Roderick on the Line

Ep. 123: "Your Mom Doesn't Work Here"


00:00:00   this episode of rock on the line is [TS]

00:00:02   sponsored by Squarespace the all-in-one [TS]

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00:00:06   create your own professional website [TS]

00:00:08   portfolio and online store for free [TS]

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00:00:19   [Music] [TS]

00:00:24   hello I John I'm Merlin how's it going [TS]

00:00:29   oh it's going well how are you going I'm [TS]

00:00:32   doing extremely well happy anniversary [TS]

00:00:36   oh really mm-hmm do we have an [TS]

00:00:38   anniversary [TS]

00:00:39   yeah every year and there was this week [TS]

00:00:42   three years ago we started doing this I [TS]

00:00:45   don't really have anything special to [TS]

00:00:46   say about that i just wanna make sure I [TS]

00:00:47   didn't let the day go by [TS]

00:00:48   wow I don't know if you three years ago [TS]

00:00:51   thought that we would still be doing [TS]

00:00:52   this three years from now i don't know [TS]

00:00:54   what I thought three years ago i've [TS]

00:00:56   liked that too [TS]

00:00:59   I'm not gonna like the ocean just ways [TS]

00:01:01   wasn't at the Clinton administration I [TS]

00:01:04   think so it might have been [TS]

00:01:05   yeah yeah you have some listeners that [TS]

00:01:09   weren't even born during the Clinton [TS]

00:01:11   administration that's not true is it [TS]

00:01:14   true true i don't know i do this thing I [TS]

00:01:17   just drop a decade sometimes you know [TS]

00:01:20   about to drop a kid on a fool [TS]

00:01:23   yeah we're all going I can't believe [TS]

00:01:25   it's 20 years since ronald reagan was [TS]

00:01:28   president go away minutes [TS]

00:01:30   I just should be as I was coming down [TS]

00:01:33   here i just did the thing where I was [TS]

00:01:35   driving along and I just drove in the [TS]

00:01:39   wrong direction or I don't go down the [TS]

00:01:43   wrong way towards your office studio or [TS]

00:01:46   either in the wrong way [TS]

00:01:47   no no the wrong the wrong way toward [TS]

00:01:50   where I was going I was just thinking [TS]

00:01:51   you know what I was thinking about I was [TS]

00:01:52   thinking about young black Republicans [TS]

00:01:54   and that haha the subject classic Merlin [TS]

00:01:59   grown through that i only got you [TS]

00:02:02   thinking it returned and I did instead [TS]

00:02:04   of right yeah I went I went the wrong [TS]

00:02:06   way and then I was like where am I you [TS]

00:02:08   know I got to an intersection was like [TS]

00:02:09   which way do I go from here [TS]

00:02:11   the answer was no way that is [TS]

00:02:13   interactive and teaching what happens [TS]

00:02:15   when you think about politics [TS]

00:02:16   well it might be it might be true that I [TS]

00:02:19   should specifically not think about [TS]

00:02:20   young black Republicans because it's a [TS]

00:02:23   because it's kind of like ass like a [TS]

00:02:25   smoke fog that's not the log cabin [TS]

00:02:27   republicans is it [TS]

00:02:28   no those are the young gay Republicans [TS]

00:02:30   or not even young anymore [TS]

00:02:32   lot of them have matured into the [TS]

00:02:34   middle-aged gay Republican but there [TS]

00:02:35   must be some young gay black Republicans [TS]

00:02:37   imagine you could get more tail than [TS]

00:02:38   Sinatra i know for a fact there are I I [TS]

00:02:42   made it up I made it a policy to [TS]

00:02:43   investigate the culture of young black [TS]

00:02:46   Republicans and I was fairly amazed at [TS]

00:02:48   what I found really yeah haha you have [TS]

00:02:56   the most expressive voice it's like it's [TS]

00:02:59   like having an expressive face but you [TS]

00:03:01   can communicate such subtlety with a [TS]

00:03:04   hole with only a couple of syllables [TS]

00:03:07   haha i'm gonna cover that and so I'll [TS]

00:03:12   ride along but you drop the studio right [TS]

00:03:14   nice when today is the first day of the [TS]

00:03:18   seattle seahawks football-playing team [TS]

00:03:22   i'll go hawks and they are going to play [TS]

00:03:24   the green bay packers and so everyone is [TS]

00:03:28   very excited that follows that kind of [TS]

00:03:31   sport and you can feel it in the [TS]

00:03:34   neighborhood already there's a guy in [TS]

00:03:35   there's a guy standing with the with the [TS]

00:03:37   with an orange flag in front of the [TS]

00:03:40   parking lot where i normally park and he [TS]

00:03:43   has a sign that says parking fifty [TS]

00:03:45   dollars [TS]

00:03:47   wow just parking parking fifty dollars [TS]

00:03:51   and the game doesn't start for seven [TS]

00:03:55   hours [TS]

00:03:56   Wow and he's out there already selling [TS]

00:03:58   parking for fifty dollars and so when I [TS]

00:04:00   got into my parking lot so I just like [TS]

00:04:02   drove by man waved and he was like uh I [TS]

00:04:04   was like yeah yeah I've got a parking [TS]

00:04:06   spot i get back in there and there's a [TS]

00:04:09   bus a full-on like a rockstar bus with [TS]

00:04:15   vancouver plates already parked in the [TS]

00:04:19   parking lot taking up [TS]

00:04:20   however many at eight spots and the bus [TS]

00:04:24   is full of canadians who are who are [TS]

00:04:28   tailgating the seahawks game and they're [TS]

00:04:31   in there drinking already it's ten [TS]

00:04:32   o'clock in the morning [TS]

00:04:33   wow yeah so that that is just a [TS]

00:04:38   harbinger of of the day to come here [TS]

00:04:41   we've had a big dust up here because the [TS]

00:04:46   our football team is called the 49ers [TS]

00:04:48   and the races [TS]

00:04:50   yeah I know I know it's it's you know [TS]

00:04:53   all 49ers love gold huh [TS]

00:04:56   now i know right what about the people [TS]

00:04:57   became in 54 in 48 yeah right where [TS]

00:05:00   their parade was their stadium i'll tell [TS]

00:05:02   you where the stadium is used to be at [TS]

00:05:03   Candlestick Park which is you know [TS]

00:05:05   already kind of on the the rim of San [TS]

00:05:07   Francisco they built a new state in the [TS]

00:05:09   levi's stadium has been built in santa [TS]

00:05:12   clara what now I know pretty much [TS]

00:05:15   everything you stand for something on [TS]

00:05:16   the peninsula so you don't need to keep [TS]

00:05:18   track but basically long story short [TS]

00:05:20   ar-ar-ar towns football organization now [TS]

00:05:24   has the distinction of having the [TS]

00:05:27   stadium that is farthest from its actual [TS]

00:05:29   town of anybody in the NFL really did [TS]

00:05:35   yeah right i mean i'm not a football is [TS]

00:05:37   football day like excluding Silicon [TS]

00:05:39   Valley traffic like it's gonna take an [TS]

00:05:40   hour to drive there isn't that isn't [TS]

00:05:43   that crazy and still the San Francisco [TS]

00:05:44   49ers they built a whole big stadium [TS]

00:05:46   it's crazy i read a rundown I mean you [TS]

00:05:48   got you go to sports gaming things [TS]

00:05:50   sometimes some you know it's gotten [TS]

00:05:52   pretty costly you might you might [TS]

00:05:53   football you might spend like two [TS]

00:05:55   hundred dollars on a ticket yes that's [TS]

00:05:58   is that real is that really true [TS]

00:05:59   well yeah because you know that's the [TS]

00:06:02   whole game of professional sports right [TS]

00:06:04   uh aside from the game of actually [TS]

00:06:06   playing the game the game is to is to [TS]

00:06:10   figure out a way to get public money to [TS]

00:06:14   build a giant sports stadium which then [TS]

00:06:17   the majority of his devoted exclusively [TS]

00:06:20   to private wealth and if you spin that [TS]

00:06:25   if you spin it right you can convince [TS]

00:06:29   the municipalities and the people that [TS]

00:06:32   having the sports team that injects a [TS]

00:06:35   lot of money into the economy [TS]

00:06:38   and it is somehow it's a public good and [TS]

00:06:41   right having it having a good sports [TS]

00:06:43   team is like a promotes the city in all [TS]

00:06:47   these you know these confusing ways that [TS]

00:06:50   can't really be quantified and then you [TS]

00:06:53   then you set aside whole levels of the [TS]

00:06:57   stadium for multi multi million dollar [TS]

00:07:00   private boxes and with a baseball team [TS]

00:07:06   my understanding of how this works the [TS]

00:07:09   baseball team place 200k play 650 games [TS]

00:07:12   here 651 dave was not including the suit [TS]

00:07:16   the the superbowl I think it has five [TS]

00:07:18   games a year in football season [TS]

00:07:20   yeah exactly standing amortize it you [TS]

00:07:23   got it that's right way and yet you [TS]

00:07:24   gotta charge big big big dollar so for [TS]

00:07:26   instance i have been to probably [TS]

00:07:29   conservatively 6,000 Mariners games [TS]

00:07:33   understand these are just step on um but [TS]

00:07:37   I have been a sense they tore the [TS]

00:07:39   kingdom down and built the and built the [TS]

00:07:44   but the steel taco that replaced it [TS]

00:07:47   I have been 20 Seahawks games because [TS]

00:07:51   you know who's gonna I mean I'll throw [TS]

00:07:52   ten dollars and mariners game go sit in [TS]

00:07:54   the stands get a hot dog yeah cares but [TS]

00:07:58   two hundred dollars to go to go sit in a [TS]

00:08:00   football stadium no thanks [TS]

00:08:01   yeah you know it's I don't have a super [TS]

00:08:04   strong opinion about it that's backed up [TS]

00:08:06   by how little i've actually chosen to [TS]

00:08:07   learn about this but i dunno it's [TS]

00:08:09   dispiriting its way I like I live in a [TS]

00:08:12   part of town where there are uh matters [TS]

00:08:15   like a lot of like quick working-class [TS]

00:08:17   people who lived in San Francisco a long [TS]

00:08:19   time and you know they'll wear the the [TS]

00:08:22   several 49ers hat and 14 and undershirt [TS]

00:08:26   and the 49ers jacket and they're all [TS]

00:08:27   super into it [TS]

00:08:28   socks 49er Sox yeah but it's just that [TS]

00:08:30   same little needy when you see people [TS]

00:08:32   with multiple articles of sports [TS]

00:08:33   clothing [TS]

00:08:34   it's like this guy's whose Twitter [TS]

00:08:36   picture is then with a girl like proven [TS]

00:08:38   something you know I knew a guy and [TS]

00:08:41   hunger never seemed weird I which 1i [TS]

00:08:44   don't you the guy right [TS]

00:08:45   haha i know a guy and hungry who is the [TS]

00:08:48   world's biggest Ramones [TS]

00:08:50   in and he was one of these guys that if [TS]

00:08:53   you ask him a question the answer was [TS]

00:08:55   the Ramones and it didn't matter what [TS]

00:08:57   did matter what the question always [TS]

00:08:58   bring it back to the ramones guy its [TS]

00:09:01   that's it that's it that's it scanning [TS]

00:09:02   the Ramones The Ramones you always bring [TS]

00:09:04   back to the remote there's an anecdote [TS]

00:09:06   here somewhere where he mentions like [TS]

00:09:08   Tommy Robin yeah you don't you're gonna [TS]

00:09:10   hear about the ramones one way or [TS]

00:09:11   another if you talk to this guy for more [TS]

00:09:13   than a few minutes and he's you know [TS]

00:09:16   he's a smart guy he's an interesting guy [TS]

00:09:18   he's lit LED an interesting life but he [TS]

00:09:21   decided that the the Ramones were the [TS]

00:09:24   thing that he was going to be the expert [TS]

00:09:25   on or the not the expert but like The [TS]

00:09:27   Ramones were going to be his church and [TS]

00:09:30   I and he gave me a lot of insight into [TS]

00:09:33   sports fans because it's like yeah if [TS]

00:09:35   you choose the 49ers and that's your [TS]

00:09:38   church and all year long you're just you [TS]

00:09:41   know you just praying at the altar the [TS]

00:09:43   49ers it takes care of a lot of other [TS]

00:09:45   conversational topics that you might [TS]

00:09:47   have to think about you can just sort of [TS]

00:09:50   knots need you don't have to occupy [TS]

00:09:52   yourself with those questions because [TS]

00:09:54   you can always bring it back to the [TS]

00:09:55   49ers now I think I think you're totally [TS]

00:09:58   right and that's certainly true that's [TS]

00:10:00   an interesting topic there's a lot of [TS]

00:10:01   things like that but you know there was [TS]

00:10:03   a time even before candlestick when they [TS]

00:10:06   just played at kezar and I think he's [TS]

