0:00:00(upbeat music)
0:00:02- Hello and welcome to Connected, episode 344.
0:00:12It's made possible this week by our sponsors,
0:00:14Pingdom, Smile, and Squarespace.
0:00:17My name is Stephen Hackett,
0:00:18and I'm joined as always by Mr. Federico Vittucci.
0:00:22- Hello, hi, it's me, how are you?
0:00:24- I'm good, how are you?
0:00:25- I'm great, thank you.
0:00:27- Good, we're also joined by Myke Hurley.
0:00:29Ahoy!
0:00:30Greetings!
0:00:31Ahoy landlubber!
0:00:33Greetings?
0:00:34Is ahoy like a British thing?
0:00:38It's not a British thing, right?
0:00:39It's a sailing thing.
0:00:40Yeah, it's like a sailing thing and maybe it's a British thing.
0:00:44I think that might be a little combination.
0:00:45Have you ever sailed?
0:00:46Uh, I mean I've been on a boat.
0:00:48Well, that doesn't count as sailing, but like you're not actually doing the sailing yourself.
0:00:52I've never been on a boat with sails, I don't think.
0:00:55Me neither.
0:00:56Just been on boats with like engines.
0:00:59whatever. I would like to go in a sailboat. We need to hire a sailboat. There you go.
0:01:04We know what we're gonna do. But I don't know anybody who has one, so. Well, hire one.
0:01:08I, a friend of mine has a sailboat and he did like this, he kind of traveled the world
0:01:15on a sailboat. He's an incredible person. Like he did this tour. He started in Sardinia
0:01:22in Italy, went to Spain, and from Spain he traveled by himself. He had this whole log
0:01:30on his Instagram, actually. He basically traveled all around Africa, stopped, I believe, in
0:01:39Madagascar, and then left again and reached the Caribbeans. A really fascinating way to
0:01:49spend a year, like he actually did this during the pandemic year, like throughout the basically
0:01:54the entire year of 2020. I mean, not a bad way to spend some time. Not, yeah. Provided you know how
0:02:01to sail a boat, otherwise it's terrible. Yes, otherwise don't do it. Otherwise you don't see
0:02:05the end of the year. Yeah, no. You don't make it a Madagascar, I'll tell you that. Seems very likely.
0:02:11We have a couple of websites we need to point out. Google.com. Yeah, Yahoo. Yahoo. Bing.
0:02:18"Ming", "AltaVista", any others? That's all the websites I know. "Ask Jeeves". "MySpace.com".
0:02:27Nice, that's another good one, top one. "Friendfeed". Oh, remember "Friendsta"? I remember the name,
0:02:35I don't think I was ever on it. Yeah, I don't remember either. Anyway! Jason Thompson, a
0:02:43listener of the show created previously and we failed to mention it, thejeremys.herokuapp.com
0:02:51and it is a running tally of the Jeremy's and so it shows the picks Federico made, the
0:02:58outcome if it was incorrect or correct, and then the final score. Overall your total score
0:03:05is 60% which seems pretty good.
0:03:08That's pretty good. That's much better than I would have expected. What I like specifically
0:03:13about this website is it doesn't just show what Federico guessed like right or
0:03:18wrong it lists every guess he makes which is my favorite thing about this website
0:03:25so and you know so for example Dreamcast face is listed on the face of spiral
0:03:32or tea with holes at the bottom for bubble tea mm-hmm oh yeah look at all
0:03:37these things I've said. I've seen many things. I wonder if a little sip of Grandpa's on here.
0:03:42For flatbread I said base of a pizza left in the middle of a road and someone with a
0:03:47car drove on top of it. Yep. And then I said... And then I said... Non-descript pizza was
0:03:53also... Kiwi meatballs. Kiwi meatballs. I was watching a TV show a couple of days ago,
0:04:02think it's Parks and Rec and Fake Rom was drinking an herbal is it urban mate is that how you say it
0:04:09and we have a mate and uh i was thinking hi he's taking a sip of grandpa so classic uh you skunk
0:04:16he said rat who had too much chili last night oh that's disgusting i hate that
0:04:27What you use to go underwater?
0:04:29The diving mask.
0:04:33Okay, so go check that out. We also have
0:04:36a new website
0:04:39Made by you and as like a new entrant. What is it new challenger?
0:04:44That's the ring
0:04:46by listener Jason, this is rickys.net
0:04:49and this is a
0:04:53in their own words, but I agree, comprehensive repository of information about the ever-evolving
0:04:58Apple prediction game played on connected. It has an about section, there's a github so you can open
0:05:06issues, there are scores and stats which I want to come back to in a second, there is a bill of
0:05:13Ricky's section complete with a full change log. Incredible. Wow. Going back to episode 123.
0:05:22Here's my favorite. 245. Steven said Ricky instead of risky in an iMessage and now they're Ricky
0:05:28pics. And in 259 you proposed naming the competition that after my typo. Yeah. We need to
0:05:39talk about the scores and stats. Yeah, we do. Because there are some people that think
0:05:46that there's cheating going on, but I just want to read our total graded picks, okay? As always,
0:05:56when you see something, it wasn't what I expected. I thought it was very different to this because
0:05:59memories are terrible. Yeah, so let's start with the victories, actually. I have never won an annual
0:06:06competition. Myke has won one time. Federico has won twice. For keynote victories, I've
0:06:16won three times. Myke has won twice. Federico has won three times. So you and I are tied for
0:06:23keynote victories. You know, you like to come out here and swing around accusations of cheating that
0:06:29that you never win. We now have proof that you win plenty. So I'm the Ricky King.
0:06:37Well, no, you're not because we are all tied 5 out of 12 for risky picks. Evenly
0:06:43perfectly tied. Oh that's beautiful. I like that. Yeah, so for the actual
0:06:48risky part it's 5 out of 12 each. But yeah, Federico's won the most
0:06:53predictions, the most overall competitions. Myke is the worst at the
0:06:58flexies but I've lost most of the flexies I have donated $225 Federico
0:07:05175 Myke zero well that's cuz I might not be good but I'm smart right you
0:07:12always add in the extra ones don't you and that that ends up being go down for
0:07:16that's right then we get to coin flips this is incredible we've had three heads
0:07:21and four tails I don't know what that I guess that means in the final I'm not
0:07:25sure where that number comes from I guess the final one. Myke has won one two
0:07:31three four five seven times. Wow. I have won once I won the 2019 WBC knockout
0:07:38flip for first place. Mm-hmm. But Myke has beaten me every other time except
0:07:44once where he beat Federico for second place at 2019's WBC. Matt who's one of
0:07:51our amazing Discord mods calculated that there is a 97% chance of somebody doing worse than
0:07:58me on a coin flip, which is also equal to, there is a 3% chance of me performing as well
0:08:03as I have, so I am very good at coin flips. There is only a 3% chance that I would have
0:08:09been able to do what I have done. So basically I think what we really want to know is, you
0:08:16never want to be up against me in a coin flip, because that's where things are won and lost.
0:08:21I think so. Mostly won by me. It's really painful. It's great. But yeah, definitely go check this
0:08:29out. You can drill down into individual picks and see what round they were in, the score,
0:08:33who made them. It's fantastic. Thank you very much, Jason, for putting this together. Yeah,
0:08:40it's amazing. It's really, truly an incredible achievement. We haven't mentioned that it's
0:08:46called the "Rikipedia". Yes. Like also the name. "Rikipedia". But what is actually even better than this,
0:08:55is like better than maybe anything else I've ever seen on the internet ever, is the fact that it
0:09:01goes all the way back and chronicles every prediction that we've done, including like
0:09:07the audio predictions that we did one year, an air power based set of predictions that we did one
0:09:12year. We did airpower. It's got everything. The audio predictions. Yep. Which I won. So it goes,
0:09:18it begins in 2017 with our annual predictions. Nobody won the airpower game. No, because it
0:09:25never came out. Yeah. But it was when will it come out and none of us picked never.
0:09:29I said airpower will come out the first week of December 2018. I was very confident in this.
0:09:38I was the least confident but still not unconfident enough.
0:09:42It will come out after the 2018 iPhone event was what I guessed.
0:09:45It says winner, nobody.
0:09:47The Wikipedia is on GitHub and if you want you can open an issue, you can fork the repo.
0:09:53It's incredible.
0:09:54Okay.
0:09:55Wow.
0:09:56Don't start opening issues when you lose.
0:09:59We'll see about that.
0:10:00Right?
0:10:01I'd like to open an issue.
0:10:02I've not won enough.
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0:11:26first invoice. Our thanks to Pingdom from SolarWinds for their support of the show
0:11:30and Relay FM. Should we move on to some follow-up? Yeah, in our last episode when we were
0:11:37talking a little bit about air-tacks Federico recommended a topic for
0:11:42"Ungenious" which is another show that me and Steven host about weird Wikipedia
0:11:46articles and he recommended that we look into something called the "Quadro Tracker".
0:11:49We just did it for our most recent episode. I recommend you go and listen to
0:11:53it because it's bananas. It's fantastic. I didn't know you actually did it. Well
0:11:58- Well, of course we did.
0:11:59- Yeah, we bumped it to the top of the list.
0:12:02- It's definitely worth listening to.
0:12:03- Beautiful.
0:12:04I mean, the description alone is gonna make you listen.
0:12:07Need to find some drugs or a lost person
0:12:10or maybe a hidden weapon?
0:12:11We have the device just for you.
0:12:13(both laughing)
0:12:15- That's basically it.
0:12:18Hey Federico, how's your email journey going?
0:12:21- It's in a limbo right now.
0:12:25We are back on Gmail.
0:12:27I think what we are considering the most is Fastmail
0:12:32as an alternative service.
0:12:34- Why?
0:12:35- But I don't know, it seems interesting.
0:12:37They have some team collaboration features, I believe.
0:12:40They have this separate like collaborative service
0:12:44that is also made by Fastmail
0:12:46that I don't remember the name of it.
0:12:48- Okay.
0:12:49- Maybe Project Box, something like that.
0:12:52- That's a terrible name.
0:12:53- It's a terrible name.
0:12:54It's like, I cannot remember that name
0:12:56because it's so generic.
0:12:58But yeah, I'm considering that.
0:13:00The problem is that right now we already lost a few emails
0:13:05because of DNS propagation silliness
0:13:09in our transition last week from A to Gmail.
0:13:14And right now, for reasons that I'm sure you, Myke
0:13:20and Steven will totally understand,
0:13:22I cannot afford to have emails be undelivered right now.
0:13:27- It's a busy time.
0:13:29- It's a busy time.
0:13:31And so we have to use this current system
0:13:35that we have right now.
0:13:36We also had to deal-- - Topic box?
0:13:39- Topic box, yes, not project box.
0:13:42- I mean, topic box is not that much better
0:13:44than project box. - Yes, it's not better.
0:13:47- If anything, project box might be better for what the,
0:13:49anyway, yup, okay.
0:13:51And what was I saying?
0:13:54So yeah, we're using Gmail.
0:13:56We're still dealing with some DNS stuff and email
0:14:01authentication and that kind of stuff.
0:14:02But at the very least, we have working email
0:14:05that we can send and receive.
