Roderick on the Line

Ep. 132: "You Cannot Lie to Your Pants"


00:00:00   this episode of Roderick on the line is [TS]

00:00:01   sponsored by threes threes is a tiny [TS]

00:00:04   puzzle that grows on you [TS]

00:00:06   you can play it forever and it will [TS]

00:00:07   always be in your pocket learn more [TS]

00:00:09   about three by searching your app store [TS]

00:00:11   for threes or by visiting threes [TS]

00:00:13   game.com [TS]

00:00:14   [Music] [TS]

00:00:19   hello hi John hi Merlin how's it going [TS]

00:00:23   Jim Dandy [TS]

00:00:26   uh-huh uh-huh that's sweet [TS]

00:00:30   it's going to be upbeat episode of saved [TS]

00:00:32   you're in the universe contingent on us [TS]

00:00:37   um i am wearing my wall pants today [TS]

00:00:41   nice and it is nice except you know that [TS]

00:00:44   first day that you put on the wall pants [TS]

00:00:47   you really have to get used to this [TS]

00:00:49   appealing scratchy yeah i just said it's [TS]

00:00:54   not a planned [TS]

00:00:55   no these are old and they're just full [TS]

00:00:58   as all get-out [TS]

00:01:00   they just took the sheet basically and [TS]

00:01:02   and editor took the insides out and yeah [TS]

00:01:06   right make condoms and pants and uhhh [TS]

00:01:09   yeah it feels good it feels good for [TS]

00:01:12   winter to be here and for it to be like [TS]

00:01:15   time to get down to the nitty-gritty I [TS]

00:01:19   want some different pants today to just [TS]

00:01:21   to mix it up a little bit you know [TS]

00:01:22   different different pair of Levi's you [TS]

00:01:25   mean or well yeah different pair of [TS]

00:01:27   levis 501 this is the the second [TS]

00:01:31   brattiest pair that i own and I wear [TS]

00:01:33   them probably once a quarter because if [TS]

00:01:35   I see somebody from my child's school on [TS]

00:01:37   the street it leaves an impression [TS]

00:01:39   OIC already won Miami ding-dong falls [TS]

00:01:42   out so I can't wear those varieties are [TS]

00:01:44   you i know you know the wear patterns [TS]

00:01:46   every man has different wear patterns on [TS]

00:01:47   his Levi's 501 that are weirdly [TS]

00:01:49   consistent if you notice this [TS]

00:01:51   yeah but you have very different very [TS]

00:01:52   distinctive wear patterns on your pants [TS]

00:01:54   well I know what you're thinking of go [TS]

00:01:56   ahead because I'm doing because the [TS]

00:01:58   phone [TS]

00:01:59   well the phone but also you carry uh are [TS]

00:02:01   you at least you used to carry your [TS]

00:02:04   space pen in your front pocket [TS]

00:02:06   remember that and the space pen leaves a [TS]

00:02:08   lead you know over time you have a BF [TS]

00:02:12   like a a war a worn a Warren space pen [TS]

00:02:16   shadow in their energy in front [TS]

00:02:19   yeah yeah that's mostly from yes you are [TS]

00:02:21   a hundred percent correct time I wear [TS]

00:02:23   patterns are that's a classic I I now [TS]

00:02:25   carry a different kind of pen when I [TS]

00:02:27   carry a pan so it doesn't leave the same [TS]

00:02:28   little bit right exactly the shape [TS]

00:02:32   of the space pen in my right pocket and [TS]

00:02:35   then of course that starts out just [TS]

00:02:36   leaving shape then it leaves a white [TS]

00:02:38   shadow and then of course you get the [TS]

00:02:39   we're so right then it's like it starts [TS]

00:02:41   to break right you get you [TS]

00:02:43   ok here's I if there's one thing to take [TS]

00:02:45   away from this episode today and this [TS]

00:02:46   you cannot lie to your pants your pants [TS]

00:02:49   know the truth about you boy that is the [TS]

00:02:51   truth so many ways today now i have a [TS]

00:02:54   very very clear outline of an iphone 5s [TS]

00:02:57   oh I say pocket right yet but you know [TS]

00:03:00   but it's a.m. and we want to even get [TS]

00:03:02   into more unsavory ways that your jeans [TS]

00:03:04   tell the story but they can trip to [TS]

00:03:06   Germany tobacco back-in-the-day sure [TS]

00:03:08   yeah and did you ever have a you can [TS]

00:03:10   read me like a oh gosh yes I mean I [TS]

00:03:13   think that you could actually probably [TS]

00:03:14   go to county seat and by a kind of a [TS]

00:03:19   fake school can you can wash in your [TS]

00:03:22   laundry just to get the ring for have to [TS]

00:03:24   have the credit for the school i [TS]

00:03:26   remember at other I'm not proud of it [TS]

00:03:29   but it but at a certain point I was very [TS]

00:03:31   opposed to chewing tobacco when I was in [TS]

00:03:33   my young teens because a lot of my [TS]

00:03:36   friends dude in school don't you talk [TS]

00:03:39   about stuff I'm talking about yeah [TS]

00:03:42   copenhagen snuff yeah as opposed to the [TS]

00:03:46   red man like they want to read man no [TS]

00:03:48   and Anna mean it was there was a pretty [TS]

00:03:50   at the time pretty clear divide between [TS]

00:03:51   like guys that should skull who were [TS]

00:03:55   like pussies ya candy asses [TS]

00:03:58   yeah and guys that should cope who were [TS]

00:04:01   like a good normals or redness off [TS]

00:04:03   regard yeah you know who stuffs and this [TS]

00:04:06   was before the advent of all the other [TS]

00:04:08   kinds of of snuff there was no Kodiak at [TS]

00:04:11   the time now they get eaten get some [TS]

00:04:13   hot-ass new yeah I've seen that my dish [TS]

00:04:17   well now I guess there it was called [TS]

00:04:19   some people actually called it's new you [TS]

00:04:22   know [TS]

00:04:23   yes I was probably a grassroots think [TS]

00:04:24   I'm not trying to derail you i type this [TS]

00:04:25   in Florida this was a thing [TS]

00:04:27   it was a very real thing well it was [TS]

00:04:29   very real in in Alaska to and Iraq so I [TS]

00:04:32   was opposed to chewing and I would and I [TS]

00:04:35   was I was kind of a like a you know if [TS]

00:04:38   you can believe this i would Hector my [TS]

00:04:41   friends [TS]

00:04:42   and lecture them about what they were [TS]

00:04:43   doing wrong while you were just crossing [TS]

00:04:46   over for a young age I can't who wanted [TS]

00:04:49   to make women be chased man you an idea [TS]

00:04:52   what he was doing in between your head [TS]

00:04:54   wisdom that's right and so I was like [TS]

00:04:56   you guys cheering tobacco's is terrible [TS]

00:04:59   I you know I disapprove of you sitting [TS]

00:05:02   in the back glass and spitting to into a [TS]

00:05:04   cocaine and I had enough I had enough [TS]

00:05:06   leverage with them not leverage but just [TS]

00:05:10   like you know that they would they would [TS]

00:05:12   try and conceal their chewing from me [TS]

00:05:14   but you can't conceal that from your [TS]

00:05:16   friend but I I really envied the two can [TS]

00:05:21   ring in the back pockets of their genes [TS]

00:05:23   it just had such a nice [TS]

00:05:25   it just said so much you know i mean it [TS]

00:05:29   said upset a lot about a guy had [TS]

00:05:31   signification and so I started carrying [TS]

00:05:34   a toucan as a little wallet as a little [TS]

00:05:42   like Dimebag yeah i would get a life [TS]

00:05:46   hack [TS]

00:05:46   yeah i would put shit in an old shoe can [TS]

00:05:49   that my friend kevin gave me that I [TS]

00:05:51   washed it out and then I would you know [TS]

00:05:53   I'd fold up my money and and notes or [TS]

00:05:58   whatever and I mean you couldn't you [TS]

00:06:00   couldn't use it as a wallet because he [TS]

00:06:01   couldn't put an idea in it but I you [TS]

00:06:03   know I I did for a while I carried it [TS]

00:06:05   around as a little pouch and then I just [TS]

00:06:08   started chewing tobacco and and the rest [TS]

00:06:11   was history [TS]

00:06:11   I get down you know we talked before [TS]

00:06:16   about the other kind of wallet that i [TS]

00:06:17   carry because people care it's one of [TS]

00:06:19   those little taxi taxi driver wallets [TS]

00:06:21   which is not a super thin wallet but it [TS]

00:06:23   really works for me it folds in half [TS]

00:06:25   like a billfold it's got a little class [TS]

00:06:28   breaking point of cars inside very very [TS]

00:06:31   clear outline including down to we can [TS]

00:06:33   see the snap where the snap is iike area [TS]

00:06:36   taxi well to that I originally there [TS]

00:06:40   like that that use this one your I gave [TS]

00:06:42   your mom your mom do [TS]

00:06:44   yeah so you gave it to mom she gave it [TS]

00:06:46   to me I wore it [TS]

00:06:47   no I did that I don't know either she [TS]

00:06:50   was like I don't know why miss Merlin [TS]

00:06:51   gave me a man's wallet but would you [TS]

00:06:52   like [TS]

00:06:53   yeah true and i warn't until it was [TS]

00:06:56   until so that it would it came apart and [TS]

00:07:00   then I was at the thrift store and I [TS]

00:07:01   found a completely unused one [TS]

00:07:04   Wow an identical one to the 1i had I was [TS]

00:07:07   I was you know I was fixing it with tape [TS]

00:07:09   by that point and i found what i was [TS]

00:07:12   just like mom and I actually had to [TS]

00:07:13   fight a Chinese lady for it [TS]

00:07:15   oh man she was like she kind of was [TS]

00:07:17   standing there at the same time and I [TS]

00:07:19   picked it up and I was like check it out [TS]

00:07:20   and she was like I was just about to [TS]

00:07:22   pick that up I was like really you're [TS]

00:07:24   about to pick it up and frog had wings [TS]

00:07:26   you wouldn't doubt that'll happen and [TS]

00:07:28   that's a I don't know about that about [TS]

00:07:30   to pick it up and we SAT and talked [TS]

00:07:32   about it for a while I don't interested [TS]

00:07:34   and legally for that John she was like I [TS]

00:07:36   want you to have it was like are you [TS]

00:07:38   sure [TS]

00:07:40   um here's what I want to get to and and [TS]

00:07:43   so there's all the stuff that goes on in [TS]

00:07:45   the in the belt area that we're not [TS]

00:07:47   going to get into but I this is the [TS]

00:07:50   thing is so strange to me is the wear [TS]

00:07:52   patterns any season shoes I think you [TS]

00:07:55   see this in pants I guess if you weren't [TS]

