The Incomparable

139: Flying Horse Angel People


00:00:03   the incomparable number 139 maybe 20-30 [TS]

00:00:14   welcome back to being comfortable [TS]

00:00:16   podcast I'm your host Jason smell and [TS]

00:00:18   tonight we're convening an interesting [TS]

00:00:21   collection of panelists to have for an [TS]

00:00:24   interesting topic i would say we're [TS]

00:00:26   going to talk about a wrinkle in time [TS]

00:00:27   the classic children's book the first [TS]

00:00:30   and what apparently as a series of five [TS]

00:00:31   books on this subject but I remember [TS]

00:00:34   none of them but the first one and only [TS]

00:00:35   read i think one of the others but the [TS]

00:00:37   news peg here the thing that makes this [TS]

00:00:39   extra relevant for today's audiences is [TS]

00:00:42   that recently hope larson created a [TS]

00:00:46   graphic novel adaptation that i also am [TS]

00:00:49   holding i have each of them in one hand [TS]

00:00:51   right now many of us remember this book [TS]

00:00:53   from our childhood in fact the i'm [TS]

00:00:55   holding in 1978 del yearling addition of [TS]

00:00:59   a wrinkle in time with the childlike [TS]

00:01:02   handwriting of my wife on the inside [TS]

00:01:04   from when she lived in hollywood [TS]

00:01:05   california short was nine years old and [TS]

00:01:08   I and then of course the new hope larson [TS]

00:01:10   so we're going to talk about this book [TS]

00:01:11   and who knows where it will take us my [TS]

00:01:13   panelists to discuss this are Lisa [TS]

00:01:16   Schmeisser you heard her laughing hi [TS]

00:01:18   Lisa [TS]

00:01:18   hi it's good to have you here it's nice [TS]

00:01:21   to be here thank you serenity Caldwell [TS]

00:01:23   is also here [TS]

00:01:23   hi hi Jason good to have you and his [TS]

00:01:28   first time not not really appearing on [TS]

00:01:30   the podcast but his first time is an [TS]

00:01:31   actual panelist it is the author of the [TS]

00:01:34   incomparable radio theatre on the air [TS]

00:01:36   and somebody who reads things apparently [TS]

00:01:38   too because he's read this it's david [TS]

00:01:40   lower high i had to be here [TS]

00:01:43   yeah it's good to have you a regular [TS]

00:01:45   time I remember this book very clearly [TS]

00:01:48   from when I was a kid I I my copy didn't [TS]

00:01:52   I think survive to my adult life I had a [TS]

00:01:55   wind in the door I think that that I [TS]

00:01:58   managed to keep for a long time and I [TS]

00:02:00   always thought it was funny that I had [TS]

00:02:02   the receipt one of the sequels and could [TS]

00:02:04   never find my original and then I [TS]

00:02:06   thought I'd found it turns out that it [TS]

00:02:07   was just the one that my my wife had [TS]

00:02:09   brought to the to the marriage it's like [TS]

00:02:12   her name's on the inside it's proof that [TS]

00:02:14   it's not mine but but and i have this [TS]

00:02:17   memory of that yellow cover with the [TS]

00:02:18   sort of scent or alien with a rainbow [TS]

00:02:22   coming out of its back and this is the [TS]

00:02:24   copy holding my hand [TS]

00:02:26   what they've got they've got the rainbow [TS]

00:02:27   wings on the the Centaur take a corn [TS]

00:02:31   thing [TS]

00:02:31   yeah and that and then in the middle of [TS]

00:02:33   the floating green it brain [TS]

00:02:34   oh I don't have that yeah that's the 1i [TS]

00:02:37   have no yes it has the floating green it [TS]

00:02:40   bring the lower third the lower third of [TS]

00:02:42   the book spoilers and then there's the [TS]

00:02:44   there's the the rainbow egg accord [TS]

00:02:47   enough dude and then minus the newbery [TS]

00:02:51   award winning classic metal legs yeah [TS]

00:02:52   yeah that's well that's we have slightly [TS]

00:02:55   different editions I'm not really happy [TS]

00:02:57   with my rainbow rainbow centaur person I [TS]

00:03:00   actually like the rainbow centaurs in [TS]

00:03:02   the hope larson adaptation a little bit [TS]

00:03:04   more because they look like wings where [TS]

00:03:05   is this is like this is like the [TS]

00:03:07   painting on the set of and the 70 yeah [TS]

00:03:08   it's like a rainbow they were stabbed in [TS]

00:03:10   the back by radio now there's a rainbow [TS]

00:03:14   stuck in their bag because you can just [TS]

00:03:15   see it's like it's like that up there be [TS]

00:03:17   a purple van and you know that would be [TS]

00:03:19   like a dreamcatcher hanging from the [TS]

00:03:20   window and this would be airbrushed onto [TS]

00:03:22   one side of it and the people driving it [TS]

00:03:24   would tumble out make it smell like [TS]

00:03:25   menthol right on [TS]

00:03:27   exactly yeah spiritual unicorn you know [TS]

00:03:32   listen you sure sure exalted more in [TS]

00:03:35   keeping with the angles of aesthetics so [TS]

00:03:38   I guess we should start by talking a [TS]

00:03:39   little bit about about what your history [TS]

00:03:41   is with this with this book if you've [TS]

00:03:44   got a fun childhood memory like i said i [TS]

00:03:46   remember reading it and the sequels and [TS]

00:03:48   keeping it around and finding it very [TS]

00:03:50   strange but I didn't have you know my my [TS]

00:03:54   memory of the book the only one that I [TS]

00:03:56   can remember it you know with is this [TS]

00:03:58   first book and it's funny my memory of [TS]

00:04:01   it is very specifically the the [TS]

00:04:03   beginning more it although a bit so [TS]

00:04:06   thinking about it I kept thinking I only [TS]

00:04:09   remember the first couple of chapters [TS]

00:04:10   and then there's this whole other plot [TS]

00:04:12   that happens after that and then reading [TS]

00:04:14   it back the part that I remember as the [TS]

00:04:16   very beginning of the book it's like [TS]

00:04:17   more than half the book because this [TS]

00:04:19   book is very strangely paste and I think [TS]

00:04:21   we'll probably get to that where things [TS]

00:04:23   that I think of this like sort of setup [TS]

00:04:24   and meeting the characters you realize [TS]

00:04:27   you're more than halfway through the [TS]

00:04:28   book and you're still just sort of [TS]

00:04:29   meeting the characters but so let's see [TS]

00:04:32   what wonder what are your histories with [TS]

00:04:34   it let's start with lisa i read the [TS]

00:04:36   trilogy for the first time in fourth [TS]

00:04:37   grade [TS]

00:04:38   made it was in our classroom library and [TS]

00:04:40   I think that brought it home over the [TS]

00:04:42   weekend and and I think by that tuesday [TS]

00:04:45   i had raided my allowance and God back [TS]

00:04:47   and bought my own trilogy and I used to [TS]

00:04:49   have a little cardboard box that went [TS]

00:04:51   around the three books so it was a gift [TS]

00:04:54   set is very excited about it um it would [TS]

00:04:57   not be an exaggeration to say that a [TS]

00:05:00   wrinkle in time blew my mind and the [TS]

00:05:04   thing that sticks with me to this day is [TS]

00:05:06   toward the end of the book when we find [TS]

00:05:11   it [TS]

00:05:11   22 mrs. whatsit talks about the sommet [TS]

00:05:16   it's like yeah it's on page 179 in my [TS]

00:05:20   book you can control condition in which [TS]

00:05:22   humanities life on this earth is [TS]

00:05:25   described as a sauna it's on it and what [TS]

00:05:27   she explains is that sounded only works [TS]

00:05:29   when does haven't been in look and I [TS]

00:05:31   think one of the reasons that sucks that [TS]

00:05:32   suckers were actually doing science in [TS]

00:05:34   class at the time to as a form of poetry [TS]

00:05:35   so so the seed was there but just the [TS]

00:05:38   idea that within very strict parameters [TS]

00:05:40   you could you have limitless potential [TS]

00:05:43   to to work up and within and to create [TS]

00:05:46   something beautiful that somehow managed [TS]

00:05:48   to jump outside those parameters while [TS]

00:05:50   honoring them being shaped by them that [TS]

00:05:52   was an idea i had never encountered um [TS]

00:05:54   because nobody in my eat because it's [TS]

00:05:56   not like you know you have these [TS]

00:05:58   conversations their parents of the [TS]

00:05:59   dinner table may explain to you now [TS]

00:06:00   honey you know if you set strict limits [TS]

00:06:02   and discipline what you can do is [TS]

00:06:03   cultivate the mental base that you like [TS]

00:06:06   your parents are going to do that when [TS]

00:06:07   you're 19 years old and this was really [TS]

00:06:08   the first time i was able to put [TS]

00:06:10   together things like if I understand and [TS]

00:06:12   learn the fundamentals of math or [TS]

00:06:14   language or music or writing once I [TS]

00:06:16   figure out what those are I can do [TS]

00:06:17   anything I want with them and the [TS]

00:06:20   metaphor of create of limitless [TS]

00:06:23   creativity within very strict structure [TS]

00:06:25   has been one that i have found to be [TS]

00:06:26   incredibly useful throughout my entire [TS]

00:06:29   life and I am I credit this is book so [TS]

00:06:32   you know i can literally feel my brain [TS]

00:06:33   the pathways my brains shifting and [TS]

00:06:35   moving around when i read that the first [TS]

00:06:36   time and it's it wasn't available that [TS]

00:06:40   said I've still never been able to [TS]

00:06:42   conceptualize a tesseract like i just [TS]

00:06:43   looked [TS]

00:06:45   it's a square square root of the sport [TS]

00:06:46   again yeah bring I think about it really [TS]

00:06:49   hard men go oh I had for a second [TS]

00:06:52   yeah David what's your original your [TS]

00:06:55   history with this will add you know my [TS]

00:06:57   mother was a writer and she was also a [TS]

00:07:00   theologian so you know I kind of came at [TS]

00:07:03   the books with you know a little bit of [TS]

00:07:06   the religion going on at the same time [TS]

00:07:07   because they're fairly religious arm and [TS]

00:07:12   so I mean they were just always in the [TS]

00:07:13   house you know as far back as I can [TS]

00:07:15   remember there was this one bookshelf [TS]

00:07:16   that was talking and CS lewis and [TS]

00:07:19   Madeleine L'Engle and Charles Williams [TS]

00:07:21   and and one day my mother just took she [TS]

00:07:24   actually took swiftly tilting planet [TS]

00:07:26   which was the third one and took it off [TS]

00:07:28   the shelf and said here try this and I [TS]

00:07:31   don't know why she gave it to me out of [TS]

00:07:33   order but huh whatever continuity and [TS]

00:07:36   spoilers over well in the end of the [TS]

00:07:39   last two that she wrote that are in that [TS]

00:07:41   set they actually they're not [TS]

00:07:43   chronologically the last two it's really [TS]

00:07:45   weird anyway so the I mean I i had read [TS]

00:07:51   them when i was thinkin second or third [TS]

00:07:53   grade and it was the same kind of thing [TS]

00:07:56   it was sort of oh my god you know the [TS]

00:07:58   the the the thought and the thought of [TS]

00:08:02   the sonnet and then that you know you [TS]

00:08:04   you could create you know once you [TS]

00:08:06   figured out the pattern you were set for [TS]

00:08:09   everything else right and then I didn't [TS]

00:08:13   read them for years and years and years [TS]

00:08:15   and so it was interesting to come back [TS]

00:08:17   to them now and sort of fill in the [TS]

00:08:20   blanks as i was going because i read the [TS]

00:08:21   graphic novel first and I and I was like [TS]

00:08:25   wheat that where did what did she leave [TS]

00:08:27   out there and then I went back to the [TS]

00:08:28   book and when oh yeah I remember that [TS]

00:08:31   was a little surreal [TS]

00:08:34   oh but but yeah it was sort of [TS]

00:08:38   interesting again how much I remembered [TS]

00:08:40   of the setup and how much I remembered [TS]

00:08:42   of the the the place setting for each [TS]

00:08:47   each environment they go to write and I [TS]

00:08:51   didn't remember the details I didn't [TS]

00:08:54   remember [TS]

00:08:55   the quotes or the the very very faint [TS]

00:08:59   theology that's in there already what [TS]

00:09:01   about you [TS]

00:09:02   this is a book i read very very early on [TS]

00:09:04   when I was younger my parents were [TS]

00:09:09   musicians they played at a at a church [TS]

00:09:12   every weekend and before the church [TS]

00:09:16   service they had to go in ridiculously [TS]

00:09:18   early 637 in the morning to get [TS]

00:09:21   everything set up and to start start [TS]

00:09:24   choir and in the meantime my mother [TS]

00:09:27   would drop me off with a friend of [TS]

00:09:30   mutual friend who also went to this [TS]