0:14:07And that's all that matters right now.
0:14:10But we exported everything out of, hey,
0:14:12I confirmed that we got everything we needed.
0:14:16I canceled my subscription, let a few days pass.
0:14:20And as of last night, I also deleted my Hey account.
0:14:24So we are now, well, we're not completely gone
0:14:26because I guess Basecamp will keep data for 30 days
0:14:30and for like sort of last ditch attempt
0:14:34to backup purposes for 60 days.
0:14:36Like they say, they're gonna delete our data in 30 days,
0:14:40but we will be able to request a backup in 60 days,
0:14:43which is kind of confusing.
0:14:44Like when will my data be gone from your servers?
0:14:47Still, we're gone now.
0:14:49So that's all that matters actually.
0:14:52Yeah. Using Gmail, using Spark as per your suggestion, Myke,
0:14:58because that's like the most basic version of collaboration
0:15:02that John and I were able to find with something
0:15:06that we were already familiar with.
0:15:08- That's great.
0:15:09- I like Spark.
0:15:11I really dislike the iPad version
0:15:14because it doesn't use the native multi-column layout.
0:15:17- Yeah, I was listening to App Stories
0:15:18and I hadn't thought of that before,
0:15:20and then I hated to know it, right?
0:15:22Like I hadn't considered it, but when you said it,
0:15:24I was like, "God damn it," right?
0:15:26Because now, whenever I use the iPad app,
0:15:28I'm acutely aware of needing to swipe over
0:15:31to get the folders.
0:15:33- Yeah, yeah.
0:15:34But it's fine.
0:15:35I really like a few things that Spark does,
0:15:39like Todoist integration,
0:15:42which we're gonna talk about that later
0:15:43as to why that matters.
0:15:47They have the, obviously, the ability to chat.
0:15:50I have never used, will never use,
0:15:53and I wish I could wipe it from settings,
0:15:56the quick reaction thing.
0:15:58Like, you know, how in Spark they want you to react
0:16:03to messages with like this--
0:16:05- I feel like I never see that.
0:16:06- I think you can turn it off, maybe.
0:16:08- You can turn it off,
0:16:09but you cannot actually delete it from,
0:16:12like you can delete, I believe, some of the emoji,
0:16:15But at the very least, you've got to keep two emoji in settings,
0:16:18even if you don't use quick replies.
0:16:20I don't know. It's silly.
0:16:21I don't understand why that --
0:16:23-I think those emoji are for the Teams thing, though.
0:16:26'Cause they have, like, emoji reactions
0:16:30in the chat stuff, like Slack does.
0:16:33So I think that might be what that's for.
0:16:35-Still, like, I don't love it for --
0:16:38Yeah, I mentioned on an app store.
0:16:39It's like they have this weird mix going on
0:16:42of some native UI elements and some custom stuff.
0:16:47And it's kind of a strange mix, visually speaking.
0:16:49Sometimes you get a totally custom menu,
0:16:52and other times you get a native context menu, for example.
0:16:56And it's this kind of odd combination.
0:16:57I wish they were able to
0:16:59unify the design language a little bit.
0:17:02But it's fine.
0:17:03I mean, overall, it's fine.
0:17:04I can share messages, I can collaborate with John.
0:17:06It's okay.
0:17:08But we'll see.
0:17:09Maybe, maybe, what's the name?
0:17:11topic box. Yeah, maybe that I will consider. But after I'm done with the, you know, not
0:17:18right now because I cannot switch DNS again right now.
0:17:21Yeah, I mean, and the thing is that it's also, I guess, if you stay with Spark, it doesn't
0:17:25matter what email service you use.
0:17:27Exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally.
0:17:30Because their chat thing is just built into a Spark account and then they just do whatever
0:17:34they're doing to put it all together.
0:17:38Yeah, I need to move from "hey" but I've got like...
0:17:43I'm working with someone right now on a project and I gave them...
0:17:48They needed an email address because they're setting up like a web thing for me.
0:17:52And I created a "hey" email address for them.
0:17:55And I really... and now I have to like deal with this other person's email address as
0:18:01well as my own, you know?
0:18:02And that's like so frustrating to me.
0:18:03I have to be like "hey, you know I made you sign up for that email service that you probably
0:18:07didn't want to use, well now I need you to go here, download your inbox file, take it
0:18:13over to here, and it's like, "Ah, I think I'm going to wait until this project's done
0:18:18then and I'm going to move."
0:18:19And for me, it was like, as I said last time, I don't think I was ever going to stay on
0:18:22Hey because I just fundamentally don't like it, but I'm going to move everything back
0:18:29to Gmail, I think.
0:18:30I'm glad I never left.
0:18:31I'm really glad I didn't move my email around.
0:18:37We got some more information about the new 24 inch iMac.
0:18:42Apple put up a support document on the 30th
0:18:45that caught my eye.
0:18:47They say that under normal circumstances,
0:18:52it is only seven decibels in volume.
0:18:56So it does have two fans.
0:18:58There are little fans there under the chin
0:19:00because the whole computer's under the chin.
0:19:03Seven decibels, I looked it up.
0:19:04So I have some common sounds and how loud they are in decibels.
0:19:09A chainsaw is 120 decibels.
0:19:13- Oh, I thought you were gonna say, like, seven decibels.
0:19:16A chainsaw.
0:19:17I was like, "Oh, that's not quiet."
0:19:18- A chainsaw from eight miles away.
0:19:20Chainsaw is 120 decibels.
0:19:23That's above the threshold of pain.
0:19:25- Chainsaw would hurt.
0:19:26- Concert, generally between 108 and 115 decibels or so.
0:19:32About 110 decibels is the threshold of pain for most people.
0:19:37If a jet flies over you at 1,000 feet, it's 100 decibels.
0:19:41I don't know when you have the opportunity
0:19:43to measure how high a plane is.
0:19:44That one's not super helpful.
0:19:46- Hashtag relatable.
0:19:47- Garbage disposal or dishwasher, factory floor.
0:19:50That's about 80 decibels.
0:19:5370 decibels is about the sound of road noise in a car
0:19:58or like a normal human conversation.
0:20:0070 decibels is the high end of that.
0:20:02You have like a conversation at home is maybe 50,
0:20:09a library is about 40.
0:20:11The whisper of rustling leaves is 20,
0:20:15and breathing is 10.
0:20:17And below 10, most people can't hear anything.
0:20:20I certainly can't.
0:20:21- So the iMac is just incredibly gently breathing.
0:20:24- Effectively silent under everyday use.
0:20:28- Don't like that at all. - Which is really cool.
0:20:30I'm an iMac.
0:20:32Hello.
0:20:33Hello, I'm running Finder.
0:20:35Now I'm running Dropbox!
0:20:37I am so happy.
0:20:39That was good.
0:20:40You know what, I didn't give you the credit.
0:20:42It took a second for that joke to land on me.
0:20:44That was a very good joke.
0:20:46I'm very pleased that the ship dates have continued to slip on this computer.
0:20:51So you don't rage buy one?
0:20:53I'm having a editing challenge at the moment
0:20:56that my MacBook Pro can handle significantly better than my iMac Pro.
0:21:01Yeah.
0:21:02So I'm working on a member special right now where there are... you will probably
0:21:09understand this more Steven than maybe a bit, like in logic every little section
0:21:14is called an event. It's like we... this one has over 5,000 events. It's obscene.
0:21:20It's obscene what I'm... what's happening.
0:21:22You have created something you shouldn't have.
0:21:24Yeah, I had somebody help me and they edit with strip silence and strip silence creates all those little anyway
0:21:30Jason my iMac Pro there wasn't Jason
0:21:33When I
0:21:37Drag so if I select all forward and drag and I got like say like 4,500 events my iMac Pro beach balls
0:21:44Right my m1 not a problem, you know what you need my m1 MacBook Pro. How does it fine?
0:21:52You know you need to do you need to buy an iMac
0:21:54No, and well I've got the Mac Pro now right, but like basically my thinking is well now
0:22:01I'm kind of coming to the realization that this iMac Pro
0:22:05Would performs worse than a 24 inch iMac would for me
0:22:09Some of my tasks, so I'm I'm staying strong. I'm doing all of this editing on the MacBook Pro, but I
0:22:17Cannot wait for a computer to replace my own Mac Pro now like I have
0:22:21Even more so like I've actually I have hit an issue
0:22:25Man, I'm so pleased I have this maggle pro because I would be pulling my hair out at this point trying to edit this project
0:22:31Like I honestly don't know how it would do it. Mm-hmm. Yes
0:22:35Yeah, I'm just I'm just pleased that that these things aren't immediately available
0:22:39That's good for me. They've slipped and then I saw an article
0:22:44Today as well that the especially the 12.9 inch
0:22:47iPad pro is also way out into mid-july. It's like July
0:22:53Yeah, I think they're being conservative a little bit too, but there definitely are shortages. Yeah, maybe like
0:23:01I don't know if you too cuz I can't remember a time when a product had like a listed window after you buy it
0:23:09it. Can either of you think of that? Like my, the iron pad that I bought for Idina,
0:23:13like the delivery date is like 21st to 28th of May. Yeah it's demand, it's
0:23:18chip shortage, and I agree with you I think they probably are being a little
0:23:22conservative in case something happens. They would rather over deliver than come
0:23:28back to you and say "oh you thought you were getting it this week but you really
0:23:31you're getting it in three more weeks." Right, that's not a good look for anyone.
0:23:34Yeah, it would be weird. Like, that would feel super strange for me to Apple, for Apple to contact me and tell me there's a delay on the
0:23:41like that just seems like a very strange thing to occur. Mm-hmm. I would want a personal email from Tim if that was the case.
0:23:48Tim, uh,
0:23:50Tim is the operations guy, right? This is what they do. And so these dates, they're not gonna miss,
0:23:56I don't think. But I will be sure to let you know how good the iMac is when my,
0:24:00Mine gets here for my my review. I could just send it to you when I'm done with it
0:24:04Prom soft. Well, I mean look good in your studio. Oh, it would look great orange is the color I would get
0:24:10Yeah, I mean if you just want to give it to me then great. No, it's not
0:24:14Really what I meant
0:24:16That's the thing. That's what you said. You said I'll just send it to you. That was really can buy it from from
0:24:21512 pixels
0:24:23Interesting and then you can buy well that doesn't make any sense
0:24:28We are we're celebrating
0:24:30Relay membership time the annual specials for our members are rolling out as we speak
0:24:37These are extra episodes of a bunch of our shows
0:24:40Just for relay FM members and so Myke you were on the record sample differences one that published today it published today
0:24:48That was that was quite an honor. I had a great time. I'm gonna listen to that during my bike ride later
0:24:54I think I don't really remember what we spoke about because we started recording at my 1 a.m. Wow
0:24:59So I was a little loopy. That's that's no boy. No, that's no good at all. I think it was good
0:25:04I think it was good for the show. Yeah, sometimes you got to make sacrifices, you know
0:25:08Yeah for your for your content on on genius. We talked about Star Wars day May the 4th and
0:25:14The connected one is out and it made a lot of people feel really special inside
0:25:18So there's lots more coming you can get those no matter what show you're a member of
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0:25:46Federico, you may be getting your wish. So tell us about this report of Apple Music High
0:25:53Yeah, so there's a couple of things here that are interesting. So according to this website
0:25:59called HitsDoubleDaily, spotted by Myke Rumors, they're saying that Apple plans to unveil
0:26:07a higher fidelity version of Apple Music within the, they say, the coming weeks. And they
0:26:13also mentioned that there will be some new generation, some new AirPods to go along with
0:26:19So, "It's Double Daily" is saying that Apple is working on Apple Music Hi-Fi, basically,
0:26:25that new AirPods will be the product paired, like officially speaking, with this new version
0:26:32of Apple Music, and it's expected to cost, well, actually the same current price of Apple
0:26:38Music, which is $9.99 a month.
