The Accidental Tech Podcast

84: The Load-Bearing Finger


  If this is a sleepy case he's got to work on the whole getting ready to not have any sleep thing [TS]

  but lately Marco has been the one thing he's also Libby. [TS]

  Yeah my will my kids in school now so now waking up like an hour earlier so I'm closer to Katie's schedule I know you [TS]

  already complained about your early wake up time so bad it is harder than you did then you go back home. [TS]

  It's funny to me that when I complained and moaned for the first year [TS]

  and a half of the show it was so get over it you're fine. [TS]

  Now that the king is having to get up early suddenly we all have to go to bed I have a month [TS]

  when I really have to get up early but like you get dressed up in nice clothes [TS]

  and not come back to his house after e off go to another go to another building where you have to like not smell bad [TS]

  and have already eaten and be dressed nice and you're a parking lot [TS]

  and then talk about parking lots they have to know what do you want to work on you [TS]

  or do have to wear khakis you can you really change you. I only have one set of clothes and you've seen them all. [TS]

  That's what I wear. [TS]

  I'm not as bad as Marco yet are not as good as markers yet I should say disease is already achieved my ultimate goal [TS]

  which is to you know not have to worry about clothes into seven outfit I have not achieved that [TS]

  but I would like to basically have a small set of clothes and you've seen them all that's what I wear to work. [TS]

  So jeans and like a polo shirt not a polo shirt. You know there are other cars I describe rugby shirts. [TS]

  That's all I don't want to have her same difference that their genes make shirts I guess they kind of are now I mean I [TS]

  will not dispute the value of having a uniform it doesn't matter what the uniform is no I envy you [TS]

  but I kind of do have universities has more variety but the problem is all my uniforms the sleeves shrink [TS]

  and then I have to like that otherwise I would use them until they disintegrate like you know like my running shirts [TS]

  that are fifteen years old but I still have I just I feel like I mean I am not a fashion conscious kind of guy [TS]

  but I feel like I would get bored wearing the same. [TS]

  Everyone agrees that you're the best dressed of all of us cases are looking to hear them. [TS]

  I'm not fishing for compromise. [TS]

  Yes they may be true [TS]

  but I'm not fishing for compliments I'm just saying that I don't think of myself as having any fashion sense yet [TS]

  or really is really relative among me and Mark Oh yeah. Fashions. [TS]

  Oh yeah well I guess that's true but I mean regardless of fashion sense I just feel like looking down [TS]

  and seeing the exact same uniform every day would get really pointed you know like down market doesn't care is wearing [TS]

  I don't care one way. Yeah that's exactly it readers want which is one not to be pointed at and laughed at. [TS]

  So we find something that lets us ignore this for a for the rest of our lives or at least for the next year [TS]

  or two until the church disintegrate. I guess Casey you definitely represent humanity in the show. [TS]

  Normal normal humanity and let's not let's not talk of normal humanity too much normally had a lot of downsides. [TS]

  Did either one of you to actually read any of the follow up before we begin. No I skimmed all of it great. [TS]

  I've also I've also skimmed it. [TS]

  Everything just published in the chat room they can do follow up and none of us have looked at it. [TS]

  I put most of it there. [TS]

  OK Would we like to start with a friend of the show Jason smells correction about the i Phone six. [TS]

  Yeah so basically we said last show I said last show someone said I think was me summons the last show that the i Phone [TS]

  six plus had a slightly higher clock C.P.U. [TS]

  Than the six similar to the difference between the i Pad air [TS]

  and the Retina i Pad Mini where the errors like you know ten percent faster or something like that. [TS]

  Turns out that is I think completely wrong or at least people have we've seen things all over the place here. [TS]

  We've seen some benchmark showing that the six is faster than the six plus by some you know little amount like that. [TS]

  We've seen some banks are saying they're the same. [TS]

  We've seen some benchmarks saying the six plus a stash of in the six. [TS]

  So Jason Snell posted a follow up thing he had originally said the safe was a faster he I think then has corrected it [TS]

  and said action. That was you know mismeasured or whatever and it's wrong. [TS]

  I don't think we know quite what's going on here yet do we. But I mean there's a lot of things that could be done. [TS]

  There's things like that I'm a clock speeds happening where you know there could be throttling for thermal reasons [TS]

  Apple said it shouldn't happen that it can maintain the full speed all the time [TS]

  but we don't actually you know we don't know what kind of condition some of these benchmarks were down into maybe it's [TS]

  like you know extreme conditions or in warm environments who knows. [TS]

  But regardless there doesn't appear to be a clear difference between the two that's actually reliable. [TS]

  So there's occasionally a small difference but it kind of flip flops as to which direction it goes [TS]

  and so I think it's more likely to be chalked up to testing conditions [TS]

  or benchmarks mis measuring things then the actual actual differences in clock speeds are going to be nice if Apple [TS]

  does publish them or at the very least that there was like you can like an Intel C.P.U. [TS]

  I read off some registers and find out the clock speed like it's all guesswork [TS]

  and it's all kind of get this benchmark app to run [TS]

  and like all it does is benchmark app accurately test the speed of this particular C.P.U. [TS]

  or Yeah I don't like this guess what business [TS]

  but anyway last show I had mentioned that Jason had said conclusively the exact clock speeds and has now recanted [TS]

  and so we're back to just not knowing and we as far as anyone knows that look they're probably about the same thing [TS]

  and then we of course have a ton of follow up about the Apple Watch. [TS]

  And one of the most popular bits of follow up let me back up actually there are two popular bits of our people saying [TS]

  either we're insane or we're right on the money for saying that the watches will be expensive [TS]

  and we'll talk about that more and moments [TS]

  and people theorizing how you can justify the purchase procedure of buying a ten or twenty [TS]

  or thirty thousand dollar Apple Watch. [TS]

  And what you would do once that piece of electronics gets sold [TS]

  and the really frustrating thing about the what you would do is have a lot of people have sent in feedback saying hey [TS]

  if you're beating carat gold it stands to reason you could you know melt that down or otherwise recycle it. [TS]

  And so perhaps you'll leave. [TS]

  The Apple Watch or maybe they'll be a trade in program or something like that [TS]

  and this is really annoying because during the last episode I thought to myself you know I wonder if you could just [TS]

  like trading in your watch and then you could get a new one and then during the time that you two were talking [TS]

  and I was reasoning through this in my head I decided No that's a stupid idea I shouldn't share it [TS]

  and like twenty people saying today and so the moral of the story is I should trust my instincts. [TS]

  I thought I was actually set in fact I thought all the ideas that have been fed to us via email [TS]

  and Twitter were actually mentioned off hand in the show [TS]

  but it's obvious that the audience wants to hear more discussion of these things because many people offered elaborate [TS]

  theories. [TS]

  Well I was going to make this work so we just like mentioning one or two things off hand [TS]

  but every people want to expansions on it so I figure it's worth nothing although you skip the actually the first item [TS]

  of the fault right before this is someone who has worked in the jewelry industry for twenty years says that over five [TS]

  X. Mark ups on fashion jewelry is normal. [TS]

  So if people want to put a number on what kind of one of these crazy margins that we're talking about what kind of [TS]

  complete disconnect between the cost of goods in the products. More than five X. Is routine. [TS]

  And so one of the examples of these theories regarding how you could handle upgrading [TS]

  or whatever just was sent in by Phil Compton Apple could have two easy ways to handle the rapid obsolescence of the [TS]

  Apple Watch. [TS]

  One upgrade ability and to trade ins the upgrade ability would of course need to be done in an Apple store [TS]

  but they should be able to keep movements within a set of specifications that could allow easy upgrading of the [TS]

  internals of one generation to a newer one. [TS]

  I assume they would always be making the watch smaller So although the same adapter may be needed to fill the space [TS]

  each new generation fit in the next. [TS]

  And actually the genesis of my theory last episode that I never shared so now it sounds like a fabricated it in order [TS]

  to sound smart and wise. They mean a lot. [TS]

  Well relatively speaking a lot of mention of what is it the ASP One what is powering this thing. Yeah the S. [TS]

  One is there. [TS]

  There their marketing name for the entire computer in a little tiny case and exactly it isn't on one chip [TS]

  but it's a whole bunch of components in some kind of case that is most likely more for water resistant than anything [TS]

  else. [TS]

  Yeah but it made me think you know if you keep the pin outs of that case [TS]

  and the physical shape of that case the same even if the even if the internals get considerably better. [TS]

  Maybe that's the way you upgrade it is there some mechanism by which they can get in there [TS]

  and replace the yes one input in an S. Two X. [TS]

  Turn only looks identical in operates identical from an interface perspective but internally is twice the clock speed [TS]

  or what have you. [TS]

  This all falls down though if displays get a lot better and [TS]

  or it will if that displays a pattern of different sizes for different pen outs [TS]

  and John I'm waiting for you to blow a hole in my theory. [TS]

  Well so here's here's the deal with the upgrade ability this is definitely one of the things that many different people [TS]

  suggested they suggested that there was a part of the watch that would become obsolete [TS]

  and there was a part that would not come up the aisle become obsolete. [TS]

  The gold case [TS]

  or whatever that should be fine in prison with us for most of the cost is you could swap out those internal stuff that [TS]

  probably cost less than the band they're probably you know fifty bucks for the last one over ever it is. [TS]

  Here's the thing with that in in Apple's history [TS]

  and we'll get to this if we actually do get to the i Phone six plus spending. [TS]

  Apple has always chosen when they had a choice between keeping the same thickness angries battery life [TS]

  or make a center they would just make it thinner and that's where imaging I'm ready for the the i Phone four S. [TS]

  Form factor of this watch. [TS]

  We all assume this is the first Apple Watch and just like the first Apple phone I'm going to call the Apple phone. [TS]

  I switch it around so the Apple phone from now on that thanks like that Apple touch we all assumed they're going to [TS]

  make the watch thinner [TS]

  when they can that they're not going to say you know what let's keep the Apple Watch case exactly the same size [TS]

  and every year. Just make the battery a little bit bigger and you know and. [TS]

  Maybe other components smaller something or have they have the S one beast's wobble in and out [TS]

  and that's the way it will do upgrades a river like that. This gets back to the product cycles on the wash. [TS]

  Do we think they're going to come up with a new watch every year every two years every five years I think they'll do a [TS]

  new one every year. [TS]

  If they do a new one every year will they try to make it better or will they keep it the same size [TS]

  and make the battery think like this all those stores upgradability Never mind that Apple really is not big on [TS]

  upgradeability period now they're maxing out with their i Phones now with their i Pods those days are long gone like my [TS]

  first mac that I ever got was motherboard upgraded from Maclin twenty K. To a Mac. [TS]

  Plus something officially Apple used to sell and do the current Apple is a long way away from that. [TS]

  So I have a hard time believing unless there's some really good financial reasons having to do with the way watches are [TS]

  normally sold that Apple would never do something like this. [TS]

  Both because I just cannot see them keeping the case the same over long periods [TS]

  and because they just want you to buy a new one. [TS]

  Now I'm not going to rule it out entirely simple because everything we know about how Apple sells technology has to be [TS]

  reevaluated in terms of well this isn't really technology this is fashion so maybe a new plan [TS]

  and I don't know enough about fashion enough is any precedent for this in like the watch world of replacing the [TS]

  movements inside your thing and keeping the gold band of something like that. [TS]

  But right now it seems to me that the upgrading thing is one of those things that nerds would like Apple to do kind of [TS]

  like replaceable batteries [TS]

  or can you just another motherboard upgrade my macro to a new MacPro instead of having to buy a new one. [TS]

  The answer from Apple is no we cannot we will not do it as buy a new one I just use this one. [TS]

  So I am giving the upgrading thing technically feasible. [TS]

  Yes hundred percent feasible but I don't think it's something that that Apple is going to do. [TS]

  Given that it may be like thumbs down if I had to pick one [TS]

  and if I had to put a percentage by it I'm going to like eighty percent against. [TS]

  Yeah I would also bet strongly against it not only for all the reasons you mentioned but even even. [TS]

  You ignore the fact that they would probably almost certainly make less money over time doing it that way I don't think [TS]

  they would want to constrain themselves [TS]

  and their future changes to the watch by by a commitment whether you know what they said [TS]

  or whether it's been implied by past performance to keep the upgrades available so you know look at look at the massive [TS]

  poop fit that the world through when I change the dock connector into the Lightning connector [TS]

  and I was like ten years right. Yeah ten ten years with the same connector I think it was. [TS]

  Yeah and people people are still insanely upset [TS]

  and thinking Apple did it just to make more money like that is a common a very very common opinion of that changes [TS]

  Apple just make more money to make a room buy new cables and accessories. [TS]

  If they ever made the watch of great a bill the expectation to keep it a great deal in the future it would be so high [TS]

  that they would suffer such severe reputation damage [TS]

  and have so many angry people every time they made a backward incompatible change. [TS]

  And so that would that would either cause a bunch of poop fits from their customers on a regular basis like every few [TS]

  years and ever they make it a breaking change [TS]

  or it would constrain them from Oh well we'd like to make this change in next year's version [TS]

  but that would break compatibility with upgrades and so we kind of can't or shouldn't do that [TS]

  and I don't see Apple ever wanting to be constrained that way in the design of such an important part of their lineup. [TS]

  So who what who does upgradability benefit that's the real question like What are the benefits of operating is it a [TS]

  benefit to Apple is it a benefit to consumers who would like I think most people coming in from the consumer's [TS]

  perspective is hey if I spend there imagining for you know the case of for sake of argument that they have enough money [TS]

  to buy the super expensive Apple Watch [TS]

  and then they're further imagining that despite having all that money they also don't want to spend that money again [TS]

  any time soon as they would like to protect their investment in itself a lot by saying I spent twelve hundred bucks on [TS]

  the stand was the OP a life or a stainless steel band. Now the new one is. [TS]

  I don't has a faster processor or uses less power. [TS]

  I don't want to spend all that money again and then this is same thing people want to upgrade prices for everything [TS]

  and I told her how much I have grades my one twenty K. [TS]

  That I didn't have it in my purse that deal Plus was he probably died in today's my try like three grand [TS]

  or something [TS]

  but anyway that the upgrade will cost less money than buying the entire thing out right again so that is a consumer [TS]

  benefit. I bought this thing once the better thing is out but I don't want to buy the better thing. [TS]

  I want you to take as much as you can from my current thing [TS]

  and just swap out the parts that are not good for the better parts to save money that doesn't benefit Apple at all. [TS]

  As Mark I was saying before it isn't going to make more money no this is not going to make more money overall they will [TS]

  the average selling price of the of their watches will go down. People can do these upgrades. [TS]

  It does benefit consumers [TS]

  but does it benefit consumers in a way that Apple feels like we should do this because it will make the experience [TS]

  better for consumers I mean think like if you had to pretend you were you know magnanimous apple [TS]

  and say well we'd like to [TS]

  but we feel replacing the parts does not give the cohesive experience of being to be designed to watch [TS]

  or to have an entire device it's a balance system where everything works together [TS]

  and if you just take the Inside Out of the Apple you know there's all sorts of crazy B.S. [TS]

