00:00:15 ◼ ► is made possible by our sponsors, Ecamm, Google Gemini, and NetSuite. My name is Stephen Hackett,
00:00:25 ◼ ► Hello, it's me, continuing on from the Connected Pro show to give follow-up for that. People are not
00:00:32 ◼ ► going to understand why I'm saying this, which I think is part of the fun. Crossy Road is still
00:00:36 ◼ ► happening. They're updating it regularly. This is a game that is just continuing forever. Imagine that.
00:00:44 ◼ ► And I have the pleasure of introducing annual chairman, my chairman friend, Federico Vatici.
00:01:02 ◼ ► You're not going to get it. I want the best follow-up of all time. A selection of multiple
00:01:06 ◼ ► listeners wrote in, but Marco was first. Marco says, hi, Marco from Italy here. I listen to
00:01:16 ◼ ► In last episode, you mentioned WhatsApp not retaining the unread badge when you open the app.
00:01:21 ◼ ► They recently changed this. You have to go into WhatsApp settings, notifications, scroll down
00:01:26 ◼ ► to untoggle the, quote, clear badge option. Hope this helps. Marco has made my life better.
00:01:39 ◼ ► Yeah. It's recent. This is recent because I checked it like a few months ago. Like I was trying to dig
00:01:45 ◼ ► through this and like ended up like I was on that website that we spoke about a long time ago,
00:01:51 ◼ ► the WhatsApp releases website. Do you remember that? I ended up finding myself back there. There is an
00:01:55 ◼ ► episode of this show that is named after a WhatsApp update release. And it was from this website,
00:02:03 ◼ ► it's like WhatsApp release. Oh, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. And I ended up going back to that website a few
00:02:10 ◼ ► months ago trying to find if they had done this and no, they hadn't. But yes, now they have, which is
00:02:14 ◼ ► incredible. And yeah, I just want to talk about WhatsApp for a minute or two. Please. I'm using
00:02:20 ◼ ► WhatsApp a lot more just as I'm kind of making more acquaintances with people here. Right. So like
00:02:28 ◼ ► going to parent and classes and stuff, everybody sets up WhatsApp messages and WhatsApp groups and
00:02:32 ◼ ► stuff. It's kind of no way around it. You know, like like in Europe and like in India, like WhatsApp
00:02:38 ◼ ► is just is prevalent. Like it is at what is what everybody uses to communicate. I am the weird one
00:02:45 ◼ ► who wants to talk over iMessage. And I've been able to maintain a few groups in iMessage, but I am
00:02:57 ◼ ► And for group messages, WhatsApp is incredible. Like the way that that group can be created and
00:03:05 ◼ ► people just create groups for everything. It is so, so much better than than iMessage and
00:03:12 ◼ ► in ways that sound weird on the face of it, but make a lot of sense. Like, for example, you
00:03:17 ◼ ► know, I mean, we were put in a big group in one of the like the parenting classes that I'm in
00:03:23 ◼ ► of like everyone's in it. And then there was a group set up for just like the like the parenting
00:03:30 ◼ ► partners. And we don't we haven't exchanged phone numbers, but because we're in an existing group
00:03:36 ◼ ► together, they can set up a new group, which makes so much sense, like logistically. And people will
00:03:42 ◼ ► be like, oh, but you haven't had some kind of key exchange of phone numbers or whatever you'd say.
00:03:47 ◼ ► But like for the for the realistic world of dealing with group messages in these kinds of scenarios, it
00:03:52 ◼ ► just makes everything so easy. Federico probably has more thoughts on WhatsApp than I do. But it the
00:03:58 ◼ ► more I am using it and the more I am able to get over just how much I hate the UI from a like
00:04:10 ◼ ► I think from a functional perspective is incredible. I don't know what it is that gives you the maybe I
00:04:17 ◼ ► don't know if it's an illusion of speed or if it's actually faster than iMessage. They're using
00:04:23 ◼ ► different protocols. I don't want to get into that. But the thing is like one big thing that works
00:04:29 ◼ ► excellent, like it works so well in WhatsApp for me and it doesn't in iMessage. And it doesn't because
00:04:36 ◼ ► it shows a cultural divide, I think, between the engineers that design and work on messages versus
00:04:43 ◼ ► the people who work on WhatsApp is audio messages, voice messages, how they work in WhatsApp versus how they
00:04:52 ◼ ► work in iMessage. The design, the interaction of voice messages in iMessage has always been nonsensical
00:04:59 ◼ ► to me. And I think how they work in WhatsApp and how they were able to essentially define a new way of
00:05:11 ◼ ► communication that I believe only exists in this capacity and popularity in Europe is incredible.
00:05:18 ◼ ► like being able, like I send on a regular basis, voice messages that are like one minute, two minutes,
00:05:36 ◼ ► can only happen in WhatsApp because of the design that they have, that these voice messages have.
00:05:43 ◼ ► And the fact that you can now listen to these voice messages sped up, which I do at 2x all the time,
00:05:50 ◼ ► has been an excellent addition to WhatsApp. And so yeah, maybe, you know, there's parts of WhatsApp
00:05:58 ◼ ► that I don't like UI-wise, but the functionality and the way that they ultimately allow people to
00:06:08 ◼ ► communicate more and more easily, right here in Italy, like anything happens on WhatsApp, like
00:06:14 ◼ ► stores, you can contact them on WhatsApp. My barber, I can, I can, I can, you know, I can make an
00:06:23 ◼ ► appointment on WhatsApp. Um, my, my doctor, my, my, my veterinarian for dogs, like anything,
00:06:32 ◼ ► I can do anything on WhatsApp. And so, um, is it like UI-wise better than messages? No.
00:06:40 ◼ ► Although I will say that I don't love the new app picker UI for messages, but that's a different
00:06:46 ◼ ► conversation, but it's fast. The voice interaction is so much better than iMessage. The integration with
00:07:01 ◼ ► How, uh, you're going to have to help me with this. Is it possible to use WhatsApp on other devices?
00:07:12 ◼ ► You, uh, this functionality is called the linked devices. In fact, you can, you can even do it on
00:07:18 ◼ ► an Android device. You just link it to your iPhone. And so as long as you log into WhatsApp on your
00:07:24 ◼ ► iPhone every two weeks, everything is going to stay connected and linked devices, use WhatsApp on
00:07:37 ◼ ► Obviously. I mean, it's meta. I mean, it's meta. It's meta. Come on. What are you talking about?
00:07:44 ◼ ► You can use it on the web. Uh, you can use it on a, on a Mac. They have a desktop, uh, version on the
00:07:49 ◼ ► Mac, obviously on Android, iPhone. Yeah. That's a window. I don't know if they have a windows app
00:07:55 ◼ ► that I don't know. Uh, I don't know if I want to do this, but I'm just, I'm just intrigued because
00:08:01 ◼ ► I can see it is going to become a pretty big part of my life from now. Like just because of the way
00:08:09 ◼ ► in which my life is changing. Yeah. Uh, being able, being able to archive, um, uh, messages
00:08:16 ◼ ► into an archive section and, and still retain the ability to go in there easily and see, like, for
00:08:23 ◼ ► example, uh, you know, so many, uh, like, like the, the, the group chat of the condo where I live,
00:08:30 ◼ ► I, I archived it, but if I want to, I can go in there and see what people say. Uh, so yeah, there's,
00:08:36 ◼ ► there's tons of like different aspects that I don't know. And maybe it's just a European thing,
00:08:42 ◼ ► you know, because every time I talk about it, I get the messages from America, from people in America
00:08:46 ◼ ► being like, ah, I don't understand why you send voice messages. And cool. Like, you know, they're
00:08:51 ◼ ► popular here. I think it is a thing where people that use the app support it well, because like
00:08:58 ◼ ► people do it here too. Right. Like I see people sending voice messages to each other all the time,
00:09:08 ◼ ► WhatsApp is fascinating. I think really is just this, it's, it's an example of the kind of thing
00:09:14 ◼ ► where it's like, if you do one thing, you just really good at it. And like I message can't be as
00:09:22 ◼ ► good as WhatsApp because the company has many priorities, but like, even though WhatsApp is owned
00:09:28 ◼ ► by meta, they do seem semi-independent at least. I mean, I don't know, but it feels like they are
00:09:35 ◼ ► just very focused on that. They just have a lot of focus on making that app the best that it can be.
00:09:46 ◼ ► Mike, you're not alone. Curtis wrote in, I applaud Mike's choice of a read it later solution. I also
00:09:55 ◼ ► use Apple notes with a save for later folder containing several notes. So they have website
00:10:01 ◼ ► ideas, saved links, writing ideas, and clothing links. Uh, I guess Curtis is a big shopper.
