The Accidental Tech Podcast

143: Capital F, Capital C

 

  I also like the idea of titles that make you will not want to miss you know what [TS]

  you don't want to define capital of capital see is what you get [TS]

  obscured for the connoisseur man anyway [TS]

  first item for the most the most solid up item last week was both was Marcos [TS]

  description and my reinforcement of the idea that if you lose the title Apple [TS]

  Remote your couch cushions or it's just dark and it somewhere in your couch on [TS]

  the army or capturing a coffee table and you reaching for it and you feel around [TS]

  to try to find it and you actually slide your fingers crossed touchpad while [TS]

  you're watching video that will move to play it on the video and many many [TS]

  people are going to tell us that if you hit the menu button it would just go [TS]

  back to where it was when you move to play it doesn't actually start playing [TS]

  again until you tell it to play but then you're so kind of pace with the the [TS]

  situation about what I don't get to play head back to where I want to put I don't [TS]

  think even have to put it back for a second of all if you actually do that if [TS]

  you reaching for the remote and you slide your hands across touchpad and [TS]

  it's it's the play had somewhere just hit the menu button it will go back to [TS]

  where I think you probably also just hit you can't play anyway [TS]

  menu button the largest followed up by time I didn't know that in my one hour [TS]

  of using it but since then I have used it and it works have you used Plex yet I [TS]

  haven't I keep meaning to install that having a solid I tend to think of the [TS]

  kids in your complex I went through this big long painful experience installing [TS]

  cs4 on and was disappointed in the car on the main thing is you from installing [TS]

  it is my Plex server would be my Synology but I use the des video server [TS]

  instead and the kids use the S Video Server like you can play video format [TS]

  from my television from 10 different places and I think I'd like to mess with [TS]

  that setup settings like by enabling Plex there's a potential attacker threw [TS]

  up my existing video thing or maybe it'll show biz today on a server anyway [TS]

  it shows up as 2d on a service because my dad uses neonate and he has Plex [TS]

  running I believe posted on this knowledge if memory serves and there are [TS]

  two separate deal deal on a service for sure yeah so I'm always afraid to touch [TS]

  what works especially if it involves things to my kids are using but I will [TS]

  eventually tried really you should use force and trying to tell me about [TS]

  it right what will fall to get out at some point maybe I'm I'm sure we get one [TS]

  is just haven't done it yet trying to hold out tryna wait for the holiday is [TS]

  probably won't work we'll see what did you could say about their mental [TS]

  disorder was interesting because I've seen a lot of things about the Apple TV [TS]

  or about just technology in general where it's like we all the people don't [TS]

  understand that and only the kids you know truly understand it I thought one [TS]

  of my kids reaction to the new remote was interesting [TS]

  they're used to having lots of different remote because i dont have a universal [TS]

  universal remote have a bunch of different modes they have learned more [TS]

  or less to navigate my crazy television set up to get what they want on the [TS]

  television the not really get into it they don't know how it works I just [TS]

  wanna know the minimum possible to get to work anyway I said here is the new [TS]

  Apple TV and I showed it to him and we're watching a video at some point [TS]

  they wanted to actually about themselves and just use the new Apple TV and they [TS]

  didn't know what their most look like they used to the TiVo anyway given the [TS]

  road and show it to them and immediately my daughter she was super angry that [TS]

  this remote do not work like she was just trying to navigate the great of [TS]

  items to you know go up and to the left then I was like I go over to Netflix why [TS]

  she was watching Netflix from the TIO 2 but anyway just moving the sort of [TS]

  selection to the Netflix icon on the main screen using the touchpad did not [TS]

  was not immediately apparent how that works like a charm swipe your thumb left [TS]

  a writer tap or whatever and she had so angers like I can't just be buns I just [TS]

  want to go out of their way to the biggest she was competent with the other [TS]

  one she knows how to go up the TiVo remote I'm not overlapping she knows how [TS]

  to go about left left and then had been that but you know it's like and this [TS]

  tiny little remote was touring or it had taken away her skill and made her back [TS]

  into a novice and that is a phenomenon that we're all very familiar with in the [TS]

  adult world or the world of people who aren't in elementary school anyway where [TS]

  they have a set up computer skills that have been built up over many years and [TS]

  the introduction of anything new even if the new thing is better [TS]

  seen as a threat to our as a bad thing because it puts them back into the role [TS]

  of novice they know how to use the old system they know how to use you know a [TS]

  particular interface or piece of hardware or software or whatever and [TS]

  that expert they started their expertise to feel like that it's not internalize [TS]

  that is like I'm the company personnel how to do this job i cant whatever [TS]

  whatever task to accomplish I can accomplish and I use it in any tool you [TS]

  give them the tools actually better once you learn it because it makes them feel [TS]

  like they can no longer do the tests they could really do that too is bad it [TS]

  was amazing to me to see that happen in a year old and you know it's not where [TS]

  we're not that different people and the young people even an eight-year-old can [TS]

  be super angry that her hard-earned skills and using the the directional pad [TS]

  in the Select button on TV remote can be erased in a moment by new technology is [TS]

  used to announce just like that but yeah Thnkx three seconds you learn how to do [TS]

  it it's like she was angry about it that day but now she's just like any other [TS]

  follower we already done that if we are done that is world record follow-up I'm [TS]

  very proud of us and this has been doing more Apple TV gaming do you have [TS]

  anything more to add on it yes oh so basically what happened between last [TS]

  show in this show is that my family discovered that the Apple TV can in fact [TS]

  be good gaming system because we discovered her body was discovered two [TS]

  years ago [TS]

  badly and this is good because none of us had actually played it on iOS so it [TS]

  was all new to us bad land is a fantastic game for the Apple TV [TS]

  have never even heard of this so it's it it looks it's kind of like the art style [TS]

  of limbo but with color and and it's it's a scan of intricate really fancied [TS]

  up version of the basic gameplay mechanic flapping bird and I this is [TS]

  minimizing its its goodness but it's like so you know you have you are this [TS]

  burden you like you push the button to go up and go the button to fall and you [TS]

  notice that this kind of inertia biggest flying game and you can fly to the [TS]

  side-scrolling levels and there's all sorts of different obstacles and things [TS]

  that they changed behavior behavior things and you multiply in [TS]

  device it's it's crazy it's just a really really good game and it is [TS]

  incredibly good even on the serum it we've actually tried it with the gamepad [TS]

  and with the serum and we actually find its better with syria and I can't [TS]

  explain why I don't know why is it tap to click click click click the button [TS]

  it's just a but again it doesn't make sense I don't know why it's better but [TS]

  for some reason just feels better it feels right on the serum feel weird to [TS]

  hold a traditional console style controller into hands in the only thing [TS]

  you're doing with his pressing one button with one thought maybe that might [TS]

  be it so anyway it really is a fantastic game I highly recommend it for any Apple [TS]

  TV owner it's accessible like you know kids can play it [TS]

  adult complete non gamers can play it it is really a very nice well done [TS]

  came here like five bucks who cares just get it like it's it's really good [TS]

  by far the best Apple TV gaming experience that we've had so far which [TS]

  is think this looks at statically just reading the lyrics he's not reading but [TS]

  watching the little video on their website this looks as aesthetically a [TS]

  lot like World of Goo Danny did either of you play that its and I and I [TS]

  honestly I wouldn't expect we're gonna work is the life of a pointer but but it [TS]

  is kind of in a net in a similar art style or maybe that maybe there was one [TS]

  of the influences on it certainly it it's just it's a gorgeous you know [TS]

  artistic design game it's really really and it's it's kind of funny that's kind [TS]

  of sick like it's really good just get badly and there aren't that many things [TS]

  you can do an Apple TV in a really excellent right now because a lot of [TS]

  software to get to get ported or written for it this is one of those things this [TS]

  highly recommended badly and there's another on those one button press games [TS]

  yes because you know and designed for touch originally but lends itself well [TS]

  because you are you are forced to go forward to like you there is no move [TS]

  forward thing like isn't going for it is not like part of the gameplay itself and [TS]

  that the screen moves on whether you're ready or not so if you have to backtrack [TS]

  or something to get around outs to go and the screen is moving on to flock and [TS]

  yeah exactly and so this is [TS]

  a type of a type of game that I think traditional gamers who are used to [TS]

  having more control over their environment might find off-putting but [TS]

  is ideal for the phone where you don't want to make someone try to use a [TS]

  virtual keypad and now on the AppleTV where we actually have a real D pad or [TS]

  whatever we already have a game already tuned for single button press that [TS]

  button to block any of the screen so an ideal Apple TV part yet and it's and you [TS]

  know it's it's watchable by people like it's fun to watch someone playing it [TS]

  like they did nothing about it needs to be on a personal device that's only in [TS]

  your hands you know it's it really is very much like a a TV friendly [TS]

  family-friendly general audience kind of game is just really good that I also [TS]

  tried provenance more this week's in the province is that any later so you can [TS]

  actually get on the App Store you it's one of those is one of them relatively [TS]

  few after I think that is published with the intention of everybody is open [TS]

  source and to install it you have to download the source code [TS]

  register for an Apple developer account have Xcode build the game and catcher TV [TS]

  via USB to your computer and have Xcode installed the game onto your Apple TV [TS]

  with provisioning profiles generated from your developer account it is [TS]

  definitely not something that you can just like tell a a non developer to go [TS]

  do this and how can expect them to figure it out they might but the chances [TS]

  are not great so it is very much a cumbersome process i kno flux delux they [TS]

  that I believe just how something similar for iPhones and iPads where they [TS]

  they get they had this open source version that they say here you can you [TS]

  can side load this with with Xcode developer account if you want this on [TS]

  your own advice about jailbreaking something like that so it's a pretty [TS]

  cumbersome process and then it's nerdy then you have to like you have to tell [TS]

  to import your wrongs that you want to play any later and then [TS]

  like create a web interface and usually go from your Mac and upload them and so [TS]

  it's you know it's definitely a little bit cumbersome to get setup but when it [TS]

  is set up you have an emulator on your Apple TV and it covers all the popular 8 [TS]

  and 16 bit systems it doesn't go into [TS]

  764 or anything more advanced I think it stops at like super nintendo in Genesis [TS]

  level but it is really quite good at you know I've have played better emulators [TS]

  if you have a computer with a gamepad on your computer you can do a lot better [TS]

  because like provenance [TS]

  it lacks a lot of customizable control that a lot of employers have you can't [TS]

  for example the controls so if you don't like how they hadn't at the buttons on [TS]

  the gamepad tough luck oh I guess you can source code exchange I am a [TS]

  developer and I wouldn't bother doing that they also don't appear to have any [TS]

  of the really nice scaling mode so you know these old games ever made for a [TS]

  much lower resolution screens and if you run them on a modern emulator you that [TS]

  all these like fancy like that to access a I and super eagle at all these fancy [TS]

  scaling up modes to make the graphics look better on high-resolution larger [TS]

  screens that we have these days and so that is not present on this so if you're [TS]

  looking at like you know a pixel quadrupled version of the game or [TS]

  whatever you just get up like in the dumb in the dumbest way possible scaled [TS]

  up to to the big screen so it doesn't look great but you know it looks no [TS]

  worse than the original system did so overall it's fun it's a fun way to get a [TS]

  whole bunch of games on Apple TV if you have a game that don't even bother you [TS]

  just don't bother but if you have a gamepad check our province so if you [TS]

  have a gamepad and Apple TV and your developer and you have a USB CD USB [TS]

  cable and you have a bunch of backups of your old video games [TS]

  yes and and if you if you have legally obtained backups from I don't even know [TS]

  what hardware that would be to create those if you have all those which are [TS]

  really small it's funny like I loaded up every game I wanted from Genesis Super [TS]

  Nintendo NES and Sega Master System it is these games are like a few hundred [TS]

  kilobytes each way I play I play their sonic one and which by the way Sonic one [TS]

  is a hard kick I you I used to be a lot better at Sonic then I am now wow when [TS]

  he went to that we don't play games for like a decade it really impacts your [TS]

  your ability to play them I almost got a game over and levinson that's how bad it [TS]

  was divided in Marble Hill Zone I mean that's this is how bad I've gotten so [TS]

  bad it's like you know if you wanna kilobytes so it's a quick it's a great [TS]

  way if you are the kind of thing it is a really cool thing to do for loyalists [TS]

  that being said overall I am so now that I've had good game experiences on the [TS]

