The Talk Show

182: ‘AAA Podcast’, With Special Guest Marco Arment


00:00:00   I just kind of feel like like I just [TS]

00:00:03   discovered fills in San Francisco once [TS]

00:00:06   last year and I'm probably never gonna [TS]

00:00:09   go there again I guess what I looked on [TS]

00:00:12   the map and there is a philsie within a [TS]

00:00:14   few blocks of the san jose convention [TS]

00:00:17   center [TS]

00:00:18   oh yeah alright yeah ok hydrogen-ion [TS]

00:00:21   there a lot it's like not like across [TS]

00:00:23   the street but it's probably about as [TS]

00:00:25   close as the one the just couple blocks [TS]

00:00:28   as we go to get place that's AII do [TS]

00:00:31   wonder how different the culture of sand [TS]

00:00:34   I've never been to San Jose like I've [TS]

00:00:36   been only and only a handful of times in [TS]

00:00:38   Silicon Valley at all and and so San [TS]

00:00:41   Jose is is even less familiar to me than [TS]

00:00:44   the rest of it and but you've got to a [TS]

00:00:47   couple events here in there right yeah [TS]

00:00:49   including the only time I ever set foot [TS]

00:00:51   and in San Jose was the 2012 in a [TS]

00:00:55   October event so isn't the one a month [TS]

00:00:59   after the big iphone event they did I [TS]

00:01:01   iPads and I think that was when the [TS]

00:01:03   current form factor of the imac debuted [TS]

00:01:06   with the inside not yet retina of course [TS]

00:01:10   yeah and was the last public event Apple [TS]

00:01:14   held while Scott Forstall was was an [TS]

00:01:16   executive yeah I was that was I remember [TS]

00:01:21   so I still remember like the day that [TS]

00:01:23   that he was officially announced as [TS]

00:01:25   being out we were actually Tiffany [TS]

00:01:26   vacation seattle i was like in this [TS]

00:01:28   weird clothing store with her like [TS]

00:01:30   killing time my phone I'm trying to [TS]

00:01:32   catch up on what the heck just happened [TS]

00:01:33   everyone was exploding about it's pretty [TS]

00:01:35   cool [TS]

00:01:35   yeah I don't know it so speaking of our [TS]

00:01:37   of our imax though I have a bone to pick [TS]

00:01:40   with you about that I believe that that [TS]

00:01:43   you and I have the same 2014 first and [TS]

00:01:46   5k imac correct does yours have problems [TS]

00:01:50   the image retention know you're lucky [TS]

00:01:54   well either that or rarely I don't see [TS]

00:01:56   it it's possible that maybe I you know [TS]

00:01:59   maybe if my eyes were what they used to [TS]

00:02:01   be i would see it but it doesn't seem [TS]

00:02:03   like yours here's why here's why you [TS]

00:02:05   would see in particular because the the [TS]

00:02:08   most commonplace I see it this this [TS]

00:02:10   started happening over the last few [TS]

00:02:11   months [TS]

00:02:12   and and it's I know you're gonna say [TS]

00:02:14   yeah exactly just happened over the last [TS]

00:02:17   few months and it's getting worse [TS]

00:02:18   quickly and so what happens is I'm not [TS]

00:02:21   talking about burning like I'm plasma [TS]

00:02:23   TVs right you have a something burning [TS]

00:02:24   forever talking about LCD image [TS]

00:02:26   retention where basically you you kind [TS]

00:02:28   of see like the ghost image of what was [TS]

00:02:30   there before for a few minutes and i can [TS]

00:02:33   get like fades over like a minute or two [TS]

00:02:36   so if you have something high-contrast [TS]

00:02:38   up for five or ten minutes say so for [TS]

00:02:41   instance when your podcasting and you [TS]

00:02:42   have a couple windows up there might [TS]

00:02:44   have like text no to skype window or [TS]

00:02:45   whatever else and then you go to your [TS]

00:02:47   web browser and you load a dark grey [TS]

00:02:50   website then you will see the shadows of [TS]

00:02:55   your formerly in those spots [TS]

00:02:57   black-and-white windows you will see [TS]

00:03:00   those very clearly against the gray [TS]

00:03:02   background of the website you're looking [TS]

00:03:03   at [TS]

00:03:04   yeah it's ok for avi almost always gets [TS]

00:03:06   me 4a to 5a exactly [TS]

00:03:10   I on my previous display and it was [TS]

00:03:13   ancient I I used to talk about in the [TS]

00:03:15   podcast but before getting this this [TS]

00:03:17   this 5k imac what was that like two and [TS]

00:03:21   a half years ago now i guess yeah i was [TS]

00:03:24   using a 20 inch apple cinema display not [TS]

00:03:28   24-inch 20-inch from Cochise must be [TS]

00:03:32   like 2000-2002 or something I mean I [TS]

00:03:35   don't know it was really maybe it wasn't [TS]

00:03:37   quite that old but it was really pretty [TS]

00:03:38   old and I was sort of in a Syracuse [TS]

00:03:43   situation where I it was long past the [TS]

00:03:48   point where I could have easily afforded [TS]

00:03:49   to replace it and they're all sorts of [TS]

00:03:52   good options i could have bought but I [TS]

00:03:53   was sort of hoping for something ratna [TS]

00:03:56   for ever and ever and ever and so I just [TS]

00:03:58   kept putting it off it's like there's no [TS]

00:04:00   way I'm spending a thousand dollars on [TS]

00:04:01   an Apple even no matter how you know I [TS]

00:04:03   guess they were 30 inch for a while then [TS]

00:04:05   they went to 27 inch but I just didn't [TS]

00:04:07   feel like buying it got to have retina [TS]

00:04:09   knowing that retinol would come out any [TS]

00:04:11   year now for Morrison years and years so [TS]

00:04:14   my i was using and that display after it [TS]

00:04:17   must have been over had to be at least [TS]

00:04:18   10 years old and I used it every day had [TS]

00:04:20   terrible image retention and i know you [TS]

00:04:22   exactly where you're going because my [TS]

00:04:24   website was the nipple [TS]

00:04:25   open it really is like most if you're [TS]

00:04:28   dealing with other black-and-white [TS]

00:04:29   windows you don't really see it as often [TS]

00:04:31   but when you when you've had something [TS]

00:04:33   black and white up for a while and then [TS]

00:04:34   you switch to a large expanse of grey [TS]

00:04:36   you see it very clearly and you and my [TS]

00:04:39   initial thought is always I didn't [TS]

00:04:41   realize that Safari was translucent [TS]

00:04:43   exactly like I I always I always think [TS]

00:04:45   it's like window translucency and I'm [TS]

00:04:47   like oh that's that's a weird design [TS]

00:04:48   decision [TS]

00:04:49   oh wait that isn't a design is right [TS]

00:04:50   when i first encountered it that's [TS]

00:04:52   exactly what I thought is I thought that [TS]

00:04:53   maybe at some point I did hit some kind [TS]

00:04:55   of weird i died i diddled something in [TS]

00:04:58   the terminal with defaults write write [TS]

00:05:00   trying to let you know calm calm down [TS]

00:05:02   apple start safari / you know their [TS]

00:05:05   space translucency equals 91 or [TS]

00:05:07   something like that right exactly [TS]

00:05:09   because that's exactly what I like [TS]

00:05:11   sorry about that but now now that now [TS]

00:05:12   it's an imax oh and it's my main [TS]

00:05:14   computer and system attack [TS]

00:05:16   I don't want to send this thing in for [TS]

00:05:17   repair not using my main computer for [TS]

00:05:19   like two weeks or however long it takes [TS]

00:05:21   to get it actually fixed like [TS]

00:05:22   two-and-a-half years under even daily [TS]

00:05:24   seems like too soon [TS]

00:05:26   honestly yeah I I don't like and it's [TS]

00:05:29   like Oh am I gonna get one that has used [TS]

00:05:31   the same problem are they [TS]

00:05:32   I'm always worried that not even gonna [TS]

00:05:33   believe me or that or that i can replace [TS]

00:05:35   it because they don't think they don't [TS]

00:05:36   think it's bad enough you know even [TS]

00:05:38   though i don't mean there's not i don't [TS]

00:05:39   have a lot of basis for those feelings [TS]

00:05:41   it's just like it's such a it's such a [TS]

00:05:43   hassle to send away my main computer for [TS]

00:05:47   repair [TS]

00:05:47   especially the larger get a laptop i [TS]

00:05:49   could bring into a genius bar maybe have [TS]

00:05:51   something faster maybe but like because [TS]

00:05:54   it's such an ordeal haul this thing [TS]

00:05:56   anywhere and ship it anywhere and i [TS]

00:05:58   don't know i don't like my current plan [TS]

00:06:00   is to just hope that they do something [TS]

00:06:02   with like an imac pro or a mac pro [TS]

00:06:05   sometime this year before my applecare [TS]

00:06:09   runs out in october and then i can just [TS]

00:06:12   buy the new one [TS]

00:06:14   send this in for repair and then when i [TS]

00:06:16   get back from repair sell it if you've [TS]

00:06:18   got application should definitely do it [TS]

00:06:19   although you have to be without it but [TS]

00:06:21   it's a pain yeah it's like I don't want [TS]

00:06:23   to switch to my new crappy keyboard [TS]

00:06:25   touch bar you know I haven't I haven't [TS]

00:06:27   bought applecare since 1991 the only [TS]

00:06:30   reason I bought it on this and and i'm [TS]

00:06:32   with you most of the time you learned [TS]

00:06:33   the bottom this is that apple care that [TS]

00:06:35   the pricing is based on these tears of [TS]

00:06:38   the product they apply to a fourteen [TS]

00:06:41   hundred dollar imac has the same apple [TS]

00:06:44   care costs as a 4500 are fully loaded [TS]

00:06:46   one right and so I was buying the very [TS]

00:06:50   first generation of a new thing of the [TS]

00:06:52   5k and so I thought you know what it was [TS]

00:06:54   only like 200 bucks or something was it [TS]

00:06:56   was not a lot of money for what was [TS]

00:06:59   something like a 4400 all configurations [TS]

00:07:01   because i got like really maxed out [TS]

00:07:02   because my main computer and I figured [TS]

00:07:04   you know at the ratio their pay so i [TS]

00:07:06   don't really get it for anything else [TS]

00:07:07   but in in cases where like you're buying [TS]

00:07:10   early maxed-out configure something it [TS]

00:07:12   often does pay off because it's such a [TS]

00:07:13   low relative cost i think we might have [TS]

00:07:16   literally the same machine i know i'm [TS]

00:07:18   actually do you know I max out the ram [TS]

00:07:19   32 gigs and i would if i could you have [TS]

00:07:22   a terabyte right i think i have a [TS]

00:07:25   terabyte drive because I don't know why [TS]

00:07:26   wouldn't you want it because it's the [TS]

00:07:28   only drive i keep attachments to the [TS]

00:07:29   time actually don't even know that's [TS]

00:07:33   that's something but wow it's got to be [TS]

00:07:36   a terabyte I don't see how i would be [TS]

00:07:38   able to function if it wasn't the [TS]

00:07:40   terabyte and then what I get the 4 [TS]

00:07:42   gigahertz intel core i7 yep [TS]

00:07:45   ya think ya enjoy enjoy a wonderful [TS]

00:07:47   screen you will know quickly if it ever [TS]

00:07:50   becomes a problem [TS]

00:07:51   yes iiiir my dr 999 point three eight [TS]

00:07:54   gigabytes just bullshit i ripped off you [TS]

00:07:57   get the full terabyte yeah I boy I just [TS]

00:08:01   hope i get i hope i can fix this easily [TS]

00:08:04   I don't know ATP tipster said that this [TS]

00:08:06   was a problem with that with the one [TS]

00:08:08   that we have the 2014 but they fixed it [TS]

00:08:10   for the 2015 model and just still the [TS]

00:08:12   current model but i guess i can have new [TS]

00:08:15   ones like in marks or whatever who knows [TS]

00:08:17   with yeah we can get to march and we [TS]

00:08:19   have to have to get to that to Jason [TS]

00:08:22   kind of sounds like apples gonna release [TS]

00:08:24   like 15 things in marks like that's [TS]

00:08:26   that's kind of what like all the rumors [TS]

00:08:27   are pointing to like for ipads new imacs [TS]

00:08:32   new 12-inch MacBook one you know it's [TS]

00:08:34   like and new watch bands and who knows [TS]

00:08:37   what on the software side you know new [TS]

00:08:39   ipad stuff maybe I mean there's like [TS]

00:08:41   that there is such a giant list of [TS]

00:08:43   things that rumor people expect to be [TS]

00:08:44   launched in march it's kind of [TS]

00:08:45   ridiculous [TS]

00:08:47   you see this i don't have been into link [TS]

00:08:49   to it and I haven't because I forget why [TS]

00:08:52   i think it might be because i can't find [TS]

00:08:53   the guys name and I keep you and I ran [TS]

00:08:56   into the same thing with somebody on [TS]

00:08:57   Twitter recently the guy [TS]

00:08:59   omd or something like that or yeah you [TS]

00:09:02   didn't he like didn't have his name [TS]

00:09:04   anywhere in any of the stuff we both [TS]

00:09:05   want to link to a man named you know [TS]

00:09:07   they like nice and right like i always [TS]

00:09:10   say i think he didn't he responded sound [TS]

00:09:12   like he didn't want to be named Lucy [TS]

00:09:14   evenly first name was the hardest and he [TS]

00:09:16   said something like he's building this [TS]

00:09:17   brand on AMD or something like that and [TS]

00:09:19   it's it's harder for me to link to [TS]

00:09:21   somebody who is anonymous and idea that [TS]

00:09:23   really gets me and I had to say it to [TS]

00:09:25   you but it it's true is it was often it [TS]

00:09:28   seems like I link a lot less frequently [TS]

00:09:30   anymore to people who have tumblr blogs [TS]

00:09:32   just anecdotally but back when tumblr [TS]

00:09:35   was sort of at its peak as a blogging [TS]

00:09:38   platform like I'm not saying that tumblr [TS]

00:09:40   is is in decline but i think it's in [TS]

00:09:42   decline for the sort of blogging that i [TS]

00:09:44   tend to link to return fireball an awful [TS]

00:09:47   lot of of tumblr sites don't have that [TS]

00:09:49   the person's real name on it it's just [TS]

00:09:51   their their tumblr handle and that was [TS]

00:09:54   always a big hassle for me and have to [TS]

00:09:56   like figure out what their twitter name [TS]

00:09:57   was and go to their twitter page and [TS]

00:09:59   find a real name from there like it [TS]

00:10:00   didn't even seem like it was people who [TS]

00:10:02   are trying to hide their name it's just [TS]

00:10:03   sort of idiomatic for tumblr but anyway [TS]

00:10:06   there's this site here that was it [TS]

00:10:08   actually was actually designed that way [TS]

00:10:09   like we we meant it to be like as in and [TS]

00:10:12   they like the same way that like one [TS]

00:10:13   account could have multiple blogs right [TS]

00:10:16   and that the there would be no way to [TS]

00:10:17   tell unless you put it there which blogs [TS]

00:10:21   belong to which account arrives like you [TS]

00:10:23   know if it was very easy to create an [TS]

00:10:25   anonymous things that weren't tied to [TS]

00:10:27   your main identity and that was very [TS]

00:10:29   much intentional because like everything [TS]

00:10:30   else the time like to keep my like we [TS]

00:10:32   made tumblr as kind of a response to [TS]

00:10:35   myspace and Facebook and and like the [TS]

00:10:37   big social networks that work that were [TS]

00:10:39   big when we started in 2006 and so [TS]

00:10:42   Twitter wasn't really and Twitter exist [TS]

00:10:44   if it wasn't big so that was really a [TS]

00:10:45   response to those that were all about [TS]

00:10:47   getting your real name and putting all [TS]

00:10:49   your stuff out in public under your real [TS]

00:10:50   name and you know it a lot of people [TS]

00:10:53   can't or won't give their real name for [TS]

00:10:56   a lot of stuff they want to do online [TS]

00:10:58   and so you you enable a lot more like [TS]

00:11:01   creativity and different types of uses [TS]

00:11:03   if you if you allow people to be [TS]

00:11:05   anonymous so that was kind of that was [TS]

00:11:07   kinda like the ethos from the beginning [TS]

00:11:08   of like you can make a different blog [TS]

00:11:10   it's no risk it's not gonna like you [TS]

00:11:12   know look bad upon you this is before [TS]

00:11:14   all the hate crap that we have today I [TS]

00:11:16   think it might be a little bit different [TS]

00:11:18   calculation their way back then you know [TS]

00:11:20   most of the haight was confined to these [TS]

00:11:21   French forms and stuff and they weren't [TS]

00:11:23   really on tumblr [TS]

00:11:24   I don't even know they are now I don't [TS]

00:11:25   think they are but regardless of the [TS]

00:11:29   idea of getting like anonymous identity [TS]

00:11:31   out there very very easily was quite a [TS]

00:11:34   positive thing in 2006 anyway I just [TS]

00:11:37   saying that like it's to a guy named [TS]

00:11:39   Thomas for Shirin at very short dot-com [TS]

00:11:41   here's a Twitter link so i got his name [TS]

00:11:44   from there but anyway he is an [TS]

00:11:45   interesting speculation hear that and it [TS]

00:11:48   it's purely his guess it doesn't see [TS]

00:11:50   he's not claiming any sort of sources [TS]

00:11:52   but what he's saying is that when Apple [TS]

00:11:53   made standalone displays they tend to [TS]

00:11:56   sell them for a long time the 27th LED [TS]

00:11:58   display was on sale for three years the [TS]

00:12:01   27-inch Thunderbolt Display was on sale [TS]

00:12:03   for five years I guess they're still [TS]

00:12:04   selling it for today today they still [TS]

00:12:06   sell that right [TS]

00:12:07   I don't even know no no no they just you [TS]

00:12:09   know like a year and a half ago so you [TS]

00:12:11   can't even buy an outdated apple display [TS]

00:12:13   at this point no like that mean you [TS]

00:12:15   might go to find somebody left in stock [TS]

00:12:17   but happy to have someone new for a [TS]

00:12:18   while so here's his gas is his gas is [TS]

00:12:22   the that Apple didn't want to release a [TS]

00:12:25   5k standalone cinema display back in [TS]

00:12:28   October when they did all the new [TS]

00:12:30   macbooks that could use them because [TS]

00:12:33   they weren't yet ready to sell one with [TS]

00:12:35   true tone because they don't have true [TS]

00:12:37   tone in the imac either none of the [TS]

00:12:38   desktop max2 and so is he says here is [TS]

00:12:42   conclusion if you were Apple what would [TS]

00:12:43   you choose to do release and I an apple [TS]

00:12:45   5k cinema display in 2016 and then sell [TS]

00:12:48   it for a few years unchanged without [TS]

00:12:50   true tone or push the LG display in 2016 [TS]

00:12:54   as a stopgap and release an apple 5k [TS]

00:12:58   true tone display some time in 2017 so I [TS]

00:13:01   that is anybody who's still holding on [TS]

00:13:04   to a thread of hope that Apple hasn't [TS]

00:13:05   abandoned the standalone display game [TS]

00:13:08   which I would not bet I [TS]

00:13:10   of suspect that they are done but this [TS]

00:13:12   there's this there's a wee bit of sense [TS]

00:13:14   here in my opinion I mean so the thing [TS]

00:13:18   about like you know they they tend to [TS]

00:13:19   have these displays the last for a [TS]

00:13:21   certain amount of time throw that right [TS]

00:13:22   out doesn't matter right doesn't it [TS]

00:13:23   doesn't matter how long things have been [TS]

00:13:24   out like five years they did this is a [TS]

00:13:26   very small sample size Apple does not [TS]

00:13:28   artificially hold things back simply [TS]

00:13:30   because the last one is only three years [TS]

00:13:32   old instead of four years old I like [TS]

00:13:34   that's that's it's this is too small the [TS]

00:13:37   correlation to matter and that's not how [TS]

00:13:38   they really work [TS]

00:13:39   I think the only question here is [TS]

00:13:41   whether whether we believe that they [TS]

00:13:44   would hold back this display and go [TS]

00:13:46   through the kind of a assume the LG [TS]

00:13:49   Display was perfect which it isn't but [TS]

00:13:51   assuming LG Display was perfect [TS]

00:13:52   they still took a big PR hit in order to [TS]

00:13:55   push that as this as the solution and to [TS]

00:13:57   have the idea out there floating [TS]

00:13:59   unchallenged for months that and still [TS]

00:14:01   so far that they are out of this display [TS]

00:14:03   business [TS]

00:14:04   yeah but what if they had no choice that [TS]

00:14:05   more but it is that is that more likely [TS]

00:14:08   then them wanting to save true tone for [TS]

00:14:12   the imac they don't sell them anytime [TS]

00:14:13   access whole lot more laptops it would [TS]

00:14:15   not surprise me if when the Thunderbolt [TS]

00:14:18   Display that they just read that when [TS]

00:14:20   they discontinued recently that one when [TS]

00:14:23   it was new it wouldn't surprise me if [TS]

00:14:25   that outsold the imac when it was new it [TS]

00:14:27   but it might not but they sell a lot of [TS]

00:14:30   laptops and cell a lot of these displays [TS]

00:14:32   for laptops for their laptops and so I i [TS]

00:14:36   don't see them holding back something [TS]

00:14:39   that their customers very clearly want [TS]

00:14:41   replacing a product that was incredibly [TS]

00:14:44   out of date only for the purpose of one [TS]

00:14:47   of its really minor features like [TS]

00:14:50   jumping ahead of the imac getting that [TS]

00:14:52   same feature is that it doesn't seem [TS]

00:14:53   like that would be important enough to [TS]

00:14:54   them to justify the downside of that [TS]

00:14:56   strategy but if the original plan was [TS]

00:14:58   like a year in advance or well over a [TS]

00:15:00   year ago if they had hoped to also have [TS]

00:15:02   5k imax at the end of 2016 2 with two [TS]

00:15:05   tone and all things just maybe if that's [TS]

00:15:10   plausible buy homes i'm not saying how [TS]

00:15:13   likely it is but the whole thing seems [TS]

00:15:14   plausible to me that it's some sort of [TS]

00:15:16   engineering / supply chain [TS]

