The Incomparable

286: No One in a Powdered Wig is Scrappy


00:00:04   the entire article number 286 februari [TS]

00:00:13   welcome back everybody to the [TS]

00:00:15   uncomfortable i'm your host Jason L we [TS]

00:00:17   are going to talk about something a [TS]

00:00:18   little different for us this is in the [TS]

00:00:20   realm of musical theater [TS]

00:00:22   I know I know who would have thought but [TS]

00:00:25   it's at least it's science fiction music [TS]

00:00:26   nope it's not that [TS]

00:00:28   and it's also a musical theater that [TS]

00:00:30   none of us have actually seen so it's [TS]

00:00:32   essentially we're talking about an album [TS]

00:00:34   basically which is the two hours and 23 [TS]

00:00:37   minutes and 46 tracks of the original [TS]

00:00:40   broadway cast recording of a musical [TS]

00:00:42   called Hamilton by lin-manuel Miranda [TS]

00:00:44   which is taking many parts of the [TS]

00:00:47   culture by storm [TS]

00:00:49   it is a wild success it is hard to get a [TS]

00:00:51   ticket i believe our own Lex Friedman [TS]

00:00:54   for his birthday in november i think got [TS]

00:00:58   a ticket for September of the following [TS]

00:01:01   year to see it [TS]

00:01:02   yeah yeah it's hard it's a it's a it's a [TS]

00:01:05   tough ticket and the reason is because [TS]

00:01:06   it is spectacularly good and fun to [TS]

00:01:11   listen to and once you start you can't [TS]

00:01:13   stop [TS]

00:01:14   and it's much better than you might [TS]

00:01:16   expect that a musical that is largely [TS]

00:01:18   inspired by a biography of america's [TS]

00:01:21   first secretary of the Treasury might be [TS]

00:01:23   talking about this with me are the [TS]

00:01:27   following wonderful guests chipset earth [TS]

00:01:30   hello it was my understanding that this [TS]

00:01:33   was actually a historical doctor who [TS]

00:01:34   episode it could be just wait for it [TS]

00:01:37   um monte actually you can be my [TS]

00:01:39   right-hand man if Y is my favorite line [TS]

00:01:45   says device [TS]

00:01:48   ok David lower is here straight from the [TS]

00:01:51   theater in our dad later Jason yeah mhm [TS]

00:01:55   and serenity caldwell who's been [TS]

00:01:57   Hamilton a pretty pretty much [TS]

00:01:59   consistently for the last two months [TS]

00:02:00   I'm over 19 and my mind is older alright [TS]

00:02:04   well that works and story checks out [TS]

00:02:06   yeah seems seems to be rice yeah so [TS]

00:02:10   Hamilton any opening statements i read [TS]

00:02:13   in Siracusa here [TS]

00:02:14   oh my god it's gonna be a three hour [TS]

00:02:17   podcast and I have nobody to help us two [TS]

00:02:19   and a half hours go ahead I'll catch up [TS]

00:02:21   this should not be this thing should not [TS]

00:02:25   exist [TS]

00:02:27   this is impossible this is a simpsons [TS]

00:02:29   gag this is wrought me dr. Zaius stuff [TS]

00:02:32   and the piano anymore [TS]

00:02:35   of course you can well I didn't before [TS]

00:02:37   not to say stuff [TS]

00:02:41   dr. Zaius doctor is dr. Zaius doctors is [TS]

00:02:44   his previous [TS]

00:02:50   I love legitimate v8 I don't understand [TS]

00:02:54   how this wonderful thing can exist and [TS]

00:02:57   more to the point can be so good [TS]

00:02:59   there are few places in this musical [TS]

00:03:01   where I do get of a little bit of a [TS]

00:03:03   simpsons parody music vibe there are a [TS]

00:03:05   few lines that i think are kind of [TS]

00:03:07   clunkers where it's it's so on-the-nose [TS]

00:03:09   I'm like yeah okay i would laugh at [TS]

00:03:12   added if it were not surrounded by [TS]

00:03:14   brilliance but it is it is ninety-nine [TS]

00:03:16   percent brilliance and one percent kind [TS]

00:03:19   of cringe that just as Hamilton it's a [TS]

00:03:21   rap musical oh yes right yeah really [TS]

00:03:25   as somebody who is a huge musical [TS]

00:03:27   theater fanatic but not a big rap [TS]

00:03:31   hip-hop fan like i enjoy it casually but [TS]

00:03:34   I'm not the person who's like I know all [TS]

00:03:37   of these artists and i can i can rap for [TS]

00:03:40   you [TS]

00:03:41   I'm not a I'm not a female white rapper [TS]

00:03:43   surprised this show completely bowled me [TS]

00:03:47   over in such a weird way where I've been [TS]

00:03:50   hearing little bits of it i had been [TS]

00:03:52   hearing rumors and talk and like little [TS]

00:03:55   like Oh Hamilton Hamilton Hamilton [TS]

00:03:57   Hamilton and just kept on popping up in [TS]

00:04:00   why do you keep saying that will do you [TS]

00:04:02   answer [TS]

00:04:03   well and i was saying before before we [TS]

00:04:06   started you know I actually walked past [TS]

00:04:08   Hamilton started off broadway at the [TS]

00:04:09   public theater and I was in New York out [TS]

00:04:12   the second or third night that it began [TS]

00:04:14   running at the public and I remember [TS]

00:04:18   walking past the public and seeing these [TS]

00:04:20   big basically neon yellow of posters [TS]

00:04:24   that are like who lives who dies who [TS]

00:04:25   tells your story and then an outline of [TS]

00:04:28   hamilton and with Hamilton written in [TS]

00:04:30   big block letters at the bottom and I [TS]

00:04:32   remember looking at that being like [TS]

00:04:34   Hamilton maybe I don't maybe this is [TS]

00:04:37   like some artists that i don't know i'm [TS]

00:04:40   completely missing this this is weird i [TS]

00:04:42   saw people queuing I'm like well I could [TS]

00:04:44   find out what it is now I'm just gonna [TS]

00:04:46   keep on walking and that was my [TS]

00:04:47   experience with Hamilton for six months [TS]

00:04:50   where I was just like I kept on seeing [TS]

00:04:52   little bits to it alright see someone [TS]

00:04:54   mentioned oh I'm you know I tough an old [TS]

00:04:56   friend of mine from high school is in [TS]

00:04:58   the cast of hamilton and I was like oh [TS]

00:05:00   that's really cool maybe i'll go get in [TS]

00:05:02   get some time and then I then there was [TS]

00:05:05   the Ben Brantley is new york times [TS]

00:05:06   review was like mortgage your children [TS]

00:05:09   to see their food orders your house and [TS]

00:05:11   and that's not so Morgan wait for your [TS]

00:05:13   children yea it is was totally mortgage [TS]

00:05:15   my children to see this [TS]

00:05:17   yeah but that's a bit but so I was saw [TS]

00:05:18   that and I'm like what is the show [TS]

00:05:20   because i actually don't know and i [TS]

00:05:22   started reading I'm like oh that's [TS]

00:05:24   interesting a musical about Alexander [TS]

00:05:25   Hamilton and my mother came to visit me [TS]

00:05:29   in early September right after the show [TS]

00:05:31   had basically come to Broadway and I'm [TS]

00:05:33   like oh well maybe we'll maybe we'll [TS]

00:05:36   stand by for this musical and we'll get [TS]

00:05:39   tickets for we got tickets for [TS]

00:05:41   gentleman's guide to love and murder and [TS]

00:05:44   I'm like well maybe we'll also since the [TS]

00:05:45   matinee maybe we'll stand by for the [TS]

00:05:47   evening show and we walked by just to [TS]

00:05:50   see if they were doing a ham for ham [TS]

00:05:52   like do we walk by the richard rodgers [TS]

00:05:55   there are 700 people there and my just [TS]

00:05:59   drops because you know i'm an old school [TS]

00:06:02   musical theatre which is to say well not [TS]

00:06:04   old school like old-school for me [TS]

00:06:05   meaning i slept overnight to get tickets [TS]

00:06:08   for rent [TS]

00:06:08   like I remember the early rent lotteries [TS]

00:06:11   before Broadway had lotteries when run [TS]

00:06:14   was doing his touring cast and [TS]

00:06:15   everything else and and those lotteries [TS]

00:06:18   were you know they were verb like it [TS]

00:06:20   inspiring and exciting but it was like a [TS]

00:06:23   hundred and fifty people and to see 700 [TS]

00:06:25   people crowding as close as possible to [TS]

00:06:28   this little theatre and then later to [TS]

00:06:32   see all the him for hams as soon as we [TS]

00:06:35   got in the car after going to see a [TS]

00:06:37   gentleman's guide to love and murder [TS]

00:06:38   which was a fabulous show i immediately [TS]

00:06:40   bought the Hamilton soundtrack and I'm [TS]

00:06:42   like all right I'm just gonna listen to [TS]

00:06:44   it because someone says it's sung [TS]

00:06:45   through so it's kind of like you know [TS]

00:06:47   you can enjoy it like you might leave [TS]

00:06:48   mrs. so I'm just gonna do it and so I [TS]

00:06:51   started the Hamilton soundtrack at the [TS]

00:06:53   start of the new york drive and I [TS]

00:06:56   finished it at 1i am at the at the end [TS]

00:06:58   of my driveway literally i finished two [TS]

00:07:00   lives who dies who tells your story as i [TS]

00:07:03   was pulling up into into our driveway [TS]

00:07:06   and opportunity to solve every minute [TS]

00:07:09   yeah exactly because i was just like [TS]

00:07:11   what the first what is [TS]

00:07:14   this what is this entire that has made [TS]

00:07:16   me feel so emotions so many emotions and [TS]

00:07:20   I'm so confused on why why why is this [TS]

00:07:23   suddenly become all i can think of about [TS]

00:07:25   for the next you know week and that was [TS]

00:07:29   that was this that was the impetus for [TS]

00:07:31   me like getting obsessed about Hamilton [TS]

00:07:32   is I just listen to this thing and I [TS]

00:07:35   immediately want to listen to it again [TS]

00:07:37   and then every time someone brought it [TS]

00:07:39   up for the next three four and now [TS]

00:07:41   anytime someone talks about Hamilton I'm [TS]

00:07:43   like I need to listen to the song [TS]

00:07:45   soundtrack again which is crazy when a [TS]

00:07:48   friend of mine asked me on social media [TS]

00:07:50   you know why why are people into this i [TS]

00:07:53   don't understand this and i said it is [TS]

00:07:55   fantastic it's only yeah it's andy and [TS]

00:07:57   not cause fault that I'm into this thing [TS]

00:07:59   because he tweeted about the the sale [TS]

00:08:02   that Google Music add that was they were [TS]

00:08:04   selling it for two dollars to stinking [TS]

00:08:06   dollars yeah we're afraid that he used [TS]

00:08:08   so I get in I go nuts and this friend [TS]

00:08:10   asked me why is everybody talking about [TS]

00:08:12   Hamilton it's just that good here's the [TS]

00:08:15   show and she's response wait [TS]

00:08:17   people are getting this crazy over a [TS]

00:08:20   cast album people haven't been able to [TS]

00:08:22   see it yet it's just the castle [TS]

00:08:24   yes you're just that good some very good [TS]

00:08:27   cast album Hamilton the quality of the [TS]

00:08:31   Hamilton cast our has been really [TS]

00:08:32   inconvenient for me because a few months [TS]

00:08:35   ago i said i am out of touch with what's [TS]

00:08:38   going on Broadway because i live in [TS]

00:08:40   Seattle and broadway lives in New York [TS]

00:08:42   like a jerk [TS]

00:08:43   apologies to anybody who lives in New [TS]

00:08:45   York is not a jerk so I started a blog [TS]

00:08:47   Broadway away dot com on the grounds [TS]

00:08:50   that i live away from broadway and I [TS]

00:08:52   said what I'm going to do is I'm going [TS]

00:08:54   to catch up on broadway and we learn [TS]

00:08:56   everything about Broadway I'm gonna know [TS]

00:08:57   what's happening and there's all these [TS]

00:08:59   cast albums on spotify which is great it [TS]

00:09:02   was gonna say alright what have I missed [TS]

00:09:03   I don't really know what happens in [TS]

00:09:06   passions i dunno what happens in [TS]

00:09:08   passions but that's that sort of thing [TS]

00:09:10   so I'm just gonna listen to a whole [TS]

00:09:11   bunch of cast albums read books and know [TS]

00:09:13   what's going on [TS]

00:09:14   the problem is i just listened to [TS]

00:09:17   Hamilton over and over and over and over [TS]

00:09:19   again and I have to stop messaging know [TS]

00:09:23   you need to give Sunset Boulevard [TS]

00:09:25   another truck is a song of Sunset [TS]

00:09:28   Boulevard and you know right back into [TS]

00:09:29   Hamilton over and over and over and over [TS]

00:09:31   again it's tough it's tough at the [TS]

00:09:34   fascination to I mean we we we've said [TS]

00:09:37   it is about a guy that a lot of people [TS]

00:09:39   have never even heard of when we [TS]

00:09:41   mentioned Hamilton on Twitter are in [TS]

00:09:43   regards to this show and some other [TS]

00:09:44   stuff that we've been working on [TS]

00:09:45   I've heard from a bunch of people [TS]

00:09:47   outside of the united states who have no [TS]

00:09:49   idea not only what the show is but who [TS]

00:09:51   this person is [TS]

00:09:53   Americans would probably know hamilton [TS]

00:09:55   from him being on the ten-dollar bill [TS]

00:09:57   and from that got milk ad probably the [TS]

00:10:02   who shot Alexander Hamilton in that [TS]

00:10:04   famous duel board and yet [TS]

00:10:09   lin-manuel Miranda while on vacation [TS]

