Hypercritical

00:00:00 ◼   ► [Music] [TS]

00:00:01 ◼   ► you are listening to hypercritical this [TS]

00:00:05 ◼   ► is a weekly talkshow ruminating on [TS]

00:00:06 ◼   ► exactly what is wrong in the world of [TS]

00:00:08 ◼   ► Apple and related technologies [TS]

00:00:10 ◼   ► businesses nothing you see is so perfect [TS]

00:00:13 ◼   ► that it can't be complained and [TS]

00:00:15 ◼   ► criticized by my co-host John siracusa [TS]

00:00:18 ◼   ► I'm Dan benjamin the show is made [TS]

00:00:19 ◼   ► possible by fresh books calm mailchimp [TS]

00:00:22 ◼   ► calm which will tell you about in a [TS]

00:00:24 ◼   ► little bit but this is episode number 13 [TS]

00:00:27 ◼   ► creepy 13 are you superstitious I am NOT [TS]

00:00:32 ◼   ► in some cultures 13 is considered lucky [TS]

00:00:36 ◼   ► a lot of people would say it's unlike [TS]

00:00:39 ◼   ► them should we skip should we just call [TS]

00:00:40 ◼   ► this episode 14 and my culture 13 is the [TS]

00:00:43 ◼   ► number epic 12 [TS]

00:00:48 ◼   ► good enough good enough for me you sold [TS]

00:00:51 ◼   ► me how are you how's your week been been [TS]

00:00:56 ◼   ► good so far good we have a giant pile of [TS]

00:01:02 ◼   ► follow-up I'm still thinking about what [TS]

00:01:04 ◼   ► parts I'm going to trim don't trim any [TS]

00:01:06 ◼   ► of it I say we do the whole thing all of [TS]

00:01:08 ◼   ► it the whole show would be follow up [TS]

00:01:09 ◼   ► then yeah maybe once and for all clear [TS]

00:01:12 ◼   ► it out start fresh no this wouldn't [TS]

00:01:14 ◼   ► clear it out this was just supposed to [TS]

00:01:15 ◼   ► be one shows worth would it expanded but [TS]

00:01:17 ◼   ► I think I'll stop about halfway through [TS]

00:01:19 ◼   ► I want to start with stuff about Pixar [TS]

00:01:23 ◼   ► believe it or not it was the big shock [TS]

00:01:27 ◼   ► on last week's show yeah well it was a [TS]

00:01:29 ◼   ► shock I was shocked [TS]

00:01:30 ◼   ► yeah not a lot of feedback on that [TS]

00:01:32 ◼   ► surprisingly it brought out a few of the [TS]

00:01:36 ◼   ► people who had previously had bad [TS]

00:01:39 ◼   ► thoughts about Pixar but didn't feel [TS]

00:01:41 ◼   ► safe expressing them so now once they [TS]

00:01:43 ◼   ► hear someone else say anything bad about [TS]

00:01:45 ◼   ► Pixar they will come out of the woodwork [TS]

00:01:46 ◼   ► and tell you what they think is wrong [TS]

00:01:50 ◼   ► with Pixar right some of them agree but [TS]

00:01:51 ◼   ► and some of them I didn't but there was [TS]

00:01:53 ◼   ► one good one that stuck out to me and it [TS]

00:01:56 ◼   ► was someone who brought up a point that [TS]

00:01:59 ◼   ► I thought about before but hadn't tied [TS]

00:02:01 ◼   ► it in to what I said on last week's show [TS]

00:02:03 ◼   ► but he did in a connected all together [TS]

00:02:05 ◼   ► this was Kieran Healy he's usually in [TS]

00:02:06 ◼   ► the chatroom I don't know if he's there [TS]

00:02:07 ◼   ► today he was pointing out that most [TS]

00:02:10 ◼   ► Pixar movies have male lead characters I [TS]

00:02:14 ◼   ► think all of them do at this point and [TS]

00:02:16 ◼   ► there's very few female characters and [TS]

00:02:18 ◼   ► this is something you tend not to notice [TS]

00:02:20 ◼   ► and movies in general you know because [TS]

00:02:23 ◼   ► certain genres always have male [TS]

00:02:24 ◼   ► characters and Pixar does kids movies in [TS]

00:02:26 ◼   ► her adventure movies and they always [TS]

00:02:27 ◼   ► have male leads right and that's not a [TS]

00:02:29 ◼   ► big deal exactly until you know he had [TS]

00:02:32 ◼   ► his daughter say to him while watching [TS]

00:02:35 ◼   ► the Cars movie why don't the girls get [TS]

00:02:37 ◼   ► to go on the racetrack and you don't [TS]

00:02:41 ◼   ► notice it until you hear something like [TS]

00:02:42 ◼   ► that and then you know you have this [TS]

00:02:44 ◼   ► emotional reaction where you're like you [TS]

00:02:45 ◼   ► know what why don't the girls get to go [TS]

00:02:47 ◼   ► on the racetrack what's what exactly and [TS]

00:02:50 ◼   ► then you just look at all the other [TS]

00:02:51 ◼   ► movies that Pixar does and the [TS]

00:02:54 ◼   ► protagonist is always a male and the [TS]

00:02:55 ◼   ► female characters are [TS]

00:02:57 ◼   ► you know important too strong that the [TS]

00:02:59 ◼   ► main exception is Elastigirl from The [TS]

00:03:00 ◼   ► Incredibles I guess well she's still a [TS]

00:03:02 ◼   ► secondary character it's about think [TS]

00:03:04 ◼   ► it's about the dad right but now see I [TS]

00:03:06 ◼   ► don't I don't think that Pixar any movie [TS]

00:03:09 ◼   ► studio needs to have some sort of [TS]

00:03:10 ◼   ► balance like you know that their lead [TS]

00:03:12 ◼   ► characters must exactly match the [TS]

00:03:13 ◼   ► percentages of people on the earth so [TS]

00:03:16 ◼   ► fifty-one percent women and X percent [TS]

00:03:17 ◼   ► this race in it that's that's ridiculous [TS]

00:03:20 ◼   ► the Pixar really does strike me as a [TS]

00:03:21 ◼   ► male oriented or as you would say [TS]

00:03:24 ◼   ► orientated I would company or production [TS]

00:03:28 ◼   ► company if you think about it name name [TS]

00:03:31 ◼   ► that the the movies that they've made [TS]

00:03:34 ◼   ► I'm not saying girls don't love these [TS]

00:03:36 ◼   ► these movies too but to me they feel [TS]

00:03:38 ◼   ► they feel like boy movies yeah so that [TS]

00:03:43 ◼   ► was the tie-in to last week I was [TS]

00:03:45 ◼   ► talking about how they had a sort of a [TS]

00:03:47 ◼   ► culture of engineering creativity yeah [TS]

00:03:50 ◼   ► and engineering cultures and engineers [TS]

00:03:51 ◼   ► in general it tends to be like a [TS]

00:03:54 ◼   ► male-dominated culture so Kiran was [TS]

00:03:57 ◼   ► wondering are these two things connected [TS]

00:03:59 ◼   ► is the sort of engineer lead culture of [TS]

00:04:03 ◼   ► Pixar it is that causing this sort of [TS]

00:04:08 ◼   ► male-dominated storyline phenomenon I [TS]

00:04:11 ◼   ► don't know if the two are connected but [TS]

00:04:12 ◼   ► it's it's an interesting to consider and [TS]

00:04:14 ◼   ► the comparison is with Miyazaki who [TS]

00:04:15 ◼   ► always comparing Pixar too and [TS]

00:04:17 ◼   ► Miyazaki's movies are I don't know if [TS]

00:04:20 ◼   ► it's majority but it seems like the vast [TS]

00:04:22 ◼   ► majority of the protagonists are female [TS]

00:04:24 ◼   ► that's one of the reasons I have my [TS]

00:04:25 ◼   ► daughter watch all those movies because [TS]

00:04:27 ◼   ► they're their movies were the lead [TS]

00:04:29 ◼   ► character it's a female and I don't I [TS]

00:04:31 ◼   ► started her off on these movies and she [TS]

00:04:33 ◼   ► you know only saw movies with female [TS]

00:04:34 ◼   ► lead characters in the beginning of her [TS]

00:04:36 ◼   ► life just to sort of normalize her on [TS]

00:04:38 ◼   ► the idea that yes you can do everything [TS]

00:04:40 ◼   ► that the male characters can do there's [TS]

00:04:43 ◼   ► no limitations based on your gender [TS]

00:04:45 ◼   ► she's never said anything about the [TS]

00:04:46 ◼   ► Pixar movies because she's seen them too [TS]

00:04:48 ◼   ► but it is a stark contrast between [TS]

00:04:51 ◼   ► rescue cultures now I have no idea why [TS]

00:04:52 ◼   ► Miyazaki pick female leads and have no [TS]

00:04:54 ◼   ► idea what pics are mostly picks male [TS]

00:04:56 ◼   ► leads but the correlation is there I [TS]

00:05:00 ◼   ► thought it was interesting because I [TS]

00:05:01 ◼   ► mean it's to balance things out like in [TS]

00:05:03 ◼   ► the universe that could be I mean it [TS]

00:05:06 ◼   ► could just be coincidence it could just [TS]

00:05:08 ◼   ► be you know that's the way [TS]

00:05:10 ◼   ► the cookie crumbled for each of the [TS]

00:05:12 ◼   ► stories and the other Pixar news I got [TS]

00:05:15 ◼   ► and feedback was all the other various [TS]

00:05:17 ◼   ► Pixar projects because I was talking [TS]

00:05:19 ◼   ► about what Pixar should do next and [TS]

00:05:21 ◼   ► their their culture of not letting bad [TS]

00:05:22 ◼   ► things out the door so on that front a [TS]

00:05:26 ◼   ► couple people pointed out and I had [TS]

00:05:27 ◼   ► heard this long ago but it forgotten [TS]

00:05:29 ◼   ► about it but people would remind me that [TS]

00:05:31 ◼   ► Pixar's movie Newt as in like a little [TS]

00:05:34 ◼   ► lizard thing was canceled last year I [TS]

00:05:36 ◼   ► think it's the first time that I recall [TS]

00:05:38 ◼   ► that a sort of high profile pics our [TS]

00:05:40 ◼   ► project that people knew about outside [TS]

00:05:42 ◼   ► the company was cancelled hmm and this [TS]

00:05:44 ◼   ► was supposed to be a movie about a [TS]

00:05:45 ◼   ► blue-footed Newt who was in a lab and he [TS]

00:05:49 ◼   ► was the last one on earth but then they [TS]

00:05:50 ◼   ► found a female in the wild and they [TS]

00:05:51 ◼   ► bring a female from the wild into him to [TS]

00:05:53 ◼   ► help to try to get them to mate the PR [TS]

00:05:57 ◼   ► they showed for it had the male Newt in [TS]

00:05:58 ◼   ► the cage and he could see from his cage [TS]

00:06:00 ◼   ► a poster on the wall detailing the nine [TS]

00:06:02 ◼   ► steps of the mating ritual the [TS]

00:06:03 ◼   ► blue-footed Newt so he had been studying [TS]

00:06:05 ◼   ► that poster you know before when the [TS]

00:06:07 ◼   ► female comes right but there was a [TS]

00:06:08 ◼   ► coffee machine blocking the night step [TS]

00:06:10 ◼   ► so it wasn't sure what it is but that's [TS]

00:06:13 ◼   ► the premise of the movie the two of them [TS]

00:06:14 ◼   ► end up escaping from the cage and going [TS]

00:06:16 ◼   ► out in the wild and fighting with each [TS]

00:06:17 ◼   ► other yeah it's sort of like a romantic [TS]

00:06:19 ◼   ► comedy with newts [TS]

00:06:20 ◼   ► so it sounded interesting to me but that [TS]

00:06:22 ◼   ► was canned and so when you hear that [TS]

00:06:24 ◼   ► that's canned is that you know was it [TS]

00:06:25 ◼   ► cancelled because it was too you know [TS]

00:06:28 ◼   ► ambitious and risque or was a cancel [TS]

00:06:30 ◼   ► just because it wasn't working out you [TS]

00:06:31 ◼   ► know so you don't you don't know based [TS]

00:06:33 ◼   ► on the fact that it was canceled whether [TS]

00:06:34 ◼   ► this is an example Pixar not taking [TS]

00:06:36 ◼   ► enough risks or this is an example fix [TS]

00:06:37 ◼   ► are killing something that was just not [TS]

00:06:39 ◼   ► working out you know but it is [TS]

00:06:41 ◼   ► interesting that those type of things [TS]

00:06:42 ◼   ► are happening publicly now whereas [TS]

00:06:44 ◼   ► before you know the rewrites at Toy [TS]

00:06:46 ◼   ► Story 2 and stuff like that happened [TS]

00:06:48 ◼   ► internally had only heard about them [TS]

00:06:49 ◼   ► after the fact like after the movie was [TS]

00:06:51 ◼   ► already out and successful Pixar's [TS]

00:06:53 ◼   ► actual next movie is called brave it [TS]

00:06:55 ◼   ► used to be called the bear in the bow or [TS]

00:06:57 ◼   ► the bow and the bear or something but [TS]

00:06:59 ◼   ► now it's called brave and this one [TS]

00:07:01 ◼   ► surprise has a female protagonist it's a [TS]

00:07:03 ◼   ► Scottish girl who's the daughter of a [TS]

00:07:06 ◼   ► king and she goes off on some sort of [TS]

00:07:08 ◼   ► adventure so that's going to be their [TS]

00:07:10 ◼   ► actual next movie they'll be interesting [TS]

00:07:12 ◼   ► to see what that ends up like and then a [TS]

