00:00:04 ◼ ► talkshow ruminating on exactly what is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4">TS</a>]
00:00:06 ◼ ► wrong the world of Apple and related [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/6">TS</a>]
00:00:08 ◼ ► technologies and businesses nothing is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/8">TS</a>]
00:00:10 ◼ ► so perfect that my co-host John siracusa [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/10">TS</a>]
00:00:14 ◼ ► could not find something wrong with it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/14">TS</a>]
00:00:16 ◼ ► there's nothing he can't complain hi [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/16">TS</a>]
00:00:19 ◼ ► again I'm Dan benjamin and we'd like to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/19">TS</a>]
00:00:22 ◼ ► say thanks to Rackspace calm and Shopify [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/22">TS</a>]
00:00:25 ◼ ► comm for making the show possible tell [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/25">TS</a>]
00:00:29 ◼ ► continues but you know it's becoming [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/29">TS</a>]
00:00:31 ◼ ► it's becoming a little bit of a of a a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/31">TS</a>]
00:00:34 ◼ ► stake of yours almost that the follow up [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/34">TS</a>]
00:00:37 ◼ ► is most of the show know that the other [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/37">TS</a>]
00:00:40 ◼ ► the other hosts of the other shows are [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/40">TS</a>]
00:00:42 ◼ ► now they have something that they will [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/42">TS</a>]
00:00:44 ◼ ► refer to as John siracusa mode anytime [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/44">TS</a>]
00:00:49 ◼ ► they do follow if I can make them feel [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/49">TS</a>]
00:00:53 ◼ ► address issues raised by listeners about [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/53">TS</a>]
00:00:55 ◼ ► their previous show I feel I will have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/55">TS</a>]
00:00:57 ◼ ► succeeded I found out today you're 6 [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/57">TS</a>]
00:01:04 ◼ ► hunched old man with or without the hair [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/64">TS</a>]
00:01:06 ◼ ► that's without ok do you wet it down [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/66">TS</a>]
00:01:13 ◼ ► when you take measurements to keep it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/73">TS</a>]
00:01:14 ◼ ► flat or one it squishes down you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/74">TS</a>]
00:01:17 ◼ ► how tall you do you have some sort of a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/77">TS</a>]
00:01:19 ◼ ► Napoleon complex no I don't think so I'm [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/79">TS</a>]
00:01:21 ◼ ► you know I'm average height in Korea [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/81">TS</a>]
00:01:24 ◼ ► five seven five seven you know five [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/84">TS</a>]
00:01:28 ◼ ► eight with a nice pair of shoes on five [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/88">TS</a>]
00:01:32 ◼ ► five ten in a podium I'll file that away [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/92">TS</a>]
00:01:35 ◼ ► mm-hmm lock lock it up all right so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/95">TS</a>]
00:01:43 ◼ ► what is the fu the follow-up follow-up [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/103">TS</a>]
00:01:46 ◼ ► yeah I don't I don't think I want to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/106">TS</a>]
00:01:48 ◼ ► stick with that but it is a convenient [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/108">TS</a>]
00:01:51 ◼ ► abbreviation I like it yeah let's do [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/111">TS</a>]
00:01:55 ◼ ► that for you all right so uh last week [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/115">TS</a>]
00:02:00 ◼ ► we talked about Apple's UI consistency [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/120">TS</a>]
00:02:03 ◼ ► over the years and that that topic had [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/123">TS</a>]
00:02:06 ◼ ► been our list for a long time and we [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/126">TS</a>]
00:02:08 ◼ ► finally got to it because we're running [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/128">TS</a>]
00:02:09 ◼ ► out of stuff but I know you wanted it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/129">TS</a>]
00:02:11 ◼ ► for a long time so I only got to it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/131">TS</a>]
00:02:13 ◼ ► and then after we finished recording [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/133">TS</a>]
00:02:15 ◼ ► show I was catching up on the Twitter's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/135">TS</a>]
00:02:18 ◼ ► and I saw a tweet from mr. Merlin man [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/138">TS</a>]
00:02:20 ◼ ► who was actually reply to me which is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/140">TS</a>]
00:02:23 ◼ ► strange because he normally doesn't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/143">TS</a>]
00:02:24 ◼ ► communicate with me on Twitter but this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/144">TS</a>]
00:02:26 ◼ ► time he did reply and I said hey I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/146">TS</a>]
00:02:27 ◼ ► listened to your UI consistency thing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/147">TS</a>]
00:02:29 ◼ ► and I think you would like this talk by [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/149">TS</a>]
00:02:31 ◼ ► this other guy so I followed it and it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/151">TS</a>]
00:02:33 ◼ ► was a link to John Gruber's uh web stock [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/153">TS</a>]
00:02:36 ◼ ► mm-hmm talk from this year and I like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/156">TS</a>]
00:02:38 ◼ ► wow I thought that one was in recorded [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/158">TS</a>]
00:02:41 ◼ ► complaining that they didn't record his [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/161">TS</a>]
00:02:43 ◼ ► session and he was angry about it and it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/163">TS</a>]
00:02:44 ◼ ► turns out that was South by Southwest [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/164">TS</a>]
00:02:45 ◼ ► that he was angry about not recording [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/165">TS</a>]
00:02:48 ◼ ► and in fact it turns out that actually [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/168">TS</a>]
00:02:50 ◼ ► unbeknownst to him they only did auto [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/170">TS</a>]
00:02:52 ◼ ► audio recording right but anyway so I'm [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/172">TS</a>]
00:02:55 ◼ ► like great I'm gonna take a look at this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/175">TS</a>]
00:02:58 ◼ ► started watching the talk and he begins [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/178">TS</a>]
00:03:00 ◼ ► and I'm like yeah he's kind of starting [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/180">TS</a>]
00:03:03 ◼ ► the same place that I would be talking [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/183">TS</a>]
00:03:04 ◼ ► about like the Mac is the first GUI and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/184">TS</a>]
00:03:06 ◼ ► what it meant to be a GUI and you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/186">TS</a>]
00:03:08 ◼ ► that the days before the GUI existed and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/188">TS</a>]
00:03:14 ◼ ► examples of the early GUI he brings up [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/194">TS</a>]
00:03:16 ◼ ► that original Mac control panel so I'm [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/196">TS</a>]
00:03:18 ◼ ► watching this thing with like a growing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/198">TS</a>]
00:03:19 ◼ ► sense of horror that every single thing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/199">TS</a>]
00:03:22 ◼ ► he's saying in this talk is something [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/202">TS</a>]
00:03:23 ◼ ► that I just recorded in a podcast of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/203">TS</a>]
00:03:25 ◼ ► course the problem is that that web [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/205">TS</a>]
00:03:26 ◼ ► stock talk was like months ago is that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/206">TS</a>]
00:03:30 ◼ ► I said no I'm like yeah I think it was a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/210">TS</a>]
00:03:32 ◼ ► nothing oh my god everybody who listens [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/212">TS</a>]
00:03:34 ◼ ► to that episode is going to assume that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/214">TS</a>]
00:03:36 ◼ ► I either went to wyoweb stock or watched [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/216">TS</a>]
00:03:38 ◼ ► the web stock talk and then just rehash [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/218">TS</a>]
00:03:40 ◼ ► from an odd I don't think so at all and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/220">TS</a>]
00:03:42 ◼ ► but I swear to you I had not seen that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/222">TS</a>]
00:03:44 ◼ ► talk until after I recorded the episode [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/224">TS</a>]
00:03:48 ◼ ► almost immediately after which is it was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/228">TS</a>]
00:03:49 ◼ ► just a horrible horrible experience no I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/229">TS</a>]
00:03:51 ◼ ► thought well let me let me chime in here [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/231">TS</a>]
00:03:53 ◼ ► for a second I don't think you need to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/233">TS</a>]
00:03:55 ◼ ► worry about this at all because I think [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/235">TS</a>]
00:03:57 ◼ ► first of all I didn't watch it either i [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/237">TS</a>]
00:03:59 ◼ ► ID my only I only if I'm if John Gruber [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/239">TS</a>]
00:04:03 ◼ ► is not talking to me on the talk show I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/243">TS</a>]
00:04:05 ◼ ► don't I don't want to hear his voice [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/245">TS</a>]
00:04:06 ◼ ► so I read his stuff but I if I hear him [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/246">TS</a>]
00:04:09 ◼ ► I want to talk back so I can't listen to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/249">TS</a>]
00:04:11 ◼ ► him talking in somewhere else it's too [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/251">TS</a>]
00:04:13 ◼ ► difficult so I hadn't seen it either [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/253">TS</a>]
00:04:16 ◼ ► otherwise I would have stopped you I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/256">TS</a>]
00:04:17 ◼ ► wouldn't let you go I wouldn't let you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/257">TS</a>]
00:04:18 ◼ ► you know I would have said oh it didn't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/258">TS</a>]
00:04:21 ◼ ► you see John Gruber's thing on I didn't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/261">TS</a>]
00:04:24 ◼ ► even know what he was talking about and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/264">TS</a>]
00:04:25 ◼ ► every time I asked him what how was your [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/265">TS</a>]
00:04:27 ◼ ► I was all right so what'd you talk about [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/267">TS</a>]
00:04:29 ◼ ► and he kind of you know changes the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/269">TS</a>]
00:04:31 ◼ ► subject yeah so I mean this is not an [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/271">TS</a>]
00:04:35 ◼ ► uncommon thing amongst the two of us [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/275">TS</a>]
00:04:38 ◼ ► where we will end up having the same [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/278">TS</a>]
00:04:41 ◼ ► take on a particular topic to the point [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/281">TS</a>]
00:04:44 ◼ ► where some people would think that we [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/284">TS</a>]
00:04:45 ◼ ► collaborated beforehand on on various [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/285">TS</a>]
00:04:47 ◼ ► things or that we're the same person or [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/287">TS</a>]
00:04:49 ◼ ► anything like that but that's not the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/289">TS</a>]
00:04:51 ◼ ► case it just so happens that we end up [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/291">TS</a>]
00:04:53 ◼ ► having the same things on this case it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/293">TS</a>]
00:04:54 ◼ ► was particularly spooky because we pick [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/294">TS</a>]
00:04:55 ◼ ► like the same examples and stuff but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/295">TS</a>]
00:04:58 ◼ ► especially since you know you Gruber's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/298">TS</a>]
00:05:00 ◼ ► history with the Mack started pretty [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/300">TS</a>]
00:05:02 ◼ ► late like I think in the past episode [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/302">TS</a>]
00:05:04 ◼ ► with you who he talked about his first [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/304">TS</a>]
00:05:05 ◼ ► night being an LC right maybe that was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/305">TS</a>]
00:05:08 ◼ ► in the talk but yeah but that's that's a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/308">TS</a>]
00:05:09 ◼ ► late comer right and I was there since [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/309">TS</a>]
00:05:10 ◼ ► 1984 but we still end up with the same [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/310">TS</a>]
00:05:12 ◼ ► take on things but the reason I bring [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/312">TS</a>]
00:05:15 ◼ ► this up now is because if you watch the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/315">TS</a>]
00:05:17 ◼ ► whole talk even though there we start [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/317">TS</a>]
00:05:21 ◼ ► off the same way and we choose a lot of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/321">TS</a>]
00:05:22 ◼ ► the same examples there is a divergence [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/322">TS</a>]
00:05:24 ◼ ► there and I think the point that I was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/324">TS</a>]
00:05:26 ◼ ► making with some of those same examples [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/326">TS</a>]
00:05:27 ◼ ► was different than the points that he [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/327">TS</a>]
00:05:28 ◼ ► was making so my main point on on the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/328">TS</a>]
00:05:32 ◼ ► topics that we overlapped on was that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/332">TS</a>]
00:05:34 ◼ ► Apple has always sort of worked beyond [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/334">TS</a>]
00:05:36 ◼ ► the bounds of its own UI guidelines but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/336">TS</a>]
00:05:41 ◼ ► Gruber's point in the talk was that the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/341">TS</a>]
00:05:45 ◼ ► change in the look of the GUI was a lot [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/345">TS</a>]
00:05:47 ◼ ► slower in the beginning and it took a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/347">TS</a>]
00:05:50 ◼ ► bowl a while to feel confident that they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/350">TS</a>]
00:05:52 ◼ ► could start changing look in ways that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/352">TS</a>]
00:05:54 ◼ ► wouldn't confuse people sort of that in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/354">TS</a>]
00:05:56 ◼ ► my example that I was using was that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/356">TS</a>]
00:05:59 ◼ ► meetings where you have the you know 20 [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/359">TS</a>]
00:06:01 ◼ ► different versions of a house icon or [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/361">TS</a>]
00:06:03 ◼ ► the the the classic Mac OS extension [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/363">TS</a>]
00:06:06 ◼ ► puzzle pieces to face in all different [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/366">TS</a>]
00:06:07 ◼ ► directions as long as people can tell [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/367">TS</a>]
00:06:08 ◼ ► what it is it's ok so we were using that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/368">TS</a>]
00:06:14 ◼ ► we both took that control panel example [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/374">TS</a>]
00:06:16 ◼ ► but he was using it as an example of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/376">TS</a>]
00:06:17 ◼ ► like look at this ey doesn't use labels [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/377">TS</a>]
00:06:19 ◼ ► look at how different it is that what's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/379">TS</a>]
00:06:20 ◼ ► come before it and I was using it as an [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/380">TS</a>]
00:06:22 ◼ ► example of how Apple wasn't beholden to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/382">TS</a>]
00:06:25 ◼ ► its own guidelines from day one and they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/385">TS</a>]
00:06:26 ◼ ► made this window completely filled with [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/386">TS</a>]
00:06:28 ◼ ► non-standard controls the only standard [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/388">TS</a>]
00:06:29 ◼ ► control on the entire thing was the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/389">TS</a>]
00:06:30 ◼ ► title bar so even though we use the same [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/390">TS</a>]
00:06:33 ◼ ► example I think we made very different [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/393">TS</a>]
00:06:34 ◼ ► points now in the end you say is a last [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/394">TS</a>]
00:06:38 ◼ ► episode in his talk of a contradictory [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/398">TS</a>]
00:06:41 ◼ ► are they you know completely at odds I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/401">TS</a>]
00:06:43 ◼ ► don't think they're completely at odds [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/403">TS</a>]
00:06:45 ◼ ► they do make a lot of the same points [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/405">TS</a>]
00:06:46 ◼ ► especially about how you can change the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/406">TS</a>]
00:06:48 ◼ ► look of something and as long as people [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/408">TS</a>]
00:06:50 ◼ ► can still tell what it is it's fine and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/410">TS</a>]
00:06:52 ◼ ► the the role of fashion in design and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/412">TS</a>]
00:06:54 ◼ ► how changing the look actually has has a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/414">TS</a>]
00:06:57 ◼ ► purpose it's not just arbitrary the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/417">TS</a>]
00:07:00 ◼ ► place where I think we would diverge is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/420">TS</a>]
00:07:02 ◼ ► that a Gruber seems to contend that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/422">TS</a>]
00:07:04 ◼ ► Apple followed the Haig to the letter in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/424">TS</a>]
00:07:06 ◼ ► the old days like he's positing a time [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/426">TS</a>]
00:07:08 ◼ ► when Apple conformed more strictly to to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/428">TS</a>]
00:07:11 ◼ ► human interface guidelines and I think [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/431">TS</a>]
00:07:14 ◼ ► his example has since he used that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/434">TS</a>]
00:07:16 ◼ ► control panel example example from [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/436">TS</a>]
00:07:17 ◼ ► earlier in his talk contradicts that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/437">TS</a>]
00:07:18 ◼ ► that you know maybe the look of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/438">TS</a>]
00:07:21 ◼ ► entire OS didn't changes as quickly but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/441">TS</a>]
00:07:24 ◼ ► certainly Apple was never a slave to the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/444">TS</a>]
00:07:26 ◼ ► Haig and I don't think there was ever a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/446">TS</a>]
00:07:28 ◼ ► time that Apple was like that where I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/448">TS</a>]
00:07:29 ◼ ► think we would agree is that when he [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/449">TS</a>]
00:07:31 ◼ ► goes into this the middle time of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/451">TS</a>]
00:07:35 ◼ ► exuberance of a variation where we had [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/455">TS</a>]
00:07:38 ◼ ► kaleidoscope and he talks about be view [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/458">TS</a>]
00:07:39 ◼ ► of the thing that made your windows look [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/459">TS</a>]
00:07:40 ◼ ► like BOS he trots out the high tech and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/460">TS</a>]
00:07:43 ◼ ► the gizmo and drawing board themes from [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/463">TS</a>]
00:07:44 ◼ ► Apple there was that period where they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/464">TS</a>]
00:07:45 ◼ ► were really like there were no rules and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/465">TS</a>]
00:07:47 ◼ ► there was lots of experimentation we [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/467">TS</a>]
00:07:49 ◼ ► finally were being removed from the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/469">TS</a>]
00:07:51 ◼ ► bounds of everything looking exactly the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/471">TS</a>]
00:07:52 ◼ ► same so I think we would agree on that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/472">TS</a>]
00:07:55 ◼ ► point but where we differ is that I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/475">TS</a>]
00:07:58 ◼ ► think it was an apple that follow things [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/478">TS</a>]
00:08:01 ◼ ► to letter in the old days it was the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/481">TS</a>]
00:08:02 ◼ ► developers did that's what I tried to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/482">TS</a>]
00:08:04 ◼ ► get into a talk of saying how like Apple [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/484">TS</a>]
00:08:06 ◼ ► put out these guidelines and the people [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/486">TS</a>]
00:08:07 ◼ ► who are enthusiastic for the platform [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/487">TS</a>]
00:08:08 ◼ ► felt compelled to treat the guidelines [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/488">TS</a>]
00:08:11 ◼ ► as Bible as a way of advancing the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/491">TS</a>]
00:08:13 ◼ ► platform and it wasn't so much Apple it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/493">TS</a>]
00:08:14 ◼ ► was the very enthusiastic supporters and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/494">TS</a>]
00:08:18 ◼ ► advocates of the platform that were you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/498">TS</a>]
00:08:21 ◼ ► know signed up to the Hague is the Bible [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/501">TS</a>]
00:08:23 ◼ ► not Apple itself they made some good [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/503">TS</a>]
00:08:27 ◼ ► consistency in uniformity my favorite [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/507">TS</a>]
00:08:30 ◼ ► one was where he mentioned that Jobs had [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/510">TS</a>]
00:08:33 ◼ ► gotten rid of the idea of everything [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/513">TS</a>]
00:08:36 ◼ ► looking exactly the same he wanted [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/516">TS</a>]
00:08:38 ◼ ► things to be consistent but then had to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/518">TS</a>]
00:08:39 ◼ ► look exactly the same but then he pulls [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/519">TS</a>]
00:08:40 ◼ ► up a slide that he said I think it's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/520">TS</a>]
00:08:42 ◼ ► funny the guy who came up with this is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/522">TS</a>]
00:08:43 ◼ ► known for having a uniform and it shows [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/523">TS</a>]
00:08:45 ◼ ► 20 different pictures of jobs and he's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/525">TS</a>]
00:08:46 ◼ ► always wearing of course the same outfit [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/526">TS</a>]
00:08:47 ◼ ► the black mock turtleneck in the jeans [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/527">TS</a>]
00:08:49 ◼ ► if people haven't seen this talk it's in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/529">TS</a>]
00:08:52 ◼ ► the show notes and actually now thanks [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/532">TS</a>]
00:08:54 ◼ ► you can see the show notes during the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/534">TS</a>]
00:08:56 ◼ ► show if you go to the or is it five by [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/536">TS</a>]
00:08:59 ◼ ► five dot TV slash hypercritical slash [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/539">TS</a>]
00:09:01 ◼ ► next net slash next I'll every time will [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/541">TS</a>]
00:09:04 ◼ ► take you to whatever the the next show [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/544">TS</a>]
00:09:06 ◼ ► is for you and if there is no next show [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/546">TS</a>]
00:09:09 ◼ ► collecting links but at any point you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/549">TS</a>]
00:09:11 ◼ ► can go there as soon as we start getting [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/551">TS</a>]
00:09:14 ◼ ► ready free you can add comments and and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/554">TS</a>]
00:09:17 ◼ ► all that stuff there yeah so I suggest [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/557">TS</a>]
00:09:18 ◼ ► uh even even if you have listened the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/558">TS</a>]
00:09:21 ◼ ► last episode I was suggested watching [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/561">TS</a>]
00:09:24 ◼ ► his talk anyway even though some of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/564">TS</a>]
00:09:26 ◼ ► same points are made there are enough [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/566">TS</a>]
00:09:27 ◼ ► new points in there that you should [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/567">TS</a>]
00:09:28 ◼ ► definitely take a look at it there's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/568">TS</a>]
00:09:29 ◼ ► some good good slides in there alright [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/569">TS</a>]
00:09:33 ◼ ► and ants on the same topic last on last [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/573">TS</a>]
00:09:36 ◼ ► week's show sort of snuck into the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/576">TS</a>]
00:09:38 ◼ ► follow-up was a topic that was not [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/578">TS</a>]
00:09:39 ◼ ► actually a fallout post kind of follow [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/579">TS</a>]
00:09:41 ◼ ► up we talked about Facebook's open [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/581">TS</a>]
00:09:43 ◼ ► source data center initiative I think [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/583">TS</a>]
00:09:45 ◼ ► that was kind of a follow up as to the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/585">TS</a>]
00:09:47 ◼ ► yeah yeah online stuff in this case I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/587">TS</a>]
00:09:50 ◼ ► knew that John Stokes Ars Technica had [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/590">TS</a>]
00:09:53 ◼ ► I think either earlier that day at the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/593">TS</a>]
00:09:55 ◼ ► previous day and I intentionally didn't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/595">TS</a>]
00:09:56 ◼ ► read it so I wouldn't be spoiled so but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/596">TS</a>]
00:09:58 ◼ ► what it turns out is a my take on that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/598">TS</a>]
00:10:00 ◼ ► situation was the same as his I don't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/600">TS</a>]
00:10:02 ◼ ► think that's a big surprise just because [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/602">TS</a>]
00:10:04 ◼ ► it's kind of obvious what Facebook is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/604">TS</a>]
00:10:07 ◼ ► particular insight that either one of us [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/607">TS</a>]
00:10:09 ◼ ► had there but he did a good write-up on [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/609">TS</a>]
00:10:10 ◼ ► that and I put that link in the show [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/610">TS</a>]
00:10:11 ◼ ► notes so you know that's another example [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/611">TS</a>]
00:10:15 ◼ ► of you said if something happens and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/615">TS</a>]
00:10:17 ◼ ► seven people have the same opinion on [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/617">TS</a>]
00:10:19 ◼ ► doesn't mean they collaborate it just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/619">TS</a>]
00:10:21 ◼ ► conclusions that can be drawn from the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/621">TS</a>]
00:10:23 ◼ ► same facts that everyone has available [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/623">TS</a>]
00:10:24 ◼ ► to them alright so now for some actual [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/624">TS</a>]
00:10:27 ◼ ► follow up a little bit of feedback on [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/627">TS</a>]
00:10:30 ◼ ► the the funny look in iCal and lion I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/630">TS</a>]
00:10:36 ◼ ► directions here but someone brought up a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/636">TS</a>]
00:10:37 ◼ ► good point about how making making [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/637">TS</a>]
00:10:41 ◼ ► windows look just completely different [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/641">TS</a>]
00:10:43 ◼ ► from all the windows regardless of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/643">TS</a>]
00:10:46 ◼ ► whether it's ugly or not there has a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/646">TS</a>]
00:10:47 ◼ ► benefit of making it easy to find on the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/647">TS</a>]
00:10:50 ◼ ► screen so I Cal is this big ugly you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/650">TS</a>]
00:10:53 ◼ ► know brown looking giant toolbar thing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/653">TS</a>]
00:10:56 ◼ ► it's really easy to pick that out on the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/656">TS</a>]
00:10:58 ◼ ► as opposed to just a giant gray toolbar [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/658">TS</a>]
00:11:01 ◼ ► which blends in with all your other or [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/661">TS</a>]
00:11:03 ◼ ► anything John great tool box now there's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/663">TS</a>]
00:11:04 ◼ ► a limit to that you know one app gets to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/664">TS</a>]
00:11:05 ◼ ► be like that fine but if every app is a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/665">TS</a>]
00:11:08 ◼ ► you now lose the ability to pick stuff [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/668">TS</a>]
00:11:10 ◼ ► out because it's just like looking at a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/670">TS</a>]
00:11:12 ◼ ► big screen full of plaid you know but I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/672">TS</a>]
00:11:16 ◼ ► think that was a good point where that's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/676">TS</a>]
00:11:18 ◼ ► kind of the advantage of the Apple hats [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/678">TS</a>]
00:11:19 ◼ ► of Apple decides to make some super [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/679">TS</a>]
00:11:20 ◼ ► important app look weird like the set [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/680">TS</a>]
00:11:23 ◼ ► for the finder for instance they decide [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/683">TS</a>]
00:11:25 ◼ ► to make the Finder windows green with [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/685">TS</a>]
00:11:26 ◼ ► grass on them and nobody else could have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/686">TS</a>]
00:11:28 ◼ ► that look because you know you can't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/688">TS</a>]
00:11:29 ◼ ► theme the OS and you don't want to put [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/689">TS</a>]
00:11:31 ◼ ► custom windows on all of your things so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/691">TS</a>]
00:11:32 ◼ ► you'd see the finder window stand out [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/692">TS</a>]
00:11:34 ◼ ► this it look green well Apple can do [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/694">TS</a>]
00:11:38 ◼ ► everybody has to run because it launches [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/698">TS</a>]
00:11:39 ◼ ► when you log in and it can kind of be [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/699">TS</a>]
00:11:41 ◼ ► the only one to do it but if it becomes [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/701">TS</a>]
00:11:43 ◼ ► a trend then it just you know it stops [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/703">TS</a>]
00:11:46 ◼ ► being an advantage so I would not hold [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/706">TS</a>]
00:11:49 ◼ ► that up as a reason to justify I can't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/709">TS</a>]
