The Accidental Tech Podcast

199: 10,000 Hours of Coughing


  I'm gonna go go to bed and my friends [TS]

  and she's back in the fridge yeah good [TS]

  and i would recommend that [TS]

  how's things yeah still coughing but you [TS]

  know it's winter and I have a kid so [TS]

  that's good that's a given right every [TS]

  ounce of my being wants to get smug [TS]

  about how all come on I never get sick [TS]

  you can't you must be just your week of [TS]

  immune system but i know that i will be [TS]

  paying this price in 23 years at 1-year [TS]

  try one year probably that's true so my [TS]

  office has opened a San Francisco well [TS]

  strictly speaking an Oakland office [TS]

  which i guess is different enough from [TS]

  San Francisco that people from the area [TS]

  get perturbed if you confuse the two [TS]

  those California sensitivities and [TS]

  indeed well they've opened a Oakland [TS]

  office and the other day i was trying to [TS]

  get something accomplished with one of [TS]

  my co-workers out there and he had said [TS]

  oh I have to go for a long lunch because [TS]

  all the executives are in town and so [TS]

  you know always on vacation California [TS]

  blah blah and then I finally caught up [TS]

  with him after his launch this is [TS]

  already like roughly quitting time for [TS]

  me and he says oh you know what I can't [TS]

  do a google hangout with you to work [TS]

  through this issue because we're all [TS]

  going to the Tesla factory for a tour [TS]

  right now and i'm jealous i wish i could [TS]

  go on and I'm said don't get free cars [TS]

  you know they just you know see other [TS]

  cars being made [TS]

  I loved the BMW factory tour so much it [TS]

  was almost if not a problem was one of [TS]

  the highlights of that trip I thought it [TS]

  was in nominally cool yeah just a video [TS]

  that uh that I think I Greg put on [TS]

  Twitter of the it slave you know metal [TS]

  milling machine lathe oh my god yeah [TS]

  with it with the coolant coming out [TS]

  these the center or not that when he [TS]

  showed it was that you know ladies just [TS]

  think that spins an item and usually [TS]

  bring it to close to it as it spins you [TS]

  can shave off parts but this is the [TS]

  thing where the items spun and also the [TS]

  the cutting tool also moved in and out [TS]

  and up and down and it was making [TS]

  basically a crankshaft for an engine [TS]

  which you know I totally missed that it [TS]

  really could be because it's got to you [TS]

  can imagine I crankshaft looks like you [TS]

  can't just lay that out it's not a [TS]

  rotationally symmetrical so it has to [TS]

  cut all that stuff [TS]

  like its rotating the pieces imagine [TS]

  just trying to cut like part of the part [TS]

  of a crank shaft that connects to the [TS]

  piston right wallet while the crank [TS]

  shaft is rotating along its normal [TS]

  rotation also whole thing that cuts the [TS]

  piston and has to trace that to make [TS]

  like it was amazing amazing looking [TS]

  I don't know if that's how all [TS]

  crankshafts are made like this is what [TS]

  it takes to make one crankshaft no [TS]

  wonder and wonder internal combustion [TS]

  engines cost so much money seriously was [TS]

  this great Coney yeah I am thoroughly [TS]

  intrigued by this and I i follow Greg's [TS]

  i'm surprised that i didn't notice it [TS]

  when it flew by [TS]

  maybe I declare bankruptcy that day or [TS]

  something fair enough how's everything [TS]

  else so Marco sick John you alive [TS]

  yeah I'm okay I'm activity worrying [TS]

  about my my children's health my son has [TS]

  had a cough for a month now somewhere in [TS]

  the middle more than a month somewhere [TS]

  in the middle of that after several [TS]

  weeks we took him to the doctor and [TS]

  they're like no he doesn't have you know [TS]

  bronchitis or pneumonia or any other [TS]

  thing that we can do anything about and [TS]

  they just give them an inhaler and send [TS]

  him home and it's like you still [TS]

  coughing so now we're trying like zyrtec [TS]

  just like allergy medication and a [TS]

  theory that like somehow he's allergic [TS]

  to the change in seasons and I don't [TS]

  know and I thought I spend most of my [TS]

  time worrying about them but i'm i'm [TS]

  doing fine [TS]

  fisherman's friend was that cough like [TS]

  crazy cough drop thing that you like [TS]

  sucking on gross tasting things care is [TS]

  also cold it was so okay [TS]

  basically yes they are my crazy girls [TS]

  cough drops the fisherman's friend [TS]

  original you know red labeled variety [TS]

  you can get them on amazon i even which [TS]

  is nice [TS]

  they basically have like the most [TS]

  menthol and the least sugar of of most [TS]

  costly the problem cough drops is [TS]

  basically that they only really work [TS]

  when they're in your mouth once they're [TS]

  gone they stopped working almost [TS]

  immediately and but they do work while [TS]

  you still have them and so you can tend [TS]

  to have a lot of them you're really [TS]

  coughing a lot and you can have to make [TS]

  it all day [TS]

  you tend to have a lot of cough drops in [TS]

  in one day and if you have the regular [TS]

  like you know big square ricola kind or [TS]

  things like that they your your mouth [TS]

  shut so coated in sugar just disgusting [TS]

  your teeth get all slightly just really [TS]

  gross in your mouth after not that long [TS]

  the time whereas Fisherman's Friend [TS]

  they're incredibly strong like very [TS]

  dense menthol flavor and and there's a [TS]

  lot less sugar in them and they look [TS]

  gross and they taste gross else ok but [TS]

  they do they come with me little [TS]

  like a little Ziploc pal she can just [TS]

  keep that pouch in your pocket [TS]

  you don't have to like be unwrapping [TS]

  cough drops ricotta and then happy what [TS]

  do you do with these two rappers and [TS]

  come around each one and you gotta eat [TS]

  like a whole pocketful of spent cock [TS]

  drop rapper like it avoid that problem [TS]

  too [TS]

  so in that they're good oh yeah a friend [TS]

  of ours [TS]

  the neighbor / friend swore by whatever [TS]

  it is the fisherman's friend that I [TS]

  guess you had recommended years ago and [TS]

  said because he has like a seasonal [TS]

  cough that just won't go away for months [TS]

  and and yeah he told me that the this [TS]

  real deal that those are the only things [TS]

  i can get him from hack it to keep him [TS]

  from hacking constantly yeah i mean like [TS]

  they're it's just menthol cough drops [TS]

  like there's no secret ingredient its [TS]

  menthol cough drops but menthol works [TS]

  and as far as I could tell from the [TS]

  basic research i did like couple years [TS]

  ago I did there doesn't seem to be like [TS]

  any kind of horrible side effects using [TS]

  a bunch of metal clatters when you have [TS]

  a cough so it it seems like it's a [TS]

  pretty good bet it is very effective [TS]

  when you have this kind of broccoli [TS]

  irritation nothing else really works to [TS]

  stop it like ego treatment treating it [TS]

  with like an inhaler and things can can [TS]

  solve the long-term problem but if you [TS]

  are coughing over-the-counter stuff like [TS]

  DXM syrup is not really affect this kind [TS]

  of cough so I'm an expert in coughing [TS]

  the last few years only in the winter [TS]

  time about 10,000 hours is all it takes [TS]

  right to 10,000 hours of coffee yeah [TS]

  i'll get there give me a few more years [TS]

  yeah yeah it's this is the video John [TS]

  yeah so if you go to like you know the [TS]

  three quarters of the way done is [TS]

  starting to take shape is what you [TS]

  really want to see is how does a [TS]

  carve-out the little parts that connect [TS]

  to the Pistons because those aren't [TS]

  along the rotational axis and then you [TS]

  see the thing rotating in the tool the [TS]

  same time it's this it's crazy [TS]

  oh my I mean you just wanted to watch [TS]

  the whole video can be kind of [TS]

  meditative to watch a 15-minute video [TS]

  machine building another part of a man [TS]

  god that's intense [TS]

  wow that is pretty damn cool I want one [TS]

  of these friend for no reason just I [TS]

  want to think it's bigger than your [TS]

  house [TS]

  oh I'm sure it is there's no doubt in my [TS]

  mind that it is but i kinda want it i [TS]

  think of all the cool things I would [TS]

  never be able to figure out how to build [TS]

  this is what Greg just has one of the [TS]

  niftiest jobs in the world this is what [TS]

  like when you when you're a software [TS]

  developer anybody who like builds [TS]

  physical objects just blows your mind [TS]

  maybe we don't make anything like we [TS]

  just make its move around we make [TS]

  nothing and so that the physical world [TS]

  like baffles us it's like mystic work [TS]

  all that weed we don't know how these [TS]

  things get here they just get here we [TS]

  can we complain about them don't include [TS]

  me in this I know how things get here [TS]

  I know where food comes from your [TS]

  weekend that's why you are royal and I'm [TS]

  servile no food comes from square [TS]

  packages and so we should probably start [TS]

  with some follow-up and try to get this [TS]

  train back on the tracks [TS]

  I so Alex how old wrote in to tell us [TS]

  about the nintendo 3ds so I believe [TS]

  that's your job John to tell us about [TS]

  this last show on retirement attendance [TS]

  which I was questioning whether we were [TS]

  all questioning like warrant for the 3ds [TS]

  for apples of her apple for nintendo's [TS]

  portable and I did that mistake like [TS]

  three times the last episode 2 saying [TS]

  Apple easy i think confused until they [TS]

  buy each other anyway and I said you [TS]

  know I have been following so someone [TS]

  knows we send a link Sox hell did it's [TS]

  an interview with the president endo who [TS]

  I still realized in my mind I keep [TS]

  thinking is a water but he died [TS]

  sadly is this untimely death i think [TS]

  last year or maybe was always here I [TS]

  remember anyway there's this new person [TS]

  whose name is a tattoo me kima i'm [TS]

  pronouncing it correctly [TS]

  Jamie she ma I'm close as an interview [TS]

  and the question from the interview is [TS]

  in bloomberg question will you [TS]

  discontinue 3ds answer from the [TS]

  president endo thanks to our software 3d [TS]

  hardware still growing so that business [TS]

  still has momentum and certainly rather [TS]

  than being cannibalized by the switch we [TS]

  think 3ds two can continue in its own [TS]

  form which is a perfectly businesslike [TS]

  answer that completed Marcus suggestion [TS]

  last show which is that they're just [TS]

  gonna keep it going if this which takes [TS]

  off in Canada switch doesn't take off [TS]

  then they'll be glad they kept going so [TS]

  that seems like what they're doing [TS]

  fair enough is that all follow up now [TS]

  you guys are slacking off on the fault [TS]

  I mean it was a lot of all I'm not the [TS]

  only one with all the other follow-up [TS]

  have item on the switch to some random [TS]

  thing that i read that i don't have a [TS]

  link for was about the switch when you [TS]

  you know so you pick it up and it's like [TS]

  a little thing you hold in your hands [TS]

  get a little control just slide on the [TS]

  side but what if you're gonna sit on [TS]

  your couch and do it you put the switch [TS]

  but it looks like a big [TS]

  you know sixteen by nine inch screen you [TS]

  put that in like a docking station looks [TS]

  kind of like a napkin holder right it's [TS]

  like a little little upright vertical [TS]

  thing that you slide the switch into and [TS]

  something I read the other day was that [TS]

  when you put the switch in that docking [TS]

  station one of the advantages to being [TS]

  docked aside from obviously not writing [TS]

  down the battery because the doc will be [TS]

  connected to power is that the switch [TS]

  itself becomes more powerful because the [TS]

  docking station provides additional [TS]

  cooling allowing the internals to be at [TS]

  max you know to run at full tilt without [TS]

  hitting thermal limits which is really [TS]

  weird if you think about it basically [TS]

  means when it's handheld it won't be as [TS]

  powerful or as good as I mean like just [TS]

  frame rate will suffer or will it [TS]

  cranked down the detail that's part of [TS]

  the game makers API or whatever but [TS]

  anyway [TS]

  all the more reason for you to just keep [TS]

  it plugged into your TV and pretend like [TS]

  Nintendo was still making TV connected [TS]

  consoles instead of making really weird [TS]

  much more powerful portable systems that [TS]

  you can also use on the TV respond to [TS]

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  very much dependent for sponsor and once [TS]

  again John tell me what's going on with [TS]

  your keychain sounds like there's [TS]

  trouble in syracuse county now so Sierra [TS]

  situation I've created my wife's imac [TS]

  like am I to see our pretty quickly [TS]

  after release and there i think i [TS]

  mentioned on the show a few weird bumps [TS]

  with keychain stuff I'm like well that [TS]

  happens when you just did the upgrade [TS]

  and apps need to be reauthorized because [TS]

  they think something's different or the [TS]

  Apple built-in apps have you know [TS]

  updated themselves and now you know [TS]

  whatever like that it's a common thing [TS]

  that happens if you have great that you [TS]

  have to do some stuff involving keychain [TS]

  but here we are on how many months after [TS]

  Sierra was released and I'm ready to [TS]

  call this a persistent problem that I [TS]

  can't attribute to data related to [TS]

  things because it happens on we all have [TS]

  accounts under 5k my cabins on my [TS]

  account there and happens on her account [TS]

  and often happens on the kids accounts [TS]

  that they probably don't have much stuff [TS]

  in a keychain now and this is what [TS]

  happens so we'll be using the computer [TS]

  you know people go up to it and switch [TS]

  their account and do their stuff and my [TS]

  son goes and changes as a counter plays [TS]

  minecraft my wife comes and changes to [TS]

  her account and does stuff you know [TS]

  whatever use the computer while [TS]

  everything is fine [TS]

  there's certain point I think it's [TS]

  probably multiple days because we never [TS]

  turn this computer opposite goes to [TS]

  sleep but it's never actually offer [TS]

  restarted after a couple of days [TS]

  you get a little notification the upper [TS]

  right-hand corner of the screen usually [TS]

  again I see it on my account of my [TS]

  wife's account that's probably because [TS]

  they're the ones on most often and it [TS]

  says you need to create new I cloud [TS]

  security code and the buttons on the [TS]

  notification dialogue are created and [TS]

  later if it later it goes away if you [TS]

  create it opens the iCloud preference [TS]

  pane and then does nothing like it [TS]

  doesn't do anything I claude [TS]

  préfontaine just sits there [TS]

  um i actually have gone through the [TS]

  motion of ok i will create a new I cloud [TS]

  security code didn't even you know I [TS]

  know how to do it i'll go into the thing [TS]

  and click on the thing blonde enter new [TS]

  code baba that appears to have no effect [TS]

  you can do it but doesn't matter couple [TS]

  days later you're going to see that like [TS]

  when you see that dialogue was trying to [TS]

  tell you like what you will find out [TS]

  later if you just continue to use your [TS]

  computer is that basically nothing [TS]

  involving passwords works usually show [TS]

  for me that like it can mount this [TS]

  technology anymore because the the [TS]

  password for the technologies and the [TS]

  keychain right and so can mount this [TS]

  analogy to do time machine backups to it [TS]

  it will stop doing time machines back up [TS]

  to it and complain that it can't do that [TS]

  if you try to log into a website or [TS]

  anything like that is not getting [TS]

  passwords out of the keychain if you try [TS]

  to login somewhere and enter a password [TS]

  and then try to save the password will [TS]

  say sorry couldn't say couldn't find the [TS]

  system keychain or couldn't find the [TS]

  login keychain or something like that to [TS]

  save your password and if you launch [TS]

  keychain access and look at it you see a [TS]

  bunch of blank on blank icons in the [TS]

  sidebar and a little Texas as read-only [TS]

  mode like it's like your key chains are [TS]

  all gone they're all still there if you [TS]

  look in your library you know keychains [TS]

  thing they're all sitting there [TS]

  the files are there they're perfectly [TS]

  fine as far as i can tell but keep an [TS]

  actress won't even show their icons let [TS]

  alone any of their contents and it says [TS]

  everything is in read-only mode and the [TS]

  only way to fix this is to reboot when [TS]

  you read everything's fine again for a [TS]

  couple days all your passwords are still [TS]

  there [TS]

  nothing is corrupted they removed the [TS]

  keychain first-aid menu item i have no [TS]

  idea what the hell it did but it made me [TS]

  feel good i would have tried that if [TS]

  that option is still there but is not [TS]

  but is totally inexplicable me I keep [TS]

  looking in activity monitor to see like [TS]

  is there is some sec tu no demon that is [TS]

  hung or something and I'll see it's [TS]

  showing up as red because it's not [TS]

  pulling events offer you know what i [TS]

  don't like is there something I can [TS]

  restart but I i have not figured this [TS]

  out and because it's one of those every [TS]

  few days type of problems sometimes [TS]

  maybe only once a week and the cure is a [TS]

  very fast reboot like [TS]

  my my motivation to troubleshoot it has [TS]

  been low but it's increasing but i don't [TS]

  really know what to do people saying to [TS]

  you know disk utility set user [TS]

  permissions on everything or you have [TS]

  the equivalent of repair permissions [TS]

  like impressions all seem to be fine and [TS]