00:09:32   church and her daughter Kate was the [TS]

00:09:35   same age as me and I think at this point [TS]

00:09:36   we were probably six or seven something [TS]

00:09:39   like that maybe maybe closer to 10 i [TS]

00:09:41   mean we we basically hung out every [TS]

00:09:43   Saturday for five or six years and kate [TS]

00:09:47   and and her mother were rabid book [TS]

00:09:51   collectors and her mother worked for the [TS]

00:09:52   LA times so I every week I was basically [TS]

00:09:56   going over to Kate's and pulling off a [TS]

00:09:57   different book from her shelf and taking [TS]

00:10:01   it and hiding it in church and when I [TS]

00:10:07   when I accidentally picked up Franklin [TS]

00:10:09   time it was one of those things where [TS]

00:10:15   you start reading it you don't really [TS]

00:10:17   realize that it's a book that's going to [TS]

00:10:18   affect you as much as it does because it [TS]

00:10:21   starts off very simply but very [TS]

00:10:24   truthfully you know I'm even even at [TS]

00:10:26   nine or ten yeah you can still it still [TS]

00:10:29   resonates very deeply the feeling of you [TS]

00:10:31   know if you're a little bit stranger [TS]

00:10:34   than everybody else for your little bit [TS]

00:10:35   outside of the curve you can really [TS]

00:10:37   identify with meg you can identify with [TS]

00:10:40   Charles Wallace and there are a lot of [TS]

00:10:44   these characters that really resonate [TS]

00:10:46   even if you're not quite sure by their [TS]

00:10:49   resonate it's a it's a book for me that [TS]

00:10:51   you know what when i read it the first [TS]

00:10:53   time I just thought it was brilliant and [TS]

00:10:56   I went I went back and I stole the rest [TS]

00:10:59   of them from katie and read through [TS]

00:11:01   those up a storm and then basically [TS]

00:11:03   pestered my mother daily until I could [TS]

00:11:06   actually go to a bookstore and buy the [TS]

00:11:08   sets but you know when I look back on it [TS]

00:11:12   it's a weird it's a it's a book that I [TS]

00:11:15   value very it's a book of value very [TS]

00:11:17   highly it's a it's a quartet that I [TS]

00:11:20   value very highly and that I've read [TS]

00:11:22   these books over and over and over again [TS]

00:11:24   probably second to you know Little House [TS]

00:11:27   on the Prairie or it'sit's just it's a [TS]

00:11:30   weird sort of thing this book resonates [TS]

00:11:34   to me in images almost rather than [TS]

00:11:37   phrases although it's funny enough [TS]

00:11:40   reading through hope Larson's graphic [TS]

00:11:42   novel which is just beautiful and [TS]

00:11:44   visualizes the characters in such a [TS]

00:11:46   fantastic way without actually taking [TS]

00:11:49   away from your own imagination of what [TS]

00:11:51   it looks like and what what this is who [TS]

00:11:55   and mrs. whatsit all look like when [TS]

00:11:58   reading the graphic novel was I found it [TS]

00:12:00   funny how many of those lines I actually [TS]

00:12:01   could recall my heart even know I need [TS]

00:12:05   to know if i if i SAT and picked up the [TS]

00:12:08   book again i don't think i've read the [TS]

00:12:09   book in 10 years now but there's so much [TS]

00:12:13   of it that's laid so deep in my [TS]

00:12:15   subconscious the sonnet lines are very [TS]

00:12:19   funny to me because that that awards [TS]

00:12:23   it's so weird it's that that is a faucet [TS]

00:12:25   that's like an underlying philosophy [TS]

00:12:26   from my life and I am [TS]

00:12:28   always when i'm trying to coach or what [TS]

00:12:30   I'm trying to what I was directing [TS]

00:12:32   people i always use that sort of theorem [TS]

00:12:36   with them being like all right well we [TS]

00:12:38   have the text and we have very strict [TS]

00:12:40   structures for things like commedia [TS]

00:12:42   dell'arte and theatre mom but the whole [TS]

00:12:45   beauty of structures like that is the [TS]

00:12:47   freedom in which to play with them and [TS]

00:12:49   for some reason wrinkle in time just [TS]

00:12:50   broke that [TS]

00:12:51   yeah and I didn't even connect it until [TS]

00:12:53   you brought it up right now it's it's [TS]

00:12:55   just it's funny it's very very funny and [TS]

00:12:58   strange and magical so before we get me [TS]

00:13:02   for further along here I wanted to at [TS]

00:13:04   least give people who may not remember [TS]

00:13:07   or haven't read it and the other still [TS]

00:13:09   listening uh had an idea of what of what [TS]

00:13:11   this what this book is about and it is [TS]

00:13:13   fascinating one of the things you know [TS]

00:13:15   it's kind of far out i mean it is his [TS]

00:13:18   former book with a rainbow centre on the [TS]

00:13:20   cover you would expect it but I as a as [TS]

00:13:22   a kids book it's kind of a gentle and [TS]

00:13:24   yet also eventually really bizarre story [TS]

00:13:27   it's about a girl make Murray who is as [TS]

00:13:30   has been mentioned here she's kind of an [TS]

00:13:33   outcast she's her her arm [TS]

00:13:36   she's from a family a very very [TS]

00:13:39   intelligent family and she's intelligent [TS]

00:13:40   but doesn't get along well with other [TS]

00:13:42   people in school and she has trouble in [TS]

00:13:44   school not because she's not smart but [TS]

00:13:46   because she's actually very smart and [TS]

00:13:48   kind of bored and kind of doesn't get [TS]

00:13:50   along with people and she's got a little [TS]

00:13:52   brother a very little brother who's kind [TS]

00:13:54   of a genius a super genius and also [TS]

00:13:57   everybody thinks it's stupid because [TS]

00:13:58   he's different and then she's got twin [TS]

00:14:01   brothers who are maybe not as who are [TS]

00:14:04   bright and successful and socially adept [TS]

00:14:06   but you know not necessarily as [TS]

00:14:08   brilliant as these other two are her dad [TS]

00:14:12   is missing who he works for the [TS]

00:14:14   government and has gone off somewhere [TS]

00:14:15   and they haven't seen him in ages and [TS]

00:14:19   they they meet a through us you know she [TS]

00:14:24   also i should say she whenever somebody [TS]

00:14:27   at school insults her brother she [TS]

00:14:29   punches come which is a nice touch [TS]

00:14:32   so she gets in trouble and she goes to [TS]

00:14:33   the principal and the principal asked [TS]

00:14:35   her to conform and she basically says no [TS]

00:14:37   I'm gonna do that and then what happens [TS]

00:14:40   is that her brilliant little [TS]

00:14:42   brother Charles Wallace says that he's [TS]

00:14:44   been meeting this this this mysterious [TS]

00:14:46   woman and they go out into the to this [TS]

00:14:49   abandoned like haunted house basically [TS]

00:14:51   like stereotypical haunted house meet me [TS]

00:14:56   another kid from the school who's [TS]

00:14:58   actually popular but it turns out is [TS]

00:14:59   actually kind of faking you can get [TS]

00:15:02   along with being popular but he's [TS]

00:15:03   actually really bright and is sort of [TS]

00:15:05   faking it to get to be popular and they [TS]

00:15:08   discover that Charles Wallace has been [TS]

00:15:10   having conversations with three [TS]

00:15:12   mysterious women who are actually aliens [TS]

00:15:16   or or even more cosmic creatures than [TS]

00:15:19   that and that their father has actually [TS]

00:15:22   used a wrinkle in time or a tesseract to [TS]

00:15:26   travel across time and space to other [TS]

00:15:30   planets where he is now being held [TS]

00:15:31   captive in the in a universal battle of [TS]

00:15:34   good versus evil and that that that [TS]

00:15:36   downloads very quickly him at some point [TS]

00:15:40   in the middle of this book and then [TS]

00:15:42   they're off on an adventure that takes [TS]

00:15:44   them to i'm going to say four or five [TS]

00:15:46   other planets eventually and and they [TS]

00:15:49   meet up with they meet up with a big [TS]

00:15:52   pulsating brain monster on a planet and [TS]

00:15:54   and Charles Wallace's is possessed and [TS]

00:15:57   left behind and a rescue her dad and [TS]

00:15:59   then she has to go back and save her [TS]

00:16:01   brother and that's basically my plot [TS]

00:16:02   synopsis of wrinkle in time did I'm it [TS]

00:16:05   did I leave anything out i mean it's [TS]

00:16:06   that it's not really about the plot but [TS]

00:16:08   it's a quiz pretty crazy [TS]

00:16:10   actually when you try but when you think [TS]

00:16:11   about this the kids book and it seems to [TS]

00:16:13   be going off with like a journey of [TS]

00:16:14   self-discovery for memory and suddenly [TS]

00:16:16   they're like it's so intelligently paste [TS]

00:16:18   though because like you like you guys [TS]

00:16:20   were saying earlier it takes forever to [TS]

00:16:22   pick up speed since approximately first [TS]

00:16:24   third of the book is laying down with [TS]

00:16:26   the foundation the sense of place that [TS]

00:16:29   memory children call home right [TS]

00:16:31   the neat the the village in which [TS]

00:16:33   they're clearly leave the outcast their [TS]

00:16:35   their mother who is actually frankly [TS]

00:16:37   managing to have it all because she's [TS]

00:16:39   brilliant scientist who still cooks [TS]

00:16:40   dinner on the Bunsen burners and is a [TS]

00:16:42   single parent to for smart kids and [TS]

00:16:43   holding it together and they're all [TS]

00:16:46   these routines and rituals and she does [TS]

00:16:48   this great job of flushing out this [TS]

00:16:49   world where they need that the dog's [TS]

00:16:51   name is Fortinbras [TS]

00:16:52   and that that little detail tells you so [TS]

00:16:54   much about the about the general tenor [TS]

00:16:58   of the memory home where were clearly [TS]

00:17:00   the ethos is keep up and she can't keep [TS]

00:17:01   up take notes yeah that's it and and [TS]

00:17:06   well kids because you know just like and [TS]

00:17:08   we should just split board in the third [TS]

00:17:11   book when they find a snake the neighbor [TS]

00:17:13   columbia which is the latin which witch [TS]

00:17:15   is which the latin term for snake no [TS]

00:17:17   it's a joke is not funny it and so she [TS]

00:17:19   built up this rich idiosyncratic world [TS]

00:17:22   to give you the liverwurst and cream [TS]

00:17:23   cheese sandwiches is comfort food which [TS]

00:17:26   is a detail that is always baffled me [TS]

00:17:27   because such a disgusting but what this [TS]

00:17:31   does is if you're a kid when you when [TS]

00:17:33   you are a little kid you are still [TS]

00:17:36   intensely self-centered and intensely [TS]

00:17:38   local and so if you're a small if you're [TS]

00:17:41   if you're an elementary school who's [TS]

00:17:42   reading this what she does here is she [TS]

00:17:45   basically if she introduces the world at [TS]

00:17:48   a pace that that children can grasp [TS]

00:17:50   using a frame of reference that children [TS]

00:17:52   will immediately warm too [TS]

00:17:53   and then when she shifts gears and where [TS]

00:17:56   your hip hopping across the galaxy and [TS]

00:17:58   getting these big lessons about evil and [TS]

00:17:59   incorruptibility and so on and so forth [TS]

00:18:01   like the self-discovery a little kids [TS]

00:18:05   not going to say that the self discovery [TS]

00:18:06   goes hand-in-hand with the dramatic [TS]

00:18:07   jumps and development but that's [TS]

00:18:08   actually that that's a really uncanny [TS]

00:18:10   parallel for what happens to children [TS]

00:18:11   and adolescents and adulthood is that [TS]

00:18:14   you kind of take along in your world in [TS]

00:18:15   your world and then one day there's a [TS]

00:18:16   big leap and things look different but [TS]

00:18:18   it's still the same world and so I think [TS]

00:18:20   this book is actually perfectly [TS]

00:18:21   structured to mirror what happens to [TS]

00:18:22   people through between the ages of like [TS]

00:18:24   11 and 16 so so starting with the family [TS]

00:18:27   and you made a really good point there [TS]

00:18:29   Lee said this this book is a you know [TS]

00:18:32   setting up this family that is proudly [TS]

00:18:34   apart and different and and how and [TS]

00:18:38   they're they're very different from the [TS]

00:18:40   people who live all it almost to this [TS]

00:18:42   kind of ridiculous extreme where where [TS]

00:18:45   what is his name Cal Cal Cal his you [TS]

00:18:50   know his mother has like no teeth [TS]

00:18:52   it's Harper right right so it's like [TS]

00:18:55   these are very different people from the [TS]

00:18:56   town that their that they're living in [TS]

00:18:58   common Kings yeah it and um and that's [TS]

00:19:03   great [TS]

00:19:03   on one level because they're brilliant [TS]

