The Talk Show

123: Live From WWDC 2015 With Guest Phil Schiller


00:00:00   Ladies and gentlemen, Daring Fireball Productions is pleased to welcome you to mezzanine.

00:00:10   Please silence your phones, take your seats, and welcome to the stage, You Look Nice Today.

00:00:16   (audience cheers)

00:00:19   - How's it going everybody?

00:00:32   How you doing tonight?

00:00:33   (audience cheers)

00:00:35   I am Merlin Mann.

00:00:37   - I am Adam Lisagor.

00:00:39   - And we're used to having our friends,

00:00:45   Scott Simpson out with us! Scott Simpson everybody!

00:00:48   [audience cheers]

00:00:49   Scott Simpson!

00:00:50   [audience claps]

00:00:52   Um...

00:00:53   Hey Merlin.

00:00:54   Yeah.

00:00:55   Where's Scott Simpson?

00:00:56   I have literally no idea.

00:00:58   [audience laughs]

00:00:59   You, I, did you, did you like,

00:01:01   [imitates

00:01:01   Get with him?

00:01:03   Oh see, I was not under the impression that that was something that I was false under the rubric of my general...

00:01:09   I guess I assumed that was something John would take care of.

00:01:11   I had also likewise assumed that John would be taking care of this, notifying our partner.

00:01:19   It's great to be here! How are you guys doing tonight?

00:01:21   This is going really, really...

00:01:23   Woo! Am I right?

00:01:25   This is going really well. I see some friends in the audience.

00:01:27   Oh my god you guys. Oh so many. Five, seven, nine...

00:01:29   Nine...

00:01:31   Nine friends in the audience.

00:01:33   This guy had no idea.

00:01:35   He had no idea.

00:01:37   Oh that's...

00:01:39   F***ing Groober!

00:01:41   Jesus!

00:01:43   What a homemade piece of shit that guy is.

00:01:45   No, no.

00:01:47   He is great.

00:01:49   We're all here to celebrate John Groober.

00:01:51   I used to be into him.

00:01:53   I used to be into him.

00:01:55   Oh I was there in the beginning.

00:01:57   into Apple stuff. And I was there for a while. Me too, I love his Apple writing.

00:02:02   He writes about Apple stuff. Sometimes when he posts from Disneyland he remembers to close the

00:02:09   bracket. No, I'm super into John. But no, I am too. I love him.

00:02:17   Yes. We're here for him tonight to celebrate John Gruber. We're all here.

00:02:22   Doesn't it seem like he phones it in a little bit these days though? I had not noticed that.

00:02:26   Yeah, really? You don't notice that?

00:02:27   No, interesting. No, I think he's a solid writer.

00:02:30   Claim chowder? You don't notice that?

00:02:32   I mean, come on! It's the biggest company in the world, like they're doing fine.

00:02:38   You don't notice that?

00:02:40   Yeah, but the haters, the haters must be punished.

00:02:43   Oh, the haters, the haters.

00:02:45   Ooh, they hate John.

00:02:47   I heard he actually uses WordPress.

00:02:50   Ah.

00:02:51   With the cash off, because it doesn't really matter.

00:02:54   It's not nearly as popular as it seems.

00:02:56   Nothing against the guy.

00:02:58   He's not as tall as he seems, but...

00:03:00   [laughter]

00:03:02   That is true. That is true.

00:03:04   He's much, much shorter in person.

00:03:06   I heard he's actually not that into the Yankees.

00:03:08   [laughter]

00:03:10   Too...

00:03:12   Just a little too far.

00:03:14   A little too close to home?

00:03:16   You know, I just... I was there with him.

00:03:18   I was there every step of the way.

00:03:20   I wanted to be there.

00:03:22   But we're here for him tonight. We love the guy.

00:03:24   Yes, we're definitely. Yeah, Gruber.

00:03:26   All of us. John Gruber.

00:03:27   We got a poll for John Gruber. John Gruber everybody. John Gruber.

00:03:29   [Audience cheers]

00:03:31   John Gruber.

00:03:32   The top show.

00:03:33   I kind of feel a little bit like you're defending him.

00:03:35   Like you're kind of a little bit on his side.

00:03:37   Well of course I am. He is the reason that I am who I am today.

00:03:40   In every way. In every way.

00:03:42   Really? You're the man you are now is because of John.

00:03:45   Pretty much.

00:03:46   Okay. Kind of don't get that.

00:03:48   Something Apple, he had a site, it's the Apple stuff.

00:03:52   - It's the, well, you know, it's his passion,

00:03:54   his singular passion and vision

00:03:56   for the whole landscape of Apple

00:04:00   and the culture of Apple.

00:04:02   It's a celebration.

00:04:03   - It's a culture and celebration.

00:04:04   - That means something, it's very dear to me.

00:04:07   - Technology?

00:04:08   - What are you doing right now?

00:04:10   - I'm just, I'm literally curious

00:04:12   about how he's inspired you.

00:04:13   - Yeah, but we, this is not about me, it's about--

00:04:16   - No.

00:04:16   Is it about the ads?

00:04:20   Okay, okay. So...

00:04:24   No, this is fine.

00:04:28   No, tell him! Go ahead, tell him. It's like a personal project for me.

00:04:32   John's sponsored reads.

00:04:36   I don't know if you guys remember when he started doing these, it was just...

00:04:40   He can almost pronounce fracture.

00:04:44   you could almost pronounce most words and

00:04:49   sure see if we both love being on his show right oh yeah we do we love I love

00:04:53   it I mean I've had a great time as a guest on his show the reason in real

00:04:57   time and then the second and third time he does it you just see right yeah you

00:05:01   just nod nod no it's an audio presence of the master yes yeah you sort of you

00:05:07   sort of make up a story about the sponsor yeah right I'm not getting paid

00:05:12   I feel like there might be a set of Christmas lights in front of him and it lights up and

00:05:17   It just goes glass base and then then like he says some words

00:05:20   It's kind of just a general like chef's salad of words to come out, but here's what I did

00:05:24   I noticed that he had a he had a little difficulty really selling it selling the product

00:05:30   This is early on and I took him and I I took him under my wing and I molded him

00:05:35   He's like a child to you. Yeah. Yeah, that's yes

00:05:38   So there is some sort of ownership over John's sponsorship with Reed's which are really like really world-class

00:05:44   They are seriously the really good less slightly best CPMs to be they are

00:05:50   Literally not the worst in the world so much every week

00:05:53   Any more but then that's that's it's inspired you. It's like you see a child. Yeah, right

00:05:58   I'm gonna I'm gonna build a swing sedan. I'm gonna push you all I'm saying is

00:06:02   He used to be and now he is yes. He's a giant in the sponsored Reed's world

00:06:08   You know, it's really true. Our thanks to John Gruber.

00:06:12   He's not as bad as he seems, really.

00:06:18   No.

00:06:19   He kinda is.

00:06:20   No, he's quite good. And that is why it is a tremendous, tremendous honor for Merlin and I to be here.

00:06:27   There's a reason we call him the chairman.

00:06:29   Ladies and gentlemen, John Gruber.

00:06:31   [APPLAUSE]

00:06:34   Thanks, Scott.

00:06:45   [LAUGHTER]

00:06:48   Welcome to the fourth annual live from WWDC talk show.

00:07:00   I am John Gruber.

00:07:01   This is the talk show.

00:07:01   I'm assuming most of you are familiar with the situation.

00:07:05   I have some administrative stuff to take care of

00:07:09   before we really start the show proper.

00:07:11   I will reiterate like I did last year,

00:07:14   we have an open bar and we have a great sponsor

00:07:18   who we can thank for that.

00:07:19   You are all drinking on their dime and that's MailChimp.

00:07:22   (audience cheering)

00:07:25   If you don't know MailChimp

00:07:28   and you ever have the need for email marketing,

00:07:32   really check them out, MailChimp.com.

00:07:34   Not kidding, I remember,

00:07:36   did you guys remember this two years ago?

