Roderick on the Line

Ep. 117: "Put on the Carrot Hat"


00:00:00   this episode of rock on the line is [TS]

00:00:01   sponsored by Squarespace the all-in-one [TS]

00:00:04   platform that makes it fast and easy to [TS]

00:00:06   create your own professional website [TS]

00:00:08   portfolio or online store for your free [TS]

00:00:11   trial plus ten percent off anything you [TS]

00:00:13   by visit squarespace.com and use the [TS]

00:00:16   offer code supertrain at checkout a [TS]

00:00:18   better web starts with your website [TS]

00:00:20   below I John hi Merlin is going pretty [TS]

00:00:32   good pretty good it's really early all [TS]

00:00:36   how did your night end last night trying [TS]

00:00:39   to think so long ago I think that it [TS]

00:00:46   just was a bit just kind of petered out [TS]

00:00:48   instead of ending with a bang but a the [TS]

00:00:53   because of global climate change the [TS]

00:00:59   city of seattle all has been enjoying [TS]

00:01:02   spectacular weather i'm sorry it's been [TS]

00:01:07   a real trial and normally June is the [TS]

00:01:10   month where it rains a lot and every the [TS]

00:01:15   juniors the month where everybody's like [TS]

00:01:17   every year [TS]

00:01:20   it surprises us that this has been true [TS]

00:01:23   for the last 20 years of me living here [TS]

00:01:25   and I think throughout time because you [TS]

00:01:27   have a nice you know couple of nice days [TS]

00:01:29   in April and May and you're like a [TS]

00:01:30   summer's here and then in June just [TS]

00:01:32   rains and everybody goes oh what and we [TS]

00:01:36   forget every year we forget that it [TS]

00:01:37   happens and then when it happens it's [TS]

00:01:41   like this this bait-and-switch we feel [TS]

00:01:43   like we're being robbed and then july [TS]

00:01:45   the summer comes right that's the [TS]

00:01:47   typical seattle / summer well the last [TS]

00:01:50   couple of years it's just been sunny all [TS]

00:01:52   June like just send me the whole time [TS]

00:01:55   sunny and 75 degrees which is which is [TS]

00:02:00   you know a real ripoff [TS]

00:02:04   and one of the things that I guess we [TS]

00:02:07   never realized was that when it rained [TS]

00:02:09   it [TS]

00:02:10   it kept all all the pollen and the [TS]

00:02:13   allergenic components and kept them down [TS]

00:02:18   the ground kept them down a little bit [TS]

00:02:20   kept him down in the ground where they [TS]

00:02:21   belong and now there's nothing keeping [TS]

00:02:23   them down the sky is just filled with [TS]

00:02:26   bits and they're floating around and [TS]

00:02:32   they're getting my nose and they're [TS]

00:02:33   getting my eyes I wake up in the morning [TS]

00:02:35   it's like that's like there's gum in my [TS]

00:02:38   eyes chewing gum and my nose is all [TS]

00:02:41   scratchy and so just like such a global [TS]

00:02:49   warming is really a really bad if you [TS]

00:02:52   say think it might be real I mean items [TS]

00:02:55   are climate change I didn't mean to say [TS]

00:02:56   global warming but like you know for [TS]

00:02:59   instance like I'm sure there are some [TS]

00:03:00   people whose houses are being washed [TS]

00:03:02   away into the ocean because they live on [TS]

00:03:05   a toll and there are you know the Bears [TS]

00:03:08   are dying in the Arctic but you know i [TS]

00:03:10   have really scratchy eyes [TS]

00:03:12   yeah and I feel like if you had a parade [TS]

00:03:15   you probably could go i couldn't I'd [TS]

00:03:17   have to you know i have to be in a in a [TS]

00:03:19   motorized chair and you make the judge [TS]

00:03:21   about the bubble [TS]

00:03:22   yeah because it's like a mystery writer [TS]

00:03:26   mr. tarak sends his regrets as I walk [TS]

00:03:28   around in a t-shirt and shorts and and [TS]

00:03:31   enjoy the you know life in paradise here [TS]

00:03:33   scripts itchy so identified sneezy [TS]

00:03:38   I mean I suppose I could I could do some [TS]

00:03:40   research and take some kind of medicine [TS]

00:03:42   of some kind [TS]

00:03:43   I think I tickets I tucanos medicine [TS]

00:03:46   everyday and it's one of those things [TS]

00:03:47   where I i think it helps I you know it's [TS]

00:03:51   one of those really annoying kinds of [TS]

00:03:53   things like an old person pill where you [TS]

00:03:55   only notice that is doing anything when [TS]

00:03:57   he stopped taking it [TS]

00:03:58   mhm now how's that figure could you go [TS]

00:04:00   to the could you go to costco could you [TS]

00:04:02   get as i do a large bottle of generic [TS]

00:04:06   claritin is that that is that in your [TS]

00:04:08   technologies so this is another one of [TS]

00:04:11   these problems are you ready for this [TS]

00:04:13   so you know I rented an office and that [TS]

00:04:17   is a you know that's a payment i have a [TS]

00:04:20   monthly payment now for that and then [TS]

00:04:22   that comes with there's little utility [TS]

00:04:24   payment or something and that [TS]

00:04:25   accompanies it looks like oh i see the [TS]

00:04:28   rent isn't really the rent it's the rent [TS]

00:04:30   plus this other amount and then i gotta [TS]

00:04:33   get internet there and there's one [TS]

00:04:34   company that provides the internet you [TS]

00:04:36   can't just can't shop around familiar [TS]

00:04:39   with that you have to pay the one people [TS]

00:04:40   have to pay them whatever they ask and [TS]

00:04:43   they will provide you whatever service [TS]

00:04:45   they think it is their service like you [TS]

00:04:48   know you say i want internet I want [TS]

00:04:50   internet that's fast and good and [TS]

00:04:53   they're like well we have this internet [TS]

00:04:54   we have this amount of internet that we [TS]

00:04:56   are going to go we are able to give you [TS]

00:04:58   or willing to you can't say what you [TS]

00:04:59   described as it sounds it sounds like [TS]

00:05:01   something from like light nineties you [TS]

00:05:04   going to this place and your option is [TS]

00:05:06   pay for this wireless that we have here [TS]

00:05:09   or don't have internet right that's it [TS]

00:05:11   that's all you got so you can't get like [TS]

00:05:13   a nice I ethernet connection there [TS]

00:05:14   no those are your options you could not [TS]

00:05:16   go down to to the marketplace [TS]

00:05:20   thank you for your cooperation where all [TS]

00:05:24   the people are there are walking there [TS]

00:05:27   where's 18t comcast they're all there [TS]

00:05:31   with little booths [TS]

00:05:32   hey little Barker's hey guy come on over [TS]

00:05:35   here check out our internet there's none [TS]

00:05:37   of that so but i have to have internet [TS]

00:05:40   down there so that's another payment and [TS]

00:05:43   then I start thinking like oh well you [TS]

00:05:47   know i i've been having this trouble [TS]

00:05:48   invoicing people and now I'm not [TS]

00:05:51   downloaded this invoicing program and it [TS]

00:05:53   turns out that is a payment he pay you [TS]

00:05:55   pay for that and then now i'm looking at [TS]

00:05:59   nose spray i gotta get that I gotta get [TS]

00:06:01   back on i gotta pay for nose spray every [TS]

00:06:04   month at an additional cost and you know [TS]

00:06:07   it's one of these things when I first [TS]

00:06:08   when I first realized that I needed to [TS]

00:06:10   that I was not going to be able to live [TS]

00:06:12   in the modern world without a driver's [TS]

00:06:14   license and this I realize this at the [TS]

00:06:18   age of but 26 [TS]

00:06:20   I was like you know what I've been [TS]

00:06:22   without a driver's license for a long [TS]

00:06:23   time and that the inconvenience of it is [TS]

00:06:26   that has now surpassed the indignity of [TS]

00:06:30   having to get one and I when I got a [TS]

00:06:35   driver's license and then you know right [TS]

00:06:38   away like you know you gotta get [TS]

00:06:39   insurance and I gotta start obeying the [TS]

00:06:42   law and all these other you know [TS]

00:06:44   corollary effects and you know once they [TS]

00:06:49   get you not you know then they just they [TS]

00:06:52   drag you back in well you know I know [TS]

00:06:56   you're in kind of a raw place right now [TS]

00:06:57   with with the expenses but but let me [TS]

00:07:00   put this in 42 as somebody who's doing [TS]

00:07:01   those things with an office is also need [TS]

00:07:04   a second set of everything so if you [TS]

00:07:06   want to get the nasal chrome or you want [TS]

00:07:07   to get the generic claritin you gotta [TS]

00:07:11   have you [TS]

00:07:11   that's exactly right yeah yeah so so you [TS]

00:07:14   know it's like when I got the iphone 5 [TS]

00:07:16   all the sudden I needed to buy five new [TS]

00:07:19   cables because i had over the years of [TS]

00:07:22   owning an iphone 4i had acquired all the [TS]

00:07:25   cabling and I mean right i had a car [TS]

00:07:28   charger i had a cable at my mom's house [TS]

00:07:31   had a cable upstairs and cable [TS]

00:07:34   downstairs a table at my mom's house and [TS]

00:07:38   then but the by the new phone you wait [TS]

00:07:40   you wait for the you wait for the new [TS]

00:07:43   phone to come out and you get it [TS]

00:07:44   oh all your cables are garbage now yeah [TS]

00:07:47   I had to get all new cables and then not [TS]

00:07:52   everyone in my family switched over to [TS]

00:07:54   the iphone 5 so we got duplicated cables [TS]

00:07:56   everywhere four and five cable [TS]

00:07:59   how do i trust that Apple isn't going to [TS]

00:08:01   come up with a brand-new cable with the [TS]

00:08:03   six [TS]

00:08:03   how do i do I have you know like you [TS]

00:08:07   you're telling me I should trust that [TS]

00:08:08   you took your saying no I wouldn't do [TS]

00:08:10   that but how do i know now [TS]

00:08:13   ya know what I mean burn me once shame [TS]

00:08:15   on shame on you burn me twice is that [TS]

00:08:20   the shame on me wonder is it does do is [TS]

00:08:22   it the third time that it's a shame on [TS]

00:08:23   me for me once [TS]

00:08:26   can't fool me right that's right [TS]

00:08:28   internal that was going your eyes [TS]

00:08:30   miserable tell you what tell you what [TS]

00:08:35   so anyway I just feel like i might as [TS]

00:08:38   well just start up on autopay at my bank [TS]

00:08:40   and everybody shake hands with it just [TS]

00:08:43   starts paying him something you know [TS]

00:08:45   what I mean like just hi nice to meet [TS]

00:08:47   you old now you're now you're connected [TS]

00:08:49   via some app right somebody some tinder [TS]

00:08:53   app it's like oh hi [TS]

00:08:55   what a nice to meet you now we're now we [TS]

00:08:59   both know it turns out we both like [TS]

00:09:00   flock at all right well here's twenty [TS]

00:09:02   bucks it like Robert De Niro and get [TS]

00:09:04   around getting ever given everybody [TS]

00:09:06   twenties just goes and starts going into [TS]