00:07:57   long enough you see this in a jacket but [TS]

00:07:59   two very distinct asymmetrical wear [TS]

00:08:03   patterns so I mean I guess maybe it's [TS]

00:08:06   kind of obvious you have this with shoes [TS]

00:08:07   because we all like whatever pronator [TS]

00:08:09   we've got some kind of imbalance I'm [TS]

00:08:10   sure chiropractor could give you some [TS]

00:08:11   kind of massage for this but you know [TS]

00:08:14   youryour to shoot you go grab go grab [TS]

00:08:16   four five pairs of shoes you have for [TS]

00:08:18   that you only have had for a few years [TS]

00:08:20   flip over and it's remarkable that the [TS]

00:08:22   wear patterns on the bottom now for me [TS]

00:08:24   that's the knees on the jeans that i [TS]

00:08:26   cannot i don't know why I thought about [TS]

00:08:29   it maybe I figured out but it's so [TS]

00:08:31   strange to me that genes that I've had [TS]

00:08:33   for three four five more years [TS]

00:08:35   ah one knee always starts to wear before [TS]

00:08:38   the other and the other knee then [TS]

00:08:41   consequently blows out for the other and [TS]

00:08:43   gets bigger hole I'll be right for you [TS]

00:08:45   you don't talking about I do and there's [TS]

00:08:47   this on cuffs you'll notice this on [TS]

00:08:49   elbows it's really interesting and [TS]

00:08:51   sherlock holmes probably well obviously [TS]

00:08:52   you're a Scrivener yeah rights right [TS]

00:08:55   remember genuflecting I don't genuflect [TS]

00:08:56   I don't know you're a mincer you mince [TS]

00:08:59   around you know it well maybe not you [TS]

00:09:02   but a certain certain type of person [TS]

00:09:04   mrs. around I do like that [TS]

00:09:05   minutes i think i doing a very masculine [TS]

00:09:07   way yeah it's a masculine mincing but it [TS]

00:09:09   still wear your jeans differently [TS]

00:09:11   yeah I sometimes will as I'm walking [TS]

00:09:17   around i wasn't i was in a mall the [TS]

00:09:19   other day which is not that's not what I [TS]

00:09:21   want to be but as I had to go from one [TS]

00:09:23   into the most of the others a long trip [TS]

00:09:25   across the mall and I'm so as I was [TS]

00:09:29   walking I was consciously trying to [TS]

00:09:33   change my gate [TS]

00:09:36   I was like you didn't spy thing well I [TS]

00:09:40   was point you know I I think I I walk a [TS]

00:09:42   little splayed and I was I don't know it [TS]

00:09:46   if you ever try this but without looking [TS]

00:09:48   at your feet [TS]

00:09:49   particularly if you walks played without [TS]

00:09:53   looking your feet you point your toes in [TS]

00:09:56   and imagine that you are walking sort of [TS]

00:09:59   pigeon-toed and then you look down at [TS]

00:10:02   your feet and yours and you did [TS]

00:10:04   they're not even pointing straight right [TS]

00:10:07   i mean it's so unfamiliar to walk with [TS]

00:10:10   your feet pointing straight and it [TS]

00:10:12   changes everything [TS]

00:10:14   the everything up and down like you your [TS]

00:10:16   hips feel different your whole body [TS]

00:10:18   feels different and when I was walking [TS]

00:10:19   across Europe but i would do that for [TS]

00:10:21   days at a time just be very conscious of [TS]

00:10:23   like I'm just pointing my toes in the [TS]

00:10:25   direction that I'm traveling and and I [TS]

00:10:30   still do it sometimes as a way of you [TS]

00:10:32   know a similar type of thing you look at [TS]

00:10:34   the bottoms of your shoes and you're [TS]

00:10:35   like wow like I'm wearing these shoes [TS]

00:10:37   and such a weird fashion just gonna [TS]

00:10:41   start can I be doing it feels like I'm [TS]

00:10:43   taking a step in another step and [TS]

00:10:44   everything is equal in normal i'm not [TS]

00:10:46   you know averaging out every so many [TS]

00:10:48   years you wouldn't say I'm taking this [TS]

00:10:49   many more right turns and left turns [TS]

00:10:51   frames really strange and yet you know [TS]

00:10:54   there you are because we are all just [TS]

00:10:56   flopping around like nowhere as a [TS]

00:10:58   metrical I don't want to begin to death [TS]

00:11:00   it's the lack of symmetry it's it's own [TS]

00:11:03   is speaking of malls and essentially [TS]

00:11:05   something in the in the robot can see [TS]

00:11:07   that and you let me see let me see one [TS]

00:11:09   here especially i'm curious to get your [TS]

00:11:10   thoughts on this as somebody who follows [TS]

00:11:11   people be the trends in technology [TS]

00:11:15   naps and tell her that you're going [TS]

00:11:17   afternoons [TS]

00:11:18   yeah let's see i see so app trends here [TS]

00:11:22   not let go it is that should be a blue [TS]

00:11:24   thing and they do ya think it's okay and [TS]

00:11:27   it's a link to come from grippy yep so [TS]

00:11:29   my daughter and I would see a movie the [TS]

00:11:31   other day I went to the big mall [TS]

00:11:32   downtown and you know it's a it's [TS]

00:11:35   actually it's a kind of a fancy it's the [TS]

00:11:36   fancy mall downtown like it's a dynamic [TS]

00:11:39   new destination so fancy [TS]

00:11:41   hang on hang on saving go ahead and read [TS]

00:11:44   it but save it [TS]

00:11:45   mmm yeah so you get so fancy that you [TS]

00:11:48   can get off the subway at palace street [TS]

00:11:50   and actually walk in 2000 you don't even [TS]

00:11:53   have to go outside westfield center and [TS]

00:11:55   and so we gots one of my favorite place [TS]

00:11:57   to see movies they've got good seats [TS]

00:11:58   they got great food is a great food [TS]

00:12:00   court and it's a great daddy daughter [TS]

00:12:02   day place to count and one of our stops [TS]

00:12:04   has always been this thing that of [TS]

00:12:06   course used to be a barnes and noble [TS]

00:12:07   then after it wasn't a barnes and noble [TS]

00:12:09   like all places it became a remainder [TS]

00:12:11   bookstore right that's that's the [TS]

00:12:13   Destiny the destiny every barnes and [TS]

00:12:15   noble will ironically enough become a [TS]

00:12:17   remainder bookstore then they started [TS]

00:12:19   adding toys to it so is this great place [TS]

00:12:21   where you can go and you like to dollar [TS]

00:12:22   books puzzles doctor who figures it was [TS]

00:12:25   really a fun place to go [TS]

00:12:26   well I'm story short we show how many [TS]

00:12:29   more new guess what [TS]

00:12:31   something new is moving in it used to be [TS]

00:12:35   a barnes and noble then it was a no-name [TS]

00:12:37   remainder book and toy store now John [TS]

00:12:39   something new and there's a new thought [TS]

00:12:41   technology at westfield center [TS]

00:12:43   ah i think a photo of this it's one of [TS]

00:12:46   those things you see in front of the [TS]

00:12:47   window where something is going to be [TS]

00:12:49   built something you'd be interested in [TS]

00:12:50   talking about it so you know where your [TS]

00:12:53   block off the block off the store as its [TS]

00:12:55   as it's being developed but instead of [TS]

00:12:57   just saying like coming soon and coming [TS]

00:12:59   soon [TS]

00:13:00   casual corner right it's now it's a it's [TS]

00:13:03   sort of a branding opportunity another [TS]

00:13:04   yeah a newer branding opportunity so [TS]

00:13:07   this goes across a whole bunch of [TS]

00:13:09   storefront in front of you you know how [TS]

00:13:11   big a Barnes & Noble is right yeah and [TS]

00:13:13   so i guess and they've chosen a kind of [TS]

00:13:16   gun gun metal gray battleship gray was [TS]

00:13:19   very which is it indicates like [TS]

00:13:21   sleekness and also forward forward pneus [TS]

00:13:25   that was the color of my outie 5000 [TS]

00:13:28   coming on so envious yeah and all and [TS]

00:13:31   what it says I'd like if you don't mind [TS]

00:13:32   I'd like you're reading of the paragraph [TS]

00:13:34   but what it says is bespoke and in a [TS]

00:13:37   very fancy looking sans-serif fonts [TS]

00:13:38   bespoke with for some reason an [TS]

00:13:41   underlying under the B&B spoke and then [TS]

00:13:43   in italics there's a paragraph [TS]

00:13:45   describing what bespoke is or will be [TS]

00:13:47   would you mind sharing that with our [TS]

00:13:48   listeners I i was wondering about why [TS]

00:13:51   the underlying just one letter of [TS]

00:13:53   bespoke and then and I feel like without [TS]

00:13:56   the underline it's possible that you [TS]

00:13:59   might look at that and say the spokie [TS]

00:14:01   beast okay yeah right [TS]

00:14:04   spokeo gorgeous bouquet I mean it's the [TS]

00:14:07   best ok would have a little sante grab [TS]

00:14:10   whatever the SRX on Teague over the e [TS]

00:14:13   but but without with no at with no [TS]

00:14:16   underlining your accent you could look [TS]

00:14:18   at and say spoki right that's what if [TS]

00:14:21   you were an okie from Muskogee would say [TS]

00:14:22   the spokie was naturally ok and and but [TS]

00:14:26   with the but the underlying under the B [TS]

00:14:28   it makes you say be be you right you [TS]

00:14:33   look at you can't be [TS]

00:14:34   yeah and then what are you gonna do and [TS]

00:14:37   usually if you're if you're if you're [TS]

00:14:39   watching war games where you're watching [TS]

00:14:40   some kind of eighties nineties computer [TS]

00:14:42   thriller you would send think that [TS]

00:14:44   that's a prompt sometimes i use the [TS]

00:14:47   blinking underline indicate a problem [TS]

00:14:48   why do you have a prompt under the first [TS]

00:14:51   letter unless you are about to edit it [TS]

00:14:52   right you were about to delete it right [TS]

00:14:54   exactly [TS]

00:14:55   change it to peace pokey yeah but then [TS]

00:14:58   underneath now what what font is that [TS]

00:15:00   the underneath written it's sort of an [TS]

00:15:02   italic that looks kind of like it's a [TS]

00:15:06   fancy Georgia yeah okay and it says [TS]

00:15:09   nestled within the retail epicenter of [TS]

00:15:14   San Francisco sits a dynamic new [TS]

00:15:16   destination colon a community where [TS]

00:15:21   digital innovators collide with the [TS]

00:15:24   world's greatest brands Ivan and dash M [TS]

00:15:30   dash for work and foreplay bomb and then [TS]

