The Incomparable

231: Eat Pray Love Die Survive


00:00:02   the incomparable number 231 January 2015 [TS]

00:00:10   welcome back everybody to be [TS]

00:00:11   uncomfortable i'm your host Jason [TS]

00:00:13   Snelling we're here tonight to convene [TS]

00:00:15   another edition of our book club we i we [TS]

00:00:18   we need to just change the title to [TS]

00:00:19   apocalypse book club because we do have [TS]

00:00:23   an awful lot at the I playing Lisa as [TS]

00:00:25   you shouldn't be such miser hold on [TS]

00:00:27   we're Edward apocalyptic books also out [TS]

00:00:30   there of course it's book club it [TS]

00:00:32   wouldn't be a book club angry people on [TS]

00:00:33   Twitter point out [TS]

00:00:34   were it not for the presence of Scott [TS]

00:00:36   McNulty hello Scott are you here is this [TS]

00:00:39   officially a book club [TS]

00:00:40   it is a book club huh cool grey thank [TS]

00:00:43   goodness [TS]

00:00:44   well now that we know that it's [TS]

00:00:45   officially a book club i'd like to [TS]

00:00:46   introduce my other two guests Monty [TS]

00:00:48   actually also joins us hello Monty know [TS]

00:00:51   Jason member electricity [TS]

00:00:53   oh good times remember podcasts are they [TS]

00:00:56   were like a traveling theater but but [TS]

00:00:59   they came to you over them the the [TS]

00:01:01   clouds [TS]

00:01:03   I can't even picture such a thing i know [TS]

00:01:05   i'll draw you a comic book about it [TS]

00:01:06   later [TS]

00:01:07   we're foreshadowing what the book is [TS]

00:01:09   David lower is also here hello David [TS]

00:01:11   hi I'm calling in from John Syracuse's [TS]

00:01:14   compound good because it's looking at [TS]

00:01:16   what relaxes saving their dad likes all [TS]

00:01:19   of lex's together here because it's very [TS]

00:01:21   safe Syracuse's children there did they [TS]

00:01:23   do a house swap 10 look at the circus is [TS]

00:01:25   going to take his children to where it's [TS]

00:01:26   safe it's just likes the house they have [TS]

00:01:28   to be rescued but i'll refer you to our [TS]

00:01:30   episode about but the dogstars for that [TS]

00:01:32   one [TS]

00:01:34   this is this is about two books that are [TS]

00:01:36   more or less about apocalypses one is [TS]

00:01:39   station eleven by Emily st. John Mandel [TS]

00:01:41   and one is the peripheral by william [TS]

00:01:43   gibson leases in my old pal william [TS]

00:01:46   gibson and we're also going to talk at [TS]

00:01:49   with with bonus bonus material for those [TS]

00:01:52   who read it i didn't but that's fine [TS]

00:01:54   about John Varley slow apocalypse [TS]

00:01:57   because Lisa felt that it would be [TS]

00:01:58   relevant to this discussion and I take [TS]

00:02:01   her at her word because i didn't get it [TS]

00:02:03   let's get it let's start with a station [TS]

00:02:08   11 which is a Scott you have you were [TS]

00:02:12   the one I heard about this book from and [TS]

00:02:14   and then I saw it on somebody's best of [TS]

00:02:17   the year list so you know you you really [TS]

00:02:20   like this one and recommended it to the [TS]

00:02:22   rest of us so this is all your fault [TS]

00:02:23   right [TS]

00:02:24   I'm doing all you're doing is also [TS]

00:02:27   pushed for it to you because apocalypses [TS]

00:02:30   it was I think widely acclaimed as a [TS]

00:02:34   very good book [TS]

00:02:35   yeah of last year so it made many lists [TS]

00:02:38   and so I wouldn't be surprised if much [TS]

00:02:41   like calculus both Lisa and I discovered [TS]

00:02:44   at the same time huh [TS]

00:02:46   and both large and suggested it as a [TS]

00:02:49   book we should read and in fact it was [TS]

00:02:51   my favorite book that I read last year [TS]

00:02:53   with a second followed closely by the [TS]

00:02:55   bone clocks by our good friend David [TS]

00:02:59   Mitchell of the cloud atlas has the [TS]

00:03:01   clout wait you know this book that that [TS]

00:03:03   that those books must hit the right spot [TS]

00:03:05   for you because this book reminded me of [TS]

00:03:06   the cloud atlas a little bit mmm little [TS]

00:03:08   bit I i enjoy when they interweave [TS]

00:03:10   different time different periods and [TS]

00:03:12   jump back and forth and connect [TS]

00:03:14   everything at the end satisfyingly or [TS]

00:03:17   not so now i have to ask you because we [TS]

00:03:19   know that one of your one of your [TS]

00:03:21   charming traits is that you cannot you [TS]

00:03:23   get booked amnesia and you can't [TS]

00:03:25   remember what happened in books do you [TS]

00:03:27   would you like to talk a little bit [TS]

00:03:28   about station eleven and what it's about [TS]

00:03:30   and why you liked it at to kick us off [TS]

00:03:32   since since uh I feel like Lisa will be [TS]

00:03:36   able to join me and talking about [TS]

00:03:38   peripheral I thought maybe I would go to [TS]

00:03:39   you for station eleven to start do you [TS]

00:03:42   have the or would you like a punt I'm [TS]

00:03:45   giving the opportunity i don't remember [TS]

00:03:46   anything that happened you talk about [TS]

00:03:48   I'll catch up later [TS]

00:03:49   I read this way back in November details [TS]

00:03:54   are hand that was like before [TS]

00:03:56   thanksgiving that screams an apocalypse [TS]

00:03:58   and then you and I will admit i was [TS]

00:04:02   looking for a synopsis online to refresh [TS]

00:04:06   my memory and I could not find one which [TS]

00:04:10   did not help [TS]

00:04:11   goodreads has a little one but there's [TS]

00:04:12   not on wikimedia strangely no that's [TS]

00:04:14   gross and the gist of the story is that [TS]

00:04:19   uh I mean super simplifying it there is [TS]

00:04:23   a big [TS]

00:04:26   virus of some sort which I forget the [TS]

00:04:28   Georgian flew very best and black right [TS]

00:04:31   uh-uh that yes that sweeps the the globe [TS]

00:04:34   and we drop we the story shifts between [TS]

00:04:38   pre globe sweeping virus post globe [TS]

00:04:44   sweeping virus and there's a comic book [TS]

00:04:47   part in the whole hair sprinkled [TS]

00:04:50   throughout so this is super high level [TS]

00:04:53   overview and then all the characters [TS]

00:04:55   kind of not all the characters the main [TS]

00:04:57   characters kind of connect throughout [TS]

00:04:59   the different time periods at the end [TS]

00:05:02   and i will say a lot of a lot of scenes [TS]

00:05:06   stood out in my mind but the overall [TS]

00:05:09   plot as with many things as evaporation [TS]

00:05:13   ok so that basically the plot is that [TS]

00:05:16   you you're following a couple different [TS]

00:05:19   characters mostly it is a Kirsten who is [TS]

00:05:25   a child actress at in a production of [TS]

00:05:29   King Lear in Toronto at the moment that [TS]

00:05:32   this virus basically goes global and [TS]

00:05:35   kills almost everybody and we we see her [TS]

00:05:38   as a child there and this famous a film [TS]

00:05:41   actor dies on stage dick Shawn like if [TS]

00:05:46   anybody remembers the story median Sean [TS]

00:05:48   dying on stage and uh and then she is [TS]

00:05:52   also we see her later travelling post [TS]

00:05:54   apocalypse in a company of musicians and [TS]

00:05:57   actors who go from town to town [TS]

00:05:59   performing performing plays and playing [TS]

00:06:02   music in the Midwest to the various [TS]

00:06:04   villages that have sprung up post the [TS]

00:06:06   post-apocalypse at least the ones that [TS]

00:06:08   aren't too creepy or violent and she's [TS]

00:06:12   so she's a part of that that group and [TS]

00:06:14   we also see various stories about people [TS]

00:06:18   other people who connected with that [TS]

00:06:19   actor including the the EMT who who [TS]

00:06:24   jumped up on stage and tried to save his [TS]

00:06:27   life when he died on stage and we we [TS]

00:06:30   meet we see how the EMTs life goes after [TS]

00:06:32   the apocalypse and also how he was [TS]

00:06:36   connected to people like the actors [TS]

00:06:39   ex-wife and ex-wives and his son and [TS]

00:06:44   that all is is kind of connected so we [TS]

00:06:46   see various things that stem from this [TS]

00:06:49   moment where these people are together [TS]

00:06:50   at this at the moment where the actor [TS]

00:06:53   dies and then we see his life and his [TS]

00:06:56   wives lives in his child's life and the [TS]

00:06:59   the life of this child actress who grows [TS]

00:07:01   up post-apocalypse and also the EMT and [TS]

00:07:04   it's all kind of interconnected and and [TS]

00:07:08   yeah the Indian it's the end of the [TS]

00:07:09   world because there aren't very many [TS]

00:07:10   people around more than anything else so [TS]

00:07:13   it isn't a case where the infrastructure [TS]

00:07:14   fails and then everybody dies it's a [TS]

00:07:16   case that everybody dies and then the [TS]

00:07:18   infrastructure fails because [TS]

00:07:19   theoretically it's just you know it's [TS]

00:07:22   all too messed up for people to put back [TS]

00:07:24   together at least not yet but something [TS]

00:07:27   about right yes [TS]

00:07:29   did you mention the comic book that the [TS]

00:07:31   actors ex-wife this yes this is the most [TS]

00:07:34   vital part of the story for me is the [TS]

00:07:37   actor who is arguably the one thing [TS]

00:07:40   everybody in this book has in common [TS]

00:07:42   the actor is this is a serial husband [TS]

00:07:45   and his first ex-wife spends her time [TS]

00:07:48   drawing a comic book series that she [TS]

00:07:51   never quite finishes but her husband or [TS]

00:07:54   her ex-husband as a few copies made up [TS]

00:07:56   he gives a copy to his son and he gives [TS]

00:07:58   a copy to Kirsten when she's a small [TS]

00:08:00   child too because he's using her as a [TS]

00:08:03   standard surrogate and that comic book [TS]

00:08:06   not only acts as a metaphor for the the [TS]

00:08:11   identity crisis that humanity is having [TS]

00:08:13   post extinction event it is also the [TS]

00:08:16   thing that unravels the central mystery [TS]

00:08:18   surrounding the the post-apocalyptic [TS]

00:08:22   world's principal antagonist that [TS]

00:08:25   Kirsten and her troop run into right [TS]

00:08:26   right it's a and provides the name of [TS]

00:08:29   the book because that's the comic book [TS]

00:08:31   is called station 11 and it is about a [TS]

00:08:33   scientist who lives on a space station [TS]

00:08:35   and and we discover see station yes yes [TS]

00:08:38   Lord undersea space station I it's on [TS]

00:08:41   another planet enters our file and [TS]

00:08:44   there's a violent conflict between [TS]

00:08:47   people who want to stay safe in the [TS]

00:08:48   states in the station and people who are [TS]

00:08:50   longing for life above the surface [TS]

00:08:52   and the metaphor for life in the bubble [TS]

00:08:56   is pretty effect is pretty affecting [TS]

00:08:57   because another one of the characters in [TS]

00:08:59   the story is the dead actors best friend [TS]

00:09:02   / business manager who ends up started [TS]

00:09:06   who ends up inadvertently colonizing an [TS]

00:09:07   airport with others with other survivors [TS]

00:09:10   and curating Museum of the world the [TS]

00:09:12   past I could fire off a spoiler warning [TS]

00:09:14   here but really it's book club we're [TS]

00:09:15   gonna talk about what's in the book if [TS]

00:09:17   you don't want to know what's in the [TS]

00:09:17   book don't listen until you ever take [TS]

00:09:19   your friend yeah and I'd i have to admit [TS]

00:09:22   i really love the report sequences oh my [TS]

00:09:24   god and I've been here for weeks but it [TS]

00:09:26   so I I one of the things that fascinates [TS]

00:09:28   me as with all these books is how [TS]

00:09:30   society unravels and the nature of how [TS]

00:09:32   its portrayed at and I want to talk [TS]

00:09:35   about that and then that also ties into [TS]

00:09:36   the gibson Scott I since you liked this [TS]

00:09:40   book so much I and I know we've got some [TS]

00:09:42   differing opinions on what's on the [TS]

00:09:44   panel I'm just you know there if you [TS]

00:09:46   wonder why Monty and David or crouching [TS]

00:09:48   in the weeds silently sneaking up behind [TS]

00:09:50   you that may be why brow shame I [TS]

00:09:54   couldn't find my chair [TS]

00:09:56   the important thing is that Scott draws [TS]

00:09:57   the five my crossbow out are you kidding [TS]

00:09:59   me there there lo there low-lying weeds [TS]

00:10:02   you have to stay below the the it's good [TS]

00:10:04   for my hamstrings of 14 you can stretch [TS]

00:10:07   out before we get there those Scott once [TS]

00:10:10   you tell us up if you've got a more [TS]

00:10:12   about why this book resonated with you [TS]

00:10:15   and why you thought it was one of your [TS]

00:10:16   favorites are your favorite from 2014 [TS]

00:10:19   so I think that a lot of books that deal [TS]

00:10:22   with the apocalypse tend to turn into [TS]

00:10:25   apocalypse porn where it's all talking [TS]

00:10:29   about you know the details of how the [TS]

00:10:31   apocalypse happened and you know [TS]

00:10:33   detailed planning which is exactly what [TS]

00:10:36   slow apocalypse is get through it with [TS]

00:10:39   you [TS]

00:10:40   yeah so it's it's a stark contrast and I [TS]

00:10:43   see why Lisa why you recommend it [TS]

00:10:44   because I start contractors contrast to [TS]

00:10:46   station 11 which is basically using the [TS]

00:10:48   apocalypse as a setting and kind of a [TS]

00:10:52   plot device to start spinning these [TS]

00:10:53   characters off and it does really [TS]

00:10:55   concerned itself with you know what's [TS]

00:10:57   happening with the apocalypse or why [TS]

00:11:01   uh you know this this disease is [TS]

00:11:03   rampaging throughout the world it just [TS]

00:11:06   happened and let's move on a which I [TS]

00:11:10   find refreshing because i think the most [TS]

00:11:13   the boring parts of the Apocalypse [TS]

00:11:15   stories to me are you know the mechanics [TS]

00:11:18   of the Apocalypse I'm more interested in [TS]

00:11:21   how people react and the relationships [TS]

00:11:24   and the characters that are driven [TS]

00:11:25   through it which i know is not a little [TS]

00:11:28   you know some people really like the the [TS]

00:11:30   apocalypse mechanics and that's fine i [TS]

00:11:32   would suggest reading slow apocalypse [TS]

00:11:34   because boy when you get your full of [TS]

00:11:37   apocalypse mechanics through that book [TS]

00:11:40   with it and if you're in Los Angeles it [TS]

00:11:42   will give you a detailed map of what you [TS]

00:11:45   doin out [TS]

00:11:45   yes if there's any kind of and I mean [TS]

00:11:48   you could draw a map based on hehe goes [TS]

00:11:51   into streets and and we're gonna axe [TS]

00:11:54   yes it's it's impressive amount of these [TS]

00:11:57   stories are most likely to be loaded [TS]

00:11:58   first [TS]

00:11:59   yes this does not well in fact there's a [TS]

00:12:02   i was going to say the book has amnesia [TS]

00:12:04   about what happens post-apocalypse but [TS]

00:12:06   actually the main character has amnesia [TS]

00:12:08   about what happens post upon she loses a [TS]

00:12:11   year we don't see the aftermath really [TS]

00:12:14   that makes it works because it's because [TS]

00:12:16   to imagine that a kids on the road for a [TS]

00:12:18   year and has blanked everything out like [TS]

