Roderick on the Line

Ep. 111: "The Handjob-Industrial Complex"


00:00:00   this episode of rock on the line is [TS]

00:00:01   sponsored by Squarespace the only one [TS]

00:00:03   platform that makes it fast and easy to [TS]

00:00:05   create your own professional website [TS]

00:00:06   portfolio or online store for your free [TS]

00:00:10   trial plus ten percent of anything you [TS]

00:00:12   by visit squarespace.com and enter the [TS]

00:00:14   offer code supertrain at checkout a [TS]

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00:00:19   [Music] [TS]

00:00:24   hello hi John hi Merlin how's it going [TS]

00:00:28   pretty good how are you going [TS]

00:00:30   ah I'm impressed mm okay i'm impressed [TS]

00:00:35   I'm impressed because you're a man who [TS]

00:00:38   leaves the house and the vehicle you go [TS]

00:00:40   places and you do things you spend your [TS]

00:00:42   morning and your afternoon doing things [TS]

00:00:44   and then you show up early for a podcast [TS]

00:00:46   recording isn't that something I how do [TS]

00:00:48   you do it [TS]

00:00:49   not only that but there was a truck fire [TS]

00:00:51   on the interstate [TS]

00:00:53   mmm there are a lot of trucks on the [TS]

00:00:55   interstate at two o'clock in the [TS]

00:00:56   afternoon that seems to be high truck [TS]

00:00:58   hour but there was a dump truck bed [TS]

00:01:01   rolled over and spilled diesel fuel all [TS]

00:01:03   over the interstate and burned itself [TS]

00:01:06   I mean burned itself kind of completely [TS]

00:01:07   up ok presented a scenario where that [TS]

00:01:11   would have never happened [TS]

00:01:13   yeah if it had been on a train thank you [TS]

00:01:17   thank you [TS]

00:01:18   although trains do sometimes crash and [TS]

00:01:20   burn yeah but they crashed scale you get [TS]

00:01:22   all that's right that's right it's like [TS]

00:01:25   dying on Christmas at all you get jammed [TS]

00:01:27   all into one thing [TS]

00:01:28   yeah well and usually when a train [TS]

00:01:29   crashes it also has some tanks of like [TS]

00:01:32   you know liquids sulfuric acid or [TS]

00:01:35   something they have to evacuate an [TS]

00:01:36   entire town of bread and circuses that's [TS]

00:01:38   what I see you give them a spectacle i [TS]

00:01:41   was I went downtown today and park in a [TS]

00:01:43   parking garage that right at noon to [TS]

00:01:47   three things I never do [TS]

00:01:49   and although I guess at noon isn't a [TS]

00:01:51   thing but I went downtown at noon that's [TS]

00:01:54   the thing i did try never to do and I [TS]

00:01:55   parked in a parking garage the two [TS]

00:01:57   things I never do [TS]

00:01:58   and by the time I reach the seventh [TS]

00:02:01   floor of the parking garage and had not [TS]

00:02:03   found an empty spot I realized something [TS]

00:02:08   i guess it never and never fully [TS]

00:02:11   occurred to me like the dirty secret of [TS]

00:02:15   cities that they are hiding all of these [TS]

00:02:17   cars in these like car hives and in the [TS]

00:02:24   more this is the reason that in the [TS]

00:02:25   morning in the afternoon there are these [TS]

00:02:26   tens of thousands of cars that are [TS]

00:02:28   normally on the roads but like everybody [TS]

00:02:31   drives into town and they pack into [TS]

00:02:32   these hives i'm jon was just driving [TS]

00:02:35   through this parking garage [TS]

00:02:36   and I was I was realizing like oh wow [TS]

00:02:39   this is really the problem this is [TS]

00:02:42   astonishing that we think this is a good [TS]

00:02:46   system its each one of these cars [TS]

00:02:49   represents like one person making it [TS]

00:02:51   from their house to their place to their [TS]

00:02:54   job every one of these people is [TS]

00:02:56   probably paying thirty dollars a day to [TS]

00:02:58   park here and it's just like this [TS]

00:03:02   extraordinary ways to resources and [TS]

00:03:07   people's time and energy and all this [TS]

00:03:09   like space they had to build the hold [TS]

00:03:11   all these cars and just every aspect of [TS]

00:03:13   it is a is a colossal hilarious waste [TS]

00:03:17   and you know because it's behind kind of [TS]

00:03:22   a wall of you know like a it's just [TS]

00:03:24   packed in there in such a way that I not [TS]

00:03:27   just me but we all walk through the city [TS]

00:03:29   just kinda blissfully unaware that we [TS]

00:03:31   are everyday linkle loading these silos [TS]

00:03:34   up and I mean I guess if you work [TS]

00:03:37   downtown you're not unaware this is the [TS]

00:03:39   rest of the world you live in but right [TS]

00:03:41   but it is looking at they live situation [TS]

00:03:43   where like you just stop for a second [TS]

00:03:46   and you look at you go this is crazy and [TS]

00:03:49   it's always on the edge you notice that [TS]

00:03:51   when a truck goes up right but like that [TS]

00:03:53   does anybody ever get to work like half [TS]

00:03:55   an hour early and get the first space [TS]

00:03:57   and go i feel refreshed [TS]

00:03:59   haha well and it's so it's so ad hoc [TS]

00:04:03   that's the amazing thing you know it's [TS]

00:04:04   like why is this the system [TS]

00:04:06   well because every time there was a [TS]

00:04:08   problem somebody fixed the immediate [TS]

00:04:11   problem by building a new on-ramp by [TS]

00:04:16   building a new building a new parking [TS]

00:04:18   garage like at each step of the way we [TS]

00:04:21   solved the most immediate problem like [TS]

00:04:25   how I have to go to work downtown but my [TS]

00:04:27   wife has to go to work four blocks from [TS]

00:04:30   there [TS]

00:04:31   well we gotta get two cars right you [TS]

00:04:33   know like they saw everybody is solving [TS]

00:04:36   the problem right in front of themselves [TS]

00:04:38   and there is no there's no collective [TS]

00:04:41   problem-solving there's no collective [TS]

00:04:43   thinking in in the system really at all [TS]

00:04:47   you've really got me thinking about that [TS]

00:04:49   a lot in [TS]

00:04:49   it's probably dangerous in the last few [TS]

00:04:52   weeks talking about you know the systems [TS]

00:04:53   in the grades and I i totally agree with [TS]

00:04:55   you and because you know again say I say [TS]

00:04:58   it's like they live because they all you [TS]

00:05:00   really need you put on the glasses and [TS]

00:05:01   suddenly you can see you know what's [TS]

00:05:03   really going on and you but you're right [TS]

00:05:06   i mean most of what's happening if you [TS]

00:05:08   really really turbo way up a lot of our [TS]

00:05:10   jobs are probably useless but even if [TS]

00:05:11   they aren't using let's say they are [TS]

00:05:12   useless against probably do it mostly [TS]

00:05:14   from your house wanted absolutely what I [TS]

00:05:17   wouldn't have most people's jobs are [TS]

00:05:18   like move this file into that file type [TS]

00:05:22   thing it's all typing right they say [TS]

00:05:24   we're all just typing different things [TS]

00:05:26   and I mean you when you think about that [TS]

00:05:28   i mean this was the promise this was the [TS]

00:05:30   promise of industrialization this was [TS]

00:05:32   the promise of of technology was that we [TS]

00:05:36   would be freed from all this meaningless [TS]

00:05:38   labor right if you if you go back a [TS]

00:05:41   hundred years and you and you imagine [TS]

00:05:43   what they thought technology was going [TS]

00:05:45   to provide it was always the technology [TS]

00:05:48   would provide leisure we were going to [TS]

00:05:50   be living in a in an environmental like [TS]

00:05:53   decoteau Pia right where where what we [TS]

00:05:57   would have to work one or two hours a [TS]

00:05:58   day and the rest of the time we would be [TS]

00:06:00   like in pedal-powered dirigibles like [TS]

00:06:03   flying around the park to learning [TS]

00:06:06   languages and writing classical music [TS]

00:06:08   most yeah yeah [TS]

00:06:09   thank you it would be it would be like [TS]

00:06:10   uh it would be like the it would be like [TS]

00:06:13   Spain under the Moors Pax Romana [TS]

00:06:15   everybody would everybody would speak [TS]

00:06:18   six different languages that you know [TS]

00:06:20   the Jews would be getting along with the [TS]

00:06:22   Zoroastrians it was like a perfect [TS]

00:06:25   system [TS]

00:06:25   yeah and instead what what we have done [TS]

00:06:28   again just because of this ad hoc [TS]

00:06:31   individualism is we've with all the [TS]

00:06:36   technology all we have done is create [TS]

00:06:38   more and more anxiety and more and more [TS]

00:06:40   work but uh huh but like busywork busy [TS]

00:06:43   work busy with sing it sister and then [TS]

00:06:45   you gotta send him you gotta send an [TS]

00:06:46   email about how you can't drive to [TS]

00:06:48   someplace on time [TS]

00:06:49   oh my god I'm driving I'm driving with [TS]

00:06:51   one hand i'm texting with another guy [TS]

00:06:53   gotta post to facebook video of burning [TS]

00:06:56   truck right so then I'm the problem [TS]

00:06:58   you're not an animal [TS]

00:06:59   where's my parade i hear ya [TS]

00:07:01   so yeah it's just insane I'm not a [TS]

00:07:03   historian but there's an analogy people [TS]

00:07:05   use for lots of different things [TS]

00:07:06   especially things like old computer code [TS]

00:07:08   they refer to it as being like the city [TS]

00:07:10   of Rome where there's never gonna be [TS]

00:07:11   like a great day to just start over you [TS]

00:07:13   know really Manhattan's like this in a [TS]

00:07:15   lot of ways just keep building you have [TS]

00:07:17   some system that barely barely works at [TS]

00:07:19   doing something we needed 50 years ago [TS]

00:07:21   for a hundred years ago and you update [TS]

00:07:24   that a little bit and then you put some [TS]

00:07:26   patches on it and you hack on the little [TS]

00:07:28   bit and you add a new lane but it's [TS]

00:07:30   still the same completely screwed up [TS]

00:07:31   system and there's never a good day to [TS]

00:07:34   just start over and install pneumatic [TS]

00:07:35   tubes which is what we really need [TS]

00:07:37   well we talked about this i think a long [TS]

00:07:39   time ago in 1999 when my mom started [TS]

00:07:42   getting all these phone calls from from [TS]

00:07:45   companies who were like listen we're [TS]

00:07:48   still running the software that you [TS]

00:07:49   wrote in 1968 and nobody knows how to [TS]

00:07:53   nobody knows how to fix it right and [TS]

00:07:56   we'll pay you any amount of money to [TS]

00:07:58   come back and just let us then figure [TS]

00:08:00   out how to insert a 444 numeral date [TS]

00:08:06   code because all of the banks are going [TS]

00:08:08   to stop working and my mom was like [TS]

00:08:10   there is no amount of money that would [TS]

00:08:12   entice me back in like know and and it [TS]

00:08:17   turned out like it it didn't all come to [TS]

00:08:20   a screeching halt [TS]

00:08:21   but but the awareness i had at them at [TS]

00:08:24   that time that so much of American [TS]

00:08:27   industry was still running on patched-up [TS]

00:08:30   forty-year-old fortran code was I mean [TS]

00:08:35   cobol or whatever machining and that's [TS]

00:08:39   and that's why I think with the the way [TS]

00:08:41   that you least historically have heard [TS]

00:08:43   that city of room metaphor applied most [TS]

00:08:45   often to no surprise here the air [TS]

00:08:47   traffic control systems Jesus which you [TS]

00:08:50   know what I mean you know I see this at [TS]

00:08:52   my bank where when i go into my bank if [TS]

00:08:54   I need to get like a cashier's check or [TS]

00:08:56   something it looks like a boss that [TS]

00:08:59   they're using on [TS]

00:09:00   well I know what I would I worry about [TS]

00:09:03   or what not what I guess it's not a [TS]

00:09:05   worry but I look at that and then I [TS]

00:09:07   think okay how is this a metaphor for my [TS]

00:09:10   personal life [TS]

00:09:11   like they're mi I'm ad hoc solving [TS]

