89: Lazy Sunday


00:00:00   this is hypercritical a weekly talk show [TS]

00:00:08   ruminating on exactly what is wrong in [TS]

00:00:09   the world of Apple and related [TS]

00:00:10   technologies and businesses nothing is [TS]

00:00:13   so perfect that it can't be complained [TS]

00:00:15   about shows hosted of course by your [TS]

00:00:19   friend in mind John Syracuse and by me [TS]

00:00:21   I'm Dan Benjamin today is Sunday what [TS]

00:00:23   sunday october fourteenth 2012 it's [TS]

00:00:25   episode number 89 we'd like to say [TS]

00:00:29   thanks very much to our three sponsors [TS]

00:00:31   help spot.com hover com and source bits [TS]

00:00:36   dot com tell me more about them as the [TS]

00:00:39   show progresses we would also like to [TS]

00:00:41   say thank you very very much to our [TS]

00:00:44   friends over cash fly.com these guys [TS]

00:00:46   provide our bandwidth for this month [TS]

00:00:49   they're the most reliable CDN in the [TS]

00:00:51   business don't believe me did your [TS]

00:00:53   download come fast from five by five [TS]

00:00:55   that's because they host all of this [TS]

00:00:56   stuff there are CDN and we love them you [TS]

00:00:59   can go to cash flow calm to learn more [TS]

00:01:01   and make sure you tell them you heard [TS]

00:01:03   about it here on five by five hello John [TS]

00:01:06   how are you today didn't just fine on [TS]

00:01:09   the Sund it's Sunday you like this don't [TS]

00:01:12   you'd rather do it sunday wouldn't you [TS]

00:01:14   we're recording on a lazy sunday lazy [TS]

00:01:16   Sunday afternoon sending some light [TS]

00:01:20   sounds of smooth jazz some smooth jazz I [TS]

00:01:23   can't do the smooth jazz guy's voice no [TS]

00:01:26   can you do it no that's gotta be in your [TS]

00:01:30   bag uh I could probably do it but it [TS]

00:01:33   this is not the time or the place oh [TS]

00:01:34   this is not the time okay it's too much [TS]

00:01:37   dignity on this show right to do the [TS]

00:01:40   smooth jazz voice yeah we don't know [TS]

00:01:42   said anyone I would laid back sunday [TS]

00:01:44   she'll lay back I mean you're you're [TS]

00:01:46   probably already drunk me no know me [TS]

00:01:48   never yeah uh I wouldn't mind sunday [TS]

00:01:53   recording I think my wife mines it [TS]

00:01:54   because now she's gotta wrangle both the [TS]

00:01:56   kids yeah well I do this whereas on [TS]

00:01:59   Fridays they're off at school fridays [TS]

00:02:01   they're at school you're home alone [TS]

00:02:03   doing various and sundry adult [TS]

00:02:06   activities in your house sure better for [TS]

00:02:09   your family will keep recording friday [TS]

00:02:11   than for your family [TS]

00:02:12   that's a good idea okay and yours and [TS]

00:02:15   mine and they don't have to go turn on [TS]

00:02:17   the AC in the office yeah so that's why [TS]

00:02:19   we're starting a few minutes late is [TS]

00:02:20   that here on the weekends and this then [TS]

00:02:22   this facility's lovely facility here in [TS]

00:02:24   Austin Texas our temporary permanent [TS]

00:02:27   office space they do not run the air on [TS]

00:02:30   the weekends it turns off and you've got [TS]

00:02:32   to go all the way across the building [TS]

00:02:33   with your little key card and wave your [TS]

00:02:36   key card over a little panel in a back [TS]

00:02:38   corner of a wall and that makes the AC [TS]

00:02:41   come on in theory i'm waiting for taxing [TS]

00:02:43   get below about 78 degrees in here which [TS]

00:02:47   it's actually warmer than it sounds all [TS]

00:02:50   right I think I have to try to take this [TS]

00:02:52   show this week not slowly let's do a [TS]

00:02:55   long it will be relaxed today I don't [TS]

00:02:57   know like long because I don't have much [TS]

00:02:58   of any topics really do tell sort of [TS]

00:03:01   like a lazy you know like drifting down [TS]

00:03:03   the river on an inflatable raft yeah but [TS]

00:03:06   like without the hepatitis or whatever [TS]

00:03:08   you get in those water parks oh and I'm [TS]

00:03:13   not supposed to be the germaphobe I know [TS]

00:03:15   or you're not man enough of those lazy [TS]

00:03:17   river water poses that they kind of keep [TS]

00:03:20   me out of hepatitis in those great now i [TS]

00:03:22   can't go to those either what's the [TS]

00:03:23   waterborne illness that you get in water [TS]

00:03:25   parks i don't know i don't know that you [TS]

00:03:27   can you get that amoeba maybe you know [TS]

00:03:30   that brain amoeba yeah you know what I'm [TS]

00:03:32   talking about toxoplasmosis freeze cat [TS]

00:03:34   poop no there's some of me but it gets [TS]

00:03:36   it goes up your nose and then you get [TS]

00:03:38   goes in your brain you die cat like all [TS]

00:03:41   of a sudden rights is back to work [TS]

00:03:43   episode we gotta we gotta focus let's [TS]

00:03:46   bring this back in talk about some tests [TS]

00:03:48   so technology this is a big tech show [TS]

00:03:49   yeah maybe we'll start with follow-up [TS]

00:03:51   that sounds like something that we do [TS]

00:03:53   sure yeah alright so for the loyal [TS]

00:03:56   listeners who listen not only to last [TS]

00:03:58   week's episode number 88 but also to the [TS]

00:04:01   after dark after episode 88 you may have [TS]

00:04:03   noticed that the show ended abruptly and [TS]

00:04:06   I just wanted to reassure everyone that [TS]

00:04:08   it show ended abruptly because I last we [TS]

00:04:11   get a cold and I was once again reaching [TS]

00:04:12   for the mute button so i could blow my [TS]

00:04:14   nose or cough or something like that and [TS]

00:04:16   instead i grabbed the disconnect button [TS]

00:04:18   which is about a centimeter to the right [TS]

00:04:20   of it in my little floating palette [TS]

00:04:22   thing and since that was the end of the [TS]

00:04:24   show [TS]

00:04:25   and I explained to him over I am [TS]

00:04:26   reconnect so we could have a regular [TS]

00:04:28   goodbye said I don't worry about it i [TS]

00:04:29   just want people to know that's what [TS]

00:04:30   actually happens right you or not you're [TS]

00:04:32   not upset or any more upset than usual [TS]

00:04:35   exactly that's my secret dan I'm always [TS]

00:04:37   angry yeah so I just I was a Miss click [TS]

00:04:41   and it wasn't worth reconnecting to say [TS]

00:04:43   goodbye but I just wanted everyone to [TS]

00:04:44   know that's what happened and for people [TS]

00:04:46   who are like what the heck isn't after [TS]

00:04:47   dark this is after we are done recording [TS]

00:04:50   the show and most shows we actually [TS]

00:04:52   continue recording and usually and we'll [TS]

00:04:54   have a discussion and those can be found [TS]

00:04:56   at five by five TV so after dark and [TS]

00:04:58   there's one for almost every episode of [TS]

00:05:00   the show shows that are done here and [TS]

00:05:01   you can also get a little feed that has [TS]

00:05:04   just hyper critical and just hyper [TS]

00:05:06   criticals after darks on it too and [TS]

00:05:07   that's in the right hand side and five [TS]

00:05:09   by five dot TV / hypercritical there's [TS]

00:05:12   the URLs people always asking about [TS]

00:05:14   those feeds you got think of your feeds [TS]

00:05:15   all sorted out now with the feedburner I [TS]

00:05:17   don't think so we I mean if this would [TS]

00:05:19   be on this would be non show specific [TS]

00:05:21   follow-up but for the benefit of [TS]

00:05:22   listeners is the mass exodus from [TS]

00:05:26   feedburner happened and feedburner does [TS]

00:05:30   some kind of some kind of redirection [TS]

00:05:31   and not all pod catching clients such as [TS]

00:05:36   downcast which seems to be the one most [TS]

00:05:39   people are are having a problem with but [TS]

00:05:41   I don't think it's specific to downcast [TS]

00:05:43   in fact and this is there's no need to [TS]

00:05:45   email me telling me that your non [TS]

00:05:48   downcast pod catcher also has this [TS]

00:05:51   problem because i know they many others [TS]

00:05:52   have it but downcast seems to have the [TS]

00:05:55   most vocal audience or maybe it happened [TS]

00:05:57   there first i don't know but it does not [TS]

00:06:00   follow i guess the redirects that [TS]

00:06:02   feedburner created so you would get [TS]

00:06:04   something that would say hypercritical [TS]

00:06:05   parenthesis obsolete feed it hasn't [TS]

00:06:09   affected download number so I know [TS]

00:06:11   people are still getting it it doesn't [TS]

00:06:12   affect iTunes it doesn't affect I have [TS]

00:06:15   not gotten it to have a problem on any [TS]

00:06:17   of the apps that I use but I understand [TS]

00:06:19   some people have so I apologize for the [TS]

00:06:20   trouble and if you're hearing this it [TS]

00:06:22   probably means you figured it out [TS]

00:06:23   already but for some reason if you [TS]

00:06:25   haven't just resubscribe to it and it [TS]

00:06:27   will it will be happy and now that we [TS]

00:06:30   control our feeds the way we should [TS]

00:06:32   probably always have done we'll never [TS]

00:06:33   have a problem again lesson learned [TS]

00:06:36   indeed indubitably as you would say [TS]

00:06:38   never trust anyone that's right on the [TS]

00:06:42   internet okay first bit of follow-up a [TS]

00:06:44   couple weeks ago we discussed the iOS 6 [TS]

00:06:48   Maps situation and I talked about Apple [TS]

00:06:52   versus Google know different [TS]

00:06:53   philosophies I'm doing things and a [TS]

00:06:55   pointing out that google is not afraid [TS]

00:06:57   of the brute force solution where they [TS]

00:07:00   will do clever technical things but they [TS]

00:07:02   will also say well it looks like the [TS]

00:07:03   only way to get pictures at the front of [TS]

00:07:05   every building is to have a bunch of [TS]

00:07:07   cars drive on every single Street in the [TS]

00:07:08   entire United States so let's just do [TS]

00:07:11   that or it sounds crazy it sounds like [TS]

00:07:13   one of those you know boil the ocean [TS]

00:07:14   things but they just said you know what [TS]

00:07:15   we'll just do it so that was the smarter [TS]

00:07:17   and harder without the title the episode [TS]

00:07:18   I think smarter and harder yeah they [TS]

00:07:20   work smarter and they also work harder [TS]

00:07:22   they just bit the bullet and that seems [TS]

00:07:24   not to be in Apple's DNA so a bunch of [TS]

00:07:26   people have sent in feedback giving [TS]

00:07:30   examples of where they think Apple has [TS]

00:07:32   actually employed a brute force type of [TS]

00:07:33   solution I mentioned on the show I think [TS]

00:07:34   the data centers where they just said [TS]

00:07:37   look we need this I cloud thing is going [TS]

00:07:38   to be big and we're doing the music [TS]

00:07:40   store and we have also stuff we need to [TS]

00:07:41   just get let's just get make the biggest [TS]

00:07:44   data center we possibly can and make [TS]

00:07:45   multiple ones of them apples on to [TS]

00:07:47   public about that stuff but they have [TS]

00:07:49   been trying to do stuff there but even [TS]

00:07:50   in that case a couple of people wrote in [TS]

00:07:52   to point out that like as has been [TS]

00:07:54   discussed on past shows they don't do [TS]

00:07:56   what Google or Facebook does where they [TS]

00:07:58   decide they're going to build their own [TS]

00:07:59   hardware and write their own software [TS]

00:08:01   they're still using you know commodity [TS]

00:08:02   not commodity things like you know we [TS]

00:08:05   don't know what they're using but it [TS]

00:08:06   looks like they're using expensive [TS]

00:08:07   commercial products like emc storage and [TS]

00:08:10   maybe one point they were using Sun [TS]

00:08:12   servers and now who knows what they're [TS]

00:08:14   using but they're certainly not as far [TS]

00:08:15   as we know doing what Google and [TS]

00:08:17   Facebook do which is like we're going to [TS]

00:08:18   build our own yeah server hardware and [TS]

00:08:20   certainly not what Google does which is [TS]

00:08:22   we're going to make our own server [TS]

00:08:23   software almost our own operating system [TS]

00:08:26   not quite i think actually google has [TS]

00:08:28   its own build of Linux with its own [TS]

00:08:29   kernel and everything but still is Linux [TS]

00:08:30   so that is still is a little bit of not [TS]

00:08:34   quite going the google route to like [TS]

00:08:36   recognize that server operations are the [TS]

00:08:38   core competency of the company and we [TS]

00:08:39   should be doing it all ourselves of like [TS]

00:08:41   you're doing the feeds yourself you know [TS]

00:08:42   somewhere else could do feeds for you [TS]

00:08:44   but it's real bummer when that person [TS]

00:08:46   drops the ball and then like you know [TS]

00:08:48   maybe you feel like well it's in speeds [TS]

00:08:50   are such an essential part [TS]

00:08:52   podcasting maybe we should control that [TS]

00:08:53   arson yeah so I apologize for that [TS]

00:08:55   trouble but that's a that's a great [TS]

00:08:56   analogy yeah I mean like it's is works [TS]

00:09:00   in the case of Apple because they have a [TS]

00:09:01   hundred billion dollars and they really [TS]

00:09:03   have no excuse whereas your were various [TS]

00:09:05   points running a one-man operation and [TS]

00:09:06   you know kind of makes sense for you to [TS]

00:09:08   not do everything yourself but now [TS]

00:09:10   you're expanding anyway another example [TS]

00:09:12   people sent in was retail stores that [TS]

00:09:15   bowl was having problems of retail [TS]

00:09:16   because you'd go into compusa back in [TS]

00:09:20   the day and there would be a bunch of [TS]

00:09:21   max off in the corner covered with [TS]

00:09:22   disgusting dirty fingerprints but the [TS]

00:09:24   hundred folders name who did you fuck [TS]

00:09:25   eligos to go on the desktop from the [TS]

00:09:28   kids bang in their hands on the keyboard [TS]

00:09:30   randomly pressing command n back when [TS]

00:09:32   that would make a new folder oh such [TS]

00:09:34   days and no one was looking at them and [TS]

00:09:37   if you went over and looked at them a [TS]

00:09:38   salesperson quickly came over and sold [TS]

00:09:39   you Adele sbox I can't it almost comes [TS]

00:09:43   out of my mouth automatically but I [TS]

00:09:44   can't say that on the show but anyway [TS]

00:09:46   you know what I'm saying I do or compaq [TS]

00:09:48   s box or whatever you want to call it [TS]

00:09:49   and so they made well we're gonna try to [TS]

00:09:53   do like a an apple store within a store [TS]

00:09:55   and we'll talk to the corporate bigwigs [TS]

00:09:58   and throw money in their direction until [TS]

00:10:00   they decide they're they're going to [TS]

00:10:01   sell apple stuff the right way and that [TS]

00:10:02   kind of improved matters a little bit [TS]

00:10:04   but not really and they said all right [TS]

00:10:06   fine we'll make our own star because [TS]

00:10:07   that's what they were trying to avoid [TS]

00:10:08   they were trying to be like we're not in [TS]

00:10:10   the retail business we're Apple we make [TS]

00:10:12   computers but we're not a retailer we [TS]

00:10:14   don't want to be best buy or compusa [TS]

00:10:15   that's a terrible business to be in why [TS]

00:10:17   we're going to do that but eventually [TS]

00:10:18   they came kicking and screaming to the [TS]

00:10:20   realization you know are probably Steve [TS]

00:10:23   Jobs fit was behind this said you know [TS]

00:10:24   what why don't just make our own stores [TS]

00:10:26   I'm sick of dealing with these bozos [TS]

00:10:27   these clowns trying to sell our stuff [TS]

00:10:29   doing a terrible job we just made our [TS]

00:10:30   own stories we'd make awesome stores [TS]

00:10:32   we'd sell her stuff really well let's [TS]

00:10:34   try that and you know so they rolled it [TS]

00:10:35   out slowly it's not like they're [TS]

00:10:37   McDonald's or walmart it's not like [TS]

00:10:38   there's an apple store in every corner [TS]

00:10:39   and they just blanket the entire birth [TS]

00:10:41   but that is you know it I don't know if [TS]

00:10:44   this is an example of Apple learning to [TS]

00:10:48   take the brute force approach or an [TS]

00:10:49   example of Apple not not it not [TS]

00:10:52   occurring to Apple do that until they've [TS]

00:10:54   exhausted every other possibility of [TS]

00:10:56   like trying to work with partners in the [TS]

00:10:57   store within a store thing and years and [TS]

00:10:59   years of just terrible retail and how [TS]

00:11:01   long did they suffer before actually [TS]

00:11:03   biting the bullet whereas it seems like [TS]

00:11:04   Google [TS]

00:11:05   goes to it first like they didn't suffer [TS]

00:11:07   for years and years of trying to figure [TS]

00:11:08   out how to do Street View in a different [TS]

00:11:09   way they just went right to it instead [TS]

00:11:11   we're just going to start this it's [TS]

00:11:12   going to take a long time let's just do [TS]

00:11:13   it let's not try to do some clever way [TS]

00:11:16   like you know harvest people's [TS]

00:11:18   smartphone photos and assemble them [TS]

00:11:20   together or something like that because [TS]

00:11:21   that's cheaper and easier than paying [TS]

00:11:24   cars to do it ourselves but retail [TS]

00:11:26   stores i think is a pretty example but [TS]

00:11:28   the biggest review the biggest review [TS]

00:11:29   the biggest example everyone sent in is [TS]

00:11:31   a preview and that i think is an example [TS]

00:11:33   of where Apple didn't try to be clever [TS]

00:11:36   at first thing it dragged kicking and [TS]

00:11:38   screaming into the brute force solution [TS]

00:11:39   right they said we want to control the [TS]

00:11:43   quality of the things we in our App [TS]

00:11:44   Store to be good we want to have some [TS]

00:11:45   control over the quality there so we'll [TS]

00:11:48   just look at every single application [TS]

00:11:49   with the human like that was their first [TS]

00:11:51   there in their initial strategy it's not [TS]

00:11:53   like they tried other things Brenda [TS]

00:11:54   royal Gordon has a nice email here that [TS]

00:11:56   all quote from he says when Apple [TS]

00:11:58   decided they want to curate an app store [TS]

00:11:59   they didn't try the engineer their way [TS]

00:12:01   out of the problem they didn't design a [TS]