0:26:42So this is fascinating for a few reasons.
0:26:44Obviously, the price.
0:26:46If that is correct, and if Apple is actually going to do a lossless high-resolution tier
0:26:51for Apple Music at $10 a month, they would be undercutting the entire competition in
0:26:58this field, including Amazon with Amazon Music HD, which I believe is $15 a month.
0:27:05So pricing-wise, if this is true, I kind of get the feeling that Apple is not going to
0:27:15make it a... So this is my theory. If this is correct, that there's not going to be like
0:27:21a price increase for this, maybe it's not going to be a separate tier. They're just
0:27:26going to say "Oh, and we updated the Apple Music stream quality, and now it's high resolution
0:27:33and there's no change for you." Sort of like how they dropped 4K movies on iTunes without
0:27:38having to raise prices at all. They've done it with music before, like iTunes Plus. The
0:27:44The Digital Master version?
0:27:46At a certain point they just put all the quality up, even on old songs, and you could upgrade them for free.
0:27:53Yep, and even when they did the Apple Digital Masters on the iTunes Store, they didn't raise the prices.
0:28:01So if this is correct, maybe they are going to repeat what happened in the past.
0:28:06They're just going to say, "Yeah, we raised the quality."
0:28:09Well I also wondered if they have like the regular Apple Music costs like $5.99
0:28:14they just reduce the price of the standard tier and then $9.99 gets you the
0:28:19higher tier. One of the reasons I thought they might want to do that is
0:28:23because Apple Music on its own is really expensive now compared to Apple One. Like
0:28:30so Apple Music on its own is $10 a month and Apple One is $15 a month and then
0:28:35you also get Arcade, TV Plus, and iCloud.
0:28:39So I don't know, maybe that could be,
0:28:41or they could do what you're suggesting of like,
0:28:43just hey, it's 10 bucks now and that's everything.
0:28:47But that doesn't come with its own
0:28:49branding opportunity though, right?
0:28:51Because, so here's the thing,
0:28:53like going on what you were saying,
0:28:55and what you've been talking about before,
0:28:57like that Spotify being the main one
0:29:00will also have something called Spotify HiFi,
0:29:03and that's gonna be their high fidelity tier.
0:29:05And if Apple Music don't have this as a tier,
0:29:07people might think that they don't have high fidelity.
0:29:10You know what I mean?
0:29:10Yeah, totally.
0:29:12That is the problem.
0:29:13So I don't know.
0:29:14I kind of hope that it's going to be a separate thing
0:29:17and that they are actually going to match
0:29:19what the rest of the industry is doing in this regard, which
0:29:23is why I find this detail on the pricing interesting.
0:29:27Also, like, what a terrible time, though, for them to say,
0:29:30oh, hey, we're doing something that
0:29:31cost exactly the same as Spotify again. Right? With the European Union stuff?
0:29:36Yeah. Right? Where it's like, oh yeah but they we're gonna charge the same price if
0:29:40they want to do it we'll take 30% from them. But going back as well to that
0:29:43AirPods thing you mentioned, does that seem like the right product pairing? Like
0:29:48the regular AirPods with a high fidelity audio service? No, not at all. Not at all.
0:29:53I don't think you want to listen to high fidelity music with a bunch of teeny
0:29:58tiny AirPods. Yeah. What if they took the HomePod mini and made a
0:30:03bigger version of it? Wouldn't that be called a HomePod? I think that'd be a
0:30:06pretty interesting product that Apple's never explored. Oh I see what you're
0:30:09doing. I see what you're saying. I'm like what is he talking about? That took me a
0:30:12minute. Yeah Apple's really successful HomePod mini. They should make a bigger
0:30:15one. They should make a bigger one. HomePod bigger. So here's my other question for
0:30:20you two. So they're saying within the coming weeks will this be pre WWDC?
0:30:25Would it be iOS 15? Would they announce it at WWDC?
0:30:29Here's where it gets interesting.
0:30:31So 9to5Mac reported this, MacRumors reported this.
0:30:34I was also shown these code strings a few weeks ago and I kept silent.
0:30:40But basically in iOS 14.6 Beta 1, there's a bunch of different code references
0:30:49references to things like Dolby Atmos, Dolby Audio, and Lossless within the music app.
0:30:57So in the files for the music app in the 14.6 Beta 1 firmware, there's these references
0:31:08in the music app.
0:31:10And it seems to me like iOS 14...
0:31:15So my theory is that iOS 14.6 will be out before WWDC and this will be part of that
0:31:20announcement.
0:31:21I don't know, I just, I think it'll be kinda strange to see 14.6 as part of a WWDC keynote
0:31:31video where they also announce iOS 15, right?
0:31:35Yeah.
0:31:36Wouldn't that be a little strange?
0:31:38Like there's a new feature and we're gonna talk about it and there's some changes happening
0:31:43to Apple Music and now also let's talk about the next version of iOS.
0:31:48I don't know it feels like...
0:31:49I mean maybe it could be like we're so excited for this we don't want to wait till the fall.
0:31:53We want everyone to enjoy this now you know.
0:31:56Maybe maybe.
0:31:57Yeah like it they could they could have it as part of the Apple Music and Apple Music
0:32:02part of WWDC right so like maybe they have some features in music that they want to show
0:32:08off of iOS 15 and they'll say oh and hey we've got this new service that we're rolling out
0:32:12from today that will... but like I expect personally if this does happen, if this is
0:32:19happening soon, it will probably be a press release.
0:32:23This feels like press release material to me, yes.
0:32:25But at the same time I could also imagine them holding it for a little bit longer now,
0:32:31because I don't know but it seems it's a bit of a rough go at the moment, right?
0:32:38I don't know how much you would really want to continue to shine a light on
0:32:46competitiveness in the music streaming service world. Like I don't know if now
0:32:50is the right time. I also don't know if they would care but I think that an
0:32:54argument could be made for one of the potential reasons why AirTags were so
0:32:59delayed was that they were trying to get out ahead of the tile thing by putting
0:33:02the Find My Network in place first. Because I feel pretty confident
0:33:07in my assumption that the Find My Network maybe never would have existed
0:33:12or definitely wouldn't have existed before air tax, right, in a different
0:33:16regulatory environment or like threat of legal environment. It seems very strange
0:33:21for Apple to be like we're doing this thing oh and here's our thing. It kind of
0:33:25feels like it would have been the other way around if anything. So I don't know
0:33:28but I stand by what we've said in the past on the show like Apple should do
0:33:34this. They should have done this a long time ago considering the type of
0:33:37of hardware that they sell. But as we also spoke about, it's going to be interesting
0:33:41to see how much higher quality can they go and what hardware they as well actually support
0:33:47that. Did you see Arnold Kim's tweet about Hits Daily Double? Yeah. I'll read it.
0:33:53The last time we reported on a rumor from Hits Daily Double was way back in 2001. They
0:33:58They predicted a device called the iPod.
0:34:04The post is one sentence on MacRumors.
0:34:07"iPod, a portable hard drive for music that will feature a FireWire connection for extra
0:34:12fast data transfer."
0:34:13They, uh, they got it right.
0:34:16That is like the ultimate mic drop.
0:34:19Like the last time we linked to these folks, they predicted the iPod.
0:34:22That's pretty good.
0:34:25That's all you need to know.
0:34:26I love the MacRumors post.
0:34:28Yeah, all of these old MacRumors posts from 20 years ago used to be like that.
0:34:36Oh, 20 years ago!
0:34:38Oh, that's a horrible thing you just said.
0:34:41This is one of the things I love about MacRumors.
0:34:44The fact that the website has been around for two decades, and the fact that Arn remembers
0:34:48this stuff, and every so often links to these old posts on MacRumors.
0:34:54It's kind of like what I hope I can do someday with Mac stories, which, you know, we've been
0:35:00around 12 years, which is a pretty good time in internet years, but MacRumors has a much,
0:35:05much longer history. And that's one of the many things I love about the website, that
0:35:10they can do this kind of stuff. And you go back in time and you can see the comments
0:35:14on this post. Truly incredible. Yeah. Good job. It's daily double.
0:35:20Yeah, the "It" being 20 years ago, you know, I've been doing that 2001 Revisited series,
0:35:28and it's very upsetting every time, because I have a long list of things in what month
0:35:34they're in, and it's like, yeah, like OS X, I get it, but then like some of the things
0:35:38later on the list is like, oh no, like, that's really upsetting, including the iPod.
0:35:46When is the 20 years at the iPod?
0:35:48It's in October.
0:35:49It's in the fall.
0:35:50October.
0:35:51Speaking of things that haven't been updated in 20 years, the iPad Mini is back in the
0:35:56rumor cycle.
0:35:57That was good.
0:35:58That was really good.
0:35:59You're really good at this, Stephen.
0:36:00You should be a podcaster.
0:36:06We have all wanted the iPad Mini to become more like the iPad Pro and now the iPad Air
0:36:12with flat sides and little bezels.
0:36:13We think it'd be really, really awesome.
0:36:16But it seems like that may not be the case.
0:36:19So Myke, what is the current word on the street?
0:36:22- Yeah, so there was some reports from Ming-Chi Kuo,
0:36:25who's also reporting this today, a while ago.
0:36:27We actually spoke about them ages ago on the show,
0:36:30about there being an update,
0:36:31but that Kuo was expecting it to still have a Touch ID
0:36:34home button, still have a lightning port,
0:36:36but have a larger display and some slimmer bezels.
0:36:39And it was disappointing then,
0:36:41but the thing that's become more disappointing about this
0:36:43is now this product is not expected to be released
0:36:46until the second half of 2021.
0:36:48So by the time this product actually comes out, that is going to look so old.
0:36:55Because Apple, especially because I think the rest of this year
0:36:59is going to see some quite aggressive product design from Apple,
0:37:02right, with the Macs. I think we're going to see some pretty
0:37:05like incredible looking design there. And at that point
0:37:10it will basically just be the original iPad
0:37:13and the iPad mini that don't have that iPad Pro inspired flat side design.
0:37:18And I think it's just going to look really odd to be like,
0:37:21"Here's our new iPad Mini."
0:37:23And it's like still got a home button, right?
0:37:25It's like still curved around the edges.
0:37:27Like it's going to,
0:37:29this product would have been more acceptable
0:37:31if they would have released it a couple of weeks ago.
0:37:33I think like six, seven months from now,
0:37:36it's going to really stick out, I think.
