The Talk Show

187: ‘Forget About Frodo and Sam’, With Special Guest MG Siegler


00:00:00   in the old days if if I were going to [TS]

00:00:02   have a show it would be we would have to [TS]

00:00:04   be together you'd have to be like in the [TS]

00:00:05   studio with me and you would think i [TS]

00:00:08   would i would supply comfortable chairs [TS]

00:00:10   for my guests and you you know i feel [TS]

00:00:13   like forcing guests to you skype is like [TS]

00:00:14   you get like a folding chair that that [TS]

00:00:17   was that was outside and as like rains [TS]

00:00:20   come on it you know yeah uh yeah it's [TS]

00:00:24   nice to be on again oh I I there's a [TS]

00:00:31   couple of things we have to talk about I [TS]

00:00:32   guess so as always stuff to talk about [TS]

00:00:33   but what there's a couple of recent [TS]

00:00:35   posts that you've had on your 500 ich [TS]

00:00:38   werde site is that what it's called and [TS]

00:00:41   no that's the domain yep five hundreds [TS]

00:00:42   yeah um but you wrote about the the end [TS]

00:00:47   of virgin virgin america yep can you [TS]

00:00:51   summarize this and then again you even [TS]

00:00:54   it's a perfect piece I will put it in [TS]

00:00:55   the Xolos but it is perfect insofar as [TS]

00:00:59   you admit that virgin america only flew [TS]

00:01:02   between a very small number of cities [TS]

00:01:03   right so there's a large number of [TS]

00:01:05   people who if you don't live in San [TS]

00:01:06   Francisco LA or New York you probably [TS]

00:01:08   haven't flown virgin right and and so [TS]

00:01:11   yeah so basically you know I'm assuming [TS]

00:01:13   it by this point because it's been been [TS]

00:01:15   up like a month or so everyone knows [TS]

00:01:17   that Alaska Airlines bought virgin [TS]

00:01:19   america and as a part of that you know [TS]

00:01:22   they sort of did this whole big branding [TS]

00:01:25   thing certainly around San Francisco and [TS]

00:01:26   I assume other cities in which virgin [TS]

00:01:28   operates or it's sort of like the Alaska [TS]

00:01:30   plus virgin equals love you know type [TS]

00:01:32   Brit side marketing campaign and because [TS]

00:01:36   obviously people were worried when [TS]

00:01:37   someone else bought virgin america that [TS]

00:01:39   there would be you know would be the end [TS]

00:01:41   of virgin america and they were trying [TS]

00:01:43   to sort of play it up no this is just [TS]

00:01:44   going to make both sides even better and [TS]

00:01:46   then whenever it was a few weeks ago [TS]

00:01:49   they of course announced that they're [TS]

00:01:50   going to be shutting down the Virgin [TS]

00:01:52   America brand entirely and you know [TS]

00:01:56   basically merging the planes and in sort [TS]

00:02:00   of merging all into one entity which of [TS]

00:02:02   course I'm sure makes sense for the [TS]

00:02:04   bottom line that's the reason why [TS]

00:02:05   they're doing it for cost efficiencies [TS]

00:02:08   but yeah I mean so people who don't live [TS]

00:02:12   in one of the city's at virgin [TS]

00:02:13   services which is I'm not even sure what [TS]

00:02:16   the current number is but let's say it's [TS]

00:02:17   10 maybe 12 or something like that it's [TS]

00:02:19   not very many still started in San [TS]

00:02:21   Francisco the company was was [TS]

00:02:23   headquarters here obviously was famously [TS]

00:02:24   you know started out of Richard [TS]

00:02:27   Branson's Virgin Group and so people who [TS]

00:02:32   don't live in one of those 10 to 15 [TS]

00:02:34   whatever it is now cities you know sort [TS]

00:02:36   of don't really understand why people [TS]

00:02:39   who to live in one of those cities and [TS]

00:02:41   take virgin regularly are sort of upset [TS]

00:02:43   about this and the best push back what I [TS]

00:02:46   found most amusing was on Twitter you [TS]

00:02:48   know basically saying but Alaska [TS]

00:02:50   Airlines is such a great airline to and [TS]

00:02:52   you know I've been on Alaska certainly [TS]

00:02:54   any flight that goes to sort of the [TS]

00:02:56   Pacific Northwest and you know that's [TS]

00:02:58   sort of one of the common carriers and [TS]

00:02:59   it's fine it's a nice airline you know [TS]

00:03:02   it's not United sure we get like with [TS]

00:03:04   that in a second but it's it's fine but [TS]

00:03:07   it's not virgin america you have to be [TS]

00:03:09   on a virgin america plane to know what [TS]

00:03:11   that's like i mean if you think back to [TS]

00:03:13   when it when it started whenever that [TS]

00:03:14   was several years back you know the fact [TS]

00:03:17   that they were all sort of new planes [TS]

00:03:19   the basic thing that i highlighted it [TS]

00:03:23   you know in that in that post is i think [TS]

00:03:24   people don't understand like you got a [TS]

00:03:27   level of consistency flying virgin [TS]

00:03:29   america that you don't get with any [TS]

00:03:30   other airline because it's a total [TS]

00:03:31   crapshoot with you're gonna get an old [TS]

00:03:33   rickety plane whether you're gonna get [TS]

00:03:35   one with like you know still cigarette [TS]

00:03:36   uh yes praise you know sticker this just [TS]

00:03:41   do not use under federal law yes and [TS]

00:03:44   with virgins sort of because it was you [TS]

00:03:46   know a newer airline they had all the [TS]

00:03:48   same i think it was a a380 planes known [TS]

00:03:50   a three it is the big one whatever the [TS]

00:03:52   whatever the airbus a321 i could might [TS]

00:03:56   be that yeah maybe there's one of those [TS]

00:03:57   you know there's sort of standard in [TS]

00:03:59   smaller airbus flood plains and so they [TS]

00:04:03   were all that they all had Wi-Fi which [TS]

00:04:05   at the time you know was was a novelty [TS]

00:04:07   certainly they all had those televisions [TS]

00:04:09   in the screen backs not just in first [TS]

00:04:10   class or anything at all the screens all [TS]

00:04:12   the seats sorry had that and you had a [TS]

00:04:15   very consistent experience you knew if [TS]

00:04:16   you're getting on a virgin america [TS]

00:04:17   flight it was more likely to be a good [TS]

00:04:20   flight i mean i'm sure there you know [TS]

00:04:22   everyone will have a horse story about [TS]

00:04:23   every airline but it's not like it's not [TS]

00:04:25   like you hear about united and delta [TS]

00:04:27   and some of the other ones that are just [TS]

00:04:29   you know constantly a crummy experience [TS]

00:04:31   this was this was a definitely a notch [TS]

00:04:34   above we had them in philly until about [TS]

00:04:39   two years ago and we lost them we lost [TS]

00:04:42   virgin during the in aftermath of the [TS]

00:04:45   American oh the merger usair merger I've [TS]

00:04:49   told this story before but long story [TS]

00:04:50   short it's very simple when when US air [TS]

00:04:54   an American proposed merging one of the [TS]

00:04:57   problem areas was that it gave the [TS]

00:05:00   combined airline too many gates at JFK [TS]

00:05:03   in New York that the eft are the Federal [TS]

00:05:06   Aviation there's some kind of limit to [TS]

00:05:07   the percentage of gates that any one [TS]

00:05:09   airline can have it any Airport and US [TS]

00:05:12   air and American both had a big presence [TS]

00:05:14   at JFK and it was too many gates so they [TS]

00:05:16   had to get rid of some of the gates and [TS]

00:05:18   virgin decided they would rather take [TS]

00:05:20   more gates at JFK but leave Philly [TS]

00:05:23   entirely but and they couldn't keep both [TS]

00:05:25   because one of the problems of being an [TS]

00:05:26   airline is it's really hard to get more [TS]

00:05:28   planes I mean it sounds silly because [TS]

00:05:30   you think like oh you just buy you know [TS]

00:05:32   call Boeing up and buy a plane the way [TS]

00:05:34   right you know I mean like if you and I [TS]

00:05:35   bought a start at a moving company and [TS]

00:05:38   and it took off and we needed more [TS]

00:05:40   trucks we could just go buy more trucks [TS]

00:05:41   right that's not a problem but in [TS]

00:05:43   aviation it's a you know you gotta like [TS]

00:05:45   order an airplane like couple years in [TS]

00:05:47   advance right now such a long lead time [TS]

00:05:49   so and so I've been off virgin for a [TS]

00:05:51   while but I still get the emails like I [TS]

00:05:52   got the email the other day from Alaska [TS]

00:05:54   telling me not to worry my points are [TS]

00:05:56   okay and it's right yeah well I mean [TS]

00:05:59   we'll see of course you know Alaska's [TS]

00:06:03   trying to say all the right things you [TS]

00:06:04   know in there in the sort of press [TS]

00:06:05   statement about it they said we're going [TS]

00:06:07   to be sort of bringing the Virgin [TS]

00:06:09   experience to Alaska flights and so [TS]

00:06:12   including the humorous a bit about there [TS]

00:06:15   being mood lighting you know that's one [TS]

00:06:16   of the that's like the thing they [TS]

00:06:17   decided to focus on because virgin [TS]

00:06:19   america sort of famously has this this [TS]

00:06:21   purple hued mood lighting and so Alaska [TS]

00:06:23   is going to do that but they're going to [TS]

00:06:24   have blue mood lighting so it will be [TS]

00:06:26   it'll be not the exact same but it will [TS]

00:06:28   be almost as good and we'll see I mean [TS]

00:06:30   you know they said that that basically [TS]

00:06:32   nothing was going to change and then of [TS]

00:06:34   course everything's changing so you know [TS]

00:06:36   don't have a lot of a lot of hope for it [TS]

00:06:39   remaining as it was [TS]

00:06:41   the good news if there is like you know [TS]

00:06:43   slight good news it's going to take them [TS]

00:06:45   a long time to sort of phase in and out [TS]

00:06:47   those changes and so virgin will remain [TS]

00:06:50   operating for for I think at least like [TS]

00:06:53   a year maybe a couple years something [TS]

00:06:54   like that but yeah it'll be it'll be a [TS]

00:06:58   big change in and as we're seeing this [TS]

00:07:00   week with the the airline industry this [TS]

00:07:01   is sort of par for the course just doing [TS]

00:07:04   anything to to screw over customers I [TS]

00:07:06   think they only had two or three gates [TS]

00:07:07   in Philly so it wasn't a lot of flights [TS]

00:07:10   it wasn't a big presence and it was a [TS]

00:07:12   small desk for check-in you knows I [TS]

00:07:14   usually like to people so it's not a [TS]

00:07:16   fair comparison to like American which [TS]

00:07:19   dominates Philly um but II every time I [TS]

00:07:24   every time I could fly virgin I did and [TS]

00:07:27   I you know they had a great nonstop [TS]

00:07:30   service between philly and san francisco [TS]

00:07:31   which was it you know does a very common [TS]

00:07:34   flight for me for further work every [TS]

00:07:37   time i could i did and i never once had [TS]

00:07:40   to wait like that it's just little [TS]

00:07:42   things like that the people at the desk [TS]

00:07:44   were like super efficient and nice and [TS]

00:07:47   you'd get up there and they would be [TS]

00:07:49   like hey you know and then you'd give [TS]

00:07:51   him your ID and then they'd you know [TS]

00:07:53   take your bag if you had a bag to check [TS]

00:07:54   her or give you it you know and you were [TS]

00:07:56   gone that was it and you only had no [TS]

00:07:58   lines a never and good service on the [TS]

00:08:01   plane my favorite story about virgin was [TS]

00:08:03   one time also i used to get I got the [TS]

00:08:06   cheapest upgrades to first-class I don't [TS]

00:08:08   understand they only had the way every [TS]

00:08:10   plane I they're probably all the same [TS]

00:08:12   they only had like eight first class [TS]

00:08:13   seats it was like to Rosa too young or [TS]

00:08:16   they still do I guess and every almost [TS]

00:08:18   every time I flew I could get an upgrade [TS]

00:08:20   from Coach to first class for like a [TS]

00:08:22   hundred bucks and I'd be like they're in [TS]

00:08:24   general the first guy seats I mean [TS]

00:08:26   weren't super expensive when you compare [TS]

00:08:28   it to what they are on other airlines so [TS]

00:08:31   yeah I I flew first class on virgin as a [TS]

00:08:34   percentage higher than anywhere else and [TS]

00:08:36   it wasn't because i had the point it was [TS]

00:08:37   because it was so cheap to upgrade and [TS]

00:08:38   the service was super terrific the seats [TS]

00:08:40   were super comfortable but one time I [TS]

00:08:42   was up in first class and we actually [TS]

00:08:43   pulled away from the gate a little bit [TS]

00:08:46   and then all of a sudden there was some [TS]

00:08:48   kind of not another unpleasant commotion [TS]

00:08:51   but like some kind of you know thing [TS]

00:08:53   with the phone and [TS]

00:08:54   hey hey let's go back and they went back [TS]

00:08:56   to the gate and some poor sap who had a [TS]

00:08:58   connecting flight that was late they [TS]

00:08:59   went back to the gate I'd say it set us [TS]

00:09:02   back about three minutes they went back [TS]

00:09:04   to the gate and let this guy on the [TS]

00:09:05   plane and this bow this guy looked like [TS]

00:09:07   he won the lottery because you know he [TS]

00:09:10   didn't ever hear about that I've never [TS]

00:09:12   seen it before I mean maybe I've never [TS]

00:09:14   seen it before because i wasn't in first [TS]

00:09:15   class but i mean i think even in [TS]

00:09:17   coaching to kind of tell ya if the I've [TS]

00:09:19   never seen that if the plane stops [TS]

00:09:20   backing up and goes for her again uh it [TS]

00:09:23   was a nice thing and I was at before cuz [TS]

00:09:25   at three minutes what's the difference [TS]

00:09:26   the three minutes and coming out of it [TS]

00:09:28   was it coming back from SFO to Philly [TS]

00:09:30   and so you're probably going to wait [TS]

00:09:31   times avoiding to take off anyway but [TS]

00:09:34   for that poor guy who almost missed his [TS]

00:09:36   flight uh they just it was you know [TS]

00:09:39   thousands of dollars and happiness for [TS]

00:09:40   that guy and I was made I've seen I've [TS]

00:09:42   seen much more of the sort of the [TS]

00:09:44   opposite version of that story where the [TS]

00:09:45   get the plane isn't even pushed back [TS]

00:09:47   from the gate but they just closed the [TS]

00:09:48   door and they will not open it even [TS]

00:09:50   though the person's there the plane is [TS]

00:09:51   still there and the door is closed and [TS]

00:09:53   so it's just they will not reopen it for [TS]

00:09:55   those people not with virgin but with [TS]

00:09:57   like countless other airlines I've seen [TS]

00:09:59   that yeah and they were like in a head [TS]

00:10:00   that's the flight attendants were so [TS]

00:10:02   nice they were like hey hey you're here [TS]

00:10:04   you're on don't want you don't have to [TS]

00:10:05   run anymore take your time go find your [TS]

00:10:07   seat you want us to bring you a drink [TS]

00:10:08   and they were like he was like this is [TS]

00:10:10   amazing okay sure yeah you know take a [TS]

00:10:13   coke you know and it was but to your [TS]

00:10:16   point that was sort of like that's also [TS]

00:10:17   definitely a part of sort of the overall [TS]

00:10:20   experience with virgin and I don't know [TS]

00:10:21   what it is I don't know if they just if [TS]

00:10:23   they hired like from a different crop of [TS]

00:10:25   people in the industry or whatnot but [TS]

00:10:27   people generally didn't seem to hate [TS]

00:10:29   their heat their jobs and hate their [TS]

00:10:31   lives when they're working at virgin [TS]

00:10:32   whereas they do you know very often it [TS]

00:10:36   seems like on many other airlines yeah [TS]

00:10:37   at the big ones and I think Alaska and [TS]

00:10:39   it's like to your point I would compare [TS]

00:10:41   Alaska to southwest I haven't flown [TS]

00:10:43   Alaska a lot I've flown it and I think [TS]

00:10:45   at least twice to whenever is the XOXO [TS]

00:10:49   conference in portland right is it [TS]

00:10:51   coincided with XOXO at least for three [TS]

00:10:56   years coincided with the tail end of the [TS]

00:11:01   iphone introduction events in September [TS]

00:11:03   we're just by somewhat coincidence or I [TS]

00:11:06   guess not quite total coincidence but [TS]

00:11:08   Apple targeting like the second week of [TS]

00:11:10   September for iphone events and XOXO [TS]

00:11:12   targeting the end of the second week for [TS]

00:11:14   XOXO at least twice for me to go to XOXO [TS]

00:11:19   it made more sense to fly out to San [TS]

00:11:21   Francisco to beginning of the week wait [TS]

00:11:23   and then fly San Francisco to Portland [TS]

00:11:25   instead of flying all the way back to [TS]

00:11:27   Philadelphia and then to Portland um and [TS]

00:11:29   Alaska was like you know was the best [TS]

00:11:31   airline you know I had the most flights [TS]

00:11:32   for that so I flown Alaska at least [TS]

00:11:34   twice and I would compare it to [TS]

00:11:35   Southwest it's it's fine it's I mean [TS]

00:11:39   it's southwest I float it a lot actually [TS]

00:11:41   and I like it um it's sort of like um [TS]

00:11:45   you know it's like a nice commuter bus [TS]

00:11:47   in the sky right because they don't have [TS]

00:11:49   assigned seats and but you get like sort [TS]

00:11:51   of these numbers and you stand and then [TS]

00:11:52   you get on the plane you can just pick [TS]

00:11:53   whatever seat you want and it's like [TS]

00:11:55   very simple you know you always I think [TS]

00:11:58   you always get the same type of plane so [TS]

00:12:00   that that's sort of a similar experience [TS]

00:12:01   but again I mean that it's nice but it [TS]

00:12:05   cannot compare to what virgin virgin [TS]

00:12:07   america like is like the one that does [TS]

00:12:09   supposedly which I have not been on yet [TS]

00:12:12   i wonder if you have is the jet blue [TS]

00:12:14   mint experience um good we're on I've [TS]

00:12:17   not been on that okay we do we have jet [TS]

00:12:19   blue but they don't fly anywhere i go [TS]

00:12:21   out of philly i think yeah and i think i [TS]

00:12:23   think San Francisco has jet blue as well [TS]

00:12:25   but i don't think the mint thing is [TS]

00:12:27   currently in play or at least it's not [TS]

00:12:30   like if I would take jetblue's i think [TS]

00:12:31   i've taken it once before and I've taken [TS]

00:12:33   it to New York because obviously most [TS]

00:12:35   the time i would take virgin but i don't [TS]

00:12:37   think the mint service operates between [TS]

00:12:40   San Francisco and New York hopefully [TS]

00:12:41   they changed that maybe with the Virgin [TS]

00:12:43   news but it's like LA to New York I [TS]

00:12:44   think has it and people rave about it [TS]

00:12:46   when they take that they they say it's [TS]

00:12:48   at least as good as virgin if not better [TS]

00:12:50   I don't really know you know all the all [TS]

00:12:53   the perks and everything having that [TS]

00:12:54   take it before but I guess it's that's [TS]

00:12:57   one to look forward to potentially hmm [TS]

00:12:59   and it's just an industry and and I it's [TS]

00:13:02   you you've made it in your column you [TS]

00:13:05   made it a sort of comparison to like [TS]

00:13:07   apple and Dell or something like that [TS]

00:13:09   maybe ask us maybe more like Lenovo you [TS]

00:13:11   know where like I think Pat is a nice [TS]

00:13:12   laptop but it's right it's not and it's [TS]

00:13:15   not a Mac you know it's it's what [TS]

00:13:18   happens if somebody really tries to make [TS]

00:13:20   something [TS]

00:13:21   really good in an industry where that [TS]

00:13:26   was fine is generally considered good [TS]

00:13:28   wow you got really lucky you know my [TS]

00:13:32   fight was flying it was more or less on [TS]

00:13:34   time we landed more or less on time and [TS]

00:13:36   and none of my luggage got lost right I [TS]

00:13:40   was it was funny we were I was chatting [TS]

00:13:42   actually with a in our internal work [TS]

00:13:45   slack with some people about the news [TS]

00:13:47   and of course everyone's sort of [TS]

00:13:48   outraged right when it hits and so like [TS]

00:13:50   there's a long thread going on and that [TS]

00:13:51   was the thing that I quoted a co-worker [TS]

00:13:53   mine ken was like you know comparing it [TS]

00:13:56   to who yes sir did the the pc vs mac [TS]

00:13:59   thing which i thought would be fun [TS]

00:14:00   because of course that always you know [TS]

00:14:02   draws such heated debate on both sides [TS]

00:14:05   for that and whenever you compare [TS]

00:14:07   anything to to that situation but i mean [TS]

00:14:11   i think it does feel fairly apt you know [TS]

00:14:14   having been myself you know a long time [TS]

00:14:17   pc user when i was growing up and then [TS]

00:14:19   switching to the mac and just like i was [TS]

00:14:21   pc user and it was fine and like I would [TS]

00:14:24   get a faster pc and sometimes you know [TS]

00:14:27   windows would break down and and that [TS]

00:14:28   would suck but when it worked it was [TS]

00:14:30   fine and then you know it's uh it was a [TS]

00:14:34   totally different experience once I [TS]

00:14:35   switched it over and it's I mean do you [TS]

00:14:37   have air pods on bow bet you do oh yeah [TS]

00:14:39   I love their rights so I do too it's my [TS]

00:14:41   favorite my favorite thing in the last [TS]

00:14:43   few years I think yeah seriously love [TS]

00:14:45   them so much but that's it n epitomizes [TS]

00:14:47   what Apple stands for to me which is [TS]

00:14:50   let's try to make this as nice as [TS]

00:14:53   possible even if it's so such a simple [TS]

00:14:55   thing is just putting to your pods [TS]

00:14:57   engineer and having them just work when [TS]

00:15:00   you hit play on your phone yeah and just [TS]

00:15:02   taking it to like just just keep going [TS]

00:15:07   into tenths of a decimal 99.999% nice [TS]

00:15:10   99.999% nice and sweaty grim tale after [TS]

00:15:13   detail that's the Apple way and and it's [TS]

00:15:16   not like apples perfect my favorite [TS]

00:15:18   example from recent years of Apple [TS]

00:15:19   totally falling short on this is the [TS]

00:15:21   remote control for the new Apple TV oh [TS]

