The Incomparable

00:00:00 ◼   ► the incomparable Todd task number 101 [TS]

00:00:07 ◼   ► August 2012 [TS]

00:00:09 ◼   ► welcome back everybody to be [TS]

00:00:12 ◼   ► uncomfortable podcast I'm your hostess [TS]

00:00:14 ◼   ► and snow it's episode 101 starting a new [TS]

00:00:18 ◼   ► century of podcasting excellence [TS]

00:00:21 ◼   ► explains him quotation marks did this [TS]

00:00:27 ◼   ► week's episode is about book it's red [TS]

00:00:30 ◼   ► shirts by john scalzi we did an entire [TS]

00:00:31 ◼   ► podcast about john scalzi and his [TS]

00:00:34 ◼   ► collected works its number 37 so you can [TS]

00:00:36 ◼   ► get identified by 52 TV / incomparable / [TS]

00:00:40 ◼   ► 37 episode is called shadow war the [TS]

00:00:42 ◼   ► night dragons it's got we talked about [TS]

00:00:45 ◼   ► basically all the books that scalzi [TS]

00:00:47 ◼   ► wrote up two red shirts which is the [TS]

00:00:51 ◼   ► topic of today's podcast joining me to [TS]

00:00:55 ◼   ► talk about Richards are these three fine [TS]

00:00:59 ◼   ► upstanding citizens serenity Caldwell is [TS]

00:01:02 ◼   ► with us again [TS]

00:01:03 ◼   ► hello hello I wouldn't call myself [TS]

00:01:05 ◼   ► upstanding that you know what I'll take [TS]

00:01:07 ◼   ► the compliment I i called you that so i [TS]

00:01:09 ◼   ► get to do that all right [TS]

00:01:11 ◼   ► also the the great and well-read Scott [TS]

00:01:14 ◼   ► McNulty hi Scott [TS]

00:01:16 ◼   ► hello jason and i would call myself [TS]

00:01:18 ◼   ► great so spun off and joining us from [TS]

00:01:22 ◼   ► the Pacific Northwest a man who read [TS]

00:01:25 ◼   ► many books and hence has many opinions [TS]

00:01:27 ◼   ► about them [TS]

00:01:27 ◼   ► Glenn fleischmann Glenn I have no [TS]

00:01:30 ◼   ► opinion about whether i'm here tonight [TS]

00:01:31 ◼   ► or not [TS]

00:01:32 ◼   ► thank you thank you that that helps a [TS]

00:01:35 ◼   ► lot [TS]

00:01:35 ◼   ► so red shirts is a very strange [TS]

00:01:39 ◼   ► it's a very strange book with a very [TS]

00:01:41 ◼   ► strange subject and when i first heard [TS]

00:01:42 ◼   ► that this book was coming out [TS]

00:01:45 ◼   ► I i kind of thought it was a joke [TS]

00:01:48 ◼   ► because let's let's go through the [TS]

00:01:51 ◼   ► history here John Scalzi wrote this [TS]

00:01:54 ◼   ► shadow or the night dragons thing which [TS]

00:01:55 ◼   ► actually was a joke and got nominated [TS]

00:01:57 ◼   ► for hugo award for best short story that [TS]

00:02:00 ◼   ► was his the idea of the perfectly [TS]

00:02:02 ◼   ► targeted fantasy novel title and he also [TS]

00:02:07 ◼   ► did little fuzzy fuzzy fuzzy nation [TS]

00:02:09 ◼   ► which is the reboot of a classic sci-fi [TS]

00:02:12 ◼   ► novel little fuzzy [TS]

00:02:13 ◼   ► and so then he is red shirts thing gets [TS]

00:02:16 ◼   ► announced and I think to myself [TS]

00:02:18 ◼   ► surely this isn't real this is it was [TS]

00:02:20 ◼   ► John Scalzi gone crazy is what is he [TS]

00:02:23 ◼   ► doing all this you know all these [TS]

00:02:25 ◼   ► strange pranks and stunts and and wacky [TS]

00:02:28 ◼   ► chapters two books that don't exist and [TS]

00:02:30 ◼   ► reboots of things is it going to really [TS]

00:02:33 ◼   ► write a whole novel of with the premise [TS]

00:02:35 ◼   ► that it's a basically startrack seen [TS]

00:02:37 ◼   ► from the from the perspective of the [TS]

00:02:40 ◼   ► redshirts who are going off to their [TS]

00:02:42 ◼   ► impending doom and on of fundamental [TS]

00:02:46 ◼   ► level that is sort of where this book [TS]

00:02:48 ◼   ► starts right he did this book the only [TS]

00:02:52 ◼   ► way that this book could have been done [TS]

00:02:53 ◼   ► i kind of feel like it like everything [TS]

00:02:56 ◼   ► you did the chicken he did the the [TS]

00:02:57 ◼   ► kitchen sink approach this he like took [TS]

00:02:59 ◼   ► everything you said he did [TS]

00:03:01 ◼   ► simultaneously [TS]

00:03:02 ◼   ► well the so this book there is a way to [TS]

00:03:05 ◼   ► do this book and do it extremely badly [TS]

00:03:07 ◼   ► right which is to say okay here's it's [TS]

00:03:11 ◼   ► going to be wacky we're gonna have a [TS]

00:03:13 ◼   ► ship and it's going to be like Star Trek [TS]

00:03:15 ◼   ► and the characters will be recognizably [TS]

00:03:18 ◼   ► Star Trek characters and accept our main [TS]

00:03:21 ◼   ► characters of the red shirts and they [TS]

00:03:22 ◼   ► all realize that the redshirts get [TS]

00:03:24 ◼   ► killed a lot and it really bugs them and [TS]

00:03:27 ◼   ► that's there's it's a novel and then we [TS]

00:03:30 ◼   ► would you get that in a couple of [TS]

00:03:32 ◼   ► chapters and then the rest of it would [TS]

00:03:34 ◼   ► just will be just belabor it endlessly [TS]

00:03:37 ◼   ► and I i could type that I mean that is [TS]

00:03:39 ◼   ► what I dreaded when I read this book was [TS]

00:03:42 ◼   ► that it was going to be this one joke [TS]

00:03:44 ◼   ► and it's like well scalzi I like his [TS]

00:03:45 ◼   ► stuff [TS]

00:03:46 ◼   ► let's see if there's some other way to [TS]

00:03:48 ◼   ► do this but that was my fear was that [TS]

00:03:50 ◼   ► this was going to be a UH sort of a [TS]

00:03:52 ◼   ► single joke played out over an [TS]

00:03:54 ◼   ► appropriate length and we would get the [TS]

00:03:57 ◼   ► joke really early on and then there [TS]

00:03:59 ◼   ► would be nothing left to appreciate [TS]

00:04:01 ◼   ► about it right i mean did anybody else [TS]

00:04:03 ◼   ► you know that Scott was that your [TS]

00:04:05 ◼   ► feeling about going in it was my my fear [TS]

00:04:09 ◼   ► if you're I'm always suspicious of books [TS]

00:04:12 ◼   ► who's the author name is larger than the [TS]

00:04:15 ◼   ► title and that's a book that yes that is [TS]

00:04:19 ◼   ► I guess John Scalzi has gotten to that [TS]

00:04:21 ◼   ► point in his career where [TS]

00:04:22 ◼   ► his name is more important than the [TS]

00:04:24 ◼   ► title of the book so that worried me and [TS]

00:04:27 ◼   ► then of course the premise like you said [TS]

00:04:29 ◼   ► it's kind of flimsy I you know it's kind [TS]

00:04:33 ◼   ► of like a running science fiction joke [TS]

00:04:36 ◼   ► so I didn't know what more could be done [TS]

00:04:40 ◼   ► with it and especially I didn't know if [TS]

00:04:42 ◼   ► it was a joke that could last a whole [TS]

00:04:43 ◼   ► novel but he cleverly kind of made it [TS]

00:04:47 ◼   ► kind of three different things together [TS]

00:04:49 ◼   ► so he kind of addressed that I but you [TS]

00:04:53 ◼   ► know i mean it's it's it's it wasn't [TS]

00:04:56 ◼   ► horrible i actually quite liked it [TS]

00:04:58 ◼   ► yeah I like 22 and I liked it because it [TS]

00:05:01 ◼   ► wasn't one of the big reasons i like [TS]

00:05:03 ◼   ► this because it was not what I expected [TS]

00:05:05 ◼   ► I expected so just as a brief recap we [TS]

00:05:09 ◼   ► meet these red shirt characters this [TS]

00:05:10 ◼   ► indeed that the horror story you know my [TS]

00:05:14 ◼   ► fear of what this book would be about it [TS]

00:05:16 ◼   ► is that's what the book is at the start [TS]

00:05:18 ◼   ► right so at the start we meet these [TS]

00:05:21 ◼   ► characters who are being assigned to the [TS]

00:05:23 ◼   ► intrepid which is the ship that they [TS]

00:05:25 ◼   ► vary enterprise like ship the flagship [TS]

00:05:28 ◼   ► of the universal Union the dub dub right [TS]

00:05:31 ◼   ► there [TS]

00:05:32 ◼   ► eww eww i forget what they call yet [TS]

00:05:36 ◼   ► it's just it's it's ridiculous because [TS]

00:05:38 ◼   ► it's the Federation that's the w that's [TS]

00:05:40 ◼   ► it w space for the blob the w space [TS]

00:05:43 ◼   ► fleet the flagship the universal Union [TS]

00:05:46 ◼   ► capital ship intrepid right and and and [TS]

00:05:49 ◼   ► the characters there's a an alien ish [TS]

00:05:52 ◼   ► guy who's very basically Spock and [TS]

00:05:55 ◼   ► there's this blowhard captain and [TS]

00:05:56 ◼   ► there's a you know an engineer in a [TS]

00:05:58 ◼   ► doctor and I mean it's he's done a good [TS]

00:06:00 ◼   ► job of you know changing everything [TS]

00:06:04 ◼   ► while making it perfectly clear all we [TS]

00:06:05 ◼   ► all know what he's doing here and it's [TS]

00:06:08 ◼   ► so it looks like this is going to be the [TS]

00:06:09 ◼   ► story and then I what scalzi did that i [TS]

00:06:14 ◼   ► thought was really impressive is he you [TS]

00:06:19 ◼   ► know he he gives his character he treats [TS]

00:06:23 ◼   ► his characters like real people and he [TS]

00:06:25 ◼   ► treats the premise seriously and then [TS]

00:06:31 ◼   ► just sort of takes it to its fullest [TS]

00:06:32 ◼   ► extent and I didn't expect that I [TS]

00:06:35 ◼   ► really didn't expect you today we're [TS]

00:06:37 ◼   ► okay what if what if this scenario [TS]

00:06:40 ◼   ► played out at and then it gets really [TS]

00:06:44 ◼   ► weird and meta right where he also [TS]

00:06:46 ◼   ► throws in there that they realized that [TS]

00:06:49 ◼   ► this is they find this reclusive [TS]

00:06:51 ◼   ► character who's like hiding in the [TS]

00:06:52 ◼   ► middle of the ship somewhere and we're [TS]

00:06:55 ◼   ► all these uh like carts are stored or [TS]

00:06:59 ◼   ► something it's so bizarre [TS]

00:07:01 ◼   ► it's I thought you liked that part [TS]

00:07:03 ◼   ► because of the real genius [TS]

00:07:04 ◼   ► it is actually yeah well as well it is [TS]

00:07:07 ◼   ► he's lastly and he he is obsessed with [TS]

00:07:10 ◼   ► something called the narrative and it [TS]

00:07:13 ◼   ► turns out that this is this is a more [TS]

00:07:16 ◼   ► than just a story about characters who [TS]

00:07:19 ◼   ► were stuck on a on startrack about to be [TS]

00:07:22 ◼   ► killed it's a it's a story about [TS]

00:07:23 ◼   ► characters whose lives are being [TS]

00:07:25 ◼   ► determined by the scripts of a sci-fi TV [TS]

00:07:29 ◼   ► series and as we learn a particularly [TS]

00:07:31 ◼   ► bad side that's not so great [TS]

00:07:34 ◼   ► not so great and and schools he himself [TS]

00:07:37 ◼   ► was the technical advisor for the for [TS]

00:07:40 ◼   ► stargate universe the last and stargate [TS]

00:07:42 ◼   ► series so he had some experience with TV [TS]

00:07:45 ◼   ► although he has an author's no worries [TS]

00:07:46 ◼   ► look this Stargate Universe is much [TS]

00:07:48 ◼   ► better than this terrible show i'm [TS]

00:07:49 ◼   ► writing about now so it that that point [TS]

00:07:54 ◼   ► I have to admit that point at that point [TS]

00:07:57 ◼   ► the novel almost lost me because I [TS]

00:07:59 ◼   ► thought it was going to get very meta at [TS]

00:08:02 ◼   ► which it did but and an overly clever [TS]

00:08:06 ◼   ► and and that was the moment where I [TS]

00:08:09 ◼   ► really I i began to fear that this was [TS]

00:08:12 ◼   ► not what I expected but might actually [TS]

00:08:14 ◼   ► be worse than I expected you know I [TS]

00:08:17 ◼   ► think it brings both of those things but [TS]

00:08:19 ◼   ► at the same time it [TS]

00:08:21 ◼   ► it rides the line very carefully i have [TS]

00:08:24 ◼   ► to admit when I first started reading [TS]

00:08:25 ◼   ► the book and this is the first scalzi [TS]

00:08:27 ◼   ► book that i have read which is an [TS]

