The Incomparable

00:00:00 ◼   ► controllable contest after sold 29-20 [TS]

00:00:09 ◼   ► LMAO welcome back to the uncomfortable [TS]

00:00:11 ◼   ► podcast i am your host Daniel one [TS]

00:00:14 ◼   ► sitting in for Jason's now who for once [TS]

00:00:17 ◼   ► has not read the book that is the [TS]

00:00:18 ◼   ► subject of our talk tonight [TS]

00:00:20 ◼   ► now who is illiterate anyways i'm joined [TS]

00:00:25 ◼   ► by a gallery of rogues as you might say [TS]

00:00:27 ◼   ► we have Scott McNulty I Scott hello and [TS]

00:00:32 ◼   ► John siracusa hi John [TS]

00:00:34 ◼   ► hello everybody and the three of us are [TS]

00:00:37 ◼   ► here convening this sort of ad hoc [TS]

00:00:39 ◼   ► meeting at the book club to talk about [TS]

00:00:41 ◼   ► Patrick Rothfuss 'as debut fantasy novel [TS]

00:00:45 ◼   ► from 2007 so you know where we're a [TS]

00:00:47 ◼   ► little bit behind time I guess it's hot [TS]

00:00:49 ◼   ► off the presses the name of the wind and [TS]

00:00:54 ◼   ► part of the reason we're talking about [TS]

00:00:54 ◼   ► it now is that the books sequel The Wise [TS]

00:00:57 ◼   ► Man's Fear just came out what two weeks [TS]

00:00:59 ◼   ► ago or so [TS]

00:01:01 ◼   ► alright so we're we're here to sort of [TS]

00:01:02 ◼   ► wet your appetite [TS]

00:01:05 ◼   ► if you have not read this series well be [TS]

00:01:09 ◼   ► aware that we are going to have some [TS]

00:01:11 ◼   ► spoilers from the first book we're going [TS]

00:01:12 ◼   ► to try to avoid spoilers from the second [TS]

00:01:14 ◼   ► book we haven't all finished reading it [TS]

00:01:15 ◼   ► I think Scott's finish it i'm about [TS]

00:01:17 ◼   ► halfway through John however you like [TS]

00:01:19 ◼   ► ten percent i'm a celeb rater it's a [TS]

00:01:21 ◼   ► it's a long book to it is a half diva [TS]

00:01:23 ◼   ► it's a lot of its a lot of kindle dots I [TS]

00:01:25 ◼   ► don't know what that means but well the [TS]

00:01:28 ◼   ► first one was no was no short one either [TS]

00:01:30 ◼   ► so let's let's just dive right I'm just [TS]

00:01:32 ◼   ► gonna have a heads fire off the spoiler [TS]

00:01:34 ◼   ► harm right now for anybody who has not [TS]

00:01:36 ◼   ► read the name of the way this podcast is [TS]

00:01:38 ◼   ► going to be one probably fairly large [TS]

00:01:40 ◼   ► boiler for this [TS]

00:01:42 ◼   ► we will at the end reveal the name of [TS]

00:01:46 ◼   ► the wind it's it's bob bob bob is the [TS]

00:01:49 ◼   ► name of the wind up with how hard was [TS]

00:01:51 ◼   ► that I could have been a lot shorter [TS]

00:01:52 ◼   ► book very short book two pages so too [TS]

00:01:57 ◼   ► let's get a little low overview of the [TS]

00:01:59 ◼   ► plot of the name of the wind now this is [TS]

00:02:01 ◼   ► a fantasy book in some ways I think what [TS]

00:02:04 ◼   ► would interested me about it is that [TS]

00:02:06 ◼   ► well it has some of the tropes of your [TS]

00:02:08 ◼   ► traditional fantasy book it also feels [TS]

00:02:10 ◼   ► not entirely like you know your standard [TS]

00:02:14 ◼   ► fantasy book I think he plays with some [TS]

00:02:17 ◼   ► of the conventions which is nice [TS]

00:02:18 ◼   ► it's the story of a man named clothes [TS]

00:02:22 ◼   ► job on that could yeah thanks y'all I [TS]

00:02:25 ◼   ► mean he does a good job of pointing out [TS]

00:02:27 ◼   ► in somewhere in the book I think what [TS]

00:02:28 ◼   ► the pronunciation is at some point the [TS]

00:02:30 ◼   ► air corrects somebody a man named for [TS]

00:02:34 ◼   ► both who is kind of a legendary hero and [TS]

00:02:39 ◼   ► the other thing I really love about the [TS]

00:02:41 ◼   ► book is that the layering of the stories [TS]

00:02:43 ◼   ► in that we get the bulk of it through [TS]

00:02:46 ◼   ► coat size like he's relating this story [TS]

00:02:49 ◼   ► and it's being written down by another [TS]

00:02:52 ◼   ► man who subscribe and so you know we [TS]

00:02:55 ◼   ► have it it's all sort of tinged with his [TS]

00:02:57 ◼   ► memory of how he came to be this [TS]

00:02:59 ◼   ► legendary hero but in that ad that adds [TS]

00:03:03 ◼   ► this interesting this interesting [TS]

00:03:05 ◼   ► dynamic because we also have this [TS]

00:03:06 ◼   ► framing story in which he's doing [TS]

00:03:07 ◼   ► relating and it's also there's some [TS]

00:03:09 ◼   ► other stuff going on with you know the [TS]

00:03:12 ◼   ► way that the the world is this fantasy [TS]

00:03:14 ◼   ► world is going which is to say not very [TS]

00:03:16 ◼   ► not very well I don't know if there's a [TS]

00:03:19 ◼   ► good way of summing up sort of what the [TS]

00:03:21 ◼   ► what the plot of name of the wind is [TS]

00:03:23 ◼   ► though I don't you guys either of you [TS]

00:03:25 ◼   ► have sort of like a like a pity one word [TS]

00:03:28 ◼   ► sentence summary or something because I [TS]

00:03:30 ◼   ► would have trouble wrapping up in that [TS]

00:03:31 ◼   ► what the plot is if you take out the [TS]

00:03:34 ◼   ► whole device of the [TS]

00:03:35 ◼   ► the kind of suddenly a bookend but you [TS]

00:03:38 ◼   ► know the kind of flashback story it's [TS]

00:03:40 ◼   ► fairly straightforward right at the the [TS]

00:03:42 ◼   ► otha is that a psychopath [TS]

00:03:44 ◼   ► he is born have a gypsy right and so is [TS]

00:03:48 ◼   ► peace his parents are traveling [TS]

00:03:50 ◼   ► entertainers and he's in this troop and [TS]

00:03:53 ◼   ► threw he has some adventures and he [TS]

00:03:55 ◼   ► loves his parents and he meets some guy [TS]

00:03:57 ◼   ► who can name things and does went to the [TS]

00:04:01 ◼   ► University which is this the one school [TS]

00:04:04 ◼   ► in this world I guess where people find [TS]

00:04:07 ◼   ► out [TS]

00:04:07 ◼   ► arcane things and by the way that's good [TS]

00:04:10 ◼   ► they're having a lot of spoilers in this [TS]

00:04:12 ◼   ► one sentence [TS]

00:04:13 ◼   ► huh [TS]

00:04:13 ◼   ► [Music] [TS]

00:04:21 ◼   ► and then just passed get killed by these [TS]

00:04:24 ◼   ► with a whole troop gets killed by these [TS]

00:04:27 ◼   ► mysterious yeah kind of fairytale beings [TS]

00:04:31 ◼   ► that comical everyone except for Devon [TS]

00:04:34 ◼   ► third whatever the hell his name is [TS]

00:04:36 ◼   ► because he's out in the forest or [TS]

00:04:39 ◼   ► something and so he comes back you find [TS]

00:04:40 ◼   ► everyone dead he's very sad he goes to a [TS]

00:04:43 ◼   ► city he lives as a street urchin for a [TS]

00:04:46 ◼   ► couple of years and then he meets [TS]

00:04:48 ◼   ► somebody who inspires him to go to the [TS]

00:04:51 ◼   ► University himself he's accepted to the [TS]

00:04:53 ◼   ► University he's a shockingly he's a [TS]

00:04:56 ◼   ► stellar student at the University he has [TS]

00:04:58 ◼   ► great aptitude he meets a rich guy who [TS]

00:05:02 ◼   ► is doesn't like him because he's poor [TS]

00:05:03 ◼   ► and he knows a lot more than rich guy [TS]

00:05:05 ◼   ► and there you go that's a bit more than [TS]

00:05:09 ◼   ► one sentence but but it is a reason on [TS]

00:05:12 ◼   ► said it was it with yeah that's a bit of [TS]

00:05:14 ◼   ► a comma splice yeah but I think you get [TS]

00:05:16 ◼   ► did a good job of telling you know sort [TS]

00:05:18 ◼   ► of hitting the high notes there I but [TS]

00:05:20 ◼   ► you know it's not necessarily because [TS]

00:05:22 ◼   ► this is the first book in a series you [TS]

00:05:25 ◼   ► know obviously we don't get like [TS]

00:05:26 ◼   ► everything you know this is only the [TS]

00:05:28 ◼   ► first a part of the art like we service [TS]

00:05:31 ◼   ► were sort of in the name of the when [TS]

00:05:32 ◼   ► you're getting his rise but not [TS]

00:05:34 ◼   ► necessarily you know the middle or the [TS]

00:05:38 ◼   ► end of the story although you get the [TS]

00:05:39 ◼   ► impression from the framing story where [TS]

00:05:41 ◼   ► we having both relate this to his his [TS]

00:05:45 ◼   ► scribe that he's sort of come down in [TS]

00:05:49 ◼   ► the world instead since the frame store [TS]

00:05:50 ◼   ► he's an innkeeper and there is some [TS]

00:05:53 ◼   ► suggestion later on at least towards the [TS]

00:05:56 ◼   ► end of the book that he'd these powers [TS]

00:05:58 ◼   ► these amazing powers which made him this [TS]

00:06:00 ◼   ► legendary hero are no longer available [TS]

00:06:02 ◼   ► to him but it was like I said one of the [TS]

00:06:07 ◼   ► things I really like about it is the [TS]

00:06:08 ◼   ► sort of the layering of the stories [TS]

00:06:10 ◼   ► there i don't know if there was [TS]

00:06:11 ◼   ► something in particular they cut you [TS]

00:06:12 ◼   ► guys in terms of why you find this [TS]

00:06:15 ◼   ► assuming you you you like to the book [TS]

00:06:17 ◼   ► what about it caught your attention and [TS]

00:06:19 ◼   ► sort of set it apart for you [TS]

00:06:21 ◼   ► well I I have a confession to make i was [TS]

00:06:23 ◼   ► a very enthusiastic about doing this [TS]

00:06:25 ◼   ► show this book on the podcast most [TS]

00:06:28 ◼   ► people just want to be on a book podcast [TS]

00:06:30 ◼   ► and you guys read books way too fast for [TS]

00:06:32 ◼   ► me and I already read this one side [TS]

00:06:33 ◼   ► it was a great opportunity so you would [TS]

00:06:35 ◼   ► think I'd be a all set to say lots of [TS]

00:06:37 ◼   ► wonderful things about this book but in [TS]

00:06:39 ◼   ► fact i come here not to praise this book [TS]

00:06:41 ◼   ► but area [TS]

00:06:42 ◼   ► oh but it and yet you are reading the [TS]

00:06:45 ◼   ► second one though so that's an injured [TS]

00:06:47 ◼   ► if you didn't like the first one [TS]

00:06:49 ◼   ► yeah so I heard about this book I [TS]

00:06:52 ◼   ► remember her through the internet and I [TS]

00:06:54 ◼   ► hadn't read a fantasy book in a long [TS]

00:06:55 ◼   ► time and people are making a lot of [TS]

00:06:56 ◼   ► noise about the you know this new guides [TS]

00:06:58 ◼   ► his first book it's a great facebook you [TS]

00:07:00 ◼   ► should read it so I said fine I'll give [TS]

00:07:01 ◼   ► it a try and i started reading it and [TS]

00:07:04 ◼   ► the reason i'm reading the sequel and [TS]

00:07:06 ◼   ► the reason I'm part of the reason things [TS]

00:07:08 ◼   ► anyways there were a lot of things to [TS]

00:07:09 ◼   ► recommend this book I guess I'll start [TS]

00:07:11 ◼   ► before i start shredding at the bits [TS]

00:07:12 ◼   ► with my favorite parts of the book my [TS]

00:07:15 ◼   ► favorite parts about you guys touching a [TS]

00:07:17 ◼   ► lot of them already won i really like [TS]

00:07:19 ◼   ► the the whole magic system in the world [TS]

00:07:23 ◼   ► that the idea of sympathy and that's [TS]

00:07:26 ◼   ► kind of like the the lame magic where [TS]

00:07:29 ◼   ► you can't really do anything too [TS]

00:07:30 ◼   ► exciting and everything is kind of [TS]

00:07:31 ◼   ► balance by semi physical forces and then [TS]

00:07:34 ◼   ► there's like the real magic where you [TS]

00:07:35 ◼   ► have that where you're naming things and [TS]

00:07:38 ◼   ► that's much more mysterious and not as [TS]

00:07:40 ◼   ► commonplace that whole mechanism and I [TS]

00:07:42 ◼   ► takes up a lot of the beginning part of [TS]

00:07:44 ◼   ► the book that that stuff I like I [TS]

00:07:46 ◼   ► thought it was interesting and original [TS]