00:12:20   and there's and she mentions there are [TS]

00:12:22   things that trigger her like certain [TS]

00:12:24   sites of meat cooking or things like [TS]

00:12:26   that and between not knowing what [TS]

00:12:28   happens and having that vague trigger [TS]

00:12:29   about watching charred bone over a fire [TS]

00:12:33   frankly anything that your imagination [TS]

00:12:35   comes up with is going to be horrific [TS]

00:12:36   well we don't see her after math but we [TS]

00:12:38   do see the airport after you I was going [TS]

00:12:40   to say the one place where you see a [TS]

00:12:43   spot by spot what happens after the [TS]

00:12:46   apocalypse is in the airport everything [TS]

00:12:47   else is sort of like we're on the [TS]

00:12:49   precipice of the apocalypse and then now [TS]

00:12:52   we're dealing with life after the [TS]

00:12:53   apocalypse but the airport you're right [TS]

00:12:55   steps which we get to very late in the [TS]

00:12:59   game does step through sort of so you're [TS]

00:13:02   in an airport and the world ends [TS]

00:13:04   what do you do what happens then just in [TS]

00:13:06   case it's like the place to be [TS]

00:13:08   I'm that was like that was my takeaway [TS]

00:13:10   it's inherently awesome at the airport [TS]

00:13:12   yes go to the airport [TS]

00:13:13   well what was interesting was how [TS]

00:13:15   quickly there though the one day the two [TS]

00:13:17   details that stuck with me on the first [TS]

00:13:19   three through because i read this book [TS]

00:13:21   twice the first time I read it linearly [TS]

00:13:23   front to back and then the second time i [TS]

00:13:25   actually went through back in like a [TS]

00:13:27   goal and picked it out character by [TS]

00:13:29   character to see how their stories hung [TS]

00:13:31   together as as just a series of short [TS]

00:13:33   interlocked stories and the two details [TS]

00:13:36   that stood out the first time in the [TS]

00:13:37   report sequence where that poor girl who [TS]

00:13:38   runs out of her her her energy [TS]

00:13:42   depression [TS]

00:13:43   yeah they're serum she's taking and [TS]

00:13:45   basically walked into the woods to go [TS]

00:13:47   kill herself and and then the second [TS]

00:13:50   thing that stuck with me was when they [TS]

00:13:52   took like a quick hard line on sexual [TS]

00:13:54   assault and kicked that guy to the [TS]

00:13:55   airport and get my rifle said good luck [TS]

00:13:57   don't ever come back here right and I [TS]

00:14:00   think the reason i was impressed with [TS]

00:14:01   that was because that's kind of contrary [TS]

00:14:04   to the ethos of a lot of United [TS]

00:14:07   apocalypse port is a great way of [TS]

00:14:08   putting it because a lot of these [TS]

00:14:09   authors seem to be seemed to really [TS]

00:14:11   relish the idea that yes women look up [TS]

00:14:13   acting channel they'll be treated like [TS]

00:14:14   currency and hear you had a bunch of [TS]

00:14:16   people saying look you know we're living [TS]

00:14:18   in a horrific time there's no reason for [TS]

00:14:21   us to have to put professed have to put [TS]

00:14:23   up with that and so both the the [TS]

00:14:26   horrible disintegration and and the very [TS]

00:14:28   real human cost of people who are going [TS]

00:14:29   to lose their lives because they ran out [TS]

00:14:30   of medication that was just something [TS]

00:14:31   that really stuck with me as did them by [TS]

00:14:35   consensus setting up in enforcing rule [TS]

00:14:37   of law and entering the airport airport [TS]

00:14:38   to an outpost I loved both of those [TS]

00:14:40   details now she included them that's not [TS]

00:14:42   one of one of the scenes the six with me [TS]

00:14:44   the most is in the airport a plane lands [TS]

00:14:47   shortly after they won't let him [TS]

00:14:50   yes they just let me die in there well [TS]

00:14:53   the people the people on the plane don't [TS]

00:14:55   get off friday right yeah right that [TS]

00:14:57   anyways I was just like looking at we [TS]

00:14:59   can't you know what I'm gonna [TS]

00:15:00   contaminate where we've landed [TS]

00:15:03   yeah yeah yeah i did there are lots of [TS]

00:15:06   moments I'm like Scott so there's lots [TS]

00:15:07   of moments that stick with me I I i [TS]

00:15:10   enjoy the I enjoyed the connections [TS]

00:15:12   between the characters i did again as [TS]

00:15:14   somebody who watch lost III don't know [TS]

00:15:17   how realistic is that they would be this [TS]

00:15:19   many coincidental really caused by the [TS]

00:15:21   and you're like oh the law of economy of [TS]

00:15:23   characters is in full effect everybody [TS]

00:15:25   you know is important to have a story [TS]

00:15:27   literally they all in a walk together [TS]

00:15:30   and I i did roll my I enjoyed the whole [TS]

00:15:32   but i really enjoyed this book but i did [TS]

00:15:35   roll my eyes at that was like oh well of [TS]

00:15:36   course it has to be this character [TS]

00:15:38   because there's no one else for it to be [TS]

00:15:41   so it must be them and yet i did i did [TS]

00:15:43   enjoy it it despite that I enjoyed the [TS]

00:15:46   we talk about soft and hard apocalypses [TS]

00:15:50   on the show sometimes and and I felt [TS]

00:15:52   like I felt like the this was a softer [TS]

00:15:55   apocalypse I feel like the airport was [TS]

00:15:57   really a soft landing it's like we made [TS]

00:15:58   it work it's ok we found that is then [TS]

00:16:01   there's a chilis yeah actually pretty [TS]

00:16:04   funny right this trip the idea is [TS]

00:16:06   there's so few people here it's like the [TS]

00:16:07   road earlier on when there's still stuff [TS]

00:16:09   in the houses but I did like that you [TS]

00:16:12   you have those moments where did you go [TS]

00:16:14   from town to town and sort of like in [TS]

00:16:16   the last the last policemen there are [TS]

00:16:19   places that are better in their places [TS]

00:16:21   that are worse but it's not be [TS]

00:16:22   completely negative view that everything [TS]

00:16:25   is going to just disintegrate into [TS]

00:16:26   nothing it's more like people that the [TS]

00:16:28   survivors do sort of band together in [TS]

00:16:30   some places are bad but a lot of places [TS]

00:16:32   are perfectly good and that that the [TS]

00:16:34   traveling musicians and actors this idea [TS]

00:16:37   that this is all the culture that's left [TS]

00:16:39   going from place to place [TS]

00:16:40   I found that charming and I I enjoyed [TS]

00:16:42   that because I I didn't I don't think I [TS]

00:16:45   had an appetite for a you know [TS]

00:16:47   completely brutal apocalypse and while [TS]

00:16:49   there are some threats and there's a bad [TS]

00:16:50   you know there's a bad cult kind of [TS]

00:16:53   leader who kills people [TS]

00:16:54   it uh I liked the optimism of the fact [TS]

00:16:57   that yeah sure the world win but we will [TS]

00:16:59   still be doing some Shakespeare and [TS]

00:17:01   playing some playing some music and [TS]

00:17:03   quoting star trek and reading comic [TS]

00:17:05   books Scott by the way they're quoting [TS]

00:17:07   star trek voyager i want to point that [TS]

00:17:09   out it's seven of nine so all right [TS]

00:17:11   thing with the new world the to the tuba [TS]

00:17:13   had said once it's just horrific short [TS]

00:17:15   on elegance and i like that you [TS]

00:17:18   basically have a bunch of people who are [TS]

00:17:19   dedicated to art and elegance because [TS]

00:17:21   that is their way of you know ascertain [TS]

00:17:23   their humanity also elect him his tents [TS]

00:17:26   ghoulish I like this book because it [TS]

00:17:28   kills off one of the narrator's and it [TS]

00:17:32   will be 0 because I said yeah because [TS]

00:17:34   one of my complaints about the [TS]

00:17:35   apocalypse born or the apocalypse onra [TS]

00:17:37   is it's always those plucky few who [TS]

00:17:39   somehow managed to survive either [TS]

00:17:40   because you know mother Abigail has [TS]

00:17:43   plans for them or John Varley has [TS]

00:17:46   provided them with matt handy friend who [TS]

00:17:48   can weld together school buses or [TS]

00:17:50   whatever only skill [TS]

00:17:53   yeah I've been waiting for this to [TS]

00:17:56   happen quite in this case the part you [TS]

00:17:58   know and again if you fear if your [TS]

00:18:02   listeners you've probably read the book [TS]

00:18:04   Miranda gets the flu and dies and the [TS]

00:18:07   way they paint hurt though the way [TS]

00:18:09   Mandel describes her death [TS]

00:18:10   it's just it's weirdly beautiful and I [TS]

00:18:14   was glad that narrator was actually up [TS]

00:18:16   because i felt like it gave me as a [TS]

00:18:18   reader more of a steak because instead [TS]

00:18:19   of like are these these eight people are [TS]

00:18:21   following her almost seriously part of [TS]

00:18:23   the ten percent that lives it was like [TS]

00:18:24   he had is gonna hit her she flies a lot [TS]

00:18:27   she was exposed all the time and then [TS]

00:18:28   she dies and yeah you have a moment [TS]

00:18:31   where you think oh she's gonna she's [TS]

00:18:33   gonna swim out to the boats that are in [TS]

00:18:35   the harbor because she knows about ships [TS]

00:18:36   and they're going to go across the ocean [TS]

00:18:38   they're going to save everybody [TS]

00:18:39   yay no she's gonna lay down and die on [TS]

00:18:43   the beach he described how she crawls [TS]

00:18:45   out of her hotel room and the the hotel [TS]

00:18:48   and the hotel's empty there's just this [TS]

00:18:49   guy who's lying in the corridor and she [TS]

00:18:52   just looks at him and hope that it's [TS]

00:18:54   enough that they have that moment of [TS]

00:18:55   connection she calls out to shays launch [TS]

00:18:57   and she looks the container ships and [TS]

00:18:59   which was her business and all and she [TS]

00:19:02   yeah and says too late to get to it [TS]

00:19:04   hurts to ship herself now but she's not [TS]

00:19:06   the thought there were people in this [TS]

00:19:07   really world who are safe i like I i [TS]

00:19:10   like that I what I don't like is the [TS]

00:19:11   fact that it Telegraph's that scene [TS]

00:19:14   about a chapter earlier by saying [TS]

00:19:16   that the last thing she thought of when [TS]

00:19:18   she was out on the beach before she died [TS]

00:19:19   was this and then later we see her do [TS]

00:19:21   that like really that's amazing to break [TS]

00:19:24   it to me gently on i did like that i [TS]

00:19:26   also like that indefinable expectations [TS]

00:19:30   jeevan is that his name Jenna jeevan [TS]

00:19:33   does not meet up with everybody else [TS]

00:19:34   after the apocalypse know he was like in [TS]

00:19:37   Virginia the whole chain hotel is [TS]

00:19:38   awesome who knows probably the Prophet [TS]

00:19:40   passes through and that's about it right [TS]

00:19:42   now but I was pretty certain he was [TS]

00:19:44   gonna show up at the airport because [TS]

00:19:45   everybody else's but if it finds its [TS]

00:19:48   weakness [TS]

00:19:48   yeah and I also like that's really short [TS]

00:19:51   on everybody's journeys it's just like [TS]

00:19:53   okay we've got through that there's no [TS]

00:19:54   point obsessing and there's a point [TS]

00:19:56   where somebody says you know young [TS]

00:19:59   people actually came through this a lot [TS]

00:20:00   better because they had less to forget [TS]

00:20:02   so they adapted more easily whereas [TS]

00:20:04   people who are in their twenties and [TS]

00:20:05   thirties for were acutely aware what [TS]

00:20:07   they've lost and I like that they're [TS]

00:20:10   that she actually details these really [TS]

00:20:11   sharp generational gaps between people [TS]

00:20:13   who are fully adult when one that the [TS]

00:20:15   extinction event hit and people like [TS]

00:20:18   Pearson who were interested in because [TS]

00:20:19   it just seems so remote to her like she [TS]

00:20:21   know she was alive but she has almost no [TS]

00:20:22   memory of it [TS]

00:20:23   let's take a brief break for our sponsor [TS]

00:20:26   this week it's mail route I told you [TS]

00:20:27   about mail route before and I use mail [TS]

00:20:29   route imagine world without spam or [TS]

00:20:32   viruses or bounce male clogging your [TS]

00:20:34   inbox imagine opening your email and [TS]

00:20:36   seeing only legitimate nail that you [TS]

00:20:38   want and need to receive mail route can [TS]

00:20:40   make this dream a reality [TS]

00:20:43   perhaps the apocalypse is really lots of [TS]

00:20:46   junk mail will you can solve the [TS]

00:20:48   apocalypse by using mail route so here's [TS]

00:20:51   our outworks I've got my email client on [TS]

00:20:54   my mac and on all my phones and iPads [TS]

00:20:56   and stuff and then I've got my mail [TS]

00:20:57   server at what you do is you configure [TS]

00:20:59   your mail so that before it gets to your [TS]

00:21:02   mail server it goes to mail route and [TS]

00:21:03   mail route will take all your inbound [TS]

00:21:05   mail for if you've got your own domain [TS]

00:21:07   like I do all the users in your domain [TS]

00:21:09   will scan it and they'll use their [TS]

00:21:11   intelligence to weed out what's bad mail [TS]

00:21:13   and if they don't deliver that the stuff [TS]

00:21:15   that gets to your server and then gets [TS]

00:21:17   to your apps is the good stuff and I've [TS]

00:21:20   been amazingly impressed at how good job [TS]

00:21:22   they do most of the junk is gone there's [TS]

00:21:24   very little junk that I see anymore and [TS]

00:21:27   they tend not to filter out [TS]

00:21:30   good messages every once in awhile i see [TS]

00:21:32   a message in my little daily digest that [TS]

00:21:33   mail route sends me that's a valid [TS]

00:21:35   message but it happens maybe once a [TS]

00:21:37   month [TS]

00:21:38   most of the time it's a hundred percent [TS]

00:21:40   effective and when there is a false [TS]

00:21:42   positive i click one link in that little [TS]

00:21:44   digest and the the center's [TS]

00:21:45   automatically whitelisted the mail is [TS]

00:21:47   automatically deliver it couldn't be [TS]

00:21:49   easier [TS]

00:21:49   you don't have to set up any hardware [TS]

00:21:51   software mail route does that all for [TS]

00:21:53   you if you're an email administrator or [TS]

00:21:55   an IT professional they built tools with [TS]

00:21:57   you in mind there's an API they support [TS]

00:21:59   ldap an active directory TLS male [TS]

00:22:01   bagging outbound relay everything you'd [TS]

00:22:03   want big universities and enterprises [TS]

00:22:05   use it and individuals can use it to so [TS]

00:22:07   start a risk-free trial with no credit [TS]

00:22:10   card necessary just sign up you change [TS]

00:22:12   your MX records on your server so you [TS]

00:22:14   got to be technical enough to understand [TS]

00:22:15   about mail servers but your mailbox and [TS]

00:22:17   hardware will be completely protected [TS]

00:22:19   it's simple it's effective there's no [TS]

00:22:21   reason not to try it all listeners to be [TS]

00:22:23   uncomfortable will receive ten percent [TS]

00:22:26   off the lifetime of your account so go [TS]

00:22:27   to mail route dotnet / Snell now to [TS]

00:22:31   receive that deal mail route dotnet / [TS]

00:22:33   smell and thank you to mail route for [TS]

00:22:35   sponsoring the incomparable and [TS]

00:22:36   filtering out all my spam Monty yes [TS]

00:22:39   oh here we go it's coming here comes the [TS]

00:22:42   debate [TS]

00:22:43   no I i think i mean i can i can see lots [TS]

00:22:45   of issues that people might have with [TS]

00:22:46   this book I just I i went with android [TS]

