3: Superman Didn’t Even Make His Own Logo, with John Moltz
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"Only if you're desperate" - 2 stars.
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Love Gruber on MacBreak Weekly, but this show is very slow and the content is iffy compared
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to other tech shows.
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Just my opinion.
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By Jackdaddy5462.
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Nearly content-free - 2 stars.
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By Imabuddha.
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Unfocused, surprisingly incorrect about many details, a nearly complete waste of time.
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Was the Buddha so critical?
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I don't know a lot about Buddhism, but I know a little bit.
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Here's a review of the last episode by Sam Hill.
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Gosh, I'm not exaggerating, that was written in all caps.
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That's me reading in my all caps voice.
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Gosh, what a waste of time.
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Give me a break.
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You guys talk about yourselves, your show, and your sponsors for the majority of the
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Completely self-absorbed trite crud.
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Totally without direction.
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a two-star review by CM Harrington. The hosts sound almost identical and their short run
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length is taken up by rambling about their sponsors. In the latest episode, the hosts
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arrogantly say the listeners who want more focus don't get it. No, John, we do get it.
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We simply don't like it. There is a reason most "professional" podcasts This Week in
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Tech, MacBreak Weekly, etc. conform to a formula even if informally because there
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is an expectation on behalf of the listener. We want to know who is talking,
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we want the topics to be front-loaded, we don't want 10% or more of the podcast to
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be rambling about your sponsors. And lastly, Could Be Better, three stars, nice,
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out of five by Neri. John Gruber is Tomas de Torquemada to Paul
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Thurat's Don Quixote. When it comes to thoughtful and authoritative commentary
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on technology, the world of Apple would be a cold and vulnerable place without
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his insightful observations. That being said, the podcast is underwhelming due to
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its subpar production values and planning. There are a lot of dead air,
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um's as off-topic remarks that stretch for a long time and other minor annoying
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things which could hopefully be fixed in future episodes wait a minute
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yeah shoot I blew it these reviews are all from the old talk show these are all
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- these are how did that happen I don't know
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hold on a goof on your part let me get to the page for the new what a terrible
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goof here we go here's the new here's some reviews for the new talk show new
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listener four stars by Iannic I thought episode one was pretty good I really
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don't mind the quote rambling as some call it fun listening here's one yeah I
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was gonna say I was wondering how many people who write those reviews are just
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simply don't like you I don't know I wonder here's another one by Patrick I
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Igo, seems like one of the rare individuals who puts his name on these.
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One star review, rambling, painful recording quality.
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If you've ever wondered whether Dan Benjamin was critical to the talk show, now you know.
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The new guy can't keep Gruber on track and seems to record himself through his built-in
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That was not my built-in laptop mic.
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It was, however, a microphone on the wrong setting.
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So today, and to the person who insinuated that I did not have enough money to buy a
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good mic, I actually have two mics, and today I'm using the better of the two, which is
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slightly trickier to set up.
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But I went the extra mile today, and I should have gone the extra mile the last time.
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And I should say this is a…
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So that's a spot on criticism.
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I'm joined again by my good friend John Moltz.
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I'm John Gruber.
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This is the talk show, the new talk show.
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Let me read one more of these.
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This is, this is for the new one. This is for, uh, this is from Jim Lipsie. "Amateurish,
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one star. No one knows his subject matter as well as John Gruber. When he's focused
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and on point, it's great listening. Dan Benjamin is why the show used to consistently reach
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its potential. He kept things on track with just the right amount of conversational tension
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and he made it look easy. Now Gruber is trying out the driver's seat in a format that features
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rotating guests and the whole thing has become a meandering mess. It's exactly like listening
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to two guys bs each other at the next table at Starbucks for 90 minutes hmm I
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see that I see a pattern from the old reviews but maybe that's just me
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there's a good one full of hot air one star by Donald Rabideau it was good when
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Dan Benjamin was on it now it's just Gruber stroking his own let go oh you go
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Oh, I got you good because I I didn't want it to pay extra my wife when I told
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her two weeks ago and you know big I mean that was a big deal I mean it was
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the first episode of the newly relaunched talk show and she said who's
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gonna be on and I said moltz and she was like oh my god that's great perfect
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choice and then last week she was like who's who's on I said sandwich and she
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goes she like plopped and then this week yeah she said who's on and I said moltz
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and she says him again thanks for as well all your listeners thanks for being
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here sure so what do we got this week I think probably the big thing if you're
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an Apple Apple nerd has got to be Tim Cook's appearance at all things D uh-huh
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so you know that's the big conference out there in California I think it's in
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Southern California I'm not even sure where that is yeah it is it's someplace
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in Southern California sand sand something yeah that's everything isn't
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everything right everything in sudden yes exactly
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sand something California Tim Cook I think it's actually that it's sand
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something which is Spanish for something else actually and they you know and
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that this is the only conference that I can ever recall that Steve Jobs ever
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regularly appeared at that was not an Apple thing like Macworld or WWDC. And in fact,
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they did a very – what I think is a very nice thing is they packaged up his six previous
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appearances and they've made them available as high quality as they could get them free
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of charge as like a podcast on iTunes.