00:07:48 ◼   ► and a dry like books that do something [TS]

00:07:50 ◼   ► interesting with the magic system and [TS]

00:07:54 ◼   ► that pulled me into it but as i was [TS]

00:07:56 ◼   ► reading the book you know said that God [TS]

00:07:58 ◼   ► gave a good summary of like gypsy dude [TS]

00:08:01 ◼   ► big bad thing happens to the beginning [TS]

00:08:03 ◼   ► of the book everybody killed then his [TS]

00:08:05 ◼   ► you know down period where he's living [TS]

00:08:07 ◼   ► in the streets and stuff like that and [TS]

00:08:09 ◼   ► then sort of his rise up through the [TS]

00:08:10 ◼   ► university but as I was going through [TS]

00:08:12 ◼   ► the book in in ebook form i was looking [TS]

00:08:15 ◼   ► at the little progress meter to a [TS]

00:08:16 ◼   ► certain point I realized wait a second [TS]

00:08:17 ◼   ► there's no way they can wrap this up [TS]

00:08:20 ◼   ► like this is just gonna end I'm going [TS]

00:08:23 ◼   ► rapidly approaching the end of the book [TS]

00:08:24 ◼   ► and almost nothing has happened [TS]

00:08:26 ◼   ► how ya gonna get it is the first book in [TS]

00:08:29 ◼   ► the series so if that's not that big of [TS]

00:08:31 ◼   ► a deal but it kind of bothered me a [TS]

00:08:34 ◼   ► little bit and I was like well you know [TS]

00:08:35 ◼   ► just keep going to apply the rest of my [TS]

00:08:37 ◼   ► throat by the time i was done i had a [TS]

00:08:40 ◼   ► lot a lot of complaints about this book [TS]

00:08:42 ◼   ► and I couldn't believe people were [TS]

00:08:43 ◼   ► raving about it is it [TS]

00:08:44 ◼   ► because this great fantasy novel and [TS]

00:08:45 ◼   ► maybe that is hadn't read fast and I was [TS]

00:08:47 ◼   ► in a long time this is actually an [TS]

00:08:50 ◼   ► excellent example of the genre and I [TS]

00:08:52 ◼   ► just remember the other ones family [TS]

00:08:53 ◼   ► because I was a younger person when i [TS]

00:08:54 ◼   ► read them I don't know but before I go [TS]

00:08:56 ◼   ► through my list of things can you guys [TS]

00:08:58 ◼   ► think of anything about the book that [TS]

00:08:59 ◼   ► you didn't like what do you think I'm [TS]

00:09:00 ◼   ► gonna complain about besides that the [TS]

00:09:02 ◼   ► plot stuff that I just did [TS]

00:09:04 ◼   ► well I for one hit this is another so [TS]

00:09:06 ◼   ► what's included both is a I can't say [TS]

00:09:10 ◼   ► his name so i don't like that be [TS]

00:09:12 ◼   ► ah he's another one of these main [TS]

00:09:14 ◼   ► characters that is incredibly good at [TS]

00:09:16 ◼   ► everything right which I find a little [TS]

00:09:18 ◼   ► annoying everything he tried she like [TS]

00:09:20 ◼   ► the best flute player in the world that [TS]

00:09:23 ◼   ► he writes all these songs that everyone [TS]

00:09:25 ◼   ► knows and he's the best in this class at [TS]

00:09:27 ◼   ► everything and it gets to be a bit much [TS]

00:09:29 ◼   ► because he has all these these [TS]

00:09:31 ◼   ► challenges that are set before him right [TS]

00:09:33 ◼   ► but you know he's going to successfully [TS]

00:09:35 ◼   ► overcome them because he's the smartest [TS]

00:09:37 ◼   ► person in the book he's the most [TS]

00:09:38 ◼   ► talented freshmen in the book he has the [TS]

00:09:41 ◼   ► best voice in the book maybe a little [TS]

00:09:43 ◼   ► flaw here in there wasn't a lot i mean i [TS]

00:09:45 ◼   ► think i think baby at least i'll counter [TS]

00:09:47 ◼   ► that by saying that I think that any is [TS]

00:09:49 ◼   ► definitely true you know he's definitely [TS]

00:09:50 ◼   ► plays pictured as this character is [TS]

00:09:52 ◼   ► incredibly clever i like the times when [TS]

00:09:55 ◼   ► his cleverness doesn't do it for him and [TS]

00:09:58 ◼   ► he's like he's shown it like getting [TS]

00:10:00 ◼   ► ahead of himself I think there's a [TS]

00:10:02 ◼   ► couple of good examples one of which in [TS]

00:10:03 ◼   ► his sort of read his report a with this [TS]

00:10:06 ◼   ► he really wants to study under the guy [TS]

00:10:08 ◼   ► who who is the master of the more [TS]

00:10:10 ◼   ► esoteric naming magic who is a bit of a [TS]

00:10:13 ◼   ► was he's crazy I'll put it that way and [TS]

00:10:16 ◼   ► I think you know that guy in I guess [TS]

00:10:18 ◼   ► this comes more in the second book but [TS]

00:10:20 ◼   ► you know that is the sort of the one [TS]

00:10:22 ◼   ► thing that seems to elude him and I [TS]

00:10:25 ◼   ► think you know the it illuminates a part [TS]

00:10:28 ◼   ► of his character where he is not a very [TS]

00:10:30 ◼   ► he's he's smart but he lacks a bit of [TS]

00:10:33 ◼   ► common sense he's always doing things in [TS]

00:10:35 ◼   ► rushing in he's a bit impetuous and [TS]

00:10:38 ◼   ► sometimes they get him in trouble and i [TS]

00:10:39 ◼   ► think that's that's sort of what i like [TS]

00:10:41 ◼   ► about him is that he is as smart as he [TS]

00:10:43 ◼   ► is he is very often it seems too smart [TS]

00:10:46 ◼   ► for his own good but perhaps that's just [TS]

00:10:49 ◼   ► me [TS]

00:10:50 ◼   ► alright so that was on my list i could [TS]

00:10:52 ◼   ► expound on morning you guys covered the [TS]

00:10:54 ◼   ► basic points anything else [TS]

00:10:56 ◼   ► I let's see what else i didn't like the [TS]

00:10:58 ◼   ► look i don't know i understand all the [TS]

00:11:00 ◼   ► things that I i should say that I did in [TS]

00:11:02 ◼   ► fact enjoy the book was given before I [TS]

00:11:04 ◼   ► like John's got you on his side he sucks [TS]

00:11:07 ◼   ► you into the city you tonight as not too [TS]

00:11:09 ◼   ► hard to turn Scott to the negative side [TS]

00:11:11 ◼   ► it's true I am generally more [TS]

00:11:14 ◼   ► predisposed to not liking something so [TS]

00:11:17 ◼   ► the other thing i did not like is what's [TS]

00:11:19 ◼   ► the the character and Dina Dana whatever [TS]

00:11:22 ◼   ► has the the little love interest i found [TS]

00:11:25 ◼   ► that whole dynamic annoying i don't know [TS]

00:11:27 ◼   ► if you guys do remember but yeah so so i [TS]

00:11:30 ◼   ► guess i'm not entirely crazy because [TS]

00:11:31 ◼   ► that my two of my three pillars of [TS]

00:11:35 ◼   ► things that didn't like about this book [TS]

00:11:36 ◼   ► for one the plot but just when / where [TS]

00:11:38 ◼   ► that it didn't seem like it was going [TS]

00:11:39 ◼   ► anywhere especially since it had those [TS]

00:11:40 ◼   ► like side adventures with the Dragon and [TS]

00:11:43 ◼   ► he's often that town there's the [TS]

00:11:45 ◼   ► University section was like lots of [TS]

00:11:46 ◼   ► interconnected short stories but there [TS]

00:11:48 ◼   ► was no like overall arc and you can even [TS]

00:11:50 ◼   ► see like the beginning of an arc like [TS]

00:11:52 ◼   ► where it's going to go because it's the [TS]

00:11:53 ◼   ► framing stories so far down the road [TS]

00:11:55 ◼   ► from his various adventures [TS]

00:11:57 ◼   ► yeah that you just I can't connect the [TS]

00:11:59 ◼   ► dots yet maybe it's gonna be 20 book [TS]

00:12:00 ◼   ► series so in which case you know when [TS]

00:12:02 ◼   ► it's going to be a three-book series [TS]

00:12:04 ◼   ► will be dead by the time he finishes at [TS]

00:12:05 ◼   ► this right but that's so the character [TS]

00:12:08 ◼   ► is another thing you know that the Mary [TS]

00:12:10 ◼   ► Sue disease that he was that right on [TS]

00:12:12 ◼   ► the head he's good at everything every [TS]

00:12:15 ◼   ► woman he meets loves him [TS]

00:12:16 ◼   ► you know it is flawed yet it's more of [TS]

00:12:19 ◼   ► like it you know its laws that he's too [TS]

00:12:21 ◼   ► smart for his own good but i think that [TS]

00:12:23 ◼   ► that's not a great when you're an [TS]

00:12:24 ◼   ► interview and they say well what's your [TS]

00:12:26 ◼   ► greatest weakness I work too hard [TS]

00:12:28 ◼   ► sometimes I'm just too clever for my own [TS]

00:12:30 ◼   ► good [TS]

00:12:31 ◼   ► yeah yeah but the worst part the part [TS]

00:12:34 ◼   ► that gave me that the worst taste [TS]

00:12:36 ◼   ► throughout the entire book which it [TS]

00:12:38 ◼   ► still bothers me is the treatment of [TS]

00:12:40 ◼   ► women this book should really should [TS]

00:12:42 ◼   ► have a course and you know creative [TS]

00:12:43 ◼   ► writing courses of how not to write [TS]

00:12:45 ◼   ► women because women only exist in this [TS]

00:12:47 ◼   ► book as sexual objects and every time [TS]

00:12:52 ◼   ► they come on the scene they are [TS]

00:12:54 ◼   ► described in terms of their beauty and [TS]

00:12:56 ◼   ► attractiveness to the character and [TS]

00:12:58 ◼   ► that's the only value they add even as [TS]

00:13:00 ◼   ► this den a person or whatever she's [TS]

00:13:03 ◼   ► she's a horrible person there's nothing [TS]

00:13:04 ◼   ► to recommend her there's no reason he [TS]

00:13:06 ◼   ► should be a tractor and anyway but every [TS]

00:13:08 ◼   ► architects fellow-feeling or whatever [TS]

00:13:10 ◼   ► like any any female character Debbie [TS]

00:13:12 ◼   ► that the moneylender anytime they come [TS]

00:13:14 ◼   ► on the screen so to speak it there [TS]

00:13:16 ◼   ► immediately described in terms of how [TS]

00:13:17 ◼   ► attractive they are and very sexual [TS]

00:13:20 ◼   ► innuendo and if it was done in either an [TS]

00:13:23 ◼   ► omniscient narrator or first person from [TS]

00:13:26 ◼   ► the perspective of the young one [TS]

00:13:27 ◼   ► maybe you could excuse that because [TS]

00:13:29 ◼   ► that's like maybe 18 year old Sol have [TS]

00:13:30 ◼   ► AC women you know when you're that age [TS]

00:13:32 ◼   ► or however old you supposed to be but [TS]

00:13:33 ◼   ► it's being told by the older wiser one [TS]

00:13:35 ◼   ► he's the one relaying the tail as I [TS]

00:13:37 ◼   ► can't come up with any sort of rational [TS]

00:13:39 ◼   ► explanation for how horrible women are [TS]

00:13:41 ◼   ► treated in this book and it's just a [TS]

00:13:43 ◼   ► great sonmi and it's like if we can have [TS]

00:13:45 ◼   ► any women characters know they only [TS]

00:13:47 ◼   ► exist as pleasure centers and desire you [TS]

00:13:51 ◼   ► know tiny pinpoints of desire for the [TS]

00:13:54 ◼   ► male characters in the book and that [TS]

00:13:56 ◼   ► more than anything else just like it [TS]

00:13:58 ◼   ► bothers me immensely i don't know why I [TS]

00:14:00 ◼   ► bother maybe it was the same and all the [TS]

00:14:01 ◼   ► other fantasy books i read and i didn't [TS]

00:14:03 ◼   ► notice but I noticed that a lot in this [TS]

00:14:04 ◼   ► one [TS]

00:14:05 ◼   ► well that I mean that'sthat's a I think [TS]

00:14:07 ◼   ► that's very often a criticism of the [TS]

00:14:09 ◼   ► fantasy and science fiction genre in [TS]

00:14:11 ◼   ► general and you know there's obviously [TS]

00:14:13 ◼   ► could probably spend almost entire [TS]

00:14:15 ◼   ► podcast discussing why that's the case [TS]

00:14:17 ◼   ► but we won't dealt too much into scifi [TS]

00:14:20 ◼   ► find it less because sci-fi friends away [TS]

00:14:23 ◼   ► i think it really depends on the [TS]

00:14:24 ◼   ► you-know-what syfy reading but i think [TS]

00:14:26 ◼   ► that in the in the very like sort of [TS]

00:14:29 ◼   ► violence a traditional but like you know [TS]

00:14:31 ◼   ► that's one of the tropes I feel like of [TS]

00:14:33 ◼   ► science fiction and fantasy [TS]

00:14:35 ◼   ► well but then again that's problem [TS]

00:14:36 ◼   ► primarily a male-dominated field i was [TS]

00:14:39 ◼   ► gonna say like the most damning thing I [TS]

