The Incomparable

233: Selective Amnesia


00:00:00   this episode of the incomparable is [TS]

00:00:02   brought to you by Squarespace [TS]

00:00:03   Squarespace recently launched the latest [TS]

00:00:06   version of their platform Squarespace 7 [TS]

00:00:08   which has a completely redesigned [TS]

00:00:09   interface integrations with getty images [TS]

00:00:11   in Google Apps 15 new templates and an [TS]

00:00:14   incredible feature called cover pages [TS]

00:00:15   try the new Squarespace with a free [TS]

00:00:17   trial at squarespace.com and enter offer [TS]

00:00:20   code smell at checkout to get ten [TS]

00:00:22   percent off [TS]

00:00:22   Squarespace start here go anywhere [TS]

00:00:28   the incomparable number 233 februari [TS]

00:00:36   welcome back everybody to be [TS]

00:00:37   uncomfortable podcast I'm your host [TS]

00:00:38   Jason Snell and I'm convening a special [TS]

00:00:42   edition of our comic book club i guess [TS]

00:00:44   i'm joined by comic book club stalwarts [TS]

00:00:47   Lisa Schmeisser Monty ashley and Andy an [TS]

00:00:50   odd co we're not actually talking about [TS]

00:00:52   a particular work in this in this [TS]

00:00:54   episode work we're going to be talking [TS]

00:00:56   about comic book continuity and [TS]

00:00:59   storytelling and business decisions made [TS]

00:01:01   by large publishing conglomerates [TS]

00:01:03   regarding their intellectual property [TS]

00:01:05   which actually i think is a really [TS]

00:01:06   interesting topic where you know I a few [TS]

00:01:09   weeks ago Marvel Comics announced that [TS]

00:01:10   they were going to be doing a kind of [TS]

00:01:14   capping off a story arc from their [TS]

00:01:16   Avengers comics and doing something new [TS]

00:01:19   that was going to lead to a new status [TS]

00:01:21   quo and they were going to do another [TS]

00:01:23   secret wars miniseries and oh and you [TS]

00:01:26   know and it seems like shut down the [TS]

00:01:28   Ultimate Universe and maybe do a soft [TS]

00:01:31   reboot of the existing marvel universe [TS]

00:01:32   and of course a couple years ago DC [TS]

00:01:36   Comics did the same thing with something [TS]

00:01:37   called the new 52 after their flashpoint [TS]

00:01:40   miniseries and actually as we record [TS]

00:01:42   this the today DC Comics announced that [TS]

00:01:45   they're doing another kind of thing that [TS]

00:01:49   is not the new 52 but it's like the old [TS]

00:01:51   25-22 or something like that [TS]

00:01:54   these are big companies obviously [TS]

00:01:56   Marvel's owned by disney and DC Comics [TS]

00:01:58   is owned by Warner but i just i think [TS]

00:02:01   it's interesting because we've got comic [TS]

00:02:04   storytelling and then we've got [TS]

00:02:06   corporate intellectual property and then [TS]

00:02:08   we've got kind of like marketing and [TS]

00:02:11   stunts that are used to sell comics and [TS]

00:02:14   i wanted to i want to talk about it i [TS]

00:02:16   wanted to start by just saying i am [TS]

00:02:18   actually a big fan of ultimate [TS]

00:02:21   spider-man so i guess since nothing else [TS]

00:02:23   has ever been successful in the ultimate [TS]

00:02:25   efforts that makes me a fan of The [TS]

00:02:28   Ultimate Universe and and I like the old [TS]

00:02:31   ultimate with Peter Parker and then they [TS]

00:02:33   killed him and brought back there [TS]

00:02:35   created Miles Morales is actually a fun [TS]

00:02:37   alternate spider-man and so from that [TS]

00:02:39   perspective it's a kind of a milestone [TS]

00:02:41   for me what Marvel's doing because it [TS]

00:02:43   seems like they're finally sort of [TS]

00:02:44   saying yeah we don't need that anymore [TS]

00:02:46   it's also true that a lot of the [TS]

00:02:48   influence of the ultimate [TS]

00:02:49   universes already been felt the marvel [TS]

00:02:51   cinematic universe is very ultimate spot [TS]

00:02:54   in Ultimate Universe and the mainstream [TS]

00:02:56   Marvel Universe has maybe in like how [TS]

00:02:59   did we not mentioned curious black he's [TS]

00:03:01   black now so they've done all of these [TS]

00:03:03   things to kind of adopt that so on that [TS]

00:03:06   level i'm i'm sort of sad that that this [TS]

00:03:08   interesting experiment is coming to an [TS]

00:03:11   end i also am i I've got a lot of [TS]

00:03:14   trepidation about the idea that they are [TS]

00:03:16   revisiting the secret wars because i was [TS]

00:03:18   a I was a comic book reader when the [TS]

00:03:20   original secret wars happened and it was [TS]

00:03:22   kind of from a storytelling standpoint I [TS]

00:03:25   mean yeah spider-man got a cool new [TS]

00:03:26   costume and all it was kind of a [TS]

00:03:28   disaster [TS]

00:03:29   it was like I feel like it was one of [TS]

00:03:31   the original comic book event disasters [TS]

00:03:33   and so to see them replaying it you're [TS]

00:03:36   talking about the series that got me [TS]

00:03:37   into comics because you're here is and I [TS]

00:03:40   know that it was inspired to sell it to [TS]

00:03:42   the celebrate new toy line synergy it [TS]

00:03:46   was we can sell comics and and toys that [TS]

00:03:48   level synergy football for that but you [TS]

00:03:50   had you had one event that said we're [TS]

00:03:51   gonna sample elements of everything that [TS]

00:03:53   we publish and put these characters all [TS]

00:03:55   together into one storyline that last [TS]

00:03:58   for exactly 12 issues that will tell a [TS]

00:03:59   complete story from the beginning middle [TS]

00:04:01   and end and has all these really cool [TS]

00:04:04   moments in the middle of it i will tell [TS]

00:04:06   you exactly the page that became that [TS]

00:04:08   turn me into like a fan of comics and [TS]

00:04:11   that's where dr. doom has stolen the [TS]

00:04:13   power of Galactus this good this cosmic [TS]

00:04:17   character that destroys planets so that [TS]

00:04:19   he can fight another entity that is the [TS]

00:04:22   entire the embodiment of an entire [TS]

00:04:24   universe because he is dr. do when he [TS]

00:04:26   figures well I bet I can steal his power [TS]

00:04:28   to and he fails in about a microsecond [TS]

00:04:31   not just failing but he is just being [TS]

00:04:34   torn apart molecule by molecule in this [TS]

00:04:37   amazing page being drawn by Mike sec in [TS]

00:04:40   which you see this this guy you've been [TS]

00:04:42   following for about eight issues nine [TS]

00:04:45   inches so far the real master plotter [TS]

00:04:48   and schemer of just this guy with a [TS]

00:04:50   nobility and ability to execute a plan [TS]

00:04:52   and this one page that I remember the [TS]

00:04:54   dialogue is being it's possible that now [TS]

00:04:57   that i'm being torn apart molecule by [TS]

00:04:59   molecule by force i can barely copy [TS]

00:05:01   and much less fight against this might [TS]

00:05:03   not have been a good plan next panel [TS]

00:05:06   wait a minute [TS]

00:05:07   the fact that i came up with this plan [TS]

00:05:08   meant that it has to be a good plan i'm [TS]

00:05:10   gonna stick with this let's talk to do [TS]

00:05:12   and and i'm looking into what happens [TS]

00:05:14   the rest of the issue but that's what I [TS]

00:05:16   i want to know more about this guy [TS]

00:05:18   I i know that I'd seen copies of [TS]

00:05:21   Fantastic Four before that little lately [TS]

00:05:24   Kirby issues and like later leaker be [TS]

00:05:26   issues [TS]

00:05:27   none of them really got me to really [TS]

00:05:29   find out what is more than about this [TS]

00:05:31   guy that said in a way that's totally [TS]

00:05:33   not arrogant it's just that you look [TS]

00:05:35   mean I have such confidence in my plans [TS]

00:05:37   of what I did that even though that now [TS]

00:05:40   I'm literally being dissected by this [TS]

00:05:43   universe that is trying to figure out [TS]

00:05:44   what it is that makes me so crazy [TS]

00:05:47   that's just what maybe into a fence it [TS]

00:05:48   had its desired effect on you which is [TS]

00:05:50   it provided you with a sort of a sampler [TS]

00:05:51   of what they had and that was n [TS]

00:05:53   attracted you to try it and it got you [TS]

00:05:55   into it right is this is this is less a [TS]

00:05:58   diatribe like defending secret wars as [TS]

00:06:00   an explanation that every series that [TS]

00:06:02   somebody absolutely hates might be that [TS]

00:06:06   series that not only just somebody like [TS]

00:06:08   but got somebody to flip them from not [TS]

00:06:11   being a fan of comments to somebody who [TS]

00:06:12   would you be coming to the complex shop [TS]

00:06:14   every single week Jim shooter not really [TS]

00:06:16   great with dialogue you mean value of [TS]

00:06:18   art is kind of subjective and highly [TS]

00:06:20   personal it's not absolutely positive [TS]

00:06:22   once that this podcast is over having [TS]

00:06:24   said that secret war two was awful that [TS]

00:06:27   was really atrocious yeah but I like [TS]

00:06:28   secret war because you had no masses of [TS]

00:06:32   villains and heroes fighting and it's [TS]

00:06:33   very straightforward you know my [TS]

00:06:34   pharmacy roars I mean Jim shooter not a [TS]

00:06:37   really great writer of least great [TS]

00:06:40   dialogue guy I'm it although he was the [TS]

00:06:43   editor-in-chief Marvel during the time [TS]

00:06:44   when i was reading all the Marvel Comics [TS]

00:06:45   part of my problem with it is that i [TS]

00:06:46   read contest of Champions which was a [TS]

00:06:49   three or four issue miniseries a couple [TS]

00:06:50   years before which was the whole idea [TS]

00:06:52   was what if we had a big tournament with [TS]

00:06:55   all the heroes and villains and they [TS]

00:06:56   fought each other and it was kind of a [TS]

00:06:58   really cool mini series although if you [TS]

00:07:00   read it carefully you realize that the [TS]

00:07:02   writer got confused about the score and [TS]

00:07:05   although was a victory for one side over [TS]

00:07:07   the other if you actually pay attention [TS]

00:07:08   to the issues it was a tie [TS]

00:07:11   oops uh um some of the real problems but [TS]

00:07:14   the problem I [TS]

00:07:15   and i think is a reader when Secret Wars [TS]

00:07:16   came around is that I felt like you guys [TS]

00:07:18   already do this story and they just did [TS]

00:07:21   it again but it wasn't it was it was in [TS]

00:07:24   many ways this incredibly influential [TS]

00:07:25   comic event and around the same time DC [TS]

00:07:28   did crisis on Infinite Earths which was [TS]

00:07:30   you know I was always a Marvel guy but I [TS]

00:07:32   always felt like the the crisis was [TS]

00:07:35   about continuity in a way that secret [TS]

00:07:37   wars wasn't and that was the value I I [TS]

00:07:39   think advantage of secret wars was that [TS]

00:07:41   it was literally the alright we know [TS]

00:07:43   what you want you want to see everybody [TS]

00:07:45   fight everybody else will do that again [TS]

00:07:47   we can do that for you like but then of [TS]

00:07:49   course secret war to the beyond her who [TS]

00:07:52   was the embodiment of this other [TS]

00:07:54   universe came to earth and just wandered [TS]

00:07:56   around through every single every single [TS]

00:07:58   comic every comic they had that was [TS]

00:08:00   percent with exciting adventures like [TS]

00:08:02   spider-man teaching him how to pee yeah [TS]

00:08:05   yeah he didn't understand that was body [TS]

00:08:07   yeah yeah i just read i just read one of [TS]

00:08:08   the secret wars two crossovers with the [TS]

00:08:10   x-men there was a very similar sort of [TS]

00:08:12   thing it's like months of plot line must [TS]

00:08:15   be put on hold so that we have a little [TS]

00:08:17   quirky tail with the beyond ER we have [TS]

00:08:20   to sell the copies but thank God that [TS]

00:08:23   Marvel doesn't do that these days to [TS]

00:08:25   know they don't every single crossover [TS]

00:08:27   is completely organic to the smarter [TS]

00:08:29   story are gonna tell ya but although i [TS]

00:08:32   was actually what was I just was I just [TS]

00:08:34   reading i was just reading something i [TS]

00:08:36   can't remember what Marvel event was and [TS]

00:08:38   I was actually i am reading the spider [TS]

00:08:41   vs event and although there are side [TS]

00:08:42   stories the bulk of that event is being [TS]

00:08:45   told inside amazing spider-man and I [TS]

00:08:47   don't feel the need for me I don't feel [TS]

00:08:50   the need to read the other titles they [TS]

00:08:53   feel like supplemental material and then [TS]

00:08:54   I I I very much feel like if i read [TS]

00:08:58   these eight inches of amazing spider-man [TS]

00:08:59   i'm going to get the story [TS]

00:09:01   whereas a lot of these events is very [TS]

00:09:03   much like a continued next week in [TS]

00:09:05   ant-man number 33 feel like I'm not [TS]

00:09:07   going to read and man number 33 what are [TS]

00:09:09   you talking about when you start who do [TS]

00:09:12   I know who buys these books long time I [TS]

00:09:14   had went well three powerpack get the [TS]

00:09:18   whole story now [TS]

00:09:19   feel like house of them comes up a lot [TS]

00:09:21   on comic book club at this but that was [TS]

00:09:25   one of the things that really ticked me [TS]

00:09:26   off when I was following it as they had [TS]

00:09:28   a million times 220 you have to see how [TS]

00:09:30   Captain America affair and House of M [TS]

00:09:32   spoiler not well they had all of these [TS]

00:09:35   different like one shots or all [TS]

00:09:37   histories or what have you and I i [TS]

00:09:39   finally went through and tighten up the [TS]

00:09:41   amount of money i had spent just just to [TS]

00:09:42   get something that was merely background [TS]

00:09:44   to one of the most epic and yet Daffy [TS]

00:09:48   things that universities ever done [TS]

00:09:50   Behrman I love house of them i love [TS]

00:09:52   making fun of it it's a complicated [TS]

00:09:54   relationship but and after that I [TS]

00:09:56   thought you know what I'm not ever doing [TS]

00:09:57   this again where I have to buy all these [TS]

00:09:59   different issues across all of these [TS]

00:10:00   different titles it doesn't suck me I [TS]

00:10:02   didn't become a captain america reader [TS]

00:10:04   after that just because I i saw one [TS]

00:10:06   issue of Steve Rogers looking sad in the [TS]

00:10:08   House of M universe or whatever every [TS]

00:10:10   comic book fan has that moment where [TS]

00:10:12   they say I'm not doing this again that [TS]

