26: White Smoke


00:00:00   [Music] [TS]

00:00:02   this is hypercritical weekly talkshow [TS]

00:00:04   ruminating on exactly what is wrong in [TS]

00:00:07   the world of Apple and related [TS]

00:00:08   technologies and businesses nothing is [TS]

00:00:10   so perfect that it can't be complained [TS]

00:00:13   about by the host of this show John [TS]

00:00:15   siracusa I know him from Ars Technica [TS]

00:00:17   and elsewhere and by me I'm Dan Benjamin [TS]

00:00:20   we would like to say thanks very much to [TS]

00:00:23   fresh books calm and shopify calm for [TS]

00:00:26   making this show possible and also like [TS]

00:00:28   to mention that bandwidth for this [TS]

00:00:29   episode of hypercritical has been [TS]

00:00:31   provided by Midas green technologies [TS]

00:00:33   Virtual Private servers submerged in oil [TS]

00:00:36   seriously check them out and Midas green [TS]

00:00:39   tech dot-com how are you today Jon big [TS]

00:00:42   week for you well may or may be not I [TS]

00:00:45   don't think so [TS]

00:00:46   you're saying that you're saying it's [TS]

00:00:48   good next week is the week ah yeah [TS]

00:00:51   that's what I heard [TS]

00:00:52   that's delivery and fourth hand rumored [TS]

00:00:55   but the story I've got is that no Lian [TS]

00:00:57   this week I thought it was gonna be [TS]

00:01:00   yesterday obviously it wasn't and what [TS]

00:01:02   I've heard is that it's not gonna be [TS]

00:01:03   this week do we have a reason why no [TS]

00:01:06   this is I'm very far removed from these [TS]

00:01:08   rumors but by the time they get to me [TS]

00:01:10   all I get is not this week that's uh you [TS]

00:01:15   know I'm just gonna be honest I'm [TS]

00:01:17   disappointed in so am i I hoped it would [TS]

00:01:19   be yesterday I'm not disappointed in now [TS]

00:01:21   I'm disappointed in you for not [TS]

00:01:22   understanding why and warning me oh for [TS]

00:01:26   not understand so what is the day you're [TS]

00:01:28   hearing now the nineteenth now I hear I [TS]

00:01:30   have no date rumored all I know is not [TS]

00:01:34   this week and I only know that vaguely [TS]

00:01:35   third hand so I don't know I don't know [TS]

00:01:39   what they're waiting for but that's [TS]

00:01:40   that's actually one of our follow-up [TS]

00:01:42   talk topics so is it [TS]

00:01:43   yeah well it's vaguely follow-up related [TS]

00:01:46   I have a whole bunch of all up today and [TS]

00:01:47   we do have the markdown thing as the [TS]

00:01:49   main topic but I actually have enough [TS]

00:01:51   follow-up to push that to another show [TS]

00:01:52   if we really wanted to Wow so this could [TS]

00:01:55   be an antenna see this is why I think we [TS]

00:01:56   should I know you like [TS]

00:01:58   compartmentalizing things I do I know [TS]

00:02:00   that you do but my feeling is that if we [TS]

00:02:03   stopped calling it follow-up and just [TS]

00:02:05   talked that that is somehow it would be [TS]

00:02:08   more freeing because if it's like oh [TS]

00:02:10   well we did 90 minutes of follow-up well [TS]

00:02:12   then it wasn't really follow [TS]

00:02:13   was the main table it was just topics [TS]

00:02:15   just topics that are perhaps recurring [TS]

00:02:17   topics yeah how about this you call it [TS]

00:02:20   follow up I'll call it recurring topics [TS]

00:02:21   and we'll both be happy yeah there is a [TS]

00:02:24   difference was follow up is supposed to [TS]

00:02:25   be talking about things that have been [TS]

00:02:27   discussed on past shows versus things [TS]

00:02:29   that are just here something interesting [TS]

00:02:31   in the news or an interesting topic that [TS]

00:02:33   we've never talked about before I don't [TS]

00:02:35   know why we have to make the [TS]

00:02:36   differentiation I mean they don't have [TS]

00:02:37   to make like I bet I'm willing to bet [TS]

00:02:39   that you talk to your wife every every [TS]

00:02:42   single day about the house or the kids [TS]

00:02:45   or whatever you don't go to her oh honey [TS]

00:02:47   I have some follow-up for you about da [TS]

00:02:49   or son no you just didn't have [TS]

00:02:51   follow-ups but shows have format well [TS]

00:02:53   for me this is my life for me this is my [TS]

00:02:57   show okay [TS]

00:02:58   I like the follow-up all right fine [TS]

00:02:59   follow him all right [TS]

00:03:01   which again so the first one is a link [TS]

00:03:05   that went around maybe one around last [TS]

00:03:07   week and we just didn't get to her in [TS]

00:03:08   the show it was a giggle story that was [TS]

00:03:11   also linked on slash dot and the [TS]

00:03:13   headline was Facebook trapped in my [TS]

00:03:16   sequel fate worse than death or MySQL [TS]

00:03:18   fate worse than death if you want to go [TS]

00:03:19   that way and the gist of the story was [TS]

00:03:23   that Facebook had sort of bit off more [TS]

00:03:27   that it could chew with its number of [TS]

00:03:29   mice equal instances this is a quote [TS]

00:03:32   from the thing it says that Facebook has [TS]

00:03:34   split its my sequel database into four [TS]

00:03:35   thousand shards and all order to handle [TS]

00:03:37   the site's massive data volume and is [TS]

00:03:39   running nine thousand instances of [TS]

00:03:40   memcache or memcache D in order to keep [TS]

00:03:44   up with the number of transactions the [TS]

00:03:45   database must serve now this is all not [TS]

00:03:48   from Facebook officially but it's from [TS]

00:03:50   someone named Michael Stonebraker which [TS]

00:03:52   is a great name stone breaker is [TS]

00:03:55   apparently one of the one of the guys [TS]

00:03:57   behind ingress really old relational [TS]

00:04:01   database system that eventually spawned [TS]

00:04:03   Postgres and he's gone had done a bunch [TS]

00:04:05   of other database related projects he's [TS]

00:04:08   been a professor at the University of [TS]

00:04:10   California Berkeley I believe and his [TS]

00:04:14   current business is another database [TS]

00:04:17   company called vault DB he's the [TS]

00:04:19   co-founder and CTO of that company so [TS]

00:04:21   the slash just on this thread was well [TS]

00:04:24   what a surprise somebody from a [TS]

00:04:25   competing database [TS]

00:04:27   says that Facebook is screwed because [TS]

00:04:30   they use my sequel right and the other [TS]

00:04:34   gist of this story well get the reason [TS]

00:04:37   it's in the fall because we talked about [TS]

00:04:38   how Facebook was what they were doing [TS]

00:04:41   for scaling and they were the one who [TS]

00:04:43   was taking taking existing open source [TS]

00:04:45   off-the-shelf software and bending it to [TS]

00:04:48   their needs so they use PHP which is off [TS]

00:04:51   the shelf but they've done all sorts of [TS]

00:04:52   crazy things with it I've since heard [TS]

00:04:53   that they are they have stopped [TS]

00:04:54   supposedly compiling PHP into C++ but I [TS]

00:04:57   haven't heard what they've replaced it [TS]

00:04:58   with I don't know if that's true but any [TS]

00:05:00   write they use PHP apparently they use [TS]

00:05:02   my sequel I hadn't seen that part of the [TS]

00:05:04   story denied but they're using it at [TS]

00:05:07   just a massive scale so I mean a one my [TS]

00:05:09   sequel database instance is fine [TS]

00:05:11   splitting it up into ten or twenty [TS]

00:05:13   shards fine but when you have four [TS]

00:05:15   thousand shards and you need nine [TS]

00:05:16   thousand memcache servers to you know so [TS]

00:05:20   you don't hit the my sequel databases as [TS]

00:05:21   much that's pretty darn big so so the [TS]

00:05:25   slash comments were that this guy has a [TS]

00:05:27   complex of interest obviously because [TS]

00:05:28   he's from a competing database thing but [TS]

00:05:31   the most convincing argument I saw [TS]

00:05:33   against this article was that Facebook [TS]

00:05:35   works you know we're saying you're using [TS]

00:05:38   my sequel you're really screwed because [TS]

00:05:40   when you get to the large scale it's not [TS]

00:05:41   going to work well who's larger scale [TS]

00:05:43   than Facebook they have like 700 million [TS]

00:05:45   users and it may be a horrible ugly hack [TS]

00:05:48   but the bottom line is they took this [TS]

00:05:50   thing this crappy database and I'm not a [TS]

00:05:52   big my sequel fan I like Postgres way [TS]

00:05:55   better well they took this this crappy [TS]

00:05:57   open source thing and you know through [TS]

00:05:59   force of will and engineering and money [TS]

00:06:01   they made it work for them at the [TS]

00:06:03   highest scale you could possibly be at I [TS]

00:06:06   mean who's who's doing something are you [TS]

00:06:08   going to tell them if you're really big [TS]

00:06:10   you're in trouble who's bigger than them [TS]

00:06:11   so it's an interesting case of you know [TS]

00:06:15   this guy the Stonebraker guy I'm sure he [TS]

00:06:18   knows what he's doing I'm sure volt DB [TS]

00:06:19   is great I love Postgres I like it so [TS]

00:06:21   much better than my sequel his his [TS]

00:06:24   technical knowledge is completely sound [TS]

00:06:26   I'm sure in theory he's right [TS]

00:06:28   but in practice he's got a database [TS]

00:06:30   product that nobody is using at this [TS]

00:06:31   scale and my sequel has is used at the [TS]

00:06:35   biggest scale possible albeit in [TS]

00:06:37   probably a horrible crappy [TS]

00:06:38   way that is fragile and right [TS]

00:06:40   to blow up at any second but that's [TS]

00:06:41   probably true of all Facebook is that [TS]

00:06:43   it's just a gigantic pile of crap at [TS]

00:06:45   this point it's amazing that it stays up [TS]

00:06:47   but it does you know so you can't you [TS]

00:06:49   can't tell someone that their choice of [TS]

00:06:50   Technology is a deal breaker when when [TS]

00:06:52   they're actually using it and at the [TS]

00:06:55   scale that you've been warning them [TS]

00:06:56   about that's fine to bring that star [TS]

00:06:58   back up I just thought it was kind of [TS]

00:06:59   funny although I am rooting for volt DB [TS]

00:07:02   or any other alternatives because [TS]

00:07:04   relational databases they're great and [TS]

00:07:07   all but no one has really figured out [TS]

00:07:09   the magic scaling fairy dust I think I [TS]

00:07:12   don't know if Stonebraker was the author [TS]

00:07:13   of this paper but is that the cap theory [TS]

00:07:16   of scaling you ever heard of that see ap [TS]

00:07:18   maybe you can explain it I don't think [TS]

00:07:20   I've heard of that one [TS]

00:07:21   I I don't have it in my notes I have to [TS]

00:07:23   go over memory so it's it's basically [TS]

00:07:25   saying what are this who in the chat [TS]

00:07:27   room can bring this up see is for like [TS]

00:07:30   consistency [TS]

00:07:32   P is for network partitioning and maybe [TS]

00:07:35   one of them is for a is for availability [TS]

00:07:37   it's basically saying that you can't [TS]

00:07:39   have all three of those things if you [TS]

00:07:41   want two of them you have to sacrifice [TS]

00:07:42   one of them so I wanted nicer than that [TS]

00:07:44   if you want to be resilient to network [TS]

00:07:45   partitions like you you lose network [TS]

00:07:47   connections between the hosts then you [TS]

00:07:49   can't have one of the other two of them [TS]

00:07:50   you can't have consistency everywhere or [TS]

00:07:52   you can have you know 100% availability [TS]

00:07:54   and so on and so forth so it's all about [TS]

00:07:56   trading off yet so so people the [TS]

00:07:59   chatroom is said its availability [TS]

00:08:00   consistency and partition tolerance [TS]

00:08:02   partition tolerance so really there [TS]

00:08:04   should be a T at the end of it but it's [TS]

00:08:06   harder to say it's just a nice way to [TS]

00:08:08   think about like it's a nice formalized [TS]

00:08:10   way to think about what are the [TS]

00:08:11   trade-offs between [TS]

00:08:12   having like an Oracle RAC cluster where [TS]

00:08:14   you have a bunch of machines running a [TS]

00:08:15   relational database versus something [TS]

00:08:17   that's like eventually consistent where [TS]

00:08:18   you may not see the latest data right [TS]

00:08:20   away but eventually you will and it's [TS]

00:08:21   distributed and resilient and always [TS]

00:08:23   available that you you know it's the [TS]

00:08:25   various trade-offs of how to scale data [TS]

00:08:26   out and this is a problem that's really [TS]

00:08:28   not solved which is why there's so much [TS]

00:08:29   activity that's there you've got a [TS]

00:08:31   CouchDB MongoDB volt DB there's even a [TS]

00:08:35   menace and something else to projects [TS]

00:08:40   for making persistent versions of [TS]

00:08:42   memcache deep it's like the same [TS]

00:08:43   interface to it but instead of but when [TS]

00:08:45   you pull the plug the data doesn't go [TS]

00:08:46   away it's on disk somewhere a whole [TS]

00:08:48   bunch of the and the no sequel databases [TS]

00:08:50   that you know a couple of them I just [TS]

00:08:51   mentioned plus there's [TS]

00:08:53   the stuff that Google's got internally [TS]

00:08:55   and HBase and you know all sorts of [TS]