00:14:40 ◼   ► can say about the women in this book is [TS]

00:14:41 ◼   ► that talking has better women characters [TS]

00:14:43 ◼   ► he's got like three thousand facebook at [TS]

00:14:46 ◼   ► least his characters like least they [TS]

00:14:49 ◼   ► relate to the world and the other people [TS]

00:14:50 ◼   ► in the book as something other than [TS]

00:14:52 ◼   ► sexual objects they have their own [TS]

00:14:54 ◼   ► motivations their own feelings their own [TS]

00:14:56 ◼   ► you know agendas and every single one of [TS]

00:14:59 ◼   ► them isn't immediately described in [TS]

00:15:01 ◼   ► terms of how they are attracted to or a [TS]

00:15:03 ◼   ► track or you know drawn towards that the [TS]

00:15:05 ◼   ► male characters how the male characters [TS]

00:15:07 ◼   ► drawn to them now that and I don't want [TS]

00:15:10 ◼   ► to go on playing about this book saying [TS]

00:15:11 ◼   ► horrible Derek is obviously i'm reading [TS]

00:15:13 ◼   ► the sequel so it must be something to [TS]

00:15:14 ◼   ► recommend it [TS]

00:15:15 ◼   ► and i think the the set the interest of [TS]

00:15:18 ◼   ► the setting and the fact that the first [TS]

00:15:20 ◼   ► book didn't go anywhere makes me makes [TS]

00:15:22 ◼   ► me want to know where it's going like [TS]

00:15:23 ◼   ► because that they teased you know those [TS]

00:15:24 ◼   ► those evil guys who kill this whole [TS]

00:15:26 ◼   ► troop that if we don't know anything [TS]

00:15:27 ◼   ► about that we spent the whole first book [TS]

00:15:29 ◼   ► trying to study them but wasn't allowed [TS]

00:15:30 ◼   ► in the library for the whole book for a [TS]

00:15:32 ◼   ► name you know bad sitcom reasons if it [TS]

00:15:37 ◼   ► that's another thing with it right there [TS]

00:15:38 ◼   ► there are coincidences books that will [TS]

00:15:39 ◼   ► be clear its situations books will be [TS]

00:15:41 ◼   ► cleared up with just a simple [TS]

00:15:42 ◼   ► explanation but you know the master was [TS]

00:15:43 ◼   ► like nope don't want to hear about it [TS]

00:15:45 ◼   ► don't wanna hear about any of this yet [TS]

00:15:46 ◼   ► he gave youcandl no but I don't hear [TS]

00:15:48 ◼   ► about that all tough luck the rest of [TS]

00:15:49 ◼   ► the book you're not learn anything about [TS]

00:15:50 ◼   ► them so i guess what the way to book to [TS]

00:15:52 ◼   ► learn anything you know it [TS]

00:15:55 ◼   ► yeah so it [TS]

00:15:58 ◼   ► things like that are teased and and that [TS]

00:16:01 ◼   ► keeps me wondering like alright so maybe [TS]

00:16:02 ◼   ► he's got a really good idea about these [TS]

00:16:04 ◼   ► guys maybe the overall story is really [TS]

00:16:05 ◼   ► clever because I've learned so little [TS]

00:16:06 ◼   ► about it that I'm willing to go on so [TS]

00:16:09 ◼   ► i'll read the second book and still [TS]

00:16:11 ◼   ► nothing happens the end of the second [TS]

00:16:12 ◼   ► book i'll probably start to get [TS]

00:16:13 ◼   ► frustrated you will start to get [TS]

00:16:16 ◼   ► frustrated [TS]

00:16:16 ◼   ► yeah i mean the thing is that the fast [TS]

00:16:18 ◼   ► read like all these things that are [TS]

00:16:19 ◼   ► wrong with it [TS]

00:16:20 ◼   ► they are typical the fantasy genre and i [TS]

00:16:22 ◼   ► find that you know it's a fast read and [TS]

00:16:24 ◼   ► you don't have doesn't take too much [TS]

00:16:25 ◼   ► mental energy to read through it and [TS]

00:16:28 ◼   ► people like reading about these sort of [TS]

00:16:29 ◼   ► power fantasy books where the guy's [TS]

00:16:31 ◼   ► wonderful couldn't everything and he is [TS]

00:16:33 ◼   ► opposed by unfair forces of like the [TS]

00:16:35 ◼   ► rich guy picking on the poor guy or he [TS]

00:16:37 ◼   ► always needs money we can all relate to [TS]

00:16:39 ◼   ► that and you know but he's really clever [TS]

00:16:41 ◼   ► and good stuff so he overcomes it you [TS]

00:16:43 ◼   ► know it's it's a easy to digest story [TS]

00:16:46 ◼   ► they could probably made into an [TS]

00:16:47 ◼   ► interesting movie that would be easy to [TS]

00:16:49 ◼   ► digest but it's not it's not sort of an [TS]

00:16:51 ◼   ► adult sophisticate story I feel like [TS]

00:16:54 ◼   ► yeah i mean there there's certainly [TS]

00:16:56 ◼   ► something to be said that in that the [TS]

00:16:58 ◼   ► you know the plot the obstacles that he [TS]

00:17:00 ◼   ► faces are are fairly mundane it seems [TS]

00:17:03 ◼   ► like 4a for fantasy book for especially [TS]

00:17:05 ◼   ► for something would you know that [TS]

00:17:06 ◼   ► implies there is this grand scale I mean [TS]

00:17:09 ◼   ► yes you know there is the issue of his [TS]

00:17:10 ◼   ► family being killed but you know like [TS]

00:17:12 ◼   ► you said a lot of the wedding struggles [TS]

00:17:14 ◼   ► with his is like money problems and [TS]

00:17:16 ◼   ► being harassed by this guy at school [TS]

00:17:18 ◼   ► this is not a chasing that girl who [TS]

00:17:20 ◼   ► write worth chasing well which is none [TS]

00:17:22 ◼   ► of which is necessarily your typical [TS]

00:17:24 ◼   ► like you know fantasy right you know [TS]

00:17:26 ◼   ► they seem a lot more like teenage and of [TS]

00:17:28 ◼   ► course our character [TS]

00:17:29 ◼   ► he's also you know precociously young [TS]

00:17:30 ◼   ► right he's like like 16 or something [TS]

00:17:33 ◼   ► then things mixed in with that they have [TS]

00:17:35 ◼   ► that story that you hear about like that [TS]

00:17:37 ◼   ► the legendary backstory of these people [TS]

00:17:39 ◼   ► in the kings and that's like you know [TS]

00:17:40 ◼   ► that's fantasy book type stuff for he [TS]

00:17:42 ◼   ► talks all about you know that the king [TS]

00:17:45 ◼   ► who goes blind and the various deals [TS]

00:17:46 ◼   ► they made in the origin of these people [TS]

00:17:48 ◼   ► will kill that is just a hundred percent [TS]

00:17:49 ◼   ► hardcore epic fantasy but then you come [TS]

00:17:52 ◼   ► back as like that and it was just a [TS]

00:17:53 ◼   ► story so now i need to try to get some [TS]

00:17:55 ◼   ► more money [TS]

00:17:55 ◼   ► well and that is one of the things i did [TS]

00:17:58 ◼   ► enjoy about the book at least was those [TS]

00:17:59 ◼   ► layering of stories where you know like [TS]

00:18:02 ◼   ► i said we already have this framing [TS]

00:18:03 ◼   ► story in this guy relating a story and [TS]

00:18:05 ◼   ► then inside of that we often have [TS]

00:18:06 ◼   ► another layer of story that sort of [TS]

00:18:08 ◼   ► comes in there and I think you know [TS]

00:18:10 ◼   ► clearly rock this has an interest in [TS]

00:18:11 ◼   ► sort of delving into the lore of this [TS]

00:18:14 ◼   ► world that he's created in a lot of [TS]

00:18:16 ◼   ► times that's you know that's fun and [TS]

00:18:18 ◼   ► interesting you know sort of side trip [TS]

00:18:20 ◼   ► even if it is always tangential to the [TS]

00:18:22 ◼   ► story itself i'm curious i mean is there [TS]

00:18:25 ◼   ► anything in particular that stood out to [TS]

00:18:27 ◼   ► you as you know moments that you did [TS]

00:18:31 ◼   ► really enjoy John McHugh flip this on [TS]

00:18:33 ◼   ► your head is like there anything [TS]

00:18:34 ◼   ► particular tales yeah well yeah I had a [TS]

00:18:36 ◼   ► favorite scene that I should have [TS]

00:18:38 ◼   ► written down was thinking last night [TS]

00:18:40 ◼   ► angel was over [TS]

00:18:41 ◼   ► no i didn't i didn't like that I didn't [TS]

00:18:43 ◼   ► like that bookend thing where they were [TS]

00:18:44 ◼   ► there with a prologue and epilogue or [TS]

00:18:46 ◼   ► like the same except for a couple words [TS]

00:18:47 ◼   ► with little change in perspective I [TS]

00:18:49 ◼   ► don't think he pulled that off was my [TS]

00:18:52 ◼   ► favorite scene I that probably my [TS]

00:18:53 ◼   ► favorite scene was when he's on the [TS]

00:18:55 ◼   ► rooftop with the Loudoun or whatever his [TS]

00:18:56 ◼   ► name is and he's trying to you know get [TS]

00:18:58 ◼   ► them to come on board he tells me to [TS]

00:19:00 ◼   ► jump off the roof and he doesn't cuz i [TS]

00:19:03 ◼   ► got a chuckle out of that just because [TS]

00:19:04 ◼   ► that that's that's an example of why I [TS]

00:19:06 ◼   ► like this book because it it plays on [TS]

00:19:09 ◼   ► the on the conventions in any other [TS]

00:19:11 ◼   ► fantasy book you know he would have [TS]

00:19:12 ◼   ► jumped off and been caught in the air by [TS]

00:19:14 ◼   ► magic approved it's worth or not jumped [TS]

00:19:16 ◼   ► off and I guess what jumps off it like [TS]

00:19:17 ◼   ► breaks his legs or whatever happened to [TS]

00:19:19 ◼   ► my I remember it vaguely but that [TS]

00:19:21 ◼   ► interactions with him tend to not be as [TS]

00:19:26 ◼   ► stereotypical and and it is because that [TS]

00:19:28 ◼   ► situation which he doesn't have all the [TS]

00:19:30 ◼   ► answers I don't know what I still think [TS]

00:19:33 ◼   ► the character is so very Merry situation [TS]

00:19:35 ◼   ► i don't think this counts as a character [TS]

00:19:36 ◼   ► flaw but at least he has genuine [TS]

00:19:38 ◼   ► interactions in a situation where ma or [TS]

00:19:41 ◼   ► whatever saying that [TS]

00:19:42 ◼   ► the dramas were two characters one [TS]

00:19:44 ◼   ► character want something at the end of [TS]

00:19:45 ◼   ► the scene he doesn't get it [TS]

00:19:46 ◼   ► that's pretty much every scene between [TS]

00:19:48 ◼   ► growth and Ellen if I'm mispronouncing [TS]

00:19:50 ◼   ► both of those names so I enjoy all the [TS]

00:19:52 ◼   ► interactions and the roof seen in [TS]

00:19:54 ◼   ► particular with other yes i would have [TS]

00:19:56 ◼   ► said that was among my favorites too i [TS]

00:19:58 ◼   ► think another one of my another one that [TS]

00:20:01 ◼   ► I really enjoyed from the first book is [TS]

00:20:03 ◼   ► the the the first scene where he gets in [TS]

00:20:05 ◼   ► the first service team we have to prove [TS]

00:20:07 ◼   ► himself to be admitted to the University [TS]

00:20:09 ◼   ► any part of what i liked about that was [TS]

00:20:11 ◼   ► that you know yes he's very clever and [TS]

00:20:13 ◼   ► that's that's the scene where it [TS]

00:20:14 ◼   ► demonstrates again that is clever but i [TS]

00:20:16 ◼   ► think one of the other things i kinda [TS]

00:20:17 ◼   ► liked about that was that he also [TS]

00:20:19 ◼   ► there's a whole point made out of the [TS]

00:20:20 ◼   ► fact that he kind of cheats in that he [TS]

00:20:22 ◼   ► sits he sort of sneaks into this place [TS]

00:20:24 ◼   ► and and listen to everybody else's [TS]

00:20:26 ◼   ► questions to see what they're going to [TS]

00:20:28 ◼   ► ask before he does that and I think you [TS]

00:20:30 ◼   ► know to me that speaks to one of the [TS]

00:20:32 ◼   ► things that I that I like about quote [TS]

00:20:34 ◼   ► that is not necessarily just that he [TS]

00:20:35 ◼   ► says you know you so smart and clever [TS]

00:20:37 ◼   ► but he cheats right you know he tries to [TS]

00:20:40 ◼   ► figure out shortcuts and I think it's [TS]

00:20:42 ◼   ► one of those flaws that I that I kind of [TS]

00:20:44 ◼   ► liked about him that's his kobayashi [TS]

00:20:46 ◼   ► brew moment that says that's a street [TS]

00:20:49 ◼   ► urchin thing like that's that's the more [TS]

00:20:51 ◼   ► interesting part of this character [TS]

00:20:52 ◼   ► because he's insufferable when he's with [TS]

00:20:53 ◼   ► his family is like over wonderful [TS]

00:20:55 ◼   ► gypsies were artists and we all love art [TS]

