The Talk Show

55: Black to the Mac


00:00:00   You should have tried to get you should have gotten Martha Stewart on this week. Well, what's going on with that?

00:00:04   I've been so busy this week. I saw Martha Stewart was in the news and I have no idea why

00:00:08   So - well, she did two things this week

00:00:10   Well, I guess her company did one of them, but she got sued by loads loads us

00:00:17   Oh, you know she loads us. So she got sued by loads us for like five thousand bucks

00:00:22   Over like the in-app purchase thing. She's she's got some I

00:00:27   I don't even know what they are, but she's got some apps.

00:00:30   Some app that uses in-app purchase.

00:00:32   Yes, some app that uses in-app purchases.

00:00:34   So they sued her, and she's like, "Oh, no.

00:00:37   For those of you –"

00:00:38   No, not to Martha.

00:00:39   Martha Stewart, you don't.

00:00:40   Really?

00:00:41   So she's suing them.

00:00:42   She's trying to get their claim invalidated.

00:00:45   Awesome.

00:00:46   Yeah, which would be great, because I think that would have – I assume that would have

00:00:50   implications for everybody else.

00:00:52   Yeah, totally.

00:00:53   For all those of you guys who don't remember, LODESYS, L-O-D-S-Y-S, I think it stands for

00:00:58   – it's like a Latin word that means a bunch of assholes – is a true patent troll.

00:01:06   Like it's their quote, unquote –

00:01:08   They make nothing.

00:01:09   They make nothing.

00:01:10   Their office is like a broom closet in Texas.

00:01:17   Patent troll gets overused.

00:01:19   patent troll is used by like and there's all sorts of totally legitimate complaints about

00:01:23   the US patent system and worldwide patents and software patents in particular and people

00:01:31   throw around the term patent troll to mean companies that are doing objectionable things

00:01:36   with patents.

00:01:37   But patent troll is really a company that is like the epitome of the problems with the

00:01:42   patent system which is a company that actually has no product, doesn't do anything, has a

00:01:47   patent but has no product that actually does the thing that the patent covers

00:01:51   that just exists to sue people and and extort licenses and that's what loads us

00:01:56   is and that they've gone after which is the further objectionable part they've

00:02:02   gone after a lot of little guys like you know like when you sue Apple over a

00:02:07   patent or you sue Microsoft well you know they're ready for it and they sue

00:02:11   other people they've got you know big team of full-time patent lawyers and I'm

00:02:15   I'm sure it's a pain in the ass to them every time it happens, but it's nowhere near as

00:02:18   big a deal as when you sue, say, like our friends at the icon factory or James Thompson,

00:02:25   the guy behind Drag Thing. His TLA Systems is literally a two-person company. It's him

00:02:31   and his wife, and then they've got a big patent fight on their hands. So, hooray for you,

00:02:38   Martha Stewart.

00:02:39   And then she drops her iPad.

00:02:43   Oh no.

00:02:44   Cracks the corner, cracks the glass in the corner I guess.

00:02:47   I don't think it's all the way across but I didn't get it too far into this rabbit hole.

00:02:52   But she tweeted something about, "So do I just wait until someone from Apple comes and picks it up?"

00:03:00   [Laughter]

00:03:04   And then she was kind of getting upset about it on Twitter and then apparently I guess

00:03:13   she got called by or somehow she got feedback from Apple PR saying, "Hey, you know, lighten

00:03:18   up."

00:03:21   And so she said something about that on Twitter too.

00:03:26   But her complaint or part of her complaint was that she said, "You guys should fix this.

00:03:32   Steve Jobs gave me this iPad.

00:03:37   You know what?

00:03:38   I don't know.

00:03:39   I'm not exactly sure how to react to this.

00:03:42   I mean, if Steve gives you an iPad...

00:03:46   You do want it fixed.

00:03:47   Should the company take care of that iPad in perpetuity?

00:03:52   I don't know.

00:03:53   That's funny.

00:03:54   That seems like kind of a...

00:03:55   It also means she must be using a pretty old iPad.

00:03:57   Right.

00:03:58   I mean because what's the last one he could have given her it would have been like a

00:04:02   like a two maybe

00:04:05   Yeah, I think I had to yeah, and not even a retina screen gross

00:04:10   And then on the other hand yeah, I think Martha Stewart could probably afford to buy herself a new iPad yeah, you would think so

00:04:19   It's pretty awesome though because she could obviously afford to pay loads his five thousand dollars

00:04:25   And it's really cool that instead of doing that she's gonna spend a lot more than that to fight right right? That's pretty awesome

00:04:31   Yeah, so yeah, maybe her frugality is because that's exactly that

00:04:35   That's that it's extortion the patent troll game is genuine extortion where they just they they set a price that is you know

00:04:43   Way less than it would cost to fight and so it just yeah

00:04:47   You know it can be a very practical and I don't blame anybody who settles

00:04:52   You know who knows I might too. I don't know depending on what they did. You know that it's you know it can be

00:04:58   Incredibly expensive to fight. That's what makes it extortion

00:05:02   I'd love to see you know probably don't want to know the list of people that they've

00:05:10   Yeah, extorted to date. Yeah, and it's so funny because it was like it's just like when I've seen some of the list

00:05:17   it's just it just

00:05:19   Ying Yang's between like multi-billion dollar conglomerates and like yeah one person mom-and-pop

00:05:26   part-time software jobs

00:05:28   Because I remember the one time when TLA systems was announced as one of their targets which is James Thompson's

00:05:34   You know little two-person software company was like the next company listed was the Walt Disney Company

00:05:49   Well, hopefully she sticks it to him.

00:05:52   Yeah, that'd be great.

00:05:54   Yeah.

00:05:55   Oh, man.

00:05:56   So anyway, you couldn't get her, so you got me.

00:05:57   Yeah, couldn't get her.

00:05:58   Boy, I've always been a big fan of Martha Stewart.

00:06:01   Yeah, I think I have too.

00:06:03   I used to watch – Amy and I used to watch her show.

00:06:06   We didn't really make time for it.

00:06:08   It would be like a flipping through the channels, and when the Martha Stewart show was on, we'd

00:06:12   watch.

00:06:13   And it was like – and it sounds so dreadfully boring, and it kind of is, except that it's

00:06:18   It's so boring that it wraps around and is fascinating.

00:06:23   She is such an interesting person.

00:06:24   She's so clearly an obsessive compulsive nerd.

00:06:28   She's in her own way a design nerd.

00:06:33   It's like there are so many ways on her show where she just does not try to hide it.

00:06:40   I don't think that her and Steve Jobs were pals, but I think that in a way that he was

00:06:44   sort of a nut.

00:06:45   she's a nut in the same ways and it was just fascinating yeah actually and

00:06:50   thinking about it I mean she went to jail because I mean I'm assuming she

00:06:55   probably had multiple chances to settle that you know I don't remember about

00:07:00   that if she could sell no I mean she really got screwed though she really did

00:07:04   she did get I think she got screwed too but and so maybe they were trying to

00:07:07   make it yeah I think that I don't know that she had a chance to settle I really

00:07:10   don't yeah maybe that's maybe that's true but you think that I don't know if

00:07:15   You think from the SEC's point of view, you don't look good sending Martha to jail.

00:07:23   Yeah, you would, but I don't know.

00:07:25   SEC doesn't really seem to show much interest in sending the people who should go to jail

00:07:29   to jail.

00:07:30   Exactly.

00:07:31   There's sort of inmates running the asylum aspect to the SEC.

00:07:37   Maybe that's it.

00:07:38   It's like she's not one of them, really.

00:07:42   She's an entertainer.

00:07:43   Right.

00:07:44   One of my favorite things about the mostly old Martha Stewart show, Amy, my wife has

00:07:49   a terrific margarita recipe, but it's really just, it's just a slightly tweaked version

00:07:56   of, and she, and Amy admits it, we got from Martha Stewart.

00:08:00   And then, Chick, you would think, really, you're going to get a margarita recipe from

00:08:03   Martha Stewart?

00:08:04   But it's fantastic.

00:08:05   Number one, it is, I think, literally three quarters tequila.

00:08:09   It's like three parts tequila to like a quarter part fresh lime and orange juice.

00:08:17   Well, and there's orange in it too.

00:08:19   And it really-- and that's mostly lime, but a little bit of, I think, orange juice.

00:08:24   I think.

00:08:25   I forget.

00:08:26   But it's all fresh squeezed and three quarters tequila.

00:08:28   And it was like, who knew?

00:08:32   But that actually is sort of the key to a good margarita.

00:08:37   Served in hand-blown glass.

00:08:38   - Yeah, of course.

00:08:40   - On a doily that you made yourself.

00:08:43   - Right, and then when I made it,

00:08:45   I was serving it out of paper cups.

00:08:47   (laughing)

00:08:50   So here's a good one.

00:08:53   I loved, it's where, I love this stuff.

00:08:56   I love these, the analysts.

00:08:58   You see the thing with the, you know,

00:09:01   Philip Elmer DeWitt has always seemed,

00:09:04   he does a good job of sort of--

00:09:07   - Collecting that stuff.

00:09:07   Yeah, like analyst specific claim chowder and just sort of holding them to their predictions.

00:09:15   And the thing with the iPhone 5s and C is how many were they going to sell on the opening

00:09:20   weekend?

00:09:21   And for years, Apple has, I think every year, every time the iPhones come out, after the

00:09:26   opening weekend, they've announced how many they sold.

00:09:30   And the Wall Street consensus was like five to six million.

00:09:34   And there were a couple like, what's his name, the TV guy.

00:09:38   Monster, Gene Monster was calling for five or six million.

00:09:42   Then Apple announces the number and it's nine million and instead of, "Wow, we were wrong.

00:09:47   They sold a lot more."

00:09:48   It was, "Oh, well, they didn't really sell nine million.

00:09:53   They really sold five or six million," which is what we said.

00:09:56   And there's like a bunch of them in a closet somewhere or on a store shelves or something

00:10:04   like that.

00:10:05   Tim Cynova Or I think what the Wall Street Journal did

00:10:09   was said, "Yeah, they sold that many but you have to back out all these other ones."

00:10:14   First of all, you have to take out China.

00:10:15   Dave Asprey Yeah, China doesn't count.

00:10:16   Tim Cynova China doesn't count because they just went

00:10:18   into China.

00:10:19   Dave Asprey Yeah, so that doesn't count.

00:10:20   Tim Cynova That doesn't count.

00:10:22   The fact that they're selling two new phones, so you got to take out the C because that

00:10:26   count that doesn't count so when you take out all these other things then the

00:10:30   sales are not that impressive even though the numbers that they were

00:10:34   calling for before they announced them they didn't say oh we're not counting

00:10:37   the 5c we're only counting the 5s they just they that's what makes it so

00:10:43   comical to me like you know I hate to be wrong I really do I've said before like

00:10:47   if there's you know it is the whole point of daring fireball is to write

00:10:53   about great products and to try never to be wrong.

00:10:58   But I fail, I do.

00:10:59   I mean, it's human, so I'm wrong sometimes.

00:11:01   And you know what I do when I'm wrong?

00:11:02   I say, "Okay, I was wrong, here's why."

00:11:05   And you know what, it's great.

00:11:06   It's like such a relief.

00:11:08   Just say it, just try it sometime.

00:11:11   - Yeah.

00:11:11   - I was wrong.

00:11:12   So comical.

00:11:15   It is a good question, though.

00:11:19   Like, there is, and again, I think that these guys

00:11:22   clearly were wrong because they were calling out total iPhone sold for the weekend in their

00:11:26   predictions but I do think it is an interesting question as to what the split is between the

00:11:33   5s and the 5c and how does that compare to previous years like last year just one year

00:11:40   ago when the iPhone 5 went on sale did they sell a lot of the then year old 4s because

00:11:48   the discount applied to the 4S over the same weekend? I tend to think no. I tend to think

00:11:55   that the, you know, especially when they were just year old and two year old models at the lower price

00:12:00   points, that those just sold to people as they on a regular schedule, you know, like when they decided

00:12:08   to buy a new phone, they go in the store and get it. Whereas the people who actually know, hey, the

00:12:13   The new iPhone goes on sale today at 9 o'clock.

