The Talk Show

180: ‘Yay or Nay to Their POV’, With Special Guest Matthew Panzarino


00:00:00   Matthew pans arena welcome welcome back [TS]

00:00:01   to the show [TS]

00:00:03   thank you sir thanks for having me Wow [TS]

00:00:05   to tough week to have a show there's no [TS]

00:00:07   news it [TS]

00:00:11   yeah we was all just is headed there go [TS]

00:00:14   on vacation man yeah it's been like that [TS]

00:00:19   every day so we are recording on tuesday [TS]

00:00:23   the 31st so we are literally talking [TS]

00:00:25   like two hours after Apple posted [TS]

00:00:28   quarterly results so we can actually do [TS]

00:00:30   like a new show it's like we're like on [TS]

00:00:33   on CNN or something talking about [TS]

00:00:35   breaking news it right at this week's [TS]

00:00:38   news today or whatever yesterday [TS]

00:00:40   yesterday summarizing the quarterly [TS]

00:00:45   results [TS]

00:00:46   I think it's time I my summary is more [TS]

00:00:50   or less iphone went back to growth which [TS]

00:00:54   was contrary to some predictions that [TS]

00:00:57   that that last year's dip was was the [TS]

00:01:00   sign that that we reached pic pki phone [TS]

00:01:03   people say he's got more iphones last [TS]

00:01:05   quarter than they've ever sold in any [TS]

00:01:07   quarter including the two year ago1 when [TS]

00:01:09   their sales went bananas because of the [TS]

00:01:11   iphone 6 and 6 plus my ipad sales are [TS]

00:01:17   down a little bit year-over-year but [TS]

00:01:20   they're reasonably saying well last year [TS]

00:01:22   they came out with the brand new iPad [TS]

00:01:23   pro this year there were no new ipads in [TS]

00:01:25   holiday quarter and they're still [TS]

00:01:27   respectable 13 million mac sales were up [TS]

00:01:30   a little [TS]

00:01:31   rebounding I think showing such good [TS]

00:01:34   signs of probably the the new macbook [TS]

00:01:37   pro sales being pretty good who Apple [TS]

00:01:41   watch they don't break those out but on [TS]

00:01:43   the conference call it sounded to me [TS]

00:01:45   reading the summary that they said it [TS]

00:01:47   was a record-breaking quarter and that [TS]

00:01:50   makes sense because it's a holiday [TS]

00:01:51   quarter and I think that it's if if they [TS]

00:01:54   did break those watch sales out i think [TS]

00:01:56   the holiday quarter is going to be a [TS]

00:01:58   huge spike just like in the old days the [TS]

00:02:00   way ipod tour and then last but not [TS]

00:02:03   least services apples favorite word of [TS]

00:02:06   the last two years is up at a fair [TS]

00:02:09   summary [TS]

00:02:11   yeah I think so I mean I think there's [TS]

00:02:13   some question [TS]

00:02:13   about that other category in like the [TS]

00:02:16   overall other category there was there [TS]

00:02:18   was a dipping growth but right that was [TS]

00:02:21   like the general consensus is the watch [TS]

00:02:23   did find in the quarter right i mean [TS]

00:02:26   it's pretty much the only watch doing [TS]

00:02:28   anywhere near decent right now so it's [TS]

00:02:30   not too hard to to say that [TS]

00:02:33   yeah it seems to me like I mean there's [TS]

00:02:36   a lot of I mean this is a little off [TS]

00:02:38   topic of apples quarter but it that on [TS]

00:02:40   point with the watch that i'm starting [TS]

00:02:43   to see some serious repeated pessimism [TS]

00:02:46   about Fitbit that fit i think might be [TS]

00:02:50   in today as a company might be in [TS]

00:02:52   trouble [TS]

00:02:53   yes yeah I think that's pretty clear [TS]

00:02:55   from what we've been hearing so far I [TS]

00:02:58   think that there's a significant change [TS]

00:03:00   in direction how you refer to here in [TS]

00:03:02   Silicon Valley as a pivot we're coming [TS]

00:03:06   for them by gathers they they are [TS]

00:03:08   definitely and I don't think anybody [TS]

00:03:10   really thinks that it's completely about [TS]

00:03:13   the products and i think there's plenty [TS]

00:03:14   of quality issues they've had over the [TS]

00:03:16   years and they've never been you know [TS]

00:03:19   super highly rated as far as durability [TS]

00:03:22   and longevity and quality and they had a [TS]

00:03:24   couple of like actual real problems with [TS]

00:03:26   quality but i think it's just a tough [TS]

00:03:28   category and they just didn't quite [TS]

00:03:30   figure it out you know [TS]

00:03:32   yeah it's just it it's okay [TS]

00:03:35   they recruited you know they stand up [TS]

00:03:37   they stand alone as the only independent [TS]

00:03:40   company that's making fitness trackers [TS]

00:03:43   that that is worth even talking about [TS]

00:03:45   but it doesn't seem like they got it [TS]

00:03:47   over the hump and it's i think in [TS]

00:03:49   particular Apple watch is is doing them [TS]

00:03:52   in that [TS]

00:03:53   yeah I mean there's a heavy market in [TS]

00:03:55   this casual market of people who want to [TS]

00:03:57   spend like let's say somewhere around [TS]

00:03:59   two three hundred dollars to track their [TS]

00:04:01   fitness it seems to me like Apple watch [TS]

00:04:03   is starting to get real attraction [TS]

00:04:07   outside the early adopters you know [TS]

00:04:09   market and I i think it's that fits [TS]

00:04:11   expense [TS]

00:04:13   yeah aiden is sort of the you know you [TS]

00:04:17   bought a phone they used to be I mean [TS]

00:04:19   maybe what 45 years ago you bought a [TS]

00:04:21   phone make phone calls and maybe write [TS]

00:04:22   text messages and you got all these apps [TS]

00:04:24   with it you know you also the stuff and [TS]

00:04:26   then you come to love [TS]

00:04:27   and pretty soon you're not making phone [TS]

00:04:29   calls at all your texting everybody with [TS]

00:04:30   you know messenger or whatever but I [TS]

00:04:33   think it's the same kind of concept you [TS]

00:04:35   know so people are saying hey you know [TS]

00:04:36   now the price is getting to where I [TS]

00:04:39   don't mind spending tuner box getting [TS]

00:04:41   this thing and getting all these other [TS]

00:04:42   things with it but it's a great you know [TS]

00:04:44   so solid fitness tracker that you can do [TS]

00:04:46   all these things so yeah have category [TS]

00:04:49   and yes you mentioned a fit you know was [TS]

00:04:52   traveling alone on the backs of that one [TS]

00:04:54   pnl right right so if you break out the [TS]

00:04:56   Apple watches a business especially that [TS]

00:04:58   first launched quarter when it launched [TS]

00:05:00   I mean that stuff takes ramp time you [TS]

00:05:03   know and when it's you're relying on [TS]

00:05:05   yourself in your own revenues and [TS]

00:05:06   whatever you know venture capital [TS]

00:05:08   obviously you have you don't have [TS]

00:05:10   infinite runway [TS]

00:05:12   yeah you know yeah and i think i will [TS]

00:05:15   come back to this it on another topic in [TS]

00:05:18   a bit but I i I'm as guilty of it [TS]

00:05:22   well maybe not has anybody but I know [TS]

00:05:24   I'm guilty of it and I think others who [TS]

00:05:27   write about technology are seriously [TS]

00:05:30   guilty of being to show too focused on [TS]

00:05:34   the short term and not realizing how [TS]

00:05:36   long some things need to really get [TS]

00:05:41   mainstream acceptance you know like just [TS]

00:05:43   smartphones period you know it's like [TS]

00:05:45   remember that the what was the initial [TS]

00:05:47   goal it was like 10 million iphones in [TS]

00:05:50   the first year of sales something like [TS]

00:05:52   that and and there would you know they [TS]

00:05:57   made it but it's like if you think about [TS]

00:05:59   that now they sold 78 million phones in [TS]

00:06:02   three months [TS]

00:06:03   this last one order and whereas that you [TS]

00:06:05   know back when it first came out 10 [TS]

00:06:07   years ago it was you know we're hoping [TS]

00:06:09   for 10 million in 12 months it it takes [TS]

00:06:13   a long time you know and a part of it is [TS]

00:06:15   just the simple common sense and I mean [TS]

00:06:17   other people have written about it but [TS]

00:06:18   just there are people like me who will [TS]

00:06:21   go and buy an iphone on the day it comes [TS]

00:06:23   out but most people even if they were [TS]

00:06:26   curious and i still remember it with the [TS]

00:06:27   original iphone where like people on the [TS]

00:06:29   street would see me using it and they [TS]

00:06:31   would say right without knowing who I am [TS]

00:06:32   they would just say that iphone right [TS]

00:06:35   and they were obviously aware of it [TS]

00:06:38   they probably have one now but the it [TS]

00:06:40   took years for them to be comfortable to [TS]

00:06:42   say okay i'll get one because I've you [TS]

00:06:44   know it there's like a comfort factor of [TS]

00:06:46   Noah and I think the watches on that [TS]

00:06:48   trajectory [TS]

00:06:49   mmm yeah i think so I mean I think I've [TS]

00:06:53   definitely had it right now it's it's [TS]

00:06:57   exited that phase for me it's not like [TS]

00:06:59   people see it on my wrist and go you [TS]

00:07:01   know like oh my god is an Apple watch [TS]

00:07:02   what the dude say is oh you know I'm [TS]

00:07:06   thinking like it are used to using it [TS]

00:07:07   tonight which is an interesting way to [TS]

00:07:09   phrase it right and i think that that's [TS]

00:07:11   partially from the narrative you know I [TS]

00:07:15   guess you could call it media narrative [TS]

00:07:16   or whatever [TS]

00:07:17   hmm that the watch isn't all that useful [TS]

00:07:21   long-term that there's initial the [TS]

00:07:23   initial wave of like oh hey a book [TS]

00:07:25   around and then eventually get tired of [TS]

00:07:27   it and put it away and I definitely know [TS]

00:07:28   that there are plenty of people that [TS]

00:07:29   don't wear those anymore whatever right [TS]

00:07:31   there's gonna be that with any gadget [TS]

00:07:33   doesn't fit either what the company [TS]

00:07:36   tried to sell you it was or what you [TS]

00:07:39   know whatever their success or failure [TS]

00:07:41   and communicating what it was was or [TS]

00:07:43   your own vision of what how it would fit [TS]

00:07:45   into your life didn't quite match up [TS]

00:07:46   with how it actually did right and so I [TS]

00:07:49   think that we've exited that phase and [TS]

00:07:52   now we're in a phase where the people [TS]

00:07:53   that are still wearing it are advocating [TS]

00:07:56   in ways that are more specific [TS]

00:07:58   they're like yes i love it because x y [TS]

00:08:00   know right it's not like oh yes i love [TS]

00:08:02   it and then like what do you like about [TS]

00:08:04   it wow look at all these things and this [TS]

00:08:05   thing and that they don't think we're [TS]

00:08:07   out of that you were into these are the [TS]

00:08:09   practical benefits it offers me [TS]

00:08:11   oh yeah I have all my calendar stuff on [TS]

00:08:13   there like that's enough for most people [TS]

00:08:14   or I have you know it's a great fitness [TS]

00:08:16   tracker you know I go to the gym every [TS]

00:08:19   day all right I cycle or swim or you [TS]

00:08:21   know etc etc people are figuring out the [TS]

00:08:23   things that work for them and so it's [TS]

00:08:26   it's more about the precise benefits on [TS]

00:08:29   an individual basis versus the entire [TS]

00:08:32   you know bolus of benefits that could [TS]

00:08:35   theoretically apply to you you know and [TS]

00:08:38   i think that that that could be where [TS]

00:08:40   the sustained growth is coming from [TS]

00:08:42   versus the initial wave of who knows [TS]

00:08:44   yeah it's also true that [TS]

00:08:46   I mean we knew this this isn't something [TS]

00:08:48   we needed that to hear from tim cook on [TS]

00:08:50   the conference call today with you could [TS]

00:08:52   tell just by going to the apple store [TS]

00:08:53   and trying to buy an Apple watch that [TS]

00:08:55   they were backordered foremost last [TS]

00:08:57   square or still are i think that you [TS]

00:09:01   know they could make them fast enough [TS]

00:09:02   which is a good sign I guess [TS]

00:09:05   yeah i mean i think initially you know [TS]

00:09:09   you never know whether they just didn't [TS]

00:09:10   know how many to make or what or whether [TS]

00:09:13   they didn't know what the right mix was [TS]

00:09:15   right there [TS]

00:09:16   additionally there was a lot more people [TS]

00:09:17   buying steel then maybe they thought and [TS]

00:09:20   so there was no sin credibly hard to get [TS]

00:09:22   steel ones for a long time but now I [TS]

00:09:24   think they're getting the mix figured [TS]

00:09:25   out so if they have that makes figured [TS]

00:09:27   out that eliminates that and now you are [TS]

00:09:30   looking at [TS]

00:09:30   yeah they're just having a hard time [TS]

00:09:32   keeping up with in which theoretically [TS]

00:09:33   should be a good thing [TS]

00:09:35   on the flip side they're keeping up with [TS]

00:09:37   it so there are selling as many as they [TS]

00:09:39   could [TS]

00:09:39   which is you know not great for your [TS]

00:09:41   shareholders or whatever you want to [TS]

00:09:42   call it now with iphone sales rebounding [TS]

00:09:47   and actually growing and breaking a [TS]

00:09:49   record it did even with that even saying [TS]

00:09:53   it to record it's clear it's it's a few [TS]

00:09:57   fractions of a percentage you know I [TS]

00:09:59   think I think it's 78 million they sold [TS]

00:10:00   in 12 years ago that was the previous [TS]

00:10:02   record was like 74 million phones or [TS]

00:10:05   something like that so the e the years [TS]

00:10:08   of raw fifty percent growth [TS]

00:10:10   year-over-year are over and i think that [TS]

00:10:13   you know common sense would tell you why [TS]

00:10:15   it's because the smartphone is sort of a [TS]

00:10:17   at a saturated product I mean not that [TS]

00:10:20   there's no room for growth and in [TS]

00:10:21   certain markets but for the most part [TS]

00:10:23   over the last 10 years we've reached the [TS]

00:10:25   point where almost everybody who might [TS]

00:10:29   get a smartphone has a smartphone right [TS]

00:10:33   well i mean i think it looks like there [TS]

00:10:37   was a decline in China but every other [TS]

00:10:40   market grew yeah which is that's pretty [TS]

00:10:44   solid [TS]

00:10:45   I mean China is its own Beast you know [TS]

00:10:47   it's incredibly difficult to do business [TS]

00:10:48   there as Apple has found over the years [TS]

00:10:50   you know and we only know the public [TS]

00:10:52   stuff we don't know that many challenges [TS]

00:10:55   they come up against with the government [TS]

00:10:57   and everything else that don't quite [TS]

00:10:59   make it to the page [TS]

00:11:00   but outside of that every other region [TS]

00:11:03   was growing and I think that people [TS]

00:11:05   think of saturation and replacement [TS]

00:11:08   cycles and things like that the people [TS]

00:11:11   that do you think of those things are [TS]

00:11:13   not eat they're not communicating it [TS]

00:11:16   well or I should say that they [TS]

00:11:17   communicated fine in there in their vain [TS]

00:11:19   but it's hard to characterize those [TS]

00:11:23   things and turn them into very human you [TS]

00:11:26   know sentences or or ideas or concepts [TS]

00:11:29   for people that can help them understand [TS]

00:11:32   where the growth is coming from and [TS]

00:11:33   whether sustained growth will come from [TS]

00:11:35   because it's like you could say hey you [TS]

00:11:37   know ever every ex years people are [TS]

00:11:39   going to replace their iphone and that [TS]

00:11:41   changes based on you know major design [TS]

00:11:43   changes right sort of major design [TS]

00:11:45   change here the replacement cycle may be [TS]

00:11:47   lowered by thirty percent and then you [TS]

00:11:49   can also go to like you know there's new [TS]

00:11:52   people being born so people are turning [TS]

00:11:54   what 12 13 or 14 now that were you know [TS]

00:11:59   just born when the iphone came out and [TS]

00:12:02   they're getting phone so we're getting [TS]

00:12:03   into like the first wave of like I don't [TS]

00:12:07   new iphone consumers first-generation my [TS]

00:12:10   phone consumers so there are lots of [TS]

00:12:12   factors it's a very like liquid thing [TS]

00:12:14   and everybody treats it like oh yeah [TS]

00:12:16   everybody has a phone one at you know [TS]

00:12:17   has won once once that's it but i think [TS]

00:12:20   apple is looking at growth in terms of [TS]

00:12:22   all of these variables and and the [TS]

00:12:24   projections show you know revenue [TS]

00:12:26   projection guidance wise you know it's [TS]

00:12:28   like 51 I guess 253 billion something [TS]

00:12:31   like that you know that they're [TS]

00:12:32   projecting which is not crazy high but [TS]

00:12:36   not like by any means and so I think [TS]

00:12:37   that you know I think that they feel [TS]

00:12:39   that they've got the growth out there [TS]

00:12:41   yeah in those pockets and I think that I [TS]

00:12:46   i think a lot of people thought you know [TS]

00:12:50   long story short last year for the [TS]

00:12:52   calendar year [TS]

00:12:53   iphone sales were down year-over-year [TS]

00:12:55   the success seemingly didn't sell as or [TS]

00:12:59   didn't sell as well as the six and i say [TS]

00:13:03   that my only hesitation in saying that [TS]

00:13:05   is is my presumption that most iphone [TS]

00:13:07   sold our the the new you know the [TS]

00:13:10   top-of-the-line new model and because [TS]

00:13:12   you don't know that they don't break [TS]

00:13:13   that [TS]

00:13:13   down for competitive reasons so in [TS]

00:13:15   theory right you know they could have [TS]

00:13:17   sold you know the iphone SE could [TS]

00:13:19   secretly be the best selling iphone but [TS]

00:13:21   anecdotally it certainly seems that that [TS]

00:13:24   doesn't seem the way most people by the [TS]

00:13:26   the best 1i think some people saw last [TS]