  AppleTV I am more optimistic for its future but it's going to depend a lot on [TS]

  how many people actually bodies game controllers and then how many developers [TS]

  can afford to make games for it is certainly there's gonna be games like [TS]

  bad land where you don't need the game controller and that's good but it's so [TS]

  limited because you know you see if you don't have one of these yet you look at [TS]

  that and you might think games can use six-month note games can use basically I [TS]

  think two buttons the dpad this simulator you have the trackpad and the [TS]

  play pause button and I think that's it I think everything else is off limits [TS]

  two games because everything else has has has a meaning into the system that [TS]

  you aren't allowed to override and of course there's the accelerometer stuff [TS]

  so you kind of duly game kind of stuff some of it not even all of it cuz some [TS]

  of requires more and more position but you can do some of the kind of stuff we [TS]

  saw in the Wii but it is pretty limited so I do hope we see more good games I'm [TS]

  sure we will [TS]

  and more out now that I haven't tried yet but i i do think it's gonna be [TS]

  I do to get has the potential to be really fun gaming platform and I just [TS]

  hope it pans out [TS]

  struck again by the stories this weekend about video game sales like thinking of [TS]

  the Apple TV [TS]

  and iPhone Niemi everything else is kind of like gaming for the masses like that [TS]

  in two games but if you have a fun game to play out check it out the Apple TV [TS]

  buy it for other reasons but plays games at school but you know I think the [TS]

  general impression of people who are not in the video game industry is that most [TS]

  people play phone games you know you got a phone smartphone you can play games on [TS]

  it do you know anyone by the smartphone who hasn't had at least one game that [TS]

  they've played briefly like had a week where they were addicted to insert name [TS]

  of your favorite game here whatever that may be even as just some random single [TS]

  thing or a floppy bird you mentioned before the idea that the mass market [TS]

  there you would be so casual games like but it did so many more of those people [TS]

  right and then there are the hardcore people who weirdos who have actual game [TS]

  consoles and stuff like that but when you look at it from the number side of [TS]

  it it is flipped around call duty black ops three came out and sold like five [TS]

  hundred million dollars in the first weekend on track to earn a billion [TS]

  dollars it's almost as if like if you take it in in the movie sense people [TS]

  said people have the impression of all most people go to see these small [TS]

  independent movies because they're just movie casual than only the real hardcore [TS]

  people go see jurassic world right but no one has ever in movies while jurrasic [TS]

  world that the smash hit like bats bats for the masses that's been a mainstream [TS]

  right gaming is so weird in that the thing that everyone thinks is kind of [TS]

  like a dying industry of these you know hardcore gamers is only a couple of you [TS]

  know tens or hundreds of millions of those opposed to the billion people who [TS]

  fly cellphone games and that's where all the money is these you know that call [TS]

  duty black ops is making more money than probably the entire top 10 in the iOS [TS]

  you know gaming charts and that's just one game on the supposed platform that [TS]

  is dying PCs in [TS]

  and consoles sudden how we're gonna square that circle like I don't think we [TS]

  can extrapolate and say well consoles are going away and he's going away and [TS]

  pretty soon the mass market will take over and everyone just plays Badlands on [TS]

  their Apple TV and place five-word and crash and that is the gaming industry [TS]

  when the money people are like give me this year's Call of Duty any day because [TS]

  it is a money-making machine on the scale of a blockbuster movie and as far [TS]

  as the many people are concerned that's the mass market of gaming so I know it's [TS]

  hard for me to get a handle on this because as a gamer I do see these other [TS]

  sort of a lesser games but smaller games as as the the the thing that's weird and [TS]

  I see call duty as exactly the same as drastic world [TS]

  the only thing it doesn't get what that is the popular notion that console games [TS]

  pc games are somehow going away to be to be wiped away by lesser devices like the [TS]

  the smartphone and iPad games the kids play and Apple TV games and whatever our [TS]

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  ship it in this in this really surprisingly small box like the size of [TS]

  a dorm fridge it just comes to your house in a box and you open it up and it [TS]

  sucked the air out of the room inflates itself and there you have a mattress and [TS]

  box but it's pretty amazing and they know that buying a mattress online [TS]

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  heard from people who have them you love them we are a couple people who returned [TS]

  them didn't work out for them and they they were raving about how great the [TS]

  return process even was like that's that tells you how nice is it even somebody [TS]

  who decided not to keep it wanted to email us to tell us how great they were [TS]

  to deal with how great the return process was dismissed sounds like a [TS]

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  with them so this is completely risk-free free shipping returns made in [TS]

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  like a premium thing and it is quality wise but not price wise mattresses [TS]

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  it's a diff is a larger size like a queen or king you're paying almost [TS]

  $2,000 for that for anything really good catcher mattress charges $500 for a twin [TS]

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  lot to cast for for sponsoring our show once again so as we record big day today [TS]

  biggest the Volvo for our friend federico VTG his dreams have come true [TS]

  today as I pro day I did not have the time to go and take a look at the store [TS]

  to see if they had any in stock I did not preorder one I have no experience [TS]

  with this whatsoever but one of us does so I actually went TIFF TIFF won an iPad [TS]

  pro and so we we decided like any Apple product like if you're going to get it [TS]

  at all [TS]

  get it get it without because the price is not going to change between now [TS]

  actually nevermind though Apple is these days it will be for sale for the next [TS]

  five years it will drop by a hundred bucks but [TS]

  anyway so we decided yet if one didn't large-screen iPad so this morning I woke [TS]

  up [TS]

  ordered it for in-store pickup that I was surprised they said it was it would [TS]

  be available for online ordering today in stores later this week and they [TS]

  surprised everyone including the store's employees I talk to you by having [TS]

  available in stores today that was great so I went into ordered it like still in [TS]

  bed in the morning with the Apple Store app for the iPhone which is the better [TS]

  things unfortunately the pencil was already back ordered at eight in the [TS]

  morning already back ordered three to four weeks and the stores I asked around [TS]

  and it sounds like most stores actually got zero pencils to sell today like it's [TS]

  not like they sold out the actually just didn't get any what makes you think the [TS]

  pencils backorder as opposed to nobody's daughter the people in in my store said [TS]

  that they think this the big stores in Manhattan might have gotten a small [TS]

  number and I heard some people from maybe some stores in Europe that are [TS]

  really high profile that they got a couple so it does seem like they are [TS]

  they are coming to some stores they came to some stores today and the earlier [TS]

  this morning had some people said they got a a one- to two-week delay window [TS]

  rather than my quoted three to four weeks so they are coming but I I can't [TS]

  help but feel like Apple keeps botching the releases of these things you know [TS]

  like in the same way that the watch launch was totally botched and then the [TS]

  watchdog was a disaster where yet officially launched on this day but you [TS]

  couldn't actually get one for like months and if you wanted certain ones [TS]

  you waited even longer for things like the modern buckled leather loop or the [TS]

  or the black link that were very backorder delayed and now so it now with [TS]

  the iPad Pro its nice that's available today that that was a nice surprise that [TS]

  we have that we are able to pick one up today but two of its main selling [TS]

  features the smart Keyboard I believe that's right the keyboard from Apple and [TS]

  the pencil were both totally unavailable for most people who try to buy it today [TS]

  and and its and who knows how long it'll be it does kinda put a damper on it like [TS]

  tip [TS]

  really excited about the pencil and and so was I on the pencil and it does put a [TS]

  damper on the ok now we finally at the device that by the way was announced two [TS]

  months ago it's not like this was announced last week and we've been [TS]

  really impatient this is announced two months ago and it just barely shipped [TS]

  apparently and they couldn't even get the store stock with the really critical [TS]

  accessories like that that just seems like a botched launch to me and this is [TS]

  like the operations guy is running the company how does like how does this [TS]

  happen I don't know I'm probably being too too critical of this but it really [TS]

  does put a damper on it when you go to the store all happy to get this new [TS]

  device that you could do this cool new thing with and then he says oh you can't [TS]

  hear pencils for another month [TS]

  you know that's that's a bummer for you but what does that mean in terms of [TS]

  things that happen here is about does it mean fewer sales I did see a number of [TS]

  people today I i treated early in the morning like you know this and I did see [TS]

  a number of people responding saying that they were going to go pick up an [TS]

  iPad for a david says they can't get a pencil or just going to wait until I can [TS]

  so they're just delaying the sales you know they're still gonna sell those [TS]

  probably but they they lose be delayed but I have to imagine first of all Apple [TS]

  really wants a big opening weekend they want to be able to Brad they sold X [TS]

  million iPads in a weekend if if they do you know so its gonna hurt them in that [TS]

  way but also there is a certain degree of like right now there's an ersatz day [TS]

  one and people are really excited about it and they want to get it maybe some [TS]

  people who were on the fence about whether they wanted to get it maybe they [TS]

  now won't get it is maybe it as the center should die down over the next [TS]

  three to four weeks before they can get the accessory that they want maybe in at [TS]

  time they'll actually you know what maybe I don't really need this anymore [TS]

  you know it it's going to be a massive portion of their sales but I do think it [TS]

  will hurt them in some way [TS]

  well so how does that balance with the other side of it I think happened with [TS]

  the watch there are positive aspects of things not being available there is the [TS]

  the perceived scarcity [TS]

  essentially you know that this project playing hard to get it makes you wanted [TS]

  even more because you can't get it [TS]

  it there is for the people who weren't even that interested in it there is the [TS]

  story about people I don't wanna watch but people who do one watches are not [TS]

  able to find them it's the Cabbage Patch doll phenomenon like a while is not be [TS]

  really popular because people really wanted it sold out everywhere and that [TS]

  creates a positive buzz about it and then finally passes like you know [TS]

  someone finally got a modern buckle right as soon as these products trickle [TS]

  out when they're ready to ship or whatever you get repeat stories I know [TS]

  we've already covered seven times that he was the first person to have a video [TS]

  link bracelet is the first person have a modern buckle so on and so forth [TS]

  not that I'm saying Apple is doing an impressive purpose like it's artificial [TS]

  scarcity totally seems like this is just sit at the table to manufacture them in [TS]

  volume they ship them but I would say it but against the idea of someone being [TS]

  disappointed they can get what they want and then just saying well never mind and [TS]

  not coming back [TS]

  balance that against the positive effects the perceived desirability and [TS]

  value and the repeat press on the sort of the trickle of stuff coming out so I [TS]

  have to think I think that's bad for it not to launch all ones mostly just [TS]

  because it reflects poorly on the company and might give someone a bad [TS]

  impression about Apple but I think overall I don't think it's actually [TS]

  hurting their cells as long as I mean obviously as long as by the house by 10 [TS]

  hottest come as long as everybody wants to get an iPad pro with a pencil for the [TS]

  holidays can get one they make up that close cuz that's where you can actually [TS]

  hurt themselves because things are seasonal like that if they miss the [TS]

  holidays obviously they've really messed up as long as they make the holidays [TS]

  with a reasonable amount of time I think people like in their pencils for a [TS]

  couple weeks is not that big a deal the main main thing I'm annoyed about as a [TS]

  lazy person stay the whole time is I seem to remember in the old days that [TS]

  Apple would if not favor online orders then to the very least sort of give them [TS]

  equal footing we're now with the Apple TV experiences myself I ordered Apple TV [TS]

  and before my Apple TV arrived to me they were already showing up in stores [TS]

  so rather than you know like and so now I bet if you were to order a pencil now [TS]

  you'd get it sometime within the delivery window but then this weekend if [TS]

  you go into a big apple story may be able to pick one up if you just have to [TS]

  go [TS]

  and so it's definitely favoring retail it seems over a mail-order yeah and that [TS]

  that's again like the Apple TV it was not it was not a big box but it does [TS]

  hurt a ton of stories like that from people who are ordered online and then [TS]

  they had some weird shipping issues they didn't ship on time and then that's it [TS]

  just makes sense I'm saying this is doing a nice because I stayed home but [TS]

  people who are online who are those people they had it's better to be with [TS]

  him in this store is because most people just like wandering the mall to see the [TS]

  Apple store in a wandering they have no idea when a product launch or anything [TS]

  about its only US you like the second it's available online because we just [TS]

  want to do the action that we think is going to give us the product as soon as [TS]

  possible to retain their children at heart right and I was like 30 min order [TS]

  on order [TS]

  no one else is like that no one knows many things are they just like they go [TS]

  to the Apple store and the new iPhone 5 on their not ok well check back next [TS]

  weekend all the air out of his new Apple TV they don't know or care of things [TS]

  launch so it's much better to have them available in store for sort of impulse [TS]

  purchases behaving wandered to the Apple store and see what's available as [TS]

  opposed to trying to cater to people to stay up till 3 a.m. daughter phone I [TS]

  don't know that just the whole thing it just it just put a damper on you know [TS]

  like it it's not that doesn't ruin things it's not going to kill their [TS]

  sales but it just puts a damper on on the enthusiasm it's like oh this is [TS]

  great except no bad news [TS]

  you know it's it's been a pioneer in the restaurant doesn't even know the IPRO [TS]

  exists in knowing the ads are running a TV and when they want to turn on TV but [TS]