00:10:07 ◼ ► My action button runs a shortcut to quickly add each text each week I review and clean out unneeded
00:10:14 ◼ ► links. It's simple, effective, and requires no extra apps or logins. See, this is the way,
00:10:21 ◼ ► like it's safe to say that I'm a visionary about, about reading later. You should have seen all the
00:10:29 ◼ ► listeners coming out of the woodwork, at least two of them saying that I was right in the way that I do
00:10:34 ◼ ► with my read it later. So at least a revolution, starting a revolution. I'm, it may have been more,
00:10:39 ◼ ► it could have been a million. I just maybe haven't been checking, but like, I have no doubt that they're
00:10:43 ◼ ► out there. Like people who agree with me. Have you two been, uh, chipping away at your read it late
00:10:48 ◼ ► cues this week? You've been reading some of the things that were later. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:10:52 ◼ ► Has it been going well? You're really happy? Um, I'm satisfied. I wouldn't say I'm really happy,
00:11:03 ◼ ► Yes. Okay. You think that is odd? I just don't believe that anyone actually reads their later
00:11:09 ◼ ► cue. You, you don't. Okay. All right. I just don't think, I don't think it happens. I think
00:11:14 ◼ ► it's, uh, you think it's, uh, like this, this, this mass conspiracy against the non-readers to
00:11:21 ◼ ► make them feel bad. Okay. Exactly. They're like, ah, my, my cue is long and I read all of it.
00:11:26 ◼ ► You know, like that's, that's what you read is. You readers. You readers. Okay. Us non-readers.
00:11:33 ◼ ► I find it, I find it funny because you actually, you actually record a podcast with the one person
00:11:39 ◼ ► who among us reads the most. And that would be Jason Snell. Um, Jason reads now. He doesn't read
00:11:46 ◼ ► later. Okay. So you think, you know, Jason is a reading now. You think at any given moment,
00:11:51 ◼ ► Jason is reading probably. Okay. He's reading right now. He's in the chat. He's reading. He's
00:11:56 ◼ ► reading and listening. I just, I believe Jason is a read it now and not a read it later. You know?
00:12:02 ◼ ► Okay. Sounds like a tagline for an app. That's not going to get any VC funding. It's like,
00:12:13 ◼ ► Like you don't need to read things later because the AI reads it for you and just tells you now.
00:12:18 ◼ ► I think literally Federico and I've had a sponsor on our blogs that has something similar to that.
00:12:33 ◼ ► This episode of Connected is brought to you by Ecamm. Ecamm Live is the leading video production
00:12:39 ◼ ► and live streaming studio built for the Mac. Ecamm is great at simplifying your workflow.
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00:14:41 ◼ ► A lot of people agree with us. A lot of people think we're idiots for our takes on it. I don't even
00:14:49 ◼ ► know what our takes are on it. We just talked about it. I just want to jump in right now on that exact
00:14:52 ◼ ► point. Oh boy. Here we go. Here we go. He's going off. If you ever start your feedback with,
00:15:04 ◼ ► Just take a breath. Understand that we maybe don't live the same life as you. That like the people
00:15:11 ◼ ► saying, I can't believe you didn't mention Partiful. Do you think I'm using it and just decide not to
00:15:17 ◼ ► mention it? Is that what's going on here? Like the I am a frequent receiver and sender of Partiful
00:15:22 ◼ ► free online party invites. You know what I mean? Just like assume that maybe we're different and like,
00:15:28 ◼ ► just be like, Hey guys, did you not, have you heard about this application before? That's a nice,
00:15:32 ◼ ► I can't believe you didn't mention Partiful during this conversation. So we neglected it. We're,
00:15:39 ◼ ► we're also a part of the conspiracy. So there is an app called Partiful that does a lot of these types
00:15:45 ◼ ► of things. And I've seen people since, and I was listening to the Waveform podcast and they were
00:15:50 ◼ ► talking about it. They're obviously young, cool, hip people who receive Partiful invites. And it seems like
00:16:02 ◼ ► Basically a hundred percent similar, uh, but works cross platform and that, that like with an app
00:16:10 ◼ ► cross platform. Uh, and so, you know, I can imagine people that are using Partiful, they're probably not
00:16:17 ◼ ► Yeah. So I downloaded it and it has very much like Apple invites. And it's one of those things. Apple's
00:16:24 ◼ ► definitely aware of this app because it was a finalist for, uh, in the app store awards in 2024
00:16:36 ◼ ► It's gotta suck, right? Like that kind of thing has got to suck so bad. Like Sherlocking in general
00:16:41 ◼ ► is a shame, but like, you know, you see a lot of people say they're Sherlocked and it's like,
00:16:44 ◼ ► Apple doesn't like, you know, like you're maybe do, do they even know who you are? But like when
00:16:49 ◼ ► they've awarded you or like nominated you for best app and then like a year later or something like,
00:16:58 ◼ ► Yeah, probably. Uh, but yeah, it looks, it looks great. A lot of the feedback with people actually
00:17:03 ◼ ► in New York city. Um, like none of us live in New York city, but it has a lot of, like when you fill
00:17:09 ◼ ► out the details, it has spaces for like, here's the door code to get in or like, you know, lots of
00:17:15 ◼ ► like detail that, uh, I think is, is pretty nice. I can see why people like this. Like I can see why
00:17:20 ◼ ► it's popular. The three of us did not come across it. Um, but I, I get it. And yeah, Apple's app looks
00:17:27 ◼ ► pretty similar in a lot of ways, which is, uh, which is always uncomfortable. Uh, but this is cool.
00:17:38 ◼ ► Other folks wrote in excited about invites, including Nicole, who wrote as someone who has
00:17:42 ◼ ► to deal with Evite and Eventbrite invitations regularly for work, I can say a non-spammy
00:17:48 ◼ ► alternative would be amazing. And I think I tried touching on this, but didn't quite get there last
00:17:54 ◼ ► week. A lot of the things that are out there that are web-based are like full of ads or you never get
00:17:59 ◼ ► off their email list. Uh, Eventbrite is pretty bad about that. There's also another one called Meetup,
00:18:10 ◼ ► like you're just in the, in their list forever. And, uh, you know, hopefully Apple's not going to do
00:18:16 ◼ ► that. So, uh, it's good to have an alternative again. Like I think all three of us have our doubts
00:18:21 ◼ ► about how widespread this app could be, but if it meets your needs, that's awesome. And it is cool.
00:18:28 ◼ ► It is a cool example of Apple pulling its ecosystem together. Uh, Mike, you and Jason spoke about this
00:18:35 ◼ ► on upgrade on Monday and y'all had a piece of feedback that was like, it was so smart. I wish
00:18:39 ◼ ► I had thought of it. It was like, it's like a WWDC demo app, but like finished. It's like, yeah,
00:18:46 ◼ ► it is, it pulls all these things together in interesting ways. And so, uh, yeah, Apple invites,
00:19:10 ◼ ► It, it, this is just one of these things where it looks interesting and I'm happy for the people
00:19:17 ◼ ► that want to use it and are going to use it. I just don't imagine it having a long life,
00:19:32 ◼ ► like, or maybe it just exists forever, but like not much changes with it. Like it's just
00:19:46 ◼ ► What's a little bloggy, little bloggy. Do you remember a little widget? Okay. It's a little
00:20:08 ◼ ► Kind of like in the, back in the days when everybody called their about page, their colophon.
00:20:14 ◼ ► So I actually just changed it back. That said about, and part of the rearranging was, uh,
00:20:31 ◼ ► I feel like it's one of these things that like was on daring fireball and then everybody did it.
00:20:35 ◼ ► And now Steven's back to colophon again. So I do instantly regret my making fun of because
00:20:40 ◼ ► I am now immediately making fun of Steven. So I'm just going to continue pushing forward through this
00:20:45 ◼ ► one. Uh, the now page is, what is this? This is like a little blog, a little social media.
00:20:51 ◼ ► Like what is this? A little bloggy. I think you said, I like it. Yeah, I like it, but I want you
00:20:55 ◼ ► to explain to me what it is and why you're doing it. Cause there's not much to talk about this week.
00:20:59 ◼ ► So I need you to tell me. Yeah. So we had a whole section of the show set aside for a new iPhone SE
00:21:06 ◼ ► that just didn't come out shoving things in here. Uh, yeah. I didn't mean to like put fun of sparks.
00:21:14 ◼ ► Like he's the one who urged me to do it. Lots of people, lots of people have this. Um, it's just
00:21:20 ◼ ► kind of a place to like, just rattle off some thoughts about like what's kind of currently going
00:21:25 ◼ ► on. Uh, for me, uh, not, I, I don't even want to say it, but like it dovetails with like a break
00:21:32 ◼ ► from social media that I'm taking mostly taking, uh, why don't we talk about that? We have time
00:21:38 ◼ ► maybe in a minute. Uh, and so, but like some of these things, so I've struggled with this over
00:21:45 ◼ ► the years and I think you can see it or maybe I can see it. Maybe readers can't. We're like,
00:21:50 ◼ ► I kind of swing over time of like what goes in the feed on five 12. Like I had a post the other day
00:21:58 ◼ ► that was just a screenshot of like an ad for logic inside of logic. And I was just mad about it. Like
00:22:04 ◼ ► that would have been a social media post, but I've made it a blog post instead. And then there
00:22:08 ◼ ► have been other times you're like, no, I'm only posting longer things. I'm all over the place.