00:15:19   screw up or you know maybe screw-up is [TS]

00:15:22   too harsh of award but something didn't [TS]

00:15:24   go according to plan and and that's [TS]

00:15:26   where they are i don't know i still love [TS]

00:15:27   it I brought it up the other week on [TS]

00:15:28   this show and then there must be an [TS]

00:15:30   awful lot of people who listen to my [TS]

00:15:32   show who don't listen to ATP because its [TS]

00:15:34   highest you might expect the best [TS]

00:15:35   feedback I got was that the observation [TS]

00:15:38   we got so I got so much email about [TS]

00:15:40   ripping off Syracuse's observation from [TS]

00:15:43   ATP which I did credit him with that [TS]

00:15:45   what is a plan to do in your beautiful [TS]

00:15:47   new campus stuff all arrays and it would [TS]

00:15:50   supposedly has a more open floor plan [TS]

00:15:52   where you'll see more of the your [TS]

00:15:54   colleagues desks are they good i'm going [TS]

00:15:56   to put one of these ugly LG monitors on [TS]

00:15:59   every single one of these Johnny I've [TS]

00:16:00   designed desks like Johnny I've is [TS]

00:16:03   bottoming like often the woods you know [TS]

00:16:05   nailing desks together out of like wood [TS]

00:16:08   that comes from one special brand of [TS]

00:16:10   tree that grows in northern Italy or [TS]

00:16:12   something and they're gonna put ugly LG [TS]

00:16:14   monitors on all these desks i mean [TS]

00:16:18   that's that's also a good counter [TS]

00:16:20   argument but i think it's it's just as [TS]

00:16:21   likely that you could just say well [TS]

00:16:23   there are there solutions just they're [TS]

00:16:24   gonna give most engineers and stuff Matt [TS]

00:16:26   like I'm actually get it it really does [TS]

00:16:28   seem like a and again this could be [TS]

00:16:32   blown into the water and apple releases [TS]

00:16:33   a brand new mac pro I'm a pro whatever [TS]

00:16:36   it is in in july but i think it's very [TS]

00:16:37   unlikely i think that was gonna happen [TS]

00:16:39   we would have a lot more than casual [TS]

00:16:41   speculation about it by now the fact [TS]

00:16:43   that there's nothing in the pipeline to [TS]

00:16:46   suggest that's happening [TS]

00:16:47   make me believe it's definitely had not [TS]

00:16:49   happening this year if ever [TS]

00:16:51   and so I really do think it's very clear [TS]

00:16:53   that we all have wishful thinking that [TS]

00:16:56   goes in a different direction but the [TS]

00:16:57   reality is it's most likely that Apple [TS]

00:17:00   really is out of the display business [TS]

00:17:02   and the protest business and the mac [TS]

00:17:05   mini business and is really just going [TS]

00:17:07   to make the imac and macbook pro they're [TS]

00:17:09   only computers going forward [TS]

00:17:11   I've heard that I think I figure if I've [TS]

00:17:13   talked about this i've heard that there [TS]

00:17:15   is a new mac pro in the pipeline but [TS]

00:17:18   that it is it sounds ridiculous but that [TS]

00:17:21   it's effectively like in a slot where [TS]

00:17:24   there's so many other machines whether [TS]

00:17:26   their macs are other things that that [TS]

00:17:27   are getting testing and like validation [TS]

00:17:30   engineering [TS]

00:17:31   no resources ahead of it there's no way [TS]

00:17:34   it's gonna ship by WTC with sequins [TS]

00:17:37   ridiculous but well yeah okay even if [TS]

00:17:40   they I mean here's the thing most most [TS]

00:17:44   people who feel bad about Apple because [TS]

00:17:47   of the lack of mac pro updates at all [TS]

00:17:50   they don't necessarily need to ship at [TS]

00:17:52   WTC I think what would what would come a [TS]

00:17:54   lot of fears my own included would just [TS]

00:17:56   be like an acknowledgement and [TS]

00:17:58   confirmation that something else is [TS]

00:18:00   coming like just confirmation even if [TS]

00:18:02   you want to like one of their like kind [TS]

00:18:04   of BSE replies to the press like you [TS]

00:18:06   know keep an eye out of this based on [TS]

00:18:07   whatever else like something and Tim [TS]

00:18:10   Cook's like little Q&A response to that [TS]

00:18:12   internal Baltimore think of few months [TS]

00:18:14   back that wasn't enough that was [TS]

00:18:15   actually in fact making things worse i [TS]

00:18:17   think my kind of implying that the imac [TS]

00:18:19   was going to be going to get going [TS]

00:18:20   forward I that's all we really want here [TS]

00:18:23   but again i I just I it's what i want to [TS]

00:18:27   be true i want there to be a new mac pro [TS]

00:18:30   of some sort and if it's if it's shaped [TS]

00:18:33   like an imac and it has a built-in 5k [TS]

00:18:35   screen and it just has a xeon processor [TS]

00:18:38   in it with like a thicker back for a [TS]

00:18:39   bigger heatsink that's fine i'll take [TS]

00:18:41   that actually sounds kind of nice to me [TS]

00:18:42   it wouldn't be as ideal standalone [TS]

00:18:44   because then i have the same problem i [TS]

00:18:45   have now and get some attention after [TS]

00:18:47   send the whole thing in but I take it [TS]

00:18:49   it's better than nothing that'd be great [TS]

00:18:50   yeah it leads to a nice matter leads [TS]

00:18:53   with the weird situation that's again [TS]

00:18:55   better than nothing if they made an imac [TS]

00:18:56   pro and put is somehow put his Dion in [TS]

00:18:58   there and solve the heat problems that [TS]

00:19:01   would you know I say that technically [TS]

00:19:03   possible the big guy i think i think [TS]

00:19:07   it's possible although I talking to be [TS]

00:19:09   tipster about this a little bit in our [TS]

00:19:10   chat few weeks ago he pointed out that [TS]

00:19:13   the logic board in the imac faces the [TS]

00:19:15   wrong way to really make that happen [TS]

00:19:18   like I think the cpu faces towards you [TS]

00:19:20   when you're sitting at it and 222 [TS]

00:19:22   drastically improve the heat capacity to [TS]

00:19:25   be able to cool like a high-powered the [TS]

00:19:27   on-chip to make it more Mac Pro Class [TS]

00:19:28   processing power you need to flip the [TS]

00:19:31   whole logic board around we should kind [TS]

00:19:32   of be like a redesign on level of a [TS]

00:19:34   whole new imac generation the question [TS]

00:19:36   is like what Apple really do that for [TS]

00:19:39   this [TS]

00:19:40   you know relatively low volume i mean i [TS]

00:19:43   guess they design all case before but [TS]

00:19:44   like it sure does seem like they [TS]

00:19:46   couldn't possibly care less about [TS]

00:19:49   keeping the mac pro updated in any [TS]

00:19:51   reasonable fashion and so it really it [TS]

00:19:54   is a pretty big question whether they [TS]

00:19:56   would basically redesign the entire imac [TS]

00:19:58   enclosure and a whole new computer just [TS]

00:20:02   for this line that they haven't given [TS]

00:20:03   two craps about 43 years it's a real [TS]

00:20:07   mystery [TS]

00:20:07   I think it's probably the imac prose is [TS]

00:20:10   possible or that they'll sell it as a [TS]

00:20:12   pro somehow i don't know but I i hope i [TS]

00:20:16   wish for to be true but i just don't see [TS]

00:20:18   it right but I there's gotta be a reason [TS]

00:20:21   why they don't just stop selling the mac [TS]

00:20:23   pro's there's some contingent within the [TS]

00:20:25   company that's clearly hoping for new [TS]

00:20:27   mac pro's otherwise that it would be it [TS]

00:20:29   would be easier it would be easier and [TS]

00:20:31   they did look less foolish if they had [TS]

00:20:33   cancelled the mac pro like it lasts WWDC [TS]

00:20:35   if they just said hey these midterms are [TS]

00:20:38   so great it's you know it's all that you [TS]

00:20:40   know the time for the standalone is gone [TS]

00:20:43   whatever it would even people would [TS]

00:20:44   disagree obviously and there'd be people [TS]

00:20:46   who would be heartbroken in there be [TS]

00:20:47   people who are furious but at least [TS]

00:20:49   Apple wouldn't look foolish [TS]

00:20:50   alright like yeah because they really [TS]

00:20:52   looks bad now I get really like the [TS]

00:20:54   situation now is is kind of egregiously [TS]

00:20:57   back [TS]

00:20:58   it's it's kind of a bear thing it's hard [TS]

00:21:00   to believe it's really kind of hard to [TS]

00:21:02   believe how old it is it really is and [TS]

00:21:05   still my biggest regret is that I didn't [TS]

00:21:07   ask Schiller about it on stage last year [TS]

00:21:09   and I had the card I had it I had it on [TS]

00:21:11   a card and I did not something you some [TS]

00:21:14   people understand but I it it's so hard [TS]

00:21:16   to keep that thing going live and it's [TS]

00:21:19   it was my one and only regret from that [TS]

00:21:21   whole show that the year before when [TS]

00:21:23   shoulder was on the first time I had way [TS]

00:21:25   more regrets afterwards and I felt like [TS]

00:21:27   my myself criticism really helped and i [TS]

00:21:30   did a better job last year but my one my [TS]

00:21:32   right my 1r can't believe it and now it [TS]

00:21:36   look at this we're already at the point [TS]

00:21:37   where WWE has been announced again it [TS]

00:21:39   still hasn't been answered [TS]

00:21:41   and like the one reason why i put it at [TS]

00:21:43   a lower priority at first and then [TS]

00:21:45   towards the end when I was wrapping up I [TS]

00:21:47   was like flipping through the cards i [TS]

00:21:49   had left and it just didn't i didn't see [TS]

00:21:52   that one which I'm you know I might have [TS]

00:21:53   is like a last question but the reason I [TS]

00:21:55   originally had it lower in the stack was [TS]

00:21:57   I thought well they gotta do something [TS]

00:21:59   September right [TS]

00:22:00   hey but that like yeah and get them on [TS]

00:22:05   the record now but it's only for the [TS]

00:22:06   next you know two to three months so [TS]

00:22:09   anyway I don't know [TS]

00:22:11   oh and it's you know it's hard like when [TS]

00:22:13   you're in a situation like what you're [TS]

00:22:14   doing with the with these you know [TS]

00:22:15   executive interviews like it's hard you [TS]

00:22:18   know we got a little bit a little bit [TS]

00:22:19   this for me when ATP i interviewed liner [TS]

00:22:22   few weeks ago which was grand like like [TS]

00:22:25   we had a couple people ask us afterwards [TS]

00:22:28   like on Twitter and email and stuff like [TS]

00:22:29   why did you ask him about the map [TS]

00:22:31   oh you can ok that's yeah it's like a it [TS]

00:22:36   even if he knew about macros stuff you [TS]

00:22:39   can you know you're not going to answer [TS]

00:22:40   that and be the guy who writes the [TS]

00:22:43   compiler probably has no clue about what [TS]

00:22:46   the mac pro hardware team is doing and [TS]

00:22:48   what might or might not be released in [TS]

00:22:49   the department like it's a big company [TS]

00:22:51   like the dancerly anyway your contacts [TS]

00:22:54   like interviewing chiller onstage like [TS]

00:22:56   it's tough to know whether you should [TS]

00:22:59   bust out a question like that which is [TS]

00:23:01   slightly antagonizing and really put him [TS]

00:23:04   on the spot it because like there's a [TS]

00:23:08   very good chance that you would just get [TS]

00:23:10   like a non-answer you know just like a [TS]

00:23:12   nice PR friendly non-answer kind of like [TS]

00:23:14   you know kind of tempo stubborn you know [TS]

00:23:16   we really love desktop great desktops [TS]

00:23:17   coming in the future and stuff like that [TS]

00:23:19   and that's that's not very helpful and [TS]

00:23:21   then you just like shifted the tone of [TS]

00:23:23   the interview in a way that now they are [TS]

00:23:26   on edge or yeah that's likely to go to [TS]

00:23:28   you in the future so it's it's a tricky [TS]

00:23:30   balance and so I don't I don't blame you [TS]

00:23:33   front for asking that it wasn't because [TS]

00:23:34   I thought it was known you for not [TS]

00:23:36   asking if this yeah I this year it's [TS]

00:23:37   guys did you ask the first question yes [TS]

00:23:39   well have a watch on the end of the end [TS]

00:23:42   up getting [TS]

00:23:43   you know I don't know somebody has [TS]

00:23:46   nothing to do with mac hardware [TS]

00:23:47   something when i get this latter right [TS]

00:23:51   like all of a sudden shoulder doesn't [TS]

00:23:52   return my calls you know it's there now [TS]

00:23:56   I i would have because there's ways to [TS]

00:23:58   ask and I feel like that's something [TS]

00:23:59   that I you know maybe why I've had [TS]

00:24:02   gotten to this position where I can do [TS]

00:24:04   this is where i can ask the question but [TS]

00:24:05   do it in a way that's not a [TS]

00:24:07   confrontational you know I mean that [TS]

00:24:09   framing I would have used his look this [TS]

00:24:11   audience in particular it is largely [TS]

00:24:15   comprised of people who use xcode which [TS]

00:24:16   is one of the apps where it you know [TS]

00:24:19   extra see every better cpu power can [TS]

00:24:21   really help at times you know and oh [TS]

00:24:23   yeah and you know we're wearing this [TS]

00:24:26   transition moving towards from [TS]

00:24:28   objective-c the Swift and Swift I I [TS]

00:24:31   think it's fair to say is more taxing on [TS]

00:24:32   the comp on the cpu and objective-c it [TS]

00:24:35   seems like the Swift compilers you know [TS]

00:24:37   you can you can write swift code that [TS]

00:24:38   takes a lot longer to compile but [TS]

00:24:40   whatever it certainly is an easy to [TS]

00:24:43   compile and there's a just a general [TS]

00:24:47   sentiment that apples apples priorities [TS]

00:24:50   for pro hardware in general are lower [TS]

00:24:53   than they used to be you know the back [TS]

00:24:56   pro is I don't whatever I want 900 days [TS]

00:24:58   old at this time after an incredibly [TS]

00:25:00   splashy debut you know what the heck is [TS]

00:25:02   going on here [TS]

00:25:03   I don't think that Woods is like making [TS]

00:25:05   you know something i'm putting on the [TS]

00:25:06   spot and it's easy can easily say and [TS]

00:25:10   maybe that's all we would have said is [TS]

00:25:11   hey you know we we love you guys we got [TS]

00:25:13   you but you know I could you know you [TS]

00:25:15   know I can't talk about future stuff I [TS]

00:25:17   didn't say that and then that's the end [TS]

00:25:19   of its you know so it's possible but at [TS]

00:25:23   least I would have asked ya anyway [TS]

00:25:26   there's always there's always future [TS]

00:25:28   executive podcast interviews live at [TS]

00:25:30   everybody I love the liner interview by [TS]

00:25:32   the way I don't hide it was really an [TS]

00:25:34   especially for a show that almost never [TS]

00:25:38   does interviews I mean that you guys [TS]

00:25:40   have never at that there was one a long [TS]

00:25:43   time ago or no I guess you guys swapped [TS]

00:25:45   you guys swapped with another show [TS]

00:25:47   yeah we had John trade spots with [TS]

00:25:48   christina warren right for one episode [TS]

00:25:50   which actually turned out really nice [TS]

00:25:51   but it wasn't really an interview show [TS]

00:25:52   just like she just brings another host [TS]

00:25:54   our show for that episode right [TS]

00:25:56   and I thought that for a show that has [TS]

00:25:58   an established rhythm between the three [TS]

00:26:00   of you in which really none of it is [TS]

00:26:03   really interview style and there's an [TS]

00:26:05   incredible comfort level between your [TS]

00:26:06   personalities to have somebody new on [TS]

00:26:09   and do a three-way interview where each [TS]

00:26:12   all three of you asked good questions [TS]

00:26:13   that was really impressive because it's [TS]

00:26:16   hard to do because it was a really [TS]

00:26:17   different show [TS]

00:26:18   yeah that's like office instead of [TS]

00:26:21   driving a car you're here riding [TS]

00:26:22   bicycles or something but yeah it was a [TS]

00:26:26   lot of fun and Chris was he made it easy [TS]

00:26:29   on us like he wasn't like a prima donna [TS]

00:26:31   about anything and you know just really [TS]

00:26:32   easy to work with and no super nice guy [TS]

00:26:34   that was a lot of fun that is [TS]

00:26:36   it's you know it it's you know it's [TS]

00:26:39   obviously not true from top to bottom [TS]

00:26:40   but it is generally true that Apple [TS]

00:26:42   tends to attract very nice people there [TS]

00:26:45   are [TS]

00:26:46   yeah you know I mean federer is a great [TS]

00:26:49   example where you know I don't know what [TS]

00:26:51   he's like in real personal life but you [TS]

00:26:53   know like backstage and stuff like that [TS]

00:26:54   and when you see him at WTC and and [TS]

00:26:57   people come up and and you know just [TS]

00:26:59   random attendees are like hey can I get [TS]

00:27:01   a selfie or whatever he stops and talks [TS]

00:27:02   for you know five minutes with them and [TS]

00:27:04   asks what they're doing heat he comes [TS]

00:27:06   across like talking to a group of five [TS]

00:27:09   you know first time at WWDC at WWDC [TS]

00:27:13   attendees wearing the WWDC jacket he [TS]

00:27:16   comes across exactly the same demeanor [TS]

00:27:17   that he has on stage so like that [TS]

00:27:19   affection that people seem to have for [TS]

00:27:21   him it's true that seems to be his [TS]

00:27:23   personality and Latin is exactly that [TS]

00:27:25   type of personalities is you know just [TS]

00:27:27   just a nice guy [TS]

00:27:29   yeah whatever they tell you about last [TS]

00:27:31   year WC when i visited apples and [TS]

00:27:34   Facebook's campuses in the same day yeah [TS]

00:27:37   it's all sort of blurs together i [TS]

00:27:39   remember you doing it but I don't [TS]

00:27:41   remember what the details really [TS]

00:27:42   interesting like so you know you and in [TS]

00:27:44   in both cases like what you know the [TS]

00:27:46   mean and Casey a couple of their friends [TS]

00:27:48   we just had like but we had like a [TS]

00:27:50   French company that wanted like just you [TS]

00:27:52   know give us like quick tour let us and [TS]

00:27:54   that was around stopped at an apple [TS]

00:27:56   I only saw like you know the the you [TS]

00:27:58   know center courtyard and the and caffe [TS]

00:28:00   macs because you know you can't bring [TS]

00:28:02   people into the building's really Becker [TS]

00:28:03   from yeah exactly so I didn't see I [TS]

00:28:07   didn't see any actual offices but I i [TS]

00:28:09   was able to see like the courtyard and [TS]

00:28:11   hang out and have lunch everybody there [TS]

00:28:12   and and we had lunch with something like [TS]

00:28:14   15 people this giant table and so I got [TS]

00:28:16   to meet a lot of people there and hang [TS]

00:28:19   out for a game at a time and they're [TS]

00:28:20   pretty coffee and apple even affymax [TS]

00:28:22   gotta say and and you know kind of get a [TS]

00:28:24   feel for the vibe of the campus even I [TS]

00:28:27   didn't see any offices and then like [TS]

00:28:29   couple hours later we went to facebook [TS]

00:28:30   and I'd never been to either of these [TS]

00:28:33   campuses before i had been to the apple [TS]

00:28:35   retail store but I've never gone like [TS]

00:28:37   through the doors into the courtyard and [TS]

00:28:40   I'm actually not sure I was allowed to [TS]

00:28:41   they have some kind of weird rules about [TS]

00:28:43   bloggers but i think im just under like [TS]

00:28:46   I'm I'm not really officially apple [TS]

00:28:48   press any capacity i never have been and [TS]

00:28:50   so I think that's why it wasn't a [TS]

00:28:52   problem that i was there like I had a [TS]

00:28:54   friend who tried to go who was apple [TS]

00:28:56   press and was not allowed in the house [TS]

00:29:00   was interesting but anyway so seeing [TS]

00:29:04   apple and then seeing Facebook could not [TS]

00:29:07   have been to more different company [TS]

00:29:11   culture and environments at least [TS]

00:29:13   visibly from these brief as I did and [TS]

00:29:15   facebook i just felt horrible [TS]

00:29:20   the whole time I was there like I felt [TS]

00:29:21   kind of creeped out and intimidated by [TS]

00:29:24   just how bizarre and kind of intense [TS]

00:29:28   high energy but not high positive energy [TS]

00:29:31   it seemed to be like just really like I [TS]

00:29:35   don't know it's hard to explain i I [TS]

00:29:37   really did I really got a very bad [TS]

00:29:38   feeling from facebook a combination of [TS]

00:29:40   like how does anybody get any work done [TS]

00:29:42   here and where are the adults and [TS]

00:29:47   and it just didn't feel good it felt [TS]

00:29:48   like a dysfunctional workaholic culture [TS]

00:29:51   that was hard to get any real work done [TS]

00:29:52   in an environment that's kind of weirdly [TS]

00:29:54   like we like trapped in youth forever [TS]

00:29:58   bizarre bizarro college fantasy world [TS]

00:30:00   and then Apple was so like calm and [TS]

00:30:05   adult and just like nicely like low-key [TS]

00:30:08   the people there were just like nice and [TS]

00:30:11   comedy it kind of felt like oh this is [TS]

00:30:13   where the adults work like this this is [TS]

00:30:15   like where people come to actually do [TS]

00:30:17   serious work and it was a much it just [TS]

00:30:21   whatever the environment actually is I'm [TS]

00:30:23   you know again because I've never worked [TS]

00:30:25   at these companies and didn't even go [TS]

00:30:26   inside the office at Apple it's hard for [TS]

00:30:28   me to really say this but it just felt [TS]

00:30:30   like the little tiny windows into these [TS]

00:30:34   cultures I saw really just seemed like [TS]

00:30:37   Apple was the place where like the nice [TS]

00:30:40   mature adults go to work I i could see [TS]

00:30:43   that I I don't know if you'd get it [TS]

00:30:46   definitely seems like people who go to [TS]

00:30:48   apple and I mean it's you know company [TS]

