The Accidental Tech Podcast

193: The Escape Zone


00:00:00   it is currently five past nine on [TS]

00:00:01   thursday night the apple event was [TS]

00:00:03   earlier today my beloved virginia tech [TS]

00:00:05   hokies are presently losing to the [TS]

00:00:07   University of Pittsburgh i am i am [TS]

00:00:09   watching it out of the corner of my eye [TS]

00:00:11   on my iPad on the watch ESPN app which [TS]

00:00:13   is actually very nice and I am trying [TS]

00:00:17   desperately to pay attention what you [TS]

00:00:18   guys are saying rather than watch my [TS]

00:00:20   beloved Hokies and so if i accidentally [TS]

00:00:23   let out a cheer may be given that we're [TS]

00:00:26   losing 2116 a not happy cheer that Marco [TS]

00:00:30   may have to bleep my apologies but this [TS]

00:00:33   is what I do for you listeners it would [TS]

00:00:34   be so much kind of incredible to be to [TS]

00:00:36   be like perfectly well time we're [TS]

00:00:38   talking about like you know this new [TS]

00:00:39   touch bar in cases like to think that [TS]

00:00:41   come on that would be kind of amazing [TS]

00:00:43   haha i wouldn't put it past me [TS]

00:00:46   no promises alright so we do have a an [TS]

00:00:52   infinitesimally small bit of follow-up [TS]

00:00:54   get yes alright work within 10 yards [TS]

00:00:57   next video so even if intestinal small [TS]

00:01:00   amount of farts 04 joke reference this [TS]

00:01:02   is this is a football team you're [TS]

00:01:03   watching [TS]

00:01:04   yes this is a football game watching I [TS]

00:01:06   don't know which sport to make terrible [TS]

00:01:07   jokes about fair enough [TS]

00:01:09   oh and is it is in the world series [TS]

00:01:11   tonight as well actually come to think [TS]

00:01:12   of it and one of the games i mean [TS]

00:01:14   probably it isn't it like every night I [TS]

00:01:17   mean is like that's the thing like [TS]

00:01:18   baseball cards baseball like a DDoS [TS]

00:01:20   attack but just like every night there's [TS]

00:01:21   baseball like taking away from [TS]

00:01:23   baseballers constantly games everywhere [TS]

00:01:26   everyday that is amazing [TS]

00:01:28   well done sir so we do have a bit of [TS]

00:01:30   follow-up and for the first time in like [TS]

00:01:31   two or three weeks it's not me [TS]

00:01:34   John what have you been up to lately i [TS]

00:01:36   did actually make it to an apple store [TS]

00:01:38   to check out the phones were there this [TS]

00:01:40   mystery is dedicated trip the only [TS]

00:01:43   reason I went timely close to you to [TS]

00:01:45   check out the fonts we're gonna start [TS]

00:01:47   talking about the ipod yeah well it'll [TS]

00:01:49   be quick i'll be here's a picture you [TS]

00:01:51   took with one here's another picture you [TS]

00:01:52   took with what [TS]

00:01:53   uh-huh yeah i was gonna send it to them [TS]

00:01:56   but i decided to and I was helping to [TS]

00:01:59   clarify he had plenty to clarify which [TS]

00:02:01   1i want to get it didn't really help me [TS]

00:02:04   that much because really yeah because i [TS]

00:02:08   know i have a dilemma i think i can [TS]

00:02:09   decide what I'm going to do but you know [TS]

00:02:11   yet so the black one is group [TS]

00:02:13   there it would look better people didn't [TS]

00:02:16   touch it but people touch it so it looks [TS]

00:02:17   gross and has little scratches on it [TS]

00:02:19   like but we already covered all this [TS]

00:02:20   ground i think i'm going to think what's [TS]

00:02:24   gonna end up happening is I'm going to [TS]

00:02:25   experience the worst of all possible [TS]

00:02:26   worlds because what I think i'm going to [TS]

00:02:28   do is buy a jet black one and try using [TS]

00:02:31   without a case and then eventually [TS]

00:02:33   decided that I can't handle the outer [TS]

00:02:35   case because it looks too i'm looking at [TS]

00:02:36   scratch too much and then by case for it [TS]

00:02:38   later after it's already damaged and [TS]

00:02:40   scratched up and put the leather case on [TS]

00:02:42   my scratched up jet black iphone 7 at [TS]

00:02:45   least it wouldn't be a lie at least you [TS]

00:02:47   you wouldn't have this pristine funder [TS]

00:02:49   there that you think is totally [TS]

00:02:51   unscratched but there's actually one [TS]

00:02:52   scratch on the side i think i can get [TS]

00:02:54   pretty well but like I I the thing is [TS]

00:02:55   I've never got all my ipod touches I've [TS]

00:02:58   had cases for and my one iphone had a [TS]

00:03:00   case for us i'm just going to give it a [TS]

00:03:01   try without a case because this one is [TS]

00:03:03   gritty enough that I feel like all right [TS]

00:03:04   you know but let's give it a try and can [TS]

00:03:06   I handle the damage that is inevitably [TS]

00:03:09   going to happen to this so i think i'm [TS]

00:03:11   gonna give it a try almost but when i [TS]

00:03:12   was there but then i remembered that I'm [TS]

00:03:13   not supposed to buy one until i can [TS]

00:03:15   renegotiate summarizing thing in like [TS]

00:03:18   ten days or something and they only had [TS]

00:03:20   256 gig models anyway so I didn't get [TS]

00:03:22   but that's what i'm going to do get a [TS]

00:03:24   jet black one try without a case see how [TS]

00:03:26   long that lasts i predict that will not [TS]

00:03:28   last long [TS]

00:03:29   fair enough now are you planning to get [TS]

00:03:31   applecare oh yes yes i was still I [TS]

00:03:34   bought myself this matte black iphone 7 [TS]

00:03:38   which I stand by a few weeks later is [TS]

00:03:41   the prettiest iphone i think i've ever [TS]

00:03:42   ever owned I really genuinely believe [TS]

00:03:45   it's great-looking it is slicker than [TS]

00:03:48   anything you can imagine but it's really [TS]

00:03:50   darn good-looking [TS]

00:03:52   yes all right field goal that's a good [TS]

00:03:55   sign only down by two so anyway so I got [TS]

00:03:59   this job but this excuse me this map [TS]

00:04:01   black iphone i did not get this is all [TS]

00:04:03   starting to show you know that's fine [TS]

00:04:05   the listeners will take this journey [TS]

00:04:07   with me so tomorrow I got applecare hey [TS]

00:04:11   I know I got this I got this applecare+ [TS]

00:04:13   for the very first time and everyone [TS]

00:04:14   applecare and anything before to the [TS]

00:04:16   best of my recollection and I feel okay [TS]

00:04:19   about this [TS]

00:04:20   meanwhile later that same launch day i [TS]

00:04:23   order Aaron a [TS]

00:04:24   a-a-and iphone 7 no applecare+ because [TS]

00:04:29   she always uses a case we go to a [TS]

00:04:31   football game this past weekend and her [TS]

00:04:34   phone falls out of her pocket because [TS]

00:04:36   why wouldn't it it's slick as a bar soap [TS]

00:04:39   and she didn't have her case on it yet [TS]

00:04:43   asked me what happened aaron's phone her [TS]

00:04:45   three week old phone did you spill water [TS]

00:04:47   on it [TS]

00:04:48   no that would actually be kind of okay [TS]

00:04:50   why do not have a case on it yet how [TS]

00:04:52   long does it take for the case [TS]

00:04:53   installation process after after his [TS]

00:04:55   passion purchases like that bring to the [TS]

00:04:58   dealer to put the case on you just get [TS]

00:05:00   take out of the box you put in the case [TS]

00:05:01   well the rust-proof coating on the [TS]

00:05:03   undercarriage is very expensive and [TS]

00:05:04   takes a long time now I'm what ended up [TS]

00:05:06   happening was we had gotten an apple [TS]

00:05:09   case but even the silicone cases are [TS]

00:05:10   ridiculously expensive just wait just [TS]

00:05:12   wait [TS]

00:05:13   the silicone cases like 30-40 box and so [TS]

00:05:15   we had one but we were thinking maybe we [TS]

00:05:17   can find something that's effectively [TS]

00:05:19   the same on amazon hadn't opened up the [TS]

00:05:21   apple one in case we could return it [TS]

00:05:22   so what ended up happening was in order [TS]

00:05:25   to attempt to save the forty dollars i [TS]

00:05:27   think it was for the the silicone case [TS]

00:05:29   that we had already purchased we ended [TS]

00:05:31   up now having a hundred thirty dollars [TS]

00:05:33   with the damage that has yet to be fixed [TS]

00:05:35   because it's like when your UPS was [TS]

00:05:36   sitting next to your computer during the [TS]

00:05:38   thunderstorm not plugged into it [TS]

00:05:39   yes exactly the case sitting at home and [TS]

00:05:42   in the box while you drop your phone [TS]

00:05:44   mhm that's true that's absolutely [TS]

00:05:46   accurate so so get applecare is really [TS]

00:05:49   the most story here or put the darn [TS]

00:05:51   phone in a case and don't be like me [TS]

00:05:55   this episode is brought to you by [TS]

00:05:56   Squarespace start building your website [TS]

00:05:58   today at squarespace.com enter offer [TS]

00:06:01   code ATP and check out to get ten [TS]

00:06:03   percent off now Squarespace sites look [TS]

00:06:06   professionally designed regardless of [TS]

00:06:08   your skill level you can be a complete [TS]

00:06:09   novice or you can be a coding expert and [TS]

00:06:12   Squarespace is there for you at all [TS]

00:06:14   skill levels they have intuitive [TS]

00:06:16   easy-to-use tools and you can even get a [TS]

00:06:19   free domain of designing for a whole [TS]

00:06:20   year up front and there's so much to [TS]

00:06:23   love about Squarespace i always i will [TS]

00:06:24   use square space for our site i've used [TS]

00:06:26   it for projects before where people want [TS]

00:06:29   to ask me to make a website and i said [TS]

00:06:30   look you don't need me have here [TS]

00:06:33   Squarespace and show them how to use it [TS]

00:06:34   and sometimes like you don't get him [TS]

00:06:35   started for like half hour it looks [TS]

00:06:37   incredible and they think I did all [TS]

00:06:38   and it turns out to squarespace graphics [TS]

00:06:40   just that good and then they can help [TS]

00:06:42   themselves and if they don't need to [TS]

00:06:44   support after that they can just ask [TS]

00:06:45   where space they don't have to ask me [TS]

00:06:47   it's incredible you get so much built-in [TS]

00:06:49   with squarespace if you have a project [TS]

00:06:51   you need to make a website for it [TS]

00:06:53   it is usually not worth doing anything [TS]

00:06:55   else it's usually just worth kona [TS]

00:06:56   Squarespace have them do all the hard [TS]

00:06:58   stuff for you and if you have met if it [TS]

00:07:00   makes everybody else it's even more of [TS]

00:07:02   an obvious cell check it out start your [TS]

00:07:04   free trial site today at squarespace.com [TS]

00:07:06   when you sign up for Squarespace make [TS]

00:07:09   sure to use the offer code ATP to get [TS]

00:07:11   ten percent off your first purchase [TS]

00:07:12   thanks a lot of square space for [TS]

00:07:14   sponsoring our show [TS]

00:07:15   ah I'm all fired up ready to go to the [TS]

00:07:21   mac day I'm so happy it but yet [TS]

00:07:23   asterisks but other for the most part of [TS]

00:07:25   happy to Mac day we just start by [TS]

00:07:26   talking about TV then yeah you should [TS]

00:07:29   visit you to give an accurate simulation [TS]

00:07:31   of the experience of watching this this [TS]

00:07:33   presentation [TS]

00:07:34   well you know that was John on the phone [TS]

00:07:36   we we cannot skip any where we're going [TS]

00:07:38   to have to go chronologically so let's [TS]

00:07:40   start with the TV things have happened [TS]

00:07:42   for the apple TV and in fact things have [TS]

00:07:44   happened for more than just the apple TV [TS]

00:07:45   they have happened for iOS as well the [TS]

00:07:48   mac well I mean who cares about the max [TS]

00:07:50   just a mac event so but yeah there's an [TS]

00:07:52   apple TV app or a TV app i should say [TS]

00:07:55   for iOS not for the back but for iOS and [TS]

00:07:58   as well for the TV of course and it's [TS]

00:08:01   it's all things to all people as long as [TS]

00:08:03   you don't care about Netflix or Amazon [TS]

00:08:04   you know this it's weird kind of way [TS]

00:08:06   that they did TV stuff in this thing [TS]

00:08:08   although we kind of knew that they were [TS]

00:08:09   going to with you know justjust off our [TS]

00:08:11   features no hardware features they [TS]

00:08:12   haven't fixed the apple TV remote or [TS]

00:08:14   anything like that they didn't talk [TS]

00:08:16   about their new you know making [TS]

00:08:19   experience actually watching TV on your [TS]

00:08:21   Apple TV better which is hey a good [TS]

00:08:22   thing to do [TS]

00:08:23   maybe don't spend too long on it in [TS]

00:08:24   front of an event supposed to be about [TS]

00:08:26   Max but whatever but I think it's worth [TS]

00:08:28   talking about because this presentation [TS]

00:08:31   kind of show that Apple is still [TS]

00:08:32   chipping away at apple TV making steady [TS]

00:08:36   progress but on the other hand I think [TS]

00:08:37   it also highlighted all the ways that [TS]

00:08:39   they're behind and I had a couple of [TS]

00:08:41   thoughts in my head while watching this [TS]

00:08:43   one was that everything they were [TS]

00:08:45   showing you like the unified interface [TS]

00:08:48   TV can be in place to watch all your [TS]

00:08:50   stuff [TS]

00:08:51   easier than going to find like what [TS]

00:08:53   Apple's I watching that thing in or [TS]

00:08:54   whatever you know having a unified TV [TS]

00:08:56   thing keeps track of what you're [TS]

00:08:57   watching him if you're using another apt [TS]

00:08:58   to watch it trying to bring everything [TS]

00:09:00   together like their goal of you know I [TS]

00:09:03   forget what the words are all try to [TS]

00:09:05   scrub to the video here for like a [TS]

00:09:06   unified TV experience or whatever you [TS]

00:09:09   can't always it unified TV experience [TS]

00:09:11   there you go you can't actually deliver [TS]

00:09:14   on that until you hit some critical mass [TS]

00:09:17   of content and it's debatable what that [TS]

00:09:20   critical mass of content is but [TS]

00:09:21   obviously we would agree that you just [TS]

00:09:23   had HBO and it's never gonna be unified [TS]

00:09:26   interface or you didn't have some of the [TS]

00:09:28   major sports it wouldn't be unified [TS]

00:09:29   interface but like I'm not quite sure [TS]

00:09:31   what that is but I think Apple Apple TV [TS]

00:09:33   does not yet have a critical mass of [TS]

00:09:36   content and you may sit as dude based [TS]

00:09:39   solely on netflix not participating in [TS]

00:09:41   this that is enough at this point to say [TS]

00:09:43   no because people want their next week's [TS]

00:09:45   they have exclusive content people like [TS]

00:09:48   it if that's not part of the experience [TS]

00:09:50   so much for unified it's already [TS]

00:09:51   bifurcated as just gonna split or even [TS]

00:09:53   more for things like local sports that [TS]

00:09:54   you can get so the gold unified [TS]

00:09:57   experience is fine but as discussed many [TS]

00:09:59   many times in the past if you're not [TS]

00:10:01   going to do the omniverse box thing you [TS]

00:10:03   can never present a unified interface [TS]

00:10:05   unless you literally contain all the [TS]

00:10:08   contents are also watching TV and there [TS]

00:10:11   I don't think they're close to that for [TS]

00:10:12   most people because it's always going to [TS]

00:10:14   be something that's not in apple TV or [TS]

00:10:17   not in the TV app and apple TV for most [TS]

00:10:20   people [TS]

00:10:20   few people who only watch things that [TS]

00:10:22   are in their fine but like if that's [TS]

00:10:23   their goal they need to work on the [TS]

00:10:26   business side of this to figure out if [TS]

00:10:29   we had these content providers we can [TS]

00:10:32   get you know we will cover eighty [TS]

00:10:33   percent of the of the viewing public [TS]

00:10:34   needs or whatever and I'm sure the [TS]

00:10:36   changes from country to country and [TS]

00:10:37   region to region but there I don't think [TS]

00:10:39   they're closed now so that's depressing [TS]

00:10:40   but that's nothing new technology is due [TS]

00:10:42   entirely business deals and the next [TS]

00:10:44   thing is the TV button the the icon on [TS]

00:10:49   the remote for the TV button like that [TS]

00:10:51   it's kind of the home button with you [TS]

00:10:54   know when you're pressing you go back to [TS]

00:10:55   the screen with all the little [TS]

00:10:56   rectangles where all your different apps [TS]

00:10:58   are right but that icon it's printed on [TS]

00:11:01   the remote is also the little glyph [TS]

00:11:03   that's on the TV app [TS]

00:11:05   and so in the demo they showed if you go [TS]

00:11:09   to the TV app launch it and like as a [TS]

00:11:11   bunch of things you're watching and you [TS]

00:11:12   click on one of them like Game of [TS]

00:11:13   Thrones and your truck off into the HBO [TS]

00:11:15   a poor you're watching Game of Thrones [TS]

00:11:16   and then you hit the TV icon it takes [TS]

00:11:19   you back to the TV application not back [TS]

00:11:21   to the screen with a bunch of little [TS]

00:11:22   rectangles and it's kind of like em this [TS]

00:11:25   button and this this thing go together [TS]

00:11:29   and like it should have been there from [TS]

00:11:30   the beginning but it could be read [TS]

00:11:31   conned in but either way it kind of [TS]

00:11:33   changes the fundamental experience I [TS]

00:11:35   think for the better kind of the same [TS]

00:11:37   way the apple watch experience with [TS]

00:11:39   changes like look people don't want to [TS]

00:11:40   go back to basically springboard on [TS]

00:11:42   their apple TV all the time it's [TS]

00:11:43   supposed to be a television watching [TS]

00:11:44   devices if you're watching television [TS]

00:11:46   the television watching should be the [TS]

00:11:47   central thing when you hit the tivo [TS]

00:11:49   button you go back to you well that's [TS]

00:11:52   not a good example is always takes me [TS]

00:11:53   back to the stupid main Tebow central [TS]

00:11:55   whatever anyway [TS]

00:11:56   Reese entering the center of gravity of [TS]

00:11:59   the tale of apple TV on television I [TS]

00:12:00   think it's a good idea but then now all [TS]

00:12:04   of a sudden the appletv reframed in this [TS]

00:12:05   way less as a like humongous ipad that [TS]

00:12:09   you don't touch you know like it's just [TS]

00:12:10   like a big ipod you know less like a [TS]

00:12:11   springboard is the heart of everything [TS]

00:12:13   right [TS]

00:12:14   spring bars not the heart of everything [TS]

00:12:16   the TV app is the heart of apple TV [TS]

00:12:18   because it's all about watching TV and [TS]

00:12:20   sometimes you want to play games or [TS]

00:12:21   whatever really you want to be using TV [TS]

00:12:23   app and reframed like that then again [TS]

00:12:26   you see how far behind on their where [TS]

00:12:28   the user profiles how can i switch shoot [TS]

00:12:30   like my kids think we're all their apps [TS]

00:12:32   are going oh there's like up next or [TS]

00:12:33   whatever yeah fine if you live alone and [TS]

00:12:35   only one person ever watch TV shows at [TS]

00:12:36   the same time that's great how do i [TS]

00:12:38   switch to you know a different account [TS]

00:12:39   with a different apple idea with the [TS]

00:12:41   same Apple ID all those things that [TS]

00:12:43   netflix has long since figured out is [TS]

00:12:44   when you want to thats like that you can [TS]

00:12:46   pick who you want to be and you have [TS]

00:12:47   your own cue of stuff and you have your [TS]

00:12:48   own thing that you watched last and i'm [TS]

00:12:50   not going to go up to it and find out [TS]

00:12:51   the next things up next for me is like [TS]

00:12:53   you know some Disney Channel show that [TS]

00:12:56   my daughter was watching that I don't [TS]

00:12:57   want to watch right there so far behind [TS]

00:12:59   just the netflix app let alone other [TS]

00:13:03   full television experience you know [TS]

00:13:05   attempts to be unified thing so I'm glad [TS]

00:13:08   apple TV is making progress i think [TS]

00:13:11   they're moving in the right direction [TS]

00:13:12   but they're still behind and the remote [TS]

00:13:14   sucks well how do you really feel you [TS]

00:13:17   know I was really excited [TS]

00:13:18   did to see the live sports stuff and [TS]

00:13:21   granted as we've already discussed i am [TS]

00:13:23   not at all watching college football [TS]

00:13:25   right now but being able to just say to [TS]

00:13:29   siri you know put on the Virginia Tech [TS]

00:13:31   game or what or what have you that [TS]

00:13:33   that's really powerful and really [TS]

00:13:35   awesome but it works when it works which [TS]

00:13:38   I meanwhile I'm going on faith that it [TS]

00:13:40   generally does but that that's really [TS]

00:13:43   exciting and that's like you said its [TS]

00:13:45   movements in the right direction but I I [TS]

00:13:49   just have a hard time thinking that for [TS]

00:13:52   me this is going to be much of an [TS]

00:13:53   improvement because generally speaking [TS]

00:13:55   when im using the apple TV which I do [TS]

00:13:58   darn near daily i'm using flex or i'm [TS]

00:14:03   using netflix or occasionally i'm using [TS]

00:14:05   the standard music app it's very rare [TS]

00:14:08   i'm doing anything else [TS]

00:14:10   so having to go for I guess how this [TS]

00:14:14   would work is I would hit the TV what [TS]

00:14:16   was once the home button to go to the TV [TS]

00:14:18   app and then I guess hit again to go to [TS]

00:14:20   springboard I don't know it might take [TS]

00:14:22   you back to the springboard you think [TS]