00:08:58   things this is not a solve problem so [TS]

00:08:59   it's it's I wish it was a solved problem [TS]

00:09:01   relational databases were solve problem [TS]

00:09:03   and Postgres if you want a relational [TS]

00:09:05   database Postgres is like the pinnacle [TS]

00:09:06   of evolution of epics it's free open [TS]

00:09:08   source you know [TS]

00:09:10   non-commercial you don't have to pay a [TS]

00:09:12   million dollars to Oracle for it and [TS]

00:09:13   it's a great relational database so if [TS]

00:09:15   you want a relational database there's [TS]

00:09:16   one for you but relational databases are [TS]

00:09:19   heavily on the side of consistency and [TS]

00:09:22   are very far away from you know Network [TS]

00:09:24   partition tolerance and and availability [TS]

00:09:26   and on the internet the trade-off seems [TS]

00:09:29   to be in the other direction where they [TS]

00:09:30   want it to be available and they wanted [TS]

00:09:32   to be resilient to network failures but [TS]

00:09:34   if things are not consistent right away [TS]

00:09:36   that's okay for like your Facebook page [TS]

00:09:38   or you know something like that maybe [TS]

00:09:40   not for banking transactions which is [TS]

00:09:43   why the banks still use relational [TS]

00:09:44   databases but this is not a solved [TS]

00:09:46   problem and it's a very interesting area [TS]

00:09:47   and I wish someone would solve it [TS]

00:09:48   because it would be great if my [TS]

00:09:49   grandkids when they go to start their [TS]

00:09:51   technology start they say oh and we'll [TS]

00:09:52   just use this for our data storage and [TS]

00:09:54   we know that it scales infinitely and we [TS]

00:09:56   don't have to tweak it and we don't have [TS]

00:09:57   to worry about I would just Chuck our [TS]

00:09:58   data into it and as big as we get we'll [TS]

00:09:59   be fine but that day is not here yet [TS]

00:10:03   that was another link in the show notes [TS]

00:10:05   that I'm assuming you put there about [TS]

00:10:06   the Google+ thing we asked anything yeah [TS]

00:10:08   there was a Google engineer showed up [TS]

00:10:11   and said ask me anything and it was [TS]

00:10:15   specific to the infrastructure behind [TS]

00:10:17   Google and I thought that that sort of [TS]

00:10:20   touched on one of the topics that you [TS]

00:10:22   brought up which was not so much an [TS]

00:10:24   infrastructure one as a software one as [TS]

00:10:27   far as Howard Howard how is this working [TS]

00:10:30   how is it scaling he kind of addressed [TS]

00:10:32   that yeah I read through it as I skimmed [TS]

00:10:36   through most of it I read the questions [TS]

00:10:37   that piqued my interest it's actually [TS]

00:10:39   more of a follow-up to what you talked [TS]

00:10:40   about and build and analyze with marco [TS]

00:10:42   because he was saying yeah he was [TS]

00:10:43   wondering like how we were generating [TS]

00:10:44   the source code because he had to parse [TS]

00:10:46   it on with Instapaper [TS]

00:10:48   but was obviously machine generated not [TS]

00:10:49   human generated in that QA they talked a [TS]

00:10:52   lot about what they used client-side and [TS]

00:10:55   a little bit of what language they wrote [TS]

00:10:57   the application in like I said they use [TS]

00:10:59   Java and they didn't use GWT but they [TS]

00:11:02   never talked about what exists on the [TS]

00:11:04   server side they didn't say where what [TS]

00:11:06   they're using for data storage [TS]

00:11:07   what their data model is or how their [TS]

00:11:09   servers are distributed or how they [TS]

00:11:10   communicate or anything like that in [TS]

00:11:12   typical Google fashion they will tell [TS]

00:11:13   you that we use the closure Java [TS]

00:11:15   compiler which we released as open [TS]

00:11:16   sourced it's really good great you [TS]

00:11:18   should try it and they'll tell you if [TS]

00:11:19   they use GWT and they'll tell you they [TS]

00:11:20   use Java or if they use their go [TS]

00:11:22   language they don't use go apparently [TS]

00:11:23   and this but nothing about what the [TS]

00:11:26   server side looks like so Google [TS]

00:11:28   continues to protect its its crown [TS]

00:11:31   jewels by not talking about them in any [TS]

00:11:33   particular detail but does talk about [TS]

00:11:34   the client-side stuff which I guess it [TS]

00:11:36   wants to spread because it wants web [TS]

00:11:37   applications to be as good as they can [TS]

00:11:39   be so it's Google's tools advantage to [TS]

00:11:41   share the love about writing web [TS]

00:11:44   applications in terms of the client side [TS]

00:11:46   but the server side still keeping close [TS]

00:11:48   to the best so next item here is a show [TS]

00:11:51   bot show bot Emmy yeah from Jeremy Mac [TS]

00:11:55   he did a nice post to his blog [TS]

00:11:58   explaining the origins of show bots and [TS]

00:12:00   how he the IRC throttling business and [TS]

00:12:03   how he rewrote it and where it's hosted [TS]

00:12:05   and so on and so forth so I put that in [TS]

00:12:06   the show notes people should follow that [TS]

00:12:08   I wholeheartedly endorse the show bot [TS]

00:12:10   Emmy website versus the horribly [TS]

00:12:13   throttled IRC thing yeah [TS]

00:12:15   well let's oh hold on let's take a step [TS]

00:12:17   back because right right now this is [TS]

00:12:18   like super meta and we need to kind of [TS]

00:12:21   unfold this a little bit so for the [TS]

00:12:23   people who only listen to this show as a [TS]

00:12:26   podcast as an audio thing that they [TS]

00:12:28   download or even for the people who [TS]

00:12:30   listen live but don't know there is a [TS]

00:12:32   what we refer to as a chat room and the [TS]

00:12:35   chat room if you go to five by five dot [TS]

00:12:37   TV slash live there's a little button a [TS]

00:12:39   little link there that says chat room or [TS]

00:12:42   something I should know what it says [TS]

00:12:44   because I wrote the page but I can't [TS]

00:12:46   remember and it essentially initiates [TS]

00:12:49   within your web browser a connection to [TS]

00:12:51   the 5x5 IRC channel on freenode net so [TS]

00:12:55   if you happen to be a true geek and you [TS]

00:12:57   like to use IRC independently not in a [TS]

00:13:02   web client you can just go to freenode [TS]

00:13:03   then join the channel the 5x5 channel [TS]

00:13:06   there we'd love to have you and during [TS]

00:13:08   the show these people communicate with [TS]

00:13:10   us and they correct all the mistakes [TS]

00:13:12   that we make or I make and give us [TS]

00:13:15   little links and other interesting [TS]

00:13:17   things and you know it's it's it's sort [TS]

00:13:19   of the you know [TS]

00:13:20   chat room it's the chat we love those [TS]

00:13:21   people the Nerds in there and uh [TS]

00:13:25   periodically people would come up with [TS]

00:13:26   the title suggestions and things and [TS]

00:13:28   comments and other things that would be [TS]

00:13:30   relevant to the show or people would say [TS]

00:13:31   hey well when is the show going live or [TS]

00:13:34   whatever and this this kid who is this [TS]

00:13:38   kid Jeremy he said you know what I'm [TS]

00:13:40   going to write this this bot and the bot [TS]

00:13:43   is going to sit in the channel and [TS]

00:13:44   listen and it'll answer people's [TS]

00:13:46   questions it'll collect title [TS]

00:13:48   suggestions that people make in the [TS]

00:13:49   charrids great and this is the story [TS]

00:13:52   this is the story of show bots and the [TS]

00:13:55   new show botany website it's a beautiful [TS]

00:13:59   thing and the last show we were [TS]

00:14:00   complaining about how it was very slow [TS]

00:14:02   and doling out the titles afterwards [TS]

00:14:04   because of IRC throttling so that's why [TS]

00:14:06   that's what's website gets around the [TS]

00:14:08   website loads immediately you can see [TS]

00:14:09   all the titles and it's a cute little [TS]

00:14:10   format with speech bubbles and it [TS]

00:14:12   divides it up by show so it knows when [TS]

00:14:14   the shows start and starts collecting [TS]

00:14:15   titles for that show it's great it's [TS]

00:14:17   great feature Oh [TS]

00:14:20   next thing I have is it's about about [TS]

00:14:23   lion I mean we're both disappointed that [TS]

00:14:26   line wasn't out yeah I still blame you [TS]

00:14:28   for that I think they got wind of your [TS]

00:14:30   of your article coming and they said not [TS]

00:14:33   so fast John oh but I hate when that [TS]

00:14:36   happens because now now my article which [TS]

00:14:38   is done and edited and copy edited it's [TS]

00:14:41   just sitting there [TS]

00:14:42   aging and I'm out here knowing first of [TS]

00:14:45   all I know there's tons of things that I [TS]

00:14:46   didn't include in the article no matter [TS]

00:14:47   how long a review is there's always [TS]

00:14:50   stuff that gets left out sure one of the [TS]

00:14:52   inevitable comments it's always like [TS]

00:14:54   this is too long and boring that's [TS]

00:14:55   obvious comment in the second comment is [TS]

00:14:56   why didn't you talk about block whatever [TS]

00:14:59   blah is whatever thing they're [TS]

00:15:00   interested in is just you cannot talk [TS]

00:15:02   about everything it's in an operating [TS]

00:15:03   system released I have to pick the [TS]

00:15:04   things that are interesting to me and [TS]

00:15:05   that the worst part is when people [TS]

00:15:07   describe my reviews as comprehensive [TS]

00:15:09   they're anything but comprehensive [TS]

00:15:11   comprehensive implies that they cover [TS]

00:15:12   everything that there is to cover on the [TS]

00:15:14   operating system they do not do that [TS]

00:15:15   they cover what I think are the most [TS]

00:15:17   important topics and cover them in lots [TS]

00:15:19   of depth so they're thorough you could [TS]

00:15:21   say the thorough if you if you think of [TS]

00:15:23   the thoroughness as how deep is each [TS]

00:15:24   topic that I talked about explored but [TS]

00:15:26   they're not comprehensive tons of things [TS]

00:15:28   are not covered at all not even [TS]

00:15:29   mentioned and you have a section at the [TS]

00:15:32   end of all of our reviews called [TS]

00:15:33   grab-bag where I just throw out random [TS]

00:15:34   stuff that I found so what I usually do [TS]

00:15:36   is right up to the point where it's [TS]

00:15:38   published I'm throwing stuff into that [TS]

00:15:39   grab bag where it's like oh here's [TS]

00:15:41   something else I forgot or I go through [TS]

00:15:42   my notes oh I forgot to mention this [TS]

00:15:43   this is a neat feature or maybe I should [TS]

00:15:45   throw that in there this would make a [TS]

00:15:46   good screenshot just the little things [TS]

00:15:47   you know and I used to be able to put in [TS]

00:15:51   tons of those little things so that if [TS]

00:15:54   like if I saw any other little things [TS]

00:15:56   out there on the web of people looking [TS]

00:15:57   at pre releases or whatever I collect [TS]

00:15:59   them in my notes and put them in there [TS]

00:16:00   but now I'm holding off on editing [TS]

00:16:02   because the process those sort of the [TS]

00:16:04   workflow process at ours where it goes [TS]

00:16:07   through editing and copy editing and now [TS]

00:16:08   it's being transformed into other forms [TS]

00:16:10   think they're doing you know they have [TS]

00:16:11   the PDF version ebook versions stuff [TS]

00:16:13   that's also much more formalized and [TS]

00:16:15   that and the people are still working on [TS]

00:16:16   that workflow and if I start editing the [TS]

00:16:18   original at this point I'm screwing them [TS]

00:16:19   up is they have to start there you know [TS]

00:16:21   it's not it's not automated a lot of it [TS]

00:16:23   is done by hand and people are doing it [TS]

00:16:24   so I'm not free to randomly add stuff to [TS]

00:16:26   the review but I have things that I [TS]

00:16:29   could add to it like just you know just [TS]

00:16:32   little things here or there mostly for [TS]

00:16:33   the grab bag section and there's a [TS]

00:16:36   couple of major features that I would [TS]

00:16:37   have covered if I had more time but it's [TS]

00:16:38   it's got it's not like a print deadline [TS]

00:16:40   but it's kind of like that and that [TS]

00:16:41   you're once you enter the machinery of [TS]

00:16:43   the publishing process you're not free [TS]

00:16:46   to edit not free dude keep writing it [TS]

00:16:48   stop writing at some point you have to [TS]

00:16:49   some point yet the ship so I've picked [TS]

00:16:52   that point basically and yesterday I [TS]

00:16:53   think it made my last edit to the the [TS]

00:16:55   article which is just some a few wording [TS]

00:16:58   changes here and there [TS]

00:16:59   after the copy editing was done and so [TS]

00:17:01   that's it this is what it's going to be [TS]

00:17:03   so inevitably when the review comes out [TS]

00:17:05   people are going to say why don't you [TS]

00:17:06   talk about this or I read this elsewhere [TS]

00:17:07   and this review is supposed to be [TS]

00:17:08   comprehensive why didn't use it doesn't [TS]

00:17:10   have everything no no one review has [TS]

00:17:13   anything a Mac os10 is just too big for [TS]

00:17:14   that what I hope I did is I covered the [TS]

00:17:16   these parts that I thought were most [TS]

00:17:18   significant about Lion and a few of the [TS]

00:17:20   more esoteric technical parts that I [TS]

00:17:22   found interesting and that's all I can [TS]

00:17:24   hope to do so if people are disappointed [TS]