  I don't quite know what is going wrong [TS]

  after days of using the computer that [TS]

  suddenly the keychain just go away like [TS]

  it's not corrupt files is not corrupt [TS]

  data because then just nothing would [TS]

  work ever and I don't even know where to [TS]

  distribute this to Sierra I keep hoping [TS]

  they'll be a point update to Sierra and [TS]

  like well whatever this will be some you [TS]

  know glitch and then it will go away in [TS]

  a point update but the point is face to [TS]

  Sierra don't seem to be coming out very [TS]

  quickly i know there's one in flight [TS]

  right now but I'm not on the beta train [TS]

  maybe I should get on that and see if it [TS]

  changes things what are you doing all [TS]

  this is say that is that has prevented [TS]

  me one of the many things that has [TS]

  prevented me from upgrading my [TS]

  technically incompatible mac pro two [TS]

  Sierra like well I don't want to do with [TS]

  that my macpro works the way it's [TS]

  supposed to and how many of these [TS]

  problems so why would I want to bring [TS]

  them on it could be related to a nice [TS]

  imac could be related to the specific [TS]

  data on there you know who knows it [TS]

  could be something corrupt in iCloud [TS]

  really I it's one of those things it's [TS]

  very difficult to know what the deal is [TS]

  but half the reason I'm mentioning on [TS]

  the show is because you know I've been [TS]

  doing it for a long time and it's you [TS]

  know worth getting out there in case of [TS]

  people having a problem but really it [TS]

  selfishly I'm hoping someone's gonna [TS]

  tell me how to fix it figures [TS]

  I just haven't had time to dive into [TS]

  this and figure out what the deal is and [TS]

  googling for it is not turning up [TS]

  anything maybe I'll actually you know [TS]

  you know you're really desperate i'm [TS]

  thinking of filing a radar like just [TS]

  because working even say that after some [TS]

  weird amount of time usually a couple [TS]

  days this happens and i'll just send [TS]

  them like screenshots of keychain access [TS]

  showing everything is blank and reboot [TS]

  and it fixes it so I don't know sort of [TS]

  tangentially related i don't remember [TS]

  when it was but it was easily a couple [TS]

  years ago I used to very frequently get [TS]

  this weird bug with my magic mouse and I [TS]

  don't remember it happening with the [TS]

  trackpad on my laptops but maybe it did [TS]

  but certainly with magic mouse if I [TS]

  would use the one fingers [TS]

  a left-to-right scroll in order to go [TS]

  back a page in safari the the active [TS]

  page would move right maybe 50 points a [TS]

  hundred points and then it would just [TS]

  freeze and safari would be like freaking [TS]

  useless until you quit and restart it [TS]

  and just the last day or two this is [TS]

  started to come back and it happened i [TS]

  believe on both my work and personal [TS]

  machines which was super creepy and [TS]

  really weird and it's only happened a [TS]

  couple times and I haven't had happened [TS]

  since but this was infuriating when it [TS]

  was common a couple years ago because i [TS]

  would have to like quit safari [TS]

  constantly and it actually also happened [TS]

  in chrome once which was also super [TS]

  weird and I don't need to hear anyone [TS]

  emailing me about how I should use [TS]

  chrome and safari or about how i should [TS]

  use safari and chrome my my web browser [TS]

  choices are my business thank you very [TS]

  much but it was certainly very weird and [TS]

  very not reliably reproducible so [TS]

  similarly i'm not sure what kind of [TS]

  radar I should fire file other than hey [TS]

  look the window is frozen with the with [TS]

  me a hundred points into a back [TS]

  animation that's weird [TS]

  totally sounds like a laptop bug [TS]

  everyone has laptop always liked or [TS]

  graphics bugs ready to like their GP [TS]

  your drivers are weird GPU issues [TS]

  especially with the dual GPU switching [TS]

  stuff like that could be my favorite [TS]

  thing is that the bug is sinking itself [TS]

  hopefully between your work and home [TS]

  computers right he takes head unlike [TS]

  your board shortcut I was just about to [TS]

  say that got hit I was just about to say [TS]

  idea of keyboard shortcuts are still [TS]

  lost in the ether but hey this bug is [TS]

  sinking just great thanks iCloud oh one [TS]

  more thing about my keychain thing I [TS]

  remembered this many times I don't know [TS]

  if this is related or separate for many [TS]

  times or since upgrading to Sierra the [TS]

  computer will get into a state where [TS]

  cannot go to any website using HTTPS you [TS]

  know pls know all that but it it you try [TS]

  to load one of them they will say sorry [TS]

  could make a secure connection or [TS]

  whatever whatever weird error screen to [TS]

  the browser doesn't matter the browser [TS]

  Sierra you know Safari Chrome but they [TS]

  even tried firefox was like it just [TS]

  can't do this a lot of the symptoms are [TS]

  explained like oh your time that the [TS]

  your clock is off because many things [TS]

  will get screwed up if your clock is off [TS]

  lot of like certificates and expiration [TS]

  things or [TS]

  just agreement between the two ends of a [TS]

  connection about what the hell time and [TS]

  date it is so almost all of the googling [TS]

  that you do about this like oh you just [TS]

  need to you know your computer's clock [TS]

  is wrong it's why you can't do anything [TS]

  involving chair that's why you can't do [TS]

  anything involving secure sites so I [TS]

  can't tell you the number of times like [TS]

  it's happening I mean look at the clock [TS]

  inside is that clock right is that [TS]

  today's date you know what year is it [TS]

  it's like I'm time traveling but and [TS]

  I've turned off and TP and turn it back [TS]

  on and just as far as i can tell every [TS]

  time this happened the time and date [TS]

  have been exactly correct and toggling [TS]

  that stuff does not restore anything to [TS]

  working state and again solution is [TS]

  always to restart and comes back like [TS]

  nothing is wrong and everything is [TS]

  perfectly fine [TS]

  yeah remember when we used to make fun [TS]

  of the windows users for restarting [TS]

  their computers constantly that was [TS]

  awesome i mean that the thing is like as [TS]

  as somebody whose windows user a lot [TS]

  until two thousand five or six or so I [TS]

  generally only had to restart my windows [TS]

  computer about as often as every start [TS]

  my mac you know and as partly because i [TS]

  was i got on the windows NT kernel early [TS]

  like I i start using Windows 2000 since [TS]

  it's a beta in February 99 like drop the [TS]

  98 Colonel it by the wayside as quickly [TS]

  as it possibly could even I couldn't [TS]

  print for like a year but it was worth [TS]

  it [TS]

  it's a fucking ok but so you know it [TS]

  generally if you if you treat your [TS]

  computer's well if you are if you know [TS]

  what you're doing you don't usually have [TS]

  to restart windows or max more [TS]

  frequently than the other it is the [TS]

  little concerning that like oh man [TS]

  there's so many bugs in mac OS now it's [TS]

  really kind of sad it makes me sad that [TS]

  you know we get feedback telling us to [TS]

  stop complaining about Apple because for [TS]

  some reason we aren't allowed to but it [TS]

  really does make me sad to see my my [TS]

  computing platform of choice that I love [TS]

  so much [TS]

  they're all there's a little lot of bugs [TS]

  now and it's it's not like massive [TS]

  showstoppers like George password think [TS]

  most of the time like most times it's [TS]

  more little stuff like the other day [TS]

  like i've been using apples apples new [TS]

  notes absence it was launched in what [TS]

  iOS 9 whatever that was I think that's [TS]

  right and i've been using that for like [TS]

  all my little by little notes and I'm a [TS]

  pretty light notes user in general like [TS]

  I don't I never liked heavily used to [TS]

  the dropbox editor before that I have [TS]

  something like you know [TS]

  15 notes maybe it isn't a large number [TS]

  of them and I'm not if they're like [TS]

  always open i'll open and check one [TS]

  thing and then close and it's worked [TS]

  perfectly for me until last week now [TS]

  like notes just basically don't think [TS]

  reliable between devices anymore like [TS]

  and I tried locking at iCloud log back [TS]

  in it doesn't work but it's just nothing [TS]

  can make my notes sink reliably to [TS]

  certain devices anymore like my laptop [TS]

  logging in logging out worked my ipad [TS]

  logging and logging out didn't work like [TS]

  it's just like it's everything I never [TS]

  had to do this stuff before and it's [TS]

  just like come on late and this is this [TS]

  is this is what makes iCloud bugs and I [TS]

  message also like you know if people [TS]

  have these problems I'm exercise [TS]

  beginning it is so often the the answer [TS]

  that you get if you if you ask people or [TS]

  even if he has heard that if you can get [TS]

  Apple to tell you anything [TS]

  the answer that you guys usually like [TS]

  well just like sign of iCloud clear [TS]

  everything off sign everything back in [TS]

  its like that's not a solution like that [TS]

  that should never be the answer that is [TS]

  never good enough that's like telling [TS]

  somebody restore your phone and you know [TS]

  I don't restore from backup starkly for [TS]

  your phone erased everything you lose [TS]

  everything but that's that's not an [TS]

  answer that that is not a good solution [TS]

  and there's just so many bugs now that [TS]

  come up seemingly for no reason when it [TS]

  you know in not even edge case usage [TS]

  like I feel like now you're an edge case [TS]

  if you don't have one of these bugs [TS]

  hitting at least one of your various [TS]

  Apple syncservices actually outside my [TS]

  damn keyboard shortcuts which in the [TS]

  grand scheme of things are not that [TS]

  important i actually don't really have [TS]

  any of these problems I'll for longest [TS]

  time when people would complain and moan [TS]

  about I message ever almost everyone had [TS]

  a horror story i might be an iMessage [TS]

  unicorn because i cannot recall a time [TS]

  that I've had more than just a very [TS]

  brief hiccup not this like continual in [TS]

  non delivered messages or out-of-band [TS]

  messages you know split conversations [TS]

  where your send a message to me and then [TS]

  like I reply to your day later but it [TS]

  shows up in a separate conversation so [TS]

  you have two conversations that are just [TS]

  mean you [TS]

  yeah but that makes perfect sense like I [TS]

  it's unfortunate lyrics cents short does [TS]

  not so the problem [TS]

  this is particularly bad with group [TS]

  messages but i believe the problem to be [TS]

  that somebody say like let's say two [TS]

  three of us and I send my message to [TS]

  john's phone number in Marcos email [TS]

  address and i know i know i know the [TS]

  source of the problem but we're the same [TS]

  people like this is not you know you [TS]

  send it to my apple ID and not to my [TS]

  phone of like we're the same people to [TS]

  same icon in the application combine [TS]

  them don't make them but no i agree with [TS]

  you i totally agree with you but at [TS]

  least that problem kind of sort of makes [TS]

  sense and really and like there's no [TS]

  solution to that because it's like uh [TS]

  you know you have to make sure even if [TS]

  you make sure all your devices are set [TS]

  to when i send a message I want to send [TS]

  it from either my phone number or my [TS]

  apple ID if you like if you make it all [TS]

  consistent on your end it doesn't matter [TS]

  because you can't control how people [TS]

  contact you and it's just it's chaos [TS]

  it's you will never be merged you can [TS]

  just you just gotta hope that people [TS]

  will reply to the same thing that I got [TS]

  it on a device that is configured like [TS]

  it's intractable it's not it's not good [TS]

  they need to come up with a solution to [TS]

  this [TS]

  see this is why the unified timelines [TS]

  bad because it gets you spoiled I'm just [TS]

  want my consistency and that's a series [TS]

  of events one following the other really [TS]

  confusing right I know it's ridiculous [TS]

  no but I also i'm trying to say is that [TS]

  outside of my damn keyboard shortcuts [TS]

  which drive me absolutely bananas i [TS]

  actually don't really have any common [TS]

  bug that I feel like I hit on a regular [TS]

  basis now that my ram is actually for [TS]

  kick but I I do feel that the one off [TS]

  bugs like for example at a kernel panic [TS]

  earlier today which is something i [TS]

  haven't had happened in a long time it's [TS]

  gotta be the ram yep it was my works not [TS]

  sure I've a kernel panic like I average [TS]

  about one kernel panic per year over all [TS]

  idevices that's about right [TS]

  yes and I go multiple years without any [TS]

  and it's like being in a cluster in a [TS]

  year or you know it's and whenever I see [TS]

  when I think something is wrong [TS]

  hardware-wise at this point talking [TS]

  about how often you reboot like in the [TS]

  bad old days of the maxima nineties you [TS]

  know you would hear the bombs the little [TS]

  bonds that marker will insert into the [TS]

  podcast at this point all [TS]

  over the office all the time from poor [TS]

  developers on classic mac OS trying to [TS]

  use Adobe products to get their work [TS]

  done and it's just inevitable that [TS]

  you'll get all system freeze at some [TS]

  point probably averaging like one point [TS]

  something per day for them if you if you [TS]

  knew what you were doing and have [TS]

  limited set of non adobe software [TS]

  essentially like I could go days and [TS]

  days with just might be be edited and [TS]

  you know I e5 running or whatever but [TS]

  eventually you don't know if you're [TS]

  doing anything complicated or stressing [TS]

  and warm water staying in this little [TS]

  groove you know no no memory protection [TS]

  is like is this some reason Marco got [TS]

  off of windows 95 98 on to 2050 just [TS]

  want to get out of that world so things [TS]

  are still way better than you know in [TS]

  living memory and my very vivid living [TS]

  memory of how bad it used to be an idiot [TS]

  you know the colonel packs like in terms [TS]

  of what is the stability of the core [TS]

  system that is one of things i [TS]

  emphasized early on my OS 10 reviews [TS]

  then called Mac os10 they they did a [TS]

  really good job with the like does the [TS]

  operating system crash but as a user you [TS]

  don't care [TS]

  basically if the colonel crashes because [TS]

  if the if the entire UI freezes and the [TS]

  only way to get out of it is like you [TS]

  know kill login window and send you back [TS]

  to the login screen it might be Colonel [TS]

  might as well have crashed because [TS]

  everything you were doing his host was [TS]

  like all the operating system is fine [TS]

  like the colonel still running and just [TS]

  killed a bunch of processes and it came [TS]

  back and basically like you I freeze vs [TS]

  operating system crash it doesn't matter [TS]

  from the users perspective but [TS]

  technically speaking I would say that [TS]

