The Accidental Tech Podcast

160: Be Careful Out There


  you said it all about the m5 leaving you [TS]

  should pull the engine noise mp3's off [TS]

  the computer you can play them anytime [TS]

  you want when you're missing so let's [TS]

  move on to something super exciting [TS]

  let's talk about sequel server on [TS]

  because i couldn't even get out of the [TS]

  street [TS]

  I tried so hard I could even do it well [TS]

  this is kind of interesting right [TS]

  because like you know Microsoft had [TS]

  their database sequel server which for [TS]

  forever has required windows server and [TS]

  i would imagine a a lot of Windows [TS]

  Server licenses were exclusively to run [TS]

  Microsoft sequel server so them making [TS]

  this are announcing that it will be [TS]

  available for Linux is interesting you [TS]

  know because that's because that means [TS]

  again like we we brought up last week [TS]

  how then bringing dotnet to linux [TS]

  officially would be you know interesting [TS]

  and have might have a negative effect on [TS]

  their windows server licenses [TS]

  this will probably have an even bigger [TS]

  negative effect on Windows Server [TS]

  licenses so I think what this is showing [TS]

  is that Microsoft would rather that you [TS]

  use dotnet and instead and use windows [TS]

  and a new sequel server rather than [TS]

  necessarily be stuck to windows server [TS]

  and so all the reasons that people have [TS]

  for for not using Microsoft server [TS]

  products now they have 11 big one less [TS]

  fewer then bring this up last week I [TS]

  don't know maybe I'm misremembering i [TS]

  remember talking about the similar [TS]

  similar issues of like that Microsoft is [TS]

  becoming more friendly to linux and how [TS]

  people don't like to run linux servers [TS]

  and windows server is the to kind of [TS]

  separate domains of knowledge and really [TS]

  just run all linux servers linux is [TS]

  everywhere in the enterprise and so that [TS]

  the Microsoft could tell you i think i [TS]

  might have said exchange server for [TS]

  linux or something like that but anyway [TS]

  and also like the Microsoft could have [TS]

  it on linux distro eventually and it [TS]

  wasn't you know that was like last week [TS]

  and then this announcement came i'm sure [TS]

  this announcement Telegraph for people [TS]

  who pay more attention to Microsoft than [TS]

  i do but i had no awareness they were [TS]

  even close to this but then you know [TS]

  they're went right after last week's [TS]

  show so it and I think christina warren [TS]

  was also talking about a microscope [TS]

  linux distro around the same time [TS]

  I don't see that is implausible although [TS]

  a couple people from Microsoft tweeted [TS]

  oh you know we partner with redhead and [TS]

  so on and so forth and we let them do [TS]

  what they do best which is to a linux [TS]

  distro we don't have one or whatever but [TS]

  if Microsoft pursue this strategy to [TS]

  basically we will sell you [TS]

  enterprise software and we're not going [TS]

  to be super picky about where you run it [TS]

  like if I have a lot of customers want [TS]

  to run our software on linux fine we'll [TS]

  we'll sell them a version to run on [TS]

  linux because they're not not though the [TS]

  everything windows company anymore i [TS]

  mean they haven't been for a while now [TS]

  since Ballmer left basically maybe even [TS]

  before the fair enough it's so [TS]

  interesting push for sure and i'm [TS]

  curious to see where this all ends up [TS]

  but i like it i think this is Microsoft [TS]

  playing to their strengths which we've [TS]

  talked about you know several times on [TS]

  and off in the past so good on Microsoft [TS]

  moving on we got a lot of people that [TS]

  wrote in to talk about TV mounting over [TS]

  fireplace because unsurprisingly a lot [TS]

  of people were perturbed at where I [TS]

  mount my TV and we got to recurring [TS]

  links which will put in the show notes [TS]

  and it was a new Weinstock that I guess [TS]

  was the first one in with these links [TS]

  one of them is dynamic mounting which is [TS]

  very similar to the other which we [TS]

  receive far more often which is mantle [TS]

  mount and the two of these things [TS]

  basically allow you to stuff the TV over [TS]

  the fireplace when it's not in use but [TS]

  then drop it down kind of in front of [TS]

  the fireplace when you are using it and [TS]

  these are very clever and things that I [TS]

  would never ever bother with because I [TS]

  just don't care that much [TS]

  I would be so nervous about this like I [TS]

  mean again I i know that you can make [TS]

  amount that's super strong and [TS]

  everything but man having it having the [TS]

  TV on the walls bad enough having it [TS]

  like suspended on this arm that reaches [TS]

  like a couple of feet away from the wall [TS]

  it's like thinking like the stresses on [TS]

  that mountain oh my god i do I could not [TS]

  sleep a night with that above my TV or [TS]

  movies are like it would be fine but it [TS]

  is kind of weird though because your [TS]

  room looks weird with your TV kind of [TS]

  hang [TS]

  in front of the fireplace like I guess [TS]

  it's kind of a solution and the ideas [TS]

  you can push it back up when you want [TS]

  the room to look nicer or whatever but [TS]

  it still seems weird to me and then [TS]

  final piece of follow-up I had tweeted a [TS]

  challenge to you / our meeting follows [TS]

  that here's the PDF of my owners manual [TS]

  for my TV make it work [TS]

  I got a plethora of suggestions most of [TS]

  which are actually very helpful which I [TS]

  do appreciate because oftentimes with [TS]

  twitter that's not the case [TS]

  tentatively i think it may be fixed it's [TS]

  been very not reliable and sometimes it [TS]

  seems to be working right sometimes not [TS]

  when I say working right what I mean is [TS]

  that it doesn't overscan or anything [TS]

  like that it appears to be I I changed a [TS]

  million things at once because my [TS]

  terrible debugger apparently when it [TS]

  comes to these sorts of things anyway I [TS]

  think it is basically the showroom mode [TS]

  or something like it or they some sort [TS]

  of like let me do everything [TS]

  automatically mode when I first change [TS]

  that it didn't seem to make a difference [TS]

  then all of a sudden it seemed to be [TS]

  working so gosh only knows but the [TS]

  positive sign so far so thank you to the [TS]

  people on Twitter that it sent in some [TS]

  tips and in theory i think it might be [TS]

  better now so i think both you and Marco [TS]

  have had people download PDFs of things [TS]

  the own and read them for you and tell [TS]

  you how to work [TS]

  yeah and i think the comment i think the [TS]

  common thread between us here is that we [TS]

  just don't care enough about this [TS]

  particular thing like Marco does not see [TS]

  about about well be sure about finding [TS]

  the battery in his car he can write as [TS]

  ish and about knowing how to do [TS]

  shortcuts on the eye dr for example [TS]

  personally I think that's a little weird [TS]

  that he didn't care that much but you [TS]

  know teach their own and for me I could [TS]

  not have possibly cared less about [TS]

  reading the manual to fix this problem i [TS]

  had lived with it for like six years at [TS]

  this point I can live with it some more [TS]

  however now that it is fixed i am quite [TS]

  well tentatively i am quite pleased that [TS]

  a that you was gonna say i spent the [TS]

  time but really that the internet spent [TS]

  the time to read the PDF for me so [TS]

  thanks internet our first sponsor [TS]

  tonight is fracture go to fracture [TS] and use code ATP 10 to get ten [TS]

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  on the included screw and hang it up on [TS]

  the wall done it's all really affordable [TS]

  to press charges 15 bucks for the small [TS]

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  after that fracture prints look great [TS]

  they're all over my hair all over our [TS]

  house now there they just keep [TS]

  multiplying and they're everywhere we've [TS]

  given them as gifts people love these [TS]

  things that they complement them they [TS]

  look great [TS]

  it is literally a photo printed on a [TS]

  piece of glass and you stick it on the [TS]

  wall and that's it you don't have to [TS]

  frame it you don't worry about it like [TS]

  you know falling off of some little [TS]

  weird hanger thing it just works and [TS]

  they're great they're big they're [TS]

  beautiful they're lightweight you know [TS]

  it again no stress involved in hanging [TS]

  on the wall [TS]

  the package has been wonderful we've [TS]

  never received one that was cracked or [TS]

  broken or anything i can do you think [TS]

  sending a big piece of glass the mail it [TS]

  be risky but now they have to have that [TS]

  covered too [TS]

  it is great they make great gifts [TS]

  they're great for yourself get your [TS]

  photos / to get them out of your like [TS]

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  you see them for like a day then they're [TS]

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  somebody if you like you don't go on a [TS]

  trip with somebody or you like your kids [TS]

  a birthday or whatever takes pictures to [TS]

  them to your relatives sounds the people [TS]

  who were on the trip with you each [TS]

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  fracture to see for yourself [TS]

  thanks a lot of fracture so this past [TS]

  weekend we celebrated my mother-in-law's [TS]

  birthday and we have gotten her a [TS]

  fracture print of a photo that I taken [TS]

  of Declan at a park nearby that that we [TS]

  really liked that she had commented to [TS]

  me [TS]

  oh man that's a really great picture i [TS]

  really like it and yada yada and that [TS]

  was like a month ago and so we had [TS]

  pretty much instantly turned around went [TS]

  to fracture know when your birthday was [TS]

  coming and had that printed made pressed [TS]

  / you want to phrase it and she opened [TS]

  it up in instantly burst into tears [TS]

  because she was so overjoyed about how [TS]

  good it looked and how awesome it was [TS]

  and so seriously kids give it a shot [TS]

  it's really good stuff so i actually [TS]

  have some surprise follow-up I thought [TS]

  we were done [TS]

  no this is a surprise follow-up because [TS]

  on my desk right now i have two of the [TS]

  Apple smart battery cases [TS]

  oh god seriously seriously back to this [TS]

  respect [TS]

  we're going to spend even more time on [TS]

  the Apple our veterans just quick quick [TS]

  to get one for the the plus + 14 regular [TS]

  don't make the plus no one for me one [TS]

  for tiff they only making one size just [TS]

  for the success that's it yeah because [TS]

  you're plus already has enough battery [TS]

  life anyway I i have my you know my [TS]

  sheep amazon one that I got and I i [TS]

  expressed some concern about you know [TS]

  being not fi certified I'm a little [TS]

  worried about what am i doing my phone [TS]

  but otherwise it seems alright but [TS]

  excited for this trip to 12 and decided [TS]

  let's try these i'll give it a real shot [TS]

  a real honest shot and honestly it's [TS]

  pretty good i feel like this is a common [TS]

  theme with you all this is crap [TS]

  fast-forward you know that's not so bad [TS]

  yeah you're right you nobody else would [TS]

  ever do that Casey like Apple and BMWs [TS]

  and I've oh no I'm not innocent on this [TS]

  one I'm not interested I'm just bringing [TS]

  you down to my level [TS]

  I understand the appeal of this case now [TS]

  you know so first of all it is really [TS]

  easy to take on and off because of the [TS]

  weird bendy top it does indeed look [TS]

  really stupid holding it is actually not [TS]

  bad because the little ledge from the [TS]

  from the from the bottom edge of the [TS]

  bump you actually can rest on your pinky [TS]

  and have kind of a nice hand hold their [TS]

  almost your job unless you're John but [TS]

  if you hold your phone normally you can [TS]

  you can do that and the smartness aspect [TS]

  of it is really nice where you never [TS]

  have to turn it on or off like that to [TS]

  me that is what really sets it apart [TS]

  above all that all the other ones is [TS]

  that is always just automatic and and [TS]

  you can see its status in here today [TS]

  view and then in the batteries which it [TS]

  so and when you first plug it in it [TS]

  shows both side by side shows the case [TS]

  and your battery so overall it's [TS]

  actually pretty nice [TS]

  it still looks stupid it's still big and [TS]

  clunky not as big and clunky and some [TS]

  better cases I've seen and used but but [TS]

  it's still big and clunky the only major [TS]

  downside to it besides it's stupid looks [TS]