00:08:29 ◼   ► interesting way to enter into his [TS]

00:08:31 ◼   ► fiction the old man's war might be a [TS]

00:08:33 ◼   ► better place to start but ok yeah old [TS]

00:08:36 ◼   ► man's war was on my list but this one [TS]

00:08:38 ◼   ► came out first and I heard that it was [TS]

00:08:39 ◼   ► short and we were talking about [TS]

00:08:40 ◼   ► potentially discussing it and I'm like I [TS]

00:08:42 ◼   ► like red shirts [TS]

00:08:45 ◼   ► better go and it's his best-selling book [TS]

00:08:47 ◼   ► so i think that for a lot of people [TS]

00:08:49 ◼   ► sometimes just a strong but yeah the [TS]

00:08:51 ◼   ► first when i first started reading this [TS]

00:08:53 ◼   ► I actually assume I'm like okay well [TS]

00:08:55 ◼   ► they can go one of two ways [TS]

00:08:57 ◼   ► I I thought about the TV show in the [TS]

00:08:59 ◼   ► back of my head but my first thought was [TS]

00:09:01 ◼   ► oh they're gonna have like an evil AI [TS]

00:09:04 ◼   ► controlling and pulling the settings [TS]

00:09:06 ◼   ► right sure but he's basically been [TS]

00:09:07 ◼   ► blackmailed by this evil iight you're an [TS]

00:09:09 ◼   ► Inuit you're looking for an in-universe [TS]

00:09:11 ◼   ► premise right you know I assumed it was [TS]

00:09:14 ◼   ► that way and then the second they start [TS]

00:09:15 ◼   ► talking about the narrative I'm like oh [TS]

00:09:17 ◼   ► wait you mean this crazy half-assed [TS]

00:09:19 ◼   ► thought i had in the very beginning of [TS]

00:09:21 ◼   ► the no reading the book is actually [TS]

00:09:23 ◼   ► where they're going [TS]

00:09:24 ◼   ► this is insanity yeah yeah there's a [TS]

00:09:29 ◼   ► whole last job I always put my talented [TS]

00:09:32 ◼   ► writer hides half of the ass for later [TS]

00:09:34 ◼   ► really lolz lolz us into a sense of [TS]

00:09:36 ◼   ► believing that the narrative that he's [TS]

00:09:38 ◼   ► constructed as the narrative with the [TS]

00:09:40 ◼   ► capital and time travel plots and all [TS]

00:09:43 ◼   ► this nonsense he leads us to believe [TS]

00:09:45 ◼   ► that that's actually the narrative is [TS]

00:09:46 ◼   ► telling then he tells a different [TS]

00:09:48 ◼   ► narrative within that structure that he [TS]

00:09:50 ◼   ► tells three more in areas in appendices [TS]

00:09:53 ◼   ► yeah right we're going to bed which will [TS]

00:09:55 ◼   ► get to know really will get to the [TS]

00:09:57 ◼   ► killings write the book was fun and then [TS]

00:10:00 ◼   ► the general plot of you know the [TS]

00:10:02 ◼   ► redshirts was pretty great and I was [TS]

00:10:05 ◼   ► like this is a solid B book and like [TS]

00:10:07 ◼   ► really enjoyable and something fun to [TS]

00:10:09 ◼   ► read good summer reading and then he [TS]

00:10:13 ◼   ► dropped the remote is one after the [TS]

00:10:14 ◼   ► other [TS]

00:10:15 ◼   ► yes yes oh so before we get there so [TS]

00:10:17 ◼   ► yeah what happens is you know you're [TS]

00:10:20 ◼   ► reading a story this this is the metal [TS]

00:10:24 ◼   ► part you're reading a story and it turns [TS]

00:10:25 ◼   ► out that these guys are being controlled [TS]

00:10:26 ◼   ► by this narrative which is the TV show [TS]

00:10:28 ◼   ► and and as I was saying earlier that's [TS]

00:10:30 ◼   ► the point where I thought oh gee this [TS]

00:10:31 ◼   ► could go horribly wrong and where it [TS]

00:10:33 ◼   ► doesn't go wrong is he [TS]

00:10:35 ◼   ► he just keeps going with taking the [TS]

00:10:37 ◼   ► whole thing seriously and set and you [TS]

00:10:39 ◼   ► can see him almost as a writer saying [TS]

00:10:41 ◼   ► alright I've done that now what it's [TS]

00:10:44 ◼   ► like well now they're going to try to go [TS]

00:10:46 ◼   ► you know they'll try to go [TS]

00:10:49 ◼   ► contact the writers of the show they'll [TS]

00:10:50 ◼   ► try to go back in time but how is that [TS]

00:10:52 ◼   ► possible well of course star trek and [TS]

00:10:54 ◼   ► shows like it use ridiculous things that [TS]

00:10:56 ◼   ► don't make any sense of their several [TS]

00:10:58 ◼   ► points scientists [TS]

00:10:59 ◼   ► in the kiss your characters say that [TS]

00:11:01 ◼   ► doesn't work you couldn't do it that way [TS]

00:11:04 ◼   ► and like doesn't matter when the [TS]

00:11:06 ◼   ► narrative is focused anything is [TS]

00:11:07 ◼   ► possible because they just whatever the [TS]

00:11:09 ◼   ► writers write happens so that's his [TS]

00:11:11 ◼   ► commentary part but they go back that [TS]

00:11:14 ◼   ► was a moment where it got me back all [TS]

00:11:15 ◼   ► the way was when they said no we're [TS]

00:11:17 ◼   ► gonna go and try to talk to these people [TS]

00:11:18 ◼   ► who are writing these stories and get [TS]

00:11:20 ◼   ► them to stop killing us because that if [TS]

00:11:23 ◼   ► you were that character in that world [TS]

00:11:25 ◼   ► that's exactly what you do we gonna do [TS]

00:11:27 ◼   ► yeah and so then they do that and then [TS]

00:11:29 ◼   ► they have their adventures on on planet [TS]

00:11:33 ◼   ► earth trying to deal with the the [TS]

00:11:35 ◼   ► writers of the intrepid Series and [TS]

00:11:38 ◼   ► trying to meet them and then they [TS]

00:11:40 ◼   ► discovered that they are meeting their [TS]

00:11:42 ◼   ► actors which is something so he starts [TS]

00:11:45 ◼   ► wackiness narrow and schools is that is [TS]

00:11:48 ◼   ► that for star trek for ya also it [TS]

00:11:50 ◼   ► reminded me and I it's something i've [TS]

00:11:51 ◼   ► mentioned before there's this visit to a [TS]

00:11:54 ◼   ► weird planet damn fiction [TS]

00:11:56 ◼   ► although i think it was a published in [TS]

00:11:58 ◼   ► the seventies that was about starting a [TS]

00:12:02 ◼   ► transporter accident that swaps the [TS]

00:12:04 ◼   ► actors with the actual Star Trek [TS]

00:12:06 ◼   ► characters and that's their two stories [TS]

00:12:09 ◼   ► told from the opposite vantage points [TS]

00:12:10 ◼   ► where the actors are on the enterprise [TS]

00:12:12 ◼   ► and where the real characters are now in [TS]

00:12:15 ◼   ► in modern-day or nineteen sixties [TS]

00:12:17 ◼   ► California and it was it was very much [TS]

00:12:21 ◼   ► in that vein to where suddenly there's [TS]

00:12:23 ◼   ► the checkoff like character who keeps [TS]

00:12:25 ◼   ► getting horribly maimed but then [TS]

00:12:27 ◼   ► miraculously saved and his his actor is [TS]

00:12:33 ◼   ► like some sort of famous kind of more [TS]

00:12:35 ◼   ► Playboy's kind of character and they [TS]

00:12:37 ◼   ► they had there's a whole like you know [TS]

00:12:40 ◼   ► whole set piece really where they ended [TS]

00:12:43 ◼   ► up kidnapping him and driving him [TS]

00:12:45 ◼   ► because he's he's drunk and made they [TS]

00:12:47 ◼   ► they kidnapped him and drive him away in [TS]

00:12:49 ◼   ► his car and then they talked to him [TS]

00:12:52 ◼   ► which again you end up with these [TS]

00:12:53 ◼   ► duplicates actually talking there's no [TS]

00:12:55 ◼   ► no cheat of like well what what happened [TS]

00:12:58 ◼   ► I don't know he was unconscious you'll [TS]

00:12:59 ◼   ► never know the truth said no he and his [TS]

00:13:01 ◼   ► actor have a have a whole conversation [TS]

00:13:03 ◼   ► about their lives which is again scalzi [TS]

00:13:06 ◼   ► taking it taking it seriously in in this [TS]

00:13:09 ◼   ► completely crazy idea of applause [TS]

00:13:12 ◼   ► he he never you know he's funny but he's [TS]

00:13:16 ◼   ► taking it seriously in the sense that [TS]

00:13:17 ◼   ► he's gonna he's gonna explore his [TS]

00:13:19 ◼   ► premise to its conclusions and not fit [TS]

00:13:21 ◼   ► not to a fake-out which I really like [TS]

00:13:23 ◼   ► yeah it doesn't feel like he's just [TS]

00:13:26 ◼   ► putting it for you as you were saying is [TS]

00:13:29 ◼   ► like a oh well I guess I'll never talk [TS]

00:13:31 ◼   ► to each other and you can meet your past [TS]

00:13:34 ◼   ► pseudo self but I mean this is something [TS]

00:13:37 ◼   ► that the Coda's which come after the [TS]

00:13:40 ◼   ► story play on in a great deal is so the [TS]

00:13:43 ◼   ► characters go back and meet their actor [TS]

00:13:46 ◼   ► cells and they meet the writers of the [TS]

00:13:48 ◼   ► show and they basically two out the [TS]

00:13:50 ◼   ► writer of the show and be like why do [TS]

00:13:51 ◼   ► you gotta kill us man [TS]

00:13:53 ◼   ► and after that all happens and things [TS]

00:13:56 ◼   ► are resolved in a way that I guess we [TS]

00:13:58 ◼   ► can i watch suppose interface listening [TS]

00:14:00 ◼   ► his read the book will say let's fire [TS]

00:14:03 ◼   ► the so we're going on [TS]

00:14:06 ◼   ► but the boiler aren't ya so they get [TS]

00:14:09 ◼   ► things results and then then what [TS]

00:14:13 ◼   ► happens afterwards what happens once you [TS]

00:14:14 ◼   ► realize that as show that you have been [TS]

00:14:16 ◼   ► writing is real people [TS]

00:14:19 ◼   ► well I have been before that though the [TS]

00:14:21 ◼   ► in the last two in the last two chapters [TS]

00:14:23 ◼   ► that these two characters that this one [TS]

00:14:25 ◼   ► of the things calls he does what I [TS]

00:14:26 ◼   ► really like is he's got the what I I've [TS]

00:14:29 ◼   ► always heard you referred to as the the [TS]

00:14:32 ◼   ► law of the economy lot of economy of [TS]

00:14:33 ◼   ► characters where every character has a [TS]

00:14:35 ◼   ► purpose so if you're in a mystery and [TS]

00:14:37 ◼   ► there's only one person who's not yet [TS]

00:14:39 ◼   ► explained well they did it because [TS]

00:14:41 ◼   ► there's only they don't show you [TS]

00:14:43 ◼   ► characters who are pointless and there's [TS]

00:14:46 ◼   ► our answer these there's that our [TS]

00:14:48 ◼   ► protagonist a doll and then there's this [TS]

00:14:50 ◼   ► other character who is his buddy who [TS]

00:14:52 ◼   ► doesn't ever get killed and you keep [TS]

00:14:55 ◼   ► waiting to see why is he going to be [TS]

00:14:56 ◼   ► important and there's no explanation for [TS]

00:14:58 ◼   ► why he's important and in the end in the [TS]

00:15:00 ◼   ► next to last chapter doll realizes [TS]

00:15:03 ◼   ► something that is scalzi pulling it back [TS]

00:15:07 ◼   ► we've been reading this narrative all [TS]

00:15:09 ◼   ► along this book and and you know you buy [TS]

00:15:12 ◼   ► into the premise that they're controlled [TS]

00:15:13 ◼   ► by the TV writers because that's what [TS]

00:15:15 ◼   ► the story is about in the last chapter [TS]

00:15:17 ◼   ► scalzi undercuts that completely and [TS]

00:15:20 ◼   ► says it all realizes that he's the [TS]

00:15:23 ◼   ► protagonist of a different narrative [TS]

00:15:25 ◼   ► which is the book that were reading and [TS]

00:15:27 ◼   ► he asks his friend my to confirm this [TS]

00:15:29 ◼   ► and says you know you have no other [TS]

00:15:31 ◼   ► purpose you just kind of you've never [TS]

00:15:33 ◼   ► been hurt you have no reason to be here [TS]

00:15:35 ◼   ► and yet you're always around [TS]

00:15:37 ◼   ► I think your purpose is to confirm to me [TS]

00:15:40 ◼   ► whether this is true which the character [TS]

00:15:42 ◼   ► doesn't mess us now I gotta go because [TS]

00:15:44 ◼   ► i'm going to be on duty and he walks out [TS]

00:15:45 ◼   ► and and that's an amazing chapter [TS]

00:15:50 ◼   ► because that's really scalzi laying it [TS]

00:15:52 ◼   ► all out there about like what it is to [TS]

00:15:54 ◼   ► write characters and what happens to [TS]

00:15:55 ◼   ► them when the book is over and is it's [TS]