  I think people perfectly acceptable accepting of seeing an ad on TV for cool [TS]

  Apple thing than wandering into the Apple store and saying is that things [TS]

  son and friend TVA and having a pasar say no we don't have those now [TS]

  alright and I'll come back next weekend like that's that's how I feel like the [TS]

  vast vast majorities of Apple sales operate a pen i understand all that [TS]

  being said I was able to try the pencil and smart Keyboard in the store because [TS]

  they had a demo one that liked some of the staff were playing without loud on [TS]

  the on the floor and ceiling fan and i got to put the two they they wouldn't [TS]

  sell it to me I am [TS]

  I offered to sell to me but one million dollars for one night but there are 400 [TS]

  my god that's a reference I know it's a reference we saw a movie together yeah [TS]

  actually never seen the movie but I know what if it isn't so I will say having [TS]

  now played with the pencil and keyboard very briefly i mean this I had about [TS]

  five minutes with the pencil and I in about two minutes of the keyboard I will [TS]

  say the keyboard is not as bad as I expected I expected to be terrible as I [TS]

  heard it had similar case which is tonight book one and possibly even worse [TS]

  he filled the network one I think it's probably about the same maybe a little [TS]

  bit better even I don't know it didn't feel as horrible to me the netbook one [TS]

  but it was very very close doesn't matter you know it's it's an iPad [TS]

  keyboard it's going to be a compromise and a lot of it that's that's fine I [TS]

  know there is a Logitech one Apple stores or even selling it they they had [TS]

  that in stock they were out of stock of every other iPod accessory including the [TS]

  smart cover and the Smart Case [TS]

  now two separate like now the Smart Case is only the back part that's weird and [TS]

  so if you want both the back and the front covered you have to buy both parts [TS]

  for a total of $150 yeah so that's that's annoying like it's it's almost as [TS]

  expensive as by the keyboard which covered both teams anyway the keyboard [TS]

  was very securely attached it only really hold the iPad in one angle though [TS]

  as far as I could tell I I wasn't sure if you can adjust at all it seemed like [TS]

  it was fixed to this one particular angle it would hold that you can show [TS]

  the pencil behind it because nobody called the iPad Ford put the pencil in [TS]

  their push it back [TS]

  yeah I mean this is going to be kind of product where there's a huge opportunity [TS]

  here for third parties to make way better kisses and keyboards that Apple [TS]

  did because you're gonna want a place to put the pencil and there isn't one [TS]

  anywhere on the iPad anywhere in the end [TS]

  any of Apple's cases you know it's similar to how the iPad 1 just kinda [TS]

  they had that terrible grade like wraparound case and the iPhone just [TS]

  clearly not designed with the case in mind at all this kind of threw it on [TS]

  that's have a pencil feels today which is like here's this this awesome thing [TS]

  that almost everyone has a lot of people are going to want for this iPad and the [TS]

  iPad was seemingly designed with no regard to how this thing would actually [TS]

  be kept on or near or in the iPad as then more and pointed out today cause [TS]

  behind your ear is too heavy for that first of all I think it's so it is heavy [TS]

  it's not like uncomfortably heavy it doesn't feel like a lightweight pencil [TS]

  or or or plastic styles it feels dense and it is not too heavy but almost two [TS]

  years can take it but it really does feel incredibly good use a pencil I [TS]

  would say the keyboard if i if i were really into this thing myself I'm [TS]

  probably not going to be but if I was going to myself I would probably skip [TS]

  the keyboard but I would definitely get a pencil because I'm not an artist of [TS]

  any kind I have no illustrative abilities at all I hardly ever hand [TS]

  write anything this made me want to hand write things and draw diagrams and [TS]

  become some kind of artist even I probably won't ever be the pencil is [TS]

  great and combining it with palm rejection other touch input everything I [TS]

  I could not in my five minutes using it I never encountered an error in thinking [TS]

  that attacks was the pencil or rejecting the pump properly like it it was it was [TS]

  flawless in they were using the Adobe Adobe sketch something and over sketches [TS]

  that that's that's what we were using to to draw it and it worked very well there [TS]

  is a little bit of lag still but it is the best stylist / you know pen tablet [TS]

  thing for computer by far the best I've ever seen [TS]

  not not even close way better than then the Wacom tablet i've seen [TS]

  way better than any previous iPad or iPhone stylus that I've tried [TS]

  it just completely different experience far better I was able to rest my [TS]

  pok√©mon it flat on a table and just right just hand write [TS]

  agreements in his in his review which is very good he mentioned that he detested [TS]

  by drawing his signature and they're like $20 savings on most touch devices [TS]

  or like 10 terminals in stores it always looks horrible crazy and he said like on [TS]

  the iPad perot it looked like his real handwritten signature in my very brief [TS]

  testing here I'd try tried handwriting things like to share a few sentences and [TS]

  it looked just like my handwriting on paper it is incredibly good I wish I had [TS]

  a reason to use it and right now I don't think I do [TS]

  time for you tomorrow if you haven't already because there are two videos [TS]

  related to this topic in the show [TS]

  tweets from Steve stress saying he was not impressed with the pencil agencies [TS]

  so it's to give because we're stupid and they might take a look at that and look [TS]

  at his video I don't know I can't tell what happens using their but the leg [TS]

  thing that he's doing is just horrendous that is really rough actually alright [TS]

  now scroll down here is Matt pincer reno saying really because I was using it it [TS]

  was awesome and then look at his video also an iPad pro presumably with a [TS]

  different app and look at the lag there it looks like a different at ya might be [TS]

  although they've later in the discussion there likely I was using Adobe's get an [TS]

  answer says all I wasn't always gets too I don't know if it's in this picture and [TS]

  anyway I think with I think what this shows is that from application to [TS]

  application that there can be a big difference in latency responsible the [TS]

  hardware is capable but depending on how the application is programmed you could [TS]

  get the latency you see what I don't think they're broken iPad that you get [TS]

  the latency you see in the first video which is really a bad or with the same [TS]

  exact hardware you get the latency using the second video which is really really [TS]

  good yeah I mean it depend entirely on good coding again at some point the [TS]

  hardware is going to be the limiting factor but in my experience matches pens [TS]

  are you know that they're just being you know it does you can feel that there is [TS]

  some latency but it is really small [TS]

  and it's perfectly fine for him right I think I saw the first video I'm like oh [TS]

  maybe that's slow because it's trying to do like a brush type thing or it's like [TS]

  pressure sensitive like bristles you can see it's trying to be like a brushing [TS]

  thing where the leading edges has things but then look it depends reno's video [TS]

  and he's doing like translucence smeared ink looking like he's not just doing [TS]

  solid black line in whatever application he's using it seems to be doing fancier [TS]

  effects and this is yet another opportunity to Microsoft video showing [TS]

  differently and see things if you watch the video to calibrate my balls too hard [TS]

  numbers because they tell you just a Bleezy here's one else I can use ten [TS]

  years a hundred to my eyes the good video of the iPad pro here is still not [TS]

  down to one millisecond but it's much better than a hundred milliseconds so it [TS]

  somewhere in that range and the idea that the application can affect the [TS]

  ladies like shows that this is really just the dawning of the mass market me [TS]

  perhaps hopes that is perhaps the dawning of the mass market era of pen [TS]

  computing as it was that that started with Windows for Penn whatever the grid [TS]

  pad or that started with the servicer but never really it remains to be seen [TS]

  it this way [TS]

  popularized the pen to any significant degree but in all cases I think pen [TS]

  input is not yet at the level has not crossed the threshold that the mouse did [TS]

  when the Mac was introduced because the mouse type input devices before and [TS]

  after the Mac but one of the things that the Mac has been excellent that from day [TS]

  one is when you move the mouse cursor on the screen moves there is no stuttering [TS]

  is no lag [TS]

  it's a seemingly direct connection and that was very important to the dawning [TS]

  of the back to making a maxi like an active one of the reasons that like you [TS]

  know windows always felt weird and different until I got their career stuff [TS]

  nail down a couple of years later and on the Mac there is nothing you can do in a [TS]

  program to make their mouse cursors corrupt like it's not like well you [TS]

  program your application badly the mouse cursor won't be responsible not drawing [TS]

  with the messages you could screw that up because the original packaging to [TS]

  draw with the fancy brush tool it'll be a leg [TS]

  talk about the mass itself just moving the cursor around that stayed solid is [TS]

  nothing you could do an application to screw that up on the short of crashing [TS]

  your grandma desk or something like it even given that they tended to move [TS]

  smoothly always experience the crash with the entire computer is frozen but [TS]

  the mouse cursor still works that's an important part of the sort of physical [TS]

  interface to computers with the mouse is the reliability of you move the mouse or [TS]

  trackpad and the cursor is also by the way why it's so incredibly disconcerting [TS]

  when your mouse cursor freezes it happened many times many more times in [TS]

  the bad old days of classic Mac OS it almost feels like the world is broken [TS]

  for a second where you move your mouse in the cursor doesn't move you're like [TS]

  oh no this is not right [TS]

  something that it's like you've been knocked off kilter something that's it [TS]

  inviolate this constraint of the world that you believed in the move the mouse [TS]

  cursor moves well for pen computing or any kind of pain in foot to really [TS]

  become as sort of second nature and boring as mouse input is now a days we [TS]

  have to eventually get past the idea that the response in this will be [TS]

  different if different the Pentagon spends not a pointing device PIN is a [TS]

  drying device so I was giving them out to pass before and CEO of course if you [TS]

  look at the super pan with the spray can think it would be all gross and that's [TS]

  fine that's because the mouse isn't primarily a drawing think it's very [TS]

  moving things around and clicking and pointing but the pen it's not a pointing [TS]

  device there is no cursor on the screen is entirely about drunk so I want all [TS]

  pen input to be you know like the second video are better and it's clear that [TS]

  we're not quite there yet which is kind of a shame but this is early days of the [TS]

  cease-fire that was concerned with the pen input of the Newton sitting on my [TS]

  desk right now my dad might disagree but it's a couple thoughts on this first of [TS]

  all it's a double down on what you're saying about the world being completely [TS]

  wrong with your mouse freezes imagine how weird it is when not only the mouse [TS]

  frozen but your mouse button doesn't exist anymore because it's a software [TS]

  like that has happened to me a handful of times on this [TS]

  pro that I have for work and it is weird so you just pretty just press and the [TS]

  little vibrator thing doesn't vibrate underneath incorrect so it's like [TS]

  pushing on a place [TS]

  played a class nothing happens and that's one like everything is broken on [TS]

  the plus side you have a physical [TS]

  indicator that everything is broken but on the downside this thing that that you [TS]

  forget is all software suddenly stops working and it's very weird and the [TS]

  other thing I want to throw out is after I believe after the iPad pro was [TS]

  announced I'd remembered seeing something about Lake advanced [TS]

  multi-touch or something like that I went back and watched the WBC session on [TS]

  it and the link in the show notes its session 233 I believe and it was really [TS]

  really interesting and they talked in the session I remember who gave it a lot [TS]

  about you know these infant has my small windows of time with which you have to [TS]

  process touch input and how they call us and this and the other thing I didn't I [TS]

  watched like a month or two ago so I'm a little fuzzy on it now but it was really [TS]

  really interesting and if you have the time it's worth watching and I bring [TS]

  this up because they very well could be you know if if your YouTube videos using [TS]

  the same Adobe Apple whatever it is if it's the same apt and then this is [TS]

  irrelevant but if it is different apps it would not surprise me at all if [TS]

  they're very different performance characteristics between two different [TS]

  apps because the way they handle it can change very very dramatically depending [TS]

  on whether another good developers with another reason the API's etcetera Fraser [TS]