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Going back to 2003 or something like that or 2002, I forget which. But yes, so pretty
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far back. I've seen a number of them, but I have not seen them that far back. So, I'm
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to be interested to watch those.
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Yeah, I think the older ones have got to be the ones that are most interesting.
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Because, you know, Apple was a very different company in 2003.
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Before the iPod.
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The iPod was just – was pretty much brand new.
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Yeah, you know what?
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A couple of years.
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A couple of years.
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One of those weird things that I remember – I don't have a great memory for stuff
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a decade ago, but I remember that the iPod is exactly as old as 9/11 because the launch
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was apparently pushed back by a month because of 9/11 that they you know we're
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gonna do it in September or so and they pushed it back to November so it's 2011
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or 2001 did you buy one when right when it came out not for myself I bought that
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first one though for Amy as a Christmas present and I think historically and you
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know we've been together a very long time I believe that easily goes down as
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maybe the greatest Christmas present I ever purchased that right for 99 I
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believe yeah not bad I mean that's that's that's pretty good chunk of
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change yeah cuz she's still have you had a still have mine what was the name of
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that brand it was a solid stereo yeah I had one of those two it was a Rio and
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she you know wore it to the gym and really liked it because you know you
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didn't have to have it you know disc players were never good for like working
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sound and tape players sound like crap. And we had the Napster, so we had tons of MP3s
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and everything like that. But you got the Rio, and the Rio, I swear this is not exaggerating
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for the sake of humor, it held eight songs. I mean, that's no exaggeration.
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Add like 64K or something like that. Not good quality either.
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Right. It was like 128 kilobit per second mp3s and it hold around eight to ten of them and
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And the interface for getting songs in and off on and off of it from a Mac was just awful. I think until
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That what was the app that became iTunes sound jam yes sound jam helped with that
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But then getting her upgrading her to to a real original iPod was a huge one
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She will also if you ever catch her if you
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Catch her, you know at some place where you run into me and my wife and ask her
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She will sing the praises endlessly of the original click wheel
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The one that actually spun really
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Just because of the physical feed the feedback. Yeah, she always enjoyed that she thought that was a
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She's always been a much bigger iPod user than I was so hurt
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She has much stronger opinions on the various iPods through the years than me
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So Tim Cook at all things D. Yeah
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My take on this I thought it was pretty interesting. I watched it. I read the live blog
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And I think much like Steve Jobs he's he's good
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You know and it's you know, it's an interesting choice and a huge score for that conference, you know for Walt Mossberg and Kara Swisher
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That Apple's CEOs two of them trust them so much to make this, you know, it truly is extraordinary
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They don't really speak elsewhere. Tim Cook, I guess, speaks regularly at the Goldman Sachs
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conference, so it's not quite as exclusive a get as it was for Steve Jobs, but it's pretty
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exclusive. And I think they do a good job. But I also think that they waste an awful
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lot of time asking him questions that they know he's not going to answer.
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Like, if you've got Tim Cook on stage for 70 minutes, why keep repeatedly…
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try to get information about new products out of them right I mean that's
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a good I mean I guess they feel that they have to do that I mean it's sort of
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like this it's the same thing on the quarterly conference calls where they're
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constantly trying to get information about coming products and they say sorry
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we're not gonna we're not gonna give you that information I mean I guess they
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feel that that's their they have to they have to do that don't you think though
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that they could get it out of the way and maybe all right you have to at least
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acknowledge it and but you have to eat even if he comes back next year get it
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out of the way early and just say you're not gonna talk about anything that's
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coming are you and he'll say no and then that's it and then you don't really have
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to to do it yeah I think they they sort of feel like that's the tough question
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that they're gonna ask him I mean these things are not exactly controversial
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adversarial it's not 60 minutes with my wall it's not and that's as that's as
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tough as they're gonna get with him is trying to drill him on new products and
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so they they try and do it I almost think that it's a waste of time though
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and and I feel like he's actually and jobs too often is completely tight-lipped
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about anything forthcoming but is surprisingly honest and to the point
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about what they've done and why so for example just one recent I think
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tremendous example that we're still going to be talking about repeatedly for
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the next couple of years. That's the conference where Jobs gave his cars, trucks analogy.