00:14:24   you did you haven't first launched apple [TS]

00:14:25   TV i have no idea where we saw a demo [TS]

00:14:26   with two seconds worth of interaction [TS]

00:14:28   will find out when we get the OS update [TS]

00:14:30   i suppose but anyway if if going back to [TS]

00:14:33   springboard is via the appletv a prime [TS]

00:14:36   sorry the TV app always that's actually [TS]

00:14:38   going to be a disappointing change for [TS]

00:14:40   me but i hope i really really hope that [TS]

00:14:45   in the future the netflix and amazon [TS]

00:14:47   stuff gets squared away so that they can [TS]

00:14:49   be included because amazon is going to [TS]

00:14:52   be important too soon because of the [TS]

00:14:53   Grand Tour [TS]

00:14:54   like I said netflix is where we watch [TS]

00:14:56   pretty much any TV that isn't on you [TS]

00:14:59   know terrestrial television so and in [TS]

00:15:02   Plexus for movies and other things so I [TS]

00:15:05   feel like this is a step in the right [TS]

00:15:06   direction but it's not there yet and man [TS]

00:15:08   i'm hopeful though I'm super hopefully [TS]

00:15:11   even though i don't expect anything to [TS]

00:15:12   actually happen [TS]

00:15:13   Apple has a lot of work to do if it [TS]

00:15:15   wants to get these things and like get [TS]

00:15:17   netflix on board this is the unified TV [TS]

00:15:19   experience you need to have netflix in [TS]

00:15:20   there get amazon to have a thing like [TS]

00:15:22   integrate make sure the people who [TS]

00:15:24   should be integrating do make sure [TS]

00:15:26   plexes integrated like if you really [TS]

00:15:28   want to be unified you have to reach out [TS]

00:15:29   and it's really hard to get it looks on [TS]

00:15:31   board when Apple keeps making more [TS]

00:15:32   she's about all we're gonna be a make [TS]

00:15:34   her own content like they're doing that [TS]

00:15:35   reality show and cookies talking about [TS]

00:15:37   well you know we were looking into [TS]

00:15:39   funding content we like making your own [TS]

00:15:41   content is directly competing with [TS]

00:15:43   Netflix and Amazon who were also making [TS]

00:15:45   their own content and I i think it's [TS]

00:15:49   easier to work with something like HBO [TS]

00:15:50   which also makes it on content with HBO [TS]

00:15:52   has no pretensions to make a digital [TS]

00:15:54   platform for television watching like [TS]

00:15:56   they're not selling little Punk's like [TS]

00:15:57   you connect to your TV they don't sell [TS]

00:15:59   network services they're all about the [TS]

00:16:00   content so that is a little bit more of [TS]

00:16:02   a straightforward thing but anyway this [TS]

00:16:03   is the plan they got work to do so while [TS]

00:16:07   we're waiting for the new Apple TV with [TS]

00:16:09   a non crappy remote to come out [TS]

00:16:10   hopefully all the apples little business [TS]

00:16:12   people are scurrying around trying to [TS]

00:16:14   get these deals happen doing whatever it [TS]

00:16:16   takes or just don't be a TV platform [TS]

00:16:18   like you're going to play in the state [TS]

00:16:19   game and try to friday unified interface [TS]

00:16:21   then provide a unified integrates I [TS]

00:16:22   don't want to see you know 10 years from [TS]

00:16:24   now three or four islands of content [TS]

00:16:27   with their own apps in their own [TS]

00:16:28   ecosystems totally separate from each [TS]

00:16:29   other so annoying all right anything [TS]

00:16:32   else about the TV i know i know Marco [TS]

00:16:33   you are really excited to talk about it [TS]

00:16:35   some more but oh yes I care so much [TS]

00:16:38   about television you know you see that [TS]

00:16:41   and I know to some degree you're being [TS]

00:16:42   silly but don't you watch all of your TV [TS]

00:16:45   through the apple TV [TS]

00:16:46   yeah and I don't care about it [TS]

00:16:48   whatsoever like that to me and I the [TS]

00:16:51   apple TV is something that I its I [TS]

00:16:53   country the appletv the way a lot of [TS]

00:16:55   like our friends who love ipad so much [TS]

00:16:58   treat the mac it's like it's a thing [TS]

00:16:59   that i use i choose it as the best of a [TS]

00:17:02   whole bunch of tools i don't care about [TS]

00:17:04   and i use it and I don't really think [TS]

00:17:06   about it I I don't have a lot of passion [TS]

00:17:08   for TV or TV related things or [TS]

00:17:11   tv-related boxes the appletv the new [TS]

00:17:14   Apple TV box is largely fine [TS]

00:17:18   it could be better in a lot of ways i [TS]

00:17:20   think it will always just be fine [TS]

00:17:23   the old one was always just fine also [TS]

00:17:25   it's the apple TV has a product line has [TS]

00:17:27   been around for quite some time and has [TS]

00:17:29   always been fine so I expected to [TS]

00:17:32   continue to be fine if we continue to [TS]

00:17:34   use it on a regular basis but really [TS]

00:17:36   just never think about it at all except [TS]

00:17:39   i'm using it doesn't work I think you'll [TS]

00:17:40   appreciate the up next thing because if [TS]

00:17:42   you actually use that TV app it's easier [TS]

00:17:44   way to get back what was i doing [TS]

00:17:45   before on the appletv if it hasn't [TS]

00:17:47   retain state on the thing to be able to [TS]

00:17:49   just go to that except the things that i [TS]

00:17:51   that i watch most often our netflix and [TS]

00:17:53   flex which i'm pretty sure will probably [TS]

00:17:56   never be in it not being that it's okay [TS]

00:17:58   I hear you you know it's the kind of [TS]

00:18:00   thing like i don't i don't have cable so [TS]

00:18:02   I'm cable lock in so i can I i don't use [TS]

00:18:04   any apps that require cable login I i do [TS]

00:18:07   have HBO Go now whichever 1i have one of [TS]

00:18:10   the HBO now but I've actually been thank [TS]

00:18:12   you i'm actually been nothing about [TS]

00:18:13   canceling because we hardly ever [TS]

00:18:14   watching Miley watch up in bursts and [TS]

00:18:17   you can always turn it off and turn [TS]

00:18:18   around again [TS]

00:18:19   touchdown oh nevermind damn but [TS]

00:18:22   regardless i don't think i'm i'm going [TS]

00:18:25   to possibly ever see this TV app or if i [TS]

00:18:28   do it will be something that gets in my [TS]

00:18:31   way that that you know I have to like [TS]

00:18:32   click the the fake home button one more [TS]

00:18:34   time out of to get to what i really want [TS]

00:18:36   to watch all right anything else in the [TS]

00:18:38   apple TV is your team losing it [TS]

00:18:40   they are losing I thought we had a [TS]

00:18:42   touchdown which would put us somewhat [TS]

00:18:44   comfortably in the lead but I was [TS]

00:18:45   mistaken [TS]

00:18:46   really you know we forgot to mention [TS]

00:18:49   something they Apple opened the keynote [TS]

00:18:52   with a really lovely video on [TS]

00:18:54   accessibility I mean that genuinely I [TS]

00:18:56   completely forgot to mention that I [TS]

00:18:57   thought that was really cool and they [TS]

00:18:59   said that they're going to our I guess I [TS]

00:19:02   think it's already there i just haven't [TS]

00:19:04   looked at it yet they're they're going [TS]

00:19:05   to have like a top-level so-to-speak [TS]

00:19:07   accessibility page on their website [TS]

00:19:09   which we should check out and we'll find [TS]

00:19:12   it and put a link in the show notes but [TS]

00:19:14   I thought that was a really great video [TS]

00:19:16   and and in many ways I think that's [TS]

00:19:18   Apple at its best and and I just wanted [TS]

00:19:21   to applaud them for it because I thought [TS]

00:19:23   that was really good stuff [TS]

00:19:25   Apple has always been really good with [TS]

00:19:27   accessibility stuff like you know they [TS]

00:19:29   haven't been perfect [TS]

00:19:30   by all means anybody use the technology [TS]

00:19:32   will tell you the various times have [TS]

00:19:34   been perfect but compared to what almost [TS]

00:19:36   everyone else in the industry does [TS]

00:19:38   apples accessibility support is just [TS]

00:19:40   world-class it's so good and what you [TS]

00:19:43   get out of the box with apple products [TS]

00:19:45   for for things like screen readers and [TS]

00:19:47   and click control thingy all sorts of [TS]

00:19:49   various technologies a lot of times this [TS]

00:19:52   kind of is available on other platforms [TS]

00:19:53   only if you like buy additional software [TS]

00:19:56   or have additional hardware even [TS]

00:19:58   and it's just it's it it is so like what [TS]

00:20:01   you get with apple out of the box with [TS]

00:20:03   all their products accessibility wise is [TS]

00:20:05   just ridiculously good compared to [TS]

00:20:07   everything else in the market like the [TS]

00:20:08   most important feature of these videos [TS]

00:20:09   as aside from you know making people [TS]

00:20:12   think Apple that is a nice company and [TS]

00:20:14   you know doing all the like the pr [TS]

00:20:15   affected simply like oh you're this [TS]

00:20:17   video show you should use a nice company [TS]

00:20:19   while they are nice company and be that [TS]

00:20:21   the the other side effect of this is [TS]

00:20:23   that it exposes people who don't use [TS]

00:20:26   these features people like me don't use [TS]

00:20:28   these features for the most part to the [TS]

00:20:30   fact that they exist in how they work [TS]

00:20:32   I had no idea that the camera on the [TS]

00:20:34   iphone will speak to you about who's in [TS]

00:20:36   the frame and and whether it finds a [TS]

00:20:38   face and how big the faces so a person [TS]

00:20:40   who can't see can I take pictures with [TS]

00:20:42   the with the camera like when do regular [TS]

00:20:44   people experience these features i don't [TS]

00:20:45   think most people go into accessibility [TS]

00:20:47   and turn on accessibility features and [TS]

00:20:49   created for people who have a bad or no [TS]

00:20:51   vision or can't hear or someone just [TS]

00:20:53   experiment with it right [TS]

00:20:54   most people don't see these features at [TS]

00:20:55   all and so when you say accessibility [TS]

00:20:58   maybe people don't even know what you [TS]

00:20:59   mean like what what do you mean how can [TS]

00:21:01   a blind person who's an iphone you got [TS]

00:21:02   to see the screen right people just [TS]

00:21:03   don't know right and this these things I [TS]

00:21:06   think show you know what marketers said [TS]

00:21:09   how far these products go to be usable [TS]

00:21:12   in situations that regular people don't [TS]

00:21:13   consider because they don't they don't [TS]

00:21:14   have if you don't if you don't have [TS]

00:21:17   these limitations you don't know what [TS]

00:21:20   thing what affordances are there to help [TS]

00:21:21   you with him until you need them like [TS]

00:21:23   it's as we all get old for example i'm [TS]

00:21:26   sure most of us will be cranking up the [TS]

00:21:28   text size and all of a sudden will [TS]

00:21:30   appreciate that feature that we never [TS]

00:21:31   touched before like my parents used [TS]

00:21:32   their iphone like six eyes device in [TS]

00:21:35   like the big mode where I forget what [TS]

00:21:37   it's called but like you've everything [TS]

00:21:38   is bigger it's like zoom in it's a non [TS]

00:21:40   native res and that feature is [TS]

00:21:44   meaningless to me now but eventually as [TS]

00:21:46   my vision gets worse [TS]

00:21:47   suddenly will be like oh I'm glad that's [TS]

00:21:48   there this video's do a good job of [TS]

00:21:50   highlighting to both users and [TS]

00:21:52   developers that this stuff is actually [TS]

00:21:53   there so that when they do eventually [TS]

00:21:57   get older and start you know that their [TS]

00:22:00   sensory perception starts changing [TS]

00:22:01   they'll know to go and find those and [TS]

00:22:04   they'll feel good about you know using a [TS]

00:22:06   product line that that offers easier for [TS]

00:22:08   developers [TS]

00:22:09   it's reminding them it's not just about [TS]

00:22:11   putting late [TS]

00:22:11   was on your things there's other you [TS]

00:22:13   know go the extra mile and see what we [TS]

00:22:15   did with the camera app if you have a [TS]

00:22:17   camera app you could do something like [TS]

00:22:18   this to your application will be more [TS]

00:22:20   accessible [TS]

00:22:21   alright what else was spoken about free [TS]

00:22:24   mac stuff there was nothing that person [TS]

00:22:29   right didn't they talk about iphones [TS]

00:22:30   briefly talk about how well the apple [TS]

00:22:32   watch is selling but not giving numbers [TS]

00:22:34   I don't think and now I mean who cares [TS]

00:22:36   just talk about max its max I like iOS a [TS]

00:22:40   penetration of a iOS 10 verses the [TS]

00:22:43   latest version of Android or whatever [TS]

00:22:45   that let's let's be honest they were [TS]

00:22:47   killing time and I don't know why [TS]

00:22:48   they're coming time they they didn't [TS]

00:22:49   have like it's not as if there's one [TS]

00:22:52   thing that filler the second thing you [TS]

00:22:53   to just make what should have been a [TS]

00:22:55   much shorter presentation way too long [TS]

00:22:57   but they did we forgot to mention [TS]

00:22:59   something about the appletv minecraft is [TS]

00:23:01   on the appletv is that time I'm not [TS]

00:23:03   trying to be snarky that's something we [TS]

00:23:05   care about like is that a big dealers or [TS]

00:23:07   do you think no one will use that I [TS]

00:23:08   don't know squat about Minecraft I don't [TS]

00:23:11   think that's that I mean it it's it's a [TS]

00:23:13   big deal in Minecraft super popular in [TS]

00:23:15   terms of people buy and play it but [TS]

00:23:17   minecraft is available on like every [TS]

00:23:20   platform in the universe [TS]

00:23:21   so the fact that it's on apple TV now [TS]

00:23:23   yeah you have parody good but you know [TS]

00:23:26   alright so i guess i've run out of [TS]

00:23:27   reasons to stall other than to say that [TS]

00:23:29   tech is up 22 21 / pit I let's talk [TS]

00:23:33   about the mac overall I feel like this [TS]

00:23:39   is okay i think this was good i [TS]

00:23:41   certainly have been left I've there's [TS]

00:23:43   certain things that I'm disappointed by [TS]

00:23:45   but in the grand scheme of things these [TS]

00:23:48   new macbook pros look really darn good [TS]

00:23:51   really really good [TS]

00:23:52   I'm amped about the one they call the [TS]

00:23:54   touch bar now I'm I i don't know if i'll [TS]

00:23:58   like it but tentatively that looks good [TS]

00:24:01   i'm excited i'm excited to try it [TS]

00:24:03   even though i don't plan on buying one [TS]

00:24:06   and i'm not going to get one from work [TS]

00:24:07   for two years but anyway i'm excited to [TS]

00:24:09   try it i am sad although completely [TS]

00:24:12   unsurprised that they don't have like a [TS]

00:24:15   magic keyboard update that included it i [TS]

00:24:18   understand that leaving that screen on [TS]

00:24:20   would surely take and not insignificant [TS]

00:24:22   amount of battery power [TS]

00:24:24   but the magic keyboard is rechargeable [TS]

00:24:26   now so who really cares if I have to [TS]

00:24:28   charge it once connected with a wire and [TS]

00:24:30   then you wouldn't have a problem [TS]

00:24:31   I mean that I wouldn't want to be an [TS]

00:24:32   animal but I but no I mean I i would [TS]

00:24:36   love to see Magic keyboard that had this [TS]

00:24:38   touch bar on it i don't expect it will [TS]

00:24:40   happen but it would be neat and I say [TS]

00:24:43   that in part because that all my use the [TS]

00:24:45   desktop is an imac and certainly today [TS]

00:24:48   there was no real talk about anything [TS]

00:24:50   for the desktop but I I can't say I'm [TS]

00:24:53   surprised by that either I mean what are [TS]

00:24:54   they really gonna do the imac there's [TS]

00:24:56   not really any new chips are there in [TS]

00:24:58   and outside of maybe a new fancy [TS]

00:25:00   keyboard wired or wireless or maybe I [TS]

00:25:02   guess you could put different ports on [TS]

00:25:04   you could put us PC ports on it but [TS]

00:25:07   that's not that remarkable to me so I'm [TS]

00:25:11   not surprised there's not a desktop [TS]

00:25:13   activity nobody really thought the mac [TS]

00:25:15   pro would be updated am i right i mean [TS]

00:25:16   come on [TS]

00:25:17   we talked about this last week with [TS]

00:25:18   Marco said the same thing like it if [TS]

00:25:19   we're going to do the imac at all just [TS]

00:25:21   USB seaports and we mentioned a another [TS]

00:25:24   fancy keyboard but well that's not [TS]

00:25:26   entirely true the I believe the cable [TS]

00:25:28   lake CPUs are available roughly for the [TS]

00:25:31   imac i'm not sure like if they're in [TS]

00:25:32   volume really yet but technically new [TS]

00:25:35   CPUs are basically available for the [TS]

00:25:37   imac now I know but none of us expected [TS]

00:25:39   the imac to come or i didnt pro or the [TS]

00:25:42   mac mini expected the imac really the [TS]

00:25:43   imac has been located the last two Falls [TS]

00:25:45   like it made sense like it is right on [TS]

00:25:48   schedule for damage me updated i'm [TS]

00:25:49   guessing it's it probably is not far off [TS]

00:25:52   like i mean i wouldn't expect it like [TS]

00:25:53   next week i'm guessing it's not going to [TS]

00:25:55   be like another year until the next time [TS]

00:25:57   a cup it's probably gonna be a few [TS]

00:25:58   months maybe I don't know how that [TS]

00:25:59   you're more optimistic than I am I like [TS]

00:26:02   i said in the last show I think they [TS]

00:26:03   should keep updating imac but i have dim [TS]

00:26:06   hopes that they will like it because i [TS]

00:26:08   mean it i don't understand the reason [TS]

00:26:11   behind the cadence of like doing imac [TS]

00:26:13   update so faithfully and then just [TS]

00:26:15   dropping it but i totally expected not [TS]

00:26:17   to have any desktop max of this thing at [TS]

00:26:19   all [TS]

00:26:19   well the thing is like you know with it [TS]

00:26:21   it doing an update when it's when it's a [TS]

00:26:23   fairly minor processor and motherboard [TS]

00:26:25   chipset update it is not that hard [TS]

00:26:28   doesn't take that much engineering work [TS]

00:26:30   for Apple you know not not anymore [TS]

00:26:31   engineer with any other updates is like [TS]

00:26:33   and and it used to be not that long ago [TS]

00:26:36   so that every time there was a new [TS]

00:26:39   chipset out for either the macbook the [TS]

00:26:41   macbook pro the macbook air or the imac [TS]

00:26:43   got updated like within a month of the [TS]

00:26:45   neutral coming out so it's only been in [TS]

00:26:48   these recent years with all the work has [TS]

00:26:50   been like Apple skipping generations and [TS]

00:26:52   Intel having weird delays [TS]

00:26:54   it's only been in those years that we [TS]

00:26:56   started having these things are apples [TS]

00:26:57   kind of like deciding whether they want [TS]

00:26:59   to bother updating things I mean it used [TS]

00:27:01   to just be assumed of course they would [TS]

00:27:02   update their main computers with the new [TS]

00:27:04   ships that came out and so the imac line [TS]

00:27:08   of chips has not had those problems that [TS]

00:27:10   all the mobile ones have had with intel [TS]

00:27:11   so the imax have actually been updated [TS]

00:27:13   on a regular basis until right now and [TS]

00:27:16   it's a little questionable why wasn't [TS]

00:27:18   there now and I guess the answer will [TS]

00:27:20   will not be parents until whenever it is [TS]

00:27:23   that next time we'll figure out like you [TS]

00:27:24   know why why did not get updated now I [TS]

00:27:26   guess but well i think i think i have an [TS]

00:27:28   answer though because if you look at [TS]

00:27:30   wikipedia which is clearly the source of [TS]

00:27:32   all human knowledge never incorrect the [TS]

00:27:34   kb lake wikipedia entry says that it [TS]

00:27:36   began shipping manufacturers no msn [TS]

00:27:38   second quarter this year mobile chips [TS]

00:27:40   have started shipping with more kb lake [TS]

00:27:42   desktop ships to be released in the [TS]

00:27:44   coming months or early next year [TS]

00:27:46   so what makes you think that they're [TS]

00:27:47   available for the imac right now I don't [TS]

00:27:49   want people on Twitter told me i could [TS]

00:27:51   be wrong if you want random people in [TS]

00:27:53   the chat room are pointing out that if [TS]

00:27:55   they are available it's almost certainly [TS]

00:27:56   not the ones with the fancy iris [TS]

00:27:57   graphics that Apple always likes fair [TS]

00:27:59   enough alright so that could be the [TS]

00:28:01   reason so that it could be as simple as [TS]

00:28:02   that [TS]

00:28:03   also I think it's worth pointing out [TS]

00:28:05   like we heard from a lot of people [TS]

00:28:06   because like you Intel officially quote [TS]

00:28:08   launched cable a good month or two ago [TS]

00:28:10   whatever it was and we immediately hurt [TS]

00:28:13   anybody and Twitter saying how can Apple [TS]

00:28:14   release skylake laptops now and not [TS]

00:28:17   cabling and of course the reason why is [TS]

00:28:19   because when intel announced the launch [TS]

00:28:20   it means nothing [TS]

00:28:21   I hit that it's like Intel's basically [TS]

00:28:23   saying these chips will be available [TS]

00:28:24   sometime maybe in the future and get the [TS]

00:28:27   actual time that you can ship computers [TS]

00:28:29   with the with the right ones for the [TS]

00:28:30   computers might be you know two to 12 [TS]

00:28:34   months away from that period anyway [TS]

00:28:37   maybe like I don't think it's a big deal [TS]

00:28:39   from everything that we've read about it [TS]

00:28:41   from we know about so far it seems like [TS]

