you some reasonable way

1:17:18to use your 40 minutes that you're gonna have

1:17:20while sitting there.

1:17:21So that's one thing that so far

1:17:24the non-Tesla fast chargers around here

1:17:27are not super great at.

1:17:30But I mean, that could just be a regional difference.

1:17:31But anyway, it's something to look at.

1:17:33Like when you're comparing,

1:17:34if you're looking at electric cars,

1:17:35if you're comparing the charging networks,

1:17:37you definitely have to, I think,

1:17:39look at which ones you're likely to use

1:17:41and where they actually are,

1:17:43what kind of environment they're actually in.

1:17:45'Cause that matters a lot.

1:17:47- Like Sam said, though, this is changing rapidly

1:17:49because all the EVs from all the car companies

1:17:52are coming out pretty fast and furious now.

1:17:54And most of them, granted, are not actual cars,

1:17:56they're stupid SUV things, but there's a ton of them.

1:17:59And Electrify America and all the other sort of

1:18:02car brand charging networks

1:18:03are just going to be expanding extremely rapidly.

1:18:06And it's not just one company doing it,

1:18:08it's multiple companies doing it.

1:18:09So I expect this to be a very dynamic situation.

1:18:11In fact, I was surprised to see

1:18:12there was three times as many CCS DC fast chargers,

1:18:16'cause this is trying to compare like to like

1:18:17and not just say like any old thing,

1:18:19but the DC fast chargers.

1:18:21And I'm also surprised to see that a bunch of car brands,

1:18:24we talked about this one,

1:18:25let me get the pronunciation right 'cause I saw a video.

1:18:27Tycon.

1:18:30(laughing)

1:18:31- Nice, nice.

1:18:31- They have two syllables in their word

1:18:33and neither one of them is pronounced the way

1:18:34that an English speaker would expect them to say.

1:18:35But Porsche has a YouTube video that says,

1:18:37Ty like a necktie and then Con like the opposite of Pro.

1:18:41Tycon, which has this 800 volt system

1:18:44that allows it to charge faster and stuff.

1:18:46I recently saw a review of the new Hyundai IONIQ 5,

1:18:51which is another SUV type thing or whatever.

1:18:55I think it has an 800 volt system too.

1:18:58And it's not a fancy car.

1:19:00Like it's competing with like,

1:19:02it's competing with the mainstream SUVs, right?

1:19:05It's more expensive than a gas SUV,

1:19:07but still it's not $100,000 car.

1:19:09And those 800 volt systems can charge a lot faster.

1:19:13So the amount of time that you spend at the chargers

1:19:15may actually be decreasing,

1:19:17assuming we can get these 800 volt,

1:19:19like whatever it is, 250 kilowatt or whatever.

1:19:22I get confused with battery specs for laptops.

1:19:25If those start to proliferate.

1:19:27And the other thing I'll say about your charging experience

1:19:29is your car doesn't even have the plug and charge thing

1:19:31that we were talking about here,

1:19:32which is just like, you don't have to do any of that stuff.

1:19:34You just plug the thing in.

1:19:35I mean, that's what this feedback says

1:19:37is that you just plug it in

1:19:38and somehow it knows who you are

1:19:39based on the fact that you plug the car into it.

1:19:41Because you had set up an account

1:19:42with Electrify America beforehand.

1:19:44And that's the best experience

1:19:45because when you fill up your car with gas,

1:19:47I mean, I guess you have to pay with your phone or whatever,

1:19:50but like just be able to pull up to one of those things,

1:19:52take the plug out, shove it into your car and walk away

1:19:54and get all those features that you described

1:19:56without even having to activate Apple Pay or tap it.

1:19:59That's pretty cool.

1:20:00Although I do wonder,

1:20:01like I've been watching a lot of videos about electric cars

1:20:04'cause there are so many of them coming out.

1:20:05Most of them don't appeal to me at all,

1:20:06but a lot of them have,

1:20:08I mean, I guess we'll get to this in the next feedback.

1:20:10Interesting integrations

1:20:11with their various power supply things.

1:20:15Like, you know, their sort of charging network,

1:20:18integrations in the car, integrations outside the car,

1:20:21like you said, the thing where it texts you

1:20:22to see how filled up your thing is or whatever.

1:20:24So I wonder if those features

1:20:26will end up being differentiators

1:20:28or if we will kind of settle on one feature set,

1:20:31kind of like gas pumps.

1:20:32There's a million gas companies around here,

1:20:33but the feature set of gas pumps in the US

1:20:36has always kind of like coalesced

1:20:38around a standard feature set.

1:20:40If there was any moment where like, you know,

1:20:42mobile speed pass came out and for a little while,

1:20:44they didn't want to have it.

1:20:45Eventually, stuff like that spreads everywhere.

1:20:47So it'll be interesting to see that play out

1:20:48with electric charging stations as well.

1:20:51- And speaking of very expensive cars,

1:20:53a friend of the show, Dave Nenian writes,

1:20:54"With regard to charging station integrations,

1:20:57"you know, each car vendor either owns a charging network

1:20:59"or partners with one,

1:21:00"and at least with Volkswagen, Audi, and Porsche,

1:21:03"the charger location, routing, availability, et cetera,

1:21:05"is fully integrated into the nav system."

1:21:07I'm assuming much like Tesla.

1:21:09In the, hold on, let me see if I can do this.

1:21:10In the Taycan, and I'm sure this is true of others,

1:21:14writes Dave Nenian, "If I plan a trip,

1:21:16"it automatically routes me through chargers,

1:21:18"not just in network ones,

1:21:20"and it tells me how long to charge for

1:21:21"and adjust during the trip if conditions change.