00:13:31   year's slight dip and thought you know [TS]

00:13:33   whether it was just to be dramatic and [TS]

00:13:36   you know make clickbait predictions but [TS]

00:13:40   you know so does the beginning of a [TS]

00:13:41   trend as opposed to the counter-argument [TS]

00:13:44   was just that it looks like a dip [TS]

00:13:46   because the six was such an outlier in [TS]

00:13:50   terms of their having been so much [TS]

00:13:52   pent-up demand for a quote unquote [TS]

00:13:54   bigger iphone who and I think this you [TS]

00:13:59   know the numbers they just announced for [TS]

00:14:01   the iphone 7 certainly back that up that [TS]

00:14:03   it's it was just an outlier [TS]

00:14:05   yeah i think so i think the plus I guess [TS]

00:14:09   Tim said on the call that the iphone 7 [TS]

00:14:12   plus was the highest portion in was a [TS]

00:14:14   higher portion of the mix that fast [TS]

00:14:16   yeah so that you know people are getting [TS]

00:14:19   acclimated to the larger phones that [TS]

00:14:21   increases their profit margins obviously [TS]

00:14:24   because the larger phones don't cost [TS]

00:14:25   them you know whatever percent learn her [TS]

00:14:28   whatever percent more to make it [TS]

00:14:30   increases their asp their average [TS]

00:14:32   selling price which is always a guidance [TS]

00:14:34   point that like analysts love to look at [TS]

00:14:36   because it means that for every every [TS]

00:14:39   amount of ounce of effort they put into [TS]

00:14:40   marketing or whatever the case may be [TS]

00:14:42   the return is higher [TS]

00:14:44   you know because you get the individual [TS]

00:14:46   unit that's a higher higher price and it [TS]

00:14:48   really cost you roughly the same amount [TS]

00:14:50   to sell that as it does anything else [TS]

00:14:52   you know it's like growing a tall tree [TS]

00:14:54   versus a short tree and they're both [TS]

00:14:56   trees right now so there's there's a [TS]

00:14:58   definite like positivity around that I [TS]

00:15:02   think I've been seeing that the bigger [TS]

00:15:04   phones are people love them they're [TS]

00:15:06   taking them up and they're they're [TS]

00:15:09   buying more than ever it is interesting [TS]

00:15:11   and you know i think apple is pretty [TS]

00:15:14   good at this stuff but it's always [TS]

00:15:16   interesting to see them admit that they [TS]

00:15:18   don't that their their estimates were [TS]

00:15:20   off and it's you know like you said that [TS]

00:15:23   they've admitted that the the mix of the [TS]

00:15:25   plus to the non plus 7 even know that [TS]

00:15:27   regular iphone 7 they said was the [TS]

00:15:29   best-selling model the plus sold better [TS]

00:15:32   this year than it has a guest in the [TS]

00:15:34   previous two years and write that is a [TS]

00:15:37   mix of them you know then versus the [TS]

00:15:39   other right [TS]

00:15:40   I makes me wonder in particular if the [TS]

00:15:44   the the camera in particular I it when [TS]

00:15:49   it's got me right i mean yeah sure part [TS]

00:15:51   of it is just getting used to bigger [TS]

00:15:52   size for the camera has to drive like X [TS]

00:15:54   percent of it like I'm not I'm not [TS]

00:15:56   pulling out a number let's say thirty [TS]

00:15:58   percent of the decisions to buy that [TS]

00:16:00   phone [TS]

00:16:00   we're always got the better camera so [TS]

00:16:02   let's get that one right [TS]

00:16:04   yeah and it seems like something that it [TS]

00:16:07   you can see it when you're in the store [TS]

00:16:10   like if you go into store and you're on [TS]

00:16:12   the fence over whether to get an iphone [TS]

00:16:13   7 or 7 plus starting this year [TS]

00:16:17   you can tell just by looking without [TS]

00:16:18   even trying the camera it looks [TS]

00:16:20   different right it's it's double the [TS]

00:16:22   size it looks like it you know you can [TS]

00:16:23   see that it has like optic that the [TS]

00:16:26   previous years that's the plus models [TS]

00:16:28   had the optical image stabilization with [TS]

00:16:30   the starting with the six it was forced [TS]

00:16:32   stills only in a success added it for [TS]

00:16:36   video that's a great feature especially [TS]

00:16:40   for video I mean it's it i add it's [TS]

00:16:44   almost unbelievable how good some of my [TS]

00:16:46   little home family videos come out now [TS]

00:16:48   uh yeah because of image stabilization [TS]

00:16:50   on video but you can't see it in the [TS]

00:16:56   store so it's just a bullet point and [TS]

00:16:58   everybody is I think it it you build up [TS]

00:17:02   an immunity to bullet points because [TS]

00:17:04   every time you buy anything whether it's [TS]

00:17:06   a car or a toaster oven [TS]

00:17:09   you know it everything has bullet point [TS]

00:17:11   yeah here's the features that your [TS]

00:17:13   coffee maker has 12 cups you know it has [TS]

00:17:17   a large coffee right makes coffee [TS]

00:17:21   whereas you just look at the back of the [TS]

00:17:24   seven plus and you could get the idea [TS]

00:17:26   that the camera is better on this one [TS]

00:17:29   than the smaller one [TS]

00:17:30   it seems visceral because you just look [TS]

00:17:32   at it I can't help but think that that [TS]

00:17:33   actually successfully bumped sales of [TS]

00:17:36   this which in turn makes me think [TS]

00:17:39   yeah that if you know [TS]

00:17:41   it they may not be done we this might [TS]

00:17:44   just be the start of the bigger more [TS]

00:17:46   expensive iPhone having tangibly better [TS]

00:17:49   camera technology just because it it [TS]

00:17:52   seems like it's proof that it can drive [TS]

00:17:53   sales [TS]

00:17:54   I think you're you're right at there are [TS]

00:17:56   two things I think are really driving [TS]

00:17:59   this i have a hundred percent agree that [TS]

00:18:01   the difference could actually you know [TS]

00:18:03   the physical difference the way it looks [TS]

00:18:05   could definitely make a big difference [TS]

00:18:07   but you're right on there in it i know [TS]

00:18:09   there will people be people listen to [TS]

00:18:11   this and they'll laugh and be like oh [TS]

00:18:13   yeah I do you know people just look at [TS]

00:18:15   the back of it and going oh yeah this [TS]

00:18:16   one's bigger got a bigger camera thingy [TS]

00:18:18   on and i'm gonna buy that but he I think [TS]

00:18:21   people would be shocked especially [TS]

00:18:23   people that listen to this show which [TS]

00:18:25   you know this subset of people that are [TS]

00:18:27   in the world that listen to the show you [TS]

00:18:30   know how much higher technical savvy [TS]

00:18:32   than average probably do a lot more [TS]

00:18:33   research on products and average you [TS]

00:18:36   know if you were doing a demographic [TS]

00:18:37   survey i think that none of these things [TS]

00:18:38   would be surprising right but i think [TS]

00:18:41   people underestimate very heavily how [TS]

00:18:43   little research people do when they go [TS]

00:18:44   to buy stuff in a store like they'll go [TS]

00:18:46   to the store to get a phone and not [TS]

00:18:49   having looked at a single thing online [TS]

00:18:50   or asked anybody or whatever and they'll [TS]

00:18:54   just go and they'll just like I want the [TS]

00:18:55   best along X or Y personal axis you know [TS]

00:18:59   best camera or most storage or whatever [TS]

00:19:03   honestly whatever most recent problem [TS]

00:19:04   they had is probably how they pick and [TS]

00:19:07   I've seen this myself I used to work in [TS]

00:19:09   big-box retail and you know have sold a [TS]

00:19:12   lot of different things over the years [TS]

00:19:13   but the one of the times i was selling [TS]

00:19:15   like digital cameras especially this is [TS]

00:19:18   like early in the early digital camera [TS]

00:19:20   is very early and you know somebody [TS]

00:19:22   comes in is looking like a magic against [TS]

00:19:24   sony mavica which one of the ones that [TS]

00:19:26   took the floppy disks [TS]

00:19:27   yeah you would throw those in there and [TS]

00:19:29   you know they honestly nine times outta [TS]

00:19:33   ten all they want is which one has the [TS]

00:19:35   biggest number on the box they would [TS]

00:19:37   literally look at the boxes and they go [TS]

00:19:38   all this one has 10 that one has eight [TS]

00:19:40   and you know well yes but the one that's [TS]

00:19:42   I mean if you're an honest person you [TS]

00:19:45   know the one that's eight that slightly [TS]

00:19:46   less is actually better for you because [TS]

00:19:48   I don't know it has this swivel thing [TS]

00:19:50   and you really need that for whatever [TS]

00:19:51   you're doing but if you don't have that [TS]

00:19:53   person there [TS]

00:19:54   that decision is getting made based on [TS]

00:19:56   the number on the box right [TS]

00:19:58   hey that's ten this was aight i'll get [TS]

00:20:00   the 10 right i have the money that's [TS]

00:20:01   fine we'll go and that i think that [TS]

00:20:03   people make those decisions that way a [TS]

00:20:06   lot more than most people think and even [TS]

00:20:08   though apple store employees are [TS]

00:20:11   theoretically better informed than your [TS]

00:20:13   average big-box retailer they don't have [TS]

00:20:15   the time Apple stores are more crowded [TS]

00:20:17   than ever people are making decisions [TS]

00:20:18   without intervention by an employee and [TS]

00:20:21   just asking the employee to set it up [TS]

00:20:23   for them and hopefully the employee [TS]

00:20:25   maybe intervenes at some point if they [TS]

00:20:26   feel it's the wrong product for them and [TS]

00:20:28   tries to switch the something that is [TS]

00:20:29   but there's no guarantees [TS]

00:20:31   so I think that literally the physical [TS]

00:20:33   difference in the camera could have make [TS]

00:20:36   a real big difference for people because [TS]

00:20:38   of those reasons and it's it seems silly [TS]

00:20:41   or obvious or whatever but people are [TS]

00:20:45   silly and obvious when they buy you know [TS]

00:20:47   that's just remove them and vast [TS]

00:20:48   majority of consumers that way and I [TS]

00:20:51   think it's also telling how long Apple [TS]

00:20:53   has stuck with the shot shot on iphone [TS]

00:20:57   ad campaign you know and and you know [TS]

00:21:00   shelter said it when he was on my show [TS]

00:21:02   forget it was last year that the first [TS]

00:21:05   time two years ago where I I think name [TS]

00:21:07   drop by the I asked him like dude I [TS]

00:21:11   think it was two years ago because i [TS]

00:21:12   think last year would have it was so [TS]

00:21:13   obvious it would it wasn't too late to [TS]

00:21:15   ask but I just said like it do you [TS]

00:21:18   consider apple one of the leading camera [TS]

00:21:21   companies in the world and his answer [TS]

00:21:22   was the leading camera company in the [TS]

00:21:24   world i mean threats totally how he sees [TS]

00:21:26   you know it the importance of the camera [TS]

00:21:29   on the on the phone and I really did [TS]

00:21:31   there's no other explanation I can think [TS]

00:21:33   of for why this the mix of plus 2 non [TS]

00:21:35   plus would grow up this year because one [TS]

00:21:38   of the big complaints about that the [TS]

00:21:40   iphone 7 is that it quote unquote looks [TS]

00:21:41   just like the iphone 6 and success that [TS]

00:21:43   it's otherwise who cares i just it seems [TS]

00:21:48   like the obvious [TS]

00:21:49   yeah and it's it's a it's a great lever [TS]

00:21:54   to get people to buy that bigger phone [TS]

00:21:56   even though they don't want the bigger [TS]

00:21:58   screen you know because people are often [TS]

00:22:00   just shocked by how large it is [TS]

00:22:02   physically when they hold it you know if [TS]

00:22:04   I had somebody if I have a7 now but like [TS]

00:22:07   I off [TS]

00:22:08   use the seven plus special traveling and [TS]

00:22:10   so if i had to somebody there homey and [TS]

00:22:12   this is big you know if they've never [TS]

00:22:13   used one real one but it's a testament [TS]

00:22:16   to how how driven by camera people are [TS]

00:22:20   no don't put up with that [TS]

00:22:22   so to speak and knowing how hard the [TS]

00:22:26   camera team at apple had to push to make [TS]

00:22:30   this thing even work right that dual [TS]

00:22:33   camera thing up which is a fairly it's a [TS]

00:22:35   really significant technical you know [TS]

00:22:37   achievement and it's another company had [TS]

00:22:40   done this I mean Apple you know they [TS]

00:22:42   took their own horn a lot right but it's [TS]

00:22:45   another company had done this they would [TS]

00:22:47   have to 10 times as much as it's [TS]

00:22:49   actually a very very very very difficult [TS]

00:22:50   technical problem what they achieved [TS]

00:22:52   here and it out of everything in the [TS]

00:22:55   camera the the excuse me out of [TS]

00:22:59   everything in the phone [TS]

00:23:01   the camera is really the only thing [TS]

00:23:03   that's pushing the processor to its [TS]

00:23:06   limits into its absolute peak limits [TS]

00:23:09   right now you know I mean you know a [TS]

00:23:11   game or whatever the case maybe they [TS]

00:23:12   know what the limits are they work [TS]

00:23:14   within those but most games that on [TS]

00:23:17   average that people play are really [TS]

00:23:19   pushing that hard games is probably the [TS]

00:23:21   number to category but above that and up [TS]

00:23:24   far above anything else that most people [TS]

00:23:26   do on their phones or most of the [TS]

00:23:28   capabilities of the phone which are [TS]

00:23:29   pretty well known by now that the camera [TS]

00:23:32   in that net seven-plus with its dual [TS]

00:23:35   lens and in twin capture and blending of [TS]

00:23:38   the pair of photos and all of the stuff [TS]

00:23:41   that it does it really is pushing very [TS]

00:23:43   very hard that a series chip so it's [TS]

00:23:47   like a leading driver of the power the [TS]

00:23:50   chip power that's in the phone because [TS]

00:23:53   that chip does and has done everything [TS]

00:23:55   it needs to do for most people for a [TS]

00:23:57   very long time you know for several [TS]

00:23:59   generations [TS]

00:24:00   yeah and so it's it's driving forward [TS]

00:24:02   the processing capability and power of [TS]

00:24:05   the phone and I think it's not driving [TS]

00:24:07   sales along with it and it's it was [TS]

00:24:09   clearly instrumental in the poor [TS]

00:24:12   treatment or is you know at like why you [TS]

00:24:16   know why did portrait mode and the [TS]

00:24:18   dual-mode thing ship this year I'm [TS]

00:24:21   part of it was I think that the camera [TS]

00:24:22   engineering just the camera itself took [TS]

00:24:26   a long time I think it's complicated and [TS]

00:24:27   just the the the algorithm of how are [TS]

00:24:30   you going to use these two lenses for [TS]

00:24:34   zooming and and etc etc but i think [TS]

00:24:37   another part of it too was that it was [TS]

00:24:38   coincident with the a-series chip [TS]

00:24:41   getting fast enough that you can do this [TS]

00:24:42   on the fly from what I know about how [TS]

00:24:45   long it took them to build this and [TS]

00:24:47   obviously everybody knows that it didn't [TS]

00:24:49   ship with the phone right [TS]

00:24:51   it shipped the ships of a week later [TS]

00:24:52   right I don't think that was true [TS]

00:24:54   teaching and now i think it was [TS]

00:24:56   necessary [TS]

00:24:57   yeah it was it was absolutely necessary [TS]

00:24:59   for them to actually make it work like [TS]

00:25:01   finish it and get it to work and that [TS]

00:25:04   doesn't happen if you've been able to do [TS]

00:25:05   it for a processor generation right let [TS]

00:25:07   you use it you know literally Matthew [TS]

00:25:10   bands are you know where the first [TS]

00:25:11   person I knew who had access to it [TS]

00:25:12   because you got a pre-release version of [TS]

00:25:15   it at least a couple of days ahead of [TS]

00:25:17   the beta coming out and you had like a [TS]

00:25:20   nice little exclusive on on techcrunch [TS]

00:25:23   with with adorable pictures of your your [TS]

00:25:25   daughter but they were really want a pic [TS]

00:25:28   they chose well because you're you know [TS]

00:25:30   you've got a background in photography [TS]

00:25:31   so you're not just sitting there [TS]

00:25:33   shooting pictures of here you know I [TS]

00:25:36   don't know your desk or whatever [TS]

00:25:37   yeah but I think you could I even when [TS]

00:25:40   it first came out and they let us use [TS]

00:25:42   the beta there were performance problems [TS]

00:25:45   with it that that happens been ironed [TS]

00:25:47   out and now it's just there is a sort of [TS]

00:25:49   it just works you put in portrait mode [TS]

00:25:51   the preview is live the phone doesn't [TS]

00:25:53   get hot and it just works [TS]

00:25:55   yeah that stuff is being iterated on as [TS]

00:25:57   we speak like you and I are talking [TS]

00:25:58   right now it's four o'clock [TS]

00:26:00   you know I'm sure the camera team is [TS]

00:26:02   still working on updates to that thing [TS]

00:26:04   right because it's it's a living [TS]

00:26:07   document you know in terms of the way [TS]

00:26:10   that it performs the edge detection gets [TS]

00:26:12   better every iteration and the the blur [TS]

00:26:14   effect gets more organic and more [TS]

00:26:16   natural you know that they're able to [TS]

00:26:18   push that processor via optimization [TS]

00:26:20   because obviously the hardware and [TS]

00:26:21   changed right so they are able to [TS]

00:26:23   optimize the process is further so [TS]

00:26:25   they're able to do more and more complex [TS]

00:26:26   calculations on that but it really is [TS]

00:26:28   bleeding edge stuff like there no nobody [TS]

00:26:31   else is pushing this hard and people [TS]

00:26:32   were very quick they don't want to [TS]

00:26:34   published that preview and then [TS]

00:26:36   eventually when when we did that like [TS]

00:26:38   the review the phone and stuff like that [TS]

00:26:40   we were very quick to say all you know [TS]

00:26:41   what this model or that model from some [TS]

00:26:43   other brand has been doing the years at [TS]

00:26:45   yada it's true that other brands have [TS]