  Reasons you can't [TS]

  but some of them have some merit unlike our look at they're designing a product that is arming Syria's parts that you [TS]

  can assemble into a product like can you just take the S one out [TS]

  and put the S two in suddenly your watch gets faster and it takes less power maybe for a generation or two [TS]

  but like Marco said at a certain point you have to have a breaking design change [TS]

  or you just want to say you do things in fashion [TS]

  and just make it the same all the time fashion has to change so I think this is mostly a techno fantasy having to do [TS]

  with people who probably would never drop that much money on a watch anyway even if they could afford it because they [TS]

  would feel like it's a waste. [TS]

  But then can put themselves into that position and say [TS]

  but if I didn't do that I would still have my instincts that think it's a ridiculous expense and [TS]

  but I would want a new thing anyway that I would want to pay for it and it's a weird. [TS]

  I don't I don't think this actual character case you can bring out the user story index cards. [TS]

  I don't think I will character that that needs upgradability for the watch to be a viable thing exists I think it's [TS]

  just a sort of a fantasy we're spending out right now. [TS]

  Now the second item on the thing trade ins is an entirely different thing [TS]

  and I think that is way more plausible because Apple already does that with stuff they have now they will you know take [TS]

  year olds that most of this to get recycled. [TS]

  But like give me your old thing for a discount on the new thing that I entirely see as being caused by especially if [TS]

  it's made of precious metals but is different than upgradability. [TS]

  Yeah I think that like recycling [TS]

  or trade an approach is way more likely because they already do it for certain certain things you're right about that [TS]

  and they already do it and it just makes more sense like it. [TS]

  It avoids all the issues of the upgradeability kind of like constraining their options [TS]

  and people's expectations there like it avoids all of that and it sounded very mentally friendly [TS]

  and it seems economically somewhat responsible if you're if you want to upgrade you can get a good amount of money for [TS]

  you know your seamless steel want to whatever the gold [TS]

  when you need serious money for because you know the the metal itself is valuable. [TS]

  Apple can take it and melted down and recycled in the new Apple watches [TS]

  and they will give you good might want to give you like fifty bucks [TS]

  or like say do the recycling because they will give you good money for a gold trader. [TS]

  You know what I'm thinking about in this is taking just a half step backwards is a lot of us will spend somewhere [TS]

  between five hundred thousand dollars every year or every other year on a new phone. [TS]

  And just for the sake of conversation let's say it's every year [TS]

  and let's say it's an even thousand dollars to make the math easy and let's say an average salary in the U.S. [TS]

  Is fifty thousand dollars again just for the sake of making the math easy. [TS]

  So if you get a new phone which is a thousand bucks [TS]

  and you have fifty thousand dollars salary that's two percent of your what is a gross salary is is one thousand dollars. [TS]

  So if. You make one point five million dollars which granted is an unbelievable shed load of money. [TS]

  Then thirty thousand dollars is two percent of it and so what I'm driving at is even if an apple watch is thirty K. [TS]

  If you're making a million [TS]

  and a half as probably more people in the United States do than I care to admit to myself then getting a new thirty [TS]

  thousand dollar watch every couple years it's the same is one you know one of us getting a new i Phone every year [TS]

  or two. It's everything is relative. [TS]

  And although the market is surely smaller than the millions upon millions upon millions of i Phones that are sold in [TS]

  Yulee it's still not a bad set up especially since I would assume the markup as we spoke about earlier is just [TS]

  tremendous. [TS]

  Yeah it's worth reiterating again that we keep concentrating on the high end just because this type of product is [TS]

  different for Apple this type of fashion product where the price is so crazily out of whack. [TS]

  But they're you know volume wise they're going to sell. Apple hopes tons of the cheap one. [TS]

  And so such a small it will be like the mac pro such a small number of these expensive watches are going to be sold [TS]

  that I doubt first of all I doubt Apple will break it down for us because they never do [TS]

  but I think we can probably you know or if they do or somebody will do the math [TS]

  and try to say it's reasonable to assume that percentage wise you know ninety percent of Apple watches over the cheap [TS]

  one and then ten percent of the super expensive one and yeah you do make a lot of money of that [TS]

  but like really this is the thing about this this type of market is Apple wants to go all the way up to the top [TS]

  and the top is really high [TS]

  and it's maybe it's about exactly I'd love to see the breakdown of like how many macros are sold versus how many you [TS]

  know of the reasonably priced Macs I think will be even more extreme with this expensive watch we're just obsessing [TS]

  over because it's just such a novelty [TS]

  and we just can't figure out how it's going to work within Apple's current business [TS]

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  All right let's keep talk about Apple Watch. Do we have to. Yes we do. It isn't even out yet. [TS]

  I know but that doesn't that doesn't stop us when we come up. [TS]

  We've got several more months of this and we have months of follow up. It's never going to end. [TS]

  Another thing that we had a lot of discussion about why is how do you sell a ten twenty thirty thousand hour watch in [TS]

  an existing Apple store [TS]

  and an anonymous Apple employee wrote in to say many existing Apple stores have private business preaching rooms with [TS]

  the entire product line not tethered to tables. They exist as a space for Apple to meet with businesses. [TS]

  Discuss deals and how to integrate Apple. [TS]

  These spaces are a perfect place to showcase high end watches to customers who would like a private area away from the [TS]

  crowds. All I really want to know is how do I get that kind of sex. Because you gotta buy my prose. [TS]

  You are but little is all about you are evil. [TS]

  Well played [TS]

  but you're evil because there are Apple store our local Apple store just moved in a few spots down in the local mall [TS]

  and now it's actually a belt the right size for the area in which we live. [TS]

  But goodness before it moved it was like a locker room in there no matter what time of day you went in so I did not [TS]

  know this was a thing but apparently this is a thing [TS]

  and I'm assuming if you're coming in looking like the kind of gentleman [TS]

  or woman who is going to buy a thirty thousand dollar watch. Not about how you look at what you were just asked. [TS]

  I would like to see the Apple Watch edition they say well you have to come to the back with us. [TS]

  This as Marcus said the last show I think it's clear that Apple's stores are due for a redesign or an overhaul [TS]

  and presumably someplace where you could sell really expensive gold watches will be part of that overall [TS]

  but in the meantime whenever that happens to land in the meantime the fact of these rooms apparently exist that we [TS]

  don't know about because none of us except for Marco would ever be invited into them. [TS]

  It's nice to know that they have been out for some existing stores at least. Exactly all right. [TS]

  There was a tweet from Scott McIntyre He noted that something that I had not realized that the Apple Watch edition [TS]

  which is a terrible name but it's the expensive Apple Watch you think is worse. [TS]

  The Apple Watch edition edition or the Ferrari La Ferrari the La Ferrari [TS]

  but only by a shade I think Apple Apple Watch edition is worse because the Ferrari the way better than I watch [TS]

  and you can forgive a lot of you can forgive a lot for a Ferrari isn't just a Camry with a gold coating here it's like [TS]

  going now it's just a fee it with a gold coating right. They still know you're on her feet. Federica is going. Tell me. [TS]

  Anyway so by the way just while we're on the topic of Federico certain or a pattern I was interesting. [TS]

  So there's rumors that there's going to be a twelve inch quote i Pad Pro coming out like possibly next spring [TS]

  or something and I'm not sure I believe that but assuming that even if it does. [TS]

  On a recent episode of what's new protocols connected I was with the names. So the new product called connected. [TS]

  Reason ever heard of that Federico mention in passing is that he said he wouldn't buy that i Pad fro [TS]

  and I was thinking like if this thing is real if Federico Verty she does not want to buy an i Pad Pro who will. [TS]

  I would very Only I penned by was my thing. [TS]

  However I will never talk about i Pad Pro since like before that I was really sad that was me saying all that stuff in [TS]

  the past episodes. [TS]

  Yes I will buy it I think I said the line obviously Well the way I use my i Pad is not as a you know I use it like a [TS]

  magazine. [TS]

  I like large foreign magazines I didn't like it [TS]

  when Edge magazine shrink to the small truck to the small from I think next gen also shrunk with no magazines going [TS]

  downhill and they shrink to the Wired magazine I like that big format. [TS]

  I want big not not twenty seven and she no but like a twelve inch I think that's fine and I want to be faster [TS]

  and I'm multitasking and a split screen and all sorts of awesome stuff like that. [TS]

  We talked about this stuff remember I do [TS]

  but it just I think I tried to force myself to forget that if you want an i Pad that in almost no way resembles an i [TS]

  Pad Now it's still a big screen that you hold in your hand it to resemble a knife always except it's slightly bigger [TS]

  that's it and of course it's faster inside [TS]

  and you know as more RAM involve a ball blog idea totally resembles an i Pad And anyway did we even finish this tweet I [TS]

  didn't think it through. [TS]

  Finishing a tweeting about it I was saying and they look round matches the strap [TS]

  and yes I knew that I thought everybody knew that [TS]

  but he was offering it as an idea of saying well that means maybe the. [TS]

  The straps are interchangeable like they showed in the video that the straps coming in [TS]

  and out of the major selling point of the logic can't believe some people saw them well you can swap it now because a [TS]

  little bit of a crown is color coded so what so what you look at the little cut little crown is red. [TS]

  Can you only get red bands now use black ones you can use white ones I don't know any about fashion [TS]

  but I know that it's the right right look at the cases for the i Phone five C. [TS]

  You know the half of the point of all these different colors was that you can mix [TS]

  and match them remember I think was Schiller talked about oh you can have you know a blue phone with a red case for [TS]

  this mood in a in a white case for that mood or something like that if you know exactly what he said but [TS]

  but you're exactly right that it was they were talking about flipping things up in into liberally getting clashing [TS]

  colors to be in so everyone can be their own special snowflake [TS]

  and if you don't want that buy get one with a neutral call your over the Blackground as I'm sure there are that they [TS]

  have I think the only color grounds I saw was like a maroon ish red that went with like the dark red band [TS]

  and then a black one but you know the fact of the Crown's bass does not mean the straps [TS]

  and I could be interchangeable they're totally interchangeable. [TS]

  All right moving on this was my addition to the follow up. [TS]

  Speaking of a friend of the show Jason Snell I was reading his apple watch edition review should we just call this the [TS]

  Apple Watch Apple like the Ferrari La Ferrari so anyways he said in his review Yes there's a special box it's covered [TS]

  in leather. [TS]

  Inside is a magnetic charging cradle [TS]

  and on the back of the box space is a slot into which you plug a Lightning connector. [TS]

  That's right the Apple Watch edition is so fancy that the box is its own accessory [TS]

  and I bring that up for a couple reasons firstly I didn't know that that was a thing and second [TS]

  or secondly that how what how is this that how is that something that Apple considers the right thing to do [TS]

  and if you're going to stand here [TS]

  and tell me that oh a ten thousand dollar watch is way too expensive look at what they're doing for the freakin box I [TS]

  wonder the minute. Doesn't come with a charging cable is that yeah I can understand. [TS]

  Basically a doc like you know a member of the i Phone has become a doctor and the original came with a doctorate [TS]

  and I remember and I think that's right. [TS]

  But anyway they used to sell docs [TS]

  but it seems like if you buy the Apple Watch edition it comes with essentially a dock which also happens to be the box [TS]

  which is a nice place for you to put the watch when you're not using it which also charges it. [TS]

  But I'm sure Apple will sell the little charging doohickey thing for all the regular people who don't buy the edition [TS]

  edition and so you know it's all the same charging amongst all the boxes [TS]

  but this type of luxury thing of like how can we make this as fancy as possible they do that with all their products [TS]

  like the boxes are so beautiful when you open them up. [TS]

  But it's all disposable stuff you throw away the cardboard box you throw away the little plastic pieces that you peel [TS]

  off and everything. This I assume you won't throw away because it's actual accessory. What else is in here. [TS]

  Oh a lot of feedback about Chip and PIN. You want to cover this John because I'm going to stumble over it. [TS]

  I don't understand Also we're getting glimpses of what payment is like in the rest of the world from individual people [TS]

  via mail so these people are wrong I'm sure we'd all right in tell us so. [TS]

  Martin Gordon wrote in to say you think it's worth clarifying that the U.S. [TS]

  Won't be getting to pimp anytime soon and said we're moving over to the next year chip [TS]

  and signature our credit cards will come with chips but we won't be issued a pen [TS]

  nor will be will we be required to enter a pin during transaction so that's kind of crappy will have chips in our cards [TS]

  but we'll have still have to sign a name on a piece of paper for transactions that require that type of thing. [TS]

  Doesn't surprise me but if this is true as disappointing. [TS]

  TOM PHILLIPS tennis so two thousand for over the last year or so in the U.K. [TS]

  We've had the introduction of contactless debit [TS]

  and credit cards Coakley called just contactless you pay a chip unable to MIL's are dedicated contactless points [TS]

  or anything under twenty pounds and I have no idea how much that is a real thing if Apple Pay were to arrive in U.K. [TS]

  But I do wonder whether it would succeed to our payment system isn't as archaic as the US with contactless becoming [TS]

  relatively. Well established popular are the benefits of Apple Pay had cracked enough to get people to switch. [TS]

  I'm leaning towards no. [TS]

  This goes back to Tim Cook's big thing about it's not just that you get a wave in front of a thing to pay for your [TS]

  stuff it's that you get to not have to bring your wallet with you you don't have to bring are going to be undergoing i [TS]

  Phone my car keys and my wallet. [TS]

  If you want to go out and you want to have a way to pay for things you can just bring your phone [TS]

  and I guess you just hope the battery doesn't run out before the bar tab comes at the end of the night anyway is right. [TS]

  Apple Pay is a lot a lot easier to sell at sort of the dawning of contactless payment here in the U.S. [TS]

  Than it is in other countries where contactless is already well established. [TS]

  Yeah I don't I don't know I was going to do there. [TS]

  It seem like all the deals Apple announced that the people who are accepting payments the suction of like McDonald's [TS]

  that was international but a lot of the other stores look like they were US only. So since we live in the U.S. [TS]

  You know we probably be fined if you just left him in the U.S. [TS]

  Because everything here is so horrible but you know I don't know how I was going to do it in other countries. [TS]

  Some more Apple Pay. Dave Copeland wrote in to say in the U.S. [TS]

  The fraud policy of the banks heavily favor the card holder card total colored card holder can pretty easily have [TS]

  charges removed by calling the bank who issued the charge in the U.K. [TS]

  In Europe the banks are not so lenient with the card holders and it's much more difficult to have charges removed. [TS]

  That's what Chip [TS]

  and PIN is so prevalent across the pond that's why waiter brings a charging device to you rather than whisking your [TS]

  card away to the back so that's another you know differences in the different pain environment of who who accepts the [TS]

  who deals with fraud if something goes wrong who has to pay for it in the U.S. [TS]