00:10:11   with his honeymoon you might have been [TS]

00:10:13   trying since anyone he he read the book [TS]

00:10:16   Alexander Hamilton by ron chernow which [TS]

00:10:19   is a a long but good book about a [TS]

00:10:23   biography of Alexander Hamilton they [TS]

00:10:24   have now put a Hamilton logo on it [TS]

00:10:26   because you know marketing like putting [TS]

00:10:29   tom cruise on the cover of of the firm [TS]

00:10:32   War of the Worlds sure [TS]

00:10:34   ok now major of broadway cast recording [TS]

00:10:37   and the point of Miranda was he wanted [TS]

00:10:40   to tell the story of this a lesser-known [TS]

00:10:42   character from the American Revolution [TS]

00:10:44   and also i think really appreciated the [TS]

00:10:47   the source of Hamilton which is that he [TS]

00:10:51   was an immigrant famously as the show [TS]

00:10:54   starts you know he is his father left [TS]

00:10:56   his mother died he ended up at a very [TS]

00:11:00   young age sea first I've seen awful [TS]

00:11:01   conditions and squalor in the Caribbean [TS]

00:11:04   and then eventually proving his worth as [TS]

00:11:07   a as a brilliant young worker and people [TS]

00:11:09   pulled their money and sent him to get [TS]

00:11:11   an education on the mainland and that [TS]

00:11:13   that's how that's how he starts and in a [TS]

00:11:15   very short amount of time because he's [TS]

00:11:17   in the right place at the right time [TS]

00:11:18   with his incredible gifts he becomes a [TS]

00:11:21   key figure in the American Revolution [TS]

00:11:22   and the aftermath [TS]

00:11:24   it's a great story and I think met [TS]

00:11:26   Miranda's thought was I can't believe [TS]

00:11:28   nobody's really told this story so so he [TS]

00:11:31   took it upon himself to to do it and he [TS]

00:11:34   does it in a whole bunch of different [TS]

00:11:35   musical styles it is [TS]

00:11:36   kind of unfair to say that this is a [TS]

00:11:38   hip-hop musical it's a lot of different [TS]

00:11:39   styles including a lot of hip-hop you [TS]

00:11:42   know that but there's there's other [TS]

00:11:43   styles too i think you you don't give [TS]

00:11:45   him enough credit he's he's playing with [TS]

00:11:47   thought with all the parts are absent a [TS]

00:11:49   Swedish british pop and classic musical [TS]

00:11:52   theater style and even you know touches [TS]

00:11:55   of gilbert and sullivan so much so much [TS]

00:11:58   its yeah I have so many friends who work [TS]

00:12:01   in New York theater and and even at the [TS]

00:12:04   public theater that this has been on [TS]

00:12:05   unlike the edges of my radar for like [TS]

00:12:08   two or three gears now and so when it [TS]

00:12:11   first started the the workshop [TS]

00:12:13   performances and the first run at the [TS]

00:12:16   public theater before Broadway back when [TS]

00:12:19   they didn't they weren't I mean they [TS]

00:12:20   were hoping to go to Broadway but they [TS]

00:12:22   you know there was no concrete plan at [TS]

00:12:25   that point and even at that point the [TS]

00:12:27   the people I knew who worked there the [TS]

00:12:29   people who went to see it said oh my god [TS]

00:12:31   this is the next thing and you know and [TS]

00:12:35   and by the time I had a chance to go [TS]

00:12:37   there was no way in hell I was gonna get [TS]

00:12:40   a ticket for it [TS]

00:12:41   even with all these friends because the [TS]

00:12:42   demand was so great [TS]

00:12:44   Hamilton gets in the news now pretty [TS]

00:12:46   much every two weeks or something [TS]

00:12:49   it's great was on a leash yeah exactly [TS]

00:12:52   it's been on the all the late night [TS]

00:12:53   shows lin-manuel Miranda has gotten to [TS]

00:12:56   show off how ridiculously good he is at [TS]

00:12:58   freestyle rapping you don't pretty much [TS]

00:13:00   every show Chris Christopher Jackson was [TS]

00:13:04   on The Today Show like three days ago [TS]

00:13:06   just talking about his uh his [TS]

00:13:09   experiences I don't know there's [TS]

00:13:11   something it's it's a confluence of [TS]

00:13:14   factors right it's that the music is I'm [TS]

00:13:17   amazing blend of so many different [TS]

00:13:20   styles and types of of musical theater & [TS]

00:13:23   hip-hop of rap rock you know of all of [TS]

00:13:27   basically a hundred years of music [TS]

00:13:30   smushed into this beautiful thing for [TS]

00:13:32   all the talk about how it's a [TS]

00:13:34   revolutionary show and I think in many [TS]

00:13:36   ways it is if it's also very much in the [TS]

00:13:39   traditional musical theater I mean rap [TS]

00:13:41   has been on Broadway for decades Stephen [TS]

00:13:44   Sondheim head wrapping into the woods [TS]

00:13:46   and I mean Gilbert and Sullivan was the [TS]

00:13:49   prototype wrap on in musical theater if [TS]

00:13:52   you think about it yeah i am the very [TS]

00:13:53   model of a modern major-general is [TS]

00:13:55   totally rap it's just wrap done very [TS]

00:13:58   fast and very much you know it's [TS]

00:14:00   monosyllabic to a tune rather than just [TS]

00:14:01   monosyllabic freeform like lin-manuel [TS]

00:14:04   Miranda has had worked with some time [TS]

00:14:06   and you can tell from him from ham how [TS]

00:14:09   big a musical theater nerd this guy is [TS]

00:14:11   what i think is really special about [TS]

00:14:14   Hamilton aside from the music and the [TS]

00:14:17   orchestration by the way if you if you [TS]

00:14:19   want a new way to listen to Hamilton [TS]

00:14:20   listen with an ear guided towards the [TS]

00:14:23   orchestrations because the [TS]

00:14:24   orchestrations are brilliant and a [TS]

00:14:26   wonderful kala like they're callbacks [TS]

00:14:29   and callbacks when callbacks and really [TS]

00:14:31   smart things and banjos and weird weird [TS]

00:14:34   a little bits on a synthesizer and [TS]

00:14:37   banjos yes banjos but besides the music [TS]

00:14:42   which is wonderful [TS]

00:14:43   besides the fact that lemon wall miranda [TS]

00:14:46   is a very very talented composer and an [TS]

00:14:50   actor I the entire cast [TS]

00:14:54   there's such an energy from the show [TS]

00:14:56   from the people who are promoting it [TS]

00:14:57   which are really the on that you know on [TS]

00:15:00   the line cast members in some ways it [TS]

00:15:02   feels very high school theater in a [TS]

00:15:04   strain it's the most high school theater [TS]

00:15:06   show on Broadway there is a really good [TS]

00:15:09   take everybody so delighted to be part [TS]

00:15:12   of it like these these actors are [TS]

00:15:13   getting paid for it but their happiness [TS]

00:15:15   that's one of the things that's been [TS]

00:15:17   fascinating to me about it that right [TS]

00:15:19   now as we're speaking this weekend [TS]

00:15:22   there's the new Broadway con it's like [TS]

00:15:24   they're trying to do a comic con for [TS]

00:15:26   Broadway and the first thing then [TS]

00:15:29   everyone is talking about Hamilton and [TS]

00:15:31   and someone online brought up you know [TS]

00:15:33   the great thing about Hamilton is the [TS]

00:15:35   colorblind casting and someone else [TS]

00:15:38   immediately went it's not colorblind [TS]

00:15:41   that was intentional [TS]

00:15:42   yeah right yeah hardwood part of the [TS]

00:15:45   beauty of the ham for him shows is that [TS]

00:15:47   it is showing that it's not just a [TS]

00:15:49   gimmick these cast members love musical [TS]

00:15:53   theater and and they they are deeply [TS]

00:15:55   talent that they do more than just [TS]

00:15:56   what's in hand [TS]

00:15:57   let me take a break to tell you about [TS]

00:15:59   one of our sponsors in this episode is [TS]

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00:16:03   before these are obsessively engineered [TS]

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00:16:18   spend a third of our life sleeping i [TS]

00:16:20   feel like this last week I've been [TS]

00:16:21   spending a little bit less than a third [TS]

00:16:23   of my life [TS]

00:16:24   you think I need to get some more sleep [TS]

00:16:25   but I've been staying up late I had [TS]

00:16:27   stuff to do you know when I lay down on [TS]

00:16:29   my Casper mattress which I have I get a [TS]

00:16:32   very nice night's sleep and that's [TS]

00:16:35   because Casper is unlike most other [TS]

00:16:37   mattresses it's got two amazing [TS]

00:16:38   technologies that are brought together [TS]

00:16:40   latex foam memory foam latex foam gives [TS]

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00:16:44   memory foam has got a lot of support and [TS]

00:16:47   in the end it is the most comfortable [TS]

00:16:49   mattress that i have ever slept on and [TS]

00:16:52   i'm not kidding and they are not paying [TS]

00:16:54   you say that part that is actually the [TS]

00:16:56   truth there is a risk-free trial and [TS]

00:16:59   return policy so if you're afraid of [TS]

00:17:00   buying a mattress sight unseen not [TS]

00:17:02   knowing about it [TS]

00:17:03   putting out a lot of money and then [TS]

00:17:05   getting it being disappointed [TS]

00:17:06   don't worry about it they delivered to [TS]

00:17:08   you you can try 400 days so it's been [TS]

00:17:11   three months sleeping on it and if [TS]

00:17:12   you're not happy they will pick it back [TS]

00:17:14   up take it away and give you your money [TS]

00:17:15   back [TS]

00:17:16   the story you might lay down for five [TS]

00:17:17   minutes and it's not gonna tell you [TS]

00:17:19   anything about how comfortable the [TS]

00:17:20   mattresses with Casper you can sleep on [TS]

00:17:22   it literally they'll let you sleep on it [TS]

00:17:25   for months five hundred dollars for a [TS]

00:17:28   twin up to 9 50 for a king if you [TS]

00:17:31   compare that to the mattress industry [TS]

00:17:32   prices that's a pretty great price point [TS]

00:17:35   and of course you're going to get fifty [TS]

00:17:37   dollars toward any purchase by going to [TS]

00:17:39   Casper calm / smell and using code smell [TS]

00:17:42   terms and conditions apply thank you so [TS]

00:17:45   much to Casper for sponsoring the [TS]

00:17:47   incomparable well there are a couple of [TS]

00:17:49   other reasons that I think that this is [TS]

00:17:52   that this is struck such a court in [TS]

00:17:53   addition to what y'all have said up [TS]

00:17:56   lin-manuel Miranda makes a big deal [TS]

00:17:58   about how the whole point of the casting [TS]

00:18:01   and the music choices and things like [TS]

00:18:02   that is to just utterly remove the [TS]

00:18:05   distance between us in 2016 [TS]

00:18:08   and the time of Hamilton 1776 and all [TS]

00:18:12   that stuff [TS]

00:18:13   it's using its it's doing an incredible [TS]

00:18:15   job of translating history into [TS]

00:18:18   something that we can just this really [TS]

00:18:21   enjoy there's some it's not quite call [TS]

00:18:24   and response but there's a level of [TS]

00:18:25   audience participation [TS]

00:18:27   I understand in the theater during this [TS]

00:18:29   show they had to add extra bars the to [TS]

00:18:34   the to the song on what to win or your [TS]

00:18:38   world turned upside down when lafayette [TS]

00:18:42   and Hamilton say immigrants we get the [TS]

00:18:44   job done and give each other a high-five [TS]

00:18:46   add more bars because the audience is [TS]

00:18:48   too busy laughing nobody will hear the [TS]

00:18:50   next the next bit so i think that that [TS]

00:18:54   accessibility is really important to why [TS]

00:18:56   this thing's taken off and also you know [TS]

00:18:59   talk about viral use of social media [TS]

00:19:02   everything from lin-manuel Miranda at [TS]

00:19:05   the White House on youtube to his [TS]

00:19:08   constant tweets and the and the ham for [TS]

00:19:11   him phenomenon all this other stuff they [TS]

00:19:14   are doing everything right to just sort [TS]

00:19:18   of i rly get into your head to the point [TS]

00:19:21   that i worry about a backlash someday [TS]

00:19:23   that it just gets so big that people get [TS]

00:19:26   just sick and tired of it and maybe it [TS]

00:19:29   doesn't have a long shelf life is it [TS]

00:19:31   might because of just saturation well it [TS]

00:19:34   is it is the most pre-sold show in [TS]

00:19:36   Broadway so it's going to run for a [TS]

00:19:38   while at least it's sold out through [TS]

00:19:40   october like to state the obvious if you [TS]

00:19:42   look at the guys who were actually you [TS]

00:19:45   know the actual Washington the actual [TS]

00:19:46   Madison the actual Jefferson the actual [TS]

00:19:48   hamilton from where we are now in 2016 [TS]

00:19:53   they all look pretty much identical [TS]

00:19:54   they're all white guys and powdered wigs [TS]

00:19:58   and buckling shoes and you can tell it [TS]

00:20:01   between them and the guys in England the [TS]

00:20:03   hated upper-class who's keeping them [TS]

00:20:05   down so casting people that look and [TS]

00:20:09   talk more like America does i think is a [TS]

00:20:13   really good way of letting you identify [TS]

00:20:15   with the scrappy underdog because if you [TS]

00:20:19   saw the actual Hamilton saying I'm young [TS]

00:20:21   scrappy and hung [TS]

00:20:22   re you go no one in a powdered wig is [TS]

00:20:25   scrappy yeah well and it also breaks you [TS]

00:20:29   out of that assumption of you know oh [TS]

00:20:31   well as Thomas Jefferson or you know [TS]

00:20:32   like you look at 1776 everybody looks [TS]