00:10:07   probably seen keys are so i can write by [TS]

00:10:09   the Panhandle is this you have seen in a [TS]

00:10:11   dirty harry movie it's a it's a it's a [TS]

00:10:13   little stadium [TS]

00:10:14   it looks like it looks like a high [TS]

00:10:16   school stadium that they're getting [TS]

00:10:17   ready to replace but I mean it really [TS]

00:10:20   you read these people's anecdotes and [TS]

00:10:21   it's so sweet i mean i get caii kid [TS]

00:10:24   about the sports but I understand when [TS]

00:10:25   people talk about sports they're often [TS]

00:10:27   actually talking about family that's [TS]

00:10:28   important always remember when you make [TS]

00:10:30   fun of sports because you're really [TS]

00:10:31   talking about really know how watching [TS]

00:10:33   games and going to games with your [TS]

00:10:35   family you know throw a football around [TS]

00:10:37   the parking lot before a game and in [TS]

00:10:39   this case being out there was there was [TS]

00:10:40   a time when Morgan Freeman mode it was [TS]

00:10:43   time when a man can take his children to [TS]

00:10:45   a game and have it not caustic and my [TS]

00:10:47   mother house but you go there you just [TS]

00:10:50   go to kezar as a few bucks to get in you [TS]

00:10:52   can just kind of wandering it was like a [TS]

00:10:54   whole production like going to gain [TS]

00:10:55   today sounds like something where you [TS]

00:10:57   know you gotta plan a lot of stuff [TS]

00:10:59   no and then it's like the beers or nine [TS]

00:11:01   dollars for a regular-sized beer so [TS]

00:11:03   everybody's got drunk in the parking lot [TS]

00:11:04   before they go in I think we're seeing [TS]

00:11:07   this culture wide as a side effect of [TS]

00:11:11   the breakdown of you know the breakdown [TS]

00:11:15   of the above the big monolithic cultural [TS]

00:11:19   apparatus right let's save this one can [TS]

00:11:23   I just it's our anniversary I thought [TS]

00:11:27   maybe we could talk about something that [TS]

00:11:30   we can put out and now we're know what I [TS]

00:11:34   mean 11 and i got a fear a little bit [TS]

00:11:36   but I knew this episode of rock on the [TS]

00:11:40   line is sponsored by our good friends at [TS]

00:11:41   Squarespace the only one platform that [TS]

00:11:44   makes it fast and easy to create your [TS]

00:11:46   own professional website portfolio or [TS]

00:11:48   online store make the whole process so [TS]

00:11:51   simple they have an easy drag-and-drop [TS]

00:11:52   interface with beautiful free templates [TS]

00:11:54   you can tweak all the squarespace [TS]

00:11:56   designs are responsive so they look [TS]

00:11:58   great on every device [TS]

00:11:59   Squarespace also has free 24 x seven [TS]

00:12:02   support through live chat an email with [TS]

00:12:04   teams in New York City dublin and [TS]

00:12:06   Portland John I've you square space for [TS]

00:12:08   three years now every episode of rock [TS]

00:12:10   online has gone through them hundred 23 [TS]

00:12:13   episodes in there still so great to work [TS]

00:12:15   with [TS]

00:12:16   just like day one we would love it if [TS]

00:12:17   you would give them a try to squarespace [TS]

00:12:19   plans start at only eight dollars a [TS]

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00:12:24   please remember to tell Squarespace you [TS]

00:12:26   heard about it from your pals that [TS]

00:12:27   Roderick online listeners of this [TS]

00:12:29   program get a free trial plus ten [TS]

00:12:31   percent of any package they choose by [TS]

00:12:33   using the special offer code supertrain [TS]

00:12:35   and check out our thanks to squarespace [TS]

00:12:37   for sporting Roderick on the line we [TS]

00:12:39   could not do without you know that the [TS]

00:12:43   churches are gone for paid my fee ism is [TS]

00:12:47   you know is this is not doesn't have the [TS]

00:12:49   effect on the culture that it used to [TS]

00:12:52   we don't we don't follow the three big [TS]

00:12:54   networks anymore you know journalism is [TS]

00:12:57   balkanized everybody's got their iphone [TS]

00:12:59   nobody reads books [TS]

00:13:01   yeah but only for us but there's a [TS]

00:13:04   problem [TS]

00:13:07   we don't trust the government uh huh is [TS]

00:13:10   an app developers but but what if what [TS]

00:13:15   if what happens is that humanity revert [TS]

00:13:18   to its original its original project [TS]

00:13:22   which is is to organize itself according [TS]

00:13:24   two clans and tribes right and I no [TS]

00:13:28   intercourse in self-destruction that's [TS]

00:13:29   why we're here [TS]

00:13:30   that's exactly right and and that but [TS]

00:13:32   everybody you know everybody that the [TS]

00:13:34   internet is beautiful for this everybody [TS]

00:13:35   grabs onto their their their tribal [TS]

00:13:39   identifier 'he's right and then they're [TS]

00:13:40   bronies are there juggalos or you know [TS]

00:13:43   the one guy that's both the brownie and [TS]

00:13:47   drop below the Berlitz the nose Regulus [TS]

00:13:51   and then and then it's just it's a mad [TS]

00:13:55   dash for people to figure out how to [TS]

00:13:58   profit from that tribalism you know to [TS]

00:14:01   print up the printed t-shirts at a quick [TS]

00:14:05   before the tribe morphs and sell as many [TS]

00:14:08   of them as you can [TS]

00:14:09   who you know and you're walking around [TS]

00:14:11   town like in seattle the the Sonics I [TS]

00:14:15   guess the Sonics aren't team anymore but [TS]

00:14:17   the what are they called that the the [TS]

00:14:19   sockers Seattle soccers the Seattle so [TS]

00:14:23   the sockers they have because it had the [TS]

00:14:25   the in the 1700 thriving soccer industry [TS]

00:14:29   in the Pacific Northwest and and now [TS]

00:14:31   we're going we're going back to our [TS]

00:14:32   original sacher roots here and you see [TS]

00:14:35   people walking around all year long in [TS]

00:14:37   this in this soccer costume which which [TS]

00:14:42   is the color I can't describe you have [TS]

00:14:44   to see the Seattle soccer in fact that [TS]

00:14:46   more about the Seattle soccers the [TS]

00:14:48   Seattle soccer's their colors are like [TS]

00:14:51   colors that you wouldn't you wouldn't [TS]

00:14:54   make it [TS]

00:14:54   toddlers tollway out of these colors [TS]

00:14:57   because you would be afraid of the [TS]

00:14:59   effect that it would have on the kiddo [TS]

00:15:01   growing season is it green and like [TS]

00:15:04   cerulean sort of blue [TS]

00:15:06   yeah it's like puce grouping and [TS]

00:15:09   cerulean blue it's that they are there [TS]

00:15:11   like at some time and I test right you [TS]

00:15:14   would you if you made if you made a few [TS]

00:15:16   made children's blocks out of this you [TS]

00:15:18   would feel like it was some [TS]

00:15:20   it was some sort of seventies a like [TS]

00:15:24   Waldorf School a great experience but [TS]

00:15:27   here's a good sign John is that doesn't [TS]

00:15:29   look very flattering on the players so i [TS]

00:15:31   can only imagine what it looks like on [TS]

00:15:33   the fans of the sockers and that's [TS]

00:15:35   what's so extraordinary like they have [TS]

00:15:37   embraced the fans have embraced these [TS]

00:15:39   colors and you see them all over the [TS]

00:15:40   town and they are colors that not only [TS]

00:15:43   do not appear in nature but had never [TS]

00:15:45   really appeared in fashion before right [TS]

00:15:47   throughout the whole history of threat [TS]

00:15:49   from i observed history of fashion [TS]

00:15:53   there was never a time that color of [TS]

00:15:55   green ever was used [TS]

00:15:57   looks like pond scum and a pond at [TS]

00:16:00   disneyland so so they've so they've that [TS]

00:16:04   you know in a way they've done a [TS]

00:16:05   tremendous job of of a branding their [TS]

00:16:10   team because people haven't rejected the [TS]

00:16:12   color they've embraced it and you could [TS]

00:16:14   see a guy a mile and a half away and [TS]

00:16:17   know that he's the sounders now i see [TS]

00:16:18   yeah that's true that's true no no one [TS]

00:16:20   else oh you wouldn't use that color for [TS]

00:16:22   anything else that they they found the [TS]

00:16:25   one thing that they could you know [TS]

00:16:27   because it was safety orange or whenever [TS]

00:16:29   you just feel like the guy was like if [TS]

00:16:31   you're a fan patient you're a fan of [TS]

00:16:33   patriots you were like red white and [TS]

00:16:35   blue right is that right right when I [TS]

00:16:37   hold my in-laws my family they vary in [TS]

00:16:40   the Patriots but that's not as [TS]

00:16:42   distinctive yellow around my high school [TS]

00:16:44   we had green we had bright green and [TS]

00:16:46   bright yellow and was incredibly [TS]

00:16:48   unflattering my high school was powder [TS]

00:16:51   blue red white and blue but the blue was [TS]

00:16:54   powder blue and it's still kind of [TS]

00:16:57   haunts me that is how flattering because [TS]

00:17:00   our main opponents were black and orange [TS]

00:17:03   and they just looked so badass black and [TS]

00:17:08   orange just like yeah Halloween colors [TS]

00:17:11   and we were we were red white and packed [TS]

00:17:14   powder blue and our and our mascot was [TS]

00:17:16   the Thunderbird which isn't even really [TS]

00:17:19   a thing you know when you talk about [TS]

00:17:22   that though because we might as well [TS]

00:17:24   bring religion into the mix I I think [TS]

00:17:28   you talked about how recently about how [TS]

00:17:30   you know wasn't that long ago [TS]

00:17:32   that letter is a positive feeling or [TS]

00:17:35   negative feeling Presbyterian meant [TS]

00:17:36   something to you like an Episcopalian [TS]

00:17:39   meant something to you were you an [TS]

00:17:40   irish-catholic wearing an Italian [TS]

00:17:41   Catholic they're all these gradations [TS]

00:17:43   that even if you weren't like a super [TS]

00:17:45   observant person those meant the same [TS]

00:17:48   kinds of stuff to average American [TS]

00:17:50   people that never was like us today [TS]

00:17:52   associated with certain colleges oh you [TS]

00:17:54   want to brown or you want to know like [TS]

00:17:56   there's that certain kind of anybody [TS]

00:17:57   else would go likewise that wasn't a [TS]

00:17:59   joke on the simpsons talking about brown [TS]

00:18:01   like that doesn't make any sense but the [TS]

00:18:03   other thing that's interesting is first [TS]

00:18:05   of all like I think it's a think is [TS]

00:18:06   interesting to look at the way religion [TS]

00:18:08   changed through the 60 seventies [TS]

00:18:10   eighties when you got more into this you [TS]

00:18:12   know but promise on my ass but the [TS]

00:18:14   combination of like people become more [TS]

00:18:16   diffuse people's like total acceptance [TS]

00:18:19   of whatever was said by their clergy [TS]

00:18:21   person I think tend to get a little bit [TS]

00:18:24   more dissolute overtime but also you got [TS]

00:18:26   any more like they call i first started [TS]

00:18:27   buffet Catholicism the idea that you [TS]

00:18:29   would accept these things and not those [TS]

00:18:31   things and you know you might be [TS]

00:18:33   incredibly Arden partly Catholic about [TS]

00:18:36   these things and not those but you see [TS]

00:18:38   that now today in all these million [TS]

00:18:40   other things doctor who like in the [TS]

00:18:42   doctor who fan community is it's not [TS]

00:18:44   just like Doctor Who lots of people like [TS]

00:18:47   Doctor Who you Napoli really how [TS]

00:18:50   incredibly specific people get that is [TS]

00:18:52   true of anything when I listen to NPR [TS]

00:18:54   now i know i'm out of exciting [TS]

00:18:56   recognizing your bands on NPR and talk [TS]

00:18:58   about new pornographers yesterday hit [TS]

00:18:59   like I got 100 we're just talking to [TS]

00:19:03   these guys with beards I don't know who [TS]

00:19:04   they are but like there's so much you [TS]

00:19:06   realize instrument punk-rock apps think [TS]

00:19:07   about all the flavors of punk rock but [TS]

00:19:10   you know you know I mentioned with [TS]

00:19:11   Doctor Who because it is something that [TS]

00:19:13   I enjoy that I'm a small fan of compared [TS]

00:19:16   to the mega fans but I've never seen so [TS]

00:19:18   much diversity in a community that I'm [TS]

00:19:21   aware of that there were people get [TS]

00:19:23   along but at the same time there are [TS]

00:19:24   some people who really hate this [TS]

00:19:25   particular doctor they really love this [TS]

00:19:27   particular duck like the doctor to be [TS]