00:12:17   They're all interested in the top of the line one.

00:12:21   People don't go wait in line to buy it.

00:12:22   You know.

00:12:23   But this is the first time you could actually have some kind of indication about how well

00:12:30   that second tier sold.

00:12:32   Well, how good is that?

00:12:35   Well, they're included in the numbers now.

00:12:38   They're included in the new numbers.

00:12:39   I'm assuming.

00:12:40   Well, oh, well.

00:12:41   I mean, I wonder, does Apple include-- I guess they probably do.

00:12:47   They probably include the 4S too, don't they?

00:12:48   Well, I don't know about that.

00:12:50   Yeah, I don't know.

00:12:52   But anyway, even if they're throwing the 4S in there as well, couldn't you tell-- this

00:13:03   one from Locallytics tried to do a web analysis to see what the percentage of 5Cs on the web

00:13:11   on the web was versus 5Ss.

00:13:13   And I think they came up with something like--

00:13:19   I'll have to go back and look.

00:13:20   It was like a 4 to 1?

00:13:21   Yeah, yeah, yeah, something like that.

00:13:23   I don't know how they did that, though, because--

00:13:25   well, maybe I'm wrong.

00:13:26   I actually don't even know what those in-app analytics packages

00:13:30   can see.

00:13:31   Yeah, I don't know that either, but I'm assuming that they

00:13:33   figured it out somehow.

00:13:34   Yeah, you could run some tests on the CPU speed or something

00:13:39   and know that you're running on an A7 instead of an A6.

00:13:43   But I don't know--

00:13:44   - But it's not gonna tell you the exact model.

00:13:45   - Right, I don't know how you would be able

00:13:46   to tell a 5C apart from a plain old 5,

00:13:50   which is really what it looks like internally.

00:13:52   I don't know, maybe there's some way.

00:13:54   The other thing, I didn't link to their thing

00:13:56   because I don't trust those in-app analytics stats

00:14:01   all that much because--

00:14:03   - No, I don't either.

00:14:05   - 'Cause I question the sort of apps that include them.

00:14:09   Like, I feel like a lot of the apps I use don't use sketchy ad-based analytics, because

00:14:15   I don't use apps that have ads.

00:14:17   Well, you guys use that, right?

00:14:19   Oh, Vesper?

00:14:20   And Vesper.

00:14:21   Oh, yeah, yeah.

00:14:22   It's loaded up with everything.

00:14:28   We just have all those.

00:14:29   It's really only about 100.

00:14:30   No, it's a good call.

00:14:31   Otherwise, you don't get good data.

00:14:35   Right.

00:14:36   Yeah, we tracked your location.

00:14:45   All not true.

00:14:47   We should be very clear about that.

00:14:52   But I just don't know.

00:14:56   That was funny too though because all those people jumped on the fact that after the 5C

00:15:00   went on pre-order the week before that Apple didn't announce anything about those numbers.

00:15:06   But like I wrote when that became like a little mini scandal and everybody jumped – or

00:15:11   not everybody, but the pessimists jumped to the conclusion that they must be bad because

00:15:15   otherwise they'd promote them, that there's no way they were going to break out the 5S

00:15:19   from 5C because they don't want competitors to know that.

00:15:22   The other thing that Philip Omer DeWitt points out is that all these analysts are going nuts

00:15:27   about this and none of the other smartphone companies ever just – they don't even

00:15:31   say how many phones they've sold, period.

00:15:33   Amazon doesn't say how many phones they've sold.

00:15:37   Every once in a while, they do, right?

00:15:40   It's like out of context or you can't really pin it down.

00:15:43   It's not the same.

00:15:44   It's not the same.

00:15:45   There's a whole question about them doing shipments as opposed to sales.

00:15:52   They don't know exactly when this phone gets sold anyway.

00:15:57   But when Apple sells a phone from its store, it's sold.

00:16:03   Right.

00:16:04   And one of the other things, too, is that clearly the stores, just like with Dow Rumple

00:16:12   last week on the show, if you wanted to get one on Friday, you should have gone to an

00:16:16   Apple store, not the carrier stores, because that's where the stores that are getting the

00:16:20   most of them.

00:16:21   And Apple doesn't count those as sold until customers have sold them.

00:16:27   They do count.

00:16:28   Like when they ship a box of brand new iPhones to a Verizon wireless retail store, those

00:16:34   count as sold because Verizon takes the phones and gives Apple money and they count as sold.

00:16:39   And so if they are sitting unsold in the Verizon store, they haven't been sold to customers

00:16:44   yet.

00:16:45   But the ones that go to the Apple stores, they don't count until you have it.

00:16:49   And that's also true for the as yet unshipped online orders.

00:16:57   And so I don't even know.

00:16:58   I think the last I checked, every single one of the 5S's,

00:17:02   every color, when you go to order it online now,

00:17:05   it doesn't give you a date.

00:17:06   It just says October.

00:17:08   Oh, is that right?

00:17:10   Because I think that they're--

00:17:11   I don't know.

00:17:12   I feel like they can't even--

00:17:14   they just don't want to estimate.

00:17:16   But that means however many people--

00:17:18   I'm sure it's probably millions--

00:17:20   right now have ordered online a new 5S,

00:17:24   and it isn't yet in their hands.

00:17:26   It's coming in October, but those won't count as sold by Apple until you actually

00:17:33   have it in your hand.

00:17:34   Tim Cynova Yeah.

00:17:35   I actually went to the carrier store because I was switching from AT&T to Verizon and I

00:17:41   didn't know how well Apple would be able to deal with that.

00:17:45   But also because I walked right up.

00:17:49   That was the other thing.

00:17:50   And I wasn't getting – I got a 16 gig black, you know, space gray.

00:17:55   So I knew I was getting a phone that they were most likely to have.

00:17:58   If I was trying to get white or gold, I certainly wouldn't have gone there, but I figured,

00:18:04   oh, 16 gig space gray, they're going to have that.

00:18:10   And sure enough, I went and I got my phone and I walked by the Apple store after that

00:18:14   and there was still a line.

00:18:17   It wasn't huge, but there was still a line like 30 people long outside the phone.

00:18:21   You're saying me and Dalrymple gave you bad advice.

00:18:24   I didn't listen to you guys until after I already had my phone anyways.

00:18:27   I agree with that.

00:18:29   I mean, if you're listening as you walk home with your iPhone in your hand as you went by the line.

00:18:35   I just think it depends. It depends on what you're looking for and what you're trying to accomplish.

00:18:43   I was at the XOXO in Portland last weekend.

00:18:50   Now, I already, I was, you know, the jerk who already had a 5S because I had the review

00:18:57   unit from Apple and I had the gold one, you know, so I could actually prove that I had

00:19:02   the new one.

00:19:03   So, all I did was, but I did, I bought my own personal one, Space Gray, but I ordered

00:19:08   online because there was no way I was getting up and getting in the line.

00:19:17   ordered right at like midnight 01 like when my phone said 12 00 put down my

00:19:24   drink open up the Apple Store app which I think is the best way to do it I opened

00:19:28   up the app and it said you want to I want to replace this phone the phone I'm

00:19:32   using with a new one here's the one I want and click like two more buttons and

00:19:37   then it said okay your order is placed it'll be there in one to three days

00:19:41   wait you're saying it knew which phone you had yes the Apple when you and I did

00:19:47   this I think before too but when you order a new iPhone using the Apple store

00:19:53   app on your iPhone it'll offer you know do you want a new phone or do you want

00:19:58   to replace this very phone and you know gave me my phone number and I said yes I

00:20:02   want to replace this phone and then the phones that came because Amy got one too

00:20:07   it's really it's really slick the phone comes it you know and it came Wednesday

00:20:12   so that was three days three business days you open it up and it's already

00:20:19   says like this phone is going to replace you know no really yeah swipe here and

00:20:24   it'll become you know your you know your phone number will move over and you do

00:20:28   that and it I guess it what do they call that process activates and then as soon

00:20:33   as it does your old phone is no longer has a service and your new phone has

00:20:37   your phone number huh it's really pretty slick I wonder if they'll one day do

00:20:42   like a tap to tap to replace like with the like with the Apple TV yeah bump the

00:20:51   fan to tap to set it up yeah I guess you can do that when you order online in the

00:20:55   website too but you just have to enter you have to enter like your Verizon

00:20:59   account info and then it lists your phone numbers it's just so much easier

00:21:02   especially like if you really kind of want to get it fast and you want to kind

00:21:07   of order within a minute or two you know it's almost like getting WWDC tickets

00:21:11   You know

00:21:13   It's so much. You just saved so many steps when you say replace this phone

00:21:16   Right somebody else was with us

00:21:19   where we were Amy and I were ordering them and

00:21:22   I

00:21:26   Forget what happened, but she you know it took her an extra couple of minutes

00:21:31   And in that in the interim like the shipping time and she got like the same phone that Amy did the gold one

00:21:36   And it was like days later like estimated arrival

00:21:40   So, I mean, they did go fast.

00:21:44   So, if you use the app and your last name is Gruber.

00:21:51   I don't think that had anything to do with it.

00:21:52   You get it super fast.

00:21:54   I don't think that had anything to do with it.

00:21:57   Right to the front of the line.

00:21:59   Phil Schiller shows up with it.

00:22:02   He helps set you up.

00:22:06   - Make sure your iCloud is backed up.

00:22:08   So you did the switch, how'd that work?

00:22:14   How'd that go for you?

00:22:15   - Pretty well.

00:22:17   I'm afraid to see my AT&T bill 'cause I'm breaking.

00:22:23   - Oh, I got that bill last year.

00:22:24   - I'm breaking contract, but my wife was on,

00:22:28   we were both on AT&T.

00:22:29   I was on AT&T for like, oh my God, 15 years?

00:22:32   - Yeah, that's what I was like too.

00:22:33   - Something like that.

00:22:34   And we've never gotten very good reception in the house here.

00:22:38   And she's running her business off of her phone.

00:22:40   So she's like-- we tried to micro-sell,

00:22:46   and it kept dropping us off the micro-cell.

00:22:48   And finally, we were just like, you know what?

00:22:50   This is dumb.

00:22:51   I mean, she was getting calls from clients who were getting--

00:22:54   they were going to voicemail.

00:22:57   So she jumped a few months ago, so we

00:23:03   could keep the same network.

00:23:06   It went pretty well for me, as I recall.

00:23:08   It was sort of a hassle, and it was certainly a lot harder

00:23:10   than just upgrading the place.

00:23:11   Yeah.

00:23:11   I mean, I said to stand at the counter for a while

00:23:13   and give them, like, 10,000 pieces of information.

00:23:17   But--

00:23:18   Right.

00:23:19   But it worked.

00:23:20   Do you think ordering in a store was the way to go?

00:23:24   Well, I just thought, since I was switching networks,

00:23:26   that it would be.

00:23:27   Because I don't--

00:23:29   I just don't imagine that they're

00:23:32   that equipped to handle that at the Apple store, but I've never tried it.

00:23:35   I don't know if AT&T has something like this now too, but I know with Verizon we have a

00:23:39   pretty nice shared data plan where you just pick how many gigabytes you want for as many

00:23:46   phones as you have.

00:23:47   And I even have my iPad on it.

00:23:50   And so instead of paying separately for the iPad, it's just one collective pool of data.

00:23:56   they're they give you good warnings in advance and as long as you up move it up like if you're

00:24:05   going to go over if you have six gigabytes collectively and you get close you can go up to

00:24:09   eight and you don't pay any penalty for that you just pay the prorated thing and then next month

00:24:15   you can take it back down to six or whatever you were at so like like over the summer like i

00:24:19   I watched a lot of baseball games on the iPad,

00:24:24   and I did have to move the data up,

00:24:27   but it didn't, you know, it was nice.

00:24:29   - Well, you won't have that problem shortly.

