The Talk Show

102: ‘Maybe You Don’t Take an Apprentice’ With Dave Wiskus


00:00:00   All right, is this the show are we on the show is this the show could be

00:00:03   um

00:00:06   Which

00:00:08   2015

00:00:10   mega franchise sequel

00:00:12   News, are you more excited about this week?

00:00:14   We've got star wars with a new trailer that came out

00:00:17   Like the week before thanksgiving and we've got now as of today the day we're recording

00:00:21   a title and cast for the 24th bond movie I said it's

00:00:28   Me Star Wars and only because I've seen some of it

00:00:31   Getting to see the Millennium Falcon flying over some sand wherever that was tattooing or whatever was that like you get chills

00:00:40   It's pretty interesting to me because they're probably my two favorite franchises

00:00:43   That agree with that. Yeah drawing a blank on anything else that you would call a franchise that I could put up there with them

00:00:49   Well, maybe not up there with them. But like the the Marvel

00:00:54   Cinematic universe stuff. I like that stuff, but it's not there's no Marvel movie that's ever been announced

00:00:59   that's gotten me anywhere near as excited as

00:01:02   Either of these that maybe it's because it's so new like do you think maybe in 30 years do you think someday Jonas when they?

00:01:11   Reboot the Marvel stuff Jonas would get that excited. I

00:01:13   Don't know. I know I wouldn't I just don't think that they're of the caliber. Wait, you've seen Guardians, right? Yeah

00:01:19   Yeah, so I wouldn't I wouldn't say that it's of the caliber of Star Wars

00:01:23   But I'd say that that's the thing that I've seen in theaters lately that gave me anywhere near that same level of feeling

00:01:28   Yeah, but it's still

00:01:33   Guardian knowing that Guardians of the Galaxy 2 is coming out or when they when they announced the trailer or whatever

00:01:38   It's there's no way that I'm gonna be as excited as I am about either of these movies

00:01:41   Yeah, but that's cuz you grew up with Star Wars. Well, it's and grew up with James Bond. Maybe that's it

00:01:46   I'm not even saying it's because the quality I'm just saying right right me and I generate

00:01:50   and there's an it's just interesting to me though because they're the two my two favorite franchises and

00:01:55   They're coming out in such close proximity to each other. So Star Wars is I don't think there's a date

00:02:01   It's like just December 2015. Yeah, December and then was it November 9th for bond or 6th or something?

00:02:08   But it's a specific date

00:02:09   Yeah, I'm surprised that the Bond movie. It doesn't even start filming until Monday

00:02:15   So it hasn't even started filming it and it's gonna be in theaters in November

00:02:18   I honestly thought that blockbuster action movies like that took more than a year. Well, maybe they they've

00:02:25   They knew about the movie. So maybe like the visual effects are all done. They just got to go and shoot it real quick

00:02:30   All the effects are canned

00:02:33   But I guess it just goes to show how much longer production because and clearly these are two franchises that are known for

00:02:39   For high production values, you know Bond and Star Wars. Yeah, I

00:02:44   Think it just goes to show how much more time it takes to make a truly effects

00:02:49   laden film like a Star Wars film than

00:02:53   Than a Bond movie. I mean obviously there's a lot of effects work in a Bond movie

00:02:58   But a lot of the sets and everything are practical and so I guess it doesn't take that much longer to edit

00:03:04   You know after shooting then Star Wars. Well, yeah the visual thing not just that there's more visual effects

00:03:10   But I don't I'm I haven't seen the script for the new Bond movie, but I'm guessing that none of the characters are fully CG

00:03:16   Yeah, I mean, I hope there's no Jar Jar

00:03:19   I

00:03:23   Guess I just as curious to me

00:03:25   I just seems that just seems like the pace of Star Wars seems exactly right to me and I know that if I were a kid

00:03:32   Like when I was a kid and the Star Wars movies were new and there in the first round

00:03:36   I thought it took impossibly long for each one to come out

00:03:39   I could not believe how you know they had to wait four years for the Empire Strikes Back and well

00:03:44   I think it was another two years for Return of the Jedi

00:03:46   I couldn't believe I had to wait that long because I just I didn't have the patience

00:03:51   but now that I'm an adult like ever since this new Star Wars movie was announced the whole thing where Lucas is selling it to

00:03:56   Disney and

00:03:58   you know that they're gonna have a new trilogy and it's gonna be

00:04:02   You know basic gist it's gonna be the original, you know cast 30 years later

00:04:07   You know more or less the same amount of time in the real world that's passed since Star Wars is gonna be in

00:04:12   their universe what it is and then they announced JJ Abrams was gonna direct and the writers and etc and

00:04:18   the the

00:04:20   The schedule it just felt to me like well this all seems fair

00:04:24   This seems like a reasonable amount of time

00:04:25   Like this is proceeding at a reasonable pace and yeah 2015 sounds like a reasonable time for the movie to come out

00:04:32   This Bond movie that they're not shooting until Monday coming out

00:04:36   11 months from now that seems crazy you say that but episode 1 Phantom Menace came out in

00:04:42   99 and attack of the clones came out in 2001 and then

00:04:47   Revenge of the Sith came out 2003 so that's two years between movies

00:04:50   You got to figure they probably took a little bit of time off between right so let's say let's say a year and a half

00:04:55   I do to do each one of those I

00:04:58   Guess I don't know it just and those are I mean they had to make Jar Jar

00:05:02   They had to animate all those clones they had to do the I mean that there's a lot of

00:05:05   Not just make an explosion and put it over here and do some green screen stuff

00:05:08   But like fully realized well more or less fully realized CG characters that have to be animated and all these little details I

00:05:16   Can see it I can see how that would take longer

00:05:19   I think and if they can do that in a year and a half then it's not inconceivable that you I mean didn't they make

00:05:23   quantum of solace and like a weekend

00:05:28   It could be a visual effects and everything just like knock that one out real quick

00:05:31   I'm putting you on the spot here Dave because it's it's it is it's it is

00:05:37   It is dangerous not dangerous, but it's hallowed the talk show ground talking about the Bond movies

00:05:45   And it is something that I you know purposely and deliberately did not you know in the old run with with Dan Benjamin

00:05:54   We did the thing where we went through

00:05:56   1 through 22 and

00:05:58   You know 22 be

00:06:02   We included never say never again, which is not in the M production. So we did 23 episodes of the show

00:06:08   where

00:06:10   One bond movie per show we took, you know spent like an hour talking about

00:06:15   Which was a lot of fun

00:06:17   I think the longtime listeners of the show when people come up to me at

00:06:20   WWDC or places like that everybody I'd say half the comments about the show are always about the the bond series

00:06:26   I remember I listened to those

00:06:28   At a time when I hadn't even seen all the movies and but that part of the show

00:06:32   You know has a lot more staying power than the first half of the show, right exactly evergreen

00:06:36   All right, it's you know, pretty much as relevant and I didn't you know, we Dan and I broke up and he's no longer here

00:06:43   and then

00:06:45   Sky fall came out. And so there was no episode where I did that

00:06:50   and I don't think there ever will be I don't think be right to do it with somebody else and

00:06:55   It's not gonna happen with Dan Benjamin

00:06:57   But we can talk, you know without going for a whole hour about Skyfall we can still talk bond, but it's tough

00:07:03   you're putting on the spot here because people are gonna hold you up against the

00:07:06   the the old stuff well, I

00:07:10   Just hope I can live up to everybody's expectations. So you're more excited about

00:07:14   Star Wars than then then Spectre, which that's the title. It's it's I don't know. It's uh, I

00:07:22   Say yes, but because I've seen it like you ask yes somebody who somebody with more than one kid who their favorite kid is and

00:07:29   It's you can't really answer that question

00:07:32   But if one of the kids hasn't been born yet well I like the first one better because I've seen it

00:07:35   Yeah, well one of the differences and I've been thinking about it a lot this way

00:07:38   I just think it's so

00:07:39   Interesting that they're coming out at the same time and now big news came out within a week or two of each other and they're

00:07:45   Too my two favorite thing it just seems so serendipitous and I was thinking about it a lot

00:07:50   I'm even thinking maybe I'll do maybe like a Star Wars special episode of this show. It's sometime this month

00:07:56   Maybe like a you know in the Star Wars theme call it a holiday Star Wars

00:08:00   Star Wars holiday special

00:08:03   And go just go two hours on something something, you know

00:08:07   I could we could I could easily put together a guest or two and we could do three shows on Star Wars

00:08:12   You could start a whole new podcast just talking about Star Wars. All right, but comparing it to the bond franchise

00:08:18   Clearly one of the big differences is that we're up to bond 24 and Star Wars

00:08:23   We've only had six movies or seven if you want to count the Clone Wars

00:08:27   Which really I really don't think it's fair because even though it was released theatrically

00:08:32   They just decided to put into theaters a 90-minute TV pilot

00:08:37   Yeah, that's a funny way to look at it

00:08:39   I think well was it was made as a TV pilot and they were like, this is actually pretty good

00:08:44   You know, maybe you know, we'll you know, reframe it for cinema, you know

00:08:48   Green side maybe they didn't maybe they didn't even maybe it was 1.85 which or something like that's which is close to the 69

00:08:55   I remember seeing that in the theater and walking out and just thinking what what was that?

00:08:59   Like that wasn't that wasn't anything like I thought it was gonna be and I'm watching the cartoon like the animated series

00:09:05   It was really good and it was sometimes good

00:09:10   Well, it wasn't it wasn't consistently good

00:09:12   It wasn't I would I would say with my my most recent benchmarks for Star Wars quality being the prequel trilogy

00:09:19   Clone Wars was pretty good. I

00:09:21   Don't know. I think it was worse than the prequel toilet trilogy really

00:09:25   Yeah, I don't I think it it always felt padded out to me. It always felt to me like they didn't you know, they

00:09:31   Yeah, I think how many episodes did they do per season? Did they do 20? Oh

00:09:36   No, I thought it was less than that. I don't know whatever they did

00:09:39   They only had about half as many that were decent and it always felt padded out and maybe cliffhanger

00:09:44   Yes, did you watch it while it was going? Yeah for the most part not like we don't eat but but

00:09:49   Yeah, maybe that's it cuz I watched them all back-to-back. So I'd watch six or seven at a time

00:09:54   And so you if there's a bad one, it's kind of lost

00:09:59   It's padded out by the good ones. So even if even if half them are bad, you're still kind of remembering more of the good stuff

00:10:05   Yeah, I don't know. I just felt like overall it it it I

00:10:08   Don't know

00:10:10   it was a lost opportunity and I felt like they had a lot of things that were repetitious and that took away from that the

00:10:15   prequel trilogy like the fact that

00:10:18   obi-wan and Anakin had a bunch of

00:10:22   encounters with

00:10:25   Dooku

00:10:26   Makes it changes the like the way the movies present it, you know, they had the the one encounter in the second movie where?

00:10:34   Anakin lost his arm and obi-wan almost got killed and yoda came in and rescued him with the you know quick fight

00:10:41   And then in the next movie and they made it seem as though look we haven't seen this guy since the last time when he

00:10:47   Fucked us up real good. Let's do this. Let's do it right this time

00:10:50   But in the meantime if you've watched the Clone Wars TV show they've fought against Dooku dozens of times in between well in the movies

00:10:58   It always seemed like there's a huge chunk of time that we just didn't get to see and it felt really awkward

00:11:03   Because in the original trilogy the time between Empire and Jedi if you think about it

00:11:09   There's probably some stuff that happened like the just getting Lando into Jabba's Palace and like getting everything set up to pull that off

00:11:17   Must have taken some time

00:11:18   But you're not really missing out on much by not seeing those things like you can still get a sense of time has passed

00:11:23   But you don't need to know exactly how much time right and there was a reference in Empire Strikes Back

00:11:28   where when Han decides to

00:11:33   to leave Hoth to go pay Jabba off and it's like

00:11:36   He mentions like a this is where we need live audience

00:11:41   It's like Ord Mandel or something like that that there was like a bounty that they encountered a bounty hunter recently

00:11:47   Yeah, who tried to kill Han and you know, you know just little things like that

00:11:51   Yeah, you get hints at it you get hints that there's been some time has but the difference between the gap between episode 2

00:11:57   And episode 3 it just feels like we missed a movie

00:12:01   Yeah, if you're watching it sitting down to watch it even if you watch them back-to-back

00:12:05   It feels like there's an entire movie missing which is one of the big failings of the prequel trilogy

00:12:09   Yeah

00:12:10   But so I in that regard I didn't mind the Clone Wars going into some more of that

00:12:14   Backstory stuff because I felt like I missed it to begin with my yeah, I just I just feel like it could have been better

00:12:19   Yeah, well my trouble with it was that it never really felt like Star Wars. Yeah, I agree with that, too

00:12:24   There's like a style change that it was fine

00:12:27   And once you kind of ease into it, like once you get used to it, it's pretty it's pretty good

00:12:31   It's entertaining but it never really felt like canonical Star Wars and the way that the expanded universe stuff always kind of feels like fan

00:12:37   Fiction. Yeah. Yeah, just didn't quite feel like it same thing with scene in the movie

00:12:41   So I still say there's only six movies. I would heart that and that's the big difference is we've only had six movies over

00:12:47   What

00:12:50   37 years

00:12:53   Whereas we've had 24 Bond movies in 50 years

00:12:56   so it's you know clearly a different pace because there was a huge gap between the

00:13:01   Trilogies and we've had another gap since the last trilogy that really helps to soften the blow

00:13:07   I think if this next Bond movie isn't very good. That's okay, right?

00:13:12   And I think that's actually where Star Wars especially now that Disney owns it and you know, this is what Disney does

00:13:18   It's they're going to you know, they they keep franchises going

00:13:21   We're going to see you know, there's there's going to be more Star Wars trilogies after this one whether it's you know

00:13:26   A thousand years ago or in the future or whatever and some might be good and some might be bad

00:13:31   But eventually it will you know

00:13:33   It'll work itself out and OB abs might be that you can you can get by with ebbs and flows

00:13:39   but the fact that there have only been six is what makes people bitch so much about the

00:13:44   Prequel trilogy because we've only had six and three of them were kind of duds

00:13:50   Yeah to make a comparison in another medium you look at a TV show like Sherlock and each season is only I think three episodes

00:13:57   So it's if one of them is bad it stands out way more

00:14:00   Yeah, where is it like a normal TV show if it's 20 episodes in a season if one's bad

00:14:05   You don't just wait till next week. All right, right and it's like I've always said it like comparing baseball to football

00:14:11   It's really drastic because baseball plays

00:14:15   100 and us plays 162 regular season games a year and football and the NFL they only play 16 games

00:14:21   So like if your favorite team only lose loses four games in a row

00:14:25   It's not good in baseball, but it's you know, four out of 160

00:14:30   It's a long season if you lose four football games in a row

00:14:32   That's a quarter of your season is you've just lost all in a row right baseball you lose a game

00:14:36   You just wait until the game they play later that afternoon, right?

00:14:39   but I do feel though that the pressure is really on Star Wars at this point though because everybody was

00:14:44   consensus is that they were so disappointed in the last trilogy a

00:14:48   Consensus I think is the right word these things are always going to be subjective

00:14:53   But I think that if you polled people if this were a democracy if opinions were democracy

00:14:59   They'd just be expunged from the record if we could if we go back in time and unmake those movies

00:15:04   I bet most people would elect to do that. I'm I'm not of that opinion, and I spoke it's been a long time

00:15:09   I think since I've talked Star Wars on this show

00:15:11   I'm nowhere near as down on the prequel trilogy as a lot of my peers are of our generation and maybe it's partly because I

00:15:18   Have a son who you know, so young and I've said this before it was with moltz a while back

00:15:24   But in in Jonas's peers, they don't really see the difference between a trilogy

00:15:29   there's just Star Wars movies and for a long time he was even confused about the

00:15:34   chronology of them

00:15:36   And I know some people, you know, like I'd Syracuse it famously has like wouldn't even let his kids watch the prequel trilogy

00:15:43   Good parent

00:15:46   Yeah, I understand why as a cinema fan you would do that but you're robbing your kid of

00:15:53   You know something that is pierce now they did, you know, they like the clone troopers and stuff like that

00:15:58   It's it's it's different for them. I don't know and I think it's very hard to compare to when

00:16:05   You live in a world where you can watch them on demand whereas I grew up and it wasn't I don't think they came out

00:16:10   On home video until like I don't know the late 80s

00:16:13   so there's plenty of crap that we watched when we were kids that we really liked and we can look back as adults and

00:16:18   Recognize it was terrible

00:16:19   You could only see the Star Wars movies in cinema and you know

00:16:23   They did re-release them like in between so like you could go see Star Wars two years after it came out again

00:16:30   But you know you were limited by how many times your parents will let you go to the movie theater

00:16:34   Yeah

00:16:36   Yeah, I didn't see Star Wars until I was 15

00:16:38   Which was like what like 10 years ago?

00:16:41   Closer to 2018. Did you watch them? Yeah, so your your initial exposure was in

00:16:47   home video

00:16:49   Like I remember I was in the comics

00:16:52   I was yeah like 13 like between 11 and 13 that when I was really into comics

00:16:56   I would go to the comic book stores and they would have like Star Wars stuff and it always looked to me

00:17:01   Maybe it was the haircuts or the quality of the printing, but it always just looked old

00:17:04   It looked like old 70s like the original Battlestar Galactica or Flash Gordon like it had that vibe

00:17:10   It's like this is stuff. That's like it's gonna be old and cheesy. I don't want to bother

00:17:13   And it wasn't until a friend had gotten I think for his birthday the VHS set like one of the VHS

00:17:18   VHS sets that came out before the the re-releases the re re re re releases

00:17:23   And he's like no you got to see this and he puts in the tape

00:17:27   And I think the Kim and all of his other friends that were there everybody fell asleep

00:17:30   So the movie ends and I'm still like glued to the edge of my seat. My life had been changed

00:17:35   I'd still remember seeing it the first time and I was I don't know it must have been must have been the first run

00:17:41   77 so

00:17:43   I was only like four years old. I remember going with my dad

00:17:46   To the theater to see it and my dad I didn't go to lots of movies in the theaters

00:17:53   But you know, I went to a fair amount

00:17:56   And you know, my dad would often be the one to take me

00:17:59   And my sister's two years younger than me and a lot of times, you know, she was only two

00:18:03   I guess then so she probably wasn't even going to movies yet

00:18:06   And I remembered a general feeling that my dad

00:18:10   Didn't really give two shits about the movies that I you know kids

00:18:14   You know, he went he has a good sport about it. But you know, it's you know, it's

00:18:19   Most of the movies I went to see when I was four or five years old were pretty crappy and not very

00:18:24   interesting to a 36 year old man. I remember the opening of Star Wars and

00:18:29   that opening shot of the Star Destroyer and it's just on this immense screen so

00:18:34   it really looks big and it's really one of those things like one of the things

00:18:38   the original trilogy I think did so well is take advantage of cinema meaning that

00:18:44   when something looks big on screen it is big right as opposed to like when you

00:18:50   see something that's shot more like a TV show and it's just close-ups and it's

00:18:53   It's just, you know, you're just seeing somebody's face huge.

00:18:56   It doesn't give you the sense of enormity.

00:18:59   The sense of enormity that that Star Destroyer gives you in a theater, I remember my dad

00:19:04   like turning to me and he was just like, "Whoa."

00:19:06   Like my dad was blown away.

00:19:08   And I remember thinking that that was even as amazing as the movie is.

00:19:11   Holy cow, my dad is blown away.

00:19:13   It's just seared in my memory watching the opening of that.

00:19:16   I wish that my first exposure had been in a theater.

00:19:19   Although, you know, maybe looking back, maybe the fact that the first time I saw it was

00:19:23   on somebody's crappy CRT television in the 90s on VHS just makes it that much clearer

00:19:29   to me how good the story was or how compelling those characters were.

00:19:33   I remember too another I do remember the I also remember the first time I saw Star Wars

00:19:39   on home video it was my friend Joe's birthday must have been I don't know what year it would

00:19:47   have been probably around like 84 or 5 maybe we're around 11 or 12 and so

00:19:54   Jedi yeah I think it was post-jedi I think but it was it was a sleepover

00:20:00   birthday party with about a dozen of us and Joe's dad was all cagey and acted

00:20:07   like he had this secret this awesome secret he waited until after we had our

00:20:10   pizza and stuff and this is before there were any legit home video versions they

00:20:15   Weren't released yet. Oh Joe's Joe's dad had a bootleg version of the Empire Strikes Back the bestly shit and

00:20:23   And we couldn't believe honestly and I knew Joe's dad and you know

00:20:29   He was a lawyer and he was he was the dad who drove his car really fast

00:20:33   so like if you if like a bunch of us were going to the mall and two dads were driving you wanted to go with

00:20:37   Joe's dad because he'd drive he had like a Peugeot and he would drive it really fast

00:20:42   It just seemed too good to be true though. I really thought that he was setting us up. I

00:20:46   Couldn't believe that I was gonna get to watch Star Wars in a house. I thought he's he's shitting us

00:20:52   He's gonna put that in and it's gonna be Mary Poppins or something

00:20:56   He put it in and holy shit. It was Star Wars and it was the other thing. I remember very distinctively

00:21:00   It was because it was bootleg somehow

00:21:03   What they did for the aspect ratio was it wasn't pan and scan and it wasn't letterboxed it was squished

00:21:12   optically

00:21:14   Yeah gross, but it was still none of us had ever seen it

00:21:18   there were no legit versions of any Star Wars movies out on the market at the time and

00:21:22   It was funny. It's just one of those things like you got used to I'd say within like 10 minutes

00:21:27   He got used to it and it was just awesome. It was absolutely blow away. Awesome

00:21:33   During the like the late 90s just after Napster. Did you did you get into the thing of downloading movies at all?