00:09:14   problems in my own life at every turn [TS]

00:09:17   and if i look at my whole if i look at [TS]

00:09:20   the way I live and my goals and my [TS]

00:09:23   dreams like what if I stripped away all [TS]

00:09:27   the all of the infrastructure i think [TS]

00:09:30   i've built and really imagine like what [TS]

00:09:34   do I want to do what would I do with my [TS]

00:09:37   day if I had no if I had no operatory a [TS]

00:09:43   premise about how a day had to look even [TS]

00:09:46   so Part B saying kind of like you know [TS]

00:09:49   there's all the stuff we have to do this [TS]

00:09:50   just kind of the overhead of doing [TS]

00:09:52   grown-up stuff which you could certainly [TS]

00:09:54   use called busy work stuff that feels [TS]

00:09:56   like kind of a waste of time [TS]

00:09:58   like if you could remove all of that [TS]

00:10:00   friction would you be able to make your [TS]

00:10:03   own personal Pax Romana would you be [TS]

00:10:04   able to like become a great man and this [TS]

00:10:06   and this I feel is like is is maybe the [TS]

00:10:09   the lie of modernity the idea that we [TS]

00:10:16   are all philosopher Kings the more [TS]

00:10:19   leisure time people have the more it is [TS]

00:10:24   revealed that we do not have boundless [TS]

00:10:28   imaginations we do not know what to do [TS]

00:10:31   with leisure because we are beasts of [TS]

00:10:33   burden by construction we are meant to [TS]

00:10:37   we are meant to live nasty brutish and [TS]

00:10:42   short lives because we are well we are [TS]

00:10:48   big monkey's said before like all the [TS]

00:10:52   leisure in the world produces a reality [TS]

00:10:57   television or it produces a culture of [TS]

00:11:00   gaming that at the surface of it like [TS]

00:11:04   you know I hate to ever go on the record [TS]

00:11:07   in any way criticizing gaming mm because [TS]

00:11:11   my god you get I mean you know I i got [TS]

00:11:14   some angry letters about a podcast we [TS]

00:11:17   did a couple of weeks ago where I said I [TS]

00:11:19   don't even remember what I said but I [TS]

00:11:20   said one charitable thing about China [TS]

00:11:23   and it inflamed been innocent and a joke [TS]

00:11:27   what's that people get mad when you say [TS]

00:11:29   even one nice thing about China [TS]

00:11:31   well I think I think China there are [TS]

00:11:32   some people out there for whom china is [TS]

00:11:35   a trigger word that day whatever siloed [TS]

00:11:38   they're living in like like chinese that [TS]

00:11:42   they're convinced that china is like the [TS]

00:11:44   the inheritor of every sort of fascist [TS]

00:11:48   trope and so you can't say a nice thing [TS]

00:11:51   about China because China yeah [TS]

00:11:53   chemtrails but it but boy if you start [TS]

00:11:57   to talk about game [TS]

00:11:58   yeah and say I say a bad thing about [TS]

00:12:00   gaming you get all this money because [TS]

00:12:02   the gamers have spent 40 years defending [TS]

00:12:05   themselves against the PMRC or the for [TS]

00:12:09   their moms and dads or whatever [TS]

00:12:11   everybody going to another kind of civil [TS]

00:12:13   rights almost yeah everybody had a [TS]

00:12:15   hard-on for gaming for so long that the [TS]

00:12:16   gamers are like really have their [TS]

00:12:19   hackles up but also have their like 25 [TS]

00:12:21   lines of defense about how ballad and [TS]

00:12:24   valuable gaming is but in fact it is [TS]

00:12:27   games it is adult games it is like it is [TS]

00:12:32   like playing twister really like it and [TS]

00:12:34   I don't know and maybe it is an entire [TS]

00:12:37   world in a virtual world and a fantastic [TS]

00:12:39   environment to play in but it's the [TS]

00:12:41   holodeck and that's what we're doing [TS]

00:12:45   with our with with are acquired leisure [TS]

00:12:48   like that is that is the benefit that is [TS]

00:12:51   that's how we're spending our savings [TS]

00:12:54   that we have that we are like mining the [TS]

00:12:58   mining the earth like stripping it bear [TS]

00:13:01   and filling the skies full of smoke in [TS]

00:13:04   order that we not have to like do [TS]

00:13:08   admittedly the like difficult work of [TS]

00:13:10   farming for ourselves [TS]

00:13:14   yeah like pulling a ho or whatever and [TS]

00:13:16   and so we don't have to pull a hoe [TS]

00:13:18   anymore and we have the leisure now to [TS]

00:13:22   like put our headphones on and stare at [TS]

00:13:25   a at like a virtual space and and and [TS]

00:13:29   hop around it with our virtual little [TS]

00:13:32   man [TS]

00:13:33   no you're on your own on this one our [TS]

00:13:36   little man fills your little man goes [TS]

00:13:38   there but it's a little shooting fish in [TS]

00:13:39   a barrel i will say also that you know [TS]

00:13:42   you're just you're just mad but [TS]

00:13:43   somebody's gonna send you a really [TS]

00:13:45   really long essay John is the official [TS]

00:13:48   recipient for all notes on these things [TS]

00:13:50   he enjoys getting them this episode of [TS]

00:13:52   Roderick on the line is sponsored by [TS]

00:13:54   Squarespace beyond the one platform that [TS]

00:13:56   makes it fast and easy to create your [TS]

00:13:58   own professional website portfolio or [TS]

00:14:00   online store [TS]

00:14:01   you may not even realize it but you are [TS]

00:14:03   using square space right now because [TS]

00:14:04   John and I have hosted Roderick on the [TS]

00:14:06   line since day one they have been great [TS]

00:14:08   to us listen guys I'm not the sharpest [TS]

00:14:10   tool in the shed this morning I almost [TS]

00:14:12   gave my daughter a glass of [TS]

00:14:13   half-and-half and I later tried to buy a [TS]

00:14:15   cup of coffee with my muni card i'm not [TS]

00:14:17   a gifted man but even i can use [TS]

00:14:19   Squarespace because they make this whole [TS]

00:14:21   process so simple they offer an easy [TS]

00:14:23   drag-and-drop interface with beautiful [TS]

00:14:25   free templates you can tweak to suit [TS]

00:14:27   your needs all the designs responsive so [TS]

00:14:29   they look great on every device ever get [TS]

00:14:31   stuck [TS]

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00:14:34   seven support through dedicated teams in [TS]

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00:14:38   part [TS]

00:14:38   Squarespace plans started eight dollars [TS]

00:14:40   a month and that includes a free domain [TS]

00:14:42   name if you sign up for a year which i [TS]

00:14:44   highly recommend every plan comes with [TS]

00:14:46   the ability to create your own online [TS]

00:14:47   store so you can sell the stuff you make [TS]

00:14:49   right from your very own site so whether [TS]

00:14:51   you're a podcaster musician a writer and [TS]

00:14:54   photographer or just a fan of [TS]

00:14:55   half-and-half please do check out [TS]

00:14:56   Squarespace and tell them you heard [TS]

00:14:58   about it from Roderick on the line in [TS]

00:15:00   fact you'll get a free trial plus ten [TS]

00:15:02   percent off anything you buy by using [TS]

00:15:04   the special offer code supertrain at [TS]

00:15:06   checkout our thanks to squarespace for [TS]

00:15:08   supporting Roderick online we could not [TS]

00:15:10   do it without this but you know but I [TS]

00:15:12   mean we talked about the social meeting [TS]

00:15:13   joked about having to take a video of a [TS]

00:15:16   fire i do think there is i was talking [TS]

00:15:18   to some of the day about about facebook [TS]

00:15:20   and i always feel like I'm a little bit [TS]

00:15:22   in danger of trying of sounding like a [TS]

00:15:25   nut [TS]

00:15:26   not because I don't do facebook because [TS]

00:15:29   i have to remind people I actually do [TS]

00:15:31   have to remind people that i am one of [TS]

00:15:33   the hill people I'm not no I'm not on [TS]

00:15:35   Facebook and I I don't have that strong [TS]

00:15:37   opinion about it because it's just [TS]

00:15:39   something I don't do I mean I had a [TS]

00:15:40   stronger opinion about it when I felt [TS]

00:15:42   the pressure to have to do stuff with [TS]

00:15:43   facebook but now that i am one of the [TS]

00:15:44   hill people [TS]

00:15:45   the pressure is not there but i think [TS]

00:15:46   all [TS]

00:15:47   that stuff it does create a kind of real [TS]

00:15:49   anxiety that it's almost like if you [TS]

00:15:51   said your dog like you need to relax you [TS]

00:15:54   should start larping and they would go [TS]

00:15:56   like now I'd really just really got me [TS]

00:15:57   nervous about who's the leader out on [TS]

00:15:59   the streets right now because that's [TS]

00:16:00   more in my nature but that same kind of [TS]

00:16:03   picmonkey drive that would lead a dog [TS]

00:16:06   not to go out and play the Indian the [TS]

00:16:07   woods you know today I think that you [TS]

00:16:10   can find anxiety or social pressure and [TS]

00:16:12   almost anything nowadays and this is to [TS]

00:16:14   me what makes the work of rowdy roddy [TS]

00:16:15   piper so poignant even today [TS]

00:16:17   mmm i really do it's a hell of a movie I [TS]

00:16:20   did is a great movie and you know Robin [TS]

00:16:22   Goldwater's father played a starring [TS]

00:16:24   role dimensional why don't you you're [TS]

00:16:27   not hip to this she tell me this is he [TS]

00:16:28   the gang fights has a 10-minute fight [TS]

00:16:30   scene with him wasn't him [TS]

00:16:32   okay Goldie status is a is the is the [TS]

00:16:35   guy he's like the he's brought Roddy [TS]

00:16:38   Piper's guide guide through to the to [TS]

00:16:42   the new is Morpheus way of seeing ya its [TS]

00:16:44   is Morpheus will cover this a little [TS]

00:16:46   what we cut all this out we'll cover [TS]

00:16:48   this on her side i love doctor about [TS]

00:16:50   that but I feel like anxiety is the it's [TS]

00:16:53   the glue that holds us all together now [TS]

00:16:55   you know anxiety is the is the is the [TS]

00:16:59   thing that Don Draper figured out sold [TS]

00:17:02   us toothpaste anxiety is the thing that [TS]

00:17:04   the that the military-industrial complex [TS]

00:17:06   figured out kept us pouring money into [TS]

00:17:08   you know into their black projects [TS]

00:17:11   anxiety is the thing that keeps us [TS]

00:17:14   getting married to one another it get it [TS]

00:17:17   is the it's the glue that holds us [TS]

00:17:20   together as a society and again because [TS]

00:17:23   every one of those things was everything [TS]

00:17:26   one of those things was that was a [TS]

00:17:28   solution to a problem that was right in [TS]

00:17:31   front of us and there was you know I not [TS]

00:17:35   mean the conspiracists want us to think [TS]

00:17:37   that there's somebody or somebodies who [TS]

00:17:41   have a big plan [TS]

00:17:42   who but to whatever degree there is a [TS]

00:17:46   system it is a patchwork quilt of of [TS]

00:17:50   small individuated like rubber [TS]

00:17:58   patches on where the tire kept blowing [TS]

00:18:01   out right and it's just like okay so now [TS]

00:18:04   we're living in this world and and the [TS]

00:18:07   the the degree to which things work in [TS]

00:18:10   concert with one another is largely [TS]

00:18:13   either happenstance or it's just this [TS]

00:18:18   thing was right next to that thing so we [TS]

00:18:20   made the gears the same ratio but the [TS]

00:18:23   two things the two things work you know [TS]

00:18:26   but do they like we get five things [TS]

00:18:28   working together and we think that we [TS]

00:18:30   are really building something but does [TS]

00:18:33   that little ball fit into this you know [TS]

00:18:36   the the giant ball pit of other little [TS]

00:18:38   fiefdoms like none of it does really I i [TS]

00:18:42   think i think you're right in a when you [TS]

00:18:44   think I hate to put on my future's hat [TS]

00:18:47   but you know one of the things that [TS]

00:18:49   makes it makes it so damn difficult to [TS]

00:18:52   try to figure out what's going to happen [TS]

00:18:53   in the future because we have so much of [TS]