00:15:57 ◼   ► in everybody's imaginations and all is [TS]

00:16:01 ◼   ► the protagonist he's not this red shirt [TS]

00:16:03 ◼   ► because he's the main character in a [TS]

00:16:05 ◼   ► novel that everybody at that point who [TS]

00:16:07 ◼   ► you know has read the entire novel with [TS]

00:16:09 ◼   ► him as the protagonist so that's a great [TS]

00:16:11 ◼   ► ending up on its own without the code is [TS]

00:16:14 ◼   ► and of course it's cuz you can't resist [TS]

00:16:16 ◼   ► because he is a very funny writer and [TS]

00:16:17 ◼   ► and this is a funny book but [TS]

00:16:20 ◼   ► you can't resist one last joke which is [TS]

00:16:21 ◼   ► that doll walks out too and they live [TS]

00:16:24 ◼   ► happily ever after until six months [TS]

00:16:25 ◼   ► later where the ship is hit by an [TS]

00:16:27 ◼   ► asteroid and everybody dies and then no [TS]

00:16:30 ◼   ► no just can't handle a specialized [TS]

00:16:31 ◼   ► chapter is not just I'm just messing [TS]

00:16:34 ◼   ► with you [TS]

00:16:34 ◼   ► that's I really live happily ever after [TS]

00:16:37 ◼   ► a minute when i read that next batch [TS]

00:16:39 ◼   ► it's where the book will make me laugh [TS]

00:16:40 ◼   ► heartily laughs out loud and that last [TS]

00:16:43 ◼   ► chapter i was i was laughing that was [TS]

00:16:46 ◼   ► really funny but that that's right i [TS]

00:16:49 ◼   ► mean it's it's they're not real [TS]

00:16:51 ◼   ► he could kill them and it doesn't matter [TS]

00:16:52 ◼   ► and and yet it does matter because [TS]

00:16:54 ◼   ► you've invested something in these in [TS]

00:16:57 ◼   ► these characters and I I realized my one [TS]

00:16:59 ◼   ► level this is completely kind of a [TS]

00:17:01 ◼   ► ridiculously a self-referential thing [TS]

00:17:04 ◼   ► that he does but but he did it never you [TS]

00:17:08 ◼   ► know it never seemed cheap it never [TS]

00:17:10 ◼   ► seemed funny to me it never seemed like [TS]

00:17:11 ◼   ► he was not taking the reader and the [TS]

00:17:15 ◼   ► character seriously and I guess that's [TS]

00:17:16 ◼   ► why I I didn't you know I didn't ever [TS]

00:17:19 ◼   ► sour on the on the premise [TS]

00:17:22 ◼   ► well you know I thought the book um for [TS]

00:17:24 ◼   ► the redemption for me was i I thought I [TS]

00:17:26 ◼   ► was sort of cute like okay so that whole [TS]

00:17:29 ◼   ► first part most the large part of the [TS]

00:17:31 ◼   ► novel before the the code is coming with [TS]

00:17:33 ◼   ► Jerry no significant enough in their own [TS]

00:17:35 ◼   ► right [TS]

00:17:36 ◼   ► um I enjoyed it but I felt it was an [TS]

00:17:38 ◼   ► extended premise and I thought he took [TS]

00:17:40 ◼   ► the promises he went to the full extent [TS]

00:17:42 ◼   ► it could be i've read the same thing I [TS]

00:17:45 ◼   ► feel like in less clever form without [TS]

00:17:47 ◼   ► the science-fiction aspect but examining [TS]

00:17:49 ◼   ► the notion of that for instance Muriel [TS]

00:17:51 ◼   ► Sparks novel the comforters written in a [TS]

00:17:54 ◼   ► publisher 1957 examine this idea at some [TS]

00:17:57 ◼   ► depth in which shot [TS]

00:17:59 ◼   ► Wow right I novelist starts hearing [TS]

00:18:02 ◼   ► voices the sound of typewriter realize [TS]

00:18:03 ◼   ► it's exactly her life being you know led [TS]

00:18:05 ◼   ► so it's not a new idea and I think some [TS]

00:18:09 ◼   ► people writing about this thought wow [TS]

00:18:11 ◼   ► what a great idea to have a meta novel [TS]

00:18:12 ◼   ► like it's not original like okay we know [TS]

00:18:14 ◼   ► that's not original but I felt I don't [TS]

00:18:16 ◼   ► know I felt that kind of played out a [TS]

00:18:18 ◼   ► little far there's a lot of you know he [TS]

00:18:21 ◼   ► wanted the one character walks into a [TS]

00:18:22 ◼   ► bar and sees a version of another [TS]

00:18:26 ◼   ► character it was killed who's the [TS]

00:18:27 ◼   ► bartender in a bit part [TS]

00:18:29 ◼   ► on the show at some point as that [TS]

00:18:31 ◼   ► character is killed oh yeah that's [TS]

00:18:32 ◼   ► really that's really touching and you [TS]

00:18:34 ◼   ► know they have a more moment and I think [TS]

00:18:36 ◼   ► scalzi writes those moments well but [TS]

00:18:38 ◼   ► though what saved it for me what pull [TS]

00:18:41 ◼   ► the whole thing together i think was the [TS]

00:18:42 ◼   ► third coda which is a beautiful story [TS]

00:18:45 ◼   ► told very warmly and almost stands alone [TS]

00:18:48 ◼   ► like you almost don't need the entire [TS]

00:18:49 ◼   ► rest of the book right for that story [TS]

00:18:52 ◼   ► but i think it benefits from it and I [TS]

00:18:54 ◼   ► think for some level sort of warmed the [TS]

00:18:56 ◼   ► rest of the story for me [TS]

00:18:57 ◼   ► yes so so I'm glad you brought that up [TS]

00:18:59 ◼   ► one of the things that happens is one of [TS]

00:19:00 ◼   ► these one of its core of the Samba love [TS]

00:19:03 ◼   ► red shirts that we meet I mean he does [TS]

00:19:05 ◼   ► need to do you know what what happens to [TS]

00:19:09 ◼   ► red shirts right he needs to take a [TS]

00:19:10 ◼   ► character that's like fundamentally if [TS]

00:19:12 ◼   ► you're gonna write a book like this you [TS]

00:19:13 ◼   ► gotta meet these characters and build [TS]

00:19:15 ◼   ► them up and then kill one of them and [TS]

00:19:17 ◼   ► make it feel like it matters if even if [TS]

00:19:19 ◼   ► you don't care about them you care about [TS]

00:19:21 ◼   ► how it affects the other characters that [TS]

00:19:22 ◼   ► they're upset by it and he does that and [TS]

00:19:25 ◼   ► you know again it's kind of the price of [TS]

00:19:27 ◼   ► admission [TS]

00:19:28 ◼   ► I'm end but then exactly what you said [TS]

00:19:32 ◼   ► is the thing about scalzi doing this is [TS]

00:19:34 ◼   ► like he does the baseline and you think [TS]

00:19:36 ◼   ► okay he did the baseline and that's not [TS]

00:19:38 ◼   ► he just doesn't stop there he keeps [TS]

00:19:39 ◼   ► going and so we get a scene when they're [TS]

00:19:41 ◼   ► back on earth there back in LA and they [TS]

00:19:45 ◼   ► meet the actor who played their friend [TS]

00:19:46 ◼   ► who died and its really emotional and [TS]

00:19:49 ◼   ► upsetting and yet also happy in a way [TS]

00:19:52 ◼   ► because he didn't die i guess right away [TS]

00:19:56 ◼   ► um I and I thought that was brilliant [TS]

00:19:58 ◼   ► right because it's not it made it made [TS]

00:20:01 ◼   ► that all matter more that he died when [TS]

00:20:04 ◼   ► he was a redshirt because it mattered to [TS]

00:20:06 ◼   ► them and now you you see how their they [TS]

00:20:08 ◼   ► emotionally react to seeing him again [TS]

00:20:10 ◼   ► and in real life and that's played out [TS]

00:20:12 ◼   ► even further in the CODIS but you know [TS]

00:20:14 ◼   ► that that you know the more I think [TS]

00:20:16 ◼   ► about it the more I I just impressed [TS]

00:20:18 ◼   ► that that schools he had enough respect [TS]

00:20:20 ◼   ► for his characters in his premise to [TS]

00:20:22 ◼   ► take it all the way and not do what I [TS]

00:20:25 ◼   ► think a letter writer would have done [TS]

00:20:27 ◼   ► which is sort of fun it in and just hit [TS]

00:20:28 ◼   ► the notes and get out [TS]

00:20:30 ◼   ► yeah i think the as i said i think the [TS]

00:20:31 ◼   ► code is elevated for me from a good [TS]

00:20:35 ◼   ► summer reading you know put it down [TS]

00:20:37 ◼   ► after you finish reading and maybe I'll [TS]

00:20:39 ◼   ► think about it a couple months now but [TS]

00:20:41 ◼   ► the code is really [TS]

00:20:42 ◼   ► make it stick in my head and the first [TS]

00:20:44 ◼   ► the first Kota is funny the first Kota [TS]

00:20:46 ◼   ► is really there just to make you think [TS]

00:20:48 ◼   ► about it and again the you know i'm just [TS]

00:20:50 ◼   ► messing with you [TS]

00:20:51 ◼   ► they lived happily ever after from the [TS]

00:20:53 ◼   ► writers point of view that's fascinating [TS]

00:20:55 ◼   ► so the first Kota is a a blog which is [TS]

00:20:59 ◼   ► funny because schools he himself has a [TS]

00:21:01 ◼   ► blog a blog from one of the writers of [TS]

00:21:04 ◼   ► the intrepid who talks about his sort of [TS]

00:21:06 ◼   ► descent into madness in a way when he [TS]

00:21:09 ◼   ► realizes that all of the things that [TS]

00:21:11 ◼   ► he's writing are causing sort of real [TS]

00:21:13 ◼   ► people in another universe to live these [TS]

00:21:15 ◼   ► things and he he become sort of [TS]

00:21:17 ◼   ► paralyzed about killing them off and his [TS]

00:21:20 ◼   ► bosses are upset because the drama isn't [TS]

00:21:23 ◼   ► as good when he's trying to protect his [TS]

00:21:25 ◼   ► characters which again is an interesting [TS]

00:21:27 ◼   ► comment from a rider to say and I [TS]

00:21:30 ◼   ► thought that was really funny because [TS]

00:21:31 ◼   ► you know he he tries to throw in all of [TS]

00:21:34 ◼   ► his knowledge of what it's like to be a [TS]

00:21:36 ◼   ► two to be a writer on the internet and [TS]

00:21:38 ◼   ► have people reading and commenting and [TS]

00:21:40 ◼   ► trying to figure out what you know his [TS]

00:21:42 ◼   ► secrets that he's trying to keep they [TS]

00:21:44 ◼   ► kind of figure them all out because it [TS]

00:21:46 ◼   ► gives two in much information away and [TS]

00:21:49 ◼   ► you know I thought that was I thought [TS]

00:21:50 ◼   ► that was really funny while also [TS]

00:21:51 ◼   ► exploring this whole idea that well if [TS]

00:21:53 ◼   ► this premise is true wouldn't really [TS]

00:21:54 ◼   ► mess you up as a writer you think the [TS]

00:21:57 ◼   ► paralyzing when you you know you're [TS]

00:21:59 ◼   ► actually hold the little roll power of [TS]

00:22:01 ◼   ► life and death although you know that [TS]

00:22:03 ◼   ► there's sort of a stick which is that [TS]

00:22:05 ◼   ► the people from the future from the [TS]

00:22:08 ◼   ► intrepid come to the past but once they [TS]

00:22:10 ◼   ► go back you know there's not that same [TS]

00:22:13 ◼   ► connection like the inos intellectually [TS]

00:22:15 ◼   ► there's a connection these people in the [TS]

00:22:16 ◼   ► future is affecting their real lives but [TS]

00:22:18 ◼   ► at the same time you know what I'm going [TS]

00:22:20 ◼   ► to come back again and say look you're [TS]

00:22:21 ◼   ► doing again what are you doing to us [TS]

00:22:23 ◼   ► another sort of the and if he stops [TS]

00:22:24 ◼   ► running the show they continue to exist [TS]

00:22:27 ◼   ► apparently so there is some level that [TS]

00:22:28 ◼   ► is want to show cancelled as well is [TS]

00:22:30 ◼   ► that making just keep on going on [TS]

00:22:32 ◼   ► yeah they can make their own future yeah [TS]

00:22:33 ◼   ► I mean there's another part of nervous [TS]

00:22:35 ◼   ► too is like there's another story [TS]

00:22:36 ◼   ► there's so many stories embedded in this [TS]

00:22:37 ◼   ► is that the producer of the show or the [TS]

00:22:41 ◼   ► see the showrunner who's a son is in a [TS]

00:22:44 ◼   ► motorcycle accident and the right part [TS]

00:22:47 ◼   ► on the show so they arranged this you [TS]

00:22:49 ◼   ► know this incredibly elaborate swap [TS]

00:22:50 ◼   ► where [TS]

00:22:51 ◼   ► I only profiling by doing that you stand [TS]

00:22:54 ◼   ► it [TS]

00:22:55 ◼   ► hope that uh huhs the son's future [TS]

00:22:58 ◼   ► duplicate is in a good shape that if [TS]

00:23:01 ◼   ► they leave the you take the future [TS]

00:23:04 ◼   ► duplicate weight in the past so wait [TS]

00:23:06 ◼   ► what happens basically just do a swap [TS]

00:23:08 ◼   ► they say you you are now going to be [TS]