00:30:50   cultures attract like-minded people you [TS]

00:30:52   know but it does seem to me like in [TS]

00:30:54   general like when I've been there people [TS]

00:30:57   know how to turn it off and you know [TS]

00:30:58   that when you're going to lunch and are [TS]

00:31:00   going to have lunch with a friend there [TS]

00:31:01   their they're just having lunch with a [TS]

00:31:03   friend you know right yeah get back up [TS]

00:31:06   to speed when they get back to work or [TS]

00:31:07   whatever and that's all you want thing [TS]

00:31:09   like I I don't hear a lot of stories [TS]

00:31:11   about Facebook and Apple stealing talent [TS]

00:31:14   from each other and maybe because i [TS]

00:31:15   don't really pay attention but I tell [TS]

00:31:17   you one thing seems like both those [TS]

00:31:18   places i can't imagine that anybody who [TS]

00:31:21   works for one would want to work for the [TS]

00:31:22   other in either direction like I don't [TS]

00:31:26   think they're competing for the same [TS]

00:31:27   people at all [TS]

00:31:28   yeah I thought I've never really heard [TS]

00:31:29   that either I mean obviously at a [TS]

00:31:31   certain level there's probably some like [TS]

00:31:33   maybe it like a sysadmin or something [TS]

00:31:36   like that but and you know what there [TS]

00:31:38   was that one team at Facebook that was [TS]

00:31:39   largely poached from apple but now [TS]

00:31:41   they're all dispersed right they're gone [TS]

00:31:42   the mic designer the EAA bought a bunch [TS]

00:31:45   of designer for a while and then I [TS]

00:31:46   slowly eroded their sanity until they [TS]

00:31:48   all quit right and they built a very [TS]

00:31:50   apple-like beautiful system and custom [TS]

00:31:53   tools to support it with facebook paper [TS]

00:31:55   right [TS]

00:31:56   the weather was just paper facebook [TS]

00:31:58   paperwork [TS]

00:31:59   what are the names they stole it I fine [TS]

00:32:01   well but you know I mean that it's if it [TS]

00:32:06   fits [TS]

00:32:06   that's a tough call because the paper [TS]

00:32:08   app was the other paper at the one that [TS]

00:32:09   you drawn was their first but it is it's [TS]

00:32:11   the risk you take when you [TS]

00:32:13   yeah regular and a plain words your apt [TS]

00:32:16   name you know it seemed like for a while [TS]

00:32:18   they're like Facebook was just gobbling [TS]

00:32:20   up as much design talent is there food [TS]

00:32:22   at about the same time that Google was [TS]

00:32:24   gobbling up as much email town as they [TS]

00:32:26   could and it seems like both of those of [TS]

00:32:28   your kind of fizzled and faded over the [TS]

00:32:29   last year so I haven't heard anything [TS]

00:32:31   about them recently i think in broad [TS]

00:32:33   terms what happened was that there was a [TS]

00:32:35   period where Zuckerberg I think it [TS]

00:32:37   coincides with because you know if [TS]

00:32:41   there's one thing i don't i don't get [TS]

00:32:42   facebook I've never signed up for it and [TS]

00:32:45   so i'm not i get it does feel foreign to [TS]

00:32:48   me feel like studying a foreign country [TS]

00:32:50   but from my observations it is clear it [TS]

00:32:54   did I don't think too many questions [TS]

00:32:55   that Zuckerberg has a tremendous gift [TS]

00:32:57   for changing his mind [TS]

00:33:00   people often said that about Steve Jobs [TS]

00:33:02   Tim Cook is often money talks about [TS]

00:33:05   working with steve jobs like usually [TS]

00:33:07   just talks about him on a personal level [TS]

00:33:09   but if you can get i'm talking about [TS]

00:33:10   working his you know tim cook it tells [TS]

00:33:13   stories about is absolutely amazing [TS]

00:33:14   ability to change his mind and but the [TS]

00:33:16   you know the Steve Jobs style is that [TS]

00:33:18   when he comes in with his mind change [TS]

00:33:19   the axis who is this is opinion online [TS]

00:33:22   and I think Bill Gates had some of that [TS]

00:33:25   too right like what Bill Gates famously [TS]

00:33:27   that like Microsoft was building this [TS]

00:33:29   early nineties strategy to sort of do [TS]

00:33:32   their own custom stuff for connecting [TS]

00:33:34   computers to each other and then all of [TS]

00:33:36   a sudden you know gates writes like a [TS]

00:33:38   10-page manifester that we've got to get [TS]

00:33:39   on this internet thing and all of a [TS]

00:33:41   sudden you know I mean how long did it [TS]

00:33:44   take for for explorer2 to decimate [TS]

00:33:47   netscape didn't take long [TS]

00:33:49   yeah but at the same time to make it [TS]

00:33:50   active desktop so i don't think i was [TS]

00:33:53   never noticed I'm not saying that was [TS]

00:33:54   seamlessly executed I'm just saying he [TS]

00:33:56   did change his mind you know [TS]

00:33:58   yeah it it's you know the and the broad [TS]

00:34:00   strokes facebook was a website it was a [TS]

00:34:04   website you went to he did all these [TS]

00:34:05   things and the iphone came out [TS]

00:34:08   and an awful lot of products that were [TS]

00:34:10   popular websites in 2007 in the iPhone [TS]

00:34:15   era just were nowhere did weren't [TS]

00:34:19   getting the engagement that things that [TS]

00:34:20   could be done as a native app got and oh [TS]

00:34:23   yeah i mean not to go too far off into [TS]

00:34:26   the weeds but one reason is that an [TS]

00:34:28   awful lot of web sites were built I [TS]

00:34:30   don't think this is true anymore because [TS]

00:34:32   mobile is don't think anybody overlooks [TS]

00:34:33   it but that the back end of the website [TS]

00:34:35   was inextricably tied to the front end [TS]

00:34:38   of the website and instead of having [TS]

00:34:39   everything go through nice API is even [TS]

00:34:42   the front end of the website so that you [TS]

00:34:44   could make clients for other devices [TS]

00:34:47   like a native mac client or and and [TS]

00:34:51   people say i forgot i only native mac or [TS]

00:34:53   windows client will just go through the [TS]

00:34:54   web browser and for a lot of things for [TS]

00:34:56   a lot of years that was fine but then [TS]

00:34:58   with the phone that wasn't good enough [TS]

00:34:59   and facebook had an app that was largely [TS]

00:35:01   just front end for HTML and JavaScript [TS]

00:35:05   and then they seem to get it and it's [TS]

00:35:07   uniform Zuckerberg on down that no we [TS]

00:35:09   should do this is with as much negative [TS]

00:35:11   stuff as we can we should this app is [TS]

00:35:12   important [TS]

00:35:13   this is more important than our website [TS]

00:35:14   and that's around when he hired all [TS]

00:35:17   those designers and I think there's sort [TS]

00:35:19   of a I think there was sort of a look [TS]

00:35:21   Apple's you know apples the company to [TS]

00:35:22   look at they they value a + design [TS]

00:35:26   talent maybe we should too [TS]

00:35:28   and then I think in the intervening [TS]

00:35:29   years the facebook realized that that [TS]

00:35:32   wasn't really that important to them [TS]

00:35:33   that the native part was ya design and [TS]

00:35:36   caliber wasn't or rather I think it's it [TS]

00:35:40   seemed like there was a lot of trouble [TS]

00:35:42   like they were able to get the talent [TS]

00:35:44   but just you know by applying sheer [TS]

00:35:46   force of will and lots of money they [TS]

00:35:48   want to get the town but then the [TS]

00:35:49   question is what do you have all these [TS]

00:35:51   great all these incredibly talented [TS]

00:35:52   people do at Facebook and that was it [TS]

00:35:56   seemed like they had a hard time having [TS]

00:35:58   a good answer to that question and [TS]

00:35:59   maintaining that over time but you know [TS]

00:36:02   now it's hard to keep good people [TS]

00:36:03   interested in working for a giant [TS]

00:36:06   established product you know the Apple [TS]

00:36:08   has this problem to its really like once [TS]

00:36:10   you have something that's big and [TS]

00:36:12   successful and boring like Facebook or [TS]

00:36:13   the iphone it's hard to get people [TS]

00:36:15   interested in working on that who the [TS]

00:36:18   same kind of people who would make [TS]

00:36:19   something like that because they want to [TS]

00:36:20   go make something else now [TS]

00:36:21   I know Mike Maddux a little bit but I [TS]

00:36:24   haven't spoken to him much since he left [TS]

00:36:28   facebook so I you know and I'm just sort [TS]

00:36:30   of speculating here but i know from a [TS]

00:36:31   couple of people on the team that they [TS]

00:36:33   were used to being the a-team at the [TS]

00:36:35   company you know like Maddox was what I [TS]

00:36:38   think I know he designed a whole bunch [TS]

00:36:40   of stuff in the original iphone but like [TS]

00:36:41   I think he literally did like the actual [TS]

00:36:43   pixels for the slide to unlock you know [TS]

00:36:46   like that's you know that that's that's [TS]

00:36:49   and if you're like the person who [TS]

00:36:51   designs both the visuals and the [TS]

00:36:53   interaction for a thing doing slide to [TS]

00:36:55   unlock is pretty pretty big because I [TS]

00:36:57   mean I remember Steve Jobs actually [TS]

00:36:58   demoed it like three times he was like [TS]

00:37:00   that's what I'm going to do it again he [TS]

00:37:01   like lock the phone and did it yeah so [TS]

00:37:04   like that when you designing the feature [TS]

00:37:07   that Steve Jobs decides I'm just going [TS]

00:37:09   to do this three or four times on stage [TS]

00:37:11   because it's that I just love it so much [TS]

00:37:12   and then to go to at Facebook and you're [TS]

00:37:16   not designing you're not designing the [TS]

00:37:17   app that's in front of a billion users [TS]

00:37:19   you're designing the app that's in front [TS]

00:37:21   of like one-tenth of 1% of the users who [TS]

00:37:24   care more about how things look than the [TS]

00:37:27   the regular facebook experience and I [TS]

00:37:30   just think it's hard to get excited [TS]

00:37:31   about that [TS]

00:37:32   yeah I'll take a break let's take a [TS]

00:37:36   break and thank our first sponsor good [TS]

00:37:38   friends at audible you guys no audible [TS]

00:37:40   articles where you go to get just about [TS]

00:37:44   anything and everything [TS]

00:37:45   audio related i used to think it was a [TS]

00:37:48   place to go to get audio books and it's [TS]

00:37:50   true they have more audio books then [TS]

00:37:52   anybody but they have so much more than [TS]

00:37:57   audiobooks now you go there you sign up [TS]

00:37:58   for an account and you can get all sorts [TS]

00:38:00   of stuff they have news daily news shows [TS]

00:38:03   they have comedy shows all of this stuff [TS]

00:38:05   and a lot of this stuff is original to [TS]

00:38:07   audible if you want to listen to it [TS]

00:38:09   audible has it [TS]

00:38:10   listen to audiobooks from virtually [TS]

00:38:12   every genre anytime anywhere [TS]

00:38:14   they have a great listen guarantee so if [TS]

00:38:17   you get an audio book and start [TS]

00:38:18   listening to it and it's like putting [TS]

00:38:20   you to sleep you could just like get [TS]

00:38:22   back to know you get get like a [TS]

00:38:23   different book like that's how confident [TS]

00:38:25   they are you just you're not going to [TS]

00:38:28   get bored you're just going to fill up [TS]

00:38:29   your every minute where you need to [TS]

00:38:31   listen to something to not be bored you [TS]

00:38:33   can fill it up with stuff from [TS]

00:38:34   audible and I've always said i think [TS]

00:38:35   this is one of the greatest advertising [TS]

00:38:39   opportunities ever why do they sponsor [TS]

00:38:41   podcast because they know that everybody [TS]

00:38:43   who's listening to me tell you about [TS]

00:38:44   audible is somebody who listens to [TS]

00:38:46   spoken word content by definition so if [TS]

00:38:50   you're listening to this and you feel [TS]

00:38:51   like you've got gaps in your your your [TS]

00:38:54   life where you need more podcasts or [TS]

00:38:56   things like podcast go to audible sign [TS]

00:38:58   up go to audible.com / talk show know [TS]

00:39:02   that just talk show and no no you came [TS]

00:39:04   here and you get a 3 30 day trial 30 [TS]

00:39:07   days we can just listen to whatever you [TS]

00:39:08   want [TS]

00:39:09   audible.com / talk show i think i wrote [TS]

00:39:14   that script and maybe I was telling i [TS]

00:39:23   forget i was talking to did I forgot it [TS]

00:39:25   was on air or not but bill simmons i [TS]

00:39:28   I've been listening to him over to [TS]

00:39:30   football season I was listening he [TS]

00:39:31   doesn't sports thing it doesn't think [TS]

00:39:32   all the ringer [TS]

00:39:33   thank you very popular you probably see [TS]

00:39:37   it's probably pretty high up in overcast [TS]

00:39:39   i'll be interesting to see if it was [TS]

00:39:40   actually all that high up in overcast [TS]

00:39:41   because maybe overcast excuse towards [TS]

00:39:44   non-sports stuff maybe like sports stuff [TS]

00:39:47   is a little bit more [TS]

00:39:49   I don't know maybe in our simulated it [TS]

00:39:50   does go into it does pretty well and [TS]

00:39:52   overcast it is not as high as text shows [TS]

00:39:54   and like they're really popular you know [TS]

00:39:55   npr-style storytelling shows like this [TS]

00:39:58   american life though I think it's ben [TS]

00:39:59   thompson who were talking about it [TS]

00:40:00   forget it was on the show off but the [TS]

00:40:02   gist of it is that when on Bill Simmons [TS]

00:40:04   first started doing sponsors reads on [TS]

00:40:06   his show he was awful at it as was i [TS]

00:40:08   like when I first split off and started [TS]

00:40:12   doing this show on my own just brutal [TS]

00:40:14   I mean like maybe the show's over who [TS]

00:40:16   maybe they were ok but the the sponsor [TS]

00:40:18   breeds were just brutal [TS]

00:40:19   you just don't know why it's hard it's [TS]

00:40:21   hard thing to do you get the hang of it [TS]

00:40:22   eventually took you eight maybe a couple [TS]

00:40:24   months ago you're pretty good [TS]

00:40:25   yeah but it's but Simmons is doing [TS]

00:40:27   Simmons is actually taking it to a new [TS]

00:40:28   level he was i think i would venture to [TS]

00:40:30   say he was worse than me at the [TS]

00:40:32   beginning and now he's better than [TS]

00:40:33   anybody i've i've ever seen [TS]

00:40:36   he's he's like in howard stern territory [TS]

00:40:39   of being able to do it because sometimes [TS]

00:40:41   when i was in the stern anymore almost [TS]

00:40:43   seems like Western does one that where [TS]

00:40:44   he does the reed he's he's phoning it's [TS]

00:40:46   you could tell his phone in it [TS]

00:40:47   whereas Simmons does it and he's got a [TS]

00:40:50   real tight script and it seems like he's [TS]

00:40:52   trying to literally stick it to 30 [TS]

00:40:54   seconds get in and out and he really [TS]

00:40:57   starts talking faster and it just [TS]

00:41:00   alleviate it does just like completely [TS]

00:41:02   eliminate any urge I have to skip it [TS]

00:41:05   I tend not to sting I tend not to skip [TS]

00:41:08   ahead on sponsor reads on podcast simply [TS]

00:41:10   because I you know I know some people do [TS]

00:41:14   and if you do you know that that's why [TS]

00:41:15   the features there it's okay to my job [TS]

00:41:17   to try to make it as interesting we've [TS]

00:41:19   you and I have talked about this before [TS]

00:41:19   it's my job to try to make it so [TS]

00:41:21   interesting that you don't want to skip [TS]

00:41:22   but when i listen to podcast i tend not [TS]

00:41:24   to skip because i want to listen I'm [TS]

00:41:26   curious edit at a professional level how [TS]

00:41:29   is this person going to keep me [TS]

00:41:30   interested [TS]

00:41:31   yeah I often will listen to other people [TS]

00:41:34   who are doing research for the same [TS]

00:41:35   sponsors that i have just to keep me [TS]

00:41:37   here like how are you doing this read [TS]

00:41:38   and then like maybe maybe something I [TS]

00:41:41   can learn do better in my reach for the [TS]

00:41:42   same people from the way you're doing is [TS]

00:41:44   read yeah so what else we got a lot to [TS]

00:41:48   talk about we gotta hurry up we're [TS]

00:41:51   really good at that is so we got to have [TS]

00:41:53   at WWDC moving its the school I mean I [TS]

00:41:57   don't know anyone san jose so it's [TS]

00:41:58   really talked a little bit about that I [TS]

00:42:00   I was so completely surprised by this I [TS]

00:42:02   I really is this just wasn't even on my [TS]

00:42:05   radar but I kind of ever you know what [TS]

00:42:07   happened it was an initial shock and I [TS]

00:42:09   thought oh shit when we gonna do about [TS]

00:42:10   my live show you know of course my [TS]

00:42:13   thoughts turned myself immediately but [TS]

00:42:16   everyone else did you ever else is like [TS]

00:42:19   oh how can I fly there is our hotels [TS]

00:42:21   expensive everyone's thinking the same [TS]

00:42:22   general stuff you know that most people [TS]

00:42:25   aren't thinking where can i push my life [TS]

00:42:26   podcast but it just never occurred to me [TS]

00:42:28   that they would do this though like it [TS]

00:42:31   it s the rough thinking was and we've [TS]

00:42:34   all had this you know people who go [TS]

00:42:36   regularly that [TS]

00:42:37   san Francisco's not great the in [TS]

00:42:40   particular I mean our parts of San [TS]

00:42:42   Francisco that are absolutely gorgeous [TS]

00:42:43   but South of Market where moscone is [TS]

00:42:46   it's not great I don't hate it some [TS]

00:42:48   people really hated some people you know [TS]

00:42:50   it is what it is but it is sort of the [TS]

00:42:52   touristy hoteli and maybe towards these [TS]

00:42:58   wrong but it'sit's kind of the worst of [TS]

00:43:00   San Francisco stick that the [TS]

00:43:01   but the area that we see when we go to [TS]

00:43:03   everybody see is that is a terrible [TS]

00:43:06   image of the city as a whole [TS]

00:43:08   now and then it's not too far from union [TS]

00:43:10   square though in union square is nicer [TS]

00:43:12   but union square is just high end retail [TS]

00:43:14   it's not you know i mean like what you [TS]

00:43:17   supposed to do go shopping for jewelry [TS]

00:43:18   and stuff like that in its it's ok but [TS]

00:43:22   it is what it is but the fact is that [TS]

00:43:25   Apple we know we table what could they [TS]

00:43:27   do different well there's no other [TS]

00:43:28   facility with 5,000 people and then we [TS]

00:43:31   you know we would just say well used to [TS]

00:43:33   be in san jose but they moved out of san [TS]

00:43:34   jose for a reason and there's nothing [TS]

00:43:37   else and they're not going to go further [TS]

00:43:38   away because it's already a major stress [TS]

00:43:41   on Apple to get a thousand engineers you [TS]

00:43:44   know from the south bay area to san [TS]

00:43:46   francisco for labs and to just hang out [TS]

00:43:47   and do stuff and still get work done and [TS]

00:43:51   I for one had just completely but [TS]

00:43:55   overlooked to the well they could move [TS]

00:43:58   back to San Jose angle for years it just [TS]

00:44:00   never really i never even really gave it [TS]

00:44:02   serious thought but then once they set [TS]

00:44:03   of gary is what we're doing [TS]

00:44:05   I could totally see the logic of it and [TS]

00:44:07   it seems like a very apple-like move [TS]

00:44:09   I mean really it makes a ton of sense [TS]

00:44:11   logistically to me not only as a closer [TS]

00:44:12   to them but like San Francisco is a [TS]

00:44:15   dense competitive very expensive city [TS]

00:44:19   there's a reason why you don't see a lot [TS]

00:44:22   of tech conferences in manhattan right [TS]

00:44:24   it's because if you put on a tech [TS]

00:44:26   conference in manhattan the space that [TS]

00:44:29   you hold it in is going to be [TS]

00:44:30   extraordinarily expensive all the [TS]

00:44:33   logistics getting the food and they're [TS]

00:44:34   getting it love all the equipment that's [TS]

00:44:36   all going to be shortened expensive and [TS]

00:44:38   then for the attendees they're going to [TS]

00:44:40   have to pay ridiculous hotel prices [TS]

00:44:42   because they're going to this major city [TS]

00:44:45   that is itself a massive tourist [TS]

00:44:47   destination and so it's very unappealing [TS]

00:44:50   to hold a major conference in new york [TS]

00:44:53   city unless it really needs to be [TS]

00:44:55   specifically in new york city for some [TS]

00:44:57   reason [TS]

00:44:58   yeah so everybody see could be anywhere [TS]

00:45:00   like for the attend as far as far as the [TS]

00:45:02   attendees are concerned it doesn't [TS]

00:45:03   matter where it is you're going to see [TS]

00:45:05   talks and labs and stuff and that could [TS]

00:45:08   be in any conference center any city in [TS]

00:45:10   America it doesn't have to eat you don't [TS]

00:45:12   have to be paying [TS]

00:45:13   the extreme premium and dealing with all [TS]

00:45:16   the all the logistical challenges and [TS]

00:45:18   downsides of being in a massive tourist [TS]

00:45:21   expensive dense City yeah just to go [TS]

00:45:24   watch some some talks and go to laugh [TS]

00:45:26   and either you already have friends and [TS]

00:45:28   colleagues who you will also be there [TS]

00:45:31   and you'll see right and it doesn't [TS]

00:45:33   matter where you are or even if you [TS]

00:45:34   don't even if you're like a first-timer [TS]

00:45:35   if you're you're new you're going to be [TS]

00:45:38   surrounded by like-minded individuals [TS]

00:45:39   and it's not hard to make friends or [TS]

00:45:43   even even just temporary friends while [TS]

00:45:45   while sitting at a bar or something like [TS]

00:45:46   that you're very you know because [TS]

00:45:48   they're talking about Xcode and all of a [TS]

00:45:50   sudden you know you're not bored right i [TS]