00:20:57 ◼   ► and we're happy and my parents loved me [TS]

00:20:59 ◼   ► in there there you know these they're 20 [TS]

00:21:00 ◼   ► feet tall and towering above me and [TS]

00:21:02 ◼   ► giving me advice about it you know when [TS]

00:21:05 ◼   ► he goes through that experience living [TS]

00:21:06 ◼   ► on your pretty excited when they got [TS]

00:21:07 ◼   ► murdered huh yeah i got those guys are [TS]

00:21:11 ◼   ► dead the murder didn't hit me that much [TS]

00:21:12 ◼   ► because it's like they're just they're [TS]

00:21:15 ◼   ► visible problems characterization every [TS]

00:21:17 ◼   ► characteristic of the main characters [TS]

00:21:18 ◼   ► really cookie cutter like think about [TS]

00:21:19 ◼   ► his friends like sim and whoever the [TS]

00:21:22 ◼   ► friends and they're just there's nothing [TS]

00:21:24 ◼   ► to them they're they're barely [TS]

00:21:25 ◼   ► characters if you have to say what [TS]

00:21:27 ◼   ► distinguishes one of his friends from [TS]

00:21:28 ◼   ► the other and same thing with the girls [TS]

00:21:30 ◼   ► are just you know that this is not a lot [TS]

00:21:33 ◼   ► there in the same was true of his [TS]

00:21:34 ◼   ► parents so I didn't hit me that hard [TS]

00:21:35 ◼   ► when he died because i didn't buy into [TS]

00:21:37 ◼   ► the whole like I've analogous to the [TS]

00:21:39 ◼   ► seem real but when he's down and out and [TS]

00:21:41 ◼   ► as sort of a homeless kid and I go [TS]

00:21:43 ◼   ► through all those troubles and [TS]

00:21:44 ◼   ► everything that adds an aspect of his [TS]

00:21:46 ◼   ► character is more interesting i think we [TS]

00:21:47 ◼   ► should focus more on that if they want [TS]

00:21:50 ◼   ► to like you know enhances character [TS]

00:21:52 ◼   ► flaws and believable way that things [TS]

00:21:54 ◼   ► where he does things that [TS]

00:21:55 ◼   ► you know morally ambiguous it's you get [TS]

00:21:57 ◼   ► ahead and that seemingly doesn't regret [TS]

00:22:00 ◼   ► them you know and he does that he's [TS]

00:22:03 ◼   ► doing that in the second book now tell [TS]

00:22:04 ◼   ► me how to continue to do things that [TS]

00:22:06 ◼   ► aren't particularly heroic or Noble or [TS]

00:22:10 ◼   ► that his parents went to grow but it [TS]

00:22:11 ◼   ► isn't they don't seem to bother amount [TS]

00:22:12 ◼   ► of he's a sociopath or they're just not [TS]

00:22:14 ◼   ► just not very big on introspection you [TS]

00:22:16 ◼   ► know they want my dad think if he knew I [TS]

00:22:18 ◼   ► was cheating to get into the sea he [TS]

00:22:20 ◼   ► raised me so well and honorably or just [TS]

00:22:21 ◼   ► you know all gypsies sheets are Gypsy [TS]

00:22:23 ◼   ► listeners for the stairs at the risk of [TS]

00:22:26 ◼   ► you know making us sound like we [TS]

00:22:30 ◼   ► practiced all totally in the pit of not [TS]

00:22:33 ◼   ► liking things [TS]

00:22:34 ◼   ► well its got diseases or anything you [TS]

00:22:36 ◼   ► particularly that stood out to you that [TS]

00:22:37 ◼   ► you did like I know we talked a little [TS]

00:22:39 ◼   ► bit about what you didn't like well I'm [TS]

00:22:42 ◼   ► i did--like i read the book when it [TS]

00:22:45 ◼   ► first came out so i don't remember any [TS]

00:22:46 ◼   ► particular scenes but I did like the how [TS]

00:22:50 ◼   ► he goes about building his I mean this [TS]

00:22:52 ◼   ► is kind of a term tossed around in [TS]

00:22:54 ◼   ► science fiction and fantasy world [TS]

00:22:56 ◼   ► building right so i think that he does a [TS]

00:22:58 ◼   ► good job of I may not like the [TS]

00:23:00 ◼   ► characters but i think the world that he [TS]

00:23:02 ◼   ► puts them in is very interesting and he [TS]

00:23:05 ◼   ► does he built that world in such a way [TS]

00:23:07 ◼   ► of not really telling us about it my [TS]

00:23:10 ◼   ► kind of having his characters interact [TS]

00:23:11 ◼   ► in it and then you know telling stories [TS]

00:23:14 ◼   ► about the world and setting it up so you [TS]

00:23:15 ◼   ► don't really see much of the world [TS]

00:23:17 ◼   ► because you only see what could both is [TS]

00:23:20 ◼   ► is interacting with but you know there's [TS]

00:23:23 ◼   ► a lot more stuff out there and there are [TS]

00:23:25 ◼   ► kings and there are their stuff [TS]

00:23:27 ◼   ► happening that you don't really see so I [TS]

00:23:29 ◼   ► think that it makes the setting very [TS]

00:23:31 ◼   ► interesting to me i think that that is [TS]

00:23:33 ◼   ► you know and traditionally that's a big [TS]

00:23:35 ◼   ► part of fantasy right is world-building [TS]

00:23:36 ◼   ► that's why many of us read these these [TS]

00:23:39 ◼   ► fantasy books to sort of see what on [TS]

00:23:41 ◼   ► what other worlds that these writers can [TS]

00:23:43 ◼   ► put together [TS]

00:23:44 ◼   ► I you know I think that there's a lot I [TS]

00:23:48 ◼   ► mean despite John's misgivings I think [TS]

00:23:50 ◼   ► our are you know some of them are very [TS]

00:23:52 ◼   ► accurate i think there are there are [TS]

00:23:53 ◼   ► definitely shortcomings in the book and [TS]

00:23:55 ◼   ► I mean I'm going to get the Bible slacks [TS]

00:23:57 ◼   ► and seduces first book but you know you [TS]

00:23:59 ◼   ► know there's definitely room for [TS]

00:24:00 ◼   ► improvement and you know it's one of the [TS]

00:24:04 ◼   ► things I've been looking forward to [TS]

00:24:05 ◼   ► reading the second book for awhile i [TS]

00:24:06 ◼   ► came across this book first [TS]

00:24:08 ◼   ► actually the year it came out i think [TS]

00:24:10 ◼   ► because it was the onion AV club's like [TS]

00:24:14 ◼   ► Book of the Year like the best book they [TS]

00:24:16 ◼   ► read in 2007 see never how could that be [TS]

00:24:19 ◼   ► possible that's that's probably a lot of [TS]

00:24:21 ◼   ► what's happening here is the overhyping [TS]

00:24:22 ◼   ► like I read it after so many people that [TS]

00:24:24 ◼   ► said so many things about it so I was [TS]

00:24:26 ◼   ► really expecting something special and [TS]

00:24:27 ◼   ► you know for all the good things like if [TS]

00:24:30 ◼   ► I'd come in unknown on and i probably [TS]

00:24:31 ◼   ► would have been up on those bugs i [TS]

00:24:33 ◼   ► thought this book was gonna be another [TS]

00:24:34 ◼   ► garbage fantasy but actually had some [TS]

00:24:36 ◼   ► interesting things instead i'm coming [TS]

00:24:37 ◼   ► into it as this is the best fantasy book [TS]

00:24:40 ◼   ► in the past 10 years and every did say [TS]

00:24:41 ◼   ► no it's not [TS]

00:24:43 ◼   ► well i was thinking about that as I you [TS]

00:24:45 ◼   ► know we're prepared for this podcast I'm [TS]

00:24:47 ◼   ► i sat in a quiet room and just pondered [TS]

00:24:49 ◼   ► the book as I often do and I after I [TS]

00:24:52 ◼   ► finished reading it I thought to myself [TS]

00:24:54 ◼   ► I remember thinking very clearly this is [TS]

00:24:56 ◼   ► unlike any fantasy book i have ever read [TS]

00:24:58 ◼   ► you think it's unlike unlevel that's [TS]

00:25:01 ◼   ► what I after i read it that's what I [TS]

00:25:03 ◼   ► thought but then through the years and [TS]

00:25:05 ◼   ► thinking about what happened in the book [TS]

00:25:06 ◼   ► I thought to myself this is pretty much [TS]

00:25:09 ◼   ► what fantasy books are starting to shine [TS]

00:25:12 ◼   ► think about because I mean the story is [TS]

00:25:14 ◼   ► very traditional right you know it's a [TS]

00:25:17 ◼   ► guy who overcomes lot of challenges and [TS]

00:25:19 ◼   ► becomes this legend but i think the [TS]

00:25:22 ◼   ► interesting part of it and i don't know [TS]

00:25:24 ◼   ► if this happens in the first book but so [TS]

00:25:26 ◼   ► it definitely in the second book he kind [TS]

00:25:28 ◼   ► of in the the book and a story he [TS]

00:25:32 ◼   ► relates how he kind of he himself during [TS]

00:25:36 ◼   ► when he was a kid created these legends [TS]

00:25:38 ◼   ► about himself that you then here later [TS]

00:25:40 ◼   ► on so like you know he started spreading [TS]

00:25:42 ◼   ► the rumors about you know the various [TS]

00:25:44 ◼   ► powers that he had that he didn't really [TS]

00:25:45 ◼   ► have but he just kind of planted those [TS]

00:25:48 ◼   ► stories and well yea yea that there's a [TS]

00:25:50 ◼   ► really good scene in the first book that [TS]

00:25:52 ◼   ► I quite liked where's the he gets [TS]

00:25:54 ◼   ► punished for doing something at the [TS]

00:25:55 ◼   ► University and he gets whipped and he [TS]

00:25:58 ◼   ► makes a point of taking this you know [TS]

00:26:01 ◼   ► drug or whatever that will prevent him [TS]

00:26:03 ◼   ► from bleeding so he doesn't you know it [TS]

00:26:07 ◼   ► has included so essentially is a point [TS]

00:26:09 ◼   ► of not showing weakness is the way that [TS]

00:26:10 ◼   ► he sees it and so that sort of urns in [TS]

00:26:13 ◼   ► this code both the Bloodless about that [TS]

00:26:16 ◼   ► that's you know then becomes a larger [TS]

00:26:19 ◼   ► part of this legend like all you know is [TS]

00:26:20 ◼   ► new here [TS]

00:26:21 ◼   ► that he doesn't he doesn't bleed and [TS]

00:26:23 ◼   ► that's kinda one of the fun parts of [TS]

00:26:25 ◼   ► this is that in this framing story he's [TS]

00:26:27 ◼   ► an innkeeper having sort of resigned [TS]

00:26:29 ◼   ► from this life of heroism and yet all [TS]

00:26:32 ◼   ► the people come into the in know the [TS]

00:26:34 ◼   ► legendary figure they don't know that [TS]

00:26:36 ◼   ► that the innkeeper is the legendary [TS]

00:26:38 ◼   ► figure but they'll be telling stories [TS]

00:26:40 ◼   ► about him and you'll see the as the [TS]

00:26:41 ◼   ► story progresses as the story that we [TS]

00:26:43 ◼   ► hear from clothes progresses you'll [TS]

00:26:45 ◼   ► start to recognize like the stories that [TS]

00:26:48 ◼   ► the the people in the indoor telling [TS]

00:26:50 ◼   ► about clothes this legendary figure you [TS]

00:26:53 ◼   ► start to see the seeds of that in the [TS]

00:26:54 ◼   ► story that that were sort of getting the [TS]

00:26:56 ◼   ► real story but they're totally blown out [TS]

00:26:58 ◼   ► of proportion which is I think one of [TS]

00:26:59 ◼   ► the things I liked about it like there's [TS]

00:27:01 ◼   ► if there's definitely a strong element [TS]

00:27:03 ◼   ► of like what storytelling is and and [TS]

00:27:06 ◼   ► making you know what exactly a legend is [TS]

00:27:09 ◼   ► right and i think that was my my [TS]

00:27:11 ◼   ► favorite part of the book and that's [TS]

00:27:13 ◼   ► what I think made it so unique because [TS]

00:27:15 ◼   ► you know the story is pretty much a [TS]

00:27:17 ◼   ► fantasy story the magic system is [TS]

00:27:20 ◼   ► different than a lot of other stuff but [TS]

00:27:21 ◼   ► I mean the overall arc in the characters [TS]

00:27:23 ◼   ► kind of there's nothing too [TS]

00:27:25 ◼   ► extraordinary about them or i should say [TS]

00:27:28 ◼   ► nothing to stand out about them but i [TS]

00:27:30 ◼   ► think that the whole like like Dan said [TS]

00:27:32 ◼   ► the whole you know telling a story about [TS]

00:27:33 ◼   ► storytelling is is interesting i started [TS]

00:27:37 ◼   ► off two minds on the framing saying [TS]

00:27:39 ◼   ► because on the one hand i almost think [TS]

00:27:41 ◼   ► especially in the first book that if the [TS]

00:27:43 ◼   ► series that started straight where I was [TS]

00:27:45 ◼   ► third pressure on mission narrator no [TS]

00:27:48 ◼   ► framing story start with the kid who's a [TS]

00:27:50 ◼   ► gypsy and just gone through the story in [TS]

00:27:53 ◼   ► the linear fashion like that and then [TS]

00:27:55 ◼   ► ended i guess in the same spot for after [TS]