  Spirit says that it just use the iPad possible latency issues very apt [TS]

  dependent undetectable in notes Minneapolis application I assume but [TS]

  very leggy and paper by 53 I don't know which apps are used in this video but I [TS]

  am totally willing to believe that is entirely dependent but we're not seeing [TS]

  is like a better body hardware something is just you know just off early like a [TS]

  set of you processing the events in a particular way are using whatever the [TS]

  fast path is for doing it but like I said sorry no video that's like [TS]

  something looks like a magic marker where thanks miriam jaeger towards the [TS]

  edges something looks like grease paint something looks like water colors so [TS]

  it's not like it only works if you're a solid black line baby do anything [TS]

  fancy its slow so I really have no idea why the slow in a slow and fast on this [TS]

  fast other than you know it just may be using on abyei's or something ya know [TS]

  anyway regardless we at least know that when properly handled by but the [TS]

  software side the pen or pencil can be really great and and in a few hours [TS]

  already it already is [TS]

  and and that I mean really like using this blew my mind like how good it is it [TS]

  is I just again I wish I had a reason to hand write things I've never even I've [TS]

  never been like a notebook at my desk kind of person like a lot of people will [TS]

  sketch things out on on paper notebooks I've never even done that I never go to [TS]

  school but man I I do wish that I had a reason to use it does it really did it [TS]

  really is also do a video pictionary someone who needs to make a pictionary [TS]

  application for iPad pro-people so you can do pictionary with people across the [TS]

  country [TS]

  draw something you don't get to see their face you know right you put up an [TS]

  easel we respond to this week by lynda.com and easy and affordable way to [TS]

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  trial to access all courses for free if you visit lynda.com / ATP once again [TS]

  with a 10 day free trial access to all courses ately nba.com / ATP thanks a lot [TS]

  to lynda.com response on our show once again so I Pad Pro software wise I got [TS]

  to 540 wasn't able to get anything else for it so we have no case cover no [TS]

  pencil no keyboard anyway [TS]

  brought home so far I would say based on my experience with it it is really a [TS]

  mixed back most of the reviews seem to back up what I've experienced so far [TS]

  first of all it is huge and because it is so huge certain aspect of things that [TS]

  you could do well i pad before are actually worse in my opinion I think it [TS]

  was definitely worse for reading this you're reading things like comic books [TS]

  or magazines reeeeally as much space as possible but just like for reading [TS]

  regular column articles or iBooks look kind of ridiculous on it to be honest [TS]

  because you don't seem to offer margin control the fun sized up though that's [TS]

  because it lets you do let's you have the keep the same number of words per [TS]

  line but make the text way bigger so it's easy to see ya but then holding it [TS]

  back further I mean you know people have your eyes will go eventually [TS]

  and you are absolutely i mean you know if you if you actually need a bigger [TS]

  size just to make it legible in general [TS]

  inaccessibility reasons that's a different story but if you have vision [TS]

  within the within the normal range and you don't need to be really huge I would [TS]

  say in general that the other iPads are better reading devices for that reason [TS]

  this is obviously better for video welfare for reading though what if you [TS]

  want to have to put it that's a terrible idea why would you want to do it if you [TS]

  don't have to put air in slack in in the same thing split each one gets a [TS]

  reasonable size column like your thinking as if the screen is one thing [TS]

  that the application can fill in Apple hasn't done much to dissuade you from [TS]

  that notion but they have at least cut the screen and half or thirds or [TS]

  whatever so I think you have to in considering software which granted I'm [TS]

  sure you add to this is not an updated very well for the iPad pro in sometimes [TS]

  looks ridiculous at very least you can say all right well it may not be good [TS]

  reading experience for this thing but that's only because I'm letting it have [TS]

  the whole screen one another by the screen about something else other thing [TS]

  and now have two good reading experiences at the same time [TS]

  yeah I mean that's that's kind of the idea but like one of the things that [TS]

  made iPads and and e-readers so good for reading books compared to computers is [TS]

  that you could only do that one thing on the screen you could fill up the screen [TS]

  with one reading app and you liked it right nobody reads books on their [TS]

  computers for the most part because you these giant screens that are feeling a [TS]

  little windows all these distractions and it's not a very good reading [TS]

  environment for that that's why people don't read books and computers and it's [TS]

  one of the reasons I think the main reason is that it's uncomfortable to sit [TS]

  at a desk staring at screens and radio ok similarly it's uncomfortable to hold [TS]

  this iPad app for a long time because it is it is not light or small and so you [TS]

  know different reviewers have agreed industry in this point that I've seen so [TS]

  far [TS]

  some of them say it's ok some of them say you know tips initial impression my [TS]

  initial impression so far is that it's it's pretty heavy to hold up for for [TS]

  more than a minute or two [TS]

  you want to have it on some kind of [TS]

  you know propped up case or desk or stand or something you know not just [TS]

  holding it up in bed for a long time or anything like that so as for suffer a [TS]

  lot of things like if you've ever done anything on an iPad and it and the D [TS]

  smallness of the iPad screen has been a limiting factor for you then this will [TS]

  be an improvement that's not true for everything and you're not going to get [TS]

  patients speaking of that recently tweeted a picture of having his tweet [TS]

  was the Texas living the dream and when you have as I Pad Pro showing a comic [TS]

  book and next to it as a comic book which you could see you could take that [TS]

  physical comic book and basically place it on the screen and it was pretty much [TS]

  exactly the same size screen so if your comments reader and you're tired looking [TS]

  at comics either shrunken or cropped you can't get to page side-by-side but at [TS]

  least now you can get one full-size real-life comic book page at a [TS]

  one-to-one ratio on your iPad for oh yeah and and you know for people who [TS]

  like people who like mark-up PDFs this would be great for them because it's [TS]

  like you know you want you want to be like kind of life size or close to it at [TS]

  least and the tenant iPad was almost but not quite the right size to do that so [TS]

  you know stuff lately there are there are things that are going better on this [TS]

  for sure and it would be a lot of those things but what i'm saying is it not [TS]

  everything is better on it and and I it's important if you're thinking about [TS]

  when the device is important to know that going in I'm just because certain [TS]

  things there is such a thing as too big of a screen for certain things and and [TS]

  you you might hit that but as you as you alluded to earlier John one of the [TS]

  bigger challenges up front here is that iOS while it's nice to have things like [TS]

  the split of you and slide over and everything these features are pretty [TS]

  basic so far they they still especially things like what the slide over the [TS]

  Apple launching experience they're behaving like a girl who's giant long [TS]

  list of these ads that are capable of doing this [TS]

  like this interface I don't know who designs interface because it should have [TS]

  been obvious to anybody that as soon as you have more than a handful of absence [TS]

  support this feature this does not work very well but anyway there are there are [TS]

  performances for the big screen [TS]

  and things have taken a big screen in iOS but the iPad has always kind of been [TS]

  the second class citizen of iOS it is always gotten oftentimes delayed [TS]

  hardware capabilities or less good hardware in certain ways that the [TS]

  cameras are never as good as the iPhone cameras a context ideally the new one [TS]

  even the iPad 40 as the reviews have noted doesn't have the technology center [TS]

  from the success that the good new one it has the slower old one from the [TS]

  iPhone 5s and six and that seems crazy this is a new flagship iOS device that [TS]

  there there is a substantially better touch I D sensor that launched two [TS]

  months ago and I prohibit any 03 touch it doesn't have either that that might [TS]

  because they couldn't get to work on the big screen that's a little more [TS]

  understandable i think is like you can see the challenges involved there but I [TS]

  D sensor make sense to though because the volumes because how many like I'm [TS]

  not I don't think there is an entire world that vendors making studies and so [TS]

  i think there's a limited number of people who even can make it may be a [TS]

  patent encumbered or whatever who has the ability manufacturers expertise and [TS]

  the iPhone just so damn high volume that it's going to get every single one of [TS]

  those things that they can manufacture for the foreseeable future that I don't [TS]

  know if that's true but that is a plausible explanation as to why why you [TS]

  wouldn't you know what the iPhone observing because it has to be that is [TS]

  the most important product and if there's any part that is in limited [TS]

  supply iPhone gets it and don't even bother don't even worry about the iPad [TS]

  just give them the old sensor doesn't even matter the iPhone is it matters [TS]

  because if you have to think of a part on the iPhone that is supplied constrain [TS]

  the tiny sensor especially the brand new one is one of the one of the top ones [TS]

  that I would I think it's equally likely that this is just an area where somebody [TS]

  decided you know what people are and unlocking their iPad by a touch of ideas [TS]

  often as they do on the phone so it's not that important we can save $1 you [TS]

  know that it feels more like that is it cheaper is the new one actually more [TS]

  expensive like it might just be the same caught in it it just it seems more like [TS]

  iPhone gets every all the good stuff all the best for us it is the oldest favored [TS]

  child [TS]

  if anything is in short supply iPhone gets the stuff right so so the reason of [TS]

  that in the song on the software side unfortunately that's also true and you [TS]

  see things Lake like you know but even back forever ago when the iPad launched [TS]

  with with 3.2 3.2 then I S four with multitasking came out for the iPhone and [TS]

  it wasn't until four months later maybe even seconds later in life for pointing [TS]

  3 was unified it where they brought all the features of the iPad look at when I [TS]

  was 7 launched and then you know in the early beta as they weren't even give you [TS]

  the iPad it was so unfinished they wouldn't even give a developer beat us [TS]

  at first and then later on in the process they eventually released the [TS]

  iPad version of it and I would say the iPad version has always and still lags [TS]

  behind the iPhone version ever since I was 7 redesign there are certain things [TS]

  about it that just seemed half and you know things like control center things [TS]

  like that that swept over at picker API you I notifications have always been [TS]

  kind of weird on it there's still a guys I think as we reported on his you still [TS]

  liking him no calculator weather apps like it just seems like in so many ways [TS]

  the iPad is is trying to be this higher end of ice and in many ways to achieving [TS]

  the net but on the software side it's being held back by these limitations and [TS]

  they did make great strides with the split of you and and with the slide over [TS]

  in Iowa State that does help alot but in general it just seems like it's not [TS]

  getting a lot of attention in its software and you know see you get there [TS]

  here yet here we are [TS]

  flagship product this is obviously very important Apple to get to get the iPad [TS]

  sales you know boosted again get them going again [TS]

  you know keep your iPad alive keep it going to have this flagship product it [TS]

  launches ready for the holidays [TS]

  peak time first of all no accessories available from 12 then second of all [TS]

  hardly any apps updated for it so so already you have this weird experience [TS]

  where like when you launch most iPad [TS]

  taps they come up in the blurry blown-up way and it just looks it looks [TS]

  ridiculous a day that's that's a problem and Mike just going through tips initial [TS]

  setup here at home we've seen a lot of those at almost every option uses has [TS]

  not been updated and includes both games and browsing ads in magazines and [TS]

  shopping apps like there's so many apps that that have just not that it's prob [TS]

  number one but even just like his first impression when she saw the springboard [TS]

  home screen she was looking at how many icons you get a across the top and like [TS]

  the number of app icons has stayed the same in like how many Romney get per row [TS]

  and column springboard hasn't changed even the screen size got almost twice as [TS]

  big as everything just disclosure science spread out weird arrangement and [TS]

  she was she looking for a setting to change it [TS]

  assuming of course there has to be a setting of course this would not be the [TS]

  only way you know there's nothing to change it that is the only ship like [TS]

  it's it just seems like there is not enough resources and Apple being devoted [TS]

  to making iOS better specifically for the iPad it's it's good it's hard enough [TS]

  for developers to justify putting a lot of work into iPad apps lot of the times [TS]

  and that's that's been the problem is has because now I for the first time I [TS]

  think it in a while with both now is split you coming few months ago and now [TS]

  with the iPad pro having a whole new screen size [TS]

  not to mention if you want to take advantage of of things like the pending [TS]

  keyboard and some ways after helpers need to catch up to a lot of work to get [TS]

  their iPad apps to be really great now to really just to keep them current to [TS]

  keep them running well in the news hard work even taking advantage of hardware [TS]

  the island's do it every year in some way but the iPhone has a lot more people [TS]

  using it and therefore it's a lot easier to make money in the iPhone for a lot of [TS]

  kinds of that but the iPad because they smaller platform by installed this it's [TS]

  always been a little bit harder for a lot of people to justify doing work on [TS]

  it and doing work on iPad apps and the problems in Apple software ecosystem of [TS]

  a pricing sustainability over competition everything [TS]

  these problems are magnified on the iPad side because there isn't as much there [TS]

  are always isn't as big so you can't just make up in volume it's harder to [TS]

  make it on the iPad side there's less competition I think which helps but but [TS]

  it's it's just harder like look at how many iPad apps have just been just [TS]

