The Talk Show

00:00:00 ◼   ► multi had the had the article in the

00:00:03 ◼   ► magazine i really liked that I of i say

00:00:06 ◼   ► this with the no hyperbole but it's my

00:00:09 ◼   ► favorite article from the magazine

00:00:11 ◼   ► Wow five issues and I should just I

00:00:13 ◼   ► should get off right now

00:00:15 ◼   ► now it's pretty let's get all downhill

00:00:16 ◼   ► from here so wait this conversation gets

00:00:19 ◼   ► any better than that

00:00:20 ◼   ► yeah i'm not going to spoil it but

00:00:22 ◼   ► everybody if you don't read in the

00:00:23 ◼   ► magazines or not because you're not

00:00:26 ◼   ► right yeah there's some great

00:00:28 ◼   ► there's just been some great pieces in

00:00:29 ◼   ► there Jason snails piece this week was

00:00:31 ◼   ► particularly good you know what I

00:00:32 ◼   ► haven't read that yet because I yeah

00:00:34 ◼   ► well you wait was because that's why

00:00:36 ◼   ► that's why you think mine is better and

00:00:38 ◼   ► why you think mines the best because i

00:00:39 ◼   ► read yours is just don't question is is

00:00:42 ◼   ► better i was an issue behind so I read

00:00:44 ◼   ► the issue for and then I opened up issue

00:00:46 ◼   ► 5 and I read your piece and chuckled and

00:00:48 ◼   ► then I opened his and I saw where it was

00:00:50 ◼   ► going and it was real late i was like

00:00:51 ◼   ► sleepy and I was like you know what this

00:00:53 ◼   ► is not i'm going to read this one

00:00:55 ◼   ► yeah little heavy but yeah yeah it's

00:00:59 ◼   ► great stuff going on there

00:01:00 ◼   ► ya know it's really it's like it's a

00:01:02 ◼   ► good read every every time it comes out

00:01:04 ◼   ► to every two weeks right

00:01:05 ◼   ► every two weeks i believe ya and way you

00:01:10 ◼   ► know what I guess I i have a you know I

00:01:12 ◼   ► guess I'm just it's weird because it's

00:01:14 ◼   ► like a big circle of my friends like

00:01:16 ◼   ► rights you know Glenn was on the show

00:01:17 ◼   ► two weeks ago that you're on what's his

00:01:23 ◼   ► name has been on already

00:01:25 ◼   ► you know the guy marker and marking on

00:01:31 ◼   ► the show that guy huh

00:01:34 ◼   ► I but it's you know it's just really

00:01:37 ◼   ► good and I think it's funny how it its

00:01:39 ◼   ► it has come out and it's a new thing and

00:01:43 ◼   ► so what five issues two weeks so it's

00:01:46 ◼   ► like been like 10 weeks like a month and

00:01:48 ◼   ► i had two months two and a half months

00:01:49 ◼   ► or so since it debuted I and it's like

00:01:53 ◼   ► starting to settle in and you know I I

00:01:56 ◼   ► don't think it's a hit but it's clearly

00:01:58 ◼   ► successful it succeeded Marco is

00:02:00 ◼   ► admitted that it's you know it's it's

00:02:01 ◼   ► above you know like the minimum number

00:02:04 ◼   ► of paying subscribers that he thought he

00:02:05 ◼   ► needed

00:02:06 ◼   ► yeah on but probably shouldn't point out

00:02:09 ◼   ► that publishing on the ipad is dead

00:02:11 ◼   ► right and now public

00:02:13 ◼   ► and the ipad is dead because you know

00:02:14 ◼   ► it's too bad it's too bad he got in

00:02:16 ◼   ► because it's a because it just died and

00:02:20 ◼   ► it's just there's a couple of things

00:02:22 ◼   ► that to me make it so it is such a neat

00:02:25 ◼   ► fit to compare and contrast with the

00:02:27 ◼   ► daily even just starting with the names

00:02:31 ◼   ► you know that they have this both have

00:02:32 ◼   ► these sort of the overly generic names

00:02:36 ◼   ► right the magnetizing the daily one of

00:02:39 ◼   ► them is this huge 25 million dollar your

00:02:41 ◼   ► operation from you know what most people

00:02:45 ◼   ► many people would argue is like the most

00:02:47 ◼   ► evil people publishing corporation in

00:02:50 ◼   ► the world Rupert Murdoch's News Corp and

00:02:53 ◼   ► then the other is you know tiny little

00:02:55 ◼   ► one-man operation it equally evil but I

00:03:00 ◼   ► you know is it to man-to-man now to now

00:03:04 ◼   ► to announce you man yeah so closer

00:03:06 ◼   ► inching closer to 2 News Corp right and

00:03:14 ◼   ► I just you know it's ji I was I

00:03:16 ◼   ► shouldn't be surprised but I was

00:03:18 ◼   ► surprised at when the dailies demise was

00:03:22 ◼   ► announced I guess on monday this week

00:03:24 ◼   ► and I just how quickly so many people

00:03:27 ◼   ► jump to the conclusion that it was proof

00:03:30 ◼   ► that I pattern publishing is impossible

00:03:33 ◼   ► I mean that's actually would feel

00:03:34 ◼   ► examine you actually use the word

00:03:36 ◼   ► impossible yeah yeah I think he's a

00:03:38 ◼   ► little he's a little chase and about it

00:03:39 ◼   ► now

00:03:40 ◼   ► to his credit he is a they noted that

00:03:44 ◼   ► maybe he was you want too far

00:03:46 ◼   ► yeah and you know and he's normally

00:03:47 ◼   ► either really really a fairly reasonable

00:03:50 ◼   ► guy right yeah it's very good

00:03:52 ◼   ► it's really be no he-he's you know usual

00:03:56 ◼   ► financial coverage is spot-on is one of

00:03:58 ◼   ► my favorites I thought he covered the

00:03:59 ◼   ► whole unfortunate fiscal collapse and

00:04:03 ◼   ► and almost right black hole cratering of

00:04:06 ◼   ► the entire global economy for years ago

00:04:08 ◼   ► as well as anybody I really did I really

00:04:11 ◼   ► felt like he was one of my go-to guys to

00:04:13 ◼   ► like tell me what the hell's going on

00:04:15 ◼   ► and tell me that I shouldn't just the

00:04:18 ◼   ► action and get gold and put it in put it

00:04:20 ◼   ► in my mattress and buy a shotgun you

00:04:24 ◼   ► haven't done that now I did my dad's

00:04:26 ◼   ► name

00:04:26 ◼   ► like I was everything ok ok you seem

00:04:29 ◼   ► like you might do that you know you seem

00:04:30 ◼   ► like the type it was you know I

00:04:33 ◼   ► considered it

00:04:34 ◼   ► yeah well it's worth thinking about I

00:04:38 ◼   ► but yeah he really jumped to the

00:04:40 ◼   ► ultimate conclusion that it was proof

00:04:41 ◼   ► that its stead it's impossible and i

00:04:45 ◼   ► think you know it's it all comes back to

00:04:48 ◼   ► a lot of these other theories about

00:04:49 ◼   ► disruption that that you know that like

00:04:51 ◼   ► the whole clayton christensen which is a

00:04:54 ◼   ► book called yeah you know the guy i

00:05:00 ◼   ► don't know that guy and he got this look

00:05:03 ◼   ► them up i believe I'm drawing a blank on

00:05:07 ◼   ► facebook name is it just looks a big fan

00:05:11 ◼   ► disruptive innovation yeah is that the

00:05:13 ◼   ► that's not the name of the book though

00:05:15 ◼   ► that's not the end of the book okay

00:05:16 ◼   ► innovators dilemma

00:05:19 ◼   ► oh yeah okay i mean i know that 1i yeah

00:05:21 ◼   ► I haven't read it or no other yeah I've

00:05:22 ◼   ► heard people talk about it which is all

00:05:24 ◼   ► i need

00:05:24 ◼   ► that's right yeah but his big theory is

00:05:27 ◼   ► always that you know it's you know it's

00:05:28 ◼   ► like mammals vs dinosaurs stating that

00:05:30 ◼   ► the disruption always comes from the low

00:05:32 ◼   ► end you know needs these great case

00:05:36 ◼   ► examples about like what put like steel

00:05:38 ◼   ► industry you know how to business were

00:05:39 ◼   ► these little like places that just

00:05:43 ◼   ► melted down junk steel and the bday

00:05:46 ◼   ► eventually got so good at it so

00:05:47 ◼   ► efficient added that they ended up you

00:05:50 ◼   ► know being a better way to battle far

00:05:51 ◼   ► cheaper way to manufacture high-quality

00:05:53 ◼   ► steel than the traditional steel

00:05:56 ◼   ► foundries and etcetera etcetera etcetera

00:05:57 ◼   ► but that you're always a disruption

00:06:00 ◼   ► always is dismissed by the entrenched

00:06:02 ◼   ► because it looks inconsequential or

00:06:06 ◼   ► cheaper low-end or something like that

00:06:08 ◼   ► it and i think it seems likely that the

00:06:14 ◼   ► eventual disruption of apple if it ever

00:06:16 ◼   ► happens would be similar right yeah I

00:06:19 ◼   ► from so much some corner of the

00:06:20 ◼   ► unexpected corners and not from

00:06:24 ◼   ► Microsoft not from google write some

00:06:26 ◼   ► other place right some other place that

00:06:28 ◼   ► you would never expect and that will be

00:06:30 ◼   ► dismissed for you know possibly for good

00:06:32 ◼   ► reasons you know right i was talking

00:06:35 ◼   ► about this before but he was like in The

00:06:36 ◼   ► New Yorker

00:06:37 ◼   ► profile of clayton christensen David's

00:06:40 ◼   ► you know he said one of the things that

00:06:41 ◼   ► you know he's wrong about and I love a

00:06:43 ◼   ► guy anybody you get big points in my

00:06:45 ◼   ► book anybody who's you know supposed to

00:06:46 ◼   ► be a guru but talks about the times that

00:06:48 ◼   ► they're wrong to me that's like two

00:06:51 ◼   ► pluses right there you know in terms of

00:06:53 ◼   ► excellent absolutely and he admits he

00:06:55 ◼   ► was totally wrong about the iphone he

00:06:56 ◼   ► predicted when the iphone first came out

00:06:58 ◼   ► that it wasn't really gonna have much of

00:06:59 ◼   ► an effect on the phone industry because

00:07:02 ◼   ► it was a high-end product that it you

00:07:05 ◼   ► know that that disruption was going to

00:07:06 ◼   ► come from the low end and in hindsight

00:07:09 ◼   ► years later he admits he was wrong

00:07:10 ◼   ► because what he didn't understand at

00:07:12 ◼   ► first and i think this is brilliant

00:07:14 ◼   ► insight is that the iphone wasn't really

00:07:16 ◼   ► a high-end phone it was a low-end

00:07:18 ◼   ► portable computer right it's like this

00:07:21 ◼   ► crummy little three-and-a-half inch

00:07:23 ◼   ► screen laptop but because it's so small

00:07:27 ◼   ► and tiny and lightweight and lasts all

00:07:29 ◼   ► day and has wireless internet everywhere

00:07:31 ◼   ► you go it completely disrupted the

00:07:34 ◼   ► computer industry and the phone industry

00:07:36 ◼   ► at the same time because you didn't need

00:07:37 ◼   ► a phone if you had the right which is I

00:07:40 ◼   ► think a brilliant way of looking at it

00:07:41 ◼   ► and you know I so i'm not saying that

00:07:46 ◼   ► Marcos the magazine is going to itself

00:07:50 ◼   ► put that other magazines out of business

00:07:52 ◼   ► but to me it's the exact sort of thing

00:07:55 ◼   ► that fits in with that line of

00:07:57 ◼   ► disruptive thinking know that it's it

00:07:58 ◼   ► things like the magazine are where the

00:08:04 ◼   ► future is and I can totally see how if

00:08:06 ◼   ► you pitch that to somebody it you know

00:08:09 ◼   ► news corporation or time or something

00:08:12 ◼   ► like that that they would just dismiss

00:08:14 ◼   ► it and i would say it's just some guy

00:08:15 ◼   ► every two weeks putting out 5 750 word

00:08:20 ◼   ► essays that's that's nothing

00:08:22 ◼   ► you know that what would you know that

00:08:23 ◼   ► has nothing to do with what we're trying

00:08:25 ◼   ► to do and i would say no it has

00:08:26 ◼   ► everything with what you're trying to do

00:08:27 ◼   ► which in a nutshell is exactly what's

00:08:30 ◼   ► been wrong with the traditional

00:08:32 ◼   ► publishing industries response to the

00:08:33 ◼   ► Internet

00:08:34 ◼   ► yep I mean it's like that's all it's the

00:08:36 ◼   ► whole thing it's the whole thing all

00:08:38 ◼   ► over again I mean no one's going to