00:07:16 ◼   ► couple of people pointing me to the [TS]

00:07:18 ◼   ► live-action projects that I alluded to [TS]

00:07:20 ◼   ► for the X Pixar people one of them was a [TS]

00:07:24 ◼   ► Andrew Stanton who did a wall-e and [TS]

00:07:25 ◼   ► stuff he's going on to do a live-action [TS]

00:07:27 ◼   ► movie not with Pixar called John Carter [TS]

00:07:30 ◼   ► of Mars based on a sci-fi character from [TS]

00:07:34 ◼   ► a long ago right and it's interesting [TS]

00:07:37 ◼   ► that first it's going to be rated pg-13 [TS]

00:07:39 ◼   ► so it's not going to be entirely kids [TS]

00:07:42 ◼   ► filled and second it's live-action it's [TS]

00:07:44 ◼   ► Disney but it's not Pixar so this sort [TS]

00:07:47 ◼   ► of hemming and hawing about well is this [TS]

00:07:48 ◼   ► a is this a Pixar movie this is a spic [TS]

00:07:50 ◼   ► stars first live-action movie well not [TS]

00:07:52 ◼   ► really but it's you know as I understand [TS]

00:07:54 ◼   ► but the Pixar people aren't working on [TS]

00:07:55 ◼   ► it but it's in Disney but not Disney [TS]

00:07:56 ◼   ► owns Pixar so maybe this is a an [TS]

00:08:00 ◼   ► experiment to try to give the Pixar [TS]

00:08:02 ◼   ► treatment to a live-action movie and if [TS]

00:08:03 ◼   ► it works out maybe Pixar could go off in [TS]

00:08:05 ◼   ► that direction but we'll see but I think [TS]

00:08:07 ◼   ► it is interesting is going to be pg-13 I [TS]

00:08:08 ◼   ► think Incredibles with just PG right not [TS]

00:08:10 ◼   ► pg-13 I'm pretty sure was PG out I'll [TS]

00:08:13 ◼   ► look at that but no would you say did [TS]

00:08:16 ◼   ► you mention Ponyo we talked about last [TS]

00:08:19 ◼   ► week yeah I mean would you say that the [TS]

00:08:21 ◼   ► main character was female it seemed like [TS]

00:08:23 ◼   ► that it was as much about her as it was [TS]

00:08:26 ◼   ► about the little boy it it's tough to [TS]

00:08:30 ◼   ► say in some of these movies like [TS]

00:08:31 ◼   ► Princess Mononoke is another example [TS]

00:08:33 ◼   ► where it seems that the protagonist is [TS]

00:08:35 ◼   ► male but the title character and the [TS]

00:08:38 ◼   ► main sort of semi antagonist are both [TS]

00:08:41 ◼   ► females and important females at Ponyo [TS]

00:08:44 ◼   ► saint-like Ponyo as the title character [TS]

00:08:46 ◼   ► but she has very little dialogue and you [TS]

00:08:49 ◼   ► open on and follow what you open up on [TS]

00:08:51 ◼   ► you but you follow the little boys [TS]

00:08:52 ◼   ► adventure so the little boy I feel like [TS]

00:08:54 ◼   ► the protagonist but Ponyo is obviously [TS]

00:08:56 ◼   ► important but she doesn't have much to [TS]

00:08:57 ◼   ► say during the movie and then is that [TS]

00:08:58 ◼   ► the mother and everything a female [TS]

00:09:00 ◼   ► characters in Miyazaki movies have no [TS]

00:09:02 ◼   ► limitations Rana and it just so happens [TS]

00:09:05 ◼   ► to be the clear lead and many of them is [TS]

00:09:07 ◼   ► female um so not only was the [TS]

00:09:10 ◼   ► Incredibles PG but it was the first [TS]

00:09:13 ◼   ► Pixar film to be PG right I remember [TS]

00:09:15 ◼   ► that being a big deal so you know John [TS]

00:09:17 ◼   ► Carter of Mars live-action pg-13 not [TS]

00:09:20 ◼   ► really Pixar but a Pixar guy at the helm [TS]

00:09:23 ◼   ► so it'll be interesting to see how that [TS]

00:09:24 ◼   ► turns out I have one other movie thing [TS]

00:09:28 ◼   ► but it's it's a big rant maybe I'll tack [TS]

00:09:30 ◼   ► it on the end if we finish early but I [TS]

00:09:32 ◼   ► doubt that will happen but the next [TS]

00:09:34 ◼   ► thing I wanted to talk to it which isn't [TS]

00:09:35 ◼   ► actually follow up and I'm just sticking [TS]

00:09:36 ◼   ► stuff in here that aren't part [TS]

00:09:37 ◼   ► the main topic but it's that Open [TS]

00:09:39 ◼   ► Compute thing that happened this week [TS]

00:09:40 ◼   ► did you talk about that with anybody yet [TS]

00:09:41 ◼   ► ah [TS]

00:09:42 ◼   ► Cristina Warren and I talked about it [TS]

00:09:43 ◼   ► yesterday a little bit but the gist of [TS]

00:09:46 ◼   ► it is Open Compute is Facebook's attempt [TS]

00:09:50 ◼   ► I think this is my my gut feeling on [TS]

00:09:53 ◼   ► this is that this is their attempt to [TS]

00:09:55 ◼   ► sort of out Google Google by not only [TS]

00:09:58 ◼   ► saying we have the most awesome data [TS]

00:10:00 ◼   ► center ever but we're going to share all [TS]

00:10:03 ◼   ► of the details about how we did this [TS]

00:10:05 ◼   ► going to give away all the specs all [TS]

00:10:08 ◼   ► every everything you want to know about [TS]

00:10:11 ◼   ► making an awesome data center the way [TS]

00:10:15 ◼   ► that Google has never really revealed [TS]

00:10:16 ◼   ► that we're going at which episode we [TS]

00:10:18 ◼   ► talked about that but which one was when [TS]

00:10:20 ◼   ► I was talking about what Google's [TS]

00:10:21 ◼   ► biggest advantages I think it was maybe [TS]

00:10:23 ◼   ► the one about Apple online stuff but [TS]

00:10:26 ◼   ► anyway I had said that Google's biggest [TS]

00:10:28 ◼   ► competitive advantage was its operations [TS]

00:10:30 ◼   ► was this data center operations and it's [TS]

00:10:31 ◼   ► hardware and software in that regard and [TS]

00:10:33 ◼   ► I said that they had basically like a [TS]

00:10:34 ◼   ► ten-year head start [TS]

00:10:36 ◼   ► yeah what I meant by that was like [TS]

00:10:37 ◼   ► starting from the time that they did [TS]

00:10:38 ◼   ► this not starting from now obviously so [TS]

00:10:40 ◼   ► there's some ways into their 10 year [TS]

00:10:42 ◼   ► head start the question is how far and [TS]

00:10:43 ◼   ► in the past episode I said that there's [TS]

00:10:46 ◼   ► lots of open source stuff in this area [TS]

00:10:50 ◼   ► that's like well Google won't give us [TS]

00:10:52 ◼   ► what we have so we'll make our own so [TS]

00:10:53 ◼   ► there's stuff like Hadoop or the various [TS]

00:10:55 ◼   ► no SQL databases and stuff like that [TS]

00:10:57 ◼   ► where they're they're open source [TS]

00:10:58 ◼   ► initiatives to try to do the stuff that [TS]

00:11:00 ◼   ► Google has but isn't sharing um [TS]

00:11:02 ◼   ► and the lead that they have like when I [TS]

00:11:07 ◼   ► say they have a 10 year lead I'm kind of [TS]

00:11:08 ◼   ► implying that the leads going to go away [TS]

00:11:09 ◼   ► that the open source stuff will [TS]

00:11:10 ◼   ► eventually catch up but mostly the open [TS]

00:11:12 ◼   ► source stuff I mentioned is just on the [TS]

00:11:14 ◼   ► software side and the hardware side is a [TS]

00:11:16 ◼   ► big part of this so I think Facebook [TS]

00:11:19 ◼   ► Facebook makes its intentions clear this [TS]

00:11:20 ◼   ► is a quote right from their Open Compute [TS]

00:11:22 ◼   ► website says by releasing Open Compute [TS]

00:11:24 ◼   ► Project technologies is open hardware [TS]

00:11:26 ◼   ► our goal is developed to develop servers [TS]

00:11:28 ◼   ► and data centers following the model [TS]

00:11:29 ◼   ► traditionally associated with open [TS]

00:11:31 ◼   ► source software projects they're [TS]

00:11:32 ◼   ► basically saying we are doing with [TS]

00:11:33 ◼   ► hardware what people normally do with [TS]

00:11:37 ◼   ► open source software and that's that's a [TS]

00:11:39 ◼   ► clear indication that what Facebook [TS]

00:11:41 ◼   ► feels is that they acknowledge that [TS]

00:11:43 ◼   ► Google has had the lead in this area in [TS]

00:11:45 ◼   ► data center operations and they think [TS]

00:11:48 ◼   ► the only way that they can or maybe the [TS]

00:11:50 ◼   ► way they can catch up [TS]

00:11:51 ◼   ► fastest possibly the only way they can [TS]

00:11:53 ◼   ► ever catch them is to reframe the game [TS]

00:11:55 ◼   ► as everybody versus Google hmm so [TS]

00:11:58 ◼   ► they're going to be the everybody's like [TS]

00:11:59 ◼   ► we could try to do it on our own Google [TS]

00:12:01 ◼   ► doing our own Google has more money than [TS]

00:12:02 ◼   ► us they have a big head start it's gonna [TS]

00:12:03 ◼   ► be really tough to catch them but if we [TS]

00:12:04 ◼   ► just say everybody versus Google then [TS]

00:12:07 ◼   ► suddenly it's more of a fair fight [TS]

00:12:08 ◼   ► so trying to suit you know hasten the [TS]

00:12:10 ◼   ► demise of Google's lead in this area and [TS]

00:12:12 ◼   ► you'll know that the lead is gone like [TS]

00:12:14 ◼   ► if you're watching the space you'll know [TS]

00:12:15 ◼   ► the lead is gone when Google starts [TS]

00:12:17 ◼   ► opening up its data center hardware [TS]

00:12:18 ◼   ► stuff I don't think they would do that [TS]

00:12:20 ◼   ► just just to have a response you don't [TS]

00:12:22 ◼   ► think they would do that just to say [TS]

00:12:23 ◼   ► they need to yet but like because look [TS]

00:12:26 ◼   ► with it in the software world all these [TS]

00:12:27 ◼   ► open-source sort of semi equivalents of [TS]

00:12:29 ◼   ► stuff that Google does based on Google's [TS]

00:12:31 ◼   ► white papers and their vague you know [TS]

00:12:32 ◼   ► notions they're not coming out and say [TS]

00:12:34 ◼   ► okay you can have our whole software [TS]

00:12:36 ◼   ► infrastructure because you guys are [TS]

00:12:37 ◼   ► doing open-source equivalents they're [TS]

00:12:39 ◼   ► happy to let Yahoo and everybody else [TS]

00:12:40 ◼   ► work on their open-source equivalents in [TS]

00:12:42 ◼   ► the various no sequel databases and all [TS]

00:12:44 ◼   ► that stuff and you know that Facebook [TS]

00:12:47 ◼   ► has described blogging logging [TS]

00:12:49 ◼   ► infrastructure all sorts of projects [TS]

00:12:50 ◼   ► like that go on and Google says that's [TS]

00:12:52 ◼   ► fine you guys go with that but we still [TS]

00:12:53 ◼   ► feel like our stuff is better and in [TS]

00:12:55 ◼   ► fact we're revising our stuff we're not [TS]

00:12:56 ◼   ► sitting on our hands we are making the [TS]

00:12:59 ◼   ► version - of all our internal stuff or [TS]

00:13:01 ◼   ► whatever but no one was challenging them [TS]

00:13:03 ◼   ► in the hardware so now facebook is with [TS]

00:13:04 ◼   ► this initiative trying to formalize the [TS]

00:13:06 ◼   ► software effort and then saying we're [TS]

00:13:08 ◼   ► going to try to compete with you on fard [TS]

00:13:10 ◼   ► we're by pulling everybody else into our [TS]

00:13:11 ◼   ► circle say we did a little bit of [TS]

00:13:13 ◼   ► working out everybody join in and see if [TS]

00:13:14 ◼   ► we can't as an entire you know industry [TS]

00:13:16 ◼   ► compete with this one company that won't [TS]

00:13:18 ◼   ► share its goodies and I think as soon as [TS]

00:13:21 ◼   ► you see Google dip its toe and say well [TS]

00:13:24 ◼   ► you know we're releasing X is [TS]

00:13:25 ◼   ► open-source so we're you know here's our [TS]

00:13:27 ◼   ► hardware specs or whatever that's [TS]

00:13:29 ◼   ► basically end of their lead they will be [TS]

00:13:30 ◼   ► acknowledging that it they've at least [TS]

00:13:33 ◼   ► decided that the open-source stuff is [TS]

00:13:34 ◼   ► about to pass them by and they need to [TS]

00:13:36 ◼   ► contribute now I don't know how [TS]

00:13:38 ◼   ► successful this efforts going to be in [TS]

00:13:39 ◼   ► that regard because the software part [TS]

00:13:42 ◼   ► that's kind of happening already but it [TS]

00:13:44 ◼   ► happens slowly and organically and [TS]

00:13:46 ◼   ► hardware is harder because you can't [TS]

00:13:47 ◼   ► just get contributors to hardware like [TS]

00:13:49 ◼   ► you know randomly off the internet right [TS]