00:19:29   like an alien like that like the doctor [TS]

00:19:30   be like a human they hate this companion [TS]

00:19:32   love this campaign but like it's almost [TS]

00:19:34   endless the number of combinations in [TS]

00:19:36   fandom and you might love the companion [TS]

00:19:38   in this episode you know short stuff [TS]

00:19:39   like Star Wars I mean it's just weird [TS]

00:19:41   because that's something that's popped [TS]

00:19:42   up [TS]

00:19:43   as a fan thing especially the last five [TS]

00:19:46   years there's always been like sci-fi [TS]

00:19:47   fans but like it's this huge thing it's [TS]

00:19:49   true and comics but like it gives you [TS]

00:19:51   that satisfaction of being part of a [TS]

00:19:54   community while still being incredibly [TS]

00:19:56   passionate about something and on top of [TS]

00:19:58   it all [TS]

00:19:58   you're not just some nerd who likes nerd [TS]

00:20:01   stuff you're a very specific kind of [TS]

00:20:03   nerd and you're remembering sec you're [TS]

00:20:06   in it you're in a tribe but you will [TS]

00:20:08   really get to pick where you get to sit [TS]

00:20:10   and I I think that's both very [TS]

00:20:13   interesting and can potentially be a [TS]

00:20:15   little divisive because things start to [TS]

00:20:17   seem real but but i mean i agree with [TS]

00:20:20   you you don't have the same institutions [TS]

00:20:21   that she used to and now that we all get [TS]

00:20:23   to kind of pick our family [TS]

00:20:25   I think she interesting stuff coming out [TS]

00:20:26   of that it's definitely gonna make very [TS]

00:20:29   it's going to make for a very [TS]

00:20:30   interesting brand base to stick fighting [TS]

00:20:33   tournaments [TS]

00:20:34   oh now with a be sponsors or is that the [TS]

00:20:37   people you follow on twitter like I like [TS]

00:20:40   a best buy like people follow best buy [TS]

00:20:41   on Twitter and write out a certain point [TS]

00:20:43   all of the doctor who fans are going to [TS]

00:20:46   sit on one side of the stadium against [TS]

00:20:49   all of the Star Trek fans in the big [TS]

00:20:53   doctor who star trek fans stick fight [TS]

00:20:56   tournaments this is like England in the [TS]

00:20:58   in the late thirties you gotta pick a [TS]

00:20:59   side right but at a certain point when [TS]

00:21:01   the doctor who fans go back to the you [TS]

00:21:05   know the area around santa clara where [TS]

00:21:07   they have made their homeland and the [TS]

00:21:09   started their settlements yeah the Star [TS]

00:21:12   Trek fans go down to Santa Barbara where [TS]

00:21:14   they have made their home wins that that [TS]

00:21:17   the the regional stick fighting is all [TS]

00:21:19   going to happen between the sexes right [TS]

00:21:22   you're going to have to qualify for the [TS]

00:21:23   Star Trek team by fight you know you're [TS]

00:21:25   you're like you're Kirk cause player and [TS]

00:21:29   you're gonna have to fight against a DNI [TS]

00:21:32   cause player in order to get that right [TS]

00:21:35   at the end Troy deanna troi that's right [TS]

00:21:38   to different areas [TS]

00:21:39   I know that name I've read that name [TS]

00:21:41   yeah and so he's an empath i was i was [TS]

00:21:44   standing out in front of packs the [TS]

00:21:46   videogame conference the other day it [TS]

00:21:48   was some people I know and like and we [TS]

00:21:51   we had reason we had reason to take [TS]

00:21:54   recourse in our phones [TS]

00:21:56   for a moment and so everybody pulled [TS]

00:21:59   their phones out and i looked around and [TS]

00:22:01   i was the only one with an iphone how [TS]

00:22:05   that's super interesting let android [TS]

00:22:08   android they all had android phones and [TS]

00:22:11   I was and the thing is they didn't make [TS]

00:22:14   mention of it and I was like oh whoa do [TS]

00:22:19   you guys all have android phones and [TS]

00:22:21   they all looked up and kinda had that [TS]

00:22:23   like huh oh [TS]

00:22:26   doesn't everyone have an android phone [TS]

00:22:27   mind a lot of setup you guys are [TS]

00:22:30   Catholic [TS]

00:22:31   yeah right like they were going to [TS]

00:22:33   wonder why would you need to mention [TS]

00:22:34   what are you talking about whatever [TS]

00:22:36   you'd 0 is there another kind of phone [TS]

00:22:39   other than android phone and some of it [TS]

00:22:41   felt a little bit like practiced but [TS]

00:22:45   also times have changed just in the last [TS]

00:22:48   couple years when you wear now that's a [TS]

00:22:51   not only viable but like to some people [TS]

00:22:54   I guess so [TS]

00:22:55   always great greatly preferable for [TS]

00:22:57   certain people in many ways [TS]

00:22:59   yeah right and so and they just you know [TS]

00:23:01   back to like people poop and all of a [TS]

00:23:03   sudden I felt like I was on enemy [TS]

00:23:05   territory and I was like oh I don't even [TS]

00:23:08   care about like I'm not a person who [TS]

00:23:12   brand identifies but I'm used to in [TS]

00:23:15   rock-and-roll circles at least [TS]

00:23:17   everybody's got an iphone and the and so [TS]

00:23:20   you never have to think about what kind [TS]

00:23:22   of phone you have anymore you [TS]

00:23:25   everybody's got an iphone and so it's [TS]

00:23:27   just assume that that's the only kind of [TS]

00:23:29   phone and those questions are removed [TS]

00:23:32   mmm yeah but what happens when somebody [TS]

00:23:37   texts you and it's a green bubble utd's [TS]

00:23:41   do you think you think you can teach [TS]

00:23:42   anything like a steer might what usually [TS]

00:23:45   goes through my mind is oh now that [TS]

00:23:47   features working again or now it's not [TS]

00:23:50   again is the bigger level of blue [TS]

00:23:53   bubbles mean it's somebody you know why [TS]

00:23:55   but I text my text my mom all the time [TS]

00:23:59   and sometimes it's in a green bubble and [TS]

00:24:01   sometimes in a blue bubble and it and [TS]

00:24:04   she has a just like mine and so I feel [TS]

00:24:07   like that is that is another one of [TS]

00:24:09   it's things that like wouldn't that be [TS]

00:24:11   interesting if it worked well you're [TS]

00:24:13   like they're gonna make bigger phones so [TS]

00:24:15   that's going to be good for you that's [TS]

00:24:16   gonna be getting really really big fun i [TS]

00:24:19   have to say this is the thing I'm I'm [TS]

00:24:22   loath to say because it feels like [TS]

00:24:26   product promotion but Apple issued that [TS]

00:24:30   recall all right get the battery thing [TS]

00:24:33   and I went in and my phone my phone [TS]

00:24:39   qualified and they gave me a new phone [TS]

00:24:42   is it and did you get you five we're [TS]

00:24:44   gonna give you five s uh it's a that [TS]

00:24:47   they have a they have an internal [TS]

00:24:50   requirement that it be exactly the same [TS]

00:24:54   as the phone color you had before [TS]

00:24:57   that's cool still I mean but it's a [TS]

00:24:58   brand-new is a refurbished phoner [TS]

00:24:59   Angelus brand new phone that's awesome [TS]

00:25:02   going off the shelf and now i don't have [TS]

00:25:03   the battery problems anymore i go all [TS]

00:25:05   day long and my phone doesn't die and it [TS]

00:25:09   and it felt for it felt you know like an [TS]

00:25:12   example of I mean the my phones two [TS]

00:25:14   years old at this point and it had been [TS]

00:25:16   through a couple of different rainstorms [TS]

00:25:18   it went through the washing machine one [TS]

00:25:20   time huh [TS]

00:25:22   I yeah I i used it as a shuttlecock in [TS]

00:25:28   the in well as I was taking a carpet [TS]

00:25:31   knitting class the phone was pretty [TS]

00:25:33   badly damaged get what I'm back to a [TS]

00:25:37   badminton birdie [TS]

00:25:39   I took AI took am I took like a berber [TS]

00:25:42   carpet weaving class and you know you [TS]

00:25:44   he is if he used the phone as a little [TS]

00:25:48   shuttlecock [TS]

00:25:49   ah but the but the company made good on [TS]

00:25:54   their on their failure right [TS]

00:25:57   eventually yeah yeah they had they they [TS]

00:25:59   did a terrible thing they made a bad [TS]

00:26:01   phone Steve Jobs died and no one was in [TS]

00:26:03   charge anymore that's right and they put [TS]

00:26:05   a bad thing out into the world and then [TS]

00:26:07   two years later they made it right and I [TS]

00:26:09   am i i'm i'm pleased as well now you got [TS]

00:26:12   more battery time to give you more time [TS]

00:26:13   to be frustrated with the things that [TS]

00:26:15   don't work right on it [TS]

00:26:16   well not reach our church except i am [TS]

00:26:18   gradually I am gradually taking a [TS]

00:26:22   oops off I i put your app threes on [TS]

00:26:27   there before but i am taking other apps [TS]

00:26:30   off good-for-you everyday i take some [TS]

00:26:33   apps off and every day my I walk a [TS]

00:26:36   little lighter and and and I I feel a [TS]

00:26:38   little stronger you know you can you can [TS]

00:26:41   always get him back but you know get [TS]

00:26:43   them off there is a very freeing feeling [TS]

00:26:44   did you ever get that other facebook app [TS]

00:26:47   that you needed so I took facebook off [TS]

00:26:50   my phone [TS]

00:26:51   wow it's gone you're kidding gone [TS]

00:26:54   completely [TS]

00:26:54   that must have been hard well I you know [TS]

00:26:58   what it was i sat down and I said you [TS]

00:27:00   because because the logic i was using [TS]

00:27:03   was when i get a lot of work through [TS]

00:27:04   facebook people contact me on facebook [TS]

00:27:07   and they give me that offers two things [TS]

00:27:09   and if I don't have facebook on there [TS]

00:27:12   I'm missing out on all these people [TS]

00:27:14   these booking agents who are only [TS]

00:27:15   communicating through facebook anymore [TS]

00:27:17   but the more I thought about it i sat [TS]

00:27:20   down and I ran like well let's name the [TS]

00:27:23   top 10 gigs you've gotten from people [TS]

00:27:26   contacting you on facebook i was like mm [TS]

00:27:29   mm right it's mostly garbage you know [TS]

00:27:37   it's mostly a I do get a lot of i do end [TS]

00:27:40   up doing a lot of things but it's like [TS]

00:27:41   hey will you to be in it can i interview [TS]

00:27:44   you for my high school paper or I don't [TS]

00:27:47   you know frankly I couldn't remember a [TS]

00:27:49   single thing and and I felt like if if [TS]

00:27:52   Facebook the danger is that my facebook [TS]

00:27:54   page is still out there and so people [TS]

00:27:56   are going to send me messages on it and [TS]

00:27:58   then wonder why I didn't reply right but [TS]

00:28:03   I I can't hold it all that guilt I just [TS]

00:28:08   took it off i just took it off and I [TS]

00:28:10   stopped thinking about it that's you [TS]

00:28:11   know that's the end of the story cold [TS]

00:28:13   turkey and and it's a it's it's already [TS]

00:28:18   a delightful to not have that but really [TS]

00:28:20   really I'm its I'm just I'm narrowing in [TS]

00:28:24   on twitter i'm i'm stalking it [TS]

00:28:27   I'm thinking about it you know i'm [TS]

00:28:30   evaluating what twitter is for me and [TS]

00:28:34   I'm and I'm I'm coming close to coming [TS]

00:28:38   close to making a decision to having a [TS]

00:28:41   referendum on it [TS]

00:28:42   I keep thinking I keep thinking the [TS]

00:28:45   there's Benny's legitimately bad things [TS]

00:28:47   everybody feels bad about this is [TS]

00:28:49   generally these bad things everybody [TS]

00:28:50   doesn't like and I keep thinking okay [TS]

00:28:52   well I guess that that's good that we're [TS]

00:28:55   getting maybe this progress on that you [TS]

00:28:58   know on some kind of an issue you know [TS]

00:29:00   this is the same way that everybody [TS]

00:29:01   turned their icons green for Iran so we [TS]

00:29:03   can save them and then they change them [TS]

00:29:06   back and I keep thinking you know maybe [TS]

00:29:08   we've reached peak outrage and then it's [TS]

00:29:11   like it can't be 18 hours before [TS]

00:29:14   somebody a bunch of people are suddenly [TS]

00:29:16   mad about a new thing and it really i'm [TS]

00:29:19   not trying to be cynical because I [TS]

00:29:21   understand everybody has their reasons [TS]

00:29:22   but it really it's really i'm reminded [TS]

00:29:25   when I start getting frustrated about it [TS]

00:29:27   because it becomes not as fun to use if [TS]