00:24:33   - Why is that?

00:24:34   Oh, watching baseball games.

00:24:36   Boy, that's something.

00:24:39   We should go get back to that after,

00:24:40   I should do a sponsor break,

00:24:42   'cause I'm gonna get weepy.

00:24:44   - Yeah, I was gonna ask you.

00:24:48   Get the sponsor break out before you start sobbing like a little kitty.

00:24:53   Dave Asprey Let me tell you, our first sponsor is Transporter,

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00:25:02   Sometimes they call it File Transporter.

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00:25:18   Ah, is that right?

00:25:19   Yeah.

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00:25:22   And I can't help but think, in hindsight,

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00:26:42   with Dropbox or something like that you could share a file with

00:26:45   them or give them access to a shared folder. And why do I say

00:26:50   that 2013 is it's a great year to launch something like this?

00:26:54   Well, you know, all the crazy NSA snooping and US government

00:26:58   surveillance of cloud type services. You know, that's a big

00:27:04   deal for people. I mean, the whole point of it in the outset

00:27:06   was to keep your data, your private data private, and have

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00:27:23   works great. Their 2.0 software, which just came out like last month, it was already good

00:27:29   right away, the 1.0. But the 2.0 added a whole bunch of features that everybody was asking

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00:28:01   on whatever model you buy. So go to file transporter.com slash talk and find out more.

00:28:06   DrMR: It's high on my wish list.

00:28:10   Tom Bilyeu (01h00m 5s): It's pretty slick.

00:28:12   DrMR - Yeah.

00:28:13   Tom Bilyeu (01h00m 9s):

00:28:17   You have a lovely beverage?

00:28:18   DrMR - I do. I think mine goes the opposite way on the stimulant and depressant

00:28:23   chart than yours, but yes I do.

00:28:26   Tom Bilyeu (01h00m 19s): Well, it's five o'clock somewhere.

00:28:28   DrMR - Mm-hmm.

00:28:29   Alright, baseball. Oh my god.

00:28:32   So I just watched that video.

00:28:36   So as we record, it's Friday the 27th of September.

00:28:41   And last night at Yankee Stadium was the last game that Mariano Rivera is going to play at Yankee Stadium.

00:28:49   And, you know, Yankee season has really just gone to shit in the last three weeks.

00:28:55   I mean they were in it against all odds with the crazy amount of injuries they've had this year

00:28:59   But they were really in the hunt and when they really just needed they didn't even need to play that great

00:29:04   But they've really shit the bed and so they're out of the playoffs. They're not I mean I

00:29:09   think that the

00:29:11   The last time there was a baseball game at Yankee Stadium where the Yankees weren't in

00:29:17   playoff contention at least was

00:29:19   1993 I mean that's a hell of a run

00:29:23   So they're out of it and so really the only thing at stake is that two of the great Yankees are

00:29:28   retiring this year Mariano Rivera and Andy Pettit and

00:29:31   You know Mariano is the bigger deal, and I don't know didn't Pettit retire already once yeah, he retired in

00:29:38   Yeah

00:29:40   2010 yeah after they won the World Series in 2009 and then he was gone for a year and then and then missed it and

00:29:46   Came back

00:29:48   And it's been great. I mean the most from one of the most remarkable things about the Yankees this year

00:29:52   They've had a lot of pitching problems, but Andy Pettitte, who's 41, has been, especially

00:29:58   in the second half of the season, by far their most reliable pitcher. And Mariano Rivera is 43.

00:30:04   I think he's — because Jamie Moyer is gone. He's like literally the oldest guy in Major League

00:30:09   Baseball and had another fantastic all-star caliber season. I mean, he was amazing. I mean,

00:30:17   there's absolutely not like he couldn't play again. I mean, he's walking away at 43, still

00:30:24   literally at the top of his game. But it was amazing because everybody wanted to see him. And so,

00:30:29   even though the Yankees are out of the playoffs, which usually means that Yankee Stadium just

00:30:33   empties right out. I mean, Yankee fans are only there for one thing and one thing only, and that's

00:30:38   see some championships. It was a sellout, total sellout. Really wish that I could have been there.

00:30:45   And it was just like a big, like an Irish funeral at the end.

00:30:50   Everybody was just slobbering, crying.

00:30:52   [LAUGHTER]

00:30:54   Really kind of amazing.

00:30:55   And they did.

00:30:56   They handled it.

00:30:57   I thought they handled it amazingly.

00:30:59   Yeah.

00:31:00   No, it was very nice.

00:31:01   I mean, even someone who does not particularly--

00:31:03   who is not particularly a Yankee fan.

00:31:06   It's a nice moment in baseball.

00:31:08   Any time a guy--

00:31:09   it's like, we'll never get that in our careers

00:31:12   where we get to walk out--

00:31:13   No.

00:31:13   [LAUGHTER]

00:31:14   and wave

00:31:17   well and all crowd of people to say goodbye so few athletes even do because

00:31:21   you know usually they play until their past

00:31:24   you know

00:31:25   past their expiration date

00:31:27   and they you know they make the decision in the off season you know and they

00:31:30   don't get that

00:31:32   what they did

00:31:33   and and for those of you who aren't baseball fans i apologize but the way that it goes if

00:31:36   you're a pitcher and they're going to make a pitching change and take you out

00:31:40   and put another pitcher in the manager of the team comes out to the mound

00:31:44   takes the ball from your hand.

00:31:45   It's like a symbolic gesture.

00:31:47   I don't think the rules actually stipulate

00:31:48   you have to take the ball from your hand,

00:31:50   but that's just what it's done.

00:31:51   It's, you know, manager or at any other league, you know,

00:31:55   level, the coach comes out, takes the ball from your hand,

00:31:58   you leave the mound, and then they call in

00:32:00   the guy who's gonna replace you.

00:32:01   And Mariano Rivera, as the closer,

00:32:06   he's always the last pitcher.

00:32:08   He comes in and nobody takes the ball from him.

00:32:13   And so when he got to two outs in the ninth, the Yankees manager Joe Girardi, instead of

00:32:20   coming out, he sent two players out.

00:32:22   He sent Derek Jeter and Andy Pettit out.

00:32:25   And Jeter and Pettit took the ball from Moe.

00:32:28   And they all did.

00:32:29   Three of them just broke down crying.

00:32:31   Actually, Jeter was laughing, but that's Jeter.

00:32:37   And I've never seen anything like that before.

00:32:39   There's nobody else who you could, you know, I don't even know who could have done that

00:32:42   before but it was really just kind of amazing part of what was amazing too is

00:32:48   the catcher is a guy named JR Murphy I think he's like 22 years old so he's a

00:32:53   young kid they're only really playing them because he's sort of like a test to

00:32:56   see you know let's see what the kids got but at 22 years old that means when he

00:33:00   was born the day he was born Mariano Rivera was already in the Yankee minor

00:33:05   leagues. Which is crazy. Like this kid, like Mariano Rivera was in the Yankee minor leagues

00:33:13   playing professional baseball for the Yankee organization on the day the kid was born.

00:33:17   And then he's the guy who got to catch, you know, Mariano Rivera's last appearance. And

00:33:22   on his face, if you watch that video, Murphy's face, he looks like what you think you would

00:33:28   look like. Like, he just looks like, "Oh my god, I can't believe that I'm here."

00:33:35   I was crying. I don't think I've cried in years. I couldn't remember. I was thinking

00:33:40   about it. I don't remember the last time I've shed a tear. I was watching it. Tears

00:33:44   coming down my face.

00:33:48   Tears of laughter?

00:33:49   No, tears. It was terrible. I mean, you're never going to see Moe again. Well, he's

00:33:54   And you know what? And there's a certain... I mean, Mo at Yankee Stadium...

00:33:58   The thing that, to me, is a little ignominious is now the Yankees have three totally meaningless games

00:34:03   against the Houston Astros.

00:34:07   Which is just... it just doesn't seem right. It just seems like...

00:34:12   that they... I don't know. It just doesn't seem right.

00:34:16   But, I don't know, because they are meaningless and they don't have playoff implications.

00:34:20   rumor is that Moe wants to play centerfield so there might he might play

00:34:24   an inning or two in centerfield down in Astros that would be something to see

00:34:29   really yeah totally right he's well you know how he you remember when he hurt

00:34:34   his knee last year he ripped it ligament his knee for years his whole career he

00:34:38   likes to shag flies he's and that's like how he gets his workout in how he stays

00:34:42   in shape is before every game he's out with the outfielders and it always has

00:34:47   been his whole career catching long you know running down fly balls and catching

00:34:52   him and the word has always been that when he was like in the minor leagues

00:34:57   that a lot of the Yankees scouts thought he was one of the best outfield I don't

00:35:02   know if he was ever a good hitter I don't know if he could hit but

00:35:04   defensively you know and athletically he was always considered you know maybe one

00:35:08   of the best in the whole system and he's always said like and nobody could tell

00:35:13   if he's joking or not that but before he retires he'd like to play a little

00:35:16   center field for the Yankees. And so, you know, they asked Joe Girardi and he said, "Maybe."

00:35:22   So that was—

00:35:27   Well, why not?

00:35:27   Houston Astros.

00:35:29   At this point.

00:35:29   Kind of crazy.

00:35:31   You know, the season's basically over.

00:35:33   Right. And you couldn't do that. Like, see, they were playing the Tampa Bay Rays last night. And

00:35:37   the Tampa Bay Rays are in the wild card chase. So, like, every game they play means something.

00:35:41   So even if you, the Yankees—

00:35:43   Right, you're playing Houston, Houston's time.

00:35:45   Right. There was also a kid who came in, who's the guy who replaces Moe, and he was just

00:35:55   some no-name kid. I mean, I watch a lot of Yankees games. A kid named Daley, I think,

00:36:00   came in and threw three pitches and struck the next guy out. And it was like, man, I

00:36:06   don't think... Because it was 4-0 Tampa. I don't think that the guy purposefully struck

00:36:11   out. I think the pro baseball players, everybody was there for Mo, but you try to win. But

00:36:18   talk about nobody really wanting to see him pitch. It's like he did the right thing.

00:36:23   Threw three pitches and got the hell off. It was kind of nice.

00:36:31   What's the deal with the Mariners? Are they in the wild card?

00:36:33   Oh God.

00:36:34   [laughter]

00:36:35   Is anybody listening still?

00:36:38   Hey, we talked about Martha Stewart for a while.

00:36:41   Yeah.

00:36:42   I wonder if Martha Stewart likes baseball.

00:36:43   I wonder if people who aren't baseball fans.

00:36:45   I wonder if Martha Stewart likes baseball.

00:36:47   Probably not.

00:36:48   Probably.

00:36:49   I would imagine not.

00:36:52   Yeah.

00:36:53   But, you never know.

00:36:55   She likes tequila.

00:36:56   That's right.

00:36:57   We wouldn't have expected that.

00:37:00   Yeah.

00:37:01   A lot of tequila, apparently.

00:37:02   Yeah. Let me tell you about it. Did she make that recipe up after she got out of jail?

00:37:08   No, no. This was a long time ago. This was like maybe the late 90s or like around 2000 or something.

00:37:14   She got real anchored for bathtub gin after she got out of prison.

00:37:20   Right. I think after prison, maybe she had like recipes for how to make your own tequila. How to

00:37:29   make your own tequila out of things you can get in a prison cafeteria.

00:37:34   Dan: A potato. Dirty rag.

00:37:41   Dave What do they make prison liquor out of? Do they make it out of potatoes? I guess anything

00:37:48   that would ferment, right?

00:37:49   Dan I should ask my wife. I'm sure she knows.

00:37:51   Dave Yeah, she probably does.