00:13:51 ◼   ► this minimum you know level of entry [TS]

00:13:54 ◼   ► that you have to the crosses how are you [TS]

00:13:57 ◼   ► a hardware engineer do you have hardware [TS]

00:13:58 ◼   ► to work with are you a company that does [TS]

00:13:59 ◼   ► this you know did you ever consider [TS]

00:14:01 ◼   ► going into an outside of the [TS]

00:14:03 ◼   ► house doing the hardware engineer so I [TS]

00:14:06 ◼   ► majored in computer engineering which [TS]

00:14:07 ◼   ► doesn't have software any and is really [TS]

00:14:09 ◼   ► electrical engineering major and we do [TS]

00:14:11 ◼   ► go over hardware stuff but I did enough [TS]

00:14:13 ◼   ► hardware stuff to know that I didn't [TS]

00:14:14 ◼   ► like it [TS]

00:14:15 ◼   ► or rather that I like software better [TS]

00:14:16 ◼   ► not that I didn't like it but I [TS]

00:14:17 ◼   ► definitely like software I could see you [TS]

00:14:19 ◼   ► in there with you know a little [TS]

00:14:20 ◼   ► soldering iron kind of you know [TS]

00:14:22 ◼   ► hunkering over one of those little [TS]

00:14:23 ◼   ► RadioShack things or the transistors in [TS]

00:14:26 ◼   ► it yeah you have to do that for class [TS]

00:14:28 ◼   ► but like the people who are building [TS]

00:14:30 ◼   ► these Facebook things are really more [TS]

00:14:32 ◼   ► systems integrators like their specking [TS]

00:14:33 ◼   ► out stuff to hardware manufacturers in [TS]

00:14:35 ◼   ► Taiwan who are you know producing [TS]

00:14:37 ◼   ► prototypes for them and they're getting [TS]

00:14:38 ◼   ► and I think the interesting thing about [TS]

00:14:40 ◼   ► this joan is that there this is mostly [TS]

00:14:42 ◼   ► custom stuff this isn't off the rack so [TS]

00:14:45 ◼   ► yeah that's that's the big deal yes [TS]

00:14:46 ◼   ► Google does all its custom stuff and [TS]

00:14:48 ◼   ► they said we're going to do our custom [TS]

00:14:49 ◼   ► stuff we're going to have a motherboard [TS]

00:14:50 ◼   ► made for us tailored to our exact [TS]

00:14:51 ◼   ► specifications we're going to build our [TS]

00:14:53 ◼   ► own case you know spec out where the [TS]

00:14:55 ◼   ► fans are going to go our own power [TS]

00:14:56 ◼   ► supply the power supply is like half the [TS]

00:14:58 ◼   ► project is they you know design their [TS]

00:14:59 ◼   ► own power supply to be super efficient [TS]

00:15:01 ◼   ► and run off AC and DC Google's power [TS]

00:15:03 ◼   ► supplies I think have built in UBS's so [TS]

00:15:05 ◼   ► they don't to use a big UPS in the data [TS]

00:15:07 ◼   ► center it's all sorts of extremely [TS]

00:15:10 ◼   ► custom stuff here and it would be better [TS]

00:15:12 ◼   ► for Facebook to try to recoup those [TS]

00:15:13 ◼   ► costs by saying everybody let's share [TS]

00:15:14 ◼   ► let's all work on these designs together [TS]

00:15:16 ◼   ► so we don't have to bear the full cost [TS]

00:15:17 ◼   ► of developing this we would like to do [TS]

00:15:18 ◼   ► it as a community google says we'll just [TS]

00:15:20 ◼   ► bear the whole cost and you don't get to [TS]

00:15:22 ◼   ► share with us so I'll definitely be [TS]

00:15:24 ◼   ► watching that space because that will be [TS]

00:15:27 ◼   ► I think it'll be a big indicator of [TS]

00:15:28 ◼   ► where Google sees itself right now I [TS]

00:15:30 ◼   ► haven't heard a thing from Google so I [TS]

00:15:32 ◼   ► think there's a secure and what they [TS]

00:15:34 ◼   ► have and secure and what they're going [TS]

00:15:35 ◼   ► to do next the worst thing I could [TS]

00:15:36 ◼   ► imagine would happen would be that [TS]

00:15:37 ◼   ► Google would say oh yeah here you go you [TS]

00:15:39 ◼   ► want GFS and all this cool stuff we have [TS]

00:15:41 ◼   ► internally here's the version one of all [TS]

00:15:42 ◼   ► those things but internally they using [TS]

00:15:44 ◼   ► version 2 that's like super lame I don't [TS]

00:15:47 ◼   ► think that would be an indication of [TS]

00:15:48 ◼   ► anything except for ill-will on Google's [TS]

00:15:50 ◼   ► part where they're saying we're not [TS]

00:15:51 ◼   ► going to give you the good good stuff [TS]

00:15:52 ◼   ► but if you want to use but we were using [TS]

00:15:54 ◼   ► five years ago go nuts guys it's the [TS]

00:15:57 ◼   ► better than you have now oh where are we [TS]

00:16:02 ◼   ► so I got three more little follow-up [TS]

00:16:06 ◼   ► things but I think I'm going to skip [TS]

00:16:07 ◼   ► them and maybe we'll circle back if we [TS]

00:16:09 ◼   ► have time at the end are you sure ah [TS]

00:16:13 ◼   ► we're about 20 something minutes in well [TS]

00:16:16 ◼   ► so here here are my three things and you [TS]

00:16:18 ◼   ► can pick one of them if you want to do [TS]

00:16:19 ◼   ► it yeah let's let's pick one yeah so one [TS]

00:16:22 ◼   ► is on you're going to plan I'm going to [TS]

00:16:23 ◼   ► complain about George Lucas and Star [TS]

00:16:25 ◼   ► Wars briefly oh that's a whole show I [TS]

00:16:27 ◼   ► know but it's a very it's a very [TS]

00:16:29 ◼   ► specific focus that's number two number [TS]

00:16:32 ◼   ► two is that Quick Pick app that was [TS]

00:16:34 ◼   ► rejected from the Mac App Store this [TS]

00:16:36 ◼   ► week did you see that story I did not [TS]

00:16:38 ◼   ► see that story so maybe that be good was [TS]

00:16:39 ◼   ► another complaining about a projection [TS]

00:16:41 ◼   ► story and number three is Google [TS]

00:16:44 ◼   ► contacts and how they're annoying and [TS]

00:16:46 ◼   ► the options to make them less annoying [TS]

00:16:47 ◼   ► and I want to do that one I would say I [TS]

00:16:50 ◼   ► would say the first one or the second [TS]

00:16:52 ◼   ► one but I uh my gut says go with the [TS]

00:16:54 ◼   ► first one you want to hit okay I'll do [TS]

00:16:56 ◼   ► the Star Wars one this is not your eyes [TS]

00:17:00 ◼   ► I got a whole show about Star Wars I [TS]

00:17:02 ◼   ► don't know how tech related this is but [TS]

00:17:04 ◼   ► I doubt any of our listeners have ever [TS]

00:17:05 ◼   ► seen Star Wars so this keeps coming up [TS]

00:17:08 ◼   ► in my trial I think the thing that [TS]

00:17:09 ◼   ► triggered this same anger and me [TS]

00:17:12 ◼   ► recently was seeing the the blu-ray [TS]

00:17:13 ◼   ► release of Star Wars and stuff that's [TS]

00:17:16 ◼   ► being advertised now and it's just [TS]

00:17:17 ◼   ► making me angry about the stuff again so [TS]

00:17:20 ◼   ► everyone knows what the problem is with [TS]

00:17:22 ◼   ► Star Wars a certain set of fans want the [TS]

00:17:25 ◼   ► original versions without the special [TS]

00:17:27 ◼   ► effects added you know they want the [TS]

00:17:28 ◼   ► cleaned up you know removing the mat [TS]

00:17:30 ◼   ► lines from the optical effects on the [TS]

00:17:33 ◼   ► original fly fighter doesn't look like [TS]

00:17:35 ◼   ► it's on a piece of black cardboard as it [TS]

00:17:37 ◼   ► flies across that's that's deemed [TS]

00:17:38 ◼   ► acceptable because it didn't really [TS]

00:17:40 ◼   ► change the content of the movie but [TS]

00:17:41 ◼   ► anything where you start changing the [TS]

00:17:42 ◼   ► content of the MODY adding scenes adding [TS]

00:17:44 ◼   ► new elements that weren't there people [TS]

00:17:45 ◼   ► don't like that and Lucas as we know it [TS]

00:17:46 ◼   ► doesn't want to release those movies now [TS]

00:17:49 ◼   ► there was this URL that went around [TS]

00:17:50 ◼   ► sometime last year called the secret [TS]

00:17:51 ◼   ► history of Star Wars and it was a [TS]

00:17:53 ◼   ► section it's actually a book now I'll [TS]

00:17:55 ◼   ► link to the site in the show notes but [TS]

00:17:56 ◼   ► but the section of that book was [TS]

00:17:57 ◼   ► specifically about the original print [TS]

00:18:00 ◼   ► itself and one of the excuses that Lucas [TS]

00:18:03 ◼   ► and company have used at various times [TS]

00:18:05 ◼   ► is that even if you wanted the original [TS]

00:18:06 ◼   ► trilogy thing oh that that film doesn't [TS]

00:18:08 ◼   ► exist anymore so all that exists is a [TS]

00:18:11 ◼   ► special edition so tough luck and I will [TS]

00:18:14 ◼   ► link to this thing about the film stock [TS]

00:18:16 ◼   ► of the you know saving the Star Wars [TS]

00:18:18 ◼   ► film and how they cut pieces out of the [TS]

00:18:20 ◼   ► original negatives to make the special [TS]

00:18:21 ◼   ► editions and what you would what would [TS]

00:18:22 ◼   ► be involved in having to try to piece [TS]

00:18:25 ◼   ► together a digital copy of the original [TS]

00:18:27 ◼   ► Algie without the special edition [TS]

00:18:28 ◼   ► effects in it and this thing goes [TS]

00:18:29 ◼   ► through you know it's another excuse [TS]

00:18:31 ◼   ► Lucas's use first he said like the [TS]

00:18:32 ◼   ► footage doesn't exist and secondly said [TS]

00:18:34 ◼   ► well it to make it exist we would have [TS]

00:18:36 ◼   ► to read Italy scan and restore all these [TS]

00:18:38 ◼   ► little bits and pieces of various film [TS]

00:18:40 ◼   ► it would cost like 20 million dollars or [TS]

00:18:42 ◼   ► something like that now it's obvious the [TS]

00:18:45 ◼   ► real reason why he doesn't want these [TS]

00:18:47 ◼   ► things he just doesn't want it he says [TS]

00:18:48 ◼   ► this is my version of the movie I it's [TS]

00:18:50 ◼   ► my movie I get to decide what it is [TS]

00:18:51 ◼   ► that's it but every time he gives a [TS]

00:18:53 ◼   ► financial excuse or an excuse about the [TS]

00:18:56 ◼   ► non-existence of the negatives which is [TS]

00:18:58 ◼   ► basically disproved by this this saving [TS]

00:19:00 ◼   ► Star Wars thing from the secret history [TS]

00:19:02 ◼   ► of Star Wars I think about the unique [TS]

00:19:05 ◼   ► situation that Star Wars is in where a [TS]

00:19:08 ◼   ► lot of times there's something a bunch [TS]

00:19:10 ◼   ► of fans want like some hardcore fan base [TS]

00:19:12 ◼   ► says I want to really want the X version [TS]

00:19:14 ◼   ► of Y and I just want to have this thing [TS]

00:19:16 ◼   ► or whatever and then there's the reality [TS]

00:19:18 ◼   ► what it would take to do that well you [TS]

00:19:19 ◼   ► know it cost 10 million dollars and if [TS]

00:19:21 ◼   ► there's only 100 people or 100,000 or [TS]

00:19:23 ◼   ► whatever you know you won't recoup your [TS]

00:19:24 ◼   ► cost because it costs a lot of money to [TS]

00:19:26 ◼   ► do this work and we simply can't afford [TS]

00:19:27 ◼   ► to do this work for such a small subset [TS]

00:19:28 ◼   ► of fans and this is very true about [TS]

00:19:30 ◼   ► really small narrow interest stuff like [TS]

00:19:33 ◼   ► maybe some particular anime thing that [TS]

00:19:34 ◼   ► you could never justify the cost of [TS]

00:19:35 ◼   ► doing it now Star Wars you can debate [TS]

00:19:37 ◼   ► how many people would buy in a real [TS]

00:19:39 ◼   ► original trilogy you know blu-ray for [TS]

00:19:41 ◼   ► example and maybe it's like it seems [TS]

00:19:44 ◼   ► like a lot in our circles because all of [TS]

00:19:45 ◼   ► our friends want that but in the grand [TS]

00:19:47 ◼   ► scheme of things it's not enough to [TS]

00:19:48 ◼   ► recoup the cost but Star Wars is in a [TS]

00:19:49 ◼   ► unique position because the people who [TS]

00:19:52 ◼   ► want that original trilogy cut of the [TS]

00:19:55 ◼   ► film have a humongous and I'm just [TS]

00:19:58 ◼   ► supposing here but I think you'll [TS]

00:20:00 ◼   ► probably agree with me have a humongous [TS]

00:20:01 ◼   ► overlap with the people who have the [TS]

00:20:04 ◼   ► expertise and access to the equipment to [TS]

00:20:07 ◼   ► do the work for free right probably [TS]

00:20:09 ◼   ► right of all the people in the world [TS]

00:20:11 ◼   ► who'd want the original Star Wars [TS]