  I think now having used it really the [TS]

  only major downside is that the amount [TS]

  of extra capacity that you get really [TS]

  isn't [TS]

  that great it's something I mean I don't [TS]

  know something like two-thirds of the [TS]

  charger half of charge so it is enough [TS]

  if you need just a little boost but I [TS]

  feel like I'm on the flight on the way [TS]

  out there we both drained our cases down [TS]

  to nothing and drained our phones down [TS]

  partially just like in in the airport [TS]

  here and there you know it going in and [TS]

  out of planes and everything and yes you [TS]

  can plug in the plane but then you have [TS]

  this cable running across your lap and [TS]

  kind of inconvenient and you got a [TS]

  reason the bag and I was like ideally [TS]

  you don't have to so you know ultimately [TS]

  it was they did provide enough power but [TS]

  it would be nice if they provided more [TS]

  like if you're gonna have this big [TS]

  battery back on your phone at all i [TS]

  would like a little more power than what [TS]

  this offers other than that pretty good [TS]

  i wouldn't say it's a great value for [TS]

  the money but is there a hundred bucks [TS]

  and you can get other battery cases for [TS]

  like 50 so you know not a great value [TS]

  but the fact that you never have to turn [TS]

  on or off it just automatically charges [TS]

  your phone as necessary and to please [TS]

  yourself first and charges you first [TS]

  all those things actually pretty nice so [TS]

  that's that's my my abbreviated review [TS]

  of the Apple smart better case after [TS]

  having mercilessly made fun of it for [TS]

  like three episodes did you get a white [TS]

  1i got we have one of each color tiff [TS]

  insisted on the white I insisted on on [TS]

  the gray both colors are crappy colors [TS]

  of the white hasn't this color itself [TS]

  yet but I'm sure it will soon they both [TS]

  pick up tons of pocket-lint because they [TS]

  are the the rubbery silicon material [TS]

  physical form why's there exactly is [TS]

  mediocre to expect but they do work [TS]

  pretty well i would i would only wish [TS]

  for a little more power over although [TS]

  you know it is not terrible [TS]

  I expected to be terrible it's not [TS]

  terrible cool well that's surprising but [TS]

  I guess exciting [TS]

  yeah I mean no one i have i have this [TS]

  battery casings by lenmar and yeah I [TS]

  mean it's okay it's a little bit clunky [TS]

  but i think they have a newer one [TS]

  actually now that's thinner this 1i got [TS]

  with my six [TS]

  I like it works fine but it's definitely [TS]

  big and large and I'm I don't know if [TS]

  I'd say heavy but certainly not light [TS]

  so it's it's alright and i don't know [TS]

  maybe if I were to do it again maybe I'd [TS]

  get one of these like you have to be [TS]

  honest I did get one of those battery [TS]

  packs that you would recommended what [TS]

  who makes it again already volt ready [TS]

  that's right it's got to be reliable [TS]

  how could it not be yeah $25 my company [TS]

  you've never heard of that has all these [TS]

  little flimsy cables on it it's it works [TS]

  most of the time why not it works [TS]

  exactly what you'd expect for a $25 [TS]

  battery that's fair and i got one of [TS]

  those that on your recommendation which [TS]

  I guess was on someone else's [TS]

  recommendation first it the one I got is [TS]

  a truly hideous gold color because that [TS]

  was the only one that was available at [TS]

  the time I don't even see it on amazon [TS]

  anymore so maybe that's been updated [TS]

  since then but I'm it's too it's too [TS]

  tacky even for amazon seriously so yeah [TS]

  so it i haven't traveled with it yet but [TS]

  I i am going on a trip soon with a [TS]

  plethora of other people and I presume [TS]

  it will be a mixed crowd of iphones and [TS]

  android phones and it was appealing to [TS]

  me that this would have a connection for [TS]

  each because I'm a nice guy like that so [TS]

  we'll see how it goes if my phone melts [TS]

  then you can laugh at me and said I [TS]

  shouldn't say I should have gotten the [TS]

  smart battery case i'm not sure i would [TS]

  ever tell somebody they should have [TS]

  gotten the smart battery case like it's [TS]

  not that good and it is fairly expensive [TS]

  again you know again it's expensive for [TS]

  the capacity you get but again it is [TS]

  really nice not to have to manage it [TS]

  likes like flip it on and flip it off [TS]

  like that part is really nice [TS]

  yeah that makes sense yeah I mean [TS]

  ultimately I this this might be just [TS]

  convincing me that I should probably go [TS]

  with go 27 plus when the seven comes out [TS]

  but we'll see what happens [TS]

  don't do it man Mike might have been [TS]

  right duh don't do it man [TS]

  now you know what what's what's pushing [TS]

  more and more towards that as time goes [TS]

  on not only my battery preferences but [TS]

  also i I really don't use iPads and when [TS]

  I i have I I at least didn't get myself [TS]

  a pro and I'm probably not going to get [TS]

  myself the new you know pro mini [TS]

  whatever whatever the heck they're going [TS]

  to call the the new ipad air with pencil [TS]

  support and pro speakers and pro like [TS]

  styling you know whatever the the rumors [TS]

  from government they're going to call it [TS]

  ipad pro also [TS]

  which my theory on that actually it [TS]

  matter we're talking about it affect my [TS]

  theory on that is I think it makes sense [TS]

  for apples current marketing goals to [TS]

  name all the big iPads pro because they [TS]

  want people to be thinking of the ipad [TS]

  as a machine that you can do [TS]

  professional work on to help [TS]

  differentiate not only from you know big [TS]

  phones and everything but also help [TS]

  differentiate it from amazon's like six [TS]

  pack of cheap tablets you know that they [TS]

  want the ipad to be a premium product [TS]

  that you can do pro work on if you need [TS]

  or want to so I think that's I think [TS]

  that their goal here if the if they do [TS]

  indeed call it a pro of some form i [TS]

  think their goal here is for you just [TS]

  for you just think of the iPads as the [TS]

  pro tablets and you'll still have the [TS]

  mini that probably won't be called pro [TS]

  but you know so the little the only non [TS]

  pro ipad left will be the mini they [TS]

  still call that were many there's no [TS]

  more just plain old ipad maybe I mean [TS]

  there for much of the not much for some [TS]

  of the years that macbook has existed [TS]

  there was no just plain old macbook and [TS]

  and if you look at you know if you look [TS]

  at the laptop which i think is a fair [TS]

  comparison here like this is covered [TS]

  pretty well on an upgrade connected the [TS]

  last couple weeks but if you if you look [TS]

  at the mac lineup you have some of the [TS]

  low end and then you have like the [TS]

  entire middle and high end is all called [TS]

  Pro right and that's partially because [TS]

  you know these are higher and things [TS]

  possibly i think apple realizes like [TS]

  these are that gives the whole line like [TS]

  an air of professionalism of a premium [TS]

  miss you know superiority and and it [TS]

  kind of makes macbook you know you just [TS]

  follow the throw that kind of makes the [TS]

  whole air the whole line seen [TS]

  prestigious to have so many of them [TS]

  called Pro especially some of them [TS]

  people actually buy so you know to have [TS]

  to have most of the ipads that end up [TS]

  being sold have pro in their name [TS]

  I think helps contribute to the [TS]

  perception Apple wants to create that [TS]

  the ipad can be used for pro use whether [TS]

  or not it can is a different story [TS]

  that's you know many people can enable [TS]

  can't knock me that [TS]

  on this episode but I feel like that [TS]

  that is a plausible reason why they [TS]

  would want to do this i was on one of [TS]

  those upper episodes of upgrade and what [TS]

  I said on that episode was [TS]

  I think that the middle the middle sized [TS]

  like the plane i pad sighs the original [TS]

  iPad sighs I guess you would call it i [TS]

  think there's room to have a model that [TS]

  that big with pro in the name and a [TS]

  model it's also that big without pro in [TS]

  the name because at this point there are [TS]

  enough Pro features the smart connector [TS]

  the pen the high refresh rate screen the [TS]

  speakers that it's enough to [TS]

  differentiate to say the program has all [TS]

  that stuff and is more expensive and the [TS]

  non-pro one that is the same size is [TS]

  thinner lighter smaller cheaper and [TS]

  worse than all those other ways doesn't [TS]

  have a smart connector doesn't support [TS]

  the pen at all maybe the cameras [TS]

  crappier maybe has even the last year's [TS]

  cpu or whatever but it just seems silly [TS]

  to me to require what I consider the [TS]

  regular ipad size to be encumbered by [TS]

  all the pro features become I mean if I [TS]

  just think about what kind of iPads to [TS]

  reach people want to buy for the [TS]

  toddler's then why bother but many is [TS]

  not you know it's more fun for toddler [TS]

  to have the big-screen to like finger [TS]

  paint on and and and play little games [TS]

  just do stuff like that so I really help [TS]

  eventually maybe maybe for this first [TS]

  one they want to but i really hope [TS]

  eventually there is a pro 9.7 inch one [TS]

  that's the regular size right [TS]

  yes 9.7 inch and there's a there's a pro [TS]

  9.7 a non-pro nine but seven because [TS]

  already and they don't even that many [TS]

  preachers that I think they're already [TS]

  enough features to clearly differentiate [TS]

  the two lines there wouldn't be any [TS]

  confusion about it and they can hit more [TS]

  price points they could push the pro [TS]

  went up in price and they could push the [TS]

  non-pro and down by using cheaper stuff [TS]

  yeah maybe i don't know we'll see you [TS]

  know knowing Tim Cook's apples probably [TS]

  like 17 different iPads goodness [TS]

  alright so do you want to actually get [TS]

  to what we were planning on talking [TS]

  about today our next sponsor is [TS]

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  off now let's go on a little secret i [TS]

  don't like the websites i really don't I [TS]

  really to me like building a website for [TS]

  whatever else i'm doing is like the last [TS]

  thing that's on my priority list [TS]

  the last thing I want to work on and I [TS]

  just don't enjoy any part of making a [TS]

  website anymore if I ever did but i sure [TS]

  don't now and I'm a web developer if I [TS]

  said I hate making websites with [TS]

  squarespace the great thing about [TS]

  is that you for most of the things that [TS]

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  squarespace and then you can just be [TS]

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  to me anything that prevents me from [TS]

  having to make or maintain a website i [TS]

  consider that very valuable because the [TS]

  reality is if you love writing your own [TS]

  CMS find this it probably isn't the best [TS]

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  but you know you can probably find a [TS]

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  you can definitely find a reason to [TS]

  squarespace because any website you ever [TS]

  need to make for anything whether it's [TS]

  for yourself or if you're if you're [TS]

  making aside for somebody else and you [TS]

  don't want to have to support it all the [TS]

  time doing Squarespace and Squarespace [TS]

  supports it for you [TS]

  those people who are making for go to [TS]

  squarespace for help not you go check it [TS]

  out today go to start [TS]

  free trial site right now when you [TS]

  decide to sign up make sure to use the [TS]

  offer code ATP to get ten percent off [TS]

  your first purchase [TS]

  thank you very much to squarespace [TS]

  watching our show alright so there was a [TS]

  bit of a brouhaha over the last week or [TS]

  two about endorse ten ransomware attack [TS]

  this is the one that was in the [TS]

  transmitted by transmission which was a [TS]

  is a bittorrent client and no it'sit's a [TS]

  client for acquiring new home home [TS]

  videos at home movies but it was the [TS]

  opportunity call them home videos are [TS]

  home with the Home Videos indigo CS the [TS]

  transmission is a Bighorn bittorrent [TS]

  client / home movie acquire and [TS]

  apparently if i understood what happened [TS]

  correctly the website had been screwed [TS]

  with hijacked etc and somebody Reese I [TS]

  new transmission with a [TS]

  valid Apple service although not the [TS]

  original transmission circuit i believe [TS]

  that also had ransomware stuffed with in [TS]

  it and so a bunch of people downloaded [TS]

  from website and got infected version of [TS]

  transmission now sparkle which is the [TS]

  auto updater that many many many apps [TS]

  outside of the appstore use that i [TS]

  believe was written by you and Eva to [TS]