00:28:43   it is not really something that you [TS]

00:28:45   should be like really waiting up for Sky [TS]

00:28:47   lake was a big deal keep you awake [TS]

00:28:49   really isn't i also have another [TS]

00:28:50   important update for you it's 29 1 21 [TS]

00:28:53   tech the good guys winning this is a [TS]

00:28:55   basketball game you're watching a lot of [TS]

00:28:57   scoring going on here [TS]

00:28:59   well you know football hits sometimes [TS]

00:29:00   there's it's a more offensive and [TS]

00:29:02   defensive game if you're voting for the [TS]

00:29:04   the Hoodoo user what are you doing [TS]

00:29:06   hokey but it's okay is it was like that [TS]

00:29:08   that that uh the ringer of an auburn [TS]

00:29:10   game they had where Oliver was up like [TS]

00:29:12   50-something sex that's only do that [TS]

00:29:15   when you see I guess right [TS]

00:29:18   ok so that no desktop is no imac updates [TS]

00:29:22   it's unclear whether or not k be like is [TS]

00:29:24   available tipster saying yes I'm seeing [TS]

00:29:27   know everything the matter if it's [TS]

00:29:28   available is this lead times the getting [TS]

00:29:30   into computers and apple recently has [TS]

00:29:32   not been that spry about like as soon as [TS]

00:29:34   the chips are ready we're going to be [TS]

00:29:35   ready to go [TS]

00:29:36   like that's kind of more of the old [TS]

00:29:37   apple and this new one is like don't [TS]

00:29:40   even wake me up until they're available [TS]

00:29:41   in volume and the next generation is [TS]

00:29:43   about to come out [TS]

00:29:44   yeah then maybe we'll incorporate them [TS]

00:29:46   into a computer of some kind when Apple [TS]

00:29:49   delays on things like and we know that [TS]

00:29:50   this is probably Intel delay here but [TS]

00:29:53   when Apple glaze on things [TS]

00:29:54   what I'm saying is we know we don't [TS]

00:29:56   really have to make excuses for Apple [TS]

00:29:58   anymore like that they're there they're [TS]

00:30:00   the biggest corporation the world's most [TS]

00:30:01   of the time they have tons of resources [TS]

00:30:03   that they can choose to devote to [TS]

00:30:05   updating the computers to new components [TS]

00:30:07   to come out for them it isn't that hard [TS]

00:30:09   it doesn't take a lot of time or money [TS]

00:30:10   relative to what they make from them and [TS]

00:30:12   what they have in the company so we [TS]

00:30:14   don't need to excuse them it is up to [TS]

00:30:16   them to update things and it is my [TS]

00:30:19   opinion they should not be slackers [TS]

00:30:21   about that or skip generations be simply [TS]

00:30:23   because they don't feel like it [TS]

00:30:24   fair enough so sadness about well maybe [TS]

00:30:27   not sadness about the imac I think we [TS]

00:30:29   can all agree that's reasonably expected [TS]

00:30:30   sadness but not surprised about the what [TS]

00:30:35   does that Little Mac called it doesn't [TS]

00:30:37   come with any devices attached to its [TS]

00:30:39   dot not going to display the metal roads [TS]

00:30:42   i got like a tiny man no no no circular [TS]

00:30:45   one not the circular one it's like more [TS]

00:30:47   of a rounded rect it's not magical back [TS]

00:30:49   row the apple TV here thinking back [TS]

00:30:51   shoot i can't remember the name of Max [TS]

00:30:53   small mac small maybe no it's much [TS]

00:30:55   smaller than that I'm [TS]

00:30:57   and I little color in the macair the [TS]

00:30:59   power power mac g4 cube [TS]

00:31:00   yes that's it oh is that it okay yeah so [TS]

00:31:03   no power mac g4 cube updates no trashcan [TS]

00:31:06   updates [TS]

00:31:07   thank God because on my I wouldn't even [TS]

00:31:09   pay attention to this show anymore just [TS]

00:31:11   be watching a football game [TS]

00:31:12   actually they should update the mac pro [TS]

00:31:14   isn't that what you're doing [TS]

00:31:15   oh speaking of the mac pro I'm i was i [TS]

00:31:19   was surprised at how many random angry [TS]

00:31:21   people there were on Twitter about there [TS]

00:31:23   being no macro update which shows that [TS]

00:31:25   this is weird sort of Venn diagram [TS]

00:31:27   between people who understand the mac [TS]

00:31:29   pro hasn't been updated in forever but [TS]

00:31:31   don't follow the stuff enough to know [TS]

00:31:33   that there was no way in hell no micro [TS]

00:31:35   is coming up in this thing so it's kind [TS]

00:31:37   of weird that the anger has spread [TS]

00:31:38   beyond the people who were actually [TS]

00:31:39   going to buy 12 just the general public [TS]

00:31:41   being embarrassed for apple for having [TS]

00:31:43   this quote-unquote pro computer that [TS]

00:31:45   pretty soon the watch will be faster [TS]

00:31:46   that well because you know even if [TS]

00:31:48   you're not about to buy a mac pro the [TS]

00:31:51   fact that they have this high-end that [TS]

00:31:53   the highest computer lineup that has [TS]

00:31:55   been so neglected high and air super air [TS]

00:31:58   quotes yeah well its timing if you do [TS]

00:32:01   parallel stuff it's still the fastest [TS]

00:32:02   its facets on no other benchmarks but on [TS]

00:32:04   that barely barely or you get like five [TS]

00:32:07   iPads yes I said probably not even that [TS]

00:32:10   night but the reason this matters is [TS]

00:32:13   what you argue John in your your [TS]

00:32:15   supercar halo car thing that like it [TS]

00:32:18   matters whether Apple is treating its [TS]

00:32:20   high-end well if you are a Mac user at [TS]

00:32:24   all because of Apple is neglecting [TS]

00:32:26   significant portions of its user base [TS]

00:32:28   for the mac lineup and you are a Mac [TS]

00:32:31   user or you are heavily invested in the [TS]

00:32:33   mac as a platform that should be a [TS]

00:32:35   warning sign for you that like that's [TS]

00:32:37   just off warning bells to say like wait [TS]

00:32:38   a minute maybe the health of my platform [TS]

00:32:40   or the future my platform is not as as [TS]

00:32:43   healthier guaranteed as I as I would [TS]

00:32:45   like because if they're neglecting this [TS]

00:32:47   whole big area of it maybe there are [TS]

00:32:50   worse things to come for me or maybe [TS]

00:32:52   they they are in putting resources into [TS]

00:32:53   it so it is totally relevant whether you [TS]

00:32:56   buy a mac pro or not how apple treats [TS]

00:32:58   their pro customers [TS]

00:33:00   yeah i'm just like they crossed over the [TS]

00:33:01   point now where where it is is moved [TS]

00:33:04   beyond and now is affecting the broader [TS]

00:33:07   base of people and it's kind of like as [TS]

00:33:09   if a [TS]

00:33:10   that they were still selling the [TS]

00:33:11   original dodge viper like the original [TS]

00:33:13   original dodge viper did not change in [TS]

00:33:15   any way and it would be like the great [TS]

00:33:17   hello car for dodge chrysler but [TS]

00:33:20   eventually it becomes an embarrassment [TS]

00:33:22   because the original Viper was a [TS]

00:33:23   terrible car so many ways and just can't [TS]

00:33:27   compete with today's super cars like the [TS]

00:33:28   it would be like 900 your your your halo [TS]

00:33:32   car for dodge can be beaten off the line [TS]

00:33:34   by like a volkswagen GTI now I mean it's [TS]

00:33:37   just be or even a lesser car i keep it [TS]

00:33:40   stops being a halo car when it loses in [TS]

00:33:43   single-threaded performance the two you [TS]

00:33:45   know run-of-the-mill computers so anyway [TS]

00:33:48   so no mac pro not surprising [TS]

00:33:50   no mac mini not surprising no imac [TS]

00:33:54   almost entirely not surprising that [TS]

00:33:57   leaves us with the portable max so the [TS]

00:34:01   macbook pro is I was talking about a few [TS]

00:34:04   minutes ago my proposal can really could [TS]

00:34:06   I aesthetically it's looking really good [TS]

00:34:09   i think what they've done is really cool [TS]

00:34:12   the touch bar looks great and let that [TS]

00:34:14   we can go through this line by line but [TS]

00:34:16   man if I it it's to the point that [TS]

00:34:20   between this external display which [TS]

00:34:22   actually we should talk about as well [TS]

00:34:23   that that I haven't worked the 4k [TS]

00:34:25   display at work and these new macbook [TS]

00:34:28   pros [TS]

00:34:29   I'm starting to doubt my newfound love [TS]

00:34:32   for my desktop imac existence because i [TS]

00:34:35   love this 5k imac i love it to death but [TS]

00:34:37   I just can't help but think to myself on [TS]

00:34:39   you know I could get one of these 4k or [TS]

00:34:41   maybe the fancy 5k LG Display I could [TS]

00:34:43   get one of these new macbook pros life [TS]

00:34:46   could be pretty good that way so I don't [TS]

00:34:49   know one of you guys is probably upset [TS]

00:34:50   about this so talking to talk me out of [TS]

00:34:52   spending money i don't have that on a [TS]

00:34:54   computer i don't need probably i'm [TS]

00:34:56   probably the most upset but Mr go first [TS]

00:34:58   to say what you like so I i will go back [TS]

00:35:01   to your earlier point which I will you [TS]

00:35:03   know I'd probably i'm talking about this [TS]

00:35:05   point yet but basically the touch bar [TS]

00:35:08   looks really cool i'm sure it's going to [TS]

00:35:10   be a really big deal for people when [TS]

00:35:12   they are working on their laptops and no [TS]

00:35:14   doubt that is a lot of people a lot of [TS]

00:35:15   the time however it is not on every [TS]

00:35:19   laptop apple sells a lot [TS]

00:35:22   of the macbook air class computers and [TS]

00:35:26   so for everyone who bought the macbook [TS]

00:35:27   adorable / macbook one or for everyone [TS]

00:35:30   who buys the the old or kind of still [TS]

00:35:33   for sale but old macbook air or the new [TS]

00:35:36   whatever we're going to call the low and [TS]

00:35:39   configuration of the macbook that was [TS]

00:35:40   named in the chat where that I liked a [TS]

00:35:42   lot so far are macbook escape or the [TS]

00:35:45   fbook madam a quick escape is part of my [TS]

00:35:49   favorite but the air pro was was an [TS]

00:35:53   efenburu were also very good but a [TS]

00:35:55   netbook escape is really good anyway so [TS]

00:35:57   all those people that's a lot of mac [TS]

00:36:00   buyers not to mention all the desktop [TS]

00:36:02   buyers and granted i know Latin from [TS]

00:36:04   apartment and desktop so i know the [TS]

00:36:05   desktop buyers don't count for as much [TS]

00:36:06   but all those people and the entire mac [TS]

00:36:11   user base that has a computer already [TS]

00:36:13   before today does not have a touch bar [TS]

00:36:16   and even if you are one of the people [TS]

00:36:19   who has one of the new MacBook Pros with [TS]

00:36:23   the touch bar that is only actually [TS]

00:36:25   accessible to you when you are using it [TS]

00:36:28   in its regular mode so not in clamshell [TS]

00:36:30   mode on a desk not like as a second [TS]

00:36:33   screen like with a main screen an [TS]

00:36:35   external keyboard and mouse like only [TS]

00:36:36   one using those particular models of [TS]

00:36:39   computer and only when you're using them [TS]

00:36:40   like right on them in in like normal [TS]

00:36:43   quote laptop mode that is when the touch [TS]

00:36:46   bar can be used it is going to be a [TS]

00:36:49   really great convenience for the people [TS]

00:36:51   who use it in that way but I don't think [TS]

00:36:54   it's going to radically take over the [TS]

00:36:56   the mac experience yet and become like a [TS]

00:36:59   must-have accessory until it is [TS]

00:37:01   available across the entire lineup [TS]

00:37:03   laptops and desktops in some form that [TS]

00:37:06   might become more interesting than you [TS]

00:37:08   know when you can kind of assume that [TS]

00:37:09   all modern max habit but you can assume [TS]

00:37:12   that today as either a user or developer [TS]

00:37:14   so I think it's gonna take a while [TS]

00:37:16   before that becomes a must-have thing it [TS]

00:37:19   will be convenient from day one and [TS]

00:37:20   surely you know apples apps having a [TS]

00:37:22   built-in is nice you know and and that's [TS]

00:37:25   like that's a lot of apps that people [TS]

00:37:27   use on the mac is our apples built-in [TS]

00:37:29   app so that's good but it's gonna take [TS]

00:37:31   awhile i really like when the first [TS]

00:37:33   retina macbooks came out in 2012 [TS]

00:37:35   it took a long time for most of what you [TS]

00:37:39   saw on screen to be retina it took a [TS]

00:37:41   couple years at least four apps and [TS]

00:37:43   websites and everything to update for [TS]

00:37:45   the tux bars and take a while before you [TS]

00:37:48   can really get into using it with many [TS]

00:37:49   of your apps and everything so i would [TS]

00:37:51   say for UK see you looking at these [TS]

00:37:53   today and feeling bad you don't have one [TS]

00:37:55   it's the kind of thing where if you're [TS]

00:37:56   buying a new laptop if you were if you [TS]

00:37:59   were buying one anyway then I think you [TS]

00:38:01   should consider the touch bar as an [TS]

00:38:04   important thing to have you know [TS]

00:38:06   probably and all this should be preface [TS]

00:38:08   by saying that none of the three of us [TS]

00:38:10   were at the event [TS]

00:38:11   none of the three of us have review [TS]

00:38:12   units so none of the three of us have [TS]

00:38:15   ever touched these or handle these or [TS]

00:38:16   seniors in real life so all this could [TS]

00:38:19   be out the window the first time that [TS]

00:38:20   the world can get more experience with [TS]

00:38:22   these and we know more about them and [TS]

00:38:24   how they work in reality but i would say [TS]

00:38:26   probably that if you're buying today or [TS]

00:38:29   if you recently bought something you [TS]

00:38:30   don't want to buy another thing you [TS]

00:38:32   don't really have to feel bad yet that [TS]

00:38:34   you don't have this touch bar because [TS]

00:38:35   it's gonna be awhile before apps can [TS]

00:38:38   assume that a lot of people have it and [TS]

00:38:39   it's gonna be awhile before i have to [TS]

00:38:40   take advantage of it and we still don't [TS]

00:38:42   know how much of a must-have thing it [TS]

00:38:46   will be in practice until the things [TS]

00:38:47   wrapped for a while and we can kind of [TS]

00:38:49   look more objectively after its kind [TS]

00:38:50   after the cool has kind of rubbed off [TS]

00:38:51   and weave and we will use them ourselves [TS]

00:38:53   we know people who use them [TS]

00:38:55   you've gotten like some long-term [TS]

00:38:56   opinions from ourselves or others about [TS]

00:38:58   like how useful is actually in practice [TS]

00:39:00   so for now you don't need to feel that [TS]

00:39:02   you should feel bad [TS]

00:39:04   not because you don't touch bar but [TS]

00:39:06   because you don't have a macbook pro [TS]

00:39:09   with like modern internals its way [TS]

00:39:11   faster than one you have now that bad [TS]

00:39:13   feeling that bad feeling remains so [TS]

00:39:15   question for both of you and I'll start [TS]

00:39:18   with Marco do you think that a keyboard [TS]

00:39:21   with a touch bar will ever exist for a [TS]

00:39:25   desktop mac or do you think it will [TS]

00:39:27   always always always be four laptops and [TS]

00:39:31   if yes if you think it will one day [TS]

00:39:33   exist for desktop Mac would apple just [TS]

00:39:36   completely yo go bananas and make it [TS]

00:39:39   wired only or do you think you would be [TS]

00:39:40   just basically a revision of the smart [TS]

00:39:42   keyboard as it is today [TS]

00:39:44   I honestly don't know I I'm leaning [TS]

00:39:47   towards no [TS]

00:39:49   and no one's gonna like the reason why [TS]

00:39:51   but i'm leaning towards no and y know it [TS]

00:39:53   I know the reason you probably do we all [TS]

00:39:56   know the reason I'm leaning towards no [TS]

00:39:58   because I you know a guy I think putting [TS]

00:40:02   the touch bar as it exists today into [TS]

00:40:04   something the size and price of the [TS]

00:40:07   magic keyboard i think will be very [TS]

00:40:09   challenging and if there's probably a [TS]

00:40:11   lot of constraints there many of which [TS]

00:40:13   are self-imposed by Apple but I [TS]

00:40:15   basically don't like I don't see them [TS]

00:40:17   want to make their keyboard bigger I [TS]

00:40:20   don't see the market having much [TS]

00:40:21   tolerance for them making their keyboard [TS]

00:40:23   more expensive is already pretty [TS]

00:40:24   expensive and i don't really see them [TS]

00:40:26   you know wanting to have multiple models [TS]

00:40:29   of keyboard that they sell I mean they [TS]

00:40:30   can barely self-referrals at all anymore [TS]

00:40:32   so you know I don't see that happening [TS]

00:40:34   but ultimately the biggest reason why I [TS]

00:40:37   don't honestly see this happening even [TS]

00:40:39   if they get over the technical stuff [TS]

00:40:41   here comes is that I just don't think [TS]

00:40:43   Apple gives a damn about desktops [TS]

00:40:45   anymore and that's not to say that [TS]

00:40:46   they're never gonna make one again but i [TS]

00:40:48   but I just think the focus [TS]

00:40:50   I mean look you can barely get Tim Cook [TS]

00:40:53   to pretend to care about the mac at all [TS]

00:40:56   allmax you know there's a reason why Tim [TS]

00:40:59   didn't say a lot today about the mac you [TS]

00:41:01   know that was delegated to fill in Craig [TS]

00:41:04   because they I'm pretty sure care deeply [TS]

00:41:06   about the mac like they seem like [TS]

00:41:08   they're really like mac champions inside [TS]

00:41:10   the company at a very high level but Tim [TS]

00:41:13   I don't think is I don't think Tim cares [TS]

00:41:15   I don't think he even hide that very [TS]

00:41:17   well I don't think he even honestly [TS]

00:41:19   tries I don't think Tim cares and so as [TS]

00:41:23   long as the company is led by Tim I [TS]

00:41:26   don't see the max making substantial [TS]

00:41:28   advances and what I see instead is what [TS]

00:41:33   we what we see today which is they're [TS]

00:41:36   going to keep doing what we know what [TS]

00:41:37   they what they can do to move things [TS]

00:41:40   along [TS]

00:41:41   occasionally to be thinner lighter [TS]

00:41:43   better faster right that's what they do [TS]

00:41:45   but i don't see a time under tim cook's [TS]

00:41:48   rule which is probably going to be long [TS]

00:41:51   i don't see a time of this happening [TS]

00:41:54   here where team is going to decide that [TS]

00:41:58   the mac really needs a lot of effort put [TS]

00:42:00   into it and it needs like [TS]

00:42:02   no major resources and major [TS]

00:42:03   prioritization I just don't see that [TS]

00:42:05   happening so I don't think they're going [TS]

00:42:08   to put in like the lots of work that it [TS]

00:42:12   would take and possible profit [TS]

00:42:13   cannibalization of other products to [TS]

00:42:16   meaningfully enable this on desktops I [TS]

00:42:19   just don't see it happening [TS]

00:42:21   I wish it would but I just don't let's [TS]

00:42:24   assume for just one moment that you're [TS]

00:42:26   right that Tim either doesn't care about [TS]

00:42:29   the mac or let's even go so far as to [TS]

00:42:31   say he freaking hates the mac i'm not [TS]

00:42:33   saying he hated what I'm what I'm saying [TS]

00:42:35   is I just [TS]

00:42:36   he's obviously not a mac person he died [TS]

00:42:39   i'm pretty sure he has said on the [TS]

00:42:41   record multiple times that he does his [TS]

00:42:42   work on ipads anyway so I i basically I [TS]

00:42:45   don't think he uses macs very often if [TS]

00:42:46   at all and and I think he he is very [TS]

00:42:49   much profit focused and and he looks at [TS]

00:42:52   where Apple can make the most profit and [TS]

00:42:54   divert resources there and things that [TS]

00:42:56   that make still good profit but just [TS]

00:42:59   less are you know kind of out of his his [TS]

00:43:02   field of vision i think most of the time [TS]

00:43:04   so basically I just don't think Tim [TS]

00:43:06   gives a lot of thought to the mac and i [TS]

00:43:08   don't think it's a priority for him [TS]

00:43:10   alright so let's assume that's true and [TS]

00:43:11   you know it in any degree of of [TS]

00:43:14   aggressiveness he hates the mac or maybe [TS]

00:43:16   just doesn't really care [TS]

00:43:17   maybe it's just another line item like [TS]

00:43:18   you said let's assume any one of those [TS]

00:43:20   is true he's a pretty smart man from [TS]

00:43:24   everything we can tell [TS]

00:43:25   don't you think he would trust in in his [TS]

00:43:29   lieutenants and those who do care for [TS]

00:43:31   the mac to carry it forward like I I [TS]

00:43:33   don't you tim is the things standing in [TS]

00:43:36   the way of the mac being this perfect [TS]

00:43:39   device that you're that you're that [TS]

00:43:40   you're excited to buy a new one every [TS]

00:43:42   six months or what have you [TS]

00:43:44   i I really don't think times the problem [TS]

00:43:46   here I think it's just that Apple is [TS]

00:43:48   doing what they think is best and like I [TS]

00:43:51   think you had said Mark I mean laptops [TS]

00:43:53   are where are the maximum everyone buys [TS]

00:43:56   we're weird buying desktops and super [TS]

00:43:59   weird for you to buying cheese graters [TS]

00:44:01   and trash cans so I don't think to him [TS]

00:44:04   is the problem i think it's just that [TS]

00:44:06   this is where the users are so why not [TS]

00:44:08   cater to the ninety percent well isn't [TS]

00:44:11   debatable others even a problem maybe [TS]