00:18:55   what we know is based on the past and [TS]

00:18:57   trying to fix like I say trying to fix a [TS]

00:18:58   fifty-year-old problem with something [TS]

00:19:00   innovative that you know get that thing [TS]

00:19:02   fixed like I remember when I first heard [TS]

00:19:04   the John Lennon had a record player in [TS]

00:19:05   his rolls-royce it seemed like the [TS]

00:19:07   coolest thing in the world but in [TS]

00:19:08   retrospect it seems very very strange [TS]

00:19:10   you know certainly luxurious but but [TS]

00:19:13   there's there's one thing of all that [TS]

00:19:14   you think think back to all of the [TS]

00:19:17   novels and films as just of all the [TS]

00:19:22   popular media about what computers were [TS]

00:19:24   going to mean to people i mean and his [TS]

00:19:26   recent if you like last night's mad men [TS]

00:19:27   but you know people have for many many [TS]

00:19:30   years wondered and worried about what [TS]

00:19:33   parts of our lives [TS]

00:19:34   computers are going to replace and we [TS]

00:19:37   obviously in science fiction things like [TS]

00:19:38   what happens when they become too [TS]

00:19:39   intelligent and and so forth [TS]

00:19:41   the one part of that it's still really [TS]

00:19:43   resonates with me though is that as more [TS]

00:19:45   things get automated it does start to [TS]

00:19:47   feel a little bit like a Woody Allen [TS]

00:19:48   movie from the seventies or something [TS]

00:19:50   like if I i had to change i had had a [TS]

00:19:52   charge on my mobile phone bill that was [TS]

00:19:56   only removable by calling them so [TS]

00:20:00   there's some kinds of things you can add [TS]

00:20:01   on the website [TS]

00:20:03   I i recently we know we did we haven't [TS]

00:20:05   had our actual cable TV box for example [TS]

00:20:08   connected to the modem for my [TS]

00:20:11   it's and I've been paying for this and [TS]

00:20:12   finally I'm not only combination why [TS]

00:20:14   don't I just call them into this so but [TS]

00:20:15   but in cases of my phone company i had [TS]

00:20:18   to call them and like sit through a [TS]

00:20:20   pitch for getting home internet and why [TS]

00:20:22   wouldn't I want this service but and in [TS]

00:20:24   the case of like for example with with [TS]

00:20:26   my cable company i gotta return the [TS]

00:20:28   modem I got to have a big discussion [TS]

00:20:29   with them about this and why I'm not [TS]

00:20:30   enjoying television and things like that [TS]

00:20:32   and in that case in both of those cases [TS]

00:20:34   i got good people to talk to [TS]

00:20:36   but the one thing that still carries [TS]

00:20:38   over from that fear of depersonalization [TS]

00:20:40   dehumanization the computers in AI we're [TS]

00:20:43   gonna bring is the sense that i don't [TS]

00:20:45   really there's not really an effective [TS]

00:20:46   place to turn for almost anything sort [TS]

00:20:49   of to your thing about like if you find [TS]

00:20:50   the person with the juice that can help [TS]

00:20:51   you out but I had a hundred-dollar [TS]

00:20:53   charge every month on my phone bill and [TS]

00:20:55   I have to call and like persuade them [TS]

00:20:58   that this was something I didn't want to [TS]

00:20:59   have any more even though i have been [TS]

00:21:00   out of the country in like a year and [TS]

00:21:03   and in both of those cases will [TS]

00:21:05   why didn't I call them when I just call [TS]

00:21:06   comcast the first time it occurred to me [TS]

00:21:08   that I wasn't watching TV and I was [TS]

00:21:10   spending twenty dollars a month editing [TS]

00:21:11   or whatever it was [TS]

00:21:12   why don't I call it a hundred dollars [TS]

00:21:13   month that's asinine because I know I'm [TS]

00:21:16   already dreading that's the anxiety [TS]

00:21:18   there is a thread of having to call and [TS]

00:21:20   sit and find out how many minutes it is [TS]

00:21:22   until the call will be important to them [TS]

00:21:24   and and so on and so forth and I think [TS]

00:21:26   that's still very real [TS]

00:21:27   there's still a lot of self editing [TS]

00:21:28   self-censorship along the lines of if [TS]

00:21:31   you like big brother or like that camera [TS]

00:21:32   doesn't even need to be on all the time [TS]

00:21:34   i will create all the anxiety needed by [TS]

00:21:36   my fear of having to interact with that [TS]

00:21:37   system having to call about something [TS]

00:21:39   broken that like I don't even know if [TS]

00:21:41   that sense now i'm in Brazil and worried [TS]

00:21:43   that Bob Hoskins is going to come in [TS]

00:21:45   there and make it worse right [TS]

00:21:46   yeah they create as they create a mental [TS]

00:21:49   landscape where you pick up the phone [TS]

00:21:51   you are gonna then enter into like of a [TS]

00:21:55   enter into a virtual world to bring you [TS]

00:21:58   care brand experience environment [TS]

00:22:00   yeah right or you cannot see the horizon [TS]

00:22:01   and you're walking and you hear your [TS]

00:22:04   voice echoing and you're like hello it's [TS]

00:22:06   a lot like Las Vegas is like a casino [TS]

00:22:08   without drinks loc in this room with no [TS]

00:22:10   windows and clocks that you can't get [TS]

00:22:12   out of your right and you get your [TS]

00:22:13   hearing ticking but there's also like so [TS]

00:22:16   there's some distant music playing [TS]

00:22:17   you're navigating around its kind of [TS]

00:22:19   foggy in there you're navigating around [TS]

00:22:21   all these little minor obstacles [TS]

00:22:23   and you don't there's no exit door or [TS]

00:22:25   you see an exit door but it just it [TS]

00:22:27   turns into it's just it disappears in [TS]

00:22:29   the fog and I don't think that was I [TS]

00:22:31   don't think there was any brain trust [TS]

00:22:33   that envisioned that as a solution to [TS]

00:22:36   their customer service issues I think [TS]

00:22:39   they just happened upon it like wow look [TS]

00:22:41   at this [TS]

00:22:42   we only have five operators and there [TS]

00:22:44   are 50 people waiting to be helped and [TS]

00:22:47   like 45 of them will just sit there [TS]

00:22:50   forever [TS]

00:22:51   so what wow that's what is that it is [TS]

00:22:54   like a video game what you're describing [TS]

00:22:55   is like a video game though in that [TS]

00:22:57   sense that like I'm not that good at [TS]

00:22:58   video games and I know I'm not and I [TS]

00:23:00   know that when I get into that system [TS]

00:23:02   there's a chance that i will hit the [TS]

00:23:04   wrong button and i will end up somewhere [TS]

00:23:06   where I can't get out and the call will [TS]

00:23:08   disconnect and i'll have to start over [TS]

00:23:09   and over the dial and we're all that and [TS]

00:23:11   i might be alone i might be the only [TS]

00:23:13   lunatic in the world that sits around [TS]

00:23:15   and fear of having to make that call but [TS]

00:23:16   I am fear of that call and I hate [TS]

00:23:18   getting to the point where i can hit two [TS]

00:23:19   or do nothing [TS]

00:23:21   yeah oh my god well and I'm sure as I'm [TS]

00:23:24   sitting here thinking I'm I'm realizing [TS]

00:23:26   like this is what was so brilliant about [TS]

00:23:28   the set design of Blade Runner and Star [TS]

00:23:31   Wars both because both of those if you [TS]

00:23:34   think about the Millennium Falcon and [TS]

00:23:36   the way the Millennium Falcon is [TS]

00:23:37   designed it is it's built in such a way [TS]

00:23:42   that you see you see that it has evolved [TS]

00:23:46   from earlier ships to solve problems [TS]

00:23:50   like the Millennium Falcon is not an [TS]

00:23:52   elegant design it is a design it's an [TS]

00:23:56   ad-hoc design and over time you can kind [TS]

00:24:01   of imagine the evolution of us of a of a [TS]

00:24:04   freighter of a spaceship and this is [TS]

00:24:08   what they came up with like the Death [TS]

00:24:10   Star is basically just a speck if when [TS]

00:24:13   you get in close to it it's a thousand [TS]

00:24:16   little condos [TS]

00:24:18   you know it's like a thousand little [TS]

00:24:19   town houses and condos and bullshit [TS]

00:24:21   little towers at least it basically [TS]

00:24:24   looks like daly city in space [TS]

00:24:26   yeah because every single different like [TS]

00:24:29   minor administrator in the imperial [TS]

00:24:31   system needed his own you know had his [TS]

00:24:35   own requirements for what [TS]

00:24:36   stand you know what the building [TS]

00:24:38   standard of his little quadrant was and [TS]

00:24:41   so the death star at a distance looks [TS]

00:24:43   like a globe but when you get in close [TS]

00:24:45   its justthis pimply little ball and the [TS]

00:24:47   same is true of blade runner you get the [TS]

00:24:49   feeling that like those floating police [TS]

00:24:52   cars or whatever card are just it's just [TS]

00:24:56   what happened when you were married to [TS]

00:24:58   the idea of what a car looked like but [TS]

00:25:01   then you put but then you had like sort [TS]

00:25:05   of minor hover craft technology and [TS]

00:25:08   rather than build a new a completely new [TS]

00:25:11   thing you just built a kind of car [TS]

00:25:13   looking thing that also could hover and [TS]

00:25:15   that so those those set designs were so [TS]

00:25:18   convincing and so much like they still [TS]

00:25:22   resonate with this because it's like [TS]

00:25:23   yeah that is kind of how it would go [TS]

00:25:25   isn't it it's it's not like we're ever [TS]

00:25:28   really going to build something new [TS]

00:25:30   we're just going to keep building like [TS]

00:25:33   why does the Tesla look like a lotus [TS]

00:25:35   well because it is a lotus and the new [TS]

00:25:41   Tesla is like a fat lotus and the next [TS]

00:25:46   one will be you know will be just a like [TS]

00:25:49   something globbed onto the last thing [TS]

00:25:52   and why the human imagination [TS]

00:25:56   I mean it's not that our imaginations [TS]

00:25:57   are constrained it's that you walk into [TS]

00:26:00   the room and you're like I've got it and [TS]

00:26:03   the first five people you talk to her [TS]

00:26:04   like well but a bill that would be a [TS]

00:26:08   real investment should we just you know [TS]

00:26:12   what what what if we just took the old [TS]

00:26:13   trains and we painted them gray and we [TS]

00:26:16   called it [TS]

00:26:17   amtrak what about that mean that's that [TS]

00:26:21   be a lot cheaper than that doing the [TS]

00:26:23   thing that you're talking about like [TS]

00:26:25   redesigning redesigning the system like [TS]

00:26:28   let's just let's just keep the old thing [TS]

00:26:30   and I i watch later again last week [TS]

00:26:34   why wouldn't you it's just extraordinary [TS]

00:26:37   if anybody is listening to this podcast [TS]

00:26:39   and hasn't watched blade runner in the [TS]

00:26:41   last month and a half i don't know what [TS]

00:26:42   the hell you're talking to it ends up [TS]

00:26:45   being it's one of those you know one of [TS]

00:26:47   those movies that ends up being [TS]

00:26:48   in my snap to grid movie like it's just [TS]

00:26:50   what i end up watching sometimes and I I [TS]

00:26:53   mean I've seen it a bunch of times but [TS]

00:26:55   there's little details like when deckard [TS]

00:26:57   call Sean Young from the bar on the [TS]

00:27:01   video phone and it's got it really is [TS]

00:27:03   going on [TS]

00:27:04   it's good for fiji on it it's like it [TS]

00:27:06   looks like that's exactly what that [TS]

00:27:07   would look like you know what i mean and [TS]

00:27:09   then of course it's really expensive [TS]

00:27:10   like a doll or something for the call [TS]

00:27:11   but you know they were they were so far [TS]

00:27:13   ahead of their time and you know that's [TS]

00:27:15   what makes like you say that's what [TS]

00:27:16   makes so much of that stuff from so i [TS]

00:27:18   guess for most of the star wars on is [TS]

00:27:20   that there's a built-in brokenness you [TS]

00:27:22   know to all of it you know all the way [TS]

00:27:23   down to the death star having this you [TS]