00:26:50   done this show blur thing but not in [TS]

00:26:53   this way and not to this level of [TS]

00:26:55   sophistication and to be honest even [TS]

00:26:57   though some of the results were kind of [TS]

00:26:59   hinky up front you know what's gonna get [TS]

00:27:01   better because they're dedicated to [TS]

00:27:02   making it better and they have they know [TS]

00:27:04   this is a primary driver of purchases [TS]

00:27:07   whereas a lot of these other phones it [TS]

00:27:09   was a one-off gimmick to try and sell [TS]

00:27:11   phones that quarter and really is going [TS]

00:27:13   to get no significant updates in the [TS]

00:27:15   future you know and it's it's a shame [TS]

00:27:18   but nobody else is really driving like [TS]

00:27:19   that Samsung works sort of backwards [TS]

00:27:22   right from like oh you know what did [TS]

00:27:24   what do we think the market wants this [TS]

00:27:26   quarter [TS]

00:27:27   let's try to produce that and then you [TS]

00:27:29   know they're i'm not saying that they're [TS]

00:27:31   their products are not you know solid or [TS]

00:27:33   you know decent or whatever if they [TS]

00:27:35   don't explode but there isn't there is a [TS]

00:27:38   drive there to get that kind of stuff [TS]

00:27:41   right because they know that this is the [TS]

00:27:46   thing that people want it's not it's not [TS]

00:27:48   what they say they want which is more [TS]

00:27:50   megapixels or you know sharper images or [TS]

00:27:53   were these crude terms that they used to [TS]

00:27:55   describe it it's actually they want [TS]

00:27:57   their pictures look more like pictures [TS]

00:27:58   and that's a really nebulous thing until [TS]

00:28:00   you you know you sort of figure out how [TS]

00:28:02   to define that I think there's been a [TS]

00:28:04   lot of time trying to define that for [TS]

00:28:05   people [TS]

00:28:06   yeah I also think it is the clearest [TS]

00:28:11   path that I can think of because I I [TS]

00:28:13   fail and certain other forms of [TS]

00:28:15   imagination of how can the iphone [TS]

00:28:18   continue to get better and there are [TS]

00:28:22   some little things you know like a like [TS]

00:28:25   the true tone color that the ipad pro [TS]

00:28:28   has that would be great to eventually [TS]

00:28:30   have it on the iphone to there's you [TS]

00:28:32   know but that I can't see the display [TS]

00:28:35   quality quality wise getting radically [TS]

00:28:38   better so much so that it would that's [TS]

00:28:40   why you get a new phone [TS]

00:28:42   everybody's Reuters rumors are rampant [TS]

00:28:44   that the industrial design is going to [TS]

00:28:46   change and they're going to get rid of [TS]

00:28:47   the head [TS]

00:28:48   forehead and just sort of go from top to [TS]

00:28:50   bottom left to right edge-to-edge [TS]

00:28:51   display and visually that would be very [TS]

00:28:54   striking if it looks super cool then I [TS]

00:28:59   could see that driving sales but how [TS]

00:29:00   many do you know after you do that how [TS]

00:29:02   does it keep going [TS]

00:29:03   whereas the camera can continue to get [TS]

00:29:05   better every 12 months maybe not in a [TS]

00:29:08   radical way because you run up in the [TS]

00:29:10   limits of physics but you know and lens [TS]

00:29:13   optics but in a tangible way and that if [TS]

00:29:17   you're only if you're on like a two or [TS]

00:29:18   three-year upgrade cycle you can get a [TS]

00:29:20   radically better camera every time you [TS]

00:29:21   upgrade to a new phone back to me could [TS]

00:29:24   continue to drive sales about where we [TS]

00:29:27   are right now for the iphone four years [TS]

00:29:28   to come [TS]

00:29:29   yeah yeah there's there's not much else [TS]

00:29:34   for them to chip away at and I think [TS]

00:29:37   there will be new opportunities in other [TS]

00:29:40   categories that may even involve the [TS]

00:29:42   camera you know they are augmented [TS]

00:29:45   reality or VR whatever the case but as [TS]

00:29:47   far as like the on-device components [TS]

00:29:50   there they're pretty well along towards [TS]

00:29:53   a you know diminishing returns right so [TS]

00:29:57   yeah i agree Cameras Cameras a primary [TS]

00:30:00   driver they're all right let me take a [TS]

00:30:01   break here and thank our first sponsors [TS]

00:30:03   a new sponsor very excited about this [TS]

00:30:05   company company ministry of supply [TS]

00:30:07   ministry of supply makes performance [TS]

00:30:12   dress clothes [TS]

00:30:14   what does that mean well it was launched [TS]

00:30:15   by a bunch of a group of it former [TS]

00:30:17   engineers engineering students from MIT [TS]

00:30:20   and they make fabrics performance [TS]

00:30:25   fabrics the type of things that are on [TS]

00:30:27   like gym clothes but they use them to [TS]

00:30:29   make a dress clothes like stuff that [TS]

00:30:32   you'd wear to work [TS]

00:30:33   they are breathable they are flexible [TS]

00:30:36   they are way more comfortable totally [TS]

00:30:39   feel different and even less resist [TS]

00:30:42   they're even more resistant to wrinkles [TS]

00:30:43   should say less resistant more resistant [TS]

00:30:45   they sent me some samples they sent me a [TS]

00:30:48   jacket very nice jacket and a very nice [TS]

00:30:50   dress shirt the dress shirt is is a [TS]

00:30:52   really really nice feels great looks [TS]

00:30:56   great and even when i took out of the [TS]

00:30:58   box my wife even commented on [TS]

00:31:00   shirt she was like well what is that you [TS]

00:31:02   know because it just looks a little [TS]

00:31:04   different not like in terms of like [TS]

00:31:05   weird but just sort of like he's like a [TS]

00:31:07   nice Sheen to it was very very nice [TS]

00:31:09   they also sent me some socks just socks [TS]

00:31:11   and they're very comfortable socks so [TS]

00:31:16   here's what a is one of the examples [TS]

00:31:17   men's future forward dress shirt I think [TS]

00:31:20   that's the one they sent me it regulate [TS]

00:31:22   your body temperature based on your [TS]

00:31:24   surroundings keeps you warmer when it's [TS]

00:31:26   cold keeps you cooler when it's warm [TS]

00:31:28   there dress shots are made out of coffee [TS]

00:31:30   fibers that whisks wet and absorb odor [TS]

00:31:34   they provide extreme question and [TS]

00:31:36   shockingly comfortable i can vouch for [TS]

00:31:38   that the socks are super comfortable no [TS]

00:31:41   risk they offer free shipping free [TS]

00:31:43   returns and a wonder day no questions [TS]

00:31:45   asked return policy so you can buy your [TS]

00:31:49   clothes get your shirt find out it's the [TS]

00:31:51   slightly wrong sighs maybe you should [TS]

00:31:52   have got no one little smaller little [TS]

00:31:54   bigger send it back [TS]

00:31:56   totally free of 200 days couldn't be [TS]

00:31:58   better go to their website is Ministry [TS]

00:32:02   of supply.com / the talkshow Ministry of [TS]

00:32:08   supply.com / the talk show and what [TS]

00:32:12   they'll do if you go there is they will [TS]

00:32:15   send you a free pair of their moisture [TS]

00:32:17   wicking dress socks for free [TS]

00:32:20   fifteen dollar value with your first [TS]

00:32:22   purchase and they also have seven retail [TS]

00:32:24   stores including bethesda maryland [TS]

00:32:27   Chicago and Atlanta and you can go into [TS]

00:32:29   the retail stores if there's one near [TS]

00:32:31   you and just mention the talk show when [TS]

00:32:34   you checkout and you'll get that same [TS]

00:32:35   free pair of socks so my thanks to [TS]

00:32:38   Ministry of supply great great sponsor [TS]

00:32:41   love it really really cool stuff [TS]

00:32:43   what next on the on a the results front [TS]

00:32:47   ipad maybe ipad sales were 16 million [TS]

00:32:52   last year the same quarter and third [TS]

00:32:54   down to 13 million this quarter [TS]

00:32:55   I don't know what to make it up i don't [TS]

00:33:00   know i mean i think that i think we're [TS]

00:33:05   still we're still trying to find the the [TS]

00:33:09   replacement cycle and they and the [TS]

00:33:12   bottom of it you know [TS]

00:33:14   the what we call it the bottom the [TS]

00:33:16   bottom of the pencil mark [TS]

00:33:18   yeah but where it starts to swing back [TS]

00:33:20   up and people repurchase or steady [TS]

00:33:22   stabilizes anyway yeah i don't know i [TS]

00:33:26   mean i think there's two schools of [TS]

00:33:28   thought on this I think you could argue [TS]

00:33:29   that you know iPads are built really [TS]

00:33:31   well and they handle you know single [TS]

00:33:34   tasks and it's sort of like you got up [TS]

00:33:37   apple sold a framing hammer to someone [TS]

00:33:43   to hang pictures right mm so like you [TS]

00:33:47   video you go to the hardware store [TS]

00:33:49   there's five kinds of hammer there [TS]

00:33:51   there's a you know picture hanging [TS]

00:33:53   hammer which comes in a little like [TS]

00:33:55   plastic piano bubble pack in its got [TS]

00:34:00   like a few finish nails and the Hammers [TS]

00:34:02   like if you have anything bigger than a [TS]

00:34:04   teeny-tiny nail into a plaster or [TS]

00:34:07   whatever it just hit the head falls off [TS]

00:34:09   right and you go all the way up the [TS]

00:34:11   scale through all the different hammers [TS]

00:34:13   to a framing hammer framing hammer is a [TS]

00:34:15   hammer that like slams in 10 penny nails [TS]

00:34:18   to two-by-fours a two by sixes on a on a [TS]

00:34:21   construction lot right the framing [TS]

00:34:22   hammer is reinforced its got like a long [TS]

00:34:25   Tang thats thats you know really [TS]

00:34:27   thoroughly embedded in the head and when [TS]

00:34:29   you swing that thing paying you know it [TS]

00:34:31   goes it's gonna waffle head to see you [TS]

00:34:33   know the nail got nice and and trunk [TS]

00:34:35   down and you can see that you got your [TS]

00:34:37   imprint on that board so you know the [TS]

00:34:39   nails driven only home and you could [TS]

00:34:40   just whale away on that for ten years [TS]

00:34:42   need that hammer will last year eight so [TS]

00:34:44   apple sold people framing hammers and [TS]

00:34:48   they're they're having and picture [TS]

00:34:50   frames so you've got you know and that [TS]

00:34:55   ten-year-old or five year old or heck [TS]

00:34:57   even a teenager or adult who uses it to [TS]

00:35:01   browse the web and and for a variety of [TS]

00:35:03   different apps that don't really push [TS]

00:35:05   the capabilities of the ipad in any [TS]

00:35:06   significant way and they're like this is [TS]

00:35:09   fine [TS]

00:35:09   why can't i just keep using this because [TS]

00:35:12   that framing hammer is nowhere near its [TS]

00:35:13   limits right and i think that there's [TS]

00:35:16   that's one school of thought that like [TS]

00:35:18   you doing the ipad significantly over [TS]

00:35:20   built for the tasks that most people use [TS]

00:35:23   it for and then the other school i think [TS]

00:35:25   the other side of it [TS]

00:35:27   is Apple has not done as good a job as [TS]

00:35:30   it could explain to people how much they [TS]

00:35:34   can do with that framing hammer like [TS]

00:35:35   they haven't sold as a framing hammer [TS]

00:35:37   and so I think that there's definitely [TS]

00:35:38   some interesting debate to be had there [TS]

00:35:41   i don't even know where I fall you know [TS]

00:35:43   on that scale yet i am of two minds [TS]

00:35:45   about it but I think those are the kind [TS]

00:35:47   of arguments that people are having [TS]

00:35:48   about where the ipad is currently and [TS]

00:35:50   then on top of that you have this [TS]

00:35:52   hey we don't know how long it's gonna be [TS]

00:35:55   before people need to or want to replace [TS]

00:35:58   an ipad that they don't break right you [TS]

00:36:00   know ever since the ipad 2 or three or [TS]

00:36:02   whatever you know better i guess you'd [TS]

00:36:04   say it's been pretty capable [TS]

00:36:07   yeah so why replace it yeah i think it [TS]

00:36:10   starts with the ipad air [TS]

00:36:13   I feel like up until then it was still [TS]

00:36:16   improving rapidly I mean the first one [TS]

00:36:18   is the first one that mean you know it [TS]

00:36:20   was you know [TS]

00:36:22   Wow to tablet that people might actually [TS]

00:36:24   buy but it was super thick it didn't [TS]

00:36:25   have right now and then it got thinner [TS]

00:36:27   and then it got retina but the ipad 3 [TS]

00:36:30   that had retina actually got thicker [TS]

00:36:32   than the ipad 2 that was before it and [TS]

00:36:34   it was replaced by apple six months [TS]

00:36:36   after it came out which is sort of [TS]

00:36:38   ridiculous in hindsight just shows shows [TS]

00:36:41   how far they were pushing themselves to [TS]

00:36:43   get that retina ipad 3 out and then I [TS]

00:36:47   really feel like it found itself with [TS]

00:36:49   the ipad air where they strike the size [TS]

00:36:51   on the sides and it that the a-series [TS]

00:36:55   chips had gotten I'm sorry about that [TS]

00:36:58   that that launched Syria again on my [TS]

00:37:00   phone saying a serious [TS]

00:37:04   I'm sorry I apologise anybody out there [TS]

00:37:06   was a theory dingus was activated by it [TS]

00:37:12   but at it and I just feel like my my [TS]

00:37:15   working hypothesis on the weird [TS]

00:37:18   trajectory of ipad sales weird meaning [TS]

00:37:20   it you know at one point was like 20 [TS]

00:37:23   million a quarter and it was sky it was [TS]

00:37:25   faster [TS]

00:37:26   it was never above the iphone but it was [TS]

00:37:28   above the iphone at that date since [TS]

00:37:32   launch like the first ipad outsold the [TS]

00:37:35   first iphone the second ipad ipad 2 [TS]

00:37:37   outsold the iphone 3g [TS]

00:37:40   and you know and then it came down to [TS]

00:37:43   earth and my working theory on this is [TS]

00:37:45   simply like pretty much what you said [TS]

00:37:47   that it's there was this great unfilled [TS]

00:37:50   need Steve Jobs right that there was [TS]

00:37:52   this middle territory for something like [TS]

00:37:55   an iPad in people's lives and there was [TS]

00:37:57   nothing like it right the phones were [TS]

00:37:59   too small and laptops are you know they [TS]

00:38:04   are great for certain things but there [TS]

00:38:06   there's their impersonal enough and the [TS]

00:38:09   form factor is such that it you know it [TS]

00:38:12   creates this void that the ipad actually [TS]

00:38:15   does Phil but then once people got one [TS]

00:38:18   especially of the air vintage or later [TS]

00:38:20   there that's it they don't need another [TS]

00:38:21   one until they you know break the other [TS]

00:38:23   one who [TS]

00:38:25   yeah i mean if you look at it from the [TS]

00:38:27   terms of like a ADD Steve introduces the [TS]

00:38:29   ipad and says we think people are going [TS]

00:38:31   to love this people need this and that [TS]

00:38:33   was if you if you subscribe to the [TS]

00:38:37   histories of it the ipad was a goal and [TS]

00:38:40   the iphone was and everything that they [TS]

00:38:42   hit on but if you go to go back to that [TS]

00:38:46   and you say you have him walk onstage [TS]

00:38:49   and say we think that this is going to [TS]

00:38:52   be you know in 10 years or whatever [TS]

00:38:55   would what is an out doesn't end so 77 [TS]

00:38:59   years in seven years [TS]

00:39:00   this is going to be at that total of [TS]

00:39:03   three hundred million dollar business [TS]

00:39:04   for apple which is about what i pads are [TS]

00:39:06   maybe a little more now right people [TS]

00:39:09   would have been like overjoyed great 30 [TS]

00:39:11   million dollars uh you know that the [TS]

00:39:13   there's really a million units excuse my [TS]

00:39:15   heart three times significantly more [TS]

00:39:17   dollars but you know II you you look at [TS]

00:39:19   the amount total years old and these [TS]

00:39:22   these billions of dollars of you know [TS]

00:39:24   business that the ipad created you would [TS]

00:39:27   go hey that's an entire company more [TS]

00:39:29   than an entire company's worth of value [TS]

00:39:30   that you're going to create for apple [TS]

00:39:32   and shareholders and whatever else that [TS]

00:39:34   is more [TS]

00:39:35   that's more than great and it's only [TS]

00:39:38   because the iphone has been so you know [TS]

00:39:41   outsized popular and now we know [TS]

00:39:44   continues to grow that the ipad looks [TS]

00:39:47   poultry in comparison like it because [TS]

00:39:50   you had those go go early years [TS]

00:39:52   yeah there's at work with [TS]

00:39:54   a real ramp up right now fastest-selling [TS]

00:39:56   computer for fastest selling consumer [TS]

00:39:58   electronics device [TS]

00:40:00   I think maybe they connect beat it for a [TS]

00:40:01   time and then it will pass that around [TS]

00:40:03   don't quote me but you know one of the [TS]

00:40:05   fastest anyway selling consumer [TS]

00:40:06   electronics devices of all time and it's [TS]

00:40:09   just yeah the you can look at those boom [TS]

00:40:11   years and you go home and you know it's [TS]

00:40:14   now it's going down or whatever but you [TS]

00:40:17   know I ipad still be still sold 13 [TS]

00:40:19   million of those you know in the last [TS]

00:40:21   quarter which is crazy and if you have [TS]

00:40:23   still an enormous business and it it is [TS]

00:40:26   Apple's answer to the sub heusen dollar [TS]

00:40:30   computer market right like let's just [TS]

00:40:33   admit that the phone is a phone and even [TS]

00:40:35   Apple you know its smartphone is the [TS]

00:40:38   most important device in the computer [TS]

00:40:40   industry has ever come up with any even [TS]

00:40:41   Apple I think even as much as Apple new [TS]

00:40:43   with the 10 year ago introduction of the [TS]

00:40:45   iphone that they had something special [TS]

00:40:47   on their hands [TS]