00:20:13 ◼   ► trilogy how many of them do you think [TS]

00:20:14 ◼   ► work in the in the film scanning special [TS]

00:20:17 ◼   ► effects industry right who have access [TS]

00:20:20 ◼   ► to the film scanners who are experts in [TS]

00:20:22 ◼   ► this area who would do the work for free [TS]

00:20:24 ◼   ► in a heartbeat [TS]

00:20:25 ◼   ► like if Lucas went out I said of course [TS]

00:20:26 ◼   ► if we want to restore the original [TS]

00:20:28 ◼   ► version of Star Wars and put out a [TS]

00:20:29 ◼   ► blu-ray but we don't want to pay a cent [TS]

00:20:31 ◼   ► for labor to do the work right it would [TS]

00:20:32 ◼   ► get not only would they get volunteers [TS]

00:20:34 ◼   ► at the bhasu they will get volunteers [TS]

00:20:35 ◼   ► who are the very best in their field at [TS]

00:20:38 ◼   ► what they do right willing to volunteer [TS]

00:20:39 ◼   ► their time to do this [TS]

00:20:41 ◼   ► and I just can't even think about you [TS]

00:20:44 ◼   ► know because people are clamoring to do [TS]

00:20:46 ◼   ► this I bet it you know if you put out [TS]

00:20:48 ◼   ► that call in the first day you would [TS]

00:20:50 ◼   ► have the best possible team you could [TS]

00:20:53 ◼   ► assemble and it's willing to work for [TS]

00:20:55 ◼   ► free and so any money that you made off [TS]

00:20:58 ◼   ► this at all like the whole thing for [TS]

00:21:00 ◼   ► free Luke's wouldn't have to be involved [TS]

00:21:01 ◼   ► at all any money you made at us at all [TS]

00:21:03 ◼   ► all you'd have to recoup is the cost of [TS]

00:21:04 ◼   ► the ten cents that would never happen I [TS]

00:21:06 ◼   ► never do that but like it is it's the [TS]

00:21:10 ◼   ► most unique situation where what else [TS]

00:21:12 ◼   ► you gonna get this for free what else [TS]

00:21:13 ◼   ► you gonna say it's a zero risk [TS]

00:21:15 ◼   ► proposition George we will do all the [TS]

00:21:17 ◼   ► work for free or we will do a better job [TS]

00:21:18 ◼   ► on this than you the people who made the [TS]

00:21:20 ◼   ► you know the actual Brewers because the [TS]

00:21:22 ◼   ► people working on this will be working [TS]

00:21:23 ◼   ► at it out of the goodness of their heart [TS]

00:21:25 ◼   ► and they will use like all their skills [TS]

00:21:27 ◼   ► and all their powers to quote from The [TS]

00:21:28 ◼   ► Godfather which we should talk about it [TS]

00:21:30 ◼   ► we'll talk we'll talk about that yeah to [TS]

00:21:33 ◼   ► make this the best blu-ray release ever [TS]

00:21:35 ◼   ► in the history of the universe and if [TS]

00:21:38 ◼   ► they happen to leak a bunch of digital [TS]

00:21:41 ◼   ► scans onto the internet during the [TS]

00:21:42 ◼   ► process then you know oh well but I just [TS]

00:21:46 ◼   ► get angry when I think about that I [TS]

00:21:48 ◼   ► guess maybe someday Lucas will be gone [TS]

00:21:50 ◼   ► and someone else will think about that [TS]

00:21:52 ◼   ► but it just bothers me that all this is [TS]

00:21:55 ◼   ► tied up in economics when we're in a [TS]

00:21:57 ◼   ► situation you're weakened Alex doesn't [TS]

00:21:58 ◼   ► have to matter at all so that was my [TS]

00:22:01 ◼   ► Star Wars thing I don't know how it got [TS]

00:22:02 ◼   ► triggered and how I think I was just [TS]

00:22:03 ◼   ► thinking about movies and seeing the [TS]

00:22:04 ◼   ► Star Wars blu-ray go by on the internet [TS]

00:22:07 ◼   ► and people talking about it and I just [TS]

00:22:08 ◼   ► got angry all over again about that [TS]

00:22:12 ◼   ► that's not even today's topic and before [TS]

00:22:14 ◼   ► we say what today's topic is John this [TS]

00:22:17 ◼   ► is your cue to unplug your microphone [TS]

00:22:19 ◼   ► because they're doing are like our first [TS]

00:22:20 ◼   ► aww answer and and this is a great [TS]

00:22:23 ◼   ► sponsor this is a I love it when I get [TS]

00:22:25 ◼   ► to talk a lot about my personal [TS]

00:22:27 ◼   ► experience with the sponsor and this is [TS]

00:22:28 ◼   ► this is one of them FreshBooks comm [TS]

00:22:30 ◼   ► we've had them on the show before and I [TS]

00:22:33 ◼   ► was using them a little bit but I hadn't [TS]

00:22:36 ◼   ► really made the switch from QuickBooks [TS]

00:22:38 ◼   ► because my accountant was getting say no [TS]

00:22:40 ◼   ► no you know QuickBooks is just easier [TS]

00:22:42 ◼   ► it's easier for us I finally just [TS]

00:22:44 ◼   ► I got to say I said no I'm done with I'm [TS]

00:22:47 ◼   ► done with QuickBooks I can't hit it's [TS]

00:22:49 ◼   ► horrible I need a way I need something [TS]

00:22:51 ◼   ► that's more modern I need something that [TS]

00:22:53 ◼   ► takes the headache out of invoicing be [TS]

00:22:55 ◼   ► I hate it I hate the whole invoicing [TS]

00:22:57 ◼   ► process item night it's not fun trying [TS]

00:22:59 ◼   ► to keep track of have they seen the [TS]

00:23:02 ◼   ► invoice even have they paid it where [TS]

00:23:04 ◼   ► where is it in the process well this is [TS]

00:23:06 ◼   ► the this is the beautiful thing about [TS]

00:23:07 ◼   ► fresh books is that when you send an [TS]

00:23:10 ◼   ► invoice to a customer to a client you [TS]

00:23:14 ◼   ► know instantly if they've seen it forget [TS]

00:23:16 ◼   ► if they've paid it yet it shows you that [TS]

00:23:18 ◼   ► of course well I mean it's it it shows [TS]

00:23:21 ◼   ► you they've seen they have seen the [TS]

00:23:23 ◼   ► invoice it's great [TS]

00:23:24 ◼   ► tons of integration you can set up [TS]

00:23:25 ◼   ► recurring payments and and all kinds of [TS]

00:23:27 ◼   ► stuff and it just takes the headache out [TS]

00:23:29 ◼   ► of this custom logos everything you name [TS]

00:23:31 ◼   ► it and so here's what they're doing for [TS]

00:23:33 ◼   ► hypercritical listeners every week they [TS]

00:23:37 ◼   ► are going to give away a birthday cake [TS]

00:23:40 ◼   ► even if it's not your birthday you can [TS]

00:23:42 ◼   ► still get this they're going to give [TS]

00:23:44 ◼   ► away a cake to a hypercritical listener [TS]

00:23:47 ◼   ► every week so you go to fresh books calm [TS]

00:23:49 ◼   ► you sign up and when you sign up by the [TS]

00:23:52 ◼   ► way that's free it doesn't cost anything [TS]

00:23:53 ◼   ► to sign up you can even send invoices [TS]

00:23:55 ◼   ► and stuff for free you don't you don't [TS]

00:23:58 ◼   ► have to pay anything to trip but please [TS]

00:24:00 ◼   ► do try it out once you get in there [TS]

00:24:01 ◼   ► don't just sign up to get the cake trust [TS]

00:24:02 ◼   ► me you're going to love this once you [TS]

00:24:04 ◼   ► get in there you put in as you're [TS]

00:24:06 ◼   ► filling up hypercritical that's where [TS]

00:24:07 ◼   ► you heard about the show and you will be [TS]

00:24:10 ◼   ► eligible to get one of these free K [TS]

00:24:12 ◼   ► every week they're sending out a cake so [TS]

00:24:15 ◼   ► go check them out fresh books calm [TS]

00:24:17 ◼   ► you're gonna love it [TS]

00:24:18 ◼   ► did you plug back in John are you back [TS]

00:24:20 ◼   ► I'm back you know you mentioned you had [TS]

00:24:22 ◼   ► ditched QuickBooks ya know every word [TS]

00:24:25 ◼   ► reminded me of another legacy financial [TS]

00:24:27 ◼   ► program that a lot of people are stuck [TS]

00:24:28 ◼   ► on each tree so I've got a I use quicken [TS]

00:24:32 ◼   ► here and I use whatever the last version [TS]

00:24:34 ◼   ► of quicken was for Mac OS 10 before they [TS]

00:24:37 ◼   ► went off on this weird quicken life [TS]

00:24:39 ◼   ► financial whatever stuff but it's [TS]

00:24:42 ◼   ► PowerPC only I think it's like quicken [TS]

00:24:44 ◼   ► 2007 or something it's an ancient [TS]

00:24:45 ◼   ► program it's PowerPC only and I'm [TS]

00:24:48 ◼   ► realizing as I'm playing with lion and [TS]

00:24:50 ◼   ► everything that it's going to be a [TS]

00:24:53 ◼   ► problem because lion doesn't seem to run [TS]

00:24:54 ◼   ► Mac OS R PowerPC apps and I thought I [TS]

00:24:59 ◼   ► have no PowerPC apps left but once you [TS]

00:25:01 ◼   ► can't run them at all you realize how [TS]

00:25:03 ◼   ► many you rely on so what the heck am I [TS]

00:25:04 ◼   ► going to do want to upgrade the Lion am [TS]

00:25:06 ◼   ► I just gonna keep one machine back and [TS]

00:25:08 ◼   ► run [TS]

00:25:09 ◼   ► working on it like there's no good [TS]

00:25:11 ◼   ► alternative to it I wish there was I [TS]

00:25:13 ◼   ► know there are a lot of alternatives to [TS]

00:25:15 ◼   ► quicken but like if you're all your data [TS]

00:25:16 ◼   ► is in quicken and you know and you want [TS]

00:25:18 ◼   ► to keep I'd rather just keep using [TS]

00:25:20 ◼   ► quicken because it's what we know how to [TS]

00:25:21 ◼   ► use it works fine [TS]

00:25:23 ◼   ► the fact that it's PowerPC doesn't [TS]

00:25:24 ◼   ► bother me I don't want to go through the [TS]

00:25:26 ◼   ► whole hassle of having to upgrade to [TS]

00:25:27 ◼   ► some other program even if some program [TS]

00:25:30 ◼   ► says that it imports quicken files and [TS]

00:25:32 ◼   ► everything is just a hassle you know oh [TS]

00:25:34 ◼   ► that that's that's gotta meet the press' [TS]

00:25:37 ◼   ► that is QuickBooks for the Mac PowerPC [TS]

00:25:39 ◼   ► or is it Intel I don't quick-quick books [TS]

00:25:42 ◼   ► is Intel well at least the people in a [TS]

00:25:46 ◼   ► better situation with that but yeah hero [TS]

00:25:47 ◼   ► financial program seems like one of [TS]

00:25:49 ◼   ► those I don't want I don't want to do it [TS]

00:25:51 ◼   ► I don't want to do it anymore I don't [TS]

00:25:53 ◼   ► want to have to have this this ancient [TS]

00:25:54 ◼   ► apt of the terrible yet face that's [TS]

00:25:56 ◼   ► what's been happening is the web [TS]

00:25:57 ◼   ► services are taking over a lot of these [TS]

00:25:59 ◼   ► apps that were financial although the [TS]

00:26:02 ◼   ► wigs a lot of people out like putting [TS]

00:26:03 ◼   ► financial information in the web but [TS]

00:26:05 ◼   ► it's clearly the way all these type of [TS]

00:26:08 ◼   ► apps are going you know so maybe that's [TS]

00:26:10 ◼   ► the solution maybe I'm not they just [TS]

00:26:12 ◼   ► they already bought mint so I can't [TS]

00:26:15 ◼   ► really get a way to Roy from Intuit for [TS]

00:26:17 ◼   ► my fan it says I don't know I'm [TS]

00:26:18 ◼   ► depressed about that all right all right [TS]

00:26:20 ◼   ► what's the topic you don't even know but [TS]

00:26:23 ◼   ► we didn't talk about it all I added the [TS]

00:26:25 ◼   ► 30 minutes into the show let's hear the [TS]

00:26:27 ◼   ► topic yeah so this is one you kept [TS]

00:26:29 ◼   ► picking yes weeks and we never did this [TS]

00:26:32 ◼   ► is this is Apple's philosophy and [TS]

00:26:33 ◼   ► practice of UI consistency across the [TS]

00:26:35 ◼   ► years I've been wanting this one I [TS]

00:26:37 ◼   ► didn't think I had much to say on this [TS]

00:26:39 ◼   ► but when I was doing notes for it I [TS]

00:26:40 ◼   ► guess I do I don't know there's so much [TS]

00:26:43 ◼   ► to talk about I mean how far back do you [TS]

00:26:45 ◼   ► want to go that's the real that's how I [TS]

00:26:46 ◼   ► always start that's why I'm not having a [TS]

00:26:48 ◼   ► lot to say that I gotta go back there go [TS]

00:26:49 ◼   ► back then beginning to talk about [TS]

00:26:50 ◼   ► anything you know cuz it keep in mind [TS]

00:26:52 ◼   ► that even though probably I'm guessing a [TS]

00:26:54 ◼   ► lot of our listeners or Mac users they [TS]

00:26:56 ◼   ► may not have been Mac users three years [TS]