00:20:35   very stereotypically like the picture [TS]

00:20:37   books and you know and the music is very [TS]

00:20:39   formal it was kind of dated even when it [TS]

00:20:42   was new [TS]

00:20:43   you know and william davis has a British [TS]

00:20:45   accent still and and this you know it's [TS]

00:20:49   its vibrant its alive it jolts you out [TS]

00:20:53   of that sort of um nothing against Ken [TS]

00:20:56   Burns but it would that sort of Ken [TS]

00:20:58   Burns look at history right where it's [TS]

00:21:00   not still photographs and it's not the [TS]

00:21:02   preconceived notions and now you [TS]

00:21:04   actually listen to Thomas Jefferson this [TS]

00:21:06   was not a thomas jefferson i knew now [TS]

00:21:09   listen to it it's not that I've avoided [TS]

00:21:11   reading history but you know you never [TS]

00:21:14   think of Thomas Jefferson as being an [TS]

00:21:16   unsympathetic character or being wrong [TS]

00:21:19   sometimes right easy spencey animal [TS]

00:21:21   jefferson and more of the geography of [TS]

00:21:24   the American Revolution and so right [TS]

00:21:26   everybody's great and they'll get along [TS]

00:21:27   and it's all I mean that the line about [TS]

00:21:29   the it's very nice in the in the rap [TS]

00:21:32   battle was a real nice declaration the [TS]

00:21:36   president running or would you like to [TS]

00:21:39   join us a stinging nettle to reply but [TS]

00:21:41   the heavens you're doing monticello it [TS]

00:21:44   yet there's so much [TS]

00:21:46   um embedded in that because it is [TS]

00:21:49   talking not only about Sally Hemings but [TS]

00:21:53   it's talking about his love of of [TS]

00:21:56   marijuana which is a fact about Thomas [TS]

00:21:59   Jefferson he smoked him all the time so [TS]

00:22:02   some really nice bits that the thrown [TS]

00:22:05   into the two humanizing yeah you've also [TS]

00:22:07   got these characters are pitted against [TS]

00:22:08   each other you need to see the [TS]

00:22:09   differences it's important to see the [TS]

00:22:10   differences Hamilton story is kind of [TS]

00:22:12   his differences with everybody around [TS]

00:22:14   him [TS]

00:22:15   yeah i like the way lin-manuel Miranda [TS]

00:22:18   although his is really making history [TS]

00:22:21   come alive he's also not afraid to just [TS]

00:22:24   shamelessly cut corners it will improve [TS]

00:22:26   the narrative because um yeah his most [TS]

00:22:29   important goal is to tell the story that [TS]

00:22:31   works so for instance you have Hamilton [TS]

00:22:34   blasting Jefferson for being [TS]

00:22:35   a slaver and then turning to his best [TS]

00:22:38   friend George Washington yeah yeah [TS]

00:22:41   yep of you will be familiar to me the [TS]

00:22:44   you know the order in which the sisters [TS]

00:22:46   met Hamilton it was not at all real [TS]

00:22:49   how about my father has no son and [TS]

00:22:51   sisters had no sons is not accurate and [TS]

00:22:54   the fact is that they are at the moment [TS]

00:22:56   in the play when Hamilton you know this [TS]

00:22:58   is one of the other notable things about [TS]

00:23:00   Hamilton is that he was the first kind [TS]

00:23:01   of american politician to be bitten by a [TS]

00:23:04   sex scandal and that's detailed in this [TS]

00:23:07   in this play but he the way it works in [TS]

00:23:11   the narrative is at that point his wife [TS]

00:23:12   basically walked away from him and it's [TS]

00:23:16   a very modern take on that relationship [TS]

00:23:18   but in fact during that whole period [TS]

00:23:21   where they are seen as being basically [TS]

00:23:23   it's implied that their part in the [TS]

00:23:25   musical they were still having kids so [TS]

00:23:28   you know that's not particularly [TS]

00:23:30   accurate either but it's all in service [TS]

00:23:32   of the of the big story here and and [TS]

00:23:35   criticism of of missing some of the [TS]

00:23:37   details sort of mrs. the big picture [TS]

00:23:39   one of the nice things about it too is [TS]

00:23:40   and we sort of touched on it the last [TS]

00:23:43   time we talked about it is the idea that [TS]

00:23:45   you know this is all a flashback that [TS]

00:23:48   bird starts out [TS]

00:23:50   introducing us to and so I went back and [TS]

00:23:53   listened to it with that in mind and and [TS]

00:23:56   so it is there is a concentration not [TS]

00:23:58   just on who lives who dies who tells [TS]

00:24:00   your story but specifically on [TS]

00:24:03   unreliable narrators getting details [TS]

00:24:06   wrong [TS]

00:24:07   Eliza taking herself out of the [TS]

00:24:09   narrative from hibernating all her [TS]

00:24:10   letters which they be no that's totally [TS]

00:24:13   made-up we don't know what she did we [TS]

00:24:16   don't know why those letters don't [TS]

00:24:17   survive but that is a gorgeous moment in [TS]

00:24:20   the show and then i have seen the [TS]

00:24:22   staging for that and it is amazing so so [TS]

00:24:26   it kind of it makes it okay to have cut [TS]

00:24:30   corners it sort of gives itself a [TS]

00:24:32   license to do that it's the intelligence [TS]

00:24:34   officers I energy what i know and i know [TS]

00:24:37   but but it just sort of baked in it's [TS]

00:24:39   not it's not just oh they did it let's [TS]

00:24:41   just say some of the people i put it [TS]

00:24:43   this way some of the people who [TS]

00:24:44   criticize the fact that characters who [TS]

00:24:46   aren't white or playing white characters [TS]

00:24:47   also criticized the musical because [TS]

00:24:49   it's not entirely accurate because [TS]

00:24:51   they're looking for things to complain [TS]

00:24:52   about in this in this story because you [TS]

00:24:55   know the fact that this is a political [TS]

00:24:57   this this story is political it is [TS]

00:24:59   political in many ways not just about [TS]

00:25:01   the politics of the past but the [TS]

00:25:02   politics of the present some people [TS]

00:25:03   don't really like that there are a lot [TS]

00:25:05   of people have made a lot of money and [TS]

00:25:07   careers out of talking about the [TS]

00:25:09   intentions of the founding fathers and [TS]

00:25:11   Miranda like cherno at wants to get [TS]

00:25:15   people to know a founding father who had [TS]

00:25:17   some different ideas and that there's [TS]

00:25:18   complexity there and you can't just talk [TS]

00:25:20   about founders intent like certain [TS]

00:25:23   members of our Supreme Court do and and [TS]

00:25:26   it can be simplified quite a bit from [TS]

00:25:28   the reality of it so that that's all [TS]

00:25:29   part of the argument that's going on [TS]

00:25:30   here i think that lovely line that an [TS]

00:25:32   ensemble member tosses off when aaron [TS]

00:25:35   burr is campaigning for president and [TS]

00:25:37   says I i could I feel like I could have [TS]

00:25:39   a beer with me [TS]

00:25:40   yeah what I appreciate is that it seems [TS]

00:25:43   like miranda is first priority is [TS]

00:25:45   putting out a really entertaining show [TS]

00:25:47   with accurate history in it and I think [TS]

00:25:50   that's the correct order [TS]

00:25:52   yeah my great and it's interesting [TS]

00:25:54   enough i mean i was not dying to read or [TS]

00:25:58   unsure knows book and and I picked it up [TS]

00:26:01   in the bookstore and with this is a very [TS]

00:26:02   heavy book it is it's got tiny prints so [TS]

00:26:06   many pages and i can say from experience [TS]

00:26:08   more than once [TS]

00:26:09   it hurts when it falls on your nose when [TS]

00:26:12   you fall asleep reading is not a [TS]

00:26:14   reflection on the book it's really good [TS]

00:26:16   but it's heavy and and yet it was [TS]

00:26:19   interesting enough that i wanted to know [TS]

00:26:21   the rest of the details and I wanted to [TS]

00:26:23   know what was that excited him about it [TS]

00:26:25   so much I mean he says by the end of the [TS]

00:26:27   second chapter he was already figuring [TS]

00:26:29   out how to make it a musical you know [TS]

00:26:31   why [TS]

00:26:32   how did how did that happen so that's [TS]

00:26:34   why I picked it up and it is a good book [TS]

00:26:37   yeah it is it's a lots of interesting [TS]

00:26:40   details and the best part of it is [TS]

00:26:41   you're not just hearing a story about [TS]

00:26:43   history when you read that book but it's [TS]

00:26:44   also a story about you get the sense [TS]

00:26:47   that it's a story that hasn't been told [TS]

00:26:48   before that that cherno is in some ways [TS]

00:26:52   a character in that book because at [TS]

00:26:54   several points he points out that [TS]

00:26:55   there's information that is essentially [TS]

00:26:57   not been collected and collated and made [TS]

00:27:00   part of the overall narrative [TS]

00:27:02   until him essentially which is really [TS]

00:27:05   interesting yeah [TS]

00:27:06   Hamilton's initial thoughts were all [TS]

00:27:08   there was some sort of like the his [TS]

00:27:11   contemporaries who wanted to throw him [TS]

00:27:13   down even after he died and then there [TS]

00:27:15   were his family members who wanted to [TS]

00:27:17   build this other narrative about it and [TS]

00:27:18   then they were all the these documents [TS]

00:27:20   including things from the Caribbean that [TS]

00:27:22   nobody even nobody even found this for [TS]

00:27:25   ya and ensure no kind of put it together [TS]

00:27:26   and says look this guy's way more [TS]

00:27:28   interesting than anyone is giving him [TS]

00:27:29   credit for [TS]

00:27:30   well no one I think honestly no one no [TS]

00:27:32   one ever looked I mean you get this this [TS]

00:27:34   line in the opening song [TS]

00:27:39   his his enemies destroyed his rep [TS]

00:27:41   America forgot him and it's true and we [TS]

00:27:44   think Alexander Hamilton we think money [TS]

00:27:46   and dollars brown and father well [TS]

00:27:48   exactly what I don't think money we [TS]

00:27:49   think you on because it's the same thing [TS]

00:27:52   you know I saw the big short recently [TS]

00:27:54   which was a just a fantastic fantastic [TS]

00:27:56   book and a fantastic movie but they [TS]

00:27:59   basically say flat out and that feels [TS]

00:28:00   like yeah this stuff sounds really [TS]

00:28:03   boring [TS]

00:28:04   are you ready to go to sleep yet ok no [TS]

00:28:06   here's a model in a bubble bath to [TS]

00:28:08   distract you [TS]

00:28:09   it's the same thing it's like Alexander [TS]

00:28:10   Hamilton he deals with money he set up [TS]

00:28:12   you know banks and financial systems [TS]

00:28:15   beyond okay why is that interesting [TS]

00:28:17   let's let's talk about atoms because you [TS]

00:28:19   know Adams would really interest and [TS]

00:28:22   adams was at least a president which we [TS]

00:28:24   have here if you weren't a president and [TS]

00:28:26   you're not Ben Franklin who's the most [TS]

00:28:28   fascinating guy in the world [TS]

00:28:29   we don't care take that Jon Jay when I [TS]

00:28:32   was in school you know basically you got [TS]

00:28:36   he was the first secretary of the [TS]

00:28:38   Treasury he got shot us in a duel with [TS]

00:28:40   aaron burr he's on the ten-dollar bill [TS]

00:28:42   next and I mean the way the way history [TS]

00:28:45   was doled out to us and in high school [TS]

00:28:48   was pretty much you know okay the Civil [TS]

00:28:49   War you memorize the general for each [TS]

00:28:52   battle that's it right there was no [TS]

00:28:54   context there was no interest was just [TS]

00:28:56   like you know memorize this stuff and [TS]

00:28:57   take the test and you know I all that [TS]

00:29:00   stuff I learned on my own because I was [TS]

00:29:02   interested and now i'm watching my [TS]

00:29:04   fourteen-year-old going through the same [TS]

00:29:05   thing he doesn't like musicals he's not [TS]

00:29:07   interested in reading history books he [TS]

00:29:09   wants to know more because he fell in [TS]

00:29:11   love with the musical he wants he wants [TS]

00:29:13   his teacher to play it like maybe you [TS]

00:29:14   need to listen to this [TS]

00:29:15   so let me ask what what do you think all [TS]

00:29:17   of you are what is the what is the thing [TS]

00:29:20   that causes Hamilton to have the appeal [TS]

00:29:22   that it does to all of us we haven't [TS]

00:29:24   even seen the show to all the people who [TS]

00:29:25   are trying to see the show that people [TS]

00:29:26   who see the show and they love it you [TS]

00:29:29   know what what is what is the source of [TS]

00:29:30   of the appeal home [TS]

00:29:33   well three things i'm gonna claim 1 it's [TS]

00:29:37   super super catchy they say you need to [TS]

00:29:39   show that you can hum and I hum stuff [TS]

00:29:42   from this musical always all [TS]

00:29:44   yeah like if I'm in a line i am waiting [TS]

00:29:47   for it [TS]

00:29:48   it's an entire can of your worms it's [TS]

00:29:49   too can be [TS]

00:29:50   it's not the entire first act song after [TS]

00:29:53   song after song about how ya the first [TS]

00:29:56   act is it is staggering ya next it's a [TS]

00:29:59   genuinely interesting story about an [TS]

00:30:01   interesting guy who you'd heard of but [TS]

00:30:05   didn't know a lot about so as soon as [TS]

00:30:08   you've heard the album once you feel [TS]

00:30:11   like you know so much more about the [TS]

00:30:13   American Revolution which if you're [TS]

00:30:15   American is a very important event so [TS]

00:30:18   you can immediately be telling people oh [TS]

00:30:20   well George Washington's right-hand man [TS]