00:22:12 ◼ ► This sort of stuff, like, I think it's kind of fun to share, but it's definitely not a blog post,
00:22:18 ◼ ► right? Like, um, at least most of them aren't. And I wanted a place for them that could kind of just
00:22:25 ◼ ► like live on the site and be updated. Uh, my plan is updated every couple of weeks. I have a recurring
00:22:30 ◼ ► task to do so. And I have a revision history set up on GitHub. You can go look through if you're
00:22:34 ◼ ► really just obsessed with this idea. Um, and yeah, so just kind of a, like a running log of things going
00:22:41 ◼ ► on. Um, and it was kind of fun to put together. So here's my question for you. You write things for
00:22:54 ◼ ► Well, I, I mean, that is kind of a problem with this cause it's not in the feed. Like I've made a
00:23:02 ◼ ► blog post that's in the feed. It's like, Hey, I'm doing this and I may relink to it every once in a
00:23:07 ◼ ► while. It's also in the navigation. And you know, it's kind of like, if you want to see this, it's
00:23:11 ◼ ► there, but if you don't care, that's fine too. Like because 512 pixels isn't strictly a personal
00:23:18 ◼ ► blog, I'm okay with it kind of being off the beaten path a little bit. Okay. Interesting. It reminds me
00:23:27 ◼ ► of like a little bit like the setups page. Yeah. Yeah. I was going to see that. Yeah. Yeah. And I,
00:23:32 ◼ ► you know, I have a gear page too. That's kind of the same thing. It's like, if someone asks me about
00:23:37 ◼ ► like, what are you using? I can just send them that URL, which I think is the same thing, same reason
00:23:41 ◼ ► the Mac stories guys are doing it. And so, uh, yeah, it's kind of like a fun, like little side
00:23:46 ◼ ► project. Now I like this idea of a separate pages on a blog with a more like sort of like static
00:23:53 ◼ ► approach to like, here's a, here's a, here's like a screenshot of this moment in time about like what I
00:23:59 ◼ ► do or what I use or whatever it is. I, I wish there was, I wish there was a, a better way. And maybe it's
00:24:07 ◼ ► I believe we're both using WordPress. Um, maybe, maybe there's a better way to do this that we're not
00:24:14 ◼ ► doing, but like, uh, you know, some kind of way to advertise updates to the, to these pages more
00:24:23 ◼ ► natively on our homepage in a way that is not us manually going in there and creating a new linked
00:24:31 ◼ ► post, which is what we do when we update the setups page. Yeah. We might, we manually blog about it.
00:24:36 ◼ ► Yeah. Right. Just an idea, but maybe this is like something that theoretically at some point,
00:24:52 ◼ ► Have you heard a good word of the fatty verse? Yes. Maybe, but this is the sort of thing where
00:24:57 ◼ ► actually the fatty verse could be useful. Like, uh, I don't know. I don't know. Something we're
00:25:02 ◼ ► thinking about for sure. Yeah. So Emma recommended, what about separate RSS feeds for these things?
00:25:08 ◼ ► So like, I, I think you get this if you subscribe to the verge, like, so I have a separate RSS feed.
00:25:25 ◼ ► is fine. Um, I'm always worried about the surface going away, but I could make a separate feed,
00:25:34 ◼ ► but then like, I don't know. Like I, I, I made it that at some point. Um, the other thing I would
00:25:40 ◼ ► like it as a separate feed that I personally would very much like that, like for, for all of these
00:25:44 ◼ ► things. So I know that they've changed. I, like, cause this is what I'm saying. It's like,
00:25:48 ◼ ► I, I want to read what people have to say. Uh, but I need like for, for, for this kind of stuff,
00:25:56 ◼ ► I have to know this. I have to have an impetus to go look at it. Right. And like, and I want,
00:26:02 ◼ ► I would personally want to read everything you ever publish here, but like my concern would be like,
00:26:07 ◼ ► you would update it next week. And then in two weeks time you update it significantly. And then you,
00:26:17 ◼ ► second update. You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. I'm going to think about that. I mean,
00:26:21 ◼ ► I think if this proves to be something that I enjoy doing over the long haul, it's something that I
00:26:26 ◼ ► would, I would look at. And I mean, I can have it be a category in WordPress and then have it. So you
00:26:32 ◼ ► have a feed per category and then hide that category from the homepage, which would kind of give me like
00:26:37 ◼ ► a blog within a blog. There's, there's definitely ways to do it, but for now the simplest way is,
00:26:42 ◼ ► is just, is just a page. Um, and then, you know, highlighting it every once in a while. And
00:26:47 ◼ ► I thought too, like maybe the most recent change could be like in the sidebar, but I think like
00:26:52 ◼ ► Mac stories, I would imagine most people who read 512 do it via RSS. Like my reader base of RSS is way
00:27:04 ◼ ► bigger than the traffic to the site on any given day. And so like even having it in the navigation or
00:27:11 ◼ ► in the sidebar still is invisible to those subscribers. So like there's, there's a balance
00:27:18 ◼ ► to be found there. You know, this is version, you know, one and maybe there'll be future versions down
00:27:34 ◼ ► Yeah. And, and actually 512 already has that infrastructure. Like it has, I've used categories
00:27:40 ◼ ► from day one and they're all there. They're not visible to anybody. Like echo Mac stories,
00:27:45 ◼ ► you can go to the bottom and see the tags and like, you know, click this and see the other articles
00:27:49 ◼ ► about Instapaper or whatever. Um, I have all of that built out and I've done it for 16 years. Like
00:27:55 ◼ ► every single post on the site is in at least one category. So the plumbing is there. It would just
00:28:01 ◼ ► be a matter of, of exposing that. You could what have feed bin, take a category and make it a make
00:28:09 ◼ ► like sort of a service could take a category and just create a feed out of that category.
00:28:13 ◼ ► Yeah. Well, WordPress can do that natively even. So I wouldn't even have to run it through something
00:28:17 ◼ ► like feed press if I didn't want to. Okay. That would be nice. Yeah. Yeah. As if you do it.
00:28:27 ◼ ► if other people are doing this and like have ideas, like, uh, I'd love, I'd love to hear them. You
00:28:31 ◼ ► know, Rob Knight, I spoke to him about this yesterday and he, on his side, it's kind of like a secondary
00:28:37 ◼ ► blog and, you know, it auto publishes the social media, which is like another thing. Like part of this
00:28:43 ◼ ► is like, I want this separate on social media, at least for now. So like that would be another thing to
00:28:47 ◼ ► contend with, but yeah, it's all, all good thoughts and all interesting possibilities, uh, down the road.
00:28:52 ◼ ► Oh, so is, so when I see Rob's posts on Mastodon and they have a link to the post, that's the same
00:29:00 ◼ ► text as the post. It's one of these. Is that what that is? I think so. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. That
00:29:06 ◼ ► makes sense. Now I did, I didn't understand what was going on there. This is the, the, the
00:29:11 ◼ ► refederated verse is interesting, but it is, it's like throwing up all these, like his wildly
00:29:18 ◼ ► different implementations that have everybody's thing. Cause also like people are mentioning like
00:29:23 ◼ ► OMG LOL, right. Which they have a kind of Brad was the first person I saw to do this where it's like,
00:29:29 ◼ ► he has like a page on his site, which is like, here is what I am doing this week. Um, and which is
00:29:36 ◼ ► like a, a not too dissimilar thing from what you're doing. Right. It's like kind of like a
00:29:41 ◼ ► schedule page. Uh, it's, I think it's the status log or something. It is. Yeah. Um, and, and it just,
00:29:46 ◼ ► it has like, this is, it's, it's a new one every week. And like, this is what Brad does every week.
00:29:51 ◼ ► Like, you know, it's like, I'm streaming these days, recording the podcast these days, that kind
00:29:54 ◼ ► of thing. Um, and it's not too dissimilar from this kind of idea. It is interesting. Like the,
00:29:59 ◼ ► all of these little different things are popping up, uh, even cause the, even like the, um, the
00:30:06 ◼ ► setups page, like I see people post similar things for the apps that they use. I think,
00:30:12 ◼ ► which I think was inspired by a podcast. If I'm remembering rightly, I know one of, you know,
00:30:17 ◼ ► this piece of information and, uh, yes, yes, it was inspired, but yeah. Uh, I have that on my
00:30:30 ◼ ► excuse me, where you can see down at the bottom, it's like software. I just listed them all out.