00:08:39 ◼   ► trust no instrument trusts blogs no one

00:08:41 ◼   ► trusts independent reporters they are

00:08:44 ◼   ► they want a big organization like like

00:08:46 ◼   ► ours right with editors and managers and

00:08:50 ◼   ► a whole advertising department right and

00:08:53 ◼   ► the same way to that that most most

00:08:56 ◼   ► traditional if you get if you just tell

00:08:59 ◼   ► me you don't tell me the name of the the

00:09:01 ◼   ► publication but just say this is a

00:09:02 ◼   ► big-name publication with national

00:09:04 ◼   ► circulation they've been around for a

00:09:06 ◼   ► long time I is their website any good

00:09:09 ◼   ► i'm gonna guess now right that they tend

00:09:12 ◼   ► to most existing traditional

00:09:14 ◼   ► publications have really bad websites

00:09:16 ◼   ► without yeah I almost with almost

00:09:20 ◼   ► without exception and they were

00:09:21 ◼   ► especially bad at first like nineteen

00:09:25 ◼   ► ninety-six ninety-seven ninety-eight

00:09:26 ◼   ► they just didn't get it and you know I

00:09:30 ◼   ► remember I mean and and there were big

00:09:32 ◼   ► ideas from I even knew things things

00:09:36 ◼   ► that weren't rooted in the past but

00:09:38 ◼   ► which were from people rooted in the

00:09:40 ◼   ► past like and I'm thinking of slate in

00:09:42 ◼   ► particular right which was all staffed

00:09:44 ◼   ► with people from traditional backgrounds

00:09:47 ◼   ► in weekly magazines and that if I think

00:09:51 ◼   ► it was wasn't it jointly with Microsoft

00:09:53 ◼   ► at first yeah I think so yeah it was

00:09:56 ◼   ► like Microsoft and when Microsoft in the

00:09:59 ◼   ► nineties resent to trying to become like

00:10:00 ◼   ► a media company when they when they got

00:10:03 ◼   ► involved with NBC for MSNBC and they

00:10:07 ◼   ► co-founded a magazine on and the thing I

00:10:11 ◼   ► remember thinking was so weird is icon

00:10:12 ◼   ► slate debuted is it

00:10:14 ◼   ► it debuted it was all that was was a

00:10:16 ◼   ► website there was no print version is

00:10:18 ◼   ► just a website and yet they still had

00:10:19 ◼   ► weekly issues and end it you would like

00:10:24 ◼   ► be like wednesday and here's the new

00:10:25 ◼   ► issue of slave come back next wednesday

00:10:27 ◼   ► right that you get locked into this way

00:10:31 ◼   ► of thinking and slate you know it's

00:10:32 ◼   ► still around they're still doing good

00:10:34 ◼   ► work but they you know they obviously

00:10:35 ◼   ► abandoned that issue idea and it's hard

00:10:37 ◼   ► it's really really hard when you think

00:10:40 ◼   ► in terms of issues it's really hard to

00:10:42 ◼   ► sort of zoom back and and think about a

00:10:45 ◼   ► new medium right so that uh only one of

00:10:51 ◼   ► the questions I wanted to talk to you

00:10:53 ◼   ► about what which have been thinking

00:10:55 ◼   ► about just the last few days because

00:10:57 ◼   ► everybody keeps talking about Apple

00:10:59 ◼   ► apples eventual decline right so many

00:11:03 ◼   ► people think

00:11:04 ◼   ► it's already happening for some strange

00:11:06 ◼   ► reason that i was beyond my

00:11:07 ◼   ► comprehension but I think about this and

00:11:11 ◼   ► I wonder if it's going to be easier for

00:11:15 ◼   ► us to see that or harder for people like

00:11:17 ◼   ► us to see that you know that is a very

00:11:20 ◼   ► good question i do think about that all

00:11:22 ◼   ► the time I i would like to think that we

00:11:28 ◼   ► would see it that you and I and yeah you

00:11:32 ◼   ► know the people who like I like to have

00:11:33 ◼   ► on the show

00:11:34 ◼   ► OMG but i wonder i do wonder that

00:11:39 ◼   ► whether we've got even you know that we

00:11:42 ◼   ► think we're being i like to think that

00:11:44 ◼   ► we would see it I can them and one of

00:11:47 ◼   ► the reasons i think that is because in

00:11:48 ◼   ► the past few weeks there have been a

00:11:50 ◼   ► couple pieces published that are sort of

00:11:52 ◼   ► thoughtful looks at things that Apple is

00:11:54 ◼   ► good at and not good at and I i forget

00:11:59 ◼   ► that the name of someone who who you'd

00:12:03 ◼   ► like to just yesterday the day before

00:12:05 ◼   ► but it was about apples in a bit seeming

00:12:09 ◼   ► inability to get cloud services patrick

00:12:12 ◼   ► thompson ya done really correctly and a

00:12:15 ◼   ► night and I thought your conclusion was

00:12:17 ◼   ► was exactly right that it doesn't seem

00:12:18 ◼   ► like it

00:12:19 ◼   ► buying Twitter is really is really the

00:12:22 ◼   ► right solution to that problem but it

00:12:24 ◼   ► but it's true it seems to be for

00:12:26 ◼   ► whatever reason a blind spot for them

00:12:30 ◼   ► and then the other piece was I Michael

00:12:36 ◼   ► ops piece on forestall being really

00:12:41 ◼   ► leaving and how innovation really often

00:12:46 ◼   ► needs argument me and that he wondered

00:12:52 ◼   ► if getting rid of forestall means that

00:12:55 ◼   ► there would be less argument and if that

00:12:57 ◼   ► was a good thing for innovation or bad

00:12:59 ◼   ► thing for renovation right then maybe

00:13:01 ◼   ► the contention within the upper ranks

00:13:03 ◼   ► maybe it was unpleasant day-to-day to

00:13:06 ◼   ► deal with but maybe it was the best

00:13:07 ◼   ► thing for ya

00:13:10 ◼   ► maybe it was the best thing for the

00:13:12 ◼   ► company going forward

00:13:13 ◼   ► yeah and I i just love those both those

00:13:16 ◼   ► pieces

00:13:17 ◼   ► my head together because I thought that

00:13:18 ◼   ► they were thoughtful pieces on

00:13:21 ◼   ► ok maybe these are blind spots of apples

00:13:23 ◼   ► that could be concerning the future

00:13:25 ◼   ► without being over-the-top you know

00:13:28 ◼   ► apples doomed right is and this is the

00:13:32 ◼   ► obvious sign of their decline i I've

00:13:34 ◼   ► I've mentioned this before

00:13:36 ◼   ► ah I don't think for long it's been a

00:13:39 ◼   ► long time but probably on the show maybe

00:13:41 ◼   ► it was the old show with Dan but that I

00:13:45 ◼   ► have long thought that it's like this

00:13:48 ◼   ► sort of i was theory is giving it way

00:13:50 ◼   ► too much credence but let's call it my

00:13:52 ◼   ► theory of first impressions and that

00:13:56 ◼   ► we're hooked up evolutionarily primarily

00:14:00 ◼   ► all of the things we really ever cared

00:14:02 ◼   ► about where a small circle of the other

00:14:03 ◼   ► human beings you ever possibly encounter

00:14:05 ◼   ► know there's that that number of you

00:14:08 ◼   ► know like a hundred and fifty is like

00:14:09 ◼   ► most number of people you can have any

00:14:11 ◼   ► kind of emotional bond with and we're

00:14:15 ◼   ► hooking up to or 55 in my case the eggs

00:14:18 ◼   ► right there with your body for real

00:14:28 ◼   ► before I was exaggerating its gonna make

00:14:32 ◼   ► a joke about that there's a reason that

00:14:34 ◼   ► we generally have one kitten

00:14:36 ◼   ► nah it's always it's you actually to but

00:14:47 ◼   ► I at but my theory is more or less that

00:14:52 ◼   ► we're hooked up to you meet other people

00:14:54 ◼   ► if somebody hadn't met before

00:14:56 ◼   ► you should have a good instinct that you

00:14:59 ◼   ► should be able to make a good first

00:15:00 ◼   ► impression and accurate first impression

00:15:02 ◼   ► is this someone you should trust is it

00:15:04 ◼   ► someone you shouldn't trust is it

00:15:05 ◼   ► someone you like and you know not that

00:15:08 ◼   ► we're never wrong and not that first

00:15:09 ◼   ► impression sometimes are unsurprisingly

00:15:11 ◼   ► misleading but in general where we're

00:15:14 ◼   ► really good at that and as evolution and

00:15:16 ◼   ► there's really strong evolutionary

00:15:17 ◼   ► reasons to do to be like that but I also

00:15:20 ◼   ► think that first impressions solidified

00:15:22 ◼   ► very quickly and and when you're dealing

00:15:24 ◼   ► with people people don't change that

00:15:26 ◼   ► much right once you get to know someone

00:15:28 ◼   ► don't even think i'm not even talking

00:15:29 ◼   ► about like your

00:15:30 ◼   ► 30 second first impression but like I

00:15:33 ◼   ► just met you you're the new guy in the

00:15:35 ◼   ► office and you know we meet and we you

00:15:38 ◼   ► know the course of a couple of weeks we

00:15:40 ◼   ► get to know each other 10 years from now

00:15:42 ◼   ► you're not going to be that different

00:15:43 ◼   ► right you're still the same person

00:15:44 ◼   ► unless you know you get hit the head or

00:15:47 ◼   ► something like that but that's often

00:15:48 ◼   ► very hard to deal with like if you've

00:15:50 ◼   ► ever met anybody who's had a head injury

00:15:53 ◼   ► it's it's often it will throw you off

00:15:55 ◼   ► because you think that they're the same

00:15:56 ◼   ► and because they're not isn't it it's

00:16:00 ◼   ► really hard for families to deal with

00:16:01 ◼   ► that I mean I know trying to make light

00:16:03 ◼   ► of it i and i think that a lot of people

00:16:08 ◼   ► when it comes

00:16:09 ◼   ► we're not hooked up to deal with

00:16:10 ◼   ► something like Apple which is an

00:16:12 ◼   ► incredibly different company than what

00:16:14 ◼   ► it used to be but so many people

00:16:16 ◼   ► especially businesspeople investors and

00:16:19 ◼   ► business writers invested writers and

00:16:22 ◼   ► stuff like that have this impression of

00:16:24 ◼   ► apple from the nineties that is that

00:16:27 ◼   ► still what they see is apple and there's

00:16:30 ◼   ► just nothing that's going to it we're

00:16:32 ◼   ► gonna have to wait until they get sold

00:16:35 ◼   ► that they retire before it really the

00:16:37 ◼   ► company really shakes that right and

00:16:39 ◼   ► that it's still seen as this little guy

00:16:42 ◼   ► or the upstart or the the the deviant

00:16:45 ◼   ► from the norm in the industry and so you

00:16:48 ◼   ► still see people talking about Apple

00:16:50 ◼   ► like that when Apple gets in trouble

00:16:52 ◼   ► that they could go under go down or just

00:16:55 ◼   ► completely collapse like that's actually

00:16:57 ◼   ► impossible at this point apple is so big

00:16:59 ◼   ► and so successful that the worst thing

00:17:01 ◼   ► that would happen i think is stagnation

00:17:04 ◼   ► right like sort of more or less what

00:17:07 ◼   ► happened to microsoft and that's and

00:17:09 ◼   ► that's the other thing that people tend

00:17:10 ◼   ► to do is they they want to apply then

00:17:13 ◼   ► they always want to do this they want to

00:17:15 ◼   ► apply something that happened in the

00:17:17 ◼   ► past they want they want to say that's

00:17:19 ◼   ► the pc wars between the mac and windows

00:17:24 ◼   ► are exactly the same as what's going on

00:17:26 ◼   ► between iOS and Android right now and

00:17:28 ◼   ► none of these things ever repeat

00:17:29 ◼   ► themselves exactly the same way right

00:17:32 ◼   ► and and they want to say that

00:17:33 ◼   ► oh my god Apple's the new microsoft

00:17:35 ◼   ► right I or that androids the new windows

00:17:41 ◼   ► and iOS is young man

00:17:43 ◼   ► again but you know that the numbers are

00:17:45 ◼   ► so staggeringly different that it

00:17:46 ◼   ► doesn't make any sense to think of it

00:17:48 ◼   ► that way and I also in the whole

00:17:49 ◼   ► industry is different too i mean it's

