Roderick on the Line

01:00:00 ◼   ► he's definitely shaking and when I saw [TS]

01:00:02 ◼   ► them in 1999 I thought it was just [TS]

01:00:03 ◼   ► terrific there there was a there's a [TS]

01:00:08 ◼   ► famous moment indelibly burned into my [TS]

01:00:10 ◼   ► head of us on tour with Death Cab in 98 [TS]

01:00:19 ◼   ► hurricane hurricane and we're in Arizona [TS]

01:00:24 ◼   ► we're at a show in you know like at at [TS]

01:00:28 ◼   ► some strip mall in Phoenix and death [TS]

01:00:34 ◼   ► cabs on stage and it's not a stage right [TS]

01:00:37 ◼   ► it's like a cement floor dais [TS]

01:00:40 ◼   ► yeah where they took the PA or they took [TS]

01:00:42 ◼   ► the they took like your practice PA but [TS]

01:00:45 ◼   ► they turned it around to the audience [TS]

01:00:46 ◼   ► and we're we're there watching them play [TS]

01:00:50 ◼   ► and their merch guy a guy named little [TS]

01:00:53 ◼   ► Rob everybody just called him little Rob [TS]

01:00:56 ◼   ► Li L he starts to do the Ben Gibbard [TS]

01:01:03 ◼   ► guitar dance and you know we're at weird [TS]

01:01:09 ◼   ► view of the stage and he's just [TS]

01:01:11 ◼   ► perfectly but he's not even looking at [TS]

01:01:14 ◼   ► the stage he's got his back to them but [TS]

01:01:17 ◼   ► he's just perfectly doing that that [TS]

01:01:20 ◼   ► thing that you're describing like [TS]

01:01:22 ◼   ► shuffle swing it is like he's spent [TS]

01:01:26 ◼   ► slightly back and his shoulders are [TS]

01:01:28 ◼   ► moving in compliment with the way that [TS]

01:01:30 ◼   ► his hips are moving with a very wide [TS]

01:01:32 ◼   ► open posture mm-hmm and the guitar is a [TS]

01:01:35 ◼   ► component of it and it's yeah it's like [TS]

01:01:38 ◼   ► it's like Elvis if you left all the [TS]

01:01:41 ◼   ► hangers in this in his suits and and and [TS]

01:01:46 ◼   ► it's just like we all from that point on [TS]

01:01:49 ◼   ► we all tried to perfect [TS]

01:01:51 ◼   ► after seeing will Rob do such a great [TS]

01:01:53 ◼   ► job of it we all try to perfect our Ben [TS]

01:01:55 ◼   ► Gibbard dance and I think there's I [TS]

01:01:58 ◼   ► think I'll I'll hop into it once or [TS]

01:02:00 ◼   ► twice during a set just it just is a [TS]

01:02:03 ◼   ► little homage or the tip of the hat to a [TS]

01:02:06 ◼   ► little kind of like one two one two [TS]

01:02:09 ◼   ► I think I think that the the music video [TS]

01:02:12 ◼   ► for flock of seagulls the the first two [TS]

01:02:14 ◼   ► videos they caused such a sensation [TS]

01:02:16 ◼   ► because of that guy's hair yeah that it [TS]

01:02:19 ◼   ► he's remembered for having the swoopy [TS]

01:02:21 ◼   ► hair from the second video but in the [TS]

01:02:22 ◼   ► first one oh god there's a phrase I [TS]

01:02:25 ◼   ► can't use anymore [TS]

01:02:25 ◼   ► um more art school hair one would say [TS]

01:02:29 ◼   ► and and yeah that meet me at McDonald's [TS]

01:02:32 ◼   ► kind of haircut he's got like the he's [TS]

01:02:33 ◼   ► got the swirly I can kind of up on top [TS]

01:02:35 ◼   ► and then you got the camera with the [TS]

01:02:36 ◼   ► garbage bag like garbage bags in that [TS]

01:02:38 ◼   ► video well that was a that was an easy [TS]

01:02:40 ◼   ► special effect to use in garbage bags [TS]

01:02:45 ◼   ► and then you take a couple of box fans [TS]

01:02:48 ◼   ► [Laughter] [TS]

01:02:52 ◼   ► [Music] [TS]

01:02:54 ◼   ► you can't see me doing this he's holding [TS]

01:02:56 ◼   ► down like like in like a probably an a [TS]

01:02:59 ◼   ► with one finger and then he's the other [TS]

01:03:02 ◼   ► fingers way up in the air but there's [TS]

01:03:10 ◼   ► been that had three great Tunes oh yes [TS]

01:03:13 ◼   ► this is love song is legitimately good [TS]

01:03:15 ◼   ► song but they're like not in that [TS]

01:03:17 ◼   ► they're not thought of in that serious [TS]

01:03:20 ◼   ► rank of 80s you know they're those songs [TS]

01:03:22 ◼   ► are as good as any Gary Numan tune oh I [TS]

01:03:25 ◼   ► see yeah yeah I get what you're saying [TS]

01:03:27 ◼   ► yeah yeah we're like there was this this [TS]

01:03:29 ◼   ► Rat King of like especially English like [TS]

01:03:31 ◼   ► new wave bands and New Romantic bands [TS]

01:03:33 ◼   ► and like some of them are much it's much [TS]

01:03:36 ◼   ► cooler to still like this band than that [TS]

01:03:38 ◼   ► band I mean it's hard I mean you know [TS]

01:03:41 ◼   ► soft-sell was serious but Culture Club [TS]

01:03:46 ◼   ► was not and it's a little and it has a [TS]

01:03:49 ◼   ► lot to do with hair style that I think [TS]

01:03:52 ◼   ► now maybe even now with the [TS]

01:03:54 ◼   ► proliferation Altima proliferation of [TS]

01:03:57 ◼   ► images that we have I think you would be [TS]

01:04:02 ◼   ► less influenced by how a band looked [TS]

01:04:05 ◼   ► then we were in 1983 watching those [TS]

01:04:08 ◼   ► music videos discount something that is [TS]

01:04:11 ◼   ► a third rail but should be discussed at [TS]

01:04:14 ◼   ► least living in Florida I am NOT proud [TS]

01:04:16 ◼   ► of this by a longshot but there was also [TS]

01:04:18 ◼   ► a lot of consideration about [TS]

01:04:22 ◼   ► I don't know how to use this word [TS]

01:04:24 ◼   ► whether they seemed gay and I don't mean [TS]

01:04:27 ◼   ► that they they like people of the same [TS]

01:04:29 ◼   ► gender [TS]

01:04:29 ◼   ► sexually I just meant they're people [TS]

01:04:32 ◼   ► like the people who are listening to [TS]

01:04:33 ◼   ► Lynyrd Skynyrd would see that you were [TS]

01:04:35 ◼   ► into mark almond and that seemed kind of [TS]

01:04:36 ◼   ► gay and I think I think that had a huge [TS]

01:04:39 ◼   ► effect in a lot of ways even with like [TS]

01:04:42 ◼   ► Duran Duran like you like oh these guys [TS]

01:04:43 ◼   ► are so fruity and that was you'd feel [TS]

01:04:46 ◼   ► like a little East I felt like a little [TS]

01:04:47 ◼   ► twinge of like oh I don't know if it's [TS]

01:04:48 ◼   ► okay to be into this Dan because they're [TS]

01:04:50 ◼   ► not tough and cool which is weird [TS]

01:04:52 ◼   ► considering that Bon Jovi you know like [TS]

01:04:56 ◼   ► there's an awful lot of signaling in Bon [TS]

01:05:00 ◼   ► Jovi that is directed at you know it's [TS]

01:05:04 ◼   ► like the the transition that bands made [TS]

01:05:07 ◼   ► to because I mean even Van Halen [TS]

01:05:10 ◼   ► absolutely in the mid 70s you know [TS]

01:05:12 ◼   ► there's that famous story where van [TS]

01:05:15 ◼   ► Halen played like big day out in Texas [TS]

01:05:18 ◼   ► where all the other bands were Molly [TS]

01:05:21 ◼   ► Hatchet and ZZ Top and it was they [TS]

01:05:25 ◼   ► probably seemed everybody but Mike [TS]

01:05:26 ◼   ► probably seems very androgynous for the [TS]

01:05:28 ◼   ► time well it freaked him out the people [TS]

01:05:31 ◼   ► the folks in Texas who were just like [TS]

01:05:32 ◼   ► that rock and roll concert and it was [TS]

01:05:35 ◼   ► like everybody else was in denim and [TS]

01:05:37 ◼   ► cowboy boots right and out comes van [TS]

01:05:39 ◼   ► Halen just like yeah yeah you know it's [TS]

01:05:49 ◼   ► very very like unapologetically [TS]

01:05:51 ◼   ► California at the very least but I do [TS]

01:05:54 ◼   ► think there was also I mean music was so [TS]

01:05:58 ◼   ► it was so siloed the difference between [TS]

01:06:02 ◼   ► a band that was for girls and for boys [TS]

01:06:05 ◼   ► was really big for me like I had a [TS]

01:06:10 ◼   ► really hard this is one of the things [TS]

01:06:12 ◼   ► one of the reasons that I never got into [TS]

01:06:15 ◼   ► the Smiths was I just felt like the [TS]

01:06:17 ◼   ► Smiths was my sister's band and that [TS]

01:06:21 ◼   ► style of singing in that style of [TS]

01:06:23 ◼   ► looking and that style of being was [TS]

01:06:27 ◼   ► pandering to girls and it wasn't serious [TS]

01:06:31 ◼   ► it wasn't like serious minded because it [TS]

01:06:35 ◼   ► was so true [TS]

01:06:36 ◼   ► parents to me that it was meant to make [TS]

01:06:40 ◼   ► teenage girls cry and I could I was just [TS]

01:06:45 ◼   ► not in and it might have been a hundred [TS]

01:06:47 ◼   ► percent different if I had known one [TS]

01:06:49 ◼   ► person who said this is really serious [TS]

01:06:52 ◼   ► music but as it was it was just like it [TS]

01:06:56 ◼   ► just felt it felt like the Smiths were [TS]

01:07:01 ◼   ► pandering were like a were an extension [TS]

01:07:03 ◼   ► of Duran Duran right you think you think [TS]

01:07:06 ◼   ► about like Paul Young would be one you [TS]

01:07:08 ◼   ► already know Culture Club Paul Young but [TS]

01:07:11 ◼   ► you know Paul Young had some really some [TS]

01:07:12 ◼   ► some pretty like was a song I don't you [TS]

01:07:15 ◼   ► come back and like he had some really [TS]

01:07:17 ◼   ► good pop songs and he did that that [TS]

01:07:19 ◼   ► weird Joy Division cover but you're [TS]

01:07:22 ◼   ► right there were there were ones that [TS]

01:07:23 ◼   ► felt like there were bands for boys and [TS]

01:07:24 ◼   ► pants for girls right you know like [TS]

01:07:26 ◼   ► that's Steely Dan being an extreme [TS]

01:07:28 ◼   ► example but yeah I totally agree but [TS]

01:07:33 ◼   ► like now when you look back like there [TS]

01:07:34 ◼   ► do seem to be these bands that like in [TS]

01:07:36 ◼   ► retrospect I think a huge one that [TS]

01:07:38 ◼   ► nobody talks about much is like screw D [TS]

01:07:39 ◼   ► politi but there are these bands that [TS]

01:07:41 ◼   ► age surprisingly well that like at the [TS]

01:07:44 ◼   ► time you might have thought oh this is [TS]

01:07:45 ◼   ► pretty pretty light light pop but you [TS]

01:07:47 ◼   ► know it does stand up we talked about [TS]

01:07:49 ◼   ► this once before was it here on another [TS]

01:07:51 ◼   ► show where I made this playlist of like [TS]

01:07:53 ◼   ► I'll put it in well we don't have chance [TS]

01:07:54 ◼   ► for the show I'll put it in anyway but [TS]

01:07:56 ◼   ► list of like a new wave that still [TS]

01:07:57 ◼   ► stands up in my opinion like where the [TS]

01:07:59 ◼   ► songs have good bones or where they were [TS]

01:08:01 ◼   ► doing something that was new and [TS]

01:08:03 ◼   ► substantial like I think there's there's [TS]

01:08:05 ◼   ► still so much stuff from there but [TS]

01:08:06 ◼   ► you're right that the gender stuff and [TS]

01:08:08 ◼   ► the sexual politics stuff was was giant [TS]

01:08:10 ◼   ► I mean like you're not gonna want the [TS]

01:08:13 ◼   ► time you could not be a straight guy in [TS]

01:08:15 ◼   ► Florida who was really into Tom Robinson [TS]

01:08:16 ◼   ► band publicly like that was not gonna [TS]

01:08:18 ◼   ► happen [TS]

01:08:19 ◼   ► haircut 100 is an example of a band that [TS]

01:08:22 ◼   ► was really very very very put together [TS]

01:08:27 ◼   ► that's that a lot going on like stuff [TS]

01:08:30 ◼   ► going on totally but like a but but yeah [TS]

01:08:34 ◼   ► there were a million reasons why you [TS]

01:08:35 ◼   ► would look at that and say that's a band [TS]

01:08:37 ◼   ► for girls absolutely in fact it was like [TS]

01:08:40 ◼   ► there were even then like I was really [TS]

01:08:43 ◼   ► into the song so you know there was [TS]

01:08:45 ◼   ► always it was always like a [TS]

01:08:49 ◼   ► you could go either way and I think I [TS]

01:08:51 ◼   ► always even when flock of seagulls was [TS]

01:08:53 ◼   ► the most reviled I could not get away [TS]

01:08:57 ◼   ► from the power of their hooks I always [TS]

01:09:00 ◼   ► what they were doing I mean they were [TS]

01:09:02 ◼   ► doing what they intended to do very well [TS]