00:07:37   There's like a minimum here on the bar

00:07:39   and we came up short.

00:07:40   And it was very embarrassing to me.

00:07:44   And then I told you guys this last year.

00:07:45   I said, "So seriously, drink."

00:07:47   And we went way over last year.

00:07:49   That was better, that was better.

00:07:53   So do that again.

00:07:54   If you're thirsty, go get another one.

00:07:56   Seriously, it's all on MailChimp. My thanks to them.

00:07:58   First time this year we have live video.

00:08:04   So we are hopefully, knock on wood,

00:08:07   going out to the world at large. Better to be here live,

00:08:12   but second best, watch it on the stream.

00:08:15   And that is thanks to Fracture.

00:08:20   You guys know Fracture.

00:08:21   (audience laughing and applauding)

00:08:25   Anybody here doesn't know Fracture?

00:08:31   Well, if you don't, they have this great service.

00:08:35   You go to fractureme.com, that's their website.

00:08:38   You send them your photos, they print them on glass.

00:08:42   There's no frame around it,

00:08:43   it's just right there on the glass.

00:08:45   It looks amazing, they have great prices,

00:08:48   They have sizes ranging from like these index cards all the way up to big 23 inch by 29 inch size.

00:08:56   Can't go wrong. Go check them out and they have a special code just for this show.

00:09:00   They want to see just how well this show did.

00:09:02   If you use the code WWDC, very easy to spell, you'll save 15% on anything you order.

00:09:12   So that's a tremendous deal. So my thanks to Fracture.

00:09:15   And last but not least, the event itself is sponsored by a small software company in Seattle.

00:09:25   They're a company called Microsoft.

00:09:29   You guys know that. I mean, I write about Microsoft all the time.

00:09:34   But no joke, here's the thing.

00:09:38   If anybody here, has anybody here been to this show before in previous years?

00:09:42   So this is their third year sponsoring the live talk show. I mean this is you

00:09:48   know it's not that odd anymore. It really isn't and and they've really

00:09:54   pivoted. They've made major investments in in their developer tools and their

00:10:00   cloud infrastructure and built it out in a way that is it's tremendous for iOS

00:10:07   Mac developers even Android developers but any platform they really have grown

00:10:12   past being just about Windows and it's great stuff. We use it at Vesper for sync.

00:10:17   Our sync system has never had a problem due to the hosting stuff there. It is

00:10:22   absolutely rock-solid. I recommend it even if they weren't a sponsor I would

00:10:26   recommend it but check them out. They have a special website that they've made

00:10:30   and it's for their appeal to app developers regardless of your platform

00:10:35   and the website is any app, any dev dot com.

00:10:40   A-N-Y A-P-P A-N-Y D-E-F dot com.

00:10:45   Go check it out, that's their message to you.

00:10:47   I mean, but they're all over the place this year.

00:10:50   They sponsored Down Rumple's Beard Bash last night,

00:10:53   they sponsored Alt Conf, all sorts of great stuff.

00:10:57   So my thanks to them.

00:10:59   (audience applauding)

00:11:03   So I have one guest for tonight,

00:11:12   and it truly is, I use the words all the time

00:11:14   when Moltz is on the show, I say a very special guest.

00:11:17   That's not a very special guest.

00:11:19   (audience laughing)

00:11:20   This time I do have a very special guest,

00:11:24   and I am very excited to introduce him.

00:11:29   Ladies and gentlemen, I shit you not, Phil Schiller.

00:11:36   (Applause.)

00:11:59   (audience cheering)

00:12:02   One giant selfie, everybody, no.

00:12:19   (audience cheering)

00:12:26   Wow.

00:12:28   And I think Moltz is so funny, so I can't believe I got the cheer.

00:12:31   [laughter]

00:12:34   So my first question every year at this event is always,

00:12:39   "How'd you think the keynote went yesterday?"

00:12:41   [laughter]

00:12:44   Well, they finally introduced all the things I was expecting, so...

00:12:48   [laughter]

00:12:50   I think it went amazing. I was so impressed.

00:12:53   And everyone did a great job, from Tim on to Jimmy,

00:12:57   to Jimmy and and yeah a lot of work goes into it so you know I don't I don't

00:13:02   think a company in this earth could have done better. I heard some laughter when

00:13:09   you said Jimmy. Alright one person who did not appear on stage was you which

00:13:21   was highly unusual. How many how many keynotes in a row had you been on stage

00:13:26   prior to that? I've taken part either presenting or demoing over 50 keynotes in a row.

00:13:31   So you should have gone for 56 would have been like a Joe DiMaggio streak.

00:13:41   No no no there was no other reason than it just worked out that way this time

00:13:47   and I worked really hard on it so.

00:13:51   I thought that the opening with a Bill Hader short film was so great but like so over-the-top well-produced.

00:14:04   Like when did the gears get started on doing that?

00:14:09   Well a year ago we started thinking we need a really good video next year, truly.

00:14:16   and I think about three weeks ago we came up with the idea.

00:14:19   So...

00:14:22   By the way, if anyone has a really good idea for an opening video next year,

00:14:27   shilleratapple.com, I'll take all suggestions.

00:14:31   We do. What's that?

00:14:37   My only complaint is that it seemed to me that you cheated at the end

00:14:41   because that didn't look like

00:14:44   Presidio.

00:14:46   So the idea of the video, and we knew it would throw some people, so you're in that group,

00:14:52   that it started by saying yesterday's rehearsal, and it was meant to be in a secret location

00:15:00   where they were rehearsing separate from Moscone so people wouldn't know what the big production

00:15:05   was, and that was the reason that it looked different, and that's our story and we'll

00:15:12   stick to it.

00:15:15   I should state up front that the rules for this interview were actually extremely simple.

00:15:24   Phil said to me, "Ask me anything.

00:15:27   I may not answer everything."

00:15:31   This is true.

00:15:35   But you know our PR rules, if you ask me some questions I don't like, you'll never speak

00:15:38   to us again for the rest of your life.

00:15:45   true. Whoever said yeah doesn't know I'm not gonna use that word. Meanwhile

00:15:55   someone from Apple PR is up there with a gun pointed at my head like a like a

00:16:00   stun gun. Yes. So like if I go down and then Adam is right there ready to come

00:16:05   out and take over so the show will go on. All right a serious question very

00:16:12   serious and it's going to come out differently today, a day after the keynote

00:16:19   than I maybe expected it to. But I'm sure you've noticed it that it and it's not

00:16:26   just this year it's been growing over the last few years is people keeping

00:16:32   track of the diversity of the speakers in keynote addresses of various companies

00:16:37   at various events and that one way that Apple has had an imbalance in that regard is the

00:16:46   number of women in keynotes.

00:16:50   Now yesterday that, talking about streaks, that streak was over.

00:16:55   Jennifer Bailey introduced Apple Pay or the improvements to Apple Pay and Susan Prescott,

00:17:07   I thought killed it.

00:17:09   Didn't she?

00:17:09   She did.

00:17:10   [APPLAUSE]

00:17:13   I honestly think that the I read ESPN for the articles

00:17:16   got a bigger laugh than the Bill Hader thing.

00:17:19   I mean, that-- but talk to me about that.

00:17:22   Like, does that deserve a finally?

00:17:26   No.

00:17:27   And in fact, honestly, far from it.

00:17:29   It deserves a that's good, more of it, not a finally.

00:17:34   Yeah, there's clearly-- there's either some really high-pitched

00:17:38   guys out there or there are women in the audience.

00:17:40   I can't see anything, so that's awesome.

00:17:42   This is clearly a topic that's been growing in technology,

00:17:51   not just about Apple, but all companies,

00:17:53   and particularly here in the Valley.

00:17:55   And it's long overdue, and it's been gaining momentum

00:17:59   that there are not enough women and minorities

00:18:03   both represented across all technology companies.

00:18:06   It's time to start counting it, paying attention to it,

00:18:08   but more importantly, doing something proactively to help.

00:18:12   And there are a lot of things that Tim has championed

00:18:17   and driven at Apple now under his leadership.