00:11:51 ◼ ► looking funny in lyon but it may be a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/711">TS</a>]
00:11:55 ◼ ► practical result of iCal looking funny [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/715">TS</a>]
00:11:57 ◼ ► is that it'll be a lot easier to find [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/717">TS</a>]
00:11:59 ◼ ► assuming every other Apple app doesn't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/719">TS</a>]
00:12:00 ◼ ► also have some crazy new look I think [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/720">TS</a>]
00:12:04 ◼ ► but I think that's what we're going to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/724">TS</a>]
00:12:05 ◼ ► anticipate is that every amp is going to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/725">TS</a>]
00:12:07 ◼ ► have a weird new look they can't do it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/727">TS</a>]
00:12:09 ◼ ► with everyone - and they don't care [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/729">TS</a>]
00:12:11 ◼ ► enough like what are they gonna make [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/731">TS</a>]
00:12:12 ◼ ► terminal look different now it's gonna [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/732">TS</a>]
00:12:15 ◼ ► I don't expect there were some pictures [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/735">TS</a>]
00:12:17 ◼ ► of address book looking different - but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/737">TS</a>]
00:12:19 ◼ ► those are kind of a piece you know it's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/739">TS</a>]
00:12:21 ◼ ► like if there's an if there's an iPad [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/741">TS</a>]
00:12:23 ◼ ► equivalent of the app maybe they'll try [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/743">TS</a>]
00:12:25 ◼ ► to sync up the look among them on the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/745">TS</a>]
00:12:26 ◼ ► iCal versions all have some sort of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/746">TS</a>]
00:12:27 ◼ ► strange look on them so we'll see but I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/747">TS</a>]
00:12:30 ◼ ► really don't expect like Safari to get [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/750">TS</a>]
00:12:32 ◼ ► all weird the Finder terminal activity [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/752">TS</a>]
00:12:35 ◼ ► viewer I mean there's a limit you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/755">TS</a>]
00:12:38 ◼ ► so I related this as someone brought up [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/758">TS</a>]
00:12:41 ◼ ► the reverse of this where Apple takes a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/761">TS</a>]
00:12:46 ◼ ► distinct look and makes it all the same [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/766">TS</a>]
00:12:49 ◼ ► toolbar buttons making them look sort of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/769">TS</a>]
00:12:51 ◼ ► like they do when the iPad apps where [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/771">TS</a>]
00:12:53 ◼ ► it's just kind of like a gray silhouette [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/773">TS</a>]
00:12:55 ◼ ► like it's stamped into the toolbar right [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/775">TS</a>]
00:12:57 ◼ ► all monochrome right and that makes them [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/777">TS</a>]
00:13:00 ◼ ► much less distinct than when they were [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/780">TS</a>]
00:13:01 ◼ ► colorful photographic looking yeah [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/781">TS</a>]
00:13:04 ◼ ► icons and so now when you look at the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/784">TS</a>]
00:13:06 ◼ ► tight the title bar the toolbar of an [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/786">TS</a>]
00:13:08 ◼ ► app and you want to find the button for [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/788">TS</a>]
00:13:10 ◼ ► like you know reply to email or you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/790">TS</a>]
00:13:12 ◼ ► for word or whatever now you're just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/792">TS</a>]
00:13:13 ◼ ► looking based on shape instead of color [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/793">TS</a>]
00:13:15 ◼ ► you know you still got position but it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/795">TS</a>]
00:13:17 ◼ ► seems it seems though like for a long [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/797">TS</a>]
00:13:25 ◼ ► feature but I mean even the term aqua I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/805">TS</a>]
00:13:28 ◼ ► mean everything about Mac os10 was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/808">TS</a>]
00:13:31 ◼ ► colorful and poppin and shiny and and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/811">TS</a>]
00:13:34 ◼ ► they've just have gone continuously more [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/814">TS</a>]
00:13:36 ◼ ► and more and more toward a monochrome [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/816">TS</a>]
00:13:42 ◼ ► leeching the color out a lot I mean you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/822">TS</a>]
00:13:43 ◼ ► saw them do it with iTunes most recently [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/823">TS</a>]
00:13:45 ◼ ► right and the i io s apps tend to have a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/825">TS</a>]
00:13:48 ◼ ► lot of color leached out of them too but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/828">TS</a>]
00:13:49 ◼ ► they go off another direct light I mean [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/829">TS</a>]
00:13:51 ◼ ► you would definitely not say that the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/831">TS</a>]
00:13:53 ◼ ► new the Lion I Cal has the color leech [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/833">TS</a>]
00:13:54 ◼ ► data but its exact opposite sorry they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/834">TS</a>]
00:13:57 ◼ ► pick their battles but it seems like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/837">TS</a>]
00:14:00 ◼ ► cultivating for like the serious kind of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/840">TS</a>]
00:14:04 ◼ ► application it's monochrome look at [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/844">TS</a>]
00:14:05 ◼ ► Final Cut Pro 10 which was revealed this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/845">TS</a>]
00:14:07 ◼ ► week that interface looks like looks [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/847">TS</a>]
00:14:10 ◼ ► like the high-tech theme practically [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/850">TS</a>]
00:14:13 ◼ ► you know it's all jet black with like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/853">TS</a>]
00:14:15 ◼ ► light gray stuff on it and maybe some [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/855">TS</a>]
00:14:17 ◼ ► like blinky fake looking LED things so I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/857">TS</a>]
00:14:26 ◼ ► cultivating many different looks and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/866">TS</a>]
00:14:28 ◼ ► deciding where each one is appropriate I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/868">TS</a>]
00:14:29 ◼ ► think they're back into experimentation [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/869">TS</a>]
00:14:31 ◼ ► I think it was the quiet period was a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/871">TS</a>]
00:14:34 ◼ ► everything went gray and they finally [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/874">TS</a>]
00:14:35 ◼ ► got rid of brush mail and everything [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/875">TS</a>]
00:14:37 ◼ ► else and they just had like a reset time [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/877">TS</a>]
00:14:38 ◼ ► and now I think they're experimenting [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/878">TS</a>]
00:14:39 ◼ ► again one more one more follow-up item I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/879">TS</a>]
00:14:46 ◼ ► so there was a link that went around [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/886">TS</a>]
00:14:48 ◼ ► that's in the show notes about how TiVo [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/888">TS</a>]
00:14:50 ◼ ► was sending out surveys to its customers [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/890">TS</a>]
00:14:52 ◼ ► and it was like you you had a hundred [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/892">TS</a>]
00:14:55 ◼ ► points to to spread on the survey among [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/895">TS</a>]
00:14:58 ◼ ► a big list of features and you were [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/898">TS</a>]
00:15:00 ◼ ► supposed to distribute your points [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/900">TS</a>]
00:15:01 ◼ ► according to how much you wanted the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/901">TS</a>]
00:15:04 ◼ ► particular feature so Engadget posted [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/904">TS</a>]
00:15:06 ◼ ► this and they posted the entire list of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/906">TS</a>]
00:15:07 ◼ ► features that you were allowed to spread [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/907">TS</a>]
00:15:08 ◼ ► them along and it's a big list like 30 [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/908">TS</a>]
00:15:10 ◼ ► features or something like that I mean [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/910">TS</a>]
00:15:11 ◼ ► so I read through the whole thing I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/911">TS</a>]
00:15:13 ◼ ► don't know why I'm bothered by cooking [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/913">TS</a>]
00:15:14 ◼ ► before I read it I knew the types of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/914">TS</a>]
00:15:16 ◼ ► features that they would be asking about [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/916">TS</a>]
00:15:17 ◼ ► would not make me happy so they asked [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/917">TS</a>]
00:15:20 ◼ ► about features like a multi-room viewing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/920">TS</a>]
00:15:21 ◼ ► which a lot of the DVRs that you get [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/921">TS</a>]
00:15:24 ◼ ► from your cable company can do or use [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/924">TS</a>]
00:15:26 ◼ ► that you pay for one DVR and then the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/926">TS</a>]
00:15:27 ◼ ► second room you have another little [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/927">TS</a>]
00:15:28 ◼ ► smaller cheaper box that lets you see [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/928">TS</a>]
00:15:30 ◼ ► stuff on the other DVR so you don't have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/930">TS</a>]
00:15:32 ◼ ► these islands of content in your house [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/932">TS</a>]
00:15:34 ◼ ► then you can just have one DVR that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/934">TS</a>]
00:15:36 ◼ ► stuff you can watch it anywhere and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/936">TS</a>]
00:15:39 ◼ ► they're talking about a Fortuner model [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/939">TS</a>]
00:15:41 ◼ ► and a whole bunch of a whole bunch of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/941">TS</a>]
00:15:43 ◼ ► obvious software features that they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/943">TS</a>]
00:15:44 ◼ ► should have had years ago that I don't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/944">TS</a>]
00:15:45 ◼ ► know why they're asking about would you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/945">TS</a>]
00:15:46 ◼ ► like it if you have a HD version of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/946">TS</a>]
00:15:48 ◼ ► channel that we give you the ability to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/948">TS</a>]
00:15:50 ◼ ► hide the SD version yes of course why [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/950">TS</a>]
00:15:51 ◼ ► would I ever watch the SD version ever I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/951">TS</a>]
00:15:54 ◼ ► don't even want to see it but no they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/954">TS</a>]
00:15:55 ◼ ► have to survey about this this drives me [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/955">TS</a>]
00:15:57 ◼ ► nuts so reading this is making me angry [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/957">TS</a>]
00:15:58 ◼ ► especially since the key features that I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/958">TS</a>]
00:16:00 ◼ ► think are most important are not listed [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/960">TS</a>]
00:16:01 ◼ ► for the same reason they usually not [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/961">TS</a>]
00:16:03 ◼ ► listed and it's like a sickness that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/963">TS</a>]
00:16:05 ◼ ► companies have where they they start [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/965">TS</a>]
00:16:07 ◼ ► seeing things in terms of feature bullet [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/967">TS</a>]
00:16:10 ◼ ► understand what's actually wrong with [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/970">TS</a>]
00:16:12 ◼ ► their product what's actually wrong with [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/972">TS</a>]
00:16:13 ◼ ► TiVo is the freaking box is slow slow [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/973">TS</a>]
00:16:15 ◼ ► and ugly and just you know things should [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/975">TS</a>]
00:16:18 ◼ ► not take that long and they get slower [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/978">TS</a>]
00:16:19 ◼ ► with time and this is nowhere on the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/979">TS</a>]
00:16:21 ◼ ► list I'm not going to say would you like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/981">TS</a>]
00:16:22 ◼ ► it if the menus came out faster because [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/982">TS</a>]
00:16:23 ◼ ► people are gonna be like yeah maybe [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/983">TS</a>]
00:16:24 ◼ ► maybe not people will not ask for this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/984">TS</a>]
00:16:26 ◼ ► but you have to give it to them they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/986">TS</a>]
00:16:29 ◼ ► understand they can say well we want to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/989">TS</a>]
00:16:30 ◼ ► spend X millions of dollars to make our [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/990">TS</a>]
00:16:31 ◼ ► user interface faster it's faster what [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/991">TS</a>]
00:16:33 ◼ ► do you mean people don't complain about [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/993">TS</a>]
00:16:34 ◼ ► it being slow it's fine they don't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/994">TS</a>]
00:16:36 ◼ ► understand that you know people are not [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/996">TS</a>]
00:16:37 ◼ ► going to ask for it if if iOS never [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/997">TS</a>]
00:16:39 ◼ ► existed and it was just Android tablets [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/999">TS</a>]
00:16:42 ◼ ► it'll be like a look at the zoom tablet [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1002">TS</a>]
00:16:44 ◼ ► it's amazing and I can zoom and look at [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1004">TS</a>]
00:16:46 ◼ ► these Android things they're awesome if [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1006">TS</a>]
00:16:47 ◼ ► you've never seen ILS and how it sticks [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1007">TS</a>]
00:16:48 ◼ ► to your fingers when you move in stuff [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1008">TS</a>]
00:16:50 ◼ ► you don't know you're missing it users [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1010">TS</a>]
00:16:51 ◼ ► will not ask you for a more responsive [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1011">TS</a>]
00:16:53 ◼ ► interface but when you give them more [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1013">TS</a>]
00:16:54 ◼ ► responsive interface they will prefer [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1014">TS</a>]
00:16:56 ◼ ► that over the less responsive one even [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1016">TS</a>]
00:16:58 ◼ ► if they don't know why it is that they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1018">TS</a>]
00:17:01 ◼ ► experience of iOS is born then out and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1021">TS</a>]
00:17:02 ◼ ► the fact that TiVo is getting slower [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1022">TS</a>]
00:17:04 ◼ ► with time and instead of even just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1024">TS</a>]
00:17:05 ◼ ► staying the same let alone getting [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1025">TS</a>]
00:17:06 ◼ ► faster as it should with the huge [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1026">TS</a>]
00:17:08 ◼ ► advances in technology we've had since [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1028">TS</a>]
00:17:09 ◼ ► like 2000 just frustrating so I'm I did [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1029">TS</a>]
00:17:14 ◼ ► not like that feature list if I had if I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1034">TS</a>]
00:17:17 ◼ ► had gotten that server I would have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1037">TS</a>]
00:17:18 ◼ ► written a new option put all hundred [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1038">TS</a>]
00:17:21 ◼ ► interface faster ah all right now I love [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1041">TS</a>]
00:17:25 ◼ ► when you go off on a rant like that I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1045">TS</a>]
00:17:27 ◼ ► can't I can't take it I feel like hey [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1047">TS</a>]
00:17:29 ◼ ► dude six more shows just about TiVo like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1049">TS</a>]
00:17:31 ◼ ► we should just have you know guests in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1051">TS</a>]
00:17:34 ◼ ► the show and say do you own a TiVo name [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1054">TS</a>]
00:17:35 ◼ ► the seven thing obvious things that TiVo [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1055">TS</a>]
00:17:37 ◼ ► could do to be better that I've driven [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1057">TS</a>]
00:17:38 ◼ ► you crazy for the past decade that they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1058">TS</a>]
00:17:40 ◼ ► had refused to do so a real a roundtable [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1060">TS</a>]
00:17:45 ◼ ► everybody takes a turn it's just you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1065">TS</a>]
00:17:47 ◼ ► know I still feel like if you took ten [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1067">TS</a>]
00:17:50 ◼ ► you see though they would get you a list [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1070">TS</a>]
00:17:52 ◼ ► of features implement you don't need to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1072">TS</a>]
00:17:53 ◼ ► survey people and have them distribute a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1073">TS</a>]
00:17:55 ◼ ► hundred points and all these ridiculous [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1075">TS</a>]
00:17:56 ◼ ► esoteric features yeah people should [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1076">TS</a>]
00:18:00 ◼ ► follow the link and read the features [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1080">TS</a>]
00:18:02 ◼ ► like there they're picking it the these [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1082">TS</a>]
00:18:05 ◼ ► little you know fringes around the edges [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1085">TS</a>]
00:18:08 ◼ ► when the entire carpet is on fire I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1088">TS</a>]
00:18:09 ◼ ► don't then now I can't think of a good [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1089">TS</a>]
00:18:11 ◼ ► one you're too upset yeah all right so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1091">TS</a>]
00:18:17 ◼ ► do we have a topic for today's show we [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1097">TS</a>]
00:18:19 ◼ ► do you didn't you're not even looking at [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1099">TS</a>]
00:18:21 ◼ ► the I don't look anymore I just want I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1101">TS</a>]
00:18:23 ◼ ► just I'm on autopilot I'm doing it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1103">TS</a>]
00:18:25 ◼ ► myself I like you so you're surprised [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1105">TS</a>]
00:18:27 ◼ ► when you come in the show you want to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1107">TS</a>]
00:18:28 ◼ ► guess what the topic is didn't look at [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1108">TS</a>]
00:18:31 ◼ ► well let me look at the look at these [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1111">TS</a>]
00:18:33 ◼ ► notes here I I put it on the yeah did [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1113">TS</a>]
00:18:38 ◼ ► you you put it in Big O in the top now I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1118">TS</a>]
00:18:41 ◼ ► haven't gone on the topics page but I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1121">TS</a>]
00:18:42 ◼ ► can look at these links yeah and you can [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1122">TS</a>]
00:18:45 ◼ ► guess I see the word Copeland about five [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1125">TS</a>]
00:18:48 ◼ ► or six times yeah and speaking of words [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1128">TS</a>]
00:18:50 ◼ ► that like you know you pronounce in your [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1130">TS</a>]
00:18:52 ◼ ► head it for a long time before you have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1132">TS</a>]
00:18:54 ◼ ► to say them out loud so I read about [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1134">TS</a>]
00:18:55 ◼ ► this operating system for years and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1135">TS</a>]
00:18:57 ◼ ► years in my in my youth and I always [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1137">TS</a>]
00:19:00 ◼ ► pronounced it in my head Copland comp [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1140">TS</a>]
00:19:02 ◼ ► which is not how you pronounce it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1142">TS</a>]
00:19:03 ◼ ► because is named after the composer was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1143">TS</a>]
00:19:05 ◼ ► it Aaron Aaron Copland so I'm working [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1145">TS</a>]
00:19:07 ◼ ► really hard in the past decade or so to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1147">TS</a>]
00:19:09 ◼ ► say Copeland Copeland it's just a very [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1149">TS</a>]
00:19:11 ◼ ► with just a straightforward variable [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1151">TS</a>]
00:19:13 ◼ ► substitution you just need to run yeah [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1153">TS</a>]
00:19:15 ◼ ► it's working pretty well so far we'll [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1155">TS</a>]
00:19:17 ◼ ► see if I can get through this without [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1157">TS</a>]
00:19:18 ◼ ► slipping up so this is this is a great [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1158">TS</a>]
00:19:20 ◼ ► topic this is an awesome topic and let [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1160">TS</a>]
00:19:22 ◼ ► actually before we dive in because I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1162">TS</a>]
00:19:23 ◼ ► have a feeling that you're going to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1163">TS</a>]
00:19:24 ◼ ► you've got a lot to say about this one [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1164">TS</a>]
00:19:26 ◼ ► so before we start it let's do the first [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1166">TS</a>]
00:19:29 ◼ ► sponsor is that okay yeah all right so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1169">TS</a>]
00:19:32 ◼ ► we want to thank Rackspace do you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1172">TS</a>]
00:19:34 ◼ ► remember John back in February Rackspace [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1174">TS</a>]
00:19:36 ◼ ► asked if if listeners of this show and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1176">TS</a>]
00:19:39 ◼ ► other shows had what it takes to be king [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1179">TS</a>]
00:19:42 ◼ ► of the apps you remember that contest [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1182">TS</a>]
00:19:44 ◼ ► king of the apps vaguely okay so a whole [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1184">TS</a>]
00:19:46 ◼ ► bunch of people took up the challenge [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1186">TS</a>]
00:19:50 ◼ ► application on top of Rackspace cloud [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1190">TS</a>]
00:19:53 ◼ ► application was and they're going to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1193">TS</a>]
00:19:56 ◼ ► give you $10,000 oh yeah now I remember [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1196">TS</a>]
00:19:58 ◼ ► okay did you apply did you do this I did [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1198">TS</a>]
00:20:00 ◼ ► not that would be conflict of interest [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1200">TS</a>]
00:20:02 ◼ ► I'd say go for it this time because it's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1202">TS</a>]
00:20:04 ◼ ► as round too anyway they announced it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1204">TS</a>]
00:20:06 ◼ ► snap appointments they were crowned king [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1206">TS</a>]
00:20:08 ◼ ► of the apps in at South by Southwest now [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1208">TS</a>]
00:20:11 ◼ ► round two you have to submit your app by [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1211">TS</a>]
00:20:13 ◼ ► May 2nd all you need to do is build an [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1213">TS</a>]
00:20:16 ◼ ► app that works on cloud files Rackspace [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1216">TS</a>]
00:20:18 ◼ ► cloud files it anything you can imagine [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1218">TS</a>]
00:20:20 ◼ ► as long as it uses that you could win [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1220">TS</a>]
00:20:24 ◼ ► and the the winner will be announced [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1224">TS</a>]
00:20:25 ◼ ► dead Interop Las Vegas are you gonna be [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1225">TS</a>]
00:20:27 ◼ ► there not me no you're not going to as a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1227">TS</a>]
00:20:30 ◼ ► representative no ok that's your choice [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1230">TS</a>]
00:20:34 ◼ ► so anyway you can find out all the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1234">TS</a>]
00:20:35 ◼ ► details and find out how you could win [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1235">TS</a>]
00:20:37 ◼ ► $10,000 at Rackspace comm slash king of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1237">TS</a>]
00:20:41 ◼ ► the apps and their slogan for this is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1241">TS</a>]
00:20:44 ◼ ► showcase triumph defend I like that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1244">TS</a>]
00:20:50 ◼ ► 10,000 but what would you do with 10,000 [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1250">TS</a>]
00:20:52 ◼ ► bucks if you just built you wrote a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1252">TS</a>]
00:20:54 ◼ ► little app and got 10 grand you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1254">TS</a>]
00:20:57 ◼ ► what I would do with it it's the most [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1257">TS</a>]
00:21:01 ◼ ► buy more TiVo's no it goes right into [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1261">TS</a>]
00:21:03 ◼ ► the kids college fund that's a good [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1263">TS</a>]
00:21:05 ◼ ► thing to do with it better than TiVo [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1265">TS</a>]
00:21:07 ◼ ► yeah boring though so Copeland was I'll [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1267">TS</a>]
00:21:10 ◼ ► close the Wikipedia page Copeland was a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1270">TS</a>]
00:21:12 ◼ ► project at Apple computer to create an [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1272">TS</a>]
00:21:16 ◼ ► operating system was to have introduced [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1276">TS</a>]
00:21:22 ◼ ► underlying operating system features yet [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1282">TS</a>]
00:21:25 ◼ ► still be compatible with existing Mac [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1285">TS</a>]
00:21:27 ◼ ► software you know this is not where I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1287">TS</a>]
00:21:30 ◼ ► that's not how I start things though I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1290">TS</a>]
00:21:31 ◼ ► know I always have to go back let's go [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1291">TS</a>]
00:21:34 ◼ ► back further but there's people who are [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1294">TS</a>]
00:21:36 ◼ ► going to say Copeland what do I care [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1296">TS</a>]
00:21:37 ◼ ► about Copeland for now at least I know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1297">TS</a>]
00:21:38 ◼ ► you're talking about there's a lot of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1298">TS</a>]
00:21:41 ◼ ► people that they dare their introduction [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1301">TS</a>]
00:21:43 ◼ ► even know what cup 1 to Mac OS 10 is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1303">TS</a>]
00:21:46 ◼ ► 10.2 a lot of people just got their [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1306">TS</a>]
00:21:50 ◼ ► first MacBook you know I know well so I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1310">TS</a>]
00:21:53 ◼ ► mean it's so you don't want to take some [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1313">TS</a>]
00:21:55 ◼ ► back in now 1969 a Woodstock when you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1315">TS</a>]
00:21:59 ◼ ► know was was you know tripping out and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1319">TS</a>]
00:22:01 ◼ ► had an idea for something you know let [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1321">TS</a>]
00:22:02 ◼ ► give him a framework well I mean it's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1322">TS</a>]
00:22:05 ◼ ► alright so we'll come back to Copeland [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1325">TS</a>]
00:22:07 ◼ ► but I'll start from this is a talk [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1327">TS</a>]
00:22:10 ◼ ► that's about a series of articles I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1330">TS</a>]
00:22:11 ◼ ► wrote many years ago in 2005 and the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1331">TS</a>]
00:22:15 ◼ ► the article series was avoiding copeland [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1335">TS</a>]
00:22:17 ◼ ► 2010 and it was written in 2005 so the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1337">TS</a>]
00:22:22 ◼ ► premise underlying this entire series of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1342">TS</a>]
00:22:25 ◼ ► arc was his articles is article was like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1345">TS</a>]
00:22:27 ◼ ► at a point it was trying to say you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1347">TS</a>]
00:22:30 ◼ ► to predict the future and warned about [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1350">TS</a>]
00:22:31 ◼ ► something that can happen right so the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1351">TS</a>]
00:22:34 ◼ ► premise which i'm going to lay out now [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1354">TS</a>]
00:22:35 ◼ ► most people if you just give them the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1355">TS</a>]
00:22:37 ◼ ► premise in isolation agree with and you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1357">TS</a>]
00:22:39 ◼ ► know without even thinking about like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1359">TS</a>]
00:22:41 ◼ ► it's obviously everybody knows that it's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1361">TS</a>]
00:22:43 ◼ ► you know it's not worth even discussing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1363">TS</a>]
00:22:45 ◼ ► though we don't need to be explicit [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1365">TS</a>]
00:22:47 ◼ ► about this premise we all agree but when [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1367">TS</a>]
00:22:49 ◼ ► i'm done and i start trying to use that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1369">TS</a>]
00:22:54 ◼ ► conclusions then people will come back [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1374">TS</a>]
00:22:56 ◼ ► and challenge the premise so we'll see [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1376">TS</a>]
00:22:57 ◼ ► if that happens with you here or any of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1377">TS</a>]
00:23:00 ◼ ► the listeners so the premise is that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1380">TS</a>]
00:23:04 ◼ ► abstraction increases over time in the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1384">TS</a>]
00:23:07 ◼ ► computer industry you could take off the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1387">TS</a>]
00:23:09 ◼ ► computer interesting qualifier just say [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1389">TS</a>]
00:23:10 ◼ ► abstract can increases over time period [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1390">TS</a>]
00:23:12 ◼ ► because it's sort of the basis of all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1392">TS</a>]
00:23:14 ◼ ► human progress where it's systems built [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1394">TS</a>]
00:23:16 ◼ ► upon systems where someone figures after [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1396">TS</a>]
00:23:18 ◼ ► to do some small thing and then the next [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1398">TS</a>]
00:23:20 ◼ ► generation comes along and they figure [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1400">TS</a>]