00:10:14   was by the way incomparable number 140 [TS]

00:10:17   we talked about house of them you can [TS]

00:10:19   you look at one out for me with the [TS]

00:10:20   Avengers disassembled it was the major [TS]

00:10:23   event that led into house of them and [TS]

00:10:25   that was the one that was I think [TS]

00:10:27   definitively broke me of trying to [TS]

00:10:29   follow Marvel series events because i [TS]

00:10:32   remember they ok so I i'm used to [TS]

00:10:35   everything was written by Bendis wasn't [TS]

00:10:38   it but so I i'm used to like been to [TS]

00:10:41   style plotting where there's gonna be a [TS]

00:10:42   lot of lurching forward and then this [TS]

00:10:44   basically idling for a while then [TS]

00:10:46   lurching forward and I know that's [TS]

00:10:48   that's his style that's the sort of [TS]

00:10:50   sticking with a stick with its ok I'm [TS]

00:10:52   what I'm like watching the clock like [TS]

00:10:54   kinda like when you're watching a movie [TS]

00:10:55   and you realize that oh gee there's the [TS]

00:10:58   right that I've got this this movie's [TS]

00:11:00   been going on for like 93 minutes and a [TS]

00:11:02   lot is going to have to happen in the [TS]

00:11:03   next 10 minutes but ok let's see what [TS]

00:11:05   happens [TS]

00:11:06   I'm I'm really aware of that as this is [TS]

00:11:08   going on cg he really only has an issue [TS]

00:11:11   and a half to close a lot of storylines [TS]

00:11:13   and I bet this is gonna be incredible [TS]

00:11:14   and then when I got to the last issue [TS]

00:11:16   and it's like something or I'm dr. [TS]

00:11:18   strange you haven't seen before this [TS]

00:11:20   entire series [TS]

00:11:21   let me explain exactly what has happened [TS]

00:11:22   and now I'll just take off with her you [TS]

00:11:25   won't find out what happened [TS]

00:11:26   oh really [TS]

00:11:29   how much money I spend on this to get [TS]

00:11:31   that and it's it just feels it the it [TS]

00:11:34   might I really fun everyone when I [TS]

00:11:37   really figured out about all these my [TS]

00:11:39   relation to all these mega series from [TS]

00:11:41   Marvel is that it really is like that [TS]

00:11:43   scene in a day at the races where [TS]

00:11:45   Groucho is gonna is buying a horse tip [TS]

00:11:48   from from from chico but the the tip a [TS]

00:11:52   dollar for is just like the name of the [TS]

00:11:54   horse in code without chicken will solve [TS]

00:11:56   the codebook to get to decode it decodes [TS]

00:11:58   and it's actually a jockey will [TS]

00:11:59   celebrate your sky that gives that finds [TS]

00:12:02   out that rock is another dollar as like [TS]

00:12:04   you just give me one unit of story that [TS]

00:12:07   doesn't involve me having to go [TS]

00:12:09   elsewhere to find out like what the [TS]

00:12:10   resolution to this is or find out why [TS]

00:12:12   was Peter Parker upset in this scene and [TS]

00:12:15   what if they are having a fight in this [TS]

00:12:17   panel can I mean I'm talking about like [TS]

00:12:18   an a disagreement that's that defines [TS]

00:12:20   character might not like about will not [TS]

00:12:22   come Sokka battle like what I just again [TS]

00:12:26   12 issues gimme gimme a beginning middle [TS]

00:12:28   and that's on all side episode 21 of the [TS]

00:12:30   uncomfortable as well where we talked [TS]

00:12:32   about special events and said many of [TS]

00:12:33   the complaint about many he's hesitating [TS]

00:12:35   matter Jason the pain is still better [TS]

00:12:38   really this is an opportunity for for [TS]

00:12:40   comics fans to to get social and [TS]

00:12:44   interact with their friends in real time [TS]

00:12:45   though because just as I have the same [TS]

00:12:47   the deeply held theory that we should [TS]

00:12:49   have comics comics readers should do [TS]

00:12:51   what what lots of middle-aged ladies who [TS]

00:12:53   like wine do and have book clubs you [TS]

00:12:54   know I'm I seriously think she drink [TS]

00:12:56   heavily and read comics and talk about [TS]

00:12:58   them i feel like this is something more [TS]

00:12:59   comic fans should do because i mentioned [TS]

00:13:02   comic book clubs a couple people who [TS]

00:13:03   read comics like that's a great idea and [TS]

00:13:05   ice there's nothing stopping you from [TS]

00:13:07   doing this with your friend like a [TS]

00:13:08   support group you think you're saying [TS]

00:13:10   maybe 10 or injury [TS]

00:13:12   it's a drinking Club with a book problem [TS]

00:13:14   but the other thing again i firmly [TS]

00:13:18   believe that what you have to do is you [TS]

00:13:19   have to get together like a group of [TS]

00:13:20   three or four friends and when there are [TS]

00:13:22   these mega events you split the burden [TS]

00:13:24   and what if he was like yeah I will take [TS]

00:13:25   one for the team and by the floor and [TS]

00:13:28   another one of you says okay fine [TS]

00:13:29   three-part daredevil whatever and you [TS]

00:13:32   all and everybody takes turns buying the [TS]

00:13:34   issues and then you pull them all [TS]

00:13:36   together and you read them [TS]

00:13:37   this is a great opportunity for you to [TS]

00:13:39   increase your real-world social [TS]

00:13:41   connection [TS]

00:13:42   doesn't interact with people and you're [TS]

00:13:43   not just spending a lot of money than [TS]

00:13:44   being angry on the internet you can be [TS]

00:13:46   angry in somebody's house was drinking [TS]

00:13:48   wine it smell like me the wine makes you [TS]

00:13:50   less angry what this is one that's it [TS]

00:13:54   you may not be drinking enough of it [TS]

00:13:55   no I'm not trust me I've done [TS]

00:13:58   experiments it took time to take a brief [TS]

00:14:01   break and i will tell you about our [TS]

00:14:03   sponsor Squarespace you know building a [TS]

00:14:06   website used to take a lot of time took [TS]

00:14:08   a lot of different skills you have to [TS]

00:14:09   set it all up manually spend all day [TS]

00:14:11   troubleshooting yet to set up server [TS]

00:14:13   information you don't know how to do [TS]

00:14:15   HTML maybe CSS easy to break things hard [TS]

00:14:19   to learn now we don't need that we don't [TS]

00:14:21   need that anymore because now we have [TS]

00:14:23   Squarespace which lets you make [TS]

00:14:24   beautiful websites without a sweat [TS]

00:14:26   you don't need to know all the super [TS]

00:14:27   technical details although if you do [TS]

00:14:29   know those you can customize it to your [TS]

00:14:31   heart's content and you may have heard [TS]

00:14:33   about the new version of Squarespace [TS]

00:14:35   Squarespace seven it's got integration [TS]

00:14:38   with Google Apps if you need to connect [TS]

00:14:40   your domains to your email spreadsheets [TS]

00:14:42   and other stuff [TS]

00:14:43   it's in there there's a great [TS]

00:14:44   partnership with getty images for ten [TS]

00:14:46   dollars and image you get great [TS]

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00:14:55   they look great on desktops they're [TS]

00:14:56   responsive so they also look great on [TS]

00:14:57   phones and tablets now Squarespace did [TS]

00:15:00   something really cool for the superbowl [TS]

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00:15:04   bridges actor Jeff Bridges who created [TS]

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00:15:24   purchase and to show your support for [TS]

00:15:25   the podcast that's promo code smell and [TS]

00:15:28   visit dreaming with Jeff com Squarespace [TS]

00:15:31   start here go anywhere so so events ok [TS]

00:15:35   events are problematic so I let's throw [TS]

00:15:38   in the event as continuity altar because [TS]

00:15:42   like I said DC has led the way here DC [TS]

00:15:45   with all of its various crises and then [TS]

00:15:47   the flashpoint thing to has used events [TS]

00:15:51   as ways to actually deal with parallel [TS]

00:15:53   universes and imaginary whatever [TS]

00:15:55   zend and continuity which is something [TS]

00:15:58   that Marvel hasn't done although it [TS]

00:16:00   sounds to me like this is where they've [TS]

00:16:02   been leading for several years with [TS]

00:16:03   jonathan jonathan hickman's run in [TS]

00:16:05   adventures in New Avengers which I don't [TS]

00:16:07   know if any of you have read it I've [TS]

00:16:09   read a lot of it on Marvel unlimited so [TS]

00:16:11   I'm that means I'm like a month behind [TS]

00:16:13   but I actually think it's kind of good [TS]

00:16:15   at it but it's sort of a pre-event it's [TS]

00:16:19   like I think I think a lot of what we've [TS]

00:16:21   seen Marvel do in the last couple of [TS]

00:16:22   years has been with the knowledge of its [TS]

00:16:24   creative team that they're about to hit [TS]

00:16:26   a reset button and and Hickman story is [TS]

00:16:29   the driver and as a science fiction [TS]

00:16:31   story within Avengers I think it's [TS]

00:16:34   actually kind of interesting and fun but [TS]

00:16:37   you do have that ripoff feeling two of [TS]

00:16:41   the this idea that the reason that some [TS]

00:16:43   of the storytelling has been happening [TS]

00:16:44   is because they realize they've got a [TS]

00:16:46   get-out-of-jail-free card coming in a [TS]

00:16:47   couple of years and have you seen what [TS]

00:16:49   they're doing after this they announced [TS]

00:16:51   a force today [TS]

00:16:53   oh I have a doctor about that i think [TS]

00:16:54   and force yeah and we should talk about [TS]

00:16:56   that i think a force is during this [TS]

00:17:00   they're announcing a lot of things that [TS]

00:17:01   are happening during the secret wars era [TS]

00:17:03   before [TS]

00:17:04   presumably it gets resolved when they're [TS]

00:17:06   all unlike battleworld and continuities [TS]

00:17:09   all confused and they're different [TS]

00:17:11   worlds from different parts of time and [TS]

00:17:13   space and in there they've announced it [TS]

00:17:15   is a force which is an all-woman [TS]

00:17:17   Avengers team that's being written by [TS]

00:17:20   willow Wilson who does miss marvel and i [TS]

00:17:23   forget the name of the other writer but [TS]

00:17:25   that's it's kinda and dazzlers in it [TS]

00:17:27   which excites me because i have all [TS]

00:17:28   issues of the eighties dazzle comments [TS]

00:17:30   your me big Allyson Blair fan here sorry [TS]

00:17:34   is not aligned with Cheney found that [TS]

00:17:36   would just be interested in [TS]

00:17:36   understanding and defensive line with [TS]

00:17:38   child of the 80s you know if you make [TS]

00:17:40   you make him loud enough noise Allison [TS]

00:17:42   blaring fire lasers out of her hands [TS]

00:17:44   I'm going to make a wall and she's a [TS]

00:17:46   rock star so she's usually around loud [TS]

00:17:48   noise is what I'm saying she used to be [TS]

00:17:50   the roadie for Lila Cheney and the only [TS]

00:17:52   reason i bring that up is because i'm [TS]

00:17:54   rereading my original run of New Mutants [TS]

00:17:56   and I've just going to the really boring [TS]

00:17:58   if she were saying Guthrie can't believe [TS]

00:18:00   he's dating a rock star but the a force [TS]

00:18:03   that has been feel similar to the the [TS]

00:18:04   female Thor announcement well there's [TS]

00:18:06   also don't forget the x-men team up that [TS]

00:18:08   they've got going [TS]

00:18:08   onto where they've got that all female [TS]

00:18:11   x.x men with Betsy Braddock and the [TS]

00:18:14   vampire g believe hurts me to say that [TS]

00:18:17   in storm one fascinated by the costumes [TS]

00:18:21   on the a force image that they put out [TS]

00:18:23   because it's from as they had kind of [TS]

00:18:26   implied for secret wars it's from all [TS]

00:18:28   over continuity yeah she hulk appears to [TS]

00:18:31   be wearing her fantastic four outfit [TS]

00:18:33   yeah that's clearly the Jean Grey [TS]

00:18:35   Phoenix which is right in my commonweal [TS]

00:18:38   house while room we have also spider [TS]

00:18:40   went in the background there [TS]

00:18:41   yeah I do like that they've got a new [TS]

00:18:43   commander oh so the book from runaways [TS]

00:18:46   yes that's why I'm excited about is I [TS]

00:18:47   think they've done a real i think one of [TS]

00:18:49   the things Marvel has done right in the [TS]

00:18:50   past decade is the integrated Runaways [TS]

00:18:53   into the wider marvel universe in a [TS]

00:18:55   really elegant naturalistic way and it's [TS]

00:18:58   plausible [TS]

00:18:59   they have this new character singularity [TS]

00:19:00   who's like be living embodiment of it of [TS]

00:19:03   a universe or something like that who's [TS]

00:19:05   the one who's just a silhouette with [TS]

00:19:06   stars sounds like Captain universe to me [TS]

00:19:08   but sounds like century to me you've [TS]

00:19:11   also got the Monica Rambeau Captain [TS]

00:19:12   Marvel all the way in the background [TS]

00:19:14   there or along with carol danvers count [TS]

00:19:16   and I think nineteen nineties rogue if [TS]

00:19:18   I'm looking at that hearing is that [TS]

00:19:20   Natasha Romanoff way in the back there [TS]

00:19:22   maybe although who it's hard to tell it [TS]

00:19:24   could also be she's got the pistols and [TS]

00:19:26   marriage license from an alternate [TS]

00:19:27   reality where she's a spy for all [TS]

00:19:29   shipping ends the multiverses are all [TS]

00:19:31   collapsing as i understand it sits there [TS]

00:19:34   match them all together and since only [TS]

00:19:35   one ultimate ultimate haha only one [TS]

00:19:38   final one can exist or there basically [TS]

00:19:40   going to mix and match this is it's [TS]

00:19:42   brilliant [TS]

00:19:43   I love what they're doing because this [TS]

00:19:45   is going to be how Marvel manages to get [TS]

00:19:47   a whole bunch of fan favorite characters [TS]

00:19:48   into the movies here here's the other [TS]

00:19:50   way you could tell the stories like this [TS]

00:19:51   is just let people tell the stories they [TS]

00:19:53   want to tell ya [TS]

00:19:54   instead of having to build an event and [TS]

00:19:56   talk about imaginary universes colliding [TS]

00:19:58   to get interesting versions of [TS]

00:20:00   characters get it you could just tell [TS]

00:20:02   stories with interesting set of [TS]

00:20:03   characters and not worry about [TS]

00:20:04   continuity why is it having to tell [TS]

00:20:07   having to do an event events are fun [TS]

00:20:10   masonry since we've already talked about [TS]

00:20:12   how they're financially about fraudulent [TS]

00:20:15   and people are are irritated by the [TS]

00:20:17   inclusion by the disruption of perfectly [TS]

00:20:20   normal plot lines for stuff that makes [TS]

