The Incomparable

36: Impossible Astronauts


00:00:00   this is the incomparable podcast and yet [TS]

00:00:06   it's not this is our sort of strange [TS]

00:00:08   flash podcast sudden unexpected podcast [TS]

00:00:11   to talk about Doctor Who which the [TS]

00:00:16   two-part season premiere wrapped up over [TS]

00:00:19   the weekend and we have gathered a small [TS]

00:00:21   contingent of incomparable panelists [TS]

00:00:23   here to do a quick conversation about [TS]

00:00:26   the first two episodes of series 6 of [TS]

00:00:30   Doctor Who joining me [TS]

00:00:32   I'm Jason smell that's who they're [TS]

00:00:33   joining joining me Dan Morgan I Jason hi [TS]

00:00:38   Glenn fleischmann howdy John siracusa [TS]

00:00:42   know all [TS]

00:00:44   hello and serenity Caldwell hello hello [TS]

00:00:49   so the day of the moon was the episode [TS]

00:00:52   this weekend following the impossible [TS]

00:00:53   astronaut lots of stuff in this two-part [TS]

00:00:58   huh like overflowing bag full of stuff [TS]

00:01:01   and lots of callbacks to we know we have [TS]

00:01:04   some culmination of a bunch of stuff [TS]

00:01:06   that happened throughout season five do [TS]

00:01:10   we the silents it was I reference to [TS]

00:01:13   about don't think anything culminated [TS]

00:01:15   only people it works next chapter a word [TS]

00:01:19   mentioned in a previous season was [TS]

00:01:21   referenced again now we don't know it's [TS]

00:01:24   all the things the doctor we know that [TS]

00:01:26   we know that a river song is s song is [TS]

00:01:29   constantly refer to the fact that she [TS]

00:01:30   kills the best man she knows we see the [TS]

00:01:33   doctor killed dead we see we know that [TS]

00:01:37   she we know when he's gonna be killed [TS]

00:01:38   now offensively we know that she does it [TS]

00:01:40   but somehow there's an astronaut suit [TS]

00:01:42   their involved we know that I'm the ctrl [TS]

00:01:45   shift from the larger episode the the [TS]

00:01:48   demands for the broken spaceship is the [TS]

00:01:51   control system that the silence was [TS]

00:01:52   using we're starting to get a lot of you [TS]

00:01:54   know things starting to thread together [TS]

00:01:56   turn into a tapestry I yeah I think you [TS]

00:02:00   would you may be laying more [TS]

00:02:01   connectivity on those things that was [TS]

00:02:03   actually there we shall see i think i [TS]

00:02:06   think some of that was accident like oh [TS]

00:02:08   yeah we can use the larger TARDIS baked [TS]

00:02:11   artists too [TS]

00:02:12   tie this in with the silence that's how [TS]

00:02:14   saving budget money [TS]

00:02:16   yeah yeah also get red though so silence [TS]

00:02:20   will fall I assume that that one of the [TS]

00:02:21   twist and the season is going to be that [TS]

00:02:23   that we've seen the silence fall now and [TS]

00:02:25   it's not gonna ultimately be a good [TS]

00:02:27   thing that it wasn't about the silence [TS]

00:02:29   coming and bringing about this but that [TS]

00:02:31   actually that by the doctor kind of [TS]

00:02:33   taking a whack at them he's caused [TS]

00:02:34   terrible things to occur is basically [TS]

00:02:37   turned the entire American population [TS]

00:02:38   into murderers for the world but mostly [TS]

00:02:40   Erica that's that's what happens to the [TS]

00:02:42   dead bodies today i wanna see the dead [TS]

00:02:44   bodies they still exert a psychic [TS]

00:02:46   influence as i know you're walking as [TS]

00:02:48   a-rod knows what about all the silence [TS]

00:02:51   all the places where there's no [TS]

00:02:52   television [TS]

00:02:53   yeah interesting well there are counted [TS]

00:02:57   all and hide nepal and this that partly [TS]

00:03:00   altogether that well I mean I love the [TS]

00:03:02   idea right it doesn't make any sense i [TS]

00:03:04   think when when you process it but i [TS]

00:03:06   love the idea of the monster that you [TS]

00:03:07   can't remember that you can see it when [TS]

00:03:10   you're looking at it and you turn away [TS]

00:03:11   and it's as if it was never there that's [TS]

00:03:14   going to highlight zone episode seems [TS]

00:03:15   familiar to me it's look behind you just [TS]

00:03:19   right now you'll find out why [TS]

00:03:20   yeah it's a so my my criticism of these [TS]

00:03:25   episodes is that although they were [TS]

00:03:27   really kind of action packed and there [TS]

00:03:29   was they looked great and there was a [TS]

00:03:31   lot of interesting stuff kind of matched [TS]

00:03:33   into them that I found them kinda [TS]

00:03:36   unfulfilling that it wasn't even that [TS]

00:03:38   that some questions were resolved and [TS]

00:03:40   others were not as much as nothing was [TS]

00:03:43   resolved it felt completely like set up [TS]

00:03:45   for the rest of the season and I don't [TS]

00:03:48   mind having set up for a story arc the [TS]

00:03:50   last the whole season but to me you know [TS]

00:03:53   i feel like they need to be [TS]

00:03:54   self-contained episodes too and this [TS]

00:03:55   this didn't feel like that at all this [TS]

00:03:57   felt like a bunch of stuff put in a [TS]

00:03:59   blender and then at the end you're like [TS]

00:04:00   well I guess we'll find out sometime you [TS]

00:04:03   know in seven weeks or maybe in October [TS]

00:04:06   well Franklin little i was saying this [TS]

00:04:10   is a mirage of information right where [TS]

00:04:12   you're just getting one thing that I [TS]

00:04:14   mean the first 15 minutes of the show [TS]

00:04:15   the doctors killed dead and you just [TS]

00:04:18   kind of like okay we're back from [TS]

00:04:19   vacation everything's wait what the heck [TS]

00:04:21   is going on and then I mean it's just [TS]

00:04:24   it's action be after-action me there's [TS]

00:04:26   really no downtime for everybody to kind [TS]

00:04:29   of process about lit and even coming [TS]

00:04:31   back in the day I felt I felt more [TS]

00:04:32   acutely with the second episode i think [TS]