1:21:23"It's just like the Tesla, basically,

1:21:24"except the DC fast chargers, while fewer in number,

1:21:27"can go up to 350 kilowatts,

1:21:29"and I can charge from five to 80% in 22 minutes."

1:21:32Dave admits that that's sometimes in a Walmart parking lot,

1:21:35which is kind of crummy, but nevertheless,

1:21:37it's fast, which is great.

1:21:39- Another cool thing about the 800 watt system

1:21:41and the new Hyundai, one of the features they're advertising

1:21:43is you can use it to charge another electric car.

1:21:46(laughing)

1:21:47So you can drive over to them and just plug your thing,

1:21:49like if they run out of charge somewhere,

1:21:51you can go there and charge them up on it.

1:21:54- That's interesting.

1:21:55That would actually be really nice for

1:21:57like a towing company to have some of those in their fleet.

1:22:01So if you have an EV that gets totally dead

1:22:04and is stranded on the side of the road,

1:22:05you could drive this to them.

1:22:06- 'Cause you can't bring a gas can.

1:22:08- Right, yeah, exactly.

1:22:10That actually is a really good feature.

1:22:11- Yeah, and what you can do then is

1:22:13if you take a car back from that car

1:22:15and put it into your car, you can drive forever.

1:22:17- Right, exactly.

1:22:17- Yeah, that's how it works.

1:22:19- You just have a loop.

1:22:20- Right.

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1:24:34(upbeat music)

1:24:37- All right, let's do some Ask ATP.

1:24:39Brian Ash writes, "This one is for Jon.

1:24:41"If Apple were to announce a new mini Mac Pro

1:24:43"in April or May, can you imagine a configuration

1:24:46"that would make you switch away

1:24:47"from your Intel Mac Pro this soon?

1:24:49"How much performance would you need

1:24:51"and at what price would that need to be to make the jump?"

1:24:54- I've actually talked about this before,

1:24:56but it's worth revisiting now that we know more

1:24:57about the ARM Macs.

1:24:59I am totally open to a smaller version of the Mac Pro.

1:25:03Like all I want is some internal storage and a big GPU

1:25:07and that's what I've got in my current Mac Pro,

1:25:09but if you open it up,

1:25:09there's a lot of empty space in there, right?

1:25:12So if they make a miniature version,

1:25:13they can fit the stuff that I want

1:25:15and doesn't have room for all the stuff that I don't use,

1:25:17that's fine.

1:25:18Like this thing has so many slots in it.

1:25:19Like I have a second GPU in there that I'm not even using

1:25:22just because there are so many open slots

1:25:24that's the best place in the house to store it, right?

1:25:27So I, and I think maybe something will use it

1:25:31for compute someday, but like I do not need

1:25:33the massive amount of spaces in this thing,

1:25:35but I do actually enjoy the fact that I have, you know,

1:25:38a bunch of internal storage in there

1:25:40and my big double height video card and all that stuff.

1:25:42So we'll see, I'm totally open to a miniature one.

1:25:44And as for when I would upgrade, you know,

1:25:47I'm still assuming that the Mac Pro will be like,

1:25:50if not the very last,

1:25:51then at least one of the last machines to port over to ARM.

1:25:54So I've got a while yet to see

1:25:56what they're gonna come out with.

1:25:58And if the new ARM based Mac Pro equivalent

1:26:03comes out like by the end of this year,

1:26:04I don't think I'm gonna upgrade that soon.

1:26:06It's mostly a monetary issue

1:26:08because I'm not going to sell this one.

1:26:10Like, you know, I don't sell my Macs.

1:26:11I keep them, I keep the Macs that are meaningful to me.

1:26:13This is, this Mac is always going to be meaningful to me,

1:26:16but I don't need to use this thing for 10 years.

1:26:19Like, you know, we always knew the ARM transition was coming

1:26:21and I said, when I bought this,

1:26:22if it turns out that the ARM Macs come out

1:26:23right after I buy this, oh, well,

1:26:25I've gotta be okay with that.

1:26:26And look what happened.

1:26:27Here it is, and I'm more or less okay with it.

1:26:29I'll use this Mac until I've saved up

1:26:32enough discretionary income to replace it

1:26:34or until it becomes so obsolete that I have to replace it.

1:26:37So maybe not the end of this year,

1:26:39but you know, in two, three years, yeah,

1:26:41I'll be ready to replace it.

1:26:43- Fair enough.

1:26:45All right, Lingxiu Zhang writes,

1:26:46do you use FileVault on your personal Macs,

1:26:48and if so, why?

1:26:49I just got a new M1 MacBook Air

1:26:51and came across the setting during setup,

1:26:53which was on by default.

1:26:54I'm hesitant to turn it on because of the possible

1:26:56computational overload, but is that even still relevant?

1:26:59You know, I honestly don't even know if I'm using FileVault.

1:27:02I think I am on my laptop.

1:27:04Where is that?

1:27:05Is that in security and privacy?

1:27:06- I think you've hit on the main thing

1:27:08that I was gonna say, which is most people don't even know

1:27:11whether they're using FileVault,

1:27:12which really speaks to how transparent it is,

1:27:15both from a user's perspective

1:27:17and I think also from a computational perspective.

1:27:19There is computational overhead to it,

1:27:21and I think it can still actually be measured,

1:27:23although that might be harder with the ARM Macs

1:27:25because all the decompression stuff

1:27:28probably has some dedicated hardware units

1:27:30somewhere inside there.

1:27:31- Well, the T2 did accelerate that.

1:27:33In the last generation of Intel Macs, they used the T2.