00:15:23   yeah right which-- like how does how did [TS]

00:15:26   this ever come out of Apple as okay [TS]

00:15:28   because this is so it is fine and it's [TS]

00:15:32   not you know what I mean and it's not [TS]

00:15:33   right it's not right [TS]

00:15:35   like a comcast remote with 127 buttons [TS]

00:15:38   right right it is Apple like in certain [TS]

00:15:41   ways but it's totally on Apple like in [TS]

00:15:43   other ways it's epple like in certain [TS]

00:15:45   ways although like I feel like everyone [TS]

00:15:48   who has one has the exact same complaint [TS]

00:15:50   and that complaint is that you never [TS]

00:15:51   know if you're holding it right side up [TS]

00:15:53   or upside down and like how did how did [TS]

00:15:55   just you know just user testing even [TS]

00:15:58   with amongst Apple employees how did [TS]

00:16:00   that not come up i mean that's like the [TS]

00:16:01   first thing that comes up for everyone [TS]

00:16:02   right but it to me virgin was shooting [TS]

00:16:06   for the air pods like experience from [TS]

00:16:09   check-in to you know getting off the [TS]

00:16:12   plane that's what virgin still stands [TS]

00:16:15   for a while they while they exist but [TS]

00:16:16   and something like Alaska or Southwest [TS]

00:16:20   which I am a fan of I'm a big fan of so [TS]

00:16:22   I've flown tons of miles on Southwest I [TS]

00:16:24   don't anymore just because they've sort [TS]

00:16:26   of dropped nonstop routes between the [TS]

00:16:28   cities I go to and I'm as the longer and [TS]

00:16:31   more I fly the more resistant I am too [TS]

00:16:33   taking anything other than a non-stop [TS]

00:16:36   yeah but I really I do like them and I [TS]

00:16:40   know that they're not luxurious but the [TS]

00:16:42   main reason i like them is that that [TS]

00:16:43   they do seem to hire really nice people [TS]

00:16:46   and the planes are very consistent the [TS]

00:16:48   southwest plane is always clean and [TS]

00:16:50   always exactly the same but it's nothing [TS]

00:16:52   like virgin which is trying to say let's [TS]

00:16:55   make this really nice let's make being [TS]

00:16:57   in a coach seat like a decent humane [TS]

00:16:59   experience and the thing that's really a [TS]

00:17:02   bummer about it is you know so when [TS]

00:17:05   Virgin launched I remembered very well [TS]

00:17:08   in San Francisco there was a lot of pomp [TS]

00:17:10   and circumstances there is with many [TS]

00:17:12   sort of Richard Branson affiliated [TS]

00:17:13   things but you know deservedly so and [TS]

00:17:16   the whole criticism at the time though [TS]

00:17:18   was like yeah it's a great experience [TS]

00:17:20   but they'll never be able to keep this [TS]

00:17:22   going they're not going to be able to [TS]

00:17:23   run it profitably and this is just not [TS]

00:17:26   the way the airline industry works um [TS]

00:17:28   you know in this day and age and you [TS]

00:17:31   know I think they were running [TS]

00:17:32   unprofitable for a long time I do think [TS]

00:17:35   that they eventually turned a profit or [TS]

00:17:36   they were very close to it and so there [TS]

00:17:38   was some hope you know that like look [TS]

00:17:40   you can actually build an airline with a [TS]

00:17:41   great experience that actually makes [TS]

00:17:43   business sense as well and then of [TS]

00:17:45   course that she's got thrown out the [TS]

00:17:47   window and they merged I mean and [TS]

00:17:48   l airlines continue to constantly merge [TS]

00:17:51   and continue to constantly charge for [TS]

00:17:54   more things for overhead storage just [TS]

00:17:56   adding on fee after fee after fee and [TS]

00:17:58   that's just the you know that's the [TS]

00:18:01   state of the industry and virgin it [TS]

00:18:03   seemed like was trying to buck that [TS]

00:18:04   trend in it ultimately you know just [TS]

00:18:06   didn't didn't end up doing it we'll see [TS]

00:18:09   how Alaska sort of takes takes the takes [TS]

00:18:13   the mantle but that's what's the real [TS]

00:18:16   bummer about it it just it sort of [TS]

00:18:18   showcases that I think it just probably [TS]

00:18:20   can't ever ever work it seems like a lot [TS]

00:18:23   of people I know and it does make some [TS]

00:18:25   sense but it's a to me key to the [TS]

00:18:28   continuing I don't know if I want to say [TS]

00:18:32   success cuz I'm not quite sure how [TS]

00:18:34   profitable they are but the continuing [TS]

00:18:36   dominance of the the major mediocre [TS]

00:18:39   carriers your Americans Delta's United [TS]

00:18:42   yet Roe is that they large you know for [TS]

00:18:47   obvious reasons they they largely depend [TS]

00:18:49   on regular frequent flyers right and [TS]

00:18:52   people who once you start racking up [TS]

00:18:54   points on a certain airline so many [TS]

00:18:57   you're you're locked in so I don't feel [TS]

00:19:00   that way I've got platinum see I don't [TS]

00:19:02   either American i am which is pretty [TS]

00:19:04   nice and it gets me a couple of perks [TS]

00:19:06   and I've got miles I can cash in [TS]

00:19:09   whatever but every time I booked a [TS]

00:19:12   flight I still search for other airlines [TS]

00:19:14   just to look and if I found something [TS]

00:19:16   better cheaper on it on a different [TS]

00:19:19   airline like I still check to see if [TS]

00:19:21   Southwest is restored a couple of [TS]

00:19:23   nonstops to San Francisco every day I [TS]

00:19:25   look every once in a while like I would [TS]

00:19:27   think about going back to Southwest on [TS]

00:19:29   certain flights especially if I kit and [TS]

00:19:30   and or if I could get a better time a [TS]

00:19:33   day or something like that yeah I I'm in [TS]

00:19:36   the same boat as you I am NOT sort of [TS]

00:19:38   beholden to any sort of point system i [TS]

00:19:40   have the Virgin points of course but as [TS]

00:19:41   we just talked about like they didn't go [TS]

00:19:43   all that many places so obviously I [TS]

00:19:44   would have to take other airlines all [TS]

00:19:45   the time and so I think I have rewards [TS]

00:19:48   programs at all of them and I don't have [TS]

00:19:50   huge status but I've status that some of [TS]

00:19:52   them i would say fly quite a bit and but [TS]

00:19:55   i'm not one of those people who you know [TS]

00:19:56   is so adamant about maintaining that [TS]

00:19:59   versus just maintaining a good [TS]

00:20:00   experience that's [TS]

00:20:01   I do know people who are the exact [TS]

00:20:03   opposite i know people who take flights [TS]

00:20:05   to and from New York City just to [TS]

00:20:08   maintain their status level like they [TS]

00:20:10   don't actually they don't actually stay [TS]

00:20:12   overnight in the city they just do a [TS]

00:20:14   round trip flight on one day just to be [TS]

00:20:16   able to maintain their status which [TS]

00:20:18   sounds absolutely insane I it's just not [TS]

00:20:23   that important to me and I just don't [TS]

00:20:25   get that much for it you know like even [TS]

00:20:27   as a platinum status person on American [TS]

00:20:30   like I still don't get I still have [TS]

00:20:31   would have to pay to join their quote [TS]

00:20:33   unquote Admirals Club to get in separate [TS]

00:20:35   the lounges like right and I tend not to [TS]

00:20:41   need lounges because I tend to just fly [TS]

00:20:44   nonstop from home to my destination my [TS]

00:20:47   destination to home and the only time I [TS]

00:20:48   ever really need or wish I had access to [TS]

00:20:51   a lounge is when my flights delayed if I [TS]

00:20:54   get to the airport on time and the [TS]

00:20:56   flight is significantly delayed and I've [TS]

00:20:58   got you know two or three hours to burn [TS]

00:21:00   well then it would be nice to be in a [TS]

00:21:01   lounge you know some places I can get in [TS]

00:21:03   the amex lounge but other airports don't [TS]

00:21:05   have one but it's not I don't even get [TS]

00:21:08   it I have platinum status and I still [TS]

00:21:10   don't get it so it doesn't make any [TS]

00:21:11   sense to me why people are so loyal like [TS]

00:21:13   that but it really does seem to screw [TS]

00:21:14   the upstart Airlines like they can't [TS]

00:21:17   that one of the reasons they can't get [TS]

00:21:19   traction is people I ever heard virgin [TS]

00:21:20   is nice but I've got points on United so [TS]

00:21:23   here I go yep yeah it's uh it's it's [TS]

00:21:27   quite a racket that they that they run [TS]

00:21:29   and like you know I think you know [TS]

00:21:31   there's certain other airlines that go [TS]

00:21:32   internationally that are that are [TS]

00:21:34   obviously very nice I'm actually getting [TS]

00:21:36   ready to go to London and I'm going to [TS]

00:21:38   be on Virgin Atlantic it's sort of [TS]

00:21:40   sister thing it was like the sister [TS]

00:21:42   thing but they weren't exactly you know [TS]

00:21:43   affiliated for a long time two points [TS]

00:21:45   didn't even transfer I think they do now [TS]

00:21:46   but I think they set it up that way to [TS]

00:21:48   make it easier to have happen what [TS]

00:21:51   actually happened which was Darrell sell [TS]

00:21:53   one or the other without selling the [TS]

00:21:55   other yeah Branson wrote like a you know [TS]

00:21:59   a post-mortem or whatever and you know [TS]

00:22:00   sort of made some reference to it you [TS]

00:22:03   know like losing a child and but there [TS]

00:22:08   was all sorts of issues you know with it [TS]

00:22:11   with his ownership of it and whether or [TS]

00:22:14   not he could have [TS]

00:22:15   actually blocked anything it seems like [TS]

00:22:16   no and so that's what happened I've [TS]

00:22:18   never flown virgin atlantic but i would [TS]

00:22:20   love to and my favorite story about that [TS]

00:22:22   and it relates to the show is way back [TS]

00:22:24   in the day when damn benjamin and i were [TS]

00:22:28   reviewing all the James Bond movies we [TS]

00:22:30   were talking I know where your yes we're [TS]

00:22:31   talking about quantum of solace yes I [TS]

00:22:33   was just going to bring that up yep and [TS]

00:22:34   uh bond is is on enroute from England to [TS]

00:22:39   all right oh where was he going [TS]

00:22:41   somewhere in South America or the [TS]

00:22:42   Caribbean right yeah cuz he's with them [TS]

00:22:45   he's with the elder gentleman yeah yeah [TS]

00:22:48   and then having a drink yeah and and [TS]

00:22:50   he's bereft and he's he's getting tanked [TS]

00:22:53   at a there's a bar in the plane and hit [TS]

00:22:56   with a bartender and he's sitting at the [TS]

00:22:58   bar drinking Vesper martinis he I don't [TS]

00:23:01   like 18 of them or something and it's a [TS]

00:23:04   beautiful-looking bar and dan and I are [TS]

00:23:06   like it was a cool scene you know and [TS]

00:23:08   it's it's it's kind of unusual to see [TS]

00:23:10   bond actually get get Talia he's always [TS]

00:23:13   drinking but he's all never seems to be [TS]

00:23:15   drunk and here he is you know drinking [TS]

00:23:16   himself into a stupor but we're like how [TS]

00:23:19   unrealistic is it that there is a nice [TS]

00:23:21   bar on a commercial air flight and then [TS]

00:23:23   all these people wrote to me like oh no [TS]

00:23:24   no they have it yeah yeah they were [TS]

00:23:26   there that was actually shot on a real [TS]

00:23:27   virgin atlantic it's like oh my god I've [TS]

00:23:30   gotta get on that line I mean yeah I've [TS]

00:23:33   been on them that's a hundred percent [TS]

00:23:34   legitimate they have those bar areas and [TS]

00:23:37   it's amazing it's not usually as quiet [TS]

00:23:40   as it was I would say in that scene [TS]

00:23:42   there's usually much more people or [TS]

00:23:44   activity around it but yeah that's [TS]

00:23:46   that's legitimate it's it's pretty [TS]

00:23:48   amazing that was my fifth was some of my [TS]

00:23:51   favorite feedback ever we were both like [TS]

00:23:53   totally preposterous who would ever have [TS]

00:23:55   a commercial air something like that [TS]

00:23:57   it's like something out of the 1960s and [TS]

00:23:59   all these people wrote to us tonight oh [TS]

00:24:01   yeah it is real and it is not it's [TS]

00:24:03   fantastic um yeah and the other thing [TS]

00:24:06   with virgin is so I rarely Virgin [TS]

00:24:08   Atlantic I rarely take it because it's [TS]

00:24:10   for what some reason it ends up being [TS]

00:24:11   it's usually far more expensive than [TS]

00:24:13   British British Airways and I just we [TS]

00:24:16   just so happen to find a ticket that was [TS]

00:24:18   roughly the same price and so we decided [TS]

00:24:21   book that because you haven't taken [TS]

00:24:23   virgin but if you ever go to London in [TS]

00:24:25   Heathrow they have an amazing lounge [TS]

00:24:28   tunes well it's probably the best lunch [TS]

00:24:30   I've ever been in including you can get [TS]

00:24:33   a haircut you can shower you can that's [TS]

00:24:36   pretty that you save a spa they have all [TS]

00:24:38   this amazing stuff there the shower [TS]

00:24:40   would be nice because sometimes for [TS]

00:24:41   whatever reason when you fly [TS]

00:24:42   cross-country especially for you because [TS]

00:24:44   you're coming from the west coast I [TS]

00:24:45   always feel like it's been like three [TS]

00:24:47   days since when I get off the plane like [TS]

00:24:49   in Europe I always feel like man I felt [TS]

00:24:52   like it was 72 hours yeah yes so yeah I [TS]

00:24:57   highly recommend that if if you ever [TS]

00:24:59   going overseas all right let me take a [TS]

00:25:01   break here and thank our first friend of [TS]

00:25:03   the show our good friends at Squarespace [TS]

00:25:06   you guys know Squarespace it's the best [TS]

00:25:08   place to go to make a website register [TS]

00:25:10   domain anything like that when you make [TS]

00:25:14   your next move you're going to need a [TS]

00:25:15   website why not start it at Squarespace [TS]

00:25:18   they've got beautiful templates they've [TS]

00:25:20   got beautiful types of sites to choose [TS]

00:25:24   from to start so if you're making an [TS]

00:25:26   online store you can start with a store [TS]

00:25:28   and then choose a template from there if [TS]

00:25:29   you're making a podcast you can start [TS]

00:25:32   with something like a podcast and boom [TS]

00:25:34   you've got a podcast site you didn't do [TS]

00:25:37   any work you can host your podcast right [TS]

00:25:38   there from Squarespace you name the type [TS]

00:25:41   of site you can build it with [TS]

00:25:42   squarespace and I say this is what I [TS]

00:25:45   think is that the resistance people [TS]

00:25:47   might have to Squarespace is you say [TS]

00:25:48   well everybody signs up for Squarespace [TS]

00:25:50   and you choose from a handful of [TS]

00:25:51   templates and then my sites going to [TS]

00:25:53   look like a square space site because [TS]

00:25:54   every it's not like that they've got so [TS]

00:25:56   many templates to choose from and so [TS]

00:25:58   many ways to customize them that you [TS]

00:26:00   don't even know when you're looking at a [TS]

00:26:02   square space site I was just looking at [TS]

00:26:06   a I mentioned this on daring fireball [TS]

00:26:07   last week there's a new cheesesteak [TS]

00:26:09   place pretty near our place here in [TS]

00:26:11   Philadelphia called cleavers really [TS]

00:26:12   great new sandwich shop here I was [TS]

00:26:15   looking at their website to place to [TS]

00:26:17   take out order and one of the things you [TS]

00:26:20   click on to see the menu loaded instead [TS]

00:26:22   of as a page loaded as a standalone [TS]

00:26:24   image and I could see the URL I could [TS]

00:26:26   see it was hosted at Squarespace I was [TS]

00:26:27   like whoa Annapolis and I've you sourced [TS]

00:26:29   and look and their whole site which is a [TS]

00:26:31   really nice site but doesn't look [TS]

00:26:33   anything like any other site I've ever [TS]

00:26:34   seen it's very much strongly branded [TS]

00:26:36   like the restaurant built with [TS]

00:26:38   squarespace but that makes total sense [TS]

00:26:39   why would they waste time [TS]

00:26:41   doing something outside director parties [TS]

00:26:44   like building a website when they could [TS]

00:26:45   just do it it's Squarespace and stick to [TS]

00:26:47   building into great restaurant so keep [TS]

00:26:49   in mind next time you need a website for [TS]

00:26:51   anything check out Squarespace go to [TS]

00:26:54   squarespace com you get a free demo and [TS]

00:26:57   once you sign up remember this code [TS]

00:26:59   Gruber just my last name GRU ber and you [TS]

00:27:04   will get ten percent off your purchase [TS]

00:27:06   why thanks to them for their continued [TS]

00:27:08   support of this podcast all right next [TS]

00:27:12   next item on my list at least is your [TS]

00:27:15   reaction to the new macbook pros which [TS]

00:27:18   yeah so um and I know you have thoughts [TS]

00:27:23   on this as well and you sir the one [TS]

00:27:26   thing that you link to which I thought [TS]

00:27:27   was interesting was a few weeks ago sort [TS]

00:27:30   of a pole right of people how they feel [TS]

00:27:33   about it and so my general take is [TS]

00:27:37   pretty straightforward I just I don't [TS]

00:27:39   hate the touch bar I just think it's [TS]

00:27:42   totally useless I have a few apps you [TS]

00:27:46   know that are sort of tailored for it [TS]

00:27:47   coating things like Pixelmator handful [TS]

00:27:51   of other things a bunch a bunch more [TS]

00:27:54   that aren't of course but I honestly [TS]

00:27:57   just switched the sort of the fluid a [TS]

00:28:01   setting to be back to just the standard [TS]

00:28:04   sorta f and or no i didn't sorry i [TS]

00:28:07   didn't use the the f keys i used the [TS]

00:28:09   function because i use the actual [TS]

00:28:11   brightness and all that stuff because i [TS]

00:28:12   like I just found myself going to that [TS]

00:28:14   like way way more than I would use any [TS]

00:28:17   of those sort of dynamic options that [TS]

00:28:19   the touch bar would off offer and I just [TS]

00:28:21   I don't I I have a hard time I know it's [TS]

00:28:26   early but I have a hard time ever seeing [TS]

00:28:27   that it becomes like this great feature [TS]

00:28:30   of the macbook pro do you disagree with [TS]

00:28:33   that uh no I don't disagree I feel like [TS]

00:28:38   it exists I feel like the touch bar as [TS]

00:28:40   we have it right now exists in a sort of [TS]

00:28:43   no-man's land where you cannot I don't [TS]

00:28:45   think it's fair to trash it i no think [TS]

00:28:47   it's fair to say this is great I feel [TS]

00:28:49   like [TS]

00:28:51   it's it's nuanced now that said I don't [TS]

00:28:55   own one so I've got that I spent about [TS]

00:28:57   two or three weeks when they first came [TS]

00:28:59   out playing out the review units I had [TS]

00:29:02   multiple of them but mostly spent the [TS]

00:29:04   time at the 13-inch because that's the [TS]

00:29:05   size i like and i love touch ID yes I [TS]

00:29:11   don't use daily hearted I don't use the [TS]

00:29:14   escape key as much as some people do but [TS]

00:29:16   I do use it and I do still even now even [TS]

00:29:20   if somebody who doesn't use the escape [TS]

00:29:21   key all the time I question whether they [TS]

00:29:24   should not have left a hardware [TS]

00:29:26   traditional Escape key and made the [TS]

00:29:28   touch bar just run from escape have a [TS]

00:29:32   scape key in the upper left corner the [TS]

00:29:35   touch ID in the upper right and have the [TS]

00:29:38   touch bar exist between the two I think [TS]

00:29:40   right I think that because it would have [TS]

00:29:42   given it more symmetry as well because [TS]

00:29:44   it's you know they have one button on [TS]

00:29:45   one side why not have the escape button [TS]

00:29:47   even if they change the size of it and [TS]

00:29:48   made it square sort of like the right [TS]

00:29:50   touch ideas but make it something you [TS]

00:29:52   can actually click and I think yet what [TS]

00:29:54   if I I do feel like just reading Twitter [TS]

00:29:57   reading feedback from readers and stuff [TS]

00:29:59   like that I feel like an awful lot of [TS]

00:30:01   the criticism where the touch bar [TS]

00:30:03   relates to the Escape key as for the [TS]

00:30:07   utility of the touch part self it's hard [TS]

00:30:09   to say I do i do I remember thinking it [TS]

00:30:12   was really nice to adjust the brightness [TS]

00:30:13   with the touch bar and I ended I find it [TS]

00:30:16   I find that so much more tedious [TS]

00:30:18   honestly to do it that way um you know [TS]

00:30:21   so here's before I switched it back to [TS]

00:30:24   being sort of the brightness as as sort [TS]

00:30:27   of default button so it has like you [TS]

00:30:28   know brightness and and things like [TS]

00:30:30   bring up expose and stuff like that you [TS]

00:30:31   can you there's a setting that you can [TS]

00:30:33   you know move it to rather than being [TS]

00:30:35   the dynamic touch bar it's it's sort of [TS]

00:30:37   your old standard buttons and I did that [TS]

00:30:40   because I was actually using I think [TS]

00:30:42   it's when you hit the function the FN [TS]

00:30:44   key i think that would bring up the old [TS]

00:30:46   ones and i was just using that all the [TS]

00:30:48   time because even though there are what [TS]

00:30:49   there is a brightness button on the [TS]

00:30:51   dynamic version of the touch bar when [TS]

00:30:54   you hit it then you yeah then you have [TS]

00:30:57   to scroll sort of up or down and so [TS]

00:30:59   often i just want like you know one [TS]

00:31:01   little nit more of brightness not like i [TS]

00:31:04   don't need this [TS]

00:31:05   sort of scrubbing you know to see all [TS]

00:31:07   the way down all the way up with the [TS]

00:31:08   difference is it's like one of those [TS]

00:31:10   features that just seems like a cool [TS]

00:31:12   option on paper but when you actually [TS]

00:31:13   use it it's much less useful ma'am so I [TS]

00:31:17   don't know I I can see the mixed [TS]

00:31:18   feelings about it I I feel I feel like [TS]

00:31:21   the biggest thing that it needs is [TS]

00:31:23   haptic feedback I feel like yeah and I [TS]