00:04:34   i'm with the first mainly that hole [TS]

00:04:37   opening scene where you got any well yes [TS]

00:04:40   but like at the same time you know it's [TS]

00:04:42   supposedly three months later there's [TS]

00:04:44   never it's never really explained what [TS]

00:04:47   they were doing for all three months or [TS]

00:04:49   why they had to pretend to have the [TS]

00:04:51   doctors a prisoner or I mean like there [TS]

00:04:53   are some potential explanations for why [TS]

00:04:55   this year's ruse to to create this [TS]

00:04:56   prison that they couldn't see it but it [TS]

00:04:59   seemed like overburden is low over rock [TS]

00:05:01   for for what they're trying to do and [TS]

00:05:04   arm is everybody in on it is does he [TS]

00:05:06   have a magical gun where he can shoot [TS]

00:05:07   Amy and Rory and and they don't actually [TS]

00:05:10   die like a really good actor but all but [TS]

00:05:13   all the other all the other everything [TS]

00:05:15   they can be transplanted body bags for [TS]

00:05:17   days at a time without suffocating or [TS]

00:05:20   using a bathroom and then also he's back [TS]

00:05:21   on the FBI for this three-month stint [TS]

00:05:23   and and again and again [TS]

00:05:25   why not I mean it's it just struck me as [TS]

00:05:29   being that thing we need is we need some [TS]

00:05:30   scenes with people running around and [TS]

00:05:32   there's action and then a misdirection [TS]

00:05:34   there's a lot of good stuff in there I [TS]

00:05:36   think they needed to slit like in they [TS]

00:05:38   needed to take stuff out they look like [TS]

00:05:40   a red like they had all these great [TS]

00:05:42   ideas and what we got to get them all [TS]

00:05:44   into this one episode shot we have the [TS]

00:05:46   budget for this episode let's use it [TS]

00:05:48   here's my fundamental problem with the [TS]

00:05:50   silent so far this is the unresolved [TS]

00:05:51   question every major Doctor Who villain [TS]

00:05:55   has something behind right the Cybermen [TS]

00:05:57   want to assimilate everybody the Daleks [TS]

00:05:58   want extremely all life forms the master [TS]

00:06:01   wants to control and remake reshape the [TS]

00:06:03   university's own image he likes warlike [TS]

00:06:06   silence he wants its kind of crazy thing [TS]

00:06:08   right but a little motivation for the [TS]

00:06:10   silence like it seems to be very [TS]

00:06:12   inconvenient to run everything like this [TS]

00:06:14   is always the like I was asking [TS]

00:06:16   questions Twitter the day I did not get [TS]

00:06:17   a good response [TS]

00:06:18   why did Emperor Palpatine want to run [TS]

00:06:20   the Empire it's like it's a big asshole [TS]

00:06:22   like you know live forever whatever [TS]

00:06:23   that's all you know the this is being [TS]

00:06:26   but like what is the silent while living [TS]

00:06:28   in tunnels and manipulating all this [TS]

00:06:30   stuff when they want to destroy the [TS]

00:06:31   entire universe or do they not [TS]

00:06:33   it's lacking the fundamental [TS]

00:06:35   world-beater reason for all this other [TS]

00:06:37   kind of lazy little quiet you know haha [TS]

00:06:40   and but and yet if you want to freaking [TS]

00:06:42   spacesuit you could build it yourself or [TS]

00:06:43   you could you could convince humans to [TS]

00:06:45   have an entire i'm also not clear as [TS]

00:06:48   baseball's on we thought we saw one of [TS]

00:06:50   the mic vaporize some lady and in the [TS]

00:06:51   bathroom and like episode 12 singer tips [TS]

00:06:53   and it's like no one else gets killed by [TS]

00:06:56   them know even even in many situations [TS]

00:06:58   where probably want to wear it a lot [TS]

00:06:59   more convenient for them to just kill [TS]

00:07:01   whoever was getting in there is no part [TS]

00:07:03   of this is the plot of of a curve [TS]

00:07:05   vonnegut book [TS]

00:07:06   sirens of titan where spoiler on kurt [TS]

00:07:09   vonnegut book is that in the whole of [TS]

00:07:11   human civilization is to create a funny [TS]

00:07:13   piece of metal that needs to go to [TS]

00:07:15   tighten in order for an alien spaceship [TS]

00:07:16   to continue its mission they've [TS]

00:07:18   manipulated civilization for millions of [TS]

00:07:20   years to make this happen [TS]

00:07:21   this sort of the plot here in the [TS]

00:07:22   silence manipulating to get like a darn [TS]

00:07:25   space shoot me they spent thousands of [TS]

00:07:27   years ago and you don't think all the [TS]

00:07:29   interviewers are if you think back to [TS]

00:07:30   last season the implication is that the [TS]

00:07:32   silence has something to do with the [TS]

00:07:34   TARDIS going to amy's wedding day and [TS]

00:07:37   exploding and cracking a hole in the [TS]

00:07:39   universe and again it's out there and I [TS]

00:07:42   at this point I can't detect how much of [TS]

00:07:44   this is set up and how much of this is [TS]

00:07:46   just ridiculous plot holes and I have a [TS]

00:07:47   feeling that that it's a little bit of [TS]

00:07:49   both but there's no I feel like there's [TS]

00:07:51   no resolution coming for ages that he [TS]

00:07:54   was said he's essentially just sort of [TS]

00:07:56   set the table here and said here are all [TS]

00:07:57   the things i'm going to move around this [TS]

00:07:59   season and I don't have a fundamental [TS]

00:08:01   problem with that as long as they you [TS]

00:08:04   know I you know as long as the episodes [TS]

00:08:06   themselves in fulfilling in some way but [TS]

00:08:08   they didn't really feel fulfilling and [TS]

00:08:09   then at the end I i thought it really [TS]

00:08:10   felt flat when when he actually comes [TS]

00:08:13   out and says well we could go [TS]

00:08:15   investigate all these things that we [TS]

00:08:16   just learned about the team is admitting [TS]

00:08:18   he's hiding venture to monitor the week [TS]

00:08:20   it's like lost right it's like I could [TS]

00:08:22   ask you lots of questions but I'm not [TS]

00:08:24   gonna I mean at least he says it but [TS]

00:08:26   still [TS]