01:09:04 ◼   ► you know here's another one I'm just [TS]

01:09:06 ◼   ► gonna send it I don't know I'm not sure [TS]

01:09:08 ◼   ► what the critical reputation at this [TS]

01:09:09 ◼   ► point is this is as much - Trevor Horn [TS]

01:09:11 ◼   ► as anybody but go back and listen to the [TS]

01:09:13 ◼   ► title song from the look of love by ABC [TS]

01:09:15 ◼   ► that's a look that's the look the look [TS]

01:09:17 ◼   ► of love is such a very finely crafted [TS]

01:09:20 ◼   ► and executed pop song it's it's got [TS]

01:09:23 ◼   ► parts it's got hooks and hooks and more [TS]

01:09:25 ◼   ► hooks it's it's just it's it's such a [TS]

01:09:27 ◼   ► beautiful I don't say a masterpiece but [TS]

01:09:29 ◼   ► it's such a piece of work as a pop song [TS]

01:09:31 ◼   ► I know it I know it's probably true but [TS]

01:09:34 ◼   ► I could ABC was in my list of no thank [TS]

01:09:37 ◼   ► you [TS]

01:09:38 ◼   ► right right over there with men without [TS]

01:09:39 ◼   ► hats I didn't want either thing and it [TS]

01:09:45 ◼   ► didn't matter how much you you said like [TS]

01:09:48 ◼   ► ABC they're amazing because I knew they [TS]

01:09:49 ◼   ► were even then you could tell that they [TS]

01:09:51 ◼   ► were like dynamite yeah but I can't tell [TS]

01:09:55 ◼   ► me how Hollywood another Trevor Horn [TS]

01:10:02 ◼   ► joint loved Frankie just the honking [TS]

01:10:05 ◼   ► this cuz that was just a little bit [TS]

01:10:07 ◼   ► later that was like what 84 85 well no [TS]

01:10:09 ◼   ► because Frankie had so much attitude [TS]

01:10:12 ◼   ► they said relax and it felt like [TS]

01:10:15 ◼   ► watching them at least felt like a like [TS]

01:10:18 ◼   ► a gang like Adam in the ants right where [TS]

01:10:20 ◼   ► Frankie him Frankie and they seemed is [TS]

01:10:22 ◼   ► he dangerous fouling the neighborhood [TS]

01:10:26 ◼   ► but they were also like super [TS]

01:10:28 ◼   ► unapologetically gay and openly gay in a [TS]

01:10:30 ◼   ► way that was aggressively gay that took [TS]

01:10:33 ◼   ► that was like headline-grabbing mmm-hmm [TS]

01:10:36 ◼   ► and it just felt like yeah fuck you [TS]

01:10:37 ◼   ► that's right goddamn right and I just [TS]

01:10:39 ◼   ► felt like their Tunes were were I mean [TS]

01:10:43 ◼   ► it's hard to say they were I mean the [TS]

01:10:45 ◼   ► truth is like again Trevor Horn like the [TS]

01:10:47 ◼   ► stuff that that guy has done for for [TS]

01:10:49 ◼   ► bands is you know in that case I mean [TS]

01:10:51 ◼   ► nothing against the Frankie Goes to [TS]

01:10:53 ◼   ► Hollywood band there they're very [TS]

01:10:54 ◼   ► interesting they had a great look but [TS]

01:10:55 ◼   ► like their songs we're not particularly [TS]

01:10:57 ◼   ► substantial but like they have to say [TS]

01:10:59 ◼   ► that a great sound that a great sound [TS]

01:11:02 ◼   ► and they and that's exactly that that's [TS]

01:11:04 ◼   ► right the sound was great like the way [TS]

01:11:06 ◼   ► that the way that their big hit kind of [TS]

01:11:10 ◼   ► trails off at the end was the last thing [TS]

01:11:12 ◼   ► you hear is like sounds of files and the [TS]

01:11:14 ◼   ► sound of miles ABBA [TS]

01:11:15 ◼   ► Babbitt did like two tribes I'm not sure [TS]

01:11:19 ◼   ► two tribes necessarily hangs together as [TS]

01:11:22 ◼   ► a great political statement but like it [TS]

01:11:24 ◼   ► was so big it was so big right if you [TS]

01:11:27 ◼   ► sat down and tried to play it on the [TS]

01:11:28 ◼   ► acoustic guitar I don't seven-inch of an [TS]

01:11:42 ◼   ► emotions obsession obsession [TS]

01:11:45 ◼   ► I bought the 7-inch and everything about [TS]

01:11:48 ◼   ► it like at that point in my life there [TS]

01:11:51 ◼   ► is no way I should have bought the [TS]

01:11:52 ◼   ► 7-inch of that record because I hated [TS]

01:11:55 ◼   ► that music video they're freaky they're [TS]

01:11:57 ◼   ► I mean they're like there's something [TS]

01:11:59 ◼   ► wrong can be pretty campy but but even [TS]

01:12:01 ◼   ► the way they're looking at you that the [TS]

01:12:02 ◼   ► camera is just like no no no don't [TS]

01:12:04 ◼   ► invite those people into your house but [TS]

01:12:06 ◼   ► put the tune I just really liked it and [TS]

01:12:10 ◼   ► I couldn't I couldn't explain it I [TS]

01:12:12 ◼   ► wouldn't defend it it's very catchy yeah [TS]

01:12:15 ◼   ► I never would have told a friend that I [TS]

01:12:17 ◼   ► had it towed up Berlin pleasure and pre [TS]

01:12:20 ◼   ► pre pre top gun pleasure victim era [TS]

01:12:24 ◼   ► Berlin one of the great bands they had [TS]

01:12:27 ◼   ► that ep I think was an EP with the sex [TS]

01:12:31 ◼   ► i'ma song on it and then they had [TS]

01:12:33 ◼   ► pleasure victim I think masquerade is a [TS]

01:12:36 ◼   ► very good song I think I think that is [TS]

01:12:38 ◼   ► before its time that was some very [TS]

01:12:39 ◼   ► strong music it's super strong and the [TS]

01:12:42 ◼   ► thing about it is that whole record I'm [TS]

01:12:46 ◼   ► talking about when this is this is way [TS]

01:12:50 ◼   ► way not we're not talking about the the [TS]

01:12:54 ◼   ► Top Gun [TS]

01:12:54 ◼   ► version of Berlin that still seems like [TS]

01:12:58 ◼   ► it feels like years after I stopped [TS]

01:13:00 ◼   ► listening to Berlin but I guess it was [TS]

01:13:02 ◼   ► like a year after I was really into [TS]

01:13:04 ◼   ► Berlin but that the their record love [TS]

01:13:06 ◼   ► life which came out in 84 but which I [TS]

01:13:09 ◼   ► didn't wanna get into until 80 [TS]

01:13:13 ◼   ► seven even that record and it's the one [TS]

01:13:18 ◼   ► that has no more words oh that's a good [TS]

01:13:20 ◼   ► song but the whole record is good it's [TS]

01:13:24 ◼   ► just Oh dancing in Berlin that's a good [TS]

01:13:26 ◼   ► song yeah it's good it's just like a [TS]

01:13:28 ◼   ► major years wait so it's two years after [TS]

01:13:31 ◼   ► pleasure pleasure if it comes 1982 dude [TS]

01:13:34 ◼   ► no oh the metro oh my god [TS]

01:13:38 ◼   ► I remember hating you for loving me that [TS]

01:13:42 ◼   ► what that was as influential on me as [TS]

01:13:44 ◼   ► cars by Gary Numan I mean I know for me [TS]

01:13:47 ◼   ► or for me Adam in the ants these like [TS]

01:13:48 ◼   ► just unabashedly melodramatic songs I [TS]

01:13:51 ◼   ► just hate him with a spoon they sounded [TS]

01:13:54 ◼   ► like the future absolutely that you know [TS]

01:13:57 ◼   ► because what was happening in metal at [TS]

01:13:59 ◼   ► that time was was that everybody had [TS]

01:14:02 ◼   ► gone to pentatonic or everybody had gone [TS]

01:14:05 ◼   ► to this idea this like this dead-end [TS]

01:14:09 ◼   ► idea that without what metal was gonna [TS]

01:14:11 ◼   ► be was classical music the classical [TS]

01:14:14 ◼   ► music of art and the new weight stuff [TS]

01:14:16 ◼   ► was definitely on point but it was it [TS]

01:14:18 ◼   ► was consolidating into something very [TS]

01:14:19 ◼   ► very tight and not particularly weird [TS]

01:14:22 ◼   ► but it was it was getting I mean like I [TS]

01:14:24 ◼   ► mean what do you say about iron made one [TS]

01:14:26 ◼   ► from that time like this stuff was [TS]

01:14:27 ◼   ► amazing it was amazing but it didn't [TS]

01:14:29 ◼   ► feel like the future right it felt like [TS]

01:14:33 ◼   ► a height of what had happened before and [TS]

01:14:35 ◼   ► so like it was it was still connected to [TS]

01:14:38 ◼   ► dungeons and dragons it felt like like [TS]

01:14:41 ◼   ► like our music probably same for Judas [TS]

01:14:46 ◼   ► Priest maybe yeah I think so it's just [TS]

01:14:48 ◼   ► like leather and studs and like you know [TS]

01:14:51 ◼   ► this is music about dragons whereas and [TS]

01:14:58 ◼   ► a lot of New Wave just felt like oh this [TS]

01:14:59 ◼   ► is just pop music with keyboards but [TS]

01:15:01 ◼   ► some tunes and I feel like flock of [TS]

01:15:04 ◼   ► seagulls in Berlin fall into this [TS]

01:15:06 ◼   ► category captured the feeling of the [TS]

01:15:10 ◼   ► future where where it felt cold that's [TS]

01:15:14 ◼   ► that's that's where Gary Numan kind of [TS]

01:15:15 ◼   ► takes the cake yeah it just feels like [TS]

01:15:17 ◼   ► oh shit that you know like what the [TS]

01:15:20 ◼   ► future is scary [TS]

01:15:21 ◼   ► it's scary because it doesn't feel [TS]

01:15:25 ◼   ► like there it doesn't feel like there [TS]

01:15:27 ◼   ► are any blankets there and and I and [TS]

01:15:31 ◼   ► it's not just the music videos like it's [TS]

01:15:33 ◼   ► in the music yeah the dissonant like [TS]

01:15:37 ◼   ► squeaky they were very dissonant squeaky [TS]

01:15:40 ◼   ► keyboards at that time could sometimes [TS]

01:15:41 ◼   ► be very very upsetting but like they had [TS]

01:15:44 ◼   ► a they had a very strong effect on me [TS]

01:15:45 ◼   ► and that yeah and there and the idea I [TS]

01:15:47 ◼   ► think that got into my head forever that [TS]

01:15:51 ◼   ► there should be a note droning somewhere [TS]

01:15:54 ◼   ► which is actually something thrown back [TS]

01:15:57 ◼   ► to the Blues you know it like like it's [TS]

01:16:00 ◼   ► it's Apalachin to have what I mean like [TS]

01:16:06 ◼   ► there's some I'm trying to think of [TS]

01:16:07 ◼   ► bands you take a song like I want to say [TS]

01:16:09 ◼   ► masquerade [TS]

01:16:10 ◼   ► but the riffs would be very dissonant [TS]

01:16:13 ◼   ► and yet incredibly catchy a lot of the [TS]

01:16:15 ◼   ► time or something like in like with Gary [TS]

01:16:16 ◼   ► knew me take some like cars or even [TS]

01:16:18 ◼   ► earlier you take down in the park you [TS]

01:16:20 ◼   ► take a two-way army song song and like [TS]

01:16:22 ◼   ► there's the two-way arm it was menacing [TS]

01:16:24 ◼   ► like they do you talk about the future [TS]

01:16:26 ◼   ► without blankets title that's that stuff [TS]

01:16:28 ◼   ► just feels like oh my god does this post [TS]

01:16:31 ◼   ► Kraftwerk future we're gonna live in [TS]

01:16:32 ◼   ► where everything's just gonna be metal [TS]

01:16:34 ◼   ► walls it's just that's such a feeling to [TS]

01:16:36 ◼   ► it of like this is this is not something [TS]

01:16:38 ◼   ► we've experienced before [TS]

01:16:39 ◼   ► yeah I'm gonna be alone and no one's [TS]

01:16:41 ◼   ► ever gonna smile and if you and if you [TS]

01:16:43 ◼   ► say you know if we say the wrong words [TS]

01:16:45 ◼   ► like everyone's head is gonna turn yeah [TS]

01:16:49 ◼   ► [Music] [TS]

01:16:51 ◼   ► sure like music and you're gonna you're [TS]

01:16:54 ◼   ► gonna have a lot of mascara on I don't [TS]

01:17:01 ◼   ► think you can ever run out of mascara it [TS]

01:17:02 ◼   ► was not cool at all to like Adam well [TS]

01:17:06 ◼   ► see I always thought I still call him [TS]

01:17:07 ◼   ► out him in the ants too like Adam the [TS]

01:17:08 ◼   ► ants when I like that in the ants was [TS]

01:17:10 ◼   ► extremely not cool in Central Florida [TS]

01:17:12 ◼   ► well even up into then in some ways it [TS]

01:17:15 ◼   ► was even more embarrassing when Friend [TS]

01:17:16 ◼   ► or Foe got popular because I was into [TS]

01:17:18 ◼   ► Kingsley well frontier and Prince [TS]

01:17:20 ◼   ► Charming we're like whoa Stanton deliver [TS]

01:17:23 ◼   ► was my favorite song for probably five [TS]

01:17:24 ◼   ► years a great tune it's a good song and [TS]

01:17:27 ◼   ► they had two drummers and they dressed [TS]

01:17:28 ◼   ► like pirates and like what are they [TS]

01:17:30 ◼   ► doing with all that makeup and then [TS]