00:12:02   language that makes it impossible to [TS]

00:12:03   call private api's they didn't implement [TS]

00:12:05   uikit in a way that would make hige [TS]

00:12:07   violations impossible pig is the human [TS]

00:12:09   interface guidelines or port over the [TS]

00:12:11   garbage collector and banned pointers to [TS]

00:12:12   prevent crashes or require developers to [TS]

00:12:14   get their artwork from apple approved [TS]

00:12:15   graphic designer those are all examples [TS]

00:12:18   of like clever engineering type [TS]

00:12:20   solutions oh well we want to have an app [TS]

00:12:22   store where we have just safe apple that [TS]

00:12:24   means we have to make a new language and [TS]

00:12:27   forbid people from calling Pratt no [TS]

00:12:29   we're just going to you know you can [TS]

00:12:29   call private api's we're gonna have a [TS]

00:12:31   human being look at them and they have [TS]

00:12:32   automated tools of course that they run [TS]

00:12:33   your app through with it check to see [TS]

00:12:35   whether you've done these things but the [TS]

00:12:36   bottom line is that a human being is [TS]

00:12:38   involved in the process of every single [TS]

00:12:40   application getting on to the store that [TS]

00:12:42   also reminds me of something from I [TS]

00:12:44   don't know this is still true but back [TS]

00:12:45   in the early days of Google every person [TS]

00:12:48   hired to Google at some point came [TS]

00:12:51   across the the desk of or the notice of [TS]

00:12:54   a one of the two order that Sergey and [TS]

00:12:57   Larry is it Sergey or Sergey I think [TS]

00:13:00   it's Sergei Sergei yes sir gaer larry [TS]

00:13:03   like they would personally approve every [TS]

00:13:04   single new hire not that they did the [TS]

00:13:06   interview process right there was a [TS]

00:13:07   whole hierarchy of things behind them [TS]

00:13:08   but so at some point it went across [TS]

00:13:09   their desk yeah and they would say go no [TS]

00:13:12   go every single person crazy yeah well [TS]

00:13:14   it's it's similarly crazy too I mean [TS]

00:13:16   it's not like every app went across [TS]

00:13:17   steve jobs is desk but similar the [TS]

00:13:19   listing [TS]

00:13:19   every application goes the App Store a [TS]

00:13:21   human being has to look at that possibly [TS]

00:13:22   multiple and so that is probably the [TS]

00:13:24   best example so especially since Apple [TS]

00:13:27   didn't try all these weird engineering [TS]

00:13:28   only solutions first they went right to [TS]

00:13:30   let's just hire an army of people of [TS]

00:13:31   course they probably underestimated how [TS]

00:13:34   big and how knowledgeable that army has [TS]

00:13:36   to be and if we continue to have growing [TS]

00:13:38   pains now where they pulled all the mac [TS]

00:13:39   app review is off to review new [TS]

00:13:42   applications in bigand for iOS 6 for a [TS]

00:13:47   tall screen nah I OS X for the iphone 5 [TS]

00:13:49   for the tall screen and so the wait time [TS]

00:13:52   for submitting a Mac application was up [TS]

00:13:54   to like 41 days average or something [TS]

00:13:56   like that something crazy like that so [TS]

00:13:57   they continue to struggle with it but [TS]

00:14:00   they did go with the brute force [TS]

00:14:01   solution first and they're sticking to [TS]

00:14:03   it so thanks for everyone for the [TS]

00:14:08   feedback on that topic I still say it's [TS]

00:14:11   not in Apple's DNA to do what Google [TS]

00:14:13   does especially when it comes to the [TS]

00:14:14   specific things that Google does like [TS]

00:14:16   the mapping things and just about one of [TS]

00:14:20   the other brute force examples again [TS]

00:14:22   from google was where they said bushes [TS]

00:14:23   let's just scan every book in the entire [TS]

00:14:24   universe which sounds crazy you know how [TS]

00:14:28   can we get the information on all those [TS]

00:14:29   books will just scan every page how are [TS]

00:14:31   we going to scan every paper will have a [TS]

00:14:32   person sit there and turn every page and [TS]

00:14:34   then put the thing on the scanner and [TS]

00:14:35   Justin Masterson wrote in to tell me [TS]

00:14:37   that in the smarter and harder vein [TS]

00:14:39   Google did brute force that solution but [TS]

00:14:42   they also did it smarter they worked [TS]

00:14:44   harder which means you have to literally [TS]

00:14:46   scan every book you know or get to [TS]

00:14:47   eventually scan every book but the [TS]

00:14:49   smarter part was they created a rig with [TS]

00:14:52   a camera that points down of the pages [TS]

00:14:53   of the book that sort of like detects [TS]

00:14:56   the 3d shape of like the curled pages [TS]

00:14:58   you know you open a book out the eight [TS]

00:15:00   pages curl and you have to have it has [TS]

00:15:03   like an IR camera or something that [TS]

00:15:04   detects the shape so we can figure out [TS]

00:15:06   how to read you know how to OCR the page [TS]

00:15:08   it's like basically to unworn at a book [TS]

00:15:10   the texas curves inward toward the spine [TS]

00:15:12   the lines are all warped and everything [TS]

00:15:14   is weird and if you try to feed that [TS]

00:15:16   image as is to an OCR application I [TS]

00:15:18   won't figure it out so they figure out [TS]

00:15:20   the 3d shape of the book and flatten out [TS]

00:15:22   the image and feed to the OCR software I [TS]

00:15:23   put a link in the show notes that he [TS]

00:15:26   sent this is the the secret of Google's [TS]

00:15:28   book scanning machine revealed and of [TS]

00:15:30   course it's from a patent [TS]

00:15:32   the patent they got and of course they [TS]

00:15:34   got a patent on this device that scans [TS]

00:15:37   in book so there's an example of Google [TS]

00:15:39   smarter and harder alright the last show [TS]

00:15:43   that we talked about app.net and the [TS]

00:15:46   introduction of net bot yes and you [TS]

00:15:48   explained dentists don't like people [TS]

00:15:53   calling it that and that sounds wrong to [TS]

00:15:55   me it sounds like felon mispronouncing [TS]

00:15:58   tetanus and that's that doesn't sound [TS]

00:16:00   good doesn't sound good most of the [TS]

00:16:02   folks should have replied and written in [TS]

00:16:04   or tweeted about us I think they were [TS]

00:16:07   appreciative however you pronounce it of [TS]

00:16:09   your detailed explanation and there were [TS]

00:16:11   a number of people who said I did I had [TS]

00:16:13   no idea what thing even was until [TS]

00:16:15   Siracusa correctly explained it this is [TS]

00:16:18   actually part of the final topic AB [TS]

00:16:21   later in the show how did I know about [TS]

00:16:24   10 20 which is a domain name of the [TS]

00:16:27   protocol tent itself I think I don't [TS]

00:16:30   remember that things are on the Internet [TS]

00:16:32   don't remember everything comes but I'm [TS]

00:16:33   assuming I know about it because I [TS]

00:16:35   probably talked about at the net on the [TS]

00:16:37   show and then someone either tweeted at [TS]

00:16:38   me or emailed back to the show to say [TS]

00:16:42   hey have you heard of this 10 thing [TS]

00:16:43   maybe use the tent people themselves so [TS]

00:16:45   by me doing this podcast and having a [TS]

00:16:49   lot of followers and Twitter and talking [TS]

00:16:51   about this stuff a related information [TS]

00:16:54   comes to me because people like oh I [TS]

00:16:57   heard you talk about this you know about [TS]

00:16:58   this and then i expel it back out [TS]

00:17:00   through subsequent podcasts so you [TS]

00:17:03   people who hadn't heard of tent before [TS]

00:17:06   listening to the podcast you heard about [TS]

00:17:07   it because you listen to my show and it [TS]

00:17:10   was on my show because I have a show [TS]

00:17:12   because I talked about something related [TS]

00:17:14   so this is sort of cycle of influx of [TS]

00:17:17   information and then output again and [TS]

00:17:19   repeating is a something i'll talk about [TS]

00:17:21   in the later topic the end of the show [TS]

00:17:23   but anyway during that discussion of net [TS]

00:17:26   bot and app.net said that because of the [TS]

00:17:29   introduction of net bot which is the app [TS]

00:17:31   that port of tweetbot which is a very [TS]

00:17:33   popular twitter application from tap [TS]

00:17:35   pots lots of bots i said it seemed to me [TS]

00:17:38   that the introduction of net bot didn't [TS]

00:17:40   so much cause a big influx of new users [TS]

00:17:42   tap net people lining up to pay [TS]

00:17:44   thirty-six dollars a year or five [TS]

00:17:45   dollars from [TS]

00:17:46   whatever but it reactivated all the [TS]

00:17:49   people who were already there they had [TS]

00:17:51   you know a bunch of people I knew and [TS]

00:17:52   most of the people you know the people I [TS]

00:17:53   was following they'd been on app.net [TS]

00:17:55   since the funding period like they were [TS]

00:17:57   part of the funding experiment the sort [TS]

00:17:59   of pseudo kicked starter thing but they [TS]

00:18:02   had stopped posting like they talked a [TS]

00:18:04   lot about then at clients for a while [TS]

00:18:05   and then stopped posting and then net [TS]

00:18:07   bot came along it seemed like those [TS]

00:18:08   people tripped up again well Alex [TS]

00:18:10   Dubinsky wrote in to say that uh app [TS]

00:18:12   netizens calm is tracking the activity [TS]

00:18:16   on app.net and he said it actually did [TS]

00:18:19   cause a big influx of new users so if [TS]

00:18:21   you look in the link in the show notes [TS]

00:18:23   that links this app netizens dot-com [TS]

00:18:26   thing if you look on october third in [TS]

00:18:27   October fourth you have to kind of [TS]

00:18:28   scroll in the sidebar couldn't figure [TS]

00:18:30   out how to get a direct link what is it [TS]

00:18:33   the total users on app.net and october [TS]

00:18:36   third and October fourth all right so [TS]

00:18:38   October on September 30th there were 15 [TS]

00:18:42   new users added and then on october [TS]

00:18:45   first there were 278 and a second 512 [TS]

00:18:48   then on the third and fourth there were [TS]

00:18:50   1300 1200 this is a big hump in the [TS]

00:18:52   graph right around the introduction of [TS]

00:18:54   net pots so there's a total of [TS]

00:18:56   twenty-five thousand users but having a [TS]

00:18:58   couple of 1000 you know 1.5 k days that [TS]

00:19:03   is a bump in the graph so it's not just [TS]

00:19:07   that it made new people talk that's how [TS]

00:19:09   it seemed to me i guess because i didn't [TS]

00:19:10   immediately fall the new users but there [TS]

00:19:12   was a big bump there too so ab dot net [TS]

00:19:14   must like that in in the discussion of [TS]

00:19:18   tent speaking of tent which is a [TS]

00:19:20   decentralized protocol for doing similar [TS]

00:19:23   things to what app that netted twitter [TS]

00:19:25   do i reference to daniel i'm an article [TS]

00:19:27   titled something like is a federated [TS]

00:19:30   twitter even possible that discusses the [TS]

00:19:33   challenges that have federated and not [TS]

00:19:37   that tent auto ins federated but i [TS]

00:19:38   basically a decentralized protocol would [TS]

00:19:40   face in providing something like twitter [TS]

00:19:43   any of us did a bunch of different [TS]

00:19:44   attributes and I discussed each of them [TS]

00:19:46   were giving feedback from Daniel ciders [TS]

00:19:48   of tent and then wrote me and to say [TS]

00:19:51   that he wanted to clarify that the [TS]

00:19:53   article was not so much here of the [TS]

00:19:55   things that that you need to have to be [TS]

00:19:59   a Twitter competitive [TS]

00:20:00   and if you don't have them you're gonna [TS]

00:20:01   you're gonna fail therefore blah he was [TS]

00:20:04   really trying to emphasize how these [TS]

00:20:07   different qualities are in tension with [TS]

00:20:10   each other and you can't have all them [TS]

00:20:12   at the same time with a sense to [TS]

00:20:13   decentralize protocol so for example if [TS]

00:20:16   you're sorting your posts or tweets or [TS]

00:20:19   whatever by the time they received and [TS]

00:20:21   that time varies from node to node in a [TS]

00:20:23   decentralized system that means that two [TS]

00:20:27   users on different servers posts might [TS]

00:20:29   appear in different order and that [TS]

00:20:31   violates the chronology requirement [TS]

00:20:33   because the times and the servers aren't [TS]

00:20:34   right and stuff like that maybe you try [TS]

00:20:35   to fix this by simply sorting them by [TS]

00:20:37   the time they were sent rather than the [TS]

00:20:38   time stamp on their on their systems [TS]

00:20:40   like then you might have some newly [TS]

00:20:42   received things inserted into the middle [TS]

00:20:44   of your timeline and you can't have both [TS]

00:20:46   of those things you either you either [TS]

00:20:49   accept that you're gonna insert things [TS]

00:20:50   in the middle or you sort them based on [TS]

00:20:54   something different than the order that [TS]

00:20:56   they were actually created because the [TS]

00:20:57   times might be different and that's what [TS]

00:20:58   he was mostly was getting at that with a [TS]

00:21:00   decentralized system the client can [TS]

00:21:02   decide what policy you want to have but [TS]

00:21:04   you still might have some weird behavior [TS]

00:21:05   now I think this behavior still exists [TS]

00:21:08   even in Twitter because maybe it's just [TS]

00:21:09   the Twitter clients I've used but some [TS]

00:21:11   Twitter clients will do something like [TS]

00:21:12   show me all of my things in my stream [TS]

00:21:15   and then also find me my ad mentions and [TS]

00:21:17   it will do it in two separate requests [TS]

00:21:19   and by the time it makes a set the [TS]

00:21:20   second request it could be the one of [TS]

00:21:22   the @ mentions it receives needs to be [TS]

00:21:23   inserted into the timeline if you have a [TS]

00:21:25   unified timeline for example and even [TS]

00:21:29   though it's a centralized service [TS]

00:21:30   because the two pieces of information [TS]

00:21:32   you want need to be interleaved and you [TS]

00:21:35   make requests for them not exactly in [TS]

00:21:37   parallel and even if you did you'd never [TS]

00:21:38   get into line up exactly right I think [TS]

00:21:41   it's not so much of these things are [TS]

00:21:42   impossible to achieve in a decentralized [TS]

00:21:45   system it's that they're mostly not [TS]

00:21:47   possible to achieve in a centralized [TS]

00:21:48   system just do the nature of the way we [TS]

00:21:50   pull information unified timeline was a [TS]

00:21:53   big topic of discussion in the last show [TS]

00:21:54   i'm still getting people replying to me [TS]

00:21:57   tweeting to me and sending email that [TS]

00:22:00   they don't understand what if I timeline [TS]

00:22:01   is I don't think I want to re-explain it [TS]

00:22:03   I've tried to reply to people directly [TS]

00:22:06   on Twitter and on app.net to clarify to [TS]

00:22:09   them usually telling them he download [TS]

00:22:11   this client and see how it's different [TS]

00:22:13   from this client [TS]

00:22:13   one has unified one doesn't but I found [TS]

00:22:15   that many people apparently don't get [TS]

00:22:17   replies from people they don't follow [TS]

00:22:19   right so as far as they're concerned the [TS]

00:22:21   two things look identical they don't see [TS]

00:22:22   a difference sort of to briefly [TS]

00:22:25   summarize I guess again when you get a [TS]

00:22:28   reply from someone you don't follow if [TS]

00:22:30   that reply appears alongside all the [TS]

00:22:32   tweets for the people you do follow that [TS]

00:22:35   means you have a unified timeline and if [TS]

00:22:37   it appears in a separate place you don't [TS]

00:22:38   have a unified timeline so that's that's [TS]

00:22:40   where that comes in mentions and replies [TS]

00:22:42   from people you do not follow they don't [TS]

00:22:44   mention anybody you follow in a unified [TS]

00:22:47   timeline those appear alongside all your [TS]

00:22:50   other stuff in a single chronological [TS]

00:22:51   stream that's basically what is the [TS]

00:22:53   unified timeline in your client you just [TS]

00:22:55   go to one big list then you just scroll [TS]

00:22:57   and scroll and scroll you never go [TS]

00:22:59   anyplace else unless you want to change [TS]

00:23:00   accounts or do a random search or [TS]

00:23:03   something like that you just have one [TS]

00:23:05   thing you look for with a non unified [TS]

00:23:07   timeline you have your stream and then [TS]

00:23:09   you have a separate place where you look [TS]

00:23:10   for those replies and mentions for [TS]

00:23:11   people you don't fall and this by the [TS]

00:23:14   way is very important to you as you've [TS]

00:23:16   discussed on previous shows this is what [TS]

00:23:18   you you rely on this and that is the [TS]

00:23:22   primary reason why you you like that [TS]

00:23:24   client I'm still using that bot as my [TS]

00:23:26   app that net client because it is really [TS]

00:23:27   it's really great you know those guys [TS]

00:23:29   have lots of experience making a twitter [TS]

00:23:31   client and even though I'm not a giant [TS]

00:23:33   fan of their aesthetic it works really [TS]

00:23:36   well it has a lot of features i like the [TS]

00:23:37   gestures for pulling up the conversation [TS]

00:23:39   and stuff like it's a good it's a good [TS]

00:23:40   client and i'm using that if I found a [TS]

00:23:44   unified app.net client for iOS I may try [TS]

00:23:47   replacing that but for now i'm using net [TS]

00:23:49   pod and it still it still bothers me to [TS]

00:23:51   go back and forth i'm surprised a lot of [TS]

00:23:52   people after i explained what it is and [TS]

00:23:54   pointed them to wedge which is a unified [TS]

00:23:56   timeline client for OS 10 frap net or [TS]

00:24:01   Twitter effort for Twitter even a lot of [TS]

00:24:03   people are applying and saying hey I [TS]

00:24:04   download it either wedge or twitterrific [TS]

00:24:06   and I tried it and this unified thing is [TS]

00:24:07   great and it could be that people just [TS]

00:24:10   don't know about it and just assume that [TS]

00:24:12   the way you use twitter is you have like [TS]

00:24:13   some place that you tap to see your your [TS]

00:24:15   replies from non followers in some place [TS]

00:24:17   that you tap to see your other stuff and [TS]

00:24:18   once it's all folded into one they say i [TS]

00:24:21   like it i don't have to go to two places [TS]

00:24:22   i just go to one place and see my stuff [TS]

00:24:25   there [TS]

00:24:26   and then of course they can fortunately [TS]

00:24:29   tried to add mention the net bot skies [TS]

00:24:31   of tap bots guys and say hey you guys [TS]