00:08:27   yes he does say it but that doesn't [TS]

00:08:28   really observe him or or Steven Moffat [TS]

00:08:31   from the fact that we kind of got this [TS]

00:08:33   mishmash of of some titillating things [TS]

00:08:35   right i mean a little girl regenerates [TS]

00:08:37   who is she why is she there I I I think [TS]

00:08:41   Lana I have some ideas I i don't know [TS]

00:08:43   whether we should say them out loud or [TS]

00:08:45   not for fear that will be [TS]

00:08:47   finally love ruined the we will have [TS]

00:08:49   ruined the entire thing but I mean lost [TS]

00:08:52   let's see him right [TS]

00:08:54   ok ok you know so so so who kills the [TS]

00:08:58   doctor in the who's wearing the space it [TS]

00:09:00   its response river something but at a [TS]

00:09:02   previous age my my thinking is river [TS]

00:09:04   song is amy pond's child and that [TS]

00:09:07   somehow she got crossed in the [TS]

00:09:08   timestream there so that she has Time [TS]

00:09:10   Lord regeneration powers which was a [TS]

00:09:12   silence which topic she's I'm head right [TS]

00:09:14   that's what I meant when he says she [TS]

00:09:16   sort of likes or absorb the fetuses [TS]

00:09:18   absorb the energy of the time vortex [TS]

00:09:19   right artists and if so that's the towel [TS]

00:09:22   or networks and then yeah [TS]

00:09:25   test ones out there was ever pregnant [TS]

00:09:27   the targets before so the but the [TS]

00:09:29   related thing is that they talked about [TS]

00:09:31   the baby because i was passing the [TS]

00:09:33   spaceman are feeding off the child are [TS]

00:09:35   coming to feed off me [TS]

00:09:37   they're feeding off her time energy so [TS]

00:09:38   they've captured her they put her in [TS]

00:09:40   this space suit so they can use it as [TS]

00:09:42   their power source well and the logic [TS]

00:09:43   and the logit artist needs a if you [TS]

00:09:46   remember in the larger it needs a human [TS]

00:09:48   won't pilot it and that yet the doctor [TS]

00:09:50   is too much for it so there's a [TS]

00:09:51   suggestion that perhaps they're trying [TS]

00:09:53   to create somebody who can steer that [TS]

00:09:55   thing and fly the map where they want to [TS]

00:09:57   go half Time Lord [TS]

00:09:59   yeah you do that that other doctor from [TS]

00:10:01   the daughter of the universe [TS]

00:10:03   that's right let's get when they kill [TS]

00:10:05   the doctor and the very first scene [TS]

00:10:06   though i'm sure they wanted that to be [TS]

00:10:09   dramatic and important but we we know [TS]

00:10:12   that the doctor regenerates all the time [TS]

00:10:13   and it's a little on 200 years into the [TS]

00:10:15   future and if you still want the same [TS]

00:10:17   200 years into the future you know he's [TS]

00:10:19   not going to actually die because [TS]

00:10:20   they're not going to keep Matt Smith [TS]

00:10:21   around for 200 years [TS]

00:10:23   no you forget the david tennant to the [TS]

00:10:24   same thing that was in the season finale [TS]

00:10:26   david tennant talks about the the would [TS]

00:10:29   have called them and it's like they fit [TS]

00:10:31   you taking awhile is like he said I've [TS]

00:10:33   been bopping around 400 years so they [TS]

00:10:35   kind of built in the notion that could [TS]

00:10:36   be these long and explicable passage of [TS]

00:10:38   time which the time would stay the same [TS]

00:10:40   age whatever reason they roughly look [TS]

00:10:42   this is gonna get me one because you're [TS]

00:10:45   not going to talk about diet they're [TS]

00:10:46   going to erase that event an event that [TS]

00:10:48   killed the whole this whole season is [TS]

00:10:49   about how that event never comes to pass [TS]

00:10:51   so it's hard to take it as a as a [TS]

00:10:53   serious set up we know there's a cheat [TS]

00:10:55   where kids room because there's the [TS]

00:10:57   whole he starts to regenerate and all [TS]

00:10:58   that you know it has [TS]

00:11:00   regeneration energy gone you know have a [TS]

00:11:02   stolen it and will give it back and he's [TS]

00:11:04   not really dead and what you know [TS]

00:11:06   yeah blank read from Max Headroom brings [TS]

00:11:08   the can of gasoline and and and you know [TS]

00:11:10   what there's a lot again how much of [TS]

00:11:13   that is red herring and how much of that [TS]

00:11:14   that is gonna come back it's intriguing [TS]

00:11:16   but it does anybody remember Babylon 5 [TS]

00:11:21   there was no nobody does except that [TS]

00:11:23   there was that there's an episode about [TS]

00:11:25   15 called Babylon squared where there's [TS]

00:11:26   basically they take you in [TS]

00:11:29   it's all like setup for a payoff two [TS]

00:11:31   years later of time with based on time [TS]

00:11:32   travel and I got the sinking feeling [TS]

00:11:34   good and it kind of got messed up and I [TS]

00:11:37   got the sinking feeling was always [TS]

00:11:38   watching me Impossible Astronaut that's [TS]

00:11:40   what i was saying I was saying I've seen [TS]

00:11:41   balance where there's even a mysterious [TS]

00:11:43   figure in a spacesuit you don't know who [TS]

00:11:45   it is until much later and i think on [TS]

00:11:47   Wi-Fi they changed the identity because [TS]

00:11:49   the actor left the show and but um you [TS]

00:11:52   know it is just have that feeling like [TS]

00:11:53   this is all kind of arc arc setup and [TS]

00:11:56   and it is gonna get undone in some way [TS]

00:11:57   because it's not as if doctor who was [TS]

00:11:59   going to say well sorry that's it the [TS]

00:12:00   end he's dead [TS]

00:12:01   matt smith and then it's over exactly [TS]

00:12:03   you can't and that you're not going to [TS]

00:12:05   end a 60-year television show with matt [TS]

00:12:07   smith I mean Steven Moffat wouldn't do [TS]

00:12:09   that but I mean I'm gonna have it was [TS]

00:12:12   gonna let her do it now he's laying out [TS]

00:12:14   to you can only have two regeneration [TS]