00:17:26   because I didn't cover your favorite [TS]

00:17:28   feature or didn't complain about the [TS]

00:17:29   thing that annoys you and I guess we'll [TS]

00:17:32   talk about this more when the review is [TS]

00:17:33   published but the reason it comes up on [TS]

00:17:35   this follow-up topic is that part of the [TS]

00:17:39   one of the reasons that I think perhaps [TS]

00:17:41   that line could be delayed because at [TS]

00:17:43   this point I don't think they're going [TS]

00:17:46   to have another GMC [TS]

00:17:48   because they announce to developers like [TS]

00:17:50   hey do you want your stuff to be on on [TS]

00:17:52   the Mac App Store build it with our [TS]

00:17:54   current GM see the lion and submit it to [TS]

00:17:57   us so they're basically asking for [TS]

00:17:59   developers to use the GMC they have to [TS]

00:18:01   build their Mac applications and send [TS]

00:18:02   them to Apple for submission to the Mac [TS]

00:18:04   App Store and I have a hard time [TS]

00:18:05   believing Apple would say oh yeah feel [TS]

00:18:07   free to build your applications on a [TS]

00:18:09   pre-release version of the operating [TS]

00:18:10   system and we'll put them in the nack [TS]

00:18:11   App Store so it seems like this GM seed [TS]

00:18:15   is going to be the actual GM right now [TS]

00:18:18   but what you had said is that for those [TS]

00:18:19   of us who have and I have not but for [TS]

00:18:22   those of us who have installed this we [TS]

00:18:25   are not going to be able to update so [TS]

00:18:27   that when the first dot release or point [TS]

00:18:31   update or whatever drops you're saying [TS]

00:18:33   we won't be able to use software update [TS]

00:18:35   to update the GM oh what I said was that [TS]

00:18:37   you can't update to the gene you can't [TS]

00:18:40   up you software update on any release [TS]

00:18:42   that is not the final retail release bit [TS]

00:18:45   for bit really yeah now if they declare [TS]

00:18:49   that this GM seed is the actual GM and [TS]

00:18:52   they release it to the Mac App Store [TS]

00:18:54   without changing a single bit on it well [TS]

00:18:56   then yeah you could you can but isn't [TS]

00:18:57   that what you're saying that's what [TS]

00:18:59   you're saying [TS]

00:18:59   no because they could they could do [TS]

00:19:01   something like for example in the past [TS]

00:19:03   they've when they've declared an RC to [TS]

00:19:05   be the release it's not bit for bit the [TS]

00:19:08   same like the very least they'll change [TS]

00:19:09   the software version plist which is [TS]

00:19:11   buried down there just to change it to [TS]

00:19:13   be you know ten point x point zero or [TS]

00:19:16   whatever now historically they are in [TS]

00:19:19   this most recent release they don't need [TS]

00:19:20   to do that because I believe systems [TS]

00:19:21   softs system version that plist does [TS]

00:19:24   have ten seven zero in it but the bottom [TS]

00:19:28   line is you don't know until you see [TS]

00:19:29   something on the Mac App Store is every [TS]

00:19:31   single bit of this identical to the one [TS]

00:19:33   we have is the build number the same or [TS]

00:19:34   all the the strings is saying the [TS]

00:19:36   license agreement everything you know is [TS]

00:19:37   it exactly the same software or did they [TS]

00:19:39   do another sort of release build where [TS]

00:19:42   they didn't recompile the software but [TS]

00:19:43   they just change the metadata and the [TS]

00:19:46   packaging and then distributed that so [TS]

00:19:47   that's why I say wait one was if there's [TS]

00:19:50   going to be another GM seed obviously [TS]

00:19:51   you're screwed and the other is even if [TS]

00:19:53   there's not another GM see that they [TS]

00:19:54   changed something small about it it [TS]

00:19:55   could be the software up they've all [TS]

00:19:56   refused updated so because of the [TS]

00:19:57   uncertainty I recommend it against doing [TS]

00:20:00   that and just assuming that you'll be [TS]

00:20:01   fine you can't assume that you'll be [TS]

00:20:03   fine you might be but you might not so [TS]

00:20:05   that's why I said don't upgrade but I [TS]

00:20:07   was thinking what so if that's the case [TS]

00:20:09   if this is if they're not going to have [TS]

00:20:10   another GMC but what's the delay other [TS]

00:20:12   than to make it so we can't talk about [TS]

00:20:13   Lian for another week show is that there [TS]

00:20:17   are new Hardware rumors right the [TS]

00:20:19   hardware there's and there's a handful [TS]

00:20:21   Hardware rumors not just that not just a [TS]

00:20:23   couple first they came out with new I [TS]

00:20:25   mean everybody's been talking about [TS]

00:20:26   MacBook Airs being refreshed with the [TS]

00:20:30   the Sandy Bridge and the Thunderbolt so [TS]

00:20:33   that's that's been out there in the wild [TS]

00:20:34   for a little while but then another [TS]

00:20:37   rumor came well they're also getting [TS]

00:20:38   lighted backlit keyboards and then we [TS]

00:20:41   got a whole bunch of new serial numbers [TS]

00:20:43   that they were saying oh these are for [TS]

00:20:45   the new Mac Pros but it turns out [TS]

00:20:47   they're there apparently not for Mac [TS]

00:20:49   Pros they're for new the the white [TS]

00:20:51   plastic Mac books and Mac minis and [TS]

00:20:53   they're saying that the Mac Pros [TS]

00:20:56   themselves will be updated in a few [TS]

00:20:58   weeks - so you think that's what the [TS]

00:21:00   holdup is if the GM they feel really [TS]

00:21:01   good about it they're ready to go with [TS]

00:21:03   it what could be the holdup the holdup [TS]

00:21:05   is a hardware why not release the [TS]

00:21:06   hardware our first sponsor today whom we [TS]

00:21:09   would like to greatly thank for making [TS]

00:21:11   this show possible as FreshBooks comm if [TS]

00:21:13   you run your own business and rely on [TS]

00:21:15   invoicing to get paid then you need to [TS]

00:21:18   check out fresh books fresh books lets [TS]

00:21:20   you focus on your actual work not [TS]

00:21:23   paperwork it's just the fastest way to [TS]

00:21:25   track time organized expenses and [TS]

00:21:27   invoice your clients I use and I love it [TS]

00:21:29   are you still retyping client addresses [TS]

00:21:32   on invoices in word or manually [TS]

00:21:33   calculating invoice totals in Excel you [TS]

00:21:36   can just put all that stuff behind you [TS]

00:21:37   when you think of accounting you know [TS]

00:21:40   you have unorganized spreadsheets in a [TS]

00:21:42   shoebox of receipts I'm telling you I [TS]

00:21:44   know exactly what this is like if fresh [TS]

00:21:46   books changed all of this for me I know [TS]

00:21:48   will for you and for your business too [TS]

00:21:50   and here's the cool part getting started [TS]

00:21:52   is completely free you just go to fresh [TS]

00:21:54   books calm you sign up for a free [TS]

00:21:56   account and they're doing something [TS]

00:21:58   special for five-by-five listeners [TS]

00:21:59   they're going to give away and they've [TS]

00:22:00   done this before they're continuing this [TS]

00:22:02   they're giving away a birthday cake [TS]

00:22:03   every week to somebody who signs up from [TS]

00:22:06   this show all you need to do for a [TS]

00:22:08   chance to win it is where they're asking [TS]

00:22:10   you how you heard about us you enter in [TS]

00:22:12   hypercritical and and know it doesn't [TS]

00:22:15   have to be [TS]

00:22:15   if they win you can still win a birthday [TS]

00:22:17   cake check them out at FreshBooks [TS]

00:22:19   dot-com what you think well finally they [TS]

00:22:23   do believe that there that there will be [TS]

00:22:25   some new hardware in our near future [TS]

00:22:27   like it in a few days I don't know how [TS]

00:22:30   many days I thought you said and I look [TS]

00:22:33   air is obvious it needs to be updated [TS]

00:22:35   you know but but when there's any kind [TS]

00:22:38   of hardware rumor every hardware rumor [TS]

00:22:39   gloms onto it's like you said is any [TS]

00:22:41   machine you can think of you don't think [TS]

00:22:43   I haven't heard is like new Mac and new [TS]

00:22:44   iMacs right at least no one has said [TS]

00:22:46   that because those were just updated [TS]

00:22:47   with the Thunderbolt and everything uh [TS]

00:22:50   basically Apple's gonna put I mean we [TS]

00:22:52   know this Apple is going to put [TS]

00:22:53   Thunderbolt on all all Macs they're all [TS]

00:22:56   going to get it they're all going to get [TS]

00:22:58   it it's a matter of when and what other [TS]

00:22:59   updates are going to come along as part [TS]

00:23:02   of that and end for delay reasons you [TS]

00:23:04   could say well they're gonna want lion [TS]

00:23:06   to ship on these new machines so even if [TS]

00:23:08   it did go GM back when this was released [TS]

00:23:10   on the 1st of July or whatever even if [TS]

00:23:12   this was the official GM takes a while [TS]

00:23:14   to get that you know the hardware [TS]

00:23:15   manufacturing lead time to get that [TS]

00:23:17   software on the machines to ship them [TS]

00:23:19   out yet don't get it I've got to tweak [TS]

00:23:20   whatever installation settings to make [TS]

00:23:22   it just right and all the defaults for [TS]

00:23:24   the particular system and then they've [TS]

00:23:26   got to get a print those that they even [TS]

00:23:28   ship they do ship with DVDs still a lot [TS]

00:23:30   of them so to get a press those they've [TS]

00:23:32   got oh yeah that'll be interesting to [TS]

00:23:33   see will they come when you buy a [TS]

00:23:35   machine comes with line will it come [TS]

00:23:36   with a DVD I'll have to well obviously [TS]

00:23:39   the air is won't they'll come with that [TS]

00:23:40   little USB stick but you'd assume they [TS]

00:23:43   have to but it kind of wouldn't be kind [TS]

00:23:45   of weird that like you can't buy Lion on [TS]

00:23:46   a DVD but if you buy a new Mac it comes [TS]

00:23:48   with one well so here's here's the [TS]

00:23:49   question that I have and this is this is [TS]

00:23:51   the one topic that I had on my list that [TS]

00:23:54   I absolutely wanted to talk to you about [TS]

00:23:56   and that is this let lets say that I am [TS]

00:24:00   sure that somewhere on this planet [TS]

00:24:03   somebody has a small work group of Macs [TS]

00:24:06   and they are not on a fiber connection [TS]

00:24:08   to the end I mean I I know it's hard to [TS]

00:24:10   believe but somewhere out there this [TS]

00:24:13   exists and that person is saying you [TS]

00:24:15   know what I would like to update these [TS]

00:24:17   computers to lion and I can I can't [TS]

00:24:21   because we don't have the right kind of [TS]

00:24:23   internet connection that would make this [TS]

00:24:24   possible or we don't have any internet [TS]

00:24:25   connection we're a secret lab somewhere [TS]

00:24:29   no no only one door whatever and how are [TS]

00:24:32   they going to install this they can't [TS]

00:24:34   you can't tell me that the Mac App Store [TS]

00:24:36   is going to be the only way to update [TS]

00:24:39   this that you won't be able to buy a DVD [TS]

00:24:41   are you kidding [TS]

00:24:42   that's what you're saying I know I don't [TS]

00:24:44   think Apple announced that but I mean [TS]

00:24:46   that's a bigger Thor is the only way to [TS]

00:24:48   for you to buy Lion that's not obviously [TS]

00:24:51   it comes with your new Mac so here's [TS]

00:24:53   we're getting into a territory of my [TS]

00:24:55   review but I have a whole page on this [TS]

00:24:56   but I'm planning to read this review do [TS]

00:24:59   we do a dramatic reading of your review [TS]

00:25:01   by the way we'll get to that later all [TS]

00:25:02   right so yeah so I think I don't know [TS]

00:25:05   what the physical media situation is [TS]

00:25:06   going to be but the bottom line is I [TS]

00:25:07   don't think Apple Apple has to get this [TS]

00:25:10   thing onto the new machines because they [TS]

00:25:11   don't want to ship machines now they'd [TS]

00:25:12   have Snow Leopard on them if they're [TS]

00:25:14   brand new they have to be coming with [TS]

00:25:15   line so the most interesting rumor that [TS]

00:25:18   I saw here also most likely to be false [TS]

00:25:21   was the rumor about Mac Pro's this is [TS]

00:25:24   when they thought the back when I [TS]

00:25:25   thought the serial numbers were for Mac [TS]

00:25:27   Pros and other things before they [TS]

00:25:29   discovered the serial numbers weren't I [TS]

00:25:30   don't know if I even believe either one [TS]

00:25:32   of those that the serial numbers were [TS]

00:25:33   for Mac Pro's or that they're now [TS]

00:25:35   determined not to be it's just that [TS]

00:25:37   those rumors are extremely sketchy but [TS]

00:25:39   the discussion of the Mac Pros and [TS]

00:25:41   whether they need to be updated and what [TS]

00:25:42   that update might look like is eternally [TS]

00:25:44   interesting to me especially since I [TS]

00:25:46   believe the current Mac Pro's external [TS]

00:25:48   design has been with us for eight years [TS]

00:25:50   is it eight all right yeah because it's [TS]

00:25:52   well it started with the g5 yeah our [TS]

00:25:54   side office eight years but it's some [TS]

00:25:55   ridiculously long amount of time that [TS]

00:25:57   that machine has not been refreshed [TS]

00:25:59   externally inside the inside they've [TS]