  We're all used to this is one good thing about the rest of us from consumer's perspective sort of kind of is that if [TS]

  someone steals your credit card to make so much bogus charges with it [TS]

  or some sort of fraud happens we all just zoom over call the credit card company notice take care of it like a creditor [TS]

  coming to eat all that because they make so much more money having huge interest rates on everyone doesn't pay their [TS]

  bills on time which is why they still make tons of money in the U.S. But and so the toll. [TS]

  I'm going to eat all the other charges we just had yet another one of our credit cards stolen online a couple weeks [TS]

  back and we're just like oh no big deal yeah they bought a bunch of stuff [TS]

  but we know we're not going to pay for that well apparently in other countries it's not that way [TS]

  and so there is a demand to be more secure and not just have you know to hear hear your way [TS]

  or take my credit card walk away with it I don't care where you go if you skim it or buy something with it online [TS]

  or whatever I'm just going to have those charges reversed and they'll send me a new card I want to pay for any of it. [TS]

  But that's not true in other countries so they have much more secure payment systems that's interesting. [TS]

  And his final point is something I've learned firsthand at one of the first e-commerce sites I made I guess about ten [TS]

  years ago now twelve years ago a long time ago. [TS]

  Is that a lot of these things you see on websites and in payment processing things like the C.V. [TS]

  Code where you have to enter those little three digit number to pay for something with a credit card or signatures [TS]

  or anything like that. That's entirely at the discretion of the person of the company selling something. [TS]

  So when you do credit card transactions online you send the information to the payment processor [TS]

  and they send you back a score that says here's how trustworthy this is [TS]

  and you can decide I'm going to go forward with scores of you know above whatever value so well they'll send you back. [TS]

  Well you know the card has a middle name but they didn't enter middle name [TS]

  and the street address doesn't quite match [TS]

  but the everything else in the address matches do you want to perceive this transaction if you say yes you know the [TS]

  relationship between a business [TS]

  and a credit card processor there is some relationship there over who covers what percent of fraud or whatever. [TS]

  So it's up to it's up to the merchant basically to decide how how you know how flexible do you want to be [TS]

  and I could say as someone who's implemented this you tend to be motivated highly to be very flexible believe it [TS]

  or not because if you are super picky and like well their address says you know one two three Main Street [TS]

  and the credit card address on file has one two three main S T N S T is not the same as street [TS]

  and our process just to stupid to figure that out [TS]

  and so doesn't give it a perfect score a match on that we want to go forward if you can. [TS]

  Only went forward on like the highest possible score you would never make any money because you know you would never [TS]

  accept anyone's credit cards you know they got the code almost right or they got it right [TS]

  but didn't add like the plus for the end of it do you want to go for everything lowers your score if you know exactly [TS]

  right and so you have to decide what risk you're willing to tolerate [TS]

  and usually you're willing to go forward even if they miss tons of stuff like if they're slightly off on their address [TS]

  don't quite get the name right didn't enter the zip code but the card number is right and don't have a C.V. [TS]

  Is like just go forward because ninety nine percent of time it'll be fine [TS]

  and the other percentage of the time you will see that in the workout so that's something else to keep in mind with all [TS]

  of this secure payment type stuff. [TS]

  Individual that's why that's why I imagine I don't know this to be the case that's why I imagine a lot of places now [TS]

  don't require you to sign your name anymore is because the risk environment has changed they felt like they were not [TS]

  getting any additional security from having somebody scribble something on a piece of paper for their five dollar [TS]

  credit card purchase orders you know swipe the card and let's go. [TS]

  All right George tell me about streamlined Apple Watch shape ideas you know that was not from last week [TS]

  and remember what I was thinking of I know the fraud topic was member of the first avalanche I was saying I was [TS]

  disappointed that it looks like a little lunch box on your wrist just like a little rectangle with straps coming out of [TS]

  it I was hoping that they would do something to blend the strap into the main part of the watch in a way that was like [TS]

  forward thinking like well now it's got to be a big chunky thing in your US [TS]

  but five years from now won't be quite as chunky and it's best to go with an aesthetic that will seem natural then [TS]

  but didn't they didn't try to mask out at all [TS]

  and there are lots of ideas about from listeners about what they could do with a more streamlined shape if they had a [TS]

  sort of a taper from the big thick part with the battery in the screen to the strap they still have removable strap the [TS]

  strap sort of how to incorporate that paper somehow or whatever [TS]

  but people are full of ideas of what they could do with that extra volume one of the most popular ideas. [TS]

  Why don't they fill that place with a battery. [TS]

  Well those little wedges belief in the fat part of the in part that's just another opportunity to shove a battery in [TS]

  there. [TS]

  I don't like that idea because one I don't like the idea of having battery out there [TS]

  or my around my wrist because looking at my own batteries can get very hot and catch fire and stuff [TS]

  and I guess it's also true of the wanted inside the watch but that's inside metal [TS]

  and I feel a little better about that into I don't think working on batteries take very kindly to being bent which [TS]

  means that the taper would have to be sort of a one to make. [TS]

  Once you make the taper stiff then that is the number of different risks that it can fit on is drastically altered just [TS]

  like you do not want like it's better after you've got the stiff little rectangular part right. [TS]

  If you made little wings hanging off of the thing they were also stiff because they contain battery. [TS]

  Then they would sit very awkwardly on people with either make it so it it's OK [TS]

  and people with very large respond then it looks ridiculous some people small [TS]

  or vice versa so that I think is a non-starter. [TS]

  They made a tape [TS]

  or it would have to I don't think there's anything useful you can do with that paper other than maybe put some sensors [TS]

  in and if you want to have like the pulse sensors off centered or something else [TS]

  and there are like seven accelerometer in there but I don't think you can use it for battery [TS]

  and I don't think you can make it Stephan anyway is not the direction Apple went in. [TS]

  I think that's all I was thinking about this one line fall by them. [TS]

  We're also sponsored this week once again by Harry's going to Harry's dot com That's H A R R Y S dot com [TS]

  or you can put an apostrophe into my name and use a promo code A.T.P. [TS]

  To say five dollars off your first purchase for many of us shaving is a pain. [TS]

  It sucks it's uncomfortable and causes next cut scrapes and razor burn [TS]

  and reader blades today are outrageously expensive. [TS]

  Harrison started by two guys who wanted a better product without paying an arm and a leg. [TS]

  Harry's make their own blades from their own factory. [TS]

  It'll bleed factory in Germany delight so much so they actually bought it. [TS]

  Harry's makes high quality high performing German blades crafted by shaving experts. [TS]

  You give you a better shave that respects your face and your wallet. Harry's offers factory direct pricing and a fresh. [TS]

  Action of the big brands cost Harry's blades are about half the price. [TS]

  Plus I guess half of the fractions Plus you don't have to wait around for the guy to come unlock the ante shoplifting [TS]

  case the drug store and buy them or anything like that. [TS]

  They ship them directly to your door [TS]

  and shipping is free on almost every order I think it's over ten dollars for each so pretty much almost every order [TS]

  shipping is free so they have a starter set. It's really an amazing deal actually. [TS]

  It's fifteen bucks for a starter set and you get a raise or moisturizing shave cream and three razor blades [TS]

  and we need more blades there and how many you buy. [TS]

  They started just two dollars each and they go down all the way to like a dollar fifty eight [TS]

  or something like that if by bunch so a package is fifteen dollars a sixteen pack is just twenty five dollars [TS]

  and I would say so they sent me. [TS]

  They sent me a set I try to do it I would say Harry's blades are very comparable in the shave quality to fusion [TS]

  non-privileged leads they don't really have a particular to look for to the program. [TS]

  Strip but I'm a I was a big fan of fusion before [TS]

  and I would say Harry's blades are just as good if not better for the shave. [TS]

  Now the best price I found on Amazon for fusion blades right before the show I took a look to make sure it was a twelve [TS]

  pack for forty one dollars twelve Harry's blades. [TS]

  It's only twenty bucks so that is less than half the price of the fusions [TS]

  and if you do your own comparisons you will see the Harry's blades are roughly half the price of high end other blades [TS]

  from other companies anyway. I was also very impressed by the great packaging they had you know very classy. [TS]

  Some might say hipster I would say classy because you know there's a lot from history culture that is quite good [TS]

  and worth spreading around so I would say it's very very nice very you know just a classy design it's like kind of like [TS]

  calls back to old school shaving designs without being like overly romantic about it just you know a nice classy design [TS]

  they have a couple couple handles to choose from I like them both honestly handlers and heavy how they feel. [TS]

  I quality I really I was very impressed by them [TS]

  and again the packaging is amazing it just it's just overall very nice to deal with them. [TS]

  It's I had a very positive experience the entire time anyway [TS]

  but here you think it means an ease of ordering online high quality blades a great handle and shaving cream [TS]

  and excellent customer service at half the price of the big brands. So get started today. [TS]

  Get a set that includes a handle three blade and shaving cream for just fifteen dollars shipped to your door. [TS]

  Go to Harry's dot com and you can use promo code A.T.P. To say five dollars off your first purchase. [TS]

  And of course you let them know that you came from here so they should keep buying sponsorships which helps everybody. [TS]

  So thanks a lot to Harry's going to Harry's dot com He's from a good A.T.P. [TS]

  For five bucks off thank you very much to Harry for sponsoring the show again. OK so we got a lot of feedback. [TS]

  Well I thought about the casing of the text watch what are we still talking about the watch. Yes I am. [TS]

  John insists that we got to do all this follow that along is a quickie is Robert Thompson prob something I thought was [TS]

  funny like are we talking about the small caps thing with the watch [TS]

  and I said well you know with the little apple logo in front of it [TS]

  and it's kind of silly you know we just write out Apple Watch [TS]

  but they would use the little symbol on money doing slides like what we've got a president with Apple T.V. [TS]

  Where they show a little apple logo and I'm like well of course T.V. [TS]

  Is always capitalized it's you know short of television or whatever. [TS]

  But Robert Thompson points out that when they do happen T.V. and I'd forgotten about this they do lower case T.V. [TS]

  So so much that I think they did a little apple and the lower case T. [TS]

  With a little care on the bottom and anyway there's no rhyme or reason to this [TS]

  or so we thought until Jim sent us something that says reference is a classic vocabulary with the all caps like Omega [TS]

  Rolex tag or TOG I don't know [TS]

  and that other things are said to be that I'm not going to pronounce probably they do auto case in their name brand [TS]

  things on their watches. [TS]

  Well so maybe I was trying to go with that and again I think it's crazy to do that [TS]

  and just use the word watch it is like. Really parody of a Rolex Omega. [TS]

  Also watch All right let me explain this to everybody. Apple T.V. [TS]

  Is lower cased in the marketing logo worth the Apple logo followed by lower case T.V. [TS]

  Because somebody thought it looked good at the time. [TS]

  Apple Watch [TS]

  when it's built in a marketing way with the Apple logo followed by the all small caps watch is that way because [TS]

  somebody thought it looked good that way most likely because it's written very small on the watch [TS]

  and very small lettering looks great when it's in small caps. That is why it's that way. It is marketing reasons only. [TS]

  It doesn't matter if you think you are going to put the little apple logo on the watch next to the word watch like [TS]

  Apple logo watch. Yeah. Didn't they already show that they are doing that. [TS]

  I don't know I have I know they put it up on the slide when they introduced it [TS]

  but that's another going to have it on the watch itself. [TS]

  We've seen pictures of the back in the video so I'm pretty sure that does it doesn't matter it. [TS]

  Either way it doesn't matter. They thought it looked good that's why they're there was not. [TS]

  I guarantee you there was no thought put into oh well it's different from the way we capitalize Apple T.V. [TS]

  I guarantee you no one brought that up and no one cares you can change the capitalization [TS]

  and you can change whether you pull out the logo but it's going to be hard to change the name [TS]

  and the name is still watch and I guess the name is still T.V. To Apple T.V. [TS]

  Somehow sounds better to me than maybe I will get used to [TS]

  but I feel like I still have not gotten used to mac book so I just I think I can hold a grudge against this one. [TS]

  Mac book is permanently awkward I give you that power because such a great name and MacBook was so awkward. [TS]

  I also for whatever it's worth I did think Apple T.V. [TS]

  At first was extremely awkward and I got used to it and didn't care anymore. [TS]

  But also to talk about that much because who cares. The Apple T.V. You know. [TS]

  All right and then John would you like to defend yourself regarding. I watch no I.Q. [TS]

  and I think I'm not doing it on purpose. Trying to get better. [TS]

  So in the follow up Nathan Watkins Jr sent us that Microsoft paid the N.F.L. [TS]

  Four hundred million to use the surface and a couple of commentators still call them I've had. [TS]

  And so I assumed that you would place that in the follow up strictly to defend your erroneous I don't know that an [TS]

  interesting story like talk about watch being a generic term [TS]

  but no name that you pick can be defended against whatever the term is for likely an X. [TS]

  Where the name brand becomes genericized into mean you know you have a Kleenex for me [TS]

  or God forbid if you live in the south and someone says do you want to coke [TS]

  and I say Yeah what kind of give me a sprite. [TS]

  I know I never anything to be generous of anything you're not defended against that by picking watched by picking i Pad [TS]

  it little tabouli things are so defined by the i Pad product in the same way I guess tissues are so defined by the [TS]

  Kleenex brand that the commentators in these N.F.L. [TS]

  Programs couldn't help but say all of those guys in a silent holding i Pads are not their Microsoft Surface tablets [TS]

  but i Pad is the word that is the placeholder in lots of people's minds for a tablet thing even more so than any i [TS]

  Phone is for a smartphone because that I think you know Android sells more than the i Phone [TS]

  and it wasn't that far behind [TS]

  but Apple was so far ahead in the tablets they were only company made any tablet that anyone cared about at all that [TS]

  was and it worth a damn at all for so long like it was a year or two years before I guess the Amazon tablet came out [TS]

  or whatever that in the public consciousness if you were holding a thing that looked like a disinvite screen it was an [TS]

  i Pad So now providers have paid four hundred million dollars to get service into the hands of only going to help [TS]

  people [TS]

  and the company which is called the my i Pad in the same way they might call a tissue Kleenex even those not Kleenex [TS]

  brand so I feel bad for Microsoft here [TS]

  but I mean point putting isn't is that no name you pick even if it's Amy you totally make up like i Pad or you know [TS]

  or Kleenex or anything else you're always at risk of being genericized indeed [TS]

  and then another piece fall out that I put in a while back. [TS]

  There's more I know you know hey I was trying to curb it but we're we're almost on fulfilling time for that [TS]

  but they told us he decreed that we will do all of the F.-U. Anyway so I like everyone else. [TS]

  Hey if Steve were alive I can say the word I'm looking for but but retort I guess for lack of a better word. [TS]

  But but trope thank you that is that is a much better word for it. [TS]

  But somebody posted a little while ago a really really really great write up about how the Apple keynote announcing the [TS]

  six the six plus the watch perhaps would have gone different gone differently had Steve done it in the typical Steve [TS]

  style and if the whole if Steve were alive thing also really turns you off just forget that and just read this. [TS]