00:23:11 ◼   ► this person and because we say your this [TS]

00:23:13 ◼   ► person you're going to be that person [TS]

00:23:15 ◼   ► and everything saved the idea being that [TS]

00:23:18 ◼   ► you know the universe that is created [TS]

00:23:21 ◼   ► these weird sort of parallel future and [TS]

00:23:24 ◼   ► past world's doesn't realize that [TS]

00:23:27 ◼   ► because you know one is an actor and one [TS]

00:23:30 ◼   ► is a real person [TS]

00:23:31 ◼   ► hey they still have a hundred percent of [TS]

00:23:32 ◼   ► the same DNA so if i take the one who's [TS]

00:23:34 ◼   ► crazy crippled in a coma and then we [TS]

00:23:36 ◼   ► tell the other one here you're going to [TS]

00:23:38 ◼   ► stay here and you're going to be in a [TS]

00:23:40 ◼   ► coma I'll we can take and then have a [TS]

00:23:43 ◼   ► hey an episode written in the narrative [TS]

00:23:45 ◼   ► that says oh we fix this guy's you know [TS]

00:23:48 ◼   ► horrible motorcycle accident you never [TS]

00:23:51 ◼   ► going to wake up from his you know [TS]

00:23:54 ◼   ► vegetable state we just write a end-all [TS]

00:23:57 ◼   ► be-all fix for that then he's going to [TS]

00:23:59 ◼   ► be magically well in the future and [TS]

00:24:01 ◼   ► consciousnesses will try and verse [TS]

00:24:04 ◼   ► bodies and everything will be alright [TS]

00:24:06 ◼   ► well that's clear sciences yeah I didn't [TS]

00:24:09 ◼   ► India what's this right is that it's [TS]

00:24:11 ◼   ► supposedly i mean i'll explain their [TS]

00:24:14 ◼   ► pieces of the book right that the [TS]

00:24:16 ◼   ► science is not important just kind of [TS]

00:24:18 ◼   ► goes as it will it's true although he [TS]

00:24:19 ◼   ► did a lot of waving hands to make that [TS]

00:24:21 ◼   ► particular thing work but then you [TS]

00:24:23 ◼   ► realize later that that's why the code [TS]

00:24:25 ◼   ► is is you know the code is our first [TS]

00:24:26 ◼   ► person second person third person the [TS]

00:24:28 ◼   ► first person is the writer the second [TS]

00:24:30 ◼   ► person is this guy the kid some of the [TS]

00:24:32 ◼   ► writer who's been in a coma and it's are [TS]

00:24:35 ◼   ► rediscovering his life using the you [TS]

00:24:38 ◼   ► know very difficult to write in second [TS]

00:24:40 ◼   ► person narrative approach and the third [TS]

00:24:42 ◼   ► person is the actress who portrays the [TS]

00:24:47 ◼   ► Jenkins the guy hiding in the w our last [TS]

00:24:49 ◼   ► on his wife was killed for a plot point [TS]

00:24:51 ◼   ► which is what led him to discover the [TS]

00:24:53 ◼   ► narrative that this is the actress that [TS]

00:24:55 ◼   ► he never met his Jenkins doesn't go back [TS]

00:24:57 ◼   ► in time but one of the characters are [TS]

00:24:59 ◼   ► first-person narrative in the main part [TS]

00:25:01 ◼   ► of the book [TS]

00:25:01 ◼   ► brings back some memories to this [TS]

00:25:04 ◼   ► actress even though you know she knows [TS]

00:25:06 ◼   ► it can't be hers she doesn't get the [TS]

00:25:07 ◼   ► full explanation but you know somehow [TS]

00:25:09 ◼   ► there's another version of herself [TS]

00:25:10 ◼   ► identical that had this life with other [TS]

00:25:13 ◼   ► person that was ended [TS]

00:25:14 ◼   ► yeah that's an amazing piece of writing [TS]

00:25:16 ◼   ► that's what I love that kota it was [TS]

00:25:19 ◼   ► beautifully not like you so you can read [TS]

00:25:20 ◼   ► that coded by itself but he had to set [TS]

00:25:21 ◼   ► all this up here to give jet mean so [TS]

00:25:23 ◼   ► there's the joke right [TS]

00:25:24 ◼   ► he gave Jenkins a sort of ridiculous [TS]

00:25:26 ◼   ► character he gave Jenkins an enormous [TS]

00:25:28 ◼   ► amount of backstory in the narrative [TS]

00:25:30 ◼   ► more than made sense and he gave him the [TS]

00:25:32 ◼   ► backstory so we'd have we care for [TS]

00:25:34 ◼   ► Jenkins so that when he brought the coda [TS]

00:25:36 ◼   ► in later that right actually makes sense [TS]

00:25:38 ◼   ► for us to feel bad you know you know [TS]

00:25:41 ◼   ► there's where scholars he's talking [TS]

00:25:42 ◼   ► about life itself is that God the [TS]

00:25:44 ◼   ► universe whatever cuts short some life [TS]

00:25:46 ◼   ► for its narrative purposes and you know [TS]

00:25:48 ◼   ► in life that's maybe the random forces [TS]

00:25:51 ◼   ► are God's great plan in the book it's [TS]

00:25:52 ◼   ► disgusting doing it but he's still [TS]

00:25:54 ◼   ► dicking with you and then go to three [TS]

00:25:57 ◼   ► you see what the what the impact is on [TS]

00:26:00 ◼   ► human life you know when certain [TS]

00:26:02 ◼   ► arbitrary decision has happened and [TS]

00:26:04 ◼   ► she's been one removed from that she's [TS]

00:26:06 ◼   ► third-person observer of this and she [TS]

00:26:09 ◼   ► still has that impact and it has that [TS]

00:26:11 ◼   ► beautiful rediscovery at the end [TS]

00:26:13 ◼   ► well it's the emotional impact two of [TS]

00:26:15 ◼   ► the death of this character that I mean [TS]

00:26:18 ◼   ► it by the end John Scalzi makes you care [TS]

00:26:19 ◼   ► deeply about a red shirt who died which [TS]

00:26:22 ◼   ► is this guy Jenkins his wife who is dead [TS]

00:26:25 ◼   ► by the time we meet him but and and she [TS]

00:26:28 ◼   ► was in this actress who played her was [TS]

00:26:30 ◼   ► in like one episode of the show and that [TS]

00:26:33 ◼   ► you know she was important and he was [TS]

00:26:35 ◼   ► important but he didn't die and she died [TS]

00:26:37 ◼   ► and it was to serve a plot point and [TS]

00:26:40 ◼   ► that's what red shirts are all about is [TS]

00:26:42 ◼   ► deaths to serve plot points and you know [TS]

00:26:45 ◼   ► of course if it was that person had a [TS]

00:26:48 ◼   ► life and a family and their death [TS]

00:26:50 ◼   ► doesn't matter for the show but it would [TS]

00:26:51 ◼   ► matter deeply to you know in reality [TS]

00:26:54 ◼   ► when somebody dies like that it means a [TS]

00:26:56 ◼   ► lot to a lot of people and so by the end [TS]

00:26:59 ◼   ► here we have this character who is we [TS]

00:27:01 ◼   ► never even saw who wasn't important and [TS]

00:27:04 ◼   ► who died but was important to somebody [TS]

00:27:06 ◼   ► who we did meet and it becomes this [TS]

00:27:09 ◼   ► really deeply affecting story based on [TS]

00:27:11 ◼   ► this character who you know was in one [TS]

00:27:13 ◼   ► scene and died in [TS]

00:27:15 ◼   ► me show called back to among others of [TS]

00:27:16 ◼   ► course is the notion that these people [TS]

00:27:18 ◼   ► exist solely to serve a plot point and [TS]

00:27:21 ◼   ► more in the mothers worries that her use [TS]

00:27:24 ◼   ► of the magic in that novels world [TS]

00:27:26 ◼   ► creates all the people necessary to [TS]

00:27:29 ◼   ► populate the reading group that she [TS]

00:27:31 ◼   ► wants to have right well I mean writers [TS]

00:27:33 ◼   ► do like writing stories about writing [TS]

00:27:35 ◼   ► right and about narratives and about [TS]

00:27:36 ◼   ► storytelling because it's what they know [TS]

00:27:38 ◼   ► when they and you can you can be [TS]

00:27:40 ◼   ► self-indulgent this is a bizarre book [TS]

00:27:42 ◼   ► and it is about those things and yet I [TS]

00:27:44 ◼   ► ultimately I like I mean I guess I keep [TS]

00:27:46 ◼   ► saying the same thing which is that this [TS]

00:27:48 ◼   ► could have really been a disaster and it [TS]

00:27:50 ◼   ► wasn't and he's to be credited for [TS]

00:27:52 ◼   ► making lots of really good choices and [TS]

00:27:55 ◼   ► caking his story seriously so that it [TS]

00:27:57 ◼   ► didn't become a disaster [TS]

00:27:59 ◼   ► maybe we never never would've thought it [TS]

00:28:01 ◼   ► was a disaster and he he took his [TS]

00:28:03 ◼   ► premise and and started writing it and [TS]

00:28:05 ◼   ► then said oh ho I i think i've got a [TS]

00:28:07 ◼   ► direction i can take this that that will [TS]

00:28:09 ◼   ► that will be good and I I think he did a [TS]

00:28:12 ◼   ► pretty good job but it's not my favorite [TS]

00:28:13 ◼   ► of his books by a long shot but and it's [TS]

00:28:17 ◼   ► bizarre it's one of the weirder books [TS]

00:28:19 ◼   ► I've ever read [TS]

00:28:20 ◼   ► I would actually have to say because it [TS]

00:28:22 ◼   ► is it's it's we haven't even talked [TS]

00:28:23 ◼   ► about how you know I oh man the college [TS]

00:28:26 ◼   ► papers that are going to be written [TS]

00:28:27 ◼   ► about this book because there's so much [TS]

00:28:29 ◼   ► in it that is you know it's it's almost [TS]

00:28:31 ◼   ► like pop philosophy in a way because [TS]

00:28:33 ◼   ► there's so much sort of existentialism [TS]

00:28:36 ◼   ► in this book right it's like what does [TS]

00:28:37 ◼   ► it mean to be alive and what is the [TS]

00:28:39 ◼   ► meaning of life and are our life stories [TS]

00:28:42 ◼   ► written by other people or written by [TS]

00:28:44 ◼   ► ourselves and I mean you know take those [TS]

00:28:46 ◼   ► college students though some ideas for [TS]

00:28:48 ◼   ► papers for you [TS]

00:28:49 ◼   ► well i think that there's also case we [TS]

00:28:50 ◼   ► made the thing that room was talking [TS]

00:28:52 ◼   ► about earlier that you can read this [TS]

00:28:53 ◼   ► book to like you could read this book as [TS]

00:28:56 ◼   ► a is just the sort of lights i read i [TS]

00:28:57 ◼   ► pick it up you read the whole thing [TS]

00:28:59 ◼   ► there's the kicker chapter 24 [TS]

00:29:01 ◼   ► haha was just screwing with you guys [TS]

00:29:03 ◼   ► every we're all fine before you get to [TS]

00:29:05 ◼   ► kotas and you can read the codes and be [TS]

00:29:07 ◼   ► confused and say I don't get them you [TS]

00:29:09 ◼   ► know I don't get this but the first part [TS]

00:29:11 ◼   ► of the book was sort of clever and fun [TS]

00:29:12 ◼   ► and get it full space stuff and doubles [TS]

00:29:14 ◼   ► and time travel that's great and then [TS]

00:29:16 ◼   ► completely ignore Dakotas and to say I [TS]

00:29:19 ◼   ► don't get this one seems extra these are [TS]

00:29:20 ◼   ► like postscript don't know these need [TS]

00:29:23 ◼   ► you know what I think the Dakotas make [TS]

00:29:25 ◼   ► the book oh yeah i mean i agree i just [TS]

00:29:27 ◼   ► mean people could miss read the book [TS]

00:29:28 ◼   ► though easily oh yeah i mean i guess i [TS]

00:29:30 ◼   ► guess i could see that but at the same [TS]

00:29:32 ◼   ► time I almost see this book as something [TS]

00:29:34 ◼   ► which is almost like Ray Bradbury ask [TS]

00:29:37 ◼   ► where you have the light-hearted science [TS]

00:29:39 ◼   ► fiction and then the undercurrents of it [TS]

00:29:42 ◼   ► you know there's so much about the first [TS]

00:29:44 ◼   ► half of this book that's so wildly [TS]

00:29:47 ◼   ► scientifically inaccurate so many you [TS]

00:29:49 ◼   ► know crazy things not respond that [TS]

00:29:52 ◼   ► grounds the small stories of the qoutes [TS]

00:29:54 ◼   ► so much more like I think it was you [TS]

00:29:57 ◼   ► were saying earlier Jason about you know [TS]

00:30:00 ◼   ► or maybe it was Glenn about the code is [TS]

00:30:02 ◼   ► sort of resembling a short story that [TS]

00:30:04 ◼   ► you kind of need the first half of this [TS]

00:30:06 ◼   ► book for background on and it's kind of [TS]

00:30:09 ◼   ► interesting looking at them that way and [TS]

00:30:10 ◼   ► that I mean kota three you know could [TS]

00:30:14 ◼   ► very well be a short story on its own [TS]

00:30:16 ◼   ► but because we have sort of the sci-fi [TS]

00:30:18 ◼   ► caper in front it actually works like it [TS]