00:15:36   under that there's a graphic and it's a [TS]

00:15:39   sort of a flowchart right or what how [TS]

00:15:41   would you describe [TS]

00:15:41   it's three icons inside of circles on a [TS]

00:15:45   horizontal axis and the three icon three [TS]

00:15:49   circles are connected for no apparent [TS]

00:15:51   reason by a line right so co-working and [TS]

00:15:54   that's a what it's like he's on a pc [TS]

00:15:56   with a mouse [TS]

00:15:57   no I think that's a I think that that's [TS]

00:15:59   a mac classic an apple mac classic color [TS]

00:16:03   classic or maybe a lisa it could be i [TS]

00:16:05   think its a Mac Alicia John in addition [TS]

00:16:08   to co-working either any other kinds of [TS]

00:16:09   things to do a bespoke soco working and [TS]

00:16:12   then then align over to just a [TS]

00:16:15   microphone an unplugged microphone about [TS]

00:16:18   it with but we can alert so it's a mic [TS]

00:16:21   that it's like one of those mics you get [TS]

00:16:23   from radioshack that comes with a [TS]

00:16:24   hardwired cord like Bob Pollin Mike yeah [TS]

00:16:27   and it's and it says events events [TS]

00:16:29   events and then another line over to [TS]

00:16:33   some kind of a game controller that [TS]

00:16:35   plays place [TS]

00:16:37   yeah see I don't even play games and I [TS]

00:16:38   can just tell from looking in that it's [TS]

00:16:40   a it's a game with some kind its cord [TS]

00:16:42   that connects to something that I don't [TS]

00:16:44   think you would have had on most gaming [TS]

00:16:46   systems in even the last three to five [TS]

00:16:47   years [TS]

00:16:48   it looks like an looks like some kind of [TS]

00:16:50   Epsom printer but John yeah sure and [TS]

00:16:54   whatever what is that indicates on tech [TS]

00:16:56   demo is Emma so you got a co-working [TS]

00:16:59   offense and tech demos co-working events [TS]

00:17:02   and tech demos at bespoke absolutely [TS]

00:17:05   the URL is at bespoke underscore SF that [TS]

00:17:09   was a freebie for them [TS]

00:17:10   yeah I'm sorry shit we should we should [TS]

00:17:12   retro actively charge [TS]

00:17:14   no I want people to go and look at this [TS]

00:17:15   and scoff at it [TS]

00:17:17   yeah I want I want them to I want them [TS]

00:17:19   to say like why we're getting a lot of [TS]

00:17:20   traffic today [TS]

00:17:21   yeah that's where our numbers are really [TS]

00:17:23   going up and it's just people around the [TS]

00:17:25   world scoffing at them [TS]

00:17:26   well don't think I didn't go um nothing [TS]

00:17:28   about how i went and check out the tooth [TS]

00:17:32   from bespoke SF um and I think it's [TS]

00:17:36   pretty it's pretty inscrutable logitech [TS]

00:17:38   most I don't know CA were shooting fish [TS]

00:17:40   in a barrel but you know it's it's kind [TS]

00:17:42   of hilarious that it used to be a barnes [TS]

00:17:44   and noble thought about you like you [TS]

00:17:46   know back in the lets say by the [TS]

00:17:48   mid-nineties how about this when we got [TS]

00:17:50   a barnes and noble at the tallahassee [TS]

00:17:52   mall in circa [TS]

00:17:54   nineteen ninety two or three whatever it [TS]

00:17:56   was the barnes and noble is expanding [TS]

00:17:57   really quickly [TS]

00:17:58   that was the first starbucks i ever went [TS]

00:18:00   to was a starbucks inside of a barnes [TS]

00:18:02   and noble I mean that's how classy [TS]

00:18:04   barnes and noble was Barnes & Noble [TS]

00:18:06   alongside I guess borders the juggernaut [TS]

00:18:09   you know what has been going on for a [TS]

00:18:11   while but this was probably like 50,000 [TS]

00:18:13   square feet of store and occasionally [TS]

00:18:17   huge you don't remember that they did [TS]

00:18:19   they were driving out all the elbow the [TS]

00:18:22   little children's book stores on the [TS]

00:18:23   upper west side [TS]

00:18:24   I think sometimes they took over [TS]

00:18:27   something like maybe it was like an old [TS]

00:18:29   grocery store like that be like a pantry [TS]

00:18:31   pride type situation when the moment [TS]

00:18:33   refurbished you get a point and noble [TS]

00:18:35   you can't go in there you can buy you [TS]

00:18:37   can buy all kinds of value by playing [TS]

00:18:38   cards you can get coffee you can get a [TS]

00:18:40   Danish they have a giant periodical [TS]

00:18:43   section of barnes and noble down our [TS]

00:18:44   tanforan mall two stories including a [TS]

00:18:47   giant toy section right and children's [TS]

00:18:51   books and records they were someone to [TS]

00:18:53   stand right there is not a single [TS]

00:18:55   big-box bookstore in downtown San [TS]

00:18:58   Francisco other thing is i would use to [TS]

00:19:00   go into those places and I would I I [TS]

00:19:02   didn't know what I didn't know that they [TS]

00:19:05   weren't for me right they were not they [TS]

00:19:07   were not built for me I would walk [TS]

00:19:09   around and I would end up I will go [TS]

00:19:11   upstairs i would go downstairs I would [TS]

00:19:13   walk around walk around and eventually I [TS]

00:19:15   would buy a paperback copy of Plato's [TS]

00:19:17   Republic just to give myself something [TS]

00:19:19   to do and then I would you know give [TS]

00:19:23   that to a homeless guy because i feel [TS]

00:19:25   that that is that that plate it starts [TS]

00:19:27   the path to recovery starts with Plato [TS]

00:19:29   and mashed potatoes but first I want to [TS]

00:19:32   talk about a cave [TS]

00:19:33   are you listening and their attention to [TS]

00:19:35   get out until I would go away and I [TS]

00:19:37   wouldn't go back or you know everyone [TS]

00:19:38   for everyone so why would buy one of [TS]

00:19:39   those artists models the little wood [TS]

00:19:42   articulated men puts it on the tables a [TS]

00:19:46   present for creative people who are [TS]

00:19:48   being creative [TS]

00:19:48   that's it on the end tables in the homes [TS]

00:19:51   of interesting people i would buy one of [TS]

00:19:53   those and then give it as a gift that's [TS]

00:19:56   what I mean even I see I've always loved [TS]

00:19:59   just spending two hours in a store like [TS]

00:20:00   that but what I will say no matter who [TS]

00:20:01   you are it's great for Christmas gifts [TS]

00:20:03   because it is really sure if you don't [TS]

00:20:04   care that much [TS]

00:20:06   who you're buying for especially you can [TS]

00:20:07   find something for anybody there [TS]

00:20:09   listen the other day I i was on a [TS]

00:20:13   website called Instagram a web site okay [TS]

00:20:18   and I don't know if you are familiar [TS]

00:20:21   with jet Jessica cowan lady who works [TS]

00:20:26   for Squarespace our once and future [TS]

00:20:29   sponsor who and she sent me and a [TS]

00:20:33   message on Squarespace is our on [TS]

00:20:36   Instagram for Instagram website saying [TS]

00:20:40   there's a guy who is taking tintype [TS]

00:20:43   photographs in your town today he's at [TS]

00:20:48   itinerant tintype ER traveling the world [TS]

00:20:52   with his giant camera doing real tintype [TS]

00:20:56   photos and he and he's looking for [TS]

00:21:00   people [TS]

00:21:01   local talent he's looking for talent [TS]

00:21:04   people to look old timey and so I went I [TS]

00:21:07   so i contacted this guy was like I [TS]

00:21:09   wanted type photograph and he was like [TS]

00:21:10   come on down to seattle pioneer square [TS]

00:21:13   and I got down there I expected him to [TS]

00:21:16   be wearing a a bowler hat and a mustache [TS]

00:21:20   but he was not he was wearing either and [TS]

00:21:23   he was taking tintype photograph with [TS]

00:21:25   this camera that he kind of built [TS]

00:21:26   himself and he was using eat he was [TS]

00:21:32   using an alcove in a space that as I [TS]

00:21:34   looked around turned out to be one of [TS]

00:21:37   these co-working spaces right yeah have [TS]

00:21:42   you ever been to one of these let's say [TS]

00:21:44   about co-working yeah it's a it's a [TS]

00:21:46   co-working space it's like a floor of a [TS]

00:21:48   building and people are they're doing [TS]

00:21:49   stuff on laptops [TS]

00:21:50   yeah and so and there's a woman there [TS]

00:21:53   who represents the co-working place and [TS]

00:21:56   she started and I was like tell me about [TS]

00:21:58   your co-working space and she started [TS]

00:21:59   giving me this meal and this co-working [TS]

00:22:02   space had something there was some angle [TS]

00:22:04   right where it was like where they were [TS]

00:22:08   certainly telling me but I think also [TS]

00:22:11   telling themselves that it was [TS]

00:22:15   some aspect of their co-working space [TS]

00:22:18   was in the public good [TS]

00:22:20   there was a public-interest angle where [TS]

00:22:23   they were nonprofits or when i see they [TS]

00:22:26   were they were trying to trying to make [TS]

00:22:30   the world a better place all doing their [TS]

00:22:31   part there yet right but I I toward the [TS]

00:22:34   space and it was full of people i mean [TS]

00:22:38   every seat was taken and they were all [TS]

00:22:41   people on their laptops and I looked at [TS]

00:22:43   their laptops and they all appear to be [TS]

00:22:45   using windows 95 and they were all I [TS]

00:22:49   don't know didn't say I didn't see any [TS]

00:22:51   public interest work it's all just [TS]

00:22:54   seemed like people trying to polish [TS]

00:22:56   their resumes or I'm not sure what kind [TS]

00:22:58   of work was going on in there but i was [TS]

00:23:00   astonished that in the middle of the [TS]

00:23:02   afternoon that people would choose to [TS]

00:23:05   pay to be in this environment and I came [TS]

00:23:11   out of that I came out of that [TS]

00:23:12   experience both with a tintype [TS]

00:23:14   photograph of myself and also a new [TS]

00:23:17   curiosity about this co-working movement [TS]

00:23:22   that was my first exposure to it [TS]

00:23:25   oh really but well I don't have I don't [TS]

00:23:28   have I mean I don't work [TS]

00:23:32   it's interact with people who work yeah [TS]

00:23:34   it was just in the in the kind of I [TS]

00:23:37   guess I want to see in the tech world [TS]

00:23:38   it's something that's really taken off [TS]

00:23:40   over the years where you know for for [TS]

00:23:44   obvious economic reasons I mean let's [TS]

00:23:45   look at what is it really [TS]