  Mac os10 specifically and iOS I'm to Rio [TS]

  bow to tell you about some iOS we're [TS]

  going after this but the core OS is very [TS]

  solid like to have used mac OS 10 for [TS]

  how many years you know 10 years 15 [TS]

  years 17 whatever the hell it is [TS]

  kernel panics are just not a thing in my [TS]

  life and like you said Marko if you see [TS]

  one immediately think hardware problem [TS]

  that's how reliable the horror os's [TS]

  things above that might started flaking [TS]

  and by the way the the suggestion for [TS]

  the chat room which I'm definitely gonna [TS]

  try because it smells right to make from [TS]

  a tipster for solve my problem is turn [TS]

  off iCloud keychain which I have turned [TS]

  on because anything that involves iCloud [TS]

  could you know could be like locking my [TS]

  files and some weird-ass way it's like [TS]

  fine I'll just turn that feature off and [TS]

  not [TS]

  the the stuff so you can see if that [TS]

  solves it because I everything we've [TS]

  listed so far as like if it involves [TS]

  iCloud that means it involves something [TS]

  other than the bits on your computer and [TS]

  is very often buggy but anyway I i think [TS]

  the stability and reliability of [TS]

  everything not having to do with cloud [TS]

  services on the mac has pretty much [TS]

  gotten better over time [TS]

  it's a lumpy path there are regressions [TS]

  and everything is not a straight pop you [TS]

  know upward line it goes up and down up [TS]

  and down but in general the trend is [TS]

  good so I'm thankful for that every day [TS]

  and then it makes me appreciate all the [TS]

  more my beautiful 2008 powermac which is [TS]

  just at this point because it's running [TS]

  like the very latest version of El Cap [TS]

  and it [TS]

  I mean it's just it's just incredibly [TS]

  solid i can't remember the last time i [TS]

  had any kind of problem it would just [TS]

  get another reason i'm motivated [TS]

  upgraded to give machine [TS]

  all I was trying to say earlier is that [TS]

  go outside of these one-offs here and [TS]

  there I do think that things are pretty [TS]

  good and this is what you were you know [TS]

  saying John did things are so much [TS]

  better than they used to be and i don't [TS]

  i don't want to perpetuate the oh all [TS]

  the three of us to do is complain idea [TS]

  but because things are pretty darn great [TS]

  as long as you're not trying to keep a [TS]

  sink keyboard text replacement underwear [TS]

  ok I have literally never use that [TS]

  feature i have never created or deleted [TS]

  any of these things until until earlier [TS]

  last week when I was I was setting up my [TS]

  new laptop and i noticed i was going [TS]

  through the preference windows it was [TS]

  the first clean install I done in a long [TS]

  time and it in this in this text [TS]

  shortcuts was about 16 copies of the [TS]

  default on my way entry that they're [TS]

  like the heads gotta let that go great [TS]

  that's I've literally never touched this [TS]

  feature and somehow i have 16 copies of [TS]

  this like obviously there is no effort [TS]

  being put into this reach the reason [TS]

  that feature always comes up in our [TS]

  circles is because it is like it's like [TS]

  the easiest I example of sync like the [TS]

  amount of data is so small it's all just [TS]

  text and it's a lightly or unused [TS]

  feature it's almost as if like if you [TS]

  wanted to a demo application of like [TS]

  cloudkit and the sinking services that [TS]

  modern sitting services he would say [TS]

  let's just pretend we're thinking you [TS]

  know keyboard shortcuts was just you [TS]

  know name-value pairs all plain text [TS]

  like it can't get any easier than that [TS]

  and if that doesn't work a hundred [TS]

  percent rock solid reliable what hope in [TS]

  the world does anybody have to build a [TS]

  reliable singing engine for an [TS]

  application with actual complicated data [TS]

  on top of apples cloud services so [TS]

  that's why it always comes up like it's [TS]

  not just because we're all obsessed with [TS]

  text shortcuts because yeah it's it's [TS]

  like a canary [TS]

  you know it's like if they if that [TS]

  doesn't work then you know as a [TS]

  developer a don't even bother trying to [TS]

  build like you're here sophisticated [TS]

  applications on top of this thing engine [TS]

  and and if that doesn't work then it has [TS]

  a user makes you less confident any of [TS]

  apples on more complicated singing [TS]

  things I mean that that's why that's why [TS]

  notes having a problem for me this past [TS]

  week is is really concerning for me [TS]

  because this it was reliable for the [TS]

  last you know here and a half whatever [TS]

  it's been since they launched it and [TS]

  then all the sudden now it's just not [TS]

  and I've tried the basic debugging [TS]

  techniques i go to log out log back in [TS]

  clear everything restarts like that [TS]

  doesn't work that well [TS]

  ok now what you know it is not a [TS]

  department technique that's just like [TS]

  that the only thing you can do exactly [TS]

  notes actually no it's actually [TS]

  surprisingly sophisticated like it's not [TS]

  just text shortcuts like because it does [TS]

  do like trying to do like merging of [TS]

  changes in simultaneous accent some [TS]

  fresh air knows do you share notes like [TS]

  do you have like a shared like grocery [TS]

  list with you and tiff where you both [TS]

  have access to the same note to read [TS]

  right you know google docs I'll think we [TS]

  I've only ever do that with OneNote and [TS]

  it's no longer there [TS]

  yeah so I mean we we take it for granted [TS]

  like with the fact that we sit here and [TS]

  open edit this google doc that has not [TS]

  sure what's in it [TS]

  have we ever had data destroying bugs or [TS]

  things that have caused it to be corrupt [TS]

  or Casey write something and I say case [TS]

  you do write something I don't see [TS]

  anything that has literally never [TS]

  happened google docs whatever whatever [TS]

  they're doing it just always works is [TS]

  the greatest app in the world know is it [TS]

  possible to get weird things like when I [TS]

  was trying to select some text in case [TS]

  it was riding earlier my selection move [TS]

  because the texts going under it but you [TS]

  stopped selecting you try again but like [TS]

  that's one of the reasons i have such [TS]

  faith in google and their and their [TS]

  cloud service stuff plus or minus [TS]

  privacy stuff which you know use your [TS]

  own judgment is that the the basics you [TS]

  know google docs can multiple people a [TS]

  text document the same time doesn't get [TS]

  screwed up proof is in the pudding yes [TS]

  they totally can wear [TS]

  if we had gone with marcos one time [TS]

  perhaps sarcastic suggestion to you is [TS]

  like a shared pages document i have [TS]

  little faith that would have been a [TS]

  successful I never said shared pages i [TS]

  would never suggested that was someone [TS]

  you suggested we try like I work [TS]

  commerce something I could have been a [TS]

  joke [TS]

  yeah we did try there there was like [TS]

  there were a couple of other web [TS]

  services that we tried that people have [TS]

  recommended and none of those really [TS]

  worked out for us either [TS]

  and so we just came back to the google [TS]

  docs because it's google docs is [TS]

  basically like the the windows of my [TS]

  collaboration it's like that that's [TS]

  that's a that's too harsh i think as I [TS]

  yeah but when it comes to share tax [TS]

  documents reliability [TS]

  I mean it's not a bad application like [TS]

  it's not it's not great the UI could be [TS]

  a little bit weird but like it works all [TS]

  the time and it more or less has the [TS]

  features we need and like none of us [TS]

  ever think about it like i don't think [TS]

  we spend time worrying about how Google [TS]

  Docs working extra now or it's just it's [TS]

  just that and that's ideal for a tool [TS]

  you're going to use for this purpose [TS]

  just like it's not in the front of any [TS]

  of our minds ever we sponsor tonight by [TS]

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  month for that you just pay up front for [TS]

  the device and they cover the cost of [TS]

  the service now that's always on 3g let [TS]

  you know where vehicles parked at any [TS]

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  it also works with if this then that [TS]

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  actually tell you [TS]

  and of course there's lots of the things [TS]

  you can do with this you can integrate [TS]

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  thank you very much the automatic for [TS]

  sponsoring our show you have to my I'm [TS]

  iOS issues that the same as last time I [TS]

  just want to get this probably just like [TS]

  a whole like bug complaint show and now [TS]

  I don't want it to be I'm trying to I'm [TS]

  trying to bring it back but I but we all [TS]

  have too many new enemies isn't its bug [TS]

  complaint / desperately tried to [TS]

  crowdsource solutions to your own [TS]

  personal problem i thought we could move [TS]

  in theory you could be helping other [TS]

  people too so this trip should have [TS]

  followed but too late i was talking [TS]

  about plugging my light my big fat ugly [TS]

  lighting connected your pods into my [TS]

  iphone 7 and how case when it doesn't [TS]

  work and i just grabbed some scenarios [TS]

  where it doesn't work I could come up [TS]

  with a new scenario where it doesn't [TS]

  work where I pick up my phone I don't [TS]

  know what are your things maybe I I [TS]

  probably already unlocked it and [TS]

  overcast the front doorstep or whatever [TS]

  i plug in my headphones put the earpods [TS]

  in my ear I hit the big honking triangle [TS]

  play button overcast and sound starts [TS]

  coming out of the speakers on the phone [TS]

  yeah and there's a long time between the [TS]

  time when i plug in the headphones and [TS]

  the time and like when that happens it's [TS]

  like it's like getting out an escalator [TS]

  is not moving you're like wait what I [TS]

  you know because i plug in the [TS]

  headphones like seven seconds ago as I'm [TS]

  you know and sometimes you plug in the [TS]

  headphones then you go to springboard or [TS]

  going to go to overcast or like [TS]

  eventually you get there you know go to [TS]

  the podcast hit the play button the [TS]

  earpods have been in your ears for what [TS]

  seemed like forever and hit play and [TS]

  start playing audio out of the phone [TS]

  speaker and just like you just shake [TS]

  your head of the phone like what is what [TS]

  are you doing well like this is your [TS]

  basics like none of your previous [TS]

  iphones had this problem i plug the damn [TS]

  headphones and hit play on it on audio [TS]

  app the sound always came out of the [TS]

  headphones like always did like a [TS]

  hundred percent of the time I've run [TS]

  this experiment many times on every [TS]

  single ipod touch and every single [TS]

  iphone everything I've got [TS]

  shuffle hit play comes out because the [TS]

  headphones are plugged in when i was [TS]

  gonna come out like this is a and so [TS]

  that infuriated me [TS]

  yeah something's wrong with that it [TS]

  happens it happens to me in my car also [TS]

  like like when the car bluetooth [TS]

  captures the the output about once a [TS]

  week it will just play through the phone [TS]

  speaker still even the car things [TS]

  connected the the phone thanks to the [TS]

  car but it still plays after the phone's [TS]

  internal speaker instead bluetooth never [TS]

  works like I'm not in a car with you [TS]

  which is usually works like that that's [TS]

  the high-grade not my bluetooth is not [TS]

  when my bluetooth my honda is incredibly [TS]

  unreliable have all sorts of situations [TS]

  like that I'm used to dealing with the [TS]

  headphones like the reason it's so the [TS]

  reason it's so disturbing to me is like [TS]

  headphones are just you know I'm just in [TS]

  my kitchen right this is this is hunt [TS]

  previously hundred percent reliable [TS]

  technology so I'm really my opinion is [TS]

  goin downhill fast [TS]

  well it was never in the way iOS handles [TS]

  audio routing two different devices has [TS]

  never been a hundred percent reliable I [TS]

  think it any different releases as they [TS]

  like update and change certain [TS]

  subsystems to enable new things or [TS]

  whatever certain os's are better than [TS]

  others and I think I OS 10 is [TS]

  particularly bad in this area of like [TS]

  selecting the right output device [TS]

  reliably but this like almost every iOS [TS]

  version that comes out like almost every [TS]

  you know Beta Thetas one through five [TS]

  almost every high-res version every year [TS]

  have some massive problem with audio [TS]

  routing i don't know why i like audio [TS]

  writing is just always messed with [TS]

  I assume all they're all the changes in [TS]

  iOS 10 were to accommodate the air prods [TS]

  and and all the different because that's [TS]

  like bluetooth audio that really messed [TS]

  up for a while the beta and i'm pretty [TS]

  sure that's why but like whatever they [TS]

  do it but they're always having to mess [TS]

  with the audio stack in weird ways that [TS]

  leave it very unreliable and one of the [TS]

  very frequent problems I've always had [TS]

  with phones every once in a while you [TS]

  will tell your pocket to play and it [TS]

  will think there's no speakers connected [TS]

  to the phone any form like a little show [TS]

  like nothing in the in the in the in the [TS]

  source list from the from the airplay [TS]

  icon or it'll show like iphone as the [TS]

  only entry and he usually have to use [TS]

  reboot when Ellie there's nothing you [TS]

  can do you reboot at that point but the [TS]

  that's been a long-standing iOS bug and [TS]

  again like almost every iOS version has [TS]

  something like that [TS]

  going wrong with it every so often heavy [TS]

  but have you ever plugged in plain old [TS]

  headphones into a plain old headphone [TS]

  jack on iOS device and then played audio [TS]

  and not have to come out that phones [TS]

  I've literally never had that experience [TS]

  to like this week but the light and [TS]

  that's a good point that I know you're i [TS]

  have not had that happen to me but now [TS]

  every device is is a is whatever the [TS]

  class of device that like Bluetooth and [TS]

  car things get like now headphones like [TS]

  that too because of progress and courage [TS]

  and now they got their own little [TS]

  computers in there [TS]

  yeah so so the other thing that I saw [TS]

  which is I'm sure related to this but it [TS]

  was really weird because I've never seen [TS]

  this one you know I iOS occasionally [TS]

  freaks out I was for the most part is [TS]

  incredibly reliable like I don't reboot [TS]

  my iOS device they just run and run and [TS]

  run and run that's the way it's supposed [TS]

  to be but recently on my iphone 7 again [TS]

  plug in the headphones i plug in the [TS]

  headphones and then I hit the play [TS]

  button i think i might have been sipping [TS]

  on the lock screen because you know the [TS]

  little the media controls are so extreme [TS]

  and the play button to play and it [TS]

  doesn't play anything like well climb [TS]

  whatever doesn't plan unlimited unlock [TS]

  the phone but first let me unplug and [TS]

  plug free plug headphones which is you [TS]

  know the first thing hit the play button [TS]

  nothing happens then like weight is the [TS]

  play button even activating let me [TS]

  unlock the phone and actually go to [TS]

  overcast and it's a play button there [TS]

  and i noticed that i can unlock the [TS]

  phone like always the stupid fingerprint [TS]

  is that the problem i'll forget about [TS]

  the fingerprint let me just press the [TS]

  home button so i can do the you know [TS]

  might enter my password so i can unlock [TS]

  my phone which i never do because I just [TS]

  try to all the time and I can't get the [TS]

  password screen to come up and then I i [TS]

  hit the home button and nothing is [TS]

  happening and hit the power button and [TS]

  the phone doesn't go back to sleep and [TS]

  so i'm i'm hitting every physical [TS]

  control and semi physical control i'm [TS]

  pulling out the headphones and putting [TS]

  them back in [TS]

  I'm hitting the non-moving home button [TS]

  I'm hitting the power button and [TS]

  literally nothing is happening [TS]

  the screen is just sitting there staring [TS]

  at me it is not turning on is not [TS]

  turning off is not unlocking is not [TS]

  presenting me with unlock screen I i [TS]

  tried to do what I think I don't know [TS]

  what is this is the case when trying to [TS]

  go from memory like oh what's the what's [TS]

  the new like you know hard reboot thing [TS]

  so i doing like volume up and the power [TS]

  button i think that's wrong I didn't you [TS]

  know [TS]

  volume down anyway I tried various [TS]

  combinations the buns probably all which [TS]

  were wrong [TS]

  none of which did anything i think if i [TS]

  had that correctly found the one that [TS]

  read that kills it honestly [TS]

  you would have just you know turned off [TS]

  like the equivalent of yanking the plug [TS]

  great but I didn't find it right and I [TS]

  I'm doing this for you know I don't know [TS]

  a minute two minutes and then eventually [TS]

  things start happening and I realize it [TS]

  is catching up with everything that I've [TS]

  done over the past several men and I've [TS]

  seen this happen but having to I want to [TS]

  at all of a sudden I see the volume [TS]

  changing and going up and down the [TS]

  lockscreen coming and just and I was [TS]

  fine and then everything freaks out the [TS]

  Apple pay screen pops up because you [TS]

  kept in the home button [TS]

  yep yep yep it eventually got out of [TS]

  that all that out of its system like [TS]

  okay well it's back online [TS]