00:21:41   No, I never I I could never be bothered with I did a little bit

00:21:45   but it always seemed like too much work and it was always so hard to find it and then you had to like

00:21:50   Splotch them all together. Yeah to get him to play on anything I had you had to

00:21:55   Had to post process and you know all that shit that Don Melton's script does

00:22:01   I just can never get into it always seemed like too much work and I never ever ever ever

00:22:06   Want to watch a motion picture on a on a computer well

00:22:09   I was you know 18 years old and I didn't know anybody the idea that I could see a movie

00:22:13   But it was still in theaters was very compelling to me

00:22:16   But the problem was that they would always be out of sync halfway through the movie

00:22:20   like there's no way to get the audio and the video to line up the way you would expect them to and I

00:22:24   To this day. I have no idea technically what would even cause that problem or why anybody would find that to be acceptable

00:22:30   But I remember watching a ton of movies where?

00:22:32   By the end the audio is out of sync with the video and the aspect ratio is just super squished you can get used to

00:22:37   The aspect ratio. I don't know that you can get used to the audio being out of sync

00:22:40   I you get scattered you got to turn off the part of your brain that gives a shit

00:22:44   Because these aren't movies if you wanted to see this movie done

00:22:47   Well, you would have gone to the theater to see it anyway, I guess

00:22:49   But I wonder how many movies I thought were terrible. They're actually pretty good. I don't know that's a good question

00:22:54   So what'd you think of the Star Wars trailer?

00:22:59   Well or teaser you got to talk about that lightsaber. Yeah, I don't I didn't think anything of it

00:23:05   I was surprised that I was mostly offline at the time. I was it was Thanksgiving weekend

00:23:09   We were traveling so I heard that the trailer came out, but I didn't want to watch it on shitty screen

00:23:15   so I just put it off and waited till we got home and then like

00:23:18   The couple of days after Thanksgiving I watched I wanted to see it. I wanted to see it for the first time on my TV

00:23:24   I've of course noticed the lightsaber, but I didn't really think anything of it because I thought that the

00:23:30   The the prequel trilogy established that there's some degree of

00:23:37   Individuality and lightsaber design especially among the Sith and I'm okay with that

00:23:43   Yeah, because Dooku had his weird curved thing. That was fine

00:23:46   Darth Maul, of course with his famous double and that was a scene

00:23:50   When the when the Phantom Menace trailer came out the very first trailer was a huge deal

00:23:55   And this was right around the time when video on the internet started being a thing

00:23:58   But yeah

00:23:59   Finally we had enough bandwidth to get video and there there were like a million parodies of the episode the Phantom Menace trailer like there's a

00:24:05   South Park version I remember pretty clearly everybody was doing a thing with the trailer

00:24:10   but before the days of YouTube

00:24:13   and I remember that moment when you see Darth Maul and

00:24:17   Any you know the the snap hiss and the red blade comes out and you get excited and then the other one comes out

00:24:22   Yeah, and you just kind of like you lose your mind for a second like that's that's so why didn't I ever think of that?

00:24:28   Well, that's exactly like what I would have drawn as a kid

00:24:31   This had kind of a similar effect where I'm watching the trailer and you hear the snap hiss and the red blade comes out and there's

00:24:38   Like this weird crackle effect. You don't know is like it is the rain what's going on?

00:24:41   It's like a broken lightsaber and you're like the me at least I'm tuned into that for a second

00:24:46   I'm excited like I get chills and then these little tiny blades come out the side

00:24:50   So my reaction went from whoa to wait what I just you know, I don't know I accept it

00:24:55   I didn't think I didn't you know, it's obviously a weird design

00:24:59   I think if I were a Jedi or a Sith, I would not use a lightsaber like that

00:25:04   You're just that much more likely to hurt yourself

00:25:06   You know

00:25:07   I don't I feel like if you if you know the force you the force will keep you from hurting yourself with it

00:25:13   But it doesn't do what is it? What is it for if it's a cross guard?

00:25:17   I mean the internet has done a pretty good job of showing that that's a terrible design if somebody's blade slides down

00:25:22   It's gonna cut the metal part not the blade. It's gonna cut right through it

00:25:26   Yeah, but maybe it

00:25:28   Yeah, I don't know. I guess it's supposed to be something like a cross guard. Maybe it's just supposed to look cool

00:25:33   Maybe it's just you know the guy thinks it looks badass. I don't know

00:25:36   I've always had the impression that you don't really need a cross guard on lightsabers like you do on real swords because it seems to

00:25:42   Like when two sabers connect they kind of stick and there's no way to slide it. Oh, really?

00:25:47   I've never I've never gotten that out of it

00:25:50   But I don't seem like me seems like when they lock up and they make that two sabers locked up sound

00:25:55   It doesn't seem like there's any kind of friction between them

00:25:57   For a long time watching the the obi-wan Vader fight at the end of a new hope

00:26:02   I thought that like obi-wan's blade was shorting out because the angle at which that scene was filmed

00:26:08   His lightsaber kind of tilts back and it looks like the blade shortens

00:26:12   So I thought for a long time that his blade was shorting out and that's where the dramatic tension in that scene came from wasn't

00:26:17   A literary list was the angle. Yeah, it's funny a lot of that

00:26:21   It's funny because how the the saber fights get ever more elaborate, you know

00:26:26   The the one the one in Star Wars a new hope is is so pedestrian

00:26:32   Because it's just old guys it's a couple old guys well and it's an old guy

00:26:38   David Prowse wasn't old at the time.

00:26:40   He was actually pretty much in the prime of life,

00:26:43   but he had a helmet on.

00:26:44   - I just meant the characters.

00:26:46   Obi-Wan and Vader were supposed to be like--

00:26:47   - Yeah, but that's not why it was like that.

00:26:50   I think partially Alec Guinness

00:26:52   was physically a little limited.

00:26:55   'Cause he was kind of old.

00:26:57   And I think David Prowse famously couldn't see shit

00:27:01   out of the Darth Vader helmet.

00:27:02   He just couldn't see.

00:27:03   So there was like severe limitations as to what,

00:27:06   or any stuntman who was in there could see.

00:27:10   And it was combined with, I think,

00:27:11   the optical needs of the way that they had the sabers made

00:27:17   so that they were made out of the glowy stuff

00:27:19   that they could easily rotoscope the colors on.

00:27:22   Yeah.

00:27:23   Well, maybe.

00:27:24   And they'd just never done it before.

00:27:25   I mean, and it still--

00:27:26   because it had never been done before,

00:27:28   and it just looked so cool.

00:27:29   And maybe somebody had had the idea of laser swords

00:27:34   in pulp science fiction for 100 years

00:27:37   over and over and over again,

00:27:38   but nobody had ever made one that looked

00:27:39   like it was really a real thing,

00:27:41   which is the awesome part about lightsabers

00:27:44   and A New Hope, they looked real.

00:27:46   But that lightsaber fight was pretty weak.

00:27:51   Let me say this before we go on too.

00:27:53   I am super, super anti-spoiler.

00:27:56   Like I know nothing about this new episode seven

00:28:01   other than the basics of who's directing it,

00:28:05   the cast, the rough timeframe, and that's it.

00:28:07   I don't follow any of the rumors sites.

00:28:09   I don't know anything else. - I'm the same way.

00:28:11   I didn't even wanna watch the trailer.

00:28:13   - I trusted, I might skip subsequent trailers.

00:28:18   I trusted the fact that it was immediately billed

00:28:22   as a teaser.

00:28:24   - Yeah, yeah.

00:28:25   - Like calling it a teaser made me feel very safe

00:28:27   about watching it.

00:28:29   I get, I don't like watching trailers for movies,

00:28:32   and it kinda comes,

00:28:33   it really comes down to The Hunger Games.

00:28:36   When I went to see The Hunger Games,

00:28:36   it was because my friends wanted to go see a movie,

00:28:38   and that's what they picked.

00:28:39   I knew nothing about it other than the poster

00:28:41   had a girl with a bow and arrow.

00:28:43   Like, I didn't even know it was based on a book.

00:28:46   I went into that movie knowing nothing,

00:28:47   and knowing nothing, I enjoyed it.

00:28:49   And I was kind of hung up on how much I enjoyed

00:28:53   every moment of that movie was a surprise to me.

00:28:56   And I realized that most of the time,

00:28:58   if I watch a trailer for something, it's a movie that I want to see.

00:29:00   And if I want to see the movie,

00:29:03   I already know going into the trailer that I want to see the movie. I know now,

00:29:06   I'm they can, Disney can just have my money today. I'll pay for the ticket now.

00:29:10   There's no way I'm not going to go see the next star Wars movie.

00:29:13   So what does watching the trailer get me?

00:29:15   It can only show me things that I would get to see later and be surprised by.

00:29:19   Yeah. The modern era of trailer editing,

00:29:24   Which is evolved very very clearly into the form of Kim

00:29:29   How much can we condense the entire plot of this movie? Right?

00:29:33   minus maybe like a

00:29:36   Just the ultimate

00:29:38   plot twist at the end everything but

00:29:41   Yeah, and if you're a movie person then you like even while you're watching the movie

00:29:45   You'll start to figure things out and if they give you enough plot points in the trailer your moviegoer story

00:29:52   Follower mind is gonna fill in those gaps and you you know what the story is gonna be before it all down the theater

00:29:57   It always surprises me too when and I'm not a big

00:30:01   Believer in like the three acts structure

00:30:04   I don't think that any you know, I don't think most good films adhere to it in a very formal sense

00:30:11   I just think it's the basic sense that you know, you know, you want to have a beginning middle and end

00:30:15   But in loose terms it always surprises me when a trailer that has my attention and hey

00:30:22   This looks like a good movie file this way make a Vesper, you know note, you know

00:30:26   Make a note and Vesper to you know, put it on my movies to watch list

00:30:29   Once the trailer gets to that part where I'm into it I this is a movie

00:30:35   I'm making a note now because when it comes out I want to see it and then it keeps going

00:30:40   I've already been there and it keeps going and they're clearly going into act two, right?

00:30:46   They're clearly going into the middle of movie and it's like wait. Why are you showing me this?

00:30:49   I don't want it you already had me. Why why are you doing this like say something?

00:30:54   Let me let me just experience this and I do think too though as somebody who has a a rudimentary

00:31:00   You know dilettantes and interest in making movies and has you know, I should I made student films in college and I you know

00:31:07   Diddle with video now and think about it. I understand, you know, how

00:31:11   How fun it can be to edit video but how hard it is to edit video the way that you?

00:31:18   that trailer editors can condense a

00:31:22   Two hour motion picture into 90 seconds that spoils almost all of it is incredible

00:31:29   artistically as like the craft of editing cinema how

00:31:33   how how they can but it's the effect of it is so

00:31:38   It's just so

00:31:41   Disappointing well ever since Hunger Games and I've this I've established this rule every time I break it every time I watch a trailer

00:31:48   I regret it the most recent example is I watch the trade. Did you see a million ways to die in the West?

00:31:53   No, that's what's his name?

00:31:55   Yeah, Seth MacFarlane, yeah, I haven't seen that is it good

00:31:58   It might have been but if you've seen the trailer you've seen the movie, right?

00:32:02   That's you know what I have seen the trailer and I know exactly

00:32:04   That's every funny thing that happens that movie is in the trailer. Yeah

00:32:08   No, that's a good example of a movie that I probably would have put on my to to watch list

00:32:14   But didn't because I felt like the trailer spoiled it all like I don't understand

00:32:17   I was I was hoping cuz family guy as a show like it or hate it. It's pretty dense with jokes

00:32:23   So I went in thinking well, yeah, they put some stuff in the trailer, but there's gonna be a lot of stuff

00:32:27   No, no, those are all the jokes

00:32:30   Yeah, and to the point when did when the things happened that happened in the trailer and people in the theater are laughing

00:32:36   I'm kind of wondering why

00:32:38   Like did you not see the trailer? Yeah, how is it? How is this still funny to you?

00:32:42   I remember very specifically there was a movie and I don't know why

00:32:46   Yeah, it was a movie with

00:32:49   Robert De Niro and

00:32:52   He was a like a bounty hunter going after Charles Grodin

00:32:57   It was an 80s movie. Let me look it up De Niro and Charles Grodin. I have no idea what that would be Midnight Run

00:33:04   1988 hmm now for whatever reason I saw that was in now that was like when I was in like junior high

00:33:11   High school I was going to movies every week. That was just what we did

00:33:15   you know, it was like a group of teenagers as we went to movies. So I saw tons and that was like

00:33:19   peak theater watching movies life for me. I saw the trailer for that movie like a dozen times

00:33:26   and Charles Grodin is like a guy with a bunch of phobias and Robert De Niro is like a bounty

00:33:34   hunter who's paid to bring him in because he's got like a bail outstanding. So it's...

00:33:37   Oh, I do remember this movie.

00:33:39   So it's like a buddy, you know, it's like a mismatched, you know, it's the...

00:33:42   Yeah.

00:33:42   In the tropes category, De Niro is a tough guy and Grodin's the opposite and he's got all these things.

00:33:48   And he says like, you know, there's this line where Charles Grodin says something like,

00:33:53   "I've got agoraphobia, agoraphobia, you know, something else phobia, claustrophobia."

00:33:58   And De Niro says, "If you don't shut up, you're going to have fistophobia."

00:34:01   And it was in the trailer all this time. And then we went to see the movie and he gives the line in

00:34:08   the movie and it was, you know, and everybody in the theater laughed. And I remember thinking,

00:34:12   Why is everybody laughing surely you've seen this because it's in all the trailers. It was in the commercials

00:34:16   It was like the signature spoiled joke of the movie, but yet for some reason the theater still left

00:34:21   Yeah, I don't get it. Well, that's just I think it's just something I think I was too cynical at times a teenager

00:34:27   I think it's the way that in a crowd

00:34:29   People pay the movie people want the movie to be good because they took two hours of their lives to see it and they spent

00:34:35   The money to get the ticket they and they're you know in a community

00:34:38   You know a group like they wouldn't laugh if they were watching it at home if it was well

00:34:43   But you'd watch when you're in the theater like that's the difference

00:34:46   Yeah, and that well even a really funny movie if I'm watching it by myself at home. I rarely laugh out loud right

00:34:52   It's a laughter is a is like a laughter at a comedy movie is a is like a group thing

00:34:57   did you see somebody was just somebody maybe it was you somebody posted a link to the the original trailer for a new hope and

00:35:05   watching that after watching the episode 7 trailer

00:35:09   was a real a really interesting juxtaposition in the editing styles because then back in the 70s

00:35:17   It was things like meet Luke Skywalker a young adventurer

00:35:20   And he's like you give a little bit about the character and then it talks about and then they're gonna have these crazy

00:35:23   adventures and they do these things and they encounter these

00:35:25   Villains and you get excited about the type of story more than any specific thing that's gonna happen

00:35:31   But they don't give it anything away at least in the in the dialogue, but if you watch

00:35:35   the the video that's going by if you've seen that movie there's like wow they

00:35:40   kind of give everything away but you don't know that I think I think I know

00:35:43   which version of the trailer you're talking about I think it was one and I

00:35:46   didn't even have the the music yet is that the one yeah yeah yeah they didn't

00:35:50   even have the music and so there's this weird we'll have to see if we can get a

00:35:54   copy of that for the show notes but there's a weird it's like you know in

00:35:59   your mind that without the John Williams music Star Wars wouldn't quite be Star

00:36:02   Wars that it's as essential maybe even more essential than any you know any

00:36:07   cast member more than the logo or you know it's it's that essential to the

00:36:12   fabric of what it feels like to be a Star Wars movie you know that it's you

00:36:16   know you don't even have to think too much about like the role that that

00:36:20   musical scoring can play in cinema but then to see a trailer where there is no

00:36:24   actual John Williams Star Wars music you just think man this is just this is like

00:36:30   a saltine without salt. This just isn't right. What's that that opening note just

00:36:38   that one yeah is enough to get you excited no clear example than in the new

00:36:42   teaser when I see the Millennium Falcon and you hear the the score swell up you

00:36:46   get chills right least I did yeah it was like a real like I could feel like I got

00:36:50   butterflies I got really really excited because it's like everything that

00:36:53   everything I need to tell me that this movie is a Star Wars movie is right

00:36:57   there on the screen. Give me give me the Millennium Falcon and a John Williams score. Just even

00:37:02   the first note of the John Williams score and I'm in. I'm hooked. You've got my money.

00:37:05   Yeah, so kudos to J.J. Abrams and to Disney and everybody else that they made a completely

00:37:11   — well, not completely spoiler-free, but as spoiler-free as anything could be. A true

00:37:15   teaser.

00:37:16   Well, we were talking about this on Twitter, the question of the Stormtrooper and whether

00:37:20   or not he's really a Stormtrooper. I mean, there's a lot of room for speculation. So

00:37:23   much room for speculation that the speculation it's purely fun I don't feel

00:37:27   like we can ruin it I don't feel like saying that guy in a stormtrooper

00:37:30   outfit ruins anything I don't know who he is I don't know why he isn't as easy

00:37:33   a stormtrooper or is he a guy who was disguised as a strong right the old Han

00:37:36   and Luke trick right and so we end up having a conversation like we did on

00:37:40   Twitter about you know what does this mean and what could but there's no way

00:37:43   we can there's no way any of that discussion would ruin anything I like

00:37:46   how this episode is turning into the Star Wars special episode of the talk

00:37:50   show. Let's take a break and thank our first sponsor. It's our good friend, George Lucas.

00:37:57   No, it is our good friends at Need, N-E-E-D. Need is a refined retailer and lifestyle magazine

00:38:09   for men. I've had people since they've started sponsoring a show who've mentioned that,

00:38:14   "Man, you say lifestyle magazine for men and it's like your eyes start rolling back in your head."

00:38:18   and uh...

00:38:20   my friend jim ray

00:38:22   your jim ray

00:38:23   yeah i know it

00:38:25   at jim ray is by far away the best rest friend that i have

00:38:29   jim ray i always looks like he's just stepped out of a goddamn magazine that

00:38:33   he is well groomed he is well tailored he it's it's easy to always look stylish i

00:38:39   was feeling a slob next to him about how well-dressed and

00:38:42   jim ray told me and this is great

00:38:44   it that he heard the show and he he heard me say that need is a lifestyle

00:38:48   Magazine for men and it made him his eyes roll even though he clearly reads things like that so he can stay up on fashion

00:38:53   But he checked him out anyway, and then he said to me, you know

00:38:56   They're like the lifestyle magazine for men who roll their eyes at the words lifestyle magazine for me

00:39:02   And I was like you'd mention him because I was I went to look at the website earlier when I was talking to Matt

00:39:07   Alexander the guy who runs it I went to the website to check it out and my first thought was

00:39:12   This this looks like what Jim Ray would do. Yeah

00:39:16   It's it but I love Jim's description. It's the lifestyle magazine for men who don't like lifestyle magazines for men

00:39:22   and it is a source and curate a

00:39:26   Selection of exclusive products from brands around the world things like shirts slacks pants shoes watches

00:39:33   Anything like that and

00:39:37   it's

00:39:40   Curated meaning there's you don't go there and have to pick between 40 different styles of pants

00:39:45   They go they have like three like a pair of jeans a pair of khakis and

00:39:49   something else and that's it if you like one of those three you pick your size and you buy it and if you don't wait till

00:39:56   the next edition and

00:39:57   Maybe they'll have something else that you like but that way you're not sitting there making choices

00:40:01   They've made these choices for you and you see something you like you get it

00:40:05   They just launched their holiday collection. This is volume 2.1 just came out

00:40:12   Perfect timing for this episode of the show. They're offering some exclusive products which are great gift ideas

00:40:17   from brands like Grenton happy socks

00:40:20   men in cities and more

00:40:24   They're launching an exclusive stocking stuffers collection on Monday. So that's probably I'm guessing that's yeah

00:40:32   Monday December 8th, so yeah

00:40:34   Right in the middle of this episode. So it's you know, you might be listening. It's already out

00:40:38   And they have an ongoing essentials collection. That's at their website need edition comm

00:40:45   Essential and that features items mostly under 50 bucks

00:40:49   From studio neat those are the cool guys who make the glyph and a bunch of other cool products

00:40:54   I love get like the ice thing now - yeah, they've got the nice ice isn't that nice ice that they call it

00:40:59   I forget what they call it

00:41:00   It's it's the thing where you get like the the nice clear ice cube right you got to break it in half

00:41:06   It's kind of a weird setup. But if you if you're if you're as hardcore about your ice as I know some people are

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00:41:18   So if you're interested in getting some sharper clothes for yourself or just stuff that you might be interested in

00:41:23   They've got other stuff besides clothes

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00:41:31   They hire independent photographers to shoot all their photos

00:41:34   So they're putting good good photographers to work on original work really great. It's just a cool website to check out

00:41:41   Again the website is need edition not a edition like math like edition like the the Apple watch

00:41:50   Need edition calm go there and check them out

00:41:53   They don't have any kind of URL slug or anything like that

00:41:55   but they have a special deal for talk show listeners place an order buy anything you want and then shoot an email over to

00:42:03   hello at need addition calm to send an email and put in the subject line old-fashioned and

00:42:09   Anyone who does that anyone who buys anything from them and then emails?

