0:00:00the incomparable number 200 fine just
0:00:13welcome back everybody to be
0:00:14uncomfortable podcast I'm your host
0:00:15Jason L and in this episode we're going
0:00:17to be talking about brad bird's 1999
0:00:21animated motion picture the movie made
0:00:24before he made the incredibles it's the
0:00:26iron giant it was a box office bomb but
0:00:28it is universally loved by critics and
0:00:31by many people out there and has had
0:00:33quite a following after it left the
0:00:36theaters that nobody the empty theaters
0:00:38and went on and a home video where it is
0:00:41is beloved we're going to talk about it
0:00:42tonight
0:00:43let me introduce the the panel that is
0:00:45going to be discussing the iron giant
0:00:47with me David laura is out there
0:00:49hi David hello there good to have you
0:00:51Steve let's also out there hi Steve
0:00:55hey there scout very nice everybody
0:01:00drink some espresso and Tony sindelar
0:01:03joins us tell me it's good to have you
0:01:05here
0:01:06hey squirrels in my pants Jason it's
0:01:07climbing its way out of here yeah
0:01:09everybody avert your eyes
0:01:13John syracuse oh we we we have to when
0:01:15we're talking about animated films we
0:01:17have to have you here thanks for being
0:01:18here
0:01:19I like bread before was cool you know
0:01:21yeah and I called in the big guns for
0:01:25this one also somebody i enjoy talking
0:01:28about animated movies with Merlin man is
0:01:31back hi Merlin no I remember the raccoon
0:01:33boy i love it when people come prepared
0:01:38with references because i don't so I'm
0:01:41glad you guys are picking up the slack
0:01:42for me that this great so we I so like I
0:01:46said 1999 brad bird made this movie
0:01:48traditional animation it was costs like
0:01:5370 million dollars and made made 30
0:01:56million yeah ouch so so I don't know
0:02:01quite where to start because i never do
0:02:03with these things i guess i should ask
0:02:04if anybody has any opening remarks to
0:02:06give up this film because now would be a
0:02:08good time because it's the opening
0:02:10nothing all right you did
0:02:13you've dragged it out of me haha oh
0:02:15that's harder than usual i don't have a
0:02:18weii i do have a thing to start with and
0:02:21the thing I think I thought of room we
0:02:23watching this is that this movie we just
0:02:26discussed this movie has a lot of
0:02:27problems as a product because as a
0:02:30product as as conceived it's a it's a
0:02:33family movie you know for children and
0:02:36adults set in a time period no children
0:02:39will have any memory of or poor the poor
0:02:42the parents of those children quite
0:02:43frankly yeah or maybe that maybe it'll
0:02:45be like their parents memories or
0:02:47whatever and the the underlying themes
0:02:49of the movie are it's not just arbitrary
0:02:52the setting like that the themes of the
0:02:54movie are intertwined with this whole
0:02:57Cold War setting and everything and so
0:02:59and you know there's no cute animal
0:03:01sidekick
0:03:02there's no royalty there's no monsters
0:03:07it is yes it does not work well on paper
0:03:10if you were to if you're goddamn right
0:03:12it almost makes me that this movie got
0:03:14made because it doesn't look like it
0:03:15should work at all and truth be told
0:03:17watching it back again some parts of it
0:03:19work for fine for me as an adult I'm
0:03:22like our kids ever gonna lie I kind of
0:03:25understand why didn't make a lot of
0:03:27money which is a shame because it's a
0:03:28great movie but it it
0:03:30alchemist a little conceived but I just
0:03:33think like boy how did he ever manage to
0:03:35get this made while reading up on the
0:03:37production on the ever useful wikipedia
0:03:40it sounds like just as they were ramping
0:03:44up production on this thing quest for
0:03:45camelot came out and did absolutely
0:03:48horribly and kind of threw the whole the
0:03:52whole Warner Brothers animation studio
0:03:55into whack and somehow that translates
0:03:58to them not paying that much attention
0:04:00what Brad Bird was doing on this
0:04:02production and him being allowed to do
0:04:03basically whatever the heck you wanted
0:04:05not sure how that works exactly but it
0:04:07was also originally conceived as a
0:04:09musical if you can imagine what that
0:04:10would be like well it was a musical as
0:04:12sort of it p towns and put together the
0:04:15his his version of it which was supposed
0:04:18to be it's been awhile since tommy was
0:04:20out and I feel like producing another
0:04:21horrible rock opera so
0:04:23let me find this ancient this ancient
0:04:26book by the guy who married sylvia plath
0:04:29and and we'll set that to music that
0:04:32explains why des McAnuff is is credited
0:04:35here too because they were the
0:04:36collaborators at the la jolla playhouse
0:04:38in fact on on Tommy I and so that
0:04:41explains why there inexplicably credited
0:04:44as producers on this movie
0:04:45well they did produce this for the stage
0:04:47at one point at the what the old vic in
0:04:49London or something
0:04:50I think so yeah I i remember when the
0:04:52concert album came out because i was
0:04:54working at a record store at the time
0:04:55and and they had us put up a huge
0:04:57display and nobody ever bought a single
0:04:59thing come out there but you know we had
0:05:01to play it and listen to it in the
0:05:03stores like Iron Man Iron Man and you
0:05:07know it wasn't awful
0:05:09I could see why nobody ever did anything
0:05:12else with it but I guess brad bird had
0:05:14so much free rein that at one point he
0:05:16just decided to jettison all the songs
0:05:18and townsend said whatever I got my
0:05:20check it seems like it has a real
0:05:22affection for the setting mode because
0:05:24it's almost like a period piece where it
0:05:26is it's not it's not incidental like he
0:05:29almost makes you think like this is how
0:05:31he grew up but he's not that old
0:05:32right so it's not how here maybe that's
0:05:34how his parents grew up but there's a
0:05:36real you know it really speaks to me out
0:05:39on that level which is really weird when
0:05:41I think about the person who made it in
0:05:43the intended audience
0:05:45well this is also a love letter for the
0:05:47for the movies and the culture of this
0:05:51period even if you didn't live through
0:05:52it i mean the idea that there's the it's
0:05:55not just the Cold War setting but it's
0:05:58the you know the war of the worlds
0:06:00oh yeah when he's watching that
0:06:02black-and-white TV that black-and-white
0:06:03TV section I feel like it's the best
0:06:05part of the movie like what's on the
0:06:06television screen and my daughter asked
0:06:09if that was a real movie because she
0:06:10wants to watch it with the stilted
0:06:11dialogue in the brain that skills across
0:06:13the floor and the acting from the lead
0:06:16male character in that movie and the
0:06:18maple commercial is a real ad from the
0:06:21fifties one thing is so great in these
0:06:22and you know you see it again in the
0:06:24incredibles with Frank and Ollie
0:06:25appearing in that as well is the
0:06:28absolute affection they have for the
0:06:29animation of that period as well you
0:06:31know and how much this really could be a
0:06:33maple commercial in some ways some of
0:06:34the animation and all the care that
0:06:36is it just you know one thing I noticed
0:06:37this time is like everybody has glasses
0:06:39the glasses are just a little bit tinted
0:06:41they don't they're not just clear that
0:06:43there's a lot of care put into to every
0:06:45frame of this
0:06:46yeah it's it's it's beautiful it is
0:06:48funny that we've got the fifties his
0:06:51Hogarth is our main character his mom as
0:06:53a waitress in a diner Harry Connick is
0:06:56basically a beatnik artists there are
0:06:59lots of this is it main so you've got
0:07:01sort of like the the the guys who work
0:07:04on the boats and then you've got the
0:07:05guys with like the deerstalker caps and
0:07:07the and the shotguns and you know where
0:07:09all these types and it feels like you
0:07:12know I having lived through the fifties
0:07:14I i assume it feels like what depictions
0:07:17of the fifties retro actively felt like
0:07:21and not what the actual he's felt like
0:07:23but it definitely has that it is of a
0:07:25time
0:07:25this is what you know this is a post-war
0:07:27cold war story and and and it place it
0:07:32up and I i really enjoyed it but you
0:07:34know i'm not sure my kids really got I
0:07:35mean we can't explain this is the Cold
0:07:37War this is and they know what a beatnik
0:07:38is alright but just the cold borrow the
0:07:41culture war all these thing I mean they
0:07:43say the word beatnik in the movie to try
0:07:44to maybe give the kids something that
0:07:46they can like us they could google it
0:07:47back then the kids pick it up I mean
0:07:50he's just he's a cool guy who lives on
0:07:52his own in a you know a junkyard and
0:07:54wears bathrobes and yeah and in many
0:07:57respects like that the setting like we
0:07:59just an hour you know how much care to
0:08:01put into setting but you could this
0:08:03story is strong enough that you can set
0:08:04it almost anywhere just gets reinforced
0:08:06by this setting with the cold war stuff
0:08:08but every every other part of the movie
0:08:10like works like the story structure is
0:08:11very sturdy is just the theme like put
0:08:14it up on top of a mountain you can take
0:08:15that same story structure and put it on
0:08:17the ground in any setting it would still
0:08:18work
0:08:19well I think you have a much easier time
0:08:20selling the fact that the military is
0:08:22willing to send a bunch of trucks and
0:08:24tanks out you know in the midst of the
0:08:26Cold War when Sputnik is just launched
0:08:28and they don't know you know they're
0:08:29dealing with a big Russian invention or
0:08:31death ray or something at this point
0:08:32it's definitely got this
0:08:34this movie has got the at the start it's
0:08:37a classic boys no boys dream street
0:08:41fairytale kind of thing where it's who
0:08:44what what kid in the fifties wouldn't
0:08:46dream of giving as Home Guard says my
0:08:48own giant roll
0:08:49bot right so he finds this real body be
0:08:52friends then there's a little bit of
0:08:53that Mouse taking the thorn out of the
0:08:56paw of the lion kind of thing happens
0:08:58where he saves the iron giant from being
0:09:01electrocuted at the power station and
0:09:03convenient giant off switch that every
0:09:05perception has outside that is a super
0:09:09useful feature for your power plant you
0:09:11have to have what is the master control
0:09:13in case something happens and a giant
0:09:15robot is caught in the power lines you
0:09:16can just go Boop this as an insurance
0:09:18thing in the fifties he had to have an
0:09:19on-off switch
0:09:20yeah you just run up to it yeah well
0:09:22there was a fence the fence got knocked
0:09:24down but you know that's true good point
0:09:26that will then it makes perfect sense it
0:09:29was behind defense that's that's ok but
0:09:31then the robot is sort of you know he's
0:09:33somebody has shown him a kindness and
0:09:35the robot obviously has no has no memory
0:09:37we have no idea where the robot came
0:09:39from there's no it's never explained
0:09:41which I which I kind of love but that's
0:09:43how the story starts as we mean Hogarth
0:09:45we know that he's got a mom but not a
0:09:47daddy you know she works really hard so
0:09:50she leaves him to take care of himself
0:09:51sometimes he had it he watches that
0:09:54really hilarious Bob zombie movie
0:09:57basically definitely that feeling of the
0:10:00old black and white TV but his antenna
0:10:02gets eaten so he has to go out on a on a