  Shaq originally anyway that up i guess [TS]

  was not affected but download from the [TS]

  website were and there was a ransomware [TS]

  virus thing in there that basically said [TS]

  hey we have just read we have encrypted [TS]

  your entire hard drive past money or you [TS]

  can never get a new files back I thought [TS]

  encrypted like individual files not the [TS]

  whole drive i didn't it's not hard disk [TS]

  encryption it was just like find your [TS]

  files and encrypt them yet you're [TS]

  correct so this was a bit of an issue [TS]

  and the biggest issue is it was signed I [TS]

  mean it was a valid mac app not for the [TS]

  app store of course but it was a valid [TS]

  mac app as far as your your installation [TS]

  palestine was concerned because was [TS]

  signed with a valid development [TS]

  certificate shady perhaps because was [TS]

  coming from a very different place than [TS]

  the normal transmission sir [TS]

  geographically speaking but it was still [TS]

  a valid cert so it was a bit of a [TS]

  cluster to say the least [TS]

  what do you think about this well the [TS]

  big angle that a lot of people started [TS]

  going for was hey if this was on the mac [TS]

  app store this would never have happened [TS]

  and that baby is true because what [TS]

  you're relying on the App Store as I [TS]

  guess a preview to realize that this [TS]

  supposed bittorrent client if you wait a [TS]

  couple days and it starts encrypting [TS]

  your files maybe they wouldn't have [TS]

  noticed that because again it does wait [TS]

  a couple days maybe they're trying to [TS]

  wait out a preview like the FB app [TS]

  reviewer launch this app and tried using [TS]

  it it would work as expected does app [TS]

  review like leave it on the system [TS]

  running for a couple days or leave it [TS]

  around like that maybe it would have got [TS]

  past app review as well but that's [TS]

  that's one angle on the other one is [TS]

  that the developer ID signing thing that [TS]

  that Apple has a have created with [TS]

  gatekeeper means that you download [TS]

  applications and [TS]

  they come in three forms totally [TS]

  unsigned you know pre gatekeeper [TS]

  applications which is how every single [TS]

  madcap was and all the years before [TS]

  gatekeepers who created the applications [TS]

  that are signed with a developer ID but [TS]

  don't come to the mac app store and then [TS]

  Mac App Store applications that sort of [TS]

  like three levels of I guess trust the [TS]

  totally untrusted one doesn't require [TS]

  anything for you download a binary you [TS]

  run into runs and that's you know that's [TS]

  the way Mac apps were for most of the [TS]

  life of the mac the developer ID ones [TS]

  all that does is tie it back to an apple [TS]

  developer account which presumably ties [TS]

  back to a person or institution or [TS]

  somebody you can hold responsible or [TS]

  whatever that's kind of relying on [TS]

  Apple's signup process to correctly [TS]

  identify somebody so like can you go [TS]

  through can you get apple developer [TS]

  certificate putting in totally fake [TS]

  information [TS]

  probably but that's that's the only [TS]

  thing that developer ID is giving you [TS]

  that well two things one that your [TS]

  application hasn't been modified in [TS]

  anyway which is kind of weird like what [TS]

  was wasn't transmission modify well they [TS]

  didn't just modify it [TS]

  they reassigned it so after they [TS]

  modified they signed it with their [TS]

  developer certificate and that's extra [TS]

  difficult authenticated the fact that [TS]

  yes this thing if someone modify this [TS]

  thing after you downloaded you'll know [TS]

  about it because the signature won't [TS]

  match but what you're worried about is [TS]

  somewhat modified it and then signed it [TS]

  and it is it is it you know I valid [TS]

  container for their malware somebody [TS]

  would try to mess with their malware [TS]

  signing would have caught it and then [TS]

  the mac app store like it's the next leg [TS]

  up where there's actual human beings [TS]

  looking at your application and making [TS]

  sure it's okay so why wasn't this [TS]

  application on the mac app store my [TS]

  understanding is the mac app store is [TS]

  not allowed back to our clients at all [TS]

  you guys know if that's the case that's [TS]

  right i believe that to be true and [TS]

  quick real-time follow up this [TS]

  encryption would never have worked in [TS]

  sandboxing so even if it made it through [TS]

  app review it we wouldn't have been able [TS]

  to touch the rest of the hours they [TS]

  can't get through to the finals I mean [TS]

  in reality like this is a bittorrent [TS]

  client so it needs to be able to write [TS]

  torrent downloads to a directory and so [TS]

  what would probably happen is yes you [TS]

  could use sandboxing to you know have it [TS]

  public dialogue and have you choose the [TS]

  directory where it can write much more [TS]

  likely would be that [TS]

  even if it was sandbox outside of my [TS]

  guests or even a sandboxed they're [TS]

  probably be some option where the guy [TS]

  we'll just you know we need to write [TS]

  your whole drive to make some features [TS]

  easier to make this flow better and most [TS]

  people would say okay you can't even get [TS]

  that you can't even get that what he [TS]

  calls an entitlement anymore i think i [TS]

  think you're right well so they just [TS]

  wouldn't be sandbox and nobody would [TS]

  care [TS]

  you know like it so yeah you know what [TS]

  would make it useful in the app store is [TS]

  the sandboxing requirement of the app [TS]

  store which is problematic in so many [TS]

  other ways but in this particular case [TS]

  that would have helped [TS]

  however the reality is as long as there [TS]

  is a way to download apps that aren't in [TS]

  the app store on the mac something like [TS]

  a bittorrent client is almost certainly [TS]

  going to be a little outside of the app [TS]

  store by almost all the tutors just [TS]

  because dealing with the appstore kind [TS]

  of sucks even as user these days and you [TS]

  can make a better bit torrent app [TS]

  without sandboxing so where the [TS]

  developer ID thing really came in here [TS]

  is like this transmission could have [TS]

  been the third kind of application that [TS]

  i said not not signed with any stuff is [TS]

  just a binary that you downloaded sort [TS]

  of an old-style mac app and if that had [TS]

  been the case and tons of people have [TS]

  downloaded and start encrypting their [TS]

  drives there there would be no real way [TS]

  to help them other than education saying [TS]

  hey if you accidentally downloaded this [TS]

  from this website during this time you [TS]

  probably got infected version you should [TS]

  delete it and do this and do that and [TS]

  here's how to disinfect your system and [TS]

  so on and so forth but because it was [TS]

  signed with the developer ID Apple could [TS]

  revoke the certificate of that developer [TS]

  ID through the little sneaky update [TS]

  thing that we just described the [TS]

  checkbox if we didn't think was there [TS]

  the reason regular users should keep [TS]

  that checkbox checked is that the Apple [TS]

  canada has central control to make sure [TS]

  that this thing doesn't launch anymore [TS]

  we actually are getting real-time [TS]

  follow-up from mr. the chat saying that [TS]

  applicant blacklist any binary through [TS]

  that system including unsigned one [TS]

  well in developer ideas and wasn't [TS]

  helping at all that's a shame [TS]

  yeah that's alright so what was a what [TS]

  were the makers of transmission getting [TS]

  out of using developer ID I suppose they [TS]

  make people might have to go to the [TS]

  gatekeeper settings and put it in the [TS]

  most insecure mode [TS]

  well no you can also what is it right [TS]

  click and go in and select open and then [TS]

  it will say oh my god are you really [TS]

  sure [TS]

  and then you can say yes yes I'm really [TS]

  sure yeah i was saying what do you what [TS]

  do you get out of the developer ID thing [TS]

  as a developer i guess you get less [TS]

  scary experience for users because you [TS]

  don't require them to go to settings [TS]

  they don't understand change it in a way [TS]

  that pops up warning dialog boxes or [TS]

  whatever [TS]

  yeah you you don't require them to like [TS]

  right-click and select open the first [TS]

  time they run the app and I got that go [TS]

  to the extra scared like they still have [TS]

  the scary this application download from [TS]

  the internet dialogue but if they just [TS]

  double-click on a nap under default [TS]

  settings that is unsigned it doesn't [TS]

  then run it it says I'm sorry is one [TS]

  side and then you have like right click [TS]

  and say open then then so it lets them [TS]

  bypass all of that which you know if you [TS]

  do if you're distributing mac apps in [TS]

  this day and age that you should almost [TS]

  always have at least developer idea if [TS]

  not the app store and of course in [TS]

  theory you can track it back to whoever [TS]

  whatever Apple Developer account signed [TS]

  the bad piece of and again that's the [TS]

  disconnect detective work can you find [TS]

  someone who you want to hold responsible [TS]

  they put valid information are they in a [TS]

  country hit that has a legal system that [TS]

  lets you find them or help them [TS]

  accountable in some way i'm assuming not [TS]

  i mean the other alternative suggestions [TS]

  that room is that maybe it was just a [TS]

  legitimate developer they got a [TS]

  developer account hacked someone got [TS]

  into the developer county they were [TS]

  getting their password doing something [TS]

  some other way to get into the developer [TS]

  account [TS]

  there's also been a couple of bugs [TS]

  around that make it seem like you could [TS]

  exploit gatekeeper to execute arbitrary [TS]

  software as if it's trusted those have [TS]

  been surmised than in years past but [TS]

  there's so many ways you can hide from [TS]

  the consequences of doing this bad thing [TS]

  that that's like the maker of this [TS]

  ransomware like they're there they're [TS]

  bad actor here are they going to be [TS]

  caught and punished we have the tools to [TS]

  do that maybe maybe not [TS]

  probably not i mean the and not everyone [TS]

  is somewhere where you can get at them [TS]

  so anyway x protect the thing that [TS]

  downloads the law updates in the [TS]

  background and disables things a likely [TS]

  that driver [TS]

  it may have it may have disabled your [TS]

  ethernet driver one week but the next [TS]

  week it may have saved you from getting [TS]

  your files encrypted by ransom or yeah i [TS]

  mean that this is one of those cases [TS]

  where most of the time the one of the [TS]

  angles that like big business tries to [TS]

  try to scare people with to scare them [TS]

  away from piracy is well you know if you [TS]

  pirate stuff you never know what you're [TS]

  getting it could be dangerous you could [TS]

  get hack you could get malware you know [TS]

  and most of the time that doesn't happen [TS]

  with piracy like most of the time it's [TS]

  fine and that's one of the reasons so [TS]

  many people do it but this is like the [TS]

  one time where they were actually right [TS]

  let's work you know that we really need [TS]

  protection from gatekeeper and from [TS]

  sandboxing and you shouldn't pyar things [TS]

  because you're putting yourself at risk [TS]

  than living random software for many [TS]

  places like this is the one time where [TS]

  that was actually true but that being [TS]

  said I think this made for interesting [TS]

  news and it could prompt some [TS]

  interesting discussions for these few [TS]

  days but i don't think this is going to [TS]

  meaningfully change anything for anybody [TS]

  it's estimated that I think somebody [TS]

  said that the total number of downloads [TS]

  with the malware included was only [TS]

  something like 6,000 which for something [TS]

  like this that's not that giant of a [TS]

  number and then you know Apple fairly [TS]

  quickly blacklisted the binary so it it [TS]

  probably didn't even trigger the malware [TS]

  like the encryption step of the malware [TS]

  for most of those people so I I don't [TS]

  know this doesn't seem like it's that [TS]

  big of an event it's it's more about you [TS]