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That post PC devices like the iPad, he sees them and the iPhone, he sees them like cars
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and he sees old traditional PCs, Windows and Mac as like trucks. And for a long time, all
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we had were trucks, but it ends up most people don't need a truck. They're better off with
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a smaller car and that's what people are switching to. They're more simple and people who really
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do need trucks, there will still be trucks, but it's going to switch. And I think the
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analogy is terrific. I think it is a very apt analogy, and it came at that conference.
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And I think Tim Cook is similarly open.
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Yeah. So, you think, I mean, you think it's just a waste of time for them to ask that
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question. I agree that it is a waste of time for them to ask that question. I'm just saying
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that that's probably their motivation.
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Right. Our friend Mike Daisy is still at it. He was not happy with the interview with Tim Cook,
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felt they should have been harder on him. Surprise, surprise regarding the Asian suppliers
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and the working conditions there. I'm not opposed to some, I mean, I think in a way he's right, but
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it's obviously not the venue for that. And obviously, what's going to happen is if they
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they start asking questions that are these CEOs don't like they're gonna stop
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showing up to those conferences right so in a way they're they're just doing it
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because they have to in order to pull the conference off and get a bunch of
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big names that they want right there's somebody somebody should be I agree with
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him that somebody should be asking them those questions it's not obviously not
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gonna happen at that conference right he actually lost in the lost in this point
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that Mike Daisy has pretty much lost all of his personal credibility. He
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actually has some decent questions that could have been asked as a follow-up.
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Because I think the one thing, and Cook, you know, is absolutely right about this,
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that Apple is leading the industry in this regard right now. No other company
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that's in the same racket as Apple is open about the working conditions in
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in their factories in China as Apple is.
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And they're getting more aggressive about it.
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Instead of doing annual updates, they're doing monthly updates.
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And I think that's terrific.
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I do think it's a step in the right direction.
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And I think he was pretty open about the issues of manufacturing in the United States and
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admitted – and I know this isn't a secret anymore.
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That was an answer to a specific question about why they don't have factories in the
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United States. Right. But he did. Which is not exactly the same question. Right. He made
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a point of emphasizing that the Gorilla Glass that you use for the touchscreens is literally
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made in the USA, not just designed in the USA. And the chips, the A5. Right. But I think
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for the most part it was a pretty good interview. He also said, the big thing he said that I
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took away was that there as a company doubling down on product secrecy. Yeah. That phrase
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is slightly annoying, but –
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Doubling down?
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Doubling down.
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Somebody pointed out – I wish I knew – I could remember his name.
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Somebody pointed out to me on Twitter that he's doing an awful lot of doubling down.
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Yeah, and he used it more than once, right?
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They're also doubling down on Siri and I forget what else.
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Maybe that might be the only two, but somebody said maybe you don't want to go play Black
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Jack with James Cook.
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It's like any two cards he gets, he's doubling down.
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got a 15 against the dealer's King I'm doubling down sure yep they've got a
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pretty good hand though well at least they have a big pile of chips in front
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of them and that too so you can afford to double down when you have a gigantic
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stack of chips but I do think I I do think it's true that secrecy if anything
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and that's one of those things these these like what's going to be different
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when Steve now that Steve Jobs is gone are they going to be less secretive or
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people I know there were some people who were speculating that maybe they don't
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want to be less secretive but people aren't going to be it was fear that kept
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what the the planets in line you know fear of this Death Star you know where
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the Death Star was Steve Jobs screaming at you and firing you the leaks will
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happen but I from everything I've seen that has gotten more secretive over the
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last year. Like the big one to me is Mountain Lion, that nobody knew that
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Mountain Lion was coming until they briefed the press on it. There were no
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rumors that hey you know Apple is actually gonna do 10.8 this year. Yeah
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and you've pointed out I mean there's there seems there's a number of open
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tracks at WWDC and nobody really seems to know what's going to be. No, we can
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come back to that in a minute. Yeah. But I want to talk about the the rumor thing
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The other thing, though, that is definitely true, and you see it this week with—I know
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9to5Mac had a bunch of images—the one thing that does leak is hardware, pre-release hardware,
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because they just don't have as much control over that once it's in Asia and they're
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prototyping stuff as they do the software.