00:20:21   no sense for three issues [TS]

00:20:22   is that but again advanced events can be [TS]

00:20:24   fun I'm actually having a lot of fun [TS]

00:20:26   reading spider vs because it is fun it [TS]

00:20:28   is a it is end and I think maybe this is [TS]

00:20:32   one way the Marvel has learned some [TS]

00:20:33   lessons is that these events now seem to [TS]

00:20:35   be more or less driven by a by a single [TS]

00:20:38   riders so like hickman is driving the [TS]

00:20:41   secret worst thing that has been driving [TS]

00:20:43   the adventures thing and uh what is it a [TS]

00:20:47   is dan slott is driving the the spider [TS]

00:20:50   vs stuff and that makes it a little more [TS]

00:20:53   cohesive so I think events can be fun [TS]

00:20:55   events can also feel like huge amount of [TS]

00:20:57   work that are put together by [TS]

00:20:59   calculations about how much money you [TS]

00:21:01   can make and those are generally a lot [TS]

00:21:04   less fun and that took and that's okay [TS]

00:21:06   too but what bothers me about this one [TS]

00:21:08   is that it you get into you absolutely [TS]

00:21:11   do get into the the black Nick Fury [TS]

00:21:14   situation where there is life [TS]

00:21:17   it's a sign or something whatever move [TS]

00:21:20   yeah it's like it's like when they [TS]

00:21:23   decided that it was inconvenient to have [TS]

00:21:25   Peter Parker married and so I can [TS]

00:21:28   understand that I gotta say you're [TS]

00:21:30   publishing company i was just much much [TS]

00:21:31   rather see like a little graphic [TS]

00:21:33   representation of a post-it note on page [TS]

00:21:35   one of the whatever the next book is [TS]

00:21:36   saying hi guys lets just understand that [TS]

00:21:39   from now on let's just pretend this [TS]

00:21:40   marriage never happened is that they [TS]

00:21:42   have to create those all this apparatus [TS]

00:21:44   and they have to put the have to put [TS]

00:21:45   these people like I'm on the view at one [TS]

00:21:49   late night talk show say you know know [TS]

00:21:50   this had nothing to do with the fact [TS]

00:21:52   that we wanted to be able to market our [TS]

00:21:53   characters through the movies and [TS]

00:21:54   television a lot more efficiently this [TS]

00:21:56   really was just an organic decision we [TS]

00:21:58   made that was completely creatively [TS]

00:22:00   different wasn't this is its out its it [TS]

00:22:03   feels better when you feel as though [TS]

00:22:05   like crisis on Infinite Earths when they [TS]

00:22:07   really did feel like this is way too [TS]

00:22:09   complicated that we've got Superman on [TS]

00:22:11   trunk Superman of 18 different earths we [TS]

00:22:13   have to explain which one came from [TS]

00:22:15   which one we feel as though as as [TS]

00:22:17   editors and as writers would like to [TS]

00:22:18   have a more cohesive universe that's [TS]

00:22:20   what we did with this one it feels like [TS]

00:22:22   we really really really really really [TS]

00:22:24   want to have the young Fantastic Four [TS]

00:22:26   because that's more marketable we really [TS]

00:22:29   really really really want to have a half [TS]

00:22:31   miles morales as the new spider-man and [TS]

00:22:33   we really really really wanted to be [TS]

00:22:35   able to do X [TS]

00:22:35   Ben comics without ever having to say [TS]

00:22:37   the word x-men because then we can [TS]

00:22:38   promote our movies better [TS]

00:22:40   well really i think it's just a lot of [TS]

00:22:42   effort to bring Wolverine back to life [TS]

00:22:44   because there's no way they're coming [TS]

00:22:46   out of this with the dead Wolverine I [TS]

00:22:47   heard somebody who said this is all this [TS]

00:22:50   is gonna be like a hundred comic books [TS]

00:22:52   in order to import Miles Morales into [TS]

00:22:55   the mainstream [TS]

00:22:55   normal university and it's like oh well [TS]

00:22:57   all that's changed is that miles is here [TS]

00:22:59   and maybe a couple other little changes [TS]

00:23:01   and I guess we're done [TS]

00:23:02   meanwhile I have to say today the [TS]

00:23:05   editor-in-chief of of DC Comics and [TS]

00:23:08   their announcement said in this new era [TS]

00:23:10   of storytelling ok it's you read the [TS]

00:23:13   press release i guess this new era story [TS]

00:23:15   will trump continuity as we continue to [TS]

00:23:17   empower creators to tell the best [TS]

00:23:19   stories in the industry i found this [TS]

00:23:20   kind of a fascinating statement [TS]

00:23:22   especially bc which all of those stories [TS]

00:23:24   have been about continuity i would not [TS]

00:23:25   love it [TS]

00:23:26   story will trump continuity what what is [TS]

00:23:29   happening i feel that way more [TS]

00:23:31   interesting than any marbles as [TS]

00:23:32   announced by more excited DC this area [TS]

00:23:34   and Marvel because because again not to [TS]

00:23:36   repeat what I'm saying with Marvel I [TS]

00:23:38   feel like now get to buy a hundred [TS]

00:23:40   dollars for the comics to figure out a [TS]

00:23:41   new status quo that's been done just so [TS]

00:23:43   that the editors can the Lord is nikka [TS]

00:23:46   bibbidi-bobbidi-boo themselves into a [TS]

00:23:47   much more marketable universe that what [TS]

00:23:50   i got from the DC announcement was that [TS]

00:23:52   we're gonna have we're going to a [TS]

00:23:53   bat-mite book we're going to do a Black [TS]

00:23:55   Canary book and we're gonna have we're [TS]

00:23:57   gonna have individual books you're gonna [TS]

00:23:58   just want to see you don't even need to [TS]

00:24:00   care about whatever is happening [TS]

00:24:01   elsewhere in DC this is a good place to [TS]

00:24:03   jump on that sort i might be wrong but [TS]

00:24:05   that's the impression that i got from DC [TS]

00:24:07   so that thing that keeps banging around [TS]

00:24:08   my head because we're talking about [TS]

00:24:10   continuity is how many of you guys are [TS]

00:24:11   familiar with our three alleged Miriam [TS]

00:24:13   you are [TS]

00:24:15   yeah and 17 Camelot I hitting Enter [TS]

00:24:18   spamalot so you guys so you know our [TS]

00:24:20   Arthur's been around for forever right [TS]

00:24:22   there is law governs brute there's the [TS]

00:24:24   murder there's the murder the lip [TS]

00:24:26   Murray's lay there's more to Arthur but [TS]

00:24:29   the point is is they're all these [TS]

00:24:31   different interpretations of our that go [TS]

00:24:33   on and there's endless iterations for [TS]

00:24:35   example in the earliest historic [TS]

00:24:36   Arthurian legends its there's no [TS]

00:24:39   Lancelot it's that going to be runs off [TS]

00:24:42   with Mordred and then one last like it's [TS]

00:24:44   introduced in the more to our through he [TS]

00:24:45   all but you know the dynamics the story [TS]

00:24:47   change the point is is [TS]

00:24:48   the elements are all there and it's just [TS]

00:24:51   good storytelling every time right up [TS]

00:24:53   through th once the once and future king [TS]

00:24:54   and then when the definitive 21st [TS]

00:24:56   century Arthur comes out it will be done [TS]

00:24:57   differently again and I was thinking [TS]

00:24:59   about this in context with comics and I [TS]

00:25:01   thought I think the reason why I keep [TS]

00:25:02   coming back is because continuity [TS]

00:25:04   matters less than the elements of the [TS]

00:25:05   story and as long as you're telling me a [TS]

00:25:08   good black canary story or you're [TS]

00:25:09   telling me a good Batman story or a good [TS]

00:25:11   green arrow story or as long as you're [TS]

00:25:13   telling me you're really great run away [TS]

00:25:14   story i'm not really gonna be like oh I [TS]

00:25:17   happen to get the joke on panel 18 [TS]

00:25:19   because I to bought all a dishes of the [TS]

00:25:22   watcher crossover series last year [TS]

00:25:24   that's not the important thing about [TS]

00:25:26   continuity though cut continuity is cool [TS]

00:25:29   and helps the storytelling because it's [TS]

00:25:32   nice to have a character with a history [TS]

00:25:34   that if i read offend test [TS]

00:25:37   I don't actually fantastic for right now [TS]

00:25:39   but if I did if it didn't the fact that [TS]

00:25:41   the characters have this but 50-year [TS]

00:25:44   history of things that have happened to [TS]

00:25:46   them not only informed the way they act [TS]

00:25:48   but informs my knowledge of them it's [TS]

00:25:52   not just let's tell the story as though [TS]

00:25:54   these characters were born out of Zeus's [TS]

00:25:57   forehead today [TS]

00:25:59   yeah and against I mean this is the line [TS]

00:26:01   I mean this is the line they all walk [TS]

00:26:03   Marvel used to not worry about this [TS]

00:26:05   continuity quite so much and it's events [TS]

00:26:07   weren't about it in DC's were and now [TS]

00:26:09   with DC making the statement it seems [TS]

00:26:11   like they're trying to go go the other [TS]

00:26:13   direction and empower their creators [TS]

00:26:14   which i think is really smart from a [TS]

00:26:16   business standpoint because i think that [TS]

00:26:17   you know getting really good writers and [TS]

00:26:21   artists especially the writers to work [TS]

00:26:24   on Marvel and DC characters you want to [TS]

00:26:26   give them reasons to tell interesting [TS]

00:26:28   stories and get the mix excited about it [TS]

00:26:31   and and and while while Marvel with the [TS]

00:26:34   success of their movies has become more [TS]

00:26:37   enslaved I think into this idea of [TS]

00:26:39   having everything connect together and [TS]

00:26:42   and so I think that's to the detriment [TS]

00:26:44   of the storytelling to be honest well [TS]

00:26:46   it's agree it's I think it's a continuum [TS]

00:26:48   because I agree with Monty there is [TS]

00:26:51   richness in its the richness of a TV [TS]

00:26:53   series it's it's the richness of being [TS]

00:26:55   able to say remember what happened [TS]

00:26:58   you've been with these people for 10 [TS]

00:27:00   years remember what happened ten years [TS]

00:27:01   no there is there is there's power in [TS]

00:27:04   that there's some short hand in that I [TS]

00:27:06   can appreciate that but you end up with [TS]

00:27:08   so much of that you're precluded [TS]

00:27:10   yourself from telling other stories and [TS]

00:27:12   and if you tie it into every other comic [TS]

00:27:15   that you published over the last 20 [TS]

00:27:16   years you are you have made it [TS]

00:27:19   impossible to do anything because [TS]

00:27:21   continuities in the way so I mean that [TS]

00:27:24   was one of the reasons why i was a fan [TS]

00:27:25   of The Ultimate Universe is it stripped [TS]

00:27:27   the characters back to their core [TS]

00:27:28   without having to actually conform to [TS]

00:27:31   any history [TS]

00:27:32   ironically enough of course over 15 [TS]

00:27:34   years you're going to get history that [TS]

00:27:36   happened to the Ultimate Universe too so [TS]

00:27:38   I I see both sides here it's like I [TS]

00:27:40   understand the value of continuity [TS]

00:27:42   within reason but I also you know I also [TS]

00:27:46   roll my eyes at the fact that you know [TS]

00:27:47   this eternal present that they talk [TS]

00:27:49   about where you know everybody has [TS]

00:27:51   always been the age they are today in [TS]

00:27:53   the present day but you know but and [TS]

00:27:56   continuity where Spiderman was a team [TS]

00:27:58   was a you know teenager or college [TS]

00:28:00   student in the mid-seventies is still [TS]

00:28:02   real but how about sliding timescale [TS]

00:28:05   yeah everything happened to the last 20 [TS]

00:28:07   years or so I don't think people are [TS]

00:28:09   demanding that but i think i think the [TS]

00:28:12   Ultimate Universe is really a excellent [TS]

00:28:13   example of the sort of continuity that's [TS]

00:28:15   actually valuable where of ultimate [TS]

00:28:18   spider-man is probably the only book of [TS]

00:28:20   that entire experiment that had any [TS]

00:28:22   value in the long run I great and I look [TS]

00:28:25   at the Fantastic Four where they took [TS]

00:28:27   the core concept where more people with [TS]

00:28:29   the for people with the a web of [TS]

00:28:33   proceeding relationships suffer an [TS]

00:28:35   accident together and there they they go [TS]

00:28:38   through the the effects of did dealing [TS]

00:28:40   with what they are after this accident [TS]

00:28:41   if you back that up with all of the not [TS]

00:28:44   the details of the stories have been [TS]

00:28:46   happening for 50 years but the sum total [TS]

00:28:49   of what these characters are after 50 [TS]

00:28:51   characters 50 years you have something [TS]

00:28:53   really really valuable if you then [TS]

00:28:55   decide well how about we suddenly decide [TS]

00:28:57   that Reed Richards goes nuts and now [TS]

00:28:59   he's a member megalomaniacal super super [TS]

00:29:02   villains you're into that temporarily oh [TS]

00:29:04   that was that's that little bit but it [TS]

00:29:07   wasn't fantastic four it's like it's [TS]

00:29:09   like you can't take the label off a can [TS]

00:29:11   of coke and put it on whatever you want [TS]

00:29:12   and call it coke you may as well create [TS]

00:29:14   something brand-new [TS]

00:29:15   so this is actually a debate that we [TS]

00:29:16   have over on the flash flash cast almost [TS]

00:29:18   weekly and cross-promotion it is to get [TS]

00:29:21   the TV podcast where Lisa and Tony and [TS]

00:29:24   Emily was suppose that we talk we break [TS]

00:29:27   down without the flash see this is like [TS]

00:29:29   the continuity it's uncomfortable [TS]

00:29:31   continuity hear ya the debate that we [TS]

00:29:32   have on the flash flash cast every week [TS]

00:29:34   because in dollars really good about [TS]

00:29:36   picking up stuff from the comics he's [TS]

00:29:39   very flash fluent and the debate we have [TS]

00:29:41   is do you really want to know that much [TS]

00:29:43   about continuity and what these [TS]

00:29:44   characters have done or do you want to [TS]

00:29:46   go in and just see where the story takes [TS]

00:29:48   you and then once it's done appreciate [TS]

00:29:51   how they pulled in continuity or not [TS]

00:29:53   in other words is it better to go and [TS]

00:29:54   flying blind or is it better to go in [TS]

00:29:56   with the context and the richness that [TS]

00:29:58   you guys are talking about the trick [TS]

00:30:00   with that what the what the WB shows are [TS]

00:30:02   doing is they are to using their mining [TS]

00:30:04   rich source material to tell whatever [TS]

00:30:06   story they want however they want them [TS]

00:30:08   and that's very much like the ultimate [TS]

00:30:09   spider-man at least or lawyers genius [TS]

00:30:12   about this because they literally lifted [TS]

