The Accidental Tech Podcast

203: Screaming At Us From The Future


00:00:00   that's one of the amazing things about [TS]

00:00:01   the making of empire strikes back book [TS]

00:00:03   the digital version has a bunch of audio [TS]

00:00:05   clips of like people talking about [TS]

00:00:07   something like I'm glad somebody record [TS]

00:00:08   these things because here they are [TS]

00:00:09   having actual conversations about making [TS]

00:00:11   this movie dinner at the people have [TS]

00:00:12   recollections that i talked to them [TS]

00:00:14   about this [TS]

00:00:14   guess what we've got audio to you know [TS]

00:00:16   15 minutes of audio about this one thing [TS]

00:00:18   and it's great to hear even though the [TS]

00:00:19   quality is terrible because it was the [TS]

00:00:21   eighties it's true many things ladies [TS]

00:00:22   not Empire Strikes Back that was in the [TS]

00:00:25   ease and it was great for me in kc ya so [TS]

00:00:30   young i feel like i have spoken to Marco [TS]

00:00:35   and John both extremely recently and [TS]

00:00:37   also not in weeks because we saw each [TS]

00:00:39   other three days ago [TS]

00:00:41   alright some with that and and yet at [TS]

00:00:45   the same time we haven't we haven't had [TS]

00:00:46   we haven't had the opportunity to truly [TS]

00:00:48   and truly nerd out for a couple weeks [TS]

00:00:51   now and we're trying to talk about [TS]

00:00:53   computer stuff we're all together like [TS]

00:00:54   everyone else did not want to hear and [TS]

00:00:56   everything it was there just like a [TS]

00:01:00   rolling their eyes and trying to change [TS]

00:01:01   the subject to anything else [TS]

00:01:03   yeah they effectively said with body [TS]

00:01:05   language save it for the show and also [TS]

00:01:09   happy birthday John siracusa a little [TS]

00:01:12   bit late at this point it is four days [TS]

00:01:14   ago now but a happy birthday you are the [TS]

00:01:17   answer to what is what is the actual [TS]

00:01:19   phrasing the answer to life the universe [TS]

00:01:21   and everything [TS]

00:01:22   yeah pretty much fair enough right I do [TS]

00:01:25   we have any pre-show banter we just want [TS]

00:01:27   to go straight to follow and that was [TS]

00:01:28   the pre-show banter [TS]

00:01:29   fair enough alright let's talk about the [TS]

00:01:31   naked robotic macbook pro mr. siracusa [TS]

00:01:34   best thing ever [TS]

00:01:37   the book is said with not an ounce of [TS]

00:01:39   sarcasm i think it is I think it's [TS]

00:01:41   pretty neat at this if someone had [TS]

00:01:44   posted this as a joke a couple weeks ago [TS]

00:01:47   I think we all would have had a good [TS]

00:01:49   laugh about it [TS]

00:01:50   yep the first time i saw this i thought [TS]

00:01:52   it was a joke and I was like it some [TS]

00:01:54   people first like I guess somebody has a [TS]

00:01:55   bad joke timing [TS]

00:01:57   yeah but you know it is apparently a [TS]

00:01:59   real thing [TS]

00:02:00   this is from owc I friends and other you [TS]

00:02:02   see other world computing this is a [TS]

00:02:05   product could you can't buy it right [TS]

00:02:07   they've just sort of correct announced [TS]

00:02:09   it and more details to follow [TS]

00:02:11   if you take your new slim for USB port a [TS]

00:02:17   macbook pro that we talked about at [TS]

00:02:18   length on the show and you sit on top of [TS]

00:02:21   an aluminum rectangle that's the exact [TS]

00:02:25   size and shape has the bottom of the [TS]

00:02:29   macbook pro making your very slim 2016 / [TS]

00:02:33   2017 model macbook pro the thickness of [TS]

00:02:37   2012 macbook pro and in the process it [TS]

00:02:40   gives you a bunch of extra ports on the [TS]

00:02:42   side you get USB type a ports you get [TS]

00:02:44   ethernet you get an SD card slot you get [TS]

00:02:47   another USBC far as i can tell you don't [TS]

00:02:50   get any additional battery it does have [TS]

00:02:52   it does clean also four terabytes of [TS]

00:02:53   internal storage of some type and [TS]

00:02:55   additional things to come like they [TS]

00:02:57   haven't haven't revealed all the things [TS]

00:02:59   it's going to do so right away I have [TS]

00:03:01   some technical questions about this [TS]

00:03:03   oh yes I first how does it work because [TS]

00:03:05   I expected it to plug into the USB sea [TS]

00:03:08   ports on the side because you know you [TS]

00:03:09   can do that like the Thunderbolts last [TS]

00:03:11   year's pc forth if you you can plug for [TS]

00:03:14   example a thunderbolt three dock into [TS]

00:03:15   there and on that document have an SD [TS]

00:03:17   card port and USB ports and storage and [TS]

00:03:20   you know you can you can do all that we [TS]

00:03:22   know you can do it but you have to plug [TS]

00:03:24   into one of those ports and the pictures [TS]

00:03:26   they have show both sides of this thing [TS]

00:03:28   with all four of the Thunderbolt three [TS]

00:03:32   ports on the side of this macbook pro [TS]

00:03:34   completely open so that's mysterious [TS]

00:03:36   no I don't think it's mysterious at all [TS]

00:03:38   I I mean I understand what you're saying [TS]

00:03:39   but I will bet you a gazillion dollars [TS]

00:03:43   that if you're looking at the images of [TS]

00:03:45   the two sides so they're showing the [TS]

00:03:47   right-hand side of it but it's on the [TS]

00:03:49   left-hand side of the image and then the [TS]

00:03:51   left-hand side on the right-hand side of [TS]

00:03:52   the image so the the right side of the [TS]

00:03:55   dock where the SD card is there's a USB [TS]

00:03:57   seaport directly under one of the four [TS]

00:04:02   onboard USB seaports it's hard to paint [TS]

00:04:05   a word picture about this but anyway I [TS]

00:04:06   bet you anything work they're gonna have [TS]

00:04:08   one of those little stubby yeah USBC [TS]

00:04:10   cables right there it'll be like the [TS]

00:04:11   room you remember the daughter the [TS]

00:04:13   daughter board video cards from PCs way [TS]

00:04:15   back in the day he would go you would go [TS]

00:04:17   like VG [TS]

00:04:18   from your 2d car doesn't remember yeah [TS]

00:04:21   you go from the PGA from your 2d card [TS]

00:04:23   your 3d card and then vga from your 3d [TS]

00:04:26   card out to your monitor and then you [TS]

00:04:27   have these little like setup vga cables [TS]

00:04:30   it was barbaric but i'm going to make it [TS]

00:04:32   even all the reference back in the mac [TS]

00:04:34   days when they had scuzzy as their [TS]

00:04:36   external connector for hard drives and [TS]

00:04:39   such and you would buy hard drives that [TS]

00:04:41   fit exactly underneath the classic Mac [TS]

00:04:43   shape so you could stack them and they [TS]

00:04:44   would be exactly the size of the the [TS]

00:04:46   base of like a mac plus r5 to offer [TS]

00:04:48   whatever I and since you would stack [TS]

00:04:51   them each one would be a different hard [TS]

00:04:53   drive and you need to daisy chain them [TS]

00:04:54   together in typical see passion one [TS]

00:04:56   would have a terminator then you go for [TS]

00:04:57   12 they made c-shaped brackets that were [TS]

00:05:00   not cables at all of our exact brackets [TS]

00:05:02   you know it's a single manufacturer with [TS]

00:05:03   this album like jasmine or whatever and [TS]

00:05:06   they would plug into the back and [TS]

00:05:07   connect one drive to the one right above [TS]

00:05:09   it exactly matching these gigantic 15 [TS]

00:05:12   scuzzy connectors so not a cable at all [TS]

00:05:14   but a very stiff bracket thing i can [TS]

00:05:17   imagine that as well but they don't show [TS]

00:05:19   it in the pictures [TS]

00:05:20   correction that is fair well and also [TS]

00:05:22   these pictures should be taken with a [TS]

00:05:24   huge array of salt because they have [TS]

00:05:26   even stated these are rendering these [TS]

00:05:27   are not the final product in fact when I [TS]

00:05:29   first looked at this page maybe you know [TS]

00:05:32   an hour before that macrumors articles [TS]

00:05:33   posted these exact pictures in this [TS]

00:05:36   exact spot on on the official [TS]

00:05:38   ohdeedoh.com / DC on that page these [TS]

00:05:42   exact pictures the two sides were blank [TS]

00:05:44   except for one that this the one single [TS]

00:05:46   USBC import all like the LA and the [TS]

00:05:49   carburetor was there but all the USBA [TS]

00:05:51   and ethernet port you see right there [TS]

00:05:52   were not there like 12 hours ago so i [TS]

00:05:55   really like this is a work in progress [TS]

00:05:58   like I learn more from the macrumors [TS]

00:05:59   post about it than I did from their page [TS]

00:06:01   so clearly this is still in the very [TS]

00:06:04   early phases they said it will be [TS]

00:06:06   available in 2017 but i don't think they [TS]

00:06:09   got more specific than that [TS]

00:06:11   nor had they listed price or anything [TS]

00:06:12   but I mean it's basically yeah it's a [TS]

00:06:15   docking station that happens to be the [TS]

00:06:18   same shape as the macbook pro so you can [TS]

00:06:20   sit on top of it but when i first saw [TS]

00:06:22   the these pictures without seeing macros [TS]

00:06:24   article when I first saw the pictures [TS]

00:06:25   and it got almost no information i [TS]

00:06:28   assumed that what they were doing was [TS]

00:06:30   basically offering a service where you [TS]

00:06:31   can send you [TS]

00:06:32   put to them and they would like unscrew [TS]

00:06:33   the bottom of it yeah [TS]

00:06:35   places like and pretend you know [TS]

00:06:37   semi-permanently attach this thing and [TS]

00:06:39   if they were doing that then they could [TS]

00:06:41   maybe do something like give a bigger [TS]

00:06:42   battery and you know use internal [TS]

00:06:45   whatever kind of internal connections [TS]

00:06:48   that are present if any i honestly would [TS]

00:06:50   be surprised if there are many if any [TS]

00:06:53   but yeah i was thinking where they [TS]

00:06:54   connected internally but you can do a [TS]

00:06:56   bigger battery with external to please [TS]

00:06:57   remember that USBC port is also the [TS]

00:06:59   charging port works share this smart the [TS]

00:07:01   smartphone you know iphone case or [TS]

00:07:03   whatever examiner is but anyway that [TS]

00:07:05   isn't what this is as far as we can tell [TS]

00:07:07   from the very little information we have [TS]

00:07:08   but either way let's so basically it [TS]

00:07:11   sounds like it it almost certainly [TS]

00:07:12   doesn't offer any additional battery [TS]

00:07:14   power that's the only real reason I [TS]

00:07:15   would see for for wanting to have this [TS]

00:07:18   tremendous additional bulk added [TS]

00:07:20   permanently to your macbook or worried [TS]

00:07:22   about ya we don't know because they sell [TS]

00:07:24   more stuff is coming and if you look at [TS]

00:07:25   the stuff that's in there obviously [TS]

00:07:26   there has to be more because the stuff [TS]

00:07:28   they have in their would not take up all [TS]

00:07:30   that space so i guess a good to be [TS]

00:07:31   filled air but if you're gonna buy [TS]

00:07:33   batteries like there's not room making [TS]

00:07:34   an optical drive nice actually [TS]

00:07:37   absolutely think we're not exactly what [TS]

00:07:39   a really good keyboard you can reach now [TS]

00:07:41   so I you know it will see when this [TS]

00:07:44   thing actually provides a little more [TS]

00:07:46   information and when it actually [TS]

00:07:47   launches but i don't think the market [TS]

00:07:49   for this is going to be very big [TS]

00:07:50   I I certainly won't use it [TS]

00:07:54   no way you can make me use that because [TS]

00:07:56   the fact is that the the macbook pro as [TS]

00:08:00   it is is almost pretty good and this [TS]

00:08:04   pushes it so far in the other direction [TS]

00:08:06   that it's like ok this like you turn [TS]

00:08:09   something that's almost pretty good but [TS]

00:08:11   has mediocre battery life and a bad [TS]

00:08:13   keyboard into something that is still [TS]

00:08:16   having mediocre better life and pad kee [TS]

00:08:19   forward that is just like bigger and [TS]

00:08:21   heavier to add a what is really a very [TS]

00:08:24   small handful of of capabilities so far [TS]

00:08:27   I don't see why people would want this [TS]

00:08:30   honestly but somebody might I guess I [TS]

00:08:34   well remember market that you cannot [TS]

00:08:36   possibly do any kind of work on a [TS]

00:08:39   macbook pro unless you have asked unless [TS]

00:08:40   you have an SD card slot so if you [TS]

00:08:42   wanted to do any kind of work [TS]

00:08:44   the macbook pro you must have this doc [TS]

00:08:46   otherwise it's impossible but honestly [TS]

00:08:49   so this so it in the in the massive span [TS]

00:08:52   of time since we've last spoken of this [TS]

00:08:54   podcast I i did you know we traveled [TS]

00:08:57   upstate 24 / prepare for parent [TS]

00:09:00   Christmas stuff and I have my laptop [TS]

00:09:03   there and there was one point in which I [TS]

00:09:05   had I had brought some every year making [TS]

00:09:07   Christmas video and former from the [TS]

00:09:10   previous Christmases photos and and [TS]

00:09:12   time-lapse tip is all the work she gets [TS]

00:09:14   all the credit anyway I I bring with me [TS]

00:09:15   on my laptop copies of all the video so [TS]

00:09:17   that way when we get there after showing [TS]

00:09:19   everybody we can give everybody their [TS]

00:09:21   own copy on the thumb drives that don't [TS]

00:09:23   go into your computer [TS]

00:09:24   yeah so one of the members has an ipad [TS]

00:09:26   one has a laptop and one has a thumb [TS]

00:09:29   drive and so this is ok that's like you [TS]

00:09:31   put the wolf on the boat needs like it's [TS]

00:09:34   this crazy things that happened we put [TS]

00:09:35   the water on with the chicken rice like [TS]

00:09:37   how do we get how do we get these files [TS]

00:09:39   to these different things right [TS]

00:09:41   I'm sitting there on the couch with my [TS]

00:09:42   new macbook and first my father-in-law [TS]

00:09:45   brings down the the Lightning card [TS]

00:09:49   reader adapter with an SD card in it [TS]

00:09:51   that use iPads you put on here I like [TS]

00:09:54   the lighting and look at the SD card [TS]

00:09:55   like nope [TS]

00:09:58   and then like my brother and then like [TS]

00:10:00   you know that and I get handed this like [TS]

00:10:02   USB key like this USB thumb drive thing [TS]

00:10:05   no I guess I get a dongle for that Lee [TS]

00:10:08   upstairs get the dongle is like and it [TS]

00:10:11   wasn't it wasn't I didn't own the dongle [TS]

00:10:13   and it wasn't that I didn't even have [TS]

00:10:15   the dongle like technically with me on [TS]

00:10:16   the trip but it was upstairs and I was [TS]

00:10:18   downstairs on a soft capture it was [TS]

00:10:20   Christmas there there's just gonna be a [TS]

00:10:22   so many of these times with these new [TS]

00:10:24   macbook pros we're like even if it's a [TS]

00:10:27   minor inconvenience it still makes you [TS]

00:10:30   regret the limitations of this computer [TS]

00:10:33   in use in practice I i bet more often [TS]

00:10:37   than apple might have might have [TS]

00:10:38   estimated by whatever data a reason to [TS]

00:10:40   make this decision to to admit all the [TS]

00:10:43   useful stuff from this computer and it [TS]

00:10:45   there there are so many things about [TS]

00:10:46   that are nice like it like every you [TS]

00:10:48   know every year we go to say we go to [TS]

00:10:49   the same place my in-laws place and and [TS]

00:10:51   every year I i have to plug in my laptop [TS]

00:10:53   and every year I i had this weird layout [TS]

00:10:58   where to reach the left side of where [TS]

00:11:00   the charging port was the magsafe was [TS]

00:11:02   have to kind of lean laptop in a strange [TS]

00:11:04   way overnight when it's charging and [TS]

00:11:06   this year I could use the other side [TS]

00:11:07   which was really helpful and there's [TS]

00:11:08   going to be time but that were it's nice [TS]

00:11:10   to have charger in your side like that [TS]

00:11:11   would be great right so you know it [TS]

00:11:14   isn't all bad and it was also really [TS]

00:11:16   nice to have this thing be lighter as I [TS]

00:11:19   was carrying it around the house and you [TS]

00:11:21   know doing you know basic stuff i gave [TS]

00:11:23   it was nice having it lighter so I [TS]

00:11:25   appreciate those things I appreciate [TS]

00:11:27   some of the progress boy had not having [TS]

00:11:30   not having the SD card reader and you [TS]

00:11:32   and at least one USB a port has already [TS]

00:11:36   bitten me like it more than once in [TS]

00:11:39   these like little tiny like you know [TS]

00:11:41   razor blade cut ways i just i just it [TS]

00:11:44   doesn't leave me with a good agent about [TS]

00:11:46   this laptop overall so I think there's a [TS]

00:11:48   this product / turns out to be in the [TS]

00:11:51   market reveal some interesting things [TS]

00:11:53   we've talked about before but this is [TS]

00:11:55   like a concrete version of it [TS]

00:11:56   the first is this is an extreme case of [TS]

00:11:59   negative robotic or thing applies to the [TS]

00:12:01   mac which we talked about before the [TS]

00:12:04   idea that if you just provide the core [TS]

00:12:06   amount of functionality and let people [TS]

00:12:07   add stuff on top of that they might want [TS]

00:12:10   so with the iphone it's like we give you [TS]

00:12:11   the skinny little metal thing that you [TS]

00:12:12   want and if you want extra battery or [TS]

00:12:15   you want more protection or you know you [TS]

00:12:17   want a place to put your credit cards [TS]

00:12:18   you want a rubbery outside or whatever [TS]

00:12:20   it is that you want to do to it [TS]

00:12:21   everyone else can bring to it whatever [TS]

00:12:23   they want you want to be different color [TS]

00:12:24   a different texture whatever you can put [TS]

00:12:26   that on [TS]

00:12:27   but by making the smallest thing [TS]

00:12:28   possible with the people who want a [TS]

00:12:30   really small thing have a really small [TS]

00:12:31   thing that people want something [TS]

00:12:32   different every one can apply visit we [TS]

00:12:33   made a choice and add the big battery [TS]

00:12:35   that people want the skinny ones can [TS]

00:12:37   happen so on and so forth so this thing [TS]

00:12:39   to make a robotic macbook pro if you [TS]

00:12:41   want a bunch of ports you can slap it on [TS]

00:12:44   the end and we're at all the past the [TS]

00:12:46   all the past time to talk about this is [TS]

00:12:48   like yeah but if you add on the outside [TS]

00:12:50   because you have to have you know phone [TS]

00:12:52   motherboard battery case you know inner [TS]

00:12:57   case battery outer case like the the [TS]

00:12:59   extra layering requiring them both to be [TS]

00:13:01   products in and of themselves the case [TS]

00:13:03   is a product and the phone is a product [TS]

00:13:05   that they have their own walls and the [TS]

00:13:06   combination of all the walls is your [TS]

00:13:08   total thickness it makes them bigger [TS]

00:13:09   than if you said if you just took that [TS]

00:13:11   amount [TS]

00:13:11   a battery that's in this battery case [TS]

00:13:13   and put it inside the phone it wouldn't [TS]

00:13:14   be a stick so here we have a great [TS]

00:13:16   example that these ports that they're [TS]

00:13:18   adding if Apple had put these inside the [TS]

00:13:20   macbook pro it would be thicker but it [TS]

00:13:22   would not be this thing I mean you look [TS]

00:13:23   at the ethernet port is stacked up with [TS]

00:13:26   the USBC port above it like because they [TS]

00:13:28   can't they can't add you know they can't [TS]

00:13:30   violate the integrity of the case so [TS]

00:13:31   you've got the entire flat side [TS]

00:13:34   thickness of the case and then what they [TS]

00:13:36   have left to put their ports on is [TS]

00:13:37   anything they can put below that they [TS]

00:13:39   can't combine them so this does show the [TS]

00:13:42   you know very graphic illustration of [TS]

00:13:44   the highlight of the naked robotic or [TS]

00:13:46   strategies that if you do add stuff it [TS]

00:13:48   will always necessarily be bigger than [TS]