00:30:23   was Alexander Hamilton he had to write [TS]

00:30:25   his leverage for Washington because [TS]

00:30:26   Washington was so overwhelmed even wrote [TS]

00:30:29   washington famous farewell speech and [TS]

00:30:31   then they kind of start edging away from [TS]

00:30:33   you [TS]

00:30:34   they do with me I know dates now because [TS]

00:30:37   they're in Kachin times [TS]

00:30:38   yeah I only had two I was bluffing [TS]

00:30:41   alright time for a sponsor here on the [TS]

00:30:44   accountable you know I've got a lot of [TS]

00:30:45   feedback about the sponsor from our [TS]

00:30:46   previous episode it is unusual a little [TS]

00:30:48   bit for us it is a sponsor related to [TS]

00:30:50   panties and people are like really [TS]

00:30:51   panties [TS]

00:30:52   well you know did you not hear the ads [TS]

00:30:53   for underpants and for socks there maybe [TS]

00:30:56   who knows what other garments might be [TS]

00:30:58   coming next but this in particular it's [TS]

00:31:00   Valentine's season and this is a service [TS]

00:31:02   it is designed for people with women who [TS]

00:31:05   are your partners and you want to get [TS]

00:31:08   them something nice and this is a [TS]

00:31:09   subscription service it's called [TS]

00:31:11   enclosed and it is similar to those [TS]

00:31:14   subscription services that bring you [TS]

00:31:15   cool gadget or game or flowers or beer [TS]

00:31:20   every month but instead [TS]

00:31:22   yes this is panties for that special [TS]

00:31:24   woman in your life [TS]

00:31:26   they're not the usual kind they're very [TS]

00:31:28   nice their high-quality the idea here is [TS]

00:31:31   that she will love what she gets it [TS]

00:31:33   comes in a beautiful box there's a whole [TS]

00:31:36   kind of nice experience that goes along [TS]

00:31:38   with it some flower petals it's very [TS]

00:31:40   romantic [TS]

00:31:41   you can get 13 6 or 12 months [TS]

00:31:43   subscriptions to this and you can get it [TS]

00:31:45   just in time for valentine's day now [TS]

00:31:47   enclosed product is not cheap but when [TS]

00:31:51   we're talking about that special woman [TS]

00:31:52   in your life you wouldn't want cheap [TS]

00:31:53   would you know I didn't think you would [TS]

00:31:55   you'll thank me again go to inclose [TS]

00:31:58   lingerie calm / smell use code snail [TS]

00:32:00   during checkout you'll get twenty-five [TS]

00:32:02   dollars off any multi-month order [TS]

00:32:04   so encl OS e DLI nger I e.com that was a [TS]

00:32:10   little bit like Hamilton / smell with [TS]

00:32:13   the code smell to get twenty-five [TS]

00:32:15   dollars off any multi-month order thank [TS]

00:32:17   you to enclosed for sponsoring the [TS]

00:32:19   incomparable ran what's your what's the [TS]

00:32:22   source for you of why this works so well [TS]

00:32:24   I will go off what Monty was saying for [TS]

00:32:27   story because i really do think that [TS]

00:32:29   what is what caught me what caught my [TS]

00:32:33   boyfriend my parents who hate rap on [TS]

00:32:37   pretty much every thank you everybody i [TS]

00:32:40   know who is listen to the show is like [TS]

00:32:42   this is something special even people [TS]

00:32:44   who don't like musical theater don't [TS]

00:32:45   like rap don't like anything and I i do [TS]

00:32:47   think it's the don't like America don't [TS]

00:32:49   like to know those don't don't like [TS]

00:32:51   nothing there there anti-everything no [TS]

00:32:54   I'm it's this it's the the universal [TS]

00:32:57   connection there's something in this [TS]

00:32:59   story pretty much for everybody and the [TS]

00:33:01   songs you know the the album is very [TS]

00:33:04   well constructed that it does tell a [TS]

00:33:05   complete narrative which so few musical [TS]

00:33:08   scores you can really claim for you know [TS]

00:33:10   there's always like big leaps that you [TS]

00:33:12   have to make being like does that make [TS]

00:33:14   sense but this is a show this is a show [TS]

00:33:16   in itself but even if you listen to the [TS]

00:33:20   songs out of context they're still great [TS]

00:33:23   songs and he still tell a story you know [TS]

00:33:25   on hurricane is one of those great you [TS]

00:33:28   know examples of an act to sign that i [TS]

00:33:30   actually didn't initially like and then [TS]

00:33:33   the more I listened to it the more i [TS]

00:33:36   really really identified with oh this is [TS]

00:33:38   actually you know everybody everybody [TS]

00:33:40   can identify with that like I have I [TS]

00:33:42   have this one talent that can get me out [TS]

00:33:45   of situations and for some people is [TS]

00:33:47   writing for some people it's something [TS]

00:33:49   entirely different [TS]

00:33:50   but I don't know there's something [TS]

00:33:52   there's something just so special that I [TS]

00:33:54   feel like every everyone can identify to [TS]

00:33:58   the core values of the story the idea of [TS]

00:34:01   someone who just wants to you know wants [TS]

00:34:03   to make a name for themselves wants to [TS]

00:34:05   do something important [TS]

00:34:06   fresh off the boat yeah I literally yeah [TS]

00:34:09   i mean that that speaks to fresh [TS]

00:34:12   immigrants and honestly I mean for me [TS]

00:34:14   listening to it it it reminded me [TS]

00:34:18   a lot of like oh that's the the energy [TS]

00:34:21   that i missed that from being like I'm [TS]

00:34:23   not I'm not 22 anymore you know i'm 19 [TS]

00:34:25   i'm not like young scrappy and hungry [TS]

00:34:28   I've kind of settled a little bit and I [TS]

00:34:30   have sort of a step and a stagnant life [TS]

00:34:33   but I have a settled a good life but I [TS]

00:34:35   feel like Hamilton is the kind of show [TS]

00:34:37   you listen to to get you excited about [TS]

00:34:39   your life and what you could be doing [TS]

00:34:41   and other possibilities and living in [TS]

00:34:43   the greatest city in the world [TS]

00:34:45   I don't know it just there there are [TS]

00:34:47   parts of the show that put just the [TS]

00:34:48   biggest smile on my face and make me [TS]

00:34:50   remember like there's there's a world [TS]

00:34:52   full of possibilities just you wait [TS]

00:34:55   granted most of those possibilities turn [TS]

00:34:57   horrible in act two [TS]

00:34:58   but you're always just be the most Mario [TS]

00:35:01   exact to yeah exactly yeah maybe [TS]

00:35:04   Hamilton act 1 and not Hamilton back [TS]

00:35:06   into everything he ever not great [TS]

00:35:08   I i was thinking of when I was listening [TS]

00:35:10   to this I was thinking of lawrence of [TS]

00:35:11   arabia which again historical figure and [TS]

00:35:14   that that's that's a film with an [TS]

00:35:16   intermission and act 1 the first the [TS]

00:35:18   first half of lawrence of arabia so [TS]

00:35:20   spectacular ends on a high note and act [TS]

00:35:23   2 while things kind of suck for Lawrence [TS]

00:35:25   inactive and I am I thought about and I [TS]

00:35:26   said well that's life right from [TS]

00:35:28   especially in these biographies of of [TS]

00:35:30   great people with amazing stories is [TS]

00:35:32   there's the Act one which is like here's [TS]

00:35:34   how they became famous and it's been all [TS]

00:35:35   great and then there's act 2 which is [TS]

00:35:37   like yeah and then what the the story [TS]

00:35:40   continues and it it gets complicated and [TS]

00:35:43   kind of sad after that but that's all [TS]

00:35:45   that's all part of the arc of the story [TS]

00:35:46   chip what for you what's the source of [TS]

00:35:49   of the appeal of Hamilton two parts one [TS]

00:35:52   is one is that very ark this is not [TS]

00:35:55   Hamilton's rockstar Hamilton's great [TS]

00:35:58   let's sing let's sing the praises of [TS]

00:36:00   Hamilton he's a hero all the way through [TS]

00:36:02   the end kind of story is he's almost all [TS]

00:36:04   I apologize for dragging Babylon 5 into [TS]

00:36:07   this business almost rolando he's almost [TS]

00:36:09   a Londo malaria character when we talk [TS]

00:36:11   about one broadway show without someone [TS]

00:36:13   bragging Babylon 5 into the guy i know i [TS]

00:36:15   know every time [TS]

00:36:17   Hamilton is his own worst enemy [TS]

00:36:19   absolutely me he can't stop himself he [TS]

00:36:22   can't shut up and he destroys himself [TS]

00:36:26   the fuel the fuel that makes him great [TS]

00:36:28   also destroys him that he liked is class [TS]

00:36:31   Greek tragedy structure exactly yeah [TS]

00:36:34   it's like and you know birds birds [TS]

00:36:36   advice to talk less smile more is [TS]

00:36:39   cynical but it's also not bad advice [TS]

00:36:41   sometimes yeah it's not bad when it [TS]

00:36:43   comes to self-preservation and Hamilton [TS]

00:36:46   has no interest in self-preservation and [TS]

00:36:48   that's what makes that character so [TS]

00:36:50   fascinating to watch you know you're up [TS]

00:36:52   there cheering with him at the Battle of [TS]

00:36:55   Yorktown and he just looks unstoppable [TS]

00:36:57   and you're just so full of energy and [TS]

00:37:00   then you watch him repeatedly screw up [TS]

00:37:02   it's not just a tragedy of things bad [TS]

00:37:04   things happening to him but he gives bad [TS]

00:37:06   advice to his son he goes nuts on John [TS]

00:37:10   Adams the fatalism I i think is a really [TS]

00:37:13   good point that in my shot he says I [TS]

00:37:16   imagine that so what's it feels more [TS]

00:37:17   like a memory [TS]

00:37:18   when's it gonna get in my sleep seven [TS]

00:37:21   feet ahead of me because he had come [TS]

00:37:23   into a run to let it be [TS]

00:37:24   is it like a beat without a melody never [TS]

00:37:27   thought I'd live past 20 where I come [TS]

00:37:29   from as many ask anybody in the fast and [TS]

00:37:34   we laugh reach from a blast we have to [TS]

00:37:36   make this moment last you have like it's [TS]

00:37:38   a match that from from Hamilton that his [TS]

00:37:42   life has started out so badly and he's [TS]

00:37:44   been surrounded by death that he doesn't [TS]

00:37:46   really expect to live and and when [TS]

00:37:48   Washington tells him eventually [TS]

00:37:50   all rights you want to fight got a [TS]

00:37:52   hunger was just like you when I was [TS]

00:37:54   younger it full of that disease and die [TS]

00:37:57   like a martyr yes [TS]

00:37:58   dying is easy young men living is hard [TS]

00:38:01   this is a moment of change but that mean [TS]

00:38:03   this is Hamilton's worldview and you see [TS]

00:38:05   it it he's not he's not living to [TS]

00:38:08   survive rewrite he's living to go out in [TS]

00:38:11   a in a burst of glory [TS]

00:38:13   yeah he wants he thinks up until that [TS]

00:38:14   moment he thinks the way to make his [TS]

00:38:16   legacy is to get there do something go [TS]

00:38:19   out in a blaze of glory and it that [TS]

00:38:20   morning [TS]

00:38:21   get it get put in the fight so he can [TS]

00:38:23   die a hero instead of being back at the [TS]

00:38:25   bank general Mercer got a street name [TS]

00:38:26   for ah mr. secretary mr. Byrd did you [TS]

00:38:30   hear the news about good old general [TS]

00:38:32   Mercer now you know come on street [TS]

00:38:34   yeah they renamed it after him the [TS]

00:38:36   Mersenne [TS]

00:38:37   legacy is secure sure you only had to do [TS]

00:38:40   is die that's a lot less work we ought [TS]

00:38:42   to give it a try just that would have [TS]

00:38:44   been easy wouldn't it [TS]

00:38:45   the other thing that really makes this [TS]

00:38:48   musical just hum is sometimes Hamilton's [TS]

00:38:52   not the most interesting character in [TS]

00:38:54   the show Aaron Burr oh yeah you know [TS]

00:38:58   these are two hugely flawed people and [TS]

00:39:02   they attacked life in completely [TS]

00:39:05   different ways but aaron burr is you [TS]

00:39:10   know the things that he wants you [TS]

00:39:11   understand why he wants them and as he [TS]

00:39:14   falls further and further behind [TS]

00:39:16   hamilton and and becomes almost unhinged [TS]

00:39:22   by the end you feel for him you know [TS]

00:39:24   that that man is not going to make an [TS]

00:39:26   orphan of my daughter you know that that [TS]

00:39:28   lines just sort of like desperately [TS]

00:39:30   screamed out you watch the intersection [TS]

00:39:33   between those two characters and that I [TS]

00:39:37   that may be the most propulsive force in [TS]

00:39:40   the in the whole thing maybe even beyond [TS]

00:39:43   the catchy songs think it's well it's [TS]

00:39:45   humanist right i mean there's there's [TS]

00:39:47   these these are real people they leap [TS]

00:39:50   off of the page and out of the song I [TS]

00:39:52   really great interview with the [TS]

00:39:54   descendants of Hamilton and burr hole [TS]

00:39:57   yes a descendant of hamilton and [TS]

00:39:58   ascended tuber are both friends and in a [TS]

00:40:01   boating club in New York which i think [TS]

00:40:03   is fascinating it by itself descended a [TS]

00:40:06   burr said she really didn't like Ron [TS]

00:40:08   charnos book because aaron burr is just [TS]

00:40:11   a villain in it but she loves Hamilton [TS]

00:40:13   because Burke comes off as more of a [TS]

00:40:16   rounded character like he's got [TS]

00:40:18   motivations in the musical that really [TS]

