Roderick on the Line

Ep. 125: "All the Great Shows!"


00:00:00   this episode of Roderick on the line is [TS]

00:00:02   sponsored by Squarespace the only one [TS]

00:00:04   platform that makes it fast and easy to [TS]

00:00:06   create your own professional website [TS]

00:00:07   portfolio and online store for your free [TS]

00:00:11   trial plus ten percent off anything you [TS]

00:00:12   by visit squarespace.com and enter the [TS]

00:00:15   offer code supertrain at checkout a [TS]

00:00:17   better web starts with your website [TS]

00:00:19   [Music] [TS]

00:00:29   hello hey John hi Merlin how's it going [TS]

00:00:33   good we should you should have been [TS]

00:00:40   listening to born slippy I'm totally [TS]

00:00:41   pumped now are you pumped that my dog [TS]

00:00:44   Marte in the manger bar in the door was [TS]

00:00:47   helping at all [TS]

00:00:48   she was a lipstick boys you want a [TS]

00:00:51   beautiful boy and deer bones that help [TS]

00:00:54   you stretched i did my usual warm-up [TS]

00:00:59   routine [TS]

00:01:00   yeah yeah was that uh which is that I [TS]

00:01:03   listen to elliott smith's waltz number [TS]

00:01:05   three on the way in [TS]

00:01:07   haha oh and was a again reduced to tears [TS]

00:01:13   wats number three I know what's number [TS]

00:01:15   two including the core all right now [TS]

00:01:17   it's no balls number two its oh my god [TS]

00:01:20   he has lots of Watts's but i keep I keep [TS]

00:01:22   I keep upgrading it to the third waltz [TS]

00:01:26   because I feel like it's really too [TS]

00:01:28   waltzes you're talking about never [TS]

00:01:29   getting now that's right huh [TS]

00:01:31   we've talked about this song many times [TS]

00:01:33   it's AI don't know why that song levels [TS]

00:01:36   me I keep plumbing its depths you know [TS]

00:01:40   my interpretation of so what happened [TS]

00:01:41   was I you know I borrowed a car from a [TS]

00:01:44   friend several years ago which I'm still [TS]

00:01:46   driving and in the car was a mixtape CB [TS]

00:01:51   that she made be many years before that [TS]

00:01:56   and I never figured out where the CD [TS]

00:02:00   changer was so I just have this one [TS]

00:02:02   mixtape in there standing there the [TS]

00:02:06   whole time it's been there the whole [TS]

00:02:07   time while about four years that I've [TS]

00:02:10   had the car and the second song on the [TS]

00:02:13   mixtape is terrible and you could the [TS]

00:02:18   first song on the mixtape is waltz [TS]

00:02:20   number two and then you could you could [TS]

00:02:23   tell that she wanted to like get you [TS]

00:02:27   know get back in a happy mood or so you [TS]

00:02:29   like the second song on the tape is like [TS]

00:02:31   and now we're gonna like pop it up for [TS]

00:02:34   the second song is I won't even mention [TS]

00:02:36   it's so terrible that i have never [TS]

00:02:39   listened to any of the rest of the [TS]

00:02:42   mixtape [TS]

00:02:43   i just i turn on get in the car i turn [TS]

00:02:45   on the stereo i listen to waltz number [TS]

00:02:47   two [TS]

00:02:48   sometimes I listen to it again and then [TS]

00:02:51   I turn the stereo back off [TS]

00:02:53   I've been doing that for years but you [TS]

00:02:57   never been curious to see what or had [TS]

00:02:59   accidentally go on you never found [TS]

00:03:01   yourself playing the rest of the tape [TS]

00:03:03   because the second song is so bad as [TS]

00:03:05   soon as the opening because sometimes [TS]

00:03:07   I'll get so lost in a reverie about [TS]

00:03:09   Walt's number two that I will I will [TS]

00:03:11   forget what's coming and then the then [TS]

00:03:15   the neck that's opening chords of the [TS]

00:03:17   next song like the cords offend me [TS]

00:03:19   before the vocals even come in and out [TS]

00:03:23   because I'm in such a state of Walt's [TS]

00:03:26   number two that that will that I hear [TS]

00:03:30   that get that next guitar and I'm just [TS]

00:03:32   like die a thousand deaths and I lunch [TS]

00:03:35   for the thing so i have no idea maybe [TS]

00:03:36   the rest of the mixtape is amazing maybe [TS]

00:03:38   there are other songs to discover and [TS]

00:03:40   plum their depths but i'll never know [TS]

00:03:42   because I also a month for up even [TS]

00:03:46   though i've had this car for years i'm [TS]

00:03:47   unfamiliar enough with the stereo that I [TS]

00:03:48   don't know how to skip to the next song [TS]

00:03:50   but so I've spent all this time inside [TS]

00:03:54   of this one song interpreting it and [TS]

00:03:59   living it and you know my sense of this [TS]

00:04:02   song is that he's writing to his step [TS]

00:04:04   father and mother [TS]

00:04:06   yeah it is what I get and it's also kind [TS]

00:04:10   of a suicide note you know the the [TS]

00:04:11   bridges here today here today expecting [TS]

00:04:15   to stay on and on and on [TS]

00:04:18   huh I'm tired tired so tired and it's [TS]

00:04:22   just like uh looking out on a substitute [TS]

00:04:26   seen oh alright but the problem is that [TS]

00:04:30   the I get in the car in the morning and [TS]

00:04:32   I head out into the world like all right [TS]

00:04:34   don't cat chat here we go check it i got [TS]

00:04:37   a lot of shit to do today and I listen [TS]

00:04:40   to this one three and a half minutes [TS]

00:04:41   long song and then i'm kinda useless [TS]

00:04:44   baby for the rest of the day [TS]

00:04:47   mhm yes because we're going to change [TS]

00:04:50   well because i feel i see i don't know [TS]

00:04:52   I don't know great the car borrowed now [TS]

00:04:55   for about four years ok alright and also [TS]

00:04:57   this is not how you listen to music [TS]

00:04:59   no no no but but but so the footer but [TS]

00:05:03   additionally the problem is that I feel [TS]

00:05:05   like as I've spent all this time with [TS]

00:05:07   this one song I feel like it is a [TS]

00:05:08   perfect work who like he has [TS]

00:05:11   accomplished in this song a kind of [TS]

00:05:14   perfection in making a thing and so it [TS]

00:05:20   also sends me out when I but when i get [TS]

00:05:22   to my eventual destination I parked the [TS]

00:05:25   car and I go what's the point of [TS]

00:05:26   anything you know [TS]

00:05:28   yeah like that's how you know it's [TS]

00:05:30   working yeah he really made a thing [TS]

00:05:32   there and that's really you know like [TS]

00:05:34   it's like it's like it's like a perfect [TS]

00:05:38   definition of weariness like you know [TS]

00:05:40   even when it starts it starts out with [TS]

00:05:42   that like the waltz easiest ones that [TS]

00:05:44   don't chat is the walks easiest waltz [TS]

00:05:47   you've ever heard and then it's like its [TS]

00:05:50   size its way into the strum chords [TS]

00:05:52   getting getting getting and every you [TS]

00:05:56   know it all comes in and then the [TS]

00:05:57   goddamn cellos at the barre and he's got [TS]

00:06:00   what what you can only presume if you [TS]

00:06:02   imagine songs are recorded if you do if [TS]

00:06:04   you imagine as I do that there at the [TS]

00:06:06   band that makes the song is all in a [TS]

00:06:08   room a lot Pet Sounds and they're [TS]

00:06:09   sitting there the whole time weight and [TS]

00:06:11   yeah there's like six jealous jealous [TS]

00:06:13   just sitting and they and they really [TS]

00:06:15   gonna want to pack in the whole [TS]

00:06:16   performance in that like it just source [TS]

00:06:18   through the whole tune they're just [TS]

00:06:20   sitting there and then wow wow oh god [TS]

00:06:25   dammit now that Taoism man i think [TS]

00:06:28   that's a pretty perfect song I really [TS]

00:06:30   are you but so that's I mean I gotta get [TS]

00:06:32   a new routine [TS]

00:06:33   I mean you know some people get up to [TS]

00:06:35   get on the stairmaster they get up and [TS]

00:06:37   they designed some apps in the morning [TS]

00:06:39   round we should do something going on a [TS]

00:06:41   workflow they get a workflow who and my [TS]

00:06:44   workflow is just like wake up getting a [TS]

00:06:47   borrowed car to listen to the most [TS]

00:06:50   depressing perfect song and then try and [TS]

00:06:55   make my way to the end of the day [TS]

00:06:57   they're gonna send me down elliott smith [TS]

00:06:59   all because I can't even tell you what [TS]

00:07:01   my favorite elliott smith song is [TS]

00:07:02   because it's one of those things where [TS]

00:07:04   it's it's almost like the Beatles [TS]

00:07:05   on which of which he was obviously a fan [TS]

00:07:08   we're like I find myself going oh no no [TS]

00:07:10   uh you know I say yes [TS]

00:07:12   oh oh no you know hi my name feta means [TS]

00:07:16   the moonlight phone [TS]

00:07:17   I mean like oh my god how did have the [TS]

00:07:19   guy do it and that yet little line at [TS]

00:07:21   that don't don't don't [TS]

00:07:23   boom it's just a little under played and [TS]

00:07:26   like it's so low-key but you know that [TS]

00:07:30   had set the tone know if you really want [TS]

00:07:32   to get up and make an appt you might [TS]

00:07:33   need something might put on maybe a midi [TS]

00:07:35   one of my least favorite [TS]

00:07:36   uh listen songs and oh i see a metal [TS]

00:07:39   that make him make you mad get up and [TS]

00:07:41   make an appt yeah i got apps to make [TS]

00:07:44   sometimes you gotta get mad at least you [TS]

00:07:46   know it was though I've heard amity like [TS]

00:07:48   in on a jukebox in a bar it would be [TS]

00:07:49   okay it's just it's such an uneven [TS]

00:07:51   number which record that's on I think [TS]

00:07:53   it's on that record and it's like it's [TS]

00:07:55   such a sore thumb on that record it's [TS]

00:07:57   that record so you know it just becomes [TS]

00:08:00   evident comes blaring out and it always [TS]

00:08:03   would throw me off and I was watching [TS]

00:08:05   probably he's probably it was [TS]

00:08:07   experiencing the same thing that the [TS]

00:08:08   gallant made this mixtape was [TS]

00:08:10   experiencing which is like well I wrote [TS]

00:08:11   the perfect I've got the perfect song on [TS]

00:08:13   here already [TS]

00:08:14   the rest of this Merton mixtape should [TS]

00:08:16   just be this song over and over [TS]

00:08:19   I can't do that the rest of this album [TS]

00:08:21   should just be this one song that is [TS]

00:08:23   that that is the perfect expression of [TS]

00:08:25   growing up in a household with the [TS]

00:08:28   detached mother and an abusive [TS]

00:08:30   stepfather right so instead I should be [TS]

00:08:33   I should make a song that like gets [TS]

00:08:35   everybody excited i used to do something [TS]

00:08:37   you know kind of peculiar which is if I [TS]

00:08:39   would record a record under a tape and I [TS]

00:08:42   had room at the end sometimes i do a [TS]

00:08:44   little mix to take up the space but [TS]

00:08:46   toward the end of the cassette area I [TS]

00:08:48   would just take whatever my favorite [TS]

00:08:50   song was and and play it on repeat on [TS]

00:08:52   the CD player to play out so I would [TS]

00:08:54   listen to like minor threats out-of-step [TS]

00:08:57   like like like 11 times in a row and we [TS]

00:09:00   just want to get sick of it i was just [TS]

00:09:01   it's just like a perfect blast of a song [TS]

00:09:04   yeah there's there there are there like [TS]

00:09:08   20 seconds snippets of my bloody [TS]

00:09:11   valentine that I could just listen to [TS]

00:09:12   that 20 seconds on repeat for eternity [TS]

00:09:15   but I wouldn't get anything done because [TS]

00:09:19   he also just disappear into the music [TS]

00:09:21   yeah just be out there swelling around [TS]

00:09:23   here going to shout your starboard album [TS]

00:09:25   you're going to really need to get back [TS]

00:09:27   in the shed starbal star bolt stern look [TS]

00:09:30   at me are both County this episode of [TS]

00:09:34   rock on the line is sponsored by our [TS]

00:09:35   very good friends over [TS]

00:09:36   we're at Squarespace you know [TS]

00:09:38   Squarespace you should you're the only [TS]

00:09:40   one platform makes it fast and easy to [TS]

00:09:42   create your own professional website [TS]

00:09:43   portfolio or online store guys they make [TS]

00:09:47   it all so simple and easy drag-and-drop [TS]

00:09:48   interface as beautiful free templates [TS]

00:09:51   you can tweak anyway you like all the [TS]

00:09:53   squarespace six designs are responsive [TS]

00:09:55   that means they look great on every [TS]

00:09:56   device [TS]

00:09:57   Squarespace also offers free 24 x seven [TS]

00:10:00   support through live email and shot with [TS]

00:10:03   dedicated teams in New York City dublin [TS]

00:10:05   and Portland here's the thing you gotta [TS]

00:10:06   know John and I have used square space [TS]

00:10:08   to host Roderick online for three years [TS]

00:10:11   now hundred and twenty episodes and [TS]

00:10:12   they're still just as great to work with [TS]

00:10:14   as they were on day one we love working [TS]

00:10:16   with them and we really hope you'll give [TS]

00:10:17   them a try to the beauty part is [TS]

00:10:19   Squarespace plans start at only eight [TS]

00:10:21   dollars per month eight dollars a month [TS]

00:10:23   that includes a free domain name if you [TS]

00:10:25   sign up for a year which you should [TS]

00:10:26   totally do please remember to tell [TS]

00:10:28   Squarespace you heard about them from [TS]

00:10:29   your pals that Roderick on the line [TS]

00:10:30   because listeners of this particular [TS]

00:10:32   program get a free trial plus ten [TS]

00:10:34   percent off any package they choose by [TS]

00:10:36   using the very special offer code [TS]

00:10:38   supertrain at checkout our thanks to [TS]

00:10:40   squarespace for supporting Roderick [TS]

00:10:42   online we could not do without you I've [TS]

00:10:44   been feeling recently that all of the [TS]

00:10:46   musical stylings of the seventies have [TS]

00:10:48   like the seventies folk scene have [TS]

00:10:51   really been explored enough now I don't [TS]

00:10:55   want to hear it anymore [TS]

00:10:56   I keep turning on the radio or hearing [TS]

00:10:58   ambient music in stores and it's just [TS]

00:11:00   like it's just exploring that weird [TS]

00:11:03   little seventies thing that I seventies [TS]

00:11:05   folk thing that I feel like we're we [TS]

00:11:07   kind of had enough of even then we [TS]

00:11:09   rejected at the time and I'm just done [TS]

00:11:13   I don't want I don't want to hear [TS]

00:11:14   another acoustic guitar maybe not for [TS]

00:11:16   the rest of my life [TS]

00:11:17   uh-huh I've had that feeling that [TS]

00:11:20   something will come on it'll really [TS]

00:11:21   booing me [TS]

00:11:23   I flew out of Boston a few days ago and [TS]

00:11:27   went to get some food for got on the [TS]

00:11:29   plane because you know what kind of [TS]

00:11:30   animal eats on a plane and so I went [TS]

