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0:00:24[Music]
0:00:29hello yeah hi John hi Merlin how's it
0:00:33going happy jeez November
0:00:47yeah it's fall now bald autumn also
0:00:54pumpkins pumpkins everywhere as the song
0:00:58goes gourds gourds gourds just just
0:01:03sitting here just sitting here I mean
0:01:05that's the end the end well you know I
0:01:08don't like to talk about the show on the
0:01:10show you know but with that said
0:01:12everything that's in the show is in the
0:01:13show sure are you on your new old
0:01:16computer I am I'm in my new old room in
0:01:20my new old computer on my new old
0:01:22bedroom my new old studio room you're
0:01:25kidding in my new old computer which I
0:01:28just two minutes ago set up for this and
0:01:35I've got a there's a little bit of an
0:01:38awkwardness because I've got a table and
0:01:41the table is not big enough for the
0:01:42computer table no I mean it's a table
0:01:47but it's what's why it's it's long but
0:01:50it's not wide and it's it's not like
0:01:52it's not big enough but if I put it on
0:01:53the table then I can't see pass to the
0:01:55computer it would just be me and the
0:01:57computer and so I got a little table
0:02:00like a like a little cocktail table then
0:02:05I put on the side of the big table to
0:02:07put the monitor so that I can kind of
0:02:09look down sort of like sort of like the
0:02:12master control program in Tron
0:02:15okay so your your big cpu iMac unit is
0:02:19on the secondary table it's on the side
0:02:22right and then on the on the table is
0:02:26only the wireless Logitech sunshine
0:02:30powered keyboard that you turn me on to
0:02:34but the problem is I don't like using a
0:02:36wireless mouse
0:02:38I just don't like it I didn't feel right
0:02:40to you know I just feel like it's an
0:02:42offense to nature mm-hmm we get Wireless
0:02:45Keyboard is just as God intended but a
0:02:47wireless mouse it's not really a mouse
0:02:48anymore no it's like in the analogy I
0:02:51mean part of what made it a mouse is it
0:02:53had a little tail on it thank you
0:02:54it's like a farmer's wife cut off their
0:02:56tails with a carving knife which is
0:03:00pretty brutal oh no I can't unsee that
0:03:02so I like a wired mouse but the problem
0:03:05with that is yeah I also don't want an
0:03:09offshore mouse mm like a mouse that
0:03:12looks like it was made for a PC oh oh I
0:03:17see
0:03:18this might be a little bit of Mouse
0:03:20racism but I don't want a Logitech mouse
0:03:23I don't want a mouse that's got lots of
0:03:27buttons I don't like a mouse with a
0:03:29spinner ball you would not like my
0:03:31Logitech mouse because even though it is
0:03:33a baller Mouse yeah it really it kind of
0:03:37looks like Ed Begley Jr designed a race
0:03:39car yeah I don't want to mount that
0:03:44where it looks like I'm at a nail salon
0:03:46getting you know lifelike manicure I
0:03:50don't want a mouse that looks like a koi
0:03:52pond like a gentleman's mouse a
0:03:56gentleman's mouse and I have a nice
0:03:58Apple Mouse that I like that came with
0:04:00some ancient computer it's like it's
0:04:03basically clear plastic it probably came
0:04:05with a with one of those apples that was
0:04:08like like colored and looked like a
0:04:10gumdrop at we say african-american now
0:04:13what was that I just sent you my mouse
0:04:16you can see the Ed Begley Mouse all
0:04:18right let me see this mouse here I'm
0:04:22looking at it oh my goodness yeah that's
0:04:24going on with that mouse it's got a lot
0:04:26yeah it's got a lot of affordances on it
0:04:30so I was looking online at mice and I
0:04:33saw that a mouse touted somewhere the
0:04:38inflator the MX master is it go to Mouse
0:04:40it's like what abomination is that yeah
0:04:43it's really ugly uh so anyway but here's
0:04:47the thing my little Apple Mouse
0:04:50which is which is clear like crystal and
0:04:54only has far as I can tell it only does
0:04:56one thing just it just moves well it
0:04:58does two things it moves around and it
0:05:00clicks it has one way of clicking it's
0:05:04on a USB cord that is very short it's
0:05:07it's not meant to be strung around it's
0:05:10not probably not meant to go all the way
0:05:12to a side table right and my side table
0:05:15is on the left for not for ergonomic a
0:05:19bull's your righty and I'm a righty so I
0:05:21want my mouse to stretch all the way
0:05:23over to the other side of the big table
0:05:25and so I went on a quest for a extension
0:05:30USB cable female-to-male on one end and
0:05:37bail to be me on the other and as God
0:05:39intended that's God intended and so
0:05:41that's right I God didn't make Adam and
0:05:45Adam in a met and Jeeves
0:05:49so in my house as you probably know
0:05:53there are 40 bins full of power cables
0:05:56quarter inch cables XLR cables those old
0:06:0113 USB cables you see a couple of those
0:06:05oh yeah do I have have some blackberry
0:06:09power cables I have a lot of cables from
0:06:10LG phones
0:06:12I have printer cables I have wall warts
0:06:16for every distortion box ever
0:06:18manufactured by any manufacturer I have
0:06:21Radio Shack equipment dating back to the
0:06:2450s I could like I could make crystal
0:06:31radio set out of the cables I have and
0:06:35so I'm like I will not go to the store
0:06:39or log on to Amazon for this simple
0:06:41cable I will find it in my archives my
0:06:45cable calves and I spent the equivalent
0:06:49of the man-hours that they used to build
0:06:52the Panama Canal looking for what seemed
0:06:56to me to be a simple cable that everyone
0:06:59should have seems so
0:07:01to it if there's got to be one of those
0:07:03around and there is not it never is I've
0:07:07got things from the 90s I've got five of
0:07:10something from the 90s and I've got like
0:07:11one of those in the entire edifice and I
0:07:13can never find it I think it's red I
0:07:14think it's it's a very important cable I
0:07:17have a million USB on one side firewire
0:07:20on the other side yeah I don't know when
0:07:23they made you change on remember they
0:07:24made you change from the dirty pink
0:07:26USB adapter nobody had to get all new
0:07:27cables oh yeah he had to get an extra
0:07:30set cuz you go to different places you
0:07:31remember that I remember your about
0:07:33frustrating that was it was frustrating
0:07:35yeah well so I went on Amazon and I was
0:07:39like okay fine I'm defeated like it was
0:07:41like every time we go to Amazon it's
0:07:43like fine you got me again you got me
0:07:46Bezos go ahead and you know go ahead
0:07:49take my money build another magic
0:07:51dirigible that you won't even show the
0:07:53rest of us he's laughing all the time
0:07:56he's flying around in dirigibles and
0:07:58they have cloaking devices he's not even
0:08:00sharing the fun with us
0:08:01no we can't even came and see what he's
0:08:04showing off if I were listen I've said
0:08:09if I were yeah Elon Musk enough times
0:08:11that there ought to be an acronym for it
0:08:13mmm-hmm III II M or om um which it is
0:08:24original I would have had a dirigible a
0:08:27long time ago but not just a dirigible I
0:08:29would have done a scale not a scale I
0:08:32would have done a to scale reproduction
0:08:35of the Hindenburg - the swastika decked
0:08:39it out even nicer you know just like
0:08:42decked it out really nicely would you
0:08:44have liked tea service and stuff like
0:08:46that oh for sure
0:08:47white glove service and then here's the
0:08:50thing I wouldn't use it to go places I
0:08:53would just Park it off the coast and it
0:08:55would be my apartment oh he'll be like a
0:08:59tree house without a tree yeah it would
0:09:01just sky so disgusting does Elan live in
0:09:04San Francisco or LA or somewhere like
0:09:07else I you know what I don't know the
0:09:11answer to that it's gonna drive our
0:09:12listeners nuts but I feel like he must
0:09:15well I'm sure he has more than one out
0:09:16well I'm not sure I one imagines he has
0:09:19more than one home I'll bet he's got
0:09:21something in Silicon Valley right um
0:09:25he's got something where he lives in the
0:09:26tube bunker somewhere I you know
0:09:31actually I started thinking about this
0:09:33not connected to Elon who obviously has
0:09:37enough you know he's building a super
0:09:39high-speed train to space so he's he's
0:09:41busy I thought about this when I was
0:09:43interacting with the orbit of that like
0:09:48preppy bro that started snapchat that
0:09:51rich young kid with a rich lawyer dad
0:09:55who's like just sort of a beach bum
0:09:57starts this thing now he's got a billion
0:09:59dollars in and he's and something like a
0:10:03hundred thousand pairs of glasses that
0:10:04he can't but he did a smart thing with
0:10:12his money I thought which was he bought
0:10:13up the entire town of Venice California
0:10:15now even if his company tanks at least
0:10:18he has all his real estate I mean he's
0:10:21become he became the biggest real estate
0:10:23company that true Santa Monica he owns
0:10:26so much land he bought Santa Monica
