0:00:01the incomparable number 310 eight july
0:00:062016 welcome back everybody to the
0:00:11incomparable i'm your host Jason style
0:00:13we're here to talk about the TV season
0:00:16on past now TV is to a sort of a 12
0:00:18month a year thing now but we like to
0:00:22mark the end of the traditional TV
0:00:24season we did an episode about all the
0:00:26many superhero shows that are out there
0:00:28but there's a lot more we usually at the
0:00:31end of the game of thrones season we
0:00:33talk about it so we're gonna we're gonna
0:00:34do that tonight and we're also going to
0:00:37talk about a bunch of other shows that
0:00:38we liked over the last year basically
0:00:41nine months a year that don't involve
0:00:44superheroes basically so joining me to
0:00:47talk about more TV from the past year
0:00:50things that we liked and watched maybe
0:00:52we didn't like them but we still watch
0:00:53them that's a compulsion that happens
0:00:55our might define panelist and more'n
0:00:58hello hello
0:00:59I thank you for turning away from TV
0:01:01temporarily just to talk on a podcast
0:01:03about TV
0:01:04I literally finished a TV episode so
0:01:07that i could come on to talk about TV
0:01:09amazing amazing I is your commitment
0:01:12you're welcome
0:01:14only in Sims is also here hello hello
0:01:17turns out you were saying on Twitter you
0:01:18you watch a lot more TV than you thought
0:01:20you did when you put the list together
0:01:22yeah we I was frantically trying to like
0:01:25us putting my going through itunes like
0:01:27okay what if we purchased and I was like
0:01:29oh we've spent more money on TV than I
0:01:31thought we had so it's very exciting
0:01:34yeah you lose track a little bit and
0:01:36then you're reminded when it's time to
0:01:37sum it up and you realize oh Erica and
0:01:40signs also with us
0:01:41hello hi yeah I've watch less TV than i
0:01:44thought but i think i came up with two
0:01:46shows that probably nobody else watched
0:01:48all right but at least i watch something
0:01:50gosh darn it it's good uh brian hamilton
0:01:53is also here
0:01:53hi brian i'm also quite out of the loop
0:01:55when it comes to most TV but I've got
0:01:57some unique things I don't think many
0:01:58people are watching enough to talk about
0:02:00my podcasts owe her a nice very nice
0:02:03somebody who is the the one person here
0:02:06who does not watch Game of Thrones but
0:02:08he's here to talk about shows that
0:02:10aren't game of thrones David lure hi I'm
0:02:12just happy to say that winter is
0:02:14here really inaccuracies yeah but yes i
0:02:19have a nice list and also always joining
0:02:22us for this season rap game of thrones
0:02:24business is mr. John siracusa hi I'm
0:02:27missing the last 10 minutes of the
0:02:29second-to-last episode of asian car did
0:02:31you know there are they became like to
0:02:32our episodes at some point it's really
0:02:34confusing and it's messing with my
0:02:35scheduling but anyway that's a show I
0:02:37watched the baby burn that off
0:02:40basically it's sad that APC didn't have
0:02:42a lot of commitment in it
0:02:44alright so before we talk about Game of
0:02:46Thrones for the second part of the of
0:02:48the show and consult the show notes or
0:02:50the chapter markers if you want to jump
0:02:51to the game of thrones part not listen
0:02:54to other things but i want to talk about
0:02:56other shows that we watched that are we
0:02:59weren't covered in the superhero episode
0:03:00that we wanna do we wanna bring up and I
0:03:03want to throw one out there first which
0:03:05is one of the more notable shows that
0:03:07the last year I i caught up on it after
0:03:09the Golden Globe win for its a creator
0:03:14and lead actress crazy ex-girlfriend on
0:03:17the CW i thought was a real find of this
0:03:19year a lot of fun name up a musical with
0:03:22a funny title that made a turn a lot of
0:03:24people off i think but a very smart
0:03:26funny and self-aware musical series
0:03:31comedy drama thing unlike many other
0:03:35shows that are out there and I got
0:03:38finally got caught up i watched all of
0:03:39them and I thought it was great
0:03:41I thought it was really great and i know
0:03:43that some of the some of you have also
0:03:44seen it John you you were praising crazy
0:03:48ex-girlfriend I saw you and Rachel bloom
0:03:49actually had a little Twitter exchange
0:03:51which was kind of exciting
0:03:52yeah we're besties yeah totally i was i
0:03:55was charmed by it because I thought you
0:03:57said is totally accurate i was totally
0:03:59turned off by the title I didn't think
0:04:00this this is not a show for me I thought
0:04:02just didn't seem like something i would
0:04:04be interested in but i also know nothing
0:04:06about it other than the title so her
0:04:08enough people raving about it and I
0:04:09watched an episode of two and i was
0:04:12surprised i was surprised by the singing
0:04:14I was surprised by how clever it was and
0:04:15how is in a different twist on the sort
0:04:18of it's not it's not as cynical I think
0:04:21as most comedies are and i'm not even
0:04:23like a comedy sitcom kind of person
0:04:26as it war on it's like there's a lot of
0:04:30the more of the same so the charm kind
0:04:31of wears off because a lot of it is the
0:04:33the novelty of that but i don't think
0:04:35the show actually gets any worse I think
0:04:37it's just always going to be this and
0:04:39it's gonna be yeah yeah episode after
0:04:41episode of this but I still like it i
0:04:43still enjoyed and I will keep watching
0:04:45it its musical theater on TV so of
0:04:49course i like it and yeah it's it's
0:04:52uneven for the first two episodes 3
0:04:55episodes but it it finds its footing a
0:04:57lot quicker than shows like cougar town
0:04:59which also had a really unfortunate
0:05:01title and turned into a pretty decent
0:05:03show
0:05:03yeah i was gonna throw don't trust the B
0:05:05in apartment 23 with krysten ritter is
0:05:07another example of a show that I
0:05:08literally didn't watch because i didn't
0:05:10notice but I looked at the title i'm
0:05:11like yeah I that's not for me and I
0:05:13actually thought that was gonna be the
0:05:14premise of this show too and it's like
0:05:15it turns out these premises these titles
0:05:18can like they're notable and yet they
0:05:20can shoot down there show ya just about
0:05:23yeah but it's it's charming i mean the
0:05:26just the videos I've sent people to the
0:05:28videos of the songs just to say this is
0:05:31what you could see weekly and you know
0:05:34you've got Rachel bloom and Adam
0:05:36schlessinger of fountains of wayne
0:05:38writing music yeah and not just in one
0:05:40style I mean they're hitting and you
0:05:43know decades of of styles here and
0:05:46nailing pretty much every one of them
0:05:48which you know it takes it takes cojones
0:05:52to do a fake music man song and do it
0:05:55that well I am impressed by the fact
0:05:57that the there are moments where I i see
0:06:01where they're going in terms of the
0:06:03clichés and then I'm surprised because
0:06:05I just assume they're falling into the
0:06:06clichés that they don't I i like the
0:06:09fact that the object of her of her
0:06:11affection
0:06:12josh is not i would say a character that
0:06:16you see a lot on television in that he
0:06:19is not the sharpest tool in the shed but
0:06:22he he's a but he's a nice like a
0:06:25genuinely nice guy and I think it's an
0:06:27interesting combination that usually in
0:06:28a soapy kind of story that guy is either
0:06:32just a super amazing dream boat or he's
0:06:34a CAD and this guy is not either of
0:06:37those things he's just a dude
0:06:39who is / is very nice but not
0:06:43necessarily close to as smart as Rachel
0:06:47blooms character is so I thought that
0:06:49was interesting i I'm my own frustration
0:06:51with the show was probably that I felt
0:06:53like again that they set up a lot of
0:06:55things that seem fairly obvious as
0:06:57directions they were going in and then
0:06:58seemed over the course of the season to
0:07:00not be sure whether they wanted to steer
0:07:02into the slide or away from the slide
0:07:05like do we go against what we set up or
0:07:07do we go with what we set up and in the
0:07:10the relationships of the various
0:07:12characters over the course of the season
0:07:14that was the part where I thought it was
0:07:15kind of strange where it's like I see in
0:07:184 episode was like I see what's gonna
0:07:19happen she's gonna move to California
0:07:21and because that's the premise of the
0:07:23show the woman who's a lawyer in New
0:07:25York is very unhappy with California
0:07:27where her ex-boyfriend from Camp lives
0:07:29and there are lots of songs and she
0:07:32tries to pretend that she's not a
0:07:33stalker which she kinda is but it's very
0:07:36clear from the beginning that she's
0:07:37gonna end up with the cynical bartender
0:07:40and not the dream boy because that can't
0:07:43be real and throughout the season it
0:07:45feels like not like a clever will wonder
0:07:48what is my expectation about this
0:07:49relationship but more like they can't
0:07:52decide whether they're gonna go with the
0:07:53one guy or the other guy or what
0:07:56and that that part III did feel like
0:07:58almost like the writers just didn't know
0:08:00what they wanted to do but it's a it's a
0:08:03relatively minor quibble there's a whole
0:08:05episode where they're trapped in a party
0:08:07bus and it is the least exciting party
0:08:09bus ever as they go to the beach
0:08:12yeah it'sit's I i highly recommend it's
0:08:14available on streaming now I think just
0:08:16just went up on for streaming on netflix
0:08:20maybe so young people check it out to
0:08:23your point David I know nothing about
0:08:25the show but I've seen settle for me
0:08:26about 10-15 times just because the song
0:08:28so fantastic and I thought oh ok yeah
0:08:31this is AI know sitcom and they do a
0:08:33cute little musical scene here I no idea
0:08:35was a musical until just now so thanks
0:08:37for selling me on it
0:08:38oh yeah I mean there's there's a song
0:08:39look up cold shower which is basically
0:08:42you got trouble from the music man there
0:08:45is a song that I
0:08:46no entirely too many women have told me
0:08:49this is their life a song called heavy
0:08:52boobs sure yeah oh yeah that's a great
0:08:54song that's an amazing zone its and it's
0:08:57catchy as hell
0:08:58oh god yes ya know it it is there
0:09:01they're like to at least I basically
0:09:02there to musical numbers every episode
0:09:04is an hour long show which every time I
0:09:06watch it I think it's going to be a half
0:09:08hour because it's kind of comedy but
0:09:09it's it's not into hour-long show so
0:09:12it's breezy and and on Monday nights it
0:09:14was a nice pairing with Jane the Virgin
0:09:16it was yes
0:09:18not the same kind of whimsy but two
0:09:21shows that that sort of hit that sort of
0:09:23perfect level of whimsy and just go with
0:09:27it
0:09:28I kind of wish that there are more songs
0:09:29in it like maybe an ingredient maybe
0:09:31it's kind of like the budget is showing
0:09:32because it's like it's hard to come up
0:09:33with it even looks and songs per episode
0:09:36and they just don't have the time or
0:09:38money to get more than that but because
0:09:40they are so good it's like how much the
0:09:41whole show is like this and had just you
0:09:43know like an actual music me like brief
0:09:44brief moments of non-music in between
0:09:47just to set up the next musical number
0:09:48but instead there's lots of regular TV
0:09:50show in there and the regular TV show is
0:09:52like Jason's that kind of silly and a
0:09:54lot of will they won't they
0:09:55but at I think it's nice in that all of
0:09:58the characters are messed up in some way
0:10:00not a seinfeld way where everybody is
0:10:02just a terrible person but that
0:10:03everybody even the nice guy josh is not
0:10:06like og perfect nice guy like everybody