0:37:40- But remember, like, so the way I think Apple thinks
0:37:42about it is the iPad Air and the iPad Pro are a pair,
0:37:47and the iPad mini and the cheap iPad are a pair,
0:37:51which I disagree with,
0:37:53'cause the iPad mini is more premium,
0:37:55at least in price, than the cheap iPad.
0:37:58So maybe it's like until the regular iPad is ready,
0:38:02the iPad mini doesn't get anything new either,
0:38:04which bums me out,
0:38:05but I can kind of see how that would make sense.
0:38:08- But I agree with the idea of thinking
0:38:11that they're pairings or whatever,
0:38:13but I still think that they should update the design
0:38:16them and pair them. Like you know like Apple make Touch ID power buttons now
0:38:21rather than home buttons. We'll put that on it and get rid of the home button
0:38:25from the front and now you know now we're starting to talk right like if it
0:38:29would still look way more modern if they just got rid of the home button even and
0:38:33you know they were able to make the device physically smaller at that point
0:38:36and it'd be great but yeah I just think you know I would be intrigued by this
0:38:41device depend also it depends on the internals as well for me like what chip
0:38:45that I put in it, like I think, because you know the iPad Mini with the A12 in it right
0:38:50now is really aged and you know I'd be worried, I hope they would put an A14 in it at least.
0:38:56But yeah I just think that this isn't the product that I want it to be and you know
0:39:01I feel a little bit sad about thinking that it's also going to be a really long time until
0:39:06we see one.
0:39:07I'm so sad about this, I was really hoping that we're going to do the small iPad Pro
0:39:12device which is perfect for reading because I really oh this is a whole thing I really
0:39:22I've gone back to reading things on the iPad and by things I mean articles it's a whole
0:39:29story didn't you just get a Kindle and like do the whole thing no he got he got something
0:39:33else didn't he what was it like kobo or something yeah that didn't work out huh man it's yeah
0:39:40Who would ever switch between things like readers or task managers?
0:39:43I know.
0:39:44Email service calls.
0:39:45It's like a diss.
0:39:46How would you say flip flop in Italian?
0:39:48Ah, see that's an interesting question.
0:39:51Well, we don't say flip flop.
0:39:53If any Italians are listening to this, please get in touch with me on Twitter.
0:39:57I think we would say Volta Gabana, but I'm not positive.
0:40:03Can you tell me that more slowly, please?
0:40:06Are you texting it to me?
0:40:08It's in the Discord.
0:40:10I'm pretty sure... hold on.
0:40:12Volta Gabana?
0:40:13Yes, Volta Gabana.
0:40:14Okay. So we have Flip-Flop and Volta Gabana.
0:40:17Uh, yeah. Somebody who changes ideas and opinions.
0:40:20For... see, that's the thing that I don't like about this word, which is kind of...
0:40:24Somebody changes opinions and ideas for their own... or like for... because they are opportunistic
0:40:32or for personal gain with great ease and quickly.
0:40:38I would say personal gain with great ease and quickly.
0:40:41Okay, so there's a, the synonym of that "bande-ruola" is also very good. I will go with that. Which
0:40:47literally means "little flag". Bande-ruola. Can you again put that in the Discord so I
0:40:52can try and say it? Yes.
0:40:55Because I struggle to hear the letters. Okay, it's B-A-N-D-E-R-U-O-L-A. All those sounds
0:41:03at the end there are difficult for me. Try and say that.
0:41:06Yes, that's pretty good.
0:41:08Okay, bandero alla and flip flop. There we go.
0:41:10I don't know if there's a particularly British English, or just English, term for this.
0:41:16I'd have to think if there's something more British, but I'm not a flip flopper or a bandero alla like you two, so no problem here.
0:41:24In any case, I'm really sad that they're not making that iPad Pro Mini.
0:41:29Well, unless they do make an iPad Pro Mini.
0:41:32Where's Johnny Ive when you need him?
0:41:34Johnny wouldn't stand for this. What is Johnny doing anyway?
0:41:38Nothing. Nothing. Enjoying retirement.
0:41:41Well, no, he works at Airbnb, doesn't he? You consult for Airbnb.
0:41:44Ah, yes. Oh my god, I totally forgot this was a true story, right?
0:41:48Yeah, because it was one of those things that was like, they announced it and then that
0:41:51was the end of that, right? Like, they announced it in October and then, like, we never heard
0:41:56anything more about it, but... Designing the future of Airbnb.
0:42:00Mm-hmm.
0:42:02And it's all that there is to the story.
0:42:04But to be fair, if it was just announced,
0:42:06it's hardly likely they would have anything to show for a long time.
0:42:08Right, sure.
0:42:10Yeah, I mean, look how long it took him to redesign the iMac.
0:42:12He had to leave, so...
0:42:14He had to leave to get that done.
0:42:16Can't wait to see the first Apple LoveFrom collaboration.
0:42:18Right? They were supposed to be working together for a long time.
0:42:20Ah, LoveFrom.
0:42:22Can't wait to see that.
0:42:24Can't wait to see the first collaboration.
0:42:26Maybe it's the AirTags, which is literally a white button.
0:42:28a white button. No he would never like Johnny would never have a removable battery surely.
0:42:35Right you're sure you're right you're right you wouldn't do that. All right.
0:42:40This episode of Connected is brought to you by TextExpander from our friends at SMILE.
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0:44:54AirTags!
0:44:56- Feels like they came out forever ago, doesn't it?
0:44:59- It was just Friday.
0:45:01It was like four or five days ago.
0:45:03- They're kind of boring, right?
0:45:05- So here's my thing.
0:45:08It's fun to set them up.
0:45:11It's fun to try them out for the first time.
0:45:15And then that's it.
0:45:16What I like, I feel like I have a very attractive key ring now.
0:45:21I have the brown one, the leather brown one.
0:45:24And I have the little white disk inside.
0:45:25And it's got my initials on it.
0:45:27And I think that's a very nice looking key ring.
0:45:29And I'm happy I have the key ring.
0:45:31It's also like it's big enough that it's easy to grab.
0:45:34So I have something so I reach into my pocket.
0:45:36And it's just an easy thing for me to grab there.
0:45:38Nice, easy, very happy.
0:45:40But I guess the whole point of this product
0:45:43is like you are betting on your future with it, right?
0:45:45- The thing about the EarthTags is that
0:45:48it's a difficult product to enjoy
0:45:51because as a product it's predicated upon the idea
0:45:54of something bad happening to you.
0:45:56And so like, can you enjoy EarthTags?
0:46:00Well, yeah, you can if you lose your stuff
0:46:02and that's not fun, you know?
0:46:04So I also put them on my car keys.
0:46:07I have now a fancy EarthTag, you know,
0:46:10I have a sort of a key fob and air tag and Zelda themed key ring setup going on.
0:46:19Did you get engraved?
0:46:20Did you do engraving?
0:46:21No, I'm not an engrave type person myself.
0:46:26I wasn't and I'm not with anything else but for me the engraving on the air tags I think
0:46:30is the move.
0:46:31I think that's the way to go.
0:46:32I only engrave my body with tattoos.
0:46:35Interesting.
0:46:36Not my objects.
0:46:37Yes.
0:46:38Can you imagine if they offered the full emoji set, we could all get weird fish air tags?
0:46:42See in that case I would do it.
0:46:44Same.
0:46:45In that case I would make an exception.
0:46:48They really need to find a way to do that.
0:46:49I understand the issues like in just in logistics of having every single emoji.
0:46:56No I don't.
0:46:57When you have two trillion dollar, when you're a two trillion dollar company I don't understand
0:47:01the issue with supporting the full emoji set.
0:47:03I understand that it's difficult but they should find a way to make it happen is the
0:47:06end.
0:47:07I'm sure it must be hard. Fix it. I want every emoji available to me so I can choose.
0:47:13I, uh, yeah, we bought several. They're on keys and then bags and I got one in my truck
0:47:19for some reason. I'm using the Belkin keychain. So they have two. They have one that comes
0:47:25with a ring and the one that comes with like a, like a loop that's on some sort of string.
0:47:33are the ones we I used in mine and Mary's bags I think looped him around a
0:47:37zipper on the inside mm-hmm I like the Belkin keychain I mean it's like black
0:47:41plastic but the and I have an Apple one here I got the red one and I just I
0:47:47don't love the leather look I don't know that the Belkin one is it's not are you
0:47:53talking about the loops what which all the key ring well with Belkin I like the
0:48:01look of both better than anything Apple does. Wow that's interesting. I don't like
0:48:06the Belkin keyring. I love the Apple keyring. Yeah I have the Belkin keyring
0:48:11on my keys. Okay I like the look of the leather loop ones but I'm not convinced
0:48:16that they're right for like a backpack. I think maybe the like Belkin secure
0:48:20holder thing is probably better for a backpack. Yeah. But I haven't I have one
0:48:24of those but I haven't used it yet just cuz like I just have just like very
0:48:27large like piece of leather just like on the bag now I don't know I don't like
0:48:33the bulk and curing them why is this because it looks cheap it's not the
0:48:37cheapness what I think I think I said this on upgrade but it kind of makes it
0:48:41look more like a toy like just with it being like plastic rather than leather
0:48:46I don't know it just has more of like a toy look to it especially for some of
0:48:50the colors you can get it in yeah I think it's like a rounded plastic I
0:48:56I think kind of evokes toy to me.
0:48:59- I mean, it's not fancy by any means.
0:49:02You're not particularly nice, but it works.
0:49:06So I have a stack of them here
0:49:07'cause I haven't used them all.
0:49:10So again, like we said last time,
0:49:12I think when we travel, they'll be more useful.
0:49:14They're here, they're fun.
0:49:18The family sharing thing, people have talked about this,
0:49:20where the way it works is if you travel
0:49:26an unknown air tag, there's a setting to say, hey, this air tag belongs to somebody I know,
0:49:31don't bother me about it for 24 hours, or don't bother him out. Don't bother me about it ever
0:49:37again. And that's fine. And an Apple's gone the conservative route here. And I think that should
0:49:43be the default the way that works. But I do wish for an option to say, hey, any air tag, you know,
0:49:49set up by my spouse I'm I'm fine with it being where I am and I think that would
0:49:56be a little bit less annoying than the current setup again I think the current
0:50:00setup should remain I think what I'm saying should be an option for safety
0:50:04reasons there isn't really a good option for family sharing it just isn't like
0:50:09you can't share an air tag and I find that all you can tell your phone is to
0:50:14ignore it. Yeah. And, and so if my wife takes my truck or my keys or both, you
0:50:20know, she's going to get a message that an AirTag is gonna follow her around.
0:50:24She's got to tell her her phone to ignore that, and I just think that could
0:50:29be a little bit nicer. And I always find it frustrating when Apple has a new
0:50:34feature or product that just doesn't work with family sharing, because so much
0:50:39of it just ignores the fact that people sometimes know and even live with other
0:50:44people. Again it's like Federico said, I'm sure we'll have more stories, we could potentially
0:50:49have more stories to tell about them in the future, but it is very much like a "well,
0:50:54I have it now, now I just need to wait to see what it's like if I lose something." You
0:50:58kind of just have to wait. Honestly I bought them and I'm pretty sure I'm never going to
0:51:04use them because I never lose anything, so as we all know. So we obviously spent a lot
0:51:09of time talking about Hey last week, got a lot of great feedback and follow up about
0:51:13episode which I appreciated or base camp I should say. There's been a
0:51:19bunch of stuff happening since and I just wanted to touch on it kind of as
0:51:22follow-up more than anything else. So there's another really great Casey Newton
0:51:25article. It was in the Casey's newsletter platformer and also cross post on the
0:51:31Verge as well which kind of details an all-hands meetings at base camp so all
0:51:39and all employee meeting which occurred after the everything kicked off last week.