00:30:14   from both from the year one miniseries [TS]

00:30:17   that was I think just five or six issues [TS]

00:30:18   and then my girls runs and they they've [TS]

00:30:23   done it so well that even you know and [TS]

00:30:25   I've read them i I've read all these [TS]

00:30:26   drones and even when i'm watching this [TS]

00:30:28   series I almost can't tell when they've [TS]

00:30:29   lifted something until after it's [TS]

00:30:31   sending them like oh yeah and to me that [TS]

00:30:33   that is really great storytelling [TS]

00:30:34   because it gets back to the elements it [TS]

00:30:37   still makes me feel like continuities [TS]

00:30:38   almost a reward for paying attention as [TS]

00:30:40   opposed to this relationship you build [TS]

00:30:42   up with the character for knowing them [TS]

00:30:44   for so many years but i can see the [TS]

00:30:47   point that you guys have regarding how [TS]

00:30:50   having however many years worth of [TS]

00:30:52   knowledge of this character may enhance [TS]

00:30:55   or add weight to some of the [TS]

00:30:57   developments that happened in the story [TS]

00:30:58   maybe continuity is the wrong word maybe [TS]

00:31:01   maybe a better would be equity when I [TS]

00:31:04   really feel as though certain books they [TS]

00:31:05   build up equity as they go along like [TS]

00:31:08   you want to create stockholm story one [TS]

00:31:10   way to do it is the way that the BBC did [TS]

00:31:13   Sherlock recently with Benedict [TS]

00:31:14   Cumberbatch where you do something very [TS]

00:31:16   very conservative very recognizable as [TS]

00:31:18   sherlock holmes and that all you did was [TS]

00:31:20   let's set him in modern-day London and [TS]

00:31:23   let's make Watson a veteran of even more [TS]

00:31:26   of a [TS]

00:31:26   our modern afghan war than older one [TS]

00:31:29   another way of doing it is well what if [TS]

00:31:31   we make him an American doctor in New [TS]

00:31:33   Jersey and he's and the solves mysteries [TS]

00:31:36   that are medical in nature that's also [TS]

00:31:39   sherlock holmes and your building upon [TS]

00:31:41   the equity of the character however once [TS]

00:31:43   you start to say well what if he's a C's [TS]

00:31:46   actually a serial killer and uses [TS]

00:31:48   expertise in serial killing to make him [TS]

00:31:50   a better better detective you've created [TS]

00:31:52   something wonderful but it's not [TS]

00:31:53   Sherlock Holmes and that's that when we [TS]

00:31:56   do reboots like this and when you decide [TS]

00:31:58   what if we suddenly make again Reed [TS]

00:32:00   Richards a total jerk and is arrogant [TS]

00:32:02   and he just wants doesn't care will [TS]

00:32:04   probably already every freakin be an [TS]

00:32:07   arrogant jerk but he's not a monster [TS]

00:32:08   that's when that's when you're saying [TS]

00:32:10   that that's what I'm saying it may as [TS]

00:32:11   well not even call it the the your [TS]

00:32:13   misrepresented the product i think let [TS]

00:32:15   me tell you about our next sponsor its [TS]

00:32:18   mail route I've told you about them [TS]

00:32:20   before [TS]

00:32:21   imagine a world without spam or viruses [TS]

00:32:24   or bounced email imagine--open your [TS]

00:32:26   email and seeing only the legitimate [TS]

00:32:28   mail that you want and need to receive [TS]

00:32:29   imagine no more friend this is the world [TS]

00:32:32   that i have been living in the last two [TS]

00:32:35   years and it's because mail route is in [TS]

00:32:37   the cloud working for me in the cloud [TS]

00:32:40   means I didn't install any hardware [TS]

00:32:42   I don't maintain any software mail route [TS]

00:32:45   receives my mail it sorts it uses its [TS]

00:32:47   intelligence to determine what is valid [TS]

00:32:50   and what is invalid mail and then only [TS]

00:32:52   the valid mail gets passed on to my sir [TS]

00:32:54   mail server and to my inbox so it's easy [TS]

00:32:57   to set up its reliable I have never had [TS]

00:33:00   a problem with mail route and it's not [TS]

00:33:02   just me [TS]

00:33:03   large universities and corporations [TS]

00:33:05   trust mail route to filter their mail as [TS]

00:33:08   a desktop user you'll find mail routes [TS]

00:33:09   user interface is simple and effective i [TS]

00:33:11   love getting my little sample of what [TS]

00:33:13   has been filtered out by me around I can [TS]

00:33:15   look at it I can laugh at all the spam [TS]

00:33:17   i'm not getting and if i do see [TS]

00:33:19   something which very rarely happens that [TS]

00:33:21   I actually want to receive i click one [TS]

00:33:23   button boom it's in my inbox and that [TS]

00:33:25   person is whitelisted so I'm going to be [TS]

00:33:27   able to get their mail from that time [TS]

00:33:29   forward if you're an email administrator [TS]

00:33:31   or an IT professional their tools with [TS]

00:33:33   you in mind there's an API for easy [TS]

00:33:34   account management mail route supports [TS]

00:33:36   ldap Active Directory TLS male bagging [TS]

00:33:39   outbound [TS]

00:33:40   relay everything you want from the [TS]

00:33:41   people handling your mail so go today [TS]

00:33:43   and start a risk-free trialno credit [TS]

00:33:45   card necessary [TS]

00:33:46   signup change your MX records to go [TS]

00:33:48   through mail route and your mailbox and [TS]

00:33:51   hardware will be completely protected [TS]

00:33:53   it's simple and effective there's no [TS]

00:33:54   good reason not to try it all listeners [TS]

00:33:57   to the incomparable received ten percent [TS]

00:33:59   off of a lifetime of your account go to [TS]

00:34:01   mail route dot net / Snell now that's [TS]

00:34:04   mail route dotnet / smell and taking the [TS]

00:34:07   mail route for filtering my mail and [TS]

00:34:09   sponsoring the uncomfortable by the way [TS]

00:34:11   you should treat you should check out [TS]

00:34:12   Watson homes which is a a and elevate [TS]

00:34:16   the code word is it's an urban Sherlock [TS]

00:34:18   Holmes but what it is is is holmes and [TS]

00:34:20   watson are black in new york city urban [TS]

00:34:23   healers and yeah I know example this is [TS]

00:34:25   how they market it right but it's [TS]

00:34:26   actually it's actually a really cool [TS]

00:34:28   comic really cool comic where that we're [TS]

00:34:30   Watson is the main character and they [TS]

00:34:32   are they are in Harlem solving crimes [TS]

00:34:36   and and Watson is a an Air Force veteran [TS]

00:34:40   whose return to the inner city and it's [TS]

00:34:42   actually kind of great but there and [TS]

00:34:43   you're right the the Sherlock Holmes is [TS]

00:34:45   a serial killer and write it is holmes [TS]

00:34:48   and watson with a little spin on you [TS]

00:34:49   I think equity is a really nice when I [TS]

00:34:51   love ultimate spider-man because it is [TS]

00:34:53   retailing the the spider-man story and [TS]

00:34:57   it's got it is a spider-man story but it [TS]

00:34:59   is not burdened it with having to set [TS]

00:35:03   take it take for granted all of these [TS]

00:35:05   all of these a basic assumptions of [TS]

00:35:08   where we are in continuity time but it [TS]

00:35:11   just goes back to the beginning and says [TS]

00:35:12   look let's just tell the story again and [TS]

00:35:14   let's start fresh and let's do the Clone [TS]

00:35:17   Saga right this time and yeah we at [TS]

00:35:19   which they kind of didn't but it was [TS]

00:35:21   better but rather something that's [TS]

00:35:23   always the heartbreak when somebody [TS]

00:35:24   takes one of your favorite favorite [TS]

00:35:26   characters or favorite dynamics and [TS]

00:35:27   turns it on its head because I can [TS]

00:35:30   remember how betrayed I felt when Gail [TS]

00:35:33   Simone left birds of prey and then the [TS]

00:35:34   next one we took over i cant members [TS]

00:35:36   name but Simone had worked very hard for [TS]

00:35:38   this course of the run to build up these [TS]

00:35:40   plausible respectful holy believable [TS]

00:35:44   relationships among all of the different [TS]

00:35:46   like the main birds roster than all the [TS]

00:35:47   auxiliary people and the other people [TS]

00:35:49   who are in other lives and like that was [TS]

00:35:51   squandered within two issues and it was [TS]

00:35:52   back to [TS]

00:35:53   oh these chicks they fight crime and [TS]

00:35:55   what I'm sure loves the green arrow and [TS]

00:35:57   it was just a heart it was infuriating [TS]

00:35:59   when I stopped buying those little [TS]

00:36:01   worried she's an ass kicker such a [TS]

00:36:03   powerful for no she's not oh yeah [TS]

00:36:04   powerful female character because like [TS]

00:36:06   she can wear a bustier and fishnets and [TS]

00:36:08   hurt you and it's just and so that's [TS]

00:36:11   that's the flipside to I guess the [TS]

00:36:12   equity or the the personal investment [TS]

00:36:14   that the personal relationship to begin [TS]

00:36:15   to build up is I think sometimes it's [TS]

00:36:18   easy to forget what a strong role the [TS]

00:36:19   writer has in that too and when the [TS]

00:36:21   writer leaves unless another writer with [TS]

00:36:24   similar sensibilities or or a writer who [TS]

00:36:26   says I understand these court [TS]

00:36:27   sensibilities are going to apply them to [TS]

00:36:29   the character [TS]

00:36:30   unless that's their you you do run the [TS]

00:36:32   risk of torpedoing years of work frankly [TS]

00:36:35   or or turning off a segment of your [TS]

00:36:37   audience i just read the secret origin [TS]

00:36:39   of Wonder Woman which is mostly about [TS]

00:36:40   William Moulton Marston the Wonder Woman [TS]

00:36:43   didn't we talk about that you know we [TS]

00:36:45   mentioned inviting briefly but yeah then [TS]

00:36:48   there's a moment in that exactly [TS]

00:36:49   illustrates what you're talking about [TS]

00:36:51   where one woman has become a huge [TS]

00:36:53   property for DC she's third to Superman [TS]

00:36:56   and Batman so they decided to add her to [TS]

00:36:59   the justice society group comic book but [TS]

00:37:03   now she's going to be written by Gardner [TS]

00:37:05   foxes have William Moulton Marston and [TS]

00:37:08   in the first issue she gets added to the [TS]

00:37:11   justice society as the secretary and [TS]

00:37:15   then every issue after that she says [TS]

00:37:17   sure when I could go with you boys have [TS]

00:37:20   to stay here and then there's one issue [TS]

00:37:22   where she does get to do something get [TS]

00:37:24   all the male superheroes have been [TS]

00:37:25   kidnapped or something [TS]

00:37:27   saudi and all the girlfriends have to go [TS]

00:37:29   rescue them [TS]

00:37:30   this reminds me of this is the fam in [TS]

00:37:32   both enjoying it infuriated by with the [TS]

00:37:34   eight that the current Peggy Carter a [TS]

00:37:35   mini-series on TV is watching how Peggy [TS]

00:37:39   is reduced taking lunch orders and and I [TS]

00:37:43   realize that's part of the whole point [TS]

00:37:45   to the series is to shit is to show you [TS]

00:37:47   is a commentary on that yes i realize [TS]

00:37:49   the whole point of the series is a [TS]

00:37:50   commentary that doesn't mean I have to [TS]

00:37:51   watch and go oh it's a commentary funny [TS]

00:37:53   things are terrible like you know it's a [TS]

00:37:55   very visceral loving like oh god people [TS]

00:37:57   thought that was okay [TS]

00:37:59   butBut so I was hiding yourself [TS]

00:38:03   she's going to found shield eventually [TS]

00:38:06   and other these jerks is yeah that guy [TS]

00:38:08   from one tree hill can just go right [TS]

00:38:09   back there as far as I'm concerned yes [TS]

00:38:12   so what I mean I i would imagine that [TS]

00:38:15   these are conversations actually was a [TS]

00:38:17   funny thing i read this is totally not [TS]

00:38:19   related but I'm gonna mention it where I [TS]

00:38:22   saw a video of an interview with JJ [TS]

00:38:23   Abrams at like I'm a red carpet [TS]

00:38:25   somewhere and they were asking about the [TS]

00:38:26   the lights or lightsaber with the from [TS]

00:38:28   the trailer that's got the little cards [TS]

00:38:30   coming out of it and his comment was [TS]

00:38:32   somebody was like well you know the fans [TS]

00:38:35   talk about this a lot and he just [TS]

00:38:36   laughed he said do you do not think that [TS]

00:38:38   we had huge arguments about this on the [TS]

00:38:40   inside and I I thought that was really [TS]

00:38:44   funny and I want to bring that up in the [TS]

00:38:46   comic book context and ask you I'm sure [TS]

00:38:48   they had these conversations at all [TS]

00:38:50   levels of Marvel and DC especially but i [TS]

00:38:52   wanted to ask you three [TS]

00:38:54   what is the how do you solve the problem [TS]

00:38:59   of wanting the richness of characters [TS]

00:39:02   that were familiar with while not [TS]

00:39:04   totally stifling storytelling by tying [TS]

00:39:07   everything together with continuity [TS]

00:39:09   that's basically walling off whole [TS]

00:39:11   sections of story possibilities because [TS]

00:39:14   somebody already told a story like that [TS]

00:39:16   25 years ago that said it was a and you [TS]

00:39:18   wanted to bebe and it's too bad how do [TS]

00:39:19   you how do you take the richness and yet [TS]

00:39:22   still have things that are good stories [TS]

00:39:24   that people want to read [TS]

00:39:25   I think that selective amnesia really is [TS]

00:39:28   the secret to making all this work [TS]

00:39:30   it'sit's such a bit such a perfect [TS]

00:39:32   filter too because we can we write I [TS]

00:39:35   don't want to awaken a memory that [TS]

00:39:37   everybody I'm sure has been burying but [TS]

00:39:40   there was a time when I'm watching my [TS]

00:39:43   sisters give us riding stars writing [TS]

00:39:45   spider-man and he said well tell you [TS]

00:39:47   what he turns into a giant spider and [TS]

00:39:50   then he dies and then a new Peter Parker [TS]

00:39:53   like car like that isn't a good soon [TS]

00:39:55   it's like they're I just I just love [TS]

00:39:58   that there's no need to recon that [TS]

00:40:00   there's no way to explain like how all [TS]

00:40:01   that was actually a clone or that was [TS]

00:40:03   just a virtual reality we all just ate [TS]

00:40:05   editors includes let's just all agree [TS]

00:40:06   that we just never speak of that again [TS]

00:40:08   whereas other things that might have [TS]

00:40:11   happened around the same time they are [TS]

00:40:12   so potent and so good like when dr. [TS]

00:40:16   octopus inhabit his body for for a good [TS]