00:22:48   Monty what what are your what are your [TS]

00:22:49   thoughts are you seem to you seem to be [TS]

00:22:51   in in a more negative place about this [TS]

00:22:53   book I let us have it i thought this [TS]

00:22:59   book was incredibly lazy it felt like [TS]

00:23:04   the author wanted to tell a story about [TS]

00:23:06   before and after the apocalypse so took [TS]

00:23:09   a generic apocalypse event off-the-shelf [TS]

00:23:13   from the stand and took a generic [TS]

00:23:15   setting off the shelf and made no [TS]

00:23:19   attempt whatsoever to connect them in [TS]

00:23:21   any way other than the airport right [TS]

00:23:23   having the disconnection otherwise [TS]

00:23:25   that's that amnesia right it's the [TS]

00:23:27   amnesia allows you to go from point A to [TS]

00:23:29   point B without having to actually [TS]

00:23:31   doesn't [TS]

00:23:32   not if I believe it did because both [TS]

00:23:35   exist then I'm not judging i'm not [TS]

00:23:37   saying it's good but that's what that's [TS]

00:23:39   the trick here right here's the thing in [TS]

00:23:41   the airport people immediately gave up [TS]

00:23:45   on humanity [TS]

00:23:46   there's no attempt to do anything they [TS]

00:23:48   said oh well everybody's dead i guess [TS]

00:23:50   we're back to making tents out of [TS]

00:23:52   branches we found in this forest people [TS]

00:23:55   are thrown all the way back not to the [TS]

00:23:57   Middle Ages but to the Stone Age by this [TS]

00:24:01   people are suddenly unable to build [TS]

00:24:03   anything or make any I did question the [TS]

00:24:07   idea that that even if 99% of people [TS]

00:24:10   died i do question the idea that we that [TS]

00:24:12   nobody anywhere would be able to do [TS]

00:24:14   anything involving technology [TS]

00:24:17   I I kept asking myself cuz they talk [TS]

00:24:18   about electricity and I kept our I kept [TS]

00:24:21   asking myself what about all the solar [TS]

00:24:23   panels below so so here's my counter do [TS]

00:24:27   you remember in y the last man you got [TS]

00:24:29   to do is I'll read that right or many of [TS]

00:24:30   you read the comic series y the last man [TS]

00:24:32   and they actually have a section i [TS]

00:24:35   forget which trade its inward we're on [TS]

00:24:37   one of the characters says well the [TS]

00:24:39   reason the world is just such a hot mess [TS]

00:24:41   right now is because there were vast [TS]

00:24:44   industries that were print that were [TS]

00:24:46   predominately male and so there was a [TS]

00:24:47   lack of institutional knowledge and [TS]

00:24:49   things like that and what I'm thinking [TS]

00:24:51   is in order for this not in order for [TS]

00:24:53   people to get the lights back up and [TS]

00:24:54   running or to keep the Santa state [TS]

00:24:56   sanitation systems corner would have to [TS]

00:24:58   have you do have to have a critical mass [TS]

00:25:00   of people who either have that knowledge [TS]

00:25:02   or can pass that knowledge along and [TS]

00:25:05   when people are busy dying from the flu [TS]

00:25:07   if you're going to sit tight you're not [TS]

00:25:09   going to like no no you can't go your [TS]

00:25:10   sanitation engineer you have to pass on [TS]

00:25:11   the secrets of the valve right but 15-20 [TS]

00:25:14   years later presumably there's been some [TS]

00:25:16   collection in these towns of people who [TS]

00:25:18   know things and like I said household [TS]

00:25:20   rooftop solar panels are not that hard [TS]

00:25:23   I'm not even complaining it about the [TS]

00:25:24   electricity will get there we'll get [TS]

00:25:27   there [TS]

00:25:28   I feel like the the electricity the [TS]

00:25:30   electricity feels to me like she doesn't [TS]

00:25:33   want to deal with it because she's got a [TS]

00:25:34   beautiful image that she wants to have [TS]

00:25:35   at the very end of the book and and you [TS]

00:25:39   can't do that she's got a beautiful [TS]

00:25:41   image and can't be bothered to explain [TS]

00:25:43   it at all and that's [TS]

00:25:45   lazy storytelling no I think that once [TS]

00:25:47   you watch the entire planeload of people [TS]

00:25:49   die like on purpose [TS]

00:25:51   you're kind of like oh wow this is this [TS]

00:25:53   is bad news and and i think that if you [TS]

00:25:56   were to watch that puts the Whammy on [TS]

00:25:58   you [TS]

00:25:58   there's a moment in the airport when the [TS]

00:26:00   Museum of the past is being like it's [TS]

00:26:05   over time it's filling out and their [TS]

00:26:07   description says there were a number of [TS]

00:26:09   impractical shoes stilettos mostly [TS]

00:26:12   beautiful and strange because in the [TS]

00:26:14   others head were post-apocalypse were [TS]

00:26:17   past the time when people were where [TS]

00:26:19   impractical shoes think about in real [TS]

00:26:22   life [TS]

00:26:23   how long ago it was that nobody cared [TS]

00:26:27   about fashion so we're not only never [TS]

00:26:30   knew before electricity were bagged make [TS]

00:26:32   thousands of years to being cavemen [TS]

00:26:35   humanity just gave up completely [TS]

00:26:38   I don't buy that I i saw the shooting is [TS]

00:26:41   a commentary on a pedestrian culture [TS]

00:26:42   versus one where you have the luxury of [TS]

00:26:44   being carried places you know you're not [TS]

00:26:46   going to wear stilettos when you're [TS]

00:26:47   walking 10 15 miles a day if people were [TS]

00:26:50   in a pedestrian culture long after fancy [TS]

00:26:54   shoes were invented poor people remember [TS]

00:26:56   that for a long time like I'm thinking [TS]

00:26:59   back to when they have those huge crazy [TS]

00:27:01   platforms in Italy where rich people [TS]

00:27:03   would literally be strapped into their [TS]

00:27:04   Street shoes and strap back out again [TS]

00:27:06   and they had service to carry them [TS]

00:27:08   around here to help them walk from point [TS]

00:27:10   A to point B so their fancy shoes didn't [TS]

00:27:11   get ruined [TS]

00:27:12   you just yeah i think when one month you [TS]

00:27:14   may be saying here is to correct me if [TS]

00:27:16   I'm wrong 12 years you know [TS]

00:27:18   yeah you need your good choose for when [TS]

00:27:19   you're out hunting the venison right but [TS]

00:27:22   then you're in the you're in the [TS]

00:27:23   carpeted airport who wouldn't wear some [TS]

00:27:25   nice shoes from time to time I can't [TS]

00:27:28   believe we're having this conversation [TS]

00:27:28   money do you have more thoughts about [TS]

00:27:30   this because I i do think this is an [TS]

00:27:32   issue i think this is a book that does [TS]

00:27:33   not I enjoyed it a lot and I thought it [TS]

00:27:36   was kind of beautiful [TS]

00:27:37   I i agree that if you if you start to [TS]

00:27:39   pick the at the the premise you find [TS]

00:27:42   that it doesn't really hold up to any [TS]

00:27:44   scrutiny it doesn't really care about [TS]

00:27:46   the the specifics of the Apocalypse [TS]

00:27:49   really high high degree could drive a [TS]

00:27:52   certain type of reader crazy [TS]

00:27:53   among the things that suggest that this [TS]

00:27:55   author has put very little thought [TS]

00:27:58   into the setting in which much of the [TS]

00:28:00   story is based is the issue of books and [TS]

00:28:03   comic books and just reading in general [TS]

00:28:06   as you may remember in the Museum of the [TS]

00:28:10   future [TS]

00:28:11   srs the Museum of human history whatever [TS]

00:28:13   it's called the Stiletto museum will [TS]

00:28:16   call it cooks why not [TS]

00:28:19   it was possible to sit and read the [TS]

00:28:20   final newspapers 15 years old turning [TS]

00:28:23   Biddle pages and gloves that clark had [TS]

00:28:25   sewn together somehow [TS]

00:28:27   first of all newspapers do not go [TS]

00:28:29   brittle after 15 years right I know that [TS]

00:28:32   because i have you thinking that are [TS]

00:28:34   much older than take like a hundred [TS]

00:28:35   years yeah second this book has no idea [TS]

00:28:39   how many books and comic books there are [TS]

00:28:40   in the world it's confusing to me just [TS]

00:28:45   on a basic level that they keep talking [TS]

00:28:47   about how whenever anyone goes into [TS]

00:28:49   house they look for books and they look [TS]

00:28:51   for comic books they look for magazines [TS]

00:28:53   and they never find any of them they [TS]

00:28:56   find gossip magazines [TS]

00:28:58   that's a thousands of them in the [TS]

00:29:00   building i'm in it does feel a little [TS]

00:29:02   bit like I'm in a pastiche of aurorae be [TS]

00:29:06   medley of various apocalypse scenarios [TS]

00:29:08   that isn't particularly well thought-out [TS]

00:29:09   so this is this is the point about this [TS]

00:29:11   which is I I at several points Monty so [TS]

00:29:13   I'm on your side about this even though [TS]

00:29:15   i like that i'm on your side about this [TS]

00:29:16   part at several points i thought to [TS]

00:29:18   myself i don't know if this book knows [TS]

00:29:20   what apocalypse it's talking about [TS]

00:29:22   because there were moments where i read [TS]

00:29:24   it like you know this is this was the [TS]

00:29:26   flu [TS]

00:29:27   it doesn't eat books and there were not [TS]

00:29:30   like fires that consumed all buildings [TS]

00:29:33   everywhere right it just doesn't seem [TS]

00:29:35   right I think she's got a little bit of [TS]

00:29:37   a material culture fetish in the same [TS]

00:29:39   way that william gibson does and I i [TS]

00:29:41   kinda want to circle back to that with [TS]

00:29:43   the peripheral later but when she's [TS]

00:29:45   talking about objects and the imagine [TS]

00:29:49   social meaning they must have had or the [TS]

00:29:50   perp imagined past meeting [TS]

00:29:52   it seems like she's really caught up in [TS]

00:29:54   this very romantic vision of of people [TS]

00:29:56   sitting around wistfully thinking that [TS]

00:29:58   things were better in the past and if [TS]

00:30:01   the last movie of the Cornetto trilogy [TS]

00:30:03   worlds and taught us anything it's that [TS]

00:30:06   people just kind of roll with it and [TS]

00:30:08   there's always gonna be who were [TS]

00:30:09   actually happy things are the way they [TS]

00:30:10   are [TS]

00:30:11   we almost never ran into that here it's [TS]

00:30:13   a lot of people who are just like who [TS]

00:30:14   gossip magazines and and you know [TS]

00:30:17   they're cheerfully reading people's [TS]

00:30:18   houses and I do like this you're excited [TS]

00:30:21   about that i like that there are happy [TS]

00:30:22   towns because there are other there are [TS]

00:30:24   other stories like the walking dead or [TS]

00:30:25   something like that was like nope [TS]

00:30:26   everybody's miserable or dead that's why [TS]

00:30:28   I can't read them walking dead the road [TS]

00:30:30   yeah you are reading this book that I [TS]

00:30:32   was thinking the basic thesis of the [TS]

00:30:34   walking dead is that civilization is [TS]

00:30:36   impossible [TS]

00:30:37   yes if you can't get more than six [TS]

00:30:39   people together on the walking dead [TS]

00:30:40   before somebody goes crazy and start [TS]

00:30:42   shooting everyone else or starts eating [TS]

00:30:44   somebody else yeah that's yeah yeah so I [TS]

00:30:47   like that I like that but i but I don't [TS]

00:30:49   wear it where it's train my credulity [TS]

00:30:51   was ok they're happy towns that's good [TS]

00:30:53   but the happy towns are all kind of like [TS]

00:30:55   gentlemen farmers from you know from 500 [TS]

00:31:00   years ago or something like that they're [TS]

00:31:01   not like well we put things and again I [TS]

00:31:04   think part of this is that she wants to [TS]

00:31:05   end with this moment where they see [TS]

00:31:06   lights from a far-off town and think oh [TS]

00:31:08   my god [TS]

00:31:09   civilization is returning but you know [TS]

00:31:11   it seems it yeah it made me question [TS]

00:31:13   that it's like really it was the flu i [TS]

00:31:16   know a lot of people died but you've got [TS]

00:31:17   a lot of stuff laying around you can [TS]

00:31:19   probably figure it out in 15 years we [TS]

00:31:21   were able to create electricity is our [TS]

00:31:23   warehouses before this like when their [TS]

00:31:27   work wires everywhere I feel like it [TS]

00:31:30   could be done but she doesn't mention [TS]

00:31:31   before that final scene one guy who had [TS]

00:31:34   hooked his laptop up to his laptop up to [TS]

00:31:37   a stationary bicycle [TS]

00:31:38   yeah and it got just enough power and he [TS]

00:31:40   was looking for the internet which is a [TS]

00:31:42   stupid rich this is something new that [TS]

00:31:45   doesn't mean anything he could only do [TS]

00:31:47   it when he pedaled because batteries no [TS]

00:31:49   longer exists apparently yeah that's [TS]

00:31:51   fine I don't care that much about it [TS]

00:31:53   except for scoring a cheap point [TS]

00:31:55   yeah um not that I well I well that was [TS]

00:31:57   my friend who hasn't seen Gilligan [TS]

00:32:00   furiously pendulum the bamboo bicycle to [TS]

00:32:04   power a radio if they can do it come on [TS]

00:32:07   yeah if you just want like illumination [TS]

00:32:10   you can do that on the radio is a good [TS]

00:32:13   point two words like you could get [TS]

00:32:15   people you know to to communicate [TS]

00:32:17   there's this there is this feeling like [TS]

00:32:19   technology has just vanished and 8i just [TS]

00:32:21   weirdly and [TS]

00:32:22   you could go to a camping some outdoor [TS]

00:32:25   supply store right now and get two way [TS]

00:32:28   radios that you crank yeah right sure [TS]

00:32:30   maybe those stopped working after a [TS]

00:32:31   while but there are lots of them and not [TS]

00:32:34   that many people [TS]

00:32:35   yeah i mean my first my first place an [TS]

00:32:37   apocalypse go to bass pro shops there [TS]

00:32:40   you go [TS]

00:32:41   I so David you haven't said a lot i want [TS]

00:32:43   to ask you about the the at the actors [TS]

00:32:46   and and play parts of this since that [TS]

00:32:48   something near and dear to your heart [TS]

00:32:50   you have any thoughts about that that [TS]

00:32:52   part of the story [TS]

00:32:53   well you know and and listening to you [TS]

00:32:55   guys talking I'm you know I'm kind of in [TS]

00:32:57   between you and Monty I think that's a [TS]

00:32:59   good place to be part of an Oregon yeah [TS]

00:33:02   organ in the end I i think it drove me [TS]

00:33:06   nuts [TS]

00:33:07   although there's a lot of things I [TS]

00:33:08   really loved about it it's it's one of [TS]

00:33:10   those things where I really really loved [TS]

00:33:11   it until I hated it and I didn't really [TS]

00:33:14   hate it but I did love the idea that [TS]

00:33:18   here these people who go around keeping [TS]

00:33:22   the art alive and keeping you know where [TS]

00:33:24   we're going to play music and we're [TS]

00:33:25   gonna play Shakespeare and even like [TS]

00:33:26   that they're there is one character who [TS]

00:33:29   didn't like Shakespeare and after mouth [TS]

00:33:32   shut about it because well you know it's [TS]

00:33:35   something right we're still bringing art [TS]

00:33:38   even if it's not the art I like right [TS]

00:33:41   and and so the idea that this is [TS]

00:33:43   something that should survive in a [TS]

00:33:45   post-apocalyptic world that was that was [TS]

00:33:46   a nice idea I the yea yea though I mean [TS]

00:33:52   there is so much was I mean the language [TS]