00:18:20   And this is one of those things on the list.

00:18:22   He cares deeply about diversity at Apple

00:18:25   and believes that this isn't just something

00:18:26   to do because people tell you to do it,

00:18:28   but because ultimately we will make better products.

00:18:31   and our customers will get better products because you

00:18:33   have a diverse group of people all bringing their talents

00:18:36   and ideas to making those products.

00:18:39   And ultimately, you'll do a better job

00:18:40   and we'll all be happier.

00:18:42   And so how do you do that?

00:18:43   Well, there are a number of things you do.

00:18:45   One of them is you present some role models and say, look,

00:18:48   you can be a young girl in technology

00:18:50   who wants to learn to become a programmer,

00:18:53   become a marketing person, whatever.

00:18:55   And there are people who have gone that path

00:18:57   and been successful.

00:18:58   And you should, too.

00:18:59   look up to that and want to be that.

00:19:01   And he cares deeply about it.

00:19:03   And so we were really happy with this show

00:19:05   that we had both Jennifer and Susan.

00:19:09   Their roles are deeply involved in exactly what they presented.

00:19:13   Jennifer's worked on Apple Pay from the start.

00:19:15   I've been working with Jennifer at Apple

00:19:18   since late '80s, early '90s.

00:19:22   Susan's worked on my team for a good decade

00:19:24   now doing product marketing.

00:19:27   And not only are they really smart, great speakers,

00:19:31   deeply involved and passionate about Apple,

00:19:34   but those are two vice presidents at Apple, right?

00:19:36   They're in leadership roles, and so that's good.

00:19:39   It's a start.

00:19:40   We wanna see more and more of that always.

00:19:42   - Right.

00:19:43   (audience cheering)

00:19:46   Right, and my take has always been that the gist of it

00:19:54   is it has to be more than just the surface level

00:19:57   okay, we'll pick a woman or somebody else or person of color to go on stage because the way you guys do the keynotes

00:20:05   it's the people who are responsible for the thing doing it and so there needed to be Apple Pay news

00:20:10   for

00:20:12   Jennifer Bailey to go out and do it

00:20:14   Exactly, right, and so that's even better though because it means that there really are in these positions of influence and

00:20:21   You know getting shit done. Yes

00:20:26   All right.

00:20:28   What kind of deal does Eddie Q have with the devil?

00:20:33   He's a Duke fan, and they won the championship. He's a Warriors fan. They've never even been in the finals before. Now

00:20:42   they're in the finals. What is going on there?

00:20:44   Well, let me unwind that question because there's two different parts to it.

00:20:50   First, Duke. It's no secret. Eddie went to Duke.

00:20:55   been a fan since he was in college. He, you know, is good friends with Coach K. If

00:21:01   you don't know Duke in basketball, Coach K is the greatest winning NCAA

00:21:05   coach. And so rooting for Duke, like, isn't a big gamble that they're not

00:21:11   going to win some championships because they can do it whether he roots for them or

00:21:14   not. But he has rooted for them since college. So that's not it.

00:21:19   You don't need a big deal to make that happen. That's happening. But the

00:21:24   Warriors, Eddie has been a fan of theirs for a couple decades going to games. So

00:21:30   he's been through some lean times and he's due. And so if you know Eddie like

00:21:36   I do and we're really great close friends, Eddie is one of the most loyal

00:21:40   people you can ever have as a friend or a co-worker. And so he's been loyal to

00:21:44   his sports teams. And the last thing I'll say on this is if somebody's doing

00:21:48   a deal with the devil for the Warriors, that's one crappy deal because it's been

00:21:52   40 years without a championship,

00:21:54   you're not a good deal maker.

00:21:56   [laughter]

00:21:58   I care. I care.

00:22:01   - All right, let's get down to some of the products

00:22:03   that you guys talked about yesterday in WWDC.

00:22:07   So I think I'll stick roughly to the order, you know,

00:22:10   go in your order.

00:22:11   OS10, L--

00:22:13   I'm gonna mispronounce it.

00:22:15   [laughter]

00:22:16   Cap-- Capitan.

00:22:17   - You said it well last show.

00:22:19   show. I'm a good guesser. I really did guess. At least one of you did. It is, I

00:22:45   know there are definitely new features there some of the features are very cool

00:22:49   I love the mouse shake thing. I'm serious. I have a giant 5k iMac. I need to know where my mouse is.

00:22:57   But there used to be an init way back in like the ancient era that did the same thing. Yes.

00:23:05   When the screens were this big. I know. You had a nine inch black and white Mac screen. You had to

00:23:11   go like this to find a cursor. What was wrong with us? But yeah, in fact, I kid you not, I did it this

00:23:18   afternoon I was working on some slides, I'm on a 27-inch iMac and I went "oh where's my cursor"

00:23:22   and I like did the shake like "oh I'm not on El Capitan yet on this system it's not working"

00:23:27   it becomes very intuitive very quickly. In large part though I guess there are some new features

00:23:34   but it is mostly like a stability and refinement release of OS X or at least in large part that's

00:23:40   part of the focus of it and that was what led me to guess El Capitan because it's like there was

00:23:46   Leopard and then Snow Leopard which was sort of a hey let's slow down the new

00:23:49   features and work on reliability and then there was Lion and Mountain Lion

00:23:52   and I thought there's no such thing as Mountain Yosemite so...

00:23:59   Very astute but to your to your to your point no we don't think of it as

00:24:08   only a stability and performance release that is a big part of it but the

00:24:14   features the teams have worked on we think will matter to all of us in our

00:24:17   everyday lives using these these systems and they took a lot of work and some of

00:24:23   them will have significant ramifications for a long time. I think most of all with

00:24:29   Metal on the Mac on that. It's a huge opportunity for all of us so I think

00:24:34   there's some really important things in this. Yeah I guess that is a big one and

00:24:37   it really does sort of it's like this virtuous circle where you've got all

00:24:43   these game developers, top game developers, cranking on iOS games for years and adopting

00:24:50   Metal very quickly in the last year and already having code ready to go.

00:24:55   And it really does, iOS is really helping the Mac here in terms of elevating the Mac

00:25:00   as a gaming platform.

00:25:01   Absolutely, especially in this case.

00:25:04   It's this great leverage there.

00:25:06   But it's not just for the gaming.

00:25:07   I mean, that's a big part of it.

00:25:08   It's great for Pro apps.

00:25:10   And we've seen that.

00:25:11   Adobe came in and did some work and were really impressed with what they could do on it.

00:25:15   And our own teams have done it with systems, as Craig talked about, to have graphic software

00:25:20   layers from the system starting to get accelerated with it.

00:25:23   We see big benefits.

00:25:24   So I think it is a system-wide opportunity.

00:25:27   My son just wanted to thank you for the gaming.

00:25:33   But there has been in the last year a sort of, I don't know if it's a meme, but a sort

00:25:41   talking point that gained a lot of yeah me too I agree the basic gist of it

00:25:46   being Apple software isn't as reliable as it used to be and it got out there I

00:25:52   don't know I forget somebody wrote something about that

00:25:56   no no let's let's just deal with the elephant in the room

00:26:04   Marco

00:26:09   So there's a reason many of you read Marco's blog. He's a smart guy and he's a

00:26:18   passionate guy and I read his stuff too. So it's worth it. And so complete

00:26:25   respect for your perspective and your belief. Don't share them in this instance

00:26:29   but I respect it and I mean that. They're...

00:26:36   try to be magnanimous and you somehow step in it.

00:26:40   So there's no doubt with every release there's bugs

00:26:45   and there's things we hit on and there's things

00:26:48   that the team's passionate about getting out there

00:26:50   and fixing, but we're also very careful about

00:26:53   tracking crash logs and AppleCare calls

00:26:58   and Genius Bar visits and we even have a tool

00:27:00   that is able to follow a lot of user forms

00:27:06   to ascertain what the complaints are,

00:27:09   and try to really gather a good set of metrics

00:27:12   on all the issues.