0:10:09has their hang-ups everybody has their
0:10:10issues nobody is purely good nobody's
0:10:12purely bed which I think helps them with
0:10:14the thing they have to do to keep these
0:10:16balls in here you can't have it resolved
0:10:17because then the show is over
0:10:19it helps you understand why might
0:10:21someone be indecisive and why my people
0:10:23not be able to find each other because
0:10:25everybody's messed up in some way in the
0:10:26show and you know it's it's kind of a
0:10:29reverse like tomatoes a little later
0:10:32like a reverse of the typical thing
0:10:33where it's not a show for women but the
0:10:36show with actual women characters which
0:10:38is now sort of it in the current context
0:10:40coded as a woman's show and then the men
0:10:43are the love interests and it's like
0:10:46nice to see the love interest to
0:10:47actually be real characters instead of
0:10:48his cardboard cutouts like josh is a
0:10:50person who has good things and bad
0:10:52things about them and what's-his-name
0:10:53bartender guy
0:10:54it has bad things about him but it's
0:10:56also a nice guy on top of that and
0:10:58instead of them just being defined by
0:10:59their
0:10:59the color or whatever you like you you
0:11:02just you just mentally genderswap this
0:11:04whole show it becomes a lot more
0:11:05conventional but it's not it's actually
0:11:07the other way around um and it's and
0:11:09it's good for for a silly musical comedy
0:11:12thing to have characters there you know
0:11:15obviously silly but imbued with a tiny
0:11:18bit of humanity both good and bad it's
0:11:21it's pretty novel it's it's refreshing
0:11:23and and E is science fiction fans might
0:11:27know Rachel bloom before this for a song
0:11:30she wrote about Ray Bradbury yes that
0:11:32was nominated for hugo award the other
0:11:35thing i wanted to say was that uh
0:11:36there's a there's a there's some
0:11:38interesting relationship dynamics
0:11:40there's a strong relationship between
0:11:42Rachel blues character and her a buddy
0:11:45who works at the at the law firm that I
0:11:49think is an interesting and and for
0:11:50television more unconventional
0:11:52relationship of two women who are who
0:11:56are our best pals and become kind of
0:11:59best pals on the spot and there's
0:12:00weirdness in their relationship but it's
0:12:01actually kind of great and the guy who
0:12:03runs the law firm is a fantastic
0:12:05character who discovers he's bisexual
0:12:07about halfway through and there is a
0:12:09song about that too
0:12:11oh yes there is and it's great it's so
0:12:14great so anyway it's a it's a good show
0:12:16highly recommended what else anybody
0:12:19else wanna throw out some show that
0:12:21they've been like in the last year that
0:12:22they want to talk about a little bit in
0:12:24the same thing as when I gather from
0:12:25crazy ex-girlfriend i'm really enjoying
0:12:27younger which is another show that you
0:12:30would not expect from something like TV
0:12:32land but it's a really great show in
0:12:34terms of real characters are doing real
0:12:36things and actually you know it it
0:12:39doesn't feel as fake as something like
0:12:41Seinfeld it's it's nice to see a TV Land
0:12:44evolving beyond hot in cleveland not
0:12:46that there's anything necessarily wrong
0:12:48with hot in cleveland
0:12:50but but they're aiming at a broader
0:12:52demographic they're not hanging at you
0:12:55know 18 to 34 they're interested in
0:12:58shows that human beings which is kind of
0:13:01a shift for them some i'm curious to see
0:13:04where that goes but it but younger is
0:13:06like the first of the new the new wave
0:13:08of TV Land shows
0:13:10mm ali what about you some their show
0:13:13out there that you
0:13:13that you've been watching that you've
0:13:14this is not a draft by the way I just
0:13:17trying to draw people out nobody wins
0:13:20there no winners here we're all winners
0:13:21yeah overall winners they're all for
0:13:24losers
0:13:24yeah all winners around here at Steven
0:13:27universe Steven universe is maybe my
0:13:31favorite show ever
0:13:33at this point and it's a cartoon it's a
0:13:36cartoon networkcartoon and it's goofy
0:13:40but it's it's it's so cute and heartfelt
0:13:45in science fiction and fantasy all at
0:13:48the same time and it has really strong
0:13:52pro lgbtq+ themes and and its really
0:13:58positive in a way that especially around
0:14:01those types of things like I feel like
0:14:03you know we get at things are getting
0:14:06better definitely but but we talk about
0:14:08the LGBTQ community and people who
0:14:11belong in that community become
0:14:12punchlines often times and it totally
0:14:15completely not in Steven universe and
0:14:18it's got songs so so speaking of
0:14:21musicals and there are not every episode
0:14:24but a lot of episodes have songs a lot
0:14:26of ukulele and it's just it's it's a
0:14:30neat ride and they're easy to watch
0:14:33their you know like 11 minute episodes
0:14:35and so few by mana and itunes you get
0:14:39you know two episodes per dollar
0:14:41whatever three dollars or however much
0:14:43it is and so yes Steven universe super
0:14:49super Levitt my computer's named garnet
0:14:51after one of the characters and it's
0:14:54it's just it's it's wonderful it's
0:14:56beautiful i have not watched much anime
0:14:59but from what i gather about the enemy
0:15:01scene and my friends who are also to
0:15:02Steven universe and anime the fact that
0:15:06the characters grow in the way that they
0:15:08do after a very light season one in two
0:15:11seasons two and three where we are now
0:15:12things have gotten very heavy and play
0:15:15on expectations that Phoenix established
0:15:17in the first season that blows my mind
0:15:20in a way that I've not seen before and I
0:15:21gather that's the way that a lot of
0:15:22anime works you can tell that Rebecca
0:15:25sugar and her crew are
0:15:26super super into anime and another point
0:15:28about the songs you mentioned a lien
0:15:29they're not every episode
0:15:31it doesn't feel like a stick to me that
0:15:33facing and again not to say that crazy
0:15:35ex-girlfriend is but I would not call
0:15:37Steven universe of musical right now
0:15:39cartoon show where people happen to sing
0:15:41whenever they feel like it which is a
0:15:43really nice change of pace where you
0:15:45don't always expect a song but when it
0:15:47comes you don't feel like I feel a song
0:15:50coming on you feel like it's warranted
0:15:52and that whatever they have to say is
0:15:54better said song i love it i love this
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0:17:30dan you got anything that you want to
0:17:32throw out there
0:17:34well I think this was a year that
0:17:35started for me with a couple other
0:17:37sitcoms that I act
0:17:39really got to enjoy which were mostly
0:17:42cancelled which was kind of a bummer but
0:17:45on Fox i was watching a grandfather and
0:17:47the grinder here actually ended up being
0:17:50a pair of pretty good sitcom at the
0:17:52grinder
0:17:53I feel like the fundamental problem of
0:17:54the grinder was that it was a great
0:17:57premise it had some great cast
0:17:59there was no way in hell it was going to
0:18:01be extensible passed a first season and
0:18:06they had some trouble getting the rest
0:18:08of the cast into that but some of the
0:18:10premises of that show which is
0:18:12essentially the idea being Rob Lowe is a
0:18:14an actor who has played a super-famous
0:18:17like lawyer on a lawyer TV show comes
0:18:19back to his hometown in idaho where his
0:18:23brother played by fred savage and let's
0:18:25just applaud that casting there for a
0:18:27moment is a real lawyer and decides I've
0:18:31basically been a super famous TV lawyer
0:18:33for several years
0:18:34I can totally be a real lawyer and some
0:18:38of the most brilliant parts that were
0:18:40interspersing clips from the show that
0:18:43he's on which is actually which is also
0:18:44called the grinder and dealing with sort
0:18:48of like just bizarre over-the-top bits
0:18:52of this you know like that are kind of
0:18:54all tropes and references to all these
0:18:56legal like ridiculously old dramas and
0:19:00they developed a very strong supporting
0:19:01cast there were some really good gags
0:19:05going on throughout the season i
0:19:06actually won't spoil the last the last
0:19:10episode of it but i think it does a
0:19:11great job of sort of bringing the whole
0:19:13thing all the way around and and there's
0:19:17a particularly brilliant arc in the
0:19:19middle of the season or so with Timothy
0:19:22Olyphant who comes on and basically
0:19:24plays the guy they have cast to replace
0:19:26him like his long-lost brother on the
0:19:28new version of the show they're
0:19:29rebooting and he has some serious
0:19:32community chops in there any plays
0:19:34timothy oliver yes he plays himself
0:19:35playing yes yes as the you as the person
0:19:39cast to replace Rob Lowe's character it
0:19:43is incredibly meta the only things that
0:19:46really bugged me about it were that I
0:19:48felt so bad for the fred savage
0:19:49character it was like we all
0:19:52so he's saying and everybody else kinda
0:19:54buys into the you know Rob Lowe's
0:19:55reality distortion field and you're all
0:19:59just you spend a lot of time going like
0:20:00what why aren't you paying more
0:20:02attention to the same single guy but
0:20:06some very strong supporting work from a
0:20:09lot of the characteristic the kids in
0:20:11Fred savages the the actors who played
0:20:13his kids are pretty great and it's
0:20:17definitely kind of addictive in terms of
0:20:19you'll find yourself saying something
0:20:21like Rob Lowe always constantly has
0:20:23these catch phrases that make no sense
0:20:25that people say like well you know oh we
0:20:27can't we can't see this guy and he'll
0:20:30just be like but what if we could
0:20:31anything feel like that doesn't mean
0:20:33anything you don't it'll just keep
0:20:35rolling with it it's it's entertaining
0:20:38grandfathered i really liked as well
0:20:40which was John Stamos who plays sort of
0:20:43you know he's turning 50 and he's a
0:20:45restaurant her in LA and he's like
0:20:47really you know black bachelor he's got
0:20:49a life together and then discovers that
0:20:51this you know woman that he had a
0:20:53relationship with when he was much
0:20:55younger I had a kid who is now growing
0:20:58up and is now has a kid of his own so he
0:21:00was in fact a grandfather and it ended
0:21:03up being a really sweet heartfelt show
0:21:05that was able to straddle that line of
0:21:09like it just delivered all sort of like
0:21:11you know really solid sitcom premise
0:21:13that wasn't over Warren was was funny
0:21:18and managed to be touching and sweet at
0:21:20the same time and some great fantastic
0:21:24performances there especially from paget
0:21:26Brewster and Ravi Patel and a lot of
0:21:32other great sort of supporting
0:21:34characters there and and you know John
0:21:35Stamos see again once again great
0:21:37casting you find a role that John Stamos
0:21:39was basically born to play which is the
0:21:43basic totally self-absorbed but also
0:21:46clearly like trying to deny that he is
0:21:48turning 50 so yeah I think both of those
0:21:51were were great if i had had the if I
0:21:54had been called up by the Fox president
0:21:56asked which one to save I probably would
0:21:58have picked grandfathered if only
0:22:00because i feel like there was more
0:22:01potential for growth in there but you
0:22:04know
0:22:04at one season each I feel like there was
0:22:07a is a pretty solid show that you could
0:22:09go watching and enjoy and have a good
0:22:11time with yeah i mean i'm i'm certainly
0:22:13going to get the grinder on DVD just
0:22:15because it was so enjoyable but exactly
0:22:18i don't i don't see where it is in
0:22:21season 3 season 4 but as a single season
0:22:25it's gonna be one of those like classic
0:22:28one season shows I fendi I'm if nothing