00:30:23 ◼   ► it ties it cohesive Lee together whereas [TS]

00:30:25 ◼   ► before like if i adjust red coat of [TS]

00:30:28 ◼   ► three and a science fiction anthology or [TS]

00:30:30 ◼   ► something like that I would have been [TS]

00:30:31 ◼   ► like oh this is a you know this is an [TS]

00:30:33 ◼   ► interesting short story but I don't [TS]

00:30:36 ◼   ► really feel the sort of gut punch as you [TS]

00:30:39 ◼   ► do having gone through the first half of [TS]

00:30:41 ◼   ► the book for the call another one for [TS]

00:30:42 ◼   ► the college students is you know it's [TS]

00:30:44 ◼   ► totally true these these stories at the [TS]

00:30:46 ◼   ► end the code is at the end don't have [TS]

00:30:48 ◼   ► the impact or wouldn't have the impact [TS]

00:30:49 ◼   ► were it not for the story that comes [TS]

00:30:51 ◼   ► before and since this is a story about [TS]

00:30:54 ◼   ► these characters on a television show [TS]

00:30:57 ◼   ► I have to say you know you can think of [TS]

00:31:00 ◼   ► it that way that that some stories need [TS]

00:31:02 ◼   ► a lot of setup before you get to the [TS]

00:31:05 ◼   ► story and knowing the characters or [TS]

00:31:08 ◼   ► having good in this world for a while as [TS]

00:31:10 ◼   ► the thing that gives them impact and [TS]

00:31:11 ◼   ► that's what TV shows do really well and [TS]

00:31:13 ◼   ► it in a way the novel does exist to set [TS]

00:31:17 ◼   ► up that story and that story would not [TS]

00:31:19 ◼   ► be strong without the novel being there [TS]

00:31:21 ◼   ► and so because we understand how this [TS]

00:31:23 ◼   ► world works and what has happened [TS]

00:31:25 ◼   ► previously then that story really works [TS]

00:31:28 ◼   ► and and you know again there's a whole [TS]

00:31:30 ◼   ► another college paper waiting to happen [TS]

00:31:33 ◼   ► somebody wants to write some literature [TS]

00:31:36 ◼   ► papers about [TS]

00:31:36 ◼   ► john scalzi Scott what did you think of [TS]

00:31:39 ◼   ► of Richard's it as our a voracious [TS]

00:31:41 ◼   ► reader and at a Star Trek fan too [TS]

00:31:44 ◼   ► well you I didn't want to try min since [TS]

00:31:47 ◼   ► everyone was a you know express a great [TS]

00:31:49 ◼   ► praise for the book and sadly you would [TS]

00:31:53 ◼   ► think that I am the ideal candidate or [TS]

00:31:55 ◼   ► not this book immensely i love start [TS]

00:31:57 ◼   ► drink so that's that's a checkbox I like [TS]

00:32:00 ◼   ► john scalzi so that's that's a check [TS]

00:32:02 ◼   ► right i enjoy when writers write about [TS]

00:32:05 ◼   ► writing and include themselves as [TS]

00:32:08 ◼   ► characters and then you know think about [TS]

00:32:10 ◼   ► the narrative and that's all what this [TS]

00:32:13 ◼   ► book is about but it did not work at all [TS]

00:32:15 ◼   ► for me [TS]

00:32:16 ◼   ► ah I mean it why shouldn't they didn't [TS]

00:32:18 ◼   ► work at all for me I thought it was a [TS]

00:32:19 ◼   ► fun read but I thought it was kind of a [TS]

00:32:22 ◼   ► like a bubble all surface [TS]

00:32:25 ◼   ► I didn't really think that he really [TS]

00:32:27 ◼   ► delved into these ideas very much i [TS]

00:32:29 ◼   ► think the problem there are two problems [TS]

00:32:31 ◼   ► ah that made it didn't work for me and [TS]

00:32:34 ◼   ► they're both obviously subjective right [TS]

00:32:36 ◼   ► so the biggest one is humor right so [TS]

00:32:38 ◼   ► humor is so difficult to write because [TS]

00:32:41 ◼   ► everybody has different sense of humor [TS]

00:32:42 ◼   ► and I the the humor in the book just did [TS]

00:32:46 ◼   ► not work for me at all I didn't like the [TS]

00:32:48 ◼   ► last chapter [TS]

00:32:49 ◼   ► Oh cheap when he said you know they're [TS]

00:32:51 ◼   ► all dead and then haha just kidding that [TS]

00:32:54 ◼   ► did i did laugh at that I just thought [TS]

00:32:55 ◼   ► that's a giant rip off and I hate you [TS]

00:32:58 ◼   ► haha and i didn't believe in that I [TS]

00:33:03 ◼   ► didn't care about the characters so if [TS]

00:33:05 ◼   ► you don't care about the characters [TS]

00:33:06 ◼   ► Dakota's don't really work because I [TS]

00:33:11 ◼   ► didn't care about what happened and so [TS]

00:33:13 ◼   ► the having more information about them [TS]

00:33:15 ◼   ► didn't really matter to me i obviously I [TS]

00:33:19 ◼   ► appreciate what he was trying to do what [TS]

00:33:22 ◼   ► it just did not work at all for me and I [TS]

00:33:26 ◼   ► think that another example of kind of [TS]

00:33:29 ◼   ► like the metaphysical talking about [TS]

00:33:31 ◼   ► story things that did work for me is [TS]

00:33:33 ◼   ► there's an author called Paul Auster who [TS]

00:33:36 ◼   ► is a like one of the Giants of [TS]

00:33:38 ◼   ► post-modernism and he wrote that the New [TS]

00:33:40 ◼   ► York trilogy which is fantastic one of [TS]

00:33:42 ◼   ► my favorite novels ever and it's all [TS]

00:33:44 ◼   ► about it's kind of a detective story but [TS]

00:33:47 ◼   ► really it's a story about the story and [TS]

00:33:48 ◼   ► paul auster is a character [TS]

00:33:50 ◼   ► it and he's writing the book but it's [TS]

00:33:51 ◼   ► also in it so it's free it's kind of the [TS]

00:33:53 ◼   ► same area that skull sees a working with [TS]

00:33:57 ◼   ► but obviously not with the syfy twist [TS]

00:33:59 ◼   ► and it's unfair to compare Paul Auster [TS]

00:34:04 ◼   ► and Jonathan's calls because they're you [TS]

00:34:06 ◼   ► know they're completely different [TS]

00:34:07 ◼   ► writers obviously in there they're [TS]

00:34:09 ◼   ► trying completely different things but [TS]

00:34:12 ◼   ► it just it i kept comparing it to that [TS]

00:34:14 ◼   ► book and it would fall short as would i [TS]

00:34:16 ◼   ► think ninety-eight percent of the books [TS]

00:34:18 ◼   ► written fall short of that margins that [TS]

00:34:20 ◼   ► that mark so it's unfair obviously but [TS]

00:34:23 ◼   ► didn't really work for me [TS]

00:34:25 ◼   ► Wow is the short version of that server [TS]

00:34:29 ◼   ► no I think your criticism as well [TS]

00:34:30 ◼   ► because it's it's this is one of the [TS]

00:34:32 ◼   ► things i like about the book to is that [TS]

00:34:34 ◼   ► there's so much in it there's so much to [TS]

00:34:37 ◼   ► like dislike or critique he's packed so [TS]

00:34:39 ◼   ► much and I think you came down on the [TS]

00:34:42 ◼   ► downside of a lot of things that the [TS]

00:34:43 ◼   ► rest of us may have found as more up [TS]

00:34:45 ◼   ► properties [TS]

00:34:46 ◼   ► yeah and I can totally see the other [TS]

00:34:48 ◼   ► side I can see how as i was reading this [TS]

00:34:50 ◼   ► I was thinking I could be enjoying his [TS]

00:34:53 ◼   ► stuff [TS]

00:34:53 ◼   ► how dare you your points are equally [TS]

00:34:55 ◼   ► parallel you know exactly what I was you [TS]

00:34:57 ◼   ► I i was sad that I wasn't enjoying it as [TS]

00:35:00 ◼   ► much as I i knew i could be but just [TS]

00:35:02 ◼   ► there was something that just didn't [TS]

00:35:04 ◼   ► work for me [TS]

00:35:05 ◼   ► you have to admit he this could have [TS]

00:35:06 ◼   ► been really really bad though it was not [TS]

00:35:09 ◼   ► it was not bad at all it was not I don't [TS]

00:35:12 ◼   ► think its failure i think it he did he [TS]

00:35:16 ◼   ► took the idea and when interesting [TS]

00:35:18 ◼   ► places with it just at it overall it did [TS]

00:35:21 ◼   ► not work for me but i think that it is a [TS]

00:35:23 ◼   ► it was it an attempt that was ambitious [TS]

00:35:28 ◼   ► and certainly didn't crash and burn it [TS]

00:35:31 ◼   ► just was like I was just mad about it [TS]

00:35:33 ◼   ► and yeah i'm not going to nominate it [TS]

00:35:35 ◼   ► for you or anything right eye and I but [TS]

00:35:38 ◼   ► i think i would I do wonder how much of [TS]

00:35:39 ◼   ► my reaction to it was just sort of [TS]

00:35:41 ◼   ► relief that it was not the terrible [TS]

00:35:42 ◼   ► thing that I kind of envision that it [TS]

00:35:44 ◼   ► might be that that he was i I like i [TS]

00:35:47 ◼   ► said i really admire that he fully [TS]

00:35:49 ◼   ► committed to his premise and just kept [TS]

00:35:51 ◼   ► going with it and kept exploring it i [TS]

00:35:53 ◼   ► think you're right that it's not as [TS]

00:35:55 ◼   ► funny as it could be into individually [TS]

00:35:58 ◼   ► although i did like the ending I I that [TS]

00:36:01 ◼   ► I was totally suckered by that I didn't [TS]

00:36:03 ◼   ► I I laughed so I i took it the other way [TS]

00:36:05 ◼   ► and that it was a ripoff but that's just [TS]

00:36:07 ◼   ► it was a it was kind of a funny a funny [TS]

00:36:10 ◼   ► joke but but i did find the last the [TS]

00:36:13 ◼   ► Dakotas affecting and that I and I think [TS]

00:36:17 ◼   ► Wren said this to I think that can put [TS]

00:36:19 ◼   ► it over the top for me into the I like [TS]

00:36:21 ◼   ► two categories to hit his effort in [TS]

00:36:23 ◼   ► trying to commit fully commit to his [TS]

00:36:24 ◼   ► premise and then the fact that at the [TS]

00:36:27 ◼   ► end you you you know i did like these [TS]

00:36:30 ◼   ► characters on you know on earth on our [TS]

00:36:33 ◼   ► current planet Earth who are affected by [TS]

00:36:35 ◼   ► this crazy science fictional premise in [TS]

00:36:37 ◼   ► a real human way I like that about it [TS]

00:36:40 ◼   ► you know so that those are the things [TS]

00:36:42 ◼   ► that that made me like it but you know I [TS]

00:36:45 ◼   ► I see where you're coming from Scott I i [TS]

00:36:47 ◼   ► think there are plenty of things that i [TS]

00:36:48 ◼   ► have issue with here it's certainly not [TS]

00:36:50 ◼   ► his best work by a long shot i mean it [TS]

00:36:53 ◼   ► might even be his worst novel but I [TS]

00:36:56 ◼   ► liked all his novels so what did you [TS]

00:36:59 ◼   ► like the androids dream because this [TS]

00:37:01 ◼   ► reminds me of uh that's the 1i haven't [TS]

00:37:03 ◼   ► that's the 1i have a red that's the only [TS]

00:37:05 ◼   ► 1i haven't read it sitting on it a [TS]

00:37:06 ◼   ► little bit of a hot mess i mean i was [TS]

00:37:07 ◼   ► going to say like red shirts is a is a [TS]

00:37:09 ◼   ► positive version of that in that like [TS]

00:37:12 ◼   ► when she pulls everything together and [TS]

00:37:14 ◼   ► his dream it's like it's a lot of [TS]

00:37:16 ◼   ► interesting funny ideas that they stuff [TS]

00:37:18 ◼   ► two duffel bag and shook so it's a [TS]

00:37:20 ◼   ► little inconvenient but it's just like [TS]

00:37:23 ◼   ► there's a lot of plot in it and to sort [TS]

00:37:25 ◼   ► of make a joke about philip k dick book [TS]

00:37:28 ◼   ► at some point you know that's that's [TS]

00:37:29 ◼   ► part of the whole point of this large [TS]

00:37:32 ◼   ► joke of the book but yeah that's you [TS]

00:37:35 ◼   ► should you should read that could lead [TS]

00:37:36 ◼   ► to read involves animal husbandry i [TS]

00:37:40 ◼   ► gotta say i'm actually just as a side [TS]

00:37:43 ◼   ► note this retirement john scalzi waited [TS]

00:37:45 ◼   ► a whole podcast about him a little [TS]

00:37:48 ◼   ► worried about john scalzi honestly i-i-i [TS]

00:37:51 ◼   ► like him I like many of his novels i [TS]

00:37:55 ◼   ► think his blog is really interesting i'm [TS]

00:37:57 ◼   ► a little worried that he is he is not [TS]

00:38:01 ◼   ► focused on the things that make him a [TS]

00:38:05 ◼   ► good writer and he is [TS]

00:38:08 ◼   ► I mean what I said earlier about stunts [TS]

00:38:10 ◼   ► i mean he did this book which is this [TS]

00:38:14 ◼   ► wacky high-concept thing [TS]