01:17:31 ◼   ► Friend or Foe [TS]

01:17:32 ◼   ► I mean it really was kind of like Tiger [TS]

01:17:35 ◼   ► Beat material in some ways was still [TS]

01:17:36 ◼   ► very good song with a great band [TS]

01:17:38 ◼   ► but like then was even more embarrassing [TS]

01:17:39 ◼   ► because like oh yeah I knew you liked [TS]

01:17:40 ◼   ► this obscure English band but now I [TS]

01:17:42 ◼   ► really understand what this band is and [TS]

01:17:44 ◼   ► you like this is not very Molly Hatchet [TS]

01:17:47 ◼   ► I feel like the I feel like it's another [TS]

01:17:50 ◼   ► example of like Adam Ant had so much [TS]

01:17:54 ◼   ► attitude toward the camera mm-hmm like [TS]

01:17:57 ◼   ► he was very he was very beautiful [TS]

01:17:59 ◼   ► telegenic yeah just right in your face [TS]

01:18:02 ◼   ► with it and I I could never give I could [TS]

01:18:07 ◼   ► I could never hate that like even even [TS]

01:18:09 ◼   ► in the darkest time of like if it's not [TS]

01:18:12 ◼   ► metal it's not music his like pure [TS]

01:18:17 ◼   ► swagger and that was what I that was why [TS]

01:18:19 ◼   ► I didn't like simply red why I didn't [TS]

01:18:21 ◼   ► like Tears for Fears was that they there [TS]

01:18:24 ◼   ► wasn't swagger it looked like they were [TS]

01:18:27 ◼   ► you know they were trying to seem deep [TS]

01:18:30 ◼   ► and I didn't respond to that as much as [TS]

01:18:34 ◼   ► I did like Here I am like and why I [TS]

01:18:41 ◼   ► could never ever ever hate on George [TS]

01:18:43 ◼   ► Michael even at the even I'm just a [TS]

01:18:47 ◼   ► little bit [TS]

01:18:47 ◼   ► even when wham was ludicrous raps the [TS]

01:18:51 ◼   ► lamb rap song you think that was a [TS]

01:18:52 ◼   ► little silly at the time I mean it's not [TS]

01:18:54 ◼   ► like I was listening to those records [TS]

01:18:55 ◼   ► but I didn't I didn't look at George [TS]

01:18:58 ◼   ► Michael and have contempt for him he [TS]

01:19:00 ◼   ► wasn't you weren't offended I wasn't no [TS]

01:19:02 ◼   ► well no I I felt like yeah there it is [TS]

01:19:05 ◼   ► like he's he's owning he's owning that [TS]

01:19:07 ◼   ► space and that was and that was a I [TS]

01:19:10 ◼   ► think there was a lot I mean I don't [TS]

01:19:12 ◼   ► like Frank Zappa at all but I love Frank [TS]

01:19:15 ◼   ► Zappa oh yeah [TS]

01:19:16 ◼   ► you know the idea of Frank Zappa is very [TS]

01:19:21 ◼   ► strong the idea of Frank Zappa the smell [TS]

01:19:25 ◼   ► of Frank Zappa is something I don't want [TS]

01:19:30 ◼   ► to consider right I don't because I my [TS]

01:19:33 ◼   ► sense is that that Frank had a lot of [TS]

01:19:35 ◼   ► sex mmm [TS]

01:19:37 ◼   ► and that it was and and potentially even [TS]

01:19:40 ◼   ► largely monogamous but he was not [TS]

01:19:43 ◼   ► somebody who was gonna go like shower [TS]

01:19:46 ◼   ► before oh I see what you're saying I [TS]

01:19:49 ◼   ► think about that sometimes I think about [TS]

01:19:50 ◼   ► smells [TS]

01:19:51 ◼   ► yeah yeah I'm sensitive to smells you [TS]

01:19:53 ◼   ► know I've got a rash no because I spent [TS]

01:19:57 ◼   ► some time in hot tubs recently oh no no [TS]

01:19:59 ◼   ► no no no no no that's that's human soup [TS]

01:20:01 ◼   ► and I don't I don't be a perfect [TS]

01:20:04 ◼   ► breeding ground for that kind of thing I [TS]

01:20:05 ◼   ► like a hot bath mm-hmm I like a even a [TS]

01:20:09 ◼   ► swimming pool but a hot tub I always [TS]

01:20:12 ◼   ► come out of there with hives is it on [TS]

01:20:15 ◼   ► your bottom parts it's just in the parts [TS]

01:20:17 ◼   ► that would touch it touch the water of [TS]

01:20:19 ◼   ► attack oh okay [TS]

01:20:21 ◼   ► and it's just it's uncomfortable and it [TS]

01:20:23 ◼   ► makes me feel like it's one of the [TS]

01:20:26 ◼   ► things that separates me from the 1970s [TS]

01:20:28 ◼   ► I feel like water beds I was into I [TS]

01:20:31 ◼   ► would be into them again if they were if [TS]

01:20:33 ◼   ► it see if it seemed reasonable to have [TS]

01:20:35 ◼   ► one uh-huh but a hot tub I don't know [TS]

01:20:38 ◼   ► whether it's the whether it's the other [TS]

01:20:40 ◼   ► people or the chemicals they put in them [TS]

01:20:43 ◼   ► to keep it's the other people from [TS]

01:20:45 ◼   ► creating like Polliwogs [TS]

01:20:50 ◼   ► John I think even in the best of [TS]

01:20:52 ◼   ► conditions it's a lot of work keeping [TS]

01:20:53 ◼   ► one of those things clean I mean if [TS]

01:20:55 ◼   ► you're even if you're really riding that [TS]

01:20:57 ◼   ► hard even if you like maybe have some [TS]

01:20:58 ◼   ► you've hired some help before it I think [TS]

01:21:00 ◼   ► that's gonna be a lot of work yeah yeah [TS]

01:21:03 ◼   ► but so I was in a hot tub in one place [TS]

01:21:05 ◼   ► and then I went to another place and [TS]

01:21:07 ◼   ► they had hot tubs there too I was like [TS]

01:21:09 ◼   ► all right mr. hot tub I guess and after [TS]

01:21:14 ◼   ► the first hot tub experience I was like [TS]

01:21:16 ◼   ► I feel a little itchy [TS]

01:21:18 ◼   ► yeah where a rash is really it's like [TS]

01:21:21 ◼   ► it's like it's just a droning [TS]

01:21:22 ◼   ► existential home you really cannot [TS]

01:21:24 ◼   ► forget the physicality of your body when [TS]

01:21:26 ◼   ► you got a rash there's other kinds of [TS]

01:21:27 ◼   ► things where you can like kind of put it [TS]

01:21:28 ◼   ► off for a minute but a rice just reminds [TS]

01:21:30 ◼   ► you that you're alive and not in a good [TS]

01:21:31 ◼   ► way [TS]

01:21:31 ◼   ► I'm I'm people I think are often [TS]

01:21:35 ◼   ► surprised at how vulnerable I am to [TS]

01:21:38 ◼   ► things you're sensitive you're sensitive [TS]

01:21:40 ◼   ► soap and bad smells and that that hot [TS]

01:21:44 ◼   ► tubs but I'm very sensitive to two [TS]

01:21:47 ◼   ► things and I think right now I'm reading [TS]

01:21:50 ◼   ► a book about sleep [TS]

01:21:52 ◼   ► and the book about sleep is telling me [TS]

01:21:54 ◼   ► that if you if you're not getting good [TS]

01:21:58 ◼   ► sleep you might as well die of cancer [TS]

01:21:59 ◼   ► right now yeah and so I'm so last night [TS]

01:22:03 ◼   ► I actually read the book about sleep [TS]

01:22:05 ◼   ► until it put me to sleep and then I lay [TS]

01:22:08 ◼   ► there and I woke up a little bit later [TS]

01:22:11 ◼   ► and and my body was like you're not [TS]

01:22:14 ◼   ► ready for sleep and I I really thought [TS]

01:22:16 ◼   ► about this book like yes I am ready for [TS]

01:22:20 ◼   ► sleep potty or would you like instead to [TS]

01:22:24 ◼   ► just die at 56 of a thousand maladies [TS]

01:22:28 ◼   ► and my body said hmm all right I'll I'll [TS]

01:22:32 ◼   ► take this on under advisement [TS]

01:22:33 ◼   ► and I did go back to sleep and I did [TS]

01:22:36 ◼   ► sleep soundly and so I'm thinking about [TS]

01:22:39 ◼   ► this book and I'm thinking about like [TS]

01:22:41 ◼   ► hmm I have a rash I also have been sick [TS]

01:22:47 ◼   ► a lot lately maybe it's time to read a [TS]

01:22:49 ◼   ► book about sleep Wow and so that's where [TS]

01:22:54 ◼   ► I am I'm at I am at the point in my life [TS]

01:22:56 ◼   ► where I would voluntarily read a book [TS]

01:22:59 ◼   ► about sleep and and I'm reading the [TS]

01:23:01 ◼   ► intro and the the writer is like well I [TS]

01:23:05 ◼   ► started as a psychiatry professor at [TS]

01:23:07 ◼   ► Harvard and then I moved to Berkeley [TS]

01:23:10 ◼   ► where I'm a you know a psychokinetic [TS]

01:23:12 ◼   ► researcher and the chairman of the [TS]

01:23:14 ◼   ► department and I'm picturing you know [TS]

01:23:17 ◼   ► this sleep researcher and I turned to [TS]

01:23:19 ◼   ► the back of the book jacket and and this [TS]

01:23:24 ◼   ► person looks like the male lead of dirty [TS]

01:23:30 ◼   ► dancing Patrick Swayze Patrick Swayze [TS]

01:23:33 ◼   ► yeah and I'm like oh no and I flipped [TS]

01:23:37 ◼   ► back to the intro again and it said for [TS]

01:23:39 ◼   ► over 20 years I've been working and I [TS]

01:23:43 ◼   ► was like 20 years ago was 1998 [TS]

01:23:47 ◼   ► like this oh he still doesn't have a [TS]

01:23:50 ◼   ► dict I mean this person is 39 or [TS]

01:23:54 ◼   ► something you know you know like you [TS]

01:23:57 ◼   ► seen his leathery no I'm saying if you [TS]

01:23:59 ◼   ► got in your career started in 1998 [TS]

01:24:04 ◼   ► you are I mean he's like got bleached [TS]

01:24:06 ◼   ► hair and so it was then it was really [TS]

01:24:10 ◼   ► hard not to put the book down because I [TS]

01:24:14 ◼   ► did not want to be lectured about sleep [TS]

01:24:16 ◼   ► by someone who looked like Patrick [TS]

01:24:18 ◼   ► Swayze but I was like stay in the game [TS]

01:24:22 ◼   ► stay in the game yeah maybe he has some [TS]

01:24:24 ◼   ► insights maybe you can learn something [TS]

01:24:26 ◼   ► from a young person and well so I made [TS]

01:24:31 ◼   ► it through the first couple of chapters [TS]

01:24:32 ◼   ► there's a Supreme Court justice he's [TS]

01:24:33 ◼   ► younger than me no it's very upsetting [TS]

01:24:37 ◼   ► the new yeah of course it's yeah his [TS]

01:24:41 ◼   ► name whoever the guy is that's that they [TS]

01:24:42 ◼   ► jammed in there yeah upsetting but I got [TS]

01:24:46 ◼   ► a tip for you I can't promise is gonna [TS]

01:24:48 ◼   ► help but this is someone out of the [TS]

01:24:49 ◼   ► cognitive-behavioral tradition but [TS]

01:24:51 ◼   ► something I've been doing that has been [TS]

01:24:53 ◼   ► helping with the sleep and you've heard [TS]

01:24:54 ◼   ► me I don't know if you've ever heard me [TS]

01:24:55 ◼   ► mention this before what are my [TS]

01:24:56 ◼   ► catchphrases in life one of my guiding [TS]

01:24:58 ◼   ► principles is to remind myself that I've [TS]

01:25:00 ◼   ► decided not to let it bother me what [TS]

01:25:01 ◼   ► something starts to bother me I say to [TS]

01:25:03 ◼   ► myself you know what I've decided not to [TS]

01:25:04 ◼   ► let it bother me then every part of that [TS]

01:25:06 ◼   ► is important so I started trying to [TS]

01:25:07 ◼   ► adopt that with sleep when I wake up and [TS]

01:25:09 ◼   ► I suddenly I start feeling all the [TS]

01:25:11 ◼   ► anxiety I say hmm maybe I'm not a bad [TS]

01:25:14 ◼   ► person because I'm awake maybe I will [TS]

01:25:16 ◼   ► actually get up for a few minutes what [TS]

01:25:18 ◼   ► if I gave myself one hour to be awake [TS]

01:25:19 ◼   ► and said after an hour I'll go back to [TS]

01:25:21 ◼   ► sleep but I'm not gonna feel bad about [TS]

01:25:23 ◼   ► it I have decided not to let it bother [TS]

01:25:26 ◼   ► I've decided not to let it bother me hmm [TS]

01:25:29 ◼   ► I have decided not to let it bother me [TS]

01:25:31 ◼   ► and then and then all of a sudden you're [TS]

01:25:33 ◼   ► not a bad person anymore now you're just [TS]

01:25:34 ◼   ► somebody who's awake for a little while [TS]

01:25:35 ◼   ► and then you're somebody who can go back [TS]

01:25:37 ◼   ► to sleep because you know because you [TS]

01:25:38 ◼   ► know what kills you is the feeling bad [TS]

01:25:39 ◼   ► about it it's the being bothered that [TS]

01:25:41 ◼   ► will keep you awake [TS]

01:25:43 ◼   ► [Music] [TS]

01:25:48 ◼   ► okay well but but I mean I know that I'm [TS]