  know what it what how we're all talking [TS]

  about like you know does this change our [TS]

  our opinions of what the max should be [TS]

  where it should go security on the mac [TS]

  and that I think is a conversation worth [TS]

  having [TS]

  but this particular matter i think it is [TS]

  mostly a non-event and interestingly it [TS]

  wasn't like pirated software that was [TS]

  infected it was the software used to get [TS]

  the packets of expenditures slightly [TS]

  different but and movies and don't [TS]

  forget [TS]

  yeah and this is kind of a shame as big [TS]

  as developers like this whose [TS]

  applications basically can't be on the [TS]

  mac app store for a policy reason [TS]

  setting aside all the things that [TS]

  you're talking about Marco about like [TS]

  well the good ones would want full [TS]

  access to your drive and it's less than [TS]

  going to use but even just like if [TS]

  they're categorically denied because we [TS]

  think BitTorrent clients are are just as [TS]

  a category a thing that we don't want to [TS]

  the max are for App Store for whatever [TS]

  reason if you're a developer who makes a [TS]

  bittorrent client and you're trying to [TS]

  like do as good a job as you can do not [TS]

  being in the mac app store you would get [TS]

  a developer ID and you would sign your [TS]

  application and you would do all these [TS]

  things but you know everybody you know [TS]

  everyone gets bored sometimes I they [TS]

  could you could end up getting act so [TS]

  they could hack your website they could [TS]

  shove a little thing inside your [TS]

  downloadable application bundle and your [TS]

  reputation is smeared because everyone [TS]

  you know thanks that was whether you [TS]

  knew about it or not it's like a [TS]

  transmission isn't that thing that [TS]

  encrypts your drive and and you know [TS]

  like I feel like they're doing [TS]

  everything they could within the bounds [TS]

  of the technology and the you know the [TS]

  sort of the the rules of the system [TS]

  they're operating in and I I feel bad [TS]

  that they had a bad result that I don't [TS]

  blame the developers and I i do give [TS]

  credit to apple for having the you know [TS]

  for in putting in the system that they [TS]

  put in so many years ago to give them [TS]

  the ability to deal with this but it [TS]

  does make me feel a little bit less safe [TS]

  about downloading applications on the [TS]

  Mac because I you know I downloaded [TS]

  plenty of applications not for the mac [TS]

  app store or from the mac app store for [TS]

  that matter and every single one of [TS]

  those is exploitable through a [TS]

  non-technological means like four [TS]

  available mac app store application [TS]

  I don't have any faith that app review [TS]

  would correctly detect some sort of [TS]

  clever sleeping you know it waits a week [TS]

  and then it wakes up and does something [TS]

  bad do your thing and all that it takes [TS]

  for that to happen is for someone to get [TS]

  some poor legitimate developers a [TS]

  developer account password and you know [TS]

  you mock up one of their builds or [TS]

  submitted build our while they're away [TS]

  on vacation or do something else like [TS]

  that's just like a social engineering [TS]

  has nothing to do with technology as far [TS]

  as the entire tech stack is concerned [TS]

  this would be a completely validated [TS]

  approved Mac application and they'll be [TS]

  sandbox and everything like that and I [TS]

  have [TS]

  you know that is there a way to get out [TS]

  of the sandbox within the bounds of [TS]

  samba sandbox can do all sorts of damage [TS]

  probably like you could turn on the [TS]

  camera you could capture keystrokes type [TS]

  into that application who knows what you [TS]

  can do so like there's there is no truly [TS]

  safe scenario and I I wonder exactly how [TS]

  much safer users are overall if [TS]

  applications if we assume a gap store is [TS]

  a superior level of security to just [TS]

  developer ID it seems to me that every [TS]

  category of application that is just not [TS]

  allowed on the mac app store for some [TS]

  reason is potentially decreasing the [TS]

  security of users over what they could [TS]

  be if the mac app store is it was more [TS]

  permissive in terms of sure you can have [TS]

  a bittorrent client like it's you know [TS]

  we don't we don't say those things are [TS]

  you know no matter what we don't say [TS]

  those things are just evil [TS]

  we don't care how you use the bizarre [TS]

  legitimate uses for the most fun plenty [TS]

  of linux distros and stuff that are [TS]

  distributed by a bittorrent because it's [TS]

  a fast way to download stuff all right [TS]

  software dangerous be careful out there [TS]

  oh man this is like that's that's the [TS]

  argument I I one of the strongest [TS]

  arguments for Apple to actually improve [TS]

  the mac app store and sandboxing because [TS]

  right now to have a situation where the [TS]

  mac app store is just beyond disrepair i [TS]

  mean it's its seemingly totally [TS]

  unstaffed there's the app itself that [TS]

  that is this you know the store app that [TS]

  runs is horrible its buggy it's messy [TS]

  it's inconsistent it's outdated i mean [TS]

  it's it's just I'd say it's one of the [TS]

  worst apps Apple ships right now is the [TS]

  Mac App Store app the service behind it [TS]

  is spotty at best review times for [TS]

  developers are lengthy and inconsistent [TS]

  way worse than iOS and you have this [TS]

  technical requirements sandboxing that [TS]

  while great in theory is a huge pain for [TS]

  developers because it has also been [TS]

  kinda half baked in its implementation [TS]

  and also effectively unmaintained so you [TS]

  know and and I i want to i want to maybe [TS]

  get to Steve trend Smith's post about [TS]

  his WC predictions that came up couple [TS]

  weeks ago and and his statement that Mac [TS]

  os10 is a dead platform [TS]

  I i want to maybe get to that but and [TS]

  maybe this might lead us into that a [TS]

  little bit but it just seems like you [TS]

  know Apple started down this path with [TS]

  the appstore sandboxing that they kind [TS]

  of the they said all right here's the [TS]

  future here's how we're gonna do this is [TS]

  gonna be great [TS]

  they started and then it seems like [TS]

  nothing has changed since the mac app [TS]

  store launched a except the introduction [TS]

  sandboxing which came shortly after that [TS]

  and then it seems like nothing has [TS]

  changed with sandboxing since then [TS]

  either so we have a situation now where [TS]

  we have what is in theory a great system [TS]

  that could in theory protect people's [TS]

  max better and have more secure software [TS]

  and it easier distribution but in [TS]

  practice the implementation of that [TS]

  system has been fairly mediocre and it's [TS]

  been almost untouched for years so if [TS]

  Apple really wants to improve the [TS]

  security of the Mack what they have to [TS]

  do is make these things better make you [TS]

  know make the app store and sandboxing [TS]

  able to support more apps so that more [TS]

  apps can do it and make them good enough [TS]

  that the developers are are incentivized [TS]

  that they actually want to be in the app [TS]

  store and they actually want to adopt [TS]

  sandboxing but it just seems like [TS]

  there's like nobody you know driving the [TS]

  ship or whatever if you had been looking [TS]

  the show and see what a scene we push [TS]

  that down for next week and if you have [TS]

  not been on vacation you would have [TS]

  heard me talk about that exact question [TS]

  on upgrade i didn't want but I don't [TS]

  know I spoiler alert i haven't listened [TS]

  yet i was saving it for my car ride [TS]

  coming up to my right but I didn't [TS]

  reject one of the topics that Jason [TS]

  suggested because i wanted to save it [TS]

  for the show [TS]

  no thanks buddy and it was not that 1i I [TS]

  think there's some ground to cover here [TS]

  that you guys didn't cover upgrade [TS]

  because you know you you you made a good [TS]

  case for what the mac is and what it [TS]

  should be which I can summarize if [TS]

  you'll permit is basically like the max [TS]

  should be like the rock like that the [TS]

  stable reliable platform that's kinda [TS]

  boring to get updates but is stable and [TS]

  reliable and i agree there's one option [TS]

  the other option was you do another OS [TS]

  10 type transition right sure [TS]

  honestly though I don't really see Apple [TS]

  doing that I mean I could hear i hope [TS]

  i'm wrong but it doesn't seem [TS]

  like the devoted enough resources to the [TS]

  mac anymore to really do any more big [TS]

  transitions I i think the era of big mac [TS]

  transitions over and that might that [TS]

  might be good it's probably not but [TS]

  ultimately it seems like modern-day [TS]

  Apple seems to have this this severe [TS]

  problem of of basically just like as i [TS]

  mentioned before like the kind of the [TS]

  drive-by updates because they don't [TS]

  really have enough people that are like [TS]

  permanently staffed on on major parts of [TS]

  their engineering stuff anymore like it [TS]

  seems like so much of apples engineering [TS]

  resources or are being devoted to other [TS]

  things [TS]

  iOS TV watch a car and most likely you [TS]

  know other things like that it seems [TS]

  like they they keep moving the town [TS]

  around so much that there's just nobody [TS]

  left working on things on boring old [TS]

  things like the mac and we haven't even [TS]

  seen how they can how they can do their [TS]

  current platform yet like we haven't [TS]

  even seen what happens with watch OS and [TS]

  TV OS this year they're each you know [TS]

  less than a year old at what you know [TS]

  wilda's Apple have the the engineering [TS]

  capacity to keep mac OS IRS on the [TS]

  iphone and the ipad which are actually [TS]

  quite different these days TV OS watch [TS]

  OS and the future karo as they have the [TS]

  capacity to maintain all of those to a [TS]

  healthy level from what we've seen so [TS]

  far I think the answer is probably not [TS]

  the questions that cannot be what gets [TS]

  back bird what gets put in cases parking [TS]

  lot full of white cars look it's ignored [TS]

  you know and I think usually it's been [TS]

  the mac and the ipad that's usually what [TS]

  gets ignored this year you know your [TS]

  ipad got some attention [TS]

  we'll see what happens as time goes on [TS]

  but they probably are not in the [TS]

  position where they're going to devote [TS]

  tons of engineering talent the mac and [TS]

  that's unfortunate and it is it is [TS]

  amateur platform that doesn't need a lot [TS]

  of attention but I I again I I'm [TS]

  concerned whether they'll be able to do [TS]

  any kind of big changes in the future so [TS]