00:17:51 ◼   ► not as hard to code I think I don't know

00:17:54 ◼   ► I don't know the reasons for this

00:17:55 ◼   ► particularly because then I'm not a

00:17:57 ◼   ► coder but back in the nineties it was

00:18:00 ◼   ► much more of a trial to try and move

00:18:03 ◼   ► code between to eat between windows on

00:18:06 ◼   ► the mac then and it i think it is today

00:18:08 ◼   ► trying to do it just seems like it's

00:18:11 ◼   ► easier for the day there's a lot more

00:18:12 ◼   ► cross development going on right now I

00:18:16 ◼   ► definitely think so and I don't know why

00:18:17 ◼   ► I like i said i don't know why that that

00:18:19 ◼   ► is but it doesn't seem like it's as big

00:18:21 ◼   ► a deal to try and say okay what we wrote

00:18:23 ◼   ► this for for iOS what's right for

00:18:25 ◼   ► android or vice versa

00:18:27 ◼   ► whereas nobody did that back in very

00:18:31 ◼   ► very limited number of large

00:18:32 ◼   ► applications were quoted for both

00:18:34 ◼   ► platforms back in the nineties yeah i

00:18:37 ◼   ► think that there's some that's a good

00:18:40 ◼   ► guys actually probably good question for

00:18:42 ◼   ► the whole for like a whole show but i

00:18:43 ◼   ► think part of it is that that back then

00:18:46 ◼   ► computers were so meager technically so

00:18:49 ◼   ► much slower cpu so such by today's

00:18:53 ◼   ► standards such incredibly tiny amounts

00:18:55 ◼   ► of ram

00:18:56 ◼   ► yeah that you really kind of had to

00:18:58 ◼   ► write it right good software down to the

00:19:00 ◼   ► metal arc is closed above the metal as

00:19:04 ◼   ► you can get to make it efficient and

00:19:07 ◼   ► that it was really hard to have like an

00:19:09 ◼   ► abstraction layer that was cross

00:19:11 ◼   ► platform because it involved even a

00:19:13 ◼   ► little bit of overhead it you just

00:19:17 ◼   ► couldn't afford that that any sort of

00:19:18 ◼   ► inefficiency like that I but that is a

00:19:25 ◼   ► good segue that this whole idea of of of

00:19:28 ◼   ► Apple you know what would an apple

00:19:31 ◼   ► declined look like and it is getting rid

00:19:35 ◼   ► of forestall to alleviate contention

00:19:38 ◼   ► good or bad in that direction leads

00:19:41 ◼   ► right into the probably the biggest

00:19:43 ◼   ► thing this week is this extensive

00:19:45 ◼   ► interview with Tim Cook in bloomberg

00:19:49 ◼   ► well what is it businessweek Bloomberg I

00:19:51 ◼   ► don't know what you know what do you

00:19:52 ◼   ► call it

00:19:52 ◼   ► Bloomberg's uber this is bloomberg

00:19:54 ◼   ► businessweek I get really confused about

00:19:56 ◼   ► too because they look totally different

00:19:57 ◼   ► but Bloomberg owns businessweek and the

00:20:00 ◼   ► interview I guess is in the magazines

00:20:02 ◼   ► probably be the cover story I and they

00:20:05 ◼   ► broke it across 11 pages you have to

00:20:07 ◼   ► click 11 different web pages but then if

00:20:08 ◼   ► you go to bloomberg.com you can get the

00:20:10 ◼   ► exact same article on one nice pit don't

00:20:14 ◼   ► understand is talking about the reality

00:20:15 ◼   ► oh yeah but they cover that in the

00:20:18 ◼   ► article there's a part here where that

00:20:22 ◼   ► he sort of asked about forestall and

00:20:27 ◼   ► what does he say here I the question is

00:20:33 ◼   ► the past few weeks you replace two

00:20:35 ◼   ► members of your senior executive t

00:20:36 ◼   ► mobile software head Scott Forstall and

00:20:38 ◼   ► retail chief john browett how do these

00:20:41 ◼   ► moves make apple better which is a

00:20:43 ◼   ► polite way of saying what was wrong and

00:20:45 ◼   ► that's actually that's not me adding

00:20:47 ◼   ► that aside that's actually the question

00:20:48 ◼   ► asked cook book says the key in the

00:20:51 ◼   ► change that you're referencing is my

00:20:53 ◼   ► deep belief that collaboration is

00:20:54 ◼   ► essential for innovation and I didn't

00:20:57 ◼   ► just start believing that I've always

00:20:58 ◼   ► believed that it's always been a core

00:21:00 ◼   ► belief that Apple Steve very deeply

00:21:02 ◼   ► believe this

00:21:03 ◼   ► so the changes it's not a matter of

00:21:05 ◼   ► going from no collaboration to

00:21:07 ◼   ► collaboration we have an enormous level

00:21:09 ◼   ► of collaboration that Apple but it's a

00:21:11 ◼   ► matter of taking it to another level

00:21:13 ◼   ► you look at what we are great at there

00:21:14 ◼   ► are many things but the one thing we do

00:21:16 ◼   ► which I don't know what else does is

00:21:17 ◼   ► integrate hardware software and services

00:21:19 ◼   ► in a way that most consumers begin to

00:21:23 ◼   ► not differentiate anymore they just care

00:21:25 ◼   ► that the experiences fantastic blah blah

00:21:27 ◼   ► blah i wait but then he talks all right

00:21:31 ◼   ► here's what he says Mr Kim cook

00:21:32 ◼   ► continuing he says you don't have silos

00:21:34 ◼   ► built up where everybody is trying to

00:21:36 ◼   ► optimize their silo and figuring out how

00:21:39 ◼   ► to grab turf and all of these things

00:21:41 ◼   ► makes all of our jobs easier so we're

00:21:43 ◼   ► freed up to focus on the things that

00:21:45 ◼   ► truly matter i mean that to me doesn't

00:21:46 ◼   ► mention forestall but clearly that's

00:21:48 ◼   ► talking about forestall who had the the

00:21:52 ◼   ► the silo iOS yeah and kind and it also

00:21:57 ◼   ► sounds like Microsoft to me

00:21:59 ◼   ► not that i know that well how Microsoft

00:22:02 ◼   ► is structured and and if that kind of

00:22:03 ◼   ► thing goes on but they do have it that

00:22:07 ◼   ► that review system where they fit

00:22:09 ◼   ► everybody into a bell curve right and

00:22:12 ◼   ► you know it even if you did great

00:22:15 ◼   ► if they think someone did better than

00:22:17 ◼   ► you you're going to get forced down so

00:22:19 ◼   ► it's like 10 there's like a top 10% that

00:22:21 ◼   ► does really well there's the meat of the

00:22:24 ◼   ► bell curve that's eighty percent and

00:22:27 ◼   ► then the other ten percent of all the

00:22:28 ◼   ► way to force down to the bottom

00:22:30 ◼   ► yeah what's that called actually wanted

00:22:33 ◼   ► to talk more strength forced ranking is

00:22:35 ◼   ► one thing

00:22:36 ◼   ► yeah stack ranking or something like

00:22:38 ◼   ► yeah I actually wanted to talk to lop

00:22:40 ◼   ► about that would have to happen back on

00:22:42 ◼   ► the show but i forgot to when he was on

00:22:44 ◼   ► because you know is he's like wait

00:22:45 ◼   ► the only guy I know who knows anything

00:22:46 ◼   ► about engineering management

00:22:48 ◼   ► yeah but i would love to get his opinion

00:22:50 ◼   ► on that but it's it does seem it seems

00:22:52 ◼   ► like one of those be careful what you

00:22:53 ◼   ► test for on type warnings like the idea

00:22:58 ◼   ► is that if you have a five-person if

00:23:00 ◼   ► your product manager microsoft you have

00:23:02 ◼   ► a five-person team when it comes time to

00:23:04 ◼   ► give the reviews you get you get like

00:23:07 ◼   ► one gold star to give out to goods and I

00:23:10 ◼   ► have to give out to too bad no sad faces

00:23:13 ◼   ► you have to so if you've recruited a

00:23:15 ◼   ► team of five all-stars and you know

00:23:18 ◼   ► which you would think would be a great

00:23:19 ◼   ► way to make a great product you've got

00:23:21 ◼   ► to give two of them bad reviews you have

00:23:23 ◼   ► to and so what you end up getting

00:23:25 ◼   ► everybody seems to agree is that it

00:23:29 ◼   ► doesn't really reward excellence at what

00:23:31 ◼   ► you're doing it rewards excellence at

00:23:34 ◼   ► getting your product manager to give you

00:23:37 ◼   ► the gold star

00:23:38 ◼   ► yeah right you're gonna take your gaming

00:23:40 ◼   ► the game i think it's broader than that

00:23:42 ◼   ► I don't think they may force it down to

00:23:44 ◼   ► the like the team level so i don't think

00:23:46 ◼   ► i don't think you get a situation

00:23:48 ◼   ► whether you were five people and and

00:23:50 ◼   ► somebody gets screwed and even if all

00:23:51 ◼   ► five didn't know it does honestly Reed

00:23:54 ◼   ► is that right is that right really ok

00:23:56 ◼   ► it really is and as I work someplace

00:23:59 ◼   ► that was going to implement the system

00:24:01 ◼   ► and people were just up in arms about it

00:24:04 ◼   ► and eventually backed off of it and now

00:24:06 ◼   ► it was it was going to be more corporate

00:24:10 ◼   ► yday from when I remember at least our

00:24:13 ◼   ► implementation of it was going to be

00:24:15 ◼   ► more corporate one so I said yeah yeah

00:24:18 ◼   ► yeah that's how it works and so you end

00:24:19 ◼   ► up with which is

00:24:20 ◼   ► we're almost to where it let's say you

00:24:21 ◼   ► are really good at what you do you're

00:24:23 ◼   ► really good programmer but you're

00:24:25 ◼   ► thinking about switching to a new team

00:24:28 ◼   ► well it's to your interest to go to that

00:24:29 ◼   ► team if you know there's a couple of

00:24:31 ◼   ► turkeys on because if you're it just

00:24:34 ◼   ► looking out for your career because

00:24:35 ◼   ► you're gonna shine

00:24:36 ◼   ► whereas if you're looking at a team or

00:24:38 ◼   ► you know there's a couple of other

00:24:40 ◼   ► superstars there you might think well

00:24:42 ◼   ► this might hurt my career because I I

00:24:44 ◼   ► don't know that I can I don't know that

00:24:46 ◼   ► I can get a ranking better than those

00:24:47 ◼   ► two guys because they're awesome

00:24:49 ◼   ► yeah just seems terrible it seems

00:24:52 ◼   ► counterproductive and now but it's also

00:24:54 ◼   ► true and i think it's an interesting

00:24:56 ◼   ► contrast though at the senior management

00:24:57 ◼   ► level though where Microsoft is

00:24:59 ◼   ► organized in a way that I think most

00:25:01 ◼   ► companies are by-product divisions right

00:25:03 ◼   ► Steven Sinofsky was the head of windows

00:25:07 ◼   ► 8 right and he had nothing to do with

00:25:09 ◼   ► the phone like I remember asking him

00:25:12 ◼   ► because I got to speak to him a little

00:25:13 ◼   ► bit at the thing in New York a couple

00:25:14 ◼   ► weeks ago at the windows 8 launch event

00:25:16 ◼   ► I and they had done a thing i think was

00:25:19 ◼   ► thursday in New York they were debuting

00:25:21 ◼   ► windows 8 and then monday in San

00:25:24 ◼   ► Francisco they were debuting windows

00:25:26 ◼   ► phone 8 and i justjust offhandedly I

00:25:28 ◼   ► asked if he was you know just you know a

00:25:31 ◼   ► way to chat about the weather and

00:25:33 ◼   ► traveled it did he have to hop on a

00:25:35 ◼   ► plane and go all the way back to the

00:25:36 ◼   ► west coast for the monday thing and he

00:25:39 ◼   ► was nine I have nothing to do with that

00:25:40 ◼   ► so he wasn't even go into it and I kind

00:25:43 ◼   ► of thought that you know but they're the

00:25:45 ◼   ► Apple is is organized in a very opposite

00:25:48 ◼   ► way especially now that forestall Scott

00:25:51 ◼   ► like maybe forestall was the equivalent

00:25:52 ◼   ► of Sinofsky was in charge of an

00:25:54 ◼   ► operating system iOS um but now it's not

00:26:00 ◼   ► like that at all

00:26:01 ◼   ► you know Johnny I've is in charge of all

00:26:03 ◼   ► design design of everything your

00:26:05 ◼   ► shoulder is in charge of all marketing

00:26:07 ◼   ► doesn't matter if you have you know