00:23:47   it's like having an office combined with [TS]

00:23:49   having roommates like you don't really [TS]

00:23:51   need to go lease your own floor of an [TS]

00:23:54   office you don't have to go through a [TS]

00:23:55   leak and all that stuff [TS]

00:23:56   all you really need is a desk somewhere [TS]

00:23:57   there's a bunch of places but wouldn't [TS]

00:24:00   you just go to a cafe I guess is my [TS]

00:24:02   question and I think that's a very good [TS]

00:24:04   question and that's that's why to jump [TS]

00:24:07   to the cut to the chase to me that's not [TS]

00:24:10   how I would ever work i would not get [TS]

00:24:12   any work done in a place like that i [TS]

00:24:15   mean you know to me having an office is [TS]

00:24:17   good and bad because I place to put on [TS]

00:24:18   my shit like that i like having all my [TS]

00:24:20   shit that's good but even if you just [TS]

00:24:22   bring a laptop I cannot imagine a more [TS]

00:24:24   purpose built environment [TS]

00:24:26   for distraction and unnecessary noise [TS]

00:24:30   and movement just in my head like to [TS]

00:24:32   meet the point of having a place to work [TS]

00:24:33   in this is it again just goes to show [TS]

00:24:34   how old I am is I I've had opportunities [TS]

00:24:36   to go work at places in town where I've [TS]

00:24:39   gotten you know offers from really nice [TS]

00:24:41   places like a writing desk your twitter [TS]

00:24:43   at one point I almost got a place at [TS]

00:24:44   Twitter so this is great [TS]

00:24:45   I'll go to south park every day before i [TS]

00:24:47   got an office like five years ago six [TS]

00:24:49   years ago when I think I saw like Jason [TS]

00:24:51   Goldman there's like he's okay yeah we [TS]

00:24:53   got such up here and I was like this is [TS]

00:24:54   really nice but boys and four laps you [TS]

00:24:58   know like 1,100 bucks a month or [TS]

00:24:59   something you don't get it [TS]

00:25:01   no it wasn't that much now wasn't that [TS]

00:25:02   good but it was it was you know they're [TS]

00:25:03   gonna come here break or something but [TS]

00:25:04   anyway it would be really cool to work [TS]

00:25:06   at a you know one side all these cool [TS]

00:25:09   people but that to me people throwing a [TS]

00:25:11   ball [TS]

00:25:11   there's music going on a 2 up to a place [TS]

00:25:14   they're all like you see me uniquely [TS]

00:25:16   inappropriate for a large number of [TS]

00:25:18   people to be doing something quiet in [TS]

00:25:20   you notice that the I think there's [TS]

00:25:22   actually a lot of the time I feel like [TS]

00:25:25   arm i feel like if i were in an [TS]

00:25:29   environment like that i would just it [TS]

00:25:31   would be a personal challenge for me to [TS]

00:25:35   try and distract everyone else as much [TS]

00:25:39   as I could like I would just go from [TS]

00:25:40   desk to desk and be like hey what are [TS]

00:25:42   you working on [TS]

00:25:42   so how long you been how long you been [TS]

00:25:45   in Seattle and I would I just couldn't I [TS]

00:25:48   wouldn't be there to work i would be [TS]

00:25:50   there to socialize and to meet these [TS]

00:25:54   people and and find the interesting [TS]

00:25:55   things about them and and it just it if [TS]

00:25:58   you if you're going to work i would [TS]

00:26:00   think you would want to be in a in [TS]

00:26:02   seclusion but then that's my mind that's [TS]

00:26:05   the funny part is it's a kid's true both [TS]

00:26:07   ways i would be equal online media equal [TS]

00:26:08   parts but depending on the day i went on [TS]

00:26:10   the one hand be probably pretty annoyed [TS]

00:26:13   with how much movement activity and [TS]

00:26:16   noise there was because that's what it [TS]

00:26:17   is it's a bunch of people in a room [TS]

00:26:19   doing stuff while on the other hand I [TS]

00:26:20   could just also see myself walking up [TS]

00:26:22   and stand by somebody's desk and talking [TS]

00:26:23   to him for two hours so maybe the worst [TS]

00:26:25   of both worlds [TS]

00:26:26   I guess it works i guess it works for [TS]

00:26:28   some people but I said I i'm with you i [TS]

00:26:30   can see needing to get out of the house [TS]

00:26:32   wanting to get out of the house but i'm [TS]

00:26:35   not sure i understand how much more that [TS]

00:26:36   offers then you know then [TS]

00:26:39   then I cafe and I have friends who have [TS]

00:26:41   tried to do podcasts inside a place like [TS]

00:26:42   that [TS]

00:26:43   Wow which is like you know trying to do [TS]

00:26:45   like in the CNN NEWSROOM or something [TS]

00:26:47   well do you were so I was thinking about [TS]

00:26:50   this the other day when I was first [TS]

00:26:52   starting on out in music in seattle the [TS]

00:26:55   biggest challenge that as I perceived it [TS]

00:26:58   at the time was to find a space like a [TS]

00:27:01   practice like a shed that was the that [TS]

00:27:03   was the the biggest the biggest obstacle [TS]

00:27:08   and i had a friend named Rhys Lamb who [TS]

00:27:12   was a painter and reese was really good [TS]

00:27:16   at that he knew he knew all the people [TS]

00:27:21   in the sort of up in underground seattle [TS]

00:27:25   and i don't mean the where you go on the [TS]

00:27:27   tour of underground seattle but like he [TS]

00:27:29   knew all the people living in the in the [TS]

00:27:33   holes and recent always had a place to [TS]

00:27:36   paint because he every time you run into [TS]

00:27:40   me be like oh yeah man i'm painting them [TS]

00:27:43   in this garage down in the ne you know [TS]

00:27:46   down in the central district i met a guy [TS]

00:27:48   who really repairs old refrigerators or [TS]

00:27:51   I met a guy that you know makes rubber [TS]

00:27:53   bands and he's got this space in the [TS]

00:27:56   corner of his plan that you'd go down [TS]

00:27:58   there and it would be an uninsulated [TS]

00:27:59   corner of a steel frame building and [TS]

00:28:04   rhys would be in there painting and time [TS]

00:28:07   and time again i would say hey you know [TS]

00:28:10   Reese like can you think of any place in [TS]

00:28:15   your network of spaces that would you [TS]

00:28:17   know that i could convert it to a band [TS]

00:28:19   practice base and he would get all [TS]

00:28:20   suspicious and you're like well man I [TS]

00:28:23   mean bands are so loud and you know and [TS]

00:28:26   he was afraid that if he hooked me up [TS]

00:28:29   with some space and I turn it into a [TS]

00:28:32   band practice space it was just going to [TS]

00:28:33   attract attention to the whole [TS]

00:28:35   underground economy then somebody's [TS]

00:28:37   gonna be like what's that making all [TS]

00:28:39   that noise over there and then you like [TS]

00:28:40   just a couple clicks out of a meth lab [TS]

00:28:42   yeah there's not it's not good for the [TS]

00:28:44   environment to attract attention rock [TS]

00:28:46   band and then yeah then the cops come [TS]

00:28:48   around and they're like we're just gonna [TS]

00:28:49   start busting all these old buildings [TS]

00:28:51   and then the rubber band guys out of [TS]

00:28:53   work frigerator got a man it's all [TS]

00:28:56   because of me that rubber band man is [TS]

00:28:59   such a good song [TS]

00:29:00   god that's a great song crazy wonderful [TS]

00:29:04   but i but but then so then there was you [TS]

00:29:08   know and they were always like shared [TS]

00:29:10   band practice basis but but it was like [TS]

00:29:14   he had to know somebody they were always [TS]

00:29:16   full to overflowing I couldn't find a [TS]

00:29:19   space and then my friend Peter took a [TS]

00:29:23   job as a custodian at a theater company [TS]

00:29:27   that was occupying an old funeral home [TS]

00:29:32   Wow Peter was there custodian in [TS]

00:29:37   exchange for them letting him live in [TS]

00:29:41   one of the outbuildings which was a the [TS]

00:29:43   garage where they kept the hearses and [TS]

00:29:46   it was an onion uninsulated her sera JH [TS]

00:29:50   well I understand this so he's got a [TS]

00:29:52   place to do is stuff and a place to live [TS]

00:29:54   mhm i got what can imagine being in your [TS]

00:29:57   early twenties and coming into something [TS]

00:29:59   like that [TS]

00:29:59   well I can't imagine the eighties movie [TS]

00:30:02   where you get to have an entire loft [TS]

00:30:03   yourself for fifty dollars a month [TS]

00:30:04   oh my i was i was standing right next to [TS]

00:30:06   Peter when it happened I was like hey [TS]

00:30:07   this is incredible you know let me help [TS]

00:30:10   you fix this place up so Peter was [TS]

00:30:13   pretty handy and we took the garage door [TS]

00:30:15   off and we took it off we took all the [TS]

00:30:19   hardware off the garage door and built [TS]

00:30:22   it so that it was just a wall it still [TS]

00:30:24   looked like a garage door but it was a [TS]

00:30:25   wall it didn't open anymore [TS]

00:30:27   that would have been my choice but that [TS]

00:30:29   was Peters idea and then we cut a door [TS]

00:30:31   in the side and we found one of those [TS]

00:30:33   old sort of patchwork metal doors from [TS]

00:30:38   an industrial you know it was kind of [TS]

00:30:40   leaning against side of a building and [TS]

00:30:42   yeah it looks like a refrigerator like [TS]

00:30:44   decorated area door [TS]

00:30:46   Yeah Yeah right we found one of those [TS]

00:30:47   and and and and hung it in the side of [TS]

00:30:50   this building and then we went in and [TS]

00:30:52   got a bunch of futons and drilled holes [TS]

00:30:57   in the futons and put bolts and washers [TS]

00:31:00   and then we could hang the futons over [TS]

00:31:03   the windows and we found a bunch of [TS]

00:31:06   insulation somewhere and and borrow a [TS]

00:31:10   ladder and got up and insulated this [TS]

00:31:11   whole building and it was like this [TS]

00:31:12   amazing space and i worked on it with [TS]

00:31:15   Peter for several months making it into [TS]

00:31:19   like the ultimate bachelor pad practice [TS]

00:31:24   space and it was a huge garage found [TS]

00:31:28   some couches some carpets he was living [TS]

00:31:30   there and he was a he was kind of an a [TS]

00:31:33   tidy guy he would wake up in the morning [TS]

00:31:35   and make his bed and put some throw [TS]

00:31:38   pillows on it so it looks like a couch [TS]

00:31:40   I don't know what he thought he was he [TS]

00:31:43   never entertained indignantly just take [TS]

00:31:45   what he had he had a personal dignity [TS]