00:37:53   Dan My wife is a private investigator. That's

00:37:55   said not that my wife is she has actually been to prison many times but

00:38:00   just like a monopoly that just the just visiting area yeah they said that should

00:38:06   be like the new hipster thing you know how I get a lot of the people are making

00:38:10   their own beer oh yeah yeah and you make your own like prison that's great is it

00:38:18   gin I don't know gin seems like that'd be hard to make it's probably no it's

00:38:22   not really Jim just some kind of Jim would probably be putting on errors for

00:38:26   what that is just some kind of unclassifiable yeah rot gut I've got

00:38:33   moonshine moonshine is probably a even classier to probably too classy but

00:38:39   probably because it seems like moonshine it whenever you know my experience

00:38:43   watching it be made is watching the Dukes of Hazzard frankly but it just

00:38:47   seemed to me like it requires a pretty significant apparatus you know there's

00:38:52   these you know this crazy thing with the tubes and tinctures and glass bubbly

00:38:59   things you know like a science lab type thing right prison you need you just

00:39:03   need something you can hide in it's gotta be something you can they only

00:39:08   got they got like a little tiny sink in there and they have a toilet I don't

00:39:17   think I'm not sure that's gonna catch on we laugh but if you and I got sent to

00:39:21   prison together you know we'd set to work on oh my god oh yeah that would be

00:39:24   the first thing I did I think we I might take it as an opportunity that maybe dry

00:39:29   out I think for about a day and I think we I think we would I don't think we'd

00:39:36   have to say anything to each other and we could just look at each other and

00:39:39   and we'd be like you know yeah all right now on nobody goes in the toilet in the cell

00:39:47   we go in the yard right

00:39:52   pack it out speaking of prison liquor let me tell you about our second sponsor

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00:40:09   To me, it's if I think...

00:40:11   You're not going to say route if it's route 66.

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00:40:17   But it's mail, route, and what are they?

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00:40:23   It is for people who don't want to get involved with...

00:40:29   Let's say you're running your company's email, and you don't want to deal with Google or Microsoft.

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00:44:12   What else is going on?

00:44:19   Touch ID?

00:44:22   That's pretty good.

00:44:23   What happened?

00:44:24   What did it?

00:44:25   What?

00:44:26   I don't even know what to say.

00:44:28   Have you hacked a Touch ID yet?

00:44:31   So when did that happen?

00:44:32   It seemed like it blew up.

00:44:34   It was early this week.

00:44:36   And as soon as it started blowing up, I was like, "Well, now we know what the overblown

00:44:40   fake scandal for the iPhone 5 is going to – 5S is going to be. And then, like, the

00:44:46   weirdest thing happened. It seemed like the internet collectively came to its senses.

00:44:51   ISKRA Yeah. I haven't seen anything really outrageous about that, particularly. It seems

00:44:59   like everybody's like, "You can, you can do it." But it's not exactly like everybody's

00:45:05   going to be doing it. And-

00:45:06   Is it interesting that you can that you can spoof a fingerprint?

00:45:10   like if you know what these guys did is they print they they like took a

00:45:13   2400 DPI fingerprint scan and then you

00:45:17   Use that to produce like us like a rubber fake

00:45:22   Fingerprint put it over your own finger and then your finger, you know can spoof that fingerprint

00:45:28   I mean, it's you know, it's not impossible, but it's you know, it's kind of mission impossibly, you know

00:45:35   It's like a spy movie type thing.

00:45:37   I mean, it takes expertise.

00:45:38   Yeah, I mean, it takes some expertise.

00:45:42   Yeah, it's sort of maker-- like I said,

00:45:44   I think I said maker skills kind of thing.

00:45:48   It's a crafty-- you have to be a little crafty.

00:45:52   And then the whole point is still

00:45:54   that even with that touch ID is still-- it's obviously better

00:46:00   than what Apple said.

00:46:03   Most people just don't use a passcode at all.

00:46:05   Or it's probably still even better than a simple passcode.

00:46:10   Oh, I think it definitely is.

00:46:12   I mean, you could argue about that, about whether it's better than a simple passcode.

00:46:17   But it's unquestionably better than none at all.

00:46:20   I mean, and the bottom line is the only thing they showed is that if you are being attacked by someone who has the expertise to make a 2400 DPI fake

00:46:30   or a copy of your fingerprint

00:46:32   That the sensor can be spoofed. Well, I mean it's interesting but I don't think that's surprising, you know

00:46:39   Yeah, I don't and I think calling it a hack is is totally misleading that seemed yeah

00:46:44   That seems like the wrong word, but I don't know of a better word spoons spoof or fool

00:46:48   You know that you can spoof it with a fake fingerprint a high quality fake print fingerprint

00:46:54   I really don't think and you know and and I don't think that if I just

00:46:58   Hand it over my phone to them right now without having wiped it or anything

00:47:03   I don't think it's possible to just take a fingerprint from it. That would that would be of high enough quality

00:47:10   I think you'd have to really kind of work to get a fingerprint of that quality

00:47:13   And even if I'm wrong, you're still talking about experts

00:47:15   It's not going to be of any help to someone who just steals or finds an iPhone. I

00:47:20   Think it depends

00:47:26   And I think I think there are yeah, I know well

00:47:29   I didn't see the whole I didn't watch the whole thing, but it doesn't I mean it seems like the kind of thing that

00:47:33   You could follow and do if you really wanted to

00:47:37   but well

00:47:39   It doesn't seem like people I don't know it doesn't it seem like the people who steal a phone or much more interested in just

00:47:45   Getting the phone. Yeah, it's selling it. They're not that they're not that interested in getting your

00:47:49   Your data most most phone phone thieves are right about the phone

00:47:56   And you know let's face it for a lot of us it's really just a way to defend against somebody

00:48:01   pooping you. Yeah right. Right by which I mean that there's a whole thing where people if you

00:48:09   leave your phone unattended your your quote-unquote friends will take it and go to your Twitter and

00:48:13   then just write the word pooping. Yeah. To fake to make it look as though while you were taking

00:48:20   a poop you you tweeted it. Yeah and that's that was the example that I use because we've got this

00:48:24   friend who I go out drinking with frequently, and I know what his passcode is, just because

00:48:28   I've seen him type it in so many times. And he's got simple passcode turned on. And

00:48:34   I see people doing this all the time, but when they go to—it's like a bunch of guys

00:48:38   sitting around at the bar—they just leave their phone in the bar when they go to the

00:48:41   bathroom. And I don't do that.

00:48:45   No, I don't do that either, because I want to be on my phone while I'm in the bathroom.

00:48:51   No, but I don't do that. I don't certainly – I don't know. I feel very uncomfortable

00:48:56   when my phone is like laying –

00:49:00   Plus I know those guys would try and get into it.

00:49:03   They'll poop in you.

00:49:06   Yeah. So I'll be interested to see if anybody decides to make a big deal out of that because

00:49:17   it doesn't seem like it's that big a deal.

00:49:18   No, it doesn't. I do think it's interesting that some of the analysis of it, you know,

00:49:25   the how secure is it, you know, argument aside, just in terms of is this a cool feature. A

00:49:31   lot of it, you know, as people kind of figured out more and more how this works, that a lot

00:49:35   of it really comes down to the fact that Apple is designing its own system on a chips now,

00:49:43   Right? Like that was a big change. And I remember thinking it was almost unusual how much, how

00:49:51   proud Steve Jobs seemed of that when they first did it with what, the A4 processor?

00:49:56   So what would that have been four years ago? So what was that? The first iPhone 4. Right?

00:50:04   Right. I think that's right. And, you know, I remember thinking it was more about Steve

00:50:11   jobs sort of being old school, you know, from back in the 70s and 80s when the semiconductor

00:50:16   industry was new. And, you know, that it was, it made him proud that Apple was doing a lot

00:50:22   of that now on its own instead of just getting parts from others. But I think part of, in

00:50:29   hindsight, I think part of why he was so proud about it is that it's enabling them to do

00:50:33   features that they couldn't otherwise do. That it really is part of the system on a

00:50:39   chip design that there's this secure enclave where there's storage that is completely,

00:50:45   like, technically inaccessible to the actual regular operating system. Nothing in iOS,

00:50:51   not even the root process can access it. And that's going to be, it's going to be hard

00:50:57   to copy. Because it's, you know, chip design is like a years-long process. Like, I think

00:51:04   this is something that they started working on you know five years ago maybe

00:51:08   longer

00:51:10   yeah

00:51:11   and it may not take five years for the you know other companies to copy it but

00:51:14   it will take years

00:51:21   you like the uh... touch i_d_ use it

00:51:26   ideal yeah

00:51:28   yeah i mean

00:51:30   if one of the great things about it is that

00:51:32   it lets me turn turn on

00:51:35   the com uh... turn all i guess it's turn off simple passcode

00:51:39   rights now you have a uh...

00:51:41   along passcode

00:51:42   along passcode and i have that set

00:51:45   so for the

00:51:46   to be required to be unlocked immediately

00:51:49   yes yeah

00:51:51   i mean so i think

00:51:52   men given those two things i think my phones more secure than it was

00:51:56   yeah i totally think so

00:51:58   It'll be interesting to see what happens if somebody, and maybe it's not even a question

00:52:03   of if, maybe it's, you know, we should admit that it's a question of when somebody is going

00:52:08   to have their phone unlocked against their will by this.

00:52:12   Right.

00:52:13   You know, and there's a good question about like what law enforcement can do.

00:52:19   Like Oh yeah.

00:52:22   you know, that you're something like a password is considered like a in the US like a First

00:52:29   Amendment type thing like you can't write you know they can't say what's the password

00:52:33   to your phone you can just you know if you're allowed to not answer a question are are you

00:52:38   allowed to not have them physically force your thumb against the sensor as you know

00:52:46   people that sort of an open question on that yeah it's like a key where you can't go

00:52:52   claim a first amendment right to a key around a physical key like the key to your car right

00:52:57   except that in this case it is your you know it's a little different than a key because

00:53:00   it's you know your body so i don't know yeah it's an open question and people are concerned

00:53:04   about it and then you know i think a lot of this comes down to who are you concerned about

00:53:08   getting access to your phone you know and obviously you know this nsa stuff is on people's

00:53:13   minds and rightly so i'm not saying that it shouldn't be but um in terms of like protecting

00:53:19   you from government agencies no touch ID probably is is not gonna stop anything

00:53:25   but I you know again against like your friends or your kids or just somebody

00:53:30   who finds your phone in the back of a cab right like you you lose your phone

00:53:35   in a cab touch ID is gonna work great yeah I use it all the time

00:53:46   How many fingers did you set up with?

00:53:50   Toes.

00:53:51   I just used toes.

00:53:53   I said three, I think.

00:53:55   I think I said three.

00:53:57   Both my thumbs.

00:54:00   And then I actually used my – why am I telling you this?

00:54:03   I shouldn't say this.

00:54:04   I guess so.

00:54:05   Now someone's going to come in the middle of the night and cut my thumbs off.

00:54:10   I'm not telling you.

00:54:13   Forget it.

00:54:14   fingers right now. There was this, I don't know, this is a terrible rattle, but my parents

00:54:27   had this book, this German book that was trying to teach kids manners from the 1800s. I have

00:54:34   no idea how they got this book, but we had this book lying around growing up and one

00:54:38   of the stories, one of these horrible German stories from the mid-1800s was, I think it's

00:54:46   pronounced Der Stroulpeter, and it was this. The mother goes out. This is because that's

00:54:51   what they did back then. They just left the kids at home. So she goes out to go grocery

00:54:54   shopping or whatever, and she tells the kid, "Don't suck your thumb," or "Der Stroulpeter

00:54:59   will come get you." And so, of course, the minute the woman goes out the door, the kid

00:55:04   kid starts sucking his thumb and this guy bursts into the door and he's got these

00:55:10   huge scissor hands and he snips the kid's thumbs off and the kid is just sitting there

00:55:19   crying with no thumbs. And that's the moral of the story. Don't suck your thumbs or

00:55:28   some crazy German man with scissor hands is going to cut your thumbs off.