00:42:14   Hello at need addition calm with the subject line old-fashioned will get a bunch of extras in their order

00:42:21   You know magazines coffee accessories anything they have laying around. That's really cool

00:42:25   And the first ten orders that do it will get a free

00:42:29   Dop kit

00:42:32   What's a top kit? Do you know what one is? I have no idea what a dump kit is. Well, you're gonna get one

00:42:37   And it's worth 90 bucks. So the first ten orders that do it will get it. So that's great

00:42:43   You'll get 90 bucks worth of stuff and you'll find out what a top kit is

00:42:47   So that's pretty cool. And also know before us wait, I'm looking at them. I gotta look up what a doc kit is. Do PP

00:42:53   Okay. Oh, oh, it's a it's like a

00:42:56   Travel toiletry bag. Ah

00:42:58   Well, that's awesome and that but see now you've spoiled it for everybody

00:43:01   Well anyway first ten people to do it

00:43:03   It's it pays to use overcast and have the talk show show up automatically first ten people who do it

00:43:10   Get 90 bucks worth of freeze a 90 buck top kit. I

00:43:14   Should probably get that I needed a toiletries kit. I just carry my stuff around and like it's a plug bag

00:43:19   Savage now, I don't I have something a little better than a zip lock, but it's pretty shitty

00:43:25   Anyway anybody who emails them after ordering will receive

00:43:28   25% off for the next three months of stuff that they order so my that's nuts my thanks to need

00:43:35   Addition.com great great sponsor. It's like what a great way if you want to if you care about looking good

00:43:42   But you want to put zero effort or thought into it. This is a great way to go

00:43:44   I don't even mean that a bad way. I mean that very

00:43:46   Complimentary to the service that you that we could just go to a website and click on something

00:43:54   All you have to know is your size and you can look good. I'm credible

00:43:58   I've always thought I've said this before in many different contexts, but it is a general rule of thumb. You seldom go wrong by

00:44:04   Thinking that the most interesting of anything is at the extremes the very biggest the very smallest

00:44:11   The most complicated the most simple, right

00:44:16   Those are the areas were to me anything whether it's something you're buying a device or whatever. It's just the most interesting

00:44:24   And I would say like need is almost like the antithesis of Amazon you go to Amazon and it's like that

00:44:30   They even call it the everything store, right? It's it's and it's not only does Amazon sell everything

00:44:35   They have these partnerships with all these other things. So you search for something and you get results from other stores

00:44:40   You go to need and they've got like one pair of jeans right now

00:44:44   That's like here's your jeans this month right done. Right? Do these look good? Yes. All right, give us your size

00:44:51   We'll send them to you know I haven't done the pricing yet, but I'm tempted

00:44:55   I wonder how much it would be to just every month you just buy everything they offer

00:45:00   Yeah, I bet it wouldn't be that much money

00:45:02   Just have like a standing you know have your size have your size

00:45:04   You know your shirt size and your pants sides just done standing order. Yeah, let me subscribe to that

00:45:09   Let me just get like here's my size. Here's my money charge my card every month

00:45:13   whatever it's gonna cost and just send me the new stuff a

00:45:15   clothing of the month Club

00:45:20   All right Star Wars trailer should we dissect it I say I'm gonna save everything else about Star Wars for a future episode

00:45:26   But we could dissect the trailer we can dissect the trailer. I think who do you think the narrator is I?

00:45:31   Know the actor the

00:45:34   Andy Serkis right right

00:45:36   there was some speculation that it was Benedict Cumberbatch, which was a I can hear it but

00:45:41   Be a be weird choice. Yeah, unless Khan shows up in this movie - I am

00:45:47   Presume it feels to me cinematically like the narrator of the film or of the

00:45:53   Teaser is the Sith or Sith like guy we see with the red lightsaber

00:45:58   That that's him. I

00:46:01   read it as

00:46:03   Like some sage like character, but I guess there isn't there's like an air of darkness or villainy to the voice

00:46:09   Yeah, he sounds a little Sith like sounds a little bit like Darth Maul actually

00:46:13   Hmm Jonas thinks though Jonas watched it with me. He thinks that the character with the red lightsaber is a woman

00:46:19   He thinks it's like a witch. I

00:46:21   That would be interesting. I think he's thrown off though by the sort of kilt like thing that the guy is wearing

00:46:29   Yeah, because that's pretty tip. I mean even Darth Vader kind of wears us. Yeah, but Jonas, but he but his cape usually hides it

00:46:37   Yeah, well see I don't I don't read it as a woman

00:46:41   but I think it's interesting because the way the figure,

00:46:44   the posture of the figure sort of masks gender.

00:46:48   Like if they were just standing up straight,

00:46:50   you could kind of read it.

00:46:51   - Yeah, you know, it could just be,

00:46:54   it honestly, after he said that to me, I rewatched it.

00:46:57   I've watched it a dozen times.

00:46:59   I did rewatch it, and after, at first I thought, no way.

00:47:02   And then I rewatched it,

00:47:03   and it does seem possible at least.

00:47:04   And it does, it makes me realize that even as open-minded

00:47:07   I try to be I have a

00:47:09   Older, you know, I'm the old dad who just assumes if you have a red lightsaber

00:47:14   You're a man, even though I've seen that, you know, the Clone Wars thing with Asajj Ventress and you know

00:47:20   But Jonas as you know as a much more

00:47:22   They you know, he was much more open to the idea that that character could be a man or woman

00:47:27   Well, it's nice to see the Sith being more inclusive

00:47:29   Do you think in this do you think that the lightsaber might have something to do with that?

00:47:36   I mean if that's the case, I don't mean the the weird cross guard thing but like the weird kind of

00:47:41   Almost flame looking blade rather than just a solid. Yeah, there's a John. There's an article put it in the show notes

00:47:48   I already have it written down John Brownlee in fast company

00:47:51   fast companies design blog has a thing in defense of the new Star Wars lightsaber and

00:47:57   his argument is

00:48:00   that each

00:48:02   Jedis at least the major characters, you know, like some of the scenes in the prequel trilogy where they had like a hundred Jedi running around

00:48:08   You know and you know, they were just all copy and paste jobs, you know, you get blue you get green you get blue

00:48:14   You get green, but they only had a year and a half to make those moves

00:48:16   But the major characters all had a lightsaber that said something about their character

00:48:21   And I think that's true, you know and you know

00:48:24   Like obi like he says like obi-wan's lightsaber is just plain and he's you know

00:48:28   And it's simple and it's elegant. It is exactly what he says. It's the elegant weapon from a more civilized time

00:48:33   Even in the original Darth Vader's lightsaber had a black, you know more black than chrome on the handle

00:48:41   Just looked a little bit more into the time. Here's the only one who had a red lightsaber

00:48:44   Right, which looks it just at least to my eyes, you know, maybe it's just I'm trained it

00:48:51   But it just seems more natural that the bad guys would have read right reds the color of yeah

00:48:56   We didn't see green until return of the Jedi and then I guess the only reason we saw green is because it showed up better

00:49:02   Against the the blue sky. Yeah on Tatooine. Yeah

00:49:05   No, that was actually yeah, that's the exact story is that they were they they had they just they at the time

00:49:12   They just thought blues good guys are blue bad guys are red and then they went to do it and they'd never done one

00:49:18   Outside before and and they were like wow, this doesn't look good

00:49:21   So they said well, we'll make it green

00:49:25   Yeah, it works and then even episode one we still only see red green blue wasn't until episode two

00:49:31   That we start to see other colors, and I think the the first non red green blue

00:49:36   We saw was maze windows right the the purple right?

00:49:39   The story goes that Samuel L. Jackson specifically requested purple

00:49:43   Yeah, I've heard that story and I heard that it then that Lucas said no no no and then like a day later Lucas came back

00:49:50   Is you know what I thought about it sure?

00:49:52   What do you think is going through Lucas's head?

00:49:55   Like what do you what do you think his thought process is like is there like some canonical?

00:49:59   Here's how the gems inside the thing work or or is he just like trying to hold steadfast to some

00:50:06   Ideology he has about not well. No, he's totally a kiss changing

00:50:10   I don't know somehow it worked though for me

00:50:12   like it's one of the things little things that worked for me in the prequel trilogy where is it's

00:50:16   somehow in a world where we went from an original trilogy where there were only

00:50:23   Three Jedi for if you count Vader, right? Oh, I bet that was I bet it was the the scene at the the end of clones

00:50:30   Where you've got you know a thousand Jedi on the screen at the same time, right?

00:50:34   How do you how do you more visually establish that mace Windu is above all of these guys that he's you know?

00:50:39   he's you know in a you know in a

00:50:41   Trilogy filled with at some points in some scenes hundreds of Jedi

00:50:46   How do you have how do you establish that this guy is a cut above or two cuts above?

00:50:51   Well, not just that but the if I'm Lucas I go home and I think to myself

00:50:56   Well, I've got to do this scene with a thousand Jedi on the screen at once and if all you see is

00:51:00   Blue, oh, you can see where you could see where mace Windu was in the movie. Yeah

00:51:05   It's like well not just that but you could realize well if I'm gonna give people like yellow and pink and all this other shit

00:51:11   I should just give him the purple lightsaber. So

00:51:13   This guy at Fast Company Brownlee. He his theory is that

00:51:19   Because at the end of Return of the Jedi the only two Sith left

00:51:22   the Emperor and Vader are killed

00:51:26   That anybody whoever this guy is if it is a Sith to restart the Sith

00:51:30   He didn't have a master to teach him how to make a lightsaber, right?

00:51:33   And so he had to do it on his own and that's why it crackles and sizzles and seems a little bit less a little bit

00:51:39   You know a little bit less technically well put together

00:51:42   another assumption of the male pronoun

00:51:45   Yeah, well, I

00:51:48   I don't know he/she I don't know what to say there. But yeah this character. No, oh

00:51:52   Not not to you, but more to just like the idea that even this guy. All right

00:51:57   No, I think that that would be a really interesting switch

00:52:01   To it would play against our expectations

00:52:04   But in my mind story wise I would have assumed that whoever the new Sith is

00:52:08   Would have been like a student of Luke's or something that has gone to the dark side

00:52:12   Rather than somebody who just like woke up one day

00:52:16   Although you know if if the good guys can show up as ghosts and help guide other good guys

00:52:23   Like like obi-wan and yoda did with Luke

00:52:26   Maybe there's something to the Emperor was able to do the same thing to restart shit well and the other thing too that

00:52:33   That the whole thing with there's only two at a time

00:52:36   That's a dumb rule. That's a dumb rule, and it was clearly already broken

00:52:41   They just didn't call them Sith like they are there were already. You know there was the video game

00:52:44   I mean again what's canon and what's not anymore is up to for date, but there was the one

00:52:48   I think it was actually called wasn't it called like the secret apprentice where Vader had a secret apprentice

00:52:52   You probably played the force unleashed, right?

00:52:56   so he had a secret apprentice and the you know, even if you say well video game is in Canon, I think the Clone Wars show is

00:53:02   and

00:53:04   You know, there was a saj ventress who was like a secret apprentice to Dooku so there were

00:53:09   you know, there's there's a

00:53:13   established

00:53:15   Idea that there are Sith like force

00:53:17   users who are trained by the Sith who just aren't called Sith and

00:53:21   Use red lightsabers and you know it could just be one of them

00:53:25   I I would say that because what we get the the always to thing it's from that line of dialogue from Yoda

00:53:31   All right, this is always - there are and I think that that

00:53:34   the more I

00:53:37   Don't know forgiving reading of that line would be

00:53:41   That what he meant was there's always gonna be more if we see one there's got to be another one

00:53:45   Right was a master and apprentice not that there are only two exactly two, but there are always at least two

00:53:51   They're always coming pairs. Right right. Like we've we've seen this one dude. There's gonna be another dude

00:53:56   We don't know if this is the master or the apprentice, but there's gonna be and somewhere out there. There's another dude

00:54:00   It just seems it's like you said it's such a stupid rule that if they if they're if their goal was to overthrow the Jedi

00:54:07   I order over there's hundreds of them. All right, we're gonna overthrow these guys and we're only gonna have two of us

00:54:12   Do you think like somewhere along the way as they're passing down the stories?

00:54:16   Like one of the guys when he's training his new apprentice

00:54:19   Maybe just leave out the part where everybody before you including you has killed their master

00:54:24   You just leave that out of the history so that you don't plant that idea in your friend is his head

00:54:28   Because to me I'd be like, you know what fuck it I'm not training in a friend test

00:54:33   I'm just I'll be the last one I'll live forever. It's gonna be great

00:54:36   I think it's because I think the idea there was that they always you know that each one of them is so arrogant and so

00:54:42   Confident in their you know dominance over their apprentice that they're they're not they always think that this can't happen to me

00:54:48   But when you're like the 301, you know, you know from history that that's always gone the other direction

00:54:53   That's not a reasonable thing to think anymore

00:54:56   Right. It's like I know you and I trust you but if I knew that if I knew that the last 30 people

00:55:03   Who who hired a you you UI designer to work with them got killed by them?

00:55:10   Like it really I'm pretty sure that you're I I trust you you seem like a non psychopath you seem like a friend

00:55:16   But I probably wouldn't I probably decided not to hire a UI designer

00:55:20   Right, but it would be a good choice

00:55:23   They are to go wrong

00:55:27   Like do you think in like Sith orientation?

00:55:30   This is they're like okay. Well. Here's here's the story of how literally everyone before you has killed their master including me

00:55:37   But don't do that

00:55:40   Please

00:55:42   What else happens in the trailer we see some stormtroopers

00:55:49   X wings yeah the the new stormtroopers

00:55:52   And that's I think notable that says a lot about the movie and the the time period and the attitude of the movie that we see

00:56:00   stormtroopers

00:56:01   Where at some point in the last 30 years in a galaxy far far away?

00:56:06   Not only is the Empire still going

00:56:09   They've hired some industrial designers to come in and redo some shit. Yeah, it seems like a slightly tweaked stormtroopers

00:56:17   Yeah, it's not it's not a huge departure like they feel like stormtroopers right in the same way that the clone troopers kind of feel

00:56:24   like stormtroopers but more

00:56:26   Just on the other side of it like there hasn't been

00:56:29   Even though it's been a longer period of time, it seems like there's been less advancement,

00:56:34   which is what you would expect from an empire that's just lost their emperor.

00:56:37   Right.

00:56:38   But there's still, you know, there's still designers working out costume details and

00:56:41   maybe there's some new ships and stuff, but notably the TIE fighters we see.

00:56:45   Look like, yeah, they look like TIE fighters.

00:56:47   Yeah, they look like TIE fighters.

00:56:49   The X-wings we see look pretty much like X-wings, but with a little bit of advancement.

00:56:53   And so in the same way that original trilogy, the universe felt lived in,

00:56:58   Like everything had carbon scoring on everything was a little broken a little bit shitty

00:57:01   It kind of seems like we're on an upswing like the economy is getting better

00:57:05   But it hasn't turned around so much like there's been a long period where things still kind of sucked and there wasn't a lot of

00:57:13   Technological advancement which is what I would expect to have happened there and it feels authentic

00:57:16   yeah, my my read just based on the teaser is that

00:57:20   the the

00:57:24   the tremendous victory of both blowing up a second Death Star and killing the Emperor and Vader and

00:57:31   Leave leaving the entire, you know, which presumably the entire, you know leadership structure of the Empire was you know

00:57:39   based on the Emperor's extraordinary, you know abilities

00:57:43   Has

00:57:47   Crippled the Empire but like didn't defeat them they were still in it, you know

00:57:51   The entire vast Imperial Army their military remained loyal to the cause of the Empire

00:57:56   And that the rebel is the rebellion is still thus

00:58:00   Still like the scrappy upstart planets that are fighting against them

00:58:04   So like it maybe like knock them knocked it down said that they were on even terms and it's been like a 30 year war of

00:58:11   attrition

00:58:12   That's interesting. That's my read from the from the teaser. Yeah

00:58:15   Yeah, I could get that and maybe like not not necessarily that the Empire's got their back up against a wall but more that

00:58:22   They had to decentralize leadership or something or maybe somebody stepped in and there's a and lost so many resources that they're no longer

00:58:30   They're no longer

00:58:32   Advancing at the extreme pace that they were we last saw them right like when we last saw them

00:58:38   they went in just 20 years from the prequel trilogy to the

00:58:45   To the original trilogy they went from those Republic starships

00:58:50   We saw in the Clone Wars to the Star Destroyers and TIE fighters, you know that we see, you know

00:58:55   lots of technical advancement in their starship design and

00:58:58   armor design in 20 years but now in 30 years they've made very little progress at all and

00:59:04   The rebellion hasn't really either because they're still you know up against it

00:59:08   That's my but they still had time to redesign the stormtrooper outfits

00:59:13   Not really redesign. I would say it was more like a like a dot one like a like a point release

00:59:19   Yeah

00:59:19   Like a 1.1 releases of the armor and there could have been like some kind of necessity there

00:59:25   Maybe they just ran out of that armor

00:59:27   I'm a little surprised that the Thai fighters look exactly the same though because I I always thought as a kid

00:59:32   based on return of the Jedi like when the Thai interceptors came out which were much more like

00:59:38   like Vader's prototype from

00:59:42   177 with like the tie advance. Yeah. Yeah with the

00:59:45   You know the curved wings like the the three panel

00:59:50   Almost like octagonal. We have the the bombers had that too

00:59:55   I thought that the tie interceptors were like the new models that were coming in

00:59:58   But who knows what the explanation maybe they're more like maybe I'm just thinking the the economics of video games where?

01:00:05   in the games any of like the

01:00:07   like the the x-wing tie fighter games the

01:00:12   the the tie fighter has no shields and

01:00:14   just kind of sucks, but the tie interceptor has shields and

01:00:19   I said that one or the advance one of them it can it can even go to light speed and

01:00:24   It just seemed to me that will just stop using the tie fighters. They they have no shields

01:00:30   But you're just sending people to their death with those things. Yeah, they well they went for a quantity over quality approach

01:00:37   We'd rather have a hundred Thai fighters than ten, you know x-wings

01:00:42   Well, it's clearly the mark of a military that doesn't feel like it has much in the way of opposition

01:00:47   the Thai fighters were there to show off how many they had it to like just be a

01:00:52   An imposing presence right and they were not designed for real bad, right?

01:00:56   And they didn't really even value the lives of their own troops

01:00:58   Yeah, because everybody was the Empire so we'll just replace you maybe even at the time

01:01:03   Maybe they were still using clones for this some of this stuff

01:01:05   I thought the other one of the other interesting things in the teaser is that

01:01:08   None of the shots of the ships are in space

01:01:12   That when you see the x-wings they're flying really low like almost right right around a few feet above the wall

01:01:20   surface of some body of water and when we see the Falcon and the TIE fighters coming at it, it's right above the

01:01:25   Surface of the planet it just now occurs me. You're right

01:01:29   So we've got a teaser for a movie called Star Wars that doesn't show a single star, right?

01:01:34   I don't think it did well, maybe there's at the end when the crew and the credit comes up

01:01:37   It shows a star field when the logo comes up, but we don't see any footage of space

01:01:42   Yeah, right. We don't see it and we don't see any big space cruisers

01:01:47   We don't see any you know star destroyers or whatever the Republic has. Well, I hope nothing happened to space

01:01:52   Pretty cool. What do you think about the idea that they didn't show any of the that the only face?

01:01:57   They show is the the new character the the black guy in the stormtrooper outfit. What's it? The actor's name?

01:02:03   Oh, I forget is somebody that I hadn't heard of before yeah, British dude

01:02:07   I think it's it's I

01:02:10   Want to believe I sincerely want to believe that everything about this teaser was a well-thought-out decision

01:02:18   John Bojaga

01:02:21   Yeah, yeah, that's right. I want to believe that everything we were shown we were shown for a reason

01:02:26   Yeah, I want to believe that not only were we not shown

01:02:29   Well, no the the other face we see is the the girl riding on the oh, right, right there

01:02:34   Yeah, who just looking at her she's got like a real

01:02:38   Natalie Portman Carrie Fisher kind of look. Yeah, and so it wouldn't be a big jump

01:02:44   I think most people are assuming that she must be like Han and Leia's kid

01:02:47   but the the characters we see the faces we do see the

01:02:52   Their new characters. These are people we have no idea who they are

01:02:57   This isn't Harrison Ford. This isn't Mark Hamill

01:03:00   It says to me that they they want our expectation going in to be

01:03:05   that we're going to be exposed to new things not just

01:03:09   Fan service rehashing of old stuff. Yeah

01:03:13   that said it ends with a shot of the Millennium Falcon right as we hear the

01:03:18   John Williams score fanfare swell up so

01:03:23   Again, it feels literally show us the show us the things that are gonna get us

01:03:27   Interested and give us a sense of what we should expect from the movie

01:03:31   Which I think is gonna be this is a familiar world, but we're gonna be meeting new people

01:03:34   We're going to be taking things beyond what you what you've seen before and then ending it on a note of

01:03:39   Literally on a note of here's what here's what we mean. We know you came in hoping to see

01:03:44   My favorite you remember this. I don't know if you remember this it was

01:03:50   When when were the original that when did the special editions come out? It was like

01:03:56   97 97 I remember for something, you know when the trailer for that care teaser came out for that

01:04:04   It was really good teaser. It was in the theater and it was like it showed a TV and

01:04:10   It was like for you know for a generation kids, you know, people have only seen yeah Star Wars trilogy on on the

01:04:18   You know TV set and then an x-wing

01:04:20   Blew up the TV set it like ends up the TV set was in outer space and an x-wing flew by and like blew it up

01:04:26   Which sounds really cheesy when you describe it now, but I mean it was powerful

01:04:30   No, but like somebody at like, you know ILM did it right like it looked right it didn't well

01:04:35   I mean just conceptually just the idea of a tie an x-wing blowing up a TV. It just sounds dumb, right?