00:31:47   that's right he was German and his [TS]

00:31:49   parents had like eight brothers and [TS]

00:31:50   sisters and he just he made his bed in [TS]

00:31:52   the morning but so then he put a bit he [TS]

00:31:55   had a band i had a band and we started [TS]

00:31:57   practicing in this space and right away [TS]

00:31:59   the relationship went started this hour [TS]

00:32:03   now and Peter was like you know you know [TS]

00:32:07   this is my house this is my home [TS]

00:32:09   you guys are practicing in and leaving [TS]

00:32:11   your chook to spit cans lying around and [TS]

00:32:14   you're you know when you're your [TS]

00:32:16   marijuana reefers and and I was like [TS]

00:32:20   what do you mean this is your house like [TS]

00:32:21   this is the this is the fantasy we've [TS]

00:32:23   always had like it's a bit sup it's like [TS]

00:32:25   a clubhouse [TS]

00:32:26   yeah why would use ownership and [TS]

00:32:28   something so cool that he's like not [TS]

00:32:31   club is not your Clubhouse it's my [TS]

00:32:34   Clubhouse [TS]

00:32:35   I was like you're getting this place for [TS]

00:32:37   free for like not even being a janitor [TS]

00:32:39   over at the theatre company anyway it [TS]

00:32:43   got very contentious and and and and [TS]

00:32:47   reflecting back on it I realized that I [TS]

00:32:49   was I was taken over i was taken over [TS]

00:32:52   his his his private little space and so [TS]

00:32:57   I went over to the theater company and I [TS]

00:32:58   was like listen I'm not going to be your [TS]

00:33:00   janitor but he got he got a couple [TS]

00:33:01   outbuildings here so i got a couple [TS]

00:33:03   additional outbuildings [TS]

00:33:05   let me have one and A and they were like [TS]

00:33:11   you know we do it we have this space [TS]

00:33:12   over here that we were going to read to [TS]

00:33:13   a guy who was a motorcycle repair guy [TS]

00:33:16   but if you're a band if your artists [TS]

00:33:20   like we're a theater company we are we [TS]

00:33:22   are promised on helping people make art [TS]

00:33:25   and so they gave me this cinder block [TS]

00:33:29   garage that you know was moldy and [TS]

00:33:35   covered with oil and I and my band [TS]

00:33:38   having just helped Peter fix up his we [TS]

00:33:41   spent three four months fixing up this [TS]

00:33:45   garage and we actually took the garage [TS]

00:33:46   door out and built a cinderblock wall [TS]

00:33:48   just a lot by the Richard Hugo house [TS]

00:33:51   yeah wow that's so cool so the theater [TS]

00:33:54   company then sold itself to the Richard [TS]

00:33:57   Hugo house and I i continued a [TS]

00:34:02   relationship with them i was sort of [TS]

00:34:04   grandfathered in and they were like we [TS]

00:34:06   would much rather use that space to make [TS]

00:34:08   literary arts but i suppose since you've [TS]

00:34:11   been here and you did all this work you [TS]

00:34:13   can continue to be a rock band there [TS]

00:34:14   god this is like this is a different [TS]

00:34:16   century yeah and it is still a rock band [TS]

00:34:20   space to this day it was handed down [TS]

00:34:22   from us to a series of bands at one [TS]

00:34:30   point there's somebody will not [TS]

00:34:32   thermalright somebody kind of super [TS]

00:34:34   famous there for a while right [TS]

00:34:35   yeah there were there were there were [TS]

00:34:36   there were famous 'as there i think [TS]

00:34:39   various bands that that went in and out [TS]

00:34:41   of that space that we're all connected [TS]

00:34:44   by sort of a family relationship to to [TS]

00:34:48   me 20 years before and I don't need your [TS]

00:34:52   bastard rock children [TS]

00:34:54   yeah I don't know who's in there now but [TS]

00:34:56   the Richard Hugo house just announced [TS]

00:34:57   that they sold the entire quarter of a [TS]

00:35:00   block all of the outbuildings in the [TS]

00:35:03   funeral home and everything to some [TS]

00:35:07   developers who are going to put in a [TS]

00:35:08   tower condo tower all really it's all [TS]

00:35:13   going to get all going to go away [TS]

00:35:15   all the all the history all the blood [TS]

00:35:17   and sweat and songs and marijuana [TS]

00:35:20   reefers reefers & Peters Peters Peters [TS]

00:35:24   throwing bullets Peters lost the youth [TS]

00:35:27   and my lost youth and the the first [TS]

00:35:29   performance ever of unsalted butter and [TS]

00:35:31   it's all just going to get back hold [TS]

00:35:33   into the basement of a of some kind of [TS]

00:35:37   condo fucking tears and rain [TS]

00:35:39   yeah that's right now I'm Sean well you [TS]

00:35:41   know I guess good for Richard Hugo house [TS]

00:35:43   I mean that their margins probably [TS]

00:35:44   pretty thin they probably don't they [TS]

00:35:46   probably don't get a lot of people [TS]

00:35:47   pounding in there like that show me the [TS]

00:35:49   trout [TS]

00:35:49   well you know the story of the Richard [TS]

00:35:51   you go house was thank you i don't know [TS]

00:35:53   but I you know he's my second favorite [TS]

00:35:55   American poet i do know that and and [TS]

00:35:57   like all like a whole healthy boys i [TS]

00:36:01   have a list well and like you know like [TS]

00:36:03   all good American friends you and I both [TS]

00:36:05   have shared with one another are our top [TS]

00:36:07   four or five American poets but I [TS]

00:36:10   respect you know weird is that weird [TS]

00:36:13   it's something everybody that's [TS]

00:36:14   absolutely not we show each other and [TS]

00:36:16   then there you know it's not yeah you [TS]

00:36:18   would like your friend or you're like am [TS]

00:36:19   visiting seattle can we go by the [TS]

00:36:21   literary arts center that celebrates the [TS]

00:36:23   work of my second favorite American poet [TS]

00:36:25   and i was like hey I happen to have some [TS]

00:36:27   friends there like needed and let's go [TS]

00:36:29   i'm curious but the Richard Hugo house [TS]

00:36:32   was funded by some rich people some one [TS]

00:36:36   of the you know the first generation of [TS]

00:36:37   Microsoft and Amazon multi millionaires [TS]

00:36:39   in this town back when they were [TS]

00:36:42   millionaires already but the town was [TS]

00:36:45   still pretty shabby and real estate was [TS]

00:36:48   cheap [TS]

00:36:49   right right uh it was talking about this [TS]

00:36:51   i mean we can't assume everybody's heard [TS]

00:36:53   every episode of the show I mean you [TS]

00:36:54   know it sounds like a sinister in a [TS]

00:36:57   similar way to san francisco obviously [TS]

00:36:58   in its own way but what Seattle has in [TS]

00:37:01   your lifetime seen some massive changes [TS]

00:37:05   yeah yeah yeah yeah well and and not [TS]

00:37:08   even in my lifetime I mean they're what [TS]

00:37:09   is it makes it a tragedy is that [TS]

00:37:13   the changes started after i was already [TS]

00:37:15   aware of real estate right i mean i [TS]

00:37:19   remember standing on the tragedy it's [TS]

00:37:21   you didn't get in on it [TS]

00:37:23   yeah and away I remember standing on [TS]

00:37:25   your mommy and your mom did pretty well [TS]

00:37:26   with that [TS]

00:37:27   well no not really not considering what [TS]

00:37:30   we could have done right i mean you [TS]

00:37:32   could there were there was a time in [TS]

00:37:33   nineteen ninety five or six when you [TS]

00:37:35   could still buy a like a lot right [TS]

00:37:39   undeveloped lot within 10 minutes of [TS]

00:37:44   walking distance from downtown you can [TS]

00:37:47   buy it a like a a quarter-acre abandoned [TS]

00:37:52   lot for $20,000 don't and this you know [TS]

00:37:56   and and they were kind of all over the [TS]

00:37:58   place and the reason was that from [TS]

00:38:00   nineteen that's like four or five months [TS]

00:38:02   rent for and people who are new to San [TS]

00:38:04   Francisco [TS]

00:38:05   Yeah Yeah Yeah right and and and and [TS]

00:38:07   nobody saw it coming [TS]

00:38:09   even though i did see it but it was very [TS]

00:38:13   hard to convince people because from [TS]

00:38:16   1972 1995 that lot was never a lot [TS]

00:38:21   didn't change in value and Robbie it [TS]

00:38:24   probably was costly to maintain keep the [TS]

00:38:25   insurance i'm clean up the needles [TS]

00:38:27   yeah you got it was probably more more [TS]

00:38:29   costs and benefits got you gotta pay the [TS]

00:38:31   taxes [TS]

00:38:32   yeah there's nothing else and so it's [TS]

00:38:34   like oh well that was twenty thousand [TS]

00:38:36   dollars and one across the street was [TS]

00:38:37   twelve thousand dollars in that lot up [TS]

00:38:39   there you know that whole like corner [TS]

00:38:40   lot was twenty-four thousand dollars and [TS]

00:38:44   450 thousand dollars you could have [TS]

00:38:48   bought what would what would ultimately [TS]

00:38:49   be 20 million dollars in real-estate now [TS]

00:38:52   because they are the developers now are [TS]

00:38:55   going through that neighborhood and [TS]

00:38:56   tearing down three-story brick apartment [TS]

00:38:59   buildings in order to build you know [TS]

00:39:02   they're tearing down a [TS]

00:39:03   five-million-dollar building in order to [TS]

00:39:04   build a fifty-million-dollar old-growth [TS]

00:39:06   the beams [TS]

00:39:07   oh yeah they just goes right in the [TS]

00:39:09   dumpster but and I did see it coming [TS]

00:39:11   because I could i looked around and i [TS]

00:39:13   was like well wait a minute [TS]

00:39:15   um is that you you can buy a house and [TS]

00:39:19   in the center of Seattle [TS]

00:39:22   for $50,000 who [TS]

00:39:25   and yet the world's richest man lives [TS]

00:39:28   here and not only that but this is the [TS]

00:39:32   only this this will one day soon be the [TS]

00:39:35   last livable place I've been to Los [TS]

00:39:38   Angeles I know what it I know what's [TS]

00:39:40   going on down there you know that this [TS]

00:39:42   was all evident 15 years ago but I [TS]

00:39:45   didn't have any resources and I didn't [TS]

00:39:46   have any I didn't have the Moxie you [TS]

00:39:51   know and and and and you have it's the [TS]

00:39:54   wisdom of retrospect I can look back now [TS]

00:39:56   and say like I knew it then and I should [TS]

00:39:58   have devoted all my energy to it but in [TS]

00:40:01   fact i was trying to I was trying to [TS]