0:10:06journey with and that's where he meets
0:10:08the robot and that all happens up to the
0:10:11point where where the robot starts
0:10:12following them around like a like a
0:10:14stray dog that he's collected it up to
0:10:19the point where there's a train wreck
0:10:21caused by the giant not being able to
0:10:23put a try to eat the tracks and try to
0:10:25put them back and then the train hits
0:10:27any breaks up into a million pieces and
0:10:29i like how chill the engineers are after
0:10:31that I mean the engineers literally hit
0:10:33a giant monster at dark in the middle of
0:10:36the woods in Maine and the train derails
0:10:38and the engineers like someone out there
0:10:41everything ok hows it Collin he has seen
0:10:44with bandages around his head afterwards
0:10:46so perhaps he's just you know concussed
0:10:48and that's the that's the the Cameo
0:10:52right there right from the classic
0:10:54animators of of Disney who we see again
0:10:56in the incredibles yeah they were they
0:10:59were what they call it the column circus
0:11:01this like the seven old man nine old men
0:11:03and they worked on Bambi and Dumbo and
0:11:06maybe snow white pretty much everything
0:11:08from the 32 the fifties amazing so they
0:11:12invented you know the the 12 principles
0:11:13of disney animation which are still talk
0:11:15to this day those two work together on
0:11:18the illusion of life is a really great
0:11:21book written by the two of them that's
0:11:22like that's a classic textbook in a lot
0:11:24of animation courses so this is the the
0:11:26the train wreck is what brings us are
0:11:28our plot when the the the Fox Mulder of
0:11:34ya can't Mansley appears on the scene
0:11:37hehe is from some office of of
0:11:42Investigation he's from the Bureau of
0:11:44unexplained phenomena yeah you only see
0:11:47his car door briefly because his car is
0:11:48then eaten and I have to say I mean
0:11:51christopher mcdonald those voices he
0:11:53does a great job with it but it is the
0:11:55william atherton role and he's doing
0:11:58william atherton voice it's amazing he
0:12:00sees like that he's totally like the
0:12:02nineties that guy i don't know i'm not
0:12:04sure Atherton would have tried so hard
0:12:05to ingratiate himself to the kid just
0:12:07doesn't seem his style but after African
0:12:10would have done a chloroform on the kids
0:12:11oh yeah that's for sure
0:12:13probably probably before even talking to
0:12:14him I don't know that the immigration is
0:12:16so smart me when he tries to be so you
0:12:19know so-called befriend Hogarth that you
0:12:21never believe it
0:12:22Hogarth doesn't believe it nobody
0:12:23believes it is I i would say I think of
0:12:27william atherton in something in
0:12:28something like like Ghostbusters a real
0:12:30genius especially where he he is he has
0:12:34that ingratiating like is what we can
0:12:37Ghostbusters what is the magic word
0:12:38right but he doesn't mean that he is
0:12:40just a jerk and Mansley is exactly like
0:12:43that debts that's a good call
0:12:45he's got that qualities at the quality
0:12:46that I used to have somebody who thinks
0:12:48that people like him any and yes you
0:12:50have thanks yeah I easy text he also he
0:12:53thinks he thinks he understands kids you
0:12:56know when you meet somebody who's like I
0:12:57understand he Spitz work you know me
0:12:59Ranger are you doing guru ji wrote I
0:13:02wrote a bunch of those down thats great
0:13:03tiger Slugger cowboy champion sure it
0:13:06just
0:13:08he's got a smile on his face and a lot
0:13:10of movies every single one of the smiles
0:13:12slightly different all incredibly
0:13:14aggressive like his eyes are angry but
0:13:16his mouth the smiling always good it's
0:13:17good animation man's journey is is funny
0:13:19too because he comes to investigate the
0:13:21same thing is a real thing and he he is
0:13:24doing investigative work and he finds
0:13:26that is a real thing and he calls the
0:13:28army in the army doesn't want to hear
0:13:29him and that's when i wrote down that
0:13:30he's he's the Fox Mulder of the of the
0:13:32fifties they don't want to believe him
0:13:34but he he believes that he he's not
0:13:36wrong but then his hit then he becomes
0:13:39like uncontrollably obsessed and declaw
0:13:42reforms the kid and and and later toward
0:13:45the end of the movie he calls on calls a
0:13:46nuclear strike against everybody else's
0:13:48orders on a town in the United States
0:13:50the town that he's in you have a bit
0:13:52extreme
0:13:53at that point he kind of loses it and
0:13:55the most important thing about about
0:13:57Mansley of course is that Steven I'm
0:14:00sure you appreciate this
0:14:01he is the source of a long long string
0:14:04of poop jokes because he has fed
0:14:06laxatives so many poop chicks
0:14:09yes poop jokes are measured by a
0:14:11buttload so that's appropriate
0:14:13oh I did my favorite is that he crumples
0:14:14up the laxative and demands milkshake
0:14:16and he asks what it's called they said
0:14:18it's called a landslide which of course
0:14:20yeah but he's describing is describing
0:14:23the is going poop poop
0:14:26what's going through the air its goal
0:14:28that one he's got that there's that
0:14:30there's that moment where he's got to
0:14:31find that he's gonna find the bathroom
0:14:33and then and then later he's like behind
0:14:34a bush and he's just like no I just
0:14:37can't and and it's and it's not even
0:14:39said it's just it happens and if you're
0:14:41not paying attention you don't know
0:14:42what's going on at its all sight gags
0:14:45and I know that's the so anyway I was
0:14:47amazed by that that's the that's a
0:14:49beautiful thing that happens in the
0:14:50middle is that the the kid gets back by
0:14:53make it making poop you know one thing
0:14:56we didn't grab no from even from the
0:14:57very beginning and all throughout the
0:14:59film is how much this is so classic
0:15:03Disney when it's done well it's like how
0:15:05much care because into every character
0:15:07like every minor character is is unique
0:15:10they've each got their own funny
0:15:11expression their own funny t throne
0:15:12funny little quirks and way of talking
0:15:14like my name is when you see those
0:15:15little like a little you know exercises
0:15:17where they're showing like how this
0:15:19character is going to walk it does they
0:15:20did
0:15:21and then walk like this other guy like
0:15:22everybody's got their own little thing
0:15:23and it's I you know from the from the
0:15:26from the end wash guy at the beginning
0:15:28through you know that the guys in the in
0:15:30the diner like everybody you know to the
0:15:32shore like everybody's got their own
0:15:34little like tick you know
0:15:36yeah i mean i actually had a hey it's
0:15:37that guy moment with one of these
0:15:39characters was like where we've seen
0:15:41that guy before a this is a cartoon I
0:15:43haven't seen him anywhere before but it
0:15:45felt like this is an invoice probably
0:15:47was but it's like this is a character
0:15:49actor
0:15:49this is a face that I've seen in a
0:15:51million things like the guy who's having
0:15:53his car hood he has like two lines and
0:15:55he's so memorable
0:15:56you know it has a large bite out that's
0:16:00why i'm selling it
0:16:02even the woman character like that the
0:16:03blonde waitress who has no lines i think
0:16:06it's just that comes out of the door one
0:16:07point and that brushes against her
0:16:09awesome like that yet they actually
0:16:10manage our women who look different
0:16:11which is apparently a difficult thing to
0:16:13do in modern animation when you've got
0:16:15the same character with different color
0:16:16hair and makeup
0:16:18the blonde waitress I remember because
0:16:19she is so like she's so incredibly
0:16:21different from horse mom and so that and
0:16:24she has no lines you know so just like
0:16:26that except ever every character unique
0:16:29and like each character is an
0:16:31opportunity to do something fun with
0:16:32animation basically i think the fact
0:16:35that Hogarth has uneven front teeth is
0:16:37the master stroke though that adds so
0:16:39much character without means that he
0:16:41doesn't have a lot of defining
0:16:42characteristics but the teeth are enough
0:16:44to just immediately get you on his side
0:16:46there's also they do a lot with sound in
0:16:48general i was noticing this time watch
0:16:50it by myself so little quieter in the
0:16:52room noticing like how much stuff in the
0:16:54background you can hear conversations
0:16:55like actual conversations that the
0:16:57waitresses are having and stuff like
0:16:58that
0:16:59a nice touch you can make out like those
0:17:01words on the newspapers words on the
0:17:03television in the background with
0:17:04people's conversations and they managed
0:17:06to make it they know you're only gonna
0:17:07pick up one or two words but they
0:17:08managed to make them relevant to the
0:17:10setting or the plot events in some way
0:17:11the diner has like three different
0:17:13conversations happening simultaneously
0:17:15that if you listen they are all relevant
0:17:17and they all lead into you know you can
0:17:19hear the guys at the booth behind them
0:17:21having that conversation the whole time
0:17:23before they interrupt and it becomes you
0:17:26know it's it is that's a great scene
0:17:28although how they managed to discuss
0:17:30anything with no ear holes is utterly
0:17:32behind
0:17:32yeah stylistic choice that's weird when
0:17:35they're years or so big i was happy that
0:17:37they all had they had ten fingers you
0:17:39know not all cartoons have 10 fingers
0:17:41did make their hands like a little
0:17:43bigger because horse and look a little
0:17:44bit comical but all the other features
0:17:46exaggerated a little
0:17:47some of the checkpoint on the breadboard
0:17:49was born in 1957 so maybe this is not so
0:17:52far off from his child obviously would
0:17:53be an infant during this time and not a
0:17:55child but the thing that sets up the
0:17:57eurosport yeah I know let that so the
0:17:59thing is the thing I was picking up on
0:18:01for the memories of just being a boy in
0:18:04anytime the kid thing details
0:18:07one of them was when he has to distract
0:18:09his mother by making a noise that we can
0:18:12drag the big robotic hand through his
0:18:14house
0:18:14I has a coin and instead of just
0:18:17throwing the coin into the other room he
0:18:18did he flips the coin does anyone know
0:18:20how to do that when you snap your
0:18:21fingers and point your elbow the target
0:18:22you want to hit snap your fingers
0:18:24yeah he does that with the coin rather
0:18:26than just throwing it and that's that's
0:18:28a kid thing to do a learning that
0:18:29whatever when he dismounts his bicycle
0:18:31riding to the junkyard at one point he
0:18:33gets off on one side and glides while
0:18:34standing on the pedal for a little while
0:18:36there's no reason to do either one of
0:18:37those things you could've just thrown up
0:18:38any you could've just arrived on his
0:18:39bicycle gotten off the normal way but
0:18:41that's not what little boys do little
0:18:43boys learn to do all these little boy
0:18:44things and so you know those little
0:18:46details really pull you into the setting
0:18:49it and makes me think that like that
0:18:51Brad Bird is if not drawing himself
0:18:52drawing like parts of his own childhood
0:18:54I think about the first scene where he
0:18:57appears in the diner and he runs up to
0:18:58the counter any jumps on the stool and
0:19:00he doesn't think where he's talking with
0:19:01mom and he's swiveling is like you know
0:19:04torso back and forth on the on the on
0:19:06the stool because you know he's a kid