00:45:52   mean like if anything the city's kind of [TS]

00:45:54   wasted on you because if you're if [TS]

00:45:56   you're attending the conference you [TS]

00:45:58   don't really have time to go out and [TS]

00:46:00   explore much of the city like you for [TS]

00:46:02   the most part you're getting your waking [TS]

00:46:03   up you're trying to get to the 9am [TS]

00:46:04   session in the morning you're you're in [TS]

00:46:06   sessions and stuff all day you might [TS]

00:46:08   have a little hour for lunch but you [TS]

00:46:09   can't go that far [TS]

00:46:10   and then you back and then like five [TS]

00:46:12   o'clock rolls around you want to like go [TS]

00:46:14   to the hotel bar with your friends have [TS]

00:46:15   a couple of drinks and like that's that [TS]

00:46:17   you know we go to dinner and that's the [TS]

00:46:18   night like you can do that anywhere [TS]

00:46:20   you're not seeing the whole city again [TS]

00:46:22   it doesn't really make sense i mean like [TS]

00:46:24   like one of my favorite conference [TS]

00:46:26   venues I've ever been to is is where all [TS]

00:46:29   has been held the last couple years in [TS]

00:46:31   Killarney Ireland in this hotel called [TS]

00:46:33   the europe and it's like it's this very [TS]

00:46:36   very remote location and the hotel [TS]

00:46:39   itself you been you know that have you [TS]

00:46:41   been there actually I don't think so i [TS]

00:46:42   don't because you missed the yeah anyway [TS]

00:46:45   it's awesome contemporary know they've [TS]

00:46:49   been at the same 1i was at one was at a [TS]

00:46:51   remote location but i think i think [TS]

00:46:52   they've switched to a different remote [TS]

00:46:54   location the I this this is I i believe [TS]

00:46:57   this is the third one they're about to [TS]

00:46:58   do next month I'm going i recommend it [TS]

00:47:01   anyway so it's you know it's just like [TS]

00:47:04   this one giant hotel venue kind of the [TS]

00:47:07   middle of nowhere it's beautiful but [TS]

00:47:09   like you're all kind of self and close [TS]

00:47:10   they're either either is I mean there is [TS]

00:47:12   a nearby city of Killarney but like you [TS]

00:47:15   don't really because you totally have to [TS]

00:47:16   go there like you're all on premises and [TS]

00:47:19   you're surrounded by all the people that [TS]

00:47:21   are there for your event and so you know [TS]

00:47:24   there is there is no time to go out and [TS]

00:47:26   enjoy [TS]

00:47:27   other city like that's what you're there [TS]

00:47:28   for you're there you're there to hang [TS]

00:47:30   out with those people and see those [TS]

00:47:31   talks and do those events so to have a [TS]

00:47:33   conference in a massive see that you're [TS]

00:47:35   paying a big premium to be in doesn't [TS]

00:47:38   actually make a lot of sense [TS]

00:47:40   I love Ireland I remembered with the [TS]

00:47:42   last time i was there are and there was [TS]

00:47:45   a band member and their lead singer you [TS]

00:47:47   there this year and there's a lead [TS]

00:47:49   singer named patty PA di I've never been [TS]

00:47:51   there but it on on the same time that [TS]

00:47:53   you were there i don't think so either [TS]

00:47:55   so patty was there and he was the lead [TS]

00:47:57   singer of this band and he had nothing [TS]

00:47:58   interesting and I had no connection to [TS]

00:48:00   like Apple related stuff but he came up [TS]

00:48:04   to the pub in you know in the you know [TS]

00:48:06   without leaving the building is sort of [TS]

00:48:08   like a compound he came up and was going [TS]

00:48:11   to have a drink or two and he just you [TS]

00:48:12   know he's gregarious you know showbiz [TS]

00:48:15   performer but you know but very nice and [TS]

00:48:17   it quickly struck up conversations with [TS]

00:48:19   all sorts of people and he was having a [TS]

00:48:21   good time and and and never laughed and [TS]

00:48:25   then it like midnight that they were [TS]

00:48:26   doing last call and everybody's like I'm [TS]

00:48:29   and we're going to do everybody want to [TS]

00:48:30   stay up a little bit later and Patty [TS]

00:48:32   went up to the bartender and just hit it [TS]

00:48:35   off you know wasn't like whisper in his [TS]

00:48:37   ear but he just like spend about two [TS]

00:48:38   minutes talking to him and the next [TS]

00:48:39   thing you know the bartenders like [TS]

00:48:41   slapping on the back and the bartender [TS]

00:48:42   says I will stay open 24 hours [TS]

00:48:44   that's awesome I've never heard of [TS]

00:48:47   anything like that in my life like where [TS]

00:48:49   the staff of the place i can he got you [TS]

00:48:51   know it like called / you know he didn't [TS]

00:48:52   like make it unilaterally called of [TS]

00:48:54   another bartender was just like it was [TS]

00:48:55   you know these guys want to keep going [TS]

00:48:57   to do you know how about we do two more [TS]

00:48:58   hours but a good conference [TS]

00:49:03   why do you think WBC moved from san [TS]

00:49:06   josé de San Francisco when I did I [TS]

00:49:08   think it was 2003 or 2000 for me i don't [TS]

00:49:11   i was before my time III think some of [TS]

00:49:13   the other things I've heard [TS]

00:49:15   I think Jason had had was talking about [TS]

00:49:17   an upgrade about how like you know back [TS]

00:49:20   then Apple really wanted to be like in [TS]

00:49:23   more the media spotlight with this stuff [TS]

00:49:25   that you know it's more prestigious to [TS]

00:49:27   go there it's like you know really only [TS]

00:49:28   like yeah we're big were awesome kind of [TS]

00:49:30   attracts more media attention being [TS]

00:49:31   there but now the attention comes to [TS]

00:49:33   them they don't they don't need to do [TS]

00:49:34   that as much yeah I think that's exactly [TS]

00:49:36   it was Steve Jobs i think steve jobs you [TS]

00:49:39   know Apple was firing [TS]

00:49:40   on all cylinders the ipod was slowly [TS]

00:49:44   turning into a massive hit the retail [TS]

00:49:46   stores were slowly turning into a [TS]

00:49:49   success story they were it was that you [TS]

00:49:54   know the lat famously I know that I [TS]

00:49:56   think Jason and and mikey went over this [TS]

00:49:58   that and the last one at San Jose was [TS]

00:50:00   the one where they had a funeral for mac [TS]

00:50:02   OS 9 which was actually kind of force [TS]

00:50:07   like the reason they had its kind of you [TS]

00:50:09   think that's kind of you think that's a [TS]

00:50:10   weird thing to do is have a funeral on [TS]

00:50:12   stage for your product but it was [TS]

00:50:14   actually because it wasn't dead it was [TS]

00:50:16   because so many people were still using [TS]

00:50:18   mac OS 9 but it was at the point where [TS]

00:50:21   they felt like they were in the clear it [TS]

00:50:24   was three or four years into the guests [TS]

00:50:26   at least three years into the mac OS 10 [TS]

00:50:27   the hero but they were at the point [TS]

00:50:29   where I think they could see the light [TS]

00:50:30   at the end of the tunnel that yes what [TS]

00:50:32   we're going to make this transition all [TS]

00:50:35   max will be running Mac os10 you know [TS]

00:50:38   this isn't going to sink us the first [TS]

00:50:39   two years of mac OS 10 was kind of iffy [TS]

00:50:42   really in terms of how big the uptake [TS]

00:50:44   was so I think that after that one you [TS]

00:50:46   know the mac was clearly had a bright [TS]

00:50:48   future the ipod was great [TS]

00:50:50   retail is great i think steve jobs [TS]

00:50:51   wanted a bigger spotlight and i think [TS]

00:50:55   doing it already having like a hopeful [TS]

00:50:57   funeral like we really hope this is it [TS]

00:50:59   guys please [TS]

00:51:01   mature mature begging you please make [TS]

00:51:03   this dead i remember that and it was [TS]

00:51:05   before my time attending WWE sees but i [TS]

00:51:07   still had 22 max at my desk i had a good [TS]

00:51:11   i have added power mac 9600 that was [TS]

00:51:15   still running mac OS 9 as my main [TS]

00:51:17   machine and then I had a an ibook [TS]

00:51:20   running OS 10 I'll see now I have one [TS]

00:51:22   with the keyboard i can use and one with [TS]

00:51:24   another one [TS]

00:51:24   well so is what I think I think they [TS]

00:51:27   moved to San Francisco for the publicity [TS]

00:51:29   I think that's exactly right that they [TS]

00:51:31   wanted more attention they felt like [TS]

00:51:33   they need you know they could use it [TS]

00:51:35   they had stuff to say that stuff to [TS]

00:51:37   deserve more attention and now they [TS]

00:51:38   don't and I don't think San Francisco [TS]

00:51:40   was ever a good fit for Apple culturally [TS]

00:51:42   they're not a san francisco city [TS]

00:51:46   yeah they're they're really they have a [TS]

00:51:48   very different vibe about them than what [TS]

00:51:51   I mean again I've never ever worked for [TS]

00:51:53   apple and I live in San Francisco so [TS]

00:51:55   it's hard for me to say this but just my [TS]

00:51:56   my my kind of bird's eye view of it does [TS]

00:51:59   seem like they didn't really fit in [TS]

00:52:01   there like there's no you in the travel [TS]

00:52:03   aside like because they're there when [TS]

00:52:05   they moved to the new apple can open a [TS]

00:52:07   new Apple their agency move because [TS]

00:52:08   that's exactly my point but when they [TS]

00:52:10   opened a new apple campus to they're not [TS]

00:52:13   leaving the apple campus the original [TS]

00:52:16   infinite loop campus they need what they [TS]

00:52:17   need all the space they can get and so I [TS]

00:52:20   mean there might be some empty offices [TS]

00:52:21   for a while but that you know there's [TS]

00:52:23   going to be back and forth between the [TS]

00:52:25   original apple campus and apple campus [TS]

00:52:27   to on a daily basis so having them both [TS]

00:52:29   in cupertino is a big deal you know and [TS]

00:52:32   they have new office space in san jose [TS]

00:52:33   they have space a few other places in [TS]

00:52:36   the south bay area but the fact that [TS]

00:52:38   getting between anywhere in the south [TS]

00:52:40   bay is easier than getting from anywhere [TS]

00:52:42   in the south bay to San Francisco is a [TS]

00:52:43   big deal like there's no universe where [TS]

00:52:45   Apple Campus to is a skyscraper with the [TS]

00:52:50   same square footage in San Francisco [TS]

00:52:51   it's not absolutely and and travel aside [TS]

00:52:55   even if part of it was like a tunnel dug [TS]

00:52:57   by elon musk that could get you between [TS]

00:52:59   them in 10 minutes [TS]

00:53:01   even if you get between them in 10 [TS]

00:53:03   minutes there's just no way they would [TS]

00:53:04   do it it's just [TS]

00:53:05   San Francisco is not an apple town in a [TS]

00:53:09   way that san jose i think is I'm looking [TS]

00:53:12   forward to it because it you know it [TS]

00:53:13   really is like going to a whole new [TS]

00:53:15   conference now and you know WC i've i've [TS]

00:53:18   gone now for something like seven years [TS]

00:53:20   something like that and I've enjoyed it [TS]

00:53:23   but i'm looking forward to something new [TS]

00:53:25   something fresh and you know it's it's [TS]

00:53:27   kind of more exciting now because it's [TS]

00:53:29   it's going to be something a little [TS]

00:53:30   different i forget if I went 2006 so I [TS]

00:53:34   either want ten years in a row or nine [TS]

00:53:36   years in a row [TS]

00:53:36   yeah it's one of my favorite things [TS]

00:53:38   about covering apple is that they're [TS]

00:53:41   very predictable so if you try to [TS]

00:53:42   approach them and analyze them in a [TS]

00:53:44   logical standpoint you can have success [TS]

00:53:46   but they're also resistant to [TS]

00:53:49   complacency right so they're not going [TS]

00:53:51   to like ping-pong around and move [TS]

00:53:53   wcd random cities every year but [TS]

00:53:57   they're not going to keep it in San [TS]

00:53:59   Francisco just because that's where it's [TS]

00:54:00   been for ten years which will get one [TS]

00:54:04   will get to when we talk about a iphone [TS]

00:54:07   and ipad for form factors in the other [TS]

00:54:10   thing too is we you've heard and I've [TS]

00:54:12   heard everybody's gone in recent years [TS]

00:54:13   has heard that from the long time [TS]

00:54:15   attendees who remember the San Jose or [TS]

00:54:17   there's a reputation that downtown San [TS]

00:54:18   Jose was kind of sleepy that you know [TS]

00:54:20   restaurants and bars close early [TS]

00:54:22   there's the quote-unquote nothing to do [TS]

00:54:24   two things on that is one back then WWDC [TS]

00:54:29   didn't even sell out i don't i forget [TS]

00:54:32   when the first sellout was but I don't [TS]

00:54:33   think it was in san jose and the second [TS]

00:54:38   thing is that talking to a couple people [TS]

00:54:40   WWE are downtown San Jose has improved a [TS]

00:54:44   lot in the last 10 years that there's [TS]

00:54:46   been a lot of oh I i just looked at [TS]

00:54:51   first wwc the sellout was 2008 gee I [TS]

00:54:53   wonder what happened 2008 that would [TS]

00:54:55   cause the first cell so up until two [TS]

00:54:58   thousand eight even the first few years [TS]

00:54:59   at moscone you could like buy a ticket [TS]

00:55:01   the day before deputy see I think the [TS]

00:55:04   fact that this is obviously going to [TS]

00:55:05   sell out in that they're going to be [TS]

00:55:06   people in San Jose who don't even have [TS]

00:55:09   tickets you know it's gonna be a [TS]

00:55:11   different five and the end a couple [TS]

00:55:13   people have said that [TS]

00:55:14   downtown San Jose is really improved a [TS]

00:55:15   lot i was just talking to friends like [TS]

00:55:18   friends really hard winter like you [TS]

00:55:20   don't really need much like it when [TS]

00:55:22   you're when you're there for a [TS]

00:55:23   conference like you need a handful of [TS]

00:55:25   you eat good hotels that you can [TS]

00:55:27   hopefully get for a reasonable price [TS]

00:55:29   you need a hat you need a bunch of [TS]

00:55:31   restaurants will get food at and you [TS]

00:55:33   need you know it's just a handful of [TS]

00:55:35   decent bars and bars motels and that's [TS]

00:55:38   about it like you don't need tons and [TS]

00:55:41   tons of nightlife for a tech conference [TS]

00:55:43   for five days right [TS]

00:55:44   it's actually better the bars are [TS]

00:55:46   generally empty but are willing to stay [TS]

00:55:48   open late so you can ya take over down [TS]

00:55:51   Rumple I was talking to about it now he [TS]

00:55:53   needs familiar with the area now he goes [TS]

00:55:55   to hockey games at the San Jose forget I [TS]

00:55:59   don't know what the name of it is but [TS]

00:56:00   over the Sharks play which is only one [TS]

00:56:02   mile away from the convention center so [TS]

00:56:04   it's you know by by city standards not a [TS]

00:56:06   far walk like that's the thing about san [TS]

00:56:09   jose is that downtown San [TS]

00:56:10   jose is all in one area it's not spread [TS]

00:56:13   out and he said like after hockey games [TS]

00:56:16   you know 1030-11 there's all sorts of [TS]

00:56:17   stuff to do bars to get beers and places [TS]

00:56:20   to eat late and stuff like that so I i'm [TS]

00:56:22   looking forward to it [TS]

00:56:24   yeah you're gonna go no matter what I'm [TS]

00:56:28   going yeah I actually it last year I [TS]

00:56:31   told myself you know what I'm not going [TS]

00:56:33   to get tickets anymore like I'm because [TS]

00:56:34   i'm going to like fewer sessions I'm [TS]

00:56:37   like you know it's I feel now that i'm [TS]

00:56:39   wasting a ticket because I i keep trying [TS]

00:56:42   to do more and more other things like I [TS]

00:56:44   keep getting double booked for time [TS]

00:56:45   slots with meetings and social events [TS]

00:56:47   and podcast event that everything was [TS]

00:56:49   like you know i just i'm just going to [TS]

00:56:50   take it now actually kinda I'm [TS]

00:56:52   questioning that now it's gonna be [TS]

00:56:54   different like well maybe I should get a [TS]

00:56:56   ticket this yeah I don't know why but I [TS]

00:56:57   definitely going out there [TS]

00:56:59   yeah i mean i'll go just to cover the [TS]

00:57:01   keynote and then I have nothing to [TS]

00:57:04   announce but hopefully to do my live [TS]

00:57:05   show again but the could always do that [TS]

00:57:09   and try to always do it on tuesday [TS]

00:57:11   evenings my question is how long to stay [TS]

00:57:13   like I don't know if I'm gonna stay all [TS]

00:57:14   week [TS]

00:57:15   yeah I I don't know it's a bit because [TS]

00:57:19   the thing is we don't know it is a whole [TS]

00:57:20   new conference effectively so we don't [TS]

00:57:22   know if you know if you if you say if [TS]

00:57:25   you plan to like you know going sunday [TS]

00:57:26   and leave wednesday or so you know [TS]

00:57:28   something like that [TS]

00:57:29   are you gonna regret that you didn't [TS]

00:57:30   stay until the cool things that we're [TS]

00:57:32   going to happen on thursday night like [TS]

00:57:33   you you don't know and that's why I'm [TS]

00:57:36   kind of thinking like I just do my usual [TS]

00:57:37   like you know sunday through friday [TS]

00:57:40   afternoon things that you know it works [TS]

00:57:43   the worst that can happen to have a [TS]

00:57:44   couple bonus days in California [TS]

00:57:46   oh no no that's there are worse things [TS]

00:57:48   in the world the Hat Yai don't know what [TS]

00:57:52   I'm gonna do it anyway [TS]

00:57:53   what a surprise us that came out like [TS]

00:57:55   what the day after ATP last week's you [TS]

00:57:57   guys didn't get you haven't talked about [TS]

00:57:58   you [TS]

00:57:59   I think the gist of it and i think i [TS]

00:58:01   think everybody started wrapping their [TS]

00:58:03   heads around it is i think Apple Apple [TS]

00:58:05   can spend the money on surrounding stuff [TS]

00:58:07   around the Convention Center and the [TS]

00:58:10   number of people that will be there you [TS]

00:58:11   know [TS]

00:58:12   attendance is not going up but it even [TS]

00:58:14   if it's just 5,000 plus a couple [TS]

00:58:15   thousand of people who you know come in [TS]

00:58:19   or out of a couple thousand combat and [TS]

00:58:21   4,000 people come just to be there and [TS]

00:58:23   simultaneous with it and then cut the [TS]

00:58:26   other factor is combined with all the [TS]

00:58:28   south bay companies whose employees [TS]

00:58:29   might come after work when they couldn't [TS]

00:58:32   if it was all the way up in San [TS]

00:58:33   Francisco i think it's i think it's [TS]

00:58:36   going to feel like apples taken over san [TS]

00:58:38   jose [TS]

00:58:38   yeah my main concern is if I don't get a [TS]

00:58:43   conference ticket will I not be able to [TS]

00:58:46   get into major events that i will then [TS]

00:58:48   want to get into [TS]

00:58:49   ya know like that that's that's been [TS]

00:58:51   like my one my one concern of like you [TS]

00:58:53   know it should i go anyway or not and [TS]

00:58:56   because I in San Francisco there was so [TS]

00:58:58   much to do everywhere that whether you [TS]

00:59:01   had a WTC badge but didn't really matter [TS]

00:59:03   for anything except for the beer bash [TS]

00:59:07   that was the only thing where were [TS]

00:59:08   really mattered whether you have it or [TS]

00:59:10   not but all the other events that [TS]

00:59:11   happened around the around the [TS]

00:59:12   conference were for anybody and I hope [TS]

00:59:15   that's gonna keep being the case but I [TS]

00:59:17   don't know yet and I think it'll be the [TS]

00:59:18   same [TS]

00:59:19   I do i do think here's my theory might [TS]

00:59:22   one of my theories is that they'll have [TS]

00:59:24   the bash on campus at apple campus too [TS]

00:59:26   because i think that would be awesome [TS]

00:59:28   but I don't think it's ready [TS]

00:59:30   I maybe by junior will be on and it [TS]

00:59:32   certainly cutting it close [TS]

00:59:34   yeah I don't know or maybe they'll have [TS]

00:59:35   it back at infinite loop I don't know [TS]

00:59:37   that's what they used to do is it big [TS]

00:59:39   enough because the care of their big [TS]

00:59:41   enough to hold today's everybody see [TS]

00:59:43   crowd I don't [TS]

00:59:44   yeah i don't know i mean the new the new [TS]

00:59:46   courtyard certainly is like your buena [TS]

00:59:48   felt crowded and that that's a big yard [TS]

00:59:51   you know [TS]

00:59:52   yeah but if you speak you know it got [TS]

00:59:53   crowded by the stage but yeah I don't [TS]

00:59:57   know [TS]

00:59:57   no it was empty by the stage setup [TS]

00:59:57   no it was empty by the stage setup [TS]

01:00:00   I guess you're right it was very crowded [TS]

01:00:02   as for the further back you got from the [TS]

01:00:04   stage the craft more crack about it [TS]

01:00:07   because none of the dirt none of the [TS]

01:00:08   Nerds the conference ever wanted to be [TS]

01:00:09   near the band I want to talk to each [TS]

01:00:10   other you can hear I can't hear let's go [TS]

01:00:13   to the back [TS]

01:00:13   it's the worst gig for a band of ever [TS]

01:00:15   play some of them that success its iight [TS]

01:00:19   so bad for them every year just take out [TS]

01:00:21   godlike he thought your plane to a bunch [TS]

01:00:22   of nerds backs you were like plugging [TS]

01:00:24   their ears with their don't want to hear [TS]

01:00:26   it right [TS]

01:00:27   oh it's terrible alright let's just uh [TS]

01:00:29   that's shift gears to there's supposedly [TS]

01:00:33   a march apple event and we're going to [TS]

01:00:35   do iPads new ipads possibly a a 128 [TS]

01:00:43   gigabyte upgrade to the iphone SE and [TS]