  totally abandoned and just getting no meaningful updates because their [TS]

  developers just can't go forward to it to work on them I think this is [TS]

  ultimately going to be what decides whether the iPad pro succeeds or fails [TS]

  is will developers including Apple iOS will developers be able to justify [TS]

  investing a lot of resources into making really great software for the iPad Pro [TS]

  is if they it's it's kind of chicken and a problem if they don't then the iPad [TS]

  pro it will probably see will probably not do substantially better than the [TS]

  other iPads have done and it's not like they're bombing you know it's a bigger [TS]

  business than McDonalds or whatever you know they're doing okay but it seemed [TS]

  that the point this product was to really just really give it a substantial [TS]

  boost and unless the software comes I don't think that's going to happen I [TS]

  also don't see what in the software ecosystem will meaningfully change that [TS]

  will certainly make this a great platform that is worth developers both [TS]

  large and small spending a lot of time creating and maintaining professional [TS]

  quality after this platform like Apple's been coasting on the posting but like [TS]

  benefiting from the inevitability of the iPad that they apparently feel that I've [TS]

  always felt even from my original iPad launch when the iPad was coming out it [TS]

  was like Apple's tablet we do know that the name of it was going to be one of [TS]

  the topics of discussion around that time although we didn't have a lot of [TS]

  progress talk about it on was what is the one of the home screen and all of a [TS]

  kind Apple tablet and the reason that was a discussion because the second [TS]

  thing some any moment saying that conversation is they can't just do what [TS]

  they do on the phone and have just agreed I think is the screen is massive [TS]

  so what are they going to do like it was it was fun to think about [TS]

  what is the sort of the home experience the the root level the bottom level that [TS]

  thing you see when you turn this thing on what does that look like when you [TS]

  have italicized devices and Apple's answer was looks like a foamy spread [TS]

  stuff and as the iPod iPad change sizes smaller you know the icons are there now [TS]

  it's gotten bigger guy comes to spread out the couple I says that one is if [TS]

  they actually did put things in the same density they are in a phone that would [TS]

  be an object of ridicule people like that big iPad you can tell her anything [TS]

  is a million icons on the home screen so they could not obviously not do them [TS]

  that they just you know that's just goes to show that like the density that works [TS]

  well in the tiny thing your hand you can't use that same density in the [TS]

  things size of actual notebook piece of paper but surely looking and I've ever [TS]

  you like you can get a few more in their cancer like this is just huge white [TS]

  space between them that all gets back to the same root problem which is trying to [TS]

  figure out which Apple has been trying to do in failing for many many years now [TS]

  how to take this computing device that happened i think is the future of [TS]

  computing as obvious as anything else but that it has to grow up and it has to [TS]

  start taking on more of the capabilities of desktop computers and has to do that [TS]

  at the same time as it doesn't take on all their crap of the whole reason we [TS]

  ceded the future of computing and mobility is that there's something you [TS]

  won't be able to do an iPhone which is not the Colin edible to hear [TS]

  done right something you can do on a phone listed on small and pieces are [TS]

  still too hard to use including max so here's the thing that's in between it [TS]

  takes all the good stuff from your phone that ever knows how to use it as [TS]

  comfortable with get rid of all the legacy corrupt but how can you make it [TS]

  have more capabilities and design the home screen of the iPad was one of the [TS]

  first times that Apple is faced with it all right what do you see when you turn [TS]

  on the iPad we have this big screen can we do something different in this round [TS]

  in that realm is like the place where people go to launch their absurd to [TS]

  rearrange things or whatever and they punted are they said well I don't really [TS]

  have any good ideas right now so as make it [TS]

  just continue to get that down the road all the while knowing that surely [TS]

  there's something more they can do but if you don't want to make it into what [TS]

  do you have to find her on the iPad no no we don't want that crap the whole [TS]

  reason people like that added that it simple so it has to be straightforward [TS]

  and yeah we're fine with that but now now we're getting the point of the iPad [TS]

  solutions but we have to make it more capable so bigger good yes thumbs up [TS]

  front that ever you have to make it because it's more stuff you can do and [TS]

  then what can we do with that real estate that but that's harder problem [TS]

  I've got a real estate office right now we could split the screen make it like a [TS]

  divider that you can kind of like that's better better than nothing but it still [TS]

  shows that the haven't figured out how to add capability without adding [TS]

  complexity that the beauty of the things we all know the windows pointer mouse [TS]

  you know went interface pioneered by the National popularized by the Mac is that [TS]

  evolved over time with a vocabulary that we're all familiar with like you know [TS]

  it's easy for us to think like Macs aren't that hard or PCs on that hard [TS]

  everyone knows how to use Windows and and and menu bars and like this [TS]

  vocabulary for dealing with windows that you can resize them very edges you can [TS]

  move them around tabs or another it was added to be all understand how ted's [TS]

  work but that's us to everyone else this is insane to get the file system files [TS]

  and folders and and navigating the hierarchy a very simple consistent [TS]

  vocabulary for people who are into computers for everyone else it might as [TS]

  well be you know inscrutable and just like some people just never fully rested [TS]

  so that's why we know that the smartphone and iPad are inevitably the [TS]

  future because history has shown over decades that just people not enough [TS]

  people [TS]

  karach computers the way we grab them this interface is on you know it's much [TS]

  better than what came before the command line even a small number of people rock [TS]

  the GUI with the masses and scrollbars a larger but everybody gets the smartphone [TS]

  right and but there are those of us who use computers to do our jobs they have [TS]

  to figure out a way to make these things more capable without making it more [TS]

  complicated and that is a really difficult job and that's on Apple like [TS]

  individual developers they can make their applications to use the old [TS]

  parlance I [TS]

  perot savvy and he told you all that stuff or whatever but it's kind of an [TS]

  apple to show how this can really be the future computing and so far they've been [TS]

  timid about it because it's safe to say we just do it on the phone and bigger [TS]

  people are understanding it works fine but you're not getting into capabilities [TS]

  that even those who when you rotate male sideways good news side bar and you [TS]

  don't like the success + like they did a couple different layouts and whatever [TS]

  this is so massively huge you can to say all right now are absolute have a little [TS]

  bit different layout is sometimes you have to go over there inevitably you [TS]

  have to get to some solution that gives us what we do with Windows but in a [TS]

  simpler way and the splitter is their first crack about and I haven't used it [TS]

  so I don't cancel it is but boy it just just going to have a long way to go in [TS]

  this area and most of the complaints and surrounding software on the iPad pro I [TS]

  don't think it dooms the table as a platform it just goes to show that this [TS]

  is a hard problem and it's easy to take for granted the the breakthroughs and [TS]

  inventions that came with the Mac in with the original Google that had so [TS]

  much time to evolve we had two errors on both ends of the scrollbars I mean [TS]

  proportional to the scrollbars entirely even something as simple as moving [TS]

  window here and it's growing there's a lot of cracks at that like what we have [TS]

  now is not what was first there and we tried all sorts of different things to [TS]

  try to find something that would that was better professional scrotum [TS]

  revolution Appleton invent those obviously never really stopped him but [TS]

  that was a significant enhancement over the original scrolls and the original [TS]

  Mac scrollbars were significant enhancement over the weird ones on the [TS]

  system's the end like middle click or whatever to school so I don't expect [TS]

  anyone to nail this in the first try but the the iteration time has definitely [TS]

  slowed down I think mostly because the smartphone its interface became so [TS]

  iconic that I was like well worst case is just it's like a phone but on a [TS]

  bigger screen everybody understands that it'll be fine but we won't make [TS]

  significant progress towards the future computing capital S capital C that Tim [TS]

  Cook and several people believe must come sunday and i know i mean [TS]

  a lot of these problems people assumed to be problems like you know like my old [TS]

  you know launching apparatus setting screen design problem where you know you [TS]

  assume oh well [TS]

  computer too hard to use so the way to make it easier to use it to get rid of [TS]

  all these files and windows and everything [TS]

  giving all these things people are confused about but if you if you look at [TS]

  it only in that way that that's what kind of aid like naive like twenty [TS]

  two-year-old smart person we look at things like well this is all stupid will [TS]

  get rid of it you know and then you do and you realize oh now we have a lot of [TS]

  problems to solve and the solutions that you build up [TS]

  end up being often time is more complex or worse or at least no better than what [TS]

  was already there because it was already there was actually there for good [TS]

  reasons and so a lot of problems I i think you know have to be backtracking [TS]

  some way for example I Club Dr perfect example this where you have ok well [TS]

  there's no more files each absence has its own content in the app and then we [TS]

  have a single engine and a little just think this document still in the app and [TS]

  a note turns out having a folder that just seems everywhere like Dropbox is [TS]

  really useful and makes a lot of things way easier than all these apps having [TS]

  their own little sandbox silos and also to bring lots of other limitations and [TS]

  challenges to the platform and oh by the way all this contributes very heavily to [TS]

  why a lot of people can get their work done and iOS you feel like it is [TS]

  tempting to slide back to the old solutions yeah I think those you know i [TS]

  think is a great example of us like the new stuff is supposed to work but [TS]

  doesn't in Dropbox use the old paradigm + reliability to say thank you guys you [TS]

  guys haven't figured it out I know this is an old paradigm that is confusing but [TS]

  it's reliable and at least in the very least two people understand files and [TS]

  folders from Dropbox and other people though most along because they'll be [TS]

  reliable but it's so easy to go back to that Apple doesn't like do that that's [TS]

  why the iPad products come with a bunch of windows with widgets the slide around [TS]

  on the screen right they totally could could you know they can make like a [TS]

  touch and I was 10 designed for touch where all the way to go whatever but you [TS]

  have actual windows [TS]

  how to do that to its credit to its detriment or demerit of whatever word [TS]

  you want insert there they don't seem to have quite an idea what to do going [TS]

  forward and they've been really cautious about like poking their way toward the [TS]

  edges of Microsoft has been much more daring in thinking the old paradigms [TS]

  there we want to try something new and they went hog wild but the whole Metro [TS]

  stuff I don't think that was successful [TS]

  either but they certainly you know came went forward much more boldly than Apple [TS]

  AAPL there's been like its smartphones that everyone likes that all the [TS]

  compromises made to a small screen will report to the big screen and don't [TS]

  complain that I can't do anything more than a phone [TS]

  yeah I mean at this point I would say the name thing that holds iOS back from [TS]

  more pro adoption is the OS it's not it's not the screens weren't big enough [TS]

  you know those things help and you know things like the iPad pro and the pencil [TS]

  and and the you know finally like a decent keyboard those things will all [TS]

  help and they all bring in certain portions of the workforce and population [TS]

  that couldn't have done it before didn't want to do it before but fundamentally [TS]

  the main reason why so many people say I can't get my word on an iPad or it would [TS]

  be very clunky for me to get my work done on iPad fundamentally that comes [TS]

  down to iOS and the structure of iOS how things like files and documents and [TS]

  sandboxing and apps how these things are all and multitasking like how does all [TS]

  work together how things they can do the things they can't do that is ultimately [TS]

  what it comes down to for a lot of people and that is really hard to change [TS]

  meaningfully without edges but i just basically making a Mac redoing all these [TS]

  old complexities you know now Apple is trying to figure out which of the [TS]

  complexities were actually not necessary and and which are necessary to have a [TS]

  productive you know kind of pro work machine I don't think any of them are [TS]

  necessary the question is simply like because they are as a means to an end [TS]

  the end is I need to have a way to to use multiple to do multiple things at [TS]

  once they recalled multiple application but there's no reason that paradigm [TS]

  units take a look at the things you could have gone the OpenDocument where [TS]

  everything is inverted in the document is king and there's no real applications [TS]

  in any way they didn't have applications or face the basically the title race [TS]

  with is how do i do more than one thing at one time even before that these [TS]

  things start sharing with each other just simply how do I go to you know to a [TS]

  browser too many text add it to my email to my daughter whether you know how do i [TS]

  do more than Windows solves that problem not capital W Windows Microsoft like [TS]

  Windows is the solution that people came up with that there's going to be [TS]

  application content it's a newsletter rectangles we can change the size of a [TS]

  size too small scroll bar there to move around they have a thing that you can [TS]

  drag them on they have little buttons even close to minimize impact like we [TS]

  that's that was the old solution to that old solution [TS]

  effects seen anybody use computers windows are not something that most [TS]

  people deal with well and it is simply not gotten better you can't blame at all [TS]

  because all people did you grow up with computers there are many many people who [TS]

  grew up with him Peters who cannot manage Windows as we all know an expert [TS]

  in managing windows and because I have an aptitude for it but and it makes me [TS]

  keenly aware that pretty much everywhere else I C has no idea what to do with [TS]