00:40:04   write songs and being a band i didn't [TS]

00:40:05   want to be a real estate developer if [TS]

00:40:07   you're right you know if you but like [TS]

00:40:08   you know sometimes sometimes you even if [TS]

00:40:10   it's something in plain sight [TS]

00:40:11   there's nothing that ever gets you to do [TS]

00:40:14   something about it it's hard to explain [TS]

00:40:15   what I've idolized i'm fond of saying [TS]

00:40:17   it's difficult for me to try to explain [TS]

00:40:19   to people why didn't do something [TS]

00:40:20   Yeah Yeah Yeah right that's what the [TS]

00:40:22   caricature he calls the trigger account [TS]

00:40:24   think again he can't you can't prove a [TS]

00:40:27   negative but anyway Richard Hugo house [TS]

00:40:28   these people were the were newly minted [TS]

00:40:32   millionaires and they went into Capitol [TS]

00:40:36   Hill's ritzy neighborhood and there is a [TS]

00:40:42   particular house right across the street [TS]

00:40:43   from the Cornish College of the Arts [TS]

00:40:45   that is a massive and beautiful gracious [TS]

00:40:51   home but it's right on a busy street and [TS]

00:40:58   it's one of those beautiful homes that [TS]

00:40:59   when it was built and every once in a [TS]

00:41:02   while a guy would would putter by in a [TS]

00:41:04   one cylinder car pop up and go people [TS]

00:41:08   you know it was like oh that's charming [TS]

00:41:13   right we we have put our are big home on [TS]

00:41:16   the main street because we're Marty [TS]

00:41:18   McFly's family lived in 1955 line [TS]

00:41:21   estates or whatever me but maybe you [TS]

00:41:27   know because it made because the guy who [TS]

00:41:28   was bringing the milk on the horse-drawn [TS]

00:41:30   cart [TS]

00:41:31   a that kind of like busyness of the [TS]

00:41:36   street did not [TS]

00:41:37   it didn't impact your enjoyment of your [TS]

00:41:40   home right right the streetcar went by [TS]

00:41:42   somebody wrote by on a on a giant [TS]

00:41:46   bicycle a penny farthing or whatever but [TS]

00:41:49   there was no like being on a busy street [TS]

00:41:51   was not it was not disadvantageous and [TS]

00:41:54   now there's this big beautiful gracious [TS]

00:41:56   home but all day long is just round [TS]

00:41:59   round round buses and cars and and it's [TS]

00:42:03   just not it doesn't have it doesn't have [TS]

00:42:06   enough seclusion right so there's a [TS]

00:42:08   beautiful home but but but it's it's [TS]

00:42:10   such a big pile of of luxurious finishes [TS]

00:42:16   that even though it's on a busy street [TS]

00:42:19   you couldn't afford to live there unless [TS]

00:42:21   you were a rich person and if you were a [TS]

00:42:24   rich person why would you want to live [TS]

00:42:25   there so the Richard Hugo house people [TS]

00:42:29   initially went to that neighborhood and [TS]

00:42:32   they were like we're gonna buy this [TS]

00:42:33   house and it made perfect sense it was [TS]

00:42:36   like it was this fantastic place and big [TS]

00:42:40   entry hall a staircase that you could [TS]

00:42:44   take a team of horses up and I just [TS]

00:42:49   screamed literary arts center and then [TS]

00:42:52   it in an early example of sort of [TS]

00:42:55   Seattle NIMBY the other the old rich [TS]

00:42:59   people who lived in the in the gracious [TS]

00:43:01   homes right around there were all like [TS]

00:43:03   what we don't want but we're all these [TS]

00:43:06   literary arts people going to park [TS]

00:43:08   are you kidding we don't want to lose [TS]

00:43:10   some kind of literary can't imagine a [TS]

00:43:13   better neighbor that's going to invite [TS]

00:43:15   people that wear feathers for jewelry [TS]

00:43:21   that a literary arts you're gonna hear [TS]

00:43:24   those pencils scratching and neighbor [TS]

00:43:28   gave up together and kept the hugo house [TS]

00:43:34   from being able to buy it they it wasn't [TS]

00:43:38   just a grassroots campaign they actually [TS]

00:43:40   went to the city and said this [TS]

00:43:41   neighborhood is not zoned for this kind [TS]

00:43:45   of of questionable commercial artistic [TS]

00:43:50   use and so so they chase Richard you go [TS]

00:43:55   out out and and that your house bought [TS]

00:43:57   that funeral home kind of like it was [TS]

00:43:59   pretty far down on there it was left [TS]

00:44:04   their fourth choice or whatever [TS]

00:44:05   by the time by the time they were able [TS]

00:44:07   to get that place there like listen we [TS]

00:44:09   just need to buy a place and I think if [TS]

00:44:13   i recall correctly they they bought that [TS]

00:44:16   entire lot and funeral home and [TS]

00:44:19   everything for a million bucks and i'm [TS]

00:44:23   sure i'm absolutely sure that it's it [TS]

00:44:25   it's a ten-million-dollar piece of real [TS]

00:44:27   estate now or more [TS]

00:44:29   I know goodness $59 so they didn't do [TS]

00:44:32   too badly but I still drive past that [TS]

00:44:37   big beautiful home across from the [TS]

00:44:39   Cornish College of the Arts and think it [TS]

00:44:44   if this i mean one day this will be a [TS]

00:44:47   literary arts center if I have my way [TS]

00:44:49   when I am an old man i will come here [TS]

00:44:52   and i will turn this into a literary [TS]

00:44:54   arts center just despite the ghosts of [TS]

00:44:58   those people because it's AI mean when [TS]

00:45:01   that house was built someone had the [TS]

00:45:03   someone recently probably wrote literary [TS]

00:45:07   arts center in chalk on a beam it was [TS]

00:45:10   meant for that so mad [TS]

00:45:14   that's funny also because um you know [TS]

00:45:17   you would want in a guy down but so much [TS]

00:45:20   what he wrote about that some memorable [TS]

00:45:21   arm he had a real eye for just all kinds [TS]

00:45:26   of stuff and Pacific Northwest but one [TS]

00:45:29   of the things that makes him a good poet [TS]

00:45:31   I for a lot of different kinds of stuff [TS]

00:45:33   what [TS]

00:45:33   I mean you know he's famous you if you [TS]

00:45:35   first became famous for his fish bones [TS]

00:45:37   whatever but like the stuff is that I [TS]

00:45:39   enjoy and remember the most is enough [TS]

00:45:41   about like tumbledown Western towns just [TS]

00:45:44   kind of and you know kind of analogies [TS]

00:45:47   for life falling apart that you go and [TS]

00:45:50   visit [TS]

00:45:50   it's kind of funny though that like that [TS]

00:45:52   to me is what he has to write a [TS]

00:45:53   wonderful book on writing that i can [TS]

00:45:55   highly recommend called the triggering [TS]

00:45:56   town [TS]

00:45:56   I like your love Richard Hugo is one of [TS]

00:45:59   my favorite loves and there's so many [TS]

00:46:01   things in my life I will talk about John [TS]

00:46:03   because it bores other people and [TS]

00:46:04   portable what I talk about what poets i [TS]

00:46:05   like it makes me so excited you know [TS]

00:46:07   he's really the rich man's by which i [TS]

00:46:10   mean poor man's but a carver you know [TS]

00:46:14   what I mean like he's that is uh yeah [TS]

00:46:18   Capote the poet but but without so much [TS]

00:46:22   rich man's Raymond Carver is the rich [TS]

00:46:25   please the rich man's poor man's Raymond [TS]

00:46:27   Carver huh [TS]

00:46:28   that's my favorite people that's my [TS]

00:46:29   favorite big blackout this episode of [TS]

00:46:33   Roderick on the line is sponsored by a [TS]

00:46:35   game called threes three's a tiny puzzle [TS]

00:46:38   that grows on you [TS]

00:46:39   you can play forever and it will always [TS]

00:46:41   be in your pocket shot and I are big [TS]

00:46:43   fans of threes [TS]

00:46:44   you can learn more about 3 by searching [TS]

00:46:45   your app store or by visiting threes [TS]

00:46:47   game.com ok that's the part they wanted [TS]

00:46:51   us to say but here's the real truth [TS]

00:46:52   threes has ruined our lives [TS]

00:46:54   John and I are mere husks of men at this [TS]

00:46:56   time we play constantly are our lives [TS]

00:46:59   upside down our children are starving [TS]

00:47:01   John I want to get to the bottom of this [TS]

00:47:03   diabolical game so we did a very long [TS]

00:47:05   interview with Asher vollmer who's the [TS]

00:47:07   twisted genius behind this menace [TS]

00:47:09   here's an excerpt from the interview [TS]

00:47:11   it will be fun to throw in something [TS]

00:47:15   like a tip [TS]

00:47:17   what do you think John yeah well a tip [TS]

00:47:20   or even an argument like I've never had [TS]

00:47:24   to make an argument your entire fucking [TS]

00:47:26   life I feel like it we started talking [TS]

00:47:29   about Three's we would we would develop [TS]

00:47:32   a narrative pretty quickly around the [TS]

00:47:36   idea that it is diabolical [TS]

00:47:38   oh I like the end and that it is that [TS]

00:47:42   you know that if it it will affect your [TS]

00:47:45   self-esteem if you are not a strong [TS]

00:47:47   person you know will discover the truth [TS]

00:47:51   about three is basically so I understand [TS]

00:47:53   what you're saying here we're definitely [TS]

00:47:55   saying that we're going to help you by [TS]

00:47:56   letting you know we're going to tear the [TS]

00:47:58   veil away from this this monstrosity but [TS]

00:48:00   it's also I think we've been getting you [TS]

00:48:01   write a little bit like Lex Luthor or in [TS]

00:48:03   superman movie where he's saying some [TS]

00:48:05   people can read a candy wrapper and like [TS]

00:48:07   I understand the secrets of the universe [TS]

00:48:08   right exactly i feel like we need to [TS]

00:48:11   unmask certain aspects of threes so that [TS]

00:48:15   it isn't you know I wouldn't give threes [TS]

00:48:17   say to a vulnerable person here the rest [TS]

00:48:26   of the interview and find out ashes [TS]

00:48:27   plans for harnessing your game play for [TS]

00:48:29   free electric power please visit shown [TS]

00:48:32   us for this episode at Roderick [TS]

00:48:33   online.com you can download the full [TS]

00:48:35   interview for free there [TS]

00:48:37   listen to it a lot of fun and like we [TS]

00:48:38   said you can learn how to grab your own [TS]

00:48:40   copy of threes by visiting threes [TS]

00:48:42   gamecom or by visiting the App Store on [TS]

00:48:44   your mobile device and Real Talk guys [TS]