01:00:46   what else a new red color for the iphone [TS]

01:00:48   SE or maybe a new red color for all [TS]

01:00:52   iphones I think the rumor was a new red [TS]

01:00:54   color for the main iphone 7 lino maybe [TS]

01:00:56   which is kind of odd to do halfway [TS]

01:00:59   through a cycle but I mean who knows you [TS]

01:01:01   know it again like this is the kind of [TS]

01:01:02   thing where like if we look back and say [TS]

01:01:04   well Apple never does that you know we [TS]

01:01:06   have the iphone makes a lot of money [TS]

01:01:08   apples and evolving company that they [TS]

01:01:10   can do whatever they want and they will [TS]

01:01:12   you know if they think there's a good [TS]

01:01:13   reason to do something like those they [TS]

01:01:14   would do it so i think one of the [TS]

01:01:16   interesting things is that just about [TS]

01:01:18   everything we know about or have heard I [TS]

01:01:21   should say we know but every just about [TS]

01:01:22   all the rumors we have about upcoming [TS]

01:01:23   apple products all come from ming-chi [TS]

01:01:26   kuo the analyst at KGI securities but [TS]

01:01:30   you certainly seems like he has the best [TS]

01:01:32   info the earliest right like gurman has [TS]

01:01:36   had some stories at Bloomberg but it [TS]

01:01:39   hasn't really been a lot like an apple [TS]

01:01:40   TV thing recently but it's you know it's [TS]

01:01:42   just for k coming to apple TV in terms [TS]

01:01:45   of like iPads and iPhones he hasn't had [TS]

01:01:47   a lot recently it seems like it's all [TS]

01:01:48   coming from being chi kuo also it seems [TS]

01:01:52   like German sources or maybe more in the [TS]

01:01:54   mac area maybe because he seems to have [TS]

01:01:56   more mac info and makes you quote seems [TS]

01:01:59   to have more iOS supply chain info [TS]

01:02:02   it's all supply chain info I don't think [TS]

01:02:04   she quite as any to any sources at [TS]

01:02:06   cupertino I really don't and a lot of [TS]

01:02:08   what he gets wrong is from not having [TS]

01:02:10   those sources but that he has like [TS]

01:02:12   seemingly like drinking buddy status was [TS]

01:02:15   some foxconn executive it's but it was [TS]

01:02:20   interesting because it just yesterday [TS]

01:02:23   i'm looking at the date Mack kodikara [TS]

01:02:26   the Japanese rumor site who has a pretty [TS]

01:02:28   good track record to ya didn't I mean [TS]

01:02:31   i'll put a link in the show notes to the [TS]

01:02:33   one but i'll put the macrumors version [TS]

01:02:34   because it's an English what they're [TS]

01:02:37   saying is a much like KGI ming-chi kuo [TS]

01:02:43   the new 9.7 and 12.9 inch iPad pros so [TS]

01:02:48   take the ipad pros we already have new [TS]

01:02:50   ones a bizarre to me rumor of a 10.5 [TS]

01:02:55   inch iPad which basically has the same [TS]

01:02:59   footprint as the 9.7 inch as we know it [TS]

01:03:01   but with an edge-to-edge display so get [TS]

01:03:04   rid of the bezels at the top and bottom [TS]

01:03:05   so it has a 10.5 inch diagonal display [TS]

01:03:08   because it gets rid of the bezels now [TS]

01:03:11   the reason i call that bizarre getting [TS]

01:03:13   rid of bezel sounds like something Apple [TS]

01:03:14   would do but the reason that sounds [TS]

01:03:15   bizarre to me is that all these rumors [TS]

01:03:17   say that it's going to come alongside a [TS]

01:03:19   new 9.7 inch iPad pro like to me what [TS]

01:03:23   would make the it what both makes sense [TS]

01:03:26   and fits the historical pattern is if [TS]

01:03:30   they're going to do that introduced that [TS]

01:03:32   as the new high-end model at this [TS]

01:03:34   footprint and put the ipad the 9.7 inch [TS]

01:03:37   iPad pro at a- hundred-dollar minus two [TS]

01:03:41   hundred dollar price point lower down [TS]

01:03:42   the chain but there's an awful lot like [TS]

01:03:46   all these rumors say that are going to [TS]

01:03:47   do both and now Mac a car yesterday says [TS]

01:03:51   there's also going to be a 7.9 inch iPad [TS]

01:03:56   pro so in other words an ipad pro mini [TS]

01:03:58   yeah what should be the first place too [TS]

01:04:01   many in quite some time [TS]

01:04:03   yeah but i think that they've done that [TS]

01:04:04   before I've i think if you look at the [TS]

01:04:06   updates to the money that they've [TS]

01:04:07   skipped years before [TS]

01:04:09   yeah i mean so you know lets you know [TS]

01:04:12   easy things first the 7.9 inch iPad pro [TS]

01:04:15   many that makes a lot of sense and it's [TS]

01:04:17   not because last year specs right that's [TS]

01:04:18   what I would think is gonna have its [TS]

01:04:20   probably probably has the specs of the [TS]

01:04:21   current 9.7 pro which is now a year old [TS]

01:04:24   so that makes sense right [TS]

01:04:25   you know it apple doesn't need to like [TS]

01:04:27   you know save the pro name only for the [TS]

01:04:30   higher-end products because pro means [TS]

01:04:31   they can sell a hundred our pencil and [TS]

01:04:33   artificial our keyboard yeah with these [TS]

01:04:35   things so they they love spreading pro [TS]

01:04:37   over the whole line [TS]

01:04:38   I wonder what it and I mean a keyboard [TS]

01:04:41   that would fit i have an ipad mini in [TS]

01:04:42   front of me right now that's it's [TS]

01:04:43   cramped keyboard I i use like a logitech [TS]

01:04:47   one once a long time ago and it was it [TS]

01:04:48   was nearly impossible to use it was [TS]

01:04:51   tough like the 9.7 size allows for a [TS]

01:04:54   just barely usable keyboard case on it [TS]

01:04:56   but the point is that stuff they mean [TS]

01:05:00   they do exist and I guess somebody buy [TS]

01:05:01   them but that's that's certainly not a [TS]

01:05:03   good keyboard but anyway so that makes [TS]

01:05:06   sense so between 9.7 10.5 you know [TS]

01:05:11   there's there are these kind of similar [TS]

01:05:14   rumors that will probably get too [TS]

01:05:15   although with the whole iphone 7 7's and [TS]

01:05:18   eighth-inning also simultaneously [TS]

01:05:21   released in the fall and they're [TS]

01:05:22   basically being like the iphone quote [TS]

01:05:25   eight would be this similar bezel list [TS]

01:05:28   you know larger screen smaller case [TS]

01:05:29   higher-priced model so that's it you [TS]

01:05:34   know if they're gonna do that for the [TS]

01:05:35   iphone line whatever their reasons are [TS]

01:05:37   for doing it there they had maybe that [TS]

01:05:38   you know they finally got their edge to [TS]

01:05:40   edge design and technology lineup they [TS]

01:05:42   can finally do this whatever excited to [TS]

01:05:44   do this but it costs more to do it for [TS]

01:05:45   various reasons or whatever else or they [TS]

01:05:48   just wanted you know they want to have a [TS]

01:05:49   premium product as they want to start [TS]

01:05:51   you know if if people are really [TS]

01:05:53   treating their phones and their iPads as [TS]

01:05:56   computers both in what they're doing [TS]

01:05:58   with them and in their replacement [TS]

01:06:01   cycles then Apple probably wants to [TS]

01:06:03   boost those prices up a little bit well [TS]

01:06:05   you're only going to buy a new phone [TS]

01:06:06   every three years ago I had every five [TS]

01:06:08   and you're treated like used to treat [TS]

01:06:10   your 2000 our laptop well if we can get [TS]

01:06:12   you paid a lot of hundred bucks for [TS]

01:06:14   that's that's better for us and we can [TS]

01:06:16   give you higher and specs and higher and [TS]

01:06:18   you know more storage and fancier screen [TS]

01:06:21   technology and also stuff so it makes a [TS]

01:06:23   lot of sense why they would have higher [TS]

01:06:25   price ones at all and it's totally [TS]

01:06:28   possible with modern apple that they [TS]

01:06:31   would also keep making lower end ones [TS]

01:06:33   that you know rather because you know [TS]

01:06:36   apple releases new things like this you [TS]

01:06:39   knew I [TS]

01:06:39   iOS devices new form factors one of the [TS]

01:06:42   ways that they can release these things [TS]

01:06:44   they have in the past is you release the [TS]

01:06:47   new thing at the old price point and [TS]

01:06:48   push everything down a hundred bucks the [TS]

01:06:50   other way you do it is you leave [TS]

01:06:52   everything at the same price point and [TS]

01:06:53   you bring the new one in [TS]

01:06:55   that's a hundred bucks more than the [TS]

01:06:56   homeless because the new ones higher-end [TS]

01:06:58   so that's what I see them probably doing [TS]

01:07:00   here [TS]

01:07:00   that's probably what the 10.5 inch iPad [TS]

01:07:02   and the quote iphone 8 with this weird a [TS]

01:07:04   display both of those are probably that [TS]

01:07:07   ladder kind of product where they both [TS]

01:07:09   probably coming to an existing lineup [TS]

01:07:10   that itself doesn't really change or [TS]

01:07:12   changes only a minor ways and they [TS]

01:07:14   command a higher price points with more [TS]

01:07:15   premium stuff now so i think i think [TS]

01:07:17   it's almost like you have to because the [TS]

01:07:19   pattern is the same that there's going [TS]

01:07:20   to be new models in the old form factor [TS]

01:07:24   and this amazing edge-to-edge you know [TS]

01:07:28   blow away design without the bezels it's [TS]

01:07:31   the same story for the ipad in the [TS]

01:07:32   iphone so we might as well talk just [TS]

01:07:33   forestall the blow away thing as a verb [TS]

01:07:35   i might have allergies or it was an [TS]

01:07:39   adjective [TS]

01:07:40   it was an agitated to do I might have [TS]

01:07:44   big-league that's a big league design [TS]

01:07:48   that was bigley know your type know [TS]

01:07:52   everybody says that they were talking [TS]

01:07:54   about Trump here [TS]

01:07:55   Trump uses big league as an adjective [TS]

01:07:57   and he's it doesn't make any sense to [TS]

01:07:59   say typically it wouldn't eat has big [TS]

01:08:01   leak and but having comes out I don't [TS]

01:08:04   think not making sense is necessarily a [TS]

01:08:06   pourrait yea big league big lead do it [TS]

01:08:09   for ya but big league is what he's [TS]

01:08:11   saying trust me today to get your gonna [TS]

01:08:13   have these blowing designs forced all [TS]

01:08:14   right you've got you can even see it [TS]

01:08:16   when the White House transcribes remarks [TS]

01:08:18   it's it's big-league it's gonna be a big [TS]

01:08:19   league design ensures auto correcting [TS]

01:08:22   for the update I you know I mean what I [TS]

01:08:28   bet on it now but I [TS]

01:08:34   it's the same story but to me it makes [TS]

01:08:37   more sense with the iphone than the ipad [TS]

01:08:39   and so the story with the iphone is that [TS]

01:08:41   there would be what a presumably be [TS]

01:08:43   called or at least described i mean [TS]

01:08:45   again we can't marketing names of the [TS]

01:08:47   hardest thing to know for sure because [TS]

01:08:48   they're the tightest held secrets but it [TS]

01:08:50   sounds like they're going to do the 7s & [TS]

01:08:53   7 S Plus exactly like you would think [TS]

01:08:56   where it's the same form factor close [TS]

01:09:01   enough like down to like the tenth of a [TS]

01:09:02   millimeter where you can probably use [TS]

01:09:04   the same case with magic would [TS]

01:09:08   presumably like an better camera and [TS]

01:09:11   maybe like a next-generation a series [TS]

01:09:14   cpu you know everything you want you [TS]

01:09:17   exactly what you think in the 707s would [TS]

01:09:19   be and then also this new iphone [TS]

01:09:24   I don't know I i if this is anything if [TS]

01:09:26   there's any truth to this [TS]

01:09:27   I don't think there's any chance that [TS]

01:09:29   they call this new iphone the iphone 8 [TS]

01:09:30   there's just no way I think that they [TS]

01:09:32   would call it the iphone pro because I [TS]

01:09:35   think that's the only way that you can [TS]

01:09:37   have a reasonable amount of excitement [TS]

01:09:39   for the new 7 s and 70 s plus and have [TS]

01:09:45   this new phone like it doesn't make [TS]

01:09:46   sense to me to have an iphone 8 and 2 [TS]

01:09:49   7's in the same year like why not just [TS]

01:09:52   because who wouldn't just by the eight [TS]

01:09:54   but well it's gonna be expensive right [TS]

01:09:57   it's the part of making are all the [TS]

01:09:58   rumors that seems like a thousand [TS]

01:10:00   dollars which like if you actually look [TS]

01:10:01   at like the the full price of iphones [TS]

01:10:03   that is not that ridiculous it's like a [TS]

01:10:05   hundred fifty bucks more than just then [TS]

01:10:07   a similar respect plus model would be [TS]

01:10:08   right life in a suit if you assume that [TS]

01:10:11   it probably starts at 128 or 256 right [TS]

01:10:14   likely probably does a the 256 no rumor [TS]

01:10:18   came out today that is going to have to [TS]

01:10:19   two models 64 and 256 really so god i [TS]

01:10:24   would guess like it might be like toast [TS]

01:10:26   1049 464 and 1149 first 256 at least [TS]

01:10:31   it's only you but the idea would be that [TS]

01:10:34   these get these this would get [TS]

01:10:36   slaughtered in at a new higher price [TS]

01:10:38   point that the 7s & 7 S Plus would take [TS]

01:10:41   the existing price points and that [TS]

01:10:42   they're actually instead of going lower [TS]

01:10:44   they're actually going more upscale [TS]

01:10:47   and that was a very apple-like thing to [TS]

01:10:49   do yeah it makes sense on a lot of [TS]

01:10:51   levels i mean you know the cynical take [TS]

01:10:53   is of course they're gonna make a lot [TS]

01:10:54   more money because the ASP is going to [TS]

01:10:56   go up on their most profitable products [TS]

01:10:58   and I like that's like that's a big deal [TS]

01:10:59   for them financially for their [TS]

01:11:01   performance on Wall Street center ok but [TS]

01:11:03   also there there's good reasons for also [TS]

01:11:05   like you know one of them is they can [TS]

01:11:08   afford to put higher price parts in this [TS]

01:11:10   one so you could you could have like you [TS]

01:11:12   know something that maybe maybe they [TS]

01:11:14   couldn't afford you know parts price [TS]

01:11:16   wise to put in all the iphones for a [TS]

01:11:18   year because that's a lot of phones then [TS]

01:11:20   they can have it in this model for [TS]

01:11:22   people who want to pay another couple [TS]

01:11:23   hundred bucks and then also it you know [TS]

01:11:26   if the rumors are true that they're [TS]

01:11:27   doing this crazy edge screen thing that [TS]

01:11:29   I I think it's pretty clearly going to [TS]

01:11:30   be oled colloids are at this scale like [TS]

01:11:34   possibly they're having production yield [TS]

01:11:36   problems with the type and quality and [TS]

01:11:38   and whatever they're making and so maybe [TS]

01:11:40   they can't make like 80 million of them [TS]

01:11:42   a quarter whatever the number is so they [TS]

01:11:44   have to have like a mainstream iphone [TS]

01:11:47   for this coming year that isn't this [TS]

01:11:50   crazy new screen but they also want to [TS]

01:11:52   have this creation screen in whatever [TS]

01:11:54   quantity they could make for people who [TS]

01:11:56   are going to pay for it and it lets them [TS]

01:11:58   keep like the the kind of like [TS]

01:12:00   innovation crown going it like it [TS]

01:12:03   because it's it's okay it's just [TS]

01:12:04   wonderful like showpiece at the top of [TS]

01:12:06   the line even if like sixty percent of [TS]

01:12:09   buyers aren't buying it [TS]

01:12:11   no I i think though if they do this it [TS]

01:12:14   has to be in sufficient quantity that [TS]

01:12:17   they can meet demand as well as they've [TS]

01:12:19   met it in recent years with whatever the [TS]

01:12:22   new top-of-the-line is because I think a [TS]

01:12:24   ton of people are going to want this [TS]

01:12:25   this crate if this exact rumor comes [TS]

01:12:28   true [TS]

01:12:29   I don't know if it's forty percent but [TS]

01:12:31   it's going to be some it's not going to [TS]

01:12:32   be like just a sliver like there's gonna [TS]

01:12:34   be an awful lot of people who for extra [TS]

01:12:37   hundred or two hundred dollars or even [TS]

01:12:39   three hundred dollars are going to say i [TS]

01:12:40   want the new hotness and yeah if it's [TS]

01:12:43   like if I i could see this really i [TS]

01:12:46   think it's a risk if they if they're [TS]

01:12:48   really going to do this and I think the [TS]

01:12:49   idea you know if you're if you're [TS]

01:12:50   complaining about apples they don't take [TS]

01:12:52   risks anymore here's your [TS]

01:12:53   here's your story because of the risk i [TS]

01:12:55   see happening is if they make this [TS]

01:12:57   announcement and forty percent of [TS]

01:13:00   everybody who wants to buy a new iphone [TS]

01:13:03   in September wants this one and it's [TS]

01:13:06   instantly backordered three months or [TS]

01:13:08   something and nobody can get it [TS]

01:13:10   instantly it will be none of those [TS]

01:13:12   people are then going to say oh cancel [TS]

01:13:15   my order i'll get the 7s nobody's gonna [TS]

01:13:17   do that there are going to say alright [TS]

01:13:19   i'll wait i could so I could what I [TS]

01:13:21   could see happening if they can't meet [TS]

01:13:23   demand at least as well as they've done [TS]

01:13:25   in recent years like with this to say [TS]

01:13:27   like in the quarter they just reported [TS]

01:13:30   if they can't meet demand for this [TS]

01:13:32   iphone pro as well as they did for the [TS]

01:13:35   seven and seven plus three months ago in [TS]

01:13:40   what turned out to be the best selling [TS]

01:13:41   iphone quarter ever then I think they're [TS]

01:13:45   in real trouble because nobody everybody [TS]

01:13:47   is waiting for it is not going to settle [TS]

01:13:48   on the 7s & 7 S Plus and then [TS]

01:13:50   year-over-year it's going to look bad [TS]

01:13:52   because they're going to take a big hit [TS]

01:13:55   it'll even out eventually because [TS]

01:13:56   eventually it's not just people waiting [TS]

01:13:58   for the iphone pro going to switch to [TS]

01:14:00   android they'll wait till January [TS]

01:14:02   February or march or however long it [TS]

01:14:04   takes to get it but it's going to look [TS]

01:14:07   bad at that year-over-year [TS]

01:14:08   quarter-over-quarter demand so i think [TS]

01:14:13   that the idea i've seen people say oh [TS]

01:14:15   they'll do this and it's sort of just [TS]

01:14:16   like a like the 20th anniversary Mac you [TS]

01:14:20   know it's like a it's like a little [TS]

01:14:21   thing at the at the fringe for just a [TS]

01:14:23   handful of you know people who are [TS]

01:14:25   willing to spend a little bit more [TS]

01:14:28   I don't think that's the case at all i [TS]

01:14:30   think this would be this might be the [TS]

01:14:31   best selling phone they come out with [TS]

01:14:32   next year and i happen to know I just [TS]

01:14:34   anecdotally I see lots of people on [TS]

01:14:36   Twitter the people who really care and [TS]

01:14:38   we dive gone on this long you know with [TS]

01:14:41   that that the iphone 7 looking so much [TS]

01:14:43   like an iphone 6 and success that I [TS]

01:14:47   can't see why people are so obsessed [TS]

01:14:49   with the exterior of the phone but it's [TS]

01:14:51   true that an awful lot of people are [TS]

01:14:53   that they're not even getting into you [TS]

01:14:56   know what the camera does how good the [TS]

01:14:58   screen looks how good the touch sensor [TS]

01:14:59   is how good the virtual the new virtual [TS]

01:15:01   home button is [TS]

01:15:02   and all the other things that are like [TS]

01:15:04   about it there's an awful lot of people [TS]

01:15:05   and you see it and all the tech reviews [TS]

01:15:07   you certainly see it most of the gadget [TS]

01:15:09   reviews that it's a guy looks like the [TS]

01:15:10   old iphone math there's an awful lot of [TS]

01:15:12   people who think like that who have been [TS]

01:15:14   waiting for years for you know screwing [TS]

01:15:16   us i'll hold on to my old phone for [TS]

01:15:18   another year because I know Apple is [TS]

01:15:19   going to come out with a new thing [TS]

01:15:20   eventually yeah i mean it matters it [TS]

01:15:24   matters a lot and I think you're right [TS]

01:15:26   again i think a lot of people are going [TS]

01:15:28   to want this new thing I mean I think I [TS]

01:15:30   think we've shown that as customers that [TS]

01:15:32   no matter what the new iphone is no [TS]

01:15:35   matter how happy we are or aren't with [TS]

01:15:38   it it you know in our social media posts [TS]

01:15:40   and tech reviews and everything we all [TS]

01:15:42   want it and we're all gonna buy it and [TS]

01:15:44   we're all gonna pay whatever it costs so [TS]

01:15:47   yeah but they're gonna know if this [TS]

01:15:49   thing is real it unless it unless it has [TS]

01:15:52   some obscene downside which it probably [TS]

01:15:54   won't and again an extra hundred fifty [TS]

01:15:56   bucks is probably not enough of the [TS]

01:15:58   downside for enough people then they're [TS]

01:16:01   gonna sell this thing like literally [TS]

01:16:03   just gonna sell as many as they can [TS]

01:16:05   possibly make it really i really wonder [TS]

01:16:08   how why people would buy the 7s and 7's [TS]

01:16:12   plus I I can totally see why they would [TS]

01:16:14   keep selling the seven and seven plus at [TS]

01:16:16   lower prices but I just can't see why [TS]

01:16:18   people would my people with sign I guess [TS]

01:16:21   its people who have more sense you know [TS]

01:16:23   then I do financially and who are like [TS]