  Banzai didn't reboot the thing but that [TS]

  whole time when it was freaking out [TS]

  yeah it would seem to be kicked off by [TS]

  me plugging in my headphones but who the [TS]

  heck knows anyway that was that's very [TS]

  antisocial behavior that also makes me [TS]

  concerned about my iphone yeah that [TS]

  would that happen to me if like a few [TS]

  maybe a couple months ago I tweeted [TS]

  about it and I got a lot of responses [TS]

  from people saying that happen to them [TS]

  too and it so it seems like that's not [TS]

  that uncommon but yeah she's like Sierra [TS]

  iOS 10 is new so like I just want more [TS]

  point releases cut that you [TS]

  well I guess but like Ciara still here [TS]

  has not had a lot of point releases what [TS]

  is it up to adjust the point one still a [TS]

  ESN 12-1 yeah although dot to is is I [TS]

  believe in pretty late at this point but [TS]

  yeah it's all the rumors about the new [TS]

  polaris GPU drivers with making people [TS]

  think about mac pros in there anyway I i [TS]

  I'm ready for point releases because [TS]

  every point releasing like well maybe [TS]

  they fix this annoying thing so I intend [TS]

  to this thing on their beta 7 of 10 to I [TS]

  mean obviously they're more cautious [TS]

  with the iOS releases so it's taking [TS]

  awhile for ten to appear but it was like [TS]

  10-1 they don't do the the three-digit [TS]

  numbers iOS versions are gonna do but [TS]

  it's only for bug fixes and for the last [TS]

  section [TS]

  yeah anyway hopefully when both of these [TS]

  os's both mac OS and iOS get their next [TS]

  point releases some are all these things [TS]

  will improve our high on that happy note [TS]

  tell us about Amazon go so Amazon as [TS]

  chief summer and chief amazon has come [TS]

  up with a hey look we're building video [TS]

  that is only couple minutes long is [TS]

  worth watching and basically it's taking [TS]

  apples easy steal to the next level [TS]

  the general premises you scan a things [TS]

  like a QR code that's on your phone as [TS]

  you walk through a turnstile on your way [TS]

  in then you grab whatever it is you want [TS]

  to purchase and then you walk out and [TS]

  between my computer vision and [TS]

  presumably like you know [TS]

  wait detection or something like that [TS]

  rfid imagine an RFID you know no rfid [TS]

  what did they say was an RFID I'm [TS]

  surmising that no okay so what are the [TS]

  catchphrases they use computer vision [TS]

  keep learning algorithms sensor fusion [TS]

  are the three things they say we just [TS]

  know you bought an Altoid you always [TS]

  biting about ways we just assume you're [TS]

  gonna buy one every time at this point [TS]

  and most particularly charge you for [TS]

  things that you're gonna buy the future [TS]

  minority report a bunch of all people in [TS]

  bathtubs know what you're gonna die haha [TS]

  which is probably not far from the truth [TS]

  minus the bathtubs in the people and [TS]

  we're gonna that's what the market send [TS]

  you that the thing with the baby [TS]

  supplies before you know you're pregnant [TS]

  yeah i got that big data that really [TS]

  happened kids there's I'm not gonna put [TS]

  an article in the show notes because [TS]

  will take me three days to find it but [TS]

  that really did happen anyway we'll take [TS]

  three seconds to find out and have maybe [TS]

  but the point is you walk in you scan a [TS]

  QR code your phone to identify who you [TS]

  are you buy some things then you leave [TS]

  and there's no check out you just walk [TS]

  right out in in principle this sounds [TS]

  pretty neat to me [TS]

  we should probably you know but have a [TS]

  moment to to mention humans need not [TS]

  apply which is a great video by friend [TS]

  of the show cgpgrey about how when [TS]

  things like this autumn like these [TS]

  automations happen that means that [TS]

  eventually humans will not have jobs [TS]

  which is a problem but that horrible [TS]

  dystopian future side that sounds pretty [TS]

  cool so here's what I think about how [TS]

  this works based on this video and the [TS]

  store by the way isn't open yet is gonna [TS]

  be one location Seattle it's not open [TS]

  yet so all we've got is a video on a [TS]

  page that has a bunch of information so [TS]

  it shows there's no turn stop by the way [TS]

  that would be barbaric you walk in [TS]

  through these you know these little you [TS]

  know that they have little dividers that [TS]

  you scan your QR code is not as if [TS]

  you're going to like a subway turnstile [TS]

  or amusement park current source you [TS]

  just walk through the QR code scan now [TS]

  the thing those you're in the store and [TS]

  I think one of the key technologies is [TS]

  that the video says and then just put [TS]

  your phone away is like your skin [TS]

  I think with your phone like an apples [TS]

  apple store app or whatever [TS]

  once you scan your QR code and enter you [TS]

  still have to have your phone on you but [TS]

  you just put in your pocket is not [TS]

  involved in this you're not you're not [TS]

  tapping products with your phone you're [TS]

  not scanning them with your phone and [TS]

  your phone's camera is not seeing them [TS]

  like it's in your pocket right but they [TS]

  do have I think one part of this is [TS]

  proximity like it knows roughly where [TS]

  you are in the store probably using [TS]

  those ibeacons or similar type of [TS]

  technology and knows what your phone has [TS]

  to be on so it knows where it knows that [TS]

  you're in the store and nose roughly [TS]

  where you are and the computer vision [TS]

  thing like if you look at the video [TS]

  every product that people are getting [TS]

  it's kind of like they're inside a giant [TS]

  vending machine where things like slide [TS]

  down like the candy bar slides down a [TS]

  little twisty corkscrew right and the [TS]

  next one comes like everything isn't a [TS]

  single file lane where you grab the [TS]

  product of the front which by the way i [TS]

  would never do because you always gotta [TS]

  pull from the back middle right anyway [TS]

  and I assume they have cameras all over [TS]

  plus like your light weight sensors and [TS]

  any other things like sensor fusion of [TS]

  knowing someone has picked a product off [TS]

  of this shelf you know which practice [TS]

  because you know which road came in it's [TS]

  not like they're haphazardly shelters [TS]

  some some employees like shelving there [TS]

  there in precise rows and when you [TS]

  pulling off then-no you pulling off and [TS]

  you know it was you [TS]

  based on proximity of where your phone [TS]

  is now what if you are [TS]

  shoulder-to-shoulder with three other [TS]

  people who are also pulling things off I [TS]

  suppose if you're all reach over each [TS]

  other and all three grab things out of [TS]

  the same I'll that you're standing in [TS]

  front of it's possible to confuse the [TS]

  thing but what we're getting as I think [TS]

  it's not our ad i think there is no [TS]

  they're not rfid tags on every single [TS]

  one of these things are good as plain [TS]

  old containers [TS]

  there's nothing special about the [TS]

  containers everything is about sensing [TS]

  where you are with the phone and [TS]

  figuring out when people pull things out [TS]

  of these very specific restricted little [TS]

  columns of food and the food that you're [TS]

  getting it's not like you're your [TS]

  supermarket where you can go buy you [TS]

  know a loaf of bread mayonnaise you know [TS]

  some ground beef like just it is more [TS]

  like prepared foods and little tins like [TS]

  in the prepared foods section of whole [TS]

  foods or whatever plus maybe a couple [TS]

  staples like milk and and butter and [TS]

  stuff like that but it is not a full [TS]

  French grocery store with everything you [TS]

  expect to see there i think partially [TS]

  because it will be hard to get all that [TS]

  into this format into this little slider [TS]

  down you know whatever like [TS]

  that these little rows of food and neat [TS]

  little containers that are all uniformly [TS]

  sized that's not how real grocery stores [TS]

  work and then finally the ideas that you [TS]

  know you grab the food and you just take [TS]

  it with you and usually if like there is [TS]

  no there's no scanning of your items as [TS]

  you leave there's no like you don't even [TS]

  have to scan your QR code on the way [TS]

  back out you just just walk out of the [TS]

  store doesn't care what you put the [TS]

  items and you have to put them into a [TS]

  special bag you don't have to like just [TS]

  you just take the crap and you leave and [TS]

  I say and you know we'll we'll charge [TS]

  your account for the amount that you [TS]

  bought you notice amazon they have all [TS]

  your information your credit cards or [TS]

  whatever and you can if you're [TS]

  interested in looking at the receipt you [TS]

  can look at it right in the same app [TS]

  that you scanned on the way and you [TS]

  launch this free app but this Amazon go [TS]

  up and it says up you just bought these [TS]

  five things right and when I saw that [TS]

  and I my wife look at this too and I [TS]

  know whatever action would be to some [TS]

  degree and when I saw it I thought of [TS]

  was like oh no no no checkout lines no [TS]

  waiting in line but if everybody who use [TS]

  this was like my wife which I don't [TS]

  think everybody in the world is but [TS]

  there are enough of them what would [TS]

  happen instead of people waiting at [TS]

  checkout lines is everybody would exit [TS]

  the store with their butt their stuff [TS]

  and as soon as they got the door they [TS]

  would be staring at their phone stopped [TS]

  in place staring at the phone to make [TS]

  sure that the receipt in the apt exactly [TS]

  matches everything that's in there back [TS]

  to make sure they weren't overcharged [TS]

  for anything right [TS]

  you know and so what would actually [TS]

  happen is the entrance to the store be [TS]

  clogged with a bunch of people who are [TS]

  all frantically checking the receipt to [TS]

  make sure they didn't get charged for [TS]

  five hundred cans of Hellmann's [TS]

  mayonnaise when really they just took [TS]

  one or whatever and then going back into [TS]

  the store and trying to correct it like [TS]

  you have to have for this to work it has [TS]

  to be like the people in the video it's [TS]

  like I just walk in the store I'm fine [TS]

  like I don't even need to look at this [TS]

  receive maybe later when i'm doing like [TS]

  my bills look at the receipt but i trust [TS]

  that it's fine but people who are you i [TS]

  don't know who are very careful about [TS]

  money spending want to know immediately [TS]

  have the same reason you check a paper [TS]

  receipt like are you are you guys paper [TS]

  received checkers like after you go to [TS]

  the grocery short do you look down the [TS]

  receipt or do you watch that like the [TS]

  scanning to make sure that everything is [TS]

  being scanned for the right price and [TS]

  that you know those to be 245 dollars [TS]

  and you know you check the receipt to [TS]

  make sure that they didn't charge you [TS]

  for something you didn't buy and you got [TS]

  the right prices not usually never yeah [TS]

  well some people are received checkers [TS]

  I'm definitely a scan watcher because [TS]

  what else do you have to do during that [TS]

  time I watched items being scanned in [TS]

  case but if they like you know scan that [TS]

  you know the potatoes five potatoes i [TS]

  have it comes up as like some ridiculous [TS]

  price because they thought it was you [TS]

  know you know seven pounds of saffron or [TS]

  something [TS]

  thank you good night you want to be [TS]

  watching for that stuff if you're not [TS]

  one of those people you can go la-dee-da [TS]

  and just leave but I think there's [TS]

  enough received checkers like you just [TS]

  watch people living here just least [TS]

  glance over the receipt you know make [TS]

  sure the total makes sense make sure if [TS]

  you saw something you bought because [TS]

  they were two for five dollars and that [TS]

  was a discount that you actually do get [TS]

  them four to five dollars and it's not [TS]

  like real grocery stores are clogged [TS]

  with people checking their receipts but [TS]

  that anxiety that like this magical [TS]

  system like can I trust this magical [TS]

  system initially that's going to be [TS]

  there now if it works really well [TS]

  eventually people just let go and say oh [TS]

  I don't need to keep checking that it's [TS]

  more reliable than humans is more [TS]

  reliable than you know then self [TS]

  checkouts more reliable than having a [TS]

  real cashier which i think will be a [TS]

  real challenge because a really good [TS]

  supermarket cashier it's way better than [TS]

  that's my self checkout sucks when you [TS]

  check yourself out you realize an [TS]

  experienced cashier who knows exactly [TS]

  what code enter for these particular [TS]

  kinds of green beans just bit of you [TS]

  know like the things that don't have [TS]

  codes on them a good human cashier is [TS]

  worth way more than we pay them you [TS]

  don't realize until you either have to [TS]

  check yourself out or you get a bad [TS]

  human cashier anyway if the machines can [TS]

  never match that will we will be happy [TS]

  and we will stop obsessing with it but I [TS]

  think we have a long way to go we get [TS]

  there and in the meantime the [TS]

  possibility of being overcharged is one [TS]

  thing and the second possibility is that [TS]

  the stupid thing will miss a bunch of [TS]

  stuff and you've got a lot of food so [TS]

  that's that's possible reason to check [TS]

  out the flagship store because i would [TS]

  imagine there's going to be at least an [TS]

  equal number of situations where it [TS]

  doesn't keep track of something you just [TS]

  got some free food and if you're not a [TS]

  receipt checker you're not going to know [TS]

  or care you're gonna eat the thing and [TS]

  then later the end of the month when you [TS]

  reconcile stuff your black everything [TS]

  was pretty cheap [TS]

  oh I got to keep missing that uh the [TS]

  bunch of bananas that I take from the [TS]

  story week it has been charging for this [TS]

  is no one there watching so you know [TS]

  someone who lives in Seattle should try [TS]

  to start out and then the right into the [TS]

  show how many bananas are you buying [TS]

  where you would even notice that when [TS]

  you got them for free or not because [TS]

  they don't cost [TS]

  what I mean it's one banana Michael what [TS]

  could it cost in dollars now you a lot [TS]

  of bananas you make a lot of banana [TS]

  bread that's a staple around here we get [TS]

  a lot of bananas and if like if they if [TS]

  they you know if they go over to get to [TS]

  ground people don't eat banana bread [TS]

  banana muffins it's like you know bonus [TS]

  can sound like you're buying too many [TS]

  bands on a number of fronts here can [TS]

  never have too much banana bread I don't [TS]

  think that's possible amen [TS]

  a man couldn't agree more Iran i'm [TS]

  interested in this I think it looks [TS]

  pretty neat i suspect that it won't be [TS]

  commonplace for years we discussed this [TS]

  briefly on clockwise today which i [TS]

  happen to be a guest host on we'll put a [TS]

  link in the show notes and I i think [TS]

  this is the indication of the future but [TS]

  i don't think we're quite into the [TS]

  future yet so we'll see but it looks [TS]

  very cool if it works and it's reliable [TS]

  so this is the type of thing i like to [TS]

  see Amazon doing amazon has lots of [TS]

  things a lot of which don't seem to be [TS]

  part of their core competencies or only [TS]

  you know tangentially like it's arguable [TS]

  whether everything that would eventually [TS]

  become amazon web services and you know [TS]

  as three and easy to and stuff it is [TS]

  that part of please don't [TS]

  they sell books on the internet you know [TS]

  in the nineties version of them right [TS]

  but of course they have to run their own [TS]

  servers but then they weren't really [TS]

  running their own servers on their web [TS]

  services for a long time but then [TS]

  eventually want to be so you can argue [TS]

  that like it may not seem like this is a [TS]

  core part of a company that sells two [TS]

  things over the internet but it is [TS]

  because it's how they run their business [TS]

  and then they do stuff like the fire [TS]

  phone and a tablet you can argue about [TS]

  that and like well it kind of works in [TS]

  with the giving you easy way to buy [TS]

  things and so on and so forth but this [TS]

  one seems very straightforward to me [TS]

  amazon at this point is a place that [TS]

  sells you anything that can be sold to [TS]

  people like physical goods and people [TS]

  think about Amazon physical stores like [TS]

  how funny that is all they know they [TS]

  drove all the booksellers the [TS]

  brick-and-mortar booksellers out of [TS]

  business and now now they're all dead [TS]

  the Bible the retail space that they [TS]

  vacated and then start their own stories [TS]

  haha its kind of morbid but a store [TS]

  where you sell things [TS]

  this is an Amazon way to do that selling [TS]

  things is Amazon's core competency right [TS]

  if anyone's gonna figure out how to sell [TS]

  things better it would be amazon and [TS]

  selling things like without her [TS]

  going to pay cashiers or anything like [TS]

  that like basically a you know at a [TS]

  store that is just like a big place that [TS]

  you go into and grab stuff and Amazon [TS]

  figures how to efficiently extract your [TS]

  money that's amazon's car companies to [TS]

  that the king of the stupid one click [TS]

  patent like amazon wants to make it so [TS]

  you buy things when you sneeze like you [TS]

  accidentally finds it so easy to buy [TS]

  things it is harder not to buy things [TS]

  like you can't even look it's like don't [TS]

  look at the amazon web page you'll [TS]

  accidentally by something with your [TS]

  retinol buying that sees your gaze [TS]

  lingering on something like that's you [TS]

  know anyway it and most people like it [TS]

  like the reason we all use Amazon like [TS]

  they didn't despite all the things i [TS]

  mean i like about their labor practices [TS]

  and all sorts of stuff like that the [TS]

  draw of their product making a [TS]

  convenient to buy things is a real thing [TS]

  and so if anyone's gonna bring this to [TS]

  us i give Amazon a fair shot because [TS]

  this is definitely in their wheelhouse [TS]

  and I want to go to a store that's like [TS]

  this i want them to work on the store [TS]

  over years and years and iterating [TS]

  iterator I don't want to give up on like [TS]

  the fire phone or whatever I want this [TS]

  one to work so that five ten years from [TS]

  now there's one near me we can just go [TS]

  into and you know how to wait on [TS]

  checkout lines anymore i hope they don't [TS]

  put all the other supermarkets out of [TS]

  business and I doubt they will but I'm [TS]