00:13:49   it was built in and the second thing I [TS]

00:13:51   think is that I don't know if this was [TS]

00:13:53   just someone making estimation or if [TS]

00:13:54   they say it in the copy as a real thing [TS]

00:13:56   but i believe that they're saying this [TS]

00:13:58   makes your 2016 / 20 17 macbook pro the [TS]

00:14:03   same thickness as the 2012 model though [TS]

00:14:05   we all look at this it looks like that [TS]

00:14:07   that comic illustration of the powerbook [TS]

00:14:10   g5 together that oh yes photoshop it [TS]

00:14:13   looks like it's just comically thick [TS]

00:14:16   like it's like the size of a dictionary [TS]

00:14:18   or phone book I don't even know what [TS]

00:14:19   those are [TS]

00:14:20   it's a really thick book looks it looks [TS]

00:14:23   huge and yet this was the thickness of a [TS]

00:14:26   product that apple sold not too long ago [TS]

00:14:28   2012 mac pro the people still haven't [TS]

00:14:30   like and often they say I'm sticking [TS]

00:14:32   with my 2012 macbook pro because it's [TS]

00:14:34   got all the parts i wanted whatever this [TS]

00:14:35   I think illustrates what I've always [TS]

00:14:37   talked about and that you know that a [TS]

00:14:38   hypocritical posta long ago about people [TS]

00:14:40   complaining that the imac was getting [TS]

00:14:42   too skinny when they took away the [TS]

00:14:43   optical drive made it super skinny it's [TS]

00:14:45   like who the hell needs a super-skinny [TS]

00:14:46   imac what's the point and I i [TS]

00:14:49   transferred iphone to say like you have [TS]

00:14:51   to go thinner year after year because [TS]

00:14:53   even though from year-to-year the the [TS]

00:14:55   sacrifice doesn't make that much of a [TS]

00:14:57   difference if they go what so it's a few [TS]

00:14:59   millimeters sticker multiply that by [TS]

00:15:00   year after year after year and you'll [TS]

00:15:03   find yourself far from where you started [TS]

00:15:04   so in 2012 then shaving no millimeter [TS]

00:15:06   off 2013 another millimeter often 2014 [TS]

00:15:09   another note it seems like what's the [TS]

00:15:10   point you're just making my thing [TS]

00:15:12   dinner in a way that i can even detect [TS]

00:15:14   and I'm not getting any gains from but [TS]

00:15:15   like you said Marko you appreciate the [TS]

00:15:18   the lightness even just compared to your [TS]

00:15:21   previous model which wasn't that old [TS]

00:15:22   imagine [TS]

00:15:24   the the you-know-what you what it would [TS]

00:15:26   be like if you upgraded from a 2012 [TS]

00:15:27   model this and here we have a rewind [TS]

00:15:29   button to go back to what it was like in [TS]

00:15:31   2012 and now you can't go back now you [TS]

00:15:32   say no that's too far [TS]

00:15:34   I can't go back that far i don't care [TS]

00:15:35   how many points you have it is too big [TS]

00:15:37   and just too heavy i know now that I [TS]

00:15:39   know what's possible [TS]

00:15:41   i I can't go back to that again so there [TS]

00:15:44   is something to be said for apples [TS]

00:15:46   relentless pursuit of thinness I still [TS]

00:15:48   don't think they had any sort of [TS]

00:15:49   inflection point like my the the three [TS]

00:15:51   hours go back to is the the the [TS]

00:15:53   credit-card sized phone that just [TS]

00:15:54   fluttered to the ground and you don't [TS]

00:15:55   have to worry about cracking because no [TS]

00:15:57   one worries about dropping their credit [TS]

00:15:58   card around cracking it because it's so [TS]

00:16:00   freaking thin we haven't we haven't got [TS]

00:16:02   there not even close but this this [TS]

00:16:05   illustration and our general discussed [TS]

00:16:07   with it this product and are discussed [TS]

00:16:09   but i think it is really hammers home [TS]

00:16:11   that distend this thing even though we [TS]

00:16:14   complain about it [TS]

00:16:15   the upsides aren't just academic like [TS]

00:16:18   once you become accustomed to it being [TS]

00:16:20   that thin we wanted to be that thin and [TS]

00:16:22   also maybe have an SD card slot which by [TS]

00:16:23   the way they could totally do bispo [TS]

00:16:25   never or add two millimeters that like [TS]

00:16:28   you know we're willing to bargain a [TS]

00:16:29   millimeter to but none of us want to add [TS]

00:16:31   you know half an inch to this thing [TS]

00:16:34   because we just can't go back to that by [TS]

00:16:35   the way I can't let this go without [TS]

00:16:37   pointing out that this ancient thick [TS]

00:16:40   2012 macbook pro that they're comparing [TS]

00:16:43   this to was sold in the form of the 101 [TS]

00:16:45   until two months ago [TS]

00:16:46   yeah an optical drive funny remind you [TS]

00:16:49   ya know what I mean you're right like i [TS]

00:16:51   love the 2012 retina macbook for like [TS]

00:16:53   the 15-inch retina it's so so nice it's [TS]

00:16:56   such an overall awesome machine but now [TS]

00:16:59   that I've had this new one for one month [TS]

00:17:01   the old one which i still have my closet [TS]

00:17:03   haven't sold it yet i look at any [TS]

00:17:05   particular so often and like it feels [TS]

00:17:07   ancient and it feels like a big heavy [TS]

00:17:10   awkward lunch tray even though like a [TS]

00:17:14   month ago I was like this is fine this [TS]

00:17:15   is getting smaller like it really is all [TS]

00:17:18   about what you're accustomed to and as [TS]

00:17:20   soon as you get a customer's new one [TS]

00:17:21   even though the difference is in in [TS]

00:17:24   weight and thickness is not tremendous [TS]

00:17:27   it is a savings that is noticeable and [TS]

00:17:30   as soon as you start using it's really [TS]

00:17:31   hard to ever go back and to have it feel [TS]

00:17:34   normal [TS]

00:17:34   I mean heck even the keyboard i hate the [TS]

00:17:37   keyboard on the [TS]

00:17:37   new one but I use the killer the one [TS]

00:17:39   like this is kinda mushy like that i'm [TS]

00:17:42   really i'm completely ruined i still [TS]

00:17:45   hate the new one keyboard wide but it's [TS]

00:17:48   like and honestly i think i would hate [TS]

00:17:50   the new keyboard a lot less if they [TS]

00:17:52   would give me back to gaps above the [TS]

00:17:54   left and right arrow keys that has [TS]

00:17:56   bitten me more than any other thing [TS]

00:17:59   about this keyboard i got the key [TS]

00:18:00   switches I still don't like but I've [TS]

00:18:02   gotten used to escape I have mapped to [TS]

00:18:05   caps lock and it was a very easy [TS]

00:18:07   transition the shaping of those arrow [TS]

00:18:09   keys and not having a little gaps above [TS]

00:18:11   left and right the way they have been [TS]

00:18:13   for years that keeps messing me up so [TS]

00:18:16   much because I can no longer orient [TS]

00:18:19   myself on the arrow keys by feel [TS]

00:18:20   reliably and this has it turns out [TS]

00:18:23   there's something I need quite [TS]

00:18:24   frequently in use and I didn't realize [TS]

00:18:26   it until I don't use one of these things [TS]

00:18:28   for a while but wow that is that is that [TS]

00:18:32   is a big change but yeah when you go [TS]

00:18:34   with the old one it's like well I died I [TS]

00:18:36   don't want even though it is in so many [TS]

00:18:38   ways better you use the the quote mushy [TS]

00:18:42   keyboard and you see that the relatively [TS]

00:18:44   tiny little you know quaint little [TS]

00:18:46   trackpad on there like wow this is like [TS]

00:18:48   using a powerbook and by comparison [TS]

00:18:50   it's the new thing really does feel so [TS]

00:18:53   much newer and more modern even though [TS]

00:18:55   in these fairly large ways it is [TS]

00:18:57   definitely worse [TS]

00:18:59   this is one of the dangers of using iOS [TS]

00:19:01   are growing up with iOS and I watch my [TS]

00:19:03   son he's most of the one is the school [TS]

00:19:05   assignments like these google docs and [TS]

00:19:07   your rights school papers and stuff in [TS]

00:19:08   it which is a pretty good system in [TS]

00:19:10   terms of putting you know teachers and [TS]

00:19:13   peers you know comment on and see if it [TS]

00:19:15   work anyway because he's a child of iOS [TS]

00:19:18   and a child of the post PCH watching him [TS]

00:19:21   try to use a word processor on a Mac [TS]

00:19:23   just makes me want to tear my hair all [TS]

00:19:26   all of his cursor movement he does with [TS]

00:19:29   the mouse and I like see these keys on [TS]

00:19:32   the keyboard with the arrows on them [TS]

00:19:34   I swear to you they will move the [TS]

00:19:35   insertion point one character and easier [TS]

00:19:37   than you finding where the mouse is [TS]

00:19:39   steering you know this is not good with [TS]

00:19:41   the mouse to the steering your cursor [TS]

00:19:42   over moving it over to get as like just [TS]

00:19:45   use the matter you don't even say like [TS]

00:19:46   option or command arrows just plain use [TS]

00:19:48   the arrow keys like it is so much faster [TS]

00:19:51   and forward delete and just like these [TS]

00:19:52   amazing technologies that like watching [TS]

00:19:54   trying to text editing because always [TS]

00:19:56   ever used to is the terrible text [TS]

00:19:57   editing on iOS four you have to hold [TS]

00:19:59   your stupid finger down you get that [TS]

00:20:00   magnifying glass that also makes montara [TS]

00:20:02   even after I show America's not like [TS]

00:20:04   he's like thanks dad that's a revelation [TS]

00:20:06   I'm so much more efficient he's like no [TS]

00:20:08   I'll go back to that [TS]

00:20:09   yeah so painful I don't know kids these [TS]

00:20:12   days [TS]

00:20:12   someday the one about arrow keys we [TS]

00:20:16   respond to this week by betterment go to [TS]

00:20:18   betterment calm / ATP to learn more and [TS]

00:20:21   get up to six months of no fees [TS]

00:20:22   betterment investing made better [TS]

00:20:24   betterment has changed the financial [TS]

00:20:26   industry and make investing easier and a [TS]

00:20:29   lower cost than most traditional [TS]

00:20:30   financial advisers they manage your [TS]

00:20:32   investors with the same strategies that [TS]

00:20:34   these advisors use with clients who have [TS]

00:20:35   millions of dollars you actually heard [TS]

00:20:37   about this in the press which has the [TS]

00:20:38   wall street journal Bloomberg and [TS]

00:20:40   techcrunch have all covered betterment [TS]

00:20:42   betterment is an independent automated [TS]

00:20:44   investing server since the largest [TS]

00:20:46   independent investment service managing [TS]

00:20:48   more than 5.5 billion dollars for over a [TS]

00:20:50   hundred and eighty thousand customers as [TS]

00:20:52   of this past fall the financial services [TS]

00:20:54   industry has embraced technology and [TS]

00:20:56   innovation through the creation of the [TS]

00:20:58   automated investing services meaning [TS]

00:20:59   that you keep more of your money with [TS]

00:21:01   fees that are a fraction of what you [TS]

00:21:02   would pay for traditional financial [TS]

00:21:03   services and and their advisers and [TS]

00:21:05   excess cash that the investment generate [TS]

00:21:07   is automatically reinvested so every [TS]

00:21:09   dollar you invest is put to work all the [TS]

00:21:11   time and your portfolio is automatically [TS]

00:21:13   rebalanced so check out today go to [TS]

00:21:15   betterment calm / ATP to learn more go [TS]

00:21:19   to six months of no fees investing [TS]

00:21:21   involves risk once again go to [TS]

00:21:23   betterment calm / ATP that's betterment [TS]

00:21:26   calm / ATP betterment investing made [TS]

00:21:29   better [TS]

00:21:33   on pros leaving the mac apparently [TS]

00:21:36   somebody has done a little bit of [TS]

00:21:38   pulling and research about whether or [TS]

00:21:42   not designers would ever consider motion [TS]

00:21:44   designer specifically whatever that [TS]

00:21:46   means would you ever consider switching [TS]

00:21:47   to a pc yes 42-percent maybe forty [TS]

00:21:50   percent no eighteen percent that isn't [TS]

00:21:53   just bit to reinforce the idea was I [TS]

00:21:55   said last show that like professional [TS]

00:21:57   users whose job is to do like motion [TS]

00:21:59   graphics they're not mac users their [TS]

00:22:01   motion graphic designers right this is [TS]

00:22:03   what they do they I think this means [TS]

00:22:04   like motion video [TS]

00:22:05   you know like basically video effects [TS]

00:22:07   are transitions during the news or [TS]

00:22:08   whatever I think that's what this means [TS]

00:22:10   is what this website is about it's [TS]

00:22:11   called school of motion calm so it's [TS]

00:22:13   entirely a professional website for [TS]

00:22:15   people who do this for a living [TS]

00:22:17   it's not about Max it's not about [TS]

00:22:18   computers not about what to use do for a [TS]

00:22:20   living it's like I want to do this for a [TS]

00:22:21   living and then they talk about the [TS]

00:22:23   tools that they use so they want to get [TS]

00:22:24   the job done [TS]

00:22:26   they don't necessarily care about a [TS]

00:22:27   particular something the survey was [TS]

00:22:29   would you consider switching to be so it [TS]

00:22:31   shows that in general the bent of the [TS]

00:22:33   sites like we mostly use macs to do this [TS]

00:22:34   we talk about programs that are [TS]

00:22:36   available on the mac to do it like [TS]

00:22:38   motion i think is still for sale anyway [TS]

00:22:41   would you consider switching to be c a2 [TS]

00:22:44   percent are either yes or maybe only [TS]

00:22:46   eighteen percent say no because the [TS]

00:22:48   bottom line is it's like well if that's [TS]

00:22:50   the way I have to go to do motion [TS]

00:22:52   graphics i will do it because you know [TS]

00:22:56   they're not going to change your [TS]

00:22:57   profession biggest the computer they [TS]

00:22:58   like doesn't let them do they do it [TS]

00:22:59   they're gonna change platform so you [TS]

00:23:02   know and again like I said on the last [TS]

00:23:04   show it doesn't mean that every company [TS]

00:23:06   tries to make that transition will be [TS]

00:23:07   successful it's very you know disruptive [TS]

00:23:09   to have to buy all new hardware and [TS]

00:23:11   learn new programs and buy new licenses [TS]

00:23:12   and deal with you know file formats and [TS]

00:23:15   legacy date and all the stuff but in [TS]

00:23:18   general if the company doesn't serve a [TS]

00:23:21   professional market like that the market [TS]

00:23:23   will switch very quickly because the [TS]

00:23:25   market is not sentimental individual [TS]

00:23:27   people may be sentimental even whole [TS]

00:23:29   companies can be sentimental but the [TS]

00:23:30   market in terms of I need a bunch of [TS]

00:23:31   people to do jobs x4 me with computers [TS]

00:23:34   is not sentimental and if you don't do [TS]

00:23:36   the job someone else will and whatever [TS]

00:23:38   to get a job [TS]

00:23:39   alright so the next item in the list [TS]

00:23:42   scares me deeply [TS]

00:23:44   me too says [TS]

00:23:46   it says casey and marcos homework and I [TS]

00:23:48   think I can speak for Marco and saying [TS]

00:23:50   well maybe that I don't remember that [TS]

00:23:52   might be just me but I can speak for [TS]

00:23:54   marketing saying I didn't do my homework [TS]

00:23:56   so i suppose what was I supposed to have [TS]

00:23:58   been doing that could always speak for [TS]

00:24:00   me Casey right that part I was confident [TS]

00:24:02   it was the remembering part i wasn't [TS]

00:24:03   sure about i also don't remember what [TS]

00:24:05   the homework was I felt bad because i [TS]

00:24:07   was listening back to the show well two [TS]

00:24:09   people were tweeting at us like I can't [TS]

00:24:11   wait to hear Casey and Marco and [TS]

00:24:13   homework and and at that point I'd [TS]

00:24:15   forgotten what I had said designed to [TS]

00:24:17   you for homework but I remember doing it [TS]

00:24:19   but I did it mostly as a joke because we [TS]

00:24:21   are we know that you have time to hunt [TS]

00:24:22   homework so when I was listening back to [TS]

00:24:24   the show as i do i was reminded of what [TS]

00:24:26   the homework was but listeners may be [TS]

00:24:29   their new listeners say something about [TS]

00:24:30   that you're going to actually do this [TS]

00:24:31   helper a remember with homework 1 i'm [TS]

00:24:34   gonna be come to the show ready to have [TS]

00:24:37   the homework was very optimistic [TS]

00:24:39   yeah don't work was the idea of trying [TS]

00:24:42   to say trying to figure out how you [TS]

00:24:45   would distinguish between a situation [TS]

00:24:47   where the world is moving on from PCs [TS]

00:24:50   and we are just being left behind [TS]

00:24:52   because we were dinosaurs or a situation [TS]

00:24:54   where Apple especially abandoning the [TS]

00:24:56   mac market even though the early concept [TS]

00:24:59   of of a pc style computer has many many [TS]

00:25:02   years to go and apples making a mistake [TS]

00:25:04   and the idea from the perspective of [TS]

00:25:06   someone who loves Mack those can both [TS]

00:25:08   look the same from the inside [TS]

00:25:09   what might you look for what how what [TS]

00:25:12   might look for from the inside to try to [TS]

00:25:13   distinguish those two situations what [TS]

00:25:15   I'd like is there something because they [TS]

00:25:17   feel the same and look the same but is [TS]

00:25:19   there some kind of thing you can look at [TS]

00:25:22   to say okay well if it was the case that [TS]

00:25:24   we were being left behind as dinosaurs [TS]

00:25:25   we would see this but if it turns out [TS]

00:25:27   that Apple's actually making a mistake [TS]

00:25:28   we would see that instead [TS]

00:25:29   is there anything we can look for to let [TS]

00:25:32   us know which those two things aren't [TS]

00:25:34   couldn't think of anything on the show [TS]

00:25:35   and so I signed his homework and you [TS]

00:25:37   probably forgot about what I don't [TS]

00:25:38   suppose you have any but interesting [TS]

00:25:40   thoughts on it now [TS]

00:25:41   not really i mean i don't really care [TS]

00:25:44   what the difference there is I want what [TS]

00:25:45   I want if Apple's not gonna provide [TS]

00:25:47   anybody yell about it [TS]

00:25:48   yeah no I mean it's true i must say you [TS]

00:25:50   don't you understand why i think it's [TS]

00:25:52   interesting too because i am interested [TS]

00:25:53   in whether it's the most difficult to be [TS]

00:25:56   objective about something [TS]

00:25:58   that did you know you care deeply about [TS]

00:26:00   but it makes you kind of an enemy of [TS]

00:26:03   progress if you know you know if the [TS]

00:26:07   whatever the the buggy whip sales [TS]

00:26:09   wherever it's like you know or skc was [TS]

00:26:11   saying the stick shift thing where if [TS]

00:26:14   you know are you are you using your [TS]

00:26:17   influence to actually stop the future [TS]

00:26:19   from coming or are you right and that's [TS]

00:26:21   not actually the future and really apple [TS]

00:26:23   just doing something dumb and I think it [TS]

00:26:24   makes a difference because i don't want [TS]

00:26:25   to to use all my power and influence and [TS]

00:26:29   arguing skills to try to hold back [TS]

00:26:31   progress right so i would like to know [TS]

00:26:33   if i am not that I'm not going to be [TS]

00:26:37   upset about it but I would like to know [TS]

00:26:38   if I am actually the enemy of progress [TS]

00:26:41   here by clinging to the idea of the [TS]

00:26:43   personal computer right and so I'm [TS]

00:26:46   interested in being able to determine [TS]

00:26:47   what the situation is now I i feel like [TS]

00:26:51   i'm not particularly strongly on either [TS]

00:26:54   side of this I I don't think this is for [TS]

00:26:56   me personally the situation and maybe [TS]

00:26:58   Marco doesn't care but i think it is I [TS]

00:27:01   think it's a thing worth considering for [TS]

00:27:03   all I'm not just for their you know [TS]

00:27:04   silly [TS]

00:27:05   yeah New York in the mac things but for [TS]

00:27:07   all things of this type especially as we [TS]

00:27:08   get older [TS]

00:27:09   very often what you really don't want is [TS]

00:27:12   for things to be different than the then [TS]

00:27:13   you're used to and it's very easy to [TS]

00:27:15   decide that your desire did not have [TS]