00:31:27   was reminded of it just recently because [TS]

00:31:29   i I'm I'm I haven't used it a lot [TS]

00:31:32   because I don't personally have a neat [TS]

00:31:34   but I'm fascinated by the new clips app [TS]

00:31:36   and I think it's I think it's really [TS]

00:31:37   well done even though I realized some of [TS]

00:31:39   the initial complaint from other people [TS]

00:31:40   are that they're a little confused by it [TS]

00:31:42   but I yeah I think it's only confusing [TS]

00:31:45   at first because its ambitious and tries [TS]

00:31:46   to do a lot and so there's a lot in [TS]

00:31:48   there but I feel like everything that [TS]

00:31:50   they've done once you get it it's pretty [TS]

00:31:52   logical but the the thing that made me [TS]

00:31:55   think of the touch bar is when you've [TS]

00:31:58   got your you've got multiple clips in a [TS]

00:32:02   project in a row and if you want to [TS]

00:32:04   rearrange them you you can force touch [TS]

00:32:07   on one and you get like a little you get [TS]

00:32:09   the haptic feedback as you drag it along [TS]

00:32:11   to rearrange clips in the timeline right [TS]

00:32:14   and it feels like so you want to move [TS]

00:32:17   the one that's in the fourth spot to the [TS]

00:32:18   second spot as you drag right between [TS]

00:32:20   second and third you get a little bit [TS]

00:32:21   rumbles and you can feel it right yeah [TS]

00:32:23   you can feel like it's like you're [TS]

00:32:24   dragging it over physical slots and it's [TS]

00:32:27   so nice and I just thought boy the touch [TS]

00:32:29   bar would feel so much better if it had [TS]

00:32:31   a little bit of feedback like that and [TS]

00:32:33   that speaks to I think it was a Michael [TS]

00:32:36   op right who wrote a post about you know [TS]

00:32:39   the the usability factor of the touch [TS]

00:32:41   bar because it's almost impossible to [TS]

00:32:43   use without looking at it which is also [TS]

00:32:45   very odd right like because that's not [TS]

00:32:47   what that row of buttons has been for [TS]

00:32:49   the entire life of a macbook and so to [TS]

00:32:52   your point like if they had some sort of [TS]

00:32:54   haptic feedback where you could actually [TS]

00:32:55   tell what you were doing while still [TS]

00:32:58   keying on the screen like for scrubbing [TS]

00:33:00   or doing some other action that would be [TS]

00:33:03   significantly better than having to look [TS]

00:33:05   down because you don't know where where [TS]

00:33:07   you are yeah and I do feel like that's [TS]

00:33:10   part of it you know like it some of the [TS]

00:33:14   ones in the middle I almost never used [TS]

00:33:15   like I don't on a traditional F kero [TS]

00:33:18   like I don't [TS]

00:33:19   really I almost never adjust the [TS]

00:33:21   brightness of my keyboard keyboard you [TS]

00:33:23   know saying sometimes it's like i'll be [TS]

00:33:25   on like a dark flight and I'm all right [TS]

00:33:29   yeah I'll adjust the brightness of my [TS]

00:33:31   keyboard but i'll just do it once and [TS]

00:33:33   it's fine for me to be looking at it but [TS]

00:33:35   for like micro adjustments to the [TS]

00:33:37   brightness of the screen I I am I can do [TS]

00:33:40   it without looking just by going up with [TS]

00:33:43   my left hand to the top left I know when [TS]

00:33:45   I Escape key is and the next to or [TS]

00:33:47   brightness and even if I'm wrong even if [TS]

00:33:49   I go up and I hit brightness up even [TS]

00:33:51   though I wanted brightness down I can [TS]

00:33:53   see what happened right away and I know [TS]

00:33:55   I'm right next door and just slide my [TS]

00:33:57   finger and yep and do that without [TS]

00:33:59   looking and I'm I'm with you with that [TS]

00:34:02   and I'm the exact same way with volume [TS]

00:34:03   and both of those are now problematic on [TS]

00:34:05   the touch bar you know if they look nice [TS]

00:34:08   like that nice you know little scrubber [TS]

00:34:10   and everything but just I do not like it [TS]

00:34:14   at all I mean I don't hate hate it but I [TS]

00:34:18   just don't see like i said i switch back [TS]

00:34:20   to sort of the the old standards and [TS]

00:34:23   like you said they're not physical [TS]

00:34:24   buttons and there's no haptic feedback [TS]

00:34:25   so they're harder to use so i have to [TS]

00:34:27   actually pay attention to what i'm doing [TS]

00:34:29   and then i also i do think i agree that [TS]

00:34:31   touch ID is by far the best part of it [TS]

00:34:34   but the weird thing there is that i [TS]

00:34:37   almost never get to use it because i do [TS]

00:34:39   have an Apple watch and I'm always [TS]

00:34:40   wearing the Apple watch and that unlocks [TS]

00:34:42   faster than the touch ID does so before [TS]

00:34:46   you can even reach up to the touch ID [TS]

00:34:47   it's done so there's no point yeah well [TS]

00:34:50   it's good for purchases or whatever yeah [TS]

00:34:51   for purchase logging in logging in is [TS]

00:34:54   the big is you know the money you do i [TS]

00:34:56   log in an hour you know open it from [TS]

00:34:58   sleep and login way more frequently than [TS]

00:35:00   i buy stuff yeah um and so what do you [TS]

00:35:04   do you why do you think that they did [TS]

00:35:06   the touch bar because like so part of [TS]

00:35:10   the thing that I wrote was you know sort [TS]

00:35:11   of the the title of is a great laptop [TS]

00:35:13   laptop stagnation the notion being that [TS]

00:35:17   we've sort of reached peak form factor [TS]

00:35:20   of the laptop and I know that's [TS]

00:35:21   dangerous to say for sort of any [TS]

00:35:22   technology that we've reached peak [TS]

00:35:24   because there's always going to be some [TS]

00:35:25   level of innovation and I think I made [TS]

00:35:27   the equip that maybe we'll have phil [TS]

00:35:29   schiller on stage saying can innovate [TS]

00:35:30   anymore my ass [TS]

00:35:32   when they do something new with it with [TS]

00:35:34   the macbook but like my only line of [TS]

00:35:36   thinking is either they're going to one [TS]

00:35:39   day try to make it a bigger screen area [TS]

00:35:43   like the keyboard tray be being more [TS]

00:35:45   maybe like apt 'ok digital keys you know [TS]

00:35:50   something like that or not even like [TS]

00:35:53   replacing the entire keyboard but just [TS]

00:35:54   making that a bigger area you know for [TS]

00:35:57   for different things that they can [TS]

00:35:58   dynamically do I mean that has to be [TS]

00:36:00   some line of thinking right it can't [TS]

00:36:03   just be this this touch bar which isn't [TS]

00:36:05   that interesting i guess i don't know [TS]

00:36:08   but i find it worries him if their goal [TS]

00:36:09   is to replace hardware keyboard with a [TS]

00:36:13   virtual keyboard because I I can't see [TS]

00:36:16   how that would like whatever my I kind [TS]

00:36:19   of still prefer my older macbook [TS]

00:36:21   keyboard to the new one the shallow keys [TS]

00:36:24   yeah cuz in Newark but it's a deeper [TS]

00:36:27   case but after two or three weeks my [TS]

00:36:28   feelings we went from I like the old one [TS]

00:36:31   better too oh I have mixed feelings [TS]

00:36:33   because I also feel though that my old [TS]

00:36:35   one they feel loose and jank jank right [TS]

00:36:37   and resin the new ones even though they [TS]

00:36:40   have shallower feel so clicking them [TS]

00:36:42   feels worse because it's shallow but [TS]

00:36:44   just resting my fingers on them feels [TS]

00:36:46   better because they don't wiggle around [TS]

00:36:47   they feel more premium yep and I had a [TS]

00:36:53   problem at first I had a really weird [TS]

00:36:54   problem and I can't explain why but the [TS]

00:36:57   the new keyboards in the macbook and the [TS]

00:36:59   mac the just plain macbook in the [TS]

00:37:01   macbook pro yep have bigger keys and [TS]

00:37:04   less space between the keys the keyboard [TS]

00:37:08   takes up the exact same amount of area [TS]

00:37:09   and so the distance between just pick [TS]

00:37:12   two keys like the center of the a key [TS]

00:37:14   and the center of the f key r is exactly [TS]

00:37:18   the same so your fingers resting on the [TS]

00:37:21   home row are exactly in the same [TS]

00:37:23   position but for some reason because the [TS]

00:37:25   keys are bigger I felt for a while like [TS]

00:37:30   my fingers were spread out more yeah I [TS]

00:37:33   get that I think that's something I [TS]

00:37:36   needed to get used to I especially [TS]

00:37:38   notice it because I use the iPad [TS]

00:37:40   keyboard all the time and that is those [TS]

00:37:42   are smaller keys yeah right yeah and so [TS]

00:37:45   that's when I really notice it and [TS]

00:37:46   I honestly i think i prefer the ipad [TS]

00:37:49   keyboard is weird as that sounds I just [TS]

00:37:50   it's not it's not a perfect keyboard but [TS]

00:37:54   maybe it is like you're talking about [TS]

00:37:56   sort of the size of the keys just [TS]

00:37:57   something about it feels more familiar [TS]

00:37:59   than typing on the newer keyboards yeah [TS]

00:38:01   I can kind of see that like you're [TS]

00:38:03   talking about like the smart key bad [TS]

00:38:04   yeah everyone I don't believe it's [TS]

00:38:06   almost like on the smart keyboard cover [TS]

00:38:08   it it it celebrates the shallowness of [TS]

00:38:12   the movement whereas on the macbook it's [TS]

00:38:15   like man I still wish that these keys [TS]

00:38:17   went in further yes but I can live with [TS]

00:38:20   that I really read the the difference [TS]

00:38:24   between my feelings about the new [TS]

00:38:26   macbook pro keyboard and the previous [TS]

00:38:28   generation macbook pro keyboard I have [TS]

00:38:30   thought but the thoughts are much [TS]

00:38:34   narrower than the thought between what [TS]

00:38:37   we have now and a hypothetical Virtual [TS]

00:38:39   Touch bar that was the whole keyboard [TS]

00:38:41   yeah like well what do you think about [TS]

00:38:44   this like so the other thing that I that [TS]

00:38:46   I've chatted with some folks about is [TS]

00:38:48   the notion of one way that I think they [TS]

00:38:51   could have alleviated some of the touch [TS]

00:38:53   bar criticism is like also just putting [TS]

00:38:57   it at the bottom of the keyboard so in [TS]

00:38:59   other words keeping the function row [TS]

00:39:01   that as it was and just adding a new row [TS]

00:39:03   because like and especially on the [TS]

00:39:05   macbook so here's the thought here right [TS]

00:39:08   now they made the the touchpad the touch [TS]

00:39:10   pad itself right massive it's pretty big [TS]

00:39:13   now um I think it's bigger than it needs [TS]

00:39:15   to be for anything and so you could [TS]

00:39:17   shave that down a little bit and I think [TS]

00:39:19   if you wanted to do some sort of touch [TS]

00:39:20   bar type thing put it just above the [TS]

00:39:23   touchpad and sort of make that the whole [TS]

00:39:26   touch area especially because apples [TS]

00:39:28   whole thing as we all know is that [TS]

00:39:29   they're not going to do a touchscreen [TS]

00:39:31   macbook imac macbook pro anything and [TS]

00:39:35   the weirdness of this whole dynamic [TS]

00:39:38   right now is that they made a touch area [TS]

00:39:40   that's so close to the screen but isn't [TS]

00:39:43   the screen and you know they make they [TS]

00:39:44   have the the famous sort of picture of [TS]

00:39:46   like you know with a cross out are more [TS]

00:39:49   like pointing at the screen because it's [TS]

00:39:50   just not oregano mccreight and it's not [TS]

00:39:53   that much different in my book to sort [TS]

00:39:54   of have to go up to this top row and [TS]

00:39:58   have to sort of manipulate touch [TS]

00:40:00   that way I would have been much more [TS]

00:40:02   happy if we're my hands already rest [TS]

00:40:04   sort of at the bottom you tried to do [TS]

00:40:06   something with the touch bar and I don't [TS]

00:40:07   know my I just looking down at my [TS]

00:40:09   macbook as you say this my problem with [TS]

00:40:12   that is that my hands would cover it [TS]

00:40:13   most of the time I think the advantage [TS]

00:40:14   diving into the top is that you can see [TS]

00:40:16   it your hands don't cover it whereas [TS]

00:40:17   this way your hands cover it until you [TS]

00:40:20   go to look at it but maybe that's okay I [TS]

00:40:23   don't know if they've if they tinkered [TS]

00:40:25   without a deer or not but maybe that's [TS]

00:40:26   okay because it doesn't matter if you [TS]

00:40:27   see it or not because by the time you go [TS]

00:40:29   to do something on it you were already [TS]

00:40:31   moving your hands I don't write [TS]

00:40:33   especially if you have I mean if they [TS]

00:40:34   acknowledge that you have to be looking [TS]

00:40:36   at it to use it already and I just I [TS]

00:40:39   feel like I don't know I i could see i [TS]

00:40:42   think some people push back on that like [TS]

00:40:43   with the notion of what your palms could [TS]

00:40:45   rest on and could mess it up or [TS]

00:40:46   something obviously Apple has all the [TS]

00:40:48   palm detection stuff for the ipad [TS]

00:40:49   alrighty i'm sure they can figure that [TS]

00:40:50   out but um I just think like for certain [TS]

00:40:54   types of things certainly some of the [TS]

00:40:56   things that they were showing off like [TS]

00:40:57   the DJing and all that kind of you know [TS]

00:40:58   fun stuff uh you might not be you know [TS]

00:41:03   really needing to use the keyboard as [TS]

00:41:04   much as sort of the touch area to toggle [TS]

00:41:06   controls and stuff and so in that [TS]

00:41:08   situation it might make a little bit [TS]

00:41:10   more sense but I don't know I mean I [TS]

00:41:11   assume like you said they they may be [TS]

00:41:13   tried something or thought about it at [TS]

00:41:15   least and they determined that that [TS]

00:41:16   wasn't the way to go ma'am I don't know [TS]

00:41:19   what do you thing about the weight and [TS]

00:41:21   the size the window size are great I [TS]

00:41:23   mean it's not so I have right now I have [TS]

00:41:27   a bunch of machines I've a older macbook [TS]

00:41:31   pro for that's my work machine that sort [TS]

00:41:34   of was given to me by the people who [TS]

00:41:39   dish out computers at work and so that's [TS]

00:41:41   I think like a two and a half or three [TS]

00:41:43   year old macbook so an older style [TS]

00:41:44   macbook pro then I have the macbook the [TS]

00:41:47   small 13-inch one and then I got the [TS]

00:41:51   touch touch bar macbook pro and so my [TS]

00:41:55   other issue there is that while it is [TS]

00:41:59   obviously more svelte and lighter than [TS]

00:42:02   the the older macbook pro I have it's [TS]

00:42:04   not you know anywhere near as light and [TS]

00:42:07   it's felt as the macbook itself and so [TS]

00:42:10   if I'm going somewhere where I [TS]

00:42:13   would want sort of the most portability [TS]

00:42:15   obviously I know that most people don't [TS]

00:42:17   have three options of course but when [TS]

00:42:18   people would ask like well I just want [TS]

00:42:20   the most poor ability I would say go [TS]

00:42:22   with the macbook I mean it's it's still [TS]

00:42:24   the main problem there now is the one [TS]

00:42:26   USBC port and honestly you know I carry [TS]

00:42:32   around the dongle of course and it's [TS]

00:42:34   mildly annoying from time to time but [TS]

00:42:36   I'm not sure it would be even be that [TS]

00:42:38   much better if it's just if it had four [TS]

00:42:39   USB seaports because USBC is still not [TS]

00:42:42   doesn't seem quite as ubiquitous [TS]

00:42:44   certainly for the things like I have to [TS]

00:42:46   you know Lupin things for work all the [TS]

00:42:48   time and insert a hook up different USB [TS]

00:42:50   see stuff and I almost always need a [TS]

00:42:51   converter still so I'm just not sure [TS]

00:42:54   that that would even sort of alleviate [TS]

00:42:55   the pain so my biggest problem with the [TS]

00:42:57   the older macbook and I have the one [TS]

00:42:58   that's you know came out a couple years [TS]

00:42:59   ago so it's it's fairly slow but I think [TS]

00:43:01   a lot of people said that this sort of [TS]

00:43:03   newer version that came out several [TS]

00:43:06   months ago is significantly faster so i [TS]

00:43:09   would go with that one the thing I like [TS]

00:43:12   the most about it and I think it speaks [TS]

00:43:13   to your point that we're sort of [TS]

00:43:15   approaching peak form factor is and it [TS]

00:43:20   was the to me the part that made my my [TS]

00:43:23   personal 2014 I think I get mixed up at [TS]

00:43:28   how old a two-year-old i think i got it [TS]

00:43:29   in 2014 anyway yeah that makes sense um [TS]

00:43:32   my 2014 13 inch macbook pro the biggest [TS]

00:43:35   difference to me and it's it's petty and [TS]

00:43:38   it has nothing to do with actual [TS]

00:43:39   computing but it's the ease with which i [TS]

00:43:43   can open this display that the display [TS]

00:43:45   just lifts up perfectly and if i want to [TS]

00:43:48   adjust it slightly i just put one finger [TS]

00:43:51   on it on the new ones that is and yep [TS]

00:43:53   and it just it's just absolute the [TS]

00:43:56   perfect amount of resistance where it [TS]

00:43:57   never moves if I don't want it to and [TS]

00:43:59   when I do want to move it it's the least [TS]

00:44:00   amount of energy possible and it makes [TS]

00:44:02   my old one feel like it's way too hard [TS]

00:44:05   and heavy to lift and to me that's it [TS]

00:44:08   that's the that's the the ideal that the [TS]

00:44:11   new macbooks have ever more closely [TS]

00:44:13   approached to I don't know about the [TS]

00:44:15   regular macbook like when you lift a [TS]

00:44:17   macbook is it so light that the whole [TS]

00:44:19   thing lifts up or can you do it yeah [TS]

00:44:20   it's right that I would say it's a [TS]

00:44:22   little bit too light for that I still [TS]

00:44:24   feel the need to sort of [TS]

00:44:27   yeah like you know weigh it down a [TS]

00:44:28   little bit while I'm lifting a dollar is [TS]

00:44:29   the new macbook pros you don't have to [TS]

00:44:31   do that the new macbook pros even though [TS]

00:44:32   in theory it's it's worse to be heavier [TS]

00:44:35   all things considered right they could [TS]

00:44:37   make one that was every bit as fast and [TS]

00:44:39   powerful as the macbook yes they would [TS]

00:44:42   do it they're not going to make it [TS]

00:44:43   heavier just the Apple is not going to [TS]

00:44:45   make macbooks heavier just just to make [TS]

00:44:47   it easier to open them right future but [TS]

00:44:50   right now I feel like the macbook pros [TS]

00:44:52   are at this wonderful I deal between the [TS]

00:44:56   weight of the base where the keyboard in [TS]

00:44:58   the battery and everything are and the [TS]

00:45:00   lightness of the display and the ability [TS]

00:45:02   to lift it up I agree and so right so [TS]

00:45:05   the form factor is great right it's so [TS]

00:45:07   great that it's like it's been whittled [TS]

00:45:09   down to sort of this this uh you know [TS]

00:45:12   that that level of sort of perfection [TS]

00:45:15   for exactly what you're talking about [TS]

00:45:16   what else would they possibly do to it [TS]

00:45:19   beyond like you know expanding touch bar [TS]

00:45:21   and doing other things to it but it's [TS]

00:45:22   like that's the form factor there's my [TS]

00:45:24   what else are you gonna do to that you [TS]

00:45:26   can't really change that now no I I [TS]

00:45:29   don't other than you know and again it's [TS]

00:45:32   not really changed at a form factor but [TS]

00:45:33   in theory at some point I presume that [TS]

00:45:36   they're going to you know it won't be [TS]

00:45:38   aluminum forever I mean you know I feel [TS]

00:45:40   like we yes right the macbook still has [TS]

00:45:42   a decade maybe more ahead of it is it [TS]

00:45:46   gonna really be aluminum for 20 or 30 [TS]

00:45:49   years I don't know so new materials you [TS]

00:45:51   know yep that's basically I do think the [TS]

00:45:55   form factor is as you know for and for [TS]

00:45:58   certain tasks it is a wonderful [TS]

00:45:59   wonderful form factor and I just feel [TS]

00:46:01   like don't mess with it and I I do [TS]

00:46:03   wonder there's a part of me that wonders [TS]

00:46:05   if the touch bar is basically a mess [TS]

00:46:08   with it for the sake of messing with it [TS]

00:46:10   freshly right that's exactly what I was [TS]

00:46:13   basically alluding to in that post um [TS]

00:46:14   you know they felt like look we're sort [TS]

00:46:18   of at the perfect storm of two things [TS]

00:46:19   right now right so what we were just [TS]

00:46:22   talking about sort of the form factor is [TS]

00:46:23   we've whittled it down to near [TS]

00:46:26   perfection right and then on the flip [TS]

00:46:28   side we have sort of the the CPUs and [TS]

00:46:30   the internals are basically not getting [TS]

00:46:33   that much faster now because you know [TS]

00:46:35   more as Moore's Law is has Sloan down [TS]

00:46:38   slow down were [TS]

00:46:40   we're sort of at the point where it's [TS]

00:46:43   very hard to rationalize a year to year [TS]

00:46:46   upgrade it's hard to rationalize a two [TS]

00:46:49   year to year upgrade right for a for a [TS]

00:46:50   macbook pro because it's just not that [TS]

00:46:53   much faster than the than what the state [TS]

00:46:55   of the art was two years ago and so we [TS]

00:46:57   have those two things coming into play [TS]

00:47:00   and so when Apple's trying to think [TS]

00:47:01   about well what do we do this year to [TS]

00:47:03   get you know to get people excited about [TS]

00:47:05   potentially buying the new machine you [TS]

00:47:08   know you can do you can change the [TS]

00:47:10   colors of it they've done that a little [TS]

00:47:11   bit of course with some gold and rose [TS]

00:47:14   gold options and I don't think that that [TS]

00:47:16   really moves the needle though on uh on [TS]

00:47:18   making someone purchase a new one and so [TS]

00:47:19   this touch bar thing it feels like to me [TS]