1:27:36The T2 did that, which made the computational overhead part

1:27:40basically free.

1:27:41- Free, like at the cost of some additional power

1:27:43than your battery, you know, whatever.

1:27:44But yeah, it's the type of thing where,

1:27:48don't worry about the performance, is what we're saying.

1:27:51- Yeah, so it turns out I was looking,

1:27:53so in System Preferences, Security and Privacy,

1:27:56and then there's a tab for FileVault.

1:27:58Both of my computers are using it,

1:27:59and I would have expected that my MacBook Pro

1:28:02definitely was, and I wasn't sure about my iMac Pro,

1:28:05but yes, both of them are.

1:28:07And yeah, I don't think even having,

1:28:09I've used FileVault, especially on laptops, for years.

1:28:12I don't remember ever having noticed

1:28:14a computational difference.

1:28:15You know, I don't remember ever having noticed a slowdown.

1:28:19Even, there have been once or twice I've either turned it on

1:28:22after I've had the operating system installed and so on,

1:28:26or perhaps even turned it off.

1:28:27But yeah, I don't see any reason not to at this point,

1:28:31to be completely honest with you.

1:28:33- Margo, do you have it enabled on your Macs?

1:28:35Do you even know?

1:28:36- I didn't know.

1:28:38I thought I had it enabled.

1:28:39I just checked on my Mac Mini that I'm using now,

1:28:41and it's not on on the Mac Mini.

1:28:43I figure I probably shouldn't turn it on

1:28:46during the recording.

1:28:47- I would recommend not, Casey.

1:28:49(laughing)

1:28:50- But I, yeah, I'm pretty sure it's on my laptop.

1:28:53But yeah, I recommend leaving it on,

1:28:56because at this point, this day and age,

1:28:58the computational overhead of that,

1:29:00I don't think is relevant.

1:29:02- So my policy is I tend to put it on for laptops,

1:29:06just because they might be lost somewhere,

1:29:08and whatever modicum of security it is

1:29:10to have this stuff encrypted at rest,

1:29:12I will take that, right?

1:29:14On my desktops, I personally choose not to enable it,

1:29:18but it has nothing to do with performance,

1:29:20and everything to do with me being afraid

1:29:21of hosing myself somehow,

1:29:23by either forgetting the encryption password,

1:29:25or it's somehow getting corrupted in some way.

1:29:27I'm just paranoid in that way that I have enough problems.

1:29:31I'm always doing weird stuff with my computer,

1:29:32like trying to somehow get bootcamp installed

1:29:34and bootable on an external disk,

1:29:35which was a saga that I just reflected on this

1:29:38the other day, that I've long since forgotten

1:29:40what I did to make that happen,

1:29:41so if I ever had to do it again,

1:29:42I'd be starting from zero.

1:29:44But it was really hard, and it was scary,

1:29:46and it involved a lot of my machine

1:29:47being in a almost unbootable state,

1:29:50and that's before we even get to the ARM Macs,

1:29:52which are way harder to deal with booting

1:29:54and external booting, right?

1:29:55So the reason I don't enable it in my desktops

1:29:57is like, well, they're in my house,

1:29:59they're much less likely to be stolen or lost,

1:30:03and I'm kind of afraid that I'll accidentally

1:30:05lock myself out.

1:30:06Those are probably not good reasons.

1:30:08You should probably just enable encryption everywhere,

1:30:10but it seems like, based on Marco's experience,

1:30:12that Apple still doesn't default it to on

1:30:14for its desktop Macs, otherwise,

1:30:16if Marco doesn't remember explicitly choosing not to do it,

1:30:18it was probably just the default.

1:30:19I'm assuming it defaults to on all their laptops,

1:30:21but maybe not on their desktop, so.

1:30:23- I mean, this is also an installation

1:30:25that I brought forward from old desktops,

1:30:27so I just checked, my laptop does indeed have it on,

1:30:30and I'm kind of with you,

1:30:31like I tend to make my laptops more secure.

1:30:35Like, for instance, I always leave

1:30:38find my Mac on on my laptops,

1:30:41but I don't leave it on on my desktops,

1:30:43because remember back when Matt Honan was hacked

1:30:45and they used find my Mac to remote wipe all of his Macs?

1:30:49That scared me enough that like,

1:30:51I like the ability to remote wipe my laptop

1:30:54if it ever gets stolen,

1:30:55but I don't want anybody to have the ability

1:30:57to remote wipe my desktop.

1:30:59So, that's just one of those things,

1:31:00I always turn that off on the desktop.

1:31:03But yeah, FileVault is on on the laptop,

1:31:05and I leave all the high security stuff there.

1:31:07And I think I'll turn it on on my desktop too,

1:31:08'cause why not?

1:31:09- Yeah, I mean, like I said,

1:31:11I see no reason not to, to be completely honest.

1:31:13All right, and then finally from Johan Neubert,

1:31:16what do you think about the longevity of the M1?

1:31:18How long do you think they'll last?

1:31:20Usually buying a quote unquote first generation

1:31:22Mac computer can be bad in the long run.

1:31:25Do you think that they'll last as long as iPhones

1:31:27or even as long as John's old Mac Pro?

1:31:30I mean, I don't know, look at,

1:31:32I guess look at iPhones, right?

1:31:34Because this is, or iPads perhaps,

1:31:36especially early on, like in the iPhone 4 era,

1:31:39you were seeing dramatic speed increases

1:31:41with each new year's phone.

1:31:43But I feel like the last couple of phones I've gotten,

1:31:46they're snappier, sure,

1:31:48but I wouldn't say it's a dramatic increase

1:31:50like it was in years past.