00:40:21   are explored in the book I think it's [TS]

00:40:23   fascinating [TS]

00:40:24   well in and lemon well Miranda mentions [TS]

00:40:26   that he had a couple of different books [TS]

00:40:28   to get first side and one of them i have [TS]

00:40:30   on a perennial bookmark list to to read [TS]

00:40:33   eventually this is that the heartbreak [TS]

00:40:34   of Aaron Burr which goes down that round [TS]

00:40:36   of the you know [TS]

00:40:38   wait for it is such a fantastic song on [TS]

00:40:40   the album because it really does detail [TS]

00:40:42   like this is this is trying to get [TS]

00:40:44   inside the head of someone who will [TS]

00:40:46   later become the villain [TS]

00:40:47   and like what what he what he cares [TS]

00:40:49   about and it comes down to death doesn't [TS]

00:40:52   discriminate in this insane to teach [TS]

00:40:58   break live with everyone guide coming [TS]

00:41:08   I'm willing to wait for it [TS]

00:41:11   that's supposed to be 20 25 year-old [TS]

00:41:13   bursting that but we also we look down [TS]

00:41:16   we have the privilege of knowing future [TS]

00:41:17   history and knowing that Theodosia dice [TS]

00:41:20   unspeakable young of stomach cancer and [TS]

00:41:23   knowing that his daughter dies lost at [TS]

00:41:24   sea [TS]

00:41:25   well I you could argue that this is all [TS]

00:41:27   I mean he's an audience proxy so berber [TS]

00:41:29   in many ways has access to the knowledge [TS]

00:41:31   of where of where this is all going [TS]

00:41:32   that's part of the story because he's [TS]

00:41:34   the damn fool who shot him right from [TS]

00:41:36   the start so this is he's telling that [TS]

00:41:38   story and so and so that makes it even [TS]

00:41:41   more at the whole conceit of having [TS]

00:41:44   aaron berger tell the story of Alexander [TS]

00:41:45   Hamilton is a great move and it leads to [TS]

00:41:49   a lot of interesting shading but it's [TS]

00:41:51   funny that you mention wait for it [TS]

00:41:52   because i would actually argue that's [TS]

00:41:55   one of those songs that if you take it [TS]

00:41:56   out of the context of the musical that [TS]

00:41:58   is a legitimately great song that is [TS]

00:42:01   just a great song and then in the [TS]

00:42:03   context of who's singing it and why he's [TS]

00:42:05   singing it and you could even argue in [TS]

00:42:08   some ways he's singing it [TS]

00:42:09   I mean describing everyone who has loved [TS]

00:42:11   him has died that's the Hamilton story [TS]

00:42:14   to when he comes to America is everybody [TS]

00:42:17   has died and he there's nobody left but [TS]

00:42:19   him these two men are both in this [TS]

00:42:21   position where they know you know [TS]

00:42:23   they've got nobody until they make their [TS]

00:42:25   own way [TS]

00:42:26   bern hamilton have the same story or the [TS]

00:42:29   same backstory in many ways and yet they [TS]

00:42:32   interact with the world and they're [TS]

00:42:34   they're they're they're shaped by those [TS]

00:42:36   stories in such different ways up [TS]

00:42:39   lin-manuel Miranda you know graduation [TS]

00:42:42   speeches you know grin when well Miranda [TS]

00:42:44   set for life on that circuit uh mom and [TS]

00:42:47   he did a great one where he told the [TS]

00:42:50   crop of college graduates you know that [TS]

00:42:53   wait for it and I'm going to take my [TS]

00:42:55   shot not going to throw not throwing [TS]

00:42:58   away my shot art like the the two [TS]

00:43:00   different ways to deal with life and [TS]

00:43:03   sometimes you have to do one sometimes [TS]

00:43:05   you have to do the other and it's [TS]

00:43:06   fascinating in this musical watching [TS]

00:43:09   when those strategies work for Hamilton [TS]

00:43:12   and burr and when they fail utterly [TS]

00:43:14   absolutely and not to nothing Darrell [TS]

00:43:16   too much but i would highly recommend [TS]

00:43:18   if after you've listened to the show if [TS]

00:43:21   people want to go see there's an [TS]

00:43:23   alternate version of wait for it [TS]

00:43:25   that was performed on Broadway does the [TS]

00:43:27   thing every year where they basically [TS]

00:43:29   get focus on stage and they did a [TS]

00:43:31   basically a very close to acoustic [TS]

00:43:34   version of wait for it based around all [TS]

00:43:38   of the recent murders that have been [TS]

00:43:39   going like the the black lives matter [TS]

00:43:42   movement and some of the other the the [TS]

00:43:45   recent mass shooting in San Bernardino [TS]

00:43:46   and it's it's chilling how you can take [TS]

00:43:49   a song that you know is very much in [TS]

00:43:52   context in the musical but this is this [TS]

00:43:54   is why i think that this musical is not [TS]

00:43:56   just like pop pop culture explosion and [TS]

00:43:59   will die in six months that it actually [TS]

00:44:00   has lasting meaning that you can take [TS]

00:44:02   you know you remove the first verse and [TS]

00:44:04   you take the rest of the dish the song [TS]

00:44:07   out of context you put it in a [TS]

00:44:09   completely different situation reminds [TS]

00:44:12   me a little bit of rents like will I [TS]

00:44:14   lose my dignity will someone care was [TS]

00:44:17   just these sort of haunting haunting [TS]

00:44:19   phrases that just stick in your head and [TS]

00:44:21   are useful for so many different [TS]

00:44:23   situations it's kind of interesting [TS]

00:44:25   contrast with rent and that rent has a [TS]

00:44:28   character who's obsessed with writing [TS]

00:44:31   one song before he dies that he might be [TS]

00:44:33   remembered a little whereas everyone in [TS]

00:44:36   Hamilton is doing these huge things that [TS]

00:44:38   are going to be in history books for [TS]

00:44:40   ever [TS]

00:44:42   no it's yeah I it's funny because i [TS]

00:44:44   don't think that you know I i went [TS]

00:44:46   actually after listening to Hamilton [TS]

00:44:48   about a gazillion times I'm like I want [TS]

00:44:50   to listen to you know things older [TS]

00:44:53   musical so I went back and listened to [TS]

00:44:55   blame is which is obviously a huge [TS]

00:44:56   inspiration for Hamilton in many ways [TS]

00:44:58   and also really like the French cousin [TS]

00:45:00   of Hamilton but i also went back in and [TS]

00:45:02   listened to rent and it was funny in [TS]

00:45:06   some ways where is like things that I [TS]

00:45:07   thought were endlessly clever as a you [TS]

00:45:10   know fourteen-year-old just discovering [TS]

00:45:11   rent i think are less clever now I love [TS]

00:45:15   run but let's let's cut rent a break [TS]

00:45:17   because of this it's essentially [TS]

00:45:18   unfinished I mean it was recently our [TS]

00:45:20   second it's brilliant for what it is [TS]

00:45:22   what it is an unfinished work but what [TS]

00:45:24   exactly and I don't [TS]

00:45:25   yeah I know I'm not downplaying don't [TS]

00:45:27   know i just i want to point out that i [TS]

00:45:28   mean i think that i think you're right i [TS]

00:45:30   I think brilliant but yet it has it has [TS]

00:45:33   the it but the energy is the same i [TS]

00:45:35   think that's what I was coming back to [TS]

00:45:37   is like the the energy and the [TS]

00:45:39   excitement and the love that the care [TS]

00:45:41   that the cast felts and just that the [TS]

00:45:43   the the buzz it was something different [TS]

00:45:45   it was something special there are some [TS]

00:45:47   clunkers and rent probably would have [TS]

00:45:49   gotten smooth that probably so yeah but [TS]

00:45:51   there are a few clunkers in in there are [TS]

00:45:53   this one too it's not a perfect musical [TS]

00:45:55   but that's fine [TS]

00:45:56   perfect mother musical always always [TS]

00:45:59   enough something more to shoot for [TS]

00:46:00   I like a couple points what one is I'm [TS]

00:46:02   talking about that there's this idea in [TS]

00:46:05   this about these people in this place [TS]

00:46:07   you talk about you know all over the [TS]

00:46:09   place things are going to be remembered [TS]

00:46:10   throughout history [TS]

00:46:12   Cherno makes the point in his book that [TS]

00:46:15   he there's a whole interesting section [TS]

00:46:18   where he says that you may be asking [TS]

00:46:19   yourself what how how fortunate are we [TS]

00:46:21   that these people who had these ideals [TS]

00:46:23   and these approaches were in this place [TS]

00:46:26   at this time right the greatest city in [TS]

00:46:27   the world which is totally just sucking [TS]

00:46:29   up to the people who are we here in New [TS]

00:46:30   York City but I they the how how could [TS]

00:46:35   it be well you know it's so it's so [TS]

00:46:36   lucky and what your noses look at those [TS]

00:46:38   people are always around [TS]

00:46:39   it's only they're only useful during a [TS]

00:46:42   revolution [TS]

00:46:43   they're always around but during a [TS]

00:46:45   revolution [TS]

00:46:46   those are the people who end up [TS]

00:46:47   gravitating toward these things because [TS]

00:46:49   they're the right people for that kind [TS]

00:46:50   of moment other in another time they [TS]

00:46:53   might be a horribly frustrated person or [TS]

00:46:54   simply somebody that you never heard of [TS]

00:46:56   who lived a life where they didn't get [TS]

00:46:58   to put those ideals into action but [TS]

00:47:00   they're they're always with us and in [TS]

00:47:02   those moments when the this sort of [TS]

00:47:04   thing happens they're the ones who we [TS]

00:47:06   end up remembering so I thought it was [TS]

00:47:07   an interesting point that and that of [TS]

00:47:09   course happened like during the lives of [TS]

00:47:11   something like Thomas Paine was hugely [TS]

00:47:14   important and great when we need a [TS]

00:47:16   revolution is the revolution is over [TS]

00:47:17   Thomas Paine is a really annoying guy to [TS]

00:47:20   have stopped listening don't hear much [TS]

00:47:22   about thomas & Hamilton's youth is [TS]

00:47:24   actually really important to this story [TS]

00:47:26   because being late to the party in some [TS]

00:47:30   ways uh you know his story becomes more [TS]

00:47:33   about the nation-building about the [TS]

00:47:34   revolution the revolution is very [TS]

00:47:35   dramatic and it's part of his coming of [TS]

00:47:37   age and they're all of that in there [TS]

00:47:38   but you know Hamilton makes his stamp [TS]

00:47:41   after the Revolution when they're when [TS]

00:47:43   they're building the country and another [TS]

00:47:44   thing that's internos book is that gets [TS]

00:47:46   glossed over in American history class [TS]

00:47:48   when your kid is it was a real tenuous [TS]

00:47:51   thing that there was going to be a [TS]

00:47:52   federal government with a strong central [TS]

00:47:55   government after the Revolution it was [TS]

00:47:57   very very hard for that to be coming to [TS]

00:48:00   being in hamilton was a big part of that [TS]

00:48:02   and that that's his story his story is [TS]

00:48:04   the is the after the Revolution part [TS]

00:48:06   more really than the end of revolution [TS]

00:48:08   partying so that that's a that's kind of [TS]

00:48:10   an interesting spin on it i love stories [TS]

00:48:12   like that chip a little like Babylon 5 [TS]

00:48:14   where you know when the war is over the [TS]

00:48:17   story doesn't get isn't over in fact [TS]

00:48:19   what you do after the war when you're [TS]

00:48:21   trying to put things back together can [TS]

00:48:23   be way more interesting and complicated [TS]

00:48:24   than fighting the war and Hamilton [TS]

00:48:27   definitely deals with that Wally while [TS]

00:48:30   he also is you know his plight his life [TS]

00:48:32   is in pieces too but he's trying to put [TS]

00:48:34   the simultaneously his life is in pieces [TS]

00:48:36   and he's trying to put the country [TS]

00:48:37   together and unlike Babylon 5 the [TS]

00:48:40   post-war peace really does hold up [TS]

00:48:42   yeah well you know that's because they [TS]

00:48:44   didn't try to they didn't have to finish [TS]

00:48:46   the war early for fear that the country [TS]

00:48:48   would be cancelled point I i want to [TS]

00:48:51   shift gears a little bit i want to talk [TS]

00:48:53   about the women of Hamilton that's one [TS]

00:48:55   of the things that's really notable [TS]

00:48:56   about this [TS]

00:48:57   this play is that special is that limit [TS]

00:49:00   while Miranda and I should say also how [TS]

00:49:02   amazing is that mean he is the star and [TS]

00:49:05   he is the writer of the whole thing [TS]

00:49:07   that's pretty amazing it's pretty great [TS]

00:49:09   but he has chosen to take this narrative [TS]

00:49:12   that could very easily about the men in [TS]

00:49:15   power me but it's not and it in and make [TS]

00:49:19   sure that women's voices are heard [TS]

00:49:20   throughout but one one of the things [TS]

00:49:23   that really jumped out at me on like the [TS]

00:49:27   third or fourth lesson was that there is [TS]

00:49:30   a thread of helplessness and [TS]

00:49:33   satisfaction throughout the whole story [TS]

00:49:37   and the songs you know at first you [TS]

00:49:39   think well they're all kind of their [TS]

00:49:40   songs right they're not necessarily all [TS]

00:49:43   connected but there's there's a [TS]

00:49:44   recurring theme of that would be enough [TS]

00:49:47   oh he will never be satisfied i would be [TS]

00:49:50   satisfied if you survived [TS]

00:49:52   don't die that's that would be enough [TS]

00:49:54   right and the men are never quite [TS]

00:49:56   satisfied and the women are the same [TS]

00:49:58   ones the women are the ones are like if [TS]

00:50:00   I talk to Jefferson at all you know [TS]