00:09:08   your account i'm never gonna see you [TS]

00:09:09   again [TS]

00:09:10   well you know that's what that's what's [TS]

00:09:12   gonna happen you're gonna get you're [TS]

00:09:14   going to get these apps you know you [TS]

00:09:16   just said it's just a plague laps when [TS]

00:09:19   all we decided that down you know we all [TS]

00:09:22   long story short they basically my [TS]

00:09:23   daughter needed to have a room at some [TS]

00:09:25   point she was a kid and and plus I was [TS]

00:09:28   you know pretty sprawled out in the [TS]

00:09:31   second bedroom and so I should get an [TS]

00:09:32   office the only point is that like at [TS]

00:09:34   the time it seemed like kind of a big [TS]

00:09:36   deal but not a huge deal like oh I have [TS]

00:09:38   this office where I will go and I will [TS]

00:09:40   do office things and it seems too simple [TS]

00:09:43   mio my daughter got a rope and now like [TS]

00:09:45   I hate how much I kind of can't imagine [TS]

00:09:47   going back I would love to not have the [TS]

00:09:50   expense of this but it would be it would [TS]

00:09:52   be chaos if you go back to a pre office [TS]

00:09:54   economy [TS]

00:09:55   well I mean you know part of it is that [TS]

00:09:58   the bad on me part is like now the [TS]

00:09:59   sprawl is on the office and I just I [TS]

00:10:02   dread the idea of having to consolidate [TS]

00:10:04   all of this i can probably just walk [TS]

00:10:05   away i could grab the laptop can [TS]

00:10:07   literally walk away and set it on fire [TS]

00:10:08   he keep the next crime i'll get the [TS]

00:10:12   paddle ball game in a chair you think [TS]

00:10:14   we'll keep the office I mean it sounds [TS]

00:10:16   like it's still kind of a weird fit for [TS]

00:10:18   you [TS]

00:10:19   well it's a lot of hassle you how I if I [TS]

00:10:26   could say or how committed are you do [TS]

00:10:27   you got like a lease and stuff i know i [TS]

00:10:30   mean it's you know it's seattle right [TS]

00:10:32   you could get anyway the the most [TS]

00:10:34   stringent lease in the city I feel like [TS]

00:10:36   you could walk in [TS]

00:10:37   22 the manager's office one day and just [TS]

00:10:40   be like yeah you know I just um and the [TS]

00:10:44   manager be like oh yeah okay [TS]

00:10:47   no it's not was going to somebody and [TS]

00:10:49   sue me yeah no it's not that I feel [TS]

00:10:52   bound I like having it i'm just i'm not [TS]

00:10:56   using it yet because you know the big [TS]

00:11:00   big problem my whole life I've done this [TS]

00:11:02   it's like oh well if i dangled the [TS]

00:11:05   carrot if i put it if you know if if if [TS]

00:11:09   on monday i put a carrot on a string and [TS]

00:11:12   I put it out [TS]

00:11:14   I and I attached it to a fishing pole [TS]

00:11:16   and I attached the fishing pole to a hat [TS]

00:11:19   and I put the Hat on every morning when [TS]

00:11:22   I wake up then I will start working and [TS]

00:11:27   if i do that on monday by wednesday i [TS]

00:11:30   maybe i'll have forgotten that i did [TS]

00:11:32   that and it'll just be this carrot that [TS]

00:11:35   I don't know where it came from and I [TS]

00:11:37   wake up in the morning and i'll put on [TS]

00:11:39   my hat that i always put on you know [TS]

00:11:42   I've never put on a hat in my life but [TS]

00:11:44   this is the idea right I'm going to put [TS]

00:11:46   on this hat this new that all i have to [TS]

00:11:47   do is put on the Hat and then McCarron [TS]

00:11:49   will be there and then I'll go and I'll [TS]

00:11:50   chase the carrot and I'll forget that [TS]

00:11:52   this is all plan that I'm trying to like [TS]

00:11:55   sneak in on myself and I know it's early [TS]

00:11:58   but let me try to understand this [TS]

00:11:59   you're saying you need a way to [TS]

00:12:00   habituate yourself to doing a work thing [TS]

00:12:02   over a period of time [TS]

00:12:04   kind of yeah but that's been true that's [TS]

00:12:07   been true since i was in fifth grade [TS]

00:12:09   yeah and so so you know what I was in [TS]

00:12:14   the when I was making record albums a [TS]

00:12:18   lot which it would never actually was [TS]

00:12:20   making them a lot but the times that i [TS]

00:12:22   did make record albums but the fact that [TS]

00:12:25   there was a lot of expense involved and [TS]

00:12:27   you had to get a bunch of people all [TS]

00:12:29   pulling together actually did have the [TS]

00:12:32   effect of getting me at least to finish [TS]

00:12:34   those things that i did finish [TS]

00:12:37   but so this office is just another one [TS]

00:12:40   of these strategies of like well if i [TS]

00:12:44   get an office and i buy a new computer [TS]

00:12:46   and i put the new computer in the office [TS]

00:12:48   and i am paying for internet at the [TS]

00:12:52   office then necessarily i will wake up [TS]

00:12:57   every morning at nine have a healthy [TS]

00:12:59   breakfast read the newspaper and by non [TS]

00:13:03   your care infected but on the care that [TS]

00:13:06   by nine-thirty i will be you know i will [TS]

00:13:09   be merging into traffic [TS]

00:13:11   come on on my commute to your office on [TS]

00:13:14   my way to the office and then i will get [TS]

00:13:15   there and i'll you know hang up my head [TS]

00:13:17   on the hat rack and i'll say because [TS]

00:13:20   she's the carrot the morning Marge and [TS]

00:13:23   I'll sit down at my computer and i will [TS]

00:13:25   write the the work that i really truly [TS]

00:13:30   do want to write and that I feel like I [TS]

00:13:35   desperately need to write but obviously [TS]

00:13:39   don't need to write strongly enough that [TS]

00:13:42   i'd just wake up and and and write it [TS]

00:13:45   without all the with all without all [TS]

00:13:47   this like Bologna in the middle and it's [TS]

00:13:51   astonishing how easy it is to wake up in [TS]

00:13:53   the morning not put on the carrot had [TS]

00:13:55   and you know and spend like three hours [TS]

00:14:00   looking at my phone and then decide that [TS]

00:14:03   it's been a long time since I've had [TS]

00:14:05   Fried Chicken so I better get better [TS]

00:14:09   take care of that before the day gets [TS]

00:14:11   too much older this episode of rock on [TS]

00:14:14   the line is sponsored by our very good [TS]

00:14:16   friends at Squarespace you know [TS]

00:14:17   Squarespace they are the all-in-one [TS]

00:14:19   platform that makes it fast and easy to [TS]

00:14:21   create your own professional website [TS]

00:14:23   portfolio or online store they make the [TS]

00:14:26   whole process so simple and easy [TS]

00:14:28   drag-and-drop interface and beautiful [TS]

00:14:30   free templates you can tweak to suit [TS]

00:14:32   your needs all the squarespace six [TS]

00:14:33   designs are responsive which means they [TS]

00:14:35   look great on every device [TS]

00:14:37   Squarespace also offers free 24 x seven [TS]

00:14:40   support through live chat and email with [TS]

00:14:42   dedicated teams in New York City dublin [TS]

00:14:44   and Portland who John and I have u [TS]

00:14:47   square space to host rock on the line [TS]

00:14:49   for three years now they have [TS]

00:14:50   been great to work with we would love it [TS]

00:14:52   if you would give them a try to remember [TS]

00:14:54   Squarespace plans start at only eight [TS]

00:14:56   dollars per month eight dollars a month [TS]

00:14:58   that includes a free domain name if you [TS]

00:15:00   sign up for a year [TS]

00:15:01   please remember to tell Squarespace you [TS]

00:15:03   heard about it from your positronic on [TS]

00:15:04   the line listeners of this program get a [TS]

00:15:07   free trial plus ten percent off any [TS]

00:15:09   package they choose by using the special [TS]

00:15:11   offer code supertrain at checkout our [TS]

00:15:14   thanks to squarespace for supporting [TS]

00:15:15   router kind of line we could not do it [TS]

00:15:17   without and then you know another day [TS]

00:15:19   goes by so answer your question i love [TS]

00:15:22   the office i do not yet resented like it [TS]

00:15:25   hasn't become a thing but I paying money [TS]

00:15:27   and I just don't know i don't even want [TS]

00:15:29   to go down there because it makes me [TS]

00:15:30   feel so bad about the waist which is you [TS]

00:15:33   know that i can remember a gym [TS]

00:15:36   membership i bought in the mid nineties [TS]

00:15:38   when i went down i bought the gym [TS]

00:15:41   membership I i decided i was going to [TS]

00:15:43   get a year instead of a month-to-month [TS]

00:15:46   because that was the only way I was [TS]

00:15:48   gonna it was that year membership is [TS]

00:15:51   going to motivate me [TS]

00:15:52   I got my picture taken i got an ID card [TS]

00:15:56   with a photo on it I put it in my wallet [TS]

00:15:58   and I never went back to the gym [TS]

00:16:00   not a single time really i did not even [TS]

00:16:02   go in to use the bathroom when I was [TS]

00:16:06   walking by like that the i started [TS]

00:16:09   changing my route so that i wouldn't go [TS]

00:16:13   by the gym and be forced to remember and [TS]

00:16:16   that's a terrible feeling but I never [TS]

00:16:18   took the card out of my wallet because [TS]

00:16:19   what if tomorrow is that what if [TS]

00:16:21   tomorrow is the day here and so it's a [TS]

00:16:24   terrible feeling I've done it to myself [TS]

00:16:25   a thousand times now the office has not [TS]

00:16:27   turned into that the office still is a [TS]

00:16:29   place of hope and i still believe [TS]

00:16:33   because I have all these things I have [TS]

00:16:35   all these wonderful projects that feel [TS]

00:16:40   like they're I'm and so tantalizingly [TS]

00:16:43   close to to embarking on these little [TS]

00:16:47   projects i bought some about the [TS]

00:16:51   expensive voice recognition software [TS]

00:16:54   oh yeah [TS]

00:16:57   and I'm going to attend the training yet [TS]

00:16:59   I haven't trained it fit I want to hear [TS]

00:17:01   how that goes [TS]

00:17:01   I'm gonna train the software and then [TS]

00:17:03   I'm gonna have I'm gonna play the tapes [TS]

00:17:05   into the software and if i play the [TS]

00:17:08   tapes into the software and it produces [TS]

00:17:10   even a seventy-five percent accurate [TS]

00:17:15   documents i feel like that will that [TS]

00:17:21   will be work i'll be excited to do come [TS]

00:17:24   through the transcripts fix it up we [TS]

00:17:28   clarify the ideas begin work on a you [TS]

00:17:32   know on a big project a big writing [TS]

00:17:35   project but the dictation software could [TS]

00:17:39   also produce Jabberwocky [TS]

00:17:42   yeah I don't spoil this for you that's [TS]

00:17:47   that you know it's on the same way i [TS]

00:17:49   feel like if i were to get transcripts [TS]