  This page which will put the show notes just as a general alternative approach to the Keynote [TS]

  and there were certainly some like maybe not factual things [TS]

  but there were some little idiosyncrasies about this that I didn't totally care for [TS]

  but overall I do think that this approach to the Keynote just sounded better in principle to me than the keynote we got [TS]

  and I don't know if either of you to read this or had any thoughts about it [TS]

  but I definitely think it's worth those of you listening to to read it at your convenience because it was very good. [TS]

  Yeah I read it it's on its own. [TS]

  GIGOT e dot com And this is really my person in John moon cam and I'm positive I mispronounced that. [TS]

  I saw this being spread around and I thought as probably many listeners thought [TS]

  when he first saw it I thought oh God it's going to be you know it's going to be somebody complaining that Tim isn't [TS]

  Steve basically and and I for some reason I eventually read it against my better judgment. [TS]

  And it really did surprise me with you know I thought for sure again like I did that I thought was going to be just [TS]

  complaints that Tim is not Stephen because tim tim can't be Steve [TS]

  and he's not trying to be Steve he's trying to beat him. [TS]

  And that's I think for the best [TS]

  but I think we've seen over time from other tech companies people who try to imitate Steve Jobs's presentation style [TS]

  always fail and it's really painful. But if you see like when's October. Did it. [TS]

  Jeff Bezos tries to do it but God knows everybody from Samsung Tresidder. [TS]

  It's painful and you know if you just try to be yourself it's a much better idea anyway. [TS]

  So I read this [TS]

  and there was a lot in there that I was like you know actually that's a really good point why didn't they do it that [TS]

  way or yeah that would have actually been better liked and they plausibly could have done that and [TS]

  and I you know the main focus of it I think is like you know [TS]

  and we've heard that we've seen other people talk about this to our friend Ben Thompson talked about this a lot as well. [TS]

  You know we've seen it in the presentation. [TS]

  Tim basically introduces the watch not by saying here's why this is necessary [TS]

  but just by showing it just be like here's this thing we've got this really cool look and there it is [TS]

  and there's the planet and the sun rises above the planet and then this watch comes in [TS]

  and it's like a watch spaceship [TS]

  and you see all the cool light reflecting off with an easy watch of spinning around for five minutes and it's [TS]

  and then Johnny hides in his white world talking about it [TS]

  and it just really it assumes the presumption of the video was this is really cool and you need to buy it. [TS]

  And here's why it's so cool. [TS]

  And here's this is going to be really big as opposed to the way Steve would usually introduce a new product categories [TS]

  like the way he did with the first the i Pod and then the the i Phone of course [TS]

  and I've had here introduce it kind of first by saying why it needs to exist why we need to want it [TS]

  and then showing it to us and then saying you know here given all of the things I just said [TS]

  and why you should want this and why this device need to exist here it is. [TS]

  And Tim really didn't do that with the Apple Watch introduction I was at I watch Tim didn't really do that. [TS]

  He just showed it and said Here it is [TS]

  and we're kind of left to our own devices to figure out well OK this thing is cool and it looks cool [TS]

  but why do we want to wear a watch especially for the many. [TS]

  Give us for whom we haven't been wearing watches since we got cell phones because cell phones made watches unnecessary [TS]

  for almost everybody except for fashion reasons and even then it's not that common [TS]

  and especially among younger people so he didn't do that so I think there is a lot of valid criticism to be made about [TS]

  the way this was introduced in the presentation. [TS]

  And [TS]

  and this article on dot com was really good I thought it was you know parts it was like a little bit over the top a little [TS]

  bit contrived but overall I'd say it was very good and way better than I expected from the premise. [TS]

  Completely Curry I don't really like this article. [TS]

  I think I think what it leaned on a lot of is two things One the fact that we all miss Steve Jobs [TS]

  and lean on that it's like hey when I was still alive. [TS]

  Yes it would and to is played fast [TS]

  and loose with the actual things that they were announcing it made Apple announced things that Apple didn't actually. [TS]

  announce and boy wouldn't it be cool if Apple had said X. Y. and Z. and Did X. Y. and Z. [TS]

  I agree that Steve Jobs would have presented this better than Tim Cook. [TS]

  I don't think anyone disagrees that Steve Jobs is a better PRESENTER The root of it is most likely in that the [TS]

  particulars of the person in that Steve Jobs has excited about different things than Tim Cook is excited about for the [TS]

  price I think Tim Cook really is excited about the watches but in the stew hands in the air [TS]

  and shaking his fist like I really believe he is excited but he's excited about different aspects of the product. [TS]

  And Steve Jobs is excited about the same aspects of the product that we're excited about. [TS]

  Cool technology ways to change your life with with technology particular small features you know the little Genie go in [TS]

  and out of the dock like all the things we want to about Steve Jobs also would not attempt is excited about different [TS]

  stuff. [TS]

  So to me the less relatable PRESENTER The main value to the articles providing what Marco got out is there was no one [TS]

  there explained to us in the way that Steve Jobs felt like it was necessary to explain to us why we're doing this. [TS]

  Tim tries to explain why or has other people come in stage do. I speak in it. [TS]

  It's more kind of like they speak in generalities or in sort of corporate speaker [TS]

  and big picture speak where Steve Jobs would break down a much more primal level and say here's a problem. [TS]

  Here's what we thought about this before about that here's a solution we think you're going to use it for this [TS]

  and there's been good Steve Jobs vision balance the reason I like this article is that like Wouldn't it be great if [TS]

  this guy you really love is still alive and he announced things in a super dramatic way [TS]

  and also now some cooler things than were announced [TS]

  and that I feel like it's just it's cheating I think you know this is not this article is not a guideline viable can to [TS]

  present a better presentations unless they can do cooler things [TS]

  and resurrect Steve Jobs so I would have rather seen this article. [TS]

  I mean I have yet to see the article it says Steve Jobs was alive X. Y. and Z. [TS]

  That I've liked [TS]

  and this continues that trend sort of better explaining what was wrong with Tim Cook's presentation you can compare it [TS]

  to successful presentations by Steve Jobs [TS]

  and I think if his actual presentation happen the way they said it would be overblown for what they actually announced [TS]

  you know our personal universe company Apple if Apple to the ones they do and it was Steve Jobs it would be ridiculous. [TS]

  So you did not like it as much as you guys did but you know it was not perfect [TS]

  but I think it did it did make a lot of very good point [TS]

  and it did it did show a lot of things that Apple could have done. [TS]

  Plausibly and differently and and they chose not to [TS]

  and it also depends on like the context I think a couple I mean this most recent probably like this most recent I [TS]

  thought was not a Steve Jobs presentation [TS]

  but was really good like this is the type of stuff that Steve Jobs wouldn't have known how to describe in interesting [TS]

  way all of the the new language the development tools the showing new versions of the O. S. [TS]

  All that software [TS]

  and developer tool stuff was presented by people who knew about it in a style that is different Steve Jobs style [TS]

  and I thought it was one of the better keynote for the audience that was given to maybe not to the press or whatever [TS]

  but for a roomful of developers. Everybody was just. [TS]

  You know it was jazz that ever had something to be jazzed about in that area you see presentation I think [TS]

  but only been to work for them in person [TS]

  or whatever I think that was extremely successful compared to the last job study there are these even in very bad [TS]

  health there but he didn't have the type of stuff to announce that he likes to announce. [TS]

  So the watch room is definitely him. [TS]

  Steve Jobs is wheel house but there are other presentations than that are in the current Apple's wheel house. [TS]

  Yeah it was very clearly. [TS]

  Steve Jobs is always very bad at hiding [TS]

  when he didn't feel that strongly about something he did he was very bad in hiding that I think Tim Cook has kind of a [TS]

  different problem which is Tim Cook is really excited about certain things [TS]

  and he doesn't you know he doesn't understand that he needs to kind of lead us to that point before just telling us how [TS]

  excited he is or he doesn't know how to lead us to that point [TS]

  or he's excited about things that we're not likely I bet he if he presented to like the organization of people who [TS]

  manage supply chains whatever their name is like he would be super excited about the details of those things you know [TS]

  like he's he's excited about different things I don't want to hear us talk about finance or supply chains [TS]

  or making deals or like they have an example if we ever get to it the Charlie Rose interview [TS]

  and the interview that Tim Cook has given show the things that he's excited about. [TS]

  They just happen to be the same things as Steve Jobs excite about he's just a different person. [TS]

  Like pull on a chair [TS]

  and said that that article struck in the Steve Jobs fan section I think that is a reasonable approximation of what it [TS]

  is and if you like Steve Jobs and direction then that's a good example of it [TS]

  but it was not in the mood for Steve Jobs and fiction I would say that. Let's let's turn to the Tim Cook. [TS]

  Charlie Rose in it because we're talking about it anyway. That was first of all very good. [TS]

  It took me a second I had to downloading it from somewhere [TS]

  and watching it with quick time player at like one point five six is not a fast speaker [TS]

  and it got a little bit slow times but so I had to I had to get through it twice before I really. [TS]

  Appreciate it at the first going out. [TS]

  Switch to other tabs and do a thing and all that's right up play in the background. [TS]

  Anyway so I want to pay attention to it it really is quite good. [TS]

  It does show like it shows him getting slightly at ease here and there [TS]

  and you could tell like the real Tim is coming out when he's slightly off the cuff [TS]

  and you can tell he doesn't really go off the cuff ever like [TS]

  and this is probably as far as he ever gets you know because he's of he's a very very controlled person in public he [TS]

  you could tell he says things very deliberately very thoughtfully. [TS]

  But just seeing that a little bit more of his personality in this was I think extremely positive and interesting [TS]

  and I want to see more of the Tim Cook that we saw on Charlie Rose like I think he should let more of that come out [TS]

  because what we saw there was Tim really caring very strongly about certain things like privacy where like he came out [TS]

  so hard in privacy We'll talk about that too I guess. Like Tim is not just some boring paper pusher. [TS]

  He has a very strongly principled guy and he feels very strongly about certain things [TS]

  and I feel like so far he has not let a lot of that out. [TS]

  You know possibly because it wasn't you know he didn't think it was the right time because there are some so much so [TS]

  many eyes on him everyone looking for him to like mess up [TS]

  or you know do something do something indicate he's not fit for the job or [TS]

  or whatever so you know maybe he's been going into it slowly but the Tim Cook that we saw on Charlie Rose. [TS]

  I would like to see more from the hear read that was at a Bloomberg interview some lengthy interview with him [TS]

  and got into it was with those covers by the way what was that. Yeah well I think those are real. [TS]

  Yeah I thought they were fake for the first several tweets to go in the game and reverencing fibrous they were real [TS]

  and I join them in their surprise about in their flesh. [TS]

  After I had forgot that was a paper magazine had a cover and I was just on line anyway [TS]

  but I think it was Boomer I'll try to find a link for the show notes. [TS]

  There was an interview that was like a condensed version of what I thought were the most revealing parts of the Charlie [TS]

  Rose interview [TS]

  and I get sad what what Tim Cook really cares about beyond the things beyond obviously his job which is managing a big [TS]

  company and C.E.O. As C.E.O. [TS]

  Is usually tend not to talk to the public about aspects of their job because who cares about SEO That's why I was [TS]

  saying if Tim Cook was talking to a group of other C.E.O.'s of other people who have similar jobs managing large [TS]

  organizations he would have a lot of interesting things to say to them but not to consumers [TS]

  and then there's the technology part which Tim Cook appreciates and understands [TS]

  but is not a geek about like Steve Jobs was right he's not obsessed with one particular software feature [TS]

  or one particular hardware feature and just marveling over it everything you can tell that when you're the C.E.O. [TS]

  You can imbue the company with some aspects of your personality and like Mark was saying. [TS]

  Tim Cook has been hesitant to do that so thus far kind of like just being the sort of guy behind the scenes like he has [TS]

  been for so long but I think maybe in the mac pro you know what was that twenty eleven twenty twelve that's [TS]

  when his personality started to come out a little bit more where he was starting to become willing to use Apple the [TS]

  company as a vehicle to achieve goals that are personally important to him [TS]

  and those goals as expressed on Charlie Rose and his interviews are about the environment privacy and human rights [TS]

  and diversity topics. Very little to do with Apple watches or IMAX or anything like that. [TS]

  But now he is finally coming out [TS]

  and saying I'm the leader of the biggest company in the United States may be the biggest company in the world. [TS]

  I have tremendous power. [TS]

  I want to use that power to achieve things are important to me because I think they're good ideas. [TS]

  They're not the goals of the company Apple is not. [TS]

  Turning into you know an organization that just deals with the environment and human rights and privacy. [TS]

  But in the course of doing the things our bill does making great products to make people's lives better that they [TS]

  really love unlovable all that stuff. [TS]

  They can also do these things and part of that is him going on shows [TS]

  and saying here's what we really care about like a diversity reporter there was talk in the text interview about the [TS]

  diversity report they put out I think you mention on the show saying what percentage of Apple's employees are what age [TS]

  would what race what gender all this other stuff. [TS]

  And Tim Cook saying that internally there was friction about like should we publish just because we look terrible like [TS]

  our diversity numbers are not good. [TS]

  Should we even publish this [TS]

  and Tim Cook made the decision apparently over the objections of other people like no where we have to walk the walk I [TS]

  care about diversity. [TS]

  If we're not doing a good job we want to be transparent about that we're going to put out this thing [TS]

  and write in the thing that they publish. [TS]

  You know Tim Cook saying a little text and things says we are not happy with these numbers. [TS]

  How often do you see a gigantic company publish something that they know or centrally make them look bad [TS]

  and admit in plain language writing the thing. [TS]

  This report shows that we are not achieving our goal as you know as well as I want to. [TS]

  We're not happy with this we're going to try to do better but here's what it is anyway. [TS]

  So that's what's fascinating to me is that now the biggest company in the world is being run by somebody who cares [TS]

  about things and is willing to put his money [TS]

  and his company where his mouth is unlike with the whole data center trying to run entire data center of renewable [TS]

  energy despite the fact that it adds tremendous complication and cost I'm sure [TS]

  and the same thing with a crazy space ship type of thing. [TS]

  We haven't money we just throw a data center out there and we just pay for electricity will be fine [TS]

  but can we build gigantic solar farms in North Carolina do you just making it harder for yourself you just like it [TS]

  doesn't make business sense right. That's like one of the shareholder meeting. [TS]

  And Tim Cook practically shouted the guy down [TS]

  and said look if you're looking for someone who's just going to make decisions based on return on investment get out of [TS]

  the stock. I'm you know tough luck right. That's the real Tim Cook and. [TS]

  We don't relate to it as much because like all we like to Steve Jobs he was totally into like the pixels in the cool [TS]

  edges and the designs [TS]

  and Johnny Ive likes you know carving things with diamonds a robot can cook cares about privacy human rights [TS]

  and environment and overall health and those topics although they may not be Technorati. [TS]

  It's refreshing to see them sort of bravely and boldly both express and acted on by someone with as much power [TS]

  and money as time goes well and I think what Tim is doing is not only like you know interesting [TS]

  and progressive from like a social environmental perspective it's also just good business like he's not going to do [TS]

  anything that's going to really damage Apple's business. He's smarter than that. [TS]