1:31:51So I would expect it's probably a three to four

1:31:55to five year chip without feeling too terrible about it.

1:31:58I mean, and also look at the iMac Pro,

1:32:00or excuse me, my iPad Pro from 2018.

1:32:03I don't feel like I'm CPU bound

1:32:06or CPU limited very often on that thing.

1:32:08And that's three years old now.

1:32:09So I think you'll get some time out of it.

1:32:11What do you think, Marco?

1:32:12- Yeah, I don't, I think if anything,

1:32:14you might get more time than you expect

1:32:16because it's the first of the new architecture.

1:32:19So far, like in, you know,

1:32:21the reason why you're not really supposed

1:32:23to buy the first version of things if you can help it

1:32:25is that usually the first version has problems,

1:32:27just weird bugs or shortcomings

1:32:30or weird things that they fix in later versions.

1:32:33We've had the M1 stuff now since November,

1:32:36so, or October, whenever it was, well, it's delivered

1:32:38in November, so we've had them now for a good half a year,

1:32:42and there don't seem to be many issues,

1:32:46and possibly even any major ones.

1:32:49- There's some software issues.

1:32:51- Agreed.

1:32:52- I poll my kids about the reliability of Mac OS

1:32:55on the M1s, but those aren't,

1:32:56they're not anything to do with the hardware.

1:32:58It's just like, okay, well, Mac OS has some shortcomings

1:33:00in terms of drivers or whatever, you know, like, yeah.

1:33:04There's more weird pink screens are not unlocking

1:33:07or stuff like that, but that software,

1:33:09the software will continue to get updated,

1:33:10and the software will eventually come to accommodate these,

1:33:13but there's nothing weird about this hardware

1:33:17from a hardware perspective, simply because it is

1:33:19so much like, and now is identical to,

1:33:21the iPad hardware from which it's derived, right?

1:33:24So it's not like this is the very first system on a chip

1:33:27that Apple has made, right?

1:33:28So I think the hardware is very solid,

1:33:31and Casey was talking about, like,

1:33:33projecting forward, like, how much faster

1:33:35a chip's going to be, like, well,

1:33:36is the next year's chip gonna be so fast

1:33:38that you'll feel bad about having this one?

1:33:40The more important direction is to look as backwards,

1:33:42because backwards behind this thing are the Intel chips,

1:33:45and they're way down there in the mud,

1:33:47in terms of performance, right?

1:33:49So as these machines get older,

1:33:51the Intel machines will rapidly become,

1:33:53oh, so slow, I can't even imagine using those,

1:33:55but these things will hang on, because this is the big leap,

1:33:58this is the big discontinuity.

1:33:59It was like slow and steady, one or 2% or 5% increase,

1:34:03in Intel chips, and then this huge leap to the M1,

1:34:06and it's gonna take a long time before the performance

1:34:09that's available in the M1 becomes so slow

1:34:12that you can't even imagine using it, right?

1:34:14So I think these M1s, assuming there's no catastrophic

1:34:17hardware problem, are going to be usable, useful computers

1:34:21for a really long time.

1:34:22Like, think about that fanless $999 MacBook Air.

1:34:25What an amazing performance bargain.

1:34:27I think that computer will last longer

1:34:30than any $1,000 Apple computer has, perhaps, ever.

1:34:33So I am very optimistic about how long these will be,

1:34:37especially since that M1 MacBook Air

1:34:40doesn't have any moving parts, even.

1:34:41Like, it's so much, it's like an electric car,

1:34:43so much simpler, so much fewer parts inside it,

1:34:46fewer things to go wrong, and the performance is great.

1:34:49So thumbs up on the M1.

1:34:51I made a shirt about it.

1:34:53(laughing)

1:34:54- The only thing I will note about

1:34:55the performance characteristics of the M1,

1:34:57now having used them full-time for however many months,

1:35:00the reason it feels so ridiculously fast,

1:35:03and the reason why certain tasks are so incredibly

1:35:06much faster than they were on Intel,

1:35:07or smoother, or better responding,

1:35:09the ceiling of performance, when you have very,

1:35:14like, efficient, parallelized, vectorized code,

1:35:18is not that much higher than what we had before.

1:35:20In some cases, it isn't higher at all.

1:35:21What they did was they raised the floor a lot.

1:35:25So a lot of common things on the M1,

1:35:28common CPU tasks and everything, those are faster,

1:35:33sometimes by a lot.

1:35:34And so it seems like performance all across the board,

1:35:38everything is just snappier and more responsive,

1:35:40but where the M1 is limited is when you wanna

1:35:44push it really hard, when you're maxing out all the cores,

1:35:47and doing something really CPU intensive,

1:35:49it's not slow, but it's not as much faster

1:35:53than the Intel stuff, as you would expect,

1:35:55based on how much faster it is

1:35:56with kind of more pedestrian tasks.

1:35:58- Well, it depends on what you're comparing it to.

1:35:59If you compare it to the Intel $999 MacBook Air,

1:36:02it crushes it, and even in the parallel stuff,

1:36:05but as you get to the higher end, yeah,

1:36:06'cause they're using this chip everywhere.

1:36:07Again, we've just seen the low-end computers here.

1:36:11But let's say the MacBook Pro, 13-inch MacBook Pro,

1:36:13that's an area where I can imagine

1:36:14the previous best 13-inch MacBook Pro Intel model

1:36:18would match it in multi-core, maybe.

1:36:20But as you get to the lower-end machines,

1:36:24you're thinking of multi-core as compared to,

1:36:26what about my 10-core iMac Pro?

1:36:27But that's not what these machines are competing with.