00:27:14   And in this case, I do think the storyline isn't really

00:27:18   accurate with the reality.

00:27:20   Not to say there aren't bugs and there aren't things driving

00:27:23   some people crazy.

00:27:24   There are.

00:27:24   Of course there are.

00:27:25   But it isn't a change.

00:27:29   In fact, if there's any change, I

00:27:30   think the biggest change in Yosemite,

00:27:32   truthfully, over the last year, was

00:27:34   that we had a faster adoption rate of OS X than of any Mac OS in history.

00:27:41   And so you saw a larger number of users faster in the release cycle in more diverse networks

00:27:47   and environments in different uses and that surfaced even more things that would kind

00:27:52   of happen over a slower ramp.

00:27:55   And so there were things to chase out and go work on, no doubt about it.

00:28:00   But I wouldn't say it's systemic to some issue or some wider thing going on, not in any way.

00:28:06   The feedback I got, it seemed like you guys were taken a little surprised by that because

00:28:11   a lot of the things that you measure were all saying this is better than before.

00:28:15   We're seeing fewer crash logs per user.

00:28:18   We're seeing fewer of certain problems.

00:28:21   And I kind of feel like maybe what got lost in the shuffle there is that a lot of the

00:28:24   problems people were having were things that don't even generate crash logs.

00:28:28   it's sort of like, you know, like some of this discovery D stuff is just like all

00:28:34   of a sudden my printer just isn't connected anymore. But it's... Hey, we take

00:28:41   the good, you gotta take the good the bad, that's okay. I'll get it out of your

00:28:44   system, let's laugh about it. Okay. You know, there's an example where I think

00:28:55   everyone should be proud that if we're going to try something,

00:28:58   it's great to try things.

00:29:00   Sometimes it's OK to take a risk.

00:29:01   You don't want everything to stay and never change.

00:29:04   But if things aren't perfect and people are telling us

00:29:07   they're not happy with how something's working,

00:29:09   here we are.

00:29:10   We haven't shipped El Capitan yet.

00:29:12   Already dealing with that within this one year cycle inside

00:29:16   of that to make a big change to make things better.

00:29:19   And I think that's a sign of how much the team is

00:29:21   willing to self-analyze what the situation is

00:29:24   and do whatever's right.

00:29:31   So, just for the record, before we move on to the next topic,

00:29:38   you guys do read the radars that they file.

00:29:43   Yes.

00:29:47   Next up was iOS, iOS 9.

00:29:50   And there's a lot in iOS 9, and there's the multitasking,

00:29:54   and the keyboard, and the trackpad.

00:29:57   All, to me, the gist of it is for a lot of people,

00:30:02   this becomes a lot more of a productivity machine,

00:30:05   than a huge leap forward for advanced iOS users, iPad users.

00:30:10   In particular, the iPad features that the team

00:30:13   for the last couple years has been looking at,

00:30:16   what we think would be changes in experience.

00:30:19   Remember, when we launched the iPad and the very first iPad,

00:30:22   a lot of work went into rewriting

00:30:24   all of the applications of the system

00:30:26   to take advantage of that big, beautiful screen.

00:30:28   And a lot of thought went into that.

00:30:30   And then we put that out in the world

00:30:33   and saw how people use it, and then we went back to it

00:30:35   and said, well, what are the next things

00:30:37   we need to do unique for iPad to make

00:30:39   it a more productive, more useful product in the things

00:30:42   you do?

00:30:43   And one of the things was to help

00:30:47   you use multiple applications in new ways.

00:30:49   And it actually took a couple years of development

00:30:52   to get to this.

00:30:53   It wasn't like someone woke up six months ago and said, hey,

00:30:56   let's do multi-window multitasking on this.

00:30:58   It took a while to, for example, put out last year the size

00:31:03   classes and auto layout in iOS so people can develop

00:31:07   essentially for iPhone 6 and 6 Plus.

00:31:10   But we knew that by doing that work,

00:31:12   we were laying the groundwork to make this happen with El Capitan

00:31:15   as well.

00:31:16   So some of these things take multiple years to put everything in place to do it the right

00:31:20   way.

00:31:21   Because you can rush it out and do it the wrong way, and then we don't all like where

00:31:24   we are.

00:31:25   I thought it was the...

00:31:26   I was sitting, not in the middle, but farther back, I was really in the mix with the developers

00:31:31   too.

00:31:32   And I thought that that got the weirdest reaction, like the most mixed reaction from the crowd,

00:31:36   was when Craig said, "You've already done the work.

00:31:39   If you've been listening to us and done this auto layout and the sides classes, you've

00:31:43   already got it."

00:31:44   And there was this really mixed reaction where it seemed like half of the developers were

00:31:47   like "Yes!"

00:31:50   And they totally understood how Twitter maybe came in and really did like 50 minutes of

00:31:54   work and got it working because they already had it.

00:31:57   And then the other half of the developers were like "Uhhhh."

00:32:00   Like when you guys offer a hint as to what developers should be doing, people should

00:32:08   take the hint.

00:32:10   I think our batting average is pretty good on that.

00:32:12   (audience laughing)

00:32:15   - Wow, that's weird.

00:32:18   My next question was about 64-bit carbon.

00:32:21   (audience laughing)

00:32:24   That's an old note from a,

00:32:25   this card is very old.

00:32:28   This is from a, hold on.

00:32:30   (audience laughing)

00:32:33   This is our audience, Phil.

00:32:40   (audience laughing)

00:32:42   - A 64-bit Carmen joke got allowed.

00:32:44   (audience laughing)

00:32:47   - A pain's allowed.

00:32:49   - Yeah, there's probably some angry people out there.

00:32:51   (audience laughing)

00:32:54   It's all good now.

00:32:55   Last thing on iOS, and it's a big thing,

00:32:58   and I really thought you guys hit it several times.

00:33:01   I think you almost couldn't have been more clear on it,

00:33:04   and I really think it is the biggest story

00:33:07   in the industry this year.

00:33:09   I mean, you know, it's not like a flash in the pan.

00:33:11   I think it's ongoing.

00:33:13   But it's hard to summarize, but it's

00:33:15   this idea of contextual awareness with your devices

00:33:20   and services in terms of telling you if it's going to rain,

00:33:24   or the Craig's example of knowing

00:33:26   you're getting in your car.

00:33:29   You know, traffic patterns, you got to leave for the airport,

00:33:32   all these type of features.

00:33:36   and how a company and a platform could implement them

00:33:42   with the flip side of...

00:33:44   How did you say it? How did you guys say it in the keynote?

00:33:47   It was the second most popular mapping app on iOS.

00:33:51   Google.

00:33:53   But there's this argument going on and then the flip side of it

00:33:56   is this privacy issue with data collection

00:33:58   and all sorts of things are coming out at once

00:34:00   and Google is doing features like this, you guys are doing features like this

00:34:04   And just, I think by coincidence,

00:34:06   but the Annenberg School of Communication

00:34:08   had this widely cited paper that just came out this week.

00:34:11   I'm sure you saw it.

00:34:12   The gist of it being that typical consumers

00:34:17   do care about the privacy

00:34:19   and the implications of the information

00:34:21   that online companies like Facebook and Google

00:34:23   are collecting.

00:34:24   They're not comfortable with a lot of it,

00:34:27   but they kind of feel helpless about it.

00:34:29   And they're like, "Oh, I guess I gotta,

00:34:30   I guess Google knows where I am all the time."

00:34:33   But you guys seem to have a different vision on this.

00:34:35   And the flip side of the art, the last part of it,

00:34:37   I know this is a very long question.

00:34:39   (audience laughing)

00:34:40   Are you with me so far?

00:34:41   - Yeah, I'm waiting for the question.

00:34:42   (audience laughing)

00:34:46   - The gist of it though is that a lot of people

00:34:48   are arguing that to implement these features well,

00:34:51   a company has to collect it in an identifiable way

00:34:56   and keep a sort of dossier on you,

00:34:59   otherwise the features don't work.