00:27:20   things change trumps everything else and [TS]

00:27:23   that's not you know i'm up i believe in [TS]

00:27:26   progress and I constantly want to make [TS]

00:27:29   sure that I am NOT slowly shifting to [TS]

00:27:32   the opposite side of progress because [TS]

00:27:34   when you see it from the outside you see [TS]

00:27:36   somebody who isn't an obvious enemy of [TS]

00:27:38   progress and doesn't realize it [TS]

00:27:39   it's a pitiable situation and I never [TS]

00:27:41   want to be in that situation [TS]

00:27:43   well you know i think it's it's somewhat [TS]

00:27:45   useful to look around to see like all [TS]

00:27:48   right I have these like opinions on how [TS]

00:27:52   the types of work that I do the types of [TS]

00:27:54   problems that i need to solve how these [TS]

00:27:56   things should or need to be done you [TS]

00:27:59   know obviously one of the biggest things [TS]

00:28:01   you could say is we'll look around other [TS]

00:28:02   people of similar problems are they [TS]

00:28:04   insisted on the same requirements are [TS]

00:28:06   days are they doing things that way or [TS]

00:28:09   did they move to something else [TS]

00:28:11   a long time ago [TS]

00:28:12   oh and you didn't and they are now get [TS]

00:28:14   along just fine without the like doing [TS]

00:28:17   the same kinds of things that you want [TS]

00:28:18   to do but in in in the new you know [TS]

00:28:21   quote progress way you know obviously [TS]

00:28:23   it's hard to make this apply to [TS]

00:28:26   everything and looking around you know [TS]

00:28:28   it's hard for people to have a lot of [TS]

00:28:30   good data on like you know what a lot of [TS]

00:28:32   people doing because you know mostly [TS]

00:28:33   just a little while I look around and I [TS]

00:28:35   see like the other people in my office [TS]

00:28:37   are doing this or my parents are doing [TS]

00:28:39   this or my kids are doing this or [TS]

00:28:40   whatever you could look at it you know [TS]

00:28:42   you have a few friends you can look at [TS]

00:28:44   but like most people have a pretty small [TS]

00:28:46   sample group they can draw from for that [TS]

00:28:48   kind of analysis but I think sometimes [TS]

00:28:50   that's enough [TS]

00:28:51   you know I i think if you if you can [TS]

00:28:53   look around you can see like am I the [TS]

00:28:55   last person doing this this way you know [TS]

00:28:58   like that then that's that's probably a [TS]

00:29:00   sign that you are on the wrong side of [TS]

00:29:01   things but if there's still like if the [TS]

00:29:04   way if what you are defending is still [TS]

00:29:07   done by what seems like the majority [TS]

00:29:11   people who do that kind of thing then [TS]

00:29:14   you might still be wrong like you know [TS]

00:29:16   you might be at the very beginning of a [TS]

00:29:17   wave and just everyone else hasn't [TS]

00:29:19   realized it yet either but chances are [TS]

00:29:21   you're probably at least a little bit [TS]

00:29:23   right [TS]

00:29:23   chances are that you know you're [TS]

00:29:24   probably on the right side of that at [TS]

00:29:26   least for now [TS]

00:29:27   you know it might be something that's [TS]

00:29:28   really forward-looking that everyone's [TS]

00:29:30   missing but that doesn't happen very [TS]

00:29:32   often [TS]

00:29:33   everyone thinks that happens a lot but [TS]

00:29:34   it doesn't happen very often in reality [TS]

00:29:36   I was actually having an interesting [TS]

00:29:39   conversation with a friend of mine [TS]

00:29:40   earlier earlier tonight about whether or [TS]

00:29:44   not [TS]

00:29:45   olee he said to me something I thought [TS]

00:29:48   was very interesting and he said the mac [TS]

00:29:52   or not the mac excuse me [TS]

00:29:53   desktop os's are solved problem and I [TS]

00:29:56   think he was being a little bit of [TS]

00:29:59   dramatics right word but he was kind of [TS]

00:30:01   playing up his point of view a little [TS]

00:30:02   bit right to make a point but he was [TS]

00:30:05   saying you know desktop OS is our solve [TS]

00:30:07   problems and and at first I was like [TS]

00:30:10   what's no God no what are you talking [TS]

00:30:12   about but as I thought about it I I [TS]

00:30:15   still disagree with him and again I [TS]

00:30:17   think he was just making a point to to [TS]

00:30:19   come play devil's advocate but [TS]

00:30:21   I understand where he's coming from in [TS]

00:30:23   that if you look at what we want from a [TS]

00:30:28   desktop OS and and he asked me that [TS]

00:30:30   actually in but I said to him was I just [TS]

00:30:33   wanted not to be ignored man like i just [TS]

00:30:35   want progress but if you look at it [TS]

00:30:37   there's been progress like Siri doesn't [TS]

00:30:41   really do anything for me on the desktop [TS]

00:30:42   but that's progress that's a big deal [TS]

00:30:44   and that's just a single data point but [TS]

00:30:47   it's an example of things that are [TS]

00:30:49   happening everyone has been a moaning [TS]

00:30:52   lately about how messages hasn't been [TS]

00:30:54   touched on Sierra that's just not right [TS]

00:30:57   like the the rich previews or how [TS]

00:31:00   rephrase it where for example you paste [TS]

00:31:02   a link to a tweet and you see the tweet [TS]

00:31:06   in in the messages window like granted i [TS]

00:31:09   wish i had sticker support in Sierra [TS]

00:31:11   like I totally do [TS]

00:31:13   I don't know that I would use it that [TS]

00:31:14   often but i just wish i had the support [TS]

00:31:15   for right but even something as are [TS]

00:31:19   arguably silly as rich previews and [TS]

00:31:23   messages makes a world of difference and [TS]

00:31:25   that's progress and so to me I think [TS]

00:31:28   just not even necessarily bringing iOS [TS]

00:31:31   and into mac OS but just having that [TS]

00:31:33   that that continued incremental [TS]

00:31:36   improvement that's all I really want [TS]

00:31:37   from a desktop OS right now into that in [TS]

00:31:40   my friends kind of write that in a large [TS]

00:31:43   way it's kind of a solved problem now [TS]

00:31:45   the next breath I'll tell you what is it [TS]

00:31:46   really a small problem with the touch [TS]

00:31:48   bar this is brand new paradigm that just [TS]

00:31:49   came out we don't really know what we're [TS]

00:31:50   doing with that so obviously this is a [TS]

00:31:52   very shaky argument but when you compare [TS]

00:31:55   that to iOS where there's plenty of work [TS]

00:31:59   left to be done certainly iOS is in many [TS]

00:32:03   ways the more interesting platform now [TS]

00:32:05   not necessarily saying interesting to me [TS]

00:32:07   i'm not saying interesting to everyone [TS]

00:32:09   because personally I still like the mac [TS]

00:32:11   i still prefer the mac we went over this [TS]

00:32:13   either last episode last episode before [TS]

00:32:15   but there's a lot more progress to be [TS]

00:32:17   made and I look at people like Ben [TS]

00:32:19   Brooks I look at the teaching and I look [TS]

00:32:22   at my curly and I see them doing [TS]

00:32:24   everything in their jobs or nearly [TS]

00:32:26   everything on iOS devices and I come to [TS]

00:32:30   kind of what John was saying a minute [TS]

00:32:32   ago and either one [TS]

00:32:33   that's telling everyone to get off there [TS]

00:32:35   get off my lawn like am I the one that's [TS]

00:32:36   really holding on to the past and I'm [TS]

00:32:39   not saying that is the case but I am [TS]

00:32:41   definitely wandering into more directly [TS]

00:32:43   answer Jon's question how do we know [TS]

00:32:45   which one of these it is i'm not sure [TS]

00:32:48   but right now i can tell you that it [TS]

00:32:52   seems to me like there are some pretty [TS]

00:32:56   direct ways to accomplish things on the [TS]

00:32:59   mac and i can think of a great example [TS]

00:33:02   of top my head but but there you can [TS]

00:33:04   accomplish a lot of things on the mac [TS]

00:33:05   directly where in iOS you need to like [TS]

00:33:09   daisy chain 7 different apps to make the [TS]

00:33:11   same operation happen and that doesn't [TS]

00:33:14   mean that iOS is wrong but to me as long [TS]

00:33:17   as that still the case as long as you [TS]

00:33:19   still have to write a custom workflow to [TS]

00:33:21   get something to happen in the workflow [TS]

00:33:23   app which by the way is truly [TS]

00:33:24   mind-boggling amazing but as long as [TS]

00:33:26   that's how you get things done like that [TS]

00:33:28   is the official way to get things done [TS]

00:33:30   on iOS I don't think that the mac is [TS]

00:33:33   dead quite yet and I mean I'm not even [TS]

00:33:36   talking about like writing code or [TS]

00:33:37   anything like that i'm just talking [TS]

00:33:38   about like general things that that [TS]

00:33:40   professionals do and you can define [TS]

00:33:42   professionals professional podcasters as [TS]

00:33:44   professional project managers as cmo's [TS]

00:33:47   whatever benbrook his title is I don't [TS]

00:33:48   even remember anymore but if they're [TS]

00:33:51   jumping through hoops in order to get [TS]

00:33:52   their work done even if they don't [TS]

00:33:54   necessarily feel like it's jumping [TS]

00:33:55   through hoops it's still daisy-chaining [TS]

00:33:57   a bunch of different steps together as [TS]

00:33:59   long as that's still a thing I don't [TS]

00:34:00   think the mac is dead but when that [TS]

00:34:02   stops being a thing or becomes even [TS]

00:34:04   easier to kind of daisy chain all these [TS]

00:34:06   things you're not writing custom [TS]

00:34:07   workflows because apps are supporting it [TS]

00:34:08   then I start to wonder maybe on the old [TS]

00:34:13   man here after all [TS]

00:34:14   well that this is why I think it's [TS]

00:34:15   important to me to really make these [TS]

00:34:18   these observational comparisons will [TS]

00:34:20   check out your conversations on people [TS]

00:34:23   who do the same kind of work that you do [TS]

00:34:25   right like you know people you mentioned [TS]

00:34:27   are podcasters and writers and the [TS]

00:34:32   podcasters also use macs to podcast with [TS]

00:34:35   not not all podcast but the ones you [TS]

00:34:37   mentioned and you know a writer can get [TS]

00:34:41   away with using iOS only or primarily a [TS]

00:34:44   lot more easily than a programmer can [TS]

00:34:45   day and you know so I i think it once [TS]

00:34:49   people like you know you and I all three [TS]

00:34:52   of us are all programmers once a whole [TS]

00:34:54   bunch of programmers dump their pcs and [TS]

00:34:57   macs and do everything to all of their [TS]

00:34:59   work on iOS then I think we have to [TS]

00:35:02   start looking okay you know this there's [TS]

00:35:04   a thing here we should we should [TS]

00:35:05   consider this we should pay attention to [TS]

00:35:07   this maybe we're wrong at that point but [TS]

00:35:10   until that happens which might never [TS]

00:35:12   come again I want to be very careful [TS]

00:35:15   here and how i phrase this like you know [TS]

00:35:17   you said like you know like you know [TS]

00:35:19   that the mac is dead and back is in debt [TS]

00:35:21   until this happens and a lot of people [TS]

00:35:22   you know that you phrase these things in [TS]

00:35:25   a way that presents them as an [TS]

00:35:26   inevitable future but i do want to i do [TS]

00:35:29   want to be clear here that when i talk [TS]

00:35:31   about this i'm not necessarily [TS]

00:35:33   considering this inevitable future the [TS]

00:35:36   future I mean you know obviously OS [TS]

00:35:38   eventually do die and and you know fall [TS]

00:35:41   out of favor and fall to use and [TS]

00:35:42   maintenance but I i am still not yet [TS]

00:35:45   convinced that the pc style operating [TS]

00:35:47   system is destined to to be you know [TS]

00:35:51   sideline and killed in favor of the [TS]

00:35:54   mobile style operating system within the [TS]

00:35:56   foreseeable future like eventually on a [TS]

00:35:58   different time scale might happen but [TS]

00:35:59   you know I i don't i don't see this as [TS]

00:36:01   like the obvious you know foretold [TS]

00:36:03   future that is that is certain to happen [TS]

00:36:05   but in any way I think you really have [TS]

00:36:08   to just look at like you know people who [TS]

00:36:10   do the kind of work you do and most of [TS]

00:36:12   the people who were talking about going [TS]

00:36:14   ios-only or iOS being the inevitable [TS]

00:36:16   future [TS]

00:36:17   most of these people are writers and [TS]

00:36:21   analysts and executives and that's fine [TS]

00:36:25   and there's a lot of people who who that [TS]

00:36:26   will be fine for but if you start [TS]

00:36:29   talking to people who do different kinds [TS]

00:36:30   of things their computers including [TS]

00:36:32   things that we all that all three of us [TS]

00:36:34   do then you start very quickly to hit [TS]

00:36:37   limits of like oh well you you kind of [TS]

00:36:38   can't do that on iOS yet or you that's [TS]

00:36:41   really difficult and clunky to do in iOS [TS]

00:36:43   I don't think you can look at a bunch of [TS]

00:36:44   people who professionally right as their [TS]

00:36:47   main job and and say like well they're [TS]

00:36:51   all using iPads therefore i should be [TS]

00:36:53   using an iPad you been you should be [TS]

00:36:55   more concerned if people who do the [TS]

00:36:57   kinds of things you do [TS]

00:36:59   like programming if they switch and [TS]

00:37:01   that's when you should pay attention [TS]

00:37:03   I I largely agree with you but I don't [TS]

00:37:06   think it's fair to classify federico [TS]

00:37:09   Mike and Brooks all is simply writers I [TS]

00:37:11   mean I think they're doing I didn't say [TS]

00:37:12   simply and I well that's important [TS]

00:37:16   ok it's not there it's a job that is [TS]

00:37:18   very amenable to iOS primary or iOS only [TS]

00:37:22   work and there are a lot of jobs which [TS]

00:37:24   is the case but there's a lot where it [TS]

00:37:27   isn't also yeah I guess my point is that [TS]

00:37:30   I I don't want to paint the image [TS]

00:37:31   because I can hear Mike Harley and [TS]

00:37:34   Federico screaming at us from the future [TS]

00:37:36   it's not all that is right you know [TS]

00:37:38   it'sit's there they're doing sometimes [TS]

00:37:41   relatively intense you know spreadsheet [TS]

00:37:43   working look at the the quarterly [TS]

00:37:45   earnings reports that federico to your [TS]

00:37:47   farts out in the span of like four [TS]

00:37:48   seconds because while the workflows it [TS]

00:37:50   he's built in and you know Mike it in in [TS]

00:37:53   in Stephen hacker you know building for [TS]

00:37:55   invoicing advertisers and doing all [TS]

00:37:58   sorts of like traditional business see [TS]

00:38:00   things so I i agree with you that that [TS]

00:38:04   it is mostly writer like things on the [TS]

00:38:07   surface but there's a lot more to it [TS]

00:38:09   when you start digging in [TS]

00:38:10   but that doesn't negate your point that [TS]

00:38:12   the these people with the exception [TS]

00:38:14   perhaps of Federico actually these [TS]

00:38:15   people are not developers they're not [TS]

00:38:17   writing code will accept federico honey [TS]

00:38:20   their devices in Federation a liar and a [TS]

00:38:22   lot of his yeah I I agree I agree but on [TS]

00:38:25   but yeah I it's not the sort of thing [TS]

00:38:28   that the three of us do but i don't want [TS]

00:38:29   to discount in summary as as legitimate [TS]

00:38:32   work that is more than just writing [TS]

00:38:34   prose on a piece of paper that's all it [TS]

00:38:36   no I never said legitimate or simple lie [TS]

00:38:38   I'm not sayin yeah i'm not i'm not [TS]

00:38:40   characterizing it this way it is [TS]

00:38:42   different software needs and different [TS]

00:38:44   with different things you need from your [TS]

00:38:45   computing devices and and and different [TS]

00:38:47   levels of of like flexibility and access [TS]

00:38:50   to things like files and inner inner [TS]

00:38:53   program communication and the [TS]

00:38:55   integration of lots of things within the [TS]

00:38:57   same data set like we did with [TS]

00:38:58   programming like that you know they're [TS]

00:39:00   there are certain traits witnesses to [TS]

00:39:02   both OS styles but again you know I i [TS]

00:39:05   think when people who do the kinds of [TS]

00:39:07   things you do are switching and mass [TS]

00:39:10   that's when to pay attention before that [TS]

00:39:12   happen [TS]

00:39:13   that unless that happens I I don't think [TS]

00:39:15   you need to be worried too much that you [TS]

00:39:18   are the dinosaur holding back progress [TS]

00:39:19   also it's quite impressive that john [TS]

00:39:22   thinks that we can hold back progress [TS]

00:39:23   but now i'm just saying like what are [TS]

00:39:26   you spending your time doing this is [TS]

00:39:27   that if you see somebody yelling yes [TS]

00:39:28   that even if they if they don't actually [TS]

00:39:30   do anything it does not it seems like [TS]

00:39:33   they're they're wasting their time and [TS]

00:39:34   it's a sad situation where they don't [TS]

00:39:36   realize that the world is passing by one [TS]

00:39:38   more item on this the that i think about [TS]

00:39:40   it sort of the second level version of [TS]

00:39:43   checking yourself which is more focused [TS]

00:39:46   on Apple the company and less focused on [TS]

00:39:49   whether what the future of computing is [TS]

00:39:54   and that is the question of whether it's [TS]

00:39:58   important for Apple to be in the the [TS]

00:40:03   personal computer market so even if you [TS]

00:40:05   see everything that Marco said that like [TS]

00:40:06   okay well people doing these types of [TS]

00:40:08   jobs still need pc or whatever is it the [TS]

00:40:11   best thing for the company called apple [TS]

00:40:13   does it need to be in the pc market and [TS]

00:40:16   that's where we talk about the goal they [TS]

00:40:17   need you know the max developer iOS what [TS]

00:40:19   they have a development environment [TS]

00:40:20   iPads well it's not the same blog could [TS]

00:40:23   you develop iOS applications on PCs like [TS]

00:40:24   that's the next question is even if you [TS]

00:40:27   stipulate pieces are going away anytime [TS]

00:40:29   soon [TS]

00:40:30   should Apple continue to sell pcs is the [TS]

00:40:33   mac only hang around for old times sake [TS]

00:40:37   and tradition and affection but it will [TS]

00:40:41   be better for the company to allow all [TS]

00:40:45   the people who develop for iOS to do so [TS]

00:40:47   on a platform that someone else [TS]

00:40:48   maintains and really is arguing for [TS]

00:40:52   Apple to say in the market really we're [TS]

00:40:55   just trying to like you know I mean we [TS]

00:40:56   made the argument of times like that [TS]

00:40:57   every every other alternative is worse [TS]

00:40:59   so we would be sad but it from the [TS]

00:41:02   perspective of Apple the company they [TS]

00:41:04   may say yes everyone we agree every [TS]

00:41:06   alternative is worse than the mac but [TS]

00:41:08   the mac is no longer worth the money for [TS]

00:41:10   us to invest in a rather than letting a [TS]

00:41:11   limp along with us never updating our [TS]

00:41:13   stuff and you being all mad about it why [TS]

00:41:15   don't we just get out of the business [TS]

00:41:16   same way we got out of printers and [TS]

00:41:18   Wi-Fi hubs and what [TS]

00:41:20   that also they're not in and won't that [TS]

00:41:22   be refreshing we can finally concentrate [TS]

00:41:24   on the thing we do best which is the [TS]

00:41:26   iphone with some ancillary iOS type [TS]

00:41:28   things and you blah blah blah [TS]

00:41:31   I i think you know obviously I disagree [TS]

00:41:33   with that everybody that's that's i [TS]

00:41:34   still keep it in mind as the second the [TS]

00:41:37   second possibility [TS]

00:41:38   the first being that you know that you [TS]

00:41:40   know we're on the wrong side of history [TS]

00:41:41   and the second is where the right side [TS]

00:41:42   of history but just because we love [TS]

00:41:45   apple just because it's the best that it [TS]

00:41:47   would actually be better for the company [TS]

00:41:48   Apple to get out of this business so I [TS]

00:41:50   could concentrate on the other stuff [TS]

00:41:51   which again I I don't buy but I still I [TS]

00:41:54   still entertain that as a thought [TS]

00:41:56   experiment that I that I revisit to make [TS]

00:41:58   sure that it's not the case because that [TS]

00:42:00   can sneak up on you to where you're like [TS]

00:42:01   you feel so strongly that you're right [TS]