01:04:39   It's like how did that ever get past?

01:04:41   The the first pitch meeting it sounds like something that you would do like in the Terry Gilliam style from you know

01:04:47   Just be silly but it the giant foot squishes it yeah, it somehow worked because it was just like we're not gonna

01:04:52   Show you any of it yet. We're just gonna let you know you're gonna see it on a big-ass screen

01:04:56   Which is really all you need to know yeah even

01:04:59   Even for what it was we can say there's a lot that could be said about the special editions

01:05:06   The the idea that things were put in into the movie to make it better to enhance it for to make it feel more

01:05:15   Modern to clean it up

01:05:17   That was exciting. I think the execution was terrible, but the idea was really

01:05:21   The that you'd get like a really crisp clean print and they cleaned it up and the blacks would be blacker and the lines would

01:05:28   Be cleaner that sounded great

01:05:30   If that meant that we had to sit through a couple of extra do backs and the the Tatooine

01:05:34   Stormtrooper scene then fine, whatever some of them are okay

01:05:37   I I don't want to get into it, but I mean it's like my basic feeling

01:05:40   I didn't I don't have any kind of purity

01:05:43   You know that all it has to be exactly like what you saw in 1977 or it's you know, it doesn't count

01:05:48   I wasn't opposed to any it's minor tweaks, but some of them are just so stupid

01:05:52   I mean the hotshot first thing is right, right?

01:05:54   If you get rid of that awful job a scene and you get rid of any time any time you digitally move Han Solo

01:06:00   Anytime Harrison Ford is on screen and they digitally alter anything take those out and put them back the way they were and the rest

01:06:07   Of it I'm fine with it should have been oh

01:06:08   It should have been limited to things that only true obsessive

01:06:11   Obsessives would even notice that you'd almost have to see it side by side to notice it like oh there was only one do back back

01:06:17   in it then now there's a couple but anyway the the the the

01:06:20   I forget what's even called the the monster the big animal thing on in most easily that the Jawa falls off of

01:06:28   Yeah, like even that was kind of okay like it didn't it didn't take me out of the movie

01:06:32   It was kind of silly, but it didn't offend me right I remember

01:06:34   I remember liking some like I thought like the way that they spruced up cloud city

01:06:38   Bespin in Empire Strikes Back where there was more stuff going on outside the windows

01:06:43   Yeah, I need to feel more alive and less like a matte painting. Yeah, and it is in hindsight, you know, the the

01:06:49   Lack of anything outside the windows in the original felt a little cheap. I don't know but yeah

01:06:55   Yeah, like they like it felt like they're there on a set right but then you know, I don't know

01:06:59   I still think I think even the jaw while falling off though anything that's like a gag is too much

01:07:03   But what you know, he didn't need it. But anyway, that's that's neither here nor there

01:07:07   It was a good it the best thing about the special editions though

01:07:10   Is that it let us know that George Lucas had lost his mind and it I think it set expectations for the new trilogy

01:07:16   Accordingly, do you really think it did because I've I think I know still managed to be disappointed

01:07:22   I think the reaction to phantom menace would have been even more heartbreaking

01:07:25   I think there would've been people jumping on buildings if it if it had come out it dropped out of the blue without the special

01:07:30   editions

01:07:32   Like the special editions if the special editions didn't make everybody's

01:07:35   Feel like there was a disturbance in the force then you're not hooked up, right? I remember when Phantom Menace came out opening day

01:07:44   I went and saw it in the theater and I walked out and

01:07:46   Me and my friends and everybody else that I could hear talking outside the theater. Everybody was really excited. Everybody enjoyed it

01:07:52   Yeah, I did too. It weren't bad there there. You know, I've said this before they're not terrible. They're only they're only

01:07:59   Significantly worse compared to the original trilogy and ice I see lots and lots of of action movies

01:08:05   you know the type of movies where there are things like laser guns and chase scenes and and

01:08:09   You know superhero powers and stuff like that and the the the prequel trilogy is way better than almost all of them

01:08:16   That's way better than typical stuff that I see, you know, it's maybe better than typical

01:08:20   I was gonna go the other direction though

01:08:21   I was gonna say that it wasn't that Phantom Menace was a good movie or even necessarily a passable movie

01:08:27   I think that it's people went into that theater

01:08:29   so fully prepared to be excited that

01:08:34   They could not emotionally handle the movie they actually saw and so they had to walk out feeling good about it

01:08:41   and it wasn't until maybe

01:08:43   The next morning when we all woke up and we got in the shower and we get out

01:08:48   We still don't quite feel clean that it starts to dawn on us that that was a really terrible thing that it just happened now

01:08:52   I remember thinking as I watched I didn't come out thinking it was a

01:08:56   Bad movie and I still don't think it's a bad movie

01:08:58   But they're the parts that were that were worst were so obviously bad right away like what you don't think it's a bad movie

01:09:04   I don't I think it's you know, it's like a B-minus action movie

01:09:08   It's supposed to be a kids movie and it all centers around trade negotiations, but they don't spend too much time

01:09:12   I agree. It's it's stupid. I remember thinking the time it's like god

01:09:16   Why are they going on on this and I still don't really know what happened in that movie

01:09:19   Yeah, and I still yeah, and I also think that it's suffered, you know from some fundamental

01:09:25   Big-picture problems like establishing which sides of good guys which sides the bad guys, you know, they like that

01:09:30   Awesome, incredible clarity the way that the Empire was almost Nazi like deliberately

01:09:36   I mean, it's you know, you know the helmet design for Vader comes from a you know

01:09:41   It was one of the inspirations is a you know, a Nazi helmet

01:09:45   The lack of clarity said a whole trilogy suffers from that, you know

01:09:51   And it's all based on the stupid cockamamie idea that the you know that the Emperor was more or less

01:09:55   You know trumped up the whole war on false charges and there was no good guys or bad guys

01:10:00   And it just makes the movie less enjoyable as popcorn thriller

01:10:04   like if you're gonna make a popcorn movie you want to have crisply clearly defined good guys bad guys not any kind of

01:10:10   Ambiguity in that in that area. You should know who's who right and it's you know, who's fighting with him?

01:10:16   What why are they fighting the droids you know and every time we meet somebody interesting they almost immediately die

01:10:22   Seriously Darth Maul we get to meet that guy we're excited and then he gets cut in half I

01:10:29   Kind of I had a feeling that he was gonna go down because he don't he didn't talk enough the fact that we don't

01:10:36   Make it feel like they were setting us up for that

01:10:38   Yeah, but we see the trailer and we're all super excited about Darth Maul

01:10:42   And then he he's barely in the movie and when he's in the movie. He's awesome, and then he dies yeah

01:10:45   The best good guy in the movie is Qui-Gon too. Because Obi-Wan had such a limited part in the movie.

01:10:50   Yeah, like our hero, the only thing that we can even remotely attach to emotionally, he dies.

01:10:55   But the thing, to me the thing that stuck out the most about that movie

01:10:59   originally and

01:11:02   instantly, the first, you know, and I saw it on opening day two, was the whole opening the can of worms with this midichlorian nonsense.

01:11:08   Oh, yeah. Right? And it's, to me the thing with the midichlorians thing is

01:11:12   It it really made it the movie would only make sense if you found out that

01:11:18   you know like due to some cut the way that the contracts were written for the movies that 20th Century Fox held the rights to

01:11:24   make prequels and

01:11:26   George Lucas wanted nothing to do with it, but he didn't have there

01:11:29   He didn't have the legal ability to do it. And so 20th Century Fox went ahead and made this

01:11:34   prequel trilogy without George Lucas's, you know

01:11:39   approval or insight or input and

01:11:41   They handed it to a bunch of people who had no idea what it who didn't really understand what made the original

01:11:46   Original trilogy what it was, right?

01:11:49   So they've got a drop like the Emperor from a helicopter and I can't call anything specter, right?

01:11:54   What made the original trilogy so great was that it?

01:11:57   Explained so little and was built, you know

01:12:00   It felt like you're seeing a two-hour snippet of something that could have been 80 hours and they never they just told you your father's

01:12:06   Fought in the Clone Wars never told you what it was just sounds like a cool name for a science fiction war, right?

01:12:10   Your father fought in the Clone Wars. They don't even there's no explanation for it. That's all they say and

01:12:15   That's the best explanation. It just sounds like it fills out the world. It makes the world seem so much bigger

01:12:22   There's a real history in this world

01:12:24   Right, and then the new one is just it, you know filling in it's just explaining all the mysteries from the first trilogy and

01:12:33   creating no new mysteries of its own like no

01:12:36   Like if it had been done successfully, you know in the way that people wanted a prequel trilogy

01:12:42   Like when people heard that the new Star Wars trilogy was gonna be a prequel rather than a sequel and it was gonna go back

01:12:48   In time rather than forward it sounded exciting, right?

01:12:50   everybody was in favor of the general idea because

01:12:52   The first trilogy had opened up all these mysteries that everybody wanted answered

01:12:56   Or at least that they thought they wanted answered

01:12:58   The only way the prequel trilogy would have worked was if the prequel trilogy had itself left

01:13:04   it left it open that wow, I'd like to go back another 30 years in time and

01:13:09   See what happened then right there should have been just as many mysteries about what had led up to the prequel trilogy

01:13:15   As there was in the original trilogy

01:13:18   Yeah right now in in my mind the chronology of the Star Wars universe is all the stuff that happened in the original trilogy

01:13:25   And then all the stuff that happened in the prequel trilogy and before that was like I don't know 10,000 years ago

01:13:30   The Jedi Order formed. Yeah, maybe there's some stuff that happened then

01:13:34   I don't really care right and instead we got like an explanation for the force that makes it sound as though if you gave a

01:13:39   Jedi a blood transfusion he'd lose his powers, right? Right

01:13:43   Now now there's a thing you could physically take away from somebody right they have like a device that you could like stick the

01:13:53   the kid's hand and it comes up with a number.

01:13:55   Like you're taking a standardized test.

01:13:58   Well, it seems like the only reason to do that as a writer, the only reason to do that is to explain how they were able to...

01:14:04   Like you have to have some way of showing that Anakin tests off the charts.

01:14:08   I guess, but why not just say you sense it, right?

01:14:11   Well, I'm not saying that he handled it well. I'm not saying it was a good decision.

01:14:14   I'm just saying that's got to be... that's the only thing I could think of that Lucas said, "Okay, well, I got to solve this problem.

01:14:19   Here's how I'll do it."

01:14:20   Well, there's a pretty ham-fisted way and it's totally not cinematic a cinematic would have way would have been to do something

01:14:26   That was physical like make him like a test of how many you know how heavy a thing he could levitate or something like that

01:14:32   right or do it like yeah, yeah, like

01:14:35   Yoda and Luke in the swamp on Dagobah

01:14:38   When he has to lift up the x-finger when he goes into the cave and he fights Vader who turns out to be him

01:14:44   Like give us a nice call back to that. Yeah

01:14:47   That would be the way to handle that's how they did it with Luke. It was good enough for Luke

01:14:50   Speaking of Yoda. Let me tell you about our good friends at Squarespace. I

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01:15:38   All these templates beautifully designed

01:15:40   I don't know how they keep popping out so many great templates with all these designs.

01:15:45   And part of the thing that makes the new Squarespace 7 interface so much better than what came

01:15:49   before and it really has always been a good interface for a while but it's all wizzy wig.

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01:15:58   you can just change it right there.

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01:18:01   The thing I dig about Squarespace

01:18:02   is their templates are great.

01:18:04   It's really easy to use.

01:18:06   Even when I go to a Squarespace site,

01:18:09   I can rarely tell that it's Squarespace,

01:18:11   which is sort of the mark of--

01:18:13   Yeah.

01:18:13   --templates done well, is they don't all look the same.

01:18:16   It doesn't have that sort of gross, oh, well,

01:18:17   this guy just used the thing.

01:18:18   It kind of feels like almost the platonic ideal

01:18:22   of what they wanted, what Apple wanted iWeb to be.

01:18:26   - Yeah.

01:18:27   - Anybody can just make a website now.

01:18:28   We've all been empowered, we can all start a blog,

01:18:29   we can all start a podcast or whatever.

01:18:31   Like we can just put your stuff here.

01:18:34   You don't have to really think about it.

01:18:36   But it's also cool that they sponsor everything.

01:18:38   We kind of, we joke about this.

01:18:42   It's become like kind of a cliche, sponsored by Squarespace.

01:18:44   But the truth is, we can make fun of that,

01:18:48   but how cool is it that we have a company like that

01:18:50   that's doing really cool stuff

01:18:50   and are also kind of a patron to the arts.

01:18:53   - I've thought about that a lot

01:18:56   because they sponsor my website enough

01:18:59   and they certainly sponsor the talk show enough

01:19:01   that it's occurred to me.

01:19:03   How is it possible that they can keep sponsoring?

01:19:05   And a lot of the shows I listen to are sponsored by them.

01:19:09   I've thought about it.

01:19:10   And in some sense, I think it can be explained

01:19:13   by the fact that they've, they're a company

01:19:15   that's embraced the modern media world.

01:19:19   meaning like the post PC world of devices,

01:19:24   like the post internet world of media,

01:19:26   where in the old days, your big budget for advertising

01:19:30   would go to print and TV.

01:19:33   Well, probably I should list TV first,

01:19:34   TV and then print in the world, in the old world.

01:19:38   And TV commercials are super expensive.

01:19:40   They're super expensive to produce

01:19:42   and they're super expensive to buy,

01:19:44   at least if you're going to put it in front,

01:19:46   to get a large number of people to listen.

01:19:48   I

01:19:50   Think it makes total sense for them because I think that they're much more targeted like advert

01:19:54   I've seen Squarespace ads on TV. They have TV ads. I mean there they definitely have a huge ad budget

01:19:59   I've seen them on the subway - yeah, but

01:20:02   People who listen to podcasts of any kind let alone technical

01:20:05   Podcasts are so much more likely to be the sort of people who are going to build a website of any kind

01:20:10   That it's a better way to target at you know

01:20:16   You know far less money than you would pay to get an ad in you know, the New Yorker or something like that

01:20:22   Yeah, so specter

01:20:24   specter the title of the

01:20:27   24th Bond movie they had a they had a press conference today in

01:20:31   London this was all a huge surprise to me

01:20:34   I mean, maybe I'm just not paying enough attention, but I had no idea this was coming this this came out of no

01:20:38   Yeah, see I knew that I've tried to stay as spoiler-free as I could but I knew that there was a new one coming

01:20:43   I knew Sam Mendes had been resigned to come back even though he did I he didn't swear

01:20:49   It wasn't like a never say never again thing where he said I'm never gonna do another one

01:20:53   But he was pretty adamant that he only wanted to direct one, you know, because he does so many other things

01:20:58   You know and he you know, not just other movies, but he you know does theater and stuff like that

01:21:03   And in fact side on Squarespace

01:21:05   Yeah

01:21:05   the production of the movie was actually set back because I think they would have

01:21:09   they would have been further ahead already if they hadn't been waiting for Mendez because he had a

01:21:14   Maybe that's why I'd only take a year. He had a play in London that he was directing and you know and

01:21:21   Directing a play is you know, I don't know

01:21:24   It's all it's a weird thing because you know

01:21:26   It's like the opposite of a movie like as soon as you get a scene right in a movie you move on whereas in a play

01:21:30   You're doing it night after night after night. Yeah

01:21:33   But you know

01:21:36   Skyfall was but such a

01:21:38   office and critical

01:21:40   Success that it you know, it was almost inevitable that they would get him to come back

01:21:45   I think they you know more or less had to make him an offer

01:21:48   He couldn't refuse and he brought back like the same writing team and the same we got the same production team

01:21:54   Yeah, that kind of worries me though

01:21:57   Because I actually think that I know like I said

01:22:00   Header of the show that guy didn't do and I'm not gonna do a whole two-hour thing on Skyfall

01:22:05   But the more time goes on and the more skyfall settles in

01:22:08   The less I like it you start to see the seams

01:22:12   I feel like it's a really it's kind of a poorly written film that was made

01:22:18   extraordinarily well like

01:22:21   It's it's well cast the cast is perfect. The look is very good

01:22:26   It has a good feel the ends, you know, the just the it's just such a great cast, you know

01:22:31   Harvey Javier Bardem is so good as a Bond villain

01:22:35   It's such you know, Roger Deakins does such amazing cinematography

01:22:41   it's just a gorgeous gorgeous film and it is so clearly made by people who love the

01:22:48   At least that you know, but the Bond movies have varied so much over the 50 years of the course

01:22:53   But that would it's so clearly made by people who love the things about Bond that I love about Bond

01:22:57   It felt like a love letter to bond. Yeah. Yeah and a well done one

01:23:02   Agree, yeah, you know it makes here's that here's an example that it makes no logical sense

01:23:08   But I like it is one of the things that I thought was perfect in movie is the way that when bond wants to

01:23:15   Ditch the car that that mi6 could track he gets the old db5

01:23:20   And it makes note because that nobody would notice that well

01:23:25   Em even makes em even makes that joke that yeah

01:23:29   this is certainly inconspicuous and it also makes no sense in the sense that it's a reboot of

01:23:34   Bond, you know the whole starting with Casino Royale. It's a read right and whatever

01:23:39   Where did that car even come from whatever the vague rules of continuity were before and and then you know

01:23:45   Up until then it was sort of a hand wavy sort of continuity between Bond movies

01:23:51   You know where it was sort of insinuated that it was one guy

01:23:54   Who had done all these things even if it was played by different actors?

01:23:58   Well, you say that but Lazen be

01:24:01   What it counts, you know, well, no, no. No, I mean the that opening scene in

01:24:06   Our majesty. Yeah, I'm a majesty circuit service

01:24:10   He gets in that fight on the beach and he turns and he looks at the camera

01:24:14   That never would have happened to the other fellow. Oh, yeah that never happened to the yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that's just it's just part

01:24:21   And and again we get into a two-hour on her majesty see it's clear

01:24:25   Her Majesty's Secret Service is clearly the most divisive of all the Bond movies in my opinion because it's either somebody reason people either hate

01:24:31   It or love it. I know and I I have good friends who's who's who's tasting movies?

01:24:36   I generally agree with in large measures who swear up and down that it's the best Bond movie

01:24:42   What yeah Oh name names not irons

01:24:46   Nat yeah, really that I how that's

01:24:49   He's such a smart. Oh, yes, you can just google it. You can find lots of people who will make the argument

01:24:54   Film crit Hulk loved it

01:24:56   Yeah, read film crit. Did you read film crit Hulk's bond tree tice?

01:25:01   No

01:25:02   He reviewed he wrote like a massive thing almost like a like a booklet almost like a booklet length thing where he reviewed every single

01:25:09   Bond movie

01:25:11   This this is fascinating

01:25:13   And I don't know if he said it was his very favorite, but he at least said it was if not, it was very close

01:25:20   I think the gut punch at the very end was good. I think that makes the movie worth it

01:25:25   I don't know if I'd say it's good. It's certainly not the best

01:25:28   No, but it's but it's so stupid that it makes no sense that blowfeld was left alive

01:25:34   there was a bob bobsled chase with gunfire and

01:25:36   and blowfeld's

01:25:40   Bobsled like overturns or whatever and bonds at the bottom and what he doesn't go up there double-check that he just assumes that he's dead

01:25:48   It doesn't make any sense. I felt like I have to serve it. I feel like he deserved to have his wife killed by

01:25:54   Like there was no sorry there was no cockamamie, you know way that he disappeared off a cliff and maybe he had a you know

01:26:03   Parachute or something or some secret escape or something like that. He just wanted a rookie move. Yeah, just didn't go and check

01:26:10   Yeah, like he's never seen a good

01:26:13   He's never seen a movie I guess now

01:26:17   So what do you think of the title I?

01:26:19   Think in the same way that I want to believe that JJ Abrams picked every shot in the Star Wars teaser for a reason I

01:26:27   Have to believe what I want to believe that that title is very very intentional yeah

01:26:34   That title is them not just saying hey, we got the rights to use this name

01:26:39   We're gonna bring stuff back whatever

01:26:40   But like they're trying to say in the same way that at the end of Skyfall you hear money penny

01:26:46   Yeah, hear that name and that means something and you see Ray fines coming in as M

01:26:50   And you see on the back of the office door that that leather door, right?