00:24:32   should add unified ads if they haven't [TS]

00:24:34   heard that no that's new to them they're [TS]

00:24:36   they're brand new to this exactly well [TS]

00:24:38   you know as I said to the tap bot people [TS]

00:24:41   doesn't mean the net thought has to add [TS]

00:24:43   a unified timeline I just want someone [TS]

00:24:44   out there to make a good client with the [TS]

00:24:47   unified timeline because I think there [TS]

00:24:48   are people who would like it yep of [TS]

00:24:51   course the tap pods guys can edit if [TS]

00:24:53   they want it doesn't change there are [TS]

00:24:54   other people who would like to use it [TS]

00:24:55   the way they're using it now just leave [TS]

00:24:56   that is the default it would just be an [TS]

00:24:58   option anyway I continue to wait [TS]

00:25:00   patiently for an iOS I think this one [TS]

00:25:02   coming out what was it called I think I [TS]

00:25:04   have it in as this where everything is [TS]

00:25:06   everything is instapaper like there was [TS]

00:25:07   a unified climb line iOS client coming [TS]

00:25:11   out and I want to remember what it is so [TS]

00:25:13   I throat an insta paper that makes no [TS]

00:25:15   sense but that's where it is and I just [TS]

00:25:16   go there and I search for you know [TS]

00:25:18   app.net and I'll probably find I [TS]

00:25:20   apologize to the people who sent me this [TS]

00:25:23   information about this client I didn't [TS]

00:25:25   save it but I don't remember it offhand [TS]

00:25:26   all right now and one more thing on [TS]

00:25:30   app.net we're talking about how a [TS]

00:25:34   descent and tents we talked about how [TS]

00:25:36   the challenge of a decentralized system [TS]

00:25:38   doing search how do you do real-time [TS]

00:25:39   search with a decentralized system and [TS]

00:25:42   Twitter had in the past through [TS]

00:25:45   mentioned in the last show done [TS]

00:25:47   real-time search by feeding Google a [TS]

00:25:49   stream that called the firehose about [TS]

00:25:53   all the tweets as they happen in real [TS]

00:25:54   time and so Google hood index them very [TS]

00:25:57   very quickly just feeding off that big [TS]

00:25:58   giant fire and this is something that [TS]

00:25:59   they do just just for google this isn't [TS]

00:26:02   something that a regular person can grab [TS]

00:26:04   access to yeah well someone else used to [TS]

00:26:06   have the I think some eyes used to have [TS]

00:26:08   the fire house 2's um mi ze which was a [TS]

00:26:10   search service for Twitter just for [TS]

00:26:12   Twitter just researching Twitter but I [TS]

00:26:13   think Twitter bought some eyes many [TS]

00:26:16   years ago and so that went away and [TS]

00:26:18   there's probably used them to do their [TS]

00:26:19   internal search but Bruno grande or [TS]

00:26:21   grand one of those two wrote in to tell [TS]

00:26:24   me that Google's real-time Twitter [TS]

00:26:26   search was shut down in July of 2011 [TS]

00:26:28   after the deal with Twitter expired and [TS]

00:26:30   i have a link to that in the show notes [TS]

00:26:31   so i guess google doesn't do that [TS]

00:26:33   anymore and probably the last time i [TS]

00:26:34   used it was way back then I it kind of [TS]

00:26:39   makes sense they would [TS]

00:26:39   tempest they will want to control their [TS]

00:26:40   search in-house and blah blah blah but [TS]

00:26:43   that's a shame but anyway on the topic [TS]

00:26:46   of the centralized service is doing that [TS]

00:26:48   there's still confusion in my mind as [TS]

00:26:51   well as kind of many readers saying what [TS]

00:26:54   is the how does something like 10th [TS]

00:26:57   scale for people with lots of followers [TS]

00:27:00   over a real-time search and the main [TS]

00:27:02   point of confusion is getting back to [TS]

00:27:06   the Lady Gaga example if Lady Gaga has [TS]

00:27:08   30 million followers does Lady Gaga's [TS]

00:27:11   tenth server need to send out 30 million [TS]

00:27:13   post requests or is that only the worst [TS]

00:27:15   case scenario theoretically worst case [TS]

00:27:17   scenario every human being on the planet [TS]

00:27:18   has their own tent server yes or would [TS]

00:27:22   need to send out 30 million but [TS]

00:27:23   obviously as discussing last show we [TS]

00:27:26   would assume that tent would shake out a [TS]

00:27:27   little bit like email as shaking out [TS]

00:27:30   where most people are on one of four or [TS]

00:27:32   five big servers like an email most [TS]

00:27:34   people have a gmail or hotmail or yahoo [TS]

00:27:37   mail or something like that or a mac com [TS]

00:27:40   mail or whatever like there's a bunch of [TS]

00:27:42   big services that have most people and [TS]

00:27:44   then this corporate mail with your own [TS]

00:27:46   little corporate mail servers and then [TS]

00:27:47   of course the very fringe there's the [TS]

00:27:49   individuals in the long tail who run [TS]

00:27:51   there who do run their own mail service [TS]

00:27:52   right so you would assume tint if it [TS]

00:27:54   ever became very very popular protocol [TS]

00:27:56   would be similar and that would probably [TS]

00:27:58   mean the lady gaga if you can just send [TS]

00:28:01   to serve an update to whatever the [TS]

00:28:04   equivalent of gmail is for tent like [TS]

00:28:06   okay I'm going to send one update to the [TS]

00:28:08   you know the tmail also numbers make [TS]

00:28:11   sense I was trying to think of a Google [TS]

00:28:12   Gmail analogy anyway I'm gonna send one [TS]

00:28:14   response to this tent server that houses [TS]

00:28:16   like twenty percent of all people who [TS]

00:28:18   are on tent and there I've already [TS]

00:28:19   covered twenty percent of my 30 million [TS]

00:28:21   followers right and I'm another response [TS]

00:28:23   to this other big server and then slowly [TS]

00:28:25   degrade and so you wouldn't have to send [TS]

00:28:27   30 million have to send some much much [TS]

00:28:28   smaller number than that because once [TS]

00:28:30   you send a post request to the big [TS]

00:28:32   server that hosts lots of people you're [TS]

00:28:34   done I'm still not sure if that's the [TS]

00:28:36   case i looked at the documentation a [TS]

00:28:38   little bit maybe the 10 people can [TS]

00:28:40   clarify it seems like that would be [TS]

00:28:42   efficient right from an engineering [TS]

00:28:43   point of view oh I'll just send it to [TS]

00:28:44   that server and it's that service [TS]

00:28:45   responsibility to make it visible to all [TS]

00:28:47   the people who are on that tent server [TS]

00:28:48   for example if every single person who [TS]

00:28:50   followed me was on 10th is and I and I [TS]

00:28:52   did a post from [TS]

00:28:53   my nan 10th is 10th server I could maybe [TS]

00:28:56   just send one update to 10th is and then [TS]

00:28:58   it makes sure that everybody's on 10th [TS]

00:28:59   a/s gets it but on the other hand I do [TS]

00:29:01   know that 10 people are identified by [TS]

00:29:03   their sort of URL so mine is Syracuse [TS]

00:29:05   attend that is and someone else is going [TS]

00:29:08   to be a different name that tent that is [TS]

00:29:09   and so it seems to me that even though [TS]

00:29:12   they're all happened to be something [TS]

00:29:14   that tent that is when you make an [TS]

00:29:16   update and you want to tell all your [TS]

00:29:17   followers it's not like you go through [TS]

00:29:19   your list of follower URLs and try to [TS]

00:29:21   find common substrings do you like oh [TS]

00:29:23   all these people are on tent that is I [TS]

00:29:24   have to set in a post request to to what [TS]

00:29:27   exactly just tent Dada ass with that [TS]

00:29:29   without the name on the front of it it [TS]

00:29:30   seems to me that if everyone has a URL [TS]

00:29:32   you have to make post requests to every [TS]

00:29:33   single one of those URLs and yeah they [TS]

00:29:35   may all be virtual hosted on a single [TS]

00:29:36   you know cluster node instance of 10th [TS]

00:29:39   is but as far as you're concerned as far [TS]

00:29:41   as the other nodes are concerned they [TS]

00:29:43   can't make it any assumptions about how [TS]

00:29:45   those things are served if everyone has [TS]

00:29:46   a different URL doesn't it have to send [TS]

00:29:48   30 million post requests so this is [TS]

00:29:50   still a mystery to me I guess by [TS]

00:29:51   mentioning it like this I'm just [TS]

00:29:53   implicitly asking people to come in and [TS]

00:29:55   explain it to me I just I'd be just as [TS]

00:29:59   happy to see what the results are in [TS]

00:30:01   action like have a bunch of people set [TS]

00:30:02   up a bunch of 10 servers and see how [TS]

00:30:03   they behave in reality between each [TS]

00:30:05   other but if any ten people can clarify [TS]

00:30:06   that send it again and that's what most [TS]

00:30:08   people have been telling me that that [TS]

00:30:09   tense scaling solution is the same as [TS]

00:30:11   email scaling solution a bunch of big [TS]

00:30:13   servers have most people and only the [TS]

00:30:16   long tail do people have their own [TS]

00:30:18   servers and the final bit of follow-up [TS]

00:30:22   is related to that i mentioned email as [TS]

00:30:25   my analogy for what tent is like and [TS]

00:30:28   saying how nobody leaves email and you [TS]

00:30:32   can't kill email because if you can kill [TS]

00:30:34   gmail or you kill hotmail email still [TS]

00:30:37   exists is the thing with or without [TS]

00:30:38   those services those people would just [TS]

00:30:40   go elsewhere right you can't kill the [TS]

00:30:42   protocol and that's for nolan leaving [TS]

00:30:44   email everyone wrote and tell me the [TS]

00:30:45   donald knuth left email famously have [TS]

00:30:48   people can quit the internet and was it [TS]

00:30:49   was a mark pilgrim who quit the internet [TS]

00:30:51   one of the high-profile tech nerds yes i [TS]

00:30:54   did money was injured anymore that's [TS]

00:30:56   right so anyway news is the if i'm [TS]

00:30:59   pronouncing his name correctly knuth [TS]

00:31:01   panoz Knuth i don't like saying McKay no [TS]

00:31:04   he's not on the internet so he won't [TS]

00:31:05   hear this i canna pronounce his name [TS]

00:31:06   you will know say it any way you want [TS]

00:31:07   yeah i'll donald knuth like kunafa bunny [TS]

00:31:10   vs. Knuffle Bunny anyway they're very [TS]

00:31:14   similar Knuffle Bunny and i'm by the way [TS]

00:31:16   i am Knuffle Bunny i apparently unlawful [TS]

00:31:18   bunyan knuth not kanaha buddy in knuth [TS]

00:31:20   right but he quitting now but on email [TS]

00:31:24   being unkillable because of gmail goes [TS]

00:31:26   way it's not a big deal steve schreiber [TS]

00:31:28   wrote in to tell me that during his few [TS]

00:31:31   years when he was at hotmail there was [TS]

00:31:33   the equivalent of a red phone hotline [TS]

00:31:35   between AOL yahoo and hotmail and [TS]

00:31:38   eventually gmail was added in there and [TS]

00:31:39   says of any of the any of the providers [TS]

00:31:41   were experiencing an issue that would [TS]

00:31:43   cause them to slow their acceptance rate [TS]

00:31:44   of incoming mail this hotline are [TS]

00:31:46   actually a conference bridge she calls [TS]

00:31:48   it was invoked each of these providers [TS]

00:31:50   accepted billions of inbound messages a [TS]

00:31:52   day if any one of them saw internal [TS]

00:31:54   problems that caused them to delay let [TS]

00:31:55   alone decline inbound messages for a [TS]

00:31:57   time the messages would begin to queue [TS]

00:31:59   up on outbound mail servers or an [TS]

00:32:01   intermediary store-and-forward systems [TS]

00:32:03   so once even if you have a decentralized [TS]

00:32:06   system what what steve saying here is [TS]

00:32:07   that amongst the big guys amongst the [TS]

00:32:10   big players there's so much [TS]

00:32:11   concentration of population of email [TS]

00:32:13   among these three or four big servers [TS]

00:32:15   that if any one of them has any sort of [TS]

00:32:17   trouble because the email is storing [TS]

00:32:18   forward where you pass the message along [TS]

00:32:20   if any one of them stops accepting email [TS]

00:32:22   or slows its acceptance of email the [TS]

00:32:24   whole system can get clogged up in a [TS]

00:32:25   terrible catastrophic way and they have [TS]

00:32:27   the hot line between the jailer say you [TS]

00:32:29   know they would call up and say hey [TS]

00:32:30   hotmail we noticed your your incoming [TS]

00:32:32   separate is slowing down you're causing [TS]

00:32:34   a huge backlog because if you have [TS]

00:32:35   billions of messages and if where are [TS]

00:32:37   you trying to send them to isn't [TS]

00:32:39   accepting them you have to just like its [TS]

00:32:41   store and forward you store them and [TS]

00:32:42   then forward them and store just not [TS]

00:32:43   unlimited right so you have a problem [TS]

00:32:47   here like if you could draw that as a [TS]

00:32:48   plumbing type diagram there's a huge [TS]

00:32:50   flood of water coming and if it can't [TS]

00:32:51   continue down to the next pipe it's just [TS]

00:32:53   backing up in your current pipe and you [TS]

00:32:54   could have a big tank to fill the once [TS]

00:32:56   that tank fills you know you have a [TS]

00:32:57   catastrophic problem eventually so even [TS]

00:33:00   in decentralized system it's kind of [TS]

00:33:02   like a too big to fail type of thing [TS]

00:33:03   alright thanks even though there's not [TS]

00:33:06   one thing that controls email when the [TS]

00:33:08   players get big enough if one of those [TS]

00:33:09   big flares has problems it's almost as [TS]

00:33:12   if you destroyed email like if yahoo and [TS]

00:33:16   gmail and hotmail all stopped accepting [TS]

00:33:18   messages and [TS]

00:33:19   their arms you have like 10 minutes [TS]

00:33:21   before the basically the end of email [TS]

00:33:22   yeah pretty bad I can send my email just [TS]

00:33:25   fine to my friend that his domain well [TS]

00:33:26   you better hope it doesn't hop through [TS]

00:33:27   one of those things along the way there [TS]

00:33:29   and the spillover of the back up on that [TS]

00:33:31   system could you know cause problems so [TS]

00:33:34   this this doesn't mean decentralized is [TS]

00:33:36   bad it's much better than centralized [TS]

00:33:37   and we're managing to do with email [TS]

00:33:39   email as a proof that it can work but it [TS]

00:33:41   shows that you have to be careful once [TS]

00:33:43   things start getting big you know the [TS]

00:33:45   red hotline phone is not part of the [TS]

00:33:47   10th protocol but it would have to be if [TS]

00:33:48   tempt ever got as big as email you want [TS]

00:33:52   doing a first sponsor it's good idea [TS]

00:33:55   because we're at the end of the fall end [TS]

00:33:56   of the fu so our first sponsor is help [TS]

00:34:00   spot calm his friends of friends of ours [TS]

00:34:03   I was you know I think he was up in New [TS]

00:34:05   York I didn't get to see him when I was [TS]

00:34:06   so I was up there but that's alright [TS]

00:34:07   because help spot is still pretty cool [TS]

00:34:10   it's a lifeline for your customer [TS]

00:34:12   service what does that mean means you [TS]

00:34:14   can change the entire way you do [TS]

00:34:16   business when it comes to supporting [TS]

00:34:17   your customers or working with the folks [TS]

00:34:20   who use your service or your product how [TS]

00:34:22   because you can instead of having [TS]

00:34:24   chaotic email interactions and trying to [TS]

00:34:26   figure out who's doing what or how [TS]

00:34:27   you're helping one person with one [TS]

00:34:29   problem in another person with another [TS]

00:34:30   problem you convert all of this and to [TS]

00:34:33   structured help desk tickets they can be [TS]

00:34:35   managed they can be tracked you can even [TS]

00:34:37   let your customers help themselves by [TS]

00:34:40   using their integrated service portal [TS]

00:34:41   and you can automate things like [TS]

00:34:43   escalations responses I use this [TS]

00:34:46   software myself at two different [TS]

00:34:48   companies I worked at back when I was a [TS]

00:34:50   corporate stooge you don't have to be a [TS]

00:34:51   corporate stooge to use them and in fact [TS]

00:34:54   you should try this for your own service [TS]

00:34:57   why because it will save you so much [TS]

00:34:59   time you'll know exactly what's going on [TS]

00:35:02   with the folks that you're supporting [TS]

00:35:03   you'll know exactly if there's a trouble [TS]

00:35:06   ticket and you get someone who's doing [TS]

00:35:08   your support and they don't know what to [TS]

00:35:10   do they escalate it right up to you you [TS]

00:35:12   only get bugged about the things that [TS]

00:35:14   you actually need to help out with and [TS]

00:35:16   you can get a really great perspective [TS]

00:35:18   on everything that's going on because [TS]

00:35:20   they have real-time integrated reporting [TS]

00:35:22   lets you keep tabs on what's happening [TS]

00:35:23   anyway they're doing something special [TS]

00:35:25   for five by five listeners you get a [TS]

00:35:27   hundred bucks off your purchase if you [TS]

00:35:29   use the offer code five by five and how [TS]

00:35:31   do you do that you go to help spot calm [TS]

00:35:33   / 5 by 5 and get a hundred bucks off [TS]

00:35:38   they got everything you don't host it [TS]

00:35:40   yourself you don't to download and [TS]

00:35:41   install it yourself they'll do it I have [TS]

00:35:44   a hosted solution it's really great good [TS]

00:35:46   folks over there using these guys for [TS]

00:35:48   years help spot calm / 5 by 5 check it [TS]

00:35:50   out Henrik codone in the chatroom hope I [TS]

00:35:55   got that right hello Ike and Mike yeah [TS]

00:35:57   like mentions like a Vulcan word which [TS]

00:36:00   I'm sure you familiar with pad XMPP [TS]

00:36:05   which people may know is Jabbar [TS]

00:36:06   apparently uses dns to do this they put [TS]

00:36:09   a SRV record in the dns so for any given [TS]

00:36:11   hostname you can look it up and find [TS]

00:36:13   that record and find out what 10th [TS]

00:36:14   server should you should use to [TS]

00:36:16   communicate with whatever dot 10 thought [TS]

00:36:19   is would list 10 thought is as it's you [TS]

00:36:21   know tenth server so then as he says you [TS]

00:36:25   would end up with 30 million DNS [TS]

00:36:26   requests but those would be cached [TS]

00:36:27   locally and all that other stuff oh so [TS]