00:27:57 ◼   ► finding out nothing new about these [TS]

00:27:59 ◼   ► people and saving in town from a dragon [TS]

00:28:01 ◼   ► you know you'd be like it would would [TS]

00:28:03 ◼   ► read more like like the first harry [TS]

00:28:05 ◼   ► potter book cord where it's like [TS]

00:28:07 ◼   ► discovering the world and what you might [TS]

00:28:10 ◼   ► do in it and a little bit of adventure [TS]

00:28:13 ◼   ► and stuff like that but nothing that big [TS]

00:28:14 ◼   ► apple's book because I thought there was [TS]

00:28:17 ◼   ► so little of the framing story it was [TS]

00:28:18 ◼   ► just it was like almost like a [TS]

00:28:20 ◼   ► distraction I could come back to and [TS]

00:28:21 ◼   ► have that argument between a vast and [TS]

00:28:23 ◼   ► the chronicler and like I felt like that [TS]

00:28:25 ◼   ► was just wasting time but on the other [TS]

00:28:26 ◼   ► hand since the frame story is there and [TS]

00:28:28 ◼   ► we know he ends up its asset innkeeper [TS]

00:28:30 ◼   ► dude i hope that in the later books they [TS]

00:28:33 ◼   ► don't [TS]

00:28:34 ◼   ► and maybe in a second most men don't [TS]

00:28:35 ◼   ► pull punches and it's not just that he [TS]

00:28:37 ◼   ► retired from heroism but that he ended [TS]

00:28:40 ◼   ► up doing some really bad things because [TS]

00:28:43 ◼   ► that will add a lot of interest to the [TS]

00:28:44 ◼   ► character I think I don't want to see [TS]

00:28:46 ◼   ► like that he did heroic stuffin even [TS]

00:28:48 ◼   ► know didn't turn out the way he wanted [TS]

00:28:49 ◼   ► he always had the best intentions I want [TS]

00:28:51 ◼   ► to see him you know either become mad [TS]

00:28:53 ◼   ► with power or make some really bad moves [TS]

00:28:56 ◼   ► or do something out of jealousy or just [TS]

00:28:57 ◼   ► basically mess things opportunity [TS]

00:28:59 ◼   ► already you know imply that has caused [TS]

00:29:01 ◼   ► this big war that sort of in the [TS]

00:29:02 ◼   ► background or whatever I want to see him [TS]

00:29:03 ◼   ► do bad things I'm sort of downfall [TS]

00:29:06 ◼   ► you know I don't want to see him try to [TS]

00:29:08 ◼   ► be the earth throughout the whole thing [TS]

00:29:09 ◼   ► just like he tries to be in the first [TS]

00:29:11 ◼   ► book and just like Oh through bed [TS]

00:29:12 ◼   ► coincidences and mean people doing mean [TS]

00:29:14 ◼   ► things to me [TS]

00:29:16 ◼   ► things didn't turn out that well I want [TS]

00:29:18 ◼   ► to see some serious you know that [TS]

00:29:21 ◼   ► emotional wrenching problems happen to [TS]

00:29:24 ◼   ► him and the frame started kind of [TS]

00:29:26 ◼   ► promises that so I have my fingers [TS]

00:29:27 ◼   ► crossed CC when I think that's what the [TS]

00:29:29 ◼   ► the framing story really kind of [TS]

00:29:31 ◼   ► separates and elevates this book from [TS]

00:29:34 ◼   ► the heart which I I despise harry potter [TS]

00:29:36 ◼   ► so I never read them always in the [TS]

00:29:39 ◼   ► movies but i haven't read them for I was [TS]

00:29:41 ◼   ► the I was the only one on the harry [TS]

00:29:42 ◼   ► potter podcast here is that whatever you [TS]

00:29:45 ◼   ► and I i don't i don't care for it so i [TS]

00:29:47 ◼   ► have only read the first one everyone [TS]

00:29:49 ◼   ► says oh they get so much better and if I [TS]

00:29:50 ◼   ► don't like the first one I'm not reading [TS]

00:29:52 ◼   ► 6 more [TS]

00:29:52 ◼   ► I'm sorry but anyway so i think that [TS]

00:29:54 ◼   ► that framing story really kind of it may [TS]

00:29:57 ◼   ► be a trick like a writer trick but I [TS]

00:29:59 ◼   ► don't think it's going to get really [TS]

00:30:00 ◼   ► elevates the whole thing and because you [TS]

00:30:03 ◼   ► know how the story is going to end it [TS]

00:30:05 ◼   ► really makes the story which is kind of [TS]

00:30:08 ◼   ► running the middle story much more [TS]

00:30:10 ◼   ► interesting for sure like what how does [TS]

00:30:11 ◼   ► he get from from this little kid who you [TS]

00:30:14 ◼   ► know is great and everything to this [TS]

00:30:16 ◼   ► innkeeper who is kind of you know [TS]

00:30:17 ◼   ► seemingly washed up or is he hiding out [TS]

00:30:20 ◼   ► or what's going on with it and you don't [TS]

00:30:22 ◼   ► find out he's so cautious about laying [TS]

00:30:24 ◼   ► out details I worry about Dark Tower [TS]

00:30:27 ◼   ► disease the first Dark Tower had a [TS]

00:30:29 ◼   ► little bit of that to where it's really [TS]

00:30:30 ◼   ► interesting word you want a world and [TS]

00:30:32 ◼   ► you want to know more about it but they [TS]

00:30:33 ◼   ► tell you almost nothing so it's a very [TS]

00:30:36 ◼   ► removed it's a big big tease and it [TS]

00:30:39 ◼   ► leaves you wanting more but then then [TS]

00:30:40 ◼   ► you've got to pay off eventually you [TS]

00:30:42 ◼   ► know in the seven books you have to tell [TS]

00:30:44 ◼   ► something about this world and that's [TS]

00:30:45 ◼   ► the harder part so in the first one it [TS]

00:30:46 ◼   ► is [TS]

00:30:47 ◼   ► have a little bit easier to say we're [TS]

00:30:49 ◼   ► gonna have this framing story and we [TS]

00:30:50 ◼   ► know something happens to my hands up [TS]

00:30:51 ◼   ► here but we're not even going to tell [TS]

00:30:53 ◼   ► you what we're not even gonna tell you [TS]

00:30:54 ◼   ► whether he's like he's like you don't [TS]

00:30:56 ◼   ► know if he's hiding because people are [TS]

00:30:57 ◼   ► trying to do something bad to do [TS]

00:30:59 ◼   ► something good did he just give up we [TS]

00:31:01 ◼   ► don't know what happened to him only [TS]

00:31:02 ◼   ► thing we know is that he lives through [TS]

00:31:04 ◼   ► well we get the impression from the end [TS]

00:31:07 ◼   ► of the first the end of the frame store [TS]

00:31:10 ◼   ► from the first book that he can't do [TS]

00:31:12 ◼   ► magic anymore but yeah that's exactly [TS]

00:31:15 ◼   ► the body because he's depressed [TS]

00:31:17 ◼   ► I hope it's because you can ever imagine [TS]

00:31:19 ◼   ► he was lying the whole time and [TS]

00:31:20 ◼   ► unreliable narrator well hey I mean [TS]

00:31:23 ◼   ► that's that might be you know that would [TS]

00:31:25 ◼   ► that would be arguably very [TS]

00:31:27 ◼   ► disappointing in some ways but also very [TS]

00:31:28 ◼   ► interesting another way because we do [TS]

00:31:30 ◼   ► get this whole thing through his [TS]

00:31:31 ◼   ► perspective like there's and clearly [TS]

00:31:33 ◼   ► he's a good storyteller [TS]

00:31:34 ◼   ► so you know what if he is he claims he [TS]

00:31:37 ◼   ► is not you know embellishing it but what [TS]

00:31:39 ◼   ► if he was you know like that would be an [TS]

00:31:40 ◼   ► interesting understand this in this [TS]

00:31:43 ◼   ► world i mean if in the University magic [TS]

00:31:45 ◼   ► is kind of commonplace but once you [TS]

00:31:46 ◼   ► leave even like I looks it feels like [TS]

00:31:48 ◼   ► you walk like three steps from the [TS]

00:31:50 ◼   ► University and everyone has never heard [TS]

00:31:52 ◼   ► of magic so if you can accuse you of [TS]

00:31:54 ◼   ► consorting with demons 10 letters and I [TS]

00:31:56 ◼   ► liked how they mix it with technology [TS]

00:31:58 ◼   ► because like it's it is magic and then [TS]

00:32:00 ◼   ► there's this other thing which is their [TS]

00:32:02 ◼   ► equivalent of technology and and people [TS]

00:32:05 ◼   ► haven't heard of it because they're you [TS]

00:32:06 ◼   ► know the same way farmers have been her [TS]

00:32:07 ◼   ► transistor radios when it first appeared [TS]

00:32:09 ◼   ► but like the second book now this is a [TS]

00:32:11 ◼   ► spoiler but someone's gotta love a [TS]

00:32:12 ◼   ► refrigerator [TS]

00:32:13 ◼   ► basically it's made from these two [TS]

00:32:15 ◼   ► little magic more or less strips of [TS]

00:32:19 ◼   ► metal but it's just a refrigerator and [TS]

00:32:21 ◼   ► it's it's just as magical to him as as a [TS]

00:32:24 ◼   ► real fridge would be and that's like [TS]

00:32:26 ◼   ► that's that's the one side of the [TS]

00:32:28 ◼   ► technology that's it's boring like [TS]

00:32:30 ◼   ► people like all you got one of those [TS]

00:32:31 ◼   ► magic refrigerated likes not you know [TS]

00:32:33 ◼   ► it's not that interesting vs naming the [TS]

00:32:35 ◼   ► wind John where you were you were you [TS]

00:32:37 ◼   ► disappointed when it turned out he was [TS]

00:32:39 ◼   ► also you know like an excellent fridge [TS]

00:32:41 ◼   ► repair man at a certain point you just [TS]

00:32:43 ◼   ► assume it's going to be good at [TS]

00:32:44 ◼   ► everything he is going to the University [TS]

00:32:46 ◼   ► but it may seem so easy just right stuff [TS]

00:32:49 ◼   ► on little pieces yeah but that's totally [TS]

00:32:51 ◼   ► different than the that that's there and [TS]

00:32:54 ◼   ► that has like you know you get three [TS]

00:32:55 ◼   ► steps outside no one's even heard that [TS]

00:32:56 ◼   ► is like sympathy lights wow it's magic [TS]

00:32:58 ◼   ► but the real magic is still as far as [TS]

00:33:01 ◼   ► far along as I am in the second book [TS]

00:33:03 ◼   ► still very mysterious and very powerful [TS]

00:33:04 ◼   ► and very scary even within the [TS]

00:33:06 ◼   ► university it's not like Harry Potter [TS]

00:33:07 ◼   ► weather like [TS]

00:33:08 ◼   ► now kids raised you want we're going to [TS]

00:33:10 ◼   ► learn now even within the university [TS]

00:33:12 ◼   ► it's kind of hard corn and that's why [TS]

00:33:13 ◼   ► everyone respect the crazy professor guy [TS]

00:33:15 ◼   ► because he's the one guy who's the [TS]

00:33:17 ◼   ► professor of that real magic stuff and [TS]

00:33:19 ◼   ► the other guys it more like a scientist [TS]

00:33:21 ◼   ► my professors in actual University who [TS]

00:33:23 ◼   ► do one respects just just like an actual [TS]

00:33:27 ◼   ► university exactly where that I can hit [TS]

00:33:29 ◼   ► someone's got at once killings got that [TS]

00:33:31 ◼   ► shop for people are building things like [TS]

00:33:33 ◼   ► woodshop class is dangerous chemicals [TS]

00:33:35 ◼   ► it's basically science without having to [TS]

00:33:37 ◼   ► worry about it being science that's true [TS]

00:33:39 ◼   ► it's much more you know work a day [TS]

00:33:41 ◼   ► metric is this very interested [TS]

00:33:43 ◼   ► the magic of engineering yeah and and I [TS]

00:33:45 ◼   ► think that's my favorite part of the [TS]

00:33:46 ◼   ► whole thing is that split between [TS]

00:33:48 ◼   ► technology magic and magic magic and [TS]

00:33:51 ◼   ► especially since the stories they tell [TS]

00:33:53 ◼   ► of like long ago and the people who are [TS]

00:33:55 ◼   ► demons and the deals they make and the [TS]

00:33:57 ◼   ► magic magic like even within this world [TS]

00:34:00 ◼   ► with this kind of magic technology is [TS]

00:34:02 ◼   ► creeping up they still have these [TS]

00:34:02 ◼   ► amazing tales of when there was real [TS]

00:34:04 ◼   ► magic let me tell you kids and it wasn't [TS]

00:34:06 ◼   ► this stuff for we write little ruins on [TS]

00:34:09 ◼   ► pieces of metal make it hot no let me [TS]

00:34:10 ◼   ► tell you it was real magic and the few [TS]

00:34:13 ◼   ► hints of that I get with him calling the [TS]

00:34:15 ◼   ► wind and the let that legend that whole [TS]

00:34:17 ◼   ► thing I think ties the first book [TS]

00:34:18 ◼   ► together because lord knows the plot [TS]

00:34:20 ◼   ► doesn't tied together in fact that it's [TS]

00:34:22 ◼   ► the fact that it's called the name of [TS]

00:34:23 ◼   ► the wind and the real magic is is sort [TS]