0:51:45One detail that was kind of flabbergasting to me was that the way that Basecamp's employees
0:51:50found out about the policy changes was the blog post that Jason Free posted.
0:51:55They never actually consulted or even informed the employees at Basecamp about these changes
0:52:01before they just went ahead and told the world how great they were at making them.
0:52:05a lot of information that came out from people that were on the call giving quotes to Casey
0:52:10Newton as to how it went and the internal call was just like it just seemed like a cavalcade
0:52:15of disasters honestly. We won't go into it all here because there's a lot like I actually
0:52:20just really recommend reading this article but it you know this call was so bad that
0:52:25it led to over 20 of Basecamp 57 employees choosing to leave the company and there seems
0:52:30to be more of them leaving still. So you know we're talking we're like
0:52:36approaching half of the company has left after this and I think it was yesterday
0:52:41Jason Fried published a blog post both Jason Fried and David Hanemeyer-Hansen
0:52:46went quiet a couple of days ago which they weren't before. Which is weird for one of them.
0:52:50Yeah my expectation is that they are working with a crisis management company.
0:52:54I don't know this but would be my expectation because it's like all of a
0:52:59sudden they just went quiet like they need someone else exist oh yeah it's a
0:53:03whole industry yes like it's a part it's a part of public relations okay it's a
0:53:07part of PR like crisis management and it can form it can take many forms it can
0:53:11be something you've done or something that's happened to you right so like a
0:53:15company your company's done something that didn't mean to do and now you're in
0:53:19a crisis and so you need public relations help to deal with that I don't
0:53:23know that they're that this is happening but also at the same time with the
0:53:26considering the situation that they found themselves in right now and they are a serious
0:53:30company, I would suggest that they probably should look into it. Like, how do you get
0:53:35out of this?
0:53:36I mean, they were in the New York Times over the weekend. That's not what you want.
0:53:40Not great. So, you know, Jason Freeh pushed another Hey World post where he makes an apology
0:53:46on behalf of the company, but there's no reversal of decisions. I think he's very kind would
0:53:55be a word to use maybe about the staff that have left, you know, they said some nice things
0:54:00about them and kind of like saying, "Hey, well this is what we're doing now and this
0:54:06is how we're going to move forward." So my kind of feeling is, right, like their bed's
0:54:11made, they've made their bed now and now they will lie in it, right? Like this is the decision
0:54:16that they've made, they are happy with the decisions that they've made and this is what
0:54:20I think we said this or at least I said this in last week's episode, they can run their
0:54:24company however they want to, they did a thing, they've had a bunch of reaction, they've taken
0:54:28in the reaction and they decided this is what they want to do, go for it. But then you live
0:54:32with the ramifications of your decisions.
0:54:35Yeah, good luck with that. I just want to clarify how I don't understand exactly what
0:54:40is he apologising for in the blog post. David and I completely own the consequences and
0:54:46we're sorry. So you're sorry for the consequences? Like I don't get it. So this doesn't really...
0:54:51Yeah, that is interesting actually. I hadn't considered that until you just said it. It's
0:54:54like, yeah, you can completely on the consequence. That's fine. What are you actually sorry about?
0:54:59Because you're not changing anything. No. So why, what are you sorry? It's like, I'm
0:55:04sorry you felt that way. You know, it's like one of those kinds of apologies.
0:55:07Sorry that this blew up on Twitter and in public. Like, I don't think they are apologizing
0:55:14for anything. I think they are pretty much set in their ways and good luck with that.
0:55:18Yeah, as I said, like, go for it. Like, I fundamentally disagree with what they're doing,
0:55:24but this is the decision that they've taken, and it's like, look, you've seen, they've seen what's
0:55:29happened to them now, they know what they've done, they know that they've exploded their company,
0:55:32and it's that. I really, like, I am very intrigued to see what happens from here, because 57 people
0:55:39in a company, they've lost 20 of them, some reporting suggesting that, like, it includes
0:55:44their entire iOS stuff. And I just don't know how you continue from something like that.
0:55:52If you don't have an iOS dev team at all, the obvious consequence is that all updates to your
0:55:59mobile apps are going to take a while, right? Yeah. And I don't know how you wholesale replace
0:56:05an entire team. It feels like a massive task because usually it's a slower rolling thing,
0:56:11right? Somebody leaves and then a new person comes in and then that person's trained about
0:56:17the way the company works. And the codebase of the app, like there's a whole thing of the
0:56:23frameworks that you're using, that's the whole stack, right, of the thing that you're building.
0:56:28But to have an entire team just quit, I don't know how you're supposed to deal with that.
0:56:36And from a pure customer perspective,
0:56:41like I wouldn't want to be, and I'm not personally,
0:56:44but I wouldn't want to be in a position where I rely
0:56:46on Basecamp's iOS apps right now.
0:56:50Because who knows when they are going to get updated
0:56:52with fixes or new features, right?
0:56:54- Yeah, as he's being, this is interesting,
0:56:56I thought this is being pointed out in the Discord right now,
0:56:58like a quarter of this post is just talking about
0:57:03how they're running fine.
0:57:05And that could be enough of... that could be why this post exists.
0:57:09Like that could be what it's supposed... is like them attempting to show their customer base.
0:57:15Don't worry about the fact that people have left.
0:57:19Probably. I can see that.
0:57:21Mm-hmm.
0:57:22Also, who's gonna work at Basecamp?
0:57:25Like, let... set aside the fact that people are quitting Basecamp.
0:57:29Now, in theory, they're supposed to hire new people.
0:57:34So like to get the best people, in theory, these people are maybe already employed, they
0:57:38have experience, like that's what they're going to need right now, they can't get a
0:57:41bunch of people that are new to this role.
0:57:44And you kind of feel like if you're looking for a new job, if you just googled, if you
0:57:50didn't know about this company, and you just googled them, it doesn't necessarily seem
0:57:55like an, well, I would say it doesn't seem like an attractive place to work unless, unless,
0:57:59Well, maybe.
0:58:00There are some people in the world who now, your politics is going to align with theirs.
0:58:05Sure, sure.
0:58:07So if you agree with them, maybe this is a great place to work.
0:58:10Mm-hmm.
0:58:11But as we said last time, does that align with Jason Farid and David Hanamaya Hanson's personal worldviews?
0:58:19I don't know.
0:58:21Right? Like, I'm not going to say one way or another, right, like what they believe, because I don't know them.
0:58:26uh as we see you know what they're putting out to the world seems to be not a great world view and
0:58:33this is like one of those things where i said like you look around and you see who you have left and
0:58:39do those people match with your view and i don't know if they're putting out of a view to the world
0:58:46that would suggest it's necessarily a good one i don't know i struggle i really struggle to
0:58:53understand how you would go from being one of the most respected, um, sort of companies
0:59:02in the history of the modern web, right? To make, because they made this happen, right?
0:59:12And having this be your legacy, all this because you couldn't bear the fact that you had to
0:59:21listen to people at the workplace, share their different points of view. Again, it doesn't
0:59:28seem really business savvy to me as a strategy. I find it fascinating in the same way that
0:59:38train wrecks can be fascinating. I honestly don't understand how you could make all of
0:59:48this implode just because of your politics?
0:59:54So somebody said to me--
0:59:55I was talking to a friend about this the other day,
0:59:57and they gave me a point of view that I thought
0:59:59was really intriguing, where people
1:00:03have said about Hannah Meyer Hanson and Freed for years
1:00:09that their whole view of business
1:00:12is that they want to be comfortable,
1:00:15and they just want to do the things that they want to do.
1:00:18And that is, this is not a criticism.
1:00:21Like, this is kind of their whole ethos, right?
1:00:24This is the books that they've written of like,
1:00:25this is why they don't take investment.
1:00:27Like, they just wanna focus on the stuff
1:00:28that they wanna focus on and live their lives like that.
1:00:31- More comfortable than a rich white man in his 40s?
1:00:34I mean, that's a goal.
1:00:35- No, let me finish my point.
1:00:39I know what you're saying, right?
1:00:40But if they have this mentality of just wanting things
1:00:47to be easy in the way that they want them to be.
1:00:50You can imagine how, if that's your prevailing worldview,
1:00:55if people start to challenge you, right?
1:01:00So like, well, this isn't the easy time
1:01:04that we were looking for, and so--
1:01:06- They felt uncomfortable.
1:01:07- Yeah, so they've decided, screw this,
1:01:10we will get rid of this and it will be easy for us again.
1:01:15And I thought that that was an interesting thought.
1:01:18And again, we are making lots of assumptions,
1:01:21but we're just having a conversation.
1:01:23We don't know what's true, 'cause we're not these people,
1:01:26but we can only talk about how it looks from the outside.
1:01:28- There's 20 people leaving the company,
1:01:30surely something must have happened, you know?
1:01:33- Yeah.
1:01:34- And good luck to them, for sure.
1:01:37I think they're gonna need it.
1:01:39We'll see.
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1:03:43What have you done Federico?
1:03:45- So one thing you should know about me is that,
1:03:50well, one of the things,
1:03:51when I say something on the show,
1:03:54it always has a purpose, right?
1:03:56I never say anything accidentally,
1:03:59especially unconnected.
1:04:02So when I leave, you know, little hints here and there
1:04:06of things that I would like to have
1:04:08or things that I would like to do,
1:04:10it's either because I already have them
1:04:12or because I'm already doing them.
1:04:14And I'm just letting you in on my thing
1:04:17without actually telling you,
1:04:19because that can be a thread that can be developed later.
1:04:22Basically, what I'm saying is I'm a great storyteller,
1:04:25especially on connected, yes.
1:04:27And I'm also a confident person, as you can probably.
1:04:33- As one can tell. - Yes.
1:04:36So I remember a while back when I
1:04:38said that one of the many things that really annoys me regarding
1:04:44task management is how I spend most of my time writing
1:04:49articles, notes, documentation.
1:04:53But there's a disconnect between that writing
1:04:56and the actual creation of a task that relates to that
1:05:01document or draft or whatever it is.
1:05:04And I complained about how there's this divide between my text editor and my task manager,
1:05:10and I very often find myself wishing that I could just connect the two of them.
1:05:16There are some ways that can be accomplished, but I was really suggesting a sort of deeper integration.
1:05:24All of that, I would say, discussion a few episodes ago, was based on the idea,
1:05:33and I'm gonna need to contextualize here, that I hired one true John's son Finn, one true John Jr.
1:05:45to make... to make... I feel like we just created a cartoon character.
1:05:56I hired his son to work on custom Obsidian plugins for me.
1:06:02There's so many levels. There's so many levels to what you just said.