  I think it's more likely that we'll keep [TS]

  it on its current path of basically [TS]

  being the nice boring thing that most of [TS]

  us use and depend on very heavily for [TS]

  work but it doesn't look a lot of [TS]

  attention from Apple don't have it so [TS]

  much about their capacity to do it as [TS]

  like that they're going to put resources [TS]

  towards things with growth potential and [TS]

  regardless of the size of the mac and [TS]

  how it may be growing big the company [TS]

  feels that the potential growth that is [TS]

  does not warrant putting lots of [TS]

  resources behind it versus say the watch [TS]

  where it's conceivable that they could [TS]

  believe that the watch is like the start [TS]

  of a whole wearables thing and that the [TS]

  potential upside is huge so we're going [TS]

  to put a lot of time and effort into the [TS]

  watch then we'll see the growth [TS]

  potential is there for the mac i think [TS]

  the company feels like most customers [TS]

  and observers of the industry feel like [TS]

  there is not a tremendous growth [TS]

  potential in personal computer [TS]

  traditional personal computers anymore [TS]

  so when it comes time to allocate apples [TS]

  billions of dollars it's easier to make [TS]

  the argument for the car or the watch or [TS]

  even the TV because they're also smaller [TS]

  sonu or so non-existent that is very [TS]

  easy to spin out a tale of potential [TS]

  huge growth that will start down here [TS]

  and the graph will go way up there [TS]

  whereas the mac if it has to argue for [TS]

  its resources it can show what its [TS]

  revenue is and how it's going faster [TS]

  than the industry and has taken a chair [TS]

  for Windows PCs but they say okay [TS]

  is the mac going to be four times the [TS]

  the size it is in a couple years they [TS]

  have to say well no probably not and so [TS]

  maybe they just don't get the resources [TS]

  on before we go too far deeper on this [TS]

  because I think this might take a while [TS]

  let's do it let's cover final sponsor us [TS]

  take a while something what Apple in the [TS]

  mac right our final sponsor this week is [TS]

  hover hover com for the best way to buy [TS]

  a manager main names [TS]

  use promo code this week Craig's house [TS]

  for ten percent off your first purchase [TS]

  ever gives you easy to use powerful [TS]

  tools to buy a managed domain names so [TS]

  anybody can do it whether it's geeks [TS]

  like us we're regular people hovers [TS]

  easy-to-use and they have great support [TS]

  if you needed in fact they even have [TS]

  amazing phone support where if you are [TS]

  confused or need them to do something [TS]

  you can call on the phone during [TS]

  business hours and they have no wait no [TS]

  hold no transfer phone policy which [TS]

  means that literally you call them on [TS]

  the phone and if its business hours [TS]

  a human being picked up the phone and [TS]

  that human being can help you [TS]

  they don't have to transfer five [TS]

  different things there's no stupid menus [TS]

  you don't have to say like track a [TS]

  package like now that crap you it's just [TS]

  straightforward a human being picked up [TS]

  the phone who can help you [TS]

  it's fantastic and of course they also [TS]

  have you know email support you need [TS]

  that and online online resources to [TS]

  fight that but however is great in less [TS]

  than five minutes you can find domain [TS]

  name that you want and you can get it up [TS]

  and running all you have to do is search [TS]

  for a few keywords and they will show [TS]

  you the best available options across [TS]

  all domain extensions out there and [TS]

  there are so many weird domains now you [TS]

  can get like diamonds not plumbing and [TS]

  everything they have all those plus all [TS]

  the old ones you can get a more [TS]

  conservative if you want to but [TS]

  basically with all these new TLDs out [TS]

  there almost any word you want you can [TS]

  get dot something with that word in [TS]

  front of it so it's great now and you [TS]

  version if you ever use any other to any [TS]

  other during register before you [TS]

  probably know that it's been unpleasant [TS]

  in the past to register domain names [TS]

  most of these sites there there clunk [TS]

  either hard to use my train derailed [TS]

  your intellect confusing upsells or [TS]

  weird privacy options that you don't [TS]

  really understand however doesn't [TS]

  believe any of that they have great [TS]

  designs are respectful of you and your [TS]

  time and your attention and your money [TS]

  because hover does not try to upsell you [TS]

  on crazy stuff they include everything [TS]

  for free that should be freely domain [TS]

  privacy and they really have very [TS]

  reasonably priced options after that for [TS]

  things like email hosting if you want if [TS]

  you need email in your domain that's [TS]

  really easy to get really simple we [TS]

  don't have to you can just get them and [TS]

  be done with it very reasonable prices [TS]

  overall they're really simple to use and [TS]

  very respectful of you and those are [TS]

  things that are pretty rare in this [TS]

  business go to hover com and use promo [TS]

  code Craig's house for ten percent off [TS]

  your first purchase thanks a lot to her [TS]

  for sponsoring our show so I think with [TS]

  the mac what what's important about it [TS]

  is that they just maintain what they've [TS]

  started here you know the mac is the [TS]

  pinnacle of personal computing it really [TS]

  is the best personal computer out there [TS]

  and whether or not personal computing [TS]

  has a huge potential in front of it i [TS]

  think you're right it probably doesn't [TS]

  but doesn't mean it's going away and it [TS]

  doesn't mean it isn't already big and [TS]

  important you know and yet it isn't as [TS]

  important as the iphone but it is still [TS]

  really important to a lot of people [TS]

  and it is also the area in which i would [TS]

  say Apple has the worst and least [TS]

  threatening competition you know that [TS]

  Apple has tons of competition in a very [TS]

  strong competition in phones and tablets [TS]

  and watches in TV boxes and they will [TS]

  have tons of competition in cars with if [TS]

  you're doing that was sure sounds like [TS]

  they are for it in the mac for picture [TS]

  personal computing I don't know a lot of [TS]

  mac users who are like you know what I'm [TS]

  tempted to go try windows like that [TS]

  never happens like yeah they don't have [TS]

  it you know windows are still the [TS]

  majority market share holder but first [TS]

  of all that said something about growth [TS]

  I think but but you know windows are [TS]

  still you know the the majority holder [TS]

  here but the matches so good and so many [TS]

  of us rely on it and I I feel like [TS]

  apples responsibility to keep it decent [TS]

  to keep it good and apple needs the mac [TS]

  also i mean what are the right ones iOS [TS]

  apps on empty i guess we can get to [TS]

  Xcode on the iPads as a potential future [TS]

  thing but xcode for iOS is coming is it [TS]

  someday I'll remember the remember the [TS]

  Swift announcement i totally thought [TS]

  that was going to be trying to I did [TS]

  tweet about it a while back i pinpointed [TS]

  the exact second in the video when they [TS]

  were leading up to the Swift [TS]

  announcement they said a bunch of a [TS]

  couple sentences and I thought the [TS]

  sentences were like this is it sex card [TS]

  for iOS it wasn't but the fact that i [TS]

  was the fact that i was so willing to [TS]

  believe that that's what they were [TS]

  announcing based on like they're vague [TS]

  introductory statements AJ seems [TS]

  inevitable to make some day but yeah [TS]

  like that the the Mac the Mac is not use [TS]

  other week better to the mac like you [TS]

  know no one wants a dell running windows [TS]

  or whatever you know as as we all know [TS]

  the real competitive the mac is things [TS]

  that are not personal computers Apple [TS]

  knows that everybody knows that the [TS]

  maintenance argument is like right well [TS]

  so until something until unless [TS]

  something comes along that can do [TS]

  everything the mac does better right [TS]

  until the ipad pro grows into that role [TS]

  or whatever that grows into that role [TS]

  like maybe Rolanda vr by then who knows [TS]

  until that happens we still got max is [TS]

  still big business you have to put a [TS]

  certain amount of effort into it just to [TS]

  keep that business going and that argues [TS]

  for their like the suggestion yeah you [TS]

  mentioned from upgrade my one of my want [TS]

  to pass the mac which is the stability [TS]

  path which is not just like [TS]

  do what it takes to keep the mac sort of [TS]

  humming along the way it is but like you [TS]

  know I i had visitors are two strengths [TS]

  of the mac one strength of the mac is [TS]

  that it is the platform that you expect [TS]

  not to change and grow that much like [TS]

  it's not in the the market that's taking [TS]

  off like a rocket or whatever so how can [TS]

  you turn that into a strength you could [TS]

  turn into a strength by saying okay what [TS]

  we're going to do with the mac year [TS]

  after year after year it's all we're [TS]

  gonna do is find every single thing that [TS]

  doesn't work on it and make it work like [TS]

  that's all we're going to do we're not [TS]

  going to care how many bullet points in [TS]

  features that we have like nothing like [TS]

  you're not going to add features but [TS]

  every single day release all you want to [TS]

  do is brag about how much better the [TS]

  thing you know how much more it does but [TS]

  it was always supposed to do it in the [TS]

  first place how much more stable it is [TS]

  you know how many bugs you've squashed [TS]

  any part of it you know security would [TS]

  be a great area to go in into on the Mac [TS]

  was that's kind of stability things like [TS]

  a feature like we're really nailing down [TS]

  security even more and more clothing [TS]

  more security holes being you know [TS]

  that's one way to go and so that would [TS]

  make an experience as a Mac user is like [TS]

  well every year there's not a million [TS]

  new features but every year the mat gets [TS]

  better and better like it gets better [TS]

  for the purpose that we're using it and [TS]

  that would be you would sell it based on [TS]

  that you would say like you can start [TS]

  selling them to the world's most [TS]

  reliable operating system bulletproof or [TS]

  you know yet what whatever however you [TS]

  want to spend like you can sell [TS]

  stability because if you told any mac [TS]

  user right now that we have a new [TS]

  version of the mac operating system that [TS]

  you know snow leopard style has no new [TS]

  features and not only that but also like [TS]

  we didn't rip out any subsystems and [TS]

  change anything we just like we said [TS]

  what it does now we're gonna make it do [TS]

  that better people like yeah sure [TS]

  signing up if you heard from friends [TS]

  that I i installed the new mac operating [TS]

  system and everything was exactly the [TS]

  same except for whatever problem i used [TS]

  to have is gone now they would they [TS]

  would love that right and the other [TS]

  option to go on the mac is what could [TS]

  what is the other strength of the Mack [TS]

  it's not you have a minus is not battery [TS]

  power because laptops are the majority [TS]

  of the max old but you have a higher [TS]

  power envelope that you do on iPads and [TS]

  phones and stuff like that you can right [TS]

  now you could put more powerful stuff [TS]

  inside a mac even a laptop [TS]

  you can inside a phone or tablet because [TS]

  i pads are because a max and you know [TS]

  even this then finish laptop max [TS]

  everything they have a higher overhead [TS]

  you can fit more stuff in there you can [TS]

  put a bigger battery and you put a hard [TS]

  cpu maybe not that much higher in the [TS]

  case of the macbook one but certainly [TS]

  much hotter in the case of the iMac [TS]

  which is plugged into the wall or the [TS]

  mac pro or the 15 inch or whatever take [TS]

  advantage of that pursue the high-end [TS]

  there try to it try to install the [TS]

  fastest of the fast stuff cater to the [TS]

  the idea that if you have minimal [TS]

  computer needs get the macbook one or an [TS]

  iOS device but if you really want a big [TS]

  strong Mac will make you the biggest [TS]

  strongest back you can have and then [TS]

  what you would do with the software i [TS]

  say every year is gonna get faster and [TS]

  more powerful and we're going to have [TS]

  you know the the the fanciest features [TS]

  in the best gpus in the best cpus and [TS]

  the fastest SSDs and stuff like that [TS]

  really make it like a pro product that [TS]

  takes advantage of the Macan so far [TS]

  applebees we doing it needed one of [TS]

  those things instead they're kinda like [TS]

  limping along every year they feel like [TS]

  they need to do release where they have [TS]

  some features to town and they're kind [TS]

  of monkeying around inside there and [TS]

  they do fix the bugs they don't make it [TS]

  super duper fast and you know but they [TS]

  don't on the other hand they don't do [TS]

  nothin year after year and make it [TS]

  boring and that strategy of sort of [TS]

  maintenance level investment with an [TS]

  outward appearance of every year there's [TS]

  an amazing new OS just doesn't seem to [TS]

  be striking the balance for for [TS]

  customers [TS]

  one thing I would say too is like NN [TS]

  Steve transmit cover this in his blog [TS]

  post also i really think that [TS]

  development of apps for the mac is [TS]

  really seemingly at a standstill [TS]

  you know even Apple can barely keep [TS]

  their own apps developed for the mac and [TS]

  and certainly third-party developing [TS]

  developing for the mac seems to be [TS]

  almost non-existent I mean there's very [TS]

  little action happening they're all the [TS]

  actions of iOS and obviously a big part [TS]

  of that is that developing apps on iOS [TS]

  has a bigger market you know you can you [TS]

  can sell more people there's more people [TS]

  shopping in the app store so like the [TS]

  chances of you making a ton of money by [TS]

  being on top chart it is higher on iOS [TS]

  probably [TS]

  but there is a big part of this too on [TS]

  the Mac where the mac does not run uikit [TS]

  the mac runs app get its own you know [TS]

  older framework that was kind of like [TS]

  you like it but when you write apps for [TS]

  iOS you run against this this newer kind [TS]

  of cleaner more modern framework and [TS]

  when you write up for the Mac you're [TS]

  right against this crusty or older [TS]

  framework that has a lot more baggage [TS]

  and legacy in it at UI kit was cut up [TS]

  for iOS kind of like you know the the [TS]

  new version of the UI framework with all [TS]

  the lessons they've learned from [TS]

  advocate over the years and the mac has [TS]

  gotten some of those lessons ported back [TS]

  to it from iOS four developers to make [TS]

  things easier but but but i think still [TS]

  not most of them and I think as a [TS]

  developer who came here kinda threw iOS [TS]

  and and who and I i currently have not i [TS]

  don't have any mac apps that I've that [TS]