00:36:30   jabber does that and I guess that's a [TS]

00:36:31   possible illusion maybe that's what tent [TS]

00:36:32   does maybe that's what we'll hear about [TS]

00:36:33   as people are furiously typing they're [TS]

00:36:36   filling out the feedback form right now [TS]

00:36:38   to tell me this alright topic for today [TS]

00:36:43   to time I got two topics today one of [TS]

00:36:46   them is inspired by listening to back to [TS]

00:36:49   work I just let's do it yesterday and i [TS]

00:36:51   said no i actually want to talk about [TS]

00:36:52   that on my show so i'll do that but [TS]

00:36:54   that's my second topic okay five by five [TS]

00:36:55   show with merlin mann and me we do a do [TS]

00:36:59   weekly show you do when you listen to it [TS]

00:37:02   and you're a big for your big fan i am [TS]

00:37:04   i'm a big fan um and by my first topic [TS]

00:37:08   can you guess what my first topic is [TS]

00:37:10   nothing really interesting or exciting [TS]

00:37:13   has happened for anybody that we know [TS]

00:37:15   over the last week so I i would guess [TS]

00:37:18   you're going to talk about toasters [TS]

00:37:19   guessing cry you already looked at the [TS]

00:37:21   show I was like you're forgetting I [TS]

00:37:23   didn't I actually didn't this time [TS]

00:37:24   around I oh I always do but this time I [TS]

00:37:27   didn't look but I can look right now I'm [TS]

00:37:28   going to you don't have to because going [TS]

00:37:30   there it is clicking the links link oh [TS]

00:37:33   you are gonna talk about it I love that [TS]

00:37:37   you're gonna talk about Oh Dan sarcastic [TS]

00:37:39   reply about nothing has happened [TS]

00:37:41   interesting in anyone's life do we know [TS]

00:37:43   about he's referring to Marco of course [TS]

00:37:45   Marco Arment he is the [TS]

00:37:47   host along with with me of a show called [TS]

00:37:49   build and analyzed that we do here on [TS]

00:37:50   mondays yes and at this point I feel [TS]

00:37:53   like it's kind of surprising that builds [TS]

00:37:55   and analyze has not called the podcast [TS]

00:37:56   because people may may or may not know [TS]

00:38:00   Marco is the creator and founder [TS]

00:38:02   Instapaper as part of Instapaper he has [TS]

00:38:05   the thing called the feature which is us [TS]

00:38:07   you know selected an editor selects the [TS]

00:38:10   best of the things that people put [TS]

00:38:11   Instapaper or whatever and there's also [TS]

00:38:12   something called the brief which is kind [TS]

00:38:15   of like a very succinct roundup of the [TS]

00:38:18   week's important tech news yeah so he's [TS]

00:38:20   got the feature the brief something [TS]

00:38:23   that's not called the podcast but this [TS]

00:38:25   week i forgot what not launched it do [TS]

00:38:27   you think he regretted that by not [TS]

00:38:29   calling it the podcast i doubt it and by [TS]

00:38:32   the way there there are a lot of shows [TS]

00:38:35   out there called the show lots the show [TS]

00:38:39   attack of the renee or even just the [TS]

00:38:41   show if you were to google the show you [TS]

00:38:44   would find hundreds and hundreds of [TS]

00:38:46   places and that's because you can't you [TS]

00:38:48   can't copyright or protect the name that [TS]

00:38:50   way yeah and then interesting that's [TS]

00:38:53   like can't copyright font see there just [TS]

00:38:56   got to give a different name right only [TS]

00:38:57   the opposite but these all the same name [TS]

00:38:59   anyway ah this past week he introduced [TS]

00:39:02   something called the magazine the [TS]

00:39:04   magazine and this is issue one that he's [TS]

00:39:08   been talking about on his show for a [TS]

00:39:09   long time he's like I'm working on this [TS]

00:39:10   new app I can't tell you what it is I [TS]

00:39:12   would send very signs it's not it's not [TS]

00:39:14   a floor wax it's not dessert topping [TS]

00:39:16   it's not a Twitter client it's not a [TS]

00:39:18   podcast app even though he said he is [TS]

00:39:19   playing with that too what was it it was [TS]

00:39:22   kind of a misdirect because that people [TS]

00:39:23   kept thinking what kind of app would it [TS]

00:39:24   be the app part of it I that part of it [TS]

00:39:27   of course is an essential component but [TS]

00:39:29   it's not you know the important part is [TS]

00:39:31   that it's a publication right and the [TS]

00:39:34   app enables the publication to happen [TS]

00:39:35   but that's what it is it's a magazine in [TS]

00:39:37   the Internet age it is a publication and [TS]

00:39:39   the introducing of publication not that [TS]

00:39:43   the app isn't difficult but that's not [TS]

00:39:45   like that's not the heart of it the [TS]

00:39:47   heart of it is this stuff that you read [TS]

00:39:48   through the application the content so [TS]

00:39:50   yes he wrote an application it's a [TS]

00:39:53   newsstand application actually so for [TS]

00:39:55   the many of us who have nothing in [TS]

00:39:57   newsstand suddenly we if you subscribe [TS]

00:39:59   to this magazine you will have [TS]

00:40:01   something a newsstand finally for the [TS]

00:40:02   first time right the real benefit to [TS]

00:40:04   this is that we now finally have a [TS]

00:40:07   reason to potentially use newsstand yeah [TS]

00:40:10   and you will find it's infuriating to [TS]

00:40:11   use newsstand because you can't put it [TS]

00:40:13   in a folder and every time you want to [TS]

00:40:14   read the magazine even though it's the [TS]

00:40:16   only thing in newsstand you have to [TS]

00:40:17   first tap the newsstand I can manage [TS]

00:40:19   open and then tap the thing and then if [TS]

00:40:21   you happen to go back to the home screen [TS]

00:40:22   you realize how it's stuck in the [TS]

00:40:23   expanded newsstand thing and these are [TS]

00:40:25   all apples problems not Marcos problems [TS]

00:40:27   but yeah so he's created the magazine [TS]

00:40:29   it's a 199 per month with a free 7-day [TS]

00:40:33   trial I don't know what free 7-day trial [TS]

00:40:36   means in the context of a newsstand app [TS]

00:40:38   so i will let Marco explain that some [TS]

00:40:40   key parts this is from his article about [TS]

00:40:42   the magazine that link in the show notes [TS]

00:40:43   all subscriptions even during the fryer [TS]

00:40:46   even doing the free trial include access [TS]

00:40:48   to all back issues so if you were just [TS]

00:40:51   start your free trial you can look [TS]

00:40:52   backwards at all the passages of course [TS]

00:40:54   there's only one issue so far the day [TS]

00:40:55   this magazine was launched it launched [TS]

00:40:57   with issue number one what is the [TS]

00:40:59   magazine the magazine is a bunch of [TS]

00:41:02   articles that Marco believes would be [TS]

00:41:06   interesting to tech nerd type people [TS]

00:41:08   right but not necessarily about [TS]

00:41:09   technology he likens it to the way the [TS]

00:41:12   build and analyze is is not a show about [TS]

00:41:14   development it's a show for developers [TS]

00:41:16   filled with things that Marco believes [TS]

00:41:18   that people who are into iOS developing [TS]

00:41:19   a Mac development would be interested in [TS]

00:41:21   whether they be developed or related or [TS]

00:41:23   not and I would I would take that one [TS]

00:41:25   step back and say very much that five by [TS]

00:41:27   five is a network of shows for for geeks [TS]

00:41:33   as opposed to necessarily shows that are [TS]

00:41:36   always about those topics it's for [TS]

00:41:39   people who enjoy this kind of this kind [TS]

00:41:42   of thing in the magazine i think is uh i [TS]

00:41:43   mean look at look at they get a nice [TS]

00:41:45   roundup of articles this first issue [TS]

00:41:48   it's pretty good gy├Ârgy english as you [TS]

00:41:50   say Jason Snell a friend Alex Payne [TS]

00:41:53   michael la all have an article an issue [TS]

00:41:57   number one yeah you may or may not know [TS]

00:41:59   guy English uh he's another uh Mac [TS]

00:42:03   Developer nerd kind of guy also I think [TS]

00:42:07   he's back from the next days as well he [TS]

00:42:09   has his own blog that we've quoted on [TS]

00:42:10   the show frequently all-around good guy [TS]

00:42:12   he's got his own conference in fact [TS]

00:42:14   on right now as we record this is it is [TS]

00:42:18   it called the singleton conference it is [TS]

00:42:20   and the sea has a little like leach [TS]

00:42:22   hanging from it that's why it's Canadian [TS]

00:42:24   or something yeah anyway Jason's now of [TS]

00:42:29   course is the editorial director of [TS]

00:42:30   macworld or whatever his title is now [TS]

00:42:32   head pooh-bah macworld I think it's this [TS]

00:42:34   title Alex Payne hey wait hey boo by our [TS]

00:42:38   grand pooh-bah one of those two I think [TS]

00:42:40   it's grand yeah Alex Payne first I think [TS]

00:42:43   I first became aware of him when he was [TS]

00:42:45   talking about alternate like programming [TS]

00:42:46   languages like esoteric programming [TS]

00:42:48   languages all these esoteric some people [TS]

00:42:49   and he joined what was a first called [TS]

00:42:53   bank simple and changed names are just [TS]

00:42:55   simple right it's like it was going to [TS]

00:42:57   try to do an online bank the right way [TS]

00:42:59   he recently left that company yeah and [TS]

00:43:02   he wrote about that not that process but [TS]

00:43:06   part part of what caused him to leave or [TS]

00:43:09   I don't know you read the article you [TS]

00:43:11   say but it's he talked about it he talks [TS]

00:43:12   about a life change that's an example of [TS]

00:43:14   like he's not talking about his [TS]

00:43:15   programming languages that he's into and [TS]

00:43:17   that you know how to manage an engineer [TS]

00:43:19   organization or the development process [TS]

00:43:20   he's talking about a change of life it [TS]

00:43:22   just happens to be written by someone [TS]

00:43:24   who is a developer nur but it's more [TS]

00:43:26   widely applicable than michael lop which [TS]

00:43:29   you may know from his rands in repose [TS]

00:43:30   website blog so and so forth is writing [TS]

00:43:34   about how do you wrangle engineers and [TS]

00:43:36   how do you make a successful tech [TS]

00:43:40   company and what are the forces that [TS]

00:43:41   work there he talks about the same type [TS]

00:43:43   of stuff on his blog so these things are [TS]

00:43:47   about a thousand words each summer [TS]

00:43:50   longer some are shorter but that's like [TS]

00:43:52   that's estimating how long these [TS]

00:43:54   articles are and there was five of them [TS]

00:43:57   are now four of them plus the forward [TS]

00:43:58   for in this first issue and for two [TS]

00:44:02   dollars a month that's what you get [TS]

00:44:04   every believe it's every two weeks [TS]

00:44:06   there's another issue and i believe it [TS]

00:44:12   is auto renewing as well so if you were [TS]

00:44:16   to sign up for new stand every two weeks [TS]

00:44:17   you would go into newsstand it would be [TS]

00:44:18   a new issue of the magazine and you'd [TS]

00:44:19   read four or five whatever however many [TS]

00:44:22   articles handful of articles about a [TS]

00:44:23   thousand words in length from thoughtful [TS]

00:44:26   nerdy type people about thoughtful or [TS]

00:44:28   topics part of the the FAQ or the [TS]

00:44:32   forward about the magazine Marco [TS]

00:44:35   mentions that he is not currently [TS]

00:44:38   accepting advertising but does not want [TS]

00:44:41   to close the door on it but for now [TS]

00:44:43   basically how does the magazine work you [TS]

00:44:46   pay money to read it and that's how they [TS]

00:44:49   make money like it's a very traditional [TS]

00:44:51   business model it could be that some day [TS]

00:44:53   he also takes money from advertisers who [TS]

00:44:55   did not want to close the door on that [TS]

00:44:56   but right now that's not how it's [TS]

00:44:57   working right he didn't say no [TS]

00:44:59   advertisers he says right now no [TS]

00:45:01   advertise yep and he pays the people who [TS]

00:45:04   write the articles this is radical [TS]

00:45:05   business plan amazing you all the right [TS]

00:45:08   articles then you collect their works [TS]

00:45:09   into a thing and then people pay to read [TS]

00:45:11   it the most and then he distributes it [TS]

00:45:13   yeah it's crazy and you read it in Iowa [TS]

00:45:16   yeah the most interesting thing about it [TS]

00:45:18   from a writer's perspective is that if [TS]

00:45:20   you write something for the magazine you [TS]

00:45:23   can also post it to your own blog or [TS]

00:45:25   wherever you want after like a month or [TS]

00:45:27   something I figure what the waiting [TS]

00:45:28   period is seems fine so that stops [TS]

00:45:32   people I'm saying okay well I have this [TS]

00:45:34   great idea for a thousand word article [TS]

00:45:35   and it's really interesting and I'd like [TS]

00:45:37   to write it but if I write it for the [TS]

00:45:39   magazine only people who subscribe this [TS]

00:45:41   magazine will ever see it and I don't [TS]

00:45:43   know how many people that's going to be [TS]

00:45:44   so I feel like I'm limiting my audience [TS]

00:45:46   writing for the magazine and Marco says [TS]

00:45:48   is you can post this to your blog just [TS]

00:45:50   give it a month we'll put it in the [TS]

00:45:52   magazine you wait until month is passed [TS]

00:45:54   then you can put it on your blog you [TS]

00:45:56   retain copyright on your work right and [TS]

00:45:58   so that's the best of both worlds get [TS]

00:46:00   paid to write something interesting but [TS]

00:46:01   also be able to have it at a permanent [TS]

00:46:04   URL on your own blog that you still own [TS]

00:46:06   so the entire world can read it so that [TS]

00:46:09   is a novel concept that I haven't seen [TS]

00:46:13   any publications that I've ever written [TS]

00:46:15   for although various times I have [TS]

00:46:17   requested it like I remember way back [TS]

00:46:19   when I requested that any blog post I [TS]

00:46:21   made to my old fat bits blog I could [TS]

00:46:22   also republish on my own blog if I [TS]

00:46:24   wanted of course I haven't but I could [TS]

00:46:25   if I wanted so I think that's a great [TS]

00:46:28   idea and the second great idea is the [TS]

00:46:30   same great idea that that a lot of these [TS]

00:46:33   indymac iOS developers have or a lot of [TS]

00:46:36   the people who we talked about or people [TS]

00:46:37   like John Gruber [TS]

00:46:38   or down ripple or all these other people [TS]

00:46:41   is that the way you make money is by [TS]

00:46:43   spending less money then comes into you [TS]

00:46:46   that's the secret to profit what is it [TS]

00:46:49   there's some equation that you can point [TS]

00:46:51   out like that it's like income minus [TS]

00:46:53   expenditures all right that's how it [TS]

00:46:54   works so he has low overhead he doesn't [TS]

00:46:57   have a staff of 800 people working like [TS]

00:46:59   the daily or whatever Barack's thing was [TS]

00:47:01   right he hasn't commissioned 25 iOS [TS]

00:47:04   developers to make an application with [TS]

00:47:06   the 3d rotating carousel for you know [TS]

00:47:08   paying them each 200 grand a year plus [TS]

00:47:10   their health insurance and everything [TS]

00:47:11   for a year to develop this application [TS]

00:47:13   right he does not have a staff of [TS]

00:47:15   reporters going out and collecting news [TS]

00:47:17   he doesn't have photographers on staff [TS]

00:47:19   he doesn't have like he has very low [TS]

00:47:21   over it he wrote the application himself [TS]

00:47:23   right the application shows articles [TS]

00:47:27   right it's not it you know not that it [TS]

00:47:28   was not difficult to do but it's it's [TS]

00:47:30   not there's no fancy 3d carousel let's [TS]

00:47:32   say that alright I don't think he even [TS]

00:47:34   has the 3d page curl animation thing [TS]

00:47:36   just because that would be pained [TS]

00:47:37   implement so that was low overhead as [TS]

00:47:38   well what do you have to do to get [TS]

00:47:40   something into here you write an article [TS]

00:47:42   he puts it in there I bet the CMS for [TS]

00:47:44   this thing is not you know the most [TS]

00:47:46   amazing thing that made but doesn't have [TS]

00:47:48   to be it's you know for Little articles [TS]

00:47:49   a week so how many subscribers to the [TS]

00:47:53   magazine does he need to make it [TS]

00:47:54   profitable probably not as many as we [TS]

00:47:57   all think because his overhead is so low [TS]

00:47:59   his the biggest expenses as was his time [TS]

00:48:02   to develop the application and the [TS]

00:48:05   biggest recurring expenses the cost of [TS]

00:48:06   paying the writers and in in the forward [TS]

00:48:09   what he says is if it doesn't turn a [TS]

00:48:11   profit within two months which is just [TS]

00:48:13   for issues I'll shut it down so that's [TS]

00:48:15   his business plan he decided is going to [TS]

00:48:16   solve two bucks a month it's issue every [TS]

00:48:20   two weeks he pays the writers a [TS]

00:48:22   reasonable amount of money he wants to [TS]

00:48:24   make a little pro to profit above that [TS]

00:48:25   and if he doesn't get enough subscribers [TS]

00:48:27   to start turning a profit in two months [TS]

00:48:30   then he'll stop and you know failed [TS]

00:48:32   experiment right this sounds like a very [TS]

00:48:35   low-risk way to try something out that [TS]

00:48:38   he is interested in he would I think [TS]

00:48:39   he's making something that he would like [TS]

00:48:41   he would like to have something a [TS]

00:48:42   newsstand it's useful right it shows him [TS]

00:48:44   articles that he likes collected by [TS]

00:48:45   somebody who's tasty trust and every [TS]

00:48:48   once while you go and read it and it's [TS]

00:48:49   cheap it's cheap enough you can go ahead [TS]

00:48:50   two bucks a month plan on a big [TS]

00:48:51   alright so it's not really expensive [TS]

00:48:53   doesn't take a million years to read it [TS]

00:48:55   they're not big giant are because a lot [TS]

00:48:56   of my Mac os10 review is going to be in [TS]

00:48:57   there filled with images and movies and [TS]

00:49:00   you know secret tool tips and stuff it's [TS]

00:49:02   like you know it's type of stuff that [TS]

00:49:04   you would expect from some of them made [TS]

00:49:05   Instapaper you just want to sit there [TS]

00:49:06   anyone to read something and it's just [TS]

00:49:08   text and it's nicely rendered text and [TS]

00:49:10   and doesn't seem like you need to have a [TS]

00:49:14   staff of thousands and huge overhead to [TS]

00:49:16   do that and so if you can just get [TS]