00:12:15   left one he's on like no other day ready [TS]

00:12:18   time for that entire they've broken [TS]

00:12:19   everything that I figure they wait until [TS]

00:12:21   the last generation to show the governor [TS]

00:12:23   that years ago yeah is a while that's [TS]

00:12:25   the sort of a master's student seen the [TS]

00:12:27   Valeyard though so that's very [TS]

00:12:29   interesting theory that i read after [TS]

00:12:31   watching this was that we have not seen [TS]

00:12:34   the last of the end of this first [TS]

00:12:36   episode in that this the end of the [TS]

00:12:39   first episode where Amy shoots the girl [TS]

00:12:41   and mrs. there's a theory kind of [TS]

00:12:44   floating around that there's a lot more [TS]

00:12:46   that happened there that we have not yet [TS]

00:12:48   seen and we're only seeing kind of bits [TS]

00:12:51   and pieces but i hope so that's what was [TS]

00:12:53   I want more about Shepherd because it's [TS]

00:12:55   really lame and crap out of me and an [TS]

00:12:56   episode you would like I remember sorry [TS]

00:12:58   i missed [TS]

00:12:59   oh yeah like you're like a sec after [TS]

00:13:02   work in a warehouse what the heck [TS]

00:13:03   happened and all that information now [TS]

00:13:04   three months later there's the flashback [TS]

00:13:06   world where were a nice is really sorry [TS]

00:13:07   i missed YG that's it [TS]

00:13:09   yeah so either that was really bad or it [TS]

00:13:13   means some [TS]

00:13:13   thing but we just don't know right so [TS]

00:13:15   I'm left judging and saying that was [TS]

00:13:16   really lame [TS]

00:13:17   you know I want to step back and say I [TS]

00:13:19   actually really enjoyed the two episodes [TS]

00:13:21   despite the gaping plot holes and [TS]

00:13:22   confusing time stuff whatever i thought [TS]

00:13:24   they're beautifully shot i really love [TS]

00:13:27   what's the guy's name Mark shepherd is [TS]

00:13:28   ok yes [TS]

00:13:30   yeah but he was just that pitch perfect [TS]

00:13:32   Nixon was a little bit much but I really [TS]

00:13:34   i just thought the meson saying the the [TS]

00:13:36   richness of it nothing felt cheap the [TS]

00:13:39   aliens were really terrifying yeah so [TS]

00:13:42   big and whatever sounds I mean I think [TS]

00:13:43   that's got that going for me was a [TS]

00:13:45   rousing good show and then when you tell [TS]

00:13:47   them the details you're like all right [TS]

00:13:48   this is sort of disappointing i watched [TS]

00:13:50   both twice and I feel like there's more [TS]

00:13:52   when you watch the second time you pick [TS]

00:13:54   up i'll probably watch them again as the [TS]

00:13:55   season progresses and I think there's a [TS]

00:13:57   lot of little towels includes here and [TS]

00:13:59   there because he just looked at the [TS]

00:14:00   scene in the orphanage was just got it [TS]

00:14:02   was crazy gothic like out of nowhere [TS]

00:14:04   footage and like it you know felt like [TS]

00:14:07   we're watching the shining and you know [TS]

00:14:08   the whole thing was bizarre and closed [TS]

00:14:10   doors and all kinds of stuff that are [TS]

00:14:12   forgetting there's a lot of darkness and [TS]

00:14:14   there 2nite i agree i enjoyed the I [TS]

00:14:16   enjoyed the first episode I mean I [TS]

00:14:17   remember I got to the end of the first [TS]

00:14:18   episode was so caught up in it i was [TS]

00:14:20   surprised like all the way it's over [TS]

00:14:22   you know I felt like it you know as [TS]

00:14:24   you're saying there's a lot of action in [TS]

00:14:25   there and I think part of that is just [TS]

00:14:26   it's very you know it's very immersive [TS]

00:14:30   in it for its action in the first half [TS]

00:14:32   but i agree with you on that sort of it [TS]

00:14:33   as long as you don't think about it too [TS]

00:14:35   hard its kind of enjoyable and then you [TS]

00:14:37   start picking it apart yet losses maybe [TS]

00:14:39   a little bit of us the shine comes off [TS]

00:14:40   of it but i think that that despite that [TS]

00:14:43   there are a lot of good things you know [TS]

00:14:44   in these episodes and i still i watch [TS]

00:14:46   more less for the plots and more for the [TS]

00:14:48   characters which I think for me I enjoy [TS]

00:14:51   you know hearing that the repartee in [TS]

00:14:53   the dialogue there's some good Lori [TS]

00:14:55   stuff in the in the second episode I'm [TS]

00:14:57   long as I can we can we all agree that [TS]

00:14:59   one bad thing was seeing more of Rory [TS]

00:15:03   worrying about who Amy loves him or the [TS]

00:15:05   doctor we spent a whole season on that [TS]

00:15:07   can we [TS]

00:15:08   I mean if we're gonna do a whole other [TS]

00:15:10   season of it he's insecure he's not sure [TS]

00:15:12   but in the end she really loves and [TS]

00:15:13   we're gonna do that in every episode [TS]

00:15:15   well then also did it twice right and I [TS]

00:15:17   felt like the one at the end was very [TS]

00:15:18   effective the first one I thought was [TS]

00:15:20   not as much but when they're talking [TS]

00:15:22   about the pregnancy and he's kind of [TS]

00:15:23   eavesdropping [TS]

00:15:24   yeah I like [TS]

00:15:25   that was a better dramatic scene the [TS]

00:15:27   first one was yeah I i agree it was a [TS]

00:15:29   little bit a little bit recycle rapid [TS]

00:15:31   the execution but the idea that this is [TS]

00:15:33   going to be I think it's kinda hoping [TS]

00:15:35   that was the other seat was gonna always [TS]

00:15:37   be the capper to it and like just like [TS]

00:15:39   all right we dealt with this [TS]

00:15:40   she really does love him we're gonna [TS]

00:15:42   move on but I don't think that weeks I [TS]

00:15:44   think she would I think because she knew [TS]

00:15:45   he was listening I think she was [TS]

00:15:46   intentionally saying stuff to reassure [TS]

00:15:48   him and really they're gonna keep [TS]

00:15:49   playing this backup like but what she [TS]