00:27:25   know vulnerability let me ask you this [TS]

00:27:27   pivot so so the whole movie starts out [TS]

00:27:32   with the nexuses they've gotten too [TS]

00:27:35   smart and they're killers and now we [TS]

00:27:36   can't have them on the planet anymore [TS]

00:27:38   the Tyrell still making nexuses we got a [TS]

00:27:41   lot of work to do out in space is on the [TS]

00:27:43   offworld yeah we're colonizing all these [TS]

00:27:46   other like little law places where were [TS]

00:27:49   out by the 10 house or gate [TS]

00:27:51   yeah you know we got a lot of work to do [TS]

00:27:53   out there and that and that's the thing [TS]

00:27:55   like and and what what astonishes me [TS]

00:27:58   honestly is that we still have not [TS]

00:28:02   normalized the concept of a robot [TS]

00:28:06   handjob machine like how far how much [TS]

00:28:13   further do we have to progress is I'm [TS]

00:28:15   hole in the market my for goodness robot [TS]

00:28:18   handjob machine is just a normal thing [TS]

00:28:20   that you buy at the sears because that [TS]

00:28:23   should be like a toaster oven it should [TS]

00:28:25   be the kind of thing were forty dollars [TS]

00:28:27   you can get a pretty serviceable robot [TS]

00:28:29   handjob machine all across America and [TS]

00:28:31   I'm not saying I'm not saying the other [TS]

00:28:32   countries of the world because I know [TS]

00:28:34   techno technologically a lot of them are [TS]

00:28:35   have a lot of catching up to do [TS]

00:28:37   they are still burning peat to heat [TS]

00:28:40   their homes but in America and France [TS]

00:28:43   and Germany right and England people [TS]

00:28:48   think about the wasted effort [TS]

00:28:50   the wasted he-man pet man-hours going [TS]

00:28:52   into person hours person sorry person [TS]

00:28:55   hours going into either administering [TS]

00:28:57   hand jobs to other people [TS]

00:29:00   or all the self handjob and yeah you [TS]

00:29:03   know the nice thing about your job hand [TS]

00:29:05   job is something that is often given [TS]

00:29:08   with and received with glee and delight [TS]

00:29:12   it's like a sweet surprise that comes up [TS]

00:29:14   and it's a nice thing but you shouldn't [TS]

00:29:16   have to depend on it from his rifle it's [TS]

00:29:18   like it's like it's like a big day like [TS]

00:29:20   it be it would be nice to you know nice [TS]

00:29:23   I guess what I'm saying is like I don't [TS]

00:29:25   want to still be able to do what i do in [TS]

00:29:26   the bathroom without there being of a [TS]

00:29:27   day there in that case I you should you [TS]

00:29:29   should have a robot that could stand in [TS]

00:29:31   your shield people right now [TS]

00:29:33   yeah all up around the world are making [TS]

00:29:35   very questionable decisions in order to [TS]

00:29:39   try and secure for themselves or their [TS]

00:29:42   loved ones a handjob and those decisions [TS]

00:29:46   could be slightly busy work a lot of [TS]

00:29:49   busy what's right completely ameliorated [TS]

00:29:50   by what would I mean I think part of the [TS]

00:29:53   problem is we always imagine that with [TS]

00:29:55   the technology we're striving for is a [TS]

00:29:58   perfect robot sex partner that does not [TS]

00:30:01   have an uncanny valley [TS]

00:30:03   yeah so to speak but in fact pretty [TS]

00:30:06   ambitious John you know think about the [TS]

00:30:08   technology that's good that I mean we're [TS]

00:30:10   gonna have to be a lot of cylinders [TS]

00:30:12   firing together we are in sync to build [TS]

00:30:15   a a perfect sex partner robot but a [TS]

00:30:22   handjob [TS]

00:30:22   I mean in and you know I madam butterfly [TS]

00:30:24   is already available who that you can [TS]

00:30:27   wear under your garment for my job for [TS]

00:30:31   where's the fucking matter butterfly and [TS]

00:30:33   I'm not talking about a flashlight [TS]

00:30:34   no it's like literally undignified about [TS]

00:30:37   it's like if I'd come on here and what [TS]

00:30:40   I'm gonna tell about some guy in a white [TS]

00:30:42   van like parked in front of Rick's with [TS]

00:30:44   flashlights going like I wanted to be [TS]

00:30:46   normalized so that it's like a vacuum [TS]

00:30:49   cleaner it's like a it's a household [TS]

00:30:50   appliance on Christmas morning [TS]

00:30:53   like what do you get dad for christmas i [TS]

00:30:56   thi know i could see mom pop in for a [TS]

00:31:00   pretty nice robust get him a whirlpool [TS]

00:31:03   thing at a time that opens up for her [TS]

00:31:06   what and you know and and it when you're [TS]

00:31:08   really thinking systemically [TS]

00:31:11   has anyone really thought about the [TS]

00:31:14   multi uses of like a spooge like like [TS]

00:31:23   like let's say I'm gonna guess now I [TS]

00:31:26   yeah I'm sure somebody's thought about [TS]

00:31:28   it but let's say like I is it up [TS]

00:31:30   I mean is it a good plant food nobody's [TS]

00:31:33   nobody's tested it right i mean we know [TS]

00:31:36   that plants love electrolytes that's we [TS]

00:31:39   plan to eat picture about what I think [TS]

00:31:41   about the in the nutrients in in injins [TS]

00:31:44   Yeah right right now it's all it's all [TS]

00:31:46   just being swept away in shame [TS]

00:31:48   it's going down the toilet so they are [TS]

00:31:50   putting are putting are putting our [TS]

00:31:52   Lantern under a bushel basket [TS]

00:31:54   thank you that's right and and we are [TS]

00:31:55   asking our our sewage treatment plants [TS]

00:31:59   to process what is probably like 80 [TS]

00:32:02   gallons of juice today and we don't even [TS]

00:32:05   recognize that's what it is because it's [TS]

00:32:07   just in there with all the Putin's done [TS]

00:32:09   but that is just like potentially high [TS]

00:32:14   protein nutrient we could be think it [TS]

00:32:18   would be feeding we could be feeding our [TS]

00:32:20   our ferrets with it [TS]

00:32:22   think about what a fair would do if you [TS]

00:32:24   put a little bullet jizz in front of [TS]

00:32:25   would gobble it down so what I'm saying [TS]

00:32:30   is we need to start to think [TS]

00:32:32   systemically yeah i like i like the [TS]

00:32:35   scope of the of the robot handjob [TS]

00:32:37   machine and I'm i guess i just think [TS]

00:32:40   about handjob machine and jewelry [TS]

00:32:42   processor just like this like baby steps [TS]

00:32:45   John but yeah you're right so there will [TS]

00:32:47   be some kind of I you know what God um [TS]

00:32:50   that's a really compelling idea but you [TS]

00:32:53   know here's the other thing though is [TS]

00:32:54   you think about most the sex stuff is [TS]

00:32:56   obviously designed with like pervy porno [TS]

00:32:59   guys in mind and but like what is the [TS]

00:33:02   robot handjob machine for a gentleman [TS]

00:33:03   who's not ashamed to have one let me ask [TS]

00:33:05   you this how many people like lock their [TS]

00:33:07   bonding up at night right [TS]

00:33:09   they're not ashamed got it on the [TS]

00:33:10   goddamn coffee table that's right it's [TS]

00:33:12   like to welcome to my home and there's [TS]

00:33:14   my bong it's part of my accoutrements [TS]

00:33:16   and it's certainly it's a little bit [TS]

00:33:18   outside of the norm as it currently [TS]

00:33:20   exists but that's changing everyday [TS]

00:33:22   writing the board's much much more [TS]

00:33:24   acceptable now [TS]

00:33:25   to have a tab along and much more [TS]

00:33:27   acceptable for people to talk about to [TS]

00:33:30   talk in fact ad nauseam about their [TS]

00:33:33   sexual proclivities seems those sexual [TS]

00:33:36   proclivities are if they identify those [TS]

00:33:38   proclivities as part of their identity [TS]

00:33:40   right as part of their political [TS]

00:33:42   identity but what is somewhat is shared [TS]

00:33:46   more than masturbation it is the thing [TS]

00:33:49   that unites us as a people that anxiety [TS]

00:33:51   and masturbation anxiety and and my god [TS]

00:33:55   think about the masturbation anxiety [TS]

00:33:57   think about what a engine of progress or [TS]

00:34:01   like dubious engine of progress [TS]

00:34:03   masturbation anxiety is you've got me [TS]

00:34:05   thinking in you talking about the grids [TS]

00:34:08   in the system's I wonder if the [TS]

00:34:10   theoretical handjob economy has a lot to [TS]

00:34:15   do with why things are the way they are [TS]

00:34:17   why there is so much busy work because [TS]

00:34:19   you think about like for example like [TS]

00:34:21   let's just say nothing against bars [TS]

00:34:24   nothing against alcohol it's not like I [TS]

00:34:26   bet you the alcohol industry would not [TS]

00:34:29   be super into the idea of wide-scale [TS]

00:34:32   adoption of a robot handjob machine [TS]

00:34:34   because right they're going to [TS]

00:34:37   somebody's going to be buying desert you [TS]

00:34:40   never know what's in the future [TS]

00:34:41   why would you even go to a bar if you [TS]

00:34:44   didn't have to [TS]

00:34:45   and the only reason you go to a bar is [TS]

00:34:47   maybe you're going to get or give a hand [TS]

00:34:49   job at some point right [TS]

00:34:51   you're gonna get a little drunk it's not [TS]

00:34:53   it's not just seemed like a good idea [TS]

00:34:54   yeah but you know there's layers and [TS]

00:34:59   layers to all this John too many layers [TS]

00:35:01   H Christ weather and so what we would [TS]

00:35:03   have to do those courses you have to [TS]

00:35:05   have some kind of you wouldn't want to [TS]

00:35:08   give one want to get into a situation [TS]

00:35:10   where people could have satisfying [TS]

00:35:14   handjobs anytime they wanted because how [TS]

00:35:19   much of our culture is only how much how [TS]

00:35:22   much are we trying to solve the climate [TS]

00:35:24   change problem that we have created [TS]

00:35:27   only because of the promise of a certain [TS]

00:35:31   number of hand jobs as a result of the [TS]

00:35:33   work we're doing right like if that ends [TS]

00:35:36   up being one of our prime motivator it [TS]

00:35:38   drives the economy and we just end up [TS]

00:35:40   and we put you know we we solve that [TS]

00:35:42   problem we get we will short-circuit the [TS]

00:35:45   the motor of progress we've already [TS]

00:35:48   we've created a problem we've created it [TS]

00:35:51   the proper we've created let's say that [TS]

00:35:54   the pollution economy and now if we just [TS]

00:35:57   give ourselves all the hand jobs we want [TS]

00:35:59   to solve it [TS]

00:36:00   we're just gonna we're gonna choke on [TS]

00:36:01   our own smog sitting and talk on our own [TS]

00:36:04   feet to our favorite and we have a lot [TS]

00:36:07   while our ferrets girls go girl larger [TS]

00:36:09   and stronger on a steady diet of pure [TS]

00:36:12   judges we need to we need to figure out [TS]

00:36:17   a way to to portion out the hand jobs [TS]

00:36:20   and then it becomes a question of who's [TS]

00:36:22   in charge who's in charge of who gets [TS]

00:36:24   access to a handjob machine ok jobs the [TS]

00:36:26   jobbers see this [TS]

00:36:28   so you're saying you should be like you [TS]

00:36:30   wouldn't want to be like like an aspirin [TS]

00:36:32   it shouldn't be like a handjob pill it [TS]

00:36:34   shouldn't be that easy is that what [TS]

00:36:35   you're saying [TS]

00:36:36   maybe maybe it would be like a little [TS]

00:36:38   like one of those breathalyzers that you [TS]

00:36:40   have to use to start your car make sure [TS]

00:36:42   you breathe through the right end right [TS]

00:36:44   you be you breathe into the tube you [TS]

00:36:46   breathe into the tube and some of that [TS]

00:36:48   hot breath is collected for to add to [TS]

00:36:50   someone else's and job you're the real [TS]

00:36:52   future is John what I mean you're not [TS]