0:19:07he's not going to sit still while he's
0:19:09talking to his mom he's going to be
0:19:10fidgeting with everything i love his a
0:19:13is child phone manners and the you know
0:19:16formal but completely dead inside
0:19:19hi this is Hogarth Hughes who's calling
0:19:21please also if you want your mother to
0:19:23leave you alone
0:19:24what you do is go into the bathroom
0:19:26again poop you go into the bathroom take
0:19:28lots of grunting noises and Franco you
0:19:30okay and there are five leave me alone
0:19:32that apparently works for Mansley to ya
0:19:36lot of poop jokes in this that's all I'm
0:19:39saying let's see what else what else
0:19:43should we talk about I mean we talked
0:19:44about the giant
0:19:46yeah he some pieces he's a piece of work
0:19:48and I I didn't realize in the first few
0:19:50times i watch this that he's cg while
0:19:53the rest of the film is hand-drawn so
0:19:55he's like the the spaceship in futurama
0:19:57where he's ECG designed to look like cel
0:20:00animation i didn't i didn't know that
0:20:02the first time I saw it but now now I
0:20:04see that but I saw a note today that
0:20:05basically to make his motions fluid
0:20:08would have been tough with ya his
0:20:11movement is so fluid that it's clearly
0:20:12computer-assisted I don't know the
0:20:14details of how how that works
0:20:16so he sticks a wet say when they just
0:20:18started doing this with the
0:20:19incorporating cg in traditional
0:20:21animation it was very difficult to get
0:20:25it to look like it fits the beauty and
0:20:27the beast just the example right that
0:20:29the big dance scene and beauty and the
0:20:30beast is a CJ scene but even beauty the
0:20:32beast that background is like oh now i'm
0:20:34looking at something different or
0:20:35Aladdin Aladdin at the cg carpet ride
0:20:37that is not incorporated well the Iron
0:20:40Giant is incorporated amazingly well for
0:20:42how early it came I think it's actually
0:20:43incorporated better than futurama to
0:20:45give another obviously TV budgets are
0:20:47different than 70 million dollars for
0:20:48movie but futurama you know is that the
0:20:50more modern examples everyone knows a
0:20:52lot of the times you know the spaceships
0:20:53and stuff
0:20:54poke out yet cg like it's almost like
0:20:57like you know your advice
0:20:58John on how to set your TV so you don't
0:21:00get that soap opera effect it's almost
0:21:02like when you c cg stuff in cell
0:21:04animation it looks too fluid there's
0:21:06someone in miyazaki sometimes there's
0:21:08one where was it howl's moving castle
0:21:10now it was one of the ones with this big
0:21:12Walking castle big walking structure and
0:21:14it looks really cg you know it's too
0:21:16smooth there's too many parts moving at
0:21:18once it doesn't have any kind of like
0:21:20jumpiness in the frame it looks out of
0:21:21place didn't get that at all that's why
0:21:23I couldn't tell it first
0:21:24well so i'm princess mononoke that not
0:21:26to return to miyazaki podcast on the the
0:21:28nightwalker with all done in CG and
0:21:30miyazaki didn't like it and read it all
0:21:32by hand or have them read it behind or
0:21:34whatever so and you know it's it has a
0:21:37high bar for that but the big thing if
0:21:39you're looking for it if you're not
0:21:41looking for like I wasn't looking if
0:21:42it's in like it's a bad Matt job or like
0:21:44it looks like a specular highlights but
0:21:46nothing else does or whatever the big
0:21:48thing to look for is that three things
0:21:49rose perspective correct right so when
0:21:51you rotate the camera around they look
0:21:52exactly like they would for nothin where
0:21:53is hand-drawn animation is not
0:21:55perspective correct many cartoon
0:21:57characters you know Charlie Brown
0:21:59you know it's great example do not look
0:22:01like any real physical 3-dimensional
0:22:02object could look like from from various
0:22:04angles and you have to transition from
0:22:06this pose where we know what Charlie
0:22:07Brown looks like to this pose and there
0:22:09is no in-between that makes any sense
0:22:10there was a 3d shape you model it and
0:22:12and you put the virtual camera on and it
0:22:15looks it looks correct from every
0:22:16possible angle so it's usually very easy
0:22:18to pick out the 3d things even if they
0:22:21do a perfect job of blending the
0:22:22textures but in this movie because the
0:22:24Iron Giant is an iron giant his
0:22:27perspective correctness and his
0:22:29proportions and everything works like
0:22:30he's a robot he's not a flesh-and-blood
0:22:32wiggly you know
0:22:34yeah squash and stretch disney animated
0:22:37character he's a robot so we should look
0:22:38like that and they just such a great job
0:22:40with the detailing that he never looks
0:22:41like he's popping out from the frame he
0:22:43always looks like he's there before I
0:22:45realized it was CGI on the robot I'd i
0:22:48wrote the note that i was impressed and
0:22:50how they managed to get the perspective
0:22:51on the robot just right from down at
0:22:53Hogarth's level because there are
0:22:55several scenes that are taken from where
0:22:56Hogarth sad and you're looking up at the
0:22:58giant towards his head and you really
0:23:00get this amazing sense of how huge it
0:23:02must be from the perspective of the kid
0:23:04and I found that pretty impressive and
0:23:07unless impressed now that I realized it
0:23:09was a computer behind you should be so
0:23:10impressed that they fooled you
0:23:11that's what I'm I'm getting there is it
0:23:13the fact that it didn't that it didn't
0:23:15stick out like a sore thumb to be is
0:23:16also impressive so I can't believe this
0:23:18thing was I mean the couple things I
0:23:20read suggested this was pretty
0:23:21constrained he had to pull in people
0:23:23from CalArts to help out with some of
0:23:24the animation if this does not feel like
0:23:27a rushed movie to me
0:23:28I mean you know maybe thank God for
0:23:31quest for camelot that you could get the
0:23:32poop jokes in but you know it's amazing
0:23:34that I you know I thought it felt like
0:23:37the everything he wanted probably got
0:23:38into this even the Dean unzipping his
0:23:41pants and unleashing the squirrel which
0:23:42I didn't get the studio has been paying
0:23:44attention might not have made it to the
0:23:46final cut and the opening scenes where
0:23:48they had the they have the giant waves
0:23:51in the opening scene the waves of water
0:23:53and that that's always expensive to do
0:23:55anything with water but the fact that
0:23:56they opened the movie with that I think
0:23:58they went back to her like that's and
0:24:00they did the waves are all so CG because
0:24:02you know that I maybe that was cheaper
0:24:03to do that but in 1999 saying you're
0:24:05going to open your animated movie with
0:24:06sequins in the water that was really
0:24:09good water for 1999 yeah i mean it was
0:24:11there with stylized fit in
0:24:12the rest of the movie but I it doesn't
0:24:16like you said does not look like a movie
0:24:17where he was like time or budget
0:24:18constraint because you would just like
0:24:20you know you would have just drawn that
0:24:22from the perspective inside the boat and
0:24:23had rain lashing is the window instead
0:24:25of spending all this money on a CG waves
0:24:27so Jon I am obviously saw this movie
0:24:30many times before i ever saw castle in
0:24:33the sky and when I saw castle in the sky
0:24:36I thought hey nice robot I wonder and I
0:24:39assume that this is a huge influence on
0:24:41Brad Bird for doing the orange and I
0:24:43know that the probably it's possible
0:24:45that the book that the ted hughes book
0:24:48influenced castle in the sky I don't
0:24:50know but the the certainly when I saw
0:24:53castle in the sky I thought oh I felt
0:24:56very iron giant e to me because it is a
0:24:59long tradition of big giant robots in
0:25:01japan so I don't think you can pinpoint
0:25:02anyone influences that
0:25:04design-wise the bucket head the
0:25:07trapezoid chest the sort of simplified
0:25:10design may be contractually I forget who
0:25:13among the pic sorry and people are the
0:25:15rabbit miyazaki fans and who merely just
0:25:18like him so i don't know i can offer you
0:25:20can draw a straight line but we can look
0:25:21it up after the show and it certainly
0:25:23reminded me of that but I don't know
0:25:25what the influence is that's the robots
0:25:27that like guard the garden
0:25:28yep yeah yeah it did I immediately saw
0:25:32that in gas on this guy
0:25:34yeah yeah I came to mind anyway now
0:25:37there's a statue my twelve-year-old took
0:25:40one look at it before we watched it and
0:25:41so this is like a giant alien Rock'em
0:25:44Sock'em robot right as well kind of
0:25:48he just overcomes programming but but he
0:25:51immediately was like picking out
0:25:52different robots that had been reminded
0:25:54him of the garment the night when I see
0:25:58the end part of this movie I think of
0:26:00Brad Brad Bird school notebooks because
0:26:03during that this is not the point of the
0:26:05end of the movie but just another detail
0:26:06at the end of the movie when he went all
0:26:08the guns come out research bristling
0:26:09with weapons the weapons the heat that
0:26:12the iron giant has inside him are
0:26:14interesting and imaginative at to the
0:26:16point of like the things that kid some
0:26:18kid with doodle in his notebook it's not
0:26:19just like a series of godlike the
0:26:21articulated arms or the little the
0:26:23little thing where he fires off shots in
0:26:24different directions by it
0:26:26I intersecting the spinning disk with a
0:26:27little needle type thing that sends them
0:26:29out
0:26:30it shoots it like a revolver like a
0:26:31Western revolver like ticket yeah I
0:26:34could totally see that on Brad bird's
0:26:35peachy folders back right baby could
0:26:38have spent ok a bunch of guns come out
0:26:40and now he's in battle mode or whatever
0:26:41it's like no there's like we gotta think
0:26:42of seven awesome imaginative weapons and
0:26:45they got one give me with the War of the
0:26:46Worlds type B me snake things on the
0:26:48head but everything else they did was
0:26:50fairly original and interesting and is
0:26:53on screen for a split second is not
0:26:54important to the plot of the movie but
0:26:56clearly a lot of thought went into what
0:26:57is the payoff of seeing that the Giant
0:27:00is a weapons platform and that he has
0:27:02made 44 destruction that is the payoff
0:27:04but you're right it's there for a second
0:27:07and then we don't see it again i think i
0:27:09think that's a big that's a big part of
0:27:11the movie on multiple watchings for me
0:27:13is minorities awareness but like what
0:27:16the robot knows you know I I like you
0:27:19Jason I like the fact that i don't
0:27:20really know where he came from or like
0:27:22why he doesn't know what he's for but i
0:27:25don't know i make no sense that dent in
0:27:28the head in space or the answers by the
0:27:29way
0:27:30well the only the only issue with that
0:27:31and it's not really addressed by the
0:27:33film and obviously 44 clear reasons we
0:27:36are totally screwed as soon as more of
0:27:38these robots show clap now they're all
0:27:41friendly just don't shoot them they'll
0:27:43be fine
0:27:43I I assume it's a planet i think it's a
0:27:46planet hulk situation I think he got it
0:27:48ended up falling off and ending ending
0:27:50up in the wrong place but I but you know
0:27:52I mean to me that becomes some more
0:27:53poignant because it's not so different
0:27:55from the Cold War mentality of like hey
0:27:57listen I don't want to be a monster I
0:27:59don't want to kill anybody but if
0:28:00somebody shoots at me I'm going to
0:28:02destroy their country