01:16:25   well it is two hundred dollars i'll just [TS]

01:16:28   get the 7s yeah that's a lot of people [TS]

01:16:31   think it's not like that like it's [TS]

01:16:34   everybody who who doesn't buy the [TS]

01:16:36   top-of-the-line model of and any other [TS]

01:16:38   year right all right people who don't [TS]

01:16:41   you know don't defy the 256 even though [TS]

01:16:44   they only use 228 of their storage just [TS]

01:16:47   in case i don't even buy the 256 i do I [TS]

01:16:50   don't like I can't stand the thought of [TS]

01:16:52   not having the best one [TS]

01:16:53   ok and i often think like and then I [TS]

01:16:56   talk I say to myself like what happens [TS]

01:16:58   if you're like out and about and like [TS]

01:17:00   breaking news happens and you start [TS]

01:17:01   shooting video like of this like major [TS]

01:17:05   event like I don't want to run out of [TS]

01:17:06   space to shoot video because by cheaped [TS]

01:17:09   out on my phone by a hundred dollars [TS]

01:17:11   you have to be shooting a lot of video [TS]

01:17:13   well I don't know I'm just thought that [TS]

01:17:15   occurs to me i think the battery will [TS]

01:17:17   die before you fill it out back and then [TS]

01:17:20   we'll come back to this i'm going to [TS]

01:17:21   take another break here for a sponsor [TS]

01:17:22   but we had I'm not done with this [TS]

01:17:24   because I want to take this back to the [TS]

01:17:25   iPad because i don't think i don't think [TS]

01:17:27   the iphone story can works for the ipad [TS]

01:17:30   but I'm gonna take a break here and [TS]

01:17:32   thanks to our next sponsor our good [TS]

01:17:34   friends at zero you guys know who ero is [TS]

01:17:36   we talked about it a lot lately I their [TS]

01:17:38   new Wi-Fi base stations the old model of [TS]

01:17:41   Wi-Fi is that you'd get a router you [TS]

01:17:44   hook it up to your cable modem put it [TS]

01:17:46   somewhere where probably wherever your [TS]

01:17:47   cable boxes in your house and then hope [TS]

01:17:49   that one router would give you a good [TS]

01:17:51   Wi-Fi throughout your whole house we've [TS]

01:17:54   been doing effort like 15 years I guess [TS]

01:17:56   what that model stinks and the old way [TS]

01:17:59   if you did that you could also maybe get [TS]

01:18:00   like an extender or something but then [TS]

01:18:02   all of a sudden you're playing like [TS]

01:18:03   junior sysadmin trying to get this to [TS]

01:18:05   work to have like a second device that [TS]

01:18:08   connects to the first device and somehow [TS]

01:18:09   extends the same network so that when [TS]

01:18:13   you're just open your device it looks [TS]

01:18:14   like the same network whether you're [TS]

01:18:17   upstairs or downstairs or whatever hero [TS]

01:18:20   is a system designed from the ground up [TS]

01:18:22   to have multiple devices spread [TS]

01:18:25   throughout your house and it just [TS]

01:18:26   coordinates all the nerdy stuff to make [TS]

01:18:29   that happen seamlessly all by itself [TS]

01:18:32   you don't even have to separate which [TS]

01:18:35   device is the main one in which one of [TS]

01:18:37   the satellites they're all they're [TS]

01:18:38   actually the same little apple TV style [TS]

01:18:40   size hockey puck type things really nice [TS]

01:18:45   design you can put them anywhere in your [TS]

01:18:47   house i can't if you have a Wi-Fi router [TS]

01:18:49   anywhere in your house [TS]

01:18:51   the hero is almost certainly better [TS]

01:18:53   looking in smaller device they recommend [TS]

01:18:55   34 most houses you can just go to their [TS]

01:18:57   web site at a-put like how many floors [TS]

01:18:59   your house in how many square feet now [TS]

01:19:01   give you a recommendation on that if you [TS]

01:19:02   buy for and you really only need three [TS]

01:19:04   you can send one back you can figure the [TS]

01:19:07   whole thing through a nice really nice [TS]

01:19:09   app like you don't have to go to like [TS]

01:19:11   some weird website on the router at at [TS]

01:19:14   192 that 168 whatever none of that stuff [TS]

01:19:18   it's a really nice app you don't have it [TS]

01:19:20   and you don't have to worry that you're [TS]

01:19:21   not playing sysadmin you're just [TS]

01:19:23   you know setting up the way you want it [TS]

01:19:25   to be you want to have a guest network [TS]

01:19:27   you'd say give me a guest network then [TS]

01:19:28   your network as a guest network that's [TS]

01:19:30   it you're done really really great I've [TS]

01:19:32   got one here i've set it up i replaced [TS]

01:19:34   an apple base station set up in our [TS]

01:19:37   house with 0 and the speeds are way [TS]

01:19:40   better [TS]

01:19:41   they even tell you in the app what your [TS]

01:19:43   speeds are so you can check and you can [TS]

01:19:44   even it'll even tell you what kind of [TS]

01:19:46   speeds are getting from your cable [TS]

01:19:47   company or files or whatever you've got [TS]

01:19:49   they even have great customer support [TS]

01:19:51   it's something that the company's really [TS]

01:19:52   invested in you can call when you get a [TS]

01:19:54   hold of a real Wi-Fi expert within 30 [TS]

01:19:56   seconds just in case you need it because [TS]

01:19:59   look this stuff stuff so maybe something [TS]

01:20:01   happens [TS]

01:20:01   30 seconds you're talking to an expert [TS]

01:20:04   where do you go to find out more [TS]

01:20:05   ez-go 20 calm / the talkshow go to the [TS]

01:20:10   talk show is that code and you'll get [TS]

01:20:14   something nice I think you get expedited [TS]

01:20:17   shipping [TS]

01:20:18   yeah that's pretty sure that's it yeah [TS]

01:20:19   we expedited shipping and hero.com so [TS]

01:20:22   use that code the talk show what you're [TS]

01:20:24   talking with your code party ATP I think [TS]

01:20:26   so you can use ATP to and then and then [TS]

01:20:28   Marco will get credit for it either way [TS]

01:20:30   is fine with me [TS]

01:20:32   good company around so anyway I don't [TS]

01:20:38   think that this middle ipad that doesn't [TS]

01:20:41   have a bezel I don't think that it has [TS]

01:20:43   the same cachet that that this rumored [TS]

01:20:46   iphone does like would i pay an extra [TS]

01:20:49   two hundred dollars to get away [TS]

01:20:50   cool-looking iphone yes what I pay an [TS]

01:20:53   extra two hundred dollars to get a [TS]

01:20:54   cool-looking ipad no I don't think so [TS]

01:20:57   well I think it's you know the the ipad [TS]

01:21:01   approach that Apple has taken in recent [TS]

01:21:03   years has been pretty much scatter shot [TS]

01:21:06   just like we have this product category [TS]

01:21:08   it's not performing as well as you want [TS]

01:21:12   to or needed to so let's try a bunch of [TS]

01:21:15   stuff and and that has resulted in a lot [TS]

01:21:17   of you know weird attempts for things [TS]

01:21:19   and a lot of things that are really good [TS]

01:21:20   and you know the whole ipad pro a branch [TS]

01:21:24   of the product line that the whole thing [TS]

01:21:26   with making a pencil after you know [TS]

01:21:29   everyone assumed Apple never would [TS]

01:21:30   receive comments made one comment 20 [TS]

01:21:32   years ago like you know it there they've [TS]

01:21:35   been David just try [TS]

01:21:36   a bunch of stuff and the fact is it what [TS]

01:21:40   what most people need out of their iPads [TS]

01:21:44   to to like you know get more work done [TS]

01:21:46   or more of their work done is really [TS]

01:21:48   tricky difficult long-term software [TS]

01:21:51   stuff that's much harder to do [TS]

01:21:53   it's much easier to just let's try some [TS]

01:21:56   new screen sizes and some new hardware [TS]

01:21:57   abilities like that's actually easier to [TS]

01:21:59   do then like let's figure out file [TS]

01:22:01   management iOS or Windows or anything [TS]

01:22:04   like those are way harder and and you [TS]

01:22:06   know and never lets fix the appstore [TS]

01:22:09   pricing ecosystem like that it's way [TS]

01:22:11   harder than apple who is already an [TS]

01:22:13   excellent hardware company making one [TS]

01:22:15   more screen size or making you know one [TS]

01:22:17   more hardware configuration ipad has [TS]

01:22:19   never been to my mind and who and aww [TS]

01:22:22   industrial design product except for [TS]

01:22:27   maybe the first one the first one was [TS]

01:22:30   like because it was just like a [TS]

01:22:31   quote-unquote they're making a tablet [TS]

01:22:33   nobody knows it's gonna be thick is what [TS]

01:22:35   about how big is it [TS]

01:22:36   nobody knew you know what it was going [TS]

01:22:40   to be like and then we saw it and it was [TS]

01:22:42   like wow this is really nice and it's [TS]

01:22:44   wow this is really kind of cool to have [TS]

01:22:45   something with the touch latency of an [TS]

01:22:47   iphone on a big screen it you know it [TS]

01:22:51   was impressive but then every iteration [TS]

01:22:52   since then has been very iterative to my [TS]

01:22:55   mind like there's never been one [TS]

01:22:57   generation where you're like whoa it [TS]

01:23:00   with the possible exception of the move [TS]

01:23:02   from non-retina retina but even then [TS]

01:23:05   it's not really the the way it looks [TS]

01:23:07   well without turning it on [TS]

01:23:11   you know like but the rumors about this [TS]

01:23:13   iphone pro or iphone 8 or everyone call [TS]

01:23:16   it or that it's going to look like wow [TS]

01:23:18   what is that before you even turn it on [TS]

01:23:20   it doesn't seem you know that was never [TS]

01:23:23   really the case with with iPads I mean [TS]

01:23:26   that current iPads looking off a lot [TS]

01:23:28   like the original 1i mean the backs are [TS]

01:23:30   flat now and the bezel on the side is [TS]

01:23:33   our but like the top and bottom bezel is [TS]

01:23:36   almost exactly the same i think what is [TS]

01:23:39   it you know it's a combination of them [TS]

01:23:41   like trying to figure like you know what [TS]

01:23:42   else can we try here to to turn around [TS]

01:23:45   the sales curve and 22 let this product [TS]

01:23:47   really come into its own [TS]

01:23:49   and then also just like the ipad I I [TS]

01:23:53   don't think it's about flashing I i [TS]

01:23:54   think this is actually just about [TS]

01:23:55   utility the ipad it really struggles [TS]

01:23:58   between how much screen size you get [TS]

01:24:01   versus how nice it is to use it it's [TS]

01:24:04   really this incredibly you know polar [TS]

01:24:06   opposite relationship where like it if [TS]

01:24:09   you want to get anything more done on it [TS]

01:24:11   then [TS]

01:24:12   browsing the web and watching video you [TS]

01:24:14   really want more screen space like it if [TS]

01:24:16   you try multitasking at all the 9.7 can [TS]

01:24:20   do it but it's it's you know it's pretty [TS]

01:24:22   tight and it and the people who look [TS]

01:24:25   like people we know like in the [TS]

01:24:26   community who are big Pro ipad users who [TS]

01:24:29   do get a lot of their work on ipads [TS]

01:24:31   almost always prefer the 12.9 now for [TS]

01:24:34   getting like quote work done because has [TS]

01:24:36   more screen space but you know anyone [TS]

01:24:39   who's ever used to use 12.9 and can can [TS]

01:24:41   tell you like it's pretty big too like [TS]

01:24:44   for an ipad like for a laptop it's still [TS]

01:24:46   nice and small but for an ipad the way [TS]

01:24:49   you use and hold an ipad it really is [TS]

01:24:53   quite large and so it adding that screen [TS]

01:24:57   space to get the 12.9 it and its ability [TS]

01:25:00   to have multitasking be better and to [TS]

01:25:03   get more work done more effectively has [TS]

01:25:05   come at a great cost of this kind of [TS]

01:25:07   unwieldy size for hand-holding and ipad [TS]

01:25:10   use that's why I think a lot of typing [TS]

01:25:13   on users use like you know keyboards and [TS]

01:25:15   stuff for its kind of more like a laptop [TS]

01:25:16   properly on the table more of the time [TS]

01:25:18   because if you actually like using it [TS]

01:25:20   like one-handed like you know one hand [TS]

01:25:21   to hold it in the other hand to like [TS]

01:25:22   touch it or use the pencil like that's a [TS]

01:25:25   pretty big ipad to do that with its kind [TS]

01:25:26   of awkward it's kind of unwieldy so this [TS]

01:25:28   this 10-point whatever I think is an [TS]

01:25:32   attempt to cram that screen resolution [TS]

01:25:34   into the smaller body which for ipad [TS]

01:25:38   power users and I guess we don't have [TS]

01:25:42   any of those there are but for ipad [TS]

01:25:44   power users that sounds incredible that [TS]

01:25:46   sounds like exactly what so many people [TS]

01:25:47   would want in [TS]

01:25:50   I want an ipad that is that is still [TS]

01:25:52   small enough to feel and handle like an [TS]

01:25:56   iPad and that means 9.7 roughly you know [TS]

01:25:59   physical dimensions [TS]

01:26:00   yeah but that would have more [TS]

01:26:02   green space so i could better multitask [TS]

01:26:04   and get more of my work done on this [TS]

01:26:06   device or get my work done more [TS]

01:26:07   efficiently on this device and the [TS]

01:26:08   speculation i think is that the the [TS]

01:26:10   pixel resolution is set up being it 266 [TS]

01:26:14   pixels-per-inch it's going to be 3 26 [TS]

01:26:17   which is the pixel resolution of the [TS]

01:26:19   retina mini and the iphone and the [TS]

01:26:22   iphone that seems really small to me for [TS]

01:26:26   a device that you would hold at a [TS]

01:26:28   further away distance but maybe that's [TS]

01:26:30   just my aging vision speaking I mean [TS]

01:26:33   it's just it's just like the ipad mini [TS]

01:26:34   you know it's like it like if the ipad [TS]

01:26:35   you know that many just has like a 9.7 [TS]

01:26:37   resolution shrunk down it's gonna be [TS]

01:26:39   that same relationship so if the ipad [TS]

01:26:41   mini looks acceptable to you and you can [TS]

01:26:43   use it without eyestrain then this would [TS]

01:26:45   probably work for you too [TS]

01:26:46   it's just I'm so it's yeah it just seems [TS]

01:26:48   like a confusing decision though which [TS]

01:26:50   one you would buy doesn't it [TS]

01:26:52   you know like just probably gonna be [TS]

01:26:54   more expensive than the equivalent 9.7 [TS]

01:26:56   but it's probably like a hundred bucks [TS]

01:26:58   more at least so you know it's and maybe [TS]

01:27:00   like slightly cheaper than the 12.9 [TS]

01:27:02   version of it you know so who knows i [TS]

01:27:04   mean it it will see what they do and I i [TS]

01:27:07   think at this point it's very clear that [TS]

01:27:09   Apple strategy with the ipad against kit [TS]

01:27:11   scattershot it's like let's just try a [TS]

01:27:13   bunch of stuff and see what works and [TS]

01:27:15   just give people tons and tons of [TS]

01:27:17   options you know the date will now sell [TS]

01:27:19   you an ipad at pretty much every hundred [TS]

01:27:22   dollar price point from 250 on up to [TS]

01:27:25   like 1,100 and it's like that any of [TS]

01:27:28   these price points pick your price [TS]

01:27:29   whatever you're going to pay for an ipad [TS]

01:27:30   we got one to sell you at exactly that [TS]

01:27:32   price point but a little bit more after [TS]

01:27:34   accessories like the end and I think for [TS]

01:27:37   for what they're trying to do with the [TS]

01:27:39   ipad like I think it's very clear that [TS]

01:27:41   again I I think they're they maybe don't [TS]

01:27:44   really know what will work and what [TS]

01:27:47   won't to boost sales or to carry this [TS]

01:27:50   platform forward so they are just trying [TS]

01:27:52   a bunch of random stuff at this point [TS]

01:27:53   and I'm sure I'm sure there's more that [TS]

01:27:55   goes into it than that but it certainly [TS]

01:27:57   seems like they're taking a lot of [TS]

01:27:59   hardware risks here in order to just [TS]

01:28:01   cover more of the market in hopes that [TS]

01:28:04   people will want what they're now making [TS]

01:28:06   without having to really dramatically [TS]

01:28:08   change iOS to be more pc like I don't [TS]

01:28:10   just seems really it just seems really [TS]

01:28:12   curious to me that it would that this [TS]

01:28:14   new [TS]

01:28:14   bezel design would a debut alongside the [TS]

01:28:17   ipad pro want to you know I don't know [TS]

01:28:20   I'm glad I mean myself would understand [TS]

01:28:23   Eve but i think this is kind of a [TS]

01:28:24   hallmark of team hooks Apple is like you [TS]

01:28:26   know just it isn't it is not not an [TS]

01:28:29   aversion to throwing a bunch of [TS]

01:28:32   different options out there I don't [TS]

01:28:34   think that's Tim Cook I really don't I I [TS]

01:28:36   don't know I I don't know what the [TS]

01:28:39   thinking I think there's something we're [TS]

01:28:40   missing if this is true i just don't get [TS]

01:28:42   it I don't know I do think have you [TS]

01:28:46   played around with the math there was a [TS]

01:28:48   mac rumors had a report from each equal [TS]

01:28:51   on this new the iphone as i'm calling it [TS]

01:28:53   the iphone pro as others are saying the [TS]

01:28:55   iphone 8 which supposedly has a five [TS]

01:28:58   point eight inch oled display but that's [TS]

01:29:01   the whole device and only 5.15 inches of [TS]

01:29:05   it are really the sort of I've what we [TS]

01:29:08   think of as the iphone display now and [TS]

01:29:09   the rest is like the chin and presumably [TS]

01:29:12   they'll be new features in the OS that [TS]

01:29:14   can light stuff up down there [TS]

01:29:16   ah but basically if you do the math and [TS]

01:29:22   he's exactly right [TS]

01:29:24   it's a device that's a very different [TS]

01:29:26   aspect ratio than the iphone as we know [TS]

01:29:28   it [TS]

01:29:29   yeah it's too tall and skinny yeah it's [TS]

01:29:31   basically a device that are the hardware [TS]

01:29:35   is as narrow as an iPhone se because [TS]

01:29:38   it's an edge-to-edge display and if you [TS]

01:29:40   actually put like an iPhone se or an [TS]

01:29:42   iphone 5 on top of a 4.7 inch iphone and [TS]

01:29:47   turn the screen on and then put this [TS]

01:29:48   like an iphone SE on top of it it's [TS]

01:29:51   pretty much exactly the same with and [TS]

01:29:54   honest now [TS]

01:29:55   yeah i got this in here so it's a device [TS]

01:29:58   yeah it's device that's actually [TS]

01:30:00   narrower in hand than an iphone 7 you [TS]

01:30:03   know that a 4.7 inch it's more like an [TS]

01:30:05   SE in hand but it's as tall as an iphone [TS]

01:30:09   7 in other words it's just almost [TS]

01:30:11   exactly the height and it's a device of [TS]

01:30:13   the iphone with a 4.7 inch screen so as [TS]

01:30:17   a piece of hardware in your hand not [TS]

01:30:18   even turning it on it would be smaller [TS]

01:30:20   than an iphone 7 about the same height [TS]

01:30:22   and a little narrower [TS]

01:30:24   but that the aspect ratio that kg is [TS]

01:30:30   saying it instead of being 16 29 it's [TS]

01:30:33   more like to point just like 2.15 21 [TS]

01:30:36   it's more like a widescreen movie you [TS]

01:30:39   know like a yeah [TS]

01:30:40   anamorphic movie it's a lot wider it's [TS]

01:30:43   not just a little bit wider than 16 [TS]

01:30:45   tonight it's it's a lot wider yeah i [TS]

01:30:49   mean that that's why i think the the [TS]

01:30:50   most likely explanation for this is just [TS]

01:30:54   like there's some other key piece of [TS]

01:30:56   information that we don't know you know [TS]

01:30:58   about about how the screen is used how [TS]

01:31:00   it shaped around the device you know [TS]

01:31:02   maybe like there's this like function [TS]

01:31:04   area at the bottom where presumably some [TS]

01:31:07   kind of like home button area will go [TS]

01:31:09   maybe there's one of the top also which [TS]

01:31:11   would slice off that other party aspect [TS]

01:31:13   ratio and therefore make it look right [TS]

01:31:16   who knows but these that this is getting [TS]

01:31:19   into really nitty-gritty specifics that [TS]

01:31:21   I think we probably don't have enough [TS]

01:31:24   information to really gauge you know [TS]

01:31:27   what's real here and what's not i mean [TS]

01:31:29   it's it's so early and there's no one [TS]

01:31:32   there's no other information back this [TS]

01:31:33   up besides KGI stuff which again [TS]

01:31:36   KJ stuff has been good about a lot of a [TS]

01:31:39   lot of details about stuff especially I [TS]

01:31:40   don't think on component type stuff [TS]

01:31:42   right right but all this you know all [TS]

01:31:45   this is saying is the panel resolution [TS]

01:31:48   and there's lots of things that could [TS]

01:31:51   you know effect that being correct or [TS]

01:31:54   not and and that being like how we think [TS]

01:31:56   of the screen shape on the phone or not [TS]

01:31:58   like you know little as lots of [TS]

01:32:00   flexibility it allows you know not only [TS]

01:32:02   different shape things that allows like [TS]

01:32:04   holes to be cut in panels and stuff like [TS]

01:32:06   that in the you can do all sorts of [TS]

01:32:07   crazy stuff with the letter so it could [TS]

01:32:10   be something weird that we don't that we [TS]

01:32:11   we can explain this yet with what we [TS]

01:32:13   know but it could be a much less [TS]

01:32:16   interesting story then then you know [TS]

01:32:18   oh it's going to be a new shape phone [TS]

01:32:20   you know it might just be it might look [TS]

01:32:22   like what we have now in general [TS]

01:32:24   proportions and aspect ratios and just [TS]

01:32:26   have this weird implementation detail [TS]

01:32:28   about why the screen happens to be the [TS]

01:32:30   certain resolution would you want it to [TS]