00:17:51   of all the bullshit I've said over the [TS]

00:17:54   last three to five years i have three [TS]

00:17:56   books they just need to be edited for [TS]

00:17:58   shizzle and editing is fun it can be [TS]

00:18:01   anything I my problem was I mean God I [TS]

00:18:04   have gosh I you know what i shouldn't [TS]

00:18:06   say anything but you know [TS]

00:18:08   hmm yeah you know there's well you know [TS]

00:18:10   like for me I I i went and i went and by [TS]

00:18:16   the voice software when when I was in a [TS]

00:18:19   similar place to what I perceive you to [TS]

00:18:22   be in right now which is like there's a [TS]

00:18:23   big writing thing I need to do and my [TS]

00:18:25   problem is that that I know I know all [TS]

00:18:28   this stuff and I can feel that thing [TS]

00:18:30   just out of reach that's that's almost [TS]

00:18:32   this thing and what if I just you know [TS]

00:18:35   Mikey's alternated like yes I'm cases of [TS]

00:18:37   sit down type you know make outlines all [TS]

00:18:39   these things all right all but like it [TS]

00:18:41   will be pretty great if I could just [TS]

00:18:42   walk around in my private office and [TS]

00:18:45   have the the dingus take it all down my [TS]

00:18:48   problem was like you know what you can [TS]

00:18:50   guess what the ending was which was that [TS]

00:18:52   like it didn't help and partly because i [TS]

00:18:54   think i never got it trained too quite [TS]

00:18:56   right and I never could forget the fact [TS]

00:18:58   that i was talking to voice recognition [TS]

00:19:00   software i think that's the key turning [TS]

00:19:02   point a 70-percent if I had ninety-five [TS]

00:19:04   percent correct it was still driving me [TS]

00:19:06   bananas [TS]

00:19:06   yeah you know but you know but it could [TS]

00:19:09   work you know my problem also and I [TS]

00:19:11   don't know if this helps her or harms [TS]

00:19:12   but if when I look back at like having [TS]

00:19:14   gotten an office in 2008 that's a very [TS]

00:19:18   it's an interesting point I think it's [TS]

00:19:19   something like maybe the summer of two [TS]

00:19:21   thousand eight something like that [TS]

00:19:23   this is a different office in your [TS]

00:19:24   current offer the same office you got [TS]

00:19:25   that office in 2008 yeah you've had it [TS]

00:19:28   that whole time I had no ideas expensive [TS]

00:19:31   i but but what you know what's funny [TS]

00:19:34   about a funny thing happened I mean you [TS]

00:19:36   know it's ironic that I like a lot of [TS]

00:19:38   the reason i got its super ironic that I [TS]

00:19:40   got it because i need to record podcasts [TS]

00:19:42   and so therefore now I have a street car [TS]

00:19:44   going by outside that are right here [TS]

00:19:46   I should have really thought that [TS]

00:19:47   through but you know apart from having [TS]

00:19:49   to record things like you know what a [TS]

00:19:51   total of maybe one hour of music and [TS]

00:19:54   during that entire time to recorded [TS]

00:19:55   music but you know hours and hours and [TS]

00:19:57   hours a podcast the funny part is is [TS]

00:19:59   that like within probably a few months [TS]

00:20:01   even or at least no more than a year [TS]

00:20:04   after that like everything got so much [TS]

00:20:07   easier to do with stuff like my phone [TS]

00:20:11   and I didn't really I mean I needed a [TS]

00:20:13   place to put my giant computer and my [TS]

00:20:15   giant screens and my giant connections [TS]

00:20:17   in my giant router and all that stuff [TS]

00:20:18   but the truth is that you know if i have [TS]

00:20:21   something to say I if I really have [TS]

00:20:23   something to say and I'm motivated to [TS]

00:20:24   say i can type that on the iphone no [TS]

00:20:26   problem and and that's that's what kicks [TS]

00:20:29   me in the ass is like I have all this [TS]

00:20:31   expense and all this trouble and all [TS]

00:20:32   this hassle is garbage in my office when [TS]

00:20:35   like honestly to to be a writer like you [TS]

00:20:37   know it isn't like i have 10 books and [TS]

00:20:40   things that need to be edited edited and [TS]

00:20:42   I need to do you know the Magna Carta [TS]

00:20:45   and translation or something like that [TS]

00:20:47   you know it's it's it's kind of funny [TS]

00:20:50   that I have all this infrastructure at a [TS]

00:20:52   time when I could be writing anywhere [TS]

00:20:54   but i'm not you know that's not the [TS]

00:20:56   offices fault [TS]

00:20:58   well it's and it's not but it is kind of [TS]

00:21:01   I mean it is the it's the myth of it it [TS]

00:21:06   it's the myth of of productivity and of [TS]

00:21:10   user friendliness and listening [TS]

00:21:12   it is [TS]

00:21:15   like Apple in particular above all of [TS]

00:21:20   their companies has profited from the [TS]

00:21:25   idea that we are all artists and all we [TS]

00:21:28   lacked was the tools and I mean that [TS]

00:21:32   premise was sort of at the foundation of [TS]

00:21:36   seventies and educate seventies [TS]

00:21:39   childhood education that all we needed [TS]

00:21:43   to do was free these peoples little [TS]

00:21:46   minds and get them out of this nineteen [TS]

00:21:48   fifties model of Education and let them [TS]

00:21:51   play and let them have finger paints and [TS]

00:21:54   we're going to discover this generation [TS]

00:21:57   of artists and that and that that even [TS]

00:21:59   if we even if that were true and that [TS]

00:22:01   we've discovered a generation of artists [TS]

00:22:03   the the further lead was that that's [TS]

00:22:07   what we want that we actually want a [TS]

00:22:09   generation of artists nobody really [TS]

00:22:12   thought that I can imagine what that [TS]

00:22:14   would be like a fucking ring if [TS]

00:22:15   everybody really was an artist [TS]

00:22:17   oh my god what a fucking nightmare world [TS]

00:22:20   we would live in but that was the [TS]

00:22:22   premise that my mother used to raise me [TS]

00:22:26   like I'm going to let him explore his [TS]

00:22:29   creativity i'm going to let him you know [TS]

00:22:30   discover the artist within but what if [TS]

00:22:33   you recall back to when we were in [TS]

00:22:35   school it was in completely a pardon me [TS]

00:22:38   I have a have some glue and my throat [TS]

00:22:41   you know there was in completely applied [TS]

00:22:46   and there were certainly students in the [TS]

00:22:48   schools that were not being encouraged [TS]

00:22:49   to finger paint but in general it was [TS]

00:22:52   much more finger painting the the full [TS]

00:22:59   at philosophy of education and apple has [TS]

00:23:02   consistently done a marvelous job of [TS]

00:23:08   convincing us that we are all filmmakers [TS]

00:23:11   we are all graphic artists we are all [TS]

00:23:14   podcasters we are all writers and all we [TS]

00:23:19   needed all along was just the box of [TS]

00:23:22   tools and once we have those things the [TS]

00:23:25   box of tools would set us free [TS]

00:23:28   and we would be making the beautiful [TS]

00:23:29   things we wanted it was so easy to make [TS]

00:23:31   up the the record that we just made with [TS]

00:23:34   the film that we're working on and once [TS]

00:23:37   that thing was done you know we would be [TS]

00:23:40   completely validated and we would be [TS]

00:23:43   helping people and so we've all been [TS]

00:23:47   buying these boxes of tools from them [TS]

00:23:50   these toy box is really now for a couple [TS]

00:23:55   of decades and we each of us have [TS]

00:24:00   sitting on our desk the ability to make [TS]

00:24:03   up make it a complete film with [TS]

00:24:07   animation and all the music and you know [TS]

00:24:11   like importantly that you can shoot it [TS]

00:24:14   and edit it and shoot it on your phone [TS]

00:24:17   right shoot it edit it even compose them [TS]

00:24:20   you don't have to even play an [TS]

00:24:21   instrument because all the musical parts [TS]

00:24:24   are in there you just have to cut and [TS]

00:24:26   paste them and make a new symphony and [TS]

00:24:30   you know the I mean I you can't resent [TS]

00:24:35   them for it because it's a beautiful [TS]

00:24:38   idea and it's a beaut and they have [TS]

00:24:40   actually made very elegant software that [TS]

00:24:42   enables us to do it but but once again [TS]

00:24:46   the number of people that are actually [TS]

00:24:48   making films it like it more or less has [TS]

00:24:51   remained constant but what we all have [TS]

00:24:55   now is like hast giant it's super [TS]

00:24:59   expensive gift boxes that's it on our [TS]

00:25:02   table tops and say look how elegant I [TS]

00:25:04   him and you could be making a film on me [TS]

00:25:06   right now if you were just slightly more [TS]

00:25:08   of a person you could be making you [TS]

00:25:11   could be you could be right you could [TS]

00:25:12   already be writing the book about the [TS]

00:25:14   making of the film right but you're not [TS]

00:25:18   and it's not that you don't have the [TS]

00:25:20   tools you have the tools it is something [TS]

00:25:24   else some other flaw in you and I [TS]

00:25:27   already had that voice in me I didn't [TS]

00:25:30   need a elegant white box to amplify it [TS]

00:25:32   every morning when I woke up and walked [TS]

00:25:35   past my elegant box of tools [TS]

00:25:37   that is basically just as a well stroll [TS]

00:25:40   voice now my cereal my serie just speaks [TS]

00:25:43   to me in Welsh and and you know and but [TS]

00:25:50   that has always been the case because [TS]

00:25:52   before Apple came along I mean I am I am [TS]

00:25:56   a middle-class person who was given the [TS]

00:25:59   opportunity over and over again the art [TS]

00:26:01   lessons or nobody nobody insisted that I [TS]

00:26:05   major in engineering in college like i [TS]

00:26:07   was invited to major in literature or [TS]

00:26:11   whatever struck my fancy you know and [TS]

00:26:15   and so the burden of why i have not made [TS]

00:26:21   as much beautiful stuff as I as I feel I [TS]

00:26:25   should have the burden of that is all on [TS]

00:26:28   me I that I cannot point to any to any [TS]

00:26:33   obstacle any real obstacle that is [TS]

00:26:38   outside myself and I wonder whether that [TS]

00:26:42   it is part of this conversation that [TS]

00:26:45   we've been having for my four months and [TS]

00:26:47   years about about this generation that's [TS]

00:26:49   on our heels that is like so that is so [TS]

00:26:52   excited about all the obstacles that [TS]

00:26:55   they perceived in the culture you know [TS]

00:26:58   that the reason they haven't succeeded [TS]

00:27:01   is because of of reasons will write all [TS]

00:27:06   the institutional institutional problems [TS]

00:27:10   that maybe you maybe you look at them [TS]

00:27:13   when you see them as being a privilege [TS]

00:27:15   middle-class person but that's not how [TS]

00:27:17   they see themselves because you're not [TS]

00:27:19   perceiving the all the all the cultural [TS]

00:27:22   walls that prevent them from using their [TS]

00:27:25   little white boxes to make you don't [TS]

00:27:27   been in particular all the ones that [TS]

00:27:29   don't have the little white box that [TS]