00:55:34   That's pretty that was that was mid-1800

00:55:36   Parenting that's pretty rough

00:55:40   Probably you can look it up. You can look that up on the web

00:55:43   it's that there's they've a lot of places like boing boing and like laughing squid of

00:55:47   if it's the case if you go back a hundred years if it always looks like we were pretty terrible to our kids like maybe

00:55:54   In 1850 when they were using this book to teach kids not to suck their thumbs a hundred years prior to that

00:56:00   Maybe they actually cut off the kids thumbs and they're like, can you believe that we used to actually do this to the kids?

00:56:05   And there's like you didn't have modern parenting technology

00:56:09   That would hey and allow us to convey to the children that their thumbs would be cut off

00:56:13   Right and grandpa's you actually cut the thumbs off grandpa who grew up then is in the corner and he you know missing a thumb

00:56:19   Yeah, yeah hurt like hell

00:56:22   I cannot work in the fields

00:56:26   Do you see this thing with Steven Elop and the car? Yeah, that was everything on my list

00:56:31   so

00:56:33   Long story short and this to me is why he's got who's got two thumbs and 25 million dollars

00:56:38   Who

00:56:42   It was long

00:56:45   rumored by you know, like especially Nokia fans so the

00:56:48   When when Nokia hired him he came from Microsoft and then shortly after he got there. He said, okay my evaluation is

00:56:56   We're screwed on smartphone operating systems ours is no good the one we've been worked in you know symbionts

00:57:02   No good this whatever the me bow whatever it was they were working on not gonna cut it

00:57:05   We're gonna go to Windows 7 and so everybody was like hmm. We hire a guy from Microsoft

00:57:10   He comes in and he switches us to Windows phone this seems to me like this guy was a mole

00:57:15   Maybe his plan is to run Nokia in the ground and then have Microsoft buy them well

00:57:21   Well then it turns out this week that his contract was structured such that, well, just

00:57:25   in case Nokia gets cash strapped and their business goes down, and because they're cash

00:57:32   strapped they have to sell the company to say, or maybe their handset business to say

00:57:38   Microsoft, well if that happens we'll give you a $25 million bonus.

00:57:45   And lo and behold that's exactly what happened.

00:57:49   And then to top that off, I guess because it's such a true scandal in, what, Finland?

00:57:56   Finland.

00:57:57   Where are they?

00:57:58   Yeah.

00:57:59   Finland.

00:58:00   Because Nokia is, rightly so, that's the pride of Finland.

00:58:03   And it's a big company worldwide, but it's certainly a bigger deal in Finland.

00:58:07   There's a scandal over this.

00:58:09   And so the board apparently went to him and asked him, "Well, would you give that bonus

00:58:14   back?"

00:58:16   his answer is that he can't because he's getting his divorce and his wife won't

00:58:20   let him I don't know how that it's the shock he's already so he's gotten he's

00:58:31   already gotten the money I guess I guess whatever else is you know it's is stock

00:58:37   or whatever it is you know either he's gotten it or he's legally going to get

00:58:42   then there's nothing they could do unless he volunteered to you know turn

00:58:45   down or renegotiate or something. The thing with the wife is interesting to me on two

00:58:51   fronts. On a personal level, the fact that he was willing to publicly throw her under

00:58:55   the bus makes it a lot less surprising that she wants to divorce him in the first place.

00:59:02   But the second part is I don't blame her at all. She didn't run Nokia into the ground.

00:59:08   You know the his wife she is legally entitled to half the money, so you know why in the world should she?

00:59:16   Let turn it down

00:59:19   It's you know to me, yeah, no keep the dumbass Nokia boards fault for agreeing to a contract like that, right?

00:59:27   It just seems like a crazy thing to put in a contract like it would be like if you were hiring a new coach of

00:59:35   your team and you

00:59:37   rewarded losing a record number of games. Just in case we only win ten ball games in one of the next three seasons,

00:59:43   you'll get a bonus.

00:59:45   Like, why would you put a bonus like that in? I guess it was structured in

00:59:49   language that made it seem like a golden parachute, right? Like, if the handset business is acquired,

00:59:56   you know, if you the board approve a handset sale, I get a big bonus.

01:00:00   But, you know, doesn't it logically seem like

01:00:04   The only way that the handset business would get sold is if you do a pretty bad job running it I

01:00:10   Guess the I don't know I mean maybe the idea is that if you look at it the other way that his

01:00:18   Compensation you know if he had done it if he had done a good job and not run the company into the ground his

01:00:22   Compensation would have been a lot more

01:00:24   I

01:00:27   Guess I don't know it just certainly yeah, yeah, right. I mean you could

01:00:32   It leaves a bad day just for you know I mean if some of these packages 25 million is not really

01:00:37   That big and it really does I mean no it I never thought it sounded crazy. It's not you know the

01:00:45   Kubrick faked the moon landings crazy. It's just you know like hmm

01:00:50   I don't know that's kind of a conspiracy the idea that he was a Microsoft mole from the beginning

01:00:54   But you know now that they're actually selling the hints at unit to Microsoft it

01:00:58   You know it's kind of like well call it a conspiracy or what you will

01:01:01   it's what happened. And it certainly hasn't been good for Nokia shareholders or customers.

01:01:07   Jared "Seth" Johnson No.

01:01:08   So, I'm interested to know what Nokia, the company, is going to do after this.

01:01:16   I mean, they're buying their mobile services.

01:01:21   Pete Laskowski Right.

01:01:22   Jared "Seth" Johnson Microsoft is buying their mobile services business,

01:01:24   and Nokia is still a company in Finland.

01:01:28   Pete Laskowski Yeah, I don't know what other businesses they have.

01:01:30   There was some, and I forget who mentioned this on Twitter, somebody like, maybe it was

01:01:35   Nealey Patel, said somebody mentioned this in comments or something on The Verge. It may not

01:01:39   have been The Verge, but I can't remember. That Nokia would go and buy HTC and then start making

01:01:46   Android phones. Which I thought was interesting. I'm not sure if that really helps them, but...

01:01:54   I don't know.

01:01:58   But it gets back to that whole question about what they should have done in the first place.

01:02:02   It's like their chance for a do-over. Although, four years too late or whatever it was,

01:02:11   three years. How long ago was that that they ditched? It was three years?

01:02:18   Yeah, it was pretty fast in the grand scheme of things.

01:02:20   Because it had to be three years because the iPhone's only been out six years.

01:02:26   the whole thing was precipitated by the rise of…

01:02:29   And Windows Phone hasn't been around that long.

01:02:33   No. I think two years? Is that right?

01:02:38   No, I think it's been longer than that, but…

01:02:40   Three years, yeah.

01:02:41   Yeah, I think it's been three years.

01:02:43   Yeah.

01:02:43   I keep saying it's going to take over Android. I should go back and find that one again. Every

01:02:56   once in a while I pull that one out. That's probably a worse, that's probably one of the

01:03:00   worst claimed chowders ever because it's so so bad and it but it is what they wanted right that

01:03:08   you know and it's so directly comparable you know that you know some of the Android to iPhone

01:03:13   comparisons are so tough because Android is just an OS that they license to other people to make

01:03:18   and iPhone is all Apple whereas Windows Phone is it's an OS that they license to handset makers to

01:03:24   make like windows phone and android are couldn't be more direct competitors

01:03:28   right and and what was it like I forget who it was like by 2014 yeah it's gonna

01:03:35   be yeah we see that's the funny that's the yeah because it was by the end of

01:03:38   this year yeah it's coming up that one of those firms had speculated that you

01:03:43   know and it's even worse I got it here all right you got it hang on a sec well

01:03:48   it's it's even worse than the infamous claim chowder by Eric Schmidt who like

01:03:53   a year ago said that by the middle of the next summer,

01:03:55   half the TV sold in America were gonna have Google TV

01:03:58   hooked up to them.

01:03:59   Now that's bad, and he was wrong.

01:04:01   I mean, nobody even talks about Google TV anymore.

01:04:03   - But at least then he's trying to push his own company.

01:04:07   I mean, you could call that marketing.

01:04:09   That's what he's supposed to do.

01:04:12   Whereas this was an analyst,

01:04:14   this is pyramid research analyst Stella Boken

01:04:18   said that Windows Phone is poised to overtake

01:04:21   Android's massive market share as soon as 2013. And this was back in 2011, May of 2011.

01:04:28   It's like – you should have known by then.

01:04:35   With Eric Schmidt, he was on stage being interviewed and I think he sort of has a tendency to run

01:04:42   his mouth a little bit. He was shooting from the hip. And maybe as soon as he said it,

01:04:46   he was like, "Ah, I don't know why I said that." But to hell with it. I'm promoting

01:04:49   Like you said he's a spokesman for the company. Whereas this is supposed to be a measured well considered research report

01:04:57   Right, right. This is our analysis. This is why you should you should pay our company to provide research

01:05:04   For you because we're so good. We're so smart

01:05:08   We understand the market

01:05:10   Yeah

01:05:11   And I really I have to believe that they think that a lot of these companies think that

01:05:15   But they just need to get their name out there and so they need to say something crazy in

01:05:18   order to get their name out there.

01:05:22   But I just can never figure out exactly how they reconcile that with looking like idiots

01:05:30   for saying something that's so obviously not going to happen.

01:05:33   I don't get it.

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01:08:23   speaking of crying goodbyes you see Steve Ballmer I didn't yeah that's like

01:08:29   the big I can't big annual watch that guy yeah it's kind of sad watching him

01:08:34   go out he's really yeah that's not the way you want to go out it's really

01:08:39   pretty ugly yeah he is not going out like Mariano Rivera no see a rumor I

01:08:47   saw right at the top of his game I read it in Business Insider so and Lord only

01:08:51   knows what I was doing on our website so it could be completely false but I saw

01:08:56   that it said that a leading candidate to replace him is the guy who's the CEO of

01:09:00   Ford Ford Motor Company yeah I heard that I don't know anything about the CEO

01:09:06   of the Ford Motor Company but I will tell you it does not sound to me like he

01:09:09   should be running Microsoft it doesn't sound to me like any like that sounds

01:09:12   like going again Scully yeah you know I mean yeah it doesn't seem like that's

01:09:21   gonna end well yeah it does not it is a it doesn't seem to and I know Ford is

01:09:26   not like going under and I know that during the whole fiscal crisis that of

01:09:31   the big three US automakers they were in far better shape you know didn't need a

01:09:35   bailout like GM did or whatever and you know good for them but nobody really I

01:09:41   can't think of any other do you thinks Wow Ford's really you know dominating

01:09:45   the world of cars. So I don't know about that. And the CEO knows how to rescue a gigantic

01:09:55   software company. Yeah, and I feel like if there's any kind of lesson, I mean, I don't

01:10:02   know. I still think that a big part of the problem with Balmer as CEO is that the guy

01:10:07   just never really got it. And I'm not saying you have to be Bill Gates who was literally

01:10:13   a great programmer. You don't have to be a programmer to run Microsoft, you know,

01:10:19   in the same way that you don't have to be an industrial designer to run Apple,

01:10:24   right? Tim Cook is not a designer, but I do feel that Tim Cook fundamentally, when

01:10:29   you listen to him, he understands what it is that Apple is supposed to be doing.

01:10:34   And I don't think Balmer ever really got that with Microsoft, at least in the

01:10:38   consumer space. I think Balmer's understanding of how and why Microsoft

01:10:44   was successful is entirely revolved around the franchises he had inherited

01:10:50   and around the enterprise market, which could be, you know, could be lucrative and

01:10:55   maybe long-term that's the route that Microsoft goes, but I think the reason

01:10:58   that he's being shown the door is because of their failures in the

01:11:01   consumer space. Right. Yeah, I mean I don't think there's any question about that.