01:32:32   be that tall do you think like what if [TS]

01:32:33   it but if it really is just it's [TS]

01:32:36   as wide as a iphone 7 but tall no way [TS]

01:32:41   taller so like you see more messages in [TS]

01:32:44   a list and mail if you're reading an [TS]

01:32:46   article and seal more the article on [TS]

01:32:48   screen at once but it is the exact same [TS]

01:32:50   width as the designer of an app that has [TS]

01:32:56   to lay out a giant square in the middle [TS]

01:32:57   of its Now Playing screen that would be [TS]

01:33:00   awesome but as a user of the phone I [TS]

01:33:02   don't think I need that really i mean [TS]

01:33:03   that's it i think there's a lot of [TS]

01:33:05   advantages to the to the phone display [TS]

01:33:07   being sixteen by nine one of them is [TS]

01:33:09   when he turned sideways and shoot video [TS]

01:33:10   you have the whole screen that looks [TS]

01:33:12   right right I'm so there's a lot of [TS]

01:33:14   advantage to that a 60-mile allows you [TS]

01:33:17   to lay out a lot of different shapes [TS]

01:33:19   fairly nicely within it [TS]

01:33:21   you know squares for my three mrs. [TS]

01:33:23   so-and-so it's i don't i don't think i [TS]

01:33:27   really want the screen to be taller and [TS]

01:33:29   skinnier but who knows i mean i have to [TS]

01:33:31   actually see it and use it well the [TS]

01:33:32   screen wouldn't be any skinnier and that [TS]

01:33:34   the numbers add up so he's saying that [TS]

01:33:36   that this is his numbers for the pixel [TS]

01:33:38   resolution 2436 hi this is for the [TS]

01:33:41   display area not the whole panel but the [TS]

01:33:43   part that would be used as a display [TS]

01:33:45   area by 1125 wyd now 1125 wide is really [TS]

01:33:49   interesting because an iphone 7 and a [TS]

01:33:51   dive on 6's and the six the ones that [TS]

01:33:55   were 4.7 inches have a 375 point and at [TS]

01:34:03   2x in its and pixels it's what is 375 [TS]

01:34:06   times two [TS]

01:34:07   it's 750 yeah and so if you take 375 [TS]

01:34:12   times three [TS]

01:34:13   guess what you get 1125 so basically its [TS]

01:34:16   name is gonna have 3x it's exactly 3 X [TS]

01:34:19   so it would be the exact same point for [TS]

01:34:22   point size as the iphone 4.7 inch [TS]

01:34:25   screens that we know except instead of [TS]

01:34:26   being a 2x resolution it would be 3x and [TS]

01:34:29   unlike the plus phones it would be a [TS]

01:34:31   real 3x with no downsample what should I [TS]

01:34:35   mean that would look great as the plus [TS]

01:34:36   phones with their like you know render [TS]

01:34:39   3x scale down to 1080p that already [TS]

01:34:42   looks really nice like it isn't it isn't [TS]

01:34:45   a massive difference over 2x but it is a [TS]

01:34:47   difference and like you it [TS]

01:34:49   don't look back look nicer and III can [TS]

01:34:51   explain why i don't think i can really [TS]

01:34:53   see like the pixels for making it just [TS]

01:34:56   does look nicer [TS]

01:34:57   so you know to have it be true 3x and [TS]

01:35:00   not even have two down sampling compared [TS]

01:35:03   to what we have now in the 4.7 inch line [TS]

01:35:05   i think would look really great [TS]

01:35:06   yeah i think that like 10 years ago or [TS]

01:35:08   or prior the down sampling technique [TS]

01:35:12   even if it was technically a higher [TS]

01:35:14   resolution screen but if you downsampled [TS]

01:35:16   it might look bad i think it probably [TS]

01:35:18   would have but I think at this point the [TS]

01:35:19   pixels are so small that downsampling [TS]

01:35:21   actually makes it look better so long as [TS]

01:35:23   the actual pictures of smaller but [TS]

01:35:24   anyway this rumored phone would actually [TS]

01:35:26   be true 3x resolution which and the fact [TS]

01:35:30   that the numbers really add up makes [TS]

01:35:31   gives me makes me think that he's onto [TS]

01:35:33   something [TS]

01:35:34   yeah i think because like if these are [TS]

01:35:38   these are weird numbers to just make up [TS]

01:35:40   or two like to misinterpret you know [TS]

01:35:43   like so that there is probably something [TS]

01:35:45   here I think again the only question [TS]

01:35:47   comes down to like how are these pixels [TS]

01:35:49   actually allocated to the various screen [TS]

01:35:52   elements right and what does the app get [TS]

01:35:54   what does the system get so many right [TS]

01:35:56   exact the other last aspect of this is [TS]

01:35:59   that it seems like nobody knows what the [TS]

01:36:01   hell is going on with touch ID seems [TS]

01:36:03   like some of this stuff is like well [TS]

01:36:05   touch ID must go away because the [TS]

01:36:07   display goes all the way to the bottom [TS]

01:36:08   so there's nowhere to put the little [TS]

01:36:09   sapphire button right or wrong I think [TS]

01:36:13   so too i don't think i and i think that [TS]

01:36:16   there's a way to integrate it into the [TS]

01:36:18   screen just put in the middle you know [TS]

01:36:20   and you know clearly the move away from [TS]

01:36:24   the physical button last year to a [TS]

01:36:26   virtual button that has happened [TS]

01:36:27   feedback would play right into this but [TS]

01:36:32   then there's all these rumors also [TS]

01:36:34   rumors that they're going to use a new [TS]

01:36:35   fancy new camera to face recognition or [TS]

01:36:37   something like that I would be surprised [TS]

01:36:40   if they do that but I would be a little [TS]

01:36:41   surprised if they did it in place of [TS]

01:36:43   touch ID because I feel like touch ID [TS]

01:36:44   it's it seems like it's like a habit [TS]

01:36:47   people already have I don't feel like [TS]

01:36:48   they can't take that away [TS]

01:36:51   well I mean they again they could they [TS]

01:36:53   could try whatever they want especially [TS]

01:36:54   with all this weird high-end one that is [TS]

01:36:56   already kind of like selecting for fewer [TS]

01:36:58   buyers but but I I'm i think it's [TS]

01:37:01   unlikely i'm with you on that I mean [TS]

01:37:02   again we'll see what happens i mean we I [TS]

01:37:04   think we all thought the headphone jack [TS]

01:37:05   was unlikely to but no i didn't [TS]

01:37:07   okay yeah that's right he didn't I can't [TS]

01:37:10   wait for him to get rid of my headphone [TS]

01:37:12   jack [TS]

01:37:14   anyway that's the but I don't have the [TS]

01:37:17   energy for that 280 yeah I had the the [TS]

01:37:21   whole face recognition thing I i I'm [TS]

01:37:25   sure they wouldn't do it if they [TS]

01:37:26   couldn't do it really well right [TS]

01:37:28   the same time fingerprint where the [TS]

01:37:29   first fingerprint sensor was was pretty [TS]

01:37:31   darn good [TS]

01:37:32   yeah and like when you compared to [TS]

01:37:33   previous fingerprint sensors at the time [TS]

01:37:36   they were all really awkward and [TS]

01:37:38   garbagey and Apple came out with a [TS]

01:37:39   really good one and now they're all [TS]

01:37:41   pretty you know they're all apparently [TS]

01:37:43   used to be [TS]

01:37:43   yeah I you know people saying now that [TS]

01:37:45   they're like face recognition on their [TS]

01:37:47   samsung whatever whatever it was was [TS]

01:37:49   crappy [TS]

01:37:50   I think again like I don't see Apple [TS]

01:37:53   doing this unless they could do really [TS]

01:37:55   well so I wouldn't worry too much about [TS]

01:37:57   what these things have been like in the [TS]

01:37:59   past other people but I still despite [TS]

01:38:02   saying that I still think it's pretty [TS]

01:38:03   unlikely that this is what they have in [TS]

01:38:06   mind just because it it doesn't sound [TS]

01:38:08   like it would be better it sounds like [TS]

01:38:09   it would be worse [TS]

01:38:10   yeah i guess the other thing too is that [TS]

01:38:13   when i first heard these rumors a few [TS]

01:38:15   months ago I was really really skeptical [TS]

01:38:17   because it again same thing with the [TS]

01:38:19   ipad for it so on a typical for Apple to [TS]

01:38:22   introduce two generations of new stuff [TS]

01:38:25   at the same time write like that if they [TS]

01:38:28   do this the 7s and sevens plus are [TS]

01:38:30   totally going to get lost because they [TS]

01:38:31   are they're debuting his mid-range [TS]

01:38:33   phones and that just hasn't happened [TS]

01:38:35   before and the other aspect is that [TS]

01:38:39   Apple has had so much success since the [TS]

01:38:41   iphone 6 by selling to size phones it [TS]

01:38:44   really three sighs so if you count the [TS]

01:38:46   SC which is obviously a support price [TS]

01:38:48   hit I mean they've admitted yet they [TS]

01:38:50   underestimated demand for that so [TS]

01:38:54   multiple sizes of proven so popular why [TS]

01:38:56   in the world would they come out with a [TS]

01:38:57   brand-new design at only one size [TS]

01:39:00   but when you do all the math and think [TS]

01:39:03   about this [TS]

01:39:03   it's actually a pretty good-sized to be [TS]

01:39:06   a one-size-fits-all because it's you [TS]

01:39:10   know the usable display area is four [TS]

01:39:13   point five point four or five inches [TS]

01:39:15   more than the 4.7 inch phone diagonally [TS]

01:39:19   8.35 inches less than 5.5 inch phone [TS]

01:39:24   yes it was right in the middle right in [TS]

01:39:25   the middle and the end errors a little [TS]

01:39:27   bit on the bigger side [TS]

01:39:28   yeah but physically in hand it's [TS]

01:39:31   narrower than the 4.7 inch phone which [TS]

01:39:34   is to me the biggest factor of what [TS]

01:39:35   makes the iphone SE so so nice to hold [TS]

01:39:37   is that exam narrow so in terms of like [TS]

01:39:41   well you like something that fits in [TS]

01:39:43   your hand really securely and that you [TS]

01:39:45   can go from side to side with your thumb [TS]

01:39:47   and you like the fit more information on [TS]

01:39:50   screen at once like an iphone 7 plus and [TS]

01:39:53   the last aspect to all these rumors is [TS]

01:39:55   that it's supposedly going to have a [TS]

01:39:57   iphone 7 plus caliber at least in the [TS]

01:40:03   general range battery as opposed to the [TS]

01:40:05   4.7 because that's the other factor i [TS]

01:40:07   mean i know it i mean there's some [TS]

01:40:08   people who just love the big phone and [TS]

01:40:10   you and I both know people who have the [TS]

01:40:12   seven plus and they don't even like the [TS]

01:40:14   size but they do everything I think [TS]

01:40:15   you're even talking about it where the [TS]

01:40:17   battery life Allah is sometimes a reason [TS]

01:40:19   enough to get it like I yeah it doesn't [TS]

01:40:22   fit my pocket just too big to hold but I [TS]

01:40:26   could use it all day and still have [TS]

01:40:27   battery life at the end of the day [TS]

01:40:29   although to be fair that was a lot more [TS]

01:40:31   true of the six versus six plus it has [TS]

01:40:34   been of the of the success or seven [TS]

01:40:36   generations like the gap is now smaller [TS]

01:40:37   yeah and to the point where now like the [TS]

01:40:40   battery life on the seven is actually [TS]

01:40:42   pretty decent and on the seven plus it [TS]

01:40:44   is better but it's not better by as much [TS]

01:40:47   as it used to be in the previous ones [TS]

01:40:48   yeah it'sit's gotta say it's for it [TS]

01:40:50   the seven has the best battery life for [TS]

01:40:52   me I think of any iphone I've ever had [TS]

01:40:54   yeah me too the only time i ever get [TS]

01:40:57   down in a red is on days when I somehow [TS]

01:40:59   had been a circumstance where I didn't [TS]

01:41:01   even start the day with a hundred [TS]

01:41:02   percent [TS]

01:41:03   which is rare because usually I sleep [TS]

01:41:05   with the charging but anyway [TS]

01:41:08   alright let me take another break here [TS]

01:41:10   and thank our third and final sponsor of [TS]

01:41:13   the day do you think it's a guess [TS]

01:41:17   hmm Casper Squarespace however we gotta [TS]

01:41:22   become I guess 1m going to squarespace [TS]

01:41:25   up Casper ah Casper you guys know Casper [TS]

01:41:29   the obsessively engineered mattress and [TS]

01:41:32   they sell it and shockingly fair price [TS]

01:41:34   go to Casper com /d talk show and use [TS]

01:41:37   that code the talk show and you'll save [TS]

01:41:38   50 bucks towards any mattress insert x [TS]

01:41:42   asterisk right there there's a footnote [TS]

01:41:44   you have to wait for it [TS]

01:41:45   here's the different conditions to apply [TS]

01:41:46   Casper to me is it's it's like an [TS]

01:41:50   apple-like company where to me [TS]

01:41:52   design is making decisions and they've [TS]

01:41:56   designed one perfect mattress you don't [TS]

01:41:59   go to casper and select from like six [TS]

01:42:02   different types of mattress and then get [TS]

01:42:04   the size you want now you just pick the [TS]

01:42:05   size you want that's it and then they [TS]

01:42:07   send it to you and it's one perfect [TS]

01:42:08   mattress they've engineered they have [TS]

01:42:09   mattress engineers that's a real thing [TS]

01:42:11   they spent a lot of money in time to get [TS]

01:42:13   one mattress that's just is the right [TS]

01:42:16   mattress for most people [TS]

01:42:18   combination of support of memory foam [TS]

01:42:20   and all sorts of other technology ships [TS]

01:42:25   to you in a little box it's about it's [TS]

01:42:28   the size of like a little like like a [TS]

01:42:30   little dorm room refrigerator or maybe a [TS]

01:42:32   little bigger than that but remarkably [TS]

01:42:33   small for a big mattress you put in your [TS]

01:42:35   bedroom you open a box following their [TS]

01:42:38   instructions it sucks all the air out of [TS]

01:42:40   the room to fill the mattress so you do [TS]

01:42:42   you get lightheaded when you do it and [TS]

01:42:44   you'll get kind of get dizzy but it's [TS]

01:42:47   fun to be in a room and it happens it [TS]

01:42:49   makes a very cool sound and then boom [TS]

01:42:51   you've got great mattress [TS]

01:42:53   I say it all the time it's going to a [TS]

01:42:55   mattress store is gross because what you [TS]

01:42:57   want to do you want to sit on a bed that [TS]

01:42:58   all sorts of other people have come in [TS]

01:43:00   and sat on and later on and whatever and [TS]

01:43:02   laying honored mattress with bright [TS]

01:43:05   fluorescent lights and a mattress store [TS]

01:43:06   doesn't stimulate sleep so the fact that [TS]

01:43:09   you can actually sit on a mattress in a [TS]

01:43:11   retail store it doesn't really give you [TS]

01:43:12   any better hint of whether you're gonna [TS]

01:43:13   like the mattress you buy anyway so why [TS]

01:43:15   he just trusts Casper buy it but next [TS]

01:43:18   time you need a mattress they give you a [TS]

01:43:19   hundred knight home trial if you don't [TS]

01:43:21   love it they'll just give me a ring or [TS]

01:43:23   go to the web site they'll pick it up at [TS]

01:43:25   your house and give you a full refund no [TS]

01:43:27   questions asked no hard sell this is not [TS]

01:43:29   like it's not like sending your cable [TS]

01:43:31   box back and cord-cutting where they do [TS]

01:43:34   seem like a Gestapo after you get to [TS]

01:43:36   really keep you now they're just say [TS]

01:43:38   okay sure [TS]

01:43:38   sorry you know here's your money back [TS]

01:43:40   we'll come pick up the matters [TS]

01:43:42   here's the asterisk they also sell a dog [TS]

01:43:44   matters and i keep hearing from people [TS]

01:43:45   who bought it for the daughter dogs [TS]

01:43:47   didn't know that [TS]

01:43:48   yeah they have a dog mattress and it's [TS]

01:43:50   very very popular people who've got if [TS]

01:43:53   listeners are the show have gotten it [TS]

01:43:54   love it but here's the deal you don't [TS]

01:43:56   save the 50 bucks on it because it's [TS]

01:43:58   like a lower-cost mattress and this is [TS]

01:44:00   the gist of it is I got a whole bunch of [TS]

01:44:01   emails from people who bought the dog [TS]

01:44:03   mattress and then they said hey I just [TS]

01:44:04   wanted to say i love the mattress my dog [TS]

01:44:06   loves it but the 50 bucks code didn't [TS]

01:44:08   work [TS]

01:44:08   i botched the first time they had the [TS]

01:44:10   dog matters so anyway go to Casper [TS]

01:44:12   constantly talk show remember that code [TS]

01:44:13   the talkshow state 50 bucks toward your [TS]

01:44:15   mattress unless it's a dog mattress but [TS]

01:44:17   you'll get 50 bucks the love from your [TS]

01:44:19   dog that will that will make up for it [TS]

01:44:21   oh yeah alright when we talk about [TS]

01:44:25   overcast overcast three point out just [TS]

01:44:27   shipped yesterday and the update i knew [TS]

01:44:31   you were working on this but I somehow [TS]

01:44:33   had no idea that it was that close to [TS]

01:44:35   shipping i think i was even on the beta [TS]

01:44:37   was I on the patient yeah you were [TS]

01:44:40   definitely on the list I don't know if [TS]

01:44:41   you actually ever installed it but you [TS]

01:44:43   were on the list i think i did i think i [TS]

01:44:44   remember my overcast having the orange [TS]

01:44:46   dot next to it but I don't [TS]

01:44:48   I'd I never remember Denny I I'd I [TS]

01:44:51   remember the switch the cards and [TS]

01:44:53   talking to you about it and i remember [TS]

01:44:54   playing with the slide on the car this [TS]

01:44:57   was months ago though [TS]

01:44:58   and.and you had it really when i was [TS]

01:45:00   when i was in philly i showed you a [TS]

01:45:01   prototype and override you play without [TS]

01:45:03   my phone what you thought hops in right [TS]

01:45:05   we're in ops and yeah i was playing with [TS]

01:45:07   my head and it was already did the [TS]

01:45:08   prototype was very very good i had very [TS]

01:45:11   minor feedback but it was I could even [TS]

01:45:13   find anything to complain about [TS]

01:45:15   I forget what i wrote today that i write [TS]

01:45:18   this today i know i wrote a bit about [TS]

01:45:19   the business model but then I write [TS]

01:45:21   about how if you do casual user not [TS]

01:45:23   paying attention isn't going to be even [TS]

01:45:25   know yet [TS]

01:45:25   that's my two points is that it's a [TS]

01:45:28   great update because it all these things [TS]

01:45:30   every single thing you documented on [TS]

01:45:32   your blog about the changes i think [TS]

01:45:34   every single one of them it's like yes I [TS]

01:45:36   totally agree this is better this is [TS]

01:45:37   better this is better but i think a [TS]

01:45:39   casual person who just wants to listen [TS]

01:45:40   to podcast they they been if they have [TS]

01:45:42   like auto updates on they may not even [TS]

01:45:43   notice that but it's a new version [TS]

01:45:46   yeah it's it's odd because here I was [TS]

01:45:49   like you know really blessed in my [TS]

01:45:52   button and just changing all that was a [TS]

01:45:54   lot of work going into these changes and [TS]

01:45:57   overcast three and then at the end when [TS]

01:46:00   it comes time to like you know right the [TS]

01:46:01   release notes and start like promoting [TS]

01:46:04   it to people and all right well what's [TS]

01:46:06   the list of new features and 31 out and [TS]

01:46:09   it's like uh i redesigned a lot of the [TS]

01:46:13   UI that's about it [TS]

01:46:16   there's like there's like a couple like [TS]

01:46:17   you features here and there but it's and [TS]

01:46:19   there's a new watch app that's which is [TS]

01:46:21   actually does less the old one but is [TS]

01:46:23   way faster and that's about it like the [TS]

01:46:28   the bullet point list of what is new [TS]

01:46:30   this update is incredibly short unless [TS]

01:46:32   you want to go through like itemized all [TS]

01:46:34   the UI changes but nobody wants to read [TS]

01:46:36   that because nobody cares what you care [TS]

01:46:37   about is the whole thing like how how [TS]

01:46:39   the whole thing feels works for you and [TS]

01:46:41   everything else and there were tons of [TS]

01:46:43   changes and tons of of time that went [TS]

01:46:47   into this that most of which is fairly [TS]

01:46:50   subtle or hidden or is the kind of [TS]

01:46:53   change that you notice the very first [TS]

01:46:55   day use it and then it just becomes [TS]

01:46:57   normal and you you immediately stopped [TS]

01:46:59   noticing it exits that's how this [TS]

01:47:01   happens now and and you know and things [TS]

01:47:04   like you know the whole the card you I [TS]

01:47:06   took forever to get work at six so long [TS]

01:47:11   and and so much work and there and there [TS]

01:47:14   are still so many weird little [TS]

01:47:15   considerations with it like one of the [TS]

01:47:18   things i had to issue a quick [TS]

01:47:21   three-point appoint one update because I [TS]

01:47:24   i moved all of the like secondary [TS]

01:47:26   screens in the app into these cards I [TS]

01:47:28   have [TS]

01:47:28   the reusable controller that i can use [TS]

01:47:31   for anything now to put in one of these [TS]

01:47:33   cards and the problem is that when a run [TS]

01:47:36   iOS standard table view is in one of [TS]

01:47:39   these cards in certain modes the reorder [TS]

01:47:44   controls like the drag handles and [TS]

01:47:45   you're gonna tables and reordering mode [TS]

01:47:47   just don't work like it moves like you [TS]

01:47:50   know two pixels and stops and it's only [TS]

01:47:52   because it's in this card environment [TS]

01:47:54   and a few a few of the implementation [TS]

01:47:56   details of that and so I had to asian or [TS]

01:47:59   another day today that just moved the [TS]

01:48:01   playlist editor out of out of the cards [TS]

01:48:04   because I otherwise you can reorder the [TS]

01:48:06   priority podcast setting it's like we [TS]