00:42:02   that like look everybody who's editing [TS]

00:42:04   videos doing in a big powerful personal [TS]

00:42:06   computer [TS]

00:42:07   prosecutors can't go I'm a video editor [TS]

00:42:08   i need that video i look at all the [TS]

00:42:10   other people who are writing video and [TS]

00:42:11   no one's doing on an iPad clewd the [TS]

00:42:13   pieces of thing and then to make the [TS]

00:42:14   leap there for Apple needs to make a new [TS]

00:42:16   mac pro does Apple need to make an actor [TS]

00:42:18   or do you just need to switch to windows [TS]

00:42:20   and be sad my you know a bit because [TS]

00:42:22   again pros will use whatever they have [TS]

00:42:24   to use to get the job done and the more [TS]

00:42:26   like an appliance is the time on market [TS]

00:42:28   was talking about getting the surface to [TS]

00:42:29   do the more you use a computer like an [TS]

00:42:32   appliance to get your job done as a [TS]

00:42:34   professional the less tied you are [TS]

00:42:37   effectively if not emotionally to the [TS]

00:42:39   particular platform using so if you just [TS]

00:42:41   gonna be in Lightroom all day and the [TS]

00:42:42   surface to do is the best you know [TS]

00:42:44   dedicated lightroom appliance you go [TS]

00:42:46   into the office it down frame and all [TS]

00:42:48   you do is lightroom lightroom like them [TS]

00:42:49   all day long [TS]

00:42:50   maybe that is better than any solution [TS]

00:42:53   apple has to offer and maybe Apple [TS]

00:42:54   staying in that business is just [TS]

00:42:55   sometimes a mental thing that you care [TS]

00:42:56   about but realistically speaking we [TS]

00:42:58   would all be much happier of Apple got [TS]

00:42:59   out of it and stop making a line of [TS]

00:43:00   computers entirely and you just sat down [TS]

00:43:02   in front of your service to do and gave [TS]

00:43:03   that business to Microsoft some company [TS]

00:43:05   that that's actually interested in [TS]

00:43:06   pursuing it [TS]

00:43:08   yeah well as soon as apple tarts being [TS]

00:43:09   managed by the numbers that way they're [TS]

00:43:11   going to find themselves i think in in a [TS]

00:43:15   very boring and slowly declining place [TS]

00:43:18   with numbers suggest so or not that is a [TS]

00:43:20   very very fast way to become microsoft [TS]

00:43:22   with under steve ballmer I'm not like [TS]

00:43:24   that's you know that there was this [TS]

00:43:26   wonderful Steve Jobs video that flutter [TS]

00:43:29   and read a couple weeks ago about how [TS]

00:43:31   like [TS]

00:43:32   you know it took like five it takes like [TS]

00:43:33   five years to realize that when the bit [TS]

00:43:35   flips and you start like make computers [TS]

00:43:38   just to make money and not to make [TS]

00:43:39   better computers or something like that [TS]

00:43:41   i'm probably butchering it but he also [TS]

00:43:43   said he would milk the mac for all tours [TS]

00:43:44   and move on to the next big thing and [TS]

00:43:45   guess what [TS]

00:43:46   the mac is it's not like an analogy he [TS]

00:43:48   was talking about specifically the Mac [TS]

00:43:49   the Mac we're talking about now [TS]

00:43:51   no good for all it's worth we want the [TS]

00:43:52   next thing is clearly thought the next [TS]

00:43:53   thing was the iPhone the iPad and it's [TS]

00:43:56   pretty clear the next thing is the [TS]

00:43:57   iphone that but we're still making mac [TS]

00:43:59   so in some ways it would be like [TS]

00:44:00   pursuing your passion not continuing to [TS]

00:44:03   make the back just because you've always [TS]

00:44:04   made it if the company itself is [TS]

00:44:05   enthusiastic about iOS devices only then [TS]

00:44:08   continuing to make max in a [TS]

00:44:10   disappointing way you know it's not as [TS]

00:44:12   if I were you just going to go if you're [TS]

00:44:14   going to go by the numbers that i should [TS]

00:44:16   go where the big business but maybe that [TS]

00:44:17   maybe the passion just not doing it [TS]

00:44:18   anymore for the max maybe they see it as [TS]

00:44:20   a declining business they're not [TS]

00:44:21   interested in and isn't it better for [TS]

00:44:24   all of us to divorce this dysfunctional [TS]

00:44:26   relationship stop making the mac force [TS]

00:44:28   everybody to go windows which will or [TS]

00:44:30   whatever which will force more money [TS]

00:44:32   into that market that will hopefully [TS]

00:44:33   motivate microsoft to make the surface [TS]

00:44:34   to do better you know I'm am not [TS]

00:44:36   recommending any of this just because [TS]

00:44:38   you're all thought experiments and all [TS]

00:44:39   things that I revisit every visit mostly [TS]

00:44:41   reject but if you never revisit them [TS]

00:44:42   you'll they'll sneak up on you [TS]

00:44:45   well but here's the problem with [TS]

00:44:46   thinking so you start running the [TS]

00:44:49   company by the numbers and you think [TS]

00:44:52   well it'll be fine will you no will will [TS]

00:44:54   let the mac languages will kill it [TS]

00:44:55   because it's not you know it's not what [TS]

00:44:57   we want to go or whatever whatever the [TS]

00:44:59   reason doesn't matter but it's not about [TS]

00:45:00   the numbers they're not passionate about [TS]

00:45:01   is the past in there they're passionate [TS]

00:45:03   about the future so they're running it [TS]

00:45:04   by their passion they're not they're not [TS]

00:45:06   being a slave to the past they're saying [TS]

00:45:07   what we're interested in is I don't [TS]

00:45:09   maybe interested in AR or whatever but [TS]

00:45:11   you know that maybe they're not [TS]

00:45:12   interested in the mac anymore so I've [TS]

00:45:13   ever since the opposite of running about [TS]

00:45:15   that because the numbers would tell you [TS]

00:45:16   why throw away 22 billion dollar [TS]

00:45:17   business right [TS]

00:45:18   there's just this free money why you [TS]

00:45:20   throwing it away say we're throwing it [TS]

00:45:21   away so we can concentrate more fully on [TS]

00:45:23   the thing that we really believe in the [TS]

00:45:24   future which is the opposite of steve [TS]

00:45:26   ballmer steve ballmer will keep the mac [TS]

00:45:27   going forever and just do exactly what [TS]

00:45:29   the customers wanted forever and ever [TS]

00:45:31   as the rest of the world moves on you [TS]

00:45:33   know I mean I feel like that's more of [TS]

00:45:34   the steve ballmer your Apple would [TS]

00:45:35   definitely not keep some same products [TS]

00:45:37   forever [TS]

00:45:38   no I mean like I don't like I you know [TS]

00:45:40   of cell of trying to do with that market [TS]

00:45:42   wants exactly like they would be giving [TS]

00:45:44   us Big Macs with lots of [TS]

00:45:45   ports and you know constantly revising [TS]

00:45:47   them and just SAT like making them [TS]

00:45:50   satisfied in the way to like you know [TS]

00:45:51   IBM mainframe customers are satisfied [TS]

00:45:53   the IBM will continue to make mainframes [TS]

00:45:55   for its mainframe customers and give [TS]

00:45:56   them exactly what they want all the [TS]

00:45:58   while the whole rest of the movie world [TS]

00:46:00   is moving on from mainframes but they [TS]

00:46:02   don't know they're like it's fine you [TS]

00:46:03   know they keep making us better and [TS]

00:46:04   better mainframes and we love mainframes [TS]

00:46:05   and they wake up one day and the entire [TS]

00:46:07   world has moved on like wait there's [TS]

00:46:09   only like 10 of us left but we were so [TS]

00:46:11   happy for all these years and and we're [TS]

00:46:13   happy to give IBM all this money and [TS]

00:46:14   they kept making these also made for [TS]

00:46:15   insurance and the world has moved on [TS]

00:46:17   past right so that I feel like that's [TS]

00:46:19   more of a bomber thing fair but [TS]

00:46:22   everything you're saying about the mac [TS]

00:46:26   what happens when they apply that exact [TS]

00:46:29   same logic to the iphone but they can I [TS]

00:46:33   mean if there are no longer passionate [TS]

00:46:35   about the iphone and they think the next [TS]

00:46:36   big thing is something else you know [TS]

00:46:38   then they should like it's it's exactly [TS]

00:46:40   the same thing Steve Steve Jobs saying [TS]

00:46:41   like milk the mac for alternate move on [TS]

00:46:43   to the next big thing eventually its [TS]

00:46:45   milk the iphone fall to earth move on to [TS]

00:46:46   the next big thing because if you don't [TS]

00:46:47   someone else will like someone else [TS]

00:46:49   where your lunch if you don't need [TS]

00:46:50   another cannibalizing your business [TS]

00:46:52   Apple's the window cannibalized its own [TS]

00:46:53   ipods appleton cannibalize ipod sales [TS]

00:46:56   the sales curve for ipods look like the [TS]

00:46:58   same big hump with spikes on it for the [TS]

00:47:00   holidays [TS]

00:47:00   it would look exactly the same but [TS]

00:47:02   someone else would have replaced it [TS]

00:47:04   whether it's samsung or Microsoft or [TS]

00:47:05   whoever whoever would have won that war [TS]

00:47:07   if Apple can cannibalize the ipod [TS]

00:47:09   someone else would so it's not like [TS]

00:47:10   Apple bank the company on the ipod said [TS]

00:47:13   it's going to be ipod forever and the [TS]

00:47:14   American people were saying the ipod is [TS]

00:47:15   going to go off the mac and now Apple is [TS]

00:47:17   just an ipod company and the apple store [TS]

00:47:18   is the ipod store right [TS]

00:47:20   Apple's the one cannibalize the ipod it [TS]

00:47:22   turns out the ipod ark was obviously [TS]

00:47:24   shorter than we think the iphone arc is [TS]

00:47:26   going to be the iphone our cholesterol [TS]

00:47:27   lives for all we know right or longer [TS]

00:47:29   but that's that's the challenging of the [TS]

00:47:32   innovators dilemma and all that other [TS]

00:47:33   crap that's the challenge of business [TS]

00:47:35   and the mac in all these grasses this [TS]

00:47:38   aberration that never goes up and never [TS]

00:47:39   goes down it just keeps on trucking and [TS]

00:47:42   I think they're you know I'm again i'm [TS]

00:47:44   not i'm playing devil's advocate [TS]

00:47:45   everything this year [TS]

00:47:46   these are things that are worth thinking [TS]

00:47:47   about I don't find them convincing if I [TS]

00:47:49   had to make the argument I would say [TS]

00:47:51   Apple needs to continue making the mac [TS]

00:47:52   and should do much better job at it [TS]

00:47:53   because the time is not complex i'm [TS]

00:47:55   mostly [TS]

00:47:56   I'm on the same page marker like other [TS]

00:47:59   people who are doing these tasks are not [TS]

00:48:01   currently using anything that's not like [TS]

00:48:04   a pc that using PC's to do them like [TS]

00:48:06   they're not using surface tablets are [TS]

00:48:08   not using this point is still using [TS]

00:48:10   surface to do that they're using PC's [TS]

00:48:12   with the windows pcs or unix [TS]

00:48:14   workstations running Maya or or max [TS]

00:48:17   they're just not using iPads to do these [TS]

00:48:19   jobs right and that's I think that is [TS]

00:48:22   you know but market and doing homework [TS]

00:48:23   but he came up with their pretty [TS]

00:48:25   reasonable last-minute scrambling all [TS]

00:48:27   the teachers come around and collecting [TS]

00:48:29   the papers how I got through school [TS]

00:48:31   yeah i think that is a thing to look for [TS]

00:48:34   and you have to be careful because if [TS]

00:48:35   you're just looking at the people who [TS]

00:48:36   are like hanging out in the same circles [TS]

00:48:38   as you then it's all like sort of [TS]

00:48:39   self-selecting like we'll all my friends [TS]

00:48:40   still use pcs but maybe every kid [TS]

00:48:43   graduating school is doing you know like [TS]

00:48:45   for example digital video like every kid [TS]

00:48:47   graduating film school is shooting [TS]

00:48:49   digital video and editing digibeta [TS]

00:48:50   you're like well my friends are still [TS]

00:48:52   shooting on film so films never gonna [TS]

00:48:53   die you're you're being blind you're [TS]

00:48:55   missing it right but I think in this [TS]

00:48:57   case for the jobs were talking about [TS]

00:48:59   certainly programming because I think we [TS]

00:49:00   have a good view on that [TS]

00:49:01   not just for iOS and mac program which [TS]

00:49:03   in all realms that serious programming [TS]

00:49:06   is still done in pc-style devices video [TS]

00:49:08   editing for the most part is still done [TS]

00:49:10   pc-style devices but you gotta want to [TS]

00:49:11   watch the kids watch the kids coming in [TS]

00:49:13   from school are there edit our the [TS]

00:49:14   editing the film school project on an [TS]

00:49:17   iPad or on a surface studio are on [TS]

00:49:20   anything like that you know that's the [TS]

00:49:22   sort of like the leading indicator and [TS]

00:49:23   that's the thing to watch for I i think [TS]

00:49:25   right now the answer is that [TS]

00:49:26   pc-style computers are still think to do [TS]

00:49:29   my big fear is that Apple decides that [TS]

00:49:31   it's not worth them being in the [TS]

00:49:32   business I don't particularly have a [TS]

00:49:33   fear fear that in the near future the pc [TS]

00:49:36   style of computing is going to go away [TS]

00:49:37   I have a fear isn't the Apple personal [TS]

00:49:40   computer meaning the mac is going to go [TS]

00:49:43   away because apple doesn't care about or [TS]

00:49:44   neglected to the point and that's the [TS]

00:49:46   worst-case scenario where you still have [TS]

00:49:47   to use a pc but you don't longer get to [TS]

00:49:50   choose the mac because it's you know [TS]

00:49:52   it's no longer any good for you that's [TS]

00:49:53   when i switch to linux god help us all a [TS]

00:49:56   quick side note about that though John I [TS]

00:50:00   had some co-workers at the last gig that [TS]

00:50:02   did use surface tablets to do their work [TS]

00:50:06   like to write code to do their work to [TS]

00:50:09   do have that was their complete [TS]

00:50:10   they're only couple of them in and I [TS]

00:50:11   think by and large they kind of [TS]

00:50:13   regretted their decision but in that [TS]

00:50:15   sense it is happening that is the thing [TS]

00:50:17   that happens from time that i recall [TS]

00:50:19   that I keep putting the surface and [TS]

00:50:21   around thinking more of like using the [TS]

00:50:22   touch interface to the surface devices [TS]

00:50:24   even more the surface studio where your [TS]

00:50:25   where you are touching the screen that [TS]

00:50:27   amaze respects the surface books and all [TS]

00:50:29   that stuff [TS]

00:50:30   they're just a convertible laptop like [TS]

00:50:31   it's modeled by the fact that that [TS]

00:50:33   Windows is this unified platform but [TS]

00:50:36   yeah I have people work to do [TS]

00:50:37   programming stuff on services to but [TS]

00:50:39   it's just a laptop is it at that point [TS]

00:50:41   it's like a weird laptop with a bendy [TS]

00:50:43   hinge and it's running windows and [TS]

00:50:45   they're running terminal stuff and they [TS]

00:50:46   have a keyboard and they have a trackpad [TS]

00:50:48   pointing device and they also have a pen [TS]

00:50:50   you can kind of be a tablet but [TS]

00:50:52   essentially they're using a laptop like [TS]

00:50:53   they have they have windows with with [TS]

00:50:55   title bars and scroll bars like it's i [TS]

00:50:58   pay you know it it's confusing because [TS]

00:51:00   of the way Microsoft has done its [TS]

00:51:02   unified us strategy but i would still [TS]

00:51:03   totally classify was as pc-style because [TS]

00:51:06   it's it is very distinct from the iOS [TS]

00:51:08   style even when i see my daughter she's [TS]

00:51:10   getting a keyboard logitech keyboard [TS]

00:51:11   thing for I bet he when she does you [TS]

00:51:14   know form of laptop with her you know [TS]

00:51:16   that's one twin Soria you guys miss that [TS]

00:51:18   show anyway right but she makes a little [TS]

00:51:21   laptop out of her iPad and our keyboard [TS]

00:51:24   there's no it's still not a laptop [TS]

00:51:27   yes it looks like one yes there's a kind [TS]

00:51:29   of a vertical screen and horizontal ish [TS]

00:51:31   keyboard but there's no point on her [TS]

00:51:33   screen she's not using a trackpad there [TS]

00:51:35   are no windows there are no scroll bars [TS]

00:51:37   and scroll thumbs is no menu bar along [TS]

00:51:38   the top of it is not a pc computing [TS]

00:51:40   experience she's not you know like it [TS]

00:51:43   its yeah we we live in a strange time we [TS]

00:51:46   live in a strange transitional time but [TS]

00:51:47   some things defy categorization but i [TS]

00:51:50   think the salient points like what makes [TS]

00:51:53   it a pc what makes it a pc style [TS]

00:51:55   computing environment are pretty clear [TS]

00:51:58   for me obviously it's all about windows [TS]

00:51:59   because what the hell imagine if the 28 [TS]

00:52:03   inch surface studio did not have windows [TS]

00:52:06   like everything was full screen or split [TS]

00:52:09   screen like it doesn't the ipad we would [TS]

00:52:11   say this is the biggest waste of a 28 [TS]

00:52:13   inch screen in the world unless you're [TS]

00:52:14   only ever in one app doing like more [TS]

00:52:16   time than fine but for a general-purpose [TS]

00:52:18   computing device getting back to Marco's [TS]

00:52:20   idea that you can do more than one thing [TS]

00:52:22   at a time [TS]

00:52:22   a general-purpose computing device that [TS]

00:52:25   can only show apps in full screen on a [TS]

00:52:27   20 inch display is just a very wrong [TS]

00:52:29   headed idea and i would say that's not [TS]

00:52:31   pc computer that's more like iOS here's [TS]

00:52:34   a question where it in what products is [TS]

00:52:37   Apple really like stepping on the gas [TS]

00:52:39   and really firing on all cylinders [TS]

00:52:41   earpods I know it's not the valid answer [TS]

00:52:44   in this context but I cannot stop [TS]

00:52:48   talking about how much i love my ear [TS]

00:52:49   pods i would say the iphone i mean i [TS]

00:52:52   know i think the last show recently [TS]

00:52:53   listened to it so it's fresh in my mind [TS]

00:52:55   marker said like all the new iphone 7 [TS]

00:52:57   like internally the changes aren't that [TS]

00:52:59   big like look at the graphs man like [TS]

00:53:01   every part of this every part of this [TS]

00:53:02   that can be better computing wise and [TS]

00:53:05   capacity wise is better by leaps and [TS]

00:53:08   bounds by like nineties error pc leaps [TS]

00:53:11   and bounds like it's not that the state [TS]

00:53:12   the cpu is not just a little bit faster [TS]

00:53:14   the GPU is not just a little bit faster [TS]

00:53:15   than the flash capacities like Max's [TS]

00:53:18   would you know that double like you can [TS]

00:53:19   only get 1 28 last year 9250 sexes it's [TS]

00:53:23   fantastically better internal in it you [TS]

00:53:26   know the only thing that's not you know [TS]

00:53:29   better about a bio they're not stand [TS]

00:53:31   against like oh the case is the same [TS]

00:53:32   shape and even there they did you know [TS]

00:53:34   they changed the surface in such a way [TS]

00:53:35   that Marcos universe saying is his [TS]

00:53:37   favorite product of last year because it [TS]

00:53:40   made such a difference in in day-to-day [TS]

00:53:41   use so I i still think iphone is is you [TS]

00:53:46   know pedal to the metal and their pods [TS]

00:53:47   are part of that are part of their weird [TS]

00:53:48   headphone thing which by the way has [TS]

00:53:50   bitten me I don't have a USBC laptop but [TS]

00:53:52   I've been bitten by the the headphones [TS]

00:53:54   thing like five times recently where I [TS]

00:53:57   thought I had everything I needed [TS]

00:53:59   I was going to plug a headphone in and [TS]

00:54:00   realized even on the plane coming back I [TS]

00:54:03   brought the adapter for me to use my [TS]

00:54:04   noise-canceling headphones but then my [TS]

00:54:05   daughter wanted to use some headphones [TS]

00:54:08   to and plug-in it's like out well I only [TS]

00:54:09   have one of that they're like you always [TS]

00:54:12   you always think you have everything you [TS]