00:19:05   and [TS]

00:19:05   and have you know and mom is cooking [TS]

00:19:08   stew out on a Bunsen burner while she's [TS]

00:19:10   doing chemical experiments and things [TS]

00:19:12   like that but it has a cost because it's [TS]

00:19:15   cool [TS]

00:19:15   conformity is actually what is being [TS]

00:19:17   sought here and I i thought when i was [TS]

00:19:19   reading it no one's reading at the [TS]

00:19:20   beginning I was like oh no wonder i love [TS]

00:19:22   this book this is but you know because [TS]

00:19:23   because meg is having a hard time [TS]

00:19:26   fitting in and you know gets really [TS]

00:19:29   frustrated and I just I was like okay I [TS]

00:19:32   totally identified with that but it's so [TS]

00:19:35   that that's one aspect of this is that [TS]

00:19:36   this really interesting thing about this [TS]

00:19:38   is a very interesting brilliant family [TS]

00:19:39   and they don't fit they don't end it [TS]

00:19:42   doesn't matter necessarily accept to Meg [TS]

00:19:44   and presumably eventually Charles [TS]

00:19:46   Wallace because they don't they don't [TS]

00:19:47   fit [TS]

00:19:48   unlike the twins who just kinda slide [TS]

00:19:51   along its kind of the twins peculiar [TS]

00:19:53   genius though is is just like Megas an [TS]

00:19:56   incredible mathematical genius and [TS]

00:19:57   probably the one most in touch with [TS]

00:19:59   humanity's darker emotions especially [TS]

00:20:02   compared with Charles Wallace it was a [TS]

00:20:06   really thinly veiled and walk to the [TS]

00:20:07   christ-child Dennis and Sandy have [TS]

00:20:11   managed to figure out how to pass for [TS]

00:20:13   lack of a better word early on [TS]

00:20:14   yes yeah and and they're they're very [TS]

00:20:17   skilled at passing and I think I and and [TS]

00:20:20   I've always felt like they kind of get [TS]

00:20:21   short shrift in the first three books i [TS]

00:20:22   haven't read the one in which they they [TS]

00:20:24   start as it were but I've always felt [TS]

00:20:27   they kind of get the short shrift [TS]

00:20:28   because to grow up with the family that [TS]

00:20:29   they had and then to make the deliberate [TS]

00:20:32   decision that yes we're going to be good [TS]

00:20:33   at sports [TS]

00:20:34   we're going to manage to to straddle the [TS]

00:20:38   line between these two cultures that we [TS]

00:20:39   have to negotiate with at home and not [TS]

00:20:41   home and then they go into medicine and [TS]

00:20:43   law which are you know by virtue of the [TS]

00:20:45   professions of this patina of [TS]

00:20:46   respectability it's it's intriguing to [TS]

00:20:48   that they pulled off that balancing act [TS]

00:20:49   yeah I get one this book that they are [TS]

00:20:52   they're not particularly really are on [TS]

00:20:54   screen yeah many waters is actually the [TS]

00:20:57   book i read the most after wrinkle and [TS]

00:20:59   time in terms of that the quartet on and [TS]

00:21:03   that's actually a really fascinating [TS]

00:21:04   book it's a much more religious book in [TS]

00:21:06   some ways than the other three are [TS]

00:21:08   rather overtly religious because it [TS]

00:21:10   deals with biblical times and it deals [TS]

00:21:12   with very very noticeable biblical [TS]

00:21:16   characters [TS]

00:21:18   so you you know the initial jump into [TS]

00:21:23   the story can sometimes turn people away [TS]

00:21:25   because oh it's heavy heavily [TS]

00:21:28   Christianity but their reactions and [TS]

00:21:32   they're sort of working through the [TS]

00:21:34   story of basically Noah and the flood [TS]

00:21:36   gives them a really really interesting [TS]

00:21:39   character background that you don't see [TS]

00:21:41   any other three books so I I mean I i [TS]

00:21:43   really liked that book even though I [TS]

00:21:45   know it gets kind of unfair unfair [TS]

00:21:48   shrift and it's um it was published a [TS]

00:21:50   lot later than the other three because [TS]

00:21:52   it was published in between her second [TS]

00:21:54   set of quartets that star spoiler alert [TS]

00:21:59   i usually make and Calvin's kid so I [TS]

00:22:04   haven't actually read any of those but [TS]

00:22:06   but many waters is quite good so when i [TS]

00:22:10   was reading the here's what i did i read [TS]

00:22:12   the graphic novel and then I went back [TS]

00:22:15   and read the book again and when i was [TS]

00:22:17   reading the graphic novel i was thinking [TS]

00:22:18   of myself [TS]

00:22:19   was it was it this weird and the answer [TS]

00:22:21   is yeah it was uh I found that out but [TS]

00:22:24   one of the things that's one of the [TS]

00:22:26   things that I thought was was did [TS]

00:22:28   obviously as a kid I kind of missed the [TS]

00:22:31   or didn't notice or didn't you know just [TS]

00:22:35   didn't read on me both the there's a [TS]

00:22:38   religious aspect of this that we need to [TS]

00:22:40   talk about and there's also this kind of [TS]

00:22:41   you know this individualism message [TS]

00:22:45   where I was thought oh is this kind of [TS]

00:22:46   it's going to turn out to be some sort [TS]

00:22:48   of like coated and randiyan thing that I [TS]

00:22:50   didn't realize was an awful when I was a [TS]

00:22:52   kid and now i owe my god and it's not [TS]

00:22:55   but um but it is about there's this [TS]

00:22:57   whole thing about individualism in here [TS]

00:22:59   in it and you see that the beginning and [TS]

00:23:00   at the end and it's a strong thread [TS]

00:23:01   throughout but before we get there I do [TS]

00:23:04   want to talk about religion and get your [TS]

00:23:06   guys take on it because Lisa and ran [TS]

00:23:08   both mentioned it and David mentioned [TS]

00:23:10   that his mom was a theologian so we're [TS]

00:23:12   going to get into it i'm not a [TS]

00:23:14   particularly ritual religious person all [TS]

00:23:15   the way to go to Sunday School and so I [TS]

00:23:17   had a background in that when i was a [TS]

00:23:19   kid reading this for the first time [TS]

00:23:21   what struck me about the religion in a [TS]

00:23:23   wrinkle in time is that it's mentioned [TS]

00:23:26   but it's not it's not that over its more [TS]

00:23:30   i I'd almost say it's almost more like [TS]

00:23:32   the wallpaper of religion that it's it's [TS]

00:23:34   just a thing that's part of the world [TS]

00:23:36   and not you know I hate to say it but [TS]

00:23:40   these days you get this this real [TS]

00:23:42   push-and-pull whether it's either real [TS]

00:23:43   religious propaganda or it isn't [TS]

00:23:46   it's either about science or it's about [TS]

00:23:49   religion it's about heart or it's about [TS]

00:23:51   religion but everything is pitted [TS]

00:23:53   against each other that literally you [TS]

00:23:54   can't have something if something's got [TS]

00:23:56   religion in it generally the feeling [TS]

00:23:59   today is that that's that's because its [TS]

00:24:01   propaganda and in many cases that's [TS]

00:24:02   because it is propaganda and this struck [TS]

00:24:05   me as being something that like there's [TS]

00:24:07   that great scene where they they ask [TS]

00:24:08   about this they say there's a struggle [TS]

00:24:10   between you know darkness and light [TS]

00:24:11   which is just as easily star wars as it [TS]

00:24:14   is the Bible but they say now who do you [TS]

00:24:17   think are the people who fought for for [TS]

00:24:20   light and one of the kids says Jesus [TS]

00:24:22   like yes and I said but also and they [TS]

00:24:25   list off a bunch of artists and [TS]

00:24:26   scientists and i thought now see that's [TS]

00:24:29   really interesting because it's not it's [TS]

00:24:32   not uh you know hey hey kids i'm [TS]

00:24:35   enlisting you in the cause of good be [TS]

00:24:37   like Jesus see you know he's fighting on [TS]

00:24:39   the side it's like know it's him and and [TS]

00:24:41   Leonardo Leonardo DaVinci internet and [TS]

00:24:45   Shakespeare and Einstein right 10 and so [TS]

00:24:49   I thought that was really interesting [TS]

00:24:50   there there's another Bible verse that [TS]

00:24:52   big needs to remember later on and I [TS]

00:24:53   mean it's definitely there and and the [TS]

00:24:56   the the alien horse people [TS]

00:25:01   rainbow people are kind of angels and [TS]

00:25:03   are referred to as such by cal at one [TS]

00:25:05   point but it's not like they're angels [TS]

00:25:07   it's more like how do I describe them to [TS]

00:25:09   you [TS]

00:25:10   I can't really think of it like guardian [TS]

00:25:12   angels they're kind of like that right [TS]

00:25:13   it's not it just it managed to use [TS]

00:25:16   religious imagery and talk about [TS]

00:25:17   religion as it was part of the world [TS]

00:25:19   without seeming like it was super coded [TS]

00:25:23   propaganda least that's how I read it [TS]

00:25:25   when I reread it kind of being wary [TS]

00:25:27   about what I was going to find inside [TS]

00:25:29   yeah it's almost like a step forward [TS]

00:25:31   from CS lewis's narnia books in a way [TS]

00:25:34   because good [TS]

00:25:35   it's a it's a it's in a weird you know i [TS]

00:25:38   will and that's an example where the [TS]

00:25:40   Narnia books are actually I think [TS]

00:25:42   much better coding for religious [TS]

00:25:43   parables than the his sci-fi books which [TS]

00:25:47   are much more heavy-handed i think but [TS]

00:25:49   yeah well no I mean Narnia Narnia is [TS]

00:25:52   very heavy-handed but in a wonderfully [TS]

00:25:55   lyrical sort of way where it's never you [TS]

00:25:57   know it's never so overt that anyone [TS]

00:26:00   under the age of 12 is going to catch on [TS]

00:26:03   whereas wrinkle in time and its [TS]

00:26:07   successors are very much yes religious [TS]

00:26:10   religion is in this world religion is [TS]

00:26:12   part of this world religion influences [TS]

00:26:14   what is going on my religion is not the [TS]

00:26:17   end-all be-all and religion works in [TS]

00:26:19   concert with these other you know with [TS]

00:26:22   science and with art and their-their can [TS]

00:26:25   get theirs and almost makes an argument [TS]

00:26:27   that there can be no religion without [TS]

00:26:29   science and art and that they all they [TS]

00:26:31   all must work together or else the [TS]

00:26:33   entire fabric of the universe falls [TS]

00:26:35   apart and you kind of get a little bit [TS]

00:26:37   of that with it in terms of you know [TS]

00:26:39   where we've taken away everything for [TS]

00:26:42   vast structure and in this structure [TS]

00:26:44   there's no real religion there's no real [TS]

00:26:47   art there's no real science it's just [TS]

00:26:49   everybody you know under this grip not [TS]

00:26:52   want to individual orders without [TS]

00:26:54   without creativity its exact specifics [TS]

00:26:56   on it right yeah the the point that [TS]

00:26:58   Jason makes about you know Jesus as [TS]

00:27:01   somebody who changed the universe for [TS]

00:27:03   the better but scientists do an artist [TS]

00:27:04   do as well I group is a Catholic in the [TS]

00:27:06   bible belt and I grew up in fact in the [TS]

00:27:09   neighborhood with a Southern Baptist [TS]

00:27:10   mom's managed to make the case to my [TS]

00:27:13   parents that I should be sent to [TS]

00:27:15   southern baptist bible school during the [TS]

00:27:16   summer so I so my soul can be saved so [TS]

00:27:19   hopefully some nice well it you know [TS]

00:27:22   it's it [TS]

00:27:23   welcome to the Bible Belt working [TS]

00:27:24   himself and so to 10 of again to have [TS]

00:27:27   the idea that there was more than one [TS]

00:27:29   way to be a good person in the world and [TS]

00:27:32   to do good towards the world that was an [TS]

00:27:35   idea that i needed to have expressed to [TS]

00:27:38   me and legitimate ways as a child and [TS]

00:27:40   this book is a wonderful job of doing [TS]

00:27:41   that I do wonder if it's more of a [TS]

00:27:44   product of its time because it was [TS]

00:27:46   written during the early 1960s where [TS]

00:27:49   religion wasn't seen so much as an us [TS]

00:27:52   versus them thing is nice today [TS]

00:27:54   exactly I'm [TS]

00:27:55   it's much more gentle it whereas if you [TS]

00:27:59   take a look at some of our older works [TS]

00:28:01   for example i'm also a fan of her meet [TS]

00:28:03   the Austen's books and those are far [TS]

00:28:06   more overtly religious and far more far [TS]

00:28:09   more adamantly christian and i have [TS]

00:28:11   noticed that as writers get older they [TS]

00:28:13   do tend to sink into whatever is going [TS]