00:11:32   into the legal seafood bar which also [TS]

00:11:35   serves food it which is great you know [TS]

00:11:37   they got a hell of a lobster roll there [TS]

00:11:38   it's like $75 and as I walked in they [TS]

00:11:42   were playing September girls by big star [TS]

00:11:44   em and I felt so fucking old because [TS]

00:11:47   that was that song was old when I got [TS]

00:11:49   into [TS]

00:11:49   yes but somebody knows to play that over [TS]

00:11:53   some satellite station in the in the in [TS]

00:11:55   the 830am mix he at an airport but then [TS]

00:12:01   Jackie blue came on which I have her in [TS]

00:12:03   a really long time that's what good to [TS]

00:12:05   that sounds kinda weird it's got a weird [TS]

00:12:07   space to it looks like their seventies [TS]

00:12:09   cocaine songs that create this really [TS]

00:12:11   strange environment that I can't quite [TS]

00:12:13   put my finger on [TS]

00:12:14   I don't understand it either you can't [TS]

00:12:16   go back and recapture that people have [TS]

00:12:18   been trying for decades brother Louie [TS]

00:12:20   like there's these certain songs from [TS]

00:12:22   the seventies that like have such a [TS]

00:12:24   weird space and it's all it's all sound [TS]

00:12:27   it's sonically weird and like in both [TS]

00:12:32   comfortable and envelop ingrained also [TS]

00:12:34   like kind of emotionally cold but in a [TS]

00:12:38   way that feels like home huh [TS]

00:12:41   I don't understand I mean you know [TS]

00:12:43   obviously Baker Street being the [TS]

00:12:45   ultimate I'm gonna say I'm gonna toss in [TS]

00:12:47   Baker Street and it's it's a psychic [TS]

00:12:51   partner i'm going to say you're the cat [TS]

00:12:53   or or possibly time as the judges both [TS]

00:12:57   of those and I'm going to throw in one [TS]

00:12:59   of the calcaneus cocaine's of all time [TS]

00:13:00   I'm gonna throw in sentimental lady by [TS]

00:13:03   Bob Welch great tune for the same album [TS]

00:13:07   magic ok Gnaeus cocaine song of all time [TS]

00:13:09   ebony eyes give me that one [TS]

00:13:12   the video with Valerie Bertinelli you [TS]

00:13:15   know what else uhhhh a devil woman [TS]

00:13:18   oh oh yes he's just a devil woman within [TS]

00:13:23   the online [TS]

00:13:25   oh my god how did they do what you think [TS]

00:13:27   is the cocaine shit it's got its got to [TS]

00:13:29   be cocaine it's going to be cocaine and [TS]

00:13:31   tube tube amplifiers at but they were [TS]

00:13:34   like they were they were chasing i made [TS]

00:13:38   a combination of like am radio song [TS]

00:13:41   writing chops and all the time in the [TS]

00:13:45   world with the best equipment and I mean [TS]

00:13:49   but honestly if if I knew I would I [TS]

00:13:52   would be trying to approximate it and [TS]

00:13:54   everybody else would too and you know of [TS]

00:13:57   course like we haven't even said like [TS]

00:13:59   all of that Fleetwood Mac weird shit [TS]

00:14:01   and Fleetwood Mac actually took that [TS]

00:14:03   into the eighties I feel like we've [TS]

00:14:06   argued about christine mcvie before I [TS]

00:14:08   you know I i just want to have a [TS]

00:14:10   different point of view but I i enjoy i [TS]

00:14:12   enjoy her contribution to other people's [TS]

00:14:14   songs a superlight yeah but i feel like [TS]

00:14:16   the christine mcvie hits on the early [TS]

00:14:19   eighties fleetwood mac stuff is an [TS]

00:14:21   evolution of the seventies cocaine [TS]

00:14:24   coldness em but like like you know what [TS]

00:14:29   I mean like it's it's music that never [TS]

00:14:31   breaks a sweat no one in any of those [TS]

00:14:33   tunes is sweating at all huh [TS]

00:14:36   they're just like so cool [TS]

00:14:39   I don't I mean and I feel like I feel [TS]

00:14:42   like that but like maybe Cat Stevens got [TS]

00:14:45   the ball rolling a little bit on that I [TS]

00:14:48   there's something like you know it's [TS]

00:14:51   some is the pigment guy what's that [TS]

00:14:53   guy's name yeah that's all oh what's his [TS]

00:14:55   name of the Bob Bob firing by moonlight [TS]

00:14:58   Bob moon [TS]

00:14:59   I think pink 00 Bob pink yeah that [TS]

00:15:02   Volkswagen song [TS]

00:15:03   yeah books working guy yeah Nick break [TS]

00:15:06   Bob box white box objects minh it's a [TS]

00:15:09   even yeah it's fine like there is a part [TS]

00:15:11   of this must just because i was a little [TS]

00:15:12   kid knows a lonely kid and listen to [TS]

00:15:14   non-stop am radio when I wasn't watching [TS]

00:15:17   TV or reading encyclopedia brown [TS]

00:15:19   I was listening am radio like all the [TS]

00:15:22   time and snoopy of the Red Baron after [TS]

00:15:25   that there are none of the century had a [TS]

00:15:28   45 then I'm sure he'll likely able to [TS]

00:15:31   Scott and then that probably got our [TS]

00:15:32   early interest in mia in the German war [TS]

00:15:34   efforts [TS]

00:15:35   yeah sure I mean that's how i got into [TS]

00:15:37   world war one was the ballad of snoopy [TS]

00:15:39   in the Red Baron I was like I got to [TS]

00:15:41   know more about this story tell me more [TS]

00:15:42   about the Snoopy is interesting but [TS]

00:15:46   there's all kinds of songs like that to [TS]

00:15:48   this day I have such a specific [TS]

00:15:50   recollection of like standing in a [TS]

00:15:52   certain place being like exactly a [TS]

00:15:54   certain age I know what season it was I [TS]

00:15:56   know what like month that was when that [TS]

00:15:57   came out and I don't know that some of [TS]

00:15:59   them are just really fixed in time as [TS]

00:16:01   the scrap love [TS]

00:16:03   oh yeah but all that captain and [TS]

00:16:06   Tennille stuff like I feel like my when [TS]

00:16:09   I hear captain and Tennille that was the [TS]

00:16:12   dawn of my sexual awakening [TS]

00:16:15   oh it's nothing like the proto sexual [TS]

00:16:18   awakening [TS]

00:16:19   yeah let me just knew you wanted [TS]

00:16:21   something they were seeing in there know [TS]

00:16:23   what it was I didn't I didn't I didn't [TS]

00:16:25   know what a-what lady parts looked like [TS]

00:16:27   even but I knew that to neal had was [TS]

00:16:31   expressing a thing that I wanted to you [TS]

00:16:33   know in a way that Abba was too polished [TS]

00:16:36   and there were too many people there [TS]

00:16:39   Camille and you know the captain had [TS]

00:16:42   that hat and the dark glasses you [TS]

00:16:44   weren't sure what he was doing today but [TS]

00:16:46   yeah if my name were Darryl dragon I [TS]

00:16:49   would not call myself captain haha you [TS]

00:16:51   at least call yourself captain dragon [TS]

00:16:54   no-brainer my god fucking dragon but [TS]

00:16:57   nothing on the cap just call me captain [TS]

00:17:01   yeah because I got Michael I got a hat I [TS]

00:17:03   got a cab mr. dragons my father [TS]

00:17:09   yeah yeah I don't know I don't know it's [TS]

00:17:11   at you right now I mean how do you [TS]

00:17:12   recreate that that sound in that [TS]

00:17:14   environment and you know maybe part of [TS]

00:17:16   it was there was maybe a little more [TS]

00:17:17   money around like you say that's been a [TS]

00:17:19   little more time in the studio yeah but [TS]

00:17:21   I but there's others something to gain [TS]

00:17:24   on the board and I think I think you've [TS]

00:17:26   hit it which is that there is an [TS]

00:17:28   emptiness to those tracks where you [TS]

00:17:32   listen to it and you can hear every [TS]

00:17:34   element it doesn't feel empty it feels [TS]

00:17:37   impossibly full alright but there's [TS]

00:17:40   space their space between the things [TS]

00:17:43   things come in [TS]

00:17:44   it's a little bit of a holdover from the [TS]

00:17:46   the restrictions of the four-track where [TS]

00:17:49   there still was like a lot of spookiness [TS]

00:17:51   in the room [TS]

00:17:53   yeah and then still like okay the chorus [TS]

00:17:55   or you know okay here the guitar part is [TS]

00:17:57   coming in and we're going to put this [TS]

00:17:58   guitar part on the lead vocal channel [TS]

00:18:01   because we don't want to waste the tape [TS]

00:18:04   space or something you know like there's [TS]

00:18:06   it doesn't have the excess of later [TS]

00:18:08   where it's just like well we got 24 [TS]

00:18:10   tracks so let's just have 24 instruments [TS]

00:18:12   all playing at one [TS]

00:18:13   it's there's still a little bit of that [TS]

00:18:15   like okay and then the acoustic guitar [TS]

00:18:17   comes in but then when it goes away it [TS]

00:18:19   goes away and it isn't replaced by [TS]

00:18:23   something it's just like everything does [TS]

00:18:26   a little bit of work and then goes I [TS]

00:18:30   don't know I admire it so much it is so [TS]

00:18:32   evocative I said almost on rumors the [TS]

00:18:34   never known back again and down yes I [TS]

00:18:38   mean and I'm like that's the just think [TS]

00:18:42   it's because a great creepy a lot of the [TS]

00:18:44   songs are our little creepy [TS]

00:18:46   yeah close harmonies a Lindsey [TS]

00:18:49   Buckingham is intrinsically creepy you [TS]

00:18:52   know but he and Brady spits he and [TS]

00:18:56   christine mcvie are playing on [TS]

00:18:58   sentimental lady mm you know that you [TS]

00:19:00   hear that impeccable guitar sound here [TS]

00:19:02   uh I mean that's Christine McVie because [TS]

00:19:06   you know he used to be when he was doing [TS]

00:19:07   even more cocaine i think i don't know i [TS]

00:19:09   think it's cocaine use it just went up [TS]

00:19:10   and up and up but he has to be an [TS]

00:19:12   employee with mac for I think a couple [TS]

00:19:13   years who did [TS]

00:19:15   oh I'm sorry Bob Welch oh oh icic yeah [TS]

00:19:19   he was in fleetwood mac in the interval [TS]

00:19:20   into regular he was in the the [TS]

00:19:23   transitional Fleetwood Mac he might have [TS]

00:19:25   maybe guy I used to know this by heart [TS]

00:19:27   here I think I know something is not [TS]

00:19:29   google me I'm trying to do that he [TS]

00:19:32   wasn't on the rumors but I think he [TS]

00:19:34   might have been on the rebooted [TS]

00:19:36   Fleetwood Mac record let's go look at [TS]

00:19:38   our friend wikipedia right boys a real [TS]

00:19:40   creepy guy smoking a big cigar in this [TS]

00:19:42   video's yeah yeah yeah he died what well [TS]

00:19:45   you know that happens [TS]

00:19:47   yeah a lot of a lot of people have died [TS]

00:19:51   when you put it that way you know what I [TS]

00:19:58   mean John Lennon died [TS]

00:19:59   yeah died right thoughts ice pick [TS]

00:20:03   I said head yet I boom yeah I well she [TS]

00:20:08   is 71 invited to join there's friction [TS]

00:20:11   in the band believe it or not there was [TS]

00:20:12   friction in fleetwood mac antfee where [TS]

00:20:14   it was before [TS]

00:20:16   there weren't even any girls in the [TS]

00:20:18   and already fiction maybe he didn't have [TS]

00:20:20   anyone to get on the side maybe that [TS]

00:20:24   maybe was Dylan john mcvie that's why [TS]

00:20:25   Christine got involved she was like i'm [TS]

00:20:28   joined this band now what a terrible [TS]

00:20:31   idea [TS]

00:20:32   you don't have tonight like having sex [TS]

00:20:33   with other people in your band who are [TS]

00:20:35   married to other people in your band [TS]

00:20:36   what a terrible idea [TS]

00:20:37   it's a pretty terrible idea i have been [TS]

00:20:39   in bands with gals that i have found [TS]

00:20:42   attractive even and that's got me was [TS]

00:20:45   that was it is a very handsome woman [TS]

00:20:47   yeah I've always drawn the line I just [TS]

00:20:49   feel like you know it's bad it's bad [TS]

00:20:51   what's better is I mean it's dead yet [TS]

00:20:52   business its work like what it's what a [TS]

00:20:54   terrible idea although there are all [TS]

00:20:57   kinds of situations where it's like I [TS]

00:20:58   don't like that guitar part that you're [TS]

00:21:00   playing I don't think you know and then [TS]

00:21:04   the other person says like it's not it's [TS]

00:21:06   my guitar parts not your place to say [TS]

00:21:07   and if you could just say like let's [TS]

00:21:10   fuck that would hear a lot of times [TS]

00:21:14   resolved the issue if you could have [TS]

00:21:17   done it with Mike Squires just think how [TS]

00:21:19   much how much attention you could have [TS]

00:21:20   releases just blown off the tension and [TS]

00:21:24   then it's just like you know what it [TS]

00:21:25   turns out i love your guitar parts are [TS]

00:21:27   thanks I'm learning here let's see em in [TS]

00:21:32   1972 six months after the release of [TS]

00:21:34   future games the band released Fleetwood [TS]

00:21:36   Mac release bare trees which featured [TS]

00:21:38   watches song sentimental lady and [TS]

00:21:39   original version of sentimental lady [TS]

00:21:41   what on a Fleetwood Mac wrecker [TS]

00:21:44   home this is why you dig into the deep [TS]

00:21:46   cuts yeah i want to go i just am [TS]

00:21:50   listening to this one song over and over [TS]

00:21:51   five years so I mean I i was thinking [TS]

00:21:54   about it it kind of goes against my hole [TS]

00:21:57   like I'm not a fan of things a premise [TS]

00:22:02   better stopping and then but then it [TS]

00:22:04   goes all the way through to the other [TS]

00:22:06   side of the i'm not a fan of things [TS]

00:22:08   premise to like oh sure i'm a fan of [TS]

00:22:11   things sometimes this is why i'm not a [TS]

00:22:12   fan of things because if I really like [TS]

00:22:15   something i'll just look I'll just enjoy [TS]

00:22:17   it alone for five years darling that's [TS]

00:22:20   not the way to really absorb a lot of [TS]

00:22:23   culture you know I met Dan Harmon the [TS]

00:22:24   other day I wait I know this Dan Harmon [TS]

00:22:27   is the guy from the TV show that's right [TS]

00:22:29   ok and and I and I made the classic I've [TS]

00:22:33   only done this a few times in my life [TS]

00:22:34   but but but one whatever i do it blows [TS]

00:22:38   up in my face I said there's some [TS]

00:22:42   there's some guys they were like you got [TS]

00:22:44   to meet Dan Harmon i was like i don't i [TS]

00:22:45   don't really care to meet Dan Harmon I [TS]

00:22:48   don't know what do you get it was gonna [TS]

00:22:50   say you know well so let me tell you [TS]

00:22:52   what I said look they're like no no you [TS]

00:22:54   guys got to meet each other's is really [TS]