  I'm really rooting for this because i [TS]

  think i think this is and it's not like [TS]

  implausible future like you know [TS]

  hoverboards or whatever not the fake [TS]

  once the ruins [TS]

  I think that we're close to this kind of [TS]

  technology unlike what I've said about [TS]

  like true self driving cars which I [TS]

  think are farther off than everybody [TS]

  else thinks they are but that but real [TS]

  people really just don't have the same [TS]

  definition me about self-driving cars [TS]

  anyway I think this is close enough to [TS]

  work the first one's gonna be a disaster [TS]

  whatever but like work out the kinks [TS]

  give it a few years stick to it and I'm [TS]

  excited for this i would i would love it [TS]

  if it would ever come to the suburbs [TS]

  where I live but i think it's unlikely [TS]

  he will definitely come to where you [TS]

  live because rich people the core market [TS]

  for this totally want about you know [TS]

  someone like prepared foods i can you [TS]

  imagine how much stuff is going to cost [TS]

  you know going to whole foods and try to [TS]

  like you know a tiny cup of cup fruits [TS]

  like each one of them is made of dollar [TS]

  bills that's true [TS]

  the most expensive food items per pound [TS]

  in the universe unite two thoughts here [TS]

  first of all I love more about John [TS]

  making fun of Marco for being where the [TS]

  rich people live his John I think you [TS]

  need i'm in the rich people are too like [TS]

  that's where the stores are gonna be I'm [TS]

  pretty sure your neighborhood is more [TS]

  upscale than mine for the record it's [TS]

  not you live next to Batman I live next [TS]

  to like the people who were command [TS]

  staff hahaha before [TS]

  wow that was a pissing match i did not [TS]

  expect to be a part of but anyway I'm [TS]

  the other thing i will say which is now [TS]

  not nearly as funny but one time I was [TS]

  it worked like two years ago and I'd [TS]

  forgotten to bring a launch or maybe I'd [TS]

  I didn't bring lunch because i thought i [TS]

  was going out to eat and so I was [TS]

  without a lunch I was launched list and [TS]

  I thought to myself you know what I'm [TS]

  gonna treat myself when we go to Whole [TS]

  Foods I'm gonna get me you know one of [TS]

  those boxes where I go to the hot bar [TS]

  and put a whole bunch of stuff in there [TS]

  so when I got you look a little thing of [TS]

  ribs don't go for the hard-boiled eggs [TS]

  that way too much sound bar tricks [TS]

  it's funny you say that because i made [TS]

  the critical mistake of getting a mac [TS]

  and cheese which is like 18 pounds for [TS]

  of mac and cheese for like one bite and [TS]

  I went and I want to check out and put [TS]

  my box of goodies on the scale and it [TS]

  was like literally $18 nothing like that [TS]

  happens when i was about to guess eighty [TS]

  dollars as a joke price i was gonna be [TS]

  as 27 but i rather have a gauge on [TS]

  exactly how much food you're piling into [TS]

  the everyday there's this thing about [TS]

  prepared foods like a they're really [TS]

  expensive and you can kind of understand [TS]

  how they're really expensive you start [TS]

  doing the math on they have to pay for [TS]

  the raw ingredients they have to pay for [TS]

  that people remember they must have a [TS]

  huge amount of waste because all that [TS]

  stuff guess it doesn't get sold every [TS]

  day and they got to dump it or give it [TS]

  away or whatever right so I understand [TS]

  why it's expensive but be it doesn't [TS]

  taste very good like know if i was [TS]

  paying a lot of money if i was going to [TS]

  a restaurant and paying eighteen dollars [TS]

  for lunch I want something that taste [TS]

  you know the taste good enough to be [TS]

  worth $18 but that stuff that's sitting [TS]

  there under like heat lamps or whatever [TS]

  I don't like it is it is it doesn't [TS]

  taste good to me so I i will never buy [TS]

  that i will i will sooner by just the [TS]

  plain ingredients to something and make [TS]

  myself a sandwich out of the the loaf of [TS]

  bread and the three ingredients i got [TS]

  then by one other prepared things I [TS]

  maybe I'm just allergic to prepared [TS]

  foods and I [TS]

  want i want to either be freshly made or [TS]

  something that doesn't need to be fresh [TS]

  like you know I don't like a thing of [TS]

  yogurt or something where it's not like [TS]

  they're making it right there but it's [TS]

  you know it's it's a seal prepared food [TS]

  versus they made something for you at [TS]

  some point in the hopefully not too [TS]

  distant past and then just sits there [TS]

  waiting for you to buy it it seems like [TS]

  they don't know that salt exists that [TS]

  most of these prepared food bars tell [TS]

  you that you should never be going to [TS]

  just be going to Delhi you have actual [TS]

  Delhi Belly out there and they'll make [TS]

  you a sandwich out of the angry and [TS]

  those ingredients like they're sitting [TS]

  there in the thing like you know my [TS]

  beloved exile in your beloved chicken [TS]

  salad is the same deal someone [TS]

  salad is the same deal someone [TS]

  let's repair that and hopefully in the [TS]

  not too distant past and there's a lot [TS]

  of waste and they get rid of it but if [TS]

  it's a difference between the chicken [TS]

  salad sitting in a tub or even like [TS]

  whatever and chicken salad sandwiches [TS]

  sitting there in a case waiting for you [TS]

  to show up when you show up they make [TS]

  you chicken salad sandwich with the [TS]

  chicken salad upsetting the top but they [TS]

  make it right there and handed to you [TS]

  and that is so much better then if the [TS]

  sandwich was sitting there totally I [TS]

  mean it's you're talking now you know [TS]

  just like our previous discussion about [TS]

  like subway is like now you're in the [TS]

  category of like airport triangle box [TS]

  sandwiches and as those are just always [TS]

  sake it never get all right everybody [TS]

  whole foods is hopefully a little bit [TS]

  better than that but like there's [TS]

  nothing you can do about that you can't [TS]

  have how long as they had you know [TS]

  rotisserie chicken been sitting under [TS]

  the heat lamps [TS]

  I think that's a pretty that's a pretty [TS]

  shelf-stable thing where it's not going [TS]

  to get to gross but it's it's gross [TS]

  enough not to be worth like the $18 the [TS]

  case he's paying for the thing is yeah I [TS]

  will say though so I I don't usually [TS]

  participate in the in the prepared food [TS]

  bar at grocery stores because as you [TS]

  said as you pointed out i typically have [TS]

  you no more options around i can just go [TS]

  to one of those however I my crazy [TS]

  indulgence is the pre chopped vegetables [TS]

  that come on in the produce section [TS]

  the lazy person section yeah it's like [TS]

  if I didn't if I cooked meal like I [TS]

  don't buy everything pre-chopped but [TS]

  things that are really tedious i will [TS]

  often go that route just grab me just [TS]

  try this is fine is good enough i'll say [TS]

  10 minutes [TS]

  it's where it's worth the extra do not [TS]

  look at the price so you can sleep at [TS]

  night because that the sum of my [TS]

  look-alike are even I can't do that i [TS]

  cannot justify its stomach nine dollars [TS]

  for the chopped walnuts just put them [TS]

  back [TS]

  well nobody's want as long as you're [TS]

  terrible and they would never class nine [TS]

  dollars because water worthless because [TS]

  they're terrible i heard about your [TS]

  walnut hate know so they just the worst [TS]

  nights ever did they cost nothing [TS]

  because nobody likes them and anyway [TS]

  feels like brains but like you know [TS]

  somebody like pre-chopped you know a [TS]

  onion that i'm going to throw any way or [TS]

  like a whole bunch of peppers like [TS]

  that's gonna save me time and I also [TS]

  hate chopping onions because they make [TS]

  my eyes crazy so John alright like I [TS]

  I'll pay extra like two dollar premium [TS]

  for that way did you get pre chopped [TS]

  onions [TS]

  not every time but like you know if I'm [TS]

  making something that did that night [TS]

  I have a draw the line of that because [TS]

  once you break the cell walls and that [TS]

  stuff starts reacting make it changes [TS]

  the nature of the product you have to do [TS]

  it at time of preparation you can have [TS]

  those sitting there if it's going to fry [TS]

  pan who cares now but you know how long [TS]

  they've been sitting like as soon as you [TS]

  chop an onion the reaction start you've [TS]

  got you know that the everything mixing [TS]

  with the air producing that so few [TS]

  orgasms that you know with the water in [TS]

  your eyes that is because I'm get like [TS]

  that reaction starts as soon as you cut [TS]

  that onion so i don't i don't want that [TS]

  to start three hours before i prepare [TS]

  for me also i can pick up the things [TS]

  might be the limit of our prepared food [TS]

  laziness is and I've never done this but [TS]

  it has been done and I have accepted [TS]

  that has been done by appreciated [TS]

  Parmesan cheese [TS]

  I would rather try it myself because [TS]

  it's because the pre-shredded ads like [TS]

  five dollars a pound or something [TS]

  obscene to the price of the already very [TS]

  expensive Parmesan cheese [TS]

  i buy that your body of course is it [TS]

  some kind of like fancy like imported [TS]

  age now is it just parmigiano-reggiano [TS]

  there's only one thing its it is a it is [TS]

  a specific product this is what you [TS]

  should buy if you want it [TS]

  there's different grades that like [TS]

  there's different age lengths and [TS]

  there's like whether you get like dop [TS]

  official one or some crazy one out only [TS]

  the official and everything else that is [TS]

  not stamped on the outside as the real [TS]

  thing is I don't think I was even sells [TS]

  it and nobody should sell it and nobody [TS]

  should buy it but just the question is [TS]

  whether do you bring home a big chunk of [TS]

  his heart reason and great yourself or [TS]

  do you buy it pretty great and the pre [TS]

  graded ads tremendously to the cost and [TS]

  I don't like how they grate it they [TS]

  grate it to find that i like it to be a [TS]

  little bit thicker little pieces than [TS]

  them [TS]

  that's as far as I'll go no I by the pre [TS]

  created i think it's i think it's [TS]

  something like 12 bucks a pound [TS]

  no it's way more than that way more than [TS]

  an ungraded is 15 to 20 pound ungraded [TS]

  gonna go look good [TS]

  look everyone say this is really [TS]

  happening what is the show turned into I [TS]

  don't know the price of many things but [TS]

  I know the price of Parmesan cheese it [TS]

  is staple in our house the same as as [TS]

  milk and butter and eggs parmesan was [TS]

  the cheese you had me shred for the [TS]

  pizzas and then you utterly shamed me [TS]

  for my inability to show you you don't [TS]

  you can you not identified cheese that [TS]

  or no that was what's around that was [TS]

  mozzarella wasn't it yes [TS]

  my bad what I want when I tell tell the [TS]

  kids is pizza cheese [TS]

  yeah i was so scarred by the experience [TS]

  view shaming me for my inability to [TS]

  shred appropriately right back i'm gonna [TS]

  i'm gonna protect nineteen dollars a [TS]

  pound that's exactly right it is it is [TS]

  the ambrosia brand parmigiano-reggiano [TS]

  dop graded imported from Italy 19 bucks [TS]

  a pound really fine graded right really [TS]

  fine like a million tiny little wispy [TS]

  things that's two to find for me I'm [TS]

  sorry I like a little bit little bit [TS]

  thicker than that but yeah but sometimes [TS]

  if you're in a hurry and you realize you [TS]

  don't have it and it takes time to do it [TS]

  someone will come and arrived and with a [TS]

  pre-shredded thing and I always keep it [TS]

  separate from our real cheese which is [TS]

  in the dedicated tupperware container in [TS]

  the fridge [TS]

  I don't want to mix it together but [TS]

  sometimes you know you gotta do what you [TS]

  gotta do with that but that's it pretty [TS]

  cut vegetables no-good onions definitely [TS]

  know my wife gets a paper cut fruit all [TS]

  the time which I can't stand i just try [TS]

  desperately not to look at the price no [TS]

  matter what I want to peel it off [TS]

  without looking at so i just don't see [TS]

  like 1299 on this like tub like [TS]

  sad-looking watermelon and cantaloupe [TS]

  pieces like 1299 really really yeah like [TS]

  certain things that works better than I [TS]

  was like watermelon I I don't buy [TS]

  pre-cut because it is so expensive and [TS]

  and whole watermelons cost basically [TS]

  nothing right kind of shocking how [TS]

  little hole watermelons cost per pound [TS]

  like how do these even get transported [TS]

  here [TS]

  yeah as soon as you cut into cubes it [TS]

  becomes like gold it's dipped in printer [TS]

  ink the only ones that are more [TS]

  expensive than pre-cut fruit plate like [TS]

  certain things are actually worth [TS]

  getting freakin certain things work but [TS]

  it's only like one of the things like it [TS]

  like it was like if you if you need [TS]

  shredded Brussels sprouts for like a [TS]

  salad or something like that they sell [TS]

  those in a little box now and it's [TS]

  pretty good and you can't tell it they [TS]

  taste just as good if you have chopped [TS]

  fresh Brussels sprouts and takes way [TS]

  less time and here you have shredded [TS]

  president is it isn't expensive like [TS]

  certain things it's worth it but [TS]

  obviously not everything not watermelon [TS]

  beer sponsor tonight by a betterment go [TS]

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  accidental food podcast by late breaking [TS]

  news [TS]

  microsoft is bringing windows desktop [TS]

  access apps to mobile arm processors so [TS]

  this is sort of kind of Windows RT but [TS]

  not windows 10 on arm this is from the [TS]

  Virgin's arriving thanks to a [TS]

  partnership with Qualcomm initially [TS]

  microsoft will support the qualcomm [TS]

  snapdragon 835 processors in laptops are [TS]

  expected to be the first devices will [TS]

  see in the market next year [TS]

  microsoft is enabling Windows 10 to [TS]

  support arm chips directly by building [TS]

  an emulator into the operating system [TS]

  devices will be able to run x86 win32 [TS]

  applications but they will not support [TS]

  x64 this is part of that story we had on [TS]

  the past show and the rumor was that it [TS]

  was going to be armed 64 could emulate [TS]

  x86 64 stuff and that was going to be in [TS]

  the future I don't know if this is a [TS]

  separate story where they're doing 32 [TS]

  now and 64 later but the power cities [TS]

  that they get from having like laptops [TS]

  with arm processors in them not going to [TS]

  be helped by emulating access ok it's so [TS]

  true [TS]

  interesting though it's certainly [TS]

  interesting because I mean we've been [TS]

  talking on and off about the you know [TS]

  max on our man in fact I should plug [TS]

  upgrade [TS]

  I had a wonderful episode this week [TS]

  where Jason smell made some really [TS]

  fascinating points on our macs and kind [TS]

  of that what the position of the mac is [TS]