0:22:31else worth it for the episodes also
0:22:32where Jason Alexander plays the
0:22:34basically the executive producer of the
0:22:37show within a show who tries to lure Rob
0:22:39Lowe back and there's a fantastic scene
0:22:42where they're saying well you know all
0:22:43the network it'll network loved in the
0:22:45ratings you know all this stuff but none
0:22:47of that's really important we both know
0:22:49what really matters a Rob Lowe nods
0:22:51knowingly and says what the fans are
0:22:53saying on Twitter so if you have the
0:22:56yeah the wish fulfillment aspect of all
0:22:59people paying attention to what the rest
0:23:01of us silly people think of these shows
0:23:03it does a nice job of sort of satirizing
0:23:07a lot of that Erica do you have anything
0:23:09or you just here to talk about swords &
0:23:11Dragons well you know I thought I was
0:23:13just here to talk about swords & Dragons
0:23:14but then I realized that there were a
0:23:16couple things that I had watched they
0:23:17just ended longer ago long enough ago
0:23:20that my brain had forgotten about them i
0:23:22watch the last season of The Good Wife
0:23:24which I know Scott watches but he's not
0:23:27here to talk about is naughty again it's
0:23:30got but I I enjoyed most of the season
0:23:36I think this is a show i started
0:23:37watching with season five and never felt
0:23:39the need to go back and watch anything
0:23:40earlier so I've really been enjoying it
0:23:42since season five and there has been a
0:23:45subplot that has popped up for the last
0:23:47couple seasons with the NSA tapping
0:23:49Alicia's the main characters phone and
0:23:52listening in on her life and basically
0:23:54treating it like a soap opera right
0:23:55which is very meta because you know
0:23:57that's that's what we the audience are
0:23:59doing training like soap opera and just
0:24:00kind of watching and listening in and
0:24:03and that was fun that that popped up
0:24:04again and I except for the episode that
0:24:07took place in canada was very fun
0:24:10yeah they did please please do not have
0:24:13American actors try to do canadian
0:24:15accents just don't
0:24:17I feel very strongly about this now that
0:24:19I live here yeah it's just all kinds of
0:24:21wrong the last the very last episode I
0:24:25don't really know how most people felt
0:24:27about it because I didn't take to
0:24:28Twitter and look around and find out
0:24:30I myself was not particularly a fan I
0:24:32think maybe it worked better if you've
0:24:34been watching the show from the very
0:24:36beginning because the last seen sort of
0:24:37mirrors of their very first scene and I
0:24:40read about it afterwards and it makes
0:24:41sense and i think i can understand it
0:24:43but it was one of those endings that
0:24:46wasn't much of an ending and we left
0:24:49unless things very open-ended things you
0:24:52know there's there's a great big love
0:24:53story kind of at the center of the last
0:24:55couple of seasons they years ago killed
0:24:58off the main love interest which was
0:25:00apparently a big deal that was actually
0:25:02what got me to start watching the show
0:25:03like that's a bold move i wanna i wanna
0:25:05see what what the rest of this show is
0:25:07like and I completely fell for the guy
0:25:09that she also felt for later on and
0:25:11there's no official resolution to what
0:25:14happens with him and I I like a
0:25:17beginning a middle and the end and gosh
0:25:18darn it
0:25:19and there was no no real end I don't
0:25:21want open-endedness at the ends of my my
0:25:24series when that happens so I was a
0:25:25little bit sad said with that so in my
0:25:28headcanon that last episode never
0:25:30happened to know worked out a very very
0:25:32different way in my mind and the other
0:25:35show that I watched i'm not actually
0:25:37even sure that I am completely caught up
0:25:39on it but watched most of season 2 of
0:25:42stitches which is a show on freeform
0:25:44which I gather is what ABC family turned
0:25:47into yes and it's it is about what you
0:25:49would expect from a science-fiction show
0:25:52on ABC Family now free form it has it
0:25:55has the budget that you would expect for
0:25:57a show like that they are clearly not
0:25:59hiring like the most first-rate writers
0:26:01in the world they're they're people who
0:26:03i think you know some of them may have a
0:26:05future but they need to work on making
0:26:07their characters believable and in many
0:26:09cases likable even for the main
0:26:11characters but even so it has charmed me
0:26:14enough to keep watching it is a
0:26:15ridiculous premise where the the main
0:26:19character who is a skinny blonde white
0:26:21girl has to get in to this like tight
0:26:26black leather looking cat suit thing and
0:26:28it does herself in a pool of water
0:26:31in order to dip into people's dead
0:26:34people's memories to solve crimes but of
0:26:37course it's not just to solve crimes
0:26:39there's this mysterious backstory with a
0:26:41government agency that's all shadow and
0:26:42there's stuff going on with her father
0:26:44who's alive or maybe not
0:26:47and people keep dying and it's it is it
0:26:50is completely ridiculous i'm not gonna
0:26:52strongly recommend that people go and
0:26:54check it out but if you're looking for
0:26:55something that's just kind of like mine
0:26:57candy and easy to watch and if you
0:27:01really want to see a show sort of pick
0:27:03itself up off the ground and improve a
0:27:06yeah start at the first season and then
0:27:07catching the second think it's so much
0:27:10better
0:27:11yeah so stitchers it's it's ridiculous
0:27:14but it's ridiculous in in a fun way for
0:27:17me anyway she has to put on the leather
0:27:19catsuit to solve crimes
0:27:21so you know they they upgraded their
0:27:22first season 2 it was it for her
0:27:24nice nice yeah the freeform kicked into
0:27:27the zipper budget tonight oxys and of
0:27:30course she keeps it like way too low and
0:27:32like i'll come on show your ridiculous
0:27:34she does thats to get the memories in
0:27:36there
0:27:37let's go sure that I'm sure that's a
0:27:39shimmery through your skin
0:27:40allene what what other shows you want to
0:27:43mention before we move along and ok so
0:27:46the last season of Downton Abbey yeah
0:27:51I've been watching the 100 it's a show
0:27:54that I like and hate at the same time
0:27:56and but what I really like about it is
0:27:59that a for the most part the female
0:28:03characters the women in the show have
0:28:05agency and are calling the shots which
0:28:07is unusual for kind of a dystopian
0:28:09sci-fi type show and I don't know I know
0:28:12John's been watching it too i don't know
0:28:14if he has things to say hi I think it's
0:28:16a great interesting show because a
0:28:17setting aside the end-of-the-world stuff
0:28:19that I always loved it's kind of why I
0:28:22don't know if I believe you would
0:28:24categorize that way but I think about
0:28:25the dealership even though the actors
0:28:27all look like they're in their twenties
0:28:28they're supposed to be like under-18
0:28:29that's why they were in the the jail or
0:28:31whatever in the beginning of you know
0:28:33they're all supposed to be teenagers and
0:28:35the show loves to sideline the adults
0:28:37like in theory like that the premises
0:28:40you know they separate the teams from
0:28:41the adults and it's like okay what teams
0:28:42are on
0:28:42it's like lord of the flies but then the
0:28:44you-know-what all spoiler alert i think
0:28:47it then the teens and adults are
0:28:48together in the later part of the show
0:28:50but the teens are still kind of in
0:28:52charge so it's like totally yaa where
0:28:54you imagine the grown-ups is there not a
0:28:57bunch of doofuses like their their
0:28:58characters and they're smart and they're
0:28:59competent everything to but to a degree
0:29:02that is a little bit unrealistic unless
0:29:04you consider the whole thing to be yaa
0:29:05the kids are running the show and then
0:29:08the other aspects likely inside is the
0:29:10the women in the show it's it's
0:29:13basically just parody or maybe just
0:29:15barely parody but it comes off in the in
0:29:18the environment that this is being
0:29:19released into as startling in how you
0:29:23know how can the main characters of a
0:29:25show be women is not impossible like
0:29:27shouldn't the main character every
0:29:29single show be men and this show for all
0:29:31its you know sort of silly you know why
0:29:35a high school atmosphere in a grim
0:29:38situation shows that you can actually
0:29:40have one show on television where women
0:29:43of the main characters in the world was
0:29:44an end and so I find that not all over
0:29:46the world actually did end but that was
0:29:47prior to the show be part of the beating
0:29:50the show it's not post world ending a
0:29:52yeah and there's also a positive
0:29:55portrayal of LGBTQ relationships and
0:29:57that too
0:29:58I'm which is another thing I appreciate
0:29:59about but also of course the infamous
0:30:01killing of a of a character that led to
0:30:04a a whole feeling of outrage in the same
0:30:07community and I'll i think frank
0:30:09discussion on the internet by the
0:30:11creators and TV critics and I think a
0:30:13lot of people learned a lot and I think
0:30:15maybe a lot of writers in the TV
0:30:18business maybe realized that there's a
0:30:20cliché that they didn't realize was a
0:30:22cliché because they weren't paying
0:30:23attention to it so there's a lot of
0:30:25conversation about probably not what the
0:30:28producers the 100 wanted to talk about
0:30:29which was how they wrote out a character
0:30:31who was because the actor was going to
0:30:33it be a regular on a different show but
0:30:36that was definitely a big part of the
0:30:37story of the hundred this year and
0:30:39that's why diverse writing rooms matter
0:30:41yep this edition of the uncomfortable is
0:30:43brought to you by like splash that's
0:30:46like splash one word it's your one-stop
0:30:48app for all of your interest movies
0:30:51restaurants songs books podcast apps and
0:30:53more and they all lived together in one
0:30:54beautiful app
0:30:55you may feel like you've got too many
0:30:57apps on your phone too much to deal with
0:30:59if you like movies or restaurants or
0:31:01books or songs you end up with a nap for
0:31:03each one may be more than one end up
0:31:05with what a couple dozen apps to explore
0:31:07like supply solve this problem by
0:31:09linking you to all your favorite apps
0:31:10and services directly rather than having
0:31:13to open the different apps and it gets
0:31:15better with a few taps you can explore
0:31:16collections of favorite movies songs
0:31:18books apps created by your friends or
0:31:21other users who share your interests and
0:31:23here's another feature that they offer
0:31:26you if you forgot about a TV show
0:31:28let's say like one of the ones that
0:31:29we've just recommended here or maybe a
0:31:32restaurant something like that happens
0:31:34all the time you can bookmark movie
0:31:36songs books apps TV shows pretty much
0:31:38anything you fancy using the app it's
0:31:40all organized into categories and
0:31:42connected your favorite apps and
0:31:43services
0:31:44it's a great sort of like super
0:31:46bookmarking feature so check it out like
0:31:48splashes on the App Store you can click
0:31:49the link in the show notes or go to bit
0:31:51ly thats bitd ly / get like splash vit d
0:31:56ly / GT li ke SPL a sh like splash one
0:32:02after all your interests avoid app
0:32:03clutter get like splash thanks to like
0:32:05spice for sponsoring the incomparable
0:32:07the other big one I want to mention as I
0:32:09zombie-like i watch The Walking Dead and
0:32:11you know things that everybody else
0:32:12watches too but I love iZombie I learned
0:32:14about the premise of the show and was
0:32:16like this is totally not for me it's
0:32:19like just it's just not for me and then
0:32:22when it came to at Netflix and my friend