  Everything he does is is carefully measured he knows what he's getting into [TS]

  and he's doing it because he has probably decided it's worth it [TS]

  and it will be a net gain for the company like you know [TS]

  when you're as big as Apple as as they as we all know you get people attacking you for all sorts of crazy stuff you [TS]

  know and some of it is fair and some of it isn't [TS]

  and it is very important for Apple to maintain its reputation specially in fashion [TS]

  but you know it's very important for them to not be known as a company that has all these like you know labor abuses in [TS]

  China and not you know to the company that's destroying the environment all the data and everything else like [TS]

  and not do as a company that sells your data to advertisers like it is very important for Apple to maintain these these [TS]

  images to you know to to to address the issues that are coming up in technology so a few years ago those issues were [TS]

  environmental. Today they're diversity like that. [TS]

  These issues are coming up and they're being talked about and they're [TS]

  and accusations are being thrown around what do you do what do you do about it what are you doing about your companies [TS]

  that probably are companies the problem. [TS]

  Tim Cook is getting ahead of these things when he can or at least responding to them when he needs to [TS]

  and that I think serves Apple well overall. [TS]

  You know releasing a diversity report and saying I'm not happy with this and work [TS]

  and we're trying to do better than this. That is smart. [TS]

  It is it is both socially responsible and good business [TS]

  and I think that again what we're seeing from Tim Cook all over the place he does things that are smart [TS]

  and good business. [TS]

  And he you know because you know the thing on a stock like you it was addressing a question about environmental stuff [TS]

  and making things as out of line [TS]

  and everything it's like they're like that is not costing Apple a meaningful amount like it is not making them a lot a [TS]

  sieve a severely less profitable company [TS]

  and certainly is not making an unprofitable company to care about things like this. [TS]

  So like it is it isn't harming their business meaningfully like [TS]

  and shutting down sometimes shareholder meeting probably helped their business because that was reported everywhere as [TS]

  look how good this guy is he is he has things under control [TS]

  and he's principled like he does things that help you know I was trying to find the exact thing in that in that [TS]

  interview with him [TS]

  but it was a similar question from the interviewer about whether there is some tension between you [TS]

  and other people your organization about what the company should do [TS]

  and the question put to him cook in the role of someone who wanted to just go ahead with something because they were [TS]

  like you know one of Johnny I've said it's not good enough or you said well we got to ship something now [TS]

  and I can cook it maybe was a different question re would Tim Cook answer made the point that he's not a short term [TS]

  C.E.O. [TS]

  He's not looking for we got to make our numbers next quarter and that's [TS]

  when you're getting a market with like these things look like oh you're being so brave or whatever [TS]

  but they also happened to be in the long run better for the company better for the planet better for everybody is just [TS]

  that so much thinking especially in large corporations like I don't care what's going to long run just make your money [TS]

  now get it while the getting's good and forget about long term consequences [TS]

  and the right decision if you if your time winter was longer than a year [TS]

  or two the right decision is about renewable energy to care about diversity to care about the working editions in China [TS]

  and all those stuff right. Those are actually not only the right thing to do. [TS]

  But better for the company in the same way that Apple has proven like if we just care if we pay attention to the [TS]

  products we don't make a million products and try to sell [TS]

  and every little market category some people want to harbor a keyboard some people don't some people want to big [TS]

  computers somebody want to smoke I get to fill every single little thing. [TS]

  No they have a small number of products that make them as good as they can. [TS]

  The diversify is needed but they're not like all the companies like H.P. [TS]

  Just will make a product for every single person every single purpose [TS]

  or is going to get the money now going to get a get it. Long term that's not a good long term. [TS]

  Apple has focused on the product make a few products really awesome don't get into businesses where just for the hell [TS]

  of it like one of things they're talking about is all the different kinds of products that our research [TS]

  and decided not to make short term that looks dumb like seems like a waste of money. [TS]

  Long term Apple's program for the winning strategy so all these things it does [TS]

  and the Apple the company does are always focused on the long term. [TS]

  And two people so focused on the short term it seems like they're making the wrong call [TS]

  but it is actually the right thing to do and also the thing that will make Apple's successful years [TS]

  and years down the line. [TS]

  You know whether investors care about that because they want to get in out of the stock of the average [TS]

  or the average time a stock is held now these days is like less than a year when you know few minutes now. [TS]

  Well hypothetical trading but yeah it's just a different mindset and it is the correct mindset [TS]

  and it's kind of an that's nice that's fine for my own type of situation with well if you're Apple you can afford to [TS]

  have that thing but it's the reverse. [TS]

  If you have that attitude that's your only chance of ever becoming a company like Apple. [TS]

  Our final sponsor this week is our friends that hover once again which I now know I'm pronouncing correctly. [TS]

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  Don't forget promo code white cars law for ten percent off Marco [TS]

  and I both received our new i Phone six is on this past Friday. We are recording on Wednesday night. [TS]

  I've had a couple of work days with the i Phone six that I ordered. [TS]

  To recap I ordered a i Phone six space gray sixty four gig like pretty much everyone on Twitter [TS]

  and I don't know what to think it is too big. Well the four point seven is too big it's too big. [TS]

  I've played with one this week. [TS]

  Disagree I was pleasantly surprised at how not big this small one felt so I think the problem is is that I like using [TS]

  my i Phone one handed quite a lot. [TS]

  You could make a legitimate argument that I don't need to most times [TS]

  but nevertheless I tend to use my phone one handed and so because of that [TS]

  when I hold my phone the way I'm used to which is my pinky covering the lightning port as kind of like the weight [TS]

  bearing the load bearing the finger if you will my ring and middle fingers on the left. [TS]

  This is my right hand ring in filming middle fingers on the left hand side of the phone my pointer finger basically on [TS]

  the Apple logo and then my. My right thumb doing all the operating. [TS]

  I can only get about two thirds up the screen you're holding Iran K.Z. [TS]

  Know totally how I don't know how you're doing that because it's what I'm used to. [TS]

  I forgot to watch you more closely next time I see you didn't seem like the most precarious way to hold this thing like [TS]

  I don't have my i Pod touch with if I did the reach test on the i Phone six to see what I can reach with my normal grip [TS]

  and I thought this was everybody's number [TS]

  but hearing you just described that that is not the way I hold the phone I have with the corner sort of nestled in the [TS]

  palm of my hand. [TS]

  I can reach everywhere across the face of the six of my thumb except for the farthest corner [TS]

  and the farthest corner like maybe half an inch in most. [TS]

  I'm missing from this without me shimmying [TS]

  or moving my palm at all just palm anchored in my all four fingers wrapped on one side of the phone the other car the [TS]

  phone as well as my palm [TS]

  and my thumb sweeping the thing I can reach the top right corner I think we should bottom left corner I can reach the [TS]

  bottom right corner top left I can't quite reach I would have to guess my grip [TS]

  but that's more than I thought I would be able to reach I was in visioning may not be able to reach any corners except [TS]

  the one closest to my palm. [TS]

  You with the bouncing on the pinky with your pointer finger on the Apple logo I don't know what you do [TS]

  and put all four fingers inside of especially now that they have the power button on the side you can hit it with your [TS]

  thumb. [TS]

  Yeah and to be honest I think you're probably right that I just need to give up several years of a habit [TS]

  and it just is that's reasonable but it'll be more secure. [TS]

  Saying this other grip even with the five size thing that grip is better with that one you're less likely to drop it. [TS]

  No I'm less likely to drop it because I have my pinky blocking it from being dropped No that's you're just making this [TS]

  little bounce cradle from and just handle flipping out of the things you know actually gripping it. [TS]

  You're just sort of balancing it on it's like sheet music sitting on the sheet music stands on the center of going to [TS]

  tumbling off mine I'm actually holding in my hand now in Casey's defense I hold it sounds like the same way as Casey [TS]

  and it is it is a quite secure hole if you if you just hold it like with you know the thumb and you know your thumb. [TS]

  Whatever that's called on one side and then all four fingers on the other side across the middle then it can fire up [TS]

  and down whereas it's like if you take if you just hit the pinky and you bring it down on the bottom [TS]

  and you're anchoring the bottom right corner exactly right. I thought that's my son moving anywhere. [TS]

  Can't go down because it's literally in the palm and it can go up because I'm gripping with all four fingers on my [TS]

  and the side of my hand like I have it in a vice grip it's not as if I don't have to daintily hold it [TS]

  and have it sort of nestled in a holster shaped like my hand I'm actually holding it. [TS]

  So anyway we could observe also causing intending issues as well because I'm holding it wrong. [TS]

  Anyway I do like it if you leave aside the one handed use which I still haven't come to grips with be that my fault be [TS]

  it the phones fault one way or another I haven't come to those upon haven't come to grips with one handed use [TS]

  but nevertheless the screen itself. I do like I do like it being a little bigger. [TS]

  I do think it looks better although I don't I think there must be in my head because the four point seven inch screen [TS]

  is pretty much identical to the five S. Screen isn't it. No better viewing angles better. Better color depth. [TS]

  And what about the current glass I love the curve that is in the glass love it. [TS]

  So here's the thing about the curve glass when I first got my phone and I did not have a case for it yet. [TS]

  I really liked the curved glass [TS]

  and the most awesome part about the curved glass to me was the swipe from the left edge to the right which is a back [TS]

  gesture [TS]

  and also an unlocked jester although obviously don't use that too terribly often with Touch ID it makes that gesture so [TS]

  much nicer than it was on the squared off five S. but I had a apple leather case for my five S. [TS]

  and It was far and away the best case. [TS]

  Ever used on any phone I had had bumpers before I came in we would use like battery cases of them at a conference [TS]

  and I loved the leather case in the five S. [TS]

  So I got one for the six [TS]

  and the problem with the Apple weather case for the six is that the way it melts it it kind of covers up the nice bit [TS]

  of the edge of the curved edge of the glass and just kind of ruins that feel. [TS]

  Yeah I am worried about cases on the curve thing that's what I was thinking about I was holding it how are you going to [TS]

  put a case on this and preserve the things that are good about [TS]

  and I don't know they they don't really work like I actually got to hold Casey's phone I had the exact same problem [TS]

  with it it's like once you have the case on it it really does ruin that curve [TS]

  and so I don't know what to do because I am enough of a klutz that I often bang my phone into things because I'm not [TS]

  paying attention what I'm doing. Not gone well there's no new wood nearby but knock on glass not found bent aluminum. [TS]

  Yeah exactly not convents a limb I haven't dropped a phone ever to the point that the screen shatters. [TS]

  But I'm so scared especially since the back in the sides of the singer so darn slippers slippery or sleepy or whatever. [TS]

  I'm so scared I'm gonna drop it especially since I can't anchored on my pinky ahem rip it [TS]

  or drop it if you did you buy that did you buy the extra insurance. [TS]

  I did not expect a boxer at seventy or eighty isn't it now. [TS]

  I'll probably buy it just because it's still cheaper than getting like I don't trust myself not to drop it we've got it [TS]

  on my wife's phones. [TS]

  Course that means she hasn't dropped them [TS]

  but I just feel better buying in the grand scheme of things I worry less about it so my policy on that is I stop buying [TS]

  Apple Care and various protection plans and warranties a few years ago [TS]

  and my current policy is the first time I really need one and regret not having bought one. [TS]

  I'll start buying them again. So far it hasn't happened I'm coming out way ahead. [TS]

  Yeah I tend to agree with you but remind me of that [TS]

  when I take a case of I don't buy it on my Macs I've never really bought IMAX because I was. [TS]

  Like they're not going to be in a harsh environment. [TS]

  But once I'm carrying something around I have dropped my i Pod Touch many many times just so happens to have been [TS]

  broken and you have a case on if I can find a case that I like for the six assuming I buy one that is like this. T.P. [TS]

  You Delkin case I have a my Pod touch is I really like this case and in this case totally annihilate the curve. [TS]

  But if if the I just feel like this i Pod Touch case was does it's got like a five C. [TS]

  It's like a little bath tub like a squared off bath tub. Fine I'll be fine with that I like the how the five C. [TS]

  Feels as well I think the sex is great. [TS]

  Without a case to see what it's like with cases as I would like the result of my trying the fix in person is that I [TS]

  think the six is not too ridiculous [TS]

  and now I'm doing just waiting for the October event to see if there's any i Pod Touch action happening there. [TS]

  So are you implying that if there is no new i Pod Touch you're going to finally get an i Phone. Probably. [TS]

  Wow this is like I'm really I'm guessing there. [TS]

  I'm guessing if there's a new i Pod Touch it would not have these bigger screens. [TS]

  I'm guessing it would be like you know basically a five S. [TS]

  or Less because I think I think the bigger screens really require that harbor display scaler which is probably only in [TS]

  the I don't mean a plus I just mean the six size like but no I don't simply put also an A.C.L. [TS]

  or Put in a seven and it doesn't have a scalar and it sure doesn't. Yup sure does. [TS]

  It's not scaling up anything it's just a higher resolution. [TS]

  It's still that the apps when they aren't made for the screen [TS]

  or the display of there's only perhaps that aren't updated for the sex right. [TS]

  Yeah but either way I'm pretty sure the scalar is there [TS]

  and I'm pretty sure that they would not have a device with that size screen in this day [TS]

  and age without that scalar which probably means [TS]

  and they also probably wouldn't make like a custom part for the i Pod Touch and nobody buys them [TS]

  but they made a big deal about the scale of a my i Pad three can run you run double the i Phone apps on the i Pad for [TS]

  years it's fine. I'm guessing. [TS]

  They're not going to do it until they can put it in it are things like this not the big size because that one that's I [TS]

  think you would need it in there to do that [TS]

  but to make a great i Pod Touch like that size screen for you know for a kid for the kids thing where you know want to [TS]

  give your kid a phone but you want to be able to play I.O.'s games then it's got a bigger screen. [TS]

  It's a total win for [TS]

  and I bet they still feel like an i Pod Touch thing they want to make I think that size a natural fit the bigger size. [TS]

  Not so much. That's an interesting point I agree with you. [TS]

  To come back to the i Phones [TS]

  and to get toward the six plus a couple other quick thoughts about the six the apple in their case no longer covers the [TS]

  bottom of the phone which looks a little jank here [TS]

  but is actually kind of convenient because there's no real headphone cut out anymore that you have to worry about. [TS]

  And additionally there's no lightning port cut out anymore because I found that I think it was the Amazon lightning [TS]

  cables were too thick at that the head in order to get into the little cutout for the lightning port on the five S. [TS]

  Case. [TS]

  So I do kind of like that and I do love the feel of the apple leather cases [TS]

  and it makes the protruding lens not be an issue anymore but I don't know sitting here now. [TS]

  I love I think the phone looks good I like having a little bit more real estate more than I thought I wouldn't fact [TS]

  however every time I pick up Aaron's phone and she's staying with the five Best Buy your own choice. [TS]

  I think to myself what the first thought is holy crap this is tiny. [TS]

  The second thought I have is my goodness it feels so much better in my hand. [TS]

  Now what do you what do you think Marco first of all let me let me address the cosmetic angle. Both of our friends. [TS]