1:36:30- Right, exactly, and so if you are someone

1:36:33who tends to buy the high-core machines,

1:36:37the 15 or 16-inch MacBook Pro, the iMac Pro, the Mac Pro,

1:36:41if you're buying the highest-core accounts

1:36:42and you're matching those things out,

1:36:45first of all, you're gonna want probably more GPU power

1:36:47than this can offer if you're using that for video stuff.

1:36:51But I can see a good case for waiting until,

1:36:57whatever it's called, the M1X or maybe the M2,

1:36:59whatever the beefier version of this

1:37:01for the bigger computers ends up being called,

1:37:04waiting for that, but otherwise,

1:37:07and that's, by the way, that's why my computer

1:37:11never feels slow to me anymore unless I am doing something

1:37:15like an Xcode archive build, (laughs)

1:37:18or a lot of Xcode builds, honestly,

1:37:20where my project is big enough now

1:37:22that when I do a lot of builds in Xcode,

1:37:25and I'm using it on Swift now, thanks a lot, Swift,

1:37:27(laughs)

1:37:28whenever I do a build in Xcode, it maxes out

1:37:30all of the cores for maybe 10 to 60 seconds

1:37:35depending on what exactly it's doing.

1:37:36And you definitely feel that, and there are areas

1:37:39where I would love to have more high-performance cores

1:37:42just so I can shorten those builds.

1:37:45And when that, whatever the next little Mac Pro ends up being

1:37:50whenever that comes out, I will probably buy it

1:37:52for that reason because I don't need any GPU power

1:37:56more than I already have, but I really would love

1:37:58way more high-performance cores,

1:38:00as many as they will give me, I'll take them.

1:38:02'Cause right now I have four, that's great.

1:38:04Give me 12, give me 16, great, that would be even better.

1:38:07And so I don't know what they're gonna do,

1:38:08but if you are that, if you have that kind of performance

1:38:11need where you're doing a lot of high-end parallel stuff,

1:38:14you may wanna wait and see what else comes out after this

1:38:17if you're looking to use it for a very long time.

1:38:19That being said, right now, I am incredibly satisfied

1:38:23with this, it just, the only time I notice it being

1:38:26a little bit slow is that.

1:38:27But I also look and say like, well this is a MacBook Air,

1:38:31or a Mac Mini, depending on which computer I'm using.

1:38:34And like, these are, for what they are,

1:38:37and for what I paid for them, it's fantastic.

1:38:40All right, thank you to our sponsor this week, Backblaze,

1:38:42and thank you to our members who support us directly.

1:38:45You can become a member and get a discount

1:38:48on our new merch by going to ATP.FM/JOIN.

1:38:52If you just wanna buy a shirt and not become a member,

1:38:54no problem, that's cool, go to ATP.FM/STORE.

1:38:57Thank you everybody, and we will talk to you next week.

1:39:00(upbeat music)

1:39:03♪ Now the show is over ♪

1:39:05♪ They didn't even mean to begin ♪

1:39:08♪ 'Cause it was accidental ♪

1:39:10♪ Accidental ♪

1:39:10♪ Oh it was accidental ♪

1:39:12♪ Accidental ♪

1:39:13♪ John didn't do any research ♪

1:39:15♪ And Marco and Casey wouldn't let him ♪

1:39:18♪ 'Cause it was accidental ♪

1:39:20♪ Accidental ♪

1:39:21♪ Oh it was accidental ♪

1:39:23♪ Accidental ♪

1:39:24♪ And you can find the show notes at ATP.FM ♪

1:39:29♪ And if you're into Twitter ♪

1:39:32♪ You can follow them at C-A-S-E-Y-L-I-S-S ♪

1:39:37♪ So that's Casey Liss M-A-R-C-O-A-R-M ♪

1:39:43♪ N-T Marco R. Menn ♪

1:39:45♪ S-I-R-A-C ♪

1:39:48♪ U-S-A-C-R-A-C-U-S-A ♪

1:39:50♪ It's accidental ♪

1:39:52♪ Accidental ♪

1:39:53♪ They didn't mean to ♪

1:39:55♪ Accidental ♪

1:39:57♪ Accidental ♪

1:39:58♪ Tech podcast ♪

1:40:00♪ So long ♪

1:40:02- Oh my god, my arms are on fire.

1:40:05- Your arms?

1:40:06Oh, because-- - The hives, the hives.

1:40:08- I've never had hives before this week.

1:40:09It's terrible.

1:40:10- It does not sound particularly fun.

1:40:12- And these aren't even severe hives.

1:40:14I don't have to be scratching them all the time.

1:40:16I'm trying not to scratch them at all.

1:40:18And they go away sometime in the middle of the night.

1:40:20So I go to bed.

1:40:21They start around like seven or eight p.m.

1:40:24I go to bed, and then I wake up in the morning,

1:40:26and they're gone.

1:40:27So I don't know what's going on.

1:40:29- People get me talking about my toes on rectus.

1:40:31I think this is worse.

1:40:32I don't wanna hear about hives.

1:40:34- I don't wanna have them, believe me.

1:40:35This is not a fun thing, but--

1:40:39- Well, how do you think all that 5G

1:40:40is getting out of you, man?

1:40:41- I know.

1:40:43I'm glad that they started before the shot

1:40:46so I know that that's not it.

1:40:47- That's true, actually.

1:40:48That's a good point.

1:40:49Your body's a petri dish.

1:40:52Some people's body are a wonderland.

1:40:53Marco's body is a petri dish.

1:40:55- I always get the weird medical issues in the family.

1:40:57I don't have anything normal that's wrong with me.

1:41:00I only have occasional really weird stuff like this happen,

1:41:03and then it goes away.