00:27:30   have to use a dell which also has all [TS]

00:27:34   the same software or maybe doesn't even [TS]

00:27:36   have a dell maybe has to go to the [TS]

00:27:37   computer science center at the library [TS]

00:27:40   to use their incredible little white [TS]

00:27:43   boxes that are available free to anyone [TS]

00:27:46   um yeah I mean you know what I got a lot [TS]

00:27:49   of thoughts on this but i mean i'll keep [TS]

00:27:51   it short that one thing is that we [TS]

00:27:52   really are still in the infancy of a lot [TS]

00:27:54   of this stuff the problem you're [TS]

00:27:55   describing is is not new but what is new [TS]

00:27:59   is that I mean in the course of wanting [TS]

00:28:03   to take 20 years [TS]

00:28:04   really you know in the course of really [TS]

00:28:06   kind of five years but especially above [TS]

00:28:08   10 years we've gone from so many things [TS]

00:28:11   that were out of touch out of reach [TS]

00:28:13   either so I mean so many things where as [TS]

00:28:16   we've talked about ad nauseam [TS]

00:28:17   I mean a time when the idea of being [TS]

00:28:20   able to pretty to write perform produce [TS]

00:28:25   and publish and sell your own music [TS]

00:28:29   each required a different special set of [TS]

00:28:33   stuff that was costly maybe not the [TS]

00:28:35   writing you can come along and play the [TS]

00:28:36   ukulele but you know recording your [TS]

00:28:38   music meant going to a studio certainly [TS]

00:28:41   meant you know are buying and mastering [TS]

00:28:44   an instrument getting that Preston [TS]

00:28:47   mastered costs money getting that [TS]

00:28:50   distributed to Sam Goody all of the [TS]

00:28:53   steps you know it seems so far away and [TS]

00:28:56   it's partly what made rockstar seem like [TS]

00:28:57   rockstars is that all that stuff [TS]

00:28:59   required the benediction of so many [TS]

00:29:01   people and or you know or a fat wallet [TS]

00:29:04   I mean you know you remember like seeing [TS]

00:29:06   ads in the back of rolling stone for [TS]

00:29:07   being able to publish your own book and [TS]

00:29:09   the idea that generally least call it a [TS]

00:29:11   vanity press right so you can go out and [TS]

00:29:13   publish your memoirs and say I have a [TS]

00:29:15   published book that I happen to about [TS]

00:29:17   all 1,000 copies so I mean that's always [TS]

00:29:20   been something that's available people [TS]

00:29:21   but it's I think we're all I mean I [TS]

00:29:24   don't know it's so different from person [TS]

00:29:25   to person but I think we're all still [TS]

00:29:26   catching up with that in some ways it's [TS]

00:29:28   just that right now i think it is i [TS]

00:29:31   don't know how much it says about like [TS]

00:29:32   our artistic this is nothing overarching [TS]

00:29:35   about their artistic future but you know [TS]

00:29:37   it's just it is very easy and fun to [TS]

00:29:39   take a photograph add some filters to it [TS]

00:29:42   and put it somewhere you know they [TS]

00:29:43   collect your stars is that that is [TS]

00:29:45   really fun and there's a it's it's [TS]

00:29:47   addictive and it's it's a big community [TS]

00:29:49   kind of thing and if you want i'm trying [TS]

00:29:52   to pivot to a bigger point here but in [TS]

00:29:54   that case like I'm guilty as anybody of [TS]

00:29:56   like saying oh gosh i said a funny thing [TS]

00:29:58   i hope people like it [TS]

00:29:59   I put up a pretty picture i hope people [TS]

00:30:01   start it and that is what could be more [TS]

00:30:04   distracting or more procrastination [TS]

00:30:06   making or this is even setting aside the [TS]

00:30:09   entire anger inch industry of all the [TS]

00:30:11   things that we're supposed to be you [TS]

00:30:12   know passionate about but in all in [TS]

00:30:14   those cases I mean everybody knows what [TS]

00:30:16   they've got on their phone everybody [TS]

00:30:17   opens up garage band at least once in [TS]

00:30:19   place with it you know people have [TS]

00:30:22   probably edited you know videos of their [TS]

00:30:23   baby when they're very motivated about [TS]

00:30:26   that topic and send it to the family but [TS]

00:30:28   it isn't something you keep going within [TS]

00:30:29   the pivot is that this really awful and [TS]

00:30:34   and annoying and in my experience [TS]

00:30:36   absolutely true fact which is that [TS]

00:30:41   to paraphrase things will durant you [TS]

00:30:43   know we are what we do what we [TS]

00:30:44   frequently do whatever it is that you do [TS]

00:30:46   a lot is what you do and you know you [TS]

00:30:49   talked about in a previous episode about [TS]

00:30:51   manifesting about the idea of sort of [TS]

00:30:54   announcing that you're now a [TS]

00:30:55   professional photographer or one that [TS]

00:30:57   always gets me is people announcing the [TS]

00:30:58   third SEO expert or a thought leader it [TS]

00:31:00   you know doesn't cost anything to do [TS]

00:31:02   that and you know other people who are [TS]

00:31:04   aspiring now look up to you because of [TS]

00:31:05   that but it's not the same thing is [TS]

00:31:07   showing up in doing that work every day [TS]

00:31:08   so I mean what William seo seo again its [TS]

00:31:12   search engine optimization and it's this [TS]

00:31:14   huge industry google yeah it's it's the [TS]

00:31:20   day the basic idea is in its to put it [TS]

00:31:22   in the least you know value-laden way [TS]

00:31:24   it's a way of making sure that the [TS]

00:31:26   content on your website is being gobbled [TS]

00:31:30   up properly by google but that gets [TS]

00:31:32   darker and black hat it's a way of [TS]

00:31:35   turning game system so that you show up [TS]

00:31:37   at the top for viagra or whatever right [TS]

00:31:39   but anyway I mean all I'm saying is like [TS]

00:31:41   I'm this is I don't mean this as advice [TS]

00:31:43   except in as much as it is advice that I [TS]

00:31:45   need to hear which is that like you know [TS]

00:31:46   what it really it's just a matter of if [TS]

00:31:48   you write you get up every day and [TS]

00:31:49   you're right well true regardless of [TS]

00:31:51   where you are and that's what I struggle [TS]

00:31:52   with because i know it really is that [TS]

00:31:54   simple [TS]

00:31:54   that's the part that that we're having [TS]

00:31:56   this expensive and having a I could get [TS]

00:31:59   up if i could get up at five an hour [TS]

00:32:01   before my daughter wakes up and have an [TS]

00:32:03   hour right if I wrote 15 minutes a day [TS]

00:32:05   every day I have so much more written [TS]

00:32:07   you know all the time that i SAT around [TS]

00:32:10   thinking what I really need is to go on [TS]

00:32:11   some kind of [TS]

00:32:12   retreat so i can actually write the [TS]

00:32:14   thing i need to write but yeah I've got [TS]

00:32:15   an office where I can do that feel bad [TS]

00:32:17   about that too [TS]

00:32:18   that's the advice of bird by bird by [TS]

00:32:19   annie Lamont yeah it's pretty it's [TS]

00:32:22   pretty great book that's a nice little [TS]

00:32:23   book [TS]

00:32:24   announcer the artist with me but the [TS]

00:32:27   artist way already [TS]

00:32:28   that's it do morning pages ya at [TS]

00:32:33   i mean i-i don't mean to describe all [TS]

00:32:37   this stuff as as though it were an [TS]

00:32:40   actual additional obstacle as much as to [TS]

00:32:44   say it is another in a long line of non [TS]

00:32:48   actual obstacles but that are but that [TS]

00:32:53   are authentically obstacles you know I [TS]

00:32:56   in the in the sense that in 1964 if you [TS]

00:33:03   wanted to design a new car if you worked [TS]

00:33:06   for General Motors and you wanted to [TS]

00:33:07   design a new car you drew it on a big [TS]

00:33:09   pad and then he went out and you [TS]

00:33:11   constructed you constructed that drawing [TS]

00:33:15   in three dimensions using clay and wood [TS]

00:33:18   and shaped it with a you know with the [TS]

00:33:21   exacto knife until it looked like the [TS]

00:33:24   GTO in your imagination to end the [TS]

00:33:29   process that it took to get that drawing [TS]

00:33:32   into production and to make a new car [TS]

00:33:36   was incredibly labor-intensive and yet [TS]

00:33:42   at some point it happened every year you [TS]

00:33:48   know they redesigned those cars every [TS]

00:33:50   year the difference between 56 and 57 [TS]

00:33:53   Chevy and the 58 Chevy I mean they don't [TS]

00:33:55   look alike at all they were redesigning [TS]

00:33:57   those cars using clay models and [TS]

00:34:00   everybody signed off on it and put those [TS]

00:34:04   cars and production and were you know [TS]

00:34:06   and I and across town there were people [TS]

00:34:10   that were making missile trajectories [TS]

00:34:12   they were calculating missile [TS]

00:34:14   trajectories using slide rules and you [TS]

00:34:18   know they did not have we now have the [TS]

00:34:20   technology to calculate missile [TS]

00:34:22   trajectories on our phone if you [TS]

00:34:24   into and we now have the capability [TS]

00:34:28   using auto drafting programs to just we [TS]

00:34:32   could design a new car every day and [TS]

00:34:34   make a 3d model of it our printer in our [TS]

00:34:36   in our living rooms but if you look at [TS]

00:34:39   the design of cars now or the design of [TS]

00:34:44   buildings or the really the design of [TS]

00:34:46   anything i don't think i don't think [TS]

00:34:48   it's just a matter of taste i think it [TS]

00:34:50   is objectively worse and worse all the [TS]

00:34:53   time right [TS]

00:34:54   the easier and easier it gets to make [TS]

00:34:56   things is related [TS]

00:34:58   well i can't i can't feel like it's not [TS]

00:35:05   it in the sense that in the sense that [TS]

00:35:10   it what used to be special knowledge [TS]

00:35:13   that was um that was prized knowledge is [TS]

00:35:19   now diffuse knowledge if you call [TS]

00:35:22   yourself a car designer and you design a [TS]

00:35:25   bunch of cars like-- way if if General [TS]

00:35:27   Motors if General Motors I I cannot [TS]

00:35:31   imagine what is happening in the car [TS]

00:35:33   design salons at general motors but I [TS]

00:35:38   have to imagine that what we're there [TS]

00:35:40   once was a room and some people with [TS]

00:35:43   theirs in their shirtsleeves and [TS]

00:35:47   horn-rimmed glasses like walking around [TS]

00:35:49   drafting tables and at a certain point [TS]

00:35:53   the design had to come out of somebody [TS]

00:35:55   and then if if the committee or other [TS]

00:35:58   people wanted modifications made you [TS]

00:36:02   know they each time knew it was kind of [TS]

00:36:04   like recording on tape right [TS]

00:36:06   you knew what the limitations were [TS]

00:36:08   before you made a suggestion [TS]

00:36:10   so it's like okay we just recorded that [TS]

00:36:12   track live the bass player made a little [TS]

00:36:14   fun it's the bass player screwed up a [TS]

00:36:16   little bit [TS]