00:26:01   changed a lot obviously used to have [TS]

00:26:02   PowerPC chips but everything about the [TS]

00:26:04   inside what where the motherboard is [TS]

00:26:06   where the RAM is where the drives are [TS]

00:26:08   how many drives there are almost [TS]

00:26:09   everything about it has been changed [TS]

00:26:11   inside but the outside it kind of looks [TS]

00:26:13   the same so the rumor the almost [TS]

00:26:15   certainly false rumor from days ago this [TS]

00:26:17   is from nine to five Mac was that it [TS]

00:26:20   would have a redesigning closure that's [TS]

00:26:22   narrower and rack-mountable and 16 core [TS]

00:26:26   CPUs and Thunderbolt and blah blah blah [TS]

00:26:29   happy I hadn't heard that around far [TS]

00:26:31   right recommendable seems like it's such [TS]

00:26:34   a crazy pipe dream they just killed the [TS]

00:26:35   XOR why in the world would they produce [TS]

00:26:37   another rack mountable computer but not [TS]

00:26:40   outside you know they could say well the [TS]

00:26:42   XR [TS]

00:26:42   was an enterprise computer but this is [TS]

00:26:44   actually just a Mac Pro that's squished [TS]

00:26:46   well this kind of enters into the and [TS]

00:26:49   this put this happens every time every [TS]

00:26:51   time that they're sort of rumors out [TS]

00:26:53   there lurking if if the rumors aren't [TS]

00:26:56   answered promptly by whatever the new [TS]

00:26:59   release is that's initially creating and [TS]

00:27:02   generating the rumors [TS]

00:27:03   if there isn't a swift response like the [TS]

00:27:06   rumors come out and then six days later [TS]

00:27:07   Apple has the the release then you start [TS]

00:27:11   getting all these weird now I think it [TS]

00:27:13   would be great I mean if you're asking [TS]

00:27:14   me what would I like to have of course [TS]

00:27:16   I'd love to have a have a Mac Pro that I [TS]

00:27:19   could slap a you know a slider on each [TS]

00:27:22   end of it and just rackmount the thing I [TS]

00:27:24   mean would that be great that'd be [TS]

00:27:25   perfect of course and yeah this this [TS]

00:27:27   ancient net you know in computer terms [TS]

00:27:30   ancient enclosure yeah it's a great [TS]

00:27:33   enclosure but you know it Apple is [TS]

00:27:36   really really pushing limits of what you [TS]

00:27:37   can do with space so why don't we have a [TS]

00:27:40   smaller enclosure do we need all that [TS]

00:27:43   space still you know no we don't let's [TS]

00:27:45   make it smaller let's let's let's be [TS]

00:27:48   inventive with with the way that we do [TS]

00:27:49   it I mean look at the Mac Mini something [TS]

00:27:51   between give us something between a Mac [TS]

00:27:53   Mini and a Mac Pro with the the [TS]

00:27:56   expandability or close to it of the [TS]

00:27:58   current Mac Pro and that you would think [TS]

00:28:00   that would thing would sell really well [TS]

00:28:01   and hey by the way put some rails on [TS]

00:28:03   it'll go right in the rack that's when [TS]

00:28:05   you start thinking that that's too good [TS]

00:28:07   to be true [TS]

00:28:07   that's one of the things I want to talk [TS]

00:28:09   about the reason why to bring this up [TS]

00:28:10   not so much that I believe these Mac Pro [TS]

00:28:11   rumors but that well there's two topics [TS]

00:28:14   first is the X Mac which which Marco [TS]

00:28:16   didn't mention I'm build and analyze for [TS]

00:28:18   people who don't know I put a link to it [TS]

00:28:19   in the show notes [TS]

00:28:20   my old ex Mac story the X Mac it's a [TS]

00:28:23   little X capital M I believe this term [TS]

00:28:26   originated in the ARS technica forums I [TS]

00:28:28   tried to research it back when I wrote [TS]

00:28:30   this article to see if I could find [TS]

00:28:31   earlier instances of it and I couldn't [TS]

00:28:33   so I'm going with that I the X Mac was [TS]

00:28:36   the term for basically for the machine [TS]

00:28:38   between the iMac and the Mac Pro it's a [TS]

00:28:41   big gaping hole and apples lineup that's [TS]

00:28:43   been there forever that you could buy an [TS]

00:28:44   all-in-one computer with a monitor and [TS]

00:28:46   everything and it's a cute little iMac [TS]

00:28:47   and the iMac goes of course changed so [TS]

00:28:48   much over the years but it's always been [TS]

00:28:50   an all-in-one thing or you can get a Mac [TS]

00:28:52   Pro which is a big honking tower with [TS]

00:28:54   more expandability than almost anyone [TS]

00:28:55   will ever need [TS]

00:28:56   it's big and noisy and heavy and super [TS]

00:28:57   expensive right and there's an obvious [TS]

00:28:59   huge gap between those two computers and [TS]

00:29:01   there's nothing there so the ex Mac was [TS]

00:29:04   the term for the computer would slot in [TS]

00:29:07   there now since it's so vaguely defined [TS]

00:29:09   everybody thinks the ex Mac is whatever [TS]

00:29:11   kind of computer they want so depending [TS]

00:29:14   on what they want out of the ex Mac they [TS]

00:29:15   will just map their desires onto it the [TS]

00:29:17   only thing you need to have is it it can [TS]

00:29:18   have a built-in monitor right and it [TS]

00:29:20   can't be as big as the Mac Pro but [TS]

00:29:22   everything else is all open season so in [TS]

00:29:24   my old ex Mac article I wrote a story [TS]

00:29:26   about what I thought of would be a great [TS]

00:29:28   Mac X Mac not that I thought Apple was [TS]

00:29:30   going to do it but it was my take on [TS]

00:29:32   here's what I wanted for for the X Mac [TS]

00:29:35   my current definition of the X Mac which [TS]

00:29:38   I think is a reason is what most people [TS]

00:29:42   the vast majority people mean when they [TS]

00:29:43   talk about it at least the Nerds the [TS]

00:29:45   arstechnica nerds and other people is [TS]

00:29:47   that you know obviously it's not not an [TS]

00:29:49   iMac and not a Mac Pro what that means [TS]

00:29:50   is it has user serviceable RAM hard [TS]

00:29:52   drive and video card like like a Mac Pro [TS]

00:29:55   it doesn't have an embedded or an [TS]

00:29:57   integrated video like it has an actual [TS]

00:29:59   video card not one of those things [TS]

00:30:01   that's soldered on the motherboard or [TS]

00:30:02   integrated into the CPU and you can have [TS]

00:30:04   more than one the hard drive it those [TS]

00:30:05   three bullet points are probably the [TS]

00:30:07   only ones you can get everyone agreed to [TS]

00:30:08   for the X Mac what it boils down to is [TS]

00:30:10   if for example gamers is a good thing if [TS]

00:30:13   you want to do games on a Mac you have [TS]

00:30:14   to buy stupid Mac Pro because the gaming [TS]

00:30:16   cards in the IMAX have always been so [TS]

00:30:18   awful they've gotten a lot better over [TS]

00:30:19   time in fact the current one is actually [TS]

00:30:21   pretty darn good and it's actually I [TS]

00:30:23   believe an external card now although [TS]

00:30:25   it's not user serviceable because that [TS]

00:30:27   iMac is pretty well sealed up and you [TS]

00:30:28   don't want to be digging in there but if [TS]

00:30:30   you want a good if you want the best [TS]

00:30:31   available video card that you can get on [TS]

00:30:32   a Mac you have to buy a Mac Pro which is [TS]

00:30:34   a huge waste because this is this huge [TS]

00:30:35   volume of space in there and slot so [TS]

00:30:37   you're not going to use and and hard [TS]

00:30:39   drive slots and all this stuff and it [TS]

00:30:42   seems like such a waste of money to buy [TS]

00:30:43   a huge expensive three thousand alot [TS]

00:30:45   computer just because you want to play [TS]

00:30:45   games so it's like give me give me a [TS]

00:30:47   small computer that has a big fancy [TS]

00:30:51   gaming video card but otherwise is [TS]

00:30:53   compact and quiet and maybe holds two [TS]

00:30:55   hard drives instead of four and maybe [TS]

00:30:57   doesn't support dual socket CPU is just [TS]

00:31:00   one CPU is enough for gaming just make [TS]

00:31:02   it the high clock speed you know it [TS]

00:31:03   doesn't have to have as many cores Apple [TS]

00:31:05   does not make that machine and people [TS]

00:31:07   always want it so anytime there's any [TS]

00:31:08   kind of rumor [TS]

00:31:09   Mac Pros and other instance of people [TS]

00:31:10   saying well Mac Pro is really old and [TS]

00:31:12   wouldn't be great if there were a little [TS]

00:31:13   bit smaller because it seems so big and [TS]

00:31:15   the everyone just everyone will come [TS]

00:31:17   back to the X Mac they don't know the X [TS]

00:31:18   Mac name but that hole in the lineup is [TS]

00:31:20   there and they will converge on it with [TS]

00:31:22   their rumors and desires and the reasons [TS]

00:31:24   Apple doesn't make that machine are [TS]

00:31:26   pretty obvious first first the most [TS]

00:31:28   important now is probably because most [TS]

00:31:29   people buy laptops Apple sales have been [TS]

00:31:31   majority of laptops for a long time and [TS]

00:31:33   it continues a shift in that direction [TS]

00:31:34   so Apple's attention paid to the desktop [TS]

00:31:36   line as always it's always kind of [TS]

00:31:38   second fiddle to the portables but even [TS]

00:31:41   beyond that there's not really any [TS]

00:31:42   upside for Apple and building the X Mac [TS]

00:31:44   it would necessarily have lower margins [TS]

00:31:46   than the Mac Pro because the whole point [TS]

00:31:47   is it wouldn't be as expensive as the [TS]

00:31:49   Mac Pro it's not supposed to be like the [TS]

00:31:50   g4 cube where it's small and cute but [TS]

00:31:52   also super expensive it's supposed to be [TS]

00:31:53   cheaper otherwise why not just buy a Mac [TS]

00:31:55   Pro it's also more complex than the iMac [TS]

00:31:58   so it's kind of one of those don't make [TS]

00:32:01   me think situations where Apple doesn't [TS]

00:32:03   want a customer to come into the store [TS]

00:32:04   and say well I could buy this iMac but [TS]

00:32:06   people tell me there's this other one [TS]

00:32:08   where you get the monitor separate and [TS]

00:32:10   it could be less expensive or more [TS]

00:32:11   expensive depending on how you configure [TS]

00:32:13   it and blah blah [TS]

00:32:14   they don't like that confusion that's [TS]

00:32:16   not the Apple Wave it's no one goes into [TS]

00:32:18   the the Apple Store confused where they [TS]

00:32:20   should get a Mac Pro or an iMac because [TS]

00:32:21   if you want an AK Pro you know you want [TS]

00:32:23   a Mac Pro right if you don't want a Mac [TS]

00:32:24   Pro guess what you get in an iMac or a [TS]

00:32:25   laptop right so it's like portable or [TS]

00:32:27   not portable and then once you pick [TS]

00:32:29   once you pick not portable I don't if [TS]

00:32:30   you want to call desktop once you big [TS]

00:32:32   desktop the choice is really easy [TS]

00:32:34   there's no confusion so why would Apple [TS]

00:32:37   introduced a new model that adds [TS]

00:32:38   customer confusion that lowers their [TS]

00:32:39   margins cannibalizing sales of the Mac [TS]

00:32:41   Pro most likely more than pulling people [TS]

00:32:43   up from the iMac it just doesn't make [TS]

00:32:46   any financial or practical sense for [TS]

00:32:48   than ever to produce this Mac but [TS]

00:32:49   computer nerds would love that for there [TS]

00:32:51   to be one and I would too barring that [TS]

00:32:54   which I don't think is ever going to [TS]

00:32:56   happen what I would like to see is a [TS]

00:32:58   revision to the Mac Pro enclosure for a [TS]

00:33:02   couple of reasons first is it's just [TS]

00:33:03   fashion like don't you get bored with [TS]

00:33:05   the same everyone else gets redesigned [TS]

00:33:07   the iMac Scott redesigned seven [TS]

00:33:08   different ways a Sunday even even the [TS]

00:33:09   laptops which are so limited in how they [TS]

00:33:11   can look because they have to be [TS]

00:33:12   portable and you know there's only a [TS]

00:33:13   limited number of things you can do with [TS]

00:33:14   laptop those have changed radically over [TS]

00:33:17   the years in subtle ways and the iMac [TS]

00:33:19   even more radically but the stupid Mac [TS]

00:33:21   Pro you know it's time for us to have [TS]

00:33:22   some fun - I'd so [TS]

00:33:23   for the Mac Pro to change more slowly [TS]

00:33:24   than the other models but it should [TS]

00:33:26   change like I don't want to have this [TS]

00:33:27   case I don't want to be buying my third [TS]

00:33:30   computer that looks like a giant cheese [TS]

00:33:31   grater let's just let's draw the line [TS]

00:33:33   somewhere but internally there are [TS]

00:33:35   actual practical issues that can that [TS]

00:33:37   can be fixed so actually before we get [TS]

00:33:38   internally externally those handles [TS]

00:33:39   they're super sharp and they're not [TS]

00:33:41   particularly comfortable they may look [TS]

00:33:42   cool but and they're better than no [TS]

00:33:44   handles but they're not great to pick [TS]

00:33:47   the thing up from not that I carry [TS]

00:33:48   around my Mac's a lot people who work in [TS]