0:32:25Steve Lucas was like no you really need
0:32:26to watch the show and I did and I am
0:32:30hooked
0:32:30I like it it's you know zombies and who
0:32:34remain a human unless they are starved
0:32:38for too long and there becomes like this
0:32:41the this whole like brain
0:32:44I don't know Brandon rotten market uh
0:32:47yes
0:32:48so it's it's I don't know it's it's
0:32:51clever in quirky kind of the way that
0:32:53brain Fuller's shows can be that's not
0:32:56by going fuller and it's and I don't
0:32:59know I just really really enjoyed I
0:33:00think it's fun and it's also smart so I
0:33:04appreciate that i'm so glad to hear that
0:33:06it stays good i have only seen the first
0:33:08season so far and I
0:33:09just absolutely adored it so I just
0:33:12haven't been able to find the next the
0:33:14rest of it candidates are sometimes the
0:33:16second season is is also really quite
0:33:18good and it windy i award this year for
0:33:21shows which you can't really like
0:33:25there's a lot of shows a kind of is
0:33:26dressed as a procedural right because
0:33:28it's kind of dresses like a procedural
0:33:30cop drama
0:33:31except there's a zombie helping them
0:33:33solve crimes and that's all well and
0:33:36good but as the show goes along and you
0:33:39realize while they're laying down all
0:33:40these different weird pieces and as you
0:33:42realize the procedural stuff start
0:33:44shifting to the back and the sort of
0:33:46ongoing plot shifts to the front and i
0:33:48found just get one my award for I have
0:33:51no idea where this is going like there
0:33:54are a lot of shows that are sort of
0:33:55telegraphed I feel like it's like okay
0:33:57yeah these people are going to these
0:33:58people and they show no compunction
0:34:01about being like all what is this like
0:34:02what is crazy terrible things that we
0:34:04can do this people let's throw these
0:34:05people together and see what happens
0:34:07you're like oh my god I can't believe
0:34:08this is going on right now what is
0:34:10happening and i think it's it's
0:34:13fantastic a great great cast
0:34:16I will say one of my favorite bits from
0:34:18this season involves a character who
0:34:21returns out is very very angry at george
0:34:23RR martin for not finishing his master
0:34:26and one of the best deliveries wife from
0:34:29a character who you otherwise would not
0:34:30expect that to come from and also I
0:34:33think a great job with one of my
0:34:35favorite characters in that show who is
0:34:38a person that could have come off as
0:34:39very two-dimensional is major who is the
0:34:42main characters ex-fiance and he feel
0:34:45like he could have just gotten relegated
0:34:47to this kind of dull like oh he's the
0:34:50love interest role but by the end of the
0:34:52first season have to get some really
0:34:54really interesting to like directions
0:34:56with his character and that actor is
0:34:59fantastic he's just delivery is so good
0:35:03he's so charming and like mild-mannered
0:35:05like everybody in that show is is great
0:35:08you know obviously a rose mciver replace
0:35:12the lead to she's fantastic and it's
0:35:14just got a great cast Rob Thomas who do
0:35:16who created is the same guy created
0:35:18Veronica Mars and that really shows if
0:35:21you watch batteries
0:35:22but it's good i highly highly second
0:35:25that and also rob thomas from matchbox
0:35:28Tony meeting up here and i think another
0:35:30season you made it so well it's really
0:35:35so good so funny
0:35:37yeah if you're not watching that when I
0:35:38don't even know why you're here go do
0:35:40you hang up and watch that's ok bye guys
0:35:45yeah John anything you want to mention
0:35:47the only ones i had on my list i think
0:35:50is a the walking dead which i still
0:35:51enjoy i know a lot of people are tired
0:35:53of it I'm not tired of it
0:35:55they still I'm still interested the
0:35:57characters that I come to know and love
0:35:59I'm still interested in what happens to
0:36:00them and they're still be able to
0:36:02introduce new characters that like was
0:36:05leftovers that already do that in the
0:36:07last podcast about TV
0:36:08I think we want to talk about I finally
0:36:10have gone through the first season I
0:36:12haven't watched the second season yet
0:36:13but i thought i thought that was a very
0:36:15quietly brilliant show actually yeah the
0:36:18second season i really liked I liked it
0:36:20more than the first season and I
0:36:22actually like the first season as well
0:36:23so I feel like that show is I don't know
0:36:25where we can go from here i don't think
0:36:26i can imagine season 3 being better but
0:36:28I'm really glad that I saw the first two
0:36:29seasons of that I'm really glad it
0:36:30wasn't cancelled and there's only one
0:36:32more season
0:36:32yeah yeah is there wasn't even a third
0:36:35season the last season alright well i
0:36:37guess they can do something spectacular
0:36:38for the Big Finish or they can just blow
0:36:39it will see and then the other one is
0:36:41the Americans which i think is sort of
0:36:44at the ragged edges of its premise at
0:36:47this point I'm i don't know i get the
0:36:51premises silly begin with a lot of
0:36:52things that show are silly if you think
0:36:55about them for 12 seconds but now
0:36:56they're really running out of runway for
0:36:59the show but it's been pretty good all
0:37:01the way through a lot i don't quite
0:37:02understand why people rave about it as
0:37:04much as they do I think it's good i
0:37:05don't have any bad things to say about
0:37:06it but I'm not bowled over like I was by
0:37:09you know like that the Marquis programs
0:37:11people throw this up there like oh it's
0:37:12as good as you know breaking bad or the
0:37:14wire or The Sopranos and it's not on
0:37:16that tier for me but it's still a really
0:37:18good show and it's an interesting
0:37:20premise and i like most of the actors
0:37:21and and they've announced it's going to
0:37:23be two more seasons and then it's done
0:37:25yeah so it has a finite ending insight
0:37:27actually like it only has one season of
0:37:29plot left two more seasons
0:37:31maybe I think they're shorter seasons
0:37:32that I think it's like the breaking bad
0:37:34trend that's i'm watching the first
0:37:36season of that right now and it is great
0:37:38i'm enjoying a lot so I'm just you know
0:37:40time-shifted pillow from 2011
0:37:43ok Brian anything that you want to throw
0:37:47out there we've talked a lot about the
0:37:49expanse on the TV feet of the
0:37:51incomparable but it learned it's lessons
0:37:53from game of thrones before Game of
0:37:54Thrones itself learned those same
0:37:56lessons the season so good for that i'd
0:37:58like to throw a documentary now which is
0:38:00on ifc Bill Hader and Fred Armisen make
0:38:03silly documentary parodies they're
0:38:04really detailed they're really suddenly
0:38:07funny there things from Grey Gardens to
0:38:09the thin blue line to rock documentaries
0:38:11i had a ton of fun going through that
0:38:13this year that's all on netflix now it
0:38:16is all the netflix yes don't make the
0:38:17mistake I made and I think that there's
0:38:19only six episodes when there's a second
0:38:21part of the blue jean committee episode
0:38:23I'd like to throw out a special mention
0:38:25to jeopardy
0:38:26I'm very excited to see buzzy cohen and
0:38:28Hunter aperture uh face off in next
0:38:31year's tournament champions these past
0:38:33months in 17 and no it's clear it's
0:38:37really Glenn Glenn wearing up to Ryan
0:38:40asked i don't like to throw a bone to
0:38:43whoever runs the joy of painting youtube
0:38:45account on thanks for helping me sleep
0:38:47that's technically team right sure great
0:38:50dropped in a helicopter e 700 club girl
0:38:54happy little school and playing with his
0:38:55nuts like the guy who plays the test
0:38:57pattern he's great thanks for being
0:39:00there to a David what do you have
0:39:05I will if this were drafted be in pretty
0:39:07good shape i mean i've crossed a couple
0:39:09of things off like documentary now and
0:39:11the expanse and one that I know is on
0:39:13your list but I've got Angie Tribeca
0:39:16which on TBS
0:39:18it's just Rock stupid but it plays rock
0:39:22stupid really well if if you like
0:39:25airplane if you like police squad and
0:39:27especially if you like police squad more
0:39:29than you like The Naked Gun this is the
0:39:31show you've been waiting for it manages
0:39:34to hit that that tone pretty perfectly
0:39:37then let's see the second season of
0:39:41Fargo which I thought was as good
0:39:44as the first maybe and i really like the
0:39:47first full frontal
0:39:50also on TBS has become a weekly thing
0:39:54for me along with last week tonight
0:39:57veep which people were worried about
0:40:00because Armando Iannucci was leaving the
0:40:02show how can you do it without Armando
0:40:05Iannucci but not only did they maintain
0:40:09it they sort of went beyond they've
0:40:11ended in a really interesting place
0:40:14I don't want to spoil anything but it's
0:40:16not where you think it's going which is
0:40:19kinda cool
0:40:21the Carmichael show the second season
0:40:24that was very entertaining
0:40:25it's a throwback to the the Norman Lear
0:40:28style of issue-oriented comedy but i
0:40:30really like that of life in pieces said
0:40:34come on CBS that is a pleasant way to
0:40:37pass the time it takes it kind of does
0:40:40the modern family format of an extended
0:40:44family but instead of having a you know
0:40:48trying to fit everybody in to every
0:40:49story they do short stories in each half
0:40:52hour so it's it's almost like it's
0:40:54designed to be put on youtube in little
0:40:56viral bites which is kind of interesting
0:40:58to see how they're constructing that and
0:41:01sometimes they do tie them all together
0:41:02nicely but documentary now I'll just
0:41:05cross it off
0:41:07Louie CK is Horace and Pete which is not
0:41:10quite a comedy and it's not quite a
0:41:12drama and it's not quite TV because it's
0:41:15kinda like live theater with so it's
0:41:17again a very much a throwback it is very
0:41:22funny at times it is harrowing at times
0:41:24so it's it's it's not a ride for the
0:41:29easily disturbed but man it's good it
0:41:33could have used a sharper hand and
0:41:35heading down the script but you know
0:41:37i'll give it a pass because you don't
0:41:39see that on TV alot and then I'll finish
0:41:42off with two shows on the Sundance
0:41:44Channel of all things one that's a
0:41:48co-production with australia and new
0:41:50zealand called clever man which is a
0:41:54science fictiony retelling of Aboriginal
0:41:57ecology in the present day in a sort of
0:42:01a superhero context it's really
0:42:03fascinating the first episodes little
0:42:06confusing stick with it there are only
0:42:08six so far I don't know if you're going
0:42:10to do more but it's it's really
0:42:12different i really liked it and a show
0:42:16called HAP and Leonard which is based on
0:42:19a series of books by Joe are lansdale
0:42:21set down in the deep south with a crime
0:42:25if you miss justified this could scratch
0:42:29that itch and when I guess the the last
0:42:32thing that's been taking up my time in
0:42:34the last few weeks the match game I hate
0:42:38to admit it they got it right even even
0:42:41with alec baldwin they got it right it
0:42:43feels like the 1970s match game and and
0:42:46it's on at 10pm for good reason it is it
0:42:49is at least as smart as the original so
0:42:51good for that which was on it 38 3pm so
0:42:54exactly go figure after school with
0:42:57watch it but yeah it it's the first
0:43:00they've tried to revive it multiple
0:43:01times it's the first one that catches
0:43:03the tone and the ease and the width of
0:43:07the original right Dan
0:43:09what else do you have alright well I've
0:43:11got a bit of a list you so I'll just run
0:43:13through these are the USA show suits
0:43:17which is about answer its six-season