00:36:17   is it worth it for us to go back and [TS]

00:36:19   record that entire thing and and and and [TS]

00:36:22   shoot for the moon for knowing that [TS]

00:36:25   we're going to either be burning tape [TS]

00:36:27   that's expensive or that work that we [TS]

00:36:29   might lose this take like the [TS]

00:36:30   limitations of number of tracks and [TS]

00:36:32   stuff like that and all that stuff and [TS]

00:36:34   so so before anyone made a suggestion [TS]

00:36:37   everybody had it in their mind that like [TS]

00:36:40   oh if i want to change some minor thing [TS]

00:36:42   about the tail light of this design this [TS]

00:36:45   talented draftsperson and the designer [TS]

00:36:48   they're going to have to go back and [TS]

00:36:50   redo this whole thing and it's going to [TS]

00:36:53   take them a lot longer and it's gonna [TS]

00:36:55   and it's expensive to do [TS]

00:36:58   it's not a question of just moving the [TS]

00:37:00   mouse and the thing you know like let's [TS]

00:37:02   try that let's make let's take a look [TS]

00:37:04   and see if what if the taillights were [TS]

00:37:06   oval-shaped what if the taillights were [TS]

00:37:08   shaped like a bat you know it was and so [TS]

00:37:12   what ended up happening was the design [TS]

00:37:14   more or less came out of one person's [TS]

00:37:16   imagination [TS]

00:37:17   maybe you made some suggestions but but [TS]

00:37:20   for the most part like the the work in [TS]

00:37:24   getting it to to the place where [TS]

00:37:26   everybody could even see it was was the [TS]

00:37:28   lion's share of the work and i can i can [TS]

00:37:31   only picture now just as in the [TS]

00:37:33   recording studio the ease of putting on [TS]

00:37:35   a thousand tracks the ease of [TS]

00:37:37   manipulating the waveform of the [TS]

00:37:40   baseline we're like able to grab like [TS]

00:37:43   drag across the screen and grabbed 10 or [TS]

00:37:45   15 points on a vector 3d vector drawing [TS]

00:37:47   and drag them to completely change the [TS]

00:37:49   shape of the car [TS]

00:37:50   yeah right we're at and so anybody [TS]

00:37:52   walking through that salon who has the [TS]

00:37:56   clearance who is who has made it to the [TS]

00:37:59   level of of manager can waltz by [TS]

00:38:03   presumably and say what if the hole par [TS]

00:38:07   was two inches shorter and two inches [TS]

00:38:09   taller and everybody knows that there's [TS]

00:38:13   no cost to making that suggestion so [TS]

00:38:16   even though the designer is sitting at [TS]

00:38:17   the computer going oh my god please fuck [TS]

00:38:20   off [TS]

00:38:21   he he kinda has to look and answer to [TS]

00:38:25   the guy be like okay sure [TS]

00:38:26   let's try it and so he makes it two [TS]

00:38:28   inches taller he makes it two inches [TS]

00:38:30   shorter and the guy goes like that [TS]

00:38:32   better [TS]

00:38:33   and the designer goes fuck it's worse [TS]

00:38:39   we call that over-the-shoulder time if [TS]

00:38:41   you ever if you ever go to like the [TS]

00:38:43   print bureau that we used to go to in [TS]

00:38:44   Tallahassee had they had a rate in a [TS]

00:38:47   rush rate and they had an [TS]

00:38:48   over-the-shoulder time rate which is not [TS]

00:38:50   if the person with the print job stood [TS]

00:38:52   over you while you were doing stuff with [TS]

00:38:54   it on the computer you have to pay a lot [TS]

00:38:55   more I bet right but you know but that's [TS]

00:38:58   that's got to be happening everywhere [TS]

00:39:00   and and so as i drive around the city [TS]

00:39:03   you know I can pin i can point to a [TS]

00:39:06   building and tell you whether that [TS]

00:39:10   building whether that building was [TS]

00:39:11   designed you know sort of pre or post [TS]

00:39:14   autocad right you can point you can [TS]

00:39:17   point to the you can point to the the [TS]

00:39:19   architecture of the development of [TS]

00:39:21   neighborhoods of things and at a point [TS]

00:39:24   at which it was no longer expensive to [TS]

00:39:26   design things really the quality of the [TS]

00:39:30   design just like drops and and so [TS]

00:39:36   because all of a sudden now you're like [TS]

00:39:37   well the design is just a thing that we [TS]

00:39:39   just can do and so now it's a question [TS]

00:39:41   of how much is the matter how much is a [TS]

00:39:43   cost how much are the materials gonna be [TS]

00:39:46   too and so there's a designer there was [TS]

00:39:49   like a night then I put dragons all [TS]

00:39:51   across the top of the building and every [TS]

00:39:53   window is is quadruple pain purple glass [TS]

00:39:57   and there's somebody that's like well no [TS]

00:39:59   that's too expensive [TS]

00:40:00   can you figure out a way to do it [TS]

00:40:02   without those things and the guys like [TS]

00:40:04   delete delete delete delete [TS]

00:40:06   yeah here's here's the version of it [TS]

00:40:08   without anything [TS]

00:40:09   yeah that looks good to me does that [TS]

00:40:10   look at you yeah okay good let's go and [TS]

00:40:14   it's true across the board meeting you [TS]

00:40:15   think about contemporary car design the [TS]

00:40:20   way that they they do things now as they [TS]

00:40:22   they make a platform and then that [TS]

00:40:25   platform runs for 15 years and every [TS]

00:40:28   every year they just changed a slightly [TS]

00:40:29   change that tail lights and the you know [TS]

00:40:32   they make a little modification here a [TS]

00:40:35   little modification there was only one [TS]

00:40:37   way one way they that those places I [TS]

00:40:39   assume are similar to apple or any [TS]

00:40:41   electronics maker is that I don't say [TS]

00:40:43   they start with the components [TS]

00:40:45   but I mean one reason you may or may not [TS]

00:40:46   see a revision is they have to offset [TS]

00:40:49   the cost of what they're losing in scale [TS]

00:40:52   so for example they could put out the [TS]

00:40:54   five applicable about the 5c because [TS]

00:40:56   using the same processor as the iphone [TS]

00:40:59   what4s my phone in anyway the point is [TS]

00:41:02   they had gotten a break because they [TS]

00:41:04   were buying such volume it's very costly [TS]

00:41:06   to to start all over with stuff that [TS]

00:41:08   you're going to try to make it scale you [TS]

00:41:10   know anything but so for my part like [TS]

00:41:12   the projects that i have in mind right [TS]

00:41:14   now are but I should finish my album i [TS]

00:41:19   should also finish an album of songs [TS]

00:41:23   that are different than the songs that [TS]

00:41:25   I'm making currently like an album of [TS]

00:41:28   songs that do not sound like the long [TS]

00:41:29   winters furniture she crazy my Sunday's [TS]

00:41:31   record right i should finish my book [TS]

00:41:34   about my walk across Europe please I [TS]

00:41:37   should my wife that's about that if you [TS]

00:41:39   should you know anybody who you let read [TS]

00:41:44   part of that book is like what is with [TS]

00:41:45   him [TS]

00:41:46   it's such a good book but i'm [TS]

00:41:49   sympathetic but still I should finish or [TS]

00:41:52   I should then write my book i should [TS]

00:41:56   write my theory of feminism mm which is [TS]

00:41:59   you know going to be pretty thick book [TS]

00:42:01   but it's gonna change the way we look at [TS]

00:42:03   the world i should write my book on [TS]

00:42:05   economics again massive tongue and write [TS]

00:42:13   a book on economics [TS]

00:42:14   yeah absolutely oh those are hot right [TS]

00:42:17   now I have a really good book on [TS]

00:42:18   economics that's going to blow people's [TS]

00:42:20   minds but you know it really suits the [TS]

00:42:22   hard work it requires it requires [TS]

00:42:24   research wikipedia i wouldn't heat [TS]

00:42:26   agreed at least three minions or i could [TS]

00:42:30   sit and be like what is the lab figure [TS]

00:42:33   out how much trees are worth [TS]

00:42:41   and you know and then also i have i have [TS]

00:42:46   essentially if I collected all of my [TS]

00:42:48   seattle weekly columns all the columns [TS]

00:42:51   I've written in the last couple of years [TS]

00:42:53   there is the thread of a kind of [TS]

00:42:56   rock-and-roll autobiography / you know [TS]

00:42:59   book of cultural musings i mean the the [TS]

00:43:04   the page count is already there [TS]

00:43:06   it just requires like the connective [TS]

00:43:08   tissue nice to think that yeah I know [TS]

00:43:11   right and uh and so all these things are [TS]

00:43:15   like Oh yash you know it isn't a [TS]

00:43:17   question of pick one and go [TS]

00:43:19   it is because because if I pick 1i work [TS]

00:43:22   on it for a little while and I'm like up [TS]

00:43:23   at that other thing ever and and I can [TS]

00:43:28   you know I have to imagine that that [TS]

00:43:30   that that writers have been doing this [TS]

00:43:32   for centuries right and the the [TS]

00:43:35   unpublished works of all my heroes are [TS]

00:43:38   all these like half thought-out [TS]

00:43:40   scribbles and outlines of the books that [TS]

00:43:44   they should be writing and so forth and [TS]

00:43:46   so on but you know in addition to all of [TS]

00:43:51   that work you know I have to maintain my [TS]

00:43:53   Twitter and I still haven't graduated [TS]

00:43:56   from college and other people's twitter [TS]

00:43:58   i have to maintain other people's [TS]

00:44:00   Twitter you got it you know what are you [TS]

00:44:02   going to make make corrections yeah [TS]

00:44:04   arata so I mean I obviously like I don't [TS]

00:44:10   believe that the technology isn't is a [TS]

00:44:13   is any kind of new inhibition because [TS]

00:44:17   it's just it is just given shape and a [TS]

00:44:19   different shape and form two very old [TS]

00:44:22   inhibitions are very old roadblocks in [TS]

00:44:25   between as you say the real process of [TS]

00:44:28   just what wake up in the morning and [TS]

00:44:30   writing which is which couldn't be [TS]

00:44:34   simpler and yet it's not easy it's [TS]

00:44:39   simple but it's not easy right [TS]

00:44:40   and yet each new tool i mean i remember [TS]

00:44:42   i remember WordStar and sitting and [TS]

00:44:46   working inward star and having to having [TS]

00:44:48   to remember the commands [TS]

00:44:51   for all the very simple little edits [TS]

00:44:54   that you wanted to make and you know and [TS]

00:44:58   feeling like this is better than a [TS]

00:45:02   typewriter because with a typewriter you [TS]

00:45:06   can't go back and change a whole [TS]

00:45:09   paragraph but but the the fact of a [TS]

00:45:16   typewriter is that once you write the [TS]

00:45:18   paragraph it at least as written [TS]

00:45:21   you can go back in and cross it out with [TS]

00:45:24   a red pen [TS]

00:45:25   yeah but but it's there and maybe maybe [TS]

00:45:30   two months later you come back and [TS]

00:45:31   you're like why did I cross that out [TS]

00:45:32   that was actually the the germ of a [TS]