00:28:15   to give them comfort and validation and [TS]

00:28:17   it seems like the angle kind of did that [TS]

00:28:18   with her work whereas I think this is [TS]

00:28:20   one of the second book she wrote and so [TS]

00:28:23   she's still figure she's still finding [TS]

00:28:25   her way as a voice and she synthesized [TS]

00:28:27   most four major themes but this is much [TS]

00:28:29   more product if it's if it's time in the [TS]

00:28:31   sixties which is there are a lot of [TS]

00:28:33   different ways to create miracles and [TS]

00:28:35   wonders Jesus crisis when we're doing it [TS]

00:28:37   scientists who can help us find the [TS]

00:28:39   truth about the University another way [TS]

00:28:40   artists that can help us express that [TS]

00:28:41   truth about the universe or another way [TS]

00:28:42   philanthropist who can help us express [TS]

00:28:44   kindness in the universe or another way [TS]

00:28:46   and I wish that was an idea that was [TS]

00:28:48   more and play now [TS]

00:28:49   yeah yeah because you get a lot of [TS]

00:28:51   science fiction now and a lot of what's [TS]

00:28:53   coming out in the last 10 to 15 years in [TS]

00:28:55   popular science fiction religions become [TS]

00:28:58   the big bad bulky man in a lot of books [TS]

00:29:01   and then of course in in so much [TS]

00:29:03   religious discussion neuroscience is the [TS]

00:29:05   enemy exactly right and and night [TS]

00:29:07   neither of those necessarily is a you [TS]

00:29:09   know me I'm always looking for a [TS]

00:29:10   moderate path the the neither of those [TS]

00:29:13   is particularly constructive and you [TS]

00:29:16   know not to get on a night together [TS]

00:29:18   totally bizarre chain tangent now the [TS]

00:29:20   episode about this soon but you know [TS]

00:29:22   Babylon 5 one of the TV show from the [TS]

00:29:24   nineties that I really loved written by [TS]

00:29:26   an 80s Joe michael Straczynski has [TS]

00:29:28   extraordinary nuanced takes on religion [TS]

00:29:31   and how it shapes people's lives and [TS]

00:29:32   ethics it's fantastic i believe won an [TS]

00:29:34   award for the portrayal of religion on [TS]

00:29:36   television it was like we can portray a [TS]

00:29:38   future where they're aliens and people [TS]

00:29:40   are in outer space and people guess what [TS]

00:29:42   still have religions because that's [TS]

00:29:43   going to happen because you know those [TS]

00:29:45   aren't going to just disappear one day [TS]

00:29:47   despite what gene roddenberry thanks [TS]

00:29:49   soho I and I always so that was [TS]

00:29:52   refreshing and I i think it's too bad it [TS]

00:29:54   knowing that that these books become [TS]

00:29:56   more overtly religious over time it's [TS]

00:29:58   like ice [TS]

00:29:58   I really appreciated the fact that the [TS]

00:30:01   in this book it's part of the mix and [TS]

00:30:04   it's relevant and it's and it's it you [TS]

00:30:06   know it's it's got some cultural [TS]

00:30:07   signifiers to it's like it [TS]

00:30:09   of course you know these verses from the [TS]

00:30:11   Bible because people know those things [TS]

00:30:12   and then it's also got the the you know [TS]

00:30:16   the fact is we're talking about a [TS]

00:30:17   struggle between good and evil here [TS]

00:30:19   universal struggle between good and evil [TS]

00:30:20   and it's kind of interesting to frame [TS]

00:30:22   that you know bigger context of the [TS]

00:30:24   universe with the smaller context of [TS]

00:30:26   what people on earth know about about [TS]

00:30:29   that struggle through their religion i [TS]

00:30:31   just i love i love the fact that that it [TS]

00:30:34   just puts it all out there in 11 big one [TS]

00:30:37   big mix instead of saying no no we can't [TS]

00:30:39   talk about that we don't know we can [TS]

00:30:41   don't mention Jesus we can talk about [TS]

00:30:43   him or information science we can't talk [TS]

00:30:45   about it is that since both they're both [TS]

00:30:47   infuriated was like when when I was [TS]

00:30:49   little my mom would ask you know what [TS]

00:30:52   religion do you think the memories are [TS]

00:30:54   and I I never had a good answer for it [TS]

00:30:58   because i mean if if they are any [TS]

00:31:01   religion in particular their christian [TS]

00:31:04   because there you go through talking [TS]

00:31:05   about the Bible they're talking about [TS]

00:31:06   the quotes from the Bible and guardian [TS]

00:31:09   angels and all that kind of thing but [TS]

00:31:11   she doesn't really specify she doesn't [TS]

00:31:14   go beyond that and I kind of like that [TS]

00:31:16   so that you know if you grew up catholic [TS]

00:31:19   regroup Episcopalian regroup you know [TS]

00:31:20   whatever variety you could identify with [TS]

00:31:24   them and maybe more so at in the period [TS]

00:31:27   of you know when it was written but you [TS]

00:31:30   know you you could see yourself in their [TS]

00:31:34   situation a little bit maybe just [TS]

00:31:36   because yet garden I was viewed as sort [TS]

00:31:39   of garden-variety mid-twentieth century [TS]

00:31:42   American religion right American [TS]

00:31:45   Protestantism right yeah exactly exactly [TS]

00:31:47   and they were you know it's like sure [TS]

00:31:49   people know about that and maybe they [TS]

00:31:50   only go to church on easter sunday or [TS]

00:31:53   maybe the they don't go to church very [TS]

00:31:55   much but they send their kids to Sunday [TS]

00:31:57   School which is what happened with me my [TS]

00:31:59   parents go to church but I went to [TS]

00:32:00   Sunday school for a while I don't get [TS]

00:32:02   that but that was what that was what it [TS]

00:32:04   was and and sang in the choir [TS]

00:32:07   ok mother wouldn't let me go to Sunday [TS]

00:32:09   school or Catholic school because she [TS]

00:32:11   was like that will destroy your faith I [TS]

00:32:14   went ok [TS]

00:32:16   oh yeah oh oh no nothing yeah and that's [TS]

00:32:20   tapping religion with a bunch of errands [TS]

00:32:22   here [TS]

00:32:22   probable that was thinking that they're [TS]

00:32:26   probably Unitarian that was my guess [TS]

00:32:27   yeah sure whatever scientist also what I [TS]

00:32:30   love about this book is all the cultural [TS]

00:32:32   signifiers that she does drop later as [TS]

00:32:34   you're going through school and you [TS]

00:32:36   finally doing camera handling the wild [TS]

00:32:37   for the first time in the name and [TS]

00:32:39   Fortinbras comes up boom the penny drops [TS]

00:32:41   for you because you know that's why in [TS]

00:32:43   the dark Orton browser or something and [TS]

00:32:45   similar to god I can't even think of [TS]

00:32:49   half the culture half of the cultural [TS]

00:32:50   name-checks that go on that the dog's [TS]

00:32:52   name is always stood out for me just [TS]

00:32:54   because you know who in the world names [TS]

00:32:55   their dog for well some really you know [TS]

00:32:58   I iconoclastic scientist types with [TS]

00:33:02   their bohemian ways in their lab in the [TS]

00:33:06   back bedroom and they're they're in the [TS]

00:33:08   garage or whatever it is and I don't [TS]

00:33:10   know is that is that almost like a [TS]

00:33:11   fantasy view of like the ultimate super [TS]

00:33:15   cool science family he's weirdly [TS]

00:33:19   optimistic outlook surprise and again [TS]

00:33:22   i'm kind of surprised people came out 62 [TS]

00:33:24   because it creates Betty Ford an and it [TS]

00:33:26   also goes to show that Madeleine L'Engle [TS]

00:33:28   had no exposure to actual working [TS]

00:33:29   scientists because yeah well be okay [TS]

00:33:34   first of all and i say this is somebody [TS]

00:33:36   who spent all four years of her [TS]

00:33:37   undergrad firing up a Bunsen burner [TS]

00:33:38   everyday for different class for it in [TS]

00:33:40   different labs um if you're doing the [TS]

00:33:42   type of science mrs. Morrow was doing [TS]

00:33:44   the kind of equipment you need you can't [TS]

00:33:47   just you know go down to your local [TS]

00:33:49   hardware store and and then oh and it [TS]

00:33:52   and jerry rig that together be her [TS]

00:33:54   husband's equipment that he got from the [TS]

00:33:56   government but it's still a physicist [TS]

00:33:58   she's a bio yeah it was no your eyes for [TS]

00:34:00   mitochondrial right it's real oh yes [TS]

00:34:02   with the mitochondria I do i do remember [TS]

00:34:04   that yes you know it's it's basically [TS]

00:34:07   this fantasy and i also wonder how much [TS]

00:34:09   of that is Lange goals [TS]

00:34:10   it is a product of her time were so it's [TS]

00:34:12   ok for mrs. murder have a new identity [TS]

00:34:14   that fulfills her but the important [TS]

00:34:16   things that she's still running the home [TS]

00:34:17   however idiosyncratically and she still [TS]

00:34:19   cooks you're still making ironically [TS]

00:34:20   enough even she's making dinner and in [TS]

00:34:24   three actually puts on a burner cook [TS]

00:34:26   book based on because when I got to [TS]

00:34:28   college that was one of the first things [TS]

00:34:29   i asked my team was do you guys ever [TS]

00:34:30   cook on Bunsen burners I grew up reading [TS]

00:34:31   this book where they always cooked on [TS]

00:34:33   Bunsen burners and he's like [TS]

00:34:35   no but we can try and so we did [TS]

00:34:39   that's yeah you know it is it is funny [TS]

00:34:42   that her out there with her things [TS]

00:34:44   because it is sort of like honey I'm [TS]

00:34:46   doing science out here like this not [TS]

00:34:48   what do you what kind of science you're [TS]

00:34:50   doing scientific kind involving burners [TS]

00:34:53   what has science done either science [TS]

00:34:57   alright also making stew yes [TS]

00:35:00   try not to mix up my stew with my [TS]

00:35:02   science my liverwurst and cream cheese [TS]

00:35:05   sandwiches all my god [TS]

00:35:07   any other thoughts you guys have about [TS]

00:35:08   their religious aspects of it i mean it [TS]

00:35:11   is intertwined with this whole thread [TS]

00:35:12   about individualism that we see early on [TS]

00:35:14   with a with a megan Charles Wallace sort [TS]

00:35:17   of being ostracized and trying to assert [TS]

00:35:19   their you know be yourself and be proud [TS]

00:35:21   of who you are which has a you know it's [TS]

00:35:23   a big thing that I I loved in this book [TS]

00:35:26   because that was definitely it something [TS]

00:35:29   that I felt in in my childhood and then [TS]

00:35:31   at the end when they go to Camazotz and [TS]

00:35:32   they've got the this entire society [TS]

00:35:35   that's basically been turned into a [TS]

00:35:37   hivemind a group mind with this thing [TS]

00:35:39   called it which is it turns out just as [TS]

00:35:42   described in the book and depicted in [TS]

00:35:43   the graphic novel a big squishy brain on [TS]

00:35:45   the table but it's representative of the [TS]

00:35:49   the group mind and it's a disembodied [TS]

00:35:51   brain there it's yeah well right well [TS]

00:35:56   don't know what it is it's a red it's a [TS]

00:36:00   red brain in with the right then so [TS]

00:36:03   there's that so that's the flip side of [TS]

00:36:05   it is the is the this is a place where [TS]

00:36:06   everybody conforms and everybody is [TS]

00:36:08   exactly the same and it's individualism [TS]

00:36:10   like i said i had that moment like it's [TS]

00:36:11   gonna get really weird and I'm gonna [TS]

00:36:15   tell you about you know about communism [TS]

00:36:17   or in the rugged individualism or [TS]

00:36:19   anything like that it never gets that I [TS]

00:36:21   mean there is a pulsating bring on the [TS]

00:36:22   table and yet I wouldn't say it gets [TS]

00:36:24   super weird just sort of base level [TS]

00:36:27   weird and it fits in with those other [TS]

00:36:29   themes of individualism that don't [TS]

00:36:30   aren't necessarily like in in soviet [TS]

00:36:33   russia brilliant girl dollar of [TS]

00:36:35   scientists will sit at her desk right [TS]

00:36:38   it's not like that's what not what [TS]

00:36:39   they're trying to the subject Hassan's [TS]

00:36:41   ball bounce you [TS]

00:36:43   oh yeah yes the poor kid who wants to [TS]

00:36:46   bounce this ball and his torture [TS]

00:36:47   horribly formats [TS]

00:36:48   it's kind of rough do ya got a brutal i [TS]

00:36:52   think the book as a whole pushes buttons [TS]

00:36:55   on a lot of issues but it never goes you [TS]

00:36:57   know it pushes it about halfway and then [TS]