00:23:21 ◼ ► out how to do something built on the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1401">TS</a>]
00:23:23 ◼ ► previous system because i don't have to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1403">TS</a>]
00:23:25 ◼ ► worry about that one it's been figured [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1405">TS</a>]
00:23:26 ◼ ► out so they could build something more [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1406">TS</a>]
00:23:29 ◼ ► computers that has sort of played out [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1409">TS</a>]
00:23:31 ◼ ► very very quickly much more quickly than [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1411">TS</a>]
00:23:33 ◼ ► just like all of human history where [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1413">TS</a>]
00:23:36 ◼ ► computers just came into existence you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1416">TS</a>]
00:23:38 ◼ ► know within a human lifetime or two and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1418">TS</a>]
00:23:41 ◼ ► we've gone so far since then so I'm [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1421">TS</a>]
00:23:44 ◼ ► going to speak specifically about [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1424">TS</a>]
00:23:45 ◼ ► programming computers what do you have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1425">TS</a>]
00:23:47 ◼ ► to do to tell a computer what to do and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1427">TS</a>]
00:23:50 ◼ ► and this sort of briefly go through the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1430">TS</a>]
00:23:52 ◼ ► progression that's made so in the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1432">TS</a>]
00:23:53 ◼ ► beginning ignoring the phase where you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1433">TS</a>]
00:23:56 ◼ ► had just toggle switches and people were [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1436">TS</a>]
00:23:57 ◼ ► just you know flipping switches on and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1437">TS</a>]
00:23:58 ◼ ► off to enter binary in the beginning [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1438">TS</a>]
00:24:00 ◼ ► when you had program programmable [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1440">TS</a>]
00:24:01 ◼ ► computers people were programming with [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1441">TS</a>]
00:24:02 ◼ ► machine code which means you would enter [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1442">TS</a>]
00:24:05 ◼ ► basically just a series of ones and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1445">TS</a>]
00:24:06 ◼ ► zeros that would the computer would [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1446">TS</a>]
00:24:09 ◼ ► interpret as instructions you know this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1449">TS</a>]
00:24:11 ◼ ► this particular number means this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1451">TS</a>]
00:24:13 ◼ ► instruction and the next number is an [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1453">TS</a>]
00:24:15 ◼ ► address in the next number is a value is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1455">TS</a>]
00:24:17 ◼ ► so on and so forth that's how is it von [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1457">TS</a>]
00:24:20 ◼ ► Neumann machines am i pronouncing that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1460">TS</a>]
00:24:21 ◼ ► correctly I think so you see there von [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1461">TS</a>]
00:24:23 ◼ ► Neumann or no I'm on I don't know why go [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1463">TS</a>]
00:24:27 ◼ ► with Norman let's go with Norman anyway [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1467">TS</a>]
00:24:29 ◼ ► of you have a big set of memory that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1469">TS</a>]
00:24:33 ◼ ► instructions then you have a CPU that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1473">TS</a>]
00:24:34 ◼ ► reads from the program from memory and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1474">TS</a>]
00:24:37 ◼ ► excuse these instructions and back in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1477">TS</a>]
00:24:39 ◼ ► the day when people made the first [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1479">TS</a>]
00:24:40 ◼ ► computers that's how you would program [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1480">TS</a>]
00:24:42 ◼ ► it you have to put in the numbers that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1482">TS</a>]
00:24:43 ◼ ► the CPU would eat and perform the actual [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1483">TS</a>]
00:24:46 ◼ ► task now no one wants to just enter in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1486">TS</a>]
00:24:47 ◼ ► long strings of binary or hexadecimal or [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1487">TS</a>]
00:24:49 ◼ ► anything numbers because it's ridiculous [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1489">TS</a>]
00:24:51 ◼ ► so the next phase was assembly code [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1491">TS</a>]
00:24:55 ◼ ► representations of these numbers where [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1495">TS</a>]
00:24:56 ◼ ► the instruction for you know moving a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1496">TS</a>]
00:24:59 ◼ ► value from one register to another we're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1499">TS</a>]
00:25:01 ◼ ► just going to call that mov and you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1501">TS</a>]
00:25:02 ◼ ► don't have to remember that access on [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1502">TS</a>]
00:25:03 ◼ ► the number four and then your addresses [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1503">TS</a>]
00:25:05 ◼ ► you just you make up names for them and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1505">TS</a>]
00:25:07 ◼ ► then you prefer to those names in the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1507">TS</a>]
00:25:08 ◼ ► program and then an assembler would come [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1508">TS</a>]
00:25:11 ◼ ► representation and say okay mov that's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1511">TS</a>]
00:25:13 ◼ ► this instruction and you know this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1513">TS</a>]
00:25:15 ◼ ► symbolic name you know ax okay that's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1515">TS</a>]
00:25:17 ◼ ► the register this this is the value for [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1517">TS</a>]
00:25:20 ◼ ► that register and you made up this name [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1520">TS</a>]
00:25:22 ◼ ► for this new memory address so I'll [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1522">TS</a>]
00:25:23 ◼ ► substitute that memory address for the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1523">TS</a>]
00:25:24 ◼ ► name um that was called assembly code [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1524">TS</a>]
00:25:26 ◼ ► and the assembler was the thing that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1526">TS</a>]
00:25:28 ◼ ► turned it into a machine code and then [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1528">TS</a>]
00:25:30 ◼ ► the CPU executed the machine code so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1530">TS</a>]
00:25:31 ◼ ► that's the first layer of abstraction [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1531">TS</a>]
00:25:32 ◼ ► where you didn't have to write the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1532">TS</a>]
00:25:34 ◼ ► machine code you wrote in this thing it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1534">TS</a>]
00:25:36 ◼ ► was little bit nicer humans then another [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1536">TS</a>]
00:25:37 ◼ ► program that someone wrote before you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1537">TS</a>]
00:25:39 ◼ ► would come and turn it into machine code [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1539">TS</a>]
00:25:41 ◼ ► um but that was still stuck run on a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1541">TS</a>]
00:25:44 ◼ ► single CPU because machine code only [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1544">TS</a>]
00:25:46 ◼ ► works on one particular CPU and assembly [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1546">TS</a>]
00:25:48 ◼ ► code turns into machine code that only [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1548">TS</a>]
00:25:49 ◼ ► works on one CPU so the next layer layer [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1549">TS</a>]
00:25:52 ◼ ► abstraction was portable languages where [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1552">TS</a>]
00:25:54 ◼ ► you could write a program and have it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1554">TS</a>]
00:25:55 ◼ ► execute on different CPUs because your [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1555">TS</a>]
00:25:58 ◼ ► compiler can pilot for them the most [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1558">TS</a>]
00:25:59 ◼ ► popular one of those is C where you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1559">TS</a>]
00:26:01 ◼ ► would write in the language C was called [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1561">TS</a>]
00:26:03 ◼ ► portable assembler is kind of a a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1563">TS</a>]
00:26:05 ◼ ► derogatory term but basically you write [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1565">TS</a>]
00:26:08 ◼ ► and you write in a more abstract form [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1568">TS</a>]
00:26:12 ◼ ► basically machine code sometimes passing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1572">TS</a>]
00:26:15 ◼ ► through assembly on its way down for a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1575">TS</a>]
00:26:17 ◼ ► particular CPU so the same C program you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1577">TS</a>]
00:26:19 ◼ ► could compile for two different CPUs and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1579">TS</a>]
00:26:21 ◼ ► executed on two different CPUs in a wood [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1581">TS</a>]
00:26:26 ◼ ► higher-level concepts or stuff that the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1586">TS</a>]
00:26:29 ◼ ► machine would understand so I had this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1589">TS</a>]
00:26:31 ◼ ► the concept of types where you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1591">TS</a>]
00:26:34 ◼ ► you'd have integer types and character [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1594">TS</a>]
00:26:36 ◼ ► types and stuff like that they're all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1596">TS</a>]
00:26:36 ◼ ► end up being numbers behind the scenes [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1596">TS</a>]
00:26:38 ◼ ► but these types would add constraints to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1598">TS</a>]
00:26:40 ◼ ► your program to make it make sure you're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1600">TS</a>]
00:26:41 ◼ ► doing what you thought you were doing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1601">TS</a>]
00:26:43 ◼ ► and you had much more complicated [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1603">TS</a>]
00:26:44 ◼ ► statements where you'd have a single [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1604">TS</a>]
00:26:46 ◼ ► line of code that would result in many [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1606">TS</a>]
00:26:48 ◼ ► many many lines of assembly many many [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1608">TS</a>]
00:26:50 ◼ ► many lines of machine code in the end [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1610">TS</a>]
00:26:52 ◼ ► but you didn't have to write all those [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1612">TS</a>]
00:26:53 ◼ ► lines it would figure it out for you and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1613">TS</a>]
00:26:55 ◼ ► that phase lasted a long time where [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1615">TS</a>]
00:26:58 ◼ ► you're writing and see pascal those type [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1618">TS</a>]
00:26:59 ◼ ► of compiled languages there were various [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1619">TS</a>]
00:27:02 ◼ ► forms of you know portable assembly [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1622">TS</a>]
00:27:04 ◼ ► language where you'd write something [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1624">TS</a>]
00:27:07 ◼ ► architectures maybe that lasted until [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1627">TS</a>]
00:27:09 ◼ ► the nine user so that's that's a pretty [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1629">TS</a>]
00:27:11 ◼ ► long time we've gone from the first [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1631">TS</a>]
00:27:12 ◼ ► computer in the 60s all up the nineties [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1632">TS</a>]
00:27:14 ◼ ► and we haven't gotten that much farther [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1634">TS</a>]
00:27:15 ◼ ► along in abstraction but then around the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1635">TS</a>]
00:27:18 ◼ ► late 80s early 90s a lot of the research [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1638">TS</a>]
00:27:21 ◼ ► progress to accept done this before but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1641">TS</a>]
00:27:23 ◼ ► this was the first time that popular [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1643">TS</a>]
00:27:24 ◼ ► languages started being memory managed [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1644">TS</a>]
00:27:27 ◼ ► where they would move even farther away [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1647">TS</a>]
00:27:29 ◼ ► from assembly where they would basically [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1649">TS</a>]
00:27:31 ◼ ► write a little program called a virtual [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1651">TS</a>]
00:27:34 ◼ ► machine that would represent a computer [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1654">TS</a>]
00:27:36 ◼ ► didn't actually exist but that was much [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1656">TS</a>]
00:27:37 ◼ ► nicer to deal with than a CPU and then [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1657">TS</a>]
00:27:40 ◼ ► you would write programs to that virtual [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1660">TS</a>]
00:27:41 ◼ ► machine a virtual machine would compile [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1661">TS</a>]
00:27:43 ◼ ► those programs down to machine code in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1663">TS</a>]
00:27:44 ◼ ► the machine code would execute on the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1664">TS</a>]
00:27:45 ◼ ► actual CPU so one more layer up there [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1665">TS</a>]
00:27:49 ◼ ► the big the big difference and this is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1669">TS</a>]
00:27:52 ◼ ► programmer to manage memory manually [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1672">TS</a>]
00:27:54 ◼ ► sometimes didn't have to deal with it at [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1674">TS</a>]
00:27:56 ◼ ► all they would just make variables they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1676">TS</a>]
00:27:57 ◼ ► were pop into existence and disappear [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1677">TS</a>]
00:27:59 ◼ ► when they went out of scope you didn't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1679">TS</a>]
00:28:00 ◼ ► have to worry about where the memory [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1680">TS</a>]
00:28:01 ◼ ► came from where I was going or who still [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1681">TS</a>]
00:28:03 ◼ ► had references to it the virtual machine [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1683">TS</a>]
00:28:04 ◼ ► would take care of that for you and with [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1684">TS</a>]
00:28:08 ◼ ► that came the the ability for you to not [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1688">TS</a>]
00:28:11 ◼ ► worry about accidentally writing over [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1691">TS</a>]
00:28:13 ◼ ► arbitrary memory so with all the old [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1693">TS</a>]
00:28:15 ◼ ► models since all this got turned into it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1695">TS</a>]
00:28:17 ◼ ► eventually a memory address or whatever [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1697">TS</a>]
00:28:19 ◼ ► who if you ended up with a bad value [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1699">TS</a>]
00:28:21 ◼ ► when you do reference that it as an [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1701">TS</a>]
00:28:22 ◼ ► address then you just start scribbling [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1702">TS</a>]
00:28:23 ◼ ► wherever the heck you wanted in memory [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1703">TS</a>]
00:28:25 ◼ ► it was in your memory image anyway and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1705">TS</a>]
00:28:28 ◼ ► that would cause your program to crash [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1708">TS</a>]
00:28:30 ◼ ► while the virtual machine once it said [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1710">TS</a>]
00:28:32 ◼ ► no we're not going to give you any any [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1712">TS</a>]
00:28:33 ◼ ► facility in the programming language to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1713">TS</a>]
00:28:35 ◼ ► grab an address to memory based on some [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1715">TS</a>]
00:28:37 ◼ ► number and just start writing over it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1717">TS</a>]
00:28:38 ◼ ► it's just you're not able to do that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1718">TS</a>]
00:28:40 ◼ ► period of course the virtual machine [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1720">TS</a>]
00:28:42 ◼ ► itself was usually written in a language [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1722">TS</a>]
00:28:43 ◼ ► like C and eventually would take your [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1723">TS</a>]
00:28:46 ◼ ► program and convert it into machine code [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1726">TS</a>]
00:28:48 ◼ ► for the particular CPU that it's running [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1728">TS</a>]
00:28:50 ◼ ► on sometimes they would do that at [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1730">TS</a>]
00:28:52 ◼ ► execute so now we're like three layers [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1732">TS</a>]
00:28:54 ◼ ► up from maybe three or four layers up [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1734">TS</a>]
00:28:56 ◼ ► from the actual CPU and then around that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1736">TS</a>]
00:28:59 ◼ ► same time maybe a little bit later the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1739">TS</a>]
00:29:01 ◼ ► dynamic language started to become [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1741">TS</a>]
00:29:03 ◼ ► popular that that word really means [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1743">TS</a>]
00:29:04 ◼ ► nothing but what it really means is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1744">TS</a>]
00:29:06 ◼ ► languages that are memory managed but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1746">TS</a>]
00:29:10 ◼ ► have even fewer constraints than the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1750">TS</a>]
00:29:14 ◼ ► memory manage languages like Java or C [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1754">TS</a>]
00:29:16 ◼ ► sharp or anything like that one of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1756">TS</a>]
00:29:18 ◼ ► things they threw away was that having [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1758">TS</a>]
00:29:20 ◼ ► to deal with types they said well it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1760">TS</a>]
00:29:21 ◼ ► will just figure that out for use [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1761">TS</a>]
00:29:23 ◼ ► there's no like integer types or you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1763">TS</a>]
00:29:25 ◼ ► know string types or anything you just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1765">TS</a>]
00:29:27 ◼ ► have variables and we'll figure out what [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1767">TS</a>]
00:29:29 ◼ ► the type is for you we'll also figure [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1769">TS</a>]
00:29:30 ◼ ► out all the memory for you we'll build [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1770">TS</a>]
00:29:31 ◼ ► in some more nice stuff for you that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1771">TS</a>]
00:29:33 ◼ ► everybody wants to do anyway like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1773">TS</a>]
00:29:34 ◼ ► regular expressions and stuff like that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1774">TS</a>]
00:29:36 ◼ ► and we'll make it so that a lot of these [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1776">TS</a>]
00:29:39 ◼ ► things compiled when you ran them so you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1779">TS</a>]
00:29:42 ◼ ► executable and run the executable when [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1782">TS</a>]
00:29:43 ◼ ► you ran the thing it would compile it at [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1783">TS</a>]
00:29:45 ◼ ► that point and executed immediately [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1785">TS</a>]
00:29:46 ◼ ► and JavaScript is another example of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1786">TS</a>]
00:29:49 ◼ ► this and so this has been a long long [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1789">TS</a>]
00:29:54 ◼ ► JavaScript to machine code because now [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1794">TS</a>]
00:29:56 ◼ ► think about a modern JavaScript engine [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1796">TS</a>]
00:29:59 ◼ ► in a web browser right so you've got [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1799">TS</a>]
00:30:01 ◼ ► this language that doesn't have anything [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1801">TS</a>]
00:30:07 ◼ ► compiled on to usually some sort of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1807">TS</a>]
00:30:09 ◼ ► virtual machine in your browser which is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1809">TS</a>]
00:30:11 ◼ ► itself written in the language like C or [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1811">TS</a>]
00:30:13 ◼ ► C++ which ends up being compiled and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1813">TS</a>]
00:30:17 ◼ ► executing in machine code and sometimes [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1817">TS</a>]
00:30:19 ◼ ► even assembly on you know for the tight [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1819">TS</a>]
00:30:21 ◼ ► loops inside the JavaScript engines on [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1821">TS</a>]
00:30:23 ◼ ► your CPU so that's the big trail through [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1823">TS</a>]
00:30:27 ◼ ► what has happened to two programming [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1827">TS</a>]
00:30:32 ◼ ► abstraction has increased over time I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1832">TS</a>]
00:30:33 ◼ ► don't think people would disagree with [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1833">TS</a>]
00:30:34 ◼ ► that you say to people writing assembly [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1834">TS</a>]
00:30:36 ◼ ► today yeah some people still write in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1836">TS</a>]
00:30:37 ◼ ► assembly sometimes like that guy who's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1837">TS</a>]
00:30:38 ◼ ► writing the JavaScript engine for your [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1838">TS</a>]
00:30:41 ◼ ► browser sometimes it is some particular [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1841">TS</a>]
00:30:42 ◼ ► tight loop inside the virtual machine [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1842">TS</a>]
00:30:45 ◼ ► that runs JavaScript you wanted to be [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1845">TS</a>]
00:30:46 ◼ ► super fasty baby you do it and assembly [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1846">TS</a>]
00:30:48 ◼ ► you know but the vast majority people [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1848">TS</a>]
00:30:51 ◼ ► are not writing an assembly versus you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1851">TS</a>]
00:30:52 ◼ ► know in the 60s and 70s you know you're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1852">TS</a>]
00:30:55 ◼ ► writing an assembly if you were writing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1855">TS</a>]
00:30:57 ◼ ► you know like the original Mac operating [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1857">TS</a>]
00:30:58 ◼ ► system for example is mostly written in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1858">TS</a>]
00:30:59 ◼ ► assembly hard to believe but like the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1859">TS</a>]
00:31:01 ◼ ► first GUI operating system which were [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1861">TS</a>]
00:31:02 ◼ ► thinking I'm a super modern everything [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1862">TS</a>]
00:31:03 ◼ ► is absolutely filled with assembly [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1863">TS</a>]
00:31:06 ◼ ► whereas nowadays very very small parts [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1866">TS</a>]
00:31:09 ◼ ► of the operating system are in assembly [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1869">TS</a>]
00:31:10 ◼ ► just a few keys tiny parts and most of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1870">TS</a>]
00:31:13 ◼ ► it or in a higher-level language and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1873">TS</a>]
00:31:15 ◼ ► things like websites no one's writing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1875">TS</a>]
00:31:16 ◼ ► websites and assembly you know no one's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1876">TS</a>]
00:31:18 ◼ ► writing websites in C++ unless they're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1878">TS</a>]
00:31:20 ◼ ► I guess think there's one or two people [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1880">TS</a>]
00:31:21 ◼ ► out there still doing that but uh but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1881">TS</a>]
00:31:23 ◼ ► the trend line is clear what are they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1883">TS</a>]
00:31:25 ◼ ► teaching in in the universities these [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1885">TS</a>]
00:31:27 ◼ ► days what's the if you decide you want [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1887">TS</a>]
00:31:29 ◼ ► to do computer jobs man I mean it makes [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1889">TS</a>]
00:31:31 ◼ ► sense when I was when to date myself a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1891">TS</a>]
00:31:33 ◼ ► lot here when I was in college its [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1893">TS</a>]
00:31:36 ◼ ► Pascal you know they were switching from [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1896">TS</a>]
00:31:38 ◼ ► modular to Pascal and and like one of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1898">TS</a>]
00:31:41 ◼ ► the teachers was only doing Pascal and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1901">TS</a>]
00:31:44 ◼ ► to stay I guess to keep kosher with the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1904">TS</a>]
00:31:48 ◼ ► rest of the staff you could turn your [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1908">TS</a>]
00:31:50 ◼ ► assignments in in modular and he would [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1910">TS</a>]
00:31:52 ◼ ► allow that but only for the rest of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1912">TS</a>]
00:31:57 ◼ ► computer science has about as much to do [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1917">TS</a>]
00:31:58 ◼ ► with computers as astronomy has to do [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1918">TS</a>]
00:32:00 ◼ ► with telescopes so a lot of the things [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1920">TS</a>]
00:32:02 ◼ ► they're using using and teaching are to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1922">TS</a>]
00:32:05 ◼ ► teach you concepts of computer science [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1925">TS</a>]
00:32:07 ◼ ► which are more mathematical in nature [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1927">TS</a>]
00:32:08 ◼ ► and the fact that they have to use an [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1928">TS</a>]
00:32:10 ◼ ► actual language to teach you this is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1930">TS</a>]
00:32:11 ◼ ► almost like it's a kind of a shame [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1931">TS</a>]
00:32:13 ◼ ► because they would rather just you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1933">TS</a>]
00:32:15 ◼ ► talk about it conceptually but I guess [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1935">TS</a>]
00:32:17 ◼ ► you got to write some sort of code that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1937">TS</a>]
00:32:18 ◼ ► excuse I'm not teaching you to be a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1938">TS</a>]
00:32:19 ◼ ► programmer as in as a trade they're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1939">TS</a>]
00:32:22 ◼ ► concepts the concepts of computer [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1942">TS</a>]
00:32:24 ◼ ► science and the particular language they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1944">TS</a>]
00:32:26 ◼ ► use to do that it's not important but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1946">TS</a>]
00:32:27 ◼ ► within the industry that the trend line [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1947">TS</a>]
00:32:31 ◼ ► has been clear most working programmers [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1951">TS</a>]
00:32:32 ◼ ► are not working in assembly they're not [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1952">TS</a>]
00:32:34 ◼ ► working in machine code they're not even [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1954">TS</a>]
00:32:35 ◼ ► working and see like these days they're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1955">TS</a>]
00:32:36 ◼ ► working in c-sharp Java you know took [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1956">TS</a>]
00:32:39 ◼ ► over a lot of the the bulk of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1959">TS</a>]
00:32:41 ◼ ► programming market when it came out I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1961">TS</a>]
00:32:43 ◼ ► and lots of people now working in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1963">TS</a>]
00:32:44 ◼ ► dynamic languages like Ruby JavaScript [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1964">TS</a>]
00:32:46 ◼ ► Python stuff like that what are you work [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1966">TS</a>]
00:32:47 ◼ ► in most days can you say that because I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1967">TS</a>]
00:32:49 ◼ ► know you're soakin girl which will flip [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1969">TS</a>]
00:32:51 ◼ ► people out but believe it or not people [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1971">TS</a>]
00:32:53 ◼ ► still do that and I'll talk about my [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1973">TS</a>]
00:32:55 ◼ ► talk more about that at the end if I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1975">TS</a>]
00:32:57 ◼ ► so no we're going to make time for that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1977">TS</a>]
00:32:58 ◼ ► yeah we can do a whole episode on that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1978">TS</a>]
00:33:00 ◼ ► you know actually helps probably have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1980">TS</a>]
00:33:01 ◼ ► some good rants about that um can you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1981">TS</a>]
00:33:04 ◼ ► read your own Perl once you write it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1984">TS</a>]
00:33:05 ◼ ► of course I can okay yes most most [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1985">TS</a>]
00:33:08 ◼ ► people can't it's not true all right [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1988">TS</a>]
00:33:10 ◼ ► so that that is the premise and you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1990">TS</a>]
00:33:13 ◼ ► agree with it right but absolutely [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1993">TS</a>]
00:33:15 ◼ ► gotten more abstract absolutely and I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1995">TS</a>]
00:33:17 ◼ ► think this is a trend that's going to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1997">TS</a>]
00:33:19 ◼ ► or level off or not continue I would say [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/1999">TS</a>]
00:33:23 ◼ ► it's either going to it's interesting [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2003">TS</a>]
00:33:26 ◼ ► because you the choices you gave me are [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2006">TS</a>]
00:33:28 ◼ ► is it going to to level off reverse or [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2008">TS</a>]
00:33:32 ◼ ► not continue my I think it's going to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2012">TS</a>]
00:33:35 ◼ ► continue I think it's going to maybe [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2015">TS</a>]
00:33:38 ◼ ► level off or continue keep continuing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2018">TS</a>]
00:33:40 ◼ ► alright so finally getting back to this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2020">TS</a>]
00:33:43 ◼ ► avoiding Copelan 2010 thing I'd be one [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2023">TS</a>]
00:33:45 ◼ ► more quick history oh my god so yeah I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2025">TS</a>]
00:33:48 ◼ ► know I was tough so back in the 90s [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2028">TS</a>]
00:33:51 ◼ ► Apple found itself kind of behind [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2031">TS</a>]
00:33:54 ◼ ► technically Steve Jobs wasn't there at [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2034">TS</a>]
00:33:56 ◼ ► this point he'd been kicked out into [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2036">TS</a>]
00:33:58 ◼ ► 85-86 the company made a lot of money [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2038">TS</a>]
00:34:03 ◼ ► charging a lot for its hardware but as a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2043">TS</a>]