1:41:03Like, okay, well.

1:41:04So anyway, hopefully by next week,

1:41:08I won't be having hives every night for unknown reasons.

1:41:11- Actually, next week's show, I will be vaccinated.

1:41:14- And next week's show, I will be where Marco is

1:41:17because that's the day my second shot was scheduled for.

1:41:20- Oh, nice.

1:41:21- I don't recall.

1:41:22Are you Pfizer or Moderna?

1:41:23- Pfizer.

1:41:24- Okay, so I'm the lone Moderna man.

1:41:26- My wife got her second shot today, too.

1:41:27She went to bed early complaining of a headache, so.

1:41:30- Lots of hydration is what I've heard.

1:41:33I'm not sure.

1:41:34I think it's placebo, but it's always a good idea anyway.

1:41:37- It is probably a placebo,

1:41:38but I was drinking water and Powerade, Pedialyte,

1:41:42literally Pedialyte, like whatever,

1:41:44nonstop the day before and the day of,

1:41:46and I really did not have a bad go of it at all.

1:41:51Like I said, I think earlier in the show,

1:41:52there was a couple hours where I was like really chilly

1:41:55during the day and felt a little rundown.

1:41:57I had a lot of like, I don't know if you guys get this,

1:42:00but when I take NyQuil, which I don't do often,

1:42:02the following day I'll wake up and I'll feel like my head

1:42:04is like two or three floors above my body.

1:42:08That's the only way I can describe it.

1:42:09Like it's the most odd, like very light,

1:42:11not lightheaded, but like fuzzy feeling.

1:42:14And I had, and I would like would waffle between,

1:42:17oh, my head is not several stories above my body

1:42:20like it is after NyQuil,

1:42:21but it's like the next story above my body.

1:42:24And then it would go into like a light headache

1:42:25and then back to this like floating head, like brain fog,

1:42:28as a roll call says in the chat,

1:42:30that's a good way of looking at it.

1:42:32And I kept going back and forth with that.

1:42:33And I was freezing at night for two nights,

1:42:36but that was it, like I tweeted about all this

1:42:40and some people were like, wow, that sounds really bad.

1:42:41And I was like, no, actually it really was nothing.

1:42:44Like it really wasn't bad at all.

1:42:46So yeah, it seems to be just the luck of the draw.

1:42:49I don't know what to make of it.

1:42:50- I can tell you from experience though,

1:42:52this is all better than actual COVID.

1:42:54- Yeah, I was gonna say like from my experience,

1:42:56not having had it, it's like,

1:42:57certainly even what Aaron's going through,

1:42:59you know, super, super tired and feeling not the greatest.

1:43:03Like I'll take that over COVID any day of the week.

1:43:05And you actually are in the,

1:43:06you're uniquely positioned to say with authority

1:43:10that it is indeed better.

1:43:11- Yeah, imagine having that brain fog for a month.

1:43:14- Yeah, no.

1:43:15- In addition to like the horrible fever and aches

1:43:16and everything that you had for two weeks.

1:43:18Like that's, it's just, it's no contest.

1:43:22This is better.

1:43:23- Indeed.

1:43:24And I've probably said this live.

1:43:26And the thing of it is, is that like,

1:43:28if I knew that COVID was just a bad flu,

1:43:31like hear me out, hear me out.

1:43:32If I knew it was like just a bad flu

1:43:34where you feel like crap for a week, like fine, whatever.

1:43:36I probably would have just gone on living my life.

1:43:37But because there's such a variance between like,

1:43:41oh, you get it and nothing really happens.

1:43:42And oh, you get it and literally die.

1:43:46That's why I've been locked in my house for a year

1:43:49because you don't know what's gonna happen.

1:43:51And yeah, like Aaron and I both were,

1:43:55not that we were dreading getting our second shot,

1:43:57but we're both like, oh God, what's gonna come of this?

1:43:59Are we gonna feel like death for a day?

1:44:00But you know what?

1:44:01I'll take it.

1:44:02That is absolutely worth it.

1:44:05I will absolutely do it.

1:44:06And I wasn't planning on getting preachy in the after show,

1:44:09but here we are.

1:44:10If you have the opportunity to get a vaccination,

1:44:12please, please do so.

1:44:13Please do so.

1:44:15- This is really like,

1:44:16this is all of our duty to society.

1:44:19If you can get vaccinated, get vaccinated.

1:44:23- Yep.

1:44:25Couldn't agree more.

1:44:26I think that's fine for an after show,

1:44:28to be honest with you.

1:44:29- I don't know how long I have in this Benadryl.

1:44:30So we're gonna keep it moving.

1:44:33- I gotta get you on the phone in like an hour

1:44:35and start asking for something

1:44:37that you really don't wanna give me.

1:44:38Like, hey man, you wanna buy me a Ticon?

1:44:40- Store's down, Marker, you gotta fix it.

1:44:41What, what?

1:44:42You won't be able to, I'll be in DND mode, auto DND.

1:44:4510 p.m. is when it starts.

1:44:46- Hey man, I can call you twice in a row.

1:44:49That'll bust right through.

1:44:50- Will it?

1:44:51I think it's only if I like tell you to, right?

1:44:52Like don't I have to whitelist you for that?

1:44:54Or is that everybody?

1:44:55- I think it might be like people in your address book

1:44:58can double call through, I don't remember.

1:44:59- Oh crap, you're in my address book.

1:45:01- He's gonna actually do it, don't worry.

1:45:03- I'm not gonna.

1:45:04- Yeah, he's gonna be asleep by then.

1:45:05- Oh yeah, I'm absolutely going to sleep.