00:36:58   takes the handoff the thing the the [TS]

00:37:02   button and put your hand on it and says [TS]

00:37:04   okay how do you feel about this [TS]

00:37:06   mhm and it back it puts a lot of the big [TS]

00:37:09   questions and a lot of the thoughts [TS]

00:37:12   regarding it and regarding religion and [TS]

00:37:15   regarding how science flavors the book [TS]

00:37:18   into the readers hands or at least it [TS]

00:37:20   feels like that to me if you're right [TS]

00:37:21   I'm I like it [TS]

00:37:23   she has extraordinary respect for her [TS]

00:37:25   readers intelligence that one hmm [TS]

00:37:27   and when your child that's what you want [TS]

00:37:28   is for for an author not to talk down to [TS]

00:37:30   you when one of the things i found [TS]

00:37:32   really interesting this time through was [TS]

00:37:35   that you know again going back to the [TS]

00:37:37   religion a little bit is that it's the [TS]

00:37:40   place where everybody knows and believes [TS]

00:37:42   the same thing and does the same thing [TS]

00:37:45   and acts the same way and that's what's [TS]

00:37:49   wrong [TS]

00:37:50   it's like wow that's really interesting [TS]

00:37:52   the pulsating brain is is it's so so [TS]

00:37:55   hopeful our son does this graphic novel [TS]

00:37:57   have you all look at the graphic novel [TS]

00:37:59   oh yeah i bought it and granted ok you [TS]

00:38:01   know I i really liked it i really [TS]

00:38:03   enjoyed reading it having only vague [TS]

00:38:05   memories of the book too because I got [TS]

00:38:07   to play the game of like is this real [TS]

00:38:10   it was really like this and then reading [TS]

00:38:12   a book and 10 yeah it's it's it's so [TS]

00:38:14   amazingly faithful and it helps that the [TS]

00:38:16   original novel is like 200 pages long [TS]

00:38:19   and the paperback that I've gotten [TS]

00:38:20   that's what kind of like some spacing [TS]

00:38:22   and big type and so it turns to this [TS]

00:38:25   graphic novel that is so faithful in [TS]

00:38:28   some ways because it's you know it's 390 [TS]

00:38:30   pages but mostly you know that [TS]

00:38:31   essentially all the dialogue that's in [TS]

00:38:34   the book is in the graphic novel and and [TS]

00:38:36   even stuff like the pulsating brain on a [TS]

00:38:38   table that's actually what is in the [TS]

00:38:41   book there is it is a big quivering [TS]

00:38:45   bring the Communist thank you Lisa brain [TS]

00:38:48   mhm yes yes but I i was really impressed [TS]

00:38:52   i i i know the fear of a lot of people [TS]

00:38:55   in [TS]

00:38:56   in taking something that's a beloved [TS]

00:38:57   childhood book and doing an adaptation [TS]

00:39:00   like this is that you're gonna overwrite [TS]

00:39:02   your memories of your sort of mental [TS]

00:39:04   images and for whatever reason you know [TS]

00:39:07   when i read it the stuff that i [TS]

00:39:09   remembered from reading the book i was [TS]

00:39:10   just nodding and going yeah yeah yeah [TS]

00:39:12   that's about right [TS]

00:39:13   yeah our style is so unique in a way [TS]

00:39:16   that it it let's get it on ments your [TS]

00:39:20   your viewing experience I said that [TS]

00:39:22   earlier in the podcast but reading [TS]

00:39:24   through the graphic novel the way that [TS]

00:39:26   she illustrates and the way that she [TS]

00:39:29   carries you through the story is almost [TS]

00:39:31   a little bit dreamlike like all of her I [TS]

00:39:34   her brush drive i'm going really [TS]

00:39:36   technically r know the way that she [TS]

00:39:38   illustrated this book is very freeform [TS]

00:39:41   and very flowing and in a certain way it [TS]

00:39:44   feels very dreamlike and it feel it [TS]

00:39:46   doesn't it doesn't overwrite the [TS]

00:39:49   memories that I have of the book and it [TS]

00:39:50   doesn't overwrite this the way I picture [TS]

00:39:52   characters in the way that i picture you [TS]

00:39:55   know be supreme beings and and aliens [TS]

00:39:57   and planets but it's a wonderful it's [TS]

00:40:01   almost like a viewing portal into the [TS]

00:40:05   here is this universe of a wrinkle in [TS]

00:40:07   time here is how this person sees a [TS]

00:40:10   wrinkle in time and like the book you [TS]

00:40:13   can find places where you go oh yeah [TS]

00:40:15   like this is totally what I saw or this [TS]

00:40:18   is different than what I saw but still [TS]

00:40:21   not wrong it's you know it's traveling [TS]

00:40:24   different timelines i have never seen [TS]

00:40:26   such a painfully accurate depiction of [TS]

00:40:28   adolescence as what the way make [TS]

00:40:31   memories is is drawn through this entire [TS]

00:40:32   book every line in every frame that [TS]

00:40:36   she's in you can just feel the the [TS]

00:40:38   jangling of her nerves and the ruling of [TS]

00:40:40   her emotions and the confusion and fear [TS]

00:40:42   and uncertainty and the whole book to me [TS]

00:40:45   has that same feel to it which i think [TS]

00:40:47   is perfect for the underlying message [TS]

00:40:49   and that the heroines journey as it were [TS]

00:40:52   you know it's funny the in reading the [TS]

00:40:56   book especially when your kid reading [TS]

00:40:58   the book you're not really sure about [TS]

00:40:59   the ages and and it for me it was harder [TS]

00:41:02   to picture them and and reading in the [TS]

00:41:03   graphic novel what one thing I really [TS]

00:41:04   liked about this not only is it very [TS]

00:41:06   clear sort of like the age differences [TS]

00:41:08   and [TS]

00:41:09   you said she's that you know she is a [TS]

00:41:11   age you know just in adolescence [TS]

00:41:14   yeah but what I love about it is in the [TS]

00:41:16   book it describes her [TS]

00:41:18   well it's not just description it's her [TS]

00:41:20   interaction with her mother where her [TS]

00:41:21   mother they say oh you know her mother [TS]

00:41:22   is beautiful and I and you know where as [TS]

00:41:27   Megan's plain awful and her mom says [TS]

00:41:29   something like no no that I would i look [TS]

00:41:32   like you did when I was your age and and [TS]

00:41:34   you should you know just just wait and [TS]

00:41:36   it's tough [TS]

00:41:37   adolescence is tough and all your all [TS]

00:41:39   your parts of your body and your face [TS]

00:41:41   are growing at different rates and it's [TS]

00:41:42   all out of sync but it will all work out [TS]

00:41:44   and one of the nice things about the way [TS]

00:41:46   that hope larson draws Meg in this book [TS]

00:41:49   is that at times she looks incredibly [TS]

00:41:52   awkward and adolescent yes and then at [TS]

00:41:55   other times you're like oh yeah i can i [TS]

00:41:57   can see she's gonna she's going to be [TS]

00:41:58   beautiful like her mother growing and [TS]

00:42:00   she's just not you know it's just kind [TS]

00:42:02   of here and there and shifting around [TS]

00:42:03   which is exactly what it's like [TS]

00:42:04   yeah well this is really nice passage in [TS]

00:42:06   the book itself where they talk about [TS]

00:42:09   you know Meg had tried to blow off some [TS]

00:42:11   steam at recess by roughhousing and the [TS]

00:42:13   girls in her greater like we don't do [TS]

00:42:14   that anymore because we are no longer [TS]

00:42:16   children and then a few paragraphs later [TS]

00:42:18   it mentions that when her hair was still [TS]

00:42:20   in the braids that she had worn through [TS]

00:42:22   grammar school it was fine but now that [TS]

00:42:25   she had cut it to fit in with the rest [TS]

00:42:26   of high school kids she could never get [TS]

00:42:28   her hair right and struck out all over [TS]

00:42:29   the place and it was just such a perfect [TS]

00:42:30   metaphor for she was good at being a [TS]

00:42:33   child because she didn't carry them [TS]

00:42:35   about how different she was but she's [TS]

00:42:37   terrible being an adolescent because [TS]

00:42:39   nothing fits and the art is exquisite [TS]

00:42:42   and what the way all of the pickles with [TS]

00:42:44   me and maker drawn you just feel very [TS]

00:42:46   conscious of somebody who goes from [TS]

00:42:48   place to place not feeling like she [TS]

00:42:49   quite fits she quits in and how she's [TS]

00:42:52   going to deal with that I don't find [TS]

00:42:55   them [TS]

00:42:55   I didn't find the book particularly [TS]

00:42:56   beautiful Armour first read-through [TS]

00:42:57   because it was making me feel antsy [TS]

00:43:00   uncomfortable it wasn't until I figured [TS]

00:43:01   out that the book was doing a really [TS]

00:43:03   good job of channeling of a creative [TS]

00:43:06   visual representation of adolescents [TS]

00:43:07   once I figure out that's why and I'm on [TS]

00:43:10   edge i could sink into a little bit more [TS]

00:43:12   and step back from a bit and and begin [TS]

00:43:16   to appreciate the ways in which i mean [TS]

00:43:17   Larson's got beautiful command over the [TS]

00:43:19   way she could she yeah she draws people [TS]

00:43:22   especially [TS]

00:43:22   the the graceful lines of their hands of [TS]

00:43:24   the way that they hold themselves in [TS]

00:43:25   relation to other people but it took me [TS]

00:43:27   a couple tries to to get through it [TS]

00:43:29   that's what one of her thankless task is [TS]

00:43:31   that she also has to render the the [TS]

00:43:33   aliens the teachers and that's you know [TS]

00:43:36   that's where your you know your [TS]

00:43:39   imagination is pitted against reality as [TS]

00:43:41   you can you know it turns out that you [TS]

00:43:44   know hope larson is going after going [TS]

00:43:46   off of the very specific descriptions in [TS]

00:43:48   the book but you know as a reader you [TS]

00:43:50   can discard and what whatever you don't [TS]

00:43:53   want to take and imagine whoever you [TS]

00:43:54   like and she needs to be a little more [TS]

00:43:56   faithful and I thought you know they're [TS]

00:43:58   there are moments like with the and [TS]

00:44:00   beast [TS]

00:44:01   I've always sort of a piece more as a [TS]

00:44:02   collection of lame smells weird to see [TS]

00:44:04   are depicted physically but it is [TS]

00:44:06   accurate that it's these weird kind of [TS]

00:44:08   like multi-armed multi fingered [TS]

00:44:10   creatures with like indentations in [TS]

00:44:12   their heads but not actual it was [TS]

00:44:15   interesting and weird but i think [TS]

00:44:17   faithful it turns out the one the one [TS]

00:44:19   that really gets me is again we're back [TS]

00:44:20   to our our Center rainbow angel people [TS]

00:44:24   and that one is really bizarre but it's [TS]

00:44:27   also completely accurate that that [TS]

00:44:29   that's the way it's described it's just [TS]

00:44:31   kind of funny that that is weirder in [TS]

00:44:33   the graphic novel fit in the book [TS]

00:44:35   because you just have to accept that [TS]

00:44:37   yes but it is going to be a big centaur [TS]

00:44:39   rainbow person and but it's beautiful [TS]

00:44:43   it's well done [TS]

00:44:43   it's just weird and it just struck me [TS]

00:44:46   that that you know what what you can [TS]

00:44:47   just discount when you're as a reader [TS]

00:44:49   you're like me i don't like that i'm not [TS]

00:44:50   going to even think about that i'm gonna [TS]

00:44:51   cast somebody else in that part and the [TS]

00:44:53   graphic novel hope Larson's doing the [TS]

00:44:55   casting and we have to follow and she [TS]

00:44:57   did a great job but it you know she you [TS]

00:44:59   know she she has to make those creative [TS]

00:45:01   decisions we get basically taking metal [TS]

00:45:04   ingles cues [TS]

00:45:06   oh yeah absolutely one of the things I [TS]

00:45:08   loved was you know I i I'd come and [TS]

00:45:10   looking at how would I adapt it because [TS]

00:45:13   I've done that [TS]

00:45:14   yeah and you know it's it's really [TS]

00:45:17   interesting how even in the very [TS]

00:45:19   beginning she she doesn't do exactly the [TS]

00:45:25   same opening all the details are there [TS]

00:45:27   but she entered cuts them and weaves [TS]

00:45:30   them together differently [TS]

00:45:31   and does it very economically it's it's [TS]

00:45:34   very much a show don't tell kind of [TS]

00:45:35   thing and so in just a few panels we [TS]

00:45:39   have almost that entire first chapter [TS]

00:45:40   and it's all there and it's a slightly [TS]

00:45:44   different order and and going through [TS]

00:45:46   the whole graphic novel then it's like a [TS]

00:45:50   great i was just fascinated by the [TS]

00:45:53   choices she was making in what to show [TS]