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The software in Cupertino, I think, is as secret as it's ever been.
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You'd think that because that's the biggest vector for leaks that Digitimes would do better
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than it does.
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That actually is true.
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That's their source.
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I mean, why are you not actually capable of managing that better?
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The best and most accurate source of leaks about forthcoming Apple products is the Asian
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supply chain.
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And Digitimes, which is based in Asia and pretty much covers the Asian supply chain,
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is the least accurate and that's always their source and it's always what they
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say what their sources are sources in the supply chain right I wanted to talk
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about this with you the first episode and didn't get around to it because the
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show is rambling and unfocused of course and I'm a bad host but and I'm a bad
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guest so but you ran and I know that you you just because of that your your
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history that you like me are in a way obsessed with Apple rumor sites and have
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long been like from the 90s yeah but almost in a meta sense where almost
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what's most interesting about them isn't the actual rumors it's the rumor sites
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yeah it wasn't always like that for me I think during the 90s I read them
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obsessively just because I really wanted to know what Apple was gonna release next
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and I took them much more seriously back then than I do now.
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The thing that always...
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And it was different back then. I think it was easier to get actually to get good rumors back then.
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Before Steve came back.
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At least enough to keep some semblance of credibility.
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You know, that if only one out of so many actually ends up turning out,
00:18:59
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it's enough to keep people coming back it's that whole you know risk versus
00:19:06
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reward type thing where you you all right I'm gonna read this rumor and hope
00:19:11
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that it's true but I'm kind of taking a risk by wasting all my time reading all
00:19:16
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these rumors and you want to get the payoff of actually having some of them
00:19:19
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be accurate but it's what always shocked me though is that in the grand scheme of
00:19:24
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things they were all even the ones that were good were mostly inaccurate you do
00:19:29
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Do you remember one, I distinctly remember this and I have not been able to find it,
00:19:35
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that Apple would come out with crank powered laptops.
00:19:38
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I do remember that.
00:19:40
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I definitely remember that.
00:19:42
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And I have not, that seems to have been 86 and I can't look at them.
00:19:46
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But yeah, it was 90s though.
00:19:47
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That was, to me that was the pinnacle.
00:19:49
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That was the late 90s and I was just, and that was I think the cracking point for me
00:19:53
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where I, and that's how I ended up starting to make fun of.
00:19:59
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I remember too, I remember that rumor and correct me if, I'm pretty sure that it was
00:20:03
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also pitched as being a big deal for education.
00:20:07
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I'm not quite sure why because I think it had something to do with kids' desks not being
00:20:12
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near power plugs.
00:20:14
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Yeah, kids sitting under trees cranking their laptops up.
00:20:18
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Begin your day with the Pledge of Allegiance and then you'd crank your laptop.
00:20:24
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I guess it's not the craziest idea, but I do remember that one.
00:20:28
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I remember it was somehow pitched as being a huge deal for schools that schools can't
00:20:32
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can't get kids power plugs or something.
00:20:36
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Budget cutbacks.
00:20:37
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Yeah, well that was before the dark days.
00:20:38
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No, there's no power.
00:20:39
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None of the schools have power.
00:20:40
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That was before the dark days.
00:20:41
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Back then schools had money.
00:20:44
◼
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No, but you ran, in a sense, the only Apple rumors site that had a perfect record.
00:20:54
◼
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Because everything.
00:20:55
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►
Perfectly wrong?
00:20:56
◼
►
on the Crazy Apple Rumors site was completely made up.
00:21:02
◼
►
So did you ever have any on Crazy Apple Rumors that you made up but then turned out true?
00:21:07
◼
►
I think so. The one thing, I mean, I wrote – it wasn't on Crazy Apple Rumors, but
00:21:15
◼
►
I wrote this for Macworld during the – because they do this annual – and you do this. They
00:21:20
◼
►
these annual predictions for the coming year.
00:21:23
◼
►
And the one they did for the January 2007 issue, I said that Apple would release an
00:21:31
◼
►
iPhone and it would have one button.