01:25:51 ◼   ► a bad person [TS]

01:25:52 ◼   ► well I don't convinced of that or [TS]

01:25:56 ◼   ► disabused I was sir [TS]

01:25:58 ◼   ► but what yeah I just this guy you know [TS]

01:26:03 ◼   ► he he made me feel okay because he was [TS]

01:26:06 ◼   ► like he gave me some of what I was [TS]

01:26:08 ◼   ► looking for which it is if you stay up [TS]

01:26:12 ◼   ► late at night that's because that's what [TS]

01:26:13 ◼   ► you're supposed to do and your body is [TS]

01:26:15 ◼   ► on a cycle and you can't do [TS]

01:26:16 ◼   ► just a normal healthy American boy I'm [TS]

01:26:19 ◼   ► an owl I'm an owl not an early bird I'm [TS]

01:26:21 ◼   ► an owl and and so I was like yeah damn [TS]

01:26:26 ◼   ► right and he said but if you don't get [TS]

01:26:28 ◼   ► eight hours of sleep at night you're [TS]

01:26:30 ◼   ► gonna die [TS]

01:26:31 ◼   ► this is your alright the bad news is [TS]

01:26:34 ◼   ► it's killing you face compliment [TS]

01:26:38 ◼   ► sandwich world's fucked up nobody you [TS]

01:26:41 ◼   ► know the world is not made for people [TS]

01:26:43 ◼   ► that want to sleep until 10:00 a.m. [TS]

01:26:45 ◼   ► let alone noon so it's too bad for you [TS]

01:26:48 ◼   ► if you don't get eight hours of sleep a [TS]

01:26:50 ◼   ► night your brain is gonna turn into [TS]

01:26:51 ◼   ► spaghetti noodles and be too tired to [TS]

01:26:55 ◼   ► realize it I'm gonna be too tired to go [TS]

01:26:57 ◼   ► to war teach on that shoot tired [TS]

01:27:06 ◼   ► [Music] [TS]

01:27:06 ◼   ► [Music] [TS]

00:00:00 ◼   ► [Music] [TS]

00:00:05 ◼   ► I'm Merlin how's going good long time [TS]

00:00:10 ◼   ► Nessie Esmond that long we just talked [TS]

00:00:13 ◼   ► last week right that's right yeah yes [TS]

00:00:17 ◼   ► there's no Vale to tear away no we've [TS]

00:00:19 ◼   ► been talking consistently yes we talked [TS]

00:00:23 ◼   ► about politics last week oh yeah as you [TS]

00:00:29 ◼   ► remember when we talked last week yeah [TS]

00:00:31 ◼   ► yeah we talked about politics that was a [TS]

00:00:33 ◼   ► that was a real hit show it's barnburner [TS]

00:00:35 ◼   ► yeah it was got a lot of got a lot of [TS]

00:00:38 ◼   ► hearts and faith for that one yeah [TS]

00:00:40 ◼   ► collective hearts collected faves mmm [TS]

00:00:44 ◼   ► collecting them in my in my little [TS]

00:00:46 ◼   ► Tupperware in my it's not a little [TS]

00:00:48 ◼   ► Tupperware it's a big big big one of [TS]

00:00:50 ◼   ► those big Tupper what's the name of a [TS]

00:00:51 ◼   ► soundcloud rapper locally clever where a [TS]

00:00:54 ◼   ► little Tupperware yeah yeah I got a I [TS]

00:00:58 ◼   ► got a big bucket of those hit hearts and [TS]

00:01:01 ◼   ► babes I've been collecting since 2011 [TS]

00:01:02 ◼   ► mm-hmm hearts and minds hearts and faves [TS]

00:01:05 ◼   ► well it's nice to talk to you you used [TS]

00:01:07 ◼   ► to get a lot of faves [TS]

00:01:09 ◼   ► jimena yeah got gold star faves yeah I [TS]

00:01:13 ◼   ► don't use the internet as much as I used [TS]

00:01:14 ◼   ► to [TS]

00:01:16 ◼   ► you said a mouthful mm-hmm man you know [TS]

00:01:19 ◼   ► I use it I use it differently the pipes [TS]

00:01:21 ◼   ► and the wires you know I've rerouted [TS]

00:01:22 ◼   ► them a little bit a little bit of a home [TS]

00:01:24 ◼   ► improvement on my internet you know it [TS]

00:01:26 ◼   ► was my uncle's law partner that said the [TS]

00:01:29 ◼   ► internet was a series of tubes right [TS]

00:01:32 ◼   ► that's uncle Ted uncle pad yeah it's [TS]

00:01:35 ◼   ► like no no no you don't put on the back [TS]

00:01:37 ◼   ► of a truck that's what he said right [TS]

00:01:38 ◼   ► that's right he added some nuance to it [TS]

00:01:40 ◼   ► I talked about him a lot in the last [TS]

00:01:42 ◼   ► week or so cuz I visited my uncle who is [TS]

00:01:45 ◼   ► 91 now and he's trying to write his [TS]

00:01:48 ◼   ► autobiography and he's got he's written [TS]

00:01:52 ◼   ► quite a bit of it but he was telling a [TS]

00:01:55 ◼   ► lot of stories about the good old days [TS]

00:01:57 ◼   ► while we were sitting around sitting [TS]

00:02:00 ◼   ► around the couch and heard a lot of [TS]

00:02:03 ◼   ► great Ted Stevens stories any you can [TS]

00:02:08 ◼   ► share because because Ted Stevens in the [TS]

00:02:10 ◼   ► popular imagination I think if you know [TS]

00:02:12 ◼   ► the name Ted Stevens you may know that [TS]

00:02:14 ◼   ► he is the the tubes a series of tubes [TS]

00:02:16 ◼   ► back of a truck guy [TS]

00:02:18 ◼   ► you may know wasn't he famous for the [TS]

00:02:20 ◼   ► quote-unquote Bridge to Nowhere [TS]

00:02:21 ◼   ► wasn't that his boondoggle no that was a [TS]

00:02:23 ◼   ► different Alaskan see I already don't [TS]

00:02:26 ◼   ► know who I'm talking about yeah that was [TS]

00:02:28 ◼   ► Wally Hickel Wally Hickel the former [TS]

00:02:31 ◼   ► governor and Nixon Secretary of the [TS]

00:02:34 ◼   ► Interior Ted was a fan of political pork [TS]

00:02:37 ◼   ► was he not well Ted Oh Merlin yuck that [TS]

00:02:41 ◼   ► let me get you started please permit me [TS]

00:02:43 ◼   ► you said it political pork Ted was the [TS]

00:02:47 ◼   ► chairman of the Armed Forces [TS]

00:02:50 ◼   ► Appropriations Committee they get to [TS]

00:02:53 ◼   ► decide where what bad heart defense [TS]

00:02:57 ◼   ► money goes no that's where all the [TS]

00:02:59 ◼   ► defense money all the defense may all [TS]

00:03:01 ◼   ► the great defense like all the great [TS]

00:03:02 ◼   ► defense money the Appropriations [TS]

00:03:04 ◼   ► Committee is very powerful and Ted was [TS]

00:03:07 ◼   ► the leader of it and so and you guys are [TS]

00:03:10 ◼   ► right there by by the Soviet Union you [TS]

00:03:12 ◼   ► can about your window that's right and [TS]

00:03:14 ◼   ► you know my dad and my uncle are [TS]

00:03:16 ◼   ► peaceniks or at least anti-war they're [TS]

00:03:20 ◼   ► doves that's what they would have been [TS]

00:03:22 ◼   ► calling doves prefer peace they prefer [TS]

00:03:29 ◼   ► peace and they would say you know Ted [TS]

00:03:31 ◼   ► you gotta what are you doing here man [TS]

00:03:32 ◼   ► with these guns and Ted would say you [TS]

00:03:36 ◼   ► know 48 out of 50 states the military is [TS]

00:03:40 ◼   ► their number one employer that should [TS]

00:03:45 ◼   ► get it's a logical fallacy that's a [TS]

00:03:47 ◼   ► really good logical fallacy it's like my [TS]

00:03:49 ◼   ► dad used to do when I when I started to [TS]

00:03:52 ◼   ► try and take his car away because it was [TS]

00:03:54 ◼   ► too old to drive and he would say I got [TS]

00:03:56 ◼   ► a guy got an appointment to get the car [TS]

00:03:58 ◼   ► fixed people run everything so we should [TS]

00:04:04 ◼   ► let white people run everything so Ted [TS]

00:04:07 ◼   ► Ted yeah Ted you know he was appointed [TS]

00:04:11 ◼   ► to the Senate the first time he never he [TS]

00:04:14 ◼   ► didn't even he was his like he didn't [TS]

00:04:19 ◼   ► win election to that office [TS]

00:04:23 ◼   ► initially okay I'm looking him up here I [TS]

00:04:25 ◼   ► go and that was that's like kind of [TS]

00:04:29 ◼   ► extraordinary just in the sense that he [TS]

00:04:32 ◼   ► he became one of the longest senators [TS]

00:04:35 ◼   ► serving his president pro-tem for years [TS]

00:04:41 ◼   ► he was that the time he was the lamb [TS]

00:04:43 ◼   ► around the internet science site he was [TS]

00:04:45 ◼   ► the longest serving Republican senator [TS]

00:04:47 ◼   ► in history at the time he left office [TS]

00:04:48 ◼   ► now of course that's orrin hatch yeah [TS]

00:04:52 ◼   ► orrin hatch now has made it made it over [TS]

00:04:54 ◼   ► here I mean they're gonna have to pry [TS]

00:04:56 ◼   ► the Senate from his his one good hand [TS]

00:05:03 ◼   ► lot of layers part of his whole thing [TS]

00:05:09 ◼   ► was like there's he was off of term [TS]

00:05:12 ◼   ► limits or didn't like the idea that [TS]

00:05:14 ◼   ► these guys would get in there and then [TS]

00:05:16 ◼   ► never leave it was real frustrating to [TS]

00:05:17 ◼   ► him and that was I think in 1977 is that [TS]

00:05:21 ◼   ► right was in 1977 when he came in orrin [TS]

00:05:23 ◼   ► hatch yeah no I have no idea I don't [TS]

00:05:25 ◼   ► follow the career born read the traits [TS]

00:05:28 ◼   ► assumed office January 3 1977 Wow yeah [TS]

00:05:32 ◼   ► yeah and Ted was already there right he [TS]

00:05:34 ◼   ► was he was there Ted this is what's [TS]

00:05:37 ◼   ► crazy he went into the Senate right [TS]

00:05:39 ◼   ► about the time I was born so I mean [TS]

00:05:44 ◼   ► there was like three months of my entire [TS]

00:05:46 ◼   ► life that Ted Stevens autumn in the US I [TS]

00:05:48 ◼   ► want to just reflect the fact that I [TS]

00:05:50 ◼   ► just totally confused orrin hatch and [TS]

00:05:51 ◼   ► Bob Dole thank you very much all fixing [TS]

00:05:52 ◼   ► the Edit damn good 1976 his first run [TS]

00:05:58 ◼   ► for office elected to the Senate [TS]

00:05:59 ◼   ► defeating Frank Moss the three-term [TS]

00:06:00 ◼   ► incumbent among other issues hatch [TS]

00:06:03 ◼   ► criticized his ha mosses 18-year tenure [TS]

00:06:06 ◼   ► in the Senate saying what do you call a [TS]

00:06:08 ◼   ► senator who served in office for 18 [TS]

00:06:10 ◼   ► years you call him home he ran on the [TS]

00:06:12 ◼   ► promise of time right he got in there he [TS]

00:06:14 ◼   ► got on the promise of term limits that [TS]

00:06:16 ◼   ► was we should do yeah I should have do [TS]

00:06:19 ◼   ► not don't like me in there in a while [TS]

00:06:22 ◼   ► mm-hmm it's early it's really early so I [TS]

00:06:25 ◼   ► took I took you off your game so uncle [TS]

00:06:27 ◼   ► Ted comes in oh and it was a weird thing [TS]

00:06:30 ◼   ► because that he came in because a Senate [TS]

00:06:34 ◼   ► era that our senator at the time a guy [TS]

00:06:37 ◼   ► named Bob Bartlett [TS]

00:06:38 ◼   ► who was a Democrat Bob Bartlett died [TS]

00:06:45 ◼   ► and it was not yet the rule that if if a [TS]

00:06:54 ◼   ► senator died in office and you were [TS]

00:06:56 ◼   ► going to appoint a replacement that you [TS]

00:06:58 ◼   ► require you appointed a replacement from [TS]

00:07:00 ◼   ► the same party so the new governor was a [TS]

00:07:04 ◼   ► Republican and he just appointed a [TS]

00:07:05 ◼   ► Republican Oh No kidding [TS]

00:07:07 ◼   ► instead of replacing Bob Bartlett with [TS]

00:07:09 ◼   ► the Democrat Bob Bartlett born in [TS]

00:07:11 ◼   ► Seattle yeah and you know the one of our [TS]

00:07:14 ◼   ► competing high schools in Anchorage I [TS]

00:07:16 ◼   ► went to East High School one of our [TS]

00:07:19 ◼   ► competing high schools was called [TS]

00:07:20 ◼   ► Bartlett High School after after Bob [TS]

00:07:22 ◼   ► Bartlett thought all the histories [TS]

00:07:25 ◼   ► connected yet salt it's all connected [TS]

00:07:27 ◼   ► it's all you know Alaska is very small [TS]

00:07:29 ◼   ► very small political politically Alaska [TS]

00:07:32 ◼   ► very small he died the year you were [TS]

00:07:36 ◼   ► born [TS]

00:07:37 ◼   ► I believe December 11 1968 yeah he had [TS]

00:07:40 ◼   ► had some heart surgery and that's why [TS]

00:07:42 ◼   ► Ted Stevens was appointed by the [TS]