00:45:55   when and in which order and and how it [TS]

00:45:58   worked i'm a huge amount of care [TS]

00:46:01   yeah okay taken with it because i mean [TS]

00:46:03   it's it's been adapted into a play and [TS]

00:46:06   an opera and a miniseries that was [TS]

00:46:09   turned into a bad movie because it was [TS]

00:46:11   apparently a bad miniseries and at the [TS]

00:46:16   time [TS]

00:46:17   Madeleine L'Engle was interviewed and [TS]

00:46:19   they stay asked her did it meet your [TS]

00:46:22   expectations and she said yes I expected [TS]

00:46:25   it to be bad and it was no disney i will [TS]

00:46:29   i've never watched any of the adaptation [TS]

00:46:31   and don't think I don't think I ever [TS]

00:46:33   will [TS]

00:46:33   there's only one good wrinkle in time [TS]

00:46:35   adaptation it is 90 seconds long and it [TS]

00:46:38   was made I think last year the year [TS]

00:46:41   before [TS]

00:46:41   I'm as part of the 92nd newbury video [TS]

00:46:44   contest and it is it's basically a bunch [TS]

00:46:47   of child just a bunch of kids who seem [TS]

00:46:51   to be part of the same family acting out [TS]

00:46:55   wrinkle in time and very sweet fashion [TS]

00:46:57   and it's beautiful 3 l's passed I passed [TS]

00:47:01   down all right kids let's go to the [TS]

00:47:03   Lincoln yeah I I admit David that i was [TS]

00:47:05   i was reading the book after having read [TS]

00:47:08   the graphic novel i went back to the [TS]

00:47:09   book and I was thinking how would you [TS]

00:47:11   make this into a into a TV series camera [TS]

00:47:14   or a TV movie or a movie and and you [TS]

00:47:17   know i think it could it could be done [TS]

00:47:20   and done well but i wouldn't lay odds on [TS]

00:47:25   it right about i think it could I think [TS]

00:47:27   it clearly doesn't animated one travel [TS]

00:47:29   more [TS]

00:47:29   well yeah I mean you could you could [TS]

00:47:31   absolutely do that but i was thinking [TS]

00:47:32   about lifestyle you know it's not [TS]

00:47:34   unreasonable that the-the-the there are [TS]

00:47:36   some the aliens are a little bit weird [TS]

00:47:38   but these days you can you can kind of [TS]

00:47:39   do anything but so much of it is about [TS]

00:47:41   about the kids and when they get to [TS]

00:47:43   Camazotz it's just a town you know [TS]

00:47:45   was not that is something about this [TS]

00:47:46   that's a sci-fi reader that's convenient [TS]

00:47:49   everybody speaks everybody understands [TS]

00:47:51   everybody else you know the the go to [TS]

00:47:55   this far-off planet of Camazotz and it's [TS]

00:47:57   it's just a town on a planet like you [TS]

00:48:01   know presumably they have onions kid [TS]

00:48:03   with bouncing a ball i mean they're not [TS]

00:48:06   there they're people right there not [TS]

00:48:08   aliens or anything or just kind of other [TS]

00:48:09   people so you know it's it's it's outer [TS]

00:48:12   space achill when it needs to be and it [TS]

00:48:14   was the Southern California suburb and [TS]

00:48:16   it's just a parable women needs to be [TS]

00:48:18   you know that which is fine i don't mind [TS]

00:48:20   it's it's actually kind of fun i was i I [TS]

00:48:22   actually was thinking about Doctor Who [TS]

00:48:23   for a little bit while I was reading [TS]

00:48:24   this because it struck me as being very [TS]

00:48:27   similar in the sense to creations from [TS]

00:48:30   the early sixties in the sense that that [TS]

00:48:32   the the details with scientific details [TS]

00:48:35   of it weren't really the point and so [TS]

00:48:37   they didn't matter right and that it was [TS]

00:48:39   really about the the gestalt of the you [TS]

00:48:41   know it's just sort of like look at [TS]

00:48:43   story make a go of it it doesn't stop [TS]

00:48:46   don't stop to ask me about why this town [TS]

00:48:49   has been this planet have humans on it [TS]

00:48:51   when the other places have aliens just [TS]

00:48:54   it's need no it's not the point of the [TS]

00:48:56   story and I felt like that with this to [TS]

00:48:58   which I like I know it drives some [TS]

00:48:59   particular kinds of sci-fi fans crazy [TS]

00:49:01   because they really want it to be like [TS]

00:49:03   completely scientifically explainable [TS]

00:49:06   and accurate and all that but it's you [TS]

00:49:08   know it's it's not it's not meant to be [TS]

00:49:10   and I was fine with it but I had that [TS]

00:49:12   moment of like sure there are rainbow [TS]

00:49:14   centaurs ok let's sure there's the smell [TS]

00:49:18   they hit the furry smell people who [TS]

00:49:20   can't see anything [TS]

00:49:22   alright that's cool right now I don't [TS]

00:49:24   need to think about how they evolved to [TS]

00:49:25   that I just it's fine and actually i [TS]

00:49:27   really love that we didn't mention that [TS]

00:49:28   but a beast and her people they can't [TS]

00:49:31   see so make has to try to explain what [TS]

00:49:33   light is to them which is fascinating [TS]

00:49:34   like oh well there's the warm part of [TS]

00:49:36   the day and there's the cold part of the [TS]

00:49:37   day but I don't know what you're talking [TS]

00:49:38   about light and she had that realization [TS]

00:49:40   like wow they I thought they were really [TS]

00:49:42   sad because they can't see anything but [TS]

00:49:44   they've totally got like five or six [TS]

00:49:46   more senses than I have and I'm [TS]

00:49:48   completely clueless to them and I [TS]

00:49:50   thought that was a really nice bit of of [TS]

00:49:53   thinking outside of of of your own [TS]

00:49:57   person [TS]

00:49:58   your own perspective that for a kids [TS]

00:50:00   book is really great again about the [TS]

00:50:03   different point of view [TS]

00:50:04   yeah and it comes towards the very end [TS]

00:50:06   of the book worm eggs already been [TS]

00:50:08   forced to confront the fact that [TS]

00:50:09   different people have different points [TS]

00:50:10   of view that are equally valid and by [TS]

00:50:12   not understand by not trying to [TS]

00:50:14   understand she's making them so much of [TS]

00:50:16   an outsider's the people who insist on [TS]

00:50:17   making her an outsider right if I were [TS]

00:50:19   adapting this i think i might take out [TS]

00:50:21   the happy medium though I really don't [TS]

00:50:22   know why that is [TS]

00:50:23   that's a Daffy interlude you know I me [TS]

00:50:26   give you a little bit of backstory oh [TS]

00:50:28   you were a star you give up your life [TS]

00:50:30   100 earth is awful and and but but but [TS]

00:50:33   you know Calvin's mom abuses and but you [TS]

00:50:36   know they're there but it's like it's [TS]

00:50:37   weird it's weird let's go to happy [TS]

00:50:39   medium she's got a crystal ball she's [TS]

00:50:41   gonna tell us about our past and our [TS]

00:50:42   future she passes out and then oh I'm [TS]

00:50:44   really tired from watching you from [TS]

00:50:46   showing these things to go well actually [TS]

00:50:50   let's go Calvin O'Keefe for a minute [TS]

00:50:51   they really go over the course of the [TS]

00:50:54   first three books because again the the [TS]

00:50:56   ones that I think most of us and [TS]

00:50:58   Generation X read you know we've [TS]

00:51:01   established that his home life is not [TS]

00:51:03   great his father drinks way too much hit [TS]

00:51:05   it beats the kids his mother beats the [TS]

00:51:07   kids he somehow manages to emerge from [TS]

00:51:10   this completely unscathed [TS]

00:51:11   despite these horrific details that come [TS]

00:51:13   out in subsequent books where where we [TS]

00:51:17   find out that basically his mother had [TS]

00:51:18   to marry the first man who came along [TS]

00:51:20   because her stepfather was um was [TS]

00:51:23   getting ready to to sexually assault her [TS]

00:51:25   and and yet albums that is incredibly [TS]

00:51:28   well adjusted incredibly even-tempered [TS]

00:51:30   genius guy who handles and really [TS]

00:51:32   handles and really girlfriend wife does [TS]

00:51:36   that I I've always had really mixed [TS]

00:51:39   feelings because it seems i'm not sure [TS]

00:51:42   if this isn't meant to be empowering 22 [TS]

00:51:44   fell to children who are growing up in [TS]

00:51:46   similarly similarly dire situation [TS]

00:51:48   saying you know relax your special you [TS]

00:51:50   can get through this or if this is just [TS]

00:51:51   incredibly dismissive of how hard it is [TS]

00:51:54   to grow up under those circumstances [TS]

00:51:56   mmm and as i get older i find it more [TS]

00:51:58   and more problematic huh i don't know i [TS]

00:52:02   mean knowing the people that I do have [TS]

00:52:05   come from similar households i would say [TS]

00:52:09   that especially being the eldest [TS]

00:52:11   in that kind of a household you do build [TS]

00:52:14   up a certain i'd only want to say [TS]

00:52:18   tolerance a certain you you have to grow [TS]

00:52:22   up very quickly and you have to be very [TS]

00:52:24   much the the person in charge and the [TS]

00:52:26   person who has their stuff together [TS]

00:52:28   because no one else does and I i see a [TS]

00:52:32   lot of that in Calvin but yeah I mean I [TS]

00:52:35   think you're absolutely right in terms [TS]

00:52:36   of that's that is only one picture of [TS]

00:52:40   that kind of scenario in but in this in [TS]

00:52:44   this book I feel like a you know [TS]

00:52:46   Calvin's role is I mean it's kind of [TS]

00:52:49   interesting because they just kind of [TS]

00:52:50   run into him but I i feel like i mean [TS]

00:52:52   he's there to be part of the gang and to [TS]

00:52:54   be supportive and to be a love interest [TS]

00:52:56   you know it promise of a love interest [TS]

00:52:59   for Meg but i think is number one role [TS]

00:53:02   is to be like sort of like the twins but [TS]

00:53:06   but in that he's socially capable but [TS]

00:53:09   not like the twins and that we see with [TS]

00:53:12   him on and and they don't get to show [TS]

00:53:14   this in this book that that he really [TS]

00:53:17   does your inform or and that him being [TS]

00:53:18   popular is actually kind of a prison for [TS]

00:53:20   him and I feel like that's like the [TS]

00:53:23   really hit the own not the only the most [TS]

00:53:26   by far the most important thing that he [TS]

00:53:28   does in this book is just to be kind of [TS]

00:53:29   like a connection for Meg of you know [TS]

00:53:33   he's like her [TS]

00:53:34   the end just because he's popular [TS]

00:53:35   doesn't mean he's happy and doesn't mean [TS]

00:53:37   that you know he is secretly frankel [TS]

00:53:39   yeah yeah just another another color in [TS]

00:53:42   the in the in the palette of freakiness [TS]

00:53:46   well he's a grounding force in some ways [TS]

00:53:49   and then make becomes his grounding [TS]

00:53:51   force in terms of where they're holding [TS]

00:53:53   learning have their tests are acting [TS]

00:53:55   here when it you know going back to the [TS]

00:53:57   the thought of how much set up there is [TS]

00:54:00   it's also you know you sort of build [TS]

00:54:04   this sense of comfort with the [TS]

00:54:06   characters and with their lives so that [TS]

00:54:09   when they're ripped out of it and thrown [TS]

00:54:10   across the universe and everything it's [TS]

00:54:12   that much more dramatic because we've [TS]

00:54:15   we've gotten used to their family life [TS]

00:54:17   now too [TS]

00:54:18   that's why i love the first half of this [TS]

00:54:20   book it and i wouldn't complain about [TS]

00:54:21   the fact that it the the plot is crammed [TS]

00:54:25   into [TS]

00:54:25   like four chapters at the end in many [TS]

00:54:28   ways I mean in many ways it really is [TS]

00:54:30   it's like really they're going to [TS]

00:54:31   they're going to the planet now and at [TS]

00:54:33   last couple chapters like wow they're [TS]

00:54:34   going to result how are they going to [TS]

00:54:35   resolve this may do mr. Murray finally [TS]

00:54:37   gets ripped free and her was reunited [TS]

00:54:39   there's like three pages in their back [TS]

00:54:40   on their hillside behind the house y'all [TS]

00:54:42   well that's kinda gruff yeah but I don't [TS]

00:54:44   mind it because that the the first half [TS]

00:54:47   is so great and memorable and that the [TS]

00:54:50   scene setting I mean it is very [TS]

00:54:52   important it all pays off later but it's [TS]

00:54:54   very important to to get that it's [TS]

00:54:56   really enjoyable too i mean i really [TS]

00:54:57   enjoyed the length of time spent on the [TS]

00:55:02   midnight snack during the hurricane [TS]