00:27:00 ◼   ► ago or five years ago or ten years ago [TS]

00:27:01 ◼   ► or in 1984 like we were not have been [TS]

00:27:05 ◼   ► alive in 1984 very true it's all feel [TS]

00:27:07 ◼   ► old together that's all let's all join [TS]

00:27:08 ◼   ► hands and you know sing songs about our [TS]

00:27:13 ◼   ► misspent youth but anyway the point is [TS]

00:27:15 ◼   ► there are a lot of people who never even [TS]

00:27:18 ◼   ► used OS 9 let alone [TS]

00:27:20 ◼   ► yeah you know then and they don't know [TS]

00:27:22 ◼   ► about the hague and they don't know [TS]

00:27:24 ◼   ► about all of this this extra stuff and [TS]

00:27:26 ◼   ► geeks like us we obsess about this so I [TS]

00:27:29 ◼   ► think there's some stuff that will be [TS]

00:27:30 ◼   ► surprising even for old-timers I'm going [TS]

00:27:32 ◼   ► to try to put a lot of these things in [TS]

00:27:33 ◼   ► the show notes a lot of them are just [TS]

00:27:35 ◼   ► screenshots like disembodied images that [TS]

00:27:37 ◼   ► I googled around for because it's hard [TS]

00:27:38 ◼   ► to find good comprehensive pictures of [TS]

00:27:41 ◼   ► old UIs [TS]

00:27:42 ◼   ► but I would suggest that people actually [TS]

00:27:43 ◼   ► look at them after the show and so they [TS]

00:27:48 ◼   ► can see what I'm talking about here so [TS]

00:27:49 ◼   ► I'm going to go back to the beginning [TS]

00:27:51 ◼   ► with the Mac um now the people who don't [TS]

00:27:54 ◼   ► know the youngins the Mac really was the [TS]

00:27:56 ◼   ► first major GUI platform that had [TS]

00:27:59 ◼   ► widespread success there were gooeys [TS]

00:28:00 ◼   ► before it but they weren't as successful [TS]

00:28:02 ◼   ► as the Mac the neck sort of defined that [TS]

00:28:03 ◼   ► the graphical user interface ah and [TS]

00:28:06 ◼   ► along with that was this big push from [TS]

00:28:09 ◼   ► Apple to get developers to make Mac apps [TS]

00:28:12 ◼   ► that sounds kind of silly it's like well [TS]

00:28:14 ◼   ► obviously you know if you make a new [TS]

00:28:15 ◼   ► platform you want people to make apps [TS]

00:28:17 ◼   ► what would the memo that was they wanted [TS]

00:28:18 ◼   ► you to make an application it looked [TS]

00:28:20 ◼   ► like it belong in the Mac they didn't [TS]

00:28:22 ◼   ► want you to take like a das or Apple to [TS]

00:28:23 ◼   ► program and put it in a window and say [TS]

00:28:25 ◼   ► look I brought my program to the Mac you [TS]

00:28:27 ◼   ► know you double-click this icon the [TS]

00:28:28 ◼   ► program launches and inside the window [TS]

00:28:30 ◼   ► is what you would see previously on on [TS]

00:28:31 ◼   ► the da screen or what you would see [TS]

00:28:32 ◼   ► previously on an Apple 2 screen that is [TS]

00:28:34 ◼   ► the last thing Apple want they wanted [TS]

00:28:35 ◼   ► you to make Mac applications and the [TS]

00:28:38 ◼   ► famous example of them sort of enforcing [TS]

00:28:40 ◼   ► this with hardware they didn't put arrow [TS]

00:28:41 ◼   ► keys on the original Mac's keyboard [TS]

00:28:43 ◼   ► which sounds crazy you know how can you [TS]

00:28:45 ◼   ► have a keep over that arrow keys but [TS]

00:28:46 ◼   ► that was their clear signal to people [TS]

00:28:48 ◼   ► writing applications do not make no [TS]

00:28:51 ◼   ► function keys either by the way do not [TS]

00:28:52 ◼   ► make the dots application in a window do [TS]

00:28:54 ◼   ► not make an Apple 2 application in a [TS]

00:28:55 ◼   ► window there are no arrow keys you have [TS]

00:28:57 ◼   ► to use the mouse make a Mac application [TS]

00:28:59 ◼   ► and this was part of their push to sort [TS]

00:29:02 ◼   ► of establish the GUI is a viable [TS]

00:29:03 ◼   ► paradigm for computing which also sounds [TS]

00:29:05 ◼   ► ridiculous like you know people or [TS]

00:29:08 ◼   ► younger don't even realize that there [TS]

00:29:10 ◼   ► was a long time before the GUI was [TS]

00:29:11 ◼   ► anything and there was it you know you [TS]

00:29:13 ◼   ► had to computer with a mouse attached it [TS]

00:29:15 ◼   ► was like there must be some toy computer [TS]

00:29:16 ◼   ► is it a fisher-price you know real men [TS]

00:29:18 ◼   ► use the command-line interface this is [TS]

00:29:20 ◼   ► not a real computer there's good decade [TS]

00:29:23 ◼   ► of that after the Mac was introduced of [TS]

00:29:25 ◼   ► dismissing it as a toy so Apple was you [TS]

00:29:28 ◼   ► know Apple's challenge was make this [TS]

00:29:31 ◼   ► acceptable maple people to understand [TS]

00:29:32 ◼   ► that it's OK for a computer to [TS]

00:29:34 ◼   ► like this and that you should make your [TS]

00:29:35 ◼   ► applications look like this and that [TS]

00:29:37 ◼   ► that old stuff with the command line [TS]

00:29:38 ◼   ► that's going away and that was an [TS]

00:29:41 ◼   ► incredibly tough sell and if you didn't [TS]

00:29:43 ◼   ► live through it it's hard to even [TS]

00:29:44 ◼   ► imagine that this would be an issue of [TS]

00:29:45 ◼   ► debate because nowadays you could not [TS]

00:29:47 ◼   ► get a regular person to sit in front of [TS]

00:29:48 ◼   ► a command line and do anything but back [TS]

00:29:50 ◼   ► then that was the dominant metaphor for [TS]

00:29:53 ◼   ► interfacing with a computer you know [TS]

00:29:55 ◼   ► that was considered and I'll just [TS]

00:29:57 ◼   ► mention this there was a notion for many [TS]

00:30:00 ◼   ► years that even even the youngest in our [TS]

00:30:03 ◼   ► audience should remember that it was [TS]

00:30:06 ◼   ► considered that that Mac's were for [TS]

00:30:09 ◼   ► artists and designers and maybe [TS]

00:30:11 ◼   ► musicians and pcs were like if you [TS]

00:30:13 ◼   ► wanted to do real work you know you're [TS]

00:30:15 ◼   ► in business you get a PC even that was a [TS]

00:30:18 ◼   ► triumph even that was a triumph to say [TS]

00:30:20 ◼   ► yes there was a class of people for whom [TS]

00:30:23 ◼   ► the Mac is actually useful tool like [TS]

00:30:24 ◼   ► just getting the artist to because [TS]

00:30:26 ◼   ► previously was just like oh come on [TS]

00:30:27 ◼   ► you're not gonna buy this thing it's [TS]

00:30:28 ◼   ► like a fisher-price I mean you can't do [TS]

00:30:30 ◼   ► a thing with it it's got these pictures [TS]

00:30:31 ◼   ► on the screen is it for kids or [TS]

00:30:32 ◼   ► something you know it's useless for [TS]

00:30:34 ◼   ► every button and finally you know [TS]

00:30:35 ◼   ► desktop publishing and stuff like that [TS]

00:30:37 ◼   ► came in all right so fine I guess it's [TS]

00:30:38 ◼   ► okay for those hippies yeah we had we [TS]

00:30:40 ◼   ► had a medical study at our school that [TS]

00:30:42 ◼   ► that was the one of the the only ones [TS]

00:30:45 ◼   ► and it was the Makah see that we did the [TS]

00:30:47 ◼   ► school newspaper and like the yearbook [TS]

00:30:50 ◼   ► on and people would line up waiting to [TS]

00:30:52 ◼   ► use this thing but but people need to [TS]

00:30:55 ◼   ► remember that John I think that that the [TS]

00:30:57 ◼   ► Mac was off in this own like there was a [TS]

00:30:59 ◼   ► you needed to have a mouse because there [TS]

00:31:01 ◼   ► were a lot of people that didn't have a [TS]

00:31:02 ◼   ► mouse that was not weird oh yeah again [TS]

00:31:06 ◼   ► for years and years and years pcs did [TS]

00:31:08 ◼   ► not come with the mouse or any kind of [TS]

00:31:09 ◼   ► pointing device they just ignored what [TS]

00:31:11 ◼   ► the Mac was doing and then you know the [TS]

00:31:12 ◼   ► fact that Mac started going desktop [TS]

00:31:14 ◼   ► publishing and I still find there's some [TS]

00:31:15 ◼   ► class of users they need to use this [TS]

00:31:17 ◼   ► type of computer but seriously if you're [TS]

00:31:18 ◼   ► going to liam Peter for your house [TS]

00:31:19 ◼   ► obviously you get a PC and don't worry [TS]

00:31:21 ◼   ► about that Mouse and gooey stuff it's [TS]

00:31:22 ◼   ► silly and we have Windows anyway and [TS]

00:31:24 ◼   ► it's almost the same thing right so the [TS]

00:31:26 ◼   ► advent of Windows you know and the [TS]

00:31:28 ◼   ► popularization of Windows was an [TS]

00:31:29 ◼   ► admission that maybe there is something [TS]

00:31:32 ◼   ► the scoobies thing but Windows ran from [TS]

00:31:33 ◼   ► das and it was a whole other you know [TS]

00:31:36 ◼   ► thing there I might a quick aside on [TS]

00:31:39 ◼   ► Windows and das my favorite thing about [TS]

00:31:42 ◼   ► Windows the windows and das battle this [TS]

00:31:44 ◼   ► is this is a slight tangent here but you [TS]

00:31:46 ◼   ► know when I was [TS]

00:31:47 ◼   ► of all windows versus the Mac and as we [TS]

00:31:49 ◼   ► all know Windows came to dominate but in [TS]

00:31:51 ◼   ► the beginning it was a bunch of DOS [TS]

00:31:52 ◼   ► people installing Windows 3.1 which was [TS]

00:31:54 ◼   ► like the first decent version that [TS]

00:31:56 ◼   ► operated anything like a real GUI had [TS]

00:31:59 ◼   ► overlapping windows and mouse support [TS]

00:32:00 ◼   ► and stuff like that and the way you [TS]

00:32:02 ◼   ► would do it is you install Windows but [TS]

00:32:04 ◼   ► then when you booted your computer you'd [TS]

00:32:05 ◼   ► be at a DOS prompt and what you would do [TS]

00:32:07 ◼   ► at the DOS prompt is type win which is [TS]

00:32:09 ◼   ► short for Windows that was a shorter [TS]

00:32:11 ◼   ► version they launched windows Mary and [TS]

00:32:13 ◼   ► the sheer psychological weight of [TS]

00:32:16 ◼   ► millions of PC users typing the word win [TS]

00:32:19 ◼   ► there Wow has always just sat on my [TS]

00:32:23 ◼   ► shoulders think how much did this have [TS]

00:32:25 ◼   ► to do with Windows winning the the [TS]

00:32:27 ◼   ► desktop battle because at that point was [TS]

00:32:28 ◼   ► only geeks who are using any kind of [TS]

00:32:30 ◼   ► computer and we all knew there was this [TS]

00:32:32 ◼   ► battle hood desktop and here these users [TS]

00:32:33 ◼   ► typing win win win win millions of every [TS]

00:32:37 ◼   ► day win win and just the repetition had [TS]

00:32:41 ◼   ► to hammer into their head you know a [TS]

00:32:42 ◼   ► psychological predisposition to think [TS]

00:32:44 ◼   ► that Windows was going to win the Mac PC [TS]

00:32:45 ◼   ► wars that is that perhaps the [TS]

00:32:47 ◼   ► touchy-feely 'us hippie dippie ASEC [TS]

00:32:49 ◼   ► splen asian for why the Mac lost the war [TS]

00:32:51 ◼   ► for the desktop that you could possibly [TS]

00:32:53 ◼   ► imagine but it is always not sat right [TS]

00:32:54 ◼   ► with me and I just wonder if there's [TS]

00:32:56 ◼   ► someone inside Microsoft who decided to [TS]

00:32:58 ◼   ► put in that little shortcut who was [TS]

00:33:00 ◼   ► smiling as people were typing it all [TS]

00:33:03 ◼   ► right go back back to the GUI time so [TS]

00:33:05 ◼   ► the Mac with the first major GUI [TS]

00:33:07 ◼   ► something that gooeys came with the [TS]

00:33:10 ◼   ► command line things didn't really was [TS]

00:33:11 ◼   ► that it came with like parts out of the [TS]

00:33:13 ◼   ► box you know if you're writing a GUI app [TS]

00:33:15 ◼   ► you don't have to draw every pixel [TS]

00:33:17 ◼   ► yourself it came with a bunch of parts [TS]

00:33:18 ◼   ► you want to draw a button the operating [TS]

00:33:20 ◼   ► system had a way to draw a button for [TS]

00:33:21 ◼   ► you if you wanted to our window the [TS]

00:33:23 ◼   ► operating system had a way to draw a [TS]

00:33:24 ◼   ► window for you it had scroll bars [TS]

00:33:25 ◼   ► cursors menus little pieces from which [TS]

00:33:27 ◼   ► you can assemble your application right [TS]

00:33:30 ◼   ► but on top of that Apple had their [TS]