  I've released or that i'm working on [TS]

  really don't get too crazy at all [TS]

  sorry so you know I that I would be so [TS]

  much more likely to to put effort into [TS]

  mac apps if they used a version of UI [TS]

  kit and I've tried app kid I tried [TS]

  making as before and I'm sure if I was [TS]

  if I was you know entirely motivated to [TS]

  do it i plowed through and learn and it [TS]

  would be fine and learned that kid I [TS]

  tolerating doesn't know be fine but the [TS]

  fact is right now the fact that I that I [TS]

  have to learn this similar but still [TS]

  fairly different UI framework on the mac [TS]

  to make mac apps that is a big barrier [TS]

  that is discouraging me from doing it so [TS]

  you have a combination of no UI kit on [TS]

  the mac plus the crappy appstore [TS]

  situation plus the fact that it's a [TS]

  smaller market to begin with I feel like [TS]

  that the something there has to change [TS]

  for developers to be interested in [TS]

  making mac apps and right now it seems [TS]

  like nothing is on the horizon for any [TS]

  of those things to change you know app [TS]

  get proponents or experts can make all [TS]

  the same all the same arguments that [TS]

  that shouldn't matter that people like [TS]

  me make about Swift not being necessary [TS]

  thank you you can you can look at that [TS]

  you can say well you know I could learn [TS]

  objective-c but he'll these ugly [TS]

  brackets I don't want to and Swift comes [TS]

  along eventually and it switches getting [TS]

  a lot of people into into iOS and mac [TS]

  development who weren't there before [TS]

  because they just didn't want to learn [TS]

  objective-c a similar kind of effect [TS]

  could happen on the mac with with you [TS]

  like it you know if they brought uikit [TS]

  in some in some form obviously I [TS]

  couldn't be identical but if they [TS]

  brought in some form to the mac i think [TS]

  that would that would really bring in a [TS]

  lot of developer interest and really [TS]

  help a reignite third-party interest in [TS]

  the mac as an application platform so I [TS]

  hear us and we're not the only ones talk [TS]

  about well the mac app store is a [TS]

  dumpster fire which shrank it kind of is [TS]

  nobody's doing much for the ipad these [TS]

  days by in large obviously federico [TS]

  amongst others would would disagree but [TS]

  certainly there's a lot of people that [TS]

  are paying a lot of attention the ipad [TS]

  you're not paying much attention to the [TS]

  ipad Marco for example and opaque [TS]

  upfront apps are a dumpster fire you [TS]

  didn't me that's poor way of phrasing it [TS]

  but they don't really work [TS]

  the only thing that's even slightly [TS]

  working seems to be free with in-app [TS]

  purchase so I feel like the three of us [TS]

  and again we're not the only ones say [TS]

  the mac app store Sox ipad app store Sox [TS]

  the iphone app store store has a lot of [TS]

  great options but it sucks to make money [TS]

  and they are we crazy like there's a lot [TS]

  of apps in the App Store and there's a [TS]

  lot of stuff getting made every single [TS]

  day so why like either were a little bit [TS]

  crazy or it's just not as dire as we [TS]

  think it is it does that make sense like [TS]

  it just the the situation cannot be as [TS]

  bad as we're painting it that you're [TS]

  confusing different kinds of badness [TS]

  alright so one kind of badness is the [TS]

  the fact that it doesn't seem to be a [TS]

  lot of people making new mac [TS]

  applications like that there's every [TS]

  week there are thousands of new mac [TS]

  applications most of which may be crap [TS]

  but every once in a while there's a good [TS]

  like there's not a lot of activity not a [TS]

  lot of churn not a lot of like there's a [TS]

  lot of there's not a growing base of [TS]

  customers to sell to that base is small [TS]

  and there's not tons and tons of [TS]

  developers knocking on door to make tons [TS]

  of new mac apps so that's one kind of [TS]

  ailment because if you have a software [TS]

  market and not many people are making [TS]

  new applications for that platform the [TS]

  platform feels kind of crappy the iphone [TS]

  has the opposite problem [TS]

  everybody wants to make an appt [TS]

  everybody's making a nap and they're [TS]

  just all climbing all over each other to [TS]

  get the last scraps and figure out how [TS]

  to exploit people to extract money was [TS]

  touched so many apps is too many apps in [TS]

  the app store it's not because people [TS]

  don't care about the iphone people care [TS]

  about the iphone a lot like there's tons [TS]

  of developers as tons of apps and all [TS]

  the things you described about their but [TS]

  all you can have paid upfront apps and [TS]

  blah blah that's a symptom of an [TS]

  entirely opposite problem which is you [TS]

  know too much activity lots of [TS]

  competition lots of people trying to [TS]

  figure out how to get money and plenty [TS]

  of people getting rich on on the app [TS]

  store like enough people that it [TS]

  attracts other people right from the [TS]

  outside it looks like all you hear about [TS]

  the stories of the five developers who [TS]

  are getting red trainer realize that [TS]

  there were 10,000 have submitted that [TS]

  week right [TS]

  and none of those people are going to [TS]

  rich p there's enough people getting [TS]

  rich that it seems like thats place to [TS]

  go everyone has phones huge market even [TS]

  if the market is growing its still [TS]

  tremendous so but there's just two ends [TS]

  of the spectrum the phone in the mac [TS]

  both of which have problems but they're [TS]

  totally opposite problems I mean you [TS]

  would kill to get a little bit of that [TS]

  iOS App Store problem on the Mac we're [TS]

  all we can't handle the the overflow [TS]

  everytime everytime I look at the maps [TS]

  or there's 10,000 new applications i [TS]

  can't handle it [TS]

  that just doesn't happen right so and [TS]

  then in the middle the ipad i think it [TS]

  has more of the max problem where it's [TS]

  like yeah there's lots of applications [TS]

  that you can run on the ipad but not a [TS]

  lot of them really take advantage of [TS]

  what's different about the ipad you know [TS]

  so the big complaint now is that people [TS]

  are IRS applications that already run [TS]

  the ipad but don't take advantage of [TS]

  split-screen or don't support the ipad [TS]

  pros display or both and why don't they [TS]

  update them well it turns out that there [TS]

  even though the iOS platform has tons of [TS]

  customers the ipad subset is much [TS]

  smaller and so it's more like the mac [TS]

  where like if I had to spend some time [TS]

  going to make sure that my iOS [TS]

  application is updated for the iphone 7 [TS]

  whatever new features that has [TS]

  and then maybe when I have time I'll [TS]

  update the if i get around to it update [TS]

  mud the ipad version of my iOS [TS]

  application to take advantage of [TS]

  something that only works on the big [TS]

  ipad like split screen or whatever so [TS]

  you're right that there's something to [TS]

  complain about everywhere but I don't [TS]

  think it's I don't think it's as if [TS]

  we're saying that they all have the same [TS]

  problem they have very different [TS]

  problems with very different causes in [TS]

  very different solutions so it doesn't [TS]

  very different solutions so it doesn't [TS]

  doesn't seem to be a contradiction to me [TS]

  i guess that's fair i don't know it just [TS]

  seems weird that all three platforms [TS]

  seem to have some really really systemic [TS]

  issues and i'm not saying that that [TS]

  those issues aren't real i'm not saying [TS]

  that they're not extremely important but [TS]

  I don't know just how does Apple not [TS]

  either not care or not fix this or we [TS]

  crazy and it's not as bad as we think it [TS]

  is I don't just seems weird to me that [TS]

  that we feel and again when it's not [TS]

  just us so many people feel like this is [TS]

  broken and there seems to be not a lot [TS]

  of care given to it from apple and I [TS]

  presume that there is care but as usual [TS]

  it's all happening internally and [TS]

  working on the wiser but golly I it's [TS]

  just it seems weird to me that there's [TS]

  no action on this [TS]

  well you haven't listed like the pros of [TS]

  for example the mac side where with [TS]

  something that we all hear from our [TS]

  developer friends and that's probably [TS]

  true is that it [TS]

  it's easier to make money with a really [TS]

  good application on the mac minute is an [TS]

  iOS because if you have a really good [TS]

  application iOS guess what there are [TS]

  thousands of really good applications [TS]

  iOS if you have a really good [TS]

  application on the mac there are not [TS]

  thousands of really good applications in [TS]

  the mag especially not thousands in your [TS]

  category whatever kind of application [TS]

  that you made and for whatever reason [TS]

  again it may just have to do with [TS]

  physical size or whatever you can tend [TS]

  to charge more for the mac vs not [TS]

  tremendously more these days but still [TS]

  more so if you are super talented [TS]

  developer and you can make a really good [TS]

  application in a category that is not [TS]

  overcrowded on any platform if you make [TS]

  it a mac application charge 999 for it [TS]

  even though you will sell far fewer [TS]

  copies you will make up for it for the [TS]

  fact that you'll see he'll sell you'll [TS]

  make more money on the mac and I and [TS]

  again it's hard to go apples and oranges [TS]

  there is like well you can make the same [TS]

  application you can make an iOS and who [TS]

  knows maybe we'll take you longer to [TS]

  make it on the Maccabees like Marco you [TS]

  don't know the mac and you have to learn [TS]

  over there are lots of variables in the [TS]

  mix here but I would imagine sort of the [TS]

  the the average price of applications [TS]

  sold on the mac the ones that are not [TS]

  free is higher than Iowa [TS]

  and mac users are still willing to pay [TS]

  money for good applications and your [TS]

  application really will stand out [TS]

  because you don't have to compete with [TS]

  thousands and thousands of other really [TS]

  talented developers who may have the [TS]

  same idea for an application in the same [TS]

  categories you and that's because it's [TS]

  the opposite the type of behavior if you [TS]

  look at someone like a family who does [TS]

  both things they have great Mac [TS]

  applications that they charge real money [TS]

  for ninety-nine cents and they also have [TS]

  companion iOS applications and I think [TS]

  they're finding a way to play to the [TS]

  strengths of each platform like we [TS]

  should make a mac application because [TS]

  their applications are complicated and [TS]

  sophisticated and we can charge high [TS]

  prices for the mac users will pay it [TS]

  whereas if we have sophisticated [TS]

  complicated applications that either [TS]

  won't work on iOS because that is just [TS]

  not a platform that supports its [TS]

  complexity and if it does work we have [TS]

  to charge less money and on the other [TS]

  hand people want to you to have access [TS]

  to the data on-the-go and so on and so [TS]

  forth will make a series of iOS [TS]

  applications which will be high priced [TS]

  for iOS applications but still lower [TS]

  price than like a $99 madcap or whatever [TS]

  and it will be a virtuous cycle you'll [TS]

  be able to use your you know your mac in [TS]

  your iOS applications together like it [TS]

  is possible to take advantage of the [TS]

  ecosystems as they exist and make money [TS]

  off of it and do a good job but on the I [TS]

  feel like it's kind of grandfathered in [TS]

  and that they have the expertise and [TS]

  talent and experience on the mac [TS]

  platform and have expanded out into iOS [TS]

  if I think of like where is the next [TS]

  nominee coming from is there going to be [TS]

  company that starts up now that has that [TS]

  deep expertise on the mac and is able to [TS]

  make amazing mac applications and [TS]

  charged reasonable prices for their also [TS]

  make companion iOS applications i don't [TS]

  know how many of those are popping up [TS]

  whereas an iOS is that since there are [TS]

  so many people because the numbers are [TS]

  so big even if a fraction of a fraction [TS]

  of a percent of them end up striking it [TS]

  rich [TS]

  it's enough that you register story the [TS]

  day like some story about the class of [TS]

  people might clash of clans how many [TS]

  millions and millions of dollars they're [TS]

  making off of that stuff there's just so [TS]

  much activity so many customers [TS]

  happening happening in iOS that it is [TS]

  attracting people whereas the mac i [TS]

  don't see I don't see it attracting [TS]

  people even I felt better in the days [TS]

  like text me where it's like what's this [TS]

  a text editor coming on [TS]

  we heard of this text may text editor [TS]

  how dare you try to make a text editor [TS]

  everyone knows text our market is also [TS]

  not by inserting name of other [TS]

  competitors here but text was very [TS]

  popular and it could have been a going [TS]

  concern if if the mac market had been [TS]

  enough to you know make the maker of [TS]

  text made as much money to clash of [TS]

  clans got you can you can be sure he'd [TS]

  still be making that and we wouldn't [TS]

  market wouldn't be using textmate to [TS]

  whatever all versions using now he's [TS]

  still making it tues and cut in beta [TS]

  with constant updates [TS]