00:35:00   And you guys seem to have a very different stance on that.

00:35:03   And obviously, this is not new.

00:35:05   This is something we've believed for many, many years

00:35:08   and hoped that it would get traction

00:35:10   that more and more people would start to care

00:35:13   and question the choices they have to make.

00:35:16   If ever there's a modern definition of a Faustian bargain,

00:35:19   this is it, right?

00:35:20   Which is that if you wanna get the features,

00:35:23   give us all this information about your life

00:35:25   that you'd really rather not.

00:35:26   And we've believed for a very long time

00:35:29   that that doesn't have to be the case.

00:35:31   And so we've built systems and processes all around the idea

00:35:35   that in order to help users, you can

00:35:39   do things that are surprising and delightful and magical,

00:35:42   but we don't know your data.

00:35:46   If there's something that has to get through our server,

00:35:48   then it's non-identifiable.

00:35:50   And if it can be done in any way on your device

00:35:52   without going to our server, then that's

00:35:54   the better place to do it.

00:35:55   And that we think we can deliver great experiences protecting

00:35:58   users' privacy.

00:36:00   And that has been a belief for many years.

00:36:03   And now it's really becoming a much more well-received

00:36:07   message.

00:36:08   And we're probably talking a little bit louder about it

00:36:10   because we think people do want to hear it.

00:36:12   But we haven't changed our feeling.

00:36:14   This is our feeling for many, many years about it.

00:36:16   But it's sort of coming to a head now because it's like--

00:36:19   I feel like these features really bring out the difference

00:36:22   in the two strategies.

00:36:24   We hope so.

00:36:24   We hope people will see that I can get the capabilities I want

00:36:28   and somebody standing up for my privacy and somebody,

00:36:31   I mean, one of the great things about Apple, I believe,

00:36:34   is that our customers trust us.

00:36:36   They put trust in the fact that we're trying

00:36:39   to make something that's quality.

00:36:40   They put trust in the fact that we're gonna support them.

00:36:42   They put trust in the fact that we're gonna respect

00:36:44   privacy and security and do everything we can.

00:36:47   And I think that these are the features

00:36:50   that best demonstrate that today.

00:36:52   Okay.

00:36:53   (audience applauding)

00:36:56   (audience applauding)

00:36:59   - I might be getting the next one out of order.

00:37:04   It was a long keynote.

00:37:06   My notes are a little mixed up.

00:37:10   - I've been to longer, but.

00:37:12   - I was wondering if maybe that wasn't the longest.

00:37:16   I always thought that maybe you guys had like a loose rule

00:37:19   that you wanted to keep it under two hours.

00:37:21   - We do actually.

00:37:22   We think that in general, keynotes, people seem

00:37:27   comfortable in the 145 to 210 kind of range.

00:37:31   But that's never perfect.

00:37:32   There's other times when things can be shorter or longer.

00:37:37   And in order to get it to the length we did, we

00:37:41   cut a lot of things.

00:37:42   We were very, very aggressive on trimming back on--

00:37:47   yeah, well, I was thinking more about the power feature in

00:37:51   iOS 9 and how we you know we didn't even show the UI for that or a whole bunch of

00:37:56   things that that are there that were actually really nice but we had to we

00:38:00   have to and even then you know some people nobody seemed to get up and leave

00:38:04   so I think we were okay. All right but I think next was Apple watch. Watch OS with

00:38:14   lowercase W. Are you trying to kill me?

00:38:19   I think it works really well. I think it's nice. It's ownable. It's special.

00:38:31   I think you'll see. Give us time. We've been through many fun naming things. This

00:38:40   is an easy one. There have been many fun naming things through the years. Some very

00:38:43   emotional, some very easy and most of the time when all said and done you look

00:38:48   back years later people say yeah you guys were right you know it all made

00:38:52   sense together so so so I think we're doing the right thing. I'm hoping that

00:38:58   it's like well was it the 3GS which was the one where they had a look your

00:39:04   lowercase s the 5s and then you uppercase the s. As I said sometimes in

00:39:12   middle of things we decide we haven't done the right thing and we fix it.

00:39:17   All right hopefully right in your wheelhouse but one thing that really

00:39:25   struck me is in the run-up to the release of the watch and in the TV spots

00:39:31   that ran it ended with the watch is coming and then when it launched I think

00:39:40   probably right around probably timed at April 24th, "The watch is here." And I

00:39:45   thought that was such a great slogan but it also conveys the different position

00:39:50   Apple is in now than even even 2010 with the iPad in terms of you didn't have to

00:39:57   say which watch. Well thank you for liking the marketing I appreciate that.

00:40:04   I don't think of it that way as necessarily different. When you look back with iPhone,

00:40:11   you may remember that we started the very first ad for iPhone was a teaser ad during the Grammys,

00:40:17   where it was just shots of people answering the phone and saying hello from famous movies.

00:40:21   And yeah, that was a great ad. And we didn't have to say anything about it. Everybody knew

00:40:26   that's because iPhone's coming, right? And so it was okay to do something and we had that freedom

00:40:31   to express it that way. So in this case the whole world was anticipating the

00:40:36   watch, they knew about the watch, we had you know introduced it last September

00:40:40   and so as we're getting closer there had been a billion stories written about it

00:40:44   so we didn't have to say much more than the watch is coming and show a lot

00:40:49   of the designs and show a lot of the interface because one of the great

00:40:53   things about the watch is the variety of choice you have with it and so the

00:40:57   ad got to show that and it created some energy and some uplifting you know

00:41:01   beats to it to get that sense that hey we're building up to a moment of

00:41:05   excitement here the watch is coming and so I think it worked pretty well at that.

00:41:09   All right thank you. A developer question so watch kit was announced last year at

00:41:18   the end of the year which I think it surprised me because it was out before

00:41:23   way before the watch months before so that developers could get ready for it

00:41:26   And now here we are six weeks after the watch actually shipped and you guys, I know it's not out, it's coming in the fall when it's going to ship,

00:41:34   but you've already, you know, developers probably spend all day in those sessions at WWDC learning about native apps on the watch.

00:41:43   Do you think, was doing WatchKit first worth it rather than just waiting to go right to native apps?

00:41:52   Well, time will tell, and that'll be the judge of it, but I think so.

00:41:58   We've been through this once before with iPhone, and that model we had a year without any native

00:42:04   apps, just web apps, and then came out with the SDK and all the APIs necessary to do a

00:42:09   good job with apps, and that model worked great.

00:42:13   People were frustrated during that time, but it worked great.

00:42:16   In this case, we knew we, again, need to finish the software, get the first version out before

00:42:21   we could solidify the SDK and APIs to do native apps.

00:42:25   And so what do you do in the time before that?

00:42:27   Do you give developers an opportunity

00:42:29   to do something on it?

00:42:30   Do you create a watch kit?

00:42:32   And will that watch kit have enough value

00:42:34   for certain kinds of apps that it will make sense anyway

00:42:36   in the fullness of time, even with the full native APIs?

00:42:40   And obviously, our belief was, yeah, it

00:42:42   would help to have developers do it

00:42:44   to use watch kit from the beginning.

00:42:46   And there are many classes of apps

00:42:47   that may be exactly what they want,

00:42:49   And they don't need to do more than that

00:42:51   and use the full native version.

00:42:53   But others will.

00:42:54   And I think that gave the maximum opportunity

00:42:57   for developers.

00:42:58   And so the one other thing we did that I think--

00:43:00   because we talk about this.

00:43:01   The same thing you guys all talk about,

00:43:03   we talk about internally all the time.

00:43:05   And we said, how will people react to that if we bring

00:43:07   out WatchKit and then native?

00:43:09   So if you may recall, back last September

00:43:11   when we talked about it in last year's developer conference,

00:43:14   we said-- and we will bring out a native API and SDK later--

00:43:19   We wanted people to know that that was coming,

00:43:21   so no one could say, "Oh, I wouldn't have done this

00:43:23   "if I had known that."