00:40:18   year to that we're going we're going to [TS]

00:40:20   accept that as something that's true i [TS]

00:40:22   think that really you don't think that [TS]

00:40:25   this secret is just repeat yourself it's [TS]

00:40:26   just a comment i should really just [TS]

00:40:28   relax and as I don't think you're [TS]

00:40:30   getting this bakery boots are these big [TS]

00:40:32   explanations i say just keep the good [TS]

00:40:34   stuff like it he said there was [TS]

00:40:37   something cool remember that to star [TS]

00:40:39   trek as an example [TS]

00:40:40   apparently in the Star Trek animated [TS]

00:40:42   series which is sort of cannon there's [TS]

00:40:44   an episode that end with a 200 foot tall [TS]

00:40:46   vegetable clone of Spock just left out [TS]

00:40:49   on a planet somewhere so that's there [TS]

00:40:51   for all the future movies and series [TS]

00:40:54   know who cares that was done we forgot [TS]

00:40:56   about it after you know I Peter and Mary [TS]

00:40:59   Jane had a baby that was taken away and [TS]

00:41:03   they thought that the that the baby died [TS]

00:41:05   and was taken away by Norman Osborn to [TS]

00:41:06   Europe where would be it [TS]

00:41:08   educated and evil European schools or [TS]

00:41:11   something like that and it literally [TS]

00:41:13   which actually yes [TS]

00:41:14   that baby is actually the premise of the [TS]

00:41:16   spider girl comic where she didn't get [TS]

00:41:18   taken away but I i remember reading [TS]

00:41:20   those comics and looking up on reading [TS]

00:41:22   wikipedia several years later like [TS]

00:41:23   whatever what they ever do with that [TS]

00:41:25   story and you know what the answer is [TS]

00:41:26   what we don't speak of it like it's just [TS]

00:41:30   now that didn't do whatever we didn't [TS]

00:41:32   happen [TS]

00:41:33   let's not worry about it it's like [TS]

00:41:34   Richie's brother on happy days [TS]

00:41:36   yeah just like continuity that and i [TS]

00:41:38   like that Superman has whatever 80 years [TS]

00:41:42   of history if they didn't have those [TS]

00:41:43   reboots yeah it doesn't matter if he had [TS]

00:41:47   super puzzle solving ability for two [TS]

00:41:50   issues in the nineteen fifties you can [TS]

00:41:52   ignore that nobody really mind except [TS]

00:41:54   for the puzzle makers of america and [TS]

00:41:56   they're like why do Superman offices I [TS]

00:41:59   this pad panel 2 on page 8 of action [TS]

00:42:02   comics number 438 Clark Kent scratches [TS]

00:42:05   his head and says I've never been good [TS]

00:42:07   at puzzles but I point you know that [TS]

00:42:09   having that I like big I like DC's [TS]

00:42:13   occasional big crisis or zero hour [TS]

00:42:16   shake it all up and see what happens i [TS]

00:42:18   don't see that as a negative i think [TS]

00:42:20   those are fun diversion as [TS]

00:42:22   once i'm not paying for the week by week [TS]

00:42:23   because this again comes down I I'm [TS]

00:42:26   gonna come back to the Arthurian thing [TS]

00:42:27   because i think one of the reasons the [TS]

00:42:28   Arthurian legend has managed to maintain [TS]

00:42:32   across British literary history for [TS]

00:42:34   hundreds of years is because it's got [TS]

00:42:37   the fundamentals of of a story in there [TS]

00:42:39   Arthur is always somebody who is the [TS]

00:42:42   literal embodiment of the land where is [TS]

00:42:44   somebody who is the embodiment of [TS]

00:42:45   authority and treachery Morgan is always [TS]

00:42:47   the embodiment of weakness later on you [TS]

00:42:49   have gallon galant but the point is all [TS]

00:42:52   these elements are the same and they can [TS]

00:42:54   be creatively mixed and matched and spun [TS]

00:42:56   off into side stories and you know [TS]

00:43:00   there's a free which anthology it was [TS]

00:43:02   that had all the different stories of [TS]

00:43:03   all the different knights of the round [TS]

00:43:04   table and I think when comics is firing [TS]

00:43:09   on all cylinders [TS]

00:43:10   it's basically doing that were the [TS]

00:43:11   writers all have an idea in their head [TS]

00:43:13   that this is this is this character's [TS]

00:43:15   personality profile this is what they do [TS]

00:43:18   in any given situation let's throw them [TS]

00:43:19   into a situation where they adopt a [TS]

00:43:21   dragon or less stringent situation where [TS]

00:43:23   they become a Valkyrie or let's turn [TS]

00:43:25   them into a situation where they become [TS]

00:43:26   a vampire then adopt a baby growing [TS]

00:43:29   frustration where he's not a vampire but [TS]

00:43:32   instead a weirdo who's really Richard [TS]

00:43:34   lives in Seattle example God if you pick [TS]

00:43:38   well that's not good storytelling I mean [TS]

00:43:39   even if my some even if it was you [TS]

00:43:43   probably could make it work if it was [TS]

00:43:45   like if it were gifted writer gifted [TS]

00:43:46   storyteller but you know that the point [TS]

00:43:49   is is that the good stuff in the story [TS]

00:43:52   is almost always immutable and it can be [TS]

00:43:53   recognized from iteration to iteration [TS]

00:43:54   or feeling that the second approach i [TS]

00:43:57   would suggest is the John Cleese [TS]

00:43:59   approach where you had basically the [TS]

00:44:01   same cast make both fish called wanda [TS]

00:44:02   and fierce creatures fierce creature [TS]

00:44:06   isn't and a movie [TS]

00:44:08   yeah movie that is so good you don't [TS]

00:44:10   remember it's not the movie about leave [TS]

00:44:12   their parts of that movie that I will [TS]

00:44:13   defend to the death parts look but I'll [TS]

00:44:17   I've always liked the idea of not one of [TS]

00:44:19   the things I love about sketch comedy is [TS]

00:44:21   how performers can manage to be both [TS]

00:44:24   simultaneously versatile and incredibly [TS]

00:44:26   reliable where when the minivan come on [TS]

00:44:28   screen part of your subconscious that [TS]

00:44:30   subconsciously goes oh and now we're [TS]

00:44:32   going to see this element enter the [TS]

00:44:34   story or open now [TS]

00:44:35   we're gonna see this element enter the [TS]

00:44:36   situation the problem is you can't [TS]

00:44:38   really decide what are the essential [TS]

00:44:40   elements of characters before they've [TS]

00:44:43   been around for hundreds of years we [TS]

00:44:44   can't well like Wonder Woman is it [TS]

00:44:47   essential that she fought Nazis i think [TS]

00:44:49   yes [TS]

00:44:50   mmm the writers think know is it okay [TS]

00:44:52   that she stops being from Paradise [TS]

00:44:54   Island and that was from the mascara in [TS]

00:44:57   this area time I less silly name it's [TS]

00:44:59   pronounced Paradise Island I don't quite [TS]

00:45:03   agree with that just because I'm but and [TS]

00:45:07   here here here i'm going to contradict [TS]

00:45:08   my argument immediately after i make it [TS]

00:45:10   when i was reading storm watch and being [TS]

00:45:12   professional Lisa yeah I was big bolts [TS]

00:45:15   phone rings from watching the authority [TS]

00:45:17   they were did the writers were a bit [TS]

00:45:19   more analysis special is basically [TS]

00:45:20   inventing a whole new ensemble of [TS]

00:45:23   superheroes and he does a really good [TS]

00:45:27   job of characterizing them in just a few [TS]

00:45:28   issues and there isn't a whole lot of [TS]

00:45:30   backstory either but that doesn't make [TS]

00:45:31   the stories any less compelling or less [TS]

00:45:33   rewarding to read at the same time I [TS]

00:45:36   could also argue that the reason that [TS]

00:45:38   those books were so successful is [TS]

00:45:40   because he was subconsciously drawing [TS]

00:45:42   upon or perhaps deliberately drawing [TS]

00:45:43   upon archetypes that had been [TS]

00:45:45   established by you know other writers [TS]

00:45:46   and other titles for 50 60 70 years but [TS]

00:45:49   i think you can you know Runaways I [TS]

00:45:51   think works out really well as a story [TS]

00:45:53   yeah but that's new that's new [TS]

00:45:54   characters right now because nuclear [TS]

00:45:55   yeah that and that and that's exactly [TS]

00:45:57   what I i would like to see DC and Marvel [TS]

00:45:59   do i mean i'd like to see them to a lot [TS]

00:46:01   of guys like new characters i think they [TS]

00:46:02   do you know well I mean it's only once [TS]

00:46:05   one solution is that the rolling amnesia [TS]

00:46:08   like I said but another one is just [TS]

00:46:10   simply say just bite the bullet and say [TS]

00:46:11   that fantastic the reed richards and Sir [TS]

00:46:14   Richard's are now in their sixties and [TS]

00:46:16   all of the and Peter Parker is now in [TS]

00:46:19   his fifties and you have to let you now [TS]

00:46:21   have the the senior class but they are [TS]

00:46:24   doing things that they wouldn't be doing [TS]

00:46:25   with when they were like 16 17 18 year [TS]

00:46:28   olds but that's that's great because you [TS]

00:46:30   have been cultivating new generations of [TS]

00:46:32   characters to sort of take their places [TS]

00:46:34   so it's it's good to have it there's a [TS]

00:46:37   game at the Fantastic Four mean there's [TS]

00:46:40   a problem now with Johnny Storm because [TS]

00:46:42   he's just locked into he's got to be 21 [TS]

00:46:45   years old he's got to be completely [TS]

00:46:47   irresponsible [TS]

00:46:48   turn again where exactly where is you [TS]

00:46:51   have these other characters like even of [TS]

00:46:53   that can i connect my whole bunch of [TS]

00:46:56   like minor characters that have because [TS]

00:46:58   they they're not licensed they're not [TS]

00:47:00   hot licensed characters you can have [TS]

00:47:03   them be [TS]

00:47:04   you can track them as in the [TS]

00:47:05   mid-seventies she was like part of the [TS]

00:47:07   miss marvel used to be part of like the [TS]

00:47:09   hey let's have some some women [TS]

00:47:11   superheroes now we can basically develop [TS]

00:47:14   them so that little by little they're [TS]

00:47:17   proud of the senior class now they're [TS]

00:47:18   not these characters that don't know [TS]

00:47:20   what they're doing and they're doing the [TS]

00:47:21   best they can [TS]

00:47:22   no she hulk is now leaders is not a [TS]

00:47:24   leader of a group and it has areas [TS]

00:47:26   possibility not because she's a new [TS]

00:47:28   character thats been written as this [TS]

00:47:30   formidable lawyer but because you can [TS]

00:47:32   actually acknowledge that while she's [TS]

00:47:33   been at this hero game for about 10-15 [TS]

00:47:35   years now she is a graduate of the [TS]

00:47:37   been-there-done-that class and now you [TS]

00:47:40   with these are things you can only do if [TS]

00:47:41   you allow the characters to at least [TS]

00:47:43   gain experience points i think that's [TS]

00:47:45   something that you kind of lose when you [TS]

00:47:46   basically make sure that they're just on [TS]

00:47:48   that that standing desk and that they [TS]

00:47:50   can move a lot but they can never really [TS]

00:47:52   move forward [TS]

00:47:53   that's when the saddest things i've ever [TS]

00:47:55   heard a standing desk for you can move a [TS]

00:47:57   lot never move forward a treadmill desk [TS]

00:47:59   is the worst one because that when you [TS]

00:48:00   literally walk 10 miles and never leave [TS]

00:48:03   your desk [TS]

00:48:04   I'm I'm exhausted I'm exhausted I'm [TS]

00:48:06   sticky by still blade on my deadlines I [TS]

00:48:08   don't know how that happened [TS]

00:48:09   let me tell you about another sponsor [TS]

00:48:11   its lootcrate loot crate is a monthly [TS]

00:48:14   subscription box service for epic geek [TS]

00:48:16   and gamer items and pop-culture gear for [TS]

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00:48:22   gear apparel collectibles unique [TS]

00:48:25   one-of-a-kind items and much more [TS]

00:48:27   now here's how Lou create works until [TS]

00:48:29   the nineteenth of the month at nine p.m. [TS]

00:48:31   pacific time you can get that months [TS]

00:48:34   lootcrate you subscribe and you will get [TS]

00:48:36   that much loot crate once it is nine [TS]

00:48:38   o'clock on the 19 you are going to miss [TS]

00:48:41   out until the next month so hurry run [TS]

00:48:45   don't walk to loot crate dot-com / smell [TS]

00:48:47   that's my name and enter code smell to [TS]

00:48:51   save three dollars on any new [TS]

00:48:52   subscription to loot crate now februari [TS]

00:48:55   crate if you get in by februari 19th [TS]

00:48:57   it's gonna be a lot of fun for people [TS]

00:48:58   who like to play games break out the [TS]

00:49:00   dice the car [TS]

00:49:01   the controller's strategize february's [TS]

00:49:04   create it's all about the fun and [TS]

00:49:05   fantastic games we left to play [TS]

00:49:07   tabletop video board card role-playing [TS]

00:49:11   games and much more lucrative put [TS]

00:49:13   together something that celebrates the [TS]

00:49:14   boundless levels of adventure and [TS]

00:49:16   creativity and excitement that great [TS]

00:49:18   gaming can bring what's in this great an [TS]

00:49:22   exclusive look great addition of a [TS]

00:49:23   popular table top title of vinyl [TS]

00:49:25   collectible figure a best-selling title [TS]

00:49:27   of my gamer geeks worldwide and much [TS]

00:49:29   more loot crate is like a friend who [TS]

00:49:31   knows exactly what you love and [TS]

00:49:33   surprises you with an awesome present [TS]

00:49:34   every month they ship 29 countries and [TS]

00:49:37   there's much more information about it [TS]

00:49:38   on their site to go to loot crate [TS]

00:49:40   dot-com / smell and enter code smells [TS]

00:49:43   safe three dollars on any new [TS]

00:49:45   subscription and thank you to look great [TS]

00:49:46   for sponsoring the uncomfortable [TS]

00:49:49   I don't know I'm this is a really [TS]

00:49:51   interesting conversation because in the [TS]

00:49:52   end I it comes back to telling good [TS]

00:49:55   stories and i know i I've had [TS]

00:49:56   conversations I think with all of you [TS]

00:49:58   about that's the past it one of the [TS]

00:50:00   frustrating things about the comic book [TS]

00:50:01   the comics medium in general and and [TS]

00:50:04   there are graphic novels and there are [TS]

00:50:06   independent comics that you to tell [TS]

00:50:07   fixed stories but one of the the appeals [TS]

00:50:10   of the broad you know the Marvel and DC [TS]

00:50:13   intellectual property kind of stories [TS]

00:50:16   and characters is they are the ones that [TS]

00:50:18   we grew up with [TS]