00:50:03   we'll we'll see about getting women into [TS]

00:50:05   the sequel in in the declaration of [TS]

00:50:07   independence and common sense and all [TS]

00:50:09   those things and and the women are [TS]

00:50:11   eminently sensible in this show and and [TS]

00:50:15   the men are idiots [TS]

00:50:17   it also extends to the ensemble the US [TS]

00:50:20   soldiers the cabinet members men and [TS]

00:50:24   women it's you know yet that doesn't [TS]

00:50:26   come across in the cast album but but [TS]

00:50:29   it's an ensemble yeah you can tell you [TS]

00:50:31   can tell from the from the choral [TS]

00:50:33   arrangements if you have an ear for [TS]

00:50:34   those things but yeah I mean in if you [TS]

00:50:36   look at any of the any of the shots and [TS]

00:50:39   I of the cast [TS]

00:50:41   it's incredible actually just how many [TS]

00:50:42   of the ensemble members are ladies and [TS]

00:50:45   if you listen to the background voices [TS]

00:50:47   on the on the cast album for all of sort [TS]

00:50:50   of the little bit parts you know [TS]

00:50:53   oh I wish i'm so glad we're here with [TS]

00:50:55   him and oh no you didn't during the rap [TS]

00:50:58   battles it's a lot of the call-outs are [TS]

00:50:59   all the the ladies all sonically usually [TS]

00:51:02   have to find a way to shove women in [TS]

00:51:04   somehow [TS]

00:51:04   uh-huh that's why Gilbert and Sullivan [TS]

00:51:06   Iraq were constantly saying and here he [TS]

00:51:09   is with his eight daughters [TS]

00:51:11   yeah exactly all right we need coral [TS]

00:51:14   harmonies but no i mean what i found was [TS]

00:51:18   really fascinating about the staging of [TS]

00:51:21   this and just the use of the coral [TS]

00:51:24   members you know quite the chorus often [TS]

00:51:26   plays a lot of different roles like [TS]

00:51:28   they're expected to kind of quick change [TS]

00:51:29   and and sort of be scenery and be [TS]

00:51:31   ensemble members wherever the ensemble [TS]

00:51:34   is necessary but Hamilton seems to take [TS]

00:51:36   it a step further and also a step back [TS]

00:51:39   in the sort of the tradition of your [TS]

00:51:40   Greek chorus where you know the chorus [TS]

00:51:43   and most of the pictures are very very [TS]

00:51:46   simply dressed in white beauty like [TS]

00:51:48   beautiful white inspired colonial [TS]

00:51:52   outfits but not quite [TS]

00:51:53   colonial outfits and they're all white [TS]

00:51:55   and off-white and then they get these [TS]

00:51:57   various things but you combine this with [TS]

00:52:00   just an ever presence of like these are [TS]

00:52:02   almost the ghosts walking through [TS]

00:52:04   Hamilton versus life and you have this [TS]

00:52:07   proscenium stage that has an upper an [TS]

00:52:10   upper balcony where characters are [TS]

00:52:12   constantly standing on and looking down [TS]

00:52:15   at the action and judging the characters [TS]

00:52:18   for what's going on and what what's [TS]

00:52:20   about to happen there was a great [TS]

00:52:22   interview vulture did this huge this [TS]

00:52:24   whole series about Hamilton Alexander [TS]

00:52:27   Hamilton's birthday so they did a [TS]

00:52:28   week-long about the show Hamilton and [TS]

00:52:30   they did am an interview with a couple [TS]

00:52:32   of the cast members of the the auxiliary [TS]

00:52:35   cast members and including Renee lows at [TS]

00:52:39   least goals i butchered her name [TS]

00:52:40   um who plays Angelica Skyler on and DVD [TS]

00:52:44   digs who plays jefferson and they [TS]

00:52:47   mentioned her like yeah there's you know [TS]

00:52:49   there's one of the songs and I'm you [TS]

00:52:52   know I look up because i have a free [TS]

00:52:54   moment and i see that Chris Jackson who [TS]

00:52:56   plays George Washington is just standing [TS]

00:52:59   up in the winter you know standing up on [TS]

00:53:01   this upper balcony just judging me just [TS]

00:53:03   looking at me one and its influence [TS]

00:53:05   every single performance i've done since [TS]

00:53:07   then because I just feel his eyes on the [TS]

00:53:09   back of my neck while I'm singing and I [TS]

00:53:12   don't know I there's there's something [TS]

00:53:14   omnipresent about it that I really loved [TS]

00:53:16   and well it can makes no bones about it [TS]

00:53:19   being a story told to you [TS]

00:53:22   oh yeah that whole framework of the [TS]

00:53:24   staging it's not it's you know it's not [TS]

00:53:27   obvious or blatant about it's not like a [TS]

00:53:30   look at what we're doing but exactly [TS]

00:53:32   it's like you [TS]

00:53:33   it's just they're leveling call he adds [TS]

00:53:37   i love when feeder can do that history [TS]

00:53:39   has its eyes on you [TS]

00:53:40   yeah who tells your story that it's [TS]

00:53:43   difficult to tell stories uh from these [TS]

00:53:45   periods involving women when all the [TS]

00:53:48   action is happening with the men in [TS]

00:53:51   terms of what we know as the history and [TS]

00:53:53   so with with angelica especially I think [TS]

00:53:58   was satisfied you get some very [TS]

00:54:01   interesting moments we have we have put [TS]

00:54:03   Alexander Hamilton up on a pedestal this [TS]

00:54:06   is his show we have heard 11 songs you [TS]

00:54:09   know that are all about Hamilton in one [TS]

00:54:12   way or another [TS]

00:54:13   and when we get to Angelica song her [TS]

00:54:16   reaction to Hamilton is finally there's [TS]

00:54:19   somebody who can match me which is we [TS]

00:54:21   will undermine left right yeah it's not [TS]

00:54:23   he's not he's he's just it's a relief [TS]

00:54:25   that he's at her level and it's a real [TS]

00:54:28   relief it's kind of amazing this is what [TS]

00:54:30   it feels like to match with one of your [TS]

00:54:32   level with the feeling of freedom of the [TS]

00:54:35   light you see it right conversation with [TS]

00:54:38   two minutes maybe three minutes [TS]

00:54:39   everything we can in total agreement is [TS]

00:54:41   the dream dance in the monster with a [TS]

00:54:44   bit of a blur but i'm giving a chance [TS]

00:54:47   family you can see the [TS]

00:54:49   and envisioning you understand [TS]

00:54:51   anyways he's flying by the seat of his [TS]

00:54:52   pants and so will and that song is that [TS]

00:54:54   may be my favorite song the whole thing [TS]

00:54:56   although I you know every song in the [TS]

00:54:57   first actor Michael that's my favorite [TS]

00:54:59   no no this wasn't her but she's got the [TS]

00:55:02   she's got the line and that that is I [TS]

00:55:10   think very important because this is [TS]

00:55:13   this is the show saying look this is [TS]

00:55:15   what this is our lot in life is we have [TS]

00:55:18   to work with stuff like this and it's [TS]

00:55:20   not that she is any less capable than [TS]

00:55:23   hamilton and in real life Angelica [TS]

00:55:26   scholar with a formidable person reading [TS]

00:55:29   common sense but Thomas Paine yeah when [TS]

00:55:31   I meet Thomas Jefferson and I did and [TS]

00:55:33   I'm have had an affair with me boo knows [TS]

00:55:36   yeah she's apparently real pals with [TS]

00:55:39   Jefferson oh yeah but when it's because [TS]

00:55:41   they're both overseas she moves i'm [TS]

00:55:44   heading off to London I have found a [TS]

00:55:45   wealthy husband who always pays no [TS]

00:55:47   actually I wanted to say something about [TS]

00:55:49   the one-two punch of helpless and [TS]

00:55:52   satisfied and I think our is very very [TS]

00:55:55   important to the core of this musical [TS]

00:55:56   it's my boy also modern in a narrative [TS]

00:55:59   way where we see the courtship play out [TS]

00:56:02   and helpless and then in satisfied [TS]

00:56:05   immediately we rewind and see the entire [TS]

00:56:07   courtship again and planning played out [TS]

00:56:09   through the other sisters perspective [TS]

00:56:11   it's so it's brilliant brilliant young [TS]

00:56:14   and some 21 fun fun side note i'm went [TS]

00:56:18   once I saw Hamilton i went back and [TS]

00:56:20   watched or listened to all of Miranda's [TS]

00:56:21   other stuff and there's a small rewind [TS]

00:56:25   bit and bring it on the musical which he [TS]

00:56:27   worked on together and as soon as I [TS]

00:56:29   heard that that the whole musical is [TS]

00:56:32   like oh my god I see the seeds of all of [TS]

00:56:33   these things [TS]

00:56:34   yeah but going back to to satisfied into [TS]

00:56:37   helpless i think it is really [TS]

00:56:38   fascinating to me that we we don't see [TS]

00:56:41   it through Peggy's I before we don't get [TS]

00:56:43   a Peggy Peggy vision but i love that i [TS]

00:56:45   don't have a contrast between we've got [TS]

00:56:49   Eliza just being completely struck head [TS]

00:56:51   over heels with this with this [TS]

00:56:53   magnificent thinker who just always says [TS]

00:56:56   the right thing and has the right words [TS]

00:56:57   and then you've got Angelica who is like [TS]

00:57:00   yeah you're pretty smooth I appreciate [TS]

00:57:01   that you can be on my level and both of [TS]

00:57:04   these women [TS]

00:57:05   the second act get called better they [TS]

00:57:07   get called back to the end of the first [TS]

00:57:08   act to do you know Eliza basically being [TS]

00:57:10   like you know all I wanna be is around [TS]

00:57:12   you know I want to be around your [TS]

00:57:14   brilliance i wanna you know I know who I [TS]

00:57:15   married I know what I signed up for and [TS]

00:57:18   I'm okay with this [TS]

00:57:19   Angelica's like well you know I know [TS]

00:57:22   what I had to sign up for and i'm just [TS]

00:57:24   going to live you know i'm going to live [TS]

00:57:26   vicariously through my letters to you [TS]

00:57:27   and I'm gonna still time [TS]

00:57:29   perhaps dr. Thomas Jefferson and and [TS]

00:57:33   enact to each of these ladies get say [TS]

00:57:36   you know Eliza gets her own song but [TS]

00:57:39   I'll but I evangelica gets a little bit [TS]

00:57:41   where they get to read like go back to [TS]

00:57:45   their original their first act selves [TS]

00:57:47   and just basically be like no you know [TS]

00:57:50   what I'm revising my I'm revising my [TS]

00:57:52   place in the narrative where it's like [TS]

00:57:54   Angelica you know Angelica of course is [TS]

00:57:56   singing the melody from satisfied when [TS]

00:57:58   she goes into him after he's you know [TS]

00:58:00   ruined everything and you publish the [TS]

00:58:01   Reynolds pamphlets happy [TS]

00:58:10   what we had died i'm standing at a time [TS]

00:58:13   you gonna be my god [TS]

00:58:16   she just walks off she's like BAM she's [TS]

00:58:19   not just saying i love Eliza more than I [TS]

00:58:21   love myself she's telling it Alexander [TS]

00:58:23   you know it's fun being pen pals with [TS]

00:58:25   you but I'm here for allies it not you [TS]

00:58:28   yeah actually yeah my the most important [TS]

00:58:31   thing to me in my life is my family and [TS]

00:58:34   you have basically just ruined my family [TS]

00:58:36   its mind over yourself you in so yeah [TS]

00:58:39   exactly and then Eliza has this [TS]

00:58:41   blockbuster moment and burn which used [TS]

00:58:44   to be one of my least favorite songs and [TS]

00:58:46   is now very much grown on me but burns [TS]

00:58:49   is basically the entire like burn for [TS]

00:58:51   one thing it's the inverse chord [TS]

00:58:53   structure of helpless which is beautiful [TS]

00:58:55   and for another she's basically tearing [TS]

00:58:58   down everything that she said and how [TS]

00:58:59   helpless when she's like I see myself as [TS]

00:59:01   this naive kid you know I saved every [TS]

00:59:03   letter you wrote me and and I love all [TS]

00:59:07   of these things and and then I and then [TS]

00:59:09   she gets to see she has to see it from [TS]

00:59:12   an outsider's perspective she wrote to [TS]

00:59:17   you you told the whole world how you [TS]

00:59:20   brought this girl into our bed and [TS]

00:59:23   clearing your name have ruined on ma [TS]

00:59:30   angelica what she read what you've done [TS]

00:59:38   everything it comes to close to the side [TS]

00:59:42   it's very much the the concept of oh [TS]

00:59:47   well this one was actually very [TS]

00:59:48   uneducated this woman that he had an [TS]

00:59:50   affair with and this woman was complete [TS]

00:59:52   complete you know buffoon not be food in [TS]

00:59:54   some ways but very under the education [TS]

00:59:57   level of any of the Skyler sisters [TS]

00:59:57   level of any of the Skyler sisters [TS]

01:00:00   and.and she manages to paint this in [TS]

01:00:02   such a way that like it's such a biting [TS]

01:00:04   way of I was this stupid I was this I [TS]

01:00:07   was this lovesick girl I was the person [TS]

01:00:10   who did this and I'm taking i'm taking [TS]

01:00:12   my narrative back she said she may say [TS]

01:00:14   i'm removing myself from the narrative [TS]

01:00:16   from your narrative but in in essence [TS]

01:00:18   she's also saying like I'm taking my [TS]

01:00:20   narrative back and I'm not going to be [TS]

01:00:22   you know i'm not going to be the help [TS]

01:00:24   sick love you know the lovesick girl who [TS]

01:00:26   can't who can't be on her own [TS]

01:00:28   you can't do anything who requires a man [TS]