00:47:22   that was you know some idea like let's [TS]

00:47:24   try this you know let's let's see if [TS]

00:47:27   this is interesting and that's uh that's [TS]

00:47:29   a dangerous game for Apple to play I [TS]

00:47:30   think I totally agree and I wonder about [TS]

00:47:34   and it is clearly to me their most [TS]

00:47:36   important product I know we just had the [TS]

00:47:38   whole thing with the mac pro and that [TS]

00:47:39   there's imax coming out and stuff like [TS]

00:47:41   that but the macbooks are clearly the [TS]

00:47:42   bread and butter of the mac lineup you [TS]

00:47:46   know if they had to cut back for some [TS]

00:47:48   reason you know that's the last max to [TS]

00:47:51   go are going to be the macbooks and I [TS]

00:47:53   wonder you and I have talked about this [TS]

00:47:55   before and I know a lot of people [TS]

00:47:56   obviously have different differing [TS]

00:47:58   thoughts in this but like so the other [TS]

00:47:59   part I think towards the end of the post [TS]

00:48:02   I wrote was basically I'm very much in [TS]

00:48:06   the camp of I would love to just do [TS]

00:48:08   everything on an iPad I'm milling 19 I'm [TS]

00:48:10   95 let's say percent of the way there [TS]

00:48:13   the problem is that other five percent [TS]

00:48:15   matters and so I just can't do it yet I [TS]

00:48:17   would love to be in that camp though are [TS]

00:48:19   you it and I know you're definitely you [TS]

00:48:21   know still in the macbook camp but if if [TS]

00:48:24   they could do if they had full sort of [TS]

00:48:27   parody maybe not you know not quite as [TS]

00:48:30   easy to do certain things and vice versa [TS]

00:48:32   but if they had sort of full parity in [TS]

00:48:34   terms of functionality would you want to [TS]

00:48:39   use an iPad more than you use the [TS]

00:48:41   macbook no I don't think so i think the [TS]

00:48:43   longer time goes on the less likely i am [TS]

00:48:46   to use to even want to use an ipad i [TS]

00:48:49   feel like i have the clarity now and i [TS]

00:48:52   might I feel like but I don't feel [TS]

00:48:54   like I speak to the the mass market it's [TS]

00:48:57   I have so many little things little [TS]

00:49:00   custom nerd scripts and things that I [TS]

00:49:03   have set to keyboard shortcuts on my Mac [TS]

00:49:05   that I can't do on the iPad and that [TS]

00:49:09   even if I wanted to do through workflow [TS]

00:49:11   or something like that and i'm a super [TS]

00:49:12   super happy that apple bought workflow [TS]

00:49:14   and seems to want to keep it around and [TS]

00:49:16   maybe they'll integrate it in the OS but [TS]

00:49:19   like I have a shortcut that it's system [TS]

00:49:25   wide service that I made so that i can [TS]

00:49:26   convert it the selected text in any app [TS]

00:49:28   from mark down to HTML and the key [TS]

00:49:32   command i made for it is command shift k [TS]

00:49:37   I don't know why I forget why damn [TS]

00:49:40   because command ship damn is like [TS]

00:49:41   minimize windows and so I went to K mark [TS]

00:49:44   I don't know but I don't even have to [TS]

00:49:46   think about had to pause to remember it [TS]

00:49:47   because my fingers just know it and I've [TS]

00:49:49   had it for years yeah but you know the [TS]

00:49:52   ipad pros like we were just talking [TS]

00:49:54   about they cut you know you can get the [TS]

00:49:55   the keyboard that's with it and they you [TS]

00:49:57   know they have command + Shift + k still [TS]

00:49:59   I guess that in theory they could add [TS]

00:50:03   that they could add stuff to the system [TS]

00:50:06   software that would enable something [TS]

00:50:07   like that in theory right but the form [TS]

00:50:09   factor doesn't speak to me either like [TS]

00:50:11   last week when I was flying home from [TS]

00:50:17   San Francisco after the the shindig at [TS]

00:50:22   cupertino I was at the gate at the [TS]

00:50:26   terminal and I had a couple just a [TS]

00:50:28   couple of minutes before they started [TS]

00:50:29   boarding and somebody dm'd me that I had [TS]

00:50:33   a typo in a DF post and instead of [TS]

00:50:37   fixing it on my phone I just I knew I [TS]

00:50:40   had like a couple minutes I just quick [TS]

00:50:42   took out my macbook from my backpack [TS]

00:50:45   opened it and just without even sitting [TS]

00:50:47   down just held it in the palm of my hand [TS]

00:50:49   and opened it logged in fixed it shut it [TS]

00:50:55   put it back my backpack like I don't see [TS]

00:50:57   how you could do that on an iPad I you [TS]

00:50:59   could do it but you wouldn't have the [TS]

00:51:00   hardware keyboard there's no way you can [TS]

00:51:01   just sit there and stand and [TS]

00:51:03   connect a hardware keyboard and yeah I [TS]

00:51:06   get that and and I'm sort of the same [TS]

00:51:08   way that's one of the sort of five [TS]

00:51:09   percent thing is definitely on the [TS]

00:51:10   writing side of things so I actually do [TS]

00:51:12   a lot of writing on the iPad but I'll [TS]

00:51:14   sort of right in the in the app Ulysses [TS]

00:51:16   and then I basically export it to medium [TS]

00:51:19   or wherever I'm going to publish and I [TS]

00:51:22   don't publish though from there because [TS]

00:51:24   I wait to do some of the formatting [TS]

00:51:25   stuff that I can just I feel like I can [TS]

00:51:27   just have a much better handle on using [TS]

00:51:29   on a on a macbook and so I wait to [TS]

00:51:31   publish until after there but that's [TS]

00:51:34   that's sort of one of the larger parts [TS]

00:51:36   of the five percent that is still [TS]

00:51:38   holding me back but in in my butt in my [TS]

00:51:40   book i'm sort of i'm quite different i [TS]

00:51:42   guess from you in that regard because i [TS]

00:51:44   like my ideal computing experience would [TS]

00:51:47   be where i could go on a trip not have [TS]

00:51:51   to take any macbook with me just take [TS]

00:51:54   the the ipad pro with the keyboard cover [TS]

00:51:57   and you know i do it right now for short [TS]

00:52:00   little trips or you know just on a daily [TS]

00:52:02   basis like if i'm going to just do email [TS]

00:52:04   or and then do some reading and i go to [TS]

00:52:07   a sort of local cafe I just love [TS]

00:52:09   grabbing that thing and walking out the [TS]

00:52:10   door don't ring a bag it's so it just it [TS]

00:52:13   just feels like this is the way I want [TS]

00:52:16   to be doing computing in my life and I [TS]

00:52:18   don't want to have a you know even as we [TS]

00:52:21   were just talking about even as felt as [TS]

00:52:22   the macbooks are now I just there's [TS]

00:52:25   there's too much going on I like the [TS]

00:52:27   simplicity of doing everything through [TS]

00:52:29   the iPad I totally see the appeal of it [TS]

00:52:30   but it doesn't it just doesn't speak to [TS]

00:52:32   me and I'd you know and I like I pen but [TS]

00:52:36   for me and again i'm a big proponent i [TS]

00:52:38   have been for years fighting against the [TS]

00:52:40   argument that it's fundamentally only [TS]

00:52:42   good for consumption and not for [TS]

00:52:44   creation i've argued it but for me [TS]

00:52:46   personally that actually is very true [TS]

00:52:48   that I i tend to use it I actually have [TS]

00:52:50   left the cover of mine for a while now [TS]

00:52:52   and I just have it with no cover and I [TS]

00:52:54   read tons on it and I read lots of [TS]

00:52:56   Twitter and I bookmark things to post [TS]

00:52:59   the daring fireball later from a [TS]

00:53:01   different machine from it but it's I [TS]

00:53:02   tend not to do any actual typing on it [TS]

00:53:05   but I can see the appeal I totally see [TS]

00:53:07   the appeal and I would totally see the [TS]

00:53:09   appeal for long-form writing too I feel [TS]

00:53:11   like the longer the thing you're writing [TS]

00:53:13   the more the more pleasant it is and [TS]

00:53:15   like when I wrote like I [TS]

00:53:16   did I enjoyed writing my review of the [TS]

00:53:18   ipad pro on the ipad pro because it was [TS]

00:53:20   long review uh and I do kind of like [TS]

00:53:23   that it is naturally distraction-free I [TS]

00:53:26   find I never used the distraction free [TS]

00:53:28   full screen modes on the mac for any app [TS]

00:53:31   ever because I find that it's just just [TS]

00:53:34   gets in a way when I want to get out of [TS]

00:53:35   it whereas on the iPad it's totally [TS]

00:53:37   natural it's you know and I'm a big [TS]

00:53:39   believer net in general I feel anything [TS]

00:53:41   you tack on to a system afterwards is [TS]

00:53:44   never as good as if it was there from [TS]

00:53:45   the beginning so full screen mode on the [TS]

00:53:47   mac to me I use it for video and that's [TS]

00:53:50   about it but otherwise to me it feels [TS]

00:53:52   tacked on because the mac wasn't [TS]

00:53:54   designed at the start it was designed to [TS]

00:53:56   have everything windows that are [TS]

00:53:58   overlapping you can drag around whereas [TS]

00:54:00   the ipad was designed from the ground up [TS]

00:54:01   to have full screen apps yeah I mean I [TS]

00:54:04   so I do a lot of it you know anything [TS]

00:54:07   that i write basically like you said [TS]

00:54:09   sort of that's that's longer than just a [TS]

00:54:10   blurb or something like that i try to do [TS]

00:54:12   on the ipad and I just it's something [TS]

00:54:13   about it reminds me of like when I was a [TS]

00:54:15   kid growing up going to my father's [TS]

00:54:16   office and like they had typewriters and [TS]

00:54:18   just using the typewriter right i mean i [TS]

00:54:21   know it's obviously very different but [TS]

00:54:23   something about this focus thing and [TS]

00:54:25   it's almost like you know there's a [TS]

00:54:26   there's a blank sheet of paper in front [TS]

00:54:27   of you and the words are magically [TS]

00:54:30   appearing on it m and it most things in [TS]

00:54:32   my life most things in my life are that [TS]

00:54:35   I'm in control of our complete mess like [TS]

00:54:37   my desk is usually just a complete Andy [TS]

00:54:39   Rooney style mess of papers and odd [TS]

00:54:43   objects and boxes and it all sorts of [TS]

00:54:46   stuff so I like lots of things I have [TS]

00:54:49   her a complete mess other things though [TS]

00:54:51   I try to keep obsessively neat and like [TS]

00:54:54   the daring fireball homepage would be a [TS]

00:54:55   fine example there's no clutter you know [TS]

00:54:58   I aspire to that I wish that I had the [TS]

00:55:00   organizational ability and the the [TS]

00:55:03   wherewithal to have everything in my [TS]

00:55:05   life be like that I I when I see [TS]

00:55:07   pictures of people who have lived these [TS]

00:55:09   minimal offices I covet them I do I see [TS]

00:55:12   the appeal and I do I look at my mac [TS]

00:55:16   with all of these windows like if i go [TS]

00:55:18   to expose or whatever and see how many [TS]

00:55:20   apps i have running and how many windows [TS]

00:55:22   are actually overlapping sometimes my [TS]

00:55:25   mac looks like a mess and i do I like [TS]

00:55:28   the way that the ipad even if you open a [TS]

00:55:30   second [TS]

00:55:30   I love how neat it is that if you have [TS]

00:55:32   like message the messages app on the [TS]

00:55:36   right in a narrow iphone with column [TS]

00:55:38   your other thing whether it's Safari or [TS]

00:55:41   your writing app in a square to the left [TS]

00:55:43   of it I love how neatly that's organized [TS]

00:55:46   where there's no overlap there's no [TS]

00:55:47   shadows from windows showing depth it's [TS]

00:55:50   just to uh rectangles perfectly aligned [TS]

00:55:55   I love that and I can see how that is [TS]

00:55:58   soothing mentally soothing to people and [TS]

00:56:01   an appealing um since it's sort of the [TS]

00:56:05   perfect segue and night might not be [TS]

00:56:07   much to talk about but just curious like [TS]

00:56:09   so obviously apple released the sort of [TS]

00:56:12   you know though the cheaper ipad version [TS]

00:56:14   but they didn't do anything you know as [TS]

00:56:17   was rumored by many various sites for [TS]

00:56:20   actual new ipad hardware and so are a [TS]

00:56:23   presume now were there were at the end [TS]

00:56:25   of april we're not going to see any sort [TS]

00:56:26   of event before WWDC so do they do that [TS]

00:56:29   at wwc do they wait for the fall I don't [TS]

00:56:33   know it is it's very intriguing to me [TS]

00:56:35   that the supply chain rumor mill seemed [TS]

00:56:37   to think it was going to happen you know [TS]

00:56:40   right like neither last month or the you [TS]

00:56:42   know the first week of April or [TS]

00:56:43   something like that and i agree with you [TS]

00:56:44   i don't i don't eat and I don't hear any [TS]

00:56:46   rumblings to the ground that there's [TS]

00:56:47   anything coming before WWDC so I almost [TS]

00:56:52   feel like it's something that maybe [TS]

00:56:54   they've successfully kept under wraps so [TS]

00:56:57   it could happen at WWDC but if they wait [TS]

00:57:01   into the fall I almost feel like they've [TS]

00:57:03   got to wait till October because it [TS]

00:57:05   sounds like after I phone right because [TS]

00:57:08   I don't think they'd want to share the [TS]

00:57:09   stage with iPhone because it sounds like [TS]

00:57:11   they've got a very exciting iphone to [TS]

00:57:13   unveil and right if it's on schedule [TS]

00:57:15   it'll be like the second week of [TS]

00:57:16   September as I said before I mean [TS]

00:57:19   they've they've been pretty consistent [TS]

00:57:20   on that for three or four years and I [TS]

00:57:23   don't think they'd want to share the [TS]

00:57:24   stage but they could in theory you know [TS]

00:57:27   it may not be it may come naturally if [TS]

00:57:30   there's you know like a shared design [TS]

00:57:32   language of a more edge-to-edge display [TS]

00:57:35   it could make sense to unveil them side [TS]

00:57:38   by side I don't know but it would make [TS]

00:57:40   more sense to me if they did I phones in [TS]

00:57:42   September and iPads in October and you [TS]

00:57:45   but you don't think that they would do [TS]

00:57:46   it at WWDC I guess they could but it [TS]

00:57:51   depends how much these new iPads which [TS]

00:57:55   at least some of the you know one of [TS]

00:57:57   them is rumored to be a more [TS]

00:57:58   edge-to-edge display where the right you [TS]

00:58:00   know that the 9.7 inch iPad is still [TS]

00:58:02   going to be nine point seven inches as a [TS]

00:58:05   device but that the screen will be 10 [TS]

00:58:07   points something inches instead of nine [TS]

00:58:09   point seven inches because it's going to [TS]

00:58:11   take up more of the front face but that [TS]

00:58:13   sounds to me like what the rumor is for [TS]

00:58:15   the iphone and if right and they don't [TS]

00:58:17   want to they don't want to spoil it [TS]

00:58:19   right that they want the i reveal come [TS]

00:58:21   out first right but is that am i [TS]

00:58:27   overthinking it am i overthinking there [TS]

00:58:29   you know willingness to just let the [TS]

00:58:32   product that's ready to ship first ship [TS]

00:58:34   first whether it's the iphone or not I [TS]

00:58:36   don't know yeah and if there was some [TS]

00:58:39   sort of marquee feature in iOS 11 you [TS]

00:58:43   know that was sort of ipad rhyme or ipad [TS]

00:58:46   focused maybe but yeah there hasn't been [TS]

00:58:50   much rumors about iOS 11 at all no even [TS]

00:58:54   though we're fairly close which is [TS]

00:58:57   interesting but well other than the fact [TS]

00:58:59   that there for a while i don't know if [TS]

00:59:01   you've noticed this but I've heard [TS]

00:59:02   rumors for a while that months ago I [TS]

00:59:05   guess more or less when Iowa's 10 came [TS]

00:59:07   out last WWDC there after the event was [TS]

00:59:12   over there were rumors beforehand that [TS]

00:59:14   that Apple might unveil some iPad [TS]

00:59:17   specific ipad pro specific features you [TS]

00:59:21   know and that the keynote came and went [TS]

00:59:24   and there were none and then in the [TS]

00:59:26   aftermath the word was well that got [TS]

00:59:28   punted from ten point oh but it's going [TS]

00:59:30   to come in like 10.2 or something 10.2 [TS]

00:59:32   over 8.3 but we've gotten to 10.3 and it [TS]

00:59:35   didn't happen and there's not going to [TS]

00:59:37   be a 10.4 between now and June because I [TS]

00:59:41   you know All Hands are working on iOS 11 [TS]

00:59:44   so whether that ships in iOS 11.0 or not [TS]

00:59:49   or get punted once again to the first [TS]

00:59:52   big update you know in december or [TS]

00:59:53   january of 11.2 I [TS]

00:59:55   no but that's the way week but there [TS]

00:59:57   have been recent like this time last [TS]

00:59:59   year that they [TS]

00:59:59   year that they [TS]

01:00:00   have Pro specific improvements to the OS [TS]

01:00:04   for multitasking and stuff like that and [TS]

01:00:07   if that is the case and we may have just [TS]

01:00:09   answer a riddle right that they would [TS]

01:00:11   they would launch that and presumably [TS]

01:00:14   they would want to have new iPad pro [TS]

01:00:15   hardware to show whatever that [TS]

01:00:17   functionality is off since the ipad pro [TS]

01:00:20   would be relatively old at that point [TS]

01:00:23   right over a year between iterations [TS]

01:00:26   right well and the the 12-inch one the [TS]

01:00:29   13-inch one would be a year and yeah [TS]

01:00:31   really oh really alright at this point [TS]

01:00:33   um I don't know but I mean both of them [TS]

01:00:37   launched with I feel a lot of headroom [TS]

01:00:38   to wait for the next version because [TS]

01:00:40   they really are pretty fast for ipads I [TS]

01:00:42   mean I've you know they're both you know [TS]

01:00:44   faster than I don't know if they're [TS]

01:00:45   faster than the current macbook but i [TS]

01:00:47   think they are and they're certainly [TS]

01:00:48   faster than the macbook that you're [TS]

01:00:49   talking about the original macbook with [TS]

01:00:52   one port I mean that's how fast they are [TS]

01:00:54   yep i'm using the big ipad pro right now [TS]

01:00:57   which I almost never use again speaking [TS]

01:01:00   to obviously is as we all do we just buy [TS]

01:01:02   a bunch of devices probably more than we [TS]

01:01:05   need but it is nice when you're sort of [TS]

01:01:07   sitting at a desk it's a nice sort of [TS]

01:01:09   second screen yeah I don't know so I I [TS]

01:01:12   feel like they need to though and I feel [TS]

01:01:14   like I feel like selling points on [TS]

01:01:16   changes to the OS to make it a little [TS]

01:01:20   bit more you know bring the ipad [TS]

01:01:23   especially the ipad pro a little bit [TS]

01:01:25   more towards the mac in terms of [TS]

01:01:28   capabilities not necessarily copying [TS]

01:01:30   things from the mac and how you do it [TS]

01:01:32   but just making it easier um I mean the [TS]

01:01:35   thing I would like to see them do let me [TS]

01:01:37   take a break actually I mean I hold this [TS]

01:01:39   thought and I'll take a break because [TS]

01:01:40   it's a good good way to keep you posted [TS]

01:01:42   spent okay I want to talk to you bout [TS]

01:01:45   our next sponsor I love this company I [TS]

01:01:48   love their products and I this is a [TS]

01:01:51   company that I hate to say it but they [TS]

01:01:53   shouldn't even be paying me to promote [TS]

01:01:56   their products because I would sing [TS]

01:01:57   their praises even if they weren't and a [TS]

01:01:59   company is 0 ee r 0 0 makes Wi-Fi [TS]

01:02:06   routers for your house [TS]

01:02:08   you don't have to choose which one they [TS]

01:02:09   just have one model right now you go you [TS]

01:02:11   buy like a three pack you plug one of [TS]

01:02:14   them their little white boxes roughly [TS]

01:02:15   the size of like an apple TV or [TS]

01:02:17   something like that that almost looks [TS]

01:02:18   like an apple design product they ship [TS]

01:02:20   with apple style really supple even like [TS]

01:02:23   the ethernet cables they give you in the [TS]

01:02:24   box are nice it's like a nice ethernet [TS]

01:02:27   cable it's not like a piece of junk [TS]

01:02:29   thing that you got from Joe's cables on [TS]

01:02:31   the corner nice cable nice power cable [TS]

01:02:33   you plug it into your router and now [TS]

01:02:35   you've got there's your primary ero base [TS]

01:02:37   station then you take like the other two [TS]

01:02:39   and you're like maybe your router is on [TS]

01:02:42   the first floor you put another one on [TS]

01:02:43   the second floor and another one on a [TS]

01:02:45   third floor keep them near the steps try [TS]

01:02:47   to minimize how many walls has to go [TS]

01:02:48   through and it creates what's called a [TS]

01:02:50   mesh network through your house and it [TS]

01:02:54   is a huge difference now I don't know [TS]

01:02:57   what you know maybe if you live in if [TS]

01:02:58   you live in a studio apartment guess [TS]

01:02:59   what you don't need really need to [TS]

01:03:00   narrow its a nice base station but you [TS]

01:03:02   really only need one and it really it'd [TS]

01:03:04   be a nice space station for that but the [TS]

01:03:06   mesh network thing isn't going to help [TS]

01:03:07   you out but if you live in the city like [TS]

01:03:09   I do we have four floors if you you [TS]

01:03:13   there's really no way to set up one [TS]

01:03:15   router that I've ever tried that gets a [TS]

01:03:19   good Wi-Fi signal everywhere in the [TS]

01:03:21   house I ended personally I just recently [TS]

01:03:24   upgraded my comcast service had comcast [TS]

01:03:27   come in got new internet comcast new [TS]

01:03:30   router they gave me a router with the [TS]

01:03:33   the thing in the room where I have it [TS]

01:03:36   set up in my home office I get like a [TS]

01:03:38   hundred and fifty two hundred megabits [TS]

01:03:40   per second over Wi-Fi it's amazing [TS]

01:03:42   that's amazing performance it's like 10 [TS]

01:03:44   times faster than what I have before one [TS]

01:03:46   floor up still pretty good it's like 50 [TS]

01:03:50   megabits per second something like that [TS]