01:26:54   But just like from the old movies it kind of right now

01:26:58   We're in this place where the Bond movies the country of the Bond movies is Luke. Yeah, it looks like yeah, I even he even

01:27:05   It's like I wrote on during fireball day. He's just

01:27:09   Ray fines M is a very Bernard Lee like M

01:27:14   you know now there's obviously a different dynamic because

01:27:16   Ray find is clearly not that much older than

01:27:21   Daniel Craig and

01:27:24   He's new as M

01:27:26   Whereas in the in the old Bond movies it always and and in the novels both in the movies and the novels

01:27:34   It there's an idea that M and M has been there forever, you know that he's been there for a lot

01:27:42   He's been in charge of mi6 for a long time, right? It's a kind of a paternal relationship. Yeah, yes exactly

01:27:47   It's in fact, it's in the novels at least I think it even is it even says so explicitly that it's like a paternal

01:27:54   Relationship and you can kind of see it in the movies. Yeah with the like the thing with the gun the

01:28:00   The the okay. What was the was the gun that he originally had?

01:28:04   Yeah, the one that in the original Quartermaster comes in and says it's it would be good for a lady

01:28:11   Yeah, there's the argument about the end I know the T.

01:28:13   Hit a Beretta.

01:28:14   I mean, that's gonna hit me for not knowing this, but yeah, the question of he was supposed

01:28:18   to be using the other gun and he was like, he's very steadfast, like, no, this is...

01:28:22   I think he carried a Beretta and the Quartermaster and M insisted that he switch to the Walter

01:28:30   PPK.

01:28:33   Was it?

01:28:34   Yeah, it was a Beretta.

01:28:35   It was a Beretta.

01:28:36   Yeah.

01:28:37   But the argument about that, it never felt to me like this was Bond sticking to what

01:28:41   He knew and what he liked so much as it was it was kind of him sticking it to him

01:28:45   But he was being it felt like a little bit of youthful teenage rebellion

01:28:49   Yeah, a little bit as much as a little bit of column a little bit of column B there

01:28:52   Boot major booth right boot, right? The backstory on that is that there was a guy who was like a weapons expert who?

01:29:01   Who wrote to Ian Fleming after one of the novels and he said look I love these novels. I'm a big fan

01:29:08   But I've got to tell you your choice of weapon for this guy is is

01:29:12   It's pretty poor. This is a this this gun has terrible stopping power

01:29:17   It's you know, there's there's really nothing to recommend it over

01:29:20   You know for this and for the serious business that he gets into he ought to carry, you know, like something something else

01:29:26   And so Ian Fleming wrote him back and with like a thank you. Thank you

01:29:31   This was one, you know, wonderful feedback and then named a character after the guy

01:29:35   That's like a honor form. Did you watch the I think is the BBC?

01:29:40   Fleming the man who would be bond, you know, I I have it in my notes here to talk to you about that. I I

01:29:48   This was my even a year ago where me and you and Brent were somehow like in a back channel

01:29:56   You know with Q branch our soft, you know Q branch our software thing

01:30:00   You guys had watched it and recommended it and well

01:30:04   well Brent was he'd watched the first episode and recommended that we watch it but said it was terrible hmm and

01:30:09   I so I watched it and I I strongly disagreed with his assessment

01:30:14   I put it on my I put on my list of things to watch and then it was like I hit one of those like

01:30:19   June 30th. It was there on July 1st. It wasn't it was gone from Netflix and

01:30:24   I thought and and I remember specially I don't think it was on iTunes either or

01:30:30   - It should be on iTunes.

01:30:32   - Well, maybe it is.

01:30:33   I don't know, but at the time, a year ago.

01:30:34   - It's been the $15.

01:30:35   - But it was like, well, anyway, it's right now,

01:30:37   as we speak, in December 2014, it's back on Netflix.

01:30:42   And oddly enough, I actually started watching it

01:30:45   like four nights ago.

01:30:47   - Oh, how far in are you?

01:30:48   - Three out of four.

01:30:50   - What do you think?

01:30:51   - I'm making that gesture with my hand that's like,

01:30:55   you know, like so-so.

01:30:57   Like, I'm glad it exists, and I am enjoying it,

01:31:00   but it feels like a BBC TV show, not like a movie.

01:31:05   - The, that attitude of I like it, I'm enjoying it,

01:31:09   I'm glad it exists, but it's not great, is kind of,

01:31:11   I mean, the worst Bond movies are still enjoyable.

01:31:15   And there's 24 of them.

01:31:17   - Yeah.

01:31:18   - So there's gonna be good ones, there's gonna be bad ones,

01:31:20   but even the worst of the Bond movies,

01:31:22   even if you really hate Never Say Never Again,

01:31:25   or you really hate Majesty's Secret Service,

01:31:27   you still enjoy watching it, it's still a Bond movie.

01:31:29   And what the show felt like to me was not so much like a biopic about Fleming as it was kind of

01:31:36   Kind of a semi sort of maybe a little bit

01:31:40   sanctioned prequel

01:31:43   Maybe I read it as this and it's it right there in the title the man who would be bond

01:31:48   So it feels to me like this is the template for bond by the way, I think you just grew bird

01:31:53   The word biop I see I've always said it biopic

01:31:58   like biography picture biopic

01:32:01   Biopic would be like it was like a disease over the eye or something. Oh, let's let's find this out biopic

01:32:07   I like that you call it a group break, right? I'm gonna alright. I'm gonna let's look this up

01:32:12   Now I want to know

01:32:15   Well, my problem with looking up emphasis and maybe this is why I miss perhaps

01:32:18   How many words is I don't know how to read the diacritical marks?

01:32:22   and there's like three or four different systems of diacritical marks to show you how to like

01:32:26   Pronounce a word and where the emphasis goes. I don't I don't understand any of them once like all those Schwoz and everything starts showing

01:32:32   Up, I don't know

01:32:33   Well, this is what the internet is for. Yeah, it'll uh, you can just listen a little a little audio clip. Here's one

01:32:40   Bio pic. Oh, you're right. Yeah, it's a yeah, it's a bio and a picture. So it's a bio pic

01:32:48   Bio pic to me sounds like somebody taking photographs in the bathroom. I

01:32:54   I just think it's industry lingo, you know, yeah. Yeah, they're like a chick flick. I've learned something today biopic

01:33:01   And see if you had said biopic I would have called you out on that. Yeah

01:33:05   I've had I and I I you know, okay

01:33:09   Whenever I hear somebody pronounce a word differently than I have pronounced it my entire life

01:33:13   I generally assume I generally assume that I've just learned something

01:33:17   Because it's usually a safe bet like, you know

01:33:20   It's like with the Sith thing like you get you mispronounce enough words that you've read visually

01:33:25   But never pronounced enough and you're almost always wrong you start to assume that if I pronounce it differently, I'm wrong

01:33:31   Wait, did you miss found Seth? No, but in the way that like you pointed out that maybe if you know

01:33:39   Anything down information if you killed you if you're a Sith apprentice and you just killed your master

01:33:46   To become the master. Maybe you don't take an apprentice if you realize that you're completing like a

01:33:51   Thousand generation chain of that happening, you know over and over again every time and if you're the new guy 30 years later

01:33:58   You've got no idea how to pronounce medical organs

01:34:00   Did you see the thing where the the poster that they unveil and there's a cool little movie they have to where it just shows

01:34:10   The the name specter being like animated it

01:34:13   Oh, yeah, and it was like the in the the bullet in the glass

01:34:16   It almost reminds me of the did you see you saw it at Singleton - but do you see Dave Addy's post? Yeah on

01:34:22   The opening credits of alien. Yeah, it's sort of that same sort of effect where the word specter is revealed piece by piece in the letters

01:34:31   And it's just a I think the type nerd in me and the bond nerd in me for being

01:34:36   It was like maybe 20 seconds of video that shows you nothing

01:34:40   It felt really good watching it. Yeah, and the way that the you see and you mentioned

01:34:44   Did you just mention is that the logo looks like the old spectrum of the broken glass underneath? Yeah

01:34:48   Yeah, there's the the bullet like a bolt through the glass

01:34:50   But the way the glass shatters there's the like the tentacles like the Hydra style

01:34:54   all right, but the specter logo middle of the the Hydra meaning that

01:34:58   The Hydra logo from the Marvel Universe and the specter logo shares some visuals limited similarities, right?

01:35:04   But the idea behind the logo is that it's like a multi tentacle

01:35:08   Organization that you know, you can't you know, kill one technical and still got other seven ones around the world or whatever

01:35:14   You cut off one head and two more shall appear

01:35:17   So I the most interesting casting to me is Christoph Waltz, oh

01:35:23   Yeah, I mean there's there's there's lots of good all the news and casting is good news

01:35:29   But but Christoph Waltz that's that's like

01:35:31   Now we got a fucking movie. Yeah

01:35:34   It's funny. It's and it seems like they've really in and there's what's his name the guy from Guardians of the Galaxy

01:35:39   David Bautista, yeah is mr. Hinks, which is so obviously it's so old-school Bond henchmen

01:35:48   I mean, you know look at the guy. Yeah. Yeah gotta be like a criminal henchman with the name. Mr

01:35:54   Hanks sounds perfect, but it's totally taking it back like

01:35:57   You know to to Connery and more era Bond, you know

01:36:04   It's got a little bit of camp in it. Yes, that's that's kind of what made bond fun then. Will it work now?

01:36:10   Yeah, I don't know. So the the speculation has been there have been rumors and again, I've tried to avoid them

01:36:17   But you know, I think everybody now that they're calling the movie specter. It's not spoiling anything that there were rumors that Kristoff Waltz

01:36:23   Was gonna play Blofeld for a while. You're saying you didn't see those rumors the the name that what was the name?

01:36:30   They gave him for him in their announcement. They've saying he's playing a character named Oberhauser

01:36:35   Yeah, which if you google that name?

01:36:38   I googled it because I wanted to find out what it meant in German because I thought maybe that was a hint at something because

01:36:42   I kind of had it just has the scent of this is a codename for a character

01:36:46   This isn't the characters real name and if you google that name

01:36:48   It's the name of this like Nazi general who has tried for war crimes after World War two

01:36:53   Like this very famous Nazi and to me that's that's so over the top

01:36:58   That it can't possibly be a real character's name that has to be masking something. Yeah, I think he's blow fell

01:37:05   Bring back if you're gonna bring back

01:37:08   Specter you might as well bring back blow film

01:37:10   I mean you could make the argument that you bring back

01:37:13   Specter and then blow felled is revealed in the next movie in the same way that you got hints of specter or maybe even

01:37:18   Glimpses of blow felled in even like as far back as doctor

01:37:23   No, you don't really get to see blowfeld until two or three movies in four movies before yeah four movies in or five five

01:37:31   It was so first movie was dr

01:37:34   No, and blowfeld was a guy and a cat you saw him from behind a chair and he had the cat

01:37:39   But you never saw his face and then in Russia with love you saw him in that secret meeting room where he was behind

01:37:46   Phoenician blinds

01:37:48   So you still couldn't see his face and he'd like that was where he unveiled that was where they unveiled the the gag

01:37:54   that dr. Evil used where he had like a

01:37:56   Boardroom table and he could hit right right to kill a guy and then he wasn't in Goldfinger

01:38:04   he wasn't in Goldfinger Goldfinger and Goldfinger had nothing to do with the specter and then in

01:38:09   The next movie was

01:38:12   Thunderball, which was a specter plot to steal a

01:38:17   a

01:38:19   Nuclear missile

01:38:21   But blow felled I don't even know if he was even pictured in it. It was Largo

01:38:26   The the guy with the eyepatch was the the head operative of the mission. Oh, I think maybe we saw him

01:38:33   I don't think we even see him in thunder ball. I don't even think he makes a

01:38:37   Blow feldian like you don't get to see his face, but he's there

01:38:40   I think that

01:38:42   Largo is the only guy and then the next movie is you only live twice and that's where we finally see him and he's played by

01:38:48   David Pleasence

01:38:51   The the the and it's the one that everybody remembers it's the guy the bald guy with the scarred face

01:38:57   Right in the in the crazy suit right the like the you know the doctor evil the doctor evil look

01:39:03   I want to say we saw him and we saw a glimpse of him in two movies prior mostly because

01:39:09   The the three times that we see him the first two hints and then the time when we actually see him

01:39:14   There's like three different looks the clearly three different actors. It's always different actors. Yeah, and in fact it was part of the way that they

01:39:21   they just had this loosey-goosey continuity that would never fly anymore and

01:39:26   The guy who played him in dr. No

01:39:30   Even though he was just seen in a chair from behind stroking his pussy

01:39:38   Was the actor who played I think his name was

01:39:43   Strang wise or maybe it was the guy who played the guy who'd played him in in from Russia with love was

01:39:52   The guy who played strang wise the strang ways the guy who's very was yeah the guy who in in Jamaica in

01:40:00   dr. No

01:40:03   was

01:40:04   the the like

01:40:07   anthropologist who was crooked and

01:40:09   Tried to sneak in and bond killed him while he was playing member bond was playing solitaire to wait for him to come back

01:40:15   And he's right right. Yes, that guy played

01:40:17   played below Feld in the next movie and then the craziest one is

01:40:22   In

01:40:27   You only live twice the one where he goes to Japan and before it gets all crazy racist and he dawned the yellowface makeup

01:40:34   He meets the mi6 operative in Tokyo and the guy is

01:40:40   wearing a kimono and it's like he's been stationed there. He's a British guy who's been stationed there for 30 years and

01:40:47   It's a nice little touch he makes he

01:40:50   He makes him a martini and he says stirred not shaken right which is of course wrong

01:40:57   But bond being a polite British person says perfect. Thank you

01:41:01   You know, it just accepts it and doesn't bother correcting him and then he gets stabbed by like a ninja assassin and bond has to go

01:41:07   chasing him that actor the guy who played a

01:41:11   British intelligence agent in you only live

01:41:15   Twice two movies later is the guy who played Blofeld in diamonds or forever

01:41:21   Really? Yeah, and he doesn't even look different. It wasn't even like they gave him different makeup or a different hairstyle. That's right

01:41:27   That's right. So a lot of this blurs together for me because I watch all of the Bond movies over the course of a month

01:41:32   It's it's 20

01:41:35   You would never ever have like a like a recasting. It's almost like, you know, like they were they were casting out of like

01:41:42   You know like Saturday Night Live like where you have like a an ensemble cast and you just have to keep reusing actors

01:41:50   So will you say that but look at Doctor Who Peter Capaldi the new doctor?

01:41:54   He was in an episode as you know just some side character like five years ago

01:41:59   The the previous companion was always in that same episode in fact as a totally different character

01:42:05   Maybe there's just not that many actors in the UK. Yeah, I don't know

01:42:11   There's random people at least it was like an old boys club back then

01:42:14   I don't know people and I think cuz nobody got to rewatch movies on home video that everybody just assumed that they were

01:42:19   I do it was like a thing ahead. It was like nobody's ever gonna watch this again

01:42:24   I don't know, but it's crazy that just two movies apart the same guy played a British agent and blow felt

01:42:31   Yeah, I'm guessing see his face -

01:42:36   I'm guessing that Christoph Waltz is blow felt because you're gonna bring back specter

01:42:41   You got to bring back blow felt and if you're gonna have blow felt who I mean, he's as good an actor as anybody

01:42:46   I mean, he's that's just it. That's just it like in these procedural TV shows

01:42:51   They try to do the thing where they they want to keep you guessing as to who the who the guy was who committed the

01:42:57   Murder, but like you can just say look, but this is the character actor that I've seen in other TV shows clearly. That's the murderer

01:43:03   Right you look at this a big-budget big production like this. You don't bring in Kristoff Waltz to just play some dude

01:43:10   That's it. I look at it this way if blow felt is in the movie. It's got to be Kristoff Waltz and

01:43:18   If blow felts not in the movie then when because how many more does Daniel Craig have in him, right?

01:43:24   if you're gonna bring back specter for for the end of

01:43:27   Daniel Craig's run in the role you got to have blow felt in there as soon as possible

01:43:32   I figure you bring them you got to bring them in and you know

01:43:36   Finally have you know like in the old Bond movies finally have a movie where Bond doesn't get that guy at the end

01:43:43   You know blow fell to ski. I'm expecting blow felled. Whatever his crazy scheme is in this movie will escape at the end

01:43:48   It'll be back in the next movie

01:43:50   You know, whatever hard lessons bond has learned in casino Royale quantum solace and Skyfall

01:43:55   He hasn't had a huge failure yet other than the just the failure of Vesper land

01:44:02   That's pretty bad. Well, yeah, but it wasn't it wasn't a failure

01:44:06   That was a personal failure

01:44:08   That wasn't a failure on the level of the guy who was trying to destroy the world kind of got away with blowing up a chunk

01:44:14   of it

01:44:16   Speaking of specter and evil worldwide multi-tenacled organizations. I want to tell you about our good friends at back blaze

01:44:23   Back blaze is unlimited unthrottled online

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01:44:38   Sounds dirty it really that's I forget what did

01:44:43   They even told us how big a petabyte is and I forget how big it is

01:44:47   And I sent us an email and it was just it was it's so much more data than you have

01:44:51   It's crazy and it's they've done great stuff

01:44:55   You know if you google it and they talk about like how to set up a data center that's reliable and cheap and how much

01:45:00   You know cost to get drives and stuff like that

01:45:03   It's crazy how much data they have backed up but how they figured out a way to do it

01:45:08   Cheap because there's a factor with back plays and I've talked about it for a while

01:45:13   But it is a factor where there's almost a too good to be true feel to it

01:45:16   Because it's just five bucks a month per computer for unlimited unthrottle backup

01:45:24   And it's again it's one of these things. It's such a great product

01:45:27   But it I remember I heard about it for a long time before I signed up

01:45:31   Because I remember there's other shows that they sponsored

01:45:33   And one of the reasons I didn't sign up is it had like this too good to be true feel to it

01:45:39   Because you think things like well it probably only backs up your startup drive

01:45:43   No

01:45:44   It backs up like if you have like an external hard drive that is three terabytes or four terabytes or bigger

01:45:50   Where you keep all of your you know digital media and stuff like that

01:45:54   They back that up to right it might take a while depending on your upstream, but once it's backed up

01:46:00   It's up there and you you know then after that everything is you know incremental when you add new files and stuff like that

01:46:06   But it's not just your startup drive

01:46:09   It's you know it's everything and five bucks per Mac per month for unlimited

01:46:15   unthralled a backup and it just works and it just runs you install their software and

01:46:19   Forget about it. You see like like fate well

01:46:24   You don't use Facebook

01:46:24   But sometimes you see posts from people or emails from people or YouTube comments from people

01:46:28   Where every other word is misspelled and there's no punctuation or capitalization and you wonder in 2014

01:46:34   When every device you could possibly touch that that has a battery has spellcheck

01:46:39   How it's possible that these people like there's no excuse for misspelling words unless autocorrect gets you in the same way

01:46:45   You've got no excuse if your hard drive crashes and you don't have a backup at five dollars a month

01:46:50   There's just it's it's unfathomable to me that you wouldn't have had something in place

01:46:54   It's I here's what I'm gonna do this holiday season is I because I have a bunch of family members with max who don't have back

01:47:00   Plays yet and I'm not gonna give it as a gift because you know, here's here's back up. Here's your present

01:47:04   I'll get him a real gift but talking stuffer, but when I'm at their house, I am going to in addition to a gift

01:47:10   I'm gonna give them back place and I'm gonna set it up for him and just soak it up because I

01:47:15   Feel better. I'm like my parents don't have back place on their Mac yet

01:47:18   But I'm gonna make that make sure that it's like my commitment this year when we go home for the holidays

01:47:22   I'm gonna do it because I would feel so much better if all the pictures my mom has on her Mac are backed up somewhere

01:47:28   outside of her house and

01:47:30   Just do that for everybody in your family when?

01:47:33   You go home for the holidays

01:47:36   and

01:47:38   It'll be you're gonna feel so much better about it

01:47:40   I think it's you know, it's like a in addition to a gift give them back place because

01:47:44   It eventually it's gonna happen. I had somebody in my in Amy's family. Just had a Mac have a

01:47:51   Hard drive go bad like so bad that like when you reboot and go into disk

01:47:56   Disk utility it's like I

01:48:01   Got nothing, you know, and then they took it to the Apple Store and they were like you we got nothing

01:48:06   So like everything, you know, they'd lost photos. They had a whole bunch of photos, you know that

01:48:10   They're just gone. I

01:48:13   Feel and I had the same thought you did I feel terrible about it because I felt like there's so many things you could do

01:48:18   like if they had backblaze I feel bad I felt a little guilty that I hadn't yet told them

01:48:24   that they should have backblaze because it would have saved them five bucks a month per

01:48:28   computer unlimited unthralled backup and here's the thing you get a risk-free no credit card

01:48:35   required trial to start out just go to backblaze.com/daringfireball and you can get it to try out you could just

01:48:44   do that for your relatives just give them the free trial over Christmas and show them

01:48:48   It is and you know let them put the bill so great and tell them to let back plays know that

01:48:53   You heard it on the talk show. Yeah use that use RL back blaze comm slash daring fireball

01:48:59   You can't go wrong

01:49:02   There's no excuse there's no excuse for not having how many do you even have a camera that takes pictures on film?