00:40:48   I don't think they even Apple itself was [TS]

00:40:50   surprised at just how how useful [TS]

00:40:52   smartphone could be and how much we [TS]

00:40:54   would depend on it as are all right [TS]

00:40:56   primary device if you just think of the [TS]

00:40:59   ipad if they called it the mac pad [TS]

00:41:02   instead of ipad and you just counted it [TS]

00:41:04   with mac sales as pc i don't i don't [TS]

00:41:07   think that's a ridiculous comparison to [TS]

00:41:09   make you know that there are people who [TS]

00:41:11   are going to you know to gonna go drop [TS]

00:41:13   five hundred dollars on a portable [TS]

00:41:14   computer we're not going to buy a [TS]

00:41:16   macbook because there is no system is a [TS]

00:41:18   five-hundred-dollar macbook but they [TS]

00:41:19   might get an ipad pro or you know it an [TS]

00:41:22   ipad air or whatever it if you add up [TS]

00:41:27   you know those 13 million ipad sales to [TS]

00:41:31   the max five million sales that's 18 [TS]

00:41:33   million personal computers that apple [TS]

00:41:35   sold you know enough [TS]

00:41:37   whatever price range from ipad 2 to you [TS]

00:41:40   know most expensive Mac it's pretty [TS]

00:41:43   impressive but i do think that it's sort [TS]

00:41:46   of goodness i think it's already settled [TS]

00:41:48   into sort of a mac like static number of [TS]

00:41:51   how many million they can sell a quarter [TS]

00:41:53   you know so did the analogy the cars and [TS]

00:41:58   trucks analogy where the cars a you know [TS]

00:42:02   lightweight computer and a truck is a [TS]

00:42:05   desktop or wherever many people off [TS]

00:42:08   then view the ipad is the car and you [TS]

00:42:11   know that's then set the iphone aside [TS]

00:42:13   but i think it's interesting to read you [TS]

00:42:16   get a little bit and view the iphone is [TS]

00:42:18   the car [TS]

00:42:18   um you know the iphones your daily [TS]

00:42:21   driver right that you name me a day you [TS]

00:42:24   don't touch your iphone possible right [TS]

00:42:26   you lost it you broke it you don't touch [TS]

00:42:29   it other than that you touch it every [TS]

00:42:30   day [TS]

00:42:31   that's your car the desktop stays the [TS]

00:42:33   truck right so the question then is like [TS]

00:42:36   is the ipad your your utility vehicle or [TS]

00:42:44   is it your sports car in other words do [TS]

00:42:47   you like take it out on the weekends to [TS]

00:42:49   get work done or do you take it out on [TS]

00:42:50   the weekends for fun and I think that [TS]

00:42:52   there's there's whatever the case [TS]

00:42:54   whatever side of that he come down on I [TS]

00:42:56   think there's definitely a case to be [TS]

00:42:57   made for the ipad as like a a [TS]

00:42:59   purpose-driven device that mean you know [TS]

00:43:02   their whole companies built up around [TS]

00:43:04   revel systems and other things that are [TS]

00:43:06   built up around using the iPads to to [TS]

00:43:08   serve functions in the aid large portion [TS]

00:43:13   of its business is driven by [TS]

00:43:15   institutional sales right like schools [TS]

00:43:17   and other things that use the iPads in [TS]

00:43:20   in very specific ways and I think that [TS]

00:43:23   there's did the netbook arena whatever [TS]

00:43:27   when you remember the netbook error in [TS]

00:43:28   schools when everybody's like all of [TS]

00:43:30   this by netbooks for the kids and those [TS]

00:43:32   things are just so bad whatever so bad [TS]

00:43:35   garbage yeah garbage garbage it was at [TS]

00:43:39   the office it was very funny to me [TS]

00:43:41   because I mean my son is now in seventh [TS]

00:43:44   grade but as a thirteen-year-old he's [TS]

00:43:46   sort of like an interesting age [TS]

00:43:50   technology wise because you know when he [TS]

00:43:53   first started going to school it was and [TS]

00:43:57   I wasn't quite 10 years ago but you know [TS]

00:43:59   2008-9 whatever school had a lot of I [TS]

00:44:04   don't know if they were called netbooks [TS]

00:44:05   but you know effectively they were [TS]

00:44:07   that's what a lot of the devices they [TS]

00:44:08   had and all the key all kids knew they [TS]

00:44:10   were junk like that because it and it's [TS]

00:44:13   so funny to me because I remember when I [TS]

00:44:14   was a kid getting access to any computer [TS]

00:44:16   in school was it was it would if it's [TS]

00:44:19   like all of a sudden Pope [TS]

00:44:21   to just pumped full of dopamine and I'm [TS]

00:44:24   on you know you're right and yes there [TS]

00:44:26   were ones that were better than others [TS]

00:44:27   and newer than others and there are even [TS]

00:44:30   that some of them some of the classes I [TS]

00:44:32   mean it's okay ad-hoc at the school [TS]

00:44:34   elementary school I went to there were [TS]

00:44:35   you know some teachers had like a TI 99 [TS]

00:44:37   for a or whatever it was called which is [TS]

00:44:39   a total piece of junk I mean it ran on [TS]

00:44:41   the little cassette tape drive but i [TS]

00:44:44   loved it it was just so funny to me to [TS]

00:44:46   see like first graders who thought that [TS]

00:44:47   you know didn't even want to use the [TS]

00:44:49   netbooks because they were such piece of [TS]

00:44:50   jump who write and they can it's like [TS]

00:44:55   they can tell anybody could tell [TS]

00:44:56   everybody could tell and I if you look [TS]

00:44:59   at the ipad that way when you look at it [TS]

00:45:01   like hey you know no matter what your I [TS]

00:45:05   mean you know there are some people that [TS]

00:45:07   can't afford any computer at all and [TS]

00:45:09   that's that's you know to be that's a [TS]

00:45:11   different problem a different discussion [TS]

00:45:14   to be had right but if you can afford a [TS]

00:45:17   computer the almost nearly the first [TS]

00:45:19   computer you could afford either [TS]

00:45:21   subsidized iphone or an unsubsidized [TS]

00:45:23   ipad right and i think that if you you [TS]

00:45:27   could look at like chromebox and a lot [TS]

00:45:28   of other things as sort of those [TS]

00:45:30   companies efforts to do that to lower [TS]

00:45:33   the barrier to get somebody to using [TS]

00:45:35   their computer / using the web in [TS]

00:45:38   Google's case using their services and [TS]

00:45:41   using their connected you know they're [TS]

00:45:43   connected services that that carry [TS]

00:45:44   advertising and whatever the case may be [TS]

00:45:46   in Apple's kc it's the same thing it's [TS]

00:45:49   like we want people to be into the apple [TS]

00:45:51   ecosystem so we can teach them about how [TS]

00:45:53   good Apple could be for them and and [TS]

00:45:55   what you know what an apple computer [TS]

00:45:57   feels like versus another computer and I [TS]

00:46:00   think the kinds a good ambassador that [TS]

00:46:01   way and so if it always exist if it [TS]

00:46:04   levels out at some point is we're not we [TS]

00:46:07   haven't seen any leveling out i think [TS]

00:46:08   that's the big question marks that [TS]

00:46:10   everybody is saying right now as once [TS]

00:46:12   the this the true replacement cycle [TS]

00:46:14   start to kick in and or you know Apple [TS]

00:46:17   finds a way to revitalize it in some [TS]

00:46:19   significant way where you know we can a [TS]

00:46:21   new spike that resets the bar and then [TS]

00:46:24   it's you know slopes downwards from [TS]

00:46:25   there as everybody adopted the new thing [TS]

00:46:27   whatever the case may be I think there [TS]

00:46:30   will be a point where it eventually [TS]

00:46:31   levels out and we see what kind of [TS]

00:46:34   business the ipad [TS]

00:46:35   business actually is and will be long [TS]

00:46:37   term I think that business will always [TS]

00:46:39   be characterized by its ability to you [TS]

00:46:43   know give people expanded computing [TS]

00:46:46   capabilities at far less price than a [TS]

00:46:48   macbook now and that's that's what it [TS]

00:46:51   will always be for apple and an apple [TS]

00:46:53   could preach about you know what it [TS]

00:46:54   could be for artists and what it could [TS]

00:46:56   be for creatives and all this other [TS]

00:46:57   stuff that's great [TS]

00:46:59   and hopefully the continued to serve [TS]

00:47:00   those people by pushing the capabilities [TS]

00:47:02   of the device but the vast majority of [TS]

00:47:04   sales in the category or not that that [TS]

00:47:06   you know there's not 13 million draw [TS]

00:47:10   artists buying it for pencils you know [TS]

00:47:12   it's just not that's not the way it [TS]

00:47:13   works [TS]

00:47:14   the the number i pointed out one of the [TS]

00:47:16   numbers i pointed out it was that just [TS]

00:47:18   looking at revenue last year ipad was [TS]

00:47:22   above mac and services by like little [TS]

00:47:25   bit for mac and about a billion dollars [TS]

00:47:28   in revenue for the same quarter last [TS]

00:47:29   year and as of this year and announce [TS]

00:47:32   the numbers announced today the mac did [TS]

00:47:36   7.2 billion in revenue and ipad was down [TS]

00:47:40   to 5.5 and services were up from six [TS]

00:47:44   billion to 7.2 billion and again i'm not [TS]

00:47:48   a doom and gloom on ipad but I think it [TS]

00:47:50   just goes to show how the mix of the [TS]

00:47:54   price points that are selling at ipad [TS]

00:47:56   are Arlo i think that that you know and [TS]

00:47:59   I think ipad pro is a successful product [TS]

00:48:01   but i think it's going to be most [TS]

00:48:03   successful in years to come as it [TS]

00:48:05   trickles down you know the original iPad [TS]

00:48:07   pro trickle down to the lower price [TS]

00:48:09   points and I think it's clear since the [TS]

00:48:12   max like unit sales are just about dead [TS]

00:48:15   even [TS]

00:48:15   but the revenue was up quite a bit that [TS]

00:48:19   the macbook pros the new ones sold [TS]

00:48:21   pretty well for the first quarter and I [TS]

00:48:23   don't even think that that would they [TS]

00:48:24   weren't even out for the whole quarter [TS]

00:48:25   right yeah they were in when you look at [TS]

00:48:30   that trickle-down effect I mean look at [TS]

00:48:31   the ipad pro especially the larger one [TS]

00:48:34   and how much capability i mean it easily [TS]

00:48:38   at on par utility wise at least in the [TS]

00:48:43   specific utilities with it [TS]

00:48:46   week you know computers from wacom that [TS]

00:48:50   were several thousand dollars more [TS]

00:48:53   and frankly worse you know that the [TS]

00:48:57   missile tracking was not nearly what it [TS]

00:48:59   is on the ipad and the screen does not [TS]

00:49:01   have the color rendition and accuracy of [TS]

00:49:04   the ipad pro and you look at all that [TS]

00:49:06   and you look as that trickles down [TS]

00:49:07   you're going to see those pro devices [TS]

00:49:11   being in giving people access artists [TS]

00:49:15   and other Creators access to those [TS]

00:49:17   capabilities in ways that just were not [TS]

00:49:20   even heard of and I think apple doesn't [TS]

00:49:22   get credit for that stuff because people [TS]

00:49:24   want to see you know in the business in [TS]

00:49:27   tech writing world people want to see [TS]

00:49:29   those results in the new numbers and [TS]

00:49:31   it's like Oh every everybody must buy [TS]

00:49:33   that ipad pro and really drive up the [TS]

00:49:36   sales and price and stuff every quarter [TS]

00:49:38   whereas if you look at it in the Ark of [TS]

00:49:40   the game where it's like hey worshipping [TS]

00:49:43   miss now in in a year it's going to be [TS]

00:49:46   really affordable and we're going to [TS]

00:49:48   sell a lot more of them or a lot more of [TS]

00:49:50   devices that have their capability [TS]

00:49:52   whatever they're going to call them [TS]

00:49:53   yeah and that that arc i think is a very [TS]

00:49:56   interesting one and it's hard to message [TS]

00:49:58   right because people don't want to hear [TS]

00:50:00   were we're putting this thing out that [TS]

00:50:03   not a lot of people are gonna buy but [TS]

00:50:05   more people will buy later when it's [TS]

00:50:07   affordable they want to hear or putting [TS]

00:50:08   this thing out the people must buy now [TS]

00:50:10   yeah yeah you know right it's like [TS]

00:50:14   anything short of an ipad that makes [TS]

00:50:15   everybody just throw their old ipad in [TS]

00:50:17   that garbage and go get in line to buy [TS]

00:50:20   the new one is somehow failure but it [TS]

00:50:22   doesn't really work right [TS]

00:50:23   the only other thing I have from the [TS]

00:50:26   results and from the the notes of the [TS]

00:50:28   conference call that I read was that tim [TS]

00:50:31   cook pointed out that Apple pay users [TS]

00:50:33   are up 33 x year-over-year so that's it [TS]

00:50:37   really gives that's that's a very good [TS]

00:50:40   year for Apple pay especially since it's [TS]

00:50:42   what two years old now [TS]

00:50:43   two-and-a-half years old who uh and [TS]

00:50:46   again that's the other thing I had in my [TS]

00:50:48   notes that is sort of like hey let's all [TS]

00:50:50   remember that that getting people to do [TS]

00:50:52   something with it 22 like twenty [TS]

00:50:56   thirteen years hey you're going to pay [TS]

00:50:58   for stuff but [TS]

00:50:59   putting your fingerprint on a phone at [TS]

00:51:01   the register on your cell phone right [TS]

00:51:04   sounds weird right it's like different [TS]

00:51:06   and it's like I don't know i mean at it [TS]

00:51:08   I i know enough about how it works i [TS]

00:51:11   understand it that it's I actually [TS]

00:51:12   understand that it's actually more [TS]

00:51:14   secure than using a credit card a lot [TS]

00:51:16   more secure it you know if you're doing [TS]

00:51:19   a magnetic swipe but you know people [TS]

00:51:23   always have the the heebie-jeebies about [TS]

00:51:25   putting your credit card into the phone [TS]

00:51:26   or something like that i mean there is a [TS]

00:51:28   lot of an awful lot of people who spent [TS]

00:51:30   years not buying anything at all on the [TS]

00:51:32   web because they didn't feel like they [TS]

00:51:34   can trust it because it was new and [TS]

00:51:35   different and that's just the way humans [TS]

00:51:37   are hooked up for the most part that new [TS]

00:51:40   and different is scary and therefore you [TS]

00:51:42   wait so 3x growth in apple-pie guess I I [TS]

00:51:46   didn't see the details on where exactly [TS]

00:51:48   that is like how much of that is in the [TS]

00:51:49   US how much of it is worldwide expansion [TS]

00:51:51   but i feel it's one of those stories [TS]

00:51:55   that in terms of hey Apple hasn't done a [TS]

00:51:57   goddamn thing under tim cook that that [TS]

00:51:59   that crowd it conveniently overlooks [TS]

00:52:02   that it's a really solid Tim Cook Apple [TS]

00:52:06   era success story [TS]

00:52:08   yeah BTW user behavior and something [TS]

00:52:12   that has to do with their wallet you [TS]

00:52:13   know their bank account for whatever [TS]

00:52:14   thats did say me hard [TS]

00:52:17   it's insanely hard and so it is it is [TS]

00:52:19   encouraging to see things like that that [TS]

00:52:21   theoretically you know could be big bets [TS]

00:52:24   I mean you know when people had the [TS]

00:52:26   inkling that they were going to get into [TS]

00:52:28   payments you know people saw that as a [TS]

00:52:30   as a very big business for them and I [TS]

00:52:32   think it's still you know it already is [TS]

00:52:34   so somewhat of a business another [TS]

00:52:36   Services category and could be a much [TS]

00:52:37   larger business in the future especially [TS]

00:52:40   if you know apples able to sell apple [TS]

00:52:43   pay through and keep up this kind of [TS]

00:52:45   growth but I mean it's the hurdles you [TS]

00:52:49   have to overcome when you're switching [TS]

00:52:51   over to something like Apple pay are [TS]

00:52:53   crazy you know i mean you got you come [TS]

00:52:55   to the counter and you're gonna pay with [TS]

00:52:57   your phone and you're not quite sure [TS]

00:52:59   where to put it and you're not you know [TS]

00:53:01   how far away and what part of this [TS]

00:53:04   credit card so i put it where the credit [TS]

00:53:06   card goes to put it over the keypad and [TS]

00:53:08   put it over some weird symbol that i'm [TS]

00:53:09   not familiar with to put on this clear [TS]

00:53:11   plastic part in [TS]

00:53:12   and people are embarrassed didn't want [TS]

00:53:15   to do that if the smaller people behind [TS]

00:53:17   them yeah it's still so early ways it [TS]

00:53:19   it's still so early days that usually [TS]

00:53:22   like when I go to like a place that just [TS]

00:53:23   like I noticed that they've upgraded [TS]

00:53:25   their point-of-sales systems and I [TS]

00:53:28   either see the Apple pay logo or I see [TS]

00:53:29   that little wifie looking logo that [TS]

00:53:31   means it usually works apple pie usually [TS]

00:53:34   works even if they're not officially [TS]

00:53:35   Apple pay yet you know that it just has [TS]

00:53:38   contactless you know a NFC payments the [TS]

00:53:42   Clark usually has no idea and I'll say [TS]

00:53:44   like there will be like how you going to [TS]

00:53:45   pay out so I'm gonna try Apple pay and [TS]

00:53:46   they'll say what's that [TS]

00:53:48   I mean I've had that happen and it i'm [TS]

00:53:50   not afraid to do it because i know you [TS]

00:53:52   know i am NOT embarrassed even if it [TS]

00:53:55   doesn't work and be you know I am NOT [TS]

00:53:58   embarrassed that I might know more about [TS]

00:54:00   how this works than that Clark but [TS]

00:54:01   somebody has to go first and people are [TS]

00:54:03   resistant to stuff like that [TS]

00:54:05   here's a funny thing this is true ok i [TS]

00:54:07   forget if I've mentioned something to [TS]

00:54:08   show before now but one of the places I [TS]

00:54:10   go that just added a new point of sale [TS]