00:33:50   labs or any other place else where you [TS]

00:33:51   do actually have to lift these things [TS]

00:33:52   you know that those handles are pretty [TS]

00:33:54   cruel let me let me ask you a question [TS]

00:33:55   before you get too into destroying the [TS]

00:33:58   current enclosure has there ever been a [TS]

00:34:01   Mac desktop enclosure that we've had for [TS]

00:34:05   as long as we've had this current one [TS]

00:34:07   across the board in any model I don't [TS]

00:34:10   think so the only one I would say is if [TS]

00:34:11   you wanted to count all of the g4s as [TS]

00:34:13   one model where they just changed the [TS]

00:34:14   sort of plastic cladding then maybe you [TS]

00:34:16   could count that or if you just wanted [TS]

00:34:18   to count that shape like the g3 through [TS]

00:34:19   g4 shape the one with a little that they [TS]

00:34:22   handles at an angle right that external [TS]

00:34:24   shape lasted for a really long time [TS]

00:34:26   you're talking about the bits the visual [TS]

00:34:28   oh you in the Bozell yeah now the whole [TS]

00:34:32   thing the whole case shaped like if you [TS]

00:34:34   were just look at it in silhouette from [TS]

00:34:35   the Yosemite g3 all the way up to [TS]

00:34:38   whatever the last g4 thing was with [TS]

00:34:41   mirrored Drive doors whatever that shape [TS]

00:34:42   stayed with us for a long time - but it [TS]

00:34:45   at least it changed fashion wise to [TS]

00:34:47   change color that features changed it's [TS]

00:34:49   sprouted vents and glory holes and all [TS]

00:34:53   sorts of slots and shiny things and [TS]

00:34:55   letters and that changed in much more [TS]

00:34:58   interesting ways so yeah but I do think [TS]

00:35:00   the mac pro case has changed at least [TS]

00:35:02   for the longest amount of time maybe the [TS]

00:35:03   Xserve ones that maybe the Xserve [TS]

00:35:05   changed less than that I know they move [TS]

00:35:07   the vents and change to three hard [TS]

00:35:09   drives when they went to I believe when [TS]

00:35:11   they went to Intel so at least that had [TS]

00:35:13   a break in the content of the X or it [TS]

00:35:15   did look kind of the same about it but [TS]

00:35:17   fashion aside and handles aside on the [TS]

00:35:19   inside I liked when they change from two [TS]

00:35:23   hard drives to four because that's one [TS]

00:35:24   of the reasons I buy a Mac Pro is I want [TS]

00:35:26   to be able to buy cheap hard drive [TS]

00:35:28   mechanisms without any other stuff [TS]

00:35:30   attached to them and just stick them [TS]

00:35:31   into - you chuck it in there it's the [TS]

00:35:33   cheapest way to get extra storage much [TS]

00:35:35   less expensive than [TS]

00:35:37   sometimes at this point the external [TS]

00:35:38   cases you buy like so you just want a [TS]

00:35:40   cheap USB case or firewire case or a [TS]

00:35:42   thunderbolt case someday those cases [TS]

00:35:44   tend to cost as much or more than the [TS]

00:35:46   hard drive which kills me and I always [TS]

00:35:48   like well I'll buy one these cases but [TS]

00:35:50   I'll be able to reuse it but you can't [TS]

00:35:51   really because first of all one of my [TS]

00:35:53   lot of my cases are parallel ata which [TS]

00:35:56   of course isn't used anymore so those [TS]

00:35:57   all went by the wayside and the second [TS]

00:35:58   thing is when you have a case with a [TS]

00:35:59   hard drive minute you think you're going [TS]

00:36:00   to reuse the case what are you going to [TS]

00:36:01   do with the hard drive is in there and [TS]

00:36:03   it seems like such a waste to just take [TS]

00:36:04   it out and put in the attic or throw it [TS]

00:36:06   in the garbage see you know what ends up [TS]

00:36:09   happening is you don't reuse them as [TS]

00:36:10   much as you thought you would and [TS]

00:36:11   eventually they become obsolete it's oh [TS]

00:36:13   I'd much prefer to have internal space [TS]

00:36:14   for drives and the current models drives [TS]

00:36:17   have these drive sled things I don't [TS]

00:36:19   know if you have you pulled out the [TS]

00:36:20   drive sleds in your Mac Pro you yeah so [TS]

00:36:23   it's like a metal it's like a flimsy [TS]

00:36:24   l-shaped metal thing with four screws on [TS]

00:36:27   it to the drive attaches to but it's not [TS]

00:36:29   a great experience like it's well [TS]

00:36:31   alright they're very hard to get an out [TS]

00:36:34   right and they there's sort of a point [TS]

00:36:36   of tension where you have to pull but if [TS]

00:36:39   you pull too hard the thing will just [TS]

00:36:40   sort of fly out like a rocket and and [TS]

00:36:43   also when you're pulling since it's an [TS]

00:36:44   l-shaped piece of metal if you pull on [TS]

00:36:45   the bottom of the L shape you're [TS]

00:36:47   applying vertical pressure you know as a [TS]

00:36:50   lever you just want to be pulling it out [TS]

00:36:52   horizontally right you try to pull it [TS]

00:36:53   horizontally it's no place there's no [TS]

00:36:55   place to grip it so that you're pulling [TS]

00:36:56   directly horizontal so the force vector [TS]

00:36:58   is going entirely horizontally and so [TS]

00:37:00   there's no other force vectors going up [TS]

00:37:01   or down [TS]

00:37:02   Oh physically yeah the only place you [TS]

00:37:04   have to grab it causes force vectors ago [TS]

00:37:06   in all sorts of directions in it and it [TS]

00:37:07   binds up and sometimes it's hard to get [TS]

00:37:09   them out all right and and it's metal on [TS]

00:37:11   metal it's it's a piece of anodized [TS]

00:37:12   aluminum or something sliding into metal [TS]

00:37:14   slots and that's not a nice experience [TS]

00:37:16   you know metal sliding it's metal is [TS]

00:37:17   like it's not fingers on the chalkboard [TS]

00:37:19   but it's close it's like scrapey and if [TS]

00:37:21   you remember the B Power Mac g5 you [TS]

00:37:24   remember what that hard drive thing was [TS]

00:37:25   like yeah it had what you would do is [TS]

00:37:29   you would take your hard drive mechanism [TS]

00:37:30   that you bought from the store and they [TS]

00:37:32   have these little dome headed screws [TS]

00:37:35   they're almost rubberized yeah although [TS]

00:37:37   the screws were on rubberized screws [TS]

00:37:38   were smooth shiny metal that's right I'm [TS]

00:37:41   sorry dome heads on them and they had to [TS]

00:37:43   let fit into a little trough inside [TS]

00:37:46   right yeah and the trough was plastic so [TS]

00:37:49   here you had [TS]

00:37:50   smooth metal on soft plastic when the [TS]

00:37:52   great thing was that those little screws [TS]

00:37:54   had little places for them to be like [TS]

00:37:56   there was four screw holes for them to [TS]

00:37:57   be stuck inside the case so it would [TS]

00:37:59   come with one hard drive with the screws [TS]

00:38:00   already in it but when you got your [TS]

00:38:01   second hard drive you'd be like where [TS]

00:38:02   are those dogs where are the screws how [TS]

00:38:03   do I have to buy them but they were [TS]

00:38:04   already there yeah yeah they were they [TS]

00:38:06   were sort of there were four little [TS]

00:38:07   screw holes up inside that you just had [TS]

00:38:09   to I guess you just had to know that [TS]

00:38:11   they were there or if you read your [TS]

00:38:12   manual perhaps it said yeah and if you [TS]

00:38:15   want to buy them third party like you [TS]

00:38:17   made the mistake of taking a drive out [TS]

00:38:19   and didn't take the screws off those [TS]

00:38:21   things were really expensive yeah that's [TS]

00:38:23   the same thing with a drive sled so the [TS]

00:38:25   other thing with the drive slides is if [TS]

00:38:26   you want [TS]

00:38:26   I've been swapping drives a lot with [TS]

00:38:28   having a lion Drive and I took out my [TS]

00:38:30   Windows drive for a while and I've been [TS]

00:38:31   you know that you're just using our [TS]

00:38:32   wife's computer for that I'm using [TS]

00:38:34   everything I'm using every piece of [TS]

00:38:35   hardware in this house including my [TS]

00:38:37   things so I'm swapping out drives but [TS]

00:38:38   swapping out drives as a penguin then I [TS]

00:38:40   sled because you have to unscrew this [TS]

00:38:41   lead and screwed into the other one [TS]

00:38:42   you're was afraid you're going to strip [TS]

00:38:43   those tiny little screws because they're [TS]

00:38:45   really small Phillips head size zero [TS]

00:38:48   zero zero or whatever I would like to [TS]

00:38:51   have an extra sled because I need to sly [TS]

00:38:52   up the sled and slide the other one in [TS]

00:38:53   but the sleds again cost half as much as [TS]

00:38:55   an entire hard drive because they're [TS]

00:38:57   there I don't know they're rare I don't [TS]

00:38:59   know why they cost so much drive sleds [TS]

00:39:00   always cost a bazillion dollars I guess [TS]

00:39:02   it's a supply and demand thing so I [TS]

00:39:03   would like to not have drive sleds the [TS]

00:39:05   g5 situation where you had shiny metal [TS]

00:39:08   screws smooth metal screws on plastic [TS]

00:39:10   that was a much more pleasing sliding [TS]

00:39:11   experience the only problem with the g5 [TS]

00:39:13   one was that only it only had two drives [TS]

00:39:15   and to get one of them out you had to [TS]

00:39:17   take the other one out like you could [TS]

00:39:18   take one of them in and out [TS]

00:39:19   independently but if you wanted to take [TS]

00:39:20   the second one out you also had to take [TS]

00:39:22   the first one out because it was weird [TS]

00:39:23   sliding thing so I would like something [TS]

00:39:25   that like the current Mac Pro's where [TS]

00:39:27   you've got four or more drives in fact I [TS]

00:39:29   would say four or five six let me put as [TS]

00:39:31   many drops as I want there I'll use them [TS]

00:39:32   all but do not have metal and metal have [TS]

00:39:35   to be a smooth slide without any bad [TS]

00:39:37   mechanical you know mechanisms in there [TS]

00:39:41   that caused them to bind up so there's [TS]

00:39:43   definitely room for improvement in the [TS]

00:39:44   user serviceable parts on the Mac Pro [TS]

00:39:47   and the RAM is a little bit testy too [TS]

00:39:48   but you ever use the Drobo no I'm not a [TS]

00:39:52   Drobo family but we talked about that I [TS]

00:39:53   think we did right I was just wondering [TS]

00:39:55   if you have ever because they have a [TS]

00:39:56   kind of an interesting [TS]

00:39:57   drive insertion mechanism that doesn't [TS]

00:39:59   require doing anything to the drive you [TS]

00:40:01   just slide it in and it locks into place [TS]

00:40:03   and there are people who [TS]

00:40:04   like in people who don't I was just [TS]

00:40:05   curious if you had tried yeah I like [TS]

00:40:07   I've seen it I've seen like videos of [TS]

00:40:09   people doing it I like the idea you know [TS]

00:40:11   no weird screws no sleds just slide the [TS]

00:40:13   drive in and if it works fine and [TS]

00:40:14   there's not a lot of slop and you don't [TS]

00:40:15   get like the connector shaking loose or [TS]

00:40:17   anything then it seems fine let's I've [TS]

00:40:19   been using Drobo's for years and I've [TS]

00:40:21   never had a problem with drive insertion [TS]

00:40:25   or anything in Ottomans it's simple it [TS]

00:40:27   just works [TS]

00:40:27   and I do would think that Apple would [TS]

00:40:29   innovate something like that yeah well [TS]

00:40:31   you know hard drives are kind of creepy [TS]

00:40:33   in that there's one of the last pieces [TS]

00:40:35   of a computer that's not hot swappable I [TS]

00:40:37   don't know if Siri lays a technically [TS]

00:40:40   support hot swapping I think it might [TS]

00:40:41   but certainly the Mac the packet is not [TS]

00:40:44   so do not remove your hard drive while [TS]

00:40:45   the computer is on do not put a new one [TS]

00:40:47   in to mine our drivers on bad things [TS]

00:40:48   will happen and Thunderbolt obviously [TS]

00:40:51   fixes this but then you have the whole [TS]

00:40:53   external case issue and does the case [TS]

00:40:55   have a fan does the case have a power [TS]

00:40:56   supply it's not bus powered that gets so [TS]

00:40:59   much messier I'm a big fan of internal [TS]

00:41:01   drives I always pack my machines with as [TS]

00:41:02   many drives as they can fit internally [TS]

00:41:04   we would also like very much to thank [TS]

00:41:07   Shopify comm one of our long-term [TS]

00:41:08   sponsors love these guys [TS]

00:41:10   Shopify is absolutely the best way to [TS]

00:41:13   sell anything online I love them now you [TS]

00:41:16   get your own online store you'll be able [TS]

00:41:18   to accept credit cards you'll be able to [TS]

00:41:19   use your own domain you'll be able to [TS]

00:41:21   customise your stores design they host [TS]

00:41:23   everything for you you don't have to do [TS]

00:41:24   anything it's all right there it's just [TS]

00:41:26   done it's done you can pick from over 50 [TS]

00:41:29   free and premium themes in their theme [TS]

00:41:32   store and if you know HTML and CSS [TS]

00:41:34   forget it design your own it's up to you [TS]

00:41:36   you'll get your own shopping card to get [TS]