00:49:17   enough like-minded people to subscribe [TS]

00:49:19   for two dollars a month the sudden that [TS]

00:49:20   becomes a profitable business and maybe [TS]

00:49:22   it grows from there and gains reputation [TS]

00:49:24   he becomes a publishing mogul someday or [TS]

00:49:26   he doesn't and not enough people [TS]

00:49:27   subscribe and he stops it but what did [TS]

00:49:28   he lose during that time you know he [TS]

00:49:30   lost his time he lost a little bit of [TS]

00:49:31   money but not that much right um of [TS]

00:49:35   course his biggest I think his big as [TS]

00:49:37   ace in the hole here is that he didn't [TS]

00:49:38   have the pain he went to write the [TS]

00:49:39   application like he already knows how to [TS]

00:49:41   do that and I bet probably leverage some [TS]

00:49:43   of his code and exit expertise certainly [TS]

00:49:45   and possibly also some code from [TS]

00:49:47   Instapaper because what it's Instapaper [TS]

00:49:48   for doing make it's a nice way to read [TS]

00:49:50   text it's got an iOS version that works [TS]

00:49:52   on the iphone you know ipod touch and [TS]

00:49:54   ipad and he's making another application [TS]

00:49:56   that works on those same platforms the [TS]

00:49:58   best example is in typical Marco fashion [TS]

00:50:02   it looks like a simple application but [TS]

00:50:03   there are clever things in there so if [TS]

00:50:04   you go to an article in the magazine [TS]

00:50:06   which I'm assuming you can pull up now [TS]

00:50:08   Dan because I'm assuming you subscribed [TS]

00:50:09   as well so you're contractually [TS]

00:50:11   obligated to mm-hmm by Marco you come [TS]

00:50:13   and find you I I don't have an iOS [TS]

00:50:15   devices near me while I record but I in [TS]

00:50:17   theory yes I could do what you're saying [TS]

00:50:19   alright so I've got it up here so if [TS]

00:50:20   you're reading an article I'm looking at [TS]

00:50:22   or whose Ark my looking at now guy [TS]

00:50:24   English's our first are clear and it's [TS]

00:50:26   it's hypertext it's got links in it [TS]

00:50:28   right it's not the New York Times where [TS]

00:50:29   they forget to put links into things [TS]

00:50:31   they you know they mention a website but [TS]

00:50:34   that you can't click on the name of the [TS]

00:50:35   website to go there because of the New [TS]

00:50:36   York Times anyway it's written in HTML [TS]

00:50:38   hypertext so if you have a link when you [TS]

00:50:41   tap on that link what you see on the on [TS]

00:50:43   the the phone or iPod version of it is [TS]

00:50:45   that a little pain slides up over [TS]

00:50:48   covering about a third of the screen yes [TS]

00:50:50   on the bottom it's black and it's got [TS]

00:50:51   the white text on it very readable yeah [TS]

00:50:54   and it what it shows is the title of [TS]

00:50:56   that thing that you clicked on like the [TS]

00:50:57   title of that page and like a byline and [TS]

00:50:59   then some introductory text not the full [TS]

00:51:02   text of the article but a little bit of [TS]

00:51:03   interactive test and if it doesn't fit [TS]

00:51:04   on the screen [TS]

00:51:05   you can scroll this is on the iphone [TS]

00:51:06   version of it right and it doesn't cover [TS]

00:51:09   up the entire thing that you were [TS]

00:51:10   reading so you can kind of get gist of [TS]

00:51:11   what it's going to say and I'm assuming [TS]

00:51:13   he's using insta papers like text afire [TS]

00:51:15   because it's taking a big giant web page [TS]

00:51:17   and just showing you like you know an [TS]

00:51:18   inch of it on your screen and if you [TS]

00:51:20   didn't use something like Instapaper [TS]

00:51:21   sexta fire all you would see was like [TS]

00:51:23   the top banner ad like the navigation or [TS]

00:51:25   something like that he's he's extracting [TS]

00:51:27   the the content portion of the page and [TS]

00:51:30   showing you just that so you can go you [TS]

00:51:32   know you click on that link to see what [TS]

00:51:34   it is but you don't you're not committed [TS]

00:51:35   to followed to really follow that link [TS]

00:51:37   yet it's showing you a small preview and [TS]

00:51:39   the first paragraph or so of text from [TS]

00:51:41   that thing and if you really want to see [TS]

00:51:43   it then click on the link in the title [TS]

00:51:45   there and go to the full article ah so [TS]

00:51:49   instead of just saying oh I'm going to [TS]

00:51:50   put a web view and I'm going to put the [TS]

00:51:51   article content in it and then I'm done [TS]

00:51:53   right he's done more than that he's made [TS]

00:51:57   it you know and the first time that [TS]

00:51:58   happened it just felt natural to me and [TS]

00:52:01   then I thought about it wait a second he [TS]

00:52:02   had to implement it that's not some like [TS]

00:52:03   built-in feature right when you tap on a [TS]

00:52:05   link I just want to see what is this [TS]

00:52:07   thing should I read this or whatever and [TS]

00:52:08   he since he's someone who reads things [TS]

00:52:10   in Instapaper probably has a sensitive [TS]

00:52:11   or by the way I like it it shows that [TS]

00:52:14   little preview let's see what else and [TS]

00:52:17   on the I iPad iteration of this thing it [TS]

00:52:20   does a popover which is a little bit [TS]

00:52:22   bigger and doesn't slide up and cover [TS]

00:52:23   the whole bottom of the page but a [TS]

00:52:24   similar type of idea so that that's an [TS]

00:52:25   example of him leveraging his own [TS]

00:52:27   expertise in doing this in probably his [TS]

00:52:29   own code you can talk about that on his [TS]

00:52:30   show is he actually using the Instapaper [TS]

00:52:32   text extractor I would assume he is yeah [TS]

00:52:34   of course I don't know I don't even know [TS]

00:52:36   I don't even need to ask him of course [TS]

00:52:37   he's right so that's that's his that's [TS]

00:52:40   his uh what do you call it as he heads [TS]

00:52:43   you would say his ace in the hole his [TS]

00:52:45   bread-and-butter golden Hank the golden [TS]

00:52:47   goose goose laid the golden egg right so [TS]

00:52:49   this is a very people were trying to [TS]

00:52:51   think of what is Mark we're gonna do for [TS]

00:52:52   his next step if they were thinking like [TS]

00:52:54   he's gonna make like he's gonna make a [TS]

00:52:56   massively multiplayer online game or [TS]

00:53:00   he's gonna like just totally crazy sorts [TS]

00:53:02   of things you were thinking of in [TS]

00:53:05   retrospect like many moves it seems like [TS]

00:53:07   all it's obvious he would do something [TS]

00:53:09   that if he's gonna do something like as [TS]

00:53:12   an experiment he can mitigate risk by [TS]

00:53:14   doing something Queen we kind of knows [TS]

00:53:15   what he's doing on the other hand it's a [TS]

00:53:17   big risk because [TS]

00:53:19   as I think he's talking about it [TS]

00:53:21   singleton I'm judging judging by the [TS]

00:53:23   tweets that I'm staying marco by the way [TS]

00:53:24   is presenting at the singleton [TS]

00:53:25   conference this week I believe his talk [TS]

00:53:28   had something to do with uh being [TS]

00:53:33   audacious I think one of the things I [TS]

00:53:34   saw quoted on Twitter was that authority [TS]

00:53:37   is not given it has to be taken and so [TS]

00:53:40   he that's the Klingon way is that one [TS]

00:53:43   yeah you know about that you've lived it [TS]

00:53:45   yeah I can't I can't wait to see his [TS]

00:53:49   talk because uh for one he did the talk [TS]

00:53:51   without slides which is which is [TS]

00:53:53   brilliant because this is totally in the [TS]

00:53:56   independent Mac Developer way of doing [TS]

00:53:58   things which seems like it could be [TS]

00:54:00   totally motivated by laziness and [TS]

00:54:02   partially it kind of is but the other [TS]

00:54:04   secret is that doing less work is better [TS]

00:54:08   if you're a one-man operation so it's [TS]

00:54:10   better for Marco not to have to wrangle [TS]

00:54:12   a staff of thousands but it's also [TS]

00:54:14   better for the product because it just [TS]

00:54:15   simplifies it and clarifies it like a [TS]

00:54:17   lot of the things that you think you [TS]

00:54:18   need you don't necessarily need he [TS]

00:54:20   references the louis ck story and his [TS]

00:54:23   forward i believe we're louis ck kept [TS]

00:54:25   asking his agent do we need to do those [TS]

00:54:26   stupid radio PR hit promote my right my [TS]

00:54:30   comedy club near like all this is what [TS]

00:54:31   you do you go into a city you have a [TS]

00:54:32   comedy show you got to go on stupid [TS]

00:54:34   radio station it's like yeah but do we [TS]

00:54:35   need to do that as such something we [TS]

00:54:36   always do I said you know what let's try [TS]

00:54:38   not doing that and he didn't do that and [TS]

00:54:40   didn't make a difference and so he's [TS]

00:54:42   like going out around to do that anymore [TS]

00:54:43   well so can you do a presentation [TS]

00:54:44   without slides my kind of slides that's [TS]

00:54:47   what a presentation is but do you need [TS]

00:54:49   to have slides or can't just not do that [TS]

00:54:50   part and it works just as well uh and [TS]

00:54:53   that's the experiment that he ran and [TS]

00:54:54   for the taking authority thing Marco has [TS]

00:54:58   gone from a guy who works at tumblr and [TS]

00:55:00   is you know developer doing their web [TS]

00:55:02   back in two and then he wrote like a nap [TS]

00:55:04   in his spare time and then he became a [TS]

00:55:05   guy who has a very popular success for [TS]

00:55:09   iOS application so he's like oh I'm an [TS]

00:55:10   iOS developer right and now he and then [TS]

00:55:13   he became you know i have a blog that i [TS]

00:55:15   write stuff on and yeah I review light [TS]

00:55:17   bulbs and do all sorts of crazy thing [TS]

00:55:19   like that and talk about coffee beans [TS]

00:55:20   and stuff right ah now I'm a writer why [TS]

00:55:22   am I writer cuz I have a thing and I [TS]

00:55:24   write on it i'm declaring myself a [TS]

00:55:26   writer so now he's he's not just an iOS [TS]

00:55:29   developer now he's a writer and now with [TS]

00:55:32   the magazine he's [TS]

00:55:32   okay well I'm an iOS developer so i can [TS]

00:55:34   write an application and i'm a writer or [TS]

00:55:37   he's also a podcaster how did it become [TS]

00:55:39   a podcaster he has a podcast and i said [TS]

00:55:41   wat phnom a podcast just go and do it [TS]

00:55:43   right and now he's a publisher and an [TS]

00:55:46   editor he's editing these articles those [TS]

00:55:48   things so he's a publisher a knitter and [TS]

00:55:49   why is he a publisher never known [TS]

00:55:50   anointed him a publisher and editor he's [TS]

00:55:52   a publisher and header because he has a [TS]

00:55:53   publication that he publishes and edits [TS]

00:55:55   all right so I mean this is kind of the [TS]

00:55:59   way it works no one else externally is [TS]

00:56:02   going to just declare that Marco Arment [TS]

00:56:05   creator instapaper is now a publisher uh [TS]

00:56:08   he declares it by publishing something [TS]

00:56:11   right he may be a failed publisher if [TS]

00:56:13   this doesn't work or he could be a [TS]

00:56:14   massively successful publisher and then [TS]

00:56:15   people say Marco army that's the guy [TS]

00:56:17   behind the magazine it's like did you [TS]

00:56:18   know he had he also used to write an [TS]

00:56:19   application called instapaper did you [TS]

00:56:20   know he worked for tumblr once did you [TS]

00:56:22   know that like I believe his talk is [TS]

00:56:24   about scaling a career because the theme [TS]

00:56:26   of singleton is scaling and so if you [TS]

00:56:28   trace Marcos career he's been many [TS]

00:56:29   different things in more in many [TS]

00:56:30   different hats this is going to turn [TS]

00:56:32   into a back to work episode again but [TS]

00:56:34   you've done the same thing right you [TS]

00:56:36   weren't you know just a couple few short [TS]

00:56:38   years ago you weren't Dan Benjamin a [TS]

00:56:41   podcast network mogul your den venchan [TS]

00:56:44   am I am I've had no thank you well I [TS]

00:56:48   mean no but I understand you I [TS]

00:56:49   understand your point what you're saying [TS]

00:56:50   is how do you create a publishing [TS]

00:56:54   company start publishing stuff how do [TS]

00:56:56   you become a writer I start writing [TS]

00:56:58   right was like it if you how do you live [TS]

00:57:01   in san francisco and and drive a jet car [TS]

00:57:03   ease let's move to san francisco there [TS]

00:57:06   you go yessuh and you were that guy who [TS]

00:57:09   talks at rails conferences or that guy [TS]

00:57:12   who the corked guy was that you like you [TS]

00:57:14   know when people your name would come up [TS]

00:57:15   with so many different things they could [TS]

00:57:17   have associated with your name now of [TS]

00:57:18   course your name comes out the people [TS]

00:57:19   think five by five but if I don't have [TS]

00:57:20   didn't exist right many years ago and [TS]

00:57:22   just merely by doing it but you know you [TS]

00:57:25   should you should give it talk about [TS]

00:57:25   scaling a career because you demarco [TS]

00:57:27   have good stories to tell about that and [TS]

00:57:30   of course the timing of this you'll talk [TS]

00:57:34   to Marco I'm sure about the timing but [TS]

00:57:35   the timing it was almost perfect because [TS]

00:57:36   the magazine comes out and then he jets [TS]

00:57:38   off to Canada to talk at this conference [TS]

00:57:39   and I'm assuming if like say is the [TS]

00:57:42   magazine application had not been [TS]

00:57:44   approved in time [TS]

00:57:45   maybe a hold maybe a whole different [TS]

00:57:47   talk maybe gives the same talking says [TS]

00:57:49   I'm now announcing an application but of [TS]

00:57:51   course hasn't gotten through a brutal [TS]

00:57:52   yet but that that was quite a chicken [TS]

00:57:54   race with the app approval process that [TS]

00:57:56   he was running there and it seems like [TS]

00:57:58   it was pretty close so I'm sure he has [TS]

00:57:59   some good stories to tell about that um [TS]

00:58:01   so yeah one more one more note on the [TS]

00:58:07   the the one point 0 version of the [TS]

00:58:11   magazine it had a bug in it the Marco [TS]

00:58:15   knew about of course before it was [TS]

00:58:16   approved because that's just the nature [TS]

00:58:17   of approval so he's got to be sitting [TS]

00:58:18   there seething going uh there's this [TS]

00:58:20   thing I've got the thick sport ready but [TS]

00:58:22   I need to get the one point 0 through to [TS]

00:58:24   be approved and the bug was that if you [TS]

00:58:25   had two different devices like you've [TS]

00:58:27   got an iphone and an ipad and you [TS]

00:58:29   subscribe to it on your iPhone when you [TS]

00:58:31   went to your iPad and tried to look at [TS]

00:58:33   it it would try to confirm your [TS]

00:58:35   subscription and fail and he just had a [TS]

00:58:37   bug in there because for subscribing [TS]

00:58:39   multiple devices and you immediately [TS]

00:58:41   submitted the one point 0 point on [TS]

00:58:42   version and he used his expedited you [TS]

00:58:45   know developer thing to put that out and [TS]

00:58:48   then it came out like the same day was [TS]

00:58:51   it the same day I don't remember I think [TS]

00:58:52   it might have been the on the exact [TS]

00:58:54   launch day by night time the new version [TS]

00:58:56   was out so this was just a tiny glitch [TS]

00:58:58   but uh that was another chicken rice [TS]

00:59:01   work you know he could have I assume [TS]

00:59:03   pulled the one point O and say oh this [TS]

00:59:04   is this is a showstopper I don't want [TS]

00:59:06   people to try to subscribe into devices [TS]

00:59:07   and have it fail instead he just you [TS]

00:59:10   know damn the torpedoes plow ahead one [TS]

00:59:12   point no one get it shoved through get [TS]

00:59:13   it to come out as quickly as possible [TS]

00:59:15   and in practice I don't think it was a [TS]

00:59:16   problem for anybody because I know I [TS]

00:59:18   tried to install it on my iPad I got the [TS]

00:59:20   error and then like an hour later the [TS]

00:59:22   new thing was out of course now [TS]

00:59:23   everything is all cured hunky-dory is as [TS]

00:59:26   they say so there's a guy in a balloon [TS]

00:59:29   now jumping out of that bloom from like [TS]

00:59:31   90,000 feet to do the world's highest [TS]

00:59:33   skydive or whatever but I think Marco [TS]

00:59:35   didn't jump out of a capsule strung on a [TS]

00:59:37   bloom but he did quite a daring high [TS]

00:59:40   wire act with the introduction of this [TS]

00:59:42   application because remember like while [TS]

00:59:44   he's doing this he's running Instapaper [TS]

00:59:46   stuff and get preparing a presentation [TS]

00:59:48   to talk about this stuff at the same [TS]

00:59:49   time he's trying to actually get this [TS]

00:59:50   thing through and fix bugs in it so it [TS]

00:59:53   was I applaud his efforts I don't know [TS]

00:59:56   how the jumper guy how that turned out [TS]

00:59:58   for him [TS]

00:59:59   but I think [TS]

00:59:59   but I think [TS]

01:00:00   Oracle landed safely so far very cute so [TS]

01:00:05   what do you think of us handicapped [TS]

01:00:09   Marcos odds of success with the magazine [TS]

01:00:11   oh I think it's a shoo-in and do you [TS]

01:00:15   think it's a shoo-in because lots of [TS]

01:00:17   people will want to pay two dollars a [TS]

01:00:19   month to read eight or nine blog length [TS]

01:00:23   articles from nerd people I'll tell you [TS]

01:00:26   I'll give you a few reasons why should I [TS]

01:00:28   make it exciting and do a sponsor first [TS]

01:00:30   or should I that's your way then yes [TS]

01:00:32   let's do this and then little bit our [TS]

01:00:34   next sponsors hover com I actually [TS]

01:00:37   registered three domains today this is [TS]

01:00:41   what they do their domain name registrar [TS]

01:00:42   but they're they're different there's [TS]

01:00:45   simplified domain management and it's [TS]

01:00:47   not just about going there and [TS]

01:00:48   registering it's about going there and [TS]

01:00:50   managing your domains and there's a [TS]

01:00:52   subtle difference let me tell you about [TS]

01:00:53   it you've probably gone to one of these [TS]

01:00:55   other folks and register the domain with [TS]