00:44:13   job at the CEO is to be forward-looking [TS]

00:44:15   like what is this a product line isn't [TS]

00:44:16   an ascension are in decline and clearly [TS]

00:44:18   desktop PCs laptop PCs and that whole [TS]

00:44:21   market are in decline compared to [TS]

00:44:23   smartphones and possibly even tablets [TS]

00:44:25   and so he's trying to be forward-looking [TS]

00:44:26   but not for Apple that's the thing [TS]

00:44:28   they're not in decline for Apple there [TS]

00:44:30   in decline for everyone else but until [TS]

00:44:32   Apple stopped dating for three years [TS]

00:44:34   they were in decline for apple like [TS]

00:44:36   Apple has this entire market that could [TS]

00:44:37   keep taking share from it's a big market [TS]

00:44:39   it was declined relative to the rest of [TS]

00:44:41   their business for the rest of the [TS]

00:44:42   business was growing much faster at this [TS]

00:44:44   point service revenue is more than mac [TS]

00:44:45   revenue right based service revenue was [TS]

00:44:47   growing guess what just passed Mac [TS]

00:44:48   revenue right so if you are looking [TS]

00:44:50   where the next big you know where is the [TS]

00:44:53   next big product that's going to go on a [TS]

00:44:55   big growth trajectory gonna come from [TS]

00:44:56   it's not the pc is not the mac that's [TS]

00:44:59   what Apple currently thinks and so again [TS]

00:45:01   it's debatable whether the long-term [TS]

00:45:03   this is a name correct choice i think [TS]

00:45:04   that were in the painful period now [TS]

00:45:06   where it's like well look at you gonna [TS]

00:45:07   do max you're not going to maximum [TS]

00:45:08   apples like oh no we're gonna do max but [TS]

00:45:11   they're doing them not with the gust 0 [TS]

00:45:13   meaning not with the investment that [TS]

00:45:15   they used to do them and to get back to [TS]

00:45:17   casey's question now you know do I think [TS]

00:45:19   they're gonna do a keyboard with a with [TS]

00:45:22   a touch bar on it the Apple that was [TS]

00:45:26   still investing heavily in the mac where [TS]

00:45:28   the mac was like super important and [TS]

00:45:30   central even even as the iphone was [TS]

00:45:32   growing and the ipod and other [TS]

00:45:34   businesses were obviously where the big [TS]

00:45:36   growth was back oh you know not too many [TS]

00:45:38   years ago Apple was still heavily [TS]

00:45:40   investing in the mac because those [TS]

00:45:42   growing one start off small and the ipod [TS]

00:45:44   one did a hump and went back down right [TS]

00:45:47   and so was like well the mac you know we [TS]

00:45:49   got to keep investing the mac is the [TS]

00:45:50   ipod looks great and it's big business [TS]

00:45:51   for us but actually we can see it's on [TS]

00:45:53   the way back down all the iphones [TS]

00:45:55   looking great and it's on its way back [TS]

00:45:56   up but if you look at those line graphs [TS]

00:45:58   the mac was still in the mix certain [TS]

00:46:00   point the phone just took off and now [TS]

00:46:03   every single graph is like here's the [TS]

00:46:05   iphone company and then there's some [TS]

00:46:07   lines down there hit near the final axis [TS]

00:46:10   and those lines like service revenue [TS]

00:46:12   mcintosh like he just crap like that and [TS]

00:46:15   once that happens like it's hard to it's [TS]

00:46:18   hard to justify like is it the right [TS]

00:46:19   thing for the for the CEO to do to [TS]

00:46:21   continue to invest that much [TS]

00:46:23   proportionally in the mac is used to and [TS]

00:46:25   it's clear that they're not right and so [TS]

00:46:27   the old Apple [TS]

00:46:28   I'm saying like good old days but the [TS]

00:46:29   old apple with the old Apple mix of [TS]

00:46:31   products in revenue and profits right [TS]

00:46:33   that apple would have had touch bar [TS]

00:46:36   keyboards in this presentation today [TS]

00:46:38   like guaranteed because like Marco said [TS]

00:46:40   what the hell's the point of this thing [TS]

00:46:42   even people who have laptops when they [TS]

00:46:44   set them at their desk you know you're [TS]

00:46:46   not like laptops are bad organically to [TS]

00:46:49   sit in front of all day the keyboard not [TS]

00:46:50   be touching the display like it's like [TS]

00:46:52   that because it's a portable device and [TS]

00:46:53   you you know when using portable that's [TS]

00:46:55   what you got to go with but if you're [TS]

00:46:56   sitting in a desk your laptop is off the [TS]

00:46:58   side you have a second monitor your [TS]

00:46:59   laptop is up on a stand but then you [TS]

00:47:01   can't use that keyboard using a big [TS]

00:47:02   keyboard like the touch bar can't be [TS]

00:47:05   part of the quote-unquote Mac experience [TS]

00:47:07   at the only place that exists is on [TS]

00:47:08   keyboard attached to a laptop period so [TS]

00:47:10   the old Apple would have had it is the [TS]

00:47:11   old Apple was investing in the mac much [TS]

00:47:13   more for comprehensible reasons not like [TS]

00:47:16   out of spite or meanness or whatever now [TS]

00:47:18   if you would have this discussion with [TS]

00:47:20   tim cook and and try to convince him [TS]

00:47:22   that it is important to continue to [TS]

00:47:24   invest in the Mac you can't say it's [TS]

00:47:25   because the mac is going to be [TS]

00:47:27   proportionately larger percentage of [TS]

00:47:29   apples profit and revenue in the future [TS]

00:47:30   because probably isn't but you could [TS]

00:47:32   make the argument that even though look [TS]

00:47:33   small and the argument I think we may [TS]

00:47:35   even though it looks small and it's it's [TS]

00:47:37   not going to come out of nowhere and [TS]

00:47:39   become a big thing it is as many people [TS]

00:47:41   who pointed on Twitter and said it was [TS]

00:47:42   very smelly for whatever the foundation [TS]

00:47:45   of so many other things apple does [TS]

00:47:46   you've got the halo car factor for [TS]

00:47:48   having like the you know highest [TS]

00:47:49   performance computing device you've got [TS]

00:47:51   the fact that the development for all [TS]

00:47:52   you do for the platform that's important [TS]

00:47:54   most important your company's done on [TS]

00:47:55   max right you've got the historical a [TS]

00:47:59   loyalty and fan base you've got the [TS]

00:48:01   Alpha geeks creatives type angle which [TS]

00:48:03   we can talk about when we talk about the [TS]

00:48:05   microsoft studio there are lots of [TS]

00:48:06   reasons not having to do with how much [TS]

00:48:09   they sell how much their profit is that [TS]

00:48:10   the mac is really important and I could [TS]

00:48:12   make that argument pretty strongly tim [TS]

00:48:14   cook and I bet people are trying to make [TS]

00:48:16   that argument but that argument relies [TS]

00:48:17   on a lot of assumptions are you have to [TS]

00:48:19   be convinced that if this in this in [TS]

00:48:21   this therefore this you can't back it up [TS]

00:48:23   by saying look I don't even need to [TS]

00:48:24   convince you of like human psychology or [TS]

00:48:27   customer loyalty or other things like [TS]

00:48:29   that i can show you that the lines on [TS]

00:48:31   the graph with dollar sign attached to [TS]

00:48:33   them and you can because you have to go [TS]

00:48:34   to it more touchy-feely argument to [TS]

00:48:36   convey [TS]

00:48:36   it's tim cook to invest more in the [TS]

00:48:38   maximum they are currently investing and [TS]

00:48:39   I'm hope i'm hoping the people who are [TS]

00:48:41   making that argument inside Apple are [TS]

00:48:44   winning and that what we're just seeing [TS]

00:48:46   here is you know what a course [TS]

00:48:48   correction that they haven't quite [TS]

00:48:50   corrected all the way and tumble the [TS]

00:48:52   Intel delays mess things up and they'll [TS]

00:48:53   be restarted in the next year when they [TS]

00:48:55   have inevitably reduce reduce this guy [TS]

00:48:57   like mac pros someday maybe possibly is [TS]

00:49:00   inevitable [TS]

00:49:01   well I don't know I liked her cry [TS]

00:49:03   backtrack from inevitable saying the [TS]

00:49:05   potential potential mac pro that we [TS]

00:49:08   might you know if they could still turn [TS]

00:49:09   this around and sort of get back on an [TS]

00:49:11   even keel but the the lack of a touch [TS]

00:49:14   bar external keyboard is a perfect [TS]

00:49:16   example of how Apple is just not an [TS]

00:49:19   investing as much in the mac as they [TS]

00:49:21   used to and it's i think it is an [TS]

00:49:24   argument to be had whether that is smart [TS]

00:49:26   or not smart but as fans of Max as all [TS]

00:49:29   of us on this podcast our friends at max [TS]

00:49:30   it is painful to see the product that [TS]

00:49:32   used to be so important to the company [TS]

00:49:35   being so much less important now I I [TS]

00:49:39   don't know if I would go that far at all [TS]

00:49:41   just because they're not updating [TS]

00:49:44   desktop max with the speed or efficacy [TS]

00:49:46   that you to approve of doesn't mean they [TS]

00:49:48   don't care about the mac or any [TS]

00:49:50   Maccabees the laptops aren't updated [TS]

00:49:51   forever either [TS]

00:49:53   well yeah but i think a lot of that was [TS]

00:49:56   obviously none of us know but if I would [TS]

00:49:58   wager gas that was relying on Intel to [TS]

00:50:02   give them a decent reason to make an [TS]

00:50:04   update or perhaps let's assume that [TS]

00:50:06   wasn't the issue [TS]

00:50:07   maybe they were just trying to get this [TS]

00:50:09   pretty darn fancy touch bar tack and the [TS]

00:50:12   fancy touch ID tech which apparently is [TS]

00:50:16   basically a mini apple watch within the [TS]

00:50:18   device it within the macbook pro that [TS]

00:50:21   can't have been easy so I I don't think [TS]

00:50:25   it's fair to characterize Apple as [TS]

00:50:26   caring as not caring about the mac or [TS]

00:50:29   caring that much less about them is it's [TS]

00:50:32   not about carrying it its investment [TS]

00:50:34   it's not care like don't is not [TS]

00:50:36   personify the company's and it's like [TS]

00:50:37   how much money and resources you put [TS]

00:50:39   into this investment is not it's not [TS]

00:50:41   like we did that max feelings are hurt [TS]

00:50:43   or whatever it's a choice about resource [TS]

00:50:44   allocation right and that's the that's [TS]

00:50:46   the argument view your design and I and [TS]

00:50:49   I feel like the perfect examples like [TS]

00:50:50   even if we buy everything you're saying [TS]

00:50:51   about the touch bar and and being [TS]

00:50:53   difficult or whatever it's apparently [TS]

00:50:55   ready to announce now they could have [TS]

00:50:56   announced keyboards right alongside it [TS]

00:50:58   but you know if they felt that was [TS]

00:51:00   important part of the mac experience and [TS]

00:51:01   I have done speaking in such bar onto [TS]

00:51:03   the next topic on the move to is [TS]

00:51:04   specifically about touch part but we can [TS]

00:51:06   get done gnashing of teeth over the mac [TS]

00:51:08   investment [TS]

00:51:09   well but that's the thing is I really [TS]

00:51:11   don't i mean i guess there's no way that [TS]

00:51:13   I'm going to convince you that you're [TS]

00:51:15   wrong and there's certainly no way [TS]

00:51:16   you're going to convince me that I'm [TS]

00:51:17   wrong but I just for the record there is [TS]

00:51:19   one of the three of us thinks that there [TS]

00:51:21   are investments happening to the max I [TS]

00:51:23   am I am as as it sits right now I feel [TS]

00:51:26   like I'm or desktop Mac guide then then [TS]

00:51:28   I'm than a portable mac guy but I am [TS]

00:51:31   really excited about the macbook pros [TS]

00:51:33   and that is what most mac users use [TS]

00:51:36   almost everyone uses Matt a macbook pros [TS]

00:51:39   or perhaps the airs which at this point [TS]

00:51:42   is near as makes no difference to the [TS]

00:51:43   President Pro is effectively an air [TS]

00:51:45   I don't think it's fair to characterize [TS]

00:51:47   this is a lack of investment i don't [TS]

00:51:49   think it's fair of the three of us to [TS]

00:51:50   say Oh putting a mini apple watch next [TS]

00:51:53   to a mini retina display honest on a box [TS]

00:51:56   that's physically smaller that has [TS]

00:51:58   better battery life that is quicker like [TS]

00:52:01   these are all worthwhile investment and [TS]

00:52:04   and I don't think it's fair that a bunch [TS]

00:52:06   of nerds are getting butthurt about the [TS]

00:52:07   fact that this isn't the thing that they [TS]

00:52:09   wanted Apple to investment no that's not [TS]

00:52:11   what this is about it all like even if [TS]

00:52:13   we ignore all like what we think apples [TS]

00:52:15   philosophy is and how they choose to [TS]

00:52:16   investigate we don't know where their [TS]

00:52:17   money goes because we don't have the [TS]

00:52:18   level of granularity ignore all that and [TS]

00:52:20   just treat apples a black box and look [TS]

00:52:22   at the products they release in when [TS]

00:52:24   they release them the release cadence of [TS]

00:52:26   max has changed [TS]

00:52:28   they released them less often which [TS]

00:52:30   means that the existing ones that you [TS]

00:52:32   can buy our worst relative to other [TS]

00:52:33   things and they also keep selling old [TS]

00:52:35   ones for much longer [TS]

00:52:36   that is inarguably affect you could say [TS]

00:52:39   that's not because they're not investing [TS]

00:52:40   as much in fact they're investing even [TS]

00:52:42   more but that dictates that they have to [TS]

00:52:44   have bigger gaps being products that is [TS]

00:52:45   probably the only argument you can make [TS]

00:52:47   this like oh it actually costs so much [TS]

00:52:48   more money to do the touch bar than the [TS]

00:52:50   other [TS]

00:52:50   didn't max but don't worry about it like [TS]

00:52:52   that the macbook pros they were out [TS]

00:52:53   there on the market were behind the [TS]

00:52:56   15-inch macbook pro was an embarrassing [TS]

00:52:58   product to sell is like this used to be [TS]

00:52:59   the best like that in the presentation [TS]

00:53:01   like the best macbook pro and how we [TS]

00:53:02   made it even better be able to do that [TS]

00:53:04   pitch because when they replace them the [TS]

00:53:05   old one is still pretty good [TS]

00:53:06   you almost piece of crap what the hell [TS]

00:53:08   was it out ivy bridge or as well [TS]

00:53:10   whatever the how it had when it has like [TS]

00:53:11   well like it's ridiculous [TS]

00:53:13   like that's not and that's we can't we [TS]

00:53:16   can argue about what the cause of that [TS]

00:53:17   was but on the outside we can see that's [TS]

00:53:19   the case that 15-inch macbook pro was [TS]

00:53:21   not a pro product was not the worst the [TS]

00:53:23   price their body part wasn't mac pro [TS]

00:53:24   levels of bed but it was bad and this is [TS]

00:53:26   their flagship product and so of course [TS]

00:53:27   when they make a new one it's thinner [TS]

00:53:29   faster better like yeah that's great [TS]

00:53:31   it's better faster better we totally [TS]

00:53:32   agree with all that of course when they [TS]

00:53:34   compared to the old models just like [TS]

00:53:35   i'll come on you know how much faster is [TS]

00:53:37   in our macro you know why is your [TS]

00:53:38   macbook pro sucked [TS]

00:53:40   that's why he's so much better like a [TS]

00:53:41   port like we know like and again I'm i [TS]

00:53:45   know it sounds negative i'm gonna get [TS]

00:53:46   even more negative and a little bit [TS]

00:53:48   these are good these are good genes [TS]

00:53:50   right but I'm arguments cases on trying [TS]

00:53:53   to convince you that regardless of what [TS]

00:53:55   we think about these machines which I [TS]

00:53:56   think they're pretty darn good and we'll [TS]

00:53:57   talk about that eventually I promise [TS]

00:53:59   oh shit i don't think you can say that [TS]

00:54:04   Apple is putting the same amount of [TS]

00:54:06   resources into the mac as they used to [TS]

00:54:08   because the proof is in the products [TS]

00:54:10   that they release and when they release [TS]

00:54:11   them and we can argue about what the [TS]

00:54:12   causes are and stuff like that but i [TS]

00:54:14   don't think there's an argument to be [TS]

00:54:15   had that they're doing the same as they [TS]

00:54:16   used to [TS]

00:54:17   it's not fair to say that they're [TS]

00:54:20   putting the same amount of investment as [TS]

00:54:22   they used to i concur but I what I'm [TS]

00:54:25   hearing which maybe is a [TS]

00:54:27   misinterpretation my part of what I'm [TS]

00:54:28   hearing is all they're ignoring the mac [TS]

00:54:30   there the the mac is on life-support [TS]

00:54:32   nobody cares about the mac timko Kate's [TS]

00:54:33   the mac like I don't say i don't see ya [TS]

00:54:36   you said all those things not true i [TS]

00:54:40   mean i-i just it i don't i feel like [TS]

00:54:42   you're crapping all over that you [TS]

00:54:44   collective you and not just you 2i mean [TS]

00:54:46   I saw a lot of just grumbling going on [TS]

00:54:50   today on Twitter like I feel like [TS]

00:54:51   everyone's just getting grumpy about [TS]

00:54:53   touchdown tech everyone's getting around [TS]

00:54:56   here and Iraq and then our behalf I'm [TS]

00:54:58   back I'm back we're going to going to [TS]

00:55:00   you like right correct about tootie's [TS]

00:55:03   here [TS]

00:55:03   that's it that's exactly right yeah [TS]

00:55:06   there is so everyone's getting so upset [TS]

00:55:08   about all they're not investing enough [TS]

00:55:10   in the mac and I just personally I don't [TS]

00:55:13   see it that way at all [TS]

00:55:14   I agree John that that certainly there [TS]

00:55:16   was a dark period I perhaps I shouldn't [TS]

00:55:19   be sweeping the dark period under the [TS]

00:55:20   rug as quickly as emphatically as is as [TS]

00:55:23   i am right now but this is a to me this [TS]

00:55:27   is a clear sign that the mac matters and [TS]

00:55:30   I mean this is got to have been like [TS]

00:55:32   this touch bar which I really need to [TS]

00:55:33   shut up so we can get this we can move [TS]

00:55:35   on to that the touch bars got to be an [TS]

00:55:37   unbelievably cool piece of technology [TS]

00:55:38   and then turned in touch ID as well it [TS]

00:55:41   that's got to have been hard to create [TS]

00:55:43   in and again touch ID apparently is [TS]

00:55:45   being controlled by a mini watch OS and [TS]

00:55:48   I can't imagine getting an ARM chip in [TS]

00:55:50   the way that's controlling the touch ID [TS]

00:55:53   to cooperate and behave nicely with the [TS]

00:55:55   intel chip that's controlling the rest [TS]

00:55:57   of the mac that can't have been terribly [TS]

00:55:59   easy that must have been difficult to do [TS]

00:56:03   can they not have a little bit of time [TS]

00:56:05   to do that they can have a just-released [TS]

00:56:07   other max in between yes and here's the [TS]

00:56:09   thing by the way Casey like it's worth [TS]

00:56:12   pointing out here that there's this kind [TS]

00:56:13   of distortion here that I see a lot in [TS]

00:56:15   corporate culture especially into in 10 [TS]

00:56:18   cooks apple that it is indeed a lot of [TS]

00:56:21   work what they did the team worked [TS]

00:56:24   really hard on this they did and they [TS]

00:56:26   should be commended in some kind of [TS]

00:56:28   price ceremony for how hard they were [TS]

00:56:30   contacting a level that's very [TS]

00:56:31   impressive [TS]

00:56:31   however that doesn't either a absolved [TS]

00:56:35   them of the the rest of the neglect of [TS]

00:56:37   the mac line and the land they left of [TS]

00:56:39   this line the meantime like that was [TS]

00:56:40   clearly bad management of the lineup and [TS]

00:56:43   end of the whatever the supply chain [TS]

00:56:44   whatever led to these long span for [TS]

00:56:47   these things have been updated and [TS]

00:56:48   whatever into the mac pro a mac mini and [TS]

00:56:51   imac still not being updated so it [TS]

00:56:54   doesn't it doesn't solve that and also [TS]

00:56:57   you don't get automatic reward just for [TS]

00:57:00   trying something difficult just for [TS]

00:57:01   trying something complicated knew it [TS]

00:57:04   might well be that the touch bar might [TS]

00:57:06   end up being awesome it we might look [TS]

00:57:08   back on this time and save men it we [TS]

00:57:10   can't believe we ever live without this [TS]

00:57:12   this was such a revolution but first we [TS]

00:57:14   don't know that yet it might it might [TS]

00:57:16   not [TS]

00:57:16   and that doesn't absolve them of the [TS]

00:57:19   other problems like you know there are [TS]

00:57:21   some downsides to visit to these new [TS]

00:57:22   releases which we get to but one of the [TS]

00:57:23   biggest ones that people are upset about [TS]

00:57:24   is that these costs a lot more than they [TS]

00:57:26   used to and that's not insignificant and [TS]

00:57:29   you know and things were taken away so [TS]

00:57:31   you know it certainly like there's going [TS]

00:57:34   to be people who are upset because in [TS]

00:57:36   certain ways they got worse for them and [TS]

00:57:39   it doesn't matter like if you if you are [TS]

00:57:41   buying these things if you were buying [TS]

00:57:43   like macbook airs in bulk and you had to [TS]

00:57:45   have been hit a certain price point and [TS]

00:57:47   now you can't do that anymore [TS]

00:57:49   I then the back is still selling them [TS]

00:57:51   well but yeah basically like everyone [TS]

00:57:55   has it whenever Apple releases something [TS]

00:57:58   new that these days especially but yeah [TS]

00:58:00   this is not that new [TS]

00:58:01   there's always pluses and minuses fix it [TS]