00:38:17 ◼   ► and he you know he quit himself ok right [TS]

00:38:19 ◼   ► or or not if you're Scott uh he don't [TS]

00:38:24 ◼   ► regret reading it [TS]

00:38:25 ◼   ► he did he did he did a fuzzy nation [TS]

00:38:28 ◼   ► which again I kinda liked although I [TS]

00:38:29 ◼   ► actually read the original and thought [TS]

00:38:33 ◼   ► it was better than fuzzy nation was [TS]

00:38:35 ◼   ► heated shadow or the night dragons he's [TS]

00:38:37 ◼   ► doing this I guess I was like a serial [TS]

00:38:38 ◼   ► novel thing on tor.com he i just i [TS]

00:38:43 ◼   ► wonder if he is you know it is he not [TS]

00:38:48 ◼   ► focusing on the things that made him [TS]

00:38:50 ◼   ► successful in the beginning with what [TS]

00:38:52 ◼   ► writing these novels like old man's war [TS]

00:38:54 ◼   ► and and that series and has become [TS]

00:38:58 ◼   ► almost like a you know the internet [TS]

00:39:01 ◼   ► celebrity sci-fi writer who does crazy [TS]

00:39:04 ◼   ► you know high-concept projects instead I [TS]

00:39:09 ◼   ► don't know III because I I feel like [TS]

00:39:11 ◼   ► he's done a lot of those lately [TS]

00:39:13 ◼   ► well this is more ready player one that [TS]

00:39:15 ◼   ► is old man's war that's for sure that's [TS]

00:39:18 ◼   ► true and i asked see him read a report [TS]

00:39:21 ◼   ► for this book and I kind of got that I [TS]

00:39:23 ◼   ► it i I'm sure he's a lovely man he [TS]

00:39:25 ◼   ► seemed very personable but I I got the [TS]

00:39:28 ◼   ► sense that he was really really enjoying [TS]

00:39:32 ◼   ► his internet celebrity which of course [TS]

00:39:34 ◼   ► you know he should and he should enjoy [TS]

00:39:35 ◼   ► his success uh and who am I to judge [TS]

00:39:38 ◼   ► what he does sure he's he's far more [TS]

00:39:42 ◼   ► successful than I am so who would he [TS]

00:39:44 ◼   ► doesn't care what I think but I was just [TS]

00:39:45 ◼   ► got a weird vibe from the whole thing [TS]

00:39:48 ◼   ► yeah he got the Wil Wheaton reading its [TS]

00:39:49 ◼   ► audiobook and he's got the jonathan [TS]

00:39:51 ◼   ► coulton doing a song for his you know [TS]

00:39:54 ◼   ► for it for the novel there's like a [TS]

00:39:56 ◼   ► redshirt song there is it's cute but but [TS]

00:40:00 ◼   ► it feels like you know how is he [TS]

00:40:02 ◼   ► nerds on the internet love that stuff [TS]

00:40:05 ◼   ► right but I I part of me feels like it [TS]

00:40:08 ◼   ► it can be really insular and and you you [TS]

00:40:12 ◼   ► risk believe in you if you believe your [TS]

00:40:14 ◼   ► own PR uh-huh and you risk disappearing [TS]

00:40:17 ◼   ► up your own backside and I worried about [TS]

00:40:19 ◼   ► that with john scalzi know that's what [TS]

00:40:21 ◼   ► the point at which you know at the [TS]

00:40:23 ◼   ► reading I was like oh this is not good [TS]

00:40:24 ◼   ► because obviously you're doing reading [TS]

00:40:27 ◼   ► people go there who like you right so [TS]

00:40:29 ◼   ► it's kind of an easy [TS]

00:40:30 ◼   ► the crowd and I got it he was getting a [TS]

00:40:34 ◼   ► lot less and he he wrote this dialogue [TS]

00:40:37 ◼   ► things set in the red church universe [TS]

00:40:40 ◼   ► about a lawyer suing the United Union uh [TS]

00:40:45 ◼   ► you know on part at under labor laws and [TS]

00:40:48 ◼   ► trying to get a settlement for it right [TS]

00:40:50 ◼   ► and so he wrote this thing so he could [TS]

00:40:51 ◼   ► do it at various readings and he told [TS]

00:40:55 ◼   ► people it secret don't tell anybody [TS]

00:40:56 ◼   ► about it whatever and you know it was [TS]

00:40:58 ◼   ► mildly amusing but people were laughing [TS]

00:41:01 ◼   ► their heads off like this was the most [TS]

00:41:03 ◼   ► insanely funny thing they've ever heard [TS]

00:41:06 ◼   ► which i think if you kind of if you do [TS]

00:41:09 ◼   ► not you know set yourself in your mind [TS]

00:41:12 ◼   ► okay this is a very amenable audience [TS]

00:41:15 ◼   ► and perhaps this isn't as funny as it [TS]

00:41:17 ◼   ► would be elsewhere [TS]

00:41:19 ◼   ► you might start believing your own hype [TS]

00:41:21 ◼   ► well this is the Woodstock implosion [TS]

00:41:24 ◼   ► it's that you have a very large audience [TS]

00:41:27 ◼   ► of people who have now found their sort [TS]

00:41:29 ◼   ► of arch semi Ron a ironic an erotic [TS]

00:41:33 ◼   ► crowd so you've got my fallen storm and [TS]

00:41:37 ◼   ► wil wheaton and john scalzi and a whole [TS]

00:41:39 ◼   ► bunch of other people Felicia Day like 2 [TS]

00:41:41 ◼   ► everyone is working at everyone else's [TS]

00:41:43 ◼   ► projects everyone involved in it and it [TS]

00:41:46 ◼   ► you can't critique it from the [TS]

00:41:47 ◼   ► standpoint of popularity because all [TS]

00:41:49 ◼   ► these people are achieving a measure of [TS]

00:41:51 ◼   ► Fame beyond a geek subculture or you [TS]

00:41:54 ◼   ► know both you know by any measure [TS]

00:41:56 ◼   ► they're making money they're getting [TS]

00:41:58 ◼   ► popular they're leeching into mainstream [TS]

00:42:00 ◼   ► culture but it is a Woodstock Oh sphere [TS]

00:42:03 ◼   ► you know echo chamber that is [TS]

00:42:05 ◼   ► threatening to swallow us all into a [TS]

00:42:07 ◼   ► singularity of 8-bit graphics now it's [TS]

00:42:10 ◼   ► not beyond know that that's a complete [TS]

00:42:12 ◼   ► loss of perspective it is concentrated [TS]

00:42:14 ◼   ► nerd subculture but it's not beyond it [TS]

00:42:17 ◼   ► was a black is black hole so it's simple [TS]

00:42:19 ◼   ► it's super narrow nerds appealing to [TS]

00:42:24 ◼   ► other nerds and you know it's great the [TS]

00:42:26 ◼   ► redshirts got the marketing that it did [TS]

00:42:28 ◼   ► and it's great that it is that John [TS]

00:42:30 ◼   ► Scalzi sold a lot of copies of it more [TS]

00:42:32 ◼   ► than his other books but he's got a lot [TS]

00:42:33 ◼   ► of other books that are better and my [TS]

00:42:36 ◼   ► head that sort of the root of my concern [TS]

00:42:37 ◼   ► is it would be a damn shame if people as [TS]

00:42:40 ◼   ► talented as john scalzi and some of the [TS]

00:42:42 ◼   ► other people that we mentioned here [TS]

00:42:43 ◼   ► I know not a damn shame that they can [TS]

00:42:46 ◼   ► make a living by serving that nerd [TS]

00:42:48 ◼   ► audience but i think a damn shame if [TS]

00:42:50 ◼   ► they are that they kind of turn inward [TS]

00:42:53 ◼   ► and are only trying to serve that [TS]

00:42:55 ◼   ► audience and not trying to serve ya a [TS]

00:42:57 ◼   ► broader audience and think more broadly [TS]

00:42:59 ◼   ► and that's Michael I'm sorry that's why [TS]

00:43:01 ◼   ► we go that's why I'm calling an [TS]

00:43:02 ◼   ► implosion is that there's a lot of the [TS]

00:43:03 ◼   ► artists facing inward in that circle [TS]

00:43:05 ◼   ► were actually doing quite well within [TS]

00:43:06 ◼   ► some of it leaks out you know so expects [TS]

00:43:09 ◼   ► suspect escapes the Woodstock black [TS]

00:43:12 ◼   ► heroes fears and but so the broader [TS]

00:43:14 ◼   ► culture but i think there is a lot of [TS]

00:43:16 ◼   ► inward turning I mean Jonathan Coulton [TS]

00:43:17 ◼   ► an interesting case you've forgotten [TS]

00:43:19 ◼   ► episode two of you talk to him but his [TS]

00:43:21 ◼   ► music can be broadly appealing although [TS]

00:43:23 ◼   ► it has a narrower appeal to a particular [TS]

00:43:26 ◼   ► niche audience as well that made the [TS]

00:43:28 ◼   ► following much more closely and then it [TS]

00:43:29 ◼   ► joins not big enough [TS]

00:43:31 ◼   ► he doesn't have to appeal I mean this is [TS]

00:43:32 ◼   ► like the louis ck thing or all of those [TS]

00:43:34 ◼   ► things is a point at which you don't [TS]

00:43:36 ◼   ► have to appeal outward and do stuff that [TS]

00:43:38 ◼   ► may be more challenging and difficult or [TS]

00:43:40 ◼   ► be interesting to a group outside of the [TS]

00:43:42 ◼   ► insular part and i think there's a [TS]

00:43:43 ◼   ► danger there as you say I like I'm sure [TS]

00:43:46 ◼   ► it hasn't really happened yet but yes I [TS]

00:43:48 ◼   ► feel like see a lot more of that [TS]

00:43:49 ◼   ► everyone pointing to each other in a [TS]

00:43:51 ◼   ► circle and you know outside that circle [TS]

00:43:53 ◼   ► are 10 million people with dollar bills [TS]

00:43:55 ◼   ► and there's nothing wrong with was [TS]

00:43:57 ◼   ► saying I could make a i can make a [TS]

00:43:58 ◼   ► living i found an audience and I could [TS]

00:44:00 ◼   ► make a living at this i mean i think [TS]

00:44:01 ◼   ► that's fantastic that people like like [TS]

00:44:04 ◼   ► Jonathan Coulton can can make a living [TS]

00:44:06 ◼   ► because they found even though they're [TS]

00:44:07 ◼   ► not broadly popular they have found an [TS]

00:44:10 ◼   ► audience big enough that loves them [TS]

00:44:11 ◼   ► enough to support them i think that'd be [TS]

00:44:13 ◼   ► great [TS]

00:44:13 ◼   ► artistically it bothers me because I [TS]

00:44:16 ◼   ► feel like that leads to this sort of the [TS]

00:44:19 ◼   ► video potential you're just you i know [TS]

00:44:21 ◼   ► my audience and I know what they want [TS]

00:44:23 ◼   ► and I'm not saying that that that like [TS]

00:44:25 ◼   ► Holden would do this but it would be [TS]

00:44:27 ◼   ► very easy for jonathan coulton I've [TS]

00:44:28 ◼   ► heard him when he was on with Merlin [TS]

00:44:30 ◼   ► Mann on Marlins podcast he talked about [TS]

00:44:31 ◼   ► the you know the archetypal jonathan [TS]

00:44:34 ◼   ► coulton song and you know you could you [TS]

00:44:35 ◼   ► can do a paint-by-numbers jonathan [TS]

00:44:37 ◼   ► coulton song fairly easily [TS]

00:44:39 ◼   ► it might it be as good as his but you [TS]

00:44:41 ◼   ► know I at if I if he's an artist that I [TS]

00:44:43 ◼   ► like I want to see him stretch himself [TS]

00:44:45 ◼   ► and and push himself and and Scotty I'm [TS]

00:44:47 ◼   ► worried is is you know he's had a lot of [TS]

00:44:50 ◼   ► projects recently then I'm not so sure I [TS]

00:44:52 ◼   ► think they're like more high-concept [TS]

00:44:53 ◼   ► appealing to the to the masses who love [TS]

00:44:56 ◼   ► him and may [TS]

00:44:57 ◼   ► he not trying to push himself further [TS]

00:44:59 ◼   ► and hey you know if if you can make a [TS]

00:45:01 ◼   ► living doing that that's great but as a [TS]

00:45:03 ◼   ► consumer of your work I i would like to [TS]

00:45:05 ◼   ► see you not be kind of in this insular [TS]

00:45:08 ◼   ► you know in insular nervous fear I think [TS]

00:45:11 ◼   ► you hit with high concept to its [TS]

00:45:12 ◼   ► something i mean that's that deal right [TS]

00:45:13 ◼   ► is like high concept means you can [TS]

00:45:15 ◼   ► describe it in shorter than elevator [TS]

00:45:17 ◼   ► ride between two floors you know why [TS]

00:45:19 ◼   ► after you while you're walking up the [TS]

00:45:20 ◼   ► flights three stairs three steps [TS]

00:45:22 ◼   ► redshirts novel on it's like red shirts [TS]

00:45:25 ◼   ► i wonder if that's what bothered you [TS]

00:45:26 ◼   ► about it initially bothered me a bit too [TS]

00:45:28 ◼   ► was you like the title of the book tells [TS]

00:45:31 ◼   ► you what it's going to be about and then [TS]

00:45:32 ◼   ► the book turns out not to entirely [TS]

00:45:34 ◼   ► confirm our worst fears [TS]