00:22:55   important like you're like all right [TS]

00:22:59   ok so find out me Dan Harmon so I walk [TS]

00:23:02   in and dan harmon's in there and he's [TS]

00:23:03   you know kept pacing the room he [TS]

00:23:05   obviously he gives up the energy of [TS]

00:23:07   being like a lion right he's in charge [TS]

00:23:09   of the room he's the reason that the [TS]

00:23:11   room was built to house Dan Harmon for [TS]

00:23:14   this short amount of time and and I and [TS]

00:23:18   I like that energy i appreciate that [TS]

00:23:19   energy here's a you know here's a like [TS]

00:23:21   there's a Greybeard hoop kind of feels [TS]

00:23:25   like every room in the world was built [TS]

00:23:26   to house him every room he ever enters [TS]

00:23:28   and and you know my interlocutors take [TS]

00:23:34   me over and say like John rock Dan [TS]

00:23:37   Harmon Harmon John Rother can I put out [TS]

00:23:38   my hand and I say you're ready for this [TS]

00:23:40   god I say hi nice to meet you big fan [TS]

00:23:44   because because I don't know why I had a [TS]

00:23:50   I don't have you ever seen this program [TS]

00:23:53   no okay see that's that's what I was [TS]

00:23:55   worried about ya i have one time [TS]

00:23:57   Jonathan Coulton said you really gotta [TS]

00:23:59   see this episode of community which is [TS]

00:24:02   like the Christmas episode and it they [TS]

00:24:04   do it as a musical and he showed it to [TS]

00:24:07   me and I thought it was very charming [TS]

00:24:08   but that is the only one of any of his [TS]

00:24:12   things I have seen so I walking out now [TS]

00:24:14   technically in the usual sense of the [TS]

00:24:15   phrase a big fan but I really and he [TS]

00:24:19   turned somebody makes you watch your [TS]

00:24:20   show but maybe what I I could have said [TS]

00:24:23   that I John Roberts somebody made me [TS]

00:24:24   watch one of your shows one time I just [TS]

00:24:26   gotta face [TS]

00:24:28   I don't know why that one time that the [TS]

00:24:31   the hilarious 11 time 10-15 years ago [TS]

00:24:34   Shawn Nelson and I were standing there [TS]

00:24:36   and a guy comes up and says hi at a bar [TS]

00:24:40   and I mistook him for someone else and I [TS]

00:24:44   was like oh hey man great to see you hey [TS]

00:24:47   great show the other night and the guy [TS]

00:24:51   looked at me and was like what show i [TS]

00:24:53   don't go and in the moment that he and [TS]

00:24:55   he was a guitar player an entertainer [TS]

00:24:57   but it was just a different guy than I [TS]

00:25:00   thought and in the moment that he's [TS]

00:25:01   saying that I'm realizing a that I had [TS]

00:25:05   it wrong and he's like what show and I [TS]

00:25:07   said no all the great shows on now all [TS]

00:25:11   the great shows that you have played big [TS]

00:25:15   big fan and so Sean still like well [TS]

00:25:19   every once in a while you know say to me [TS]

00:25:21   like all the crates shows the kind of [TS]

00:25:23   like as a bit of a shutdown but anyway [TS]

00:25:27   so I say to Dan Harmon hey hi nice to [TS]

00:25:29   meet you big fan and i don't i'm [TS]

00:25:31   thinking that he's at this thing and [TS]

00:25:32   that everybody's a big fan of his and [TS]

00:25:35   that this is just going to be some [TS]

00:25:36   social lubricant where I go [TS]

00:25:37   hi big fan and he's gonna go hi thanks a [TS]

00:25:39   lot and it's going to be it's another [TS]

00:25:41   thing is you didn't go wrong in a sense [TS]

00:25:43   that that is a really good generic thing [TS]

00:25:46   to say to somebody where you know it's [TS]

00:25:47   going to be a 15-second interaction [TS]

00:25:49   because it takes a lot of the pressure [TS]

00:25:50   off except that he shakes my hand looks [TS]

00:25:54   at me and goes oh yeah fan of what [TS]

00:25:57   and I went uh arm you know some of your [TS]

00:26:02   old shows and I don't get out [TS]

00:26:05   I'm like some of your old shows and she [TS]

00:26:08   says which one time and I and he's i [TS]

00:26:13   don't know whether he senses that he's [TS]

00:26:15   got me on the ropes something here for [TS]

00:26:16   you guys to watch you swing he's trying [TS]

00:26:20   to kill me now I mean I just I walked [TS]

00:26:21   into the Lions Den covered in fucking [TS]

00:26:24   hamburger and I'm like uh and then I'm I [TS]

00:26:28   don't even remember the name of his show [TS]

00:26:30   that I did see one episode of and I'm [TS]

00:26:32   I'm like uh a community and he goes oh [TS]

00:26:39   you mean the one that's back on the air [TS]

00:26:41   now mm he's not gonna let you off [TS]

00:26:45   it's not letting me go and everybody in [TS]

00:26:47   the room is like like watching a lion [TS]

00:26:51   take apart a lamb and I'm sitting there [TS]

00:26:54   like still still clinging to this the to [TS]

00:26:57   the to the to the little tail lights on [TS]

00:27:00   the train of big fan that I see [TS]

00:27:04   disappearing into the message there goes [TS]

00:27:06   the Train big fan big fan train and I'm [TS]

00:27:09   standing there and I you know and i and [TS]

00:27:11   part of me wants to be like you got me i [TS]

00:27:14   have never seen anything you've done [TS]

00:27:15   I've heard your name i guess i read it [TS]

00:27:17   wired once people talk about you like [TS]

00:27:19   you are important and matter and i just [TS]

00:27:22   wanted to be part of that for a second [TS]

00:27:25   really just time to go for me now and he [TS]

00:27:29   and he just he presses the he presses in [TS]

00:27:34   and so I am trying to convert and you [TS]

00:27:38   know Joel McHale is a long winter span [TS]

00:27:41   that's cool and that's the star of the [TS]

00:27:44   case for our community and he and I have [TS]

00:27:46   had many many good times he's come to [TS]

00:27:48   many long winter shows we've like we do [TS]

00:27:52   a lot of we ran into each other once at [TS]

00:27:54   legoland in san diego special did you [TS]

00:27:57   decide to pivot to Joel Joel McHale and [TS]

00:27:59   I have a lot of good history and so I [TS]

00:28:04   decided to try to pivot to [TS]

00:28:06   haha this is not gonna be good [TS]

00:28:09   except as i'm picking it's like you've [TS]

00:28:12   brought in a different coupon from a [TS]

00:28:14   different part that's like giving like [TS]

00:28:16   well actually I know a couple of people [TS]

00:28:21   on your show as i'm doing it i can't [TS]

00:28:28   remember joel mchale's name he says [TS]

00:28:32   crude because joel mchale has a name [TS]

00:28:36   kind of like Nick Drake he's got one of [TS]

00:28:38   those one of those my friend market [TS]

00:28:39   calls it the snap to grid name where it [TS]

00:28:41   sounds like lots of other names gonna go [TS]

00:28:43   you know what I Joel Grey is running [TS]

00:28:46   jumping over a john mccrae that guy with [TS]

00:28:48   the hair that Joe Joe mar kale and you [TS]

00:28:53   get your sledging it that's so I'm like [TS]

00:28:56   you know big and he's like oh yeah [TS]

00:28:58   whatever though the show the back in [TS]

00:28:59   there and I'm like oh well yeah I mean [TS]

00:29:00   I'm come kind of pretty good friends [TS]

00:29:02   with the couple of people on the show [TS]

00:29:04   and he's like who [TS]

00:29:05   oh god and i can't remember his name and [TS]

00:29:09   I'm like rm10 and so Gillian Jacobs what [TS]

00:29:14   I've met her a couple of times in LA and [TS]

00:29:19   I fell in immediately in love with her [TS]

00:29:21   did I ever tell you that story now we [TS]

00:29:23   were at the Chateau Marmont and in at [TS]

00:29:27   first glance i felt like oh here's a [TS]

00:29:29   little blonde actress like I'm not that [TS]

00:29:32   I and others [TS]

00:29:33   I'm not predisposed to be interested in [TS]

00:29:35   her but we're standing and looking out [TS]

00:29:38   over the balcony and LA and and she says [TS]

00:29:43   see that building over there and I was [TS]

00:29:45   like yeah [TS]

00:29:47   and kind of distracted not even paying [TS]

00:29:49   much attention and she says that [TS]

00:29:51   building was built by the guy who built [TS]

00:29:55   the original garden of Allah which is [TS]

00:29:58   where Groucho Marx met Joan Didion in [TS]

00:30:05   the piano and I was just like I kind of [TS]

00:30:07   slow take a look over at her like you [TS]

00:30:11   are blowing my mind right now and then [TS]

00:30:13   she starts talking about the tile in the [TS]

00:30:15   bathroom of the of this building that [TS]

00:30:18   once that was torn down many years ago [TS]

00:30:20   and over the course of 20 minutes she [TS]

00:30:23   reveals that she knows all of the [TS]

00:30:26   architecture all of the historical [TS]

00:30:28   architecture of La that it's just one of [TS]

00:30:30   the many fascinating little l elements [TS]

00:30:38   aspects of her of her like expansive [TS]

00:30:42   intelligence that's not fair and I was [TS]

00:30:45   like so I'm sitting there all of a [TS]

00:30:47   sudden I'm like well I I'm in love with [TS]

00:30:49   you are you do you have a boyfriend are [TS]

00:30:52   you are you famous actress of some kind [TS]

00:30:55   of you know and have and because I what [TS]

00:30:58   I had never seen her show I was not [TS]

00:30:59   aware that she I didn't know that she [TS]

00:31:01   was a like famous I was just like you [TS]

00:31:05   you are extraordinary did you study [TS]

00:31:08   architecture can we talk more about [TS]

00:31:10   architecture i would like to hear more [TS]

00:31:12   about la through your eyes little guide [TS]

00:31:16   guide to the world for me and she just [TS]

00:31:19   you know she's so she became kind of [TS]

00:31:23   this light in the sky for me like oh my [TS]

00:31:25   god there are people like Gillian Jacobs [TS]

00:31:27   out there in the world dinner that are [TS]

00:31:29   like comedic actresses on popular [TS]

00:31:31   television shows and also interested in [TS]

00:31:34   esoteric architecture stories so I'm a [TS]

00:31:39   little late in life to learn that that's [TS]

00:31:41   pretty painful it's tipped it was [TS]

00:31:43   excruciating and I'm sure that she's [TS]

00:31:46   dating some a guy that has expensive [TS]

00:31:49   sunglasses you know it's just like la [TS]

00:31:51   like you go to LA like [TS]

00:31:52   but in any case i'm looking at Dan [TS]

00:31:57   Harmon and I'm like I know two people on [TS]

00:31:59   your show that i have lots of stories [TS]

00:32:05   about that we can talk about and I can't [TS]

00:32:08   remember either one of their names and [TS]

00:32:10   but I didn't remember to not say that i [TS]

00:32:13   know some people on it show and so that [TS]

00:32:15   he's like who [TS]

00:32:16   yeah and i'm like some actors that are [TS]

00:32:20   on your show and I met you know my you [TS]

00:32:22   can just you can smell the diesel oil [TS]

00:32:25   burning out of my ears and he there are [TS]

00:32:30   other people in the room he could be [TS]

00:32:31   talking to he's telling you though I [TS]

00:32:33   think you're gonna you're gonna be the [TS]

00:32:34   sacrificial lamb literally he has he's [TS]

00:32:37   he plants both feet leans in and is just [TS]

00:32:40   like tell me more about that about the [TS]

00:32:44   actors on my shows that you know and i'm [TS]

00:32:47   like I brr-brr are rare and i'm not even [TS]

00:32:51   I'm not nervous [TS]

00:32:52   I don't care about Dan Harmon in the [TS]

00:32:55   sense of like oh my god I'm talking to [TS]

00:32:56   my hero [TS]

00:32:57   i'm nervous because i am just fucking [TS]

00:32:59   shoving feet in my mouth [TS]

00:33:03   I'm shoving like actors feet that I've [TS]

00:33:08   met a couple of times [TS]

00:33:09   whats in my mouth and eventually we [TS]

00:33:14   arrived at a place where Dan Harmon just [TS]

00:33:17   stops talking and I stopped talking and [TS]

00:33:20   we stand there and he's looking at me [TS]

00:33:23   and I'm looking at him and then I [TS]

00:33:29   remember joel mchale's name and I go [TS]

00:33:32   Joel Joel McHale as it is it to prove [TS]

00:33:39   now you finally proven you know because [TS]

00:33:41   you remember the name of a TV star [TS]

00:33:43   jumped bail is the guy that I know uh [TS]

00:33:47   and it probably ended right there right [TS]

00:33:50   well you just just stood and I stood we [TS]

00:33:56   stared and I and I finally I mean this [TS]

00:33:59   whole thing only lasted [TS]

00:34:02   I can only imagine it was not very long [TS]

00:34:04   but it seemed like a thousand years and [TS]

00:34:07   I finally was just like okay all right [TS]

00:34:12   nice meeting you you know just sort of [TS]

00:34:14   like turn and go and it was instructive [TS]

00:34:19   that it was instructive for me that this [TS]

00:34:25   that the that I do a lot of that social [TS]

00:34:28   lubricant of like all the great shows [TS]

00:34:31   big fan [TS]

00:34:33   hi great to see you and i'm not a big [TS]

00:34:36   fan it's not great to see them and i [TS]

00:34:39   don't i don't know I i picked up those [TS]

00:34:43   habits from my dad probably has a way of [TS]

00:34:48   just like moving through a crowd and [TS]

00:34:52   meeting a lot of people and not [TS]

00:34:54   remembering their names you know like [TS]

00:34:56   counselor [TS]

00:34:57   it's a version of all of that but boy [TS]

00:35:01   every once in a while it's just like [TS]

00:35:03   stepping in a bear trap when you when [TS]

00:35:04   you when you encounter someone who is [TS]

00:35:06   prepared to turn around and go oh your [TS]

00:35:08   big fan [TS]

00:35:09   won't you tell me more about that and I [TS]

00:35:11   don't know why I don't know how he [TS]

00:35:12   smelled it or if or if he didn't if he [TS]

00:35:16   just like who I mean maybe maybe [TS]

00:35:19   initially he really wanted to hear me [TS]

00:35:21   praise one of his shows [TS]

00:35:23   I doubt it I don't know pretty pretty [TS]

00:35:27   gross you you accidentally became pretty [TS]

00:35:30   LA I did I did I because isn't that I [TS]

00:35:34   mean that's pretty acceptable their [TS]

00:35:36   right to go i letting you know love you [TS]

00:35:38   when you do the thing in the thing that [TS]

00:35:39   was that's totally like showbiz manager [TS]

00:35:43   greaseball kind of talk like I was [TS]

00:35:47   basically I was basically at cause [TS]

00:35:50   playing a lawyer big fan i worked with a [TS]

00:35:55   couple of people on your show you know [TS]

00:35:57   it's like I kinda you know I I handled [TS]

00:35:59   the divorce of one of your gardeners or [TS]

00:36:01   whatever I I like gum [TS]

00:36:05   I'm Dan Harmon but I i sometimes just [TS]

00:36:08   you know for a little bit of a diversion [TS]