00:43:24   And so we wanted to make sure there was transparency

00:43:26   and openness about that.

00:43:28   - Good answer.

00:43:31   (audience laughing)

00:43:34   Music.

00:43:40   I think Apple Music looks amazing.

00:43:43   I think that the size of the catalog is amazing.

00:43:47   I think it, what was the phrase in the moving the needle in the entire music industry? I

00:43:53   really do. I kind of thought the segment in the keynote was a little long.

00:43:58   You say potato, I say potato, but. There's my big question and this is where

00:44:06   I'm rocketing towards being an old man. I just don't know. That's a very serious question.

00:44:13   So the basic proposition is you pay $10 a month.

00:44:17   There's a three month free thing to get started,

00:44:19   you know, see what it's like, see how much you like it.

00:44:21   But the basic idea for the long term is

00:44:24   you pay Apple $10 a month and you can listen to all of it.

00:44:28   Are there a lot of people who wanna pay $10?

00:44:32   Well, I think it's a great deal, I really do.

00:44:34   I mean, I think the family deal is a no brainer.

00:44:36   I really think it's a great bargain.

00:44:38   But I'm an idiot, I've been paying for music my whole life.

00:44:41   (audience laughing)

00:44:43   I was so happy when the iTunes store came out because I hated the Napster stuff because the songs didn't have the metadata

00:44:49   and it's like you're doing all this cleanup work just to like get the file names right. It's like just let me pay it.

00:44:54   But is that, is there a lot of people, are there a lot of people out there who are going to pay ten dollars a month

00:45:00   for a music service?

00:45:01   Well, obviously we believe so. We think that once you see the service and you start to use it,

00:45:08   you'll realize the benefits of

00:45:11   having really great curated curated lists and you know albums and playlists and things being recommended to you and every time you see something

00:45:19   you say oh, I like that. I want to listen to that. I want that playlist great

00:45:22   I'll use that the next time I go on my trip. Oh cool new album. I want that and

00:45:25   you don't have to think about it anymore

00:45:27   you're just getting it and then you know and some people think that's all people will do or some of us who are

00:45:34   older and a lot older

00:45:36   There's I have favorite artists that I just want to buy it just because I do I'm it's just locked in my brain that way

00:45:42   And so I'll still have you still have the iTunes store you can buy the things you want to buy

00:45:46   You don't have to choose between the two models, but once we're on this for a while

00:45:51   We're all living it we understand the social impact of music. That's completely available to you

00:45:56   I think it's going to change enough

00:45:59   Especially if there's that impetus coming from the curation and the recommendations that will keep you really wanting to

00:46:05   to just add all that to your library constantly.

00:46:08   - What do you think connect is got

00:46:15   that's gonna make it succeed where Ping didn't?

00:46:19   (audience laughing)

00:46:22   - A better name to start.

00:46:25   It's an opportunity to,

00:46:32   on a bunch of levels that's different.

00:46:35   I think Connect is much more been built from the ground up

00:46:39   from an artist's perspective of what

00:46:41   would they like to share with their fans

00:46:43   and how do they like to communicate.

00:46:45   And so for Connect, the artist will

00:46:47   have a very simple ability to create whatever content they

00:46:50   want-- videos, audio tracks, photos and lyrics,

00:46:55   and on and on-- and the ability to like and say

00:47:00   what you care about and then instantly also share it

00:47:03   directly to other social networks--

00:47:04   you're not locked into one network, and the ability to communicate with users, it's not a one-way pipe.

00:47:10   And so I think that it's a much more interactive environment and the ability to share a lot more, and we'll see.

00:47:16   But we think that based on the artists who have worked with us on it, that it's the kind of environment they want to contribute with fans.

00:47:24   You and I just have a lot of times when we meet off the record or whatever, we blow the whole...

00:47:32   We never meet off the record.

00:47:33   (audience laughing)

00:47:35   - We'll have like-- - You just think we do.

00:47:37   - But it'll be like 20 minutes,

00:47:38   and we'll blow the whole thing talking about like cameras

00:47:41   and James Bond movies.

00:47:42   - Yes, I tried so hard.

00:47:44   I realized it when I got invited to this,

00:47:47   and I didn't have time,

00:47:48   'cause the one place you could order it

00:47:49   was gonna take two weeks.

00:47:50   I want to get this Specter logo t-shirt to wear,

00:47:53   just for you. (audience laughing)

00:47:55   But I couldn't get a nice octopus logo t-shirt,

00:47:58   but I couldn't get it. - But one of the things

00:47:59   that we both share a passion for is photography and cameras.

00:48:02   and you know, like a hobbyist type thing.

00:48:06   I've been thinking, I think it's so clear

00:48:11   and the Shot with iPhone marketing campaign shows

00:48:15   that you guys clearly believe it too,

00:48:17   but that Apple has become one of, if not the,

00:48:21   leading camera companies in the world, the.

00:48:24   (audience laughing and applauding)

00:48:32   And in the old days, being a camera enthusiast, you really were, it was like about the lenses,

00:48:37   you know, and it still is, you know, if you have with the other cameras we have.

00:48:40   But with today's era of photography, it's really about mobility,

00:48:46   and it's not about lenses and sensors, although that's part of it.

00:48:51   But it's the software that processes the images off the sensor,

00:48:55   which is why there might be other cameras from other companies

00:48:58   that might use the same sensors that you guys have or similar ones and the

00:49:03   pictures don't look the same and after that how do you get them on the phone

00:49:08   and how do you send them to where they're going and how do you edit it and

00:49:12   crop it and fix the rotation and then two years from now how do you get back

00:49:16   to that picture it's this whole circle but it's like the it's called the iPhone

00:49:24   but to me I would rather if I could have if you said hey one of your apps is

00:49:28   going to break for the next week. It's either the phone app or camera app. I want my phone

00:49:32   app to break. Do you see it the same way? Oh yeah. The camera capabilities of iPhone

00:49:39   is for me one of the most personally valuable and important parts of it. It has been for

00:49:45   quite a long time. And as you said, we both share a passion for prosumer photography.

00:49:51   I'm no great Ansel Adams, but I love photography. I love the process. I love the thought that

00:49:57   goes into it. I have cameras of all different sizes and kinds. And photography is really

00:50:03   powerful and especially once you have families engaged you realize how this stuff is meaningful

00:50:08   for the rest of your life. And we've been putting a lot into it. But I will start with

00:50:14   the most important adage in photography. Anybody who hears of serious photographer knows the

00:50:19   old line and it's true. It's not the camera, it's the photographer, right? A great picture

00:50:24   comes from a great photographer, not a great camera.

00:50:28   And so that aside, I got that done, we've been putting a lot of effort for many years

00:50:34   now to building an incredible world-class camera team and working, doing custom work

00:50:40   on sensors, building our own custom lenses, building our own flash technology, and most

00:50:46   importantly the ISP and software that makes that all come together as a complete system.

00:50:52   And the same mentality that goes into why a Mac is better than a PC,

00:50:56   and why an iPhone is better than some other junkie phone,

00:50:59   that goes into the--

00:51:00   [APPLAUSE]

00:51:02   --goes into the camera that it's a complete system designed together

00:51:06   from the beginning to work together.

00:51:09   And that's what results.

00:51:10   You can't just piecemeal put a lens with a sensor with someone else's chip

00:51:15   with someone else's software and get to the level of result

00:51:18   we're able to achieve the way the teams work together

00:51:20   to deliver a complete solution.

00:51:24   All right.

00:51:25   I have to ask this.

00:51:28   You guys have always had this--

00:51:31   well, not always, but in the modern era of Apple,

00:51:35   there's been this idea of, hey, here's three--

00:51:37   good, better, best.

00:51:40   Whether it's a Mac or a lot of different products, three--

00:51:43   good, better, best.

00:51:46   I think that with the current generation iOS

00:51:49   devices going 16, 64, 128. I think that 16 it's really hard to make an argument

00:51:59   that's good it's more like okay.