00:34:26 ◼   ► of going to be at the heart of his [TS]

00:34:28 ◼   ► journey to power and that he you know [TS]

00:34:30 ◼   ► here is about in the beginning and does [TS]

00:34:32 ◼   ► it at the end that ties it together and [TS]

00:34:34 ◼   ► makes it sort of a book for me [TS]

00:34:36 ◼   ► well then and there are a lot of things [TS]

00:34:38 ◼   ► that are hinted at and you know I kind [TS]

00:34:39 ◼   ► of I don't know I i find myself a little [TS]

00:34:43 ◼   ► surprise I know Scotty much as before [TS]

00:34:44 ◼   ► that it's you know sort of envision that [TS]

00:34:47 ◼   ► say peers as a three-book series but it [TS]

00:34:50 ◼   ► seems like and again I'm only halfway [TS]

00:34:52 ◼   ► through the second book seems like [TS]

00:34:53 ◼   ► there's a lot more material in here that [TS]

00:34:55 ◼   ► then that's gonna fit in three books [TS]

00:34:57 ◼   ► right yeah i mean i finished the the [TS]

00:34:59 ◼   ► second book and I don't I if the third [TS]

00:35:01 ◼   ► book is going to be maybe forty eight [TS]

00:35:03 ◼   ► hundred pages long [TS]

00:35:04 ◼   ► maybe I don't know because there's a lot [TS]

00:35:05 ◼   ► of other words facing right that's like [TS]

00:35:07 ◼   ► the first one I said I kept reading and [TS]

00:35:09 ◼   ► reading gone dude you're not gonna [TS]

00:35:10 ◼   ► finish let me tell you like he's using [TS]

00:35:12 ◼   ► you're not going to finish it at the [TS]

00:35:13 ◼   ► University what's gonna happen is you [TS]

00:35:15 ◼   ► can discover anything about these people [TS]

00:35:16 ◼   ► his whole mission of the first ones i [TS]

00:35:17 ◼   ► gotta find out about these people will [TS]

00:35:18 ◼   ► kill my parents [TS]

00:35:19 ◼   ► you don't have enough pages left dude [TS]

00:35:21 ◼   ► you're not gonna find anything out so i [TS]

00:35:22 ◼   ► guess you chase after dragon for a while [TS]

00:35:24 ◼   ► addressing dragon and then we'll end the [TS]

00:35:26 ◼   ► book The End call the wind en su but I i [TS]

00:35:31 ◼   ► have i have trouble following like the [TS]

00:35:33 ◼   ► chronology so i read a blog post about [TS]

00:35:35 ◼   ► this where someone said that in the the [TS]

00:35:37 ◼   ► innkeep like in his innkeeper in the the [TS]

00:35:39 ◼   ► bookend thing they think he's like 30 [TS]

00:35:42 ◼   ► years old and I imagine too much older [TS]

00:35:44 ◼   ► than that I don't need and I thought it [TS]

00:35:45 ◼   ► was like 60 yeah I think he's now I [TS]

00:35:48 ◼   ► think I mean that they're kind of big [TS]

00:35:49 ◼   ► about it you know that but people come [TS]

00:35:52 ◼   ► into the inner kind of vague about a [TS]

00:35:53 ◼   ► little one of them doesn't you know I [TS]

00:35:55 ◼   ► lose some points to him being can't be [TS]

00:35:58 ◼   ► that old you know basically I mean of [TS]

00:35:59 ◼   ► course the story we're getting from him [TS]

00:36:00 ◼   ► is he's like 16 and so you know by that [TS]

00:36:04 ◼   ► point I guess you know 30 might be [TS]

00:36:05 ◼   ► really old and fantasy world where four [TS]

00:36:07 ◼   ► people seem to die pretty on your way to [TS]

00:36:09 ◼   ► get noticed that he walked like an old [TS]

00:36:11 ◼   ► man but looks like a young man like he [TS]

00:36:12 ◼   ► moves like one of the comments one of [TS]

00:36:14 ◼   ► the people who have the first or second [TS]

00:36:15 ◼   ► book was that you move like an old man [TS]

00:36:17 ◼   ► but you look like a young man and then [TS]

00:36:18 ◼   ► you don't have life expectancy was 40 [TS]

00:36:20 ◼   ► maybe he is getting on in years I i [TS]

00:36:22 ◼   ► don't think the time gap is that [TS]

00:36:24 ◼   ► important but it's kind of like this [TS]

00:36:25 ◼   ► bothers me about Star Wars a little bit [TS]

00:36:27 ◼   ► too and that within a single generation [TS]

00:36:28 ◼   ► people like Jedi who is that and you [TS]

00:36:31 ◼   ► know just previously 10 years ago there [TS]

00:36:33 ◼   ► are swarming all over every planet solve [TS]

00:36:35 ◼   ► everybody's problems like I never heard [TS]

00:36:36 ◼   ► a Jedi don't believe in the force was [TS]

00:36:38 ◼   ► ever you know you believe in the force [TS]

00:36:40 ◼   ► of their Jedi all over the place just 10 [TS]

00:36:42 ◼   ► years ago you know people don't forget [TS]

00:36:44 ◼   ► that soon so if this guy did all these [TS]

00:36:45 ◼   ► amazing exploits and cause all these big [TS]

00:36:47 ◼   ► problems in like the past five or ten [TS]

00:36:49 ◼   ► years [TS]

00:36:50 ◼   ► well yeah I mean you picture it if [TS]

00:36:52 ◼   ► you're picturing him as a legend in [TS]

00:36:54 ◼   ► terms of like you know shrouded in the [TS]

00:36:56 ◼   ► mists of time or whatever there's [TS]

00:36:57 ◼   ► definitely seems like there needs to be [TS]

00:36:59 ◼   ► time for that to sink in [TS]

00:37:01 ◼   ► unless you just a legend in this one [TS]

00:37:02 ◼   ► little town plus the university town [TS]

00:37:03 ◼   ► legend in his own mind that that's the [TS]

00:37:07 ◼   ► stuff stuff to work out especially since [TS]

00:37:09 ◼   ► this guy seems to suggest pages come out [TS]

00:37:11 ◼   ► of him but he doesn't make progress [TS]

00:37:12 ◼   ► maybe group does not planted that well [TS]

00:37:15 ◼   ► and he's gonna I don't know if you have [TS]

00:37:17 ◼   ► the time lines all worked out but i [TS]

00:37:19 ◼   ► would think after working on the first [TS]

00:37:20 ◼   ► book for seven years or something he [TS]

00:37:22 ◼   ► should take the time to do a little time [TS]

00:37:24 ◼   ► line chart and figure out okay [TS]

00:37:26 ◼   ► he's this old this point I gotta get do [TS]

00:37:27 ◼   ► all these events happened to happen [TS]

00:37:29 ◼   ► between here and now it doesn't make [TS]

00:37:30 ◼   ► sense for the townspeople like not to [TS]

00:37:32 ◼   ► wreck another to have photography and [TS]

00:37:33 ◼   ► stuff but he's a guy with the red hair [TS]

00:37:35 ◼   ► and I don't know that if it seems like [TS]

00:37:39 ◼   ► hiding by weight and second red hair [TS]

00:37:43 ◼   ► didn't like dryer and put on the glasses [TS]

00:37:44 ◼   ► and it's like you know Superman where [TS]

00:37:46 ◼   ► did you go this just this guy here with [TS]

00:37:48 ◼   ► glasses well and there's actually [TS]

00:37:49 ◼   ► there's a there's a funny scene in the [TS]

00:37:52 ◼   ► second book where he tries to convince [TS]

00:37:53 ◼   ► one of the one of the NTSA i just got [TS]

00:37:56 ◼   ► through that scene [TS]

00:37:57 ◼   ► yeah and I felt like it was not possible [TS]

00:37:59 ◼   ► that he couldn't convince them of that [TS]

00:38:00 ◼   ► but I mean I don't know I i agree [TS]

00:38:03 ◼   ► because I think there's something II and [TS]

00:38:05 ◼   ► you know maybe that's still to be borne [TS]

00:38:06 ◼   ► out by by the rest of the story but i [TS]

00:38:08 ◼   ► think there is something like you know [TS]

00:38:09 ◼   ► if somebody walks up to you and tells [TS]

00:38:11 ◼   ► them tells you that they're like Merlin [TS]

00:38:13 ◼   ► or whatever like it you know even if [TS]

00:38:14 ◼   ► they got a long white beard and they [TS]

00:38:16 ◼   ► seem to look like you know wizard you [TS]

00:38:18 ◼   ► probably going to be a little bit [TS]

00:38:20 ◼   ► skeptical i met Merlin just the other [TS]

00:38:23 ◼   ► day and let me tell you meet a lot of [TS]

00:38:25 ◼   ► interesting people until they did you [TS]

00:38:26 ◼   ► tell you it was magic everywhere but [TS]

00:38:29 ◼   ► these people believe in magic though [TS]

00:38:30 ◼   ► it's not the same as Maryland it would [TS]

00:38:32 ◼   ► be like someone who looks just like [TS]

00:38:33 ◼   ► Robert Downey jr. but looked a little [TS]

00:38:35 ◼   ► bit scruffy here came up to you and said [TS]

00:38:37 ◼   ► no seriously i'm robert downey jr and [TS]

00:38:39 ◼   ► you like get out of here and then you [TS]

00:38:40 ◼   ► look at him close and you feel like yeah [TS]

00:38:42 ◼   ► I guess you want well and then I think [TS]

00:38:44 ◼   ► there is some question of the depth like [TS]

00:38:46 ◼   ► the definition of the world of the [TS]

00:38:48 ◼   ► framing story right because there is [TS]

00:38:50 ◼   ► there is the there's that encounter at [TS]

00:38:53 ◼   ► the end of the book where there's this [TS]

00:38:54 ◼   ► guy is basically like a demon possesses [TS]

00:38:57 ◼   ► some guy and patron you know comes into [TS]

00:39:00 ◼   ► the inn [TS]

00:39:00 ◼   ► and they're all trying to stop him but [TS]

00:39:02 ◼   ► none of them quite believe that it is in [TS]

00:39:04 ◼   ► fact a demon until after they gave you [TS]

00:39:07 ◼   ► know tried to kill it in several ways [TS]

00:39:08 ◼   ► and have failed [TS]

00:39:10 ◼   ► I mean I think it's in there is a [TS]

00:39:12 ◼   ► suggestion that that that is uncommon [TS]

00:39:14 ◼   ► but you're right that there's there's we [TS]

00:39:17 ◼   ► don't necessarily have a clear picture [TS]

00:39:18 ◼   ► of how the world in that in that future [TS]

00:39:20 ◼   ► or in presence i guess from the framing [TS]

00:39:23 ◼   ► story like how commonplace all these [TS]

00:39:25 ◼   ► things are and then they are kind of in [TS]

00:39:27 ◼   ► a backwater town or even though they [TS]

00:39:29 ◼   ► they talk about the legend stuff like [TS]

00:39:31 ◼   ► they're not sophisticated people the [TS]

00:39:33 ◼   ► chronicler is more of a sophisticated [TS]

00:39:34 ◼   ► person and is you know and it's very [TS]

00:39:36 ◼   ► friend of the two of them are more [TS]

00:39:39 ◼   ► worldly and know about these things with [TS]

00:39:41 ◼   ► the town spoke just seemed to not know [TS]

00:39:43 ◼   ► about anything [TS]

00:39:43 ◼   ► another thing I liked about the the [TS]

00:39:45 ◼   ► technology angles that the demons you [TS]

00:39:47 ◼   ► kill them with iron some sort of [TS]

00:39:49 ◼   ► allegory about technology and systems [TS]

00:39:51 ◼   ► and superstition or maybe just reading [TS]

00:39:52 ◼   ► too much into it well that's that's a [TS]

00:39:54 ◼   ► that's a classic it's a classic sort of [TS]

00:39:56 ◼   ► truck that goes back i think even to [TS]

00:39:57 ◼   ► fairy tales cold iron is usually [TS]

00:40:01 ◼   ► considered I think Shakespeare lose that [TS]

00:40:03 ◼   ► like there's a there's a scene in like [TS]

00:40:05 ◼   ► midsummer night's dream or something I [TS]

00:40:06 ◼   ► think so nice piece of Lord though they [TS]

00:40:08 ◼   ► had good scenes without like strapping [TS]

00:40:09 ◼   ► him to the big iron wheel and putting [TS]

00:40:11 ◼   ► the pit and everything all that stuff [TS]

00:40:12 ◼   ► would be good on film I feel like yeah i [TS]

00:40:14 ◼   ► mean would you make a movie out of this [TS]

00:40:15 ◼   ► it seems like it would be it seems like [TS]

00:40:17 ◼   ► it wouldn't work right it wouldn't work [TS]

00:40:19 ◼   ► with some seams in it work like that the [TS]

00:40:20 ◼   ► whole at the backstory scene would be [TS]

00:40:22 ◼   ► kind of like the backstory seen in and [TS]

00:40:24 ◼   ► fellowship of the ring without telling [TS]

00:40:26 ◼   ► the story about the the original battle [TS]

00:40:28 ◼   ► with everything was cut off [TS]

00:40:29 ◼   ► star-spangled learn everything that that [TS]

00:40:30 ◼   ► little backstory segment that story they [TS]

00:40:32 ◼   ► tell about almost the legends and stuff [TS]

00:40:35 ◼   ► would fit in that style and the scene [TS]