00:36:10   sometimes i like to fuck with PR people [TS]

00:36:12   who don't know you [TS]

00:36:14   do a similar thing we were there like a [TS]

00:36:17   you know I represent the CEO of plastic [TS]

00:36:21   on and know that you'd be really in a [TS]

00:36:23   big big big big fan of your work from [TS]

00:36:25   way back i love you have a chance to [TS]

00:36:27   have an interview with the CEO tomorrow [TS]

00:36:30   you get those kinds of things a lot and [TS]

00:36:33   I usually just you know hit ! in google [TS]

00:36:37   and marketing spam but sometimes i [TS]

00:36:38   responded i'll say wow that sounds [TS]

00:36:40   awesome [TS]

00:36:40   what's your uh what's your second [TS]

00:36:42   favorite thing I've ever done [TS]

00:36:45   let's talk a little bit about like all [TS]

00:36:46   the great stuff I do uh oh my god the [TS]

00:36:49   way you help people with your website [TS]

00:36:51   you haven't updated in four years [TS]

00:36:53   that's oh my god that's amazing the way [TS]

00:36:55   you help people [TS]

00:36:57   yeah that's one of the way I've had [TS]

00:36:59   things like that happens is never done [TS]

00:37:01   anything like that poorly that that guy [TS]

00:37:03   that demands a predator always told he's [TS]

00:37:06   absolutely absolutely predator and he [TS]

00:37:08   was picking his teeth with my shin bones [TS]

00:37:11   yeah and after that and you know [TS]

00:37:13   unfortunately for me it didn't happen on [TS]

00:37:15   stage we were just in a green room [TS]

00:37:17   somewhere and they were like three or [TS]

00:37:18   four people standing around all of whom [TS]

00:37:21   you know went over to see if there were [TS]

00:37:23   any strawberries on the craft services [TS]

00:37:24   table because they couldn't handle the [TS]

00:37:27   that at the fucking smell of blood in [TS]

00:37:30   the air as I'm standing there like hey [TS]

00:37:32   you know what I got a lot of words uh [TS]

00:37:37   for not talking about anything right now [TS]

00:37:39   that I could use those words because I [TS]

00:37:43   don't know what I because I'm because i [TS]

00:37:44   started because i can remember words [TS]

00:37:47   terra I should help man i got a nice to [TS]

00:37:49   meet you [TS]

00:37:50   boom and then gone and look for some [TS]

00:37:52   strawberries myself well you know if I [TS]

00:37:54   bet life is hard for him because I mean [TS]

00:37:56   if we are a little more charitable about [TS]

00:37:57   it maybe it's that he really doesn't [TS]

00:38:00   obviously he doesn't like that kind of [TS]

00:38:01   phony baloney think maybe he's not just [TS]

00:38:03   naturally nothing like an asshole or [TS]

00:38:04   something but I can you imagine like [TS]

00:38:06   trying to keep yourself in an [TS]

00:38:09   environment like that where you actually [TS]

00:38:11   are like you're like you're like me [TS]

00:38:13   you're someone who doesn't like having [TS]

00:38:14   conversations like that and only doesn't [TS]

00:38:16   seem like you sail like when you meet [TS]

00:38:18   the Queen or we make sure you say Your [TS]

00:38:20   Majesty versus your highness or whatever [TS]

00:38:22   you gotta learn the right way to do it [TS]

00:38:23   so don't piss anybody off but it's not [TS]

00:38:25   fun to live like that it's not fun to [TS]

00:38:27   act like that's a basis for [TS]

00:38:29   relationships or business so I mean you [TS]

00:38:31   know I wonder if he has a reputation for [TS]

00:38:33   being like hard to work with or [TS]

00:38:34   something who knows I mean everybody [TS]

00:38:36   seems to admire him and I certainly [TS]

00:38:38   admire the way that he despatched me but [TS]

00:38:44   I not enough that i'm going to ever go [TS]

00:38:47   watch a television show that was shown [TS]

00:38:48   but still are not here not here is not [TS]

00:38:51   anybody's right but but but that was uh [TS]

00:38:54   yeah that was really that was another [TS]

00:38:56   one of the all the great shows moments [TS]

00:38:59   where I feel like I can be a little bit [TS]

00:39:03   more little bit more careful about show [TS]

00:39:07   business but you know it's it it is akin [TS]

00:39:11   to show busy but really it is like [TS]

00:39:14   really it's like regional politics you [TS]

00:39:17   know what I mean like it's it's really a [TS]

00:39:20   way of of making your way through a [TS]

00:39:22   fundraiser [TS]

00:39:23   um I think of it as being a little bit [TS]

00:39:27   like maybe not magic trick but an [TS]

00:39:31   illusion [TS]

00:39:32   we're like for example like if you're [TS]

00:39:33   one of those phony baloney psychics and [TS]

00:39:35   you learn how to do cold readings and [TS]

00:39:37   the thing is like a lot of people who [TS]

00:39:38   would be amazed what somebody who's good [TS]

00:39:41   at cold readings can pull off especially [TS]

00:39:43   if you believe in the cold reading but [TS]

00:39:46   somebody is good at cold reading [TS]

00:39:48   and read you really quickly and then [TS]

00:39:51   pull out certain factors that you're [TS]

00:39:52   very likely to agree with early on they [TS]

00:39:55   end up giving more information to you [TS]

00:39:56   and then pretty soon its own seems like [TS]

00:39:58   they know your whole life and that i [TS]

00:39:59   think in some ways when you're trying to [TS]

00:40:00   survive a reason regional politics [TS]

00:40:02   that's kind of what it is if you say [TS]

00:40:04   something that you know most people that [TS]

00:40:05   this person looks like agree with you're [TS]

00:40:08   already on the right track [TS]

00:40:09   yeah we can like lead the conversation [TS]

00:40:11   something we're going to give you enough [TS]

00:40:13   information that you can pay them a [TS]

00:40:14   compliment before going in refreshing [TS]

00:40:16   your drink [TS]

00:40:16   yeah I'm pretty good at that [TS]

00:40:20   normally if this was a bad situation was [TS]

00:40:23   reversed if Dan Harmon had come up to me [TS]

00:40:28   and said oh hey big fan i might have [TS]

00:40:31   said oh really of what I i do that that [TS]

00:40:36   same thing when I feel like I'm being [TS]

00:40:39   showbiz uh I mean but you can also do it [TS]

00:40:44   in and I do it I hopefully in a [TS]

00:40:45   non-stick way of going if i get that [TS]

00:40:47   somebody's actually you know saying [TS]

00:40:49   something really nice about which thing [TS]

00:40:50   is it this thing or that thing all [TS]

00:40:52   thanks that that's that's a conversation [TS]

00:40:53   you can have for sure he's making i'm [TS]

00:40:56   guessing game [TS]

00:40:57   well and the thing is if I had said I [TS]

00:40:59   mean I have I have Dan Harmon's a [TS]

00:41:01   Wikipedia page here if I had said you [TS]

00:41:04   are really ready for next time i was a [TS]

00:41:06   big fan of your animated adult swim [TS]

00:41:09   animated television series Rick and [TS]

00:41:11   Morty with Justin roline bend and Rob [TS]

00:41:16   trabe prob [TS]

00:41:18   mhm he would have been a he would have [TS]

00:41:21   been like Oh Rick and Morty was she born [TS]

00:41:24   on january third was in 1973 right super [TS]

00:41:29   big fan of the way your ear you have a [TS]

00:41:32   beard sometimes and us just to scruff I [TS]

00:41:35   don't be thinking of a different Dan [TS]

00:41:37   Harmon are you the one who co-founded [TS]

00:41:39   the television network / website channel [TS]

00:41:42   101 was that yeah where you [TS]

00:41:43   emmy-nominated part about things I [TS]

00:41:47   listened to an eponymous podcast called [TS]

00:41:49   harmontown is that you google glass you [TS]

00:41:53   even the real fire at Google glass it by [TS]

00:41:56   it only had google fucking glass [TS]

00:41:59   anyway that's my little oh you know in [TS]

00:42:02   addition to Dan Harmon i also met a guy [TS]

00:42:05   another dan oh yeah i saw photo that [TS]

00:42:10   yeah I met Dan Benjamin yeah how'd that [TS]

00:42:12   go [TS]

00:42:13   a guy you know I wasn't really familiar [TS]

00:42:14   with his work foo [TS]

00:42:16   but you're not you're not a big podcast [TS]

00:42:19   listener but i really liked him [TS]

00:42:22   what a nice guy everybody said that he [TS]

00:42:24   was a that he was a kitten killer and a [TS]

00:42:27   Pollock Austin I but he's a really nice [TS]

00:42:29   guy is very tidy is very clean [TS]

00:42:32   he's a clean old man I'm glad you got to [TS]

00:42:37   meet and that seems like that seems like [TS]

00:42:39   one of those you know Elvis and Nixon [TS]

00:42:40   kind of things [TS]

00:42:41   it was really it was really great you [TS]

00:42:43   know and that despite his fame tidiness [TS]

00:42:47   he will he will be hugged me multiple [TS]

00:42:51   times [TS]

00:42:51   Wow and I am famously untidy so very [TS]

00:42:56   very huggable though who knows what he [TS]

00:42:58   picked up for me it was basically like [TS]

00:43:00   licking a hotel room remote haha tip to [TS]

00:43:05   hug me in the middle of the day I'm glad [TS]

00:43:09   you got it doesn't really nice picture [TS]

00:43:10   and you get things here for your finger [TS]

00:43:11   splint in the patient finger splint yeah [TS]

00:43:13   yeah you got him [TS]

00:43:14   that's a that that's so how was the guy [TS]

00:43:17   asked how the how the event was I mean [TS]

00:43:19   people this sounds like church for a lot [TS]

00:43:21   of people they love this XOXO event XOXO [TS]

00:43:24   is a great event you know I go to a lot [TS]

00:43:27   of things now that are somewhat similar [TS]

00:43:29   to this I guess I had an expectation [TS]

00:43:32   that it would be then the new genre of [TS]

00:43:36   the unconference yeah right it's like Oh [TS]

00:43:38   a conference right okay an unconference [TS]

00:43:40   conference it's like a full of people [TS]

00:43:44   who make computer maths and they're [TS]

00:43:50   talking about it to each other [TS]

00:43:53   ok I'll go to this shirt but when I got [TS]

00:43:56   there and went to the events and met the [TS]

00:43:59   people that attend the conference I was [TS]

00:44:02   like extremely pleasantly surprised with [TS]

00:44:06   food smart people it's it's an example [TS]

00:44:09   of a thing where where where some people [TS]

00:44:13   put together at an event where all of [TS]

00:44:15   the it felt like a room full of people [TS]

00:44:18   that all knowing that our live all [TS]

00:44:20   around the world and all know each other [TS]

00:44:22   on the internet better than they know [TS]

00:44:23   the people that better than they know [TS]

00:44:25   their actual friends and people that [TS]

00:44:27   live in their town and this was that [TS]

00:44:30   this was the one of a couple times a [TS]

00:44:33   year where they all got to be together [TS]

00:44:34   and really be like really express in [TS]

00:44:38   meatspace the family that they they feel [TS]

00:44:42   like they are right and it was great you [TS]

00:44:45   know it was a place where a where [TS]

00:44:48   everybody got it so i was i was very [TS]

00:44:51   pleased very pleased to meet all those [TS]

00:44:52   people and have those exchanges [TS]

00:44:55   yeah it's a there's something special [TS]

00:44:57   about that getting to be around people [TS]

00:44:59   and I think it's a very intentional [TS]

00:45:01   conference I mean I think being somewhat [TS]

00:45:03   famously have a system for trying to get [TS]

00:45:06   to even come there you've got I mean the [TS]

00:45:08   heart of it is you've got to really want [TS]

00:45:09   it [TS]

00:45:10   yeah you couldn't there were it was like [TS]

00:45:12   an amazing we dish bag free tech [TS]

00:45:17   conference [TS]

00:45:18   yeah i think it's hard not that not that [TS]

00:45:21   they won't be able to do this but it's [TS]

00:45:23   it's hard to maintain that because it's [TS]

00:45:25   expensive to do I mean I'm trying to [TS]

00:45:27   avoid talking about South by Southwest [TS]

00:45:28   but you know everybody's been two things [TS]

00:45:30   where you go and then you go for years [TS]

00:45:32   later and you're like wow there's a lot [TS]

00:45:35   of girls with almost no clothes giving [TS]

00:45:37   away cups of energy drinks here who any [TS]

00:45:39   and and then you know it's funny the why [TS]

00:45:41   you were describing the the Dan Harmon [TS]

00:45:43   affair by the way he did the co-created [TS]

00:45:45   the television pilot for heat vision and [TS]

00:45:47   Jack which i recommend you see if you [TS]

00:45:49   haven't seen it that right heat vision [TS]

00:45:50   and Jack I feel like this encounter with [TS]

00:45:52   an arm is all the Dan Harmon I can take [TS]

00:45:55   for a while I don't know [TS]

00:45:56   I'm totally sympathetic if I go watch [TS]

00:45:59   one of these shows now and I'm like this [TS]

00:46:00   is incredible [TS]

00:46:02   then I'm really going to be bummed that [TS]

00:46:05   i actually am a fan of his and yeah so [TS]

00:46:10   I'm gonna I'm gonna take a year maybe a [TS]

00:46:11   year off from Dan Harmon I think it's [TS]

00:46:13   gonna be a Harman sabbatical get home [TS]

00:46:16   RRR my magical the thing that I don't [TS]

00:46:19   know I I don't render this as much as I [TS]

00:46:20   used to [TS]

00:46:21   because I don't I try to avoid things [TS]

00:46:23   where this is SOP for the thing I hate [TS]

00:46:25   is the kind of energy so you got the [TS]

00:46:27   interaction with Dan Harmon that was [TS]

00:46:29   awkward but what's the alternative is [TS]

00:46:31   you go and you have this this discussion [TS]

00:46:36   with somebody who's trying to suss out [TS]

00:46:38   whether you're worth their time [TS]

00:46:39   yeah and they're trying to roughly [TS]

00:46:41   estimate how much money you make [TS]

00:46:43   i think is what it comes down to for a [TS]

00:46:45   lobbyist bags well I'm what but the [TS]

00:46:47   thing about the thing about Dan Harmon [TS]

00:46:48   is I had just gotten off the stage and [TS]

00:46:51   giving a presentation that i was proud [TS]

00:46:54   of and he was the next presenter but it [TS]

00:47:00   was clear as I was being introduced to [TS]

00:47:02   him that he had not seen my presentation [TS]

00:47:05   and so what would have been an effect [TS]

00:47:11   what would have been a good introduction [TS]

00:47:12   was that the people say hey Dan Harmon [TS]

00:47:16   this is john Roderick and Dan Harmon [TS]

00:47:17   goes oh hey man i really liked your talk [TS]

00:47:20   that you just gave but I was I was I [TS]

00:47:24   think throwing a little off balance [TS]

00:47:25   because that would have been nice but [TS]

00:47:27   instead he's just gave me like shark [TS]

00:47:30   eyes like he had just entered the [TS]

00:47:32   building so then it was kind of on like [TS]

00:47:35   not whatever would have introduced me [TS]

00:47:37   not there wouldn't have been a better [TS]

00:47:39   introduction then that you just saw my [TS]

00:47:41   presentation right and since he and he [TS]