01:48:08   like and when I was developed there were [TS]

01:48:10   so many weird cases like this where like [TS]

01:48:12   some some part of the you i would fail [TS]

01:48:17   in a weird way if it was moved to this [TS]

01:48:19   card thing and and so I had to either [TS]

01:48:21   try to figure out why it seemed like a [TS]

01:48:22   work around it or we implemented in a [TS]

01:48:24   different way so it wouldn't fail and [TS]

01:48:26   that's just that's just what you know [TS]

01:48:28   this that car thing is just one of the [TS]

01:48:30   changes and they were just so like I [TS]

01:48:34   mean just so many so much time going [TS]

01:48:37   into seemingly minor things like that [TS]

01:48:39   even other things like the full-time [TS]

01:48:42   drag handles now on the playlist that is [TS]

01:48:45   not easy to do in uitableview know I [TS]

01:48:48   know that I did it [TS]

01:48:50   it's not a collection of you it is still [TS]

01:48:52   a table view and the way I did it is [TS]

01:48:54   such an incredible hack and that took a [TS]

01:48:58   long time to similarly like having [TS]

01:49:00   having like the teapot style where you [TS]

01:49:03   tap on the episode and a little row of [TS]

01:49:06   buttons expands out from the bottom of [TS]

01:49:07   it that you can then select actions from [TS]

01:49:09   again [TS]

01:49:10   Oh a seemingly small thing in the UI but [TS]

01:49:13   that takes a long time to implement and [TS]

01:49:16   to figure out how you have to abuse the [TS]

01:49:18   system frameworks to let them let you do [TS]

01:49:20   this like it's all like and you know you [TS]

01:49:23   know from vesper stuff like a lot of [TS]

01:49:26   times it's these little tiny [TS]

01:49:27   implementation details of these little [TS]

01:49:28   tiny interactions are you I affordances [TS]

01:49:32   that they make all the difference in the [TS]

01:49:33   world when you're using the app in like [TS]

01:49:35   how nice it is to use or how easy this [TS]

01:49:36   team knows but like one of those [TS]

01:49:39   little-little behaviors are little [TS]

01:49:41   animations are [TS]

01:49:42   limitations might take you weeks to [TS]

01:49:45   develop that one little thing its it is [TS]

01:49:49   my opinion that the modern touch screen [TS]

01:49:54   you I that was that started with the [TS]

01:49:58   iphone is trickier and inherently more [TS]

01:50:03   limited interaction model then the mouse [TS]

01:50:09   pointer interface that we've had since [TS]

01:50:12   you know the mac and be you know go back [TS]

01:50:15   to the Xerox thing that was before the [TS]

01:50:18   mac in a lot of ways so just and I think [TS]

01:50:22   that most people don't think about it [TS]

01:50:24   you don't have to that you shouldn't [TS]

01:50:25   have to if you're not a designer but [TS]

01:50:26   when you are designer you suddenly [TS]

01:50:27   realize that you're you're limited in a [TS]

01:50:30   certain way and so for example like this [TS]

01:50:32   to say a list of things you have a list [TS]

01:50:34   of rows and you can drag them to reorder [TS]

01:50:37   it just all sorts of apps that do stuff [TS]

01:50:39   like this on a Mac you would think well [TS]

01:50:44   I could just click on the row i want to [TS]

01:50:45   move up and hold the mouse button down [TS]

01:50:47   and drag up and that's exactly how you [TS]

01:50:49   do it you click on it and drag and you [TS]

01:50:52   don't have to click and wait you just [TS]

01:50:53   you could click and wait and then drag [TS]

01:50:55   or you can just click and drag [TS]

01:50:56   immediately and it just works but you [TS]

01:50:59   can't do that on a touchscreen because [TS]

01:51:01   if you're in a list and you just touch [TS]

01:51:04   and immediately move down or move up [TS]

01:51:05   your scrolling the list because touching [TS]

01:51:08   on the list and move and moving your [TS]

01:51:10   finger is how you do it so how do you [TS]

01:51:12   take an item and move it up if you can't [TS]

01:51:15   just touch on it and move up so it's you [TS]

01:51:19   can have like a modifier he'll just hold [TS]

01:51:20   down command the end the truth is [TS]

01:51:22   there's no perfect solution [TS]

01:51:24   there's a perfect solution with a mouse [TS]

01:51:25   pointer which is just allow the user to [TS]

01:51:27   click and drag on on touchscreens i [TS]

01:51:31   could think that there's three ways I [TS]

01:51:32   can think to do it [TS]

01:51:33   Apple's usual way is to have an edit [TS]

01:51:36   button in the top-right that you tap [TS]

01:51:38   this edit button and then it switches it [TS]

01:51:42   to a mode where there's like a little [TS]

01:51:43   grippy strip over there and you can use [TS]

01:51:45   that grip nice trip to drag things up [TS]

01:51:47   and down and if you touch on the grippy [TS]

01:51:49   strip and drag it won't scroll the list [TS]

01:51:51   it will drag the thing up [TS]

01:51:52   the way Vesper did it and a lot of other [TS]

01:51:54   apps to do is you tap and hold and after [TS]

01:51:57   a brief and you know again this is the [TS]

01:51:59   sort of thing where you sit there and [TS]

01:52:00   you play with little fractions of a [TS]

01:52:02   second to see how long is too short how [TS]

01:52:04   long is too long but you know your drag [TS]

01:52:06   you know you're moving it because it [TS]

01:52:08   visually pops up off the screen and you [TS]

01:52:10   can see that it's sort of like raised [TS]

01:52:12   and then you're you're moving the item [TS]

01:52:14   up and down i like the solution you came [TS]

01:52:17   with we just put the grips trips there [TS]

01:52:19   all the time and so you can't scroll the [TS]

01:52:21   list from over at the edge of the screen [TS]

01:52:23   but you know most of it you can [TS]

01:52:26   yeah and most people don't scroll that [TS]

01:52:28   far the edge anyway so it's fine because [TS]

01:52:30   you know what I found like I i made this [TS]

01:52:32   whole blog post about like and actually [TS]

01:52:35   looking at this this blog post was the [TS]

01:52:37   release of overcast through and kind of [TS]

01:52:39   the announcement of overcast three but i [TS]

01:52:41   titled it design walkthrough because [TS]

01:52:43   this really like this release really was [TS]

01:52:45   effectively a redesign you know not like [TS]

01:52:48   not like a hundred percent redesign a [TS]

01:52:50   lot of things look kind of similar or [TS]

01:52:51   the same but there's a lot more [TS]

01:52:54   redesigning than anything else in this [TS]

01:52:55   release and and it's because you know [TS]

01:52:58   over the last couple years since I said [TS]

01:53:00   one point out like I've gotten literally [TS]

01:53:03   thousands of emails and tweets from [TS]

01:53:06   people with feedback and some you know [TS]

01:53:08   support questions this badly i've seen i [TS]

01:53:11   basically had a lot of feedback to show [TS]

01:53:13   me all the ways in which the old design [TS]

01:53:14   failed and by that but I mean like you [TS]

01:53:17   know people weren't able to find [TS]

01:53:19   features that they wanted to find they [TS]

01:53:21   couldn't understand the way something [TS]

01:53:23   worked or something caused errors two [TS]

01:53:26   and people due to air honestly invoke it [TS]

01:53:28   or things like that and so they were one [TS]

01:53:33   of them one of the major themes i [TS]

01:53:34   learned over the last couple years is [TS]

01:53:36   these built-in iOS standards things like [TS]

01:53:41   tapping edit in the top right corner and [TS]

01:53:43   then having a tableview switch its mode [TS]

01:53:45   where you can delete or reorder or batch [TS]

01:53:48   operate on on things in a list or even [TS]

01:53:51   just swiping a table cell to delete it [TS]

01:53:54   these things that you know we like power [TS]

01:53:57   users have known literally since iOS 1.0 [TS]

01:54:00   introduced most of them most people who [TS]

01:54:03   use iphones these days don't know those [TS]

01:54:06   things [TS]

01:54:06   they'll never find that they don't know [TS]

01:54:08   you can swipe on the table for you to [TS]

01:54:09   reveal delete button right they don't [TS]

01:54:11   they don't they never tap the edit [TS]

01:54:13   button in the corner and if they if they [TS]

01:54:14   do they quickly undo it because they [TS]

01:54:16   don't really understand what it doesn't [TS]

01:54:17   care so there's lots of like kind of [TS]

01:54:22   assumed knowledge of platform standards [TS]

01:54:26   that i went into with this that I think [TS]

01:54:27   a lot of iOS developer still do that the [TS]

01:54:30   reality is the customers don't have that [TS]

01:54:33   vocabulary in enough quantity [TS]

01:54:35   yeah i think that you can only really [TS]

01:54:37   count on them finding what they can see [TS]

01:54:40   exactly right and if you can't if the [TS]

01:54:43   only way to do it is is a way that you [TS]

01:54:45   don't see you have to do something to [TS]

01:54:47   see it like slide the row they won't [TS]

01:54:49   find it [TS]

01:54:50   that's why you know if you look at an [TS]

01:54:51   app like I think it's super successful [TS]

01:54:53   app is an app like apples mail for [TS]

01:54:56   iphone that's why there's a trash can [TS]

01:54:57   when you're in a message for you but [TS]

01:55:00   also why why you can swipe on the [TS]

01:55:02   message in the list of messages and [TS]

01:55:03   delete it from there [TS]

01:55:04   yeah but that trashcan has to be there [TS]

01:55:08   because asked me would be shocked to [TS]

01:55:10   find out that you can delete a message [TS]

01:55:11   any other way because like even you [TS]

01:55:14   don't even like the edit button in the [TS]

01:55:16   corner that is visible but it's not even [TS]

01:55:18   obvious enough like what it does or why [TS]

01:55:21   you like if you're in a list like what [TS]

01:55:23   does that even mean to edit in the [TS]

01:55:25   corner of this entire last episode like [TS]

01:55:27   what like a lot of people just don't [TS]

01:55:29   think that way they don't they don't try [TS]

01:55:31   to to poke everything and CEO what is [TS]

01:55:33   what is this weird word do that I that [TS]

01:55:36   doesn't seem to specify anything in [TS]

01:55:38   particular I hate to spring this on you [TS]

01:55:40   but alright i'm in all episodes and [TS]

01:55:44   there is an edit button up there [TS]

01:55:45   yeah I don't know their I don't [TS]

01:55:47   understand what it does i had it and [TS]

01:55:50   then it says done and it just toggles [TS]

01:55:52   between edit and done but what's [TS]

01:55:53   different [TS]

01:55:54   do you actually have the latest version [TS]

01:55:57   i think so because normal what's [TS]

01:55:59   supposed to happen is if you hit it [TS]

01:56:01   you're supposed to get a little head on [TS]

01:56:02   top that says edit play less than [TS]

01:56:03   one-half and delete playlist on the [TS]

01:56:05   other half and then all the rows turn [TS]

01:56:08   into the multi-select toggle dots on the [TS]

01:56:09   right maybe I don't have the latest [TS]

01:56:11   version [TS]

01:56:13   I don't know I thought I updated to the [TS]

01:56:15   abstract version let me see if I make a [TS]

01:56:18   new playlist [TS]

01:56:19   I mean you might have found a bug but i [TS]

01:56:20   might have our not supposed to work but [TS]

01:56:23   anyway i agree with you though [TS]

01:56:30   what about the so the other factor and [TS]

01:56:35   we talked about it and and one of the [TS]

01:56:36   things that let you do this and you and [TS]

01:56:38   I have had discussions about this over [TS]

01:56:39   the years you know that going back to [TS]

01:56:41   Vesper and and overcast and that ok but [TS]

01:56:46   let's just give up the end of the old [TS]

01:56:47   model for indeed software developers is [TS]

01:56:49   you free apps for you sell a version [TS]

01:56:52   let's say it's thirty dollars and then [TS]

01:56:54   you do version to point out and you [TS]

01:56:56   still sell it for thirty dollars but you [TS]

01:56:58   give your existing users and upgrade [TS]

01:56:59   price maybe they get it for half off [TS]

01:57:01   maybe they get the new version for 1499 [TS]

01:57:03   maybe you sell it the upgrade for just [TS]

01:57:05   999 but then the idea is you keep [TS]

01:57:07   building users and the ones who stood [TS]

01:57:10   keep using the app will every year or [TS]

01:57:13   however often you come out with a major [TS]

01:57:14   upgrade keep giving you upgrade money [TS]

01:57:18   and that's what funds did continued [TS]

01:57:23   development of the app because [TS]

01:57:24   eventually you stop getting it you know [TS]

01:57:27   you you max out on new users and you [TS]

01:57:30   need to monetize your existing user base [TS]

01:57:32   well there's no upgrades in the app [TS]

01:57:33   store and so new models are called for [TS]

01:57:37   if you want to sustain a nap [TS]

01:57:40   I I think you've come across an [TS]

01:57:43   interesting one because that the [TS]

01:57:44   downside to the old model and as much as [TS]

01:57:46   everybody you know I still kind of wish [TS]

01:57:49   the appstore supported and allowed users [TS]

01:57:50   the other developers the option of doing [TS]

01:57:52   it [TS]

01:57:53   the downside to it is that everybody [TS]

01:57:55   seems to agree that the way you know it [TS]

01:57:58   most cases people would decide whether [TS]

01:58:00   to buy the upgrade to the new app or not [TS]

01:58:02   based on what are the new features and [TS]

01:58:05   so like that [TS]

01:58:06   overcast three like when you say that [TS]

01:58:08   it's hard to say like here's all the new [TS]

01:58:09   features it may not sell as a paid [TS]

01:58:13   upgrade because we're just what it's [TS]

01:58:15   just a modernized you know version of [TS]

01:58:19   the same UI [TS]

01:58:22   to me this is the sort of thing I like [TS]

01:58:24   I'm glad to pay for because it's exactly [TS]

01:58:27   what i want a nap because like if you if [TS]

01:58:30   you do it the other way like wherewhere [TS]

01:58:32   you're dependent on that upgrade revenue [TS]

01:58:33   for new features ever release then you [TS]

01:58:36   get microsoft office where you have like [TS]

01:58:38   there's there's all this pressure to [TS]

01:58:40   just add more and more and more features [TS]

01:58:42   even if it kind of makes the app worse [TS]

01:58:45   to have more features added to it but [TS]

01:58:47   that's the way that's what the incentive [TS]

01:58:48   structure kind of forces you to do and [TS]

01:58:51   that's why that's one of the reasons why [TS]

01:58:53   you see these major apps like office and [TS]

01:58:56   adobe creative suite trying to get away [TS]

01:58:58   from that model moving towards [TS]

01:58:59   descriptions so aggressively over the [TS]

01:59:01   last few years and I think they've both [TS]

01:59:02   pretty much completed that move [TS]

01:59:03   yeah we're like you know now they're [TS]

01:59:06   kind of free to do things better [TS]

01:59:09   yeah supposed to like the old model of [TS]

01:59:11   like having having to try to justify [TS]

01:59:13   your revenue every single year with like [TS]

01:59:15   eight bullet list of features that you [TS]

01:59:17   added right it just it eventually even [TS]

01:59:21   the it [TS]

01:59:23   however much it was ever in dispute [TS]

01:59:24   within those companies it becomes [TS]

01:59:26   obvious to everybody that it's not [TS]

01:59:27   sustainable forever [TS]

01:59:28   you can't just keep adding more and [TS]

01:59:30   consistent and and assume that that [TS]

01:59:32   means better when you can for a while [TS]

01:59:35   like you know if it and it's generally [TS]

01:59:37   when things are young so when when the [TS]

01:59:40   applications are young or like you know [TS]

01:59:43   in the case of like you know Adobe and [TS]

01:59:45   Microsoft a lot of their revenue came [TS]

01:59:47   from people like you know os's were [TS]

01:59:51   still young right and as os's would [TS]

01:59:53   change you have to get the new versions [TS]

01:59:55   of the app students work on the new OS [TS]

01:59:56   computers were still young you be buying [TS]

01:59:59   like a new computer [TS]

01:59:59   like a new computer [TS]

02:00:00   enter every three to five years or [TS]

02:00:01   whatever it was that would be so [TS]

02:00:03   different from your old one and so much [TS]

02:00:05   better that you would buy new software [TS]

02:00:07   to take advantage of it or whatever and [TS]

02:00:09   like now everything is a lot more [TS]

02:00:10   settled down in these in these [TS]

02:00:11   industries and it's true mobile as well [TS]

02:00:13   like you know the upgrade cycle getting [TS]

02:00:14   longer for these things and and all the [TS]

02:00:17   OS is our kind of settling down and and [TS]

02:00:19   maturing and so the end and all these [TS]

02:00:22   and if you if you've had any kind of you [TS]

02:00:25   know long-standing problem in hell my [TS]

02:00:27   podcast app is only like two and a half [TS]

02:00:30   years old and I'm already running out of [TS]

02:00:32   features i think i want to add to it [TS]

02:00:35   like there's that a certain point you [TS]

02:00:37   you add pretty much everything that you [TS]

02:00:39   think it needs and its kind of done [TS]

02:00:43   feature wise but that doesn't mean it [TS]

02:00:45   can't be improved right so what you've [TS]

02:00:47   arrived at after like you know again [TS]

02:00:51   you've you've changed it suddenly with [TS]

02:00:54   each major release but where you are now [TS]

02:00:55   is it's a free download so anybody can [TS]

02:00:59   get it try the overcast for free which i [TS]

02:01:02   think is a essential in today's world is [TS]

02:01:04   been free since day 1i I'm I don't [TS]

02:01:06   regret that format right well i think [TS]

02:01:07   you and i think it did proven right and [TS]

02:01:10   because it's it's it's just you know [TS]

02:01:13   I've said this before but I'd really do [TS]

02:01:15   think it's true that when people there's [TS]

02:01:17   just too many people who with their [TS]

02:01:22   looking for a podcast app or they're [TS]

02:01:23   looking for a note app or whatever the [TS]

02:01:25   app is they'll start looking and they [TS]

02:01:28   will start trying freeones and [TS]

02:01:31   eventually one of the free ones [TS]

02:01:33   well I guess this is good enough and [TS]

02:01:35   that I'd never get past that they never [TS]

02:01:37   get past it even if your app is [TS]

02:01:38   ninety-nine cents [TS]

02:01:40   there's just too many people who never [TS]

02:01:41   ever say I'm gonna try I'm gonna I'm [TS]

02:01:43   gonna cough up a dollar before I even [TS]

02:01:45   try it just because the screenshots look [TS]

02:01:47   good [TS]

02:01:48   I mean some people will but it's not [TS]

02:01:49   enough and you know there's too many [TS]

02:01:51   free ones and there's too many free ones [TS]

02:01:53   that really are good enough [TS]

02:01:54   yeah well anyway there's that there's [TS]

02:01:56   that saying like you're always fighting [TS]

02:01:57   the last war like right I I apologize to [TS]

02:02:00   John Syracuse for butchering that but I [TS]

02:02:03   went out when i was running into paper [TS]

02:02:04   it was never free during the time i ran [TS]

02:02:07   i was paid upfront the whole time right [TS]

02:02:09   i was really adamant about that had just [TS]

02:02:11   had to be paid upfront that's how you [TS]

02:02:12   have to make revenue [TS]

02:02:13   and that was okay for the first couple [TS]

02:02:16   years of the app store but then every [TS]

02:02:20   competitor i got from that point forward [TS]

02:02:22   what they were all free right like every [TS]

02:02:24   every major competitor was free and i [TS]

02:02:27   would and then Apple made reading list [TS]

02:02:29   which was free of course because [TS]

02:02:30   built-in and it's just like I really was [TS]

02:02:34   marginalized by to a large degree by all [TS]

02:02:39   of my competitors being free and and by [TS]

02:02:42   the platform having this thing for free [TS]

02:02:43   and by my appt having a big pay wall in [TS]

02:02:46   front of it before anybody could even [TS]

02:02:47   try it [TS]

02:02:48   and so that's one of the reasons why and [TS]

02:02:51   I was always afraid that a new [TS]

02:02:55   competitor would come out that would be [TS]

02:02:56   awesome and free because I i didn't have [TS]

02:03:00   that for a long time and and so like it [TS]

02:03:04   was like every morning I would wake up [TS]

02:03:06   afraid to look at the news on my phone [TS]

02:03:08   because what if today was the day of my [TS]

02:03:10   business was crushed by a new awesome [TS]

02:03:12   free competitor and so with overcast [TS]

02:03:14   longs to free bit in part out of that [TS]

02:03:17   because I was just like you know what I [TS]

02:03:18   don't want to leave [TS]

02:03:19   I don't want to leave that gap for [TS]

02:03:20   anybody like I don't want to I don't [TS]

02:03:22   wanna wake up every morning with that [TS]

02:03:23   fear [TS]

02:03:23   well you also have the advantage though [TS]

02:03:25   and I i mean it that it's an advantage [TS]

02:03:28   that Apple already had the podcast app [TS]

02:03:30   exactly i was pretty sure locked and so [TS]

02:03:33   like I en so it was it and that was a [TS]

02:03:36   big reason why I was free because you [TS]

02:03:38   know AI didn't want to leave you know [TS]

02:03:39   what Apple calls a price umbrella have [TS]

02:03:41   44 you know competitors to to beat me [TS]

02:03:44   only on pricing if you want to beat me [TS]

02:03:46   on quality fine i doubt play that game i [TS]

02:03:48   will happily fight on that on that [TS]

02:03:51   battlefront but I didn't want price to [TS]

02:03:54   be the only thing people could compete [TS]

02:03:56   with me or I'd rather I didn't want to [TS]

02:03:58   be losing a lot of customers to someone [TS]

02:04:01   else because of price i think you and i [TS]

02:04:02   always was in the paper and and it [TS]

02:04:04   killed me and so and i was at the time I [TS]

02:04:07   was not a good enough business person in [TS]

02:04:10   this regard to recognize at the time [TS]

02:04:12   that I should have gone free and figure [TS]

02:04:13   out something else back then but in the [TS]

02:04:15   meantime I kind of figured that out and [TS]

02:04:17   that's why i launched because i think [TS]

02:04:18   you had an advantage that podcast apples [TS]

02:04:21   podcast app isn't all it always has been [