00:41:38   streamlined checkout and they have a [TS]

00:41:40   dedicated team of security experts with [TS]

00:41:42   a really thick rimmed glasses that will [TS]

00:41:45   handle all of your ecommerce stuff and [TS]

00:41:48   make it secure for you so you don't have [TS]

00:41:49   to worry about it I mean they've got [TS]

00:41:50   everything they've got analytics they'll [TS]

00:41:52   keep track of your stores progress over [TS]

00:41:54   time they do all of this you know again [TS]

00:41:57   you don't have to install anything or do [TS]

00:41:58   anything it's just right their unique [TS]

00:42:00   visitors everything now there's a 30-day [TS]

00:42:03   free trial but if you use the discount [TS]

00:42:05   code 5x5 you will get your first three [TS]

00:42:08   months free a shop in minutes of [TS]

00:42:11   business for life at Shopify com I love [TS]

00:42:15   them you will to check them [TS]

00:42:17   so on new hardware and the line delay I [TS]

00:42:20   don't know what's coming I assume [TS]

00:42:21   MacBook Airs are coming I assume there [TS]

00:42:23   will be no Mac Pro thing like like Marco [TS]

00:42:26   said on his show the Intel roadmap [TS]

00:42:28   dictates that the CPUs Apple would use [TS]

00:42:30   for its macros and not yet available but [TS]

00:42:32   on the other hand as he also said Apple [TS]

00:42:34   occasionally gets stuff early so there's [TS]

00:42:36   rumors flying around about that I think [TS]

00:42:38   he most recently posted something that [TS]

00:42:39   was his take on this serial number [TS]

00:42:43   mismatch thing was that oh it looks [TS]

00:42:45   those are actual Co numbers for the [TS]

00:42:47   white MacBook of the Mac Mini just goes [TS]

00:42:49   to show there's not going to be any new [TS]

00:42:50   Mac pros because the chips aren't ready [TS]

00:42:52   and that's probably true so and you're [TS]

00:42:53   in you're going to go on record right [TS]

00:42:55   okay so today is Wednesday so July 13th [TS]

00:42:58   you're going on record and saying there [TS]

00:43:01   will be no this is eating your gut [TS]

00:43:04   feeling and whatever insider information [TS]

00:43:06   you have and are downplaying no new Macs [TS]

00:43:11   this week no line this week that's what [TS]

00:43:14   I'm saying next week definitive definite [TS]

00:43:16   absolutely uh stink you've already [TS]

00:43:19   notional no new line I mean this is just [TS]

00:43:21   rumors I'm just guessing I'm guessing [TS]

00:43:22   like everybody else I'm saying no lion [TS]

00:43:25   this week probably know are we're this [TS]

00:43:27   week next week [TS]

00:43:27   I assume lion will will be released and [TS]

00:43:31   hardware I give 50/50 chance for next [TS]

00:43:35   week just because new hardware is coming [TS]

00:43:37   doesn't mean it's coming at the same [TS]

00:43:38   time as lion or next week you know what [TS]

00:43:40   I mean like it's obvious as you people [TS]

00:43:41   have drawn a man another they've they've [TS]

00:43:43   made that connection and said that the [TS]

00:43:45   reason that we don't have the airs yet [TS]

00:43:47   I'll just pick the airs out of the all [TS]

00:43:49   of the list cuz that's been the longest [TS]

00:43:50   runner and we know those need to be [TS]

00:43:52   updated the reason that there's no new [TS]

00:43:55   errors is because lion wasn't completely [TS]

00:43:58   ready and it takes them a week or two to [TS]

00:44:00   go from saying okay this is our GM seed [TS]

00:44:04   we think it's going to be good too [TS]

00:44:05   saying it is good to then printing it on [TS]

00:44:08   to whether it's books or DVDs which they [TS]

00:44:11   may or may not be selling or even just [TS]

00:44:13   burning the image down onto the little [TS]

00:44:15   DVD of the little USB stick rather to [TS]

00:44:19   ship along with the MacBook Airs and [TS]

00:44:21   putting them into the boxes and getting [TS]

00:44:23   them an image done to the hard drives [TS]

00:44:24   and all the little things they need to [TS]

00:44:26   do that that could take a week or two [TS]

00:44:28   but you know what I feel like that [TS]

00:44:30   kind of going back to the previous this [TS]

00:44:32   is follow up a follow up but couldn't [TS]

00:44:36   they have announced the new MacBook Airs [TS]

00:44:39   and said they ship in a week or they [TS]

00:44:41   ship in two weeks like the minute that [TS]

00:44:43   they were a hundred percent sure that [TS]

00:44:46   the GM was ready to go the minute that [TS]

00:44:48   they said that GM is good the GM this is [TS]

00:44:51   the West is our boy this is the one he's [TS]

00:44:53   ready to go out in the world that at [TS]

00:44:55   that minute they say all right MacBook [TS]

00:44:59   Airs [TS]

00:44:59   coming out yeah Apple sizing we're I [TS]

00:45:02   wait why wait why not just save shit [TS]

00:45:04   because tonight it's not like they have [TS]

00:45:05   a thing about shipping Julie you won't [TS]

00:45:06   announce analyst at shipping today [TS]

00:45:08   because they announced stuff is all the [TS]

00:45:09   time all the time but on the other hand [TS]

00:45:12   you know Apple does like to have like a [TS]

00:45:14   medium message I think it's probably [TS]

00:45:16   dictated by marketing because they do [TS]

00:45:17   they do want to announce things in a [TS]

00:45:19   certain order to push a certain message [TS]

00:45:21   and if marketing has decided that the [TS]

00:45:23   best way to release these is in this [TS]

00:45:25   order this and out you know that's the [TS]

00:45:27   that's the way it's going to go if they [TS]

00:45:28   say we should release lion and we should [TS]

00:45:31   release the hardware two days before or [TS]

00:45:33   we should at least the new hardware two [TS]

00:45:34   days after actually we should wait for [TS]

00:45:35   all the line stuff to die down before [TS]

00:45:36   announcing the new hardware you know I [TS]

00:45:38   think along when you say marketing [TS]

00:45:41   that's a euphemism for Steve Jobs no not [TS]

00:45:44   really because I think he delegates the [TS]

00:45:46   launch order of most things to the [TS]

00:45:48   actual marketing department really has a [TS]

00:45:50   lot of power within Apple and really if [TS]

00:45:53   you think he dedicates that you when you [TS]

00:45:55   say delegates that is a euphemism for [TS]

00:45:57   giving them the specific date and time [TS]

00:45:59   and order in which to launch sometimes [TS]

00:46:01   I'm sure he has strong feelings other [TS]

00:46:02   but the way the way my impression is the [TS]

00:46:04   way things work inside Apple is not that [TS]

00:46:06   he dictates everything with just that he [TS]

00:46:08   if you feel strongly about something he [TS]

00:46:10   has no problem reaching down the [TS]

00:46:11   organization and making it so but if he [TS]

00:46:12   doesn't feel strongly and that's why he [TS]

00:46:13   hires good people they come to him with [TS]

00:46:15   something they say we're thinking to do [TS]

00:46:16   an X and he goes yeah that sounds fine [TS]

00:46:18   or no it doesn't and I think he says [TS]

00:46:20   yeah that sounds fine a lot with the [TS]

00:46:22   marketing people now obviously when it's [TS]

00:46:23   it's something involving him like the [TS]

00:46:25   iCloud launch or whatever he's going to [TS]

00:46:27   say no iCloud it has to be the same time [TS]

00:46:28   as wcwc is going to be iOS 5 line and [TS]

00:46:31   iCloud and that's going to be our push [TS]

00:46:33   you know that was a clear message to [TS]

00:46:35   that conference that they had those [TS]

00:46:36   three things so even if iCloud was early [TS]

00:46:37   ready or iOS five was really ready or [TS]

00:46:39   anything all those three we're going to [TS]

00:46:40   coincide it W that we see no matter what [TS]

00:46:42   but for Hardware stuff like this you've [TS]

00:46:44   seen with a [TS]

00:46:44   with the hardware like they'll update [TS]

00:46:45   the Mac Pros and not even say anything [TS]

00:46:47   that you press roots maybe if you're [TS]

00:46:48   lucky same thing with the white Mac [TS]

00:46:50   books and stuff and then occasionally [TS]

00:46:52   they'll be like the new heirs will get [TS]

00:46:54   on the front page and they'll be a press [TS]

00:46:55   release but it's not that big of a push [TS]

00:46:56   obviously lion is going to be a big push [TS]

00:46:58   so I don't know when these things are [TS]

00:47:00   going to come but I would imagine that [TS]

00:47:02   marketing has a lot to do with it [TS]

00:47:04   and if they if they really thought it [TS]

00:47:06   was super important for line to be out [TS]

00:47:07   this week like if there was some sort of [TS]

00:47:08   external pressure they would have just [TS]

00:47:10   done it and if the hardware wasn't ready [TS]

00:47:11   they would have announced it if they [TS]

00:47:13   decided it's best for us to announce [TS]

00:47:14   hardware and software at the same time [TS]

00:47:15   they would have just announced it but [TS]

00:47:16   not this week probably next week and I [TS]

00:47:20   wouldn't be surprised if you either [TS]

00:47:21   don't see the hardware or see the [TS]

00:47:22   hardware before the software because I [TS]

00:47:24   don't know what the know what the best [TS]

00:47:27   sequence is for this you know they could [TS]

00:47:30   like you said they could announce the [TS]

00:47:31   hardware hey new MacBook Air say they [TS]

00:47:32   announced that on Monday and then on [TS]

00:47:34   Wednesday they they announced line and [TS]

00:47:36   they could announce the MacBook Airs [TS]

00:47:37   will be shipping with lion but you won't [TS]

00:47:39   get them in for two weeks or whatever [TS]

00:47:41   you know well yeah maybe that maybe that [TS]

00:47:42   just goes back to playing their hand as [TS]

00:47:44   far as announced pre announcing when [TS]

00:47:46   lion ships without intending to in other [TS]

00:47:48   words if they say oh yeah it's available [TS]

00:47:50   in two weeks well then everybody says oh [TS]

00:47:52   well that means lines not ready and [TS]

00:47:53   lines not coming out for two weeks but [TS]

00:47:55   now we know it comes out in two weeks so [TS]

00:47:56   that gives you know that plays their [TS]

00:47:58   hand and all that they do they're going [TS]

00:48:01   to keep their July promise I'm assuming [TS]

00:48:02   so I don't know so we'll see you next [TS]

00:48:04   week oh they'll keep their July promise [TS]

00:48:06   I think I think we might you know what [TS]

00:48:08   there's still a couple days left in a [TS]

00:48:09   week they've they've been known to [TS]

00:48:10   release things on Thursdays before I [TS]

00:48:13   would be shocked if it happen I'd hope I [TS]

00:48:16   just want to see what you look like [TS]

00:48:17   shocked so Josh the yokomen chatroom [TS]

00:48:20   mentioned that lion has a different [TS]

00:48:22   solution for enterprise and education [TS]

00:48:23   customers for distributing the software [TS]

00:48:26   what he says is that those customers are [TS]

00:48:28   allowed to download a line install our [TS]

00:48:30   app from the App Store and then just [TS]

00:48:33   download it once and then you can use [TS]

00:48:34   that installer app to install on all the [TS]

00:48:36   machines on the site so basically we're [TS]

00:48:40   in a situation where you if you have [TS]

00:48:43   today if you have a Mac and the Mac has [TS]

00:48:46   no operating system on it let's say the [TS]

00:48:49   hard drive completely failed and the [TS]

00:48:53   hard drive is gone and you buy a brand [TS]

00:48:57   new hard drive for [TS]

00:48:58   and you would like to install lion [TS]

00:49:00   directly you cannot well you could [TS]

00:49:03   because if you bought a Mac it you [TS]

00:49:06   didn't buy a Mac you have this Mac from [TS]

00:49:08   before did you get it from no you you [TS]

00:49:10   bought it from a fiery buddy from your [TS]

00:49:11   mom come with it should have come she [TS]

00:49:13   lost that she lost the DVD she lost it [TS]

00:49:16   find that you're gonna the same thing [TS]

00:49:17   would happen if you bought a Mac pre [TS]

00:49:18   lion and you lost the DVD and you lost [TS]

00:49:20   the harddrive you have to boot it from [TS]

00:49:21   something to get the OS installed you [TS]

00:49:23   put in the brand-new line DVD boot up [TS]

00:49:25   format but if you had a lion DVD that's [TS]

00:49:28   what my point is how do you get how do [TS]

00:49:29   you get line on there you can't you get [TS]

00:49:31   a bison you got to go and find a copy or [TS]

00:49:33   buy a copy of Snow Leopard [TS]

00:49:35   if you boy yeah I'm assuming the machine [TS]

00:49:37   will come with something you can boot it [TS]

00:49:39   from uh Snow Leopard machine what if [TS]

00:49:41   it's an existing machine no it was an [TS]

00:49:43   existing machine it came with originally [TS]

00:49:44   a Snow Leopard but I lost the disc I [TS]

00:49:46   know but you're in no different [TS]

00:49:48   situation if you lost that disc weather [TS]

00:49:49   line exists or not you know I'm saying [TS]

00:49:51   no I am because if it shipped on if [TS]

00:49:54   whatever the latest operating system was [TS]

00:49:55   shipped on DVD I could drive any Apple [TS]

00:49:58   Store or call up Amazon or whatever I [TS]

00:49:59   needed to do and get the DVD put it into [TS]

00:50:02   the Machine and install it you [TS]