00:54:13   need but here just used oh nevermind or [TS]

00:54:16   gone on a car trip and you know before [TS]

00:54:18   yeah we're going to plug in my wife's [TS]

00:54:20   old car she just had walks in with like [TS]

00:54:22   a headphone port and I brought my ipod [TS]

00:54:23   with me or my phone with me and we can [TS]

00:54:26   listen to like the podcast that I'm in [TS]

00:54:27   the middle of and we get in the car and [TS]

00:54:29   start driving away and I grabbed a [TS]

00:54:30   little aux cord from the center console [TS]

00:54:32   and pick it up ago [TS]

00:54:33   no this happens there's no place i can [TS]

00:54:35   plug that into my phone and of course [TS]

00:54:37   not carrying adapter around with me so [TS]

00:54:40   yeah the struggle is realized they say [TS]

00:54:42   response this week by Casper and [TS]

00:54:46   obsessively engineer mattress at a [TS]

00:54:47   shockingly fair price [TS]

00:54:49   go to Casper calm / ATP and use code ATP [TS]

00:54:53   for fifty dollars towards your mattress [TS]

00:54:55   Casper created one perfect mattress sold [TS]

00:54:58   directly to consumers eliminating [TS]

00:55:00   Commission driven inflated prices the [TS]

00:55:02   award-winning caster mattress was [TS]

00:55:04   developed in house with a sleek design [TS]

00:55:06   has delivered a remarkably small box you [TS]

00:55:09   can get it up narrow stairs if you need [TS]

00:55:10   to and also in addition to the mattress [TS]

00:55:12   Casper also now offers an adaptive [TS]

00:55:14   pillow and soft breathable sheets the [TS]

00:55:17   mattress industry is for consumers and [TS]

00:55:18   the payment Horace lehigh markups cancer [TS]

00:55:21   revolutionize the industry by cutting [TS]

00:55:22   the cost of dealing with resellers and [TS]

00:55:24   pass that savings directly on to you [TS]

00:55:27   the in-house team of engineers spent [TS]

00:55:28   thousands of hours developing the [TS]

00:55:30   catcher mattress it contains supportive [TS]

00:55:32   memory foams for a sleep surface with [TS]

00:55:34   just the right sink and just the right [TS]

00:55:36   balance and it's breathable design sleep [TS]

00:55:38   school to help you regular temperature [TS]

00:55:40   throughout the night and also casts were [TS]

00:55:42   made buying mattresses online easy and [TS]

00:55:45   completely risk-free mean it sounds [TS]

00:55:46   crazy a mattress online but they offer [TS]

00:55:48   free delivery and free returns with a [TS]

00:55:51   hundred knight home trial period so [TS]

00:55:53   here's how this works you can just buy [TS]

00:55:55   the mattress just take the risk because [TS]

00:55:57   if you don't love it within a hundred [TS]

00:55:59   Knights just call them up and they will [TS]

00:56:01   arrange a pickup at your house and give [TS]

00:56:03   you a full refund no questions asked [TS]

00:56:06   they understand the importance of truly [TS]

00:56:08   sleeping on a mattress before you can [TS]

00:56:10   make it you know you're gonna be [TS]

00:56:11   spending a third of your life on it [TS]

00:56:13   we've heard from friends and listeners [TS]

00:56:15   who all have great things to say about [TS]

00:56:17   casper mattresses and time as he named [TS]

00:56:19   it one of the best inventions 2015 so [TS]

00:56:21   check it out today [TS]

00:56:22   get your cast for mattress try it for a [TS]

00:56:25   hundred Knights in your home risk-free [TS]

00:56:27   free delivery free returns with home [TS]

00:56:29   pick up go to Casper calm / ATP to see [TS]

00:56:33   for yourself [TS]

00:56:34   Casper calm / ATP and use code ATP for [TS]

00:56:37   fifty dollars towards your mattress [TS]

00:56:39   terms and conditions to apply [TS]

00:56:41   thank you very much to Casper for [TS]

00:56:42   sponsoring our show [TS]

00:56:44   alright final bit of follow-up speaking [TS]

00:56:49   of cars so I'll up our own son well the [TS]

00:56:52   this is one of those episodes were [TS]

00:56:53   follow-up isn't exactly follow up which [TS]

00:56:55   is probably the most episodes anyway [TS]

00:56:58   sammobile submit who is co-host of the [TS]

00:57:00   wheel bearings podcast which if you ever [TS]

00:57:02   wanted neutral but with people who [TS]

00:57:05   actually knew what they were talking [TS]

00:57:05   about you should look up wheelbarrow [TS]

00:57:07   that's because anyway he writes into say [TS]

00:57:10   the 2016-2017 model your courts do [TS]

00:57:12   indeed support both carplay and android [TS]

00:57:14   auto as do most new hondas the only [TS]

00:57:17   hundreds that are still waiting for [TS]

00:57:18   android auto and car play update our the [TS]

00:57:20   fit in the HRV i'm not sure what that is [TS]

00:57:22   I know the crv even with HIV don't know [TS]

00:57:24   what the HRV is then be glad it's [TS]

00:57:26   terrible but anyway the 2018 odyssey's [TS]

00:57:29   debuting in a couple of weeks of Detroit [TS]

00:57:31   at the detroit auto show so that makes [TS]

00:57:34   me think the team is car does indeed [TS]

00:57:36   have carplay doesn't not so here's [TS]

00:57:39   here's the question [TS]

00:57:40   I've never used carpet I've seen [TS]

00:57:42   pictures of it online and I think I [TS]

00:57:45   didn't seem like screenshots of like [TS]

00:57:46   Marcos carplay stuff and I've seen [TS]

00:57:49   marcos disembodied car playtesting [TS]

00:57:51   what's happening right but I don't know [TS]

00:57:55   how carplay works do I have to download [TS]

00:57:56   an app onto my phone called car plant [TS]

00:57:58   know so I just you think of I just plug [TS]

00:58:01   the phone into my wife's car with a wire [TS]

00:58:03   because we don't have the wireless [TS]

00:58:04   version that something will happen on [TS]

00:58:06   the screen to indicate you are in car [TS]

00:58:09   plane now apparently if you just plug it [TS]

00:58:12   in there will be one of those alerts [TS]

00:58:14   like a computer where it says do you [TS]

00:58:15   trust this car or something like that [TS]

00:58:17   and then magic happens now I've got [TS]

00:58:19   witnesses myself this is real-time [TS]

00:58:21   follow-up but that's what I'm being told [TS]

00:58:22   you I trust this car [TS]

00:58:25   yeah last time Taylor was saying that [TS]

00:58:26   was only on certain trim levels at [TS]

00:58:28   bottom line is like the schrödinger's [TS]

00:58:30   cat of car place for it until I actually [TS]

00:58:33   try it [TS]

00:58:33   her car both has carplay support and [TS]

00:58:35   doesn't have car place support but [TS]

00:58:37   seriously i do i had not occurred to me [TS]

00:58:39   to think like do I have to download it [TS]

00:58:41   happen once i download the app do i do a [TS]

00:58:43   thing or is it just plug it in and I [TS]

00:58:45   think basically we've never actually [TS]

00:58:48   plugged any of our iphones into her car [TS]

00:58:50   because it's all been bluetooth so it [TS]

00:58:51   could be that the that's holy right mr. [TS]

00:58:53   plug it in [TS]

00:58:54   John how do you not know this already [TS]

00:58:56   I'll be the first thing i tried I've [TS]

00:58:58   driven that car onto and off of the [TS]

00:59:01   driveway like twice that's how far i've [TS]

00:59:02   driven my car [TS]

00:59:03   why don't you just go outside right now [TS]

00:59:05   and give it a shot I'm going to do not [TS]

00:59:07   i'm really not gonna take one just go [TS]

00:59:10   give it what it will take to long it'll [TS]

00:59:11   take just a minute all right out I'll be [TS]

00:59:14   back [TS]

00:59:14   hang on so literally as I'm saying this [TS]

00:59:18   tina is sending the attacks saying that [TS]

00:59:20   it is not a thing [TS]

00:59:22   hold on i'm looking up the this hrv its [TS]

00:59:27   kind it looks basically like the honda [TS]

00:59:29   x1 ok i was standard on a core TX excel [TS]

00:59:34   in touring but I think she doesn't have [TS]

00:59:36   the exo i think is optional for her trim [TS]

00:59:37   it was just not there was an optional [TS]

00:59:40   says that's we don't have that I don't [TS]

00:59:42   know what is what is it honda USA heat [TS]

00:59:46   that it whenever you go to like Honda or [TS]

00:59:47   Audi or whatever it's the corporate this [TS]

00:59:50   is the most American thing I think I've [TS]

00:59:51   ever said why does not go to high did [TS]

00:59:53   not go directly to America it's just [TS]

00:59:56   like in in the country list drop-down [TS]

00:59:58   why are we not the first time listed [TS]

00:59:59   like [TS]

00:59:59   like [TS]

01:00:00   and no applicant really this is barbaric [TS]

01:00:02   do I really have to scroll look at how [TS]

01:00:03   likely is that I'm actually from like [TS]

01:00:05   you know any of these other places like [TS]

01:00:07   just put the put the US on top for the [TS]

01:00:09   stupid arrogant Americans and everything [TS]

01:00:11   else below if I i am fully behind this [TS]

01:00:14   tina saying there was no option its she [TS]

01:00:18   does not have any exits sports special [TS]

01:00:20   it was not an option there's basically [TS]

01:00:21   no options period anyway my guest John [TS]

01:00:24   outside in the cold in the winter for no [TS]

01:00:25   reason know what I'm sure he won't be [TS]

01:00:29   mad but I'm never getting yelled at by [TS]

01:00:33   tina that nobody wants to believe her [TS]

01:00:35   I can't believe you Tina just wanted to [TS]

01:00:36   send right outside that too but this [TS]

01:00:38   basically every conversation I've had [TS]

01:00:40   with aaron ever go there and tells me [TS]

01:00:42   this is not a thing or this is a thing [TS]

01:00:44   now you've got to be wrong it turns out [TS]

01:00:46   you're right [TS]

01:00:48   every conversation I've ever had with [TS]

01:00:50   Aaron yeah I believe we have words for [TS]

01:00:52   this one of the more charitable one's [TS]

01:00:55   probably means mansplaining the magic of [TS]

01:00:57   Technology ya meri jaan here is what [TS]

01:01:01   happened so i go to the car and I get [TS]

01:01:04   all my stuff my cables and everything [TS]

01:01:05   and I I plug you know get the car turned [TS]

01:01:08   on i plug the thing in a way to see [TS]

01:01:10   something pop up on my phone screen [TS]

01:01:13   nothing ever pops up with a couple [TS]

01:01:15   seconds and here you two talking about [TS]

01:01:18   what I'm doing right now is going to you [TS]

01:01:21   tomorrow with your trainer and the the [TS]

01:01:23   honda website and stuff like that [TS]

01:01:24   because Venus phone popped on right to [TS]

01:01:27   the tina upstairs on bluetooth and the [TS]

01:01:31   car is paired with her from him so start [TS]

01:01:34   over for a second like what the world is [TS]

01:01:37   going good so obviously the magic of [TS]

01:01:40   Bluetooth anyway my result of the short [TS]

01:01:43   experiment was that plugging in the [TS]

01:01:44   phone does nothing I was not prompted to [TS]

01:01:46   do anything I couldn't find anything in [TS]

01:01:48   any the menus that mentioned car player [TS]

01:01:50   anything about carpet I could connect my [TS]

01:01:51   phone by bluetooth but that's not carpet [TS]

01:01:53   works it's not a bluetooth audio things [TS]

01:01:56   so inconclusive results but at the very [TS]

01:01:58   least merely playing my phone in did [TS]

01:02:01   nothing while you were gone i'm pretty [TS]

01:02:03   sure we found out that your wife is [TS]

01:02:04   right the whole time and you didn't need [TS]

01:02:06   to go outside [TS]

01:02:07   that's thanks Sam guy on the car park [TS]

01:02:13   cast who knows something supposedly your [TS]

01:02:15   wife knows better [TS]

01:02:16   oh I'm sure we'll get some feedback on [TS]

01:02:18   this one amazingly sometimes we don't [TS]

01:02:19   know what we're talking about [TS]

01:02:21   he really did and this is why we should [TS]

01:02:24   do a car show kids this is that people [TS]

01:02:27   love when you don't know what you're [TS]

01:02:28   talking about you do a car podcast [TS]

01:02:30   people really like that they think it's [TS]

01:02:32   not i reject this characterization i [TS]

01:02:34   know a lot about what i was talking [TS]

01:02:37   about you to keep saying that about [TS]

01:02:38   yourselves but I reject that good [TS]

01:02:42   this is this episode of speaking is [TS]

01:02:44   turning turning a to be quite good I [TS]

01:02:46   thought we could have like no structure [TS]

01:02:48   this week there's no I mean ready to [TS]

01:02:49   follow up with all those items religion [TS]

01:02:51   follow-up haha doing homework and it man [TS]

01:02:57   they went long sometimes salt goes long [TS]

01:02:59   but you know that tends to happen after [TS]

01:03:01   lots of stuff builds up and we haven't [TS]

01:03:03   recorded for awhile problem the [TS]

01:03:05   problematic part we have here is as we [TS]

01:03:07   transition to topics go look what's [TS]

01:03:09   lurking there and look at the notes very [TS]

01:03:11   first item who put that in there who is [TS]

01:03:13   actually on the Casey did you have done [TS]

01:03:14   there [TS]

01:03:15   yes I don't think I want to talk about [TS]

01:03:16   that right it's just like it's the same [TS]

01:03:18   thing we've been talking about for the [TS]

01:03:19   last month on the show I don't feel like [TS]

01:03:20   is that like I read what parts of the [TS]

01:03:22   article going but stopped before [TS]

01:03:24   yeah you deleted it but I've got here is [TS]

01:03:27   there anything in that article that is [TS]

01:03:29   not something that we've already talked [TS]

01:03:30   about that's my only question [TS]

01:03:32   no probably not so the article in [TS]

01:03:33   question the hopefully will cut this [TS]

01:03:35   from the show for the article now we're [TS]

01:03:36   talking about [TS]

01:03:37   yeah Chuck Vandross patch arrived [TS]

01:03:39   probably pronounced that wrong I [TS]

01:03:41   apologize but anyway his apple 2016 year [TS]

01:03:44   in review which tldr something suck some [TS]

01:03:48   things don't but it's a great post it is [TS]

01:03:51   yeah I mean it's good it's a totally [TS]

01:03:53   good you know that he's expressing in a [TS]

01:03:55   much more succinct way the the his [TS]

01:03:57   position on the issue is not necessarily [TS]

01:04:00   the word how to use its value is more [TS]

01:04:02   succinct in like hours and hours of [TS]

01:04:03   audio but like you know where we're both [TS]

01:04:05   were wrong Mac fans and we're all kind [TS]

01:04:08   of experiencing some dissatisfaction [TS]

01:04:09   with the treatment of the mac and we've [TS]

01:04:11   talked about it at length and this was [TS]

01:04:13   his take on it and it was good and it [TS]

01:04:14   was articulate and it was an expression [TS]

01:04:16   of his his opinion and his desires in [TS]

01:04:18   his hopes and dreams and it was a good [TS]

01:04:19   post but for the purposes of discussion [TS]

01:04:21   the show i'm wondering if it is bringing [TS]

01:04:23   any new angle [TS]

01:04:24   we haven't already given our pains on 19 [TS]

01:04:27   times [TS]

01:04:28   yeah and since will be asked about it [TS]

01:04:31   and who was that wrote this [TS]

01:04:33   hold on one sec in chrisandem chris that [TS]

01:04:36   yes or no matter the cost [TS]

01:04:38   yeah also very good although I honestly [TS]

01:04:42   I don't know if the mac pro was the best [TS]

01:04:44   choice there but we're seeing that from [TS]

01:04:46   a lot of people saying similar things [TS]

01:04:48   this is not a coincidence this is not an [TS]

01:04:50   accident this is not a a trend or people [TS]

01:04:53   being wrong [TS]

01:04:54   this is like legitimately apple is [TS]

01:04:56   causing concern in many of its customers [TS]

01:04:59   and many of its best biggest fans and [TS]

01:05:02   longest time customers and so you know I [TS]

01:05:04   i think if I can if I can summarize in a [TS]

01:05:08   very quick way or at least like try to [TS]

01:05:09   put a cap on this for now 2017 is gonna [TS]

01:05:12   be a very important year for Apple to [TS]

01:05:15   prove a lot of big things to to the [TS]

01:05:18   market into its customers right now [TS]

01:05:20   there's a lot of things where it where [TS]

01:05:24   the the answer from apple so far is [TS]

01:05:27   either silence or like just wait [TS]

01:05:31   you know like it wait till you see what [TS]

01:05:32   we have next or something like that [TS]

01:05:34   20-17 a lot of the stuff is coming do [TS]

01:05:37   you know that gives 2017 passes through [TS]

01:05:40   the whole year and there isn't like a [TS]

01:05:42   major new iphone design and there isn't [TS]

01:05:45   some answers to the mac pro and there [TS]

01:05:48   isn't maybe better quarterly earnings [TS]

01:05:50   these are some pretty big things there [TS]

01:05:54   have been bad signs on these fronts for [TS]

01:05:56   the last year or so but everyone's other [TS]

01:05:59   than next year or sooner this is going [TS]

01:06:01   to be out sooner this is going to be [TS]

01:06:02   fixed soon or the next iphone is gonna [TS]

01:06:04   be great or those quarterly earnings [TS]

01:06:05   were an anomaly all those promises are [TS]

01:06:08   going to be do this year and we you know [TS]

01:06:11   a year from now when were presumably [TS]

01:06:12   still have this podcast and still doing [TS]

01:06:14   follow-up we will see were all of our [TS]

01:06:18   concerns unfounded where were is you [TS]

01:06:20   know how how well are all these [TS]

01:06:22   complaints gonna age you are we all [TS]

01:06:24   wrong [TS]

01:06:25   is Apple about to release over the over [TS]

01:06:27   the course of the next year amazing [TS]

01:06:29   things and they're gonna blow our minds [TS]

01:06:31   and we're going to we're gonna feel good [TS]

01:06:34   about the back again and we're gonna [TS]

01:06:35   feel good about Apple's prospects again [TS]

01:06:37   everything [TS]

01:06:37   good about the iphone design again all [TS]

01:06:39   the stuff and the number is going to go [TS]

01:06:41   up and everyone the markets going to be [TS]

01:06:42   happy like is that really gonna happen [TS]

01:06:44   this year a bite [TS]

01:06:45   we don't know yet but we'll find out and [TS]

01:06:47   I really hope things go better because [TS]

01:06:49   frankly if they don't I'm going to find [TS]

01:06:51   us to talk about because i'm tired of [TS]

01:06:53   being sad all the time of the stuff i [TS]

01:06:55   love or wherever the chat room had a [TS]

01:06:57   good turn of phrase which I'm going to [TS]

01:06:59   slightly improve 2017 your mac OS on the [TS]

01:07:03   desktop nice we're going on nice whoo [TS]

01:07:09   so yeah I know Marco wanted to put a [TS]

01:07:11   capper on this but unfortunately next [TS]

01:07:13   item at the top of list is the one tiny [TS]

01:07:15   sliver of new angle on this [TS]

01:07:18   yes very old entire topic that I happen [TS]

01:07:20   to that happened to occur to me and I [TS]

01:07:23   tweeted earlier today was in response to [TS]

01:07:25   Michael sighs he's had a series of [TS]

01:07:27   articles on this on this whole same [TS]

01:07:28   thing like so many other mac bloggers [TS]

01:07:30   and he's an all-time mac user and he's [TS]

01:07:32   feeling all the same things and one of [TS]

01:07:35   his posts was on finding an alternative [TS]

01:07:37   to what he calls Mac os10 but he's not [TS]

01:07:41   he's not on board with their naming i [TS]

01:07:42   guess and he likes to Wesley Moore's a [TS]

01:07:46   post about this about you know trying to [TS]

01:07:49   find i'm looking into different linux [TS]

01:07:51   distributions and stuff like people are [TS]

01:07:52   looking for alternatives or for Mac os10 [TS]

01:07:55   there they're not looking for an escape [TS]

01:07:57   patch but like at the very least trying [TS]

01:08:00   to see what else is out there like [TS]

01:08:01   before I was happy using the mac and I [TS]

01:08:04   wasn't looking all terms but now I'm [TS]

01:08:05   starting to consider like hey what else [TS]

01:08:06   is that their house windows doing you [TS]

01:08:08   know is linux any good let me try for [TS]