00:33:55   was really poetic i loved a lot of the [TS]

00:33:57   imagery i loved a lot of the thought [TS]

00:34:00   that went into the things that she was [TS]

00:34:02   describing and I kept waiting for some [TS]

00:34:06   kind of logic to kick in right [TS]

00:34:09   I hated all the coincidences it was too [TS]

00:34:13   much coincidence [TS]

00:34:14   you know I was fine with the [TS]

00:34:15   coincidences you know I well it's like I [TS]

00:34:18   didn't need the EMT to have been a [TS]

00:34:20   former papa roxie could also interviewed [TS]

00:34:23   everyone it's like that was not what [TS]

00:34:25   the most ingenious are you for me they [TS]

00:34:28   really could have sliced his entire plot [TS]

00:34:30   line out and you would not have missed [TS]

00:34:31   anything [TS]

00:34:32   yeah he could be going to die down the [TS]

00:34:34   road out of town and it would have been [TS]

00:34:35   okay yeah i'll even there [TS]

00:34:38   I mean I liked I liked his actual story [TS]

00:34:42   i mean i like that you know holding up [TS]

00:34:44   with the brother and trying to be less [TS]

00:34:45   shallow but I didn't need him to have [TS]

00:34:48   any more connection with Arthur than the [TS]

00:34:50   fact that he tried to save his life [TS]

00:34:52   yeah but everything else was extraneous [TS]

00:34:54   was like what was the point of that [TS]

00:34:56   oh look everybody's connected no no [TS]

00:34:59   surprises with connections [TS]

00:35:01   good lord you know and so I I like that [TS]

00:35:05   he had nothing to do with anything by [TS]

00:35:07   the end but then why did he have so much [TS]

00:35:10   to do with everything in the beginning [TS]

00:35:11   it's like it's just everything about the [TS]

00:35:15   plot frustrated me and I didn't I didn't [TS]

00:35:18   mind not explaining things I didn't mind [TS]

00:35:21   you know [TS]

00:35:21   whoops apocalypse let's tell the story i [TS]

00:35:24   like that you know that it's just sort [TS]

00:35:25   of says we're going to set it here and [TS]

00:35:27   hear things that are going to happen [TS]

00:35:28   right but then you know and i'm reading [TS]

00:35:31   and reading and reading and going we're [TS]

00:35:33   running out of pages [TS]

00:35:34   what's what oh here's an exciting thing [TS]

00:35:36   with the Prophet guy and then up done [TS]

00:35:39   and then we're still running out of [TS]

00:35:40   pages and oh it just stopped [TS]

00:35:43   son of you know does it does end awfully [TS]

00:35:46   abruptly and the pacing seems kind of [TS]

00:35:48   strange I thought the proper is going to [TS]

00:35:50   be a big villain like he's going to [TS]

00:35:52   carry the plot for that last half of the [TS]

00:35:54   book i thought id do send getting dealt [TS]

00:35:56   with really that offhand matter yeah [TS]

00:35:59   just hide in the woods and then there's [TS]

00:36:01   a little bit of a thing and then I I [TS]

00:36:03   stabbed him and actually I thought the [TS]

00:36:05   first I thought that I thought that was [TS]

00:36:06   really kind of powerful because you look [TS]

00:36:08   at how those station eleven book manage [TS]

00:36:10   to save one person's life because some [TS]

00:36:13   crazy person uses it basically is as [TS]

00:36:15   almost an internal Bible and a lifeline [TS]

00:36:18   and it does save her life at the end of [TS]

00:36:19   the book but it it warped the Prophet [TS]

00:36:22   beyond imagination for the time he was a [TS]

00:36:23   little boy right [TS]

00:36:25   I loved that I loved that detail i just [TS]

00:36:28   wanted more basis for it i wanted more [TS]

00:36:30   it seems a little bit like that guide [TS]

00:36:32   your MFA classes like CR is both coding [TS]

00:36:34   Andrew dumped [TS]

00:36:35   but I don't like how i did like how [TS]

00:36:38   there was that one small moment where [TS]

00:36:40   you know it is literally where there's a [TS]

00:36:42   little bit of tragedy because those two [TS]

00:36:44   people are literally the only people go [TS]

00:36:45   to people who can have that conversation [TS]

00:36:47   and they finally found the other person [TS]

00:36:49   that can have that conversation with [TS]

00:36:50   about this unfinished story from 20 [TS]

00:36:52   years ago and has to end like it ends [TS]

00:36:55   and then it loops back around to Miranda [TS]

00:36:57   who has she's dying hallucinates the [TS]

00:36:59   sunset into the setting of station [TS]

00:37:01   eleven and basically dies while she's [TS]

00:37:02   cycling through a hallucination of the [TS]

00:37:05   of-of-of station eleven itself so [TS]

00:37:07   there's it's you know for one moment [TS]

00:37:09   you're kind of caught up in this big [TS]

00:37:11   oh my god death and connection and [TS]

00:37:13   really it's all transcended then you're [TS]

00:37:14   like wait that not only museum every [TS]

00:37:17   night I loved all the detail around [TS]

00:37:19   station eleven itself and i loved the [TS]

00:37:21   connections and I loved Clark at the end [TS]

00:37:23   realize yeah yeah at that dinner party [TS]

00:37:25   right that that's in the comic and going [TS]

00:37:29   back to not liking Shakespeare I like [TS]

00:37:31   the fact that Arthur who is in a [TS]

00:37:34   Shakespeare play is saying well i sent [TS]

00:37:38   the one comic to my son and here you [TS]

00:37:40   have the other one because i really [TS]

00:37:41   don't get comics and I don't like comics [TS]

00:37:43   but Miranda gave them to me anyway so [TS]

00:37:45   here and it was it was just this really [TS]

00:37:47   nice thing of you know people who get [TS]

00:37:51   certain kinds of art and not others and [TS]

00:37:53   and it's ok that some art is not you [TS]

00:37:56   know everybody's art right that you can [TS]

00:37:59   like different things and I thought that [TS]

00:38:01   was really nice thread throughout but [TS]

00:38:04   yeah i mean the the thing that struck me [TS]

00:38:08   as i was reading it was I would really [TS]

00:38:10   love to adapt to this into something but [TS]

00:38:12   i would want to you know give it more of [TS]

00:38:16   a plot i would want more character error [TS]

00:38:18   you know I you know let them bump into [TS]

00:38:21   each other more and more interesting [TS]

00:38:24   ways I mean it just it felt like really [TS]

00:38:26   really interesting and poetic revolution [TS]

00:38:29   fanfiction so i'm going to say i'm going [TS]

00:38:32   to say another another other thing i [TS]

00:38:33   mentioned that i feel like the the [TS]

00:38:36   technology is suppressed in part to get [TS]

00:38:39   an image at the end of that that town [TS]

00:38:42   far away that has lights [TS]

00:38:44   I feel like that's also true i think the [TS]

00:38:46   some of the important plot [TS]

00:38:49   points with the latter part of the book [TS]

00:38:50   are suppressed for a long time because [TS]

00:38:53   I'm the writer once a surprise [TS]

00:38:58   that's the identity of the Prophet which [TS]

00:39:00   like I said there's a lot of economy of [TS]

00:39:02   characters so it's 900 surprising and [TS]

00:39:04   all we're not remotely anything and in [TS]

00:39:06   fact that's why I looking back on it I [TS]

00:39:08   feel like there are a lot of [TS]

00:39:10   developments that happened in the last [TS]

00:39:11   third of the book that should probably [TS]

00:39:13   have been pulled across the whole book [TS]

00:39:15   because it doesn't feel like there are [TS]

00:39:17   large elements that that are are [TS]

00:39:21   introduced really late and that leads to [TS]

00:39:23   some weird pacing where it feels like [TS]

00:39:25   you know this is just coming out like we [TS]

00:39:28   leave giovan you know we got him in hit [TS]

00:39:31   with his brother and all that and then [TS]

00:39:32   it's like a very late he comes back in [TS]

00:39:34   with his one tidbit of information about [TS]

00:39:36   the prophet and the Prophet story [TS]

00:39:38   himself we see the town but the the [TS]

00:39:40   story the whole Airport story kinda [TS]

00:39:42   comes in late so there's some things [TS]

00:39:44   about that I had that I at the time I [TS]

00:39:46   thought well this is weird that this is [TS]

00:39:47   suddenly turning this way but now that [TS]

00:39:49   I've seen the whole story I think maybe [TS]

00:39:52   that's just because that she wanted that [TS]

00:39:54   that moment and so the whole book gets [TS]

00:39:56   distorted a little bit because of that [TS]

00:39:58   moment and and like i said i really [TS]

00:40:00   enjoy I I actually really enjoyed this [TS]

00:40:01   book but I I certainly could make a list [TS]

00:40:03   of things that aren't dead bug me about [TS]

00:40:05   it [TS]

00:40:06   yeah i mean i'm glad i read it and i [TS]

00:40:07   really enjoyed so much of the language [TS]

00:40:10   and so many of the descriptions but then [TS]

00:40:12   you know one of the things that was [TS]

00:40:13   driving me nuts throughout was you know [TS]

00:40:15   describing you know [TS]

00:40:17   well here's Kirsten and here's Syed and [TS]

00:40:19   here's the conductor and here's the oboe [TS]

00:40:22   and know they know their names just use [TS]

00:40:25   their names and i realized i would argue [TS]

00:40:26   that names anymore they're spending [TS]

00:40:28   apocalypse [TS]

00:40:29   nothing is changed it well I realize it [TS]

00:40:32   disappeared i realized that was [TS]

00:40:34   basically just an excuse to always use [TS]

00:40:35   that the term the profit instead of [TS]

00:40:37   every African to have a name and Oh [TS]

00:40:39   we'll sort of obscure it a little bit by [TS]

00:40:41   other people not using names and it's [TS]

00:40:43   like no no none of that was a surprise i [TS]

00:40:47   would have been more interested in [TS]

00:40:49   seeing how this little boy became the [TS]

00:40:54   Prophet you know I want to see a little [TS]

00:40:56   bit more than just that little tiny [TS]

00:40:58   thing you get at the airport [TS]

00:40:59   Elizabeth was the most frustrating [TS]

00:41:01   character for maybe [TS]

00:41:02   because she basically exist to be [TS]

00:41:03   described by everybody else as in me I [TS]

00:41:07   know and well this is the thing she gets [TS]

00:41:09   described as being fragile as being [TS]

00:41:11   impulsive as being driven by fear is [TS]

00:41:13   turning into some sort of blind [TS]

00:41:15   religious fanatic and you think all [TS]

00:41:17   through the airport partner laying down [TS]

00:41:19   the fact this pork is isolated by his [TS]

00:41:22   nut bar mother and has gotten a little [TS]

00:41:23   weird and funny himself and I thought [TS]

00:41:25   why don't we get some of her perspective [TS]

00:41:27   on all of this too because she was [TS]

00:41:30   remember she was flying back for the [TS]

00:41:32   funeral of her ex-husband and her [TS]

00:41:34   child's father the kid had a strained [TS]

00:41:35   relationship with the father to begin [TS]

00:41:37   with so he was clearly not in a good [TS]

00:41:39   place and that's given no quarter [TS]

00:41:42   whatsoever in the book that you have [TS]

00:41:44   this group this grieving woman and the [TS]

00:41:45   screaming child trapped in middle of [TS]

00:41:47   nowhere during during an extinction [TS]

00:41:48   event and she doesn't in you know in the [TS]

00:41:51   in the Miranda segments she comes off as [TS]

00:41:53   not having a whole lot of ways of coping [TS]

00:41:55   skills but we don't ever find out why we [TS]

00:41:58   don't ever find out what she's thinking [TS]

00:41:59   we just get everybody else's pictures of [TS]

00:42:01   her [TS]

00:42:01   yeah I felt like to be kind of mean and [TS]

00:42:03   unnecessary to be honest like her real [TS]

00:42:05   transformation happens completely off [TS]

00:42:07   screen right right exactly airport and [TS]

00:42:10   it's like well suffice to say they spent [TS]

00:42:12   a lot of time walking around and her son [TS]

00:42:14   became a crazy profit [TS]

00:42:15   yeah and she was fine with it you know [TS]

00:42:17   and it's it's I'm not I'm not asking [TS]

00:42:18   that we get basically like Bates Motel [TS]

00:42:20   flu edition where you know mother most [TS]

00:42:22   mother must never know but um I I feel [TS]

00:42:26   like we shouldn't we need to know more [TS]

00:42:27   about her [TS]

00:42:28   Arthur's like this cipher through the [TS]

00:42:30   whole book and I mean it's it's sort of [TS]

00:42:32   designed to you know i mean because we [TS]

00:42:36   keep coming back to him and coming back [TS]

00:42:38   to stories about him and and so I guess [TS]

00:42:40   we're supposed to learn and figure out [TS]

00:42:43   who he was and why everyone is so [TS]

00:42:46   interested in him and I never did figure [TS]

00:42:48   out why everyone was so interested in [TS]

00:42:50   him I didn't really learn anything about [TS]

00:42:52   him except for the fact that he was an [TS]

00:42:54   actor who married three women had a [TS]

00:42:56   child and died on stage and nothing i'm [TS]

00:42:59   a little town in Canada little time on [TS]

00:43:01   Vancouver Island wrote letters to a girl [TS]

00:43:02   back home we decide to exploit him and [TS]

00:43:04   publish a book who we never hear [TS]

00:43:06   anything really about we never really [TS]

00:43:09   understand why anyone else married and [TS]

00:43:11   we sort of get [TS]

00:43:12   why Miranda Miriam but we don't really [TS]

00:43:15   know anything else about the other women [TS]

00:43:17   we don't know anything about the [TS]

00:43:19   relationship with him in the child and [TS]

00:43:21   and I mean there's so many interesting [TS]

00:43:22   stories here that are just good left [TS]

00:43:26   behind [TS]

00:43:27   literally it was still a beautiful [TS]

00:43:29   region was like command of language i'm [TS]

00:43:32   really glad i read it i think that's the [TS]

00:43:34   strength of it is I I like a lot of the [TS]

00:43:37   images a lot of the individual scenes [TS]

00:43:38   the writing is beautiful and that's why [TS]

00:43:41   I can forgive a lot of those you know [TS]

00:43:43   eyebrow-raising moments where I where I [TS]

00:43:46   think I'm not sure this holds together [TS]

00:43:47   as a deposit on what an apocalypse might [TS]

00:43:50   be like because I do appreciate the ride [TS]

00:43:54   and the artistry and some of the scenes [TS]

00:43:56   and specific that are very vivid even [TS]

00:43:57   now in my mind Scott how you doing out [TS]

00:44:00   there gotta check in back with you [TS]

00:44:01   you've been silent as everybody's been [TS]

00:44:02   beating up your favorite book of 2014 [TS]

00:44:04   but that's that's fine that we have [TS]

00:44:06   different people get the the beauty of [TS]

00:44:08   literature's that different people get [TS]

00:44:10   different things out of it and if those [TS]

00:44:12   people who disagree with me or wrong [TS]

00:44:14   that's fine [TS]

00:44:16   obviously I'm kidding but uh yeah i mean [TS]

00:44:20   i think that the the storytelling it [TS]

00:44:23   will not storytelling with of the pros [TS]

00:44:25   and her ability as a writer to create [TS]

00:44:28   these scenes is what made it the best [TS]

00:44:31   book that I read last year now if I was [TS]

00:44:35   judging it as a science fiction novel [TS]

00:44:37   doesn't know it is a bad science fiction [TS]

00:44:41   novel whereas slow apocalypse is a good [TS]

00:44:44   science fiction novel if I'm judging it [TS]

00:44:46   as a novel I think it's a great novel [TS]

00:44:48   and slow apocalypse is a bad novel had [TS]

00:44:53   some of the most beautiful language and [TS]

00:44:55   beautiful descriptions over in the last [TS]

00:44:57   three or four years so I'm really glad i [TS]