1:06:07Yes. I realize that. I realize that. So I'm going to let you decompress for a second,
1:06:15and then we can dive deep into what I've been doing.
1:06:18Okay, so, see, now that's how you do an introduction, just from a storytelling standpoint.
1:06:26Yeah, again, you are a great storyteller.
1:06:28You know, it keeps you wanting more, right? That's the idea of introductions.
1:06:31Yeah, and you are supposed to give more now, so...
1:06:34Yes, I am supposed to. So, okay, so I've been listening to the Mac Power users...
1:06:41No, don't blame me for this. This is Spark's fault.
1:06:44I'm blaming you. I'm crediting you. I'm giving you the credit. You're supposed to be happy.
1:06:49Okay, so let me rephrase. Don't listen to the Mac power users.
1:06:53Yeah, what do they know? What do they know?
1:06:57I've been intrigued by Obsidian for a while, but I always resisted the temptation to use
1:07:04it because it was a desktop-only app. For context, Obsidian is a plain text, note-taking
1:07:11app that is based on just regular plaintext on the file system. You use Obsidian by creating
1:07:20a database called a vault, which is just a folder containing plaintext files. And you
1:07:27may have heard of Obsidian by people who use it because they work in academic environments,
1:07:34or they are students or teachers or researchers.
1:07:39And they usually share all these custom and fancy setups
1:07:44that show you these beautiful graphs of all these connections
1:07:51that they can make between notes.
1:07:53Because one of the core features of Obsidian is--
1:07:55and it's kind of like a joke in tech podcasts--
1:07:59right now, it's backlinking, right?
1:08:02The idea that you can link to any note
1:08:04and you can have these backlinks going,
1:08:06firing off in both directions.
1:08:08So you can link a note to another note
1:08:11and you make these connections
1:08:12and you can see those connections in Obsidian's graph view.
1:08:16And more broadly speaking,
1:08:20there's the whole theme of personal knowledge management
1:08:24that sort of surfaced again in 2020,
1:08:27I believe because of the pandemic, honestly.
1:08:30Like, a lot of people are suddenly interested in products like Roam Research and Obsidian
1:08:37and Notion, from that point of view, because they had a lot of time to spend at home in
1:08:42front of their computers, and they realized, "Oh, well, I am deeply disorganized in all
1:08:48the things that I'm doing, and also it's kind of fun to play around with these apps."
1:08:53But anyway, that's a bigger topic.
1:08:55Back to Obsidian.
1:08:57I resisted trying it because it was desktop only.
1:09:01But then, a couple of months ago, I discovered that Obsidian was actually testing a mobile
1:09:07version for iPhone and iPad, that unlike what the developers suggested last year, it is
1:09:16not a companion-type utility.
1:09:20Like last year, I believe the Obsidian developers said, when we are going to do a mobile version,
1:09:26It's going to be like a sort of companion type, you know, fewer features. It's not going
1:09:32to be the full desktop experience. Thankfully, they changed their minds because...
1:09:36They probably got quite a bit of pushback on that.
1:09:39Yes. Obsidian for iPhone and iPad, which is currently in beta, I think it's in private
1:09:43beta, for the, what they are called, I think, catalyst supporters. They have different tiers
1:09:50of Obsidian membership, I'm going to call it.
1:09:55You can purchase a license, they have different types of licenses, and they have been extended
1:09:59that beta throughout all the different levels of supporters that they have.
1:10:05But it is totally free to use, they have like a 100% free personal use tier, and at the
1:10:11moment you don't get the mobile app, but I'm sure that when it passes beta, you will.
1:10:18So right now the beta, which is on TestFlight and is also available on Android, is available
1:10:22to supporters.
1:10:23And when I realized that it was going to be the full desktop experience on iPhone and
1:10:30iPad, and especially when I realized it's going to support the whole set of customization
1:10:39features that make Obsidian great on the Mac, that's when it clicked for me and I realized
1:10:47I have to try this because it means I will be able to have...
1:10:53and this was sort of like the major realization that I had a couple of months ago...
1:10:57if this is actually true, if they are doing this,
1:11:00there's a good chance that I can finally create my totally custom text editor.
1:11:06And by that I mean I can have custom plugins,
1:11:10custom commands, keyboard shortcuts, custom CSS snippets,
1:11:15custom preview themes and take advantage of all the features that Obsidian has by default,
1:11:20but then build on top of it with my own stuff.
1:11:25How is this stuff built? Like what are the options available for creating your own things?
1:11:31So at a high level you can make plugins.
1:11:34Plugins are this little...
1:11:37Okay, let me back up a little.
1:11:41Obsidian is an Electron app on desktop.
1:11:44Big time.
1:11:44Yes, but I will say this is the only Electron app that I will accept, because it's the very
1:11:54web-based foundation of Obsidian, right? The fact that it's built on top of web technologies
1:12:00that allows it not only to span multiple platforms, but to be easily customizable by a lot of
1:12:08of people using web technologies.
1:12:13You can inspect on the desktop,
1:12:15you can show a web inspector for Obsidian
1:12:19that totally looks like a Safari web inspector.
1:12:22And you can take a look at how the text editor
1:12:24is arranged, for example.
1:12:26And you can make plugins using JavaScript
1:12:28or using Node or using CSS.
1:12:31And it's basically like programming these little web apps
1:12:35that are not web apps are plugins for Obsidian.
1:12:39And all of this is going to apply to iPhone and iPad
1:12:42as well.
1:12:43And so that's plugins.
1:12:45And plugins can do things that go way beyond what you can do,
1:12:51for example, in--
1:12:53like I guess on iOS, you would have drafts,
1:12:57or you would have something like TIO.
1:12:59These plugins can go way beyond that
1:13:03and actually modify the UI of the app itself
1:13:07that are plugins that rearrange the way windows are,
1:13:11the way that panels are created in Obsidian, for example.
1:13:15- Do you think that these will pass through App Review,
1:13:17that the system will pass through App Review?
1:13:18- I don't see why they shouldn't pass,
1:13:22given how you can have something like drafts,
1:13:25you can have something like Pythonista,
1:13:27you can have TIO, you know,
1:13:29all these apps that can be extended.
1:13:30- Maybe this isn't the case anymore,
1:13:32but I know there used to be a thing about creating--
1:13:35- Years ago.
1:13:35- And adapting user interfaces
1:13:37inside of applications was a no-no.
1:13:40- I think years ago, it used to be frowned upon totally.
1:13:44I think they're gonna be fine now.
1:13:46And if they're not gonna be fine,
1:13:47I'll make a big mess about it on Mac stories.
1:13:51So that should be fun.
1:13:52- I think you and Gray will get really upset
1:13:54and shout about it a lot, and David as well.
1:13:58- So plugins are one thing.
1:13:59Then you can make themes, obviously.
1:14:01You can customize the app UI with different colors, different fonts.
1:14:07Themes is not a novel concept, but in Obsidian you get full control over every single element
1:14:15of the app.
1:14:17Because all of this is based on CSS, and I'm simplifying here, but you can make these CSS
1:14:24snippets, for example, that change one particular aspect of Obsidian that you
1:14:31don't like, and you can install this by dropping them in a folder in the
1:14:37Obsidian vault that you're using and enabling them in settings. And for
1:14:42example, a few days ago I wanted to change how search results are displayed
1:14:47and I commissioned the CSS snippet to be made for me,
1:14:54and I copied the CSS text and I saved it as a CSS file,
1:14:58and I dropped it in, and I changed that particular aspect.
1:15:02So the fact that it's an Electron app and that on iOS,
1:15:06it's still going to have that Web API feeling,
1:15:10although not as much as I feared, actually,
1:15:13and it's getting better in the beta,
1:15:15I will accept that because it makes all of this possible, right? But I kind of want to
1:15:22explain why this is all so fascinating to me.
1:15:28I need to just stop you just before you do, because obviously that's going to be like
1:15:31a whole thing and we're never going to get back to this one other point that I wanted
1:15:34to make, which is like, I understand what you're saying because I have this as some
1:15:38tools that I use, right, too, where it's like, this is so far away. And like Spark, we were
1:15:44about it as an example for me right like I do not want to use this app because of
1:15:48the way it looks sometimes and the things that it does but the service is
1:15:52so good I think I'm surprised how much you're willing to accept here because
1:15:59you know like I've known about obsidian for a bit because gray was using it and
1:16:05that any is using it I've never tried it myself because I look at it and I feel
1:16:11like my brain starts melting. Like, it could not look less like an iOS app.
1:16:16I don't think I've ever encountered an application that could look less like an
1:16:21iOS app. Like, does the iOS version look like the desktop version?
1:16:25Yeah. Yes.
1:16:26I can't even fath- like, what it looks like is a Linux app because that's kind of what it is, right?
1:16:33Or like it's built on that kind of mentality. It's got- I'm so surprised.
1:16:38Like, I am genuinely very surprised. I understand how powerful it is, and I can't wait to hear
1:16:43exactly why it's latched on for you, because I'm sure you're doing just some banana stuff
1:16:47with it. But, like, does it not feel, like, really alien when you open this application?
1:16:53It does, but it feels like Obsidian. It's like...
1:16:56Yeah, yeah, yeah. You get used to it, right?
1:16:58You get used to it, and I think what makes it acceptable for me is the excellent support
1:17:05for keyboard navigation on iPad. And so even though it's got its quirks and it's weird
1:17:13in places, it's getting better, right?
1:17:16But like, aren't you gonna get real mad when they don't support the things you want them
1:17:19to support?
1:17:20But that's the thing. It kind of feels like when you're working on Obsidian, it's kind
1:17:27of like its own OS, right? It kind of feels like its own system, like you're within a
1:17:36different system. But here's, I think, the clever thing behind it. In a way, I will always
1:17:46be able to take advantage of the latest features in iOS and iPadOS, because my vault is just
1:17:53a folder in files. And so, if Apple adds versioning, like proper versioning to files, or better
1:18:03search, or smart folders, I will be able to take advantage of that, because it's not a
1:18:10proprietary system. And that's the beauty of it, that around Obsidian, like, I can work
1:18:17inside the Obsidian app, and I've been doing that a lot, but I can also build my own series of
1:18:25enhancements around Obsidian using files, using shortcuts that I've been building,
1:18:30that take advantage of the file system on iPad and iPhone. And so it's this sort of combination of
1:18:39when you work in Obsidian, it feels like its own system. But if you want to take advantage of the
1:18:46the fact that you are on an iPhone and iPad, you still get access to those files in the Files app,
1:18:54and you can choose to put your Vault anywhere. Personally, I keep it in local storage,
1:18:58and then I use the Obsidian Sync service to sync changes between devices. And so, that's exactly
1:19:06what I've been doing. Like, I've been using Obsidian itself, but also shortcuts, with
1:19:11with Toolbox Pro that has some excellent files actions that Shortcuts itself doesn't have.
1:19:19And I've been using other file-based utilities to open those files. And so I'm not locked
1:19:26in. And if Apple ever adds certain features that I want to take advantage of, it's very
1:19:33likely that I will, because everything is just stored in files. But really, for me at
1:19:40least the most important point is that I'm making, I'm working to build my own writing
1:19:48app with this system. And so I don't necessarily care if Apple doesn't give me the features
1:19:56that I want because I'm going to make them myself.