00:21:35
◼
►
And that was, at the time, that was the craziest thing I could think of.
00:21:39
◼
►
I just thought, "One button?
00:21:40
◼
►
I mean, you can't have a phone with one button.
00:21:43
◼
►
How stupid is that?
00:21:44
◼
►
That's great."
00:21:45
◼
►
And lo and behold, iPhone with one button.
00:21:49
◼
►
That's kind of awesome.
00:21:51
◼
►
I do remember that.
00:21:52
◼
►
That is actually spectacular.
00:21:55
◼
►
That's my one claim to fame, and I repeat that every chance I get.
00:21:59
◼
►
And don't you just hope, you really hope that a guy like Schiller happened to catch that
00:22:06
◼
►
Because he knew?
00:22:08
◼
►
He must have seen it.
00:22:09
◼
►
He used to ... I don't want to ... I don't want to get into that.
00:22:12
◼
►
You can say it.
00:22:13
◼
►
No, you can say it.
00:22:14
◼
►
He used to read the site.
00:22:15
◼
►
He was actually a big fan of the site.
00:22:17
◼
►
Crazy Apple Rumors.
00:22:19
◼
►
would print, I mean, they would print out some of the good ones and post them on people's doors if
00:22:24
◼
►
I wrote something about one of the executives. And I don't know how far it went. I don't know
00:22:29
◼
►
which ones. At one point, he told me that somebody, I mean, some of them liked it and some of them
00:22:34
◼
►
definitely did not like it. So, I always wondered which ones enjoyed it and which ones did not.
00:22:41
◼
►
No, Piltz-Sholorak definitely has a good sense of humor.
00:22:46
◼
►
There's no doubt about it.
00:22:48
◼
►
And the thing that made cars so funny was that it was often, to me, it was the gist of each story was
00:22:56
◼
►
about a crazy Apple product prediction or something that somebody in Apple was going to do. But what
00:23:02
◼
►
made them funny was the way that they played off the way that the so-called serious rumors sites
00:23:07
◼
►
presented their stuff. And the only other thing that struck me is that the thing that makes a
00:23:16
◼
►
website popular. This is the thing I've learned running Daring Fireball, which is not and
00:23:21
◼
►
has never been a rumor site, but I've always had this infatuation in my head of, "Well,
00:23:25
◼
►
how would you run a rumor site that was actually accurate?" In some sense, for a couple of
00:23:29
◼
►
years there, maybe that's what Daring Fireball was, was that I had "little birdies" and
00:23:35
◼
►
almost everything I got from the little birdies ended up being true. But the way that I did
00:23:39
◼
►
that is only printing stuff that I knew to be true. That meant that I don't…
00:23:44
◼
►
Then you can't print enough.
00:23:46
◼
►
I would only drop one of those things every couple of months.
00:23:50
◼
►
And so if all there was at Daring Fireball were the rumors, it would be a ghost town
00:23:55
◼
►
because it would be a site that was updated at best once every six weeks or something
00:24:00
◼
►
And you can't run a website like that.
00:24:02
◼
►
What makes a website successful is regular publication.
00:24:06
◼
►
You'd have to have some other hook.
00:24:09
◼
►
You'd have to do news and rumors.
00:24:12
◼
►
No, I mean, does anybody do... I mean, I guess there are some sites that will report on the rumors.
00:24:18
◼
►
But it seems so haphazard and not...
00:24:21
◼
►
Well, I think that's what makes arnoldkimsmackrumors.com so popular.
00:24:25
◼
►
Actually, that's a good example, yeah.
00:24:27
◼
►
Right? Arnold Kim had what I think is the best idea, which was to do a meta site where it's...
00:24:34
◼
►
here's what's the rumors being reported elsewhere, here's their track record, and that's it.
00:24:41
◼
►
But even Mac rumors if you look at just read it every day a lot of it is actually just news
00:24:47
◼
►
You know it's like here's you know
00:24:49
◼
►
Here's some new stuff that's going on in the in the community because you can't you just there's just not enough rumors to
00:24:55
◼
►
Only have rumors and keep the site going right
00:25:01
◼
►
Once you just make crap up like me
00:25:04
◼
►
All right, let me thank our first sponsor our first sponsor is
00:25:08
◼
►
pixel mentor
00:25:11
◼
►
Pixelmantor is an inspiring, easy to use, beautifully designed image editor built to
00:25:17
◼
►
help you create stunning new images and edit your existing photos on your Mac.