01:00:32   to survive to quit the last five years [TS]

01:00:34   because it seems the matically [TS]

01:00:35   appropriate it i don't know it's there [TS]

01:00:40   there arc over the over the course of [TS]

01:00:42   the musical is fascinating to me when [TS]

01:00:44   Angelica and satisfied and she's the [TS]

01:00:48   first one who really points out the [TS]

01:00:50   darkness within Hamilton that's going to [TS]

01:00:53   come out of item and that's that's [TS]

01:00:55   something i wanted to point out that [TS]

01:00:57   she's just you know she reads him [TS]

01:01:00   instantly and she's kicking herself for [TS]

01:01:02   it but as it turns out she read him [TS]

01:01:05   exactly right and when it comes home to [TS]

01:01:07   roost it at in the second act with god I [TS]

01:01:10   hope you're satisfied the one of course [TS]

01:01:13   that the way the story ends this is this [TS]

01:01:15   is and this is tied to history right [TS]

01:01:17   this is Eliza ends up telling his story [TS]

01:01:20   this is the moment that everybody so I [TS]

01:01:22   was driving to the airport to pick up my [TS]

01:01:24   mom and it was raining and it took me [TS]

01:01:26   way too long to get there [TS]

01:01:28   the traffic was really slow and I made [TS]

01:01:30   the mistake of starting sort of the end [TS]

01:01:32   of Act one of hamilton and so by the [TS]

01:01:34   time i'm sitting on the 880 freeway and [TS]

01:01:36   it's pouring down rain i mentioned ahead [TS]

01:01:37   five miles an hour and it's getting to [TS]

01:01:39   the end of hamilton and I am just [TS]

01:01:41   sobbing in the car at that last at the [TS]

01:01:44   last song but also knowing the history [TS]

01:01:46   of it now that makes it even more [TS]

01:01:48   heartbreaking because this is you know [TS]

01:01:50   Eliza is one of the reasons that we know [TS]

01:01:54   what we do she's the one who set their [TS]

01:01:56   son as well on the case of making sure [TS]

01:02:00   that people remember to Alexander [TS]

01:02:01   Hamilton was and saving his papers and [TS]

01:02:03   she creates the orphanage which of [TS]

01:02:06   course Hamilton was an orphan [TS]

01:02:07   essentially uh you know she raises funds [TS]

01:02:10   for the Washington Monument [TS]

01:02:11   these are all these are all historical [TS]

01:02:14   fact but the beauty of it is even though [TS]

01:02:17   we start with burr you know it is Eliza [TS]

01:02:20   hotels Alexander Hamilton story so so in [TS]

01:02:24   the end i mean this this is the thing [TS]

01:02:26   where we get we have the narrative and [TS]

01:02:27   she takes herself out and put yourself [TS]

01:02:28   back in all that happens so so it's just [TS]

01:02:32   she's the one who is who [TS]

01:02:34   who is finishing the story at the end [TS]

01:02:36   and so she is vitally important to this [TS]

01:02:39   all happening and historically she was [TS]

01:02:40   vitally important to Hamilton story [TS]

01:02:42   being told so in in the end you know she [TS]

01:02:45   without the women of this story the [TS]

01:02:47   story doesn't it can't be told she [TS]

01:02:49   rescues the narrative to your documents [TS]

01:02:52   she basically you know we start with / [TS]

01:02:54   when we the world was wide enough could [TS]

01:02:57   be an ending song now I'm the two [TS]

01:03:02   I was too young and lie [TS]

01:03:07   to see [TS]

01:03:11   No [TS]

01:03:13   I should have known world was wide [TS]

01:03:17   [Music] [TS]

01:03:19   the world was wide enough for both [TS]

01:03:29   [Music] [TS]

01:03:31   and then just sprinkle sadness and then [TS]

01:03:36   but that's not that but exactly right [TS]

01:03:38   but she picks up the hell is she [TS]

01:03:40   outlived both of them [TS]

01:03:42   no one one of the things that I think is [TS]

01:03:45   really pulling people into this too is [TS]

01:03:50   we can see ourselves and in a lot of [TS]

01:03:52   these characters right there's this [TS]

01:03:54   thread of youthful exuberance and [TS]

01:03:57   confidence and intelligence and Hamilton [TS]

01:03:59   there's this thread of fear and envy and [TS]

01:04:02   and worry tuber you know he's afraid to [TS]

01:04:06   make a choice he's afraid to do it but [TS]

01:04:08   he really wants to be in the room where [TS]

01:04:10   it happens is is and you by that point [TS]

01:04:13   and and yet it's the the groundedness [TS]

01:04:17   the the focus of Eliza by the end that's [TS]

01:04:22   what carries through at the end and we [TS]

01:04:24   kind of want to be that to their you [TS]

01:04:27   know i mean i can i can look back at my [TS]

01:04:28   own life and see moments where I was any [TS]

01:04:31   one of the three of them and hopefully [TS]

01:04:33   hopefully I more like Eliza than the [TS]

01:04:35   others but you know I'm human [TS]

01:04:38   but i but i love the balance between [TS]

01:04:40   those characters because because it [TS]

01:04:43   would say that's exactly right it's not [TS]

01:04:44   a traditional hero villain kind of story [TS]

01:04:47   and it's it's more interesting that way [TS]

01:04:50   we should talk about some of the other [TS]

01:04:52   other I mean how I don't let your [TS]

01:04:54   characters [TS]

01:04:55   oh my god there's so many characters [TS]

01:04:56   that are you doing laughter that are [TS]

01:04:58   major part that are major parts of [TS]

01:05:00   history even but in hamilton the musical [TS]

01:05:03   they are smaller parts get Washington [TS]

01:05:06   well so I was gonna start with George [TS]

01:05:08   Washington interesting of you if you [TS]

01:05:09   want to mention some of the other [TS]

01:05:10   characters to just say Washington [TS]

01:05:12   Washington you know he gets a lot of [TS]

01:05:14   press if you're an American you grow up [TS]

01:05:16   you know about the father of our country [TS]

01:05:17   and and and all these things and use the [TS]

01:05:19   general and the revolutionary war that [TS]

01:05:21   shot down a cherry tree that he didn't [TS]

01:05:23   actually do which he didn't do the best [TS]

01:05:25   I Washington we get here [TS]

01:05:27   ar-ar-ar-ar really great and and boiled [TS]

01:05:33   down i think some interesting historical [TS]

01:05:36   facts about Washington and how he [TS]

01:05:38   relates to Hamilton both as a general [TS]

01:05:40   and as the as the president that I [TS]

01:05:42   really appreciate I i really enjoy [TS]

01:05:45   I really enjoy Washington of course when [TS]

01:05:48   when he visits with Hamilton and we have [TS]

01:05:53   a whole right-hand man thing it is sort [TS]

01:05:55   of spectacular we get you know quoting [TS]

01:05:57   actual lines of of Washington than by [TS]

01:06:00   the chance to defend America that's [TS]

01:06:02   exactly it [TS]

01:06:03   you get that sense of disc desperation [TS]

01:06:05   which comes back and stay alive as well [TS]

01:06:07   that again [TS]

01:06:08   history we think of history as a favor [TS]

01:06:10   to complete when you get taught in [TS]

01:06:12   school and then seeing it here you [TS]

01:06:14   realize how how it could have gone any [TS]

01:06:16   number of bad ways and that these people [TS]

01:06:19   were kind of remarkable to have done [TS]

01:06:20   what they did and and the portrayal of [TS]

01:06:22   washington in hamilton actually i really [TS]

01:06:24   i really love it yet Christopher Jackson [TS]

01:06:26   does a great job it is a it is a really [TS]

01:06:28   cool kind of performance to get the [TS]

01:06:30   sense of this guy being so formidable [TS]

01:06:32   and so respected by the other characters [TS]

01:06:36   because he's I mean who else could it be [TS]

01:06:38   who else could be the president who else [TS]

01:06:40   could give legitimate legitimacy to this [TS]

01:06:43   federal government there's only one [TS]

01:06:44   person could have possibly been and that [TS]

01:06:46   was Washington we look back at this in [TS]

01:06:48   retrospect now and and all these years [TS]

01:06:50   we've known this we've known this is how [TS]

01:06:52   it all filters out but what if Luke had [TS]

01:06:55   missed the shot in the Death Star trench [TS]

01:06:57   right yeah it's the same kind of thing [TS]

01:07:00   it's just taken is given now but in the [TS]

01:07:03   moment maybe it doesn't work maybe it [TS]

01:07:05   fails we got a star wars references to [TS]

01:07:08   work yeah we're doing are we doing a [TS]

01:07:10   check by Frank that tricky [TS]

01:07:12   anyway you want to talk about you know [TS]

01:07:13   we got we got duh obviously Jefferson we [TS]

01:07:16   got a Lorentz and lafayette and Hercules [TS]

01:07:18   Mulligan mad and Samuel seabury and King [TS]

01:07:21   George George when he says that he got [TS]

01:07:25   through like the first two chapters and [TS]

01:07:26   suddenly wanted to write the book on the [TS]

01:07:28   1st earth would the show on the first [TS]

01:07:31   page of chapter 3 in the book is the [TS]

01:07:33   name Hercules mulligan and i have to [TS]

01:07:36   think he had to have read that far just [TS]

01:07:37   to go i wanna rhyme that name i'll bet [TS]

01:07:40   that I name my name is really as well [TS]

01:07:45   again I mean come on [TS]

01:07:46   sounds like a rapper named yeah I i will [TS]

01:07:49   sit I will say that [TS]

01:07:50   daveed digs in the two great roles of [TS]

01:07:53   lafayette Jefferson is incredible [TS]

01:07:56   yeah if that man does not get the [TS]

01:07:58   supporting Tony I will cry [TS]

01:08:01   yeah I hope he finds something else to [TS]

01:08:04   do on Broadway cuz i don't want him to [TS]

01:08:06   go back to just being a rapper [TS]

01:08:08   I don't know what else they can do with [TS]

01:08:10   him I he'd be a great uh Harold Hill & [TS]

01:08:14   Music Man but that's kind of obvious i [TS]

01:08:17   wanted to stick around [TS]

01:08:18   yeah he's um I mean again reading [TS]

01:08:22   interviews with him is very funny [TS]

01:08:23   because of course he's relatively new to [TS]

01:08:25   the Broadway thing and it was lemon well [TS]

01:08:27   Miranda being like oh my god I know the [TS]

01:08:29   perfect person from this and just going [TS]

01:08:32   for it and it was true it's true it's [TS]

01:08:34   absolutely true [TS]

01:08:35   the dual casting is something to talk [TS]

01:08:37   about to the fact that you know I'm devi [TS]

01:08:41   digs and i can't pronounce his name [TS]

01:08:43   properly so i'm not going to oak who [TS]

01:08:46   plays Hercules Mulligan and James [TS]

01:08:48   Madison and and Anthony Ramos who plays [TS]

01:08:50   phillip hamilton and john lawrence I [TS]

01:08:53   don't want to swap their because really [TS]

01:08:55   it's yeah but uh it's it is crazy to me [TS]

01:08:59   the fact that they have such wildly [TS]

01:09:01   different parts you know you think about [TS]

01:09:03   what defeat has to play in the first [TS]

01:09:05   half of the show vs. the second half of [TS]

01:09:08   the show the styles of like lafayette [TS]

01:09:10   and Jefferson are two very different [TS]

01:09:12   people they may have both spent a decent [TS]

01:09:15   amount of time in France come but they [TS]

01:09:17   merit not at all no no and it's such a [TS]

01:09:21   cool challenge for the actors to play [TS]

01:09:23   and they have different singing styles [TS]

01:09:25   defeat has to wrap in French essentially [TS]

01:09:28   like wrapping a French accent with a [TS]

01:09:31   little bit of French toston i'm anthony [TS]

01:09:33   around us has to die [TS]

01:09:35   well suppose died twice huh i get enough [TS]

01:09:39   history [TS]

01:09:39   I don't know John had been a while ago [TS]

01:09:41   yeah I'm Lawrence doesn't really make it [TS]

01:09:43   through the revolution spoilers for the [TS]

01:09:45   American Revolution y-yeah I guess yeah [TS]

01:09:48   and and ochre a date and help them send [TS]

01:09:53   that right who plays Hercules Mulligan [TS]

01:09:55   and James Madison I mean Hercules [TS]

01:09:57   mulligan is like the again is the best [TS]

01:10:00   rap name of hot girls elegant and then [TS]

01:10:03   he goes to play Madison [TS]

01:10:05   and it's like Mulligan wraps pretty much [TS]

01:10:07   the entire first step and is just acting [TS]

01:10:09   it's just kind of like yeah I'm the you [TS]

01:10:11   know i'm i'm the the big strong arm dude [TS]

01:10:15   and madison is almost silky and almost [TS]

01:10:18   afraid in some ways I think he's Charles [TS]

01:10:20   Jefferson's number two and he and he and [TS]

01:10:23   Alexander Hamilton used to be buds but [TS]

01:10:25   you don't see it all happens off-screen [TS]

01:10:26   yeah when you know one thing that's been [TS]

01:10:30   really interesting to watch that and [TS]

01:10:31   this is you know going back to people [TS]

01:10:34   telling me about this for years they've [TS]

01:10:36   been workshopping this mean he took six [TS]

01:10:38   years to really write it [TS]

01:10:40   they've been workshopping it since 2013 [TS]

01:10:42   daveed digs and Christopher Jackson [TS]

01:10:45   who's George Washington are the only [TS]

01:10:47   other two cast members who have been [TS]

01:10:49   there right from the start so they've [TS]

01:10:51   had you know close to three years to get [TS]

01:10:54   used to this by now and it really shows [TS]

01:10:57   that speaks to something that's sort of [TS]