00:50:19   they're the ones that are a whole new [TS]

00:50:21   generation is growing up with they are [TS]

00:50:23   that they are like mythological figures [TS]

00:50:26   like Lisa said they're like Arthurian [TS]

00:50:28   legends and things like that one of the [TS]

00:50:31   challenges with this medium is finding [TS]

00:50:33   good stories when we talk about doing [TS]

00:50:34   comic book club episodes of the [TS]

00:50:36   uncomfortable [TS]

00:50:37   what you don't want to do is say well [TS]

00:50:38   you need 40 years of history and then [TS]

00:50:40   read these you know 20 tie and comics [TS]

00:50:43   and there's a story in there [TS]

00:50:45   what you want to do is be able to throw [TS]

00:50:47   a trade or two at somebody and say [TS]

00:50:49   here's a it's like reading a novel read [TS]

00:50:52   these and we'll talk about it and that [TS]

00:50:54   is that is the challenge of the business [TS]

00:50:57   of comic-book continuity i think is that [TS]

00:50:59   it fights against that and although the [TS]

00:51:02   continuity is rich i also miss not [TS]

00:51:05   having the ability to say like I have [TS]

00:51:08   the i mentioned this before on the show [TS]

00:51:10   I have the hardcover of redbox planet [TS]

00:51:13   hulk and I'm not a Hulk [TS]

00:51:15   and at all actually but that's a great [TS]

00:51:18   story and it's self-contained and you [TS]

00:51:20   don't really need to know anything more [TS]

00:51:22   about other than like background [TS]

00:51:24   radiation of which would be gamma [TS]

00:51:26   radiation of the Hulk story to get this [TS]

00:51:28   story and and yeah it's on a different [TS]

00:51:30   planet and it doesn't have most of his [TS]

00:51:32   his regular cast on it but it's a nice [TS]

00:51:35   story to have it and I think that's the [TS]

00:51:37   downside of the continuity stuff is that [TS]

00:51:39   oftentimes you don't have the ability to [TS]

00:51:41   point of the story and say that's a [TS]

00:51:43   story instead it's like a soap opera [TS]

00:51:44   with a bunch of different parts and it's [TS]

00:51:47   much harder soap operas is a valid [TS]

00:51:50   storytelling approach to I guess I'm [TS]

00:51:52   saying I'm a little disappointed that [TS]

00:51:54   there's so much soap opera and not [TS]

00:51:56   enough sort of novels in the comics area [TS]

00:52:00   in the Marvel and DC Comics areas but [TS]

00:52:03   most of these big ridiculous crossover [TS]

00:52:04   things you can just read the trade like [TS]

00:52:07   you can read it crisis on infinite [TS]

00:52:09   earths and just the trade go alright I [TS]

00:52:12   pretty much got that I may not have [TS]

00:52:13   radii don't agree i think a lot of those [TS]

00:52:15   are our events that really require you [TS]

00:52:17   to know about everything that's around [TS]

00:52:19   them because it's 80 different [TS]

00:52:21   characters and I might know who you know [TS]

00:52:23   spider-man is or I might know who [TS]

00:52:24   Superman is but I I you know when you're [TS]

00:52:27   putting pouring everybody in from the [TS]

00:52:28   universe then it's like I don't even [TS]

00:52:30   know who these people at that well [TS]

00:52:31   particularly with crisis on Infinite [TS]

00:52:32   Earths there's so many people they don't [TS]

00:52:34   matter [TS]

00:52:35   all you have to do all you have to know [TS]

00:52:37   is on this page for universes died [TS]

00:52:41   you may not recognize all 20 people in [TS]

00:52:43   each panel because the artist is a [TS]

00:52:45   show-off [TS]

00:52:47   okay good yeah yeah this is already [TS]

00:52:49   destroyed universes this when you see a [TS]

00:52:51   Superman and Superman with gray hair [TS]

00:52:53   glaring at each other [TS]

00:52:55   you get the idea like I I guess I mean I [TS]

00:52:58   one of the I would contract [TS]

00:53:00   contrast that with the what jonathan [TS]

00:53:02   hickman's been doing in Avengers and New [TS]

00:53:03   Avengers which is about universe is [TS]

00:53:05   annihilating themselves or at least [TS]

00:53:07   Earth's in parallel universes [TS]

00:53:09   annihilating one another and this is a [TS]

00:53:13   difference between comics from the [TS]

00:53:14   eighties and comics of today there [TS]

00:53:16   there's a lot more angst about you know [TS]

00:53:20   it's them or us and are we right do we [TS]

00:53:23   have the responsibility and arguing and [TS]

00:53:25   and maybe we'll go to that Earth's we [TS]

00:53:27   can get some fine [TS]

00:53:28   some cool people and bring them back to [TS]

00:53:30   our earth and there's there's more of [TS]

00:53:32   that stuff in there in the end yeah it [TS]

00:53:33   is sort of like look you don't need to [TS]

00:53:35   know who those people are in fact you've [TS]

00:53:36   never seen them before [TS]

00:53:38   suffice it to say that they're cool and [TS]

00:53:40   now their universe is blown up [TS]

00:53:41   they did a story like that in storm [TS]

00:53:43   watch where where it was basically 11 [TS]

00:53:47   group of people got to check out and see [TS]

00:53:48   what was happening on an alternate [TS]

00:53:50   planet and all they could base all they [TS]

00:53:51   could basically do where it was like [TS]

00:53:53   they're watching a really bad TV show [TS]

00:53:54   and a lot of the a lot of the issue [TS]

00:53:58   because i think it was just a one or two [TS]

00:53:59   you think a lot of him that was was are [TS]

00:54:01   our heroes basically biting their nails [TS]

00:54:03   all this is not going to work with my [TS]

00:54:04   gosh what can we do with the answer was [TS]

00:54:06   no we can't do a thing we can just we [TS]

00:54:09   can just accept the fact that sometimes [TS]

00:54:10   we can't even save our own universe and [TS]

00:54:12   we certainly can't save anyone elses and [TS]

00:54:13   i like that i like the idea that there [TS]

00:54:16   was that that there is amplified sense [TS]

00:54:19   of helplessness [TS]

00:54:20   well I have a theory something I really [TS]

00:54:22   want marvel to do because i think [TS]

00:54:24   there's core problem is not continuity [TS]

00:54:27   and it's not too many crossovers their [TS]

00:54:29   core problem is that they had too many [TS]

00:54:30   people in New York City and they've [TS]

00:54:32   always had this problem with that's [TS]

00:54:34   where people characters characters [TS]

00:54:36   that's where spider-man lives that's [TS]

00:54:37   where dr. strange lives that's where the [TS]

00:54:40   Avengers live and that's where the [TS]

00:54:41   Fantastic Four live like all of their [TS]

00:54:43   and the x-men are just outside New York [TS]

00:54:45   City so because they were creating [TS]

00:54:48   characters that lived in the real world [TS]

00:54:50   and that's where Stan Lee and Jack Kirby [TS]

00:54:52   lived [TS]

00:54:53   everybody's in new york city and i think [TS]

00:54:57   what they really need to do is spread [TS]

00:54:59   people out a bit so tying that into the [TS]

00:55:02   way movie rights or spear around I think [TS]

00:55:04   we're gonna come out of secret wars with [TS]

00:55:07   three or four separate universes [TS]

00:55:10   universe one will have spider-man and [TS]

00:55:12   the x-men in it and we'll call that [TS]

00:55:14   universe sony universe to will call [TS]

00:55:19   universe MCU and we'll have everybody [TS]

00:55:23   that's in the Marvel Cinematic Universe [TS]

00:55:24   and then the other universe will be [TS]

00:55:27   wherever the other stuff is fox fox yes [TS]

00:55:31   yeah that's the mutant universe doesn't [TS]

00:55:33   ask for [TS]

00:55:34   yeah because it would be pretty [TS]

00:55:37   convenient for the mutants just to live [TS]

00:55:38   somewhere else [TS]

00:55:39   because there's way too many of them and [TS]

00:55:42   also if they spread out so they're [TS]

00:55:44   separated by who owns the movie rights [TS]

00:55:47   I think that'll let Marvel do really [TS]

00:55:49   cruel things to sony and start saying [TS]

00:55:52   because they've already threatened to [TS]

00:55:55   stop having a fantastic for comic book [TS]

00:55:57   that's happening [TS]

00:56:00   yeah so that's my theory Marvel ends up [TS]

00:56:02   in several different universes [TS]

00:56:03   conveniently separate segregated by [TS]

00:56:05   movie right that's dad's diabolical [TS]

00:56:07   Monty yeah [TS]

00:56:09   and yet uncannily lucrative of you i [TS]

00:56:14   just want them to work in the line I [TS]

00:56:15   don't want to cure cancer from to turn [TS]

00:56:17   people into darkness [TS]

00:56:19   sure yeah I just yeah once that way [TS]

00:56:21   Kalin is given the ability to write a TV [TS]

00:56:24   or movie for Marvel just what happened [TS]

00:56:28   there really opening up the floodgates [TS]

00:56:30   on allowing comic books to get goofy [TS]

00:56:32   again [TS]

00:56:33   yeah which like rate the idea of there [TS]

00:56:36   being a bat-mite comic or section eight [TS]

00:56:39   which is going to have the dog welder [TS]

00:56:41   whose powers that he could well dogs to [TS]

00:56:43   think that's great that's wonderful i'm [TS]

00:56:45   so excited about I believe there's one [TS]

00:56:47   of those zones in the battle world and [TS]

00:56:48   see your Wars is going to be Howard the [TS]

00:56:50   Duck related and in spider vs very [TS]

00:56:53   serious Marvel event one of the probably [TS]

00:56:56   top 10 spiders in that event is Bob your [TS]

00:56:59   porker these spectacular fighter ham so [TS]

00:57:02   there is silliness invented silly that I [TS]

00:57:05   I respect I respect jonathan hickman I [TS]

00:57:07   know that these e wouldn't be so popular [TS]

00:57:09   if he didn't have a peach audience but i [TS]

00:57:11   think the problem is every hickman book [TS]

00:57:13   I've read is that he's forgotten that [TS]

00:57:14   comic books are supposed to have some [TS]

00:57:16   element of fun [TS]

00:57:18   oh yeah I'm your son from an alternate [TS]

00:57:21   reality future in which everything is [TS]

00:57:24   dead and you're responsible for your [TS]

00:57:26   being chased by ml for God's sakes [TS]

00:57:28   flying bathtub flying to a universe in [TS]

00:57:32   which everyone looks like you know [TS]

00:57:33   asparagus and you have to solve their [TS]

00:57:35   problem to have them over for dinner [TS]

00:57:36   that's what I that's right one story [TS]

00:57:38   like that please give me a breather [TS]

00:57:40   well the good news is there are usually [TS]

00:57:42   good stories to be found and said that [TS]

00:57:45   have nothing to do with events and then [TS]

00:57:47   there are also events so there's [TS]

00:57:48   something for everyone and nothing for [TS]

00:57:51   someone i think is how that works [TS]

00:57:53   uh but it's aight i'll tell you one last [TS]

00:57:55   thing before we go as somebody who like [TS]

00:57:58   the Ultimate Universe and especially [TS]

00:58:00   ultimate spider-man who really enjoys [TS]

00:58:01   the Miles Morales thing that's my only [TS]

00:58:03   dog in this whole hunt is that I am [TS]

00:58:05   hoping that in the end that character [TS]

00:58:08   sticks around in some form that isn't [TS]

00:58:10   too distorted from who he is because [TS]

00:58:12   it's a lot of fun having a you know a [TS]

00:58:15   sixteen-year-old kid being spider-man [TS]

00:58:19   and having to learn the ropes and [TS]

00:58:20   hopefully he will not be sunset by [TS]

00:58:23   Marvel because they're good stories to [TS]

00:58:25   be told with him and I was quite [TS]

00:58:26   skeptical when they introduced him and [TS]

00:58:27   he's actually turned out to be great but [TS]

00:58:29   you know be a shame if you again [TS]

00:58:31   corporate policy prevented future [TS]

00:58:33   stories to be told with that character [TS]

00:58:36   but you know these are all pieces of [TS]

00:58:38   intellectual property and we can never [TS]

00:58:39   forget that [TS]

00:58:40   can I mention one Marvel announcement [TS]

00:58:43   that happened today that I'm actually [TS]

00:58:44   really really excited about it go for it [TS]

00:58:47   sana amin pot is an editor at Marvel [TS]

00:58:50   she's one of the people that created [TS]

00:58:52   Kamala Khan the current ms marvel she's [TS]

00:58:56   being promoted to director of content [TS]

00:58:58   and character development and I think [TS]

00:59:01   that's a great move because she's great [TS]

00:59:03   at a new position it's not clear ice [TS]

00:59:06   I've never heard of anyone else with [TS]

00:59:08   that position but that might have that [TS]

00:59:10   that's interesting because that [TS]

00:59:13   character development i find fascinating [TS]

00:59:15   because one of the problems that the big [TS]

00:59:17   the big to have had is nobody wants to [TS]

00:59:19   create new characters that's their [TS]

00:59:21   intellectual property because they'd [TS]

00:59:22   rather go create create characters on [TS]

00:59:25   their own that they own and so they can [TS]

00:59:26   be like brian michael bendis and sell [TS]

00:59:29   powers to TV and make a lot of money or [TS]

00:59:31   be like Robert Kirkman and sell walking [TS]

00:59:33   dead TV and make a lot of money and/or [TS]

00:59:37   yeah and you can name is going on so [TS]

00:59:41   character development I find that [TS]

00:59:42   fascinating because i think that is one [TS]

00:59:43   and we talked about this on the show [TS]

00:59:44   before I think that's one of the [TS]

00:59:46   problems of Marvel and DC have had is [TS]

00:59:48   they've been stifled the last 10 or 20 [TS]

00:59:50   years by you know there's not a lot of [TS]

00:59:53   new stuff coming from then they are [TS]

00:59:55   doing a lot of retreading because who [TS]

00:59:58   would create this new stuff that [TS]

00:59:58   would create this new stuff that [TS]

01:00:00   them but one of the really cool new [TS]

01:00:01   things they do have is coming back on [TS]

01:00:03   yes so the fact that what if that [TS]

01:00:06   characters creators is in this position [TS]

01:00:08   I think that's it clearly shows a good [TS]

01:00:10   commitment [TS]

01:00:11   yeah I like that I like I do find it [TS]

01:00:14   interesting that Marvel although it is [TS]

01:00:16   both interesting and and sets off my [TS]

01:00:19   cynic my cynical alert and that [TS]

01:00:22   experience [TS]

01:00:23   well he is doing as well first you have [TS]

01:00:24   the x-men they all the Optio lady x-men [TS]

01:00:27   team that launched and the book Frank [TS]

01:00:29   that could be better than it is but I do [TS]

01:00:30   find it fascinating that they've they've [TS]

01:00:32   done this this and now they're doing [TS]