  I won't try to summarize his position [TS]

  but I I really agree with a lot of it [TS]

  and and you should take a listen to that [TS]

  show but agreed that was excellent [TS]

  yeah but this is somewhat interesting [TS]

  news because Windows RT from everything [TS]

  is understood was kind of crappy because [TS]

  nothing was cross compiled for it so [TS]

  yeah was in and of itself was fine and [TS]

  maybe the battery life is good and I [TS]

  think maybe those with the surfaces [TS]

  certify that didn't have fans its memory [TS]

  serves [TS]

  but anyways but nobody could run the [TS]

  apps on it was nobody cross compiled [TS]

  forearms so this could solve that [TS]

  problem but i also agree with you John [TS]

  that it's not necessarily going to help [TS]

  think of things in terms of battery life [TS]

  if you're emulating in do x86 I think [TS]

  they want people to compile their apps [TS]

  for Windows forearm like that's what [TS]

  they want to happen that's what you're [TS]

  going to get that windows RT and it [TS]

  didn't and so it's like all right try [TS]

  number two what if we have a Malaysian [TS]

  then more people will buy them because [TS]

  they won't feel like you know that they [TS]

  are trying to solve the chicken egg [TS]

  situation people invited there's no [TS]

  absolute people make apps with no one [TS]

  buys them like i will put the emulation [TS]

  in and hopefully that will trick people [TS]

  into bottom number is a trick like [TS]

  hopefully that will motivate people to [TS]

  buy all you know you can totally run [TS]

  your existing copy of office [TS]

  it'll be fine really and then once we [TS]

  get everyone to buy them then app [TS]

  developers will say your app can run [TS]

  better on their cool are empowered [TS]

  ultrabook thing because yours will be [TS]

  compiled natively forearm and i will [TS]

  give you selling advantage [TS]

  I don't know people still buy software [TS]

  one knows that better than adobe [TS]

  software and autocad and anyway should [TS]

  make fun of that because they probably [TS]

  have a more robust professional [TS]

  application ecosystem apples at this [TS]

  point probably oh but yeah so it this [TS]

  this is a mean it's a pretty smart [TS]

  attempt to try to to solve this problem [TS]

  now why a Microsoft so seemingly [TS]

  desperate to get windows off of x86 I [TS]

  don't know maybe like this is the slow [TS]

  divorce of wintel right where Microsoft [TS]

  wants to be everywhere and all platforms [TS]

  and intel cpus are expensive compared to [TS]

  arm one [TS]

  use of supposedly equivalent ballpark [TS]

  power and Microsoft's not making RPC arm [TS]

  CPUs at this point but maybe partnering [TS]

  with Qualcomm is a different power [TS]

  balance than partnering with intel and I [TS]

  don't know but this is definitely seems [TS]

  like a very slow change happening over [TS]

  in a mostly unwatched corner of the [TS]

  market because you know everyone's [TS]

  looking at mobile like you know phones [TS]

  and stuff and not many people are [TS]

  looking at laptops and PCs these days [TS]

  except to be depressed about them but I [TS]

  wish them luck because anything that [TS]

  sort of changes the existing fairly [TS]

  boring status quo as good or even if it [TS]

  just motivates Intel to do a better job [TS]

  that helps everybody I i think this is [TS]

  worth thinking about it like that we [TS]

  we've been to we talked for you know [TS]

  forever about what about our macs and [TS]

  the the idea here is that well you know [TS]

  Intel is not doing what Apple wants it [TS]

  to do fast enough for me achieving [TS]

  enough efficiency or whatever and and it [TS]

  may be armed ships that Apple could make [TS]

  itself would be better and everything [TS]

  and it's interesting to to see basically [TS]

  now Microsoft seemingly possibly making [TS]

  the same hedged bet here of like you [TS]

  know [TS]

  Intel's not really working that well for [TS]

  us either which actually just means you [TS]

  know Intel's just not working that well [TS]

  period while they're working but they [TS]

  charge a lot of money like the Intel is [TS]

  still able to charge pretty big margins [TS]

  compared to what that you know the the [TS]

  arm vendors to charge for their things [TS]

  and like it's one of the reasons people [TS]

  say that like the mac laptops cost so [TS]

  much because of you people to the silly [TS]

  like Bill of material things for their [TS]

  adding up you know the retail prices [TS]

  which is not how this stuff works but [TS]

  anyway they try to have the price they [TS]

  realized price wise the intel cpu is a [TS]

  surprisingly large portion or the you [TS]

  know the the chips from Intel are [TS]

  surprisingly large portion of the price [TS]

  of a laptop and that was more it was [TS]

  more prompt pronounced when there's more [TS]

  parts inside the laptop at this point [TS]

  there's not much in there anymore except [TS]

  for intel cpus some supporting chips a [TS]

  big battery a screen and half of the [TS]

  keyboard that's all that's all and these [TS]

  things but they used to be all sorts of [TS]

  other stuff in there is [TS]

  you know the hard drive and even the SSD [TS]

  thrown into the next but i think it's [TS]

  still the case that Intel's margins are [TS]

  would be the envy of any armed vendor [TS]

  and especially the case of Apple where [TS]

  Apple isn't doing the design essentially [TS]

  they got the armed license they do the [TS]

  design they pay someone to fabric for [TS]

  them that relationship is much more [TS]

  straightforward and what Apple's used to [TS]

  like working with a supplier to build a [TS]

  thing i'll tell you what to build you [TS]

  know you don't you know you don't have [TS]

  to design thing you're going to build [TS]

  this and here it is and give them you [TS]

  know that the their chip design and they [TS]

  just fabric for them and I was marked [TS]

  with that it's not a matter of just like [TS]

  taking design printing it like there is [TS]

  more to it but that is that is a [TS]

  relationship where you don't have to pay [TS]

  for the margin that Intel is charging [TS]

  you for like we designed this whole trip [TS]

  and we designed all these things and [TS]

  we're not just a dumb fab or selling you [TS]

  this value and chips on put in the chat [TS]

  room that into a 60-percent gross [TS]

  margins which are which is pretty darn [TS]

  good for someone whose physical things [TS]

  instead of selling software so it [TS]

  I don't think Intel is not doing its job [TS]

  and I think they are trying to serve [TS]

  apples needs but they're still charging [TS]

  more and there's and you know for apples [TS]

  respective then Apple can control their [TS]

  schedules to the degree they control [TS]

  their own schedules for their a-series [TS]

  chips so that that's you know there is a [TS]

  definite reason to go in that direction [TS]

  long term anyway I just thought that was [TS]

  interesting we'll see how coast so so [TS]

  here's a question [TS]

  one of the concerns I have with Apple [TS]

  sorry to turn this back into apple [TS]

  complaints just for a minute I promise [TS]

  one of the country have apple is that [TS]

  obviously adding everybody even people [TS]

  who think they're doing fine can [TS]

  generally agree that they're also [TS]

  stretched very thin and a lot of their [TS]

  products are are having to take a [TS]

  backseat to something and whether it's [TS]

  the car or the idea that the iphone is [TS]

  progressing really fast even though it [TS]

  seems not to be or whatever else is like [TS]

  everything seems to be taking the [TS]

  backseat to something so my question is [TS]

  when the next big shifts happen in [TS]

  important markets to apple so things [TS]

  like computers phones tablets when when [TS]

  big shifts happen like for instance if [TS]

  everyone moves to arms processors for [TS]

  for their pc computers like you not just [TS]

  tablets and phones would like for full [TS]

  sized computers and laptops in apples [TS]

  current state where it's kinda like [TS]

  their immune system is strange like that [TS]

  they're like the heat and integrated [TS]

  algebra like they can barely hold [TS]

  together what they have now keeping [TS]

  things on their current path because [TS]

  they're doing so much and obviously [TS]

  there's a lot of resources being devoted [TS]

  to like some other future projects but [TS]

  like stuff like the mac it and see what [TS]

  it was like barely holding on and [TS]

  there's the awfully concerning rumor [TS]

  today that the next iPhone might just [TS]

  add a red color and still have the exact [TS]

  same what general case of design is Alex [TS]

  know what they're saying that it was [TS]

  also gonna be out at the same time as a [TS]

  the new all glass thing or was that [TS]

  trying to say like next year just a new [TS]

  color in a year after that the other [TS]

  last one I believe it was the latter but [TS]

  it was anyway which would be concerning [TS]

  but anyway it we we have one thing that [TS]

  so who knows but anyway so given the [TS]

  given the way it appears as though Apple [TS]

  is having a hard time keeping up with [TS]

  other product lines already as it is [TS]

  when the next big shift happens do you [TS]

  think they will be able to to to go with [TS]

  it to write it to adapt it or are they [TS]

  going to fall behind because they won't [TS]

  be prepared because they won't be [TS]

  development of resources to those areas [TS]

  like Microsoft right now doesn't have a [TS]

  successful phone business to worry about [TS]

  or to manage or or 22 to take forward so [TS]

  like Microsoft supporting everything [TS]

  they can to what they do have which is [TS]

  pcs right they do well they're they're [TS]

  pouring everything they have that that's [TS]

  what we're reading like interesting new [TS]

  developments like the surface to do like [TS]

  those which they will take off if any [TS]

  but like they are there they are ready [TS]

  to adopt whatever comes out now but [TS]

  Apple isn't like Apple is seemingly like [TS]

  keeping the mac kind of coasting for the [TS]

  most part of not doing a whole lot of [TS]

  new stuff with it and not really keeping [TS]

  up-to-date not really keeping [TS]

  competitive kinda just like sitting back [TS]

  and letting off the gas and and this [TS]

  isn't just the mac i would say this this [TS]

  definitely applies to the mac it sort of [TS]

  applies to the ipad although there's not [TS]

  a lot of your competitors anymore really [TS]

  it unless you count laptops which I'd [TS]

  not sure I would anymore and on the [TS]

  iphone it's it's kind of [TS]

  it seems like they might be letting off [TS]

  the castle but honestly was obviously [TS]

  you see what happens next year but it [TS]

  certainly looks so far that like things [TS]

  are progressing more slowly than before [TS]

  will Apple be ready for the next big [TS]

  shift and will they actually do them and [TS]

  where they lead them anymore the way the [TS]

  way they have been for that for like the [TS]

  last decade or so or are they too busy [TS]

  like building cars and stuff i don't [TS]

  know about any of that I think I I think [TS]

  basing your thoughts on the premise of [TS]

  their stepping off of the gas i i i [TS]

  understand how you come to that [TS]

  conclusion [TS]

  I'm wouldn't be so fast come to that [TS]

  conclusion I would in fact I would [TS]

  almost go so far as to say that a lot of [TS]

  silence from apple may even be [TS]

  indicating that they're standing on the [TS]

  gas harder than they ever have before [TS]

  now [TS]

  truth be told that's hard for me to make [TS]

  that argument with a straight face given [TS]

  what's been going on with say the mac [TS]

  pro but 11 point does not align make and [TS]

  obviously none of us know one way the [TS]

  other very well could be that you're [TS]

  right Marco but if i were to take a read [TS]

  the tea leaves i would say that that it [TS]

  is quite possible that big things are [TS]

  afoot and we're just not hearing about [TS]

  it because guess what Apple never tells [TS]

  us about these things until it's all [TS]

  over [TS]

  so about the specific shift you're [TS]

  talking about like whatever US Armed [TS]

  that for that specific change I think [TS]

  Apple would be fine because if that [TS]

  happened [TS]

  Apple would see it as an efficiency and [TS]

  you know it would it would be the last [TS]

  little bit Apple needs to get to kick it [TS]

  over the line to say okay I guess we'll [TS]

  try to do is we always talk about all [TS]

  the things that are keeping the [TS]

  president like is the mac even worth [TS]

  this big expensive transition and this [TS]

  disruption to users and the dev tools [TS]

  and like like is it even worth it to do [TS]

  that for the little old Mac probably [TS]

  like that's probably one of the biggest [TS]

  thing stopping our max this point is [TS]

  that the mac itself is not worth that [TS]

  kind of investment but everyone else [TS]

  which is over anyway suddenly is the [TS]

  mackie worth like well everyone else is [TS]

  going that way anyway and so we might as [TS]

  well just get on that train and we're [TS]

  already designing new a series cpus [TS]

  every year already really good at and [TS]

  we're going to make that cpu anyway and [TS]

  the cpu for the next iPhones gonna be [TS]

  plenty powerful for all but the most [TS]

  powerful laptop [TS]

  if you just add more course to be like [TS]

  it's an efficiency that they're ready to [TS]

  grab and control that they want anyway [TS]

  any little bit that kicks them over into [TS]

  doing that I think they would see as [TS]

  okay well that now the decisions been [TS]

  taken out of our hands and they would [TS]

  leap at it because they do get [TS]

  efficiencies that are now we don't have [TS]

  to deal with two things we just have one [TS]

  architecture we control our own [TS]

  destinies all the advantages of the arm [TS]

  stuff come in so that specific change I [TS]

  think that would be fine for all the [TS]

  other changes you said you know the [TS]

  stretch then well as we just got the [TS]

  pastor shows that stretch less than they [TS]

  used to be [TS]

  they're not making Wi-Fi routers anymore [TS]

  not making screens anymore they're not [TS]

  making the mac pro in the mac mini [TS]

  anymore apparently [TS]

  so they are condensing and all these you [TS]

  know all the Dark Matter the case he was [TS]

  talking about we have no idea what the [TS]

  hell they're doing [TS]

  except for the self-driving car stuff [TS]

  you know they're augmented-reality thing [TS]

  is that related to the car thing where [TS]

  the display and stuff on the dashboard [TS]

  or whatever like the way to be ready for [TS]

  it in appleton typical apple way to be [TS]

  ready these changes to be the one that [TS]

  brings them on so presumably app has [TS]

  also specific experiments going on with [TS]

  AR and VR and machine learning and [TS]

  self-driving car stuff then you know [TS]

  like those all those efforts are exactly [TS]

  what they should be doing to be ready [TS]

  for the exchange into perhaps be the one [TS]

  that initiates change but that doesn't [TS]

  help us out here because we don't know [TS]

  about that stuff except for like you [TS]

  know the car project their business to [TS]

  pick tied at this point and that is you [TS]

  know the rumors about just being about [TS]

  self-driving technology i think the most [TS]

  concerning about thing about all this [TS]

  project is that I've said this a million [TS]

  times i'll say it again they [TS]

  increasingly rely on integration with [TS]

  cloud computing and apple stills crappy [TS]

  at it and they're getting better really [TS]

  slowly [TS]

  probably not even keeping pace with [TS]

  everybody else so they're very few [TS]

  precious few things that you can do that [TS]

  don't involve some kind of cloud thing [TS]

  and apples just not shown to be good but [TS]

  so the next big thing is cloud machine [TS]

  learning in the cloud [TS]

  it's hard to envision Apple even keeping [TS]

  up with the Joneses let alone being a [TS]

  pioneer in that field because you know [TS]

  there may be no again maybe they'll [TS]

  surprise for the brand new version of [TS]

  Siri that's way better but I think [TS]

  they're mostly getting their butt kicked [TS]

  in this area self-driving cars and type [TS]

  of tech it also does not strike me as [TS]

  something that and apples wheelhouse [TS]