00:54:13   system that that supports Apple pay our [TS]

00:54:15   the the state-run liquor stores here and [TS]

00:54:19   in Pennsylvania and there's very [TS]

00:54:23   consistently it doesn't work on the [TS]

00:54:29   first try every single time I put my [TS]

00:54:31   phone there have my thumb on the sensor [TS]

00:54:33   and it says card not valid or something [TS]

00:54:37   something's not valid used card instead [TS]

00:54:40   but if I just sit there and pull lift my [TS]

00:54:42   thumb and press it again it goes ding [TS]

00:54:44   and then I get the payment but how many [TS]

00:54:46   people would even think to try that like [TS]

00:54:48   did and every time every single time I [TS]

00:54:50   you right i just looked at the error [TS]

00:54:55   message and I thought well that that [TS]

00:54:56   error message makes no sense so I'm just [TS]

00:54:58   going to try again and I'd you know [TS]

00:54:59   didn't ask the clerk for help or [TS]

00:55:01   anything I just SAT I just move the [TS]

00:55:03   phone away moved back and now every time [TS]

00:55:04   I do it gets it's the same thing I [TS]

00:55:08   anything else on your penis penis [TS]

00:55:10   doesn't doesn't translate well you know [TS]

00:55:12   and others on earnings before my nothing [TS]

00:55:15   ahead [TS]

00:55:16   all right I let me take a break then and [TS]

00:55:19   thank our next concert good friends [TS]

00:55:21   longtime sponsor of the show audible [TS]

00:55:25   audible is the unmatched selection of [TS]

00:55:32   audio content everybody thinks of them i [TS]

00:55:35   always do i do I think of them is the [TS]

00:55:37   place you go for audiobooks and they are [TS]

00:55:40   the number one source in the world for [TS]

00:55:43   audiobooks but they really have expanded [TS]

00:55:46   to just audio in general they have their [TS]

00:55:49   own audio shows news comedy all sorts of [TS]

00:55:54   stuff you get a membership you go there [TS]

00:55:56   you can number one if you go to [TS]

00:55:57   audible.com / talk show you'll get a [TS]

00:56:00   30-day free trial so they got 30 days [TS]

00:56:02   you can listen to everything you want at [TS]

00:56:04   audible.com / talk show but it's just [TS]

00:56:07   amazing how much stuff they have and [TS]

00:56:09   their stuff works on just about any [TS]

00:56:11   device that you have that can play audio [TS]

00:56:13   you can play audible stuff so even if [TS]

00:56:15   you have like an old ipod that used to [TS]

00:56:18   use like to workout at the gym or [TS]

00:56:19   something like that it doesn't have to [TS]

00:56:22   be like a smartphone you don't need like [TS]

00:56:23   a special app you can just download the [TS]

00:56:25   stuff to your by mac and think it over [TS]

00:56:27   to an old ipad or ipod or kindle or [TS]

00:56:30   anything like that that can play audio [TS]

00:56:32   and it'll work [TS]

00:56:33   audio content so great if you're [TS]

00:56:37   listening to meet sell you on audible [TS]

00:56:39   right now you obviously listen to all [TS]

00:56:41   our audio content you obviously listen [TS]

00:56:43   to really long podcast you probably have [TS]

00:56:46   more time on your commute or wherever it [TS]

00:56:49   is that you listen you want to fill it [TS]

00:56:51   with more good stuff go to audible.com / [TS]

00:56:53   talk show and you will find it so my [TS]

00:56:55   thanks to audible for sponsoring the [TS]

00:56:56   show remember that URL audible.com / [TS]

00:56:59   talk show and you'll get a 30-day free [TS]

00:57:01   trial if you haven't got one yet [TS]

00:57:06   here's some news and it's interesting [TS]

00:57:09   it's follow-up from last week's show I [TS]

00:57:11   had been Thompson on and I mentioned an [TS]

00:57:12   anecdote from a reader of the show and I [TS]

00:57:15   was a little nervous bringing it up [TS]

00:57:16   because i was like one reader who wrote [TS]

00:57:19   me this email but he convinced me it he [TS]

00:57:23   it really seemed like he knew what he [TS]

00:57:25   was talking about like it wasn't just [TS]

00:57:26   like he wasn't just spitting in the wind [TS]

00:57:28   but he bought the new LG ultra fine 5k [TS]

00:57:32   display the one that that Apple like [TS]

00:57:34   sort of code developed and it's the only [TS]

00:57:36   retina standalone display you can get [TS]

00:57:39   from apple right now is this is LG [TS]

00:57:40   models and he was having all sorts of [TS]

00:57:43   problems with it and for some reason it [TS]

00:57:46   occurred to him to try moving it and he [TS]

00:57:48   did and it turns out that moving it away [TS]

00:57:50   from his Wi-Fi router solve the problems [TS]

00:57:52   and I dimension this on the show with [TS]

00:57:54   Ben Thompson [TS]

00:57:55   well it seems like this is an actual [TS]

00:57:58   thing Zack hall wrote a story at 9to5 [TS]

00:58:02   mac person firsthand story where the [TS]

00:58:04   exact same thing happened with him where [TS]

00:58:07   he and in the problem was so bad it was [TS]

00:58:10   like actually crashing his macbook he [TS]

00:58:12   has his macbook hooked up to the 5k [TS]

00:58:14   display and it was like freezing is his [TS]

00:58:18   macbook he googled a little bit saw some [TS]

00:58:21   met people other people speculating [TS]

00:58:23   about this hey it's near a Wi-Fi router [TS]

00:58:25   his was near his Wi-Fi router so we [TS]

00:58:27   moved it to a different moved away from [TS]

00:58:29   from his desk and in the problems all [TS]

00:58:32   went away and any contacted LG and LG [TS]

00:58:35   said yet just don't use an air Wi-Fi [TS]

00:58:37   router this is crazy [TS]

00:58:42   I mean why would a computer ever be near [TS]

00:58:44   Wi-Fi around [TS]

00:58:45   hey it's okay i can't help but think [TS]

00:58:49   especially in a home office it's got to [TS]

00:58:51   be a frequent a common scenario you know [TS]

00:58:54   and anybody you know they're probably [TS]

00:58:56   anybody who's like lives in like a [TS]

00:58:59   studio apartment or something like that [TS]

00:59:01   I mean you may not even be able to move [TS]

00:59:02   it that far away you know it's kinda [TS]

00:59:05   crazy and it is insane [TS]

00:59:09   yeah i mean the just gonna be fine i [TS]

00:59:12   guess we know how exactly how closely [TS]

00:59:14   co-developed it was now [TS]

00:59:18   the the gist of this display i do not [TS]

00:59:21   have 1i have a imac here so I'm not a 5k [TS]

00:59:24   imax I'm not in the market for a [TS]

00:59:26   standalone display but I saw I've seen [TS]

00:59:27   the mini apple stores i saw them at the [TS]

00:59:29   apple event that you and I are at a [TS]

00:59:31   couple months ago and my impression my [TS]

00:59:35   first-hand impression of just looking at [TS]

00:59:37   it you know from a kick the tires [TS]

00:59:38   perspective was too gorgeous display in [TS]

00:59:42   a really chin see but at least [TS]

00:59:44   plain-looking case it doesn't it's not [TS]

00:59:48   an ugly i don't think they're ugly but [TS]

00:59:50   i'm not really not easy it's yeah yeah [TS]

00:59:52   it's not sexy like an apple product is [TS]

00:59:55   so I could be like wow that is I want [TS]

00:59:57   that that is gorgeous you move crazy but [TS]

00:59:59   the display call [TS]

00:59:59   the display call [TS]

01:00:00   all these excellent and that convenience [TS]

01:00:03   of just being able to plug in USB see [TS]

01:00:05   thunderbolt and just have it work seems [TS]

01:00:07   really great and but like you said it [TS]

01:00:11   seems pretty clear that the [TS]

01:00:12   collaboration with apple is not on the [TS]

01:00:15   enclosure so the chimpanzee the chin 0 [TS]

01:00:19   yeah and none of the shielding the [TS]

01:00:21   tenancy feeling and looking enclosure is [TS]

01:00:24   I've also gently shielded and and no i'm [TS]

01:00:28   not an expert on shielding but it seems [TS]

01:00:30   to me like this is this just emblematic [TS]

01:00:33   of why there's a practical reason beyond [TS]

01:00:37   just wanting to spend more money that [TS]

01:00:39   that a lot of us wish Apple were making [TS]

01:00:42   its own apple-branded 5k displays and [TS]

01:00:45   yeah i mean the answers that I got with [TS]

01:00:50   this stuff when I poked around you know [TS]

01:00:52   like why the heck not [TS]

01:00:53   you know you know is it's it's pretty [TS]

01:00:57   much as hard as designing an entire [TS]

01:00:58   system so why do it and it's late you [TS]

01:01:02   know we're not white doing is it's like [TS]

01:01:04   not that attitude that I got like who [TS]

01:01:05   cares it was more we have so many hours [TS]

01:01:09   in the day and this is like designing a [TS]

01:01:11   new imac so maybe we shouldn't do it [TS]

01:01:13   this time you know and maybe we should [TS]

01:01:15   put our efforts elsewhere and whatever [TS]

01:01:18   you could disagree or agree i'm not i'm [TS]

01:01:19   not a scrap i'm not saying yay or nay to [TS]

01:01:21   their POV but that's the that's the [TS]

01:01:24   input that i got and that's not through [TS]

01:01:26   official channels or anything so it's [TS]

01:01:27   not like a PR message is just a matter [TS]

01:01:30   of like it's really hard to build that [TS]

01:01:32   especially because of the the throughput [TS]

01:01:35   you know that you have to have to [TS]

01:01:37   connect to external displays and if they [TS]

01:01:39   wanted to do with the way that they [TS]

01:01:40   wanted to do it normally which probably [TS]

01:01:42   would have worked close to a Wi-Fi [TS]

01:01:44   router it would have taken them a lot of [TS]

01:01:46   time and money and manpower to achieve I [TS]

01:01:49   guess the money money is not really the [TS]

01:01:50   problem it's more the time and manpower [TS]

01:01:52   yeah you know taking something off of [TS]

01:01:55   mac's or another department to work on [TS]

01:01:58   on that or hiring people in training [TS]

01:02:01   them up through apple university and [TS]

01:02:03   blah blah blah to get you know to a [TS]

01:02:05   point where they are able to work on [TS]

01:02:07   those hardware products just they just [TS]

01:02:10   felt he couldn't devote the time to it I [TS]

01:02:12   guess I don't know [TS]

01:02:13   it's you know it's hard 1i you know [TS]

01:02:16   whether you want to fault them or not I [TS]

01:02:20   I don't know and obviously some people [TS]

01:02:22   do but for this for which is that they [TS]

01:02:26   have so much money how can this how can [TS]

01:02:28   they possibly be stretched thin on [TS]

01:02:30   resources and now whether that's an [TS]

01:02:32   actual emblematic of a problem in their [TS]

01:02:35   mindset that they're still at an [TS]

01:02:37   executive-level think too much like the [TS]

01:02:39   small company smaller company they used [TS]

01:02:41   to be free iPhone or whether it's [TS]

01:02:43   actually bad management [TS]

01:02:45   I don't know but it's obvious though [TS]

01:02:47   that they are whether they whether [TS]

01:02:50   that's reasonable and that's a sign that [TS]

01:02:52   they you know that for Apple to be Apple [TS]

01:02:54   that you know like maybe the pro [TS]

01:02:56   argument would be for Apple to be Apple [TS]

01:02:59   they have to continue to be like a small [TS]

01:03:02   company that focuses on a few things [TS]

01:03:03   because that's just how that's how it [TS]

01:03:06   works [TS]

01:03:06   the con argument would be you know it's [TS]

01:03:09   just ridiculous that they can't afford [TS]

01:03:11   to put an engineering team together to [TS]

01:03:13   do a display but it's it the proof you [TS]

01:03:17   know that whether it should be this way [TS]

01:03:18   or not they are there stretch then and i [TS]

01:03:21   think that the decision not to do this [TS]

01:03:23   it is exactly along those lines that [TS]

01:03:26   would we do if it's going to take us [TS]

01:03:27   that much effort to do this we we put [TS]

01:03:29   that effort somewhere else right [TS]

01:03:33   yes and you you could hammer all day on [TS]

01:03:35   the argument that well they should be [TS]

01:03:37   able to afford the man hours or whatever [TS]

01:03:40   the case but yeah that's the way came [TS]

01:03:42   down and that's why these decisions were [TS]

01:03:44   made the way they are as far as i know i [TS]

01:03:45   don't know maybe I'm wrong but hey I [TS]

01:03:48   think you you reach a point where saying [TS]

01:03:52   no becomes less about all we're not [TS]

01:03:55   going to pursue this new fun thing and [TS]

01:03:58   sometimes if it comes down to [TS]

01:04:01   we're not going to splinter ourselves in [TS]

01:04:06   ways that make a lot of logical sense [TS]

01:04:09   like it's much harder to say no to the [TS]

01:04:12   things that makes make a ton of sense [TS]

01:04:14   than it is to say no to the things that [TS]

01:04:16   have very obvious faults and flaws and [TS]

01:04:19   and whatever you know i'm in so many [TS]

01:04:21   unload unknowns in a project can lead [TS]

01:04:23   you to say no so many things that say [TS]

01:04:26   hey you [TS]

01:04:26   where were down this pathway we've spent [TS]

01:04:29   a lot of money and whatever those could [TS]

01:04:32   be hard to say no to [TS]

01:04:33   but the ones that make total sense i [TS]

01:04:35   wouldn't have to make an external [TS]

01:04:37   display those are the ones that you're [TS]

01:04:39   going to take the most heat over those [TS]

01:04:41   are the ones that you're gonna hopefully [TS]

01:04:42   have to really come to have a [TS]

01:04:46   come-to-jesus moment on and say we're [TS]

01:04:49   not making them for these reasons that [TS]

01:04:51   make a lot of sense to us and that we [TS]

01:04:54   can even message or or you know don't [TS]

01:04:56   want to message externally for whatever [TS]

01:04:58   reason if it is simply that they can't [TS]

01:05:03   they don't have enough people to work on [TS]

01:05:05   it man you know it's it's hard it's [TS]

01:05:07   that's a hard thing to defend but if [TS]

01:05:10   they don't have they don't happen right [TS]

01:05:12   what are you gonna do like you can't [TS]

01:05:14   just hire all the random team full of [TS]

01:05:16   random people to work on a high-profile [TS]

01:05:19   hardware release because you're gonna [TS]

01:05:21   have the same problem as the LG think [TS]

01:05:23   it's gonna have some weird um issue i [TS]

01:05:25   mean this is hard apple works on their [TS]

01:05:26   stuff there's always some weird um issue [TS]

01:05:28   when they launched something right [TS]

01:05:29   because this stuff is difficult and it's [TS]

01:05:31   very complex [TS]

01:05:32   so if you're not going to own that and [TS]

01:05:35   owned whatever problems you come you [TS]

01:05:37   can't say oh we put our BTW mom it's [TS]

01:05:39   right or we put the noobs on it you just [TS]

01:05:42   gotta say no I wouldn't be surprised if [TS]

01:05:44   apple doesn't do a standalone display or [TS]

01:05:49   two you know 4k and 5k I i don't know i [TS]

01:05:54   don't have any kind of like little [TS]

01:05:56   birdie info that yes they're coming [TS]

01:05:58   I have had little birdie info and other [TS]

01:06:00   people have to that that there were [TS]

01:06:02   apple-branded displays in the works [TS]

01:06:04   within Apple whether they're still [TS]

01:06:06   moving forward I have not heard anything [TS]

01:06:08   I don't know so I don't have that can [TS]

01:06:10   even whisper secret on the show and say [TS]

01:06:13   I've heard it but I know that there were [TS]

01:06:15   and I i wouldn't be surprised if the [TS]

01:06:20   story is I mean what everybody seems to [TS]

01:06:23   believe right now as Apple is out of the [TS]

01:06:25   standalone display game period and we're [TS]

01:06:27   never going to have another one possible [TS]

01:06:28   i would not be surprised if the network [TS]

01:06:30   is another standalone display other than [TS]

01:06:34   you know treating the imac buying an [TS]

01:06:36   imac just to use as a standalone display [TS]

01:06:38   with with [TS]

01:06:39   target display mode which is kind of [TS]

01:06:41   ridiculous the idea that you'd buy a [TS]

01:06:42   computer wouldn't use but it does work i [TS]

01:06:48   was also make the question how expensive [TS]

01:06:50   is the display versus the other [TS]

01:06:52   components of the device so if your 5k [TS]

01:06:55   display had to be sixty percent as [TS]

01:06:59   expensive as a regular imac that's on [TS]

01:07:01   the bubble that seventy percent is [TS]

01:07:03   expensive right [TS]

01:07:04   who the hell's gonna buy it right you [TS]

01:07:06   know so I if there's also that you know [TS]

01:07:08   component costs angle the kind of thing [TS]

01:07:11   about I wouldn't be surprised though if [TS]

01:07:13   the story is simply and and again on [TS]

01:07:16   this theme of Apple can only do so much [TS]

01:07:18   at a time and there's only so many [TS]

01:07:19   resources for testing and for even just [TS]

01:07:23   stuff like sales and training the the [TS]

01:07:26   entire retail staff on and product [TS]

01:07:27   design and stuff like that I wouldn't be [TS]

01:07:31   surprised if there are still in the [TS]

01:07:32   works but it was so clear that it wasn't [TS]

01:07:35   gonna be done in time for october twenty [TS]

01:07:38   sixteen when they needed to have [TS]

01:07:40   something to sell with the new macbook [TS]

01:07:42   pros they needed some sort of retina [TS]

01:07:45   display that would work with us bc and [TS]

01:07:50   Thunderbolt three that they couldn't get [TS]

01:07:54   that done in time for LG could slap [TS]

01:07:57   something together and so that's what [TS]

01:08:00   they did and I in that may be but it [TS]

01:08:02   won't i think maybe it won't come out [TS]

01:08:04   till like a year you know like next year [TS]

01:08:06   like next October in October 2017 a year [TS]

01:08:09   later [TS]

01:08:10   here's the new Apple whatever they're [TS]