00:15:50   really serious because i think it's more [TS]

00:15:52   over than that I know it's more right [TS]

00:15:54   saying to the fans [TS]

00:15:55   hey guys we're not going to worry about [TS]

00:15:56   this the season here was telling you [TS]

00:15:59   more than that in fact i think this is [TS]

00:16:00   something I felt that they had to do [TS]

00:16:02   because obviously the story arc that's [TS]

00:16:04   coming here is about Amy's pregnancy and [TS]

00:16:06   this kind of like Schrodinger's cat feed [TS]

00:16:08   us which is like pregnant not pregnant [TS]

00:16:11   not what does it mean obviously that's [TS]

00:16:13   part of the story arc I don't think you [TS]

00:16:14   can go down that path without kind of [TS]

00:16:16   clearly establishing look Amy and Rory [TS]

00:16:18   or solid it's not a problem i feel like [TS]

00:16:21   you know that they had to do that [TS]

00:16:23   because now we're gonna go down and talk [TS]

00:16:24   about her baby so your character [TS]

00:16:26   standpoint you there's a character [TS]

00:16:28   standpoint to I mean the doctor as you [TS]

00:16:31   know sort of adulterer [TS]

00:16:33   I think would be makes him a very [TS]

00:16:35   uncomfortable character in right now I [TS]

00:16:36   don't think they would do that to him he [TS]

00:16:38   he can't even kiss a girl without [TS]

00:16:39   flinching so well yeah instrumental [TS]

00:16:41   music and suppose a daughter and we [TS]

00:16:43   really just we just seen this girl [TS]

00:16:44   regenerate right so so i think without [TS]

00:16:47   sort of emphasizing that that the amy [TS]

00:16:51   and and the doctor or not having a baby [TS]

00:16:53   you've got to do that otherwise it's the [TS]

00:16:55   first conclusion you jump too is that [TS]

00:16:57   they did right so i think that's backing [TS]

00:16:59   over the kind of one of the questions [TS]

00:17:01   people might have when that's not the [TS]

00:17:04   intent i think that's why we saw all [TS]

00:17:05   that stuff with amy and well especially [TS]

00:17:07   because she tells him first that she's [TS]

00:17:09   pregnant I mean they're they're badly [TS]

00:17:12   depths there there by slipping in the [TS]

00:17:13   time head reference which i think is [TS]

00:17:15   very important [TS]

00:17:16   hey before we are out of whatever song [TS]

00:17:18   before we get to your assistance she is [TS]

00:17:20   a big Cypress i love the actress to [TS]

00:17:23   pieces I don't think there's ever been [TS]

00:17:25   anybody on doctor who has been has as [TS]

00:17:28   confident as this character you would [TS]

00:17:31   you agree at sochi maybe it'll have to [TS]

00:17:34   do sorry right okay after the fact [TS]

00:17:36   contended that [TS]

00:17:38   yeah it's easy [TS]

00:17:39   uses his old blaster so it's almost kind [TS]

00:17:40   of fitting yeah right but she's i love [TS]

00:17:42   the bit about you know i love i love me [TS]

00:17:44   a good tomb [TS]

00:17:45   oh god that line made me so happy I just [TS]

00:17:49   what it was i love a good to me is like [TS]

00:17:52   what love looks are of exactly what [TS]

00:17:54   archaeology I love a good tune [TS]

00:17:56   oh my god yeah alex kingston is great [TS]

00:17:58   and there were some you know the river [TS]

00:17:59   song thing is is interesting what [TS]

00:18:01   infuriates me about it is that they seem [TS]

00:18:03   to have decided that they are meeting in [TS]

00:18:05   reverse order which based on previous [TS]

00:18:07   poor trails is is not right that they're [TS]

00:18:10   not doing with other around a little bit [TS]

00:18:12   and I where I wonder if they're just [TS]

00:18:13   trying to simplify things for the other [TS]

00:18:15   units they're meeting out of order right [TS]

00:18:17   we know that the right but now she's [TS]

00:18:18   saying its reverse order which is right [TS]

00:18:20   for the first time they can be at least [TS]

00:18:22   a first time they meet for the doctor's [TS]

00:18:23   perspective is the time is her death [TS]

00:18:26   writer right so the time before that she [TS]

00:18:28   met with a doctor who knows her very [TS]

00:18:30   well who said goodbye to her and sent [TS]

00:18:32   her off to the library right so they [TS]

00:18:33   obviously don't meet in reverse order [TS]

00:18:35   they do meet maybe generally in reverse [TS]

00:18:38   order but there's hopping with my head [TS]

00:18:39   I'm going to write a timeline so yeah [TS]

00:18:41   there is there is online you can find a [TS]

00:18:43   timeline of it but but I to cleanse [TS]

00:18:45   suggestion earlier i do think that the [TS]

00:18:47   revelations about about river are going [TS]

00:18:49   to be related to this child and whether [TS]

00:18:51   she is Amy's child or not i think that [TS]

00:18:53   would be a sort of like human did you [TS]

00:18:57   know with time energy infused in her I [TS]

00:19:00   don't know it's it [TS]

00:19:01   she seems to factor in those somehow i'm [TS]

00:19:03   just i just don't know what the [TS]

00:19:05   connection actually a great mystery is [TS]

00:19:07   under whose authority is she in prison [TS]

00:19:09   isn't that a fascinating and and she [TS]

00:19:12   continued whenever he wants it makes [TS]

00:19:14   outside earth and a few Slovenes and [TS]

00:19:16   things that we ever see anyone in jail [TS]

00:19:17   and Doctor Who or the master what what's [TS]

00:19:20   the secret of why she goes to storm cage [TS]

00:19:22   i think is just one of those questions [TS]

00:19:24   that's been laying out there is how you [TS]

00:19:25   know who did she kill and I think we're [TS]

00:19:27   going to get that answer right in front [TS]

00:19:29   of that one [TS]

00:19:30   yeah well that was a brilliant scene in [TS]

00:19:31   the first episode she's packing [TS]

00:19:34   well the the there's a theory out there [TS]

00:19:37   that i like that says that the reason [TS]

00:19:39   that she's serving her time and for for [TS]

00:19:42   killing somebody is because she's [TS]

00:19:44   killing she quote killed somebody who [TS]

00:19:46   wanted to cover up their their [TS]