00:40:36 ◼   ► with a demon being strapped to an iron [TS]

00:40:38 ◼   ► wheel and speaking in tongues and trying [TS]

00:40:40 ◼   ► to convince you to lighten free that's [TS]

00:40:41 ◼   ► that's that's triple a cinema there but [TS]

00:40:43 ◼   ► then everything else around that you're [TS]

00:40:45 ◼   ► like I don't make a movie out of this [TS]

00:40:46 ◼   ► weekend it's not your traditional is [TS]

00:40:49 ◼   ► definitely not your to structured like [TS]

00:40:50 ◼   ► your traditional playa the movie would [TS]

00:40:52 ◼   ► end of people like what wait what [TS]

00:40:54 ◼   ► happened and then the magic isn't that [TS]

00:40:57 ◼   ► show you so I mean it's not like he's [TS]

00:40:59 ◼   ► yeah people don't want it like that work [TS]

00:41:00 ◼   ► about and definitely works well in a [TS]

00:41:02 ◼   ► book all the explanations of the magic [TS]

00:41:03 ◼   ► and everything if you're kind of a geek [TS]

00:41:04 ◼   ► or a science geek or whatever you [TS]

00:41:06 ◼   ► it's like a different world system you [TS]

00:41:08 ◼   ► but i like reading about that it's a [TS]

00:41:09 ◼   ► little bit tiresome reading about it a [TS]

00:41:11 ◼   ► second time in the second book but [TS]

00:41:13 ◼   ► that's a different [TS]

00:41:13 ◼   ► podcast we can discuss that how do you [TS]

00:41:16 ◼   ► know that it wouldn't be so interesting [TS]

00:41:18 ◼   ► to see him you know crafting a sympathy [TS]

00:41:20 ◼   ► lab been explaining how it works i would [TS]

00:41:22 ◼   ► watch that sounds riveting I i would [TS]

00:41:25 ◼   ► watch it to it does sound interesting [TS]

00:41:26 ◼   ► but for most people not ask myself my [TS]

00:41:29 ◼   ► favorite parts of the book one is in the [TS]

00:41:31 ◼   ► lab and explain the principles and and [TS]

00:41:33 ◼   ► demonstrating my love that stuff not to [TS]

00:41:37 ◼   ► interfere too much of the RF field but i [TS]

00:41:40 ◼   ► was curious [TS]

00:41:41 ◼   ► John uses only earlier about like you [TS]

00:41:43 ◼   ► know this wasn't this wasn't you the [TS]

00:41:45 ◼   ► best fantasy book of the past decade i'm [TS]

00:41:46 ◼   ► curious if there's something in [TS]

00:41:47 ◼   ► particular that stands out to you that [TS]

00:41:49 ◼   ► was that you felt like pick up the slack [TS]

00:41:51 ◼   ► and places where this was lacking yeah [TS]

00:41:53 ◼   ► i've barely read fantasy books now so [TS]

00:41:56 ◼   ► i'll just surmising that there had to be [TS]

00:41:58 ◼   ► a better book mostly what what we think [TS]

00:42:01 ◼   ► of it because yeah I that's why can't be [TS]

00:42:03 ◼   ► another book episodes because I don't [TS]

00:42:05 ◼   ► read that much and what I do read is [TS]

00:42:07 ◼   ► like stuck in this Stephen King year's [TS]

00:42:09 ◼   ► best science fiction ghetto have you [TS]

00:42:12 ◼   ► read have you read george RR martin song [TS]

00:42:14 ◼   ► of ice and fire [TS]

00:42:15 ◼   ► you know I haven't haven't read any of [TS]

00:42:16 ◼   ► his books alright i'll probably come up [TS]

00:42:18 ◼   ► in a future podcast since the TV show is [TS]

00:42:21 ◼   ► coming out next month i did I can give [TS]

00:42:23 ◼   ► an example are really you know like [TS]

00:42:24 ◼   ► fantasy books that are better than this [TS]

00:42:26 ◼   ► that had been in my lifetime obviously [TS]

00:42:28 ◼   ► looking at the lord of the rings out [TS]

00:42:30 ◼   ► there is ridiculous but obviously you [TS]

00:42:31 ◼   ► know that's that's my favorite fantasy [TS]

00:42:33 ◼   ► book of all time that's a whole other [TS]

00:42:34 ◼   ► category but not a big such a big [TS]

00:42:37 ◼   ► Stephen can King fan his one fantasy [TS]

00:42:40 ◼   ► book I thought eyes of the dragon was a [TS]

00:42:42 ◼   ► great example of why people buy the [TS]

00:42:45 ◼   ► numbers straightforward fantasy that had [TS]

00:42:49 ◼   ► lots of interesting things to recommend [TS]

00:42:51 ◼   ► like it wasn't amazing and fantastic and [TS]

00:42:53 ◼   ► transcendent but it was it was a little [TS]

00:42:55 ◼   ► bit paint by the numbers but i really [TS]

00:42:58 ◼   ► like that I thought it was at and the [TS]

00:43:00 ◼   ► ears a nose was not typical Stephen King [TS]

00:43:02 ◼   ► you can redo a kid or whatever I always [TS]

00:43:04 ◼   ► look to that as my sort of benchmark for [TS]

00:43:06 ◼   ► top-quality not not amazing but not bad [TS]

00:43:12 ◼   ► fantasy and I judge all the fantasy [TS]

00:43:14 ◼   ► books by you know is it better or worse [TS]

00:43:15 ◼   ► than eyes of the dragon and in every [TS]

00:43:17 ◼   ► regarding this is worse than I the [TS]

00:43:19 ◼   ► dragon almost every regard but better in [TS]

00:43:21 ◼   ► those highlight aspects of like had a [TS]

00:43:24 ◼   ► better world more interesting [TS]

00:43:26 ◼   ► ideas about the epic story and you know [TS]

00:43:29 ◼   ► it's a much bigger and much bigger story [TS]

00:43:31 ◼   ► that has yet to be told [TS]

00:43:33 ◼   ► ok how he's got well i will admit that [TS]

00:43:36 ◼   ► when i was in high school I kind of [TS]

00:43:39 ◼   ► burnt out on fantasy books i read a [TS]

00:43:41 ◼   ► whole bunch of pretty crappy fantasy [TS]

00:43:43 ◼   ► books like a lot of them and then I [TS]

00:43:45 ◼   ► stopped reading fantasy because I was [TS]

00:43:46 ◼   ► sick of it it's always the same thing [TS]

00:43:48 ◼   ► you know there's some extraordinary [TS]

00:43:49 ◼   ► person in need to find something and you [TS]

00:43:52 ◼   ► know sleigh and evil [TS]

00:43:54 ◼   ► so this book actually has been at these [TS]

00:43:56 ◼   ► two books i think the best fantasy books [TS]

00:43:58 ◼   ► i read in the last few years of course I [TS]

00:44:02 ◼   ► haven't read much fantasy so I'm not a [TS]

00:44:04 ◼   ► good judge of the best science fiction [TS]

00:44:06 ◼   ► best fantasy the last year's fair enough [TS]

00:44:09 ◼   ► about yourself down are you a big [TS]

00:44:11 ◼   ► fantasy person I I kind of like you I [TS]

00:44:13 ◼   ► like I read a lot of it i mean i think [TS]

00:44:15 ◼   ► the thing that killed a lot of my [TS]

00:44:16 ◼   ► fantasy interest was a robert jordan [TS]

00:44:17 ◼   ► personally personally responsible for [TS]

00:44:20 ◼   ► killing much my fantasy interest which [TS]

00:44:21 ◼   ► books that i think i read the first six [TS]

00:44:23 ◼   ► maybe seven books in that series and [TS]

00:44:25 ◼   ► that i read up to the point like where i [TS]

00:44:27 ◼   ► think i was in high school and I read up [TS]

00:44:29 ◼   ► to the point where like he had written [TS]

00:44:31 ◼   ► at that time and was like well yeah that [TS]

00:44:33 ◼   ► was pretty good [TS]

00:44:34 ◼   ► like you know although i'll read the [TS]

00:44:36 ◼   ► next book when it comes out and then the [TS]

00:44:37 ◼   ► next book came out like years later and [TS]

00:44:39 ◼   ► i was like i don't remember a thing that [TS]

00:44:41 ◼   ► happened in there and I become sort of [TS]

00:44:43 ◼   ► disenchanted with it in the meanwhile I [TS]

00:44:45 ◼   ► was like I'm never going to reread it to [TS]

00:44:46 ◼   ► to figure out what happened and then i [TS]

00:44:48 ◼   ► would read some you know care criticism [TS]

00:44:50 ◼   ► of it from other people like it you know [TS]

00:44:51 ◼   ► that's another good example [TS]

00:44:54 ◼   ► well you know the female characters [TS]

00:44:56 ◼   ► being locally sort of two-dimensional [TS]

00:44:59 ◼   ► and they're just for the that the men's [TS]

00:45:01 ◼   ► interest in them and I think you know [TS]

00:45:03 ◼   ► that sort of run home at that point [TS]

00:45:04 ◼   ► after i was at more of a distance and [TS]

00:45:07 ◼   ► and that sort of held me off for a while [TS]

00:45:09 ◼   ► i've come across a couple fancy books in [TS]

00:45:11 ◼   ► the past years that I really liked one [TS]

00:45:12 ◼   ► of them was this one at least before I [TS]

00:45:14 ◼   ► start talking job got it John has ruined [TS]

00:45:17 ◼   ► it for everyone but the other ones being [TS]

00:45:20 ◼   ► I have enjoyed George RR Martin's song [TS]

00:45:22 ◼   ► of ice and fire to lift up until the [TS]

00:45:24 ◼   ► point where is and there's a I guess the [TS]

00:45:26 ◼   ► next book is due out in the summer and [TS]

00:45:28 ◼   ► I've read to actually read the first [TS]

00:45:30 ◼   ► three books in that series twice because [TS]

00:45:31 ◼   ► i read them again when the fourth book [TS]

00:45:33 ◼   ► came out and they're very good i hope he [TS]

00:45:35 ◼   ► doesn't fall into the robert jordan trap [TS]

00:45:37 ◼   ► of sort of [TS]

00:45:38 ◼   ► spinning this story out forever and that [TS]

00:45:40 ◼   ► he has a good ending point because [TS]

00:45:42 ◼   ► there's some really good stuff in there [TS]

00:45:43 ◼   ► it's a very brutal you know series of [TS]

00:45:46 ◼   ► books it's got a lot of stuff that [TS]

00:45:47 ◼   ► focuses on things more like political [TS]

00:45:49 ◼   ► intrigue there's not a lot of magic or [TS]

00:45:51 ◼   ► other worldliness and so it makes it [TS]

00:45:53 ◼   ► that much more interesting when that [TS]

00:45:54 ◼   ► comes up that's true i had forgotten [TS]

00:45:56 ◼   ► about Jordan I will second that and then [TS]

00:46:00 ◼   ► the other book which i came across [TS]

00:46:01 ◼   ► roughly the same time i came across the [TS]

00:46:03 ◼   ► name of the wind is a book called the [TS]

00:46:04 ◼   ► lies of locke lamora which has some [TS]

00:46:08 ◼   ► things that are very similar to the name [TS]

00:46:11 ◼   ► of the wind especially in that you're [TS]

00:46:13 ◼   ► the sort of the main character is this [TS]

00:46:14 ◼   ► very clever fellow he's a thief though [TS]

00:46:17 ◼   ► and this is this book is is it's very [TS]

00:46:20 ◼   ► different in some ways it's a lot darker [TS]

00:46:22 ◼   ► the end of that book is very dark like a [TS]

00:46:26 ◼   ► John John start talking about like I [TS]

00:46:27 ◼   ► wanted to see like the actual meaningful [TS]

00:46:29 ◼   ► loss and stuff like that i started [TS]

00:46:31 ◼   ► thinking about that book because there [TS]

00:46:32 ◼   ► really is a lot of that book that you [TS]

00:46:33 ◼   ► feel sort of like wow that did not go [TS]

00:46:36 ◼   ► well for that guy and that had a sequel [TS]

00:46:40 ◼   ► called a red seas under red skies and I [TS]

00:46:42 ◼   ► think there's another book do this year [TS]

00:46:44 ◼   ► or or sometime soon and so that would be [TS]

00:46:46 ◼   ► the other series that i read started [TS]

00:46:48 ◼   ► reading few years ago and thinking wow [TS]

00:46:49 ◼   ► this is this is really good i really [TS]

00:46:51 ◼   ► like this you know you know it also [TS]

00:46:53 ◼   ► throughout their I was thinking of [TS]

00:46:55 ◼   ► picking up ere it and I mentioned doctor [TS]

00:46:57 ◼   ► before I don't get called fantasy or [TS]

00:46:59 ◼   ► sci-fi is kind of in the middle but i [TS]

00:47:00 ◼   ► thought my favorite book in the dark [TS]

00:47:02 ◼   ► tower series reads like a fantasy book [TS]

00:47:04 ◼   ► wizard and glasses my favorite one and [TS]

00:47:06 ◼   ► that reads like a more-or-less [TS]

00:47:07 ◼   ► self-contained fantasy but can I thought [TS]

00:47:09 ◼   ► that was head and shoulders above its [TS]

00:47:11 ◼   ► really that's a really coherent like out [TS]

00:47:14 ◼   ► as opposed to a lot of the other books [TS]

00:47:15 ◼   ► in that series which are kind of like [TS]