00:25:22
◼
►
I'm just going to come out and say it.
00:25:25
◼
►
Here's the thing.
00:25:26
◼
►
It's like Photoshop, but it's 30 bucks and it's Mac only and it's built on all these
00:25:31
◼
►
great Mac technologies.
00:25:34
◼
►
And for years and years and years, and John, I think you'll agree with me.
00:25:37
◼
►
People used to say, as Photoshop got more expensive, and Photoshop's a great app, but
00:25:42
◼
►
it's very expensive.
00:25:43
◼
►
Right now, a new copy of Photoshop from Adobe costs $45,000 for a single-seat license.
00:25:51
◼
►
People would say, "Why can't an indie developer, why isn't there an indie developer out there
00:25:55
◼
►
who's going to make something that competes with Photoshop?"
00:25:57
◼
►
It doesn't have to do everything Photoshop does.
00:25:59
◼
►
Just do most of it and do it really cool, put it in a beautiful Mac interface.
00:26:04
◼
►
That's what Pixelmantor does.
00:26:05
◼
►
It's a great app.
00:26:06
◼
►
It's 30 bucks in the Mac App Store.
00:26:08
◼
►
You can find out more at their website, www.pixelmator.com.
00:26:19
◼
►
It has replaced Photoshop for me.
00:26:24
◼
►
I used Photoshop originally and then that became too much for me and then I went to
00:26:28
◼
►
the what's the their consumer Photoshop light something like that and and even
00:26:36
◼
►
that was was too much and pixelmature is even less than that even more less
00:26:41
◼
►
expensive than that it does everything that there as far as I know it does
00:26:45
◼
►
everything that there the Photoshop light version does because that's all I
00:26:49
◼
►
ever used anyway and I think I think that the the the short answer to the why
00:26:55
◼
►
Why aren't there some indie developers doing a sort of stripped-down something like Photoshop, but far less expensive and Mac-specific,
00:27:04
◼
►
was that there was just even just the rudimentary, just the least version 1.0 you could feasibly ship was just too much work for a small team,
00:27:15
◼
►
And so, it's not that it's not a big deal, but it's a big deal.
00:27:20
◼
►
And so, it's not that it's not a big deal.
00:27:22
◼
►
It's not that it's not a big deal.
00:27:24
◼
►
And so, it's not that it's not a big deal.
00:27:26
◼
►
It's not that it's not a big deal.
00:27:28
◼
►
And so, it's not that it's not a big deal.
00:27:30
◼
►
It's not that it's not a big deal.
00:27:32
◼
►
And so, it's not that it's not a big deal.
00:27:34
◼
►
It's not that it's not a big deal.
00:27:36
◼
►
And so, it's not that it's not a big deal.
00:27:38
◼
►
And so, it's not that it's not a big deal.
00:27:40
◼
►
It's not that it's not a big deal.
00:27:42
◼
►
And so, it's not that it's not a big deal.
00:27:44
◼
►
saying pixelmator. Let's find out. You want to bet five bucks on it? Sure, what the heck.
00:27:52
◼
►
Alright. Like pixelmator, like the video game version of the truck from cars. Yes. What's
00:28:01
◼
►
next? What about Windows 8? You wrote a piece for Macworld about Windows 8. Which I think
00:28:07
◼
►
is hilarious. That was my hope. Right, that Macworld is running articles on Windows 8,
00:28:13
◼
►
Which I think though is--
00:28:14
◼
►
Oh, you just think that they ran it was funny.
00:28:17
◼
►
But I do think though, I think that the arc of the industry in broad terms is that there
00:28:24
◼
►
was sort of a, I think the Mac OS X era and the Windows XP era, starting around 10 years
00:28:33
◼
►
ago, really kind of separated.
00:28:36
◼
►
And Mac people were just Mac people and Windows people were Windows people.
00:28:39
◼
►
I think a lot of Mac people just tuned out of Windows.
00:28:42
◼
►
I mean, I've gone a long time without even touching a version of Windows.
00:28:45
◼
►
It just wasn't even interesting to me.
00:28:48
◼
►
I feel like with Windows 8 and with all these people switching to iOS, it's coming back
00:28:55
◼
►
together and there's a lot of people – I think there's a lot more interest in Windows
00:29:00
◼
►
8 from Mac people than anything Microsoft's put out in a long time.
00:29:03
◼
►
I think that's true.