00:45:00   read it but but it was very frustrating [TS]

00:45:02   i highlighted this Arthur lives in a [TS]

00:45:04   permanent state of disorientation like a [TS]

00:45:06   low-grade fever the question hanging [TS]

00:45:07   over everything being how did I get from [TS]

00:45:10   there to here so what I wonder is if the [TS]

00:45:13   vagueness that describes him is is [TS]

00:45:16   basically supposed to be a stand-in for [TS]

00:45:18   his mental state and that's and that's [TS]

00:45:20   the parallel were supposed to draw is [TS]

00:45:21   this is a guy who is disconnected from [TS]

00:45:24   the world around [TS]

00:45:25   him and so we don't ever really get a [TS]

00:45:26   feeling for who he is because he's [TS]

00:45:27   almost literally not there even when he [TS]

00:45:29   is there i think i think you are you he [TS]

00:45:31   is the connection point and that's why [TS]

00:45:32   he exists and that that's hit he's the [TS]

00:45:34   he's the you see him through the you [TS]

00:45:38   know what's left behind by the [TS]

00:45:39   connections and you know that's not an [TS]

00:45:41   actual person it so he is he's famous [TS]

00:45:45   just because he's famous right he's he's [TS]

00:45:48   he's not like a great actor he's [TS]

00:45:50   good-looking and I think he's a movie [TS]

00:45:52   star but we we don't really get much not [TS]

00:45:54   information about the movies he's a star [TS]

00:45:57   from right now he's in he headlined a [TS]

00:45:59   movie or two [TS]

00:46:01   yeah and that he kind of get the [TS]

00:46:03   impression hey look it's kind of a hates [TS]

00:46:05   that guy like how Christian Slater house [TS]

00:46:08   three more famous than hey it's that guy [TS]

00:46:09   if any girl who date's him gets [TS]

00:46:12   paparazzi he's christian slater he had [TS]

00:46:14   like three hits and then he had his [TS]

00:46:15   cuffs and went down [TS]

00:46:17   nice experience way more famous than [TS]

00:46:19   that any girl he dated gets biraj with [TS]

00:46:21   paparazzi that's that's true there are [TS]

00:46:24   books you know coming out about his his [TS]

00:46:26   name is and you again i was i wouldn't [TS]

00:46:28   much matter and to think the thing that [TS]

00:46:30   struck me about that whole part of the [TS]

00:46:32   plot was every time I saw Elizabeth and [TS]

00:46:35   Tyler I thought Elizabeth Taylor and [TS]

00:46:37   then I thought Richard unit vector in [TS]

00:46:39   taylor and i thought about the paparazzi [TS]

00:46:41   in the crazy you know all the things [TS]

00:46:43   around burton and taylor and all because [TS]

00:46:44   I richard burton biography that's really [TS]

00:46:46   good bye melvyn bragg anyway that's what [TS]

00:46:48   popped into my head and I thought we [TS]

00:46:51   have no basis for that level of Fame for [TS]

00:46:54   the sky [TS]

00:46:55   you know who I mean even even the most [TS]

00:46:59   shallow giant superstar has some kind of [TS]

00:47:02   charisma because they wouldn't become [TS]

00:47:04   giant super movie stars without it [TS]

00:47:07   so this is another parallel to william [TS]

00:47:09   gibson who is also obsessed with [TS]

00:47:11   celebrity very ago I sort of did like [TS]

00:47:15   the scenes where the kids were like the [TS]

00:47:18   kids and Thunderdome not understanding [TS]

00:47:20   anything or to quote the book itself you [TS]

00:47:22   see the way their eyes glaze over when [TS]

00:47:24   anyone talked to them about antibiotics [TS]

00:47:26   or engines it's science fiction to them [TS]

00:47:28   that's an interesting idea but it does [TS]

00:47:31   not at all hold up with the other scenes [TS]

00:47:34   of kids desperately reading children [TS]

00:47:36   celebrity gossip magazines and common [TS]

00:47:38   like you can't have kids goggle eyed of [TS]

00:47:42   the idea of electric lights and also [TS]

00:47:46   reading magazines that show electric [TS]

00:47:49   lights those two don't go together [TS]

00:47:52   alright also i think and i might be [TS]

00:47:56   imagining this but I think there's a [TS]

00:47:57   weird strain of light ism in this book [TS]

00:48:00   oh yeah i'll go with them I agree [TS]

00:48:03   there's the scene where for no reason [TS]

00:48:06   there's a rant about people who use [TS]

00:48:08   textspeak because what it would have [TS]

00:48:11   taken too much time and effort to punch [TS]

00:48:13   in an extra three letters and just say [TS]

00:48:14   thanks and i don't think it's a [TS]

00:48:17   coincidence that Tyler is always playing [TS]

00:48:19   his video game machine and then it goes [TS]

00:48:22   away and then he becomes the evil [TS]

00:48:24   properties intrinsic I don't think [TS]

00:48:28   that's a coincidence and I think it's [TS]

00:48:30   weird and he's more upset about the [TS]

00:48:32   video game than his father [TS]

00:48:34   yeah SeaWorld disconnected from the [TS]

00:48:36   world man [TS]

00:48:37   well the game has been there and his dad [TS]

00:48:38   is not so you can look at that way like [TS]

00:48:40   there's an apocalypse and suddenly [TS]

00:48:42   everybody stops caring about video games [TS]

00:48:44   and texting and fancy shoes you guys we [TS]

00:48:47   just have music and Shakespeare's shake [TS]

00:48:50   up here by the way that anything from [TS]

00:48:51   the last 400 years because Shakespeare [TS]

00:48:54   well the david mamet plays they are in a [TS]

00:48:56   town really fast for those so you burn [TS]

00:48:58   you burn those for fuel they were used [TS]

00:49:00   for fuel these trees were keeping pretty [TS]

00:49:04   important save the trans and Gary Glen [TS]

00:49:06   Rose good-bye again it's not like the [TS]

00:49:09   city because again that's that's the [TS]

00:49:10   moment where I think we're I think she [TS]

00:49:12   thinks this is the road and they burned [TS]

00:49:14   all the trees and there's nothing left [TS]

00:49:16   but there are forests full of trees so [TS]

00:49:19   it's not the right this is the this is [TS]

00:49:21   the harshest group of critics I've CNN [TS]

00:49:22   station eleven and here's my theory as [TS]

00:49:25   to why is because we have already a lot [TS]

00:49:27   of apocalyptic novels and i think at [TS]

00:49:29   this point like that but it has to pass [TS]

00:49:31   a number of sniff test for this is not a [TS]

00:49:34   science fiction novel and if you treat [TS]

00:49:36   it like a science fiction novel we can [TS]

00:49:38   spend for us fail pointing out all the [TS]

00:49:40   things that are wrong about it this is [TS]

00:49:41   not mean it picking this is me [TS]

00:49:43   describing things that took me out of [TS]

00:49:45   the book because the author could not be [TS]

00:49:47   bothered to think through the apocalypse [TS]

00:49:49   story she wanted to tell you wanted up [TS]

00:49:52   underdome scene where kids go tell us [TS]

00:49:54   about what it was like to have air [TS]

00:49:55   conditioning [TS]

00:49:57   she also wanted if it's already where [TS]

00:50:00   people regardless of magazines after the [TS]

00:50:02   apocalypse and the they don't go [TS]

00:50:05   together and the author makes no attempt [TS]

00:50:06   to make them go together what else do [TS]

00:50:08   you have on your list [TS]

00:50:09   oh the rest is actually nitpicking like [TS]

00:50:12   to draw your motorcycle until it stopped [TS]

00:50:17   working and then you gave up you know [TS]

00:50:19   you could put a diesel engine in there [TS]

00:50:20   and put vegetable oil in I totally could [TS]

00:50:23   not do that if you were given 20 years [TS]

00:50:25   and free right buddies are available [TS]

00:50:28   libraries to really figure it out i [TS]

00:50:30   don't think i would try i'm pretty sure [TS]

00:50:32   i'm going to be the person who blows off [TS]

00:50:34   her fingers and a really dumb accident [TS]

00:50:35   like two weeks and that's assuming i'm [TS]

00:50:37   not there are no zombies in this [TS]

00:50:38   apocalypse see this for again just end [TS]

00:50:41   up making tents out of branches you [TS]

00:50:44   brought in from the forest and living in [TS]

00:50:47   an airport for the rest of your life i [TS]

00:50:49   want to point out there's enough canned [TS]

00:50:51   food and other goods to fulfill modern [TS]

00:50:54   society and now 99% of those people are [TS]

00:50:57   not consuming anything anymore so the [TS]

00:51:00   supermarket of the world is open i think [TS]

00:51:03   the people who survived have got a lot [TS]

00:51:05   of books and a lot of food and a lot of [TS]

00:51:07   stuff and again when when [TS]

00:51:09   item one breaks go to item to because [TS]

00:51:11   there's Walmart's got 500 of them i [TS]

00:51:14   think the people who wrote and read this [TS]

00:51:16   book really have no like they read books [TS]

00:51:21   that usually have pictures of like [TS]

00:51:22   pigeon-toed girls and mackintoshes on [TS]

00:51:24   the cover and are about dating and [TS]

00:51:26   whatnot and so we're not basically the [TS]

00:51:29   coach [TS]

00:51:30   yes burn and so they're not really [TS]

00:51:33   again they're not likely sure I i [TS]

00:51:35   recently sure that if if if the [TS]

00:51:37   extinction that were to hit you all [TS]

00:51:39   would be fine i mean we've established [TS]

00:51:40   that i'm going to blow off my fingers [TS]

00:51:42   and probably end up in some horrible [TS]

00:51:43   camp but I'm totally did this the [TS]

00:51:46   Syracuse the compound is is welcoming [TS]

00:51:48   it's not like 3,000 miles away [TS]

00:51:51   that's the problem but yeah you can you [TS]

00:51:52   can get a bottle balloon and go there a [TS]

00:51:54   problem i can't just caravan with you [TS]

00:51:56   guys wait I can't just caravan with are [TS]

00:51:58   you are you planning on sticking it out [TS]

00:51:59   in in millimeter and possibly it's [TS]

00:52:02   defensible after the apocalypse everyone [TS]

00:52:04   will travel by hot [TS]

00:52:05   balloon so yeah oh my god would be the [TS]

00:52:07   best thing but the point is is I don't [TS]

00:52:09   think anybody who wrote or read this [TS]

00:52:10   book has the extensive back in in [TS]

00:52:16   apocalyptic reality show the video is [TS]

00:52:19   true just your arguments here and and i [TS]

00:52:21   totally agree with Scott that has novel [TS]

00:52:23   this work for me and as science fiction [TS]

00:52:25   it is a complete failure [TS]

00:52:26   I i think though and Monty you can be my [TS]

00:52:30   reality check on this I think the [TS]

00:52:32   argument is you're going to write a book [TS]

00:52:33   set in an apocalypse you got out there [TS]

00:52:36   is a level of work you probably need to [TS]

00:52:38   do you have your story makes sense and [TS]

00:52:41   you can't and it shows a fundamental [TS]

00:52:44   lack of respect for the reader and and [TS]

00:52:48   if there and for world-building if you [TS]

00:52:51   just kind of wave it off and say look [TS]

00:52:52   you know it's a bunch of different [TS]

00:52:53   apocalypses suffice it to say there's an [TS]

00:52:55   apocalypse let me tell you my story and [TS]

00:52:57   that you know you can write a beautiful [TS]

00:52:59   book that people like but it will [TS]

00:53:02   frustrate a lot of readers because you [TS]

00:53:04   didn't make enough effort to have your [TS]

00:53:06   story makes sense i wouldn't mind it if [TS]

00:53:09   it were if the book started with [TS]

00:53:10   hand-waving but if you have scenes [TS]

00:53:12   before and after the apocalypse and [TS]

00:53:15   there's no attempt to get from one to [TS]

00:53:17   the other than for me no matter how nice [TS]

00:53:20   individual scenes are the whole thing [TS]

00:53:23   like I say just feels lazy really lazy [TS]

00:53:27   right for me it's not that it doesn't [TS]

00:53:28   work as a science fiction novel I didn't [TS]

00:53:30   think it worked as a novel i think it [TS]

00:53:32   works as some really beautiful character [TS]

00:53:34   sketches and some really beautiful [TS]

00:53:36   poetry and there's so much granular [TS]

00:53:40   detail about some things and so much [TS]

00:53:42   hand-wavy him about so much else [TS]

00:53:45   it's like if you're gonna do you know go [TS]

00:53:47   with the hand wave him or go with the [TS]

00:53:48   granular because if you just kind of [TS]

00:53:51   blend it as it comes to you [TS]

00:53:54   it's like it's like The Twilight Zone [TS]

00:53:55   episode Midnight Sun where you know [TS]

00:53:58   there's no real explanation as to why [TS]

00:54:00   everything is getting hotter and hotter [TS]

00:54:01   and hotter and hotter and it turns out [TS]

00:54:03   oh it's all in in the girl's mind [TS]

00:54:05   because its actions everything's getting [TS]

00:54:07   colder it's everything is getting colder [TS]

00:54:09   wasn't the earth coming closer to the [TS]

00:54:11   Sun that was the idea but it's actually [TS]

00:54:12   been blown out of out of the sun's [TS]

00:54:15   orphans going-away and [TS]

00:54:17   there's there's no real attempt to make [TS]

00:54:19   that even remotely plausible but the [TS]

00:54:22   story works because you just go with it [TS]

00:54:25   but this had so many little details and [TS]

00:54:28   all this is this is exactly what would [TS]

00:54:29   happen here and this is what would [TS]

00:54:30   happen here that when they didn't [TS]

00:54:33   connect just it took me out of it [TS]

00:54:36   completely [TS]

00:54:37   again it's a beautiful read i don't [TS]

00:54:38   think it's an apocalypse genre read i [TS]

00:54:40   think it's a I think it's the kind of [TS]

00:54:42   thing where you handed to your your your [TS]

00:54:44   friends who are who like like literature [TS]

00:54:46   and I said yeah I'd say that would be a [TS]

00:54:49   title suggestions lasix if they don't [TS]

00:54:51   know how I would write it the limit is [TS]

00:54:53   right now because I have a bunch of [TS]

00:54:56   girlfriends who who are seriously like [TS]

00:54:58   Eat Pray Love types and knowing they're [TS]

00:55:00   great people don't get me wrong but the [TS]

00:55:02   you know like that point different a [TS]

00:55:03   pre-loved spoke to me and they're like [TS]

00:55:05   station was the best book of the year [TS]

00:55:07   and it's so rare that we've been [TS]

00:55:08   watching books i was all I did read Eat [TS]

00:55:11   Pray Love and I did not like it [TS]

00:55:13   so sweet pre-loved I survived let's take [TS]

00:55:16   another break i just want to remind you [TS]

00:55:18   this is not even a sponsor I'm the [TS]

00:55:19   sponsor here [TS]

00:55:21   did you know that the uncomfortable does [TS]

00:55:22   other podcasts we do in case you didn't [TS]

00:55:25   know go to the incomparable dot-com and [TS]

00:55:28   you'll see we have Tim Goodman Stevie [TS]

00:55:30   talk machine where i talk to the [TS]

00:55:31   hollywood reporter's chief TV critic [TS]

00:55:33   every week about what's on TV with the [TS]

00:55:35   TV podcast where we recap episodes of [TS]

00:55:37   recently aired shows currently covering [TS]

00:55:40   the flash we have random track where [TS]

00:55:41   Scott McNulty talks about Star Trek a [TS]

00:55:44   random episode with a non-random guests [TS]

00:55:46   every week total party kills every other [TS]

00:55:48   week where we play Dungeons and Dragons [TS]

00:55:50   there's a new story starting next week [TS]

00:55:52   the uncomfortable radio theatre will be [TS]

00:55:54   coming back in a few months you can [TS]

00:55:55   subscribe to it now [TS]