  Windows even even young kids at work my kids just out of college I see how to [TS]

  use computers and they have these massive screens in the head like maybe [TS]

  two windows that's why people love tiling window managers and things like [TS]

  Windows 10 where you jam the window inside of the screen until they managing [TS]

  Windows is it is not easy to do to have a bunch of windows all shuffling around [TS]

  it's like having 17 papers on your desk overlap with each other and how to [TS]

  manage it right that is it's not like that people are going to get better at [TS]

  that so I'm not saying it's a bankrupt parent on its way better than people [TS]

  managing the mental state required to deal with the command line right big [TS]

  advancement over that but you can't go back to it but we still have the root [TS]

  problem of what I want to do a bunch of stuff at once so how do you let me do a [TS]

  bunch of stuff ones without asking me to manage Windows and so far we don't have [TS]

  a good answer to that the iOS multitasking switchgear splitting the [TS]

  screen [TS]

  none of those things like oh we recognize all those things are better [TS]

  than nothing but still not as capable as Windows even to people who are good at [TS]

  managing Windows not like they have a lot of windows if you're at all used to [TS]

  Windows who like I wish I could have windows in this thing but then you [TS]

  realize it doesn't work with finger whatever so that's one root problem how [TS]

  do I have to give something that's the equivalent of Windows like I don't see [TS]

  it that way but how do I let people use this computing device to do more than [TS]

  one thing at the same time and and move between those tasca nice way to set that [TS]

  aside we don't have a good solution at the other one you were talking about [TS]

  Marco how do I deal with the data how do I take some piece of data to synthesize [TS]

  like pictures from here text from their link from here how do I move stuff [TS]

  between applications keep track of where things are saved things have have you [TS]

  know any also shown that was files and folders in a file system yet images yet [TS]

  text documents you know that was the old paradigm as we all know people are good [TS]

  at the old paradigm files and folders people make a big giant mess that can't [TS]

  keep track of where there are lots of people can deal with it but lots of [TS]

  people just can't and again we've had computers long after not to say like the [TS]

  old people die young people know how to deal with the soldiers nope we ran that [TS]

  experiment human beings are not changing that fast [TS]

  thousand boulders a lot of people can use it but a lot of people can't it's [TS]

  much easier when there's no saving you open the Notes app you type a bunch of [TS]

  notes in with your thumbs on your iPhone you close the notes have known known as [TS]

  begging for a Save button in the Notes application million times and it it's [TS]

  just goes to show that like those are complex is to be done need but when you [TS]

  want to do something that would usually be done with files and folders in a file [TS]

  system what is the solution for that Apple should really probably have like [TS]

  teams of fifty really smart people [TS]

  multiple ones them working all these problems because right now there are [TS]

  either not solving them at all [TS]

  are making VV most timid move in the direction of solving them and then just [TS]

  kind of being like like it's a little bit more complicated than the iPhone but [TS]

  it's not as good as the Mac what do you think of that and it's just not the same [TS]

  as the boldness [TS]

  the Mac of saying the command line is crap forget about what we're doing it [TS]

  nothing to do with the command line here is where are you know what we've seen [TS]

  the future and organize this is the direction we're going to take and it's [TS]

  way better than everything came before it and so far we haven't had that moment [TS]

  for the post [TS]

  you know the post-world so two questions for you john first of all an infinite [TS]

  time scale would we get good at using Windows think so cuz I don't think there [TS]

  is anything I don't think there's any evolutionary pressure like there is a [TS]

  will there is nothing about being good at windows that makes your jeans more [TS]

  likely to be passed on it so in in the absence of that pressure I don't see how [TS]

  the genetic makeup of humans would change over any period of time to become [TS]

  better at managing multiple tuition of windows and the second reason of course [TS]

  is that we will come up with different interfaces that are better than windows [TS]

  and simpler and better suited to us so it's not nothing holding window study of [TS]

  saying I demand that windows as they currently exist stay there for the next [TS]

  three billion years to wait and see if human evolution will make us better and [TS]

  he took that question [TS]

  way too seriously I gave you give you the answer but I appreciate and we [TS]

  thought nothing less [TS]

  exactly the other question I had and I am being serious now is you seem really [TS]

  disappointed with the multitasking paradigm in iOS and I you know I have [TS]

  the iPad Mini the first one of the retina display and it doesn't support [TS]

  the terminology wrong so it does to slide over it doesn't display people [TS]

  pretty sure got that right that's right in some only had limited experience with [TS]

  the multitasking on on on an iPad but I feel like I really liked it I will say [TS]

  that the multitasking switcher when you're switching between apps in the in [TS]

  the slide over what have you [TS]

  is stupid like I agree with you there that's dumb but the general premise [TS]

  behind it I don't think it's so bad I'm not saying there couldn't be better but [TS]

  i mean i i think it's a pretty solid first step do not think that I'm not [TS]

  like it's easy to see that is not as capable to better than one but not as [TS]

  good [TS]

  3 got far and so on and so forth 62 [TS]

  admitted doesn't help you with dozens of you yet with the you know sharing from [TS]

  one thing to the other dragging and dropping across that line or somehow [TS]

  because things are visually next to each other things same things we do the [TS]

  desktop like raindrops again saying drag and drop it will bring over because the [TS]

  old thing that worked but they need something that feels the same role as [TS]

  drag and drop in like you know why I have something over here I'm gonna drag [TS]

  it over there and I'm going to check into this thing and now this image I [TS]

  dragged 0 photos onto the desktop direct from the desktop into photos that's not [TS]

  a particular fishing move but it's using a vocabulary that we understand to do [TS]

  that the reason I'm also disappointed it as disappointed like better than nothing [TS]

  but it's so clearly still less capable than than a desktop computer but I feel [TS]

  like almost as hard to explain to people who aren't familiar why I just tried to [TS]

  show my daughter today first year for whatever reason she decided to use the [TS]

  laptop to write something instead of writing on a piece of paper I don't [TS]

  think she writes on their iPod she's not to use the laptop and she asked me how [TS]

  to make the window cover the whole screen so I showed her the full screen [TS]

  thing she's in full screen mode and then she wanted to look something up in [TS]

  Safari and I want to show her you can actually see the text editor and Safari [TS]

  at the same time but then I realized to show her that I had to show all you have [TS]

  to do all you have to do is arranged the windows arrange the windows she doesn't [TS]

  know how Windows move she doesn't know windows can be resized I resize the [TS]

  window and she asked me how I did it how did you change the size of the window [TS]

  like a single thing you know so trying to show someone how to use mine is [TS]

  obviously trying to show her how do you split view on the iPad would advise all [TS]

  that almost the same conversations like it already [TS]

  already too complicated I feel like people are gonna figure it out on their [TS]

  own and I think it suffers in comparison to windows and it doesn't really give [TS]

  you a start of functional vocabulary that you can apply repeatedly because [TS]

  once you figure out how window works you still may not be good arranging windows [TS]

  because [TS]

  just knowing head over and over cases like I know how to formal letters it's [TS]

  not the same as knowing how to write a mean or knowing how to hit one piano key [TS]

  is not the same as know how to play a piano but you know that any key on the [TS]

  keyboard with your finger will make a noise you figured out the vocab the [TS]

  function of vocabulary the basic functional look at the end of a panel [TS]

  once you figure out how Windows work you can drag them but item are you can [TS]

  resize them you can close them you can move them around you learn the [TS]

  parameters that came with all the screen oh no I can't gonna get the towel bar [TS]

  menu bar not less there's like a bug in the US which happens sometimes it is it [TS]

  really that much easier not don't think about the split view as like it's pretty [TS]

  cool kinda like you know how to use desktop computers think about it as if [TS]

  you had the show somebody who had only ever used a smartphone how do you split [TS]

  view with their eyes glaze over in a bit like I don't get it and then secondarily [TS]

  could they transfer those skills like if you say you show them how do you split [TS]

  between a figure it out [TS]

  could be useful for anything else they say now I can split view any two [TS]

  applications that would you have to show them again [TS]

  ok well this is useful if you but what if you want to come back to what will [TS]

  the same two things being something different in this book if you have [TS]

  multiple like I think it's already too complicated and still less capable now [TS]

  I'm not entirely sure about that but I'm that that's my sense of it so far is [TS]

  that it's not like it's on its way to being as good as the Mac I think it's [TS]

  it's not a game both the map and not really easier to explain that Windows I [TS]

  feel like it's a bad solution this point before I get there seems to be a certain [TS]

  baseline level of required complexity and that's not to say that for things [TS]

  like multitasking that we have windows or slide over or everything's full [TS]

  screen like that's not to say that that these things cannot be improved upon but [TS]

  I do think there is a certain like ceiling that we cannot surpass of like [TS]

  how simple can we make this because the the fundamental fact is these are [TS]

  advanced concepts that they're going to have some inherent level of minimum [TS]

  complexity 00 we're going to have multiple things that are separate that [TS]

  are running on the screen at once and is going to be some way to divide the [TS]

  screen space between them and there's gonna have to be able to pick out which [TS]

  ones to open [TS]

  somehow figure out if you want to open them one of the time or if you want to [TS]

  add multiple went to the screen in some way then figure out how to switch [TS]

  between them had a close certain ones or all of them like there's going to be [TS]

  some baseline level of complexity to this no matter how its design the matter [TS]

  what system it is there's going to therefore be some kind of basic learning [TS]

  curve [TS]

  no matter how easy would make it so again this is this isn't to say that we [TS]

  can't improved since we have now but I think people are assuming that there is [TS]

  some endgame here that we show that we are that we should be going for where [TS]

  anybody can just pick it up and all of a sudden it's perfect and that's never [TS]

  were never going to reach that I think you're mistaking to witness and the old [TS]

  parlance for just a better you are because you could say all the same [TS]

  things back before the GUI existed some inherent complexity in a time-sharing [TS]

  system for multiple programs around the same time we're never gonna make it [TS]

  easier because you know and then the GUI came along and it's like oh well I guess [TS]

  if you totally rethink things that I guess you can make it massively people [TS]

  still too complicated for all people but so much better you know like you really [TS]

  there is no I don't think there's any limitation and you know the endgame [TS]

  obviously would be like you know some crazy neural interface readers think [TS]

  stuff and the magic happens there are already in game is stationed of human [TS]

  life and the computer take over anyway there's definitely an in-game many like [TS]

  it but but firm for things like interfaces [TS]

  I think they're absolutely like I think that kind of thinking that that is just [TS]

  like there's a certain amount of complexity and there's no way we're [TS]

  gonna make it simple as just absolutely the wrong way to look at this because [TS]

  having lived through the GUI revolution having seen how that's why that's why [TS]

  we're not going in that was so brilliant dead it did find a way lots of people [TS]

  try to find ways to do it and then finally did find a way through the use [TS]

  of metaphor and through what I've maintained as one of the best interfaces [TS]

  ever the the spatial finder giving people an interface that played to the [TS]

  strengths of their of of the knowledge they have from living in the actual [TS]

  world and let them use those skills [TS]

  manage this the virtual world of the computer in a way that wasn't possible [TS]

  before and it made them much more capable didn't just make the [TS]

  capabilities easier it made them it added new capabilities and what we need [TS]

  is the next one of those revolution arguably the smartphone was the next one [TS]

  of those resolutions just happened to be in a constrained environment with a hand [TS]

  in it and he carried around with you which will let us avoid a lot of the [TS]

  more difficult problems it was a very difficult problem in itself that guy was [TS]

  the second removing the smartphone right making computing making people be able [TS]

  to do some computers people who couldn't be used for making you not even think of [TS]

  it as a computer but in the larger round we still have these other computers but [TS]

  that have changed into this incredibly capable general purpose they have the [TS]

  resulting still complicated so that is the next frontier so I don't I'm not as [TS]

  fatalistic as you are about to get there is some inherent complexity and people [TS]

  are going to change but really truly believe there absolutely is a way to [TS]

  leverage for humans are good at to let them do all the things they do a desktop [TS]

  computers in an easier way to go back a step it is absolutely insane to me john [TS]

  that you would take windows as the introduction to multiple things [TS]

  happening at the same time to me the iPad multitasking interface is much [TS]

  easier to understand and makes so much more sense yet it's it's a little bit [TS]

  weirder in that there's not a lot of visual cues as to what to do but in [TS]