00:52:06   So, I'm guessing you're all 128 gigabyte users in here. Me too. So, the 16, you know,

00:52:22   we used to be lower and so it has increased. The iPhone didn't used to shoot

00:52:29   video too. So one of the hopes and maybe we'll see how we realize it all, but the belief

00:52:40   is more and more as we use iCloud services for documents or Azure if your product uses

00:52:47   Azure or for our photos and for our videos, the more we're able to use these things and

00:52:53   your music is in the cloud, that perhaps for the most

00:52:58   price-conscious customer, the person starting out at the

00:53:01   beginning of the line, are able to live in an environment

00:53:05   where they don't need gobs of local storage because these

00:53:08   services are taking off more and more of the load and

00:53:10   making their life easier.

00:53:12   And they can start with an entry point that's lighter

00:53:14   than maybe you want, but gets their entire job done.

00:53:18   And we work very carefully to canvas and survey exactly how

00:53:23   much storage people use at different price points

00:53:25   and how much they need.

00:53:26   And if we can give them a great solution storage there,

00:53:30   we can put that cost into other things

00:53:32   to make sure they have a great camera,

00:53:34   they have a great screen.

00:53:35   And so it's all choices for the customer.

00:53:38   And that's the hope.

00:53:40   As more of this stuff is in the cloud,

00:53:42   maybe we can have an easier entry point for some customers.

00:53:46   You did say you wouldn't answer some questions.

00:53:48   [LAUGHTER]

00:53:52   I can.

00:53:52   Wow, I can get much more non-answer than that.

00:53:56   What do you say to the criticism that Apple has gotten too obsessed with device thinness?

00:54:05   With year over year iterations that are getting thinner and thinner at a point where maybe if you had stopped

00:54:11   and kept the device thinness the same and just filled that extra space with battery,

00:54:16   whether it's a phone or whether it's a MacBook, where are you guys going to stop?

00:54:20   going to stop? I mean is it going to be like a piece of paper? First of all I

00:54:26   think that feedback is always great to hear and you know people tell us what

00:54:30   they think and we always want to hear what things you want in a

00:54:36   product because they all come with trade-offs and benefits and

00:54:39   associated things. If you want a product that's thicker with a bigger battery

00:54:43   well it's also heavier, it's also more costly, it also takes longer to

00:54:47   charge.

00:54:50   All these things have ramifications

00:54:52   designing a total system.

00:54:54   And we look at this very, very, very carefully.

00:54:57   The engineering team and the industrial design team

00:54:59   work together and model every thickness and every size

00:55:03   and every weight.

00:55:04   And we hold these things and we work with them

00:55:06   to try to figure out what the feature benefit trade-offs are.

00:55:10   And I don't think we've hit the point yet where we're trading

00:55:14   off thinness for features and capabilities at the expense of the best

00:55:19   optimized product. I really don't. I love my new 12-inch MacBook. I think it's an

00:55:24   incredible product. I use it constantly and I love how thin and light that

00:55:28   feels and I love the iPhone 6 and 6 Plus and I think we've made great

00:55:34   choices there. And yes, this is something we talk about constantly, but

00:55:39   I think we've made the right choices so far.

00:55:41   All right, two-part question. What color is your new MacBook?

00:55:45   and

00:55:48   How many USB ports does it have?

00:55:50   So mine is the space gray

00:55:57   Thank you

00:56:01   But I'm glad there's individual choice diversity is important the

00:56:08   And mine has one USB-C port, as you well know, with that leading question.

00:56:17   But again, be careful what you ask for, right?

00:56:21   Because what the design team first envisioned when we started working on MacBook was to

00:56:28   say, if all we do is incremental slight change, where's the excitement, where's the value

00:56:35   of Apple pushing things forward?

00:56:37   We need to take bold risks.

00:56:39   If people don't like it, well, they can keep buying the MacBook Air, they can keep buying

00:56:44   the MacBook Pro, but why don't we design a product that's around this wireless world

00:56:50   that has really no physical connection that you need.

00:56:53   You can get by without ever needing that.

00:56:55   Wouldn't that be a better world?

00:56:57   In doing that, we realized, yeah, but we do need to charge it, so let's go create this

00:57:02   one port that can charge and be USB and be your video out.

00:57:05   And that way, if you need to connect, you can.

00:57:08   You're not giving that up.

00:57:10   But this is really design.

00:57:11   And if you do that, how far can you push it?

00:57:14   How thin can it get?

00:57:16   How light can it get?

00:57:18   How aggressive a design can it be?

00:57:20   And I think if--

00:57:23   I'm in my job for one reason, because I'm a

00:57:25   customer like all of you.

00:57:27   I love these products.

00:57:28   I love this company.

00:57:29   I want this company to be the best Apple can ever be.

00:57:32   And one of the ways it can be the best Apple can ever be

00:57:36   is to take bold risks and try to think of new things

00:57:39   that others aren't willing to do.

00:57:40   I remember-- I mean, this is all the same mentality as I

00:57:43   remember when we took out the floppy.

00:57:45   Oh, and I'm sure many of you all do too.

00:57:47   It's the exact same thinking.

00:57:49   I sat in the room with friends of mine who worked at other

00:57:52   companies in Texas and other places, and they literally

00:57:57   said, oh my god, I'm so jealous.

00:57:59   We can't do that.

00:58:00   We can't do that.

00:58:02   We can't take the risk because if the world is going to be risk adverse and

00:58:06   doesn't want us to take away anything, then if Dell doesn't have a floppy,

00:58:11   but Toshiba does, they'll just buy the Toshiba.

00:58:13   They're all the same, except if you're missing one thing,

00:58:16   no one will buy your stuff.

00:58:17   You said you're so lucky.

00:58:18   You make something where your customers give you the opportunity to try something

00:58:22   in a completely different way, and they listen to you when they try it.

00:58:26   And if you have to adjust and make an external drive for a couple years, great,

00:58:30   You'll do it, but you get to make that change and move on.

00:58:34   That's the embodiment of this new MacBook, which

00:58:36   is take a bold risk.

00:58:38   Maybe some people will think it's not perfect to them yet,

00:58:40   but for a surprising number of people,

00:58:43   it's already their future laptop.

00:58:46   The customer satisfaction is off the charts on it.

00:58:49   Customer demand is great.

00:58:51   Does anyone here have a new MacBook and love it?

00:58:53   [APPLAUSE]

00:58:56   So that's the Apple I want.

00:58:58   I want an apple that's bold and taking risks and trying new things and being aggressive.

00:59:05   So, you've been an apple for a couple of years.

00:59:21   Half my life.

00:59:23   Wow.

00:59:24   A lot of that time, an adjective that was often used to describe Apple was "beleaguered."

00:59:34   And there were some hard times, and there were years when you guys were truly the underdog.

00:59:40   And now, there's no way that anybody could argue that the most profitable company in the world is the underdog.

00:59:49   but yet people still seem to manage to say that you're one step away from collapse.

00:59:56   Like, does that surprise you that it hasn't stopped?

00:59:59   Like, I don't think it was surprising in, say, 1997

01:00:03   that there were a lot of articles predicting doom for the company.

01:00:06   Do you find it surprising that there are articles in 2015?

01:00:09   Honestly, no.

01:00:12   I don't know if, personally, I don't know if I'd know how to act

01:00:17   if people didn't write that and didn't say that.

01:00:20   Because I've been through all that.

01:00:22   You all have read the stories.

01:00:24   There was a moment there where Apple was truly six months

01:00:27   from gone and out of business.

01:00:29   And we've been through this cycle.

01:00:31   And as someone really smart once said,

01:00:36   there's nothing to make you take bold moves than a near-death

01:00:41   experience.

01:00:42   And we had that.

01:00:43   And having people tell you that you're all not that smart,

01:00:47   your products aren't that great, you're not going to survive,

01:00:51   is actually emboldens you to do good work

01:00:54   and try to make each thing better

01:00:56   and be aggressive and hungry.

01:00:58   And I think that's also the way Apple should be.