00:34:05 ◼ ► nineties started and Windows 95 was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2045">TS</a>]
00:34:07 ◼ ► looming and stuff their operating system [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2047">TS</a>]
00:34:09 ◼ ► was behind and it was behind technically [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2049">TS</a>]
00:34:12 ◼ ► and the two big things that had missed [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2052">TS</a>]
00:34:13 ◼ ► if you were nerd in his period of time [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2053">TS</a>]
00:34:14 ◼ ► you knew what Mac the classic Mac OS was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2054">TS</a>]
00:34:17 ◼ ► missing but the two big things that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2057">TS</a>]
00:34:18 ◼ ► admit that didn't have our memory [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2058">TS</a>]
00:34:20 ◼ ► protection and pre-emptive multitasking [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2060">TS</a>]
00:34:21 ◼ ► and those were super super important [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2061">TS</a>]
00:34:23 ◼ ► because people were tired of their Mac's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2063">TS</a>]
00:34:25 ◼ ► crashing memory protection is the thing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2065">TS</a>]
00:34:27 ◼ ► scribbling over the memory of another [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2067">TS</a>]
00:34:29 ◼ ► program or over the memory of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2069">TS</a>]
00:34:30 ◼ ► operating system and that was important [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2070">TS</a>]
00:34:32 ◼ ► because if you got a badly behaved [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2072">TS</a>]
00:34:33 ◼ ► application it would take out your whole [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2073">TS</a>]
00:34:34 ◼ ► Mac and you need to reboot and this was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2074">TS</a>]
00:34:36 ◼ ► increasingly common situation no it's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2076">TS</a>]
00:34:39 ◼ ► just fine but fine when you had 128k [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2079">TS</a>]
00:34:41 ◼ ► because what that can you do you got 128 [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2081">TS</a>]
00:34:43 ◼ ► k it's a miracle you can even get a GUI [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2083">TS</a>]
00:34:44 ◼ ► on the screen with 128 kilobytes of RAM [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2084">TS</a>]
00:34:47 ◼ ► an entire machine right but as the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2087">TS</a>]
00:34:49 ◼ ► machines got bigger and faster it became [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2089">TS</a>]
00:34:52 ◼ ► unacceptable to have this limitation and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2092">TS</a>]
00:34:55 ◼ ► multitasking pre-emptive multitasking [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2095">TS</a>]
00:34:56 ◼ ► allows the operating system to say all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2096">TS</a>]
00:34:58 ◼ ► right program B you're done I'm going to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2098">TS</a>]
00:35:00 ◼ ► let program a run for a little while now [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2100">TS</a>]
00:35:01 ◼ ► okay now you can run again program being [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2101">TS</a>]
00:35:03 ◼ ► back and forth the operating system [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2103">TS</a>]
00:35:05 ◼ ► could preempt you could say you know get [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2105">TS</a>]
00:35:07 ◼ ► off the cpu it's time it's someone [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2107">TS</a>]
00:35:08 ◼ ► else's turn Mac OS again when you had [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2108">TS</a>]
00:35:11 ◼ ► 128 kilobytes of RAM you didn't expect [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2111">TS</a>]
00:35:15 ◼ ► pre-emptive multitasking they just had [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2115">TS</a>]
00:35:17 ◼ ► it's an amazingly get it to run at all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2117">TS</a>]
00:35:19 ◼ ► but they have what we called cooperative [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2119">TS</a>]
00:35:21 ◼ ► multitasking which is kind of like the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2121">TS</a>]
00:35:23 ◼ ► Patriot Act's one of those nice names [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2123">TS</a>]
00:35:25 ◼ ► cooperative multitasking isn't that the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2125">TS</a>]
00:35:27 ◼ ► kinder and gentler kind of no it's not [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2127">TS</a>]
00:35:29 ◼ ► good because what it means is that if a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2129">TS</a>]
00:35:30 ◼ ► process gets the CPU it can only give [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2130">TS</a>]
00:35:33 ◼ ► gives the CPU up to another process [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2133">TS</a>]
00:35:35 ◼ ► which meant that any process could hog [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2135">TS</a>]
00:35:37 ◼ ► the entire CPU and no one else get any [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2137">TS</a>]
00:35:39 ◼ ► time and programs are notoriously bad [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2139">TS</a>]
00:35:42 ◼ ► about deciding that they don't need the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2142">TS</a>]
00:35:43 ◼ ► CPU anymore because that you're you're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2143">TS</a>]
00:35:45 ◼ ► relying on them to share to say oh you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2145">TS</a>]
00:35:47 ◼ ► know that everyone should behave when [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2147">TS</a>]
00:35:48 ◼ ► you don't need to CPU give it up and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2148">TS</a>]
00:35:49 ◼ ► like do I need to see for you well and I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2149">TS</a>]
00:35:52 ◼ ► might need it I really want to give it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2152">TS</a>]
00:35:53 ◼ ► up right now let me just have one more [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2153">TS</a>]
00:35:55 ◼ ► loop and check for events okay and I'll [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2155">TS</a>]
00:35:56 ◼ ► give it up in a second you know it was a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2156">TS</a>]
00:35:57 ◼ ► bad situation that wasted the resources [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2157">TS</a>]
00:35:59 ◼ ► that you had there so programs would hog [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2159">TS</a>]
00:36:01 ◼ ► the CPU just in case they needed it or [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2161">TS</a>]
00:36:03 ◼ ► being some sort of busy loop burning [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2163">TS</a>]
00:36:05 ◼ ► through CPU cycles do they thought they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2165">TS</a>]
00:36:06 ◼ ► were the only one running and other [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2166">TS</a>]
00:36:07 ◼ ► programs were out there starving because [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2167">TS</a>]
00:36:08 ◼ ► they're not being given cycles anymore [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2168">TS</a>]
00:36:10 ◼ ► alright so by the 90s it was clear that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2170">TS</a>]
00:36:14 ◼ ► you needed this stuff you didn't have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2174">TS</a>]
00:36:16 ◼ ► this stuff you started to look like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2176">TS</a>]
00:36:17 ◼ ► creaky old crappy technology and for [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2177">TS</a>]
00:36:19 ◼ ► reference or people who don't know every [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2179">TS</a>]
00:36:20 ◼ ► single modern operating system anywhere [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2180">TS</a>]
00:36:22 ◼ ► probably on wristwatches today has both [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2182">TS</a>]
00:36:23 ◼ ► of these speech they're super important [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2183">TS</a>]
00:36:25 ◼ ► but back then the Mac didn't have them [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2185">TS</a>]
00:36:27 ◼ ► and and so Apple's trying to figure out [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2187">TS</a>]
00:36:30 ◼ ► how do we get these we know we need to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2190">TS</a>]
00:36:32 ◼ ► have these and like every year that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2192">TS</a>]
00:36:33 ◼ ► passes it's getting more and more [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2193">TS</a>]
00:36:34 ◼ ► embarrassing that we don't have them [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2194">TS</a>]
00:36:36 ◼ ► every time someone has to reboot their [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2196">TS</a>]
00:36:37 ◼ ► Mac and we get those little chimes going [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2197">TS</a>]
00:36:38 ◼ ► off during in the office and people are [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2198">TS</a>]
00:36:40 ◼ ► complaining because things are freezing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2200">TS</a>]
00:36:42 ◼ ► you know we got to do this so they tried [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2202">TS</a>]
00:36:45 ◼ ► like seven different plans about how [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2205">TS</a>]
00:36:46 ◼ ► we're gonna get these things to our [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2206">TS</a>]
00:36:48 ◼ ► operating system so the problem is to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2208">TS</a>]
00:36:50 ◼ ► add them you didn't want to like make it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2210">TS</a>]
00:36:53 ◼ ► so none of your existing apps worked [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2213">TS</a>]
00:36:56 ◼ ► you can't like here's a brand new [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2216">TS</a>]
00:36:57 ◼ ► operating system and none year old apps [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2217">TS</a>]
00:36:58 ◼ ► work but hey guys you'll you'll come [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2218">TS</a>]
00:37:02 ◼ ► customers because of this now that was a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2222">TS</a>]
00:37:04 ◼ ► bad scene they needed to bring existing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2224">TS</a>]
00:37:07 ◼ ► customers along and make sure their apps [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2227">TS</a>]
00:37:08 ◼ ► still ran otherwise it's like you're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2228">TS</a>]
00:37:09 ◼ ► starting a whole new company from [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2229">TS</a>]
00:37:10 ◼ ► scratch and just leaving your old [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2230">TS</a>]
00:37:11 ◼ ► customers behind that that was not going [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2231">TS</a>]
00:37:14 ◼ ► to fly but retrofitting can we take [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2234">TS</a>]
00:37:16 ◼ ► existing Mac operating system and add [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2236">TS</a>]
00:37:17 ◼ ► these features well the problem was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2237">TS</a>]
00:37:20 ◼ ► every single existing iMac application [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2240">TS</a>]
00:37:22 ◼ ► including the operating system itself [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2242">TS</a>]
00:37:24 ◼ ► expected to be able to read any memory [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2244">TS</a>]
00:37:26 ◼ ► wanted and they were all you know in one [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2246">TS</a>]
00:37:27 ◼ ► big giant stoop together they expected [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2247">TS</a>]
00:37:30 ◼ ► to be able to hog the CPU they just you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2250">TS</a>]
00:37:33 ◼ ► environment and if you change the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2253">TS</a>]
00:37:35 ◼ ► environment on them every single app [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2255">TS</a>]
00:37:36 ◼ ► would break so how do we let these guys [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2256">TS</a>]
00:37:37 ◼ ► think that they can actually scribble [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2257">TS</a>]
00:37:38 ◼ ► all over memory and read memory from [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2258">TS</a>]
00:37:40 ◼ ► other applications one of my favorite [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2260">TS</a>]
00:37:42 ◼ ► classic Mac applications was uh so if I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2262">TS</a>]
00:37:47 ◼ ► that I was editing and accidentally [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2267">TS</a>]
00:37:48 ◼ ► closed the window without saving there [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2268">TS</a>]
00:37:50 ◼ ► was an application that would search [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2270">TS</a>]
00:37:52 ◼ ► through all memory in the entire machine [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2272">TS</a>]
00:37:54 ◼ ► for uh you know a string or something [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2274">TS</a>]
00:37:57 ◼ ► and so if I accidentally closed a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2277">TS</a>]
00:37:59 ◼ ► program or something and I wanted text [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2279">TS</a>]
00:38:01 ◼ ► back that was in that I could use this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2281">TS</a>]
00:38:02 ◼ ► thing to sort of scram really all memory [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2282">TS</a>]
00:38:04 ◼ ► in the entire machine and find the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2284">TS</a>]
00:38:05 ◼ ► document that was previously in memory [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2285">TS</a>]
00:38:07 ◼ ► because those pages still hadn't been [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2287">TS</a>]
00:38:08 ◼ ► overwritten well and this was not a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2288">TS</a>]
00:38:10 ◼ ► special privilege program this is a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2290">TS</a>]
00:38:12 ◼ ► program that any person can run so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2292">TS</a>]
00:38:13 ◼ ► really memory was just an open green [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2293">TS</a>]
00:38:15 ◼ ► field that any any person any program [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2295">TS</a>]
00:38:17 ◼ ► any anything could just go rummaging [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2297">TS</a>]
00:38:19 ◼ ► through and this is what applications [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2299">TS</a>]
00:38:21 ◼ ► expected and some of them actually took [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2301">TS</a>]
00:38:22 ◼ ► advantage of it so you couldn't just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2302">TS</a>]
00:38:24 ◼ ► apply these strictures because literally [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2304">TS</a>]
00:38:26 ◼ ► every single program would break and so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2306">TS</a>]
00:38:28 ◼ ► they had many failed efforts to try to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2308">TS</a>]
00:38:30 ◼ ► do this that this talent effort with IBM [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2310">TS</a>]
00:38:32 ◼ ► like let's make a brand-new operating [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2312">TS</a>]
00:38:34 ◼ ► system will partner with IBM and it'll [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2314">TS</a>]
00:38:35 ◼ ► be so awesome people won't care they'll [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2315">TS</a>]
00:38:37 ◼ ► jump ship from the Mac and leave all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2317">TS</a>]
00:38:38 ◼ ► their all the apps behinds and come with [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2318">TS</a>]
00:38:39 ◼ ► us the Copeland project we just talked [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2319">TS</a>]
00:38:44 ◼ ► about which is like well we'll make a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2324">TS</a>]
00:38:45 ◼ ► new operating system that kind of like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2325">TS</a>]
00:38:47 ◼ ► the old one and we'll try to get most of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2327">TS</a>]
00:38:49 ◼ ► the benefits of memory protection [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2329">TS</a>]
00:38:50 ◼ ► programs email - but will have the other [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2330">TS</a>]
00:38:52 ◼ ► mode where the old apps can run in the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2332">TS</a>]
00:38:54 ◼ ► old apps will still be able to crash the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2334">TS</a>]
00:38:55 ◼ ► whole operating system because they have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2335">TS</a>]
00:38:56 ◼ ► to be able to because they need to see a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2336">TS</a>]
00:38:59 ◼ ► wouldn't and we try to gradually bring [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2339">TS</a>]
00:39:01 ◼ ► people over to the new apps they never [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2341">TS</a>]
00:39:02 ◼ ► shipped that it didn't work out it was a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2342">TS</a>]
00:39:04 ◼ ► big mess and at the point where they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2344">TS</a>]
00:39:07 ◼ ► were killing that project or it's like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2347">TS</a>]
00:39:09 ◼ ► look we spent all these years on this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2349">TS</a>]
00:39:10 ◼ ► thing it's still not panning out they're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2350">TS</a>]
00:39:11 ◼ ► like fine we just had to buy something [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2351">TS</a>]
00:39:12 ◼ ► we gotta like we got to find something [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2352">TS</a>]
00:39:14 ◼ ► out there and buy it so they look they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2354">TS</a>]
00:39:18 ◼ ► cooperated just started by an X Apple [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2358">TS</a>]
00:39:20 ◼ ► guy because they had this great new [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2360">TS</a>]
00:39:22 ◼ ► operating system that was if you ran B [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2362">TS</a>]
00:39:25 ◼ ► OS on on the existing Apple Harbor the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2365">TS</a>]
00:39:26 ◼ ► day would make the Apple hardware look [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2366">TS</a>]
00:39:27 ◼ ► amazingly fast you're like yeah that's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2367">TS</a>]
00:39:29 ◼ ► like their operating system already runs [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2369">TS</a>]
00:39:31 ◼ ► on our hardware and it's way faster than [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2371">TS</a>]
00:39:32 ◼ ► ours and it's way cooler and it's got a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2372">TS</a>]
00:39:33 ◼ ► lot of buzz let's buy them but they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2373">TS</a>]
00:39:35 ◼ ► wanted like six hundred million dollars [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2375">TS</a>]
00:39:36 ◼ ► and Apple didn't want to pay it they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2376">TS</a>]
00:39:38 ◼ ► looked everywhere they considered [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2378">TS</a>]
00:39:40 ◼ ► licensing the Windows NT kernel I think [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2380">TS</a>]
00:39:41 ◼ ► one of the history books that I read on [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2381">TS</a>]
00:39:43 ◼ ► this was talking about talking to the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2383">TS</a>]
00:39:45 ◼ ► executives who were at Apple the time [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2385">TS</a>]
00:39:46 ◼ ► can you imagine that that was that was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2386">TS</a>]
00:39:48 ◼ ► one of Apple's plans and it wasn't just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2388">TS</a>]
00:39:49 ◼ ► like an outlier that was like of the top [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2389">TS</a>]
00:39:52 ◼ ► three choices that was up there like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2392">TS</a>]
00:39:54 ◼ ► let's license the Windows NT kernel from [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2394">TS</a>]
00:39:57 ◼ ► generation hopping system and who knows [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2397">TS</a>]
00:39:58 ◼ ► maybe we'll be able to run Windows apps [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2398">TS</a>]
00:40:00 ◼ ► could be a benefit for a company right [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2400">TS</a>]
00:40:02 ◼ ► in the end we know what they actually [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2402">TS</a>]
00:40:04 ◼ ► did they ended up buying a next and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2404">TS</a>]
00:40:06 ◼ ► Steve Jobs and the rest is history they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2406">TS</a>]
00:40:08 ◼ ► got you know two great things there but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2408">TS</a>]
00:40:12 ◼ ► the reason I bring this up is I'm going [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2412">TS</a>]
00:40:13 ◼ ► to compare it to what Microsoft did [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2413">TS</a>]
00:40:14 ◼ ► Microsoft had the same exact problem [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2414">TS</a>]
00:40:16 ◼ ► because they had a crappy operating [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2416">TS</a>]
00:40:17 ◼ ► system with you know they even worse [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2417">TS</a>]
00:40:19 ◼ ► problems I had segmented memory and all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2419">TS</a>]
00:40:20 ◼ ► sorts of crazy x86 Intel stuff to deal [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2420">TS</a>]
00:40:23 ◼ ► with and their programs expected to be [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2423">TS</a>]
00:40:25 ◼ ► able to read all over the place too so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2425">TS</a>]
00:40:26 ◼ ► but what they did is they had a plan [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2426">TS</a>]
00:40:28 ◼ ► that was a long long multi-year plan and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2428">TS</a>]
00:40:31 ◼ ► they executed on it much better than [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2431">TS</a>]
00:40:33 ◼ ► Apple they didn't go in 20 different [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2433">TS</a>]
00:40:34 ◼ ► directions they went in one direction [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2434">TS</a>]
00:40:35 ◼ ► and did it slowly so they introduced [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2435">TS</a>]
00:40:37 ◼ ► Windows NT in like 1993 and it wasn't a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2437">TS</a>]
00:40:41 ◼ ► replacement for the existing Windows it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2441">TS</a>]
00:40:42 ◼ ► was this other thing that was like it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2442">TS</a>]
00:40:44 ◼ ► was a modern OS it had lost all those [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2444">TS</a>]
00:40:46 ◼ ► modern features that you expected to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2446">TS</a>]
00:40:48 ◼ ► have and it had a backward compatibility [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2448">TS</a>]
00:40:49 ◼ ► layer actually had a layer where you can [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2449">TS</a>]
00:40:51 ◼ ► run POSIX programs order like UNIX [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2451">TS</a>]
00:40:53 ◼ ► programs it had a layer where you can [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2453">TS</a>]
00:40:54 ◼ ► run os/2 programs because I hear os/2 is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2454">TS</a>]
00:40:56 ◼ ► the next big thing and IBM is backing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2456">TS</a>]
00:40:57 ◼ ► even there they're a giant in the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2457">TS</a>]
00:40:58 ◼ ► industry and you could run win32 and win [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2458">TS</a>]
00:41:01 ◼ ► 16 programs on it - and what was nice [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2461">TS</a>]
00:41:03 ◼ ► about this was that it they never gave [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2463">TS</a>]
00:41:05 ◼ ► you this promise that everything was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2465">TS</a>]
00:41:07 ◼ ► going to work perfectly because it was a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2467">TS</a>]
00:41:09 ◼ ► different operating system and it was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2469">TS</a>]
00:41:10 ◼ ► intended for different audiences a whole [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2470">TS</a>]
00:41:13 ◼ ► different user base was going to be [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2473">TS</a>]
00:41:14 ◼ ► using NT so they weren't it wasn't like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2474">TS</a>]
00:41:16 ◼ ► the consumer operating system released [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2476">TS</a>]
00:41:18 ◼ ► going from you know 95 to 98 ME or [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2478">TS</a>]
00:41:21 ◼ ► whatever they could do things they could [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2481">TS</a>]
00:41:24 ◼ ► differently yeah so for example the the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2484">TS</a>]
00:41:27 ◼ ► hardware requirements of NT were way [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2487">TS</a>]
00:41:28 ◼ ► higher than the consumer OS and and it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2488">TS</a>]
00:41:30 ◼ ► was slower and it would run most your [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2490">TS</a>]
00:41:32 ◼ ► apps slower if you had legacy apps and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2492">TS</a>]
00:41:33 ◼ ► it was just this big complicated bloated [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2493">TS</a>]
00:41:36 ◼ ► enterprise-e thing that they were not [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2496">TS</a>]
00:41:37 ◼ ► selling to the average pcs were not [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2497">TS</a>]
00:41:39 ◼ ► shipping with Windows NT U in them but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2499">TS</a>]
00:41:40 ◼ ► it slowly started to filter its way into [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2500">TS</a>]
00:41:42 ◼ ► corporations for like servers another [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2502">TS</a>]
00:41:43 ◼ ► serious Hardware right but this was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2503">TS</a>]
00:41:45 ◼ ► important because it gave Microsoft's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2505">TS</a>]
00:41:47 ◼ ► next-generation operating system a place [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2507">TS</a>]
00:41:49 ◼ ► to grow up a place to say alright this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2509">TS</a>]
00:41:51 ◼ ► is gonna be a little bit creepy and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2511">TS</a>]
00:41:52 ◼ ► weird at first and it might be bugging [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2512">TS</a>]
00:41:53 ◼ ► we can't quite figure it out and it's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2513">TS</a>]
00:41:57 ◼ ► everything but you know enterprise [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2517">TS</a>]
00:41:59 ◼ ► developers enterprise customers can deal [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2519">TS</a>]
00:42:01 ◼ ► with that and they have servers they're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2521">TS</a>]
00:42:03 ◼ ► hardware anyway so you know they figured [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2523">TS</a>]
00:42:07 ◼ ► let's let's let's go with this and let [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2527">TS</a>]
00:42:09 ◼ ► it sort of grow there someone when the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2529">TS</a>]
00:42:12 ◼ ► chat rooms bring up the whole os/2 thing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2532">TS</a>]
00:42:14 ◼ ► he was a sort of betrayal of that plan [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2534">TS</a>]
00:42:16 ◼ ► this I don't want to get too far into [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2536">TS</a>]
00:42:17 ◼ ► the history there's a lot of intrigue [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2537">TS</a>]
00:42:19 ◼ ► involving this but I said we're just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2539">TS</a>]
00:42:20 ◼ ► going to pick them up the horses that we [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2540">TS</a>]
00:42:21 ◼ ► know eventually won so what happened is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2541">TS</a>]
00:42:25 ◼ ► that Windows NT grew in that little [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2545">TS</a>]
00:42:27 ◼ ► protected environment of the enterprise [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2547">TS</a>]
00:42:29 ◼ ► through several versions and eventually [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2549">TS</a>]
00:42:32 ◼ ► Microsoft did the big switcheroo and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2552">TS</a>]
00:42:34 ◼ ► they said okay our next version of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2554">TS</a>]
00:42:35 ◼ ► Windows you know the one that comes on [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2555">TS</a>]
00:42:36 ◼ ► your PC that you buy in the store that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2556">TS</a>]
00:42:38 ◼ ► the kind of windows our next version of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2558">TS</a>]
00:42:40 ◼ ► real Windows is going to have windows NT [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2560">TS</a>]
00:42:42 ◼ ► at the core and Windows 2000 was the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2562">TS</a>]
00:42:44 ◼ ► first one to do that it was still kind [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2564">TS</a>]
00:42:46 ◼ ► of like a corporate type operating [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2566">TS</a>]
00:42:47 ◼ ► system but home users were running [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2567">TS</a>]
00:42:49 ◼ ► Windows 2000 eventually where you buy a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2569">TS</a>]
00:42:51 ◼ ► PC and it would say hey this comes with [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2571">TS</a>]
00:42:52 ◼ ► the great new Windows 2000 and by that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2572">TS</a>]
00:42:54 ◼ ► point they had wrung out most of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2574">TS</a>]
00:42:58 ◼ ► compatibility and stuff like that and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2578">TS</a>]
00:42:59 ◼ ► most applications had been updated to be [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2579">TS</a>]
00:43:01 ◼ ► you know when NT savvy or whatever you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2581">TS</a>]
00:43:03 ◼ ► want to call it so it was it was time [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2583">TS</a>]
00:43:05 ◼ ► for the transition and Windows XP was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2585">TS</a>]
00:43:08 ◼ ► the the Big Bang where like even if you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2588">TS</a>]
00:43:09 ◼ ► had an upgraded Windows 2000 by the time [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2589">TS</a>]
00:43:11 ◼ ► XP came along which was also based in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2591">TS</a>]
00:43:12 ◼ ► the Windows NT core everybody had [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2592">TS</a>]
00:43:14 ◼ ► Windows XP in fact it's probably still [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2594">TS</a>]
00:43:16 ◼ ► on your PC right now if you didn't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2596">TS</a>]
00:43:17 ◼ ► upgrade to Windows 7 because nobody used [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2597">TS</a>]
00:43:19 ◼ ► Vista so that was their transition [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2599">TS</a>]
00:43:22 ◼ ► strategy was very different than apples [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2602">TS</a>]
00:43:24 ◼ ► it was a really long term plan where [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2604">TS</a>]
00:43:25 ◼ ► they had this thing on the back burner [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2605">TS</a>]
00:43:26 ◼ ► for a long time but it took them that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2606">TS</a>]
00:43:28 ◼ ► long to get you know the issues sorted [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2608">TS</a>]
00:43:31 ◼ ► I bring this up because this this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2611">TS</a>]
00:43:33 ◼ ► struggle to modernize that Mac operating [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2613">TS</a>]
00:43:35 ◼ ► system almost killed Apple it almost [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2615">TS</a>]
00:43:36 ◼ ► killed the entire company there are many [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2616">TS</a>]
00:43:38 ◼ ► things that almost killed it you know in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2618">TS</a>]
00:43:40 ◼ ► terms of pricing and hardware and just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2620">TS</a>]
00:43:43 ◼ ► bad lack of leadership and too many [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2623">TS</a>]
00:43:45 ◼ ► products and stuff like that but the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2625">TS</a>]