00:26:08 ◼   ► Apple is in charge of iphone marketing

00:26:10 ◼   ► ipad marketing math marketing if Apple

00:26:13 ◼   ► comes out with something totally new

00:26:15 ◼   ► they come out with the apple branded car

00:26:17 ◼   ► will shoulder is in charge of the

00:26:18 ◼   ► marketing of it right Johnny I've is in

00:26:20 ◼   ► charge of the design of it uh it's a

00:26:25 ◼   ► different or it's a very different

00:26:26 ◼   ► organization and that you know i think

00:26:29 ◼   ► it's it's it's a open question whether

00:26:33 ◼   ► that's

00:26:33 ◼   ► that's the better way to do it yeah the

00:26:37 ◼   ► counterpoint I thought of two locks

00:26:39 ◼   ► argument is that it because when you

00:26:42 ◼   ► reach a point where the person one of

00:26:45 ◼   ► the people creating the argument is so

00:26:49 ◼   ► difficult that you either lose you it

00:26:54 ◼   ► becomes harder to get good people in the

00:26:57 ◼   ► other positions right because a lot of

00:26:59 ◼   ► people don't want to deal with that crap

00:27:01 ◼   ► they don't have a don't have to like

00:27:04 ◼   ► have an argument every time they go into

00:27:05 ◼   ► a meeting and it and i think that you

00:27:08 ◼   ► know it had something you know I mean I

00:27:10 ◼   ► played a part in the the thermostat boy

00:27:16 ◼   ► with Tony Fadell Tony Fadell him leaving

00:27:20 ◼   ► and and I think it seemed like it was

00:27:22 ◼   ► playing a part in Big Bob Mansfield

00:27:24 ◼   ► leaving

00:27:25 ◼   ► I am so glad you could call it that but

00:27:28 ◼   ► i always call in five minutes

00:27:30 ◼   ► yeah in a different way that this is

00:27:31 ◼   ► played out has been a little

00:27:33 ◼   ► surprisingly open for apple right like

00:27:36 ◼   ► it seems like the Mansfield thing is is

00:27:39 ◼   ► it just became kind of obvious right

00:27:41 ◼   ► right and I don't know that they were so

00:27:43 ◼   ► open about it necessarily as it just was

00:27:45 ◼   ► like a hope

00:27:46 ◼   ► Oh mansfield on his way out of 4 stars

00:27:50 ◼   ► leaving me that's gonna stick around for

00:27:52 ◼   ► a little while and you can have your

00:27:53 ◼   ► head up a new set up an entirely new

00:27:55 ◼   ► organization

00:27:56 ◼   ► yeah I but there also were reports i

00:28:00 ◼   ► forget who had it but somebody had like

00:28:01 ◼   ► you know sources who wouldn't be named

00:28:04 ◼   ► different familiar with the situation as

00:28:05 ◼   ► they say that that Jony ive was at ya

00:28:11 ◼   ► was refusing to go into any meeting were

00:28:13 ◼   ► forced always gonna be yeah and i think

00:28:15 ◼   ► they said the same about mansfield in

00:28:16 ◼   ► the or maybe at least he didn't I got

00:28:19 ◼   ► 220 yeah meetings with forced all right

00:28:21 ◼   ► I and so that you know I while I

00:28:24 ◼   ► understand the argument yet I've got

00:28:26 ◼   ► nothing

00:28:26 ◼   ► you know I like a good argument but when

00:28:28 ◼   ► you have someone is so difficult that

00:28:30 ◼   ► right

00:28:30 ◼   ► he's actually pushing other people you

00:28:32 ◼   ► know very talented people and

00:28:33 ◼   ► particularly you think talk about

00:28:35 ◼   ► mansfield in and cook talks about him in

00:28:37 ◼   ► that interview he is really probably the

00:28:40 ◼   ► best hardware manager anywhere in the in

00:28:44 ◼   ► the technology industry

00:28:45 ◼   ► yeah he's just got to be right at me

00:28:47 ◼   ► because

00:28:47 ◼   ► they make and pick the best hardware and

00:28:49 ◼   ► the guy seems pretty bright and since

00:28:52 ◼   ► he's been there they really have made an

00:28:55 ◼   ► enormous number of innovations you know

00:28:57 ◼   ► yeah just thinking about you know this

00:28:59 ◼   ► whole move to these systems on a chip

00:29:01 ◼   ► I'm the way that they deal with

00:29:04 ◼   ► batteries along yeah yeah I mean we made

00:29:07 ◼   ► fun of that when they when they did the

00:29:08 ◼   ► that the Liberty gives the last macworld

00:29:11 ◼   ► right where we're shoulder was the

00:29:13 ◼   ► keynote and the big announcement was

00:29:15 ◼   ► whatever it was was that there were

00:29:17 ◼   ► integrating the battery we no longer

00:29:20 ◼   ► have removable batteries and write

00:29:21 ◼   ► 17-inch macbook pro and they did the big

00:29:26 ◼   ► video was was a video about battery

00:29:28 ◼   ► technology right which was really you

00:29:31 ◼   ► know not exist as exciting as the two

00:29:34 ◼   ► years earlier when they announced the

00:29:35 ◼   ► iphone obviously but at the same time it

00:29:39 ◼   ► turned out to be a better battery

00:29:40 ◼   ► technology is a really important part of

00:29:42 ◼   ► their business

00:29:43 ◼   ► yeah it's you know there's a

00:29:45 ◼   ► self-congratulatory angle on all those

00:29:48 ◼   ► behind the scenes you know talking to

00:29:50 ◼   ► his Jony ive talking about how beautiful

00:29:52 ◼   ► it is Bob Mansfield you know talking

00:29:54 ◼   ► about how amazing this battery is and

00:29:57 ◼   ► there's sort of a who cares aspect to it

00:29:59 ◼   ► i mean there's a reason why they show it

00:30:01 ◼   ► to the press at these things even though

00:30:03 ◼   ► they're superhot production guys and

00:30:05 ◼   ► they don't they're not like when they

00:30:06 ◼   ► put the commercials on TV for Christmas

00:30:08 ◼   ► they're not showing they're not trying

00:30:10 ◼   ► to get people excited about the battery

00:30:12 ◼   ► integration with every great man

00:30:14 ◼   ► ok like that Monday Night Football ad

00:30:18 ◼   ► for with big pot man still talking about

00:30:20 ◼   ► a battery or did or maybe they did the

00:30:23 ◼   ► ones that may be the closest they've

00:30:24 ◼   ► come to that was when they first switch

00:30:26 ◼   ► to intel processors and they had that

00:30:28 ◼   ► thing with the postal service song you

00:30:32 ◼   ► have God they had it they had a

00:30:35 ◼   ► commercial at Apple gonna have the

00:30:38 ◼   ► google this later the band the band the

00:30:41 ◼   ► poster the band is called the postal

00:30:43 ◼   ► yeah i know i know there or maybe that

00:30:46 ◼   ► maybe it was like a ripoff it was a

00:30:48 ◼   ► argue is arguably a ripoff of some music

00:30:51 ◼   ► video had a commercial that showed like

00:30:53 ◼   ► cpus coming down an assembly line you

00:30:57 ◼   ► know

00:30:58 ◼   ► with these yeah robotic things cutting

00:31:00 ◼   ► them up and it was a regular media

00:31:02 ◼   ► I don't know but anyway that was maybe

00:31:06 ◼   ► the closest they came yeah was trying to

00:31:07 ◼   ► get people excited about intel cpus I'm

00:31:10 ◼   ► but it is interesting because i do think

00:31:13 ◼   ► there's insight to be gleaned from these

00:31:15 ◼   ► things about what Apple honestly thinks

00:31:17 ◼   ► is important and what they're proud of

00:31:19 ◼   ► my mom

00:31:22 ◼   ► I you know it they're they're very quiet

00:31:26 ◼   ► they don't say much but when they do say

00:31:28 ◼   ► things i do think and I think it's one

00:31:30 ◼   ► of the things a lot of people don't

00:31:31 ◼   ► understand about Apple there they're

00:31:32 ◼   ► surprisingly forthcoming I i keep

00:31:36 ◼   ► thinking I haven't written about it but

00:31:38 ◼   ► I keep thinking about it goes also going

00:31:41 ◼   ► back to switch from powerpc to Intel it

00:31:45 ◼   ► was a WWDC keynote it did take everybody

00:31:48 ◼   ► by surprise everyone know you know it's

00:31:50 ◼   ► long been rumored but you know it was

00:31:52 ◼   ► only like the friday before when the

00:31:54 ◼   ► Wall Street Journal said yeah this is

00:31:56 ◼   ► going to happen and everybody was sort

00:31:57 ◼   ► of like what was that

00:31:58 ◼   ► how's that going to work and onstage

00:32:01 ◼   ► talking about it Steve Jobs explanation

00:32:05 ◼   ► was more or less this argument about

00:32:07 ◼   ► power her energy and performance / not

00:32:14 ◼   ► just your performance but performance /

00:32:17 ◼   ► energy consumption and that this was the

00:32:21 ◼   ► future of computing and that these intel

00:32:24 ◼   ► cpus they were switching to gave them so

00:32:27 ◼   ► much more computing power per watt of

00:32:30 ◼   ► energy burn which if you think about his

00:32:34 ◼   ► and he was very passionate about it and

00:32:35 ◼   ► it was almost like come on Steve but if

00:32:40 ◼   ► you think about it isn't that exactly

00:32:42 ◼   ► like like shouldn't the guy who listen

00:32:45 ◼   ► the most intently to that shouldn't have

00:32:47 ◼   ► been Paul Otellini right because isn't

00:32:50 ◼   ► that exactly where Intel is now found

00:32:52 ◼   ► itself behind this every yeah and that's

00:32:55 ◼   ► this whole revolution with these arm

00:32:56 ◼   ► processors for phones and tablets is is

00:33:01 ◼   ► not sure performance right i mean you

00:33:03 ◼   ► know that the high-end ipad 4 is in

00:33:07 ◼   ► terms of like benchmarking way slower

00:33:10 ◼   ► and the cheapest macbook right it's not

00:33:14 ◼   ► it's not that fast as it just as sure

00:33:16 ◼   ► processor it's about battery life and

00:33:20 ◼   ► this this new division of performance

00:33:23 ◼   ► versus energy consumption and heat right

00:33:27 ◼   ► and whens cook look at Steve Jobs really

00:33:31 ◼   ► laid it all out on the line back in i

00:33:32 ◼   ► don't when was that 2006 2005 mean

00:33:35 ◼   ► really like such a belt it out

00:33:37 ◼   ► yeah what does could call he didn't in

00:33:42 ◼   ► that little video so NBC also had a

00:33:45 ◼   ► short cut of what is gonna be on tonight

00:33:49 ◼   ► right as i think it's on tonight

00:33:51 ◼   ► yes it's on tonight on the rock-hard

00:33:53 ◼   ► show right on Brian way my rock hard

00:33:59 ◼   ► isn't that the name of the show and now

00:34:04 ◼   ► it's not as its I don't know I really

00:34:07 ◼   ► don't know

00:34:08 ◼   ► ok let me look it up it's brian williams

00:34:12 ◼   ► rockecenter yeah yeah yeah alright Brian

00:34:15 ◼   ► Williams rock hard as a different show

00:34:17 ◼   ► that's a different show it's on later

00:34:19 ◼   ► because ego that was he called the

00:34:24 ◼   ► processors because they had a funny word

00:34:28 ◼   ► for it doesn't say process races like

00:34:30 ◼   ► brain or something

00:34:31 ◼   ► engine engine i think the eyes are you

00:34:34 ◼   ► talking about i think thats is what I

00:34:36 ◼   ► think you talked about the operating

00:34:37 ◼   ► system not the processor because it

00:34:39 ◼   ► because he said it's made in the USA

00:34:41 ◼   ► that must mean that I think he means

00:34:42 ◼   ► this but that the engine is the it i

00:34:48 ◼   ► don't know where are the processors

00:34:50 ◼   ► maybe they bought that they're designed

00:34:52 ◼   ► they designed them

00:34:53 ◼   ► yes they bought that company and I guess

00:34:58 ◼   ► I thought they also made them it's all

00:35:00 ◼   ► very secretive but an hour samsung is

00:35:02 ◼   ► still making them for you know that's a

00:35:04 ◼   ► whole awkward relationship with with

00:35:07 ◼   ► Samsung that they've got this almost

00:35:10 ◼   ► Shakespearean sort of duality now and

00:35:13 ◼   ► then I guess I know Samsung has I got

00:35:15 ◼   ► chipped fab in Texas where they make

00:35:17 ◼   ► some but I don't know if they make them

00:35:18 ◼   ► all

00:35:19 ◼   ► it does seem it seems kind of crazy like