01:08:11   going to call it you know 5k display [TS]

01:08:13   right and it doesn't it will be hard to [TS]

01:08:16   think that this will be their ambassador [TS]

01:08:18   forever right that it's really hard i [TS]

01:08:20   know that you know like it it's a it [TS]

01:08:26   sounds funny but I know John Syracuse [TS]

01:08:28   has made this point on ATP several times [TS]

01:08:30   that they're going to make this brand [TS]

01:08:32   new campus it's going to be you know [TS]

01:08:33   it's all Johnny I've approved hallways [TS]

01:08:36   and curved glass and lighting fixtures [TS]

01:08:40   and a desk sees this you know they're [TS]

01:08:42   designing their own tables and then all [TS]

01:08:44   of this and what are they going to do [TS]

01:08:45   film with LG display's on the engineers [TS]

01:08:47   desk it's you [TS]

01:08:48   it just seems ridiculous [TS]

01:08:51   I mean for everybody doesn't answer keys [TS]

01:08:53   that thing right really funny ticket it [TS]

01:08:56   does so I other than nilay patel nilay [TS]

01:08:59   is the one who based on like is off the [TS]

01:09:03   record briefing at the events that Apple [TS]

01:09:05   said they're out of the game i was told [TS]

01:09:07   them a little bit more like what you [TS]

01:09:09   heard which is what i asked i was like [TS]

01:09:13   hey does this and I just I asked and in [TS]

01:09:14   a briefing like hey is this LG Display [TS]

01:09:16   does that mean you're not going to make [TS]

01:09:17   a standalone display and of course i did [TS]

01:09:19   not get an answer a master forand [TS]

01:09:22   completely prepared they were obviously [TS]

01:09:24   rehearsed on the point did not get a yes [TS]

01:09:27   or no but I got this is the display we [TS]

01:09:29   have to show you know what we're selling [TS]

01:09:31   now is the display that will be in our [TS]

01:09:33   stores that will have you know hooked up [TS]

01:09:36   in a prominent space in all of our [TS]

01:09:38   retail stores to make of that what you [TS]

01:09:40   will and that making a standalone [TS]

01:09:42   displayed in today with all the stuff is [TS]

01:09:44   as complicated as making like a new imac [TS]

01:09:47   or something like that that very doesn't [TS]

01:09:50   say never it but it does say to me [TS]

01:09:52   yes you can buy the LG Display now if [TS]

01:09:55   you need a new display and we're not [TS]

01:09:58   going to come out with one in a couple [TS]

01:09:59   of weeks or a couple of months i think [TS]

01:10:01   it honestly what it comes down to is if [TS]

01:10:03   it makes sense then they will and if [TS]

01:10:05   they it makes a lot of sense to me [TS]

01:10:07   that's all I know you know that they [TS]

01:10:08   would do it one day but that they wasn't [TS]

01:10:12   now and that they needed something to [TS]

01:10:14   ship I think you're totally right on [TS]

01:10:15   that yeah it also seems to me like in [TS]

01:10:17   terms of allocating engineering and [TS]

01:10:19   testing and all the other stuff where it [TS]

01:10:20   seems to me like the sort of thing that [TS]

01:10:22   they can get a lot of years out of [TS]

01:10:23   because they have in the past where [TS]

01:10:25   they've come out with new when they [TS]

01:10:26   called him cinema displays or whatever [TS]

01:10:28   the other product names were they sold [TS]

01:10:30   them you know they come out with a new [TS]

01:10:31   one and it would be great maybe price [TS]

01:10:33   competitive with other companies based [TS]

01:10:35   on the technology of the day and then [TS]

01:10:37   they'd apple just keep selling them and [TS]

01:10:38   999 as the years go on and monitors from [TS]

01:10:41   dell and other companies you know [TS]

01:10:43   improve or drop the price and apple can [TS]

01:10:47   keep selling it because it's apple and [TS]

01:10:49   people like to buy the apple branded 10 [TS]

01:10:51   pay a premium for it even if it's you [TS]

01:10:53   know a couple of years old [TS]

01:10:54   it just seems to me that there there at [TS]

01:10:56   a place with these displays where that [TS]

01:10:58   you know you don't need more pixels per [TS]

01:11:01   inch [TS]

01:11:02   they're super bright they've [TS]

01:11:04   got amazing color they've gotten to the [TS]

01:11:06   wide color gamut that it you know it if [TS]

01:11:10   Apple came out when i think i could see [TS]

01:11:12   that they come out with one and sell it [TS]

01:11:14   unchanged for three four five years [TS]

01:11:16   right three is probably 30 minutes 55 k [TS]

01:11:21   is like five keys [TS]

01:11:23   it's getting close to paper resolution I [TS]

01:11:25   mean you know even above if you count [TS]

01:11:27   color edition yeah and so it's it's just [TS]

01:11:29   there's not really a there's no not a [TS]

01:11:32   lot of places to go from there [TS]

01:11:34   so if they make something back a bacon [TS]

01:11:36   squeeze of many many years out of it and [TS]

01:11:38   really what would change would be you [TS]

01:11:40   know there's another major change in [TS]

01:11:41   input or output yeah i think that they [TS]

01:11:44   sort of a connector or whatever [TS]

01:11:45   yeah i think that the display itself is [TS]

01:11:47   least likely to be the that we need we [TS]

01:11:50   need something to replace it it's more [TS]

01:11:52   likely to be the the connector [TS]

01:11:55   yeah it's like it I can't believe this [TS]

01:11:57   display doesn't have USB eight you know [TS]

01:11:59   that kind of thing [TS]

01:12:03   let me take one final break here and [TS]

01:12:07   thank our third and final sponsor [TS]

01:12:09   longtime friend of the show maybe the [TS]

01:12:11   longest-running sponsor Squarespace [TS]

01:12:14   Squarespace is the best place to go to [TS]

01:12:17   build a new website it's it's just an [TS]

01:12:21   amazing product can't say enough good [TS]

01:12:24   things about it i mentioned circular saw [TS]

01:12:26   steal a talking point from Marco Arment [TS]

01:12:28   i love this i love this idea which is a [TS]

01:12:31   you're a nerd you're listening to the [TS]

01:12:32   talk show you might need a website [TS]

01:12:34   yourself and if so you should definitely [TS]

01:12:35   look at Squarespace you really should it [TS]

01:12:37   is amazing but here's the bigger thing [TS]

01:12:38   it's such a great idea [TS]

01:12:40   you probably know someone at some point [TS]

01:12:42   this year somebody you know is going to [TS]

01:12:44   come to you and say that they need a [TS]

01:12:46   website maybe it's like a school group [TS]

01:12:48   at your kids school or a like some kind [TS]

01:12:52   of community group or church or [TS]

01:12:54   something you're involved with and [TS]

01:12:55   you're like everybody knows you're the [TS]

01:12:57   tech person you're the you're the nerd [TS]

01:12:59   and they're going to come to you with [TS]

01:13:00   help on this set him up with squarespace [TS]

01:13:03   go to squarespace to get their cycling [TS]

01:13:05   because a it is a great service that you [TS]

01:13:07   might consider using anyway but be [TS]

01:13:09   because it's so easy to use and because [TS]

01:13:11   Squarespace offers award winning tech [TS]

01:13:14   support that you can get right on the [TS]

01:13:16   phone if [TS]

01:13:17   do you have a problem they're going to [TS]

01:13:18   go to squarespace and not go to you so [TS]

01:13:20   you can like wash your hands of the [TS]

01:13:21   problem you'll give them a great website [TS]

01:13:22   they'll get a great price and you'll be [TS]

01:13:26   done you won't be on the hook for like [TS]

01:13:27   when they need to add something or [TS]

01:13:29   change or whatever they can just do it [TS]

01:13:30   themselves [TS]

01:13:31   it is a great idea and a great a great [TS]

01:13:33   point I think for the audience of a show [TS]

01:13:35   like this so make your next move with [TS]

01:13:38   squarespace go to squarespace.com and [TS]

01:13:41   enter the code talk show know that just [TS]

01:13:44   talk show and you will get ten percent [TS]

01:13:46   off at checkout [TS]

01:13:47   it's a great great service keep in mind [TS]

01:13:50   next time you need a website or next [TS]

01:13:51   time anybody you know needs a website [TS]

01:13:53   remember that code to talk show [TS]

01:13:57   ah here we go deep breath wish i had a [TS]

01:14:01   stiff drink but instead of just got [TS]

01:14:02   fizzy water [TS]

01:14:04   yeah I can't we can't wallow I can't [TS]

01:14:08   keep going I can't do this without [TS]

01:14:09   mentioning Trump's immigration order [TS]

01:14:11   they came down last week and Silicon [TS]

01:14:13   Valley is responses and even if you [TS]

01:14:15   wanted you know play the lets you know [TS]

01:14:17   I'm not talk about politics it's way too [TS]

01:14:20   it is essential to the racket that we [TS]

01:14:22   cover it really hits home [TS]

01:14:24   I mean it's a huge deal and I don't that [TS]

01:14:29   I I think it's hard too hard to [TS]

01:14:32   overstate how how much of a reaction is [TS]

01:14:35   already gotten from companies like Apple [TS]

01:14:37   and Google + and etc I saw google added [TS]

01:14:42   ya background that's right employees did [TS]

01:14:47   well yeah you know I we get in [TS]

01:14:53   I've gotten so much female of this John [TS]

01:14:54   we we cover politics and we cover the [TS]

01:14:59   policies that affect tak we always have [TS]

01:15:01   you know we have for many years but [TS]

01:15:03   we've been covering so much more of it [TS]

01:15:06   lately because so much more has been [TS]

01:15:07   happening thats related to our you know [TS]

01:15:11   our industry that we cover and and you [TS]

01:15:15   know they are are the companies that [TS]

01:15:18   look to us for whatever reactions or [TS]

01:15:21   whatever context that they they want to [TS]

01:15:23   have and we you know even writing about [TS]

01:15:26   a significant amount of these things as [TS]

01:15:27   they relate to individual companies and [TS]

01:15:29   also get like 10 [TS]

01:15:30   leaders speaking out and I'm taking you [TS]

01:15:33   know stances one way or another pro and [TS]

01:15:35   con and very little pro but how far con [TS]

01:15:39   is a good question about about you know [TS]

01:15:41   how many of them have responded and I [TS]

01:15:43   just kidding i mean i've gotten hate me [TS]

01:15:44   all you know I mean I always game but [TS]

01:15:48   again you know got a lot over this and [TS]

01:15:50   there's people like why are you talking [TS]

01:15:51   about politics I don't come to you for [TS]

01:15:53   that you know people accusing us of [TS]

01:15:55   being partisan in one direction or [TS]

01:15:57   another depending on what are you know [TS]

01:15:58   what articles published on the stuff and [TS]

01:16:00   you know I just ignore most of it i'm a [TS]

01:16:03   made-up saying something about it at [TS]

01:16:05   some point but the long and short of it [TS]

01:16:07   is that this is not a tech issue it's [TS]

01:16:11   not a politics issue it's like a human [TS]

01:16:13   issue [TS]

01:16:14   yeah like if you're human you should be [TS]

01:16:16   interested in this stuff and to be fair [TS]

01:16:18   to our readers like I'm I'm not [TS]

01:16:21   instructing our writers and our writers [TS]

01:16:23   are not doing it they're not writing [TS]

01:16:24   about stuff from a pure politics [TS]

01:16:26   standpoint we're not political like [TS]

01:16:28   we're not just going like a politics [TS]

01:16:29   happened look at politics you know we're [TS]

01:16:31   definitely relating it to our industry [TS]

01:16:33   but the tech a reading the stuff that [TS]

01:16:36   he's that he's talking about with [TS]

01:16:38   immigration and you know possible [TS]

01:16:40   reduction or are crapping in clamping [TS]

01:16:44   down on h-1b pieces which allow [TS]

01:16:46   highly-skilled tech workers to come over [TS]

01:16:48   here [TS]

01:16:48   those are incredibly germane to the tech [TS]

01:16:50   industry from everybody from Apple to [TS]

01:16:52   google to to facebook and everybody else [TS]

01:16:55   uses an enormous amount of h-1b workers [TS]

01:16:57   because there are a lot of highly [TS]

01:17:00   skilled programmers that come from India [TS]

01:17:02   and elsewhere in Asia and and you know a [TS]

01:17:06   wide variety of other countries that [TS]

01:17:07   don't that aren't here because our [TS]

01:17:09   education system has a lot of loss so [TS]

01:17:12   it's a incredibly remain issue and [TS]

01:17:14   they're you know they're up in arms [TS]

01:17:15   about it hard you know up in some kind [TS]

01:17:18   of arms depending on how closely they're [TS]

01:17:19   colluding with the current [TS]

01:17:20   administration [TS]

01:17:21   yeah and you know and they're doing the [TS]

01:17:24   right thing where they you know they've [TS]

01:17:26   all these big companies you know the [TS]

01:17:28   googles apples microsoft it's inevitable [TS]

01:17:31   with the headcount that they have that [TS]

01:17:33   they have hundreds of employees who are [TS]

01:17:34   affected by this you know that somewhere [TS]

01:17:37   along the chain right there [TS]

01:17:39   passport that they you know have a [TS]

01:17:41   number born in or [TS]

01:17:43   wer were once or still are a citizen of [TS]

01:17:46   one of these seven countries and you [TS]

01:17:49   know might literally be out of the [TS]

01:17:51   country right now you know in a way that [TS]

01:17:53   this was implemented with i just signed [TS]

01:17:55   it in it even if you're in the air right [TS]

01:17:56   out your your band is you know it it's [TS]

01:18:00   great that the companies have their [TS]

01:18:01   employees backs and helping them but [TS]

01:18:02   generation i don't know i don't that and [TS]

01:18:07   and I thought it was you know I I [TS]

01:18:10   thought Tim Cook's statement could have [TS]

01:18:12   been a little stronger like I'm not [TS]

01:18:13   expecting him to lash out and you know [TS]

01:18:18   i'm obviously you know it's no secret [TS]

01:18:19   that I am vibrantly by rule ently [TS]

01:18:23   against Trump and I see him as a danger [TS]

01:18:25   in a menace personally but even so I [TS]

01:18:29   totally get that Tim Cook the CEO [TS]

01:18:31   anybody in a position like that can't be [TS]

01:18:34   even though i would certainly suspect [TS]

01:18:35   privately that he is based on everything [TS]

01:18:38   we know about him and who his personal [TS]

01:18:40   heroes are i get it and and you know and [TS]

01:18:44   I see people on Twitter who are you know [TS]

01:18:47   who want him to be you know like a [TS]

01:18:50   completely outspoken critic i see how we [TS]

01:18:52   can't but I still think his statement [TS]

01:18:53   could have been a little bit stronger [TS]

01:18:54   and and in terms of its like the old [TS]

01:18:56   adage that like when you're you know [TS]

01:19:00   collaborating with people that you work [TS]

01:19:02   with or you're in school and you're [TS]

01:19:03   doing a crit you criticize the work not [TS]

01:19:05   the person so I I don't expect him to [TS]

01:19:07   come out strongly against Trump [TS]

01:19:09   personally but I've ice [TS]

01:19:10   I think he could have come out a little [TS]

01:19:11   stronger against the the executive order [TS]

01:19:15   on immigration [TS]

01:19:16   yeah and you've got you've got a variety [TS]

01:19:21   of people it was interesting to one here [TS]

01:19:25   we was like a little inside not super [TS]

01:19:27   inside baseball but inside baseball in a [TS]

01:19:29   way if you look at the statements that [TS]

01:19:31   were released there was a cab [TS]

01:19:33   especially early on there was only a [TS]

01:19:35   couple of people that went on the record [TS]

01:19:37   and just said stuff said hey this is me [TS]

01:19:40   and here's the what I have to say about [TS]

01:19:42   it and there were a lot of leaked memos [TS]

01:19:44   even Tim Cook's was not a public [TS]

01:19:46   statement it was a quote-unquote leaked [TS]

01:19:48   memo right you know couple of [TS]

01:19:51   publications got it we ended up getting [TS]

01:19:52   it you know that of origin of those [TS]

01:19:56   memos is [TS]

01:19:57   then you know debated among various [TS]

01:20:00   journalist age you get this where did [TS]

01:20:01   you get this and we were like you know [TS]

01:20:03   sawed-off I you know I can tell you but [TS]

01:20:05   it where that where those come from is [TS]

01:20:08   an interesting thing because elite memo [TS]

01:20:10   is essentially we want to say this but [TS]

01:20:12   we don't want to make a public statement [TS]

01:20:13   about it because we're a public company [TS]

01:20:14   and this has a lot of ramifications and [TS]

01:20:17   a statement on the record statement is a [TS]

01:20:20   I feel very strongly personally about [TS]

01:20:23   this come at me bro right and that is a [TS]

01:20:26   there's a difference right an impact I [TS]

01:20:29   feel and eventually a lot of the CEOs a [TS]

01:20:33   lot of the tech companies ended up [TS]

01:20:34   having a you know some sort of public [TS]

01:20:37   personal statement about it you know [TS]

01:20:39   satya nadella posted on linkedin you [TS]

01:20:42   know the mark zuckerberg posted on [TS]

01:20:45   Facebook you know so on and so forth and [TS]

01:20:48   those those statements i mean sergey [TS]

01:20:50   brin showed up at the protest against FL [TS]

01:20:52   and he said you know this is not a not a [TS]

01:20:54   company thing i'm here as an immigrant [TS]

01:20:56   as a person but then of course the [TS]

01:20:58   employee rally and then you know google [TS]

01:21:01   was supportive of that it all about [TS]

01:21:03   about the the band or whatever you want [TS]

01:21:07   to call the order right semantics are [TS]

01:21:09   being debated as we speak but that that [TS]

01:21:14   was interesting to me to view the [TS]

01:21:15   spectrum of people who work where at [TS]

01:21:18   least i don't know if you want to call [TS]

01:21:20   it comfortable but felt passionately [TS]

01:21:22   enough about it to put it on the record [TS]

01:21:24   in their own voice and go out there [TS]

01:21:26   versus the people who were in it you [TS]

01:21:27   could it could spell caution it could [TS]

01:21:29   spell calculation you know there are a [TS]