00:30:36 ◼ ► So yeah, it's, it's just a fun, like interesting thing I think to do within the, the, the 512 blog
00:30:46 ◼ ► infrastructure. It's just a matter of like, how far do I want to push it in terms of making it easy for
00:30:52 ◼ ► people to keep up with and how it kind of fits in with the other stuff? Like there is a world where
00:30:57 ◼ ► I would do this on some service, right? Like even Macedon or, or, you know, like what Brad is doing,
00:31:06 ◼ ► or there's a bunch of those services out there. Uh, but part of this is like, I want it on 512,
00:31:13 ◼ ► but then I got to find a way to integrate it with what people have come to expect from 512. Like if I
00:31:19 ◼ ► dumped a bunch of the stuff in the main feed, I just suspect some people who subscribe to follow
00:31:25 ◼ ► Apple and that sort of thing would, would not want that. And, and so, you know, making that all work for
00:31:36 ◼ ► Yeah. And that's, yeah, that's a question too. Um, so we'll see. It's brand new, but it's all,
00:31:42 ◼ ► it's all good stuff to think about, but it's because you mentioned, here we go, staying away
00:31:48 ◼ ► from social media. Yeah. Is it official if you don't mention it? I really, exactly. Or if your
00:31:55 ◼ ► podcast cohost doesn't drag out of you on the show. So you taking another break or is this something
00:32:01 ◼ ► else? Cause you take a break, like usually in October every year. Yeah. Cause you're tired after
00:32:06 ◼ ► lots of social media engagement in September. Yeah. Yeah. And I did in October cause I was on
00:32:11 ◼ ► sabbatical too. Um, yeah. Yeah. Just, uh, yeah, just seems like a, there's a lot of stuff on the
00:32:20 ◼ ► internet and, uh, I'm trying to be sensitive to the fact that like, I don't want to stick my head in the
00:32:27 ◼ ► sand about the world, but I even said on the now page, as I mentioned, this was like, I'm still
00:32:33 ◼ ► reading the news. I'm still like giving money and time to things that I think are important. Uh, but
00:32:39 ◼ ► I don't need everyone's take on it right now. And so the, those apps are off of my phone. I'm still
00:32:45 ◼ ► signed in on the web. Cause like, you know, I still keeping an eye on my replies and stuff in a work
00:32:52 ◼ ► context, but wanted to back away from it in terms of, of personal use. And I don't know where that
00:33:00 ◼ ► goes, but it's been a couple of weeks and so far it's been really good. So again, something else
00:33:04 ◼ ► new. You're just like, not at all. You're just not on social media at all. Yeah. So I, so like this
00:33:12 ◼ ► weekend, so I'm signed in on my, on my computer, but like this weekend, my laptop stayed in the office.
00:33:17 ◼ ► Like I didn't open it. And so I didn't look at anything over the weekend on social media, like, okay at
00:33:26 ◼ ► Yeah. Open Instagram was like, Oh, there's 3000 DMs here from people. Uh, but checking it like
00:33:34 ◼ ► really mostly replies, you know, a few times a week on the web at work and using Instagram on the web
00:33:43 ◼ ► sucks. And so it's a really good, uh, uh, limiting factor. It's like, okay, I could like see a couple
00:33:48 ◼ ► of things and then move on. And I'm not signed into any of these things on my phone. And so that,
00:33:55 ◼ ► that's kind of been the other thing. It's like, well, I could just go to like the threads of the
00:33:58 ◼ ► blue sky website. Um, I don't want to use Macedon on the web cause Macedon on the web really sucks.
00:34:02 ◼ ► It's like, look, you click this other link to see the replies. Like, I don't want to do that. So
00:34:13 ◼ ► all these things are new and experimental. Hmm. I'm going to put a pledge out into the world. Just
00:34:21 ◼ ► like a wish. Like this guy has really good, like moderation features, like mute, like mute words
00:34:28 ◼ ► and that kind of stuff. That's all built into the service. You love to see it. Please let me turn
00:34:33 ◼ ► off retweets for people. Please, please, please. It's still not there. It's still not support. Oh my
00:34:38 ◼ ► God. I know you can have custom feeds that like, but no, there's just specific people that I want to
00:34:44 ◼ ► follow, but they've retweet too much. And it's even, even just like a politics thing, but it is that,
00:34:50 ◼ ► but also it isn't like some people, they just like, they write an article and then they retweet some,
00:34:55 ◼ ► every single person who reshares it, they repost it. Like, and I just don't need to see the same
00:35:00 ◼ ► article so much. You know what I mean? Like I've seen it, like I've read it, it's fine. Um, so,
00:35:05 ◼ ► you know, I, I don't need it. And so like, I just, I want to keep following these people to see what
00:35:09 ◼ ► they have to say, but I don't necessarily need every repost, but there are some people I do want to see
00:35:13 ◼ ► what they repost because they repost interesting things, you know? So like the global turn on and off is
00:35:18 ◼ ► not what I'm looking for, but like, I just, I want to be able to be like, please just let me
00:35:24 ◼ ► turn off repost from this person. Uh, but if, if they've added it, I haven't seen it and I check,
00:35:30 ◼ ► I check a lot. So, uh, yeah, I've really, I really want them to, to sort this out, but they haven't,
00:35:37 ◼ ► but, uh, the, the mute, the mute words really good. Keep adding to that list every, every couple of
00:35:51 ◼ ► This episode of connected is brought to you by Google Gemini. I tried Gemini a couple of days ago,
00:35:59 ◼ ► the Gemini live where you can talk to it. And it's really wild. Just have a full on conversation with
00:36:04 ◼ ► this thing. I asked it to give me ideas for hosting during the holidays. And when it starts giving you
00:36:09 ◼ ► results, you can just stop it and say something like, okay, but what's, what about something low key
00:36:14 ◼ ► for a smaller group? I personally don't want to host a bunch of people. And then it just adjusted
00:36:19 ◼ ► to that. And you can keep going until you get an idea that you want. And I think that's what I would
00:36:25 ◼ ► use it for the most brainstorming things. It's so good. If you don't know where to start, or if you
00:36:30 ◼ ► hit a wall, you just go to Gemini and it helps you get the ball rolling, but you can use it for all kinds
00:36:36 ◼ ► of stuff. If you want to learn something new, or you can have it give you advice, ask it to explain
00:36:42 ◼ ► Bitcoin in simple terms, or you can have it quiz you on something like microbiology. Imagine being a
00:36:48 ◼ ► student and you've got this personal tutor on hand. And it's hard to explain. You really have to go play
00:36:53 ◼ ► with it and see how it listens to you, responds and adapts to your style of conversation. Just go try it
00:37:00 ◼ ► out. It's free. Our thanks to Google Gemini for the support of the show and all of Relay.
00:37:08 ◼ ► big news. Okay. After decades of people begging, finally, you can migrate purchases between Apple
00:37:23 ◼ ► I genuinely refuse to believe that this is not related to you. We just, this has been going on
00:37:30 ◼ ► for you. We just spoke about it for like an hour and now somebody dusted off some web objects and here
00:37:37 ◼ ► we are. Yeah. Someone sent me an email, they're like, boy, don't you wish this had happened two
00:37:43 ◼ ► weeks ago? I was like, uh, yeah. So, uh, Apple on the 11th. So yesterday as we record this, uh,
00:37:52 ◼ ► published a couple of support articles about migrating purchases from one Apple account to
00:37:57 ◼ ► another. And I would just say Apple account is a new term. It was Apple ID for like a hundred years.
00:38:04 ◼ ► I'm probably going to say Apple ID a bunch, like, just forgive me. They're one of the same. If you're
00:38:09 ◼ ► confused by that, they just rebranded it to Apple account, which is, which is a better term for it.