00:33:32 ◼   ► written guidelines like here's how you [TS]

00:33:34 ◼   ► assemble these parts to make something [TS]

00:33:36 ◼   ► that is an appropriate Mac application [TS]

00:33:38 ◼   ► so first of all definitely use these [TS]

00:33:39 ◼   ► parts don't you know do a command line [TS]

00:33:41 ◼   ► thing inside a window but second well [TS]

00:33:42 ◼   ► when you use the parts here's how you do [TS]

00:33:44 ◼   ► it when you have a dialog box put these [TS]

00:33:45 ◼   ► two buttons on them the okay button goes [TS]

00:33:47 ◼   ► over here the cancel button goes over [TS]

00:33:48 ◼   ► there the default button you know should [TS]

00:33:50 ◼   ► look like this make sure there always is [TS]

00:33:51 ◼   ► a default button all these sorts of [TS]

00:33:53 ◼   ► guidelines and they call it The Hague [TS]

00:33:55 ◼   ► the human interface guidelines now human [TS]

00:33:58 ◼   ► interface guidelines existed before the [TS]

00:33:59 ◼   ► Mac but [TS]

00:34:00 ◼   ► they were more important for the Mac [TS]

00:34:01 ◼   ► because here were these parts that you [TS]

00:34:03 ◼   ► were going to assemble to make an [TS]

00:34:04 ◼   ► application you can assemble these parts [TS]

00:34:06 ◼   ► and also it's a different way so there [TS]

00:34:07 ◼   ► was much more stricter guys much [TS]

00:34:09 ◼   ► stricter guidelines than you had for [TS]

00:34:10 ◼   ► example for the Apple to wear they had [TS]

00:34:12 ◼   ► some guidelines about you know keyboard [TS]

00:34:13 ◼   ► commands and how input should look and [TS]

00:34:15 ◼   ► stuff like that but it wasn't like when [TS]

00:34:17 ◼   ► you draw this in the screen this should [TS]

00:34:18 ◼   ► be this many pixels away from that this [TS]

00:34:19 ◼   ► should be over here this should be [TS]

00:34:20 ◼   ► aligned with that it was just you know [TS]

00:34:21 ◼   ► much stricter and the guidelines that [TS]

00:34:25 ◼   ► were there were an attempt to not only [TS]

00:34:29 ◼   ► make Mac applications like Mac [TS]

00:34:30 ◼   ► application so make them all look like [TS]

00:34:32 ◼   ► each other because they were trying to [TS]

00:34:33 ◼   ► push the benefits of the GUI which is [TS]

00:34:36 ◼   ► not only that it's easier to use but [TS]

00:34:37 ◼   ► that once you learn how to use one Mac [TS]

00:34:39 ◼   ► application you can use any of them you [TS]

00:34:41 ◼   ► know so this may be foreign and crazy [TS]

00:34:42 ◼   ► for you moving around this little thing [TS]

00:34:44 ◼   ► with the cord hanging from a ball in the [TS]

00:34:45 ◼   ► bottom but once you figure out how to do [TS]

00:34:46 ◼   ► it once the next application you use you [TS]

00:34:48 ◼   ► won't have that learning curve again [TS]

00:34:50 ◼   ► provided that we can get all developers [TS]

00:34:52 ◼   ► to make their applications look the same [TS]

00:34:53 ◼   ► way to behave the same way to have [TS]

00:34:55 ◼   ► similar you know menu structures similar [TS]

00:34:57 ◼   ► dialog boxes so that you would see the [TS]

00:35:00 ◼   ► benefit of the GUI and then applicants I [TS]

00:35:01 ◼   ► see huh GUI pretty good right now during [TS]

00:35:06 ◼   ► this time you had people who saw the Mac [TS]

00:35:08 ◼   ► and said wow this is awesome like it's [TS]

00:35:09 ◼   ► clearly the way all computers are going [TS]

00:35:11 ◼   ► to be the Mac is awesome I love the Mac [TS]

00:35:12 ◼   ► that would have been me as a kid and [TS]

00:35:14 ◼   ► lots of other people alright and they're [TS]

00:35:16 ◼   ► there Apple itself had sort of a similar [TS]

00:35:19 ◼   ► fervor to say we want the maxes to seed [TS]

00:35:21 ◼   ► we want to establish the GUI as a [TS]

00:35:23 ◼   ► dominant paradigm because we have the [TS]

00:35:25 ◼   ► best GUI and therefore we will win now [TS]

00:35:27 ◼   ► what happened during that time I think [TS]

00:35:28 ◼   ► is sort of the the fervor to establish [TS]

00:35:31 ◼   ► the GUI got tangled up with religious [TS]

00:35:35 ◼   ► adherence to the hIgG because the Mac [TS]

00:35:37 ◼   ► fans would be like we love the GUI and [TS]

00:35:39 ◼   ► if you're writing GUI map you got you [TS]

00:35:41 ◼   ► got to follow these guidelines and since [TS]

00:35:43 ◼   ► we're you know geeks and otaku would be [TS]

00:35:46 ◼   ► a better term we're just obsessive about [TS]

00:35:47 ◼   ► this stuff you have to follow the hague [TS]

00:35:49 ◼   ► because here's the hague the Higa's are [TS]

00:35:50 ◼   ► you know the held it like the bible the [TS]

00:35:52 ◼   ► hague is our bible if you want to join [TS]

00:35:54 ◼   ► us this is what you have to do and if [TS]

00:35:55 ◼   ► you don't follow the hague you're not [TS]

00:35:56 ◼   ► helping the platform succeed right and [TS]

00:36:00 ◼   ► and that that you know i think it's just [TS]

00:36:02 ◼   ► for the people way back then who are in [TS]

00:36:04 ◼   ► in the midst of that revolution there [TS]

00:36:06 ◼   ► that the strongest adherence to the hIgG [TS]

00:36:08 ◼   ► is the bible you have to do what it says [TS]

00:36:10 ◼   ► and if you don't you are you're making a [TS]

00:36:13 ◼   ► lesser application [TS]

00:36:14 ◼   ► but in reality even Apple itself was [TS]

00:36:18 ◼   ► never as rigid as these as these people [TS]

00:36:20 ◼   ► who were the the rabid Apple fans were [TS]

00:36:23 ◼   ► Apple did want its platform succeed and [TS]

00:36:24 ◼   ► it did say you should use the hIgG but [TS]

00:36:26 ◼   ► they were the G is for guideline not [TS]

00:36:27 ◼   ► gospel all right if you look at like the [TS]

00:36:31 ◼   ► original Mac that came out of the box in [TS]

00:36:32 ◼   ► 1984 one of which I had from day one [TS]

00:36:36 ◼   ► Apple was not did not feel constrained [TS]

00:36:39 ◼   ► by the human interface guidelines it did [TS]

00:36:40 ◼   ► itself had written for the Mac because [TS]

00:36:42 ◼   ► if you if you look the best example I [TS]

00:36:44 ◼   ► was trying to think of an example from [TS]

00:36:45 ◼   ► the original Mac that you look at and [TS]

00:36:46 ◼   ► say this does not follow The Hague this [TS]

00:36:48 ◼   ► is completely wrong not only is it wrong [TS]

00:36:50 ◼   ► but it's a giant mess so if I had to [TS]

00:36:53 ◼   ► think one thing I would pick the control [TS]

00:36:54 ◼   ► panel do you remember with the original [TS]

00:36:55 ◼   ► Macintosh control panel look like yeah I [TS]

00:36:58 ◼   ► think I do it was it was you know a one [TS]

00:37:00 ◼   ► screen thing and it had all the little [TS]

00:37:01 ◼   ► icons inside of it and you'd pick the [TS]

00:37:04 ◼   ► one that you want to double click it and [TS]

00:37:05 ◼   ► it would it would sort of launch them as [TS]

00:37:07 ◼   ► individual apps right no you gotta go [TS]

00:37:09 ◼   ► way farther back right open I will put [TS]

00:37:11 ◼   ► it in the show notes the original [TS]

00:37:12 ◼   ► control panel that's right it was just [TS]

00:37:13 ◼   ► one it was one winning with and you [TS]

00:37:16 ◼   ► could pick the background with a little [TS]

00:37:17 ◼   ► background widget and you could pick the [TS]

00:37:19 ◼   ► the fight yeah that was good I missed [TS]

00:37:21 ◼   ► that that was so simple it was one [TS]

00:37:23 ◼   ► window and there is pretty much not a [TS]

00:37:26 ◼   ► standard control anywhere and I gotta [TS]

00:37:28 ◼   ► find a screenshot of this for the show [TS]

00:37:30 ◼   ► no it will be in the shop I found he's [TS]

00:37:32 ◼   ► already oh you already got it excellent [TS]

00:37:33 ◼   ► so actually I'll send it to you now send [TS]

00:37:36 ◼   ► it to me now I go look at it right now I [TS]

00:37:37 ◼   ► remember that how those little [TS]

00:37:38 ◼   ► backgrounds were so cool and it had did [TS]

00:37:41 ◼   ► but there was a different you had to how [TS]

00:37:43 ◼   ► did you change the sounds you have to [TS]

00:37:44 ◼   ► get that separate what was the name of [TS]

00:37:46 ◼   ► the app that let you put the house [TS]

00:37:47 ◼   ► sounds on there for the ejecting the [TS]

00:37:48 ◼   ► track that was much later but yeah there [TS]

00:37:50 ◼   ► was kaboom and so masters of my sound [TS]

00:37:53 ◼   ► master this is this is the original max [TS]

00:37:54 ◼   ► at it out of the box no no contamination [TS]

00:37:57 ◼   ► from third-party applications is what [TS]

00:37:59 ◼   ► they're shipping with on day one and the [TS]

00:38:01 ◼   ► control panel which is a pretty darn [TS]

00:38:02 ◼   ► important piece of functionality because [TS]

00:38:03 ◼   ► it's the only place you can change the [TS]

00:38:04 ◼   ► volume of the computer change the mouse [TS]

00:38:06 ◼   ► track and stuff like that you know it [TS]

00:38:10 ◼   ► has no standard controls on it it's got [TS]

00:38:11 ◼   ► this crazy little thing with a mouse [TS]

00:38:13 ◼   ► with lines come in front it lets you [TS]

00:38:15 ◼   ► change the mouse speed and has a zero [TS]

00:38:16 ◼   ► and a one button what the heck to those [TS]

00:38:18 ◼   ► mean I guess one is faster than zero for [TS]

00:38:20 ◼   ► the keyboard key press speed it has a [TS]

00:38:22 ◼   ► little bit I con of a turtle and then [TS]

00:38:24 ◼   ► the number zero through four and the [TS]

00:38:25 ◼   ► little icon of a rabbit [TS]

00:38:27 ◼   ► slow the rabbit is fast and then it has [TS]

00:38:29 ◼   ► like a thing you're pressing a button [TS]

00:38:30 ◼   ► and another series of numbers these none [TS]

00:38:32 ◼   ► of these are standard controls and [TS]

00:38:33 ◼   ► they're nonsensical like this is the [TS]

00:38:35 ◼   ► original you know this is the brush [TS]

00:38:37 ◼   ► metal of its day this out of the gate [TS]

00:38:39 ◼   ► Apple is saying we have these guidelines [TS]

00:38:41 ◼   ► but we are going to make an important [TS]

00:38:42 ◼   ► part of the system totally disregard [TS]

00:38:44 ◼   ► every single one the only thing this [TS]

00:38:45 ◼   ► thing has on it's a standard control is [TS]

00:38:46 ◼   ► the title bar the title bar has a closed [TS]

00:38:48 ◼   ► box on it it's a standard title bar and [TS]

00:38:50 ◼   ► maybe you could say the volume slider is [TS]

00:38:52 ◼   ► a standard slider control I don't think [TS]

00:38:53 ◼   ► is so cool like that is insane and if [TS]

00:38:57 ◼   ► Apple today came out and like Mac OS 10 [TS]

00:38:59 ◼   ► line and I had some app UI like that [TS]

00:39:01 ◼   ► people would flip out right so this this [TS]

00:39:05 ◼   ► is my first example of how the adherence [TS]

00:39:08 ◼   ► to the hague is really sort of an [TS]

00:39:11 ◼   ► illusion of the the faithful and that [TS]

00:39:13 ◼   ► Apple never felt constrained fine never [TS]

00:39:16 ◼   ► never never felt constrained by now if [TS]

00:39:18 ◼   ► we go forward through time you know to [TS]

00:39:20 ◼   ► say did they get this out of the system [TS]

00:39:22 ◼   ► that was there ever a golden era where [TS]

00:39:23 ◼   ► they said okay now you know forget about [TS]

00:39:25 ◼   ► that crazy stuff forget about the custom [TS]

00:39:26 ◼   ► controls forget about these windows that [TS]

00:39:27 ◼   ► make no sense but the funny icons that [TS]

00:39:29 ◼   ► you can't figure out we're gonna [TS]

00:39:30 ◼   ► everything's gonna be standard right [TS]

00:39:31 ◼   ► that's that's the one yeah but I don't [TS]

00:39:33 ◼   ► think they ever got there because in [TS]

00:39:35 ◼   ► like I'm gonna I'm gonna fast-forward to [TS]

00:39:37 ◼   ► system 7 system 6 was didn't change too [TS]

00:39:41 ◼   ► much from the other ones it introduced [TS]

00:39:42 ◼   ► color banana mineral matter but system 7 [TS]

00:39:44 ◼   ► was the first OS with real color in it [TS]

00:39:46 ◼   ► all right um now I'm always a fan of [TS]

00:39:49 ◼   ► system 7 because they could have gone [TS]