  every other measure put measurable way I feel like it is so much easier and in [TS]

  for your daughter to to be confused by Windows that's not terribly surprising [TS]

  to me but I think if you had done the reverse and started on the iPad and then [TS]

  said tomorrow will this is kinda like the iPad but you can have more than just [TS]

  too and you know you don't have to do some weird gesture that slide them [TS]

  around you just have to grab it move it I feel like that would have made a lot [TS]

  more sense to her to me i i think you're looking at the iPad interface as a [TS]

  dumbing down of windowing whereas I see even though this obviously is [TS]

  chronologically the reverse I feel like windowing is an extension of the more [TS]

  simple iPad [TS]

  and it's a much easier paradigm to understand and yes it's not discoverable [TS]

  once you've discovered it is so simple to use and it seems like it would be a [TS]

  lot of the problems that people have with windowing systems I don't think [TS]

  they would have them with the iPad I mean this is all guessing I have no [TS]

  evidence of never ask my parents hey how do you have to do you absolutely that [TS]

  same time the iPad this is all supposition but it just seems so much [TS]

  more logical to me than than the phar-mor inscrutable task of managing [TS]

  windows up again on the learnability into it is does it really matter how to [TS]

  use their first what matters is after you show them how to do it does this [TS]

  translate into sort of a new paradigm does he give them skills and vocabulary [TS]

  that they can be used to manage complexity in their life like not the [TS]

  computer complexity but the complexity whatever do everything is that they're [TS]

  using the computer to do you want to you know there's always going to be some did [TS]

  you know that at the same from the old days the only thing that actually [TS]

  intuitive as the nipple everything else is learned and so into it is totally [TS]

  read Harry right all you want is something that most people can learn in [TS]

  a reasonable amount of time and that after they learn it it gives them a [TS]

  toolset because it defines a sort of understandable world that lets them use [TS]

  those skills to solve problems so you can totally see how the GUI the Mac [TS]

  going in particular gay people that vocabulary all applications work the [TS]

  same menu bar as always all the windows work the same scrollbars workers and the [TS]

  mouse works the same as a simple click double clip and then adding that right [TS]

  click and everything like that that was a toolset I don't think the split you [TS]

  think it's a vocabulary that works in that way because it doesn't create I [TS]

  don't think there is an easily sort of there's no there's no user model is no [TS]

  mental model that people can latch onto for that mostly because this kind of not [TS]

  really an analog in the physical world because they like or what because the [TS]

  paradigm for iOS thus far has been the thing is the app the app is the thing [TS]

  and that is totally a thing [TS]

  paradigm that people can hang onto you want to go back to the place where all [TS]

  the other things are hit the home button and then when the thing goes it is the [TS]

  device that the simple one but that is a very solid paradigm that what is powered [TS]

  the the smartphone revolution you know this incredibly good iPhone user [TS]

  interface paradigm split view I think does not fit with the old paradigm and [TS]

  doesn't give the user a vocabulary mental model that think they can then [TS]

  parlay into now I can I can solve any problem because I know house but they're [TS]

  just more like a weird feature this added on top of the old system like it [TS]

  again didn't have to do with learnability are having to explain it [TS]

  it's just that it just seems like it is not a peace with the rest of the [TS]

  interface it is attacked on kind of thing but I don't think represents a new [TS]

  interface paradigm and therefore they haven't actually solve the problem he [TS]

  and I think that we fundamentally disagree is to me the only thing that [TS]

  you should be able to accomplish by understanding and rocking split the on [TS]

  the iPad is being able to put two arbitrary ops next to each other that is [TS]

  this I don't care of that lets you leap into new worlds and go out into the [TS]

  great unknown and apply this knowledge all I care about is can kill your [TS]

  daughter have safari in notes next to each other and then later on can she [TS]

  have YouTube and and sleep next to each other but she has to understand why [TS]

  they're no longer next to each other or something else and that's something else [TS]

  or how long they're expected to be next to each other like you know me and [TS]

  there's so many questions surrounding that in terms of like what what is the [TS]

  paradigm what is the user model what is the mental model how does this work [TS]

  just because you can [TS]

  just because you can [TS]

  I know how it I'm using this application I can make another appear if there's no [TS]

  actual understanding or it really is no solid paradigm underneath then every [TS]

  time you some other application you're faced with why is the thing that next to [TS]

  it now I just go through its a motion I knew before I think next to it why is [TS]

  this text that now I know how to get rid of the thing and it becomes it's like [TS]

  you're fighting with the computer instead of helping your not using it as [TS]

  a tool to help you solve a problem is just like every time you know this is [TS]

  capability but when it doesn't work the way you expected to work because you [TS]

  have a different model of like the persistence or the or how the [TS]

  interaction between the different applications is when they're not that [TS]

  way you can step into screen a few times to make it be that way but it's not it's [TS]

  not like it's not as straightforward as the the windows model which again people [TS]

  are good at least as an understandable model you make the window size you want [TS]

  to put them there were you want III at face value like that's you know it's [TS]

  enough rope to hang yourself because you don't know what size they should be [TS]

  aware you put them on Steve Jobs thing you have to be the janitor you have to [TS]

  put things where you want them I don't want you to be the general well whether [TS]

  your gender not everyone can understand the model of windows is the model [TS]

  doesn't help them manage their complexity than I could imagine windows [TS]

  which is why windows are generally a failure but I just don't feel like this [TS]

  but do you give any kind of understandable model gives a little more [TS]

  capability not as much as multiple windows but does not give you a new [TS]

  model for managing complexity going forward [TS]

  denied I still disagree with you but I I don't know either of us could be right [TS]

  on this [TS]

  you can find a way to find out is as you see people using iPads that increasingly [TS]

  capable but you see how many people you see using split for you are using it [TS]

  competently well see I think that's two very different discussions right using [TS]

  split view as I said it's not terribly discoverable so that's one thing now [TS]

  using a confidently that's where I think that's that is what will differentiate [TS]

  which one of us is right because of somebody stumbles upon it and it's like [TS]

  oh god what has happened and then is trying it is obviously trying to switch [TS]

  what happens there what have you and it's not working ok then you're [TS]

  absolutely right it's it's completely inscrutable but if someone has [TS]

  discovered split the you end up without too much effort is now using it [TS]

  confidently then I think then that indicates that I'm right and that it [TS]

  really is useful and it really is a paradigm that they've learned to help [TS]

  them get work done [TS]

  it may still be useful but like we all agree that is less capable the mobile [TS]

  windows if only because it's only two things right so yeah like the company's [TS]

  something is like if you see something using you see someone doing their work [TS]

  in a cafe in the same way you see them using a Mac now even whether the using [TS]

  full screen in the swiping between which by the way I've seen a lot of the [TS]

  younger people I work with their very confident in that because they're the [TS]

  smartphone generation I guess like they do full screen everything on a Mac [TS]

  laptops they do do the multi finger swipe between the applications but I see [TS]

  is incredibly inefficient but what they basically doing is turning them back [TS]

  into a paradigm that they understand because windows are difficult to manage [TS]

  but for split view you want to see somebody like during during their task [TS]

  using split views to help make their task more if not just once but you that [TS]

  they keep permanently in the whole thing is like I need to have slackened forever [TS]

  and ever and ever amen I wish I could tell the OS two never launched into [TS]

  launch them as a single application that is a super degenerate case using it for [TS]

  you but just to say that there there arbitrarily putting applications that [TS]

  other as is appropriate for the task they're doing if it's too difficult to [TS]

  rearrange to put this thing next thing that makes this thing then people won't [TS]

  do it and they'll be like well it's too it's too onerous to constantly the same [TS]

  way that people find it to understand here and Windows is to understand [TS]

  whatever reason so therefore I'm just gonna have once with you and everything [TS]

  else is non slip you and I would say that's not a competent use of things [TS]

  anyway even if they're using split views like that even if the using them to [TS]

  always put the two most convenient application expertise they need any [TS]

  moment in time and they have no problem doing in its second nature and they [TS]

  don't think about it it's very intuitive that's still a two things at once and so [TS]

  it's still worth it but it's worse by your metric of how many thousands of [TS]

  things can I get distracted by a ones [TS]

  know it's worse because we know people need to do more than one thing at once [TS]

  and windows are a failure because people can't use them to do more than some [TS]

  people can use the same people were trying to talking and aggregates I was [TS]

  obviously all of us can use Windows to do more than two things at once we do it [TS]

  all the time but most people when they deal with computers are not successfully [TS]

  that which means windows a successful for the people who are good at using [TS]

  computers in the old way of like you you know computers but worse for everybody [TS]

  S smartphones I would say pretty much a hundred percent of the population is [TS]

  successful at both using and and installing applications I pretty much [TS]

  think we've solved that they're not that improve but we've hit the mainstream in [TS]

  that are you are you using smartphones do you know smartphones very few people [TS]

  say that my singing like developing for hacking them that everybody knows how to [TS]

  launch the Facebook app to send text messages like we have crossed the [TS]

  effectively hundred-percent barrier there we are not even come close to [TS]

  crossing that at the can I use a general-purpose computing device to [TS]

  arbitrate things and so we're still struggling to get larger adoption then [TS]

  we have with the world of PCs and Macs [TS]

  agree with you that this that the smartphone fullscreen everything model [TS]

  is pretty pretty close to ideally usable for a lot of people but I think the [TS]

  windowing model is doing a lot better in practice then you're giving it credit [TS]

  for [TS]

  I think a lot more people than than you seem to be suggesting have figured out [TS]

  well enough to get stuff done and maybe not ideally you know I'm sure I'm sure [TS]

  you look at everyone and make sure you will look at my setup and they would [TS]

  make you cringe [TS]

  you know but but I think people-to-people figure it out they've [TS]

  been figuring out for decades most people who use a computer on a regular [TS]

  basis are able to figure out when doing enough to do this to do what they have [TS]

  to do what they want to do with anything and you can figure out like the upside [TS]

  is that if you use your model throughout but what we see the we all know the the [TS]

  things that are bad about when the reason people use the desktop so much in [TS]

  there are still with icons and they feel and non confident navigating the file [TS]

  system like that and it's obviously it's the reason everybody found smartphones [TS]

  to be such a breath of fresh air it's because all that crap that they have [TS]

  been sort of muddling through on their PCs at work or whatever is not there on [TS]

  on the smartphone there there are no files and folders this no saved button [TS]

  there's no desktop that it was just got rid of all that stuff and so even though [TS]

  they could you know he managed with PCs are calling the PC interface like a [TS]

  failure in the sense of like it [TS]

  able nobody's use it but I'd like to understand how much better it is [TS]

  compared it to people's reactions smartphones like smartphones anything [TS]

  considered computers like it is is is a discontinuity of it transcended the idea [TS]

  of a general-purpose computers it right the people do get by doing all they want [TS]

  us to full screen and playing minesweeper and click around their web [TS]

  browser in the web is another paradigm co-manager paradigm I like licking [TS]

  underlined words and stuff that was another simple enough one that was more [TS]

  successful but it's it's not like the PC or Mac is a dead end but we've clearly [TS]

  pushed the limit of how many people are going to feel comfortable using that [TS]

  interface not to its false but just even in a merely competent way like I think [TS]

  they're people who used like a computer every day for multiple decades who still [TS]

  have no idea where there anything I can navigate the file system in are [TS]

  terrified by an open box and especially want everything to be either in that one [TS]

  place they know how to get to on the desktop or something that shows that [TS]

  interfaces not succeeding that's not the way it's supposed to work whereas people [TS]

  are using smartphones essentially the way they're supposed to work under the [TS]

  sort of a very simplified iOS paradigm of the Big Red of icons a swipe between [TS]

  a launch until the screen like they're not using that the phones into jericho [TS]

  they're using the bones that way they were designed whereas the maximum dose [TS]

  of people are modeling 309 everybody not the people that we know but like the [TS]

  entire mass of humanity like thing everybody's a whole yeah I could see [TS]

  that I think I'm mostly with you on that [TS]

  alright our final spots this week is mail route mail route dotnet / ATP to [TS]

  get the best spam and virus filtering had ever ever seen now if you can [TS]

  imagine a world without span that is the world that now delivers to you and it is [TS]

  real I use it myself I've used it now for almost a year I think it's really [TS]

  great I have never seen better spam filtering the mail route delivers so [TS]

  here's here's how it works is a service it's between the internet and you as [TS]

  your email host or the servers you run like that so far it like for instance I [TS]