00:07:45 ◼   ► Republican governor by the Republican [TS]

00:07:46 ◼   ► governor and when you know and [TS]

00:07:48 ◼   ► immediately immediately immediately [TS]

00:07:50 ◼   ► [Music] [TS]

00:07:52 ◼   ► appointed yeah that was big year 1968 [TS]

00:07:58 ◼   ► yeah riots in Paris mm-hmm you know [TS]

00:08:02 ◼   ► quite a long this is the 50th [TS]

00:08:04 ◼   ► anniversary of 1968 I know isn't that [TS]

00:08:07 ◼   ► strange that's one of the years it must [TS]

00:08:10 ◼   ► have felt like five years it still feels [TS]

00:08:13 ◼   ► like they're I don't know we've had a [TS]

00:08:16 ◼   ► we've had a bigger year sentence no it [TS]

00:08:18 ◼   ► was we've talked about this every [TS]

00:08:20 ◼   ► goddamn week but like the fractious [TS]

00:08:22 ◼   ► nough some 1968 and the stuff that [TS]

00:08:23 ◼   ► happened that I mean 63 obviously with [TS]

00:08:26 ◼   ► Kennedy being assassinated that was a [TS]

00:08:28 ◼   ► real shocker for the country it just [TS]

00:08:30 ◼   ► like well I mean cuz do you think about [TS]

00:08:32 ◼   ► who was the previous one was not [TS]

00:08:34 ◼   ► Cleveland McKinley like the last [TS]

00:08:36 ◼   ► presidential assassination had been like [TS]

00:08:38 ◼   ► this from another era and you just [TS]

00:08:40 ◼   ► couldn't even imagine this seemingly [TS]

00:08:43 ◼   ► healthy young man you know just being [TS]

00:08:46 ◼   ► being cut down [TS]

00:08:47 ◼   ► emphasis on seemingly seemingly he had a [TS]

00:08:51 ◼   ► lot pills stashed a lot of pills and [TS]

00:08:54 ◼   ► and various things I but you know but [TS]

00:08:55 ◼   ► the 68 is so much happen even if you [TS]

00:08:57 ◼   ► just take the assassinations and there's [TS]

00:08:59 ◼   ► so much more than the assassinations but [TS]

00:09:01 ◼   ► like you say internationally the stuff [TS]

00:09:02 ◼   ► was stuff going on internationally was [TS]

00:09:03 ◼   ► so bananas yeah I just I feel like that [TS]

00:09:08 ◼   ► was back when years would be like a year [TS]

00:09:11 ◼   ► right like Time magazine would do like a [TS]

00:09:14 ◼   ► like the Year in Review and it really [TS]

00:09:17 ◼   ► felt like wow we really put one away [TS]

00:09:20 ◼   ► this year we were put one in the history [TS]

00:09:22 ◼   ► books they're gonna they're gonna [TS]

00:09:23 ◼   ► remember 1982 you know that was that was [TS]

00:09:28 ◼   ► a heck of a year 1997 is going to make [TS]

00:09:32 ◼   ► 1982 mmm look like 1968 Hot Wheels Hot [TS]

00:09:38 ◼   ► Wheels Hot Wheels are introduced January [TS]

00:09:40 ◼   ► 4th 1968 Hot Wheels Sesame Street Sesame [TS]

00:09:43 ◼   ► Street don't me take you out for game [TS]

00:09:45 ◼   ► I'm just reading the Internet but keep [TS]

00:09:47 ◼   ► this is my game I was realizing I would [TS]

00:09:51 ◼   ► just a second ago realized it's very [TS]

00:09:53 ◼   ► early so early [TS]

00:09:55 ◼   ► I've been up I've been up in Hale and [TS]

00:09:57 ◼   ► Hardy since like 6:30 and I by 10:00 [TS]

00:09:59 ◼   ► a.m. I'm just so tired [TS]

00:10:00 ◼   ► I got like it's like my second morning I [TS]

00:10:06 ◼   ► have introduced my daughter to the [TS]

00:10:08 ◼   ► concept of second breakfast I'm so sorry [TS]

00:10:10 ◼   ► I did Oh [TS]

00:10:11 ◼   ► breakfast is now a thing well because I [TS]

00:10:14 ◼   ► started reading her The Hobbit [TS]

00:10:16 ◼   ► okay I'll terrific well except she is [TS]

00:10:19 ◼   ► really not into it she's like ah boring [TS]

00:10:21 ◼   ► yeah but then we got to very early on [TS]

00:10:25 ◼   ► you know Bilbo starts having a second [TS]

00:10:27 ◼   ► breakfast and she hurt yours really [TS]

00:10:28 ◼   ► perked up a second referenced fixing [TS]

00:10:30 ◼   ► she's gonna want smoke a pipe second [TS]

00:10:32 ◼   ► breakfast so I do have to hear about it [TS]

00:10:36 ◼   ► now oh I was I was told by her that I [TS]

00:10:38 ◼   ► can no longer keys her and I said that [TS]

00:10:41 ◼   ► I've had I've had that conversation yeah [TS]

00:10:43 ◼   ► and I was like take something out of [TS]

00:10:45 ◼   ► Canon if you said something cute and a [TS]

00:10:47 ◼   ► funny voice you can't you can't I can't [TS]

00:10:49 ◼   ► sweep it's too Boeing like that's gonna [TS]

00:10:51 ◼   ► be on you forever kid proficient said [TS]

00:10:53 ◼   ► that when you were two if you didn't [TS]

00:10:55 ◼   ► want to be cute yeah that's right I [TS]

00:10:56 ◼   ► can't sweep it's two boys and and and I [TS]

00:11:00 ◼   ► said well what what is the number one [TS]

00:11:02 ◼   ► way that I tease you that you want me to [TS]

00:11:05 ◼   ► stop and she said [TS]

00:11:08 ◼   ► stop saying bastok of potatoes this [TS]

00:11:13 ◼   ► episode of Rodrick on the line is [TS]

00:11:14 ◼   ► brought to you by Squarespace you can [TS]

00:11:17 ◼   ► learn more about Squarespace right now [TS]

00:11:19 ◼   ► by going to Squarespace calm and get [TS]

00:11:20 ◼   ► yourself a free trial there and when [TS]

00:11:22 ◼   ► you're ready to launch please use the [TS]

00:11:23 ◼   ► very special offer code supertrain to [TS]

00:11:25 ◼   ► get 10% off your first purchase of a [TS]

00:11:28 ◼   ► website or domain holy cats there is so [TS]

00:11:31 ◼   ► much great stuff that you can do with [TS]

00:11:32 ◼   ► Squarespace well let's start as they say [TS]

00:11:33 ◼   ► with step 0 which is you can have a [TS]

00:11:34 ◼   ► podcast there the show you're listening [TS]

00:11:36 ◼   ► to right now Roderick on the line is [TS]

00:11:37 ◼   ► done entirely using Squarespace they [TS]

00:11:40 ◼   ► have the files there they got the show [TS]

00:11:41 ◼   ► notes they got the images it's all there [TS]

00:11:42 ◼   ► and John and I just love this site but [TS]

00:11:45 ◼   ► you can do whatever you need to with it [TS]

00:11:46 ◼   ► you can create a beautiful website for [TS]

00:11:48 ◼   ► whatever your next big idea is you can [TS]

00:11:50 ◼   ► make your new idea into a cool website [TS]

00:11:52 ◼   ► you can showcase your work you can [TS]

00:11:54 ◼   ► create a blog or publish other kinds of [TS]

00:11:56 ◼   ► text content you can sell products and [TS]

00:11:58 ◼   ► services of all kinds right on your very [TS]

00:12:00 ◼   ► own Squarespace site you can promote [TS]

00:12:01 ◼   ► your physical or online business [TS]

00:12:03 ◼   ► restaurants of America please get a [TS]

00:12:05 ◼   ► Squarespace site it can even announce an [TS]

00:12:08 ◼   ► upcoming event or a special project it's [TS]

00:12:10 ◼   ► all right there with a Squarespace they [TS]

00:12:12 ◼   ► do that by giving you beautiful [TS]

00:12:13 ◼   ► templates created by world-class [TS]

00:12:15 ◼   ► designers powerful ecommerce [TS]

00:12:18 ◼   ► functionality built in let's sell [TS]

00:12:19 ◼   ► anything online the ability to customize [TS]

00:12:21 ◼   ► the look and feel of your site the [TS]

00:12:22 ◼   ► settings products and even more with [TS]

00:12:24 ◼   ► just a few clicks [TS]

00:12:25 ◼   ► everything is optimized for mobile right [TS]

00:12:27 ◼   ► out of the box they even have a new way [TS]

00:12:28 ◼   ► to buy domains and choose from over 200 [TS]

00:12:31 ◼   ► beautiful domain extensions they have [TS]

00:12:34 ◼   ► analytics that help you grow in real [TS]

00:12:35 ◼   ► time you guys know all this stuff just [TS]

00:12:37 ◼   ► get out there and do it you got to make [TS]

00:12:38 ◼   ► it make it yourself easily create a [TS]

00:12:40 ◼   ► website and you know what even a [TS]

00:12:42 ◼   ► Squarespace is not the perfect thing for [TS]

00:12:43 ◼   ► you please keep it in mind for other [TS]

00:12:45 ◼   ► people in your life you do not need to [TS]

00:12:47 ◼   ► be in the webmaster business you can [TS]

00:12:49 ◼   ► point them to Squarespace get them set [TS]

00:12:51 ◼   ► up in just a really a very small handful [TS]

00:12:52 ◼   ► of minutes and they're good to go [TS]

00:12:54 ◼   ► taking care of their own thing big fans [TS]

00:12:56 ◼   ► of Squarespace once again you go to [TS]

00:12:57 ◼   ► squarespace.com and you can get your [TS]

00:13:00 ◼   ► free trial when you're ready to go you [TS]

00:13:01 ◼   ► just use the very special offer code [TS]

00:13:03 ◼   ► supertrain that's gonna get you 10% off [TS]

00:13:05 ◼   ► your first purchase our thanks to [TS]

00:13:08 ◼   ► Squarespace for supporting Roderick on [TS]

00:13:10 ◼   ► the line and all the great shows so I [TS]

00:13:16 ◼   ► was like alright you know what I'll stop [TS]

00:13:18 ◼   ► saying bass the company knows if you if [TS]

00:13:20 ◼   ► this is really [TS]

00:13:21 ◼   ► bothering you this teasing what I say [TS]

00:13:24 ◼   ► because it's a game right she says you [TS]

00:13:28 ◼   ► know what are we doing this afternoon [TS]

00:13:29 ◼   ► I'm like well I don't know we could go [TS]

00:13:31 ◼   ► to the movies or we could eat a basket [TS]

00:13:35 ◼   ► potatoes and and she's just covered in [TS]

00:13:39 ◼   ► shame yeah her guard is down but but she [TS]

00:13:42 ◼   ► started to she got started to get the [TS]

00:13:44 ◼   ► game and she would preempt me mm-hmm I'd [TS]

00:13:47 ◼   ► go well we could go to the dinner or and [TS]

00:13:49 ◼   ► she'd go get a basket potatoes and then [TS]

00:13:52 ◼   ► I was busted dad lame yeah well so so I [TS]

00:13:57 ◼   ► said I'm gonna stop teasing you I'm [TS]

00:13:59 ◼   ► gonna take that out of the out of the [TS]

00:14:01 ◼   ► the lexicon we're not you're not ever [TS]

00:14:03 ◼   ► gonna hear it again and then later on [TS]

00:14:05 ◼   ► that afternoon I said well what should [TS]

00:14:08 ◼   ► we do this afternoon and she was like [TS]

00:14:09 ◼   ► why don't we get a basket of potatoes [TS]

00:14:10 ◼   ► and I was like hey you you can't tease [TS]

00:14:14 ◼   ► me it's like it's like her n-word well [TS]

00:14:17 ◼   ► and so now she really has to she's [TS]

00:14:20 ◼   ► really chewing on it because she didn't [TS]

00:14:24 ◼   ► want to be teased but what that meant [TS]

00:14:25 ◼   ► was she didn't want to be she didn't [TS]

00:14:27 ◼   ► want to lose she didn't want to be the [TS]

00:14:30 ◼   ► one that delivered got the basket of [TS]

00:14:32 ◼   ► potatoes delivered upon her now she's [TS]

00:14:33 ◼   ► like that that all right guy who dresses [TS]

00:14:36 ◼   ► up in diapers and hangs out in safe [TS]

00:14:38 ◼   ► spaces to pony libs he's a grown man he [TS]

00:14:45 ◼   ► dresses up in he's been known to dress [TS]

00:14:47 ◼   ► up in diapers with a pacifier and he [TS]

00:14:49 ◼   ► goes to college campuses and makes fun [TS]

00:14:50 ◼   ► of safe space this morning he wears a [TS]

00:14:52 ◼   ► diaper Oh [TS]

00:14:52 ◼   ► that'll show that same thing right [TS]

00:14:54 ◼   ► that's too good potatoes same situation [TS]

00:14:55 ◼   ► it's like she's pulling herself as a [TS]

00:14:57 ◼   ► cell phone I opened my email this [TS]

00:14:59 ◼   ► morning because I made the a couple of [TS]

00:15:02 ◼   ► days ago I was like you know all right [TS]

00:15:03 ◼   ► I'm gonna go and unsubscribe from all [TS]

00:15:05 ◼   ► these things and let's see which ones I [TS]

00:15:07 ◼   ► really successfully unsubscribe from and [TS]

00:15:10 ◼   ► which ones it's just like the elevator [TS]

00:15:14 ◼   ► button anything or dropping dropping a [TS]

00:15:19 ◼   ► bit of oil onto like the overhead [TS]

00:15:22 ◼   ► projector at a dead show where it just [TS]