01:03:51   but in my master bedroom this is no shit [TS]

01:03:53   I swear to god this is true I tested [TS]

01:03:55   this with the speed test app I get 0.2 [TS]

01:03:58   megabits per second Wi-Fi from that [TS]

01:04:01   router so it goes from 200 megabits per [TS]

01:04:04   second 20.2 megabits per second so once [TS]

01:04:08   the comcast guy was gone and you know I [TS]

01:04:09   knew I had good internet i reset up my [TS]

01:04:11   eros I put my ear o in there [TS]

01:04:14   I only have three now I guess still get [TS]

01:04:17   200 or so megabits per second in my [TS]

01:04:20   office from euro but my master bedroom [TS]

01:04:22   is getting 60 megabits per second Wi-Fi [TS]

01:04:25   that's how great it is I cannot be and I [TS]

01:04:27   it I didn't have to configure anything [TS]

01:04:29   you just you just follow the [TS]

01:04:30   instructions in their little app and it [TS]

01:04:32   it just configures everything and they [TS]

01:04:35   even tell you that it they talk to each [TS]

01:04:38   other and they fix it up and and after [TS]

01:04:41   you've set it up like 24 hours later the [TS]

01:04:43   service is usually even better because [TS]

01:04:45   the knit the the eros have communicated [TS]

01:04:47   with each other about where they should [TS]

01:04:49   hand off to each other cannot tell you [TS]

01:04:51   how happy I am with this product I [TS]

01:04:53   recommend it highly I don't know what [TS]

01:04:56   else to tell you if you need Wi-Fi if [TS]

01:04:58   you're unhappy with your wife I've [TS]

01:05:00   indeed new Wi-Fi you'd be silly not to [TS]

01:05:03   check it out that what they do is they [TS]

01:05:04   recommend one ero for every thousand [TS]

01:05:07   square feet of your home three packs a [TS]

01:05:09   good starting point you can always buy [TS]

01:05:11   more and you can hook up 10 in total if [TS]

01:05:13   you need to so here's what you do go to [TS]

01:05:16   eurocom and use the code actually you [TS]

01:05:24   know what forget the code screw it [TS]

01:05:26   here's what they've done they've gotten [TS]

01:05:28   rid of these codes and to celebrate the [TS]

01:05:30   first birthday what they've done is [TS]

01:05:31   they've just dropped their prices [TS]

01:05:33   permanently so instead of using a code [TS]

01:05:35   you just go to eurocom and now you can [TS]

01:05:38   get a three pack for just three hundred [TS]

01:05:39   ninety nine dollars used to be 499 and [TS]

01:05:41   you can get a 2-pack for 299 that used [TS]

01:05:44   to be fifty dollars more so to get here [TS]

01:05:47   at this new price just go to eurocom and [TS]

01:05:49   you can get them at best buyer or even [TS]

01:05:51   amazon if you want they don't care they [TS]

01:05:53   don't they don't even care if you buy [TS]

01:05:54   them direct so get if you need Wi-Fi get [TS]

01:05:56   an arrow love this product I feel like [TS]

01:06:01   you and I talked about arrow before they [TS]

01:06:03   were sponsor of your podcast which is [TS]

01:06:05   that's nice I remember the first time I [TS]

01:06:08   read you know what I'll get back to my [TS]

01:06:10   the point I wanted to make about ipad [TS]

01:06:12   I've got my finger in the air this is my [TS]

01:06:13   reminder i know the point I want to make [TS]

01:06:15   calm but we could go on a digression [TS]

01:06:17   right now I remember the first time I [TS]

01:06:19   heard about euro was I read it in Walt [TS]

01:06:21   Mossberg column uh-huh [TS]

01:06:24   and I read his description of it and I [TS]

01:06:26   knew that I was suffering from the [TS]

01:06:28   problem he was talking about at the four [TS]

01:06:30   years I had an apple airport whatever [TS]

01:06:32   the best the best apple I think the most [TS]

01:06:36   still the most recent one because they [TS]

01:06:38   haven't updated it in years yeah the one [TS]

01:06:40   they're Ford extreme yeah the one is [TS]

01:06:41   Gabriel tall yeah I have the same one [TS]

01:06:43   and i had the same one now i have euro [TS]

01:06:45   same time I had it on the second floor [TS]

01:06:47   our living room of a four floor [TS]

01:06:49   residence and it was ok and it my office [TS]

01:06:54   was one floor up and it got pretty good [TS]

01:06:56   Wi-Fi our master bedroom on the fourth [TS]

01:06:59   floor yeah it wasn't bad wasn't like it [TS]

01:07:02   is it like it was with this comcast [TS]

01:07:04   router but it wasn't great um and and [TS]

01:07:10   for whatever reason our garage on the [TS]

01:07:11   first floor one floor down got no signal [TS]

01:07:13   whatsoever I don't know if it's because [TS]

01:07:15   the garage had insulation I don't know [TS]

01:07:17   what the heck it was I read waltz column [TS]

01:07:22   and I was like this sounds amazing [TS]

01:07:24   because a it solves a problem i have but [TS]

01:07:26   be he's telling me that I don't have to [TS]

01:07:28   configure just no you don't you don't go [TS]

01:07:30   into an admin interface and start typing [TS]

01:07:31   in IP numbers you don't start picking [TS]

01:07:35   channels you don't have to set one of [TS]

01:07:38   them in bridge mode and one of them in [TS]

01:07:40   something mode you just hook them up and [TS]

01:07:42   tap buttons in the app as you hook them [TS]

01:07:44   up around your house and follow their [TS]

01:07:45   general advice of you know where best to [TS]

01:07:47   put them and then all of a sudden you've [TS]

01:07:49   got a network that every room in your [TS]

01:07:52   house has good internet I was like that [TS]

01:07:54   sounds so amazing and it was it was [TS]

01:07:56   little the literal truth that's the [TS]

01:07:58   exact experience of using it and it's [TS]

01:08:01   yeah anyway the digression would be [TS]

01:08:03   waltz announcement that he's retiring [TS]

01:08:05   yeah obviously significant news within [TS]

01:08:11   the world in which in which we inhabit [TS]

01:08:14   um yeah you know like it's funny when I [TS]

01:08:18   moved to go so I was working as a web [TS]

01:08:21   developer down in San Diego and sort of [TS]

01:08:24   writing on the side just for fun and at [TS]

01:08:29   some point you know VentureBeat at the [TS]

01:08:31   time came calling and you know wanted me [TS]

01:08:33   to to sort of come up and consider sort [TS]

01:08:35   of writing full-time [TS]

01:08:37   and I just like sort of laughed to [TS]

01:08:40   myself like thinking like no one can [TS]

01:08:42   make a living sort of doing that all [TS]

01:08:43   right like I mean you know it's almost [TS]

01:08:45   like too good to be true and you know [TS]

01:08:48   around you know the same time there I [TS]

01:08:50   think there had been a like a profile or [TS]

01:08:53   maybe I was even just googling it but [TS]

01:08:55   just like you know the story of the rise [TS]

01:08:57   of Walt Mossberg sort of getting into [TS]

01:08:59   obviously it wasn't blogging at the time [TS]

01:09:01   it was for the wall street journal but [TS]

01:09:04   sort of making his way into this thing [TS]

01:09:08   that hadn't existed before right he was [TS]

01:09:09   he was covering politics and then all of [TS]

01:09:11   a sudden he decided he was going to [TS]

01:09:12   cover personal technology and again not [TS]

01:09:15   blogging exactly but you know not too [TS]

01:09:18   dissimilar from from I think what sort [TS]

01:09:22   of the ideal state for a lot of us [TS]

01:09:24   certainly for me at the time you know [TS]

01:09:27   that's what I aspired something to do [TS]

01:09:29   something like that right I just read up [TS]

01:09:33   I will I swear to God put it in the show [TS]

01:09:35   notes there's an interview I think it [TS]

01:09:38   just came out today but if not it came [TS]

01:09:39   out last night an interview with with [TS]

01:09:41   Walt and the columbia journalism review [TS]

01:09:43   right i haven't read it yet but i saved [TS]

01:09:45   it as well yeah he was at 1991 he was [TS]

01:09:48   the lead national security correspondent [TS]

01:09:51   for The Wall Street Journal which is the [TS]

01:09:54   columbia journalism review says is [TS]

01:09:56   literally one of the most coveted spots [TS]

01:09:58   in all of newspaper journalism I mean it [TS]

01:10:03   probably you know you could count it on [TS]

01:10:05   one hand as the one of the most [TS]

01:10:07   prestigious gigs you know the Journal [TS]

01:10:09   the New York Times Wall Street [TS]

01:10:11   Washington Post and a handful of the top [TS]

01:10:14   jobs there would be something like that [TS]

01:10:16   because national security is of utmost [TS]

01:10:18   importance and when something breaks it [TS]

01:10:21   it's you know it becomes you know you [TS]

01:10:23   own the top pick you know top right [TS]

01:10:25   corner of the front page of the [TS]

01:10:27   newspaper and I mean just no breaking [TS]

01:10:30   news is more important than national [TS]

01:10:31   security news all right so he had the [TS]

01:10:33   job he obviously had decades ahead of [TS]

01:10:36   him in his career and he gave it up to [TS]

01:10:38   create what was there then unheard of [TS]

01:10:40   which was an in a national major [TS]

01:10:44   newspaper a personal technology clump [TS]

01:10:46   everybody you know like like the CGR [TS]

01:10:49   said that most people in [TS]

01:10:50   Street you know news people were like oh [TS]

01:10:52   boy what did he do why did he get this [TS]

01:10:54   terrible demotion for great um yeah I've [TS]

01:10:58   tried to think of like what the [TS]

01:10:59   equivalent thing would be today and it's [TS]

01:11:02   hard to come up with something because [TS]

01:11:03   like because honestly it's hard to it's [TS]

01:11:05   hard to envision something that would [TS]

01:11:06   sort of become as pervasive as as just [TS]

01:11:10   technology in general right like you [TS]

01:11:12   could say like oh I'm going to stop the [TS]

01:11:15   Apple beat because I want to write about [TS]

01:11:17   Bitcoin um and you know people would be [TS]

01:11:20   like but you're on the you know you're [TS]

01:11:22   covering the most valuable company in [TS]

01:11:24   the world why do you want to write about [TS]

01:11:25   sort of this this nascent technology [TS]

01:11:27   thing and you know like it's a it was [TS]

01:11:31   one hell of a leap a faith that he did [TS]

01:11:33   and obviously like I said he sort of you [TS]

01:11:36   know was the the is a pinnacle of doing [TS]

01:11:40   that and I think you know the whole [TS]

01:11:43   generations of Engadget's gizmodo's you [TS]

01:11:48   know all the people who were doing [TS]

01:11:49   gadget reviews certainly you know that [TS]

01:11:53   that was the pinnacle and then you know [TS]

01:11:55   just in general sort of writing a [TS]

01:11:57   technology called I can't say it better [TS]

01:11:59   than him here's waltz exact words in [TS]

01:12:01   this interview there were a bunch of [TS]

01:12:02   computer columns in a lot of other [TS]

01:12:04   newspapers and certainly there were [TS]

01:12:05   computer magazines but these were all [TS]

01:12:08   written by geeks for geeks my pits to [TS]

01:12:10   the journal was that I wanted to write a [TS]

01:12:12   column that didn't use a lot of jargon [TS]

01:12:14   that treated people with respect for [TS]

01:12:16   their intelligence and I think that can [TS]

01:12:18   not be understated that that was the [TS]

01:12:21   gist of Walt's it still is the gist of [TS]

01:12:23   Walt's writing that it was never [TS]

01:12:25   computers for dummies it was it was his [TS]

01:12:30   angle was that the problem is with the [TS]

01:12:32   complicated stuff not with the people [TS]

01:12:33   who can't understand the complicated [TS]

01:12:35   stuff and that it did two things one [TS]

01:12:40   help people figure out how to make this [TS]

01:12:41   journey in the technology by telling [TS]

01:12:43   them what was good and what was bad on [TS]

01:12:44   the market explaining when some new [TS]

01:12:46   development happened what it meant what [TS]

01:12:48   it was who it might be for that was one [TS]

01:12:50   of my goals and the other one was to use [TS]

01:12:52   the power of the platform and the voice [TS]

01:12:54   that I would have in this column because [TS]

01:12:56   it was an opinion column in a way to [TS]

01:12:59   push the industry to stop ignoring [TS]

01:13:00   normal people and stop treating him like [TS]

01:13:02   they were stupid [TS]

01:13:03   that was it that was my idea and it [TS]

01:13:05   worked and I can't see I mean I cannot [TS]

01:13:08   say it oh that's that's absolutely [TS]

01:13:09   perfect because he sort of he basically [TS]

01:13:11   whether you could argue you know he [TS]

01:13:14   helped certainly helped usher that era [TS]

01:13:16   in but he also just he foresaw the fact [TS]

01:13:19   that it would move from you know sort of [TS]

01:13:22   the enthusiasts and in and geeky people [TS]

01:13:25   just being really into technology and [TS]

01:13:27   and you know reading things like PC [TS]

01:13:28   world and things like that to actually [TS]

01:13:30   going into a mainstream thing and like I [TS]

01:13:32   mean it is you know one of the most [TS]

01:13:34   mainstream things right now is [TS]

01:13:36   technology right like there's every [TS]

01:13:38   single person in the world in some [TS]

01:13:40   capacity uses some sort of technology [TS]

01:13:42   and we could you imagine sort of if you [TS]

01:13:46   know if the pc worlds were still sort of [TS]

01:13:49   the the norm in sort of writing about [TS]

01:13:51   that it would seem insane right now [TS]

01:13:53   because no one would have sort of a [TS]

01:13:55   guide to figure out how to use any of [TS]

01:13:57   this stuff and the timing is just [TS]

01:13:59   amazing that he did it and he'd made [TS]

01:14:00   this decision in 1991 because in my [TS]

01:14:03   opinion what made computers mainstream [TS]

01:14:06   arguably to fold but i think it's single [TS]

01:14:10   fold i think windows 95 obviously had [TS]

01:14:12   some part of it where the mass-market [TS]

01:14:14   lower-cost pcs jump from having a really [TS]

01:14:18   Jenky operating system like windows 31 [TS]

01:14:21   to having something that looked pretty [TS]

01:14:22   nice and was a little certainly a lot [TS]

01:14:25   better organized but the bigger thing is [TS]

01:14:27   just the internet itself which is that [TS]

01:14:30   and and you know people who love [TS]

01:14:31   computers i certainly didn't foresee it [TS]

01:14:33   I you know I was of the opinion as [TS]

01:14:35   somebody a kid who grew up loving [TS]

01:14:37   computers I couldn't understand why [TS]

01:14:38   everybody else didn't love computers and [TS]

01:14:39   want to spend as many hours a day as [TS]

01:14:41   they possibly could on computers but for [TS]

01:14:43   normal people what made computers [TS]

01:14:44   something that they didn't care about [TS]

01:14:46   something they cared about deeply was [TS]

01:14:48   that they got turned into communication [TS]

01:14:50   devices they its communication [TS]

01:14:52   everything it you know humans are [TS]

01:14:55   creatures res were born to want to [TS]

01:14:58   communicate with each other and did [TS]

01:15:00   technologies that allow us to do so are [TS]

01:15:03   the ones that rock it off I mean you [TS]

01:15:05   could even talk about the automobile [TS]

01:15:07   from the Henry Ford era a century ago as [TS]

01:15:10   altima tlie is a communications device [TS]

01:15:12   you know that yes you could use it to [TS]

01:15:14   bring things from one place to another [TS]

01:15:16   faster than you could [TS]

01:15:17   but the fact that you could go visit [TS]

01:15:18   people who you couldn't visit because [TS]

01:15:21   you wouldn't have time to get there is a [TS]

01:15:23   huge part of it right and computers [TS]

01:15:25   before they were communication devices [TS]

01:15:27   or went in like the dial-up modem era [TS]

01:15:30   when you had to dial in and telnet into [TS]

01:15:31   a bulletin board and use you know [TS]

01:15:33   cryptic command line things and nobody [TS]

01:15:35   would understand it like geeks got it [TS]

01:15:37   early we spent time on bulletin boards [TS]

01:15:39   communicating with each other but when [TS]

01:15:41   simple be easy to understand [TS]

01:15:44   communication technology became [TS]

01:15:46   available on the Internet it does when [TS]

01:15:47   it exploded but Walt had his column from [TS]

01:15:50   1991 55 years before that and so he was [TS]

01:15:53   already established as this voice of [TS]

01:15:55   authority when the explosion already [TS]

01:15:57   happened yeah and and I mean the most [TS]

01:16:00   obvious thing in the world is that the [TS]

01:16:01   the iphone was the ultimate [TS]

01:16:02   extrapolation of that right because then [TS]

01:16:05   you had the not only was it a physical [TS]

01:16:07   communication device it blended [TS]

01:16:10   everything together and you had it with [TS]

01:16:11   you all the time right one thing that I [TS]

01:16:16   was curious to your your take about this [TS]

01:16:18   topic on with you know with Walt moving [TS]

01:16:21   on was who do you think takes up the [TS]

01:16:24   mantle then as sort of the I guess that [TS]

01:16:27   go to either technology columnist or [TS]

01:16:29   reviewer you know we know the names who [TS]

01:16:31   are sort of at the at the bigger places [TS]

01:16:32   you know Farhad Manjoo at the New York [TS]

01:16:36   Times Wall Street Journal is still doing [TS]

01:16:40   the combo right of right with Johanna [TS]

01:16:44   and with Joyner right and the other guy [TS]

01:16:47   but so what and then David Pogue I you [TS]

01:16:57   know is still at yahoo i guess or is he [TS]

01:17:00   nod i don't even know like what's going [TS]

01:17:02   to happen is he going to be a duck so [TS]

01:17:03   but i feel like i don't know because [TS]

01:17:05   yeah whose future is so uncertain it [TS]

01:17:07   right is he gonna be a ethos or whatever [TS]

01:17:10   the hell that govern he's gonna become [TS]

01:17:11   so Oh Jeffrey Fowler yes Jeffrey color [TS]

01:17:17   sorry Jeffrey sorry Jeffrey uh but so [TS]

01:17:20   like so what how do you think that that [TS]

01:17:22   plays out or is it not one of the giant [TS]

01:17:24   you know sort of old-school publications [TS]

01:17:26   is it some some other is it so mark [TS]

01:17:28   Gurman you know was announced this [TS]

01:17:30   morning [TS]

01:17:30   Bloomberg's launching a like a gadget [TS]

01:17:33   show with with Garmin oh I didn't see [TS]

01:17:36   that yeah it was unlike I said axia so [TS]

01:17:40   Axios you know the new uh the new [TS]

01:17:42   newsletter thing from lyon and that [TS]

01:17:44   group um yeah they broke the story about [TS]

01:17:46   uh it looks like it's going I don't know [TS]

01:17:50   exactly what is going to be cult Alden i [TS]

01:17:52   had actually had to link here so i got [TS]

01:17:53   it up but yeah i was just talking about [TS]

01:17:57   axios because inna freed is took over [TS]

01:17:59   and as running the technology beat for [TS]

01:18:01   them and she was at the Apple shindig [TS]

01:18:03   last weekend I was talking to her about [TS]

01:18:05   it it's an interesting format and i said [TS]

01:18:08   to her i said you know i'm not just [TS]

01:18:09   saying this because you're here but i [TS]

01:18:10   have to say that especially politics [TS]

01:18:13   wise you know i'm more keenly attuned [TS]

01:18:15   every ever since november and in the [TS]

01:18:19   last few months it's surprising how many [TS]

01:18:20   of the links that have bubbled up to the [TS]

01:18:22   surface politically have been axio sites [TS]

01:18:24   like it didn't take very long after [TS]

01:18:26   axios launched before I I noticed it and [TS]

01:18:29   I was like how long has this been around [TS]

01:18:31   because all of a sudden this is in my [TS]

01:18:32   it's popping up every day and then I [TS]

01:18:34   checked and I was like oh it's only like [TS]

01:18:36   two weeks old yeah it's not like I'm a [TS]

01:18:38   oh yeah it's like right from the get-go [TS]

01:18:39   though actually been as they're doing [TS]

01:18:42   great and that not to do too much of an [TS]

01:18:44   aside on the aside but yeah so you know [TS]

01:18:47   in my world in my current world in vc [TS]

01:18:49   obviously everyone was reading dan [TS]

01:18:50   primack it when he was at fortune his [TS]

01:18:52   newsletter and he moved over to Axios [TS]

01:18:55   sort of around the time of their launch [TS]

01:18:56   and then they have the mike allen guy [TS]

01:18:59   who famously sort of wrote the you know [TS]

01:19:01   the politico newsletter for a long time [TS]

01:19:03   and it's insane because he literally [TS]

01:19:05   writes it every single day and just [TS]

01:19:07   fills it with a ton of content every [TS]

01:19:08   single day it seems to get legitimate [TS]

01:19:10   inside the White House scoops and [TS]

01:19:12   obviously prime it gets his scoop Cena [TS]

01:19:14   will get hers and it's just like on down [TS]

01:19:16   the line they have a they have a pretty [TS]

01:19:18   killer product and team yeah yeah they [TS]

01:19:20   really it's they did a very keen job of [TS]

01:19:22   focusing on just getting great talent [TS]

01:19:26   just you know they have a great format [TS]

01:19:28   and I like you know it's a good it looks [TS]

01:19:30   good there's not i don't see any clutter [TS]

01:19:32   on screen that is annoying me it's [TS]

01:19:35   they've got this focus on writing really [TS]

01:19:38   short articles that just get to the [TS]

01:19:39   point which I think goes over really [TS]

01:19:42   well like [TS]

01:19:43   there's no padding in the articles but [TS]

01:19:46   they've got great talent on all these [TS]

01:19:48   beats which is to me a great combination [TS]

01:19:50   it's a good format with a good focus its [TS]

01:19:54   user-friendly and they've assembled a [TS]

01:19:57   really good team of talented people with [TS]

01:19:59   with deep sources so anyway and they do [TS]

01:20:02   a grit and just they do a great job with [TS]

01:20:04   brevity to like they don't just they [TS]

01:20:06   don't drag on that's what I'm saying [TS]

01:20:07   long way so much on the web that drags [TS]

01:20:09   on because it's like they want now it's [TS]

01:20:11   like I feel like in the old days the [TS]

01:20:13   problem like eight nine years ago was [TS]

01:20:16   that the sites because they were [TS]