00:29:29   that's most of what's there [TS]

00:29:31   it's like you know you're never gonna be [TS]

00:29:32   not outraged there's always gonna be [TS]

00:29:34   another thing that you have to have [TS]

00:29:37   blind righteous outrage about and the [TS]

00:29:41   bar seems to be getting impossibly low [TS]

00:29:43   for that it's solo that's exactly right [TS]

00:29:46   and at least one thing i want to clarify [TS]

00:29:48   this because I i can hear these words [TS]

00:29:50   coming out of my mouth and I know what [TS]

00:29:51   it sounds like i'm not talking about [TS]

00:29:52   anybody's particular beef and i'm not [TS]

00:29:54   talking about anybody's particular right [TS]

00:29:57   right exactly as a writer about the [TS]

00:29:59   right to feel how they want about stuff [TS]

00:30:01   but sometimes when I look at the movie [TS]

00:30:03   listings i don't see any movies I want [TS]

00:30:04   to go to and more and more that doesn't [TS]

00:30:06   make me not like movies or hate people [TS]

00:30:08   who make movies but it does make me have [TS]

00:30:10   three or four weeks go by were like wow [TS]

00:30:12   this is really not for me [TS]

00:30:14   yeah that's what it feels like [TS]

00:30:15   everything is I'm the reason I'm having [TS]

00:30:18   this experience is that i'm at that it's [TS]

00:30:20   it's very personal right like i have [TS]

00:30:23   always been interested in what's going [TS]

00:30:25   on and I've always been interested in [TS]

00:30:27   engaging in the culture as it is now and [TS]

00:30:30   the end and talking about the [TS]

00:30:32   contemporary ideas [TS]

00:30:34   but i have never been someone who's felt [TS]

00:30:37   a special outraged about anything and I [TS]

00:30:42   find myself being consumed on a daily [TS]

00:30:45   basis with you know that that that [TS]

00:30:48   tightening in the chest and that knot in [TS]

00:30:51   the stomach where it's not a response to [TS]

00:30:55   the events that are being debated it's a [TS]

00:30:59   response to the debate her and and my [TS]

00:31:03   aunt and my feeling like I need to [TS]

00:31:05   engage in the debate and I need to be it [TS]

00:31:07   united we need to be in there throwing [TS]

00:31:09   elbows and like making sure that my [TS]

00:31:12   point is heard and all the stuffin you [TS]

00:31:15   know I did a series of events at [TS]

00:31:17   bumbershoot this year [TS]

00:31:19   oh yeah I want to hear how that went and [TS]

00:31:21   it was really great [TS]

00:31:22   it was you know I was sort of moderating [TS]

00:31:24   discussions everyday and early on in the [TS]

00:31:30   year we can depict various topics that [TS]

00:31:33   felt really of the moment and we had [TS]

00:31:37   these panel discussions where a couple [TS]

00:31:40   of different people who were nominally [TS]

00:31:42   experts on the topic got up and gave 10 [TS]

00:31:44   minute presentations and then we sat [TS]

00:31:46   together and discussed the ways in which [TS]

00:31:48   those ideas overlapped one another and [TS]

00:31:52   then we took questions from the audience [TS]

00:31:53   and you know it was like a like an [TS]

00:31:55   hour-long sort of words and ideas a [TS]

00:32:00   panel and two of the days went off [TS]

00:32:06   really really well they were they were [TS]

00:32:09   the first day was why beards why [TS]

00:32:12   twerking why now and it was you know it [TS]

00:32:18   was a little bit of a culture clash I [TS]

00:32:20   had my friend Elon who is a producer of [TS]

00:32:23   The Bachelor come up and talk about [TS]

00:32:26   beards because he has a kind of famously [TS]

00:32:27   unruly beard he's on the plane [TS]

00:32:30   he's a guy on the plane with diane and [TS]

00:32:32   seven alright and then I i had one of [TS]

00:32:37   the dancers for Big Freedia get up and [TS]

00:32:39   talk about twerking on the culture [TS]

00:32:41   twerking [TS]

00:32:42   well it's a it was a real cultural [TS]

00:32:45   exchange because this dancer is is it is [TS]

00:32:47   from New Orleans and came up in the [TS]

00:32:49   bounce music scene and through his [TS]

00:32:53   twerking skills and his bounce dancing [TS]

00:32:57   skills he's now seen the world right he [TS]

00:32:59   was a guy that probably would have been [TS]

00:33:01   had you know a New Orleans resident his [TS]

00:33:05   whole life and never been outside of the [TS]

00:33:07   city and through bounce and that the [TS]

00:33:10   cultural through because the world has [TS]

00:33:13   gotten excited about and has now [TS]

00:33:16   appropriated his regional culture he [TS]

00:33:20   gets an opportunity to go to Paris and [TS]

00:33:22   and dance on television and talk for [TS]

00:33:24   money work for money so talking to him [TS]

00:33:28   about about the world and how it is that [TS]

00:33:31   that his culture is so popular now in [TS]

00:33:36   his awareness that it's a it's a kind of [TS]

00:33:39   a moment in the Sun but but then he was [TS]

00:33:42   talking about how bounce is 20 years old [TS]

00:33:46   already and will and it will live in New [TS]

00:33:50   Orleans for an eternity [TS]

00:33:52   you know he was very sanguine about it [TS]

00:33:54   and it was just it was a very [TS]

00:33:56   interesting conversation and like how [TS]

00:33:57   you wouldn't think those two things went [TS]

00:33:59   together but that is exactly the kind of [TS]

00:34:01   program we were trying to do and it's [TS]

00:34:03   nice i mean you get a gloss on this but [TS]

00:34:05   it's nice to hear somebody who's not [TS]

00:34:07   super defensive about it and it's just [TS]

00:34:09   glad to see people enjoying it and [TS]

00:34:10   seeing it spread [TS]

00:34:11   yeah and I felt like he has some like [TS]

00:34:13   ownership on where he you know wants to [TS]

00:34:15   get his percentage from it right and and [TS]

00:34:17   and to his credit and I think this is [TS]

00:34:19   you know I mean when you get an [TS]

00:34:21   opportunity to talk two dancers about [TS]

00:34:24   culture you get a different perspective [TS]

00:34:25   you know and he's a he he is primarily [TS]

00:34:28   interacting with the world with his body [TS]

00:34:31   and like he wants to talk about he wants [TS]

00:34:34   to dance primarily and then he's willing [TS]

00:34:36   to talk about it and that was that was [TS]

00:34:39   cool and and [TS]

00:34:41   and exciting and then the the next day I [TS]

00:34:44   had a brownie and a juggalo come out and [TS]

00:34:47   describe their cultures that devil you [TS]

00:34:49   say [TS]

00:34:49   and really yeah and the the the brownie [TS]

00:34:52   was a guy you may have seen on the [TS]

00:34:54   internet called the world's manliest [TS]

00:34:57   brownie [TS]

00:34:58   he's a he's a a guy that works at a in [TS]

00:35:01   the parts dept of a harley-davidson [TS]

00:35:02   dealership in michigan and he's also a [TS]

00:35:06   brownie he's six foot five and 300 [TS]

00:35:08   pounds and he's got like a walrus [TS]

00:35:12   mustache walrus mustache that guy and he [TS]

00:35:15   had a real pattern about he'd been on a [TS]

00:35:18   couple of documentary films about [TS]

00:35:19   bronies and he was you he already was [TS]

00:35:21   sort of the thought of himself as a [TS]

00:35:23   celebrity and I and as a worldwide [TS]

00:35:28   advocate for bronies but the juggalo was [TS]

00:35:33   just a guy from Arizona name at the [TS]

00:35:37   dragon spell TR AG a.m. and Matt the [TS]

00:35:44   dragon was just a kid who was juggalo [TS]

00:35:51   and had made a had made a film about [TS]

00:35:55   juggalos and he had never given a public [TS]

00:36:01   presentation before and he got up and [TS]

00:36:04   started talking about juggalo lyfe and [TS]

00:36:08   this on the audience that I that I had [TS]

00:36:10   for this event you know just 250 or 300 [TS]

00:36:13   Seattle liberals and they really wanted [TS]

00:36:19   to confront this guy and I had I had [TS]

00:36:22   people stand up during the [TS]

00:36:23   question-and-answer and like and so one [TS]

00:36:26   woman said i was like i'm gonna read use [TS]

00:36:28   of insane clown posse lyrics now at Lana [TS]

00:36:31   and I want you to defend because he you [TS]

00:36:35   know he was saying like juggalos a [TS]

00:36:37   community and we are we're good for the [TS]

00:36:39   world [TS]

00:36:40   she was like I want you to defend the [TS]

00:36:41   misogyny and violence in this [TS]

00:36:45   and he very gracefully and a and because [TS]

00:36:49   he's just in the life right he he he's [TS]

00:36:52   not he wasn't thinking he wasn't he [TS]

00:36:56   wasn't prepared to be confronted but he [TS]

00:36:59   handled her question the following way [TS]

00:37:01   he said well you know the violence and [TS]

00:37:04   all the like a clownish language that [TS]

00:37:12   they use is well first of all they're [TS]

00:37:15   clowns we are all clowns and that is [TS]

00:37:19   because we feel like we're the clouds of [TS]

00:37:20   society so a lot of it is pretend we're [TS]

00:37:24   we're playing pretend [TS]

00:37:26   but but that violence and and misogyny [TS]

00:37:29   and all that stuff attracts violent [TS]

00:37:33   young men to juggle ilysm and then once [TS]

00:37:38   they're in the community we tame them [TS]

00:37:42   and and show them that we are a family [TS]

00:37:47   and that we and that they finally have a [TS]

00:37:49   family and it was like you could hear [TS]

00:37:53   the beacon here [TS]

00:37:54   a hush descends on the room and I i [TS]

00:37:57   think a lot of people didn't agree but [TS]

00:38:02   they that hear this guy was defending [TS]

00:38:05   his life and uh and I it was it was a [TS]

00:38:10   truly an example of a roomful of people [TS]

00:38:12   who left their with something to think [TS]

00:38:14   about who you know like there's a lot of [TS]

00:38:17   violent young guys out there that didn't [TS]

00:38:18   have fathers and if they end up in the [TS]

00:38:22   juggalo community [TS]

00:38:23   I mean this guy's point was there are a [TS]

00:38:24   lot worse things that could happen and [TS]

00:38:27   juggalo is a is a place for them to land [TS]

00:38:29   was like oh ok [TS]

00:38:31   right on you know that's like that [TS]

00:38:32   sounds like a successful event [TS]

00:38:35   high fives all around ok so the last day [TS]

00:38:37   the panel and I bet as it was [TS]

00:38:41   approaching out i was thinking back nine [TS]

00:38:43   months ago when I was when we were [TS]

00:38:45   throwing ideas around and we settled on [TS]

00:38:47   our ideas and I was just slapping my [TS]

00:38:50   head going [TS]

00:38:51   what were we thinking but the last day [TS]

00:38:54   the panel was why cat [TS]

00:38:56   why bullying why now and in trying to [TS]

00:39:01   put this panel together it turned out I [TS]

00:39:04   know the manager of grumpy cat he's a [TS]

00:39:07   personal friend and he's and that's his [TS]

00:39:10   job he manages grumpy cat and that's [TS]

00:39:12   that catalyst grumpy [TS]

00:39:13   it's the grumpy cat huh he's his manager [TS]

00:39:16   I think he also manages that little some [TS]

00:39:22   sort of 8-bit graphic the cat with the [TS]

00:39:26   rainbow and the triangle eyes he manages [TS]

00:39:30   that cat and he manages a one other cat [TS]

00:39:35   another famous Catholic busy [TS]

00:39:39   professional cat manager he's a [TS]

00:39:40   professional internet cat manager so I [TS]

00:39:45   know I'm gonna regret laughing in a [TS]

00:39:46   minute i think that's that's kind of [TS]

00:39:48   funny on the face of it [TS]

00:39:49   oh yeah and in fact he's in vancouver [TS]

00:39:52   right now I hope I don't give too much [TS]

00:39:53   away but he's making a grumpy cat [TS]

00:39:55   christmas movie [TS]

00:39:56   well yeah but uh the bullying topic i [TS]

00:40:03   tried to get dan Savage to be on the [TS]

00:40:04   panel and he wrote me a very thoughtful [TS]

00:40:06   email where he said I will be on any [TS]

00:40:08   panel you ever ask me to be except [TS]

00:40:12   bullying I do not ever want to talk [TS]

00:40:14   about it again [TS]

00:40:16   what because he's talked about a line [TS]

00:40:18   yeah well he's the he's the he's the guy [TS]

00:40:20   is the it gets better' guy he's the good [TS]

00:40:22   let's get back in there gets better guy [TS]

00:40:25   ok it was great except he has come under [TS]

00:40:28   tremendous fire as everyone in the world [TS]