00:47:45   was looking at me definitely like well I [TS]

00:47:46   don't have not heard your name nor have [TS]

00:47:48   i seen your username on credits of [TS]

00:47:52   things that I like so it's on you buddy [TS]

00:47:55   and that was yeah i'm not going to [TS]

00:47:58   revisit this now they're hiring an issue [TS]

00:48:00   anymore enough set but uh I did feel uh [TS]

00:48:07   I did feel very much like I I [TS]

00:48:10   that I didn't actually at this [TS]

00:48:11   conference a tremendous sympathy for you [TS]

00:48:13   because at the XOXO conference you would [TS]

00:48:21   if you had attended like you are God to [TS]

00:48:25   those people and everybody there with [TS]

00:48:29   the exception of Dan Harmon knew me and [TS]

00:48:32   they knew me because of this podcast but [TS]

00:48:36   they knew me because I was a person [TS]

00:48:39   proximate to Merlin Mann and Merlin Mann [TS]

00:48:43   is the center of all things up and it [TS]

00:48:46   and it was it was very interesting [TS]

00:48:49   because it because as I walked around [TS]

00:48:51   the conference there was a lot of like [TS]

00:48:53   strange sort of fight club energy where [TS]

00:48:58   where I was unaware that I was sometimes [TS]

00:49:04   Brad Pitt because I was just walking [TS]

00:49:07   around and people would I walked past a [TS]

00:49:10   group of total strangers and they were [TS]

00:49:11   all nod in unison ago [TS]

00:49:13   good afternoon sir although they want to [TS]

00:49:16   get on your bad side or they just wanted [TS]

00:49:18   to acknowledge hello [TS]

00:49:20   we know you like you know if you want [TS]

00:49:24   clean food i suggest you not get the [TS]

00:49:26   clam chowder there was like a little a [TS]

00:49:29   little sense of like we know to stay [TS]

00:49:31   away but we also want to you know show [TS]

00:49:33   our respect like people would give me [TS]

00:49:35   little salutes and stuff that's nice [TS]

00:49:38   it was very nice but what I realized and [TS]

00:49:41   someone someone pointed this out and [TS]

00:49:43   gave me like a great kind of insight [TS]

00:49:46   into my my place in these situations [TS]

00:49:51   through these scenarios which was that [TS]

00:49:53   Merlin Mann is the god of all things and [TS]

00:49:57   Merlin Mann is occasionally differential [TS]

00:50:01   to you John Roderick so if Merlin defers [TS]

00:50:05   to you sometimes it means that you have [TS]

00:50:09   there there's a transference where the [TS]

00:50:13   where you know like the king of the [TS]

00:50:16   kingmaker but yeah the King occasionally [TS]

00:50:19   takes your counsel and so you must be [TS]

00:50:21   like a real [TS]

00:50:23   mandarin and I you know and I that was [TS]

00:50:28   very insightful of this person to point [TS]

00:50:31   out but also like very true and if you [TS]

00:50:33   had been at the XOXO conference so this [TS]

00:50:36   is where the sympathy for you comes from [TS]

00:50:37   if you had been there you would have had [TS]

00:50:40   to have stood next to an exit possibly [TS]

00:50:44   an elevator shaft with an elaborate [TS]

00:50:47   system of ropes and pulleys where you [TS]

00:50:50   could make your escape at any moment [TS]

00:50:52   because if you stopped moving for a [TS]

00:50:55   second you would have been mobbed my [TS]

00:50:57   that fires a very nice of you to [TS]

00:51:00   something like but like but exactly the [TS]

00:51:02   kind of people you want super smart [TS]

00:51:04   people who are actually making things in [TS]

00:51:06   their own worlds you know not mobbed by [TS]

00:51:09   by dummies mobbed by people who really [TS]

00:51:12   know you and love you but mobbed [TS]

00:51:14   nonetheless and thanks for saying that [TS]

00:51:17   that's I i think i actually uh how can I [TS]

00:51:22   say this without sounding like a dark i [TS]

00:51:23   enjoy that I mean I really i like mean [TS]

00:51:26   people i like going places you said [TS]

00:51:28   something one of our very early episodes [TS]

00:51:30   i laughed when he said that you were an [TS]

00:51:32   introvert i laughed and laughed and then [TS]

00:51:34   you described an introvert deciding [TS]

00:51:37   whether you're an introvert and [TS]

00:51:38   extrovert or whatever based on how much [TS]

00:51:41   energy you get from being around other [TS]

00:51:43   people and I've realized that I'm [TS]

00:51:45   extremely extroverted up to a point and [TS]

00:51:48   then I kind of flip at a certain point [TS]

00:51:49   and I get a little like okay I need to [TS]

00:51:52   just go watch some cartoon network now [TS]

00:51:54   you know it's burning gas right but you [TS]

00:51:57   know you and I share a similar branding [TS]

00:52:00   challenge which which on the face of it [TS]

00:52:02   is is we [TS]

00:52:04   well I hear people say this about both [TS]

00:52:06   of us and I can't decide how i feel [TS]

00:52:08   about it because on the one hand it's [TS]

00:52:09   nice on the one hand it's it's kind of [TS]

00:52:11   pretentious but they say you are so much [TS]

00:52:14   nicer than I expected [TS]

00:52:15   oh yeah I hear that a lot said about you [TS]

00:52:17   all the time and I have heard people say [TS]

00:52:18   that about me it's like what a quick you [TS]

00:52:20   imagine like the jews did you think that [TS]

00:52:23   I was gonna sit there and make jokes [TS]

00:52:24   about your mom like what up what you [TS]

00:52:26   might affect my favorite thing that I [TS]

00:52:28   get a from this from people who listen [TS]

00:52:31   to this podcast are the ones that come [TS]

00:52:32   up in there like [TS]

00:52:33   they want to they want to indicate to me [TS]

00:52:36   that they know that a lot of what we [TS]

00:52:40   talked about a lot of what i say on the [TS]

00:52:42   podcast isn't true or you know it's it's [TS]

00:52:45   it's I think it's hard sometimes the way [TS]

00:52:47   i would put it I think it's hard to tell [TS]

00:52:49   sometimes [TS]

00:52:50   what were exaggerating about and how [TS]

00:52:52   much right especially given that i never [TS]

00:52:56   exaggerate [TS]

00:52:57   absolutely and that everything i say is [TS]

00:52:59   100-percent can read write that down [TS]

00:53:02   did did I uh did I pee in a Mickey's big [TS]

00:53:06   mouth bottle and give it to a sailor in [TS]

00:53:08   a strip club girl named Lola was dancing [TS]

00:53:11   yes could I have made that up what I've [TS]

00:53:14   no to everything I say by definition do [TS]

00:53:18   do i go out in my yard in the middle of [TS]

00:53:20   the night in a bathrobe with a sword and [TS]

00:53:21   talk two raccoons [TS]

00:53:22   yes what part of the podcast seems [TS]

00:53:26   untrue to you people is what I want to [TS]

00:53:29   say to people who come up to me at [TS]

00:53:31   conferences and say like wink wink when [TS]

00:53:35   i first started listening to your [TS]

00:53:36   podcast I didn't think it was AI thought [TS]

00:53:38   it was I thought you were pulling our [TS]

00:53:39   leg or something [TS]

00:53:40   I'm like uh-huh you're not heated this [TS]

00:53:43   is not that you are you are you are big [TS]

00:53:46   fan of me right now but in the wrong [TS]

00:53:48   here hit that you're saying the wrong [TS]

00:53:49   thing to me the right thing to say is I [TS]

00:53:53   thought that everything you said on the [TS]

00:53:55   podcast was true and now that I meet you [TS]

00:53:57   I see that it's only scratching the [TS]

00:53:58   surface [TS]

00:54:01   yeah the the thing that I encounter and [TS]

00:54:05   I'm sense of really weird topic to talk [TS]

00:54:08   about but the thing that I encountered [TS]

00:54:09   that i have a funny relationship with is [TS]

00:54:12   this and you must get this in spades [TS]

00:54:15   because of this program is people who on [TS]

00:54:19   the one hand you're already almost kind [TS]

00:54:21   of like friends with like you know you [TS]

00:54:22   maybe even have kind of conversations [TS]

00:54:24   with them on twitter or something like [TS]

00:54:26   you kind of know them but they also want [TS]

00:54:28   to address you in particular i'm [TS]

00:54:29   guessing kind of in character like they [TS]

00:54:31   want to tell they want to come up and [TS]

00:54:33   say you got there I got a small bag [TS]

00:54:34   packed or something like that and [TS]

00:54:36   sometimes it's hard to you know it's [TS]

00:54:39   hard to to square that you know it like [TS]

00:54:41   that that's the kind of like that's a [TS]

00:54:42   high-five you just like yeah fraid so [TS]

00:54:46   train yeah it's a beginning they get out [TS]

00:54:48   if they want a sentence and talk about [TS]

00:54:50   supertrain that's a different matter [TS]

00:54:53   well I mean it's one of those things you [TS]

00:54:55   you can only really say so much about it [TS]

00:54:57   it's it's not going to change your your [TS]

00:54:59   destiny [TS]

00:55:00   that's that's something that you're just [TS]

00:55:01   gonna have to deal with when it comes [TS]

00:55:02   that's right that's right don't think [TS]

00:55:04   you're gonna sweet-talk your way into [TS]

00:55:05   this are usually talk the talk and [TS]

00:55:07   ongoing like thing you did all the shows [TS]

00:55:09   the clog the clause does with the clock [TS]

00:55:12   will do [TS]

00:55:14   yeah you know I think I just this is [TS]

00:55:17   probably just know it's not just it's [TS]

00:55:20   hugely apart of having you know family [TS]

00:55:24   stuff to do but i just don't get away [TS]

00:55:26   for things like that as much as I used [TS]

00:55:28   to it it's expensive and you have to fly [TS]

00:55:31   and I guess I've just gotten it's not [TS]

00:55:34   that I don't like being around people i [TS]

00:55:35   really do it's just that if if it's not [TS]

00:55:37   paid for you know and to where I can [TS]

00:55:40   sort of defend it as a work thing I just [TS]

00:55:43   it's hard for me to make it to a lot of [TS]

00:55:45   fun stuff like that because of the whole [TS]

00:55:47   time i feel kind of guilty conscience [TS]

00:55:49   about being there about spending the [TS]

00:55:50   money about being away from home and [TS]

00:55:52   things like that but uh I mean I still [TS]

00:55:54   really enjoy things like that I just I [TS]

00:55:55   just like started talking Boston was [TS]

00:55:57   fantastic I mean it was it was great to [TS]

00:55:59   go and meet people and have two people [TS]

00:56:01   in the audience get a joke and stuff [TS]

00:56:02   like that it's a it's a really nice [TS]

00:56:04   feeling and you with two whole people in [TS]

00:56:06   the audience got the got a joke [TS]

00:56:08   sometimes it's hard to tell you know [TS]

00:56:09   when you do a talk I just learned to [TS]

00:56:11   really lower my expectations about what [TS]

00:56:13   anybody in the audience will do its best [TS]

00:56:15   to assume that they have no idea what [TS]

00:56:17   you do i think you know i often make the [TS]

00:56:20   opposite assumption which is that [TS]

00:56:22   everyone in the room knows everything [TS]

00:56:25   that I've ever done and was gonna get [TS]

00:56:27   every reference that you reference that [TS]

00:56:28   in there and what you're saying [TS]

00:56:30   I mean up you know i do i think that [TS]

00:56:33   there are probably every show idea where [TS]

00:56:36   I walk out onstage and go all right [TS]

00:56:38   listen up dickholes a few rules before I [TS]

00:56:43   do another thing and one of them is shut [TS]

00:56:48   up i'm sure there are people in the back [TS]

00:56:53   of the room were like who the fuck is [TS]

00:56:54   this guy but I don't care [TS]

00:56:57   you know like my assumption is when I [TS]

00:57:01   walk on the stage that it's you know I'm [TS]

00:57:03   on the stage not you and I have to own [TS]

00:57:08   the room completely to whatever to the [TS]

00:57:11   best of my ability to walk up on stage [TS]

00:57:14   and be like hi [TS]

00:57:16   for those of you who don't know me I'm [TS]

00:57:18   this guy had the most deadly line of all [TS]

00:57:21   time [TS]

00:57:22   let me tell you a little bit about [TS]

00:57:23   myself yeah like you know my I have to [TS]

00:57:26   approach walking onstage like high for [TS]

00:57:29   those of you who don't know me I'm fuck [TS]

00:57:32   you you're living under a rock [TS]

00:57:34   how did you even get in here because [TS]

00:57:38   because I just I feel like I feel like [TS]

00:57:40   you're here already [TS]

00:57:42   your weight is already on you're on the [TS]

00:57:44   wrong part of your foot if you're if you [TS]

00:57:46   walk onstage and are like I you know I [TS]

00:57:49   let me explain a little bit about how I [TS]

00:57:51   got here [TS]

00:57:52   well I I did give up i did give a talk [TS]

00:57:56   uh at the XOXO festival to a room full [TS]

00:57:59   of people where it was I mean I I [TS]

00:58:02   definitely felt like thirty percent of [TS]

00:58:04   the room knew exactly who I was and [TS]

00:58:07   thirty percent of the room didn't have [TS]

00:58:08   any idea who I was and forty percent of [TS]

00:58:11   the room was you know honor on a [TS]

00:58:13   spectrum of sort of like oh yeah that [TS]

00:58:15   might think I've heard of that guy what [TS]

00:58:17   are you all the way to like yeah I I [TS]

00:58:20   know exactly who he is and I don't like [TS]

00:58:21   him or whatever but I can't do I can't [TS]

00:58:26   do my style of presentation unless I [TS]

00:58:29   assumed that I guess I assume that [TS]

00:58:33   everybody's gonna like me i don't know i [TS]

00:58:36   see now I think that's well I don't [TS]

00:58:39   interrupt you but i think that is [TS]

00:58:40   something most people are reluctant to [TS]

00:58:42   believe and to put into effect because [TS]

00:58:45   it seems self-involved it's critical [TS]

00:58:47   it's coming like anything and whatever [TS]

00:58:48   anybody i'm with his nervous about doing [TS]

00:58:50   something going out getting on stage [TS]

00:58:52   which is understandable everybody gets [TS]

00:58:54   the jitters but I was like you know you [TS]

00:58:56   just gotta remember a few things one is [TS]

00:58:58   that the people you know whether it was [TS]

00:59:00   by accident or on purpose have decided [TS]

00:59:02   to be here they've decided to not do [TS]

00:59:03   other stuff in order to be here they [TS]

00:59:05   want to be entertained and they want to [TS]

00:59:07   be entertained by you [TS]

00:59:08   and the thing is you know they want you [TS]

00:59:11   to succeed they want you to be [TS]

00:59:13   entertaining if they don't want you to [TS]

00:59:14   be entertaining you can't save it right [TS]

00:59:17   those people off but there I think it [TS]

00:59:20   always helps to remember that like you [TS]

00:59:21   do have an advantage when you come out [TS]

00:59:23   which is that people would like to like [TS]

00:59:25   what you're doing and if you start from [TS]

00:59:27   that point of view that's not [TS]

00:59:28   self-involved that's just trying to be [TS]

00:59:29   entertaining if you start by feeling [TS]

00:59:31   like I've got to be defensive or Ivor [TS]