01:20:18   counting pages they would break up with [TS]

01:20:21   breakup articles you know click here for [TS]

01:20:23   next page next page but now I feel like [TS]

01:20:27   articles are padded for the sake of [TS]

01:20:29   being able to algorithmically interrupt [TS]

01:20:33   between paragraphs to insert either ads [TS]

01:20:36   or promotions for other thing on the [TS]

01:20:38   site and so yeah I noticed they're [TS]

01:20:40   mostly reading on the phone is it there [TS]

01:20:44   was just oh my god I forget who it was I [TS]

01:20:45   don't want to mention it because I don't [TS]

01:20:47   want to give him any attention but there [TS]

01:20:48   was an article I was reading last night [TS]

01:20:49   where they had three interruptions in [TS]

01:20:52   the same article to promote a pot a new [TS]

01:20:54   podcast that they were launching for the [TS]

01:20:56   same podcast three times in the article [TS]

01:20:58   between paragraphs and on the phone it's [TS]

01:21:00   a huge it's a huge interruption between [TS]

01:21:03   like where your eyes find the next [TS]

01:21:05   paragraph or anyway Axios does a good [TS]

01:21:07   job on them so Gurman singh is called [TS]

01:21:10   gadgets with german huh that's a great [TS]

01:21:11   idea bloomberg show so it's going to be [TS]

01:21:14   a digital video series that they're [TS]

01:21:17   going to launch across all the Bloomberg [TS]

01:21:18   stuff including the terminal it sounds [TS]

01:21:19   like but then they're going to package [TS]

01:21:21   it together and eventually sort of put [TS]

01:21:22   it on Bloomberg Television as well yeah [TS]

01:21:24   I know he's been very onerous I know [TS]

01:21:26   that's why you know I can't say I'm [TS]

01:21:28   close friends with him but I certainly [TS]

01:21:29   done friendly with him he's been on the [TS]

01:21:31   show and whenever you know I like and [TS]

01:21:33   now that now that he's you know really [TS]

01:21:36   gone pro he's he's getting invited to [TS]

01:21:38   Apple events and I always try to make [TS]

01:21:39   make a point of saying hi I know from [TS]

01:21:41   talking to him that a big reason he went [TS]

01:21:44   to Bloomberg instead of anywhere else [TS]

01:21:45   was the promise of video and TV stuff [TS]

01:21:48   you know these right he's interested in [TS]

01:21:51   that so I'm not surprised at all that [TS]

01:21:53   he's getting his own thing [TS]

01:21:54   but so you know it amongst those people [TS]

01:21:57   or someone else like is there's someone [TS]

01:21:58   who takes up that mantle or are we just [TS]

01:22:00   in an era now where it's so it's such [TS]

01:22:02   the norm that there's going to be sort [TS]

01:22:04   of the you know five to ten go to serve [TS]

01:22:06   it I don't think there is anybody it [TS]

01:22:08   takes the mantle from mossberg I really [TS]

01:22:09   don't and and I just don't I just don't [TS]

01:22:12   see how it happens because I don't see [TS]

01:22:14   it's not like the New York Times The [TS]

01:22:17   Wall Street Journal aren't still [TS]

01:22:20   important but they're differently [TS]

01:22:23   important now where I don't feel like [TS]

01:22:25   they have singular voice maybe like on [TS]

01:22:27   the new york times op-ed page you know [TS]

01:22:29   like a Paul Krugman and Maureen Dowd [TS]

01:22:31   still have that influence but I don't [TS]

01:22:36   know in technology I just don't see it i [TS]

01:22:38   just it i think the fact that Walt was [TS]

01:22:42   there so early and was so established [TS]

01:22:45   that it combined with the incredible [TS]

01:22:48   power of the Wall Street Journal even [TS]

01:22:50   today I mean wall street journal is [TS]

01:22:51   still super popular but the fact that he [TS]

01:22:53   was doing it at the journal I just don't [TS]

01:22:55   see how anybody's going to take that [TS]

01:22:56   position it's almost like you know [TS]

01:22:57   Michael Jordan retires who takes over as [TS]

01:22:59   Michael Jordan like maybe they're really [TS]

01:23:01   Braun who comes along but I I think [TS]

01:23:03   whoever that is isn't here yet yeah it's [TS]

01:23:06   gonna have to be sort of different thing [TS]

01:23:08   maybe even a different format right now [TS]

01:23:09   and you know maybe this this German [TS]

01:23:12   thing becomes interesting i do think [TS]

01:23:14   like you know some of some of the other [TS]

01:23:16   other folks who have great history like [TS]

01:23:20   steven levy is a good good friend of [TS]

01:23:21   mine obviously he's still getting a you [TS]

01:23:23   know some amazing stories for for his [TS]

01:23:25   back channel stuff which is underwired [TS]

01:23:27   now and you know there's there's going [TS]

01:23:29   to be sort of there's still the the [TS]

01:23:32   group of folks who have so much prestige [TS]

01:23:35   around them and the bigger companies are [TS]

01:23:38   still comfortable sort of you know [TS]

01:23:40   talking to them versus you know just [TS]

01:23:43   some some random person like you said [TS]

01:23:44   like sort of when when Mark was that [TS]

01:23:46   when mark Gurman was at a 9to5 mac he [TS]

01:23:50   didn't get invited to any of the Apple [TS]

01:23:51   things right even though he's breaking [TS]

01:23:52   every single story it was already too [TS]

01:23:54   late come to the enhance right like what [TS]

01:23:57   he was doing that was that was that was [TS]

01:23:59   adding adding to the overall quantity of [TS]

01:24:04   the information in the world had nothing [TS]

01:24:05   to do with what was at the event it was [TS]

01:24:07   you know [TS]

01:24:07   five months before the event right I I [TS]

01:24:11   feel like the closest would be and I [TS]

01:24:13   wonder it I think he did the right thing [TS]

01:24:16   because I think part of being pression [TS]

01:24:17   with Walt was that I think he was I [TS]

01:24:22   think he was smart to go to create the [TS]

01:24:24   all things D brand while at the wall [TS]

01:24:27   street journal and and it did again the [TS]

01:24:29   columbia journalism review mentions that [TS]

01:24:31   they did that he and kara swisher did [TS]

01:24:32   that when the consensus among print [TS]

01:24:36   journalists was still to treat the web [TS]

01:24:39   as an ugly stepchild right right you're [TS]

01:24:41   writing primarily for print and then [TS]

01:24:44   there's some b team that takes the print [TS]

01:24:46   stuff after it after it's gone through [TS]

01:24:48   the print process and i don't put it on [TS]

01:24:50   the web thing or whatever you know [TS]

01:24:51   treated as an ugly stepchild i mean here [TS]

01:24:54   in Philadelphia if I don't want to go on [TS]

01:24:56   a super long side but that Philadelphia [TS]

01:24:58   the two newspapers are the Inquirer in [TS]

01:24:59   the Daily News and they made a decision [TS]

01:25:02   in the late 90s that rather than focus [TS]

01:25:05   on having like Enquirer calm and philly [TS]

01:25:08   daily news com or whatever you want to [TS]

01:25:10   call the domains be a quality things [TS]

01:25:13   they made like a joint thing called [TS]

01:25:15   philly.com and they had content from [TS]

01:25:17   both newspapers but they just sort it [TS]

01:25:19   was never really clear which articles [TS]

01:25:22   were from which paper even though they [TS]

01:25:23   independently has print operations they [TS]

01:25:25   were completely separate and rivals it's [TS]

01:25:27   completely separate rivals even though [TS]

01:25:29   they were under the same parent [TS]

01:25:30   obligation our organization but the [TS]

01:25:33   Philly comp and it was an ugly website [TS]

01:25:35   it was slow to load they always they [TS]

01:25:38   were at the forefront of using paywalls [TS]

01:25:39   and and it almost bankrupted the comet [TS]

01:25:44   it did bankrupt the company the company [TS]

01:25:45   isn't it you know they ended up having [TS]

01:25:47   to sell their their magnificent [TS]

01:25:49   headquarters and and move into you know [TS]

01:25:51   genki office space and it you know not [TS]

01:25:55   treating the web seriously really almost [TS]

01:25:56   ran him into the ground I would say what [TS]

01:25:58   was it the opposite where Walt was you [TS]

01:26:00   know with all things D they they were [TS]

01:26:02   like will make you know will write for [TS]

01:26:04   the web first yep it will make white [TS]

01:26:06   only content that plus the conference [TS]

01:26:10   business I mean right you know they [TS]

01:26:12   which came favorite curva 2003 and I [TS]

01:26:15   think they started the all things D [TS]

01:26:16   website in 2007 I also think that you [TS]

01:26:19   know leaving leaving the journal for the [TS]

01:26:21   lab [TS]

01:26:21   you know what five six years of his [TS]

01:26:23   career to start recode at which they [TS]

01:26:25   then merged with you know box and and [TS]

01:26:28   the verge it cetera was probably the [TS]

01:26:30   right thing to do I really do think so [TS]

01:26:32   and I think it was at an eye on the [TS]

01:26:34   future but I wonder how much it lessened [TS]

01:26:37   his influence like yeah like I'd serve [TS]

01:26:41   really for Cara and and what she does [TS]

01:26:44   best with breaking scoops it's fine I [TS]

01:26:47   think in fact it's why I don't think I [TS]

01:26:49   think it was all win and in fact that [TS]

01:26:51   she's got equity in the thing and the [TS]

01:26:54   scoops go out to everybody who cares [TS]

01:26:55   about scoops when they come out but for [TS]

01:26:58   mossberg thing of being a sort of a [TS]

01:27:01   spokesperson for the everyman fright as [TS]

01:27:05   a product reviewer I do wonder whether [TS]

01:27:07   his his voice was lessened by leaving [TS]

01:27:11   the journal right and I mean that's [TS]

01:27:13   that's the hard the hard you know sort [TS]

01:27:16   of gap to close because every man it may [TS]

01:27:20   not read The Wall Street Journal you [TS]

01:27:22   know only but like they know of the Wall [TS]

01:27:24   Street Journal he ever man knows the [TS]

01:27:25   wall street journal they'll know Walt [TS]

01:27:27   Mossberg at the wall street journal and [TS]

01:27:29   certainly he had a big enough name for [TS]

01:27:32   when he leaves the wall street journal [TS]

01:27:34   to take some of that audience with him [TS]

01:27:35   but it will never be the full audience [TS]

01:27:37   of a you know a nationwide distributed [TS]

01:27:40   paper and so right I it was almost like [TS]

01:27:46   was recode more of a you know sort of [TS]

01:27:48   back to the tech enthusiast crowd versus [TS]

01:27:51   the everyman crap right like Walt [TS]

01:27:52   writing never didn't change like right [TS]

01:27:54   you know I don't think that you could [TS]

01:27:56   Pepsi challenge the difference between [TS]

01:27:57   waltz columns under the RICO tour verge [TS]

01:28:00   banner and his vered you know columns [TS]

01:28:03   under the journal banner he had the same [TS]

01:28:04   style and the same approach and the same [TS]

01:28:05   attitude if you just look at the words [TS]

01:28:08   but I think it reached fewer people i [TS]

01:28:09   think it was almost like a magnifier [TS]

01:28:11   were he built the walt mossberg brand [TS]

01:28:13   where if you put a quote up in a keynote [TS]

01:28:15   and just had a quote from walt mossberg [TS]

01:28:17   that says a lot right there but walt [TS]

01:28:20   mossberg comma the wall street journal [TS]

01:28:23   is like a it's like a multiplier because [TS]

01:28:24   now you've got both the power of the [TS]

01:28:26   wall street journal brand combined you [TS]

01:28:28   know x the power of Walt's personal [TS]

01:28:30   brand yeah and so I mean that speaks to [TS]

01:28:33   why it was probably the smart move [TS]

01:28:35   then do the sort of devoxx sale and [TS]

01:28:38   emerge basically you know with the verge [TS]

01:28:40   because it is well you know we can argue [TS]

01:28:43   about whether it's been successful yet [TS]

01:28:46   in doing so it is trying to reach a more [TS]

01:28:48   mainstream audience rather than you know [TS]

01:28:50   what I think what recode was doing [TS]

01:28:52   itself which was much more targeted [TS]

01:28:54   right and I'm you know obviously I'm a [TS]

01:28:56   I'm surprise surprise i'm a big [TS]

01:28:58   proponent of writers and independent [TS]

01:29:01   journalists going off on her own and [TS]

01:29:04   building their own brands but i'm also [TS]

01:29:07   keenly aware of the brand equity of [TS]

01:29:10   things like the journal in new york [TS]

01:29:11   times I feel like pogies in the same [TS]

01:29:13   boat where career-wise it might have [TS]

01:29:15   been exactly the right there I'm not [TS]

01:29:16   criticizing him in the least might have [TS]

01:29:18   been exactly the right thing to go to [TS]

01:29:19   yahoo and and you know it might be great [TS]

01:29:22   for his career and his family and his [TS]

01:29:24   personal finances but I can't help but [TS]

01:29:27   think that if Pogue were still at the [TS]

01:29:28   New York Times he might be in that [TS]

01:29:30   position to sort of take over as the de [TS]

01:29:32   facto like David Bogut the New York [TS]

01:29:33   Times is a much more powerful voice and [TS]

01:29:36   brand and David Pogue it at Yahoo tech [TS]

01:29:39   or whatever the umbrellas yeah it's sort [TS]

01:29:42   of interesting I know it's not a direct [TS]

01:29:44   analogy and it's in some ways probably [TS]

01:29:46   unfair but it's like you know reminds me [TS]

01:29:47   of sort of like the siskel and ebert [TS]

01:29:49   thing right when they were at sort of [TS]

01:29:53   the the pinnacle of doing film reviews [TS]

01:29:56   and and of course the getting the [TS]

01:29:58   television show and everything doing [TS]

01:30:00   that and then uh it you know both [TS]

01:30:03   unfortunately passed away and like who [TS]

01:30:07   then takes up that mantle and they're [TS]

01:30:09   really you know there's some people like [TS]

01:30:11   AO scott at the New York Times who I [TS]

01:30:12   think is great and and there's a handful [TS]

01:30:14   of other people but no one has entered [TS]

01:30:15   has that same influence a perfect [TS]

01:30:17   example that I I think there is no [TS]

01:30:19   there's no no more Siskel and Ebert and [TS]

01:30:21   even after Gene Siskel died I think [TS]

01:30:23   Ebert Ebert was enough of a voice where [TS]

01:30:26   he was still yes he was still up the [TS]

01:30:28   right but after after he died that [TS]

01:30:31   nobody really took that I can't think of [TS]

01:30:33   who I would think you know I personally [TS]

01:30:35   do like AO scott i personally i love to [TS]

01:30:39   hate read [TS]

01:30:41   uh what's his name Anthony lane in The [TS]

01:30:45   New Yorker oh right yep yep I read those [TS]

01:30:49   two yep I I get to the end of every [TS]

01:30:54   issue of The New Yorker and I I either [TS]

01:30:56   if I ever see I don't read them unless [TS]

01:30:58   I've seen the movie but as sometimes I [TS]

01:31:00   keep all fans and I kept Markham and [TS]

01:31:01   then when I do see the movie I go back [TS]

01:31:03   and I do the same exact if I can really [TS]

01:31:05   Anthony lanes and I do the exact same [TS]

01:31:08   thing for the same reason or rip it up [TS]

01:31:09   and i wanted i want to just the parolees [TS]

01:31:11   ripped up reviews in his face and say [TS]

01:31:13   you joyless yeah don't you realize that [TS]

01:31:19   sometimes a movie has just meant to be [TS]

01:31:21   fun night but he's very good at writing [TS]

01:31:24   those reviews so I still read all but I [TS]

01:31:27   can't say that like I anybody's like [TS]

01:31:29   that like Ebert i would say that yeah [TS]

01:31:31   Walt is sort of the burden cisco [TS]

01:31:33   combined baby anyway yeah anyway good [TS]

01:31:37   luck oh it's gonna be weird it's gonna [TS]

01:31:38   be weird not seeing him around I tell [TS]

01:31:40   you that yeah I'd are you going to all [TS]

01:31:43   be at the coat conference for i guess [TS]

01:31:44   that's where he's saying the the the [TS]

01:31:46   actual goodbyes so that'll be an [TS]

01:31:48   interesting i've never gone I should see [TS]

01:31:50   if i can i can wrangle in it it is I you [TS]

01:31:54   know that's it that's a promote right [TS]

01:31:55   that to be a promotion here but it is a [TS]

01:31:58   very good conference they do a very good [TS]

01:31:59   job I think the reason I never have even [TS]

01:32:01   thought about seeing if i could go is [TS]

01:32:03   that it seemed so close to WWDC and I'm [TS]

01:32:05   the air of a homebody and I don't want [TS]

01:32:07   to go away two times in shorts again and [TS]

01:32:10   it's in Southern California not not a [TS]

01:32:12   pure so right well I don't care it just [TS]

01:32:14   did do all the matters to museum [TS]

01:32:16   gazillion thousand miles away from home [TS]

01:32:19   but can't be away from that u haul desk [TS]

01:32:21   of yours so you wanna do you want to go [TS]

01:32:25   back to your iPad well pointa let me [TS]

01:32:27   finish the survey over one more sponsor [TS]

01:32:29   to think and then I'll go back to my [TS]

01:32:30   iPad point which is not perfect and it's [TS]

01:32:33   our good friends one of the best [TS]

01:32:34   sponsors fracture fracture is a photo [TS]

01:32:37   decor company here's what they do you [TS]

01:32:39   send them your personal photos you pick [TS]

01:32:41   a size and they have all sorts of sizes [TS]

01:32:42   to pick from and then they print your [TS]

01:32:44   photos directly on glass you've probably [TS]

01:32:46   heard about them before you've probably [TS]

01:32:48   heard me talk about them they've been a [TS]

01:32:49   longtime sponsor I cannot emphasize what [TS]

01:32:51   a great gift this item is now as we [TS]

01:32:54   record [TS]

01:32:55   it's the middle April mother's day is [TS]

01:32:57   coming up I don't know if there's time [TS]

01:32:59   left maybe as you hear me listen to the [TS]

01:33:01   words that are coming out of my mouth [TS]

01:33:02   you can hurry up and order some [TS]

01:33:05   fractures for mother's day if not order [TS]

01:33:09   them for Father's Day these are the [TS]

01:33:10   these are the greatest gifts of all time [TS]

01:33:12   that i have i've given them out to [TS]

01:33:15   members on both sides of our family and [TS]

01:33:17   every single time even to people who've [TS]

01:33:19   we've given them to before it's it's [TS]

01:33:21   it's you ever give a gift and and then [TS]

01:33:24   you're like wow and it was great it was [TS]

01:33:25   like well received you're like wow i [TS]

01:33:27   wish i could give them the same gift [TS]

01:33:28   again next year guess what with fracture [TS]

01:33:30   you can you can just pick new photos of [TS]

01:33:32   kids who are growing up or trips that [TS]

01:33:35   you've been on or anything that's [TS]

01:33:36   happened in the last year it's a great [TS]

01:33:39   gift and you can give it to them again [TS]

01:33:41   and again and again and it goes over [TS]

01:33:42   well he's time and they don't think that [TS]

01:33:44   the day reaction is never one of these [TS]

01:33:47   again your reaction is always oh my god [TS]

01:33:48   that's beautiful thank you so much great [TS]

01:33:51   photos printed directly on class they do [TS]

01:33:53   it right down in Gainesville Florida [TS]

01:33:54   they're made in the USA and if you've [TS]

01:33:57   never seen one in person I just can't [TS]

01:33:58   say how cool it is to have an edge to [TS]

01:34:00   edge photo no bezel it just goes right [TS]

01:34:02   from one edge to another and they comes [TS]

01:34:03   with all the stuff you need to mount it [TS]

01:34:06   on a wall and it just looks so striking [TS]

01:34:09   to have a really high quality photo that [TS]

01:34:12   looks like it's printed directly on [TS]

01:34:13   glass on the wall with no frame no bezel [TS]

01:34:16   just edge to edge glass that is pure [TS]

01:34:18   photo it's a great great gift it's a [TS]

01:34:22   great product for your own home if [TS]

01:34:23   you've got walls to fill and decorate [TS]

01:34:25   where do you go go to fracture mean calm [TS]

01:34:31   / podcast and that sounds like a fill-in [TS]

01:34:36   URL that I'm botching like it's supposed [TS]

01:34:38   to be my own code but it's not it's just [TS]

01:34:40   fracturing calm / podcasts all they do [TS]

01:34:42   is keep track of all the people who come [TS]

01:34:44   from any podcast and in the end when you [TS]

01:34:46   buy something they will ask you a walk [TS]

01:34:48   one question survey which is where'd you [TS]

01:34:50   hear a fracture from that's where you [TS]

01:34:52   can say the talk show or daring fireball [TS]

01:34:53   or whatever you want to say and they'll [TS]

01:34:55   know you came from here so my thanks to [TS]

01:34:57   that go ahead and buy them their [TS]

01:34:58   greatest gift you ever FF fracture [TS]

01:35:00   me.com fracture me calm [TS]

01:35:04   all right back to the ipad here's the [TS]

01:35:07   thing i would like to see them do my [TS]

01:35:08   biggest request would be to have a multi [TS]

01:35:11   tasking mode similar to the one they [TS]

01:35:13   have now where you arrange multiple apps [TS]

01:35:15   in full full height columns but i would [TS]

01:35:19   like to be able to make them I don't [TS]

01:35:21   know exactly I don't have I haven't [TS]

01:35:23   envisioned or invented an interface to [TS]

01:35:25   make this to figure out exactly how they [TS]

01:35:27   to do it but I would like to have it be [TS]

01:35:30   more arbitrary so if you want to have [TS]

01:35:34   three you could have three if you want [TS]

01:35:36   to drag one from the middle to the left [TS]

01:35:40   you could somehow drag the you know put [TS]

01:35:43   your finger in like the nav bar or [TS]

01:35:44   something or do a long press on it and [TS]

01:35:46   drag it over rearrange them um and I [TS]

01:35:51   would like them to do away with it [TS]

01:35:53   bothers me somehow and I can't quite put [TS]

01:35:55   my finger on but it just feels like the [TS]

01:35:57   whole thing it still makes the whole [TS]

01:35:59   field thing feel tacked on to me that [TS]

01:36:01   the left one is always main and the [TS]

01:36:04   right one is like the junior app right [TS]

01:36:08   right it doesn't feel right to me it [TS]

01:36:10   doesn't feel it's like on the Mac [TS]