  use fast now and I'm a post and you know a lot of people do this on servers at [TS]

  their own service for their business or a theory enough [TS]

  even when you're a mail server so you put mail route in front of your mail [TS]

  server or service and they filter out all the span and then they deliver to [TS]

  your service [TS]

  clean email as an investment for a while I've tried spam filtering through their [TS]

  settings I've seen other people doing it with Gmail I've tried I've I once and [TS]

  once a long time ago I did remote mail server and tried doing SpamAssassin and [TS]

  stuff like that I tried doing the junk mail filtering and Apple Mail none of [TS]

  these things have been nearly as effective as mellow out for me I i'm [TS]

  saying is honest this is my direct experience with this mail route has [TS]

  kicked their butts it in every possible way it filters out way more span almost [TS]

  all of it is very rare that I get a spam message anymore [TS]

  most days I get zero not like 1950 and it is extremely rare for legitimate [TS]

  messages to get caught in their filters as spam so I guess I can't tell you [TS]

  enough to sponsor Salina try to draw us into everyone's heads every time because [TS]

  his spoke and I can't overstate how good now outspend filtering is it makes email [TS]

  usable again I mean as much as I can be usable it makes it gives you the best [TS]

  chance of email btw crucible for you by taking all the spam and delivering only [TS]

  people denying requests for you to do things so really I can't say enough good [TS]

  things about mail route they support everything you wanted to support you [TS]

  know you point your DNS record at them they deliver mail to you and to support [TS]

  things like LDAP Active Directory TLS mailbag outbound real and all sorts of [TS]

  crazy stuff I don't understand so go to mail route that net / ATP you'll get a [TS]

  free trial and if you use that link to get 10% off the lifetime of your account [TS]

  thanks a lot to mail route for sponsoring our show once again that this [TS]

  new iPad pro [TS]

  talk about hardware but I think we should say next week a lot to talk about [TS]

  it on the iPad for hardware but that'll keep ya I mean I think it's worth you [TS]

  know giving us more time to use it first I would say you know my very very early [TS]

  impression as like an overview of it is you know whether whether you should buy [TS]

  on whether I want one for me the question is no [TS]

  TIFF I think we'll probably keep this although even she's right now because it [TS]

  is so big and a software is so not taking advantage of it yet these things [TS]

  will change over time [TS]

  you know i mean the bigness won't but in overtime software will take more [TS]

  advantage of it I would say if you're not in a huge hurry getting next year's [TS]

  is probably going to be a big improvement then most single year [TS]

  improvements would be for these things simply because not only will the [TS]

  hardware probably be a little better maybe it'll add some cool stuff like for [TS]

  stocks in better touch lady but the bigger thing is I think we need a year [TS]

  for both Apple and third-party developers to write its offer for this [TS]

  thing because it isn't there yet and there are some very now but it's it's [TS]

  gonna be awhile and it's gonna be awhile before everybody can actually afford to [TS]

  take advantage of it so the only exception I would make sure that would [TS]

  be if you are already a heavy iPad you somebody like federico VTG if you [TS]

  already are able to do a ton of your work or all of your work on an iPad and [TS]

  you already are doing things like using third-party keyboards with it and doing [TS]

  multitasking and you need more screen space if you if you already are using [TS]

  styluses to do [TS]

  artistic worker note-taking rant asians so if you if you are already and I've [TS]

  had power user then by all means consider this now but if if the if [TS]

  things about the iPad have prevented you from getting into it as a serious party [TS]

  device for your work I don't think this will change that at least not yet and [TS]

  maybe down the road it will once the software gets there but I don't think [TS]

  it's gonna be there for a little while hopefully by next year they'll have the [TS]

  iPad areas such as the virus with a pen something that could change everything I [TS]

  mean right now if you want this awesome pencil input you have to get the giant [TS]

  iPad and solely for me if I were to ever get into pencil stuff I would much [TS]

  rather have the iPad air sized one start doing art snacks if you don't need an [TS]

  iPad this and you actually paint brushes [TS]

  tough I know but the equivalent of like just having a small task that someone [TS]

  else and you to do to draw something for the day you know I'd rather just played [TS]

  pictionary no actually I actually I have kind of a fun idea for a game that I [TS]

  might want to do but it would require the pencil and it would also require me [TS]

  to develop the game so I think this is like that that's going to be doing on it [TS]

  and that's probably not gonna happen [TS]

  combination of flight control the world go do something fun actually know they [TS]

  actually found two games I've played draw the path of the the projectiles [TS]

  take any other person set up barriers to quickly drawn between them [TS]

  writes itself thanks a lot of other responses this week [TS]

  casper lynda.com and Miller out and we'll see you next week probably already [TS]

  exists 00 I'm sure there's like and them at least now the show they didn't even [TS]

  mean to begin [TS]

  accidental accidental [TS]

  case [TS]

  it was accidental and Markel [TS]

  so in other news I got my car back hours ago is still white still white vendors [TS]

  repaired all is right in the world once again I saw that picture of your car [TS]

  that can I really people are tweeting like oh that happened to John Kerry [TS]

  would have burned to the ground people don't understand how much damage to my [TS]

  car [TS]

  both willing to tolerate it and enforced to tolerate I had so many things in my [TS]

  car they're worse than that then you to spend $1000 to be repaired and the [TS]

  reason and get these repairs cause I know costs in the amount of money in it [TS]

  so you know I'm just gonna live with that giant white paint streak that was [TS]

  added to my car by someone who parked next to me this is just going to live [TS]

  with the huge gouging my bumper from the person who rendered me because my [TS]

  deductible won't cover it it's like just that's why everything about getting a [TS]

  nice car I would just never be able to drive it like you just the world the [TS]

  world that I Drive around them to just deal with too many hazards and held a [TS]

  brand new car i dented the rim of my fancy alloy wheels like in the first [TS]

  month that I got it from hitting a panel had to get a new Wii over 650 bucks so I [TS]

  couldn't believe that you is the only people in the south are people live in [TS]

  the desert do it like my car my perfect car that is preserved if it's as if it's [TS]

  a museum because we have no whether to speak of and no humid here you have and [TS]

  how can you be spending $1000 to repair quarter sized Nikki offender because it [TS]

  was down to the middle and for me was a hundred bucks with the size of a quarter [TS]

  know if it was really obvious if you had seen it was not that impressive but I [TS]

  assure you I was in dollars it's not it's $900 of all states money and $100 [TS]

  my money on your deductible pretty good that's a fancy insurance I would I would [TS]

  not sure probably paying too much for said insurance but nevertheless the [TS]

  problem that you have john is that you drive in an area that doesn't believe in [TS]

  roads that makes sense roads that function or drivers that know how to [TS]

  drive there not called mask pulls because they're good at driving a green [TS]

  over the world [TS]

  other cars are many me and it's where more damage to my car while parked than [TS]

  anything else because the parking garage at work has spots in the painting lines [TS]

  in the spots that they made the like motorcycles [TS]

  bit more spots in the parking garage that way and because it is not a big [TS]

  heart a full-size car but it's not human and I swear everytime I park I am making [TS]

  decisions about how many inches on either side of that yet the judge [TS]

  because you want like you to think most people are driving a single drivers so [TS]

  they're not gonna open the passenger door so I want to get closer but what [TS]

  the guy back since then I gotta figure out if he's a bad person then his drive [TS]

  so I have to like figure out where in in between the lines I want to be just [TS]

  perfectly and then looking at the type of car parking in two cars how likely is [TS]

  this person to be one of those people who doesn't even look at the swings the [TS]

  car door open and Janzen it anyway everyone has things they want to be [TS]

  perfect and I i admit I kind of did it with my mirror that was my fault [TS]

  coming out of my garage which is also size for a motorcycle or scared or [TS]

  something I got that repaired but that wasn't a thousand dollars and that [TS]

  damage was way more noticeable to say that you are obviously care very deeply [TS]

  about the particulars for your car look and I would like to care very deeply [TS]

  about the hell my car looks but I just cannot bear the amount of money would [TS]

  take to you then time frankly to keep bringing the car in the attack scenario [TS]

  yeah well one of them was the mechanical issue which was a week and then this was [TS]

  three days for the body issue however I'm not the only one who is going like [TS]

  ours today and I Marco I drove the white car I wouldn't say it was feeling is it [TS]

  but however you pronounce that I wouldn't say it was doing that to it it [TS]

  just so happened that the D test drivable model was white just like all [TS]

  of your car just happened to be white when they fall into your lap and you buy [TS]

  them right I agree I totally understand what you're going with here I really do [TS]

  the whole family went for this test drive there was a correct anyway yes so [TS]

  I ever seen a tester with the apt 5d last February I was very impressed by it [TS]

  but I also at the time I i said that the apt 5d is so fast I actually found it [TS]

  unpleasant [TS]

  would probably never do this from a stoplight at like flooring like that [TS]

  like it like hit you in the face so hard with with inertia that I just I didn't [TS]

  want to do that and I am threat threat since then I've been thinking more about [TS]

  doing more research I am almost certainly going to get a Tesla next I [TS]

  mean I'm basically ready to place the order because my my lease is up in late [TS]

  March and and there's like a two month lead time on lunch so I have to decide [TS]

  pretty soon I'm doing today I went up to test ride to first of all see if you [TS]

  like colors and stuff in person and also to test drive the non PC version of this [TS]

  is the 9th ed so it's just like the 85 a little more more battery so slightly [TS]

  heavier probably no speed difference really so overall I think I'm gonna get [TS]

  that one i think im gonna get the really yeah you know it's not the slow and it's [TS]

  like the middle one of them are really slow been the slowest when I think if [TS]

  your car keys right I think that's right on the numbers in front of me but I [TS]

  believe you're right but none of them are will be called slowed by anybody [TS]

  really but it's all relative so the middle one I would say in general the [TS]

  9th ed is not as fast as the m5 at the m5 peak power so the m5 win when you get [TS]

  that massive kick in the butt of turbocharged torque it is stronger [TS]

  feeling and faster feeling than the 9th ed but the 9th ed it comes it it's [TS]

  available right from zero in the AM 580 Florian five from a stop to spin the [TS]

  wheels it doesn't have any traction in and it's only reveal drive the 9th ed is [TS]

  all wheel drive with a really really good although drive system and you have [TS]

  all the powers mister and actually can put it down actually can use it [TS]

  overall I would say it didn't feel like I was really missing anything in this in [TS]

  in the middle version other then that extra big kick from from like really [TS]

  flooring it not only our wheels although we all options are on the same now I am [TS]

  torn on which wheels to get and I'm sure you have opinions I don't think they [TS]

  have any great meal options [TS]

  I agree I think all the wheels are middle of the road to ugly yeah I i [TS]

  would i would agree with that the the base one that that Johnson in this [TS]

  picture they they kind of look like the m5 winter wheels a very similar design [TS]

  it in person it just it kind of looks cheap like they don't they don't look [TS]

  like premium quality wheels none of them do really but I think the at the base [TS]

  model looks the least good of all of them [TS]

  the the 1980 Silver cyclone is kind of a halfway point between everything now the [TS]

  bigger ones do look substantially larger and more aggressive in person and so the [TS]

  question is like how aggressive and supported you in your car to look also [TS]

  I'm not quite sure I can pull off Finn 21 inch wheels on New York roads which [TS]

  are only marginally better than John what's your own identity and end the [TS]

  rims you should test drive the 21 like a lot of car makers are doing this now [TS]

  like offering new obscenely large wheels cuz they look cool and everything but [TS]

  like they just to turn that the rubber bands he can't drive and railroads with [TS]

  that yeah exactly so i think im probably gonna go with the nineteen sliver [TS]

  cyclone so that's a problem to do the red looks really awesome in person the [TS]

  black does look as bad as I thought some kind of torn between those two lean [TS]

  towards red otherwise I'm pretty much sold I i think im almost certainly gonna [TS]

  do it was tipsy about the color we never hear her car choice if if she would rank [TS]

  are for herself she'll get the blue the blue is a very nice blue I just don't [TS]

  care for blue cars for myself if it really is is being very supportive of me [TS]

  again in the red because your midlife crises red cars this is a good go down [TS]

  exactly you know like like the the black is fine if i if i want to be subtle [TS]

  mostly subtle to maximize the subtleties of this car the black be the right [TS]

  approach to that but I've been getting black car for so long I think of [TS]

  something for something different like Casey who will show is so should we [TS]

  start reading the manual for you now [TS]

  yes [TS]

  download pdf yeah I'll send it to you soon as I find it [TS]