01:10:59   fascinates me about broadway in general [TS]

01:11:01   where the lafayette and Jefferson part [TS]

01:11:03   is so tailored to defeat digs that [TS]

01:11:07   because W can go so fast lin-manuel [TS]

01:11:10   Miranda was constantly adding things [TS]

01:11:12   like I can put more syllables are there [TS]

01:11:15   are going to give him another live in [TS]

01:11:16   another line but that becomes part of [TS]

01:11:18   the official role so now because this [TS]

01:11:21   play is already moving to check that [TS]

01:11:23   movie Chicago they're opening a Chicago [TS]

01:11:25   run already [TS]

01:11:27   it's going to go on tour is going to be [TS]

01:11:28   done by kids everywhere yes and and for [TS]

01:11:31   all of those people they're all going to [TS]

01:11:33   have to be as not as good as to be digs [TS]

01:11:36   but they're gonna have to try to be as [TS]

01:11:37   fast as event said well but you know [TS]

01:11:40   it's one thing to do it for the very [TS]

01:11:42   first time and get used to it but you [TS]

01:11:45   know when Robert Preston was the music [TS]

01:11:47   man right who maybe Danny Kaye could [TS]

01:11:50   have done but then I've grown up for you [TS]

01:11:54   know 40-something years doing you got [TS]

01:11:56   trouble I can do it right [TS]

01:11:58   I've listened to it enough and so people [TS]

01:12:00   are gonna be listening to this and [TS]

01:12:01   practicing it in doing it and it'll just [TS]

01:12:04   be that's how you do it you have to do [TS]

01:12:07   it that fast you get it that's true [TS]

01:12:08   that's like lin-manuel said one of the [TS]

01:12:11   reasons he's letting kids see it cheaper [TS]

01:12:14   that the 10,000 [TS]

01:12:17   school to school children around New [TS]

01:12:19   York and you get ten dollar tickets and [TS]

01:12:22   for them this is the starting point for [TS]

01:12:25   what theater is they're going to sit [TS]

01:12:26   down and assume oh that's what the [TS]

01:12:28   musical looks like and then we get to [TS]

01:12:31   see where they take their form i'm so [TS]

01:12:34   excited to see this come to schools [TS]

01:12:38   it is such an A like a little while [TS]

01:12:41   Miranda describes all of the stuff that [TS]

01:12:44   he writes as like really i'm just [TS]

01:12:46   writing musicals for my high school and [TS]

01:12:49   it's when you think about like in the [TS]

01:12:50   heights and what he did from the heights [TS]

01:12:51   but especially Hamilton there are so [TS]

01:12:54   many parts so many juicy wonderful parts [TS]

01:12:57   and it's not just two people singing [TS]

01:13:00   two-thirds of the songs right it's there [TS]

01:13:03   there's just these there's these [TS]

01:13:04   intricate narratives I mean you think [TS]

01:13:05   about you know the women get a bunch of [TS]

01:13:08   great songs and it's again not just [TS]

01:13:10   leading lady material its meaty [TS]

01:13:13   interesting stuff there's great coral [TS]

01:13:15   parts pretty much continually there's so [TS]

01:13:18   much great coral park so many great [TS]

01:13:19   coral part so many great individual [TS]

01:13:21   parts the fact that you know you don't [TS]

01:13:24   have to double cast jefferson and [TS]

01:13:26   lafayette you can split them up if you [TS]

01:13:28   really want to and you need to make more [TS]

01:13:29   parts for a look at the airport before [TS]

01:13:33   kids in the in the musical career [TS]

01:13:36   yeah this is the III also i wanted to [TS]

01:13:38   say in addition to the light the [TS]

01:13:39   terrible legacy this and how it impacts [TS]

01:13:41   the people in theater limb well Miranda [TS]

01:13:45   when he was talking to Charlie Rose for [TS]

01:13:46   60 minutes said that you know his [TS]

01:13:48   experience with so many of these shows [TS]

01:13:51   was the album's because he didn't you [TS]

01:13:55   know he didn't go see musicals he [TS]

01:13:57   remembers the first musical he saw but [TS]

01:13:59   most of the time it was his parents and [TS]

01:14:01   cast albums that it and and he said [TS]

01:14:03   because they actually shot 60 minutes [TS]

01:14:05   shot there's a there's a thing on the 60 [TS]

01:14:07   minute website you can see they shot [TS]

01:14:09   them or recording the cast album and in [TS]

01:14:12   there Miranda says we realize this is [TS]

01:14:15   going to be this is our stamp this is [TS]

01:14:17   our thing that most people are going to [TS]

01:14:18   hear because there are only so many [TS]

01:14:19   people come here and on Broadway [TS]

01:14:21   this is this is it you know we will and [TS]

01:14:23   I want this to be good because you know [TS]

01:14:25   for him [TS]

01:14:26   that's one way you experience this stuff [TS]

01:14:28   is not is not live in person and and [TS]

01:14:30   uh you know the fact that we're so [TS]

01:14:33   enthusiastic about it and talking about [TS]

01:14:34   it here is telling because again we are [TS]

01:14:36   those people experiencing it through the [TS]

01:14:38   cast album and not being there in person [TS]

01:14:40   I mean and and being there in person [TS]

01:14:42   it's just different [TS]

01:14:43   it's a slut it's a it's a slice of time [TS]

01:14:45   it's every performance is unique that's [TS]

01:14:47   one of the beautiful things about [TS]

01:14:48   theater but the fat like I've never seen [TS]

01:14:50   book of mormon never got a chance but [TS]

01:14:52   I've listened to that LOL i've listened [TS]

01:14:55   to that soundtrack and its really great [TS]

01:14:56   and I have seen you know I did see the [TS]

01:14:59   producers with matthew broderick nathan [TS]

01:15:00   lane and that was great and I've got [TS]

01:15:02   that and that's got some memories [TS]

01:15:03   attached to it but regardless there [TS]

01:15:05   they're different and I just I love his [TS]

01:15:08   awareness of the fact that the cast [TS]

01:15:10   album is super important because it is [TS]

01:15:12   that that stamp like this is this is who [TS]

01:15:14   we all whereas the original cast and [TS]

01:15:17   this is how so many people will [TS]

01:15:18   experience the story either before they [TS]

01:15:19   see it or maybe they never see it but [TS]

01:15:21   they experience it anyway and because [TS]

01:15:23   the book is so scan it essentially the [TS]

01:15:25   the cast album is the content of the [TS]

01:15:27   musical with you know the audio content [TS]

01:15:30   of the musical that's the other part [TS]

01:15:31   it's not like you're missing long as you [TS]

01:15:35   know spoken scenes the the stories told [TS]

01:15:37   the music and so it's not like some [TS]

01:15:40   other cast musicals were cast albums [TS]

01:15:42   where you say oh I guess a story happens [TS]

01:15:45   in between those two songs that does not [TS]

01:15:47   happen and in Hamilton is it 530 great [TS]

01:15:50   story actually somebody in the chatroom [TS]

01:15:51   link to it i read i remember reading [TS]

01:15:53   this a few weeks ago [TS]

01:15:54   it is the how there are more words and [TS]

01:15:57   hamilton and then any than any musical [TS]

01:16:01   basically ever even close [TS]

01:16:03   yeah yes I'm sure it's beyond yeah it [TS]

01:16:05   was great to watch the 60 minutes piece [TS]

01:16:07   because when when he's he's standing [TS]

01:16:09   there with the shelf of cast albums and [TS]

01:16:11   he's geeking out over camelot time I'm [TS]

01:16:13   just kind of looking going [TS]

01:16:14   that was my childhood that right there [TS]

01:16:16   was the shelf of albums and i only love [TS]

01:16:19   the way that he introduces Camelot or [TS]

01:16:22   yes yes Rosie's like dis listen to go on [TS]

01:16:25   here it has the dopest belittle every [TS]

01:16:28   I'm telling you and that dude is a nerve [TS]

01:16:31   yeah we at love him and I mean you know [TS]

01:16:34   that but that was the thing was the cast [TS]

01:16:36   albums were just the songs sometimes you [TS]

01:16:38   got snippets of dialogue sometimes you [TS]

01:16:39   didn't even get all the songs because [TS]

01:16:41   you know they couldn't fit and they [TS]

01:16:43   didn't want to do [TS]

01:16:43   double album or anything the only thing [TS]

01:16:46   I have that's comparable I i lucked into [TS]

01:16:49   finding I don't even know why they did [TS]

01:16:51   this at a an album of the entire text of [TS]

01:16:55   tom stoppard's the real thing with the [TS]

01:16:57   broadcast so it's jeremy irons and Glenn [TS]

01:16:59   Close and cynthia nixon and and it's [TS]

01:17:02   bizarre and it's sitting here on my [TS]

01:17:04   shelf with all these musicals and I've [TS]

01:17:07   listened to it once and Hamilton listen [TS]

01:17:09   to over and over and over and over and [TS]

01:17:10   over but yeah I mean that's it's it's so [TS]

01:17:14   hard to get people into theater now [TS]

01:17:16   because it's you know you've got netflix [TS]

01:17:20   and hulu and you know all the [TS]

01:17:21   entertainment options on your couch and [TS]

01:17:23   then you have the cast album but this is [TS]

01:17:26   what I mean my son doesn't necessarily [TS]

01:17:30   want to go see theater all the time and [TS]

01:17:31   he's that he's not a musical fan at all [TS]

01:17:33   he wants to go see Hamilton he wants [TS]

01:17:37   lin-manuel Miranda to write all the rest [TS]

01:17:41   of history so that he can understand it [TS]

01:17:42   better right [TS]

01:17:44   he said can can you get him to do that I [TS]

01:17:46   can't get him to do that i can probably [TS]

01:17:48   get them to say hi on a video but i [TS]

01:17:50   can't get them to do that [TS]

01:17:51   get out but yeah i mean that's that's [TS]

01:17:55   how that's how we did it in Florida you [TS]

01:17:58   know you you'd watch the tonys once a [TS]

01:18:01   year and you listen to all the cast [TS]

01:18:03   albums and living in indiana same thing [TS]

01:18:05   I can go to regional theaters i can go [TS]

01:18:07   to the Broadway shows on tour still not [TS]

01:18:11   quite the same and if you don't want to [TS]

01:18:12   see any of the ones on tour huh tough [TS]

01:18:14   and that's why i started this blog [TS]

01:18:16   called broadway.com haha Thank You Monty [TS]

01:18:19   segue [TS]

01:18:20   yes I anything more before we wrap it up [TS]

01:18:22   I feel like we've covered a lot of [TS]

01:18:24   ground there's so much more to cover one [TS]

01:18:26   could probably do a podcast in which [TS]

01:18:29   every episode was covering just a single [TS]

01:18:31   track of Hamilton for 46 episodes could [TS]

01:18:35   one that's why don't you talk about it [TS]

01:18:37   long enough Jason it i don't know i [TS]

01:18:39   don't actually do you know half an hour [TS]

01:18:41   on like my shot for example i think that [TS]

01:18:44   could totally be in case maybe maybe [TS]

01:18:46   maybe we'll see we'll see if somebody [TS]

01:18:48   does a podcast like that those people [TS]

01:18:50   would be kind of a kind of nuts even try [TS]

01:18:51   something like that but that that you [TS]

01:18:53   know it's yeah i just want to point out [TS]

01:18:55   your kind [TS]

01:18:57   it's nuts oh interesting kind of kind of [TS]

01:19:01   maybe it is is David why don't people go [TS]

01:19:04   to the uncomfortable calm / pod for ham [TS]

01:19:07   and check it out it might be a podcast [TS]

01:19:11   entirely about Hamilton otherwise it's [TS]

01:19:13   time to wrap up our special episode [TS]

01:19:15   about musical theater and it might [TS]

01:19:17   happen again sometime you never know but [TS]

01:19:19   these these uh hey there was just too [TS]

01:19:22   much momentum too many people want to [TS]

01:19:23   talk about Hamilton it's too exciting [TS]

01:19:25   so we had to do it so thank you to my [TS]

01:19:27   gas for enjoying the this change of pace [TS]

01:19:30   with me David lure thank you thank you [TS]

01:19:33   chip sudderth thanks for being here [TS]

01:19:36   I'm only sorry that my son is 14 years [TS]

01:19:38   old and it's too late for me to change [TS]

01:19:39   his name to Hercules Mulligan maybe it's [TS]

01:19:42   never too late maybe you can name a [TS]

01:19:44   future cat Hercules Mulligan future cat [TS]

01:19:46   Monty Ashley thank you thank you [TS]

01:19:49   broadway.com thank you can if I stopped [TS]

01:19:53   listening to Hamilton that yeah sure [TS]

01:19:55   answer entity called well thank you [TS]

01:19:57   thank you [TS]

01:19:59   alright theater nerds back in the Box [TS]

01:20:01   sci-fi nerds you can come back out [TS]

01:20:03   I'm Jason sell for the income people [TS]

01:20:04   will see you next time [TS]

01:20:13   it has come to my attention that a lot [TS]

01:20:19   of people are not aware of some of the [TS]

01:20:20   other podcast on the incomparable [TS]

01:20:22   network especially the TV podcast if you [TS]

01:20:24   like shows like arrow the flash legends [TS]

01:20:28   of tomorrow the expanse we are doing [TS]

01:20:31   podcasts about a bunch of different TV [TS]

01:20:34   shows on the TV podcast so if you want [TS]

01:20:36   to hear us talking about the expanse for [TS]

01:20:37   example you can get to it by going to be [TS]

01:20:39   incomparable calm / TV te ve or just go [TS]

01:20:43   to the incomparable calm and click on [TS]

01:20:45   the subscribe link and you'll get a list [TS]

01:20:47   of all the great shows on the [TS]

01:20:49   incomparable [TS]

01:20:51   [Music] [TS]