00:58:04   there's like you know you you move [TS]

00:58:06   mostly steps forward but usually a [TS]

00:58:08   couple steps back or sideways and in [TS]

00:58:10   this release [TS]

00:58:11   there is a lot of cool new stuff they [TS]

00:58:13   did get seemingly really impressively [TS]

00:58:16   thin-and-light they it seems I the [TS]

00:58:20   battery still ? but if that they [TS]

00:58:22   reported specs are still reasonable so i [TS]

00:58:24   assume the better life won't be terrible [TS]

00:58:26   actually pretty good [TS]

00:58:27   so if they're able to achieve this thin [TS]

00:58:30   lightness with those battery games then [TS]

00:58:32   that's great so that like that's great [TS]

00:58:34   improvement right [TS]

00:58:35   the touch bar is mostly great it is [TS]

00:58:38   probably going to be bad to lose escape [TS]

00:58:40   keys for a lot of people i think the the [TS]

00:58:42   idea that only nerds use the escape key [TS]

00:58:45   i think is wrong i have lots of people [TS]

00:58:47   it's not like we get there we'll get [TS]

00:58:49   there and I think also a lot of people [TS]

00:58:52   were simply asking Apple can you please [TS]

00:58:54   put modern guts inside your laptops and [TS]

00:58:56   make them no faster and everything and [TS]

00:58:58   apple delivered this thing that they [TS]

00:59:01   weren't asking for and then raise the [TS]

00:59:02   prices even if you are impressed by the [TS]

00:59:06   touch bar and I think for the most part [TS]

00:59:08   it probably will end up being a good [TS]

00:59:09   thing the reason why so many people are [TS]

00:59:12   mad like people have good reasons to be [TS]

00:59:14   upset with this update because not every [TS]

00:59:17   product that that needs an update got [TS]

00:59:19   one and the update to these products [TS]

00:59:22   that did get updated came with [TS]

00:59:24   additional costs and and a couple of the [TS]

00:59:26   downsides [TS]

00:59:27   like what if you actually use [TS]

00:59:29   the SD card slot for the hdmi port or [TS]

00:59:32   things like there are a lot of things [TS]

00:59:33   removed too so you have ports that [TS]

00:59:36   removed you have a higher price and you [TS]

00:59:40   you lost some keys that you might prefer [TS]

00:59:41   to be hardware so basically even though [TS]

00:59:45   it made advances that doesn't make it [TS]

00:59:47   invalid or unreasonable for people to [TS]

00:59:49   complain about the ways in which it got [TS]

00:59:51   worse for them [TS]

00:59:52   no it doesn't but I feel like what I'm [TS]

00:59:56   hearing in its not just from you guys [TS]

00:59:58   but you're the only two on the [TS]

00:59:58   but you're the only two on the [TS]

01:00:00   phone and so that's why I'm you know [TS]

01:00:03   busting your butt so hard is what I [TS]

01:00:05   don't feel like I'm hearing is well what [TS]

01:00:06   we really wanted was a new processor [TS]

01:00:10   maybe more ram maybe more hard drive [TS]

01:00:11   space and then don't touch anything else [TS]

01:00:15   for the love no no I mean I don't think [TS]

01:00:18   anyone's like I think Marco but what [TS]

01:00:21   talk around before but basically i said [TS]

01:00:24   last week if you're going to if you can [TS]

01:00:26   have this line of products and I think [TS]

01:00:27   who is it about the web page listed all [TS]

01:00:30   of the scene Hackett the listed all of [TS]

01:00:33   the the laptop sort of in in order of [TS]

01:00:36   the lines but you're going to have all [TS]

01:00:37   these that laptops from like under a [TS]

01:00:39   thousand all the way up to like big [TS]

01:00:40   bucks for the big one right and they do [TS]

01:00:42   have a pretty good spread of prices [TS]

01:00:43   right if you decide you're going to do [TS]

01:00:45   that you're going to sell one of them [TS]

01:00:46   one on retina display with old guts and [TS]

01:00:49   old ports and you're going to sell some [TS]

01:00:50   of them with the fancy new ports a new [TS]

01:00:52   guts in the whole deal [TS]

01:00:53   the the way to do it is not to leave [TS]

01:00:57   ancient computers around and just be [TS]

01:00:59   like well this one is never gonna get us [TS]

01:01:00   species it's not worth updating we're [TS]

01:01:01   just going to keep selling the macbook [TS]

01:01:03   air forever and ever and ever update the [TS]

01:01:04   guts every once in awhile but it's never [TS]

01:01:06   going to be an overall the the way with [TS]

01:01:08   more investment which I'm not gonna say [TS]

01:01:10   again I don't like the old Apple the old [TS]

01:01:12   ways it makes like cited in the olden [TS]

01:01:14   days like it's just a question of how [TS]

01:01:15   much investment deal the old way with [TS]

01:01:17   more investment is fine you're gonna [TS]

01:01:19   sell this lot of computers from a [TS]

01:01:20   thousand bucks to 4,000 all of them get [TS]

01:01:24   some minimum set of new features rolled [TS]

01:01:26   out together like it's a rising tide [TS]

01:01:28   lifts all boats if you're gonna keep [TS]

01:01:29   selling same look that one mac book [TS]

01:01:31   which i think is gone now or still alive [TS]

01:01:33   but it is finally gone anyway like I [TS]

01:01:35   said last week if you're going to sell a [TS]

01:01:38   super cheap laptop with real expect with [TS]

01:01:40   an optical drive [TS]

01:01:41   you also have to occasionally update [TS]

01:01:43   that 1i get you can't just say we're [TS]

01:01:45   going to keep some of the old computer [TS]

01:01:46   on modified for a long long time you [TS]

01:01:48   should move the lineup together which [TS]

01:01:50   means you have a gradation of features [TS]

01:01:52   like the touch bars and going to be in [TS]

01:01:53   all of them understands expensive right [TS]

01:01:55   and same thing with all the other [TS]

01:01:56   features and all all the different [TS]

01:01:57   things you bring out they're not all [TS]

01:01:58   gonna have the p3 screen right but the [TS]

01:02:01   fact that retina still hasn't trickled [TS]

01:02:03   down to the lowest end model because [TS]

01:02:05   they want to keep selling the old model [TS]

01:02:07   like the really really old crappy one [TS]

01:02:09   mostly unmodified with only minor tweaks [TS]

01:02:11   that does not speak well too [TS]

01:02:13   investment in the product line it's [TS]

01:02:15   better to keep selling the cheaper [TS]

01:02:17   computer but continued update them all [TS]

01:02:20   together in some cases they get away [TS]

01:02:22   with it on the phones because they only [TS]

01:02:23   do like you know last year's phone and [TS]

01:02:25   then it kind of trails off at the end [TS]

01:02:26   but even there I think it's a problem [TS]

01:02:27   that's where the strategy came from but [TS]

01:02:30   with the max like how many years has [TS]

01:02:32   essentially that same quote unquote same [TS]

01:02:34   macbook air with different guts been [TS]

01:02:36   sold [TS]

01:02:37   I'm even made the point now which I look [TS]

01:02:39   at the 13-inch macbook pro is now it's [TS]

01:02:41   now more of an error than air isn't that [TS]

01:02:44   amazing [TS]

01:02:45   and yet will still sell that air because [TS]

01:02:47   the new macros five dollars more [TS]

01:02:48   expensive it would be better to have a [TS]

01:02:51   cheaper better macbook air me even want [TS]

01:02:56   to keep a non-retina make this one [TS]

01:02:58   better than it is it's a trapeze and I [TS]

01:02:59   mean like i'm not trying to sell you [TS]

01:03:01   trying to give them now I'm not saying [TS]

01:03:02   like every product has to be awesome but [TS]

01:03:04   you have to bring the products up [TS]

01:03:05   together you can have this these two [TS]

01:03:07   classes of like hear the good computers [TS]

01:03:09   and here the ones we've been saying for [TS]

01:03:10   years that are pieces of crap and [TS]

01:03:12   there's these weird that's not the case [TS]

01:03:14   though with what they're saying is [TS]

01:03:16   here's the brand-new good computers that [TS]

01:03:17   quite frankly aren't cheap and into as [TS]

01:03:20   someone of you just said they're less [TS]

01:03:22   cheap now than they used to be and then [TS]

01:03:24   if you want something that's more [TS]

01:03:26   affordable guess what [TS]

01:03:28   it's probably going to be a little older [TS]

01:03:29   on the inside it's like the difference [TS]

01:03:31   between but it should be newer than it [TS]

01:03:33   is because it's like the pricing doesn't [TS]

01:03:35   make sense it's like the mac pro we [TS]

01:03:37   understand the macros an expensive [TS]

01:03:38   computer but if you don't have that the [TS]

01:03:39   internals for three years it becomes [TS]

01:03:41   embarrassing i'm at the macbook airs in [TS]

01:03:43   terms have been updated more than the [TS]

01:03:44   mac pros we have to give them that but [TS]

01:03:45   it's still basically the same form [TS]

01:03:47   factor and the internals are pretty old [TS]

01:03:49   and slow as compared to everything else [TS]

01:03:50   like really that this to me like this [TS]

01:03:52   this is my fundamental just friction [TS]

01:03:57   that I have with the tim cook made way [TS]

01:03:59   of running Apple you don't take real [TS]

01:04:01   courage to talk about courage in this [TS]

01:04:03   head-to-head super headphone jack [TS]

01:04:04   it would take real courage would be to [TS]

01:04:07   take a temporary margin hit to make all [TS]

01:04:10   of your products great at some of the [TS]

01:04:12   generals pointing out like it's hard to [TS]

01:04:15   i'm trying to get the macbook air more [TS]

01:04:16   credit than it probably deserves in [TS]

01:04:18   terms of the specs in the money because [TS]

01:04:19   again they have updated more than mac [TS]

01:04:20   pro which is a low bar but if you if you [TS]

01:04:24   look at the pc internal you can get [TS]

01:04:27   for the similar price and again kind of [TS]

01:04:28   macbook air is a better computer as [TS]

01:04:29   nicer you know industrial design so on [TS]

01:04:31   so forth just this is just not keeping [TS]

01:04:33   up with the rest of the line and the [TS]

01:04:34   line just feels like i haven't had nuts [TS]

01:04:37   it's like the you know the ipad air and [TS]

01:04:41   ipad pros like we this gap that exists [TS]

01:04:44   everywhere and it is it's a gap that [TS]

01:04:48   reflects a level of desired investment [TS]

01:04:50   because it's so much easier to keep [TS]

01:04:52   selling the old models or even just [TS]

01:04:54   bumping the internals of the old model [TS]

01:04:55   that fundamentally change like oh well [TS]

01:04:57   we can bump the internals little bit but [TS]

01:04:59   we changed us bc that's like a whole new [TS]

01:05:01   thing and it requires more investment [TS]

01:05:02   all the stuff it and i know i don't want [TS]

01:05:06   to put value judgments on it like moral [TS]

01:05:08   things like tim cook doesn't care is [TS]

01:05:09   being mean to us i think it's just [TS]

01:05:11   investment in the end again I think the [TS]

01:05:12   investment is is justified by all of the [TS]

01:05:15   tangible attributes of the mac line as [TS]

01:05:18   compared to everything else [TS]

01:05:19   mostly the reason you hear me upset [TS]

01:05:23   anyway is because i like the mac right [TS]

01:05:26   and I from I can argue for why you [TS]

01:05:29   should do this not just because I like [TS]

01:05:30   the Maccabees here's why it's actually [TS]

01:05:32   important for apples the company like I [TS]

01:05:33   can make that argument to but personally [TS]

01:05:35   speaking it's because I like this [TS]

01:05:37   product is now getting less investment [TS]

01:05:38   that's why i find it frustrating and [TS]

01:05:40   bingo didn't help that it didn't help [TS]

01:05:41   that they said that [TS]

01:05:43   hello again on the invitation but as I [TS]

01:05:44   said last week that was overhyped that [TS]

01:05:46   you're taking one admittedly quite long [TS]

01:05:49   data point which is not updating the [TS]

01:05:52   macbook pros effectively for like two or [TS]

01:05:55   three years [TS]

01:05:55   full stop that was BS that was terrible [TS]

01:05:58   shouldn't happened but you're taking [TS]

01:06:00   that one data point as a line that says [TS]

01:06:02   though that line with a huge downward [TS]

01:06:04   slope that says that we don't care about [TS]

01:06:05   the mac well you got the mac pro to you [TS]

01:06:07   got the mac mini which is always been [TS]

01:06:08   like that and we just excuse because [TS]

01:06:09   it's always been like that [TS]

01:06:11   right okay like I even the imac has gone [TS]

01:06:15   through droughts it's just not a good [TS]

01:06:16   cycle now right even if you just want to [TS]

01:06:18   pick like things like peripherals it's [TS]

01:06:19   not making a new extended keyboard when [TS]

01:06:21   they made the new key switches stuff [TS]

01:06:22   like that like it's movie you know it's [TS]

01:06:24   it that's harder to make an argument for [TS]

01:06:26   than everything else but anyway I'm [TS]

01:06:28   gonna get off this because I think I [TS]

01:06:29   mostly just arguing the two of us [TS]

01:06:30   arguing with you and I think the larger [TS]

01:06:33   the larger like this doesn't matter to [TS]

01:06:36   most people there was the biggest up cry [TS]

01:06:39   you know how Christ on twitter with some [TS]

01:06:41   people who expect desktop max to come [TS]

01:06:43   which is you know like just because we [TS]

01:06:46   didn't expect them to come or definitely [TS]

01:06:48   didn't expect them all to be updated or [TS]

01:06:49   anything doesn't mean it's not kind of [TS]

01:06:52   like doesn't mean we're not tired of [TS]

01:06:54   waiting for them as well right and I all [TS]

01:06:57   what you saw where people who like to [TS]

01:06:58   stop max complaining there were people [TS]

01:06:59   don't like that max don't care who cares [TS]

01:07:01   nobody noticed that max exist as far as [TS]

01:07:03   they're concerned max our laptops and [TS]

01:07:05   they think the macbook airs are fine and [TS]

01:07:06   so on and so forth but where you know [TS]

01:07:09   computer enthusiasts and mac fans and [TS]

01:07:11   desktop Mac fans and so of course we're [TS]

01:07:13   upset about it its separate argument [TS]

01:07:15   whether just because were upset that the [TS]

01:07:17   products we like are getting updated [TS]

01:07:19   does that mean that Apple should update [TS]

01:07:21   them are often but that explains the [TS]

01:07:24   upsetness I think the upsetting this is [TS]

01:07:25   not for the most part people think Larry [TS]

01:07:27   the same as saying Apple should do what [TS]

01:07:31   I want right because that's what you're [TS]

01:07:32   gonna have before we would like it if [TS]

01:07:35   Apple do something different but you [TS]

01:07:37   know we just allow us to be upset that [TS]

01:07:39   Apple's not doing what we want and then [TS]

01:07:41   we can have a discussion about whether [TS]

01:07:43   Apple should do this thing that we want [TS]

01:07:45   whether it's good for Apple are good for [TS]

01:07:46   computing or whatever night that i think [TS]

01:07:48   i can turn that into a big segue into [TS]

01:07:51   what i wanted to get into which is the [TS]

01:07:52   touch bar is remarkable put an add [TS]

01:07:55   something we also sponsor tonight by Mac [TS]

01:07:58   paw and clean my mac three go to Mac [TS]

01:08:01   Paul that's Mac PA w.com / ATP to learn [TS]

01:08:05   more mac Paul the reputable software [TS]

01:08:07   developer makes cleanmymac this is this [TS]

01:08:09   great program that helps you clean out [TS]

01:08:11   disk space and caches and things that on [TS]

01:08:12   your mac and mac three they recently [TS]

01:08:14   added a great new feature exclusively [TS]

01:08:16   for developers who use xcode xcode is [TS]

01:08:20   all the all these crap files keeps [TS]

01:08:21   around attempt files build files derive [TS]

01:08:25   data old support files for old simulated [TS]

01:08:27   devices and all devices you don't use [TS]

01:08:28   anymore [TS]

01:08:29   CleanMyMac 3 by Mac paw safely and [TS]

01:08:32   quickly can clean the xcode cash for you [TS]

01:08:34   more easily than ever before as app [TS]

01:08:37   developers Mac pod knows that it's a big [TS]

01:08:40   heart of try to remember all these [TS]

01:08:41   things are to even find these files to [TS]

01:08:43   know clean to remember clean them to try [TS]

01:08:45   to do anything anything quickly or with [TS]

01:08:46   any kind of like single key command [TS]

01:08:48   anything it's really hard so they made [TS]

01:08:50   all this safe easy and fast with [TS]

01:08:52   cleanmymac [TS]

01:08:53   three you can see for yourself you got [TS]

01:08:55   to check this out go to go to Mac pod [TS]

01:08:57   calm / ATP that's Mac p aww Mac ba.com / [TS]

01:09:02   ATP to check out CleanMyMac 3 especially [TS]

01:09:05   if you're a developer to see the new [TS]

01:09:06   feature to clear xcode cache files once [TS]

01:09:09   again thanks a lot to Mac paw and clean [TS]

01:09:11   my mac three for sponsoring our show so [TS]

01:09:17   many years ago one of my early maybe my [TS]

01:09:20   first but one of my earlier articles for [TS]

01:09:22   macro magazine the back page article was [TS]

01:09:26   about this fairly fanciful idea again i [TS]

01:09:30   have is a history to the back page of [TS]

01:09:32   macworld mac user magazine that made me [TS]

01:09:34   think of writing something that probably [TS]

01:09:36   won't even write a blog post today but i [TS]

01:09:38   did in a print article back then about [TS]

01:09:40   the idea of mac laptop that you could [TS]

01:09:47   use a mac but then you could somehow [TS]

01:09:49   folded over on itself kinda like the all [TS]

01:09:51   those convertible like a lot of [TS]

01:09:54   convertible pc laptops feel like this [TS]

01:09:55   remember when they're making a lot about [TS]

01:09:56   they're still making but the month you [TS]

01:09:58   can fold over it turns into a tablet [TS]

01:09:59   basically and when you turn into a [TS]

01:10:01   tablet [TS]

01:10:02   however you want to do a twisting the [TS]

01:10:03   screen and going down fulton all [TS]

01:10:05   backwards [TS]

01:10:06   we want it in tablet mode it's basically [TS]

01:10:08   an ipad and when it's in mac mode its a [TS]

01:10:10   Mac and I was like well you know you've [TS]

01:10:13   already got us running an intel on the [TS]

01:10:14   simulator and the you know that the [TS]

01:10:18   conversion would be kind of anything [TS]

01:10:19   we've seen lots of pc makers do it [TS]

01:10:21   Apple could do a good job on that the [TS]

01:10:23   hinge mechanism make it very you know [TS]

01:10:24   interesting and and sturdy and and good [TS]

01:10:27   to use all these different scenarios and [TS]

01:10:28   when that be an interesting kind of [TS]

01:10:30   computer because that would deal with [TS]

01:10:32   the the dichotomy that was then a hot [TS]

01:10:34   topic and still kind of a hot topic [TS]

01:10:35   between iOS and and the mac OS and all [TS]

01:10:38   this stuff and you know obviously [TS]

01:10:40   nothing came of that windows continue to [TS]

01:10:42   sell those those are convertibles [TS]

01:10:44   windows is converted its OS to be one [TS]

01:10:47   unified OS for both touch interface and [TS]

01:10:50   everything else and again we might talk [TS]

01:10:51   about that later on a different show but [TS]

01:10:54   setting that aside now that you know the [TS]

01:10:56   idea that you could run both iOS and [TS]

01:10:58   what was then OS 10 or Mac os10 at that [TS]

01:11:01   time [TS]

01:11:02   on the same computer because iOS also [TS]

01:11:04   runs on intel what we have today with [TS]

01:11:07   these things as you pointed out Casey is [TS]

01:11:09   a mac that runs mac OS on its intel [TS]

01:11:13   processor and then off to the side this [TS]

01:11:15   little T 1 processor that is presumably [TS]

01:11:18   arm and presumably run something like [TS]

01:11:21   iOS I mean again the core OS of both [TS]

01:11:23   Western and both mac OS and iOS Darwin [TS]

01:11:26   anywhere but anyway [TS]

01:11:27   presumably that little chip is running [TS]

01:11:28   in the West that's running a touch bar [TS]

01:11:29   doing all this stuff here we have a mac [TS]

01:11:31   is essentially running to os's on two [TS]

01:11:36   different screens [TS]

01:11:37   the only difference is the tablet mode [TS]

01:11:40   is just a little skinny strip that goes [TS]

01:11:42   along the top of the thing and then the [TS]

01:11:43   mac part gets the big thing of the top [TS]

01:11:46   and you look at this and I to I joked [TS]

01:11:48   was teasing Marco about this a couple [TS]

01:11:50   shows ago [TS]

01:11:51   just you wait until the entire keyboard [TS]

01:11:52   is one big screen for the people who [TS]

01:11:54   don't mind behind glass like look at the [TS]

01:11:57   evolution of the keyboards on these macs [TS]

01:11:59   going from big honkin giant keys that [TS]

01:12:01   are like on the Apple extended to keep [TS]

01:12:03   order the mac portable like big giant [TS]

01:12:05   mechanical switch petrunka chunk by [TS]

01:12:07   chunk and they just got squished and [TS]

01:12:09   squished and the plungers became a [TS]

01:12:11   butterfly hinges became dome switches [TS]

01:12:13   where they've just the keys have just [TS]

01:12:14   been descending into the thing becoming [TS]

01:12:16   like comically thinner and smaller like [TS]

01:12:19   like they were rolling over by a [TS]

01:12:20   steamroller year after year and now a [TS]

01:12:22   sudden one of the cortical keys is a big [TS]

01:12:25   flat screen that looks like the keys [TS]

01:12:26   they did a really good job by the way of [TS]

01:12:28   like pattern matching them like so it's [TS]

01:12:29   the same kind of matte finish on both [TS]