01:08:11   distribution stuff like that and then [TS]

01:08:13   Gruber also talked about anyway so this [TS]

01:08:16   Michael signpost uh what I tweeted I [TS]

01:08:19   used a little quote we feature which [TS]

01:08:20   actually am starting to like this gives [TS]

01:08:22   you room to actually write something [TS]

01:08:23   we're also including their feet [TS]

01:08:25   welcome to like two years ago job and I [TS]

01:08:28   know I mean I my client has supported [TS]

01:08:30   the iOS version twitter is but it's [TS]

01:08:32   totally up to date but i am still my [TS]

01:08:33   habits are based on the old but I'm [TS]

01:08:35   talking about like not knowing when to [TS]

01:08:37   move huh [TS]

01:08:38   now I use it like nothing my normal to [TS]

01:08:41   Twitter way would be to like I write a [TS]

01:08:43   tweet and then paste the last 20 [TS]

01:08:45   characters be the shortened URL [TS]

01:08:47   right but by by quoting you get some [TS]

01:08:49   characters back anyway what we did was [TS]

01:08:52   the last time Mac users were seriously [TS]

01:08:53   passing around articles like this [TS]

01:08:55   articles like the one about finding [TS]

01:08:56   alternatives was during the transition [TS]

01:08:58   for mac OS to Mac os10 and as I had [TS]

01:09:02   committed to someone else who had [TS]

01:09:03   replied some replied I can't wait for [TS]

01:09:06   people for the million replies they're [TS]

01:09:08   going to say and now it's the transition [TS]

01:09:09   for mac OS to iOS haha which yes there [TS]

01:09:12   are many of those replies but you know [TS]

01:09:15   what my commentary on all of this was [TS]

01:09:18   analysis intentionally omitted a because [TS]

01:09:22   it's winter and you don't have room to [TS]

01:09:23   do that and be I like to just let this [TS]

01:09:26   tweet lie because it is like a Rorschach [TS]

01:09:29   test you know that the last time this [TS]

01:09:30   article about this was the transition [TS]

01:09:31   macro and micro spent half the people [TS]

01:09:33   are going to see that and say yeah and [TS]

01:09:35   what those dummies wrong because Mac [TS]

01:09:36   os10 was awesome and all the people [TS]

01:09:38   think the mac OS with a bunch of chumps [TS]

01:09:39   and the other half of the people are [TS]

01:09:41   going to say yeah that's around the last [TS]

01:09:43   time the mac almost died and we came [TS]

01:09:44   through by the skin of our teeth by you [TS]

01:09:46   know struggling mightily to get this [TS]

01:09:49   next base the West up into shipshape so [TS]

01:09:51   that it's satisfying to mac users and [TS]

01:09:53   then yet another group people are going [TS]

01:09:54   to say yes but a lot of people like you [TS]

01:09:56   didn't leave the mac then it's just that [TS]

01:09:57   they were replaced by unix nerds and all [TS]

01:09:59   evened out or actually was in that win [TS]

01:10:00   and so many different views on how the [TS]

01:10:03   US the Mac os10 transition went you know [TS]

01:10:05   I i'm fairly intimately familiar with [TS]

01:10:07   the Mac os10 transition so I know what I [TS]

01:10:09   think about it but so many different [TS]

01:10:11   people have different ideas of like what [TS]

01:10:13   it was like you guys didn't experience [TS]

01:10:14   this you didn't experience the [TS]

01:10:15   incredible turmoil much where is a much [TS]

01:10:18   worse than the current firmware using [TS]

01:10:20   much much much worse of a a diet [TS]

01:10:24   practically dying company certainly a [TS]

01:10:26   dying us like is this is you know the [TS]

01:10:28   senior parlance the windows 95 you know [TS]

01:10:31   no memory protection no pre-emptive [TS]

01:10:34   multitasking like trying to get from [TS]

01:10:36   that world into a modern OS while trying [TS]

01:10:39   to preserve something anything that was [TS]

01:10:40   good about the mac totally felt like [TS]

01:10:42   Apple as a company could be dying which [TS]

01:10:44   is not a thing that we are currently [TS]

01:10:45   worried about right now at all right [TS]

01:10:48   and certainly that the mac could be [TS]

01:10:50   dying along with the company because [TS]

01:10:51   even if they survive what what is what [TS]

01:10:53   comes out the other side of this thing [TS]

01:10:55   will not be a mac it will be some stupid [TS]

01:10:56   unix thing with terminal that won't be a [TS]

01:10:59   mac at all [TS]

01:11:00   and everything is terrible in the end [TS]

01:11:03   you know I think we successfully [TS]

01:11:05   navigated that transition but all of the [TS]

01:11:08   participants all all the players were [TS]

01:11:10   there but there wasn't much podcasting [TS]

01:11:12   going on but I i can tell you that there [TS]

01:11:13   were many many people who are from the [TS]

01:11:17   old school [TS]

01:11:18   macworld complaining just like me [TS]

01:11:21   complaining of his podcast through every [TS]

01:11:23   channel available to them again Twitter [TS]

01:11:26   didn't exist either but like using that [TS]

01:11:28   lots of arguing on usenet I'm arguing [TS]

01:11:30   something awesome person named guy [TS]

01:11:31   English which is totally sounds like a [TS]

01:11:32   made-up name on using that about the [TS]

01:11:34   merits of classic mac OS vs next I don't [TS]

01:11:37   like it was on you know on the the [TS]

01:11:41   nascent web and on our blogs and in [TS]

01:11:43   person and in mac user groups and the [TS]

01:11:45   pages of magazines and letters to [TS]

01:11:47   editors about how the mac was going and [TS]

01:11:52   the reason I reference that is not [TS]

01:11:53   because I think we're in the same [TS]

01:11:54   situation again I think that was a way [TS]

01:11:55   more dire situation which gives me some [TS]

01:11:57   comfort because it's like I came through [TS]

01:11:59   that and we're nowhere near as bad as [TS]

01:12:01   that is but but just to say that no one [TS]

01:12:05   was seriously circulating check out [TS]

01:12:08   these alternatives to Mac os10 in the [TS]

01:12:11   circles among diehard mac users [TS]

01:12:12   obviously there's always you know [TS]

01:12:14   articles about like hey if you're [TS]

01:12:15   thinking of using this look at this [TS]

01:12:16   alternative all but within our sort of [TS]

01:12:20   blogging and tweeting circles all these [TS]

01:12:23   people who've been using Mac's for years [TS]

01:12:24   and love it [TS]

01:12:25   I haven't seen our go like this in ages [TS]

01:12:28   let alone a series of them had to find [TS]

01:12:30   1i have to go back to the last time our [TS]

01:12:34   little community was in turmoil and that [TS]

01:12:36   was when we were like all if they're [TS]

01:12:38   going to do this to the mac i might as [TS]

01:12:40   well use windows or i might as well try [TS]

01:12:41   linux or I'm gonna leave the mac and go [TS]

01:12:45   to know there was no no one said they're [TS]

01:12:47   going to leave then I can go to Palm OS [TS]

01:12:48   biggest that wasn't you anyway [TS]

01:12:50   it gives me some historical perspective [TS]

01:12:52   but it also highlights the fact that [TS]

01:12:53   even though the current situation is not [TS]

01:12:56   as bad as it was then is at least of the [TS]

01:12:58   same type that these kinds of articles [TS]

01:13:02   are are in circulation and are of [TS]

01:13:06   interest to everybody even if you don't [TS]

01:13:09   feel that way even if you just want to [TS]

01:13:10   read it so you can sneer the people who [TS]

01:13:12   are you know claiming that the sky is [TS]

01:13:15   falling or whatever the fact is the [TS]

01:13:16   articles are being passed around and [TS]

01:13:18   people are reading on people think about [TS]

01:13:20   and that hasn't happened in a long time [TS]

01:13:22   how long ago was the micro [TS]

01:13:23   centralization 2001 ish so we had a good [TS]

01:13:26   15 years of peace and now we're gonna [TS]

01:13:29   have a little bit of its not war then [TS]

01:13:31   maybe at least Im and pestilence beer [TS]

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01:14:11   is even possible and any web programmers [TS]

01:14:14   will know like wow this is they put a [TS]

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01:14:36   Squarespace and it's so incredibly easy [TS]

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01:15:00   doesn't matter start their Squarespace [TS]

01:15:03   because first of all making for somebody [TS]

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01:15:05   Squarespace becomes their support person [TS]

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01:15:10   themselves once you direct them there so [TS]

01:15:11   you can put yourself out of the loop [TS]

01:15:13   completely and get back to your life if [TS]

01:15:15   you're making a life for yourself why [TS]

01:15:16   waste time doing it any other way doing [TS]

01:15:18   Squarespace you'll thank me later [TS]

01:15:20   give it a shot squarespace.com we decide [TS]

01:15:23   to sign up make sure to use offer code [TS]

01:15:24   ATP to [TS]

01:15:25   a ten percent off your first purchase [TS]

01:15:27   make your next move with a beautiful [TS]

01:15:29   website from Squarespace ah since [TS]

01:15:35   clearly the mac is doomed and the future [TS]

01:15:37   is not even iOS its voice tell us about [TS]

01:15:40   your google home my google home [TS]

01:15:43   yeah so I'd I gotta go home as a gift my [TS]

01:15:48   wife / gift for the family [TS]

01:15:50   it's complicated by the fact that our [TS]

01:15:54   photos are you know I signed up for [TS]

01:15:56   google photos using my one terabyte of [TS]

01:15:58   google me back up for a second [TS]

01:16:00   yeah I i heard from your wife that you [TS]

01:16:03   got this google home as a gift i'm [TS]

01:16:05   getting to that as a gift to her and [TS]

01:16:08   impaired it to your phone i'm about to [TS]

01:16:10   you know that it's not paired to the [TS]

01:16:11   phone i'm about to explain this so gets [TS]

01:16:13   a homer on it that it's obviously for [TS]

01:16:16   you know for the whole family because [TS]

01:16:18   it's in a room it's not like it one of [TS]

01:16:19   us has it on their desk or something [TS]

01:16:20   right [TS]

01:16:21   but one of the things that it can do for [TS]

01:16:24   you is you can ask it to like display [TS]

01:16:26   your photos on your TV so show me [TS]

01:16:28   pictures of whoever on my chromecast and [TS]

01:16:30   we'll do that i don't have comcast yet [TS]

01:16:31   but I plan to get when they like 30 [TS]

01:16:33   bucks or whatever it's not a big deal [TS]

01:16:34   and I do have hdmi ports available on [TS]

01:16:36   the side of my TV so i'm going to do [TS]

01:16:37   that but all of our google photos are [TS]

01:16:41   associated with my google account not [TS]

01:16:44   hurt even though she has the iphone with [TS]

01:16:46   the photo library under 5k imac under [TS]

01:16:49   her account so she owns that but Amanda [TS]

01:16:53   and this is actually a feature I like [TS]

01:16:54   the fact that we can cause i had one [TS]

01:16:56   terabyte google storage that I used for [TS]

01:16:57   other things and so when it came time to [TS]

01:17:00   look at the photos i said i can run the [TS]

01:17:02   google photos thing on your account on [TS]

01:17:05   your 5k imac but use it [TS]

01:17:07   upload all of your photos from the [TS]

01:17:09   family photo library up to my google [TS]

01:17:11   account storage because I'm the one with [TS]

01:17:13   one terabyte of storage and so I have [TS]

01:17:16   all the google photos and you could only [TS]

01:17:18   associate the google home with one [TS]

01:17:21   google account that is the first thing I [TS]

01:17:22   i searched by googling because I saw how [TS]

01:17:26   you set up okay now how do i had another [TS]

01:17:28   campus you know and all the google web [TS]

01:17:29   properties you can be signed into mobile [TS]

01:17:30   accounts which among them and have you [TS]

01:17:32   know like i thought surely that's the [TS]

01:17:33   thing but immediately found out that [TS]

01:17:35   google home currently is limited to [TS]

01:17:37   being connected to one google [TS]

01:17:38   account so it is connected to my google [TS]

01:17:40   account and the reason is connected to [TS]

01:17:41   my google account is because I'm the one [TS]

01:17:44   with all the photos and that's one of [TS]

01:17:45   the one of the few things that this [TS]

01:17:46   thing can do for me so that's that's the [TS]

01:17:48   limitation number one about this [TS]

01:17:51   limitation number two is i mean it's [TS]

01:17:54   it's a big number 20 will link in the [TS]

01:17:56   show notes this article Dan Martin wrote [TS]

01:17:57   about these devices and avid i look [TS]

01:18:00   forward to the summary of this like I'm [TS]

01:18:02   like the book jacket like John siracusa [TS]

01:18:03   called google home dot a big number two [TS]

01:18:06   yeah oh yeah that the number two thing [TS]

01:18:09   is the basic like Amazon echo has a big [TS]

01:18:11   lead and it does way more stuff right it [TS]

01:18:13   just doesn't especially in terms of home [TS]

01:18:15   automation of other things like it's [TS]

01:18:17   been out longer it has more integrations [TS]

01:18:19   and so if you're looking for something [TS]

01:18:23   you could take out of the box and hook [TS]

01:18:24   up a bunch of 50 different things too [TS]

01:18:26   and make your actions like this is not [TS]

01:18:28   that thing someone asked me on twitter [TS]

01:18:30   if you had to do it over again would you [TS]

01:18:32   still buy the google home and I can't [TS]

01:18:34   even know i have a google home and we [TS]

01:18:35   talked about doing it over again I'd [TS]

01:18:36   just got the google home like I don't [TS]

01:18:38   know but the reason I got it and I think [TS]

01:18:41   we've talked about this before them when [TS]

01:18:42   i said i was interested the reason I got [TS]

01:18:44   it is because i believe in the promise i [TS]

01:18:46   believe in the promise of google home as [TS]

01:18:47   a proxy actuality google hormones [TS]

01:18:49   product is that it's it's nice-looking [TS]

01:18:51   in the echo and in some ways it it's [TS]

01:18:53   better in terms of yeah i think maybe [TS]

01:18:56   the speaker's a little bit better and [TS]

01:18:57   it's smaller and you know it's it's a [TS]

01:19:00   little bit more polished i think but I'm [TS]

01:19:02   totally buying it because I believe that [TS]

01:19:05   google will eventually be better at all [TS]

01:19:08   the things that I care about which is [TS]

01:19:09   understanding what I'm saying and find [TS]

01:19:11   me find me useful information and [TS]

01:19:12   answers and I do use google calendar we [TS]

01:19:14   all use google calendar i use google [TS]

01:19:16   from my email we have our photos on [TS]

01:19:17   google in theory this has access to more [TS]

01:19:20   of our stuff in the Amazon echo would [TS]

01:19:22   and I subscribe to google play because I [TS]

01:19:23   subscribe to google play family thing [TS]

01:19:24   with to get youtube red or whatever so i [TS]

01:19:26   can say things like you know I hate ok [TS]

01:19:29   Google but that's what it is instead of [TS]

01:19:31   Alexis I wish you could make it [TS]

01:19:32   configured what i can say okay google [TS]

01:19:33   play some Christmas music and guess what [TS]

01:19:35   a place christmas music because it has [TS]

01:19:36   access to you know they're they're [TS]

01:19:38   streaming music service whereas you ask [TS]

01:19:40   amazon echo do the same thing you can [TS]

01:19:43   set something up to do it or you can try [TS]

01:19:44   to get it to play audio on another [TS]

01:19:46   bluetooth connected device and play the [TS]

01:19:47   audio it's on that device or whatever [TS]

01:19:49   but anyway [TS]

01:19:50   so far mostly the children have been [TS]

01:19:53   asking you to say things in foreign [TS]

01:19:54   languages and do unit conversions i did [TS]

01:19:57   use it to set timers but it is really [TS]

01:20:01   limited like the one of the very first [TS]

01:20:04   things I had to do was remind me two [TS]

01:20:06   hours to check on the roast this is like [TS]

01:20:08   on Christmas Day right and it said I [TS]

01:20:12   can't set up a reminder if you sorry [TS]

01:20:13   about that something like you can't set [TS]

01:20:15   up reminders like you don't need to do [TS]

01:20:17   this doesn't need to be network [TS]

01:20:19   integration just do it right it can do [TS]

01:20:21   timers set a timer for two hours for the [TS]

01:20:24   roast [TS]

01:20:25   ok I've set a timer for two hours for [TS]

01:20:27   the roast right but remind me in two [TS]

01:20:29   hours and knows that i want a reminder [TS]

01:20:30   but yeah I guess it classifies them in [TS]

01:20:33   the same with Apple classifieds [TS]

01:20:34   reminders vs timers and it has no way to [TS]

01:20:36   create a reminder in the world of google [TS]

01:20:39   yet right so again I google this and so [TS]

01:20:41   on a million people saying yes it can [TS]

01:20:43   set reminders that maybe we'll be able [TS]

01:20:44   to in the future so i really hope that [TS]

01:20:48   they get cranking on the integrations [TS]

01:20:51   and the functionality [TS]

01:20:52   I am very impressed with his ability to [TS]

01:20:54   understand my children's poor addiction [TS]

01:20:56   as they yell over each other to try to [TS]

01:20:58   get it to do things right [TS]

01:21:00   I'm impressed with its ability to [TS]

01:21:01   understand me talking from other rooms [TS]

01:21:04   and mumbling and how responsive it is to [TS]

01:21:07   ask me to set timers it takes me longer [TS]

01:21:09   to figure out when I can start talking [TS]

01:21:11   to Siri than it does to complete the [TS]

01:21:13   action on the google all right was that [TS]

01:21:15   just an internal frustration have the [TS]

01:21:17   fanciest fastest iphone and half the [TS]

01:21:20   time I'm like is it okay for me to talk [TS]

01:21:22   to have to wait for the boop and then [TS]

01:21:23   like I start talking then it goes boom [TS]

01:21:25   and then it doesn't understand me and I [TS]

01:21:26   can't reset it and have to start all [TS]

01:21:28   over as I just want to talk to there and [TS]

01:21:30   you mentioned Casey before serie in the [TS]

01:21:32   mac that this is I think one of one of [TS]

01:21:35   the things about the Amazon echo and the [TS]

01:21:36   google home do so much better than Cirie [TS]

01:21:39   on the Mac it's searing the mac really [TS]

01:21:41   want to be worth a damn it should be [TS]

01:21:42   like this two devices where I can just [TS]

01:21:44   say ok Mac what's the weather like [TS]

01:21:46   tomorrow no preamble no pressing the key [TS]

01:21:49   know making sure the mac is ready before [TS]

01:21:51   I talk just freaking said because if [TS]

01:21:53   this little tiny hundred-dollar cylinder [TS]

01:21:55   can do it this huge thousand [TS]

01:21:57   multi-thousand dollar computer should be [TS]

01:21:59   able to do that to let alone the fact [TS]

01:22:01   there's no hey seriously though you [TS]

01:22:02   going [TS]

01:22:02   without script to make it organized when [TS]

01:22:04   you say no like this is understandable [TS]

01:22:07   Mac Mac has to be able to do too because [TS]

01:22:09   as as Marco well knows that is the [TS]

01:22:12   killer feature to be able to just [TS]

01:22:13   rattled off in the air with no setup and [TS]

01:22:16   no preamble and no making sure everybody [TS]

01:22:18   is ready and just friggin does it and [TS]

01:22:20   that's awesome right that I mean that i [TS]

01:22:22   think the most important feature all [TS]

01:22:24   these cylinders is really good [TS]

01:22:26   microphones that can understand you from [TS]

01:22:28   far away with background noise and [TS]

01:22:30   incredible responsiveness and iphones [TS]

01:22:32   don't have that and max don't have that [TS]

01:22:34   is a damn shame so anyway google home [TS]

01:22:37   it shows promise it for the things that [TS]

01:22:40   can do it's very responsive i [TS]

01:22:42   intentionally bought it because i [TS]

01:22:44   believe in the promise of google doing [TS]

01:22:47   this type of stuff really well and the [TS]

01:22:49   things that it does do it does do really [TS]

01:22:51   well you can phrase your engine like [TS]

01:22:53   Google search you can phrase your unit [TS]

01:22:54   conversions or questions about the [TS]

01:22:55   weather or follow-up questions in a [TS]

01:22:57   fairly natural way and it pretty much [TS]

01:22:58   nails it [TS]

01:23:01   it just needs more features so I'm [TS]

01:23:02   patiently waiting for them to appear [TS]

01:23:04   yeah I i gotta say i mean i have yet to [TS]

01:23:06   see the google home but having had now [TS]

01:23:10   quite a bit of experience with the [TS]