00:15:25 ◼   ► is like blurring and now all of a sudden [TS]

00:15:26 ◼   ► I get 400 emails because I've identified [TS]

00:15:28 ◼   ► myself as a living person but I got an [TS]

00:15:31 ◼   ► email from the NRA [TS]

00:15:33 ◼   ► listen which I had never had one [TS]

00:15:36 ◼   ► directly from them are you are you [TS]

00:15:38 ◼   ► remember no most of my family was but [TS]

00:15:42 ◼   ► are not well my late father was a he [TS]

00:15:46 ◼   ► basically his occupation his career was [TS]

00:15:49 ◼   ► I mean he'd been an Eagle Scout he was [TS]

00:15:52 ◼   ► he's from that age we're like normal [TS]

00:15:54 ◼   ► guys had guns and he talked gun safety [TS]

00:15:56 ◼   ► classes and he was in the NRA and he was [TS]

00:15:57 ◼   ► in Ducks Unlimited he's like hey we [TS]

00:15:59 ◼   ► can't kill all the Ducks so we won't get [TS]

00:16:00 ◼   ► to shoot ducks anymore like an early [TS]

00:16:01 ◼   ► kind of like right-wing conservative [TS]

00:16:04 ◼   ► movement like a conservation movement [TS]

00:16:06 ◼   ► like he was oh he was like a good he was [TS]

00:16:08 ◼   ► a good gun guy he taught like I say he [TS]

00:16:09 ◼   ► taught gun safety classes and except for [TS]

00:16:12 ◼   ► Korea never shot a guy [TS]

00:16:14 ◼   ► except for Korea he never shot a guy [TS]

00:16:16 ◼   ► yeah he was he had a bad time in Korea [TS]

00:16:18 ◼   ► it was not a good police action oh [TS]

00:16:20 ◼   ► that's too bad [TS]

00:16:21 ◼   ► yeah hit the PTSD didn't you know didn't [TS]

00:16:25 ◼   ► call it that then they just thought he [TS]

00:16:26 ◼   ► was a guy who didn't like fireworks [TS]

00:16:27 ◼   ► would be a marina or an army he was uh [TS]

00:16:30 ◼   ► he was very briefly a PFC until he got [TS]

00:16:33 ◼   ► busted to basic private because he [TS]

00:16:35 ◼   ► refused to paint a barracks right before [TS]

00:16:38 ◼   ► they he knew they were bugging out oh [TS]

00:16:40 ◼   ► yeah there's just two ways and one of [TS]

00:16:44 ◼   ► them's the army way another way is that [TS]

00:16:46 ◼   ► you could get less money each week yeah [TS]

00:16:48 ◼   ► that's a that's a tough one [TS]

00:16:50 ◼   ► to get to get but busted down he's in he [TS]

00:16:54 ◼   ► was in frontline battles he had frozen [TS]

00:16:55 ◼   ► feet and stuff it was a terrible [TS]

00:16:56 ◼   ► situation no it's awful it was awful it [TS]

00:16:59 ◼   ► was off so he didn't want to watch mash [TS]

00:17:00 ◼   ► let's see he I don't know if he why mash [TS]

00:17:05 ◼   ► is on for a couple years before he died [TS]

00:17:06 ◼   ► I don't remember that being a show that [TS]

00:17:08 ◼   ► we watched but everybody man everybody [TS]

00:17:11 ◼   ► you know Winchester just died Charles [TS]

00:17:13 ◼   ► Emerson Winchester the third Charles [TS]

00:17:15 ◼   ► yeah he just he passed a couple three [TS]

00:17:17 ◼   ► days ago oh no my daughter knows him [TS]

00:17:19 ◼   ► through his voice work he's been who's [TS]

00:17:21 ◼   ► been the voice in many things he's a [TS]

00:17:22 ◼   ► voice in miyazaki movie spirited away he [TS]

00:17:26 ◼   ► is a voice in the wonderful and [TS]

00:17:28 ◼   ► underrated lilo and Stitch huh that and [TS]

00:17:31 ◼   ► he's in a program of terrible not [TS]

00:17:32 ◼   ► terrible a program my daughter likes [TS]

00:17:34 ◼   ► called the Regular Show he also has a [TS]

00:17:35 ◼   ► role in there huh no kidding yeah I'm [TS]

00:17:38 ◼   ► always amazed by people that recognize [TS]

00:17:39 ◼   ► other people's voices didn't voiceover [TS]

00:17:42 ◼   ► work [TS]

00:17:42 ◼   ► I mean I can pick out Morgan free it's [TS]

00:17:44 ◼   ► it's a it's a sport in our house is like [TS]

00:17:46 ◼   ► who can name that person first I fee I [TS]

00:17:48 ◼   ► took you out the Panay toes [TS]

00:17:50 ◼   ► oh no I mean I there was never a time [TS]

00:17:55 ◼   ► where I didn't feel like the National [TS]

00:17:58 ◼   ► Rifle Association was not an [TS]

00:18:01 ◼   ► organization that did not represent me [TS]

00:18:03 ◼   ► wait I guess a lot of knots in that time [TS]

00:18:05 ◼   ► that's right that there's there was [TS]

00:18:08 ◼   ► never be they used to be I mean I think [TS]

00:18:11 ◼   ► the where we stand today is it's fairly [TS]

00:18:13 ◼   ► well known that even though they portray [TS]

00:18:15 ◼   ► themselves as an organization that is [TS]

00:18:17 ◼   ► for people who believe in the Second [TS]

00:18:19 ◼   ► Amendment right to keep and bear arms [TS]

00:18:21 ◼   ► they are I think that was pretend to be [TS]

00:18:23 ◼   ► doing that it is a they are a [TS]

00:18:25 ◼   ► industry-funded lobbying group whose [TS]

00:18:28 ◼   ► primary goal is to sell more guns and [TS]

00:18:30 ◼   ► secondary goal is to not allow anything [TS]

00:18:31 ◼   ► to happen that would prevent selling [TS]

00:18:33 ◼   ► more guns that's not to be cynical but I [TS]

00:18:35 ◼   ► think that's pretty much what they are [TS]

00:18:37 ◼   ► at this point this this was a you know [TS]

00:18:39 ◼   ► the the transformation of the NRA from a [TS]

00:18:42 ◼   ► sportsman's organization to whatever it [TS]

00:18:43 ◼   ► is now a lot everything was a lobbying [TS]

00:18:45 ◼   ► group well but you know a sportsman's [TS]

00:18:49 ◼   ► lobbying group to whatever it is now I [TS]

00:18:51 ◼   ► mean industry centric yeah well or no [TS]

00:18:54 ◼   ► it's not even it I don't think it's that [TS]

00:18:56 ◼   ► it's a propaganda organization now it [TS]

00:18:59 ◼   ► doesn't have anything to I mean but that [TS]

00:19:01 ◼   ► transformations been happening [TS]

00:19:03 ◼   ► throughout the course of my life like my [TS]

00:19:04 ◼   ► and father was even by 1950s [TS]

00:19:10 ◼   ► standards a gun nut like a nut mm-hmm [TS]

00:19:16 ◼   ► I've probably described before that in [TS]

00:19:19 ◼   ► the house the house my mom grew up in [TS]

00:19:23 ◼   ► she said that there were just rifles [TS]

00:19:26 ◼   ► leaning you know in all the corners of [TS]

00:19:29 ◼   ► all the rooms like in the living room [TS]

00:19:32 ◼   ► all four corners just had like rifles [TS]

00:19:36 ◼   ► leaning in them and so when she was home [TS]

00:19:39 ◼   ► alone at night and it's a farm house [TS]

00:19:41 ◼   ► it's out you know a mile from the [TS]

00:19:45 ◼   ► nearest neighbor [TS]

00:19:46 ◼   ► she'd be home alone studying at night [TS]

00:19:49 ◼   ► and I guess they didn't have curtains [TS]

00:19:51 ◼   ► because they couldn't I don't know why [TS]

00:19:55 ◼   ► because back then why would you have [TS]

00:19:57 ◼   ► curtains I'm not sure I don't think they [TS]

00:19:58 ◼   ► were too poor for curtains although they [TS]

00:20:01 ◼   ► right hide nothing curtains right on the [TS]

00:20:04 ◼   ► border of being too poor for curtains [TS]

00:20:06 ◼   ► what we could use that fabric as napkins [TS]

00:20:11 ◼   ► but like guns in the corner and so she [TS]

00:20:14 ◼   ► would move her she would move her little [TS]

00:20:16 ◼   ► study chair to the center of the room [TS]

00:20:19 ◼   ► because she didn't want she was [TS]

00:20:22 ◼   ► obviously like she's you know young girl [TS]

00:20:24 ◼   ► she was afraid that someone was looking [TS]

00:20:27 ◼   ► at her in the in the dark [TS]

00:20:30 ◼   ► somebody was out in the dark looking in [TS]

00:20:31 ◼   ► but she also felt like there are guns in [TS]

00:20:34 ◼   ► all the corners like I'm fine [TS]

00:20:36 ◼   ► ultimately like I can get to a gun [TS]

00:20:39 ◼   ► within seconds but the strange [TS]

00:20:43 ◼   ► environment to grow up in to me yeah and [TS]

00:20:46 ◼   ► it's not natural to her I mean she's [TS]

00:20:51 ◼   ► still she's still deadly people weapons [TS]

00:20:59 ◼   ► and I think one cognitive disconnect [TS]

00:21:02 ◼   ► between in our country right now is that [TS]

00:21:04 ◼   ► there are people who think of guns [TS]

00:21:05 ◼   ► primarily as people killing machines and [TS]

00:21:07 ◼   ► other people who think of it no [TS]

00:21:08 ◼   ► differently than they would think of a [TS]

00:21:09 ◼   ► screwdriver or a hammer it's something [TS]

00:21:11 ◼   ► that's part of a certain rural lifestyle [TS]

00:21:14 ◼   ► that includes hunting and the need for [TS]

00:21:15 ◼   ► protection because there's no one to [TS]

00:21:17 ◼   ► help you there well I mean hunting sure [TS]

00:21:21 ◼   ► but there are a lot of people in America [TS]

00:21:22 ◼   ► that can that look at a rifle I think as [TS]

00:21:24 ◼   ► a tennis racket it's something that you [TS]

00:21:28 ◼   ► go and you get to go to the range or you [TS]

00:21:30 ◼   ► go somewhere and and then planket cans [TS]

00:21:33 ◼   ► or shoot at targets I went to a target [TS]

00:21:36 ◼   ► shooting match the other day a friend of [TS]

00:21:38 ◼   ► mine from Portland is a is a competitive [TS]

00:21:42 ◼   ► shooter and his team was playing the [TS]

00:21:49 ◼   ► local Seattle team and he and his he and [TS]

00:21:52 ◼   ► his pal a fellow shooter came up and I [TS]

00:21:56 ◼   ► went to the range with them and [TS]

00:21:58 ◼   ► they competed against the locals and you [TS]

00:22:01 ◼   ► know the the Portland team maybe [TS]

00:22:03 ◼   ► predictably were all in their 40s [TS]

00:22:10 ◼   ► quickly reduce the pointless infighting [TS]

00:22:12 ◼   ► no like they all had kind of long hair [TS]

00:22:15 ◼   ► and beards and the Seattle team were all [TS]

00:22:18 ◼   ► 7b Oh interesting and had suspenders and [TS]

00:22:23 ◼   ► there's still regionality in anything I [TS]

00:22:25 ◼   ► love that they had suspenders on their [TS]

00:22:27 ◼   ► jeans and you know like the Seattle team [TS]

00:22:31 ◼   ► was definitely like old gun people and [TS]

00:22:35 ◼   ► the Portland team were like we're the [TS]

00:22:36 ◼   ► young you know these are very technical [TS]

00:22:38 ◼   ► instruments these pistols and you know [TS]

00:22:43 ◼   ► that's a whole I mean shit they're still [TS]

00:22:45 ◼   ► shooting in the Olympics get the [TS]

00:22:49 ◼   ► biathlon that's a great that's a crazy [TS]

00:22:51 ◼   ► event did you watch the women's biathlon [TS]

00:22:54 ◼   ► no no no but I just remember well first [TS]

00:22:55 ◼   ► when I first became aware of it as like [TS]

00:22:57 ◼   ► a teen I was like one get this straight [TS]

00:22:58 ◼   ► like you ski really hard you get out of [TS]

00:23:00 ◼   ► breath they always said that's the hard [TS]

00:23:01 ◼   ► part is you're kind of out of breath and [TS]

00:23:03 ◼   ► they need to pull out a rifle and shoot [TS]

00:23:05 ◼   ► very accurately at a distance i watch [TS]

00:23:07 ◼   ► the women's biathlon and it was [TS]

00:23:08 ◼   ► thrilling oh cool some thrilling [TS]

00:23:11 ◼   ► thrilling Olympic drama but you have [TS]

00:23:16 ◼   ► that tennis racquet thing the idea of it [TS]

00:23:20 ◼   ► just being a thing that you go like it's [TS]

00:23:22 ◼   ► just a sport transport to go try and put [TS]

00:23:25 ◼   ► a little little piece of metal into the [TS]

00:23:28 ◼   ► center of a piece of paper that's a long [TS]

00:23:30 ◼   ► way away like but my my grandfather was [TS]

00:23:36 ◼   ► somebody that according to my mom he put [TS]

00:23:39 ◼   ► all of his spare money in guns curtains [TS]

00:23:47 ◼   ► I mean that's right what are you gonna [TS]

00:23:50 ◼   ► do send your daughter to college man so [TS]

00:23:53 ◼   ► by the time he died his gun collection [TS]

00:23:56 ◼   ► was worth a small fortune because he had [TS]

00:24:00 ◼   ► all these plans Wow yeah like he had [TS]

00:24:03 ◼   ► bought all these beautiful weapons and [TS]