00:43:46 ◼ ► technical issues especially for a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2626">TS</a>]
00:43:47 ◼ ► computer company I would say are at [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2627">TS</a>]
00:43:48 ◼ ► least 50% of what almost killed Apple [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2628">TS</a>]
00:43:50 ◼ ► they did not have a competitive product [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2630">TS</a>]
00:43:52 ◼ ► and they didn't know how to fix it and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2632">TS</a>]
00:43:53 ◼ ► the markets saw that and saw that them [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2633">TS</a>]
00:43:55 ◼ ► saw them drowning and waving their hands [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2635">TS</a>]
00:43:58 ◼ ► technical problem we are not competent [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2638">TS</a>]
00:44:00 ◼ ► to fix it it every year announced a new [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2640">TS</a>]
00:44:01 ◼ ► plan and then we canceled the plan then [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2641">TS</a>]
00:44:03 ◼ ► we try another plan and we canceled that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2643">TS</a>]
00:44:04 ◼ ► one and investors don't like that and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2644">TS</a>]
00:44:05 ◼ ► investors tanked that the stock everyone [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2645">TS</a>]
00:44:07 ◼ ► else at Apple I think they're going [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2647">TS</a>]
00:44:09 ◼ ► under I mean even if you didn't know why [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2649">TS</a>]
00:44:10 ◼ ► even if you didn't know anything about [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2650">TS</a>]
00:44:12 ◼ ► Apple doesn't have memory protection and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2652">TS</a>]
00:44:14 ◼ ► pre-emptive multitasking you knew they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2654">TS</a>]
00:44:15 ◼ ► were flailing you knew they were trying [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2655">TS</a>]
00:44:17 ◼ ► to look for some next generation thing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2657">TS</a>]
00:44:18 ◼ ► to do and they were not figuring it out [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2658">TS</a>]
00:44:20 ◼ ► and you know they almost died the only [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2660">TS</a>]
00:44:22 ◼ ► thing that saved them was getting that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2662">TS</a>]
00:44:24 ◼ ► that trio of things a jobs next in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2664">TS</a>]
00:44:26 ◼ ► Moore's law because I got the man job [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2666">TS</a>]
00:44:28 ◼ ► who's going to be their leader for the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2668">TS</a>]
00:44:29 ◼ ► future they got a software our UNIX you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2669">TS</a>]
00:44:31 ◼ ► know the next base the operating system [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2671">TS</a>]
00:44:33 ◼ ► which would have UNIX underneath it and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2673">TS</a>]
00:44:34 ◼ ► all what modern stuff in it and they got [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2674">TS</a>]
00:44:37 ◼ ► the hardware to run at all Moore's law [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2677">TS</a>]
00:44:38 ◼ ► eventually made max fast enough where [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2678">TS</a>]
00:44:39 ◼ ► they could take that UNIX operating [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2679">TS</a>]
00:44:41 ◼ ► system and run it on their hardware with [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2681">TS</a>]
00:44:44 ◼ ► these you know the blue blocks for [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2684">TS</a>]
00:44:46 ◼ ► applications and you finally have enough [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2686">TS</a>]
00:44:48 ◼ ► RAM to do all that stuff these are [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2688">TS</a>]
00:44:49 ◼ ► solutions that maybe weren't feasible in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2689">TS</a>]
00:44:51 ◼ ► the early days but became feasible when [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2691">TS</a>]
00:44:53 ◼ ► the harbor caught up with it and then in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2693">TS</a>]
00:44:54 ◼ ► the end you know Mac OS 10 10.0 was slow [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2694">TS</a>]
00:44:57 ◼ ► as molasses anyway and still was a tough [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2697">TS</a>]
00:44:59 ◼ ► sell if it wasn't for jobs you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2699">TS</a>]
00:45:00 ◼ ► pressing it and saying well you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2700">TS</a>]
00:45:01 ◼ ► this Mac OS 10 thing is pretty crappy [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2701">TS</a>]
00:45:03 ◼ ► but look shiny and Steve Jobs is pretty [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2703">TS</a>]
00:45:06 ◼ ► cool you know took years to get that up [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2706">TS</a>]
00:45:08 ◼ ► speed but this crisis did almost kill [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2708">TS</a>]
00:45:13 ◼ ► avoiding Copeland 2010 article was is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2713">TS</a>]
00:45:16 ◼ ► there another crisis like this this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2716">TS</a>]
00:45:18 ◼ ► Copeland crisis I called the köppen [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2718">TS</a>]
00:45:20 ◼ ► crisis because Copeland was the you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2720">TS</a>]
00:45:23 ◼ ► the most well known project that was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2723">TS</a>]
00:45:25 ◼ ► going to save apple from its crappy [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2725">TS</a>]
00:45:27 ◼ ► operating system and it's the one that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2727">TS</a>]
00:45:28 ◼ ► cratered right so is there some sort of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2728">TS</a>]
00:45:31 ◼ ► crisis like this looming in Apple's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2731">TS</a>]
00:45:32 ◼ ► future now the new apples on its feet [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2732">TS</a>]
00:45:34 ◼ ► it's got Mac OS 10 everything settled [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2734">TS</a>]
00:45:39 ◼ ► protection stuff anymore it's it's got [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2739">TS</a>]
00:45:40 ◼ ► all these other you know great things [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2740">TS</a>]
00:45:42 ◼ ► going on but is there another crisis [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2742">TS</a>]
00:45:44 ◼ ► like this a technical crisis in Apple's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2744">TS</a>]
00:45:46 ◼ ► future that that they have to worry [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2746">TS</a>]
00:45:49 ◼ ► about and my conclusion in the article [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2749">TS</a>]
00:45:51 ◼ ► was that yes there is a problem like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2751">TS</a>]
00:45:53 ◼ ► that lurking out in Apple's future and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2753">TS</a>]
00:45:55 ◼ ► it's a type of problem where just like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2755">TS</a>]
00:45:58 ◼ ► the operating system problem it doesn't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2758">TS</a>]
00:45:59 ◼ ► seem to be a good solution for and the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2759">TS</a>]
00:46:00 ◼ ► problem is that what Apple lacks now [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2760">TS</a>]
00:46:03 ◼ ► that they will eventually need is a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2763">TS</a>]
00:46:05 ◼ ► memory managed language and API for [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2765">TS</a>]
00:46:07 ◼ ► programming Mac applications because as [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2767">TS</a>]
00:46:10 ◼ ► we all know Mac applications today are [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2770">TS</a>]
00:46:11 ◼ ► written Objective C which is a C based [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2771">TS</a>]
00:46:14 ◼ ► language which uses pointers and all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2774">TS</a>]
00:46:15 ◼ ► that good stuff and the API is built for [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2775">TS</a>]
00:46:18 ◼ ► Objective C and it links to a lot of C [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2778">TS</a>]
00:46:20 ◼ ► libraries and your programming and C [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2780">TS</a>]
00:46:23 ◼ ► basically and the reason I think this is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2783">TS</a>]
00:46:24 ◼ ► a problem is because like we just went [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2784">TS</a>]
00:46:26 ◼ ► through the abstraction of programming [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2786">TS</a>]
00:46:29 ◼ ► languages increases over time and I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2789">TS</a>]
00:46:31 ◼ ► don't think that's going to stop I don't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2791">TS</a>]
00:46:33 ◼ ► think that's ever going to stop and so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2793">TS</a>]
00:46:34 ◼ ► you're in a situation where Apple is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2794">TS</a>]
00:46:36 ◼ ► using a C based language but everybody [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2796">TS</a>]
00:46:38 ◼ ► else on the desktop platforms is not [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2798">TS</a>]
00:46:41 ◼ ► because some you know took a look at [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2801">TS</a>]
00:46:43 ◼ ► what they had and executed on a plan to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2803">TS</a>]
00:46:45 ◼ ► change so you had Java which sort of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2805">TS</a>]
00:46:47 ◼ ► came out of nowhere for set-top boxes [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2807">TS</a>]
00:46:48 ◼ ► and took over the entire enterprise [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2808">TS</a>]
00:46:50 ◼ ► software industry that was you know hey [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2810">TS</a>]
00:46:52 ◼ ► everybody stop programming C++ with [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2812">TS</a>]
00:46:54 ◼ ► pointers start programming job and no [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2814">TS</a>]
00:46:55 ◼ ► pointers right and that just swept [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2815">TS</a>]
00:46:57 ◼ ► through like crazy and you had Microsoft [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2817">TS</a>]
00:47:00 ◼ ► to to its credit had a multi-year really [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2820">TS</a>]
00:47:03 ◼ ► complicated plan to to get away from [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2823">TS</a>]
00:47:05 ◼ ► what they were programming which was C [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2825">TS</a>]
00:47:06 ◼ ► and C++ they came up with this common [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2826">TS</a>]
00:47:08 ◼ ► language runtime which was like a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2828">TS</a>]
00:47:09 ◼ ► virtual machine that sort of learned [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2829">TS</a>]
00:47:11 ◼ ► from the mistakes of the Java Virtual [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2831">TS</a>]
00:47:12 ◼ ► Machine or if you want to be less [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2832">TS</a>]
00:47:14 ◼ ► charitable copy the Java Virtual Machine [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2834">TS</a>]
00:47:16 ◼ ► and made a few tweaks here in there and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2836">TS</a>]
00:47:18 ◼ ► change the letters but either way I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2838">TS</a>]
00:47:19 ◼ ► think they learn from mistakes of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2839">TS</a>]
00:47:21 ◼ ► JVM and did something better than they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2841">TS</a>]
00:47:23 ◼ ► did c-sharp which again if you want to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2843">TS</a>]
00:47:25 ◼ ► be unkind say it's just a bad clone of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2845">TS</a>]
00:47:26 ◼ ► Java but they took what Java had done [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2846">TS</a>]
00:47:29 ◼ ► learned from Javas mistakes made a new [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2849">TS</a>]
00:47:31 ◼ ► language called C sharp that looked a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2851">TS</a>]
00:47:32 ◼ ► little more like C and had its own [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2852">TS</a>]
00:47:34 ◼ ► unique features and then they revised [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2854">TS</a>]
00:47:35 ◼ ► like crazy they made C sharp they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2855">TS</a>]
00:47:37 ◼ ► version the language and just kept [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2857">TS</a>]
00:47:38 ◼ ► coming out with new versions of XI sharp [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2858">TS</a>]
00:47:40 ◼ ► that were better and better and had more [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2860">TS</a>]
00:47:41 ◼ ► and more features tutor try to make them [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2861">TS</a>]
00:47:42 ◼ ► you know more palatable to programmers [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2862">TS</a>]
00:47:45 ◼ ► and c-sharp ran on the common language [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2865">TS</a>]
00:47:47 ◼ ► runtime and then finally they have a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2867">TS</a>]
00:47:48 ◼ ► dotnet api's which were a new set of API [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2868">TS</a>]
00:47:51 ◼ ► is not the old one 32 80s but a brand [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2871">TS</a>]
00:47:53 ◼ ► new set of API is tailored for a modern [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2873">TS</a>]
00:47:55 ◼ ► memory managed language to run on a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2875">TS</a>]
00:47:56 ◼ ► common language runtime that was going [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2876">TS</a>]
00:47:58 ◼ ► to replace you know every part of their [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2878">TS</a>]
00:48:01 ◼ ► old thing their old c c++ base 132 win [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2881">TS</a>]
00:48:03 ◼ ► 16 MFC all those things were going to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2883">TS</a>]
00:48:05 ◼ ► replace relays not net api's and this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2885">TS</a>]
00:48:07 ◼ ► this process has tooken has taken many [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2887">TS</a>]
00:48:10 ◼ ► many many years and tons of Rd and lots [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2890">TS</a>]
00:48:12 ◼ ► of money and lots of really smart people [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2892">TS</a>]
00:48:13 ◼ ► because you can't just flip a switch and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2893">TS</a>]
00:48:15 ◼ ► get this stuff like they invented a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2895">TS</a>]
00:48:16 ◼ ► virtual machine a language and a new API [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2896">TS</a>]
00:48:18 ◼ ► for their platform and they're still [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2898">TS</a>]
00:48:20 ◼ ► doing it they're still in the process of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2900">TS</a>]
00:48:21 ◼ ► trying to transition people away from [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2901">TS</a>]
00:48:22 ◼ ► 1:32 and stuff like that so it you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2902">TS</a>]
00:48:24 ◼ ► it's not like you can't just start this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2904">TS</a>]
00:48:27 ◼ ► and then be done within a year this this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2907">TS</a>]
00:48:29 ◼ ► initiative from Microsoft is taking [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2909">TS</a>]
00:48:30 ◼ ► about five years seven ten it's a long [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2910">TS</a>]
00:48:34 ◼ ► time this point they're still not done [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2914">TS</a>]
00:48:35 ◼ ► with it so what I was looking for is how [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2915">TS</a>]
00:48:39 ◼ ► is Apple going to match this because [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2919">TS</a>]
00:48:41 ◼ ► they're still back on a sea-based [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2921">TS</a>]
00:48:42 ◼ ► language and as far as I knew at the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2922">TS</a>]
00:48:44 ◼ ► time in 2005 they didn't have a plan to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2924">TS</a>]
00:48:47 ◼ ► say here's how we're going to move away [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2927">TS</a>]
00:48:49 ◼ ► you know here's our next language in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2929">TS</a>]
00:48:52 ◼ ► runtime so in back in 2005 I considered [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2932">TS</a>]
00:48:55 ◼ ► so what are the possibilities what can [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2935">TS</a>]
00:48:57 ◼ ► they do one of the possibilities is all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2937">TS</a>]
00:49:01 ◼ ► languages pick Java or C sharp or some [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2941">TS</a>]
00:49:03 ◼ ► languages out there that are memory [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2943">TS</a>]
00:49:04 ◼ ► manage languages why don't you just use [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2944">TS</a>]
00:49:06 ◼ ► one of those you don't need to invent [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2946">TS</a>]
00:49:07 ◼ ► your own language even back then it was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2947">TS</a>]
00:49:10 ◼ ► kind of clear to me that Apple really [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2950">TS</a>]
00:49:13 ◼ ► was not into using some depending on [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2953">TS</a>]
00:49:15 ◼ ► someone for something that important [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2955">TS</a>]
00:49:16 ◼ ► this was even before it was this before [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2956">TS</a>]
00:49:19 ◼ ► Safari I don't know but it is before [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2959">TS</a>]
00:49:21 ◼ ► Apple had decided not to use GCC anymore [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2961">TS</a>]
00:49:23 ◼ ► and it wanted its own compiler before [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2963">TS</a>]
00:49:25 ◼ ► Apple didn't want flash on its platform [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2965">TS</a>]
00:49:26 ◼ ► you know before all of these things it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2966">TS</a>]
00:49:29 ◼ ► was already clear that Apple did not [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2969">TS</a>]
00:49:30 ◼ ► want to be dependent on someone else [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2970">TS</a>]
00:49:32 ◼ ► they wouldn't want to pick Java for [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2972">TS</a>]
00:49:33 ◼ ► example because now like you're holding [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2973">TS</a>]
00:49:34 ◼ ► to Sun and I sure as hell would want to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2974">TS</a>]
00:49:37 ◼ ► beholding the Microsoft report that one [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2977">TS</a>]
00:49:39 ◼ ► range you know and maybe they could do [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2979">TS</a>]
00:49:41 ◼ ► an embrace and extend where they just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2981">TS</a>]
00:49:42 ◼ ► take Java or C sharp and extend it and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2982">TS</a>]
00:49:45 ◼ ► give it a new name and just start [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2985">TS</a>]
00:49:46 ◼ ► developing on their own but Apple the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2986">TS</a>]
00:49:48 ◼ ► apple of 2005 was not yet ready to do [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2988">TS</a>]
00:49:50 ◼ ► that type of thing like where they just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2990">TS</a>]
00:49:52 ◼ ► said great that's an open source thing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2992">TS</a>]
00:49:53 ◼ ► or that's an open standard we're just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2993">TS</a>]
00:49:54 ◼ ► going to take that and you know rename [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2994">TS</a>]
00:49:58 ◼ ► it call it you know Apple something or [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/2998">TS</a>]
00:50:02 ◼ ► responsibility for development of it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3002">TS</a>]
00:50:05 ◼ ► the other possibility I thought of was a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3005">TS</a>]
00:50:08 ◼ ► objective-c with garbage collection at [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3008">TS</a>]
00:50:10 ◼ ► that point garbage collection was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3010">TS</a>]
00:50:11 ◼ ► clearly telegraphed as something Apple [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3011">TS</a>]
00:50:13 ◼ ► was looking into it right I kind of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3013">TS</a>]
00:50:16 ◼ ► rejected that one as well just because [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3016">TS</a>]
00:50:17 ◼ ► garbage collection means you don't have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3017">TS</a>]
00:50:19 ◼ ► to deal with manual memory management [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3019">TS</a>]
00:50:20 ◼ ► but it still means that when you're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3020">TS</a>]
00:50:23 ◼ ► programming you're like one bad pointer [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3023">TS</a>]
00:50:24 ◼ ► dereference away from scribbling all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3024">TS</a>]
00:50:26 ◼ ► over memory like it doesn't change the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3026">TS</a>]
00:50:27 ◼ ► nature of the language it just makes it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3027">TS</a>]
00:50:29 ◼ ► so you probably don't have to deal with [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3029">TS</a>]
00:50:30 ◼ ► the memory management yourself but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3030">TS</a>]
00:50:31 ◼ ► you're still like down there at the Bell [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3031">TS</a>]
00:50:33 ◼ ► net bare metal and you're still writing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3033">TS</a>]
00:50:34 ◼ ► and portable assembly and you still have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3034">TS</a>]
00:50:37 ◼ ► all those things that make CC you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3037">TS</a>]
00:50:39 ◼ ► you've got all that the casting and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3039">TS</a>]
00:50:41 ◼ ► there's the node that to their type [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3041">TS</a>]
00:50:43 ◼ ► system and there's no native strings in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3043">TS</a>]
00:50:46 ◼ ► the native collection classes it's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3046">TS</a>]
00:50:47 ◼ ► portable assembly and garbage collection [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3047">TS</a>]
00:50:48 ◼ ► doesn't change that about the language [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3048">TS</a>]
00:50:50 ◼ ► and the final thing was bridges so you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3050">TS</a>]
00:50:55 ◼ ► had things where you could take some [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3055">TS</a>]
00:50:56 ◼ ► other higher-level language and Bridget [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3056">TS</a>]
00:50:59 ◼ ► to objective-c so spy Objective C Ruby [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3059">TS</a>]
00:51:04 ◼ ► camel bones no one knows what camel [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3064">TS</a>]
00:51:06 ◼ ► bones that was a pearl bridge to gogo I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3066">TS</a>]
00:51:09 ◼ ► bridges all it's not like I mentioned [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3069">TS</a>]
00:51:10 ◼ ► Jerry that's that's one of the big ones [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3070">TS</a>]
00:51:12 ◼ ► now and they're actually in some cases [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3072">TS</a>]
00:51:13 ◼ ► getting better performance out of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3073">TS</a>]
00:51:15 ◼ ► bridges than they are but do use bridges [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3075">TS</a>]
00:51:17 ◼ ► well so here's what I say about bridges [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3077">TS</a>]
00:51:19 ◼ ► or what I said back then in my opinion [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3079">TS</a>]
00:51:21 ◼ ► really hasn't changed I even if you are [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3081">TS</a>]
00:51:23 ◼ ► writing in a higher-level language the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3083">TS</a>]
00:51:26 ◼ ► API that you're writing to is still [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3086">TS</a>]
00:51:27 ◼ ► built for a lower-level language so you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3087">TS</a>]
00:51:31 ◼ ► structures that make absolutely no sense [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3091">TS</a>]
00:51:33 ◼ ► in the higher-level language just to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3093">TS</a>]
00:51:34 ◼ ► appease the API that was written for the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3094">TS</a>]
00:51:36 ◼ ► lower-level language and and you're not [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3096">TS</a>]
00:51:38 ◼ ► using any of the unique features of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3098">TS</a>]
00:51:40 ◼ ► higher-level language you know what I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3100">TS</a>]
00:51:42 ◼ ► where if your high-level language [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3102">TS</a>]
00:51:43 ◼ ► supports you know arbitrary collections [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3103">TS</a>]
00:51:46 ◼ ► of stuff because it's got a native array [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3106">TS</a>]
00:51:47 ◼ ► class or it's got you know a native [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3107">TS</a>]
00:51:49 ◼ ► associative array structure you're still [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3109">TS</a>]
00:51:51 ◼ ► building NS dictionaries to pass down to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3111">TS</a>]
00:51:53 ◼ ► some function or whatever which is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3113">TS</a>]
00:51:54 ◼ ► ridiculous because that's all its entire [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3114">TS</a>]
00:51:56 ◼ ► other layer of abstraction that you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3116">TS</a>]
00:51:58 ◼ ► don't need because I look I've already [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3118">TS</a>]
00:52:00 ◼ ► got I've already got something that's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3120">TS</a>]
00:52:01 ◼ ► like a dictionary it's part of my [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3121">TS</a>]
00:52:02 ◼ ► language why are you making me build [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3122">TS</a>]
00:52:03 ◼ ► this object to pet all it's because your [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3123">TS</a>]
00:52:05 ◼ ► API is written for Objective C not for [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3125">TS</a>]
00:52:08 ◼ ► and the unique features of the language [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3128">TS</a>]
00:52:09 ◼ ► like the most least high level languages [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3129">TS</a>]
00:52:11 ◼ ► have support for closures and especially [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3131">TS</a>]
00:52:13 ◼ ► in a time of you before blocks or [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3133">TS</a>]
00:52:14 ◼ ► whatever it's like well can I pass you a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3134">TS</a>]
00:52:17 ◼ ► closure and you can oh no none of our [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3137">TS</a>]
00:52:18 ◼ ► api's will ever expect expect to be [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3138">TS</a>]
00:52:20 ◼ ► passed the closure because we don't have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3140">TS</a>]
00:52:22 ◼ ► something that's written in Objective C [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3142">TS</a>]
00:52:23 ◼ ► and I don't care if you have a closure [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3143">TS</a>]
00:52:25 ◼ ► and you know Ruby or Python or something [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3145">TS</a>]
00:52:27 ◼ ► like this we're not going to take your [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3147">TS</a>]
00:52:28 ◼ ► lamb doesn't do anything with them [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3148">TS</a>]
00:52:29 ◼ ► because we have no idea what they are so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3149">TS</a>]
00:52:30 ◼ ► even though you're using a high-level [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3150">TS</a>]
00:52:32 ◼ ► language you're not using a higher-level [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3152">TS</a>]
00:52:33 ◼ ► language and the final thing is that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3153">TS</a>]
00:52:35 ◼ ► it's not perceived as native you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3155">TS</a>]
00:52:37 ◼ ► writing programs in this you're just not [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3157">TS</a>]
00:52:39 ◼ ► writing to the native API so you'd [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3159">TS</a>]
00:52:41 ◼ ► always have these people like oh that's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3161">TS</a>]
00:52:42 ◼ ► fine and good you want to write your [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3162">TS</a>]
00:52:43 ◼ ► thing in PI Objective C but I'm writing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3163">TS</a>]
00:52:45 ◼ ► in the native language of the of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3165">TS</a>]
00:52:46 ◼ ► platform and online will always be [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3166">TS</a>]
00:52:48 ◼ ► better and faster now you know even if [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3168">TS</a>]
00:52:50 ◼ ► you win some minor benchmarks I'm [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3170">TS</a>]
00:52:53 ◼ ► applications and you're using a bridge [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3173">TS</a>]
00:52:55 ◼ ► so it's got that stigma attached to it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3175">TS</a>]
00:53:01 ◼ ► Copland yes so you want to sponsor [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3181">TS</a>]
00:53:05 ◼ ► before yeah yeah yeah because here are [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3185">TS</a>]
00:53:06 ◼ ► you ready to get to the meat of this yes [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3186">TS</a>]
00:53:09 ◼ ► finally it's only been you know an hour [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3189">TS</a>]
00:53:12 ◼ ► I try to go as fast as I can all right [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3192">TS</a>]
00:53:14 ◼ ► all right so we'd also like to thank [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3194">TS</a>]
00:53:15 ◼ ► Shopify dot-com now we've sold the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3195">TS</a>]
00:53:17 ◼ ► t-shirts for 5x5 but there's a whole lot [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3197">TS</a>]
00:53:23 ◼ ► Shopify we barely scratched the surface [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3203">TS</a>]
00:53:25 ◼ ► of what it can do it's it's really the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3205">TS</a>]
00:53:27 ◼ ► absolute best way to sell anything [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3207">TS</a>]
00:53:29 ◼ ► online it's got a super clean design [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3209">TS</a>]
00:53:31 ◼ ► makes setting up the store incredibly [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3211">TS</a>]
00:53:34 ◼ ► easy every single store from from square [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3214">TS</a>]
00:53:36 ◼ ► one no matter what level what plan [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3216">TS</a>]
00:53:38 ◼ ► you're on they all come with beautiful [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3218">TS</a>]
00:53:40 ◼ ► themes to choose from or you can design [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3220">TS</a>]
00:53:42 ◼ ► your own 100% customizable you want to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3222">TS</a>]
00:53:44 ◼ ► use your own HTML and CSS and make it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3224">TS</a>]
00:53:46 ◼ ► look exactly like the rest of your site [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3226">TS</a>]
00:53:48 ◼ ► you can do that or you can pick one of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3228">TS</a>]
00:53:51 ◼ ► their designs and spend zero time and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3231">TS</a>]
00:53:53 ◼ ► their designs are pretty awesome there's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3233">TS</a>]
00:53:56 ◼ ► a 30 day free trial which is nice but if [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3236">TS</a>]
00:53:59 ◼ ► you use the code five by five you'll get [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3239">TS</a>]