00:45:37 ◼   ► it's like a relief and the respect and [TS]

00:45:39 ◼   ► uh he uh i'm scott i'm usually you in [TS]

00:45:42 ◼   ► this scenario so I the book is entirely [TS]

00:45:45 ◼   ► from reviewers really the words red [TS]

00:45:48 ◼   ► shirts and the knowledge he writes about [TS]

00:45:50 ◼   ► science fiction tells you what you think [TS]

00:45:51 ◼   ► the books me about and everything else [TS]

00:45:53 ◼   ► elaboration and it's much better and [TS]

00:45:55 ◼   ► more subtle than that you worried that [TS]

00:45:56 ◼   ► someone can just do a call-out you know [TS]

00:45:59 ◼   ► hey i'm going to talk about [TS]

00:46:00 ◼   ► you-know-what back since we call you [TS]

00:46:02 ◼   ► know you worry that the whole thing [TS]

00:46:04 ◼   ► becomes call-outs shoutouts right right [TS]

00:46:09 ◼   ► no I think that's it I mean and again I [TS]

00:46:10 ◼   ► don't wanna die I think it's great that [TS]

00:46:12 ◼   ► people love Woodstock and people you [TS]

00:46:15 ◼   ► know people love wil wheaton and they [TS]

00:46:16 ◼   ► love Jonathan Coulton and they love but [TS]

00:46:18 ◼   ► I don't know that I want that I want [TS]

00:46:19 ◼   ► that culture to creep after I feel like [TS]

00:46:21 ◼   ► when you when everybody's on a cruise [TS]

00:46:23 ◼   ► ship you know it's all hot cocoa crews [TS]

00:46:26 ◼   ► and Woodstock and things like that [TS]

00:46:27 ◼   ► I think it's great inside there and I [TS]

00:46:29 ◼   ► also wanted to be already validated but [TS]

00:46:32 ◼   ► i wanted to be a this is where we were [TS]

00:46:34 ◼   ► talking on episode 100 of the [TS]

00:46:36 ◼   ► incomparable about organization and [TS]

00:46:38 ◼   ► genre ghettos and so forth it's against [TS]

00:46:40 ◼   ► the same thing you want you don't want [TS]

00:46:42 ◼   ► the stuff you like necessarily to be [TS]

00:46:43 ◼   ► entirely trapped inside of a [TS]

00:46:45 ◼   ► self-perpetuating hermetic means that [TS]

00:46:47 ◼   ► only people right steep themselves so [TS]

00:46:50 ◼   ► fully in the culture can understand you [TS]

00:46:52 ◼   ► wanna be able to talk to other people [TS]

00:46:53 ◼   ► about this stuff too [TS]

00:46:54 ◼   ► yeah and if it becomes so insular that [TS]

00:46:56 ◼   ► it's great if everybody can make a [TS]

00:46:57 ◼   ► living at it but I I'm not really [TS]

00:46:59 ◼   ► ultimately not interested in reading a [TS]

00:47:01 ◼   ► novel by a person who is only interested [TS]

00:47:03 ◼   ► in making references to the circle of [TS]

00:47:06 ◼   ► people that we all know and are all I [TS]

00:47:08 ◼   ► mean at some point it's just [TS]

00:47:10 ◼   ► yeah it's just disappointing and [TS]

00:47:11 ◼   ► depressing and I saw you know I'm not [TS]

00:47:13 ◼   ► gonna buy my new novel called Colton day [TS]

00:47:16 ◼   ► wheaton the eternal trilogy yeah okay [TS]

00:47:20 ◼   ► well ya around ready player to [TS]

00:47:22 ◼   ► reconnoiter to that's my favorite [TS]

00:47:26 ◼   ► yeah I don't know I that that's a that's [TS]

00:47:29 ◼   ► it's just if it's just a feeling little [TS]

00:47:31 ◼   ► spider sense the back that it's just so [TS]

00:47:34 ◼   ► I hope John Scalzi while he's he should [TS]

00:47:36 ◼   ► make money and as much of it as he as he [TS]

00:47:38 ◼   ► can and he should do he should follow [TS]

00:47:41 ◼   ► his bliss but I hope you know I hope he [TS]

00:47:45 ◼   ► continues to challenge himself [TS]

00:47:46 ◼   ► creatively and not just kind of pander [TS]

00:47:47 ◼   ► to the to the audience that is a little [TS]

00:47:51 ◼   ► smaller and more insular and you know [TS]

00:47:53 ◼   ► but hey you Richard sold really well so [TS]

00:47:56 ◼   ► maybe I did maybe not be red shirts to a [TS]

00:48:00 ◼   ► shadow war the night dragons which I [TS]

00:48:02 ◼   ► read because it was a hugo nominee you [TS]

00:48:04 ◼   ► know it's funny but at the same time [TS]

00:48:06 ◼   ► it's really just kind of a terry [TS]

00:48:07 ◼   ► pratchett riff it felt like a lost [TS]

00:48:09 ◼   ► chapter from a charity project novel [TS]

00:48:12 ◼   ► yeah I read that whatever that the short [TS]

00:48:15 ◼   ► story and and you when you compared to [TS]

00:48:17 ◼   ► the other nominated short stories you [TS]

00:48:19 ◼   ► think why why yeah why is this here [TS]

00:48:22 ◼   ► oii so any Hugo's you can you can vote [TS]

00:48:24 ◼   ► no award is one of the options and you [TS]

00:48:29 ◼   ► can rank them it's a ranked choice votes [TS]

00:48:30 ◼   ► you can have six votes if there are five [TS]

00:48:32 ◼   ► nominees and that means you can insert [TS]

00:48:34 ◼   ► no award in the middle and say below [TS]

00:48:38 ◼   ► here if these are the only ones left [TS]

00:48:41 ◼   ► I vote to not have an award which is [TS]

00:48:43 ◼   ► great because it's the fu of of award [TS]

00:48:46 ◼   ► voting it's hilarious in the best novel [TS]

00:48:49 ◼   ► category you might put no award above [TS]

00:48:51 ◼   ► deadline by mere grant just an example [TS]

00:48:54 ◼   ► and not saying that's how I voted that's [TS]

00:48:56 ◼   ► how about it and 44 short story for [TS]

00:49:00 ◼   ► short story i voted i voted no word [TS]

00:49:03 ◼   ► above shadow or the night dragons [TS]

00:49:04 ◼   ► because it doesn't fit [TS]

00:49:05 ◼   ► it's a joke and I'm actually really [TS]

00:49:07 ◼   ► concerned that because people like John [TS]

00:49:09 ◼   ► Scalzi he's gonna get the award today [TS]

00:49:11 ◼   ► he's a nice guy and he is he's funny and [TS]

00:49:13 ◼   ► he's got his website and that's great [TS]

00:49:14 ◼   ► and in no it's not appropriate [TS]

00:49:19 ◼   ► it doesn't fit it's a it's a funny joke [TS]

00:49:22 ◼   ► that's really a terry pratchett parody [TS]

00:49:25 ◼   ► sort of and no now yeah and I mean there [TS]

00:49:28 ◼   ► are some of the short stories [TS]

00:49:30 ◼   ► denominators are just absolutely [TS]

00:49:31 ◼   ► beautiful and that yes I it would be a [TS]

00:49:34 ◼   ► shame for a joke to win it would be a [TS]

00:49:38 ◼   ► joke for a shame to win but still if [TS]

00:49:40 ◼   ► it's a well-crafted joke i think it has [TS]

00:49:43 ◼   ► its on its own merits I don't [TS]

00:49:44 ◼   ► necessarily think it should win either [TS]

00:49:45 ◼   ► but it's I think writing it off as aid [TS]

00:49:49 ◼   ► in April Fool's Day prank rather than [TS]

00:49:52 ◼   ► looking at it as I mean the story as [TS]

00:49:54 ◼   ► good as far as farcical as it is is it [TS]

00:49:58 ◼   ► I mean it's a I I thought it was kind of [TS]

00:50:01 ◼   ► funny but really you know again like I [TS]

00:50:04 ◼   ► said I felt like a terry pratchett kind [TS]

00:50:06 ◼   ► of thing to me and just a chapter and [TS]

00:50:08 ◼   ► there were some jokes in it and it was [TS]

00:50:10 ◼   ► funny but i don't know i mean it was it [TS]

00:50:12 ◼   ► didn't feel some of those short stories [TS]

00:50:16 ◼   ► are really kind of beautiful and [TS]

00:50:17 ◼   ► spectacular and then this was you know [TS]

00:50:19 ◼   ► an internet joke that was mildly funny I [TS]

00:50:21 ◼   ► I just don't i don't know i don't think [TS]

00:50:24 ◼   ► they measure up at all maybe they need a [TS]

00:50:25 ◼   ► new category that's like best internet [TS]

00:50:27 ◼   ► joke [TS]

00:50:29 ◼   ► yeah I mean I don't necessarily think [TS]

00:50:31 ◼   ► that the story is better than the rest [TS]

00:50:33 ◼   ► of the short stories out there for the [TS]

00:50:35 ◼   ► Hugo's but it's just I I'm reticent to [TS]

00:50:38 ◼   ► disqualify something just because it was [TS]

00:50:40 ◼   ► written for the internet or written as a [TS]

00:50:43 ◼   ► joke or something like that you know i [TS]

00:50:44 ◼   ► would [TS]

00:50:45 ◼   ► it's it's not as good a story as the [TS]

00:50:47 ◼   ► other short stories there [TS]

00:50:49 ◼   ► yeah but that's why it should not when [TS]

00:50:51 ◼   ► the Huguenots that it was already fools [TS]

00:50:53 ◼   ► project i don't know if it was a [TS]

00:50:55 ◼   ► beautifully written [TS]

00:50:57 ◼   ► Joe could that through you know on the [TS]

00:51:00 ◼   ► well I guess it all goes to what do you [TS]

00:51:02 ◼   ► think is a why should something a hero [TS]

00:51:05 ◼   ► right so if it's just because it's fun [TS]

00:51:07 ◼   ► to read and popular then sure that you [TS]

00:51:10 ◼   ► get the you go if you think that it's an [TS]

00:51:11 ◼   ► award for you know the craft writing and [TS]

00:51:15 ◼   ► you know how you know how well-written [TS]

00:51:18 ◼   ► something is and how it affects you then [TS]

00:51:21 ◼   ► I think that that probably shouldn't win [TS]

00:51:23 ◼   ► Hugo yeah of course I guess it is a [TS]

00:51:26 ◼   ► popularity contest when it comes down to [TS]

00:51:27 ◼   ► it so maybe we'll so before we go I [TS]

00:51:30 ◼   ► wanted to just very quickly go around [TS]

00:51:33 ◼   ► the [TS]

00:51:34 ◼   ► room and asked my favorite uncomfortable [TS]

00:51:37 ◼   ► book club question which is what are you [TS]

00:51:41 ◼   ► reading [TS]

00:51:42 ◼   ► Scott McNulty what are you doing [TS]

00:51:45 ◼   ► oh I i'm reading a book yay [TS]

00:51:48 ◼   ► really it's an actual physical book that [TS]

00:51:51 ◼   ► I got oh there's this building that has [TS]

00:51:53 ◼   ► the books in it you can take it out free [TS]

00:51:55 ◼   ► and it's not theft so wow it's very [TS]

00:51:59 ◼   ► exciting so I read there's a new book [TS]

00:52:01 ◼   ► this that just came out called sharps by [TS]

00:52:03 ◼   ► an author called KJ parker who had never [TS]

00:52:07 ◼   ► heard of but they were really marketing [TS]

00:52:09 ◼   ► this sharps book so i bought it with [TS]

00:52:13 ◼   ► some google credit that I had from the [TS]

00:52:16 ◼   ► google play store and i read it and i [TS]

00:52:17 ◼   ► thought was really good so that led me [TS]

00:52:19 ◼   ► to want to read another one of this [TS]

00:52:22 ◼   ► person's books i was going to say her [TS]

00:52:23 ◼   ► but KJ parker is a pen name and that no [TS]

00:52:26 ◼   ► one knows who this person is or what [TS]

00:52:28 ◼   ► their sex is so i am currently reading a [TS]

00:52:32 ◼   ► book by KJ parker called devices and [TS]

00:52:34 ◼   ► desires about basically an engineer who [TS]

00:52:38 ◼   ► is kicked out of his City because he [TS]

00:52:42 ◼   ► created an abomination which meant that [TS]

00:52:45 ◼   ► he built and a little toy outside of the [TS]

00:52:49 ◼   ► specification agreed-upon specifications [TS]

00:52:52 ◼   ► of the guild so they were going to kill [TS]

00:52:54 ◼   ► him he escapes and it's all about how [TS]

00:52:56 ◼   ► he's going to exact revenge upon the [TS]

00:52:59 ◼   ► city through a very complicated means [TS]

00:53:02 ◼   ► one imagines in the trilogy this is the [TS]

00:53:03 ◼   ► first book in the trilogy so we will see [TS]

00:53:06 ◼   ► how it goes [TS]

00:53:09 ◼   ► from the library mhm it came from the [TS]

00:53:12 ◼   ► library [TS]

00:53:12 ◼   ► very nice serenity Caldwell what are you [TS]

00:53:16 ◼   ► reading I'm reading several things also [TS]

00:53:18 ◼   ► from the library is the new place that I [TS]

00:53:21 ◼   ► moved into the library is three blocks [TS]

00:53:23 ◼   ► from so I feel like it's a cardinal sin [TS]

00:53:26 ◼   ► if i don't go check out books at least [TS]