01:01:01   And we don't need to be told how great we are

01:01:03   and how big we are.

01:01:04   It's not about that.

01:01:05   And we don't want it to become about that.

01:01:07   It's not about PDEs and it's not about market value.

01:01:11   I mean, sure the finance team has to worry about that.

01:01:13   of the rest of us, it's about are we making the best product? Do people love what we do?

01:01:17   Or is it changing lives? And if it isn't, then beat us up till it is. And that's a good

01:01:23   place. And I don't remember any great product we've made where people haven't panned it

01:01:26   in the press in the beginning. I mean, they panned the iPhone. They panned the iPod. They

01:01:30   panned the iPad. And great, say it, you know, because that's--I don't know what a successful

01:01:36   product is if it doesn't start out with people saying, "I don't get it and I don't like it."

01:01:39   [APPLAUSE]

01:01:47   This has been great.

01:01:48   I really appreciate you being here and the time we've spent.

01:01:51   But--

01:01:51   [APPLAUSE]

01:01:53   Did you say "but"?

01:01:55   No, no, not "but."

01:01:57   But I was going to--

01:01:58   I did say "but."

01:01:59   But before we finish up, do you remember the first time

01:02:05   you got in contact with me?

01:02:08   It was a long time ago now.

01:02:10   It was October 2004.

01:02:13   Earlier in the month, the Yankees had,

01:02:18   maybe it was September, I don't know,

01:02:19   might have been September, I forget when the ALCS,

01:02:21   probably October, probably October, probably early October.

01:02:24   My favorite team, the New York Yankees,

01:02:26   had taken a three games to nothing lead

01:02:28   against the Boston Red Sox.

01:02:30   And I still have this tradition,

01:02:35   it's just been a number of years

01:02:36   since I've been able to do it,

01:02:38   which is when the Yankees are in the post season,

01:02:42   I use their logo instead of my star in a circle.

01:02:47   And I used to in the early years, 2002, 2003,

01:02:51   when I was really greedy,

01:02:52   'cause the Yankees used to win the World Series

01:02:54   every single year,

01:02:55   I didn't even count the division series.

01:02:58   I didn't change the logo

01:03:00   until they got to the AL championship series.

01:03:03   Those are the days.

01:03:07   Well, one thing led to another, and I don't know what happened,

01:03:09   but somehow the Red Sox ended up winning that ALCS.

01:03:12   [cheers and applause]

01:03:14   And it was--

01:03:15   - Greatest choke in baseball history.

01:03:20   - So I wake up the next day, and I was despondent,

01:03:22   'cause it was like, "Jesus, of all the teams today--"

01:03:24   I mean, number one, losing three games is nothing.

01:03:26   That hurts, but to the Red Sox.

01:03:28   And I start to work, and I--

01:03:30   Well, you know, whenever I'm in a bad mood,

01:03:32   it's like, my work can distract me.

01:03:33   And I go, and I check my email,

01:03:35   And this is back in the day when you didn't get the preview.

01:03:39   I forget what the subject was, but it said "From Philip Schiller."

01:03:46   And I thought, "Somebody's pranking me."

01:03:50   And I clicked on it, and it's from philschiller@apple.com, and it said, "Hey, John."

01:04:00   It's so great, because I changed the logo back because they lost the game, and it said,

01:04:04   It's so great to see the regular logo back on Darren's Fireball.

01:04:12   [cheers and applause]

01:04:16   The Yankees put up a good fight.

01:04:18   Regards, Phil.

01:04:20   Now, do you remember? Is it coming back to you?

01:04:22   - Oh, yes, I remember that week really well.

01:04:25   - So it--

01:04:28   My reaction that morning was so bifurcated.

01:04:32   It was, "Holy shit, I got an email from Phil Schiller and he reads 'Daring Fireball'!"

01:04:40   And it was like half an icy dagger in my heart, like the last

01:04:44   remaining warm blood in my body was just drained.

01:04:49   That's what I was shooting for.

01:04:55   But...

01:04:58   But to show I'm...

01:05:00   Obviously, I grew up in Boston, so I'm a big Boston sports fan.

01:05:04   Go Cats!

01:05:06   I don't care how much air is in the ball.

01:05:08   I don't.

01:05:08   [LAUGHTER]

01:05:11   I'm a Brady fan, and take it for what it's worth.

01:05:15   But that series-- so the third game,

01:05:17   I happened to be on an Apple business trip in New York

01:05:20   during the third game.

01:05:21   And I said, I've got to watch the game.

01:05:23   And I said to someone in the hotel,

01:05:24   I'm going to go, where's a good place

01:05:25   to watch the baseball game?

01:05:26   They said, well, the Mickey Mantle bar.

01:05:29   I said, "It's a Yankees game at the Mickey Mantle Bar.

01:05:32   "All right, I'll go."

01:05:33   And I went and I whipped over my Red Sox cap.

01:05:36   I was the only Red Sox fan in the entire Mickey Mantle Bar

01:05:38   and that was the game we got beat like 17-six or something.

01:05:41   And I took a drubbing and everyone giving me a hard time

01:05:44   and it was worth it because look,

01:05:46   we stunk and we deserved it.

01:05:48   And so I felt I'd really taken the pain

01:05:52   and there was this cathartic thing that I could nicely,

01:05:55   and I think I wrote that email probably 12 times

01:05:57   in different ways.

01:05:59   Digging you, teasing you, being tongue in cheek,

01:06:01   and finally just said, just the simple, clean way.

01:06:04   That's the way to go.

01:06:05   [APPLAUSE]

01:06:08   So I told this story before the show

01:06:14   to one of your colleagues, Bill Evans at Apple.

01:06:18   He goes, oh yeah, classic Phil.

01:06:19   [LAUGHTER]

01:06:22   He goes, that's Phil all the time.

01:06:24   So anyway, thank you Phil.

01:06:26   A couple more thank yous.

01:06:29   I want to thank everybody here at Mezzanine.

01:06:34   This place is great.

01:06:35   I have had nothing but good things to say about here.

01:06:38   The entire staff, everybody from sound, security,

01:06:42   the bartenders, everybody let's give it up for them.

01:06:45   (audience cheering)

01:06:48   I want to thank my friend Caleb Sexton.

01:06:51   He's handling audio tonight.

01:06:53   and turning this into the audio podcast,

01:06:56   making sure we sound good.

01:06:58   I wanna thank my sponsors, MailChimp,

01:07:00   who sponsored the bar, our friends at,

01:07:02   (audience cheering)

01:07:04   our friends at Fracture, who sponsored the video.

01:07:09   I'm glad nobody yelled anything.

01:07:11   Did the video stay up?

01:07:12   - No.

01:07:13   (audience laughing)

01:07:14   - It's hard to do right.

01:07:15   - I--

01:07:16   (audience laughing and cheering)

01:07:20   (audience cheering)

01:07:23   We tried.

01:07:28   And Microsoft, thank you Microsoft for sponsoring the event.

01:07:32   (audience cheering)

01:07:35   I also wanna thank Jed Hurt and Jake Schumacher.

01:07:39   They're the directors of the documentary app,

01:07:42   The Human Story.

01:07:43   They're here tonight shooting this

01:07:44   just to help with the video feed and everything like that.

01:07:49   That should be coming out later this year, early next year.

01:07:52   Great movie that they're helping out with the video.

01:07:54   And then lastly, I want to thank all of you.

01:07:59   (audience cheering)

01:08:00   Thank you.

01:08:01   You guys are the best audience in the world.

01:08:06   You guys get it.

01:08:08   I really appreciate it.

01:08:10   They say at Mezzanine, they thank me,

01:08:12   and they're like, "Your show is the best.

01:08:14   "These people are so nice."

01:08:16   (audience laughing)

01:08:17   So thank you for that.

01:08:20   Thank you, Phil.

01:08:22   Good night.

01:08:22   (audience cheering)

01:08:25   (audience cheers)

01:08:28   (audience applauding)

01:08:31   [ Applause ]

01:08:33   [BLANK_AUDIO]