00:48:46   thanks a million Asher for making our [TS]

00:48:48   all-time favorite video game for taking [TS]

00:48:50   the time to talk to us and for [TS]

00:48:51   supporting Roderick on the line [TS]

00:48:53   I was listening to buffalo Tom on the [TS]

00:48:59   weigh-in today bar brains like and the [TS]

00:49:05   Twitter yeah he's good [TS]

00:49:07   I are buying a used to sound a lot like [TS]

00:49:10   dinosaur [TS]

00:49:11   well yeah and the replacements like all [TS]

00:49:13   those bands yet from the late eighties [TS]

00:49:15   in America all sounded like dinosaur jr [TS]

00:49:18   and the replacements and end the [TS]

00:49:21   recordings don't sound very good and [TS]

00:49:23   there's there's a lot of kind of I guess [TS]

00:49:26   jangle strumming but through over driven [TS]

00:49:29   names [TS]

00:49:30   yeah it's also weird how I mean even I [TS]

00:49:32   think this kind of happened even with [TS]

00:49:33   dump truck but there are others that [TS]

00:49:35   cluster of bands from around that time [TS]

00:49:37   were like they were these crusty post [TS]

00:49:41   minneapolis not exactly hardcore bands [TS]

00:49:43   but like my only was a pop-punk but you [TS]

00:49:45   know what I mean [TS]

00:49:46   bands like lemon heads and like soul [TS]

00:49:48   asylum that were very I think very much [TS]

00:49:51   had their roots I'm not to disparage but [TS]

00:49:54   very much had their roots the book pets [TS]

00:49:56   to junior the book pens [TS]

00:49:57   yeah but me it's funny you go back and [TS]

00:49:58   listen lemonheads back when the other [TS]

00:50:00   guy wrote songs too [TS]

00:50:01   they sound a lot like mr. do abs and [TS]

00:50:04   obviously soul asylum stuff before like [TS]

00:50:08   hang time sounds so much like the [TS]

00:50:11   replacements it's fun i'm just another [TS]

00:50:14   delights yellow kind of secret record [TS]

00:50:16   and who's the who's the guy with the [TS]

00:50:18   frosted hair you know the guys that [TS]

00:50:22   became really popular window metric no [TS]

00:50:24   home no come on and nobody [TS]

00:50:27   yeah the group training never coming [TS]

00:50:31   back now that's all right now to get a [TS]

00:50:33   google dolls dolls dolls used to sound [TS]

00:50:36   even more like they send a lot like what [TS]

00:50:39   is it finding all of those bands that [TS]

00:50:40   you can go back and listen like they're [TS]

00:50:41   late eighties output and I state my hang [TS]

00:50:44   time it's glossy but it's a good album [TS]

00:50:46   it's like replacements meets cheap trick [TS]

00:50:47   is great but then those I but i couldn't [TS]

00:50:50   i never got into the goo goo dolls i [TS]

00:50:52   could never get anybody like it'sit's [TS]

00:50:53   what's funny in retrospect because if [TS]

00:50:55   you do go back and listen to those [TS]

00:50:56   records you so clearly here they going [TS]

00:50:58   oh my god i really want to I mean it [TS]

00:51:00   seems like kind of me in rem at one time [TS]

00:51:02   like oh my gosh I would love to recreate [TS]

00:51:03   this certain sound [TS]

00:51:05   and it's funny because then they'd all [TS]

00:51:07   like to a band got famous for some [TS]

00:51:10   generally power ballad or six so you got [TS]

00:51:13   the runaway train [TS]

00:51:14   I'm gonna take these wool pants off [TS]

00:51:16   excuse me don't know please go ahead i'm [TS]

00:51:18   talking talking we're taking my so hot [TS]

00:51:20   who [TS]

00:51:21   so you got that in the lemonheads they [TS]

00:51:22   started to kind of turn it down you know [TS]

00:51:25   starting with the it's a shame about ray [TS]

00:51:27   stuff that's right then they got all I [TS]

00:51:29   think he actually did win a writer like [TS]

00:51:30   everybody now was she got there you got [TS]

00:51:33   done never did I never dated Buffalo Tom [TS]

00:51:35   they had the headlight song that was [TS]

00:51:37   kind of a power ballad you do you [TS]

00:51:39   remember i remember a early nineties all [TS]

00:51:44   the way after grunge had already a [TS]

00:51:48   crested Paul Westerberg still was voted [TS]

00:51:53   America's number one songwriter in some [TS]

00:51:56   Rolling Stone pole and and I remember [TS]

00:52:00   you know what the Academy Awards there [TS]

00:52:02   John that's getting better 17 really [TS]

00:52:04   felt like Tim Conway getting an Emmy [TS]

00:52:06   water appearance on 31 if it's a very [TS]

00:52:11   little left my book at matts go really [TS]

00:52:15   really that's better than satisfied i'm [TS]

00:52:17   telling you everything is that REM i I [TS]

00:52:20   don't know what I don't know whether it [TS]

00:52:21   is just that I certainly did you drink [TS]

00:52:25   the kool-aid and then that's the [TS]

00:52:27   kool-aid that you drank drank the [TS]

00:52:28   kool-aid that was given in your time I [TS]

00:52:30   think that's right but a butt like [TS]

00:52:31   monster was the first REM Malcolm you [TS]

00:52:33   heard we're gonna have some very awkward [TS]

00:52:34   country yeah I guess that's true but [TS]

00:52:36   like the first three REM records are [TS]

00:52:38   here [TS]

00:52:39   I you know they are absolutely [TS]

00:52:41   bulletproof and and there's not a single [TS]

00:52:43   even the wrong notes are right and yet I [TS]

00:52:48   you know put on I'll put on the [TS]

00:52:50   replacements and I know I know I've [TS]

00:52:54   heard it all a thousand times and I'm [TS]

00:52:55   and I saw them back in the day and i [TS]

00:52:58   have sat on i have sat on a dirty couch [TS]

00:53:01   with two other guys in horn-rimmed [TS]

00:53:04   glasses and uh and and baseball hats [TS]

00:53:08   from feed and seed companies and we have [TS]

00:53:10   argued about this for 25 years I've been [TS]

00:53:13   arguing about this but I put on those [TS]

00:53:14   replacements record just go there [TS]

00:53:16   really yeah well I i got a thought on [TS]

00:53:20   that I I have a theory on why that would [TS]

00:53:23   because I sometimes think i'll take what [TS]

00:53:25   i think this is the most [TS]

00:53:25   oh I hope this is the most radical thing [TS]

00:53:27   I say today is that I i think i think [TS]

00:53:32   that [TS]

00:53:33   Let It Be is a way better finished [TS]

00:53:37   product then Tim I think the production [TS]

00:53:40   on tim is incredibly dated my even Jim [TS]

00:53:43   Dickinson stuff on pleased to meet me [TS]

00:53:46   I mean my god i'm not gonna bring up the [TS]

00:53:48   gated problem but there's a lot of gated [TS]

00:53:50   reverb on there that makes it sound like [TS]

00:53:51   they're playing in half a toilet with [TS]

00:53:53   the lip balm but what I mean there is [TS]

00:53:57   not there is no worse record in terms of [TS]

00:54:02   production then I against I Bad Brains [TS]

00:54:06   really [TS]

00:54:07   and yet what I this allows any records [TS]

00:54:10   that like i said is misty records with [TS]

00:54:12   yeah that's that spot guy ruined a lot [TS]

00:54:16   of really good albums you really did and [TS]

00:54:18   and and i mean i think that is a [TS]

00:54:20   fantastic album i can hear it i can [TS]

00:54:23   listen to it and love it through the [TS]

00:54:25   production [TS]

00:54:25   yeah i do not care different you might [TS]

00:54:27   be remembering right it's pretty River [TS]

00:54:29   be oh my god who knows it sounds like [TS]

00:54:31   they put it sounds like they put a [TS]

00:54:32   microphone down a manhole cover and the [TS]

00:54:35   band was playing in a truck that was [TS]

00:54:36   driving by the rich language truck [TS]

00:54:38   there's no that they were never there [TS]

00:54:41   playing a like a ok i'm sure that's bad [TS]

00:54:45   breaking like not it's just sounds [TS]

00:54:48   terrible and and when you listen to you [TS]

00:54:49   can't help but say like oh god if you [TS]

00:54:51   could just have also been recording this [TS]

00:54:54   record when this record was recorded [TS]

00:54:56   like if there was another guy there who [TS]

00:54:58   was actually recorded back to your [TS]

00:54:59   theory about being a producer is more [TS]

00:55:01   than standing behind the faders it's [TS]

00:55:02   having editorial voice to make sure that [TS]

00:55:04   you got the skills to make it sound good [TS]

00:55:05   and then you make sure it sounds good [TS]

00:55:07   yeah right i mean you just I mean I'm [TS]

00:55:09   sure that recording a band was really [TS]

00:55:10   difficult and just personality-wise like [TS]

00:55:14   HR came in and you know and just started [TS]

00:55:17   calling you not hear whatever it was or [TS]

00:55:19   a Jew or whatever it was is because his [TS]

00:55:21   trip was that our but but you know my [TS]

00:55:25   god that those performances that moment [TS]

00:55:27   in time right you can't go back and read [TS]

00:55:29   course that record because nobody could [TS]

00:55:31   do it nobody could play that record now [TS]

00:55:33   it was they had they were they had they [TS]

00:55:37   were touched by angels right but you're [TS]

00:55:39   saying you're saying that as a new [TS]

00:55:41   brother replacements hasn't moved you as [TS]

00:55:42   much as it's not a lot of people I [TS]

00:55:44   songwriting i mean the the sounds of [TS]

00:55:48   those records not withstand the song you [TS]

00:55:50   don't like the songwriting I'd it's not [TS]

00:55:52   that I don't like it I just go like yeah [TS]

00:55:54   this is for other people this is for [TS]

00:55:57   guys in feed and seed hats or this is [TS]

00:56:00   for the goo goo dolls uh this one this [TS]

00:56:03   is the you know like I felt that way [TS]

00:56:06   about Dylan the first time I heard him [TS]

00:56:07   but then I grew to understand and love [TS]

00:56:09   Dylan and Dylan moves me now but I've [TS]

00:56:12   gone back to the replacements well a [TS]

00:56:14   hundred times and I always just come out [TS]

00:56:17   of it feeling like yeah those were the [TS]

00:56:19   guys that lived in the house across the [TS]

00:56:20   street from the house that I lived in [TS]

00:56:21   and we were friendly but not friends [TS]

00:56:24   mmm yeah I mean I i can't i can't argue [TS]

00:56:28   with that I mean you know at the time [TS]

00:56:29   that something becomes a sensation [TS]

00:56:30   whether it's any of these bands are my [TS]