00:55:05   yeah is ridiculous and it's great right [TS]

00:55:09   it's incredible detail Charles Wallace's [TS]

00:55:12   down their makers downstairs he's [TS]

00:55:13   waiting for her she figured he'd come [TS]

00:55:15   upstairs but he's like no I knew you'd [TS]

00:55:16   come down [TS]

00:55:17   he's got the liverwurst and cream cheese [TS]

00:55:18   sandwiches and the mom comes out and [TS]

00:55:20   he's ready for her and you know it [TS]

00:55:23   incredible detail they're totally not [TS]

00:55:25   necessary accepted paints that wonderful [TS]

00:55:27   picture of their relationships and where [TS]

00:55:29   there you know how they all interrelated [TS]

00:55:31   to each other in this family and and [TS]

00:55:33   that's for me that stuff was actually [TS]

00:55:35   the most memorable 20 30 40 years later [TS]

00:55:40   was that stuff and not not the pulsating [TS]

00:55:43   brain on a table which I didn't remember [TS]

00:55:44   it all the kid with the ball i [TS]

00:55:47   remembered that kid but I wanted to [TS]

00:55:50   publish those cameras ads for a book or [TS]

00:55:52   book contest and so I've always wrong [TS]

00:55:53   with that big being protective of [TS]

00:55:55   Charles Wallace is something that I get [TS]

00:55:57   stuck with me all that time she was the [TS]

00:55:59   big sister who's going to get in fights [TS]

00:56:01   with other kids who said mean things [TS]

00:56:03   about her little brother that bubbles [TS]

00:56:05   now as an adult [TS]

00:56:06   it made sense to me because I I being [TS]

00:56:08   more than a few kids who picked on my [TS]

00:56:09   brother because i was his older sister [TS]

00:56:12   and and it was but it was my job to [TS]

00:56:14   Kellerman losses but I I went back and I [TS]

00:56:19   realized there's like a 10-year age [TS]

00:56:20   difference into them and I thought what [TS]

00:56:22   the hell kind of time is she living [TS]

00:56:24   where people are making fun of [TS]

00:56:25   four-year-olds 222222 a teenager's face [TS]

00:56:29   I mean you know what what what on earth [TS]

00:56:31   i hear that the same kind of town where [TS]

00:56:34   her father supposedly has disappeared to [TS]

00:56:37   go for another one [TS]

00:56:38   I mean it's a small town that that [TS]

00:56:41   family is the talk right you know when [TS]

00:56:43   they're not like them they're not from [TS]

00:56:44   there they're not like them it's [TS]

00:56:45   probably the rest of them probably been [TS]

00:56:47   there and their parents were there and [TS]

00:56:48   all that I grew up in a town like that [TS]

00:56:49   right and it will end was not one of [TS]

00:56:52   those families [TS]

00:56:53   I so I totally I totally get that you're [TS]

00:56:56   right it may be a little stretch the [TS]

00:56:57   extreme although even then that whole [TS]

00:56:59   thing is we're going to know that they [TS]

00:57:01   got that little one he's not right in [TS]

00:57:03   the head he's got the very using the [TS]

00:57:05   books that clever people often have [TS]

00:57:07   subnormal children and I and I thought [TS]

00:57:09   this is how you can tell the book was [TS]

00:57:10   written during the sixties is some [TS]

00:57:11   normal is used as a perfectly acceptable [TS]

00:57:13   dessert before you leave [TS]

00:57:15   oh yeah well in reality of people [TS]

00:57:17   wouldn't use something that polite [TS]

00:57:19   school on the business well now i know i [TS]

00:57:21   should point out also just because I'm [TS]

00:57:23   like this that Sawyer is reading a [TS]

00:57:27   wrinkle in time in a couple episodes of [TS]

00:57:29   lost which also feels and features time [TS]

00:57:31   travel and discussion of of religion and [TS]

00:57:35   other similar topics religion and faith [TS]

00:57:38   and i thought i should mention that [TS]

00:57:40   because of course the books that the [TS]

00:57:42   characters on lost read are meaningful [TS]

00:57:44   because they're selected by the [TS]

00:57:45   producers and and then of course there's [TS]

00:57:48   time traveling at two so you know [TS]

00:57:50   believe there is a I'm an interview [TS]

00:57:53   somewhere that said that wrinkle in time [TS]

00:57:55   was actually a weirdly big influence on [TS]

00:57:57   lost in some ways yeah you can see [TS]

00:58:00   yep yep I think so also i'm looking at a [TS]

00:58:03   google image search for a wrinkle in [TS]

00:58:04   time and I found like 80 different [TS]

00:58:07   covers because every edition of its [TS]

00:58:09   somebody's like hey let's Commission [TS]

00:58:11   illustration and some illustrator goes [TS]

00:58:12   flying horse angel people beside me up [TS]

00:58:16   and then they do this dreamed it and [TS]

00:58:18   there are so many so many here it's [TS]

00:58:23   amazing [TS]

00:58:24   including mine where they where he [TS]

00:58:25   stabbed in the back with a rainbow not [TS]

00:58:28   the best piece of art I do like that [TS]

00:58:30   they don't bother to show the people if [TS]

00:58:31   they show more the supernatural things [TS]

00:58:33   because i think it does let children and [TS]

00:58:35   adults my copies got kids riding on the [TS]

00:58:38   back of the rainbow [TS]

00:58:40   oh SI mi doesn't um although my copy of [TS]

00:58:42   a swiftly tilting planet features the [TS]

00:58:45   teenage Charles Wallace who look at [TS]

00:58:47   mighty seventies and a pair of Flair's [TS]

00:58:49   and chuck highlights in my pants [TS]

00:58:51   if you're almost back of feathered hair [TS]

00:58:53   thing yeah and he's riding like he's [TS]

00:58:55   reading gaudy or the unicorn and it is [TS]

00:58:57   the most glorious and Carter you're a [TS]

00:58:59   picture i have ever seen in my life [TS]

00:59:01   it's i love that cover so much so hope [TS]

00:59:04   Larson is far from the first person who [TS]

00:59:06   had to actually add adapt she just had [TS]

00:59:08   to tell the story where is everybody [TS]

00:59:09   else gotta got to say hey I'll have a [TS]

00:59:11   i'll have a rainbow centaur flying over [TS]

00:59:14   at all Mountain does that this super [TS]

00:59:16   cool maybe we'll be buying inspired the [TS]

00:59:21   if that's right i'll do that whereas the [TS]

00:59:23   wrinkly time graphic novel cover is the [TS]

00:59:25   kids [TS]

00:59:26   yeah and the stars and the stars and the [TS]

00:59:29   end and kind of a black hole it's all i [TS]

00:59:32   really love how they do it because [TS]

00:59:34   you've got the there's about two thirds [TS]

00:59:36   of the way down the hardcover copy that [TS]

00:59:38   I've got there's this this this [TS]

00:59:39   luminescent blue band and it goes from [TS]

00:59:42   these these silhouettes of the children [TS]

00:59:44   to the closeup of their faces they're [TS]

00:59:46   reacting where Meg looks a little um [TS]

00:59:48   weary and Calvin looks openly stunned [TS]

00:59:51   but Charles Wallace's just kind of [TS]

00:59:52   common looking around and I love the [TS]

00:59:53   juxtaposition of their faces and [TS]

00:59:56   postures with their little silhouettes I [TS]

00:59:59   think it is a good job [TS]

00:59:59   think it is a good job [TS]

01:00:00   um demonstrated the inter the the short [TS]

01:00:03   and long journeys they had to take this [TS]

01:00:05   is your cover the one that's got the [TS]

01:00:07   gets got the Centaur person flying and [TS]

01:00:09   below there's like a brain with red eyes [TS]

01:00:11   in a bubble yes yes that is super creepy [TS]

01:00:14   isn't it doesn't just know what your [TS]

01:00:18   fourth grader like this is the greatest [TS]

01:00:19   yeah that's super scary know mine mine [TS]

01:00:23   google image search you have to go down [TS]

01:00:25   like about five rows to see this yellow [TS]

01:00:27   cover with a with a rain big rainbow at [TS]

01:00:31   the top and flowers at the bottom [TS]

01:00:32   because they give her to give him the [TS]

01:00:34   flowers to breathe [TS]

01:00:35   I get how that's right they do that on [TS]

01:00:37   the planet ok i was in the planets are [TS]

01:00:39   sending you 3000 Uriel yes [TS]

01:00:43   yeah plenty on your own so what I don't [TS]

01:00:47   like is there really 1960s one we're all [TS]

01:00:49   just the nuclei of atoms that's I I've [TS]

01:00:51   never cared for that matter [TS]

01:00:52   yeah that's it yeah it's kinda cool from [TS]

01:00:56   our perspective that I don't think I oh [TS]

01:00:58   I know what you're talking about [TS]

01:01:00   oh the rainbow yeah no wings at all just [TS]

01:01:05   a rainbow know he's been flying by rebo [TS]

01:01:08   you can hold on hook from that window in [TS]

01:01:12   your sliding glass door [TS]

01:01:14   not after yeah I actually if you could [TS]

01:01:16   well it's actually a stained-glass for [TS]

01:01:18   you you put the stained-glass pellets in [TS]

01:01:20   and bake it and then you hit accept [TS]

01:01:23   because that's going to during the [TS]

01:01:24   eighties as well around the same time [TS]

01:01:25   yeah so we're almost at the end of our [TS]

01:01:27   time but what topics haven't we covered [TS]

01:01:29   that you would like to discuss before we [TS]

01:01:30   can well since you brought up laws [TS]

01:01:32   tonight I want to bring an idea book [TS]

01:01:36   that won the newbery in 2010 called when [TS]

01:01:40   you reach me by Rebecca stead which she [TS]

01:01:44   had said point blank wrinkle in time was [TS]

01:01:47   heard main influence and on this book [TS]

01:01:49   and it's it's also about a young teenage [TS]

01:01:53   girl also very similar to Meg in the [TS]

01:01:56   late seventies and it also involves time [TS]

01:02:00   travel and I want standing room but and [TS]

01:02:02   and the character is reading wrinkle in [TS]

01:02:04   time throughout the book and and with [TS]

01:02:07   when she finishes reading it [TS]

01:02:08   she starts reading it again and it's a [TS]

01:02:11   really interesting [TS]

01:02:13   book to read in companion ship to at [TS]

01:02:16   least the the first book of the the time [TS]

01:02:20   quintet I guess it is now is now and it [TS]

01:02:25   you know I picked it up because like [TS]

01:02:27   well I'm i'll check it out before my [TS]

01:02:29   kids try reading it and I couldn't put [TS]

01:02:32   it down it was great and it's one of the [TS]

01:02:34   few books that my eleven-year-old he [TS]

01:02:36   does not read books where girls are the [TS]

01:02:38   heroes and heroines and he read this [TS]

01:02:41   when damn that's good but yes that is [TS]

01:02:45   like a doctor who kind of things like [TS]

01:02:46   it's like a doctor who puzzle so I'm [TS]

01:02:50   still working on him with wrinkle you'll [TS]

01:02:51   get there if you like that one [TS]

01:02:53   oh yeah maybe ok and his best friend is [TS]

01:02:55   reading it right too so that helps [TS]

01:02:58   well I have to say it was a it was great [TS]

01:03:01   I i read the graphic novel checked it [TS]

01:03:03   out from my local library books are [TS]

01:03:05   available for free at the library this [TS]

01:03:08   episode brought to you by the library [TS]

01:03:10   mom and I and then of course i had my [TS]

01:03:15   wife's copy bad copy which is which is [TS]

01:03:18   it was fated that we were going to be [TS]

01:03:19   together because we have the same [TS]

01:03:21   edition exactly with the rainbow and [TS]

01:03:25   flowers and it was so much fun to [TS]

01:03:27   revisit this because all I did have were [TS]

01:03:29   these misty water-colored memories of of [TS]

01:03:32   the way I was and I was really afraid [TS]

01:03:35   that I was gonna go back to the book and [TS]

01:03:37   and and be really disappointed because [TS]

01:03:41   there's so many things you revisit from [TS]

01:03:43   childhood that are disappointing in [TS]

01:03:44   hindsight that that as an adult you [TS]

01:03:46   reading like oh this isn't that good and [TS]

01:03:48   i gotta say I i really liked it and I I [TS]

01:03:52   i thought it i thought well my kids [TS]

01:03:54   should read this this is this is good [TS]

01:03:55   this is actually it's sci-fi but it's [TS]

01:03:58   gentle and it's got these interesting [TS]

01:04:00   other aspects to it and it's and it's [TS]

01:04:03   you know the characters are really good [TS]

01:04:05   i I you know I i didn't have enough [TS]

01:04:08   nostalgia for it to just be a nostalgia [TS]

01:04:11   trip I really was taking a chance of [TS]

01:04:14   invalidating my fond memories of it and [TS]