00:55:56   phillip michael and lisa Schmeisser ruin [TS]

00:55:58   the movies they ruin a movie they [TS]

00:56:00   haven't even seen and it's very funny [TS]

00:56:02   and also coming back for a new season [TS]

00:56:03   not playing with lex friedman and Dan [TS]

00:56:05   more'n so many podcasts there are more [TS]

00:56:08   on the way so check it out if you like [TS]

00:56:10   this podcast give us a try the [TS]

00:56:12   incomparable dot-com there's itunes [TS]

00:56:14   links and feed links there so you can [TS]

00:56:16   subscribe to some other shows that I [TS]

00:56:18   think you like we need to talk at least [TS]

00:56:20   a little bit about the peripheral and [TS]

00:56:22   slow apocalypse because i stayed up til [TS]

00:56:24   twelve-thirty last night reading that [TS]

00:56:25   book so I could finish it on where God [TS]

00:56:28   oh please [TS]

00:56:29   grip this one I kind of liked its weird [TS]

00:56:35   ambition [TS]

00:56:35   yeah it's got an idea i liked i don't [TS]

00:56:39   like william gibson so i should i should [TS]

00:56:41   point that I'd never liked it even books [TS]

00:56:43   and this becomes a streak that about my [TS]

00:56:45   go hot and cold on him so in the [TS]

00:56:48   peripheral perfect so we've Gibson this [TS]

00:56:50   is a new day a book and not any [TS]

00:56:53   university is written in before you [TS]

00:56:54   answer a trilogy of things this is not [TS]

00:56:56   any of the any of his trilogies maybe [TS]

00:56:58   we'll see books in this universe again [TS]

00:56:59   maybe we won't [TS]

00:57:00   I like william gibson I loved his most [TS]

00:57:02   recent trilogy and I loved his first [TS]

00:57:04   trilogy that made him famous [TS]

00:57:06   this book is fascinating the the plot [TS]

00:57:10   the plot of it is essentially this is [TS]

00:57:11   the peripheral the plot is essentially [TS]

00:57:13   that there is a so spoilers for the [TS]

00:57:17   peripheral [TS]

00:57:20   the plot is basically there is a [TS]

00:57:24   post-apocalypse world whether these [TS]

00:57:27   people in London and there aren't very [TS]

00:57:29   many people left we don't really know a [TS]

00:57:30   lot about what happened it's called the [TS]

00:57:32   jackpot but something happened and not [TS]

00:57:33   many people left they have super-high [TS]

00:57:35   nanotechnology so hey an apocalypse [TS]

00:57:37   happened but all of society didn't fall [TS]

00:57:40   apart there's all this super high [TS]

00:57:41   technology they have the ability to [TS]

00:57:44   communicate mac in time to before the [TS]

00:57:47   apocalypse sort of as the apocalypse is [TS]

00:57:50   starting to happen and uh and in a [TS]

00:57:53   strange set of events the the past [TS]

00:57:57   they're communicating with is [TS]

00:57:58   immediately once you communicate with it [TS]

00:58:00   branches off you can change the future [TS]

00:58:02   by communicating with the past but you [TS]

00:58:04   can communicate with this alternate [TS]

00:58:05   paths that you've created by [TS]

00:58:06   communicating with them but it's not [TS]

00:58:08   actually the past right let's start says [TS]

00:58:10   that it's not your past turns into [TS]

00:58:12   someone else's past the minute that you [TS]

00:58:13   begin to monkey with a fair i read this [TS]

00:58:15   to be and maybe I took this room but [TS]

00:58:18   they're communicating with some chinese [TS]

00:58:19   server [TS]

00:58:20   yeah right well as the means by which [TS]

00:58:23   they are doing it yeah yeah only only a [TS]

00:58:25   Chinese web server would send you 70 [TS]

00:58:27   years into the past so you should use [TS]

00:58:29   desperate method out Hillbillies to do [TS]

00:58:31   your video game labor for you [TS]

00:58:33   the idea is if they keep the quantum [TS]

00:58:34   computer and its unlocked the ability to [TS]

00:58:36   dial into the past but but just the the [TS]

00:58:40   standard kind of many worlds idea once [TS]

00:58:42   you interfere with the past it's not [TS]

00:58:44   your past anymore you've branched it off [TS]

00:58:46   and so you end up with it so in this [TS]

00:58:48   book in the first 10 pages it is dense [TS]

00:58:50   and weird and it is it is I almost gave [TS]

00:58:53   up about five times it's unclear for a [TS]

00:58:55   long time what these two time frames are [TS]

00:58:57   and how they if they have anything in [TS]

00:58:58   common with one another and then there [TS]

00:59:01   is a moment and I i think i saw other [TS]

00:59:03   people commenting on this there is a [TS]

00:59:04   moment i don't know how many pages into [TS]

00:59:06   it where it it suddenly becomes very [TS]

00:59:09   clear after all of this confusion about [TS]

00:59:11   what's actually going on and it's a [TS]

00:59:13   really nice moment I thought I was like [TS]

00:59:14   oh ok it's like an alternate future [TS]

00:59:18   these people are like it's like Bitcoin [TS]

00:59:21   mining except it's like a world they're [TS]

00:59:23   like yeah we just strip mine your world [TS]

00:59:25   for information and labor and we don't [TS]

00:59:27   really care about it because we're up [TS]

00:59:29   time here doing our [TS]

00:59:31   thing and the end and that was really [TS]

00:59:33   interesting and some of the VR stuff [TS]

00:59:34   with the the the woman Flynn who's who's [TS]

00:59:37   there 3d printing things and they got [TS]

00:59:39   drones everywhere and they and they get [TS]

00:59:41   this huge influx of money thanks to the [TS]

00:59:43   people in the future and they start [TS]

00:59:45   buying stuff and there's like some crazy [TS]

00:59:47   tech there but they're also on the [TS]

00:59:49   precipice of apocalypse that was kind of [TS]

00:59:51   interesting the future the far future [TS]

00:59:53   people are really weird and some very [TS]

00:59:56   strange things going on out there [TS]

00:59:57   I thought that was kind of interesting [TS]

00:59:58   so there are [TS]

00:59:58   so there are [TS]

01:00:00   there that some so for me the first part [TS]

01:00:02   was a slog then there was a kind of a [TS]

01:00:04   moment of clarity there was like oh that [TS]

01:00:05   was really clever william gibson I see [TS]

01:00:07   what you did there then there's some [TS]

01:00:09   really interesting stuff that is like [TS]

01:00:11   well yeah Bravo and then and then the [TS]

01:00:15   individual worlds are kind of [TS]

01:00:17   interesting how they interact that the [TS]

01:00:19   the peripheral is a like a a brainless [TS]

01:00:22   body that you can ride in using VR which [TS]

01:00:26   felt to me kind of like the one piece of [TS]

01:00:29   wink wink technology that's like yeah [TS]

01:00:31   that's totally works we got this working [TS]

01:00:33   in the future that but was weird but it [TS]

01:00:35   allows the people from the past to sort [TS]

01:00:37   of see the present or the whatever the [TS]

01:00:39   people from the future to see the [TS]

01:00:41   further future tenses are difficult guys [TS]

01:00:43   are following the right around with the [TS]

01:00:45   book you do I had no problem totally [TS]

01:00:47   totally makes sense [TS]

01:00:48   basically what happens is people from [TS]

01:00:49   the from the future more from that from [TS]

01:00:52   the far from 70 years into the future [TS]

01:00:53   use people from the past as a way to our [TS]

01:00:56   free capital and virtual and virtual [TS]

01:00:58   labor the book chronicles the gradual [TS]

01:01:00   disintegration of the world as we know [TS]

01:01:01   it today owing to a multitude of factors [TS]

01:01:04   including environmental collapse radical [TS]

01:01:06   economic inequality and epidemics all [TS]

01:01:09   the poor people die basically hence the [TS]

01:01:11   jackpot for Jackie exactly and and the [TS]

01:01:14   people in the future there's a tiny [TS]

01:01:15   bunch of them it's now a bunch of it's [TS]

01:01:17   now a bunch of kleptocracy Zola garki so [TS]

01:01:19   it's a bunch of corporate nation-states [TS]

01:01:20   not unlike what you see in the [TS]

01:01:22   stephensons the diamond age book that I [TS]

01:01:24   like the Commission this is much better [TS]

01:01:25   yes and the thing is is this is this is [TS]

01:01:28   such a classically gives onian book in [TS]

01:01:30   so many ways because there's a whole lot [TS]

01:01:32   about how nature has been quietly you [TS]

01:01:35   know destroyed and now people fetishize [TS]

01:01:38   a lot of consumer objects that take [TS]

01:01:39   clear inspiration from nature like the [TS]

01:01:41   squid suits which of this kind of [TS]

01:01:42   camouflage or they talk about how in the [TS]

01:01:45   future people have shirts honey beeswax [TS]

01:01:48   candles despite being completely extinct [TS]

01:01:52   and back breeding file Essenes and other [TS]

01:01:55   extinct animals is now status symbol [TS]

01:01:57   which is an awesome replicator that can [TS]

01:01:59   make any kind of alcoholic beverage ever [TS]

01:02:01   except the guy who's an alcoholic is [TS]

01:02:03   locked out of it in Game biologically [TS]

01:02:04   speaking I mean that was you [TS]

01:02:06   the thing is is this is such a gibson [TS]

01:02:08   novel in that there's this extreme [TS]

01:02:10   fetishization of material culture where [TS]

01:02:12   people you know spend a lot of time [TS]

01:02:13   noticing how awesome upholstery is in [TS]

01:02:15   luxury car yes and there's also his [TS]

01:02:17   touching belief that vast amounts of [TS]

01:02:19   money can can make any problem go away [TS]

01:02:21   ever and not creating a captain not [TS]

01:02:23   created cascade of future problems and [TS]

01:02:26   doors all I don't know if he believes [TS]

01:02:28   that I I kind of feel like I feel like [TS]

01:02:30   the end of the book is kind of setting [TS]

01:02:31   us up for two more where it turns out [TS]

01:02:33   this radical experiment in averting the [TS]

01:02:35   the jackpot is going to backfire [TS]

01:02:37   horribly yeah what one part i really [TS]

01:02:39   liked right towards the end of the book [TS]

01:02:41   was when they were describing what the [TS]

01:02:43   bad person had done [TS]

01:02:45   oh it's like screwing around with [TS]

01:02:48   alternate timeline which they're called [TS]

01:02:50   stubbs he would apparently turn them [TS]

01:02:52   into giant gladiatorial combat roles and [TS]

01:02:56   just evolve super weapons out of them [TS]

01:02:59   that reminds me of what happens in our [TS]

01:03:02   stub at the end of the book we're like [TS]

01:03:04   so everything's fine now that we've got [TS]

01:03:08   complete control of your economy and [TS]

01:03:10   your billionaires and we were pretty [TS]

01:03:12   sure we've locked everything down and if [TS]

01:03:14   not then you know be it's all an [TS]

01:03:16   experiment to them because it can affect [TS]

01:03:17   their life and there's this you feel [TS]

01:03:19   like maybe there's a bond there but at [TS]

01:03:21   the same time it's like well if this [TS]

01:03:22   doesn't work you guys have to live with [TS]

01:03:24   it [TS]

01:03:24   not us but Gibson's always have been big [TS]

01:03:27   into the themes of corruption of money [TS]

01:03:29   and outdoor power because you know [TS]

01:03:31   you've got that because that's the whole [TS]

01:03:32   point to neuromancer you've got that the [TS]

01:03:34   test your ash cool people who go crazy [TS]

01:03:36   and build satellites and eventually [TS]

01:03:38   there a is go sentience and build a [TS]

01:03:40   whole other alternate universe and then [TS]

01:03:42   that pops begin the different light [TS]

01:03:43   trilogy correct me if I'm wrong that's [TS]

01:03:45   also liked that crazy rich people are [TS]

01:03:47   insulated from consequences and [TS]

01:03:49   subsequently become crazy like that's [TS]

01:03:50   something that pops up in the big and [TS]

01:03:52   trilogy to so this is this is given [TS]

01:03:54   species what gives those they're the [TS]

01:03:56   people with the money there's big money [TS]

01:03:57   in this big technology and they have [TS]

01:03:59   that he has is corrupt and they have [TS]

01:04:00   this corrupting effect and in fact in [TS]

01:04:02   the stub in this you have you know they [TS]

01:04:04   they lay the money down to say by the [TS]

01:04:07   governor they I mean they based they are [TS]

01:04:10   able with their money to completely [TS]

01:04:12   suffered everything that's going on here [TS]

01:04:13   and I i don't think that necessarily [TS]

01:04:14   what he's trying to hit message is not [TS]

01:04:17   yay [TS]

01:04:18   money fixes everything its [TS]

01:04:19   like c-money can do anything and it [TS]

01:04:23   generally does bad things during sex and [TS]

01:04:25   that's what money is good but also bad [TS]

01:04:27   its powerful money makes things easy [TS]

01:04:30   seems to be this [TS]

01:04:31   yeah it's very seductive and chapters [TS]

01:04:33   are short in the future [TS]

01:04:34   yes well this is like Gibson does it [TS]

01:04:36   mean his his having his his chapters are [TS]

01:04:39   all very short and he cycles between the [TS]

01:04:41   different character different the [TS]

01:04:42   different points of views and you're [TS]

01:04:43   always moving on to the next the next [TS]

01:04:46   chapter [TS]

01:04:46   I feel like that gives it a false sense [TS]

01:04:48   of urgency because yeah I I feel like I [TS]

01:04:51   feel like it's my feel like it's watch [TS]

01:04:53   the hand watch the hand because [TS]

01:04:54   otherwise you're like oh this is [TS]

01:04:55   basically story that takes place over [TS]

01:04:56   five days or well it's ask paste right [TS]

01:04:59   except then you realize that you're [TS]

01:05:00   flipping between a guy walking and [TS]

01:05:02   another guy walking in your back to the [TS]

01:05:04   first guy walking and that's not he [TS]

01:05:05   paced got there that's not fast that's [TS]

01:05:08   just flipping his characters all have [TS]

01:05:10   really short lines [TS]

01:05:12   yes and he tends to neighbors yeah and [TS]

01:05:15   he has really short description and its [TS]

01:05:18   really Connor and Carlos and Flynn and [TS]

01:05:21   will ya [TS]

01:05:23   Flynn and will fan I in Burkina oh I [TS]

01:05:26   really like Connor who is the guy who [TS]

01:05:28   tests but who spends all his time in [TS]

01:05:31   poverty hand some peripheral right [TS]

01:05:34   because he's a veteran and he's lost his [TS]

01:05:36   limbs and he can use that peripheral and [TS]

01:05:39   he's got all his arms and legs in its [TS]

01:05:40   and that reminds me of like a bunch of [TS]

01:05:42   different short stories in the [TS]

01:05:43   science-fiction goldner Selfridge back [TS]

01:05:45   in the seventies for the ideas that you [TS]

01:05:47   know and actually reminds me a bit of [TS]

01:05:49   Peter wats novel starfish where the [TS]

01:05:52   premise of that was only mentally ill [TS]

01:05:54   people were suited for life [TS]

01:05:56   deep deep deep undersea because they [TS]

01:05:59   responded to reacted differently too [TS]

01:06:00   deep pressure conditions that mentally [TS]

01:06:02   healthy people did and so there's always [TS]

01:06:04   been kind of this fascination sci-fi [TS]

01:06:05   with well what do we do with people who [TS]

01:06:07   are differently abled truly is an [TS]

01:06:08   environment where they can thrive and [TS]

01:06:10   gives us making the argument that what [TS]

01:06:12   technology you can do anything [TS]

01:06:13   so this this book feels really over [TS]

01:06:15   stuff to me i think yeah I think the [TS]

01:06:17   this is an understatement probably i [TS]

01:06:19   think the stub idea alone is a novel and [TS]