  I know it's the open-source thing [TS]

  welcome to the end of bldg analyze like [TS]

  five years ago [TS]

  yeah i know but like but you know not [TS]

  the text editors are an exciting field [TS]

  but like text editing is something that [TS]

  people do on the mac and it's not as if [TS]

  there are 17 really good high quality [TS]

  textures to come for the mac every week [TS]

  there's maybe like one or two a year [TS]

  right and they usually have to have an [TS]

  iOS counterpart no one's interested in [TS]

  them so another thing I've been thinking [TS]

  about a lot lately is my an old man and [TS]

  bear with me here but I think it is [TS]

  really silly the hoops that someone like [TS]

  federico jumps jumps through and I've [TS]

  deep respect for Federico but it seems [TS]

  silly to me the hoops that federico [TS]

  jumps through in order to accomplish [TS]

  things that are very quaint really quite [TS]

  simple on the mac and we talked about [TS]

  this a few weeks ago when i was talking [TS]

  about signing a PDF from my ipad and in [TS]

  dealing with scans and things like that [TS]

  and how for me it was very very [TS]

  difficult to do that and I i talked with [TS]

  a handful of people like my curly about [TS]

  that segment because Mike used to be [TS]

  very anti ipad and then now is like [TS]

  almost as big an ipad fan is Federico is [TS]

  and I don't know it just seems to me [TS]

  like they feel like I'm missing the [TS]

  point [TS]

  and in Federico's case it is deeply [TS]

  important to him to be able to work from [TS]

  anywhere and that's semi true with the [TS]

  mac [TS]

  kish or me know maybe it's true with a [TS]

  mac and a tethered phone but it's not as [TS]

  true as an ipad pro you can take I've [TS]

  had pro anywhere it has its own internet [TS]

  connection and you can work anywhere and [TS]

  it just it still seems to me to be a bit [TS]

  crazy and I can't help but wonder are [TS]

  the three of us just too old to [TS]

  understand the purpose of the ipad and [TS]

  is in to bring this back to what Stephen [TS]

  was saying on his post is OS 10 really [TS]

  kind of dead like I don't know it just [TS]

  seems like maybe we're the ones that are [TS]

  missing the boat means going to London [TS]

  me and where I'm going to want an ipad [TS]

  pro I'm actually I pee sitting next to [TS]

  my bed [TS]

  well I use the I use my iPad daily so i [TS]

  am also a very I would maybe not develop [TS]

  but a very frequent ipad user i love my [TS]

  ipad i love it but I would never in a [TS]

  million years look to my ipad to get [TS]

  something done over looking at my mac [TS]

  even even to some degree the typical [TS]

  things like consumption [TS]

  maybe if I'm just cruising twitter i [TS]

  would probably choose my ipad over my [TS]

  back but damn near anything else man i'm [TS]

  gonna go to my mac first because I just [TS]

  feel faster quicker better with it and I [TS]

  guess what I'm saying roundabout ways is [TS]

  that because it's what I'm used to and [TS]

  it's not that the mac is faster and [TS]

  quicker and better i'm sure empirically [TS]

  it is but you know what i mean like is [TS]

  it just because that's what I'm used to [TS]

  and i have severely OS 10 colored [TS]

  glasses let me settle this for you [TS]

  we are all old men i am in this way the [TS]

  oldest I I i am the least flexible you [TS]

  know most skeptical of new things most [TS]

  defensive my old ways of the three of us [TS]

  i also i also like the ipad the least [TS]

  out of the three was I think that being [TS]

  said I have no problem with people who [TS]

  can do tons of their worker all the work [TS]

  on the ipad so I wish I could honestly [TS]

  because there's a number of advantages [TS]

  22 going all ipad you know obviously [TS]

  there's the physical advantages that [TS]

  iPads are smaller and lighter and [TS]

  have better battery life usually then [TS]

  then the most mac laptops but also you [TS]

  know that's kind of where Apple's [TS]

  attention is now again that being said I [TS]

  wouldn't necessarily assume that the [TS]

  ipad version of iOS is going to keep [TS]

  apples attention from airline has it now [TS]

  but it didn't have much attention for [TS]

  years and as we see Apple getting pulled [TS]

  all the different directions as they try [TS]

  to tackle everything all at once with [TS]

  limited engineering resources and a few [TS]

  ways that they're unwilling to budge [TS]

  that will make it hard for them to [TS]

  attract more engineering talent that to [TS]

  get as much as they need things like you [TS]

  know remote workers salaries terms of [TS]

  employment stuff like that just make it [TS]

  hard for them to attract certain talent [TS]

  it's only a matter of time before the [TS]

  ipad falls out of the spotlight for [TS]

  apple like that will it's only a matter [TS]

  of time before the resources that were [TS]

  devoted to making iOS 9 really great on [TS]

  the ipad and getting the ipad pro at the [TS]

  door and and getting the multitasking [TS]

  and something that like you know getting [TS]

  with the special things for the ipad [TS]

  that are in iOS it's only a matter of [TS]

  time before those resources are put [TS]

  somewhere else before the attention is [TS]

  directed somewhere else in apple so I [TS]

  don't necessarily expect the ipad 2 to [TS]

  be Apple star platform for long but [TS]

  right this second it is so right this [TS]

  second if you are a person who gets all [TS]

  your work done or a lot of your phone on [TS]

  an iPad this is a great time to be one [TS]

  of those people because you're getting [TS]

  cool new stuff from Apple you know [TS]

  recently and seemingly you might get a [TS]

  little bit more soon right who knows [TS]

  we'll see what iOS 10 does but it's kind [TS]

  of nice to be like an apple sweet spot [TS]

  like where they're where they're putting [TS]

  their attention where they're putting [TS]

  you know their resources and and what [TS]

  and with like to do the future [TS]

  alright so that that's nice but I don't [TS]

  to me it's it doesn't stick right the [TS]

  the ipad a it to me it does feel like [TS]

  jumping through tons of hoops but that's [TS]

  just the work i do and that's the kind [TS]

  of use that I that I do is the kind of [TS]

  user I am is what I'm used to you know I [TS]

  think personal computers with you know [TS]

  keep [TS]

  word mouse big monitor a desk a lot of [TS]

  time I think that world is going to stay [TS]

  for a long time I don't think it is as [TS]

  dire as a lot of people have said but I [TS]

  also i totally don't begrudge anybody [TS]

  else for using whatever they think is [TS]

  better and and whatever they're most [TS]

  comfortable with because for them it's [TS]

  iPads and phones maybe for me it's max [TS]

  and that's fine you know and maybe the [TS]

  only problem is that that it is pulling [TS]

  apple and all these different directions [TS]

  is pulling their resources with all [TS]

  these different directions and i think [TS]

  that could be a bit of a problem and [TS]

  we've seen it become a little bit of [TS]

  problem so far with just like things [TS]

  that get ignored and things that get [TS]

  elected and things that get these [TS]

  drive-by updates [TS]

  I i hope they can find a way to resolve [TS]

  this but I'm not hopeful about the [TS]

  chances that actually happening I don't [TS]

  know I i really hope I'm wrong with all [TS]

  this and you know that over the next [TS]

  couple years they proved us wrong and [TS]

  and we see major significant changes to [TS]

  the app stores and you know Mac OS gets [TS]

  notable updates and they keep updating [TS]

  all their new product lines not just [TS]

  know what you like the ones that aren't [TS]

  getting a lot of tension forever but I [TS]

  don't see any evidence that we're [TS]

  heading in that kind of direction and [TS]

  that's that's my concern [TS]

  yeah and i don't mean to begrudge those [TS]

  that prefer to use an iPad it's just [TS]

  it's hard for me to understand why [TS]

  that's better [TS]

  I mean other than the mobility which is [TS]

  is pretty much on it [TS]

  unequivocal I just don't get why that's [TS]

  better and i think what i really should [TS]

  be saying is that for me it's not better [TS]

  and i don't mean to begrudge that it is [TS]

  better for my core federico or anyone [TS]

  else I'm just saying for me it's hard [TS]

  for me to wrap my head around why that [TS]

  would be better and I think Marco you [TS]

  made a great point that a lot of that [TS]

  release the fact that now I'm living in [TS]

  xcode previously i was living in vmware [TS]

  fusion that's that's my day-to-day job [TS]

  works for a lot of these people that's [TS]

  not their job [TS]

  also you know what I said earlier all [TS]

  the action in the app store like all the [TS]

  action and apps is happening iOS right [TS]

  now like if if you make use of you know [TS]

  cool new modern apps to do pretty much [TS]

  anything too [TS]

  different workflows and maybe you're [TS]

  doing like photo editing and you want to [TS]

  use a cool plugins and effects and [TS]

  everything all that action is happening [TS]

  iOS iOS if you want to play games ever [TS]

  game from a kind of miserable most of [TS]

  the time like all the action for cool [TS]

  new absolute being developed [TS]

  cool new workflows cool new things you [TS]

  can do with your computer most of that [TS]

  is happening on iOS most of the iphone [TS]

  in particular but some of it is also [TS]

  getting back into the ipad on the mac it [TS]

  you know there's no action to be had you [TS]

  know Mac Mac apps are seemingly either [TS]

  like in in stasis or dying like you have [TS]

  like an aperture gone you know logic and [TS]

  final cut are like barely supported you [TS]

  have third-party apps that are kind of [TS]

  wither on the vine a lot of times it's [TS]

  it's tough it's it's a little scary to [TS]

  be a Mac user right now as we see kind [TS]

  of a big part of the world moving on you [TS]

  know a big part of apples and [TS]

  third-party developers efforts moving to [TS]

  other places [TS]

  what you said before about the ipad like [TS]

  you think that eventually their [TS]

  attention will go elsewhere like it's in [TS]

  the Sun now like the ipad pro but that [TS]

  eventually the the you know they lose [TS]

  interest again because you know in the [TS]

  early in the ipads hit life it was [TS]

  basically like a a less less important [TS]

  version of iOS it didn't have many ipad [TS]

  specific features for several years and [TS]

  that may be the case but I have to think [TS]

  that Apple overall as a company had one [TS]

  of its goals that has that have [TS]

  somewhere and it's big list of like [TS]

  multi-year goals is to to do what it [TS]

  normally does and be the company they [TS]

  cannibalize the maxi the mac with no big [TS]

  growth potential [TS]

  they see it as another market that could [TS]

  potentially be cannibalized by other [TS]

  markets like it's small biz other [TS]

  markets are growing apples whole thing [TS]

  is we want to be the ones to cannibalize [TS]

  the neck and we want to be the ones to [TS]

  cannibalize the ipod by replacing with [TS]

  the iphone we if because if we don't do [TS]

  it someone else will eventually because [TS]

  if whatever thing that we're talking [TS]

  about being cannibalized does not have a [TS]

  very big growth trajectory eventually [TS]

  whatever size it is will be your fault [TS]

  whatever the next big thing is so Apple [TS]

  is kind of in the business of ok well [TS]

  let's figure out what the next big thing [TS]

  is because if we just do nothing [TS]

  someone else will do it for us and the [TS]

  ipad and they cut the emphasis mad pro [TS]

  is one effort to do that hey if the next [TS]

  going to be cannibalized let let us do [TS]

  it [TS]