01:49:08   No, well I do I but I haven't I don't even know if it works anymore

01:49:12   Yeah, I but I take I don't know probably hundreds of pictures a month

01:49:17   month and they're all digital and they're all on my hard drive or

01:49:21   somewhere. If anything happens and I didn't have a backup

01:49:25   then that's like every record of my life.

01:49:29   I lose my hard drive, I just don't exist anymore. I'm like Michael J. Fox in Back to the

01:49:33   Future in that photo. My hand starts disappearing.

01:49:37   It can definitely happen. I mean, SSDs can go bad too, but

01:49:41   if you have anybody that has anything stored on a spinning hard disk, man, you gotta

01:49:45   Have it backed up somewhere else or your laptop gets stolen or I mean there's a million things that can happen

01:49:50   It's just that there's five bucks a month imagine you could get health insurance for five dollars a month of course you do it

01:49:55   Of course you free like unlimited unthrottle online backup for five dollars a month. Yeah

01:50:01   Well imagine if health insurance meant that if you got hit by a bus you could like reboot to where you were yesterday

01:50:06   Right I would definitely pay five dollars a month for that right that's what backblaze is for your data five bucks a month

01:50:15   If only there was back plays for us

01:50:17   It'd be great. That should be their 2.0 product

01:50:20   The engineers are working on yeah

01:50:23   So what else would specter here's the thing I was thinking about with specter and and net one it's

01:50:30   That this was just resolved legally last year this whole backstory and those of you have been listening listen to that whole bond

01:50:37   5x5 the talk show thing from years ago know that we covered this but

01:50:43   The basic stories there's a guy named Kevin McClory

01:50:46   who

01:50:48   Ian Fleming had collaborated with before the bond thing even really got big. I don't think

01:50:54   Yeah, they were there doing it wasn't it supposed to be like a TV movie. Yeah, and they came up with

01:50:59   Collaboratively, I think there was even a third collaborator though who who'd never you know

01:51:04   Who somehow got bought out of his rights early on in the process?

01:51:07   So but he got screwed but forget about the third guy

01:51:10   Just a bit as Ian Fleming and Kevin McClory came up with the premise. That was basically Thunderball. What if a

01:51:17   criminal organization

01:51:19   Could somehow

01:51:22   Compromise a pilot who would be flying a test flight with a nuclear-armed fighter plane and

01:51:30   get the compromised pilot to

01:51:33   Drop the bomb not you know ignited but just drop it in the ocean somewhere where they could

01:51:39   You know then pick it up from the bottom of the ocean and then hold the world

01:51:42   But you know the Western world hostage

01:51:45   Which is really pretty clever like it's you know

01:51:49   One of the things about that thunderbolt plot is in the grand scheme of the whole world is at risk

01:51:54   James Bond plots

01:51:57   It's actually seems pretty plausible right that there are by today's standards, right?

01:52:01   that you know that there are pilots who are flying planes that have nuclear-armed weapons and

01:52:08   Then at that point you've got one guy who you know, if you could compromise that one guy maybe you know

01:52:14   You get him to do something with it

01:52:16   Nothing came of it

01:52:18   I guess whatever the original what TV movie that was supposed to be somehow it fell through

01:52:22   but Ian Fleming thought well that was a hell of a good story and he went ahead and just used it for the

01:52:27   Novel thunderball. Well, wouldn't you?

01:52:30   I mean I can hardly I mean I can see the the contention there, but yeah, I guess I you know

01:52:36   I don't know I'd you know who came up with how much of it who knows you know

01:52:40   I mean like only really maybe maybe only in Fleming and and and McClory really know how much of it

01:52:45   Ian Fleming truly had a right to reuse how much of it he came up with

01:52:49   But regardless they you know that the McClory sued and

01:52:56   There was even some I remember reading about it that the eon productions, you know

01:53:00   The the people who make the movies even they were aware of it and they even you know were wary of making

01:53:06   Done, you know doing a movie of thunderball until it was resolved

01:53:10   But they had lawyer enough lawyers who said now that's is all gonna go away this McClory's a crock, you know a crackpot

01:53:15   But it ended up that he got the rights it by the time it was ended it ended with

01:53:22   It was like a you know, like the the fable of Solomon where you know, two women come in saying this is our baby

01:53:28   Right, and he's like yeah cut it in half and the woman who said no

01:53:32   No, just you know, he's like, ah, you must be the real mother because you know

01:53:36   You're more concerned about the baby than you are about this

01:53:38   It was like a Solomonic decision with this where they both had the rights to Thunderbolt

01:53:44   Ian Fleming and thus eon productions who had the rights to Ian Fleming's James Bond and Kevin Maclaurie

01:53:50   so Kevin McClory had the legal rights to make a movie based on the novel thunderball and

01:53:56   That's you know, and he spent like decades trying to get it made and that's what eventually became never say never again

01:54:02   That's why I never say never again. The plot is so similar to thunderball. It's a weird it's a weird

01:54:08   Moral fable who wants half a baby?

01:54:11   It is weird. Yeah, it's weird. It's weird that you know, I you know, it's like all those fables, you know

01:54:19   They're painted the the the the lying woman was was like, you know painted in broad strokes. She was like the

01:54:24   Empire, you know, shoot

01:54:27   She's okay with that. But maybe like that's fine, right?

01:54:29   Yeah, and to say like if she had a fleet of TIE fighters, she wouldn't to put shields on

01:54:33   Save a couple bucks

01:54:36   Whatever it takes get it done

01:54:38   It's weird that Kevin McCrory got

01:54:41   Even the ability to use the name James Bond right whatever you'd say about his claim to the story

01:54:46   Okay, great. You can you can use the same story. Just use a different name for the character

01:54:50   Yeah, I've linked to this before I put it in the show notes again. I hope it's still there on YouTube

01:54:56   Do you ever see the recut opening of never say never again? Yeah

01:54:59   I think I think when you link to it, maybe maybe was on

01:55:02   This show or maybe it was on during fireball

01:55:06   But you talked about how great it would be if they redid the whole movie like that, right?

01:55:09   It's the gist of it is is the real never say never again has this terrible cheesy 80s

01:55:15   soundtrack and theme and even the logo thing is really cheesy and it's part of

01:55:24   what makes it feel off right from the start and some genius on put up on

01:55:29   YouTube pretty much like the whole like opening five-minute thing of Never Say

01:55:33   Never Again but with the real James Bond theme music and you know logo and you

01:55:43   you know, the stuff like that.

01:55:45   And it improves it so immensely, and it feels real.

01:55:50   It feels like this is a real James Bond movie.

01:55:52   And it's exactly like what I said earlier

01:55:53   about John Williams in Star Wars.

01:55:55   It makes you realize-- - Yeah, you need it.

01:55:56   - Right, it makes you realize how much that music

01:55:58   and graphical theming is part of what makes it feel

01:56:01   like a Bond movie.

01:56:04   - Well, we saw that pretty clearly

01:56:06   at the end of Casino Royale, when you first hear the,

01:56:10   well, I forgot the guy's name,

01:56:11   when you first hear the Bond theme.

01:56:13   I know you mean yeah, and you and they held the

01:56:15   the silhouette, you know

01:56:18   Pulled the gun out and shoot a bullet into the screen. Yeah, and the blood comes down

01:56:23   They held it until the end of that movie

01:56:25   Right, right because this was that the whole point of that movie was this is how he becomes bond, right?

01:56:29   it was like this it was almost like the whole movie was sort of a

01:56:32   Feature length

01:56:36   What's it called like a prelude

01:56:41   What do you call like chapter zero of a book?

01:56:43   Like prologue. Yeah prologue like it was like a two-hour prologue

01:56:47   Yeah, well, I kind of read it as

01:56:50   similar to like Batman Begins and that was at the time and movies when Batman Begins and

01:56:54   Like rebooting a thing was the thing to do like give us some more origin stories, please

01:56:59   Yeah, it was a casino Riles like the greatest origin story ever. I think I think I'd agree with that

01:57:06   I think I'd agree that in so much of it for me and

01:57:09   There's I don't think I'm giving away any secrets by saying that Vesper land my favorite bond girl

01:57:13   And I think that is such such a defining moment in bonds life if you want to imagine that it's it's one guy

01:57:19   And this is all his story that

01:57:21   The the story of Vesper land is the story of bond without her. There's no James Bond

01:57:26   yeah, and they you know, it wasn't like he started as a

01:57:30   85 pound

01:57:33   You know sickly weakling who needed a super serum to become James Bond. He was already

01:57:38   He wasn't bitten by a radioactive secret agent, right?

01:57:41   He was obviously already well trained in the military

01:57:44   And had the mindset and was on the type of person who would be on a career path to become a double-o in mi6

01:57:51   It's you know, what is it? Like? What would that what would that character be? Like when he's like one cut below becoming a double-o

01:57:59   You know and what would he be like when he first gets granted the double-o status and isn't really comfortable at that level

01:58:07   It doesn't really get it yet isn't really

01:58:09   Isn't quite prepared for it, you know, but still maybe a little a little insufferably arrogant. Yeah

01:58:16   He knows he's on the cusp, but he's not he's not seasoned enough to be comfortable in it yet

01:58:21   Yeah, and we've that scene on the train with him and Vesper going back and forth trading shots and he loses that argument

01:58:28   Yeah, if anybody who doesn't anybody who doesn't hold that that's one of the best scenes in an action movie in

01:58:35   Recent memory, you know, I would say ever but in you know in the modern era of movies

01:58:40   It's like we're just not gonna be able to have a we're not gonna agree on anything when it comes to cinema

01:58:45   It's not even actually that's one of my favorite scenes in a movie. Yeah, it's just so good

01:58:49   It's and it's you know, it's in a series where the the level of actual

01:58:56   Personal interplay between Bond and the women in the movie

01:59:03   It's just notoriously thin, you know, and it's more or less just blah blah blah. Let's go to bed

01:59:09   Right. Yeah, and this plays so well against that but it even stands on its own

01:59:14   It works in both directions, which I think is what makes it so great, right?

01:59:17   You can see why both of them like each other and you can see why both of them dislike each other and you can see

01:59:22   Why both of them like the other because of the reasons that they dislike the other?

01:59:26   Yeah, when she asks, how's the lamb and he says skewer? Yeah sympathizes. He says it with a smile

01:59:31   Like he's kind of into this he's into this lady. Yeah. Yeah, it's definitely one of the best scenes

01:59:36   I it makes it to otherwise it's a great movie anyway, but it's it's really the scene that like puts it over the top

01:59:42   What do you think I was thinking about this with specter and the movie specter?

01:59:47   And the organization is that there's there they could be repeating a pattern

01:59:52   So in the in the Sean Connery films, there's dr. No, and that's a specter movie. Dr

01:59:57   No is is you know, one of the agents of specter and from Russia with love is a specter movie

02:00:03   Then the third one goldfinger was just about it was off specter and it was just this

02:00:08   crackpot guy goldfinger and his plan and then in the fourth and fifth ones they went back to

02:00:13   Specter with dr. No and and you only live twice

02:00:16   So you're saying that with Casino Royale you had this there was this shadowy organization that I believe

02:00:23   You know you and I chatted about this today in prep for the show

02:00:26   But I believe in Casino Royale there was never given a name to it, but there was the guy mr. White

02:00:30   Which is the guy who he?

02:00:33   The great scene at the end of the movie when this guy mr. White who had been like behind all this

02:00:39   scheming and the funding of La Shifra

02:00:41   And who saved James Bond's life by coming in and killing La Shifra and letting Bond go when he was being tortured

02:00:48   Lefler, yeah, how would you pronounce it? I think it's Le Chiffre Le Chiffre. Yeah, I mean

02:00:55   I'm sure the Internet's gonna correct. Yeah, let's shift for whatever

02:00:58   The sheaf I guess that's what they say in a movie actually

02:01:01   It's foreign

02:01:04   This mr. White guy is you know, obviously if not the highest up

02:01:09   It's he's a higher up in some shadowy criminal organization

02:01:12   And then he's you know, one of the neat things about quantum of solace, which it opposite of Skyfall

02:01:18   I continue to like more and more as I as the years go on and I rewatch it

02:01:24   Like if I redid I bet of all the the the commentaries I did with Dan on the original series

02:01:29   The one I would probably change the most if I redid it now is quantum of solace

02:01:33   Which I at the time did not like because of a bunch of plot holes and some weak writing

02:01:38   The more I watch it. I like it more

02:01:41   And I I even like I like the idea that it starts like an hour after Casino Royale. Yeah, it's like the next day

02:01:49   Yeah, he's got like he's got mr

02:01:51   White in the trunk of his car, but you don't even know that until he opens the trunk of his car

02:01:55   When you see it in theaters, it had been like two or three years since Casino Royale

02:01:59   So you've probably forgotten about that and I think that

02:02:02   Assuming that this was a whole new story starting over was what ruined the movie for the people who didn't like it

02:02:07   Right, but if you watch them if you it yeah, that's a good thing

02:02:10   I think that's why I like it more and more I do think so that it's the fact that it continues from it

02:02:14   Yeah, take a day take an afternoon and watch them back to back quantum of solace is a much better movie than you probably so

02:02:21   I didn't know this I was under the impression that the criminal organization and you know and that they had like the

02:02:26   Right hand man to M was in fact a double agent working for them

02:02:32   You know and he he betrays them and you know almost kills them and bond and he's the guy who rescues. Mr. White from captivity

02:02:39   That that organization in quantum of solace it ends up that they call the organization quantum at some point and if you google and you

02:02:48   Know look around and just google for quantum

02:02:51   Organization James Bond you'll see that there's people who call that organization quantum and that's how I read it

02:02:56   I guess but wouldn't it be cool though?

02:02:58   If if if they somehow make it seem as though that organization is a specter

02:03:03   Well, it was pretty strongly of the hinted at least and that's how I read it

02:03:07   Right is that that was or maybe that was like the code name. Well, yeah

02:03:10   Yeah

02:03:10   like a code name of it and the

02:03:12   Explanation behind the scenes was that dates they'd hadn't settled this lawsuit with the clever Kevin McClory mistake

02:03:18   Mistake, you know getting back to McClory. The whole thing is a year ago in 2013

02:03:22   Eon productions finally wrote a check of you know

02:03:26   both sides agreed not to say what it was but

02:03:28   some amount of money they gave to Kevin McClory's estate because I guess McClory died a few years ago and

02:03:34   now

02:03:36   Eon wholly owns the rights to

02:03:38   Specter and Thunderball again

02:03:40   That seems like the thing that could only happen after McClory dies and after Albert Broccoli dies

02:03:46   Right once once like the people who were actually having

02:03:49   Actually involved in that that angry battle are out of the picture

02:03:53   It could like cooler heads prevail, right?

02:03:55   Because that was one of the side effects even though McClory only had the rights to redo as in terms of Ian Fleming's material

02:04:01   to do thunderball somehow part of the side effects of this judgment was that

02:04:05   Yan

02:04:06   Couldn't use specter anymore and they did make a few more movies, you know after thunderball, but at some point after

02:04:13   diamonds are forever

02:04:16   the

02:04:17   lawsuit got to such a place where they felt like they couldn't or shouldn't or

02:04:21   Explicitly told they can't make if they use specter then McClure you would get the rights to that movie, too

02:04:26   You know that if they put him in, you know, the spy love right that then then McClure, you know

02:04:32   somehow specter was somehow part of what you got with thunderball and so last year they finally just made it all go away and

02:04:39   Now they own the rights to it. So now they can call it specter. So I feel like they should

02:04:45   Clearly they should do that right they should make you know

02:04:48   Somehow blur the lines of that what was called quantum and just say that that's you know specter

02:04:53   Yeah, it could be that it was quantum was an offshoot

02:04:57   It could be that that was the precursor organization would have been don't even really need to give us a whole bunch of backstory

02:05:02   You just tie it together quickly to give us one line of dialogue

02:05:08   Yeah, like the call it call it a give us an allusion to project quantum, and that's good enough. Yeah

02:05:14   I hope they don't I hope they don't reuse the acronym the special projects and

02:05:21   Something something because it doesn't even really add up to specter

02:05:25   You have to like cross out a cousin

02:05:27   And to get the S and the P you have to count both the S and P and special or you know

02:05:33   We know what you're doing. You're just trying to get to the word specter. Just if you want to call it specter

02:05:38   Just call it specter. Yeah, cool name. Yeah, because we all agree. It's a cool man. Yeah

02:05:42   There's no reason to back run him it and and the one that Fleming came up with was pretty bad

02:05:46   It's kind of like shield shield has a crazy

02:05:49   Yeah, and they totally embraced that with the there in one of the I don't know if it was an Iron Man movie

02:05:56   or yes, Iron Man where they didn't have the acronym yet, but agent Coulson

02:06:01   You know said him from the whatever a homeland blah blah blah blah blah and strategic homeland intelligence

02:06:07   Something in logistics division. I can't believe I remembered that much of it. All right

02:06:11   Yeah, and he's like somebody says that's a mouthful and he says yeah, we're working on it. Yeah

02:06:17   That's actually but if you think about it, it's actually I remember thinking about it when it came out

02:06:24   It's actually pretty good

02:06:25   Like there aren't any like real clunker words in there like there are in the specter actor

02:06:30   I wonder how many people they had working on that. I don't know if they came up with one guy. He was really good at

02:06:36   background naming

02:06:38   That's just such a fun word. Where is the air? It's the special executive for counterintelligence

02:06:44   terrorism revenge and extortion

02:06:48   So you have to use the S and the P from special right and I mean if you're gonna if you're gonna make a special

02:06:53   Case for any word it should be the word special and the way Fleming spelled it if counterintelligence was hyphenated

02:06:59   So you have to ignore the I?

02:07:03   Words you get two letters

02:07:05   Sometimes you get two words only have one letter and I think revenge really sticks out as sort of

02:07:11   You know that if you weren't back running it, why would you put revenge in as the organization, you know counterintelligence? Okay terrorism, definitely

02:07:21   Extortion definitely right as opposed to you know, like a religious terrorist group that is just after for the the you know

02:07:32   For the the virgins in heaven or whatever, you know specters in it for the money

02:07:37   So yeah extortion definitely part of it, but revenge

02:07:40   Like it's like look guys we can do all these things but only the people who have wronged us

02:07:45   Yeah

02:07:46   Cuz it also

02:07:46   implies that you're gonna have they're gonna build up a list of enemies along the way that they have to get revenge against as opposed to

02:07:53   Wouldn't your wouldn't your ideal be that you leave no enemies behind?

02:07:56   That there is nobody that you need to seek revenge against because you're never gonna get wronged

02:08:01   Oh, I thought it was that they were it was all in the name of revenge against people for things that had already happened

02:08:07   Oh, maybe which leaves you no room for advancement or growth

02:08:11   former schoolmates of Blofeld

02:08:14   There's the guy that like gave him a swirly in second grade right the girl who wouldn't go to the prom with him

02:08:21   It's pretty pretty short list. We're not gonna be that busy. Don't be honest with you guys

02:08:27   We might have to add some letters at the end for like I don't know

02:08:30   Playing online poker we can we can maybe do some stuff together on the weekends

02:08:35   How do you guys feel about larping?

02:08:37   Let's if you take one last break and thank our final sponsor for this episode

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02:13:16   So Fleming the BBC series we finished that there would you get the best you you couldn't have missed it

02:13:21   There's a vest. I think it's an episode one. There's a Vesper joke

02:13:24   I'm I'm sure I did but Fleming comes to a bar and

02:13:30   It's I guess it's supposed to be like a seedy place. I don't know

02:13:33   I didn't really look like it seemed like poor art direction, but he goes up to the bartender and just says

02:13:38   Three measures of Gordon's one measure. Ah, yes half a measure of Kina Lillie and the bartender hands him a bottle of beer

02:13:45   And there's this sort of you know

02:13:50   We don't have shit like that here look on the bartender's face and that's it

02:13:55   I like that because it's a joke that you have to be a fit, you know

02:13:58   You know if you're not a Bond fan. It doesn't make it. That's that that whole interaction makes no sense

02:14:02   And if you are a Bond fan, it's it makes all the sense in the world well

02:14:07   I think it still makes sense it means that here's a guy's coming in wanting a hoity-twitty kind of drink

02:14:11   and he it says something about that character and his

02:14:14   misunderstanding of where he was

02:14:17   Yeah, because he was kind of this entitled brat at that point in his and in the story

02:14:21   I was gonna say in his life, which may have also been true. Yeah, it's very watching it at no point

02:14:26   Did it occur to me to?

02:14:28   take this as a literal reading of anything that ever happened to Ian Fleming.

02:14:31   Like, I'm sure there's elements of truth to it, but it seems like this is somebody

02:14:35   making a miniseries out of the stories that Ian Fleming told the people to make

02:14:40   himself sound cool.

02:14:41   Hmm. I actually, since I started watching it, I haven't, I've resisted the urge to

02:14:47   google it, because I want to watch the fourth episode before I do, but then I

02:14:50   want to look and see how much of it is purportedly true. I think a significant

02:14:55   amount of it is true. I think it's, you know, it...