0:28:03yeah no I think it's pretty clear that a
0:28:04robot that's loaded down with that many
0:28:06different kinds of weapons is not a
0:28:07peace-loving robot well or but he's a
0:28:10defensive robot though he's he's his job
0:28:12is to go somewhere and and be a guard or
0:28:16defend I guess any or maybe till he's
0:28:18activated but i liked i think that work
0:28:19says I don't know for me that worked as
0:28:21an analogy for the cold war in some ways
0:28:23to which is nobody thought they were a
0:28:24monster at the time nobody thought that
0:28:26what they were doing with arms as
0:28:27escalation was something that was gonna
0:28:30you know in danger generations of people
0:28:32they thought they were doing what they
0:28:33had to do because they knew so little
0:28:35about what the other side was doing
0:28:37we've got it we've gotta get
0:28:38I'll get all these guns otherwise you
0:28:40know we're gonna be dead and that not
0:28:42knowing what's going on i think really
0:28:44feeds into that Cold War paranoia that's
0:28:47what made a paranoia is we didn't we
0:28:48didn't know what a shambles to see the
0:28:50inn was you know
0:28:51yeah I think that's why the the
0:28:53emotional bit at the end of this movie
0:28:54that will eventually get through the
0:28:55reason why i think that works or at
0:28:57least it works for nerds of our stripes
0:28:59i can include us all into this is that
0:29:01if you identify with the robot not
0:29:04Hogarth but the robot that is a lot of
0:29:08the emotional payoff at the end of the
0:29:10movie because you know it's kind of an
0:29:12edward scissorhands situation you know
0:29:13who you know what alienated child has
0:29:15not felt that they are large capable of
0:29:18mass destruction but ultimately
0:29:19misunderstood and being shot at by
0:29:21everybody and you know you don't like
0:29:23that's at by the end of the movie where
0:29:26identifying with the robot
0:29:27we're not thinking of ours anymore and
0:29:29that's yeah that's maybe why this is a
0:29:31cult classic and not a widespread movie
0:29:33because maybe you need a certain kind of
0:29:35disposition or childhood experience or
0:29:38both to identify with the robot in this
0:29:39movie I would also like just to clarify
0:29:42for my own purposes we differentiate the
0:29:45end of the movie and the ND Mick
0:29:48and-and-and of the movie because I got
0:29:51some thoughts on all right two things I
0:29:53don't like about this movie I'd like to
0:29:55return to but you know yeah i mean the
0:29:57the entire like what should have been
0:29:58the end of the movie absolutely
0:30:01staggering you know you think the cat
0:30:03should be talking at this point is what
0:30:05you say
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0:34:23much to drobo for putting a single box
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0:34:31to mention a couple a couple gags that I
0:34:33really liked early 11 game that I like a
0:34:35lot is the when hoegaarden Dean Hogarth
0:34:39eventually takes the robot to dean at
0:34:41the junkyard and there's that moment
0:34:43where we're first Hogarth drinks
0:34:47espresso and is bouncing off the walls
0:34:49which I really like and you get all of
0:34:51his backstory and that mean that 32nd
0:34:53minute everything you ever learned about
0:34:56Hogarth you get in 30 seconds well he's
0:34:58hopped up on espresso
0:34:59his name is Dean we like Dean is a very
0:35:02nice line and then there's the really
0:35:04funny things like nope nope no way see
0:35:06forget it see you later cut to 37
0:35:08minutes later alright that's a really
0:35:12nice guy like he can stay scene is also
0:35:15really chill just like those engineers
0:35:17you
0:35:17he's there's there's some kids sneaking
0:35:19around is scrap yard in the middle of
0:35:20the night he's like come on in its main
0:35:22you know gonna come hang out with this
0:35:25crap art or scrap artist and have some
0:35:26expresso will hang around my kimono i'm
0:35:29totally i'm totally not creepy you know
0:35:30you can't trust the man from the
0:35:32government and that child grew up to be
0:35:35Stephen can
0:35:36yeah you know the yeah I like that
0:35:38though there is that feeling of like
0:35:39this is a town where people don't lock
0:35:41the doors and you know and it's and it's
0:35:43like sure kid whatever I mean and I
0:35:46really feel it's like I know who your
0:35:47mom is I know where you live you know I
0:35:49go to the diner it's fine whatever
0:35:51what's going on and he's cool he's cool
0:35:54about it he doesn't have any chloroform
0:35:56that he's staring first person he was
0:35:59paying enough attention that he offered
0:36:01him espresso and not something else at
0:36:02least this is interesting though in that
0:36:04it's a pg-rated animated movie where
0:36:07they they clearly reference alcohol in
0:36:09several occasions like they accused the
0:36:11old codger at the beginning of being
0:36:13drunk on whiskey or beer when he sees
0:36:15the giant robot and then later you see
0:36:17the general sitting in his room watching
0:36:19some Western rather on TV while Mansley
0:36:21talks to him and he's got some whiskey
0:36:23neat sitting on sun the side table next
0:36:25to him in general i like I always liked
0:36:28when is a rational military person so we
0:36:31have we have immensely being all the
0:36:33crazy a detergent i think but the
0:36:34general for the most part
0:36:35John Mahoney he's totally reasonable I
0:36:38mean he sees a little bit excitable but
0:36:40in the end is like he wants to not harm
0:36:42children he doesn't want to nuketown
0:36:44main like he's got you know that's what
0:36:47it takes to be reasonable
0:36:48yeah I know everything or even when or
0:36:50even when the guy calls him up assistant
0:36:51giant robot is like stop bothering me
0:36:53yeah i need to actually you need some
0:36:55evidence i'm not getting out of my chair
0:36:57until there's an actual robot not just
0:36:58tales of her about whereas if he was
0:37:00like a robot we got you know this if
0:37:02he's not as cartoonish as he could be
0:37:05yeah i like i like ammonia at the end he
0:37:07is very clearly acting rationally hehe
0:37:10he doesn't believe that the crazy robot
0:37:12talk at the front and then at the end
0:37:13it's very clear you know this movie
0:37:15would have been a much lesser movie i
0:37:17think if everybody in the town
0:37:19misunderstands once lighting robot
0:37:21doesn't becomes an angry mob and all of
0:37:23that we have to kill the robot
0:37:25united and no it's like he saves the kid
0:37:27who's fallen the kids were falling off
0:37:29the building and because they're looking
0:37:31at him but he saves those kids and what
0:37:33actually seems awfully miyazaki esque as
0:37:36well
0:37:37yes there's no ticker-tape after he
0:37:39catch them up so there's that but you
0:37:42know and everybody's like everything
0:37:43like yeah we know yeah the robot and and
0:37:46and the generals like this is not what
0:37:49you know this is not what we thought it
0:37:50was that we know we're not gonna we're
0:37:52not going to do this I enjoy that after
0:37:54Mansley orders the launch he uses his
0:37:58last couple minutes on earth to like to
0:37:59him out right
0:38:00he's like I don't think a little bit of
0:38:02time here i want to make sure that you
0:38:03know how dumb you are before we die or
0:38:05are making sure he can escape as if you
0:38:07could drive away in gbg fast enough to
0:38:09escape the do the oncoming nuclear blast
0:38:12but he's looking for something to duck
0:38:13and cover under I think there's nothing
0:38:16out of the town square that he can hide
0:38:17underneath this is the the cartoon
0:38:19version of the add-on for Red October
0:38:21you know you've murdered us it's not you
0:38:23fool
0:38:25but you know it's all okay in the end
0:38:27what else before we get we shouldn't you
0:38:29know get the end yet what else do people
0:38:33i already talked about poop jokes that
0:38:34was key that i bring up poop jokes i
0:38:37like i like the way their relationship
0:38:39evolves you know there's a lot of stuff
0:38:41i was you know willing to well I'm not
0:38:44like super critics but I was willing to
0:38:46overlook you know a lot of stuff about
0:38:47the skepticism like the town's not that
0:38:50skeptical that a robot just save these
0:38:51kids the mom seems to warm up to the
0:38:53robot pretty fast I was okay with all
0:38:55that because i love the way that Hogarth
0:38:57and I mean you know really the heart of
0:38:59the film the middle of the film so much
0:39:01of it is about their relationship and
0:39:02how quickly the robot is is getting this
0:39:07new culture and I think that's a lot
0:39:08really where the heart of the movie is
0:39:10the you know beating heart of the movie
0:39:12is you know getting the idea of Superman
0:39:14and understanding you know this new
0:39:16world that he's in I thought that was
0:39:17that was all really well done and doing
0:39:19it in this little steps and you know
0:39:21doing the Cannonball and all that stuff
0:39:23I thought that was really well done the
0:39:24superman vs at amo thing is brilliant to
0:39:27write because it's visit robots are
0:39:28supposed to be the bad guys and and not
0:39:31only is that a piece of pop culture from
0:39:34the from the fifties like here's a
0:39:36superman comic book
0:39:37let's let's read it
0:39:38trying to teach you about life on Earth
0:39:40by showing you about this Superman an
0:39:42evil robot which is not life on Earth
0:39:44but you know it and and that he's like
0:39:47no tomm Oh Superman beautiful
0:39:50yea even even after showing the lesson
0:39:52howarth wants to play act that game and
0:39:54fourth wants to be the good guy wants
0:39:55the robot to play the bad guy the robot
0:39:57feels bad about playing the bad guy
0:39:59because he doesn't want to be the bad
0:40:00guy when that was one of my favorite
0:40:02moments was not not just that you have
0:40:04where he showing the comic books and
0:40:06saying here Superman and here's Tom oh
0:40:07but he also shows them the spirit which
0:40:10is almost a throwaway moment
0:40:12its just oh and here's the spirit here's
0:40:14another good guy but you know the it's
0:40:16very thematic because he's a hero who is
0:40:20thought to be dead and he wakes up from
0:40:22suspended animation and just becomes a
0:40:24hero and it was just a really nice sort
0:40:28of subtext great there and it's like oh
0:40:30and then we'll go into Superman is that
0:40:32a DC comic it is now the most the most
0:40:35recent one the most recent book by
0:40:37Darwyn Cooke was a TC book right but
0:40:39that's a classic it's a classic
0:40:41oh yeah that's from the forties yeah
0:40:43okay that we should talk about the band
0:40:45be seen there is a beautiful deer that
0:40:49they spot and that that comes up to the
0:40:52iron giant he touches it snows and it's
0:40:54this really nice thing at least skittish
0:40:55dear of all time of all time know they
0:40:57are obviously feeding the deer in Maine
0:41:00they're feeding it by hitting them by
0:41:01hand well I mean we see that you know
0:41:03like that dear doesn't you know it's
0:41:05gonna have some light lifetime issues
0:41:07with how far it's gonna make it
0:41:08there's a big summer in florida subject
0:41:10metal nipple that delivers dear food and
0:41:13that's why he's not freaked out when the
0:41:14gigantic fingerprint approaches knows
0:41:16maybe dear aren't afraid of robots only
0:41:19living things and maybe he has hearing
0:41:21issues it's unclear yeah so then so then
0:41:24the deer dies and and Hogarth is put in
0:41:26the position of trying to explain like
0:41:28death and other issues of the you know
0:41:31death and what happens to us when we die