1:19:59I need you to explain this to me more before I ask you the million more questions I have
1:20:03because you might answer it for me.
1:20:06Right. So, for context, I've been... So, I will say that I've been unifying, finally,
1:20:14all kinds of writing in Obsidian. So, not taking... Writing for Max Stories and Club
1:20:21Max Stories, research, documentation that I've been writing for Max Stories and the
1:20:26Club, highlights that I save from articles that I read and books that I
1:20:33I read, everything is going in Obsidian. Obviously, it's stored in different folders, all nicely
1:20:40organized, but everything is going in here.
1:20:43And so, what I mean by making my own writing app is, I've been trying to identify some
1:20:54key features that I've always wanted to have in a text editor, and that before they were
1:21:00were either not possible or I had to build workarounds for them.
1:21:05So the first plugin that Fin worked on for me, and I guess, by the way, at some point
1:21:13we will probably open up these plugins for more people.
1:21:18We will release them in public, I think, but we'll see.
1:21:21So the first one.
1:21:24It's called Export Markdown with Embeds.
1:21:27So I'm going to try and make this simple. In Obsidian you can embed a note within another
1:21:34note. This is called file transclusion. And it's usually...
1:21:41File transclusion?
1:21:42Yes.
1:21:43Oh, he's losing me already.
1:21:47Okay, so this is very simple. Imagine that you have a file named "table of contents".
1:21:52you have a table of contents, and you have multiple chapters for a book, or for a review
1:21:58in my case. You have chapter one, chapter two, and three. And you want to compile all
1:22:05of those chapters in the final output, which is the complete book. In the table of contents
1:22:12file, what you do is you embed each one of them. And by embed, I mean it's a single line
1:22:18of text that says exclamation point, exclamation mark, double square brackets, chapter one,
1:22:26and so forth for the other two chapters. So in three lines of text, you have referenced
1:22:31three files, you have embedded them inside of the table of contents, so that when you
1:22:37export it, you get the complete output that includes the text of all those three referenced
1:22:44files. This is something that I've been doing for my iOS review for the past few years in
1:22:51iAwriter, right? Using what they call in their system "content blocks". I wanted to replicate
1:22:59the same system in Obsidian, but make it more powerful. And this is where I got real nerdy
1:23:06about it all. So, with the plugin that we made, I can hit a keyboard shortcut, Command-Option-E,
1:23:17to export the current Markdown file that I'm looking at. And what this plugin will do is,
1:23:25it'll run through all of those referenced files. It will compile them all in the final output.
1:23:35And then it gives me the option to share this final output to the system clipboard to create a new file
1:23:42in Obsidian
1:23:44containing all of those referenced items as well as the system share sheet.
1:23:49Finn was able to add support for the clipboard and the share sheet. I don't know how, but it's a genius, so I don't care.
1:23:56So I have three output options, but there's another magic trick that we've been doing here.
1:24:04One of the things that I always wanted to do that I, a writer, did not allow me to do is to
1:24:11process all the headings of each reference document.
1:24:18So, essentially, when I'm working on an individual chapter,
1:24:23ideally, I want the title of the chapter to be an H1 header, and
1:24:28I want sections of that chapter to be H2, H3, and so forth.
1:24:33But when I'm compiling the review, the title of the chapter cannot be an H1.
1:24:39It has to become an H2, because H1 would be
1:24:44iOS 15 Review, the Max Stories Review, the actual title of the story.
1:24:48Which means that each heading needs to be increased by one.
1:24:54Right? So H1 needs to become H2, H3 needs to become H4, and so forth.
1:25:01So this plugin has a toggle that asks "increase level of addings"
1:25:08and if you flip it, it'll automatically do that for all of the files that you've referenced in your table of contents
1:25:15And I don't have to do this manually anymore. This is a thing that I used to do manually
1:25:21before or I
1:25:23And it was super annoying and now the system takes care of that for me
1:25:27So that's the first plugin we made
1:25:30And of course, because it's Obsidian, all of these commands, they show up in the command palette of Obsidian,
1:25:37which you can invoke with Command-P, and
1:25:39Fin was able to add separate commands for each option.
1:25:45So I can also directly press Command-S to bring up the sharesheet instantly.
1:25:51Yes.
1:25:53The second plugin that
1:25:56we're working on. This is still a work in progress, and this is the most ambitious one, I think.
1:26:02So there's an existing plugin
1:26:05made by an Obsidian user
1:26:07called Obsidian Todoist. And Obsidian Todoist is very clever in that
1:26:14it allows you to
1:26:17embed
1:26:19tasks from Todoist in a note, and when you preview the note, you get
1:26:26this actual, like, it looks like a tiny portion of the Todoist website
1:26:30in the node preview.
1:26:32And it's actually...
1:26:34Oh, my God.
1:26:35And it's actually interactive.
1:26:37Oh, my God.
1:26:38So that you can click check boxes in that preview to check off the task.
1:26:43Oh, jeez.
1:26:45But there's more. Hold on. There's more.
1:26:47And that block of tasks is customizable.
1:26:55So using the native Todoist filter syntax,
1:27:00you can, in each note,
1:27:05you can preview a different set of Todoist tasks.
1:27:08So if you have a note for Relay FM,
1:27:11I don't know, sponsors,
1:27:13you can just show the Todoist tasks
1:27:17that belong to the sponsor project
1:27:19and that have been tagged with invoices.
1:27:22Or in my case, if I have Cloud Max Stories admin tasks,
1:27:26I can filter those and in the note preview of my club note,
1:27:30I can show those.
1:27:31So this is made by an Obsidian user.
1:27:34It's incredible, really well done.
1:27:37But I asked Finn, can we go a step beyond this?
1:27:41Because right now, what this plugin does,
1:27:44and this is, I think,
1:27:45where you're gonna be even more impressed.
1:27:47So what this, so by, also, I should say,
1:27:49By default, this plugin was not working on mobile,
1:27:52so Finn was able to fork the existing plugin
1:27:55and make it work for me the way I wanted on iPhone.
1:27:58But I said, so this plugin, all it does is preview tasks,
1:28:04and you see now what I was talking about on connected.
1:28:10One of my biggest problems with task management
1:28:14and text editors is that I was never able
1:28:16to connect the two of them, right?
1:28:19And so I wondered, what if we extend this plugin in a way that it can scan my document
1:28:30for lines of text that look like tasks, and with the proper syntax, sync them up to my Todoist account,
1:28:42and file them under a specific project task with a due date.
1:28:48Basically, we are, Finn is working,
1:28:52we are extending this plugin to achieve true two-way sync
1:28:58between the text editor and Todoist.
1:29:00A text editor, a to-do app.
1:29:02These aren't two separate things.
1:29:05This is one thing.
1:29:08So, the idea is that I gave Finn a spec to follow in terms of I want to reference a project
1:29:17with a hashtag, I want to reference tag with the @ sign in front of them, and I want to
1:29:23enter due dates this way. But the idea is that the plugin will scan a document for lines
1:29:28of text that begin with a dash followed by a space and two square brackets, which is
1:29:33the default sort of plain text syntax for tasks, supported in iWriter, in drafts, it's
1:29:39sort of like a standard at this point, and when it finds one it will create a task in
1:29:47Todoist for it, but at the same time it'll also store in the original document the fact
1:29:53that that line of text is now a task in Todoist.
1:29:57So I just want to make sure I'm contextualizing this, right? So like, you're writing the iOS
1:30:0115 review and while you're writing the iOS 15 review you're like "ah crap I've got to
1:30:06take a screenshot of this thing" so you do like close bracket open bracket or whatever
1:30:11way around it was. No no I just typed I have a keyboard shortcut I have a what's it called
1:30:16a text replacement I just type ttt and it expands into the and then you're like take
1:30:23screenshots and then when you're done writing for the day you run this script it will collect
1:30:30up everything that's left in that document and put it into Todoist. Yes.
1:30:34Incredible. But there's even more. But wait, there's more! It can also auto refresh so I don't need to
1:30:41remember to do it. And in Obsidian the task will automatically get a link back to the
1:30:51task on Todoist and in Todoist the task will get a link back to that line of
1:30:56of text in Obsidian. So that in the two places I can jump back and forth. So if I'm looking
1:31:03at Todoist I can say "hey what's this about?" and I click the link and it takes me to that
1:31:07specific line in Obsidian. I guess it can look however it wants really, can't it, if
1:31:11you can do stuff like that. And when I preview the note, obviously, that line of text becomes
1:31:19a Todoist preview so that I can check it off from Obsidian and it's also complete in Todoist.
1:31:26So that's what we're working on right now.
1:31:28That's very cool.
1:31:30We also did something else. We took another existing... See, this is the beauty of this
1:31:37community. The Obsidian community has been, frankly, amazing, especially in the Discord
1:31:41server. Very welcoming community. A lot of people that were already listening to Connected
1:31:46before, so that was fun when I showed up. That was a really fun moment. Actually, those
1:31:52people have known for a while that I was doing this. And thank you for keeping it quiet,
1:31:58because it looks like everybody right now in the relay Discord had no idea, so that's
1:32:03cool. The beauty of this Obsidian ecosystem is that all of these plugins are usually open
1:32:09source, and so you can take them, you can fork them, and you can modify them in a way
1:32:14that suits your needs. So we took the—and this is another thing that a lot of people
1:32:21are using these days. We took the Obsidian Readwise plugin, which is also made by...
1:32:28I have no idea what this is.
1:32:29So Readwise is a service, maybe Steven knows it. I know that David uses it, I believe.
1:32:34He does.
1:32:34Readwise is a service that aggregates highlights from all the things you need to...
1:32:40Oh, I know this.
1:32:41Yeah, okay.
1:32:41Yeah, from Read It Later Services, Kindle, etc., etc.
1:32:46There's a plugin made by an Obsidian user that syncs your readwise highlights with Obsidian.
1:32:55And basically for every article that you read or every book that you read,
1:32:59it creates a note in Obsidian containing the metadata of the item and all the highlights
1:33:07that you saved. So that plugin was not working on mobile, and so Fin fixed it, and the first step
1:33:15was "okay now this can be used on mobile". But then we also modified the plugin so that
1:33:21when you sync your Readwise account it's not like it just dumps all of those files
1:33:29at the root level of your vault. In our version you can choose a specific folder to store those
1:33:37highlights in. So now, and this goes back to my point about how I don't really care if Obsidian
1:33:47doesn't take advantage of the latest APIs. Around all of this, I've been building my own shortcuts
1:33:54to sort of complement the experience. And one example that I think I will share on Cloud
1:34:00Mac stories at some point soon, is I wrote a shortcut that when I'm reading an article in Safari
1:34:08and I want to highlight something, I highlight a bit of text on a web page, I run the shortcut,
1:34:15that bit of text turns yellow in Safari, because I had some JavaScript in shortcuts to do this, but
1:34:27The highlight gets also saved to my Readwise account.
1:34:31So I can read stuff in Safari, I can take advantage of content blockers,
1:34:37Safari Reader, all of the stuff that you get in Safari.