00:59:33   I've got to like show my bona fides let [TS]

00:59:35   me seemed kind of like you said like [TS]

00:59:36   you're on the wrong foot [TS]

00:59:38   yeah yeah and a particularly a tech [TS]

00:59:40   conference where there are people uh you [TS]

00:59:45   know I'll what when when when you came [TS]

00:59:48   up and we did that presentation with our [TS]

00:59:50   silly ass friends at the Seattle [TS]

00:59:53   interactive conference when we met the [TS]

00:59:58   digital profit [TS]

00:59:58   digital profit [TS]

01:00:00   where I'm at the digital profit that was [TS]

01:00:01   a silly ass presentation that was [TS]

01:00:03   somewhat derailed and and maybe [TS]

01:00:07   completely derailed somewhat so forth [TS]

01:00:09   derailed by one of our good friends at [TS]

01:00:11   one of the participants went a little [TS]

01:00:13   bit rogue I don't want the technically a [TS]

01:00:15   mutiny [TS]

01:00:16   I think I think any court maritime court [TS]

01:00:18   would probably find him guilty of mutiny [TS]

01:00:20   yeah i think it was a mutiny and I think [TS]

01:00:22   it was you know partly nervousness and [TS]

01:00:24   partly like love the microphone or [TS]

01:00:25   whatever but so you and I definitely [TS]

01:00:29   were on the stage I was scrambling to [TS]

01:00:32   sell that the event and you were visibly [TS]

01:00:37   discomforted was I yeah you you know you [TS]

01:00:41   want to help people trying to figure out [TS]

01:00:43   something useful to say yeah you you [TS]

01:00:45   were given you there were a couple of [TS]

01:00:46   times when i looked over at you and you [TS]

01:00:48   looked at me and grimaced grimaced like [TS]

01:00:51   you had just bitten into an onion is [TS]

01:00:53   always the chance that you're gonna [TS]

01:00:55   punch somebody in the face and I did not [TS]

01:00:56   want that to happen on such a good about [TS]

01:00:59   ticket sales but in any case after the [TS]

01:01:02   after the fact i was a i was on the [TS]

01:01:05   internet and I was scrolling through [TS]

01:01:08   seattle interactive conference comments [TS]

01:01:13   and there was a comment from someone who [TS]

01:01:15   was at social media a webinar expert and [TS]

01:01:21   she said I went to see this group of [TS]

01:01:26   people talk about social networking or [TS]

01:01:32   whatever the whatever the premise of our [TS]

01:01:34   premises stated originally was something [TS]

01:01:37   like hey you guys are are wackadoodle [TS]

01:01:39   pseudo celebrities [TS]

01:01:41   how are you dealing how are using social [TS]

01:01:42   media to try and do your work right and [TS]

01:01:45   so this uh this woman like online said [TS]

01:01:50   that was a total waste of time it was [TS]

01:01:52   just five or six guys up there who liked [TS]

01:01:55   to hear them the sound of their own [TS]

01:01:57   voices and they were just wasting my [TS]

01:02:01   time I agree with all of that except the [TS]

01:02:03   part about how is a waste of time and I [TS]

01:02:06   ill-advisedly perhaps God commented to [TS]

01:02:11   her and was like you [TS]

01:02:13   our time must be extremely valuable for [TS]

01:02:16   it to feel so wasted by that our of like [TS]

01:02:20   completely harmless high jinks [TS]

01:02:23   but but the sense that she had that she [TS]

01:02:25   had come to this interactive conference [TS]

01:02:27   to really learn to have some takeaways [TS]

01:02:31   that she could take back to her social [TS]

01:02:33   media business and convert that [TS]

01:02:35   knowledge into more business or [TS]

01:02:38   something I don't know I there I i had a [TS]

01:02:41   sense when i got up at the XOXO [TS]

01:02:43   conference that there might be people in [TS]

01:02:45   the room who are really looking for new [TS]

01:02:48   thought technologies that can help them [TS]

01:02:50   be better app makers and that I was not [TS]

01:02:54   going to be giving I was not gonna be [TS]

01:02:55   providing any of that [TS]

01:02:57   um I was going to be doing infotainment [TS]

01:03:01   of a different sort but it turned out [TS]

01:03:05   that the XOXO conference did not have a [TS]

01:03:07   bunch of social media managers and it [TS]

01:03:10   had people who were looking for new [TS]

01:03:11   thought technologies of a different kind [TS]

01:03:13   the kind that I have I'm kind of the not [TS]

01:03:18   kind of an obsessive about walking in [TS]

01:03:21   the room [TS]

01:03:22   what mmm mean is it something you just [TS]

01:03:25   do it [TS]

01:03:26   I feel like I feel like I feel like [TS]

01:03:27   starting a sentence by saying I'm kind [TS]

01:03:29   of been taking the word kind of back and [TS]

01:03:33   replacing it with obsessing is like [TS]

01:03:36   there's a lot of week there's a lot of [TS]

01:03:38   room ok alright little clarity I says [TS]

01:03:40   I'm if allowed to do things the way I [TS]

01:03:43   like to do them i have a very specific [TS]

01:03:44   way I like to do them about which I will [TS]

01:03:47   be obsessive and we're here and I [TS]

01:03:48   learned I can't do that I throw it all [TS]

01:03:50   out and do something else so you know [TS]

01:03:52   I'm really ended like I try to get there [TS]

01:03:53   like like in the case of this talking it [TS]

01:03:55   was it was kind of a weird random manic [TS]

01:03:57   talk that I did but uh but i did made it [TS]

01:04:01   manic because I thought that's what [TS]

01:04:02   would work so like I would like to go up [TS]

01:04:05   and it's maybe it's superstition I don't [TS]

01:04:07   think it is I like to go up and see [TS]

01:04:09   where I'm going to be standing before [TS]

01:04:11   people get there and walk around and see [TS]

01:04:13   what it would be like to be watching [TS]

01:04:15   this from the audience i watch other [TS]

01:04:16   people in the same room [TS]

01:04:17   I look at stuff like the equipment and [TS]

01:04:19   what I can expect out of the equipment [TS]

01:04:21   you know in this case like I learned [TS]

01:04:23   this is this is an amazing set up they [TS]

01:04:24   just built this whole fist this whole [TS]

01:04:26   new four [TS]

01:04:26   facility at this company with this [TS]

01:04:27   incredible presentation system like this [TS]

01:04:30   amazing presentation system where this [TS]

01:04:31   thing around your neck and it got an [TS]

01:04:33   infrared signal so the camera can follow [TS]

01:04:35   you automatically so you can walk around [TS]

01:04:37   you have to stand in one place we got a [TS]

01:04:39   built-in mic it was new technology and I [TS]

01:04:42   learned like for example this is kind of [TS]

01:04:44   boring may be relevant but like I [TS]

01:04:46   learned for example that when people saw [TS]

01:04:47   this on a monitor myself once again the [TS]

01:04:50   slides would be the main thing on the [TS]

01:04:53   screen and I would be a [TS]

01:04:55   picture-in-picture like a sixth of the [TS]

01:04:57   size of the slide [TS]

01:04:59   oh right so the thing is it doesn't [TS]

01:05:01   matter probably not like remote for most [TS]

01:05:03   people who wouldn't matter because you [TS]

01:05:05   got your presentation you're going to do [TS]

01:05:06   in a certain way and you just go up [TS]

01:05:07   there any power through it and I I don't [TS]

01:05:09   know I i try to like adapt what I'm [TS]

01:05:11   going to say and how i'm going to say [TS]

01:05:13   that depending all of those dumb factors [TS]

01:05:15   realizing there is a pillow there's a [TS]

01:05:17   pillar a load-bearing pillar right here [TS]

01:05:19   that we're like 15 people aren't going [TS]

01:05:21   to be able to see me so they're gonna [TS]

01:05:22   feel left out if I'm not found not [TS]

01:05:24   moving around it's gonna seem kind of [TS]

01:05:25   weird knowing that these slides so I had [TS]

01:05:28   to make a lot of like gametime decisions [TS]

01:05:30   this is not like heroic but like how to [TS]

01:05:32   change what did you how did you how did [TS]

01:05:33   you alter your presentation initially I [TS]

01:05:35   decided as I do about fifty percent of [TS]

01:05:37   time I initially thought I just threw [TS]

01:05:38   out the slides not two slides at all i [TS]

01:05:40   knew that the technology was new and [TS]

01:05:42   although these guys were very very [TS]

01:05:44   competent added I still knew that they [TS]

01:05:46   had only been kind of testing it for a [TS]

01:05:48   couple weeks so I went into it knowing [TS]

01:05:50   that all a lot of things could change [TS]

01:05:54   like even while i was speaking and that [TS]

01:05:56   makes a really big difference to know [TS]

01:05:58   that because and why does that matter [TS]

01:06:00   what matters because if you have a slide [TS]

01:06:02   deck that you put together where you [TS]

01:06:04   haven't rehearsed it a lot or let's see [TS]

01:06:06   even have heard a lot but you're still [TS]

01:06:08   relying on seeing the slides to know [TS]

01:06:09   what's next thing you're gonna say is [TS]

01:06:11   you're doing that awful things like [TS]

01:06:12   reading off of your slides when you know [TS]

01:06:14   what the problem is like if you go [TS]

01:06:15   somewhere don't you slide look at dope [TS]

01:06:17   because everybody expects slides but the [TS]

01:06:18   slides can be such a distraction for for [TS]

01:06:21   a million different reasons so anyway [TS]

01:06:22   even if i end up doing it 95% the way [TS]

01:06:25   that I planned I still have the somewhat [TS]

01:06:27   obsessive walkthrough of knowing you [TS]

01:06:29   know of you know and the dumb stuff more [TS]

01:06:32   dumb stuff like some stand-up comic [TS]

01:06:33   stuff like trying to learn a little bit [TS]

01:06:35   like I've said to people before like [TS]

01:06:37   notice like when you arrived at that [TS]

01:06:38   venue was it hard is it [TS]

01:06:39   tip this is not the talk but like notice [TS]

01:06:42   wasn't hard to find a parking space [TS]

01:06:43   well guess what I bet you almost [TS]

01:06:44   everybody else in the audience also had [TS]

01:06:46   trouble finding a parking space [TS]

01:06:47   did you have to go through crazy [TS]

01:06:48   security okay you already have something [TS]

01:06:51   to bring into the room and everybody can [TS]

01:06:52   share with you [TS]

01:06:53   that's a great jumping off point to [TS]

01:06:54   whatever it is you want to say because I [TS]

01:06:56   you want more than anything like no [TS]

01:06:57   matter who you are you want to establish [TS]

01:07:00   what this is about and which things were [TS]

01:07:02   on the same page about I said you taken [TS]

01:07:04   two hits of mescaline probably the only [TS]

01:07:06   people in the audience taken to be have [TS]

01:07:08   now do you definitely does identify the [TS]

01:07:12   milanos I I'm it for me that's a little [TS]

01:07:15   bit of a compulsive thing where I just [TS]

01:07:17   it helps me walk that stage you know [TS]

01:07:19   walking stage helps me feel a little bit [TS]

01:07:21   more relaxed about it but you know to [TS]

01:07:24   the pivot here like i just watched this [TS]

01:07:25   documentary about Robin Williams and [TS]

01:07:28   they were talking about how he did his [TS]

01:07:29   stand-up i'm not about to compare myself [TS]

01:07:31   to Robin Williams but very inspirational [TS]

01:07:32   for me as a kid I mean God I wanted to [TS]

01:07:35   be rather Williams and talking about [TS]

01:07:36   like how you know again who knows this [TS]

01:07:39   could be like ebay started because of [TS]

01:07:40   pez dispensers not true but supposedly [TS]

01:07:43   one time he went out and the mic didn't [TS]

01:07:45   work and that's one of the things that [TS]

01:07:47   got him started on his whole like [TS]

01:07:48   roaming into the audience approach to [TS]

01:07:50   became a real temple of his stand-up was [TS]

01:07:53   that he really blossomed like a lot of [TS]

01:07:55   great improv people keep lost him [TS]

01:07:57   awesome when things went tits-up that [TS]

01:07:59   when you thrive when things went wrong [TS]

01:08:01   when the mic broke that's when he [TS]

01:08:03   learned that he could walk into the [TS]

01:08:04   audience and be maybe twice as funny as [TS]

01:08:06   he was doing a you know a gay [TS]

01:08:08   hairdresser on stage he got to interact [TS]

01:08:10   with people in the moment and when that [TS]

01:08:11   went bad it got even funnier if you met [TS]

01:08:13   a drunkie bring them up on stage and [TS]

01:08:15   direct them in a film you know so i [TS]

01:08:18   don't know i always feel like it's it's [TS]

01:08:19   you know part of the what makes people [TS]

01:08:22   so anxious about going to those things [TS]

01:08:24   and about putting on a show like that is [TS]

01:08:26   the feeling that like something's going [TS]

01:08:28   to go wrong and i feel like there's like [TS]

01:08:29   a certain set of things that you can do [TS]

01:08:31   that will help you be at ease which will [TS]

01:08:33   help with the audience at ease and then [TS]

01:08:35   you know you don't have to go up there [TS]

01:08:37   and read your resume to make people [TS]

01:08:38   think that you're worth listening to [TS]

01:08:39   well and what I have discovered in the [TS]

01:08:41   last year is that the thing that makes [TS]

01:08:44   me happiest is to do no preparation of [TS]

01:08:47   any kind i hear that [TS]

01:08:49   and it makes me happy right up until 10 [TS]

01:08:54   minutes before I go onstage and then [TS]

01:08:56   that last 10 minutes of before I go [TS]

01:08:58   onstage I say idiot [TS]

01:09:02   what kind of person does no preparation [TS]

01:09:06   and I spent 10 minutes kind of you know [TS]

01:09:09   fighting with myself or the other voice [TS]

01:09:12   is saying this is what you do you do [TS]

01:09:16   know preparation this is your thing and [TS]

01:09:19   then I walk up on stage and i'm so glad [TS]

01:09:21   i didn't know preparation but i cannot [TS]

01:09:25   vouch for how um I cannot vouch for like [TS]

01:09:31   the person in the room who is the who is [TS]

01:09:34   the most predisposed to be suspicious of [TS]

01:09:36   me or or dislike my show I can't say [TS]

01:09:40   what [TS]

01:09:41   oh how they receive it but over time I [TS]

01:09:45   realized like you can't win them all and [TS]

01:09:47   that the best shows that i do from from [TS]

01:09:50   a standpoint of like where I just feel [TS]

01:09:53   comfortable right up until doing it and [TS]

01:09:55   then I feel of a rush of excitement and [TS]

01:09:58   then I feel glad after i'm done our [TS]

01:10:02   shows where I i dunno i have no notes i [TS]

01:10:06   have no I have only with that the [TS]

01:10:09   thinnest kind of sense of like narrative [TS]

01:10:14   arc and I just walk up and and [TS]

01:10:17   introduced myself and and I generally do [TS]

01:10:20   a thing where I say I don't like where [TS]

01:10:22   the chairs are you know I walk up and [TS]

01:10:24   I'm just like I don't like where these [TS]

01:10:25   chairs are right you going to kind of [TS]

01:10:27   assert yourself in the room [TS]

01:10:29   yeah like who put this who put this vase [TS]

01:10:31   here this base doesn't go here and in [TS]