01:36:12   there's never it's there's a front most [TS]

01:36:14   window and then there's all other [TS]

01:36:15   windows and they're all equal and if you [TS]

01:36:17   click on one it becomes frontmost and [TS]

01:36:19   it's every bit as legit as the other [TS]

01:36:21   ones like so if i have three apps on my [TS]

01:36:24   ipad in columns side by side when i'm in [TS]

01:36:28   the middle one I feel like it should be [TS]

01:36:30   every bit the real the main app as it [TS]

01:36:32   would be as if it were the left one and [TS]

01:36:35   secondarily I would like them to figure [TS]

01:36:38   out a way to more visually clarify which [TS]

01:36:39   one is the is currently has the focus [TS]

01:36:42   right all right um but so with that [TS]

01:36:45   three the notion of three does that work [TS]

01:36:47   ratio wise for sort of the you know how [TS]

01:36:52   big the Attic because I think that if [TS]

01:36:53   you do the size classes right it could [TS]

01:36:55   be it your apps should rearrange [TS]

01:36:57   themselves you know should use out using [TS]

01:37:00   auto layout etc to any arbitrary with [TS]

01:37:03   you shouldn't be worried about exact [TS]

01:37:05   whether it's exactly you know 767 pixels [TS]

01:37:09   or I got that wrong but you know that [TS]

01:37:11   did you shouldn't be worried about [TS]

01:37:12   hitting this short list of exact pixel [TS]

01:37:15   widths you should be in [TS]

01:37:17   like a mac app you should be able to [TS]

01:37:19   rearrange to any arbitrary width I'm not [TS]

01:37:21   saying that the that the ipad should let [TS]

01:37:24   you drag the little divider and change [TS]

01:37:26   it from 750 pixels to 748 pixels I feel [TS]

01:37:29   like the fact that the ipad isn't so [TS]

01:37:31   fussy and has these set sizes that it [TS]

01:37:34   that the apps clip2 is actually nice [TS]

01:37:37   Yeah right like it's it's always [TS]

01:37:40   bothered me a little that you that when [TS]

01:37:42   you resize a mac app window that it's [TS]

01:37:45   never really perfect it's always just [TS]

01:37:47   where you know whichever wherever you [TS]

01:37:49   left off the mouse right so you want you [TS]

01:37:52   want a combination of those things like [TS]

01:37:54   be just it being strict in sort of [TS]

01:37:57   formatting but just being more options [TS]

01:37:59   for what you write how you can format it [TS]

01:38:01   right and I don't want infinite options [TS]

01:38:02   I feel like you know like a 9.7 inch [TS]

01:38:05   iPad maybe the maximum is three maybe on [TS]

01:38:07   the dry point nine the maximum is for [TS]

01:38:09   you know I trust Apple to work that out [TS]

01:38:12   but if i want to go 5050 I want to have [TS]

01:38:16   two that are exactly 50 50 or if I want [TS]

01:38:18   to go like two-thirds one-third I could [TS]

01:38:21   do that very easily and if i want to go [TS]

01:38:23   one-third one-third one-third 43 I could [TS]

01:38:25   do that easily uh and do you do you [TS]

01:38:29   think now I assume the ipad certainly [TS]

01:38:32   the ipad pros at the point where it [TS]

01:38:34   could run three apps simultaneously [TS]

01:38:35   without an issue i think so without [TS]

01:38:38   question and especially with the way [TS]

01:38:41   that yeah i think so i think it has an [TS]

01:38:45   ax frame to do that um yeah i would love [TS]

01:38:48   to see something like that i think you [TS]

01:38:50   know one of the biggest drawbacks it's [TS]

01:38:53   not huge but it one that I have because [TS]

01:38:55   I use the I've had a ton is just there's [TS]

01:38:58   still a little cutesy with sort of [TS]

01:39:00   switching between the apps you know they [TS]

01:39:01   still have sort of these the animations [TS]

01:39:03   that go on so sort of you know flip it [TS]

01:39:05   around and whatnot and it just makes it [TS]

01:39:07   a little bit longer than it needs to be [TS]

01:39:08   right and so if you're really into like [TS]

01:39:11   using two apps yeah I know you could do [TS]

01:39:14   this side by side things and I do that [TS]

01:39:15   for certain maps it makes sense to do [TS]

01:39:17   that for but i would even just like it [TS]

01:39:19   just make it as fast as possible to [TS]

01:39:21   switch between two yeah i did they [TS]

01:39:23   tweaked that in iOS 10.3 and i think [TS]

01:39:26   it's a little bit fast yeah a shorten [TS]

01:39:28   some of the animation times [TS]

01:39:29   yeah like I'm using it right now yeah i [TS]

01:39:31   mean it is faster because it slides [TS]

01:39:33   right in now but they still you know [TS]

01:39:35   there's still cute a little cutesy with [TS]

01:39:37   the animations yeah and it the longer [TS]

01:39:39   you use a computer like the more that [TS]

01:39:41   you use an ipad as like your main [TS]

01:39:44   writing computer it the more those [TS]

01:39:46   animations great on you because the more [TS]

01:39:49   sensitive you are to knowing that you're [TS]

01:39:51   waiting for the animation and not really [TS]

01:39:53   waiting for the computer total and i [TS]

01:39:55   feel like in the classic days like in [TS]

01:39:57   the original mac like 84 85 86 when the [TS]

01:40:00   first max first came out and and you [TS]

01:40:02   know the in hindsight they were [TS]

01:40:04   desperately desperately slow and [TS]

01:40:06   desperately starved for every resource [TS]

01:40:09   you can imagine disk space and ram and [TS]

01:40:12   video ram and everything when you [TS]

01:40:15   double-click something and you got those [TS]

01:40:18   zoom rectangles that showed it coming up [TS]

01:40:20   part of it was to help you understand [TS]

01:40:22   okay you've opened this folder and its [TS]

01:40:25   opening into a window and the animation [TS]

01:40:27   would help you do that but the other [TS]

01:40:28   reason your animations were there was to [TS]

01:40:30   give you something to look at while you [TS]

01:40:32   were waiting for the computer to [TS]

01:40:33   actually do it because it wasn't going [TS]

01:40:34   to happen instantaneously anyway whereas [TS]

01:40:37   sort of solving two birds with one stone [TS]

01:40:38   which was it was giving you this visual [TS]

01:40:41   clue of telling you what was happening [TS]

01:40:43   like oh this folder is opened into a [TS]

01:40:46   window now and when i closed the window [TS]

01:40:48   it closes into the icon from which it [TS]

01:40:51   opened i see the folder is a window in [TS]

01:40:53   the window is a folder and the folder if [TS]

01:40:56   i go back to that window as a different [TS]

01:40:57   visual state when the window it rep its [TS]

01:40:59   corresponding window is open run but the [TS]

01:41:03   animations never felt like they were [TS]

01:41:04   slowing you down because you were [TS]

01:41:06   waiting for the computer anyway and as a [TS]

01:41:07   computer's got faster I feel like those [TS]

01:41:09   visual clues like I still like in some [TS]

01:41:12   ways like on the ipad or iphone when you [TS]

01:41:14   tap an icon and the app animates as it [TS]

01:41:18   opens up i still feel like it's amit i [TS]

01:41:19   don't feel like it should I don't feel [TS]

01:41:21   like the screen should flash instantly [TS]

01:41:22   but I feel like that animation should be [TS]

01:41:24   very fast right um and just playing [TS]

01:41:28   around with it now like so I think a [TS]

01:41:30   political job sort of if you use command [TS]

01:41:32   tab which you can use if you have the [TS]

01:41:34   keyboard you know hooked up to the to [TS]

01:41:36   the iPad it's it's actually very fast [TS]

01:41:38   it's pretty good um but if you just do [TS]

01:41:41   the double click of the home button it's [TS]

01:41:42   still sort of [TS]

01:41:43   a slowish zoom out and then you click on [TS]

01:41:46   the one you want and then it's a slowish [TS]

01:41:47   zoom in and then the worst of all maybe [TS]

01:41:51   and I don't know I assume very few [TS]

01:41:53   people actually use this but you know [TS]

01:41:54   you can do the forefinger sort of swype [TS]

01:41:56   thing and go from sort of app to app [TS]

01:41:58   that way and it's just like [TS]

01:42:00   unnecessarily slow so yeah I almost [TS]

01:42:04   never used that as a result of that but [TS]

01:42:06   that's currently I guess the state of [TS]

01:42:08   the art the only other thing I was going [TS]

01:42:10   to head to the ipad discussion since we [TS]

01:42:12   were talking about sort of newer ones so [TS]

01:42:14   the pro that i'm using now still feels [TS]

01:42:17   superfast the newer 9.7 pro super fast [TS]

01:42:20   but i will say the iPad Mini is a little [TS]

01:42:22   slow these days I still use it for you [TS]

01:42:27   know for certain times reading take it [TS]

01:42:30   out with me since it's nice and small [TS]

01:42:31   but that's pretty slow and I know that [TS]

01:42:33   there was some debate back and forth [TS]

01:42:35   whether or not they would actually just [TS]

01:42:37   sort of get rid of that product and I [TS]

01:42:39   hope they don't but anyway I wonder [TS]

01:42:42   because it does stick out now because [TS]

01:42:43   it's actually at an entry level it's [TS]

01:42:45   more expensive than the 930 937 the new [TS]

01:42:48   or level yeah it does have more storage [TS]

01:42:53   so it's not completely inexplicable why [TS]

01:42:56   it's more expensive but it does seem [TS]

01:42:57   weird because up until this most recent [TS]

01:42:59   introduction of the quote new 9.7 inch [TS]

01:43:02   iPad there was a correlation and cost [TS]

01:43:05   between okay the small one is the [TS]

01:43:06   cheapest the mid-sized one is mid priced [TS]

01:43:08   and the new big one right the most [TS]

01:43:10   expensive and now of a sudden there's a [TS]

01:43:12   weird situation where if your budget [TS]

01:43:14   conscious you're going to get the 9.7 [TS]

01:43:16   inch not that the you know your [TS]

01:43:18   seemingly getting more more of a device [TS]

01:43:20   than you are you know for 329 than you [TS]

01:43:22   would at 399 for the mini and it's also [TS]

01:43:26   it's been over two years right since [TS]

01:43:27   it's been updated at this point oh yeah [TS]

01:43:29   I don't know it's done though I don't [TS]

01:43:31   know i mean it's it's hard to say i [TS]

01:43:33   don't know i guess it really it comes [TS]

01:43:35   down to how many people are buying it I [TS]

01:43:37   mean it an Apple Apple knows that and [TS]

01:43:39   isn't going to tell us but I wouldn't be [TS]

01:43:41   surprised either way I wouldn't be [TS]

01:43:42   surprised if it gets a very quiet update [TS]

01:43:45   more or less like with the specs of the [TS]

01:43:47   quote new 9.7 inch iPad just in the [TS]

01:43:50   smaller size and it just right sits [TS]

01:43:52   there that may know I don't know who [TS]

01:43:53   knows if they could lower the price but [TS]

01:43:54   you know [TS]

01:43:56   um maybe and I would be surprised if it [TS]

01:43:59   just never gets updated in two years [TS]

01:44:02   from now it just goes away that the sort [TS]

01:44:05   of got killed by the plus-size iPhones [TS]

01:44:07   right and yeah especially if you know [TS]

01:44:11   when the if and when this new its [TS]

01:44:13   top-of-the-line iPhone comes out if that [TS]

01:44:15   even makes it even more of sort of a [TS]

01:44:17   glaring discrepancy between them yeah [TS]

01:44:20   and I wonder I can't help but think that [TS]

01:44:22   the the pro uses like I don't think [TS]

01:44:25   there's ever going to be an iPad Mini [TS]

01:44:26   Pro I just don't but I don't they they [TS]

01:44:28   gonna make keyboard that small I think [TS]

01:44:29   it would be would really take child I [TS]

01:44:32   did get one of those keyboards that was [TS]

01:44:34   like the logitech one that you could use [TS]

01:44:36   with it they was so ridiculously small [TS]

01:44:38   not very useful uh it is good though as [TS]

01:44:43   a like a reader you know like it because [TS]

01:44:45   it is wrong emphasized and so if you [TS]

01:44:47   really do just read but maybe they're [TS]

01:44:48   thinking is that for the people who do [TS]

01:44:50   use it they mostly just reading it [TS]

01:44:51   doesn't matter if it's long in the tooth [TS]

01:44:53   and a little slow at this point I don't [TS]

01:44:54   know yeah but I can't see I'm adding a [TS]

01:44:59   smart connector and having a keyboard [TS]

01:45:01   for it yeah did just it it's too small [TS]

01:45:07   the screen size to actually make an [TS]

01:45:08   ergonomic keyboard and you all you have [TS]

01:45:10   to do is play with logic 1 45 seconds to [TS]

01:45:12   know that I am I talked about this [TS]

01:45:15   before I still think it's interesting [TS]

01:45:17   that the Apple 18 when they had me they [TS]

01:45:20   had a briefing for the new iPad and [TS]

01:45:22   clips app and stuff and I went up to New [TS]

01:45:24   York and and saw it they they don't have [TS]

01:45:29   a special keyboard for the new 9.7 inch [TS]

01:45:31   iPad but in collaboration with logitech [TS]

01:45:33   they're supporting this logitech case / [TS]

01:45:37   keyword which is sort of it's very thick [TS]

01:45:41   it's like rugged but it's you know you [TS]

01:45:43   can totally see if you think about it in [TS]

01:45:44   the context of like a k-12 school you [TS]

01:45:47   think oh yeah I can see why they would [TS]

01:45:48   love that because it looks like [TS]

01:45:49   something that would easily survive like [TS]

01:45:51   a drop but one of the reasons it's [TS]

01:45:54   important is that you put it into this [TS]

01:45:55   case you put the ipad in this case [TS]

01:45:57   that's totally surrounded and it has a [TS]

01:45:59   lightning port inside and i don't know [TS]

01:46:02   if it has a battery or not but that [TS]

01:46:03   means that it's not a bluetooth [TS]

01:46:04   connection to the keyboard it's a [TS]

01:46:06   hardware connection to the keyboard [TS]

01:46:07   through lightning [TS]

01:46:09   and that's essential for k-12 because [TS]

01:46:12   all of the standardized tests that take [TS]

01:46:16   place on a computer it's mandated that [TS]

01:46:18   there's no wireless connectivity yes and [TS]

01:46:22   you can understand you know it's I see [TS]

01:46:24   it I get it no wireless whatsoever it's [TS]

01:46:27   like complete airplane mode otherwise [TS]

01:46:28   the software decks that you're not [TS]

01:46:30   airplane mode and and won't run and I [TS]

01:46:35   could totally see I've got my app I feel [TS]

01:46:36   like if it if a kid can cheat via [TS]

01:46:38   bluetooth that would be pretty [TS]

01:46:39   impressive um but yeah I understand [TS]

01:46:42   fraud I mentioned is the other week on [TS]

01:46:45   the show with dan frommer he said that [TS]

01:46:47   he and his friends used to I forget if [TS]

01:46:49   he said Palm Pilots I forget what they [TS]

01:46:50   had but when he was in high school I had [TS]

01:46:52   something and they were I ahran their [TS]

01:46:54   cheats to each other if they're just all [TS]

01:46:56   I wonder if they I remember like you [TS]

01:46:59   know that remember like the ti heels in [TS]

01:47:01   Texas Instrument sort of scientific [TS]

01:47:03   calculators we used to have all sorts of [TS]

01:47:05   fun things on that I think you could run [TS]

01:47:06   doom like it an emulator to run doom on [TS]

01:47:09   it and some other fun stuff yeah you're [TS]

01:47:12   too young you're you're you're too young [TS]

01:47:13   for me I didn't have anything of that [TS]

01:47:15   capability but we had calculators that [TS]

01:47:17   had they just had the the numeric [TS]

01:47:21   display but you could type letters in [TS]

01:47:23   them too but it was only on one row and [TS]

01:47:26   it had like memory functions and so our [TS]

01:47:29   cheat our way of cheating was to put the [TS]

01:47:31   brief as possible cheap notes in those [TS]

01:47:33   memories auctions and they don't bring [TS]

01:47:36   them up and instead of just being [TS]

01:47:37   numbers it would you know be some sort [TS]

01:47:39   of like 32 character oh yeah that's how [TS]

01:47:41   you know that's how you yep yeah [TS]

01:47:44   children find a way yeah no matter the [TS]

01:47:46   technology anything else that you want [TS]

01:47:49   to talk about um the only other thing [TS]

01:47:52   and we can sort of briefly talk about it [TS]

01:47:55   just because I did think it was [TS]

01:47:56   interesting you you had sort of a [TS]

01:47:58   shortest rant and linking to something [TS]

01:47:59   and it does relate directly maybe to [TS]

01:48:01   some of the ipad stuff we were just [TS]

01:48:02   talking about is the app bundle size [TS]

01:48:04   thing ah because there was also like you [TS]

01:48:08   and I had a not really back and forth I [TS]

01:48:09   responded to you and they both got a ton [TS]

01:48:11   of yours and mine both got a ton of [TS]

01:48:13   likes because i think this resonates [TS]

01:48:14   with people you were talking about in [TS]

01:48:16   that tweet the dropbox app like why is [TS]

01:48:18   it 260 megabytes or whatever and then in [TS]

01:48:21   your linked post you were talking about [TS]

01:48:22   the [TS]

01:48:22   someone wrote a breakdown of why the [TS]

01:48:25   facebook app is so big now right I so I [TS]

01:48:28   noticed this because I was without Wi-Fi [TS]

01:48:30   service for a week or so and so I was [TS]

01:48:34   living entirely off LTE and I have i [TS]

01:48:37   upgraded our verizon plan to quote [TS]

01:48:39   unquote unlimited but i've read the fine [TS]

01:48:42   print when we did it like our family [TS]

01:48:43   plan and unlimited is not really [TS]

01:48:46   unlimited there's i forget what point [TS]

01:48:48   but there's a point where they reserve [TS]

01:48:49   the right we're in your month if you go [TS]

01:48:51   over like 20 gigabytes or something they [TS]

01:48:53   reserve the right to throttle you [TS]

01:48:54   something like that it's not really [TS]

01:48:56   unlimited and so one of the things I did [TS]

01:49:00   in the week or so I was without Wi-Fi is [TS]

01:49:02   I didn't update any of my apps with the [TS]

01:49:05   update all I would just go through and [TS]

01:49:07   look for ones that I either thought were [TS]

01:49:08   essential or like small and it's amazing [TS]

01:49:11   how many apps so more or less I didn't [TS]

01:49:13   update any app over a hundred megabytes [TS]

01:49:15   and by the end of the week I had like [TS]

01:49:17   twenty six app updates it's amazing it's [TS]

01:49:19   amazing how many of them are over 200 [TS]

01:49:21   megabytes I know and I mean that's [TS]

01:49:23   without question that's creeping up [TS]

01:49:25   across all apps over time is it was sort [TS]

01:49:27   of one at maybe it was the clips app or [TS]

01:49:30   something like that it was one of [TS]

01:49:31   apple's apps i noticed the other day you [TS]

01:49:33   know i think it was clips maybe and it [TS]

01:49:36   was like 6 megabytes and i was like oh [TS]

01:49:38   my god I don't even remember the last [TS]

01:49:40   time I saw an app update that was that [TS]

01:49:41   tiny because they're all now at least 50 [TS]

01:49:45   and then many are over 100 some over 200 [TS]

01:49:47   low you were talking about and it's [TS]

01:49:49   insane and so I like that the thing you [TS]

01:49:51   linked to like sort of breaking down [TS]

01:49:52   looking unpacking the the you know [TS]

01:49:56   Facebook's bundle for that and they just [TS]

01:49:58   have so much cruft in there that's [TS]

01:50:00   that's obviously duplicate duplicate [TS]

01:50:02   let's get you happy to the same [TS]

01:50:04   framework to put get copies of the same [TS]

01:50:05   image assets and and even that even if [TS]

01:50:08   you got rid of all the duplicates it [TS]

01:50:09   that still seems like it would be big [TS]

01:50:11   but it's crazy I know I know from [TS]

01:50:14   somewhat and I know one of the things is [TS]

01:50:18   that it's these analytics packages that [TS]

01:50:20   the apps are all using and that they [TS]

01:50:22   come as binary blobs where you just they [TS]

01:50:25   give you this framework to toss into [TS]

01:50:27   your Xcode project and the whole thing [TS]

01:50:29   is in there and it's you know and then [TS]

01:50:31   somebody else is from the SEO team on [TS]

01:50:34   your company is like what we want this [TS]

01:50:36   analytics product to and then all of a [TS]

01:50:37   sudden you got two of them and they add [TS]

01:50:39   up to 100 megabytes and it's not it not [TS]

01:50:41   even your app uh right about the example [TS]

01:50:45   is an innocent either because the iworks [TS]

01:50:47   apps are humongous Oh huge and Microsoft [TS]

01:50:49   those are some of the worst that I works [TS]

01:50:51   all the the productivity stuff whenever [TS]

01:50:54   I have Microsoft Word one of them and it [TS]

01:50:56   was like it was like six hundred [TS]

01:50:58   megabytes like what in an app update [TS]

01:51:00   what are they doing it's all templates [TS]

01:51:02   and and the image assets to go with the [TS]

01:51:05   template I can't imagine what else it [TS]

01:51:06   would if you languages and I I don't [TS]

01:51:09   even know um one of the things I know [TS]

01:51:11   obviously Facebook does one of the [TS]

01:51:13   reasons for the bloat is there always [TS]

01:51:16   including various a be tests in their [TS]

01:51:19   app and so they will trigger things [TS]

01:51:22   based on country I think based on other [TS]

01:51:26   things as well to try to you know a be [TS]

01:51:28   test various functionality back in the [TS]

01:51:31   TechCrunch days you know I used to to [TS]

01:51:32   sort of know where to look and who to [TS]

01:51:36   ask about sort of unpacking some of that [TS]

01:51:38   because you could always find stuff I [TS]

01:51:39   think I found the ipad version of the [TS]

01:51:41   facebook app when it was still bundled [TS]

01:51:43   in before there was an official ipad [TS]

01:51:45   version because it was baked into the [TS]

01:51:46   you know the standard iOS version and so [TS]

01:51:50   is right there and i'm sure they're [TS]

01:51:52   they're always doing stuff like that I [TS]

01:51:54   it I feel like it's getting out of [TS]

01:51:57   control though and part of it I noticed [TS]