00:19:49   disappearance and if that's the doctor [TS]

00:19:51   that's kind of interest [TS]

00:19:52   and that dovetails with some an [TS]

00:19:54   interview with steven moffat where he [TS]

00:19:55   said one of the fundamental problems [TS]

00:19:56   with modern doctor who is he wanders [TS]

00:19:58   around and everybody knows him and that [TS]

00:20:00   he's this oncoming storm and he's he's [TS]

00:20:02   you know he's destroyed all these [TS]

00:20:05   different bad guys in all these [TS]

00:20:06   different worlds and that they need to [TS]

00:20:07   kind of take it back a notch to have [TS]

00:20:09   them be just a guy who shows up and [TS]

00:20:10   nobody knows who he is so I do wonder if [TS]

00:20:13   that's the direction they're going where [TS]

00:20:14   this death of his is not it is it's for [TS]

00:20:17   show more than anything else but me he [TS]

00:20:19   didn't invite everybody to his own [TS]

00:20:21   funeral [TS]

00:20:21   yes well not everybody but certainly a [TS]

00:20:24   nice ensemble including himself [TS]

00:20:26   yes this man nice well so this is the [TS]

00:20:29   problem was is river song if she [TS]

00:20:31   actually is being a backwards through [TS]

00:20:32   time she would know she's already seen [TS]

00:20:35   his death right but you can say but she [TS]

00:20:38   can't say and she knows his name river [TS]

00:20:40   you know my name nobody knows that i [TS]

00:20:42   would only tell somebody that when you [TS]

00:20:44   know that whole thing in a in the [TS]

00:20:46   library or the CSS library right someone [TS]

00:20:50   will eventually go through clip all the [TS]

00:20:51   relevant scenes and put them in the [TS]

00:20:53   correct yeah let's just wait and watch [TS]

00:20:55   it out there that'll make it it's gonna [TS]

00:20:56   have so much I want to give a shoutout [TS]

00:20:58   to the guy who played lb elderkin [TS]

00:21:00   delaware the third workshop back blank [TS]

00:21:02   read from his father I'm gonna be was [TS]

00:21:05   blank read and Max Headroom he was [TS]

00:21:06   headed to start correcting he was this [TS]

00:21:08   it's hard and start trying to make [TS]

00:21:09   generation he was in Star Trek six he [TS]

00:21:12   was the Klingon who welcomes them to [TS]

00:21:15   repent a he was in Star Trek the reboot [TS]

00:21:17   as the Vulcan hotel Spock that they'll [TS]

00:21:20   the let him into the anatomy despite his [TS]

00:21:22   community cap it's the Morgan Shepherd [TS]

00:21:25   he has been in any in anything and [TS]

00:21:27   everything is really following in his in [TS]

00:21:29   his footsteps [TS]

00:21:30   yes he is a guest star who is on every [TS]

00:21:32   everything no no he's great [TS]

00:21:34   that's created did not realize that [TS]

00:21:35   that's lovely father and so there sat [TS]

00:21:36   next to each other signing at comic-con [TS]

00:21:38   last year when I got Morgan Shepherd [TS]

00:21:40   autograph Mark shepherd was sitting [TS]

00:21:41   right next to signing autographs for [TS]

00:21:44   fans of supernatural like it is always [TS]

00:21:47   present i did not know at the time to [TS]

00:21:50   call back [TS]

00:21:51   yes so so you know so everybody [TS]

00:21:56   everybody entertained i'm just i was [TS]

00:21:58   disappointed even though i think there's [TS]

00:22:00   a lot of intriguing stuff and i love the [TS]

00:22:01   look of it and I loved some of the [TS]

00:22:03   elements of it in the end I felt kinda [TS]

00:22:05   like [TS]

00:22:05   down and maybe part of that is just [TS]

00:22:07   because I expected to the season opener [TS]

00:22:11   to sort of like get me excited about the [TS]

00:22:13   season and you know it didn't it just [TS]

00:22:16   was a lot of stuff match together i felt [TS]

00:22:17   was like the homework for the rest of [TS]

00:22:19   the season so did everybody else have a [TS]

00:22:21   more positive feeling about tonight i [TS]

00:22:24   would say meets expectations is my [TS]

00:22:26   rating for you [TS]

00:22:27   alright only because my expectations are [TS]

00:22:29   so low for dr. like I thought that I I [TS]

00:22:33   thought it was fine you know like I just [TS]

00:22:34   want expect from guard who a bunch of [TS]

00:22:36   stuff that's kind of sloppy and i put [TS]

00:22:37   together well they don't know how to [TS]

00:22:39   edit it's not it's not tight like you [TS]

00:22:40   know the best of twilight zone or the [TS]

00:22:42   best of you an amazing stories or [TS]

00:22:44   anything like that it's checking out and [TS]

00:22:46   we're on but have the emotional impact [TS]

00:22:48   of war games i need to i didn't close I [TS]

00:22:52   mean that's the thing with doctor who is [TS]

00:22:53   I find it very hard to get invested like [TS]

00:22:55   especially in this episode I i feel like [TS]

00:22:56   these two episodes didn't earn their [TS]

00:22:59   dramatic you know when they do the the [TS]

00:23:01   dramatic dr. music that dun dun dun [TS]

00:23:03   music yeah most good episodes they will [TS]

00:23:05   earn that little little cherry that they [TS]

00:23:07   give themselves in the dramatic moment [TS]

00:23:09   and miss these two episodes of like they [TS]

00:23:11   didn't are in that queue but I'd who [TS]

00:23:14   didn't bother me so much because they're [TS]

00:23:15   all things Jason's complaining about i [TS]

00:23:17   agree with but I could say the same [TS]

00:23:18   thing about almost any you pick a random [TS]

00:23:21   episode from her past season and it's [TS]

00:23:22   just something I tolerate about Doctor [TS]

00:23:24   Who for the notice to be there for the [TS]

00:23:25   fun ride and I'm just like all right [TS]

00:23:26   i'll go with it whatever i mean i have [TS]

00:23:29   to say that while overall i was [TS]

00:23:31   entertained the the to death sequences [TS]

00:23:35   specifically the doctors death in the [TS]

00:23:36   beginning of the first episode and then [TS]

00:23:38   Rory and Amy's and rivers all fake [TS]