00:45:34   great idea and in word processing [TS]

00:45:37   software you know you i will all the [TS]

00:45:39   time delete a page of stuff that is just [TS]

00:45:45   sort of deleted right i mean i guess i [TS]

00:45:48   could go back to an earlier draft but [TS]

00:45:50   never do right and a lot of times you [TS]

00:45:53   delete as you're writing and it's just [TS]

00:45:54   like nope nope nope nope nope and what [TS]

00:45:56   you end up with is what you end up with [TS]

00:45:59   and a lot of times it feels like it's [TS]

00:46:02   what you settle on rather than what you [TS]

00:46:05   rather than it being crafted [TS]

00:46:10   particularly crafted you know i have [TS]

00:46:14   i've recently gotten to be friends with [TS]

00:46:16   this guy is going to virtually [TS]

00:46:17   impossible to track his name because [TS]

00:46:19   anybody can get this guy is but he's on [TS]

00:46:22   is it [TS]

00:46:23   I you know I use this word [TS]

00:46:25   parsimoniously I think he's very [TS]

00:46:26   inspiring times yep yep he's a good man [TS]

00:46:29   now this guy is either as a webcomic [TS]

00:46:31   that he puts up every day and he's it's [TS]

00:46:34   pretty popular it's pretty super popular [TS]

00:46:36   and it's so he's just there in Photoshop [TS]

00:46:39   and makes this webcomic and he puts it [TS]

00:46:41   up you know every night by midnight and [TS]

00:46:43   that's just the thing that he does every [TS]

00:46:45   day growing it but there's so much about [TS]

00:46:48   what he does that I want to see [TS]

00:46:49   inspiring it's like I want to steal his [TS]

00:46:51   ideas for what he does [TS]

00:46:52   it's not that in that sense it's not so [TS]

00:46:54   different from blogging in some ways but [TS]

00:46:55   he has up you know a pretty rabid [TS]

00:46:57   following for his comic but like he's [TS]

00:46:59   just strikes me as such a smart guy [TS]

00:47:01   because that's if you ask what he does [TS]

00:47:03   you say all he does is comic you've [TS]

00:47:04   heard of [TS]

00:47:04   called this and he does that he puts it [TS]

00:47:06   up every night but like he really he [TS]

00:47:09   interests me because first of all he [TS]

00:47:11   does that every day which is harder than [TS]

00:47:13   it sounds having something you gotta do [TS]

00:47:15   you haven't seen the desert there's a [TS]

00:47:16   pretty good documentary recent [TS]

00:47:18   documentary called stripped it's all [TS]

00:47:20   about comic strips and making them and [TS]

00:47:22   it lots of great interviews and watching [TS]

00:47:24   people draw but its trajectory is real [TS]

00:47:26   drudgery have to you know turn in weeks [TS]

00:47:29   of Kathy or whatever like there's a lot [TS]

00:47:31   of work to it but anyhow but what so [TS]

00:47:33   that's interesting to me that he manages [TS]

00:47:35   to pull that off every day but other [TS]

00:47:37   things that appeal like you know he's [TS]

00:47:39   like a better word leverage that into [TS]

00:47:42   these other things so basically he's [TS]

00:47:44   just constantly making web comics and [TS]

00:47:47   he's making in with these characters [TS]

00:47:48   you're familiar with selected a he put a [TS]

00:47:50   post on medium he has a column [TS]

00:47:53   quote-unquote in Macworld every week one [TS]

00:47:56   of his you know cartoons is featured in [TS]

00:47:58   Macworld and but you know it all started [TS]

00:48:00   with this thing where he just had a [TS]

00:48:01   thing you put on the web and now that's [TS]

00:48:03   in turn in all those places now here's [TS]

00:48:04   the twist is that he's a very [TS]

00:48:07   frustrating character to a lot of people [TS]

00:48:08   because he I don't think he has any [TS]

00:48:11   advertising on the site if he does it's [TS]

00:48:13   just for his stuff because what he's [TS]

00:48:14   done is also built this platform of like [TS]

00:48:17   selling so many like t-shirts and coffee [TS]

00:48:19   cups and ice scrapers and stuff that [TS]

00:48:21   it's really really fun stuff that people [TS]

00:48:23   love to get and I think people that [TS]

00:48:26   makes people love him even more that [TS]

00:48:27   he's like here you like the comic don't [TS]

00:48:29   worry about the abs like by the ice [TS]

00:48:31   scraper it's a really cool ice scraper [TS]

00:48:32   and that's and that's his thing now is [TS]

00:48:34   like he's just constantly making comics [TS]

00:48:36   constantly putting them out but then his [TS]

00:48:38   whole like revenue thing is about making [TS]

00:48:40   things and selling them and either [TS]

00:48:42   something really appealing about that to [TS]

00:48:44   me at first I love the idea of making a [TS]

00:48:45   thing that you sell to people like well [TS]

00:48:47   that's a nap or whatever it is there's [TS]

00:48:49   something I have to admit a little [TS]

00:48:50   appealing to me about a physical good [TS]

00:48:51   even though God that overhead that is [TS]

00:48:53   just crazy but i don't know i find [TS]

00:48:55   something like that so inspiring were [TS]

00:48:57   like to me that's it that's a success [TS]

00:48:58   story and what the tools let us do in so [TS]

00:49:01   many ways and how the changing platform [TS]

00:49:03   hasn't left him behind because well [TS]

00:49:06   everybody's running around scrambling [TS]

00:49:07   trying to get more I mean do you ever [TS]

00:49:09   look at i don't know i read a lot on my [TS]

00:49:11   iphone and ipad read a lot of news [TS]

00:49:13   stories will follow a link somewhere and [TS]

00:49:15   you know used to joke about used to give [TS]

00:49:16   me a hard time about you know websites [TS]

00:49:18   where the content is the size of a can [TS]

00:49:20   of tuna and then it's just surrounded by [TS]

00:49:21   ads that's how I feel now I can't even [TS]

00:49:23   scroll down the page because there's [TS]

00:49:24   just so many ads on the page and the [TS]

00:49:27   irony is of course they could give a [TS]

00:49:28   flying Fig about any of those [TS]

00:49:29   advertisers they treat them all equally [TS]

00:49:31   poorly but there's something I don't [TS]

00:49:33   know I I find that really appealing [TS]

00:49:34   somebody who's been able to and he's [TS]

00:49:36   certainly not alone in that but the idea [TS]

00:49:38   of like making a little thing every day [TS]

00:49:40   putting it out and being able to do that [TS]

00:49:42   on your own not being behold in to a [TS]

00:49:45   given one source of income for what you [TS]

00:49:48   do I find that really inspiring and I [TS]

00:49:50   think it's a good example though not [TS]

00:49:52   everybody can do it but not everybody's [TS]

00:49:53   trying to do it and that's something [TS]

00:49:55   we're like he's found a way using those [TS]

00:49:56   tools the changes in the platform the [TS]

00:49:58   changes in the environment around what's [TS]

00:50:02   possible [TS]

00:50:03   I mean that would not have been [TS]

00:50:04   inconceivable to do it conceivable you [TS]

00:50:07   couldn't make money off it [TS]

00:50:08   you couldn't have made those kinds of [TS]

00:50:09   goods that quickly and sold them 10 or [TS]

00:50:11   15 years ago thats all gotten so much [TS]

00:50:13   easier we've talked about doing t-shirts [TS]

00:50:14   on demand teach we should totally do by [TS]

00:50:17   the way but I don't know I i like [TS]

00:50:19   looking at examples where that did turn [TS]

00:50:21   out well and he's constantly stressed [TS]

00:50:22   out because not stressed out but I mean [TS]

00:50:23   it's a lot of pressure to have to do [TS]

00:50:25   that everyday [TS]

00:50:26   no I don't have the pressure that I feel [TS]

00:50:28   that I'm not making stuffed his pressure [TS]

00:50:29   is that he has a thing that he makes [TS]

00:50:30   every day and then people love it and I [TS]

00:50:33   don't know something like I'm really [TS]

00:50:34   appealing about that i'm not about to [TS]

00:50:35   say that these tools don't make us [TS]

00:50:37   progressed anymore because they [TS]

00:50:38   certainly can and they can guilt us but [TS]

00:50:40   I think we need to look at people who [TS]

00:50:41   are finding a way to like have a [TS]

00:50:44   creative voice and a way to make dough [TS]

00:50:45   in a way that would be inconceivable a [TS]

00:50:48   few years ago and I think that's going [TS]

00:50:50   to change has to change even more and [TS]

00:50:52   more quickly like in the next five years [TS]

00:50:54   you know I mean well I do but but I feel [TS]

00:50:57   like and Anna and I admire your friend [TS]

00:51:00   too and and and aspire to that kind of [TS]

00:51:04   program channel envious special envious [TS]

00:51:06   though man and there and there are there [TS]

00:51:08   are innumerable examples in among our [TS]

00:51:10   friends where it's like oh I aspire to [TS]

00:51:13   to have a workflow like that person and [TS]

00:51:15   to make good stuff like that person does [TS]

00:51:18   but but i do feel like this but I feel [TS]

00:51:22   like zooming out from an economic [TS]

00:51:24   perspective or from from a larger [TS]

00:51:27   cultural perspective all right [TS]

00:51:28   look on economics it's right that really [TS]

00:51:31   what that is is returning to an almost [TS]

00:51:34   medieval economy where each person is [TS]

00:51:38   sort of carving little appleheads [TS]

00:51:42   carving you know carving little shrunken [TS]

00:51:45   appleheads and selling them up at the at [TS]

00:51:48   the fair where each we each have a [TS]

00:51:51   little booth where we are producing our [TS]

00:51:54   small little product arrowheads [TS]

00:51:57   matchbooks souvenir spoons souvenir [TS]

00:52:01   spoons and we're going out to to the to [TS]

00:52:04   the ren faire and each of us kind of you [TS]

00:52:07   know trying at even successfully making [TS]

00:52:10   a living with our little where's and [TS]

00:52:13   it's it's very different from from a [TS]

00:52:17   system whereby we are [TS]

00:52:19   I mean that for instance that is not how [TS]

00:52:21   you would build an interstate highway [TS]

00:52:22   system nor is it how you would build a [TS]

00:52:27   skyscraper or even work a farm you know [TS]

00:52:31   it is it's it's very siloed it's very [TS]

00:52:35   much not thinking of not thinking of the [TS]

00:52:41   system as a thing that we are actively [TS]

00:52:43   changing but it's just like okay this is [TS]

00:52:45   the system and hear how do i find a way [TS]

00:52:47   within it to make you know to make my [TS]

00:52:51   booth unique enough that people come [TS]

00:52:55   here and buy you know because ultimately [TS]

00:52:56   like ultimately t-shirt sales like we [TS]

00:52:59   all have all the t-shirts we need and so [TS]

00:53:03   any new t-shirt is just a tshirt up it [TS]

00:53:09   there any new t-shirt is an except as an [TS]

00:53:11   excessive t-shirt right i mean like if [TS]

00:53:13   every one of us is making a living [TS]

00:53:15   selling t-shirts it is at a certain [TS]

00:53:18   point we're going to run out of clean [TS]