00:36:54   why we're not afraid to go big picture [TS]

00:36:56   why waste the hot breath I see the theme [TS]

00:36:58   i see a theme here though that you you [TS]

00:37:00   it seems like it's I don't think of you [TS]

00:37:03   as foremost as an environmentalist but [TS]

00:37:06   you're really looking at the at the at [TS]

00:37:08   the at the biome you're looking at the [TS]

00:37:10   big picture of where all this stuff goes [TS]

00:37:12   right is like it's kind of a big part of [TS]

00:37:14   it you seems to me like you're saying [TS]

00:37:15   you're throwing pennies down our toilet [TS]

00:37:17   all day long we should be putting these [TS]

00:37:18   into some kind of a sperm bank [TS]

00:37:20   it's absolutely right it seems to me [TS]

00:37:21   crazy and i think that i think the more [TS]

00:37:23   conventional way of looking at this as [TS]

00:37:24   you drive through the town [TS]

00:37:25   you look up especially six o'clock at [TS]

00:37:27   night in the wintertime you look up [TS]

00:37:29   through the through the big playground [TS]

00:37:31   glass windows at the hundreds and [TS]

00:37:32   hundreds of people on exercise bikes all [TS]

00:37:35   with headphones on all just plowing away [TS]

00:37:38   just burning energy and and you know [TS]

00:37:43   we-we-we-we bioengineered the corn that [TS]

00:37:48   went into their high fructose corn syrup [TS]

00:37:50   lunches and now here they are on their [TS]

00:37:54   bikes like like schoolgirls windows are [TS]

00:37:57   electric razor electric machines they're [TS]

00:37:59   drawing electricity between order to [TS]

00:38:01   have people generate electricity that [TS]

00:38:03   goes nowhere and and the idea that we [TS]

00:38:05   have not already i mean we identified [TS]

00:38:06   this problem a long time ago but we have [TS]

00:38:09   not actually just gone in as a as a [TS]

00:38:12   human race [TS]

00:38:14   no innovator has come along and said [TS]

00:38:15   look every exercise bike from here on [TS]

00:38:18   out has to have to add energy to the [TS]

00:38:21   grid rather than take it like it's just [TS]

00:38:23   a no-brainer [TS]

00:38:24   why are we not putting all these [TS]

00:38:26   exercise machines why are we not [TS]

00:38:28   developing passive resistance as a [TS]

00:38:30   technology used in exercise and every [TS]

00:38:34   single gym in the country should be [TS]

00:38:36   producing admittedly a small amount of [TS]

00:38:39   energy but still energy like the the [TS]

00:38:43   food that we are giving to these these [TS]

00:38:46   human agents these like automatons these [TS]

00:38:51   human beings that we have paid to sit in [TS]

00:38:53   front of a computer all day and now its [TS]

00:38:55   ass in front of a computer and move [TS]

00:38:57   virtual paper around now they in order [TS]

00:39:02   to even feel alive and feel like human [TS]

00:39:04   beings they need to pretend they're [TS]

00:39:06   pulling a plow [TS]

00:39:07   oh yeah when we pay them to sit very [TS]

00:39:11   still [TS]

00:39:11   yeah now why are we not trying to [TS]

00:39:13   harvest that energy why not just go the [TS]

00:39:15   wine I just get go the whole hog and [TS]

00:39:18   just recognize that we are at that human [TS]

00:39:21   it that it is essentially a kind of [TS]

00:39:23   matrix where human beings are an [TS]

00:39:27   extremely inefficient way of of [TS]

00:39:31   converting corn energy into electricity [TS]

00:39:36   into fake paper and additional but I [TS]

00:39:38   mean like you could just burn corn and [TS]

00:39:41   probably harvest more energy then you're [TS]

00:39:45   the venue that you're going to get from [TS]

00:39:48   feeding corn too [TS]

00:39:50   kiss my somebody making of flappy bird [TS]

00:39:52   naka that and then having them sit in an [TS]

00:39:55   air on chair all day and then at the end [TS]

00:39:57   of the day telling them to climb virtual [TS]

00:40:00   stairs while a little video screen tell [TS]

00:40:02   you know while they're watching like fox [TS]

00:40:05   news right why should we not in that in [TS]

00:40:09   that entire process also have a tube [TS]

00:40:11   connected to their penis where we are [TS]

00:40:14   harvesting their kids wear like [TS]

00:40:17   collecting their sweat and where were [TS]

00:40:19   feeding that 22 some other like helpful [TS]

00:40:21   rodents [TS]

00:40:23   uh-huh we have I mean why are we not [TS]

00:40:25   working as why is this not a symbiosis [TS]

00:40:28   yeah there's no there's a lot of corn [TS]

00:40:30   being raised for dicey reasons for sure [TS]

00:40:32   jesus H Christ there is just too much [TS]

00:40:34   goddamn corn and you know and the other [TS]

00:40:36   thing is I'm thinking now about like [TS]

00:40:38   when I remember the first time I gotta [TS]

00:40:39   watch that winds itself as you walk [TS]

00:40:41   around now you can watch yourself [TS]

00:40:44   I don't drive one of those shifter [TS]

00:40:45   watches no now I've got an automatic i [TS]

00:40:48   watch Ryan's wines itself or like add [TS]

00:40:50   like the way a previous works isn't part [TS]

00:40:52   of a Prius I think when you hit the [TS]

00:40:53   brakes it like adds energy to the [TS]

00:40:55   battery [TS]

00:40:56   yea rather than just rather than convert [TS]

00:40:59   the ejaculate in all of that wonderful [TS]

00:41:02   energy all over the rather than [TS]

00:41:04   converted into heat which you then have [TS]

00:41:05   to dissipate it is trying to convert it [TS]

00:41:08   into energy through a generator it [TS]

00:41:11   sounds like there are i mean once the [TS]

00:41:13   vision is in place it seems like it's [TS]

00:41:15   mostly about there's several different [TS]

00:41:16   sort of arms if you like of the [TS]

00:41:18   technology that have to go into place [TS]

00:41:20   you're obviously yes we need people [TS]

00:41:22   working on a rapidly improving robot [TS]

00:41:25   handjob machine but also we really do [TS]

00:41:27   need to look into what's being thrown [TS]

00:41:29   away what could be made for what could [TS]

00:41:30   be replaced with it [TS]

00:41:32   that's right i think about think about [TS]

00:41:33   think about a train right if you if you [TS]

00:41:36   think about force time force equals mass [TS]

00:41:40   times acceleration right so if a if a if [TS]

00:41:45   a if a feather its you at 50 miles an [TS]

00:41:50   hour [TS]

00:41:50   it doesn't hurt but a train it's you at [TS]

00:41:54   50 miles an hour boy it does and that's [TS]

00:41:57   like one of the basic understandings [TS]

00:41:59   that we have right as as people [TS]

00:42:02   but we are not where we're not seeing [TS]

00:42:05   the other side of that equation if you [TS]

00:42:06   think about what it takes to stop up a [TS]

00:42:09   fully loaded freight train the amount of [TS]

00:42:12   energy it took to get that train going [TS]

00:42:15   and then we have to burn off that energy [TS]

00:42:18   to stop that train and there is no [TS]

00:42:20   locomotive in America no train in [TS]

00:42:24   America that has just an extra car in a [TS]

00:42:28   hundred car train an extra car whose job [TS]

00:42:30   it is to collect that energy as we're [TS]

00:42:34   breaking the train which we have to do [TS]

00:42:37   every freaking day we have to break [TS]

00:42:39   these trains we have to you know they're [TS]

00:42:41   coming down out of the mountains and [TS]

00:42:43   it's an it's one of the primary problem [TS]

00:42:47   it's one of the prop primary problems [TS]

00:42:49   that train people have to solve this [TS]

00:42:51   train is going to come down this [TS]

00:42:53   mountain and it has so much mass behind [TS]

00:42:57   it to keep this train from just breaking [TS]

00:43:00   loose and becoming a wild train and [TS]

00:43:03   crashing into the city like it's one of [TS]

00:43:07   the big technologies of like being [TS]

00:43:09   trained people right we have to keep the [TS]

00:43:11   train from going out of control but but [TS]

00:43:14   nobody is saying why are we not [TS]

00:43:16   harvesting that energy there's all this [TS]

00:43:18   energy we're just burning off and it [TS]

00:43:22   would be it would [TS]

00:43:23   I'm no engineer i am a computer science [TS]

00:43:25   professor but I'm no engineer but it [TS]

00:43:29   would not be that big of a leap to [TS]

00:43:33   design the next-gen of trains where as [TS]

00:43:39   they break they are stop there [TS]

00:43:41   they're converting that energy into [TS]

00:43:42   electricity [TS]

00:43:45   and you know yeah and then what do you [TS]

00:43:48   do with that what do you do with that [TS]

00:43:49   electricity [TS]

00:43:50   well I need to plan for getting a [TS]

00:43:53   handjob machines and that you know and [TS]

00:43:57   that will end up being the whole end up [TS]

00:43:58   being a increment of of like our uh of [TS]

00:44:03   economic thinking like this local our [TS]

00:44:06   brand new locomotive conserves enough [TS]

00:44:10   energy to power 200,000 handjob machines [TS]

00:44:13   used to think about in terms of movies [TS]

00:44:14   every time like a train my like post [TS]

00:44:16   college years every time I think about [TS]

00:44:18   spending money on something I guess who [TS]

00:44:20   forty dollars that's like four movies [TS]

00:44:22   right sector comes to color the coin of [TS]

00:44:26   the realm it's like five thousand [TS]

00:44:27   dollars is one homeowner monetary unit [TS]

00:44:30   and HMU i like to call it when i moved [TS]

00:44:33   into my house i was like i need to [TS]

00:44:36   replace the roof on the barn and [TS]

00:44:37   somebody said all that will cost about [TS]

00:44:39   five thousand dollars and then I said [TS]

00:44:41   boy I need to fix the you know I need to [TS]

00:44:43   fix the furnace know that will cost five [TS]

00:44:44   thousand dollars and after I'd lived [TS]

00:44:46   here about a year I realized everything [TS]

00:44:48   costs five thousand dollars that's [TS]

00:44:50   insane [TS]

00:44:51   and so what what you end up doing is you [TS]

00:44:53   end up you end up looking at at home [TS]

00:44:56   improvement projects like how many hm [TS]

00:44:59   you'se is it going to be if we remodel [TS]

00:45:01   the guest room that's for hm you'se if [TS]

00:45:04   if you want to redo a kitchen you're [TS]

00:45:06   looking at five to six hm you'se if you [TS]

00:45:10   want to just like put a new roof on the [TS]

00:45:11   house probably 12 to hm you'se really [TS]

00:45:14   yeah and extraordinary hm you'se are [TS]

00:45:17   just a thing that you have to give to [TS]

00:45:19   get the factor into owning a home you [TS]

00:45:22   can't you can buy your house and you can [TS]

00:45:25   live in it for five to ten years and [TS]

00:45:27   then shits gonna start breaking and when [TS]

00:45:29   it does you're going to you're going to [TS]

00:45:31   learn that the man with the clipboard [TS]

00:45:34   comes to the house and he's gonna you [TS]

00:45:37   know you might you might get your [TS]

00:45:40   gutters replaced for half of an HMU [TS]

00:45:42   point five hm you'se food but you know [TS]

00:45:45   forget about forget about anybody coming [TS]

00:45:48   to look at your pipes or your your basic [TS]

00:45:52   like infrastructure of the house for [TS]

00:45:54   less than [TS]

00:45:55   listen about point 521 HMU give a [TS]

00:45:59   thought on high-density housing do I i [TS]

00:46:04   ask because I I learned some not tragic [TS]

00:46:08   news but bummer news last week and I [TS]

00:46:12   don't need to ask you this year we've in [TS]

00:46:13   the flax write a couple times em they [TS]

00:46:18   gotta move on oh yeah 23,000 like 23,000 [TS]

00:46:22   square foot square feet of art supplies [TS]

00:46:24   and incredibly helpful people they gotta [TS]

00:46:27   move because they're going to put some [TS]

00:46:28   condos in there and the thing is the [TS]

00:46:30   city really really really needs [TS]

00:46:33   well yes yes that's one of those [TS]