00:38:14 ◼ ► Like I like the branding better, but, uh, Apple ID is like burned into my head. So, uh, if you were like
00:38:21 ◼ ► me to like briefly recap weeks of pain in my life, I was using one Apple ID from a long time ago
00:38:27 ◼ ► for purchasing. And I was using a different one for iCloud, like syncing notes and bookmarks and all
00:38:34 ◼ ► that jazz. And it was fine because Apple devices let you sign in to one Apple ID for iCloud and a
00:38:41 ◼ ► separate Apple ID. I'm already doing it. Apple ID for media and purchases. Just say Apple ID. Just
00:38:48 ◼ ► say Apple ID. We all know. It's like if John Syracuse says megabytes instead of gigabytes,
00:38:51 ◼ ► people are like, ah, it's John, you know? Yeah. I can't believe you didn't mention Apple
00:38:55 ◼ ► account. I can't believe. Why is no one talking about this? Yeah. I ran into an issue where I
00:39:01 ◼ ► wanted to add an additional two terabytes of iCloud storage. I was unable to because that legacy
00:39:08 ◼ ► purchasing account was not in my iCloud family. So I solved this by adopting myself into my iCloud
00:39:15 ◼ ► family. So I now have Steven and legacy Steven, who again, if you missed the detail, his account
00:39:21 ◼ ► picture in my, in my Apple iCloud family is, is like grayed out because he's legacy Steven. It's like
00:39:29 ◼ ► Have I told you my thing? If I ever see a black and white image of someone on Instagram,
00:39:34 ◼ ► I think they've died. Oh yeah. Yeah. If I, if I ever, anyone ever posts a black and white image,
00:39:41 ◼ ► I'm like, oh no, they're dead. And then, and then I realize they're not, because what happens is every
00:39:49 ◼ ► He's dead. He's dead to me. He's dead to me. This change, which I'm going to get into the
00:39:54 ◼ ► details in a second would not have fixed my initial problem. I don't think of like not being able to
00:39:59 ◼ ► add iCloud storage all the cart, but it would have made the fallout of adopting legacy Steven into my
00:40:07 ◼ ► family, uh, because I turned on purchase sharing, but that mostly works, but there's some like rough
00:40:14 ◼ ► spots. And I got, I kind of came to a point where it was like, I'm just kind of kind of like the family
00:40:20 ◼ ► sharing is enabled, but I'm, I'm using the new Apple ID new and air quotes. I've had it since the mobile
00:40:26 ◼ ► me days. It's a, it's a me.com is my primary using that for purchases moving forward. It would have made
00:40:32 ◼ ► some of that easier. So, so what Apple has done is built a tool that has lots of fine, fine print to
00:40:43 ◼ ► consider. We're going to get into some of that where you can say the purchases made with my
00:40:53 ◼ ► take those purchases and don't just share them like an iCloud family, but actually move those purchases
00:41:02 ◼ ► from my old account into my new one. So it's like my new one bought all those movies 15 years ago,
00:41:11 ◼ ► bought all those apps, you know, when the iPhone first came out. And if you walk through this process,
00:41:18 ◼ ► that is effectively the outcome where your new or current Apple account, it looks and acts like you,
00:41:33 ◼ ► Yeah. People have wanted this for a long time. Like, uh, in John's, uh, post on it, on Mac stories,
00:41:40 ◼ ► it's like, I've wanted this for 20 years. It's like, yeah. And his pictures of a HP running iTunes on
00:41:46 ◼ ► windows XP, which is just like chef's kiss that OTJ for that, that blog post, but it comes with a lot of
00:41:54 ◼ ► fine print. And these links will be in the show notes. If you're thinking about doing this, read through
00:41:58 ◼ ► them. I'm just going to kind of hit the highlights here, but there's some things you have to do to
00:42:03 ◼ ► make sure that the legacy or the secondary account is ready, including spending any balance. If you
00:42:09 ◼ ► have account credit or like, if you have a gift card or something on that account, you have to spend
00:42:14 ◼ ► that money. I guess it just goes away or gets like stranded on that old account. So that, that would be
00:42:19 ◼ ► bad. Uh, you can't have any rentals or, or pre-orders going on. So if you've rented a movie or you've
00:42:28 ◼ ► said, Hey, I want to pre-order this movie or app, that's got to be all taken care of. And what's
00:42:35 ◼ ► going to get a lot of people into trouble, wait up to 15 days since the last purchase on the secondary
00:42:42 ◼ ► account. So if you want to do this and you bought a movie with your purchasing account this weekend to
00:42:49 ◼ ► watch with your family, you got to wait two weeks. And not buy anything else. And not buy anything
00:42:54 ◼ ► else. No apps, no in-app purchase, no media. Fascinating. What could possibly be the reason
00:43:01 ◼ ► for 15 days? I don't know. Isn't that like weird? That's very weird. It's very weird. And I have this
00:43:08 ◼ ► at the bottom of this section in Notion, but I'll say it now. Apple could have built this tool
00:43:19 ◼ ► I do wonder if there's something about like, and maybe this is just giving them an out. I don't
00:43:23 ◼ ► know. There's some kind of like licensing rule or something. Cause I can't understand why you would
00:43:31 ◼ ► need to wait specifically 15 days, like not 14, not 30, right? Like 15 is like a very strange number to
00:43:38 ◼ ► me. It seems very specific. And Zach and discord mentions about the refund period. That's also what
00:43:46 ◼ ► I thought was like, well, if you want to refund out of the app store, which is like a whole process,
00:43:51 ◼ ► we don't have time to get into that could be a billing thing, but it is very specific. And if you
00:43:56 ◼ ► want to do this, like you got to keep that timer running in your head, I guess, or use a countdown
00:44:02 ◼ ► widget and widget Smith, you know, they're great. Okay. So if you've jumped through all those hoops
00:44:08 ◼ ► and everything's ready and there's some other things in here, like two factor has to be turned
00:44:11 ◼ ► on. They have to both be in the same country. So say that you've had, for instance, an American
00:44:17 ◼ ► Apple account and an Italian Apple account can't move things in between them. Uh, and actually you
00:44:23 ◼ ► can't do an Italian account anyways, because this is not available to users in the EU. Yeah.
00:44:28 ◼ ► Yeah. So make of that what you will, uh, yeah, it's India, the EU and, uh, the United Kingdom
00:44:40 ◼ ► actually. So neither of you can do this. I mean, I, I, I would not be the kind of person that would
00:44:47 ◼ ► get themselves into this situation. Right. Yeah. You've been responsible with your Apple. I've been
00:44:52 ◼ ► responsible. I haven't decided to just change my Apple ID for some reason over the last 15 years.
00:44:58 ◼ ► years. That's fair. Personally called out. Uh, so yeah. So if you're in, if you're in the European
00:45:05 ◼ ► union, the UK or India, tough luck, I guess, in terms of this. So you do this, you can only do it
00:45:12 ◼ ► on an iPhone or iPad. You go into the media and purchase a setting. There's a button that says
00:45:19 ◼ ► migrate purchases. It has your review everything. And then you get a confirmation email, uh, to
00:45:28 ◼ ► both accounts, which I think is really good. So like both accounts know what's going on. I think
00:45:34 ◼ ► it's a good security check. And, uh, and then once it's done, you sign out of your old account and
00:45:40 ◼ ► you're just in your new one. So like now for me, because I did all this in the old way of like using
00:45:44 ◼ ► family sharing, I'm signed into the, my, my main Apple account in iCloud and the media purchases where
00:45:51 ◼ ► before those were two different email addresses, two different accounts. So that part's relatively
00:45:58 ◼ ► straightforward. I think if you've jumped through all the hoops, um, there are some other gotchas.
00:46:03 ◼ ► You cannot migrate purchases. If both Apple accounts have music library data associated with
00:46:09 ◼ ► each of them. So if you've created a music library under both accounts, for some reason,
00:46:15 ◼ ► you can't migrate. And I'm unclear. Like, can you delete that library data? Like out of the new one,
00:46:21 ◼ ► if you want to adopt the old one? I don't know. Apple's document, not super clear about what that
00:46:26 ◼ ► means. Maybe nobody knows. It's possible. Literally nobody knows. Yeah. You can't migrate purchases.
00:46:33 ◼ ► So, uh, if you have family sharing and you're like, you're sharing that data, you've got to unwind all
00:46:47 ◼ ► of that. Um, that secondary Apple account also cannot be in a family group. So what I've done is again,
00:46:55 ◼ ► I adopted legacy Steven into our iCloud family. I would have to undo that. I would have to jettison
00:47:02 ◼ ► legacy Steven out of the family. Oh no. I'd have to ban him from the family and then break the purchase
00:47:11 ◼ ► sharing to do this because the secondary account can't be part of a family. So that's another
00:47:17 ◼ ► complication here. Really? If this had come out three weeks ago, I might've, I might've done this
00:47:24 ◼ ► and not, but I don't think I'm going to unwind what I've done, um, to jump to the end. Um,
00:47:30 ◼ ► if your primary account has never been used for purchases or free downloads, you can't migrate
00:47:36 ◼ ► purchases. So this was another gotcha that would have been for me because I've done all my purchases
00:47:41 ◼ ► in that legacy account. My current Apple ID, like my real one has never bought anything. So what am I
00:47:46 ◼ ► going to have to do? Like log in on a Mac and like download something free from the app store so I can do
00:47:52 ◼ ► this very strange. Um, and then lastly, this one probably doesn't apply to many people, but it was
00:47:58 ◼ ► notable to me. Neither Apple account old or new can receive any special access to apps or content. So if
00:48:06 ◼ ► your Apple account is enrolled in the volume purchasing program through an employer, like say that, uh, you know,
00:48:14 ◼ ► a lot of companies do this as a way to like send apps to their employees, neither Apple account can be
00:48:22 ◼ ► a part of that. Um, and it will probably also break test flight because I, my test flight did break and
00:48:29 ◼ ► I'm just like, I've had to start over and what betas I have access to, which has been fun.
00:48:34 ◼ ► So it's a lot of fine print. It's a lot of things to jump through. And that's my complaint about this.