00:53:20   ones I wasn't implying everyone should [TS]

00:53:21   do it all right but I mean but that but [TS]

00:53:23   this is that this is the thing about [TS]

00:53:24   this is the thing we've all experienced [TS]

00:53:26   in bands for the last ten years which is [TS]

00:53:28   like are we really in t-shirt sales is [TS]

00:53:30   that what we are that was the suggestion [TS]

00:53:32   10 years ago or would you rather be in [TS]

00:53:34   ad sales [TS]

00:53:35   well no you wouldn't but you'd rather be [TS]

00:53:37   in music sales where you are you know [TS]

00:53:40   where you're selling your music [TS]

00:53:41   and people told us in 2005 that that [TS]

00:53:45   wasn't what we could expect that anymore [TS]

00:53:48   because music should be free and if you [TS]

00:53:52   if you were really good people would [TS]

00:53:54   keep by your t-shirt and that that's [TS]

00:53:56   what you should you know that that's [TS]

00:53:59   where you should go [TS]

00:54:00   and-and-and-and all power to the all [TS]

00:54:03   power to the music is free people but I [TS]

00:54:07   but you know what I'm saying like no [TS]

00:54:08   it's not it's at that's not directed at [TS]

00:54:10   any one person and it isn't directed at [TS]

00:54:12   you and me trying to sell rock on the [TS]

00:54:14   line t-shirts because I would be [TS]

00:54:15   thrilled to do it now let's solve [TS]

00:54:16   themselves where they thought you know [TS]

00:54:18   what I mean like running on the line [TS]

00:54:19   t-shirts there's already bootleg rocker [TS]

00:54:21   milan t-shirts and I want to discourage [TS]

00:54:23   anyone that's listening to the show from [TS]

00:54:24   ever bootlegging because we're our team [TS]

00:54:27   of lawyers is going to come after you [TS]

00:54:29   like I can barracudas coming down the [TS]

00:54:31   tapers but uh you know what home t-shirt [TS]

00:54:35   making is killing podcasts but yeah but [TS]

00:54:39   but from the perspective of like well [TS]

00:54:41   what are we doing as humans where are we [TS]

00:54:43   headed what is that what is like what is [TS]

00:54:45   a our plan [TS]

00:54:48   I don't feel like the atomization of of [TS]

00:54:53   making is necessarily of step forward it [TS]

00:54:58   and maybe it is that's the thing maybe [TS]

00:55:00   maybe 10 years from now we will look [TS]

00:55:02   back and be like oh it was only through [TS]

00:55:04   the atomization of making and that that [TS]

00:55:08   the and the democratization of of [TS]

00:55:12   manufacturing I guess that we were able [TS]

00:55:16   to arrive at this next place which was [TS]

00:55:19   actually an advancement of of thinking [TS]

00:55:25   you know like an a brand new way of [TS]

00:55:27   imagining us as humans but building [TS]

00:55:32   something new / but at least for now [TS]

00:55:36   right now it just feels like okay [TS]

00:55:38   everybody's got a garage sale now like [TS]

00:55:40   we have gone we have lost our industrial [TS]

00:55:44   base we have lost a degree of collective [TS]

00:55:47   cooperative making of things [TS]

00:55:50   and now we just have 1,000,000 garage [TS]

00:55:53   sales and and we are being encouraged at [TS]

00:55:56   random and Apple or the the internet are [TS]

00:56:00   our internet overlords are encouraging [TS]

00:56:03   us to everyone of us have an etsy store [TS]

00:56:05   but that isn't like really progress [TS]

00:56:11   we're back to selling our knitting which [TS]

00:56:16   was thing that we've been doing for a [TS]

00:56:18   long long time and the fact that it's [TS]

00:56:21   not that we have a website to do it is [TS]

00:56:22   it doesn't change the fact that it's but [TS]

00:56:25   it's just knitting so yeah I mean I you [TS]

00:56:30   know that but I want a part of the thing [TS]

00:56:32   like with whether it's with gm's or GM [TS]

00:56:34   or highways or whatever it is that [TS]

00:56:35   there's not the money at an [TS]

00:56:36   institutional level that there used to [TS]

00:56:38   be two those kinds of things but I mean [TS]

00:56:40   there's so much money now more than ever [TS]

00:56:42   before all over [TS]

00:56:43   yeah i mean i-i think about like oh I [TS]

00:56:46   want to publish a book right [TS]

00:56:48   I definitely do not want to die if you [TS]

00:56:52   don't want to die unpublished I don't [TS]

00:56:53   want to die from this life without [TS]

00:56:54   having published at least one book and [TS]

00:56:58   hopefully more than one but looking at [TS]

00:57:02   my shelf of books then I'm you know that [TS]

00:57:05   I'm sitting here like lovingly like [TS]

00:57:09   calling with my eyes if i were to [TS]

00:57:13   publish a book now [TS]

00:57:14   um it it it wouldn't be like those books [TS]

00:57:20   right i think i think just as just as [TS]

00:57:24   started happening in music where people [TS]

00:57:25   are like what are you actually going to [TS]

00:57:26   make a CD or you're just going to put it [TS]

00:57:28   up online like when that became a [TS]

00:57:31   question when that became a valid [TS]

00:57:34   question [TS]

00:57:34   not not a question that you would just [TS]

00:57:36   ask abandoned thought they were going to [TS]

00:57:37   sell 500 CDs but a band that you would [TS]

00:57:40   or a question you would ask like an [TS]

00:57:42   established artists are you really going [TS]

00:57:44   to manufacture cds or you just gonna [TS]

00:57:46   just going to release it on iTunes put [TS]

00:57:48   it up online [TS]

00:57:50   it was like oh wow it's that happened so [TS]

00:57:53   fast that music went from you know that [TS]

00:57:58   that then it and then an album was [TS]

00:58:01   something that you owned and and even [TS]

00:58:05   clean took care of yeah right you know [TS]

00:58:07   cleaned and and took out and looked out [TS]

00:58:10   of the tized that it just became like [TS]

00:58:12   ours you just gonna you're just going to [TS]

00:58:14   hook it into the sea with everything [TS]

00:58:16   else and and and your music is going to [TS]

00:58:20   be valued accordingly you know you're [TS]

00:58:24   out of your new album comes out and a [TS]

00:58:26   certain small segment of people put it [TS]

00:58:28   on repeat or put it on their iPads and [TS]

00:58:32   listen to it at the gym but a lot of [TS]

00:58:34   people will you no will download one [TS]

00:58:36   song off of it listen to a once and then [TS]

00:58:39   they'll and then it's not that they [TS]

00:58:41   don't like it they downloaded they [TS]

00:58:43   listen to it they're left how people [TS]

00:58:44   consume music anymore and it just goes [TS]

00:58:46   into the things so now if you're if [TS]

00:58:48   you're like I have a new book I think [TS]

00:58:51   we're very very close to a time when the [TS]

00:58:53   question is well are you actually I mean [TS]

00:58:56   you know how expensive it is to actually [TS]

00:58:57   publish it as a book you know isn't it [TS]

00:59:00   just a kindle file and and so it isn't a [TS]

00:59:06   book you know like let's stop kidding it [TS]

00:59:08   let's stop kidding ourselves that we [TS]

00:59:10   have that bans are making albums anymore [TS]

00:59:11   they're not and let's stop kidding [TS]

00:59:13   ourselves that people are writing books [TS]

00:59:15   anymore they're not i was on an airplane [TS]

00:59:17   with them with our good friend John [TS]

00:59:20   Hodgman the other day and he was like [TS]

00:59:21   listen we're gonna go meet george RR [TS]

00:59:23   martin and you have never you've never [TS]

00:59:25   read a word of his writing and you are [TS]

00:59:27   an embarrassment to me [TS]

00:59:29   and I was like well I mean I've been [TS]

00:59:31   meaning to and he handed me his phone [TS]

00:59:34   and it was a game with he had game of [TS]

00:59:38   thrones on his phone and I was like whoa [TS]

00:59:40   you you actually read it and he was like [TS]

00:59:43   i have read it you don't do that you [TS]

00:59:46   know my books away on my phone [TS]

00:59:48   well phone iPad Mac yeah okay do not [TS]

00:59:51   know I still buy them in book form and [TS]

00:59:54   so but i'm sitting on an airplane and [TS]

00:59:56   I'm and I start to read game of thrones [TS]

00:59:58   on Hodgins phone and it [TS]

00:59:58   on Hodgins phone and it [TS]

01:00:00   it's a it's a nice like the interface is [TS]

01:00:02   nice that the it's definitely different [TS]

01:00:05   it's different but I mean but it's nice [TS]

01:00:07   because the type of the type is is big [TS]

01:00:10   it's easy to read [TS]

01:00:12   maybe maybe he gave the easy-to-read [TS]

01:00:14   version or you know the grandpa font but [TS]

01:00:19   you know you you read and then you flip [TS]

01:00:21   to the next page and each each screen is [TS]

01:00:24   much shorter than a page of typewritten [TS]

01:00:27   book writing is like a paragraph and a [TS]

01:00:31   little a paragraph in a little but that [TS]

01:00:33   but i found very quickly that that was [TS]

01:00:35   kind of an enjoyable way to read because [TS]

01:00:37   you you kind of get you have a thought [TS]

01:00:40   and then you flip to the next page and [TS]

01:00:42   you have another thought [TS]

01:00:43   and so pretty soon i'm sitting on this [TS]

01:00:44   airplane and i'm not talking to him i'm [TS]

01:00:46   reading I'm reading game of thrones on [TS]

01:00:47   his phone and by the time the plane [TS]

01:00:51   landed i had read a couple of chapters [TS]

01:00:53   and and I really enjoyed it enjoyed the [TS]

01:00:57   ease of reading it on my phone or his [TS]

01:00:59   phone and I was like okay right like I [TS]

01:01:04   can't be opposed to that because that [TS]

01:01:06   was nice that was that was pretty great [TS]

01:01:08   and it's dumb to be opposed to something [TS]

01:01:13   that is happening that's already [TS]

01:01:14   happening and its really like [TS]

01:01:16   value-neutral right it's just it's just [TS]

01:01:18   easy and it's and it's no different [TS]

01:01:21   the reading part i guess is no different [TS]

01:01:23   but when I think about like I wrote a [TS]

01:01:25   book and i am happy to publish it and [TS]

01:01:31   the fact that it's not probably going to [TS]

01:01:33   be a book an actual book or that if it [TS]

01:01:37   is it if it is an actual book it's like [TS]

01:01:39   it's like releasing records on vinyl now [TS]

01:01:42   hardcover book without a slip slip case [TS]

01:01:44   like a with that the cover on it [TS]

01:01:47   yeah that is it is stacked in a pyramid [TS]

01:01:48   in the window of a bookstore right that [TS]

01:01:51   people go in excitedly to buy it in that [TS]

01:01:54   form and carry it around in there in [TS]

01:01:57   their bag [TS]

01:01:58   and read it on park benches or whatever [TS]

01:02:00   you know that that that makes it that [TS]

01:02:04   makes me feel that makes me feel sad [TS]

01:02:05   which i think is just nostalgia or it's [TS]

01:02:08   just it's just like oh that makes me [TS]