0:10:29Airport it's the only true wealth right
0:10:32so he just was you know like like rather
0:10:37than then just keep that money in sports
0:10:40football teams like Paul Allen oh Paul
0:10:43Allen also bought a bunch of real estate
0:10:45I mean real estate but so he's you know
0:10:48he's doing that thing of like young tech
0:10:50billionaire he's doing a little bit
0:10:53smarter cuz he's buying real estate but
0:10:54I'm sure he's rolling around Venice on a
0:10:56unicycle with six armed guards also on
0:10:59unicycles I was like why wouldn't that
0:11:02kid buy have a Hindenburg bill for
0:11:05himself park it right above and slightly
0:11:09off the coast of Venice and just sit
0:11:11there all day with those engines just
0:11:12more
0:11:15relaxing how relaxing it would be and
0:11:17like if you need to go somewhere maybe
0:11:19you want to get a bite it's something
0:11:20you don't have on the dirigible you want
0:11:22to go to like in and out or something
0:11:23you just slowly lower it down that's
0:11:27something to do in downtown LA and you
0:11:29would just like slow because I've always
0:11:38loved
0:11:39I've always loved forts I've over my
0:11:42life I have created so many secret
0:11:44hideouts for myself there's a time in
0:11:46junior high when I almost lived in the
0:11:48crawlspace where I'd like I had a whole
0:11:50like environment up there that I created
0:11:52you know to get your best what was your
0:11:54best secret for man that was a thing
0:11:57well no it's okay it can be revealed now
0:11:59it's been unsealed but like circa eighth
0:12:01grade when I was really at peak weirdo
0:12:04at some point we gotten you get you get
0:12:06a they you'll really call it an attic
0:12:08you call it a crawlspace and it is
0:12:09usually accessible via in Florida you
0:12:11don't have basements it's accessible in
0:12:13the garage there's usually like a little
0:12:15door you move you get a ladder you move
0:12:18this door aside and you can go up there
0:12:19and put your Christmas shit up there um
0:12:21and I'm not sure why this happened maybe
0:12:24we had a credit card with Sears we
0:12:26started getting lots of Sears things we
0:12:27had Sears come out and install those
0:12:30it's like a door you pull down a handle
0:12:34and then folding steps come down you
0:12:36know and you walk up you ascend up into
0:12:38there and I had made that has got to be
0:12:42up there for me excluding certain like
0:12:44you know point of forts in the woods and
0:12:46stuff like that that if to have that in
0:12:48house like nearby to have someplace you
0:12:50could go that was in your house but away
0:12:52from your house it was like finding a
0:12:53secret room
0:12:54if felt totally underutilized to me like
0:12:56why would you just put Christmas
0:12:57ornaments up here like you could you
0:12:59could bring choose your own adventure
0:13:00books and a 16-ounce bottle of coke up
0:13:02there it had a floor and and the wreath
0:13:05it kind of had a floor mostly had that
0:13:07pink itchy insulation the dry beans
0:13:11that's sort of one reason you would you
0:13:13but you know bears the other thing was
0:13:14when you're in eighth grade and you got
0:13:16coke and potato chips in a choose your
0:13:17own adventure book you also have
0:13:18relatively unlimited time especially if
0:13:20you don't do homework so you can really
0:13:22you can really plunge a resource I'm
0:13:24just thinking like you know if you two
0:13:26applied that
0:13:27if you took that mindset with the budget
0:13:29of a Zeppelin well sure but I'm curious
0:13:33about this space did you put in a floor
0:13:36or what what what did you stand I don't
0:13:38remember what I did because you really
0:13:40weren't supposed to be up there it
0:13:42troubled my family that I went up there
0:13:43I wasn't doing anything like dad I just
0:13:46didn't want to be around people I think
0:13:47I think I would bring up a portable
0:13:49radio and then I would have had a little
0:13:51bookshelf I put up there with my books
0:13:53and I just mostly go up there just be
0:13:56myself and listen to key 1:05 and that I
0:14:00see I want to say that I put down boards
0:14:03but I can't imagine I had the upper-body
0:14:05strength to move boards up steps I
0:14:07probably put down like a cardboard box
0:14:08or fashion in their sets chair between
0:14:13the beams of the house there was a there
0:14:16was an apartment building here in
0:14:17Seattle where a bunch of I used to work
0:14:20in a punk rock pizza parlor and a bunch
0:14:24of the pizza parlor people all moved in
0:14:28together into one sort of rickety old
0:14:31janky apartment building was it called a
0:14:35squat yeah well they were paying rent
0:14:37okay okay and it was one of those things
0:14:40where the nice bedroom
0:14:42belonged to the responsible girl who was
0:14:44kind of the assistant manager and then
0:14:46the next bedroom belonged to you know
0:14:49the girl that worked hard and then the
0:14:52next bedroom was so late lazy girl and
0:14:56her like like her incompetent friends no
0:15:00and then like there was a actual stair
0:15:07like a finished stair up to an attic
0:15:09which was unfinished and had just no
0:15:12floor it just had had like you're saying
0:15:16insulation but it was a proper stair up
0:15:18there and so a couple of the dudes at
0:15:23the pizza parlor went in there and
0:15:25showed all this ingenuity and and put
0:15:30all this effort and money into buying
0:15:32wood nailing it down and building a
0:15:36floor in this
0:15:37a building where I think the rent for
0:15:39the whole thing was probably $400 Wow
0:15:42and then all of a sudden they had they
0:15:45built this like because it was an old
0:15:48building so you could stand up up there
0:15:51it was it was a big big attic space it
0:15:54was a proper not just bedroom it was a
0:15:56it was the whole top of the building Wow
0:15:59what it was a flat and they had this
0:16:01incredible loft up there which they just
0:16:06constructed out of the air as far as I
0:16:09could tell and I think the arrangement
0:16:12was that they pay you know I don't know
0:16:14how much rent they paid because they
0:16:16invented the room but you know it was
0:16:20such a step up from my thing which was
0:16:22like hey is anybody sleeping on this
0:16:24couch tonight oh yeah
0:16:26that I just I was I was in awe of it and
0:16:29then I'm probably you know I'm glad to
0:16:31have you a little bit out of the way
0:16:33well they were glad to have them they
0:16:36none of them wanted me there after a
0:16:38very short period of time and and it was
0:16:40and that was that was that how a house
0:16:42or a set of a set of people that I would
0:16:49that was a time when I was behaving just
0:16:51shamefully and so even when I think back
0:16:55at it what should be wonderful memories
0:16:58of my like mid to late drug period
0:17:05they're awful memories and when that
0:17:08building eventually was torn down by a
0:17:10giant collection of backhoes and
0:17:13bulldozers and replaced with a just
0:17:16skeezy new condo eight story tall new
0:17:21condo I rejoiced a little because it had
0:17:25because some of my bad memories were
0:17:27buried buried in a hole
0:17:29yeah but I'm with you about the fort's
0:17:36promise we didn't have none of our
0:17:38places had good forts
0:17:43anywhere no good forts you know I feel
0:17:46like part of it is I mean obviously
0:17:48there's this one thing where like when
0:17:49you're a kid and I
0:17:50count you know being 14 is you know
0:17:52still being a kid but you know when
0:17:53you're a kid especially when you're a
0:17:55little kid you're small you can fit
0:17:57under the sink you could go into the
0:17:59credenza there's this there's a certain
0:18:01appeal to like I wonder if I could fit
0:18:03into that you know what I mean and like
0:18:05then you see these photographs of like
0:18:07apartments in Hong Kong I don't feel you
0:18:09ever seen any of those photos of the
0:18:10inside of apartments in Hong Kong but
0:18:11they're just they're crazy I mean
0:18:13they're like a little bigger than like
0:18:14an airport bathroom and a family lives
0:18:16in them and it's just completely crazy
0:18:18what people fit into these I think
0:18:19there's something very appealing to a
0:18:22certain kind of introvert weirdo
0:18:23personality about having a hidey-hole
0:18:25yes
0:18:27well all I ever wanted was a secret room
0:18:30and I freaking I was talking to but it
0:18:38was a friend who was having a house
0:18:39built oh oh I know who was it was my
0:18:42good friend Matt Dresner former bass
0:18:45player of the gits
0:18:47he had he has just rebuilt his house it
0:18:51was you know it was a did a sort of gut
0:18:54renovation of it and of course the first
0:18:57question I asked was well did you have a
0:19:00secret room installed mm-hm
0:19:02and on the face of it his denial that he
0:19:08had a secret room built is the smart
0:19:11move right if I did I couldn't tell you
0:19:14it's right you're not gonna say like
0:19:16yeah I want to know where the secret
0:19:18room is it's behind the painting where