00:48:40 ◼ ► Like I'm super glad it's here. It's long overdue, but Apple, like if, if you went through the trouble
00:48:48 ◼ ► and I'm sure it was trouble to make this work at all, why not make it easier for users? And again,
00:48:56 ◼ ► that's discounting and maybe it's an owl. I don't want to excuse them, but maybe I am like,
00:49:00 ◼ ► I'm sure there's like a legal and purchasing and billing stuff that is an issue, but this seems
00:49:07 ◼ ► really complicated. And a bunch of, you know, people have linked to this. Uh, a lot of people
00:49:12 ◼ ► have linked to me cause I helped break it, which was really kind of everybody. Thank you. Nine to
00:49:16 ◼ ► five and macro and everybody else. But I've seen a lot of comments on those articles and some emails
00:49:21 ◼ ► to me of like, I don't want to go first. Like I want someone else to do this. Uh, well, I got an email
00:49:27 ◼ ► from somebody who went first. So a listener of MPU named Dave wrote in, Dave wrote to me per the Apple
00:49:34 ◼ ► guide. I turned off purchase sharing and it seems to have auto defaulted the purchase account to my
00:49:39 ◼ ► primary Apple ID, which is I think what's expected. That might be okay. If the migration worked,
00:49:45 ◼ ► but it failed. I got an unable to migrate purchases pop up. Now my, this gets worse. Now my family is
00:49:55 ◼ ► locked out of their music and Apple one access and the purchase sharing because, because purchase
00:50:03 ◼ ► sharing can only be changed every 90 days. Oh, so Dave's whole family now is stuck in limbo
00:50:11 ◼ ► here. Uh, Dave has a ticket in with Apple that, uh, Dave says has been escalated to senior engineering
00:50:17 ◼ ► and they say they know about this and are working on it. A light went off when Dave did. Yeah.
00:50:22 ◼ ► He was the first one. And so I asked Dave to keep me updated on this. And so there may be follow
00:50:28 ◼ ► up to Dave Saga here. Oh, can you imagine having to go to your, like your, your partner and you know,
00:50:34 ◼ ► your children and be like, Hey y'all, like, uh, I know you want Apple music or, uh, iCloud space,
00:50:47 ◼ ► All right. Who knows? I'm going to drag Dave now for a second. Okay. Don't do this. Like,
00:50:53 ◼ ► don't do this first. Like this is the whole thing, Dave. Yeah. If your whole family's relying
00:50:58 ◼ ► on you, this is why like anything that's related to like the family, you just, you don't make
00:51:04 ◼ ► changes on it. Like you, you gotta, you know, cause this is, this is why Dave now, the next
00:51:09 ◼ ► time you ask if you could do something, the family is going to be like, no, no, you can't
00:51:14 ◼ ► do this. Yeah. Because, because they would say we don't trust dad. After what happened last
00:51:19 ◼ ► time, we don't trust you anymore. Yeah. You, you, you, yeah. I'm sorry, Dave. You ruined
00:51:25 ◼ ► it for your family. Yeah. If we could take a quick aside, I'm going to read to you guys
00:51:31 ◼ ► a text message that I got from my mom. And I want to see if you, if you get this is the
00:51:36 ◼ ► way you receive emails changed on your phone. I don't like it. I don't get it. Yeah. They
00:51:41 ◼ ► basically blame you for any changes to the phone. But like that, that message that I got
00:51:53 ◼ ► Wait, what's, what's, what's sorting? The primary. Just the, it's not Apple intelligence. It's
00:51:58 ◼ ► just the sorting features, right? Where like it puts it into the primary or transactions.
00:52:03 ◼ ► Oh, the categories. Okay. Categories. Yeah. So I ended up like making some screenshots from
00:52:09 ◼ ► my mom to show how to turn it off. And she was very proud of herself that she's able to
00:52:13 ◼ ► do it. Like you should have, you should have done the, you should have done the screen sharing
00:52:21 ◼ ► that a few times. I couldn't do it at that point. And I knew how I could just send two screenshots
00:52:26 ◼ ► and I was convinced that she could do it. And at first, the first message was like, I can't
00:52:31 ◼ ► do it. This is too complicated. Followed up by a minute later. I've done it. Which is like
00:52:39 ◼ ► than she thinks she is. And due to the fact that she uses an iPhone every day, you know
00:52:43 ◼ ► what I mean? Uh, but she just lacks the confidence in it, but yeah, I find it amusing that your
00:52:50 ◼ ► mom is in agreement with you that there are no good email apps. I mean, it's true. There
00:52:56 ◼ ► are no good email apps. I mean, as I said before, my, my identity is email is bad. So all email
00:53:00 ◼ ► apps are bad, but all email apps are bad. Um, I do like the sorting though. I, I, it works
00:53:07 ◼ ► well enough for me for like what I want as like a very, very basic of like, just put things
00:53:12 ◼ ► in my inbox that I care about and everything else just goes somewhere else. And, and you
00:53:16 ◼ ► can control where things go, but my mom doesn't need that because you know, my mom is like so
00:53:21 ◼ ► many people where she gets like a thousand emails, you know, and like just doesn't read
00:53:26 ◼ ► any of them, you know? Uh, unless there's something she knows that she needs to go and get, um,
00:53:32 ◼ ► and then she'll just go and get it. Like, you know, she wants her email from the national
00:53:51 ◼ ► Just kidding. So yeah. Um, legacy Steven died a hero is what we've, what we've learned. I'm
00:53:58 ◼ ► taking credit for this and I, this is where I'm requesting my new title. Okay. Which would
00:54:05 ◼ ► be King of the K base? I mean, look, you can call yourself that and I would agree that you
00:54:18 ◼ ► intro webpage and we just have to read it? Then Zach could be creating a constitutional
00:54:23 ◼ ► crisis. Well, that doesn't matter. Oh, what kind of constitution? Yeah, it's fine. What,
00:54:40 ◼ ► precedent for anybody to come in. I think I did win it. Apple purchase migration. I mean,
00:54:58 ◼ ► source that we deem trustworthy that says between us, but it was that connected episode and that
00:55:05 ◼ ► experience from Steven that prompted us to accelerate this feature, we will give you the
00:55:11 ◼ ► title. Yep. And then this will be like a canary in the coal mine kind of thing, right? Yeah. If
00:55:17 ◼ ► Steven starts being called king of the K base, then you'll know. You know, Mike has a way to deal
00:55:22 ◼ ► with sources. You know, you can just go to connected feedback, send an anonymous message saying,
00:55:28 ◼ ► yes, it was that. But you know, we will consider it. You can be one of my AIs. Yeah. But you can't actually
00:55:37 ◼ ► be anonymous. That's the thing though. Cause then it's not verifiable. So like if, if Steven just opens up the
00:55:44 ◼ ► feedback form right now, just types in, Steven was the reason. No, we, we need, there are people out there.
00:55:52 ◼ ► It can be verified. That we know. Yeah. Then you need, this needs to be verifiable, but I would be very happy if it's
00:55:58 ◼ ► verifiable, but you got to win it. You got to win your titles. Okay. Okay. That's fair. Yeah.
00:56:05 ◼ ► I do believe I genuinely, I genuinely believe that this happened because of Steven. Like I, I actually
00:56:13 ◼ ► genuinely believe it because the, the, the conspiracy, not conspiracy, wait, the coincidence, that's the
00:56:20 ◼ ► word. They're kind of similar conspiracies and coincidences. Uh, the coincidence is too strong.
00:56:27 ◼ ► Too strong. That like, this has been a thing for so long. We just spent so much time about it. And now
00:56:33 ◼ ► two weeks later it's changed, but someone needs to convince me and then we will call Steven King of
00:56:38 ◼ ► the K base. Okay. I like that. Do, it kind of feels like one of those things. Have you ever been someplace
00:56:46 ◼ ► in public and there's like a little sign on something that's like very clearly there because someone did
00:56:51 ◼ ► something stupid, right? Like, like maybe there's like a ceiling fan. It's like, don't put your hand
00:56:57 ◼ ► in the fan. It's like, we all know that. Right. But someone did it and a lawsuit made the sign happen.
00:57:04 ◼ ► Or like, um, I know that this one is a little bit more complicated than this, but just like coffee cups
00:57:10 ◼ ► that say hot drink inside. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. It's a hot drink in the K base. Tastes like Steven.
00:57:18 ◼ ► But why are you mentioning this, Steven? I'm just saying like, it's the same kind of thing,
00:57:32 ◼ ► Something worse happened to Dave. Are you the sign in this scenario, Steven, or are you the hot drink?
00:57:43 ◼ ► This episode of Connected is brought to you by NetSuite. Nobody knows for sure what the future
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00:59:25 ◼ ► Apple has new headphones that Marques Brownlee in his review, we gave two things that I thought
00:59:35 ◼ ► were fascinating here. For one, he said he believes these are the best earbuds for most people.
00:59:45 ◼ ► Well, I just, I just think that earbuds with a little hook are not the best earbuds for most people.