01:06:24   then but it's called the peripheral and [TS]

01:06:26   and partway through realize okay well [TS]

01:06:28   it's about basically like virtual bodies [TS]

01:06:31   or essentially that you can be [TS]

01:06:33   in another body and and that sounds like [TS]

01:06:36   the subject of a whole novel to but [TS]

01:06:38   instead and not only do you have those [TS]

01:06:42   together which seems like there's just [TS]

01:06:44   too much [TS]

01:06:44   it's like spider-man feelings you don't [TS]

01:06:46   need three of them then on top of it it [TS]

01:06:48   is your william gibson plan i say this [TS]

01:06:51   is somebody loves william gibson ugh it [TS]

01:06:53   ends up becoming about money and crime [TS]

01:06:55   and the gunfights and feel about [TS]

01:06:58   quadcopters and candy and groans in this [TS]

01:07:01   case that's a little that's a little new [TS]

01:07:02   variety is also there are drones here [TS]

01:07:05   and it's just it's over it's over stuff [TS]

01:07:07   to me too so of so just got and and then [TS]

01:07:11   and we'll go to Monte Scott you don't [TS]

01:07:13   like Gibson any any particular [TS]

01:07:15   impressions about this one since we have [TS]

01:07:17   forced you to read it before I could [TS]

01:07:20   stop at any time you know attempted to [TS]

01:07:22   stop many times but I just thought I [TS]

01:07:25   power so I thought I mean you had a lot [TS]

01:07:27   of great ideas in it i just find I mean [TS]

01:07:30   it's a stylistically I find Gibson's [TS]

01:07:33   writing could be annoying i love this i [TS]

01:07:36   love his style I love his style so that [TS]

01:07:39   one we will disagree on every week it's [TS]

01:07:42   okay that you're wrong on that one Scott [TS]

01:07:44   I i understand i know i mean he people [TS]

01:07:46   lots of people love him he's just not my [TS]

01:07:48   cup of tea and I kind of felt like the [TS]

01:07:50   end of it was like i went through all of [TS]

01:07:52   this and this is the whole point the end [TS]

01:07:54   I i felt like i missed the end and what [TS]

01:07:56   would that's it it's always when did she [TS]

01:07:58   become pregnant what happened I couldn't [TS]

01:08:00   even tell i flipped into and then kindle [TS]

01:08:02   brings a full box of like well that's [TS]

01:08:03   the end how do you rate I'm like what [TS]

01:08:05   that's it by this point you're turning [TS]

01:08:07   pages so fast like all right that's [TS]

01:08:09   chapter that chapter alright no go but [TS]

01:08:12   wait what [TS]

01:08:13   yeah yeah it is that was really [TS]

01:08:14   frustrating i was saying to Lauren after [TS]

01:08:16   i read i was like i was kinda enjoying i [TS]

01:08:18   finally got in a groove with it was like [TS]

01:08:19   okay we got the two different worlds and [TS]

01:08:21   it's and building to a climax all then I [TS]

01:08:23   was like that's it and it's and it is a [TS]

01:08:25   sort of sudden disappointing ending if [TS]

01:08:28   he is planning more books in this world [TS]

01:08:30   then that that actually kind of he's [TS]

01:08:32   never really done the continuing story [TS]

01:08:34   thing it tends to be an oblique take in [TS]

01:08:37   the same world the next time and if he [TS]

01:08:39   does that then so be it but it was a bit [TS]

01:08:41   the end was you know not there was yeah [TS]

01:08:45   it was just abrupt end [TS]

01:08:46   and perfunctory i guess but it was [TS]

01:08:49   better written than slow apocalypse so [TS]

01:08:51   Oh God not well I i read i would argue [TS]

01:08:54   that i read Gibson i think i think i [TS]

01:08:58   read Gibson primarily for the style and [TS]

01:09:01   and i always love his style and then [TS]

01:09:04   there are times when I mean and it's [TS]

01:09:07   it's like a fever dream sometimes in [TS]

01:09:09   fact the first hundred pages of this [TS]

01:09:10   book it really was like a fever dream I [TS]

01:09:12   I was worried that I was I had a fever [TS]

01:09:14   and was completely confused and lost but [TS]

01:09:17   when he when he hits it when he gets [TS]

01:09:19   those points and they're like really [TS]

01:09:20   trenches they're really on point about [TS]

01:09:22   like what life is like right now and [TS]

01:09:24   he's using it to to make you think about [TS]

01:09:27   possible technical implications of [TS]

01:09:30   present technology in the future and an [TS]

01:09:33   interesting you know MacGuffin plot to [TS]

01:09:35   draw you along then you then he nails it [TS]

01:09:38   and and the last trilogy that he did [TS]

01:09:40   that that started with pattern [TS]

01:09:41   recognition he nailed that those are [TS]

01:09:43   kind of recognition might have become my [TS]

01:09:45   favorite william gibson book when he [TS]

01:09:46   doesn't nail in like in the Virtual [TS]

01:09:48   Light trilogy the bridge trilogy and end [TS]

01:09:51   in this book I I appreciate his writing [TS]

01:09:56   but I start to see the seams of he's [TS]

01:09:58   pouring a bunch of this stuff in there [TS]

01:09:59   and stirring it around and sometimes [TS]

01:10:01   what you get out is is a is a mess and [TS]

01:10:04   this was this was more of a mess to me [TS]

01:10:06   there's a william gibson playbook that I [TS]

01:10:09   feel like he plays by where do I have a [TS]

01:10:12   theme that talks about how technological [TS]

01:10:14   disintermediation is inherently [TS]

01:10:15   dehumanizing everyone who participates [TS]

01:10:17   chap check do I want to fetishize a [TS]

01:10:20   luxury brand name like amazed chat while [TS]

01:10:24   commenting on the on the questions of [TS]

01:10:27   why one might fetishize such a bring [TS]

01:10:29   life to I wanted to imagine doing what I [TS]

01:10:31   imagine what life is like for the [TS]

01:10:32   uneducated pores in futureworld check it [TS]

01:10:36   you know do I want to exotica sighs some [TS]

01:10:38   somebody who's not Anglo and and [TS]

01:10:40   therefore introduced exotic Russian [TS]

01:10:41   culture the exotic Japanese culture [TS]

01:10:43   whatever check there are a lot of light [TS]

01:10:46   motif sticker from trilla to trilogy [TS]

01:10:48   trilogy and i found this book to be a [TS]

01:10:51   big slug and so frankly for me like half [TS]

01:10:52   the engine was like yep I remember [TS]

01:10:54   seeing that in [TS]

01:10:55   Marley's overdrive yep I remember that [TS]

01:10:58   just remember that from pattern [TS]

01:11:01   recognition i could only give some bingo [TS]

01:11:04   card oh yeah it was like yeah when [TS]

01:11:06   you're drinking game you can tell [TS]

01:11:07   William gives you could plausibly do [TS]

01:11:09   William Gibson drinking a bingo card for [TS]

01:11:11   sure for sure and like Jason I found the [TS]

01:11:14   ending to be really abrupt and jarring [TS]

01:11:16   because all of a sudden Flynn is married [TS]

01:11:18   and pregnant and is apparently ok with [TS]

01:11:21   bmis elachi well extends police officer [TS]

01:11:24   yeah except that she's turned a little [TS]

01:11:26   more sophisticated because now she's [TS]

01:11:28   checking in weekly with the future to [TS]

01:11:30   shape and she's on a first-name basis [TS]

01:11:32   with the President and my bet is that [TS]

01:11:35   either her or one of her descendants [TS]

01:11:36   ends up in some sort of you know sure [TS]

01:11:38   things have happened but you have to [TS]

01:11:42   mark coo for life Flynn will be blah [TS]

01:11:44   blah blah you know the same way that [TS]

01:11:47   they're there were there are always [TS]

01:11:49   hooks between the trilogy's where [TS]

01:11:51   there's some offhanded mention of how [TS]

01:11:52   somebody's a in a radically different [TS]

01:11:54   position they were booked ago but there [TS]

01:11:58   are things I liked about it because I i [TS]

01:12:00   did--like i did like he's being loved [TS]

01:12:05   he seems to be getting a sense of humor [TS]

01:12:06   digital age Clovis and Connor for [TS]

01:12:09   example are both incredibly funny [TS]

01:12:11   characters for him and I enjoyed the [TS]

01:12:14   little bit of levity they provided [TS]

01:12:15   because this is not a book that's big on [TS]

01:12:17   having a sense of you know that said I [TS]

01:12:20   was really disappointed how there is a [TS]

01:12:23   couple different parts of the book where [TS]

01:12:26   it's like what science will help us out [TS]

01:12:28   but science will advance despite the [TS]

01:12:30   fact that any percent of the world [TS]

01:12:31   population is dying off and it's kind of [TS]

01:12:34   almost the opposite of the direction 11 [TS]

01:12:36   problems and station eleven like [TS]

01:12:37   everyone goes back to treating books [TS]

01:12:39   like holy sacred objects to be kept by [TS]

01:12:41   monks to scientists they managed to [TS]

01:12:43   survive everything and now they're [TS]

01:12:45   bringing us a better work [TS]

01:12:46   there's nothing they can do that is true [TS]

01:12:48   i don't buy the apocalypse skills all [TS]

01:12:50   technology but i don't know that i buy [TS]

01:12:52   that immediately creates nanotechnology [TS]

01:12:55   it'sit's world [TS]

01:12:57   leaving it for and that's all that [TS]

01:12:59   doesn't like I was poor people or [TS]

01:13:00   otherwise the jackpot man [TS]

01:13:02   ya know and the thing that also bugs me [TS]

01:13:05   about about this it [TS]

01:13:07   okay first of all the thing I like [TS]

01:13:08   you're not really quite sure what [TS]

01:13:09   happened to the US because the only [TS]

01:13:11   mention made his phone is like I guess [TS]

01:13:12   the u.s. is like Connor only without a [TS]

01:13:14   sense of humor and you're like that's a [TS]

01:13:16   mercenary nation-state I don't know but [TS]

01:13:18   what I've always found kind of [TS]

01:13:19   problematic is is like it's like Africa [TS]

01:13:21   and South the continent of africa and [TS]

01:13:23   south america never ever existed his [TS]

01:13:25   books like you you never meet people [TS]

01:13:27   from there there's there's no culture [TS]

01:13:29   there's no that his characters never [TS]

01:13:30   traveled there [TS]

01:13:31   well that there is that joke in this [TS]

01:13:33   that means that the milagros cold iron [TS]

01:13:35   is based in Costa Rica or something like [TS]

01:13:38   that but that's it it's just kind of a [TS]

01:13:40   joke or Columbia and cold iron was a [TS]

01:13:42   misspelling of Calder on yeah they even [TS]

01:13:44   got that wrong yeah it's I mean I love [TS]

01:13:46   Gibson i love gives there's a lot of [TS]

01:13:48   little better but this book was just so [TS]

01:13:50   I was like yeah i'm not sure i'm picking [TS]

01:13:52   yourself after i turned the corner with [TS]

01:13:54   that moment of the of the two different [TS]

01:13:56   futures I was like oh ok and then I was [TS]

01:13:58   able to appreciate on a level a and the [TS]

01:14:01   ending was disappointing so yeah I found [TS]

01:14:03   it I I had a moment where I thought oh [TS]

01:14:05   my god I think I'm gonna have to just [TS]

01:14:07   give up on William it's a novel which [TS]

01:14:09   I've never done before and I didn't do [TS]

01:14:11   that and i found something that I like [TS]

01:14:12   about I like the dread of the jackpot [TS]

01:14:15   how how they mentioned the jackpot Flynn [TS]

01:14:16   and she's like you know it's it's bad [TS]

01:14:19   and we're like oh jeez this is really [TS]

01:14:21   bad and it goes a long time where you're [TS]

01:14:23   trying to get information about what [TS]

01:14:25   exactly did happen [TS]

01:14:27   what is he not telling us about this [TS]

01:14:28   future and how it came to be [TS]

01:14:30   unfortunately when it is revealed its [TS]

01:14:32   kind of abrupt and not that interesting [TS]

01:14:35   here and thats like okay well that was a [TS]

01:14:37   letdown and then the only other plot [TS]

01:14:38   twist that i thought was kind of clever [TS]

01:14:40   and yet at the same time felt almost [TS]

01:14:42   like he was trying too hard is that [TS]

01:14:44   there's a character in the future who is [TS]

01:14:46   very very old who is revealed to be in [TS]

01:14:49   the present as well but it's a [TS]

01:14:51   transgender character so we do I throw [TS]

01:14:53   you off the scent [TS]

01:14:54   it's a man in the present but a woman in [TS]

01:14:56   the future it's kind of like a crying [TS]

01:14:58   game twist again didn't it didn't feel [TS]

01:15:01   like it was actually very well done it [TS]

01:15:03   was more [TS]

01:15:04   yeah I I didn't think it did a good job [TS]

01:15:06   with that I appreciated that twist [TS]

01:15:08   because i was spending a lot of time [TS]

01:15:09   because obviously there's going to be [TS]

01:15:11   some connection to right-wing lot of [TS]

01:15:13   autonomy of characters again like the [TS]

01:15:15   station eleven i'm going who's the [TS]

01:15:16   Prophet going to be all probably this [TS]

01:15:18   kid right that's gonna be alright [TS]

01:15:20   no we're gonna be but it's gotta be [TS]

01:15:23   somebody clearly these two times soldier [TS]

01:15:26   timelines are gonna have somebody in [TS]

01:15:27   common what's it gonna be [TS]

01:15:29   oh that guy and nothing really it [TS]

01:15:33   doesn't even matter [TS]

01:15:33   oh alright you go that's kind of like [TS]

01:15:36   this but good luck [TS]

01:15:37   you got it on you although there's [TS]

01:15:39   there's a nice moment where where they [TS]

01:15:40   revealed that they know to the to the [TS]

01:15:42   the characters a question to them [TS]

01:15:45   the man in the present that the that in [TS]

01:15:48   the future he becomes a woman and that's [TS]

01:15:51   that there is a nice scene where it's [TS]

01:15:52   like I've never told anybody that how [TS]

01:15:54   could you know that and they're like [TS]

01:15:55   well stubs servers anyway but that's the [TS]

01:15:59   kind of a nice thing it's like the [TS]

01:16:00   future knows all your secrets but yeah [TS]

01:16:03   about that just assumed this stuff was [TS]

01:16:05   going to be important like well you see [TS]

01:16:07   Flynn you cause the jackpot haha [TS]

01:16:10   tada apparently not know my take on the [TS]

01:16:14   book it felt very much to me like a [TS]

01:16:16   Gibson eyes version of neal stephenson's [TS]

01:16:18   anthem huh [TS]

01:16:20   possibly just because an anthem also has [TS]

01:16:23   that moment in the middle of the really [TS]

01:16:25   figure it out we go here's what's [TS]

01:16:27   happening and you go oh that's what this [TS]

01:16:31   book is about that element felt the same [TS]

01:16:34   in both books and everything else that's [TS]

01:16:36   Neal Stephenson e in the one book has [TS]

01:16:38   been replaced by william gibson me stuff [TS]

01:16:40   in this book was like instead of monks [TS]

01:16:43   doing math like its philosophy its [TS]

01:16:45   quality not answering my dominator [TS]

01:16:47   nanotechnologies yeah exactly i felt [TS]

01:16:51   like the core ideas of the book there [TS]

01:16:54   were enough of those they're complicated [TS]

01:16:55   enough that he didn't need to put in [TS]

01:16:57   nonsense like this artist skins herself [TS]

01:17:01   every few years [TS]

01:17:02   yes person has animated tattoos that are [TS]

01:17:06   apparently sent to you I found the core [TS]

01:17:08   murder mystery of this also completely [TS]

01:17:10   not compelling right it's not necessary [TS]

01:17:13   Gibson apparently felt the same cuz it [TS]

01:17:16   didn't [TS]