01:51:59   it with this I've noticed it before that [TS]

01:52:01   but I noticed it with this week where I [TS]

01:52:03   didn't have Wi-Fi but I've noticed it [TS]

01:52:05   before and it just seems preposterous to [TS]

01:52:07   me I mean like I'm not say I mean we you [TS]

01:52:10   know we were finicky and fussy but [TS]

01:52:11   vesper I'd looked it was the the last [TS]

01:52:14   version of Vesper which is still in the [TS]

01:52:16   app store is 5.5 megabytes wow yeah [TS]

01:52:20   that's impressive huge chunk of that is [TS]

01:52:21   that we embedded a custom font it's if [TS]

01:52:24   we use the system font it would have [TS]

01:52:26   been even significantly smaller uh [TS]

01:52:28   there's no reason for it and I and its [TS]

01:52:32   really wasteful and facebook after i [TS]

01:52:34   mentioned that somebody wrote to me and [TS]

01:52:36   i forgot to even mention this but it's a [TS]

01:52:37   good point is facebook updates their app [TS]

01:52:40   all the time so multiply the size of the [TS]

01:52:43   update versus how frequently they have [TS]

01:52:45   new versions and it's yeah i mean they [TS]

01:52:47   famously say in their update notes we [TS]

01:52:49   update the app every [TS]

01:52:50   yes that's all they say in the update [TS]

01:52:51   right so they do it every two weeks and [TS]

01:52:53   the same with messenger messenger is [TS]

01:52:55   almost as big I feel like in that you [TS]

01:52:57   know the facebook Messenger product and [TS]

01:52:58   then facebook has several other apps [TS]

01:53:00   that are all sort of roughly in the same [TS]

01:53:02   situation and then I that an offshoot of [TS]

01:53:07   all of that reminds me of this was [TS]

01:53:10   several weeks ago Twitter actually added [TS]

01:53:12   something in their settings to basically [TS]

01:53:15   kill clear the cache um and when I did [TS]

01:53:18   that I had like a gigabyte worth of [TS]

01:53:20   information in there like what on earth [TS]

01:53:23   they were cashing I guess images and in [TS]

01:53:26   gifts or something from like years and [TS]

01:53:29   years ago it was a gigabyte worth of [TS]

01:53:31   data what Twitter 140 characters hey so [TS]

01:53:37   in a world where all but the newest [TS]

01:53:39   devices were still sold in 16 gigabyte [TS]

01:53:41   configurations you can have a gigabyte [TS]

01:53:44   of all tweets stored there I don't know [TS]

01:53:47   but I feel like it's it's getting out of [TS]

01:53:50   control and I know that in the early [TS]

01:53:51   years of the app store it was a pretty [TS]

01:53:53   big deal i think the limit was a hundred [TS]

01:53:55   where you could rise like 100 / rights [TS]

01:53:58   it was the limit where so had to be on [TS]

01:54:00   Wi-Fi otherwise you could be on cellular [TS]

01:54:01   and it was a big deal for developers to [TS]

01:54:03   stay under 100 because i wanted users to [TS]

01:54:05   be able to update as soon as they could [TS]

01:54:07   and if they were on cellular for an [TS]

01:54:08   extended strike stretch they wanted them [TS]

01:54:10   to get the updates but it seems like [TS]

01:54:12   they've just blown past that uh but it's [TS]

01:54:15   a Syria it adds up to serious bandwidth [TS]

01:54:17   so like I checked like um I think I pay [TS]

01:54:21   fifty dollars a month for an AT&T [TS]

01:54:25   cellular service on my iPad and I'm [TS]

01:54:28   thinking about giving us up when I next [TS]

01:54:30   get an ipad but my strategy when i [TS]

01:54:33   bought it's an ipad mini and i got it I [TS]

01:54:35   don't two or three years ago probably [TS]

01:54:37   like three years ago but that's my [TS]

01:54:38   personal iPad and my strategy was I'm [TS]

01:54:41   gonna have verizon service on our the [TS]

01:54:44   whole family's iphones and i'm going to [TS]

01:54:46   get AT&T on my ipad so that if i'm ever [TS]

01:54:48   similar verizon you know I got a [TS]

01:54:50   vacation or something and there's no [TS]

01:54:52   good verizon service i'll have AT&T [TS]

01:54:53   service and i pay 50 50 bucks for seven [TS]

01:54:57   gigabytes a month and i think i think [TS]

01:54:59   amy pays like 30 bucks for four [TS]

01:55:02   gigabytes or [TS]

01:55:03   I don't know but it's very single digit [TS]

01:55:06   gigabytes of bandwidth a month and if [TS]

01:55:07   you've only got four gigabytes of [TS]

01:55:09   bandwidth in a month and app updates are [TS]

01:55:11   200 megabytes each all right five app [TS]

01:55:14   updates use up what a quarter of your [TS]

01:55:16   bandwidth you could easily chew through [TS]

01:55:19   the four gigabytes and I don't feel like [TS]

01:55:22   people know that I think people realize [TS]

01:55:23   that hey if I'm going to stream video [TS]

01:55:26   that's going to chew up my bandwidth [TS]

01:55:28   like if I'm going to watch YouTube for [TS]

01:55:30   an hour to I that's obviously i'm using [TS]

01:55:32   cellular i'm using my bandwidth if i [TS]

01:55:34   watch a major league baseball game in [TS]

01:55:36   the MLB app i know that i'm using oh you [TS]

01:55:40   know significant chunk of my bandwidth [TS]

01:55:41   like updating my apps doesn't feel like [TS]

01:55:44   that should be squandering a huge [TS]

01:55:46   percentage of my monthly bandwidth but [TS]

01:55:48   it is because people have you know a lot [TS]

01:55:50   of people have a pretty low single-digit [TS]

01:55:53   number of gigabytes a month of bandwidth [TS]

01:55:54   to use yeah I mean I the exact same [TS]

01:55:57   situation when I was last moving same [TS]

01:55:59   thing we were using sort of a tethered [TS]

01:56:01   device I think was a mifi unit that I [TS]

01:56:03   just gotten and hooked up to our AT&T [TS]

01:56:05   account and not even explicitly but I [TS]

01:56:08   just either forgot or I have too many [TS]

01:56:10   devices to even remember every single [TS]

01:56:12   one of them but I would just leave it on [TS]

01:56:14   if I left it on at night we would always [TS]

01:56:16   have to turn it off because if I left it [TS]

01:56:17   on they would auto update because you [TS]

01:56:20   know it considers it to be Wi-Fi because [TS]

01:56:21   I'm connected to a mifi unit right and [TS]

01:56:23   so it would auto update and then I'd [TS]

01:56:25   look at the bill and we would blow past [TS]

01:56:28   our when I'm like 20 gigs in like four [TS]

01:56:30   days there's almost all from a pup days [TS]

01:56:33   we weren't watching video it was like it [TS]

01:56:35   was crazy mark mark Oh Lauren has a [TS]

01:56:37   funny story about that from years ago he [TS]

01:56:39   was at WWDC and he was tethering you [TS]

01:56:42   know what in the era of relatively low [TS]

01:56:44   gigabytes per month and he was tethering [TS]

01:56:45   and he wanted to set up so he could [TS]

01:56:48   publish a podcast that they recorded any [TS]

01:56:50   left he left his it went to bed and he [TS]

01:56:52   left his macbook open and it downloaded [TS]

01:56:54   and the iTunes downloaded a new episode [TS]

01:56:57   of mad men in HD it costs him like [TS]

01:56:59   seventy dollars I got like a single [TS]

01:57:02   episode of the show you subscribe to it [TS]

01:57:04   was like a seventy dollar overage fee or [TS]

01:57:05   something that's because their mac does [TS]

01:57:08   it anyway uh no that's a good topic I [TS]

01:57:11   don't know what's going on but I feel [TS]

01:57:12   like apples got to get on top of this [TS]

01:57:13   because I don't feel like we're just [TS]

01:57:14   crazy old men [TS]

01:57:16   whoo all right there you go get off my [TS]

01:57:17   lawn with your big ass apps there's no [TS]

01:57:19   reason for these apps to be so big [TS]

01:57:20   there's absolutely no reason for it it [TS]

01:57:23   reminds me well two things Orion's me of [TS]

01:57:25   coz one it reminds me of back when you [TS]

01:57:27   know they tried to launch magazines on [TS]

01:57:30   the iPad right and like they were [TS]

01:57:31   massive because they were just pictures [TS]

01:57:33   of of pages all right they would like [TS]

01:57:36   scan in a picture of a wired magazine [TS]

01:57:39   and that would be the app and so they [TS]

01:57:40   were each each individual artists owed [TS]

01:57:44   each individual issue was like 700 to [TS]

01:57:48   800 megabytes and it was just so [TS]

01:57:50   ridiculous and so tedious to download [TS]

01:57:52   they seem to have streamline that a [TS]

01:57:54   little bit obviously there's less of an [TS]

01:57:55   emphasis on it these days but I noticed [TS]

01:57:58   they just down there downloading faster [TS]

01:58:00   so i assume that they're smaller the one [TS]

01:58:02   other thing is this actually came out a [TS]

01:58:05   couple weeks ago I think so Twitter now [TS]

01:58:08   Twitter one of the things further [TS]

01:58:10   launched recently was Twitter light li [TS]

01:58:12   te it's like the lite version of their [TS]

01:58:14   service because of this problem right [TS]

01:58:16   like in in developing countries they [TS]

01:58:19   can't possibly download you know 250 [TS]

01:58:23   megabyte apps or have your twitter app [TS]

01:58:26   store a gigabyte worth of data and so [TS]

01:58:29   they ended up launching it's just on the [TS]

01:58:31   web and it's the same thing Facebook did [TS]

01:58:34   back in the day this was several years [TS]

01:58:35   ago they launched a Facebook Lite and [TS]

01:58:37   like when they launched these things [TS]

01:58:39   like you know everyone seems to praise [TS]

01:58:41   them for it because it's like wow it's [TS]

01:58:43   so great it's so fast I remember I [TS]

01:58:45   wanted I would try to use Facebook Lite [TS]

01:58:47   as my main thing even though it's meant [TS]

01:58:48   for sort of third world countries so [TS]

01:58:52   they're all like they have these funny [TS]

01:58:53   ways around it because they know that [TS]

01:58:54   that situation is just completely [TS]

01:58:56   untenable certainly outside of the [TS]

01:58:59   United States and so they have like [TS]

01:59:00   whole teams now devoted to launching [TS]

01:59:02   lite versions of their product it's I [TS]

01:59:05   don't know what the solution is but [TS]

01:59:06   something's got to be done because it's [TS]

01:59:08   it's getting out of hand and it's only [TS]

01:59:09   getting worse I just can't help but feel [TS]

01:59:12   too that when i read that technical [TS]

01:59:14   analysis of the facebook app bundle and [TS]

01:59:17   how many duplicate resources and [TS]

01:59:19   frameworks they have like the the [TS]

01:59:21   project the xcode project to build it [TS]

01:59:23   must be like a total like mess of [TS]

01:59:25   spaghetti logic yeah there's just no way [TS]

01:59:28   that you get in that situation [TS]

01:59:30   there's no good there's no good [TS]

01:59:32   explanation behind that well and the [TS]

01:59:34   problem also I assume you know unlike [TS]

01:59:37   sort of like like you with Vesper where [TS]

01:59:39   you know you have a very small team [TS]

01:59:40   workout it you know Facebook presumably [TS]

01:59:42   has hundreds if not more people working [TS]

01:59:44   on all of these things and so you can [TS]

01:59:46   say like just you know stream lights of [TS]

01:59:48   it that's like whose job is that you [TS]

01:59:49   need like an overseer of the code right [TS]

01:59:51   I guess I mean I guess I can see how it [TS]

01:59:53   happened but it's still not a good [TS]

01:59:54   explanation where if the people who are [TS]

01:59:56   working on their a snapchat clone [TS]

01:59:56   working on their a snapchat clone [TS]

02:00:00   need they need to depend to build it [TS]

02:00:03   they need a copy of the the facebook you [TS]

02:00:06   know framework that the the everybody [TS]

02:00:09   uses this framework with our core share [TS]

02:00:11   code but the other teams need the same [TS]

02:00:13   thing but they can't depend on where [TS]

02:00:15   that is and that's all of a sudden how [TS]

02:00:17   you have three copies of the same [TS]

02:00:19   framework because right team a needed it [TS]

02:00:21   Team B needed it and you know all of a [TS]

02:00:24   sudden I also really liked his uh his [TS]

02:00:26   note about like you know finding the [TS]

02:00:27   strings that were like you will be fired [TS]

02:00:29   if you include if you turn this on [TS]

02:00:31   writers API that was about you and what [TS]

02:00:36   you know my joke back to you about the [TS]

02:00:38   dropbox one was like well yeah of course [TS]

02:00:39   because they're including the dropbox [TS]

02:00:41   stories into it but though i think [TS]

02:00:43   someone else had even funnier when I [TS]

02:00:44   thought were just like for the Facebook [TS]

02:00:46   ones where it's like well yeah of course [TS]

02:00:48   they're that big I mean they had to [TS]

02:00:49   shove all of snapchat into the atom so [TS]

02:00:51   what else you're gonna do uh look in [TS]

02:00:57   here anything I do want to talk about [TS]

02:00:58   clips a little bit or yeah we can I [TS]

02:01:02   don't I don't have to i played with it a [TS]

02:01:04   little bit I found it confusing when I [TS]

02:01:06   was first using it but i only have [TS]

02:01:08   played with it for a few minutes it [TS]

02:01:09   sounds like you know you you did to sit [TS]

02:01:11   down sort of a walkthrough with Apple [TS]

02:01:13   about it what's from me from your view [TS]

02:01:16   what's there what's their mentality I [TS]

02:01:18   know you said something like you know [TS]

02:01:19   obviously they didn't launch a social [TS]

02:01:21   network there it's just meant for other [TS]

02:01:23   networks right but um why why do it is [TS]

02:01:27   it a reason to buy the iphone like [TS]

02:01:28   what's what's the rationale I think the [TS]

02:01:31   rationale is that they see these things [TS]

02:01:33   as and I don't think we collectively [TS]

02:01:37   have a name for it yet but that it's a [TS]

02:01:39   new medium it's not quite a video it's [TS]

02:01:42   not quite an animated gift it's sort of [TS]

02:01:45   but it's it's got all these ideas where [TS]

02:01:47   you can use text to annotate you can [TS]

02:01:50   include multiple clips so it's not just [TS]

02:01:52   one shot of video you can include stills [TS]

02:01:55   it's meant to be viewed on a phone and [TS]

02:01:59   you can do it with minimal fuss and that [TS]

02:02:02   it's right up their alley to make its [TS]

02:02:04   like the social networks are how they [TS]

02:02:06   get distributed right instagram and [TS]

02:02:08   snapchat and Facebook of course but that [TS]

02:02:11   the tools to actually make [TS]

02:02:13   the best possible version of this is [TS]

02:02:16   exactly in Apple's wheelhouse of the [TS]

02:02:18   sort of things that they do well and I [TS]

02:02:20   still stand by I'm very proud of it as a [TS]

02:02:22   tweet length review that it's like [TS]

02:02:24   iMovie and keynote had a baby in a the [TS]

02:02:27   baby got the best genes from both [TS]

02:02:28   parents like I really do believe that I [TS]

02:02:31   have a couple of small complaints about [TS]

02:02:34   but one thing that they do that's very [TS]

02:02:35   smart and I think it's why the the [TS]

02:02:37   bundle size is so small is that all the [TS]

02:02:40   they have all these like titles and [TS]

02:02:42   certainly the music soundtracks they're [TS]

02:02:46   not included in the download and so when [TS]

02:02:48   you start using the app fresh if you [TS]

02:02:50   want to get the soundtracks you have to [TS]

02:02:52   download them okay that's good maybe [TS]

02:02:54   that's what like Facebook and other [TS]

02:02:56   should learn I think it's a great idea i [TS]

02:02:57   think it's it's so you can start using [TS]

02:02:59   the app with a minimal download and just [TS]

02:03:01   downright and so if you are on cellular [TS]

02:03:03   or slow network you can just download [TS]

02:03:05   the ones you really want my only beef [TS]

02:03:08   about it is i do wish there was a [TS]

02:03:09   download all button like in itunes you [TS]

02:03:12   can do that so like if you're using the [TS]

02:03:14   iTunes music library you can have a [TS]

02:03:16   music album that's in the cloud and if [TS]

02:03:19   you just want one song you can download [TS]

02:03:20   it but if you want to download the whole [TS]

02:03:22   album you can download the whole album [TS]

02:03:23   without clicking 11 times to download I [TS]

02:03:26   feel like clips should have that for the [TS]

02:03:28   title styles and for the music [TS]

02:03:30   soundtrack why do you think though that [TS]

02:03:33   they launched it when they did why not [TS]

02:03:34   you know make it a feature of iOS 11 why [TS]

02:03:36   do it as a fully standalone thing ah [TS]

02:03:39   that's a good question i guess because [TS]

02:03:42   it's ready and they feel like why not I [TS]

02:03:44   add my guess and that you know maybe [TS]

02:03:46   that they you know they see this as an [TS]

02:03:50   exploding form you know these sort of [TS]

02:03:53   stories based meme style many videos um [TS]

02:03:59   you know one of the other things too [TS]

02:04:01   that I think is central to it is that [TS]

02:04:03   being silent is part of you know you can [TS]

02:04:07   include sound you can include including [TS]

02:04:09   those music soundtracks but the fact [TS]

02:04:10   that a lot of people are going to listen [TS]

02:04:12   to them in silence right is part of the [TS]

02:04:15   idea and it's part of why they spent so [TS]

02:04:18   much effort on this annotated text that [TS]

02:04:19   gets the text as you as you you know [TS]

02:04:23   where as you dictate it [TS]

02:04:25   I feel like that they see this as it is [TS]

02:04:29   my guess is that they see this our art [TS]

02:04:31   form as exploding and that it makes [TS]

02:04:33   sense to get it out sooner rather than [TS]

02:04:34   later because iOS 11 isn't going to ship [TS]

02:04:37   until September yeah they're on schedule [TS]

02:04:39   so it's right so if they're wrong go now [TS]

02:04:42   in early April and I think it is I think [TS]

02:04:44   the app is certainly certainly in one [TS]

02:04:46   point o shape it's very good one point [TS]

02:04:48   of shape I feel like they don't want to [TS]

02:04:50   wait you know maybe maybe do less as big [TS]

02:04:53   monolithic OS updates and keep doing [TS]

02:04:55   more as individual app update do you buy [TS]

02:04:59   anything into the notion of this being [TS]

02:05:02   sort of a toe dip into augmented reality [TS]

02:05:05   because obviously we see that we see [TS]

02:05:06   both Microsoft Google and a handful of [TS]

02:05:08   others sort of launched on these things [TS]

02:05:10   Microsoft just launched one thing called [TS]

02:05:11   like sprinkles the other day which is [TS]

02:05:13   you know effectively using some of their [TS]

02:05:15   machine learning technology to sort of [TS]

02:05:18   ultra images google just launched that [TS]

02:05:19   thing where you can doodle and it will [TS]

02:05:21   look up it you know try to match it to a [TS]

02:05:22   picture so all of these guys are clearly [TS]

02:05:25   doing that as both experimentation but [TS]

02:05:27   also to sort of train data right to be [TS]

02:05:30   better at that Dubai Apple trying to do [TS]

02:05:33   that a little anything with a little for [TS]

02:05:35   augmented reality have to call the face [TS]

02:05:39   recognition as augmented reality right i [TS]

02:05:41   mean it maybe it's not augmenting it but [TS]

02:05:43   it certainly is it's it's it's reality [TS]

02:05:46   aware is that a better way to say it you [TS]

02:05:48   know where it shouldn't clip and it has [TS]

02:05:50   three of your friends in it and the [TS]

02:05:52   facial recognition is able to identify [TS]

02:05:54   them and the fact that when you go to [TS]

02:05:56   share it there the first three people [TS]

02:05:57   that suggests sharing it too it's not [TS]

02:06:00   quite augmented reality in the sense of [TS]

02:06:02   okay here's goggles that show you the [TS]

02:06:05   real world and overlay write-ins but it [TS]

02:06:08   is machine learning for sure is and it [TS]

02:06:10   is the device in your hand is making is [TS]

02:06:14   aware of the real world it is saying i [TS]

02:06:16   know right i'm shooting that's a picture [TS]

02:06:19   of your son you know i know that you [TS]

02:06:23   know it I almost feel like augmented [TS]

02:06:26   reality is is a term that's not going to [TS]

02:06:29   pan out I feel like it's more just [TS]

02:06:33   devices being reality aware [TS]

02:06:37   yeah and I think like I I don't disagree [TS]

02:06:42   with that because I do think you know [TS]

02:06:44   sort of everyone assumed augmented [TS]

02:06:47   reality would be sort of like what the [TS]

02:06:49   magic leap videos are right where it's [TS]

02:06:50   like you're looking out and you have [TS]

02:06:53   glasses on or something and then a whale [TS]

02:06:54   jumps out of the rent of street but what [TS]

02:06:57   we're seeing is like the mainstream [TS]

02:06:58   usage at least right now of course of [TS]

02:07:00   what you would call quote-unquote [TS]

02:07:02   augmented reality is more long lines of [TS]

02:07:04   snapchat filters and Pokemon go right [TS]

02:07:07   where they're just different there's [TS]

02:07:09   there's nuance to how they're they're [TS]

02:07:12   not quite not quite like that Pokemon [TS]

02:07:16   goes a little bit more like that but [TS]

02:07:18   snapchats more just what you were [TS]

02:07:20   talking about sort of you know being [TS]

02:07:21   able to to recognize a face and do [TS]

02:07:24   manipulation of that and if you think [TS]

02:07:27   about it with a little bit of battery [TS]

02:07:31   you could like why can't your iPhone be [TS]

02:07:35   as aware of where it is as as you are it [TS]

02:07:39   there's I think it's I don't think we're [TS]

02:07:42   very far from this at all and I mean [TS]

02:07:44   this in the sense of beyond GPS like GPS [TS]

02:07:47   is certainly one aspect of knowing where [TS]

02:07:49   it is but like when I'm walking down [TS]

02:07:53   Broad Street in Philadelphia like if you [TS]

02:07:57   had me blindfolded until the moment and [TS]

02:07:59   then you open my eyes it's only going to [TS]

02:08:02   take me an instant or two to realize you [TS]

02:08:04   know where I am on Broad Street and [