00:24:05 ◼   ► and he had [TS]

00:24:09 ◼   ► score upon score of them and I guess my [TS]

00:24:14 ◼   ► mother's brother took who also was Gunny [TS]

00:24:19 ◼   ► he wasn't like super gun nut but he was [TS]

00:24:23 ◼   ► gonna sh [TS]

00:24:23 ◼   ► at least gonna jacent but he he took it [TS]

00:24:28 ◼   ► all and sold it sold it all as a big you [TS]

00:24:32 ◼   ► know as a as a major component of his [TS]

00:24:34 ◼   ► quote unquote estate which I think was [TS]

00:24:36 ◼   ► largely made of guns ended up being a [TS]

00:24:47 ◼   ► shelter former shelter and I was I'm [TS]

00:24:50 ◼   ► actually even now many many years later [TS]

00:24:53 ◼   ► decades later I feel a little bit like [TS]

00:24:59 ◼   ► the little tiny piece of me is missing [TS]

00:25:03 ◼   ► in that I do not have a single one of my [TS]

00:25:06 ◼   ► grandfather's my crazy grandfather's oh [TS]

00:25:09 ◼   ► I can totally understand that yeah some [TS]

00:25:13 ◼   ► just like some bird rifle or something [TS]

00:25:15 ◼   ► you know what is it there's a [TS]

00:25:16 ◼   ► long-running beef in my near family [TS]

00:25:20 ◼   ► where basically at some point after my [TS]

00:25:23 ◼   ► dad died an acquaintance of our family [TS]

00:25:25 ◼   ► was like basically taking care of my [TS]

00:25:27 ◼   ► dad's collection of rifles and pistols [TS]

00:25:29 ◼   ► and my mom had asked for it back never [TS]

00:25:32 ◼   ► got it back into this day she's still [TS]

00:25:34 ◼   ► steamed about it yeah that's how it was [TS]

00:25:37 ◼   ► at the time like that's very assist that [TS]

00:25:39 ◼   ► would be like keeping his watch in his [TS]

00:25:40 ◼   ► wallet or something keeping his watch in [TS]

00:25:42 ◼   ► his wallet exactly my brother David got [TS]

00:25:44 ◼   ► my dad's Navy flight jacket a long time [TS]

00:25:48 ◼   ► before I came along right he grabbed [TS]

00:25:49 ◼   ► that out of the closet cuz that's a [TS]

00:25:51 ◼   ► weird thing in 1968 let's let's put [TS]

00:25:57 ◼   ► let's locate this story in 1968 when my [TS]

00:26:01 ◼   ► brother David would have been 18 my dad [TS]

00:26:05 ◼   ► is not my dad already is looking at his [TS]

00:26:07 ◼   ► Navy flight jacket as some moth-eaten [TS]

00:26:09 ◼   ► old thing that's hanging around the back [TS]

00:26:13 ◼   ► of his closet talk about 23 years there [TS]

00:26:15 ◼   ► yeah and when his teenage kids like hey [TS]

00:26:17 ◼   ► let me wear you let me wear your jacket [TS]

00:26:20 ◼   ► in my dad's like sure whatever you know [TS]

00:26:23 ◼   ► get it out of here not even thinking [TS]

00:26:26 ◼   ► that he would ever have another son who [TS]

00:26:28 ◼   ► would 20 years later who has kids that [TS]

00:26:33 ◼   ► later [TS]

00:26:34 ◼   ► yes exactly who would ever want that [TS]

00:26:37 ◼   ► jacket later you know what more mm-hmm [TS]

00:26:40 ◼   ► wanted more take better care of it so my [TS]

00:26:42 ◼   ► brother you know my brother took it and [TS]

00:26:44 ◼   ► I'm sure like put out his joints on it [TS]

00:26:47 ◼   ► for however long and then it just was [TS]

00:26:51 ◼   ► gone [TS]

00:26:52 ◼   ► just went into the went into the shit [TS]

00:26:53 ◼   ► pile like all the other jackets that [TS]

00:26:55 ◼   ► that hippies didn't appreciate but I did [TS]

00:27:00 ◼   ► get my dad's watch in his wallet [TS]

00:27:02 ◼   ► I feel a little bit bad about it because [TS]

00:27:05 ◼   ► I was over at his old folks home one day [TS]

00:27:08 ◼   ► I was in the bathroom looking for a [TS]

00:27:10 ◼   ► q-tip and I opened up some drawer and [TS]

00:27:12 ◼   ► his watch was in there never tell you [TS]

00:27:15 ◼   ► this [TS]

00:27:15 ◼   ► no and I said dad what's your watch [TS]

00:27:18 ◼   ► doing in this in the bathroom and he [TS]

00:27:22 ◼   ► said oh I you know put it in there so [TS]

00:27:24 ◼   ► the cleaning lady won't find it and I [TS]

00:27:27 ◼   ► said the cleaning Li is first of all [TS]

00:27:29 ◼   ► that's not the problem but second of all [TS]

00:27:31 ◼   ► the bathroom isn't like the place and I [TS]

00:27:37 ◼   ► said I'll tell you what I'll I'll take [TS]

00:27:39 ◼   ► it and keep it for you I'll protect it [TS]

00:27:42 ◼   ► for you and he said you're stealing my [TS]

00:27:45 ◼   ► watch can't go better than a cleaning [TS]

00:27:47 ◼   ► lady and I said I'm not stealing your [TS]

00:27:50 ◼   ► watch like you're not wearing it anymore [TS]

00:27:52 ◼   ► what do you what do you thinks gonna [TS]

00:27:54 ◼   ► happen to this watch this watch this [TS]

00:27:56 ◼   ► this is a this is the topic of watch [TS]

00:28:00 ◼   ► advertising you hand your watch down [TS]

00:28:03 ◼   ► that's what happens [TS]

00:28:04 ◼   ► old men hand their watches down to their [TS]

00:28:06 ◼   ► young sons he was like bullshit [TS]

00:28:09 ◼   ► Oh cuz the struggle the struggle at that [TS]

00:28:13 ◼   ► point is very much about maintaining [TS]

00:28:15 ◼   ► agency and relevance and importance and [TS]

00:28:20 ◼   ► like taken away the greatest generations [TS]

00:28:22 ◼   ► watch is wasting leo you don't need to [TS]

00:28:24 ◼   ► know what time it is anymore well right [TS]

00:28:26 ◼   ► but what I was afraid of and it's a [TS]

00:28:28 ◼   ► natural that he was gonna hide it by [TS]

00:28:30 ◼   ► tucking it in the couch right you know [TS]

00:28:33 ◼   ► tucking it in his rent [TS]

00:28:34 ◼   ► did couch and the biggest mistake I feel [TS]

00:28:38 ◼   ► like I made we were cleaning out his [TS]

00:28:41 ◼   ► house and he had some gateway computer [TS]

00:28:46 ◼   ► that he used to Peck out emails to me on [TS]

00:28:50 ◼   ► you know where it was just like he would [TS]

00:28:53 ◼   ► after a while just stopped using [TS]

00:28:55 ◼   ► punctuation I mean it was you know he [TS]

00:28:57 ◼   ► was just like hey what are you doing you [TS]

00:29:00 ◼   ► know email and when I when I was [TS]

00:29:07 ◼   ► cleaning out his place I was just like [TS]

00:29:08 ◼   ► you know he had mostly particleboard [TS]

00:29:12 ◼   ► furniture by then and and I just put [TS]

00:29:16 ◼   ► that gateway computer in a box and took [TS]

00:29:18 ◼   ► it to the thrift store and it never [TS]

00:29:21 ◼   ► occurred to me and honestly the chances [TS]

00:29:25 ◼   ► of this are about 6% but there's a six [TS]

00:29:30 ◼   ► percent chance that he had been sitting [TS]

00:29:32 ◼   ► at that computer pecking out some [TS]

00:29:36 ◼   ► autobiography right and the thing is I [TS]

00:29:39 ◼   ► know that it's six percent rather even [TS]

00:29:42 ◼   ► than 16 percent because he never did [TS]

00:29:46 ◼   ► anything like that in his whole life [TS]

00:29:49 ◼   ► he never sat down see how he would think [TS]

00:29:51 ◼   ► about using the tool even how to present [TS]

00:29:54 ◼   ► well I'm 90% sure that he didn't think [TS]

00:30:00 ◼   ► of it that way but but he you know he [TS]

00:30:02 ◼   ► was a lawyer he was no stranger to [TS]

00:30:04 ◼   ► filling up legal pads but he never once [TS]

00:30:08 ◼   ► that I ever saw and I have every legal [TS]

00:30:11 ◼   ► pad he ever touched because I'm a [TS]

00:30:13 ◼   ► because I didn't I threw away his [TS]

00:30:16 ◼   ► computer but I didn't throw away all [TS]

00:30:17 ◼   ► these legal pads but he never was like [TS]

00:30:20 ◼   ► you know I was thinking or you know he [TS]

00:30:24 ◼   ► never wrote a single page of like [TS]

00:30:25 ◼   ► reflections on the way life used to be [TS]

00:30:29 ◼   ► huh like he never done so so I don't [TS]

00:30:35 ◼   ► think that his computer was full of his [TS]

00:30:38 ◼   ► autobiographical notes but I've had 6 [TS]

00:30:42 ◼   ► percent chance that it wasn't eats at [TS]

00:30:44 ◼   ► you just a little I mean there's so many [TS]

00:30:47 ◼   ► things [TS]

00:30:48 ◼   ► eating at me I feel like I'm in a I'm in [TS]

00:30:49 ◼   ► the Amazon and I'm I'm being pecked at [TS]

00:30:52 ◼   ► from all sides although apparently [TS]

00:30:54 ◼   ► that's not how piranhas work as a team [TS]

00:30:58 ◼   ► right well but if you stepped in to the [TS]

00:31:00 ◼   ► you could walk across the Amazon and the [TS]

00:31:02 ◼   ► piranhas would not skeletonize me it's [TS]

00:31:04 ◼   ► so good to know yeah I think that's I [TS]

00:31:06 ◼   ► think I learned that on one of those [TS]

00:31:08 ◼   ► unless the word John I could not get to [TS]

00:31:09 ◼   ► use that right now you don't have a real [TS]

00:31:13 ◼   ► piranha problem there in the sunset [TS]

00:31:15 ◼   ► though see we're back to work back to [TS]

00:31:17 ◼   ► gorilla suits in quicksand [TS]

00:31:18 ◼   ► like piranhas another one of those [TS]

00:31:20 ◼   ► things that we were raised to believe [TS]

00:31:21 ◼   ► was something that was like a genuine [TS]

00:31:22 ◼   ► issue of concern oh sure quick I mean [TS]

00:31:25 ◼   ► like you can't tell these millenniums [TS]

00:31:26 ◼   ► but like there was a time when we can [TS]

00:31:28 ◼   ► all be pretty sure that somebody you [TS]

00:31:29 ◼   ► knew would die in quicksand it was [TS]

00:31:31 ◼   ► everywhere absolute gorilla suits every [TS]

00:31:34 ◼   ► where so many gorilla suits and they [TS]

00:31:36 ◼   ► just don't hear about in piranhas just [TS]

00:31:37 ◼   ► don't come up anymore you don't hear [TS]

00:31:39 ◼   ► about them the way you did it's [TS]

00:31:40 ◼   ► absolutely true there was one killer bee [TS]

00:31:43 ◼   ► killer bee there F well Africanized bees [TS]

00:31:45 ◼   ► hmm one one week in 1968 March 31st [TS]

00:31:51 ◼   ► Lyndon Johnson announces he will not [TS]

00:31:53 ◼   ► seek re-election now you hear that today [TS]

00:31:55 ◼   ► and you go oh no big deal it was a huge [TS]

00:31:57 ◼   ► deal it was a huge shocking deal when he [TS]

00:31:59 ◼   ► said he would not seek it he would not [TS]

00:32:01 ◼   ► accept you think about another president [TS]

00:32:03 ◼   ► who said no not for me [TS]

00:32:07 ◼   ► April 2nd April 2nd 2001 comes out April [TS]

00:32:10 ◼   ► 3rd Planet of the Apes comes out April [TS]

00:32:11 ◼   ► 4th Martin Luther King is assassinated [TS]

00:32:13 ◼   ► also April 4th Apollo 6 is launched [TS]

00:32:18 ◼   ► April 6th a shootout between Black [TS]

00:32:20 ◼   ► Panthers and Oakland Police result in [TS]

00:32:22 ◼   ► several arrests and deaths including [TS]

00:32:23 ◼   ► sixteen-year-old Panther Bobby Hutton [TS]

00:32:25 ◼   ► that was one week yes indeedy-do uh-huh [TS]

00:32:31 ◼   ► and that's what that was all immediately [TS]

00:32:33 ◼   ► before I was born [TS]

00:32:34 ◼   ► now you were born by then yeah I was [TS]

00:32:36 ◼   ► getting born you were alive and this is [TS]

00:32:38 ◼   ► you know this is what you would think [TS]

00:32:41 ◼   ► that there would be a generation divider [TS]

00:32:44 ◼   ► between if you were born before Martin [TS]

00:32:48 ◼   ► Luther King was killed or after thanks [TS]

00:32:52 ◼   ► SME street might be a bigger deal Sesame [TS]

00:32:55 ◼   ► Street it feels like but but don't you [TS]

00:32:56 ◼   ► feel like there's a generation gap that [TS]

00:32:58 ◼   ► starts with people where do you [TS]

00:33:01 ◼   ► think you start to feel like people are [TS]

00:33:03 ◼   ► younger than you what what age when they [TS]

00:33:06 ◼   ► were born I have a totally crazy one but [TS]

00:33:09 ◼   ► it's unavoidable this is really dumb and [TS]

00:33:11 ◼   ► so trivial but like a lot of my friends [TS]