00:54:04 ◼ ► that's pretty nice so anyway these guys [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3244">TS</a>]
00:54:07 ◼ ► are the absolute best and people say oh [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3247">TS</a>]
00:54:10 ◼ ► well that's great if you want to sell [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3250">TS</a>]
00:54:11 ◼ ► t-shirts you want to sell physical goods [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3251">TS</a>]
00:54:13 ◼ ► and things like that but I just want to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3253">TS</a>]
00:54:15 ◼ ► do electronic stuff I want to sell [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3255">TS</a>]
00:54:16 ◼ ► licenses or I want to sell you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3256">TS</a>]
00:54:18 ◼ ► something that's a purely digital well [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3258">TS</a>]
00:54:21 ◼ ► they can do that there there are plugins [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3261">TS</a>]
00:54:23 ◼ ► there are add-ons there are features for [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3263">TS</a>]
00:54:25 ◼ ► this and you can even write your own if [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3265">TS</a>]
00:54:27 ◼ ► you're if you are a software developer [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3267">TS</a>]
00:54:28 ◼ ► you can write your own add-on some [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3268">TS</a>]
00:54:30 ◼ ► plugins and fully-integrated customize [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3270">TS</a>]
00:54:32 ◼ ► it do whatever you want to do see a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3272">TS</a>]
00:54:34 ◼ ► really great stuff so shopping minutes [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3274">TS</a>]
00:54:36 ◼ ► of business for life check them out [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3276">TS</a>]
00:54:38 ◼ ► Shopify com use code 5x5 three months [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3278">TS</a>]
00:54:42 ◼ ► for free check out fig here's what I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3282">TS</a>]
00:54:46 ◼ ► would do John I would say if you don't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3286">TS</a>]
00:54:48 ◼ ► have something that you think of that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3288">TS</a>]
00:54:49 ◼ ► you want to sell today go sign up and by [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3289">TS</a>]
00:54:53 ◼ ► the time you're through the sign up [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3293">TS</a>]
00:54:54 ◼ ► you'll be building a store and you'll [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3294">TS</a>]
00:54:55 ◼ ► just figure it out you'll figure out [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3295">TS</a>]
00:54:56 ◼ ► something to sell love these guys there [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3296">TS</a>]
00:55:02 ◼ ► did you unplug and replug I did okay I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3302">TS</a>]
00:55:05 ◼ ► always do my new system so it seems like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3305">TS</a>]
00:55:09 ◼ ► finally we can talk about the topic of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3309">TS</a>]
00:55:12 ◼ ► the show well that was part of it was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3312">TS</a>]
00:55:14 ◼ ► the warning that there was this this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3314">TS</a>]
00:55:15 ◼ ► this Coplin like crisis looming and that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3315">TS</a>]
00:55:18 ◼ ► I didn't feel in 2005 that Apple had any [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3318">TS</a>]
00:55:21 ◼ ► answer to it like what the heck were [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3321">TS</a>]
00:55:23 ◼ ► they going to do right um so I had that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3323">TS</a>]
00:55:26 ◼ ► when I had to think of a title for that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3326">TS</a>]
00:55:29 ◼ ► avoiding Copeland and then I was going [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3329">TS</a>]
00:55:30 ◼ ► to put in a year which was going to say [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3330">TS</a>]
00:55:32 ◼ ► like avoiding a Copeland like situation [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3332">TS</a>]
00:55:36 ◼ ► and this was 2005 and 2007 it was a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3336">TS</a>]
00:55:40 ◼ ► round number you know because of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3340">TS</a>]
00:55:41 ◼ ► arthur c clarke angle and everything [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3341">TS</a>]
00:55:43 ◼ ► like that in part two of the series I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3343">TS</a>]
00:55:44 ◼ ► actually said that I thought 2010 was a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3344">TS</a>]
00:55:46 ◼ ► bit early but I didn't want to use a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3346">TS</a>]
00:55:48 ◼ ► date that was really far off in the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3348">TS</a>]
00:55:49 ◼ ► future because people brains just switch [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3349">TS</a>]
00:55:51 ◼ ► off when you when you hear really [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3351">TS</a>]
00:55:52 ◼ ► distant dates like if I called it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3352">TS</a>]
00:55:54 ◼ ► avoiding Copeland 2010 or 2020 or [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3354">TS</a>]
00:55:56 ◼ ► something through like 2020 that's so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3356">TS</a>]
00:55:57 ◼ ► far away who cares about that you know I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3357">TS</a>]
00:55:59 ◼ ► had to use a year that was close enough [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3359">TS</a>]
00:56:01 ◼ ► that people felt people felt that it was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3361">TS</a>]
00:56:04 ◼ ► a pressing issue so I couldn't pick [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3364">TS</a>]
00:56:06 ◼ ► something really far away all right but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3366">TS</a>]
00:56:08 ◼ ► so 2010 rolls around and I thought it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3368">TS</a>]
00:56:11 ◼ ► was time for me to revisit the topic [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3371">TS</a>]
00:56:12 ◼ ► because I wrote this series of articles [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3372">TS</a>]
00:56:14 ◼ ► that was warning about something bad [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3374">TS</a>]
00:56:15 ◼ ► that was going to happen I use 2010 in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3375">TS</a>]
00:56:17 ◼ ► the title and here we are in 2010 so how [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3377">TS</a>]
00:56:20 ◼ ► did it turn out it's time so I hold [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3380">TS</a>]
00:56:21 ◼ ► myself accountable for these you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3381">TS</a>]
00:56:23 ◼ ► these dire predictions about horrible [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3383">TS</a>]
00:56:24 ◼ ► things so so what happened well here's I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3384">TS</a>]
00:56:29 ◼ ► started out that what happened the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3389">TS</a>]
00:56:30 ◼ ► article which is in the show notes with [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3390">TS</a>]
00:56:33 ◼ ► recapping the assumptions from the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3393">TS</a>]
00:56:35 ◼ ► original series and the assumptions were [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3395">TS</a>]
00:56:36 ◼ ► just three of them one that fully [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3396">TS</a>]
00:56:39 ◼ ► eventually be an expected feature of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3399">TS</a>]
00:56:41 ◼ ► desktop application development that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3401">TS</a>]
00:56:44 ◼ ► like this is something that everyone [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3404">TS</a>]
00:56:45 ◼ ► just can expect to have when they're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3405">TS</a>]
00:56:46 ◼ ► writing desktop apps too is that the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3406">TS</a>]
00:56:48 ◼ ► rest of the energy will have that will [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3408">TS</a>]
00:56:49 ◼ ► have this by 2010 ever the rest of you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3409">TS</a>]
00:56:52 ◼ ► industry will have memory management API [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3412">TS</a>]
00:56:54 ◼ ► is in fully automatic memory management [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3414">TS</a>]
00:56:57 ◼ ► environment and the third one was that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3417">TS</a>]
00:56:59 ◼ ► existing technologies in 2005 and any [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3419">TS</a>]
00:57:01 ◼ ► sort of obvious evolutions of them [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3421">TS</a>]
00:57:03 ◼ ► didn't fit the bill for what Apple [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3423">TS</a>]
00:57:05 ◼ ► needed to fix their problem so those are [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3425">TS</a>]
00:57:08 ◼ ► my three premises ok so here's what [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3428">TS</a>]
00:57:14 ◼ ► everyone is going to have automatic [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3434">TS</a>]
00:57:16 ◼ ► memory management for the desktop OS [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3436">TS</a>]
00:57:17 ◼ ► applications I think that's pretty much [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3437">TS</a>]
00:57:22 ◼ ► platforms it's just Windows and Apple [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3442">TS</a>]
00:57:23 ◼ ► and a couple other esoteric things but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3443">TS</a>]
00:57:26 ◼ ► Microsoft I'm going to write a Windows [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3446">TS</a>]
00:57:28 ◼ ► application what should I write with [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3448">TS</a>]
00:57:29 ◼ ► they're going to say you see sharp [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3449">TS</a>]
00:57:30 ◼ ► Usenet use our new API use a new memory [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3450">TS</a>]
00:57:32 ◼ ► manage language that's how you write one [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3452">TS</a>]
00:57:33 ◼ ► to other applications so that that one [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3453">TS</a>]
00:57:35 ◼ ► panned out I and you know and I think [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3455">TS</a>]
00:57:40 ◼ ► it's in a kind of an expected feature [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3460">TS</a>]
00:57:41 ◼ ► like you're writing an application [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3461">TS</a>]
00:57:42 ◼ ► that's kind of what you expect I think [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3462">TS</a>]
00:57:44 ◼ ► when when developers new to iOS come [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3464">TS</a>]
00:57:46 ◼ ► along and they realize this in this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3466">TS</a>]
00:57:47 ◼ ► funky language like objective-c I'll try [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3467">TS</a>]
00:57:49 ◼ ► they got a retaining release their own [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3469">TS</a>]
00:57:51 ◼ ► memory a lot of them are like huh you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3471">TS</a>]
00:57:52 ◼ ► know I'm coming off years as a Java [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3472">TS</a>]
00:57:54 ◼ ► developer or whatever and this is kind [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3474">TS</a>]
00:57:56 ◼ ► of like going backwards to me but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3476">TS</a>]
00:57:57 ◼ ► whatever you know I'll keep going you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3477">TS</a>]
00:57:59 ◼ ► know developer iOS because that's where [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3479">TS</a>]
00:58:01 ◼ ► the money is or whatever but I think [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3481">TS</a>]
00:58:02 ◼ ► that expectation is in there for most [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3482">TS</a>]
00:58:04 ◼ ► developers who have who have lived [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3484">TS</a>]
00:58:06 ◼ ► elsewhere who have not been in the Apple [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3486">TS</a>]
00:58:08 ◼ ► camp forever and just accepted as the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3488">TS</a>]
00:58:10 ◼ ► way it is is that if you're writing a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3490">TS</a>]
00:58:12 ◼ ► GUI application at this point in time [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3492">TS</a>]
00:58:14 ◼ ► people just don't expect to be having to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3494">TS</a>]
00:58:16 ◼ ► deal with with memory manually they just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3496">TS</a>]
00:58:18 ◼ ► you know and I think Java is the big one [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3498">TS</a>]
00:58:22 ◼ ► developers use Java for so long and it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3502">TS</a>]
00:58:25 ◼ ► really just got everybody out of the C++ [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3505">TS</a>]
00:58:26 ◼ ► thing and the only people using C were [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3506">TS</a>]
00:58:27 ◼ ► like device driver writers and stuff and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3507">TS</a>]
00:58:30 ◼ ► then the final thing was that there were [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3510">TS</a>]
00:58:32 ◼ ► no existing technologies that Apple [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3512">TS</a>]
00:58:33 ◼ ► could sort of latch on to to get them [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3513">TS</a>]
00:58:35 ◼ ► out of their rut and I don't know if [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3515">TS</a>]
00:58:36 ◼ ► there were or not but the bottom line is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3516">TS</a>]
00:58:38 ◼ ► that here we are in 2010 and when you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3518">TS</a>]
00:58:39 ◼ ► want to write a Mac OS 10 application [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3519">TS</a>]
00:58:41 ◼ ► Apple says use Objective C and Objective [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3521">TS</a>]
00:58:43 ◼ ► C is still objective-c and they've [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3523">TS</a>]
00:58:45 ◼ ► enhanced it in many ways but it's still [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3525">TS</a>]
00:58:46 ◼ ► C based language it's still sort of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3526">TS</a>]
00:58:48 ◼ ► same as it ever was in terms of you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3528">TS</a>]
00:58:52 ◼ ► memory safety and the API that's that's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3532">TS</a>]
00:58:54 ◼ ► tailored to it but the important thing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3534">TS</a>]
00:58:57 ◼ ► that happened that it was not accounted [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3537">TS</a>]
00:58:59 ◼ ► for in 2005 series is a little thing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3539">TS</a>]
00:59:02 ◼ ► mmm 2005 maybe that was a glimmer in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3542">TS</a>]
00:59:05 ◼ ► somebody's eye and I remember I'm uh [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3545">TS</a>]
00:59:07 ◼ ► back at an old job we used to have a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3547">TS</a>]
00:59:09 ◼ ► whiteboard where we were predict what [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3549">TS</a>]
00:59:11 ◼ ► was going to be announced at witc or mac [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3551">TS</a>]
00:59:13 ◼ ► world where we'd all put our predictions [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3553">TS</a>]
00:59:15 ◼ ► then we get points for you know who got [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3555">TS</a>]
00:59:16 ◼ ► what right and I was writing iPhone on [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3556">TS</a>]
00:59:18 ◼ ► that board for years before you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3558">TS</a>]
00:59:19 ◼ ► years before Apple had a phone or even [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3559">TS</a>]
00:59:21 ◼ ► talked about a phone or whatever I just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3561">TS</a>]
00:59:23 ◼ ► wrote the word iPhone on there and every [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3563">TS</a>]
00:59:24 ◼ ► year was disappoint that there for years [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3564">TS</a>]
00:59:26 ◼ ► like nope no iPhone this year you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3566">TS</a>]
00:59:29 ◼ ► actually called it iPhone which was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3569">TS</a>]
00:59:30 ◼ ► something that nobody expected I thought [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3570">TS</a>]
00:59:31 ◼ ► was just that placeholder but but back [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3571">TS</a>]
00:59:33 ◼ ► then no one was thinking about that so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3573">TS</a>]
00:59:39 ◼ ► development developing for these little [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3579">TS</a>]
00:59:40 ◼ ► tiny dinky things has sort of pushed [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3580">TS</a>]
00:59:42 ◼ ► back the the urgency of this problem [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3582">TS</a>]
00:59:46 ◼ ► because basically the hardware regressed [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3586">TS</a>]
00:59:47 ◼ ► now we have these amazing Mac's now that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3587">TS</a>]
00:59:49 ◼ ► are just ridiculously fast enough huge [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3589">TS</a>]
00:59:52 ◼ ► amounts of memory but people are writing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3592">TS</a>]
00:59:54 ◼ ► applications for iOS devices which have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3594">TS</a>]
00:59:56 ◼ ► a fraction of the memory in a tiny [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3596">TS</a>]
01:00:00 ◼ ► you know you know the they don't want to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3600">TS</a>]
01:00:01 ◼ ► use all the CPU carbs that burns your [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3601">TS</a>]
01:00:03 ◼ ► battery too much you know so you can't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3603">TS</a>]
01:00:05 ◼ ► like flash for example if a flash ran [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3605">TS</a>]
01:00:07 ◼ ► fast enough on a desktop or on an iOS [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3607">TS</a>]
01:00:10 ◼ ► device but like I find it runs fast [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3610">TS</a>]
01:00:11 ◼ ► enough but if it burns your battery down [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3611">TS</a>]
01:00:12 ◼ ► you're like no no stop running I don't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3612">TS</a>]
01:00:14 ◼ ► care that you run fast enough you I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3614">TS</a>]
01:00:15 ◼ ► don't want flash on this device because [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3615">TS</a>]
01:00:16 ◼ ► it burns my battery down so there's all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3616">TS</a>]
01:00:17 ◼ ► these new constraints that make it so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3617">TS</a>]
01:00:19 ◼ ► that all the advantages of objective-c [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3619">TS</a>]
01:00:22 ◼ ► which people in a chat room I'm sure [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3622">TS</a>]
01:00:24 ◼ ► then talking about while we've been [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3624">TS</a>]
01:00:27 ◼ ► chatting here all the advantages of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3627">TS</a>]
01:00:28 ◼ ► objective-c are suddenly given a new [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3628">TS</a>]
01:00:29 ◼ ► lease on life Objective C is faster than [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3629">TS</a>]
01:00:31 ◼ ► these virtual machine-based language is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3631">TS</a>]
01:00:35 ◼ ► overhead there's no virtual machine [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3635">TS</a>]
01:00:36 ◼ ► running in the background you can you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3636">TS</a>]
01:00:38 ◼ ► can you know manage your memory manually [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3638">TS</a>]
01:00:40 ◼ ► down to the byte so you you know you're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3640">TS</a>]
01:00:41 ◼ ► using exactly what you want and all of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3641">TS</a>]
01:00:43 ◼ ► these advantages which became much less [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3643">TS</a>]
01:00:45 ◼ ► important on a Mac with 4 gigabytes of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3645">TS</a>]
01:00:49 ◼ ► suddenly become really important on a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3649">TS</a>]
01:00:50 ◼ ► tiny little iOS device with in the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3650">TS</a>]
01:00:52 ◼ ► beginning was it a 128 megabytes ram 512 [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3652">TS</a>]
01:00:56 ◼ ► megabytes some religious as well but to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3656">TS</a>]
01:00:59 ◼ ► the original the original iPhone I think [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3659">TS</a>]
01:01:01 ◼ ► the original iPhone was 128 128 no [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3661">TS</a>]
01:01:03 ◼ ► kidding something like that I don't know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3663">TS</a>]
01:01:05 ◼ ► what Kapiti would know but and then so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3665">TS</a>]
01:01:06 ◼ ► the CPU is like less than a gigahertz [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3666">TS</a>]
01:01:08 ◼ ► dinky little in order or cores that just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3668">TS</a>]
01:01:10 ◼ ► you know have no cpu power compared to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3670">TS</a>]
01:01:13 ◼ ► what was available on a desktop and so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3673">TS</a>]
01:01:15 ◼ ► that was like hey you know we're using [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3675">TS</a>]
01:01:16 ◼ ► reusing objective-c and guess what it's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3676">TS</a>]
01:01:18 ◼ ► awesome that's why we're faster than [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3678">TS</a>]
01:01:19 ◼ ► everybody that's why we're bettering and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3679">TS</a>]
01:01:21 ◼ ► if we had changed your memory manage [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3681">TS</a>]
01:01:22 ◼ ► language there's no way we'd be getting [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3682">TS</a>]
01:01:23 ◼ ► like c-sharp or net on here and even [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3683">TS</a>]
01:01:25 ◼ ► Android trying to bring Java onto it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3685">TS</a>]
01:01:27 ◼ ► like well we're gonna have a native SDK [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3687">TS</a>]
01:01:28 ◼ ► too if you want to do games and stuff [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3688">TS</a>]
01:01:30 ◼ ► because we know those are too slow and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3690">TS</a>]
01:01:31 ◼ ► Java so suddenly this this thing it was [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3691">TS</a>]
01:01:34 ◼ ► a problem for Apple it's got a new lease [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3694">TS</a>]
01:01:35 ◼ ► on life hey you know everyone's happy [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3695">TS</a>]
01:01:37 ◼ ► again don't worry about it guys you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3697">TS</a>]
01:01:38 ◼ ► we the subject you see turned out to be [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3698">TS</a>]
01:01:40 ◼ ► great move didn't it well I don't think [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3700">TS</a>]
01:01:42 ◼ ► I don't think that was a strategy I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3702">TS</a>]
01:01:43 ◼ ► think they had no alternative but what [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3703">TS</a>]
01:01:45 ◼ ► you know what I'm going to say is I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3705">TS</a>]
01:01:47 ◼ ► that's that's all well and good but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3707">TS</a>]
01:01:50 ◼ ► situation they or maybe they reset the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3710">TS</a>]
01:01:52 ◼ ► clock a little bit but that trend line [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3712">TS</a>]
01:01:54 ◼ ► of more abstraction over time is not [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3714">TS</a>]
01:01:56 ◼ ► going away even though there's a little [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3716">TS</a>]
01:01:57 ◼ ► bump in the road here that trend line [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3717">TS</a>]
01:01:58 ◼ ► keeps going and at this point they're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3718">TS</a>]
01:02:00 ◼ ► kind of in the same situation on the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3720">TS</a>]
01:02:02 ◼ ► mobile platform because don't all the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3722">TS</a>]
01:02:03 ◼ ► other mobile platforms such as they are [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3723">TS</a>]
01:02:05 ◼ ► offering manage memory manage language [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3725">TS</a>]
01:02:08 ◼ ► and API I could be right for Android you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3728">TS</a>]
01:02:09 ◼ ► right in their little you know Java [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3729">TS</a>]
01:02:12 ◼ ► for licensing reasons but you write your [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3732">TS</a>]
01:02:15 ◼ ► applications in Java and Windows Phone I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3735">TS</a>]
01:02:17 ◼ ► think they want you to write in c-sharp [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3737">TS</a>]
01:02:18 ◼ ► or maybe they'll let you write in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3738">TS</a>]
01:02:20 ◼ ► Silverlight even or whatever then you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3740">TS</a>]
01:02:21 ◼ ► have things like palm with the webOS [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3741">TS</a>]
01:02:22 ◼ ► where you're writing in like JavaScript [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3742">TS</a>]
01:02:24 ◼ ► and web technologies all those are [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3744">TS</a>]
01:02:26 ◼ ► memory manage language and API so here's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3746">TS</a>]
01:02:27 ◼ ► apple without a memory manage language [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3747">TS</a>]
01:02:29 ◼ ► an API on the mobile platform and right [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3749">TS</a>]
01:02:32 ◼ ► now I think it's still an advantage for [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3752">TS</a>]
01:02:34 ◼ ► them because their devices are faster [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3754">TS</a>]
01:02:35 ◼ ► better have better battery life and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3755">TS</a>]
01:02:36 ◼ ► everything like that but everyone else [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3756">TS</a>]
01:02:38 ◼ ► has not it chosen to go with that like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3758">TS</a>]
01:02:40 ◼ ► they have some sort of native SDK where [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3760">TS</a>]
01:02:42 ◼ ► you can do games and stuff but they're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3762">TS</a>]
01:02:43 ◼ ► trying to say no if you're right if [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3763">TS</a>]
01:02:44 ◼ ► you're writing a GUI application for our [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3764">TS</a>]
01:02:48 ◼ ► language used as memory manage API and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3768">TS</a>]
01:02:50 ◼ ► is that why they're slower now maybe but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3770">TS</a>]
01:02:53 ◼ ► you know sometimes being slower pays off [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3773">TS</a>]
01:02:56 ◼ ► in the long run like Mac OS 10 in courts [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3776">TS</a>]
01:02:59 ◼ ► where their their display layer was much [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3779">TS</a>]
01:03:00 ◼ ► lower than everybody else especially in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3780">TS</a>]
01:03:01 ◼ ► the early days but it pays off when the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3781">TS</a>]
01:03:03 ◼ ► hardware finally caught up to it now [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3783">TS</a>]
01:03:04 ◼ ► they don't have to do it through this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3784">TS</a>]
01:03:05 ◼ ► painful revision of the display layer [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3785">TS</a>]
01:03:07 ◼ ► like Microsoft has been going through [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3787">TS</a>]
01:03:09 ◼ ► replacing it with whatever the heck [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3789">TS</a>]
01:03:10 ◼ ► their acronyms is that replaces GDI so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3790">TS</a>]
01:03:13 ◼ ► when FX I know maybe some of the chat [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3793">TS</a>]
01:03:15 ◼ ► room knows but this if they're having a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3795">TS</a>]
01:03:18 ◼ ► long painful process of changing their [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3798">TS</a>]
01:03:19 ◼ ► display layer from the old version to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3799">TS</a>]
01:03:21 ◼ ► the new version whereas Apple shipped [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3801">TS</a>]
01:03:23 ◼ ► Mac OS 10 with a sort of next-generation [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3803">TS</a>]
01:03:24 ◼ ► display layer from day one it was slow [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3804">TS</a>]
01:03:26 ◼ ► as molasses but eventually the Arbour [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3806">TS</a>]
01:03:29 ◼ ► caught up and now Apple sitting pretty [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3809">TS</a>]
01:03:30 ◼ ► and Microsoft still struggling the chat [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3810">TS</a>]
01:03:32 ◼ ► room says WPF will windows presentation [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3812">TS</a>]
01:03:34 ◼ ► foundation I think that's a multiple use [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3814">TS</a>]
01:03:37 ◼ ► acronym where it applies to both the API [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3817">TS</a>]
01:03:38 ◼ ► and the and the API layer and the driver [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3818">TS</a>]
01:03:42 ◼ ► layer really right so I think this is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3822">TS</a>]
01:03:47 ◼ ► still a problem and that's what more or [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3827">TS</a>]
01:03:49 ◼ ► less what I said in the revisit article [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3829">TS</a>]
01:03:51 ◼ ► is that okay so you you delayed this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3831">TS</a>]
01:03:53 ◼ ► problem somewhat but the scary thing is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3833">TS</a>]
01:03:56 ◼ ► that in 2010 I looked again at what what [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3836">TS</a>]
01:03:58 ◼ ► are the alternatives what are you going [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3838">TS</a>]
01:04:00 ◼ ► to do about this and there are don't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3840">TS</a>]
01:04:02 ◼ ► seem to be many more choices the only [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3842">TS</a>]
01:04:04 ◼ ► thing I would say about Apple's choices [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3844">TS</a>]
01:04:06 ◼ ► now is that Apple has proven itself to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3846">TS</a>]
01:04:09 ◼ ► be competent enough to have more options [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3849">TS</a>]
01:04:12 ◼ ► like it's we've seen where it can take a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3852">TS</a>]
01:04:15 ◼ ► technology from somebody else like KHTML [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3855">TS</a>]
01:04:17 ◼ ► from the KDE initiative and make WebKit [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3857">TS</a>]
01:04:21 ◼ ► out of it and just saying oh we're going [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3861">TS</a>]
01:04:22 ◼ ► to own this from now on we're going to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3862">TS</a>]
01:04:23 ◼ ► drive it we're going to fork your thing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3863">TS</a>]
01:04:24 ◼ ► I don't know if they consider it a fork [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3864">TS</a>]
01:04:26 ◼ ► and we're going to be the driving force [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3866">TS</a>]
01:04:28 ◼ ► behind development from it from now on [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3868">TS</a>]
01:04:30 ◼ ► and we're going to build it into a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3870">TS</a>]
01:04:31 ◼ ► world-class browser engine called WebKit [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3871">TS</a>]