0:19:19the wall safe is like you're not gonna
0:19:21reveal it to just any you know defeat on
0:19:23purpose yeah but I could tell in his
0:19:25reply that he he didn't have a secret
0:19:29room built because what he said was I
0:19:30talked to the contractor about a secret
0:19:33room and it ended up that the bid to
0:19:36build a secret room would have been was
0:19:38prohibitively expensive I'll bet that's
0:19:39how they get you
0:19:40I'll bet they know we got a loved one
0:19:43right yeah this I see this guy coming a
0:19:46mile off he's gonna want a hidey hole
0:19:49alright look at or a hidden staircase or
0:19:52all those all those yeah I'm like I'm
0:19:54okay so the I feel like there's a
0:19:56hierarchy of these things we've talked
0:19:57about the monk hole I think having a way
0:19:59to get out of your house and move a
0:20:01distance away even if it's not
0:20:03inhabitable
0:20:04per say it's just a smart idea yeah
0:20:06right every house every house has to
0:20:08have two means of egress like in case on
0:20:10fire right you got to have way to get
0:20:12out that just makes sense tunnel to the
0:20:13back nine to the back nine but you also
0:20:15I mean don't you need an existencial
0:20:17means if aggress what if you just need
0:20:18to get away from you what if you just
0:20:20need to be somewhere so I think you got
0:20:22it you get among coal and that could be
0:20:23a very modest Montcoal but it doesn't
0:20:25have to be like a full-on like hallway
0:20:28like a James Bond hallway although that
0:20:29would be really nice that would be nice
0:20:31then you get I think you can think about
0:20:33again this is not as spectacular but
0:20:36certainly like hidden panels like what's
0:20:38the first thing you do in D&D you go in
0:20:39a room and you search for like doors and
0:20:42panels right yeah someplace where you
0:20:43could put stuff I think a secret hallway
0:20:47feels like a really smart grown-up thing
0:20:51to put in your house a waiting made
0:20:52there that's just for you is a very very
0:20:56good idea my aunt my aunt's beach house
0:21:01the entire inside of the house and I'm
0:21:05talking about walls and ceiling was
0:21:09painted beadboard and it's a style of
0:21:13Oregon beach house that I think is it is
0:21:18an imitation of a style of Cape Cod
0:21:21beach house except because it was Oregon
0:21:24you like Oregon in the in 1890 really
0:21:29wanted to be Cape Cod in 1790 and so
0:21:33they they built like whole communities
0:21:35including the little town of gearheart
0:21:36Oregon in imitation of this you know
0:21:39like weathered
0:21:41cedar shingles and and this though but
0:21:48the thing about Cape Cod and I don't
0:21:49think a lot of people know this is that
0:21:51their beach houses of the East Coast the
0:21:54vacation homes of the East Coast often
0:21:56not even beach ones but like up in Maine
0:21:58and out on the coast a lot of them are
0:22:01uninsulated like it's just the out walls
0:22:05and then the the beams you know though
0:22:08yeah I've made a lot of vacation homes
0:22:10in pretty nice areas that are
0:22:11essentially like a hovel uh-huh yeah
0:22:13just a fucking missiles almost like a
0:22:15lean-to
0:22:17when you look at these on Cape Cod from
0:22:18outside they're three storeys tall they
0:22:20look like beautiful elegant homes it's
0:22:22just that the inside isn't done and what
0:22:26and because what they do is that the end
0:22:28of the season the last day of summer
0:22:30they lock the door and they don't come
0:22:33back until May or June and it seems
0:22:37crazy to me and from the Northwest
0:22:39perspective it's never consistently the
0:22:43weather is never consistent enough here
0:22:44that you would build a house like that
0:22:46I mean we don't have air conditioning
0:22:47anywhere but we certainly do put
0:22:50insulation in things so the oregon beach
0:22:53house has insulated walls but beadboard
0:22:56floor-to-ceiling and also the ceiling
0:22:59and in this house it was painted kind of
0:23:04dark green the beadboard was dark green
0:23:08upstairs the beadboard was all painted a
0:23:11bright and cheery cream yellow mm-hmm
0:23:13but what it meant was because the
0:23:16beadboard is just panels they had a few
0:23:22different places where if you kind of
0:23:25pressed on the wall it would go pump and
0:23:29you just wall would just open oh my god
0:23:33and that's where their liquor cabinet
0:23:36was oh my god behind a wall next to the
0:23:40fireplace if you just like leaned on it
0:23:42it would go and then the wall opened and
0:23:46it was full of booze yeah like her hole
0:23:49but the the problem was over the course
0:23:52of 50 years of living there they that
0:23:56was a popular place and so there's a
0:23:59spot where you get wear and tear you
0:24:02give 10,000 hands and so there's
0:24:08basically like a like a brat like sort
0:24:11of a gray hand shaped stain in the paint
0:24:15yeah that's bad OPSEC yeah exactly so I
0:24:20mean I think you also if you're gonna do
0:24:22it that way you also have to carry a
0:24:23hanky with you okay well it should be
0:24:25like a hankie on a string well I mean I
0:24:27think you're probably establishing one
0:24:29of the
0:24:30guidelines for this kind of thing which
0:24:32is that you know have it be commensurate
0:24:35with how secret you needed to be how
0:24:37much it's used uh-huh right so if you're
0:24:40the kind of person like we were recently
0:24:42looking at cap boxes in new litter box
0:24:45and that you can get some very obviously
0:24:48you can get self-defend a lot of money
0:24:50some people want a litter box that also
0:24:52doubles as like an end table or a
0:24:54nightstand
0:24:56well I'm not here to judge but that for
0:25:00me kind of feels like the worst of all
0:25:02worlds right but I mean you know if it's
0:25:05something where like you wouldn't want
0:25:06your refrigerator to be invisible like
0:25:08you know that's not hiding anything from
0:25:09anybody although you do see those
0:25:11kitchens where you walk in and you're
0:25:13like where's the refrigerator we have
0:25:14which of these things are doors for
0:25:16something yeah and it just they made it
0:25:18look like a cupboard that's that's a
0:25:20little cute for my liking well yeah
0:25:22because what you are you ashamed to have
0:25:24a refrigerator why would you mask it
0:25:26yeah we all have them
0:25:28yeah it's just it's just nature but like
0:25:34what I mean so in the hierarchy though
0:25:36then so you got you you move up you get
0:25:38my uncles I know I realize my uncle is a
0:25:40very ambitious project you probably want
0:25:42to undertake from the very design of the
0:25:45house but like you know a secret panel
0:25:48you get into like a hidden corridor and
0:25:50I would call it a corridor but like a
0:25:52secret room it doesn't even need to
0:25:54really doesn't need to be like a V for
0:25:56Vendetta room it doesn't need to be like
0:25:58an entire like like secret den in fact I
0:26:02think it'd be less detectable from
0:26:03people who are like going and looking at
0:26:06your plans right you don't want it to be
0:26:08too detectable there's probably some
0:26:10kind of illusion you can use with with
0:26:11false walls and depths and assumptions
0:26:13and visual illusions and tricks but I'm
0:26:16talking about like a room that's big
0:26:17enough to have like like like just I
0:26:19don't know even just like a chair in it
0:26:21but a place to lay down would be nice
0:26:22too the first thing I do when I'm in a
0:26:26space for any length of time as I walk
0:26:28around trying to make sure that the
0:26:33physical space as I perceive it for the
0:26:35outside comports with the
0:26:38the way that the space is conditioning
0:26:40it's a hundred percent I do the side I
0:26:43don't talk about it but I do the same
0:26:44thing I learned this in the Amityville
0:26:45Horror the horror you realize there
0:26:48could be a secret red room in your
0:26:49basement that you don't know about until
0:26:50it's 3:15 a.m. right right you I don't
0:26:53want to know no no no no no alarms and
0:26:56no surprises I want to know what I'm
0:26:58dealing with here and so you could do
0:26:59that you know and again to talk to
0:27:01another movie you look at the the
0:27:03watching movie well Rorschach takes out
0:27:04his tape measure he has an air SATs tape
0:27:06measure to figure out where the comedian
0:27:07is hiding his costume in photos there's
0:27:09something like that I would take a
0:27:11hidden panel in my closet I would put my
0:27:13trophies in my and my pictures of Silk
0:27:14Spectre one in there I would totally do
0:27:16that I well and also who doesn't want a
0:27:20thing where you open a wall and it's
0:27:22full of machine guns machine guns
0:27:23newspaper clippings
0:27:25maybe things you've received from the
0:27:27mayor I think I've told you before about
0:27:29the house in Sun Valley I went to with
0:27:32my friend Trevor where his uncle after
0:27:35we were smoking cigars after our steak
0:27:37dinner he said you want to see my gun