01:21:31   lot of ways to take it it just depends [TS]

01:21:33   on how you look at it you know huh [TS]

01:21:37   one weekend I know it is honestly you [TS]

01:21:42   know [TS]

01:21:43   yeah there's a lot here that doesn't [TS]

01:21:46   really feel that it is a lot of here [TS]

01:21:50   that seems to be very clearly to be [TS]

01:21:51   coming from Steve band and abandons to a [TS]

01:21:56   10-year at Breitbart and the [TS]

01:21:59   publication's bent it's very clear that [TS]

01:22:01   these are all things that he feels very [TS]

01:22:03   strongly personally about how much of [TS]

01:22:05   those feelings that trump shares will be [TS]

01:22:07   a very interesting historical account to [TS]

01:22:10   read [TS]

01:22:11   I mean if we ever figure that out you [TS]

01:22:12   know how closely their views are aligned [TS]

01:22:15   or if man is able to just you know push [TS]

01:22:18   forth his views and make them transfuse [TS]

01:22:22   but it seems very clear that these [TS]

01:22:24   attitudes towards immigration and [TS]

01:22:26   towards a variety of other government [TS]

01:22:28   institutions very strongly held by band [TS]

01:22:31   and this rapid application of the [TS]

01:22:36   executive order which Republicans were [TS]

01:22:39   so angry that Obama utilized even though [TS]

01:22:42   utilize them for less than say Reagan or [TS]

01:22:43   someone else you know he it is very [TS]

01:22:48   interesting to see what the [TS]

01:22:50   ramifications of this very fast and [TS]

01:22:52   loose application of this these orders [TS]

01:22:55   that obviously had far less let's put it [TS]

01:22:59   this way weights very clear they had far [TS]

01:23:01   less vetting from the appropriate [TS]

01:23:02   agencies than previous executive orders [TS]

01:23:06   right you know from the agents affected [TS]

01:23:07   agencies are agencies responsible for [TS]

01:23:09   their execution so I'm this is not a [TS]

01:23:12   politics thing this is like a logistics [TS]

01:23:15   thing or if you're looking at the [TS]

01:23:17   government as a business which trumpet [TS]

01:23:19   said he does is very interesting to see [TS]

01:23:21   this kind of business being conducted [TS]

01:23:23   and what the ramifications of it will be [TS]

01:23:25   given that we are a weekend and we're [TS]

01:23:27   already exhausted [TS]

01:23:29   it is definitely going to be interesting [TS]

01:23:32   to see how people maintain their [TS]

01:23:33   vigilance that these things are handled [TS]

01:23:36   according to the rule of law and [TS]

01:23:38   according to appropriate procedure and [TS]

01:23:40   process because few gives a real thing [TS]

01:23:43   you know I mean are fatigued that a real [TS]

01:23:45   thing you know he just simply can't keep [TS]

01:23:48   up it's so fatiguing that you [TS]

01:23:50   mispronounced it i thought one of them [TS]

01:23:53   was telling you we're in Nunda and [TS]

01:23:54   there's so much good writing that's [TS]

01:23:56   going on it's hard to keep up with all [TS]

01:23:57   of it but one of the most telling things [TS]

01:23:59   i did I actually noted this back in the [TS]

01:24:01   campaign i remember this but there were [TS]

01:24:03   a couple of you know when it was clear [TS]

01:24:04   that the Steve band was going to be so [TS]

01:24:06   or was so influential his campaign and [TS]

01:24:09   then after the election when he when we [TS]

01:24:11   found out that the sky one that he was [TS]

01:24:13   going to be a top adviser Trump had been [TS]

01:24:17   a guest on bannon's radio show to catch [TS]

01:24:20   this on a podcast and get some kind of [TS]

01:24:22   actual radio network [TS]

01:24:24   but band had a show and one of the times [TS]

01:24:29   that Trump was on they talked about they [TS]

01:24:31   were talking about immigration and Trump [TS]

01:24:32   was this is where they differed where [TS]

01:24:34   Trump was arguing more or less that he [TS]

01:24:37   wanted to make it easier for when [TS]

01:24:40   immigrants come and go to our [TS]

01:24:42   universities and become experts in [TS]

01:24:45   science or whatever other fields they [TS]

01:24:47   are that it would be better for the [TS]

01:24:48   country to figure out a way to keep them [TS]

01:24:50   here with their newly found us educate [TS]

01:24:52   you know expertise than to have them [TS]

01:24:55   leave again and band you know you say [TS]

01:24:57   you agree with that right abandoned the [TS]

01:24:59   argument was that there's you know [TS]

01:25:00   something to do if it didn't quite say [TS]

01:25:02   was a probability you could tell us [TS]

01:25:03   where he was going that when two-thirds [TS]

01:25:05   or three-fourths of the CEOs in Silicon [TS]

01:25:07   Valley or from Asia or South Asia you [TS]

01:25:11   know that's a problem and you know like [TS]

01:25:14   I there's no way to avoid it i mean [TS]

01:25:16   either you think either you look at [TS]

01:25:18   something and you see like a sundar [TS]

01:25:21   Pichai who was born in India is the CEO [TS]

01:25:24   of one of the most successful companies [TS]

01:25:26   in the history of the United States you [TS]

01:25:29   either see that as a great success [TS]

01:25:31   I I mean I just there's no common ground [TS]

01:25:34   i see this is that sundar Pichai is [TS]

01:25:36   proof that the system works and that our [TS]

01:25:38   country can be great and the sieve and [TS]

01:25:41   hold it up as a you know like a problem [TS]

01:25:42   to be so that needs a solution and i [TS]

01:25:45   don't know i don't see how ya think you [TS]

01:25:47   referred to it as a cultural right that [TS]

01:25:50   you know what it refers to our culture [TS]

01:25:52   that we have to maintain a certain [TS]

01:25:53   culture and then the question then [TS]

01:25:55   becomes you mean white culture right [TS]

01:25:57   right like do you mean you mean that the [TS]

01:26:00   European people who came over and killed [TS]

01:26:02   off the natives like those are the folks [TS]

01:26:04   that are the best excuse me [TS]

01:26:06   those are the folks that are the best in [TS]

01:26:08   those that's the culture we need to [TS]

01:26:09   maintain and you know i mean i think [TS]

01:26:13   that you have to take that stuff at face [TS]

01:26:15   value and I think that was you you can [TS]

01:26:18   read something about this but you know [TS]

01:26:21   everybody that was saying in any of the [TS]

01:26:22   Peter teal said this and nobody really [TS]

01:26:24   believed him at the time but it really [TS]

01:26:26   looks pretty gross [TS]

01:26:28   in retrospect you know it is in terms of [TS]

01:26:31   a gross miscalculation or gross decembe [TS]

01:26:34   lling [TS]

01:26:35   of the truth in that is that you know [TS]

01:26:39   you don't take it literally grabbed [TS]

01:26:40   right did don't take Trump literally [TS]

01:26:42   take him at his his intent not his word [TS]

01:26:46   or whatever they you know saying was but [TS]

01:26:49   it's become very clear that you have to [TS]

01:26:51   take this stuff literally so if you look [TS]

01:26:53   at statements like that you go okay well [TS]

01:26:54   you know if this person's you know [TS]

01:26:58   policies or whatever are enacted then [TS]

01:27:00   you know the their goal is to create a [TS]

01:27:04   safe space for white people in America [TS]

01:27:05   and then to you know a destroy as much [TS]

01:27:12   of the current government establishment [TS]

01:27:15   as possible because they view it as [TS]

01:27:17   corrupt or unnecessary because these he [TS]

01:27:20   says he views himself as a bulb [TS]

01:27:21   Lannister whatever you'd like to disturb [TS]

01:27:24   his band like to tear down as much of [TS]

01:27:27   the gov existing government as possible [TS]

01:27:29   so you look at things like that you can [TS]

01:27:30   look at them hey you know I'm I'm [TS]

01:27:32   intellectually curious about what this [TS]

01:27:34   person's views are and you know where [TS]

01:27:36   this gentleman is coming from and then [TS]

01:27:38   you can look at the stuff that's [TS]

01:27:39   happened in the last week and you go oh [TS]

01:27:42   maybe I should take this as a statement [TS]

01:27:44   of fact and not a statement of [TS]

01:27:46   philosophy aura or game theory [TS]

01:27:49   yeah and I think that that is a very [TS]

01:27:52   scary proposition I have a theory on [TS]

01:27:55   that from you that and you know it is as [TS]

01:27:59   much hope as as a while can't prove it [TS]

01:28:03   but it's certainly what I hope in terms [TS]

01:28:06   of the sustainability of this [TS]

01:28:08   administration it's a fact that [TS]

01:28:11   according to polls these is the least [TS]

01:28:14   popular incoming president in modern [TS]

01:28:16   history meaning in the history of like [TS]

01:28:18   the gallup poll and modern polling [TS]

01:28:20   technology and with just about every [TS]

01:28:23   previous are in fact not just about with [TS]

01:28:25   every previous elected new president [TS]

01:28:28   there is this grace period after the [TS]

01:28:31   election where the soon as the elections [TS]

01:28:34   over here's the winter you know [TS]

01:28:36   congratulations and the campaigning [TS]

01:28:38   stops there is a groundswell of support [TS]

01:28:41   and their popularity grows they enter [TS]

01:28:43   office with an approval rating that is [TS]

01:28:45   is higher this was true for Reagan this [TS]

01:28:48   was true for Carter Bill Clinton George [TS]

01:28:52   W Bush George HW Bush it's always been [TS]

01:28:55   true and it's not true with Trump [TS]

01:28:58   Trump's popularity and approvals went [TS]

01:28:59   down between the election and starting [TS]

01:29:02   and amazingly this gal approval rating [TS]

01:29:06   went down eight points in his first week [TS]

01:29:08   as president which just doesn't happen [TS]

01:29:11   and again it [TS]

01:29:13   I don't know but probably lost everybody [TS]

01:29:15   who's anybody who's listening it was a [TS]

01:29:17   trump supporter but I don't I think I [TS]

01:29:20   lost him a while ago but here's the help [TS]

01:29:22   for someone who's supposed to trump is [TS]

01:29:24   my theory is that Trump had a coalition [TS]

01:29:28   of voters who half of them [TS]

01:29:32   let's say roughly loved every little [TS]

01:29:34   word he said they wanted to lock her up [TS]

01:29:37   they wanted to build a wall they wanted [TS]

01:29:39   to make Mexico pay for the wall that [TS]

01:29:41   they didn't want they wanted to ban [TS]

01:29:44   Muslims from the country and any other [TS]

01:29:47   half where the like the peter thiel type [TS]

01:29:49   and which is why i wrote about it which [TS]

01:29:51   is the you can take this guy literally [TS]

01:29:54   he did he says these things because they [TS]

01:29:55   sound good he's a showman that he's not [TS]

01:29:57   going to do any of this stuff you know [TS]

01:29:59   it's just think of the vague intent you [TS]

01:30:01   know it's you know Till's description [TS]

01:30:03   and it's so funny that he picked up on [TS]

01:30:05   the the band the Muslims was that oh [TS]

01:30:09   yeah he just says that but what he [TS]

01:30:11   really means is they're going to have a [TS]

01:30:12   saying image [TS]

01:30:13   they're just gonna have a saner smarter [TS]

01:30:14   immigration policy well this this [TS]

01:30:16   immigration policy is insane and it's [TS]

01:30:18   not smarter it's poorly written it's [TS]

01:30:20   hard to execute I think what's happening [TS]

01:30:23   with Trump's approval is that the people [TS]

01:30:25   the only people he's going to be left [TS]

01:30:26   with are the group that wanted him to be [TS]

01:30:28   taken literally and that the group who [TS]

01:30:30   didn't want to take it literally and [TS]

01:30:32   just assumed that he wouldn't are [TS]

01:30:34   jumping ship because now they see that [TS]

01:30:36   he actually is doing these these things [TS]

01:30:38   and I don't think that there's [TS]

01:30:39   widespread support for them [TS]

01:30:44   yeah yeah it is [TS]

01:30:47   I mean there's this like a couple of [TS]

01:30:49   there's a couple of accounts on Twitter [TS]

01:30:51   can sort of collating regretful truck [TS]

01:30:54   motors [TS]

01:30:54   hmm who we are expressing their then one [TS]

01:30:59   today that you know hundreds of tweets [TS]

01:31:01   long sort of before-and-after tweets the [TS]

01:31:05   first it's like clipping the i'm afraid [TS]

01:31:07   i don't remember the account right now [TS]

01:31:08   but they're clipping the before to meet [TS]

01:31:10   you know when they're like all the trip [TS]

01:31:12   is going to x and y and you know trust [TS]

01:31:14   him and then the before the afterwards [TS]

01:31:16   like he's not gonna do this at all i'm [TS]

01:31:18   not now i'm not going to healthcare or [TS]

01:31:20   whatever and i think that there is [TS]

01:31:21   there's a shot in front and that but [TS]

01:31:24   there's also like it when people say you [TS]

01:31:27   have to see the other side and or you [TS]

01:31:31   know cross borders to to make that [TS]

01:31:33   always seems like it's always one side [TS]

01:31:35   having to cross those borders but I [TS]

01:31:37   thought honestly think there's [TS]

01:31:38   opportunity there to not be like Nelson [TS]

01:31:41   haha and be like look you were fooled [TS]

01:31:45   now let's fix it right and unfortunately [TS]

01:31:48   you know for many people [TS]

01:31:52   unfortunately for especially for people [TS]

01:31:53   who are very solidly were very slowly [TS]

01:31:55   Hillary Clinton Clinton supporters [TS]

01:31:57   whatever fixing it is going to end up [TS]

01:32:00   with penson power and the worst-case [TS]

01:32:02   scenario is that you know for those [TS]

01:32:04   folks is definitely bandhan stays in [TS]

01:32:06   power and implements his true strategy [TS]

01:32:08   which he laid out very explicitly and [TS]

01:32:11   you have to believe he wants those [TS]

01:32:13   things because he's you know in Britain [TS]

01:32:16   and influenced all of the other stuff so [TS]

01:32:18   far that's matched up 141 right and so [TS]

01:32:22   that's worst-case scenario that buddy [TS]

01:32:24   your best-case scenario is pence which [TS]

01:32:25   you know pence does not share liberal [TS]

01:32:29   values that all right i mean very [TS]

01:32:31   far-right you would consider him one of [TS]

01:32:34   the farthest right if it wasn't for the [TS]

01:32:36   band Trump conglomerate right so yeah [TS]

01:32:41   it's gonna be a rough for years i think [TS]

01:32:43   for anybody well ruff to it maybe if [TS]

01:32:47   this groundswell of of disapproval and [TS]

01:32:51   or you know activity or our activism is [TS]

01:32:56   able to carry for two years [TS]

01:32:58   you get into the midterm elections and [TS]

01:33:01   maybe you know the checks and balances [TS]

01:33:03   are back in place where it's some sort [TS]

01:33:06   of middle ground is found between the [TS]

01:33:08   two halves of the country literally [TS]

01:33:10   almost two halves of the voting public [TS]

01:33:11   right now uh you know so it's it's [TS]

01:33:14   definitely it at set times like this [TS]

01:33:17   where you realize just how important to [TS]

01:33:20   the balance of the force so to speak [TS]

01:33:24   those checks and balances are when [TS]

01:33:25   they're not there anymore it's it's a [TS]

01:33:27   very sudden cold bath you know [TS]

01:33:30   yep and you know I don't think we're at [TS]

01:33:32   the end of it and and in terms of issues [TS]

01:33:34   that will just pop up on stun [TS]

01:33:38   unexpectedly that draw uh you know the [TS]

01:33:41   industry that we cover into it directly [TS]

01:33:44   I mean it's going to be something I mean [TS]

01:33:45   for example I mean I mean trumpets [TS]

01:33:47   harping about it a year ago with the San [TS]

01:33:49   Bernardino case and apples studied [TS]

01:33:54   refusal to to give the FBI you know not [TS]

01:33:57   to go down that whole story again but [TS]

01:33:58   you know they didn't want to give them [TS]

01:34:01   an OS to unlock the phone in and it's [TS]

01:34:03   going to be a little different when and [TS]

01:34:05   Trump is the presidents that have just [TS]

01:34:06   the candidate and the heats fighting [TS]

01:34:08   back against it so I'm sure what will go [TS]

01:34:10   down that path again but yeah I mean [TS]

01:34:13   cybersecurity is the next big thing [TS]

01:34:15   so we'll see alright briefly because i [TS]

01:34:17   know we've gone over only on he's in [TS]

01:34:18   charge so outline one last thing I just [TS]

01:34:21   wanted to touch on is that you know how [TS]

01:34:24   many years now you've been going back [TS]

01:34:25   last week you were at sundance in Utah [TS]

01:34:27   yeah and I do that [TS]

01:34:31   so tell me about it tell me what you [TS]

01:34:33   know you do seems like you really have a [TS]

01:34:35   good time out there [TS]

01:34:36   yes I'm gonna have been going as long as [TS]

01:34:39   some folks I mean obviously it's been [TS]

01:34:40   going on for decades but um I started [TS]

01:34:43   going in 20 [TS]

01:34:47   13 2012 2013 somewhere in there so for a [TS]

01:34:51   few years now I've been going over here [TS]

01:34:52   in I like it a lot I mean it's you know [TS]

01:34:56   I like everything about it there's you [TS]

01:34:58   go to this town in utah park city which [TS]

01:35:01   is this Sundance's cover salt lake city [TS]

01:35:04   park city and a couple of other small [TS]

01:35:07   venues like Robert Redford's how [TS]

01:35:08   students personal screening room and [TS]

01:35:10   some other things had bases and he's got [TS]

01:35:15   ahold Conclave up there [TS]

01:35:16   the dude basically just owns this whole [TS]

01:35:18   town that's really funny but it's a you [TS]

01:35:23   go [TS]

01:35:24   it's in this snow there's nothing else [TS]

01:35:26   to do but watch movies and eat your you [TS]

01:35:30   know your kind of locked in i mean you [TS]

01:35:32   could ski and said I'd never do I always [TS]

01:35:33   tell myself all over that you know take [TS]

01:35:35   an afternoon or whatever but there's [TS]