00:46:35   locations where when you realize that [TS]

00:46:37   like that prime space is being taken up [TS]

00:46:42   with little wood human models let's get [TS]

00:46:45   in there canonical item is a little [TS]

00:46:47   under sign outside kept the sketcher [TS]

00:46:50   dolls or whatever those things are [TS]

00:46:51   called we're going to go for precisely [TS]

00:46:54   the pen that I want you know that's the [TS]

00:46:56   thing now you're going to have to you're [TS]

00:46:57   going to have to get in the car and go [TS]

00:47:00   out to go up to sausalito yeah well I [TS]

00:47:05   mean this is the this is the thing that [TS]

00:47:07   that we've seen here in king county in [TS]

00:47:09   seattle if you don't want all the [TS]

00:47:12   surrounding farms to be turned into [TS]

00:47:14   tract housing you have to submit to the [TS]

00:47:17   fact that they're going to redevelop [TS]

00:47:19   your city in such a way where they tear [TS]

00:47:21   down nice old churches and they tear [TS]

00:47:25   down what they consider what the [TS]

00:47:27   conventional wisdom right now considers [TS]

00:47:29   to be inefficient old Victorian how [TS]

00:47:32   housing or one-story a retail and they [TS]

00:47:38   put in I I vhi college I ovh inefficient [TS]

00:47:42   old Victorian houses i will be a job [TS]

00:47:45   there they turn that shit down each [TS]

00:47:47   one's about 20,000 hmm its they [TS]

00:47:50   construct these new buildings which are [TS]

00:47:52   quote unquote green and about half of [TS]

00:47:55   the half of the construction material is [TS]

00:47:58   actually blown in in a hose right they [TS]

00:48:01   like build some they build some [TS]

00:48:03   galvanized tin superstructure [TS]

00:48:06   to hold their blown in like newspaper as [TS]

00:48:10   they as they tear out hundred and fifty [TS]

00:48:12   year old Slavic before pics yeah right i [TS]

00:48:15   like all the homes made out of old [TS]

00:48:17   growth for their just ripping it down [TS]

00:48:20   and shipping it off to a to a landfill [TS]

00:48:22   so they can build this green housing and [TS]

00:48:26   then you're living in a Habitrail but I [TS]

00:48:29   think that's what these are gonna be the [TS]

00:48:30   reason i mention that i need to look at [TS]

00:48:32   that article again but I think these are [TS]

00:48:34   going to be those like home of the [TS]

00:48:35   future top condos [TS]

00:48:37   you know it's like living in an RV oh [TS]

00:48:40   yeah you know the thing they're doing [TS]

00:48:41   now we can get like it's kinda been a [TS]

00:48:43   least on the paper and stuff they talked [TS]

00:48:45   a lot lately about San Francisco and you [TS]

00:48:47   know a future where we might have more [TS]

00:48:48   and more than 300 square foot [TS]

00:48:51   oh sure Peter minutes at what they would [TS]

00:48:53   have their ideal situation is that every [TS]

00:48:55   new housing is just like turned it's [TS]

00:48:57   just something out of the Tokyo Airport [TS]

00:48:58   where you put it you put your dad's room [TS]

00:49:02   for your fixing your hands out machine [TS]

00:49:04   value at four hundred yen into a slot a [TS]

00:49:07   little tube opens your clients like a [TS]

00:49:09   torpedo tube you climb in their face [TS]

00:49:11   down your penis just naturally goes into [TS]

00:49:14   the handjob slot and I'm and then [TS]

00:49:17   there's like sunscreen that's playing [TS]

00:49:19   you anime videos like Bank of videos of [TS]

00:49:23   like a rabbit's with the giants and [TS]

00:49:27   you're here all your functions are [TS]

00:49:29   naturally there tube goes right up your [TS]

00:49:31   personal or so far ahead of us corn [TS]

00:49:34   effluvia it [TS]

00:49:36   the problem is of course that ok here's [TS]

00:49:39   here's a here's a a inefficient [TS]

00:49:42   victorian housing unit right and the [TS]

00:49:46   prospect of shared housing where each [TS]

00:49:49   room in that house would be someone's [TS]

00:49:51   apartment and they would pay you know it [TS]

00:49:53   be it's the classic sort of college [TS]

00:49:55   shared house [TS]

00:49:56   well that's the old way of living [TS]

00:50:00   that's the way that I mean that that's [TS]

00:50:01   the way that house was designed [TS]

00:50:02   originally because the reason it has so [TS]

00:50:04   many bedrooms is that grandma lived with [TS]

00:50:06   you and your spinster aunt lived there [TS]

00:50:08   and you're here like your text [TS]

00:50:10   brother-in-law lived there and all these [TS]

00:50:13   people were living together in the house [TS]

00:50:15   and then for many years it was just like [TS]

00:50:18   a hippie flophouse or [TS]

00:50:20   people were sharing these rooms but now [TS]

00:50:22   the prospect of sharing a kitchen with [TS]

00:50:24   strangers are sharing a sharing even a [TS]

00:50:27   common area with strangers fills us with [TS]

00:50:30   anxiety and we would much rather have a [TS]

00:50:34   smaller and more antiseptic living [TS]

00:50:39   environment where we can go close our [TS]

00:50:41   door be away from other people no one [TS]

00:50:43   you know in a way we are becoming a [TS]

00:50:47   culture and I never thought I would say [TS]

00:50:49   this but like where introversion is is [TS]

00:50:53   setting the standard for for the way we [TS]

00:50:58   build and think about our space takes up [TS]

00:51:00   space in a sense that like just in my [TS]

00:51:04   own life just in my own adult life 20 [TS]

00:51:08   years ago and it wasn't just because i [TS]

00:51:11   was young but like what did you do on a [TS]

00:51:14   saturday night if you weren't going to a [TS]

00:51:15   rock show you were going to some [TS]

00:51:17   alternative theater or like the be [TS]

00:51:20   playing your baby grand piano [TS]

00:51:22   they are the alternatives were all [TS]

00:51:24   public it was if you weren't even social [TS]

00:51:30   social you work even if you were [TS]

00:51:32   somebody who was very like solitaire [TS]

00:51:38   without I mean it you could stay alone [TS]

00:51:44   in your apartment but even the most [TS]

00:51:45   solitary person needs some kind of [TS]

00:51:47   interaction and it and you had to get [TS]

00:51:50   that in the public sphere you had to go [TS]

00:51:53   to an event or at least go out and [TS]

00:51:55   wander around and in the last 20 years [TS]

00:51:57   all of our innovation has happened in [TS]

00:52:01   the sphere of allowing people to [TS]

00:52:03   interact with other people without go [TS]

00:52:05   out what's interesting and so if i don't [TS]

00:52:10   i would you have why would you have an [TS]

00:52:12   eight-room house in a way it's almost [TS]

00:52:14   like housing becomes does for housing [TS]

00:52:16   it's doing for housing what the cloud [TS]

00:52:18   does for data where we don't have to [TS]

00:52:20   have our own hard drive sitting around [TS]

00:52:21   we don't need a place to put a grand [TS]

00:52:22   piano effectively if you're going to [TS]

00:52:24   mostly be working at Twitter for 16 [TS]

00:52:26   hours a day pop into doc's clock for two [TS]

00:52:28   hours and then right back to your pod [TS]

00:52:30   like why would you need all of that [TS]

00:52:31   stuff right and and [TS]

00:52:33   increasingly like what do you need in [TS]

00:52:35   your house you need a sink you need a [TS]

00:52:37   shower [TS]

00:52:38   lots of power outlets lots of power [TS]

00:52:40   outlets nobody takes a bath anymore you [TS]

00:52:42   just need a kind of like you're any we [TS]

00:52:45   don't even really need to shower it [TS]

00:52:46   could just be compressed air you know [TS]

00:52:49   that just blows the dirt off of you and [TS]

00:52:52   then you have a microwave and you have [TS]

00:52:53   one sort of heating element that that [TS]

00:52:55   connects your pot so that it boil some [TS]

00:52:59   water for your ramen screen for [TS]

00:53:01   seamless.com and and and you need to [TS]

00:53:05   poop chute man and for now at least you [TS]

00:53:11   need up you need a box of Kleenex for [TS]

00:53:13   your just because nobody has figured out [TS]

00:53:15   a way to recycle that they're starting [TS]

00:53:16   they're going to knock down flax in [TS]

00:53:18   order to put up tiny condos I hope [TS]

00:53:19   there's going to be some some cheese [TS]

00:53:22   apertures well there won't be because [TS]

00:53:24   because you and I don't have that do not [TS]

00:53:27   have the widespread agency yet to be [TS]

00:53:30   affecting like zoning or touching people [TS]

00:53:33   that only few at a time [TS]

00:53:34   yeah and I and I feel like I don't [TS]

00:53:38   necessarily think that housing people in [TS]

00:53:41   pods is is the wrong direction but again [TS]

00:53:45   I mean and I an addict i will be the [TS]

00:53:47   last guy to reference the matrix movies [TS]

00:53:52   over and over and over [TS]

00:53:54   sure but but like those little yellow [TS]

00:53:59   gel-filled like yes it's basically it's [TS]

00:54:03   like a human ramekin sitting there like [TS]

00:54:06   a desert product right and you are you [TS]

00:54:08   are unaware of the outside world you're [TS]

00:54:10   unaware that you are even that your [TS]

00:54:12   world isn't the world you perceive it to [TS]

00:54:15   be it's just a little holding it's just [TS]

00:54:18   a little soap dish that that that you [TS]

00:54:23   know keeps you alive as you generate [TS]

00:54:25   energy for the road as you generate [TS]

00:54:26   energy for the robots and I mean it's [TS]

00:54:29   it's amazingly appreciate when you start [TS]

00:54:33   to when you start to imagine that the [TS]

00:54:36   that the next generation the next [TS]

00:54:38   iteration of our modern world is a lot [TS]

00:54:41   closer to the first step toward that [TS]

00:54:43   eventualities than it is a step in a [TS]

00:54:46   different direction [TS]

00:54:47   right you know like sure put me in a [TS]

00:54:49   smaller apartment and and put my virtual [TS]

00:54:52   headset on and and give me a give me a [TS]

00:54:54   sex friend and I you know and and the [TS]

00:54:58   heat these super ferrets that have [TS]

00:55:00   become sort of sort of self-aware [TS]

00:55:03   because they're eating this high [TS]

00:55:05   nutrition food super ferrets are [TS]

00:55:07   basically performing the role of helper [TS]

00:55:09   monkeys [TS]

00:55:10   haha that's terrific thank you know they [TS]

00:55:12   can turn pages for you that you don't [TS]

00:55:14   then you're plugging your you're walking [TS]

00:55:16   walking stickers [TS]

00:55:17   yeah they have a natural affinity for [TS]

00:55:19   going up high and they want to go to [TS]

00:55:21   there and reach stuff for you like this [TS]

00:55:23   store treat ya get up there hey hey fair [TS]

00:55:25   buddy you know like if you don't bring [TS]

00:55:28   me down my cocoa krispies I'm not going [TS]

00:55:30   to give you your little fugitive the you [TS]

00:55:33   know like a pearl jam [TS]

00:55:35   oh goodness man takes a village [TS]

00:55:45   pearl jam is that where that comes from [TS]

00:55:48   and I figured it was a little on the [TS]

00:55:51   nose but is that the you know they claim [TS]

00:55:54   that it's named after grandma pearls jam [TS]

00:55:58   i heard it was under the giant there was [TS]

00:56:01   a drawing from john lennon son was lucy [TS]

00:56:05   in the sky and so who ya at ncc that [TS]

00:56:10   steely dan still Barrett's lot of rock [TS]

00:56:14   rock sex crossover I mean I'm feeling it [TS]

00:56:18   I'm feeling it all the time in my own [TS]

00:56:21   life is that right well if you're [TS]

00:56:24   feeling the pole to to make a dick joke [TS]

00:56:26   in your band name [TS]

00:56:27   i I just I feel like as you get to as [TS]

00:56:30   you get is you arrive at a certain [TS]

00:56:32   station in life I i was watching this [TS]

00:56:35   documentary the other day where George [TS]

00:56:38   Hamilton appears in the documentary john [TS]

00:56:41   milius I was watching that John Milius [TS]