01:12:31   the screen in the key so it looks like [TS]

01:12:32   it's a big key anyway and now all of a [TS]

01:12:35   sudden one of them turns into a screen [TS]

01:12:36   and it's run by this little process has [TS]

01:12:38   an OS and like someone didn't animated [TS]

01:12:40   gif that i retweeted it was like next [TS]

01:12:42   year the number keys are screen next [TS]

01:12:44   year the top row of the qwerty keyboard [TS]

01:12:46   is keep next year the next row keys next [TS]

01:12:47   year the next rose the keys and [TS]

01:12:48   eventually the whole lot of the things [TS]

01:12:49   that the keys and eventually the top [TS]

01:12:51   screen goes away and you just have an [TS]

01:12:53   ipad right like it slowly slowly making [TS]

01:12:56   the Nintendo ds2 dual-screen thing you [TS]

01:12:59   know by by converting the keyboard and [TS]

01:13:01   i'm not saying this is the inevitable [TS]

01:13:03   direction they're going to go but it's [TS]

01:13:05   hard to look at that touchpad are the [TS]

01:13:07   touch bar and if this touch bar has any [TS]

01:13:10   legs at all the thing that people might [TS]

01:13:11   want to do not to see this as like a [TS]

01:13:13   weird transitional fossil [TS]

01:13:15   and I don't again I don't totally get [TS]

01:13:17   into the Microsoft Surface studio thing [TS]

01:13:19   but like this weird transition possibly [TS]

01:13:23   weird transitional fossil held up [TS]

01:13:25   against this the surface studio where [TS]

01:13:29   the whole freaking thing is one giant [TS]

01:13:30   touches play on by the way there's a [TS]

01:13:32   keyboard when you need it one of those [TS]

01:13:34   looks like they skip to the end of this [TS]

01:13:36   evolution again this may be a dead end [TS]

01:13:37   and evolution may be the wrong about [TS]

01:13:39   this is the you know the future of [TS]

01:13:40   computing or whatever may be the wrong [TS]

01:13:42   about the OS maybe the wrong about so [TS]

01:13:43   many other things but for one of the [TS]

01:13:46   first times in recent memory apple looks [TS]

01:13:48   to be making a more cautious bet then [TS]

01:13:53   then Microsoft at least in this [TS]

01:13:55   particular scenario and that's not [TS]

01:13:57   necessarily bad because i think the [TS]

01:13:58   cautious bet like the odds i think the [TS]

01:14:00   odds of touch bar being interesting and [TS]

01:14:02   useful are higher than the odds of the [TS]

01:14:04   surface studio being a runaway smash hit [TS]

01:14:06   that saves microsoft right or whatever [TS]

01:14:07   because like that it's safer [TS]

01:14:11   I think it has a higher chance of [TS]

01:14:12   success but I i look at that touch bar [TS]

01:14:15   and it's hard not to start thinking [TS]

01:14:17   about putting screens for the key but [TS]

01:14:20   why is the touchpad the the trackpad not [TS]

01:14:22   entirely screen the keyboard is not a [TS]

01:14:23   screen but is it has market would say [TS]

01:14:26   getting progressively worse as a [TS]

01:14:27   keyboard but other people might say [TS]

01:14:28   getting progressively less keyboard e [TS]

01:14:30   because people don't care about [TS]

01:14:32   keyboards anymore and when I just make [TS]

01:14:33   the whole thing screen and then when you [TS]

01:14:34   do that why do you have two screens [TS]

01:14:35   wanted to make one screen and you just [TS]

01:14:36   reinvented the ipad again but with a [TS]

01:14:38   different OS but now you know so i think [TS]

01:14:41   this is all this seems like it's all [TS]

01:14:44   eventually going to come to a head and I [TS]

01:14:46   think we'll look back at this and be [TS]

01:14:47   able to see the progression but right [TS]

01:14:49   now the progression that we can see from [TS]

01:14:51   the past is the keys are getting flatter [TS]

01:14:54   the things are getting thinner and now [TS]

01:14:58   the limitations of keys have gone to the [TS]

01:15:00   point where they're bringing some [TS]

01:15:01   screens down into that area and i'm not [TS]

01:15:03   quite sure where this will end but apple [TS]

01:15:06   looks like the more the more iterative [TS]

01:15:09   let's analyze a cautious or careful [TS]

01:15:11   because this is an interesting move but [TS]

01:15:13   it's definitely more iterative then sort [TS]

01:15:15   of leapfrog e then [TS]

01:15:17   then we're used to I think I don't think [TS]

01:15:20   that's a bad thing I i think it's i [TS]

01:15:23   don't want to really turn this into a [TS]

01:15:24   surface studio discussion but it is a [TS]

01:15:27   fascinating part of case studies the [TS]

01:15:30   right way of looking at it but it's it's [TS]

01:15:31   fascinating to see Microsoft just [TS]

01:15:34   tripping down on this hybrid OS idea [TS]

01:15:39   which to me seems utterly preposterous [TS]

01:15:41   and i actually have installed Windows 10 [TS]

01:15:43   on my work laptop because I've been [TS]

01:15:45   doing a little c-sharp API work and i [TS]

01:15:49   gotta tell you i was expecting Windows [TS]

01:15:51   10 to be really good because everyone i [TS]

01:15:53   know that has run it has said oh it's [TS]

01:15:54   great it's a lot better they fixed a lot [TS]

01:15:56   of the problems that it's really good [TS]

01:15:58   and i could go on for hours about how [TS]

01:16:01   awful i found windows tend to be and in [TS]

01:16:03   no small part because high DPI support [TS]

01:16:06   is a joke at best and non-existent at [TS]

01:16:08   worst but that being said all of a [TS]

01:16:14   sudden with the surface to do I sort of [TS]

01:16:17   understand what Microsoft is going for [TS]

01:16:18   with this hybrid world where touches is [TS]

01:16:21   touching non-touch os's are one in the [TS]

01:16:23   same i think that that is the surface to [TS]

01:16:28   do is kind of the ultimate realization [TS]

01:16:30   that they it's to some degree kind of a [TS]

01:16:32   naked robotic or of love Microsoft [TS]

01:16:34   strategy that lets make a machine with [TS]

01:16:37   this huge what is it's a 27 inch monitor [TS]

01:16:39   i believe something like that does [TS]

01:16:40   matter huge monitor 18 inch I think okay [TS]

01:16:43   and i believe it's taller right because [TS]

01:16:44   it's a different aspect ratio then we [TS]

01:16:45   asked there is 3 by 2 [TS]

01:16:47   yeah I i would love honestly so let's [TS]

01:16:50   make this very large that you know kind [TS]

01:16:53   of contrary device where it's not [TS]

01:16:55   widescreen like everything else on the [TS]

01:16:57   market is and let's make it touch [TS]

01:17:00   sensitive everywhere and that is kind of [TS]

01:17:03   the ultimate realization of microsoft [TS]

01:17:05   microsoft strategy and although i would [TS]

01:17:09   i would give almost anything not to run [TS]

01:17:11   windows and I can understand why this [TS]

01:17:14   would be appealing [TS]

01:17:16   I don't think I would ever want to have [TS]

01:17:17   a computer that is a drafting table so [TS]

01:17:19   to speak but i can see how would be [TS]

01:17:22   really really cool [TS]

01:17:23   similarly I think this touch bar is kind [TS]

01:17:27   of the ultimate realization [TS]

01:17:30   of what Apple thinks is the best idea [TS]

01:17:33   for a quote unquote hybrid world which [TS]

01:17:35   is not as much that the screen is a [TS]

01:17:37   touchscreen but more [TS]

01:17:38   hey will give you a little sick separate [TS]

01:17:41   touchscreen that you can interact with [TS]

01:17:43   and you can do cool stuff with and by [TS]

01:17:45   the way it's more than just buttons like [TS]

01:17:47   when we had seen the preview or the [TS]

01:17:50   renderings for this i don't recall [TS]

01:17:52   anyway having seen that there was going [TS]

01:17:53   to be anything on here really but a [TS]

01:17:55   bunch of just programmable buttons if [TS]

01:17:57   you will and there's all sorts of cool [TS]

01:17:59   stuff that they show on this they show [TS]

01:18:00   timelines and like Final Cut Pro or [TS]

01:18:02   maybe a different app they showed kind [TS]

01:18:05   of a cover flow version of all the [TS]

01:18:07   pictures that are in a folder when [TS]

01:18:08   you're looking and find her like there's [TS]

01:18:10   some really trick cool stuff coverflow [TS]

01:18:13   will never die but forever that I we [TS]

01:18:16   always know is a well the rumors were [TS]

01:18:18   all an oled screen so we kind of knew [TS]

01:18:20   that there was going to be other stuff [TS]

01:18:21   up there but like I go back to what you [TS]

01:18:23   said earlier Casey I think the key [TS]

01:18:24   phrase that I don't think it's apt here [TS]

01:18:26   is ultimate realization because this is [TS]

01:18:28   not the ultimate realization of anything [TS]

01:18:29   this is an iterative improvement and I [TS]

01:18:31   think it's good and I think it's going [TS]

01:18:32   to really cool but it's almost as if the [TS]

01:18:36   more cool this is the more we will [TS]

01:18:38   realize that limiting it to just a [TS]

01:18:40   little strip is bad and that you know [TS]

01:18:44   like why is the whole trackpad not a [TS]

01:18:46   screen why is the whole bottom of the [TS]

01:18:47   laptop screen wise though keyboard not a [TS]

01:18:49   screen is the point will say well the [TS]

01:18:50   whole keyboard on screen just type in [TS]

01:18:52   glasses terrible many millions of money [TS]

01:18:53   will say now we love it it's great you [TS]

01:18:55   know that it's like and then once you do [TS]

01:18:57   that it's like well then why is there a [TS]

01:18:59   bottom screen and the top screen why's [TS]

01:19:00   it all one screen and then you just like [TS]

01:19:02   it really feels it's not the ultimate [TS]

01:19:04   realization writing the ultimate [TS]

01:19:05   realization if this idea turns out to be [TS]

01:19:07   good of this computer on this laptop [TS]

01:19:10   idea but this computing idea using like [TS]

01:19:14   the value system that is most in line [TS]

01:19:16   with probably mine and Marcos is the [TS]

01:19:19   server studio which is just make the [TS]

01:19:21   whole freaking thing a big giant [TS]

01:19:22   gorgeous touchscreen but also give me a [TS]

01:19:24   physical keyboard when I want to type [TS]

01:19:26   because I'm old and I like to have on [TS]

01:19:27   physical keyboards and when i'm not [TS]

01:19:29   typing I don't have to deal with that [TS]

01:19:30   and there's no like separate region of [TS]

01:19:33   the keyboard that's also a screen and I [TS]

01:19:34   can use 77 hand and foot ten fingers and [TS]

01:19:37   five elbows all the same time with a [TS]

01:19:39   little dial and like just you know that [TS]

01:19:41   is the ultimate realization of ideas it [TS]

01:19:43   go [TS]

01:19:43   idea does it work well as the OS good [TS]

01:19:45   other other and intangibles that are [TS]

01:19:46   stopping them again I think we do have [TS]

01:19:47   to talk about this service to do some [TS]

01:19:49   point but the touch bar is not the [TS]

01:19:51   ultimate realization of any idea it is [TS]

01:19:53   the next good iterative step along the [TS]

01:19:57   lines of the idea that apple's pursuing [TS]

01:19:59   and I think it looks really cool and [TS]

01:20:01   really awesome with some minor caveat [TS]

01:20:02   it's but it feels it feels like just one [TS]

01:20:07   more step in it kind of its transition [TS]

01:20:09   off that makes me feel not uncomfortable [TS]

01:20:12   but like anticipatory like I like I'm [TS]

01:20:14   I'm waiting to see what's next it's [TS]

01:20:16   tantalizing in the like where does this [TS]

01:20:18   all go where does this lead because [TS]

01:20:19   clearly this is not going to be the end [TS]

01:20:21   this is clearly on its way to something [TS]

01:20:23   and I you know it's like it's like a [TS]

01:20:26   glimpse of the future that is not yet [TS]

01:20:27   here right [TS]

01:20:28   the keyboard is getting flatter we [TS]

01:20:30   showed a screen on it but it's still [TS]

01:20:32   kind of disappointed this thing is still [TS]

01:20:33   kind of shape of the old computer and [TS]

01:20:35   certainly the shape of mac OS is still [TS]

01:20:37   as separate from iOS is that ever was [TS]

01:20:39   and we don't know I don't know where [TS]

01:20:42   it's going but this is like I feel like [TS]

01:20:43   this is the first step off of the path [TS]

01:20:47   that the mac has been going on to an [TS]

01:20:49   acknowledgement that there can be that [TS]

01:20:52   not there you know emerging the os's or [TS]

01:20:55   whatever but just trying trying to [TS]

01:20:57   reconcile this world where we want to [TS]

01:20:59   touch stuff and have touchscreen things [TS]

01:21:01   with the world of the mac we're not [TS]

01:21:03   touching things right and how do we [TS]

01:21:05   bring them together and this is honestly [TS]

01:21:06   this is the first mac with a touchscreen [TS]

01:21:08   right no automatic has had a screen that [TS]

01:21:11   you talked to touch pads and a little [TS]

01:21:13   hybrid things [TS]

01:21:14   hey we want to touch screen Mac you got [TS]

01:21:16   10 by the way the screen is really thin [TS]

01:21:17   and that just makes me think like where [TS]

01:21:19   is this going where what is the future [TS]

01:21:20   of this like surely this is not a [TS]

01:21:22   holding pattern that we stand for [TS]

01:21:23   another 15 years with a little script [TS]

01:21:25   strip on the screen there [TS]

01:21:27   this has to lead to something and I'm [TS]

01:21:28   excited to see where that goes but this [TS]

01:21:30   this machine makes me like hunger to see [TS]

01:21:33   what's next [TS]

01:21:34   yeah quick aside about the surface [TS]

01:21:36   studio from everything I can tell it's [TS]

01:21:37   using the exact same processors as the [TS]

01:21:39   imac and it isn't out for another two [TS]

01:21:41   months [TS]

01:21:41   yeah no it's not a super like that that [TS]

01:21:43   machine but its separate topic intend to [TS]

01:21:45   switch also sorry if you're here to her [TS]

01:21:46   present tense which probably not this [TS]

01:21:48   week [TS]

01:21:48   intense which Microsoft service studio [TS]

01:21:50   there on the list we will talk about [TS]

01:21:52   them [TS]

01:21:53   alright so now you said nice things [TS]

01:21:55   about touchpad a few minor annoying [TS]

01:21:57   things about the touchpad well now what [TS]

01:21:59   one fun thing about it that the [TS]

01:22:01   customized thing pure APPL feature love [TS]

01:22:04   that he can drag the little thing off [TS]

01:22:05   the screen onto the onto the touch bar [TS]

01:22:06   that's awesome right [TS]

01:22:08   that's like another one of those magical [TS]

01:22:09   type of things and I did when you're [TS]

01:22:11   editing mode where you want to edit the [TS]

01:22:13   buttons to customize it is good that [TS]

01:22:15   that's a feature because customizing is [TS]

01:22:16   great and they go into shaky mode you [TS]

01:22:19   know like iOS where you when you you [TS]

01:22:21   know when you're editing your [TS]

01:22:23   springboard icons that's that's kind of [TS]

01:22:24   like a a UI idiom that Apple has coined [TS]

01:22:27   and now they use across the product line [TS]

01:22:29   to great effect when when these things [TS]

01:22:31   are in the mode where they're being [TS]

01:22:32   edited have them wiggle so it's clear [TS]

01:22:34   that you're in like editing mode and all [TS]

01:22:35   the rules are different that's very [TS]

01:22:37   clever very good bit of you either [TS]

01:22:39   they've been smart spread everywhere but [TS]

01:22:41   the tricky bit on the little strip the [TS]

01:22:44   touch bar screen is that they're using [TS]

01:22:46   edge-to-edge every single pixel that [TS]

01:22:48   thing to show the buttons because it's [TS]

01:22:50   such a skinny screen like they're going [TS]

01:22:52   all out from the top edge there's no [TS]

01:22:53   margins they're leaving on it so they [TS]

01:22:55   can't have the icons shake back and [TS]

01:22:57   forth as if they're rotating like the [TS]

01:22:59   springboard icons but it would be you [TS]

01:23:01   did now because they would be because [TS]

01:23:03   they would be clipped on the top and [TS]

01:23:05   bottom and you would be it would break [TS]

01:23:06   the illusion that their keys when you [TS]

01:23:08   saw them clipped by the screen edges so [TS]

01:23:10   instead they they they shake but only [TS]

01:23:13   left and right i was just okay yeah [TS]

01:23:15   they're in there and they're wiggling [TS]

01:23:16   and you don't know there's something a [TS]

01:23:17   little off but basically like jostling [TS]

01:23:19   up against each other like a bunch of [TS]

01:23:20   like you know peas in a pod or whatever [TS]

01:23:23   but they can't we go up and down because [TS]

01:23:24   the club which I thought was a really [TS]

01:23:26   clever way to solve that problem because [TS]

01:23:27   the problem is that we want to use every [TS]

01:23:28   pixel this thing but we make them shake [TS]

01:23:31   the other way they clip top and bottom [TS]

01:23:32   and it destroys the illusion so just [TS]

01:23:34   make them shake side-to-side I thought [TS]

01:23:35   that was super clever and adorable and [TS]

01:23:37   they look cute when i do that and that's [TS]

01:23:38   a great feature but it's the same trick [TS]

01:23:40   using the watch display to is like on [TS]

01:23:41   the watch and this is one of things you [TS]

01:23:42   could do with all that like one reason [TS]

01:23:44   looks so great is like black on oled [TS]

01:23:46   looks really black and so you can more [TS]

01:23:50   easily concealed the edges of the actual [TS]

01:23:53   screen like the actual pixels of the [TS]

01:23:54   screen with the black margin around it [TS]

01:23:57   so on the watch interface elements go [TS]

01:23:59   right up to the edge like they did he [TS]

01:24:01   specifically in the interface guidelines [TS]

01:24:02   like you should design your screens that [TS]

01:24:04   way don't leave any margin around you [TS]

01:24:06   let's go ride right to the edges and [TS]

01:24:08   then on the watches physical hardware [TS]

01:24:10   they just leave enough of a margin [TS]

01:24:11   around the screen to make that look [TS]

01:24:13   right into the doing the same thing on [TS]

01:24:14   the touch part here which is another one [TS]

01:24:17   of the many parallels that have to watch [TS]

01:24:18   because it appears to run a very to [TS]

01:24:21   watch us and it's running on on what [TS]

01:24:23   appears to be a variant of the watches [TS]

01:24:25   s1 chip as it's totally different as a [TS]

01:24:28   TV there instead of an s totally [TS]

01:24:29   different right right and the w12 [TS]

01:24:31   different yes anyway so yeah it's the [TS]

01:24:33   same similar move areas it's a genius [TS]

01:24:35   move like to know just we don't need the [TS]

01:24:37   screen to be any bigger than this [TS]

01:24:39   because the buttons are gonna be that [TS]

01:24:40   big [TS]

01:24:40   so just make it look like the screen has [TS]

01:24:41   a healthy margin and don't waste any [TS]

01:24:43   pixels and power on anything that's not [TS]

01:24:45   you know necessary so margins get within [TS]

01:24:48   margins taketh away [TS]

01:24:49   let's now discuss the escape button [TS]

01:24:51   other way all the people like I didn't [TS]

01:24:53   want to respond to us on Twitter for the [TS]

01:24:54   past week because it seemed tiring but [TS]

01:24:56   now i'm going to do it in the podcast [TS]

01:24:57   the the point that we made either on the [TS]

01:25:01   show last week or on twitter about the [TS]

01:25:03   escape key was all about the fact that [TS]

01:25:05   being a physical key [TS]

01:25:06   none of us on the show we're saying that [TS]

01:25:08   there was not going to be a little gray [TS]

01:25:10   square with the letters esc ended in the [TS]

01:25:12   upper left corner that little screen [TS]

01:25:14   well almost the upper left corner [TS]

01:25:16   yes yes I'm getting to that point to it [TS]

01:25:18   was all knew it would be there it's just [TS]

01:25:20   we were we were asking for a key because [TS]

01:25:22   in our line of work it is a key that we [TS]

01:25:24   had more often than probably the average [TS]

01:25:26   person and it's nice to be able to reach [TS]

01:25:27   up and feel for it and so as far as so [TS]

01:25:28   that was it was not about Lisbeth people [TS]

01:25:30   think when they showed the key look [TS]

01:25:32   there's an escapee you got your escapees [TS]

01:25:34   like it's not a key it's just a picture [TS]

01:25:35   on the screen and we knew that was going [TS]

01:25:36   to be there anyway it's an escape zone [TS]

01:25:38   yes as for margins the escape zone [TS]

01:25:41   escapes on the touch bar does is not in [TS]

01:25:45   the corner so if we want to it's like [TS]

01:25:48   well okay so it's not a physical button [TS]

01:25:50   but it's still on the corner and you can [TS]

01:25:51   reach for and feel the corner of the [TS]

01:25:52   screen right [TS]

01:25:53   unfortunately if you touch just the [TS]

01:25:56   corner of the screen you won't hit the [TS]

01:25:57   escape button because that first [TS]

01:25:59   centimeter or so of the touch bar is as [TS]

01:26:02   far as I'm able to determine completely [TS]

01:26:04   inert I know it doesn't have a screen [TS]

01:26:06   underneath it [TS]

01:26:06   I'm pretty sure it also doesn't have [TS]

01:26:08   touch sensors underneath that although I [TS]

01:26:09   see those things are necessarily [TS]

01:26:11   connected they could have put touch [TS]

01:26:12   sensors under there but no screen anyway [TS]

01:26:14   no screen is under there so they can't [TS]

01:26:15   physically draw the escape button [TS]

01:26:17   against the left edge of the touch bar [TS]

01:26:19   and i'm pretty sure you can't touch [TS]

01:26:22   their which makes it kind of a shame [TS]