  C G P gray on the most recent episode of hello internet which I highly recommend It's a fantastic pod cast [TS]

  but in the Senate see G.P. Gray went on a nice rant in the last episode of hello internet where he basically said he. [TS]

  Believe how unbelievably ugly the i Phone six is really [TS]

  and also our friend Virginia Robert's blog post I believe it was the other day we'll put that in the sentence as well. [TS]

  Making some similar complaints about the appearance of it. [TS]

  So so should you be great main complaints were the rounded glass first of all [TS]

  and I think we're going to complain about to be around a glass I think I think they're right. [TS]

  It doesn't it doesn't look as good like if you see the way the light reflects off of it it doesn't look like a plastic [TS]

  covering it it does not look as good however I think it feels so much better that it I think is worth I think it looks [TS]

  good too like the ugliest Phone design is five and five S. Design and if I had maybe the three G.S. [TS]

  Comes close but I really didn't like the the five five S. [TS]

  As I thought it was just terrible [TS]

  and always it was a super boring sharp edges no no interest where is the curve glass like that the whole thing is that [TS]

  it's curved [TS]

  but it's actually made of glass you know it's not the first one to do a ton of the tons so the hundred people are right [TS]

  and yes we are aware of many many Android phones about curved glass [TS]

  and all sorts of curves in every different directions with the first Avalon fine [TS]

  and if they had like it I like that one of the Android phones that like it was on the front I like that one [TS]

  but I was on this because it's glass and it's hard it's not some squishy little thing. [TS]

  It [TS]

  and especially the joint that it makes with the rest of the thing you know tight panel gaps Lexus the relentless pursuit [TS]

  of professional ball bearings accent neutral anyway all that's what I think it reflects well on the device I can [TS]

  understand some people being annoyed by the antenna lines on the back yeah that was that was the other thing like [TS]

  and both great Actually [TS]

  when I think Virginia does does Well I think the antenna lines are indeed ugly I think the backs of these phones are a [TS]

  little ugly. [TS]

  I wouldn't say it's as severe as as with Gracie ripping I do think though those internet bands are indeed ugly [TS]

  and I wish I didn't have them however I will also say that I have noticed. [TS]

  Significantly improved Wind Fire reception from the five S. [TS]

  There are a number of areas in and around my house where used to be like right on the edge [TS]

  and sometimes a drop the connection with why far. And with every previous phone up to the five S. [TS]

  and Then the six that I've had for the last few days has not had a problem like in the same area as it has like two [TS]

  arcs of life. [TS]

  I reception and old connection just fine [TS]

  and is able to transfer data just fine so whatever it's worth the wife eye is definitely better reception in this [TS]

  current design and whether the due to something about something that requires the Baron's who knows. [TS]

  I don't like the bands [TS]

  but if that's what it takes to Goodwife I reception on edge areas of my house I'll take them all with the bands there. [TS]

  They have the same decision like first of all that metal is not radio transparent [TS]

  and they want to have metal for like they have a classical on the five C. I think it's great. [TS]

  It looks great [TS]

  but they obviously want to have a metal on that you can have the hand as you have that something that plastic [TS]

  or some other material at the ready waiting it out so they decided We know we have to have a plastic part we don't want [TS]

  to make plastic panels top and bottom we don't want to make glass panels from bottom. [TS]

  We don't want to do all the things we've done before. We can shove it all through a little glass apple logo. [TS]

  We have to have these plastic parts. [TS]

  What can we do to make them attractive [TS]

  and what they've done with them is like like the curved glass interfacing with the aluminum. [TS]

  They're showing off their ability to manufacture to tolerances by making the plastic exactly flush with the metal [TS]

  behind it. [TS]

  If those strikes were like slightly indented [TS]

  or you can catch your fingernails on earth they ever become that way like after you know a month or two months [TS]

  or year of use. [TS]

  If they start to get on even an expanding contract at different rates or become warped [TS]

  or whatever that will ruin the effect. [TS]

  But you know these i Phone six is that we've all seen that are brand new from the factory. [TS]

  I think them showing off again like panel gap though I look it is like one seamless material isn't that amazing I [TS]

  grieve that from a distance looking at it like why those ugly stripes all over it but in the details close up. [TS]

  I appreciate the craftsmanship. Like it's kind of like when you do. [TS]

  I figured I'd call it would inlays where you someone I would have would work in the chat room anyway. [TS]

  Like do you know where you cut out pieces of wood to precisely fit inside next to other pieces of wood [TS]

  and you're partial to guess what looks like one continuous piece of wood. [TS]

  That's kind of what they've done they've got an antenna inlays they're not ornamental they're fairly straight forward [TS]

  but I think that it's it's I think it's a nice look for a necessary evil. [TS]

  Again I think the forest design is still the best one because it took on a sort of evil [TS]

  and incorporated into the design by making entire back glass entire front glass we all know the problems that were [TS]

  but as a piece of sculpture the forest wins. [TS]

  But as something I hold in my hand and probably won't ever see the back of it like the six yeah. [TS]

  Honestly I think you know I totally agree with with some of the concerns that it is indeed harder to reach things in [TS]

  the SEC's like you know going from the forest to the five. [TS]

  So certain things on Scheme are hard to Reka specially if you hold on the bottom in most of us do the upper corners [TS]

  became much harder to reach with the new one the four point seven [TS]

  and the five point five that that it takes it in bigger directions you know it even more things are now harder to reach [TS]

  without like an awkward regrip or reach over kind of thing. No question that part is worse. [TS]

  However I think overall it's overall the sixty feels way better in the hand even with the awkward reaching needs. [TS]

  Now have you noticed improved battery life because you granted these are new devices [TS]

  and Stephen Hackett took me to task on that in Naturally any new batteries going to feel a little a little better [TS]

  or feel like it lasts longer than an older battery but that being said that and I'm making up numbers here [TS]

  when I got done with an average work day with my five S. [TS]

  I would be at something around thirty [TS]

  or forty percent I don't have a battery percentage on my on my status bars this is all just visually [TS]

  but I feel like I'm coming home from an average day at work with. [TS]

  Ten or twenty percent more battery power remaining on my six than I ever did on my five S. [TS]

  and I was curious Marco if you seem to have noticed similar results or if perhaps I'm just crazy. [TS]

  I guess it's better and I don't have a regular schedule so like every day I treat my phone weirdly differently. [TS]

  Yeah I know I think it's it's close enough like you know we're not talking about twice as long. [TS]

  No no no no no you're talking about maybe twenty percent longer so it's I think it's close enough that it's within the [TS]

  realm of like every day variances of how it's being used [TS]

  or the age of the battery being one year newer things like that that I don't I don't think we can draw the conclusion [TS]

  from that. Enough that the biggest one of batteries is when you get a new device. [TS]

  Your old one has a way of least a one year old battery [TS]

  and I think that it's always that if you had just simply gotten a new version of the phone you already had you'd like [TS]

  well this battery is better that's just a fact of life with with the mind batteries even more severe laptop so you only [TS]

  get a new one every four years. Yeah and it's even it's even bigger than the Hey I just saw the new version of the O.S. [TS]

  and It feels faster [TS]

  but it's just because I rebooted because the battery thing is real measurable difference even just from a year old [TS]

  battery use your phone every day. [TS]

  Yes the new new battery is always such nice big when I mean I see we got my son and i Pod Touch [TS]

  and like how old is that I bought that's not three years old two years old whatever it is. [TS]

  When he got a brand new one is better is way better than mine and I should have given a mild one but I didn't. [TS]

  Right so let's Any other thoughts about the six and then I'd like to talk about the six plus. [TS]

  Well I think some of them I bridge the two is software thoughts like what it's like to use apps they're just bigger. [TS]

  So in that case you and I have used the six now for about a week or whatever will live in a week. [TS]

  It's weird because you know obviously a lot of that aren't updated yet which is unfortunate because they really do look [TS]

  awful when they're not updated and I really I hope developers listen into this. [TS]

  If you thought that an update was something that you had to like. [TS]

  Maybe kind of casually get to and you haven't really [TS]

  and you haven't even submitted it yet I know there's a long submission so you know if you're stuck in this mission Q [TS]

  This does not apply to you [TS]

  but if if you're a developer who's like well we'll get to it sometime soon you should reconsider that position you [TS]

  should really get on because not none of the added apps really do look awful [TS]

  and most importantly they don't work very well if you ever bring up the keyboard because the keyboard a scaled also [TS]

  which means that everything on the keyboard is slightly differently sized than the native keyboard as in every other [TS]

  app on the phone. And so you may come to typos because you like your it slightly off from what you're used to. [TS]

  So definitely get your get your ass updated as soon as you can. [TS]

  Anyway for apps that have been updated including all the built in ones. [TS]

  An example of third party ones I think it's kind of like you know so on our US it's like every Windows always maximized [TS]

  or whatever a West-End calls zoomed or different [TS]

  and I was it's like everyone knows always maximize the way maximize means on Windows. [TS]

  Everything is always full screen edge to edge unless we get a crazy i Pad resizing apps thing but we'll see about that. [TS]

  And so when you get a bigger screen you know you don't just have you don't have more room to put apps side by side [TS]

  or anything. [TS]

  All the apps just get larger they get more space [TS]

  and so some of the apps I think are suffering from not knowing how to use the space very well. [TS]

  It's you know even looking at something like mail like I even I mean this isn't even I'm not even talking of the six [TS]

  plus even just on the six I'm having this problem with mail where it just kind of looks like they don't know what to do [TS]

  with the space yet like it looks like you've maximized a window on a on a new bigger monitor [TS]

  and everything just spread out more and you know it's it isn't proportionally scaled it by accident [TS]

  or I sent over cast out for i Pad exactly you know a little less severe than that [TS]

  but if it is that same kind of effect where it's like. [TS]

  This was clearly designed for a differently sized screen and it's just being scaled up to to this new one [TS]

  but it was obviously designed for a smaller screen [TS]

  and it kind of looks ridiculous to an extent I'm getting that feeling all over the place with with this with the six [TS]

  the six plus I would imagine is probably worse. [TS]

  I did getting both my six plus was right a few hours ago so I haven't had a lot to understand that the reason I got [TS]

  both is for developer purposes you know I think we developers have been lucky in all previous years for developing for [TS]

  the i Phone or i Pad in that we've never really had to buy extra ones for him if I gave this rant last week I forgot [TS]

  but I live here on Twitter. You know we've never had to buy extra phones. [TS]

  If you're an Android Developer the center take your developers generally have to buy extra phones beyond the ones they [TS]

  would normally get from the cells. [TS]

  Just because you need more stuff to test on people if you just bought a new i Phone every year [TS]

  or two you were mostly OK. [TS]

  This was the first time I really felt like I had to buy an extra one because the six [TS]

  and six plus are very different from each other not to mention all previous i Phones I think if you're a developer it's [TS]

  very clear it goes from you know just looking at the sales numbers even though they're combined. [TS]

  Looking around seeing what is selling I even I asked a guy an Apple store today you know what roughly this is the sales [TS]

  mix between the two and he said well you know they're getting a lot fewer of the six pluses. [TS]

  So they're selling more sixes [TS]

  but if they had them both in stock they probably Sun about equally because every since so many people asking for the [TS]

  six plus. [TS]

  So I think this is very clear like we're not going to have one of these being the massive majority winner over the [TS]

  other one. We're going to see the I think both of these are going to be major selling devices. [TS]

  It's important for developers to be able to test on both of them because they're different. [TS]

  The six plus is not just the six but bigger it has different size classes it. [TS]

  Please make sure I've had interfaces and landscape it has a scalar and it runs at three X. [TS]

  and Like the entire screen runs differently [TS]

  and the way you hold is different the ergonomics are different where each controls might be different. [TS]

  It's these are very different devices from each other and from past ones [TS]

  and so I think it's important for developers to have both. [TS]

  So what I did was I got my regular eight hundred eighty one for the small one [TS]

  and the big one I got an unlocked one at full price in the same capacity same color black sixty four so that I could [TS]

  swap the sim into it and so what I'm going to actually do is I'm going to switch to the big one for like a week [TS]

  or two here [TS]

  or there just so I can get a feel for what it's like to use one so I have some idea of what I should be developing on [TS]

  it like where should controls go how should things work like I think it's important for developers to familiarize [TS]

  ourselves with both of these devices because they're huge not in size Well that's two [TS]

  but they're going to be huge in sales and influence. [TS]

  Anyway all that being said I think the six plus is going to have this problem even more of having apps just kind of be [TS]

  scaled up and not like in like the old unupdated way [TS]

  but even after you have that your absolute OK you make your apple run in this in this banding rectangle. [TS]

  It's still not really redesigned for it until you do something special for it [TS]

  and I think is going to be a while before developers [TS]

  and Apple with its own apps really know how to use the space well enough I think. [TS]

  And so income it was what I said last week where I think in a world where the Apple Watch is commonplace I think the [TS]

  five plus the six plus will make more sense because a bigger phone is hard to take in and out your pocket [TS]

  or wherever it happens to be stored. [TS]

  If you have a watch to check out of occasions [TS]

  and to do minor actions on you don't need to take out your pocket as much so I think next year [TS]

  and in future years the five to six play. [TS]

  US liner that the large size line will be more compelling for more people because it's mostly sitting in your pocket [TS]

  and you're just not going to watch all day and you're using it when you have to handle vailable. [TS]

  This year I think it'll be it'll be very successful but a lot of like us won't be switching to it. [TS]

  That being said it's going to be big and I think it's going to take us a year [TS]

  or two to even figure out how to use the space. I think you're right. [TS]

  We actually saw each other Marco and I this past weekend and I had gotten a few friends together over the weekend [TS]

  and one of my friends Phil actually had gotten his six plus that Friday this past Friday [TS]

  and so I got to play with this i Phone six plus for a little while. [TS]

  And my initial impressions about it were firstly Oh my God enormous second. [TS]

  Secondly it was it was just it just felt to me a little bit wrong like the the six still feels like a phone to me. [TS]

  Granted I just spent a little while earlier telling you I do think it's a little too big [TS]

  but maybe over time I'll adjust the six pluses indisputable e freakin huge [TS]

  and huge to the point that I almost I think mentally associate it more as a very small i Pad [TS]

  and then I do a very large i Phone. [TS]

  Oh yeah I think I think if the if the i Pad was the better selling device they might have called this the i Pad Nano. [TS]

  I agree I agree completely. [TS]

  I did briefly use it in landscape mode in mail where it had the split view going on [TS]

  and I actually really really like that [TS]

  and I really thought that was really nice to have that extra bit of context as you're going through email. [TS]

  And so presumably that would apply. [TS]

  To many other apps that will eventually support the split views but overall it just felt completely wrong to me [TS]

  and i even if I was bumping into battery issues constantly like Mike earlier as I would be hard pressed to want to [TS]

  carry something that large all the time. [TS]

  To me I have my phone when I on the go and I have my i Pad when I don't need to create a lot of things [TS]

  but I want something with a little more breathing room. I was the i Pad Mini I should say. [TS]