00:59:52 ◼ ► Okay. Well, Marcus Brownlee said that. Federico Vettici said, strong disagree. So these are the
00:59:57 ◼ ► two quotes I have. And then the other quote is, he said in the briefing that he got about this product,
01:00:04 ◼ ► that these, that he was told that these are, quote, the best selling headphones in the world.
01:00:13 ◼ ► Yeah. I also, but so did he though, which was the point of his, in his videos, like he was told this,
01:00:18 ◼ ► he says it doesn't make any sense to him, but if he's going to believe it, fine. Right. But anyway,
01:00:25 ◼ ► we have the Power Beats Pro 2. Power Beats Pro are basically a Beats in-ear wireless, like wireless in-ear
01:00:33 ◼ ► workout headphone, because they are the ones that have those little hook that goes behind the ear.
01:00:38 ◼ ► But these, this version got a ton of new features. So they got the Apple H2 chip, which brings a bit
01:00:45 ◼ ► active noise cancellation, transparency mode, adaptive EQ. The case is smaller, but the battery life is
01:00:51 ◼ ► longer. It has sweat and water resistance. I think it had that before, but it also got MagSafe charging
01:00:57 ◼ ► as well in the case, USB-C as well. But also the brand new feature is heart rate monitoring sensors.
01:01:04 ◼ ► And this is the thing that we've been hearing about was maybe coming to AirPods Pro and maybe still will,
01:01:09 ◼ ► but they got heart rate monitoring sensors. And from Victoria Song's review in The Verge, I found kind of
01:01:15 ◼ ► fascinating. So the heart, the data from the heart rate sensor shows in the health app and in some apps that
01:01:23 ◼ ► Apple have partnered with on iOS, but not everywhere, like Fitness Plus. The heart rate monitor in the
01:01:31 ◼ ► Power Beats Pro 2 from Apple does not work in Fitness Plus, but however, quote, Android users have more options. You should be able to
01:01:40 ◼ ► use it in any app that compare with a Bluetooth heart rate monitor. Beats is like, I desperately want to understand how that
01:01:48 ◼ ► team works, where like, they can get access to a bunch of stuff, but not everything. And then also has really good support for
01:01:59 ◼ ► Android. But if you wear these and an Apple watch, it will not take the reading from the Beats headphones
01:02:04 ◼ ► on iOS and you can't change it. So I can, it kind of tells you something about what Apple think from a reliability
01:02:10 ◼ ► perspective. I don't know, but kind of fascinating. Also comes in four colors, including this orange, which
01:02:17 ◼ ► is amazing. The orange is sick. It's so good. Super good. Super good. Federico, why are you so upset about,
01:02:23 ◼ ► not upset, but like, what is your, what is your, what is your doubt on these headphones? And what do you,
01:02:29 ◼ ► Well, no, I'm, I'm fascinated by the idea of the in-ear heart rate monitoring. I just disagree with the idea
01:02:36 ◼ ► that these are the best earbuds for most people, because most people don't want to use the ear hooks.
01:02:40 ◼ ► You know, most people just want to grab something from a case and put them in their ear without having to
01:02:46 ◼ ► have this whole contraption going over their ears. That's why, anecdotally, but I think, you know,
01:02:54 ◼ ► anybody who lives in, in a society and goes outside could say, anecdotally, do you see more people
01:03:02 ◼ ► wearing AirPods or variation of AirPods? Or do you see more people wearing Power Beats Pros? Like,
01:03:09 ◼ ► I just think it's such a, you know, it's such an obvious thing that most people tend to prefer
01:03:14 ◼ ► regular earbuds. And also, I don't believe Apple's statement that these are the best selling earbuds
01:03:22 ◼ ► on earth. Anything Apple says always has to be the best and the greatest. And so right now,
01:03:30 ◼ ► their PR spin is that these are the best. But until a couple of months ago, AirPods Pro 2 were the best,
01:03:36 ◼ ► and then AirPods 4 were the best. So the concept of best is always like in flux, depending on what
01:03:42 ◼ ► product you're launching. And what's newest. And what's newest. And that goes back to what I think
01:03:50 ◼ ► will become one of the concepts that I will refer to the most over the next few years, which is something
01:03:58 ◼ ► that Jason said. Apple is institutionally incapable of saying, yeah, this is a product. No, everything
01:04:04 ◼ ► always needs to be the best, greatest, the most. Um, so I don't believe it. I don't believe any of it.
01:04:11 ◼ ► So you don't, well, one, obviously you don't believe Apple's claim, but, but this is Marcus Brownlee's
01:04:17 ◼ ► feeling from reviewing them. Sure. He thinks this, but sure. I mean, and opinions are opinion. You don't
01:04:22 ◼ ► have to agree with it. No, no, no. Well, I, uh, yeah, he can think whatever he wants. That's the beauty of,
01:04:28 ◼ ► you know, being a regular person. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I think this design in particular is for people who
01:04:38 ◼ ► want to be really active with their headphones and like, like my wife, Mary, who is the resident
01:04:44 ◼ ► beats expert on connected who, um, well, we'll get to her in a second, but she wears hers to work out
01:04:52 ◼ ► every day and like likes the hooks and for her AirPods don't fit. And so these fit a little bit
01:04:59 ◼ ► better. You actually have more air tip sizes in the AirPods pro, uh, they're up to five different
01:05:04 ◼ ► sizes now. And with the hook, they stay, you know, they stay put a little bit better. Do they go in
01:05:10 ◼ ► the ear? They do like in, in, or just resting. They're like the, the tips are like the air pod pros
01:05:17 ◼ ► tips. Like the rubber ones you take on and off. It's kind of like double bolt in a door, isn't it?
01:05:28 ◼ ► Yeah. It's like they go in and around and around and you put a sweat band around them. You know,
01:05:34 ◼ ► these things aren't going anywhere. And then you put a helmet on above it all. Uh, so yeah,
01:05:39 ◼ ► I think the form factor is obviously a big, a big thing here. You know, interestingly now the
01:05:44 ◼ ► technology is basically the same between the AirPods pro two and these, cause they've got
01:05:48 ◼ ► the H two, they have all the noise cancellation and transparency stuff. Uh, the case is smaller,
01:05:54 ◼ ► which Mary was really excited about. So when these were rumored, these have been rumored for
01:05:59 ◼ ► a long time, but a couple of weeks ago when the colors leaked, I like showed her an article
01:06:05 ◼ ► about it. I was like, Hey, you know, she's used power beats pro for a long time. Her, I think
01:06:11 ◼ ► her pairs are like the like original launch day that, you know, she's like, Hey, do you
01:06:15 ◼ ► want an upgrade to these? If you do like, what color would you like? Cause you know, if they
01:06:18 ◼ ► come out, I can just order them for you on the day. And she wanted the hyper purple. We didn't
01:06:24 ◼ ► know the names then, but the, the leaks, the colors were spot on. So she has a pair of purple
01:06:29 ◼ ► ones that are delivered tomorrow. And at some point in the next couple of weeks, I'll interview
01:06:35 ◼ ► her about, about them and we'll, we'll play it on the show. So, um, the, as the time on the
01:06:41 ◼ ► tradition. Yes. She, she talks about headphones on connected. So there's very specific headphones.
01:06:47 ◼ ► That's right. Just beats. Um, and you know, and so I told her, Hey, you want to come on the show?
01:06:52 ◼ ► She's like, yeah, like let's do it. But she's excited to come back. Uh, so yeah, the power beats
01:06:57 ◼ ► pro too, you know, they're definitely not for everybody. Like as someone who wears glasses,
01:07:01 ◼ ► I find anything that has like a hook over the ear, a bit uncomfortable. It's just like a lot going on
01:07:08 ◼ ► back there. But if you are jumping around a bunch doing kickboxing and you don't wear glasses, um,
01:07:14 ◼ ► maybe they're a better solution for you. And, and maybe that's where apples, you know, sort of
01:07:20 ◼ ► probably over the top statement comes from is from people who are really active with these things in
01:07:25 ◼ ► a way that maybe, maybe we aren't. I would like to take a moment to recommend my, my favorite headphones
01:07:32 ◼ ► at the moment, which are the Oslo sleep buds. Yeah. Oh yeah. I've heard of this. Yeah. I love these
01:07:39 ◼ ► things so much. They're so good. I mean, they're very much like a startups product product product. Like
01:07:46 ◼ ► they have some weirdness to them, but I love these things so much. They just basically,
01:07:51 ◼ ► they go in the ear, they're super low profile so I can lay flat and like, I don't feel them pressing.
01:07:57 ◼ ► Yeah. Um, and then they play white noise. They can, they have a bunch of inbuilt white noise.