1:45:08- He's gonna have a sleepy shirt.

1:45:09- I am in my sleepy shirt, you are correct.

1:45:12That is a fact.

1:45:13- I'm in my sleepy hives, so I'm ready to go.

1:45:15- Oh no, yeah, you're in your own sleepy shirt.

1:45:18- Yes, red and blotchy on my arms.

1:45:20Kinda itchy, kinda hot.

1:45:23- Okay, I did think the toe thing was much worse,

1:45:26but we're starting to even out, no longer you go on.

1:45:30- I mean the toe wasn't like infectious

1:45:32or you know what I mean?

1:45:33Like it's not spreading across my body,

1:45:35or as Marcos is gonna be.

1:45:36- Hives aren't infectious.

1:45:37- You're just gonna be one big hive soon.

1:45:39- Yeah, but it's not infectious,

1:45:40it doesn't spread to other people.

1:45:42- I don't know, I don't know how the hives work,

1:45:44it's spreading to yourself.

1:45:45- Now granted, I only learned this like 48 hours ago

1:45:48when I looked it all up.

1:45:49Oh God, this is terrible.

1:45:52I don't know how people do this.

1:45:55Like a lot of allergy people have hives

1:45:56on a more regular basis.

1:45:57I, God I hope this is not my new life.

1:46:00This is not, I hope this has been my new normal.

1:46:02- Time for some more allergy shots.

1:46:04- Oh yeah, I haven't got,

1:46:05I actually haven't gotten them in a few months

1:46:06because it's difficult where I live to get that done.

1:46:10- Well before you die, let's take it by the live listeners.

1:46:15Thank you if you're listening live,

1:46:16if you've joined because at least a couple of you did,

1:46:19if you've bought merch, which I haven't looked,

1:46:21but I'm assuming at least a couple of you did.

1:46:23Thank you, thank you for just listening to us,

1:46:24shill for all these things, that's very kind of you,

1:46:26and thank you for being live listeners,

1:46:28hopefully not covered in hives.

1:46:29Live listeners, not hive listeners.

1:46:31- And you all can rest assured,

1:46:32when Casey said a few of you joined,

1:46:35Casey watches the membership number.

1:46:37- Oh, like a hawk, like a hawk.

1:46:41You don't even know.

1:46:42- There was one time when there was a wave

1:46:44of payment failures, just 'cause it was the interval

1:46:49that they were new on, and Casey posted in our chat,

1:46:52we've had a, what was it, disastrous,

1:46:54what was the word you used?

1:46:55- I know what you're thinking of,

1:46:56but I don't remember how I phrased it.

1:46:57- Had a disastrous drop in members,

1:46:58and it was like .01% or something,

1:47:01but it was like some number of people,

1:47:04like five people or something.

1:47:05- It was more than five, you big jerk, but yes.

1:47:07- It was some small number of people,

1:47:09and you were like, it's a disaster.

1:47:11- Excuse me, it was like 20 or 30 people, sir,

1:47:15and I will concede that I was definitely

1:47:18having a chicken little moment.

1:47:19It was more than you were making it out to be,

1:47:21but it was still not as much as my reaction justified.

1:47:24- Yeah, and regardless, so if you're out there thinking,

1:47:28should I become a member, would they even notice?

1:47:31Rest assured, Casey will notice.

1:47:34- I will notice.

1:47:35- I look at the numbers too,

1:47:36and I actually keep track of them.

1:47:37I mean, I don't keep track of them over time,

1:47:39but I do have a little solver sheet that I updated in.

1:47:43Let's put it this way, perspective members.

1:47:45We do not have enough members

1:47:47that you are one of an anonymous few.

1:47:48You are a precious gem, a unique ingot of whatever.

1:47:54There's not so many members, so come and join,

1:47:56so there'll be more.

1:47:57- And rest assured, at least Casey

1:47:59and probably John will notice.

1:48:01I won't notice, but I will appreciate it.

1:48:03- Marco doesn't give a shit.

1:48:05- I care about like--

1:48:07- I'm kidding, I'm kidding.

1:48:08- He cares in the aggregate.

1:48:10- Yeah, that's it, that's it.

1:48:11- I care like, what's the ballpark of how we're doing,

1:48:14and is the average either going up or staying the same?

1:48:16That's what I care about.

1:48:17If it starts, like if the average starts going down,

1:48:20then I'll start caring in a bad way, you know,

1:48:22but like as long as things are flat or going up,

1:48:26like trend-wise, I'm fine with that.

1:48:28- Yeah, I would agree with that.

1:48:29I pay closer attention than I know I should,

1:48:32and is probably healthy, but it's important to me.

1:48:34So, and that implies it's not important to you too,

1:48:37you know what I mean.

1:48:38It's just, there are things that I choose to worry about.

1:48:42- Casey also needs his garage door status

1:48:44and his menu bar and his Mac, so there you go.

1:48:47- Hey, both of these things,

1:48:47they're literally next to each other.

1:48:49- Oh yeah, did you see, this was,

1:48:52I think this was the best email of the week,

1:48:54from Russ Newcomer.

1:48:55Subject line, "Casey, AirTag is used.

1:48:58"I am surely not the first person to suggest

1:49:01"that you put one on the top half of your garage door

1:49:03"to determine if it's open or not."

1:49:05- See, I read that, I'm like, how is that supposed to work?

1:49:07Like the U1 can like point an arrow

1:49:09to say if it's open or closed.

1:49:10Like I don't feel like the resolution

1:49:11would be enough to make that useful.

1:49:13- Well, it depends on how close the bedroom is to the garage.

1:49:15It's pretty close, right? - That's true, actually.