00:56:32   other favorite bands that i learned [TS]

00:56:33   about because they became sensations you [TS]

00:56:35   know a lot of it has to do with the time [TS]

00:56:37   and the time in the timing and some of [TS]

00:56:38   that stuff does age better than others [TS]

00:56:42   some of it was never really that great [TS]

00:56:43   to begin with and Buffalo tom is an [TS]

00:56:46   example of a band that i saw in 1990-91 [TS]

00:56:50   and the show just blew me away [TS]

00:56:53   and so I I can't hear a bad word about [TS]

00:56:55   him you know what I mean like I love [TS]

00:56:56   i'll always love them because I remember [TS]

00:56:59   the feeling of being at their show and [TS]

00:57:02   feeling like this is doable like this is [TS]

00:57:05   doable [TS]

00:57:06   these guys are doing this and it's and I [TS]

00:57:08   could do this this is doable and this is [TS]

00:57:11   amazing in this show [TS]

00:57:12   there are a lot of people at the show [TS]

00:57:15   and they're all it was that first time [TS]

00:57:17   because i always going to punk shows [TS]

00:57:20   right right [TS]

00:57:21   those were the only shows that you went [TS]

00:57:23   to like hard hard-core show is where a [TS]

00:57:26   lot of it was about the mechanics and [TS]

00:57:27   volume [TS]

00:57:28   yeah right i mean i couldn't afford to [TS]

00:57:30   go see the to the cure is our ship right [TS]

00:57:35   I wasn't going to go to those shows i [TS]

00:57:36   was going to the show the five-dollar [TS]

00:57:37   show at the rec center of the three [TS]

00:57:39   dollar show direction [TS]

00:57:40   and those bands were all hardcore bands [TS]

00:57:42   and and so I would be at the show and I [TS]

00:57:45   would look around and everybody was [TS]

00:57:46   rocking their there punk thing and I [TS]

00:57:52   loved I loved to Slamdance it was one of [TS]

00:57:55   my favorite things to do but i was i did [TS]

00:57:57   not walk out of that show and feel like [TS]

00:57:59   you know what I'm gonna shave my head [TS]

00:58:01   and I'm gonna start you know I'm gonna [TS]

00:58:06   go vegan and i'm going to start like [TS]

00:58:09   living and working at a soup kitchen [TS]

00:58:10   like i did not i was not transformed [TS]

00:58:13   into right now I know but at buffalo Tom [TS]

00:58:16   show i looked around and i was like wow [TS]

00:58:18   like everybody here is my age and [TS]

00:58:21   they're all wearing carhartt jackets and [TS]

00:58:26   there are there girls here and most of [TS]

00:58:30   these guys are wearing glasses like [TS]

00:58:32   these are my people [TS]

00:58:35   it was it was really it was really kind [TS]

00:58:38   of uh it was afraid was freaky [TS]

00:58:41   well yeah yeah and now you're making me [TS]

00:58:43   think because that was that some of the [TS]

00:58:45   early shows i went to and it was just [TS]

00:58:48   their electric I mean just so such a [TS]

00:58:50   adrenaline shot to go to a show like [TS]

00:58:52   that but what's funny is like sometimes [TS]

00:58:54   I would end up seeing bad thing [TS]

00:58:55   especially bands that were opening for [TS]

00:58:57   somebody else that I had heard the name [TS]

00:58:59   of it might be a little bit familiar [TS]

00:59:00   with but bands were like that some of [TS]

00:59:03   the bands that really ended up sticking [TS]

00:59:04   with me like yo tengo and steelies and [TS]

00:59:07   these bands were you go and like if you [TS]

00:59:09   just heard their record first you might [TS]

00:59:11   you might not get it but we're girls are [TS]

00:59:15   killed big example of all man they were [TS]

00:59:17   when they were good they were real [TS]

00:59:19   glossy but they were they were amazing [TS]

00:59:21   they were fun and funny but like yeah [TS]

00:59:23   but I mean you'll attend go to me like I [TS]

00:59:24   think there's something is fantastic i [TS]

00:59:26   think the evolution of them over time is [TS]

00:59:27   great i think they seem like interesting [TS]

00:59:29   people or you know again with the [TS]

00:59:31   feelies the Phillies are like as close [TS]

00:59:33   as I'll ever get to something like the [TS]

00:59:34   Grateful Dead like where you go and i'm [TS]

00:59:36   justin intently watching the way this [TS]

00:59:38   song is unfolding because it's it is it [TS]

00:59:41   is very rock and roll you know but it's [TS]

00:59:43   just very very intense but it's also [TS]

00:59:46   kind of nerdy like yo tengo that's if [TS]

00:59:48   there's something basically nerdy about [TS]

00:59:50   it but it just happens to rock so called [TS]

00:59:53   me that night [TS]

00:59:53   and then that leads me down the rabbit [TS]

00:59:55   hole of going and looking for all the [TS]

00:59:56   records from those guys that's then that [TS]

00:59:58   stuff that is really like you Buffalo [TS]

00:59:59   tom [TS]

00:59:59   tom [TS]

01:00:00   stuff that really stuck with me and i [TS]

01:00:02   don't i don't think it's defensible I [TS]

01:00:04   don't think you can I don't think you [TS]

01:00:05   could stand on a on a on a on a [TS]

01:00:09   overturned create outside of hyde park [TS]

01:00:13   and say I like Buffalo Tom and don't [TS]

01:00:16   like the replacements like I don't think [TS]

01:00:18   that that is artistically defensive when [TS]

01:00:20   people use your time i'm i'm gonna get a [TS]

01:00:23   ticket to London and I maybe i'm going [TS]

01:00:25   to make that case you didn't get a [TS]

01:00:27   moment of your time please gather around [TS]

01:00:29   gather around [TS]

01:00:30   I know John Buffalo Tom but it but I [TS]

01:00:36   don't care for the replacement soap [TS]

01:00:39   watch once I driver behind you but but [TS]

01:00:45   there it is [TS]

01:00:46   you know what I made through the coffee [TS]

01:00:47   cup of pee at you don't follow budget i [TS]

01:00:54   take your p you that [TS]

01:00:58   mmm yeah yeah even listening music the [TS]

01:01:02   same way anymore though John it's just [TS]

01:01:03   not the same anymore [TS]

01:01:04   yeah I guess I don't we came from the [TS]

01:01:08   actions guess I don't care I don't care [TS]

01:01:12   I was listening I was listening to the [TS]

01:01:14   radio and they were playing some old [TS]

01:01:15   music by which i mean music from my [TS]

01:01:19   youth like you know Punk and grunge and [TS]

01:01:23   i was struck again by how bad [TS]

01:01:25   most of it was and I realized that [TS]

01:01:28   there's you couldn't you could not sit a [TS]

01:01:31   young person down and explain what it [TS]

01:01:34   meant you know you couldn't you couldn't [TS]

01:01:37   sit them down and say like it used to be [TS]

01:01:39   hard to hear music [TS]

01:01:41   it used to be hard to even find it right [TS]

01:01:45   yeah you first you had to get the [TS]

01:01:46   rosetta stone that tells you which bands [TS]

01:01:48   to even know the name of then you had to [TS]

01:01:50   find out like what their music was like [TS]

01:01:52   you had to read extensive reviews [TS]

01:01:53   there's like five steps before you ever [TS]

01:01:55   even went and spent your fucking money [TS]

01:01:57   on it for this thing and not that thing [TS]

01:01:59   but 22 to be important to be 22 years [TS]

01:02:02   old in it in my case and go to a rock [TS]

01:02:07   show [TS]

01:02:08   where it was your first exposure to the [TS]

01:02:11   audience to an audience that looked like [TS]

01:02:15   you who like kind of first time ever [TS]

01:02:19   right because the more i think about it [TS]

01:02:21   like I'd been to heavy metal stadium [TS]

01:02:25   concerts and I'd been to a thousand a [TS]

01:02:29   punk rock shows in youth Center's but I [TS]

01:02:32   had never been to a show in a club where [TS]

01:02:35   the where the other people where the [TS]

01:02:38   audience had taken some college classes [TS]

01:02:41   because those bands didn't come to [TS]

01:02:44   Anchorage right re i'm never played in [TS]

01:02:46   Anchorage when I was growing up and and [TS]

01:02:49   that and to be 22 years old and have it [TS]

01:02:52   be the first time that you ever were [TS]

01:02:54   standing in a room where you were like I [TS]

01:02:55   believe that this room of people is a [TS]

01:02:58   mirror i am seeing myself for the first [TS]

01:03:01   time [TS]

01:03:02   how would you explain that to someone [TS]

01:03:04   who was 22 years old now right [TS]

01:03:07   I'm because presumably they have [TS]

01:03:09   certainly bit there they are aware that [TS]

01:03:14   there are rooms full of people who [TS]

01:03:16   resemble them even if they've never been [TS]

01:03:19   in one was designing a lot fewer things [TS]

01:03:22   that are just strictly speaking a black [TS]

01:03:23   box there are a lot fewer things where [TS]

01:03:26   you actually have no idea what this is [TS]

01:03:28   gonna be like right or it's just not [TS]

01:03:30   possible to find out what it's going to [TS]

01:03:31   be like until you do it until you do it [TS]

01:03:33   right you could not you i could not have [TS]

01:03:35   had an advanced I guess somebody I guess [TS]

01:03:38   somebody could have said like you should [TS]

01:03:40   go to this show because you seem like [TS]

01:03:43   you would be a fan of them right [TS]

01:03:45   that would be the closest would be the [TS]

01:03:47   closest approximation of like here's [TS]

01:03:51   where you belong and it turned out I [TS]

01:03:53   didn't belong there either right [TS]

01:03:55   I walked around and I was like hi hi [TS]

01:03:57   nice to meet you high and everybody was [TS]

01:03:59   like you know we don't really just walk [TS]

01:04:01   up and say hi to each other that's kind [TS]

01:04:02   of the way this works [TS]

01:04:04   that's not how we do it I was like oh [TS]

01:04:05   right right okay okay mm yeah [TS]

01:04:08   I was thinking about that the other day [TS]

01:04:10   I was walking down the street and I'm i [TS]

01:04:11   was taught I don't know about you but I [TS]

01:04:13   was taught that when you're walking down [TS]

01:04:15   the street you make eye contact with [TS]

01:04:18   people and and nod and smile like you [TS]

01:04:23   make eye contact with people that you [TS]

01:04:25   pass on the street have we talked about [TS]

01:04:26   this now and you're worrying a little [TS]

01:04:30   bit and now I where we talked about John [TS]

01:04:34   get to be an hour [TS]

01:04:36   ok that's right that's right don't move [TS]

01:04:46   bespoke oh got out of there well saved [TS]