00:47:17 ◼   ► this weird pastiche mix-match of genres [TS]

00:47:19 ◼   ► Wizarding glasses really really coherent [TS]

00:47:21 ◼   ► and like sort of focused on this story [TS]

00:47:25 ◼   ► and again it's sort of a it's a [TS]

00:47:26 ◼   ► flashback right because its role in [TS]

00:47:28 ◼   ► telling the story of yeah very little [TS]

00:47:30 ◼   ► framing story and that one but mostly in [TS]

00:47:32 ◼   ► the world bulb and then it's been retold [TS]

00:47:34 ◼   ► that they sort of told three different [TS]

00:47:36 ◼   ► lens in the Sudan doing a graphic novel [TS]

00:47:38 ◼   ► version of that and it's sort of it [TS]

00:47:42 ◼   ► telling some of the same story or the [TS]

00:47:43 ◼   ► the story of sort of young Roland which [TS]

00:47:45 ◼   ► is again interesting i think that i [TS]

00:47:46 ◼   ► agree that the world that world i really [TS]

00:47:49 ◼   ► enjoy [TS]

00:47:50 ◼   ► and wizards and glasses a pretty pretty [TS]

00:47:52 ◼   ► good book and you have to call that [TS]

00:47:53 ◼   ► fantasy right especially that old world [TS]

00:47:55 ◼   ► stuff is a kind of headlines and nights [TS]

00:47:56 ◼   ► an email they have done and seen [TS]

00:47:58 ◼   ► westerns right right well it's kind of a [TS]

00:48:00 ◼   ► mix-match of those two bowls of the [TS]

00:48:01 ◼   ► college more of the Western [TS]

00:48:03 ◼   ► self-contained book will that and that's [TS]

00:48:05 ◼   ► definitely a Western yeah well western / [TS]

00:48:07 ◼   ► syfy vs right [TS]

00:48:09 ◼   ► western / fantasy and I can study and [TS]

00:48:12 ◼   ► that's one of the things I love about [TS]

00:48:13 ◼   ► the dark tower is that it doesn't [TS]

00:48:14 ◼   ► embrace all those things but I guess [TS]

00:48:15 ◼   ► again something probably for another [TS]

00:48:17 ◼   ► podcast yeah but i would but i would put [TS]

00:48:19 ◼   ► that up there is like it was trying to [TS]

00:48:20 ◼   ► think of fantasy books i read i always [TS]

00:48:22 ◼   ► try to read those years best fantasy you [TS]

00:48:24 ◼   ► know just like I read the year's best [TS]

00:48:25 ◼   ► sci-fi stuff and for some reason have a [TS]

00:48:27 ◼   ► much easier time reading the year's best [TS]

00:48:29 ◼   ► sci-fi short stories and the fancy ones [TS]

00:48:31 ◼   ► I just I just peter out and don't make [TS]

00:48:33 ◼   ► it through the book [TS]

00:48:35 ◼   ► yeah I don't know what the I i'm trying [TS]

00:48:38 ◼   ► to think of other fantasy books I've [TS]

00:48:39 ◼   ► read in the last few years i think some [TS]

00:48:40 ◼   ► of them a lot of the other ones that i [TS]

00:48:42 ◼   ► really like are things that have been [TS]

00:48:43 ◼   ► around for awhile that are i mean for [TS]

00:48:46 ◼   ► example i love love Terry Pratchett who [TS]

00:48:48 ◼   ► writes in a fantasy world but it's very [TS]

00:48:49 ◼   ► means community right it's a little [TS]

00:48:51 ◼   ► different thing that's like saying [TS]

00:48:52 ◼   ► exactly like science fiction so I like [TS]

00:48:54 ◼   ► the hitchhiker's guide that so that he [TS]

00:48:55 ◼   ► has a general to himself and so does [TS]

00:48:57 ◼   ► terry pratchett I love him too [TS]

00:48:58 ◼   ► yeah so i'm trying to think if there's [TS]

00:49:00 ◼   ► anything else that was really like that [TS]

00:49:01 ◼   ► would jump out at me from the past 10 [TS]

00:49:03 ◼   ► years and yeah I there are some that are [TS]

00:49:06 ◼   ► the they're very like I everyone smile [TS]

00:49:08 ◼   ► see things come across but they could [TS]

00:49:09 ◼   ► always sound like very traditional sort [TS]

00:49:11 ◼   ► of fantasy books of the type that I you [TS]

00:49:13 ◼   ► know didn't really like that much so [TS]

00:49:15 ◼   ► that I had one of the things I liked [TS]

00:49:18 ◼   ► about the name of the wind i think in in [TS]

00:49:19 ◼   ► sort of coming back around to that is [TS]

00:49:21 ◼   ► that like Scott said that it didn't seem [TS]

00:49:24 ◼   ► too [TS]

00:49:25 ◼   ► while it has a lot of the tropes of a [TS]

00:49:27 ◼   ► fantasy novel it has enough different [TS]

00:49:29 ◼   ► going for it that I i found it kind of a [TS]

00:49:33 ◼   ► departure [TS]

00:49:34 ◼   ► it's kind of a fresh take on it's right [TS]

00:49:36 ◼   ► because it's not the same thing over and [TS]

00:49:39 ◼   ► over again like when I was a kid argue [TS]

00:49:41 ◼   ► your case i read a lot of david eddings [TS]

00:49:44 ◼   ► so I was obsessed with David a text i [TS]

00:49:46 ◼   ► read he had a 10 book series and I read [TS]

00:49:49 ◼   ► the whole thing and then he came out [TS]

00:49:50 ◼   ► with a new series and i read that was [TS]

00:49:51 ◼   ► five books they came up with another [TS]

00:49:53 ◼   ► series and slowly dawned on me that he [TS]

00:49:56 ◼   ► was telling the exact same story with [TS]

00:49:58 ◼   ► slightly different characters over [TS]

00:50:00 ◼   ► varying numbers of books and so I [TS]

00:50:02 ◼   ► stopped read that but this this was kind [TS]

00:50:04 ◼   ► of a similar story but had a very [TS]

00:50:05 ◼   ► different viewpoint [TS]

00:50:07 ◼   ► ya know I i agree with that I i never [TS]

00:50:11 ◼   ► read a lot of those ones that were big [TS]

00:50:13 ◼   ► when I was a when I was in high school [TS]

00:50:15 ◼   ► like terry brooks and Terry good kids [TS]

00:50:17 ◼   ► and all that I never never got into [TS]

00:50:19 ◼   ► those who I return good can then he [TS]

00:50:20 ◼   ► started getting very he sido un osito [TS]

00:50:25 ◼   ► masochistic it was weird [TS]

00:50:28 ◼   ► there are women who had pain sticks and [TS]

00:50:31 ◼   ► they wore red leather outfits so that [TS]

00:50:33 ◼   ► when blood splashed on them wouldn't [TS]

00:50:34 ◼   ► show up it got to be a bit much working [TS]

00:50:38 ◼   ► out some personal issues sure exactly [TS]

00:50:42 ◼   ► yeah i think that everything else that [TS]

00:50:45 ◼   ► I'd you know a lot of the other stuff [TS]

00:50:46 ◼   ► that i enjoyed as much older stuff and [TS]

00:50:50 ◼   ► you know I think there's always there's [TS]

00:50:51 ◼   ► a very porous you know border with a lot [TS]

00:50:54 ◼   ► of the science fiction and fantasy [TS]

00:50:56 ◼   ► things that I'll but I've wiped from [TS]

00:50:57 ◼   ► that era out but yeah there's there's [TS]

00:51:01 ◼   ► but it's it's an interesting uh it's an [TS]

00:51:04 ◼   ► interesting dilemma when you have these [TS]

00:51:06 ◼   ► sort of well-established genre with all [TS]

00:51:08 ◼   ► these well-trod story type so it's [TS]

00:51:11 ◼   ► always nice to see somebody break free a [TS]

00:51:12 ◼   ► little bit and well John I hope that I [TS]

00:51:15 ◼   ► hope the second book treats you better [TS]

00:51:16 ◼   ► than that than the first one is that it [TS]

00:51:18 ◼   ► released maybe you can you you can see [TS]

00:51:20 ◼   ► it through to the end [TS]

00:51:21 ◼   ► vibrations you are not going to like it [TS]

00:51:23 ◼   ► nah I don't call me crazy but I was [TS]

00:51:26 ◼   ► thinking that you know it probably [TS]

00:51:27 ◼   ► doesn't go anywhere either with I don't [TS]

00:51:29 ◼   ► know at this point I'll just because i [TS]

00:51:31 ◼   ► read a lot of books that are not great [TS]

00:51:33 ◼   ► like I read almost everything Stephen [TS]

00:51:34 ◼   ► King does and almost everything he does [TS]

00:51:36 ◼   ► is not great but there are certain [TS]

00:51:38 ◼   ► writing styles and authors that just [TS]

00:51:41 ◼   ► somehow the pages keep turning and just [TS]

00:51:42 ◼   ► go through you know I'm in the middle of [TS]

00:51:44 ◼   ► like there's the problem of the [TS]

00:51:46 ◼   ► e-readers maybe Scott has this problem [TS]

00:51:47 ◼   ► too i don't have a lot of e-readers [TS]

00:51:49 ◼   ► compared to him but i do have a lot of [TS]

00:51:50 ◼   ► devices where I can read and I'm in the [TS]

00:51:53 ◼   ► middle like nine books it's just it's [TS]

00:51:56 ◼   ► too many when i was doing paper book [TS]

00:51:57 ◼   ► that was always one of the time but now [TS]

00:51:59 ◼   ► it's like what I'm in the mood to read a [TS]

00:52:01 ◼   ► lot of them are nonfiction and those i [TS]

00:52:03 ◼   ► feel like i could stop and start at any [TS]

00:52:04 ◼   ► time but even the fiction books [TS]

00:52:07 ◼   ► I'm just in the middle so many of them [TS]

00:52:08 ◼   ► and like maybe do i remember i am in [TS]

00:52:10 ◼   ► this book yep i'll read a few chapters [TS]

00:52:11 ◼   ► of this and this is why I never make any [TS]

00:52:13 ◼   ► progress in my books moment when these [TS]

00:52:15 ◼   ► books come out [TS]

00:52:15 ◼   ► these name of the wind things I think I [TS]

00:52:17 ◼   ► pretty much for that straight through to [TS]

00:52:19 ◼   ► the end and i'll probably do the same [TS]

00:52:20 ◼   ► thing with the sequel because even if [TS]

00:52:22 ◼   ► anything happens there are amusing [TS]

00:52:23 ◼   ► scenes and you want to see what happens [TS]

00:52:25 ◼   ► and it's not you know the same reason [TS]

00:52:27 ◼   ► you watch bad sitcom TV like an [TS]

00:52:29 ◼   ► entertainment for a few minutes but when [TS]

00:52:31 ◼   ► it's over I do feel a little dirty [TS]

00:52:33 ◼   ► yeah and I think Jack slur every day [TS]

00:52:38 ◼   ► yeah but the Lord yeah I don't think [TS]

00:52:39 ◼   ► we're helping like it's hard to get [TS]

00:52:40 ◼   ► people on this podcast to read a fantasy [TS]

00:52:42 ◼   ► book right so it's just the three of us [TS]

00:52:44 ◼   ► one guy was never on a book episode and [TS]

00:52:46 ◼   ► the and the two guys who read everything [TS]

00:52:47 ◼   ► this podcast is not going to help us get [TS]

00:52:50 ◼   ► people on the beach you know the next [TS]

00:52:51 ◼   ► fantasy football guess but for God's [TS]

00:52:53 ◼   ► sake people read the dark tower so we [TS]

00:52:54 ◼   ► can talk about it it's only 8,000 pages [TS]

00:52:57 ◼   ► are you waiting for [TS]

00:52:59 ◼   ► would you here's the question for both [TS]

00:53:01 ◼   ► you and then would you recommend this [TS]

00:53:03 ◼   ► book if someone you're with your friends [TS]

00:53:05 ◼   ► computer says hey I want to read a [TS]

00:53:07 ◼   ► fantasy book [TS]

00:53:07 ◼   ► what would you recommend you read of [TS]

00:53:09 ◼   ► recent vintage i'd recommend i have [TS]

00:53:13 ◼   ► recommended this book a to a few people [TS]

00:53:15 ◼   ► and and most of them will have I think [TS]

00:53:17 ◼   ► enjoyed it [TS]

00:53:18 ◼   ► although I have some friends who are [TS]

00:53:20 ◼   ► very wary of that whole like george RR [TS]

00:53:22 ◼   ► martin robert jordan disease of its [TS]

00:53:24 ◼   ► going two years and years before the you [TS]

00:53:26 ◼   ► know the final book in the series comes [TS]

00:53:28 ◼   ► out now but this is definitely one that [TS]

00:53:31 ◼   ► i've recommended to several people and [TS]

00:53:32 ◼   ► that they seem to mostly enjoyed the [TS]

00:53:35 ◼   ► lies of locke lamora as i mentioned [TS]

00:53:36 ◼   ► before is another one that I often [TS]

00:53:38 ◼   ► recommend and then probably you know [TS]

00:53:41 ◼   ► george RR martin you know in terms of [TS]

00:53:43 ◼   ► recent stuff but there's definitely [TS]

00:53:44 ◼   ► older stuff i like it i'm a big fan of [TS]

00:53:46 ◼   ► dark hour tom has as John i know is and [TS]

00:53:51 ◼   ► i'm trying to think after that again if [TS]