  I've always said that the ipad has the [TS]

  potential to be the thing that replaces [TS]

  the mac if given enough attention and if [TS]

  its capabilities are extended in the [TS]

  ipad pro could be like the very very [TS]

  beginning of that process but say it [TS]

  doesn't work out so they try to make the [TS]

  try to cannibalize mac with a Predator [TS]

  drone doesn't work if the ipad losses [TS]

  apples attention i think it will be [TS]

  because they have another idea of the [TS]

  things going to cannibalize the mac and [TS]

  they don't have a certain number of [TS]

  shots of this idea of what's going to [TS]

  cannibalize the night before someone [TS]

  else does it for them but i think that [TS]

  Apple is the company does not want some [TS]

  other thing made by some other non apple [TS]

  company to be the thing that finally [TS]

  makes the mac irrelevant i think apple [TS]

  wants to make the mac irrelevant right [TS]

  now is the ipad is the thing that's [TS]

  doing that so i have to think that [TS]

  attention is going to be paid to the [TS]

  ipad until either something else makes [TS]

  the mac irrelevant as in not an apple [TS]

  product or until Apple gives up on the [TS]

  ipad doing that and decided that it [TS]

  needs another solution [TS]

  I don't think there is any long-term [TS]

  we're 60 years from now the max soldiers [TS]

  on pretty much exactly as it is I just [TS]

  don't see that happening so my hope is [TS]

  that Apple figures out what to replace [TS]

  the mac with and I think the ipad line [TS]

  has the potential to do that if enhanced [TS]

  in all the ways that we've discussed in [TS]

  past shows in terms of larger screens [TS]

  iPads aren't really particularly [TS]

  portable way more capabilities in an iOS [TS]

  figuring out the whole file situation so [TS]

  when it's over I think wait you're [TS]

  probably right long-term monitoring [TS]

  timescale thing you're probably right [TS]

  but I have a hard time seeing how iOS [TS]

  gets from here to there [TS]

  iin technically you know like on a [TS]

  low-level like on an API level on a [TS]

  kernel level everything you're probably [TS]

  right that like the the next version the [TS]

  next major version of mac OS is probably [TS]

  in iOS derivative I don't know what's [TS]

  going on that's coming out and whether [TS]

  that'll be good but but like I think [TS]

  what replaces mac OS eventually will [TS]

  indeed be a version of iOS and we will [TS]

  just have large iOS devices with [TS]

  keyboards and mice guess i don't know i [TS]

  mean it probably you know but and and [TS]

  that would also solve my UI kit problem [TS]

  with no universe that kind of thing but [TS]

  I i I don't I don't know I there's so [TS]

  much distance between iOS today and what [TS]

  it would have to be to be even a basic [TS]

  mac OS replacement that I have a hard [TS]

  time seeing that happening just because [TS]

  the distance is so great and maybe [TS]

  that's the short side of me i don't know [TS]

  i mean it may not have to be an [TS]

  equivalent for you but like when you're [TS]

  retired or dead [TS]

  it just needs to have the capabilities [TS]

  of the people who grew up in the [TS]

  generation that grew up with iOS devices [TS]

  find acceptable to do like the same kind [TS]

  of things you're doing now developing [TS]

  software like under whatever whatever it [TS]

  is that you're doing with your mac that [TS]

  you feel like you can only do on your [TS]

  Mac all that needs to happen is that [TS]

  needs to be a generation of customers [TS]

  who feel like they can best do that on [TS]

  some tablet type device whether or not [TS]

  you can best do that on the tablet type [TS]

  device doesn't really matter you just [TS]

  need the capabilities need to be there [TS]

  it's like with case was saying about [TS]

  Michael that Mike finds the ipad [TS]

  experience superior in ways the case he [TS]

  does understand i can understand some of [TS]

  them and in terms of just the simplicity [TS]

  and this fewer things that can go wrong [TS]

  and iOS device and this newer things to [TS]

  worry about or whatever and also that [TS]

  thing's feel better sometimes in terms [TS]

  of just like body gesture or touching [TS]

  the screen or using a pen [TS]

  or whatever and those can go a long way [TS]

  towards covering up the fact that you're [TS]

  actually it takes more steps or it's [TS]

  less efficient or it's you know it's not [TS]

  as straightforward as it would be on the [TS]

  mac or whatever but I'm totally willing [TS]

  to give the ipad pro and that type of [TS]

  thing a shot because like Apple has just [TS]

  barely scratched the surface they just [TS]

  now divided the screen up into two [TS]

  pieces like that'sthat's level they're [TS]

  at right [TS]

  they've just now offered you an actual [TS]

  keyboard that you can attach the thing [TS]

  like this is the baby is the baby steps [TS]

  like they just now give you a stylus [TS]

  which is a thing that has not really [TS]

  taking off on the macro today offers you [TS]

  know a a new angle so I'm willing to [TS]

  give that a few years i'm not it's not a [TS]

  slam dunk but i think there is a [TS]

  fruitful avenue of pursuit there and [TS]

  what they're pursuing is not the phone [TS]

  obviously what they're pursuing is if [TS]

  the mac is going to go away will be [TS]

  replaced with something we think it [TS]

  might be this and then we were benefits [TS]

  like well fine max shrinks ipad pro [TS]

  grows all that money goes to apple the [TS]

  ipad as a guest on a better growth [TS]

  trajectory whatever if that turns out [TS]

  not to be the case at least have it be [TS]

  from you know that that not because you [TS]

  didn't put money into it because like [TS]

  for the first several years of the ipad [TS]

  was if Apple almost like they thought we [TS]

  make a tablet device that's all we have [TS]

  to do and then instantly will become the [TS]

  new future personal computers like now [TS]

  you got actually put more effort into it [TS]

  and that otherwise people going to keep [TS]

  using Mac's so I i feel like the math is [TS]

  safe for a long time just because even [TS]

  if Apple's a hundred percent right it [TS]

  will take them a long time to figure out [TS]

  all the ins and outs and probably the [TS]

  mac OS for all of our active careers or [TS]

  whatever but remember in our dotage and [TS]

  retired don't be surprised if you're [TS]

  looking at grandkids on a gig ipad pro [TS]

  screen thanks for three sponsor this [TS]

  week fracture Squarespace and hover and [TS]

  we will see you next week [TS]

  now the show is over they didn't even [TS]

  mean to begin as it was accidental [TS]

  it was accidental John didn't research [TS]

  Marco in kc would let down [TS]

  because it was accidentally was [TS]

  accidental and you can find the show [TS]

  know today p dot and its twitter follow [TS]

  them [TS]

  yes byl ISS so that's Katie list and a [TS]

  co-pay rm20 Marco Arment and our see [TS]

  that Syracuse [TS]

  so John let me ask you something [TS]

  have you ever been to Las Vegas and if [TS]

  not how badly do you want to go you know [TS]

  the answers to both of those life had I [TS]

  did that more for my own community for [TS]

  my own laughter so as as I was in Vegas [TS]

  last weekend and Casey as you are headed [TS]

  to Vegas in a few days i hope that you [TS]

  consider while you're there as i did [TS]

  while I was there [TS]

  what it would be like to see John [TS]

  siracusa in vegas and the state of mind [TS]

  he would be in to be sitting there I [TS]

  felt so bad for him even not being there [TS]

  like just I felt so bad for theoretical [TS]

  siracusa in vegas like that [TS]

  oh my god why would he would be so [TS]

  miserable not to mention the flight on [TS]

  the way there but you know any I mean my [TS]

  god to see him in any part of Las Vegas [TS]

  would be both sad and incredible my [TS]

  company but i'm not a miserable person [TS]

  like I would find like they have food [TS]

  there right at the very least i would [TS]

  find some kind of food that I could eat [TS]

  that i would like you know how could you [TS]

  not there's gotta be a million different [TS]

  restaurants there that make some kind of [TS]

  hopefully good food [TS]

  I don't be interested in gambling [TS]

  smoking is disgusting [TS]

  I don't like lots of people like it's [TS]

  not a lot there for me but I was stuck [TS]

  there [TS]

  there are a lot of restaurants right so [TS]

  i could find something there are [TS]

  excellent restaurants however in many [TS]

  many of them require walking through a [TS]

  smoky casino to get to me that's pretty [TS]

  gross delightful you end up up or down [TS]

  against the house down by roughly a [TS]

  hundred bucks that's not bad [TS]

  it not only is that not bad but that was [TS]

  after three nights and a lot of that was [TS]

  given out as tips to the dealer's you're [TS]

  up fifty percent the last time I heard [TS]

  and you're like me to stop now but [TS]

  apparently you didn't I was up I was up [TS]

  forty percent after the first night but [TS]

  then you know second night was way down [TS]

  and then the third night was kind of [TS]

  even right but you said after that you [TS]

  said after the night that you're up you [TS]

  used to yourself I believe in slack [TS]

  maybe I should just quit while I'm ahead [TS]

  he said and then didn't yes I mean [TS]

  gambling is always you know everything [TS]

  it in hindsight gambling is very easy to [TS]

  highlight was it was a current right [TS]

  then cite you had that you had a nice [TS]

  immediately at the time not later [TS]

  not not the next day you didn't say boy [TS]

  I really should have quit when I was up [TS]

  forty percent when you were up when [TS]

  you're up you said maybe I should quit [TS]

  now I did to that but then I wouldn't [TS]

  have had as much fun the next two nights [TS]

  ago I wouldn't have been I would have [TS]

  had activity so it's you know it's like [TS]

  you know i paid that money for an [TS]

  activity you know and I mean you know [TS]

  most of the games that you can gamble on [TS]

  in Vegas you know that the odds in favor [TS]

  the odds are always in favor of the [TS]

  house but the percentage that they're in [TS]

  favor of the house by is usually not [TS]

  that big and so if you if you kind of [TS]

  bet responsibly you don't make really [TS]

  huge better like make like accelerating [TS]

  bet strike one picture money like my [TS]

  strategy was very simple i bet the same [TS]

  amount of money and everybody took i was [TS]

  playing to play not to win a bunch of [TS]

  money because i know that the chances of [TS]

  winning a bunch of money were very very [TS]

  low so simple as that you know I it was [TS]

  a fun activity and it served its purpose [TS]

  and i paid about a hundred bucks for [TS]

  three nights and includes tips and then [TS]

  include all the free drinks i got the [TS]

  time so I don't I I think that's [TS]

  actually pretty good for my first [TS]

  gambling experience [TS]

  nope they're actually that was my second [TS]

  camera experience my first camping [TS]

  experience was in college when I [TS]

  discovered that online blackjack existed [TS]

  and I put 20 bucks of real money into [TS]

  online blackjack in college lost in [TS]

  about 10 minutes and like well I'm an [TS]

  idiot that was dumb [TS]

  didn't the kinetochore idea is that [TS]

  right that's like that's not really a [TS]

  lot of fun that's a very short time to [TS]

  lose all your money and you just yeah it [TS]

  wasn't that what that was [TS]

  they didn't have the same field it would [TS]

  be better if someone smoking cigarette [TS]

  next to why you did it [TS]