01:23:12   Amazon echo these like home cylinders [TS]

01:23:14   with voice stuff to connect two simple [TS]

01:23:16   things like timers and weather and music [TS]

01:23:19   services and home automation this is a [TS]

01:23:22   real deal this category is really great [TS]

01:23:24   it's a really fun and there's this [TS]

01:23:28   pretty significant like you know [TS]

01:23:29   land-grab going on right now mostly [TS]

01:23:31   being one by amazon i am honestly kind [TS]

01:23:34   of concerned that Apple's not playing in [TS]

01:23:35   the space yet and I mean we've heard [TS]

01:23:37   rumblings that they're working on it i [TS]

01:23:38   really hope they get here soon because [TS]

01:23:40   this is the time into this business that [TS]

01:23:43   is that so / christmas we we got my [TS]

01:23:45   in-laws an echo that was kind of funny [TS]

01:23:48   like it for the last you know five six [TS]

01:23:51   Christmases we've we've gotten people [TS]

01:23:53   various Apple things mean I like Apple [TS]

01:23:56   TV's here and there and and occasionally [TS]

01:23:58   iPads for like big gifts sometimes this [TS]

01:24:02   year nobody got anything by Apple like [TS]

01:24:05   this year was apple had nothing to do [TS]

01:24:07   with our holiday fun this year they were [TS]

01:24:09   just you know we were all like using I [TS]

01:24:11   think that's basically but like there is [TS]

01:24:13   nothing there was no like new stuff from [TS]

01:24:14   apple is here [TS]

01:24:16   for us and grando the airports are big [TS]

01:24:17   deal on it but you know that that wasn't [TS]

01:24:20   any way that wasn't for all diseases [TS]

01:24:21   anyway all the fun was playing with the [TS]

01:24:24   echo and these are the end and all at [TS]

01:24:27   the home automation like the bygone the [TS]

01:24:28   handful of like the belkin wemo outlets [TS]

01:24:30   and everything that you can switch them [TS]

01:24:31   and just like this stuff [TS]

01:24:34   this is where all the action is [TS]

01:24:35   happening right now in like cool fun new [TS]

01:24:37   technology and yeah it is it isn't like [TS]

01:24:40   you know a massive business there's not [TS]

01:24:43   a lot of profit to be made here mean [TS]

01:24:44   amazon's already selling the echo for [TS]

01:24:46   under 200 bucks and the dots are like 40 [TS]

01:24:49   bucks and what's the google home like a [TS]

01:24:51   hundred and fifty or something when I [TS]

01:24:52   got on sales one of the reasons about I [TS]

01:24:54   got a 410 929 so like you know this is [TS]

01:24:57   obviously going to be like a low-margin [TS]

01:24:58   business for you know probably forever [TS]

01:25:00   and that's that's going to be difficult [TS]

01:25:02   for Apple because I I can't see Apple [TS]

01:25:05   coming in that you know under 250 [TS]

01:25:07   probably you know I mean look the apple [TS]

01:25:08   TV is you know in a similar boat were [TS]

01:25:10   like all the competitors are really [TS]

01:25:12   cheap but apple TV is still very [TS]

01:25:13   expensive for you compared to them so [TS]

01:25:15   anyway you know I I worry about Apple [TS]

01:25:17   this business because like it's so cool [TS]

01:25:19   it's so much fun these devices are [TS]

01:25:22   really really awesome and but in order [TS]

01:25:24   to be good I have it like they require [TS]

01:25:25   two things apple very good at service [TS]

01:25:28   consistency and integration with a bunch [TS]

01:25:31   of other stuff i don't have to beat as a [TS]

01:25:33   joke like you no sirree for all of its [TS]

01:25:35   benefits and faults it one thing it [TS]

01:25:38   really isn't even even people who love [TS]

01:25:40   Siri I think they would usually agree [TS]

01:25:42   one thing early isn't is consistent and [TS]

01:25:45   you know that the echo is so incredibly [TS]

01:25:48   rock-solid so anyway between Google and [TS]

01:25:51   Amazon I really haven't read a single [TS]

01:25:54   review of the google home that makes me [TS]

01:25:57   think anybody should buy over the echo I [TS]

01:25:59   honestly like I it all the reviews seem [TS]

01:26:01   to say like yeah it's kind of the same [TS]

01:26:02   thing but worse like I what am I missing [TS]

01:26:06   here [TS]

01:26:07   I mean it is i feel like it is better at [TS]

01:26:09   all the same things that Google is good [TS]

01:26:11   that you can type thing to do a google [TS]

01:26:12   search box and lots of different ways [TS]

01:26:13   and more or less figures out what you [TS]

01:26:15   mean like in in the same way that you [TS]

01:26:18   know the difference sweetie we know what [TS]

01:26:19   Google does that thing where it's like [TS]

01:26:21   it's like you're a bunch of search [TS]

01:26:22   results and hear a bunch of ads but by [TS]

01:26:23   the way i'm pretty sure I know what [TS]

01:26:25   you're getting and here's a box at the [TS]

01:26:26   top that shows like exactly what you're [TS]

01:26:29   interested [TS]

01:26:29   like a score of the game or like the [TS]

01:26:31   answer to the trivia question you were [TS]

01:26:33   asking or whatever before it even gets [TS]

01:26:34   the search results that type of stuff is [TS]

01:26:37   more or less exposed in a spoken way as [TS]

01:26:41   opposed to like you're like 17 10 [TS]

01:26:42   morning as we talked about doing the [TS]

01:26:44   language translation the echo or likes a [TS]

01:26:46   rather can do that as well but it [TS]

01:26:48   displays the results on your on your [TS]

01:26:50   phone in the ios app it doesn't speak [TS]

01:26:52   them back to you so it's it's like it [TS]

01:26:55   was all the things that Google is good [TS]

01:26:56   at if you're interested in controlling [TS]

01:26:58   stuff in your home the echo has way more [TS]

01:27:01   integration if you're interested in [TS]

01:27:02   buying things like forget it and that's [TS]

01:27:04   amazon's brain but you might want to buy [TS]

01:27:06   things by talking Amazon's got you [TS]

01:27:07   covered i don't know if you can do that [TS]

01:27:09   at all in Google Play what by the way [TS]

01:27:10   that sounds like a stupid thing until [TS]

01:27:13   you do it i'm sure you'll love it [TS]

01:27:15   yeah haha once once you're like 10 you [TS]

01:27:18   know once you get into the Amazon way of [TS]

01:27:20   life and you start ordering like [TS]

01:27:22   everything from amazon you can't like [TS]

01:27:23   you can do things like say name of thing [TS]

01:27:27   reorder a fridge filter and it will go [TS]

01:27:30   through your order history and it will [TS]

01:27:31   query it for the freezer fridge filter [TS]

01:27:33   and will say do you want me to add this [TS]

01:27:36   thing you know it'll read the name and [TS]

01:27:37   was a here's how much it costs and [TS]

01:27:39   here's you know it has four star reviews [TS]

01:27:41   whatever also knows they do want to buy [TS]

01:27:43   it now and you can you know you can add [TS]

01:27:45   it to your cart and just do it later [TS]

01:27:46   you had your shopping list or you can [TS]

01:27:48   just have it say yes and place it place [TS]

01:27:50   the order right then you can you can [TS]

01:27:52   literally get rid of your like Iran of [TS]

01:27:55   this thing or another one of these [TS]

01:27:56   things you can eliminate those problems [TS]

01:27:58   like without ever touching computer like [TS]

01:27:59   oh my fridge filters replaced are [TS]

01:28:01   getting the fridge filter two days later [TS]

01:28:03   just shows up it's kind of amazing i [TS]

01:28:05   also before we got this thought that was [TS]

01:28:08   a ridiculous concept but once you do it [TS]

01:28:10   like once and you kind of break the like [TS]

01:28:13   the break the seal almost killed the [TS]

01:28:15   heat you break hearts like once you do [TS]

01:28:17   once you're just like oh my god this is [TS]

01:28:19   kind of awesome [TS]

01:28:21   why have I not been doing this and I [TS]

01:28:23   think we're kind of in an apple google [TS]

01:28:25   situation like the early days of the [TS]

01:28:27   iphone where was like oh we have this [TS]

01:28:29   nice sort of symbiosis where a apples [TS]

01:28:31   going to do this awesome hardware in the [TS]

01:28:33   OS and Google will do the cloud services [TS]

01:28:35   like the maps and stuff and it's a [TS]

01:28:37   marriage made in heaven and then they [TS]

01:28:38   split it seems like they're already [TS]

01:28:40   split because there are things that [TS]

01:28:41   Amazon does [TS]

01:28:42   better but there are also things that [TS]

01:28:43   Google does better and i basically any [TS]

01:28:46   kind of search for intelligence to [TS]

01:28:48   figure out what you mean [TS]

01:28:50   amazon can do all those things mostly [TS]

01:28:51   because they have integration with [TS]

01:28:53   Google or Google like services but they [TS]

01:28:54   don't do themselves whereas buying [TS]

01:28:56   things amazon is totally like it's all [TS]

01:28:59   integrated with your amazon account [TS]

01:29:00   knows your order history can do stuff [TS]

01:29:02   like that it gets to you would you would [TS]

01:29:05   want a home automation thing that can do [TS]

01:29:07   all of these things right and the same [TS]

01:29:09   way like eternity I'm as i'm probably [TS]

01:29:10   has them every service under the Sun but [TS]

01:29:12   google has all my photos and doesn't [TS]

01:29:14   doesn't have any iphones I can't ask the [TS]

01:29:16   echo to show photos of my son on the [TS]

01:29:18   television you know show photos my son [TS]

01:29:20   2015 on my chromecast I can't ask amazon [TS]

01:29:23   to do that i mean i could maybe make a [TS]

01:29:25   little skill or program or a little app [TS]

01:29:27   in their little things that make it do [TS]

01:29:28   but like but Google's got my stuff and [TS]

01:29:30   in the same way Apple if they ever come [TS]

01:29:32   up with one apples got a lot of my stuff [TS]

01:29:33   to they've got also got my photos and [TS]

01:29:36   you know they have my reminders because [TS]

01:29:37   they use reminders on my phone and they [TS]

01:29:38   have my imessages but they don't have my [TS]

01:29:40   calendar because Google has that and so [TS]

01:29:43   you know in some respects the best would [TS]

01:29:46   be a cylinder that you talked to that [TS]

01:29:50   doesn't have a horse in that race but [TS]

01:29:52   integrates with all of them sort of the [TS]

01:29:53   cylinder equivalent of the omniverse box [TS]

01:29:55   but of course that doesn't exist so [TS]

01:29:56   instead we're we have to choose silos [TS]

01:29:58   have a solid has nothing except for a [TS]

01:30:00   sort of cranky Syria that you can really [TS]

01:30:02   talk to him by the way if they ever did [TS]

01:30:03   make a cylinder can you imagine that [TS]

01:30:05   they may respond to a high telephone [TS]

01:30:08   which i'm not going to say every device [TS]

01:30:10   in your home would go off and then maybe [TS]

01:30:11   the cylinder with bloop later like they [TS]

01:30:13   should just give these things different [TS]

01:30:15   names or whatever else is like it [TS]

01:30:18   actually is not an easy problem to solve [TS]

01:30:19   what like like what when the when the [TS]

01:30:22   Amazon set of products first came out if [TS]

01:30:24   you had them if you have more than one [TS]

01:30:26   looks they're so cheap it and you kind [TS]

01:30:29   of always want one nearby so it i think [TS]

01:30:31   a lot of people have or will have more [TS]

01:30:33   than one which again puts a problem on [TS]

01:30:35   apples strategy of probably a nicer more [TS]

01:30:38   expensive one anyway so it when you have [TS]

01:30:41   more than one like if both of them are [TS]

01:30:44   within earshot when you say the trigger [TS]

01:30:46   word you know originally they were just [TS]

01:30:48   kind of both operate independently it [TS]

01:30:50   eventually the software update which by [TS]

01:30:51   the way everybody had to know baloch [TS]

01:30:53   biggest update themselves and don't even [TS]

01:30:55   tell you they just [TS]

01:30:55   updates amazing but a software update [TS]

01:30:57   eventually they added a thing where like [TS]

01:30:58   you can give them both the same trigger [TS]

01:31:00   word and now like whichever one like [TS]

01:31:02   heard you best will handle the command [TS]

01:31:04   and so and and you know they're I i [TS]

01:31:07   believe they're also wanted to work on [TS]

01:31:09   things like multi-room audio similar [TS]

01:31:11   what sonos does i think google home talk [TS]

01:31:13   about something like that to it will [TS]

01:31:14   either they're doing it they're going to [TS]

01:31:15   do it like this is actually it's going [TS]

01:31:18   to ramp up quickly into a category where [TS]

01:31:21   like the minimum bar to entry is [TS]

01:31:22   actually you know non-trivial that's why [TS]

01:31:25   I kind of like for Apple sake if they're [TS]

01:31:27   going to play this business at all [TS]

01:31:29   I hope they get here soon because [TS]

01:31:31   there's a lot to do and the competitors [TS]

01:31:33   going to keep raising that bar and [TS]

01:31:35   apples you can be playing catch-up if [TS]

01:31:37   they really don't don't get here very [TS]

01:31:38   very soon [TS]

01:31:39   I feel like Amazon even though they are [TS]

01:31:41   the leader now is added quite a [TS]

01:31:43   disadvantage because both Google and [TS]

01:31:44   Apple have more people stuff than amazon [TS]

01:31:46   the only thing amazon has for most [TS]

01:31:48   people is their purchase history and [TS]

01:31:50   purchases which is great for Amazon [TS]

01:31:52   because they're have trying to find a [TS]

01:31:53   way for you to order things by talking [TS]

01:31:54   and make money that's fine but most [TS]

01:31:56   people don't have all their family [TS]

01:31:59   photos on their most people don't have [TS]

01:32:01   big video collections up on amazon most [TS]

01:32:03   people don't have their calendars and [TS]

01:32:04   Amazon or their you reminders or their [TS]

01:32:07   shopping list which even though it has [TS]

01:32:08   these features like in other words to to [TS]

01:32:10   win like you said this you have to have [TS]

01:32:11   it's an ecosystem Play and Apple has its [TS]

01:32:14   ecosystem google has its and you can [TS]

01:32:15   argue about whose is better or whatever [TS]

01:32:16   but amazon's is the least full-featured [TS]

01:32:19   of all them like I and cool you know you [TS]

01:32:23   have to actually integrate with them for [TS]

01:32:24   you to win doesn't doesn't help the [TS]

01:32:25   google logo google has a calendar if I [TS]

01:32:27   can't do anything with the calendar [TS]

01:32:28   which you can you can ask about your day [TS]

01:32:30   and stuff like that [TS]

01:32:31   google has maps data and traffic data [TS]

01:32:33   like you need the integrations but it's [TS]

01:32:35   easier to make those integrations if [TS]

01:32:37   Apple Google actually gives a damn about [TS]

01:32:38   his products that schools are the [TS]

01:32:39   weaknesses historically then like I will [TS]

01:32:41   try this but maybe we're not that [TS]

01:32:42   interested whatever right but it's [TS]

01:32:45   easier for Google to do this integration [TS]

01:32:46   and then it is for amazon to get people [TS]

01:32:48   to use amazon for email amazon for [TS]

01:32:50   calendars amazon photo storage like even [TS]

01:32:52   if they offer these services unit they [TS]

01:32:54   make all these services to make world [TS]

01:32:55   class versus the service to match both [TS]

01:32:57   apple and Google's services then you [TS]

01:32:59   have to get people to switch to them so [TS]

01:33:00   there is a big disadvantage if to for [TS]

01:33:04   them to ever be in the ballpark if this [TS]

01:33:07   becomes an ecosystem why play [TS]

01:33:09   there I guess their ace in the hole is [TS]

01:33:11   like we don't have to have that [TS]

01:33:12   ecosystem we will just we will try to be [TS]

01:33:13   as I'm nervous as possible and give you [TS]

01:33:15   away [TS]

01:33:16   give people a way to make those [TS]

01:33:17   integration so pay by the Amazon necro [TS]

01:33:19   if you have your reminders on Apple we [TS]

01:33:21   can integrate with them if you have your [TS]

01:33:22   calendar on google we can integrate with [TS]

01:33:24   them like that's there that's the route [TS]

01:33:25   but it's certainly easier for Apple and [TS]

01:33:27   Google to integrate with their own stuff [TS]

01:33:29   it's just you know that they're playing [TS]

01:33:32   catch-up and like it in that article [TS]

01:33:33   link in the show notes that reviewing [TS]

01:33:35   them like Google Amazon integrates with [TS]

01:33:37   all of these amazonica rituals all the [TS]

01:33:40   with all these home automation devices [TS]

01:33:41   in google just integrates with these [TS]

01:33:42   three but every single the one who was [TS]

01:33:44   listed as announced support frugal home [TS]

01:33:46   right so it's not like Google is behind [TS]

01:33:48   but it's not like they're like Apple [TS]

01:33:50   where they do a single sign-on thing and [TS]

01:33:52   then wait six months and say the same [TS]

01:33:53   three pathetic companies are the only [TS]

01:33:54   ones we got for single sign-on oops like [TS]

01:33:56   everybody has announced removal home [TS]

01:33:58   that doesn't mean anything a lot of [TS]

01:33:59   people ask for home kit to I know but [TS]

01:34:01   it's the question of whether a google [TS]

01:34:03   falls through on that and yeah google [TS]

01:34:07   actually released a product they [TS]

01:34:09   announced the product and they released [TS]

01:34:10   it and it works which is way more than [TS]

01:34:12   apple has done so apples clearly in last [TS]

01:34:14   place and I have some faith that Google [TS]

01:34:16   home will have a more illustrious career [TS]

01:34:19   and life then did all the other like [TS]

01:34:22   Google TV and we're still again I just [TS]

01:34:25   think about the chromecast which seemed [TS]

01:34:26   like this little turkey thing that had [TS]

01:34:28   no future but tons of people have [TS]

01:34:29   chromecast and love them and even though [TS]

01:34:32   it's a very small simple thing [TS]

01:34:34   now you get chromecast angle home now [TS]

01:34:36   you have two pieces and they kind of fit [TS]

01:34:38   together and that chromecast was already [TS]

01:34:40   valuable suddenly becomes more valuable [TS]

01:34:41   exhibit you home [TS]

01:34:42   this is like ecosystem 101 so I do have [TS]

01:34:46   some faith the Google understands that [TS]

01:34:49   they can be they can be in our player [TS]

01:34:51   here while Apple snoozes my amazon gift [TS]

01:34:55   market takes on all marcos money every [TS]

01:34:57   time he speaks $14 a time for a fridge [TS]

01:35:01   filter and and and the option by the way [TS]

01:35:03   the Dan Martin option is these things [TS]

01:35:05   like a hundred something bucks there's [TS]

01:35:07   no reason you can't have both of them [TS]

01:35:08   they don't take up that much room [TS]

01:35:09   anymore it's got to them as I think [TS]

01:35:10   you're like three of them in this house [TS]

01:35:11   there's no reason you can't have all [TS]

01:35:12   them say a lot by me toilet paper and [TS]

01:35:15   google translate this phrase for me or [TS]

01:35:16   Google what's on my calendar today right [TS]

01:35:19   it's confusing to talk to multiple [TS]

01:35:20   systems but it's not that bad [TS]

01:35:21   like it's not like you're making of [TS]

01:35:23   three thousand dollar investment in a [TS]

01:35:25   computing platform you're just buying a [TS]

01:35:26   little cylinder plug into the wall [TS]

01:35:27   somewhere so i'm i'm actually [TS]

01:35:29   considering that as well to get both of [TS]

01:35:32   them because they don't conflict it's [TS]

01:35:34   fine how much the ecosystem matters to [TS]

01:35:39   which one succeeds or fails or which [TS]

01:35:40   ones succeed or fail i think also [TS]

01:35:43   depends on what people want these [TS]

01:35:44   cylinders to do like what what is the [TS]

01:35:46   role this is playing for you and let you [TS]

01:35:50   know like you're thinking about like you [TS]

01:35:52   asked the google thing to show you [TS]

01:35:53   pictures from your google photostream of [TS]

01:35:55   something on your TV [TS]

01:35:57   I would never do that you are doing that [TS]

01:35:59   and so they obviously people have [TS]

01:36:01   different needs for this kind of thing [TS]

01:36:03   but you know I think certain roles are [TS]

01:36:05   going to come out ahead like one of the [TS]

01:36:07   like one of the things like there's a [TS]

01:36:08   rumor that came out a little couple [TS]