00:40:31   does now who says anything off the [TS]

00:40:34   reservation out in the world and I don't [TS]

00:40:37   even know why he has come under fire [TS]

00:40:39   from inside that community people yeah [TS]

00:40:41   on the goddamn bowling topic I don't [TS]

00:40:42   know why I don't I don't I didn't even [TS]

00:40:44   research it enough to know why he feels [TS]

00:40:46   burned but he's like I don't want to [TS]

00:40:48   talk about anymore and I tried to get a [TS]

00:40:50   couple of different people and nobody [TS]

00:40:51   would talk about it and as as we got [TS]

00:40:54   closer to bumbershoot I was like I [TS]

00:40:55   understand why no one wants to talk [TS]

00:40:58   about bullying in public [TS]

00:41:00   and I'm wondering why I thought it was a [TS]

00:41:02   good idea to have this on the have this [TS]

00:41:06   is a topic and the more I thought about [TS]

00:41:09   it was like oh i remember why i thought [TS]

00:41:11   it was interesting because it is [TS]

00:41:12   interesting it would be it's a very [TS]

00:41:15   interesting topic it's a kid why is [TS]

00:41:18   bullying why has it become so a [TS]

00:41:21   fascinating to us at this moment in time [TS]

00:41:23   it is occupying a huge place in the [TS]

00:41:26   culture talking about bullying and what [TS]

00:41:29   is bullying and what does it represent [TS]

00:41:31   and I mean it's a fascinating topic and [TS]

00:41:35   I remember why I chose it because i [TS]

00:41:38   really really thought it would be [TS]

00:41:39   interesting but as it got closer and I [TS]

00:41:42   tried to get a panelist to represent it [TS]

00:41:44   and all I got back was like no thank you [TS]

00:41:48   i mean i would love to work with you [TS]

00:41:50   anytime but please know i'm feeling I'm [TS]

00:41:52   feeling down here John is it because [TS]

00:41:54   talking about trying to stop bullying [TS]

00:41:56   makes you a target for being bullied [TS]

00:41:58   well let me let me tell you what [TS]

00:42:01   happened so we got a woman who is a [TS]

00:42:03   stand-up comedian from Portland who [TS]

00:42:06   agreed to talk about bullying and she [TS]

00:42:07   she got up and her presentation was a [TS]

00:42:11   kind of polemical she cheat true on all [TS]

00:42:17   the received wisdom that you would find [TS]

00:42:19   on twitter about you know like we all [TS]

00:42:23   agree that we live in a patriarchal rape [TS]

00:42:26   culture where etc etc etc you know all [TS]

00:42:30   the all the sort of like we all agree [TS]

00:42:33   statements and what follows from that is [TS]

00:42:37   uh is this you know is the fact that [TS]

00:42:42   bullying is endemic in our culture and [TS]

00:42:46   that it is that it creates all these [TS]

00:42:49   terrible outcomes and that it is a that [TS]

00:42:51   it's even further evidence that that [TS]

00:42:57   that that are I guess that our culture [TS]

00:43:00   is unsustainably broken and then the [TS]

00:43:05   audience started and I i preface the [TS]

00:43:07   whole event by saying like we're talking [TS]

00:43:10   about these ideas in their contemporary [TS]

00:43:12   context so we're not just going to get [TS]

00:43:14   up here and define bullying and then [TS]

00:43:18   argue about it it's what's interesting [TS]

00:43:21   about this is like why now why is this [TS]

00:43:23   happening now and how does this relate [TS]

00:43:25   you know cats are very popular on the [TS]

00:43:28   internet right now [TS]

00:43:29   cats are a perennial topic they've [TS]

00:43:31   always cats have been around for [TS]

00:43:32   hundreds of thousands of years [TS]

00:43:34   why are they so contemporary and [TS]

00:43:37   bullying to has always existed why now [TS]

00:43:40   you know that was the idea [TS]

00:43:41   well so this woman gets up and actually [TS]

00:43:43   does give just a definition of what she [TS]

00:43:45   imagines the definitely she sounds like [TS]

00:43:47   she unlike the others maybe she opened [TS]

00:43:49   up this is good or bad [TS]

00:43:50   it says she opened up by reminding you [TS]

00:43:53   that we all agree on what describes this [TS]

00:43:56   problem didn't just open up that was [TS]

00:43:58   that was her entire presentation was [TS]

00:44:00   just yet fully like you said polemic [TS]

00:44:02   yeah was just was describing her not her [TS]

00:44:05   take on it because there was nothing [TS]

00:44:07   imaginative about it but basically just [TS]

00:44:09   reading hashtag bullying presumptions [TS]

00:44:15   and then the audience started raising [TS]

00:44:19   their hands to ask questions and i felt [TS]

00:44:20   like i was at a fucking chemtrails [TS]

00:44:22   conference every person stood up and [TS]

00:44:27   gave a five-minute long speech about [TS]

00:44:29   what they thought about boolean no [TS]

00:44:36   questions that were not even that there [TS]

00:44:39   wasn't even the slightest hint of a [TS]

00:44:40   question thread into these statements i [TS]

00:44:42   was like being at a tea party town hall [TS]

00:44:44   meeting and I'm sitting on stage and [TS]

00:44:47   that this hasn't happened at any other [TS]

00:44:49   panel that I've moderated and I'm trying [TS]

00:44:52   to you know I'm like okay that's great [TS]

00:44:54   well you know trying to interrupt and [TS]

00:44:55   say like is there a question in this or [TS]

00:44:57   do you have something at it and people [TS]

00:45:00   were shouting talking over me sound so [TS]

00:45:04   weird and then all of a sudden there's a [TS]

00:45:07   there's like an invisible divide that [TS]

00:45:08   starts [TS]

00:45:09   down the middle of the room where think [TS]

00:45:11   the cat guy is kind of setting up there [TS]

00:45:13   like okay dokey well and he leans in and [TS]

00:45:17   says you know I mean it's funny because [TS]

00:45:19   a lot of these bullying a lot of this [TS]

00:45:23   stuff we're um people don't know what [TS]

00:45:25   the rules are a lot of that used to be [TS]

00:45:28   solved in the old days by a like [TS]

00:45:30   basically playground playground [TS]

00:45:35   democracy right if you were a bully you [TS]

00:45:37   got Smackdown by somebody else and maybe [TS]

00:45:39   a little bit of bullying is what keeps [TS]

00:45:41   people in line and all of a sudden half [TS]

00:45:45   the room was like yeah and the other [TS]

00:45:49   half of the room could not have been [TS]

00:45:51   more appalled and they were like you [TS]

00:45:53   know who and I was like whoa whoa that's [TS]

00:45:58   you know that's that's he just [TS]

00:46:00   contributed a sentence to the [TS]

00:46:02   conversation it's not like we are no you [TS]

00:46:05   put your Spears down everybody and that [TS]

00:46:08   and I was as the moderator sitting on [TS]

00:46:10   stage just hoping that the hour would be [TS]

00:46:14   over [TS]

00:46:15   it's at that point you know I feel after [TS]

00:46:17   after 75 minutes at that point you go [TS]

00:46:20   like I don't know there's a way out of [TS]

00:46:21   this there and I was just I was I was [TS]

00:46:24   you know anything you say is gonna be [TS]

00:46:27   again this is not a value thing but once [TS]

00:46:28   you start once one starts feeling that [TS]

00:46:30   pressure you realize that anything you [TS]

00:46:32   say is likely to make it worse [TS]

00:46:34   there's nothing you can do or you're [TS]

00:46:35   gonna sound dismissive of people you're [TS]

00:46:37   gonna you're gonna sound like you're [TS]

00:46:39   taking one side more seriously than the [TS]

00:46:40   other and even in deciding like okay [TS]

00:46:42   there's obviously two sides here you're [TS]

00:46:44   going to give a lot of weight to one [TS]

00:46:46   side just by acknowledging that it [TS]

00:46:47   exists that's right you know what I mean [TS]

00:46:49   it's like the whole network TV thing [TS]

00:46:51   I've always trying to find the two sides [TS]

00:46:52   to every issue it's just somebody [TS]

00:46:54   agreeing that there could be a second [TS]

00:46:56   side of this makes it extremely [TS]

00:46:57   controversial yeah and-and-and that the [TS]

00:46:59   woman had set up the setup fill the [TS]

00:47:01   whole structure of it like well we all [TS]

00:47:04   agree that we live in a patriarchal rape [TS]

00:47:06   culture even matter people on the [TS]

00:47:08   defensive [TS]

00:47:09   well but the thing is like it to at just [TS]

00:47:11   to illustrate what you're saying if you [TS]

00:47:12   say well there are two sides to that the [TS]

00:47:15   the only other side to that is that we [TS]

00:47:17   do live in a patriarchal rape culture [TS]

00:47:19   and you're denying it in [TS]

00:47:21   like that's the only like you think of [TS]

00:47:23   actually I don't accept the terms of [TS]

00:47:24   your argument i want to argue with you [TS]

00:47:26   but we're not going to start with that [TS]

00:47:28   has to look it [TS]

00:47:29   yeah and as the moderator it was you [TS]

00:47:32   know I she she had a 10-minute [TS]

00:47:34   presentation and by the time she was [TS]

00:47:35   done like I couldn't I thought my job [TS]

00:47:38   was not to debate or my job was just a [TS]

00:47:40   physical facilitate the conversation and [TS]

00:47:43   so it's like right okay I mean yeah it's [TS]

00:47:47   like we all agree on cheez-its except we [TS]

00:47:49   don't all agree on cheese but if you [TS]

00:47:52   don't you know if you if you don't agree [TS]

00:47:54   with cheese in within the context of [TS]

00:47:56   that argument you are basically a cop in [TS]

00:47:59   Ferguson um and so anyway it was it was [TS]

00:48:03   an example of when I walked out of that [TS]

00:48:06   panel i felt very emotionally raw and it [TS]

00:48:12   it had transported me back to the place [TS]

00:48:14   on the internet that I least wanted to [TS]

00:48:17   be and I felt for a couple of hours like [TS]

00:48:19   this totally new sensation which was [TS]

00:48:24   maybe i am not i can maybe I maybe the [TS]

00:48:32   culture is moving in a direction that I [TS]

00:48:34   can't go you know I felt for a for a [TS]

00:48:38   brief moment like it was 1969 and [TS]

00:48:41   somebody was standing somebody was [TS]

00:48:44   confronting me on the street and saying [TS]

00:48:46   don't trust anyone over 30 and I was [TS]

00:48:49   like wait a minute I'm 45 and I am [TS]

00:48:51   trustworthy and the and the response was [TS]

00:48:54   just like nope [TS]

00:48:56   the end up right now you're [TS]

00:48:57   counter-revolutionary yeah right having [TS]

00:48:59   and now we call you a [TS]

00:49:00   counterrevolutionary you're over 30 and [TS]

00:49:02   that's where we've drawn the line and so [TS]

00:49:04   and and and it you know as as history [TS]

00:49:07   has shown don't trust anyone over 30 was [TS]

00:49:11   a dumb idea [TS]

00:49:12   I mean it was it fulfilled the purpose [TS]

00:49:14   of it but as a rallying cry it can seem [TS]

00:49:18   very sensible especially if you're doing [TS]

00:49:20   a lot of illegal activities like at the [TS]

00:49:22   time doing the felony of smoking pot you [TS]

00:49:25   probably don't want to trust that many [TS]

00:49:26   people over 30 but as a view of life it [TS]

00:49:28   does not have longevity right if you're [TS]

00:49:30   lucky that it's a moment it's a moment [TS]

00:49:33   in history [TS]

00:49:34   in 1968 i'm sure it made a ton of sense [TS]

00:49:37   but yeah if you hold on to that as a as [TS]

00:49:40   a as a guide [TS]

00:49:42   you're gonna be really sad on your 30th [TS]

00:49:44   birthday and it's anything amazing how [TS]

00:49:47   few subtleties you you'll find things [TS]

00:49:49   that began as things people shouted [TS]

00:49:51   right and then i have this moment where [TS]

00:49:54   I felt like oh maybe this is the [TS]

00:49:56   contemporary version of that it is meant [TS]

00:49:58   to be a scorched-earth policy [TS]

00:50:01   you're either on one side of the this [TS]

00:50:05   whole like constellation of issues and [TS]

00:50:09   if you're if you're on the one side of [TS]

00:50:12   it then you're uh then you are on the [TS]

00:50:15   right side of history and if you're on [TS]

00:50:17   any other side any one of 50 other [TS]

00:50:20   potential viewpoints are all rejected [TS]

00:50:22   because there's only one but there's [TS]

00:50:25   only one way of linking all these ideas [TS]

00:50:28   together and well that's a shame though [TS]

00:50:31   I mean I I can only go by what you said [TS]

00:50:33   but it's a shame that it was presented [TS]