  I don't really think i would not be [TS]

  comforted by self-driving car software [TS]

  written by Apple be installed in my [TS]

  thing especially considering you know I [TS]

  mean always done is carplay and hasn't [TS]

  you know it's fine whatever but the gap [TS]

  between that and also drive the car for [TS]

  me and do a cool AR display on it was [TS]

  hard on my windshield such a huge gap [TS]

  but whatever you know like whatever the [TS]

  next big thing is Apple should be out [TS]

  there trying to find it and the act of [TS]

  trying to find it appears invisible for [TS]

  a company like Apple we have no idea [TS]

  what is the stretched thin feeling comes [TS]

  from you know you know do that R&D do [TS]

  that experimental thing investigate [TS]

  things killer project if it doesn't it's [TS]

  working out do all that stuff but you [TS]

  also have to have one eye on the rest of [TS]

  your business and we must complain about [TS]

  the maxi like the mac i think they are [TS]

  definitely not stepping off the gas on [TS]

  the iphone in all areas except for [TS]

  perhaps industrial design and I could be [TS]

  just because they keep grabbing for that [TS]

  whatever the next all glass phone is but [TS]

  if you look at how the internal so the [TS]

  iphone have improved in after generation [TS]

  we would kill for that kind of [TS]

  improvement in the mac every a serious [TS]

  tip is so much better than the past one [TS]

  the cameras get better [TS]

  the battery life gets better plus or [TS]

  minus apples needs to 10 stuff down like [TS]

  they are you know the iphone is so [TS]

  clearly their main product and they [TS]

  improve in ways that we can only dream [TS]

  of in the macworld so I think that's [TS]

  doing fine i think a lot of it is [TS]

  superficial like all you're gonna make [TS]

  the same shape again it's boring it's a [TS]

  problem that's a marketing problem [TS]

  that's a PR problem that's a problem for [TS]

  being able to sell these things to [TS]

  people but if you view it as like how [TS]

  much money did they invest in making the [TS]

  iphone better just because they don't [TS]

  have a new case because there they keep [TS]

  trying to go for that cool wireless [TS]

  charging all-glass whatever magic phone [TS]

  like I can't get a year after year i [TS]

  give him a pass on that because what's [TS]

  inside the phones just getting better so [TS]

  much faster so you know i i'm i'm not [TS]

  concerned about the iphone business not [TS]

  even concerned about the ipad business [TS]

  except for the fact that they don't seem [TS]

  to be willing to feel any competitors to [TS]

  something like the service book whether [TS]

  that's an iOS device or not but it just [TS]

  gets back to us [TS]

  whining about our max but world [TS]

  that's true did you guys I didn't have a [TS]

  chance to read this but I saw some [TS]

  headlines and the chat rooms brought [TS]

  this up as well [TS]

  courts had a piece entitled inside the [TS]

  secret meeting where Apple revealed the [TS]

  state of it's AI research and I guess [TS]

  there was a invite-only lunch at an [TS]

  industry AI conference where Apple [TS]

  showed a bunch of slides a couple of [TS]

  which are a handful of which courts got [TS]

  their hands on and so one of them says [TS]

  machine learning research summary and [TS]

  there's several different segments that [TS]

  their apparent that Apple's apparently [TS]

  looking at health and vital signs of [TS]

  volumetric detection of lidar which to [TS]

  me means self-driving car production [TS]

  with structured outputs there's a [TS]

  picture of cars driving image processing [TS]

  and colorization intelligent assistant [TS]

  in machine language modeling and [TS]

  activity recognition and then later on I [TS]

  didn't get a chance to read into this [TS]

  much but there are a couple of graphs [TS]

  we're at a glance it seems to hint that [TS]

  Apple's GPUs are being used for machine [TS]

  learning and are considerably quicker [TS]

  than equivalent amazon AWS offerings now [TS]

  again I've only glanced at this I might [TS]

  be butchering the details but it [TS]

  certainly seems that at least in an [TS]

  academic sense maybe apples [TS]

  machine-learning chops aren't so bad [TS]

  after all now to be fair that has to get [TS]

  applied and executed upon and certainly [TS]

  you know here we are are giggling but [TS]

  also crying about a keyboard you know [TS]

  tex replacement and so you do need to to [TS]

  apply all this machine learning at some [TS]

  juncture but the the academic urd stuff [TS]

  seems like they might be keeping up [TS]

  maybe even making improvements start [TS]

  complaining about all their this type of [TS]

  academic research stuff at apple is that [TS]

  academics want to publish because this [TS]

  vital for their continued career as a [TS]

  academic and apple doesn't want you [TS]

  publish and so the fact that they're [TS]

  presenting this is it may be a change in [TS]

  you know a slight lessening of apples [TS]

  incredible drive for secrecy that you [TS]

  can't get the best academics to come [TS]

  work for you if you won't let them do [TS]

  stuff like this because it's vital for [TS]

  their career to be able to do this you [TS]

  can't just take them and hide them away [TS]

  like they do with industrial designers [TS]

  who Johnny I've only lets out once a [TS]

  year and [TS]

  the time spent in room they sleep under [TS]

  black sheets right and then the morning [TS]

  they just come out anyway it's difficult [TS]

  to get people to work for you do that [TS]

  google has a much more open environment [TS]

  google is probably the leader in this [TS]

  because they have so many freaking phd's [TS]

  and they put the stuff to use in the [TS]

  magic that is every google thing that [TS]

  you just type something into it figures [TS]

  out what the hell you mean google search [TS]

  being the best example I I still it is [TS]

  still not worn off to me that i can type [TS]

  in queries and Google finds results and [TS]

  like it is live long since gotten past [TS]

  the point where I where I can even [TS]

  understand how could we will figure out [TS]

  what i was talking about and gave me the [TS]

  thing i wanted but it's like the magic [TS]

  of big data is the magic of you know [TS]

  that they're doing it for real [TS]

  an apple all we have from them to [TS]

  demonstrate their chops to Siri which [TS]

  has its ups and downs but charitable [TS]

  yeah like it's not it no one no one [TS]

  except someone who works for apple to go [TS]

  to put it as the leader in this they're [TS]

  all kind of silly all the devices to [TS]

  kind of silly but serious such a lead [TS]

  and everyone caught up really quickly [TS]

  and google just seems to be on top of [TS]

  this stuff so i hope i hope it's true [TS]

  that Apple is doing because I i think it [TS]

  is table stakes in the future to have [TS]

  competency in this area so Apple has to [TS]

  just be doing this just to keep up [TS]

  I don't know this means that there's [TS]

  something going to be the leader in or [TS]

  whatever but it seems like they're [TS]

  learning what it takes to attract those [TS]

  people to come work for apple and put [TS]

  them on projects and hopefully like [TS]

  cases when it comes out of it like you [TS]

  have to make a product eventually doing [TS]

  this research is important and if you [TS]

  don't do this research you'll never be [TS]

  able to make a product because we're in [TS]

  that phase now with machine learning [TS]

  where it's not commoditized at this [TS]

  point you have to have your stuff [TS]

  in-house to do it it just I'm not [TS]

  entirely sure that the best application [TS]

  of all this technology is self-driving [TS]

  car tech which seems to be the path [TS]

  they're going which is a hard problem [TS]

  and someone's going to be first and [TS]

  maybe we'll be apple and maybe they'll [TS]

  be known as the company that put [TS]

  self-driving software and all of our [TS]

  cars but for now we just have rumors and [TS]

  a lot of money spent and you know no [TS]

  announce anything from apple and all the [TS]

  stuff that we can do anytime or user [TS]

  something we use for an entirely [TS]

  different purpose like you know go [TS]

  goggles or some other weird they are [TS]

  thinking us so from this article [TS]

  machine-learning scientists have long [TS]

  criticized Apple 42 lectins to [TS]

  contribute back to the research [TS]

  community during the presentation which [TS]

  served to bring a small select group of [TS]

  researchers up to speed with apples [TS]

  efforts some individuals Salik could [TS]

  celica Hinda of didn't didn't off i'm [TS]

  sorry i didn't practice that before the [TS]

  show because I know it's gonna be [TS]

  talking about this a prominent AI [TS]

  researcher himself at Carnegie Mellon [TS]

  said that apple would begin to publish [TS]

  its research and make a greater effort [TS]

  to work with the research community [TS]

  according to attendees just like you [TS]

  said John additionally Oliver cameron [TS]

  who is self-describing as a the lead of [TS]

  the self-driving car team at Udacity had [TS]

  a series of 5 tweets which will put the [TS]

  show notes which begins with him saying [TS]

  hey this article this quarter this [TS]

  Court's article it deserves more [TS]

  attention he says apples clearly 1000% [TS]

  working on autonomous vehicles powered [TS]

  by machine learning c volume and [TS]

  volumetric detection of lidar and in [TS]

  that slide [TS]

  they may be building custom gpus for [TS]

  machine learning perhaps only internally [TS]

  they also have a custom image data set [TS]

  twice the size of image net which i'm [TS]

  not entirely clear what that is but I'm [TS]

  assuming it's the public set of images [TS]

  for training neural networks recognize [TS]

  things [TS]

  30 thanks we benchmarked they bench [TS]

  marked MX net which is Amazon's [TS]

  framework of choice on their GPUs and [TS]

  custom image data set in not tensorflow [TS]

  so tldr this is against Oliver tldr the [TS]

  new apple is catching up fast machine [TS]

  learning and this is from someone who [TS]

  theoretically doesn't have any vested [TS]

  interest in saying such things as phrase [TS]

  that's catching up fast not faulting to [TS]

  the lead or leaving the culture behind [TS]

  but it's it is it is the minimum bar [TS]

  that you have to meet because it's so [TS]

  clear that this type of technology is [TS]

  coming to the point where it can do [TS]

  useful things and if you don't have this [TS]

  capability in house if you just wait [TS]

  around until it becomes like until until [TS]

  amazon is essentially vending the [TS]

  seventh version of this as part of their [TS]

  web services offering or like it until [TS]

  it becomes commoditized it's a big [TS]

  advantage be able to do it in-house and [TS]

  in some respects like this is part of [TS]

  the things that make google into google [TS]

  is they they had a good idea for search [TS]

  algorithm [TS]

  and they eventually were faced with the [TS]

  problem of scale how to build our data [TS]

  centers and you know how to do all this [TS]

  stuff and they did a lot of stuff [TS]

  in-house that for a long time gave [TS]

  google the abilities that other [TS]

  companies didn't have to scale out to [TS]

  worldwide data centers to get good [TS]

  performance to everybody to do these [TS]

  really complicated things right and they [TS]

  had to build a lot of that house and had [TS]

  to figure all this out and eventually [TS]

  started to become commoditized to the [TS]

  point where Google itself is venting [TS]

  some of his cloud services and of course [TS]

  amazon has its web services and so many [TS]

  things are built on that and so now it [TS]

  is no longer really a competitive [TS]

  advantage or at least not as big as it [TS]

  used to be to be really good at setting [TS]

  up your data centers and having a [TS]

  strategy for you no redundancy and and [TS]

  being close to everybody in the world [TS]

  and in dealing with our drawings data [TS]

  because it's been figured out enough [TS]

  that if you want to get off the ground [TS]

  you can bootstrap yourself onto one of [TS]

  these things and not not have to have [TS]

  this in-house but machine learning is [TS]

  still the point where if you want to do [TS]

  this you want to participate in this at [TS]

  all you have to do it in-house because [TS]

  nobody has got it figured out and [TS]

  commoditize to the point where it's no [TS]

  longer and so Apple has to do this [TS]

  microsoft has to do is google has to do [TS]

  it and I was on your they all have to do [TS]

  it in facebook for that matter and it's [TS]

  kind of a you might think it's isn't [TS]

  like duplication of effort but it's just [TS]

  called competition so they'll have to be [TS]

  doing it and if if Apple wasn't doing we [TS]

  should be really concerned so there is [TS]

  degrees like they weren't doing it at [TS]

  all [TS]

  we should be super concerned well we're [TS]

  concerned about now is ok they're doing [TS]

  it but are they doing it well enough to [TS]

  keep up with the big boys and it seems [TS]

  like probably yeah but again the proof [TS]

  will be in the products they may be [TS]

  keeping up with the basic research [TS]

  research but when does that translate [TS]

  into making serie better you know or [TS]

  does is all just for self-driving car [TS]

  texts that's that's a big bet you know [TS]

  that the even the bet that apple will be [TS]

  involved in all of that because it seems [TS]

  like I was not making its own car and if [TS]

  people who do make cards don't want [TS]

  apples technology then all apples work [TS]

  is pointless because if the car [TS]

  companies don't want it you know Tesla [TS]

  doesn't want it doesn't want for don't [TS]

  want you right then who is the customer [TS]

  for this Apple has great self-driving [TS]

  car technology [TS]

  you can use the power like the shiny [TS]

  white go-karts that used to go around [TS]

  the spaceship campus great i can sit [TS]

  gotta get this into a car and if you're [TS]

  not going to make a car you better [TS]

  convince somebody that they should buy [TS]

  your thing instead of you know there [TS]

  because not like the car companies are [TS]

  sitting on their hands waiting for a [TS]

  technology company to offer them [TS]

  self-driving tech like they're not [TS]

  waiting on Apple they're all doing their [TS]

  own things so not that concerns me a [TS]

  little bit so so which Mac do you think [TS]

  the all this like AI and GPU development [TS]

  which mac of the people using who are [TS]

  developing those sure doing on PCs you [TS]

  can even get you doing on a on a macbook [TS]

  pro well it if they are building their [TS]

  own custom gpus then I was like [TS]

  rack-mounted services like they're using [TS]

  exurbs or whatever but as they're [TS]

  sitting in front of their computers it [TS]

  you know it at a certain point when [TS]

  you're doing research all you're using [TS]

  is a fancy terminal window to connect to [TS]

  the bigger computers were all the real [TS]

  action is happening true and I imagine [TS]

  that's the case because you're not [TS]

  you're going to a computer it's like you [TS]

  know the giant maze those clusters or [TS]

  whatever so it doesn't really matter [TS]

  they could be using a I you know a [TS]

  macbook one it's not think the computing [TS]

  power of the things are sitting in front [TS]

  of doesn't matter as much [TS]

  well they are typing the yeah they are [TS]

  typing but maybe they have people to do [TS]

  that doesn't have a graduate students [TS]

  have already typing wow alright thanks [TS]

  143 sponsors this week kingdom automatic [TS]

  and betterment we will see you next week [TS]

  now the show is over they didn't even [TS]

  mean to be in because it was accidental [TS]

  it was accidental [TS]

  Jonathan [TS]

  research Margo in kc wouldn't let me [TS]

  because it was accidental was accidental [TS]

  and you can find the show know today [TS]

  DP that and if your twitter follow them [TS]

  [Music] [TS]

  yes byl ISS so that's Katie list and a [TS]

  co-pay rm20 Marco Arment our AC at [TS]

  Syracuse [TS]

  I've got nothing for the after-show well [TS]

  i still haven't watched a new top gear [TS]

  episode 2 because you told me not to be [TS]

  there I yeah you totally bummed me out [TS]

  for watching it did you watch three know [TS]

  yet what are you suggesting that I skip [TS]

  two and watch the rest of the season and [TS]

  go back to watch you don't miss out on [TS]

  all the continuity [TS]

  no I don't know what's happening in [TS]

  episode 3 there is actually a little bit [TS]

  of continuity as it turns out but that [TS]

  being said if you're pressed for time [TS]

  and/or don't want to get briefly [TS]

  depressed skip episode tune and then [TS]

  episode 3 actually i think has been [TS]

  mostly a return to what's right in the [TS]

  world is like the only podcast where I'm [TS]

  not talking about westworld because I [TS]

  guess neither one of you are watching it [TS]

  nope that's a show yeah hard to believe [TS]

  that it was a game or a movie [TS]

  ya know you here should you don't you [TS]

  out you have the HP I think you should [TS]

  eat you took my want to try it like this [TS]

  season's over all 10 episodes just [TS]

  sitting there waiting for you see if [TS]

  there's not gonna be a new season for [TS]

  like a year so sometime during the [TS]

  winter if you're bored and want to try a [TS]

  new show tonight I go to use not really [TS]

  up your guys ali but i mean whatever [TS]

  thought of science fiction will try it [TS]

  yet since I find was not gonna work the [TS]

  main problem is that anything on HBO Go [TS]

  right now we basically can't watch [TS]

  because the apple TV apps for HBO has [TS]

  decided to just not work anymore [TS]

  like that's great tell us why you are [TS]

  playing from your iPad before when you [TS]

  mentioned it right that is why is [TS]

  because the Apple anything for ya like [TS]

  that man the apple TV is such a mess [TS]

  I don't want to complete any more apples [TS]

  up today so I'm just if you don't have [TS]

  anything nice to say don't say it at all [TS]

  so I'm not going to be talking about the [TS]

  apple TV is after show [TS]