00:35:21 ◼   ► the way everything hopscotch is all

00:35:23 ◼   ► around where they make the

00:35:24 ◼   ► last in Kentucky and then send it over

00:35:27 ◼   ► to China and they make the CPUs in Texas

00:35:29 ◼   ► and then send them over to China and

00:35:31 ◼   ► then they put them all together and then

00:35:32 ◼   ► send the phones back to the US I thought

00:35:36 ◼   ► he was talking about the operating

00:35:38 ◼   ► system maybe you're right cabbie was

00:35:39 ◼   ► talking I just talked about the

00:35:40 ◼   ► processors but I oh I don't know it and

00:35:43 ◼   ► I could be there

00:35:43 ◼   ► I don't know yeah but that's the other

00:35:46 ◼   ► thing that he announced is that they're

00:35:50 ◼   ► gonna start trying to do a little more

00:35:52 ◼   ► manufacturing in the United States and

00:35:54 ◼   ► today there was also announcement that

00:35:56 ◼   ► Foxconn is going to so I don't know if

00:35:58 ◼   ► those two things are the same

00:35:59 ◼   ► oh really seems like yeah that Foxconn

00:36:01 ◼   ► is going to open or do more

00:36:03 ◼   ► manufacturing in the u.s. mean I don't

00:36:07 ◼   ► know if they doing here you're currently

00:36:08 ◼   ► but so we're gonna get some of that

00:36:11 ◼   ► great foxconn job so if you're looking

00:36:16 ◼   ► for a sweatshop job it's not really a

00:36:21 ◼   ► sweatshop but yeah yeah he doesn't wait

00:36:28 ◼   ► another 10 13 another one to file under

00:36:31 ◼   ► be careful what you wish for

00:36:33 ◼   ► yeah right way yeah we will bring those

00:36:35 ◼   ► jobs back to America this sucks I and

00:36:42 ◼   ► that's the other thing that I I feel

00:36:44 ◼   ► fairly confident that someone will

00:36:47 ◼   ► predict that Apple's decline it you know

00:36:51 ◼   ► another sign of apples impending decline

00:36:53 ◼   ► is that they're bringing jobs United

00:36:55 ◼   ► States anything they do differently is a

00:36:57 ◼   ► sign that they're declining right right

00:36:59 ◼   ► i could see i mean i can see sort of

00:37:02 ◼   ► your argument there because you'd be

00:37:03 ◼   ► saying well that means they're gonna

00:37:05 ◼   ► have to be more expensive and you know

00:37:07 ◼   ► whatever see there's there is a there is

00:37:11 ◼   ► room for a reasonable argument but the

00:37:12 ◼   ► same time it I think I and this is the

00:37:16 ◼   ► sort of the whole problem with these

00:37:17 ◼   ► arguments is that because of apples

00:37:20 ◼   ► track record and because it still has

00:37:22 ◼   ► basically the same core of good

00:37:25 ◼   ► executives that it had and the and the

00:37:29 ◼   ► right guy leading the company i trust

00:37:33 ◼   ► their ability to execute and

00:37:37 ◼   ► to accept all these up counter-arguments

00:37:41 ◼   ► that's to say that the company is surely

00:37:43 ◼   ► in decline you have to sort of throw

00:37:45 ◼   ► that out you have to say no only you

00:37:48 ◼   ► know Steve Jobs was the only one that

00:37:50 ◼   ► was worth of damage the company and

00:37:51 ◼   ► everybody else is a mouth breathing

00:37:54 ◼   ► right number so I don't get I mean

00:37:58 ◼   ► obviously right actually I don't get

00:38:00 ◼   ► that and I think the I mean I was your

00:38:05 ◼   ► private was your overall impression of

00:38:07 ◼   ► the of the interview I thought it was

00:38:08 ◼   ► pretty

00:38:09 ◼   ► that was pretty good for how these

00:38:11 ◼   ► things are are done

00:38:13 ◼   ► yes to certain degree these are all puff

00:38:15 ◼   ► pieces he wasn't really throwing

00:38:17 ◼   ► anything terribly difficult but it would

00:38:20 ◼   ► but it also wasn't complete softballs

00:38:22 ◼   ► right like ideally we you know you'd

00:38:26 ◼   ► love to get some yeah they know that you

00:38:29 ◼   ► didn't bother asking anything about

00:38:31 ◼   ► future products right you have ideally

00:38:33 ◼   ► to satisfy our curiosity would like to

00:38:36 ◼   ► know

00:38:37 ◼   ► stuffed to a level of detail that is

00:38:39 ◼   ► outside apples interest in sharing right

00:38:42 ◼   ► and Tim Cook has not added in bold and

00:38:45 ◼   ► so he's not going to do that but I feel

00:38:47 ◼   ► like in terms of the line of what he

00:38:49 ◼   ► might be willing to talk about

00:38:51 ◼   ► I felt like like that the interview is

00:38:54 ◼   ► very well done and that it went it went

00:38:56 ◼   ► up to that line and kind of filled today

00:38:57 ◼   ► yeah right like you're not going to the

00:39:00 ◼   ► apples not going to let somebody follow

00:39:02 ◼   ► a product development team around for

00:39:05 ◼   ► six months and document exactly how they

00:39:07 ◼   ► actually do it i thought one of the most

00:39:11 ◼   ► interesting tidbits IM it makes sense if

00:39:13 ◼   ► you think about it but I hadn't thought

00:39:14 ◼   ► about it this way was very said that

00:39:15 ◼   ► that eighty percent of the company's

00:39:18 ◼   ► revenue from this corner is coming from

00:39:20 ◼   ► products that were released within the

00:39:22 ◼   ► last 60 days

00:39:23 ◼   ► yeah which is its kind of amazing

00:39:27 ◼   ► we don't really yeah you really think

00:39:28 ◼   ► about that because they did turn the

00:39:29 ◼   ► whole ipad line over right and and what

00:39:33 ◼   ► do you have the ipod too right oh that's

00:39:36 ◼   ► just true that's true but i suspect i

00:39:40 ◼   ► very much

00:39:41 ◼   ► well I don't know that's interesting i

00:39:42 ◼   ► wonder if you I mean I'm so i'm assuming

00:39:44 ◼   ► that that statistic is yes he's not he's

00:39:47 ◼   ► not over emphasize area

00:39:50 ◼   ► now I that seemed bigger than it really

00:39:53 ◼   ► is

00:39:54 ◼   ► right now but i don't think that the

00:39:55 ◼   ► ipad i think it's a hit i think it's

00:39:57 ◼   ► successful i and I've said before and

00:39:58 ◼   ► that's the only reason why they would

00:40:00 ◼   ► keep it around is that people are buying

00:40:01 ◼   ► it right whether it's they're still

00:40:03 ◼   ► buying it with the many available you

00:40:05 ◼   ► know was that the price that was making

00:40:06 ◼   ► them buy it or was it the fact that they

00:40:08 ◼   ► really wanted the tenants eyes and they

00:40:10 ◼   ► just want the cheapest one that it will

00:40:12 ◼   ► know the answer to that if that I you

00:40:13 ◼   ► know if it sticks around but you know I

00:40:16 ◼   ► i think i think tim cook that sort of

00:40:18 ◼   ► thing that I don't think he would miss

00:40:20 ◼   ► speak about like he might I yeah I don't

00:40:21 ◼   ► think so either you might get

00:40:23 ◼   ► loosey-goosey about what's the quote

00:40:24 ◼   ► engine of the phone like that might be

00:40:27 ◼   ► something that he's just going to wave

00:40:28 ◼   ► his hands about when it's comes to

00:40:30 ◼   ► things like we're eighty percent of the

00:40:32 ◼   ► revenues coming yeah yeah i think you

00:40:34 ◼   ► know i think the guys like a living

00:40:37 ◼   ► breathing spreadsheet

00:40:38 ◼   ► yeah i guess probably scary how much of

00:40:41 ◼   ► that stuff he's got his edited given

00:40:43 ◼   ► moment

00:40:44 ◼   ► yeah that was the thing i look kinda

00:40:46 ◼   ► look for is he seemed it i'm trying to

00:40:49 ◼   ► think of all the examples he used a word

00:40:52 ◼   ► a buzzword that he apologized for using

00:40:55 ◼   ► I detected a best-of-breed best-of-breed

00:40:59 ◼   ► yeah i used it yet so yeah use that but

00:41:02 ◼   ► at least copy of that with st. by saying

00:41:05 ◼   ► that he hated it right eye and he there

00:41:07 ◼   ► was one other sort of buzz worthy thing

00:41:09 ◼   ► that he used that I would you know I

00:41:11 ◼   ► mean it's stupid to do this but I didn't

00:41:13 ◼   ► I thought what will if that was

00:41:15 ◼   ► something that jobs would have said but

00:41:18 ◼   ► then the other i was pleased that he

00:41:20 ◼   ► hears the word crappy been talking about

00:41:25 ◼   ► we're talking about keyboards on

00:41:26 ◼   ► netbooks and I thought that was it seems

00:41:31 ◼   ► you know I you know I'd look for a

00:41:35 ◼   ► little clues about his is characterized

00:41:37 ◼   ► guess yeah just to see what kind of guy

00:41:39 ◼   ► is yeah i guess that is the interesting

00:41:41 ◼   ► thing one of the interesting things

00:41:42 ◼   ► about him is that he is a bit of a

00:41:44 ◼   ► cipher and I felt like the interview you

00:41:46 ◼   ► know the what's his name Josh I want to

00:41:48 ◼   ► give him credit because he didn't yeah

00:41:49 ◼   ► yeah i i'm not a triangle is kind of got

00:41:55 ◼   ► like a harder and we'll just call josh

00:41:57 ◼   ► Josh to wrangle Randall gossamer Angeles

00:42:03 ◼   ► yes for you're the perfect person to try

00:42:06 ◼   ► and figure out how to pronounce this

00:42:07 ◼   ► name yeah we go we should go like grade

00:42:12 ◼   ► school style just call Josh t just ed

00:42:15 ◼   ► yeah

00:42:16 ◼   ► mr. Josh yeah yeah brother John's in

00:42:18 ◼   ► your in your class growing up

00:42:20 ◼   ► oh yeah sure yeah we had three jon was

00:42:23 ◼   ► touch-and-go China why is John not a

00:42:25 ◼   ► popular name anymore it's a great name

00:42:27 ◼   ► it's the best name I I was crazy to put

00:42:30 ◼   ► a grill oh man I think Johnson invest

00:42:33 ◼   ► John Adams got some great people but

00:42:38 ◼   ► John Kennedy and it's a great name

00:42:41 ◼   ► anyway but we had to we had three we had

00:42:43 ◼   ► janji I was yours truly jaunty John are

00:42:47 ◼   ► huh

00:42:48 ◼   ► I wondered always wondered what we

00:42:51 ◼   ► didn't do that had if you had two at the

00:42:53 ◼   ► same initial ya i dont no matter how we

00:42:55 ◼   ► would have a despite their to fight it

00:42:57 ◼   ► out

00:42:57 ◼   ► yeah they put it up put them in a pit

00:42:59 ◼   ► with a couple of sticks pointed sticks

00:43:01 ◼   ► and let him go now I diet so no I always

00:43:05 ◼   ► just I mean I mean not at that age and

00:43:08 ◼   ► grade school age but I just eventually

00:43:10 ◼   ► became bolts right so yeah same here

00:43:12 ◼   ► i've always been molds

00:43:13 ◼   ► yeah I've always been groomed yeah I let

00:43:18 ◼   ► me do take a break and read a sponsor

00:43:20 ◼   ► yet with one big sponsor this week it's

00:43:22 ◼   ► talks coffee

00:43:23 ◼   ► oh yeah ever heard of the tongues I've

00:43:25 ◼   ► heard of the talks it's it's the best

00:43:29 ◼   ► ah it's a great gift now I got it I got

00:43:32 ◼   ► some some correction from last week it

00:43:35 ◼   ► was i was talking in Maryland and I said

00:43:37 ◼   ► you know you can you know maybe this

00:43:39 ◼   ► idea of giving somebody a subscription

00:43:41 ◼   ► to a thing that comes in the mail maybe

00:43:42 ◼   ► it's you know got a bad rap as a holiday

00:43:44 ◼   ► gift because of the the Christmas

00:43:46 ◼   ► vacation I think I said that he got the

00:43:49 ◼   ► cake of the Month Club my it's a beloved

00:43:52 ◼   ► holiday classic my wife and my son were

00:43:54 ◼   ► both appalled that I didn't remember

00:43:56 ◼   ► what Clark got from the park Griswold

00:43:59 ◼   ► got from his boss was it a subscription

00:44:01 ◼   ► to the jelly of the month club and how I

00:44:04 ◼   ► and that his cousin Eddie said it's the

00:44:07 ◼   ► gift that keeps on giving

00:44:09 ◼   ► I will talks coffee as a gift idea for

00:44:12 ◼   ► the holidays it's the real deal though