02:14:58   When I went through it, it seemed, from what I read, it seemed like most of this

02:15:03   was blurred lines. Like, so much of what he did while he was in the service was

02:15:11   like redacted and stuff that you're... They'll never come out and say whether

02:15:15   that's true or not, whether he actually did those things. But what they could

02:15:17   line up is like, well, there's elements of truth and these things probably

02:15:21   happened maybe not the way he said but the the consensus it seemed was that

02:15:25   this is sort of you know as much bullshit as it was truth right which to

02:15:29   me is I mean that's that's what storytelling is and that's what he was

02:15:32   was a storyteller yeah and it seems like it's set up where he's sort of repeatedly

02:15:40   he you know he works as you know in British intelligence during World War

02:15:46   war 2 that's almost the bulk of the movie or that series and

02:15:50   Just comes up with clever. His whole job is to come up with clever ideas to screw the Germans

02:15:56   but he he keeps wanting to get sent out into the field and isn't isn't allowed to and

02:16:04   Then you know

02:16:05   It sets it up that his the whole the whole reason he wrote the bond series was to have a guy like him

02:16:10   Who does get to go out in the field? Yeah a little bit of

02:16:14   Exploring those fantasies getting to live out those fantasies through your character. Yeah, I forget her name, but there's like a

02:16:19   Money penny like woman who works with his bought for his boss who is almost too

02:16:28   Uncannily like the the original money penny in the movies which must have been that they had to be intentional

02:16:35   Oh, I think it's absolutely and you know, I think it's over-the-top intentional. I

02:16:40   Wouldn't be surprised if I don't know. I don't know

02:16:42   I haven't looked it up yet, but I wouldn't be surprised if that part of it for example is just purely fiction. Yeah

02:16:48   But it's so tough to tell because so much of that era of his life is just him telling those stories

02:16:53   Yeah

02:16:53   My bottom line on Fleming is for anybody if you love Bond and you like the you like Bond you should watch it

02:17:01   Especially while it's free on Netflix and if you're not if you're like kind of like and on Bond it's I would say skip it

02:17:06   What was the other Oh everything or nothing the documentary? Yeah, that was disappointing too. I thought really

02:17:12   Well, I liked it. But again, I wouldn't recommend it for anybody who wasn't a big fan. I

02:17:17   would say if you've seen

02:17:19   Every or nearly every Bond movie you'd probably like Fleming and you'd probably like everything or nothing

02:17:24   Actually, I take it back now that I think about it more

02:17:27   I think everything I think I think I'm miss remembering off the top of my bed

02:17:30   I actually I think top of my head. I think I actually really liked everything or nothing. I enjoyed it

02:17:35   And I think if for nothing else

02:17:37   To hear Lazenby get to talk about in hindsight the way he acted and his role in the bond universe

02:17:44   Yeah, that's worth the price of admission

02:17:46   Yeah, I totally take it back now that I think about it cuz that's the one I was misremembering

02:17:50   It's the one where in addition to some great stuff with Lazenby

02:17:54   I thought there was really really great stuff with

02:17:58   Pierce Brosnan. Oh

02:18:01   Yeah, well he was talking about he he says I forget the forget exactly what he says

02:18:06   But he pretty much comes right out and says on camera that after after golden eye

02:18:12   He doesn't really remember the differences between the movies. They're all more or less the same

02:18:16   He well, not that he doesn't remember the differences, but that he can't he doesn't remember which one was which right, right?

02:18:20   Yeah, that's what I mean that there's like well, they all they're all kind of blurred together like he remembers

02:18:24   You know who was in them and he remembers, you know that but he can't you know

02:18:28   Which ones the world is not enough which one is you know?

02:18:33   Because that that era I have the same problem. I remember golden I very very clearly and everything after that for him

02:18:39   I don't remember which I don't even remember that was there was he in three of them or four of them

02:18:42   It was in five I believe

02:18:44   No, yeah

02:18:46   Let's go look it up

02:18:48   There's golden. I world is not enough tomorrow never dies

02:18:51   I think it was it. I think was three no I'm gonna bet there's five

02:18:59   I'll go as high as four you might be right. So there was golden eye in 95 tomorrow never dies in 97

02:19:06   that's the one with

02:19:09   Then the news right? Yeah the the the Rupert Murdoch

02:19:15   Yeah

02:19:15   the Rupert Murdoch guy and

02:19:17   Terry Hatcher as like an old girlfriend who's now back in his life because she was dating the Rupert Murdoch then there's the world is not

02:19:24   Enough that was with Denise Richards. Yeah, and then die another day

02:19:28   Oh, that's right. There were four Halle Berry, right? I think that was Halle Berry and I think that was also the

02:19:35   the

02:19:38   invisible car

02:19:40   And the ice hotel just try to say that without laughing it's impossible

02:19:44   But yeah, but you know what and it's funny you want to talk about you know, is specter a good title at least

02:19:50   You know like those those those other titles are so empty tomorrow never dies. The world is not enough die another day

02:19:57   They sound like Bond movies, but they sound like what they are like Bond movies that are indistinguishable from one another

02:20:03   Yeah, exactly like like like die another day tomorrow never die

02:20:08   So if you told me that the plot of die another day was tomorrow never dies

02:20:11   I would say I would believe you and if you told me the plot of

02:20:14   Tomorrow never dies was in fact the plot of die another day. I would believe you

02:20:19   I guess the title means nothing it refer to anything that happened the same thing with the world is not enough

02:20:24   I don't know like if you told me the world is not enough is the one with the Rupert Murdoch guy

02:20:28   I would say that makes sense because it's like he wanted to take over the world or something. I don't know but it's not

02:20:33   Whereas if you told me that

02:20:36   Dr. No was about a crazy German guy who wants to steal all the gold in Fort Knox. I would be like no

02:20:44   You know or if you told me that

02:20:47   Diamonds are forever, which a lot of people don't even like

02:20:52   You know diamonds are forever was about a guy

02:20:55   You know who

02:21:00   Had a had a crazy tank that looked like

02:21:05   Gila monster on an island in Jamaica. I would be like no that was dr. No

02:21:12   At least like

02:21:17   Goldfinger that that meant something to the plot right diamonds are for them meant some moonraker that

02:21:22   Definitely meant something to the plot say what you will about moonraker that title meant something right but tomorrow never dies

02:21:27   Same as skyfall skyfall, you know, and it breaks a pattern where it's not named after like the bad guy or the McGuffin

02:21:34   But it's about the character, you know, you know, you'll never like 30 40 years from now

02:21:38   We're not gonna forget which one skyfall was killer song. Yeah

02:21:43   Quantum of solace quantum of solace fails that test the song test now the title test and the and and the song test it is

02:21:51   And you know how did quantum of solace have the sound garden song?

02:21:55   Maybe it was a good song or is that the it was Chris Cornell Chris Cornell, but not not full-on sound garden

02:22:01   I think yeah, that wasn't bad

02:22:03   I would say it passes the song test but Skyfall that that song like that still stands you still hear that on the radio

02:22:09   Yeah steer here like in the when you're out shopping or something. You'll hear that on the PA like that's still a good song

02:22:15   Yeah, those are bad. But anyway Pierce Brosnan even admits that he confuses them

02:22:19   And so I would tell I would hold hardly recommend the world or know what's the documentary?

02:22:24   Everything or nothing. Yeah, because that's that's where we learned what what eon productions stood for an eon everything or nothing, right?

02:22:31   Which was a huge reveal to me. Yeah, same here

02:22:35   I didn't know that and it's because I just knew it always confused me that it didn't seem like it had any kind of

02:22:40   reference to the initials of Cubby broccoli or

02:22:43   The other guy who was his original co-producing partner

02:22:46   Saltzman yeah. Yeah Harry Saltzman. Yeah, that's right

02:22:52   There's like a million people listening this right now like

02:22:56   Angry that that they're not able to have their voices heard when they're when we're trying to struggle to remember these things

02:23:03   We need a life. We need the live audience. I'm sure people are yelling at their phones right now. It's Saltzman. Yeah

02:23:09   All right one last thing before we wrap up keep this show short I

02:23:15   Do I want to talk to you about it?

02:23:17   I was you've got a new thing

02:23:18   So you've got a new thing that you've been doing for a couple weeks couple months better at the better elevation

02:23:24   Podcast you used to have a blog we still have a blog called better elevation

02:23:27   Yeah, this is I guess it's I went from it being a blog to it being this other thing

02:23:31   And it does it coincide does it coincide with the end of unprofessional?

02:23:36   It through I guess or just

02:23:39   It yeah, that's not like a direct. I mean there's like a chronological

02:23:44   I had this availability and I was thinking about what I could do creatively

02:23:47   But there's no like this led to that kind of a causal relationship. So now you're doing a show on YouTube

02:23:54   Do you consider yourself a youtuber? I guess just today I signed up for a Vimeo Pro account

02:24:00   mostly because they had this this deal sort of a Black Friday deal where if you bought

02:24:04   It's 200 bucks a year for Vimeo pro account and that their deal was if you buy

02:24:08   The one-year membership the pro account for $200

02:24:12   They would give you a $200 gift card to B&H, which is a like a photography electronic store

02:24:17   Here in New York, and I need to buy some more equipment. So this was like well, I'm gonna spend that money

02:24:22   Anyway, I may as well get a Vimeo account up. I'm

02:24:25   Rolling my eyes thinking about our sponsors this we don't really have anybody who sells gadgets even in the rotation of sponsors

02:24:31   But B&H is a fantastic

02:24:33   Store

02:24:35   They have amazing prices a major amazing service and this crazy like pneumatic tube system for sending the things down to

02:24:43   Even how to explain it and in the confines of a nice short podcast like this

02:24:48   Yeah, I've never been there in person, but I've heard that it's cool. It's pretty amazing

02:24:52   It's like when you were a kid

02:24:54   Do you ever go like the the drive-up teller at the bank and they have them? Yeah. Yeah

02:24:57   When I was a kid like I was so fascinated like the my imagination went nuts

02:25:02   like there must have been a chocolate factory back there where Willy Wonka and the Oompa Loompas were sending money through tubes and

02:25:08   Sometimes candy would come through when they noticed there's a kid in the car

02:25:11   And that's it's kind of like being in the chocolate factory watching the tubes go over your head

02:25:17   That's what it's like being a B&H man

02:25:18   If you want like an obscure lens for like a Canon or Nikon or something like that man B&H has everything

02:25:23   But anyway you bet you're doing you're doing this how many episodes you up to now five six six

02:25:30   I think and they're about four or five six minutes long and

02:25:33   it's

02:25:36   So it's sort of the opposite of

02:25:39   like this show which is two hours of I

02:25:44   Don't want to say a rambling I want to I don't you know

02:25:46   But it's the complaint about podcasts like the talk show that it's unstructured and goes on

02:25:51   It's five minutes of very tightly scripted and then edited

02:25:56   Monologuing yeah and a couple weeks ago. I did an episode about podcasting about what I thought the problem with podcasting is and

02:26:05   it it's almost uncomfortable to say it here on this show because

02:26:10   You know, it's this show but it sort of seems like there's the talk show and then there's a bunch of shows that kind of

02:26:17   followed the template of the talk show and

02:26:19   Even even on things that I've done

02:26:22   I've tried to never do a podcast about like, you know work stuff

02:26:26   I've never done a podcast about design like even unprofessional was very specifically not talking about work

02:26:31   Yeah, that was the whole premise of unprofessional was that it was here's somebody whose work we admire and right at whatever field and we are

02:26:39   Ground rules for the episode is that we are not going to talk about that work. Yeah, that's the one rule

02:26:44   We can talk about anything but work and sometimes it would be crazy stuff like talking to somebody about like, you know

02:26:49   Elephant genitalia because that was just where the conversation wound up with molts

02:26:54   We had molts on we went up talking about what it would be like to eat people

02:26:57   You know

02:26:58   You never know where it's gonna the conversation is gonna take you and that's kind of what it's like to be at a bar and talk

02:27:02   To people I'm surprised the elephant genitalia didn't come up with moles

02:27:07   Because frankly whenever I see it's all everyone's

02:27:10   It's like if moltz moltz is so intimately familiar with elephant

02:27:18   you know the old thing where there's like three blind guys feeling an elephant and they all say different things and one guy's like

02:27:23   You know, it's a tree trunk. It's

02:27:25   You know moltz if he was the blind guy would be right underneath the middle and he'd be like it's an elephant and it's a man

02:27:31   the male I

02:27:34   Know this elephant

02:27:37   I'd recognize that anywhere these grapefruit sizes. Well, they're probably bigger than grapefruit sizes

02:27:44   Actually, I honestly have no idea

02:27:46   I'm so clearly not familiar with the Alpha genitae. I think that I think the topic was about how they they were or were not prehensile

02:27:54   Elephant penis. No, not to be

02:27:57   Why would they be pretty they're huge probably but why would they be prehensile?

02:28:01   But I don't know well it was because like kangaroos kangaroos. They are prehensile. Oh anyway. Yeah getting way off topic here

02:28:08   I did yeah that yeah

02:28:10   And I only know this because I was at a zoo in Australia

02:28:12   And there are some kangaroos going at it that and yeah

02:28:15   It was like it was like the the male kangaroo on top of the female kangaroo

02:28:19   And it was like it was kind of feeling around down there trying to find where to go

02:28:21   And it was a it was a very illuminating and disturbing moment that should be just as well known as the pouches thing

02:28:27   Yeah, well, I don't think they like telling that to kids in school

02:28:31   One time we had Amy's, Amy has a much younger brother,

02:28:36   and he was still a kid, he's in college now,

02:28:38   but he was, I don't know, he was only like 10 or 11,

02:28:41   and we took him to the Philadelphia Zoo,

02:28:43   and we were at the turtle exhibit,

02:28:45   and these turtles, they have signs,

02:28:47   I mean these turtles are like,

02:28:48   some of the, like the male is like 85 years old,

02:28:50   I mean he's ancient, I mean he's super old,

02:28:52   and wouldn't you know it, the guy went right up

02:28:55   behind the female and just went right at her.

02:28:59   I forget if it was the male or the female or if it was

02:29:02   If it was impossible to tell because neither of their mouths were really moving

02:29:06   But one of them was really really getting into it audibly. I

02:29:09   Mean, it's broad daylight open and I would say 10 or 15 feet away from the railing and there's these big

02:29:17   three four foot grand turtles and they're

02:29:22   screwing right there and open and

02:29:26   All these kids there's so many kids and all the kids are saying

02:29:30   What are they doing?

02:29:33   What is he hurting her and I mean the question kids are really like, you know

02:29:39   Like something was clearly going on and it was noisy genuine concern

02:29:42   Right and for the most part those turtles don't even move and this the male this old male turtle is really going

02:29:49   And it was I it was one of the best it was like the reason zoos exist because it's like what do you watch?

02:29:55   Do you watch the 85 year old turtle have at it or do you turn around and watch all the parents try to decide?

02:30:03   What do I do like some of the parents were clearly of the let's just pretend this is nothing

02:30:09   You know, let's just you know

02:30:12   let's get real Catholic about this and just go into denial that this is going on and

02:30:16   Other parents were more of the sort of liberal open-minded

02:30:22   I don't want to act as though this is anything to be embarrassed about I'm going you know

02:30:26   How do I explain this to my kid in a sort of?

02:30:28   Mature professional and and there's no way you could there's no possible way that you could talk to like a ten-year-old kid in a serious

02:30:35   Way about turtles who are having having sex it becomes a meta zoo where you're watching people watch animals

02:30:41   Alright, that would be a good Bond movie title turtles having sex

02:30:44   I'd watch it

02:30:47   No, but yet

02:30:48   But your pot that's one of the things that

02:30:51   I've had it in my notes for the next time you were on the show to talk about the podcast you called it podcast intervention

02:30:56   Yeah, it just seems like we've got a lot of really smart people and a lot of very talented people but

02:31:03   We we've kind of fallen into and when I say we I mean like, you know the Apple tech community

02:31:10   No, I mean not like the world at large or even the tech community at large but like in within our bubble

02:31:14   It's like a lot of people kind of doing

02:31:17   Variations on the same theme and it's not that I think people shouldn't do podcasts. In fact, I think people should do more podcasts

02:31:23   I think everybody should have a podcast. I think it's a great way to communicate ideas and broadcast them

02:31:27   I just wish that we would maybe try some other stuff too and maybe try some variation in the way we approach podcasting

02:31:34   You're you know, we work together. You're not gonna you know

02:31:36   It's we work together on this show you edit the show for those who don't know Dave edits the show Dave

02:31:41   Even handles the sponsorship sales now for this show the talk show

02:31:46   I mean you're as close as there is to

02:31:48   Well, you are you you should you should be correct you do enough work on this show that you should get a credit except we

02:31:54   Don't have credits if the show had any kind of visuals

02:31:56   There would be an edited and some kind of maybe even produced by Dave whiskers credit on the talk show

02:32:03   So it's no surprise that you're going to say good things about it

02:32:07   But when I saw that episode of better elevation, I even know you I don't even remember if you mentioned my show

02:32:14   I think you said good things about this show in ATP something about the fact that we you know that this show in ATP work because

02:32:20   The authors have strong voices that we already knew and now we get to hear them in another context something

02:32:25   It's it's it's the already new part

02:32:27   It's that you would you listen to the talk show not because you heard there's this thing called the talk show and it's great podcast

02:32:32   You're probably listening to the talk show because you read during fireball. Yeah, I've done who knows I know that's a good question

02:32:37   I just assume that for as popular as this show has gotten I just assume that it's

02:32:42   It's a subset of the people who read daring fireball that there are very I maybe there are some though

02:32:48   I'd love to hear from you. But if there are people who don't like daring fireball, but do like the show

02:32:52   But I I do kind of feel like it's sort of like I it's funny to start tying some of these strings together

02:32:57   But I think it's in the way that Fleming only works if you're already a bond fan

02:33:02   Mmm, yeah, then the talk show only works if you're already a daring fireball fan

02:33:06   Well, yeah, you you've referred to the talk show as the it's like the director's commentary track writing fireball

02:33:11   But what I saw your your better elevation it even though you were complimentary towards the show. I took it as you know, I

02:33:19   Took it as as

02:33:23   Motivation that why don't I up the game?

02:33:25   I do feel like I'm incredibly lazy with the format of this show that there's more I could do we could do anything

02:33:30   You know

02:33:31   but I think that's a healthy response and really like oh I

02:33:35   Kind of pissed some people off and some people thought that I was attacking one person or another

02:33:40   I don't want to get into like all of that

02:33:42   But the when I when I had mentioned on the in the video that we have

02:33:47   Multiple podcast networks that are run by a white dude who is on more than one of those shows

02:33:53   Chloe if not every show on that network then almost every show on the network

02:33:58   And it's really easy to assume that I'm talking about anyone who's people when really I'm the fact that there are more than one

02:34:04   There's more than one person that I could be talking about is kind of what I'm talking about, right?

02:34:07   it's not like it's not like it has anything particular to do with Leo Laporte or Dan Benjamin or

02:34:12   Even who like Moises or somebody like that, you know

02:34:16   Yeah

02:34:16   or or Mike Hurley or Renee Richie or but there's so many to choose from and that's kind of what I'm talking about where

02:34:22   We might have a hundred podcasts, but it seems like it's maybe the same 20 people doing all 100 of them

02:34:27   Right and and that again that's not even necessarily a bad thing

02:34:30   It's that the problem isn't with any one of those people or any one of those shows

02:34:32   It's that you can you can say that vague phrase, you know white dude

02:34:37   You know from the tech world who's on a bunch of shows and it can apply to so many of them

02:34:41   Yeah

02:34:41   and any one of those shows any one of those people their quality shows quality people do most of them are friends of mine people that

02:34:46   I would I would speak very highly of them and their shows and their approach to their work

02:34:49   Mike early I talked to a lot even before like I sent him the script for the show and we talked a lot about like

02:34:54   The state of podcasting and what what could be done to push things forward and he's got a lot of great ideas

02:34:58   and I really do think that he's a voice for for positive change there, but

02:35:04   Like at a macro level when you zoom out and you you start to see a lot of like

02:35:08   It's like it's like the speaking tying threads together

02:35:10   It's like you zoom out in attack of the clones and you see just a sea of blue and green lightsabers

02:35:16   That wouldn't look great. You start to see the problem with only two colors

02:35:19   You have to add some more colors in there and I'm worried that as our sphere of influence grows

02:35:25   We're not really adding anything else to it. Like we're kind of working with those same ingredients

02:35:30   yeah, and I worry that we and by we I really mean me since I have a

02:35:35   Popular show and I already have an audience and I'm not doing anywhere near enough to exercise any sort of muscles to play with the

02:35:43   form

02:35:45   It's you know hit record and we've got plenty of stuff to talk about and I think that it's you know

02:35:51   and based on feedback from people and the fact that you know, the the

02:35:55   Download numbers for this show are going up there

02:35:58   They're growing up faster than traffic at daring fireball like a daring fireball is sort of peaked

02:36:03   Readership wise at least in terms of things you can measure but the show is gaining popularity

02:36:07   and I think it's because I've gotten so many interesting people on who have interesting things to say but the forum is

02:36:14   incredibly lazy, it's get somebody interesting on the other end and hit record for two hours and

02:36:21   Then you know pass it over to Dave to get the levels fixed and the mistakes cut out

02:36:26   Whereas we could do anything, you know, we could do something like cereal or whatever

02:36:31   Yeah

02:36:31   people were I kept seeing when that when that thinking man there's been all this discussion now about

02:36:35   podcasts over the last couple of weeks and I keep hearing the same phrase repeated which is

02:36:40   podcasts are

02:36:43   the new blogs

02:36:45   Which I disagree with because with a blog post presumably

02:36:49   You would come up with an idea and you'd think through it and you would edit it and you would refine it and you'd go through

02:36:54   A few drafts whereas on a podcast you you at least from what I know on the landscape

02:36:58   It's more like sitting down and you hit record and having a conversation

02:37:01   So it's not that podcasts are the new blogs. It's more like podcasts or the new I am logs

02:37:06   Like this is it's a conversation. There's nothing wrong with that

02:37:09   My my only argument is I think we could also be doing other things to push it forward

02:37:13   Yeah, I totally agree with that. I

02:37:17   Like for example, I and I know not that nobody has ever done it but like for something like WWDC, you know

02:37:24   Instead of just doing one big show or like I've done last couple years like the live show which I could still do

02:37:30   But why not in the course of the week do you know a couple of 15-minute episodes just with?