01:04:17   it didn't say i was very happy with it [TS]

01:04:20   and then the graphic novel this [TS]

01:04:21   fantastic too so I I you know for me [TS]

01:04:23   this was a great [TS]

01:04:25   visit back to this this material that i [TS]

01:04:28   hadn't you know experienced since 1980 [TS]

01:04:31   how about you guys [TS]

01:04:33   I love this book so much for getting [TS]

01:04:35   that from you yet know and and the thing [TS]

01:04:39   is it's it's I pulled out of my [TS]

01:04:40   daughter's bookcase before I put her [TS]

01:04:41   down to bed tonight and I think honestly [TS]

01:04:44   I'm just going to keep it in the [TS]

01:04:46   bookcase along with the graphic novel [TS]

01:04:47   and butter discovered on her own as well [TS]

01:04:50   I don't want to push the books i love [TS]

01:04:51   down her throat because I don't want I [TS]

01:04:55   don't want to have a complicated reveal [TS]

01:04:56   my mom likes this [TS]

01:04:58   you know or or to feel like she has to [TS]

01:04:59   like it because i like it so I think one [TS]

01:05:02   of the hardest things are going to have [TS]

01:05:03   to do in terms of cultural [TS]

01:05:04   indoctrinating my kids just keep my [TS]

01:05:05   hands keep keep my hands back and let [TS]

01:05:07   her discover this yourself [TS]

01:05:08   yep i still i think i've read a wrinkle [TS]

01:05:12   in time six seven times maybe over the [TS]

01:05:14   course of the last 30 years and i still [TS]

01:05:18   find something new every time I read it [TS]

01:05:20   and like jason said sometimes when you [TS]

01:05:23   go back to that the the books are you [TS]

01:05:25   thinking back and read them and you're [TS]

01:05:26   like holy cow have a mountain of center [TS]

01:05:28   oh my god like come back and recently [TS]

01:05:30   read The Chronicles of Narnia because [TS]

01:05:32   again i have those my daughter's [TS]

01:05:33   bookcase waiting for her and I got to [TS]

01:05:36   the last battle at all [TS]

01:05:37   wow those those Calormenes are holy [TS]

01:05:41   Moses if I were is if I removal may be [TS]

01:05:43   furious [TS]

01:05:44   yeah yeah yes or I'm similarly i have [TS]

01:05:48   girlfriends who are reading little house [TS]

01:05:50   at the little house that oh man with [TS]

01:05:53   their daughters and they're like those [TS]

01:05:55   books are incredibly problematic like oh [TS]

01:05:57   how Sony went back an old now I see how [TS]

01:05:59   so [TS]

01:06:00   I'm they are but uh huh and yeah and I [TS]

01:06:03   don't know if it's because my love for [TS]

01:06:05   this book is all it is is is incredibly [TS]

01:06:07   rational and still tied into the 10 year [TS]

01:06:10   old who write it [TS]

01:06:10   I'm just until i'm here to tell you it's [TS]

01:06:12   not yeah I hear to validate your choices [TS]

01:06:16   Lisa for things i can see they're [TS]

01:06:18   basically relics of of the early sixties [TS]

01:06:20   or of the time was pushing wrote it you [TS]

01:06:22   know a lot of the lines that she's [TS]

01:06:23   choosing sure the tramp is the one that [TS]

01:06:26   gets me it's like yeah you gotta update [TS]

01:06:28   that because nobody's nobody's going to [TS]

01:06:29   be talking about the train there's a [TS]

01:06:31   tramp that was seen around down [TS]

01:06:33   yes yes but they're no longer answer [TS]

01:06:35   homeless people here home [TS]

01:06:36   people yes or when they refer to Charles [TS]

01:06:39   Wallace is a moron affectionately I'm [TS]

01:06:41   like oh my gosh maybe not yeah but you [TS]

01:06:45   so so I find some of the the cultural [TS]

01:06:48   artifacts to be interesting but all my [TS]

01:06:49   gosh [TS]

01:06:50   every time I read this book i'm always [TS]

01:06:51   glad that I did I don't have that same [TS]

01:06:53   crunchy Oh or or oh my gosh it's you wow [TS]

01:06:57   I had no idea this was you know racist [TS]

01:06:59   or or not of course I should point out [TS]

01:07:03   here that it's easy to sidestep the the [TS]

01:07:06   the multicultural questions in this book [TS]

01:07:08   because it's a fairly homogenous group [TS]

01:07:10   of of people who do the time travel and [TS]

01:07:13   even they run into other cultures it's [TS]

01:07:15   are incredibly respectful and and that [TS]

01:07:17   said i would love to see how the Murray [TS]

01:07:19   family does negotiate the streets of New [TS]

01:07:20   York City anointing sixties but but no I [TS]

01:07:25   just I like this is probably in my top [TS]

01:07:27   five books of all times so it's a little [TS]

01:07:31   difficult for me to be able to apply [TS]

01:07:32   critical faculties to because i suspect [TS]

01:07:34   i have not wear this book is concerned [TS]

01:07:36   it might from my perspective it passes [TS]

01:07:38   you what i like to call the scooby-doo [TS]

01:07:40   test which is scooby-doo is the thing [TS]

01:07:43   that I watched a lot of them i saw an [TS]

01:07:44   episode my thought oh my god it's [TS]

01:07:46   terrible i think that brands all really [TS]

01:07:48   animated and poorly written and awful [TS]

01:07:50   right and something you don't don't [TS]

01:07:52   revisit your past things but this one [TS]

01:07:53   held up for me David [TS]

01:07:55   what about you yeah it's it's one of [TS]

01:07:57   those books that you know when there are [TS]

01:08:01   a couple of books and films and things [TS]

01:08:02   that just bring back my mother right and [TS]

01:08:06   and you know even just like passages or [TS]

01:08:10   quotes or something and you know when i [TS]

01:08:12   find myself writing something that [TS]

01:08:14   either she might have written or or that [TS]

01:08:18   you would love you know it just sort of [TS]

01:08:19   hits me like a ton of bricks and this is [TS]

01:08:23   one of those books and so again you know [TS]

01:08:26   I don't know how much critic faculty i [TS]

01:08:28   have for it either [TS]

01:08:29   yeah you know I mean picking up the [TS]

01:08:32   graphic novel I just pounded through it [TS]

01:08:35   i mean it I didn't put it down oh yeah [TS]

01:08:37   mayor and then you know picking up the [TS]

01:08:39   book itself [TS]

01:08:41   same thing and and so yeah I i think i [TS]

01:08:46   think it works beyond my own attachment [TS]

01:08:48   to it and yeah it'll be interesting to [TS]

01:08:52   see what my kids do with it if they do [TS]

01:08:54   with it [TS]

01:08:55   how are you planning on are you hoping [TS]

01:08:57   we'll just pick it up on their own one [TS]

01:08:58   day or are you going to say hey I really [TS]

01:09:00   like this you might too [TS]

01:09:01   well you know I being a writer and being [TS]

01:09:04   married to a librarian our houses like [TS]

01:09:06   pretty much just books right and brought [TS]

01:09:08   to you by library party by libraries [TS]

01:09:10   grandmother buzzer buzzer Oliver [TS]

01:09:14   children brought to you by librarians [TS]

01:09:15   and yes it's true you're somebody bout [TS]

01:09:18   with you and so you know their books [TS]

01:09:21   that we just have around and I've I've [TS]

01:09:23   told told them you know you can read [TS]

01:09:26   anything you want in this house you know [TS]

01:09:28   if it's if it's not necessarily a kids [TS]

01:09:30   book will talk about it but you know [TS]

01:09:32   there's nothing off-limits because [TS]

01:09:34   that's how I grew up to but yeah I mean [TS]

01:09:36   their books we just leave around and [TS]

01:09:37   they'll pick up and they find [TS]

01:09:38   interesting or their books that they'll [TS]

01:09:40   hear about in school and go home wait i [TS]

01:09:42   have that at home and but then there are [TS]

01:09:44   other books that they'll actually say [TS]

01:09:46   you know what is this why is this here [TS]

01:09:48   you know so when they see all the Harry [TS]

01:09:50   Potter books on the shelf and wrinkle in [TS]

01:09:52   time what does that mean [TS]

01:09:54   and i think i think the first time are [TS]

01:09:57   younger son saw his immediate reaction [TS]

01:09:59   was dr who that's a doctor who title as [TS]

01:10:03   well no not exactly but then you know I [TS]

01:10:07   you I was telling telling the millions [TS]

01:10:09   this was my grandma's favorite books and [TS]

01:10:12   they went and that's that's sort of like [TS]

01:10:15   that shortcut trigger 20 i need to read [TS]

01:10:19   that then gets grandma thought it was [TS]

01:10:20   cool because you know they they didn't [TS]

01:10:24   get to know her as long as I did [TS]

01:10:25   obviously but they still want that [TS]

01:10:27   connection to her to go home [TS]

01:10:29   ok this will help solve questions that i [TS]

01:10:32   might have about her and and how they [TS]

01:10:35   what what she did to make my dad the way [TS]

01:10:38   he is you uh how but yeah for the most [TS]

01:10:43   part we just sort of let them discover [TS]

01:10:46   and it's it's fun to watch them go meet [TS]

01:10:51   you read this [TS]

01:10:52   well it's in my house son yes I read it [TS]

01:10:55   at some point [TS]

01:10:56   yeah I think I maybe having enjoyed it [TS]

01:10:58   now i may be a little more active and [TS]

01:11:00   suggesting that my daughter read it and [TS]

01:11:03   my son I might actually suggest you look [TS]

01:11:04   at the graphic novel because he tears [TS]

01:11:06   through graphic novels to read how about [TS]

01:11:09   you help us in a how does it hold up on [TS]

01:11:12   revisiting wonderfully and I'm I mean [TS]

01:11:15   it's probably no surprise the the [TS]

01:11:17   graphic novel has been either a [TS]

01:11:20   christmas gift to friends or a you know [TS]

01:11:24   if I if I have somebody who needs a [TS]

01:11:26   christmas gift they're getting a copy of [TS]

01:11:28   the graphic novel is basically been my [TS]

01:11:30   way of you've never read wrinkle in time [TS]

01:11:33   here try to miss this [TS]

01:11:35   yes he had you like it I promise and one [TS]

01:11:41   of us what would you like to sign up for [TS]

01:11:45   my newsletter and waving he likes to [TS]

01:11:47   throw a ball in tandem for a longer [TS]

01:11:50   yes you can skip rope with you enjoy [TS]

01:11:53   this lovely did tasty turkey dinner with [TS]

01:11:58   gravy and trimmings [TS]

01:12:00   ya know it stands up wonderfully I i [TS]

01:12:04   really love this story i love her [TS]

01:12:07   writing there are so few authors that i [TS]

01:12:10   can think of that immediately spring to [TS]

01:12:12   mind where their 400-page books there [TS]

01:12:15   you know 200-page books are just 200 [TS]

01:12:18   pages of poetry and 200 pages of imagery [TS]

01:12:20   and Ray Bradbury is one and Madeline [TS]

01:12:23   Langille is another and I I mean the her [TS]

01:12:28   her books are one of I did not bring a [TS]

01:12:31   lot of books from Los Angeles when i [TS]

01:12:33   moved across the country back to Boston [TS]

01:12:36   I've still had them all in a box waiting [TS]

01:12:39   to be shipped but he probably says [TS]

01:12:41   something that her books my ray bradbury [TS]

01:12:44   books and my diana wynne jones books are [TS]

01:12:46   the the one sitting on my nightstand [TS]

01:12:48   right now [TS]

01:12:49   well this has been a fantastic change of [TS]

01:12:54   pace I think for the uncomfortable to do [TS]

01:12:55   this sort of combination of a classic [TS]

01:12:58   book from our childhood and they a [TS]

01:13:00   modern graphic novel retailing which is [TS]

01:13:02   still has been a lot of fun to to [TS]

01:13:04   revisit and we are [TS]

01:13:05   44 in not being disappointed by [TS]

01:13:07   revisiting it which is also a good sign [TS]

01:13:09   and not trample on those wonderful [TS]

01:13:11   childhood memories but have them [TS]

01:13:12   reaffirmed so yay for us until the next [TS]

01:13:17   year until the next edition of the [TS]

01:13:19   incomparable I'd like to thank my guests [TS]

01:13:22   for being on this journey with me Lisa [TS]

01:13:24   Schmeisser great to have you as always [TS]

01:13:26   this is so much fun uncle it really was [TS]

01:13:28   serenity called well thank you to thank [TS]

01:13:31   you always a pleasure and David Laura [TS]

01:13:34   was great to have you on an actual [TS]

01:13:35   episode was great to be here thank you [TS]

01:13:37   thank you for coming and i'm jason l [TS]

01:13:41   your host as always thank you for [TS]

01:13:43   listening everybody will see you next [TS]

01:13:44   time [TS]