01:02:11   feel sad well too bad but but but it [TS]

01:02:17   changes the nature of changes my feeling [TS]

01:02:20   about it in a and like a in a kind of a [TS]

01:02:24   primary way and I think it changes like [TS]

01:02:27   it [TS]

01:02:27   it shatters what it is it isn't a book [TS]

01:02:32   right [TS]

01:02:32   it's a like it is it a mean game of [TS]

01:02:37   thrones obviously was published first is [TS]

01:02:38   a book now I'm reading it on a phone but [TS]

01:02:40   if that was published today like it's a [TS]

01:02:44   novel but what is it a blog even you [TS]

01:02:48   know what I mean like yeah I think I do [TS]

01:02:49   I mean you know I've always been really [TS]

01:02:51   interested in I had a lot of friends in [TS]

01:02:53   college in particular I mean like [TS]

01:02:57   everybody I knew I kind of horrid books [TS]

01:02:58   I wanted books i want to have books [TS]

01:02:59   around I could totally round boxes from [TS]

01:03:02   place to place [TS]

01:03:03   I think it's I think it's someone [TS]

01:03:04   important one way it is i think it is [TS]

01:03:06   pretty different maybe from music and [TS]

01:03:10   maybe even comics I don't know is i [TS]

01:03:12   think there are people who like books [TS]

01:03:13   and there are people who like reading [TS]

01:03:15   and as it happens the Venn diagram for [TS]

01:03:17   that is pretty tight that the most [TS]

01:03:19   people who like reading like books and [TS]

01:03:20   most people like books like reading but [TS]

01:03:22   I mean there are I i do i have to say i [TS]

01:03:24   have a lot of friends that did say [TS]

01:03:26   they're reading more than they ever have [TS]

01:03:27   in years because they can get on a plane [TS]

01:03:29   with all of those books on it I that [TS]

01:03:33   they would never in a million years [TS]

01:03:34   truck around a candidate to flip that [TS]

01:03:36   around you know I can't say for how many [TS]

01:03:37   years I would go to books-a-million in [TS]

01:03:39   the nineties and you know pick up five [TS]

01:03:41   books and kind of glanced through the [TS]

01:03:42   first chapter of three of them maybe [TS]

01:03:44   read one of them maybe read the fifth [TS]

01:03:46   one year later like I've always really [TS]

01:03:48   loved books but you know having that at [TS]

01:03:51   at hand i don't know i mean it's it's [TS]

01:03:52   it's a different it's a different kind [TS]

01:03:54   of thing but I take your point but do [TS]

01:03:55   you feel [TS]

01:03:56   I mean I guess I guess it's the it's the [TS]

01:03:58   it's the in a way the democratization of [TS]

01:04:01   the platform right like [TS]

01:04:03   there was a there used to be a huge [TS]

01:04:06   difference between putting on a vinyl [TS]

01:04:08   record and listening to your friends [TS]

01:04:10   demo on his cassette recorder and you [TS]

01:04:15   you would you listen to your friends [TS]

01:04:17   demo on a cassette recorder need to be [TS]

01:04:18   like oh yeah yeah sounds good man your [TS]

01:04:20   band sounds great and then you would go [TS]

01:04:22   put on your vinyl record that was you [TS]

01:04:25   know that just by the format alone you [TS]

01:04:28   knew was something special and now you [TS]

01:04:33   put on your headphones he sit in front [TS]

01:04:34   of your computer and you listen to your [TS]

01:04:36   friends demo and you listen to a [TS]

01:04:38   major-label release and you can hear the [TS]

01:04:41   difference but in some cases the major [TS]

01:04:44   label releases intentionally loaf I and [TS]

01:04:47   your friends demo has been dressed up [TS]

01:04:49   with a lot of expensive sounding [TS]

01:04:52   plug-ins and it's just as over [TS]

01:04:54   compressed as top 40 that you hear on [TS]

01:04:56   the radio [TS]

01:04:57   yeah and it's like you know in a way yes [TS]

01:05:01   the the quality of the of the good stuff [TS]

01:05:03   should always win out and you should be [TS]

01:05:07   able with your eyes closed to tell the [TS]

01:05:09   difference between something really [TS]

01:05:11   wonderful and something that is just [TS]

01:05:14   made to approximate something wonderful [TS]

01:05:17   but the demo we describe the demo is [TS]

01:05:20   more like a sketch in some ways where [TS]

01:05:22   everybody knew that it wasn't the [TS]

01:05:23   finished product it was meant to be [TS]

01:05:25   something to give you the gist right [TS]

01:05:26   well and and and ultimately like for [TS]

01:05:29   that for that because the for that [TS]

01:05:31   cassette demo to make it all the way to [TS]

01:05:34   a vinyl record required as you were [TS]

01:05:37   describing so many intermediary steps [TS]

01:05:40   where it had to get where somebody had [TS]

01:05:43   to say like yes this is good enough to [TS]

01:05:44   make it to the next level and that and [TS]

01:05:47   what I remember the feeling of having a [TS]

01:05:50   cassette demo of my band and feeling [TS]

01:05:53   like there's no way we will ever make an [TS]

01:05:56   actual album we're just not good enough [TS]

01:05:58   but here we have this cassette and you [TS]

01:05:59   know like i can play it for people in a [TS]

01:06:01   party but now reading a novel on your [TS]

01:06:05   phone [TS]

01:06:06   and then using that same device to read [TS]

01:06:09   a YouTube comic comments section or [TS]

01:06:14   using your same device to read a you [TS]

01:06:17   know [TS]

01:06:17   buzzfeed ultimately you're interacting [TS]

01:06:23   with the device the same way and the [TS]

01:06:25   words look the same team and so it's a [TS]

01:06:29   very different experience of you know of [TS]

01:06:32   reading of reading everything fit [TS]

01:06:38   through the same window and I have to [TS]

01:06:43   imagine that like your brain like the [TS]

01:06:50   work of saying like oh this is thomas [TS]

01:06:52   pynchon this is good and now i'm on a [TS]

01:06:55   comment section and this is bad or this [TS]

01:06:58   is garbage right and um you will we're [TS]

01:07:03   not we're not we're not taking the [TS]

01:07:05   intermediary steps of like okay I'm you [TS]

01:07:07   know I'm not listening to talk radio [TS]

01:07:09   anymore now I'm putting the radio off [TS]

01:07:11   i'm going over I'm taking the I'm taking [TS]

01:07:14   the book down i'm changing gears I'm [TS]

01:07:16   it's just a different app essentially [TS]

01:07:19   right and so when you're when you work [TS]

01:07:21   on it when you work on a novel or a book [TS]

01:07:24   of ideas and you're like I am adding my [TS]

01:07:27   book of ideas to the world conversation [TS]

01:07:30   and people are reading your book of [TS]

01:07:32   ideas and scanned switching between [TS]

01:07:35   twitter which is a world of ideas and [TS]

01:07:39   BuzzFeed which is a world of ideas and [TS]

01:07:41   all the ideas end up kind of being in a [TS]

01:07:43   soup of ideas and it's hard to remember [TS]

01:07:47   which ones are the good ones and which [TS]

01:07:49   ones are the bad ones [TS]

01:07:51   there's no we're not allowing ourselves [TS]

01:07:56   the we're not making any word [TS]

01:08:00   privileging any ideas over any others in [TS]

01:08:04   a way even even just by format [TS]

01:08:08   I don't know it feel it feels ultimately [TS]

01:08:10   I that I have this problem all the time [TS]

01:08:12   where it's like I don't remember where i [TS]

01:08:13   read that i read that in The New Yorker [TS]

01:08:15   or did somebody did somebody comment on [TS]

01:08:19   a chem trails website up and I read it [TS]

01:08:23   there and you know nobody is chasing [TS]

01:08:27   down attributions nobody i mean III by [TS]

01:08:29   posted a carl sagan quote on my Twitter [TS]

01:08:31   the other day and yet you know [TS]

01:08:35   yes I yeah and you know like probably [TS]

01:08:39   eighty percent of the replies were like [TS]

01:08:41   wow amazing and then ten percent of the [TS]

01:08:45   replies work that's probably a fake [TS]

01:08:46   quote because generally any time [TS]

01:08:49   somebody says something really smart and [TS]

01:08:51   appreciates it turns out that it's fake [TS]

01:08:54   and then ten percent of the people who [TS]

01:08:59   labored to explain to me how Carl Sagan [TS]

01:09:02   could not actually see into the future [TS]

01:09:04   but all of his observations were obvious [TS]

01:09:07   and not an elite unit that's the girl [TS]

01:09:12   saying quote right and so all the people [TS]

01:09:15   are like wow amazing I mean that was the [TS]

01:09:19   that was the the response i was trying [TS]

01:09:24   to solicit but my Carl second quote on [TS]

01:09:28   my Twitter was probably just one of like [TS]

01:09:31   40 quotes that they read up between [TS]

01:09:34   Facebook and wherever else they go and [TS]

01:09:36   all of them are while amazing and all [TS]

01:09:39   them completely out of context and then [TS]

01:09:42   it was hilarious to me the people who [TS]

01:09:45   believed who were chastising me for [TS]

01:09:49   posting a fake quote the app that wasn't [TS]

01:09:51   actually fake they didn't take the to [TS]

01:09:53   check a check it down [TS]

01:09:55   I did track you down and I reply to [TS]

01:09:56   those people at least a couple of them [TS]

01:09:58   until i got bored of doing that saying [TS]

01:10:00   like here's you know here's the [TS]

01:10:02   attribution of the quote it's actually a [TS]

01:10:03   quote from a book [TS]

01:10:05   but the best ones where the people who [TS]

01:10:07   somehow mistook me saying like wow carl [TS]

01:10:12   sagan could see into the future mistook [TS]

01:10:15   that as me actually saying I believe [TS]

01:10:17   that Carl Sagan could see the future you [TS]

01:10:21   know like um like they didn't they [TS]

01:10:26   didn't perceive that I was saying [TS]

01:10:28   not that he could see the future but [TS]

01:10:31   that but that isn't this it is an [TS]

01:10:33   interesting remark [TS]

01:10:34   isn't this interesting isn't this an [TS]

01:10:36   interesting remark it seems it seems to [TS]

01:10:40   apply to us now and I mean if I had read [TS]

01:10:44   that in a book instead of reading it [TS]

01:10:47   instead of like scraping it off with [TS]

01:10:49   somebody else's twitter feed and [TS]

01:10:50   repurposing it meeting somebody else [TS]

01:10:54   it's photoshopped image taken quote [TS]

01:10:58   gravitas if you read in the book I feel [TS]

01:11:02   like it by and ready to begin to put it [TS]

01:11:04   on your Pinterest but you know what [TS]

01:11:06   maybe i would never maybe in my whole [TS]

01:11:07   life I never would've read that book [TS]

01:11:09   yeah so and right now I couldn't could [TS]

01:11:13   tell you contain thing about that quote [TS]

01:11:15   likely that was Mark Twain it's in the [TS]

01:11:17   past that goes Eleanor Roosevelt group [TS]

01:11:19   up i'm so sick of myself [TS]

01:11:25   that journey [TS]