1:34:41I run a shortcut, and it visually highlights stuff on the page,
1:34:47but it also syncs that bit of text to my Readwise account.
1:34:51Later, when I open Obsidian, the plugin is configured to run automatically when I start
1:34:58up the app so that I don't have to do anything.
1:35:01When I open Obsidian, it pulls all my latest highlights from Readwise and adds them to
1:35:09the folder that I specified.
1:35:11I plan to switch back to my Kindle instead of the Kobo for this very reason.
1:35:18Oh, it all comes together.
1:35:21We just talked about that.
1:35:22- Yep, so.
1:35:23- You know, what is it, a beautiful mind
1:35:28where like the guy has all the red string
1:35:30to all the walls figuring things out?
1:35:32- Yeah.
1:35:33- This is what it's like to live inside Federico's brain.
1:35:36- So for read later, because of this shortcut,
1:35:41I've gone back to Safari reading list
1:35:46because you can, unfortunately,
1:35:49If you use a third-party browser on iOS,
1:35:53you do not get access to the DOM of the web page,
1:35:58which means you cannot do things like accessing selections,
1:36:02for example.
1:36:03If you use Firefox or Google Chrome,
1:36:05you cannot do what I'm doing with JavaScript in Safari.
1:36:08And so I'm using that for articles.
1:36:13And Readwise does not support COBOL highlights.
1:36:18it appears, unfortunately.
1:36:19So I gotta use the Kindle for that.
1:36:21This is also why, just a few minutes ago,
1:36:23I said that I was sad that the iPad Mini
1:36:27with the iPad Pro design is not coming out soon
1:36:30because I really wanted to have that device
1:36:31for reading articles.
1:36:33So these are three examples of plugins
1:36:36that I have just for me right now.
1:36:39I have plenty more ideas that,
1:36:41and I have a lot of work for Fin if he's up for it.
1:36:47Because I realized, you know, all the things that I want to do, they don't exist.
1:36:53I don't care.
1:36:54I'm just going to have someone build them for me.
1:36:57And it's incredible.
1:36:58It's an incredible feeling to know that you have this foundation, but you can also build
1:37:07on top of it.
1:37:09So I also wanted to mention quickly some plugins made by the community that I have not modified
1:37:17because they are pretty awesome as is.
1:37:20Workspaces, I believe this is a core plugin.
1:37:25It lets you save
1:37:27specific workspaces in the app. By workspace
1:37:30I mean you have a specific note on the left, another note on the right. You can save that workspace,
1:37:36give it a name, and then you can reload it. And it recreates that workspace in Obsidian for you.
1:37:43I love it. I use it a lot. I give it a keyboard shortcut. It's fantastic
1:37:47Advanced obsidian URI. This is a plugin that and it's kind of wild
1:37:53If obsidian doesn't have a URL scheme that you want
1:37:58You can add your own and this plugin does that it creates more commands for the obsidian URL scheme
1:38:07Which is incredible
1:38:10quick switcher plus plus
1:38:13This is also a fun one because it lets me navigate to a specific header in a document.
1:38:20It's called Symbol Navigation.
1:38:22So, if I have a story with a bunch of sections, I can hit Option+S, and it brings up a list of all the sections in my story,
1:38:30and I can use the arrow keys to navigate to a specific section.
1:38:34And lastly, Page Preview. This is also one of the core plugins of Obsidian.
1:38:39It's really awesome because you can hover over a referenced note in Obsidian
1:38:46and it shows you a little floating preview of the note that you're referencing.
1:38:52So that's a really cool plugin.
1:38:54I also want to shout out to, I mentioned the Obsidian community before,
1:38:59I want to recommend this newsletter, ObsidianRoundUp.org.
1:39:04Really, really fantastic place to discover a lot of Obsidian-related things on a weekly
1:39:11basis. It's curated by Eleanor…
1:39:13There's a community for everything, right?
1:39:15Yes. But this one, like, if you want to discover CSS snippets and plugins and themes, it's
1:39:22got all of that.
1:39:23To cut you off, you were going to say Eleanor Konick, right? Is the puzzle.
1:39:27Yes, Eleanor Konick. One last thing. I don't think I'm using Obsidian the way that
1:39:34most users are. No, no you're not. Doesn't sound like it. I don't care about Zettel,
1:39:41Kasten. I don't care about the fancy graph view. I understand why a lot of people do.
1:39:47I'm using Obsidian as my custom writing app for everything that I am going to extend over
1:39:54time with all the Markdown related additions that I want. So this is really going to be
1:39:59the hub for IOS 15 for you this summer? Yes, that is the goal. So we're trying to
1:40:06get to the point where by the summer I have this entirely custom system for me that takes
1:40:11care of outlining, mind mapping, because there's also plugins for mind maps in Obsidian, task
1:40:19management, so being able to save todos when I'm writing and to have them be available
1:40:26elsewhere via Todoist. And backups and versioning, that is also, I guess that's
1:40:32the thing we're gonna look at next. When I'm done, when we're
1:40:37done with Todoist, I want to look at a backup plugin made just for me, and
1:40:43also a way... because also, like, over the past few months we've been doing a lot
1:40:49of things at Maxor is behind the scenes that we will announce soon, but one of
1:40:52them is a brand new CDN that we're using. And so I get another plugin that I've
1:40:56would like to have is one that directly communicates with our CDN so that any local image attachment
1:41:04can easily become an actual image link for our CDN. I have plenty of ideas. If you're
1:41:13an Obsidian plugin developer and you're looking for some work, get in touch with me. I mean,
1:41:18Finn cannot do it all by himself. The army of one true Johns.
1:41:23I'm hiring, this is what I'm saying.
1:41:28I'm hiring for a very, very specific role.
1:41:31Incredibly specific role.
1:41:33I mean, this is the end game of editorial years and years ago.
1:41:38I've been thinking about editorial the entire time.
1:41:41I mean, I didn't want to bring it up, because it was like,
1:41:44you know, this is kind of what I was getting at.
1:41:46And I know what you're saying about if it doesn't support
1:41:50technologies, but I do also imagine a point where it would start to become a problem for
1:41:55you, but I don't think we're even close to that.
1:41:59Because what I'm saying is, like, imagine that they, like, you know, Apple's like, "I
1:42:03have this new amazing window and system, just plug it in with a monitor," and Obsidian's
1:42:07like, "Ah, we can't do that."
1:42:09You know what I mean?
1:42:10Like, that's the kind of stuff that I imagine.
1:42:11And I know what you're saying of, like, you can build stuff that hooks into it, but if
1:42:15If you're doing the actual writing in the application, you know, you're going to want
1:42:20it to try and be up to date in some ways, at least.
1:42:25That is part of the beauty of it though, is that at the end of the day it is just a folder
1:42:29of markdown.
1:42:30So you could, if that were to happen, or if you just found another writing environment
1:42:35you liked more, you could use this as some sort of like hub and then use an external
1:42:40editor.
1:42:41And then you jump into the ghetto of old Obsidian and write the scripts.
1:42:45the burning husk.
1:42:47Yeah, yeah. But not that, I mean, although this is a burgeoning new community, like I,
1:42:52you know, if anything happens, it's not going to happen for a long time because like, it's
1:42:56new and it's got a lot of attention and I'm sure that they're making a big business out
1:43:00of this right now, so, you know.
1:43:03Just one quick thing to answer, TJ in the Discord. He asked, "Has Federico ever used
1:43:08the same system for two iOS reviews.
1:43:10Yes, I've been using IE Writer for two years,
1:43:14or maybe even three.
1:43:16No, but for sure, two iOS reviews I've done
1:43:19in the same app with the same system,
1:43:21which is also why I was kind of, you know, a little fed up
1:43:24and I was like, I really want to have my own thing
1:43:27going at this point.
1:43:29Yeah, so I'm optimistic though,
1:43:31because the Obsidian developer
1:43:33is really responsive to feedback.
1:43:36So, you know, fingers crossed that they will support.
1:43:39I have one last question for you.
1:43:41I know that Obsidian on the Mac, it's pulling folders from the file system.
1:43:46Yeah. How does this work on iOS?
1:43:49The same way. Same way you create a vault.
1:43:52So it's pulling it from the files app?
1:43:54That's why I told you I can build all of these additional shortcuts.
1:43:59No, no, I figured it was like, I don't know, like it was going somewhere
1:44:02and it goes into the files.
1:44:04OK, so that's super interesting.
1:44:05Yes, yes, yes.
1:44:07Which is like, it makes me feel better
1:44:09because I know that the very foundation
1:44:12is the system that Apple will continue to develop over time.
1:44:17How does it work cross-platform then?
1:44:20Well, that's the beauty of Obsidian Sync.
1:44:23It's not storing your data,
1:44:26it's only syncing the changes, right?
1:44:30How do you feel about using an early beta
1:44:33of an application for your iOS review? Well we'll see when I start writing if it's still
1:44:39in beta but this is exactly why I want to have a backup and a plugin made next. Because
1:44:46again you've probably heard this but when Gray used the alpha it deleted a bunch of
1:44:51his data. I know, I know. I know. I listened. He had a backup because he figured something
1:44:56bad might happen and the worst thing happened you know. I like it's a habit of mine now
1:45:02Now I always manually export my drafts to working copy and I sync them up to my GitHub
1:45:10account so I'm not too concerned about that.
1:45:13This is what you're going to do if you change system every year, right?
1:45:16You're going to run into at least some problems along the way.
1:45:19Yeah.
1:45:20Well, look at you.
1:45:24It's all fun making these custom things.
1:45:27I want to see it in action at some point and that would be exciting.
1:45:31I'll show you.
1:45:32Once I have...
1:45:33Show me some videos.
1:45:34I will.
1:45:35I will show you.
1:45:36Especially when I have the create a new task thing happening.
1:45:41That would be fun.
1:45:42I think that does it.
1:45:43If you want to learn more about the stuff we talked about, there are some links in the
1:45:48show notes at relay.fm/connected/344.
1:45:54While you're there, you can get in touch with email for feedback or follow up, or you can
1:45:58do that out on the internet.
1:46:00You can find us all on Twitter.
1:46:02Federico is there at Vitici, V-I-T-I-C-C-I, and he's the editor-in-chief of MacStories.net,
1:46:09and as we now know, Obsidian Wizard.
1:46:13You can follow Myke on Twitter as @IMYKE.
1:46:16Myke hosts a bunch of other shows here on Relay FM, and streams over on Twitch about
1:46:21mechanical keyboards at Myke.live.
1:46:24You can find me online as @ismh and my writing at 512pixels.net.
1:46:29Before I let you go, I'll tell you about another show here on Relay FM that you should check
1:46:33out and that's Parallel.
1:46:35If you like tech podcasts, you're going to like Parallel.
1:46:37It's hosted by journalist, accessibility expert, and all around excellent person, Shelley Brisbane.
1:46:43Parallel is a tech podcast with accessibility sprinkles that you can listen to by going
1:46:47to relay.fm/parallel or search parallel wherever you get your podcast.
1:46:53I'd like to thank the sponsors for this episode of Connected, Pingdom, Smile, and Squarespace.
1:46:59And until next time, gentlemen, say goodbye.
1:47:02- I do that to you.