0:27:38room and we went upstairs this is back
0:27:42before gun room was a thing where you
0:27:44would go like oh no are you a murderer
0:27:47this was back when I was like gun room
0:27:50yeah you are it didn't used to be the
0:27:52last thing you'd hear no it was like
0:27:54you're a top shelf gentleman and we went
0:27:57upstairs and into his bed he had a big
0:27:59big house in in Sun Valley and we walked
0:28:02through some door in his closet and then
0:28:05through a secret door
0:28:07an entire room a full-on bedroom sized
0:28:11room full of machine guns oh man and he
0:28:15wasn't a survivalist or anything like
0:28:16that he was just a rich dude an
0:28:20eccentric a rich eccentric the trevor
0:28:23was like oh that's my that's my uncle
0:28:25with the
0:28:26you know like it rolled his eyes but
0:28:28when we can't when we went to Sun Valley
0:28:30this uncle was like yeah
0:28:32Trevor's here with his friends and he
0:28:35just like we couldn't pay for anything
0:28:36he treated us like big shots staking
0:28:39cigars and he also had a room full of
0:28:42guns and probably a room full of gold
0:28:44bars that he didn't show that's what he
0:28:45showed exactly this episode of Roderick
0:28:49on the line is brought to you in part by
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0:28:52Elton you can learn more about Mack
0:28:53Weldon right now by visiting Mack Weldon
0:28:56calm guys I'm a huge fan of Mack
0:28:58Weldon's clothes I buy an unconscionable
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0:29:03American money it's true I'm wearing
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0:29:07Mack Weldon makes stuff like shirts
0:29:09pants hoodies socks and yes they're
0:29:12internationally famous underwear these
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0:29:16they're sturdy and well-made they fit
0:29:19great they look very handsome and they
0:29:20feel amazing to wear real talk today I
0:29:24want to talk to you once again about
0:29:25Mack Walden's shirts because that's my
0:29:26favorite that's that's I have so many of
0:29:29these it's really really weird they make
0:29:30something called the Pima long sleeve
0:29:33t-shirt
0:29:34I'm not comfortable admitting how many
0:29:36of these I own but let's just say I have
0:29:37sacks and stacks of them mini mini
0:29:39they are literally my daily go-to top
0:29:42layer and unless the occasion demands it
0:29:43you'll more often than not find me in
0:29:45one of these boys everyday they are the
0:29:47best right now can you hear it
0:29:49that's it close I know this sounds like
0:29:52a weird one but I love their plain white
0:29:53t-shirts it's so hard to find a white
0:29:55t-shirt that you like they gets so gross
0:29:57they're so skinny and they get all
0:29:59balled up and untucked mm-hmm not at
0:30:02Mack Walden these are Hardy well
0:30:03tailored shirts with a nice long tail
0:30:05keeps it tucked in like you're a big boy
0:30:07I switch to these last years throughout
0:30:09all my other shirts with the disgusting
0:30:11yellow pit stains since then I've never
0:30:12looked back Mac Weldon and then of
0:30:15course yes there are their magical
0:30:16Underpants mat golden has a line of
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0:30:19naturally antimicrobial and that means
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0:30:25first pair you can keep it no refund
0:30:27your money no questions asked this is
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0:30:30Mac Weldon you guys listen please go you
0:30:33head over to Mac Weldon calm go have a
0:30:35look around look at these shirts look at
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0:30:47Roderick on the line and all the great
0:30:50shows right that's left the room that he
0:30:53showed you you know okay now let me ask
0:30:55you this is it mmm how does one put this
0:30:57where is the line in deciding what you
0:31:02offer up to people these RVs showing
0:31:04your secret
0:31:05things because it seems to me somebody
0:31:06who's offering to show you their secret
0:31:08things may not be so good at keeping a
0:31:09secret or do you think it's not like a
0:31:11false flag operation he's showing you
0:31:13the little gun room
0:31:14he's never gonna show you what the big
0:31:15gun room is my sense of that because
0:31:19this was in the 1980s my sense of that
0:31:23is that at the time conspiracy was not a
0:31:29mainstream thing like it wasn't I
0:31:32remember I'm sorry to interrupt you but
0:31:34I remember very specifically I was
0:31:35working at my parents restaurant and
0:31:37there's a guy who pulled me aside he was
0:31:39a regular customer every Saturday night
0:31:40and he asked me what I knew about the
0:31:42Trilateral Commission uh-huh and I said
0:31:45I said can I get you more water and he
0:31:47said do you understand what the
0:31:48Trilateral Commission is and I said I do
0:31:49not know what the trial omission is and
0:31:51and this is gonna surprise you but at
0:31:53length he told me what the Trilateral
0:31:55Commission is and now my first my first
0:31:58hands-on exposure to conspiracy culture
0:32:01was probably 1979 or 80 I I don't think
0:32:04I don't think it became such a thing
0:32:05until maybe even Waco like I don't think
0:32:08that normal people would look at
0:32:11something like that and go you are a
0:32:12loon yeah well because because the great
0:32:16conspiracies all were anti-semitic right
0:32:20I mean you were you had to you already
0:32:23had established yourself if you were
0:32:24talk about the trilateral commission
0:32:26there was an 80% chance that you were
0:32:28gonna start talking about the
0:32:29Rothschilds Zionism yeah and in a winky
0:32:33winky kind of way okay okay um you know
0:32:36the protocols of the Elders of Zion
0:32:38just like JFK well so that was right I
0:32:42think JFK was great probably the first I
0:32:44mean after after it let's be honest
0:32:45after the Judaism issue JFK has got to
0:32:48be one of the first truly great white
0:32:50people conspiracies right where the word
0:32:52that I mean the CIA the Cubans Lyndon
0:32:58Johnson the like the people that managed
0:33:02Wiggly pigley like everybody was
0:33:04involved it's all connected I have seen
0:33:05look at this red yarn but in the in the
0:33:0780s and into I think the first
0:33:10conspiracy a book I read that wasn't
0:33:14that wasn't like a mainstream conspiracy
0:33:16like who shot JFK
0:33:18was a book called behold the pale horse
0:33:20oh yeah you've talked about this remind
0:33:23me about this yeah behold the pale horse
0:33:24was written by one of these guys
0:33:26probably the same guy that that wouldn't
0:33:28let you finish your busboy rounds cuz he
0:33:32wanted to talk about the crisis it's all
0:33:33connected John everything's kind of put
0:33:35it but this was the first book I think
0:33:37that made that argument that it's all
0:33:40connected and it goes down throughout
0:33:43the book and it and it talks about all
0:33:45the conspiracies the Flat Earth them
0:33:48under the under the ice UFO secret
0:33:53government has have been around for a
0:33:55while the lizard people yeah it has and
0:33:58and this guy took it all and put it
0:34:02together you know as he know with a
0:34:04conspiracy it there only has to be loose
0:34:06association association it wouldn't be a
0:34:09conspiracy do you know do you know what
0:34:12kind of like self-knowledge and sanity
0:34:15it takes to take in that much disparate
0:34:17information and stay a sane person it
0:34:19takes a very strong character trying it
0:34:21does it does and and it's funny because
0:34:24yesterday I posted without comment a
0:34:28couple of grapple graphs and
0:34:31infographics and put on some
0:34:33infographics that I found as I was
0:34:35watching the internet go as I was
0:34:38watching it roll on roll on steam
0:34:40rolling on I found these infographics on
0:34:43voxcom
0:34:44and one of them they were two very
0:34:45interesting ones it was just like gun
0:34:47ownership on one axis to violent deaths
0:34:52on another axis by state and by and by
0:34:56country by nation and you know
0:34:59predictable results like the states that
0:35:02had more gun ownership had more gun
0:35:07deaths I know that's a radical I mean
0:35:10you're not even drawing a conclusion
0:35:11from it it's just a data all right and
0:35:15the countries that had more guns had
0:35:18more gun deaths in them there's not a
0:35:20graphic indicating how many good guys
0:35:21with guns bring up that save rate yeah
0:35:24and it doesn't end it and and to be
0:35:27honest it does not make a distinction
0:35:30between
0:35:31and suicide deaths and violent crime
0:35:35deaths I think it's cause mm-hmm and and
0:35:38and there was and it was hilarious
0:35:40because you know at first of course my
0:35:42Twitter followers the initial wave of
0:35:44them are like wow you know this should
0:35:48this is a wake-up call or you know it
0:35:50was like the the sort of Twitter
0:35:52responses that are validating the
0:35:56amplifying preaching to the choir once