0:43:19they took a really sharp left turn and
0:43:22finally sort of dropped the hammer on
0:43:23the premise which was interesting
0:43:27I'm curious to see how they deal with
0:43:29that since it will change the format of
0:43:31the show pretty largely we'll see if
0:43:33they stick with it but I've enjoyed that
0:43:35show quite a bit it's got a really good
0:43:36cast
0:43:37I've got a British trial British cop
0:43:42trifecta third season i just watched
0:43:44thirties of line of duty which is a
0:43:46really intense sort of internal affairs
0:43:48style british show there are three
0:43:51seasons each of them sort of focuses on
0:43:53slightly different cases of
0:43:56investigating you know an incident and
0:43:58then there's a larger theme running
0:44:00through it about sort of corrupt cops it
0:44:03is it is one of those magnetic
0:44:04edge-of-your-seat style shows and the
0:44:07only six episodes of season two so it's
0:44:09pretty easy to sort of plays through
0:44:11endeavour just finished third season of
0:44:13at a young inspector morse really well
0:44:17done period oxford drama in the sixties
0:44:20just really a lot of fun and the there
0:44:25those are longer episodes there's only
0:44:26like four in a season but they're an
0:44:28hour and a half so they're more like
0:44:29watching little mini movies but they're
0:44:31they're great if you like British
0:44:33detective drama Ripper Street i finally
0:44:38managed to you find the fourth season
0:44:40which is really also good i've enjoyed
0:44:44that show a lot going through Matthew
0:44:45McFadden and Jerome Flynn from Game of
0:44:48Thrones who plays Braun plays the
0:44:49sergeant in this one which is a
0:44:51victorian-era police procedural the
0:44:57third season of that which we were last
0:44:58year or two years ago was really good
0:45:00and had sort of a really interesting
0:45:01overarching plot and they sort of
0:45:02continued the fallout from that in this
0:45:05most recent season I shows that i
0:45:09haven't seen all of the time i am
0:45:11watching a silicon valley I've really
0:45:15enjoyed what I've seen a third season I
0:45:16just haven't had time to finish it yet
0:45:18but the addition especially of Stephen
0:45:20Chbosky in early on in the season was
0:45:22great and that show is when it when it's
0:45:26good man is it good if they have some
0:45:29really sharp satire and when it's you
0:45:31know Mike Judge it's really mike judge
0:45:34and i just finished the first season
0:45:38right now is to show I was watching her
0:45:40before got on here was the first season
0:45:42of hold and catch fire
0:45:44I which I just finished which is a
0:45:47really interesting show that maybe tries
0:45:49to be mad Men a little too hard but some
0:45:53of it is kind of fun to watch a show
0:45:54where it's like oh wait this is all
0:45:56computer history I know about all this
0:45:57stuff and I do enjoy a pace even if he
0:46:02is a little bit over the top on the show
0:46:03I know Jason really likes you're the
0:46:06worst and he got me
0:46:08yeah the second season of that show is
0:46:11fan-tastic areas and probably I feel
0:46:15like has one of the better depictions of
0:46:18dealing with like depression of of
0:46:22anything certainly that I've seen
0:46:24and he's just yeah it's really good
0:46:28that's a really good show and it is it
0:46:30is seriously underrated and the just the
0:46:33the leads ice personally my favorite is
0:46:35uh oh now I'm gonna blank
0:46:38what's the name of his room 808 girl
0:46:40Edgar yes Edgar and and the the best
0:46:44friend of the main character Lindsay yes
0:46:46the supporting characters that show
0:46:48yeah you know what can you say about
0:46:49sure where the supporting characters are
0:46:50as good as they really are two main
0:46:52characters Catherine Donahue is
0:46:54spectacularly good as Lindsay
0:46:57spectacularly good
0:46:58yes she's really good even enjoy these
0:47:01stupid like the stupid other side
0:47:04characters like the married couple and
0:47:08it's just it's so well written and so
0:47:10good i just i watched the heck out of
0:47:12that it's a great show it's hilarious
0:47:16this whole area is fine to show it's
0:47:18really weird because I was a show they
0:47:19got recommended by multiple angles
0:47:20including you Jason and then my parents
0:47:22liked it was like I don't really want to
0:47:24thank you are my parents
0:47:25no but and then the last couple things I
0:47:31had Star Wars rebels and i'm just going
0:47:34to plug it because I got you for a show
0:47:37that's 11 season in this season of
0:47:39supernatural was surprisingly good i was
0:47:42really a getting the point of being like
0:47:43and I don't know how much they can keep
0:47:45doing this they get a really good season
0:47:47this year and part of it was going back
0:47:49to stuff that they sort of left up in
0:47:50the air like like five or six years ago
0:47:53yeah and then do you want to hug you now
0:47:55I'm okay it was a good show
0:47:57I have to say I i was surprised i I just
0:48:00sort of been sleepwalking through a lot
0:48:01of the recent seasons because I felt
0:48:03like man I am in this deep but you know
0:48:05what they do the full credit for them
0:48:07finding a way to make it sort of fresh
0:48:10and and still having reasons for me to
0:48:14invest 11 seasons in and guess what gap
0:48:16its wealth so I kept them still going
0:48:18yeah
0:48:19Stockholm Syndrome going I got no
0:48:23problems I can handle your mockery what
0:48:26mockery now we're being and I'm
0:48:28confident in my I'm comfortable where I
0:48:30am right now we've only been mocking
0:48:32you're watching supernatural for like
0:48:33five years
0:48:35comments I mean if you made it through
0:48:37the first season we can talk we can oh
0:48:39yeah i know i resigned to it never being
0:48:41something ever gets discussed on the
0:48:43show
0:48:44well we discussed now so there's no I
0:48:48monologue about it this is different
0:48:50I just can't get again i can't get past
0:48:52season 1i just have tried i can't get
0:48:54past jared padalecki guys in one is
0:48:57season one is rough and yeah after
0:49:01seasons like two through five you do
0:49:03watch those those are great i would stop
0:49:05honestly there i would not if we're I
0:49:07starting today I would not follow myself
0:49:09all the way down this dark path but
0:49:11season 5 has one of the best that like
0:49:14arc basically through season five is one
0:49:16of the best constructed i'll put that up
0:49:18against almost anything it's just it's a
0:49:20really solid development of these
0:49:22characters and an overarching plot that
0:49:25is basically coherent from like first
0:49:27episode to the end of the fifth season
0:49:29and he should have just left it there
0:49:30but they kept going so well and I've and
0:49:3427 more seasons after that I hate they
0:49:36did I mean a this is a show they hit 200
0:49:38episodes and did it as a basically as a
0:49:40high school musical about itself now
0:49:43which was crazy but really well done
0:49:45i'll mention a couple to a master of
0:49:48none
0:49:49Aziz Ansari's comedy on netflix is
0:49:51really graves on my list you should you
0:49:54should watch it it's really great
0:49:55and since Dan mentioned you're the worst
0:49:57i will then just mentioned catastrophe
0:49:59on amazon a very funny show about an
0:50:03American man who meets a woman when he's
0:50:07in London and they sleep together and
0:50:09she gets pregnant and he decides he's
0:50:11gonna stay and be a parent and it is
0:50:15very funny and i'll throw out there
0:50:19Mozart in the jungle to on amazon which
0:50:21yeah is a very good show about a
0:50:24classical music and the the simple
0:50:28Symphony musicians in New York and has a
0:50:31it and there's almost no way I can
0:50:34describe it won't make it sound boring
0:50:36it is very funny it is off-kilter it is
0:50:40not snooty at all
0:50:43there is like you learn in the first
0:50:46episode which guy in the orchestra is
0:50:47the one you go to
0:50:49I drugs it's that kind of show and it's
0:50:52got a fun performance by Malcolm
0:50:54McDowell is the deposed former conductor
0:50:57of the orchestra and a spectacularly
0:51:00good form a performance by guile garcía
0:51:03Bernal as the maestro of the orchestra
0:51:06who is just I loved every minute he's
0:51:09on-screen he's it's such a great is our
0:51:12performances
0:51:13he's very creative and does weird things
0:51:15and everybody's like well it's the
0:51:17maestro he just does what he does and
0:51:19it's yeah it's a it's a legitimately
0:51:21hilarious show so people should check
0:51:24out 1 i've talked about a lot with Tim
0:51:26Goodman over on the talk machine and it
0:51:29really you know for people who love
0:51:30slings and arrows which is one of my
0:51:32favorite shows well this is the same
0:51:35kind of the it sits behind the scenes of
0:51:38creative people being created yeah and
0:51:41this the struggle with how have they
0:51:44exist in the world and still be creative
0:51:47and you know it's it's it's not the same
0:51:50sense of humor it's not it's not slings
0:51:52and arrows to point out but if you like
0:51:55the one you will probably like this too
0:51:57thus ends the not a draft listing of
0:51:59shows that you should probably watch if
0:52:01you are looking for shows to watch
0:52:03because we liked although shows and we
0:52:05mentioned them
0:52:06it's very positive of us were not
0:52:09currently out shows that like we don't
0:52:10like where it's just all the good stuff
0:52:13i think we watches that we don't like
0:52:15like about we usually got the day off
0:52:17right
0:52:18there's too many good shows that used to
0:52:20be you'd watch mediocre shows because
0:52:22you're we ran out of good shows and
0:52:25there is you cannot run out of good
0:52:26shows now
0:52:27okay we're gonna fire up the spoiler
0:52:29horn and talk about season 6 or game of
0:52:30thrones now
0:52:31[Music]
0:52:35alright season six game of thrones so
0:52:37last season of Game of Thrones kind of a
0:52:39downer kind of down lots of bad stuff
0:52:41happened to his dark things were bad on
0:52:43this show a downer little bit of a
0:52:46bummer with all the terribleness that
0:52:48happened in it but this season was
0:52:51different for Game of Thrones I thought
0:52:53I spent the entire season talking about
0:52:56every single episode all but John
0:53:00actually of those of us who who were
0:53:02here and David doesn't count because he
0:53:04didn't watch that were on TV episodes
0:53:07about Game of Thrones with me or not
0:53:08with me in the case believe you were on
0:53:10with Brian right i was on the frame so
0:53:12mean it all connects it all
0:53:14interconnects John prefers to wait and
0:53:17ponder season 6 of Game of Thrones like
0:53:19every season and so I guess I should
0:53:21start with John and and if people want
0:53:24to hear what I had to say about Game of
0:53:26Thrones season 6 hey there's 10 episodes
0:53:28of or eight episodes of the TV podcast
0:53:30where I talk about eight episodes of it
0:53:32John what do you think of season 16
0:53:34minutes we'll start with you I don't
0:53:36know if this season was your just frame
0:53:38it was like oh it's not as big of a
0:53:39downer is the previous season because
0:53:41bad things do happen but I think every
0:53:45time we talk about the show in the
0:53:47beginning I knew nothing about nothing
0:53:48about the book I did you know and I'm
0:53:51think I'm very early i made jokes about
0:53:53like boy winter is coming sure taking a
0:53:54long time to get here that stop being a
0:53:56joke like a season and a half ago
0:53:58it's like seriously his winter coming
0:54:01how slow do the White Walkers actually
0:54:04walk are they just loitering outside the
0:54:06wall but I think the reason this season
0:54:09was so satisfying to everybody is
0:54:11because all those story threads and all
0:54:13that stuff
0:54:14finally finally looks like we're