02:37:36   You know new stuff like if I don't have time on day one to do a real episode of the show

02:37:41   Why can't I have something that hits the feed and goes to podcast things with just like a 10-minute overview?

02:37:46   Yeah, and like like build around segments rather than my conversation, right?

02:37:51   And it would be you know in loose terms because the analogy doesn't hold for long

02:37:54   But it would be like the way that on daring fireball. It's not just big long articles

02:37:58   It's in fact, most of it is you know, real short things just links to other things

02:38:02   Why couldn't the feed for the talk show have a bunch of little things in it? Yeah. Yeah

02:38:07   And so it was I don't know Jason Snell was on unprofessional months ago and we had this like sort of meta discussion about

02:38:15   Podcasting and what it all means and I was thinking about video and how?

02:38:20   You'll you'll have you know a decent podcast that that gets a fair bit of traffic

02:38:27   You'll get you know ten thousand people listening to an episode

02:38:29   But you put out a YouTube video and that could hit tens or hundreds of thousands of views it could hit millions of views

02:38:36   there's people out there with with YouTube channels that have

02:38:39   20 to 30 million subscribers to say nothing of the views they get just subscribers people who are actively subscribed to that channel and

02:38:46   It just seems like there's this huge audience for for this kind of content that

02:38:51   Maybe we're we're just not we're not tapped into for whatever reason

02:38:54   And I started thinking about that and I decided that whatever I do next I want to I want to try something new

02:38:59   I want to I want to push a boundary that I don't feel like we've been pushing and something that I

02:39:04   Definitely feel I haven't pushed. Yeah, and for sure the way to do video

02:39:08   I think is not the

02:39:10   Let's just record a podcast and we'll also let the camera on our computer

02:39:16   Stream us while we record a podcast

02:39:19   You know what? I mean? Like yeah, Howard Stern did that

02:39:23   As a show was just them filming while they were recording the radio show. Yeah, and that was a little bit higher production value

02:39:31   I'm you know

02:39:32   like I'm thinking like like

02:39:34   And I know some people like it some people actually like it but like the way that

02:39:38   With Leo's shows the guests are all you know, there's also, you know, they're recording audio

02:39:44   but they also have video and

02:39:45   Some of the people are in the studio and it works a little bit more because it looks a little bit more like a regular

02:39:51   TV thing but like like whenever I've been on, you know

02:39:54   Mac break weekly or something like that. It's just a stupid view of me here in my home office

02:39:59   you know staring at the computer with headphones on and

02:40:03   To me that's it's not really adding anything to me. It's almost distracting

02:40:07   I feel like I would never enjoy listening to it watching it to show like that

02:40:11   Like I don't want to see the guys record ATP that would I would gain nothing from that

02:40:16   Whereas I do think though that in theory there is something that like the ATP guys could do that would be video

02:40:22   But it's a different thing

02:40:24   Right, right and that's where I get excited about the idea of video as a medium and it's so funny to talk about this as

02:40:31   if it's like some new frontier that we've just discovered. Whereas your son who's ten

02:40:38   already knows everything about YouTube and that's just like the world he lives in and

02:40:41   like you're not somebody until you have a YouTube channel.

02:40:43   Well, and it's funny because it's something, you know, it gets to the weird notion that

02:40:47   you have to have a name for a thing and that the name for a thing can affect the way people

02:40:52   feel and see and approach it, you know, and that it was possible to do what is exactly

02:40:59   known as blogging before the word blog or web blog or whatever you want to call it hit

02:41:04   but that it was only after we had a name for it that we all kind of agreed that you'd make

02:41:08   posts and they would top down chronological order that it made the whole thing take off.

02:41:17   People were doing what we now call podcasts before the word podcast existed. I mean they

02:41:22   were doing it before there was even an iPod which is where the pod and podcast come from.

02:41:27   And I remember the first show I ever did was Sean King's

02:41:32   Your Mac life and it was I was after during fireball started so it was like 2002

02:41:39   But the tech I mean it was only 12 years ago

02:41:43   But the tech was so old that there was no like way to do it over the internet

02:41:46   I actually had to use like a telephone and call in and we talked for like two hours. Yeah, I think we need

02:41:52   There needs to be a template for this kind of thing. Yeah in the in the way that

02:41:56   that link blogs sort of became a thing

02:42:00   after KotKey and during Fireball.

02:42:03   Like we had a template, we kind of knew how that worked

02:42:05   and so it was like, oh, well that seems like a thing,

02:42:07   I understand it, I can do that,

02:42:09   not to the same level of quality,

02:42:10   but I can make a thing to that pattern.

02:42:13   And it's not that there's anything wrong

02:42:15   with following the pattern, it's that after a while

02:42:18   if no new patterns start to emerge,

02:42:20   then maybe we've got a problem.

02:42:22   - Yeah, I think part of it, you know,

02:42:23   if you want to have something that,

02:42:25   What did you call for, like a Tumblr for podcasts, more or less?

02:42:28   Yeah, there's no drop-in, easy system.

02:42:31   It seems like, in the same way that anybody could sit down in front of Tumblr or Squarespace

02:42:36   and just make a website, there's no way to do that for podcasts.

02:42:40   And it seems like there should be. It seems like there should be really great software for making podcasts.

02:42:45   Because everybody who writes software has a podcast now. You'd think that this would just happen.

02:42:50   Yeah

02:42:51   I almost feel like the board podcast has become known as just two people or or a panel of people just turning on record and

02:42:57   talking and

02:42:59   That the name at the word itself is sort of limited the idea of what it what it can be

02:43:04   Whereas if we just called them shows

02:43:06   It would be a little bit more open-ended and might be might entice people more to do editing

02:43:11   and I think also the word podcast has this like vibe of

02:43:14   nerdy tech thing

02:43:17   Maybe I don't know about that. I think it definitely has a sort of amateur ring to it

02:43:22   Just like blonde did and it will will and will continue to wear off as more and more

02:43:27   Podcasts get better production wise and more and more people with you know, like NPR

02:43:33   You know, I like the millions of people who listen to cereal which is a podcast

02:43:39   Yeah

02:43:39   But it's it's a great example of what you could be doing with the medium and what's funny to me is audio as a medium

02:43:45   is older than movies, that's older than TV.

02:43:47   - Yeah.

02:43:48   - That we're not looking at that as the template

02:43:53   is interesting to me.

02:43:55   Like, well you get like Incomparable,

02:43:56   they're doing radio plays and that kind of thing.

02:43:59   You get, I forget the name of the show,

02:44:03   Mike Hurley and Casey List talking about real life stuff.

02:44:07   These are shows that are kind of,

02:44:08   if the format isn't pushing a boundary,

02:44:10   then at least the subject matter is.

02:44:12   And that's like, I'd love to see more of that.

02:44:15   But also, I'd like to see people trying things

02:44:17   that aren't just audio.

02:44:20   Like there are other things we could be doing.

02:44:21   And we have, in the same way that we,

02:44:26   it's so easy to sit down in front of a computer

02:44:28   and put something on the internet that you typed out,

02:44:31   or that you recorded in audio,

02:44:33   it's in fact even easier.

02:44:35   As bad as, as weird as it is that the tools don't exist

02:44:39   to make podcasting easier,

02:44:40   it's even weirder that we're not doing more video

02:44:42   when those tools do exist for video.

02:44:44   I feel like it's an editing problem too though because I feel like that the tools to make these like we're in it

02:44:50   They'll come eventually. They'll probably come sooner rather than later, but I feel like it's more than just about hitting record and

02:44:56   Then hitting stop and then somehow being able to quickly post what happened in between hitting record and stop like

02:45:05   I'm not saying it right it's I know your level of quality anything but the tools for editing and posting video from your phone

02:45:13   Way better than podcasting from your phone. Yeah, I think it's funny that we've got these super high def cameras

02:45:17   And there's always this big push every year when the new iPhone comes out we talk about the camera

02:45:21   But there's been no major advancements to the microphone technology. Hmm. That's a good point. Right like nobody would recommend

02:45:26   Nobody would recommend

02:45:29   Recording a podcast using the built-in mic on an iPhone. Whereas you could record pretty you can record pretty damn good video with

02:45:35   Yeah, but the audio notoriously is terrible. Yeah, I found you I go and I spend all this this damn money on a

02:45:41   Canon 5d mark 3 and I find that when when I'm on vacation or if I'm traveling

02:45:48   I just shoot from my iPhone because those videos are stellar. Yeah, especially with a

02:45:53   Little bit of post-processing to the video. You can really get pretty fairly, you know

02:45:58   I get in the word professionals a little loaded and has other meanings

02:46:01   Yeah, pretty close to what you know

02:46:03   What better you can get better than what used to be considered professional video pretty quickly, right? Yeah, definitely and professionally

02:46:11   loaded but okay so the video I shoot from my phone I probably wouldn't put

02:46:16   into the next James Bond movie but it works great on my youtube channel right

02:46:21   and the shots look fantastic and I don't mean it looks great in an amateur this

02:46:25   is something I threw together in a weekend kind of way I mean it's like you

02:46:28   know on that size screen and that size and that kind of format that kind of

02:46:32   content it works brilliantly yeah this is high def video there's definitely

02:46:38   something intimate about video too that is different and I tell you honestly I

02:46:42   sometimes have trouble watching your better elevation videos because I know

02:46:48   you I do and it be your soul I it yeah I it's in a way that I have a lot of

02:46:53   trouble listening to my own voice and show like if it was up to if it was up

02:46:58   to me I couldn't edit this show because I just can't bring myself to listen to

02:47:01   it I can listen to parts of it and you know I've done it enough for enough

02:47:05   that it doesn't, it's not like an instant ick factor.

02:47:08   But it's really hard.

02:47:11   And I remember seeing on Letterman,

02:47:13   I think Johnny Depp is one of these actors

02:47:14   who professes that he never watches his own movies.

02:47:18   And I used to think that was bullshit.

02:47:20   I used to think, come on, you're being falsely modest.

02:47:23   But I actually think it's true now.

02:47:25   I think depending on your mindset,

02:47:26   you just can't bear to watch yourself.

02:47:29   - Yeah, you can't enjoy it.

02:47:30   You can't see it the way other people do.

02:47:32   - And it's like I kind of get that feeling

02:47:34   when I watch your better elevation videos,

02:47:36   'cause I know you.

02:47:37   If I didn't know you, it wouldn't occur to me.

02:47:38   You would just be this guy saying this interesting thing

02:47:41   on a video, but because I know you, it's like,

02:47:44   wait, that's Dave, and he's looking at me,

02:47:46   'cause he's looking at the camera.

02:47:48   - Yeah, Guy mentioned something about being

02:47:50   a little weirded out, like I was staring at him directly,

02:47:52   and like I was making eye contact with him.

02:47:54   - But I think it's because I know you.

02:47:56   - Yeah, maybe. - I don't know.

02:47:57   But your most recent one you did

02:47:59   without you being on camera, it was entirely visuals.

02:48:04   or not, well, everything's visual, but like a bunch of them.

02:48:06   - Right, yeah, it's like it's all sort of,

02:48:08   almost like slide wear.

02:48:10   - Yeah.

02:48:11   - And it was done in the style of,

02:48:11   and I gotta give credit to,

02:48:12   it was done in the style of CGP Grey's videos.

02:48:14   - Yeah.

02:48:15   - And that as an influence is written all over it.

02:48:17   If you've ever seen anything that CGP Grey's done,

02:48:20   it's pretty obviously in his style.

02:48:22   And it was partly an homage,

02:48:24   and it was partly me kind of playing around with it.

02:48:26   And I had realized that I had started to get into habits

02:48:29   with like the way I was handling jump cuts,

02:48:32   and the way I was doing anything on that show.

02:48:33   Like I felt like well, this is still really early and the whole point is to be experimenting. So let's try something new

02:48:38   Yeah, maybe it's gonna be terrible. Maybe it's gonna be unwatchable, but I'm just gonna try something new and if it works

02:48:42   It works if it doesn't and that was your episode called how to make a hit app

02:48:46   I found that one super easy to listen to or watch, you know, like it went down like butter

02:48:51   Whereas all the ones where you're on camera to me not because they're you're bad or awkward or unprofessional

02:48:57   But it's because they're dude. I know you there's something weird about that

02:49:00   Because I'm looking longingly into your eyes through your computer screen

02:49:04   I don't know. It's the way like whenever you see somebody, you know on a video doesn't it have like a weird effect on you

02:49:10   You know, like I you know, I've seen Letterman thousands of times over the years

02:49:14   But like if somebody I knew was on Letterman, it's weird like it's weird when I see Clayton Morris on TV. Yeah

02:49:21   Right. Yeah, I can see that. Well, maybe like now I'm just sort of thinking out loud

02:49:27   But those Johnny Ive videos that they they show whenever Apple releases a new product

02:49:31   That same video where he's talking about the aluminium and how the thing is contoured in the whatever

02:49:38   Imagine the whole time he's talking he's staring into the camera, right?

02:49:42   Probably be a little off-putting. So maybe there's maybe there is an element to there's an intimacy to eye contact that that

02:49:49   Not necessarily good or bad but there might be something to that

02:49:54   Yeah, maybe there's some kind of psychology but like, you know, the nightly news guys all look right at the camera

02:50:00   You know, the teleprompter is set up so that it looks like they're looking at the camera. Yeah, and I think it's it's maybe a

02:50:05   Instructional versus informative. I don't know maybe there's got to be I'm sure somebody's done studies on this

02:50:11   Yeah, I don't look this stuff up figure out the hell I'm doing

02:50:14   I don't know Jon Stewart does the for a whole first half of his show looking right at the camera. Yeah, it's true

02:50:18   Could be about the distance from the camera to like the length of focal length of the lines

02:50:22   I don't know but that's often the wheat where should people go where so you're not married to YouTube in particular though

02:50:27   You might be switching to Vimeo. It's video. Well, not not switching. I'm just trying to like YouTube

02:50:32   I know is a thing and for for searchability

02:50:34   YouTube is the second largest search engine and that's that's a real thing and I don't want to miss out on

02:50:40   the kids in their YouTube

02:50:42   but I also some people just hate YouTube and they hate Google and that's you know, at least an understandable position and

02:50:48   If that's the case now, I'm on Vimeo because I got that killer deal

02:50:52   So both like I'm just trying to I'm trying to make some stuff and see what works and whatever works

02:50:56   You know when it comes to words

02:50:57   It's like it's interesting to me and it's like you said with the kids in there YouTube

02:51:01   Like I hear the word youtuber and to me it sounds dismissive

02:51:04   like I would be hesitant to say that you're a youtuber now because I don't want to I don't I

02:51:10   It sounds to me like I'm insulting you like I'm calling like when people call

02:51:13   Deuce Heather Armstrong a mommy blogger. It's like she's not a mommy blogger. She's a writer. She's a really good one

02:51:20   And but it's you know, it somehow everything new I think sounds novel and diminutive

02:51:26   Like I'm sure the word like when they first started abbreviating television is TV it it's you know in the 40s or 50s

02:51:33   It sounded like dismissive. It's just TV. It's you know, it's crap

02:51:37   Whereas when you open that word right who was born in the era where TV is an just almost

02:51:43   Unimaginably dominant dominating cultural force. It just is what it is

02:51:48   You know, they could have called it anything and it would just seem awesome because TV is awesome

02:51:52   You know, I used to reject the word blog I really it's just not a good word to me

02:51:58   I stuck with calling them web blogs for as long as I could but now it's been long enough that it's you know

02:52:04   It no longer feels like anything and I feel like youtuber is that way and I've noticed with Jonas like, you know who watches

02:52:11   Obsessive amounts of YouTube he watches far more YouTube than he watches commercial television

02:52:17   And youtuber is just it's as no

02:52:21   Plus or minus meaning at all. It just means somebody whose shows you can watch on

02:52:26   YouTube, you know, that's it

02:52:29   There's this really cool

02:52:31   Democrat ization of content effect where this is sort of like this was our dream, right?

02:52:36   The the Internet's dream was that anybody could make stuff and just put it out there, right?

02:52:40   I'm playing music with some friends now and we're talking about like well in the 90s if

02:52:46   If you wanted to you know make a video that would be seen by anybody if you want to make a record you had to

02:52:50   Have a record deal and you had to have all this money and it cost a fortune

02:52:53   now like we could we could record a song and make the video for it and have like the song on iTunes and the video

02:52:59   On YouTube by the end of the day. Well, the big thing I remember from the 90s was

02:53:03   Pressing your own CDs and being you know, giving them out at you know

02:53:07   If you're a bit good enough to even be booked at a venue

02:53:10   Then you can give them out or sell them at the venue where if you were still below that you you know

02:53:14   like on college campuses and stuff, you'd, you know,

02:53:16   set up shop somewhere and just hand them out to people.

02:53:19   - Yeah, and now we live in this time

02:53:22   where you can just make stuff and put it on the internet

02:53:24   and it's there for anybody.

02:53:26   And that's really cool.

02:53:27   And it seems like the people,

02:53:28   like the most creative and the most talented

02:53:31   and the people with the access to the best equipment

02:53:33   and technology should maybe be the ones

02:53:36   making the best content,

02:53:38   but it doesn't necessarily seem to always be that way.

02:53:41   - Yeah, and the last thing that really hit me about that

02:53:42   and ties into your podcasting episode,

02:53:46   the podcast intervention episode is,

02:53:49   it ties into the, at first, if you're older

02:53:53   and you're used to what comes, the new stuff seems amateur,

02:53:57   like whether it's blogging for writing or YouTube videos,

02:54:01   five minute YouTube videos for video,

02:54:03   and it just seems like, well, this is the lesser,

02:54:05   this is the self, what do they call it

02:54:08   when you publish your own novel, self-published novel.

02:54:10   This is where the people who can't make it in the real world go and you know, pretend like they're doing it and then

02:54:18   You open your mind and realize that you know

02:54:21   The good stuff could be coming from anywhere and you realize that the new format is the one that has the most freedom

02:54:27   Where you don't have to do it in 30-minute increments because you're based on this TV model where everything has to be

02:54:33   30 60 90 minutes long to fit in a schedule and you can do something like say I have a six-minute essay

02:54:40   essay on making hit apps and it can be exactly six minutes long.

02:54:47   Which is exactly what I feel like if there's anything I've done you know successfully with

02:54:52   form with Daring Fireball it's right in a form where if I need a thousand words I can

02:54:58   use a thousand words.

02:54:59   If I need three thousand words I can use three thousand words and if I can make my point

02:55:03   with three words I use three words.

02:55:06   And you could never do that in the print world.

02:55:08   couldn't have, you know, Paul Krugman's column in the New York Times can't be seven words long.

02:55:13   It has to, you know, has to be 750 words or 350 or 750 I think is what they have.

02:55:18   Yeah, and I look at your stuff and Marco's stuff and Jason Snell's stuff and it seems especially

02:55:25   the three of you in particular. It strikes me that you guys have these voices that people listen to

02:55:30   and you've got these shows like literally voices that people listen to and like there's an authority

02:55:35   And a legitimacy to that and it would be cool to see that kind of weight put behind

02:55:41   Yeah, those podcasts and videos. Yeah, and so I think maybe the the

02:55:46   Even the word intervention and like maybe it came off a little bit more

02:55:50   I don't know like I was condemning something that I meant for it, too

02:55:54   but like my whole point my the whole spirit of all of this is like I just want to try new stuff and I want

02:55:59   other people to try new stuff because I think that

02:56:01   there's a lot of really smart really talented people with a lot of

02:56:04   Pretty advanced technology in their pockets. All right, where's the best place then?

02:56:09   Where's the one place people can go if they want to see a couple episodes of better elevation?

02:56:13   YouTube comm slash better elevation or vimeo comm slash better elevation or or just Google for better elevation

02:56:21   Yeah, I think that I think that works elven gel at genitalia turtles screwing slash better elevation slash better elevation

02:56:30   So, uh, hey, let's talk about computers