00:53:27 ◼   ► once a week we love what I have actually [TS]

00:53:30 ◼   ► I've never read the dark is rising [TS]

00:53:32 ◼   ► series so despite being young adults and [TS]

00:53:35 ◼   ► despite me having should have having [TS]

00:53:37 ◼   ► read it like 10 years ago I picked it up [TS]

00:53:39 ◼   ► because I'm like I have been meaning to [TS]

00:53:41 ◼   ► read this and this seems like it could [TS]

00:53:42 ◼   ► be interesting summer reading despite [TS]

00:53:44 ◼   ► the fact that it's set in christmas time [TS]

00:53:45 ◼   ► I so I have that on my on my I'd say my [TS]

00:53:50 ◼   ► bedside table but really it's a floating [TS]

00:53:52 ◼   ► bookshelf in my doorway because i don't [TS]

00:53:54 ◼   ► have room for a bedside table in the [TS]

00:53:56 ◼   ► studio so that's sitting on my floating [TS]

00:53:58 ◼   ► bookshelf as well as stranger in a [TS]

00:54:00 ◼   ► strange land [TS]

00:54:01 ◼   ► it's a it's a catch-up time yeah i'm [TS]

00:54:05 ◼   ► using the summer as catch-up time for [TS]

00:54:07 ◼   ► books that I have been meaning to read [TS]

00:54:09 ◼   ► but haven't read yet and i just finished [TS]

00:54:11 ◼   ► Joe Waltons uh half half penny what's [TS]

00:54:17 ◼   ► the series called Scott like the small [TS]

00:54:19 ◼   ► small small change will change yeah I I [TS]

00:54:23 ◼   ► keep on thinking of its other name where [TS]

00:54:25 ◼   ► it's like a a brief look at fascism or [TS]

00:54:28 ◼   ► something codes to fascism but that I [TS]

00:54:33 ◼   ► just finished reading the third book in [TS]

00:54:34 ◼   ► that series and that is a really lovely [TS]

00:54:36 ◼   ► technology for people who haven't read [TS]

00:54:38 ◼   ► we're going to do a book club about that [TS]

00:54:40 ◼   ► serious i think yeah we should I I what [TS]

00:54:43 ◼   ► we should do that we should we have a [TS]

00:54:45 ◼   ► quorum of people who have read it [TS]

00:54:46 ◼   ► yep I'm with the third one yet but I'd [TS]

00:54:48 ◼   ► be more than happy to I just wish you [TS]

00:54:50 ◼   ► know depressed enough by the first to it [TS]

00:54:51 ◼   ► I thought I'd leave it out there for a [TS]

00:54:52 ◼   ► little while the third one is pretty [TS]

00:54:54 ◼   ► good [TS]

00:54:54 ◼   ► alright i liked it i'll read it when [TS]

00:54:57 ◼   ► what are you reading [TS]

00:54:58 ◼   ► I will have an epic couple months of [TS]

00:55:01 ◼   ► work and in which work is occupied [TS]

00:55:05 ◼   ► have you read nothing my waking hours so [TS]

00:55:07 ◼   ► I red red shirts [TS]

00:55:08 ◼   ► I'm actually reading i think the closest [TS]

00:55:11 ◼   ► thing to an appropriate book that I'm [TS]

00:55:13 ◼   ► reading is the Phantom Tollbooth which [TS]

00:55:14 ◼   ► i'm reading aloud to my five and [TS]

00:55:17 ◼   ► seven and a fraction almost eight year [TS]

00:55:20 ◼   ► old alma ATA adore it's a 51-year old [TS]

00:55:23 ◼   ► book it's a lovely book everything is a [TS]

00:55:25 ◼   ► kid not totally getting it's fun to read [TS]

00:55:27 ◼   ► it as an adult [TS]

00:55:28 ◼   ► it is so horribly full of puns and [TS]

00:55:31 ◼   ► mechanisms and synecdoche and silliness [TS]

00:55:36 ◼   ► and Hungary and it's um it's a wonderful [TS]

00:55:39 ◼   ► book and what's great is it works so [TS]

00:55:41 ◼   ► amazingly for kids when you're reading [TS]

00:55:43 ◼   ► stuff that's really deep critique of [TS]

00:55:46 ◼   ► language at some level and silly the [TS]

00:55:48 ◼   ► silly part comes through even when the [TS]

00:55:51 ◼   ► critique of society language freedom [TS]

00:55:53 ◼   ► patriarchal domination whenever when [TS]

00:55:57 ◼   ► that parties requires more advanced [TS]

00:55:59 ◼   ► years so i highly recommend that a [TS]

00:56:01 ◼   ► 51-year old book delightful dice and [TS]

00:56:04 ◼   ► hamburger is my favorite sort of buggery [TS]

00:56:06 ◼   ► by the world hunger is the only [TS]

00:56:08 ◼   ► acceptable form that doesn't get your [TS]

00:56:09 ◼   ► explicit label on itunes I and i just [TS]

00:56:14 ◼   ► finished a talent for war by jack [TS]

00:56:16 ◼   ► mcdevitt which is the first of his Alex [TS]

00:56:19 ◼   ► Benedict series of novels which of [TS]

00:56:22 ◼   ► course i have read all the others could [TS]

00:56:25 ◼   ► save the first four last which is very [TS]

00:56:27 ◼   ► strange but I just sort of fell into [TS]

00:56:29 ◼   ► those books and they don't really need [TS]

00:56:30 ◼   ► to be read in any order and that's you [TS]

00:56:33 ◼   ► know I had to laugh because this in many [TS]

00:56:34 ◼   ► ways is the archetypal McDevitt [TS]

00:56:36 ◼   ► adventure novel they're fun big brought [TS]

00:56:39 ◼   ► you know widescreen space adventure [TS]

00:56:41 ◼   ► novels this is Benedict is the Indiana [TS]

00:56:44 ◼   ► Jones of outer space he's a an [TS]

00:56:46 ◼   ► archaeologist who finds lost treasures [TS]

00:56:49 ◼   ► throughout the galaxy and what's funny [TS]

00:56:53 ◼   ► about it is that McDevitt has his things [TS]

00:56:55 ◼   ► that he has in every like every jack [TS]

00:56:57 ◼   ► mcdevitt book somebody will munch on a [TS]

00:56:59 ◼   ► sandwich sandwiches will fit figure in [TS]

00:57:01 ◼   ► the plot at some point there will be [TS]

00:57:03 ◼   ► asking of skimmers that they get around [TS]

00:57:05 ◼   ► in there like little air cars there will [TS]

00:57:07 ◼   ► be a skimmer accident probably involving [TS]

00:57:09 ◼   ► sabotage there will be a shocking moment [TS]

00:57:12 ◼   ► when one character is threatened by [TS]

00:57:13 ◼   ► another character with a gun and there [TS]

00:57:16 ◼   ► will usually be something that happens [TS]

00:57:18 ◼   ► planetside when they're down on a planet [TS]

00:57:21 ◼   ► that threatens their ability to go back [TS]

00:57:23 ◼   ► to the the ship that's in orbit and I [TS]

00:57:25 ◼   ► swear you know four out of five of those [TS]

00:57:28 ◼   ► things happen in every single one of his [TS]

00:57:29 ◼   ► novels and i love them [TS]

00:57:30 ◼   ► but he's got his things that he does but [TS]

00:57:33 ◼   ► I love that they're all these various [TS]

00:57:34 ◼   ► planets and usually his plots involved [TS]

00:57:36 ◼   ► you know we don't know why this person [TS]

00:57:38 ◼   ► never came back but there may be like [TS]

00:57:40 ◼   ► there may be an undiscovered planet that [TS]

00:57:42 ◼   ► they went to that's a secret or there [TS]

00:57:44 ◼   ► may be a spaceship lost somewhere that [TS]

00:57:46 ◼   ► we could find and I i like that that [TS]

00:57:49 ◼   ► that kind of stuff and it's setting like [TS]

00:57:51 ◼   ► the year 10,000 and so it's also very [TS]

00:57:53 ◼   ► amusing because they keep investigating [TS]

00:57:55 ◼   ► ancient history and ancient history is [TS]

00:57:57 ◼   ► still like the year eight thousand on [TS]

00:58:00 ◼   ► some planet somewhere where they've lost [TS]

00:58:02 ◼   ► all the records and that is really funny [TS]

00:58:05 ◼   ► too so it's a it's a nice sort of light [TS]

00:58:08 ◼   ► summer reading kind of thing that it's [TS]

00:58:10 ◼   ► easy fun a sci-fi for the summer and [TS]

00:58:14 ◼   ► given that i'm also trying to get [TS]

00:58:16 ◼   ► through pretty do street station by [TS]

00:58:18 ◼   ► China Mieville and boy i'm having the [TS]

00:58:20 ◼   ► devil of a time getting through that so [TS]

00:58:22 ◼   ► I i read an entire other book just to [TS]

00:58:24 ◼   ► just to procrastinate and avoid reading [TS]

00:58:28 ◼   ► the pretty street station that stuff [TS]

00:58:31 ◼   ► i've read that one [TS]

00:58:32 ◼   ► I've read that one too i wish i can read [TS]

00:58:35 ◼   ► that one [TS]

00:58:36 ◼   ► I bet your life but this channel maybe I [TS]

00:58:37 ◼   ► shouldn't maybe should abandon it [TS]

00:58:39 ◼   ► I don't know it's a big messy book much [TS]

00:58:41 ◼   ► Glenn's been special review big messy [TS]

00:58:43 ◼   ► book the payoff I is so horrible and [TS]

00:58:47 ◼   ► unsatisfying battery rest of the [TS]

00:58:50 ◼   ► sprawling book seems to be less useful [TS]

00:58:52 ◼   ► in its nature you know me like a lot of [TS]

00:58:54 ◼   ► officers problems with the pay the [TS]

00:58:55 ◼   ► payoff and i have to say that pretty [TS]

00:58:57 ◼   ► perdido street station set up an awful [TS]

00:59:00 ◼   ► lot for what crumbles into a pile of [TS]

00:59:04 ◼   ► crud i recall band more and saying at [TS]

00:59:06 ◼   ► one point that he felt like he had to [TS]

00:59:09 ◼   ► take a shower after reading perdido [TS]

00:59:11 ◼   ► street station because he thought it was [TS]

00:59:12 ◼   ► so kind of dirty and gross and ugly and [TS]

00:59:15 ◼   ► nasty yeah I feel the same way I felt I [TS]

00:59:18 ◼   ► felt covered with like undergrowth and [TS]

00:59:20 ◼   ► battled protraction city and this it's [TS]

00:59:24 ◼   ► like that was horrible was like you just [TS]

00:59:26 ◼   ► got like yeah Mary montreal i won't come [TS]

00:59:30 ◼   ► off and maybe i will just give up like a [TS]

00:59:32 ◼   ► street and if it paid off I'd be okay [TS]

00:59:34 ◼   ► with it but I just don't feel there are [TS]

00:59:36 ◼   ► characters and plots and pieces [TS]

00:59:37 ◼   ► abandoned so [TS]

00:59:38 ◼   ► much on the sides of the track that you [TS]

00:59:40 ◼   ► know you're like to have snow banks load [TS]

00:59:42 ◼   ► plot detritus as the train rumbles on [TS]

00:59:45 ◼   ► yeah well okay well that got me totally [TS]

00:59:48 ◼   ► up for that book there you go i just [TS]

00:59:50 ◼   ► save you 800 pages or something yeah [TS]

00:59:52 ◼   ► pretty much pretty much all right well i [TS]

00:59:55 ◼   ► am going to close up the incomparable [TS]

00:59:57 ◼   ► book club for this [TS]

00:59:58 ◼   ► this edition will be back [TS]

00:59:58 ◼   ► this edition will be back [TS]

01:00:00 ◼   ► with another book hopefully soon maybe [TS]

01:00:02 ◼   ► in fact we'll talk about those Joe [TS]

01:00:03 ◼   ► waldenbooks that's a great idea i'm glad [TS]

01:00:05 ◼   ► we came up with it so until next time I [TS]

01:00:08 ◼   ► want to thank my guests for reading the [TS]

01:00:10 ◼   ► books because not everybody reads the [TS]

01:00:12 ◼   ► books but these three people they read [TS]

01:00:14 ◼   ► the book so Glenn fleischmann thank you [TS]

01:00:16 ◼   ► very much for being here thank you for [TS]

01:00:18 ◼   ► having me i read the books [TS]

01:00:19 ◼   ► yes you do that's what I said I said you [TS]

01:00:22 ◼   ► read the books you read the books [TS]

01:00:24 ◼   ► yes I read the books good we read the [TS]

01:00:27 ◼   ► books together sometimes already called [TS]

01:00:29 ◼   ► well thank you for reading the books to [TS]

01:00:30 ◼   ► you know I i love reading the books glad [TS]

01:00:34 ◼   ► that I have an excuse for reading the [TS]

01:00:35 ◼   ► books besides my own love of books [TS]

01:00:37 ◼   ► because it it accentuates the love of [TS]

01:00:39 ◼   ► books [TS]

01:00:40 ◼   ► yeah I feel funny now when I when I'm [TS]

01:00:42 ◼   ► not in the middle of a novel i feel like [TS]

01:00:44 ◼   ► i'm getting horribly behind and the [TS]

01:00:46 ◼   ► incomparable book club will suffer panic [TS]

01:00:48 ◼   ► no panic and Confused read more books [TS]

01:00:51 ◼   ► and Scott McNulty nobody has read more [TS]