00:50:34   in that way because of all the things [TS]

00:50:36   you're talking about that seems like one [TS]

00:50:38   that could potentially people could find [TS]

00:50:40   I'll get having made a slight difference [TS]

00:50:41   agreements but there's the kind of thing [TS]

00:50:43   most people kind of agree on which is [TS]

00:50:45   something that's something we'd rather [TS]

00:50:46   not have why is that interesting today [TS]

00:50:48   in a way that it wasn't 30 years ago [TS]

00:50:50   and why is that challenging today and it [TS]

00:50:52   was the way it wasn't 30 years ago which [TS]

00:50:53   is of a much more nuanced question it's [TS]

00:50:56   a fascinating [TS]

00:50:57   it's a fascinating topic icons my excuse [TS]

00:50:59   for what it's worth at my kids school [TS]

00:51:00   she's in first grade now and that last [TS]

00:51:03   year and this year there's like these [TS]

00:51:04   two like real big tentpole things that [TS]

00:51:06   are school both of which i think pretty [TS]

00:51:07   great [TS]

00:51:08   what is this thing called restorative [TS]

00:51:09   practices which sounds really fruity but [TS]

00:51:11   it's basically just this idea of trying [TS]

00:51:13   to learn to settle agreements by talking [TS]

00:51:14   about what actually happened instead of [TS]

00:51:16   like yelling at people and its really [TS]

00:51:17   neat it's actually ever need any other [TS]

00:51:19   one is bullying and you can tell that [TS]

00:51:20   every third-grader that place has made a [TS]

00:51:22   poster that's on the walls about [TS]

00:51:23   bullying [TS]

00:51:24   it's just everywhere really advise that [TS]

00:51:26   this is a little I don't know it's not [TS]

00:51:27   all that useful just saying no to [TS]

00:51:28   bullying sure that really solves it but [TS]

00:51:30   the thing is they want the school once [TS]

00:51:32   you understand the bullying is not okay [TS]

00:51:34   here that's on every wall [TS]

00:51:36   I don't know with the net result of that [TS]

00:51:37   is but I'm telling you this is a as [TS]

00:51:39   current as today's headlines [TS]

00:51:41   I think that the I think that the net [TS]

00:51:42   result is that a lot of kids that are 10 [TS]

00:51:44   years old right now [TS]

00:51:45   if you said have you you know is they're [TS]

00:51:48   bullying in your school they would they [TS]

00:51:50   would go what know something about [TS]

00:51:52   looking on the sides [TS]

00:51:53   yeah there's no bullying at all [TS]

00:51:55   and-and-and in it in a way considering [TS]

00:51:59   how much bullying there was that when we [TS]

00:52:01   were kids that is [TS]

00:52:04   you know that's I think a tremendous [TS]

00:52:07   advance [TS]

00:52:08   except except what you know the dark [TS]

00:52:11   side of that is like like our art I mean [TS]

00:52:14   are they prosecuting kids like are [TS]

00:52:17   adults hyper-vigilant over them me in a [TS]

00:52:20   way that one piece of that one piece of [TS]

00:52:22   it is the basic educational process of [TS]

00:52:26   saying something over and over often [TS]

00:52:28   enough and having different people say [TS]

00:52:29   that the same way off enough over and [TS]

00:52:31   over that it does start to see more [TS]

00:52:32   conventional wisdom so God willing that [TS]

00:52:34   would be it [TS]

00:52:35   that's not gonna have a huge effect on [TS]

00:52:36   some of his father's beating them up at [TS]

00:52:37   home and want to come into school and [TS]

00:52:38   find somebody shrimpy to hit that's a [TS]

00:52:40   much more complicated problem that [TS]

00:52:42   doesn't come down to as easy as stop [TS]

00:52:44   bullying but but somebody somebody in [TS]

00:52:47   middle school high school college for [TS]

00:52:51   chance somebody out there started that [TS]

00:52:53   bullying some time for some reason it [TS]

00:52:55   didn't that the just didn't probably [TS]

00:52:57   come out of you know spontaneous [TS]

00:53:01   generation so I mean I think they're [TS]

00:53:03   trying to you know put down the seeds [TS]

00:53:05   and I don't think I don't see it like I [TS]

00:53:06   used to you know you don't see just [TS]

00:53:08   because the way kids are supervised [TS]

00:53:09   today it's different but I mean yeah I [TS]

00:53:11   mean who knows who knows the the dread [TS]

00:53:13   you have is a little kid know when I [TS]

00:53:14   walk around this corner i'm going to be [TS]

00:53:16   facing this thing and that happens every [TS]

00:53:18   day right probably have you know it's [TS]

00:53:20   happening [TS]

00:53:21   wherewhere kid is gonna throw rocks at [TS]

00:53:22   you or or or put your head in the toilet [TS]

00:53:25   or whatever Oscars next to their lockers [TS]

00:53:27   lockers never not gonna be next year [TS]

00:53:28   locker they're always going to have [TS]

00:53:29   three or four friends there and they're [TS]

00:53:31   always gonna have a little relaxation [TS]

00:53:33   time by treating you like less than a [TS]

00:53:35   person and that's writing that happens [TS]

00:53:36   every day and we thought we I mean much [TS]

00:53:39   I've had that Shirin and so have I and I [TS]

00:53:42   guess I guess the the part of the [TS]

00:53:44   conversation that's interesting to me is [TS]

00:53:46   like throughout the whole second half of [TS]

00:53:50   the 20th century we have had a lot of [TS]

00:53:52   social engineering projects [TS]

00:53:55   that we that we introduced into the [TS]

00:54:01   school's right we're trying to solve [TS]

00:54:03   problems as adults [TS]

00:54:06   we're trying to solve problems in our [TS]

00:54:07   adulthood by going not back to our own [TS]

00:54:11   childhoods but into the schools of of [TS]

00:54:14   kids now and saying like okay well there [TS]

00:54:17   are a lot of racial problems in America [TS]

00:54:20   and so we're going to put kids on buses [TS]

00:54:24   and send them all the way across town [TS]

00:54:26   and we're going to we're going to enter [TS]

00:54:28   we're going to forcibly integrate the [TS]

00:54:30   schools and in so doing we are going to [TS]

00:54:33   solve the racial problems in America and [TS]

00:54:36   it's an example of adults not knowing [TS]

00:54:38   how to solve that problem in the adult [TS]

00:54:41   world and not being willing to make [TS]

00:54:44   those changes in their own lives but [TS]

00:54:46   instead deciding that what we're going [TS]

00:54:49   to do is go into the schools and we're [TS]

00:54:51   going to we're going to force the kids [TS]

00:54:53   to resolve the issue by this kind of [TS]

00:54:57   social engineer I exactly was gonna say [TS]

00:54:59   it's a kind of benevolent benevolent [TS]

00:55:01   like you're trying to do so but you're [TS]

00:55:03   doing it from a good place [TS]

00:55:04   yeah and it's a beautiful it's a [TS]

00:55:06   beautiful idea the kids you know the [TS]

00:55:08   thing that's so hard for me to accept [TS]

00:55:10   somebody likes to think of himself as [TS]

00:55:12   trying to do the right thing and being [TS]

00:55:13   principled is I know that if I say [TS]

00:55:16   something to someone not just my kid [TS]

00:55:18   that anybody if I say that something is [TS]

00:55:20   important or I say that I believe [TS]

00:55:22   something I could see that hundreds even [TS]

00:55:25   seriously hundreds of times i could say [TS]

00:55:27   brush your teeth before bed but you know [TS]

00:55:29   what if I don't brush my teeth every [TS]

00:55:31   night before bed and have them see that [TS]

00:55:33   that's cognitive dissonance and yeah it [TS]

00:55:35   hurts my credibility and more [TS]

00:55:36   importantly show you that's not how the [TS]

00:55:38   world works [TS]

00:55:39   so like when I was in in Tallahassee [TS]

00:55:41   know this is nothing its people Florida [TS]

00:55:44   please relax but I don't think I can't [TS]

00:55:45   think of a single person i interacted [TS]

00:55:47   with who would have thought themselves [TS]

00:55:48   on the face of it as a racist and yet i [TS]

00:55:51   can tell you including me when I moved [TS]

00:55:53   to san francisco i think i told you this [TS]

00:55:55   but it was maybe two months before [TS]

00:55:57   something that was a weird niggling [TS]

00:56:00   thing on the honors kind of the corner [TS]

00:56:02   of my consciousness became very clear [TS]

00:56:04   which is I went Wow [TS]

00:56:06   there are so many not white people in [TS]

00:56:09   positions of power here everyday a kid [TS]

00:56:11   that grows up in our town sees asian [TS]

00:56:13   people who are in power they see black [TS]

00:56:15   people who are in power you have a black [TS]

00:56:16   boss and I'm just here to tell you that [TS]

00:56:18   that was not something you saw every day [TS]

00:56:21   in places where i lived in ohio and [TS]

00:56:23   florida you see it but it wouldn't it [TS]

00:56:25   would seem weird enough that you didn't [TS]

00:56:27   make you change your vision of things [TS]

00:56:28   but i did not see the point of the point [TS]

00:56:30   I'm going on about is that like that [TS]

00:56:32   stuff will not seem real until you [TS]

00:56:34   actually see it when people just keep [TS]

00:56:36   telling you that that's the thing that [TS]

00:56:37   should happen over and over like in the [TS]

00:56:40   petri dish of an elementary school [TS]

00:56:41   it's really different from spinning [TS]

00:56:43   noticing what people are pulling each [TS]

00:56:44   other as much as they used to [TS]

00:56:46   I'm finding a different way to work this [TS]

00:56:47   out i have a black boss and she's [TS]

00:56:49   actually pretty great right [TS]

00:56:51   whatever what you see everyday is what [TS]

00:56:53   I'm saying at the those projects i mean [TS]

00:56:58   like integration was a culture wide [TS]

00:57:01   project we were trying we were trying [TS]

00:57:03   two hundred different things you know [TS]

00:57:06   affirmative action and and a bra and [TS]

00:57:09   well and busing and affirmative action i [TS]

00:57:13   think was a very positive like had very [TS]

00:57:15   positive results i'm not sure about [TS]

00:57:17   busting and and primarily it's because [TS]

00:57:20   we added a tremendous layer of [TS]

00:57:24   inconvenience to something that was [TS]

00:57:26   already inconvenient which is getting [TS]

00:57:28   your kid up and going to school busing [TS]

00:57:29   was bussing nothing was an unsuccessful [TS]

00:57:31   hack because it is successful hack right [TS]

00:57:35   within encoding is something that takes [TS]

00:57:38   an annoying problem and solves it [TS]

00:57:40   potentially in elegant way that was a [TS]

00:57:42   very in elegant solution that basically [TS]

00:57:44   made it clearer than ever will be that [TS]

00:57:46   you're going to be fucking super [TS]

00:57:47   inconvenience by this but may that there [TS]

00:57:49   is a basic inequality that we can't fix [TS]

00:57:51   and so we have to reset where the pieces [TS]

00:57:53   on the board and have you agree that [TS]

00:57:55   that's making it better [TS]

00:57:56   even they are fixing your basic problem [TS]

00:57:58   and and so that the I mean it in the in [TS]

00:58:02   the long term we have so much less [TS]

00:58:05   bullying now in the culture than we did [TS]

00:58:08   even when we lose internet stuff done [TS]

00:58:13   you sure about that i mean the thing [TS]

00:58:16   about the admin internet bullying is [TS]

00:58:20   that the internet is just a giant [TS]

00:58:22   bullying cesspool I mean I'm a 45 year [TS]

00:58:25   old man i would go on the internet every [TS]

00:58:27   day and feel in one way or another [TS]

00:58:28   bullied and a lot of the bullying is [TS]

00:58:31   from people who would describe [TS]

00:58:33   themselves as primarily as victims you [TS]

00:58:36   know like it's the it's the oldest trick [TS]

00:58:38   in the book to get on the internet and [TS]

00:58:40   say I am a victim of this oppressive [TS]

00:58:42   culture and so I am so mad that i'm [TS]

00:58:45   going to be that i'm going to be hateful [TS]

00:58:47   to everybody i encounter today at and [TS]

00:58:50   that is and that is and that's like I [TS]

00:58:53   the argument against that is that are [TS]

00:58:56   you miss Andres now I mean are you like [TS]

00:58:59   that the the idea that the idea that [TS]

00:59:02   this woman presented which is that he [TS]

00:59:07   had a perceived imbalance of power is [TS]

00:59:11   equal to an actual imbalance of power [TS]

00:59:13   and so a person can be a person who [TS]

00:59:18   perceived themselves to be in a position [TS]

00:59:20   of less power [TS]

00:59:22   [Music] [TS]

00:59:23   it might as well be that that person is [TS]

00:59:25   in a position of less power and I was [TS]

00:59:28   like listening to a presentation I was [TS]