01:10:35   that moment i'm trying to say like this [TS]

01:10:38   stage belongs to me now and and i'm also [TS]

01:10:42   like now on the stage and so that so the [TS]

01:10:47   the light can descend write the energy [TS]

01:10:50   can start going [TS]

01:10:51   and until i walk out there I can't let I [TS]

01:10:55   can't I can't [TS]

01:10:56   uncage it or whatever I can unleash a [TS]

01:10:58   thing but as soon as I walk out if I say [TS]

01:11:01   if I if I say something like you know [TS]

01:11:03   this isn't where this goes [TS]

01:11:05   um you know who chose who chose these [TS]

01:11:09   curtains you know some kind of thing [TS]

01:11:11   like that it's it's like uncorking the [TS]

01:11:16   the relationship the ability to talk to [TS]

01:11:19   people in the audience like it like [TS]

01:11:22   there's just four of us there right and [TS]

01:11:25   i don't know i mean honestly in the next [TS]

01:11:27   year I think I'll i think i'll have a [TS]

01:11:29   much better sense of whether that is [TS]

01:11:31   genuinely a thing because I've been [TS]

01:11:34   doing these shows at the rendezvous and [TS]

01:11:36   i know that i have 80 people a week that [TS]

01:11:39   that keep coming in some combination to [TS]

01:11:43   see this but this XOXO talk was the [TS]

01:11:46   first really the first time that I i got [TS]

01:11:50   up and did oh I did like an hour-long [TS]

01:11:54   thing right for a room [TS]

01:11:58   more or less of strain injury law room [TS]

01:12:00   full of people who for whom it's it [TS]

01:12:02   would be a lot to assume the reason they [TS]

01:12:04   came to the conference was to see you [TS]

01:12:06   the internet they came to that day [TS]

01:12:07   because they were interested but it's [TS]

01:12:09   not like 80 people who paid to see you [TS]

01:12:11   in a small theater [TS]

01:12:12   yeah right i am i'm one of several [TS]

01:12:14   presentations every one of which is sort [TS]

01:12:18   of better prepared some of them totally [TS]

01:12:22   prepared and and even the least prepared [TS]

01:12:27   is more structured but you know i don't [TS]

01:12:31   think i don't think i could get up at a [TS]

01:12:32   seahawks game and give an hour-long talk [TS]

01:12:35   about my feelings and thoughts and keep [TS]

01:12:40   50,000 football fans like on the edge of [TS]

01:12:42   their seat right maybe maybe that's [TS]

01:12:45   something to aspire to but uh but I felt [TS]

01:12:49   like at least at this conference it [TS]

01:12:52   knowing knowing also not to search too [TS]

01:12:55   deeply on the internet but but a what a [TS]

01:12:58   what a a look like a quick read of the [TS]

01:13:02   Internet in the in the aftermath of the [TS]

01:13:04   show [TS]

01:13:04   there wasn't anybody on there saying [TS]

01:13:06   this was a total waste of my time my [TS]

01:13:08   galley but I came to this thing I I am I [TS]

01:13:13   have I always think about like when [TS]

01:13:16   there's going to be a big swimming race [TS]

01:13:18   and you'll see those those swimmers that [TS]

01:13:21   before the gun goes off they'll jump in [TS]

01:13:23   the water you know I guess that's an old [TS]

01:13:25   that's an old old trick you know you're [TS]

01:13:27   talking about so you're on the blocks [TS]

01:13:28   and you're ready and they'll do they'll [TS]

01:13:30   intentionally do a false start for which [TS]

01:13:32   you will not be penalized but there's [TS]

01:13:34   something about being able to jump in [TS]

01:13:35   the water and get wet before it's [TS]

01:13:37   officially started that helps them then [TS]

01:13:39   be able to feel acclimated and point you [TS]

01:13:42   could consider I don't recall a [TS]

01:13:43   competitive advantage but I that that [TS]

01:13:45   analogy works perfectly for me I [TS]

01:13:48   completely get why somebody why somebody [TS]

01:13:50   who's a swimmer would want to jump in [TS]

01:13:51   the water and get that shot off and then [TS]

01:13:54   go that's what it feels like to go in [TS]

01:13:55   the water I can start swimming the [TS]

01:13:56   second i go in even pro right so I mean [TS]

01:13:59   for me like having something that this [TS]

01:14:01   is complicated because I I don't [TS]

01:14:03   consider myself like a great consistent [TS]

01:14:05   presenter or performer and I mean I cut [TS]

01:14:10   a part of me that would really like to [TS]

01:14:11   be a part of it is i'm just not i'm too [TS]

01:14:13   lazy to get good at the conventional way [TS]

01:14:16   of doing those things you think I'm [TS]

01:14:17   capable of that it's just that it [TS]

01:14:19   doesn't really interest me to to do that [TS]

01:14:24   thing in the way people expect so i have [TS]

01:14:26   to feel I have to interject it's a lazy [TS]

01:14:29   is this word that you use that i use to [TS]

01:14:32   describe ourselves and yet you know you [TS]

01:14:35   work your ass off [TS]

01:14:36   I worked my ass off and so it's I and I [TS]

01:14:41   feel this i use the exact same word to [TS]

01:14:43   say like I am too lazy to put together [TS]

01:14:45   an hour-long presentation for accept [TS]

01:14:48   what I really feel like is that too to [TS]

01:14:53   achieve an hour-long presentation that [TS]

01:14:55   is better than what i would do by my by [TS]

01:15:00   my method i would have to work i would [TS]

01:15:03   have to work for 4am I totally get what [TS]

01:15:07   you're saying and that's actually where [TS]

01:15:08   i was going to go with this first of all [TS]

01:15:10   I got one I mean like I got done [TS]

01:15:11   throwaways there's a throwaway that I've [TS]

01:15:13   used maybe three or four times where in [TS]

01:15:15   this case like I knew a lot of people in [TS]

01:15:16   the side and second introduced [TS]

01:15:18   come out and I didn't have like a joke [TS]

01:15:21   about the venue to start and so I have [TS]

01:15:23   the dumbest joke in the world that [TS]

01:15:24   always kills which I come out I look [TS]

01:15:26   like a douchebag about to give a talk [TS]

01:15:28   and I say it is everybody ready to get [TS]

01:15:30   rich and a couple people laugh and I go [TS]

01:15:33   shut up and for some reason that set the [TS]

01:15:36   tone that i want for the room I want no [TS]

01:15:38   that's me jumping in the water that jump [TS]

01:15:41   in the water and going ok then maybe [TS]

01:15:42   this isn't gonna be what you expected [TS]

01:15:43   i'm not gonna this might get a little [TS]

01:15:45   silly because I look I feel like a dick [TS]

01:15:47   up here [TS]

01:15:48   I know I look like a dick up here let's [TS]

01:15:50   have a little fun with that [TS]

01:15:51   yeah to do to your point I you know it's [TS]

01:15:54   so difficult to talk about lazy you're [TS]

01:15:55   right ladies a tough work is lazy has a [TS]

01:15:57   negative connotation of meaning that [TS]

01:15:58   you're like shiftless and you want to [TS]

01:16:00   get away with stuff by not doing work [TS]

01:16:02   when I think lazy sometimes is a way I [TS]

01:16:05   can be a way of us saying there's a [TS]

01:16:06   different way to do this [TS]

01:16:08   yeah and and so like on this podcast [TS]

01:16:10   like a lot that I'm on [TS]

01:16:11   sometimes-uncomfortable I John siracusa [TS]

01:16:14   Jason's know a lot of people use this [TS]

01:16:16   phrase we're talking about movies [TS]

01:16:18   we're talking about TV and it's it's a [TS]

01:16:20   it's a phrase from athletics but applies [TS]

01:16:23   a lot to storytelling and they'll say [TS]

01:16:25   well you know the thing is what this [TS]

01:16:26   person doing here had a high degree of [TS]

01:16:28   difficulty so it may not be the most [TS]

01:16:31   perfectly executed thing you've ever [TS]

01:16:33   seen but it was pretty interesting [TS]

01:16:34   because they tried something a little [TS]

01:16:36   bit different and sometimes you give [TS]

01:16:37   people a little more credit something [TS]

01:16:39   like a no more fantastic way of [TS]

01:16:40   storytelling you people a little more [TS]

01:16:42   credit for trying something that is not [TS]

01:16:44   what the expected thing was so right to [TS]

01:16:46   the laziness angle to me that means I [TS]

01:16:49   the the the middle level of difficulty [TS]

01:16:53   is to have a completely polished [TS]

01:16:55   100-percent bulletproof show that never [TS]

01:16:58   goes wrong with beautiful graphics [TS]

01:16:59   fantastic presentation and maybe i'll [TS]

01:17:01   tell you if we can all aspire to doing [TS]

01:17:03   that to having a show that when you know [TS]

01:17:06   flawlessly you got the hundred-percent [TS]

01:17:07   entertainment experience it's just that [TS]

01:17:09   the thing is if you don't put yourself [TS]

01:17:10   into a position where you could fail by [TS]

01:17:12   trying something different a lot of the [TS]

01:17:14   excitement kind of drains out of the [TS]

01:17:15   room [TS]

01:17:16   it's really nice to watch someone shoe a [TS]

01:17:18   horse who really knows how to do it you [TS]

01:17:20   sure hope they don't kill the fucking [TS]

01:17:21   horse but at the same time there's [TS]

01:17:23   something nice about knowing there's no [TS]

01:17:25   net here it's what makes him prob so [TS]

01:17:26   interesting to me is that like on the [TS]

01:17:28   one hand [TS]

01:17:29   ok again I could never do stand-up [TS]

01:17:31   don't think because i don't have the [TS]

01:17:33   brain for it and I'm terrified of the [TS]

01:17:35   idea of having to go through a stand-up [TS]

01:17:36   routine the idea of improv is incredibly [TS]

01:17:39   exhilarating to me because when it goes [TS]

01:17:42   wrong is when it gets interesting and [TS]

01:17:43   that's actually kinda when I thrive so [TS]

01:17:45   when I say lazy i think part of it is [TS]

01:17:46   also that like I could spend a lot of my [TS]

01:17:50   least interesting energy and skills on [TS]

01:17:52   trying to make this exactly what sixty [TS]

01:17:55   percent of the audience would expect and [TS]

01:17:57   then I'd be evaluated based on whether [TS]

01:17:58   it was as good as a Seth Godin talk or [TS]

01:18:00   whatever which is fine because the guy [TS]

01:18:02   gives great talks i could see wanting to [TS]

01:18:03   become that but that's kind of what [TS]

01:18:05   everybody wants to become so maybe it's [TS]

01:18:07   a little cheat a little bit but I think [TS]

01:18:09   it's also that's that's how I want to be [TS]

01:18:10   entertaining [TS]

01:18:11   I want to be entertaining by going out [TS]

01:18:13   there and going like this and you just [TS]

01:18:15   can't even know how I tear my hair out [TS]

01:18:16   for the three weeks before i do any talk [TS]

01:18:18   like I'm a nervous wreck i've done a lot [TS]

01:18:20   and I still incredibly nervous about it [TS]

01:18:22   because I wanted to be something that is [TS]

01:18:25   I want to be in that room I wanted to be [TS]

01:18:27   something you have kind of had to be in [TS]

01:18:28   the room for as it happened right [TS]

01:18:30   watching our video later you might go [TS]

01:18:31   that was okay that was kind of funny [TS]

01:18:33   that was weird [TS]

01:18:34   why do you do that but in the room I [TS]

01:18:35   wanted to be as exhilarating for them [TS]

01:18:37   for the people who can like it in the [TS]

01:18:39   way I want to do it and to me that's [TS]

01:18:41   what independent entertainment is is [TS]

01:18:44   figuring out how to do something the way [TS]

01:18:46   the best way you know how to do it in [TS]

01:18:48   front of people who are prepared to [TS]

01:18:49   enjoy it that way and will will [TS]

01:18:51   appreciate the level of difficulty in [TS]

01:18:53   trying something they never expected [TS]

01:18:54   that day [TS]

01:18:55   yeah and I i have to keep I have to not [TS]

01:18:58   just keep reminding myself of that but [TS]

01:19:00   keep walking back to that initial [TS]

01:19:03   premise which is that whatever it is I'm [TS]

01:19:07   trying to do because i don't i couldn't [TS]

01:19:08   be a stand-up either i don't even [TS]

01:19:10   understand how it works like you said [TS]

01:19:13   and think of a funny joke and then you [TS]

01:19:15   may be trying out 10 versions of it over [TS]

01:19:18   you trying to run here like and then you [TS]

01:19:21   try and work it up so that it seems like [TS]

01:19:24   you're just thinking about it for the [TS]

01:19:25   first time when you're onstage and you [TS]

01:19:27   do that every night like I couldn't do [TS]

01:19:28   it I don't even know how to I don't know [TS]

01:19:30   how to do it because what i think is [TS]

01:19:33   great about being funny hear about jokes [TS]

01:19:36   is like oh that just popped up like the [TS]

01:19:39   best jokes I've ever heard are ones that [TS]

01:19:41   just popped up [TS]

01:19:42   let last week when I said in a meta way [TS]

01:19:45   let's move on and you thought I was [TS]

01:19:48   telling you that we should move on on [TS]

01:19:50   the show when I was actually talking [TS]

01:19:52   about the guy you got in a fight with a [TS]

01:19:53   lot to me that was a very funny moment [TS]

01:19:56   because it was not what we expected only [TS]

01:19:58   both misunderstood each other and that [TS]

01:19:59   may be funny [TS]

01:20:00   you can't plan that no and Shawn Nelson [TS]

01:20:03   is amazing at that kind of humor and you [TS]

01:20:05   are amazing at that kind of humor where [TS]

01:20:07   it's just like pow [TS]

01:20:09   and that's what I like but but i keep [TS]

01:20:11   thinking you know I keep judging my [TS]

01:20:15   attempts at doing these improvisational [TS]

01:20:18   talks or extemporaneous talks rather up [TS]

01:20:23   by like well as this as good as a [TS]

01:20:27   TEDTalk is this as good as as as is this [TS]

01:20:32   as good as them as Tony Robbins is this [TS]

01:20:34   look is this motivational is this like [TS]

01:20:37   that what will people profit from this [TS]

01:20:39   and I have to keep walking back to this [TS]

01:20:41   idea like this is what i am doing and [TS]

01:20:44   I'm just trying to find a place to do it [TS]

01:20:46   where people are where people appreciate [TS]

01:20:49   the difficulty appreciate the well as [TS]

01:20:54   the Syracuse it says like the create a [TS]

01:20:57   culture degree of difficulty you know [TS]

01:20:59   like this is difficult [TS]

01:21:02   the degree of difficulty for me getting [TS]

01:21:04   up and extemporize in for an hour is [TS]

01:21:06   less than it might be for a lot of [TS]

01:21:08   people because that is a that's a thing [TS]

01:21:11   like swimming or running that I can do [TS]

01:21:13   but it is still like extremely [TS]

01:21:18   challenging and and if you're judging it [TS]

01:21:23   like tight i'm sure i told you we played [TS]

01:21:25   the independent in San Francisco one [TS]

01:21:26   time you might have been at the show or [TS]

01:21:28   it might have been during that phase [TS]

01:21:30   when you weren't coming too long winter [TS]

01:21:31   shows because the sexual tension between [TS]