0:35:59and then it got into that realm of
0:36:02internet professor oh boy here he comes
0:36:06and the first and and and people who are
0:36:09like I'm not a statistician but I play
0:36:12one on TV yeah and I got the first reply
0:36:16where the reply er used the word
0:36:22causation and I was like in before
0:36:27correlation does not equal causation
0:36:29like I wanted to get in before that in
0:36:32the in the in the 4chan parlance because
0:36:36law and the the first ones were these
0:36:40people that were like interesting
0:36:44correlation mm-hm
0:36:46and I was like is that feels like a dog
0:36:49whistle mm-hmm but then out it goes into
0:36:52the world
0:36:53and pretty soon it's one of those things
0:36:55that has found its way to people that
0:36:57are that are sitting on their branches
0:36:59out in the doubt in the dirt and there's
0:37:03no I made no comments on these graphs
0:37:10and within the graph fix themselves
0:37:13there's no commentary it's just simply a
0:37:16line turns out when there's more rain
0:37:20things get wet that's right it's just
0:37:22the thing and people started arguing
0:37:25they started arguing with the with the
0:37:27graphic because they started arguing
0:37:29with the implication that they drew from
0:37:32the graphic and gradually little by
0:37:34little came this wave of correlation
0:37:36does not equal causation
0:37:39and what that is is the that's another
0:37:43one of these things like ad hominem
0:37:46attack or straw man fallacy where you
0:37:51get a term and it's used enough that it
0:37:57is disseminated out to a group of people
0:37:59that don't really know how to use it
0:38:01but they but now they're employing it as
0:38:04a way of like like during the during the
0:38:07last election the number of times I read
0:38:09the word straw man mm-hm
0:38:13even referring to things that was like
0:38:14well that's what you know that's
0:38:16actually not I mean it it is a fallacy
0:38:18it's just not that one but it's one of
0:38:21those ones like like the one the classic
0:38:24hit for me is just introducing the
0:38:27notion of hypocrisy it's one of those
0:38:29it's in your quiver as one of those
0:38:31things that will just shut down the
0:38:33conversation and you may understand why
0:38:35the conversation just shut down but you
0:38:37feel you get to feel like you won
0:38:38because you said caught you said you
0:38:40said correlation yeah yeah that's right
0:38:43and so that I think came as a result of
0:38:46people trying to talk to conspiracy
0:38:49theorists and say well I mean I see
0:38:52there is some correlation here but it
0:38:56but it doesn't that doesn't mean that
0:38:59there's causation here and the
0:39:02conspiracy theorist got that and they
0:39:03were like hmm that's that shut me down
0:39:05that time I didn't know what that meant
0:39:07so now I'm gonna I'm gonna turn that
0:39:09around
0:39:10right and now all the conspiracy
0:39:11theorists are using it or or rather all
0:39:14that like nuts are using it to to argue
0:39:19with graphs all right argue with like
0:39:22not just statistic that's the price of
0:39:24freedom John it was really an
0:39:26interesting process really an
0:39:27interesting like three hours because it
0:39:30just press freedom John in order to have
0:39:34the freedom to have guns for no
0:39:35particular reason we need to understand
0:39:36some people are going to die from guns
0:39:37cuz that's the price of freedom it is
0:39:39freedom it is the price of freedom well
0:39:42I think you know the other thing you
0:39:43have to remember is people die Oh
0:39:46correlation yeah well things go to sleep
0:39:48there's no snow and then you wake up and
0:39:50everybody's been shot that's a
0:39:52correlation
0:39:52it's not the gun it's the bullet that
0:39:56kills people so what are you gonna do
0:39:57Marilyn you're gonna make bullets you
0:39:59gonna take physics and make it illegal
0:40:01you can't land on a fraction law cars
0:40:04kill people you're gonna make cars
0:40:05illegal this episode of Roderick on the
0:40:12line is brought to you in part by our X
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0:43:00half your argument is invalid so anyway
0:43:06but I I want to return just for a moment
0:43:09to your search for a cat box yeah have
0:43:14you ever I've seen a lot of cat boxes
0:43:20advertised as smell free mm-hmm smell
0:43:25proof and I've never actually seen a cat
0:43:30box in the wild that was truly smell
0:43:33proof I've seen smell proof
0:43:35self-cleaning cat boxes in the wild but
0:43:37they smell like cat boxes yeah do you
0:43:41know of in all this technology so we put
0:43:45a man on the moon right we we have
0:43:47invented the Roomba
0:43:48can't put metal in the microwave but you
0:43:51can't put metal in the microwave also a
0:43:53microwave cannot cook the center of a
0:43:55lasagna no matter how long you put it in
0:43:57there that's I have seen that just
0:43:59that's not correlation that's just a
0:44:00fact yeah so yeah
0:44:02oh you guys are you real smart you got a
0:44:04thousand Rams in your computers ya
0:44:06figure this out but how the fuck do you
0:44:08cook the inside of a lasagna you can't
0:44:10do it yeah but why has there not why has
0:44:14Elon Musk or someone or the poor the
0:44:17dude bro from snapchat yes why did he
0:44:19make those sunglasses
0:44:20stead of actually inventing a way to own
0:44:22a cat and not have your house smell like
0:44:25a cat scene why would anybody spend
0:44:29money putting in fucking granite
0:44:30counters in their kitchen when they
0:44:32could use that money to make a secret
0:44:33room whoa right oh how about I you know
0:44:37what I want everything in my kitchen to
0:44:39be invisible
0:44:40I don't want doors I don't want to see
0:44:42doors but I can't can't afford a hidden
0:44:44room here's the thing I think there's
0:44:46two ways to look at smell at least two
0:44:47ways to look at smell in the one way the
0:44:50one that people think about is ooh my
0:44:52cat makes a tinkle on a duty in a box
0:44:54right and I don't want to smell it no
0:44:57right I think that's when most people
0:44:59talk about that I think that's what they
0:45:00mean in our case it's that as much as
0:45:04one does not want to be led around by
0:45:06one's cat one's cat decides whether or
0:45:10not that box will accommodate its
0:45:12blessing oh and so the other kind of
0:45:15smell is it maybe the cat doesn't like
0:45:17the way that thing smells so although
0:45:18the pleasant knock-on effect of
0:45:20frequently changing or you know sifting
0:45:22out the cat box and nice knock-on effect
0:45:25of that as your house does not smell
0:45:26like ammonia as much right the important
0:45:28thing is you make sure you maintain a
0:45:30high level of confidence and dignity
0:45:33with your cat that your cat knows that
0:45:34the he or she or they can go into the
0:45:37box and offer up their blessing in a way
0:45:40that won't be disturbing to them has it
0:45:42ever occurred to you or does it appeal
0:45:44to you at all to be one of those people
0:45:45that teaches their cat to crouched on
0:45:47the toilet seat and go to the bathroom
0:45:48in the toilet I'm intrigued by the
0:45:50people who do and I've done a little bit
0:45:53of scholarship about cat training I
0:45:55don't I don't hold that it is impossible
0:45:58is probably difficult but I think if you
0:46:01if you're the kind of person that really
0:46:02wants to train a cat maybe you can or
0:46:04more importantly maybe you can see
0:46:06yourself you think the cat if you're the
0:46:08kind of person who wants to think that
0:46:10you've trained a cat yes I like that
0:46:13it's kind of it's a kind of feline
0:46:14suggestibility I'm not against it and
0:46:16I'm not saying it doesn't exist don't
0:46:17don't email me yeah what we were looking
0:46:21for was we have an old cat who's got a
0:46:23lot of problems and at one point why did
0:46:27we do this basically we wanted to have a
0:46:29box that she would enjoy using and that
0:46:32we ideally wouldn't have to see
0:46:34and smell so we've tried some different
0:46:35ones now we're gonna get a lot of
0:46:36letters about this because you can
0:46:38actually plunge a lot of money I have
0:46:41friends who have the very expensive
0:46:42self-cleaning boxes that look like a
0:46:44space capsule uh-huh and you can spend
0:46:47four figures on something like that and
0:46:48those worked there they're useful device
0:46:50they think they work they tell you that
0:46:52they work but I mean that's a lot like
0:46:54trading a cat yeah right that's the
0:46:56thing right they try they tell you that
0:46:58works but how much how much side
0:47:00maintenance are they doing that they're
0:47:01not acknowledged John is there any
0:47:02chance that it could just be cat
0:47:03correlation cat correlation is not
0:47:07causation it could be a cat availability
0:47:09heuristic right cat confirmation by us
0:47:12it could be a cat hominem argument well
0:47:14there it is cat confirmation bias
0:47:16because there tip so plasma trichinosis