00:59:30   like no that is in that is exactly wrong [TS]

00:59:32   like just to perceive yourself to have [TS]

00:59:35   less power is not anything just because [TS]

00:59:38   you feel it doesn't mean it's real [TS]

00:59:40   in the words of Radiohead and and I [TS]

00:59:44   think the internet is full of people who [TS]

00:59:46   are like I perceive myself to be a [TS]

00:59:48   victim of everything and so you know [TS]

00:59:50   every time I go on the internet I'm on [TS]

00:59:53   I'm on a daily crusade to lecture [TS]

00:59:55   everybody hey I have an encounter with [TS]

00:59:58   to go from place to place [TS]

00:59:58   to go from place to place [TS]

01:00:00   place to place just pedantically [TS]

01:00:02   schooling fools right and left and it's [TS]

01:00:04   just like oh my god you're just [TS]

01:00:06   spreading you are spreading evil but is [TS]

01:00:09   like people are going to remember that [TS]

01:00:11   lesson you were meant to be teaching [TS]

01:00:12   they're going to remember that you're [TS]

01:00:13   kind of an unpleasant person [TS]

01:00:15   yeah and so the internet is a giant is [TS]

01:00:18   just a giant Hudson that's an ugly place [TS]

01:00:20   now it's not a place I want to be but I [TS]

01:00:22   think ultimately is there less bullying [TS]

01:00:25   in the world in our world [TS]

01:00:28   yes is there less bullying is there less [TS]

01:00:31   bullying in seattle than there is in [TS]

01:00:33   oklahoma city probably is there less [TS]

01:00:36   bullying in oklahoma city than there is [TS]

01:00:38   in lagos yes in almost certainly like [TS]

01:00:42   his bullying still rife in in the the [TS]

01:00:48   outskirts neighborhoods in Shanghai yeah [TS]

01:00:51   i bet it is because I i guess this is [TS]

01:00:55   one of the this is one of the big [TS]

01:00:56   questions of of like secularism is that [TS]

01:01:03   if we establish that we are members of [TS]

01:01:07   the animal kingdom which the secular [TS]

01:01:11   half of the of the world you know has [TS]

01:01:15   been a lot of time trying to say like we [TS]

01:01:17   are part of the system we are animals we [TS]

01:01:20   are not God beings we are not separate [TS]

01:01:24   from our environment we are not we are [TS]

01:01:26   we are not significantly different from [TS]

01:01:32   animals that we can afford to rule over [TS]

01:01:36   the world without consequence but the [TS]

01:01:40   flip side of that is nowhere in the [TS]

01:01:43   animal kingdom is anything fair and we [TS]

01:01:48   are looking at ourselves as [TS]

01:01:50   simultaneously members of this of this [TS]

01:01:57   natural system and also imposing upon [TS]

01:02:00   ourselves [TS]

01:02:02   incredibly unnatural thought [TS]

01:02:04   technologies and that is if that's [TS]

01:02:08   fascinating and wonderful because a lot [TS]

01:02:12   of those thought technologies that take [TS]

01:02:14   us out of the animal kingdom have [TS]

01:02:16   improved our lot in life and are [TS]

01:02:20   improving the world but now but i would [TS]

01:02:23   suggest never presume that any of those [TS]

01:02:26   things are real or that any of those [TS]

01:02:29   things reflect reality they are they are [TS]

01:02:32   experiments they are attempts and so [TS]

01:02:37   like when you talk about it like and [TS]

01:02:39   wanting to try on and I idea like a [TS]

01:02:41   jacket yeah so we're we're trying to [TS]

01:02:43   eliminate bullying even though bullying [TS]

01:02:46   is in the animal kingdom in the natural [TS]

01:02:49   world [TS]

01:02:50   bullying is one of the foundational [TS]

01:02:52   methods like every single animal family [TS]

01:02:59   uses precisely bullying as a way of [TS]

01:03:05   organizing itself bigger animals squash [TS]

01:03:09   little animals the two you know the the [TS]

01:03:12   litter of kittens establishes their [TS]

01:03:14   their their dominance chain like pigs do [TS]

01:03:19   it [TS]

01:03:20   chickens do it it's a pecking order [TS]

01:03:23   I mean everything we all of our language [TS]

01:03:25   for that stuff comes from watching [TS]

01:03:29   animals do it and every animal doesn't [TS]

01:03:32   so if our end game is to eliminate [TS]

01:03:34   bullying what is it mean it isn't just a [TS]

01:03:40   small little inconvenience that we are [TS]

01:03:45   that we should be ashamed of and like [TS]

01:03:47   that that should that we should continue [TS]

01:03:51   to be outraged and appalled by we should [TS]

01:03:54   be able to look at it and say this is [TS]

01:03:55   one of the fundamental principles of [TS]

01:03:57   animal life and we are trying to [TS]

01:04:00   dispense with it we are trying to change [TS]

01:04:04   and evolve so that bullying is not the [TS]

01:04:08   way that we order our systems [TS]

01:04:10   but it is absolutely in everything and [TS]

01:04:16   so to change it is not just a question [TS]

01:04:20   of like go into the schools and put [TS]

01:04:21   posters on the walls and indoctrinated [TS]

01:04:24   the kids so that they don't think of [TS]

01:04:25   bullying anymore it's not a small thing [TS]

01:04:27   the book kids are seeing bullying in [TS]

01:04:30   every walk of life and in every in every [TS]

01:04:34   aspect of human culture and so if if [TS]

01:04:37   this is our project [TS]

01:04:38   I just wish that we could talk about it [TS]

01:04:40   in this bigger sense of like okay if [TS]

01:04:44   we're gonna if we're going to evolve [TS]

01:04:46   into the Grays like like I'm all for it [TS]

01:04:51   let's go but if you're but what are you [TS]

01:04:54   going to replace bullying with because [TS]

01:04:57   if you go into the offices of Vogue [TS]

01:04:59   magazine i guarantee you there's [TS]

01:05:01   bullying at every desk if you go into [TS]

01:05:03   the west wing of the White House [TS]

01:05:05   bullying is everywhere and it's encoded [TS]

01:05:09   and the more white collar you make it [TS]

01:05:11   the more the the subtler it gets but [TS]

01:05:14   subtle bullying is fucking bullying so [TS]

01:05:18   so it just it feels a little bit like [TS]

01:05:21   the the posters on the walls of the [TS]

01:05:23   schools and the and the attention that [TS]

01:05:26   were paying two kids to eradicate what [TS]

01:05:28   we think is this you know this bullying [TS]

01:05:31   is another to me and in a way up [TS]

01:05:35   potential busing idea which is just like [TS]

01:05:38   we're going to go into the schools and [TS]

01:05:40   we we can't fix this problem in our own [TS]

01:05:42   culture [TS]

01:05:43   we're not even capable of seeing it for [TS]

01:05:45   what it is but we don't but we all have [TS]

01:05:48   painful memories of being bullied as a [TS]

01:05:49   kid and so we're going to go down into [TS]

01:05:51   the schools and create a kind of [TS]

01:05:54   fahrenheit 451 scenario where at where [TS]

01:06:00   no one is able to say what things are no [TS]

01:06:03   one is able to acknowledge reality and [TS]

01:06:07   kids are going to be 19 years old and [TS]

01:06:09   they're going to come out of these [TS]

01:06:10   schools and be like bullying is bad i [TS]

01:06:12   have never bullied anyone nor have I [TS]

01:06:13   ever been bullied [TS]

01:06:15   but it's all you know it's all just a I [TS]

01:06:20   like a soup of lives mi i think i could [TS]

01:06:25   get what you're saying but I just have [TS]

01:06:27   one angle on it though which is that i'm [TS]

01:06:30   reminded of the times I've gone and talk [TS]

01:06:32   to companies and I always have an easy [TS]

01:06:34   laugh when I talk about the signs the [TS]

01:06:35   people leave by the coffee machine you [TS]

01:06:38   know where the signs I have your mom [TS]

01:06:40   doesn't work here and how there's I [TS]

01:06:42   think they have to affect those have are [TS]

01:06:44   pretty consistent i am I don't wanna [TS]

01:06:46   argue whether bullying is snatching [TS]

01:06:48   animal thing maybe it is i think we [TS]

01:06:49   might be using that word a little [TS]

01:06:51   differently but what I will say is its [TS]

01:06:53   when you put up a sign in the in the [TS]

01:06:56   kitchen arm to no one in particular a [TS]

01:06:59   shame song is Yeah right right where you [TS]

01:07:02   like you're an asshole because you're [TS]

01:07:03   not doing this thing that I'm telling [TS]

01:07:04   you we all agreed we should do which may [TS]

01:07:08   or may not be true you know the fact is [TS]

01:07:10   if you worry about the cleanliness of [TS]

01:07:11   the kitchen it means a lot to you to [TS]

01:07:12   keep it clean you know what fair enough [TS]

01:07:14   you're probably aa above the 50 [TS]

01:07:16   percentile of people who clean the [TS]

01:07:17   kitchen i'll even give you that one [TS]

01:07:19   the problem is when you put that sign up [TS]

01:07:20   the the effects that you have that I [TS]

01:07:22   think i mighta shown and not talk about [TS]

01:07:24   some other shows but I never showed you [TS]

01:07:25   a lot of dogs poop in a park near our [TS]

01:07:28   house and at one point somebody had gone [TS]

01:07:29   up and put signs around the entire [TS]

01:07:31   perimeter of the reservoir with noting [TS]

01:07:34   how many piles of poop they had counted [TS]

01:07:36   in the last month the people had left [TS]

01:07:37   their it's sort of like this workplace [TS]

01:07:39   has this noise without a poop [TS]

01:07:41   yeah but think about that for a second [TS]

01:07:43   and I just as I is my mind at my age [TS]

01:07:45   goes through what the actual effect of [TS]

01:07:48   that will be icy several things [TS]

01:07:49   happening and i think this is related to [TS]

01:07:50   what you're talking about [TS]

01:07:51   there's on the one hand there's going to [TS]

01:07:53   be a whole bunch of people like a ton of [TS]

01:07:55   people who don't have dogs who could [TS]

01:07:57   like what a stupid sign what's wrong [TS]

01:07:59   with these people [TS]

01:08:00   I don't like poop either but what a dumb [TS]

01:08:01   sign this is gonna be a lot of people [TS]

01:08:03   with dogs who pick up their dogs poop [TS]

01:08:06   we're going hey why are you yelling at [TS]

01:08:08   me i'm already doing that if anything [TS]

01:08:10   that's gonna make them less you know [TS]

01:08:11   they're not you that this is how [TS]

01:08:13   enforcement works you know a [TS]

01:08:14   reinforcement that's gonna make them [TS]

01:08:16   probably more likely to not want to do [TS]

01:08:17   because they don't feel applauded for [TS]

01:08:19   doing what's been done they feel yelled [TS]

01:08:21   at by this by this warrior who's gonna [TS]

01:08:23   tell them that that's what they should [TS]

01:08:24   be doing and you know what the most [TS]

01:08:25   importantly arguably i will bet you x 2 [TS]

01:08:28   don't [TS]

01:08:28   that's that 11 out of 13 people who do [TS]

01:08:32   let their dog shit anywhere are not [TS]

01:08:35   going to change a single thing as a [TS]

01:08:37   result of seeing that side it will have [TS]

01:08:38   that arrow will have fallen very far [TS]

01:08:40   away from its target that the sign that [TS]

01:08:42   you put in the kitchen that ends up [TS]

01:08:44   yelling at ninety percent of the office [TS]

01:08:45   is not going to change the one or two [TS]

01:08:47   people who are doing that thing so that [TS]

01:08:51   i think is part of the problems when you [TS]

01:08:53   start out and I you know again I don't [TS]

01:08:54   care [TS]

01:08:55   everything works in different ways with [TS]

01:08:56   different people but I think it's [TS]

01:08:58   important to remember that when you set [TS]

01:08:59   something up with anybody set something [TS]

01:09:01   up as an adversarial relationship i [TS]

01:09:03   understand why we do that it's very [TS]

01:09:05   natural especially if you feel like [TS]

01:09:07   you've been aggrieved by something or [TS]

01:09:08   you know something's happening you very [TS]

01:09:10   understanding to to come out of the box [TS]

01:09:12   mad about that the thing I think it's [TS]

01:09:14   important to remember to take bullying [TS]

01:09:16   for example there's going to be three [TS]

01:09:18   maybe three large amounts 33 mainly [TS]

01:09:21   three kinds of kids there's a kind of [TS]

01:09:22   kids that are not bullying anybody on [TS]

01:09:24   any conceivable level there are the kind [TS]

01:09:26   of kids who are unrepentant fucking [TS]

01:09:28   bullies that hope for home assign is [TS]

01:09:30   going to change absolutely nothing right [TS]

01:09:32   but the one that those signs might reach [TS]

01:09:34   the people that i'm most interested in [TS]