0:54:16actually getting payoffs for things like
0:54:19they actually allowed to Starks to meet
0:54:21each other it was like it was like a
0:54:23miracle it was like how can that is how
0:54:26can that even happen how can look
0:54:28they're hugging like it's just
0:54:30miraculous and I really the season was
0:54:33kind of more of the same chest people
0:54:37peace moving and then one big episode of
0:54:39the middle toe to punch you in the gut
0:54:41the door episode and then huge finish a
0:54:45huge finish i think those last two
0:54:47episodes combined
0:54:48and are better than most of the movies
0:54:49I've seen in the past several years both
0:54:52in terms of how satisfying it was you
0:54:53can imagine this is like the second or
0:54:55third movie in a trilogy those two
0:54:57episodes and all the other seasons
0:54:59compress down just the good part step
0:55:01couple of just fantastic finish and so
0:55:03like that's a good strategy but your TV
0:55:07season by the way we forget about all
0:55:09the little small chest piece moving and
0:55:11tiny little scenes here and there in the
0:55:12early part of the season if it all comes
0:55:13together in the end and things happen
0:55:16things move and even though those poor
0:55:18white walkers are still going even
0:55:20though ships are still selling across to
0:55:22see enough happened that we all just
0:55:24settle down I felt like after the season
0:55:25said Jason Monty and I didn't really
0:55:29have much nice to say about that the
0:55:30ultimate episode where they're fighting
0:55:32the Bolton's but I I said nice things
0:55:34you said and I think it was on the nice
0:55:37thing but I didn't even John you make a
0:55:40great point I didn't even think about
0:55:41comparing it to a movie that sounds
0:55:43really dumb but honestly when I will go
0:55:45to game of thrones I want the plot i
0:55:46want things to happen
0:55:48not much happened in that episode
0:55:49plot-wise except for like the incredible
0:55:51ending and honest I didn't even think
0:55:53about comparing it to something like the
0:55:55two towers a return of the king where so
0:55:57much of those movies are fighting that
0:55:59you just kind of get plot thrown in
0:56:01sprinkled throughout and it made a lot
0:56:03more sense
0:56:03comparing it to a movie in terms of the
0:56:06scale that we get in the budget that
0:56:07they're allowing to say thank you for
0:56:09that they held that the battle back like
0:56:11they have like a lot of times it's
0:56:12people talking and people thinking about
0:56:14things or whatever but like that's the
0:56:15seasons that tend to be unsatisfying is
0:56:17a lot of those people having
0:56:18conversations and different sort of
0:56:20political maneuvering but it doesn't
0:56:22culminating anything or maybe culminates
0:56:24into a single murder which blends into
0:56:25the background on Game of Thrones all
0:56:27the other incidental murders they go on
0:56:28this all these moving around moving
0:56:31pieces culminates in a final clash of
0:56:33the pieces that had been aligned and
0:56:35you're right like that the battle the
0:56:37bastards that the reason I think that
0:56:38worked for me so well is a this is a big
0:56:41thing that's been coming for a long time
0:56:42we need to actually have a result
0:56:44instead of just having people just do
0:56:45something go off in different directions
0:56:46again and be i thought it was an
0:56:49amazingly well done battle scene i
0:56:51thought it was as good as any sort of
0:56:53mud and blood battle scene in medieval
0:56:56you know fantasy settings that I've seen
0:56:57a movie in gear
0:56:58years and this is a TV show just
0:57:01phenomenally well done because you care
0:57:02about the characters that you can tell
0:57:04what's going on the whole time as it
0:57:06interesting shots that you didn't expect
0:57:08it's not just a bunch of cliches and yes
0:57:11there's enough silliness with the person
0:57:12who doesn't know it is exactly he runs
0:57:14and some vino different things that
0:57:16don't make a lot of sense in terms of
0:57:18how confident someone could be that
0:57:19their plan would go off as expected but
0:57:21all that you know just like and I needed
0:57:24that I after season diseases i needed to
0:57:26see a big gigantic battle between forces
0:57:28that have been going together for a long
0:57:30time to be resolved decisively in a
0:57:32single episode there was a winner there
0:57:34was a loser the big banner comes down on
0:57:36the side of the building
0:57:37yes you know i am i am the queen of of
0:57:41not meeting a big battle scene I will
0:57:42never say that that's something i need
0:57:44and i always get bored I am the first
0:57:46person to say im bored with battle
0:57:47whether it's a gunfight or a sword fight
0:57:49doesn't matter however i actually was
0:57:52pretty darn ok with that battle in with
0:57:55the battle of the bastards it i do think
0:57:58that it went on too long for my taste
0:58:00but not by nearly as much as I expected
0:58:02and i quite liked a good chunk of it
0:58:05because it it didn't do that thing that
0:58:08so many shows of this type does and Game
0:58:11of Thrones has done in the past is like
0:58:13glorify battle make it look like you
0:58:15know this is such an epic sing and look
0:58:17at these sweaty men swinging their
0:58:19swords around and slow motion and isn't
0:58:21it a beautiful wonderful thing all this
0:58:24testosterone know it made it look
0:58:26terrible and terrifying all of these
0:58:29like super fast quick cuts from from
0:58:32place to place you can't actually tell
0:58:33what's going on
0:58:34that's exactly what it would be like in
0:58:36the middle of a battle you wouldn't be
0:58:37able to tell what's going on I felt like
0:58:39it that seen more than any other battles
0:58:43on the show kind of it gave me a feeling
0:58:45for what it would be like to be in this
0:58:47situation and to be you know the
0:58:49trampled under almost right several
0:58:52hundred people trying to get away i have
0:58:54to say i had the interesting experience
0:58:56of watching this with my girlfriend who
0:58:58had during we're watching the season
0:59:00together and then she moved to india but
0:59:02halfway through the season and so it
0:59:04turns out in India they actually show it
0:59:06live on TV sponsored by like amazon
0:59:09india like not even on premium cable
0:59:11just like I'm like
0:59:12broadcast except india being a slightly
0:59:15more conservative country they cut a
0:59:17bunches of apples as showing it like a
0:59:20lot of the super gory stuff so we're
0:59:22watching it and I was just you're
0:59:23watching this episode going who i like
0:59:26it and she's like what I don't even know
0:59:27what you're seeing right now like I I
0:59:30surprised that episode was not just five
0:59:32minutes long at that point because he
0:59:33felt like it was all pretty gory but I i
0:59:36think from a larger perspective what I
0:59:39found really good about the season which
0:59:40I think we obviously have to acknowledge
0:59:41is the fact that we're basically you
0:59:43know we're beyond the the pale when it
0:59:45comes to these books because we're off
0:59:47the map right like you know those of us
0:59:49who have read the books to a certain
0:59:52extent the plot was hamstrung by needing
0:59:55to follow where the books were you know
0:59:57in so far as they could and so I think
0:59:59this is
0:59:59this is
1:00:00what a really good example for this to
1:00:02my mind was was the last season with the
1:00:05hard home episode
1:00:06mhm like that was an episode that
1:00:08basically took something that did not
1:00:09happen at least on screen in the books
1:00:11and just flushing that out and being
1:00:14able to sort of give a chance for the
1:00:16the TV show didn't do its own thing and
1:00:20then basically i think you know what we
1:00:22saw this season was in large part that
1:00:24it's sort of i promise written with
1:00:26large which was
1:00:27hey free rein you know we kind of we
1:00:30yeah we know where George is going with
1:00:32the story but we basically get to do
1:00:34what we want to do and set up a bunch of
1:00:36stuff and and I think having that
1:00:39freedom to set stuff up and as a John
1:00:41said pay it off by you know structuring
1:00:44it in such a way that things that
1:00:46happens chestpiece moving eventually
1:00:48results in something which you kind of
1:00:50need to do a TV show right leg it just
1:00:52string it out forever people do get
1:00:54bored and stop watching things unless
1:00:56you're me and watch 12 seasons of
1:00:57supernatural but other than me
1:00:59people get w don't get kind of bored if
1:01:02there's no if there is no payoff and so
1:01:04I think that is actually probably to the
1:01:07biggest credit of this this last season
1:01:09is the fact that they haven't had to
1:01:11follow a blueprint note by note feeling
1:01:14like oh the fans will be so disappointed
1:01:15if it doesn't do this and this isn't
1:01:18said they just said yeah we're gonna
1:01:19wait to tell our story we tell it like
1:01:21it's a TV show and not like it's a you
1:01:23know a translation from a novel and I
1:01:26think that work to great effect for them
1:01:28so kudos to the the showrunners for you
1:01:31know taking the the road less traveled
1:01:33by gets me paid off things from the
1:01:35previous season two like using mentioned
1:01:38payoffs like they set up enough stuff
1:01:40early in the season to pay off here but
1:01:42they were paying off things from past
1:01:43seasons like I mean felt the whole thing
1:01:45with Cersei and and the mean nuns like
1:01:47to watch that season you're like that
1:01:50mean non boy she's gonna going to do
1:01:52something terrible that mean not and
1:01:53it's like and season ends
1:01:55but what about the mean none not paid
1:01:58off you know the Infinity salesman guy
1:02:00he's really annoying and he does lots of
1:02:03stuff in the previous season and then
1:02:04the season ends you're like but but and
1:02:06this season paid off so that it's the
1:02:10advantage of coming I
1:02:11assuming the latter half of how many
1:02:13more seasons two more two more two more
1:02:15shorter shorter season yeah but the
1:02:17advantage coming towards the end is that
1:02:18you finally get to resolve these things
1:02:20and I think we will look back on the
1:02:21middle seasons as a tough period to get
1:02:25through to get to what I hope is just an
1:02:28increasing amount of really big payoffs
1:02:30I mean they've got a lot of big a lot of
1:02:33big sets of chess pieces moving around
1:02:35this board towards each other we already
1:02:36had these two big big battle on a big
1:02:38explosion at the end and I hope it's
1:02:40just more of that well when it comes to
1:02:41pay off my talk to on the TV up so we do
1:02:44about this about how dissatisfied I was
1:02:46and how upset I am with Game of Thrones
1:02:47for continually doing the let's kill off
1:02:50every single main character that was put
1:02:52into this season in the season finale I
1:02:54wish that they stopped doing that
1:02:56because it feels like a cop-out why
1:02:58would we spend all of these all this
1:03:00time with these characters only to have
1:03:01them die in a completely unceremonious
1:03:03way and it's great for shock value but
1:03:05it really doesn't feel like a good park
1:03:07for anybody involved and then know
1:03:09Jason's mentioned something on that TV
1:03:11episode about how about how they're not
1:03:14necessarily important to any of the
1:03:16character arcs but much more for the Ark
1:03:19of the kingdom and series as a whole so
1:03:22that kind of payoff feels very mixed in
1:03:25terms of these character moments at
1:03:26while also moving the plot along
1:03:27ridiculous lengths there's so many
1:03:30characters though I feel like killing
1:03:32off characters is fine with me like
1:03:33asthma as sad as I am at like archery
1:03:36the Marjorie got wiped out because i
1:03:38really like her that I felt like the