00:23:40   deaths in the beginning of episode two [TS]

00:23:42   they set these all these deaths up its [TS]

00:23:44   big epic things and they kind of come [TS]

00:23:46   out of nowhere and you don't really know [TS]

00:23:48   how I feel about them and i have to say [TS]

00:23:49   that definitely threw me off [TS]

00:23:51   that's the third third fake rory death [TS]

00:23:53   by yes I people were confirmed that he [TS]

00:23:56   is in fact that still be the fake Rory [TS]

00:23:59   or the only not no no don't know i don't [TS]

00:24:01   think he's plastic I don't know he's [TS]

00:24:02   human but he remembers being plastic is [TS]

00:24:05   it when they redid the university became [TS]

00:24:07   real boy [TS]

00:24:08   yeah but he remembers right everything [TS]

00:24:09   like I think there's some ambiguity that [TS]

00:24:11   killed him three times now and brought [TS]

00:24:13   him back [TS]

00:24:14   looks like i'll simply killed in real [TS]

00:24:15   really didn't they 22 [TS]

00:24:17   never dies where's had enough seen [TS]

00:24:20   enough you're only supposed to get one [TS]

00:24:22   good death scene is an actor I thought [TS]

00:24:24   that was a bit at the end of the second [TS]

00:24:25   episode when when he doctor the doctor [TS]

00:24:28   says you only live once and they give [TS]

00:24:29   each other a look and I thought at first [TS]

00:24:31   it was worried going like hey dude look [TS]

00:24:33   at me look at you and I was like oh no [TS]

00:24:35   they're talking about the callback to [TS]

00:24:36   the dr dying but i was still like [TS]

00:24:38   everybody seems to have died on friday [TS]

00:24:40   with some amy was dead he was dead they [TS]

00:24:42   restored in the Pandorica ok so go [TS]

00:24:44   so Dan enjoyed generally generally [TS]

00:24:47   correct [TS]

00:24:48   I i say i generally enjoyed I think [TS]

00:24:49   there was a lot of there are some nice [TS]

00:24:51   little touches that I really thought [TS]

00:24:52   well done i love the whole marking all [TS]

00:24:55   the arms and the faces and everything [TS]

00:24:56   that was I was very effective it's been [TS]

00:24:59   could have been a two-parter in and of [TS]

00:25:00   itself though right yeah i mean i think [TS]

00:25:02   that again i think my main complaint is [TS]

00:25:04   that there is too much they needed to [TS]

00:25:06   you know kill some darlings in there and [TS]

00:25:07   say that we just don't have room for [TS]

00:25:09   this [TS]

00:25:09   that's a separate episode or we just got [TS]

00:25:11   to drop it because I think there's too [TS]

00:25:12   much they were in love with in this [TS]

00:25:14   episode as a second the second unit [TS]

00:25:15   really really wanted to do some great [TS]

00:25:18   panoramic us if you want to watch others [TS]

00:25:21   are beautiful shot dr. confidential [TS]

00:25:23   they're like they really wanted to these [TS]

00:25:25   giant shots and they need a giant reason [TS]

00:25:27   to do it so the second it's like let's [TS]

00:25:29   kill roar I mean they're not this year [TS]

00:25:30   on the top of the Glen Canyon Dam [TS]

00:25:32   oh yeah so going eight you liked it me [TS]

00:25:35   yeah yeah I seem to enjoy hide it I [TS]

00:25:38   definitely the thing I liked about i [TS]

00:25:40   will agree with John in heart only in [TS]

00:25:43   part that the doctor who is all about [TS]

00:25:45   sort of sloppy ridiculous what we [TS]

00:25:47   believe wobbly if you if you really [TS]

00:25:49   focus the plan doctor who you are [TS]

00:25:50   inevitably going to be disappointed it's [TS]

00:25:53   not you enjoy repete and the whole sort [TS]

00:25:55   of you know just off of it and it's not [TS]

00:25:58   it has to be fun that way because the [TS]

00:25:59   plots are always like that but I'm but I [TS]

00:26:01   think there are a lot of things that [TS]

00:26:02   really pulled me up short the aliens I [TS]

00:26:04   thought were super creepy i thought it [TS]

00:26:05   was great and even when the doctor died [TS]

00:26:08   I was like holy them so they're watching [TS]

00:26:09   like holy crap like what the like I know [TS]

00:26:12   what I know it has to be a positive [TS]

00:26:13   resolution because i'm not in the series [TS]

00:26:15   but was still I was really shocked a few [TS]

00:26:17   times it's hard to do that as a jaded [TS]

00:26:19   Doctor Who modern version watcher [TS]

00:26:22   alright I I yeah I I see where you're [TS]

00:26:25   coming from [TS]

00:26:25   I'm a little more skeptical i I just I [TS]

00:26:27   just found myself San come on standalone [TS]

00:26:29   episodes I'm really looking forward to [TS]

00:26:31   seeing [TS]

00:26:31   pirates this coming week right it's like [TS]

00:26:34   it's just hire an attractive pirate ship [TS]

00:26:37   to two weeks though we get a neil gaiman [TS]

00:26:39   penned episode tantalizingly titled the [TS]

00:26:41   doctor's wife yeah looking forward to it [TS]

00:26:44   definitely looking forward to this he's [TS]

00:26:45   been married so so I'm and my prediction [TS]

00:26:48   by the way for the last scene of the [TS]

00:26:50   last episode of this season is that [TS]

00:26:53   Amy's gonna give birth to a baby girl [TS]

00:26:55   and the doctors gonna say hello sweetie [TS]

00:26:58   that's my prediction mark my words what [TS]

00:27:01   I want you think she's but mark my words [TS]

00:27:04   i really think she's River Song [TS]

00:27:06   yeah no I would not be surprised they [TS]

00:27:09   would not surprise me I I get the [TS]

00:27:10   feeling that they're trying to wrap up [TS]

00:27:12   you know or out or at least explain that [TS]

00:27:14   story and explain who she is now that [TS]

00:27:17   they've got this baby involved who's got [TS]

00:27:18   through special traits well remember [TS]

00:27:20   that imagine meeting her imagination as [TS]

00:27:22   a young girl or is it she's a young girl [TS]

00:27:24   which talk about being the doctor [TS]