01:09:35   this very very quiet little percentage [TS]

01:09:38   of people who didn't know that there is [TS]

01:09:40   something they might think about [TS]

01:09:40   differently and maybe despite being [TS]

01:09:42   fucking yelled at every turn about how [TS]

01:09:44   to act they discovered there's a way I [TS]

01:09:46   could change my behavior a little bit [TS]

01:09:48   they would make the world a little bit [TS]

01:09:49   better and it doesn't make me less [TS]

01:09:50   strong to do that that's the people i [TS]

01:09:52   admire and that's why i always think if [TS]

01:09:54   you go into something yelling you're [TS]

01:09:56   going to have a smaller and smaller [TS]

01:09:57   amount of that super interesting third [TS]

01:09:59   group who sometimes can be very [TS]

01:10:01   influential people but if you come out [TS]

01:10:03   of box like yelling at everybody and [TS]

01:10:04   having a system having a program in mind [TS]

01:10:07   and basically explain to everybody what [TS]

01:10:09   the problem is before they had an [TS]

01:10:10   opportunity to understand it you always [TS]

01:10:12   lose the chance of the subtle people who [TS]

01:10:14   might have changed what they do because [TS]

01:10:16   now they feel like they're being [TS]

01:10:18   victimized by being yelled at or you [TS]

01:10:20   know what i mean i think that when you [TS]

01:10:22   think about although it doesn't lead to [TS]

01:10:24   anything getting that much better it [TS]

01:10:25   just leads to us becoming more callous [TS]

01:10:27   about thinking who else is wrong about [TS]

01:10:29   this [TS]

01:10:29   yeah this is what I'm saying how think [TS]

01:10:31   about all the much more interesting ways [TS]

01:10:33   of reaching that subtle group of people [TS]

01:10:35   then putting up [TS]

01:10:37   science in the kitchen yeah basically [TS]

01:10:39   Stalinist signs all around instructing [TS]

01:10:43   everyone on how to live and I and I [TS]

01:10:45   guess I guess what it boils down to to [TS]

01:10:47   me is that the endgame for for everybody [TS]

01:10:52   for any school of thought if you ask [TS]

01:10:54   somebody to to describe their plan like [TS]

01:10:58   why do they have a certain school of [TS]

01:11:00   thought they will give you a utopian [TS]

01:11:03   answer right the endgame is someday in [TS]

01:11:06   the future when everyone realizes the [TS]

01:11:10   truth of this premise and if everybody [TS]

01:11:14   realizes the truth of this premise then [TS]

01:11:16   we will be living in a world of peace [TS]

01:11:18   and harmony and done it often comes down [TS]

01:11:21   to one phrase on both either any of 50 [TS]

01:11:23   different sides you can almost always in [TS]

01:11:25   America today boil it down to one [TS]

01:11:27   statement which is I want people to be [TS]

01:11:29   free and it's amazing how often that [TS]

01:11:32   line could be subsumed in the rhetoric [TS]

01:11:34   of pretty much anybody and it kind of [TS]

01:11:36   makes sense but there's nobody there's [TS]

01:11:38   no George Lincoln Rockwell there's not [TS]

01:11:40   that many people out there that actually [TS]

01:11:41   want America to be fascist even people [TS]

01:11:44   you know the people who are saying i [TS]

01:11:45   don't want to spend money for more than [TS]

01:11:47   highways and defense or whatever like if [TS]

01:11:50   you're also a hardcore libertarian boys [TS]

01:11:53   principal zero of that is I want people [TS]

01:11:55   to be free [TS]

01:11:56   I want me to be free right and the panel [TS]

01:11:59   who want to say well let's have [TS]

01:12:00   scholarships for people they want people [TS]

01:12:02   to be free because they're saying in the [TS]

01:12:04   past this is not worked out these people [TS]

01:12:05   have not even had a chance to come to [TS]

01:12:06   the table that's gonna help them be free [TS]

01:12:08   but there's nobody there almost nobody [TS]

01:12:10   out there who thinks that what they're [TS]

01:12:11   doing is making people less free and the [TS]

01:12:14   and the and so the so the problem is [TS]

01:12:16   that every one of those scenarios [TS]

01:12:17   involves wanting everybody to be free [TS]

01:12:21   and all we have to do to accomplish that [TS]

01:12:23   is just that everyone not be free in [TS]

01:12:27   this one small way which is that we all [TS]

01:12:28   agree on cheese [TS]

01:12:31   and and if everybody would just get in [TS]

01:12:35   line about this one thing that we could [TS]

01:12:37   all be free and ultimately that is why [TS]

01:12:40   every single ideology is true because if [TS]

01:12:45   we all agreed on anything then yes we [TS]

01:12:50   would be in we would be able to create a [TS]

01:12:54   socialist workers paradise or a [TS]

01:12:57   libertarian free-market paradise or a [TS]

01:13:00   you know uh a white homeland and I De [TS]

01:13:03   Niro it gets so narrow it's like a no-no [TS]

01:13:06   engineer would take somebody seriously [TS]

01:13:08   if they said we want to this jet will [TS]

01:13:11   fly super far as long as it doesn't have [TS]

01:13:13   to carry a bunch of heavy fuel [TS]

01:13:14   yeah right exactly know how we need to [TS]

01:13:16   re-engineer these other points of this [TS]

01:13:19   is not going to change one factor about [TS]

01:13:20   anything without changing everything [TS]

01:13:22   else about the entire project so with [TS]

01:13:24   bullying the premise seems to be we need [TS]

01:13:27   to eradicate bullying when really the [TS]

01:13:30   question is how do you make a good world [TS]

01:13:33   where there's always going to be two [TS]

01:13:37   percent bullies like yes you could make [TS]

01:13:41   a perfect world if you eliminated [TS]

01:13:43   bullies but there are always going to be [TS]

01:13:45   two percent bullies and so how do you [TS]

01:13:49   minimize the creation of bullies and the [TS]

01:13:50   impact of their behavior [TS]

01:13:52   yeah and and at what happens with [TS]

01:13:53   bullying is that it is that there's the [TS]

01:13:56   bully is the bad guy right but there are [TS]

01:13:58   the five friends that maybe would be [TS]

01:14:01   maybe would be off making projects with [TS]

01:14:04   construction paper but somehow if when [TS]

01:14:07   bullying is ok those five friends jump [TS]

01:14:10   on the bandwagon every and die exactly [TS]

01:14:12   it [TS]

01:14:14   it's what you're talking about you [TS]

01:14:15   wanted you want to get those three [TS]

01:14:16   friends that maybe follow the guy if [TS]

01:14:21   he's bullying but also would follow [TS]

01:14:22   somebody if they were dancing and you [TS]

01:14:24   want to say like don't follow the below [TS]

01:14:26   fully follow the dancer like that's the [TS]

01:14:29   that's the culture that we're trying to [TS]

01:14:32   create what is that culture created by [TS]

01:14:35   putting posters up in the in the coffee [TS]

01:14:37   room [TS]

01:14:38   no it's not apple seeds i don't think [TS]

01:14:40   people almost ever see themselves in [TS]

01:14:43   those things make it basically selfish [TS]

01:14:45   the American thing part of our the [TS]

01:14:46   American experiment that I don't think [TS]

01:14:48   we see ourselves in signs [TS]

01:14:51   no we see otherwise the other people who [TS]

01:14:54   are rightly or wrongly being accused of [TS]

01:14:56   making things worse for us [TS]

01:14:57   yeah if the sign said if the sign said [TS]

01:15:00   it has been four days since someone [TS]

01:15:02   named Merlin smoked a cigar in this park [TS]

01:15:04   you would look at that sign and you'd be [TS]

01:15:06   like huh that's interesting i wonder how [TS]

01:15:08   many Merlin's there are smoking cigars [TS]

01:15:09   in this part of hazardous get your dicks [TS]

01:15:11   those dicks as you let up a cigar in the [TS]

01:15:13   park [TS]

01:15:14   no we never see ourselves in science [TS]

01:15:15   because that's not that because the [TS]

01:15:17   challenge of creating a world of human [TS]

01:15:21   beings is to not think about a utopia [TS]

01:15:26   the challenge is to is to treat every [TS]

01:15:29   situation individually and to do the [TS]

01:15:32   difficult work of you know if if we if [TS]

01:15:35   everybody practice no child left behind [TS]

01:15:38   the schools would be producing geniuses [TS]

01:15:41   but the problem is it's a utopian idea [TS]

01:15:43   it doesn't work because you can't apply [TS]

01:15:45   it you can't have one textbook that [TS]

01:15:47   works in every school in the country you [TS]

01:15:49   can't have one premise about bullying [TS]

01:15:52   every single kid is different and that [TS]

01:15:55   is impossible it's impossibly hard to [TS]

01:15:58   create a uniform culture and this I this [TS]

01:16:04   attempt to impose like a super structure [TS]

01:16:07   and say everybody is the same we are all [TS]

01:16:11   the end this is true of us all in in the [TS]

01:16:15   pursuit of a utopia a utopian end where [TS]

01:16:19   if we can we can eradicate this then we [TS]

01:16:22   will all be living in the light and it's [TS]

01:16:24   just it's it's the it's the way in which [TS]

01:16:27   every ideology is exactly the same as [TS]

01:16:29   every other one and they all are you [TS]

01:16:33   know they all crash on the rocks as soon [TS]

01:16:37   as they encounter one person who doesn't [TS]

01:16:39   want to go to doesn't want to go along [TS]

01:16:41   and I am that person [TS]

01:16:45   I do not want to go and I and so I'm [TS]

01:16:50   getting off the internet [TS]

01:16:51   yeah or or I'm you know or I'm gonna [TS]

01:16:55   definitely curate the topics of any [TS]

01:16:57   public discussion i have a little bit [TS]

01:17:00   better so that I am exist your farewell [TS]

01:17:04   to the Troops so that I am dealing [TS]

01:17:06   exclusively with caps and twerking and [TS]

01:17:11   and a sympathetic judge and a [TS]

01:17:14   sympathetic fellow and not at all with [TS]

01:17:17   that you know with whatever the the the [TS]

01:17:20   hot-button issues are right now where [TS]

01:17:22   people are trying to you know work bored [TS]

01:17:24   where social engineering where that [TS]

01:17:26   where the diamond tip of social [TS]

01:17:28   engineering is is etching its groove in [TS]

01:17:32   our in our cultural moment you know I [TS]

01:17:34   don't believe that it works unless it's [TS]

01:17:42   super train in which case it absolutely [TS]

01:17:44   works but has to work function [TS]

01:17:46   it's not like an optional the [TS]

01:17:48   traditional third anniversary gift is [TS]

01:17:50   leather series so I was thinking of [TS]

01:17:53   getting some chaps I'm a gun belt you [TS]

01:17:57   might look good with a gun belt several [TS]

01:17:58   times i have been in a situation where [TS]

01:18:00   there have been chaps available to me [TS]

01:18:03   really yeah classic and at whole havin [TS]

01:18:07   ass exposing chaps they're one of the [TS]

01:18:10   great moments for me and a thrift store [TS]

01:18:12   was in this in the little cowboy town of [TS]

01:18:16   Monroe Washington I was dating a girl at [TS]

01:18:19   the time who was very like a she was a [TS]

01:18:22   well she was a Firedancer that was her [TS]

01:18:25   job a a naked Firedancer to be specific [TS]

01:18:30   Wow and she had a lot of tattoos and she [TS]

01:18:33   was very exotic and beautiful girl and I [TS]

01:18:37   was dating her at the time and I was in [TS]

01:18:38   monroe and i found in a thrift store [TS]

01:18:42   they're a pair of white fringed chaps in [TS]

01:18:48   a petite size so brother and I bought [TS]

01:18:53   them for her [TS]

01:18:54   and they were spectacular oh my any fit [TS]

01:18:58   if they fit her perfect she wanted to [TS]

01:19:00   wear them and she did want to wear them [TS]

01:19:02   oh my god and we want to honor my friend [TS]

01:19:05   I really did and I you know I won't say [TS]

01:19:07   anymore about it except that it was a it [TS]

01:19:10   was a great man how many of those are [TS]

01:19:11   there even in the world and that i [TS]

01:19:13   should find them and that they should [TS]

01:19:14   fit and that she would like them and I [TS]

01:19:17   so kinky Cinderella yeah it really was [TS]

01:19:19   it was the glass slipper of our [TS]

01:19:21   relationship and so after that I was [TS]

01:19:26   like well maybe I should have some [TS]

01:19:28   chance haha and I I think you hit a new [TS]

01:19:33   journey vika I and I am and I've had [TS]

01:19:37   several chaps come my way and the [TS]

01:19:41   problem is that what that um that when i [TS]

01:19:46   wear chaps it is just like I am [TS]

01:19:50   reanimating the cow [TS]

01:19:58   [Music] [TS]