0:47:19deposit trichinosis and also yeah you
0:47:22know I mean like you know who knows no
0:47:25the cat has you convinced and smell the
0:47:27cat is important right the cat the cats
0:47:31like you love the smell who's training
0:47:36whom maybe it's training less that's it
0:47:39that was one of my favorite or a late
0:47:41period or eat the Franklin I don't know
0:47:47why we have animals in our house some of
0:47:51the photographs of these cat boxes are
0:47:52very very funny just like the idea that
0:47:55you get your lamp up on the table and
0:47:56you see this little head sticking out oh
0:47:57yeah this is my shit box I put a light I
0:48:02visited a cat last night oh that I used
0:48:07to own Oh
0:48:09after my wonderful cat my beloved cat
0:48:13Lewis was killed I was despondent and a
0:48:19friend of mine had a cat that was the
0:48:25this friend of mine was in a love
0:48:27relationship with a guy that I know I
0:48:30know them both they're both friends of
0:48:31mine and it turned out that their and
0:48:34then they had a baby a beautiful
0:48:36beautiful baby and then it turned out
0:48:38that the guy didn't really want to like
0:48:42be tied down by a bunch of rules sound
0:48:46and so we're always trying to tie it
0:48:48down with rules I know
0:48:50rules and stuff and so their
0:48:52relationship ended and as a parting gift
0:48:56to kind of like maybe salve the wound of
0:49:01him just moving into an apartment across
0:49:04town and getting a girlfriend he got
0:49:06them a cat that they didn't want I'm
0:49:09kind of fun it was like a lovely parting
0:49:11gift it was sort of like oh you know
0:49:14brought it home it gave the cat to the
0:49:16little girl like sweetie I got you this
0:49:20wonderful gift you take care of this now
0:49:22yeah and the mom was like we didn't want
0:49:23cat yeah and if we had wanted a cat it
0:49:26wouldn't be that cat we didn't even get
0:49:27to choose the cat and he dropped the cat
0:49:30off and then was never seen again
0:49:31definitely a certain kind of genre of
0:49:33gift here you have yes yeah and and it's
0:49:36not that he was never seen again I see
0:49:38him all the time it's just that he never
0:49:39was seen again in the context of the cat
0:49:43this was one of those cats that was
0:49:46weaned too early it had it's a cat whose
0:49:51head is too small for its body oh no not
0:49:55like micro encephalitis of Oh Mike Oh
0:49:59Mike Rowe okay oh no so cephalic did it
0:50:02was it was just a you know some cats
0:50:04have proportions like anybody else and I
0:50:06don't want a body shame this cat but
0:50:08it's just like him just for you it's not
0:50:10the prettiest cat no no and what you
0:50:13picked it to bring into your home for
0:50:15ever this is not a cat I would have
0:50:17picked this is a cat that my mom would
0:50:19suggest that you drown in a river she's
0:50:21from Ohio she has she had 20 cats living
0:50:23under the corn crib but that's a
0:50:24different thing and so the cat was one
0:50:29of those cats that if you touched it the
0:50:31first time it would purr have you
0:50:33touched it the second time it would like
0:50:34rub up against your hand I mean if you
0:50:37touched it the third time it would grab
0:50:38you in its claws and bite you I'm not
0:50:40I'm not a cat psychologist but you think
0:50:41that comes from the weaning too early it
0:50:43sounds like it has trust issues in
0:50:44additionally have a tiny tiny head it
0:50:46sounds like it's got trust issues cuz Oh
0:50:48a cat is ultimately a wild animal
0:50:49it wants to be wild that's right and
0:50:51this cat did have trust issues this cat
0:50:53was purchased or
0:50:55scavenged by this guy who immediately
0:50:58handed it over to a one and a half year
0:51:00old and they start and and a woman that
0:51:04didn't want it there but I think it was
0:51:05already this way so the cat stayed with
0:51:09them for a while at this point we saw
0:51:13evidence no no he left a cat into the
0:51:16house like dropped it off and said here
0:51:17this is me now no no I mean I think he
0:51:24sees her on Wednesdays and Sundays
0:51:25what's the cat I sleep and and so this
0:51:29little girl you know these are
0:51:31progressive people these are good
0:51:32friends of mine and progressive people
0:51:33and they were one of the they were one
0:51:37of the parents's who taught their pre
0:51:41verbal child sign language oh right
0:51:44because of the you know because of the
0:51:46understanding that child can communicate
0:51:49before they can talk and so they taught
0:51:51the the baby how to sign like hungry and
0:51:55tired and stopped sending to me mad and
0:51:58like you know you're not the boss of me
0:51:59and whatever else and so the mom my pal
0:52:05came into the room one time to find the
0:52:07cat like claws in each side of the
0:52:12baby's head like like cat biting the the
0:52:16baby's pate made the baby into prey
0:52:19while the baby was signing frantically
0:52:23signing stop stop stop
0:52:25no I hate that image it's terrible and
0:52:27stuff cuz the cat didn't speak baby
0:52:29silent hitch the cat did not speak baby
0:52:31silent they should see they should've
0:52:33thought the big cat sign language well
0:52:35this is the thing they taught the baby
0:52:36sign language they didn't I guess
0:52:38communicate to the baby that she needed
0:52:40to be looking at someone while signing
0:52:43and so that they could see her she was
0:52:46talking to herself with her hands yeah
0:52:48she was talking to them to the walls and
0:52:50so the mom immediately called me and
0:52:52said we need your help and that help is
0:52:57get this cat out of here can't do an
0:52:58extraction and I said I'll be there in
0:53:0115 minutes
0:53:02and so I came over with a cat extraction
0:53:08vehicle
0:53:08that's right it was it was like a Geek
0:53:12Squad actually doesn't yeah I showed up
0:53:22with a cardboard box and a roll of
0:53:26masking sitting by the front door for
0:53:35other reasons I was like okay I'll take
0:53:38this box in this roll of masking tape
0:53:40mm-hm
0:53:40so I show up over there and here's this
0:53:42cat who now just seems demure and and
0:53:46the baby the cat doesn't know it's bad
0:53:48we put that on the cat cat spine and you
0:53:51know I am a cat whisperer that's why she
0:53:53called me
0:53:53and so I'm there and and I do the thing
0:53:56that a cat whisperer does which is not
0:53:58approach the cat you just sit and start
0:54:00making Pleasant chitchat with the with
0:54:02the other humans let the cat find you
0:54:05the cat's gonna find you cats not
0:54:09unaware that you're there it's curious
0:54:12it just means it's time so I'm talking
0:54:14to the to the grown-up and you know and
0:54:18interacting with the child and they both
0:54:19have a look of desperation in their eyes
0:54:21like like a Stockholm Syndrome situation
0:54:23like everything's fine everything's fine
0:54:25but there there's eyeballing me well
0:54:27their adrenaline let's just be pumping
0:54:28yeah when are you gonna get this this
0:54:31monster out of here right and I'm you
0:54:35know I'm like I'm like the bus driver in
0:54:40in the spill Justin Hoffman movie one
0:54:44day but no the one who walks around the
0:54:50streets shouting Attica Attica oh yeah
0:54:53Dog Day Afternoon I'm like the I'm like
0:54:55the cop bus driver that that fooled the
0:54:58audience in the big twist at the end of
0:55:00the movie when I see so spoiler alert
0:55:03you're the sleeper cell
0:55:04I'm the sleeper cell or something you're
0:55:06at least in disguise so but you know in
0:55:08your kind of training that like you need
0:55:10to come in and play it off legit the
0:55:11only way to make friends with a cat is
0:55:13to not pay attention to the cat that's
0:55:14right and so the cat eventually finds me
0:55:16and I pick the cat up and the cat is you
0:55:18know the cat gives me two three paths
0:55:20and then is
0:55:21biting me and climbing me mm-hmm but in
0:55:24a way that it thinks is fun and I'm like
0:55:26you know Kitty I've been clawed by by
0:55:29bigger cats than you and I gradually
0:55:34just maintaining friendly eye contact
0:55:36with my friend and her daughter I take
0:55:38the cat
0:55:39I put the cat in the box now you me that
0:55:43simple did you scoop it did you did you
0:55:44grab it by the by the scrub I already
0:55:46had the cat in in my lap you're doing
0:55:49like a Blofeld pet yeah and then the cat
0:55:52a Blofeld pet that's attacking you okay
0:55:54I put the cat in the box now the cat did
0:55:56not expect the box the cat never expects
0:56:01the box if you leave a box out a cat
0:56:05will go into it
0:56:07but the cat expects that box mm-hmm so
0:56:10if you go if you try and approach that
0:56:12box with the cat in it and like close up
0:56:14the box it depends on the cat yeah
0:56:16that's gonna sometimes but in this
0:56:19instance it was like hey cat why don't
0:56:22you go in this box for a little bit I
0:56:25put the cat in the box and then I tried
0:56:27to seal the box with masking tape
0:56:31loosely right but standard cardboard