00:39:50 ◼   ► much crazier with the color in system 7 [TS]

00:39:52 ◼   ► so some 7 was the first one written [TS]

00:39:53 ◼   ► written from day one to support color [TS]

00:39:55 ◼   ► and they could have made everything like [TS]

00:39:56 ◼   ► purple and blue or like you know like [TS]

00:39:59 ◼   ► windows basically they could have used [TS]

00:40:00 ◼   ► garish color everywhere instead what [TS]

00:40:02 ◼   ► they did was they took the original look [TS]

00:40:03 ◼   ► and I just highlighted it with just a [TS]

00:40:05 ◼   ► little bit of color around the edges [TS]

00:40:06 ◼   ► like very subtle light color [TS]

00:40:08 ◼   ► highlighting the edges of the existing [TS]

00:40:10 ◼   ► black and white art do you have any [TS]

00:40:11 ◼   ► screenshots yeah oh I'll have I need to [TS]

00:40:14 ◼   ► see these so we can talk about you don't [TS]

00:40:16 ◼   ► remember what system 6 looks like no I [TS]

00:40:17 ◼   ► remember a member system 7 so I don't [TS]

00:40:20 ◼   ► have any good system stuff in [TS]

00:40:21 ◼   ► screenshots and notes but I will get one [TS]

00:40:23 ◼   ► for you at the end of the show but you [TS]

00:40:24 ◼   ► know a system 7 look like Rio I loved [TS]

00:40:26 ◼   ► system 7 that was my that was my [TS]

00:40:28 ◼   ► favorite Mac OS since up to now up to [TS]

00:40:30 ◼   ► present [TS]

00:40:31 ◼   ► not including present rather yeah I [TS]

00:40:34 ◼   ► think I think for me leopard is on par [TS]

00:40:37 ◼   ► with system 7 so some well Snow Leopard [TS]

00:40:39 ◼   ► is better for me system 7 is [TS]

00:40:41 ◼   ► tied up in the age that I was at the [TS]

00:40:42 ◼   ► time so the original system seven is [TS]

00:40:44 ◼   ► these operating system release I was [TS]

00:40:46 ◼   ► most excited about on the one that I was [TS]

00:40:47 ◼   ► most satisfied with which really has no [TS]

00:40:50 ◼   ► foundation in the facts because system [TS]

00:40:53 ◼   ► seven itself was a little bit buggy and [TS]

00:40:55 ◼   ► you know there wasn't even a fonts [TS]

00:40:56 ◼   ► folder until 7.1 and it was clearly [TS]

00:40:58 ◼   ► shipped out early and a lot of a lot of [TS]

00:41:00 ◼   ► things not to recommend system seven but [TS]

00:41:01 ◼   ► because of where I was in my life at a [TS]

00:41:03 ◼   ► time and how excited I was about it that [TS]

00:41:04 ◼   ► that was the best the ID that our [TS]

00:41:07 ◼   ► friends the Nerds in the chat room have [TS]

00:41:09 ◼   ► submitted it's a very nice screen system [TS]

00:41:13 ◼   ► yes isn't that a guidebook GUI site now [TS]

00:41:16 ◼   ► I don't need I don't need to look at it [TS]

00:41:18 ◼   ► cuz I assist them something has burned [TS]

00:41:19 ◼   ► in my brain and it feels good to look at [TS]

00:41:21 ◼   ► it alright but even in system seven [TS]

00:41:23 ◼   ► Apple still you know they made new [TS]

00:41:26 ◼   ► guidelines for color and everything and [TS]

00:41:27 ◼   ► how things should look in a bunch of new [TS]

00:41:28 ◼   ► controls but they still said yeah this [TS]

00:41:31 ◼   ► doesn't apply to us I mean do you [TS]

00:41:32 ◼   ► remember the CD player application [TS]

00:41:34 ◼   ► mm-hmm right that was like the iTunes of [TS]

00:41:38 ◼   ► its day but even worse all right so [TS]

00:41:40 ◼   ► first of all the CD application again [TS]

00:41:42 ◼   ► had no standard controls that are [TS]

00:41:43 ◼   ► discerned anywhere on it every control [TS]

00:41:45 ◼   ► was custom and only were they custom [TS]

00:41:47 ◼   ► didn't even look like standard control [TS]

00:41:48 ◼   ► so the buttons look like physical [TS]

00:41:49 ◼   ► buttons right on an actual CD player and [TS]

00:41:52 ◼   ► it looked like there was a little deck [TS]

00:41:53 ◼   ► for stuff to go in there was lots of [TS]

00:41:55 ◼   ► recesses and highlights and stuff like [TS]

00:41:57 ◼   ► that I mean it's play space us in the [TS]

00:42:00 ◼   ► chat room because people I want to take [TS]

00:42:02 ◼   ► a look at it too but not only was it [TS]

00:42:04 ◼   ► crazy-looking even the title bar by the [TS]

00:42:06 ◼   ► way even the title bars notice the end [TS]

00:42:07 ◼   ► of the clothes which it was not a [TS]

00:42:08 ◼   ► complete custom you are but on top of [TS]

00:42:11 ◼   ► that you could change the color of the [TS]

00:42:12 ◼   ► thing you could pick black or like a [TS]

00:42:14 ◼   ► hundred percent separate saturated red [TS]

00:42:16 ◼   ► or I think other colors were yellow or [TS]

00:42:18 ◼   ► blue or green you could change the [TS]

00:42:19 ◼   ► entire GUI to some incredibly garish [TS]

00:42:22 ◼   ► color and again if they came out with a [TS]

00:42:24 ◼   ► version of iTunes and said now it comes [TS]

00:42:26 ◼   ► in colors and you can pick from this [TS]

00:42:27 ◼   ► popup menu and change the color of the [TS]

00:42:29 ◼   ► whole app and by the way there's not a [TS]

00:42:30 ◼   ► standard control anywhere to be found in [TS]

00:42:32 ◼   ► the app people will go nuts yeah and [TS]

00:42:33 ◼   ► this is basically the equivalent of [TS]

00:42:34 ◼   ► iTunes it was the audio player of its [TS]

00:42:36 ◼   ► day there was no mp3 is just playing [TS]

00:42:37 ◼   ► audio CDs from your CD Drive which is a [TS]

00:42:40 ◼   ► you know advanced technology and the [TS]

00:42:44 ◼   ► rest of the OS was you know fairly [TS]

00:42:46 ◼   ► standard but they never felt any [TS]

00:42:48 ◼   ► compunction from just completely going [TS]

00:42:50 ◼   ► off the map to do whatever the heck they [TS]

00:42:51 ◼   ► wanted but no reason like why did the CD [TS]

00:42:53 ◼   ► player look like that leaves it a better [TS]

00:42:55 ◼   ► application [TS]

00:42:55 ◼   ► because of that you know was there some [TS]

00:42:57 ◼   ► reason that it had to be non-standard [TS]

00:43:00 ◼   ► hey it's the apple of today has always [TS]

00:43:04 ◼   ► been the end apples always been like [TS]

00:43:06 ◼   ► that it's not a new phenomenon that you [TS]

00:43:08 ◼   ► make a great point and I'd forgotten [TS]

00:43:10 ◼   ► about some of these these things they [TS]

00:43:12 ◼   ► didn't and that's true they always have [TS]

00:43:14 ◼   ► been kind of weird here's the height of [TS]

00:43:17 ◼   ► apples and sanity I think if you could [TS]

00:43:19 ◼   ► say it today that they're not as bad as [TS]

00:43:20 ◼   ► they had once been this would be the [TS]

00:43:21 ◼   ► peak the peak was when they were comment [TS]

00:43:22 ◼   ► doing the the Copeland project which was [TS]

00:43:24 ◼   ► going to be the next generation Mac OS [TS]

00:43:26 ◼   ► but it was modern and everything this [TS]

00:43:28 ◼   ► was the original Mac OS 8 Apple [TS]

00:43:30 ◼   ► eventually released something called Mac [TS]

00:43:31 ◼   ► OS 8 but is not this this was their [TS]

00:43:33 ◼   ► original project of this and they had a [TS]

00:43:35 ◼   ► technology in there called the [TS]

00:43:36 ◼   ► appearance manager which would let you [TS]

00:43:38 ◼   ► change the appearance of all the [TS]

00:43:40 ◼   ► standard controls to whatever the heck [TS]

00:43:41 ◼   ► you want and Apple itself made a bunch [TS]

00:43:44 ◼   ► of themes for the appearance manager and [TS]

00:43:46 ◼   ► their themes the appearance manager were [TS]

00:43:49 ◼   ► crazy like they were clearly just trying [TS]

00:43:51 ◼   ► to show off what it was that they could [TS]

00:43:53 ◼   ► do with the appearance manager I pasted [TS]

00:43:55 ◼   ► some more URLs into the chat here so I [TS]

00:43:58 ◼   ► don't know if people remember these but [TS]

00:43:59 ◼   ► one of them was called gizmo and gizmo [TS]

00:44:02 ◼   ► gizmo had made the window border into [TS]

00:44:06 ◼   ► squiggly lines and is I don't know how [TS]

00:44:12 ◼   ► to describe it it's obvious it's obvious [TS]

00:44:13 ◼   ► ly something you would not want to use [TS]

00:44:15 ◼   ► like it's just you know this is clearly [TS]

00:44:16 ◼   ► for kids or something like that right [TS]

00:44:18 ◼   ► that's what people would say about the [TS]

00:44:20 ◼   ► top widgets look like you know a spike [TS]

00:44:23 ◼   ► with a bunch of colored blocks stuck [TS]

00:44:25 ◼   ► onto it and the borders were striped and [TS]

00:44:27 ◼   ► the scroll bars were red right and then [TS]

00:44:29 ◼   ► they have made one called high tech [TS]

00:44:30 ◼   ► which was all black and dark and Blade [TS]

00:44:32 ◼   ► Runner in all the world there are black [TS]

00:44:33 ◼   ► that actually looks looks like what they [TS]

00:44:36 ◼   ► had in Linux on the Enlightenment window [TS]

00:44:39 ◼   ► yes years the high tech one does look [TS]

00:44:41 ◼   ► like a Linux scheme slot but the key [TS]

00:44:44 ◼   ► feature that the technology in question [TS]

00:44:46 ◼   ► here was that they were saying we're [TS]

00:44:47 ◼   ► going to build into the operating system [TS]

00:44:48 ◼   ► a way for you to change what every [TS]

00:44:50 ◼   ► single thing looks and look how far they [TS]

00:44:51 ◼   ► had come from saying every Mac [TS]

00:44:53 ◼   ► application has to look and behave the [TS]

00:44:54 ◼   ► same just saying okay I think people get [TS]

00:44:56 ◼   ► the GUI now but you know let's let you [TS]

00:44:58 ◼   ► change anything you want right now Mac [TS]

00:45:01 ◼   ► OS 8 Copeland did not ship instead they [TS]

00:45:04 ◼   ► shipped a evolution of Mac OS 7 system 7 [TS]

00:45:08 ◼   ► that they eventually renamed [TS]

00:45:09 ◼   ► Mac OS 7.6 that they eventually renamed [TS]

00:45:11 ◼   ► Mac OS 8 and they add a lot of these [TS]

00:45:13 ◼   ► technologies to it so the appearance [TS]

00:45:14 ◼   ► manager actually shipped in the real Mac [TS]

00:45:16 ◼   ► OS 8 which was just an evolution of [TS]

00:45:18 ◼   ► system 7 and so you could do you know [TS]

00:45:21 ◼   ► themes and stuff for an in fact if you [TS]

00:45:23 ◼   ► if you manage to get your hands on the [TS]

00:45:25 ◼   ► Apple themes they would work in the [TS]

00:45:27 ◼   ► shipping actual Mac OS 8 and you could [TS]

00:45:29 ◼   ► run them and change your things to look [TS]

00:45:30 ◼   ► like that there's another one they did [TS]

00:45:31 ◼   ► called drawing board actually which [TS]

00:45:33 ◼   ► looks classier but again crazy look like [TS]

00:45:35 ◼   ► a drafting a drafting board type of look [TS]

00:45:38 ◼   ► work a lot it's like someone had drawn [TS]

00:45:40 ◼   ► your Windows on a graphing board and [TS]

00:45:41 ◼   ► done that thing where you make the lines [TS]

00:45:42 ◼   ► go filter that yeah farther yeah I'll [TS]

00:45:45 ◼   ► paste that one in the chat room too now [TS]

00:45:48 ◼   ► you miss out if you're not in the [TS]

00:45:49 ◼   ► chatroom people keep asking how do you [TS]

00:45:51 ◼   ► do this you get a five by five TV slash [TS]

00:45:53 ◼   ► live or slash audio if you just just [TS]

00:45:56 ◼   ► want audio in an html5 player without [TS]

00:45:58 ◼   ► flash and you click the little chat [TS]

00:46:02 ◼   ► button or if if you're a geek then you [TS]

00:46:05 ◼   ► can launch your favorite IRC client go [TS]

00:46:08 ◼   ► to freenode net and join room 5x5 and [TS]

00:46:13 ◼   ► apple's efforts in these areas were not [TS]

00:46:14 ◼   ► in a vacuum like there was a thriving [TS]

00:46:16 ◼   ► community of third party theming things [TS]

00:46:18 ◼   ► and that you used the appearance manager [TS]

00:46:20 ◼   ► that Apple had built or did their own [TS]

00:46:22 ◼   ► sort of thing with you know memory [TS]

00:46:23 ◼   ► patching and all the great things that [TS]

00:46:25 ◼   ► we did back in the days of classic Mac [TS]

00:46:26 ◼   ► OS 10 [TS]