01:00:34   this booth with the Avengers as well and [TS]

01:00:37   part of me is thinking okay this is [TS]

01:00:39   great because on the one hand you get a [TS]

01:00:41   lot of characters and you can see them [TS]

01:00:43   interact with each other as colleagues [TS]

01:00:44   and equals and not just as the token [TS]

01:00:46   woman on some other team and I like that [TS]

01:00:50   because you know even older lineups if [TS]

01:00:52   it was the x-men it was usually Oh [TS]

01:00:54   it'sit's some body and it's a tank and [TS]

01:00:58   it's and it's a god Scott and there's [TS]

01:01:01   gene and she's the girl that grip and [TS]

01:01:02   instead you have some even when you have [TS]

01:01:04   an excellent team is detectable x-women [TS]

01:01:06   tits [TS]

01:01:06   there's no that and the girl they're all [TS]

01:01:08   the girls so this way they're all just [TS]

01:01:10   people [TS]

01:01:10   hooray yay and hopefully with the [TS]

01:01:12   Avengers the same thing we're all just [TS]

01:01:14   people hooray yay [TS]

01:01:15   um but part of me wonders if this is a [TS]

01:01:19   little bit of political theater so so [TS]

01:01:22   there's that will work with women in [TS]

01:01:24   comics are committed to diversity and [TS]

01:01:26   you know on also we're making in this [TS]

01:01:28   Marvel movie eventually pay no attention [TS]

01:01:31   to the crazy ratio you know there's part [TS]

01:01:33   of me that wonders if this is a well if [TS]

01:01:34   we give the ladies their own book and we [TS]

01:01:36   give them this the sort of character [TS]

01:01:37   development and this opportunity to [TS]

01:01:38   reach continuity we don't have to worry [TS]

01:01:40   about it across all books and we can [TS]

01:01:42   tell women that were building products [TS]

01:01:43   for them [TS]

01:01:44   I feel like sometimes that they've done [TS]

01:01:46   better [TS]

01:01:47   they've done so much better they were [TS]

01:01:48   doing the 90 min the early audience but [TS]

01:01:50   I still feel like sometimes there is a [TS]

01:01:52   mindset in corporate comics that women [TS]

01:01:54   are kind of another species and the [TS]

01:01:55   question is how to get women to read [TS]

01:01:57   comics and how do you write women in [TS]

01:01:58   comics as opposed to oh they're human [TS]

01:02:00   beings and they like to buy things and [TS]

01:02:02   they have wildly different tastes like [TS]

01:02:03   women are not a monolithic a monolithic [TS]

01:02:06   consumer entity and they're not a [TS]

01:02:08   monolithic storytelling almond either [TS]

01:02:10   that's why the dc's announcement today [TS]

01:02:12   was partly so interesting because they [TS]

01:02:15   just they just blasted here's a list of [TS]

01:02:17   all the books were doing all the talent [TS]

01:02:18   that we've got working on them and great [TS]

01:02:21   pie i first found out about this [TS]

01:02:22   announcement great boxing look at how [TS]

01:02:24   many asian-americans are but the asian [TS]

01:02:26   americans are working on on key titles [TS]

01:02:29   and then you look at look at look at all [TS]

01:02:31   the women that are working on key titles [TS]

01:02:32   and not necessarily here's the here's [TS]

01:02:34   our women's line it's just we just [TS]

01:02:35   happened to have hired a lot of people [TS]

01:02:37   that are not white dudes to a two-door [TS]

01:02:40   comics so it's the it's getting better [TS]

01:02:44   and there was an interview with Kelly [TS]

01:02:45   sue deconnick recently where she said I [TS]

01:02:47   used to know every other woman who is [TS]

01:02:48   working on my local on comics and I [TS]

01:02:51   don't anymore and I think that's [TS]

01:02:52   fantastic you know so i want to [TS]

01:02:55   emphasize it is getting better than the [TS]

01:02:56   fact that i can rattle off three or [TS]

01:02:58   three or four what i would consider a [TS]

01:03:00   level writers where the same levels as [TS]

01:03:02   Bendis and burn the rest off the top of [TS]

01:03:03   my head i think i could have maybe named [TS]

01:03:05   one about 10 to 15 years ago so but but [TS]

01:03:08   but at the same time there's a little [TS]

01:03:09   bit theater going on i think with all 80 [TS]

01:03:11   teams you know I'm getting suspicious of [TS]

01:03:13   why they're been making such a big deal [TS]

01:03:14   about of rolling them out and does this [TS]

01:03:16   really and does this really count right [TS]

01:03:17   yes it counts come on that you're acting [TS]

01:03:21   like this didn't even happen [TS]

01:03:23   our range body is the best mounting [TS]

01:03:25   maybe their pandering to women a little [TS]

01:03:27   but that at least they're admitting they [TS]

01:03:29   exist now this this is the thing that [TS]

01:03:30   came up when we did that episode about [TS]

01:03:32   their about the comic-book recasting a [TS]

01:03:34   few months ago and I I've sort of [TS]

01:03:35   settled on the idea that it can be both [TS]

01:03:38   it can be both a marketing ploy and [TS]

01:03:40   actually have not only some creative and [TS]

01:03:44   artistic merit but also it does serve as [TS]

01:03:47   a signal to women that there there's [TS]

01:03:51   some attention being paid to them and [TS]

01:03:53   that and that girls can read comics and [TS]

01:03:56   see women in all these different [TS]

01:03:57   positions that maybe weren't there [TS]

01:03:59   before but so it's like you know it can [TS]

01:04:01   be both [TS]

01:04:02   I don't think that they use it as [TS]

01:04:04   marketing for what it was but why would [TS]

01:04:06   I say that maybe it doesn't count [TS]

01:04:08   so much that i was so I was super [TS]

01:04:09   excited about it i thought i would get [TS]

01:04:11   the idea of just not a full not a lady [TS]

01:04:14   Avengers team but it's a full Avengers [TS]

01:04:16   team that happens to be like all women [TS]

01:04:18   are going to be here is going to [TS]

01:04:19   showcase for female characters that [TS]

01:04:21   we've got and then I saw that [TS]

01:04:23   such a great idea that is always some [TS]

01:04:25   pointed out that oh it's a secret worst [TS]

01:04:26   title [TS]

01:04:27   okay so they're doing this confident [TS]

01:04:29   knowing that at some point secret wars [TS]

01:04:31   will be over with and they don't have to [TS]

01:04:32   continue with this book anymore [TS]

01:04:33   well no comic is forever harley quinn [TS]

01:04:36   was like no one would think that was [TS]

01:04:37   going to be a huge hit and I was like [TS]

01:04:39   Natalie's not only is a huge hit guys [TS]

01:04:41   going on for second year but it's [TS]

01:04:42   getting its own spin-off yeah i think [TS]

01:04:43   what I'd say is if a force does well [TS]

01:04:45   it's not going anywhere [TS]

01:04:47   yeah no matter what is happening in the [TS]

01:04:49   Secret Wars if a force as well it's not [TS]

01:04:51   going to go anywhere i'd like to direct [TS]

01:04:52   you to the new director of content and [TS]

01:04:54   character development dominant woman of [TS]

01:04:57   South Asian descent that really does [TS]

01:04:59   make me feel happy about Kamala Khan [TS]

01:05:01   because the the I think that one of the [TS]

01:05:04   things a lot of people myself included [TS]

01:05:05   are really worried about whenever they [TS]

01:05:07   hear about these reboots is that i [TS]

01:05:08   really like I really like this book like [TS]

01:05:10   ms marvel i really like this book and I [TS]

01:05:13   don't want this book to be rebooted I [TS]

01:05:15   don't want this free but I don't want [TS]

01:05:16   her to be have now there's gonna be a [TS]

01:05:19   new reality in which you know she's 28 [TS]

01:05:21   years old and she's hot she's a member [TS]

01:05:23   of the Avengers I really want her to be [TS]

01:05:25   there the self of the the self-declared [TS]

01:05:27   superhero of a little bit of a little [TS]

01:05:29   town in New Jersey and that's and that's [TS]

01:05:32   where I want this book to be it's it's [TS]

01:05:34   it's like I don't want you to reboot [TS]

01:05:35   something I like it's like you go to the [TS]

01:05:37   doctor and you're free checkup and [TS]

01:05:39   you're feeling great [TS]

01:05:40   that's the biggest dread you ever have [TS]

01:05:43   because that you know that when you you [TS]

01:05:45   know that after a three-hour examination [TS]

01:05:46   the doctors not gonna say good news it [TS]

01:05:48   turns out that you have a superpower you [TS]

01:05:50   can chicken out like cook meat by [TS]

01:05:52   starting out with your eyes the only [TS]

01:05:53   possible news i'll come with us Oh turns [TS]

01:05:57   out that we found something and we're [TS]

01:05:58   going to send you in for an MRI but [TS]

01:06:01   we're not going to tell you what to [TS]

01:06:01   worry about like oh just give you the [TS]

01:06:04   results of this horrible test please wow [TS]

01:06:05   I I i think i lost the story about that [TS]

01:06:08   I was focused on meat cooking vision [TS]

01:06:11   which i think is Superman's new power [TS]

01:06:13   rankings and popular parties to you have [TS]

01:06:16   to fire up the grill anymore it's one of [TS]

01:06:18   his old powers actually well technically [TS]

01:06:20   well this is very specific get to meet [TS]

01:06:22   ok it's not heat risen related this is a [TS]

01:06:25   more microwave power he can't cook [TS]

01:06:27   potatoes just meet ya know ya SDSU's [TS]

01:06:30   actually nothing metal short throws [TS]

01:06:32   sparks you know no popcorn [TS]

01:06:34   it's always burns at [TS]

01:06:35   yeah I think so I mean just to wrap this [TS]

01:06:38   up III wanted to say the you know at all [TS]

01:06:43   of these things are its card and [TS]

01:06:45   commerce together and if if if ms marvel [TS]

01:06:49   I mean even if it's so cynical is to say [TS]

01:06:51   what we're going to do a force and it's [TS]

01:06:53   all women but we know that it's all part [TS]

01:06:55   of the secret wars event in six months [TS]

01:06:56   we're gonna kill it if the reaction is [TS]

01:06:59   good they they will keep it around [TS]

01:07:01   because it will be a way for them to [TS]

01:07:03   sell comic book that is successful I I [TS]

01:07:07   don't think it's quite as cynical as to [TS]

01:07:09   say well we can say that we're making [TS]

01:07:11   progress and then six months later we [TS]

01:07:13   can just kill it [TS]

01:07:14   don't everybody to wait six months for [TS]

01:07:16   it to actually get cancelled before we [TS]

01:07:17   declare it a cynical said marketing ploy [TS]

01:07:21   what I would have been more pleased with [TS]

01:07:23   this if they had done this last year [TS]

01:07:25   outside of an event then that using [TS]

01:07:27   excuses we're doing this big thing and [TS]

01:07:29   we get we can do we can launch all these [TS]

01:07:30   titles that are related to this event as [TS]

01:07:32   opposed to simply like ms marvel was not [TS]

01:07:34   tied it was technically inspired by the [TS]

01:07:38   the Inhumans saga or whatever they're [TS]

01:07:40   doing whatever craziness doing over [TS]

01:07:41   there but it was not the x-men it was [TS]

01:07:44   more it was more like we're going with [TS]

01:07:45   this is an opportunity to create new [TS]

01:07:46   heroes to create a new hero book [TS]

01:07:48   what kind of curious do we want to [TS]

01:07:49   create as dozen ongoing thing i'm not [TS]

01:07:52   happy and I don't believe in being [TS]

01:07:53   cynical about this time soon as simply [TS]

01:07:55   saying that I've I would feel more [TS]

01:07:57   optimistic about if they are being [TS]

01:07:58   launched as a regular series outside of [TS]

01:08:00   event knowing how many times they [TS]

01:08:02   launched things as part of events with [TS]

01:08:04   no intention of ever following through [TS]

01:08:06   on it big events are when new books get [TS]

01:08:08   announced DC announced a whole new line [TS]

01:08:10   and bait as far as i can tell held on to [TS]

01:08:13   them for a good long time until [TS]

01:08:15   established nobody was reading some of [TS]

01:08:17   them and then they dropped some which [TS]

01:08:18   they do all the time anyway they [TS]

01:08:20   announce this as a new monthly series [TS]

01:08:22   that's going to be part of the results [TS]

01:08:25   of secret wars that's exactly the same [TS]

01:08:28   as saying we have our stupid one year [TS]

01:08:31   later jump forward and you're our new 52 [TS]

01:08:34   series and big events are what launched [TS]

01:08:37   new books and scope it sounds like a [TS]

01:08:40   great book and i will definitely buy it [TS]

01:08:41   i'll enjoy it for however long we have [TS]

01:08:43   ok good conversation everybody gotta [TS]

01:08:46   stop in somewhere the referee is called [TS]

01:08:47   fight standing eight count everybody in [TS]

01:08:50   the corners [TS]

01:08:51   fortunately there four of us in the four [TS]

01:08:53   corners so we'll be okay thank you for [TS]

01:08:55   talking about many many comic book [TS]

01:08:57   related things I appreciate it [TS]

01:08:59   Lisa Schmeisser thanks for being here it [TS]

01:09:01   was my pleasure [TS]

01:09:02   Monty Ashley a pleasure as always comics [TS]

01:09:05   are fun [TS]

01:09:06   yay and an eco thank you [TS]

01:09:09   I'm spent throw in the towel ooh throw [TS]

01:09:11   it and I can't fight no more [TS]

01:09:13   alright and to everybody out there [TS]

01:09:14   thanks for listening to encumber ball [TS]

01:09:16   this has been jason l we will see you [TS]

01:09:18   next time [TS]

01:09:39   we didn't talk about Superman's new [TS]

01:09:41   power which is not to be less boring huh [TS]

01:09:45   he's had so many dumb powers in the past [TS]

01:09:48   the problem is it's it's fundamentally [TS]

01:09:52   he should be he should be a really [TS]

01:09:54   unnerving character because you're [TS]

01:09:55   talking about a super-powered alien who [TS]

01:09:57   has chosen to infiltrate society and an [TS]

01:10:00   end and ostensibly acting our interests [TS]

01:10:03   and I'm just much more interested in the [TS]

01:10:04   idea of an alien who is infiltrating [TS]

01:10:05   society because you know i would like to [TS]

01:10:08   conquer this planet or he infiltrates [TS]

01:10:10   society but he passes really poorly [TS]

01:10:12   because he doesn't understand the innate [TS]

01:10:14   communications body language that we all [TS]

01:10:15   grew up internalizing or something to [TS]

01:10:17   conquer this planet that's why you like [TS]

01:10:18   invincible it's because that's exactly [TS]

01:10:20   what Nolan is is not removed but he's [TS]

01:10:22   secretly part of an alien race is going [TS]

01:10:24   to take us over and starts trying to [TS]