01:26:24   because if you're feeling for something [TS]

01:26:26   to like reach out to the corner to find [TS]

01:26:28   a thing it's the one part you can feel [TS]

01:26:30   for on a completely smooth like touch [TS]

01:26:32   bar screen as you can feel for the top [TS]

01:26:34   edges in the sides so i would love to be [TS]

01:26:36   able to reach up to that corner and hit [TS]

01:26:37   the escape zone on the screen [TS]

01:26:39   yes but it looks like i will have to hit [TS]

01:26:41   the zone slightly over to the right from [TS]

01:26:44   the escape zone and i'm not particularly [TS]

01:26:48   happy about that because it's like [TS]

01:26:49   snatching defeat from the jaws of [TS]

01:26:51   victory because you guys like the one [TS]

01:26:52   button i care about this being replaced [TS]

01:26:54   by virtual button the one hit the most [TS]

01:26:55   often at least it's in the corner and [TS]

01:26:57   i'll be able to feel for but now i can [TS]

01:26:59   feel for by the way and i'm probably [TS]

01:27:01   getting one of these at work which is [TS]

01:27:02   why more invested in this at this point [TS]

01:27:03   and as I snuggly tweeted earlier [TS]

01:27:07   can we all guess why the screen doesn't [TS]

01:27:10   go all the way to the edge on the left [TS]

01:27:12   side [TS]

01:27:12   why doesn't the screen expand a little [TS]

01:27:14   bit it's so on the opposite side is the [TS]

01:27:17   touch ID sensor that's the same width as [TS]

01:27:19   the margin on the left side interesting [TS]

01:27:23   exactly the same whether it's just [TS]

01:27:24   clothes I i think it's exactly the same [TS]

01:27:27   i haven't haven't verified that yes i [TS]

01:27:29   think it is I think you're right it is [TS]

01:27:31   exactly the same with who I know who [TS]

01:27:33   likes margins to be exactly the same [TS]

01:27:35   with on the right and left sides of [TS]

01:27:36   things that they design i don't know i [TS]

01:27:38   mean maybe it might be the same person [TS]

01:27:40   who put the camera shutter / volume up [TS]

01:27:44   button directly opposite of me turn off [TS]

01:27:45   the screen and go to sleep button on the [TS]

01:27:47   iPhone offsetting those wouldn't help [TS]

01:27:49   that much but anyway like if you again [TS]

01:27:51   if you squint this laptop you see this [TS]

01:27:53   is still a 15-inch laptop which it with [TS]

01:27:55   a tiny keyboard crammed in there and I [TS]

01:27:57   know you won't have room for the [TS]

01:27:58   speakers and I know someone so all I'm [TS]

01:27:59   saying is that keeper could be big round [TS]

01:28:01   that each model but they want to be [TS]

01:28:02   uniform [TS]

01:28:03   same thing with the inverted to you get [TS]

01:28:04   a full-size arrow keys if you didn't [TS]

01:28:06   have a perfect rectangle Jony ive and [TS]

01:28:08   the Apple designers like symmetry I like [TS]

01:28:10   symmetry I like things to be uniform and [TS]

01:28:13   centered and everything but everyone has [TS]

01:28:15   their limits and this hit the touch ID [TS]

01:28:18   being on the gap on the right [TS]

01:28:20   I know it has to be there that's fine [TS]

01:28:21   what I would have chosen if i was [TS]

01:28:23   designing this is the screen would go [TS]

01:28:25   over to the edge on left side even [TS]

01:28:28   though it's not symmetrical [TS]

01:28:29   that's the choice I would have made [TS]

01:28:30   apple made a different choice all they [TS]

01:28:33   have open the door for is the ability to [TS]

01:28:34   lefties model of this button is on the [TS]

01:28:36   left you want the lefty/righty pitch [TS]

01:28:38   macbook pro I won't touch ID and left [TS]

01:28:40   anyway it's mostly silly i think it will [TS]

01:28:42   probably be fine but is another [TS]

01:28:44   maddening case of some people would say [TS]

01:28:48   it's its form over function i think [TS]

01:28:50   that's okay it's a little far I think [TS]

01:28:52   I'll probably still be able to find that [TS]

01:28:53   escape key how the arrow keys bothered [TS]

01:28:56   me more than this but boy I babe I'm i [TS]

01:29:00   am on a slightly different page than [TS]

01:29:01   apples designers when it comes to [TS]

01:29:03   symmetry and ergonomics well and also [TS]

01:29:05   like you will probably want to find it [TS]

01:29:06   but you will probably have to look more [TS]

01:29:09   often and and we don't know yet like in [TS]

01:29:12   practice how often will be a problem [TS]

01:29:14   with all the buttons on the touch bar [TS]

01:29:15   but i would say for the most part I [TS]

01:29:17   think most people who use mac and [TS]

01:29:19   windows windows on all sorts of like [TS]

01:29:21   frequent shortcuts to the f keys like it [TS]

01:29:23   does is the only way to close window [TS]

01:29:25   still alt f4 like it so if we win those [TS]

01:29:27   people might use more often [TS]

01:29:28   Mac people for the most part you're not [TS]

01:29:30   very heavily using almost anything that [TS]

01:29:32   function bro [TS]

01:29:33   except the Escape key where many people [TS]

01:29:36   and you know we as guess we we often [TS]

01:29:40   minimizer or diminish or underestimate [TS]

01:29:42   everyone else who's not a computer geek [TS]

01:29:44   and their ability to use our computers [TS]

01:29:46   that we think are even even that guy I [TS]

01:29:49   slipped into right anyway sorry about [TS]

01:29:51   that other people who are not geeks many [TS]

01:29:55   of them know that the Escape key often [TS]

01:29:58   performs a cancel shortcut to lots of [TS]

01:30:02   things in the OS fullscreen things [TS]

01:30:05   dialogues really there's so many things [TS]

01:30:06   in using a computer where the Escape key [TS]

01:30:10   is a useful shortcut for literally [TS]

01:30:13   escape cancel or escape what I'm doing [TS]

01:30:15   right and normal people in quotes many [TS]

01:30:19   of them know that this is not like a [TS]

01:30:21   thing that only people who use them use [TS]

01:30:23   like a lot of people know this so this [TS]

01:30:26   is this is not just like a thing that [TS]

01:30:29   annoys geeks like the loss of a of a [TS]

01:30:32   hardware Escape key that you can hit [TS]

01:30:34   without looking because we've all been [TS]

01:30:36   taught to type without looking at the [TS]

01:30:38   keyboard and the more you use keyboards [TS]

01:30:40   the more you [TS]

01:30:41   just get into the habit of not looking [TS]

01:30:43   at them the the lack of the hardware [TS]

01:30:45   Escape key is actually going to [TS]

01:30:46   inconvenience a lot of people it is not [TS]

01:30:48   just nerds [TS]

01:30:49   now it might be worth it the whole rest [TS]

01:30:51   of the benefit of this thing might end [TS]

01:30:53   up being worth it in the end but I don't [TS]

01:30:55   like when people sit when people [TS]

01:30:56   minimize this is just an earth because [TS]

01:30:57   it really isn't [TS]

01:30:58   I think more nerds don't look at the [TS]

01:31:00   keyboard and regular people but I you [TS]

01:31:02   know I i know a lot of people if i gave [TS]

01:31:04   this computer to would be annoyed by the [TS]

01:31:05   fact that escape is not a button but the [TS]

01:31:07   even if they're looking at the key part [TS]

01:31:09   of all time but you know that's I i I'm [TS]

01:31:11   willing to say that the benefit totally [TS]

01:31:12   outweighs that because the features that [TS]

01:31:13   are available on this thing or just [TS]

01:31:14   fantastically better than our growth [TS]

01:31:16   keys and I'm all involved with onboard [TS]

01:31:18   with that it's just like I said like the [TS]

01:31:20   one but the one button that you can feel [TS]

01:31:21   for if such ideas on the right the left [TS]

01:31:24   corner is the easiest place and that [TS]

01:31:25   thing to find and if the touch region [TS]

01:31:27   extended all the way to left that would [TS]

01:31:29   be that would make it almost as easy to [TS]

01:31:30   hit because it's not like you're typing [TS]

01:31:32   the escapee every once in a while you're [TS]

01:31:33   hitting it if you're a normal person [TS]

01:31:34   you're not it's not like the Ikki where [TS]

01:31:36   you're kind of like typing it so the [TS]

01:31:37   fact that it's not a button wouldn't be [TS]

01:31:38   like oh it feels weird when it's not a [TS]

01:31:40   button would be fine if it was over to [TS]

01:31:42   left more by the way the second most [TS]

01:31:43   frequently used button in the top row [TS]

01:31:45   for me on my Apple extended keyboard at [TS]

01:31:47   work and guess what it is [TS]

01:31:48   play pause volume now it's the eject [TS]

01:31:51   button and I don't hit on purpose i hit [TS]

01:31:54   accidentally when i try to hit backspace [TS]

01:31:55   and my CD tray of a mac program sticking [TS]

01:31:59   out like a giant tongue and why do I [TS]

01:32:00   accidentally hit the eject button when [TS]

01:32:02   i'm hitting backspace well i'm not a [TS]

01:32:04   great typist [TS]

01:32:05   but why do I actually hit the button [TS]

01:32:06   because the top row of keys is jammed [TS]

01:32:08   right up against the number 0 in the [TS]

01:32:10   backspace key is you know why because [TS]

01:32:11   it's just not enough room on my giant [TS]

01:32:13   expansive desk to put an extra five [TS]

01:32:15   millimeters between those two roadies [TS]

01:32:17   even Microsoft has lost the technology [TS]

01:32:20   of separate sets of keys remember the [TS]

01:32:22   original microsoft word on keyboard it [TS]

01:32:24   had the two halves of the keys and then [TS]

01:32:26   have a space and then had the function [TS]

01:32:28   keys and I had a space and had the [TS]

01:32:29   inverted T then it had a space that had [TS]

01:32:31   the numbered look at the one that they [TS]

01:32:33   just introduced recently and your mouse [TS]

01:32:34   is in New Jersey [TS]

01:32:35   I know what I'm just saying like you can [TS]

01:32:37   solve that problem by getting a getting [TS]

01:32:39   rid of America better whatever i'm not [TS]

01:32:41   asking for seven inches of space between [TS]

01:32:43   these regions right but if you look at [TS]

01:32:45   the new microsoft economic keyboard they [TS]

01:32:47   copied Apple down to the half-size [TS]

01:32:49   function keys that are jammed up against [TS]

01:32:51   the numbers like with vertical and they [TS]

01:32:53   have [TS]

01:32:53   huge risks rest on this thing is like a [TS]

01:32:55   7 inch wrist rest and yet they couldn't [TS]

01:32:58   spare five millimeters to put a space [TS]

01:32:59   between the top row functions i couldn't [TS]

01:33:02   make the top of functions these [TS]

01:33:02   full-sized like what do you think we [TS]

01:33:05   have room on your desk or did not think [TS]

01:33:06   we have reminded us because this [TS]

01:33:07   keyboard is huge but all your keys or [TS]

01:33:09   jam together and the numeric keypads [TS]

01:33:11   jammed against it at home end and page [TS]

01:33:13   up page and jam together like I don't [TS]

01:33:15   know who's designing these things are [TS]

01:33:16   what they think is going to like spaces [TS]

01:33:18   between different sets of keys are [TS]

01:33:20   feature being able to feel for the top [TS]

01:33:22   edge of the backspace key is a feature I [TS]

01:33:23   hated that freakin eject button and [TS]

01:33:25   seeing my CD tray eject and I can hit [TS]

01:33:27   without even looking to push back in [TS]

01:33:29   once i get the mechanism start going [TS]

01:33:30   because it was a delight [TS]

01:33:31   like I did it again i have and hold on [TS]

01:33:34   we can use I don't understand what you [TS]

01:33:36   just said you said something about a [TS]

01:33:37   tray in it in it you know what I know I [TS]

01:33:40   know it's hard to understand it's a [TS]

01:33:41   couple of kc oh the cup holder [TS]

01:33:43   oh yeah I miss having one of those i [TS]

01:33:45   mean that that man that's a long time [TS]

01:33:47   ago I and i would say again on a laptop [TS]

01:33:50   could you fit a keyboard on the 15-inch [TS]

01:33:52   macbook pro that has a space between [TS]

01:33:54   number keys and the little strip think [TS]

01:33:56   maybe you would want to in his new [TS]

01:33:57   scenario because it's like a screen and [TS]

01:33:58   you want to be able to reach about [TS]

01:33:59   everything for traditional keyboards [TS]

01:34:01   i think the space is important i think [TS]

01:34:03   having half-size keys up there is dumb i [TS]

01:34:06   think it you know the little strip thing [TS]

01:34:08   is not the full height of the keys [TS]

01:34:10   why not make that little strip to be [TS]

01:34:11   taller than it is maybe it's just the [TS]

01:34:13   right height for the the proportions [TS]

01:34:14   they wanted for the features but a lot [TS]

01:34:15   of times they shall i can in Photoshop [TS]

01:34:17   demo they're showing the history of the [TS]

01:34:18   images but the images were either they [TS]

01:34:21   were either cropped are squished because [TS]

01:34:23   you if you throw them if you show them [TS]

01:34:24   proportionally they'll be really small [TS]

01:34:25   so you want to show more of it but you [TS]

01:34:27   only have with to expand in like why [TS]

01:34:29   isn't the touch bar the height of a [TS]

01:34:31   full-height key right that's enough is [TS]

01:34:33   it just because the keys that is [TS]

01:34:35   replacing or a fight like maybe it's a [TS]

01:34:37   cost concern maybe its power concern i'm [TS]

01:34:39   not entirely sure but lots of decisions [TS]

01:34:41   flow out of this that I don't quite [TS]

01:34:42   understand but as far as keys go [TS]

01:34:44   I liked it better when I had full-size [TS]

01:34:45   keys with different regions separated [TS]

01:34:47   from each other especially on a gigantic [TS]

01:34:49   expansive desktop keyboard responsive [TS]

01:34:53   tonight by audible.com with an unmatched [TS]

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01:35:27   us not to and from work every day [TS]

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01:35:32   of them are right by the author's [TS]

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01:35:37   try new authors and dramas without [TS]

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01:36:03   audible.com / ATP that's audible.com / [TS]

01:36:07   ATP thanks to audible for sponsoring our [TS]

01:36:10   show [TS]

01:36:14   if I had to summarize the releases today [TS]

01:36:17   i am on on like the the good side like [TS]

01:36:21   overall this was good and said earlier [TS]

01:36:24   it does not come with it isn't all roses [TS]

01:36:27   like they're there are some like bitter [TS]

01:36:29   pill to swallow here but overall this [TS]

01:36:31   was good and I'm I'm really happy that [TS]

01:36:34   they are still doing things like the [TS]

01:36:37   touch bar even even though like I will [TS]

01:36:40   probably not use one for quite some time [TS]

01:36:42   primarily because I get on working on [TS]

01:36:44   the desktop like and as I mentioned [TS]

01:36:45   earlier I don't expect this to come to [TS]

01:36:47   desktops anytime soon if ever [TS]

01:36:50   and and so this this particular thing [TS]

01:36:53   will probably not impact me day-to-day [TS]

01:36:54   it for a while if ever but they did make [TS]

01:36:59   their laptops better faster newer [TS]

01:37:02   designs thinner lighter like overall [TS]

01:37:05   this was a really good day for mac [TS]

01:37:08   laptops it was just not a day for mac [TS]

01:37:10   desktops or for anybody who cares about [TS]

01:37:13   money which is a lot of people i had [TS]

01:37:17   some lighter things on the the touch bar [TS]

01:37:19   before I move on from that topic sure is [TS]

01:37:21   your credit to people on twitter so i [TS]

01:37:23   was talking about you know when i was [TS]

01:37:25   doing my cranky tweets about the [TS]

01:37:27   symmetrical space on the size of the [TS]

01:37:29   touch bar like asking you know can [TS]

01:37:31   anyone guess why that space is like I [TS]

01:37:33   posted a picture from the Apple human [TS]

01:37:34   interface guidelines that emphasizes the [TS]

01:37:36   fact that the margins are identical on [TS]

01:37:38   both sides of it as a into the people [TS]

01:37:39   who are listening to the show and dave [TS]

01:37:42   liebman had a good answer as to why the [TS]

01:37:44   Escape key is not up against left margin [TS]

01:37:46   that's the space taken up by the [TS]

01:37:47   headphone jack [TS]

01:37:48   oh it's not that but you couldn't put [TS]

01:37:51   them on Jack we had me now we have to [TS]

01:37:53   come we had to fit in and you know [TS]

01:37:54   that's the headphone jack is right under [TS]

01:37:56   and then I also tweeted that we should [TS]

01:37:59   start the countdown to touch bar games [TS]

01:38:01   because you know if because it's the mac [TS]

01:38:04   and we don't have to send into the mac [TS]

01:38:05   app store and this thing does have an [TS]

01:38:07   API you can make a touch bar game i'm [TS]

01:38:09   sure of some fashion how responsive it [TS]

01:38:12   can be i don't know because I don't it's [TS]

01:38:14   not like you're you know i think is it [TS]

01:38:16   is how to remove without a separate t1 [TS]

01:38:17   chip over there but it would be fun to [TS]

01:38:19   try to have tried to do something cool [TS]

01:38:20   and here are the best entries for [TS]

01:38:23   potential touch bar games richard gale [TS]

01:38:24   so just punch the monkey which is a joke [TS]

01:38:26   that only be nice [TS]

01:38:27   and then in the nineties will get [TS]

01:38:28   because that was a banner ad with the [TS]

01:38:30   monkey and he moved mostly horizontal [TS]

01:38:32   because there wasn't much room to go to [TS]

01:38:33   punch the monkey is the right thing and [TS]

01:38:35   Benjamin looking wins the idea for touch [TS]

01:38:38   bar game which he calls really boring [TS]

01:38:41   snake snake by the way for all over [TS]

01:38:44   younger people is a game that was [TS]

01:38:45   popular on cell phones back when the [TS]

01:38:47   only games they could play was having a [TS]

01:38:49   Lenny I can't explain snake if you don't [TS]

01:38:50   get the joke trust me it's very funny it [TS]

01:38:52   was called nibble and qbasic back in the [TS]

01:38:54   day [TS]

01:38:54   mm remember really boring snake he [TS]

01:38:57   should copyright is capital R capital B [TS]

01:38:59   capital s TM the game that you can make [TS]

01:39:02   Margo I honestly the the gaming things [TS]

01:39:04   might be I saw James Thompson of peacock [TS]

01:39:06   Fame talking earlier about the US [TS]

01:39:09   Attorney sdk awesome news that their [TS]

01:39:11   parent there appears to be a simulator [TS]

01:39:13   for building apps for so you don't need [TS]

01:39:15   to have the hardware yet but it also [TS]

01:39:18   appears that you only have access to it [TS]

01:39:20   when your app is active [TS]

01:39:22   so if you were to make a a touch bar [TS]

01:39:24   game you might have to always have a [TS]

01:39:26   window on screen the user keeps active [TS]

01:39:28   for your gift to keep showing up in the [TS]

01:39:29   touch bar [TS]

01:39:30   yeah i know it again at the macro see [TS]

01:39:33   what kind of hacks people can do it but [TS]

01:39:34   like and you mentioned before that the [TS]

01:39:36   addressable market for touching our [TS]

01:39:37   things going to be small and I think [TS]

01:39:40   that would be more of a problem if the [TS]

01:39:41   touch bar wasn't so damn cool [TS]

01:39:43   uh yeah and and it probably seems like [TS]

01:39:45   it and it's also seems like it's easy to [TS]

01:39:47   do something down there it's just so [TS]

01:39:49   cool and it's in the simulator and i [TS]

01:39:51   expect to see a lot of applications [TS]

01:39:52   doing possibly inadvisable things with [TS]

01:39:55   the touch bar but it's just to have [TS]

01:39:57   another place that I you know to have a [TS]

01:39:59   place next to the keyboard that's [TS]

01:40:01   configurable that you can do stuff in it [TS]

01:40:03   will be exciting for developers to just [TS]

01:40:05   try something especially if it's fairly [TS]

01:40:07   straightforward implement it seems like [TS]

01:40:08   the classes they have for this type of [TS]

01:40:09   stuff that a scrubber and all the stuff [TS]

01:40:11   in the whole API seems pretty well [TS]

01:40:13   thought out and well designed it won't [TS]

01:40:15   be that hard to get something up there [TS]

01:40:16   even if it's just a bunch of buttons and [TS]

01:40:18   stuff and the Apple apps are really [TS]

01:40:20   showing the way with like we're not just [TS]

01:40:21   putting a bunch of configurable buttons [TS]

01:40:22   like Casey with you know case you're [TS]

01:40:23   saying before they all just a bunch of [TS]

01:40:25   buttons to change based on the context [TS]

01:40:26   they've got you know I mean it's obvious [TS]

01:40:28   lots of horizontal stuff but timelines [TS]

01:40:30   thumbnails lots of interfaces it seemed [TS]

01:40:33   pretty responsive in that you could do [TS]

01:40:35   things on this little tiny iOS control [TS]

01:40:37   computer that would cause changes on the [TS]

01:40:39   big mac computer a couple inches away in [TS]

01:40:42   a fairly responsive fashion making it so [TS]

01:40:45   you can do things without taking your [TS]

01:40:46   hands off the keyboard or you know doing [TS]

01:40:48   things two hands at once with one on the [TS]

01:40:50   touch part 1 the trackpad i found that [TS]

01:40:52   demonstration pretty compelling and I [TS]

01:40:54   think even though such a small number of [TS]

01:40:57   people relative to the rest of the mac [TS]

01:40:58   users are going to have this developers [TS]

01:41:00   will add this feature because it's cool [TS]

01:41:01   I i love the idea of this like amazing [TS]

01:41:06   like high-end dual-core supercomputer [TS]

01:41:09   sitting there mostly idle as you play a [TS]