00:27:25   because she's young she met she meant [TS]

00:27:28   yeah which is the time traveler's wife [TS]

00:27:29   basically which Steven Moffat has not [TS]

00:27:30   been shy from knocking off in numerous [TS]

00:27:33   ways so why not again when he's publicly [TS]

00:27:36   acknowledged yes he has now it's nice [TS]

00:27:38   nice of him to do that so any other [TS]

00:27:40   final parting thoughts for this before [TS]

00:27:42   we go on to a hundred pirate ship [TS]

00:27:44   I love the firefight at the end of the [TS]

00:27:47   second episode with with river and the [TS]

00:27:48   doctor trying to fire people with the [TS]

00:27:50   screwdriver is like what are you doing [TS]

00:27:52   I'm so he like shielding or something [TS]

00:27:56   now I don't think he's doing anything I [TS]

00:27:57   think he just wants to feel useful [TS]

00:27:58   meanwhile she actually kills people just [TS]

00:28:01   distracting the silence yes okay face [TS]

00:28:03   mark thing bothered me a little bit but [TS]

00:28:05   the so I like the idea of the things [TS]

00:28:08   that you don't remember in making marks [TS]

00:28:09   to remember it but a why would you do is [TS]

00:28:12   hash marks we have like a number system [TS]

00:28:13   that takes up less room and be why would [TS]

00:28:15   you ever put barks in your face you can [TS]

00:28:17   see it in your face unless you have a [TS]

00:28:18   mirror so how can you be checking that [TS]

00:28:19   the numbers of changes the last time I [TS]

00:28:22   know they had the reflection in the [TS]

00:28:23   window it just seemed it seems silly to [TS]

00:28:24   vegas that they went for drama but I [TS]

00:28:26   feel like writing on your hand with [TS]

00:28:27   numbers may what would have made more [TS]

00:28:30   sense and you wouldn't have lost [TS]

00:28:31   anything they could use binary notation [TS]

00:28:33   that would have been even worse [TS]

00:28:34   hexadecimal of hexadecimal would have [TS]

00:28:37   been even more space-efficient for [TS]

00:28:39   harder for the audience to read but hash [TS]

00:28:40   marks and on your face like you're going [TS]

00:28:43   to draw a hash mark on your forehead [TS]

00:28:44   personal it's hard to do try drawing [TS]

00:28:45   hash marks on your forehead and making [TS]

00:28:47   sure that that's one crosses the for the [TS]

00:28:48   US troop previous you try this [TS]

00:28:51   well he did research just like jelly and [TS]

00:28:54   healthy while all choice realize obvious [TS]

00:28:56   choice the obvious choice is to write [TS]

00:28:58   numbers on your hands and they went with [TS]

00:29:00   this other choice which makes no sense [TS]

00:29:03   also I want to have the children wrote [TS]

00:29:04   in giant red letters go home get out of [TS]

00:29:07   here in the north today I thought that I [TS]

00:29:09   thought the ocular date your dad I don't [TS]

00:29:11   have a carrot the crazy you did [TS]

00:29:13   oh I see a lot of course that's because [TS]

00:29:15   they were in fact the children's India's [TS]

00:29:17   exactly that he was great he was like [TS]

00:29:19   that of some kind of like great gothic [TS]

00:29:21   novel found covered in the you know [TS]

00:29:25   something we have the crazy the crazy [TS]

00:29:27   hash marks i read something right after [TS]

00:29:30   I watched the episode where someone's [TS]

00:29:31   like you want to figure out a way to [TS]

00:29:32   really scare your kids right after [TS]

00:29:34   having them watch this episode let them [TS]

00:29:36   go to sleep and then draw hash marks all [TS]

00:29:38   over haha yeah and i'm waiting for them [TS]

00:29:42   to find a mirror presumably yes so [TS]

00:29:44   because these are now being aired [TS]

00:29:46   simultaneously in the US and the UK [TS]

00:29:48   we've actually tried the experiment of [TS]

00:29:50   watching these we watch these episodes [TS]

00:29:51   with our kids sight unseen and the after [TS]

00:29:55   the impossible astronaut my son demanded [TS]

00:29:57   that he sleep with the door open and the [TS]

00:29:58   light on in the hallway [TS]

00:30:00   yeah that's it that's okay my wife sexy [TS]

00:30:02   what you didn't know it's great to have [TS]

00:30:04   you sitting right there is I had a [TS]

00:30:07   moment being a little scared i had a few [TS]

00:30:09   moments in the basement yesterday after [TS]

00:30:11   watching the episode turning on lights [TS]

00:30:14   and going around dark corners and going [TS]

00:30:16   ok all right just after watching it so [TS]

00:30:18   that's good that's because they were [TS]

00:30:19   behind me Glenn have a spacesuit putting [TS]

00:30:21   education that's good that's right thank [TS]

00:30:26   you [TS]

00:30:26   alright so thank you all for joining me [TS]

00:30:29   in this crazy flash podcast will try to [TS]

00:30:32   do this again maybe 44 other doctor [TS]

00:30:34   who's or other things that come up and [TS]

00:30:35   then we post them and there's no editing [TS]

00:30:37   and so everybody gets it exactly as it [TS]

00:30:39   was here in all of its glory and mess [TS]

00:30:43   what do you want it's an extra thing you [TS]

00:30:45   know what did you pay [TS]

00:30:47   just your valuable time sorry you also [TS]

00:30:50   get the DVD commentary of this episode [TS]

00:30:52   for free [TS]

00:30:53   sure I don't understand that when Glenn [TS]

00:30:56   we're gonna listen to the episode and [TS]

00:30:58   comment on this actual pot kettle on the [TS]

00:31:00   podcast again anyway raman singh to to [TS]

00:31:04   the meta commentary on our actual [TS]

00:31:06   podcast and it hasn't happened yet not [TS]

00:31:08   yet i hope it never does [TS]

00:31:09   but if it does that will be a different [TS]

00:31:11   episode of the uncomfortable so until [TS]

00:31:13   next time when we post a proper episode [TS]

00:31:15   i'm justin still thinking the guests and [TS]

00:31:18   warren and Fleischmann John siracusa and [TS]

00:31:20   serenity Caldwell everybody say goodbye [TS]

00:31:24   that's it thanks for listening [TS]