01:04:33 ◼ ► we're going to give it a name we're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3873">TS</a>]
01:04:35 ◼ ► going to rebrand it we're still going to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3875">TS</a>]
01:04:36 ◼ ► be open source but still share with you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3876">TS</a>]
01:04:37 ◼ ► or whatever but we're not waiting for [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3877">TS</a>]
01:04:39 ◼ ► you we're not waiting for KDE people you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3879">TS</a>]
01:04:40 ◼ ► know oh is it okay if we put this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3880">TS</a>]
01:04:41 ◼ ► pageant no we're just plowing ahead as [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3881">TS</a>]
01:04:43 ◼ ► fast as we possibly can and we're going [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3883">TS</a>]
01:04:45 ◼ ► to do our thing and they decided to do [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3885">TS</a>]
01:04:47 ◼ ► with their compiler too they said well [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3887">TS</a>]
01:04:48 ◼ ► GCC you know it's nice that we had that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3888">TS</a>]
01:04:51 ◼ ► for all those years but you guys aren't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3891">TS</a>]
01:04:53 ◼ ► as receptive for the kind of changes [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3893">TS</a>]
01:04:55 ◼ ► that Apple needs and so we're just going [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3895">TS</a>]
01:04:57 ◼ ► to you know say thanks but no thanks [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3897">TS</a>]
01:04:58 ◼ ► we're gonna make our own compiler will [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3898">TS</a>]
01:05:00 ◼ ► make our compiler you know command-line [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3900">TS</a>]
01:05:01 ◼ ► compatible the GCC so we can build all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3901">TS</a>]
01:05:03 ◼ ► our old programs with it but we're just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3903">TS</a>]
01:05:04 ◼ ► going to go off in our own direction so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3904">TS</a>]
01:05:06 ◼ ► they made you know they took the LLVM [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3906">TS</a>]
01:05:07 ◼ ► guys and made a new compiler based on [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3907">TS</a>]
01:05:09 ◼ ► that and they're you know it's a long [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3909">TS</a>]
01:05:12 ◼ ► difficult process to do that but all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3912">TS</a>]
01:05:14 ◼ ► these technologies have to do with C [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3914">TS</a>]
01:05:16 ◼ ► based things and not memory manage [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3916">TS</a>]
01:05:18 ◼ ► languages but it does show that they can [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3918">TS</a>]
01:05:19 ◼ ► take someone else's project and just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3919">TS</a>]
01:05:21 ◼ ► take it over a hundred percent say we're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3921">TS</a>]
01:05:23 ◼ ► gonna we can hey we got it from here so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3923">TS</a>]
01:05:25 ◼ ► now maybe they have more options in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3925">TS</a>]
01:05:28 ◼ ► terms of all right so can Apple take [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3928">TS</a>]
01:05:31 ◼ ► c-sharp and just say thanks Microsoft [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3931">TS</a>]
01:05:32 ◼ ► but we're gonna go on our own direction [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3932">TS</a>]
01:05:34 ◼ ► with this thanks for giving us a good [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3934">TS</a>]
01:05:35 ◼ ► start you figured out a lot of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3935">TS</a>]
01:05:36 ◼ ► problems we're just going to make a new [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3936">TS</a>]
01:05:37 ◼ ► language and called you know Apple P [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3937">TS</a>]
01:05:39 ◼ ► sharp or something like that right and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3939">TS</a>]
01:05:41 ◼ ► and make our own language alright so but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3941">TS</a>]
01:05:44 ◼ ► the language is just one part of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3944">TS</a>]
01:05:46 ◼ ► equation I think if they make a new [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3946">TS</a>]
01:05:47 ◼ ► language it doesn't buy you anything you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3947">TS</a>]
01:05:48 ◼ ► need a new API a new API that's built [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3948">TS</a>]
01:05:51 ◼ ► for that language right so that your [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3951">TS</a>]
01:05:53 ◼ ► programs become shorter that you need [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3953">TS</a>]
01:05:55 ◼ ► fewer API calls fewer instructions that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3955">TS</a>]
01:05:57 ◼ ► you take advantage of all the native [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3957">TS</a>]
01:05:58 ◼ ► aspects of this fancy new high-level [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3958">TS</a>]
01:06:01 ◼ ► programmers lives easier and and the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3961">TS</a>]
01:06:04 ◼ ► final difficult bit is even after you've [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3964">TS</a>]
01:06:07 ◼ ► done those two things even if you pick a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3967">TS</a>]
01:06:09 ◼ ► language is the most awesome language [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3969">TS</a>]
01:06:11 ◼ ► and you you know you own it you control [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3971">TS</a>]
01:06:13 ◼ ► and you made it so great that just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3973">TS</a>]
01:06:14 ◼ ► people can't even believe how awesome it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3974">TS</a>]
01:06:15 ◼ ► is you make a new API built on like wow [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3975">TS</a>]
01:06:17 ◼ ► I could write a program in this let this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3977">TS</a>]
01:06:19 ◼ ► API there's like a hundred times shorter [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3979">TS</a>]
01:06:21 ◼ ► than the cocoa application because all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3981">TS</a>]
01:06:23 ◼ ► this stuff that you had to do in cocoa [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3983">TS</a>]
01:06:24 ◼ ► is just not it's just noise you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3984">TS</a>]
01:06:28 ◼ ► creating those NS dictionaries and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3988">TS</a>]
01:06:30 ◼ ► making any string objects and like no [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3990">TS</a>]
01:06:32 ◼ ► it's all of it doesn't language you get [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3992">TS</a>]
01:06:33 ◼ ► native strings we got native collection [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3993">TS</a>]
01:06:35 ◼ ► classes we got regular expressions built [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3995">TS</a>]
01:06:36 ◼ ► into the syntax we just got everything [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/3996">TS</a>]
01:06:40 ◼ ► making objects and classes everything is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4000">TS</a>]
01:06:41 ◼ ► great then you need to say okay well [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4001">TS</a>]
01:06:45 ◼ ► you've got these great things but you've [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4005">TS</a>]
01:06:46 ◼ ► got a bunch of developers who are [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4006">TS</a>]
01:06:47 ◼ ► writing objective-c cocoa apps who know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4007">TS</a>]
01:06:49 ◼ ► Objective C really well and like cocoa [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4009">TS</a>]
01:06:50 ◼ ► how you can get them to say okay well we [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4010">TS</a>]
01:06:54 ◼ ► would like you to write your programs in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4014">TS</a>]
01:06:57 ◼ ► different API that you've never heard of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4017">TS</a>]
01:06:59 ◼ ► and you can't really port your old [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4019">TS</a>]
01:07:01 ◼ ► programs to it so we really kind of like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4021">TS</a>]
01:07:03 ◼ ► you just like rewrite them so maybe for [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4023">TS</a>]
01:07:05 ◼ ► the next version just do it in this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4025">TS</a>]
01:07:07 ◼ ► different language and start over from [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4027">TS</a>]
01:07:08 ◼ ► scratch it is really really difficult to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4028">TS</a>]
01:07:10 ◼ ► transition developers and to keep all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4030">TS</a>]
01:07:12 ◼ ► your existing applications running and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4032">TS</a>]
01:07:14 ◼ ► keep everybody happy just ask Microsoft [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4034">TS</a>]
01:07:15 ◼ ► Microsoft is spending I think it's got [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4035">TS</a>]
01:07:17 ◼ ► to be at least a decade at this point [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4037">TS</a>]
01:07:18 ◼ ► they built this infrastructure they're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4038">TS</a>]
01:07:21 ◼ ► saying okay please people stop writing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4041">TS</a>]
01:07:23 ◼ ► to the win32 API stop writing MFC [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4043">TS</a>]
01:07:25 ◼ ► application to stop writing whatever you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4045">TS</a>]
01:07:27 ◼ ► know please use our new API is they're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4047">TS</a>]
01:07:29 ◼ ► you should use them and then they would [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4049">TS</a>]
01:07:31 ◼ ► say but of course well when we ship [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4051">TS</a>]
01:07:32 ◼ ► Windows or Windows applications are [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4052">TS</a>]
01:07:34 ◼ ► still going to be written with the old [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4054">TS</a>]
01:07:35 ◼ ► api's but no you should use them because [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4055">TS</a>]
01:07:37 ◼ ► they'll be really good for you we can't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4057">TS</a>]
01:07:39 ◼ ► write into an Explorer using them [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4059">TS</a>]
01:07:40 ◼ ► because you know they just wouldn't work [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4060">TS</a>]
01:07:41 ◼ ► and yet Windows Explorer won't be [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4061">TS</a>]
01:07:43 ◼ ► written using them and ya know none of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4063">TS</a>]
01:07:44 ◼ ► the applications in the operating system [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4064">TS</a>]
01:07:45 ◼ ► were written using them but now you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4065">TS</a>]
01:07:46 ◼ ► should use them because they're really [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4066">TS</a>]
01:07:48 ◼ ► great and you don't have to worry about [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4068">TS</a>]
01:07:49 ◼ ► memory and it's just been a terrible [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4069">TS</a>]
01:07:51 ◼ ► terrible slog to try to get their [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4071">TS</a>]
01:07:53 ◼ ► developers onto this new API which at [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4073">TS</a>]
01:07:55 ◼ ► this point is like pretty darn mature [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4075">TS</a>]
01:07:57 ◼ ► and has some great new API is that have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4077">TS</a>]
01:07:59 ◼ ► advantages yeah over over those other [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4079">TS</a>]
01:08:02 ◼ ► things with it like yeah but I have a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4082">TS</a>]
01:08:03 ◼ ► working application it uses the old API [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4083">TS</a>]
01:08:05 ◼ ► and as long as you don't make the old [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4085">TS</a>]
01:08:06 ◼ ► API stop I'm going to keep using that so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4086">TS</a>]
01:08:09 ◼ ► I think Apple has gotten a little [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4089">TS</a>]
01:08:12 ◼ ► reprieve here but they the problem still [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4092">TS</a>]
01:08:17 ◼ ► exists and this is where people start [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4097">TS</a>]
01:08:20 ◼ ► flipping out if they're not already [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4100">TS</a>]
01:08:21 ◼ ► flipping out in the chatroom is that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4101">TS</a>]
01:08:23 ◼ ► they're gonna there we will swear up and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4103">TS</a>]
01:08:24 ◼ ► down that what I'm saying is nonsense [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4104">TS</a>]
01:08:27 ◼ ► that Objective C is perfectly fine in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4107">TS</a>]
01:08:29 ◼ ► fact it's awesome in fact objective-c is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4109">TS</a>]
01:08:30 ◼ ► the reason why writing for a Mac OS 10 [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4110">TS</a>]
01:08:33 ◼ ► platforms or that the Koki API is are [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4113">TS</a>]
01:08:36 ◼ ► objective-c all those faults you talked [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4116">TS</a>]
01:08:39 ◼ ► about they seem theoretically important [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4119">TS</a>]
01:08:41 ◼ ► but really in practice they're they're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4121">TS</a>]
01:08:44 ◼ ► you know they're not a problem if our [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4124">TS</a>]
01:08:45 ◼ ► experience Objective C developers and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4125">TS</a>]
01:08:47 ◼ ► Apple has been revising the languages [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4127">TS</a>]
01:08:48 ◼ ► and they added blocks down at the sea [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4128">TS</a>]
01:08:50 ◼ ► level and everything and they added you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4130">TS</a>]
01:08:51 ◼ ► know synthesized properties and all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4131">TS</a>]
01:08:55 ◼ ► progressing we've got a lot of great [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4135">TS</a>]
01:08:56 ◼ ► features that you're talking about those [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4136">TS</a>]
01:08:57 ◼ ► high level angers we don't need it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4137">TS</a>]
01:08:59 ◼ ► really it's kind of like that Winston [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4139">TS</a>]
01:09:02 ◼ ► Churchill joke where the woman I forget [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4142">TS</a>]
01:09:04 ◼ ► that I can scrub this joke but he talks [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4144">TS</a>]
01:09:06 ◼ ► some woman and offers her money for sex [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4146">TS</a>]
01:09:09 ◼ ► and and she refuses oh you know the show [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4149">TS</a>]
01:09:13 ◼ ► saved me for myself I don't I don't you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4153">TS</a>]
01:09:15 ◼ ► don't know this joke no song at Rome [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4155">TS</a>]
01:09:18 ◼ ► the punch line is that madam I've [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4158">TS</a>]
01:09:21 ◼ ► already we've already established what [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4161">TS</a>]
01:09:22 ◼ ► you are now we're just haggling over [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4162">TS</a>]
01:09:23 ◼ ► price so go google that and find a joke [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4163">TS</a>]
01:09:26 ◼ ► part of it you can make your own joke [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4166">TS</a>]
01:09:28 ◼ ► someone says that George Bernard Shaw [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4168">TS</a>]
01:09:30 ◼ ► and not Churchill that's probably [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4170">TS</a>]
01:09:31 ◼ ► correct um but at any rate if you agree [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4171">TS</a>]
01:09:35 ◼ ► with the premise that we talked about [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4175">TS</a>]
01:09:36 ◼ ► earlier about abstraction increasing all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4176">TS</a>]
01:09:38 ◼ ► we're arguing about here is a timeline [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4178">TS</a>]
01:09:39 ◼ ► no one is arguing that objective-c is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4179">TS</a>]
01:09:42 ◼ ► going to be it forever or at least I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4182">TS</a>]
01:09:44 ◼ ► don't think any sane people because you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4184">TS</a>]
01:09:46 ◼ ► can't especially in the computer so you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4186">TS</a>]
01:09:47 ◼ ► can't say Objective C will last forever [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4187">TS</a>]
01:09:49 ◼ ► our grandchildren's grandchildren will [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4189">TS</a>]
01:09:51 ◼ ► be doing writing an objective-c there [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4191">TS</a>]
01:09:53 ◼ ► will be dereferencing pointers well they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4193">TS</a>]
01:09:56 ◼ ► will not it's just a matter of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4196">TS</a>]
01:09:57 ◼ ► timeline and this is the type of thing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4197">TS</a>]
01:09:59 ◼ ► you can't just decide well looks like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4199">TS</a>]
01:10:01 ◼ ► Objective C is kind of spent alone we [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4201">TS</a>]
01:10:05 ◼ ► literally decades or more to build up a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4205">TS</a>]
01:10:08 ◼ ► foundation you can transition to and and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4208">TS</a>]
01:10:11 ◼ ► you can't cheat by making bridges and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4211">TS</a>]
01:10:13 ◼ ► you can't cheat by keeping the old ABI [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4213">TS</a>]
01:10:14 ◼ ► I'm putting a new language you just have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4214">TS</a>]
01:10:16 ◼ ► to put in the work to figure out what is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4216">TS</a>]
01:10:18 ◼ ► the next generation of developing for [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4218">TS</a>]
01:10:20 ◼ ► our platform going to be like and if [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4220">TS</a>]
01:10:22 ◼ ► Apple has some secret answer that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4222">TS</a>]
01:10:23 ◼ ► they're that they're working on inside [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4223">TS</a>]
01:10:25 ◼ ► the the corporation I don't know about [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4225">TS</a>]
01:10:27 ◼ ► it I didn't know about in 2005 I still [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4227">TS</a>]
01:10:29 ◼ ► don't know about it maybe they have a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4229">TS</a>]
01:10:30 ◼ ► skunkworks project that's been going on [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4230">TS</a>]
01:10:31 ◼ ► for 5-10 years that I don't know about [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4231">TS</a>]
01:10:33 ◼ ► but I seriously doubt it and I'm really [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4233">TS</a>]
01:10:36 ◼ ► concerned that they're not going to have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4236">TS</a>]
01:10:38 ◼ ► an answer and I'm concerned because all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4238">TS</a>]
01:10:39 ◼ ► their competitors have you already paid [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4239">TS</a>]
01:10:42 ◼ ► this price or are starting from scratch [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4242">TS</a>]
01:10:43 ◼ ► like palm with webOS and don't have to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4243">TS</a>]
01:10:45 ◼ ► deal with this transition you know all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4245">TS</a>]
01:10:47 ◼ ► their competitors are starting at a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4247">TS</a>]
01:10:49 ◼ ► higher level of abstraction in them and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4249">TS</a>]
01:10:51 ◼ ► Apple has tremendous advantages over [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4251">TS</a>]
01:10:53 ◼ ► them right now but if they don't you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4253">TS</a>]
01:10:55 ◼ ► know if they do completely squash [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4255">TS</a>]
01:10:57 ◼ ► everybody else then everyone for like a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4257">TS</a>]
01:10:58 ◼ ► Dark Age of objective-c where we can off [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4258">TS</a>]
01:11:00 ◼ ► this friggin language to a higher-level [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4260">TS</a>]
01:11:02 ◼ ► language but if they don't squash [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4262">TS</a>]
01:11:03 ◼ ► everybody else eventually they're going [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4263">TS</a>]
01:11:05 ◼ ► to be in that Coppola Mike situation [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4265">TS</a>]
01:11:08 ◼ ► developers like ya iOS I was making a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4268">TS</a>]
01:11:11 ◼ ► lot of money on that back and you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4271">TS</a>]
01:11:12 ◼ ► the first decade of the 2000s but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4272">TS</a>]
01:11:14 ◼ ► nowadays just I can't deal with this [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4274">TS</a>]
01:11:16 ◼ ► this whole memory thing is just so much [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4276">TS</a>]
01:11:17 ◼ ► easier to write you know programs in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4277">TS</a>]
01:11:20 ◼ ► these other languages and api's I have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4280">TS</a>]
01:11:21 ◼ ► to ride half as many lines of code then [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4281">TS</a>]
01:11:23 ◼ ► I have to deal with all those argument [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4283">TS</a>]
01:11:24 ◼ ► marshalling and all this ridiculous you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4284">TS</a>]
01:11:25 ◼ ► know strange objective-c stuff is just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4285">TS</a>]
01:11:28 ◼ ► BS these days I shouldn't have to deal [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4288">TS</a>]
01:11:30 ◼ ► with that uh and that's what I'm worried [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4290">TS</a>]
01:11:32 ◼ ► about with it with the Copeland 2010 [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4292">TS</a>]
01:11:34 ◼ ► thing apparently I was way off on a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4294">TS</a>]
01:11:36 ◼ ► timeline I didn't see iOS coming I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4296">TS</a>]
01:11:37 ◼ ► didn't see how that was going to give [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4297">TS</a>]
01:11:38 ◼ ► them a new lease on life but I think [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4298">TS</a>]
01:11:39 ◼ ► it's the problem and no one I have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4299">TS</a>]
01:11:41 ◼ ► talked to has said here's what Apple's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4301">TS</a>]
01:11:46 ◼ ► going to do to get out of it they either [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4306">TS</a>]
01:11:47 ◼ ► say this is not a problem or I'll be [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4307">TS</a>]
01:11:48 ◼ ► retired by the time it's a problem so I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4308">TS</a>]
01:11:50 ◼ ► don't care which is a valid argument you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4310">TS</a>]
01:11:51 ◼ ► know say hey I'll be retired on an [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4311">TS</a>]
01:11:53 ◼ ► island I don't really care what Apple [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4313">TS</a>]
01:11:54 ◼ ► does it's not my problem and same thing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4314">TS</a>]
01:11:56 ◼ ► for the people who are running Apple [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4316">TS</a>]
01:11:58 ◼ ► they could say that's not going to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4318">TS</a>]
01:11:59 ◼ ► happen on my watch because I'll be [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4319">TS</a>]
01:12:01 ◼ ► retired by then but if anyone is looking [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4321">TS</a>]
01:12:03 ◼ ► out for the long-term health of the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4323">TS</a>]
01:12:05 ◼ ► company in the flat form I think you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4325">TS</a>]
01:12:07 ◼ ► have to have an answer to this and 2005 [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4327">TS</a>]
01:12:10 ◼ ► maybe it was too early to be worrying [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4330">TS</a>]
01:12:11 ◼ ► about it but I would say now in 2010 [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4331">TS</a>]
01:12:13 ◼ ► despite this iOS diversion someone needs [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4333">TS</a>]
01:12:16 ◼ ► to be thinking about this and I have no [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4336">TS</a>]
01:12:18 ◼ ► idea what they're going to do and I have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4338">TS</a>]
01:12:19 ◼ ► never heard from anybody something that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4339">TS</a>]
01:12:22 ◼ ► they're going to do that has convinced [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4342">TS</a>]
01:12:23 ◼ ► me that they're all set um so that's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4343">TS</a>]
01:12:27 ◼ ► about it I had a whole other section [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4347">TS</a>]
01:12:28 ◼ ► here that we just simply do not have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4348">TS</a>]
01:12:30 ◼ ► time for I'm I guess I'll make it into a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4350">TS</a>]
01:12:31 ◼ ► whole other show topic but then that's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4351">TS</a>]
01:12:34 ◼ ► programming languages oh so you don't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4354">TS</a>]
01:12:36 ◼ ► even want to go into Perl here that's I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4356">TS</a>]
01:12:41 ◼ ► programming language this is I always [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4361">TS</a>]
01:12:44 ◼ ► start my my blog ideas with a title [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4364">TS</a>]
01:12:46 ◼ ► because once I have a title that I like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4366">TS</a>]
01:12:49 ◼ ► I will eventually write something about [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4369">TS</a>]
01:12:50 ◼ ► it this is my longest-running title ever [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4370">TS</a>]
01:12:52 ◼ ► that you have or have not written about [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4372">TS</a>]
01:12:54 ◼ ► that I have not written about are you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4374">TS</a>]
01:12:57 ◼ ► I should just cuz I'm never gonna [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4377">TS</a>]
01:12:58 ◼ ► freakin write about it this is kind of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4378">TS</a>]
01:13:01 ◼ ► the imarco thing where I don't want to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4381">TS</a>]
01:13:02 ◼ ► talk about programming languages on like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4382">TS</a>]
01:13:03 ◼ ► our technical article because people get [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4383">TS</a>]
01:13:06 ◼ ► too antsy about it and it's not my usual [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4386">TS</a>]
01:13:07 ◼ ► thing but the title which no one should [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4387">TS</a>]
01:13:09 ◼ ► steal because I swear I'll write about [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4389">TS</a>]
01:13:10 ◼ ► this in at least the next decade or two [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4390">TS</a>]
01:13:12 ◼ ► is General Dynamics which is a pun that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4392">TS</a>]
01:13:14 ◼ ► normally even get unless you know about [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4394">TS</a>]
01:13:15 ◼ ► like defense contractors from the 80s [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4395">TS</a>]
01:13:17 ◼ ► but anyway General Dynamics isn't is the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4397">TS</a>]
01:13:20 ◼ ► title and it's about dynamic languages [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4400">TS</a>]
01:13:22 ◼ ► and the sad situation of therein but I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4402">TS</a>]
01:13:24 ◼ ► think that should be a separate show top [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4404">TS</a>]
01:13:26 ◼ ► okay wait we can do that can do that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4406">TS</a>]
01:13:31 ◼ ► someone's got a General Dynamics made [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4411">TS</a>]
01:13:34 ◼ ► the f16 that's right who doesn't know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4414">TS</a>]
01:13:35 ◼ ► General Dynamics children of the 80s [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4415">TS</a>]
01:13:37 ◼ ► fans of jet fighter planes and defense [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4417">TS</a>]
01:13:40 ◼ ► contractors do you ever make models when [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4420">TS</a>]
01:13:42 ◼ ► you were a little kid I did you ever do [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4422">TS</a>]
01:13:45 ◼ ► an f-16 and f-18 all Ryu's to be able to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4425">TS</a>]
01:13:50 ◼ ► aircraft from my lifetime or several [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4430">TS</a>]
01:13:53 ◼ ► decades prior why does that not surprise [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4433">TS</a>]
01:13:54 ◼ ► me that models of them all in my room I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4434">TS</a>]
01:13:57 ◼ ► wish actually do a whole show on the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4437">TS</a>]
01:14:00 ◼ ► that is a great gosh I can't wait for [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4440">TS</a>]
01:14:02 ◼ ► that one yeah that's a great example of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4442">TS</a>]
01:14:04 ◼ ► it it's a great analogy to Apple and the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4444">TS</a>]
01:14:06 ◼ ► technology market now here come the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4446">TS</a>]
01:14:09 ◼ ► emails from the people who say you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4449">TS</a>]
01:14:10 ◼ ► should totally do a show you know or the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4450">TS</a>]
01:14:14 ◼ ► Osprey a couple of the military wonks [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4454">TS</a>]
01:14:16 ◼ ► print out the Osprey that gets more into [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4456">TS</a>]
01:14:18 ◼ ► like that's more show about government [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4458">TS</a>]
01:14:19 ◼ ► waste I think then about military here [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4459">TS</a>]
01:14:22 ◼ ► so let's wrap this up with it something [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4462">TS</a>]
01:14:25 ◼ ► positive for change why would we do that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4465">TS</a>]
01:14:28 ◼ ► because I think I think there are a lot [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4468">TS</a>]
01:14:30 ◼ ► of people out there now here's my take [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4470">TS</a>]
01:14:34 ◼ ► I could never get used to the syntax of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4474">TS</a>]
01:14:37 ◼ ► it I just don't like it I don't like the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4477">TS</a>]
01:14:39 ◼ ► way it looks and this is weird this is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4479">TS</a>]
01:14:41 ◼ ► really weird because say well who cares [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4481">TS</a>]
01:14:44 ◼ ► how it looks it's how does it feel any [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4484">TS</a>]
01:14:45 ◼ ► program etre you didn't give it enough [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4485">TS</a>]
01:14:47 ◼ ► time or you didn't give it a chance well [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4487">TS</a>]
01:14:48 ◼ ► I did I've written a bunch of absent [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4488">TS</a>]
01:14:51 ◼ ► objective-c and I you know you just at [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4491">TS</a>]