0:41:33to this giant robot from outer space
0:41:36which is fascinating to see a an
0:41:38eight-year-old kid trying to explain
0:41:40these these weighty matters to a robot
0:41:42who basically doesn't even understand or
0:41:44at least compared Lee speak any words
0:41:47well he's trying to figure out whether
0:41:48robots die is like well I guess you your
0:41:50cut your mission
0:41:51I mean but you have feelings and like a
0:41:53lot of robots he doesn't thinking out
0:41:56loud which you know maybe not realistic
0:41:58but it's good for the movies where he's
0:41:59talking about when he first finds the
0:42:00robot
0:42:01alright so what I can bring to my mom no
0:42:03no get the screaming problem again
0:42:05really just you know that we don't do
0:42:07that that's what makes people shoot you
0:42:09you know so like he's he's going to the
0:42:10same thing when he gets asked this but
0:42:12the robot are to explain death is like
0:42:14no are you alive
0:42:16guess you're alive yeah you're alive you
0:42:18say you're probably died too
0:42:19there's really a lot of exposition in
0:42:21this film with the characters sort of
0:42:23explaining what they're doing as they go
0:42:25which normally I find kind of irritating
0:42:27but in this case I was watching with my
0:42:28seven-year-old son and there was a lot
0:42:30of stuff I didn't have to explain to him
0:42:32and it wasn't just over-the-top
0:42:34irritating kind of a you know i am now
0:42:36going to go to the bathroom kind of
0:42:38stuff that was one like that he didn't
0:42:40like when her off its not going to snow
0:42:42that what's-his-name says he's
0:42:43unconscious but he's ok right grant got
0:42:46established in one line
0:42:47yeah he could he could have a traumatic
0:42:49brain injury who knows no no he's fine
0:42:51well you just need to move the plot
0:42:52along you need you need the road to
0:42:53think he's dead you need the audience to
0:42:55realize he's ok I mean I think that's
0:42:57kind of the best part of the movie is
0:42:59all the stuff we're Hogarth is you know
0:43:01he's talking to us-based talking to the
0:43:02robot and the robot the Giants not going
0:43:04to say anything excited you know it's
0:43:05not Lily's not verbally and look funny
0:43:07robot guttural things but it works
0:43:10really well and I think part of it is
0:43:11the animation is great if you watch
0:43:12those scenes again yogurt is Hogarth is
0:43:15so kind of exaggerated and expressive he
0:43:18talks with his hands in a way that I
0:43:19don't think any children actually do but
0:43:21it works really great i mean what one of
0:43:23the things you can kind of do in terms
0:43:25of like evaluating how effective that
0:43:27animation is you know watch it with the
0:43:28sound off in terms of seen you know what
0:43:30does he communicate with his body
0:43:31language that matches up with what he's
0:43:33saying there's also just kind of looking
0:43:35at him as like a silhouette he does so
0:43:37much with his hands and like away from
0:43:38his body on the totally conveys what's
0:43:41going on and you know makes those things
0:43:42interesting and not just exposition
0:43:44about what's going on
0:43:45it's also the look of somebody who's
0:43:46trying to teach somebody who doesn't
0:43:48understand your language is that
0:43:49involuntary like you start getting into
0:43:51the body language trying to like gesture
0:43:53your way to understanding and that's
0:43:55what Carter is doing with the with the
0:43:56giant of a lot of points I think I
0:43:58thought the scene where the robot was
0:44:00imitating him worked on a lot a lot a
0:44:02lot of levels because it was it was a
0:44:04great
0:44:05shortcut to helping us understand that
0:44:07the robot we know was a learning machine
0:44:09it could pick stuff up and it was trying
0:44:11to emulate him and but it also sort of
0:44:14showed that he wasn't threatening you
0:44:16know what i mean and also the great
0:44:17animation of like the weight of the
0:44:19robot like blink landing you know to to
0:44:21imitate Hogarth beautifully done
0:44:24I love that where he sits where he sits
0:44:26down the exact such an amazing little
0:44:29little bit for all that that helpful
0:44:31exposition sort of help my son get it as
0:44:35because he was going along i think the
0:44:36deer scene was maybe a little too
0:44:38weighty for the seven-year-old his
0:44:41response at that point as the deers
0:44:42lying there and that the two rifles are
0:44:44lying in the snow next to him he turns
0:44:46to me and says that would be cool if you
0:44:48picked up those guns and attach them to
0:44:50himself and then when something bad
0:44:51happened he'd go people watch tonight
0:44:55with a nine-year-old the twelve-year-old
0:44:56and they loved it but the nine-year-old
0:44:58was wrapped from the first the first
0:45:00scene is watching Hogarth getting
0:45:03knocked unconscious as a little rough to
0:45:05right i mean that's like I mean because
0:45:08it's a kid and it's the protagonist that
0:45:10feels a little you know this is why you
0:45:12need to have parental guidance they
0:45:14suggest parental guidance so guide he
0:45:18got it immediately you know it's like
0:45:19right right in that moment he's like but
0:45:21the robot saved him
0:45:22this well yes keep watching they also
0:45:26have to have the robot like I mean it is
0:45:27the so many it's not a lot of fat in
0:45:31this movie that's there for no reason
0:45:32like the train crashes to establish that
0:45:34the little parts come back together
0:45:36which will be important at the end of
0:45:37the movie The Moron doesn't like and the
0:45:39poking of the deer that one of the year
0:45:42is dead like he goes to touch it is like
0:45:43I don't touch it or he was about to like
0:45:45stand it back up which i thought would
0:45:47have been hilarious but me also another
0:45:48program for kids movie but he does the
0:45:52same gesture to her when her brothers in
0:45:53the snow he goes to touch him and he
0:45:55does the same little motion and hope
0:45:57that doesn't move and you know he
0:45:58doesn't understand the difference
0:45:59between unconscious and dead or whatever
0:46:00I you know that shorthand a lot of a lot
0:46:05of economy of motion there they they get
0:46:07things out that's why I think the plot
0:46:08is really well structured like this
0:46:10looks like we talked about Pixar's you
0:46:12know brain trust and everything this
0:46:14this looks like a movie that had gone
0:46:15through a lot of story beat
0:46:18polishing to say we got this this this
0:46:20and it all fits together into a nice
0:46:21beautiful puzzle and you know there's
0:46:23and and everything is there for a reason
0:46:25and it all works in it you know it's not
0:46:27overly Telegraph that were insulting the
0:46:29intelligence the audience but it is
0:46:31clear enough that even a kid will get it
0:46:32and you can have a gentle the robot is
0:46:36like the the he gets that this is
0:46:38something he needs to protect maybe like
0:46:40the dairy cups in his hands even when he
0:46:42like puts his hands down to have whole
0:46:44earth walk out of his hand like his
0:46:45fingers like turn into a little ramp
0:46:47that Hogarth can walk down you know it
0:46:49doesn't think I can just all drop them
0:46:51from 10 feet and he'll be fine
0:46:52it's it's got a general quality inn and
0:46:54that's part of what's amazing to me
0:46:55about the animation is how much the
0:46:57robot is in the movie it isn't just like
0:46:59this but there's a shot of a kind of
0:47:01rubber suit over here
0:47:02I mean he really is he's interacting
0:47:03with everybody and you know understands
0:47:06almost like a massive if you ever known
0:47:08like a really large dog a dog that's
0:47:10like really aware of how big it is in a
0:47:12room he seems a little bit like cowed by
0:47:14how big he is and how powerful he is
0:47:16compared to these little people really
0:47:19warming up to the idea that he is that
0:47:21his actual purpose is something that is
0:47:23like a guard and you know because I what
0:47:25I don't want to really believe is that
0:47:27he is a killing machine that is you know
0:47:30about just being sent places in the
0:47:32universe to slaughter people that well
0:47:34if he were it would have been a really i
0:47:36mean and i agree with you because i
0:47:38think it worry I mean that would have
0:47:39been a movie he would have he would have
0:47:41been war of the worlds and he would have
0:47:43looked for the weakest thing he could
0:47:44destroy it anytime
0:47:45that's the whole point of the the dent
0:47:46in his head he's he lands on his head
0:47:48and he ends up you know violating his
0:47:51programming because he's temporarily my
0:47:53name is the self-determination think
0:47:54it's like you choose what you are if you
0:47:56are just a thing than someone then it's
0:47:58just like an animated gonna have a bad
0:48:00guy has the gun has bad things with a
0:48:01good guy has a gun it is good that you
0:48:03know everybody if you are not just a gun
0:48:05if you're not an amateur object then you
0:48:07have a choice about what to do and what
0:48:09he's fighting against his you know he's
0:48:10a programmer or whatever is defensive
0:48:12and that even if you choose to be a good
0:48:14person or even if you are a good person
0:48:15in your heart if you if your eyes turn
0:48:18into little red tits right every time
0:48:20points good you're getting active the
0:48:22Cold War things like oh yeah now we're
0:48:24all good people but don't point a gun to
0:48:26me because then I turn into the giant
0:48:27crazy thing with the million
0:48:28you know laser-shooting snakes coming
0:48:30out of my shoulders and and and that's
0:48:32that's why it's important that every
0:48:34time he does that is because it is
0:48:36purely defensive reaction he's not going
0:48:39out there and hunting things and that's
0:48:41why I like to believe that the dentin
0:48:43his head is to have him lose his mission
0:48:46and not know where he's supposed to be
0:48:48here who he is but I i would like to
0:48:50believe that the United again we are
0:48:53arguing about the personality of a giant
0:48:54metal the creature but i like it on time
0:48:57ya sure ya later we'll talk about the
0:49:00real robots so I'd like to believe that
0:49:06the that the giant isn't fundamentally
0:49:09is a defender I think that's a really
0:49:10good way to think that he acts he
0:49:12responds with lethal force when attacked
0:49:15but he's not going out and seeking
0:49:17things to destroy and so I like that
0:49:19thought that this is a creature that's
0:49:21built with huge armaments but you know
0:49:23is not fundamentally we see he is not
0:49:26fundamentally a destroyer of things he
0:49:29he only acts when he's when he shot at
0:49:31now I think that's something that's
0:49:32plausible like you be he might be shot
0:49:34out like a decent part of some
0:49:35intelligent alien force you might be
0:49:36shot out to some planet where we don't
0:49:38know what's gonna happen
0:49:39hey listen don't shoot the place up
0:49:41unless somebody's shooting at you and
0:49:43then that's something we need to know
0:49:44about and you need to defend I think
0:49:46it's sensible alright well either way
0:49:47we're totally screwed because even if
0:49:49he's a defensive weapon
0:49:50what are the odds that for five more of
0:49:52these things land on Earth and they are
0:49:53shot and it stays worry it came here
0:49:56accidentally but I think he's an
0:49:57offensive weapon and i think that the
0:49:59reason that's like the defensive stuff
0:50:01like your reflexes if you touch
0:50:02something hot like you can't that's not
0:50:04gonna come out of you from getting a