01:11:07   And wasn't Ford the company that made a pretty big push into the Microsoft designed

01:11:13   Software interface to their cars and it was you know shockingly terrible. I

01:11:19   Don't know that sounds familiar, but I'm not sure I

01:11:24   Just it seems like the kind of thing where you would have hoped that something they have somebody inside

01:11:32   That they could promote. Yeah, that was kind of what I thought but I don't know but then I'd yeah

01:11:37   I bet I don't know any anything about their bench

01:11:40   Yeah

01:11:40   and the other thing to me is if that's the route they were gonna go I would have thought that I

01:11:45   Would think that maybe it wouldn't be we're gonna have a year-long transition. They would have said yeah

01:11:49   No

01:11:50   They would have done that quietly on the side and right done a done a little at the old switcheroo

01:11:55   And I know that it's different circumstances than it was with Steve Jobs because you know

01:12:00   We now know in hindsight that dirt, you know that that transition was he you know, he was at the end of the rope

01:12:06   Health-wise he was dying

01:12:08   Or at least failing

01:12:11   But you know

01:12:13   It is though like in terms of like a step-by-step process. It's how you do it

01:12:17   You know like you you announce something but you say and here's the guy, you know, who's coming up

01:12:22   mm-hmm

01:12:24   Just seems yeah, I don't think they're gonna I don't think they're going to hire someone from inside

01:12:29   Yeah, it doesn't look like it, which I just think it seems like a terrible I

01:12:33   Can't really I cannot think of an instance where that's worked really well

01:12:38   Yeah, I don't know maybe I mean I'm sure it happens all the time, and I'm maybe that's just a feeling of my

01:12:45   How

01:12:48   keyed in I am to that kind of thing but I

01:12:51   would think in the software industry I would

01:12:56   technology I would have heard of something like that, but it's just that the companies in the saw in the computer industry are to me

01:13:03   So

01:13:06   distinctive like the ones that get big and successful like

01:13:09   Microsoft is nothing like Google and neither one of them is anything like Apple and they're none of those

01:13:14   Companies or anything like Facebook, you know, and I just feel like it's you know, they have such strong

01:13:23   Personalities, you know like what it is that makes a successful Microsoft product a Microsoft product. There's a feel to it

01:13:29   You know it permeates everything they do both the design and the brand and just even what it's meant to do

01:13:36   And I feel like I don't know bringing in the guy from Ford. I just don't doesn't seem like it's gonna help them at all

01:13:48   Or what's how about Samsung coming out with a gold I've I found gold the galaxy

01:13:53   Got anything on that no

01:13:57   It's just a matter of time and they went with a real gold gold that's the one I didn't even know what joke to crack

01:14:05   And it's plastic too, well, of course it is that was one of the I think that's one of the hard things

01:14:12   And I think it you know, it's pretty hard to pull off in plastic. Yeah, I

01:14:18   I think you just, yeah, you don't want to go there but...

01:14:22   You know like when you first heard the rumors in like early August or whenever it was that

01:14:28   it seemed like Apple might be, you know, the new 5s was gonna come in gold and everybody was like,

01:14:33   "Ooh, it doesn't sound good." Yeah, no, it sounded terrible at first.

01:14:37   As you sucked the air between your teeth and thought and cringed a little and crinkled your

01:14:42   eyes and worried, that color of gold that you had in your mind, that's the color of

01:14:48   gold that Samsung is going with.

01:14:51   Dan: Now supposedly they had a gold phone prior to this, but it was a flip phone.

01:14:58   Dave: Of course they did.

01:15:00   I love the people who defend them.

01:15:01   Dan.

01:15:02   So they got there first, but in the all-important gold flip phone market.

01:15:10   I do think that it's an interesting way going to gold. I don't think it's the only reason

01:15:18   they went to gold. I think Apple made this gold iPhone because it looks good and a lot

01:15:21   of people really like it. And I think people, you know, it's an interesting way to keep

01:15:25   that same hardware design for two years as they've done for six years in a row and have

01:15:33   something that's compatible with all the existing cases, etc., etc., and yet still make it look

01:15:38   really know

01:15:39   uh... but i can't help but think though that the fact that they make the iPhone

01:15:43   out of metal

01:15:44   you know is it making a gold is an interesting way to differentiate it from

01:15:49   samsung's plastic

01:15:54   you know to keep the the five s as a top-tier that the uh...

01:15:59   that the other phones

01:16:00   both from competitors

01:16:02   and even with the five c from apple itself that they're you know

01:16:06   they're a shelf below. Right. I was gonna go this time I was gonna go with the white

01:16:15   if they had kept the same color scheme I was actually gonna get my first white iPhone.

01:16:19   Cause I think the I actually think the white iPhone 5 looks better than the black one.

01:16:27   But you went to space. Cause my wife my wife ended up getting a white 5. And you went space

01:16:30   because but I got space great because I think that's something improves I mean

01:16:36   the the banding around it is is nice yeah it's definitely it's definitely

01:16:41   better than the black one from last year yeah do you agree like what I said last

01:16:45   week or maybe it was down a little I forget if I'm stealing this or if I came

01:16:48   up with it but uh it's my show so I think it's okay do you agree that's

01:16:53   reminiscent of the original iPhone it's a darker it's a little darker than the

01:16:57   metal in the original. Yeah, no I think it's, I think it's, oh the back, yeah, a little

01:17:02   bit. Yeah, I'd say a little bit. I didn't really think about that, but I would say it's

01:17:08   a little bit like that. It's a nice looking phone though. I could see them switching to

01:17:14   make like Macbooks in this color. Oh yeah. It's been a long time since they've changed

01:17:21   the color of Macbooks, you know? Right. I mean, I'm pulling this out of my ass, I mean,

01:17:27   I don't have any kind of…

01:17:29   That would throw the Ultrabook business into…

01:17:34   Exactly.

01:17:35   But I feel like, you know, I don't think Apple worries itself too much about other

01:17:38   companies copying their designs.

01:17:40   I mean, I'm sure it's annoying, but at the same time, it's got to be flattering

01:17:43   because everybody knows, like, when all these other things come out that look so much like

01:17:46   Mac books that it's, you know, it just emphasizes who's the market leader.

01:17:51   But at a certain point, I feel like they're going to want to do something new.

01:17:54   They can't just get this this same color forever, and I feel like this space gray would totally work. Yeah

01:18:00   Even if it was only for like the MacBook Pro or something like that oh

01:18:05   That would be back to the back to the black MacBook

01:18:09   Extra $50 for space gray

01:18:13   Wait what is that? Oh wait? Did they charge extra for that? Yeah? Yeah? I got that too

01:18:20   I got that I didn't I end up liking it

01:18:24   I switched from a power book was it called the Mac that was yet or was it still the was it still the eye?

01:18:30   No, that was no as the MacBook and and they came out with a black one

01:18:34   They were plastic and they came out with a black one and it did look better

01:18:37   I thought and they charged an extra 50 bucks. Yeah. Yeah, I wouldn't I wasn't gonna get the white one

01:18:43   I just couldn't bring myself to get the white one

01:18:45   But I switched from a power book to that and it wasn't I wasn't happy with that

01:18:50   that the plastic wasn't, I mean, it was much better once they switched to unibody plastic,

01:18:55   but the seams were annoying.

01:18:57   I think that that's one of those cases where that's why some people hate Apple. Like, charging

01:19:04   extra for the color.

01:19:06   It is pretty bad.

01:19:08   Is exactly, it is right, like, it's right teed up perfectly for, that is what makes

01:19:18   people go crazy about Apple. Absolutely insane crazy.

01:19:24   They didn't charge extra for gold. No. No. I think that they've kind of learned.

01:19:30   There was some. I think there was some people were speculating about that

01:19:32   before, you know, when it first came out. It's really hard to get it. I mean, I think

01:19:36   it's nonsense. I can't. I'm not even gonna link to it, but I saw a story that

01:19:40   somebody said that somebody sold a gold iPhone on eBay for $10,000. Oh yeah. Yeah.

01:19:45   I mean that's crazy. I mean, you know, I can see selling it for double the price to some

01:19:49   Moron who really has to just can't wait to get their hands on it, but not ten thousand dollars. That can't be true

01:19:55   It has to be fake

01:19:56   But I don't know. I read it on the internet. I wouldn't maybe asked I mean people bought that I am rich app

01:20:03   So

01:20:08   Somebody did, anyway.

01:20:12   I wonder what the most that Apple could have gotten away charging for the gold iPhone is.

01:20:21   I don't even want to speculate.

01:20:26   Yeah, I don't know.

01:20:28   Imagine if they did, if they charged like five grand for it, and all it is is gold anodized

01:20:33   color.

01:20:34   Just the gold.

01:20:35   Yeah.

01:20:36   I think you're gonna charge five grand.

01:20:38   It should be real gold.

01:20:39   Dave: Yeah, I wonder what the reception would be like on that.

01:20:42   Tim Cynova Oh, yeah.

01:20:44   Dave: It'd be heavy, too.

01:20:46   Tim Cynova Certainly made for some great headlines.

01:20:49   Dave People would buy it, though.

01:20:52   Tim Cynova I'm sure somebody would.

01:20:56   Dave Those Virtu phones are still...

01:20:57   Virtu is still around, the company that sells like $5,000 leather cell phones.

01:21:05   And they've switched to Android finally.

01:21:07   They used to be like Symbian.

01:21:09   Somebody took one apart and it really literally was inside the leather and jewel embellished

01:21:16   case.

01:21:17   It was like a $40 Nokia Symbian phone.

01:21:23   Somebody would buy it.

01:21:24   I mean, that's what...

01:21:25   I mean...

01:21:26   **BEN HONG:** That's what people claim iPhones are too, though.

01:21:28   **REZ CABRERA:** Yeah, that's what they claim.

01:21:29   But you know, Virtu really...

01:21:30   **BEN HONG:** I mean, it only costs $200 to make.

01:21:32   And they say that it's like a concierge service.

01:21:36   Like there's a button you can hit and you know, talk to it.

01:21:39   If you have a Virtu phone, you have like a button and you can get like a Virtu concierge

01:21:43   and say, "Hey, I'm in Seattle tonight.

01:21:47   Can I get a dinner reservation at like a good Italian restaurant?"

01:21:52   And then somehow they take care of it or something.

01:21:53   I don't know if it works well or whatever.

01:21:56   But it seems to me like, you know, there are other ways to get somebody to make a hotel

01:22:00   reservation or restaurant reservation for you than to buy a $4,000 Symbian phone.

01:22:05   Tim Cynova You could get a free,

01:22:07   get the one, what is it, one table app for free.

01:22:11   Eric Meyer Yeah, it does, you know,

01:22:13   seems like there's a better way. Tim Cynova

01:22:18   So, oh, so Amy's got the gold one. Eric Meyer

01:22:22   Yeah, and I still have the, I have to send it back. I got to send back my review unit.

01:22:26   Tim Cynova Oh, they gave you a gold,

01:22:28   They gave me a gold review unit and a pink 5C.

01:22:33   You know what? People laugh about that.

01:22:35   There's lots of tweets like that.

01:22:36   Everybody loved that Apple gave me the pink one.

01:22:40   I don't think-- it's not a jokey joke pink.

01:22:43   It's not like a little--

01:22:44   No, it's really not.

01:22:44   Yeah.

01:22:45   It's not a little girl's pink.

01:22:48   It really isn't.

01:22:49   I mean, I could see that there would be--

01:22:53   well, I don't know.

01:22:54   It's pink.

01:22:55   but it's not it's not as ridiculous as it sounds yeah it's it's all it's more

01:22:59   like a salmon rose yeah something like that it's not exist it's not pink pink

01:23:04   yeah I guess that's the other question well you know again Apple is never going

01:23:09   to tell us but we're gonna have to like eyeball it you know as we just observe

01:23:13   people but I'm curious to see which colors are the most popular how that how

01:23:17   they're distributed the greens pretty cool I would I would have suspected the

01:23:22   blue but I think the greens gonna be popular yeah it really stands out and I

01:23:30   don't know if it's just a coincidence or not but a lot of the ads I've seen so

01:23:35   far are the green yeah so I don't know yeah green is it looks pretty good and I

01:23:43   think wasn't trying to remember which ones were the ones that sold out yellow

01:23:48   yellow apparently sold out first. Yeah. But who knows? Yeah, maybe yellow and green, because I thought green was one of them though.

01:23:53   But you have no way of knowing whether it's because they made the same number of all and yellow sold out first, or if Apple thought,

01:23:59   "I don't know about this yellow. We're going to make fewer of them," and then they sold out. Yeah.