01:14:55 ◼ ► least in my case you know I'm the kind [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4495">TS</a>]
01:14:57 ◼ ► of person where if I don't like the the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4497">TS</a>]
01:15:01 ◼ ► look of the IDE or I don't like the text [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4501">TS</a>]
01:15:03 ◼ ► editing window or I don't like the color [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4503">TS</a>]
01:15:05 ◼ ► of the terminal and the fonts I I won't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4505">TS</a>]
01:15:07 ◼ ► be able to do anything I'll have to get [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4507">TS</a>]
01:15:12 ◼ ► connection I'm not will not explain it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4512">TS</a>]
01:15:14 ◼ ► but people knit in the chat room Joint [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4514">TS</a>]
01:15:16 ◼ ► Strike Fighter not liking how something [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4516">TS</a>]
01:15:19 ◼ ► looks yes I will add that to the show [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4519">TS</a>]
01:15:21 ◼ ► non-school do it and follow up okay so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4521">TS</a>]
01:15:24 ◼ ► in that situation for me that the way [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4524">TS</a>]
01:15:26 ◼ ► something looks the way the interaction [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4526">TS</a>]
01:15:31 ◼ ► although I certainly understand the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4531">TS</a>]
01:15:34 ◼ ► programming language like Perl it's it's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4534">TS</a>]
01:15:37 ◼ ► not something that's enjoyable to read I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4537">TS</a>]
01:15:38 ◼ ► was just sitting down with with the guru [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4538">TS</a>]
01:15:40 ◼ ► the guy who is the biggest mentor in my [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4540">TS</a>]
01:15:44 ◼ ► programming life I was just having lunch [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4544">TS</a>]
01:15:48 ◼ ► with him it's like our goodbye lunch [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4548">TS</a>]
01:15:50 ◼ ► because I won't see him again because [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4550">TS</a>]
01:15:51 ◼ ► we're moving to Austin I'll probably [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4551">TS</a>]
01:15:53 ◼ ► I mean Nevers a long time this person [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4553">TS</a>]
01:15:54 ◼ ► have a name or is it like secret that's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4554">TS</a>]
01:15:56 ◼ ► why we have to calm the goo he's known [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4556">TS</a>]
01:15:57 ◼ ► as the Guru and to you or worldwide as [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4557">TS</a>]
01:16:03 ◼ ► if that's either of those do things have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4563">TS</a>]
01:16:05 ◼ ► a different meaning and both alright [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4565">TS</a>]
01:16:08 ◼ ► I mean worldwide the the only I'm I am [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4568">TS</a>]
01:16:12 ◼ ► the only way that people would know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4572">TS</a>]
01:16:14 ◼ ► so therefore worldwide known as the Guru [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4574">TS</a>]
01:16:17 ◼ ► I thought he was one of the very first [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4577">TS</a>]
01:16:19 ◼ ► picture of him that I'll add to the show [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4579">TS</a>]
01:16:21 ◼ ► notes there's a picture of him in my [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4581">TS</a>]
01:16:29 ◼ ► information Tom to Ed so much so we were [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4589">TS</a>]
01:16:31 ◼ ► having lunch at Chipotle and we were we [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4591">TS</a>]
01:16:35 ◼ ► were talking about something sort of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4595">TS</a>]
01:16:37 ◼ ► sideways related to this and you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4597">TS</a>]
01:16:40 ◼ ► for him he excels at all programming [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4600">TS</a>]
01:16:45 ◼ ► languages at you know he operates it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4605">TS</a>]
01:16:47 ◼ ► very much a genius level and for him [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4607">TS</a>]
01:16:50 ◼ ► it's simply it's more like a different [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4610">TS</a>]
01:16:52 ◼ ► kind of muscle memory he types one way [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4612">TS</a>]
01:16:54 ◼ ► in one app another programming language [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4614">TS</a>]
01:16:57 ◼ ► rather a different way in another it's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4617">TS</a>]
01:16:59 ◼ ► just the minor differences just okay [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4619">TS</a>]
01:17:01 ◼ ► that's how I do it here I I can't I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4621">TS</a>]
01:17:03 ◼ ► don't get into I like I want to like the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4623">TS</a>]
01:17:06 ◼ ► language that I'm using visually as well [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4626">TS</a>]
01:17:08 ◼ ► I want to like the way it looks on the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4628">TS</a>]
01:17:10 ◼ ► screen I want to enjoy reading it is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4630">TS</a>]
01:17:12 ◼ ► that weird maybe so for me when I look [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4632">TS</a>]
01:17:15 ◼ ► at a language like Objective C my first [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4635">TS</a>]
01:17:17 ◼ ► response is that it's ugly and they'll [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4637">TS</a>]
01:17:23 ◼ ► is that weird that's not weird I mean [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4643">TS</a>]
01:17:26 ◼ ► that that also explains very neatly why [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4646">TS</a>]
01:17:29 ◼ ► you like Ruby yeah that's the main [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4649">TS</a>]
01:17:32 ◼ ► reason I like Ruby this is definitely an [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4652">TS</a>]
01:17:34 ◼ ► aesthetic appeal that I I don't I I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4654">TS</a>]
01:17:38 ◼ ► actually might like the language or not [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4658">TS</a>]
01:17:40 ◼ ► I admire people who can deal with it I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4660">TS</a>]
01:17:43 ◼ ► think they're they should be applauded [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4663">TS</a>]
01:17:46 ◼ ► ugliest objective-c because its if you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4666">TS</a>]
01:17:49 ◼ ► if you're willing to do that if you're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4669">TS</a>]
01:17:50 ◼ ► willing to to set aside everything that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4670">TS</a>]
01:17:53 ◼ ► that your heart and and soul will tell [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4673">TS</a>]
01:17:56 ◼ ► you it's a very powerful language you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4676">TS</a>]
01:17:58 ◼ ► could do amazing things like make a fart [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4678">TS</a>]
01:18:00 ◼ ► AB for you know million dollars among [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4680">TS</a>]
01:18:04 ◼ ► other really good apps I mean you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4684">TS</a>]
01:18:05 ◼ ► obviously the the amazing apps that are [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4685">TS</a>]
01:18:08 ◼ ► out there I think John are a testament [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4688">TS</a>]
01:18:10 ◼ ► to what can be done with Objective C [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4690">TS</a>]
01:18:12 ◼ ► first so forget the syntax part forget [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4692">TS</a>]
01:18:15 ◼ ► that it's a a rough language to to get [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4695">TS</a>]
01:18:17 ◼ ► into if you can get over that hurdle [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4697">TS</a>]
01:18:20 ◼ ► which admittedly I would never quite did [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4700">TS</a>]
01:18:23 ◼ ► if you can do that the whole world is is [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4703">TS</a>]
01:18:27 ◼ ► right there at your fingertips you can [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4707">TS</a>]
01:18:29 ◼ ► make apps you can make apps that help [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4709">TS</a>]
01:18:32 ◼ ► people apps that are just make you money [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4712">TS</a>]
01:18:34 ◼ ► apps that are useful educational great [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4714">TS</a>]
01:18:36 ◼ ► games what's wrong with that who cares [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4716">TS</a>]
01:18:40 ◼ ► if you if you get a deal with this all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4720">TS</a>]
01:18:42 ◼ ► these things you pointed out who cares [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4722">TS</a>]
01:18:43 ◼ ► it just so what it says par for the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4723">TS</a>]
01:18:46 ◼ ► course and so what if this is all we [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4726">TS</a>]
01:18:48 ◼ ► ever have why is that so mad well who [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4728">TS</a>]
01:18:51 ◼ ► eventually people will care and to think [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4731">TS</a>]
01:18:54 ◼ ► ridiculous on its face it eventually you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4734">TS</a>]
01:18:56 ◼ ► know maybe in the people who are live [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4736">TS</a>]
01:18:58 ◼ ► today won't care is all be dead but [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4738">TS</a>]
01:18:59 ◼ ► eventually it will be ridiculous it'll [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4739">TS</a>]
01:19:01 ◼ ► be ridiculous as today if you say well [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4741">TS</a>]
01:19:03 ◼ ► if you want to write an application for [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4743">TS</a>]
01:19:04 ◼ ► the iPhone you got to do it in machine [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4744">TS</a>]
01:19:05 ◼ ► code so get out your hex out that would [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4745">TS</a>]
01:19:07 ◼ ► be very ridiculous that would be a sir [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4747">TS</a>]
01:19:09 ◼ ► or Eve or even assembly right but if you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4749">TS</a>]
01:19:12 ◼ ► if we were having this conversation back [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4752">TS</a>]
01:19:13 ◼ ► in the 60s when you know computers were [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4753">TS</a>]
01:19:15 ◼ ► just coming online or whatever and I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4755">TS</a>]
01:19:17 ◼ ► said well you know of course we write [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4757">TS</a>]
01:19:18 ◼ ► all our programs here assembly here in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4758">TS</a>]
01:19:19 ◼ ► the military for this targeting computer [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4759">TS</a>]
01:19:21 ◼ ► or whatever and yeah assembly is a pain [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4761">TS</a>]
01:19:24 ◼ ► but if you can get past it boy you can [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4764">TS</a>]
01:19:25 ◼ ► do some great things and it's just you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4765">TS</a>]
01:19:26 ◼ ► can really get down to the bare metal [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4766">TS</a>]
01:19:27 ◼ ► and it of assemblies all we ever have I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4767">TS</a>]
01:19:30 ◼ ► think that'll be fine in 2010 we're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4770">TS</a>]
01:19:31 ◼ ► still writing an assembly everybody will [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4771">TS</a>]
01:19:33 ◼ ► be fine with it that's not how progress [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4773">TS</a>]
01:19:34 ◼ ► works that's not how humanity works [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4774">TS</a>]
01:19:36 ◼ ► people will not be fine with Objective C [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4776">TS</a>]
01:19:38 ◼ ► forever so do you do you then suspect [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4778">TS</a>]
01:19:40 ◼ ► that at some point it's Apple that's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4780">TS</a>]
01:19:43 ◼ ► going to take charge of this or do you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4783">TS</a>]
01:19:44 ◼ ► think it'll come you know remember what [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4784">TS</a>]
01:19:48 ◼ ► language there's a full-on IDE was a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4788">TS</a>]
01:19:50 ◼ ► code warrior code word I knew people [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4790">TS</a>]
01:19:52 ◼ ► that were using code warrior swore by [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4792">TS</a>]
01:19:57 ◼ ► everything that came out when Xcode came [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4797">TS</a>]
01:20:00 ◼ ► a new matter they didn't have a new [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4800">TS</a>]
01:20:01 ◼ ► language but they had a new API API and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4801">TS</a>]
01:20:04 ◼ ► new and used this uses our power plant [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4804">TS</a>]
01:20:06 ◼ ► API instead of writing to the Mac [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4806">TS</a>]
01:20:08 ◼ ► toolbox which had that line the Mac [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4808">TS</a>]
01:20:09 ◼ ► toolbox with ridiculously creaky and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4809">TS</a>]
01:20:11 ◼ ► they built a higher level API on top of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4811">TS</a>]
01:20:13 ◼ ► the same language I think it all depends [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4813">TS</a>]
01:20:15 ◼ ► on who's steering Apple at the point [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4815">TS</a>]
01:20:18 ◼ ► that the crisis starts till doom I think [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4818">TS</a>]
01:20:20 ◼ ► it's irresponsible for the company not [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4820">TS</a>]
01:20:21 ◼ ► to have a project about this already [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4821">TS</a>]
01:20:23 ◼ ► maybe they do I can't say that they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4823">TS</a>]
01:20:24 ◼ ► don't because if they did it's not like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4824">TS</a>]
01:20:26 ◼ ► they're going to tell people that they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4826">TS</a>]
01:20:26 ◼ ► do maybe they've tried seven different [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4826">TS</a>]
01:20:29 ◼ ► experimenting internally but I'm going [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4829">TS</a>]
01:20:31 ◼ ► to say that if at this point Apple does [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4831">TS</a>]
01:20:33 ◼ ► not have some sort of plan in motion [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4833">TS</a>]
01:20:37 ◼ ► figuring out what's after objective-c [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4837">TS</a>]
01:20:39 ◼ ► and cocoa they're being irresponsible as [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4839">TS</a>]
01:20:41 ◼ ► a corporation despite the fact that all [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4841">TS</a>]
01:20:43 ◼ ► the leadership who are there now will [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4843">TS</a>]
01:20:44 ◼ ► likely be retired when it's time to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4844">TS</a>]
01:20:46 ◼ ► execute in that plan they need to be [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4846">TS</a>]
01:20:47 ◼ ► thinking about it now I certainly hope [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4847">TS</a>]
01:20:49 ◼ ► to be alive at the point where I think [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4849">TS</a>]
01:20:51 ◼ ► it will be embarrassing to ask people to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4851">TS</a>]
01:20:54 ◼ ► write an objective-c in cocoa for iOS [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4854">TS</a>]
01:20:57 ◼ ► and the only way that's not going to be [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4857">TS</a>]
01:20:58 ◼ ► embarrassing is if Apple comes to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4858">TS</a>]
01:21:00 ◼ ► dominate so thoroughly that like I said [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4860">TS</a>]
01:21:02 ◼ ► it's the I think this will definitely be [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4862">TS</a>]
01:21:05 ◼ ► objective-c starts to rain sort of like [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4865">TS</a>]
01:21:07 ◼ ► a Dark Age of Windows when there was no [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4867">TS</a>]
01:21:08 ◼ ► progress in you know web technology [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4868">TS</a>]
01:21:11 ◼ ► because ie was dominant and not a lot of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4871">TS</a>]
01:21:13 ◼ ► progress on desktop applications because [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4873">TS</a>]
01:21:15 ◼ ► they were just you know increasingly [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4875">TS</a>]
01:21:17 ◼ ► complicated Windows applications I just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4877">TS</a>]
01:21:19 ◼ ► every version they had a ten new buttons [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4879">TS</a>]
01:21:20 ◼ ► to the toolbar and it took Apple to come [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4880">TS</a>]
01:21:22 ◼ ► along and sort of wipe the slate clean [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4882">TS</a>]
01:21:23 ◼ ► and say here's what you can do with [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4883">TS</a>]
01:21:25 ◼ ► application design that's different and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4885">TS</a>]
01:21:26 ◼ ► you know here's what you can do with web [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4886">TS</a>]
01:21:28 ◼ ► browser design with uh with Mozilla and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4888">TS</a>]
01:21:32 ◼ ► actually be cool if you're not stuck in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4892">TS</a>]
01:21:33 ◼ ► IE forever I don't want to see a Dark [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4893">TS</a>]
01:21:35 ◼ ► Age of objective-c but it's the only way [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4895">TS</a>]
01:21:37 ◼ ► that Objective C is not going to hit a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4897">TS</a>]
01:21:39 ◼ ► crisis point in my lifetime assuming I [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4899">TS</a>]
01:21:41 ◼ ► live to a ripe old age and so I think [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4901">TS</a>]
01:21:44 ◼ ► there needs to be a plan and I have no [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4904">TS</a>]
01:21:46 ◼ ► idea what that good it should be but it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4906">TS</a>]
01:21:48 ◼ ► needs to be something hopefully uh [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4908">TS</a>]
01:21:51 ◼ ► hopefully they're on the ball do you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4911">TS</a>]
01:21:54 ◼ ► think you think when they do do it that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4914">TS</a>]
01:21:56 ◼ ► it will be a universal transition the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4916">TS</a>]
01:21:59 ◼ ► way that it was with Xcode in the past [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4919">TS</a>]
01:22:01 ◼ ► like this is the way to build it or do [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4921">TS</a>]
01:22:06 ◼ ► complementary compatibility so that so [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4926">TS</a>]
01:22:10 ◼ ► transition it's your choice you can use [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4930">TS</a>]
01:22:14 ◼ ► structure coding infrastructure you'd [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4934">TS</a>]
01:22:16 ◼ ► like to use so if if I am the most [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4936">TS</a>]
01:22:19 ◼ ► optimistic and I say let's imagine that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4939">TS</a>]
01:22:20 ◼ ► the most competent incarnation of Apple [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4940">TS</a>]
01:22:23 ◼ ► is the one executing this plan it's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4943">TS</a>]
01:22:24 ◼ ► because the most competent Carnation of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4944">TS</a>]
01:22:28 ◼ ► everything you need to be good at to do [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4948">TS</a>]
01:22:30 ◼ ► this they're really good at transitions [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4950">TS</a>]
01:22:32 ◼ ► that's how many transitions they've done [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4952">TS</a>]
01:22:35 ◼ ► languages different IDs they are really [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4955">TS</a>]
01:22:37 ◼ ► good at transitions at their best they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4957">TS</a>]
01:22:38 ◼ ► can pull off amazing things and no one [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4958">TS</a>]
01:22:40 ◼ ► imagined like changing the entire CPU [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4960">TS</a>]
01:22:41 ◼ ► architecture of their entire line of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4961">TS</a>]
01:22:43 ◼ ► products like without a little bump even [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4963">TS</a>]
01:22:45 ◼ ► that was just pretty amazing like they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4965">TS</a>]
01:22:47 ◼ ► can pull it off they can do those types [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4967">TS</a>]
01:22:49 ◼ ► of things if that is the crew running [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4969">TS</a>]
01:22:51 ◼ ► the show and if they have a good plan [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4971">TS</a>]
01:22:53 ◼ ► the big you know because it's going to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4973">TS</a>]
01:22:54 ◼ ► take years and years to do this no [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4974">TS</a>]
01:22:55 ◼ ► matter what if they start early enough [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4975">TS</a>]
01:22:57 ◼ ► and have a good plan and aren't acting [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4977">TS</a>]
01:22:59 ◼ ► out of panic or desperation and have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4979">TS</a>]
01:23:00 ◼ ► good leadership I think they can pull it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4980">TS</a>]
01:23:02 ◼ ► off with it with a complete transition [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4982">TS</a>]
01:23:04 ◼ ► sort of the way they put everyone on [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4984">TS</a>]
01:23:05 ◼ ► decks code right it was a little bit [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4985">TS</a>]
01:23:07 ◼ ► bumpy in the beginning right but they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4987">TS</a>]
01:23:09 ◼ ► just they were slow and methodical and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4989">TS</a>]
01:23:10 ◼ ► you know it Xcode didn't even exist they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4990">TS</a>]
01:23:12 ◼ ► said stop using power plant we will [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4992">TS</a>]
01:23:15 ◼ ► support you with carbon for a little [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4995">TS</a>]
01:23:16 ◼ ► while but like seriously guys stop using [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4996">TS</a>]
01:23:18 ◼ ► power plant you should really use [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4998">TS</a>]
01:23:19 ◼ ► project builder we don't want you to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/4999">TS</a>]
01:23:21 ◼ ► build your application with metro works [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5001">TS</a>]
01:23:22 ◼ ► but it will still work for a little [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5002">TS</a>]
01:23:23 ◼ ► while and eventually like no seriously [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5003">TS</a>]
01:23:24 ◼ ► forget about that Metro work stop no [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5004">TS</a>]
01:23:26 ◼ ► more power plant I'm serious go on to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5006">TS</a>]
01:23:28 ◼ ► project builder and byways there's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5008">TS</a>]
01:23:29 ◼ ► nothing called Xcode forget about [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5009">TS</a>]
01:23:30 ◼ ► project builder I know you neckties are [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5010">TS</a>]
01:23:32 ◼ ► cranky but we're making a new app called [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5012">TS</a>]
01:23:33 ◼ ► Xcode and it'll be cool and you know [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5013">TS</a>]
01:23:35 ◼ ► they go with that for a few years and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5015">TS</a>]
01:23:36 ◼ ► they say that Carbon thing we need to go [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5016">TS</a>]
01:23:38 ◼ ► you need to cut that out besides legacy [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5018">TS</a>]
01:23:41 ◼ ► Carbon guys sorry you know your apps [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5021">TS</a>]
01:23:43 ◼ ► will still work but you're not getting [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5023">TS</a>]
01:23:44 ◼ ► on the 64 bit train with us and Xcode [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5024">TS</a>]
01:23:46 ◼ ► we're going to do it as a single indoor [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5026">TS</a>]
01:23:47 ◼ ► interface it looks like iTunes and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5027">TS</a>]
01:23:48 ◼ ► you're going to deal with it and we're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5028">TS</a>]
01:23:49 ◼ ► just all in the Train everybody on the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5029">TS</a>]
01:23:51 ◼ ► Xcode Train now and by the way that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5031">TS</a>]
01:23:53 ◼ ► compiled that you like GCC we've got a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5033">TS</a>]
01:23:54 ◼ ► new one forget about that ECC thing [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5034">TS</a>]
01:23:55 ◼ ► we're going to transition to a new one [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5035">TS</a>]
01:23:57 ◼ ► takes years and years and years in [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5037">TS</a>]
01:23:59 ◼ ► incremental steps but everybody gets [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5039">TS</a>]
01:24:01 ◼ ► funneled into it so I think when they do [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5041">TS</a>]
01:24:02 ◼ ► undertake this procedure it's going to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5042">TS</a>]
01:24:05 ◼ ► be a big giant funnel and it's going to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5045">TS</a>]
01:24:06 ◼ ► be like alright guys let's start you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5046">TS</a>]
01:24:07 ◼ ► know start turning off the lights on [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5047">TS</a>]
01:24:09 ◼ ► that old stuff but you're going to be [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5049">TS</a>]
01:24:10 ◼ ► around for years and years but it's just [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5050">TS</a>]
01:24:12 ◼ ► going to be like powerplant and carbon [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5052">TS</a>]
01:24:14 ◼ ► and you know project builder and all the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5054">TS</a>]
01:24:17 ◼ ► other stuff that you like and GCC it's [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5057">TS</a>]
01:24:19 ◼ ► not going to go away today it's not [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5059">TS</a>]
01:24:20 ◼ ► going to go away tomorrow but we're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5060">TS</a>]
01:24:21 ◼ ► telling you it's a big long funnel and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5061">TS</a>]
01:24:23 ◼ ► we're all going down the chute to the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5063">TS</a>]
01:24:24 ◼ ► slaughter or wherever you want to think [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5064">TS</a>]
01:24:26 ◼ ► about these are all bad analogies [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5066">TS</a>]
01:24:27 ◼ ► and everyone together in a line and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5067">TS</a>]
01:24:30 ◼ ► we're all going to transition to you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5070">TS</a>]
01:24:31 ◼ ► know Apple basic or the hell they're [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5071">TS</a>]
01:24:32 ◼ ► going to come up with them is going to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5072">TS</a>]
01:24:34 ◼ ► be a new API and Coco's great and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5074">TS</a>]
01:24:36 ◼ ► everything and we'll still do bug fixes [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5076">TS</a>]
01:24:37 ◼ ► but I'm sorry but coco is not making the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5077">TS</a>]
01:24:42 ◼ ► ridiculous yeah people think I'm serious [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5082">TS</a>]
01:24:44 ◼ ► about hundred twenty but but anyway [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5084">TS</a>]
01:24:46 ◼ ► that's the type of thing you're gonna [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5086">TS</a>]
01:24:47 ◼ ► but that's Apple at its best where they [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5087">TS</a>]
01:24:49 ◼ ► have a plan takes many years to execute [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5089">TS</a>]
01:24:51 ◼ ► and they do it in incremental steps and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5091">TS</a>]
01:24:53 ◼ ► people grumble along the way but in the [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5093">TS</a>]
01:24:54 ◼ ► end everyone comes out the other side [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5094">TS</a>]
01:24:55 ◼ ► happier that is the best case scenario [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5095">TS</a>]
01:24:58 ◼ ► and I think they need to be working on [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5098">TS</a>]
01:25:02 ◼ ► all right I can't disagree I really [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5102">TS</a>]
01:25:06 ◼ ► can't disagree with you I like doing it [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5106">TS</a>]
01:25:09 ◼ ► when I can I try no I I want to I can't [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5109">TS</a>]
01:25:12 ◼ ► you can disagree with me on that then [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5112">TS</a>]
01:25:14 ◼ ► iMac languages yeah well will will have [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5114">TS</a>]
01:25:15 ◼ ► a lot to say then that's that's not say [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5115">TS</a>]
01:25:18 ◼ ► you're using Perl it's not nuts must be [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5118">TS</a>]
01:25:22 ◼ ► golden handcuffs thing we'll get to that [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5122">TS</a>]
01:25:25 ◼ ► alright let's wrap this up thanks [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5125">TS</a>]
01:25:27 ◼ ► everybody for tuning in thanks to [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5127">TS</a>]
01:25:29 ◼ ► Shopify dot-com remember use code 5x5 [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5129">TS</a>]
01:25:32 ◼ ► and you'll get three months free thanks [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5132">TS</a>]
01:25:34 ◼ ► to Rackspace comm slash king of the apps [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5134">TS</a>]
01:25:36 ◼ ► you could win ten we do a lot we give [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5136">TS</a>]
01:25:38 ◼ ► you we give you $10,000 in three months [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5138">TS</a>]
01:25:40 ◼ ► free do as much as we can here and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5140">TS</a>]
01:25:42 ◼ ► thanks to John siracusa there's no Z and [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5142">TS</a>]
01:25:45 ◼ ► last time you said that follow-up you [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5145">TS</a>]
01:25:47 ◼ ► said could you spell my name instead of [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5147">TS</a>]
01:25:51 ◼ ► just saying there's no Z it's s IRAs IRA [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5151">TS</a>]
01:25:55 ◼ ► see us on Twitter I'm Dan benjamin on [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5155">TS</a>]
01:26:00 ◼ ► twitter and we appreciate you listening [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5160">TS</a>]
01:26:02 ◼ ► you can check out 5x5 TV here a whole [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5162">TS</a>]
01:26:05 ◼ ► bunch of other shows we've just got a [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5165">TS</a>]
01:26:07 ◼ ► new show just premiered today with Mike [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5167">TS</a>]
01:26:10 ◼ ► Montero it's called let's make mistakes [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5170">TS</a>]
01:26:13 ◼ ► so go check that out at 5x5 dot TV [<a href="https://overcast.fm/+Ipl3z-2g/5173">TS</a>]