00:56:42   document wasn't that a hell of a thing [TS]

00:56:44   as an extraordinary documentary it was I [TS]

00:56:47   did not know I didn't either about what [TS]

00:56:50   happened well for I mean I knew he was a [TS]

00:56:52   little bit unusual i didn't know he was [TS]

00:56:54   had that many photos of himself taking [TS]

00:56:56   them uniforms with guns [TS]

00:56:57   yeah but i didn't know what happened to [TS]

00:56:58   him that's so sad [TS]

00:57:00   well I mean certainly the stroke is sad [TS]

00:57:03   but the clerk's but certainly this is [TS]

00:57:09   something that the like I I was not [TS]

00:57:13   aware that he made red dawn I didn't [TS]

00:57:16   know he did code and I don't know chance [TS]

00:57:18   to read on the other day because I feel [TS]

00:57:20   like the I feel like the logic of red [TS]

00:57:22   dawn made so much sense to me as a [TS]

00:57:25   teenager like somebody in the [TS]

00:57:27   documentary there's some like you know [TS]

00:57:29   do-gooder whole segment about all this [TS]

00:57:33   scare segments about way Red Dawn means [TS]

00:57:35   about American yes and some guy says [TS]

00:57:37   like the most violent the most violent [TS]

00:57:39   movie ever made [TS]

00:57:40   it's only only a teenager would watch [TS]

00:57:42   this movie and then he turns the camera [TS]

00:57:43   is like only a dumb teenager and I was [TS]

00:57:46   like excuse me sir i was that teenager [TS]

00:57:49   and you tested very well and Red Dawn [TS]

00:57:53   you know let don was a movie that the [TS]

00:57:58   the plot of red dawn had occurred to us [TS]

00:58:00   all for 15 years you couldn't have grown [TS]

00:58:03   up during the cold war without imagining [TS]

00:58:06   because we all saw the day after and [TS]

00:58:08   we've been in the day after was was [TS]

00:58:11   pandering to an idea that we'd already [TS]

00:58:13   had a million times like if if we bases [TS]

00:58:17   apocalypse porn [TS]

00:58:19   yeah if if nuclear war is inevitable [TS]

00:58:21   then your options are either you are [TS]

00:58:22   vaporized in the first instance and have [TS]

00:58:24   no a have no awareness of it or you are [TS]

00:58:29   chemically poisoned and die a gruesome [TS]

00:58:33   death in a in a burned-out basically [TS]

00:58:36   basically looking like a non-player [TS]

00:58:37   character in a terrible D&D campaign [TS]

00:58:39   right or your third option is somehow [TS]

00:58:42   you survived it either because you live [TS]

00:58:44   way out in Montana or because you are a [TS]

00:58:48   mutant and you have a that you are [TS]

00:58:50   immune to to radiation or the radiation [TS]

00:58:53   only makes you stronger or something and [TS]

00:58:56   then what they didn't exploit that full [TS]

00:58:58   but of the three options when you're [TS]

00:59:01   let's say you're a thirteen-year-old [TS]

00:59:03   hear your three options either you are [TS]

00:59:04   vaporized instantly and you don't know [TS]

00:59:06   anything [TS]

00:59:07   or you get sick and die in short order [TS]

00:59:10   or maybe you become a mutant rebel [TS]

00:59:14   leader which one which idea are you [TS]

00:59:18   going to spend more time thinking about [TS]

00:59:19   ya and so I mean but but but realizing [TS]

00:59:23   now that red dawn that the logic of red [TS]

00:59:26   dawn is powering our whole generation [TS]

00:59:31   where we no longer have a Soviet threat [TS]

00:59:33   people are able to insert whatever [TS]

00:59:35   threat [TS]

00:59:36   whatever the threat de jure is into the [TS]

00:59:39   into that function machine of like [TS]

00:59:42   here's my red dawn function machine i [TS]

00:59:44   don't care what the what the [TS]

00:59:47   the reason is that I end up having to [TS]

00:59:49   move out to the grid and defend my land [TS]

00:59:51   but I and i'll put a new thing in there [TS]

00:59:54   as suits but what my fantasy is is that [TS]

00:59:58   is that [TS]

00:59:58   is that [TS]

01:00:00   some like new world order some big [TS]

01:00:03   overarching power comes after me and I [TS]

01:00:07   have to king of the sewer dwelling [TS]

01:00:09   Morlocks yeah right I i I'm king of the [TS]

01:00:11   more the moment for the or the like [TS]

01:00:14   country people or whatever and we fight [TS]

01:00:17   we fight a war of resistance is [TS]

01:00:20   fascinating I mean I wonder I wonder how [TS]

01:00:22   much my own fantasy life is still locked [TS]

01:00:25   in a red dawn John you can tell people [TS]

01:00:30   today about the eighties because it's [TS]

01:00:32   it's so frankly unbelievable something [TS]

01:00:34   we talked about probably two or three [TS]

01:00:35   times that I hear people talk about this [TS]

01:00:37   and everybody slept this off like it [TS]

01:00:38   wasn't a real thing but the absolute [TS]

01:00:41   obsession that everything was about [TS]

01:00:43   Satanism for a while [TS]

01:00:45   was it was everywhere whether that was [TS]

01:00:47   dnd or whether that was judas priest or [TS]

01:00:49   whatever was and but there were people [TS]

01:00:50   on TV shows that my grandmother watch [TS]

01:00:52   the SAT there and played records [TS]

01:00:53   backwards because they thought it was [TS]

01:00:55   really it was really telling you [TS]

01:00:57   remember when every day care in the [TS]

01:00:59   country was actually a Satanist sex ring [TS]

01:01:02   yeah that was like little old ladies [TS]

01:01:05   were raping our babies have one story is [TS]

01:01:09   say so chilling about that with a mother [TS]

01:01:10   and the son at that place the famous [TS]

01:01:14   case absolutely chilling but you know [TS]

01:01:16   it's another one of these hysteria is [TS]

01:01:18   where every once in a while the village [TS]

01:01:19   has to just completely freaked out about [TS]

01:01:20   the other and then just insert you know [TS]

01:01:22   name of other here [TS]

01:01:24   whatever happened to Satanists I imagine [TS]

01:01:27   there are more sickness [TS]

01:01:28   I mean just going on the number of [TS]

01:01:30   people I see wearing pentagram necklaces [TS]

01:01:32   had comicon I think irony has been hard [TS]

01:01:35   on Satanist it's a Satan Satanism is a [TS]

01:01:39   it's not very hit I mean it was hit but [TS]

01:01:42   there was one thing to be like Anton [TS]

01:01:44   LaVey guy in the sixties and seventies [TS]

01:01:46   or something I mean there's one thing to [TS]

01:01:48   be like into the magics back then and [TS]

01:01:51   today I think it's it seems a little i [TS]

01:01:54   don't know i think if it seems ludicrous [TS]

01:01:56   remember the Eddie Murphy movie where he [TS]

01:01:58   went to Tibet or yeah the golden child [TS]

01:02:02   the golden child right and just barely [TS]

01:02:05   hand and like I or maybe it was nepal [TS]

01:02:09   know i think it was Tibet and and he was [TS]

01:02:12   he was trying to s [TS]

01:02:13   chords the the new lama who was just a [TS]

01:02:17   little boy and the Lama had to get back [TS]

01:02:20   to Tibet for some reason but then Satan [TS]

01:02:23   was involved what somehow and actually [TS]

01:02:25   according to Hoyle Satan well that's the [TS]

01:02:28   thing like there were some bad men who [TS]

01:02:30   were trying to capture the golden child [TS]

01:02:32   because the golden child would someone [TS]

01:02:34   at capturing him in a giant bird cage [TS]

01:02:36   was going to help them advance their [TS]

01:02:38   evil starting a fever dream at what did [TS]

01:02:42   within and i highly recommend everybody [TS]

01:02:44   watch the golden child again it's a [TS]

01:02:46   great Eddie Murphy vehicle and coming to [TS]

01:02:49   America and butt but like somewhere [TS]

01:02:52   along the line in the film i think [TS]

01:02:56   probably when the screenwriters what [TS]

01:02:59   would like the the first run of cocaine [TS]

01:03:01   had run out and they they were like you [TS]

01:03:04   know they were like seven pizza boxes [TS]

01:03:06   deep and they were just like okay all [TS]

01:03:08   right now what happens well write these [TS]

01:03:11   guys are these bad guys are actually [TS]

01:03:13   Satan and demons their demons right and [TS]

01:03:18   then the chief bad guy is the devil and [TS]

01:03:20   I was and I was like I even remember it [TS]

01:03:24   watching this movie as a teenager and [TS]

01:03:25   and asking like is the devil part of the [TS]

01:03:30   like cosmology of tibetan buddhism I [TS]

01:03:35   don't think of it being a real demon [TS]

01:03:38   centered that sounds like i like i like [TS]

01:03:41   high school creative writing thing but [TS]

01:03:43   like the bad guy is a real and different [TS]

01:03:45   eons i think yeah right right right [TS]

01:03:47   about this movie like really spiraled [TS]

01:03:50   out into into a world of it got a cup [TS]

01:03:55   bury it in a way with it was I don't [TS]

01:03:57   remember which one came first i think [TS]

01:03:59   maybe golden child but there it got into [TS]

01:04:02   some real big trouble in little china [TS]

01:04:04   territory where you gotta watch that you [TS]

01:04:07   keep reminding me i got to watch you [TS]

01:04:09   know where there's some supernatural [TS]

01:04:10   powers that that maybe hint at it it's [TS]

01:04:15   that whole ladies thing where it's like [TS]

01:04:17   there's a there's a really bad guy here [TS]

01:04:20   who has some Anor [TS]

01:04:22   most power like he's eternal but somehow [TS]

01:04:26   but the stakes of this film are are [TS]

01:04:32   pretty small like like this this eternal [TS]

01:04:35   Chinese demon that means to marry a girl [TS]

01:04:39   with green eyes [TS]

01:04:40   ok that seems like something he could [TS]

01:04:42   have done over the last where's here's [TS]

01:04:43   the thing i'm did you ever see the [TS]

01:04:45   original Rosemary's Baby the Roman [TS]

01:04:47   Polanski Rosemary's Baby [TS]

01:04:48   no because you know how I am about scary [TS]

01:04:51   movies [TS]

01:04:52   it's the thing that's much too probably [TS]

01:04:54   the last three or four months and i have [TS]

01:04:57   to say it's it's so awfully good and it [TS]

01:05:00   is so chilling and here's part of what [TS]

01:05:02   there's something odd about this great i [TS]

01:05:03   mean there's so many layers especially [TS]

01:05:05   once you got a kid it gets interviewed a [TS]

01:05:07   double maybe well that's the thing and [TS]

01:05:09   this is what makes it great so if there [TS]

01:05:10   was a guy with a pitchfork and horns [TS]

01:05:13   running around going teehee it would be [TS]

01:05:16   silly but it's all of these people who [TS]

01:05:18   are doing creepy stuff there's little [TS]

01:05:20   the two big parts of it three first [TS]

01:05:22   pregnancy okay anytime you get pregnancy [TS]

01:05:24   and what happens in that so crazy insane [TS]

01:05:27   body you know destroying process that [TS]

01:05:30   are interesting [TS]

01:05:31   yes and then BES you do have these [TS]

01:05:33   people who appear to be you know [TS]

01:05:35   involved in some pretty bad business [TS]

01:05:37   with Satan but finally there is no like [TS]

01:05:39   guy with horns in it and that's what [TS]

01:05:41   makes it work [TS]

01:05:42   she even today is you don't need the [TS]

01:05:44   devil to be real in order for Satan's to [TS]

01:05:45   be scary because if they think that [TS]

01:05:47   they're working and and they're they're [TS]

01:05:49   basically passing as people who are just [TS]

01:05:51   your nice old people neighbors know Ruth [TS]

01:05:53   Gordon last person in the world you [TS]

01:05:54   think would be a crazy same person right [TS]

01:05:56   well yeah but what they look that's [TS]

01:05:58   that's what makes that effective is not [TS]

01:06:00   too on-the-nose you know what I mean it [TS]

01:06:02   was saving as a lot scarier when you [TS]

01:06:03   can't see him well and we're in this [TS]