01:24:03   So you don't know. I mean, and Apple's never going to tell you.

01:24:09   Blackberry reported their revenue. It's getting ugly.

01:24:15   ugly it's not good when it's gonna happen with them I guess there's some

01:24:22   crazy guy who's gonna buy the company apparently yeah which is I guess taking

01:24:29   it is that taking a prior they're taking it private then yeah I guess I just feel

01:24:33   like you know like he's gonna it's like you know come down off off the like week

01:24:38   long bender he's on and it wakes up he's gonna go I did what I bought what

01:24:44   And there was a rumor that what's-his-name was trying to buy it.

01:24:49   Lazardius or whatever his name is.

01:24:51   Lazardius.

01:24:52   Lazardius.

01:24:53   Mike Lazardius.

01:24:54   Whatever his name is.

01:24:56   That would have been bad.

01:24:57   I like my joke on that where it was, you know, that his pitch to the investors is the other

01:25:03   guy was the problem.

01:25:07   New candles?

01:25:11   New candles? What else we got?

01:25:13   I don't know. Where do they go?

01:25:17   I don't know. It seems like the point where they should have...

01:25:21   Like where Nokia is now. Nokia is like, they still have their pride.

01:25:25   They maybe could still stand alone, but they're selling now. Like the time for

01:25:29   RIM or BlackBerry was like two or three years ago. They kind of needed

01:25:33   to sell the company like two years ago.

01:25:37   And now it's like nobody I don't think anybody knows what to do with them before they did that whole thing with the playbook

01:25:43   Yeah

01:25:45   embarrass themselves, yeah

01:25:47   About the new Kindles

01:25:51   There's a really look into that that much what other than hearing about the

01:25:56   May Day service. Yeah

01:25:58   They look good. It's kind of a weird thing though, like where they didn't do an event

01:26:03   But they organized, you know, they had some like that big a deal

01:26:07   Yeah, and they had some you know, but they did have some embargoed

01:26:10   Reviewers and they you know a couple of interviews conducted in advance, but then they had the embargo lift at midnight

01:26:17   I forget if it was midnight Pacific or midnight Eastern but either way kind of a weird time to lift an embargo

01:26:22   Like when a lot of people are in bed

01:26:25   Just seems weird

01:26:27   I guess that the strategy is then people wake up in the morning and it's still at the top of the news because nothing else

01:26:31   happened overnight, but

01:26:33   Just seemed a little weird

01:26:36   They look good, but I don't know it. I don't know, you know, I

01:26:39   Don't see many I you know, they've been out for a while I don't see very many Kindle fires out there in the wild

01:26:47   And the ones I do see tend to be the this

01:26:51   You know the small one like the one that people I think people have bought like, you know

01:26:56   My guess is that they are you know, pretty much bought just to have a Kindle ebook reader that's in color

01:27:04   Right, which is a totally credible product. I'm not even I'm not disparaging it

01:27:08   But it you know the ones I've seen over the years have tended to be the small one and it's people on airplanes

01:27:14   Using them to read books. I

01:27:17   Assume that they're books who knows what they're reading

01:27:19   We see it we see more out here obviously we I think we talked about this once before but you know when I used to commute

01:27:30   up to Seattle

01:27:33   Yeah, I'd see a lot of them on the train.

01:27:35   Do you see more window tablets? Because some of those people were...

01:27:39   I've seen a few, not a lot though. I mean they haven't sold very many. It's pretty hard to...

01:27:51   I sold... Yeah, I definitely see more, definitely see more Kindles.

01:27:56   I mean on the train when I was commuting, I would see a fair number of them.

01:28:01   But I mean, like I said, some of those people were probably going to Amazon.

01:28:04   And…

01:28:04   I saw somebody at the airport when I was coming home from Portland last week who was

01:28:10   right out of a Windows commercial, a Windows tablet commercial. She was using hers on her lap

01:28:15   at the airport with the keyboard and typing away at a pace where I have to admit I could never

01:28:23   achieve on an iPad personally. You know, it seemed to me like she would, you know, maybe she bought

01:28:29   the right tablet. I don't know. But I hadn't seen it. I don't see many, many Windows ones

01:28:34   at all. It almost seems like the announcements are half-hearted. I'm not saying that Kindle

01:28:42   and Windows have given up on competing against the iPad. But the Kindle won this week. No

01:28:52   event came at midnight you know it hasn't made that big a splash when

01:28:57   Microsoft had the next-gen surface announcement you know seemed like the

01:29:02   guy was half asleep up there it's like yeah we're not giving up we're doing

01:29:09   another one we know you're not gonna buy it am i wrong and my name I am I am I

01:29:15   reading it wrong that's how I felt to me I don't know I mean it's gotta be a hard

01:29:19   hard thing to do yeah let's spend all year making this thing that we know we

01:29:25   really kind of know people aren't gonna buy they switched the ads you saw the

01:29:30   ads are now more product centric than the they got rid of the dancing hmm

01:29:36   which is definitely an improvement they're still not great ads but they're

01:29:39   but they're much better than the ones they had originally yeah wonder how much

01:29:46   are going to spend on it. I saw that there was a story...

01:29:54   A billion dollars already in write-off. There was a story that Motorola was going

01:29:58   to spend $500 million on an ad campaign for the Moto X, which is a lot of money. I think

01:30:04   they said that Apple's budget in the US for ads is like a billion a year or something

01:30:09   like that. But $500 million is roughly in the ballpark. It's not Samsung money. Samsung

01:30:16   Samsung spends like $10, $11 billion a year on advertising. It'll be interesting to see

01:30:24   how that goes. I can't remember the last time I saw a Motorola campaign. They seem to have

01:30:30   given up.

01:30:31   Yeah, I haven't seen one either. I don't listen to the radio anymore, but every once in a

01:30:36   while my wife listens to the radio and I frequently hear a Samsung ad.

01:30:41   Hmm. No, they spend the most. I mean, they outspend Apple like 10 to 1. I think Horace

01:30:46   DeGioia was the first guy to kind of point that out. And that it's, you know, arguably,

01:30:52   you know, nobody ever, famously, nobody ever really knows how to measure the effectiveness

01:30:56   of advertising. But it does seem, though, that they've spent so much money on advertising

01:31:06   that competitors like HTC have, they can't keep up because HTC can't spend that kind

01:31:12   of money because they don't have it.

01:31:13   Right.

01:31:14   They don't have it.

01:31:15   And they also run the gamut of outlets too, it seems like.

01:31:21   Right.

01:31:22   They have TV ads.

01:31:23   They've got stuff in the newspaper.

01:31:25   They've got stuff on the radio, whereas Apple just does, well, I mean, I guess they

01:31:32   do magazine ads too.

01:31:33   Yeah, Apple certainly does a lot.

01:31:35   I've seen one in the newspaper. Probably like a big, like a, you know, like a New York Times.

01:31:40   But I don't think they don't, they don't do radio. I don't think.

01:31:47   Yeah. The May Day thing, I guess that's the most interesting thing of all the other tablets

01:31:51   that was announced this week. This feature where all, all your new Kindle tablets come

01:31:55   with a one-button feature. You hit it and their goal is that within 15 seconds or less,

01:32:01   you get a video chat with a customer support rep.

01:32:05   And you can see them and hear them, and they can hear you,

01:32:09   but they don't see you.

01:32:10   All they see is your screen.

01:32:13   And then they can draw on your screen

01:32:15   to show you how to do stuff, or they can remotely take control.

01:32:18   It sounds fantastic for people who

01:32:24   are nervous about technology.

01:32:26   It just does not sound to me like something that can scale,

01:32:30   given the way that no matter what company i call first

01:32:34   for support

01:32:36   if it's just a good old-fashioned phone call i can't get on the phone with

01:32:39   somebody sooner than three minutes

01:32:42   so i don't know

01:32:45   it is though to me a typical jeff days those feature where it is it does sound

01:32:49   crazy

01:32:52   and it is about making customers happy which i have to say is you know

01:32:56   certainly one of the

01:32:57   you know the best things about amazon as a company

01:32:59   say what you want about their pricing and stuff like that

01:33:02   and what they do to markets that they enter.

01:33:05   But in terms of that they want their customers to be happy,

01:33:08   that's always been the case.

01:33:10   But for example, I don't think Apple,

01:33:15   I don't even think, even if Apple wanted to dip

01:33:17   as far into its cash reserves as possible,

01:33:19   I don't know that they could technically

01:33:22   offer that feature for the iPad.

01:33:24   - Right.

01:33:26   - They just sell too many.

01:33:27   I mean, where would you even find enough people

01:33:31   to answer the phone?

01:33:32   - Yeah, and I was just thinking,

01:33:34   that's what I was just thinking about,

01:33:35   I was wondering if those people,

01:33:36   where those people are, if they're out here or...

01:33:40   I'd heard, I'd read some stories about

01:33:44   some of the support stuff that a lot of these companies

01:33:47   had shipped overseas years ago coming back

01:33:51   just because the economy had gotten to the point

01:33:53   where it was so bad here that they could afford

01:33:54   to bring some of it back.

01:33:56   But I don't know, I mean I still think that was a relatively small percentage.

01:34:04   Like my wife, she had a problem with, she's got a fax printer copy machine thing and she had a problem with it.

01:34:11   She called to get technical support in that and that went to India.

01:34:17   So I still think that a lot, I mean the percentage that came back from what went over is not that great.

01:34:24   great. I had a problem with my cable TV from the wonderful Comcast company this

01:34:31   week where did we just stopped getting anything other than like three channels

01:34:36   we just got like the local ABC, NBC, CBS affiliates and you know we were supposed

01:34:42   to get I don't know 800 channels and so I had to call them and this is a perfect

01:34:46   example I mean it was like you know it wasn't a horrible experience but I was

01:34:50   on the phone for 15 minutes all told I mean it was at least three or four

01:34:54   minutes before I got through the automated part where I had to answer stupid questions

01:34:58   and then finally get connected to a person. And when I got connected to a person, pretty

01:35:03   sure she was not in the United States. I mean, she was very nice, but she was, you know,

01:35:07   we had a little bit of a communication problem in terms of understanding accents, I think.

01:35:13   She was very nice. And, you know, I don't know, it had been a while since I'd called

01:35:19   Comcast for any reason but and she didn't ask what she says she goes is it

01:35:23   okay if I call you by your first name sir I was like yeah sure I was like why

01:35:28   would you ask that but you know see it was she was over bend over backwards you

01:35:31   know to be nice but apparently all she had to do is like hit a button and quote

01:35:35   send a signal to to our the cable cards in the back of our TV and then they just

01:35:40   suddenly worked again like it it did not seem like I should have been on the

01:35:45   phone 15 and 20 minutes. It was a very long time for something that, you know, and she said, "I'm

01:35:51   sending the signal now. Can you get these channels?" And, you know, after she said those words that I

01:35:57   started getting those channels. It was instantaneous, but I don't know why it took so long before she

01:36:01   decided to send the signal. Or why they just don't send that signal all the time. Right, exactly. Why

01:36:10   not send it all the time. Just keep sending the signal. That's a premium service. You

01:36:16   have to pay extra for that. Well, and I should say I'm not naive. I understand why it takes

01:36:20   so long. It's because it costs so much less to hire people in other countries like, say,

01:36:26   India. And you'd only hire a few of them and you make it harder to actually get one

01:36:31   on the phone and you do all these things. But I'm saying, it just seems like if you're

01:36:39   I'm kind of surprised that both AT&T and Verizon, at least in my experience, use domestic call

01:36:46   centers.

01:36:47   I wonder why that is.

01:36:48   Yeah, I mean, it seems like they would have to employ a lot of people.

01:36:51   Yeah, it seems like you'd have a lot of cost on them.

01:36:53   Because they've got so many people across the country on both of those networks.

01:36:57   Yeah, I don't know.

01:36:58   Every time I talk to somebody, well, I don't call at 3 o'clock in the morning, but maybe

01:37:03   that's what they do.