00:44:13 ◼   ► because it's not some shitty jelly

00:44:16 ◼   ► it's it is the best coffee in the world

00:44:21 ◼   ► like you're giving somebody something

00:44:22 ◼   ► that they're actually going to use is

00:44:24 ◼   ► presuming that you've got someone in

00:44:25 ◼   ► your friend or family who drinks coffee

00:44:28 ◼   ► and if they don't drink coffee

00:44:29 ◼   ► I mean what's wrong with because it just

00:44:31 ◼   ► came out the other thing it just came

00:44:33 ◼   ► out last week that the more coffee you

00:44:35 ◼   ► drink the better you are

00:44:36 ◼   ► I don't know that's what I took four ya

00:44:37 ◼   ► know that it's not the demonstrable be

00:44:41 ◼   ► true right there was some kind of study

00:44:43 ◼   ► came out that drinking copious amounts

00:44:45 ◼   ► of coffee is on the whole good for your

00:44:47 ◼   ► health

00:44:48 ◼   ► yeah and it's integral zoomed up being a

00:44:50 ◼   ► good you're writing a good weblog right

00:44:52 ◼   ► now exactly i mean it's it's what you

00:44:55 ◼   ► know what and somebody else pointed out

00:44:56 ◼   ► to me that on twitter that they said

00:45:01 ◼   ► good piece on the daily but you missed

00:45:03 ◼   ► what was surely the core of their

00:45:05 ◼   ► failure that they obviously did not have

00:45:07 ◼   ► I over-caffeinated fizzy water

00:45:10 ◼   ► over-caffeinated over fizzy water and it

00:45:15 ◼   ► was carbonated carbonated over

00:45:17 ◼   ► carbonated fizzy water fussy coffee and

00:45:20 ◼   ► clicking keyboard they were must have

00:45:22 ◼   ► been missing at least one and A three

00:45:23 ◼   ► possibly all three probably all 3i

00:45:25 ◼   ► probably all three given out what it was

00:45:28 ◼   ► but those are my keys to success on the

00:45:31 ◼   ► internet / kappa / carbonated water

00:45:33 ◼   ► policy delicious coffee and clicking

00:45:36 ◼   ► keyboards

00:45:37 ◼   ► yeah i would put the coffee first

00:45:39 ◼   ► frankly I mean I'd if I can we have one

00:45:41 ◼   ► of the 3i would we put the coffee first

00:45:44 ◼   ► I could get my work done with the shitty

00:45:46 ◼   ► keyboard and with flat water or juice or

00:45:48 ◼   ► something like that

00:45:49 ◼   ► not really sure how I didn't get

00:45:51 ◼   ► anything going without the coffee honks

00:45:53 ◼   ► is the best they get it from all over

00:45:54 ◼   ► the world it is it it's great coffee and

00:45:57 ◼   ► if you're lazy like me you don't have to

00:45:59 ◼   ► leave the house I mean it fits right in

00:46:01 ◼   ► with your piece in the magazine you

00:46:03 ◼   ► don't have to go anywhere right you've

00:46:04 ◼   ► got a poly you can get deliveries come

00:46:06 ◼   ► into your office right you've got like a

00:46:08 ◼   ► policy there with the wife

00:46:09 ◼   ► so the tongues qualified under the door

00:46:11 ◼   ► comes right in I up through december 16

00:46:15 ◼   ► you can order in time for the holidays

00:46:18 ◼   ► go to talks dot-org t 0 NX dot 0 RG sign

00:46:23 ◼   ► up you get a free sample for yourself

00:46:24 ◼   ► it's a great gift idea if you don't have

00:46:27 ◼   ► the talk to everybody should have the

00:46:29 ◼   ► tongs hide

00:46:30 ◼   ► don't understand why some people haven't

00:46:32 ◼   ► signed up for yet really thanks to them

00:46:34 ◼   ► for their continuing support of the talk

00:46:35 ◼   ► show this is my thing for Christmas that

00:46:38 ◼   ► for myself that I'm I'm trying to trying

00:46:41 ◼   ► to arrange is to up my coffee game

00:46:44 ◼   ► yeah and i think this is going to be an

00:46:46 ◼   ► integral integral part of this because I

00:46:48 ◼   ► I got on my on my Amazon wish list is

00:46:51 ◼   ► the air be aeropress yeah and I gotta

00:46:54 ◼   ► get I gotta organize and I'm switching

00:46:57 ◼   ► to talks to

00:46:58 ◼   ► I when I was out for the the show that I

00:47:02 ◼   ► did in Los Angeles with the sandwich and

00:47:06 ◼   ► ryan Johnson and looper director couple

00:47:08 ◼   ► shows ago because we did that we did

00:47:10 ◼   ► that show right there in the same with

00:47:11 ◼   ► studios there in Los Angeles one of the

00:47:15 ◼   ► guys who works with Adam there it's at

00:47:17 ◼   ► sandwich video JP volunteer to to make

00:47:21 ◼   ► me a cup of coffee and I I was not

00:47:22 ◼   ► familiar with the aeropress and of

00:47:24 ◼   ► course there was talk because I believe

00:47:26 ◼   ► they're not sure if I can say this but I

00:47:28 ◼   ► think they're working on a sandwich

00:47:30 ◼   ► video for talks haha so they're you know

00:47:33 ◼   ► they're it's all part of the talks

00:47:35 ◼   ► family and he made me the aeropress cup

00:47:37 ◼   ► of coffee and it really was one of those

00:47:39 ◼   ► like pulp fiction moments of like a damn

00:47:41 ◼   ► that's good yeah I like wow like it

00:47:48 ◼   ► really kind of like set me off like I

00:47:50 ◼   ► lost my train of thought it's like this

00:47:51 ◼   ► is making really really delicious

00:47:54 ◼   ► the other thing too that's fun about

00:47:56 ◼   ► getting into copy you can really kind of

00:47:58 ◼   ► nerd out on it and it's it's not

00:48:00 ◼   ► expensive you know like you're not you

00:48:02 ◼   ► know they like I'm always afraid I don't

00:48:04 ◼   ► I never drink wine because I'm afraid

00:48:05 ◼   ► that if i get into it all of a sudden

00:48:07 ◼   ► I'm buying $85 bottles and I I I don't

00:48:10 ◼   ► want to get into something like that you

00:48:12 ◼   ► know i mean like all you need is boiled

00:48:14 ◼   ► water and coffee beans

00:48:17 ◼   ► yeah right you can get like a nice

00:48:19 ◼   ► little fussy cattle and it's you know

00:48:23 ◼   ► what's what's a teakettle cost doesn't

00:48:24 ◼   ► cost a lot of money and are not like get

00:48:26 ◼   ► into some kind of thing where you're

00:48:27 ◼   ► can't pay your amex every month I want

00:48:33 ◼   ► to get one of you should have you should

00:48:34 ◼   ► not have to do that I want to get a

00:48:36 ◼   ► teakettle that has the long skinny spout

00:48:39 ◼   ► have you seen that like this seems like

00:48:41 ◼   ► all the real that that's the way you

00:48:42 ◼   ► make fun of

00:48:43 ◼   ► yeah it's got like a real skinny spot

00:48:45 ◼   ► mine has a big fat spout that's like you

00:48:48 ◼   ► know it's just like it unfussy tea

00:48:50 ◼   ► kettle or no water kettle whatever you

00:48:52 ◼   ► want to call it and I feel like I got it

00:48:54 ◼   ► I got it up my teakettle game under tim

00:48:59 ◼   ► cook drinks coffee that's it i would bet

00:49:04 ◼   ► he seems like i don't know i don't know

00:49:07 ◼   ► i would hope so

00:49:08 ◼   ► yeah I don't know I say eats a lot of

00:49:11 ◼   ► energy bars is that used to be the other

00:49:15 ◼   ► thing that was in all the profiles of

00:49:16 ◼   ► that easy gets in early leave late I he

00:49:21 ◼   ► eats a lot of it eats a lot of energy

00:49:26 ◼   ► bars Steve Jobs never would have eaten

00:49:29 ◼   ► energy bars you know one of the other

00:49:32 ◼   ► things company in decline

00:49:37 ◼   ► actually I one of the little things i

00:49:41 ◼   ► noticed in the article was a day and

00:49:44 ◼   ► this time unless i skipped it they never

00:49:46 ◼   ► actually got back to talking about John

00:49:48 ◼   ► Browett noise no I don't think you did

00:49:51 ◼   ► it like he really just focused on for

00:49:54 ◼   ► stolen glossed over brown right it's

00:49:57 ◼   ► this whole thing here with forestall and

00:50:00 ◼   ► a big explanation which is really I

00:50:02 ◼   ► think about as open as they were going

00:50:03 ◼   ► to get about you know what was going on

00:50:06 ◼   ► there i really do mean you know i mean

00:50:08 ◼   ► obviously not going to get into

00:50:09 ◼   ► specifics I any you know kind of went

00:50:13 ◼   ► out of his way

00:50:14 ◼   ► euphemistically not to mention forestall

00:50:16 ◼   ► my name as i get gentleman's agreement

00:50:18 ◼   ► all of this i who had the podcast where

00:50:23 ◼   ► they were talking about the severance

00:50:27 ◼   ► agreements think it was siracusa going

00:50:29 ◼   ► on on hypercritical when I wanted first

00:50:32 ◼   ► broke and he was talking about these

00:50:35 ◼   ► there's like a term for these type of

00:50:37 ◼   ► agreements it's like a gardeners clause

00:50:43 ◼   ► or something like that a guard gardening

00:50:45 ◼   ► severance or something like that and

00:50:46 ◼   ► they really it's a tradition

00:50:49 ◼   ► I you know what he said I had forgets

00:50:55 ◼   ► for something like that but the gist of

00:50:56 ◼   ► it is it's like an old term from

00:50:57 ◼   ► england and the gist of it is that it's

00:50:58 ◼   ► in the contract that the company if we

00:51:01 ◼   ► decide to get rid of you we can pay you

00:51:03 ◼   ► this gardeners thing where you just

00:51:06 ◼   ► going to stay at home and garden garden

00:51:08 ◼   ► but you're going to be on the payroll at

00:51:10 ◼   ► your regular salary for a year but we

00:51:11 ◼   ► don't want you to even come into the

00:51:13 ◼   ► office come it but we're gonna but we

00:51:16 ◼   ► don't want you to go to a competitor

00:51:18 ◼   ► you know I tried to get one of those

00:51:20 ◼   ► four years in its own little bit finally

00:51:23 ◼   ► just got to quit

00:51:25 ◼   ► it's one of those things where when you

00:51:26 ◼   ► get to a certain level of achievement

00:51:27 ◼   ► everything it's like it must be nice you

00:51:30 ◼   ► know what I mean yeah you know what they

00:51:32 ◼   ► call golden parachutes solution right I

00:51:35 ◼   ► normal people when you get fired you

00:51:37 ◼   ► know you know yeah you just get fired

00:51:39 ◼   ► you get weeks right you get like two

00:51:42 ◼   ► weeks of pay you get maybe if you're

00:51:44 ◼   ► lucky you get four weeks of pay

00:51:45 ◼   ► no I you know like when you reach the

00:51:49 ◼   ► executive level and you get fired you

00:51:52 ◼   ► get tens of millions of dollars that's

00:51:54 ◼   ► right you know and i don't mean the lab

00:51:58 ◼   ► I really don't mean like that sometimes

00:51:59 ◼   ► I worry about things like I just think

00:52:01 ◼   ► like it like I don't think Scott

00:52:03 ◼   ► Forstall listens to the talk show but

00:52:05 ◼   ► the odds that he listens to the talk

00:52:07 ◼   ► show it's definitely somewhere above

00:52:08 ◼   ► zero right i mean is maybe it's one

00:52:11 ◼   ► percent chance right and so I I always

00:52:14 ◼   ► sometimes I think like I don't want to

00:52:15 ◼   ► sit here and God you know maybe he's at

00:52:17 ◼   ► home you know what gardening right bored

00:52:19 ◼   ► out of his mind

00:52:20 ◼   ► Jesus Christ and listen to podcasts and

00:52:22 ◼   ► then here we are laughing about the fact

00:52:24 ◼   ► that he got fired I mean I don't I

00:52:25 ◼   ► really don't mean to make light of it

00:52:27 ◼   ► now i really do think you know in a way

00:52:29 ◼   ► I think that there's a good sad story

00:52:31 ◼   ► there where I think that this is a guy

00:52:33 ◼   ► who's been taken away from his life's

00:52:35 ◼   ► work and I I mean this without any I I'm

00:52:39 ◼   ► not making fun of trying to be serious

00:52:41 ◼   ► here

00:52:41 ◼   ► uh but you know it's not like the guys

00:52:45 ◼   ► just get a better

00:52:48 ◼   ► yeah he doesn't have to his family

00:52:50 ◼   ► doesn't have to switch to the store