0:50:05knock in the head but you forget your
0:50:07programming so he's essentially you know
0:50:09forgotten what his programming mission
0:50:11is and could be commanded to be an
0:50:12attack robot I think that's what he is
0:50:14an attacker but underneath it all is the
0:50:16well you don't defend yourself so the
0:50:18defensive stuff is still there and at
0:50:19the end when he gets really mad because
0:50:21they killed Hogarth the dent pops out of
0:50:23his head and after that he's ready to
0:50:25shoot Hogarth fourth is not a threat to
0:50:26him heart's not pointing got an empty
0:50:28was about the blast him until Hogarth
0:50:30you said you choose you have to choose
0:50:32who you are so on and so forth so I i
0:50:34totally think he's an offensive weapon
0:50:35on the planet that he came from or
0:50:37whatever it's just that programming and
0:50:39not
0:50:39Adam and all that was left was like the
0:50:40brainstem kind of if you are threatened
0:50:43by something looks like a gun and what
0:50:44and you know what a gun looks like 200
0:50:46baht you react but at the end he goes
0:50:48full bore offensive he's destroying
0:50:50everything in its path including almost
0:50:51home birth because his anger you know
0:50:53pops a dent out of his head in typical
0:50:55animation exaggerated fashion always
0:50:58pretty good about targeting the the
0:51:00tanks and the military vehicles and
0:51:02things and not taking out buildings and
0:51:03whatnots GI joe people check just in
0:51:05time you know
0:51:06yeah well you know he's he's not
0:51:08Superman at least the man of steel
0:51:09superman because he actually takes care
0:51:12of buildings John you know I i we can I
0:51:15like i said i would like to buy I like
0:51:17this idea of trying to believe that he's
0:51:19not a killing machine although that
0:51:20definitely is a perfectly reasonable
0:51:21interpretation i only mention this to
0:51:24mention that in a chat room we have an
0:51:26opinion that the Iron Giant is actually
0:51:28a Love Machine and i think i just wanted
0:51:30to put that out there i think that's
0:51:32wise words wise words that's a different
0:51:35really know what I've seen that movie
0:51:37too
0:51:37I i want to mention a couple of things
0:51:39while we're talking about a giant so we
0:51:42got to talk about Vin Diesel I think you
0:51:43know is this vin diesel's greatest
0:51:45performance or only you know well now it
0:51:47is
0:51:48we'll find out next month Groot yeah
0:51:50pitch-black pitch-black is pretty good
0:51:52yeah
0:51:53pitch black is good I bet he's gonna be
0:51:55a great group I got a good feeling
0:51:57sure similar number of lines yes you
0:51:59know so he's good in moderation or in
0:52:03lots in quantity both really versatile
0:52:05but it's it's a great i mean you need a
0:52:07rumbly you need a rumbly robot voice and
0:52:10Vin Diesel provides a great rumbly robot
0:52:13voice for the iron job he says voice is
0:52:15so process though he has so few lines in
0:52:17it so process that the animation does
0:52:19most of the acting from a tiny did a bad
0:52:20job or anybody's he's buried in this
0:52:22movie and yet one of his best
0:52:24performances this is what I'm saying
0:52:25it's supposedly they wanted to have like
0:52:28a purely mechanical voice but then they
0:52:30decided I i feel like i can hear a voice
0:52:32in there one of the wacky things in this
0:52:33movie that I want to mention is Bogaerts
0:52:35sleep off with Mansley it haha one one
0:52:39step above a staring contest is the
0:52:42they're both across the hallway from
0:52:44each other
0:52:45bowing to stay awake and not let the
0:52:47other one have the upper hand by being
0:52:49awake but so brilliant know how it
0:52:51incorporates like the helm
0:52:52that we've been seeing him where his
0:52:54dad's helmet like how great is that
0:52:56yeah and then at the end Mansley it has
0:52:59has 1 and then he falls asleep he falls
0:53:01asleep and wakes up and sees the whole
0:53:03car still in his bed and goes haha our
0:53:04morning can then he walks by this
0:53:08morning got a loud laugh from myself
0:53:10what might my gag my favorite gagging
0:53:13the movie is when you open can't is on
0:53:16the phone with the with the Frasers dad
0:53:18and and freaking out and he staring at
0:53:20the oven mitt with the wacky face like
0:53:22making like the goofy face as if to say
0:53:26don't you tell me I'm crazy flips the
0:53:28oven mitt around such a perfect note
0:53:31when John was talking about how compact
0:53:34this movie is I just wanted to bring up
0:53:36the fact that it's it's refreshing after
0:53:38to a two-and-a-half-hour animated films
0:53:41to encounter one that gets it done in
0:53:43one and a half hours it's it's amazing
0:53:46i've been for a while watching this film
0:53:48the first time for the first time in I
0:53:50don't know 15 years or whatever it's
0:53:52been like man that there wasn't that
0:53:56much to that movie and it took me a
0:53:57while to realize yeah that's fine
0:53:59they didn't need anymore everything
0:54:02that's in this movie is in here for a
0:54:03reason and that's it there's not a bunch
0:54:06of fluff and there's not a bunch of
0:54:08extra gags turn in for no reason it's
0:54:10fairly light on the gags even though the
0:54:11ones that are there good and involve
0:54:13poop generally but the last film that i
0:54:15watch for this for this podcast with
0:54:171776 haha how did how does that compare
0:54:22you to watch this movie back forward
0:54:23then backward and then forward again the
0:54:25poop jokes aren't quite as good
0:54:27that's true but the poop songs are
0:54:30amazing but but you can actually get
0:54:32through this movie without having to
0:54:33poop which is nice so we talk about the
0:54:35end let's talk about the end
0:54:38okay does this man have an opening
0:54:41statement about yeah you know I don't
0:54:43want to
0:54:44I you know I don't wanna be pegged with
0:54:46that I i like the end that I think maybe
0:54:49kind of should have been the end I think
0:54:51it's one of the UH god I mean like huh
0:54:54room getting hot and dusty at the end of
0:54:56this movie does not i get real dust we
0:54:58watched we watched it the other night in
0:54:59mind my daughters like you know why do
0:55:01you always get weird and smoothly and
0:55:03like that's it it's
0:55:04it's it's amazing how it gets its it's
0:55:07so perfect and you know I I just feel
0:55:09like it really is
0:55:11hmm so we're going through two things
0:55:13just very unrelated to what you guys
0:55:15just said we've been with huge Harry
0:55:16Potter movies at our house we watch
0:55:18harry potter movie like every night and
0:55:20the watch tonight is a hundred and
0:55:22fifty-seven minutes long
0:55:24it was really good but it's really
0:55:26really really long time trying to
0:55:28explain to my daughter the idea of
0:55:29compression in storytelling like the
0:55:31idea that like when you see Hedwig like
0:55:33flying and it's green and then flying
0:55:36and it's white and snowy out like that's
0:55:39a real attorney explained her that's a
0:55:40good piece of compression like letting
0:55:41you know now it's Christmastime right
0:55:43you know just those little things that
0:55:44like we don't have to tell you
0:55:45everything that happened every day but
0:55:48geez sometimes it just feels like it
0:55:49goes on and on every move you watch
0:55:51these days that's like fantastical or
0:55:53sci-fi is always two and a half hours
0:55:55long
0:55:56you know I don't mean that I don't have
0:55:57a don't have a note on how to make that
0:55:59better but it just feels like and
0:56:01certainly in those books are like making
0:56:02movies shorter how about that one that's
0:56:04a pretty good one but that's a 4-inch
0:56:06book so I understand like why that
0:56:08happens but but also just this idea of
0:56:10like and they're almost restrained with
0:56:12with harry potter by the fact that if
0:56:14they're not utterly slavish to the book
0:56:15that they get huge complaints from them
0:56:17the hordes of potter fans they got they
0:56:20got people that people thought they were
0:56:21too slavish with the first couple and
0:56:23then after that they weren't slaves
0:56:24enough anyway but but also you know just
0:56:27getting into that idea of like how much
0:56:29of this like keep the story moving
0:56:30forward and actually honestly most of
0:56:32the harry potter ones are pretty good at
0:56:34that but like you know the adventures is
0:56:35good but it's so long all these movies
0:56:37are so long
0:56:38this one I thought that by the time we
0:56:41get to the point where stuff is really
0:56:42going down in rockwell like I I felt
0:56:45like like a lot of the lot of the
0:56:47different threads in the movie came
0:56:49together like really elegantly write it
0:56:51right you know all the stuff that they
0:56:53want to say about guns also if they want
0:56:54to say about the Cold War about
0:56:55understanding i felt like that all came
0:56:57together really well at the point of
0:56:59three catches the kids and I just
0:57:01thought it was amazingly well done given
0:57:02you know how how tight the story was
0:57:05that was amazing
0:57:06this is the point where you you've
0:57:07gotten to the point where you believe
0:57:08that this robot is is a is a person with
0:57:12his own decisions that he can make and
0:57:14so when he makes his act of
0:57:16self-sacrifice there's the moment where
0:57:18he realizes that this killing machine or
0:57:20at least this machine armed with all
0:57:22these these weapons what he decides to
0:57:24do is not you know it is not anything on
0:57:28that level he decides to just fly upward
0:57:30to intercept the nuclear missile and
0:57:32save the town and sacrifice himself that
0:57:35is a decision you know
0:57:36hogar says that you got to choose what
0:57:38you want to be and he chooses super
0:57:40being Superman especially given that we
0:57:43just we just saw that like Hogarth like
0:57:45causes him to like shoot off kind of off
0:57:48to the right of blowing up the the boat
0:57:50out on the water and we get that he is
0:57:52kind of a bomb like he could be a very
0:57:54serious threat but his reaction is to is
0:57:56to be Superman
0:57:57yeah well it had already decided early
0:57:59in the movie he decided what he wants to
0:58:01be that's the whole that's the whole
0:58:02identifying with the robot aspect of the
0:58:04movie soon so the comic book is like you
0:58:06know Tom oh whatever he says now
0:58:07Superman yeah that's the address on the
0:58:09thing like he totally decided I'm going
0:58:11like so many of us is that I'm going to
0:58:13be a good person right but he failed he
0:58:15fails in well that's interesting too
0:58:17because he seems intrigued by at amo at
0:58:19least briefly what he wants to know what
0:58:21everyone else thinks of him but he but
0:58:22he wants to be Superman and he fails at
0:58:24being Superman repeatedly constantly
0:58:25whatever gun comes out he's almost
0:58:26camera skills whole got the couple times
0:58:28he almost nukes that the the battleships
0:58:30I and the end of the movie isnot now I
0:58:33finally decided to be what he was trying
0:58:34to be good the whole time the end of the
0:58:36movies him successfully being good for
0:58:38him from turning his desire to be a good
0:58:41person into actions that you know you
0:58:43don't mean it's like that so it's not
0:58:44that hard to want to be Superman it's
0:58:46hard to actually do it on the day right
0:58:48and especially hard for him because you
0:58:50know he's its programming or the do it
0:58:52is designed he's designed to be he's got
0:58:54all these weapons coming out we designed
0:58:56the building up that's what he's good at
0:58:57all these excuses of why he's failing to