01:36:10   weeks ago about how it may be the next [TS]

01:36:12   ecco might be like a tablet kind of [TS]

01:36:14   thing that's really made to be a kitchen [TS]

01:36:16   appliance really like because they found [TS]

01:36:19   that so many people put the echo in [TS]

01:36:20   their kitchens and turns out people [TS]

01:36:22   really like using it in the kitchen [TS]

01:36:24   while cooking so that you know it'd be [TS]

01:36:25   nice to meet you have something like you [TS]

01:36:27   know screen showing showing your timers [TS]

01:36:29   because the tires are really popular [TS]

01:36:31   thing as opposed to just like you know [TS]

01:36:34   some kind of you know the audio thing we [TS]

01:36:36   have now or screen is like a recipe or [TS]

01:36:38   cooking or whatever else so you know [TS]

01:36:41   amazon is finding their uses in the [TS]

01:36:43   kitchen [TS]

01:36:44   Google might find their uses in the [TS]

01:36:45   living room each one could find their [TS]

01:36:47   audience or it might turn out that the [TS]

01:36:51   things that Google Doc amazing for [TS]

01:36:52   people actually just want to use their [TS]

01:36:54   phones to do those things and no one's [TS]

01:36:56   really going to want their cylinders to [TS]

01:36:57   do that and so Google making a bad bet [TS]

01:36:59   on that and maybe people really want [TS]

01:37:01   just a kitchen cylinder that plays music [TS]

01:37:03   actually adding things most of the time [TS]

01:37:05   maybe amazon women there who knows like [TS]

01:37:07   I don't think it's a safe assumption to [TS]

01:37:09   say that the ecosystems that each of [TS]

01:37:11   these companies have now are a sure [TS]

01:37:13   thing to guarantee the success in this [TS]

01:37:15   new area because Pete we might find with [TS]

01:37:17   this new area that people use it [TS]

01:37:19   differently than what we initially [TS]

01:37:20   expect ya is saying is it's a question [TS]

01:37:23   of whether it's easier to add [TS]

01:37:24   integrations are was easier to add those [TS]

01:37:26   ecosystems because like having ownership [TS]

01:37:28   of people's calendars and their messages [TS]

01:37:30   and their purchases like those are [TS]

01:37:32   things like purchases for example there [TS]

01:37:35   no way Apple and Google can get that [TS]

01:37:36   they can't like we're going to start [TS]

01:37:38   competing retail business so we'll have [TS]

01:37:39   a list of people to purchase it nope you [TS]

01:37:41   want and in the same way [TS]

01:37:42   amazon can't say we're going to start an [TS]

01:37:44   email service and it's gonna be as big [TS]

01:37:46   as gmail nope it won't and we're gonna [TS]

01:37:48   have a calendaring service and it will [TS]

01:37:49   be integrated into the iphone as Apple's [TS]

01:37:51   calendar or with android cool you won't [TS]

01:37:53   like so that the lines are kind of drawn [TS]

01:37:55   along there and those things are not [TS]

01:37:58   esoteric like photos calendar email [TS]

01:38:02   address messages purchases those are [TS]

01:38:05   fundamental those are fundamentally on [TS]

01:38:08   this kind of like they have those [TS]

01:38:09   squares and the Monopoly board right and [TS]

01:38:11   they're not they're not going away [TS]

01:38:14   it's just a question of how they're [TS]

01:38:15   going to be divvied up between them and [TS]

01:38:17   the the extras about the integrations [TS]

01:38:21   like that with the chromecast the [TS]

01:38:23   example I gave putting photos on my TV [TS]

01:38:24   this is the thing I do now but i do it [TS]

01:38:26   the long annoying manual way which is [TS]

01:38:28   always annoying i use apple tv2 do it i [TS]

01:38:30   pull up the photo library half of the [TS]

01:38:31   thumbnails not show up is terrible [TS]

01:38:33   experience but like that's the thing i [TS]

01:38:34   want to do and relatives are over [TS]

01:38:36   let's look at pictures i have them [TS]

01:38:37   usually sorted into albums or smart [TS]

01:38:39   albums or something like that when we [TS]

01:38:41   see the picture of my wife strip [TS]

01:38:43   mediterranean cruise i have all the [TS]

01:38:45   setup i already have the album apple TV [TS]

01:38:47   because I'd use my photos and apple [TS]

01:38:49   things has that stuff and I just want to [TS]

01:38:51   see them and I have to use that terrible [TS]

01:38:55   remote and use a bunch of the UH of [TS]

01:38:57   applications to you know make sure her [TS]

01:38:59   computer's on the wake of all blah [TS]

01:39:01   whereas if I could use a little [TS]

01:39:03   chromecast don't have to think about a [TS]

01:39:04   little cylinder to think about and just [TS]

01:39:05   sit down and say show mediterranean [TS]

01:39:08   cruise photos and notes from the the GPS [TS]

01:39:11   tags but that I'm talking about because [TS]

01:39:12   it's cool and it's really smart and even [TS]

01:39:14   have to make an album that's a better [TS]

01:39:16   experience but you can only do that if [TS]

01:39:19   you know where to get the photos from [TS]

01:39:20   and most people are not going to be sort [TS]

01:39:22   of the self hackers of like well my [TS]

01:39:23   photos are on a you know freebie a [TS]

01:39:25   freenas thing in the basement and i [TS]

01:39:27   wrote a linux server the polls they like [TS]

01:39:28   no one's going to do that like you can [TS]

01:39:30   with the Amazon echo you can do is [TS]

01:39:31   integrations and in the beginning that [TS]

01:39:33   that's kind of its impressive to create [TS]

01:39:36   these Rube Goldberg machines but I still [TS]

01:39:38   feel like oh especially in the subtle [TS]

01:39:41   world they were in ownership of data [TS]

01:39:43   dictates what kind of things you can use [TS]

01:39:47   it [TS]

01:39:48   for LA and I said the same way that you [TS]

01:39:50   cannot tell Google's thing to order your [TS]

01:39:51   new fridge things [TS]

01:39:52   amazon owns that there's nothing we can [TS]

01:39:54   really do about that Amazon is not going [TS]

01:39:55   to be keen on letting google integrate [TS]

01:39:57   with its purchases in that way so if [TS]

01:39:59   that's one of the things that you want [TS]

01:40:02   to do and I think it is usual thing to [TS]

01:40:03   do you are the only choice you have is [TS]

01:40:05   amazon and that's why I think we may be [TS]

01:40:08   trapped not trapped but like faded to be [TS]

01:40:12   talking to multiple semi-intelligent [TS]

01:40:15   assistance referring to them by name in [TS]

01:40:17   the same way that we go to multiple [TS]

01:40:19   websites to do things like go to Amazon [TS]

01:40:21   when I'm shopping but I go to you know [TS]

01:40:23   gmail when I want to do my mail [TS]

01:40:25   I sale daughter army fridge filters and [TS]

01:40:29   I say Google do we have any appointments [TS]

01:40:32   tomorrow afternoon because Google has my [TS]

01:40:34   calendar and alexis has my purchases and [TS]

01:40:36   again if these little cylinders like [TS]

01:40:39   they're cheap now they're only going to [TS]

01:40:40   get cheaper if they're mostly network [TS]

01:40:42   based off combined with really good [TS]

01:40:43   microphones and a tiny little low power [TS]

01:40:45   cpu that's always listening and stuff i [TS]

01:40:48   think that is it aside from any sort of [TS]

01:40:51   global cooperation between these giant [TS]

01:40:53   companies which is not going to happen [TS]

01:40:57   talking to different things in our house [TS]

01:40:58   seems to me the most likely outcome of [TS]

01:41:01   all this so I I think I think we're all [TS]

01:41:03   doomed to have multiple increasingly non [TS]

01:41:06   cylindrical cylinders like eventually [TS]

01:41:07   just be a bunch of tiny little things [TS]

01:41:09   that are dotted all over our house and [TS]

01:41:10   having multiple ones that will be a big [TS]

01:41:12   deal thanks 143 sponsors this week [TS]

01:41:15   Casper betterment and square space and [TS]

01:41:18   we will see you next week [TS]

01:41:22   now the show is over they didn't even [TS]

01:41:25   mean to begin because it was accidental [TS]

01:41:29   it was accidental Jonathan [TS]

01:41:34   any research Marco in kc wouldn't let me [TS]

01:41:37   because it was accidental was accidental [TS]

01:41:42   and you can find the show know the day [TS]

01:41:45   EP die and if your twitter follow them [TS]

01:41:52   is a yl ISS so that's Casey list and a [TS]

01:41:59   co-pay rm20 Marco Arment and our AC at [TS]

01:42:07   Syracuse [TS]

01:42:20   we all saw each other this earlier this [TS]

01:42:27   week actually and Marco this was your [TS]

01:42:30   first probably multi-hundred mile trip [TS]

01:42:34   and the Tesla is that right [TS]

01:42:35   that is right it's the longest trip I've [TS]

01:42:37   taken yet and the first trip that [TS]

01:42:38   required a supercharger in the middle so [TS]

01:42:41   how to go when I it before about the [TS]

01:42:44   Tesla the the prediction i had was that [TS]

01:42:49   this is going to be a car that's really [TS]

01:42:51   nice and every day used to never have to [TS]

01:42:52   go to a gas station and just gonna be a [TS]

01:42:55   bit of a pain in the butt when I go on [TS]

01:42:56   long car trips we're going to have these [TS]

01:42:58   like you know have forced a half-hour [TS]

01:43:00   supercharger breaks every like three to [TS]

01:43:03   four hours and it's going to be a pain [TS]

01:43:06   and everything else but I figured like [TS]

01:43:07   that will be like I will tolerate that [TS]

01:43:09   inconvenience for the awesomeness of the [TS]

01:43:11   car in all the circumstances so this is [TS]

01:43:14   the first trip we actually had to [TS]

01:43:16   realize what it was like to to rely on [TS]

01:43:18   the supercharger network for your range [TS]

01:43:20   because every other I've got super just [TS]

01:43:22   like twice in the past it was kind of [TS]

01:43:24   optional like one time I was just [TS]

01:43:26   pouring rain and I just need a break [TS]

01:43:27   anyway i'm passing one so let me just [TS]

01:43:29   take a break here we go coffee shop [TS]

01:43:31   whatever any of the time I was more [TS]

01:43:34   again like you know similar like not [TS]

01:43:36   really necessary to stop for a few [TS]

01:43:37   minutes anyway this is the first time i [TS]

01:43:39   had to really stop for like 30 minutes [TS]

01:43:41   I you know we pull up we find it was [TS]

01:43:43   that it was the the Delaware rest stop [TS]

01:43:46   on i-95 that you know everybody goes to [TS]

01:43:48   and there's like 12 spots and half of [TS]

01:43:51   them were open so I was fine you know [TS]

01:43:53   pull up plug-in and we went in we all [TS]

01:43:56   went to the bathroom and we all got you [TS]

01:43:58   know a quick little launched from the [TS]

01:43:59   crappy food places they have in this [TS]

01:44:01   wonderful delaware rest stop that the [TS]

01:44:03   food's the worst but it's just don't go [TS]

01:44:05   to the baja fresh because you think [TS]

01:44:07   about how fresh that should be good [TS]

01:44:09   because real buy fresh stores are good [TS]

01:44:11   but this is a buy fresh express and what [TS]

01:44:14   that means is that it's a terrible [TS]

01:44:15   terrible pile of garbage that has the [TS]

01:44:18   baja fresh sign above it but that is not [TS]

01:44:21   a real baja fresh you never ever get [TS]

01:44:24   that so you know we we know had lunch [TS]

01:44:26   everything and before i knew it like we [TS]

01:44:28   were just like doing you know basic rest [TS]

01:44:30   up before I knew it my car is like [TS]

01:44:31   ninety-eight percent and I was like [TS]

01:44:34   trying to rush out of there so I didn't [TS]

01:44:35   hit a hundred start getting charged 40 [TS]

01:44:37   cents a minute for sitting there taking [TS]

01:44:38   up a spot on a separately know how how [TS]

01:44:42   what were you at when you pulled in just [TS]

01:44:43   ballpark [TS]

01:44:44   I forget I somewhere around like 30 or [TS]

01:44:47   so that i don't know how did something [TS]

01:44:48   like that ok [TS]

01:44:49   it was amazing like a charge up and like [TS]

01:44:52   so like we were stopping anyway and you [TS]

01:44:55   know like if we were like if we were [TS]

01:44:56   like one of the hardcore long-distance [TS]

01:44:58   drivers that like the the total time it [TS]

01:45:01   takes you to get where you're going as a [TS]

01:45:02   career is very important to you and you [TS]

01:45:04   don't like to stop at all then this is [TS]

01:45:07   not the car for you but you know if you [TS]

01:45:09   if you stop anyway just like four basic [TS]

01:45:11   comfort and take a break [TS]

01:45:13   it's quite something else on the way [TS]

01:45:15   home I had an even cooler experience I [TS]

01:45:18   was really I was a little bit sick and I [TS]

01:45:21   was really tired i could really really [TS]

01:45:23   just use a break from driving like I was [TS]

01:45:25   very I was unreasonably tired just [TS]

01:45:27   because of the because i just i was sick [TS]

01:45:29   and you anyway [TS]

01:45:30   tiff and Adam went into starbucks to get [TS]

01:45:33   some coffee and to give Adam a sandwich [TS]

01:45:36   i sat in the car left the heat on and [TS]

01:45:40   left the heated seat on and just took a [TS]

01:45:43   nap i leave and leave the seat back [TS]

01:45:46   nice i took like a 20 minute nap so here [TS]

01:45:48   I was I'm like this is kind of amazing [TS]

01:45:50   so my car is filling up with the fuel it [TS]

01:45:52   needs for free while I sit in a heated [TS]

01:45:57   nicely heated car with nicely heated [TS]

01:45:59   seat in the winter and take a nap [TS]

01:46:02   actually I think this is like the best [TS]

01:46:05   cock through like that for long road [TS]

01:46:08   trip comfort I've ever seen like I again [TS]

01:46:11   I thought this is going to be some kind [TS]

01:46:13   of like big hassle on long trips but [TS]

01:46:15   it's only a hassle if you want to get [TS]

01:46:17   there in the small amount of time [TS]

01:46:18   possible but if you are more leisurely [TS]

01:46:20   like we always have been and you like to [TS]

01:46:22   like stop for lunch at like or you know [TS]

01:46:24   stop and take a break every so often if [TS]

01:46:27   that's your style of driving this is the [TS]

01:46:29   best like it is but there's so much the [TS]

01:46:32   best because it allows you to not only [TS]

01:46:36   fill up for free and it for you take [TS]

01:46:38   these breaks or intervals but like the [TS]

01:46:40   process of filling up for free is way [TS]

01:46:42   nicer than stopping the gas station [TS]

01:46:44   oh my god it's so it's so actually [TS]

01:46:47   I really quite enjoyed it and it was [TS]

01:46:48   wonderful and i look forward to future [TS]

01:46:50   long trips where I have to use them [TS]

01:46:52   that's awesome that's somewhat [TS]

01:46:54   surprising but super cool sound like [TS]

01:46:57   tipsy could new cars gonna have even [TS]

01:46:59   fewer miles and her old one truth that [TS]

01:47:04   we are beach house car [TS]

01:47:05   yeah you still that's the next that's [TS]

01:47:07   the next bit of electric car anxiety [TS]

01:47:09   that you have to get over just by doing [TS]

01:47:10   it was your like to be sitting there and [TS]

01:47:12   will be discharging it should let it sit [TS]

01:47:13   there for a week i bet that's not a [TS]

01:47:14   problem either [TS]

01:47:15   you gotta try it well I ever did I did [TS]

01:47:17   the experiment i left my car on plug [TS]

01:47:19   here when we went there to kind of try [TS]

01:47:21   that and end up i think it loses like [TS]

01:47:22   one or two percent day so it isn't that [TS]

01:47:24   big of a deal but but now I did the [TS]

01:47:26   bigger problems i want for my trunk with [TS]

01:47:27   sand all cheese [TS]

01:47:31   look it you're going to use your car or [TS]

01:47:33   is it just a piece it's just a piece of [TS]

01:47:35   art that you look at their two things [TS]

01:47:36   around a lot of my trunk sand and [TS]

01:47:38   glitter in vacuum the sand up I promise [TS]

01:47:40   you [TS]

01:47:41   yeah yeah you know what i was told that [TS]

01:47:43   about the glitter in my trunk when we [TS]

01:47:44   had a better heavy [TS]

01:47:46   yeah exactly yeah so but saying I can do [TS]

01:47:49   you have a trunk liner I didn't think [TS]

01:47:51   I've seen your truck at what does that [TS]

01:47:53   mean it's covered in carpet I don't know [TS]

01:47:54   that's a no right so you can usually by [TS]

01:47:57   you can usually by like a little rubber [TS]

01:47:59   thing that goes in there so you can get [TS]

01:48:02   you know if it's multiple like if it's [TS]

01:48:04   like some groceries back together and [TS]

01:48:05   spill and get sticky stuff wherever they [TS]

01:48:07   did basically you don't ruin the carpet [TS]

01:48:09   in your car but also if it gets filled [TS]

01:48:10   with sand [TS]

01:48:11   you can take that whole rubber thing out [TS]

01:48:12   turned upside down double the same [TS]

01:48:14   background put in but even if you do it [TS]

01:48:16   right on the carpet [TS]

01:48:16   I promise you you can vacuum sand out of [TS]

01:48:19   carpeting in the car it will be fine [TS]

01:48:21   and finally sand in your car is a badge [TS]

01:48:23   of honor if you are a beach person which [TS]

01:48:25   I know that you're not but we're [TS]

01:48:26   converting you're right i am a i'm a [TS]

01:48:29   beach town person i like the like the [TS]

01:48:32   beach town i like the beach environment [TS]

01:48:34   I like the beach mindset even but I i [TS]

01:48:37   still do not like sand [TS]

01:48:39   I that sand is the sand is a problem and [TS]

01:48:42   I nicely there i don't see how glitter [TS]

01:48:45   can be such the the scourge of humanity [TS]

01:48:47   that it is and and and it can like [TS]

01:48:50   glitter ruin my my 328 like when I had [TS]

01:48:52   that Carly I i got there is that there [TS]

01:48:54   is a that Christmas which we brought my [TS]

01:48:57   car upstate and it was a year where [TS]

01:49:00   the wrapping paper that was in use that [TS]

01:49:02   year contained glitter and the ribbon [TS]

01:49:03   all contain glitter and so my entire car [TS]

01:49:06   filled with glitter it never I could not [TS]

01:49:09   get it all out of that car i eventually [TS]

01:49:11   had to turn the car in for them to [TS]

01:49:12   release it was still there and turn the [TS]

01:49:14   glittery trunk better i was not actually [TS]

01:49:16   find for that but they they should have [TS]

01:49:18   fined me for that even I would have [TS]

01:49:20   fined me for that you need to nip that [TS]

01:49:21   in the bud like I'm familiar with this [TS]

01:49:23   phenomenon wrapping paper with glitter [TS]

01:49:24   on the outside of it [TS]

01:49:25   just say no that cannot enter your house [TS]

01:49:27   or someone else brings your present with [TS]

01:49:29   that on it you have to like isolated [TS]

01:49:31   like it's radioactive [TS]

01:49:32   but by all means when you're wrapping [TS]

01:49:34   your own presence do not choose that [TS]

01:49:36   paper with glitter on it that is a [TS]

01:49:37   terrible mistake that should never be [TS]

01:49:39   allowed to happen [TS]

01:49:40   setting aside cars forget about cars for [TS]

01:49:42   justjust in your own home they cannot [TS]

01:49:44   that cannot be allowed to because that [TS]

01:49:46   was all that that caused a rule to be [TS]

01:49:48   enacted that no more glitter in my car [TS]

01:49:50   ever and no glitter in any part of the [TS]

01:49:53   house I care about which is basically [TS]

01:49:55   the office and my car its plants and [TS]

01:49:57   does not like that I promise it but [TS]

01:49:59   Santa just dull glitter like how is that [TS]

01:50:01   not what is not did is that it's very [TS]

01:50:03   small rocks [TS]

01:50:04   how does it not work the same way and [TS]

01:50:07   what else [TS]

01:50:07   floats in water [TS]

01:50:09   it's probably a reference i'm not [TS]

01:50:11   getting it is i can tell when you use [TS]

01:50:14   your reference voice yeah you do have a [TS]

01:50:16   reference voice everybody else will [TS]

01:50:18   forget that I could've tried to the [TS]

01:50:20   accent goodness [TS]