01:10:26   remember the name of the short story [TS]

01:10:27   it's in the John Varley superheroes [TS]

01:10:29   collection and short story basically [TS]

01:10:31   right from the perspective of Superman [TS]

01:10:32   where he actually does have a really [TS]

01:10:35   difficult time picking up on people's [TS]

01:10:36   language simply because so much of human [TS]

01:10:38   communication comes down to body [TS]

01:10:40   language and it's actually good [TS]

01:10:44   the the body language we have actually [TS]

01:10:46   the only doctor primates so there's some [TS]

01:10:48   argument that it's entirely unconscious [TS]

01:10:49   and processing it on a different level [TS]

01:10:50   than we process spoken language but [TS]

01:10:52   because his brain is wired so [TS]

01:10:54   differently he misses out and he can [TS]

01:10:56   barely keep up with conversations and [TS]

01:10:58   when a group he comes back to his [TS]

01:11:00   apartment to try to put the moves on me [TS]

01:11:02   like I have no idea [TS]

01:11:03   I don't even know why you're here i'm [TS]

01:11:05   not attracted to you we can never have a [TS]

01:11:07   meal together because my metabolism [TS]

01:11:08   can't handle any carbon-based who and [TS]

01:11:12   just the idea that super that a Superman [TS]

01:11:14   like character would be so fundamentally [TS]

01:11:15   isolated both socially and and [TS]

01:11:17   cognitively has always stuck with me [TS]

01:11:19   something would be worth exploring more [TS]

01:11:21   well not Superman because he was raised [TS]

01:11:23   here well he may have been raised here [TS]

01:11:25   but if his body is fundamentally [TS]

01:11:27   different he may not be able to have the [TS]

01:11:28   same foods I mean think about how even [TS]

01:11:30   different cultures there are some there [TS]

01:11:32   are some us gene not us there's some [TS]

01:11:34   there are some human gene pools where [TS]

01:11:35   people can't I just not because their [TS]

01:11:37   ancestors had it for years [TS]

01:11:39   sure i'll talk about body language yeah [TS]

01:11:41   yeah but that's that's that's almost [TS]

01:11:43   exactly the problem that i have with [TS]

01:11:44   like a lot of conflict riding and even [TS]

01:11:47   rebooting where it's like you have you [TS]

01:11:49   have a character that is essentially he [TS]

01:11:51   is Superman [TS]

01:11:52   literally Superman Wonder kid watching I [TS]

01:11:54   really want to see stories about the [TS]

01:11:56   adventures of superman but then you have [TS]

01:11:58   so many riders that are like wait a [TS]

01:12:00   minute i just figured something out if [TS]

01:12:02   his hair grows but it can't be cut [TS]

01:12:05   what if we have a whole storyline in [TS]

01:12:06   which he has to it's like Rapunzel he [TS]

01:12:09   flies and you know exactly what is that [TS]

01:12:12   how do we want we explain why no one [TS]

01:12:14   figures out he's Clark Kent like well I [TS]

01:12:16   don't really care when figuring out [TS]

01:12:17   who's Clark and I'm I've had happened [TS]

01:12:19   with the explanation that just like you [TS]

01:12:21   the the guy who's that the barista your [TS]

01:12:23   starbucks the kind of sex to lego brock [TS]

01:12:25   obama you never wonder if he's actually [TS]

01:12:27   open Rocco publix move on tell me [TS]

01:12:29   stories about this incredible guy [TS]

01:12:31   my problem is that there's so many [TS]

01:12:33   people in the DC Universe it sounds cool [TS]

01:12:35   to say well he's an alien who decided to [TS]

01:12:38   infiltrate the planet and help us but [TS]

01:12:41   there's like 12 of them in the Yankees [TS]

01:12:42   American man hunter is right next to him [TS]

01:12:44   doing exactly the same so do do so it [TS]

01:12:47   has it has decided infiltrate this is [TS]

01:12:49   just this is just his home is just where [TS]

01:12:50   he grew up [TS]

01:12:51   that's true that's always been the [TS]

01:12:52   coolest thing about that character to me [TS]

01:12:54   anyway uh I said I'm kind things about [TS]

01:12:57   Superman on Twitter and I'm not sorry [TS]

01:12:59   now that's if there's one thing that [TS]

01:13:02   Marvel can never be they can never have [TS]

01:13:05   that trinity of Superman Batman Wonder [TS]

01:13:07   Woman just these three huge operatic [TS]

01:13:10   characters where you could write stories [TS]

01:13:13   on an immense kisses the Arthurian [TS]

01:13:15   legend all over again where Superman is [TS]

01:13:18   Arthur Batman is Lancelot and Wonder [TS]

01:13:21   Woman is gonna fare what ya the [TS]

01:13:24   connection between one woman and [TS]

01:13:25   Guinevere i would like you to expand on [TS]

01:13:28   that without mentioning her gender [TS]

01:13:29   that's the only thing I see their [TS]

01:13:31   Guinevere is strongly tied to the [TS]

01:13:34   roundtable the roundtables would [TS]

01:13:35   introduce the entire notion of justice [TS]

01:13:38   and and noble knighthood and it was the [TS]

01:13:41   could end it helped confer legitimacy to [TS]

01:13:43   arthur's rain by becoming a simple [TS]

01:13:46   statehood sochi so one of your was both [TS]

01:13:48   political marriage and a symbol of [TS]

01:13:50   statehood that elevated Arthur and sort [TS]

01:13:51   of gave him the social permission he [TS]

01:13:54   needed to do what he needs to do in [TS]

01:13:55   Britain ok ok I to wonder woman tied to [TS]

01:13:59   any woman wonder woman is in many ways [TS]

01:14:01   the pragmatic conscience of the Justice [TS]

01:14:04   League and [TS]

01:14:04   somebody who has some pretty pretty well [TS]

01:14:07   thought out if not nuance but she's got [TS]

01:14:09   some fair she's got some pretty well [TS]

01:14:11   thought out ideas on what constitutes [TS]

01:14:12   justice and to whom it applies and under [TS]

01:14:15   what circumstances I would argue that in [TS]

01:14:17   a lot of ways she's the moral authority [TS]

01:14:18   of the Justice League in the way that's [TS]

01:14:20   Superman is not i mean Superman is [TS]

01:14:23   supposed to be for truth justice and the [TS]

01:14:24   American Way wonder woman's got around a [TS]

01:14:25   bigger picture [TS]

01:14:26   I yeah I think I just she's written well [TS]

01:14:29   she's been written poorly and everything [TS]

01:14:31   every time I've enjoyed it it's been you [TS]

01:14:33   get this sense of gravity of she's been [TS]

01:14:35   around 4,000 years or more and with the [TS]

01:14:39   jarwin cook i like the Darwin cook [TS]

01:14:40   iteration of Wonder Woman where she goes [TS]

01:14:42   into Vietnam and she starts teaching [TS]

01:14:43   women how to fight back [TS]

01:14:44   I think one might have the biggest range [TS]

01:14:46   of good and bad writing like there's [TS]

01:14:49   been some bad Batman's but there's been [TS]

01:14:51   some really bad Wonder Woman inning [TS]

01:14:53   yeah yeah take it i think that you soon [TS]

01:14:56   as you just take a look at the boots if [TS]

01:14:58   they have heels you're not being [TS]

01:14:59   strapped in it's not going to be was not [TS]

01:15:01   going to be a good ride if she's were [TS]

01:15:03   critical just your Wonder Woman Budaj oh [TS]

01:15:07   my goodness I love not exactly [TS]

01:15:09   Catwoman to it's like shit i never got [TS]

01:15:11   interesting that character until the [TS]

01:15:12   readers I think it was the the Darwin [TS]

01:15:14   cook redesign together you get to him [TS]

01:15:16   where what if we just put him in she's a [TS]

01:15:18   street-level fighter put her in [TS]

01:15:19   motorcycle boots something that's [TS]

01:15:20   practical she cannot be in stiletto [TS]

01:15:22   heels we can we can kind of justify the [TS]

01:15:25   whip because it's going to double as a [TS]

01:15:26   belt and stylistic thing but she's got [TS]

01:15:28   to wear some sensible boots yeah this is [TS]

01:15:31   what this is why I go up and down all [TS]

01:15:33   the different Black Canary outfits as [TS]

01:15:34   I'm like well the fish guts are kind of [TS]

01:15:36   iconic but on the other hand not [TS]

01:15:38   practical [TS]

01:15:39   they're not welcome from like Kevlar at [TS]

01:15:42   least she's got a leather jacket though [TS]

01:15:43   like that something [TS]

01:15:44   yeah I i would I wouldn't i would i [TS]

01:15:47   would be less uncomfortable with black [TS]

01:15:49   canary if she were not wearing fishnets [TS]

01:15:51   yeah I'm a little concerned about what [TS]

01:15:53   the art is going to be like a harley [TS]

01:15:55   quinn and power girl [TS]

01:15:56   oh god well didn't forget new outfit you [TS]

01:16:00   know Starfire got an outfit that is that [TS]

01:16:02   is not a bikini it's not like a monokini [TS]

01:16:06   d yeah it's better than the sexpot [TS]

01:16:09   person that's right progress already had [TS]

01:16:12   the the harley quinn Power Girl team up [TS]

01:16:14   in her own book [TS]

01:16:16   thatthat's they're great characters of [TS]

01:16:18   play off each other so gotten god knows [TS]

01:16:20   what version we're going to see by the [TS]

01:16:22   time this is published but power power [TS]

01:16:24   power girls the one with a boob window [TS]

01:16:25   right they torture into they worked they [TS]

01:16:27   worked harley quinn to air already which [TS]

01:16:29   is very funny very briefly she had awful [TS]

01:16:31   an off-camera line it was an off-camera [TS]

01:16:34   line but I was like oh my gosh don't [TS]

01:16:35   think some officers are a year behind a [TS]

01:16:37   narrow so shotwell this this was last [TS]

01:16:39   year [TS]

01:16:40   okay well so shush I still don't [TS]

01:16:42   understand why they can't just cast tara [TS]

01:16:44   strong as Harley clean in a movie or TV [TS]

01:16:46   show she does the voice better than [TS]

01:16:49   anyone that early instruction and she [TS]

01:16:51   looks like Harley Quinn but when they're [TS]

01:16:53   doing this [TS]

01:16:54   Suicide Squad movie differently if I may [TS]

01:16:57   be honest the reason we're not going to [TS]

01:16:58   casters because she's in her forties [TS]

01:17:00   right [TS]

01:17:01   what's that stuff called white on know [TS]

01:17:03   you that you say you say but the thing [TS]

01:17:05   is they want they want women that and [TS]

01:17:09   this is going to sound me they want [TS]

01:17:11   women that 20-something man can prevent [TS]

01:17:12   can can be like well plausibly for ready [TS]

01:17:14   to go to the bar the age difference will [TS]

01:17:16   not be so great [TS]

01:17:17   well here is my basic thesis about [TS]

01:17:20   harley quinn the more clothes she has on [TS]

01:17:22   the sexier the character is you may be [TS]

01:17:24   alone in that piece [TS]

01:17:26   oh yeah look at her in Batman the [TS]

01:17:28   Animated Series covered head-to-toe I [TS]

01:17:31   was horrible and that yeah [TS]

01:17:33   now look at the juggalo version for me [TS]

01:17:34   after that new 52 started but everyone [TS]

01:17:37   hates her [TS]

01:17:38   yeah I just I just don't know that she's [TS]

01:17:39   ever sexy because she's she's got a real [TS]

01:17:42   flaming instability that yeah she does [TS]

01:17:46   yeah we want you want you want to watch [TS]

01:17:47   from a safe distance but you don't want [TS]

01:17:49   her to ever know your name [TS]

01:17:51   listen don't judge me chris sims might [TS]

01:17:53   have written the definitive collar on [TS]

01:17:54   the unspeakable tragedy of being harley [TS]

01:17:56   quinn where the ideas that she's [TS]

01:17:58   hopelessly in love with fish like even [TS]

01:18:02   her dream of being in love with somebody [TS]

01:18:03   is just so fundamentally rotten and [TS]

01:18:05   wrong there's no way she can never live [TS]

01:18:06   as a fulfilled person in any capacity [TS]

01:18:08   whatsoever and that's that's just a huge [TS]

01:18:10   tragedy when you stop to think about it [TS]

01:18:11   so it's made me feel very sorry for this [TS]

01:18:14   whack job character I've always thought [TS]

01:18:15   there was a real sadness about her [TS]

01:18:17   because the Joker is just a force of [TS]

01:18:19   untamable insanity almost like a force [TS]

01:18:22   of nature is harley quinn is this woman [TS]

01:18:25   who [TS]

01:18:26   is has issues she really seems to have a [TS]

01:18:29   mental illness that keeps her from [TS]

01:18:31   having a normal life and that their way [TS]

01:18:34   there could be a way of curing her of [TS]

01:18:36   this but it's just not going to happen [TS]

01:18:38   in her current condition and that's [TS]

01:18:39   always to me that's always that tied [TS]

01:18:41   it's never at the forefront but every [TS]

01:18:43   time as i'm reading these these books by [TS]

01:18:45   a paparazzi and and and a controversial [TS]

01:18:49   name Amen Amanda Connor I love these [TS]

01:18:51   books there's always that tiny little [TS]

01:18:53   thing of ours this just a drop of trans [TS]

01:18:56   tragedy in there [TS]

01:18:57   yeah my favorite harley quinn is in [TS]

01:18:59   Batman adventures the comic book that's [TS]

01:19:01   based on batman the animated animated [TS]

01:19:02   series after they peel her away from the [TS]

01:19:05   Joker and she's hanging out with poison [TS]

01:19:06   ivy [TS]

01:19:07   it's a very similar dynamic because she [TS]

01:19:10   really likes IV and IV sort of tolerate [TS]

01:19:13   ER but it's healthier than with the [TS]

01:19:16   Joker DC Comics I don't you should read [TS]

01:19:20   Batman adventures those are fun [TS]

01:19:22   well is not a huge Gail Simone fangirl [TS]

01:19:24   and hurt her see her villains united in [TS]

01:19:28   secret six are phenomenal and i love the [TS]

01:19:30   secret six forearm for the puppet the [TS]

01:19:34   guy who has replaced all these joints [TS]

01:19:37   without rotating ball bearings because [TS]

01:19:38   he's he's harley quinn levels of crazy [TS]

01:19:40   and he's delightful because he spends [TS]

01:19:42   all of his evildoing money on buying gum [TS]

01:19:44   custom-made outfits for his book first [TS]

01:19:46   pet monkeys and its just oh it's awesome [TS]

01:19:49   you've got to read it and the letter M [TS]

01:19:51   Sonya is also fun and the land the [TS]

01:19:52   lettering for that series is exquisite [TS]

01:19:55   because she did they do a really good [TS]

01:19:57   job of different a very different [TS]

01:19:58   lettering styles from the characters but [TS]