01:00:57   them and a lot of the time they saw you [TS]

01:00:59   stuff you're not interested in or they [TS]

01:01:01   they up-sell you on on tons of things [TS]

01:01:03   just just so that you want it you just [TS]

01:01:05   want to go and check out register domain [TS]

01:01:06   and that's it and be gone or you want to [TS]

01:01:09   go and edit your dns anyone will wade [TS]

01:01:11   through fifty thousand different menus [TS]

01:01:12   to do it these guys are simple now of [TS]

01:01:15   course you can register ComNet they do [TS]

01:01:16   all the big ones but they do all the [TS]

01:01:18   little ones too and I loved little ones [TS]

01:01:19   like dot Co TVs some of my favorites [TS]

01:01:21   they make it easy just type the domain [TS]

01:01:23   name you want into their search box if [TS]

01:01:25   it's available they'll tell you it's [TS]

01:01:27   available i'll also show you some [TS]

01:01:28   alternatives you might not have thought [TS]

01:01:29   of if it's not available then i'll say [TS]

01:01:31   hey man you can't register it it's taken [TS]

01:01:33   but look there here's some other ones [TS]

01:01:35   you can just go and type in a word you [TS]

01:01:36   can type in phrases they'll check it all [TS]

01:01:38   out and its really really convenient and [TS]

01:01:40   it's not just all bunch of stupid [TS]

01:01:42   suggestions they're really good [TS]

01:01:43   suggestions so go there and check it out [TS]

01:01:47   where you go to hover com / dan sent me [TS]

01:01:51   or just use the code Dan sent me and [TS]

01:01:54   you'll get ten percent off everything [TS]

01:01:56   you buy it includes DNS management [TS]

01:01:58   they'll transfer your domains they do [TS]

01:02:00   that you know the domain name transfers [TS]

01:02:01   when you transfer domain from another [TS]

01:02:04   registrar you get the time that you had [TS]

01:02:06   left at the other registrar plus a year [TS]

01:02:08   you don't lose the time they keep that [TS]

01:02:10   for you and you can get ten percent off [TS]

01:02:13   it to go dance [TS]

01:02:13   they do email hosting they do all of [TS]

01:02:16   that stuff and they have human beings [TS]

01:02:18   who will answer the phone toll-free [TS]

01:02:19   number on every page of their site and [TS]

01:02:20   if you don't want to go through that [TS]

01:02:22   transferring of the domain name process [TS]

01:02:24   they'll do it for you you're just calm [TS]

01:02:26   and say do it and then do it check them [TS]

01:02:28   out Robert calm dan sent me all right [TS]

01:02:32   I'll tell you why I think this thing is [TS]

01:02:33   going to win first of all Marco has made [TS]

01:02:36   quite a name for himself as the guy who [TS]

01:02:39   gets indie publishing and he has created [TS]

01:02:44   the perfect vehicle for indie publishing [TS]

01:02:45   we all know I mean those of us who love [TS]

01:02:48   our iphones and our iOS devices as [TS]

01:02:50   amazing as the browsing experience is on [TS]

01:02:56   especially device like an iPad but on an [TS]

01:02:57   iPhone to browsing around is not really [TS]

01:03:01   the best way for a lot of us to get our [TS]

01:03:03   content a lot of people use newsreaders [TS]

01:03:05   a lot of people are interested in [TS]

01:03:08   getting content a different way look at [TS]

01:03:09   the good things like Flipboard look at [TS]

01:03:11   things like Twitter I mean that's just [TS]

01:03:12   different ways for us to get our content [TS]

01:03:14   and what Marco has done here is he said [TS]

01:03:16   look at let's take this stupid newsstand [TS]

01:03:17   thing that nobody's putting out good [TS]

01:03:19   content for and I'll combine it I'm [TS]

01:03:23   speaking as Marco right now and he [TS]

01:03:25   hasn't he hasn't told me anything I know [TS]

01:03:26   I know less probably than everybody else [TS]

01:03:28   about this and he says look I this [TS]

01:03:32   Instapaper platform is really great [TS]

01:03:33   because I'm getting content from all [TS]

01:03:35   around the web and I've written software [TS]

01:03:36   that's making it able to I'm essentially [TS]

01:03:40   pulling that content into one place [TS]

01:03:42   based on users requests and making it [TS]

01:03:44   easier for them to read why don't I just [TS]

01:03:45   stop pulling content from around and [TS]

01:03:47   just get the content myself it's the [TS]

01:03:49   same exact model if you think about it [TS]

01:03:50   using Apple's infrastructure to [TS]

01:03:53   distribute this to people and instead of [TS]

01:03:55   just relying on content to be created [TS]

01:03:58   and users to find the content he's [TS]

01:04:00   saying I know a thing or two about [TS]

01:04:01   curating content in fact let me go and [TS]

01:04:03   take it a step further and work directly [TS]

01:04:05   with the writers built this thing [TS]

01:04:06   together so it's he's distill down the [TS]

01:04:09   things of in about Instapaper that or a [TS]

01:04:12   couple of the things about Instapaper [TS]

01:04:13   that have made it successful and that [TS]

01:04:14   people really like and he's taking the [TS]

01:04:16   work out of it it's like do it's like [TS]

01:04:17   Instapaper without the work because when [TS]

01:04:20   you've got to work to use Instapaper oh [TS]

01:04:22   I want to read this article Instapaper [TS]

01:04:24   later I'm going to go in and have the [TS]

01:04:25   thing and some [TS]

01:04:26   already he said look I'll just I'll just [TS]

01:04:28   make some really great stuff for you [TS]

01:04:29   it's a combination of the you know the [TS]

01:04:33   feature and the brief and all that to [TS]

01:04:35   pull together here's some content don't [TS]

01:04:37   do anything will send it to you of [TS]

01:04:39   course it's going to work and it's two [TS]

01:04:41   bucks a month like that's not a lot of [TS]

01:04:42   money for really anybody if you have an [TS]

01:04:45   iPhone the extra two bucks to get [TS]

01:04:48   something like this i think if you find [TS]

01:04:50   it's right up your alley is easy and [TS]

01:04:52   because it's their apples infrastructure [TS]

01:04:53   you don't have to worry very much about [TS]

01:04:54   well if you don't like it I'll just stop [TS]

01:04:56   getting it you have to well who do i [TS]

01:04:57   email about that no just stop getting it [TS]

01:05:00   done two bucks there's a couple [TS]

01:05:02   interesting things about instant paper [TS]

01:05:04   and publications in their relationship [TS]

01:05:06   the marcos talked about at length and it [TS]

01:05:07   shows but one of the complaints from [TS]

01:05:09   publishers to sometimes they'll people [TS]

01:05:11   come to our site and then they click [TS]

01:05:12   their little read later button in there [TS]

01:05:14   bookmark bar on their browser and it [TS]

01:05:16   scrapes archon right its craters the [TS]

01:05:18   content they don't get ads as your [TS]

01:05:20   promise it removes the ads and stuff [TS]

01:05:22   like that there it's legit despite the [TS]

01:05:24   fact that you know they've already given [TS]

01:05:25   you your page for you and stuff like I [TS]

01:05:26   knee and Marco is waffles various times [TS]

01:05:28   on doing the multi page scraping versus [TS]

01:05:30   not doing it blob lice talked about that [TS]

01:05:32   on the show right so now here Marco is [TS]

01:05:34   calling the other side of the fence say [TS]

01:05:35   I'm going to be a publisher ah and the [TS]

01:05:39   things he publishes first of all like [TS]

01:05:40   you look in the magazine app they look [TS]

01:05:42   like they've already been Instapaper [TS]

01:05:43   because like there's not there's no [TS]

01:05:45   banner ads no navigation it's just like [TS]

01:05:48   nicely formatted text but I don't even [TS]

01:05:50   know if there's a choice of font thinks [TS]

01:05:51   just like font size up down a limited [TS]

01:05:54   limited options for the one point now [TS]

01:05:55   i'm sure that will flush out sec to it [TS]

01:05:57   but anyway it looks like it's already [TS]

01:05:59   means the paper but then i can imagine [TS]

01:06:01   publishers going out Oh Marco how you're [TS]

01:06:03   trying to sell this publication how [TS]

01:06:04   would you feel people go and start [TS]

01:06:05   Instapaper your Oracle's well in the [TS]

01:06:07   application I think it's in that let me [TS]

01:06:09   look at it now oh but the magazine oh my [TS]

01:06:15   poor slow ipod touch what do we have [TS]

01:06:19   here you need to get new on those maybe [TS]

01:06:23   it's not in here another it is at the [TS]

01:06:24   top yeah there's a share button in the [TS]

01:06:27   upper right hand corner of every single [TS]

01:06:28   article you look at and the options are [TS]

01:06:30   the typical iOS you know iOS 6 share [TS]

01:06:32   things mail message twitter facebook [TS]

01:06:34   copy and send to instapaper he's [TS]

01:06:38   integrated the [TS]

01:06:40   raping quote-unquote of his publication [TS]

01:06:42   it's in the application to his own [TS]

01:06:44   things then you could send it to [TS]

01:06:45   instapaper from here now I'm not [TS]

01:06:47   entirely sure why you would do that but [TS]

01:06:49   it does something because like I said it [TS]

01:06:50   looks there's no reason there's nothing [TS]

01:06:51   on this page that makes you want to oh I [TS]

01:06:53   can't read this here I gotta look at it [TS]

01:06:54   instead of a ver it already looks nice [TS]

01:06:55   right but it's integrated into the thing [TS]

01:06:58   because that's taking advantage of a [TS]

01:07:01   feature that instapaper has that other [TS]

01:07:02   services don't which is that it can send [TS]

01:07:04   the content to something that isn't on [TS]

01:07:06   the public web like you can only see [TS]

01:07:08   these magazine articles least until a [TS]

01:07:09   month later by subscribing right but [TS]

01:07:14   since it's the paper doesn't just send [TS]

01:07:15   the URL Instapaper it takes the actual [TS]

01:07:17   page content and sends it and instead [TS]

01:07:19   paper can accept the page content you [TS]

01:07:21   can send this stuff to instapaper and [TS]

01:07:23   all by the way you can also select and [TS]

01:07:25   copy and paste the text which is another [TS]

01:07:26   infuriating thing that these in a [TS]

01:07:28   newsstand applications would do like [TS]

01:07:30   you'd get this new same application [TS]

01:07:31   would download 700 megabytes of crappy [TS]

01:07:34   images and image based text and then you [TS]

01:07:36   can't copy and paste from any of up is [TS]

01:07:37   oh no you can't select text that would [TS]

01:07:39   violate our copyright like that so he's [TS]

01:07:41   walking the walk all the the exact the [TS]

01:07:43   key and lock fit between how Instapaper [TS]

01:07:45   works and how he believes the public aid [TS]

01:07:47   like if you made money by selling your [TS]

01:07:49   publication with login the only people [TS]

01:07:51   who pay money can see those articles [TS]

01:07:52   instapaper will let you send them to [TS]

01:07:55   instapaper in that way as well but if [TS]

01:07:56   you make a publication that is nicely [TS]

01:07:58   formatted that there's no reason for [TS]

01:07:59   anyone descended Instapaper uh a they've [TS]

01:08:01   already giving your money anyway and be [TS]

01:08:03   why not let them because no skin off [TS]

01:08:05   your back now in his little faq he's one [TS]

01:08:08   of the faq items is are you gonna have [TS]

01:08:10   support for readability and pocket and [TS]

01:08:11   stuff like that like not just send Vince [TS]

01:08:13   to ever send a readability sent two [TS]

01:08:15   pockets right that right and his answer [TS]

01:08:16   on the fact I believe it still this way [TS]

01:08:18   I don't remember if he's changed it was [TS]

01:08:20   LOL all caps it's like haha you think [TS]

01:08:24   I'm going to send to my competitors [TS]

01:08:25   application those are his competitors by [TS]

01:08:27   the way readability and in pocket [TS]

01:08:29   formerly known as something in RM and [TS]

01:08:32   what I tweeted when he mentioned that [TS]

01:08:34   was that it reminded me of Apple [TS]

01:08:37   strategy tax article I wrote a couple [TS]

01:08:39   years ago about how the fact that Apple [TS]

01:08:42   runs the App Store but also has its own [TS]

01:08:45   bookstore means that there's a tension [TS]

01:08:47   between Apple providing the best [TS]

01:08:49   possible platform for say the kindle [TS]

01:08:51   application versus Apple trying to make [TS]

01:08:53   the ibook [TS]

01:08:54   store successful so kindle in the kindle [TS]

01:08:58   iOS application you can't buy books [TS]

01:09:00   within the kindle application they don't [TS]

01:09:02   even like you to link out to a web page [TS]

01:09:03   to buy them i don't even know if you're [TS]

01:09:04   allowed to do that anymore if Apple was [TS]

01:09:06   just a vendor of mobile applications and [TS]

01:09:09   they were trying to be the best vendor [TS]

01:09:11   of mobile applications they would try to [TS]

01:09:14   have the best mobile applications and [TS]

01:09:15   it's much better for the user for you to [TS]

01:09:17   be able to buy your kindle books right [TS]

01:09:18   within the kindle application i [TS]

01:09:20   mentioned on the show where I talk about [TS]

01:09:22   this that I think it's more about money [TS]

01:09:23   than about publication but there still [TS]

01:09:25   is a tension between Apple as platform [TS]

01:09:27   owner and apfel as someone who wants to [TS]

01:09:29   feel its own bookstore its own you know [TS]

01:09:32   movie store its own streaming video [TS]

01:09:33   service you know competing with Netflix [TS]

01:09:35   and stuff like that and the strategy [TS]

01:09:37   taxes when a single company does [TS]

01:09:39   multiple things which are kind of in [TS]

01:09:40   conflict with each other your your your [TS]

01:09:43   iBooks thing can't be the best it can be [TS]

01:09:44   because they would squish step on the [TS]

01:09:46   toes of the people on your platform and [TS]

01:09:48   your platform can't be the best it can [TS]

01:09:49   be because you don't want to you want to [TS]

01:09:51   like help out your ibook store a little [TS]

01:09:53   bit because hey you are the platform [TS]

01:09:54   owner so here's an instance where he's [TS]

01:09:56   got a publication and the LOL attitude [TS]

01:10:01   is like I would never put those guys in [TS]

01:10:04   here why would I they're my competitors [TS]

01:10:06   and so I think that's a little you know [TS]

01:10:08   in this case the decision is completely [TS]

01:10:10   justified because those other services [TS]

01:10:13   as far as I'm aware can't do what [TS]

01:10:15   Instapaper does you can't send them the [TS]

01:10:17   content of the article they will stick [TS]

01:10:19   it in there and you can't send them the [TS]

01:10:20   URL or whatever so it could be just [TS]

01:10:21   technically speaking the answer is [TS]

01:10:23   really not lol but even if I wanted to I [TS]

01:10:25   couldn't but the LOL implies that even [TS]

01:10:27   if I could I wouldn't and why wouldn't I [TS]

01:10:29   because they're my competitors so [TS]

01:10:31   there's a tension between you're selling [TS]

01:10:34   me an application that i can read the [TS]

01:10:35   magazine on right is this the best [TS]

01:10:38   reading experience i could possibly have [TS]

01:10:39   well for me if I'm a user a readability [TS]

01:10:41   or pocket and like that's the service [TS]

01:10:43   that I use I would like your application [TS]

01:10:45   to support the service that I use and if [TS]

01:10:47   that's all you did is all I do is I make [TS]

01:10:49   an application through which you can [TS]

01:10:50   read monthly publications you can be [TS]

01:10:52   sure that he would support like the pop [TS]

01:10:54   the most popular read it later services [TS]

01:10:56   he wouldn't just support one but since [TS]

01:10:58   he's not just making the magazine [TS]

01:11:00   application he's also making instapaper [TS]

01:11:02   he's inclined or just human nature to [TS]

01:11:05   say uh the only read it later sir [TS]

01:11:08   is available in this application [TS]

01:11:09   Instapaper and why well mate because [TS]

01:11:11   it's made by the guy who makes [TS]

01:11:12   instapaper now again the situation here [TS]

01:11:15   may just be simply that there's a [TS]

01:11:16   technical limitation but his answer on [TS]

01:11:18   the FAQ was not about technical [TS]

01:11:20   limitations it was you know laughing [TS]

01:11:22   could have just been a joke you know i'm [TS]

01:11:24   sure you'll talk about to him about this [TS]

01:11:26   on his show but that tension totally [TS]

01:11:27   exists that i'm sure he's aware of it [TS]

01:11:29   and managing that tension is not easy [TS]

01:11:31   apple has trouble with it and I'm sure [TS]

01:11:32   Marco will eventually probably have to [TS]

01:11:34   face it in various ways as well because [TS]

01:11:37   he is doing two different things can he [TS]

01:11:40   make the best magazine reading [TS]

01:11:42   experience without supporting other [TS]

01:11:44   related services or is he short changing [TS]

01:11:47   his customers by not supporting those [TS]

01:11:49   other read it later services you know is [TS]

01:11:50   that synergy or is that a strategy tax I [TS]

01:11:53   should put that strategy text article in [TS]

01:11:55   the journal ins and there's no there's [TS]

01:11:57   no easy answer here except for now if [TS]

01:12:00   it's a technical impossibility that's [TS]

01:12:01   the easy answer I'd love to support [TS]

01:12:03   those services but I can't well I don't [TS]

01:12:04   know if you would love to so I'm sure [TS]

01:12:05   you can discuss that with them on the [TS]

01:12:07   show that that is definitely an [TS]

01:12:08   interesting part of going into a second [TS]

01:12:10   line of business that is in some ways a [TS]

01:12:13   complement to your first line but in [TS]

01:12:14   other ways it's you know the other side [TS]

01:12:17   of the fence from Instapaper is taking [TS]

01:12:18   content collecting it and now he's [TS]

01:12:19   producing content do you do you feel [TS]

01:12:21   that this could eventually become [TS]

01:12:23   something that is bigger for him than [TS]

01:12:26   Instapaper I'm i don't know i'm having [TS]

01:12:30   trouble handicapping us i think his his [TS]

01:12:32   secret weapon in this entire thing as i [TS]

01:12:34   said is the secret weapon of all indie [TS]

01:12:36   developers neighbor who writes their own [TS]

01:12:37   blogs and stuff is low overhead that he [TS]

01:12:39   doesn't have to sell a bazillion [TS]

01:12:41   subscriptions to this for it to be very [TS]

01:12:44   profitable right uh he has a fixed very [TS]

01:12:47   low overhead for each issue of this [TS]

01:12:49   thing at all he's got to do is get you [TS]

01:12:51   know enough people to cover that cost [TS]