0:59:00fulfill is everything at the end of the
0:59:01movie it's it's him realizing as he goes
0:59:04up to the missile that he is he has now
0:59:06become the thing that he wanted to
0:59:08become and also is dying at the same
0:59:09time which is why we land in like that
0:59:12watching the movie many many many times
0:59:14it every time I watch it I think it's
0:59:15not going to affect me this times I've
0:59:17seen it I've seen it so many times like
0:59:18it's so it's so corny you know i am now
0:59:20I'm not a gun it's like it's like is
0:59:22that little on-the-nose writing-wise
0:59:24it's like it's like three is three
0:59:26syllables three syllables and you're
0:59:28like all right and it's and it's also so
0:59:30on-the-nose you're like oh is that you
0:59:32can come up with something better than
0:59:33that it's like a kid's mind that it's
0:59:34still it's still works every time
0:59:35well it's perfectly orchestrated right i
0:59:37mean he's flying through space the the
0:59:39missile turns around there's a great
0:59:42swell the score you get Hogarth echoing
0:59:45in his head you are what you choose to
0:59:46be
0:59:47he says Superman kind of you know stoic
0:59:50Lee and then he closes his eyes and
0:59:52that's what kills me he closes his eyes
0:59:53and it's he's got like a little bit of a
0:59:55smile on his face even though he knows
0:59:57what's coming and it should be you
0:59:58couldn't possibly have
0:59:58couldn't possibly have
1:00:00orchestrated that better it works so
1:00:02perfectly
1:00:03yeah it's kind of like pie too bad it
1:00:06wasn't this episode with you Jason but
1:00:07kinda like The Karate Kid corny in every
1:00:10possible way that you could be corny but
1:00:12when the host party pieces come together
1:00:13in just the right way you realize why
1:00:15this is a formula that works so we
1:00:18should talk about the end and part which
1:00:21is the you know what I've been starting
1:00:23to call the ET ending which is you you
1:00:26know i have an opening statement for
1:00:27this sort of oh ok well i can't wait to
1:00:31the end and it's not really an opening
1:00:32statements not my opening statement so
1:00:34at this point in the movie
1:00:36my son had been watching the whole thing
1:00:37in raptured my daughter walked into the
1:00:40room to have some lunch she decided not
1:00:41to watch with and she was munching on
1:00:45something at the table and the whole
1:00:48real ending happens where he blows up
1:00:50and she says this movie is sad didn't
1:00:53see any of it up to this point but she's
1:00:54clearly this movie is sad and then my
1:00:56son the seven-year-old with a smile
1:00:58turns around and says no it's not going
1:01:00to be sad i know what's going to happen
1:01:02it happens in all movies who is not
1:01:07wrong it and yeah a little bit later he
1:01:09gets presented with the bolt and he
1:01:10looked back with the most knowing green
1:01:13i'm casey i have an opening statement
1:01:16here too
1:01:16I don't stipulate I like I I against my
1:01:19better judgment I i still find myself
1:01:21melting a little bit at the endemic and
1:01:24and I think partly because of the
1:01:26swelling music and it is very well done
1:01:28and that wonderful like sort of like a
1:01:30simulation like a tracking shot like you
1:01:32know yeah that was great but the pieces
1:01:34moving in the fog
1:01:36yeah it's very very well done and you
1:01:38get to that face and it's it's it really
1:01:40is great and I'm so happy for my kid
1:01:43that she gets to see the the robot being
1:01:44alive but I kind of the two things I
1:01:51don't like about this movie are the
1:01:52typefaces in the credits and and it's
1:01:55been attacked on ending and I there's
1:01:57still this part of us i was just
1:01:59shooting with a friend of mine who works
1:02:01at Pixar about this like you know I
1:02:03still have really mixed feelings about
1:02:05that ending I kind of feel like it it
1:02:07should have if it really was all the
1:02:10breadboard movie a kind
1:02:11give I don't know either my Karma's sake
1:02:13I kind of feel like it shouldn't have
1:02:14had that ending you guys prefer the like
1:02:16the alternate ending to ET where it's an
1:02:18alien autopsy video is I discover he
1:02:23said oh yeah he's still white and being
1:02:25dissected that's what you guys are
1:02:26looking for
1:02:27well supposedly brad bird's original
1:02:28script had had a very different ending
1:02:30with with the USA and USSR at war or
1:02:33something
1:02:33I tried to be good I i will say normally
1:02:37I hate that kind of you know the feeling
1:02:40of attacked on your always a happy
1:02:41ending but now this this is coming from
1:02:44sort of a theologian you know if he's
1:02:47also a Christ figure right you have to
1:02:50have a resurrection at the end you know
1:02:53it just it it connects that way so it
1:02:55made sense to me it was like it was ok
1:02:57watching it today I almost thought it
1:02:59would be better if if they had just
1:03:01ended it on the scene of the bolt sort
1:03:03of rolling through the grass towards god
1:03:05knows what I yeah that's the same it's
1:03:07the same ending mow it is effectively
1:03:09because you know that the head has to
1:03:11have its little antenna to be attracting
1:03:13the pieces to it but it's a little on
1:03:14the nose to end with with him being okay
1:03:17after another atomic well i'll let you
1:03:19gotta like tune in next week for the
1:03:20other net further adventures of the iron
1:03:22giant you want to go into the cereals
1:03:24that the science-fiction cereals that he
1:03:25was watching this movie pays homage to
1:03:28so much that I mean I i agree didn't
1:03:31need to be there for kids movie it's a
1:03:32type of thing i can imagine an executive
1:03:34side while the Giants gotta live right
1:03:35we have got to have that damning but on
1:03:37the other hand it's not like whether the
1:03:40bolts rolling away you see the smiling
1:03:42face
1:03:42I think the main problem is story-wise
1:03:44is that you don't you don't have
1:03:45anywhere to go from there
1:03:46that the move like you already had your
1:03:48ending and now you've introduced this
1:03:51new thing that that is intriguing over
1:03:52the Giants alive and then immediately
1:03:54you think kid or adult well then what
1:03:56happens now to Syria somebody go back to
1:03:57heart as you live in the town does he
1:03:59work this he carries lumber you carry
1:04:01lumber for main I mean like at some
1:04:03point we're gonna run out of scrap to
1:04:04feed this guy and then what's gonna
1:04:06happen quickly edit and like you say ski
1:04:08then his buddies his buddies are gonna
1:04:09come down it's not gonna be so fun
1:04:10you honestly the fact that he survived
1:04:12the bomb just makes me more worried
1:04:14about let's go well and also his I
1:04:17thought about that when I watched it
1:04:18that the surviving the bomb like oh how
1:04:20could how could you have survived that
1:04:22you know that they go bomb and I feel
1:04:23like the the design of this robot is
1:04:25such that is designed to come apart
1:04:27easily so the nuclear blast doesn't
1:04:29doesn't melt him but rather just
1:04:32disperses the parts and of course the
1:04:33sparks are autonomous and they can find
1:04:35those you want the thing to break apart
1:04:36and spread away from the blast rather
1:04:38than sort of absorbing it doesn't really
1:04:40make much sense but it makes a little
1:04:41bit of sense actually I'm not I'm not
1:04:43entirely convinced that the the nuclear
1:04:45bomb itself goes off i think that maybe
1:04:47he impacts the missile in at edits at
1:04:50its height and the missile explodes and
1:04:53you know if you hit a nuclear so what
1:04:54you're saying is that there's atomic
1:04:55space junk still floating around up
1:04:57there oh it's a dirty bomb well it's
1:04:59floated all over the AK could have been
1:05:00outside the atmosphere and it could have
1:05:02just you know got swept away and burned
1:05:04out because you know that I I an atomic
1:05:06bomb has to be very precisely detonated
1:05:08or it doesn't actually do the chain
1:05:09reaction so I think he smashed into it
1:05:11flung into a million pieces the the
1:05:13missile itself you know plunged into the
1:05:15Atlantic and it was the prettiest thing
1:05:17it's the percussion of the strike
1:05:19yeah yeah he backed into it and and
1:05:22prevented from doing the big big nuclear
1:05:24Club that's what i'm gonna choose to
1:05:26believe what do we know an atomic bomb
1:05:28does in space where it doesn't have air
1:05:30as a medium or at least not much if this
1:05:32if this were a whaling now in retrospect
1:05:33that reminds me of the end of wolverine
1:05:37wolverine origins movie for Deadpool put
1:05:40his head back on like this what is this
1:05:42what a Marvel movie that would have been
1:05:43after the credits i like wow that's
1:05:45that's true I i think i do think you
1:05:47have to end the movie this way and I
1:05:48don't mind because I i feel i feel that
1:05:50the Giants it when this with this kind
1:05:53of ending is bad is when in hindsight if
1:05:56you feel like the the it wasn't a
1:05:58sacrifice that they didn't truly make
1:06:00the sacrifice expecting that it would be
1:06:02a sacrifice but he knew it was he knew
1:06:04it was a sacrifice
1:06:05yeah he closes his eyes he's expecting
1:06:08that this is the end and and then you
1:06:10also get the what i think is really
1:06:12important you get the town has built
1:06:14this statue of him which is also one of
1:06:18those things that makes the room a
1:06:19little dusty for me is that they he was
1:06:22appreciated and not hated and here is
1:06:24he'll always be here in the children
1:06:25will look at this this statue of the of
1:06:27the iron giant and then at the end yeah
1:06:29it's more like it's just a nice it's not
1:06:33it puts a smile on your face at the end
1:06:35oh but but wait and then that's it and
1:06:38you never get the door closes and and
1:06:40you feel like isn't that nice that he
1:06:41still has possibilities and the end
1:06:43right maybe he'll grow up to be the king
1:06:46of Iceland or something I don't know but
1:06:48robot King benevolent robot king of
1:06:50Iceland well he can fly back to where
1:06:52he's from and tell him not to blow the
1:06:53crap out of us because maybe what the
1:06:55second movies about I'm I'm just happy
1:06:57he didn't wink at the end haha but you
1:07:02know as as as it goes black and I'm
1:07:04sitting there looking at the font and
1:07:06cringing and twitching can we talk about
1:07:08the font is it just me yeah it's no it's
1:07:11not just you
1:07:11what is that like euro-style what is
1:07:13that oh god it looks like the opening
1:07:16credits from tech war it's it's like
1:07:19what is with this fun but you know we're
1:07:21sitting there and then my
1:07:22twelve-year-old immediately says so when
1:07:24do they make iron giant two giant harder
1:07:26as well
1:07:28nah I don't know yet that's when the
1:07:30love robot programming really comes out
1:07:32kind of horrible face who would pick
1:07:35that would pick that is look at the
1:07:37here's the thing here's the thing about
1:07:38Brad berg you look at like all of this
1:07:40stuff in his movies he cares so much
1:07:42about like how every newspaper looks you
1:07:44go and look at like in the incredibles
1:07:46look at how all of like all that stuff
1:07:48looks who picked those fonts it was not
1:07:51brad bird it's kind of like being an
1:07:53author where you don't get to pick the
1:07:54title of your book will in non Pixar
1:07:56studios and seems like people who make
1:07:58the movies don't get to pick the credits
1:08:00no I mean this was made on a very very