01:37:04   Is it possible that they're not going to be able to do that?

01:37:06   but maybe that's what they do.

01:37:08   Is it possible that they're union companies?

01:37:11   Like somehow inherited from the old Ma Bell?

01:37:15   Yeah, right.

01:37:17   Bell.

01:37:18   That's a good question.

01:37:22   I saw an interview.

01:37:23   Did you see the thing that was linked up?

01:37:24   It was like, "What if the iPhone were a standalone business?

01:37:27   How big would it be?"

01:37:28   It would be like the 17th biggest company in the Fortune 500.

01:37:31   I thought it was interesting that in that list, still in the top 10,

01:37:36   by revenue, both AT&T and Verizon.

01:37:39   And I know that Verizon is not just Verizon wireless.

01:37:42   And in fact, Verizon wireless, which is what all of us think of when we think

01:37:46   of Verizon, is co-owned between Verizon and T-Mobile in Europe,

01:37:51   and that Verizon is buying the other half of it out from T-Mobile for,

01:37:55   I don't know, like $20 billion.

01:37:57   It's huge.

01:37:58   Oh, that's right.

01:37:58   Yeah, I saw that.

01:38:01   But still, fundamentally, there are two halves of the same phone--

01:38:05   what was once when we were kids-- the same phone company.

01:38:08   Imagine if they hadn't been broken up, how big AT&T would be.

01:38:13   It's interesting to me that they got split up.

01:38:19   And then they were split up into a bunch of parts.

01:38:22   And then somehow, like that liquid metal Terminator,

01:38:27   they all sort of came back together.

01:38:29   And they still haven't combined into one.

01:38:31   And you know that it would never get approved.

01:38:33   An AT&T Verizon merger would never get approved.

01:38:36   No.

01:38:39   Because AT&T tried to buy-- was it Sprint or T-Mobile?

01:38:43   T-Mobile?

01:38:45   AT&T tried to buy one of them, and it got shot.

01:38:47   Yeah, and even that got shot down.

01:38:50   There's no chance.

01:38:51   But you know that they kind of want to.

01:38:54   Oh, yeah.

01:38:57   They're only being held apart by federal regulators. It's exactly, it's like two parts of a

01:39:04   terminator that just desperately want to recombine because all they can think of is,

01:39:08   "Oh my God, if we could combine, imagine how much we could charge people per month for their

01:39:12   cell phones." I think my bill went down. I still got to wait for the first

01:39:21   payment to come through, but it seems like from what they were saying,

01:39:25   Oh, wait. The best part, I can't wait till you get it. You got to let me know when you

01:39:29   get your final bill from AT&T.

01:39:33   That's not going to be good.

01:39:34   Because I, you know what, I remember last year, it was last year when I switched to

01:39:37   Verizon and it was, it took a while. It was like five weeks later. So I had kind of forgotten

01:39:41   about it. And I kind of done the math in my head and knew it was going to be expensive.

01:39:44   And all of a sudden, at like midday, and I guess the mail came, I hear Amy downstairs,

01:39:48   "John!"

01:39:49   What did you do?

01:39:51   What did you do?

01:39:52   And I was like, "What?"

01:39:55   It was a lot.

01:39:56   It was big.

01:39:57   Yeah.

01:39:58   Yeah, you don't want to mess with those guys.

01:40:01   It is in terms of what a corporation can do to you.

01:40:05   And I know, I guess I shouldn't complain.

01:40:07   I knew that I had a two-year contract or whatever.

01:40:10   But it is effectively a legal way for AT&T, when you break off your relationship with

01:40:16   them to just mail you a box of feces here you go here is a massive bill for a

01:40:25   service that you haven't used for five you've already been gone for five weeks

01:40:31   it's it's really is awful it's you can't you can't buy an off con not an off

01:40:39   contract you can't what's the term I'm looking for you can't just pay out right

01:40:43   for a Verizon phone, can you? No, I don't think... A Verizon iPhone. No, they won't

01:40:46   let you. You can do that on AT&T though, right? I think so, yes. Yeah, which is weird. I don't

01:40:52   know why one of them does that but the other one doesn't. I think because Verizon is like

01:40:59   a little bit less nickel and dimey but a little bit more control freaky. Yeah. And it's the

01:41:05   same way that they don't use SIM cards. I mean, they do, but it's only for International

01:41:09   roaming that you don't have a SIM card from Verizon. It's like somehow your identifier

01:41:16   is built into the phone hardware. I think that's the reason they stick with that is

01:41:22   it gives them more control over the devices on their network. That's it. I ran down

01:41:29   my list for the week. You got anything else?

01:41:31   No, I think we… oh, the only other thing was the iOS 7 motion sickness.

01:41:39   Oh, well, that's good. We could do that. That's a good way to close the show, make

01:41:42   people sick. I think that's pretty interesting. So the idea here is that there's a lot of

01:41:50   people who now that they've upgraded to iOS 7, that the extra motion in it, the zooming

01:41:55   in and out, the parallax effect, is making some people who are susceptible to parallax

01:42:01   of motion sickness, it's triggering it and they're feeling nauseous, nauseated.

01:42:07   And I've gotten that sort of fake, there's that Star Wars ride, I don't know if they

01:42:12   still have it, but there's a Star Wars ride at Disney World where you go into a box and

01:42:16   they basically just shake the box around to simulate flying around in an X-wing or something

01:42:22   like that.

01:42:23   That made me sick because you're not really flying, obviously.

01:42:28   It's not like, I mean, I can do a roller coaster no problem because you're really moving, but

01:42:31   That thing actually, walking out of that,

01:42:33   I thought I was gonna yak.

01:42:35   I don't have that problem with iOS 7 though.

01:42:39   - Right.

01:42:40   It seems to me like, I think I sympathize

01:42:44   with everybody who's affected.

01:42:45   And I've seen a lot of stuff online.

01:42:47   I mean, you read the comments, and it's like,

01:42:50   people are so stupid.

01:42:51   There's people who, obviously,

01:42:52   are clearly not affected by this.

01:42:55   Their response to some of these articles is,

01:42:58   well, then these people should buy a different phone.

01:43:00   Now that's pretty… you're not really thinking this through. This is a fixable problem.

01:43:07   The answer… nobody is asking for Apple to take all these, if you like them, and I like

01:43:12   a lot of them, if you like these cool effects and transitions. They're not saying that

01:43:15   they should take them out. They just want a way to turn them off.

01:43:20   And Apple already has some of that. You can turn off the parallax, but there's some

01:43:23   of the zooming effects, like when you go back to the home screen from an app and the icons

01:43:28   fly in. You know, I think people want that turned off.

01:43:31   Right.

01:43:32   Because I do sympathize. I would, because I love the iPhone and I'm on the iPhone all

01:43:38   the time, it would be, I would feel like Alex in the Clockwork Orange if using my iPhone

01:43:42   made me nauseated. I'm like compelled to do this thing that makes me want to throw up.

01:43:51   Beethoven playing in the background.

01:43:53   I can't stop checking Twitter and my email on my phone, but now I keep retching.

01:43:57   [laughs]

01:44:01   And it might be better, it might make it better on the

01:44:05   iPhone 4, too. Because it's a little difficult on the 4.

01:44:09   I've heard mixed comments from my readers, and it's

01:44:13   a very fun way, like having big readership

01:44:17   during Fireball and not having comments and people just email me. It's a fun way to

01:44:21   sort of get a survey. I've gotten email from people who are like, "I upgraded on my 4,

01:44:28   and I can't believe—I was really worried about it because I saw all these people saying

01:44:31   it was going to be slow. I think it's great." And then I got email from other people who

01:44:34   are like, "Wow, I upgraded to 7 on my 4 and really regret it."

01:44:38   Tim Cynova Yeah, I'm kind of in the middle of the road

01:44:42   on it. I mean, I probably would do it just to get the extra features. I mean, I've got

01:44:46   That was the first thing that I tested it on was an old 4 and then I went to a 4S and

01:44:53   finally the 5 but it's...

01:44:57   Some of it's a little difficult I think.

01:44:59   Sure takes a while to boot up to.

01:45:04   What about on the iPad?

01:45:05   Do you have it on your iPad?

01:45:06   I just put it on the iPad last night.

01:45:07   I've got a third generation iPad and when I first upgraded to it I was like, "Oh my

01:45:14   my god I should not have done this. But it's gotten, it's actually seems to have stabilized

01:45:20   a little. I'm not sure exactly what was going on in the background, but it seems to be better.

01:45:25   And I really like the parallax on a bigger screen.

01:45:27   Yeah. It's much more noticeable, it's more fun,

01:45:30   I think. I mean it's one of those stupid eye candy things that doesn't really give you

01:45:40   a lot, but I think it's pretty cool. Yeah, I'm in the middle of the road on it.

01:45:44   I stick with what I thought a month ago, which was that I thought that, you know, all summer

01:45:50   long using the betas that on the iPad it was about a month behind the iPhone.

01:45:56   Like when the iPhone got to a certain point in quality about a month later, iOS 7 on the

01:46:00   iPad reached that point.

01:46:01   And so I expected that they were going to release it just for the iPhone at first to

01:46:06   coincide with the new iPhone event two weeks ago.

01:46:09   And then in a month later, next month, October, when they do the iPad, then they'll release

01:46:14   Iowa 7 for iPad. And I, you know, I'm not saying should is maybe a strong word, but

01:46:19   I still think if they had done that it would probably be in better shape. And I would not

01:46:23   be surprised at all if when the new iPads come in a couple of weeks that it were up

01:46:28   to like, let's, I don't know if it's going to be 7.1 or just 7.0.4 or something, but

01:46:35   some update that isn't even out yet where it's, you know, smoothed out. Because I noticed

01:46:39   There's some things like where I'm switching just between mail and Safari because I'm

01:46:44   reading messages where I've linked links and I'm opening them in Safari.

01:46:48   Sometimes it's real smooth and then sometimes when I switch, it is like three, four, five

01:46:53   seconds before the other app loads and I can't even hit the – even hitting the home button,

01:46:58   it's whatever is going on there behind the scenes, the whole system is jammed up and

01:47:02   I don't see that on the phone.

01:47:04   I tried to switch the background of the wallpaper and I just like I wasn't getting any response whatsoever

01:47:10   Yeah, you know I only switched it and it seemed like it was alright. Yeah

01:47:14   David Barnard, I saw it posted a

01:47:18   Vine and was it vine at six limited to six seconds

01:47:23   I think so yeah

01:47:26   So you have a limit of six seconds and the time it takes to change your wallpaper was longer than a vine

01:47:32   So like you guys talked about this last week. Yeah, and I thought that was pretty telling so yeah

01:47:37   But still it was but I also got to the point using it on my phone where going back to i/o six was

01:47:45   Was jarring in its own way

01:47:48   So, you know picking up my iPad and seeing i/o six was like yeah, I don't I don't like this anymore

01:47:55   Yeah, I've moved on

01:47:58   Emotionally and I need to be on it on all my devices. Yeah, I don't know and part of it

01:48:03   I think is that you said that the

01:48:05   That the parallax seems more noticeable on the bigger screen

01:48:09   I think yeah, so definitely it really makes to me the home screen on an un-updated iPad feel static

01:48:15   It just feels like there's no life to it

01:48:18   Yeah, all right, I

01:48:21   See what you mean. I wrap it up. I'll see what you mean here about the Samsung's history of gold flip phones

01:48:27   It's actually from Samsung themselves

01:48:29   It's a Samsung blog. Oh, is that right? Yeah, Samsung tomorrow

01:48:35   I'll post this to the show notes. It's the golden history of Samsung phones and editorial from Samsung

01:48:42   So that it's interesting that it comes from Samsung because it's

01:48:48   It you know, it's like I wonder why they posted this

01:48:52   Yeah, why would you why they would do that?

01:48:56   Why would you see the need to defend your decision to put out a new gold phone?

01:49:00   All right, John moltz, thank you for joining the show. Thank you