00:50:03   understand what I'm saying what if it [TS]

00:50:04   what if yeah and there's I you you I [TS]

00:50:07   know that this is just something you [TS]

00:50:09   can't fathom but there are a lot of [TS]

00:50:11   people who are like still wanting to do [TS]

00:50:14   it this way or might have to do it this [TS]

00:50:15   way and I'm saying there there has to be [TS]

00:50:18   a way listen I'm the first person in [TS]

00:50:21   line to say let's get rid of DVDs I I [TS]

00:50:23   hate all of that kind of media I I love [TS]

00:50:27   all of this electronic distribution and [TS]

00:50:29   for me it's perfect I'm the kind of [TS]

00:50:31   person who died I never need to see that [TS]

00:50:34   kind of stuff again get every everything [TS]

00:50:35   should be streamed everything should be [TS]

00:50:37   downloadable every everybody should have [TS]

00:50:39   files power to the people but the [TS]

00:50:43   reality is there's a lot of people who [TS]

00:50:45   just don't don't have this in the world [TS]

00:50:48   I'm talking about the world like you [TS]

00:50:50   know the continent of Europe I think [TS]

00:50:51   they're almost there getting Internet [TS]

00:50:53   soon but I talking about in the [TS]

00:50:55   individuals or institutions individuals [TS]

00:50:58   the individual as an institution discuss [TS]

00:51:00   but anyway you know what I'm saying I'm [TS]

00:51:03   saying that that an individual person [TS]

00:51:04   who isn't as in this situation it's not [TS]

00:51:07   typical but there's still people like [TS]

00:51:09   that what are the what does that person [TS]

00:51:10   do they got to go find a copy of [TS]

00:51:12   snow leopard install that get on to the [TS]

00:51:14   App Store make the account by Snow [TS]

00:51:17   Leopard [TS]

00:51:17   I mean lion wait while that thing [TS]

00:51:19   downloads install it from Snow Leopard [TS]

00:51:21   that's that's a headache that's a honey [TS]

00:51:25   that room some of the chat room says [TS]

00:51:26   they are on a two hundred megabyte per [TS]

00:51:28   day satellite internet care you there [TS]

00:51:31   you that's a typical listener I guess [TS]

00:51:33   where do you think that person looks UK [TS]

00:51:35   because they don't have internet over [TS]

00:51:36   there Ohio there you go so I don't think [TS]

00:51:41   Apple cares about the people with no net [TS]

00:51:43   connections that I do I do think there [TS]

00:51:46   has to be some sort of physical out for [TS]

00:51:51   these people even if the physical out is [TS]

00:51:52   to go to an Apple store and set and tell [TS]

00:51:55   them your plight say you know I've got a [TS]

00:51:57   computer at home I lost the CD I really [TS]

00:52:00   want to put lion on it you guys don't [TS]

00:52:02   sell Snow Leopard anymore I guess you [TS]

00:52:04   could probably bison all over from [TS]

00:52:05   Amazon to something but there's no more [TS]

00:52:06   Snow Leopard DVDs available anyway if I [TS]

00:52:09   get a new hard drive how do I reinstall [TS]

00:52:10   the operating system on this thing now [TS]

00:52:12   like you suggested earlier it could be [TS]

00:52:15   that new computers will come with the [TS]

00:52:17   DVD line DVD and Apple will have a bunch [TS]

00:52:19   of in the back of the room for you [TS]

00:52:20   assume this person also has no friends [TS]

00:52:22   by the way because you could someone [TS]

00:52:24   could burn you a lion DVD for using the [TS]

00:52:25   Installer pretty easily or imagine they [TS]

00:52:27   live you know they live in Ohio or [TS]

00:52:29   somewhere where they're no other they [TS]

00:52:31   have yeah they have no other geek friend [TS]

00:52:32   right no access anything but they can [TS]

00:52:34   drive to an Apple store would the Apple [TS]

00:52:35   store burn you a DVD or have some in the [TS]

00:52:38   background for you or would they have [TS]

00:52:39   like thumb drives that you can buy for a [TS]

00:52:41   nominal fee or something like that I [TS]

00:52:43   don't know it seems like it's not as big [TS]

00:52:45   a problem [TS]

00:52:46   I think practically speaking it's going [TS]

00:52:48   to be very difficult to ever be in a [TS]

00:52:49   situation where you absolutely can't get [TS]

00:52:51   a physical version like who has no [TS]

00:52:52   friends who have max you know who also [TS]

00:52:55   has on that I don't know it seems like [TS]

00:52:57   you could get something very much an end [TS]

00:52:58   case but I just I think it's I think [TS]

00:53:01   it's a pretty big deal I think it's a [TS]

00:53:03   pretty big deal it's as big of a deal as [TS]

00:53:05   maybe as not having a floppy drive in [TS]

00:53:07   the IMAX when that happened so are you [TS]

00:53:09   going to predict the new machines that [TS]

00:53:11   come with line are they going to ship [TS]

00:53:12   with an optical disc that you can boot [TS]

00:53:14   from you know I could almost imagine [TS]

00:53:16   instead just why not have the little USB [TS]

00:53:19   thumb drive that they do just for the [TS]

00:53:21   airs why not want to do that for all new [TS]

00:53:23   Macs [TS]

00:53:24   well the opto this is way cheaper than [TS]

00:53:26   that USB thumb yeah but and cents well I [TS]

00:53:29   know that but I think I just think [TS]

00:53:30   that's such a neat way to do it it isn't [TS]

00:53:33   he so so you do you think they'll have [TS]

00:53:36   something physical whether it's a thumb [TS]

00:53:37   drive or an optical drive but they have [TS]

00:53:39   two new machines in ship with line have [TS]

00:53:41   to come with a physical things you think [TS]

00:53:42   I think so I think they have to I be I [TS]

00:53:45   wouldn't be shocked if they didn't but I [TS]

00:53:48   I suspect something I suspect I'll have [TS]

00:53:51   to I think they will and I think it will [TS]

00:53:54   be an optical disk yeah for that would [TS]

00:53:56   not that would not surprise me but then [TS]

00:53:57   does that mean you wouldn't be able to [TS]

00:53:59   buy one of those in the store eventually [TS]

00:54:01   I don't I don't think they're gonna ever [TS]

00:54:03   sell them you may be able to obtain them [TS]

00:54:06   from your friendly Apple store if you [TS]

00:54:09   just go and tell them and no either burn [TS]

00:54:10   you one or have a bunch in the backroom [TS]

00:54:12   or once you can prove that you actually [TS]

00:54:14   purchase line by showing them on the Mac [TS]

00:54:15   App Store see look I purchased it I just [TS]

00:54:17   can't download this Apple stores are [TS]

00:54:19   always accommodating with stuff like [TS]

00:54:20   that and what and why wouldn't they what [TS]

00:54:21   other than you know as long as you make [TS]

00:54:23   a Genius Bar appointment and you've made [TS]

00:54:25   your appointment you filled your time [TS]

00:54:26   slot you come in there and say you know [TS]

00:54:27   what I need I need Lion I bought it on [TS]

00:54:29   the Mac App Store let me log you in the [TS]

00:54:31   Mac App Store on one of these Macs and [TS]

00:54:32   show you see I bought it but I totally [TS]

00:54:33   can't get it because I'm in Ohio and I [TS]

00:54:35   have satellite internet can you help me [TS]

00:54:36   out what's like what's the kid's name in [TS]

00:54:38   Ohio what's the kid's name that was a TJ [TS]

00:54:41   Loma am i mangling that name that says [TS]

00:54:43   he knows comm TJ yeah so here we are [TS]

00:54:48   burned through a bunch of follow up and [TS]

00:54:50   we still didn't get the mark down I'm [TS]

00:54:52   still not even done with my follow up [TS]

00:54:53   well let's just do we'll do a whole [TS]

00:54:54   episode of follow up yeah [TS]

00:54:57   oh it what is this next thing I see [TS]

00:54:59   quick pic oh I wanted that forever that [TS]

00:55:02   has been in my notes for months and [TS]

00:55:04   months and that's that's a rant topic oh [TS]

00:55:06   we could save that for another time I [TS]

00:55:08   guess once more around with DHCP yeah [TS]

00:55:12   you put that in there I looked at the [TS]

00:55:13   article I thought you would like that [TS]

00:55:15   you don't like that it was technically [TS]

00:55:16   interesting to explain why max can join [TS]

00:55:18   networks quickly when you have you ever [TS]

00:55:20   I mean if you're a Mac user and most I [TS]

00:55:22   would think most of our audience [TS]

00:55:23   probably is you may not you may not know [TS]

00:55:27   this but because you're a lot of people [TS]

00:55:30   who use Mac's only use Mac's but if you [TS]

00:55:33   open up your your Mac laptop by the time [TS]

00:55:37   that you can get [TS]

00:55:38   a web browser assuming you're on a [TS]

00:55:40   network that you've been on once before [TS]

00:55:43   you know Wi-Fi network by the time you [TS]

00:55:46   can like get to start typing something [TS]

00:55:48   into the web browser you're online [TS]

00:55:50   you're you're browsing web you're there [TS]

00:55:52   you've got your DHCP address assigned [TS]

00:55:54   you're on the network you're ready to go [TS]

00:55:56   you may not know this but it's not that [TS]

00:56:00   way for non Mac machines especially not [TS]

00:56:04   Windows machines Linux not really either [TS]

00:56:07   that takes a little bit longer now we're [TS]

00:56:09   not talking about minutes where you're [TS]

00:56:11   sitting there waiting and waiting and [TS]

00:56:12   waiting waiting to get a signal no but [TS]

00:56:14   it's a perceptible amount of time that [TS]

00:56:16   might it might be several seconds longer [TS]

00:56:19   if not maybe even longer for an older [TS]

00:56:21   machine whereas all the Macs are just [TS]

00:56:23   boom they're right there on the network [TS]

00:56:24   so this guy wrote this this article very [TS]

00:56:28   technical article what's this guy's name [TS]

00:56:30   David Simmons he's a software engineer [TS]

00:56:33   and he does like the low-level system [TS]

00:56:35   stuff and it occurred to him one day [TS]

00:56:37   that his Mac's were way faster getting [TS]

00:56:39   on the network so he's analyzed this [TS]

00:56:41   whole thing he used a samsung galaxy tab [TS]

00:56:45   running 10.1 a MacBook Pro running 10 6 [TS]

00:56:50   8 and I was would those the only two [TS]

00:56:53   machines he tests are do you test [TS]

00:56:54   something else but he basically watched [TS]

00:56:57   how they get the their links established [TS]

00:57:00   and what happens behind the scenes in [TS]

00:57:01   DHCP and should he integrate this into [TS]

00:57:04   the Linux kernel and what did you make [TS]

00:57:05   of this thing that was pretty neat it [TS]

00:57:08   what it shows me because he shows the [TS]

00:57:10   packets and in the timings yeah [TS]

00:57:12   what it shows me is that this is not a [TS]

00:57:13   technology thing where like Apple has [TS]

00:57:16   some super advanced technology they [TS]

00:57:17   don't have right it's it's an attention [TS]

00:57:19   to decent detail thing because the only [TS]

00:57:21   difference is the policy that's used the [TS]

00:57:23   Apple someone an Apple said it's [TS]

00:57:25   annoying when I open up my laptop lid [TS]

00:57:27   and I can't use the network for like 10 [TS]

00:57:28   seconds right you know or five seconds [TS]

00:57:30   or whatever so someone high enough up [TS]

00:57:32   said that's annoying can we fix that and [TS]

00:57:34   when you say someone that's a euphemism [TS]

00:57:36   for Steve Jobs or anybody else who has [TS]

00:57:38   been influenced by his you know value [TS]

00:57:41   system so the PC laptop that he's got [TS]

00:57:44   what it shows is basically it does a [TS]

00:57:45   bunch of stuff and then it waits and it [TS]

00:57:48   decides after 10 seconds which is [TS]

00:57:49   probably configurable time out somewhere [TS]

00:57:51   it's like well [TS]

00:57:52   I guess there's no that you know this is [TS]

00:57:54   a different network let me see if this [TS]

00:57:55   is DHCP server that's just a policy it's [TS]

00:57:57   like try your old networking if you [TS]

00:57:58   can't get to it see if there's a DHCP [TS]

00:58:00   server and there's a 10 second wait [TS]

00:58:02   between it so the boom there's your 10 [TS]

00:58:03   seconds so the guy who got this request [TS]

00:58:06   at Apple said I don't like waiting that [TS]

00:58:07   amount of time I said well we don't have [TS]

00:58:09   to do it that way why don't we just [TS]

00:58:11   remember the last few networks we've [TS]

00:58:13   connected with and see if any of them [TS]

00:58:14   are still viable and get right back to [TS]

00:58:16   using them and we can do that in more [TS]

00:58:18   quickly than if we use this other policy [TS]

00:58:20   it's just a change in what do you do [TS]

00:58:23   when you wake up and how long do you [TS]

00:58:25   wait to see if the thing you thought was [TS]

00:58:26   there is there or not or whatever so [TS]

00:58:29   that's just that there's no reason [TS]

00:58:30   Windows or any other vendor can't do [TS]

00:58:32   this probably Windows the reason Windows [TS]

00:58:33   can't do everything is because they say [TS]

00:58:34   well there's some enterprise vendor [TS]

00:58:35   somewhere that says if we change this [TS]

00:58:37   mechanism it will invalidate their [TS]

00:58:39   network security and the government says [TS]

00:58:41   we have to do follow this algorithm [TS]