00:52:51 ◼   ► brand cornflakes was it seems like I

00:52:56 ◼   ► mean you know a guy like that he's gonna

00:52:57 ◼   ► he's gonna do something else

00:52:59 ◼   ► I mean he's gonna he's gonna land on the

00:53:01 ◼   ► speed and it's not gonna be alright

00:53:03 ◼   ► sitting around in his bathroom right

00:53:06 ◼   ► watching Washington watching his shows

00:53:10 ◼   ► for a couple years just watch it'll keep

00:53:12 ◼   ► cycling into a spiral of cruising

00:53:15 ◼   ► congressional Bill's got there was one

00:53:19 ◼   ► about you and like we would like he's

00:53:24 ◼   ► already talking and you know he's

00:53:26 ◼   ► already out there talking to people like

00:53:27 ◼   ► figuring out what the next things right

00:53:29 ◼   ► there's a reason that he got to be the

00:53:31 ◼   ► senior vice yeah exactly right you gotta

00:53:33 ◼   ► get ready clawed his way up there but

00:53:35 ◼   ► probably murdered a bunch of people to

00:53:37 ◼   ► get there he's gonna going to do it

00:53:40 ◼   ► again

00:53:40 ◼   ► god I really don't want to think about

00:53:42 ◼   ► what how i would do something really but

00:53:45 ◼   ► he stepped in and took took your blog

00:53:48 ◼   ► away right

00:53:49 ◼   ► yeah sorry the word there's nothing

00:53:52 ◼   ► you're done every once in a while I like

00:53:54 ◼   ► what I see words and I the word I'm

00:53:57 ◼   ► seeing right now it's is in big big

00:54:01 ◼   ► future of bold all caps says

00:54:03 ◼   ► intervention haha but yea yea trip to

00:54:13 ◼   ► the health clinic didn't do you have a

00:54:16 ◼   ► do you have a martini glasses in your

00:54:18 ◼   ► bathroom like we do

00:54:19 ◼   ► look at that hey last night's martini

00:54:22 ◼   ► glasses that ya know

00:54:25 ◼   ► okay good you still got a ways to go

00:54:29 ◼   ► then

00:54:30 ◼   ► ya gotta catch up i want to be there but

00:54:35 ◼   ► i keep up with the multiples

00:54:36 ◼   ► yeah I won't say that I don't

00:54:38 ◼   ► occasionally lose one where various just

00:54:42 ◼   ► don't take it into the bathroom with the

00:54:47 ◼   ► other thing i noticed in the same

00:54:48 ◼   ► segment so he did they never actually

00:54:49 ◼   ► get back to talking about John brow it

00:54:51 ◼   ► just seems like that was just like only

00:54:54 ◼   ► ever I me and he barely talked about all

00:54:56 ◼   ► I honestly though in a sense though if I

00:54:58 ◼   ► had it if there's one complaint of my

00:55:00 ◼   ► complaints one of the things that

00:55:01 ◼   ► occurred to me and i don't think i don't

00:55:03 ◼   ► know I I feel like I'm only good at

00:55:06 ◼   ► finding these things afterwards i'm not

00:55:07 ◼   ► saying I would have done a better job if

00:55:09 ◼   ► Apple and said look you want an hour

00:55:10 ◼   ► with tim cook and I've of course would

00:55:12 ◼   ► have said yes but I don't know that I

00:55:14 ◼   ► would have done a better job than this

00:55:15 ◼   ► guy i really don't

00:55:16 ◼   ► yeah because I just start drawing blanks

00:55:19 ◼   ► I'm not good

00:55:20 ◼   ► I i think very very slowly and I think

00:55:22 ◼   ► to be an interview

00:55:23 ◼   ► you got to think fast but it occurs to

00:55:24 ◼   ► me though that I would have liked him to

00:55:26 ◼   ► go back to browse because the browser

00:55:28 ◼   ► thing to me is all on cook right like

00:55:32 ◼   ► the the forestall situation is obviously

00:55:34 ◼   ► been simmering literally for a decade

00:55:36 ◼   ► right i mean force that's been there for

00:55:38 ◼   ► ya

00:55:39 ◼   ► I and you're as proud as something where

00:55:41 ◼   ► he at you know he brought him in and add

00:55:44 ◼   ► a turnaround shown the door right the

00:55:46 ◼   ► whole thing with ron johnson leaving

00:55:48 ◼   ► happened after Jobs died I you know and

00:55:52 ◼   ► there's and I who knows whether there's

00:55:53 ◼   ► any truth to return I think it's

00:55:54 ◼   ► ridiculous but there's some speculation

00:55:56 ◼   ► that that that Johnson wanted the CEO

00:55:59 ◼   ► job at apple and that if you know when

00:56:01 ◼   ► it was curtains gonna go to cook with

00:56:02 ◼   ► any was out because there was no that

00:56:04 ◼   ► doesn't seem that he doesn't seem like a

00:56:07 ◼   ► good fit he doesn't it doesn't seem like

00:56:08 ◼   ► it would have to be in the cards that

00:56:09 ◼   ► the readouts guy would ever rise you

00:56:12 ◼   ► know that if you know you can in theory

00:56:14 ◼   ► you could see it like Johnny I've the

00:56:16 ◼   ► design guy if he wanted to be CEO that

00:56:19 ◼   ► you

00:56:19 ◼   ► you know it wouldn't play if they said

00:56:21 ◼   ► hey you know hooks retiring jony ive's

00:56:24 ◼   ► the new CEO i think that would play I I

00:56:27 ◼   ► think Schiller would play you know sure

00:56:29 ◼   ► and i and I've said this before it many

00:56:33 ◼   ► times that he's you know what people

00:56:35 ◼   ► think of his marketing is not what Apple

00:56:37 ◼   ► thinks of his marketing he's not just in

00:56:39 ◼   ► charge of ads you know and and stuff

00:56:41 ◼   ► like that if you know what sugar does it

00:56:44 ◼   ► would totally play that he could be the

00:56:45 ◼   ► CEO like the the retail guy no matter

00:56:47 ◼   ► how good their retail is it just doesn't

00:56:50 ◼   ► play but anyway he did leave after Jobs

00:56:53 ◼   ► was gone and so the whole thing of how

00:56:55 ◼   ► do we replace ron johnson and keep the

00:56:57 ◼   ► retail thing going was all on cook and

00:57:00 ◼   ► it was you know as soon as it was

00:57:01 ◼   ► announced everybody who is familiar with

00:57:03 ◼   ► that those shitty stores that Brown ran

00:57:05 ◼   ► in England I forget what they were

00:57:09 ◼   ► called but everybody in the UK the

00:57:11 ◼   ► announces and everybody in the UK who

00:57:12 ◼   ► knew was like what the hell is Apple

00:57:14 ◼   ► doing this customers suck

00:57:16 ◼   ► yeah they're like the whole reason the

00:57:18 ◼   ► apple stores are successful there like

00:57:19 ◼   ► the anti apple stores and I was like

00:57:22 ◼   ► well I don't know maybe the guy you know

00:57:24 ◼   ► right that's what I thought too i was so

00:57:25 ◼   ► I wanted to give you the benefit of the

00:57:27 ◼   ► doubt

00:57:28 ◼   ► right i thought well maybe in turns out

00:57:29 ◼   ► I was wrong no it turns out that the

00:57:32 ◼   ► snap judgment from the people in England

00:57:33 ◼   ► was exactly right

00:57:35 ◼   ► I the guys like a hack which seems weird

00:57:38 ◼   ► yeah just seems weird I kinda feel like

00:57:39 ◼   ► if you got Tim cooked in front of you

00:57:41 ◼   ► and you can ask him about it i feel like

00:57:43 ◼   ► you know you something along the lines

00:57:46 ◼   ► of look disguise stores in England he

00:57:48 ◼   ► came from these stories that are unlike

00:57:49 ◼   ► apples

00:57:50 ◼   ► yeah what did you see that you thought

00:57:53 ◼   ► might be right exactly right i think

00:57:56 ◼   ► that would explain that initial decision

00:57:57 ◼   ► right I feel like he could have held his

00:57:59 ◼   ► feet to the fire their eyebrows a little

00:58:01 ◼   ► bit where ya forestall thing you know

00:58:03 ◼   ► they did cover it well but he didn't get

00:58:04 ◼   ► back to proud I guess they think that

00:58:06 ◼   ► that's the four-star things more

00:58:08 ◼   ► interesting but and I can see that but

00:58:11 ◼   ► it also in a way it's more interesting

00:58:15 ◼   ► to figure out what happened with brown

00:58:16 ◼   ► like how that does that went wrong right

00:58:19 ◼   ► and I kind of feel like you know if

00:58:21 ◼   ► there is like a you know like you said

00:58:22 ◼   ► earlier like looking for chinks in the

00:58:25 ◼   ► armor and yeah and yeah I could that

00:58:27 ◼   ► would seem like a bigger one than I then

00:58:30 ◼   ► the forestall situation right and I

00:58:32 ◼   ► wonder about the you know it's obviously

00:58:35 ◼   ► mostly speculative we don't know the

00:58:37 ◼   ► internal but the speculation is that we

00:58:39 ◼   ► do know that cook is a big numbers guy

00:58:41 ◼   ► and he's an operations guy and you know

00:58:44 ◼   ► we know that that some of the things

00:58:46 ◼   ► that this proud guy did when he was in

00:58:48 ◼   ► charge of apple retail seemed sort of

00:58:51 ◼   ► operationally you know like cognac hours

00:58:54 ◼   ► doing those tricks where you get you

00:58:55 ◼   ► know make sure nobody gets more than 37

00:58:59 ◼   ► and a half hours he taunted him his

00:59:00 ◼   ► full-time employees and stuff like that

00:59:03 ◼   ► anyway stuff that made the employees

00:59:05 ◼   ► that wasn't good for the employees and

00:59:07 ◼   ► sort of put like a if gone in that

00:59:10 ◼   ► direction would make the stores the

00:59:11 ◼   ► worst experience but and a bean counter

00:59:15 ◼   ► level seemingly makes sense you know

00:59:17 ◼   ► makes sense if you're looking at the

00:59:19 ◼   ► store through an Excel spreadsheet

00:59:20 ◼   ► instead of actually being in the store I

00:59:24 ◼   ► and that's sort of like the fear with

00:59:27 ◼   ► cook right that he's the numbers guy

00:59:29 ◼   ► that he's gonna start running the

00:59:31 ◼   ► company in a numbers focused way

00:59:34 ◼   ► yeah right as opposed to Steve Jobs who

00:59:38 ◼   ► you know he like came in and he was mad

00:59:41 ◼   ► at the first stores opened up and he was

00:59:42 ◼   ► pissed about like the scuff marks on the

00:59:44 ◼   ► floors and

00:59:47 ◼   ► so he like I don't know if you went to

00:59:49 ◼   ► himself what the story is but they like

00:59:51 ◼   ► went to Venice and got like some kind of

00:59:53 ◼   ► like you can only get it in the Venice

00:59:55 ◼   ► granite stone that they polished certain

00:59:59 ◼   ► way

00:59:59 ◼   ► way

01:00:00 ◼   ► to make this that's how I that's what

01:00:01 ◼   ► we're going to use for the floors from

01:00:03 ◼   ► now on

01:00:03 ◼   ► yeah right doesn't make any financial

01:00:05 ◼   ► sense at all

01:00:07 ◼   ► goddammit get some hot wax right but

01:00:11 ◼   ► just goddamn band the floors are nice

01:00:13 ◼   ► some italian yacht wax shiny floors up

01:00:18 ◼   ► I i like the story about him talking to

01:00:23 ◼   ► steve about being about taking over

01:00:25 ◼   ► yeah and trying trying to fight right

01:00:28 ◼   ► now but were eventually he kept asking

01:00:33 ◼   ► him like you know is which one because

01:00:35 ◼   ► he was going to jobs is gonna becomes

01:00:37 ◼   ► chairman of the board and cook would be

01:00:41 ◼   ► CEO right is that the way that is

01:00:43 ◼   ► correct

01:00:44 ◼   ► yeah and then he kept asking manager

01:00:45 ◼   ► sure this is what you were doing it and

01:00:48 ◼   ► finally he said I'm sure stop asking

01:00:51 ◼   ► he all right now this is really you know

01:00:55 ◼   ► is one of the best I I didn't want a

01:00:57 ◼   ► block quote because it was a guy I

01:01:01 ◼   ► didn't want to spoil it in the article

01:01:03 ◼   ► its its way at the bottom so via the

01:01:04 ◼   ► internet any of you out there started

01:01:06 ◼   ► reading this long interview and cut got

01:01:07 ◼   ► halfway to really stick with it I mean

01:01:09 ◼   ► that's good

01:01:10 ◼   ► here's the here's the party says this is

01:01:16 ◼   ► cook talking one weekend he called me

01:01:18 ◼   ► and he said I'd like to talk to you this