  But you know I have my laptop if I really need to sit down [TS]

  and do work I don't personally see were six plus fits in my life. But I mean apparently a bunch of people do think so. [TS]

  But man it's just so you know the more I think about the six plus but I still haven't even seen in person [TS]

  but the more I think about it in the abstract the more I relate it to my beloved still [TS]

  but similarly trouble of the i Pad three in that it just seems like a compromise device. The three X. [TS]

  Resolution scaled down I know some people say that you can't tell and doesn't matter and it looks great [TS]

  and blah blah blah. But I'm pretty sure I will be able to tell. [TS]

  And even if I can't tell it's just such an awkward like what am I gaining out of that like four hundred D.B.I. [TS]

  Fine but rendering it three X. [TS]

  A scaling down that's not gaining me anything right that is not it's making the hardware work harder. [TS]

  Render at a higher resolution and then taking away throwing away a lot of that information [TS]

  when it scales it down I don't know if they just couldn't hit the target you know they couldn't get screens that actual [TS]

  resolution three X. [TS]

  Bothers me because I don't care for three resolutions or multiple to sixteen [TS]

  but I do care that they're evenly divisible [TS]

  and I guess they all use was moving away from pixel perfect design who cares [TS]

  or whatever like why why make that compromise. You don't have to because they can't do it for X. [TS]

  That's why it's three X. Four X. Too much they can't even do Native three X. Three X. [TS]

  and Scale down just the whole thing seems like a transition point toward something else because we had one X. [TS]

  and We had two X. and It was a clear like we waited a while to us when we got it with a clean win three X. [TS]

  Scale down is not a clean win big or two X. Fine for X. [TS]

  Which we're not there yet fine but this just seems like a way station in between where we are now [TS]

  and where we might like to be. Or maybe we can just decide the two X. [TS]

  Is enough and there's not any benefit to going to four or three X. [TS]

  Scaled down [TS]

  but just the plus as a as a hardware device mostly defined by a screen because both are just one big screen I don't [TS]

  like it. [TS]

  I think your opinion might change if you see one you know academically I get your points about how the scaling is kind [TS]

  of gross. [TS]

  No question but in person it doesn't really matter [TS]

  and the screen just looks really really good you know you don't see the hairline showing when you scroll. [TS]

  Single single native pixel lines basically hairlines scroll down what you can see them shimmer I think I don't. [TS]

  So far I haven't noticed that. [TS]

  Now voted your attention oh yeah there it is very you have to be scrolling the table you know extremely slowly to see [TS]

  it and looking for it. [TS]

  Also I mean I it's not so much it is really in the like in the idea that this this hardware is is compromised like it's [TS]

  because they couldn't do for X. but They didn't want to just do two X. [TS]

  That size so they were because they wanted to get higher D.B.I. [TS]

  So this is all this is the compromise and I'm only in the same way that I sit there and just wait [TS]

  and don't buy any new hardware until the hardware comes out that I was right. [TS]

  I kicked off a network well with the i Pad I waited until they had a retina model [TS]

  and even that I got compromised because the very first retina wanted if I cared about like three performance [TS]

  or whatever it would be which I don't but even just things like scrolling order like weight to the thing you want [TS]

  and I didn't buy an i Pad despite what I thought I knew I would love one. [TS]

  Still when REDMAN I don't regret that decision. [TS]

  I'm sitting here with this two thousand and eight macro not buying into until it's just the right thing [TS]

  and in that sort of mindset. [TS]

  The plus is not the one like in turn you know I know where they're going they're not there yet this is a transitional [TS]

  fossil it will come and go. [TS]

  We will forget that it ever existed and you know the correct one that that is a better better fit between C.P.U. G.P.U. [TS]

  Screen and resolution three X. Just I don't think I'll ever be happy with that. I don't. 3. X. [TS]

  Itself if it was if it was native to the panel I don't think that we have problem [TS]

  but I mean first of all I think you're holding the too high of a standard you know the way. [TS]

  Oh you know regular people don't care is this is me personally no one else has those values I totally understand. [TS]

  Like if your phone is subsidized by your carrier [TS]

  and you can get a new one every year for every two years for like three hundred bucks you don't have to worry about [TS]

  like you know your macro decision is am I going to be OK for the next five years. [TS]

  Your phone decision is am I going to be OK use computer for the next one to two years. [TS]

  It's esoteric like I just have specific demands of the heartbreaking people came into retina versus not right now this [TS]

  is totally right. [TS]

  However I don't like I'm just not I'm talking about me personally like [TS]

  when I look at the arc of the hardware if you are a hardware afficionado there are certain machines that are just like [TS]

  that was just the right time just the right combination of the all the parts were in harmony no part was unnecessarily [TS]

  compromised by being in a transition between an old one and a new one right. [TS]

  Like the retina screen likely didn't do much with the screen they didn't change resolution that in changes size until [TS]

  they can go retina knows just such a big leap such a clean [TS]

  when they could have been compromised in between by tweaking the resolution increasingly be after they didn't this [TS]

  three X. One just smells to me like we couldn't do for X. Y. and You know we had to do three X. [TS]

  and We couldn't even get a screen that so we had to do three X. [TS]

  Scale down and here's your device and maybe the only hope this gives me is that maybe it means a plus size I thought. [TS]

  Such actually is in the works because if you going to give a kid something to play games on [TS]

  or watch a video on the back of a car and you don't want to give them an i Pad plus size i Pod Touch would be great [TS]

  and maybe it's like well we could have had the super high end screen on the i Phone six Plus if we had another fifty [TS]

  bucks but we knew we were going to use the exact same screen and the plus size i Pod Touch [TS]

  and so we had to go with this crazy compromise but I'm just making excuses for them now does not. [TS]

  It offends me on a technique [TS]

  or hardware level none of that has anything to do with how successful the product will be in the market. [TS]

  I think also you know you you're calling this a compromise device you know similar to the i Pad three [TS]

  and I think by that let me know if this is fair [TS]

  and I think you're saying like design compromises had to result in something mediocre. Is that a fair characterization. [TS]

  Not just mediocre [TS]

  but like like River setting a dog he saw like a couple animation to look like him out of started a little more on the [TS]

  plus. [TS]

  That's something that a consumer could notice that it is smoother on the six [TS]

  but even though this is the more expensive model the I think the compromises on this are a lot less significant [TS]

  and less obvious than what you might be thinking like the three X. Divide. [TS]

  Again I think you're I see what you're saying about how it's offending you like on a nerd level that I get I think the [TS]

  overall device looking at it I'm holding one of my hand now looking at this device like I think this is rather than [TS]

  saying it's a compromise device I would say it's more like a seventeen inch Power Book. [TS]

  Remember that or a macro for a I was also compromised by the ridiculous keyboard floating in the giant sea of aluminum. [TS]

  Of course you have a problem with the use of same keyboard on the on that thirteen inch Power Book [TS]

  and the twelve inch power. [TS]

  Well that was all of these are I think I call a feature too [TS]

  but no I didn't really know that these are just part sharing [TS]

  but you know it was nice to be consistent with you know your fingers you know [TS]

  and you know I can certainly let standardize on the worst keyboard. Oh John are you ever happy. [TS]

  Anyway I like the six plus does benefit from having I would assume exactly the same fitting tension cool designing [TS]

  curve corners [TS]

  and everything like that all the things I say I like about the six of them do it just they are like I'm not saying the [TS]

  hardware is just the balance of the the internals in the screen seems off to me. [TS]

  I think like the seventeen inch Power Book People are going to love this thing [TS]

  and not maybe not all people maybe not even the majority will see it in the majority and how they might go for this. [TS]

  Either way it's a radio people care about anything that says that they have this is totally immaterial Mazal has been [TS]

  battling all they care is the bigger screen [TS]

  and said For them it's price you know do I want to under dollars more for the bigger ones as I said I think the six [TS]

  will be the more popular model. [TS]

  It's so hard to tell now because this exposes are so incredibly supply constrained that there are we sold out [TS]

  everywhere and they could fool fool people into thinking that they are the more popular model [TS]

  but they're not it's like the gold iphone. [TS]

  Sure [TS]

  but I think like you know if if they made a retina seventeen inch MacBook Pro today for my next for my next laptop I [TS]

  might buy that because I'm almost always limited on what I can do on my laptop by the screen space [TS]

  and yes it has a scaling mode but they make these really tiny and it's hard to see. [TS]

  I would almost certainly by a seventeen and try to map a pro if one was available. [TS]

  The seventeen year old macro pro and power book didn't sell well as far as I know [TS]

  but it's sold because if it was like if that was your only computer and you only if you only had a laptop [TS]

  and you were a power user and portability was a little bit less important then no screen space [TS]

  and being able to you know use as much as you could in one thing because you had to be very productive on just a laptop [TS]

  humid no external monitor. If those are your needs. That was a fantastic computer and those were granted. [TS]

  Education needs. But that was a really great solution to it now I think there's a parallel to draw between. [TS]

  That and your i Phone being your only mobile device if you don't have a tablet and possibly your primary [TS]

  or only computer if you don't even have a P.C. or You don't use one anymore you hardly ever use one. [TS]

  So many people use their phones as their only or primary computer these days. It does make sense to have a big screen. [TS]

  It's basically have as big of a screen as you can tolerate carrying around [TS]

  and using in your hand because so many things on a computer are better on big screens [TS]

  and so I think from that point of view this actually isn't a compromised device. [TS]

  It's simply another option for people for whom this is their primary computer I think is a compromise implementation of [TS]

  a device that everyone knows that there's a demand for which is a big honking phone I'm saying except that a big hunk [TS]

  of phone is two levels of Commerce One cut categories big honking phone you're consciously choosing a happy medium [TS]

  between all the other devices that you're not going to get to just can have one phone fine. [TS]

  Once you establish that type of thing you want to make how do you make a really good big honkin phone [TS]

  and the answer is not render three X. and Scaled down to H.D. With a G. View they can barely handle it. [TS]

  I don't know honestly. [TS]

  I'm I'm I think in the back of my mind there's like a forty percent chance [TS]

  or so that I'm actually during my trial of the thing I'm actually like a better [TS]

  and switch to it full time because like I'm exactly the kind of user who would like this like I feel like a big phony [TS]

  like I'm not saying you know again that category of thing if it turns out that you want to big phone this is this is [TS]

  the only big i Phone So really big i Phones This is your only choice [TS]

  and it's fine like this is not just it just bothers me [TS]

  and I get what it looks like is something that if they if they had a choice they would have done it differently [TS]

  but couldn't for reasons of parts availability [TS]

  or you know just like something didn't work out so well it seems like to me. Yeah. Again that's fair. [TS]

  I just think in real world use it doesn't really matter now. No it doesn't. [TS]

  Just just bothers me I mean my i Pad three is exactly the same deal gets too hot it's big [TS]

  and it's take it's got a thirty pin connector the G.P.U. [TS]

  Can barely handle a screen RASM [TS]

  and I was happy with it because I was holding out for as long as I possibly going to get a retina screen [TS]

  and retina versa non-relatives totally worth it. [TS]

  But I also recognize that of all the Retina i Pads This one is the bad one right. [TS]

  Someone like fairly direct and the four came out so quickly after I had four of lightning part right. [TS]

  Yeah but anyway the many many parallels and I say this is like I'm still using my i Pad three [TS]

  and this is part of Apple's curse that like I have not seen it is a hard I'm going to get replace it with an air of [TS]

  actually two but I've watched generations of i Pads come and go [TS]

  and every time I said you know my pedestal pretty darn good the screen looks good I use it when I'm on my couch [TS]

  and in my bed and it's just fine and I can go to three years getting a new i Pad and i bet Apple hates that [TS]

  but that is a testament to the longevity of even the worst Retina i Pad they've ever it was a compromise device [TS]

  and I don't feel like you want to get one because my hands are always cold. [TS]

  Well like to me like on a personal level for a minute I think I would say now in retrospect now you know having seen [TS]

  both the i Pad air and now big phones I would say the i Pad mini is kind of a compromise device. [TS]

  The non retina ones just get rid of that. Well that way. Yeah I wish. [TS]

  Oh God I hope they stop selling that next month so we can stop supporting a five chips anytime soon. [TS]

  The i Pad Mini doesn't fit in most pockets unless you unless you carry a larger bag [TS]

  or a big jacket you know the i Pad Mini it's it's not always with you like a phone is also not as specious in feel as [TS]

  the full size i Pad even though I notice same resolution but it's also that that is just much nicer [TS]

  and also the fault of I've had a just a higher end device you know the the retina many because it's unsubsidized like [TS]

  all the like all the i Pads It really is a very low end device it is. It is similar to the i Pod touch in like. [TS]

  The quality of components that it that it will probably usually end up getting. [TS]

  I think the current one was a fluke in that it had the same a seven as the big one the same [TS]

  and the same capabilities and the same I think it even had the same cameras [TS]

  and everything like it was just you know slightly clocked lower and lower quality screen. [TS]

  Well looking at the i've had ere now [TS]

  and having Oh now the retina Mini I think if I if I buy another i Pad will of course I'm going to buy that I bought it [TS]

  at some point whatever I've had I buy next. [TS]

  I'm almost certain I'm going for the full sized one is I think the full size i Pad is a better i Pad like it's a serve [TS]

  and i Pad like role for for the kind of things I would use it for. [TS]

  Which is not to bring it around as my as my portable device anymore [TS]

  but as like a small tablet in the house like a small tablet to be next to my bed [TS]

  or next to the couch you know browse the Internet at you know on furniture. It's great for that. [TS]

  I think for portable use the big phones are just going to eat lunch because they're just so much better at portable use [TS]

  they're so much smaller. They are always with you. [TS]

  They have better cameras [TS]

  and their higher end devices there's way way more profit in them so they can afford to have better components better [TS]

  cameras other stuff. [TS]

  And they're always going to be higher end devices [TS]

  and they're always going to have cell plan because you already have a cell plan like you don't to worry about in the SO [TS]

  their i Pad having a separate plan [TS]

  or pulling with your just in one like it's just such a more compelling argument for portable use to have just a little [TS]

  bigger phone and to have no i Pad [TS]

  and then have the i Pad if you're going to have a I've had it all have it be the in your house portable casual tablet [TS]

  in which case the telling side I think is better than the mini you know my brain knows that you're right. [TS]

  But God do I love my my retina i Pad Mini and I having had a third generation i Pad and that's Aaron's i Pad now. [TS]

  I just don't see myself ever wanting to go to a big i Pad again. [TS]

  But you know teach our own that's what makes walk around [TS]

  when the twelve inch comes out the ten one ten one little bit of it maybe going been some some i Phone self I don't [TS]

  know I don't like we're over two hours are we really going to keep going. [TS]

  We'll do it in the after show thanks but we're three sponsors this week. [TS]

  Mobile looks Harry's and hover and we will see you next week. [TS]

  Now there's still a silver to be accidental accidental death [TS]

  and you are now sitting on the train as it says to that list and the team Michael. [TS]