00:46:27 ◼   ► the big one was called kaleidoscope [TS]

00:46:28 ◼   ► where people make kaleidoscope games and [TS]

00:46:30 ◼   ► kaleidoscope could change any part of [TS]

00:46:31 ◼   ► the GUI so there's a huge culture [TS]

00:46:34 ◼   ► surrounding changing the GUI to look [TS]

00:46:36 ◼   ► like all sorts of crazy things and it's [TS]

00:46:38 ◼   ► not just from but like I said it's not [TS]

00:46:40 ◼   ► just some third party Apple built the [TS]

00:46:41 ◼   ► the plumbing for this into the operating [TS]

00:46:43 ◼   ► system and planned to build into the [TS]

00:46:45 ◼   ► next generation operating system when [TS]

00:46:46 ◼   ► they couldn't they just poured it to [TS]

00:46:47 ◼   ► their regular operating system which [TS]

00:46:48 ◼   ► continued to limp on for many years [TS]

00:46:50 ◼   ► after that now the message about this I [TS]

00:46:56 ◼   ► think was made clear in this book that I [TS]

00:46:58 ◼   ► have that I think very few people have [TS]

00:46:59 ◼   ► it was published back in 1991 called [TS]

00:47:02 ◼   ► Todd on interface you know Todd is I [TS]

00:47:04 ◼   ► really remember talk I don't have this [TS]

00:47:06 ◼   ► book so this is Bruce [TS]

00:47:07 ◼   ► Todd Mazzini I hope I'm pronouncing his [TS]

00:47:09 ◼   ► name right he was a I don't know if he [TS]

00:47:13 ◼   ► was head of the human interface group [TS]

00:47:14 ◼   ► but he was influential in human [TS]

00:47:15 ◼   ► interface in Apple he'd been an apple [TS]

00:47:16 ◼   ► for years since the Apple 2 and he's the [TS]

00:47:19 ◼   ► one to put together the hIgG and did all [TS]

00:47:22 ◼   ► the user interface tests [TS]

00:47:23 ◼   ► stuff like that so he wrote a book sort [TS]

00:47:24 ◼   ► of outside the auspices of Apple saying [TS]

00:47:27 ◼   ► here's what I have to say about [TS]

00:47:28 ◼   ► interface design but he used examples [TS]

00:47:29 ◼   ► from his Apple work all the time of the [TS]

00:47:31 ◼   ► book so I guess it had to have some sort [TS]

00:47:32 ◼   ► of Apple blessing or cooperation um it [TS]

00:47:36 ◼   ► was published by addison-wesley I'll put [TS]

00:47:38 ◼   ► try to put a link to that in the show [TS]

00:47:39 ◼   ► notes but I think it's out of print so [TS]

00:47:42 ◼   ► on page 157 of this book he's got a [TS]

00:47:45 ◼   ► little diagram and a paragraph or two [TS]

00:47:48 ◼   ► about what he calls multiplex meanings [TS]

00:47:50 ◼   ► and he shows first he shows a bunch of [TS]

00:47:53 ◼   ► little house icons for Hyper card and [TS]

00:47:55 ◼   ► only gonna remember HyperCard but there [TS]

00:47:56 ◼   ► was a concept of going home in a hyper [TS]

00:47:58 ◼   ► card stack and he showed these seventeen [TS]

00:48:01 ◼   ► different icons the hyper card came with [TS]

00:48:03 ◼   ► four going home all sorts of different [TS]

00:48:05 ◼   ► sizes of houses houses chimneys [TS]

00:48:06 ◼   ► two-story house one-story house house [TS]

00:48:08 ◼   ► from the side you know house from a [TS]

00:48:10 ◼   ► different angle and he said that it's [TS]

00:48:14 ◼   ► not too much to ask the user to [TS]

00:48:16 ◼   ► recognize all these as being houses like [TS]

00:48:19 ◼   ► once you figure out that house means [TS]

00:48:21 ◼   ► home which may or may not be a hurdle to [TS]

00:48:22 ◼   ► get over when you see the little house [TS]

00:48:24 ◼   ► icon anywhere in a hypercard stack you [TS]

00:48:26 ◼   ► click it and you go home and it doesn't [TS]

00:48:28 ◼   ► matter oh well this house has its [TS]

00:48:29 ◼   ► chimney but the last one didn't I have [TS]

00:48:30 ◼   ► no idea what this house is going to do [TS]

00:48:31 ◼   ► when I click it now you recognize it as [TS]

00:48:32 ◼   ► a house and the other example he gave [TS]

00:48:35 ◼   ► was from system 7 [TS]

00:48:36 ◼   ► he showed six or seven different puzzle [TS]

00:48:39 ◼   ► piece icons which in system 7 were for [TS]

00:48:41 ◼   ► system extensions things that change the [TS]

00:48:44 ◼   ► way the system worked most of them are [TS]

00:48:46 ◼   ► kind of hacky but for example at a [TS]

00:48:47 ◼   ► system extension for changing the [TS]

00:48:50 ◼   ► appearance like kaleidoscope would be a [TS]

00:48:51 ◼   ► partially system extension or drivers [TS]

00:48:53 ◼   ► and stuff like that and they were puzzle [TS]

00:48:54 ◼   ► piece icons because they were you know [TS]

00:48:56 ◼   ► fitting together to change the way the [TS]

00:48:58 ◼   ► system works whatever whatever metaphor [TS]

00:48:59 ◼   ► they was using they were they were [TS]

00:49:00 ◼   ► puzzle pieces but there are many of them [TS]

00:49:02 ◼   ► there was just puzzle piece facing this [TS]

00:49:04 ◼   ► way puzzle piece with a hole in the [TS]

00:49:05 ◼   ► bottom and a tab on the top puzzle piece [TS]

00:49:07 ◼   ► facing sideways it all sorts of [TS]

00:49:08 ◼   ► different directions but all them [TS]

00:49:09 ◼   ► clearly recognizable as puzzle pieces [TS]

00:49:11 ◼   ► right and the message was that things [TS]

00:49:13 ◼   ► don't have to look identical they just [TS]

00:49:15 ◼   ► have to be identifiable as the things [TS]

00:49:17 ◼   ► they're supposed to be so once you [TS]

00:49:18 ◼   ► figure out the puzzle piece icon means [TS]

00:49:20 ◼   ► extension you don't have to be a slave [TS]

00:49:22 ◼   ► to only use the standard puzzle piece [TS]

00:49:24 ◼   ► icon because if you don't people have no [TS]

00:49:26 ◼   ► idea what it what it means and it will [TS]

00:49:27 ◼   ► make the system worse right and he had a [TS]

00:49:30 ◼   ► little quote at the end of this remember [TS]

00:49:31 ◼   ► this is 1991 so this is ages ago on [TS]

00:49:33 ◼   ► technology wise but what he said was as [TS]

00:49:34 ◼   ► bandwidth of you as the bandwidth of use [TS]

00:49:37 ◼   ► interfaces increases he put bandwidth in [TS]

00:49:38 ◼   ► quotes because he's kind of just talking [TS]

00:49:40 ◼   ► as technology increases he's kind of [TS]

00:49:42 ◼   ► these kinds of multiplexing will become [TS]

00:49:44 ◼   ► more and more practical so what he's [TS]

00:49:45 ◼   ► saying is that as we can make nicer [TS]

00:49:47 ◼   ► icons as the fidelity of on-screen [TS]

00:49:49 ◼   ► images and the fidelity interface [TS]

00:49:50 ◼   ► increases there'll be even more things [TS]

00:49:54 ◼   ► that we can do that make the appearance [TS]

00:49:56 ◼   ► different but are still leaves the items [TS]

00:49:59 ◼   ► identifiable as what they're supposed to [TS]

00:50:00 ◼   ► be all right so now here we are today [TS]

00:50:04 ◼   ► with you know the Retina displays on [TS]

00:50:07 ◼   ► iPads and millions of colors on [TS]

00:50:09 ◼   ► everything and you know huge huge [TS]

00:50:11 ◼   ► bandwidth in his parlance of the [TS]

00:50:12 ◼   ► interface so we can make the appearance [TS]

00:50:14 ◼   ► very to crazy degree but the same [TS]

00:50:17 ◼   ► question applies now is it applied then [TS]

00:50:19 ◼   ► what's the point why are you burying the [TS]

00:50:22 ◼   ► appearance so what why have seven [TS]

00:50:24 ◼   ► different puzzle pieces why have twelve [TS]

00:50:26 ◼   ► different kinds of houses why I have 50 [TS]

00:50:28 ◼   ► different things that do the same thing [TS]

00:50:31 ◼   ► but look slightly different and there's [TS]

00:50:33 ◼   ► a couple of reasons for this first [TS]

00:50:34 ◼   ► obviously is fashion and I don't think [TS]

00:50:36 ◼   ► you can dismiss that fashion is a valid [TS]

00:50:38 ◼   ► reason to change the appearance of [TS]

00:50:40 ◼   ► something fashion has changed you know [TS]

00:50:42 ◼   ► who's to say what's the purpose of [TS]

00:50:43 ◼   ► fashions and people's clothes you know [TS]

00:50:45 ◼   ► long hair short hair long skirts short [TS]

00:50:48 ◼   ► skirts tight pants loose-fitting pants [TS]

00:50:50 ◼   ► you know stripes plaid plain things [TS]

00:50:53 ◼   ► fashion changes and the function of [TS]

00:50:56 ◼   ► fashion is not it doesn't do anything [TS]

00:50:59 ◼   ► for you it's just it's as part of the [TS]

00:51:00 ◼   ► human experience and too so why [TS]

00:51:02 ◼   ► shouldn't fashion be part of the [TS]

00:51:04 ◼   ► computing experience as well so if [TS]

00:51:05 ◼   ► someone decides something year that the [TS]

00:51:07 ◼   ► fashion of Mac OS 10 is going to be [TS]

00:51:08 ◼   ► different than it was last year and we [TS]

00:51:10 ◼   ► think we're moving from the 60s into the [TS]

00:51:11 ◼   ► 70s or the 80s or you know using the [TS]

00:51:14 ◼   ► equivalent fashion errors why not right [TS]

00:51:16 ◼   ► I think that's that is reason alone to [TS]

00:51:19 ◼   ► say yes you can change the appearance of [TS]

00:51:22 ◼   ► the user interface purely on the basis [TS]

00:51:25 ◼   ► of fashion a correlator this is kind of [TS]

00:51:27 ◼   ► mood mood gets more into objective [TS]

00:51:31 ◼   ► measures where you can have a look of an [TS]

00:51:35 ◼   ► interface that's frantic or sort of you [TS]

00:51:39 ◼   ► know exciting like an example I would [TS]

00:51:40 ◼   ► give is the Windows XP blue themed let [TS]

00:51:42 ◼   ► me remember what that was in the chat [TS]

00:51:44 ◼   ► room like when XP first came out you [TS]

00:51:46 ◼   ► could put it in classic Windows 95 look [TS]

00:51:48 ◼   ► but the sort of native [TS]

00:51:50 ◼   ► Windows XP look it was in all the [TS]

00:51:51 ◼   ► screenshots was really saturated blue [TS]

00:51:54 ◼   ► yeah with a green background and it [TS]

00:51:56 ◼   ► looked very different from the old one [TS]

00:51:58 ◼   ► this little chunkier and dissing I'm [TS]

00:52:01 ◼   ► wrong and that was a very different mood [TS]

00:52:03 ◼   ► than Windows 95 which was mostly grey [TS]

00:52:05 ◼   ► so whatever Microsoft was trying to said [TS]

00:52:07 ◼   ► they were they were conveying a message [TS]

00:52:08 ◼   ► with their UI this is more exciting [TS]

00:52:10 ◼   ► Windows XP it's it's not this stayed old [TS]

00:52:12 ◼   ► Windows 95 they used it it was all grey [TS]

00:52:14 ◼   ► it's it's you know it's new it's shiny [TS]

00:52:16 ◼   ► you know it's plastic fantastic whatever [TS]

00:52:20 ◼   ► first thing I would do in a row get on [TS]

00:52:22 ◼   ► an XP box and I still have a couple of [TS]

00:52:25 ◼   ► them here in the studio that we use for [TS]

00:52:27 ◼   ► different things immediately immediately [TS]

00:52:28 ◼   ► switch it back to classic immediately [TS]

00:52:31 ◼   ► yeah even the metrics were different [TS]

00:52:33 ◼   ► like the windows were the window title [TS]

00:52:34 ◼   ► bar was thicker yeah tarimov blue thing [TS]

00:52:36 ◼   ► it wasn't any clearly was not an [TS]

00:52:38 ◼   ► improvement nobody liked that some [TS]

00:52:40 ◼   ► people did because I thought you're [TS]

00:52:42 ◼   ► interesting but hey Mon so so let's [TS]

00:52:43 ◼   ► compare this to a different mood from an [TS]

00:52:47 ◼   ► OS vendor which is a next step next step [TS]

00:52:49 ◼   ► was just gray as far as the eye could [TS]

00:52:52 ◼   ► see everything was gray or black it [TS]

00:52:54 ◼   ► looked like you know a banker suit right [TS]

00:52:58 ◼   ► these things sounds like I'm just [TS]

00:53:00 ◼   ► talking about fashion again but I'm not [TS]

00:53:02 ◼   ► because there's a mood to the operating [TS]

00:53:03 ◼   ► system that affects the people using it [TS]

00:53:05 ◼   ► if you make something bright and shiny [TS]

00:53:06 ◼   ► and blinking and everything that has a [TS]

00:53:08 ◼   ► different effect on the user than if you [TS]

00:53:10 ◼   ► make something that sort of calm or [TS]