00:58:43   exactly in the 10 second wait is [TS]

00:58:44   mandatory and blob you know there's [TS]

00:58:46   always some reason why Windows can't do [TS]

00:58:47   anything when during Windows is totally [TS]

00:58:49   bogged down with enterprise [TS]

00:58:51   entanglements I think it did an article [TS]

00:58:53   on that way back when but it's still as [TS]

00:58:55   true today as it was then enterprise [TS]

00:58:57   entanglements tie at Microsoft's hands [TS]

00:58:59   or Microsoft believes they tie its hands [TS]

00:59:01   they choose to cater to that audience so [TS]

00:59:03   they can't do stuff so Apple doesn't [TS]

00:59:05   have those problems Apple's not going to [TS]

00:59:06   sell some big clients gonna say wait [TS]

00:59:07   wait wait actually the old algorithm the [TS]

00:59:10   way it works is that's our network needs [TS]

00:59:12   you to wait that 10 seconds because we [TS]

00:59:13   do X Y and C it up says no it's more [TS]

00:59:15   important for the majority of our [TS]

00:59:16   customers to open the lid and get the [TS]

00:59:18   network connection as fast as possible [TS]

00:59:20   so we're going to change our network [TS]

00:59:21   stack a little bit on our Wi-Fi thing [TS]

00:59:22   and say all right when you when they [TS]

00:59:24   lift the lid actually send out these [TS]

00:59:25   four or five packets remember the last [TS]

00:59:27   few networks you've connected to see if [TS]

00:59:28   them any of them available and quickly [TS]

00:59:29   reconnect to them because it gives a [TS]

00:59:31   better user experience and we don't care [TS]

00:59:32   if it violates the expectations of the [TS]

00:59:35   network administering 10 seconds so [TS]

00:59:43   that's another example of Windows and PC [TS]

00:59:45   vendors failing not because they lack [TS]

00:59:47   the technology or expertise but because [TS]

00:59:49   they have the wrong value system they're [TS]

00:59:50   to make they make the wrong choices [TS]

00:59:51   about what's important so I guess it [TS]

00:59:55   wasn't a pet sorry a little technical [TS]

00:59:57   rated in the shona really for this show [TS]

00:59:58   a little technical [TS]

00:59:58   a little technical [TS]

01:00:00   yeah well I don't know I'm not a network [TS]

01:00:03   guy so is a little technical assistance [TS]

01:00:05   because something that I don't [TS]

01:00:06   understand thoroughly so I have a vague [TS]

01:00:08   understanding of network related topics [TS]

01:00:10   so you don't want to talk about that but [TS]

01:00:11   you'll fry and talking about chemistry [TS]

01:00:13   or whatever physics physics so do you [TS]

01:00:17   think then we basically got two days [TS]

01:00:20   this week in two days next week where [TS]

01:00:22   we're line could be announced or [TS]

01:00:24   released to know whether or not next [TS]

01:00:27   week's show will be about it we were [TS]

01:00:28   hoping it might be this week's show my [TS]

01:00:30   now now we're thinking might be next [TS]

01:00:31   week's show you got to think you know [TS]

01:00:33   Apple likes Tuesdays so I'm still [TS]

01:00:35   thinking next Tuesday or next Wednesday [TS]

01:00:38   now if this if Oh when's day I thought [TS]

01:00:40   it was only Tuesday or Thursday and even [TS]

01:00:42   no Wednesday was on potential what is [TS]

01:00:45   Wednesday Wednesday is I don't know [TS]

01:00:46   you're right it's probably Tuesday or [TS]

01:00:48   Monday - who knows who knows I heard I [TS]

01:00:52   heard the 19th a long time ago I was [TS]

01:00:54   saying the 19th and then these these [TS]

01:00:56   12th and 14th rumours started in the [TS]

01:00:58   fine yeah I'll tell I'll tell you what [TS]

01:01:02   this is hope the listeners will know if [TS]

01:01:05   line comes out into white smoke well [TS]

01:01:09   know they'll know if line comes out [TS]

01:01:10   they'll know that this show is going to [TS]

01:01:12   be in a lion extravaganza spread apart [TS]

01:01:15   six six six to ten different episodes [TS]

01:01:18   well it will begin long series will [TS]

01:01:20   begin will say I don't know how long [TS]

01:01:22   it's gonna take us to go through it it [TS]

01:01:23   depends on if you have a specific [TS]

01:01:25   question might take might take a good [TS]

01:01:26   six months well one thing I can say is [TS]

01:01:29   I'm going to assume that when we do that [TS]

01:01:30   show that the people listening have [TS]

01:01:32   either read or skim to the article [TS]

01:01:34   because I'm not going to reiterate [TS]

01:01:37   everything in the art or perhaps they [TS]

01:01:38   will have listened the article perhaps [TS]

01:01:40   they will have listened to my dramatic [TS]

01:01:42   reading of the article if I can acquire [TS]

01:01:44   the rights to do that I'm not sure I [TS]

01:01:45   mean you're right your response to that [TS]

01:01:47   I have not eyed so for the people who [TS]

01:01:49   don't shame on you if you don't follow [TS]

01:01:51   me on Twitter I'm Dan benjamin on [TS]

01:01:52   twitter and you can follow john at [TS]

01:01:54   siracusa no z-s IRAC us a note there's [TS]

01:01:59   no longer is Ian that and you can you [TS]

01:02:03   could follow the discussion there and [TS]

01:02:04   basically what I did is I asked people I [TS]

01:02:06   said what would you enjoy a dramatic [TS]

01:02:09   reading of either perhaps some or maybe [TS]

01:02:13   all there's only 85 pages you know [TS]

01:02:17   essentially an audiobook format now it [TS]

01:02:20   would really ideal would be for Merlin [TS]

01:02:22   to read it in his a car van honks voice [TS]

01:02:28   can you do an impression of Merlin [TS]

01:02:30   knowing that impression no but I can and [TS]

01:02:32   will do and it in a Squidward voice [TS]

01:02:34   which is the same as doing it in a John [TS]

01:02:36   siracusa voice let's hear that [TS]

01:02:38   impression I will have an art school I [TS]

01:02:41   don't you you need to just go watch the [TS]

01:02:43   show I know I would like to hear your [TS]

01:02:45   impression [TS]

01:02:46   you'll hear it when I do the dramatic [TS]

01:02:47   reading all right all right so anyway I [TS]

01:02:49   have applied through the powers it be [TS]

01:02:51   over at ARS technica can I say Who I did [TS]

01:02:56   I asked I shouldn't I asked the powers [TS]

01:02:58   that be that's enough and I'm waiting [TS]

01:03:00   for a response it would be great I [TS]

01:03:01   didn't you know I don't know what the [TS]

01:03:03   legality of it is I know that if you [TS]

01:03:05   ever listen to regular traditional or [TS]

01:03:06   satellite radio they read they read [TS]

01:03:08   things all the time they rarely read [TS]

01:03:10   something in its entirety but they [TS]

01:03:11   frequently read it and then they'll take [TS]

01:03:13   excerpts from it and things like this [TS]

01:03:15   now this is a different situation [TS]

01:03:16   because we're talking about you know 85 [TS]

01:03:19   pages and that's not a lot for me to [TS]

01:03:22   read I could read 85 pages and you know [TS]

01:03:25   in an hour and a half easy I mean I [TS]

01:03:27   could do it like the micromachines guy [TS]

01:03:29   remember those commercials the FedEx guy [TS]

01:03:31   Micro Machines guy the fast reader [TS]

01:03:33   I don't think of this reading let me [TS]

01:03:34   just go on record and say that I think a [TS]

01:03:36   dramatic reading is a dumb idea and no [TS]

01:03:37   one should ever listen to it because you [TS]

01:03:39   have to let yet see the screenshots and [TS]

01:03:41   you know it just maybe I'll make it a [TS]

01:03:42   screencast and I'll show the screenshots [TS]

01:03:44   while I'm reading it it just seems like [TS]

01:03:46   a weird thing I'm trying to raise money [TS]

01:03:48   to do it and they give you the rights [TS]

01:03:50   I'm trying to raise money for you I'm [TS]

01:03:51   gonna let people donate they can donate [TS]

01:03:53   nothing or they can I'll donate a [TS]

01:03:55   hundred percent of the profits to you [TS]

01:03:56   well why don't you wait to see you get [TS]

01:03:58   the rights because I think to read the [TS]

01:03:59   entire thing you definitely do need the [TS]

01:04:01   rights from the people what about this I [TS]

01:04:03   know that I could read some excerpts of [TS]

01:04:05   it certainly yeah anyway long long story [TS]

01:04:08   short long story short I would I would [TS]

01:04:11   very much like to read perhaps part of [TS]

01:04:12   it perhaps just like an intro like a [TS]

01:04:13   very cool intro I just read the intro do [TS]

01:04:16   you have a cool intro paragraph or [TS]

01:04:17   something where you like set the stage [TS]

01:04:19   for the whole article I could just read [TS]

01:04:21   no bar no part of what I wrote in this [TS]

01:04:23   article is cool hate the bruster bubble [TS]

01:04:27   I think your stuff is kind of cool yeah [TS]

01:04:29   maybe that might that my son asked me [TS]

01:04:31   yesterday if I was cool oh he had to ask [TS]

01:04:34   I thought it was a trick question [TS]

01:04:36   like did you tell him were you honest I [TS]

01:04:39   did would you say something like in what [TS]

01:04:42   context I did I more or less I did say [TS]

01:04:46   you know probably not but some nerdy [TS]

01:04:49   people think some of the things I talk [TS]

01:04:50   about is cool so it really depends on [TS]

01:04:52   who you're talking to because yeah I [TS]

01:04:53   mean you're the same deal you're [TS]

01:04:55   definitely not cool but there are people [TS]

01:04:57   who think you're cool because you're [TS]

01:04:58   cool to them you know what I mean yes [TS]

01:05:00   the wider scheme of things definitely [TS]

01:05:02   not cool that's okay that's that's why [TS]

01:05:05   we're nerds here you know nobody judges [TS]

01:05:07   here that's right but I would say yes [TS]

01:05:10   from in the in the real definition of [TS]

01:05:13   cool there was nothing cool in my [TS]

01:05:14   article but if you're going to Mac os10 [TS]

01:05:16   maybe you'll find some parts of the cool [TS]

01:05:17   I don't know so I wouldn't I wouldn't [TS]

01:05:19   worry about next week's show even if [TS]

01:05:20   fine is now because I got so much stuff [TS]

01:05:22   I don't know why my list of topics [TS]

01:05:24   exploded I didn't get to here's all the [TS]

01:05:26   things I didn't get to we didn't get to [TS]

01:05:27   mark down again sorry people we didn't [TS]

01:05:29   get to the quick quick thing which has [TS]

01:05:30   been on my list forever ah [TS]

01:05:32   I wanted to I fun so I was riding the [TS]

01:05:35   line review and I'm Way behind on five [TS]

01:05:37   by five shows which is annoying because [TS]

01:05:39   now I'm living in the past basically I'm [TS]

01:05:40   listening to shows for two and three [TS]

01:05:41   weeks ago I just heard the show with you [TS]

01:05:45   and Merlin flailing helplessly in in the [TS]

01:05:48   sea of Mack misremembered Mack facts and [TS]

01:05:51   oh it feels like a million years or and [TS]

01:05:54   Star Wars things yeah that's how far [TS]

01:05:55   behind we did that show just for you [TS]

01:05:57   yeah well it was it was painful so I [TS]

01:05:59   wanted I would want to talk about that I [TS]

01:06:01   have lots of things to talk about in [TS]

01:06:03   subsequent shows so don't worry if Mac [TS]

01:06:06   os10 is not out next week we will [TS]

01:06:08   definitely still have things and I'm [TS]

01:06:10   sorry we didn't get to all of them this [TS]

01:06:11   week [TS]

01:06:12   [Music] [TS]

01:06:14   but I think that's it for us well we [TS]

01:06:16   will be back next week and if you hear [TS]

01:06:18   about Lyon or any new Apple stuff coming [TS]

01:06:21   out before Wednesday you'll know we'll [TS]

01:06:24   be talking about it otherwise and [TS]

01:06:25   markdown that's right maybe maybe we'll [TS]

01:06:29   have a good week John you too [TS]

01:06:32   well that about does it for this week's [TS]

01:06:34   episode of hypercritical were really [TS]

01:06:35   glad that you decided to join us this [TS]

01:06:38   week you can follow John on Twitter at [TS]

01:06:40   siracusa nosie I'm Dan Benjamin on [TS]

01:06:43   Twitter also nosy please check out 5x5 [TS]

01:06:46   TV and you can hear previous episodes of [TS]

01:06:49   this show as well as the entire catalog [TS]

01:06:51   of five-by-five shows which we would [TS]

01:06:53   love for you to check out if you want [TS]

01:06:55   you can rate the show on iTunes it helps [TS]

01:06:56   new listeners find the show it does a [TS]

01:06:58   whole lot of other great things so [TS]

01:07:00   please consider doing that if you [TS]

01:07:02   donated thank you so much for doing that [TS]

01:07:04   every little bit helps and and that's [TS]

01:07:06   about it we want to make sure to say [TS]

01:07:08   thanks to our amazing sponsors fresh [TS]

01:07:10   books calm and Shopify calm be sure to [TS]

01:07:14   go and check those guys out and help the [TS]

01:07:15   show that way too we will be back next [TS]

01:07:17   week maybe to talk about line maybe not [TS]

01:07:20   you never know but we'll be here see you [TS]

01:07:22   next week [TS]

01:07:30   you [TS]