  So you're bending your i Phone already you have even gotten one yet now the i Phone thing this reminds me so much of [TS]

  our you know the court screen in testing and scratching with glass and stuff like that [TS]

  and I'm only I'm only going to slam this one video that is the only one I saw that was the one featured on Time dot com [TS]

  that everyone linked to the guy bending it a guess is the guy bending his i Phone six Plus. [TS]

  So it's one part if you're going to make a video of this obviously you're sacrificing a piece of hardware you like I'm [TS]

  going to see it was kind of like that. [TS]

  Like I was doing with the with the screen I'm going to stab her with a knife I'm going to this is like a torch to see [TS]

  what can this device stand out if you're going to go through all this tub trouble [TS]

  and destroy a multi hundred dollar device it's like the U.S.B. [TS]

  Connector like you would use it [TS]

  when she spent some time since it's such a big deal like this guy who's going to use a million devices this video is [TS]

  going to cost me hundreds of dollars. [TS]

  Let me think for five minutes about how I can how much value can I get out of this device of bending this device how [TS]

  much value can I get out of standing the screen with a knife [TS]

  and I think you would have to say like you just bending this thing or submitting it to a stress test [TS]

  or even if you have a really complicated you know Dr drawing metal stressing machine they'll be like digital readout [TS]

  showing how much force [TS]

  and where the folk are MS And also there's like you have to compare it to something otherwise we have no idea if it's [TS]

  better or worse than the other ones you have to bend the five S. You have to but you you can't just do it in isolation. [TS]

  So he takes upon he bends it it's really hard it bends like so what does that tell me you bet your phone for hundreds [TS]

  of dollars. You didn't tell me. Well I've been to five S. [TS]

  and It was harder it was easier it was like we assume it may be easier you know again doctoring to tell us exactly the [TS]

  equations that you know how much more leverage you get on a longer phone and every extra millimeter gives us X. [TS]

  Amount of force because of printing [TS]

  and where you put the focus you have to compare you have to say stamp this screen with a knife stab the old screen with [TS]

  a knife one is harder. [TS]

  Just this is basically my asking of the scientists here [TS]

  but if you had to strap on the main thing we want to know is is this big giant phone more susceptible to bending then [TS]

  the old phones. [TS]

  Don't just assume that because you can bend a new phone you have therefore in part of the information that like OK well [TS]

  we've got the new phone [TS]

  and the only stories about the new phone therefore the new phone is worse no Ben the old phone too. [TS]

  So painful [TS]

  but as for bending it the only interesting information out of the vending was one that looked really hard to bend [TS]

  and to it. [TS]

  Ben as they point out in the video event in the weak spot in the side where the volume buttons come through because [TS]

  that's the part the little you know semicircular curve is the most weak because it's got you know it's got holes in it [TS]

  or whatever. [TS]

  All that said I completely believe the story that someone had an i Phone six Plus in the front pocket of their pants [TS]

  and at the end of the bending in [TS]

  and the reason I believe that is because cloth is very strong surprisingly strong especially to the strength of the you [TS]

  know like pulling on it's not going to tear apart that's why we make pants out of cloth right they don't fall apart [TS]

  when you wear them. [TS]

  So it can and you know big big man's thighs plus a bunch of really tight fitting dress pants pasta phone [TS]

  and a pocket I can totally see them imparting enough enough force on a large phone to bend it. [TS]

  But it's still that doesn't you know that doesn't answer any of my questions which are Is this a problem unique to the [TS]

  six plus or could he also has bent any of the past models would he also have bent [TS]

  and I've had many who knows we don't know. So I feel like this story is still an open question. [TS]

  If the i Pad is more subtle bending because it is larger [TS]

  and because you get more leverage on it maybe a little bit of this responsibility can haunt apple in that if you're [TS]

  making a device slightly larger people still might try to use it like an old device by putting it in their pocket is a [TS]

  half a mile from a pocket is a little bit bigger. [TS]

  This it's in our pocket I'll do that too whereas I think no one was ever trying to shove i Pad Mini into their pockets [TS]

  and if they did they would be just as bendy or even more bendy could get even more leverage on it. [TS]

  Anyway I don't think this is as big a non-story as everyone else does [TS]

  but first of all don't put your devices in your pockets. [TS]

  I think going to put on a show I can believe that she put in her pocket [TS]

  and she said Why take it out before I sit down don't sit on your vices. [TS]

  Don't put it on the front part of the pants because just because I think that it's possible to put it in the front [TS]

  pocket your pants and bend it you still feel that like you saw a feeling. [TS]

  Your leg the amount of force you need to impart on these metal things to bend them is substantial and [TS]

  when you feel that happening in your front pocket God my God like I put my tiny little i Pod touch in my front pocket [TS]

  sometimes and when I sit down on a couch I feel a little bit of tension if I over till I get my back up [TS]

  and you know just don't do that don't think it's indestructible. [TS]

  I disagree with your statement that people should not put their devices in their pockets. [TS]

  Yeah but the six plus like it's not so much to put don't [TS]

  when you talk about like like for your back pocket like no one is no one's putting like their their phone in their back [TS]

  pocket and sitting down in concrete right. [TS]

  My very limited understanding of these matters is that a lot of women do precisely that because their front pockets [TS]

  simply aren't large enough to handle even a five S. [TS]

  but You're cracked the screen like just from like plop in your butt down something there's not enough cushion between [TS]

  the glass screen especially if you have no case [TS]

  and a thin back pocket of your pants on the concrete you'll end up chipping the glass on a screen while you put you put [TS]

  the screen side towards the butt or the legged screen so I didn't get it on are you if you had it. [TS]

  Well here's the thing with putting the screen side [TS]

  and if you try to do that your front pocket he got a little fake pocket where the i Pod Nano goes there's a little [TS]

  metal thing poking out of that so he put the screen in [TS]

  when you go into that pocket you'll be putting that melting against your screen. [TS]

  Well that's why your left pocket is made for devices because the the little change pocket thing is always only on the [TS]

  right side. Yeah but that's only for lefties I agree with John. No you guys are wrong anyway. [TS]

  Like putting in your pocket is like you can have in your pocket as long as you don't get that feeling like Oh my God [TS]

  I'm now crushing the thing that's in my pocket. [TS]

  Right you know you that feeling when you when you sit down with it in your in your pocket the wrong way or it's [TS]

  when you're standing up it's fine [TS]

  when you start putting it under tension like you're going to feel that you if you put enough force with your pants [TS]

  pocket on a device to bend it you will feel that happening [TS]

  and you feel it happening going oh it's fine I'm sure it's an instructor nothing will happen to it that's that's on you. [TS]

  But this gets back to what we just talked about with the watch. [TS]

  If Apple had made the i Phone six plus two millimeters thicker and strengthen. [TS]

  So it was heavier and got better battery life. Were people have thought that was the worst of us or a better device. [TS]

  I think a better device personally but that's not what Apple wants. [TS]

  As you've said several times I go the other the other angle is well why do they keep making a thinner Could you don't [TS]

  get too radically thinner in one big jump you have to get there by a little increment [TS]

  and if you don't keep getting thinner every year you're never going to get to the end point and someone else will [TS]

  and you'll be screwed [TS]

  and so I understand Apple's philosophy behind this I think there's room in their product line for one device that [TS]

  doesn't make the same tradeoffs. [TS]

  I think overall they still need to keep going thinner because that's that's that's making progress I think that's [TS]

  moving toward something that is radically better. [TS]

  But what all along that path are allowed to be bumps [TS]

  and if I was going to make a bomb I would make it with a big honkin sic i Phone six Plus we are moving towards a world [TS]

  in this in the first year where there's been more than one new i Phone the five c I don't think counts. [TS]

  This is the first year it has been more than one radically new i Phone And so you know if there's going to be like [TS]

  obviously the only new i Phone of the year is not going to be some big think battery monster [TS]

  but there is room in the lineup as you said for multiple entries and if they had say a third entry [TS]

  and it was a six plus plus ninety nine where it had an extra battery [TS]

  and everybody has in the back of that would be fine. That said we all keep saying oh yeah we want. [TS]

  We'd love that you've made a little thicker have more battery and battery twice as big or whatever [TS]

  but I'm not entirely sure that is what we would actually want like you know we we haven't held a device like that we [TS]

  don't know batteries are so frickin heavy that we don't know how that would actually feel. [TS]

  Apple has most likely tried this. They have labs they try lots of things. [TS]

  They've probably tried that you know let's see how big we can make the battery and balance that they can it's [TS]

  and I don't think they're bouncing in that way I think they had their design goals are based on. [TS]

  And thinner than last year as thin [TS]

  or thinner than last year I think he killed them to do the three with the extra back. [TS]

  Now and that's I agree [TS]

  and I think Jason snow also had a good point in his new show once a call I remember the number of things. [TS]

  Agreed yes on a great episode I believe it was [TS]

  and one he was talking about how like it seems like Apple has like a like a like a target battery life [TS]

  and I don't really feel the need to give more battery life then. Roughly what we have now. [TS]

  Well it's a minimum like it has to be as thin as last year or thinner and I think it has a good battery life [TS]

  or better and or better and Orson are always good [TS]

  but if you can't you know if you can reach those goals I think a barrier you can't be below that [TS]

  and they get they had to compromise for the first round and make it a little bit bigger than the two [TS]

  and that was all for them but you got to do what you gotta do. [TS]

  The thickness is mostly as new battery life [TS]

  but the way to where you're going tomorrow is the key point to someplace on a chair on the C.C. One M. [TS]

  Eighty two millimeter thinkers [TS]

  and you know that it still bends that's why I mentioned not just making if they're going to put in more room for the [TS]

  battery but also being willing to make it heavier. [TS]

  Have your what do you do with the heavier you could have your strengthening materials in there [TS]

  but the bottom line is all these things are bendable they're made of aluminum [TS]

  and glass aluminum Benza does not spring back like plastic does. [TS]

  Plastic shatters [TS]

  or breaks apart like you have you have to just not apply enough force on these things the bend I could take my i Pad [TS]

  put half on half off the table and lean on one end of it and break it like you know or bend it or damage [TS]

  and in some way and that's why I think pockets in the pocket ability of this becomes a factor [TS]

  or at the very least awareness of what's in your pocket [TS]

  and what forces are being applied to your bike just because you can kind of barely fit in your pocket [TS]

  and then you sit down on concrete and you feel a bunch of clunks or you feel that stretching in your pockets. [TS]

  Like don't ignore that feeling that it's not that they're not main made of adamantium or unobtainium [TS]

  or any other made up metal this is indestructible. [TS]

  They can bend and they can break and we know they can break when they drop them. [TS]

  We just you know we try to avoid dropping them we know they can. [TS]

  And when you plot the force in them don't put them in a pocket that's going to apply a lot of force to it. [TS]

  Yeah I think it's important to keep in mind two major factors. [TS]

  When Whenever anyone brings up a problem with the new i Phone which happens every year. [TS]

  Number one if you have to ask yourself Does this happen to every phone you know it's a problem with every cell phone [TS]

  that comes out and you know therefore it's kind of you know probably unavoidable or at least somewhat reasonable. [TS]

  Number two you have to consider that [TS]

  when the new i Phone comes out if you can show a flaw with it you'll get tons of attention you'll get tons of page [TS]

  views you'll get tons of ad money from those pages. [TS]

  You have a lot to gain by pointing out a major flaw in the new i Phone and this will happen every year. [TS]

  And people always try to figure out what that form might be. [TS]

  First it was the antenna thing on the i Phone four antenna was a much more solid case than bending because the antenna [TS]

  was like you don't need a weird use case. [TS]

  I can just round it like that and they're going to get with like well so that's fine [TS]

  but show me with other phones which is essentially what Apple did when they did their video. [TS]

  They didn't just say hey here's all the videos were here's my phone to let me wrap my hands around the denigrate the [TS]

  way I look at this no signal as like OK well then show me you know last year's i Phone or previous ones [TS]

  and somebody was eventually to do that but that's the key. [TS]

  Like if you can just do something [TS]

  and say in this bed you have to compare it to something that we either are familiar with [TS]

  or find acceptable which is why you know no one complained about bending with every single other I.O.'s device before. [TS]

  Maybe all of the previous I was devices were more bendable than the current range. [TS]

  We don't know because the comparison has been made all people care about it. [TS]

  Well I can bend this one if I try will hard. [TS]

  Well try to bend all the other ones or don't bother telling me anything but bending is a crazy right. [TS]

  Find other giant phones like you know try to bend the Samsung ones right of any age to see one such a couple of the [TS]

  older they develop like they built someone Benz N S four and you can see it. [TS]

  Comes the parts of the seams because it's not you know it's plastic [TS]

  and then eventually the screen cracks because the plastic allows more bending the aluminum does [TS]

  and once you bend the glass a certain amount of shatters you know you're right that it's all the sensationalism as you [TS]

  know this is from being the highest profile not the most popular in terms of sale [TS]

  but certainly the most popular in terms of like what people care about celebrity essentially i Phone [TS]

  and i was devices or the celebrity devices. [TS]

  Yeah that you're going to get a lot of interest in the story the show something bad about them [TS]

  but as a consumer there is an actual consumer angle here [TS]

  and the consumers want to know is this something I should care about [TS]

  or is it just one of those things in the way you do that is by saying how does it compare to products I previously [TS]

  owned that I know you're with and the best way to do that is to compare to previous i Phones or previous i Pads [TS]

  or something like that to say is it better worse or the same. [TS]

  Does that give consumers actual information and then they can choose to ignore it [TS]

  or not not based on the whole idea of like oh we're always complains about Apple stuff [TS]

  and so I should not pay attention or oh that darn Apple they're always doing bad things so this is terrible. [TS]

  Let me know. Is it worse than a five S. Better than five S. [TS]

  Are the same is by using information [TS]

  and I can say this person did this comprehensive test that compared against all your things [TS]

  and it turns out that the i Phones are no worse or better than any other one. [TS]

  Then I know I can ignore the story but I haven't seen that story and I get into arcs [TS]

  and like I stick it into my pocket and sit down with them [TS]

  but if that's the type of thing that you do you should be looking for a story that tells you whether this is a concern [TS]

  or not. [TS]

  So titles and it's a load bearing finger his critique actually where's your holier on Kasab [TS]

  or the low bank fingerless because I disagree with Casey's holding technique and I think he's right. [TS]

  Oh my God you know it's funny to me that both of you are the self declared official arbiters of everything of all the [TS]

  things your horizon is now I know I'm waiting. [TS]

  You're holding technique based on the things that you would measure a holding technique on one of the discomfort. [TS]

  One has to be clearly like this quite already around is arbitrary because you do it it's bad we're trained the way [TS]

  evaluate anything. [TS]

  What qualities of a of a way that you hold the phone are important might consider in which way of holding on is better [TS]

  than another. [TS]

  I don't even know what to say right now it's not the way you evaluate anything as if you know what are not you do. [TS]

  Again we get back to the invisible spreadsheet that's a bit of an orifice out there the spreadsheet may be invisible to [TS]

  you you may not have control over all the columns of numbers you may not be even aware that they exist but they do. [TS]