1:08:02low budget you know for an animated
1:08:03feature and on a very tight schedule so
1:08:06maybe this was just one of those things
1:08:07we're gonna do 70 million dollars that's
1:08:09not a low-budget did you guys see you
1:08:11guys see this
1:08:12I I had no idea like I've been off the
1:08:13cable for a long time did you guys see
1:08:15this when it was played on what they say
1:08:18on cartoon network they would play this
1:08:20for like 24 hours once a year to get
1:08:23guys know about that is that is our you
1:08:25guys for sought I saw their one-year
1:08:28this is their Christmas this is like
1:08:30their christmas story like they would
1:08:31they would play this for 24 hours on
1:08:34yeah that's what wikipedia says anyway I
1:08:36heard about this from roger ebert you
1:08:38know because he gave it a really
1:08:39positive review and while she's gotta
1:08:41wash now that was what what made me say
1:08:44it before we had kids was problem that
1:08:46was probably Roger
1:08:47childhood too so of course he's going to
1:08:49give it a big thumbs up I didn't want to
1:08:50go back to get it was very briefly
1:08:52mentioned but i really like that scene
1:08:54where he's presenting the comic books
1:08:56and he goes through you know the
1:08:59superman comic and he goes through tommo
1:09:01and it's it's clear at that point that
1:09:03the the Giant is intrigued by the atomic
1:09:06comics a very short little subtle thing
1:09:09but he sees a Tommy goes oh it's me and
1:09:13then Hogarth very quickly so he's a bad
1:09:15guy and covers it up with a Superman
1:09:16comic and in that in that mirror moment
1:09:18there you could almost see you know an
1:09:20alternate version of this story where he
1:09:22does go bad but you know in that in that
1:09:24brief moment that's also a kindness of
1:09:28Hogarth right he did he he doesn't want
1:09:30to think of this robot is a bad guy and
1:09:34so he's like he doesn't know the world
1:09:36is racist against the robot yeah check
1:09:38out Superman he's awesome and also it's
1:09:40at amo which is a little on the nose but
1:09:42still probably at the atomic Holocaust
1:09:46video in the classroom is great with the
1:09:48gun but it's almost like what's-his-name
1:09:50something k where the ren & stimpy guy
1:09:53where the kid is left on the desk and on
1:09:55the pedestal of Earth that has been
1:09:57unharmed but the blast the desk is there
1:09:59too
1:10:00what's that what's the right instead of
1:10:01you guys named John Kruk floosie yeah
1:10:04that that that animate that whole film
1:10:06strip looks like something he could have
1:10:07done
1:10:07yeah that's the one that's your that's
1:10:10your modern snarkiness inside the
1:10:13fifties thing is these media portrayals
1:10:15that we get when we get the duck and
1:10:16cover video we get the horror movie you
1:10:18want to stick that in notes
1:10:19Jason if I to atomic cafe remember that
1:10:22that is beyond USA at night it was all
1:10:25like is it is that my remembering that
1:10:27right David it's all like old like
1:10:28fifties like duck and cover was a thing
1:10:31they really were like it's ok just
1:10:32getting your dad's well atomic cafe was
1:10:35a documentary film I think you're
1:10:36thinking of night flight
1:10:38that is the u.s. I think that showed
1:10:40like all these weird fifties movies and
1:10:43stuff
1:10:44yeah but yeah there was one that had out
1:10:45that like had collected a whole bunch of
1:10:47those wackadoodle like like fifties you
1:10:49know municipal safety films yet that is
1:10:52atomic cafe
1:10:53that'sthat's that what else what else
1:10:55but i I've got a sort of everything
1:10:57covered here but I don't want to go
1:10:59before everybody gets their gets there
1:11:00say about
1:11:01after they want to talk about about the
1:11:02iron giant anything else you know what
1:11:05that that duck and cover video in the
1:11:06iron giant it looks like it's modern
1:11:09snarkiness and it clearly is but it's
1:11:11not that frankly is not that different
1:11:12now i'm looking at the thumbnail the
1:11:14thumbnail from duck and cover is a
1:11:16turtle wearing a helmet know like it's
1:11:19not gonna be good to get your shell
1:11:20maybe games right that's fine that's
1:11:22fine that's not why it's so funny when
1:11:24Mansley he's gotta go duck and cover
1:11:26somewhere I guess I hope we've covered
1:11:28Mansley enough because he's so
1:11:30tremendous in this I I what a fun
1:11:32character that Mansley I work for the
1:11:34government
1:11:34I chris chris mcdonald is superb that
1:11:36he's made a living on on doing a
1:11:38weaselly boutique law reforms Hogarth it
1:11:41doesn't end up for being being for any
1:11:42reason it's just to be a disturbing
1:11:44would later become armed guards and then
1:11:46Garth wakes up in his bed and no
1:11:48significant time has passed
1:11:51maybe just ended the interrogation said
1:11:54alright let's go to bed now that would
1:11:55have been had to come back there but it
1:11:58was but it's not like it's not like he
1:12:00went into the bunch of stuff while
1:12:01Hogarth was drugged it's just like now
1:12:03your bed and I'm gonna stand here and
1:12:06what I know I I think Marlon Marlon can
1:12:08probably relate but he really wanted to
1:12:10avoid is having to tell him for the 900
1:12:12time together but jamas on brothers me
1:12:14which part of its bedtime don't you
1:12:18understand
1:12:19perhaps more disturbing in that scene is
1:12:20the fact that mom stays out all night
1:12:22she's working she's a single mom it was
1:12:25it was surprisingly little sexism and
1:12:27shunning of the single mom in this movie
1:12:29we said we've said almost nothing about
1:12:30about her grass mom she was off on a
1:12:34date with ross for the whole thing I i
1:12:36cannot separate jennifer aniston from
1:12:38her voice in this movie that's my
1:12:39problem with the mob
1:12:41I kinda like that actually I'm in mind
1:12:44this is around the time she did office
1:12:46space to ya les flare on the on this
1:12:51waitress them i have a similar problem
1:12:52with frazier's dad but that's only
1:12:54because after all those years of seeing
1:12:55him as Frazier's dad and he was on a
1:12:58what was it was it using say anything I
1:13:02was so great that I didn't have a whole
1:13:05lot of notes here I'll i really like the
1:13:07the image of just the head with the eyes
1:13:10lit up that you see in shadow from the
1:13:11distance oh yeah several times in the
1:13:14mood
1:13:14I think that that's really well done and
1:13:16nice and subtle I mean even just the
1:13:19first before the first moment races i
1:13:21see the lighthouse and and then it turns
1:13:23and there's two eyes you go i love a
1:13:26scene where where they turn back where
1:13:28the armies leaving town and they turn
1:13:30back in there and the Giant is towering
1:13:32over every building in the entire town
1:13:33that is a wonderful scene and he's just
1:13:36hovering he's not doing anything and
1:13:37that's and then Mansley of course says
1:13:39he's attacking the town is everybody all
1:13:41worked up and there's a moment right in
1:13:43the beginning where it's it's the waves
1:13:44its after you know it's like when you're
1:13:46just seeing the waves then where it's
1:13:49almost exactly the composition of the
1:13:52great wave of kanagawa by jaco sigh
1:13:54which we have hanging on our wall so
1:13:56both of the kids went hey yes i know
1:14:00that what about the pop songs are those
1:14:02real song to where they written for the
1:14:04movie because they feel like real pop
1:14:06songs which pop songs that like trade
1:14:08that trini lopez song during the trini
1:14:10lopez sounding song during the montage
1:14:12yeah that's not a real song
1:14:16yeah okay yeah those are those are
1:14:18genuine Zhan searched in every whichaway
1:14:20that's that's a classic
1:14:21oh I didn't know that mhm was a was wig
1:14:26out really a thing in 1950s yeah because
1:14:30we got at least three different workouts
1:14:31although well you know
1:14:33Dobie Gillis and beatniks and all that
1:14:35that would be about the right the right
1:14:36time I wonder if they were used week out
1:14:38on that we just assume 64 that because
1:14:40of the whole wig element of it
1:14:42yeah my daughter loves when a Dean is
1:14:47reading the paper after the after the
1:14:50the Cannonball all the water national
1:14:53yeah yeah that seems problematic for me
1:14:56too are you in the road he's just
1:14:58murdered like half of lakes worth of
1:14:59fish
1:14:59yeah and that raccoon is not long for
1:15:01this world either a suspect
1:15:03no yeah i mean i was a nice button on
1:15:06that to just you know fish fish fish
1:15:08raccoon also the animation of Dean
1:15:11floating through the wave is a little
1:15:13weird
1:15:14I like that he's holding on to his arm
1:15:16rest and that keeps him oriented
1:15:17properly throughout the many lands
1:15:20yeah they do eggs exaggerated cartoon
1:15:23physics sparingly like the other thing
1:15:24that I think of it
1:15:25the hand is crawling back to the robot
1:15:27it lifts up the corner of the barn and
1:15:29goes underneath it's like you have your
1:15:30allowed like one or two seconds of
1:15:32ridiculous cartoon physics and you go
1:15:34back to their movement of the hand is
1:15:36also a dog the hand behaves like a dog
1:15:38which is cute
1:15:40it's more of a cat really well i think
1:15:41it's a dog it's good it's a fast wag on
1:15:43the tail
1:15:44yeah have you ever had a dog take the
1:15:45toilet paper apart because that's a very
1:15:48cat thing
1:15:49yeah but that dogs eat it toxic more
1:15:51than that didn't know I decide later I
1:15:59think you got it in a legit in the case
1:16:02the camera and all right now
1:16:03alright I think it's time to wrap it up
1:16:05then do you remember the raccoon but
1:16:07alright well that brings us to the end
1:16:14of our discussion of the iron giant
1:16:16which was lovely and I'd like to thank
1:16:17my panelists were discussing with me
1:16:19Steve let's thanks for being here
1:16:21Oh glad I could be here Jason it was a
1:16:23fine time I wouldn't want to talk about
1:16:26those poop jokes with anybody i was
1:16:28gonna say yeah I almost you to join in
1:16:30but I knew you would be sad if they were
1:16:32poop jokes discussed and I was not here
1:16:33to it would feel wrong I would feel as
1:16:36if one part of my body had popped off
1:16:38and was slowly beeping its way back to
1:16:40me so I'm glad you could be here
1:16:42it's a very disturbing image yeah yeah
1:16:45dollars that would be if it was yeah
1:16:47David lower thanks for being here it's a
1:16:52queue anytime anytime well then i'll
1:16:55take that as about you know I appreciate
1:16:57it
1:16:57Tony sindelar thank you for being here
1:17:00John siracusa thank you for being here
1:17:02to talk about animation again we we
1:17:04veered into anime just for a moment
1:17:05there want to talk about some other
1:17:07animated films in the future i think yes
1:17:09i am also not a gun all right I've heard
1:17:13that about you good to know everyone man
1:17:15thank you for coming back
1:17:17I really appreciate you being here this
1:17:18was a lot of fun I rest my case
1:17:20alright that's good no final statements
1:17:24no finala
1:17:25finala I don't even know what I'm saying
1:17:28here that I think the cat was stalking
1:17:31the campus yet you think the cat is a
1:17:33cat magical or was his magic and Kiki
1:17:36all along
1:17:37thank you for having me on it was great
1:17:39to have you and for the incredible i am
1:17:41your host Jason snow once again thanks
1:17:43for listening we'll see you next time
1:17:45want to know what we're doing next 10
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