00:33:14 ◼   ► who are just slightly younger than me or [TS]

00:33:15 ◼   ► feel just slightly younger than me I had [TS]

00:33:17 ◼   ► a couple things for better for worse [TS]

00:33:19 ◼   ► like I was born late in 1966 and I [TS]

00:33:22 ◼   ► started school late so I was one of the [TS]

00:33:24 ◼   ► older kids in my class but with that [TS]

00:33:25 ◼   ► said friends of mine who just feel just [TS]

00:33:27 ◼   ► slightly younger than me a real ended [TS]

00:33:28 ◼   ► like shitty 80s robot cartoons where I [TS]

00:33:32 ◼   ► was already on to like you know Doctor [TS]

00:33:34 ◼   ► Who or whatever right there's all this [TS]

00:33:37 ◼   ► affection for like and then just [TS]

00:33:39 ◼   ► slightly younger than that you already [TS]

00:33:40 ◼   ► get into Pokemon I'm like Pokemon like I [TS]

00:33:42 ◼   ► was fucking like 25 when that came out [TS]

00:33:44 ◼   ► you know so how so where is that line I [TS]

00:33:47 ◼   ► mean do you think of me as younger than [TS]

00:33:49 ◼   ► you I used to but now I do not let's [TS]

00:33:53 ◼   ► toss out a few in the indie rock days [TS]

00:33:56 ◼   ► when you and I first met mm-hmm we were [TS]

00:33:58 ◼   ► already both in our thirties yeah that's [TS]

00:34:00 ◼   ► true about my relationship with you like [TS]

00:34:04 ◼   ► well you know did you and Marilyn like [TS]

00:34:05 ◼   ► always did you or did you use to text [TS]

00:34:08 ◼   ► each other I was like what no podcast is [TS]

00:34:21 ◼   ► that we used to talk on the phone and [TS]

00:34:23 ◼   ► neither of us wanted to talk on the [TS]

00:34:25 ◼   ► phone but that was the only way you [TS]

00:34:26 ◼   ► could talk to you on the phone yeah we [TS]

00:34:28 ◼   ► watched a Kitchen Nightmares the other [TS]

00:34:30 ◼   ► day where the guy had a flip phone and [TS]

00:34:31 ◼   ► my daughter was like what is he doing [TS]

00:34:32 ◼   ► with that phone I was like yeah well [TS]

00:34:34 ◼   ► that's like when this show came out [TS]

00:34:35 ◼   ► that's the phone that most people had [TS]

00:34:37 ◼   ► know yesterday we I was at a restaurant [TS]

00:34:40 ◼   ► in Canadia and there was a there was a [TS]

00:34:42 ◼   ► phone like a desk phone but it was even [TS]

00:34:44 ◼   ► older than I would have ever seen it was [TS]

00:34:46 ◼   ► like a bakelite phone like a [TS]

00:34:48 ◼   ► ding-a-ling-a-ling son like a [TS]

00:34:49 ◼   ► ding-a-ling phone and my daughter picked [TS]

00:34:51 ◼   ► it up and it was a dial phone a rotary [TS]

00:34:54 ◼   ► phone and I said do you know how those [TS]

00:34:56 ◼   ► work and she said yes and she she put [TS]

00:35:01 ◼   ► her finger in it and she said you put [TS]

00:35:02 ◼   ► your finger in here and you move it to [TS]

00:35:04 ◼   ► the number that you want to call so I [TS]

00:35:07 ◼   ► want to call for instance I want to call [TS]

00:35:08 ◼   ► the letter C French to move it up to the [TS]

00:35:11 ◼   ► letter C and then went to dit and she [TS]

00:35:14 ◼   ► was like [TS]

00:35:15 ◼   ► tada I said well yeah it's not too far [TS]

00:35:19 ◼   ► off your clothes [TS]

00:35:21 ◼   ► yeah we found out we found out mixed in [TS]

00:35:23 ◼   ► with all of our many stickers books was [TS]

00:35:26 ◼   ► a copy of a zine that I used to like [TS]

00:35:28 ◼   ► which is a zine about big star called [TS]

00:35:31 ◼   ► back of a car and she's like what is [TS]

00:35:32 ◼   ► this comic that's like it's it's like a [TS]

00:35:36 ◼   ► magazine but little and it's and it had [TS]

00:35:38 ◼   ► a flexi disc and still had the flexi [TS]

00:35:40 ◼   ► disc like staple inside of it and I felt [TS]

00:35:42 ◼   ► like but when we first met she felt that [TS]

00:35:48 ◼   ► I was a little bit younger than you [TS]

00:35:49 ◼   ► because there were musical cues that you [TS]

00:35:52 ◼   ► that that could differentiate a year and [TS]

00:35:57 ◼   ► a half in age it's like you know what [TS]

00:36:00 ◼   ► the same with your kids like you your [TS]

00:36:01 ◼   ► daughter Shirley has friends has had [TS]

00:36:04 ◼   ► friends through her life that are just [TS]

00:36:05 ◼   ► like you know those kind of like maybe [TS]

00:36:06 ◼   ► you don't see them every week but it's [TS]

00:36:08 ◼   ► your ongoing oh that was your that was [TS]

00:36:09 ◼   ► your really good friend when you were a [TS]

00:36:10 ◼   ► baby and they're like what are you [TS]

00:36:11 ◼   ► talking about like there's a friend [TS]

00:36:12 ◼   ► there's might be a friend who's like a [TS]

00:36:13 ◼   ► year older and she started almost [TS]

00:36:15 ◼   ► certainly probably at this point has [TS]

00:36:16 ◼   ► friends who are like a year younger and [TS]

00:36:18 ◼   ► that year for obvious reasons matters [TS]

00:36:20 ◼   ► less and less mostly as you get older [TS]

00:36:23 ◼   ► right and in that case like you know [TS]

00:36:25 ◼   ► that's like again the mr. show bit like [TS]

00:36:27 ◼   ► I'm into Star Wars you're into that a [TS]

00:36:28 ◼   ► Empire Strikes Back bullshit you know [TS]

00:36:30 ◼   ► it's like these these incredibly small [TS]

00:36:32 ◼   ► differences become less and less [TS]

00:36:34 ◼   ► important but like when we met oh shit [TS]

00:36:36 ◼   ► dog Joe Joe from from the label had a [TS]

00:36:40 ◼   ► tooth the other day part um what is it [TS]

00:36:43 ◼   ► the thermals is it more [TS]

00:36:44 ◼   ► parts-per-million came out it's like oh [TS]

00:36:50 ◼   ► yeah like Eric knows those guys and it's [TS]

00:36:53 ◼   ► like it was a big deal like oh this this [TS]

00:36:54 ◼   ► is this really cool record though [TS]

00:36:58 ◼   ► doesn't that seem insane well especially [TS]

00:37:01 ◼   ► since I still think of the thermals has [TS]

00:37:03 ◼   ► like like youngster kids little guys in [TS]

00:37:07 ◼   ► the shirts yeah yeah yeah but but like [TS]

00:37:09 ◼   ► when we met like I at that point was you [TS]

00:37:13 ◼   ► and I were branched in slightly [TS]

00:37:14 ◼   ► different directions in terms of like [TS]

00:37:16 ◼   ► what we knew a lot about or were real [TS]

00:37:17 ◼   ► into and I was certainly deep in my [TS]

00:37:19 ◼   ► Sloan phase and a lot of like you know [TS]

00:37:21 ◼   ► the Canadian rock and stuff at that [TS]

00:37:22 ◼   ► point and you were very very up-to-date [TS]

00:37:24 ◼   ► unlike what was happening on the charts [TS]

00:37:26 ◼   ► and in the vnw [TS]

00:37:27 ◼   ► and all that kind of stuff but I don't [TS]

00:37:30 ◼   ► remember talking to ton when we talked [TS]

00:37:32 ◼   ► about old music it would be like you me [TS]

00:37:34 ◼   ► and Shawn talking about like very old [TS]

00:37:36 ◼   ► music listen which I mean like in our [TS]

00:37:39 ◼   ► lifetime but that was a long time ago [TS]

00:37:40 ◼   ► but you were really you you you really [TS]

00:37:44 ◼   ► took us in hand and and like actually [TS]

00:37:47 ◼   ► literally sat us down like come in here [TS]

00:37:51 ◼   ► sit down and begin to show us things we [TS]

00:37:56 ◼   ► hadn't seen famously electronic stuff [TS]

00:38:01 ◼   ► yeah like here's what here's what the [TS]

00:38:04 ◼   ► internet forum is in that forum but also [TS]

00:38:08 ◼   ► like you showed us the office for the [TS]

00:38:11 ◼   ► first time the British seen or heard of [TS]

00:38:15 ◼   ► when that was still contemporary you you [TS]

00:38:19 ◼   ► were the first person who had a DVR that [TS]

00:38:22 ◼   ► any of us had put the Jeff Bridges that [TS]

00:38:25 ◼   ► we watch it oh my god and it would and [TS]

00:38:35 ◼   ► this was before there was like gifts or [TS]

00:38:38 ◼   ► any kind of internet just keeping the TV [TS]

00:38:43 ◼   ► like I saved this like 11 seconds [TS]

00:38:46 ◼   ► there's this one time when I turned the [TS]

00:38:48 ◼   ► channel and accidentally caught Jeff [TS]

00:38:49 ◼   ► Bridges being seemingly pretty high on [TS]

00:38:52 ◼   ► Charlie Rose and it was really really [TS]

00:38:54 ◼   ► funny and we would watch it over and [TS]

00:38:55 ◼   ► over I can never find it now I don't [TS]

00:39:04 ◼   ► know I wouldn't even know where to look [TS]

00:39:05 ◼   ► for it it was so it was so it felt so [TS]

00:39:08 ◼   ► contemporary it was it was a technology [TS]

00:39:11 ◼   ► that none of us possessed like so wait a [TS]

00:39:14 ◼   ► minute wait a minute explain this again [TS]

00:39:15 ◼   ► you were you were changing channels you [TS]

00:39:17 ◼   ► can just go watch any Seinfeld now yeah [TS]

00:39:20 ◼   ► and it was recording somehow and you [TS]

00:39:23 ◼   ► were able to go back and and you were [TS]

00:39:25 ◼   ► like yeah it's recording everything all [TS]

00:39:27 ◼   ► the time you can watch whatever you want [TS]

00:39:28 ◼   ► whenever like recording everything all [TS]

00:39:30 ◼   ► the time how does it do it where does [TS]

00:39:32 ◼   ► keep the tapes it's turning it over [TS]

00:39:35 ◼   ► looking around they're elves [TS]

00:39:37 ◼   ► this work yeah right where are the tubes [TS]

00:39:40 ◼   ► and that felt so in that case that's [TS]

00:39:42 ◼   ► funny okay I haven't thought that much [TS]

00:39:43 ◼   ► about that I do have many fond [TS]

00:39:44 ◼   ► recollections of your band and me [TS]

00:39:46 ◼   ► sitting around in our underwear and [TS]

00:39:48 ◼   ► while my wife went to work and I [TS]

00:39:49 ◼   ► watching TV well there was a lot of that [TS]

00:39:51 ◼   ► but also I mean one night when I first [TS]

00:39:54 ◼   ► when you and I first met and I and this [TS]

00:39:56 ◼   ► is obviously like a story drenched in [TS]

00:39:58 ◼   ► moss but you still had a PC running in [TS]

00:40:02 ◼   ► your office yeah but you had begun to [TS]

00:40:06 ◼   ► evangelize about Macintosh well justjust [TS]

00:40:09 ◼   ► clarify Macs have been my computer since [TS]

00:40:11 ◼   ► 1987 and I've owned one since 88 it's [TS]

00:40:14 ◼   ► just that for that there was a period [TS]

00:40:15 ◼   ► where I had two computers one of which [TS]

00:40:17 ◼   ► is a very old like 386 PC that I just [TS]

00:40:19 ◼   ► used for development and listening to [TS]

00:40:20 ◼   ► streaming music that was but pretty much [TS]

00:40:22 ◼   ► all but it was it wasn't like a big [TS]

00:40:24 ◼   ► board long like a big piece of plywood [TS]

00:40:25 ◼   ► in my office but it was the first time [TS]

00:40:27 ◼   ► that somebody it was in that what was [TS]

00:40:30 ◼   ► this that we're talking about 2003 [TS]

00:40:32 ◼   ► probably yeah - when you and I first met [TS]

00:40:36 ◼   ► we were on tour with Ken string it was [TS]

00:40:38 ◼   ► after the first record him before the [TS]

00:40:41 ◼   ► second record because the second record [TS]

00:40:42 ◼   ► was what you know that was that was kind [TS]

00:40:44 ◼   ► of when we became really I think better [TS]

00:40:46 ◼   ► friends and like went to the website and [TS]

00:40:47 ◼   ► everything a 2002 was when when we met [TS]

00:40:51 ◼   ► for sure we did something to her out [TS]

00:40:54 ◼   ► with the Stringfellow on his touched [TS]

00:40:56 ◼   ► tour that's such a good record it is a [TS]

00:40:58 ◼   ► good record it pains me to say that song [TS]

00:41:01 ◼   ► uniforms oh my god it's so good but it [TS]

00:41:03 ◼   ► was an oh my god do you know the day [TS]

00:41:07 ◼   ► that it came out I'll give you a hint [TS]

00:41:09 ◼   ► same day a very good jay-z record came [TS]

00:41:11 ◼   ► out that got a little overlooked for a [TS]

00:41:12 ◼   ► while holy shit oh it came out on [TS]

00:41:14 ◼   ► September 11 9/11 2001 Wow that's right [TS]

00:41:17 ◼   ► I do remember holy shit and that's the [TS]

00:41:19 ◼   ► reason that we didn't tour it until a [TS]

00:41:23 ◼   ► little bit later because it was like [TS]