01:21:33   you and I had gotten so high [TS]

01:21:35   but i don't know if you remember this [TS]

01:21:37   but I walked out on stage we started to [TS]

01:21:39   play the first song and I tripped over [TS]

01:21:43   my amplifier and fell backwards and [TS]

01:21:46   broke the guitar that was behind the [TS]

01:21:49   amplifier and like ended up feet in the [TS]

01:21:53   air just on top of the smash smash [TS]

01:21:56   members of the car this is the only [TS]

01:21:58   getting four minutes into the set and I [TS]

01:22:02   bounced back up I was like hello I found [TS]

01:22:05   da and I read later a review from a [TS]

01:22:11   woman where she was just like I they'll [TS]

01:22:13   the long winters took the stage i'm a [TS]

01:22:15   huge fan of theirs but this is the first [TS]

01:22:17   time I've ever seen him live took the [TS]

01:22:18   stage and they were drunk and like [TS]

01:22:23   completely unprofessional [TS]

01:22:25   they didn't play any of the songs in a [TS]

01:22:28   way that sounded like they were on the [TS]

01:22:30   record [TS]

01:22:31   well gosh oh my and and i just think i [TS]

01:22:35   just wish that they would like take [TS]

01:22:36   their job seriously and put on a [TS]

01:22:38   professional show and you know it hurt [TS]

01:22:42   but I also felt like I couldn't I [TS]

01:22:45   couldn't put on the kind of professional [TS]

01:22:47   show that she's expecting I couldn't do [TS]

01:22:50   it and so I can't ever judge myself [TS]

01:22:54   according to that standard because it [TS]

01:22:57   would it's just like it's it's like [TS]

01:23:00   judging yourself against against against [TS]

01:23:03   like this anonymous profile photo like [TS]

01:23:05   this blank picture the little egg on [TS]

01:23:07   twitter is like they're evaluating [TS]

01:23:09   yourself against a completely anonymous [TS]

01:23:11   and unknown world and then wondering how [TS]

01:23:13   any of like whatever 78 billion people [TS]

01:23:16   could conceivably not love what you did [TS]

01:23:17   which is completely bananas [TS]

01:23:19   yeah it's bananas but it's so it's so uh [TS]

01:23:23   it's so maximum rock and roll it so this [TS]

01:23:26   band could be your life to constantly [TS]

01:23:32   remind yourself and it's absolutely [TS]

01:23:34   necessary to constantly remind myself [TS]

01:23:36   that what I'm doing what I'm trying to [TS]

01:23:40   do has a small audience and that is not [TS]

01:23:44   an indictment of it [TS]

01:23:46   mhm and and the fact that it has a small [TS]

01:23:49   audience and will not ever produce [TS]

01:23:52   massive wealth and Dan Harmon is never [TS]

01:23:55   gonna recognize me and I met you know my [TS]

01:23:58   face is not going to be my calling card [TS]

01:24:00   with gillian jacobs i'm going to just be [TS]

01:24:05   a guy who's doing a thing and it's it's [TS]

01:24:08   small and weird but the people who want [TS]

01:24:11   to be there really want to be there and [TS]

01:24:13   like that is that's such a a complex [TS]

01:24:18   idea to keep in the front of your mind [TS]

01:24:20   and it seems illogical it does because [TS]

01:24:23   everywhere we go everything we look at [TS]

01:24:26   in the in our culture now is trying to [TS]

01:24:28   be as big as possible or except for [TS]

01:24:32   except for my friends and your friends [TS]

01:24:34   that are doing things that are actually [TS]

01:24:36   good that I like that's what you're [TS]

01:24:37   nailing in there isn't is to meet is an [TS]

01:24:39   inherent paradox whenever you whenever [TS]

01:24:41   anyone hear me moaning about the the [TS]

01:24:44   mobs that are out there you know in on [TS]

01:24:48   the internet one way or another time [TS]

01:24:49   when partly moaning about is that [TS]

01:24:51   there's the paradox which is on the one [TS]

01:24:53   hand the upside the great side of the [TS]

01:24:55   paradox is it's probably never been [TS]

01:24:58   easier if you have the interest i mean [TS]

01:25:00   when you say the talent if you have if [TS]

01:25:03   you want to get something out there in [TS]

01:25:04   front of other people [TS]

01:25:06   I would defy you to pull up a time when [TS]

01:25:08   you would have a better chance of [TS]

01:25:10   economically putting what it is you like [TS]

01:25:12   to do in front of other people think [TS]

01:25:13   it's kind of hard to dispute but at the [TS]

01:25:15   same time all those other people out [TS]

01:25:17   there doing their own performance which [TS]

01:25:18   is what they have to say about you which [TS]

01:25:20   i think is just something that we that [TS]

01:25:21   we have to accept the paradox part for [TS]

01:25:23   me comes from people i think especially [TS]

01:25:26   when you have moments of self-doubt like [TS]

01:25:29   we all have you're wondering if you're [TS]

01:25:30   able to do anything good is that you [TS]

01:25:33   start listening a lot more to the people [TS]

01:25:35   who are telling you what you need to be [TS]

01:25:37   that's different from who you are and [TS]

01:25:39   i'm not talking about you know just [TS]

01:25:40   morally ethically anything it could just [TS]

01:25:41   be that they want you to play your songs [TS]

01:25:43   like on the record and the thing is that [TS]

01:25:44   the voices that you're most likely to [TS]

01:25:46   hear it's difficult to hear the voices [TS]

01:25:48   of the people who are essentially like I [TS]

01:25:50   still I still enjoy the thing you do I'm [TS]

01:25:51   anxious for the imax to the next thing [TS]

01:25:53   that you would like to do which I think [TS]

01:25:56   it's certainly that can become a recipe [TS]

01:25:58   for self-absorption but [TS]

01:25:59   it's really important to remember that [TS]

01:26:00   nobody out there is looking for the most [TS]

01:26:03   average version of a given jon renau [TS]

01:26:06   nobody wants the like you know the [TS]

01:26:08   algorithm for the heuristic that's going [TS]

01:26:10   to create the most lovable band in the [TS]

01:26:12   world that would be terrible [TS]

01:26:14   they've done this with pop music they [TS]

01:26:15   use I've heard these things where they [TS]

01:26:16   take one of the elements that make a [TS]

01:26:18   great pop song and try to [TS]

01:26:19   algorithmically figure that it's draws a [TS]

01:26:21   city rollers [TS]

01:26:22   Wow almost looks like a crazy butBut I [TS]

01:26:28   don't know I know it sounds like [TS]

01:26:29   inspiration or something but like i just [TS]

01:26:31   i think it's important to remember that [TS]

01:26:33   like you maybe i'm not saying that you [TS]

01:26:36   should go on like this really love [TS]

01:26:37   everything you've ever made but you [TS]

01:26:39   should remember that the people who came [TS]

01:26:41   along with you so far we're there [TS]

01:26:44   because they found something interesting [TS]

01:26:45   about what you're doing [TS]

01:26:46   maybe they didn't love every every song [TS]

01:26:48   maybe they didn't love every blog post [TS]

01:26:50   maybe they love every video or podcast [TS]

01:26:52   but they were there because there's [TS]

01:26:53   something about you that they found [TS]

01:26:55   interesting and I think just about the [TS]

01:26:57   worst thing you can do is to allow [TS]

01:26:59   yourself to become less interesting in [TS]

01:27:01   the service of pleasing completely [TS]

01:27:03   anonymous group of people because [TS]

01:27:05   there's an anonymous group of people [TS]

01:27:06   they're never gonna love you right it's [TS]

01:27:07   like all you can do is try to become a [TS]

01:27:09   better version of whatever you're fucked [TS]

01:27:11   up self is in front of other people and [TS]

01:27:14   there's never been a better time to try [TS]

01:27:15   and do that [TS]

01:27:16   yeah and i think this is what we should [TS]

01:27:17   have done it that talk if it's hardwood [TS]

01:27:19   shut up we could have said this to [TS]

01:27:20   people [TS]

01:27:20   oh I love that I I feel like more and [TS]

01:27:23   more all I'm trying to do is to make [TS]

01:27:25   matter how he happy [TS]

01:27:27   that's a great goal and if I'm making [TS]

01:27:30   him happy I feel like I'm you know I'm [TS]

01:27:32   in the ballpark of what I should be [TS]

01:27:34   doing is so fucking funny that you [TS]

01:27:36   should say that Amy and the other day I [TS]

01:27:39   was sitting on a street corner playing [TS]

01:27:41   threes but the diabolical and thank that [TS]

01:27:46   and banana diabolical cellphone game [TS]

01:27:49   that you bought for me and I'm sitting [TS]

01:27:52   there playing threes and over the course [TS]

01:27:53   of the weekend at the XOXO festival i [TS]

01:27:55   was playing three is quite a bit because [TS]

01:27:57   it's now all that my brain wants to do [TS]

01:27:59   and it's keeping you off the internet [TS]

01:28:01   multiple people walked by and did overdo [TS]

01:28:04   the thing I guess which is now [TS]

01:28:06   acceptable which is to look at someone [TS]

01:28:08   else's phone to see what they're doing [TS]

01:28:09   and then they would tap me on the [TS]

01:28:11   shoulder and give me two thumbs [TS]

01:28:12   that would be like 30 my right and I was [TS]

01:28:15   like oh my god [TS]

01:28:17   but I'm sitting I'm playing threes on [TS]

01:28:19   the side like outside of a venue at one [TS]

01:28:21   o'clock in the morning sitting against a [TS]

01:28:23   wall crouched on the sidewalk playing [TS]

01:28:26   threes and matter how he walks over and [TS]

01:28:28   he's like you're playing threes I said [TS]

01:28:32   yeah I didn't look up i just said yeah [TS]

01:28:34   he's like that makes me so happy and I [TS]

01:28:39   was like I'm doing the right thing that [TS]

01:28:41   I'm making man how we happy [TS]

01:28:46   oh god I will cut this out after I say [TS]

01:28:48   it I used to be I'm not this is not [TS]

01:28:51   going to make it into the show [TS]

01:28:52   ok I I used to be on a really popular [TS]

01:28:54   podcast and you know let's just say that [TS]

01:28:58   I felt like they were good weeks and bad [TS]

01:28:59   weeks but there's a part of me that was [TS]

01:29:00   like I'm not sure that I'm the right [TS]

01:29:01   person to do this anymore and i'm just [TS]

01:29:04   going to say at one point [TS]

01:29:05   matt said he couldn't listen to the show [TS]

01:29:06   anymore and it had a huge effect on me [TS]

01:29:09   deciding to do it anymore [TS]

01:29:11   well and what was his reason what he did [TS]

01:29:13   not like about it oh you know it wasn't [TS]

01:29:15   for him I don't want to get into it but [TS]

01:29:17   all I'm trying to say is how fucking [TS]

01:29:18   funny is that it was exactly matter how [TS]

01:29:21   he's saying you know [TS]

01:29:22   yeah i have been able to sit for a while [TS]

01:29:23   and I was like okay thanks to get [TS]

01:29:26   unlimited that was the company later [TS]

01:29:28   when I you're my canary in the coal mine [TS]

01:29:30   so if i try you know I don't even really [TS]

01:29:35   try to describe three is to you because [TS]

01:29:38   I a new it's one of those things like [TS]

01:29:39   trying to you know describe the [TS]

01:29:41   hallelujah chorus or something like that [TS]

01:29:43   so there's little those cards you move [TS]

01:29:45   around you try and make three zones of [TS]

01:29:47   them and you feel like okay that sounds [TS]

01:29:49   really interesting but what do you think [TS]

01:29:51   let us review you know it took me it [TS]

01:29:53   took me it took me three hours like you [TS]

01:29:57   know you get it I get you get it right [TS]

01:29:59   away kind of and then it takes about [TS]

01:30:01   three hours to sort of go like oh i see [TS]

01:30:04   the I see the bigger picture and then [TS]

01:30:08   after about three hours it's like right [TS]

01:30:11   all right we're cooking here and I you [TS]

01:30:13   know I got like AI scored eight thousand [TS]

01:30:16   or something obviously are you are you [TS]

01:30:19   serious you know the top scores are like [TS]

01:30:21   a million my friend serenity got like [TS]

01:30:23   64,000 yeah I can't get over I [TS]

01:30:26   think it over like 8,000 ever ever ever [TS]

01:30:28   and i've been playing like a lot [TS]

01:30:30   yeah right well 8,000 is hard to get to [TS]

01:30:32   and so then I then as I got to know it [TS]

01:30:35   better you know by like the second day I [TS]

01:30:39   couldn't get anywhere close to eight [TS]

01:30:40   thousand because I'm overthinking it and [TS]

01:30:42   I was like over here I was over there [TS]

01:30:43   and clean up those twos and ones i think [TS]

01:30:45   that's the H key [TS]

01:30:47   yep and so now I've settled into a kind [TS]

01:30:50   of a comfortable like you know sort of [TS]

01:30:54   seven eight thousand ya got so fucking [TS]

01:30:57   angry I and and how he was angry too he [TS]

01:31:00   was like you've been playing this for [TS]

01:31:01   how long and I was like I don't know [TS]

01:31:02   three days four days and he was like you [TS]

01:31:05   fuck you but what's crazy is that I have [TS]

01:31:08   never gotten what is the what is the [TS]

01:31:12   next one for me I think I've I meant [TS]

01:31:15   like that she's like the 256 one or I [TS]

01:31:17   might have gotten the whatever that next [TS]

01:31:19   big one is the f55 whatever i've gotten [TS]

01:31:22   that five whatever's but I haven't [TS]

01:31:23   gotten the the 1000 dry when it says oh [TS]

01:31:27   my so I'm cooking like it though making [TS]

01:31:31   the 192 but I really feel like now I [TS]

01:31:36   need to understand something else that I [TS]

01:31:38   don't understand about it like i have to [TS]

01:31:40   dig I had a path to dig deeper into the [TS]

01:31:43   theory kind of become of fan its I'm [TS]

01:31:47   right play it a lot i really like I mean [TS]

01:31:49   it's only been it's only been three or [TS]

01:31:51   four days since i put it on my phone [TS]

01:31:53   orders are like strategy soy sauce [TS]

01:31:55   punching article surrounding right about [TS]

01:31:56   this but I think one of them is you [TS]

01:31:58   gotta work the corners work the corners [TS]

01:32:00   you're saying how does that help [TS]

01:32:02   ok alright work the corners right i just [TS]

01:32:05   learned yesterday that you can like kind [TS]

01:32:08   of preview a move own and not let go [TS]

01:32:11   that's huge and watch for that little [TS]

01:32:12   notation that over the plus that a big [TS]

01:32:14   week coming where a big 1i like the big [TS]

01:32:16   ones anyway fun game [TS]

01:32:20   you were right not to describe it to me [TS]

01:32:22   because I had the the fun of of [TS]

01:32:25   discovery boom-boom to hear my sleep but [TS]

01:32:33   let me help a lot of people this week [TS]

01:32:35   you think so yeah check the rest of the [TS]

01:32:38   day off [TS]

01:32:39   alright i agree to high-five who I [TS]

01:32:44   filled three coffee cups with pee while [TS]

01:32:47   we're doing the show [TS]

01:32:48   yeah i just added a mute button that's [TS]

01:32:50   pretty cool a very nice and there's the [TS]

01:32:57   [Music] [TS]