01:08:01 ◼ ► And so like, I just have them play these like ocean sounds. Um, it's just a very simple product,
01:08:07 ◼ ► but like is very, very good for what I need. And they have a bunch of features that like are
01:08:12 ◼ ► available, but I don't use them. Like you can, uh, you can also like play your own audio if you want
01:08:17 ◼ ► to. Like they're just Bluetooth headphones that connect to your iPhone. Um, and, but the, the,
01:08:22 ◼ ► the actual, like they work on their own. So you like, you open the case, the lights flash when the lights
01:08:28 ◼ ► stop flashing, which takes a few seconds, it means they're ready. You just put them in your ears and
01:08:32 ◼ ► they just start playing. I don't have to do anything on my phone. Um, and then I have it play for an hour.
01:08:37 ◼ ► The only thing for me is it plays for an hour. If I wake up and can't get back to sleep again,
01:08:42 ◼ ► you have to put them back in the case for a second and then they'll re like kind of do whatever it is
01:08:47 ◼ ► they do. And then it starts playing again and you can choose, you can have it play all night,
01:08:51 ◼ ► but just for battery life reasons. Um, just so I don't have to keep charging, keep charging the
01:08:56 ◼ ► case, like the case up all the time. Um, I just haven't played for an hour and that usually does the job
01:09:01 ◼ ► for me, but they're a cool product and you know, they're trying to do some sleep tracking stuff and
01:09:05 ◼ ► things like that. But just to do this one thing is great. I mean, cause they basically the people
01:09:10 ◼ ► that started this, they used to work at Bose, Bose used to make a product called the Bose sleep buds.
01:09:15 ◼ ► They stopped making that product. And so they left and started their own company called Oslo. And
01:09:22 ◼ ► these are the Oslo sleep buds. So I think they kind of worked out with Bose. They're Bose like,
01:09:36 ◼ ► Sure. Uh, but yeah, I, I really liked this product. Like if, if you are the type of person
01:09:41 ◼ ► that likes to listen to things when you sleep and don't have a pair of headphones that feel
01:09:45 ◼ ► comfortable to you or you want white noise or whatever, but not everybody in your house wants
01:09:55 ◼ ► I think it's a small company just trying to make this work on their own, but I really like it. It
01:10:00 ◼ ► has an alarm too, which is great. Um, so like I, the alarm goes off in the morning and it's like,
01:10:06 ◼ ► you can't escape the alarm, you know, like, cause it's inside your head. Yeah. You can't escape that
01:10:12 ◼ ► alarm. And also therefore it is an alarm that doesn't bother other people as well. So it's like, it's,
01:10:16 ◼ ► it, I like it. And like the earbuds are kind of difficult to get out, like not in a bad way,
01:10:21 ◼ ► but they have those little wing tip things that go in the ear. So you really have to kind
01:10:25 ◼ ► of get in there to get them out. And so like, that is also good for the alarm part, right? You can't
01:10:30 ◼ ► just like yank these things off your head. You have to kind of just like, you have to be aware enough
01:10:37 ◼ ► to, to stop the alarm. So yeah, it's cool. It's a really nice little product. Um, it's very niche,
01:10:43 ◼ ► uh, but I wanted to recommend it. Um, this is funny. They're doing it. I'm just on their website and
01:10:47 ◼ ► they're doing a Valentine's day promotion for, for two, two pairs. I see. It's pretty funny. Um,
01:10:53 ◼ ► but yeah, there you go. Yeah. And Beats makes a product kind, I mean, not like the sleep part,
01:11:00 ◼ ► but one that goes in your ear with a little wing tip. Um, yeah, that was one thing Mary and I were
01:11:05 ◼ ► talking about when I was, uh, kind of showing her this, like, Hey, these are going to get revised.
01:11:09 ◼ ► She's like, do they still make those ones that I hate it? Cause I think they're the Beats X.
01:11:13 ◼ ► Beats fit. Beats fit. Um, and I, I think, you know, you mentioned a second ago that Beats is
01:11:20 ◼ ► like doing, you know, different stuff than the AirPods. And I think one reason the, I mean,
01:11:25 ◼ ► addition to the brand having great brand recognition, like everyone knows Beats is it gives Apple an
01:11:31 ◼ ► opportunity to create products to like meet the needs of people on a broader basis than maybe they
01:11:37 ◼ ► would do with the AirPods line. And so like, I don't think there'd ever be a set of AirPods
01:11:42 ◼ ► AirPods that had a over the ear hook, but they can do it over in Beats land and they, you know,
01:11:47 ◼ ► can do full colors and do the Android stuff. And I just think that's very, it's a very interesting
01:11:52 ◼ ► thing. Like of all sort of the modern, like things and businesses Apple is in Beats is one of the most
01:11:59 ◼ ► interesting to me because they use that brand to go into markets and to like sell products that maybe
01:12:08 ◼ ► they wouldn't otherwise. And clearly it's successful because they're still doing it. And, you know, you walk
01:12:13 ◼ ► into an Apple store and they've got all the AirPods stuff, they have all the Beats stuff, but you go into a
01:12:18 ◼ ► Best Buy or Target or something like that, Beats stuff is everywhere. And they are clearly very successful
01:12:23 ◼ ► with it and popular. And Mary's very excited to get some new purple headphones tomorrow.
01:12:29 ◼ ► Hmm. I was just reminded in going to the Beats website that they had the iPhone cases this year.
01:12:39 ◼ ► Because we only make one type of case now. That's funny. I returned mine. It was awful.
01:12:45 ◼ ► The Beats case. Yeah. I remember it was like really weird plastic, right? Like kind of slippery.
01:13:31 ◼ ► You know, really, Power Beats Pro could be really good for Idina because she leaves her AirPods
01:13:43 ◼ ► I think about her all the time. Like anytime I take my AirPod out and the case isn't in
01:13:59 ◼ ► Uh, sometimes. Sometimes they're just not exciting. Like it's just like an AirPod on the kitchen
01:14:05 ◼ ► counter. I like it when there is something going on specifically. Like my favorites is when
01:14:13 ◼ ► one. Uh, so if I ever see that, you will get that picture. But the random AirPods around
01:14:26 ◼ ► I mean, we're already talking about the fact that we have, we're going to have to live differently.
01:14:30 ◼ ► We're like the two of us are typically at home. Both of us wearing our AirPods doing something
01:14:44 ◼ ► Yeah. Well, you know, I still commute. I still commute. So I'll be listening to my podcast.
01:15:10 ◼ ► Can I, can I, can I, can I, can I put my stick in the ground here and make a prediction?
01:16:00 ◼ ► want to sort of come back in phases on some of the shows or maybe just ask for like another
01:16:08 ◼ ► I think that is a very fair, because there is a possibility that the phasing thing might
01:16:57 ◼ ► Like we need this, this source to come out of the work to say, Stephen, make this happen.
01:17:16 ◼ ► Mark Gurman has been reporting for the past few days that Apple is, as you may have seen,
01:17:52 ◼ ► or most likely early next week, which is when Apple is holding product briefings, Gurman
01:18:01 ◼ ► Just a few minutes ago, Mark said that as like later today, finally, Apple will debut Apple
01:18:09 ◼ ► TV Plus on Android, which is something that I think I mentioned this when we talked about
01:18:16 ◼ ► I was very surprised by the lack of an Apple TV Plus experience, especially if you want
01:18:21 ◼ ► to be a services company and especially if you want to attract people to your TV streaming
01:18:26 ◼ ► So it looks like, it looks like, you know, just like Steven was right about moving purchases.
01:18:42 ◼ ► The other part, Gurman says that there's going to be some small announcement with PR people
01:19:19 ◼ ► My theory is that this will be something about the rumored PlayStation VR controllers coming
01:19:28 ◼ ► I could see a scenario in which at the PlayStation state of play event in a few hours, as I'm saying
01:19:36 ◼ ► this, maybe Sony will say that PlayStation VR is coming to the Vision Pro and Apple will
01:19:44 ◼ ► Now, Apple typically isn't the company that likes to have other companies upstage their
01:19:57 ◼ ► I just think it's been rumored for a while Apple could use all the help they can get with the
01:20:26 ◼ ► Well, I did just while you were talking about the 9to5Mac and they have a thing from two hours
01:20:30 ◼ ► ago that suggests that potentially Apple is bringing Vision Pro to third-party retailers.
01:20:49 ◼ ► And then, because there's a new app in the App Store that's called Apple Vision Pro Demo
01:21:05 ◼ ► They gotta bring those, those, they gotta bring those hand controllers to Vision Pro at some
01:21:10 ◼ ► I gotta, I gotta, I gotta say that I hate this time of year because it's what, it's, let's
01:21:32 ◼ ► Like, the one thing I'm looking forward to the most is obviously iOS 18.4 with the rumored
01:21:59 ◼ ► Uh, Federico is the editor-in-chief at MacStories.net, home of many fine articles and podcasts and
01:22:30 ◼ ► Mike co-hosts a bunch of other shows here on Relay and you can check out his work at Cortex
01:22:49 ◼ ► The great thing is, is the overly, like just the amount of leave people, like the dads usually
01:24:37 ◼ ► Membership also comes with a bunch of great goodies, including access to the Relay members