  I love mine mine works great now I don't [TS]

  die don't do terribly complex things [TS]

  with it but plex works great the photos [TS]

  like screensaver works great the [TS]

  screensaver works great [TS]

  that's it does I'm serious I'm serious [TS]

  because it doesn't on my Mac that's a [TS]

  nice screensaver I've got that hey we [TS]

  can we can get that out of the show [TS]

  notes been the shots for about two years [TS]

  now i deleted deleted yeah I had in the [TS]

  top of our document for maybe two years [TS]

  maybe more a link to be able to download [TS]

  the [TS]

  OS version area allows the apple TV [TS]

  screen saver [TS]

  yeah which is really cool looking at [TS]

  mean it's not you realize when you see [TS]

  on a 5k screen at all the all the movies [TS]

  and images are not enough resolution [TS]

  like they look great on your TV within a [TS]

  look great on your 5k imac but it's a [TS]

  cool screen saver and if you want to [TS]

  have the screensaver on your mac and why [TS]

  wouldn't you [TS]

  it is available someone like ported [TS]

  ripped it out of the apple TV and ported [TS]

  to get help because it's really just a [TS]

  matter of getting the correct urls to [TS]

  pull the movies down and then having [TS]

  them you know just you know play on the [TS]

  screen so if we can resurrect that [TS]

  Lincoln putting that I have a habit it's [TS]

  called Ariel I think [TS]

  yep that's right and that's actually not [TS]

  what I was talking about on the appletv [TS]

  i was talking about the thing where you [TS]

  point it at a photo a what am I trying [TS]

  to say the in a shared album photo [TS]

  library photos you can see right your [TS]

  kids and stuff exactly that works great [TS]

  now that being said this aerial [TS]

  screensaver that's what I use on my work [TS]

  computer and it's fantastic i can't [TS]

  recommend it enough real-time follow-up [TS]

  the chat rooms and for me that I have [TS]

  HBO now on HBO GO [TS]

  I know I know I'm for having given up [TS]

  correcting an autocrat of your head that [TS]

  point [TS]

  yeah yeah so whichever HBO thing i have [TS]

  doesn't work anymore on the appletv and [TS]

  so I'm not really sure why i'm paying [TS]

  for installing and uninstalling and [TS]

  rebooting I haven't tried reinstalling [TS]

  yeah Wow know god yes I just I just want [TS]

  things to work I did and why is it so [TS]

  much to ask [TS]

  it's great that we have all this new [TS]

  stuff I just wish it worked better [TS]

  well you just use the new single sign-on [TS]

  feature in your funny i support so many [TS]

  providers I honestly like I i wish like [TS]

  I keep using the apple TV because like i [TS]

  have tried the other things before I've [TS]

  tried the Amazon whatever i've tried the [TS]

  the little roku whatever I haven't tried [TS]

  the google thing yet because I'd like [TS]

  remote controls and don't use android so [TS]

  it kind of doesn't offer a whole lot for [TS]

  me but the other things are worse and [TS]

  that's why i keep using apple TV because [TS]

  the appletv really is better than what's [TS]

  out there for many things that I that I [TS]

  want but I just wish it was better than [TS]

  it is like it's like why when i pick up [TS]

  the remote when we haven't used it [TS]

  in a few hours why does it not respond [TS]

  immediately [TS]

  why does the remote take like 10 to 15 [TS]

  seconds before like swiping back and [TS]

  forth on the trackpad actually works [TS]

  like what it maybe it's a sleep for to [TS]

  save power 1 by using it like how long [TS]

  does it take to wake up [TS]

  why when it boots up just seemed doesn't [TS]

  seem like it's been asleep the entire [TS]

  time and has literally updated nothing [TS]

  about anything ever [TS]

  it's plugged into the wall it can update [TS]

  whenever it wants but it doesn't why [TS]

  when it wakes up is it always tell me [TS]

  there's no internet connection even [TS]

  though they're always it's hardwired it [TS]

  always has an internet connection [TS]

  it's like I just I I don't understand [TS]

  why this product is the way it is and is [TS]

  this the way it's frustrating because [TS]

  it's just like just like many of apple [TS]

  products it's frustrating that it has [TS]

  these flaws because it is still the best [TS]

  in the market for me I still like it [TS]

  better than the alternatives so I'm [TS]

  going to keep using it i just wish it [TS]

  was better and it seems like really [TS]

  basic stuff the design of the remote [TS]

  aside I've already you know war Matt's [TS]

  death but like why doesn't just work [TS]

  better [TS]

  why do I occasionally have to reboot it [TS]

  it makes no sense to have these kind of [TS]

  shortcomings in this kind of product in [TS]

  this year I remember one marker wasn't [TS]

  getting a plan about apple tv2 remember [TS]

  that case and that's nice i do remember [TS]

  that i do remember that family that was [TS]

  a wonderful moment seems so long ago and [TS]

  I've known for changing my mind [TS]

  and now that was a great day [TS]

  [Music] [TS]

  I don't know it's I mean I have the same [TS]

  feelings about is taking a one good [TS]

  thing you're measuring the apple TV [TS]

  remote one good thing about the up to [TS]

  your remote that battery life is amazing [TS]

  like this is not a big remote that's [TS]

  your battery can't be that big in there [TS]

  i'm trying to think i think i've plugged [TS]

  it in to charge it once ever after [TS]

  that's it for this Apple TV like one [TS]

  time ever in my entire life so that I [TS]

  have the big apple TV like the one [TS]

  that's too tall so whenever that cannot [TS]

  i bought it exactly when it came out and [TS]

  i plugged in once so that's good [TS]

  everything else you said you know it's [TS]

  totally true although my apps all work [TS]

  on the appletv for the most part i still [TS]

  have the same problems like waking it up [TS]

  and why does it take so long wise not [TS]

  all the time and like you know that all [TS]

  those things happen but and also i'm [TS]

  constantly cleaning the gross stuff from [TS]

  my kids fingers off of that track mad [TS]

  because my kids are gross but yeah when [TS]

  it plays video successfully I consider [TS]

  it a victory and I just know walk away [TS]

  but you do you have is it just me do you [TS]

  guys have these problems with yours mine [TS]

  like I have like you know sometimes able [TS]

  to get like a can't play your itunes [TS]

  video because of something like whatever [TS]

  weird iTunes server error and I get the [TS]

  sluggishness and it's not reacting to my [TS]

  things and stuff like that but for the [TS]

  most part it plays video eventually and [TS]

  plays it through successfully without [TS]

  dying in the middle i just want like [TS]

  when when it's being non-responsive or [TS]

  when it's being seemingly very heavily [TS]

  loaded with background tasks like what [TS]

  is it doing because like it doesn't [TS]

  support background operation of apps it [TS]

  has a few things where like it like you [TS]

  can like refresh certain feeds for [TS]

  things that appear like in the carousel [TS]

  top and everything but it's really very [TS]

  few of those things and it's fairly [TS]

  decent iOS hardware inside they're [TS]

  running you know and I stripped down [TS]

  version of iOS software that doesn't [TS]

  have a whole lot to do and is plugged [TS]

  into the wall and has a constant [TS]

  internet connection so we can do things [TS]

  whenever it wants to in the background [TS]

  I just don't understand like what it do [TS]

  it widely is so much file i/o because [TS]

  that anything i can blame the HFS plus i [TS]

  will write with like it's gotta be it's [TS]

  gotta be bio because it's not doesn't [TS]

  have fast storage like the storage unit [TS]

  it's it's flash storage but it's not [TS]

  fast flash storage and if it you know [TS]

  and because agents still single threaded [TS]

  and only one process can be accessed [TS]

  that you know writing the vials in the [TS]

  time that's a potential bottleneck and [TS]

  if you see anything having to do with [TS]

  iOS devices like if you get update all [TS]

  on a bunch of apps that if you're still [TS]

  an old person you manually update your [TS]

  apps like I do you know that will [TS]

  cripple your phone you know like you can [TS]

  let it update stuff but as it's doing [TS]

  anything having to do with like pulling [TS]

  down things and messing with your [TS]

  filesystem everything is gonna be super [TS]

  slow during that time so that's my [TS]

  guests for what it's doing like what is [TS]

  doing the background is doing something [TS]

  having to do with lots of file i/o and [TS]

  that just blocks everything down i guess [TS]

  maybe FS will fix all this for you yeah [TS]

  it's just I just wish it was better get [TS]

  like why why is it not better just get [TS]

  the center working on Marco no I I [TS]

  occasionally have a little bit of [TS]

  unresponsiveness from the remote when I [TS]

  first grabbed it but I've taken to and [TS]

  cut to me i don't find this is [TS]

  unreasonable but I presume that Marco [TS]

  you're going to find this completely [TS]

  egregious I just mash down on the [TS]

  including the trackpad or the home [TS]

  button either 1i tend to click the track [TS]

  because it's a bigger target yeah the [TS]

  home button or the trackpad smashdown [TS]

  that like five or six times and then as [TS]

  the TV the apple TV is starting up and [TS]

  and I usually as my TV is also starting [TS]

  up which although i have a fine TV like [TS]

  it's a reasonable TV but it takes and it [TS]

  Ernie to turn on so anyway as i'm [TS]

  waiting for all these things turn on [TS]

  usually the remote is woken up there's [TS]

  been a couple of occasions where it [TS]

  hasn't or maybe the remote has gone into [TS]

  sleep mode before the apple TV has but [TS]

  if I mass on a button for second it [TS]

  starts working like I don't really have [TS]

  any problems and the only apps I [TS]

  typically use on my appletv are plex [TS]

  which is probably ninety percent of the [TS]

  time it's an airplay receiver for [TS]

  spotify and not unreasonable amount of [TS]

  time and netflix and for those uses [TS]

  which admittedly i'm not trying to say [TS]

  these are terribly complex uses but for [TS]

  those uses works pretty darn reliably [TS]

  for me i did get the big one because was [TS]

  a gift from aaron and she wasn't sure if [TS]

  I would want the bigger one of the [TS]

  smaller one I doubt that makes a [TS]

  difference but for what it's worth I do [TS]

  have the the [TS]

  the higher capacity one but yeah I mean [TS]

  it definitely has problems from time to [TS]

  time but generally yeah I found it works [TS]

  great and I do the same thing with when [TS]

  I know I'm going to watch them out to be [TS]

  the first thing I do is I hippie the [TS]

  home button on the appletv not because I [TS]

  expected to do anything like the little [TS]

  one that looks like the TV button but [TS]

  because it will turn the apple TV on so [TS]

  it i do that first then i turn my TV on [TS]

  then every time I receiver on don't tell [TS]

  me about universal remotes i'm picturing [TS]

  the case here and all about bringing [TS]

  back that Victor and everything is [TS]

  essentially ready at the same time but I [TS]

  have developed that have it because if I [TS]

  do it the other way and get everything [TS]

  all turned on and then switch to the [TS]

  apple TV input and then grab the apple [TS]

  TV remote the apple TV is asleep and my [TS]

  apple TV is plugged into the wall like [TS]

  everyone else's is connected to gigabit [TS]

  ethernet I would love for it to be doing [TS]

  more my playstation 4 both of them will [TS]

  download entire multi gigabyte games [TS]

  when their corner off like the fan is [TS]

  not spinning right it's still plugged in [TS]

  it's still in its sleep mode but once [TS]

  since the moment you will download game [TS]

  updates for me it will charge my [TS]

  controller it is doing so much more work [TS]

  for me that stupid Park and apparently [TS]

  does nothing until I turn it on i should [TS]

  also note that when I grabbed my apple [TS]

  TV remote in or in the TV is off my hdmi [TS]

  c and cec almost at C&C is in like the [TS]

  Music Factory [TS]

  yeah exactly the Music Factory the point [TS]

  being I mashed down the button and then [TS]

  the TV turns itself on now i will i will [TS]

  say that the TV does not always switch [TS]

  to the right input but with 99% [TS]

  reliability the TV does indeed turn [TS]

  itself on when the apple TV comes on [TS]

  which is nice [TS]

  I don't know maybe I'm just a special [TS]

  snowflake know that this is what's [TS]

  frustrating like this stuff works like [TS]

  ninety percent of the time it's like [TS]

  it's really frustrating but it's not a [TS]

  hundred percent and I know it's really [TS]

  hard it's really complicated but like [TS]

  certain things that don't work just [TS]

  seemed like they really should like the [TS]

  responsiveness of the software in the [TS]

  remote like that's a lot of the trackbed [TS]

  itself i was feeling it would be more [TS]

  responsive but part of it is the [TS]

  awkwardness of swiping that little thing [TS]

  it just doesn't feel like that's why i [TS]

  often use it as a d-pad I don't do the [TS]

  swiping i will hit that will click the [TS]

  edges which is in itself is a strange [TS]

  motion but i find it i find it more [TS]

  reliable that I know [TS]

  I've done the motion then especially [TS]

  like up and down flicking with like your [TS]

  thumb it i don't know i'm i'm not a [TS]

  trackpad person at all and I feel like I [TS]

  feel like a disconnection between them [TS]

  between those motions in the thing that [TS]

  you even just like whoever came up with [TS]

  the idea that selection state is going [TS]

  to be represented by by making some of [TS]

  the rectangles bigger I don't think it's [TS]

  a particularly successful idea because [TS]

  very often I have to double-check you [TS]

  know by looking at the screen to make [TS]

  sure the rectangle i think is selected [TS]

  selected like a big hunk and blue [TS]

  outline would certainly be out of here [TS]

  in less elegant but it would let me know [TS]

  better than anything you know it's [TS]

  obvious in a screenshot like you can't [TS]

  tell what selected look at this [TS]

  rectangle it spoken out in front of [TS]

  everything else is overlapping and [TS]

  clearly it's the one that selected but [TS]

  it's it's not obvious enough I think to [TS]

  you know like that the elegance benefit [TS]

  of it and the aesthetic benefit is [TS]

  outweighed by the the usability i wish i [TS]

  wish there was more of like a glow or a [TS]

  prominence about it and then when i'm [TS]

  trying to use the swiping to move around [TS]

  and get to the netflix app or whatever [TS]

  overshooting and having to go back one [TS]

  is definitely a thing and that's [TS]

  frustrating and I don't like hitting the [TS]

  d-pad going left left left down down [TS]

  down [TS]

  that's frustrating to because i see it i [TS]

  could just I can get it with the mouse [TS]

  instantly and it was a touchscreen I get [TS]

  touched immediately having to go left [TS]

  left left down down is a pain but at [TS]

  least i can count the number of less [TS]

  than the number of downs and I know I [TS]

  land on it having to go swipe is the [TS]

  bottom of the barrel where I have to go [TS]

  swipe swipe swipe down down but i don't [TS]

  know how many times I have swype because [TS]

  momentum may bring me over and then I [TS]

  have to correct and it's just not a [TS]

  pleasant experience some and when I [TS]

  talking to the remote like I've almost [TS]

  given up on that because see really [TS]

  frustrates me and they're like when are [TS]

  you ready for me to talk Cirie and they [TS]

  keep changing like oh it's always [TS]

  listening to start talking about often i [TS]

  start talking then it goes boom in the [TS]

  middle of me talking and I know it's not [TS]

  it didn't catch after what i said and [TS]

  when I tried talking to the remote i [TS]

  hold down the microphone button and I [TS]

  never always wonder when it's safe for [TS]

  me to talk to have to wait for the [TS]

  little rainbow colored things show up [TS]

  can I start talking now and very often [TS]

  it takes two or three tries and it's [TS]

  often still better than the alternative [TS]

  Connecticut into a nap but yeah I'm [TS]

  ready for the next version i'll keep [TS]

  buying example to use the same reason [TS]

  you do about that [TS]

  the other reason I have the market [TS]

  perhaps dozens I'm essentially out of [TS]

  inputs at this point right so if I [TS]

  want to try something else have to fix [TS]

  something and I've locked myself into [TS]

  the apple ecosystem below the itunes [TS]

  like movies and stuff that I bought so i [TS]

  have to have an apple TV so I'm gonna [TS]

  keep buying them and I'm ready to buy a [TS]

  new one anytime I want to make it better [TS]