01:17:16   get this all know I felt like he was [TS]

01:17:19   taking the piss out of steampunk with [TS]

01:17:20   the character ash yeah because he talks [TS]

01:17:24   a lot about our excessive fetishization [TS]

01:17:25   of baroque technology and how she be [TS]

01:17:27   appropriate for that world and I was [TS]

01:17:29   like okay this is him basically putting [TS]

01:17:31   down his foot and saying he doesn't like [TS]

01:17:32   steampunk he wrote The Difference Engine [TS]

01:17:34   how dare he [TS]

01:17:35   there were there was a puncturing I [TS]

01:17:36   don't know who's about steampunk there's [TS]

01:17:38   a puncturing of kind of pretentiousness [TS]

01:17:40   in that of art and artists in the future [TS]

01:17:44   that I i was amused by that was actually [TS]

01:17:46   one of the things that I thought was [TS]

01:17:48   funny in this but but yeah I'm with I'm [TS]

01:17:51   like Monty that that there is again I it [TS]

01:17:54   just feels over stuff like I feel like [TS]

01:17:55   he's got too many things on the [TS]

01:17:56   checklist here and as a result the book [TS]

01:17:59   is not really ever sure what it what it [TS]

01:18:01   wants to be and his more successful [TS]

01:18:04   books are sort of about a thing and then [TS]

01:18:06   have interesting coloring around yeah [TS]

01:18:08   the edges and this is more like no no [TS]

01:18:11   it's about uh two different futures and [TS]

01:18:14   I and time travel of a sort and I mean [TS]

01:18:18   it's just like pilot mall in there and [TS]

01:18:19   nanotechnology and drones and it's just [TS]

01:18:22   I is like it feels like it's too much [TS]

01:18:24   and neuromancer and pattern recognition [TS]

01:18:26   the pros is streamlined the plot is [TS]

01:18:29   complicated but it's basically [TS]

01:18:31   streamlined and entertaining [TS]

01:18:33   yeah and this has so much stuff in it [TS]

01:18:35   his best books still have very simple [TS]

01:18:37   plots it's just a decoration on them [TS]

01:18:39   that makes them seem twist year than [TS]

01:18:40   they actually are and and I like the [TS]

01:18:43   decoration so it's fine and below it is [TS]

01:18:45   just a film like a film or plot that [TS]

01:18:47   there's not one to it this yeah this is [TS]

01:18:49   like not in it not that is more [TS]

01:18:51   complicated just kind of Messier [TS]

01:18:52   and-and-and yeah overstuffed I feel like [TS]

01:18:55   there's a fine class rage I feel like [TS]

01:18:57   there's a fine raging class warrior in [TS]

01:19:00   william gibson that could come out if [TS]

01:19:01   you would just give more full throat to [TS]

01:19:02   it because the way he talks about [TS]

01:19:04   because because the way he talks about [TS]

01:19:06   burton and connor and and especially the [TS]

01:19:11   way he begins to an end especially the [TS]

01:19:13   way that he points out that whatever [TS]

01:19:15   wipes out the world's population isn't [TS]

01:19:16   likely be one thing it's going to be a [TS]

01:19:18   lot of things exacerbated by inequality [TS]

01:19:20   and faulty infrastructure I think this [TS]

01:19:22   is a guy who who thinks long and hard [TS]

01:19:24   and seriously about the warping effects [TS]

01:19:26   of money and the way it works people on [TS]

01:19:28   all ends he just it [TS]

01:19:30   just gets buried under who it's an [TS]

01:19:31   Army's case i think that says I think [TS]

01:19:34   that's his dick I think he's not he's [TS]

01:19:36   the kind of person who writes these kind [TS]

01:19:38   of somewhat disconnected emotionally [TS]

01:19:40   commentaries on this rather than you [TS]

01:19:44   know heating up and and just making [TS]

01:19:47   something that's a little more angry [TS]

01:19:48   let's just get this Gibson yeah people [TS]

01:19:50   don't really get angry in his books do [TS]

01:19:52   they they're confused or they're taking [TS]

01:19:54   it back with overwhelmed or or they're [TS]

01:19:56   they're even thrilled in a gentle way [TS]

01:19:59   but I can't remember anybody who's been [TS]

01:20:01   genuinely lose their head furious i [TS]

01:20:03   think Molly got angry didn't she once [TS]

01:20:06   maybe maybe yeah my little annalisa [TS]

01:20:08   overdrive she's pretty common one is a [TS]

01:20:10   lot of kind of her to remove emotionally [TS]

01:20:13   yeah and yeah i did not find it [TS]

01:20:14   surprising to learn that the going into [TS]

01:20:16   an alternate past 2-4 resources concept [TS]

01:20:19   was taken from the story starlings [TS]

01:20:21   misinformation yeah [TS]

01:20:23   mozart and mirrored shades by rooster [TS]

01:20:25   lling and Lewis shiner i have that story [TS]

01:20:28   except for Stephenson and Gibson that's [TS]

01:20:30   the most cyberpunk stuff you can put in [TS]

01:20:33   one title and author mirrors [TS]

01:20:35   yeah i have i have the cyber i have the [TS]

01:20:37   cyberpunk ontology mirrored shades for [TS]

01:20:39   that book is yes yeah we are we are [TS]

01:20:42   desperately overtime but i want i want [TS]

01:20:43   those who read John Varley slow [TS]

01:20:45   apocalypse tell me about it because I [TS]

01:20:47   didn't read it so the basic premise is [TS]

01:20:50   that the zero petroleum event happens an [TS]

01:20:53   angry scientists invents a bacteria that [TS]

01:20:55   somehow causes in the world's entire [TS]

01:20:57   petroleum supply to lock up and go on a [TS]

01:20:59   series of earthquakes and implosions and [TS]

01:21:02   getting I think it's ice 94 oil you can [TS]

01:21:05   use yes yes it is and with the worst [TS]

01:21:08   writer [TS]

01:21:09   well worse than I mean at worse than [TS]

01:21:12   vonnegut is most writers but as [TS]

01:21:14   dentistry better burn scars so basically [TS]

01:21:18   what happens is barley set up the [TS]

01:21:19   promise the world has no oil and the [TS]

01:21:21   whole the whole book seems can be summed [TS]

01:21:23   up as one if humanity as you know where [TS]

01:21:26   to collapse tomorrow we'd all be we'd [TS]

01:21:27   all be screwed to when things turn when [TS]

01:21:30   things go bad people will go bad [TS]

01:21:33   three it's great to be male [TS]

01:21:37   and.and for it helps if you hoard things [TS]

01:21:41   and five in order to deprive in order to [TS]

01:21:44   survive an apocalyptic event you have to [TS]

01:21:46   have advanced intel on what's going to [TS]

01:21:48   happen because basically the protagonist [TS]

01:21:49   is this out of work Hollywood [TS]

01:21:51   screenwriter who gets a hot tip from a [TS]

01:21:53   military guy he's been trying to talk up [TS]

01:21:55   and the guide the military guy was like [TS]

01:21:57   yeah look the the bad the bug has [TS]

01:21:59   already been spread the Middle East it's [TS]

01:22:00   gonna spread across the world military [TS]

01:22:02   guy is literally shot and killed like [TS]

01:22:03   two pages later because the powers that [TS]

01:22:06   be are covering this up [TS]

01:22:07   this causes the protections to panic [TS]

01:22:09   take all of their money out of the bank [TS]

01:22:11   maxed out his credit cards on on [TS]

01:22:13   survival supplies get his daughters [TS]

01:22:16   horses from their stable and and try to [TS]

01:22:18   ride this thing until hollywood hills [TS]

01:22:19   until like an upgrade until like a [TS]

01:22:21   Richter Niner the quake-hit Los Angeles [TS]

01:22:23   one of his writers assistance is raped [TS]

01:22:26   by a gang of Hell's Angel and that they [TS]

01:22:27   decide they have to head someplace else [TS]

01:22:28   and start a new life as farmers that is [TS]

01:22:30   your book and sounds great [TS]

01:22:34   well is barley is a super funny super [TS]

01:22:39   entertaining writer and he's actually [TS]

01:22:41   kind of guy where if you were seriously [TS]

01:22:43   stuck in an apocalypse you like okay [TS]

01:22:44   this is kind of a how-to manual i need [TS]

01:22:46   step one stock up on lithium step to [TS]

01:22:48   make sure you have a fan because it's [TS]

01:22:49   got high fat and protein content [TS]

01:22:51   step three different way to filter water [TS]

01:22:52   like it's it's I I get the feeling he [TS]

01:22:56   spent a lot of time trolling prepper [TS]

01:22:57   sites for this and a lot of his later [TS]

01:23:01   works have have basically had had a thin [TS]

01:23:03   undercurrent of oh god were killing the [TS]

01:23:05   planet Oh God something Awful's going to [TS]

01:23:06   happen civilization as we know it is [TS]

01:23:08   going to end soon and so I I feel like [TS]

01:23:10   this is him you know trying to turn like [TS]

01:23:12   take a few deep breaths and write it all [TS]

01:23:13   out and get out of assistant perhaps [TS]

01:23:15   therapist suggestion but it is like [TS]

01:23:18   literally the exact opposite of station [TS]

01:23:20   11 where osher bad things happen in [TS]

01:23:22   children ramneyg act for a year but [TS]

01:23:24   Shakespeare survived and in this one [TS]

01:23:25   it's like well a bunch of old men [TS]

01:23:27   hobbyist are going to get steam trains [TS]

01:23:28   working against we can move food up and [TS]

01:23:30   down the west coast and oh we work six [TS]

01:23:33   days a week on a farm and we have to [TS]

01:23:35   hard water but hey you're alive it is [TS]

01:23:37   not great and we're back to using the [TS]

01:23:38   post office and it's so romantic [TS]

01:23:39   annually [TS]

01:23:41   I'm not sure I i think i would rather [TS]

01:23:43   have gone and the shooting gallery after [TS]

01:23:45   the earthquake or or maybe killed in the [TS]

01:23:47   Olympic Stadium bowl after the chlorine [TS]

01:23:49   gas escaped or or because i read it like [TS]

01:23:53   what the heck is going to happen next [TS]

01:23:55   like something horrible what happened [TS]

01:23:56   like two pages later and then like [TS]

01:23:58   there's a revealing one chapter that [TS]

01:23:59   they've turned element into a prison [TS]

01:24:01   camp for Refugees them all wait what [TS]

01:24:03   what's your uh what's your take on this [TS]

01:24:08   one [TS]

01:24:10   don't be in Los Angeles when the [TS]

01:24:11   apocalypse happens if you take away [TS]

01:24:13   wherever maybe but yeah yeah well i'm [TS]

01:24:17   going to bed Los Angeles briefly but i [TS]

01:24:19   think i can get on board with that I [TS]

01:24:21   mean he is really into detailing how one [TS]

01:24:25   goes through an apocalypse e so if you [TS]

01:24:28   if you're into that [TS]

01:24:29   check it out it's a quick read I [TS]

01:24:31   certainly keeps it going [TS]

01:24:33   stuff happens bad stuff happens yeah so [TS]

01:24:36   much bad stuff happened having heard [TS]

01:24:37   your description of the the all oil [TS]

01:24:40   turns to goo [TS]

01:24:41   um i would mention the windup girl which [TS]

01:24:45   I have plugged many times by palette [TS]

01:24:47   bacigalupi that is better that is a [TS]

01:24:49   story about a world where we're Oriole [TS]

01:24:52   has run out and you know they make it [TS]

01:24:55   work [TS]

01:24:55   it's not great and you know the Seas [TS]

01:24:57   have risen and they've got like [TS]

01:24:59   genetically engineered elephants that [TS]

01:25:02   crank turbines in order to generate [TS]

01:25:03   power but it's you know I I feel like [TS]

01:25:06   that's a that that's a nice story about [TS]

01:25:10   what would happen in our dependence on [TS]

01:25:11   oil for for energy sources that uh [TS]

01:25:15   doesn't an apocalypse it just ends in a [TS]

01:25:18   kind of unpleasant future but it's not [TS]

01:25:19   it's not like the War end of the world [TS]

01:25:21   happened a short story where it's about [TS]

01:25:23   the an Amish community they find out [TS]

01:25:26   that the rest of the world ended and [TS]

01:25:27   they're like oh too bad for you guys huh [TS]

01:25:30   I'd it will that's that's how the last [TS]

01:25:32   policeman trilogy and nobody is in an [TS]

01:25:35   Amish community family [TS]

01:25:36   yeah and that they're living their lives [TS]

01:25:38   until the world ends in one of my [TS]

01:25:41   favorite post-apocalyptic details how [TS]

01:25:43   and y the last man they finally get to [TS]

01:25:45   the African continent and find out that [TS]

01:25:46   they're like well you know the women are [TS]

01:25:48   fine here they didn't have any sort of [TS]

01:25:49   social collapse because they're already [TS]

01:25:52   doing a lot of everything anyway they [TS]

01:25:54   they just kept on hitting on you and I I [TS]

01:25:57   liked that a lot because it was a nice [TS]

01:25:59   way to tweak the f no centrosome of a [TS]

01:26:01   lot of apocalyptic tales which are [TS]

01:26:03   Oh God North America's and flames all of [TS]

01:26:06   the world must have gone down and you [TS]

01:26:08   know there's no now we were fine [TS]

01:26:11   yeah we kept the poachers away from the [TS]

01:26:13   lines it's all cool if you make your [TS]

01:26:16   superbug work too quickly no one's gonna [TS]

01:26:18   have time to fly to Africa to infect [TS]

01:26:21   everyone [TS]

01:26:22   that's true too yeah yeah I was never [TS]

01:26:24   got clearance station 11 where people [TS]

01:26:27   just missed getting it at the beginning [TS]

01:26:29   and so they never got it that didn't [TS]

01:26:31   seem to make a lot of sense to me but [TS]

01:26:32   again we're not gonna talk anymore about [TS]

01:26:33   station eleven now suffice it to say it [TS]

01:26:37   is of a certain Caillou you know by now [TS]

01:26:39   whether you want to read this book or [TS]

01:26:40   not if you if you haven't already read [TS]

01:26:42   it and if you have you also know that [TS]

01:26:44   you can feel your presence your regret [TS]

01:26:47   for your delight [TS]

01:26:49   no matter what that's right all right [TS]

01:26:51   we've written we've we've talked about [TS]

01:26:52   many books what I'm not gonna even ask [TS]

01:26:53   you what you're reading because that was [TS]

01:26:54   blunt books and lots of time and it's a [TS]

01:26:56   long book club so I'm going to thank my [TS]

01:26:57   guests for talking about many books with [TS]

01:26:59   me Scott McNulty as always a pleasure to [TS]

01:27:01   have you on the book club and it was a [TS]

01:27:03   pleasure to meet you [TS]

01:27:04   this is wiser thank you very much it's [TS]

01:27:06   always a pleasure to explore the end of [TS]

01:27:08   the world with you body actually thank [TS]

01:27:12   you for being here and making a list and [TS]

01:27:15   checking it twice about things that are [TS]

01:27:18   bothersome about the apocalypse [TS]

01:27:20   thank you it was a pleasure having you [TS]

01:27:22   and David lower thank you for reading [TS]

01:27:25   one of the books [TS]

01:27:26   parting is such sweet sorrow even if i [TS]

01:27:28   don't care for Shakespeare anymore i was [TS]

01:27:30   hoping for a quote from Star Trek [TS]

01:27:31   Voyager oh well well I've got this whole [TS]

01:27:34   in Neelix's lungs script here there's no [TS]

01:27:37   point in having playwrights after the [TS]

01:27:39   apocalypse and the right because it's [TS]

01:27:41   all just Shakespearean all shakes that's [TS]

01:27:43   all other books were burned for fuel and [TS]

01:27:45   Lulu of the forest and thanks everybody [TS]

01:27:48   for listening to be uncomfortable we'll [TS]

01:27:50   see you next time [TS]