01:12:53   and then maybe double that number now [TS]

01:12:55   he's making a good profit maybe double [TS]

01:12:56   it again and maybe you know like at some [TS]

01:12:58   point he can start folding that money [TS]

01:13:00   back in and paying more money for [TS]

01:13:02   content that cost more money to produce [TS]

01:13:03   right and there's increasing paid to the [TS]

01:13:06   people may be having more articles may [TS]

01:13:07   be having longer articles i'll have to [TS]

01:13:09   manage that but seems to me that just [TS]

01:13:11   based on the nerds who like know of and [TS]

01:13:13   follow marco and you like signed up on [TS]

01:13:15   day one and they're just going to be too [TS]

01:13:17   lazy to ever unsubscribe right uh as [TS]

01:13:19   long as the content continues to be high [TS]

01:13:22   quality uh it seems like a slam dunk to [TS]

01:13:25   me I think Marco thinks this is slam [TS]

01:13:27   dunk to he said in the in the fact is [TS]

01:13:29   like you know it doesn't print a profit [TS]

01:13:30   I'll shut it down but he says but I bet [TS]

01:13:32   it will and like he literally bets he's [TS]

01:13:34   betting by like putting his time and [TS]

01:13:36   energy into this and that is the bet [TS]

01:13:38   he's making and like I'm I have far less [TS]

01:13:41   experienced in this demarco but I have [TS]

01:13:44   that same feeling like a gut feeling [TS]

01:13:45   you're like you don't need to get that [TS]

01:13:47   many people to read this for it to turn [TS]

01:13:48   a profit right uh it seems like it [TS]

01:13:52   should work and if it doesn't work [TS]

01:13:53   that'll be that'll be even more [TS]

01:13:57   interesting to talk about why it does [TS]

01:13:59   not work like maybe he can come on his [TS]

01:14:01   show and give like the actual numbers [TS]

01:14:02   whether it did work or didn't and say [TS]

01:14:04   like how close was it the working but [TS]

01:14:05   just it seems like it's a slam dunk that [TS]

01:14:07   it's gonna work does not a slam dunk but [TS]

01:14:08   it's going to be this hugely profitable [TS]

01:14:09   business to rival Instapaper right that [TS]

01:14:12   I think remains to be seen because [TS]

01:14:14   running a publication you know he can [TS]

01:14:16   declare himself a publisher and become a [TS]

01:14:17   publisher but as you learned from [TS]

01:14:19   declaring yourself a podcast the network [TS]

01:14:22   guru and doing that it's really hard [TS]

01:14:23   like every new business has new [TS]

01:14:25   challenges and he's got to meet those [TS]

01:14:27   challenges I know wrangling writers [TS]

01:14:29   getting people to write interesting [TS]

01:14:30   things doing the editorial process just [TS]

01:14:32   keeping it all together like you have a [TS]

01:14:33   fixed calendar based schedule you've got [TS]

01:14:36   to get those articles in on time you've [TS]

01:14:37   got to keep finding people to write them [TS]

01:14:39   for you've got to pay the people enough [TS]

01:14:41   to make them on the right you know the [TS]

01:14:42   whole nine yards it's not easy to do [TS]

01:14:44   that I see them on a big scale with the [TS]

01:14:46   people who run ours and that is that's a [TS]

01:14:48   difficult job right this is much smaller [TS]

01:14:50   scale than something like ours but he's [TS]

01:14:53   the only right now he's the only one [TS]

01:14:55   doing it all right and that's a new set [TS]

01:14:58   of things you have to do so there's a [TS]

01:15:00   danger of him being spread too thin this [TS]

01:15:02   danger of uh you know making bad [TS]

01:15:07   decisions early amelie doesn't have the [TS]

01:15:08   experience and how to run a publication [TS]

01:15:09   or maybe he just won't like what it's [TS]

01:15:12   like the run of obligation maybe he [TS]

01:15:13   likes the idea of some of being somewhat [TS]

01:15:15   successful publication more than the [TS]

01:15:17   actuality of what it takes to run a [TS]

01:15:18   successful publication so there are many [TS]

01:15:21   possible ways this can end but it seems [TS]

01:15:23   to me that that for issue thing I think [TS]

01:15:25   it's probably already turned a profit [TS]

01:15:27   that's my guess like on day one all the [TS]

01:15:28   people subscribe to the anyone because [TS]

01:15:30   they follow Marco like that's it he's [TS]

01:15:32   set for four issues already yeah and [TS]

01:15:34   then then see me just up to him to say [TS]

01:15:36   this turns a profit but it turns enough [TS]

01:15:37   profit for like me to get extra coffee [TS]

01:15:39   every month like it's not i'm not losing [TS]

01:15:41   money on it i'm spending all this time [TS]

01:15:43   and it's not turning a lot of profit uh [TS]

01:15:45   or maybe you know maybe it's more than [TS]

01:15:47   that maybe it's an you know it's like [TS]

01:15:49   one tenth of instant a pers income but [TS]

01:15:50   it's still taking like thirty percent of [TS]

01:15:53   my time and I think that's not a good [TS]

01:15:54   trade-off or maybe he's in it for the [TS]

01:15:55   long haul and says you know this is a [TS]

01:15:56   you know I'm just going to stick to this [TS]

01:15:58   even though I'm putting in way more time [TS]

01:15:59   than you know then I'm getting out of it [TS]

01:16:02   because in long run I think it'll turn [TS]

01:16:03   out to be a big business that's more of [TS]

01:16:04   an apple model where in the beginning it [TS]

01:16:07   seems like a loser buddy just stick with [TS]

01:16:08   it you know it starts to do a hockey [TS]

01:16:09   stick can you get going ah but I think [TS]

01:16:12   it is interesting because it's it seems [TS]

01:16:15   like what newspaper a newspaper [TS]

01:16:16   newsstand has been designed for which [TS]

01:16:18   it's not take all the old world models [TS]

01:16:21   and try to cram them into the ipad it's [TS]

01:16:22   find a new model that works in this [TS]

01:16:24   world don't be dumb allow people to copy [TS]

01:16:27   and paste text allow people to send it [TS]

01:16:28   to their reading later services don't [TS]

01:16:30   have humongous overhead will take care [TS]

01:16:32   of all the publication you know renewal [TS]

01:16:34   subscription stuff for you so you don't [TS]

01:16:36   have to worry about that don't base your [TS]

01:16:37   business on harvesting user information [TS]

01:16:39   even though as a newsstand application [TS]

01:16:42   it presents this dialogue with a firm [TS]

01:16:43   sure Marco can complain to you once [TS]

01:16:45   again about that says the magazine would [TS]

01:16:48   like your like email address and zip [TS]

01:16:50   code and blah blah blah magazine would [TS]

01:16:52   not like it like that's mandatory he [TS]

01:16:54   can't get rid of the dialog if you [TS]

01:16:55   wanted to do you have an auto renewing [TS]

01:16:56   subscription it always puts that up so [TS]

01:16:58   um you know that that's a shame but [TS]

01:17:00   that's not his business model he's not [TS]

01:17:01   harvesting your information to sell [TS]

01:17:02   their advertisers and the model that [TS]

01:17:06   he's come up with a couple people pay a [TS]

01:17:10   few bucks a month and that's it that's [TS]

01:17:12   the simple model that feels like that [TS]

01:17:15   should work doesn't it like that's what [TS]

01:17:17   we're all that when we ever we make fun [TS]

01:17:20   of these other people like keep picking [TS]

01:17:21   on the daily but any of these these [TS]

01:17:23   publications that you know try to shower [TS]

01:17:26   the wired magazine at 700 megabytes they [TS]

01:17:27   try to show up there print world into an [TS]

01:17:29   electronic version and then complain [TS]

01:17:31   when they lose money it's like well [TS]

01:17:32   you're doing it wrong like this it's too [TS]

01:17:34   much overhead there's too many people it [TS]

01:17:35   doesn't work out you got to figure out [TS]

01:17:37   something different and you can't have [TS]

01:17:38   all our subscriber information and sell [TS]

01:17:40   its advertisers you know so I'm the kind [TS]

01:17:44   of like app net this is kind of it it's [TS]

01:17:46   like app that net in that I'm rooting [TS]

01:17:47   for it to succeed because it seems like [TS]

01:17:49   it should [TS]

01:17:49   make sense it's unlike apt the net in [TS]

01:17:51   that initially I thought apt on that [TS]

01:17:52   there was no chance that it would [TS]

01:17:53   succeed this I'm saying I think it will [TS]

01:17:56   at least pass this does it turn a profit [TS]

01:17:58   in four issues I think it will [TS]

01:18:00   definitely pass that a notice be a [TS]

01:18:01   question of Marco deciding whether he's [TS]

01:18:03   in it for the long haul or if it's [TS]

01:18:05   making enough money to justify it or [TS]

01:18:06   whatever so I'm a fan I like the first [TS]

01:18:10   four articles I give a thumbs up to the [TS]

01:18:12   idea and to the content I mean of course [TS]

01:18:14   I do because like I'm these are people [TS]

01:18:16   whose blogs I'm reading anyway and I'm [TS]

01:18:19   perfectly happy to have them sit down [TS]

01:18:22   and really think and try to write [TS]

01:18:23   something of a medium link that I'm [TS]

01:18:26   going to get every two weeks in this [TS]

01:18:27   nice little application to read it even [TS]

01:18:29   if it is buried in the newsstand folder [TS]

01:18:30   which again Marco can't control now let [TS]

01:18:35   me ask you another question other than [TS]

01:18:36   the simplicity of newsstand and being in [TS]

01:18:40   the newsstand folder I mean do you think [TS]

01:18:44   folks are surprised about that that he [TS]

01:18:45   didn't release like a completely [TS]

01:18:47   standalone app that worked in a [TS]

01:18:50   different way and used in that purchase [TS]

01:18:52   I mean it makes sense to me but there [TS]

01:18:53   I've saw some people on Twitter saying [TS]

01:18:55   why didn't you release it as a [TS]

01:18:56   standalone thing just to get around [TS]

01:18:58   those limitations of newsstand um I'm [TS]

01:19:02   not surprised about it I think the [TS]

01:19:03   reason you're not surprised by it and [TS]

01:19:04   other people who know a little bit about [TS]

01:19:06   Iowa the iOS platform is the newsstand [TS]

01:19:09   things can do things that regular apps [TS]

01:19:11   can't exactly they can download issues [TS]

01:19:13   in the background Apple handles all the [TS]

01:19:14   ordinary subscription stuff for you like [TS]

01:19:17   it's a no-brainer to anybody who knows [TS]

01:19:19   about the implementation that yeah this [TS]

01:19:20   is if you want to have low overhead and [TS]

01:19:22   not worry about all the stuff this is [TS]

01:19:23   how you do it and in many respects if [TS]

01:19:25   you want certain features is the only [TS]

01:19:26   way you can do it on the iOS platform so [TS]

01:19:29   that doesn't surprise me and if people [TS]

01:19:31   are surprised maybe they're not familiar [TS]

01:19:32   with the limitations and I think Marco [TS]

01:19:34   has talked about them at length when [TS]

01:19:35   complaining about things that Instapaper [TS]

01:19:37   can't do that you could do if you were a [TS]

01:19:39   new stand-up it in practice it's [TS]

01:19:41   probably not as big a deal because it's [TS]

01:19:44   not like he would like you to download a [TS]

01:19:46   seven hundred megabyte thing in the [TS]

01:19:48   background like these things are these [TS]

01:19:49   issues are small he could probably get [TS]

01:19:52   away with not having a be newsstand but [TS]

01:19:54   then he did like this just a [TS]

01:19:56   subscription stuff alone to have an auto [TS]

01:19:57   renewing subscription and have apple [TS]

01:19:59   handle all that stuff for you instead of [TS]

01:20:01   having like a new in app purchase every [TS]

01:20:02   time a new issue [TS]

01:20:03   comes out of something like that like [TS]

01:20:04   this is the appropriate fit in the iOS [TS]

01:20:06   platform for what he wants to do is just [TS]

01:20:07   clearly this is what you're supposed to [TS]

01:20:09   do this is what he is doing it's a [TS]

01:20:10   perfect fit and I think Apple should be [TS]

01:20:14   very happy that someone is doing this I [TS]

01:20:15   think Apple probably was more happy that [TS]

01:20:17   Rupert Murdoch was trying to foist this [TS]

01:20:18   big giant thing on there with the daily [TS]

01:20:20   because that seems like a high-profile [TS]

01:20:22   thing or you know Wired magazine or [TS]

01:20:23   something but I think those are not [TS]

01:20:25   great fits for this platform and Marcos [TS]

01:20:27   thing is a better fit the other thing I [TS]

01:20:30   saw people complaining about is why [TS]

01:20:31   can't it read this on Android why can't [TS]

01:20:33   I read it on the web you're making a [TS]

01:20:35   publication that only people who who are [TS]

01:20:37   iOS users can read those are all valid [TS]

01:20:41   concerns if it weren't for the fact that [TS]

01:20:44   this publication if ever there was a [TS]

01:20:46   publication tailored for iOS users it's [TS]

01:20:50   this one it's not like he's making a [TS]

01:20:51   publication about like you know [TS]

01:20:52   gardening as I crawley why would you [TS]

01:20:54   limit a gardening publication just [TS]

01:20:56   people who use iOS that you're right [TS]

01:20:57   that doesn't make sense but why would [TS]

01:20:59   you limit an article by and for mac [TS]

01:21:02   apple nerd people to iOS well because [TS]

01:21:04   they're all gonna have iOS devices [TS]

01:21:05   anyway right now I think he's still [TS]

01:21:08   thinking about how to handle the web is [TS]

01:21:10   their web incarnation can you sign in [TS]

01:21:11   with like your newsstand subscription on [TS]

01:21:14   the viewer on the web how does that work [TS]

01:21:15   I don't know how that if you go to the [TS]

01:21:17   website now it's like the hyphen [TS]

01:21:18   magazine org I believe you can see like [TS]

01:21:22   previews of all the articles and then it [TS]

01:21:25   just links you to like if you want to [TS]

01:21:26   read the rest this article subscribe to [TS]

01:21:27   the thing or whatever um I'm not sure [TS]

01:21:30   what he's gonna do on the web there but [TS]

01:21:31   in this particular case of this [TS]

01:21:33   particular publication and in the case [TS]

01:21:36   of his business plan and having lower [TS]

01:21:37   overhead and not having to make a web [TS]

01:21:38   version not having to make an android [TS]

01:21:40   version all that stuff it makes perfect [TS]

01:21:41   sense for this to be iOS all me um for [TS]

01:21:43   now anyway what do you think I think I'm [TS]

01:21:50   talking about the magazine I don't know [TS]

01:21:52   do you want to talk about some more I [TS]

01:21:53   want to I want to make sure we cover [TS]

01:21:54   everything so that Marco is not good [TS]

01:21:57   luck tomorrow when when Mark when I [TS]

01:21:59   talked that he that literally he's he [TS]

01:22:01   says I wish there was something I could [TS]

01:22:03   add oh there's so much he can add I'm [TS]

01:22:06   trying not to actually spill all the [TS]

01:22:09   beans I've actually probably mistakenly [TS]

01:22:12   said too much already but I believe [TS]

01:22:13   Marco will have many many more things to [TS]

01:22:15   talk about you [TS]

01:22:16   any many more things talk about about [TS]

01:22:18   this thing certainly about you know his [TS]

01:22:20   presentation which I've only seen like [TS]

01:22:21   three tweets about he could talk about [TS]

01:22:22   the actual presentation he gave well [TS]

01:22:24   there's only like eight or nine people [TS]

01:22:25   go to that conference seems like it [TS]

01:22:27   right now they all fit in a little room [TS]

01:22:28   that's one little room it's up in what [TS]

01:22:30   is it Toronto or Montreal or whether [TS]

01:22:32   it's all the same up there and media [TS]

01:22:33   yeah and I mean there's like five people [TS]

01:22:37   in medicine just SAT you know put a use [TS]

01:22:39   this a macbook camera to do it streamed [TS]

01:22:42   it yeah they will although singleton [TS]

01:22:44   videos will be up on the web eventually [TS]

01:22:46   so ah i look forward to seeing that I [TS]

01:22:48   mean it I'm just trying to imagine the [TS]

01:22:50   situation you described earlier where [TS]

01:22:52   the app doesn't come out in time do you [TS]

01:22:54   think you would have had like a fallback [TS]

01:22:55   plan like showing screenshots of it or [TS]

01:22:57   would he had just he didn't have slides [TS]

01:22:59   there was nothing today she had nothing [TS]

01:23:00   to show that sure I think he would have [TS]

01:23:02   gone up there was was he gonna do I [TS]

01:23:03   think he would have got there and said [TS]

01:23:04   uh I have a new thing it's called the [TS]

01:23:06   magazine the plan was for you to be able [TS]

01:23:08   to download it today but you can't [TS]

01:23:10   because of whatever the reason think you [TS]

01:23:11   would have done that or he would have [TS]

01:23:12   just pivoted no I think he would have [TS]

01:23:14   talked about it you can ask him I will [TS]

01:23:15   that's the only question I'm gonna ask [TS]

01:23:17   him well you gotta ask my more than that [TS]

01:23:19   but yeah I'm sure he will have a lot to [TS]

01:23:21   talk about then and a lot of people said [TS]

01:23:22   oh you know this the schedule shuffle [TS]

01:23:24   with you know your your jet setting [TS]

01:23:25   around we had to move the show to Sunday [TS]

01:23:28   and everyone shows got move because you [TS]

01:23:29   were traveling and it's like Oh Marco [TS]

01:23:31   can't catch a break now he's not even [TS]

01:23:33   gonna get to talk about his own thing uh [TS]

01:23:34   is previously I'd been talking about a [TS]

01:23:38   lot of topics that both of us would like [TS]

01:23:39   to talk about our shows when my show [TS]

01:23:40   happen to come first and once again I [TS]

01:23:41   get to talk about ver I me know who knew [TS]

01:23:44   this time slot was so fortuitous such a [TS]

01:23:45   boon a boon for you yeah and it didn't [TS]

01:23:48   make sense and people like how'd you [TS]

01:23:49   know John's gonna steal your topic and [TS]

01:23:51   as he pointed out like why don't you [TS]

01:23:54   complain about someone else you know [TS]

01:23:55   giving basically free publicity to this [TS]

01:23:57   publication it's gonna make tons of [TS]

01:23:58   people who had never heard of the [TS]

01:23:59   magazine go and look into it and maybe [TS]

01:24:02   download it and maybe subscribe right [TS]

01:24:03   now he's gonna talk about it in his show [TS]

01:24:06   and it's double publicity so I encourage [TS]