0:56:36Amazon stop box with four flaps that's
0:56:38right oh boy now I don't know if you've
0:56:41ever tried to seal a cat in oh yeah but
0:56:46cat was not into it and masking tape is
0:56:48not sufficient you know you you're never
0:56:51really truly ready for a motivated cat
0:56:54that's right that's right it was the cat
0:56:58moves in ways that are very
0:57:00unpredictable the best you can do is
0:57:03like like a blanket party the best you
0:57:04can do is like basically throw it in a
0:57:06sack which I've done I have thrown a cat
0:57:07in a sack it's yeah as you need to
0:57:09really like overwhelm the cat so quickly
0:57:11that there's no part of their body
0:57:13they're like yeah like any kind of a
0:57:14pest if they can get their head out the
0:57:15whole body will come out that's exactly
0:57:17what I get for flaps down and tape it it
0:57:20was very hard and I'm God I mean I read
0:57:23a thread on Quora the other day where
0:57:27some European smartypants was like why
0:57:30are American cops so rough
0:57:32and then of course there was the
0:57:34predictable answer from a bunch of cops
0:57:35but what is correlation yeah one of the
0:57:38cops was like I'd like to propose a
0:57:40thought experiment why don't you go
0:57:42wherever you are and find the smallest
0:57:45person you know just the one that you
0:57:47think is like the smallest least
0:57:49physically imposing person you know now
0:57:51try to put handcuffs on them if they
0:57:53don't want you to yeah what we're
0:57:55neither one did you get hurt I challenge
0:57:58you go do it now find the smallest
0:58:00person I mean that's not a child the
0:58:02smallest adult person you and try and
0:58:03put handcuffs on it you say go and
0:58:05apprehend a twink we go well now that's
0:58:08not a word we can use it I use that word
0:58:10anymore I can't say it because it's not
0:58:12part okay okay let's say you've got to
0:58:17[Music]
0:58:27get this cat in the box I put enough
0:58:29masking tape over it that it is just an
0:58:32initial level and I mean I was coming
0:58:34out of the crack well at the very first
0:58:36I think I had successfully convinced the
0:58:39cat it was a game but then I picked the
0:58:42box up and I am saying
0:58:44avoir to my friends as I'm hustling to
0:58:49the door with the cat in the box and the
0:58:52cat then realizes the jig is up
0:58:54and nothing to lose he's trying to get
0:58:58out of that box
0:58:59sure and once we get outside I don't
0:59:01want to let the cat out of the box
0:59:02outside cuz it's not an outside cat so
0:59:06I'm on my way to the car and I'm trying
0:59:08to keep the cat immediately has nine
0:59:11paws right like how are how are all
0:59:14these paws getting out of this box
0:59:16there's like I can count nine paws as
0:59:19it's just thrashing and roaring well I
0:59:23get it to get it to my car and I get the
0:59:26cat in the car and then I don't care if
0:59:28it gets out of the box because the car
0:59:30is a contained environment all I have to
0:59:31do is get the cat in the box one more
0:59:33time
0:59:34I get it in the car I take it and I get
0:59:38in the car okay and she puts a bunch of
0:59:41cat accoutrement in the trunk and she's
0:59:47so grateful she's like thank you
0:59:49collects all the cats things all the
0:59:51cats luggage in the trunk can I go home
0:59:55the cat is walking around my car roaring
0:59:59at me
0:59:59at me
1:00:00I'm only grateful that it is a girl cat
1:00:03because she's not like pissing on
1:00:05everything in that kind of fury piss
1:00:07that only a cat can do like a dog does a
1:00:10defensive spray or a scared spray we're
1:00:14scared spray right I think that's the
1:00:17that's what a cat does when it feels
1:00:18threatened but a cat's an asshole right
1:00:21cuz they're all assholes it feels
1:00:23threatened just because you're like you
1:00:25put it in a car in a box covered with
1:00:27masking tape anyway I get it home and I
1:00:31get the cat in the in the house and the
1:00:34cat and I began to live together well so
1:00:46so the cat is named Lucy and I could
1:00:51never separate the cat's name from
1:00:53Lucile Van Pelt's because they basically
1:00:55have the same personality the cat is
1:00:58deceptive the cat is like you know like
1:01:00it's one of those cats where you wake up
1:01:02in the morning you stumble down the
1:01:04stairs pour yourself a cup of ambition
1:01:06yawn stretch try to you know come to
1:01:09life and this cat leaps out from behind
1:01:13leaps out from its secret room which we
1:01:15weren't even aware existed and claws the
1:01:17shit out of your ankles while you're not
1:01:18ready and now you're in a Clouseau and
1:01:21Kato type situation it's exactly right
1:01:23where the cat the cat thinks that it's
1:01:25funny to come attack you and then rage
1:01:27off into the night and so you're always
1:01:29walking around the house with your
1:01:31ankles and wrists are are always like
1:01:34covered with scratches and you have I
1:01:36mean I had cat scratch fever the entire
1:01:38time cat scratch fever it's better than
1:01:43Wango Tango it's a great riff dude that
1:01:57is a really good riff so eventually
1:02:00didn't scratched by Kate oh yeah
1:02:03actually I'm like cat
1:02:05Lucy Lucy cat she lived here for about
1:02:08six months I was like Lucy I just I find
1:02:12this relationship
1:02:13just isn't going anywhere like I'm not
1:02:17falling in love with you I mean I fell
1:02:19in love with Lois the day he showed up
1:02:23[Music]
1:02:24just not meant to be
1:02:26I'm not bonding with you sweetheart
1:02:27mm-hmm and I said you're gonna go live
1:02:32on a farm and in this case on the farm
1:02:34the farm is my mom's house oh I see it's
1:02:38it's a metaphorical metaphorical form
1:02:39that's right because my mom had 20 cats
1:02:41living under the corn crib and only two
1:02:43of them had names she knows what to do
1:02:46with a disagreeable cat
1:02:47she's not gonna train you to go to the
1:02:49bathroom in a toilet she just doesn't
1:02:50care
1:02:51mm-hmm and that like lack of care kind
1:02:56of extends in all directions so the cat
1:02:58went to live with my mom and my mom was
1:03:00fine she was fine the cat was fine I
1:03:04think the I think Lucy understood as all
1:03:07animals do that you do not jump out from
1:03:11behind a piece of furniture and claw my
1:03:13mom now boy we do it once it's not at
1:03:16one time buddy we had a cat that would
1:03:21not enter the living room I knew better
1:03:26it knew better than to go into the
1:03:28living room and we would all be in the
1:03:30living room with the doors wide open on
1:03:32both sides and the cat would would come
1:03:37to the threshold of the living room and
1:03:40sit now if you can train a cat to do
1:03:43that I will put in with you you cannot
1:03:46train a cat to do it unless you are my
1:03:49mom and she never hit this is also an
1:03:53important distinction though because
1:03:54training is man I'm gonna get a book and
1:03:57I'm gonna get an audio book and I'm
1:03:59gonna watch some YouTube videos and I'm
1:04:00gonna train my cat or you could be the
1:04:03kind of person who throws a certain
1:04:05shape where the cat just learns how to
1:04:07stay alive yeah the cat was like
1:04:10entering that room puts me at risk
1:04:12somehow I don't get my mind right yeah
1:04:15psionic risk mm-hmm because the woman
1:04:18there the woman what that is that is
1:04:20vibrating in colors that only I can see
1:04:22the woman that is making that is making
1:04:25noises at both ends of the
1:04:27sonic spectrum that no human can hear
1:04:29she comes in colors everywhere yeah she
1:04:31will send mind lightning now huh if I
1:04:35walk across the threshold so I don't
1:04:37want that sadness that's a good word for
1:04:38it yeah so and my mom uses psyonix all
1:04:41the time she uses it on like I haven't
1:04:44seen her in months and I get her
1:04:45psionics yeah well she's she walks
1:04:48around and like um you know like bad men
1:04:52on the sidewalk in the middle of the
1:04:55night we'll kind of step to the side and
1:04:56take their head their their their
1:04:58balaclavas off on their way to their
1:05:00their appointment robbing stores milady
1:05:08yeah she does it but she eventually said
1:05:16there's no there is no magic to this cat
1:05:21mm and if I'm gonna feed and clothe a
1:05:28worker I would like that worker to be
1:05:33working in the mind and a cat has a job
1:05:36yeah and this cat is not performing up
1:05:39to the standards of employment here well
1:05:44right about that time Erik Corson bass
1:05:47player of the long winters was spending
1:05:50a lot of time at the house because we
1:05:52had built a studio in our Munk hole in
1:05:55the basement of her house we had a rock
1:05:58and roll monk hole down in the basement
1:06:01no one down by your racks of glasses yep
1:06:03yeah down there we call it the Red Room
1:06:06but it was only because it had I had
1:06:08chosen for it bright red carpet but the
1:06:11room itself was painted gunmetal grey so
1:06:14it was already it was already creating