1:49:16- Isn't it right on top of it?

1:49:18- That's right, our master bedroom

1:49:19is directly above the garage.

1:49:20- Then we had to like launch the Find My app,

1:49:22which always takes a long time,

1:49:23and wait for it to find and register,

1:49:25and show the letter arrow,

1:49:26and then show the number of feet.

1:49:27(laughing)

1:49:28- I was slightly miffed by it,

1:49:31but also it was a very, very good email.

1:49:34And so I did laugh.

1:49:35- That was my favorite email of the week.

1:49:37Russ gets an award, a gold star,

1:49:40for the best email of the week.

1:49:41- I've put in our super secret text,

1:49:43this is my menu bar as it stands right this very moment.

1:49:46So you'll see that there's a padlock that is locked,

1:49:49so the garage is indeed closed,

1:49:51and then there's a one to seven digit number

1:49:54that indicates subscriber count.

1:49:56- You have that in your menu bar?

1:49:58- You're damn right I do.

1:49:59(laughing)

1:50:00You're damn right I do.

1:50:01- He's got too much stuff in that menu bar.

1:50:03Like do you need backblaze there?

1:50:05Like the whole point of backblaze

1:50:06is it just runs without you worrying about it.

1:50:08- No, I don't want backblaze there.

1:50:10Can I remove it?

1:50:10- Yes, go to the-- - Oh really?

1:50:12- Go to the prep range and uncheck the checkbox, yeah.

1:50:14- Where?

1:50:15I don't see any such checkbox.

1:50:16- I'll find it for you.

1:50:17- I don't even know what half the stuff in my menu bar is.

1:50:20- Backblaze.

1:50:21- Oh my god, there it is.

1:50:21- Settings, yeah.

1:50:22- Oh John, I love you.

1:50:23- It's not new, it's always been there.

1:50:25- I don't doubt it, I've just never noticed.

1:50:26I love you John, that's trans.

1:50:27- All right, so I saved you some space.

1:50:29What else can we get rid of?

1:50:30You can't get rid of Skype

1:50:31'cause it puts that up here whenever it's running.

1:50:32- That'll go away.

1:50:33Do is there.

1:50:34- Bluetooth, do you actually use that menu bar?

1:50:36- I used to more often than I do now,

1:50:40so I could probably remove that.

1:50:41- Yeah, control center now makes that a lot less necessary

1:50:43for a lot of people.

1:50:44- Do you ever disable Wi-Fi or pick a different network?

1:50:47- No.

1:50:48- So get that out of there.

1:50:49- Can you remove the Wi-Fi?

1:50:50- Oh yeah, good idea.

1:50:51- We're really cleaning house here.

1:50:52- Oh okay, I'm liking this.

1:50:54All right, can I get rid of the Wi-Fi?

1:50:55This is, oh yeah I can.

1:50:58- Command drag.

1:50:58- You were performing.

1:50:59- Command drag, and it's still available

1:51:00under control center if you ever actually want to do it,

1:51:02so it's technically still in your menu bar.

1:51:03- Oh you were performing a wonderful service John.

1:51:05- Yeah, and then get rid of Fuzzy Clock 'cause it's dumb.

1:51:09- I like Fuzzy Clock.

1:51:10For those who don't know, Fuzzy Clock is,

1:51:13right now it says five, literally the words five space two.

1:51:17- F-I-V-E space T-O space T-E-N because it's five to 10.

1:51:22- I like Fuzzy Clock.

1:51:23- And it's like how can we make time

1:51:25really hard to read quickly?

1:51:27Like I know time is easy to tell at a glance

1:51:28'cause people are used to looking at both analog clocks

1:51:30and digital clocks, but can we make it,

1:51:32can we slow them down?

1:51:33Can we add cognitive load?

1:51:34Someone said yes we can.

1:51:36- All right, I'm also taking away day one.

1:51:37I used to be religious about taking a note

1:51:39as to what I work on today.

1:51:40- That's the little bookmark shape thing.

1:51:41- Yeah, that's the bookmark.

1:51:42And I don't need to do that anymore.

1:51:44So I'm just taking that away.

1:51:45Dropler I use enough that I want it in the menu bar

1:51:48even though I probably should just remove it.

1:51:50- What's the lock icon on the far left?

1:51:52- That's my garage door, man, it's closed.

1:51:53- Oh, that's right, okay.

1:51:55But you need a custom icon for the garage door.

1:51:57Now that we've made all this space for the glory item

1:51:59which is the garage door, you need a custom template image

1:52:03for garage door open and garage door closed.

1:52:05- Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1:52:07Everything else though, I have iStep menus

1:52:08which I know is your favorite app of all time.

1:52:11Let's see, can I get rid of time machine up there?

1:52:14- You can get rid of Siri, I would recommend it.

1:52:16- Can I? - Yeah.

1:52:17- God bless you, how do I not know all these things?

1:52:19God, I'm an amateur.

1:52:20- 'Cause you don't use a Mac, I don't know.

1:52:22- Seriously, good grief.

1:52:24Oh, this is looking so much better, John.

1:52:26I would get rid of the clock

1:52:27but now that's the fricking notification center

1:52:30so I can't get rid of that.

1:52:30I can't get rid of spotlight either.

1:52:32- You got fuzzy clock and you've got the analog clock.

1:52:35- I know, I know, I know.

1:52:36Then Synology Drive, yeah, let's see.

1:52:41This is looking much better.

1:52:42- I'm basically making your screen bigger.

1:52:44Pretty soon it'll feel like you have an XDR.

1:52:46[beeping]

1:52:48[BLANK_AUDIO]