01:41:13   game on this little 30 pixels tall strip [TS]

01:41:15   the whole screens like they're lit up [TS]

01:41:18   the whole computers on doing nothing but [TS]

01:41:20   it's it they're playing the game on this [TS]

01:41:22   little watch processors little space it [TS]

01:41:25   could be an inversion of like the old [TS]

01:41:27   like the top part will be just like the [TS]

01:41:29   the status display that shows your [TS]

01:41:30   inventory and the whole game is better [TS]

01:41:33   up on the bottom lots of infinite runner [TS]

01:41:35   runners are potentially good i I don't [TS]

01:41:37   know how much control you have there but [TS]

01:41:39   because it is a little computer doing [TS]

01:41:41   that I wonder if you can somehow get [TS]

01:41:42   code onto it for it to run i'm not sure [TS]

01:41:44   what the whole deal is it [TS]

01:41:45   it seems to be communicating at removed [TS]

01:41:48   from the rest of the mac system but [TS]

01:41:50   there is code running there to run the [TS]

01:41:51   display and if you can get your code [TS]

01:41:53   onto the t1 or onto whatever the t1 does [TS]

01:41:55   and get it run to run from there that [TS]

01:41:58   will be where your your fun at the very [TS]

01:42:00   least you should probably go to do pong [TS]

01:42:01   or something right or or really boring [TS]

01:42:03   snake and i would like to the the other [TS]

01:42:06   things as far as there's already Apple [TS]

01:42:07   human interface guidelines for it i [TS]

01:42:09   briefly looked at them and I remember [TS]

01:42:10   reading in like all this all seems [TS]

01:42:12   sensible and good ideas but one of the [TS]

01:42:14   items maybe think that Apple has [TS]

01:42:15   actually done a demo that was countered [TS]

01:42:17   to its me to see if I can find out about [TS]

01:42:19   like well that's that's not it [TS]

01:42:21   oh yeah apple doesn't always follow the [TS]

01:42:24   egg and following the end of it is not a [TS]

01:42:26   bible that has to be followed to the [TS]

01:42:28   letter it so now they've got it didn't [TS]

01:42:30   you [TS]

01:42:31   the one that was confusing me there [TS]

01:42:32   there within the bounds of things to [TS]

01:42:34   avoid mirroring the touch bar [TS]

01:42:35   interactions on the main screen but they [TS]

01:42:36   mean that the example to give it the [TS]

01:42:38   user taps about in touch bar is [TS]

01:42:39   presented with listed options don't also [TS]

01:42:41   present the same options on the main [TS]

01:42:43   screen what they demoed was for example [TS]

01:42:44   in photos when you're messing with like [TS]

01:42:46   the exposure slider they it rather than [TS]

01:42:49   just you messing with the exposure [TS]

01:42:51   slider on the touch bar and seeing the [TS]

01:42:52   exposure chain [TS]

01:42:53   John the full screen image when you go [TS]

01:42:55   into edit mode the Photos app also goes [TS]

01:42:57   into edit mode and when you drag the [TS]

01:42:59   exposure slider the exposures lighter is [TS]

01:43:01   visible on the main screen as well and [TS]

01:43:02   it drags in it you know the same time as [TS]

01:43:04   you're dragging your thing now that's [TS]

01:43:06   arguably not the same as presenting [TS]

01:43:08   delicious options in both places but it [TS]

01:43:10   isn't kind of mirroring the controls [TS]

01:43:11   like a look at my my changing exposure [TS]

01:43:13   in the sidebar photos are my changing [TS]

01:43:15   exposure on the on the touch bar and [TS]

01:43:18   it's kind of weird to have it in both [TS]

01:43:19   places like the advantage should be as [TS]

01:43:21   they showed in a couple other demos if [TS]

01:43:23   I'm using touch bar that means those [TS]

01:43:25   controls don't have to be on the screen [TS]

01:43:26   like this the whole point of the touch [TS]

01:43:28   bar i have them down here some more of [TS]

01:43:29   the screen can be used to show me the [TS]

01:43:30   content but maybe just because photos [TS]

01:43:32   hasn't been updated to do that and the [TS]

01:43:33   only way to be in edit mode is to have [TS]

01:43:35   that view visible I don't know but [TS]

01:43:37   anyway well we'll put this link and you [TS]

01:43:39   get and you can check it out it's short [TS]

01:43:41   it's one page and it's an interesting [TS]

01:43:42   insight into how Apple expects the Dutch [TS]

01:43:44   part can be used by developers write [TS]

01:43:47   anything else worth talking about [TS]

01:43:49   next we haven't talked about the max ram [TS]

01:43:51   16 gigs Mac ram on a four thousand [TS]

01:43:53   dollars that's okay [TS]

01:43:54   yeah we're gonna do you got to say now [TS]

01:43:56   on that one like 16 gigs that you know [TS]

01:43:59   standard on the 15-inch fine i can [TS]

01:44:01   almost kind of forgive eight gigs on the [TS]

01:44:03   13 maybe maybe not but all 13 pro is [TS]

01:44:06   increasingly less pro haven't talked [TS]

01:44:08   about that but uh 16 gigs maximum on the [TS]

01:44:10   big one not not a good choice not a good [TS]

01:44:13   choice at all especially since it's such [TS]

01:44:16   a powerful machine compared to the [TS]

01:44:17   previous one like to have the same [TS]

01:44:19   maximum but if you are going to run any [TS]

01:44:20   vm those are going to end up your memory [TS]

01:44:22   and if you're going to be doing all [TS]

01:44:24   these fancy things that you can do on [TS]

01:44:25   this this new computer with hi-res [TS]

01:44:28   images and video 16 gigs of ram max is [TS]

01:44:31   not great [TS]

01:44:32   well I mean look let's be honest here I [TS]

01:44:33   mean like I see people on Twitter and [TS]

01:44:35   stop complaining like how could a pro [TS]

01:44:37   machine not have this or have this [TS]

01:44:39   whatever else apples use of the word pro [TS]

01:44:42   is primarily about size and price target [TS]

01:44:46   it it does not have to do with whether [TS]

01:44:49   professionals whatever that means [TS]

01:44:50   however you define that are able to use [TS]

01:44:53   this computer for what they need or [TS]

01:44:54   whether it's designed for them or not [TS]

01:44:55   pro means it's the big expensive one [TS]

01:44:58   period so the fact that pros often need [TS]

01:45:02   more than 16 gigs of ram does not seem [TS]

01:45:04   to enter apples thoughts about you know [TS]

01:45:06   power whether to make that option with [TS]

01:45:08   option available or not here I think it [TS]

01:45:10   enters their thoughts that just one more [TS]

01:45:11   battery to do it probably and that's [TS]

01:45:13   where the sticking points i'm assuming I [TS]

01:45:15   mean ram does use battery power and and [TS]

01:45:18   not a small amount of it but compared to [TS]

01:45:20   everything else in there i mean the [TS]

01:45:22   15-inch has a 45 watt cpu next 235 lat [TS]

01:45:27   GPU and and by the way one of the things [TS]

01:45:29   that makes me sad about the new 15-inch [TS]

01:45:31   is that I was always a fan of buying the [TS]

01:45:35   low-end 15 a configuration that only had [TS]

01:45:38   the intel integrated GPU which wich that [TS]

01:45:40   option has been available now for quite [TS]

01:45:42   some time i think since around twenty [TS]

01:45:43   ten or so where it used to be [TS]

01:45:46   first it was just always discreet and [TS]

01:45:47   then eventually they they had these dual [TS]

01:45:50   GPU models around 2008-2009 or something [TS]

01:45:53   like that where they would have this one [TS]

01:45:55   they had the high-power discrete GPU and [TS]

01:45:57   they would also have the Intel [TS]

01:45:58   integrated GPU and then it would switch [TS]

01:46:01   between them based on and we know [TS]

01:46:02   whether anything was running the needed [TS]

01:46:04   more power of the big one and and the [TS]

01:46:06   switching not only not only just having [TS]

01:46:08   two GPUs and having a high-powered when [TS]

01:46:09   they're in the first place [TS]

01:46:10   not only does that raise the power [TS]

01:46:12   requirement when that GPU is active and [TS]

01:46:15   every the ceiling of how high the power [TS]

01:46:16   consumption can get if it's under load [TS]

01:46:18   but also there were often bugs switching [TS]

01:46:21   between those two gpus it that's not an [TS]

01:46:23   easy task and the mac switch between [TS]

01:46:25   would often have weird issues and [TS]

01:46:28   they're they're like why of visual [TS]

01:46:30   glitches both gpus staying active using [TS]

01:46:32   too much power [TS]

01:46:33   occasionally even blue screens also the [TS]

01:46:36   other problem is that having another big [TS]

01:46:39   hot chip on the logic board will [TS]

01:46:42   actually significantly raises the [TS]

01:46:44   failure rates and many people there i [TS]

01:46:47   think there have even been class actions [TS]

01:46:48   against an extended service programs and [TS]

01:46:49   everything we're often a 15-inch macbook [TS]

01:46:53   pro will have a big problem with the GPU [TS]

01:46:56   failing after my time is really just the [TS]

01:46:58   additional heat and stress in the board [TS]

01:46:59   and everything like they were big [TS]

01:47:01   problems video back in the day and and [TS]

01:47:03   these problems i don't know if there's [TS]

01:47:04   any recent ones but it is basically [TS]

01:47:07   there's enough of a downside to having a [TS]

01:47:10   to having the discrete GPU in the [TS]

01:47:12   15-inch both in in battery and heat in [TS]

01:47:15   possible bugs and possible failures down [TS]

01:47:17   the road [TS]

01:47:18   that I've always favor the option [TS]

01:47:20   because I'm i am neither a gamer nor do [TS]

01:47:24   i use external monitors with my 15 [TS]

01:47:27   inches like I just use it as itself when [TS]

01:47:29   I do use it [TS]

01:47:30   I've always been a fan of of buying the [TS]

01:47:32   Intel only GPU version and for whatever [TS]

01:47:35   reason that version that option is gone [TS]

01:47:38   now [TS]

01:47:39   now you can only buy it with the AMD one [TS]

01:47:42   and somebody on Twitter told me earlier [TS]

01:47:44   i don't know if this is true and [TS]

01:47:45   somebody said that the the newest [TS]

01:47:47   version of the intel integrated GPU that [TS]

01:47:49   would be in this is actually slower than [TS]

01:47:50   the previous one so that might be the [TS]

01:47:52   reason Apple might have a legitimate [TS]

01:47:53   reason for getting rid of adoption but [TS]

01:47:55   what about what about the fact that it [TS]

01:47:57   can drive to 5k displays I don't suspect [TS]

01:48:00   was gonna mention that like there's [TS]

01:48:02   there there's some big advantages to [TS]

01:48:04   this and you lose the prostatic [TS]

01:48:05   Markowitz the wannabes like I don't need [TS]

01:48:07   to drive to find creative ways but i [TS]

01:48:08   think all these reasons the one that is [TS]

01:48:11   common to tell them in the both the [TS]

01:48:13   memory and the GPU is uniformity if you [TS]

01:48:15   just have one model it always comes with [TS]

01:48:16   16 gigs always come to the GPU that's [TS]

01:48:18   another cost savings that's another [TS]

01:48:20   resource and investment thing how many [TS]

01:48:22   different SKUs do you want to have how [TS]

01:48:23   many different varieties do you want to [TS]

01:48:24   have the rama soldered to the board if [TS]

01:48:26   we have one with more RAM it's more of a [TS]

01:48:28   pain like do you want to have on with [TS]

01:48:30   and without discrete GPU just do the one [TS]

01:48:32   discrete GPU because the one without you [TS]

01:48:35   know the integrated ones crapping you [TS]

01:48:36   can't drive the monitors and then how do [TS]

01:48:38   you have for Thunderbolt three ports and [TS]

01:48:40   everything you know so I there's a lot [TS]

01:48:43   of reasons I can think of for for both [TS]

01:48:45   of these choices but I have more faith [TS]

01:48:47   in marco then in the discrete GPU simply [TS]

01:48:50   because this one is 40 nanometers which [TS]

01:48:51   is got to help with the heat and [TS]

01:48:53   everything and I'm hoping that they have [TS]

01:48:55   mostly worked out the kinks of the GPU [TS]

01:48:57   switching if they can do it power wise [TS]

01:48:59   it might be easier just to always use [TS]

01:49:01   the discrete one that would probably be [TS]

01:49:03   slaughtered your battery but that would [TS]

01:49:05   be good from a bug perspective i know a [TS]

01:49:06   lot of people use what was that thing [TS]

01:49:07   called Marco the little menu bar that is [TS]

01:49:10   a graphics card status by Cody Krieger [TS]

01:49:12   yeah that's right yeah there was a [TS]

01:49:14   utility where you could say you could [TS]

01:49:16   make it use one GP with the other and [TS]

01:49:18   one possible solution to bugs like [TS]

01:49:19   lugging your laptop and just make it [TS]

01:49:21   only use discrete GPU and then going to [TS]

01:49:24   worry about it well but even even that [TS]

01:49:26   was controversial because like even that [TS]

01:49:27   one like it could force the discrete GPU [TS]

01:49:29   to be on but it couldn't force the [TS]

01:49:31   creepy to be all [TS]

01:49:32   because be like under certain models [TS]

01:49:34   like it would it would tell that that [TS]

01:49:36   that utility that it wasn't that was it [TS]

01:49:39   was integrated only but it's still [TS]

01:49:41   running it would still run the discrete [TS]

01:49:42   one anyway and it was it basically like [TS]

01:49:44   you can never count on it to only use [TS]

01:49:46   the integrated one you could as you said [TS]

01:49:48   you could count always discreet but then [TS]

01:49:50   you're losing a lot of battery life and [TS]

01:49:51   making more heat to get that because you [TS]

01:49:53   know the GPUs are very complicated GPU [TS]

01:49:56   and I pop these days like a good one is [TS]

01:49:58   almost or equally or even more [TS]

01:50:01   complicated and heat demanding and [TS]

01:50:03   battery demanding than a cpu so you know [TS]

01:50:05   like that said that's 35 what GPU in [TS]

01:50:07   there next to a 45 watt cpu that's a lot [TS]

01:50:10   of extra power there so if you don't [TS]

01:50:13   need it and you know again the document [TS]

01:50:15   does the definition of pro there are [TS]

01:50:17   lots of types of pro work that don't [TS]

01:50:20   need GPU power I have never really [TS]

01:50:24   needed my sheep our what I do I'm a pro [TS]

01:50:26   tip doesn't mean she's a pro like lots [TS]

01:50:28   of John but you don't need except for [TS]

01:50:30   games but on your computer but you don't [TS]

01:50:32   have it [TS]

01:50:32   are you ready you don't need a graphics [TS]

01:50:34   card power Casey do you need a good [TS]

01:50:36   graphics card on your computer or your [TS]

01:50:38   home one for that matter [TS]

01:50:39   no but I think you're pretty giving a [TS]

01:50:41   pretty narrow different definition of [TS]

01:50:43   pro pro to you as someone who does the [TS]

01:50:45   sorts of things that you or your family [TS]

01:50:47   do and there's a lot of other flavors of [TS]

01:50:49   pro that might necessitate that GPU and [TS]

01:50:52   since I have the floor i will say that [TS]

01:50:54   the only time I ever had problems with [TS]

01:50:56   my 2011 to my 2 2011 macbook pros each [TS]

01:51:00   with each of which had discreet cpu GPU [TS]

01:51:02   is the only time I ever had any sort of [TS]

01:51:05   glitches or issues was when i was [TS]

01:51:06   running graphics card status when i was [TS]

01:51:08   just using OS 10 or you know Mac OS now [TS]

01:51:10   out-of-the-box I never had an issue [TS]

01:51:12   except I could not agree with you more [TS]

01:51:14   Marco that battery life just was [TS]

01:51:16   slaughtered when the discrete GPUs on [TS]

01:51:19   completely agree there but in terms of [TS]

01:51:20   like glitches and stuff like that [TS]

01:51:22   I never had any of those problems as [TS]

01:51:24   soon as I stopped talking about graphics [TS]

01:51:27   card status that since I stopped rolling [TS]

01:51:29   graphics card status i would always by [TS]

01:51:31   vitac choice and they had everything I [TS]

01:51:33   would always buy the one with the [TS]

01:51:33   discrete GPU anyway later game with all [TS]

01:51:36   the bugs I even not just because of the [TS]

01:51:38   game just because it's like look if [TS]

01:51:39   you're buying the pro you just it's [TS]

01:51:41   gonna be the biggest the hottest the you [TS]

01:51:45   know and [TS]

01:51:45   and like i said i think i have i have [TS]

01:51:47   faith i like the fact that were not in [TS]

01:51:49   the bad old days with the GPUs to be [TS]

01:51:51   done on a word processing the cpu GPU is [TS]

01:51:53   40 nanometers it is on actually it is [TS]

01:51:56   actually the current architecture the [TS]

01:51:57   AMD is a has out right now I think it's [TS]

01:52:00   the current polaris instead of being [TS]

01:52:02   like three or four generations behind [TS]

01:52:04   like the embarrassing g it's not it's [TS]

01:52:05   not the superfast some people are asking [TS]

01:52:07   is this like a gaming laptop no it is [TS]

01:52:08   not like this is not this is not the [TS]

01:52:10   best cpu you can get in a laptop by a [TS]

01:52:13   long stretch of the imagination but [TS]

01:52:14   compared to what we had before like [TS]

01:52:15   that's what they could put up the slide [TS]

01:52:16   look it's a hundred percent faster it's [TS]

01:52:18   like yeah because those ones were [TS]

01:52:20   ancient and this one is contemporary [TS]

01:52:23   middle-of-the-road you know probably not [TS]

01:52:25   as clocked as high not the best of the [TS]

01:52:28   best [TS]

01:52:28   you know me but I like gpus I would [TS]

01:52:31   always buy the one with the bigger GPU [TS]

01:52:32   my laptop is going to be plugged in at [TS]

01:52:34   work all the time anyway but it's it's [TS]

01:52:36   good for it would be nice you know again [TS]

01:52:38   options how many skills you have how [TS]

01:52:39   many options do you have [TS]

01:52:41   market would like one that has a big [TS]

01:52:42   screen but doesn't have discrete GPU [TS]

01:52:43   they don't make that product i think [TS]

01:52:45   mostly because of uniformity make one of [TS]

01:52:48   these computers were like one of those [TS]

01:52:49   who make one of those they did until [TS]

01:52:50   today I know actually a pretty little [TS]

01:52:52   self [TS]

01:52:53   yeah you might be what you might be able [TS]

01:52:55   to stop by the old one because why would [TS]

01:52:57   they stop selling it [TS]

01:52:58   yeah but any basically so besides that I [TS]

01:53:00   mean the 1500 ultimately the 15-second [TS]

01:53:02   incredible update i I'm a little [TS]

01:53:04   concerned about real-world battery use [TS]

01:53:08   here I i I'm very very interested to see [TS]

01:53:11   the reviews come out and to see people's [TS]

01:53:13   experiences with these things as they [TS]

01:53:14   come out because one of the problems [TS]

01:53:16   that i've always had that I've had [TS]

01:53:17   recently with a lot of the as i [TS]

01:53:19   mentioned before a lot of the games [TS]

01:53:20   we've made a battery life it recently in [TS]

01:53:22   you know probably last five years at [TS]

01:53:24   least has really been in reducing the [TS]

01:53:27   the idle power levels of these chips and [TS]

01:53:30   of computers basically reducing the [TS]

01:53:32   amount of power that computers use when [TS]

01:53:34   you're when you're using them very [TS]

01:53:35   lightly for things like email and web [TS]

01:53:37   browsing but as soon as you do anything [TS]

01:53:39   that really strains them like many pro [TS]

01:53:42   types of applications or running chrome [TS]

01:53:44   then the battery life dropped [TS]

01:53:47   tremendously like it like you might get [TS]

01:53:50   10 hours if you're doing light web [TS]

01:53:52   browsing but for hours if you're [TS]

01:53:54   actually pushing it a little hard or two [TS]

01:53:56   hours to be pushing it to the max and [TS]

01:53:58   like this [TS]

01:53:59   huge differences in in like a better [TS]

01:54:02   life under under light loads and better [TS]

01:54:04   life under moderate to heavy loads with [TS]

01:54:06   this guy i fear that we're going more in [TS]

01:54:09   that direction because you just look at [TS]

01:54:10   the specs and you have these these big [TS]

01:54:11   hot chips in there and the one that [TS]

01:54:14   doesn't go in this direction that I'm [TS]

01:54:15   very very interested in is the new [TS]

01:54:18   macbook escape because that one I think [TS]

01:54:20   we need to talk about so the macbook [TS]

01:54:22   escape the new 13-inch low and one with [TS]

01:54:25   the real FM keys is the one that I have [TS]

01:54:29   pre-ordered or ordered I guess that it's [TS]

01:54:32   gonna ride next week that the reason why [TS]

01:54:35   is because as far as i can tell so [TS]

01:54:37   here's here's the weird thing about this [TS]

01:54:39   computer APPL quotes all three of these [TS]

01:54:42   new macbook pros the macbook escape the [TS]

01:54:45   new 13 with the touch bar and new [TS]

01:54:47   15-minute x-bar they quote all three of [TS]

01:54:49   them as having 10 hour battery life and [TS]

01:54:52   if you look at what hardware is in them [TS]

01:54:55   that doesn't quite make sense now the 15 [TS]

01:54:58   of course the victim is a bigger battery [TS]

01:54:59   that makes sense though you know it has [TS]

01:55:01   much more power hungry components in it [TS]

01:55:04   but it has a bigger battery you can kind [TS]

01:55:06   of see that the 13 right 13 with touch [TS]

01:55:09   bar and the 15 touch bar having very [TS]

01:55:11   different components very different [TS]

01:55:12   battery sizes can be made him to have [TS]

01:55:15   the same battery life but the macbook [TS]

01:55:18   escape has effectively the macbook air [TS]

01:55:22   guts in it it has the macbook air [TS]