1:06:17like disturbance in you even as he
1:06:20walked through the door like it was like
1:06:22alert alert alert monk home uncle Eric
1:06:27loved it down there and he he and I were
1:06:29spending a bunch of time down there
1:06:31recording tambourine tracks on the
1:06:33unreleased forth long winter's records
1:06:38months and months anyway Eric and Lucy
1:06:43saw each other across a crowded dance
1:06:46floor and moved through the crowd toward
1:06:53one another and met in the middle and
1:06:56were never to be apart and Lucy now to
1:07:03this day
1:07:04ten years later lives happily with Eric
1:07:07Carson in his house in white center
1:07:10Seattle and Eric thinks about her and
1:07:18she thinks about him every minute of
1:07:21their lives and he and every morning he
1:07:24wakes up and stumbles to the kitchen she
1:07:29attacks him and shreds his ankles and he
1:07:32considers it the ultimate gesture of
1:07:34love and he grabs her and goes oh do do
1:07:38pooty doo doo doo dee and she bites him
1:07:41in shreds him and he goes Dora burger
1:07:44googoo gaagaa and she loves him I've
1:07:47never seen an animal love a person so
1:07:49much she wasn't doing it out of
1:07:56malfeasant aggression no that's how she
1:08:00do this is just a weaning thing she is
1:08:03so important didn't get enough time with
1:08:06her mom so I'm interacting with Lucy all
1:08:10the time because I've been over Eric's
1:08:11house oh really and you know glad to
1:08:15hear that yeah it's fun oh it's fun
1:08:17um and my impression of I mean I've had
1:08:20more interesting interpersonal
1:08:24interactions with a hard-boiled egg that
1:08:27I have Lucy do you see listen
1:08:29differently now I mean now that you see
1:08:30Lucy in an accommodating environment you
1:08:32see the cat differently well when I look
1:08:35into her eyes deep into her eyes tiny
1:08:37little head I see into infinity because
1:08:42between her eyes and infinity there
1:08:44isn't anything it just goes and goes is
1:08:48she an old soul
1:08:49I don't know why I think that is part of
1:08:55the infinity in there okay and it may be
1:08:59that I don't see it because it's smaller
1:09:00than the space that it's meant to occupy
1:09:03it's kind of like maybe it's down in the
1:09:06bottom and I can't quite see it okay but
1:09:09she and Eric understand each other
1:09:11perfectly and watching her be a good
1:09:16house cat and a good studio cat and like
1:09:18a constant companion and friend she she
1:09:22and Eric play this game you know he has
1:09:24one of those walk around houses where
1:09:26you walk into the kitchen then you can
1:09:27go down the hall and you come back into
1:09:28the living room and you know you can go
1:09:30around in a circle oh that's a nice plan
1:09:31they play a game like it like an adult
1:09:35and a toddler where she follows him
1:09:38around the ceramics the Eric see adult
1:09:40Eric's the adult in this case okay she
1:09:43or or actually depending you know it
1:09:45depends on who how old the toddler isn't
1:09:47who who's in charge of the games but
1:09:50he'll he'll go around he'll sneak around
1:09:53until she's like where'd he go and then
1:09:56she turns around and goes the other way
1:09:57and then he turns around it goes the
1:09:59other way and they'll sit in the living
1:10:02room and watch them play this game and
1:10:03they're both having the time of their
1:10:06life um and they're you know and Eric's
1:10:09like where'd he go wait oh wait and
1:10:14she's like looking around this corner
1:10:16look out and then she's like I'm gonna
1:10:17get him this time and goes this way and
1:10:19I'm like this is amazing
1:10:20I feel like this is a YouTube channel
1:10:24that like that they just haven't
1:10:27discovered yet I mean it so this is
1:10:28could be a YouTube channel that had 40
1:10:30million views yeah oh no question about
1:10:33it he be he well they they would both be
1:10:35huge stars so and of course in Japan a
1:10:39fat cat with a tiny head there's
1:10:42probably a whole word for that there's a
1:10:44word and there's a fan fan group you
1:10:47probably get a pillow like that you can
1:10:48sleep with a pillow with it that guy
1:10:50with the tiny head in a bikini a tiny
1:10:53bikini spiky blue hair but it was it it
1:10:58has taught me you know it has taught me
1:11:00to believe in happy end
1:11:03I should say so because I did not see it
1:11:06going this way John no I like this is
1:11:09like he just fired into the Sun my god I
1:11:11was prepared to take Lucy down to the
1:11:14Washington State ferry system and take
1:11:16her on a ferry and then leave the ferry
1:11:18without her and after a while the people
1:11:20that work on the ferry would after about
1:11:22three trips I think they'd be like is
1:11:24there a cat on the Thomas ferry yeah
1:11:26he's like a monkey's paw yeah and then
1:11:28they would find a home for her right
1:11:31yeah that's right a car would get on and
1:11:34the cat would jump in the car I mean
1:11:36whatever it would be it'd be it would be
1:11:37one of those great adventure movies but
1:11:40that's not what happened it turned out
1:11:41that that all Lucy needed was Erik and
1:11:44while Erik needed was Lucy I don't like
1:11:48to talk about this because it reveals
1:11:50something about myself but it reveals a
1:11:51lot of things about myself that I'm just
1:11:53it's not very on-brand for me I hope we
1:11:57heard that there's a thing you can get
1:12:00when you have a pet especially a cat you
1:12:03hear about things that you can get you
1:12:05hear about this from like news groups
1:12:07yes sure friends circles you hear about
1:12:11like oh you should get it this kind of
1:12:13scratching post you should get your cat
1:12:15this kind of a bowl so it doesn't get
1:12:18whisker fatigue you should get it this
1:12:20kind of a box you should get we heard
1:12:22about something called comfort zone
1:12:25comfort zone it looks like one of those
1:12:28modern air freshener things like a
1:12:32renews it kind of thing where you plug
1:12:34it in and basically it claims to release
1:12:37a relaxing scent that relaxes the cat we
1:12:43bought these years ago seen this coming
1:12:51asking if I'd have for the same scent I
1:13:02don't know I'm not a cat can you smell
1:13:04it no I don't just uses electric as far
1:13:07as I know it could be it could be
1:13:09glycerin in there I don't know but like
1:13:11we went through this time where the cat
1:13:13has had a very traumatic life she was
1:13:15bullied she's
1:13:17she's funny-looking she's got a lot of
1:13:18problems and then sometimes she's a
1:13:20stand in the hallway and do this up to
1:13:2713 times often at 4:00 in the morning my
1:13:31wife says to me she says well maybe we
1:13:33should get some of these cat relaxers
1:13:34and I said do you think you had a job in
1:13:37like a nuclear missile silo klaxon and
1:13:47you know you gotta buy refills for them
1:13:49and so yeah relax her refills we use it
1:13:55for a while it ran out I didn't give it
1:13:56much thought but it was determined by
1:13:59members of our household that it made a
1:14:00difference really and you know what so
1:14:04we got more of them we I now have a
1:14:06reminder every two weeks to check out
1:14:08that I actually have something I have to
1:14:09click that says check on cat relaxers
1:14:11these these things only last two weeks
1:14:14no they last seven supposedly a month
1:14:17this is the ultimate ill Marilyn oh god
1:14:20sing it sister about boxes of six I
1:14:22vitamins six packs now you have you have
1:14:25the greatest eel of all the electric cat
1:14:27relaxers I have to stop what I'm doing
1:14:29and walk around unscrew the bulb of cat
1:14:32relaxer and put a fresh one on because
1:14:34it's been determined that it helps now
1:14:35here's the funny part and this is why
1:14:36I'm so simpatico with your cat training
1:14:38you type situation which is I think they
1:14:40might work a little bit but I can't tell
1:14:42I don't know if it's a toxoplasmosis I
1:14:44don't know if it's love I don't know
1:14:46what it is but we now have Carol acts
1:14:48errs and I think it might work does the
1:14:51cat continue to klaxon in the middle of
1:14:53this is the problem now we don't know if
1:14:56it's the exception of the rule because
1:14:57sometimes she does it and it's cuz she
1:14:59wants food other times it might because
1:15:01she's lonely I think it's because she's
1:15:02deaf and blind although candidly I'm the
1:15:04only one who thinks that right she
1:15:06doesn't understand that
1:15:07don't stop stepping right where I'm
1:15:09about to step and then take take the
1:15:11next step to where I'm about to head
1:15:12stop seeing surprised
1:15:14I've never anywhere but where I walk all
1:15:17the time and if you keep walking right
1:15:19where I'm walking you're gonna have
1:15:20surprise for the last year was your
1:15:21fucking life yeah yeah so that's the
1:15:24thing I do now is do refill those do you
1:15:27think it could be whisker fatigue well
1:15:30we got the rules for that
1:15:35[Music]
1:15:36[Laughter]