01:24:09   everyone to go check it out you can ask [TS]

01:24:10   him the other thing you should ask him [TS]

01:24:11   is what seven day free trial means I [TS]

01:24:12   guess that means like you haven't [TS]

01:24:13   actually spent any money and if seven [TS]

01:24:15   days you cancel the description doesn't [TS]

01:24:16   charge you anything I'm not too I'm not [TS]

01:24:18   familiar with newsstand as you might [TS]

01:24:20   notice that with magazine being my one [TS]

01:24:21   lonely thing and yeah I have you ever [TS]

01:24:23   read anything else in New stand before [TS]

01:24:24   this i just recently like last week on [TS]

01:24:27   my ipad only downloaded [TS]

01:24:29   I did a I bought a single issue of edge [TS]

01:24:31   magazine which is a newsstand thing on [TS]

01:24:34   my iPad because edge magazine is a [TS]

01:24:37   gaming magazine and it's from the UK and [TS]

01:24:39   it costs a tremendous amount of money [TS]

01:24:40   for me to get paper versions over here [TS]

01:24:42   it's probably the most expensive yearly [TS]

01:24:44   subscription I have and I like the [TS]

01:24:46   magazine I really do like it but don't [TS]

01:24:48   like paying that much I'm like maybe I [TS]

01:24:50   could try the digital version it would [TS]

01:24:51   be cheaper it's a little bit cheaper but [TS]

01:24:54   usually digital versions are kind of [TS]

01:24:55   cruddy so I tried one out a single issue [TS]

01:24:57   for like five bucks and that is like an [TS]

01:24:59   example if it's got tons of you know [TS]

01:25:01   images and hundreds of megabytes and [TS]

01:25:03   movies and stuff like that and I'm kind [TS]

01:25:05   of on the fence about it i would i would [TS]

01:25:07   probably get if it was free with the [TS]

01:25:08   other stuff was so anyway my ipad i have [TS]

01:25:10   to newsstand things i have this one [TS]

01:25:12   issue of edge magazine that I'm going [TS]

01:25:13   through now as you know testing the [TS]

01:25:16   waters and I have the magazine in there [TS]

01:25:18   so I'm not familiar with the process in [TS]

01:25:20   the ends of at a newsstand so Marco can [TS]

01:25:23   talk more about that but yeah at a 199 [TS]

01:25:25   yeah this seems like it not a big risk [TS]

01:25:30   for me to just subscribe to that and [TS]

01:25:32   check it out and I've enjoyed all the [TS]

01:25:33   articles and I hope I continue to enjoy [TS]

01:25:35   all the articles one of the title [TS]

01:25:39   suggestions is a boon for siracusa [TS]

01:25:43   County coming in from time you guys not [TS]

01:25:46   time the Jackals in the Chairman third [TS]

01:25:48   sponsor source fits calm these guys are [TS]

01:25:50   super super cool folks they they're a [TS]

01:25:53   mobile app development house they help [TS]

01:25:56   you you come to them with an idea so [TS]

01:25:58   this is that this is what I want to [TS]

01:25:59   build and maybe it's an iOS app maybe [TS]

01:26:01   it's Android I maybe it's both maybe it [TS]

01:26:03   has a web backend doesn't matter they do [TS]

01:26:05   all of this stuff they've got over 300 [TS]

01:26:07   developers interface designers and they [TS]

01:26:11   can put as many of these folks you have [TS]

01:26:13   access to the mall and put as many of [TS]

01:26:14   them as necessary on your project that's [TS]

01:26:17   up well 300 these guys must only take [TS]

01:26:18   giant prod know they take things of all [TS]

01:26:21   sizes you have a tiny little app that [TS]

01:26:23   has one little function they can build [TS]

01:26:25   that you've got something that's [TS]

01:26:25   integrated as a web back and it's the [TS]

01:26:27   time two million things and you need a [TS]

01:26:28   website they'll do it they've done it [TS]

01:26:32   for more than 500 applications they've [TS]

01:26:35   got 20 of those that have reached the [TS]

01:26:36   top 10 in global application [TS]

01:26:38   marketplaces and they understand how to [TS]

01:26:39   apply brilliant design [TS]

01:26:41   and take your idea and turn it into [TS]

01:26:43   something real turn it into something [TS]

01:26:45   that hopefully make some money they have [TS]

01:26:48   an end to end product strategy I mean [TS]

01:26:49   all the stuff that you would want [TS]

01:26:50   they've got engineers and designers that [TS]

01:26:52   can take a sketch that you've come up [TS]

01:26:54   with and you say I don't know how to [TS]

01:26:54   build this thing but here's how I want [TS]

01:26:57   it to work they can turn that into a nap [TS]

01:26:59   they can turn that into a website [TS]

01:27:00   apparently they know all the ins and [TS]

01:27:06   outs of this because they have some of [TS]

01:27:08   the best developers in the business [TS]

01:27:09   doing it go check them out at sorts bits [TS]

01:27:11   calm that's the place to go let them [TS]

01:27:15   know you heard about it's here on a five [TS]

01:27:16   by five you know John I used to say oh [TS]

01:27:18   you don't want a couple college kids [TS]

01:27:20   like you don't hire a couple college [TS]

01:27:21   kids who are gonna you know tell you [TS]

01:27:23   they can build something and take some [TS]

01:27:24   six months to build it then I started [TS]

01:27:26   getting emails from college kids who [TS]

01:27:28   were saying why are you banging on [TS]

01:27:30   college kids to the ageist and I said [TS]

01:27:33   you know I mean you could be you could [TS]

01:27:34   be 60 years old in college I mean you [TS]

01:27:37   can still be a kid at 70 that's what I'm [TS]

01:27:39   told mmm you're only as old as you feel [TS]

01:27:41   them but so I said you know what you're [TS]

01:27:44   right any developer could could do that [TS]

01:27:47   not just college kids these guys are [TS]

01:27:49   they're legit they're they're a real [TS]

01:27:50   business they've been doing this for [TS]

01:27:51   years and they're great so check them [TS]

01:27:54   out source pits calm couple things from [TS]

01:27:57   the chat room here somebody linked to [TS]

01:28:00   the actual tweet where someone where [TS]

01:28:02   Marco replied to his LOL faq entry about [TS]

01:28:04   how pocket readability he says I don't [TS]

01:28:06   think pocket or readability can even [TS]

01:28:08   save non-public links with HTML so I'd [TS]

01:28:12   like that tweeting the show notes and [TS]

01:28:13   someone in the chat room shinohara says [TS]

01:28:17   that of somewhere Marco apparently said [TS]

01:28:19   he's already got enough readership to [TS]

01:28:21   make a profit but he can't find where he [TS]

01:28:23   said that so it could be that my guest [TS]

01:28:26   that he's already in the black is [TS]

01:28:28   actually true but I didn't see him say [TS]

01:28:30   that on Twitter or app.net so maybe i [TS]

01:28:32   missed it somewhere yeah I'm kind of [TS]

01:28:37   excited about the the magazine thing got [TS]

01:28:39   like whoa Cain so did he did he go into [TS]

01:28:42   detail about how like is he reaching out [TS]

01:28:45   to the writers and saying I will you [TS]

01:28:48   know write a piece or can you get in [TS]

01:28:50   touch with him to submit I think both he [TS]

01:28:52   has reached out to people and I think he [TS]

01:28:54   said somewhere [TS]

01:28:55   you do want to write for the magazine [TS]

01:28:57   drop me a line he's I think it's in the [TS]

01:28:58   fact like send me a pitch send me a [TS]

01:28:59   story pitch what did you catch him um I [TS]

01:29:03   don't know who I'm allowed to say what I [TS]

01:29:05   bitch don't you know you want to keep it [TS]

01:29:08   keep secret dude and so at least I got [TS]

01:29:11   you to reveal that you did pitch [TS]

01:29:12   something see yeah well when when I [TS]

01:29:15   heard that he was doing this why not [TS]

01:29:17   like I feel like our god I gotta think [TS]

01:29:20   of something that I want to say on this [TS]

01:29:22   thing you know I think you know what I [TS]

01:29:23   think you should start doing what I [TS]

01:29:25   think you should because you know you do [TS]

01:29:27   the OS 10 thing or a sex thing as you [TS]

01:29:31   say for ours maybe you start doing an [TS]

01:29:33   iOS review and you do it here send a [TS]

01:29:36   thousand words yeah a thousand words no [TS]

01:29:38   see that's the thing is you need [TS]

01:29:40   constraints you write too much that's [TS]

01:29:41   the stoop I have two constraints I i [TS]

01:29:43   forget what his original thing was like [TS]

01:29:45   I think he said he wants to be like [TS]

01:29:46   eight hundred to a thousand it's like a [TS]

01:29:47   hard and fast limit right but that's [TS]

01:29:49   like the kind of length is like so I you [TS]

01:29:51   know I I immediately said I want to be [TS]

01:29:54   part of this right cuz I like the idea [TS]

01:29:56   and I need to think of something that [TS]

01:29:59   fits into this format and that's what I [TS]

01:30:03   endeavored to do so many people are [TS]

01:30:06   saying you know iOS is smaller than [TS]

01:30:08   right to this thing I all the same way [TS]

01:30:09   iOS is smaller than OS 10 fewer words [TS]

01:30:12   needed do it here just saying I don't [TS]

01:30:17   know I think they're about the same size [TS]

01:30:18   at this point okay so she said yeah that [TS]

01:30:22   you were off that now I'm back you're [TS]

01:30:24   back yeah that wasn't even a good one no [TS]

01:30:28   it wasn't are you rusty here I don't [TS]

01:30:29   know oh well warm up getting warm that [TS]

01:30:32   and my final topic which I don't think [TS]

01:30:34   we have time to do justice but I'll just [TS]

01:30:35   tease it maybe we'll talk about any [TS]

01:30:37   other char maybe we'll talk about a [TS]

01:30:38   little bit is on but this week's it was [TS]

01:30:42   just weeks back to work I think in the [TS]

01:30:44   the pre-show part of the show that [TS]

01:30:46   doesn't have a name but should like the [TS]

01:30:48   part where you talk about things that [TS]

01:30:50   are not the topic of your show but it's [TS]

01:30:51   not follow up what do you call that part [TS]

01:30:52   of back to work ah the beginning dan and [TS]

01:30:56   Merlin special time and Terry quite [TS]

01:30:59   special alone time together yeah yeah [TS]

01:31:01   and then this one in that way before you [TS]

01:31:04   get in that from the chat room we have [TS]

01:31:07   shahara [TS]

01:31:08   sayonara I'm sorry if i'm pronouncing [TS]

01:31:10   wrong and djuan who's i believe is [TS]

01:31:12   Daniel dawn who have each submitted a [TS]

01:31:14   link the first one is a twitter link [TS]

01:31:18   that says thanks for an amazing first [TS]

01:31:19   day everyone the magazine is number one [TS]

01:31:21   in newsstand today even beating the new [TS]

01:31:23   york times for new downloads yeah i read [TS]

01:31:25   that too and he has the same thing on an [TS]

01:31:29   alpha dot app.net jerra is that worth [TS]

01:31:30   putting the show notes I already did [TS]

01:31:32   cross posting l don't like cross posting [TS]

01:31:35   the name of the same thing I know but [TS]

01:31:36   anyway yeah I did see that but that's [TS]

01:31:38   not the same as saying he's already [TS]

01:31:39   turned a profit show notes it five by [TS]

01:31:41   five TV / hypercritical slush 89 right [TS]

01:31:44   yep okay all right so Merlin was talking [TS]

01:31:50   about in his special time with you this [TS]

01:31:52   week was a bit about Twitter and app.net [TS]

01:31:55   and he Marilyn had been cranky but I've [TS]

01:31:59   done it for a while he doesn't have to [TS]

01:32:00   have the second service a thing and he [TS]

01:32:02   talked a little bit of this week about [TS]

01:32:03   how he uses Twitter and his frustrations [TS]

01:32:05   with it and frustrations with checking [TS]

01:32:07   multiple places and what he doesn't do [TS]

01:32:10   doesn't doesn't do on Twitter and I [TS]

01:32:13   think we may have talked about the exact [TS]

01:32:15   same thing so this topic may actually be [TS]

01:32:17   a repeat but I think at least some part [TS]

01:32:19   of it will be fresh because app that net [TS]

01:32:21   exists now and didn't exist when the [TS]

01:32:23   last talked about it maybe we never [TS]

01:32:24   talked but i don't know i'm old i can't [TS]

01:32:25   remember I apologize to this is a repeat [TS]

01:32:27   but I wanted to talk about how I use [TS]

01:32:31   Twitter because I think that topic like [TS]

01:32:34   that was like a topic for like two [TS]

01:32:35   thousand eight when people like Twitter [TS]

01:32:36   have you heard about this twitter thing [TS]

01:32:37   and then you'd go like well I've been [TS]

01:32:39   using Twitter over a year now here's how [TS]

01:32:40   I use it and you try to explain to them [TS]

01:32:42   what Twitter is and why they might get [TS]

01:32:43   some value out of it and why they might [TS]

01:32:44   want to use it now that conversation [TS]

01:32:46   goes away because everyone just knows [TS]

01:32:47   where Twitter is but now app.net is here [TS]

01:32:49   i think the topic is fresh again because [TS]

01:32:51   it's like well now what do we do what [TS]

01:32:52   what are you doing a nap net it's [TS]

01:32:55   different than you do on Twitter what do [TS]

01:32:56   you want app that that to be do you want [TS]

01:32:57   to be different than Twitter you want to [TS]

01:32:59   just be a better Twitter do you leave [TS]

01:33:00   Twitter to go to app that net I think I [TS]

01:33:03   have probably a whole shows worth of [TS]

01:33:06   discussion especially don't want to get [TS]

01:33:08   into it 90 minutes into this show but [TS]

01:33:09   I'll leave this out there for a teaser [TS]

01:33:12   for next week to think about how anyone [TS]

01:33:15   listening the show I'm assuming most of [TS]

01:33:17   the people seem to show either have a [TS]

01:33:18   Twitter account or have an app that net [TS]

01:33:21   account or both thank [TS]

01:33:22   how you do or don't use those accounts [TS]

01:33:24   in why that's your homework for for this [TS]

01:33:27   show and we'll come back next week and [TS]

01:33:29   assuming something or shattering doesn't [TS]

01:33:31   happen we'll talk about that because [TS]

01:33:33   I've this is actually by far the [TS]

01:33:35   farthest and that like that that [TS]

01:33:36   magazine thing we're like I have a [TS]

01:33:37   screen full and then this twitter thing [TS]

01:33:38   is like for screen folds of stuff so i'm [TS]

01:33:40   i'm probably going to ramble on a quite [TS]

01:33:43   extensive length about had a good value [TS]

01:33:45   out of Twitter or how i get value of [TS]

01:33:47   twitter an app that net and how they [TS]

01:33:48   differ from each other but i don't want [TS]

01:33:50   to give it short shrift so we're not [TS]

01:33:52   going to stick it in today I know people [TS]

01:33:54   but now that I'm being so disciplined [TS]

01:33:56   about the shorter show stripling she [TS]

01:33:57   shouldn't feel like he has to keep them [TS]

01:33:58   shorter I don't do it in our account we [TS]

01:34:00   love the long shows I know you do but [TS]

01:34:02   this is for me some things have to do [TS]

01:34:03   for me this is I need to tighten unless [TS]

01:34:05   your time that's right and I and for the [TS]

01:34:07   record I've never said to you John I'd [TS]

01:34:09   like to do a shorter show a vial nope [TS]

01:34:11   never not once now because I don't [TS]

01:34:13   believe that I believe that you should [TS]

01:34:15   do the show that's as long as the show [TS]

01:34:17   that you would like to do and in the [TS]

01:34:19   great words of a great man you know I've [TS]

01:34:21   been thinking about this and if I'm here [TS]

01:34:22   and you're here isn't this our time it [TS]

01:34:26   yes it is can you name that then hmm to [TS]

01:34:31   secure it to obscure for you someone in [TS]

01:34:32   the chat room is gonna get it but [TS]

01:34:33   that'll be fine what hat what do they [TS]

01:34:35   get if they get it did you do they get a [TS]

01:34:37   dinner dinner with certain in Siracusa [TS]

01:34:39   county get respect Dan think it respect [TS]

01:34:42   it was out of respect this one time yeah [TS]

01:34:45   you got that one city I know where you [TS]

01:34:47   going we're all bro I know all about [TS]

01:34:49   that one i just rewatched that again I [TS]

01:34:52   know it seems like a sound constant loop [TS]

01:34:53   in your house were you worried about [TS]

01:34:55   Jonah baby it seems like not [TS]

01:34:58   age-appropriate but I don't care about [TS]

01:35:00   that the hell you don't know they don't [TS]

01:35:03   understand that oh they understand [TS]

01:35:05   everything the baby understand just wing [TS]

01:35:07   yeah first word I'm gonna be something [TS]

01:35:10   we can't say we after dark yeah before [TS]

01:35:12   four letters no not mama alright so I [TS]

01:35:19   think we can wrap this up alright if you [TS]

01:35:21   wish yep princess bride so you can go to [TS]

01:35:25   five by five TV / hypercritical / 89 and [TS]

01:35:31   you can see all the show notes and links [TS]

01:35:32   that John is mentioned for this episode [TS]

01:35:34   you can follow John [TS]

01:35:36   on both Twitter and alpha dot net as [TS]

01:35:39   siracusa SI RAC u.s.a i'm dan benjamin [TS]

01:35:44   on twitter dan on alpha dot net [TS]

01:35:47   appreciate you listening we appreciate [TS]

01:35:49   you visiting those sponsors and of [TS]

01:35:51   course it really really helps us out if [TS]

01:35:52   you were to take a moment and rate the [TS]

01:35:55   show on iTunes you do that just by [TS]

01:35:57   searching for hypercritical in the [TS]

01:35:59   iTunes Store and it will come up and you [TS]

01:36:01   can give it some stars you can write a [TS]

01:36:03   long lengthy review as John would like [TS]

01:36:04   you to do if you want to get in touch [TS]

01:36:06   with us you go to five by five dot TV / [TS]

01:36:07   contact like hypercritical from the list [TS]

01:36:09   type your thing will get it John will [TS]

01:36:11   probably not reply but he may read it on [TS]

01:36:13   the air and that's uh that's all the [TS]

01:36:15   business I have to do hear anything else [TS]

01:36:17   John you covered it all right have a [TS]

01:36:20   good one talk to you in a little less [TS]

01:36:21   than a week oh my god yeah that's right [TS]

01:36:23   let's could be trippy all right see then [TS]

01:36:25   I [TS]

01:36:27   [Music] [TS]

01:36:36   you [TS]