01:01:20 ◼   ► was in the summer of 11 I said fine when

01:01:23 ◼   ► and typical Steve fashion is it now

01:01:26 ◼   ► great and write a typical so I go over

01:01:29 ◼   ► to his house and i still remember how he

01:01:31 ◼   ► started this discussion said there has

01:01:32 ◼   ► never been a professional transition at

01:01:35 ◼   ► the CEO level and apple he said our

01:01:37 ◼   ► company has done a lot of great things

01:01:38 ◼   ► but it's never done this one last guy is

01:01:40 ◼   ► always fired and then someone new comes

01:01:42 ◼   ► in he goes I want there to be a

01:01:44 ◼   ► professional CEO transition and I've

01:01:47 ◼   ► decided and i'm recommending to the

01:01:48 ◼   ► board that you be the CEO i'm going to

01:01:51 ◼   ► be the chairman and it goes on it's

01:01:54 ◼   ► really good that's you know

01:02:00 ◼   ► I hope they help their able to keep up

01:02:04 ◼   ► crazy stories like this

01:02:08 ◼   ► yeah you know even the hook jobs going

01:02:11 ◼   ► but she's just like and I don't know how

01:02:14 ◼   ► you do that because it's like it's

01:02:16 ◼   ► little stuff like that that makes it i

01:02:19 ◼   ► mean her love stories like that and

01:02:21 ◼   ► having worked at a company

01:02:22 ◼   ► those are those are always the best I

01:02:25 ◼   ► mean you just if you have a story like

01:02:27 ◼   ► that it part in a really it sounds

01:02:29 ◼   ► stupid but it actually helps build the

01:02:31 ◼   ► culture of the company

01:02:32 ◼   ► yeah if you can tell crazy stories are

01:02:36 ◼   ► just great nutty things about the

01:02:38 ◼   ► executives and stuff that's fun not you

01:02:40 ◼   ► know people get yeah well I mean it's

01:02:43 ◼   ► also kind of fun to hear about people

01:02:44 ◼   ► getting fired in the elevator but

01:02:45 ◼   ► there's the old one about cook the one

01:02:48 ◼   ► and you know you don't hear these

01:02:50 ◼   ► stories angle but there's the one about

01:02:51 ◼   ► their something was going wrong in China

01:02:54 ◼   ► and need one he said you pointed to the

01:02:57 ◼   ► one guy heating and said okay you're the

01:02:59 ◼   ► one that fix it and then like five

01:03:01 ◼   ► minutes later looked up and said what

01:03:02 ◼   ► are you still doing here and the guy got

01:03:05 ◼   ► really good one

01:03:06 ◼   ► any guy got haywire like dinner still on

01:03:09 ◼   ► a plane right he did he touch with that

01:03:11 ◼   ► they said the guy did though he didn't

01:03:13 ◼   ► even go home he liked guys car cook told

01:03:15 ◼   ► his wife I gotta go to China and he just

01:03:17 ◼   ► drove drunk in san jose airport and

01:03:19 ◼   ► booked a ticket to China will buy some

01:03:22 ◼   ► clothes there right yeah it probably

01:03:24 ◼   ► cheap

01:03:25 ◼   ► yeah guys like spend two weeks in China

01:03:30 ◼   ► where like ill-fitting clothing that

01:03:34 ◼   ► jumpsuit

01:03:36 ◼   ► ok i'll get one at the factory yeah

01:03:39 ◼   ► there anything else going on this week

01:03:43 ◼   ► terrific five came out yeah I'm gotten

01:03:48 ◼   ► yet but well as I do i do enjoy the

01:03:51 ◼   ► terrific is that you're using your

01:03:53 ◼   ► twitter client of choice i go back and

01:03:55 ◼   ► forth and i used to use but I do use

01:03:59 ◼   ► both these Tweetbot and twitterrific

01:04:00 ◼   ► yeah it's really and on and on iOS is

01:04:04 ◼   ► both yeah it's really good and I kind of

01:04:06 ◼   ► feel like they're they're doing a

01:04:08 ◼   ► skating to where the puck is going to be

01:04:12 ◼   ► thing with the aesthetics

01:04:14 ◼   ► of the app is that it's it i know that

01:04:19 ◼   ► the whole skeuomorphism thing it's such

01:04:21 ◼   ► an overused word and it means more than

01:04:24 ◼   ► just the textures right that like and

01:04:28 ◼   ► and that it was an interview with Lauren

01:04:30 ◼   ► Richter of letterpress fame with erica

01:04:33 ◼   ► OGG by Erica eigen you go on this week

01:04:36 ◼   ► he mentioned it that skeuomorphism is

01:04:39 ◼   ► more than just the visual textures and

01:04:41 ◼   ► putting sticks leather it's the things

01:04:43 ◼   ► like when you've turned a page and it

01:04:45 ◼   ► looks like a piece of paper as you turn

01:04:47 ◼   ► the page whether it's good or bad it's

01:04:48 ◼   ► you know it's more than just what it

01:04:50 ◼   ► looks like but I feel like twitterrific

01:04:53 ◼   ► is this new version 5 is going in this

01:04:56 ◼   ► opposite direction of just talking about

01:05:00 ◼   ► the textures and stuff like that sort of

01:05:02 ◼   ► taking them all out and and going in

01:05:05 ◼   ► this minimalist flat

01:05:06 ◼   ► yeah the least chrome you can get away

01:05:10 ◼   ► with and you know it Windows 8 is

01:05:16 ◼   ► obviously in that direction but this

01:05:17 ◼   ► doesn't look anything you know there's

01:05:19 ◼   ► no one way to do it if you know what I

01:05:20 ◼   ► mean yeah it's a similar concept but

01:05:23 ◼   ► it's but it's um it's nicer in the same

01:05:26 ◼   ► way that like is well here's a good

01:05:31 ◼   ► example like the difference between

01:05:32 ◼   ► apples aqua interface and the windows

01:05:36 ◼   ► vista interface which were both largely

01:05:39 ◼   ► based on this sort of plasticky

01:05:41 ◼   ► translucency glass shadows transparency

01:05:46 ◼   ► sort of aesthetic you can go very

01:05:48 ◼   ► different ways with it what I one can

01:05:50 ◼   ► look pretty good in one can

01:05:52 ◼   ► yeah and look like you know you got it

01:05:53 ◼   ► came yeah I there's different ways to do

01:05:56 ◼   ► minimalism 2i and I kind of feel like I

01:06:00 ◼   ► do kind of feel like that's what Jony

01:06:02 ◼   ► ive has been talking about like when is

01:06:03 ◼   ► little hints about the aesthetics of the

01:06:07 ◼   ► OS you know and edited the little sort

01:06:09 ◼   ► of knows quickly made when the guy from

01:06:11 ◼   ► The Guardian asked him about it was the

01:06:13 ◼   ► guardian whoever it was asked him about

01:06:14 ◼   ► this stitched leather you know that is

01:06:17 ◼   ► not really being true to the hardware

01:06:18 ◼   ► twitterrific 5i think is a really

01:06:21 ◼   ► interesting example of that I kind of

01:06:23 ◼   ► feel like like like I contractor has

01:06:25 ◼   ► jumped ahead

01:06:27 ◼   ► of this state-of-the-art for athletics

01:06:29 ◼   ► letterpress is another example of that

01:06:34 ◼   ► you play the last y'all

01:06:35 ◼   ► yeah you have we played yet we have not

01:06:38 ◼   ► played now we probably should

01:06:39 ◼   ► oh man that should be like my new rule

01:06:41 ◼   ► for getting people on the show we gotta

01:06:42 ◼   ► plan to play the letterpress yeah but

01:06:47 ◼   ► yea letterpress is another example of

01:06:49 ◼   ► that and that's you know that's where it

01:06:50 ◼   ► came up in Laurens interview with Erica

01:06:53 ◼   ► you know that there's obviously this

01:06:55 ◼   ► minimalist death aesthetic on but it

01:07:01 ◼   ► doesn't mean undesigned right there's

01:07:03 ◼   ► it's harder to explain because when

01:07:05 ◼   ► something is like a visual texture that

01:07:08 ◼   ► design jumps right out at you where is

01:07:10 ◼   ► it's more about the subtleties

01:07:12 ◼   ► yeah like but when you move tiles around

01:07:15 ◼   ► and letterpress it's not like there's

01:07:16 ◼   ► nothing going on there's something very

01:07:18 ◼   ► fancy going on where it's sort of

01:07:20 ◼   ► jiggles in and it says jaunty little and

01:07:23 ◼   ► even when you fire it up and it does

01:07:24 ◼   ► that little that little rotating yeah

01:07:26 ◼   ► thingamabob whatever it is

01:07:28 ◼   ► yeah you know what that is its that's

01:07:31 ◼   ► the eight bits logo

01:07:32 ◼   ► oh that's right it's eight minutes right

01:07:36 ◼   ► and the way it rotates is it goes seven

01:07:39 ◼   ► times clockwise and then that the eighth

01:07:42 ◼   ► goes counterclockwise and I will go

01:07:44 ◼   ► seven clockwise for the inside sounds

01:07:49 ◼   ► like the thing from Indiana Jones what

01:07:52 ◼   ► will take one take one back 500 got one

01:07:56 ◼   ► back Ilana yeah exactly

01:07:59 ◼   ► they're digging in the wrong place i

01:08:01 ◼   ► gotta play in leather place but anyway

01:08:03 ◼   ► letterpress is another example and again

01:08:04 ◼   ► letterpress and twitterrific five are

01:08:07 ◼   ► both super super distinctive don't look

01:08:10 ◼   ► anything at all like each other really

01:08:11 ◼   ► except that there's a sort of Shh

01:08:15 ◼   ► I don't know there's something to its

01:08:17 ◼   ► kinda hard to talk about but I feel like

01:08:18 ◼   ► there's like a shared sense of this is

01:08:20 ◼   ► where you sensibility yeah yeah and I

01:08:24 ◼   ► really think that they did good work

01:08:26 ◼   ► ethic I feel like congratulations to all

01:08:30 ◼   ► our friends that

01:08:31 ◼   ► yeah an apple seems to get that kind of

01:08:34 ◼   ► me when there was nothing in the

01:08:35 ◼   ► interview was that he was talking about

01:08:37 ◼   ► sort of a whole held up an iphone i

01:08:39 ◼   ► guess this was in the

01:08:40 ◼   ► the maybe the scene with the in the NBC

01:08:43 ◼   ► interview

01:08:44 ◼   ► yeah and he held up the iphone and

01:08:45 ◼   ► talked about with Rocco see how the face

01:08:51 ◼   ► of it is the operating system I forget

01:08:54 ◼   ► exactly what he said but just that it

01:08:57 ◼   ► you know and we've talked about this

01:08:59 ◼   ► before but now it's just it's like a

01:09:00 ◼   ► glass and you just have a glass front

01:09:02 ◼   ► and then you're interacting with the

01:09:04 ◼   ► operating system right there and that's

01:09:05 ◼   ► the that's their design ethic right so I

01:09:16 ◼   ► say we call it show all right i want to

01:09:18 ◼   ► say one thing I never mentioned this is

01:09:20 ◼   ► one thing I just don't mention it hears

01:09:21 ◼   ► that I want to talk about the the

01:09:22 ◼   ► sponsorship anybody out there listens to

01:09:24 ◼   ► the show you got a product or service

01:09:26 ◼   ► that you think the talk show audience

01:09:28 ◼   ► would be interested in

01:09:29 ◼   ► I get in touch i don't really have a

01:09:31 ◼   ► good mechanism for this I have a really

01:09:33 ◼   ► nice little page for during fireball

01:09:34 ◼   ► sponsorships people go there and they

01:09:36 ◼   ► can see the schedule and there's a

01:09:38 ◼   ► little email address i don't have

01:09:39 ◼   ► anything like that for the talk show i

01:09:40 ◼   ► feel like its it i don't know i gotta

01:09:44 ◼   ► set something up but in the meantime

01:09:45 ◼   ► just go to the daring fireball

01:09:47 ◼   ► sponsorship page go to during fireball

01:09:49 ◼   ► click on sponsorships just click the

01:09:50 ◼   ► email there and tell me that you want to

01:09:52 ◼   ► sponsor the talk show instead of daring

01:09:54 ◼   ► fireball on but I've got some good guess

01:09:57 ◼   ► already lined up not molt's good guess

01:09:59 ◼   ► for the next couple of episodes and

01:10:04 ◼   ► there's a couple of sponsorship spots

01:10:05 ◼   ► open on all of them so anybody out there

01:10:08 ◼   ► you got a product or service that that

01:10:10 ◼   ► you want this this audience to know

01:10:12 ◼   ► about get in touch now most thank you

01:10:15 ◼   ► very much for being so yeah

01:10:17 ◼   ► oh you're welcome the best