1:03:41high Sparrow I didn't need to see any
1:03:42more of him this is how he got taken out
1:03:44that's the end of his story loris you
1:03:46know he was fine but he's a minor
1:03:47character uncle Kevan Lannister you know
1:03:50that the other characters in there I
1:03:51kind of didn't care about the only one
1:03:53the only one that was a bummer i just
1:03:55love that there's a guy named Kevin I
1:03:56know it's spelled with an a it doesn't
1:03:57matter it so Kevin do you home alone
1:03:59thing every time
1:04:00so yeah Marjorie Marjorie is a bummer
1:04:02but at the same time I don't know a lot
1:04:04of characters and in the end the payoff
1:04:06here was seriously taking out some of
1:04:08her her enemies and that's going to
1:04:10happen in Game of Thrones III much would
1:04:13much rather see more people die then
1:04:15more new characters introduced at this
1:04:18point but game of thrones you got you
1:04:19got you got a window down right i mean
1:04:21yeah like I think this late in the game
1:04:23not everyone's gonna make
1:04:25alive obviously so will anyone to start
1:04:28that's not yeah that's my question to
1:04:30you
1:04:30I mean yeah and I feel like at this
1:04:32point if you're going to tie up
1:04:34everything there are probably a lot of
1:04:36people where the inside of us if they're
1:04:38dead right like they don't struggle as
1:04:41much I guess that's got dark
1:04:42that's one of the things that drew me
1:04:44the show in the beginning not having
1:04:45read the books as I game it's playing
1:04:47against type and against the the tropes
1:04:49of fantasy novels where you have that
1:04:50road character you know he's going to
1:04:51face many dangers but in the end become
1:04:54trampled and Game of Thrones state the
1:04:56dialogue and it's the sort of the the
1:05:00true to life nature of like when you
1:05:02read a history book you read about
1:05:05whoever it was that survived World War
1:05:08Two and went on to be a congressperson
1:05:10eventually became president united
1:05:12states but if you go back in time and
1:05:14are living through it and you look at
1:05:16all the different men in the same
1:05:17situation went off to war or whatever
1:05:19you can't tell which one of them is
1:05:22going to live through the war and become
1:05:23a congressman and become elected
1:05:24president I state you just they all look
1:05:26the same from this perspective and so
1:05:28you're wondering like which one is going
1:05:29to make it through like this the great
1:05:31filter or whatever and if you're
1:05:33watching your thoughts on having read
1:05:35the books as these people die off you're
1:05:37like yeah because that that's kind of
1:05:38what will be like you don't like the
1:05:40most heroic or bravest or strongest or
1:05:43most noble character there's nothing
1:05:44keeping them alive in real life they you
1:05:47know how many people die in wars and we
1:05:49never know anything more about them it's
1:05:50like you start trying to pick out
1:05:51characters early on in the season I was
1:05:53like is are you gonna be the one who
1:05:55lives for a long time like wow seems
1:05:57highly unlikely but you know and they
1:06:00weren't showing her that much and like
1:06:01trying to pair with Starks we're gonna
1:06:03live like obviously with the rub the Rob
1:06:06head fake but then it's like but Jon
1:06:08Snow he's kind of you know moody and
1:06:11like is that is we hang everything on
1:06:12that answer
1:06:13Sansa's a nitwit and like if you try to
1:06:16figure out who's who's gonna make it
1:06:18through and you realize as the show goes
1:06:19on
1:06:19they don't make it through because of
1:06:21who they are they become who they are
1:06:23because they made it through which i
1:06:25think is something so charming about
1:06:27this shit weird to call charming but
1:06:28such forgot the show that like said that
1:06:31it refuses to to like retcon itself to
1:06:35say always always clear from the
1:06:37beginning
1:06:38the jon snow would be the hero of the
1:06:40whole story that wasn't clear at all
1:06:41like an amine he he didn't I you know we
1:06:44can see it not only it wasn't clear he's
1:06:47gonna do it he actually did I just you
1:06:48know got a get-out-of-jail-free cards
1:06:50and got better
1:06:51yeah it was only mostly dead jaaniya at
1:06:54this point in the show I its condition
1:06:57me I think just to losing characters i
1:06:59honestly cannot think of any character
1:07:01right now that I would be truly
1:07:03heartbreaking heartbroken to lose like
1:07:06RX Tyrion oh god no I I would be happy
1:07:09to see are you get off track yeah yeah
1:07:11no I will I will have a one-person riot
1:07:14like people will opportunity that's
1:07:17right yeah perceiving characters even
1:07:19the characters i really like I i still
1:07:21feel like well I i would be alright with
1:07:24it if they if they want because that's
1:07:25just the way the show the only
1:07:26characters that I i would say I never
1:07:29thought they were going to die because
1:07:31they they seemed so it's not it's not
1:07:34the idea that the story is anybody can
1:07:36die it's like sometimes there are
1:07:37characters that if they died at a
1:07:39certain point you'd be like why do i
1:07:40watch them all this time because like
1:07:41nothing happened there and so that's why
1:07:44I always thought like Canaris is gonna
1:07:46do something right i mean never ever
1:07:48since she came out of you know when they
1:07:50put the crown on her the golden crown on
1:07:52her brother and kill them right at the
1:07:54boys like okay she's gonna make it cuz
1:07:56why are we following her all around if
1:07:58that's like hey there was this business
1:07:59girl over and in the in the east and she
1:08:02was gonna be a queen in Westeros and oh
1:08:05and she died like why would we do that
1:08:07she's out there on her own
1:08:09like if you're if you are away from
1:08:11other characters then if you die your
1:08:13entire thread of the story disappear so
1:08:15it's difficult but to pick them up one
1:08:17when you're in the mix it's easy I mean
1:08:19I guess I Johnson I felt like he was
1:08:20separated from everybody but I felt like
1:08:22he could have been separated to you know
1:08:24always send them off the wall that's
1:08:25where I felt like the lesson of the
1:08:28lessons we learned about the world and
1:08:29him ranging north of the wall and being
1:08:32the only character of real note who
1:08:35could i mean i-i didn't think they were
1:08:37going to pivot and say well I guess it's
1:08:38all about the onion knight now right and
1:08:40I love him he's my favorite character
1:08:41but it was like it felt to me like even
1:08:43when i read the book to and they kill
1:08:45Jon Snow's like yeah that his story's
1:08:47not done he's going to be back but those
1:08:49are exceptions to the rule in most cases
1:08:51take you know as much as I really like
1:08:53Marjorie as a character Marjorie's death
1:08:55is very important in terms of Cersei and
1:08:59she's a very important character and so
1:09:00I I kind of get that but it's true
1:09:03again it's the law of economy of
1:09:05characters again i would like to see
1:09:07fewer characters we're reaching the end
1:09:08game lots of people are gonna die
1:09:10this is the moment where you don't
1:09:11introduce new characters the sand snakes
1:09:14whatever behind the hall come on I want
1:09:18more of them whether they're already
1:09:20here I don't know yeah they're exactly
1:09:22exactly right but but it'sit's now it
1:09:24doesn't feel like we're introducing lots
1:09:26of characters and then killing them off
1:09:28and the bloodbath will continue
1:09:29indefinitely now it feels like we're in
1:09:31the end game and people are gonna die
1:09:32but they're going to die because the
1:09:34whole story is narrowing everything is
1:09:36coming together and that's a different
1:09:37feeling to me than just like you know
1:09:40random just everybody just keeps dying
1:09:42randomly which is not as fun because you
1:09:44don't get the sense like the story is
1:09:46progressing well and when we get to the
1:09:47end when we get the whole end of this
1:09:49thing we're getting close to the end now
1:09:50you will be able to back solve and tell
1:09:54the tale of let me tell you about the
1:09:56heroic Arya Stark or the heroic Tyrion
1:09:58Lannister whoever it is who ends up
1:10:00alive at the end a good position you no
1:10:03matter which of the characters lives who
1:10:05is currently live you will be able to
1:10:06construct a narrative that makes them
1:10:08the hero and you could really tell the
1:10:10whole story as the story of Tyrion he
1:10:12came from adversity and it looked like
1:10:14he wasn't gonna make it himself but then
1:10:15he became king of the Seven Kingdoms but
1:10:17you know what I pick any character
1:10:19wherever they end up they all you can
1:10:20always you know because they have all
1:10:22faced adversity and challenges and
1:10:24unlikely you know her patterns or
1:10:26whatever and that like it's just so nice
1:10:28to see the story not told as if everyone
1:10:32already knows how it ends but rather a
1:10:34bunch of people moving forward in time
1:10:35and a bunch of them don't make it and it
1:10:38mostly disconnected from how likable
1:10:42they are how noble they are what family
1:10:45there from what advantages they had or
1:10:47didn't have the beginning it truly is
1:10:50kind of like the weather of the world
1:10:52killing more or less indiscriminately
1:10:54based on bad luck in circumstance and
1:10:57things that people have no control over
1:10:59and i like that i may remind me reading
1:11:02the books i always thought like they're
1:11:04so detailed and make any read so much
1:11:06like they would be a history in a way
1:11:08that I would always think that this is
1:11:11the point where I would go to Wikipedia
1:11:12and look up what happens to all these
1:11:14people later on and history and you
1:11:16can't do it with a game of thrones
1:11:17because it's made up and that's I think
1:11:19that's part of the appeal is that you
1:11:20just don't you don't know where this is
1:11:21going although i will say again it's a
1:11:24song of ice and fire Denarius and jon
1:11:26snow just saying seems pretty important
1:11:29but you know we'll see
1:11:31we don't know could be brand bran stark
1:11:33interior our bar there they high-five at
1:11:35the end that's what happens i don't know
1:11:37I would be okay with it
1:11:40beers and high five yeah it's also going
1:11:42to be the return to be the I wanted to
1:11:45be the young the lady Mormon she's the
1:11:48only one yes you actually she's she is
1:11:51the one character that i think i would
1:11:52be the saddest if she died and she's
1:11:54great she's pretty cool
1:11:55she's pretty good I this season was such
1:11:57an improvement over last season for me I
1:11:59there like three points last season
1:12:02where I was like I'm not gonna watch
1:12:04this anymore and it was always you know
1:12:06the sansa storyline and i thought was it
1:12:10was brutal not i thought it was brutal
1:12:11it was brutal
1:12:12every time we got a female character a
1:12:15new female character who seems like they
1:12:17had you know agency and the ability to
1:12:20make things happen and they could take
1:12:21care of themselves they were like killed
1:12:23sometimes in the same episode and I i
1:12:26just it made me so angry I was like what
1:12:29do these people have against women like
1:12:31what the writers not the people in the
1:12:34story what are the writers have against
1:12:35women and this season was I don't want
1:12:39to say it was redemptive but it was a it
1:12:42was so much better and now we see Sansa
1:12:45with agency and with like you know not
1:12:49deferring to the person who she thinks
1:12:51of as the head of her house she's like
1:12:53okay well John you're gonna do this
1:12:55thing I'm gonna go to my other thing and