00:29:04
◼
►
I mean, heck, I was interested and I was not – I mean, I had to use Windows at work where
00:29:10
◼
►
I worked and so I got to know it that way but I would never have gone out and
00:29:15
◼
►
found out about it on my own probably and this version I think is there's a
00:29:20
◼
►
lot there's like I said it's it's so vastly different from previous versions
00:29:26
◼
►
of Windows that it's it obviates all that stuff that we as Mac users found
00:29:32
◼
►
distasteful. Well give me an example. Well just the whole the whole metro
00:29:37
◼
►
interface. So basically the fact that you could really use it without ever having to touch the
00:29:43
◼
►
Windows desktop. Which is one of the things that we just never really clicked for us. So,
00:29:49
◼
►
and there's some great things about it. I think there's some really nice things about the Metro
00:29:54
◼
►
interface. And I would be interested to try it on a tablet. I don't have a tablet I could try it on,
00:30:00
◼
►
But it's, there's some strange, strange anachronisms on a desktop device because
00:30:08
◼
►
it seems really oriented towards a touch device. Right, that to me is, and I haven't
00:30:13
◼
►
spent a lot of time using it, but it just looks to me like it is meant for a
00:30:20
◼
►
tablet. Duh, I can see why. And it is definitely, all credit to Microsoft, I
00:30:25
◼
►
repeat this over and over again, it is like nothing I've seen before. And I also
00:30:30
◼
►
think a lot of people when the first Windows 7 phones came out which is the
00:30:35
◼
►
same Metro basic UI style or Metro debuted on the phones I think a lot of
00:30:41
◼
►
people looked at it in their first impression was this looks cool but it
00:30:44
◼
►
almost looks like something that's meant for a bigger screen because the on the
00:30:48
◼
►
phone Metro often has like if you have like a little left to right thing that
00:30:51
◼
►
you can flip through the next thing to the right you see like the first I don't
00:30:56
◼
►
I don't know, 15 pixels of it over there on the right edge.
00:31:00
◼
►
Like it's sitting there to give you that visual clue that there's something over there.
00:31:03
◼
►
But it almost makes it look like you're getting too tight of a crop on the interface.
00:31:08
◼
►
It really looks like it was meant to run on a tablet.
00:31:12
◼
►
I guess we'll find out.
00:31:13
◼
►
Did you see this thing by this guy, Michael Mace?
00:31:16
◼
►
Yeah, you sent that to me.
00:31:18
◼
►
So that was the first I had seen it.
00:31:20
◼
►
It's a great post.
00:31:22
◼
►
It's very long.
00:31:23
◼
►
Very detailed.
00:31:25
◼
►
I think I completely agree with it.
00:31:29
◼
►
Here's the thing he says, and I write in the middle, but I think it's the most important
00:31:34
◼
►
He says, "The most important message I want you to understand is this.
00:31:37
◼
►
Windows 8 is not Windows.
00:31:39
◼
►
Although Microsoft calls it Windows, a lot of Windows code may still be present under
00:31:42
◼
►
the hood, Windows 8 is a completely new operating system in every way that matters to users."
00:31:48
◼
►
Do you agree?
00:31:51
◼
►
Well, I don't know about completely new operating system, but it is a largely new operating
00:31:57
◼
►
That was one of the points that I made in my piece is for enterprises, which is where
00:32:01
◼
►
most of Microsoft's customer base or their biggest paying base, they are going to be
00:32:07
◼
►
faced with a real challenge in implementing that operating system because they don't want
00:32:11
◼
►
to have to go through and retrain everybody on how to use Windows.
00:32:19
◼
►
A lot of them, they stuck on XP for so long that they, and then Vista came out and they
00:32:25
◼
►
were like, "Oh, that doesn't seem to be working very well, so let's wait for the next thing."
00:32:28
◼
►
They waited for Windows 7, and then a lot of them have just finished migrating to Windows
00:32:32
◼
►
7, and now they're faced with this thing that's completely new.
00:32:36
◼
►
I think a lot of them are just going to give it a pass right now and see what happens with
00:32:39
◼
►
the next version.
00:32:40
◼
►
Yeah, I really wonder.
00:32:44
◼
►
I don't know.
00:32:45
◼
►
And it just seems like because it's like a tablet looking OS, it just seems like it would
00:32:50
◼
►
be silly on like a 27 inch screen on your desk.
00:32:55
◼
►
Just like it just doesn't seem like the iPad.