01:06:05   case like it kind of I mean like their [TS]

01:06:08   stuff that happens before you should see [TS]

01:06:10   it's going ok I'll watchin watchin yeah [TS]

01:06:12   yeah but that's a in that case get men [TS]

01:06:14   speaking finally speaking of the Dalai [TS]

01:06:16   Lama big hitter the lama to me saying [TS]

01:06:19   that red dawn like makes kids want to go [TS]

01:06:21   fight the cold war is like saying [TS]

01:06:22   Caddyshack makes people want to play [TS]

01:06:24   golf [TS]

01:06:25   it's like mrs. what it is about the [TS]

01:06:26   movie that's so compelling and in and [TS]

01:06:28   Red Dawn that's a big part of it but I [TS]

01:06:30   mean it read on is about a more basic [TS]

01:06:33   and little Lord of the Flies maybe but [TS]

01:06:34   it's really about you know what happens [TS]

01:06:37   when the parents go away and wanting to [TS]

01:06:39   be part and wanting to be an important [TS]

01:06:41   part of something important to not just [TS]

01:06:43   be a cog has all this theoretical stuff [TS]

01:06:45   that might happen in the future for them [TS]

01:06:46   to really need you to save the day and [TS]

01:06:48   your special high school skills might [TS]

01:06:50   actually be useful for some reason that [TS]

01:06:52   that to me is what makes it great i mean [TS]

01:06:53   yeah i was certainly timely and was done [TS]

01:06:56   that way for a reason but I don't think [TS]

01:06:58   it was primarily about politics [TS]

01:07:00   I think it's about 12 blow shit up [TS]

01:07:02   absolutely well wanting yeah wanting the [TS]

01:07:05   other the desire that every kid has to [TS]

01:07:09   every to have your parents all die i [TS]

01:07:13   mean it's it's like I think in eight you [TS]

01:07:17   don't want you don't want to kill your [TS]

01:07:18   parents you don't want to be responsible [TS]

01:07:20   for them dying but you would secretly [TS]

01:07:23   kind of love it if they just all died [TS]

01:07:25   some how you were forced to remake the [TS]

01:07:29   world in your own sort of people with [TS]

01:07:32   your teenage wisdom to to remake the [TS]

01:07:36   world as you as it should be could be I [TS]

01:07:38   mean that the amazing thing about red [TS]

01:07:41   dawn to me is that jennifer grey I [TS]

01:07:46   forgot jennifer grey with and of course [TS]

01:07:48   you love Jennifer fucking grey is in [TS]

01:07:50   that movie [TS]

01:07:51   Jennifer a classic classic jennifer grey [TS]

01:07:53   that's right not to Jennifer grand new [TS]

01:07:55   ginger oil and like no buddy there's no [TS]

01:08:02   kissing in it like at one point somebody [TS]

01:08:05   makes like a gesture to jennifer grey [TS]

01:08:08   that is immediately like she rebuffs it [TS]

01:08:11   as a delegate tough she's a tough girl [TS]

01:08:14   with no the takes no shit off anybody [TS]

01:08:17   and like here these teenagers boys and [TS]

01:08:21   girls together and it's a very you know [TS]

01:08:26   it's a very it comported with my [TS]

01:08:30   understanding of sexual politics even in [TS]

01:08:34   the eighties people think I think a lot [TS]

01:08:36   of young people feel like they're the [TS]

01:08:38   first ones to ever think about feminism [TS]

01:08:41   or gay rights but of course in the [TS]

01:08:44   eighties we were [TS]

01:08:45   we were like soaking in it right [TS]

01:08:50   I mean that was the that was the [TS]

01:08:52   atmosphere that we had been raised into [TS]

01:08:55   and we were maybe a a roar less it the [TS]

01:09:02   the idea of what was that what was to [TS]

01:09:04   come was less codified but we were [TS]

01:09:07   wrestling with all those same ideas and [TS]

01:09:10   and that was what I imagined would [TS]

01:09:12   happen you know if I fall the adults [TS]

01:09:15   were killed and we were living in a [TS]

01:09:16   post-apocalyptic apocalyptic world it [TS]

01:09:21   was it was clear to me that it was not [TS]

01:09:23   going to get the system that we built [TS]

01:09:25   out of the ashes was not going to be the [TS]

01:09:28   old patriarchal system it was going to [TS]

01:09:31   be a new we were going to make a new [TS]

01:09:33   world and it was going to be one where [TS]

01:09:37   where there was a kind of equality that [TS]

01:09:41   wasn't possible and that at the time we [TS]

01:09:44   couldn't imagine how we would get from [TS]

01:09:46   where we were to where we were going [TS]

01:09:48   it seemed like maybe all the adults [TS]

01:09:50   would have to die for us to to build the [TS]

01:09:53   world we imagined but but it was it was [TS]

01:09:57   a much more egalitarian future the Red [TS]

01:10:02   Dawn future the posts we all knew that [TS]

01:10:06   the Cold War was was bananas and it was [TS]

01:10:10   sort of evidence that adults were banana [TS]

01:10:12   all I also like all teenagers we knew [TS]

01:10:14   that the system was basically corrupt [TS]

01:10:15   and fix the lines current state [TS]

01:10:17   yeah but lie again like all teenagers we [TS]

01:10:20   could not possibly imagine that really [TS]

01:10:22   what all it would take was years [TS]

01:10:25   okay to get there by writing your [TS]

01:10:26   congressman yeah 20 years from now we [TS]

01:10:28   would be the adults and most of us would [TS]

01:10:32   have survived to adulthood with some of [TS]

01:10:34   those some of those new ideas intact [TS]

01:10:38   I mean hard too hard to imagine that [TS]

01:10:42   that would be an interesting reading for [TS]

01:10:45   a piece of paper the you know the [TS]

01:10:48   ultimately like feminist egalitarian [TS]

01:10:51   under message of red dawn [TS]

01:10:55   don't think I don't think that i'm going [TS]

01:11:00   to write that paper because i'm not [TS]

01:11:01   trying to graduate from about that about [TS]

01:11:03   that George Hamilton know huh oh my god [TS]

01:11:06   oh my god it was so wonderful to see old [TS]

01:11:10   Hollywood for a second just completely [TS]

01:11:12   unchecked he's a beast he's sucking on a [TS]

01:11:16   cigar and he's like he said what I said [TS]

01:11:19   how many hookers can we get out to palm [TS]

01:11:21   springs before the end of the day you [TS]

01:11:22   know it's just like no motorcycles no [TS]

01:11:25   more than some no more women i'm taking [TS]

01:11:27   them all away [TS]

01:11:28   he sent me an email or a hundred [TS]

01:11:31   telegrams so it's so great so like who [TS]

01:11:37   knew but of course we all knew it's just [TS]

01:11:40   nobody nobody goes on record really just [TS]

01:11:43   talking that way except except for our [TS]

01:11:45   man here see the Knievel is that one of [TS]

01:11:49   those move those movies that is referred [TS]

01:11:52   to in the documentary well there's [TS]

01:11:53   there's an evil case first time to get [TS]

01:11:55   into this [TS]

01:11:56   there's one Evel Knievel movie the early [TS]

01:11:58   one is the one that middle road on which [TS]

01:12:01   is the one starring starring George [TS]

01:12:04   Hamilton and i really love any kind of a [TS]

01:12:06   seventies promo reel or somebody's in [TS]

01:12:09   like fully decked out as the character [TS]

01:12:11   but then comes out and talk to the [TS]

01:12:12   people in the theater [TS]

01:12:14   yeah yeah yeah hi I judge myself not [TS]

01:12:18   evil Knievel there's another one called [TS]

01:12:20   Viva Knievel starring evil i think it's [TS]

01:12:22   called evil Knievel starring Evel [TS]

01:12:24   Knievel co-starring oh god who is it [TS]

01:12:28   it's a gene is a dancer engine a out the [TS]

01:12:35   first air but Gino Ginger Rogers hello [TS]

01:12:40   Gina jelly bean Autry Kelly Kelly's in [TS]

01:12:44   it [TS]

01:12:45   ya know what really yeah and helped [TS]

01:12:47   people move Evel Knievel movie starts [TS]

01:12:49   out with evil it starts out with the [TS]

01:12:50   inside of an orphanage run by nuns and [TS]

01:12:53   Evel Knievel has broken into the [TS]

01:12:55   orphanage full of nuns in the middle of [TS]

01:12:57   the night to hand out Evel Knievel [TS]

01:12:58   branded toys to all the kids so sure of [TS]

01:13:00   course that you stop with all the time I [TS]

01:13:02   don't have the answer was an orphan the [TS]

01:13:03   past [TS]

01:13:04   John Evel Knievel I killed my parents to [TS]

01:13:10   be here [TS]

01:13:10   how many nights that I wish I could wake [TS]

01:13:12   up and see Evel Knievel waiting for me [TS]

01:13:13   with the toy is full it says to standing [TS]

01:13:16   over me with one of those like Evel [TS]

01:13:17   Knievel on a motorcycle we lined it up i [TS]

01:13:19   love that thing [TS]

01:13:21   great i was obsessed with him i'm kinda [TS]

01:13:23   close to later JJ arms of course i was [TS]

01:13:26   totally obsessed with JJ arms [TS]

01:13:28   how many times did you jump your dirt [TS]

01:13:29   bike over some in you know something [TS]

01:13:32   like drainage culverts and an eight inch [TS]

01:13:34   scar on my left leg that much my [TS]

01:13:38   favorite was we built a we built a cart [TS]

01:13:41   out of a wagon like a rocket car out of [TS]

01:13:44   a wagon and supply calvin and hobbes [TS]

01:13:46   yeah yeah and and we we started down the [TS]

01:13:49   and we had open culverts in our [TS]

01:13:50   neighborhood we started down the hill [TS]

01:13:53   and the when we couldn't steer the thing [TS]

01:13:55   because we had been taken but taking all [TS]

01:13:57   the steering controls and rebuilt them [TS]

01:13:59   and they broke instantly and this thing [TS]

01:14:01   went down into the ditch and slammed [TS]

01:14:04   into the cement culvert at a high rate [TS]

01:14:07   of speed and I mean there's blood [TS]

01:14:09   everywhere my blood everybody's blood it [TS]

01:14:11   was a pretty bad but it was basically [TS]

01:14:14   the Snake River Canyon jump [TS]

01:14:16   uh-huh smaller scale oh my god is to [TS]

01:14:19   love to watch this movies him crashing [TS]

01:14:21   caesars palace on the king's island he [TS]

01:14:24   didn't pick up the Kings on right by my [TS]

01:14:25   house on Harley Davidsons like these [TS]

01:14:29   guys that are flying through the sky on [TS]

01:14:30   on their on their you know kawasaki 250 [TS]

01:14:33   or whatever kind of like like trying to [TS]

01:14:36   come something in a Cadillac yeah [TS]

01:14:37   basically a headstrong that it's heavy [TS]

01:14:39   very 2,500 pound like welded steel with [TS]

01:14:43   with you know with kind of pumped his [TS]

01:14:46   cds and yamaha or something [TS]

01:14:48   well it was it was the USA man his [TS]

01:14:51   fucking costume was an American flag a [TS]

01:14:53   sparkly American flag everything I own [TS]

01:14:56   is right blue it's not going to drive a [TS]

01:14:58   goddamn kawasaki come on [TS]

01:15:01   yeah Evel Knievel right there the name [TS]

01:15:04   America very fucking name [TS]

01:15:06   it's an anagram of america with a V [TS]

01:15:08   instead of a w-4 [TS]

01:15:10   is evil and then of course he moved to [TS]

01:15:13   Florida and he got arrested at [TS]

01:15:15   Bennigan's near our house for being a [TS]

01:15:16   guy up with a baseball bat see that at [TS]

01:15:19   that they don't make them like that [TS]

01:15:20   George Hamilton ever did that I hope [TS]

01:15:23   they say that about me one day [TS]

01:15:24   whatever happened John robbery I just [TS]

01:15:27   got arrested at Bennigan's in florida [TS]

01:15:28   for beating up again with a baseball bat [TS]

01:15:29   again [TS]

01:15:31   hi there you go [TS]

01:15:35   yeah those that was growing what's a lot [TS]

01:15:38   of handjobs [TS]