1:12:58then you know we'll hope it works out
1:13:00I'm going to speak up for myself you
1:13:02know the first season's it was all about
1:13:03being a lady and tending to her
1:13:05embroidery and doing what mother and
1:13:07father said and you know i'm going to
1:13:09marry the king and now she's like no
1:13:11so that's this is this is not the path
1:13:14for me i'm going to take care of myself
1:13:16I've learned I need to take care of
1:13:17myself and so I it was such a relief to
1:13:22me to have kind of that turnaround and
1:13:27for women in in the story like even
1:13:31searcy is awful she has she was treated
1:13:34so so poorly last season and I was kind
1:13:37of glad to see the high Sparrow open
1:13:38flame like I don't think we I don't I
1:13:43think that he had an agenda and I don't
1:13:46know that we'll ever know what his
1:13:47agenda was and i do not think it was you
1:13:50know honoring the gods i think he was up
1:13:52to something we may not know what that
1:13:54was but a I've heard people say that
1:13:57this season was really weak that the the
1:13:59storytelling was weak and I patently
1:14:01disagree with ya better with people are
1:14:04but they're formats that is crazy i yeah
1:14:06i just want to give you a great big high
1:14:07five only because I felt the same way I
1:14:09mean after a hard home was the moment
1:14:12that i almost just gave up on the show
1:14:14and honestly anybody who did give up
1:14:15last season I don't blame you but yeah
1:14:17there was plenty plenty of good reason
1:14:19to do so but I am glad that I didn't
1:14:23even though i will probably never watch
1:14:25hard home again ever
1:14:27i I'm glad that I didn't because I I got
1:14:30to see it's not just that the last few
1:14:32seasons were bleak because that's how
1:14:34narrative storytelling works you know
1:14:35darkest before the dawn but also yes
1:14:38that I don't know if they were paying
1:14:39attention to people's complaints or what
1:14:41or if they finally just got their heads
1:14:43out of their bums but yet the women are
1:14:45have been written much much better this
1:14:46season and I mean that you have episodes
1:14:49where it's just just the ladies talking
1:14:51to each other and being amazing i mean
1:14:53that the throne room scene between Danny
1:14:56and Yara I just had to stand up in my
1:14:59room here it was because it was
1:15:01overblown it wasn't overdone they didn't
1:15:03throw it in your face as much as they
1:15:06very very well could have so I mean that
1:15:08each character was still their own sort
1:15:10of dry subtle self and it just played
1:15:13off of each other so well so i think
1:15:15really when you look at all of the major
1:15:18power structures that we have in this
1:15:19world at this point have a woman at the
1:15:22top or very very near to the top
1:15:25which is not something I would've
1:15:26expected after the first few seasons of
1:15:27the show so i'm i'm excited to see where
1:15:30it goes and and hope that you know this
1:15:32trend continues of if the women aren't
1:15:34necessarily completely with succeeding I
1:15:37want them to fail for good reasons for
1:15:40me you know overcome not because they
1:15:42are you know stupid or feminine or have
1:15:44some type of very gendered motivation
1:15:46like not being able to kill a baby some
1:15:48people
1:15:49oh yeah haha yeah as long as they can as
1:15:52long as they can go down fighting in
1:15:54whatever manner that happens to be for
1:15:55the character i'm good with that and hey
1:15:57we had more Diana regular season and if
1:15:59we can keep having more dynamic i will
1:16:01be happy no matter what I'd be sad if
1:16:03she died too but not like I really
1:16:04thought that she was gonna buy today at
1:16:06some point there but I'm glad you made
1:16:07it a lot Marjorie got her out right she
1:16:09said her little flower note for those ya
1:16:11little note to get on a grandmother this
1:16:13guy you can't be here anymore
1:16:14uh yeah I liked it a lot i like the
1:16:17season a lot i felt like i like all of
1:16:19you have said they were unburdened I
1:16:22think I kind of my pet theory is that I
1:16:24feel like they were honoring george RR
1:16:27martin and i would include things that
1:16:29they might otherwise have left out and
1:16:32now that they don't have books to base
1:16:34on they just got kind of a plot outline
1:16:36they're able to kind of make better
1:16:38decisions for television and it felt
1:16:40like it everything started picking up I
1:16:41felt the whole season really moved a lot
1:16:44faster than last season even from the
1:16:45start
1:16:46there were a couple episodes of setup
1:16:47but the the I thought though there was a
1:16:49lot of plot advancement and and the
1:16:52story coming together at the end and hey
1:16:53after six seasons dinero sexually is
1:16:56like on a boat heading west that is
1:16:58progress
1:16:59I say yeah if we were each if we were
1:17:01still going by joining his timetable I
1:17:03don't want she would have gotten like
1:17:04for the you-know-what what is further
1:17:07west than Western just find out let's
1:17:09spend some serious time you know they in
1:17:12the books they say something about like
1:17:13to there's a prophecy of like to go west
1:17:15you must first go east and I thought oh
1:17:17god how far east you have to go like you
1:17:19did no no just keep sailing is maybe a
1:17:21wraparound is she's finding she's
1:17:24finding the passage in you know you'll
1:17:26find that it's a discworld then it's
1:17:27over here cross over at all that would
1:17:30be made what if what if the game of
1:17:32thrones universe is just the other side
1:17:33of the difference right is corporal only
1:17:36got hold on ecology
1:17:37my head hurts ok anything else about
1:17:40Game of Thrones Season six people wanna
1:17:41throw out before we wrap it up
1:17:43well they are we do should we discuss
1:17:45the I'm sure that probably came up in
1:17:47the end of the game of thrones cast you
1:17:49but the Jon Snow parentage again sort of
1:17:53like the reveal potentially of of
1:17:55something that's hung over the entire
1:17:57show basically I mean my favourite bit
1:17:59still being you know hey Ned says I'll
1:18:01tell you about your mom next time i see
1:18:03you never gave her and never again
1:18:05no it's so sad now and famously when
1:18:08george RR martin met with Benioff and
1:18:09Weiss the producers to talk to them
1:18:12about possibly making a show based on
1:18:14his books that's actually the cool the
1:18:16question he quizzed them with witches
1:18:17who do you think Jon Snow's parents are
1:18:19and they gave george RR martin the right
1:18:21answer which is liana stark and what
1:18:25Rhaegar Targaryen Rhaegar Targaryen yeah
1:18:27i just wanna say that's why you leave a
1:18:29note by the way
1:18:30yeah it should be opened in the in the
1:18:32event of my death
1:18:34I'm hoping that that truce doesn't come
1:18:36out like we have been we've been showing
1:18:38this because of brands vision and that
1:18:40brand either dies or never tells anyone
1:18:42he's alive and he's never mentioned
1:18:43again for the rest of the show we just
1:18:45assume like that that's the total game
1:18:47thrones thing to do because in many
1:18:49histories like how someone's actually
1:18:50didn't know that package but they died
1:18:52before they could tell anybody or they
1:18:53never told anybody
1:18:54the end no I think what's gonna happen
1:18:56is like there's going to be a big like
1:18:58explosion or flames of you know
1:19:00sometimes we go on fire and jon snow is
1:19:02gonna walk out of it totally naked and
1:19:04unburned and he's gonna be like what the
1:19:06hell just happened brands gonna go oh
1:19:07did I not tell you you're a Targaryen it
1:19:11is that a recessive Targaryen gene or is
1:19:14that like because I because what's his
1:19:16name
1:19:16Daenerys brother-sister particularly
1:19:18heat-resistant no not-not-not the molten
1:19:21gold anyway it would have been pretty
1:19:22funny if you have jobs that was all pan
1:19:24I totally should have let Melisandre
1:19:26sipping on fire i thought that was the
1:19:28right play
1:19:29yeah well I don't know but yeah I i
1:19:31suspect of it that's going to come up
1:19:32the to Jon Snow is a like the nephew of
1:19:37benares I think you know
1:19:39yeah that's right he can get Mary's and
1:19:41yeah well the data that we've told been
1:19:43told the Targaryen actually do marry in
1:19:45their family so they could totally get
1:19:47married
1:19:48that doesn't make it okay
1:19:49that's how you get the Mad King right
1:19:51that is how you get an American yeah
1:19:52yeah they don't we just back around
1:19:55we're back around to look at our aim
1:19:56problems before yeah well you know yeah
1:19:58totally better history always repeats
1:20:00itself you know
1:20:01alright and to end Tyrion getting a
1:20:03getting I I thought it was a really
1:20:05sweet seem the the scene where Tyrion
1:20:08kind of drops his guard is being the
1:20:11cynical guy and it's like no I believe
1:20:13in you and she makes him a hand of the
1:20:14Queen and all that that was all just
1:20:16that skirts that was made me cry and
1:20:18yeah
1:20:19Atlanta Syrians fate has a someone who's
1:20:22not going to make it may be doing to
1:20:24draw circles on the only thing keeping
1:20:26you alive but only with his only with
1:20:28with her with her only with his queen
1:20:30he's doing that is the love of his life
1:20:32to I think Tyrians gotta have a you know
1:20:36he's going to get get seriously i think
1:20:38i think that's he's gonna be he's gonna
1:20:40meet his brother and sister again at
1:20:43some point in a dramatic fashion I think
1:20:45that has to happen to you
1:20:47where's uncle kevin they want huh
1:20:49couldn't couldn't could make it the
1:20:52thing blew up the side it was
1:20:54Thanksgiving dinner
1:20:55yeah sorry Kevin oh alright well onward
1:21:00to the next game of thrones season
1:21:02whenever it shows up because apparently
1:21:03they've delayed filming they claim
1:21:06because there's winter is not coming
1:21:08yeah they need they need the skies to be
1:21:10gloomy here so they can shoot the winter
1:21:12scenes in their locations but it's been
1:21:17fun talking game of thrones and many
1:21:18other shows with my panel and i will i
1:21:21will say again there are 10 episodes of
1:21:23the TV podcast at the incomparable com
1:21:26/t VTE that you can find about every
1:21:30single episode of Game of Thrones this
1:21:31season if you would like to listen to
1:21:33those thanks to my panelists for being
1:21:36on and talking television with us taking
1:21:38time away from their busy
1:21:39television-watching to be on a podcast
1:21:41about television de Morgan thanks for
1:21:43being here
1:21:44I thanks for having me i should go back
1:21:46to watching television now David Laura
1:21:47know you've been quiet for the last
1:21:49little bit thank you so much for being
1:21:50on anytime i'm i'm excited to go back
1:21:53and watch all of season six now that I
1:21:55know what happened yes exactly right you
1:21:57just get caught up on the game of
1:21:58thrones brian hamilton thanks a lot for
1:22:00being here i'd like to make it a true
1:22:02Daily Double in me
1:22:03category of famous wolves famous wolves
1:22:06soup i'm sorry the correct answer was
1:22:09shaggy-dog shaggy DA shaggy tarpaper
1:22:13shacks dogs John siracusa Thank You a
1:22:16man waits patiently for the next season
1:22:17only in Sims thank you very much
1:22:22I've got daredevil waiting for me gotta
1:22:24go I don't know and Erica and sign
1:22:27thanks thanks a lot as usual you guys
1:22:30have made me feel like I'm not watching
1:22:31enough TV so thank god Erica get with
1:22:35the program come on get with all of the
1:22:38program's get with thank you
1:22:40mes british spelling for program and
1:22:43thanks everybody out there for listening
1:22:44to the incomparable we will see you next
1:22:47week right
1:22:57[Music]