01:35:37   always seems to be something to see you [TS]

01:35:38   something to do but you go in there snow [TS]

01:35:42   locked in this little town everybody [TS]

01:35:44   there's is there to see movies there are [TS]

01:35:47   like 60 70 movies that play every day [TS]

01:35:50   across all the venues you can only see [TS]

01:35:52   three or four of them a day I mean [TS]

01:35:53   that's if you pack them in and how do [TS]

01:35:55   you decide how do you mean what do you [TS]

01:35:57   do to get like a loser just like I hear [TS]

01:35:59   you get lucky you you get like a pass [TS]

01:36:01   and here's a list of all the movies and [TS]

01:36:02   you just go through and and pick them [TS]

01:36:04   yeah it's different for passholders so [TS]

01:36:07   if your pass holder you buy a package [TS]

01:36:09   which gives you access to certain kinds [TS]

01:36:11   of tickets and so many tickets a day or [TS]

01:36:13   whatever the case right near those past [TS]

01:36:15   holders get some nice perks like to get [TS]

01:36:17   to go in and see get seeded first to the [TS]

01:36:19   theater and whatnot but I goes press [TS]

01:36:20   because i do cover variety things like [TS]

01:36:23   last year for instance the the [TS]

01:36:25   documentary there were hartzog [TS]

01:36:27   documentary on on the internet you know [TS]

01:36:30   the kind of impact of the internet was [TS]

01:36:33   showing there so get to interview him [TS]

01:36:34   and and wrote about that for TechCrunch [TS]

01:36:36   and so I went in there more stuff there [TS]

01:36:40   is interactive vraa are versus just [TS]

01:36:43   films so when i go i always find [TS]

01:36:46   something to write about for TechCrunch [TS]

01:36:47   and it's it's fun to go is pressed [TS]

01:36:51   because you get you sign up you get your [TS]

01:36:53   press pass your press pass allows you to [TS]

01:36:55   see any press screening they have [TS]

01:36:56   essentially 14 theater multiplex [TS]

01:37:00   where it runs press P&I screenings all [TS]

01:37:03   day so pressing industry you can go to [TS]

01:37:04   any of those just get in line and go in [TS]

01:37:06   and watch those and then you can also [TS]

01:37:08   wait list for any movie throughout the [TS]

01:37:11   day and weightlifting is essentially [TS]

01:37:13   they have a little app in you you when [TS]

01:37:15   the waitlist thing turns on you hit go [TS]

01:37:17   and it says your number and so the [TS]

01:37:19   overflow seating which they have between [TS]

01:37:21   40 and a hundred to two hundred seats on [TS]

01:37:23   every theater assigned to the waitlist [TS]

01:37:25   you could possibly get in if you don't [TS]

01:37:27   have a ticket you buy your ticket for [TS]

01:37:29   twenty dollars that each movie ticket is [TS]

01:37:31   twenty dollars and me go and see this [TS]

01:37:33   movie that nobody's ever seen so it's [TS]

01:37:34   kind of a good deal for like local [TS]

01:37:35   residents and folks that don't have [TS]

01:37:37   ticket packages but for the press you [TS]

01:37:39   sign up you get your app where your [TS]

01:37:41   press pass which allows you to do all [TS]

01:37:43   that then you get 10 free complimentary [TS]

01:37:45   tickets over the course of the show and [TS]

01:37:47   then you can request between one and two [TS]

01:37:48   tickets every day that the press office [TS]

01:37:51   in the morning so everybody rushes down [TS]

01:37:52   and you know says always try to see this [TS]

01:37:54   or that they sell out of those tickets [TS]

01:37:56   once they would sell out and that's it [TS]

01:37:58   so in general like this last time I [TS]

01:38:00   don't have my stubs in front of me to [TS]

01:38:02   count but i think i saw i got there [TS]

01:38:04   thursday and left tuesday morning was a [TS]

01:38:06   short trip for me and I saw that big 20 [TS]

01:38:09   movies in that space of time [TS]

01:38:11   well and then a bunch of VR exhibits so [TS]

01:38:13   when you pack it in you know you're [TS]

01:38:15   there you might as well you know I mean [TS]

01:38:17   I do anyway you know different people [TS]

01:38:18   handle it differently the film [TS]

01:38:20   journalists usually stay there for a [TS]

01:38:21   week or even to because it's the runs [TS]

01:38:25   two weeks and that second week is a [TS]

01:38:27   second weekend / week is great because [TS]

01:38:30   nobody's there [TS]

01:38:31   I've gone in the second week some years [TS]

01:38:33   and you know it's it's purely about the [TS]

01:38:36   movies like the stars of all left to go [TS]

01:38:38   back to their lives or wherever the [TS]

01:38:41   first week every show you go to the [TS]

01:38:44   director or the actors or everybody [TS]

01:38:47   involved is there you get to see it [TS]

01:38:50   essentially what the people that made [TS]

01:38:51   the movie including down to the grips [TS]

01:38:53   and camera guys or wherever else came [TS]

01:38:55   and then those q and A's after every [TS]

01:38:57   movie so you get kind of you know talk [TS]

01:39:00   to the filmmakers about their [TS]

01:39:01   motivations and all that stuff [TS]

01:39:03   person-to-person right there so it's [TS]

01:39:04   pretty fun uh what was the best movie [TS]

01:39:07   they saw your team can pick one give a [TS]

01:39:10   handful yeah I'm gonna write about 2 e.r [TS]

01:39:13   yeah [TS]

01:39:14   is a couple that I found really good i [TS]

01:39:15   mean there's a couple that are non tech [TS]

01:39:16   related that I saw was there the big [TS]

01:39:19   sick which is Camille Nanjiani he wrote [TS]

01:39:23   that with his wife about their [TS]

01:39:25   experiences Camille's that one of the [TS]

01:39:27   guys from Silicon Valley is that he [TS]

01:39:30   plays one of the programmers very good [TS]

01:39:33   and you will hear about this I think [TS]

01:39:34   netflix bottom actually so you should be [TS]

01:39:37   able to watch it on netflix i don't know [TS]

01:39:38   if they're gonna release it theatrically [TS]

01:39:39   are directly on the fly but netflix and [TS]

01:39:43   amazon were big enormous presence is [TS]

01:39:45   there they bought a ton of movies from [TS]

01:39:47   this is like for 2013 [TS]

01:39:50   there is just like rumblings that [TS]

01:39:54   netflix is like poking around like there [TS]

01:39:56   are people here and then year after year [TS]

01:39:58   they got to be a more and more of a [TS]

01:39:59   presence until this year it was like you [TS]

01:40:02   know they were there were some of the [TS]

01:40:03   biggest purchasers at the show and [TS]

01:40:05   everyone everybody's lips and many of [TS]

01:40:07   the movies that premiered there had [TS]

01:40:08   already been pre-purchased by netflix [TS]

01:40:10   and things like that so it's you know [TS]

01:40:13   are my world was colliding with so happy [TS]

01:40:15   with Sunday's world at a rapid pace over [TS]

01:40:17   the last several years and it's got to [TS]

01:40:19   be it has to be from their perspective a [TS]

01:40:21   lower-risk way because these are movies [TS]

01:40:23   that are already made you know that in [TS]

01:40:24   it you know I don't that you could say [TS]

01:40:27   look I did you know and and there's some [TS]

01:40:29   subjective miss to it we're obviously [TS]

01:40:30   whoever it is from netflix is watching [TS]

01:40:32   the movie into yeah this is good you [TS]

01:40:34   know making a subjective judgment that [TS]

01:40:36   this this is a good good movie or a good [TS]

01:40:38   enough that we should think about buying [TS]

01:40:39   it but then once they do that the risk [TS]

01:40:41   is so much lower than backing something [TS]

01:40:44   but you know when it's just a screenplay [TS]

01:40:46   and there's so much uncertainty and I [TS]

01:40:47   know who are you going to get who can [TS]

01:40:49   you cast is it going to come together [TS]

01:40:50   you know so I got a surprise me at all [TS]

01:40:54   price right right and like last every [TS]

01:40:58   time I go to one of them my favorite [TS]

01:40:59   things to do is when i'm in line I just [TS]

01:41:01   talked to people because in general [TS]

01:41:03   these are film industry people that are [TS]

01:41:05   there i mean their bands to write just [TS]

01:41:07   folks that want to see movies but like I [TS]

01:41:09   talk to you know academy award-winning [TS]

01:41:11   producers that are just standing in line [TS]

01:41:13   and we just have a discussion right [TS]

01:41:14   because they're waiting to see some new [TS]

01:41:16   things and they're like oh yeah here [TS]

01:41:17   it's great or whatever and you know I [TS]

01:41:20   talked with them about their next [TS]

01:41:21   project and about the industry in blah [TS]

01:41:24   blah and like I talk to buyers and [TS]

01:41:27   and producers and they're talking about [TS]

01:41:29   netflix and amazon they're talking about [TS]

01:41:31   Cassidy is this a challenge to you is it [TS]

01:41:34   like do you view it as like an invasion [TS]

01:41:36   or whatever there-there you know in [TS]

01:41:39   general the response has been very [TS]

01:41:40   positive when they're like hell no for [TS]

01:41:42   us it's like a way to tell a filmmaker [TS]

01:41:44   look you can use these people to make [TS]

01:41:46   your next movie in other words sell this [TS]

01:41:48   movie [TS]

01:41:49   you're not going to bet you know be rich [TS]

01:41:51   off of it or whatever you're gonna make [TS]

01:41:53   a decent deal because neither whether [TS]

01:41:55   amazon amazon netflix are overpaying [TS]

01:41:57   right now for movies simply because a [TS]

01:41:59   they have the money and be there sort of [TS]

01:42:00   trying to build momentum but they're [TS]

01:42:04   also enabling filmmakers to just boom [TS]

01:42:08   like sell that and then make another [TS]

01:42:10   movie right like it move on to your next [TS]

01:42:12   project and then allows them to build a [TS]

01:42:14   body of work and it's just like a new [TS]

01:42:16   plug-and-play distributor that they're [TS]

01:42:18   able to just can't go it's a netflix [TS]

01:42:22   comes with our corpus of data that says [TS]

01:42:24   this is what we know works [TS]

01:42:25   amazon comes with their deep pockets and [TS]

01:42:27   says hey we're going to really shoot [TS]

01:42:28   theatrically like they're different [TS]

01:42:30   playbooks there's not they're not just [TS]

01:42:31   like bland entities the handle things [TS]

01:42:34   the same way you know they definitely [TS]

01:42:35   distribute them very differently but [TS]

01:42:38   logic new opportunities you know for [TS]

01:42:39   filmmakers any other movies you want to [TS]

01:42:41   give a shout out to other than the big [TS]

01:42:42   sick [TS]

01:42:43   yeah Marjorie prime I really really [TS]

01:42:45   liked it and Marjorie prime is a movie [TS]

01:42:48   that stars Jon Hamm geena davis who else [TS]

01:43:00   a tim robbins isn't it as well so I mean [TS]

01:43:05   like you know all all-star cast I mean [TS]

01:43:07   it's directed by this guy named mark [TS]

01:43:09   Michael I'm radio I think I'm raida I'm [TS]

01:43:14   meet my mispronounced aid he directed [TS]

01:43:16   the hamlet in our neighborhood with [TS]

01:43:18   ethan hawke yesterday back but yeah the [TS]

01:43:21   movie stars lowest smith and louis smith [TS]

01:43:24   is a very variable actress you you have [TS]

01:43:26   seen her you know it you listeners out [TS]

01:43:29   there you have seen her in something [TS]

01:43:30   trust me that busy with our if you [TS]

01:43:33   remember East of Eden [TS]

01:43:34   yeah with uh yeah yeah she was in that [TS]

01:43:37   like she's been in in the biz a long [TS]

01:43:39   time [TS]

01:43:40   I think she's e85 86 now but she wasn't [TS]

01:43:44   you know she's been in tons of stuff [TS]

01:43:45   that people have seen like fried green [TS]

01:43:47   tomatoes and oyster and you know true [TS]

01:43:50   blood and all kinds of stuff right but [TS]

01:43:52   she played that she plays a character [TS]

01:43:54   who is losing her memory either via [TS]

01:43:56   dementia or Alzheimer's or whatever and [TS]

01:43:59   her family and she played this same [TS]

01:44:01   character in a stage play written by the [TS]

01:44:04   guy who you know they adapted the [TS]

01:44:05   screenplay off of and she's played that [TS]

01:44:07   character twice in two runs of that play [TS]

01:44:09   and then he directed this director [TS]

01:44:12   director her in this movie version of [TS]

01:44:14   that play and she's an older woman who's [TS]

01:44:16   losing her cognitive ability and her [TS]

01:44:19   family purchases her and a i called the [TS]

01:44:22   Prime and that prime is there to talk [TS]

01:44:26   with her and to help her to keep those [TS]

01:44:29   memory pathways active right the helper [TS]

01:44:33   relive her life and and and talk about [TS]

01:44:36   her memories so Jon Hamm plays her [TS]

01:44:39   husband in his younger state because [TS]

01:44:42   that's the way she wanted to remember [TS]

01:44:43   him and the prime is set up to engage [TS]

01:44:47   with her and ask her about her life and [TS]

01:44:48   to learn so when she talks to it learns [TS]

01:44:51   about her life essentially learning to [TS]

01:44:52   be more human and more like him but the [TS]

01:44:56   themes obviously the AI you know [TS]

01:44:59   component of it as a huge portion of the [TS]

01:45:01   theme themes i found absolutely just a [TS]

01:45:04   spellbinding I mean I I was barely [TS]

01:45:07   breathing by the end of it and it's not [TS]

01:45:09   a very it's not thriller by any means [TS]

01:45:11   you know it's an extremely calm [TS]

01:45:13   meditative movie that I found to be [TS]

01:45:16   extremely well acted full of nuance and [TS]

01:45:18   add rested arrest some really really you [TS]

01:45:21   know interesting topics about AI the way [TS]

01:45:24   will affect us you know the way that [TS]

01:45:27   humans can sort of impart their being to [TS]

01:45:30   AI in the future or may impart them if [TS]

01:45:32   it ever gets to that point you know it's [TS]

01:45:35   very very interesting i do recommend [TS]

01:45:36   checking it out when it comes out i [TS]

01:45:38   think maybe netflix but it sounds right [TS]

01:45:40   up your alley so I feel like we're [TS]

01:45:42   entering a goal against as Hollywood [TS]

01:45:44   devolves into nothing but sequels two [TS]

01:45:47   franchises and 300 million dollar [TS]

01:45:50   budgets and the expectation you know [TS]

01:45:52   that [TS]

01:45:53   did the last two thirds of the movie is [TS]

01:45:55   going to be blowing up a city every [TS]

01:45:57   single time [TS]

01:45:58   alright we're entering like at a golden [TS]

01:46:01   age of of smaller budget you know what [TS]

01:46:04   used to be called indie movies I don't [TS]

01:46:05   know what you want to call them now but [TS]

01:46:06   you know outside Hollywood and outside [TS]

01:46:08   the blockbuster mindset of science [TS]

01:46:10   fiction and a lot of a meeting and you [TS]

01:46:13   know it's no surprise that were that [TS]

01:46:14   people are thinking about AI because [TS]

01:46:16   it's starting to to get real and it's so [TS]

01:46:19   great it is so refreshing to see movies [TS]

01:46:21   about AI that have gotten away from AI [TS]

01:46:24   that goes bad and takes over the plan [TS]

01:46:27   exactly that said yeah that's generally [TS]

01:46:30   see and I mean I the one thing what they [TS]

01:46:33   will say this might be interesting to to [TS]

01:46:35   be publicity is that the mood at [TS]

01:46:38   sundance this year I mean I'd like I [TS]

01:46:40   said I'm not you know I'm not claiming [TS]

01:46:41   to be some historians of sundance but [TS]

01:46:43   the mood this year compared to years [TS]

01:46:45   past because remember the inauguration [TS]

01:46:47   was happening on that friday that of the [TS]

01:46:51   beginning of the festival yeah and all [TS]

01:46:53   this stuff started happening you know [TS]

01:46:54   like this these the first executive [TS]

01:46:57   actions and stuff started being passed [TS]

01:46:59   and all this and people are realizing [TS]

01:47:01   just how much Trump was being going to [TS]

01:47:03   be the trumpet promise to be in the mood [TS]

01:47:06   at Sundance was insane and it was somber [TS]

01:47:09   and meditative and defiant and you know [TS]

01:47:11   as artists being artists you know just [TS]

01:47:13   saying like we're not going to give up [TS]

01:47:16   the light we're going to push and we're [TS]

01:47:17   gonna tell stories and we're going to [TS]

01:47:20   help unify via those stories you know [TS]

01:47:23   Redford and various programmers make [TS]

01:47:25   comments as I was sitting in you know [TS]

01:47:27   screenings and things like that about [TS]

01:47:28   telling challenging and difficult [TS]

01:47:31   stories and not letting up on that it [TS]

01:47:34   was just seemed very very interesting [TS]

01:47:36   very very unified in its in its emotion [TS]

01:47:40   you know it in years past it was all [TS]

01:47:42   over the place you know people have [TS]

01:47:44   different thoughts and feelings but it [TS]

01:47:45   seemed very very interesting to me so [TS]

01:47:47   it'll be interesting to see how artists [TS]

01:47:49   and filmmakers and people like that [TS]

01:47:50   react over the next several years [TS]

01:47:52   yep well it's nice to talk about [TS]

01:47:54   something a little bit nicer than a [TS]

01:47:56   Trump but it's it inevitably it came [TS]

01:47:59   back to trump have you my thanks to you [TS]

01:48:04   for your time [TS]

01:48:05   this is a great discussion everybody can [TS]

01:48:08   absolutely find you on twitter whats [TS]

01:48:10   your twitter handle pains r pn zer and [TS]

01:48:16   of course your good work as editor at [TS]

01:48:19   TechCrunch keep up keep up the good work [TS]

01:48:21   my thanks to our sponsors this week we [TS]

01:48:23   had Squarespace and we had audible and [TS]

01:48:30   our new sponsor ministry of supply so my [TS]

01:48:34   thanks to them my thanks to you [TS]

01:48:36   audios [TS]